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Hello my fellow W Story and 
greetings and welcome back to 

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our occasional Saturday live 
streams. 

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We have an excellent episode 
planned today. 

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We are finishing up the awesome 
Ninepenny Kings War, which we 

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got started a few weeks ago and 
covered a lot of the back story,

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a lot of the characters, a lot 
of the preparations for war, the

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setup in terms of politics, and 
how all the band of nine came 

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together. 
We talked about the strange and 

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interesting Tree of Crowns, 
whatever the heck that is. 

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We talked about the unusual, to 
put it mildly. 

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Maley's the monstrous. 
So with me as always is Ashea 

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and returning for Part 2 because
he was such a big part of Part 1

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is Steven Atwell. 
Hey Steven, welcome back. 

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Hello. 
Right on. 

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So tell remind everybody again 
about your excellent blog and 

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pod race for the Iron Throne. 
Sure. 

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So I write at Race for the Iron 
throne.wordpress.com where I go 

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chapter by chapter through Song 
of Ice and Fire. 

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I also do some other essays. 
I've just started my run through

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of Duncan Egg for example. 
Nice and relevant and. 

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Yes, very relevant. 
I also just in general write 

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about sort of the intersection 
of history, politics, and pop 

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culture. 
You can also find my stuff at 

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Twitter at Steve Natwell, or on 
Tumblr at Race and Furniture. 

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Cool, right on. 
Yes, very highly recommend 

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checking that out y'all. 
And let's let's get to it. 

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A couple of patrons to shout out
at. 

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Of course, we have our wonderful
history of Westeros's first 

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sword. 
That's Jeff Gnarly, the long 

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snapper. 
And we have Telanis the Talon, 

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king of Gagasos, rider of 
Telerius, the red dragon with 

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scales, horns and talons of 
midnight black. 

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Would have been useful for 
melees to have a dragon, but 

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that's why this was a tough 
conflict. 

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No side had Dragons. 
Dragons have been gone for a 

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while. 
We this of course is Part 2. 

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Part 1 was released about a 
month ago I suppose, so 

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hopefully you check that out, 
but if you didn't, it's not a 

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big deal to catch this one 
first. 

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The the information is all it. 
It's better taken in Part 1 

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first, but this stuff is really 
good on its own. 

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We covered a lot of the events 
there. 

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Now we've we've just recently 
released House Blackwood Part 1.

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It's our first scripted episode 
in a while, so if you haven't 

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checked that out, I highly 
recommend it. 

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And let's get to it. 
We left off with just before 

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just the outbreak of war, 
really, where we have the band 

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of nine beginning to make their 
first moves, beginning to start 

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their conquest plans. 
And that really starts with the 

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taking of three main places this
the step stones, Thai Rosh and 

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the disputed lands. 
And it's funny to think about 

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the disputed lands. 
What a name, right? 

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I mean, I wonder if the locals 
call it that. 

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Yeah, I live in the disputed 
lands. 

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So it's kind of a conundrum 
because it's fought over so much

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that it's surely war-torn. 
On the other hand, it's got to 

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be worth fighting over a little 
bit. 

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It must be some reason to to 
hold it. 

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There must be some value to it. 
And Ty Rash has been fighting it

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over for centuries. 
What do you think about the 

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disputed lands in general? 
What do you think they're the 

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benefit to the Band of 9 was? 
It's just something where I, I, 

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I don't know, I go back and 
forth on and I, I think that I'm

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somewhat in disagreement with 
George RR Martin because he, he 

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sometimes refers to the, the 
disputed lands as desolate. 

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That doesn't make a lot of sense
because no Renaissance city 

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state was able to feed itself, 
right? 

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They all required an 
agricultural hinterland, and 

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that's territory that would be 
worth fighting over, right? 

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They are also mostly run by 
merchant Princess, so you tend 

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to have a more kind of economic 
motivation for war, right? 

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You know, why if the land is 
worthless, why fight over the 

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land? 
Why not just go straight for 

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your opponent's city? 
You know, And the thing that 

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always makes me think in terms 
of like, what would people say 

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is if they are very right, if 
the lands are very disputed, if 

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the borders flow back and forth,
it must be very hyperlocal, 

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right? 
You'd say like, I live in this 

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village because you might not 
know on a year to year basis. 

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Am I part of Tyra, right. 
Am I part of lease? 

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Am I part of Mirror? 
You know that might change many 

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times in in the course of your 
life. 

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Yeah, absolutely. 
Well said. 

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So regardless of what was what 
happened what what actual value 

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it has, they they certainly took
it and held it for a little 

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while at least. 
I suppose they probably lost it 

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before the end. 
I think the last thing they 

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ended up losing was Ty Rash 
itself. 

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Yeah, but that was six years 
later. 

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So they they have held it for 
several years. 

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Yeah, that's true. 
Which probably in in terms of 

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the disputed lands, a few years 
is probably really long. 

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Yeah. 
Probably usually doesn't get 

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help for very long at a time. 
Now moving onwards. 

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So they took the disputed lands.
However they did and for 

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whatever value that held for 
them, which which sets up the 

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taking of Thai Rosh. 
We talked about this a little 

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bit, I think and how they did 
this. 

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There's there's some potential 
for them having taken it 

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internally, like setting up a a 
coup or it may have been more of

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a straight invasion. 
It's hard to say. 

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Let's let's take a quick quote 
about Thai Rosh here, and then 

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we'll discuss some of these 
possibilities. 

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Thai Rosh and altogether harder 
city began as a military 

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outpost, as its inner walls of 
fused black Dragonstone testify.

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Valyrian records tell us the 
Fort was raised initially to 

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control shipping, passing 
through the step stones. 

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Not long after the city's 
founding, however, a unique 

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variety of sea snail was 
discovered in the waters off the

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bleak Stony island where the 
fortress stood. 

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Now that unique variety of sea 
snail is the is a real world 

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parallel to the Tyree in purple 
found in Tyre, which is called 

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royal purple by a lot of people.
It's it's, it's super, super 

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expensive. 
It's hard to fathom how 

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expensive dyes were in that era 
and how much money it made for 

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the Tyrians. 
And the equivalent is almost 

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certainly true here. 
You can see it in their culture.

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The Tyrachi dye their beards and
there yeah, it's it's pretty 

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wild. 
So this is this maybe doesn't 

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sound like something that would 
make huge amounts of money, but 

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it made huge amounts of money. 
Almost certainly the case for 

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Thai Rosh as well. 
So you can see why they wanted 

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it. 
It was a wealthy city and it was

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also positioned on the step 
stones. 

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In fact, it was originally 
designed to control trade in the

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step stones by the Valyrian. 
So it would make sense that 

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someone else would want to 
suborn it for the same purpose. 

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And that is exactly what 
happened. 

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And it's also the city most 
associated with the black fires.

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Damon's wife, AKA the matriarch 
of all black fires is Rohan of 

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Tairash. 
Young Griff famously refers to 

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the blue hair he dies in heart 
of his mother, which is one of 

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the clues that he's a black fire
because his the real mother of 

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all black fires was in fact a 
Tairash Now, of course, or was a

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Tairashi Now, of course, Young 
Griff is just that's his cover 

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story. 
But you know, that's probably 

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George being playful as truth. 
Yeah. 

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So talk to us a little bit about
Ty Rush, why they would want it 

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and what kind of value it would 
give to them, things like that. 

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Yeah, I mean, I think there's a 
couple of reasons. 

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One, if they're trying to take 
the step stones, it would be 

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right at their back, right, and 
would, if left alone, be 

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enormously hostile to some new 
force trying to take over the 

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step stones. 
So you need it for that purpose 

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alone. 
The second thing is it's a huge 

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port city. 
So, you know, it gives you a 

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great naval stepping stone to 
the step stones. 

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It means that you can have your 
supply lines operating. 

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You've got somewhere to to dock 
your ships before you set out 

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for the step stones. 
It allows for all of that sort 

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of good interior lines of 
communication. 

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Right on. 
And then the final thing is, is 

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it was quid pro quo, right? 
That, you know, what's his name?

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Elequo had given his support in 
exchange for Tyraj. 

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So if they want to keep being 
financed and they're going up a 

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whole king, you know, going up 
against a whole Kingdom that has

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feudal taxation that it can draw
on, and they're just a bunch of 

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mercenaries, they're going to 
need some sort of finance. 

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And I think that the argument 
that, you know, it was taken 

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from the in stone inside is 
probably right. 

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In fact, given that the the bulk
of their forces were cell 

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swords, at least one of their 
bands might have started as the 

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mercenary army in, you know, 
under contract to Tyra. 

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Yeah, and the black fires were 
familiar enough in the area. 

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They may have been. 
The Golden Company may have been

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simply allowed inside over time.
They may have been just a 

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feature of the city people who 
used to them coming in and that 

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may not be the case anymore. 
They're like, well, we're not 

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letting y'all back in again 
after what you did. 

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But this one time before they 
broke their broke the not the 

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contract, of course, but kind of
broke this this piece. 

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They could have just been like, 
well, there's 10,000 of us were 

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inside the walls and we're going
to take this. 

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Yeah. 
Or maybe they the army is on the

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outside If if they weren't let 
inside, it's pretty easy to 

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imagine that someone opened a 
gate for them or they didn't 

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have to pummel their way. 
In it was not a a long siege or 

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a a bloody assault because they 
had the entire Stepstones and we

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know from the history of the war
for the Stepstones, that's not 

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easy right there. 
There are a lot of pirates on 

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the Stepstones who are not going
to give up without a fight. 

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There's a lot of other, you 
know, in addition to Lise and 

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Mir. 
You know, you've got Pentos, 

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you've got Braavos, you've got a
lot of interested parties. 

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So you would not want to sort of
waste your manpower on this in 

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this old siege because then all 
your momentum is going to be 

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lost. 
And everyone sees what you're 

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doing. 
They have time to react. 

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Now to be clear, I think they 
probably could have done it if 

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they needed to siege tyros. 
That would have been 

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interesting. 
They had two or at least 2 

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fleets and all these different 
sell sword companies. 

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It's not the kind of work sell 
sword companies are ideal for, 

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but they'll do it. 
You know, you're paying them so 

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much, but in this case they'd be
paying themselves or or you 

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know, doing it on their own. 
Still definitely agree that it's

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more likely they took it from 
the inside. 

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So As for once they have Thai 
Rosh, like you said, that's a 

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huge base for them. 
They get there's a lot they can 

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do with it. 
Whether the Golden Company was 

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allowed in before, they 
certainly are now once they, you

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know, kind of own it. 
And with that, they have all 

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sorts of options or like you 
said, money is now somewhat 

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taken care of. 
They have this huge tax base. 

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They can perhaps who knows what 
they're able to get out of the 

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citizens. 
They probably could have done 

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all kinds of things to extort 
and ransom. 

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And yeah, the city was probably,
it wasn't the best time for Thai

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Rash probably. 
And as far as the Stepstones, 

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yeah, they would probably be, 
there might be some forcible 

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recruitment maybe, or at least 
suborning of, of goods and and 

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weapons and and money, if not 
people. 

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And there's so many slaves in 
Tairaj, so that would be another

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resource that they would 
probably make use of. 

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Yeah. 
To build, maybe to build ships 

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or to work on their weapons or 
probably not to fight in their 

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armies, but maybe that too. 
Yeah, I mean. 

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Who knows? 
Like, if you're not planning to 

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stick around in Tairaj, right? 
This is where the sort of 

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different motives kick in is, 
you know, Who knows if if 

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Maelee's the monstrous thickly 
cared about like preserving the 

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property rights of Tairoshi's 
slave masks, he's got bigger and

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and further further afield 
things on his mind. 

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Yeah, so they move out from Thai
Rosh to start taking the step 

225
00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:04,840
stones. 
It's kind of an obvious next 

226
00:13:04,840 --> 00:13:06,080
step. 
Of course, like I said, Thai 

227
00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,680
Rosh was designed to and in part
to help control the step stones.

228
00:13:09,680 --> 00:13:13,000
So, and it's right there. 
Now I wonder what their plan was

229
00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:15,080
though. 
We know that the short term, 

230
00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,000
they want the step stones, it's 
the next step, but it could 

231
00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:19,680
easily cross into Dorn from 
there. 

232
00:13:19,680 --> 00:13:24,000
But Dorn is not the best base 
for invading the rest of 

233
00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:26,280
Westeros. 
It's a pretty good spot, but 

234
00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:30,520
it's kind of hard to emerge from
those passes into the Reach or 

235
00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:35,000
the Stormlands because they can 
kind of see you coming. 

236
00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:38,520
They know there's only two ways 
you can enter the rest of 

237
00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:41,120
Westeros, and so that's not 
necessarily ideal. 

238
00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:45,080
I wonder if they had plans to 
maybe invade some of the other 

239
00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:48,000
islands or or head straight for 
King's Landing once they control

240
00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:50,320
the step stones. 
What do you think the point of 

241
00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:52,200
the step stones was? 
Beyond. 

242
00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:55,600
I mean as far as a campaign 
strategy, beyond it being 

243
00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:57,880
important in the short term. 
What do you think the next step 

244
00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:01,440
would have been? 
So I have a slightly different 

245
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:05,960
theory, which is that I think 
the step stones were taken as 

246
00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:07,560
sort of a trap. 
Yeah. 

247
00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:12,600
They wanted the previous 
Blackfyre rebellions had all 

248
00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:16,720
failed in part because they were
fighting on enemy territory, 

249
00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:20,040
right? 
So they're they're fighting on 

250
00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:21,960
ground not of their own 
choosing. 

251
00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:26,760
And it's much easy for the 
Westerosi to Marshall all of 

252
00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:31,280
their resources. 
Then for the the black fires to 

253
00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:33,880
Marshall theirs. 
They have longer supply lines. 

254
00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:37,200
The Westerosi don't. 
And there's also an interesting 

255
00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:41,160
thing that happens with speed, 
which is that we know with both 

256
00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:46,560
Aegon the 5th and Jay Harris the
second that they expected the 

257
00:14:46,560 --> 00:14:52,640
other SoC powers to deal with 
them first, that the the problem

258
00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:55,040
would be taken care of before 
they got to them. 

259
00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:59,800
But then things keep happening 
faster than expected, right? 

260
00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:02,520
They take the whole of the 
disputed lands, they take Tyraj,

261
00:15:02,720 --> 00:15:06,280
they take the step stones. 
All of that happens before the 

262
00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:11,560
Westerosi actually get involved,
you know, in, in the in the war.

263
00:15:12,240 --> 00:15:15,960
And that suggests to me that in 
part the band of nine are just 

264
00:15:15,960 --> 00:15:19,520
moving faster than expected and 
they're encountering fewer 

265
00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:22,160
obstacles, right? 
You know it probably helps if 

266
00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:27,360
you have several pirate kings 
and Queens right working with 

267
00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:31,240
you that the Pirates of the Step
Stones are not going to be as 

268
00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:35,600
fiercely defensive as they might
otherwise be because some of 

269
00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:37,080
them are on your side to begin 
with. 

270
00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:39,920
Yeah, they might join up or be 
convinced to join, or some of 

271
00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:42,520
them may have already been 
considering alliances. 

272
00:15:42,520 --> 00:15:43,760
Some of them already have been 
allies. 

273
00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:47,920
The Band of Nine may have maybe 
already had a step stone or two 

274
00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:49,920
given all these pirate Lords 
that were part of the group. 

275
00:15:49,920 --> 00:15:51,480
So that's not super well 
defined. 

276
00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:54,880
So they may have already had 
sort of a head start, yeah. 

277
00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:59,480
And that's kind of interesting 
again, because as with the 

278
00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:03,040
disputed lands in Tyros, it's 
another example of something 

279
00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:05,600
that could easily bog an army 
down. 

280
00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:09,080
I mean, we saw the Kingdom of 
the Three Sisters, right? 

281
00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:13,120
Their attempts to take the step 
stones took a long time and a 

282
00:16:13,120 --> 00:16:16,440
lot of investment of manpower. 
Yes. 

283
00:16:16,640 --> 00:16:18,840
But the Golden Company do it 
inside a year. 

284
00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:24,240
They're so much better at it. 
Yeah, so they, they're just 

285
00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:28,080
they're able to sort of husband 
their own resources. 

286
00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:33,160
And then when we get to the the 
Westerosi intervention, I'll get

287
00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:36,640
a little bit more into why I 
think it was designed as cool. 

288
00:16:36,640 --> 00:16:39,440
OK, well, let's start off, let's
let's set the stage a little bit

289
00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:41,920
with the step Stones themselves,
a little detail about what 

290
00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:46,000
they're like and what's going on
there in terms of general 

291
00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:49,680
outlook rather than before the 
the Band of nine came there. 

292
00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,800
I would say they're generally 
filled with kind of nasty 

293
00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:54,800
people. 
There's, there's, I don't mean 

294
00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,720
like everyone there is evil, but
it's, it's a tough place to 

295
00:16:57,720 --> 00:16:59,640
live. 
I mean, you got pirates all over

296
00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:01,640
the place. 
You got, it's not part of any 

297
00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:05,079
nation. 
So there's not rulers that keep 

298
00:17:05,079 --> 00:17:07,400
the peace, so to speak. 
It's, it's, it's up to these 

299
00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:10,400
pirate Lords to keep the peace 
and they have less interest in 

300
00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:13,680
that in general. 
So I kind of imagine the 

301
00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:17,160
commoners there are kind of like
the people of Bear Island in the

302
00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:19,359
sense that that everyone learns 
to fight. 

303
00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:21,880
They're used to it. 
It's a way of life that at any 

304
00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:25,040
minute, any moment, you need to 
be ready to pick up your spear 

305
00:17:25,319 --> 00:17:30,720
and defend your your homeland. 
And it's often a proving ground 

306
00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:33,920
for the Ironborn. 
We see a lot of references where

307
00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:38,080
they just go off and decide to 
go raid in the Stepstones. 

308
00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:41,680
And part of that's because it's 
the closest land that isn't 

309
00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:42,760
Westeros. 
They can't. 

310
00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:44,720
They're not allowed to reave in 
Westeros. 

311
00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:46,160
That doesn't stop them. 
But you. 

312
00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:48,720
It wasn't always stop, but it 
usually stops them. 

313
00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:52,280
And so they have to go somewhere
else and the Step Stones are 

314
00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:56,000
full of pirates and people that 
there's no nation that can get 

315
00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,680
revenge on them. 
And the Iron Born, the Iron 

316
00:17:58,680 --> 00:18:00,880
Isles are so far away that no 
one's going to come after them. 

317
00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:02,440
So it's kind of a proving 
ground. 

318
00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:04,760
They get used to it, they fight,
they learn, they they cut their 

319
00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:07,480
teeth, etcetera. 
Yeah, no one cares if you steal 

320
00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:09,680
from thieves. 
That's a good. 

321
00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:10,680
Yeah, that's a good way to put 
it. 

322
00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:11,880
It's. 
Actually interesting that you 

323
00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:14,520
bring up the Iron Islands 'cause
they, the step stones sort of 

324
00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:18,560
remind me of like Essos version 
of the Iron Islands, right? 

325
00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:22,600
They're these group of pirates 
who live on these islands. 

326
00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:27,640
They, you know, attack trade a 
whole bunch, but they're rather 

327
00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:31,480
difficult to conquer or hold, 
you know, maintain control of 

328
00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:35,880
for very long. 
And they're, you know, they're 

329
00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:39,240
slightly kind of other, right? 
They're a little bit mixed. 

330
00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:42,720
There's people from all of the 
different, you know, associate 

331
00:18:42,720 --> 00:18:45,720
islands. 
There are, you know, we know 

332
00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:47,920
that there's a bunch of Royner 
who live there. 

333
00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:52,000
But you know, I wouldn't be 
surprised also if there weren't 

334
00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:55,040
a whole bunch of people who were
Westerosi, right? 

335
00:18:55,040 --> 00:19:01,240
If you're from Tarthur or what 
have you and there's no work for

336
00:19:01,240 --> 00:19:05,080
you or whatever, why not go to 
the step Stones and see there's 

337
00:19:05,080 --> 00:19:09,040
an island that you can grab or 
pirate to to take work on. 

338
00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:12,240
So I imagine it's very sort of a
a bit like this sort of 

339
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:14,840
Caribbean islands during the 
golden age of piracy. 

340
00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:18,640
It's this very sort of 
cosmopolitan group of 

341
00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:24,160
independent minded, you know? 
Criminals in a very Wild West 

342
00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:26,440
scenario where there's like, 
there's no law, there's no 

343
00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:28,960
central authority. 
Yeah, that's really cool. 

344
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:32,080
So we actually have a map here. 
It shows not only the different 

345
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:34,360
step stones, but shows just how 
close it is to Doran and Thai 

346
00:19:34,360 --> 00:19:36,840
Roche. 
That's really useful as a visual

347
00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:38,640
aid. 
Let's talk a little more about 

348
00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:41,440
what else is going on there and 
how it relates to other people 

349
00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:43,440
in Westeros and and A Song of 
Ice and Fire proper. 

350
00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:47,320
There's pockets of Rhinar still 
living there be back in 

351
00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:49,200
Nymeria's day. 
They passed through that area 

352
00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:52,720
and some of them stayed 
basically everywhere in Nymeria 

353
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:55,200
went and then and then picked up
and moved again. 

354
00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:57,360
There was a few people that 
didn't follow. 

355
00:19:57,360 --> 00:20:00,160
There's always a few people that
stuck around and and hung out 

356
00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:01,560
wherever in this different 
location. 

357
00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:02,960
And the Stepstones is one of 
those places. 

358
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:07,200
So like Steven said, it's 
multicultural. 

359
00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:10,160
They're certainly living on the 
Stepstones create would, I would

360
00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:13,640
imagine, would create some sort 
of subculture there because like

361
00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:17,600
I said, it requires toughness 
and and survival skills. 

362
00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:20,480
We see several characters pass 
through there. 

363
00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:23,400
The cinnamon wind with Sam and 
Gilead board passes through 

364
00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:25,920
there and appropriately enough, 
it's attack. 

365
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,840
And I mean, it's it's pirates 
live there and it's not much of 

366
00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:33,240
an attack because the cinnamon 
wind is well, like many swan 

367
00:20:33,240 --> 00:20:36,840
ships is very well prepared to 
deal with pirates, at least 

368
00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:38,760
small amounts of pirates. 
You know, if it was like a whole

369
00:20:38,760 --> 00:20:42,280
fleet, they might have trouble. 
But the swan ships are super 

370
00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:44,160
fast and they have those awesome
bows. 

371
00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:46,440
And I believe that's exactly 
what happens. 

372
00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:49,320
They fire a few volleys at the 
pirates and they're like, never 

373
00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:52,840
mind, we'll wait for someone 
weaker to come through. 

374
00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:58,640
And of course probably the most 
famous and unknown character who

375
00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:02,880
is probably set up there is the 
so-called Lord of the Waters who

376
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:04,720
sets up on an island called 
Torturous Deep. 

377
00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:09,480
And the fandom is pretty sure, 
myself included, that's Oraine 

378
00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:13,920
Waters, who made off with 
Searcy's freshly made ward 

379
00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:17,320
Romans, which were very large 
warships, 10 of them. 

380
00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:20,880
And so the good chance he's 
there. 

381
00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:23,640
Now I have no idea what's going 
to happen with him, but that's a

382
00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:25,880
whole nother topic. 
Very curious though to see what 

383
00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:29,680
happens with him. 
For a real life comp I would 

384
00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:32,040
call I would say Sicily is a 
pretty good example. 

385
00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:36,280
Now Sicily is just one island, 
but it's similar in that it was 

386
00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:40,640
very, very, very much fought 
over in ancient times and and in

387
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:43,080
Roman times and Mediterranean, 
it's the center of the 

388
00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:44,640
Mediterranean. 
It has a lot of the same 

389
00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:48,120
features of the Stepstones in 
that it's potentially powerful 

390
00:21:48,120 --> 00:21:52,800
as a trade spot because it's in 
the Unites 2 large land masses, 

391
00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:56,960
but that just ends up instead of
being a great Trade Center. 

392
00:21:57,440 --> 00:21:59,360
Well, it is a great Trade 
Center, but it's also heavily 

393
00:21:59,360 --> 00:22:00,520
fought over for that same 
reason. 

394
00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:02,120
What do you think of that 
comparison? 

395
00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:05,280
Yeah, I mean, you know, 
Mediterranean islands in 

396
00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:07,320
general, right? 
What it what it reminded me a 

397
00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:11,520
lot of is Pompey's campaign 
against the Pirates. 

398
00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:13,840
Oh yeah. 
Right, where, you know, all 

399
00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:16,880
across the sort of, you know, 
eastern Mediterranean, central 

400
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:21,600
Mediterranean, you know, they're
all of these little islands, all

401
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:28,080
these little inlets where 
pirates could thrive because 

402
00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:31,760
they could sort of, you know, 
run out, attack and then sneak 

403
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:33,560
off. 
And then you don't know which 

404
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,400
little island or inlet they're 
at. 

405
00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:40,400
So, you know, it was very 
difficult to to sort of deal 

406
00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:42,840
with the pirates all in one go. 
And there were attempts to sort 

407
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:46,880
of take some of the bigger 
islands like Crete or what have 

408
00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:51,960
you, But you know, they would 
just sort of move on to the next

409
00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:54,520
Cove down the road. 
Yeah, they're very mobile. 

410
00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:55,400
Yeah, exactly. 
And. 

411
00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:59,520
It took Ptolemy sort of taking 
this enormous fleet and sort of 

412
00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:02,920
using it as a broom across the 
Mediterranean, going West to 

413
00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:08,160
east where he just wouldn't 
allow them to double back on 

414
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:09,160
him. 
And he just sort of hit, 

415
00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:13,240
squeezing them and squeezing 
them into a smaller area that 

416
00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:14,840
they were able to be defeated 
do. 

417
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:18,320
You think maybe that's what the 
the Band of Nine was trying to 

418
00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:20,080
do here. 
Maybe kind of go start with the 

419
00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:23,120
first step stone and kind of 
move their way West and lock it 

420
00:23:23,120 --> 00:23:25,560
all down and create supply lines
and all that. 

421
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:26,680
You think that was part of their
goal? 

422
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:29,080
It's possible it could, you 
know, they could have done the 

423
00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:32,760
sort of the island hopping 
strategy of, of the Pacific 

424
00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:36,680
theater and World War 2. 
Or it could be that they managed

425
00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:40,640
to sort of roll up the whole 
stepstone in one go, in part 

426
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:42,640
because they did have no 
friends. 

427
00:23:43,120 --> 00:23:46,000
Friends on the inside. 
And they may have hoped to. 

428
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:49,640
They may have hoped to cut 
Westerosi support from itself to

429
00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:53,320
maybe keep the anything coming 
from the South to be able to 

430
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,480
reach the North. 
If you could keep the ships 

431
00:23:55,600 --> 00:24:01,080
bottled up below Dorn, that 
might be a good strategic 

432
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:03,800
objective to keep help from 
coming around and getting the 

433
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,600
King's Landing, for example. 
Yeah, it would make it extremely

434
00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:11,720
difficult for, say, the 
Westerlands or the Reef to, you 

435
00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:14,440
know, intervene in a war in the 
east because they'd have to 

436
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:16,680
cross the whole of the continent
first. 

437
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:19,720
Yeah. 
Yeah, that may have been part of

438
00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:23,400
the strategy as well. 
And I think as far as an overall

439
00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:26,520
strategic goal for the Band of 
Nine, we know that all of them 

440
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:29,680
had different goals. 
Alequo's goal was Tyraj and he 

441
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:32,720
got that goal. 
And Malice's goal was Westeros, 

442
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:35,280
which is surely the most 
ambitious of the goals. 

443
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:38,840
But taking that one, we being 
successful with Westeros would 

444
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:41,160
absolutely enable whatever the 
rest were. 

445
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:44,720
Because if you have Westeros, I 
mean, damn, you can do a lot. 

446
00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:46,680
You could. 
Whatever the other Pyre Lord's 

447
00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:49,640
goals were could pretty easily 
be accomplished with with 

448
00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:52,720
Westeros backing that endeavor. 
I, I was going to say, you know,

449
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:56,760
mentioning that the pirate 
kings, you know, that may have 

450
00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:59,120
been their quid pro quo. 
Is like OK? 

451
00:24:59,120 --> 00:25:02,240
We want the step stones. 
That's going to be our little 

452
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:06,080
pirate Kingdom. 
And so, you know each step along

453
00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:09,840
the way, right, Males make sure 
that his friends get what they 

454
00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,200
they bargain for so that they 
keep supporting. 

455
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:16,600
That's a good call. 
I like that it makes a lot of 

456
00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:23,000
sense as part of this males is 
crowning before even the 

457
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:24,680
invasion of the Stepstones 
begins. 

458
00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:30,560
So obviously calling yourself a 
king can help you draw more 

459
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:34,000
support, or at least it it kind 
of issues the challenge Westeros

460
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,160
has kind of put on notice 
because he's not calling himself

461
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,240
King of the Stepstones. 
He's not calling himself King of

462
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:40,840
Tairash or the deputed lands. 
He's calling himself king of 

463
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,880
Westeros. 
And that requires an answer from

464
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:46,880
Westeros. 
Let's talk about the what's 

465
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:48,440
going on in Westeros during all 
this time. 

466
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:53,320
Sure, prior to Summerall, around
the time the band was forming 

467
00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:56,680
perhaps, or Maelice was making a
name for himself as a new leader

468
00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,840
of the Golden Company, there was
a there were interesting things 

469
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:03,080
happening in Westeros. 
This was the era which Aegon the

470
00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:08,640
5th AKA Egg the Egg was trying 
to reform Westeros. 

471
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:13,480
He was a very much pro commoner 
and that is perhaps in part 

472
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:15,400
because he lived as one for a 
long time. 

473
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:16,840
But we don't need to get into 
the Wise. 

474
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:20,640
The point is he was doing it. 
He was focused on doing it, but 

475
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:23,560
he was frustrated because the 
great Lords, who were very 

476
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:26,280
powerful, of course didn't want 
to give up their rights. 

477
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:29,560
They didn't want to give up any.
They didn't want to concede 

478
00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:31,440
anything to the peasants. 
They didn't want to lose any 

479
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:35,200
power. 
And this is of course partly why

480
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:39,040
Aegon wanted to hatch Dragons 
again, because he knew that the 

481
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:43,840
great Lords would not push back 
nearly as much or at all if the 

482
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:46,960
Dragons were in place again. 
It's an interesting sort of 

483
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:53,960
period of time because Aegon the
Fifth has lost his son Prince 

484
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:57,480
Duke, right? 
There's just been the rebellion 

485
00:26:57,480 --> 00:26:59,400
of the the rat, the hawk and the
pig. 

486
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,440
Whatever that was. 
And then they they didn't really

487
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:06,560
take the the Band of nine 
seriously initially that. 

488
00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:07,480
That's true. 
They didn't. 

489
00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:10,920
Prince Duncan says that you 
know, crowns are being sold 9 a 

490
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,080
penny, and the quote in the 
World of Ice and Fire is. 

491
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:17,200
It was thought at 1st that the 
Free Cities of Essos would 

492
00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:20,320
surely bring their power against
them and put an end to their 

493
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:23,400
pretensions. 
But nevertheless preparations 

494
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:27,080
were made should Maelis and his 
allies turn on the Seven 

495
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:29,640
Kingdoms. 
But there was no great urgency 

496
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,760
to them, and King Aegon remained
intent on his reign. 

497
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:40,360
So in the final years of Aegon's
reign and of his life, they 

498
00:27:40,360 --> 00:27:42,400
didn't really take this 
seriously. 

499
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:44,960
They hoped that someone else 
would deal with it. 

500
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:49,480
They made certain preparations, 
but they didn't really have all 

501
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,760
of their ducks in a row when the
war actually started. 

502
00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:58,680
Yeah, right on. 
So there was a little bit of 

503
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:04,160
unrest but around Westeros, but 
it's not a that kind of thing 

504
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:05,760
isn't a huge deal. 
It may have interfered with 

505
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:09,000
their preparations, but Westeros
was always going to unite 

506
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:11,480
against a foreign invader, which
is something, by the way, to 

507
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:14,040
keep in mind for A Song of Ice 
and Fire proper. 

508
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:17,440
When it comes, when this kind of
thing, when, when say some, I 

509
00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:21,600
don't know, some person maybe 
with Dragons, brings the foreign

510
00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:24,240
army to Westeros, that might 
provoke a reaction too. 

511
00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:26,840
But let's not get into that 
right now. 

512
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:29,560
But it is irrelevant to keep 
these things in mind because 

513
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:31,120
George loves to have history 
repeat itself. 

514
00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:34,880
Not exactly, but in in cycles 
with with similar patterns. 

515
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:38,240
So sure, surely there were other
factors, but this was a 

516
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,840
contribution to the need for the
hatching of Dragons. 

517
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:45,080
Maybe, maybe even in the back of
his mind, Aegon was thinking, 

518
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:47,480
well, yeah, I have all these. 
I have this need for Dragons. 

519
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:51,320
And hey, it might also help with
this Band of Nine situation if 

520
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:54,880
it gets out of hand. 
If he hatches the Dragons number

521
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:59,280
one in the short term, it's like
a huge symbolic victory, right? 

522
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,120
You know who's who's the 
rightful king of Westeros? 

523
00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,160
Well, it's it's absolutely the 
one with the dragon. 

524
00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:09,800
But if he can get a few years in
there right? 

525
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:15,240
Doesn't take Danny what, 2 years
to get the Dragons ready for Big

526
00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:19,840
enough for battle. 
Yeah, it'll take a little while 

527
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:21,720
at least. 
Well, yeah, So, you know, if 

528
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:24,920
he's gets two years that, you 
know, if he can delay things for

529
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,280
a little bit, he may be able to,
you know, and we saw it like, 

530
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:33,440
you know, with Prince Damon, one
dragon can be incredibly 

531
00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:36,360
decisive on the stepstone. 
That's very true. 

532
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,600
That's a good point to bring up.
Damon Targaryen, AKA the Rogue 

533
00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:43,600
Prince, the famous King Kong 
sort of Rainiera during the 

534
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:45,440
Dance of the Dragons. 
He before the Dance of the 

535
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:48,000
Dragons, he had conquered the 
Stepstones, named himself King 

536
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,720
of the Stepstones and then and 
just kind of left eventually he 

537
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:54,560
was like he kind of got bored 
with it, but but he had a 

538
00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:57,200
dragon. 
That's the point is it was easy 

539
00:29:57,200 --> 00:30:00,680
ish It well, it wasn't easy, but
it was easier for him than just 

540
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:05,160
about anyone because he had 
Caraxes the bloodworm, which you

541
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:08,240
know, you can see how something 
with that name would be helpful 

542
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:10,960
in in conquering. 
So there's a lot of other 

543
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:13,920
interesting people who were 
alive in this era, people some 

544
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:16,960
of whom are still alive now. 
I would say Paisel, but he's 

545
00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:19,800
technically not still alive. 
But he was alive then. 

546
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:23,080
And his appointment as Grand 
Maester actually helps us date 

547
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,720
some of these things because he 
was appointed in 259 to be Grand

548
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:30,440
Maester and he served Egg on the
5th for a few months, which 

549
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:34,320
means Summerhall was not in 
early 259, it would have been in

550
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:39,000
at least middle or late 259. 
So Paisel was Grand Maester for 

551
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:42,200
all of Jahari's the second 
reign, meaning all of the 

552
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:45,600
interim between Summerhall and 
the war and all of the war 

553
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:48,120
itself. 
So that's pretty interesting. 

554
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:50,800
And he wrote the book on. 
Yeah, he wrote the book on it, 

555
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:53,400
that's true. 
And that's where he, of course, 

556
00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:57,080
he, he seems to have 
particularly focused on Tywin 

557
00:30:57,280 --> 00:30:59,040
and some of the Lannisters and 
stuff. 

558
00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:02,480
But hey, that's myself for you, 
you know, that's the you. 

559
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:04,280
We've come to expect that from 
him. 

560
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:07,920
So what do you think it meant as
a if we talk about symbols, the 

561
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,360
Dragons would have, had Dragons 
been born, that would have been 

562
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:13,720
a symbol. 
Instead, basically the opposite 

563
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:16,200
happened. 
Instead of them gloriously 

564
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:19,480
bringing Dragons back into the 
world, they got themselves all 

565
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:23,200
killed. 
And if, if if you're someone 

566
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:27,080
who's got a sense of destiny, 
mainly's maybe thought he was 

567
00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:30,120
destined to take the throne. 
And if he wasn't, maybe some of 

568
00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:32,960
his followers were worked up 
into a frenzy, feeling that same

569
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:37,160
that same destiny and seeing the
king just kind of immolate 

570
00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:39,920
himself and and most of the 
Targaryen royal family, that had

571
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:44,520
to give them a big boost of, of 
morale, if not like a 

572
00:31:44,680 --> 00:31:48,480
superstitious shot in the arm 
saying, wow, this is a destiny 

573
00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:50,080
thing. 
You think that was relevant? 

574
00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:52,400
I, I was going to say like, you 
know, one of the things that you

575
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:55,200
notice with the Blackfyre 
rebellions is that they're 

576
00:31:55,320 --> 00:32:00,200
often, they're, they happen 
shortly after some sort of like 

577
00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:05,680
negative event, you know, so 
the, the great spring sickness, 

578
00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:07,120
right? 
Or that, you know, the weakness 

579
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:09,720
of heiress the first or what 
have you. 

580
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:14,800
So I, I imagine it must have 
influenced Malus especially. 

581
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:18,480
Like, what better symbol could 
there be that he's the rightful 

582
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:24,160
king and that the Targaryens are
weak and degenerate and, you 

583
00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:27,200
know, they've lost the mandate 
of heaven, so to speak, Then 

584
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:30,880
they all go up in flames. 
Yeah, it's really symbolic, 

585
00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:33,760
right? 
Like it's like, wow, of course 

586
00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:37,120
it's also, you know, concludes 
Rhaegar's birth and things like 

587
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:38,440
that. 
But hey, that's another story. 

588
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:42,400
But also the person who succeeds
is like, known to be a little 

589
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:46,200
bit of a weakling, right? 
It's not any of the sort of 

590
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:53,120
warrior sons of Aegon the 5th. 
It's this sort of sickly heir 

591
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:55,600
and you know, who is never 
expected to be king. 

592
00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:59,320
So he might have sort of said 
rates, you know, not only does 

593
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:03,040
the is the sort of court 
distracted by the fact that 

594
00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:06,880
they've got a change in 
government, but the new 

595
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:10,760
government is completely 
unprepared and unqualified. 

596
00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:15,120
So that's even further sign that
I'm the the rightful ruler and 

597
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:17,640
can win this war on a cakewalk 
kind of thing. 

598
00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:19,400
Yeah, yeah. 
Well said. 

599
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:24,400
So let's see here. 
Whatever it meant to the Band of

600
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:26,960
nine, it was certainly a a big 
deal in Westeros. 

601
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:31,440
It was certainly a a major 
memorable event for the the king

602
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:33,720
and the royal family to immolate
themselves. 

603
00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:36,640
And, well, we've got a nice 
quote. 

604
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:39,480
The tragedy of Sommerhall 
brought Jaharis, the second of 

605
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:43,320
his name, to the Iron Throne in 
259 AC Scarcely had he donned 

606
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:46,280
the crown and the Seven Kingdoms
found themselves plunged into 

607
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:49,320
war, for the Ninepenny Kings had
taken and sacked the Free City 

608
00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:51,680
of Tyros and seized the 
Stepstones. 

609
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:55,120
From there they stood poised to 
attack Westeros. 

610
00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:58,800
So it seems that with having 
sacked Tyros, it seems that they

611
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:02,440
were most likely trying to 
exploit or extort as much wealth

612
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:06,560
as possible in order to make 
these next set of moves. 

613
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:09,880
And well, they were very 
ambitious set of moves. 

614
00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:13,080
Carl, I'll take a quick 
diversion here. 

615
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:15,920
Luminia M sends a super chat and
says thank you for helping me 

616
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:17,440
understand George RR Martin's 
writing. 

617
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:20,639
You are most welcome. 
It is a bit of a challenge, but 

618
00:34:20,639 --> 00:34:23,400
it is a worthy challenge. 
It's fun and I'm glad that we're

619
00:34:23,639 --> 00:34:27,080
we're doing that for you. 
A question from a lot of people.

620
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,440
What about black fire the sword?
Yeah, we certainly plan on 

621
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:31,880
talking about that and might as 
well be right now. 

622
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,880
It's, it's difficult to be 
certain about Black Fire the 

623
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,480
sword here. 
We, we, we, I believe we briefly

624
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:43,199
talked about it last time. 
But if it's in play here, Malice

625
00:34:43,199 --> 00:34:46,480
would have it. 
But if it's not in play here, 

626
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,400
then where the heck is it? 
Where, who, who would have it? 

627
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:52,920
It's it's really hard to say. 
It's a it's a bit of a mystery 

628
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:56,520
because the places it should be,
it's not mentioned, which 

629
00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:58,480
doesn't mean it's not there, 
just maybe that it's not 

630
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:02,120
mentioned. 
But if it's not in Maelice's 

631
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:05,080
hand, and if it's not held by 
the Iron Throne, then what the 

632
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:07,800
heck happened to it? 
That's an interesting question 

633
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:12,880
because in the like official 
artwork, Maelice doesn't build a

634
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,400
sword. 
He's got like a a morning star, 

635
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:17,240
a flail, right? 
Yeah, it's got a morning star, 

636
00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:19,720
you know, So that may just be 
like a weapon of personal 

637
00:35:19,720 --> 00:35:23,080
preference that he was just 
like, I mean, especially if 

638
00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:25,240
you're a very big strong dude, 
right? 

639
00:35:25,240 --> 00:35:29,600
You can pull a lot of force 
behind one of those things and 

640
00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:33,120
knock people out around. 
We also know that he liked axes,

641
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:36,880
so it may just have been a 
personal preference thing. 

642
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:40,880
It may be that he just kept it 
around for sort of ceremonial 

643
00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:45,320
purposes, like not bringing it 
out on a battlefield where it 

644
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:49,320
could be potentially lost 
because, you know, the black 

645
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:53,200
fires had lost the sword and had
to get it back a couple times, 

646
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:56,080
mostly when, you know, they kept
getting killed. 

647
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:00,720
So that may have been a 
consideration, though, like keep

648
00:36:00,720 --> 00:36:04,360
it safe until the war's won and 
then you bring it out. 

649
00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:05,680
Makes sense. 
Yeah. 

650
00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:08,920
And, and one of my no, I 
wouldn't say this is a strong 

651
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:11,120
theory, but something that I've 
considered as a as a 

652
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:13,080
possibility. 
That black fire was destroyed at

653
00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:14,520
Summerhall. 
They may have brought it there. 

654
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:15,840
I don't know why they would 
bother to bring it there. 

655
00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:17,360
They would probably just leave 
it at the Red Keep. 

656
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,400
But that would if if George is 
decides he's written himself 

657
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:21,920
into a corner, he's got that 
option. 

658
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:26,320
He's like, wait, maybe it was 
just melted at Summer Hall. 

659
00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:27,560
Maybe. 
But then the. 

660
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,200
Question is, well, how did 
Illyrio get his hands on it? 

661
00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:32,360
Yeah, I do think Illyrio 
probably has it. 

662
00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:35,560
So that doesn't really satisfy. 
Yeah, it. 

663
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:38,120
It's hard to fake Valyrian 
steel. 

664
00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:39,800
You know what? 
I mean very true and I don't 

665
00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:41,880
even know the wildfire would be 
enough to destroy the blade. 

666
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:43,680
It would probably it would 
destroy the hilt most likely, 

667
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:47,960
but the blade itself not so sure
about that comment from Matt 

668
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:50,720
Reese George with relating to 
the disputed lands. 

669
00:36:50,720 --> 00:36:52,680
He says George might be saying 
that the disputed lands is 

670
00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:55,840
desolate because it's being 
fought over all the time and it 

671
00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:58,200
doesn't have it's unable to 
produce things because of the 

672
00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:02,040
constant war. 
If it were held and kept stable,

673
00:37:02,240 --> 00:37:05,200
it might be able to grow food 
and be useful, but because of 

674
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:08,640
the constant fighting, it's 
unable to get to that point. 

675
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:11,680
That potentially makes sense. 
Matt says think various lands in

676
00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:14,760
Germany during the 30 year war. 
Here's Here's the thing though. 

677
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:19,840
Medieval or I should say pre 
Modern Warfare doesn't actually 

678
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:23,600
damage like soil productivity 
that much. 

679
00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:28,720
You know, ironically, if if 
anything, you know, it's sort of

680
00:37:28,720 --> 00:37:31,680
the reverse bodies, human bodies
make for good. 

681
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:34,680
Fertilizer. 
Good point. 

682
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:36,240
All those horses running around.
Yeah. 

683
00:37:36,240 --> 00:37:38,400
And. 
You know, there, there's been 

684
00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:43,080
actually some like academic 
research on like, did you know 

685
00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:46,720
this sort of the myth of like 
salting the earth at Carthage? 

686
00:37:47,120 --> 00:37:48,160
Yeah, right. 
Did. 

687
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:51,120
That start was so expensive. 
That seems very unlikely. 

688
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:52,800
Yeah. 
Did that actually damage 

689
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:53,920
productivity? 
Well, no. 

690
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:56,920
We know that the Romans, after 
they finally defeated the 

691
00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:59,240
Carthaginians, they occupied 
Carthage. 

692
00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:04,840
Yeah, it was a it was a a grain 
exporting province for a long 

693
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:07,440
time. 
And the the thing that made the 

694
00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:12,400
30 Years War so destructive to 
Germany is really the loss of 

695
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:15,480
population. 
It's not so much that the soil 

696
00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:18,880
changes that like half the 
population dies so. 

697
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:21,000
There's no one to actually tend 
the fields. 

698
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:25,240
Yeah, and that was really 
unusual for for wars. 

699
00:38:25,240 --> 00:38:32,240
I mean it, it's the the sort of 
particular nature of a very 

700
00:38:32,240 --> 00:38:36,080
extended conflict, right? 
A war that took many, many, many

701
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:40,680
years, that doesn't normally 
happen, usually shorter, 30 

702
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:43,240
years. 
And that it was a religious war.

703
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:48,880
So if you were a regular Royal 
Army, or even a mercenary army, 

704
00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:52,880
right, you'd go through and 
you'd rob the peasants, 

705
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:56,080
certainly. 
You don't think they would burn 

706
00:38:56,080 --> 00:39:00,000
any crops or anything like that?
I mean, you might a little bit. 

707
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:05,120
The Chevrolet's were a thing, 
but you wouldn't kill everybody.

708
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:06,720
Like because you want to 
conquer. 

709
00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:10,720
Them. 
Yeah, would really be unusual. 

710
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,360
It's the fact that it was a 
religious conflict where it's 

711
00:39:14,360 --> 00:39:18,280
all of a sudden, you know these 
you don't think of people as 

712
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:23,080
like peasants to be to be 
conquered and and taxed. 

713
00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:26,960
You think of them as heretics 
who need to die so that their 

714
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:29,840
souls can be saved. 
No. 

715
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:33,080
Right. 
So that's really what change. 

716
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:35,800
And, you know, and one of the 
reasons why we know that it 

717
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:39,200
didn't damage the land exactly 
is that in the aftermath of the 

718
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:44,920
30 Years War, a lot of sort of 
local German Princess started 

719
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:48,000
kind of advertising for 
immigrants. 

720
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,440
They would say. 
Like, hey, come to my lands, 

721
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:52,760
I'll give you these vacant 
farms. 

722
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:56,440
I'll, you know, you won't have 
to pay taxes for 10 years or 

723
00:39:56,440 --> 00:39:59,240
whatever. 
And lo and behold, the the 

724
00:39:59,240 --> 00:40:02,640
people who are able to attract 
immigrants to their Kingdom. 

725
00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:06,480
All of a sudden saw a pretty 
quick turn around of economic 

726
00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:09,920
fortune. 
So that's kind of like I think 

727
00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:14,280
Martin might be drawing from 
some earlier less accurate 

728
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,880
history there, OK. 
Yeah, makes sense. 

729
00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:20,360
All right, let's take a quick 
break, give some shout outs, and

730
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:24,640
then we'll come back with the 
actual war and then the actual 

731
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:27,200
aftermath. 
I want to give a shout out to 

732
00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:29,840
our Ironborn captains. 
Ironborn are going to be making 

733
00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:32,120
an appearance in the war here 
very soon. 

734
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:36,720
We've got the father of Euron 
and Bailon and bringing his long

735
00:40:36,720 --> 00:40:38,880
ships over to get involved in 
the Step stones. 

736
00:40:38,880 --> 00:40:41,080
That makes a lot of sense, 
doesn't it? 

737
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:44,080
So let's give a shout out to the
history of Westeros Ironborn 

738
00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:46,800
captains who I am currently 
searching for on my page. 

739
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:49,600
Here it is Black Mattos, Storm 
Rider, captain of the Rusted 

740
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:53,000
Hinge, Sir Selvis, Red Blade of 
White Harbor, captain of Trident

741
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:55,960
of the North, Lord Chucklaws, 
captain of the Droman Night 

742
00:40:55,960 --> 00:40:59,080
Blood, destroyer of Evil. 
John Gregor is captain of the 

743
00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:02,400
First of the Drowned God. 
Sir Kiran of Lonely Light is 

744
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:06,480
Surge of the Sunset Sea, captain
of Naga's Breast, a Droman armed

745
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:10,000
with siphons of wildfire. 
Aileen is Archer Queen, captain 

746
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:13,000
of the Border Collie Crimson 
Kate is captain of the Drowned 

747
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:16,000
Queen's Vengeance, just son of 
the Justice Collector of Tolls, 

748
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:19,280
captain of the Golden Gift. 
Lord Mitch of House Bailey is 

749
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:21,920
captain of Widow's Blood. 
His heir is Lordling Mason. 

750
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:25,120
House Bailey Beneath the Gold is
a podcast focusing on lesser 

751
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:26,520
known A Song of Ice and Fire 
characters. 

752
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:29,200
Check them out. 
Krakash, the Lord Protector of 

753
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:31,760
the Gallifreans, is captain of 
the TARDIS of the Seven Seas. 

754
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:35,200
Tempest of House Brewer is 
captain of the Summer Storm. 

755
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:40,440
Also a shout out to our Blood 
Rider patrons that includes 

756
00:41:40,560 --> 00:41:43,840
Kohoi, wielder of called 
Sunpiercer, Rather wielder of a 

757
00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:46,560
dragon bone bow, Vorsaki, 
wielder of the Valyrian Steel 

758
00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:49,920
Air Act with a dragon bone hilt,
and Kokavo the Tamer wielder of 

759
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:53,600
the wildfire with Gehenna. 
Also I would like to give shout 

760
00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:56,080
outs to our Queens of Love and 
Beauty from the depths of Flea 

761
00:41:56,080 --> 00:41:57,960
Bottom. 
Lord Ken of House Hammer has 

762
00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,760
declared for Queen Carey, Fire 
of the North who recovered Dark 

763
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:04,000
Sister from beyond the wall, and
a Laurel of glory in the name of

764
00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:07,200
love to Bud of House Beresford, 
Knight of Tokian and arbiter of 

765
00:42:07,200 --> 00:42:10,960
Scotch from Sandy the dragon 
blood of Queen Daenerys and Lady

766
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:14,320
of Jameson. 
The Pot Mom's Podcast is a 

767
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:17,440
weekly pot themed podcast that 
talks about cannabis and 

768
00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:19,720
parenting. 
The Pot Mom's Podcast exists to 

769
00:42:19,720 --> 00:42:22,640
help debunk the myth that moms 
and dads who smoke pot are bad 

770
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:23,640
parents. 
We aren't. 

771
00:42:23,800 --> 00:42:26,560
We're really, really good ones. 
They review products and 

772
00:42:26,560 --> 00:42:29,160
strains, interview interesting 
people, and join people who 

773
00:42:29,160 --> 00:42:31,520
support or would like to learn 
more about cannabis and the 

774
00:42:31,520 --> 00:42:33,800
great community around it. 
Hopefully they'll make you laugh

775
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:35,200
too. 
And honestly, maybe it's just 

776
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:37,600
worth a listen so you can hear 
their dope theme song. 

777
00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:41,800
Join Kate and Paul on their 
weekly show, available on almost

778
00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:45,120
all your favorite streamlined 
platforms, and destigmatize and 

779
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:45,760
learn. 
Cool shit. 

780
00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:54,520
Keep blazing and stay amazing. 
And now the war itself. 

781
00:42:55,520 --> 00:42:58,720
Quote, Jerry said, known that 
the Band of Nine meant to win 

782
00:42:58,720 --> 00:43:01,120
the Seven Kingdoms for Melis the
Monstrous, who had declared 

783
00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:03,160
himself King Melis the First 
Black Fire. 

784
00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:06,360
But like his father Aegon, Jerry
said, hope the alliance of 

785
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:09,360
rogues would founder in Essos or
fall at the hands of some 

786
00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:12,480
alliance among the Free Cities. 
Now the moment was at hand, and 

787
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:15,120
King Aegon the Fifth was gone, 
as was the Prince of 

788
00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:18,400
Dragonflies, Prince Daron. 
That splendid night had died 

789
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:22,160
years before, leaving only 
Jairus, the Laced Marshall of 

790
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:24,720
Aegon's three sons. 
That's something you touched on 

791
00:43:24,720 --> 00:43:26,720
briefly before, but now it's a 
little. 

792
00:43:26,720 --> 00:43:28,840
Now we've got kind of the 
official statement for it. 

793
00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:31,360
And it's no wonder Jairus was 
concerned. 

794
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:33,680
The scorn of his father and 
older brother was apparently 

795
00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:36,160
misplaced. 
They were, as we said before, 

796
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:37,840
Dunk. 
Prince Duncan, who died at 

797
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:42,400
Summerhall, said, you know, 
they're giving crowns out nine a

798
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:45,000
penny now. 
So they were, as we pointed out,

799
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:47,240
they did make some preparations,
but mostly they didn't take it 

800
00:43:47,240 --> 00:43:51,120
super seriously. 
And now all of a sudden, the 

801
00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:54,480
Band of Nine has conquered 3 
pretty hard to conquer places, 

802
00:43:54,720 --> 00:43:56,640
and it doesn't seem like it took
them very long. 

803
00:43:56,640 --> 00:44:00,640
So 3 hard to conquer places 
taken in a short period of time,

804
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:02,960
that's definitely going to 
change the outlook and make 

805
00:44:02,960 --> 00:44:05,840
someone like King Jerry's sit up
and pay attention. 

806
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:08,520
Huh. 
So this is a war of conquest, 

807
00:44:08,520 --> 00:44:10,360
not rebellion. 
That's really important. 

808
00:44:10,680 --> 00:44:13,120
This is why people don't call it
the Fifth Black Fire Rebellion, 

809
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:15,960
because there really wasn't, at 
least initially. 

810
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:19,320
There may have been eventually, 
had the black, had Bailey's had 

811
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:22,960
more success, but at first there
doesn't seem to have been any 

812
00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:25,400
Westerosi support for him. 
Is that right? 

813
00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:29,040
Well, I was, I was just amused 
because I, I was thinking that 

814
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:33,720
my counterparts in the Citadel 
of Westeros probably, you know, 

815
00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:38,760
there probably are lots of like 
academic books and missives back

816
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:42,600
and forth arguing this point 
like, Oh yeah, he's a black 

817
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:44,600
fire. 
So it's gotta be a black fire 

818
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:47,480
rebellion. 
No, but he didn't have any 

819
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:49,920
support in Westeros. 
So it's not a rebellion. 

820
00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:53,600
It's a foreign invasion. 
And it never actually got to 

821
00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:56,360
Westeros. 
So I imagine that there's a lot 

822
00:44:56,360 --> 00:44:58,240
of sort of back and forth on 
this. 

823
00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:00,560
Yeah, that's a good point. 
I love thinking about it. 

824
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:02,680
What the what the maestros would
be arguing over. 

825
00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:04,760
You're totally right. 
They would, absolutely they're. 

826
00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:08,120
Arguing over the War of 5 Kings 
where they're like, no, well, 

827
00:45:08,120 --> 00:45:11,600
there weren't actually 5 kings 
at any one point in time, so it 

828
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:14,520
doesn't make any sense. 
And if we count this other king,

829
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:17,000
then it's 6 kings. 
And what about Queens? 

830
00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:21,640
Other people are just like, no, 
but just people call it the word

831
00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:23,320
5 kings. 
So that's just what we're going 

832
00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:25,280
to do. 
Yeah. 

833
00:45:26,040 --> 00:45:29,520
So it's actually interesting to 
compare Maelise's claim versus 

834
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:33,160
Robert Baratheon's claim. 
There are only 23 years apart, 

835
00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:35,760
so that might some people might 
think that this that these were 

836
00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:37,920
events were farther apart, but 
that's not that's about a, you 

837
00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:41,000
know, a little more than a 
generation terms of how 

838
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:44,120
Targaryen he really was. 
You know, obviously Roberts 

839
00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:47,640
Targaryen blood was part of the 
equation for him getting the the

840
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:49,240
throne at the end of the 
rebellion. 

841
00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:55,880
And Damon Blackfyre frankly had 
more Targaryen blood than the 

842
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:57,200
guy he was trying to unseat 
Daryl. 

843
00:45:57,200 --> 00:46:01,480
Not that's some big argument or 
or advantage, but it's certainly

844
00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:04,160
was relevant to the discussion 
at the time. 

845
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:08,160
And of course, Ori's Barafian. 
Maeulis's, you know, second 

846
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:10,920
head. 
I imagine that the Blackfires 

847
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:16,560
practiced a lot more Targaryen 
incest than the Targaryens were 

848
00:46:16,560 --> 00:46:19,240
doing at that point in time. 
It's entirely possible. 

849
00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:22,920
Yeah, especially, well, Aegon 
the 5th got unlucky with his 

850
00:46:22,920 --> 00:46:26,760
kids, but you could sort of see 
that there was a a push probably

851
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:30,560
speaking to like try to to 
diversify the gene pool. 

852
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:33,560
Very true. 
It looks like the black fires 

853
00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:36,040
kind of did the reverse. 
It kind of does, doesn't it? 

854
00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:38,400
Yeah. 
And you see you see this that 

855
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:41,560
guy we talked about the one with
the filed teeth, if he had been 

856
00:46:41,560 --> 00:46:43,920
one of the black fires, you 
wonder if he'd filed his teeth 

857
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:48,080
because as a result of some sort
of other abnormality, he just 

858
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:50,560
turned it into AI don't want to 
call it a strength, but turned 

859
00:46:50,560 --> 00:46:54,160
it into a fearsome aspect. 
Now we don't even know that that

860
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:57,160
guy was a black fire, but it's 
it's fun to consider that in the

861
00:46:57,240 --> 00:47:01,960
in light of them doing bad 
things with incest, it could 

862
00:47:01,960 --> 00:47:08,920
result in, in things like that. 
But in terms of Robert, he had, 

863
00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:12,360
you know, one of his claims was 
being a descendant of Auris 

864
00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:13,920
Baratheon. 
And and of course he had 

865
00:47:14,560 --> 00:47:17,320
Targaryen blood closer in the 
bloodline to in fact, Egg's 

866
00:47:17,320 --> 00:47:22,160
children were were married into 
his dynasty, his family rather. 

867
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:24,960
And they're both warriors. 
That's another important 

868
00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:26,440
comparison. 
I mean, Robert and Meilis were 

869
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:28,680
both fearsome warriors. 
Meilis, you could say maybe was 

870
00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:31,560
a little more scary because of 
what he looked like, but Robert 

871
00:47:31,560 --> 00:47:34,280
could kill you just as well. 
I think he was, you know, in 

872
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:37,600
terms of a fighting skill, I 
doubt we could say we don't know

873
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,360
whether Meilis or Robert was 
more skilled, but Robert was 

874
00:47:40,360 --> 00:47:41,720
certainly incredible as a 
warrior. 

875
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:46,600
But here we have Jaharis has a 
big weakling and his son Aries 

876
00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:49,040
the second is also a weakling 
and that's who Robert fought 

877
00:47:49,040 --> 00:47:51,280
against. 
So there's some interesting 

878
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:53,440
little parallels there. 
Now, of course, there's no 

879
00:47:53,440 --> 00:47:56,600
Dragons in either scenario, but 
wildfire of course, hangs over 

880
00:47:56,600 --> 00:48:00,240
both because Aries was certainly
going to blow up King's Landing 

881
00:48:00,240 --> 00:48:04,440
near the end and this war 9 
Penny Kings was significantly 

882
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:05,840
boosted by Summer Hall 
happening. 

883
00:48:06,520 --> 00:48:10,760
Whatever Westeros kid Marshall 
to stop this threat. 

884
00:48:11,240 --> 00:48:14,840
Let's summarize real quickly 
what the Band of nine had as 

885
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:18,160
they're moving into the the 
across the Stepstones. 

886
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:21,920
So they had the disputed lands, 
they had Tai Rash, most or all 

887
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:23,720
the step stones. 
We don't know exactly at what 

888
00:48:23,720 --> 00:48:28,160
point Westeros sent their armies
to the step stones to interfere 

889
00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:32,040
with all this, but probably 
wasn't right away, especially 

890
00:48:32,040 --> 00:48:34,680
because of what we were saying 
about how quickly the Band of 

891
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:39,800
Nine was moving. 2 pirate fleets
plus whatever ships they 

892
00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:44,400
suborned from Thai Rosh itself, 
at least 4 cell sword companies,

893
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:49,200
including the Golden Company and
lots of money. 

894
00:48:49,720 --> 00:48:52,280
They'd sacked Thai Rosh. 
The Golden Company probably had 

895
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:54,680
built up a lot, a decent bit of 
wealth itself. 

896
00:48:54,680 --> 00:48:58,440
Melee's probably had some cash. 
We've got pirate Lords, they've 

897
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:01,200
got their, they've got all their
loot stashed, things like that. 

898
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:07,040
And the fact that Thai Rosh is 
having lots of cell sorts. 

899
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:09,560
Thai Rosh just has is a, is a 
city that is known for having 

900
00:49:09,680 --> 00:49:12,640
and hiring cell sort companies. 
So they probably picked up a few

901
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:15,240
others and along the way there, 
it probably wasn't just the ones

902
00:49:15,240 --> 00:49:18,240
that were controlled directly by
the bandit. 9 would you get, 

903
00:49:18,240 --> 00:49:23,440
would you? 
The commander of the Westerosi 

904
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:26,720
armies was fittingly, Lord Orman
Baratheon. 

905
00:49:26,720 --> 00:49:30,040
How nice a Baratheon. 
Jerry's the second, even though 

906
00:49:30,040 --> 00:49:34,080
we mentioned he was kind of a 
weakling, but he wasn't weak in 

907
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:37,360
terms of his attitude. 
He wanted to lead the troops. 

908
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:41,200
But Orman talked him out of it, 
saying, look, man, you're just 

909
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:43,480
your health is delicate. 
You're you're not. 

910
00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:45,160
This is not the kind of campaign
for you. 

911
00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:48,880
And you might wonder if Ormond 
was just trying to get the glory

912
00:49:48,880 --> 00:49:51,440
for himself, but it sounds like 
he was telling the truth. 

913
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:54,920
Joe Harris died in his 30s just 
of ill health. 

914
00:49:54,920 --> 00:49:56,840
There's no evidence that it was 
poison. 

915
00:49:56,840 --> 00:49:59,040
No reason to suspect that, as 
far as I know. 

916
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:02,360
So it really does seem like 
Ormond was right. 

917
00:50:02,800 --> 00:50:06,320
Given all the things like plague
and disease and and all the 

918
00:50:06,320 --> 00:50:09,960
different difficulties that the 
soldiers faced, it was probably 

919
00:50:10,080 --> 00:50:13,160
Ormond was probably right. 
Another person who could have 

920
00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:16,760
had an opinion on this was well,
we mentioned him already, 

921
00:50:17,160 --> 00:50:21,440
Paisel. 
And here's a quote from Paisel. 

922
00:50:21,920 --> 00:50:24,560
Unlike his brothers, Jerry's 
Second Targaryen was thin and 

923
00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:27,320
scrawny and had battled various 
ailments all his life. 

924
00:50:27,600 --> 00:50:29,920
Yet he did not lack for courage 
or intelligence. 

925
00:50:30,160 --> 00:50:32,960
Drawing on his father's plans, 
His Grace put aside his grief, 

926
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:35,640
called his Lords bannerman, and 
resolved to meet the Ninepenny 

927
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:38,440
Kings upon the Stepstones, 
choosing to take the war to them

928
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:40,680
rather than awaiting their 
landing on the shores of the 

929
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:43,160
Seven Kingdoms. 
King Jihari said intended to 

930
00:50:43,160 --> 00:50:46,040
lead the attack upon the 
Ninepenny Kings himself, but his

931
00:50:46,040 --> 00:50:48,880
hand, Lord Orman Baratheon, 
persuaded him that would be 

932
00:50:48,880 --> 00:50:50,800
unwise. 
The King was unused to the 

933
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:53,680
rigors of campaign and not 
skilled in arms, the Hand 

934
00:50:53,680 --> 00:50:56,760
pointed out, and it would be 
folly to risk losing him in 

935
00:50:56,760 --> 00:51:00,360
battle so soon after the tragedy
of Summerhall. 

936
00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:02,760
That's a decent point. 
A lot of good points there. 

937
00:51:03,080 --> 00:51:04,680
So, Lord Orman, let's talk about
him. 

938
00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:10,200
It was his father Lionel, AKA 
the Laughing Storm, who dueled 

939
00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:14,000
none other than Sir Duncan the 
Tall when Prince Duncan the 

940
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:19,840
Small married Jenny of Old 
Stones instead of Lord Lionel's 

941
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:23,480
daughter. 
Now the fallout of that was a 

942
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:28,400
very short war that resulted in 
a trial by a combat of sorts 

943
00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:30,320
between Duncan and the Laughing 
Storm. 

944
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:33,800
Not to the death, but Sir Duncan
won and the Laughing Storm gave 

945
00:51:33,800 --> 00:51:37,600
up his crown. 
And part of the arrangement was 

946
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:41,880
for him to marry a Lord Ormond, 
which Sir Ormond at the time 

947
00:51:42,360 --> 00:51:45,560
Lionel's son, to marry Rael, one
of Egg's daughters. 

948
00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:49,760
So they redid the marriage 
alignment arrangement with a 

949
00:51:49,760 --> 00:51:54,520
different pair of children. 
So this is also, by the way, the

950
00:51:54,520 --> 00:51:57,520
basis for Robert and Stannis and
Renly's claim to the throne, 

951
00:51:57,520 --> 00:52:00,920
this marriage to Rael. 
So this has this this switching 

952
00:52:00,920 --> 00:52:03,160
up of things actually had some 
pretty far reaching 

953
00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:06,680
consequences. 
Lord Ormond's captains include 

954
00:52:07,320 --> 00:52:11,200
for several guys who were not 
named, but a few that are like 

955
00:52:11,200 --> 00:52:14,240
Sir Jason Lannister. 
Not to be confused with the Lord

956
00:52:14,240 --> 00:52:16,360
of Cast the Rock during the 
Dance, who was married to 

957
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:19,680
Johanna. 
This is the father of Joanna, as

958
00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:24,320
in Tywin's wife, mother of 
Cersei and Jamie and Tyrion. 

959
00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:28,360
And this is also the father of 
Stafford Lannister, the one who 

960
00:52:28,360 --> 00:52:31,480
is killed at Ox Cross by Ricard 
Karstark. 

961
00:52:32,320 --> 00:52:35,080
So in other words, the 
grandfather to Jamie, Searcy and

962
00:52:35,080 --> 00:52:37,720
Tyrion here. 
So that's pretty interesting. 

963
00:52:37,920 --> 00:52:40,360
And we also have Lord Kellan 
Greyjoy, who I mentioned. 

964
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:43,120
That's the father of Bailon and 
Euron and Victorian and all 

965
00:52:43,120 --> 00:52:47,520
those guys. 
He came over and we got a quote 

966
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:49,680
from him, A leal servant of the 
Iron Throne. 

967
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:53,160
He led 100 long ships around the
bottom of Westeros during the 

968
00:52:53,160 --> 00:52:56,720
War of 9 Penny Kings and played 
a crucial role in the fighting 

969
00:52:56,720 --> 00:52:58,800
around the Stepstones. 
Now here's where we're really 

970
00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:00,640
getting into. 
We really have to speculate, 

971
00:53:01,240 --> 00:53:03,680
were there Manderlys or 
Valerians or Celtic Guards or 

972
00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:06,760
Pharmans or the Arbor, any of 
the other island nations were 

973
00:53:06,760 --> 00:53:08,920
involved? 
And because they would be really

974
00:53:08,920 --> 00:53:11,720
valuable in dealing with island 
warfare there. 

975
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:14,120
They've lived on these places 
for thousands of years. 

976
00:53:14,520 --> 00:53:18,160
But there might be some internal
politicking. 

977
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:21,600
Who wants to be commanded by a 
Greyjoy? 

978
00:53:21,680 --> 00:53:26,200
A lot of Lords and their pride 
would not allow for that. 

979
00:53:26,200 --> 00:53:27,360
What do you think? 
Do you think that would have 

980
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:31,600
been would have been a problem? 
It may be that there were like 

981
00:53:31,720 --> 00:53:35,000
several fleets going on at once,
right? 

982
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:38,600
That you know the the Grey Joey 
fleet of long ships is much 

983
00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:43,600
better suited for fast moving 
harassment than. 

984
00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:46,960
Yeah, that's true. 
Then big capital ships that can 

985
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:51,200
hold hundreds of warriors inside
them. 

986
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:55,040
So it it may be that they were 
sort of operating separately. 

987
00:53:55,040 --> 00:53:57,600
One other thing that I want I 
wanted to touch on is that 

988
00:53:57,880 --> 00:53:59,880
Ormond also brought his son, 
Stephen. 

989
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:04,000
Yeah. 
And Stephen was very close to 

990
00:54:04,800 --> 00:54:08,680
Eris. 
He was his his page and Squire. 

991
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:11,040
That is a big deal. 
That's, of course, that's 

992
00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:13,800
Roberts and Stannis and Renly's 
father, rather than Ormond and 

993
00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:15,520
grandfather. 
One of the things that sort of 

994
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:17,880
that we always have to keep in 
mind with the war of 9 Penny 

995
00:54:17,880 --> 00:54:21,080
Kings is like these these 
generational issues, right? 

996
00:54:21,400 --> 00:54:25,840
You know, fathers and sons kind 
of working together, one 

997
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:30,760
replacing the other, this sort 
of politics and and dynastic 

998
00:54:30,760 --> 00:54:32,920
succession in brief, all kind of
mixing. 

999
00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:37,360
Very true. 
Now Jason Lannister getting back

1000
00:54:37,360 --> 00:54:40,360
to him for a second. 
He apparently brought 10,000 

1001
00:54:40,360 --> 00:54:43,240
infantry and 1000 nights. 
Now that's the Westerland's 

1002
00:54:43,240 --> 00:54:44,680
compliment. 
Maybe the Westerland's 

1003
00:54:44,680 --> 00:54:47,720
compliment was particularly 
large, but even if only, say, 

1004
00:54:47,920 --> 00:54:52,600
5000 came each from Dorn, the 
Iron Islands, the Storm lands, 

1005
00:54:52,600 --> 00:54:54,880
the Crown lands, the river 
lands, the Vale on the north, 

1006
00:54:55,200 --> 00:54:58,760
this could be a very, very big 
army. 

1007
00:54:58,760 --> 00:55:00,920
You know, it wouldn't all be in 
one place at one time, else we'd

1008
00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:03,960
be talking field of fire for the
largest ever army assembled. 

1009
00:55:03,960 --> 00:55:07,040
But still, this is a very large 
amount of troops. 

1010
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:10,520
And it contains notables like we
mentioned them at the beginning.

1011
00:55:10,520 --> 00:55:13,720
But here's where Barristan and 
Blackfish, who weren't well 

1012
00:55:13,720 --> 00:55:16,720
known at this point, well, 
they're about to be well known. 

1013
00:55:16,720 --> 00:55:18,640
They're getting this is where 
they made their name. 

1014
00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:21,880
Here's another quote. 
We get specifics about some of 

1015
00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:25,520
the other Lannisters besides 
Jason, as well as a few other 

1016
00:55:25,520 --> 00:55:29,160
important mentioned characters. 
Knighted on the eve of the 

1017
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:32,880
conflict, Sarah Tywin Lannister 
fought in the retinue of the 

1018
00:55:32,880 --> 00:55:37,440
King's young heir, Aries, Prince
of Dragonstone, and was given 

1019
00:55:37,440 --> 00:55:39,280
the honor of dubbing him at 
knight. 

1020
00:55:39,480 --> 00:55:43,160
At war's end. 
Kevin Lannister, squiring for 

1021
00:55:43,160 --> 00:55:47,960
the Red Lion, also won his spurs
and was knighted by Roger Raine 

1022
00:55:47,960 --> 00:55:51,040
himself. 
Their brother Tiger, a Squire of

1023
00:55:51,040 --> 00:55:54,800
10, was too young for 
knighthood, but his courage and 

1024
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:59,480
skill at arms were remarked upon
by all, for he slew a grown man 

1025
00:55:59,480 --> 00:56:03,320
in his first battle and three 
more in later fights, one of 

1026
00:56:03,320 --> 00:56:08,160
them a knight of Golden Company.
Those who beheld these proud 

1027
00:56:08,160 --> 00:56:12,400
Young Lions on the battlefield 
might rightly wonder how such 

1028
00:56:12,400 --> 00:56:16,360
could ever have sprung from the 
loins of the quivering fool 

1029
00:56:16,360 --> 00:56:20,840
beneath the Rock, Grand Maester 
Pycelle wrote scornfully in his 

1030
00:56:20,840 --> 00:56:25,320
observations upon the recent 
bloodletting on the Stepstones. 

1031
00:56:25,320 --> 00:56:26,640
Recent bloodletting on the 
Stepstones. 

1032
00:56:26,640 --> 00:56:30,680
So it means it's it implies he 
wrote that fairly like right 

1033
00:56:30,680 --> 00:56:33,240
after this war, which is pretty 
interesting. 

1034
00:56:33,240 --> 00:56:34,880
It's obviously very pro 
Lannister. 

1035
00:56:35,320 --> 00:56:38,800
I also love that title because 
it's sort of that perfect, like 

1036
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:41,480
academic boring title. 
It's like you're talking about, 

1037
00:56:42,120 --> 00:56:45,800
you know, this enormous, you 
know, recent, you know, upheaval

1038
00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:49,040
and it's, you know, observations
on the recent Bloodlette. 

1039
00:56:49,600 --> 00:56:56,840
It's, you know, it's just so 
trying, trying to strip out all 

1040
00:56:56,840 --> 00:57:00,040
of the drama, yeah. 
It's like, man, this was really 

1041
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:02,360
more interesting than you make 
it sound by itself. 

1042
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:07,120
But a couple observations from 
that, for example, this shows us

1043
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:09,680
a lot was we, we're going to get
into the details, but this was a

1044
00:57:09,680 --> 00:57:12,800
really nasty war. 
And that for someone like Tywin 

1045
00:57:12,800 --> 00:57:16,680
to get and Kevin and Tygut all 
that have been there early on, 

1046
00:57:17,320 --> 00:57:20,760
it really says a lot about their
development and why they became,

1047
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:24,440
well, the way they turned out. 
And it's, it's a bit sad too, 

1048
00:57:24,440 --> 00:57:28,440
because Kevin Lannister squiring
for the Red Lion, was knighted 

1049
00:57:28,440 --> 00:57:31,640
by the Red Lion. 
It's not long after this war 

1050
00:57:31,640 --> 00:57:35,080
ends that those two, well, all 
of those two houses go to war 

1051
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:37,840
effectively. 
And so Kevin's on the side is, 

1052
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:40,280
is, is fighting against the man 
who knighted him. 

1053
00:57:40,280 --> 00:57:42,400
That's, that's, that's not fun. 
That's not weird. 

1054
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:46,800
That's not ideal by any means. 
And interestingly, we're told 

1055
00:57:46,800 --> 00:57:50,400
that Gary and Lannister, the 4th
brother who's not mentioned 

1056
00:57:50,400 --> 00:57:53,800
here, Tywin's youngest brother, 
was, according to Tyrion, he was

1057
00:57:53,800 --> 00:57:57,680
sort of the the odd man out. 
He was separate from his other 

1058
00:57:57,680 --> 00:58:00,200
three brothers. 
And this explains why almost 

1059
00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:03,080
certainly, maybe it's just a 
coincidence, but he's the one 

1060
00:58:03,080 --> 00:58:04,720
that wasn't part of it. 
The other three went through 

1061
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:07,720
this experience, this bonding 
experience, this formative 

1062
00:58:07,720 --> 00:58:09,880
experience together. 
Garin was too young for it. 

1063
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:13,000
So it's no wonder that he tried 
to go make a name for himself by

1064
00:58:13,000 --> 00:58:15,960
doing something kind of crazy 
and unique by going to sailing 

1065
00:58:15,960 --> 00:58:17,720
to Valyria and and such like 
that. 

1066
00:58:17,760 --> 00:58:22,320
Yeah. 
And it also speaks to how three 

1067
00:58:22,320 --> 00:58:26,440
brothers who are a very 
different personalities who 

1068
00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:30,120
don't always get along very well
could have then cooperated 

1069
00:58:30,160 --> 00:58:33,560
during the brains of Castmere. 
I, I, you know, we'll get into 

1070
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:38,280
this more later, but I think 
that sort of initial bonding 

1071
00:58:38,280 --> 00:58:41,960
experience was really important 
in making sure that like all of 

1072
00:58:41,960 --> 00:58:45,680
House Lannister was on the same 
team when that. 

1073
00:58:46,040 --> 00:58:49,960
Started and of course it it it's
huge for Tywin's relationship 

1074
00:58:49,960 --> 00:58:52,800
with Aries, which as we know was
good to begin with it was good 

1075
00:58:52,800 --> 00:58:55,080
for a long time. 
They were like best friends on 

1076
00:58:55,080 --> 00:58:58,520
the OR or at least something 
like that certainly had a strong

1077
00:58:58,520 --> 00:59:01,600
working relationship. 
Of course, things went bad much 

1078
00:59:01,600 --> 00:59:05,960
later, in part because of 
Aries's growing into madness and

1079
00:59:05,960 --> 00:59:08,640
and Tywin being his own Lord and
I'm just having mother other 

1080
00:59:08,640 --> 00:59:11,360
things to disagree on. 
But anyway, this is where that 

1081
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:13,440
started and it shows that it 
started well. 

1082
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:16,760
They started off as on on the 
right foot, but much later 

1083
00:59:16,760 --> 00:59:18,560
things went bad. 
So let's talk about a few other 

1084
00:59:18,560 --> 00:59:22,520
characters who would have been 
of age or of an age to be at 

1085
00:59:22,520 --> 00:59:24,480
least involved or impacted by 
this. 

1086
00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:27,280
Doran Martel would have been 12 
or 13 years old. 

1087
00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:30,040
We don't, of course. 
He probably didn't fight in the 

1088
00:59:30,040 --> 00:59:32,840
war, but we know we have a quote
here about Doran's 

1089
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:36,200
participation. 
Doran continued to be closely 

1090
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:39,520
allied with House Targaryen in 
the years that followed, with 

1091
00:59:39,520 --> 00:59:42,640
the Martels supporting the 
Targaryens against the Black 

1092
00:59:42,640 --> 00:59:46,520
Fire pretenders and sending 
Spears to fight the Ninepenny 

1093
00:59:46,520 --> 00:59:50,400
Kings on the Stepstones. 
So John Aaron was already 40 

1094
00:59:50,400 --> 00:59:52,560
years old. 
He probably was. 

1095
00:59:52,560 --> 00:59:54,040
He may have already been lured 
by then. 

1096
00:59:54,440 --> 00:59:57,440
Bronzeon Royce, who's an older 
man, would have been of age to 

1097
00:59:57,440 --> 01:00:01,400
fight in this war. 
John Aaron being the the Warden 

1098
01:00:01,400 --> 01:00:05,240
of the East right, The 
Stepstones are his bailiwick. 

1099
01:00:05,440 --> 01:00:07,560
Good point, Good point. 
So, you know, he's sort of 

1100
01:00:07,560 --> 01:00:10,480
legally obligated to do 
something about all of it. 

1101
01:00:10,840 --> 01:00:13,480
Very true. 
Walder Frey would have been 52 

1102
01:00:13,480 --> 01:00:16,440
years old, so he wouldn't have 
fought in this war, but he may 

1103
01:00:16,440 --> 01:00:19,840
have sensed Evron Frey, the the 
his heir who fought in the War 

1104
01:00:19,840 --> 01:00:23,560
of 5 Kings with Rob and died at 
long not long after. 

1105
01:00:23,560 --> 01:00:28,160
I think it was Ox Cross Amy's 
Frey, one of the architects of 

1106
01:00:28,160 --> 01:00:30,800
the Red Wedding. 
He's of age to have maybe fought

1107
01:00:30,800 --> 01:00:33,360
in that war, although he's he's 
said to be more of a commander 

1108
01:00:33,360 --> 01:00:34,600
type. 
But still, he would have had to 

1109
01:00:34,600 --> 01:00:38,040
do some, you know, soldiering 
before he moved up the ranks. 

1110
01:00:38,360 --> 01:00:41,160
Luthor Tyrell, the one who rode 
off the Cliff, would have been 

1111
01:00:41,160 --> 01:00:44,800
Lord of Highgarden around here. 
Certainly you'd expect the the 

1112
01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:46,880
red wines or the high towers 
with. 

1113
01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:49,120
The. 
Naval forces to be involved. 

1114
01:00:49,360 --> 01:00:51,840
Very good point. 
Plus they're just such powerful 

1115
01:00:51,840 --> 01:00:55,480
houses that it would be shameful
for them not to contribute to 

1116
01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:58,600
the defense of the entire 
continent, which is a different 

1117
01:00:58,600 --> 01:01:01,480
situation than internal fight. 
When they when 2 houses fight 

1118
01:01:01,480 --> 01:01:02,840
each other, that's a different 
look. 

1119
01:01:02,840 --> 01:01:05,280
It's like, well, it's internal. 
It's a civil thing. 

1120
01:01:05,280 --> 01:01:08,200
We, we don't necessarily have to
take a side, but it's, it's kind

1121
01:01:08,200 --> 01:01:12,120
of cowardly for an outside 
invader to come and for houses 

1122
01:01:12,120 --> 01:01:14,360
to not help. 
I think that's it's, it's one of

1123
01:01:14,360 --> 01:01:17,040
those noble sort of, it's like a
pride thing. 

1124
01:01:17,600 --> 01:01:20,240
A Hoster Tully's father would 
have been Lord of River Run. 

1125
01:01:20,240 --> 01:01:22,520
And Hoster Tully definitely 
fought in this war. 

1126
01:01:22,560 --> 01:01:26,480
We know that he this is when he 
met and apparently befriended 

1127
01:01:26,920 --> 01:01:30,680
Lord Peter Baelish's dad. 
And that's how that whole 

1128
01:01:30,680 --> 01:01:34,960
situation got started with the 
fostering of of Peter at River 

1129
01:01:34,960 --> 01:01:35,440
Run. 
So. 

1130
01:01:37,160 --> 01:01:42,960
Interesting because this is 
before him and the Blackfish 

1131
01:01:42,960 --> 01:01:44,840
have their falling out. 
Oh yeah, yeah. 

1132
01:01:44,840 --> 01:01:47,280
So it would have been sort of 
one of the few times where you 

1133
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:51,440
could see the two Tully brothers
kind of getting along. 

1134
01:01:51,440 --> 01:01:55,360
Now given their their 
relationship, I imagine it was 

1135
01:01:55,360 --> 01:01:58,960
always somewhat contentious, but
they were not yet not speaking 

1136
01:01:58,960 --> 01:02:00,880
to each other. 
Yeah, you wonder if Hoster was 

1137
01:02:00,880 --> 01:02:03,920
maybe a little jealous that 
Blackfish the younger, his 

1138
01:02:03,920 --> 01:02:06,200
younger brother is the one that 
got famous from this. 

1139
01:02:06,200 --> 01:02:09,760
He's the one that really rose in
esteem and and got popular and 

1140
01:02:09,760 --> 01:02:12,080
noticed. 
Whereas, you know, as the way 

1141
01:02:12,280 --> 01:02:15,440
pride amongst nobility works and
the way the elders are supposed 

1142
01:02:15,440 --> 01:02:17,320
to be, you know, they get 
everything. 

1143
01:02:18,080 --> 01:02:22,160
So it might be a, a point of 
pride for Hoster and a point of,

1144
01:02:22,280 --> 01:02:25,400
of, well, something for 
Blackfish to hold over his his 

1145
01:02:25,400 --> 01:02:29,200
older brother, which could in 
turn be fuel some of their 

1146
01:02:29,200 --> 01:02:30,920
arguments over marriage and 
things like that. 

1147
01:02:31,360 --> 01:02:33,640
Ed Weil Stark would have been 
Lord of Winterfell at the time. 

1148
01:02:33,640 --> 01:02:36,960
That's Ned's grandfather. 
Wyman Manderley would have been 

1149
01:02:36,960 --> 01:02:40,560
in his late teens, Gior Mormont 
would have been of age to fight 

1150
01:02:40,560 --> 01:02:42,680
in this war, Sir Roderick 
Cassell as well. 

1151
01:02:42,680 --> 01:02:45,480
And we don't know that they did.
It's just it makes sense that 

1152
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:47,520
they would have. 
Joe Magician brings up What 

1153
01:02:47,520 --> 01:02:50,680
about Black Walder Afraid? 
Black Walder, I'm not sure how 

1154
01:02:50,680 --> 01:02:51,760
old he is. 
I think he might have been a 

1155
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:53,760
little too young, but that's a 
possibility. 

1156
01:02:53,760 --> 01:02:57,440
I think he might only be in his 
40s, which would mean he was two

1157
01:02:57,440 --> 01:03:01,480
years old or three years old. 
But Rickard Stark. 

1158
01:03:02,040 --> 01:03:05,720
Yeah, Rickard would have been. 
A very strong possibility 

1159
01:03:05,720 --> 01:03:09,400
because his whole southern 
ambitions, right, had to start 

1160
01:03:09,400 --> 01:03:12,760
somewhere and where better to 
like start building 

1161
01:03:12,760 --> 01:03:18,520
relationships with people as 
far-flung as like John Aaron or 

1162
01:03:18,560 --> 01:03:23,560
Hoster Tully then being at war. 
And we know that, like Richard 

1163
01:03:23,560 --> 01:03:30,160
Stark was like a very was a 
talented warrior because he was 

1164
01:03:30,160 --> 01:03:34,840
like absolutely sure that come a
trial by combat with one of the 

1165
01:03:34,840 --> 01:03:41,280
Kingsguard, I can win. 
So, you know, he he probably was

1166
01:03:41,280 --> 01:03:43,520
a bit of a badass. 
That's a good point, yeah. 

1167
01:03:44,600 --> 01:03:46,720
As far as other people in the 
Stormlands, Maester Crescent 

1168
01:03:46,720 --> 01:03:49,800
would have been the maester 
would have been a maester, maybe

1169
01:03:49,800 --> 01:03:52,800
at either at Storm's End or 
Dragonstone. 

1170
01:03:53,040 --> 01:03:55,320
Donald Noy. 
Donald Noy, the blacksmith at 

1171
01:03:55,320 --> 01:03:58,880
the Wall, he would have been of 
age and he was blacksmith or at 

1172
01:03:58,880 --> 01:04:01,120
least at Storm's End around this
time. 

1173
01:04:01,800 --> 01:04:04,560
Some of the other Kingsguard, of
course, because Aries is going 

1174
01:04:04,560 --> 01:04:06,400
Prince, he's the Prince, he's 
the heir to the throne. 

1175
01:04:06,720 --> 01:04:08,520
Of course there would be 
Kingsguard there. 

1176
01:04:08,520 --> 01:04:10,840
Now what's interesting about the
Kingsguard at this time is it 

1177
01:04:10,840 --> 01:04:14,640
would be mostly a fresh batch of
Kingsguard because Summerhall 

1178
01:04:15,080 --> 01:04:19,000
very likely wiped out most if 
not nearly all of them because 

1179
01:04:19,000 --> 01:04:22,000
the whole royal family was there
minus maybe one or two. 

1180
01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:24,720
And wherever the royal family 
is, the Kingsguard goes to. 

1181
01:04:25,120 --> 01:04:28,120
And we know Duncan died there, 
Duncan Batal. 

1182
01:04:28,560 --> 01:04:30,600
And so they lost their. 
Lord Commander. 

1183
01:04:30,960 --> 01:04:36,000
Yeah, and so Gerald Hightower is
maybe the new Lord Commander, 

1184
01:04:36,440 --> 01:04:38,800
which would be a little unusual 
for a younger man to be Lord 

1185
01:04:38,800 --> 01:04:40,520
commander when there were 
veterans. 

1186
01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:43,960
But there probably weren't 
veterans because of Summerhall. 

1187
01:04:44,480 --> 01:04:48,560
And it wouldn't be long, in 
fact, before Gerald would be in 

1188
01:04:48,560 --> 01:04:51,600
charge of the whole army. 
So let's talk about what 

1189
01:04:51,600 --> 01:04:54,920
happened, because he was not in 
charge at first. 

1190
01:04:55,080 --> 01:04:59,440
Now this is where we're getting 
back to your idea that there may

1191
01:04:59,480 --> 01:05:01,680
have been a trap. 
So let me let's do this quote 

1192
01:05:01,680 --> 01:05:06,040
and we'll get to that. 
In 260 AC, his lordship landed 

1193
01:05:06,040 --> 01:05:10,000
Targaryen armies upon three of 
the Stepstones, and the War of 

1194
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:12,280
the 9 Penny Kings turned. 
Bloody. 

1195
01:05:12,600 --> 01:05:16,160
Battle raged across the islands 
and the channels between for 

1196
01:05:16,160 --> 01:05:19,680
most of that year. 
Maester Eon's account of the War

1197
01:05:19,680 --> 01:05:24,200
of the 9 Penny Kings, one of the
finest works of its kind, is a 

1198
01:05:24,200 --> 01:05:27,760
splendid source for the details 
of the fighting, with its many 

1199
01:05:27,760 --> 01:05:31,080
battles on land and sea and 
notable feats of arms. 

1200
01:05:31,080 --> 01:05:33,480
Yeah, I wish we had that book. 
So let's talk about this. 

1201
01:05:33,480 --> 01:05:37,240
The early fighting almost right 
away. 

1202
01:05:37,760 --> 01:05:43,040
Lord Ormond Baratheon is killed 
by Meilis the monstrous and dies

1203
01:05:43,040 --> 01:05:47,000
in the arms of Stefan Baratheon,
his son, again, father of Robert

1204
01:05:47,000 --> 01:05:49,360
Stannis and Renly. 
So you have a a theory here. 

1205
01:05:49,600 --> 01:05:53,200
I like this, but whatever. 
Just a little more background, 

1206
01:05:53,200 --> 01:05:56,920
Lord Ormond, probably a big guy 
like almost every Baratheon we 

1207
01:05:56,920 --> 01:05:59,440
hear about is a big guy. 
So this would have been might 

1208
01:05:59,440 --> 01:06:01,760
have been quite a fight here. 
And we already compared melees 

1209
01:06:01,760 --> 01:06:04,600
to Robert before, so I can't 
help thinking of a Robert like 

1210
01:06:04,600 --> 01:06:08,320
figure facing a melees with two 
heads and his giant weapon. 

1211
01:06:08,520 --> 01:06:10,400
That would have been something 
cool. 

1212
01:06:10,760 --> 01:06:12,600
Anyway, tell us, what do you 
think? 

1213
01:06:12,960 --> 01:06:18,240
So the fact that Ormond is among
the first to die and dies 

1214
01:06:18,240 --> 01:06:22,480
specifically at the hands of 
melees makes me think that this 

1215
01:06:22,480 --> 01:06:26,800
was something of a trap that 
basically, you know, at least in

1216
01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:31,160
these early battles, Malus's 
whole plan was, well, let me cut

1217
01:06:31,160 --> 01:06:36,680
the head off the snake, right? 
Go after, ambush the leadership 

1218
01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:39,880
of the Westeros sea armies, and 
then, you know, they're 

1219
01:06:39,880 --> 01:06:42,120
scattered across multiple 
islands. 

1220
01:06:42,360 --> 01:06:46,800
It's very difficult to have 
communication and coordination 

1221
01:06:46,880 --> 01:06:50,600
in the best of case, but if I 
can take out the the leadership,

1222
01:06:50,600 --> 01:06:55,520
then it's like each little bit 
is fighting on its own and not 

1223
01:06:55,520 --> 01:06:59,640
fighting as a unified mass, 
which is if you have to fight a 

1224
01:06:59,640 --> 01:07:03,680
bigger opponent. 
And given how many 10s of 

1225
01:07:03,680 --> 01:07:07,280
thousands of men the Westerosi 
brought with them, that's not a 

1226
01:07:07,280 --> 01:07:10,000
bad way to go about it. 
That's a great point too. 

1227
01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:12,120
Just the fact that you you 
mentioned that there were so 

1228
01:07:12,120 --> 01:07:15,880
many men on probably on both 
sides, yet somehow Melius and 

1229
01:07:15,880 --> 01:07:17,800
Orman go at it almost right 
away. 

1230
01:07:18,160 --> 01:07:19,960
It does imply something was up 
there. 

1231
01:07:19,960 --> 01:07:23,640
I mean, maybe there were just 
two just guys that just really 

1232
01:07:24,160 --> 01:07:26,280
wanted to go against each other 
since they're so big and 

1233
01:07:26,280 --> 01:07:28,240
noticeable across the 
battlefield that it was 

1234
01:07:28,240 --> 01:07:30,200
something simpler like that. 
But I, I agree with you. 

1235
01:07:30,200 --> 01:07:33,560
There's a lot of room for 
something suspicious to be up 

1236
01:07:33,560 --> 01:07:36,200
here. 
If not a trap, at least a, a 

1237
01:07:36,200 --> 01:07:39,880
well planned counter strike was 
like, look here, we know they're

1238
01:07:39,880 --> 01:07:41,640
coming. 
We know we have an idea where 

1239
01:07:41,640 --> 01:07:44,200
they're going to land and we're 
going to be ready for them. 

1240
01:07:44,400 --> 01:07:49,760
Likely Ormond is crossing in the
flagship, so it's possible to 

1241
01:07:49,760 --> 01:07:53,760
sort of identify his vessel 
ahead of time and sort of say, 

1242
01:07:53,760 --> 01:07:57,200
OK, I know where he's going to 
be, let me go after. 

1243
01:07:57,640 --> 01:08:00,240
And you can understand why they 
would want to why the Malius 

1244
01:08:00,240 --> 01:08:02,920
would want to strike at the 
Westerosi forces quickly, 

1245
01:08:03,080 --> 01:08:07,040
because with the step stones, 
it's it's this crazy chaotic 

1246
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:10,440
space. 
If you allow them to build a 

1247
01:08:10,440 --> 01:08:14,880
base of operations, then this 
becomes quite a difficult 

1248
01:08:14,880 --> 01:08:17,040
endeavor for both sides. 
But if you can maybe stop them 

1249
01:08:17,040 --> 01:08:18,720
from getting that initial 
foothold. 

1250
01:08:18,960 --> 01:08:21,439
It says in that quote that 
they'd landed armies on three of

1251
01:08:21,439 --> 01:08:23,200
the step stones. 
So they were aware that they 

1252
01:08:23,200 --> 01:08:27,640
needed to have a broad start. 
They can't just grab a corner of

1253
01:08:27,640 --> 01:08:29,680
one step stone and kind of work 
from there. 

1254
01:08:29,680 --> 01:08:32,399
You need to have a take off a 
bigger chunk at the beginning. 

1255
01:08:33,160 --> 01:08:36,080
And this is partly why if they 
had just grabbed 1 little spot, 

1256
01:08:36,319 --> 01:08:39,600
well, it'd be really be even 
easier for the for the black 

1257
01:08:39,600 --> 01:08:43,479
fire forces to come and find 
that one place and concentrate 

1258
01:08:43,479 --> 01:08:46,240
on it. 
So there's a lot of potential 

1259
01:08:46,240 --> 01:08:48,439
for spying and and 
reconnaissance to have played a 

1260
01:08:48,439 --> 01:08:52,359
huge role here for the pirate 
ships to have really made use of

1261
01:08:52,359 --> 01:08:55,680
their our knowledge of the area 
and and bring that to a great 

1262
01:08:55,680 --> 01:08:59,800
advantage because this is 
something the not the the black 

1263
01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:02,560
fireside, then the band of nine 
side would be. 

1264
01:09:03,200 --> 01:09:05,800
Experts on the Stepstones. 
But they might be and the 

1265
01:09:05,800 --> 01:09:08,120
Westerosi armies are definitely 
not. 

1266
01:09:08,120 --> 01:09:12,399
That's the, I would say that 
probably using a sports term 

1267
01:09:12,399 --> 01:09:15,640
that that Westeros was kind of 
the away team here. 

1268
01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:18,240
And the the Band of Nine, even 
if they weren't experts on the 

1269
01:09:18,240 --> 01:09:20,279
Stepstones, they at least had 
some time to get used to it. 

1270
01:09:20,520 --> 01:09:22,760
And we know that some of their 
forces were used to it. 

1271
01:09:22,760 --> 01:09:26,160
So that's a a big advantage in 
terms of terrain and knowing the

1272
01:09:26,160 --> 01:09:30,000
lay of the land. 
The white Pole replaces Lord 

1273
01:09:30,000 --> 01:09:35,319
Ormond after this potentially 
epic duel between males and Lord

1274
01:09:35,319 --> 01:09:38,240
Ormond. 
We don't know how the war goes 

1275
01:09:38,240 --> 01:09:41,880
from there, but we know it 
becomes kind of maybe not drawn 

1276
01:09:41,880 --> 01:09:44,560
out, but a, a real back and 
forth. 

1277
01:09:44,560 --> 01:09:47,479
Really nasty. 
You suggested that there's a lot

1278
01:09:47,479 --> 01:09:52,680
of evidence for protracted, 
maybe not like super long sieges

1279
01:09:52,680 --> 01:09:55,200
of years because this this 
engagement wasn't that long, but

1280
01:09:55,200 --> 01:09:58,840
maybe armies having to stick in 
place for a long time. 

1281
01:09:59,400 --> 01:10:02,080
And what does it mean? 
What happens when armies have to

1282
01:10:02,080 --> 01:10:06,720
sit in place for too long? 
So the problem is when an army 

1283
01:10:06,720 --> 01:10:11,440
is in seed as opposed to like 
marching around, you start using

1284
01:10:11,440 --> 01:10:13,600
the same cesspits over and over 
again. 

1285
01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:18,040
Human waste starts to leak into 
the the water table, the water 

1286
01:10:18,040 --> 01:10:21,320
goes bad and that's when you 
start to get disease spreading. 

1287
01:10:22,440 --> 01:10:26,560
And we know that some 
significant people died in the 

1288
01:10:26,560 --> 01:10:31,040
War of the Stepstones not from 
injury, but from disease. 

1289
01:10:31,840 --> 01:10:35,120
Very specifically, Sir Jason 
that we just mentioned, the 

1290
01:10:35,120 --> 01:10:38,960
father of Joanna, the wife of 
Tywin, dies of bloody flux. 

1291
01:10:39,360 --> 01:10:42,480
Now if it got a Lord like him, 
there's a pretty good chance 

1292
01:10:42,480 --> 01:10:43,960
that it got a lot of other 
people. 

1293
01:10:43,960 --> 01:10:49,160
Not that diseases afflict 
necessarily afflict lower status

1294
01:10:49,160 --> 01:10:53,760
people more often, but obviously
a bloody flux can get anyone but

1295
01:10:53,840 --> 01:10:56,480
he of all the the best water 
around. 

1296
01:10:56,480 --> 01:11:00,040
You got to figure the Lord of of
Casterly Rock or a scion of 

1297
01:11:00,040 --> 01:11:02,360
Casterly Rock is going to have 
the best available food and 

1298
01:11:02,360 --> 01:11:04,480
water. 
They've got the money, right? 

1299
01:11:04,480 --> 01:11:04,960
He's not. 
Eating. 

1300
01:11:05,440 --> 01:11:08,240
He's not eating with the common 
soldiers unless things have gone

1301
01:11:08,240 --> 01:11:10,760
really bad. 
Either way, something really bad

1302
01:11:10,760 --> 01:11:11,960
happened. 
Maybe it was just a fluke, but 

1303
01:11:11,960 --> 01:11:14,200
it doesn't sound like it. 
We've got other examples of 

1304
01:11:14,200 --> 01:11:17,440
people getting disease. 
So Roger Rain, the Red Lion 

1305
01:11:17,440 --> 01:11:20,280
takes over. 
So again, this is setting up 

1306
01:11:20,280 --> 01:11:23,120
some tragedy later. 
You got the the guy bravely and 

1307
01:11:23,120 --> 01:11:26,400
capably leading the western 
forces who is eventually going 

1308
01:11:26,400 --> 01:11:30,080
to be, you know, persona non 
grata to to house Landis. 

1309
01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:32,240
But it also. 
Suggests that there is a certain

1310
01:11:32,240 --> 01:11:33,880
element of chaos. 
Right. 

1311
01:11:33,880 --> 01:11:36,680
Yeah. 
It it doesn't say that the White

1312
01:11:36,760 --> 01:11:41,760
Bull appointed Roger Rain to 
lead the Westerman contingent. 

1313
01:11:41,760 --> 01:11:44,880
They just says he sees he he 
sees command. 

1314
01:11:45,880 --> 01:11:47,920
That's true. 
You know, part of what may be 

1315
01:11:47,920 --> 01:11:50,640
going on is that because you 
have the Westerosi forces 

1316
01:11:50,640 --> 01:11:55,080
divided in three and maybe only 
intermittently able to 

1317
01:11:55,080 --> 01:11:56,520
communicate, right, You know? 
Yeah. 

1318
01:11:56,560 --> 01:11:57,960
They're not. 
There's no Ravens going back and

1319
01:11:57,960 --> 01:12:00,440
forth, that's for sure. 
Yeah, so you know, the only way 

1320
01:12:00,440 --> 01:12:04,760
to get messages is by shit. 
And if, you know, the Blackfyre 

1321
01:12:04,800 --> 01:12:08,880
Navy seems to be doing better on
a given day than than your Navy,

1322
01:12:09,320 --> 01:12:12,080
you may be very difficult, you 
know, you may be cut off. 

1323
01:12:13,320 --> 01:12:16,640
So it certainly suggests that 
like to an extent, this sort of 

1324
01:12:16,640 --> 01:12:19,200
like top down command is 
starting to break down. 

1325
01:12:19,200 --> 01:12:23,080
And instead what you're seeing 
is that individuals are able to 

1326
01:12:23,080 --> 01:12:27,120
distinguish themselves and, you 
know, partly through sort of 

1327
01:12:27,120 --> 01:12:31,520
personal feats of arms and 
partly through kind of force of 

1328
01:12:31,520 --> 01:12:35,400
personality to take command. 
We spoke earlier about like 

1329
01:12:35,400 --> 01:12:40,000
Hoster and Brendan Tully, right?
If you get into a situation 

1330
01:12:40,000 --> 01:12:44,080
which the the river men are on 
their own, or you know, the 

1331
01:12:44,240 --> 01:12:47,640
they're under the command of 
someone who dies unexpectedly, 

1332
01:12:48,160 --> 01:12:52,320
then that helps to explain how 
all of these young men start to 

1333
01:12:52,320 --> 01:12:55,440
make their reputation. 
Because leaving aside the sort 

1334
01:12:55,440 --> 01:12:58,760
of fathers and sons, you get 
people stepping into dead men's 

1335
01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:01,440
shoes all the time. 
True. 

1336
01:13:01,880 --> 01:13:04,720
And I, I really think that you 
mentioned it, but I would really

1337
01:13:04,720 --> 01:13:07,200
reemphasize the problems of 
communication here. 

1338
01:13:07,840 --> 01:13:11,320
Even armies that are separated 
from each other on mainland 

1339
01:13:11,320 --> 01:13:14,600
Westeros can communicate 
reasonably well because they can

1340
01:13:14,600 --> 01:13:19,120
send riders back and forth. 
And it's difficult for anyone to

1341
01:13:19,120 --> 01:13:21,920
stop those riders because 
they're generally going from one

1342
01:13:22,760 --> 01:13:25,360
allied camp to another. 
But with the step stones, with 

1343
01:13:25,360 --> 01:13:26,440
things, there's so much back and
forth. 

1344
01:13:26,440 --> 01:13:30,360
There isn't just like a line you
can draw where left of this line

1345
01:13:30,360 --> 01:13:33,320
or West of this line is the 
Westerosi side, and then east of

1346
01:13:33,320 --> 01:13:35,000
it is the black fireside. 
It's not like that. 

1347
01:13:35,000 --> 01:13:38,400
There's probably very piece meal
like they have a corner of 1 

1348
01:13:38,400 --> 01:13:41,440
island and a chunk of another 
island and this one's being 

1349
01:13:41,440 --> 01:13:43,920
fought over and no other island 
knows what's happening on the 

1350
01:13:43,920 --> 01:13:46,240
other islands. 
They get information brought to 

1351
01:13:46,240 --> 01:13:48,480
them but it's already out of 
date as soon as it gets there. 

1352
01:13:48,920 --> 01:13:51,680
So that brings us back to Sir 
Jason dying of flux. 

1353
01:13:51,680 --> 01:13:55,480
Because it may have been this 
chaos may have created problems 

1354
01:13:55,480 --> 01:13:58,960
with supplies and logistics. 
So maybe Sir Jason wasn't 

1355
01:13:58,960 --> 01:14:01,240
drinking the best water and 
eating the best food. 

1356
01:14:01,240 --> 01:14:06,520
Maybe all his fancy Lannister 
gold wasn't able to achieve much

1357
01:14:06,520 --> 01:14:09,240
because while they were cut off 
for some reason or another, 

1358
01:14:09,240 --> 01:14:12,480
maybe they got yeah. 
Some sinks or whatever. 

1359
01:14:12,640 --> 01:14:14,720
Yeah, there's a million things 
that could go wrong in a 

1360
01:14:14,720 --> 01:14:19,840
campaign situation like this. 
Let's turn our mind away from 

1361
01:14:19,840 --> 01:14:23,720
the Lords and think a little bit
more about the common soldiers 

1362
01:14:23,720 --> 01:14:25,040
and what their experience would 
be like. 

1363
01:14:25,040 --> 01:14:27,400
And of course, it's not pleasant
at all. 

1364
01:14:27,680 --> 01:14:30,440
From Brienne's chapters come 
quite a bit of context that's 

1365
01:14:30,440 --> 01:14:32,680
much different than the 
historical perspectives given 

1366
01:14:32,680 --> 01:14:38,000
by, say, Paisel, who is focused 
on the nobles, especially the 

1367
01:14:38,000 --> 01:14:40,440
Lannisters, and not thinking too
much about the commoners. 

1368
01:14:40,720 --> 01:14:43,920
So if we take a step back, this 
is fitting because Brienne's 

1369
01:14:43,920 --> 01:14:46,520
chapters do so much in 
explaining the cost of war. 

1370
01:14:46,880 --> 01:14:49,240
Ari is too, by the way, but 
Brienne's are particularly 

1371
01:14:49,240 --> 01:14:51,080
focused on that. 
Her chapters are thick with 

1372
01:14:51,080 --> 01:14:54,200
aftermath, the short term, 
meaning the War of 5 Kings is 

1373
01:14:54,200 --> 01:14:57,200
the most prominent, but the long
term hangs over at all. 

1374
01:14:57,560 --> 01:15:00,440
Consider that long term when 
thinking about the oldest 

1375
01:15:00,440 --> 01:15:03,760
characters in The Song of Ice of
Fire, the ones who have seen war

1376
01:15:03,760 --> 01:15:07,440
before, ones who were already 
veterans when Greyjoy's 

1377
01:15:07,440 --> 01:15:09,320
Rebellion and Robert's Rebellion
came around. 

1378
01:15:09,520 --> 01:15:13,160
So no Ned, no Robert, certainly 
not Brienne herself. 

1379
01:15:13,160 --> 01:15:15,160
I'm talking about a lot of these
characters we've mentioned 

1380
01:15:15,360 --> 01:15:19,480
already, like the guys who were 
55 and up when A Song of Ice and

1381
01:15:19,480 --> 01:15:23,400
Fire begins, people we've 
mentioned like Tywin and Aries, 

1382
01:15:23,400 --> 01:15:25,320
things like that. 
But of all these characters, a 

1383
01:15:25,760 --> 01:15:27,360
lot of them are veterans of this
war. 

1384
01:15:27,360 --> 01:15:30,760
That's the important thing here.
It's no small thing to see war 

1385
01:15:30,760 --> 01:15:34,560
at such a young age, and echoes 
of these old wars are found in 

1386
01:15:34,560 --> 01:15:37,200
George R Martin's 
characterizations of these most 

1387
01:15:37,200 --> 01:15:40,800
senior of veterans. 
And Brienne is our portal to so 

1388
01:15:40,800 --> 01:15:43,320
much of that aftermath, recent 
and long gone. 

1389
01:15:43,440 --> 01:15:46,960
Her chapters take us there. 
She encounters a variety of 

1390
01:15:46,960 --> 01:15:49,760
older characters that have 
experience in war and this 

1391
01:15:49,760 --> 01:15:53,600
particular war, from the over 
the top but honorable goofball 

1392
01:15:53,600 --> 01:15:57,400
Hedge Nights, to the brutally 
unsympathetic Randall Tarley, to

1393
01:15:57,400 --> 01:16:01,920
Nimble Dick Crab to the Bloody 
Mummers from Podrick to our next

1394
01:16:01,920 --> 01:16:06,880
mini subject, Sir Goodwin. 
The name might not mean much, 

1395
01:16:06,880 --> 01:16:09,840
but I would wager most of you 
were moved by his short presence

1396
01:16:09,840 --> 01:16:12,120
in Brienne's memories. 
The name isn't memorable, but 

1397
01:16:12,120 --> 01:16:15,880
his deeds, his thoughts are. 
He's the one who trained her. 

1398
01:16:16,000 --> 01:16:19,360
He's the one who gave her those 
very valuable lessons and left a

1399
01:16:19,360 --> 01:16:21,920
deep impression on her. 
He's the one who taught her to 

1400
01:16:22,120 --> 01:16:24,800
fight slowly. 
Let them expend themselves, let 

1401
01:16:24,800 --> 01:16:29,720
them expend their energy. 
This is how she beats Jamie and 

1402
01:16:30,160 --> 01:16:33,320
and Roarge as well. 
So Brienne is from House Tarth, 

1403
01:16:33,880 --> 01:16:37,880
which is an island in the 
Stormlands not terribly far from

1404
01:16:37,880 --> 01:16:41,960
the Stepstone. 
So Tarth would know the Pirates 

1405
01:16:41,960 --> 01:16:44,040
of the Stepstones better than 
most. 

1406
01:16:44,400 --> 01:16:47,600
It might have even been personal
for some of the Knights of Tarth

1407
01:16:47,600 --> 01:16:48,920
to take a shot at some of these 
pirates. 

1408
01:16:48,920 --> 01:16:50,920
It might be there. 
Like we've been wanting to get 

1409
01:16:50,920 --> 01:16:53,960
back at these guys for a while. 
We've been enduring attacks from

1410
01:16:53,960 --> 01:16:57,000
them for a long time without 
much ability to strike back. 

1411
01:16:57,400 --> 01:17:01,240
So if it wasn't personal for Sir
Goodwin at first, it certainly 

1412
01:17:01,240 --> 01:17:06,080
became personal when he himself 
fought against the forces of the

1413
01:17:06,080 --> 01:17:08,600
9 Penny Kings. 
This is from A Beast for Crows 

1414
01:17:08,880 --> 01:17:12,160
for yen 4. 
When I was a Squire, young as 

1415
01:17:12,160 --> 01:17:15,560
you, I had a friend who was 
strong and quick and agile, a 

1416
01:17:15,560 --> 01:17:18,800
champion in the yard. 
We all knew that one day he 

1417
01:17:18,800 --> 01:17:22,920
would be a splendid knight. 
Then war came to the step 

1418
01:17:22,920 --> 01:17:25,800
stones. 
I saw my friend drive his foam 

1419
01:17:25,800 --> 01:17:28,520
into his knees and knock the axe
from his hand. 

1420
01:17:28,800 --> 01:17:31,720
But when he might have finished,
he held back for half a 

1421
01:17:31,720 --> 01:17:34,960
heartbeat. 
In battle, half a heartbeat is a

1422
01:17:34,960 --> 01:17:38,320
lifetime. 
The man slipped out his dirt and

1423
01:17:38,320 --> 01:17:40,360
found a chink in my friend's 
armor. 

1424
01:17:40,800 --> 01:17:46,000
His strength, his speed, his 
valor, all his hard won skill. 

1425
01:17:46,520 --> 01:17:48,840
It was worth less than a 
mummer's fart because he's 

1426
01:17:48,840 --> 01:17:51,200
flinched from killing. 
Remember that girl? 

1427
01:17:51,880 --> 01:17:54,320
I will. 
She promised his shade there in 

1428
01:17:54,320 --> 01:17:58,000
the Piney wood. 
She sat down on a rock, took out

1429
01:17:58,000 --> 01:18:00,920
her sword, and began to hone its
edge. 

1430
01:18:01,120 --> 01:18:04,000
I will remember, and I pray I 
will not flinch. 

1431
01:18:04,000 --> 01:18:07,600
I wonder how many other Knights 
who facing their first battle 

1432
01:18:07,600 --> 01:18:10,280
were having a thought kind of 
like that, like like I've been, 

1433
01:18:10,280 --> 01:18:13,400
I've been preparing for this 
moment and I I I pray I will not

1434
01:18:13,400 --> 01:18:14,760
flinch. 
I pray I will do what I need to 

1435
01:18:14,760 --> 01:18:16,760
do. 
So that's hugely moving. 

1436
01:18:16,760 --> 01:18:19,000
I think this is this is a really
powerful moment. 

1437
01:18:19,000 --> 01:18:21,600
It's really interesting to think
about that because this quote, 

1438
01:18:22,200 --> 01:18:24,040
it says war came to the 
stepstone. 

1439
01:18:24,040 --> 01:18:26,720
It's it no one mentions the 
ninepenny kings because it's not

1440
01:18:26,720 --> 01:18:30,040
that important what war it was 
for in the time during a piece 

1441
01:18:30,040 --> 01:18:32,760
for crows. 
They the point is this lesson, 

1442
01:18:33,000 --> 01:18:35,200
right? 
But it's interesting for us 

1443
01:18:35,200 --> 01:18:38,640
today that he happens to have 
learned this lesson in the war 

1444
01:18:38,640 --> 01:18:40,920
of Ninepenny Kings. 
What do you think about this, 

1445
01:18:40,920 --> 01:18:42,160
Steven? 
Yeah. 

1446
01:18:42,160 --> 01:18:46,640
I mean it very much suggests 
that a lot of the fighting was 

1447
01:18:47,240 --> 01:18:49,200
quick hand to hand stuff. 
It was. 

1448
01:18:49,920 --> 01:18:55,720
We see some images of sort of, 
you know, more traditional open 

1449
01:18:55,720 --> 01:19:00,880
field battles, but it does seem 
that a lot of this is this kind 

1450
01:19:00,880 --> 01:19:03,560
of like almost sort of like, you
know, ambushes, right? 

1451
01:19:03,560 --> 01:19:08,120
It's like small scale conflict. 
It's it's, I almost think of the

1452
01:19:08,120 --> 01:19:10,040
Dance of the Dragons because you
didn't want, you couldn't have 

1453
01:19:10,040 --> 01:19:12,560
large armies of the Dance of the
Dragons because it was too 

1454
01:19:12,560 --> 01:19:15,760
dangerous to gather a lot of men
because of the dragon could just

1455
01:19:15,760 --> 01:19:18,560
come and cook the whole thing. 
In this case, it's not that 

1456
01:19:18,640 --> 01:19:20,960
you're worried about a dragon 
coming along, it's just that you

1457
01:19:20,960 --> 01:19:23,760
can't have too many men at once.
These aren't large battlefields.

1458
01:19:23,760 --> 01:19:27,520
These aren't flat planes where 
you can charge with with a whole

1459
01:19:27,520 --> 01:19:30,200
group of Knights. 
You don't necessarily have room 

1460
01:19:30,200 --> 01:19:32,760
for Pike formations and things 
like that. 

1461
01:19:32,760 --> 01:19:35,520
So yeah, they're all adapting to
war that they're not used to 

1462
01:19:35,520 --> 01:19:37,720
fighting. 
And for the commoners who aren't

1463
01:19:37,720 --> 01:19:39,960
used to fighting at all, don't 
know why they're there. 

1464
01:19:40,120 --> 01:19:44,080
They don't understand the point.
And it's so wild for them to be 

1465
01:19:44,960 --> 01:19:48,520
taken out of Westeros. 
I mean, every other Westerosi 

1466
01:19:48,520 --> 01:19:51,600
engagement that we hear about is
a civil conflict. 

1467
01:19:51,600 --> 01:19:56,200
The only other foreign conqueror
I can really think of is, I 

1468
01:19:56,200 --> 01:19:58,640
mean, Aegon himself. 
And he wasn't even really 

1469
01:19:58,640 --> 01:19:59,600
foreign. 
He lived there. 

1470
01:19:59,600 --> 01:20:02,160
He just. 
He lived on Dragonstone, so 

1471
01:20:02,360 --> 01:20:04,480
that's that's a stretch to call 
him a foreigner. 

1472
01:20:04,840 --> 01:20:09,240
So this is a really unique war, 
having commoners, levees, people

1473
01:20:09,240 --> 01:20:12,960
who maybe have never left their 
own village, not just taken 

1474
01:20:13,520 --> 01:20:16,640
miles and miles away to fight in
some battle over some castle. 

1475
01:20:16,640 --> 01:20:19,920
They're taken off the continent 
onto a yeah. 

1476
01:20:19,920 --> 01:20:22,000
A lot of them. 
It would be the first time and 

1477
01:20:22,000 --> 01:20:25,720
probably the only time that they
were on a ship, yeah. 

1478
01:20:25,840 --> 01:20:28,720
It's kind of interesting. 
Just think about how much more 

1479
01:20:28,720 --> 01:20:32,720
worldly there would be for like 
a certain generation coming back

1480
01:20:32,720 --> 01:20:35,000
as commoners. 
Like they would really would 

1481
01:20:35,000 --> 01:20:40,560
know about some luxuries, some 
SoC things I don't know. 

1482
01:20:40,600 --> 01:20:42,680
It's true they would have a much
different outlook than most 

1483
01:20:43,040 --> 01:20:45,560
money generation, you know. 
World War One or World War 2 

1484
01:20:45,560 --> 01:20:47,880
where you know how, how do you 
keep them on the farm once 

1485
01:20:47,880 --> 01:20:51,040
they've seen Paris? 
Yeah, it's. 

1486
01:20:51,240 --> 01:20:53,600
Example though you know the step
stones aren't perverse. 

1487
01:20:55,040 --> 01:20:56,680
That's a good point. 
They're they're pretty bad. 

1488
01:20:56,680 --> 01:20:57,800
They may have been worse than 
they. 

1489
01:20:57,920 --> 01:21:01,040
Would have seen King's Landing. 
That's true, yeah. 

1490
01:21:01,160 --> 01:21:05,240
Storm's End, stuff like that. 
Definitely seen more than they 

1491
01:21:05,240 --> 01:21:09,040
would have ever expected to see.
Even more important than this 

1492
01:21:09,040 --> 01:21:11,000
Sir Goodwin and his nameless 
friend. 

1493
01:21:11,520 --> 01:21:14,000
This is one of the most moving 
passages in the entire series. 

1494
01:21:14,000 --> 01:21:16,240
It's a centerpiece for most 
anyone who wants to argue that 

1495
01:21:16,240 --> 01:21:18,640
Feast is as good if not better 
than the other 4. 

1496
01:21:19,000 --> 01:21:20,600
I'm Speaking of Sept and 
Meribald. 

1497
01:21:21,240 --> 01:21:23,400
I'm one of those people. 
Right on, there you go. 

1498
01:21:24,800 --> 01:21:27,880
Surely one of the most memorable
parts of A Feast for Crows is 

1499
01:21:27,880 --> 01:21:31,200
his Broken Man's speech. 
A live A live performance of it 

1500
01:21:31,200 --> 01:21:33,840
by our good friend Scotty from 
Davos Fingers is one of my 

1501
01:21:33,840 --> 01:21:35,680
favorite fandom moments of all 
time. 

1502
01:21:35,880 --> 01:21:38,240
He recited this. 
He performed it from memory. 

1503
01:21:38,320 --> 01:21:40,160
Wearing a cloak and a cat was so
good. 

1504
01:21:40,480 --> 01:21:43,320
I believe you can find it on the
Ice and Fire Con YouTube 

1505
01:21:43,320 --> 01:21:44,360
channel. 
Oh hell yeah. 

1506
01:21:44,840 --> 01:21:48,800
So given Sept and Maribald's 
travels, he has clearly seen the

1507
01:21:48,800 --> 01:21:53,360
aftermath of war more than most.
But as he speaks, it becomes 

1508
01:21:53,360 --> 01:21:56,120
clear that war is even more 
personal to him than that. 

1509
01:21:56,120 --> 01:21:58,960
It's not just something that 
he's he's trying to help out 

1510
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:00,440
with, something that he's seen 
first hand. 

1511
01:22:00,440 --> 01:22:02,320
It's something that he 
experienced first hand when he 

1512
01:22:02,320 --> 01:22:04,560
was younger. 
A detail that you may have 

1513
01:22:04,560 --> 01:22:07,800
forgotten is Sept and Maribald's
first experience in war when he 

1514
01:22:07,800 --> 01:22:12,000
gives his famous quote was that 
he fought in the War of 9 Penny 

1515
01:22:12,000 --> 01:22:14,560
Kings. 
Brienne could hear the wind 

1516
01:22:14,560 --> 01:22:18,080
rustling through a clump of 
pussy willows, and farther off, 

1517
01:22:18,080 --> 01:22:21,920
the faint cry of a loon. 
She could hear Dog panting 

1518
01:22:21,920 --> 01:22:26,120
softly as he loped along beside 
the septon and his donkey, 

1519
01:22:26,360 --> 01:22:30,160
tongue rolling out of his mouth.
The quiet stretched and 

1520
01:22:30,160 --> 01:22:32,440
stretched until finally she 
said. 

1521
01:22:32,600 --> 01:22:35,120
How old were you when they 
marched you off to war? 

1522
01:22:35,480 --> 01:22:38,880
Why, no older than your boy? 
Maribald replied. 

1523
01:22:39,000 --> 01:22:42,560
Too young for such, in truth, 
but my brothers were all going 

1524
01:22:42,800 --> 01:22:46,440
and I would not be left behind. 
Willem said I could be his 

1525
01:22:46,440 --> 01:22:50,920
Squire, though Will was no 
knight, only a potboy armed with

1526
01:22:50,920 --> 01:22:53,080
a kitchen knife he'd stolen from
the inn. 

1527
01:22:53,440 --> 01:22:57,160
He died upon the Stepstones and 
never struck a blow. 

1528
01:22:57,520 --> 01:23:02,280
It was fever did for him and for
my brother Robin Owen died from 

1529
01:23:02,280 --> 01:23:06,160
a Mace that split his head apart
and his friend John Pox was 

1530
01:23:06,160 --> 01:23:08,760
hanged for rape. 
Nor of the 9 Penny Kings? 

1531
01:23:08,960 --> 01:23:12,080
Asked Heil Hunt. 
So they called it, though I 

1532
01:23:12,080 --> 01:23:14,440
never saw king nor earned a 
penny. 

1533
01:23:14,680 --> 01:23:17,440
It was a war, though, that it 
was. 

1534
01:23:17,960 --> 01:23:21,080
There was glory for the nobles, 
well, some of them anyway, But 

1535
01:23:21,080 --> 01:23:25,440
that what Sept and Maribal 
described just now was the lot 

1536
01:23:25,440 --> 01:23:27,960
that fate gave to many of the 
peasantry. 

1537
01:23:28,080 --> 01:23:30,800
And we're reminded of what 
Steven was talking about. 

1538
01:23:30,880 --> 01:23:34,880
Two different characters 
mentioned in that quote died of 

1539
01:23:34,880 --> 01:23:36,680
fever. 
And that's. 

1540
01:23:36,680 --> 01:23:39,360
Yeah, so you get what we're 
saying. 

1541
01:23:39,360 --> 01:23:43,400
Like these guys, three, several 
of these men never, it says will

1542
01:23:43,400 --> 01:23:47,360
never, never struck a blow. 
Robin and Owen maybe didn't 

1543
01:23:47,360 --> 01:23:50,360
either. 
Yeah, just wild. 

1544
01:23:50,360 --> 01:23:52,560
Just what a waste. 
And it was probably 

1545
01:23:52,560 --> 01:23:54,280
unprecedented, right? 
Like I said, these guys have 

1546
01:23:54,280 --> 01:23:56,520
never been outside of of where 
they lived. 

1547
01:23:57,040 --> 01:24:00,360
So a related lesson from both 
Sept and Maribald and Sir 

1548
01:24:00,360 --> 01:24:03,840
Goodwin is that the Westerosi 
armies would be full of untested

1549
01:24:03,840 --> 01:24:07,080
Knights and untrained levees. 
And in Westeros versus Westeros 

1550
01:24:07,080 --> 01:24:09,680
conflicts, both sides have many 
of such right. 

1551
01:24:09,680 --> 01:24:12,480
When you get the peasant levy, 
when the Stormlands rallies 

1552
01:24:12,480 --> 01:24:15,720
their levees and goes to war 
with the Reach, well, it's the 

1553
01:24:15,720 --> 01:24:17,920
peasant levies are fairly 
equally matched. 

1554
01:24:18,120 --> 01:24:20,600
But on the step stones, these 
levees were not arrayed against 

1555
01:24:20,600 --> 01:24:22,800
other levees. 
They were pitted against cell 

1556
01:24:22,800 --> 01:24:27,040
swords and pirates and the 
otherwise violently ambitious. 

1557
01:24:27,280 --> 01:24:30,360
In other words, trained and 
seasoned killers who perhaps 

1558
01:24:30,800 --> 01:24:34,120
never needed to be told not to 
flinch when it came to killing. 

1559
01:24:34,120 --> 01:24:36,760
They're like, Oh yeah, this is 
what we're ready to do. 

1560
01:24:37,040 --> 01:24:40,360
These are men who, if flinching 
is out of the question, they 

1561
01:24:40,360 --> 01:24:43,160
enjoy killing, right? 
This is why they're in this 

1562
01:24:43,160 --> 01:24:45,480
business that they're in, 
because they, I mean, sell 

1563
01:24:45,480 --> 01:24:47,160
swords who flinch from killing, 
please. 

1564
01:24:47,720 --> 01:24:48,680
Pirates who flinch. 
Yeah. 

1565
01:24:50,040 --> 01:24:52,320
There's no old cell swords. 
There's no bold cell swords. 

1566
01:24:52,480 --> 01:24:54,200
There's also, there's no old 
bold cell. 

1567
01:24:54,200 --> 01:24:57,640
There's also no cowardly, you 
know, afraid to draw their 

1568
01:24:57,640 --> 01:25:01,040
swords cell towards Maribold 
Never never spoke of the journey

1569
01:25:01,040 --> 01:25:04,320
they took by ship to get there. 
But this is something we should 

1570
01:25:04,320 --> 01:25:07,600
consider from both a military 
strategic and strategic 

1571
01:25:07,600 --> 01:25:11,680
perspective and from a what was 
it like from the soldiers type 

1572
01:25:11,680 --> 01:25:13,400
perspective? 
So let's let's briefly talk 

1573
01:25:13,400 --> 01:25:16,440
about that naval engagements. 
We touched on it briefly, but 

1574
01:25:16,680 --> 01:25:19,560
let's focus on it a little more.
There's like I said earlier, 

1575
01:25:19,560 --> 01:25:22,160
there's a significant history of
Ironborn reaving versus step 

1576
01:25:22,160 --> 01:25:24,280
stones. 
Specifically Harwin Hoare 

1577
01:25:24,280 --> 01:25:27,160
mentions it the red Kraken from 
the dance of the dragon. 

1578
01:25:27,160 --> 01:25:30,560
He specifically went there. 
Bailon specifically reaved in 

1579
01:25:30,560 --> 01:25:33,040
the Stepstones. 
Asha has specifically reaved in 

1580
01:25:33,040 --> 01:25:36,400
the Stepstones. 
Dagmar cleft jaw, which again, 

1581
01:25:36,400 --> 01:25:38,680
by the way, something Theon 
missed out on reaving in the 

1582
01:25:38,680 --> 01:25:40,640
Stepstones. 
Yet another thing that separates

1583
01:25:40,640 --> 01:25:42,880
him from his family, but that's 
another story. 

1584
01:25:43,280 --> 01:25:46,760
So imagine the Ironborn versus 
Samarosan. 

1585
01:25:46,760 --> 01:25:48,280
They all start with s s. 
They're all similar anyway. 

1586
01:25:48,280 --> 01:25:51,560
So Samarosan and his fleets and 
the Jolly Fellows and the Old 

1587
01:25:51,560 --> 01:25:55,960
Mother and the Ebon Prince 
versus 100 of Kellan Greyjoy's 

1588
01:25:55,960 --> 01:25:57,640
long shifts. 
Can you imagine? 

1589
01:25:57,640 --> 01:26:00,000
I I hardly know where to begin 
with thinking about that. 

1590
01:26:00,400 --> 01:26:04,640
It, it does sort of sort of 
smack of like, I mean, it's 

1591
01:26:04,640 --> 01:26:09,520
Vikings versus pirates, right? 
There aren't any ninjas 

1592
01:26:09,520 --> 01:26:11,520
involved. 
But you know, you, you have to 

1593
01:26:11,520 --> 01:26:13,400
sort of presume around the 
edges. 

1594
01:26:14,120 --> 01:26:16,880
There must have been this a 
whole other side of, of this 

1595
01:26:16,880 --> 01:26:21,280
war, which is basically the only
way to keep your armies fed, 

1596
01:26:22,000 --> 01:26:23,200
right. 
Yeah. 

1597
01:26:23,200 --> 01:26:26,800
Is to control the sea lanes, 
which means that you know if you

1598
01:26:26,800 --> 01:26:29,360
can sever the sea lanes on on 
the other side. 

1599
01:26:29,640 --> 01:26:32,480
So it's like 2 wars are 
happening at once. 

1600
01:26:32,880 --> 01:26:36,400
And it does suggest that like 
given the the spread of disease 

1601
01:26:36,400 --> 01:26:40,880
among the Westeros sea, that 
supplies were not the best 

1602
01:26:41,040 --> 01:26:44,720
maintained in in part because I 
imagine the Ironborn are a lot 

1603
01:26:44,720 --> 01:26:48,880
more experienced at raiding 
other people than preventing 

1604
01:26:48,880 --> 01:26:51,920
people from being raided. 
Good point, Good point. 

1605
01:26:52,120 --> 01:26:54,560
Yeah, they're the ones taking 
the supplies, not delivering 

1606
01:26:54,560 --> 01:26:57,560
them. 
Also, you wonder too, if this 

1607
01:26:57,560 --> 01:27:00,960
was part of the Black Fire 
Ubanda 9 strategy once. 

1608
01:27:00,960 --> 01:27:06,400
If they saw the logistical flaws
in the Westerosi approach, they 

1609
01:27:06,400 --> 01:27:08,440
may try to exploit that, say, 
look, they're doing they're 

1610
01:27:08,440 --> 01:27:11,200
going about this all wrong. 
If we do this and that, they're 

1611
01:27:11,200 --> 01:27:12,320
going to start losing man to 
disease. 

1612
01:27:12,320 --> 01:27:15,600
And if we just attack their 
supplies and avoid too many 

1613
01:27:15,600 --> 01:27:18,480
direct conflicts and and focus 
on guerrilla raid, things like 

1614
01:27:18,480 --> 01:27:19,640
that, it could be really 
effective. 

1615
01:27:19,840 --> 01:27:22,200
Well, this is where I think they
were kind of like reverse 

1616
01:27:22,200 --> 01:27:26,440
engineering from the 3rd and 4th
Blackfyre rebellions, where they

1617
01:27:26,440 --> 01:27:30,000
were the ones conducting a 
foreign invasion and stretching 

1618
01:27:30,000 --> 01:27:33,840
out their supply lines across 
the same area, right? 

1619
01:27:33,840 --> 01:27:37,520
If you were invading from Thai 
Roche into the Stormland, you're

1620
01:27:37,520 --> 01:27:38,920
going right through the step 
stones. 

1621
01:27:40,320 --> 01:27:43,160
So they may have sort of said 
like we know how difficult it is

1622
01:27:43,160 --> 01:27:46,080
to do this because we were on 
the receiving end. 

1623
01:27:46,400 --> 01:27:49,720
If we reverse the situation, 
then maybe we'll get the upper 

1624
01:27:49,720 --> 01:27:51,640
hand out. 
Sounds good. 

1625
01:27:51,640 --> 01:27:55,960
Yeah, well said the another just
a yet another difference about 

1626
01:27:56,240 --> 01:28:00,320
this campaign, this theater of 
war, is that there's much 

1627
01:28:00,320 --> 01:28:02,840
different structures. 
We don't know what's on the 

1628
01:28:02,840 --> 01:28:05,280
Stepstones, but there's not 
Westerosi style castles for 

1629
01:28:05,280 --> 01:28:08,640
sure, which also means there's 
no maesters. 

1630
01:28:08,840 --> 01:28:12,400
There's no guy who knows healing
and communication and can send 

1631
01:28:12,400 --> 01:28:16,480
messages at every several miles 
or so, or at least every 

1632
01:28:16,960 --> 01:28:19,240
reasonable amount of distance. 
Nothing like that at all. 

1633
01:28:19,240 --> 01:28:22,440
So again, this just speaks to 
the issues of communication and 

1634
01:28:22,520 --> 01:28:25,480
the lack of people who know how 
to deal with diseases and 

1635
01:28:25,480 --> 01:28:28,680
injuries, which helps explain 
how this got so out of hand. 

1636
01:28:30,320 --> 01:28:33,920
Well, however things went, 
however the the strategies were 

1637
01:28:33,920 --> 01:28:37,160
what whatever direct conflict, 
whatever guerrilla warfare was 

1638
01:28:37,160 --> 01:28:41,800
happening, some at some point 
things came to a head. 

1639
01:28:42,040 --> 01:28:44,680
Here we have a section that I've
called the Bold and the 

1640
01:28:44,680 --> 01:28:47,280
Unbeautiful and let's have a 
quote. 

1641
01:28:48,200 --> 01:28:51,840
As the war hung in the balance, 
a young knight named SER 

1642
01:28:51,840 --> 01:28:56,440
Baraston Salmi slew Melese in 
single combat, winning undying 

1643
01:28:56,440 --> 01:28:58,800
renown and deciding the issue in
a stroke. 

1644
01:28:59,280 --> 01:29:02,560
Just like that, someone kills 
Melese and it's someone we know 

1645
01:29:02,560 --> 01:29:05,880
very well. 
A character who's got PO VS and 

1646
01:29:06,520 --> 01:29:08,720
damn it I wish he would have 
thought about this. 

1647
01:29:09,120 --> 01:29:10,400
It's POV. 
It's not too late. 

1648
01:29:10,400 --> 01:29:11,960
We'll, we'll see what the wind's
winter. 

1649
01:29:11,960 --> 01:29:14,320
Yeah, yeah. 
I really wish he just let me 

1650
01:29:14,360 --> 01:29:16,840
think about. 
Boy, that sure was a great duel 

1651
01:29:16,840 --> 01:29:18,560
I had with Melee. 
The monstrous. 

1652
01:29:18,560 --> 01:29:20,560
Come on, Bears didn't give us 
that, but given. 

1653
01:29:20,560 --> 01:29:22,520
That we're doing a very similar 
thing right. 

1654
01:29:22,520 --> 01:29:24,960
He's riding out in in the battle
of fire. 

1655
01:29:24,960 --> 01:29:30,240
He's riding out with his cavalry
to like try to smack into the 

1656
01:29:30,400 --> 01:29:34,120
the enemy forces and take out 
their leadership. 

1657
01:29:34,520 --> 01:29:37,600
So there's a, there's a, one of 
my head cannons is that 

1658
01:29:38,000 --> 01:29:40,840
Barristan will fight Bloodbeard 
because first of all, Barristan 

1659
01:29:40,920 --> 01:29:42,560
really wants to fight 
Bloodbeard. 

1660
01:29:43,240 --> 01:29:45,520
And second of all, it would just
be really cool. 

1661
01:29:45,640 --> 01:29:47,840
And if he goes up against 
Bloodbeard, I think he might get

1662
01:29:47,840 --> 01:29:49,680
Meili's vibes. 
The commander of a sells work 

1663
01:29:49,680 --> 01:29:52,320
company who's large and and 
savage and brutal. 

1664
01:29:52,800 --> 01:29:54,320
So there's a chance, there's a 
chance. 

1665
01:29:54,320 --> 01:29:58,120
I've got hope now, given that 
comparison of Melees to Gregor 

1666
01:29:58,120 --> 01:29:59,680
that we made back in the first 
part. 

1667
01:29:59,880 --> 01:30:03,200
It's not hard to for your mind 
to float towards Red Viper 

1668
01:30:03,200 --> 01:30:05,840
versus Gregor vibes when you 
think about this, but it's 

1669
01:30:05,840 --> 01:30:09,080
actually pretty different. 
This was a battle, not a duel. 

1670
01:30:09,280 --> 01:30:11,800
There would be other members of 
the Golden Company alongside 

1671
01:30:11,800 --> 01:30:13,520
Melees. 
Apparently Barrison killed 

1672
01:30:13,520 --> 01:30:15,360
several of them to get to 
Melees. 

1673
01:30:15,360 --> 01:30:18,000
I think the phrase is like he 
cut his way through the Golden 

1674
01:30:18,000 --> 01:30:19,360
Company. 
What about us? 

1675
01:30:19,360 --> 01:30:21,560
Yeah, it's really cool. 
I got, we got to. 

1676
01:30:21,560 --> 01:30:25,480
I wish we could see that so many
of these guys close to Melius 

1677
01:30:25,480 --> 01:30:27,960
would have been like his closest
companions, guys who had fought 

1678
01:30:27,960 --> 01:30:30,000
up beside him for years in the 
Golden Company. 

1679
01:30:30,320 --> 01:30:33,360
Some of them may have even been 
in the 4th Blackfyre Rebellion. 

1680
01:30:33,360 --> 01:30:34,960
Some of them would have known 
Bittersteal. 

1681
01:30:34,960 --> 01:30:39,360
These are veterans of the Golden
Company, and these are strong, 

1682
01:30:39,360 --> 01:30:42,280
experienced, tough warriors. 
So this is you really can't 

1683
01:30:42,280 --> 01:30:44,520
understate Barristan's badassery
here. 

1684
01:30:45,480 --> 01:30:46,960
Is it actually a one-on-one 
duel? 

1685
01:30:46,960 --> 01:30:49,320
Like were they on horseback? 
Art indicates they were on 

1686
01:30:49,320 --> 01:30:51,560
horseback like you pointed out 
that he that's where we see him 

1687
01:30:51,560 --> 01:30:53,920
in his flail with his flail and 
and no helmet. 

1688
01:30:53,920 --> 01:30:56,000
Well. 
That would that would make a 

1689
01:30:56,000 --> 01:30:59,800
certain amount of sense, which 
is if, if everything was like 

1690
01:30:59,800 --> 01:31:04,520
these dug in infantry blocks, 
right, it's much harder to get 

1691
01:31:04,880 --> 01:31:08,960
through to attack the commander.
Whereas with a cavalry charge 

1692
01:31:08,960 --> 01:31:12,000
that meets another cavalry 
charge, things are a little bit 

1693
01:31:12,000 --> 01:31:16,280
looser and you can't really like
it's hard to stop a charging 

1694
01:31:16,280 --> 01:31:18,040
horse. 
And that's true. 

1695
01:31:18,200 --> 01:31:20,680
You know, it's it you tend to 
see more of these sort of like 

1696
01:31:20,680 --> 01:31:23,080
assets. 
One side sort of swings past the

1697
01:31:23,080 --> 01:31:26,520
other group, people die in the 
middle and then they sort of 

1698
01:31:26,520 --> 01:31:28,880
both turn around and swing back 
again. 

1699
01:31:30,440 --> 01:31:34,240
So I can sort of see in that 
scenario that, yeah, if if 

1700
01:31:34,240 --> 01:31:38,080
Melee's, you know, being the 
half strong warrior that he was,

1701
01:31:38,800 --> 01:31:42,840
is, is leading his men 
personally in a cavalry charge, 

1702
01:31:43,240 --> 01:31:46,200
that would be the scenario where
you could actually cut through 

1703
01:31:46,200 --> 01:31:48,560
enough people to kill him. 
You have the momentum. 

1704
01:31:48,560 --> 01:31:49,400
Yeah. 
It's like you're going to run 

1705
01:31:49,400 --> 01:31:50,640
into a wall or something. 
That's a good. 

1706
01:31:50,640 --> 01:31:51,520
That's a great point. 
Yeah. 

1707
01:31:51,520 --> 01:31:54,680
So it's which also just makes it
even more brave and just tells 

1708
01:31:54,680 --> 01:31:56,880
you more about how these Calvary
engagements work and just how 

1709
01:31:56,880 --> 01:32:00,080
crazy they are and how. 
Yeah, you really kind of have a 

1710
01:32:00,080 --> 01:32:03,480
tough mind for this stuff. 
And Malius himself, I mean, 

1711
01:32:03,920 --> 01:32:06,480
we've compared him to Gregor. 
We compared him to Robert here. 

1712
01:32:06,480 --> 01:32:08,360
We mean we've compared him to 
Megor the Cruel. 

1713
01:32:08,560 --> 01:32:12,160
And it's it's both an 
interesting facet and a major 

1714
01:32:12,160 --> 01:32:14,920
flaw in having a king who likes 
to fight in the front lines. 

1715
01:32:14,920 --> 01:32:18,880
It's very inspiring for the men.
The men love having a king who 

1716
01:32:19,120 --> 01:32:21,880
takes on similar or equal 
dangers to them. 

1717
01:32:21,880 --> 01:32:24,320
Someone like Alexander the Great
did the similar thing and he was

1718
01:32:24,320 --> 01:32:27,680
not a large man. 
But it's also, this is the big 

1719
01:32:27,680 --> 01:32:30,840
flaw in it. 
You have, you can get killed 

1720
01:32:30,880 --> 01:32:33,600
right in the middle of battle, 
but no one's going to tell 

1721
01:32:33,600 --> 01:32:35,120
Meilis the monstrous not to 
fight. 

1722
01:32:35,120 --> 01:32:36,720
I mean, it's the same thing with
Robert. 

1723
01:32:36,720 --> 01:32:40,880
You they tried to tell Robert 
not to fight to get him to 

1724
01:32:40,880 --> 01:32:43,120
fight. 
They they knew it wouldn't have 

1725
01:32:43,120 --> 01:32:45,000
the opposite effect. 
So it's going to make him want 

1726
01:32:45,000 --> 01:32:47,640
to fight even more. 
I'm imagining that if any of 

1727
01:32:47,640 --> 01:32:49,600
Meilis's commanders were like, 
maybe don't fight. 

1728
01:32:49,800 --> 01:32:51,840
Yeah, that's just going to make 
him want to fight even more. 

1729
01:32:52,320 --> 01:32:55,080
He was probably one of those 
guys that generally loved 

1730
01:32:55,080 --> 01:32:56,800
fighting. 
I mean, he was born into a cell 

1731
01:32:56,800 --> 01:33:00,000
sword company. 
So yeah, it kind of goes with 

1732
01:33:00,000 --> 01:33:04,160
the territory. 
And Sir Duncan the Tall slew the

1733
01:33:04,160 --> 01:33:06,520
prior black Fire pretender, 
Damon the third. 

1734
01:33:07,400 --> 01:33:10,560
This wasn't actually two in the 
two in a row for the Kingsguard 

1735
01:33:10,560 --> 01:33:14,000
though, because Barristan wasn't
in the King's Guard yet. 

1736
01:33:14,000 --> 01:33:16,040
This is what earned him the 
white cloak. 

1737
01:33:16,600 --> 01:33:20,000
He got his nickname the Bold 
came from before this too. 

1738
01:33:20,000 --> 01:33:24,680
So he is well, well regarded. 
He was, I think, 23 years old 

1739
01:33:24,680 --> 01:33:27,520
when this happened. 
So Barristan is very conflicted 

1740
01:33:27,520 --> 01:33:29,640
over Duskindale, right? 
That's a big part of his 

1741
01:33:29,640 --> 01:33:34,120
character, epic act of skill and
bravery, clearly, but he's torn 

1742
01:33:34,120 --> 01:33:36,920
over it because he saved the Mad
King, and that's tough. 

1743
01:33:36,920 --> 01:33:38,800
The Mad King went on to do awful
things. 

1744
01:33:39,240 --> 01:33:42,720
The slaying of melees, though, 
no conflict there whatsoever. 

1745
01:33:42,840 --> 01:33:46,240
That's maybe part of why it's 
not something that he readily 

1746
01:33:46,240 --> 01:33:49,040
thinks of, because there's no it
may have been important and 

1747
01:33:49,040 --> 01:33:52,280
defining for his life, but it 
wasn't anything that he's 

1748
01:33:52,280 --> 01:33:55,080
conflicted over. 
He killed an invading king in 

1749
01:33:55,080 --> 01:33:57,320
the sick of battle. 
That's, I mean it didn't 

1750
01:33:57,320 --> 01:33:59,880
entirely end the war, but it 
ended the threat of an invasion.

1751
01:34:00,200 --> 01:34:03,440
So saying he ended the war in a 
in one kill is pretty close to 

1752
01:34:03,440 --> 01:34:05,960
true and also of great 
importance. 

1753
01:34:05,960 --> 01:34:08,880
It's a matter of honor to avenge
one's Liege Lord. 

1754
01:34:08,880 --> 01:34:10,800
And they think this gets lost in
the shuffle a bit. 

1755
01:34:11,280 --> 01:34:16,600
Not because what melee's killed 
Lord Orman Baratheon, that's the

1756
01:34:16,600 --> 01:34:19,880
Hand of the King and Lord of 
Storm's End, but also the Lord 

1757
01:34:19,880 --> 01:34:23,840
Paramount of the Stormlands. 
That's how Selmi's overlord. 

1758
01:34:23,840 --> 01:34:28,240
So he avenged his overlord, he 
avenged the Lord Paramount of 

1759
01:34:28,240 --> 01:34:31,440
the Stormlands. 
That's it is really hard to win 

1760
01:34:31,440 --> 01:34:36,280
more glory with a single kill. 
You end the war, you avenge your

1761
01:34:36,280 --> 01:34:37,720
Liege Lord. 
All this stuff. 

1762
01:34:37,720 --> 01:34:40,760
I mean, let's I, I've, I've, 
I've been going on for a while. 

1763
01:34:40,760 --> 01:34:42,080
Steven, let's hear your thoughts
on this. 

1764
01:34:42,520 --> 01:34:46,200
Yeah, I mean, it does help to 
explain, like, why Barristan is 

1765
01:34:46,200 --> 01:34:52,440
so legendary is that all of his 
actions have this sort of. 

1766
01:34:53,200 --> 01:34:54,560
Yeah. 
It's not just that he fought in 

1767
01:34:54,560 --> 01:34:56,080
battles and distinguished 
himself. 

1768
01:34:56,080 --> 01:34:59,240
Well, it's just, you know, 
almost like superhero level of 

1769
01:34:59,240 --> 01:35:02,000
individual accomplishments, 
Right. 

1770
01:35:02,040 --> 01:35:04,400
But, you know, he just does all 
these things on his own. 

1771
01:35:04,400 --> 01:35:08,320
He wasn't there in the fighting 
when when Malos died, he went 

1772
01:35:08,320 --> 01:35:12,920
off on his own and did it. 
And. 

1773
01:35:12,920 --> 01:35:14,760
Yeah, you can. 
You can see why. 

1774
01:35:14,800 --> 01:35:17,800
You know, I it's, it's rather 
surprising that it took a while 

1775
01:35:17,880 --> 01:35:22,000
for him to get knighted, you 
know, to be given a white 

1776
01:35:22,000 --> 01:35:25,000
clothes, although it's possible,
you know, there weren't any 

1777
01:35:25,120 --> 01:35:27,040
vacancies. 
Yeah, that's my, that's what I 

1778
01:35:27,040 --> 01:35:29,160
that they. 
May have, you know, refilled the

1779
01:35:29,280 --> 01:35:32,920
the King's Guard after after 
Summer Hall and then just, you 

1780
01:35:32,920 --> 01:35:35,240
know, got to wait. 
And especially if they refilled 

1781
01:35:35,240 --> 01:35:38,680
it with young people, then it 
might there would not be some 

1782
01:35:38,680 --> 01:35:40,920
old guy ready to, you know, 
like, well, just wait. 

1783
01:35:40,920 --> 01:35:44,880
That guy will be gone soon. 
So in terms of that, when people

1784
01:35:44,880 --> 01:35:47,640
speak in awe bearest in the bold
during the Song of Ice and Fire 

1785
01:35:47,640 --> 01:35:50,520
novels, there's a lot of reasons
why this is guy. 

1786
01:35:50,520 --> 01:35:51,800
He's not. 
He's certainly not a one trick 

1787
01:35:51,800 --> 01:35:55,320
pony, but the slaying of melees 
is really what put him on the 

1788
01:35:55,320 --> 01:35:57,680
map. 
He was kind of notable for 

1789
01:35:57,680 --> 01:36:00,680
entering a tournament at age 10,
but that didn't make him famous.

1790
01:36:01,040 --> 01:36:05,440
That just made him kind of maybe
semi famous amongst the nobility

1791
01:36:05,440 --> 01:36:08,040
of the Stormlands. 
He gave him, Yeah, he gave him a

1792
01:36:08,040 --> 01:36:09,240
nickname. 
That's just yeah. 

1793
01:36:09,440 --> 01:36:11,000
It was definitely something he 
got. 

1794
01:36:11,000 --> 01:36:13,360
He was certainly more notable 
than just about any other 10 

1795
01:36:13,360 --> 01:36:14,960
year old. 
Too. 

1796
01:36:15,480 --> 01:36:18,000
That's true. 
There's like, oh, this punk kid 

1797
01:36:18,000 --> 01:36:22,280
who? 
Yeah, but Dusk and Dale was also

1798
01:36:22,280 --> 01:36:23,960
more recent. 
So that's another thing. 

1799
01:36:23,960 --> 01:36:26,240
It's it's it's another reason he
thinks of it more and it's 

1800
01:36:26,240 --> 01:36:29,040
something people remember him 
for more because it it happened 

1801
01:36:29,040 --> 01:36:30,280
during a lot more people's 
lifetimes. 

1802
01:36:30,280 --> 01:36:36,040
I mean, that was 23 years ish 
before the the OR 22 years 

1803
01:36:36,040 --> 01:36:40,800
before the war before the books 
begin, versus this happening 30 

1804
01:36:40,800 --> 01:36:42,880
some years before the war before
the books begin. 

1805
01:36:42,880 --> 01:36:46,600
I guess. 38, Yeah, 38 years. 
So here's a little tidbit from a

1806
01:36:46,600 --> 01:36:48,320
meta perspective. 
Barristan the Bold was one of 

1807
01:36:48,320 --> 01:36:51,000
the very first characters George
R Martin ever created. 

1808
01:36:51,360 --> 01:36:52,960
I don't mean A Song of Ice and 
Fire. 

1809
01:36:53,440 --> 01:36:56,880
I mean ever, ever. 
When George R Martin was a 

1810
01:36:56,880 --> 01:37:00,560
freshman at Northwestern, he 
wrote that King Barristan the 

1811
01:37:00,560 --> 01:37:04,720
Bold was slain by winged demons 
within the borders of the 

1812
01:37:04,720 --> 01:37:08,040
Dothrak Empire. 
So it's fun to see these 

1813
01:37:08,080 --> 01:37:11,960
elements that George later 
forged into a much bigger story.

1814
01:37:11,960 --> 01:37:15,400
But he likes to he he gets a 
task to some of these character 

1815
01:37:15,400 --> 01:37:16,960
names, I think, and likes to 
recycle them. 

1816
01:37:16,960 --> 01:37:18,320
But yeah, King Bears and the 
Bull. 

1817
01:37:18,320 --> 01:37:21,200
That's pretty cool. 
So the death of Meilis, it 

1818
01:37:21,200 --> 01:37:22,720
changed everything in an 
instant. 

1819
01:37:23,160 --> 01:37:27,160
The band of, well, eight now 
would still want to keep the 

1820
01:37:27,160 --> 01:37:29,920
Stepstones, but Westeros was 
kind of out of the picture now. 

1821
01:37:29,920 --> 01:37:32,520
They couldn't, they didn't have 
a claimant anymore. 

1822
01:37:32,520 --> 01:37:34,720
And yeah, that's a huge thing, 
so. 

1823
01:37:35,120 --> 01:37:38,360
On the other hand, the war kept 
going for six months of hard 

1824
01:37:38,360 --> 01:37:40,880
fighting. 
It wasn't like they gave up 

1825
01:37:41,680 --> 01:37:43,600
again. 
I think that that's what gives 

1826
01:37:43,600 --> 01:37:45,880
the sense of like this grinding 
conflict. 

1827
01:37:46,400 --> 01:37:48,160
Yeah, that I agree. 
That's a good point. 

1828
01:37:48,200 --> 01:37:52,160
And the Sep stones being ruled 
by pirates, that's that's 

1829
01:37:52,160 --> 01:37:55,040
nothing new then or now. 
It was the Black Fire King that 

1830
01:37:55,040 --> 01:37:56,720
was the problem. 
So once Baileys is dead, they're

1831
01:37:56,720 --> 01:37:59,920
like, well, it'd be better if we
could clean all this pirate 

1832
01:37:59,920 --> 01:38:03,600
activity up, but honestly, 
they're not going to attack our 

1833
01:38:03,600 --> 01:38:06,480
continent anymore, so this is no
longer our problem. 

1834
01:38:06,880 --> 01:38:11,080
And both sides would know that. 
So because it was a war conquest

1835
01:38:11,680 --> 01:38:13,520
without that claim, that's just 
it. 

1836
01:38:13,520 --> 01:38:16,200
Everybody knows that. 
So like you said, it was about 

1837
01:38:16,200 --> 01:38:19,920
1/2 a year before the disputed 
lands and step stones were lost.

1838
01:38:19,920 --> 01:38:21,840
But this was a pretty big domino
effect. 

1839
01:38:21,840 --> 01:38:25,400
It was like they Bailey's dies 
and it just starts collapsing, 

1840
01:38:25,400 --> 01:38:27,960
right? 
You just have instant like 

1841
01:38:27,960 --> 01:38:31,560
reversals start happening like 
immediately as fast as they got 

1842
01:38:31,560 --> 01:38:33,840
going. 
It seems like just as fast 

1843
01:38:33,840 --> 01:38:37,680
things started to be undone. 
Now somehow Alaquo the Silver 

1844
01:38:37,680 --> 01:38:41,840
tongue despite sacking Tie Rush 
as part of all this, he held on 

1845
01:38:41,840 --> 01:38:46,160
to Ty Rash for six more years 
but was eventually poisoned by 

1846
01:38:46,160 --> 01:38:48,280
his queen. 
Now that's got to be an 

1847
01:38:48,280 --> 01:38:51,160
interesting story because surely
there was someone influencing 

1848
01:38:51,160 --> 01:38:53,600
her to do that? 
Maybe she was bribed or. 

1849
01:38:53,920 --> 01:38:55,520
Or a faceless man. 
Yeah. 

1850
01:38:56,400 --> 01:38:59,040
Wow, that's a good everyone. 
Thinks that it was his queen, 

1851
01:38:59,160 --> 01:39:01,960
but I didn't think about that 
under the face. 

1852
01:39:02,320 --> 01:39:04,440
Good point. 
Yeah, very good point. 

1853
01:39:04,440 --> 01:39:07,040
That's a great idea because they
would have the money probably 

1854
01:39:07,080 --> 01:39:09,880
for this well or or. 
Somewhat, you know, I mean, I 

1855
01:39:09,880 --> 01:39:14,120
can definitely imagine there's C
Lord of Bravos who's like, OK, 

1856
01:39:14,480 --> 01:39:18,960
we need to wrap this shit up. 
Yeah, how how much for this guy?

1857
01:39:20,280 --> 01:39:22,840
The Iron Bank give us a loan. 
Let's let's let's make this 

1858
01:39:22,840 --> 01:39:24,960
happen. 
He's wrecking trade everywhere. 

1859
01:39:24,960 --> 01:39:28,360
Like, yeah, just like, imagine 
the impact it would have if the 

1860
01:39:28,360 --> 01:39:31,880
step stones were closed off 
because Bravos wouldn't be able 

1861
01:39:31,880 --> 01:39:36,080
to trade with Volantis or Lease 
or Karth or the JC. 

1862
01:39:36,080 --> 01:39:40,320
I mean, that's a big deal to a 
lot of rich people really want 

1863
01:39:40,320 --> 01:39:44,160
this taken care of. 
A lot of rich people really are 

1864
01:39:44,160 --> 01:39:46,040
are cut off from making more 
money. 

1865
01:39:46,040 --> 01:39:48,440
And you know what happens when 
rich people get cut off from 

1866
01:39:48,440 --> 01:39:51,160
their source of wealth? 
They they tend to take action. 

1867
01:39:52,080 --> 01:39:55,760
So we don't have a lot of info 
on what happened to the other 7.

1868
01:39:56,160 --> 01:39:57,600
Some of them may have been 
killed. 

1869
01:39:57,600 --> 01:40:00,720
It's entirely possible. 
Like Spotted Tom the Butcher was

1870
01:40:00,720 --> 01:40:02,240
killed on the Stepstones as 
well. 

1871
01:40:02,240 --> 01:40:04,640
We have no idea. 
Some of them may have just been 

1872
01:40:04,640 --> 01:40:07,520
like, Oh well that didn't work, 
let me go back to being a pirate

1873
01:40:07,520 --> 01:40:08,960
or back to being a sell sword 
captain. 

1874
01:40:08,960 --> 01:40:11,760
They may have just entirely gone
back to their former perfection.

1875
01:40:11,880 --> 01:40:15,480
Sons are still around as yeah, 
good point, a significant sell 

1876
01:40:15,480 --> 01:40:19,000
sort fleet. 
So they as as the sons so often 

1877
01:40:19,000 --> 01:40:21,960
seem to do, they managed to get 
out of the conflict relatively 

1878
01:40:21,960 --> 01:40:25,200
unscathed. 
Having made a profit, it's true 

1879
01:40:25,280 --> 01:40:27,640
Somehow, somehow the sons are 
good at that, aren't they? 

1880
01:40:28,320 --> 01:40:31,200
As some of these guys may have 
burned bridges, muddied the 

1881
01:40:31,200 --> 01:40:33,400
waters, so to speak, Maybe it 
would be hard for them to get 

1882
01:40:33,400 --> 01:40:35,080
contracts. 
You might have a situation like 

1883
01:40:35,520 --> 01:40:39,560
the second sons in A Song of Ice
and Fire proper, where either 

1884
01:40:39,560 --> 01:40:42,480
Barristan or Jorah points out 
that the reason the second Sons 

1885
01:40:42,480 --> 01:40:45,200
are all the way in Slaver's Bay 
is because no one will give them

1886
01:40:45,200 --> 01:40:47,680
contracts in the Free Cities 
anymore because Miro is just so 

1887
01:40:47,680 --> 01:40:49,840
untrustworthy. 
So you might have that kind of 

1888
01:40:49,840 --> 01:40:52,800
situation, but there would 
always be work for cell swords 

1889
01:40:52,840 --> 01:40:56,440
because as many if they if they 
burn bridges with the free 

1890
01:40:56,440 --> 01:40:58,200
Cities. 
Well, there's always the Jade 

1891
01:40:58,200 --> 01:41:01,040
Sea, there's always farther E, 
there's always people that were 

1892
01:41:01,040 --> 01:41:03,800
not touched by any of this, and 
there's always people that want 

1893
01:41:03,800 --> 01:41:06,600
to hire killers. 
So yeah, they would still be 

1894
01:41:06,600 --> 01:41:09,720
able to find work, but maybe not
in the cities that formerly 

1895
01:41:09,720 --> 01:41:12,760
hosted them. 
Now, here's another quote from 

1896
01:41:12,800 --> 01:41:18,040
Gil Dane that I'm not so sure 
he's right about this one. 

1897
01:41:19,000 --> 01:41:22,800
Meilis the Monstrous was the 
fifth and last of the Black Fire

1898
01:41:22,800 --> 01:41:25,640
pretenders. 
With his death, the curse that 

1899
01:41:25,640 --> 01:41:29,120
Aegon the Unworthy had inflicted
on the Seven Kingdoms by giving 

1900
01:41:29,120 --> 01:41:33,520
his sword to his bastard son was
finally ended. 

1901
01:41:34,320 --> 01:41:39,240
Yeah, so not really, though, as 
we know, as any reader of A Song

1902
01:41:39,240 --> 01:41:44,080
of Ice and Fire knows, there are
definitely strong Black Fire 

1903
01:41:44,080 --> 01:41:49,280
vibes still in the books. 
Young Griff very possibly is a 

1904
01:41:49,280 --> 01:41:53,200
Black fire, and of course 
Illyrio very candidly says the 

1905
01:41:53,200 --> 01:41:56,120
male line was extinguished. 
So are you. 

1906
01:41:56,120 --> 01:41:59,040
I don't know if I've ever 
straight up asked you on a 

1907
01:41:59,040 --> 01:42:01,040
stream. 
Anyway, do you believe that 

1908
01:42:01,120 --> 01:42:03,080
Young Griff is a Blackfyre 
descendant? 

1909
01:42:03,480 --> 01:42:07,160
Yeah, I think with the sword 
it's probably the case. 

1910
01:42:07,960 --> 01:42:11,480
Right on. 
Now, my personal theory is the 

1911
01:42:11,480 --> 01:42:13,920
that Illyria talks about his 
lover Sarah. 

1912
01:42:15,880 --> 01:42:19,520
Yeah. 
Well, I mean I have my whole 

1913
01:42:19,520 --> 01:42:22,120
theory about the the double swap
of the babies. 

1914
01:42:22,120 --> 01:42:28,760
Yeah, women who look Targaryen 
that fall, whose house collapses

1915
01:42:29,120 --> 01:42:32,520
in, who live in the Free Cities,
ending up as sex workers. 

1916
01:42:32,760 --> 01:42:34,320
You can see how that would 
happen. 

1917
01:42:34,560 --> 01:42:38,600
That's in fact what, you know, 
they wanted to take Daenerys and

1918
01:42:38,600 --> 01:42:40,480
make her into that. 
You know, there's a lot of lot 

1919
01:42:40,480 --> 01:42:42,920
of those, like gross slavers. 
They were telling her that would

1920
01:42:42,920 --> 01:42:46,960
be her fate. 
Added on to this, we happened to

1921
01:42:46,960 --> 01:42:49,920
get the chance to ask George R 
Martin a question every once in 

1922
01:42:49,920 --> 01:42:51,440
a while. 
Shay and I have been to a lot of

1923
01:42:51,440 --> 01:42:55,520
Q&A S and one of the questions I
asked him was, did Bitter Steel 

1924
01:42:55,520 --> 01:42:57,960
ever have kids with Calla 
Blackfire? 

1925
01:42:58,240 --> 01:43:01,200
If you don't recall Calla, 
that's the why. 

1926
01:43:01,200 --> 01:43:05,360
That's Damon's eldest daughter. 
So Damon Blackfire had five sons

1927
01:43:05,360 --> 01:43:07,760
and or seven sons and some 
number of daughters. 

1928
01:43:07,760 --> 01:43:10,160
At least two, we're not sure how
many, but at least 2 because of 

1929
01:43:10,160 --> 01:43:13,400
the plural was used and the 
eldest of them was Calla and 

1930
01:43:13,400 --> 01:43:15,760
Kala and Bittersteel were 
married but since but George 

1931
01:43:15,760 --> 01:43:18,360
says they did not have kit. 
Well, he says I don't think so. 

1932
01:43:18,360 --> 01:43:21,960
So he left the door open in case
he changes his mind. 

1933
01:43:21,960 --> 01:43:25,960
But it sounds like no. 
There's another theory out there

1934
01:43:25,960 --> 01:43:30,360
that Boris himself could be a 
black fire orphan, could be a 

1935
01:43:30,680 --> 01:43:33,160
descendant of all that. 
It would explain his softness 

1936
01:43:33,160 --> 01:43:36,400
for noble bastards. 
But you know the the what 

1937
01:43:36,400 --> 01:43:38,280
happens when a family falls 
apart like that and they get 

1938
01:43:38,520 --> 01:43:39,280
tossed out of the? 
Street. 

1939
01:43:39,920 --> 01:43:43,480
I just think he he is who he's 
his story, OK? 

1940
01:43:43,920 --> 01:43:46,120
You know, certainly Illyrio's 
story makes him out. 

1941
01:43:46,440 --> 01:43:47,320
Right on. 
Yeah, I believe it. 

1942
01:43:47,320 --> 01:43:48,080
I believe it. 
I mean, it could. 

1943
01:43:48,080 --> 01:43:49,520
I think both those stories can 
work together. 

1944
01:43:49,520 --> 01:43:51,880
But yeah, it's we don't really 
need to get deep into that 

1945
01:43:51,880 --> 01:43:53,040
theory. 
Certainly that that's one that 

1946
01:43:53,040 --> 01:43:54,320
one's out there for people to 
check out. 

1947
01:43:54,320 --> 01:43:55,640
We don't need to debate that 
here. 

1948
01:43:56,480 --> 01:43:59,840
So let's talk about the 
Westerosi side, victory and new 

1949
01:43:59,840 --> 01:44:01,560
friendships. 
There's a plenty here. 

1950
01:44:01,560 --> 01:44:03,800
Of course, we talked about 
Barristan and Blackfish, and we 

1951
01:44:03,800 --> 01:44:06,480
know that Barristan got it, got 
his job when the next opening 

1952
01:44:06,480 --> 01:44:09,680
presented itself. 
Iron Islands closer to being a 

1953
01:44:09,680 --> 01:44:11,040
part of the realm than it ever 
was. 

1954
01:44:11,080 --> 01:44:13,840
You know, the Iron Islands 
actually uniting with the rest 

1955
01:44:13,840 --> 01:44:16,240
of the realm to fight a war and 
then being on the same sides. 

1956
01:44:16,240 --> 01:44:20,760
That's pretty unusual. 
On the other hand, when Robert 

1957
01:44:20,760 --> 01:44:24,200
Rebellion broke out, Kellen 
Greyjoy did not take sides, 

1958
01:44:24,240 --> 01:44:25,840
which I think is quite 
interesting. 

1959
01:44:25,840 --> 01:44:28,320
Everyone else seems to have 
immediately had a side to take. 

1960
01:44:28,320 --> 01:44:30,600
They had friendships and 
relationships and that really 

1961
01:44:30,600 --> 01:44:32,360
determined what side they were 
going to take. 

1962
01:44:32,880 --> 01:44:38,160
But it was only because of 
Bailon and Euron arguing, 

1963
01:44:38,320 --> 01:44:42,080
pressing their father to enter 
the war, to take a side, that 

1964
01:44:42,080 --> 01:44:44,320
they finally did take a side. 
And they didn't have much of an 

1965
01:44:44,320 --> 01:44:47,360
impact on the war. 
But they definitively sided with

1966
01:44:47,360 --> 01:44:50,000
Robert. 
So you could argue that the 

1967
01:44:50,000 --> 01:44:52,480
Greyjoy's weren't exactly 
embarrassed by him the way Tywin

1968
01:44:52,480 --> 01:44:56,000
was over Taito's, but they 
definitely didn't like the way 

1969
01:44:56,000 --> 01:44:58,760
he was ruling the Iron Islands. 
But he was a powerful man and 

1970
01:44:58,760 --> 01:45:01,840
and not easy to overcome. 
So it wasn't until his death 

1971
01:45:01,840 --> 01:45:05,040
that things changed. 
So this is also a set up for 

1972
01:45:05,040 --> 01:45:07,040
southern ambitions. 
Of course I mentioned some of 

1973
01:45:07,040 --> 01:45:08,560
these. 
These alliances were sort of 

1974
01:45:08,560 --> 01:45:10,560
predetermined. 
We talked about Hofstra, Tully 

1975
01:45:10,560 --> 01:45:13,120
and and Peter Baelish, John 
Aaron and Richard Stark. 

1976
01:45:13,120 --> 01:45:15,240
Quite possibly this is where a 
lot of this got set up. 

1977
01:45:15,600 --> 01:45:19,720
But and as you said, Tywin and 
his brothers and and the Prince 

1978
01:45:19,720 --> 01:45:23,520
Aries at the time future. 
King Aries and Stephen Baratheon

1979
01:45:24,080 --> 01:45:28,320
know that the three of them were
really close, so that could have

1980
01:45:28,320 --> 01:45:35,480
been a sort of alternative power
block forming, but due to 

1981
01:45:35,520 --> 01:45:40,560
various reasons, right Tywin? 
Sort of love for monopolizing 

1982
01:45:40,560 --> 01:45:44,160
power. 
Eris's sort of paranoia. 

1983
01:45:44,640 --> 01:45:46,680
It didn't. 
It didn't really shake out that 

1984
01:45:46,680 --> 01:45:49,280
way. 
Their sort of initial closeness 

1985
01:45:50,000 --> 01:45:53,320
in this era sort of eventually 
kind of fell apart. 

1986
01:45:53,840 --> 01:45:54,760
Right on. 
Yeah. 

1987
01:45:55,640 --> 01:45:58,560
So let's let's talk about the 
set up for the reign Tarbek 

1988
01:45:58,560 --> 01:46:01,880
Revolt, AKA the reigns of Cast. 
What the thing that ended with 

1989
01:46:01,880 --> 01:46:06,160
the reigns of Castamere, what 
motivated Tywin for all this 

1990
01:46:06,160 --> 01:46:10,360
was, was maybe, do you suppose 
maybe Tywin slash Joanna was 

1991
01:46:10,360 --> 01:46:14,400
upset that Jason was killed 
while Lord Taito stayed home 

1992
01:46:14,400 --> 01:46:17,560
being lazy as he always does? 
Or maybe people were maybe 

1993
01:46:17,560 --> 01:46:18,560
there. 
Maybe there's a little pride 

1994
01:46:18,560 --> 01:46:21,160
issue on Tywin's side that he 
was that the Lannisters were 

1995
01:46:21,160 --> 01:46:24,560
outshine by Roger Rain. 
Or do you think it's just 

1996
01:46:24,560 --> 01:46:28,800
something simpler than that? 
I mean, I think it it goes back 

1997
01:46:28,800 --> 01:46:33,720
further than that because like, 
we know that when Tywin was sent

1998
01:46:33,720 --> 01:46:38,800
off to King's Landing to be a 
Squire and a page and a 

1999
01:46:38,800 --> 01:46:41,440
cupbearer, he had hit his 
father. 

2000
01:46:41,960 --> 01:46:45,080
Oh yeah. 
I think like he had already 

2001
01:46:45,080 --> 01:46:49,280
established in his mind from his
childhood, right well before he 

2002
01:46:49,320 --> 01:46:53,160
he becomes a fighting age. 
My father is weak and this 

2003
01:46:53,160 --> 01:46:57,680
situation is unsupportable. 
And I'm when I get strong 

2004
01:46:57,680 --> 01:47:00,080
enough, I'm going to take 
action. 

2005
01:47:00,880 --> 01:47:04,320
And it's with the worth of Nine 
Penny King is that he feels that

2006
01:47:04,320 --> 01:47:07,360
he's strong enough in part 
because he distinguishes 

2007
01:47:07,360 --> 01:47:09,000
himself. 
His brothers distinguish 

2008
01:47:09,000 --> 01:47:11,800
himself. 
But we also learn the extended 

2009
01:47:12,080 --> 01:47:18,360
Westerlands section of World of 
Ice and Fire that Tywin came 

2010
01:47:18,360 --> 01:47:23,840
back to Casterly Rock with 500 
hardened Knights, right? 

2011
01:47:23,840 --> 01:47:26,960
So he had his own private army. 
And we're having. 

2012
01:47:27,040 --> 01:47:31,200
Got those Knights? 
Well, if you're are a hedge 

2013
01:47:31,200 --> 01:47:36,520
knight, right, a sworn sword who
no longer has a master because 

2014
01:47:36,520 --> 01:47:40,080
the war's over, you're looking 
for new work. 

2015
01:47:40,080 --> 01:47:44,600
And Tywin's there with all the 
gold of Casterly Rock saying 

2016
01:47:44,680 --> 01:47:47,400
come join me. 
You know, that's also fairly 

2017
01:47:47,400 --> 01:47:49,000
similar. 
You know, you see a lot of 

2018
01:47:49,040 --> 01:47:51,480
veterans of World War One found 
that they sort of liked 

2019
01:47:51,480 --> 01:47:54,320
fighting, right? 
So, you know, you're taking all 

2020
01:47:54,320 --> 01:47:56,640
of these veteran soldiers who 
are like, oh shit, I've got 

2021
01:47:56,640 --> 01:48:00,800
nothing to do now and saying, 
hey, kill the people I want you 

2022
01:48:00,960 --> 01:48:04,240
to kill. 
So here's a quote that that 

2023
01:48:04,240 --> 01:48:05,800
really sets up what we're 
talking about here. 

2024
01:48:05,880 --> 01:48:10,000
Hardened by battle, and all too 
aware of the low regard in which

2025
01:48:10,000 --> 01:48:13,280
the other Lords of the realm 
held, his father, Sir Tywin 

2026
01:48:13,280 --> 01:48:17,160
Lannister set out at once to 
restore the pride and power of 

2027
01:48:17,160 --> 01:48:19,720
Tasterly Rock. 
Yeah, there's this this line 

2028
01:48:19,720 --> 01:48:24,560
where Jamie is telling Sir Kevin
to be careful when he if he's 

2029
01:48:24,560 --> 01:48:28,720
going after Sandor Lagaine, who 
isn't actually Sandor Lagaine. 

2030
01:48:29,040 --> 01:48:32,360
But Kevin kind of looks back at 
Jamie like, are you kidding me? 

2031
01:48:32,680 --> 01:48:35,720
I have been hanging robber 
Knights since before you were 

2032
01:48:35,720 --> 01:48:38,040
born. 
And it's true. 

2033
01:48:38,040 --> 01:48:40,440
This is this. 
Kevin fought in the war of 9 

2034
01:48:40,440 --> 01:48:42,520
Penny Kings and he is a big part
of that. 

2035
01:48:42,520 --> 01:48:45,120
This last line here in that 
quote, Tywin Lannister set out 

2036
01:48:45,120 --> 01:48:46,840
to restore the pride and power 
of Catholic Rock. 

2037
01:48:47,120 --> 01:48:52,680
Tito's rule had allowed the 
Westerlands to become in a not 

2038
01:48:52,680 --> 01:48:55,880
chaotic, but in a state of not. 
It wasn't well managed. 

2039
01:48:55,880 --> 01:48:58,600
There were robber Knights. 
There were bandits, things like 

2040
01:48:58,600 --> 01:49:00,400
that. 
And so this is when Kevin talks 

2041
01:49:00,400 --> 01:49:03,560
about he's been hanging Knights,
robber Knights and and bandits 

2042
01:49:03,560 --> 01:49:06,520
since before Jamie was born. 
This is what he's talking about.

2043
01:49:06,760 --> 01:49:10,440
This is how he got started. 
So Tywin immediately gave Kevin 

2044
01:49:10,440 --> 01:49:12,920
a lot of these Knights that 
Steven just mentioned and said, 

2045
01:49:12,920 --> 01:49:16,160
hey, go clean all this up. 
And Kevin did it. 

2046
01:49:16,160 --> 01:49:19,640
He was very good at it. 
And that's part of why Tywin has

2047
01:49:19,680 --> 01:49:22,560
always trusted Kevin, because 
Kevin is very competent at 

2048
01:49:22,560 --> 01:49:24,360
things like this. 
Yeah, he's the loyal soldier, 

2049
01:49:24,840 --> 01:49:27,520
Yeah. 
That's a really big deal. 

2050
01:49:27,520 --> 01:49:32,040
And like you said also, Steven 
Titos was a weak was was kind of

2051
01:49:32,040 --> 01:49:35,680
weak and Tywin was strong and 
they disagreed on a lot of 

2052
01:49:35,680 --> 01:49:37,480
things and this just made it 
worse and. 

2053
01:49:37,680 --> 01:49:38,360
Jason was dead. 
So then. 

2054
01:49:38,360 --> 01:49:39,400
And Jason was dead. 
You're right. 

2055
01:49:39,400 --> 01:49:44,840
Sort of strong, older Lannister.
It was just these sort of 

2056
01:49:44,840 --> 01:49:47,200
younger men. 
Yeah, Jason was maybe been a 

2057
01:49:47,200 --> 01:49:50,480
bridge like a help them kind of 
relate to each other that was 

2058
01:49:50,480 --> 01:49:52,360
taken away. 
That's a great point. 

2059
01:49:52,360 --> 01:49:54,760
And Tywin would be even more 
different than his father after 

2060
01:49:54,760 --> 01:49:56,960
like his after his this this 
quote says he was hardened by 

2061
01:49:56,960 --> 01:49:58,840
battle. 
So he was tough and then he was 

2062
01:49:58,840 --> 01:50:01,400
tougher and he even even more 
different than his father and 

2063
01:50:01,400 --> 01:50:04,560
even more willing to to spill 
some blood. 

2064
01:50:04,560 --> 01:50:07,440
And his father would would still
be the way he was. 

2065
01:50:07,440 --> 01:50:10,080
So there the gap between their 
attitudes would have widened. 

2066
01:50:13,280 --> 01:50:16,920
I'd say the 9 penny Kings is an 
example like very few others. 

2067
01:50:16,920 --> 01:50:20,000
It gives us an example as to how
the country reacts in the face 

2068
01:50:20,000 --> 01:50:22,240
of a foreign invasion. 
Like I said at the beginning, 

2069
01:50:22,240 --> 01:50:25,000
this could be extremely relevant
for Young Griff, but even more 

2070
01:50:25,000 --> 01:50:28,240
so for Danny because her army's 
even more foreign than his. 

2071
01:50:28,440 --> 01:50:32,080
And to many traditionalists in 
Westeros, the idea of a queen is

2072
01:50:32,080 --> 01:50:34,680
pretty foreign too. 
So a lot of things they might 

2073
01:50:35,560 --> 01:50:40,040
that might unite Westeros 
against her, and maybe that 

2074
01:50:40,040 --> 01:50:42,680
creates new alliances and 
friendships as these people 

2075
01:50:42,680 --> 01:50:44,600
fight alongside each other. 
Who knows? 

2076
01:50:44,800 --> 01:50:46,440
Lots of interesting 
possibilities. 

2077
01:50:46,840 --> 01:50:48,800
So we're going to move into our 
final. 

2078
01:50:48,880 --> 01:50:51,440
Just a few questions and our 
thanks, but I want to give 

2079
01:50:51,440 --> 01:50:55,040
Steven the chance to say any 
last bits that we may have 

2080
01:50:55,040 --> 01:50:56,920
missed or any wrap up points you
have. 

2081
01:50:57,080 --> 01:50:59,280
All my theories. 
Awesome, awesome. 

2082
01:50:59,280 --> 01:51:04,880
OK, well then we have a shout 
out from Teflon TV, our friend 

2083
01:51:04,880 --> 01:51:08,440
Tony Teflon sending a super chat
saying show him some love, peace

2084
01:51:08,440 --> 01:51:10,160
and stay sexy. 
Absolutely. 

2085
01:51:10,160 --> 01:51:13,800
Thanks to you Tony. 
Appreciate that and y'all check 

2086
01:51:13,800 --> 01:51:15,560
out Teflon TV when you get the 
chance. 

2087
01:51:15,560 --> 01:51:18,680
Good stuff going on over there. 
Also a super chat from Nina. 

2088
01:51:18,680 --> 01:51:20,760
Hey, popping in and out. 
We wanted to give a shots of my 

2089
01:51:20,800 --> 01:51:23,000
favorite people in the fandom. 
Well, thank you for that Nina. 

2090
01:51:23,240 --> 01:51:27,920
You're one of our favorites too.
So Steven, what is next for you?

2091
01:51:27,920 --> 01:51:30,840
We've we've, we've heard where 
to find you, but what are you 

2092
01:51:30,840 --> 01:51:35,320
working on next? 
So I've reached the 50% mark in 

2093
01:51:35,320 --> 01:51:39,480
A Storm of Swords, so I'm taking
the time to do some sort of 

2094
01:51:39,480 --> 01:51:42,560
little side essays. 
I just did the first Duncan Egg 

2095
01:51:43,200 --> 01:51:47,200
essay about hedge knight. 
I'm going to do 1 about Swan 

2096
01:51:47,200 --> 01:51:51,840
Sword. 
I have the like a fanfic The 

2097
01:51:51,840 --> 01:51:54,040
Hour of the Wolf that I need to 
finish up. 

2098
01:51:54,800 --> 01:51:59,120
It's been sort of like 
incomplete for for God going on 

2099
01:51:59,120 --> 01:52:04,960
a year or so now. 
But I also want to like, make a 

2100
01:52:04,960 --> 01:52:11,880
dive for the Red Wedding and 
just like knock a whole bunch of

2101
01:52:11,880 --> 01:52:14,880
chapters out 'cause I'm not that
far off, right? 

2102
01:52:14,880 --> 01:52:20,960
I'm, yeah, John I, I did John 5.
And you know, the Red Wedding is

2103
01:52:20,960 --> 01:52:25,440
just like what you know. 
Not long after that, I can't 

2104
01:52:25,440 --> 01:52:27,920
remember exactly. 
We're not quite there in Valor. 

2105
01:52:27,920 --> 01:52:29,080
We read us ourselves. 
We're more. 

2106
01:52:29,080 --> 01:52:31,320
We're around. 
Chapter 51. 

2107
01:52:31,320 --> 01:52:37,000
So I've only got 10 chapters to 
go. 11 if. 

2108
01:52:37,000 --> 01:52:41,480
You include Aria 11 as sort of 
showing the what's going on 

2109
01:52:41,480 --> 01:52:43,000
outside. 
Right, right. 

2110
01:52:43,000 --> 01:52:45,200
Yeah, there's, there's all those
related chapters close together.

2111
01:52:45,240 --> 01:52:47,680
Yeah, yeah. 10 chapters. 
That's not very far. 

2112
01:52:48,160 --> 01:52:49,040
So cool. 
Well that's great. 

2113
01:52:49,920 --> 01:52:53,480
Looking forward to that. 
Then thanks also to Shaya for 

2114
01:52:53,480 --> 01:52:56,880
they were, we had some, she 
managed some difficult technical

2115
01:52:56,880 --> 01:52:58,920
stuff today. 
There's always something to to 

2116
01:52:58,920 --> 01:53:01,160
worry about and she's always on 
top of that. 

2117
01:53:01,360 --> 01:53:04,280
Appreciate that so much and 
reading quotes and managing the 

2118
01:53:04,280 --> 01:53:07,080
chat all at the same time. 
When people say a Shea is the 

2119
01:53:07,080 --> 01:53:09,480
best, well, that's not 
hyperbole. 

2120
01:53:10,040 --> 01:53:14,040
Also thanks to Michael Clarfeld 
for our music, finding our music

2121
01:53:14,040 --> 01:53:17,960
through Kevin McCloud and our 
maps and the video intro that we

2122
01:53:17,960 --> 01:53:20,320
have for all of our episodes. 
Very awesome. 

2123
01:53:20,320 --> 01:53:23,120
Check him out at claradocs.de 
that's with AK. 

2124
01:53:23,840 --> 01:53:28,440
Also thanks to Jesse Koal and 
Joey Townsend for our intro 

2125
01:53:28,440 --> 01:53:30,920
outro music. 
Thanks to our Ben Geneer for 

2126
01:53:30,920 --> 01:53:34,400
audio editing assistance and 
thanks to everyone who came 

2127
01:53:34,400 --> 01:53:36,160
live. 
You guys had a great looks like 

2128
01:53:36,160 --> 01:53:38,640
the chat was booming as it often
is. 

2129
01:53:38,840 --> 01:53:41,880
Lots of great questions were 
coming out, lots of curiosities 

2130
01:53:41,880 --> 01:53:44,320
and related topics to the 9 
Penny Kings and all these 

2131
01:53:44,320 --> 01:53:46,960
different characters that were 
some of them we like briefed, 

2132
01:53:46,960 --> 01:53:49,240
touched, touched on briefly. 
So you can't really, we can't do

2133
01:53:49,240 --> 01:53:51,680
deep dives on characters that 
are only barely part of this, 

2134
01:53:51,680 --> 01:53:54,720
but people in the chat can do 
whatever they want and talk 

2135
01:53:54,720 --> 01:53:56,240
about those things. 
So a lot of times really good 

2136
01:53:56,240 --> 01:53:57,600
side discussions happen on 
there. 

2137
01:53:58,480 --> 01:54:00,760
And thanks to everyone who likes
and shares history of Westeros 

2138
01:54:00,760 --> 01:54:03,400
podcast as well as liking and 
sharing Race for the Iron 

2139
01:54:03,400 --> 01:54:05,680
Throne. 
And let me do some Patreon shout

2140
01:54:05,680 --> 01:54:10,040
outs as we say goodbye to y'all.
And we'll see you hopefully for 

2141
01:54:10,560 --> 01:54:14,040
Valerie Ritas on Sunday, or if 
not, a future live stream or 

2142
01:54:14,040 --> 01:54:16,800
game stream. 
Thanks again, everybody. 

2143
01:54:18,160 --> 01:54:22,120
Thanks to the mysterious BR Hand
of the King, Lord Stephen Stark 

2144
01:54:22,120 --> 01:54:24,640
titles titles Hand of Queen 
Ashea, who is known as the best.

2145
01:54:24,640 --> 01:54:28,040
Also make sure to check out the 
Here be Dragons show that's his 

2146
01:54:28,040 --> 01:54:30,080
every Sunday after Valerie 
Ritas. 

2147
01:54:30,080 --> 01:54:33,040
They are they have a variety of 
great things from Game of 

2148
01:54:33,040 --> 01:54:36,640
Thrones talk to Expanse to they 
talked about the Oscars. 

2149
01:54:36,640 --> 01:54:39,040
They talked about different 
superheroes to lots of just 

2150
01:54:39,040 --> 01:54:41,080
great topics. 
But my favorite is when they 

2151
01:54:41,080 --> 01:54:42,720
talk about the Expanse. 
But hey, they do lots of things 

2152
01:54:42,720 --> 01:54:44,720
well. 
Lord Jim the Fortuitous of Wars 

2153
01:54:44,720 --> 01:54:47,360
and Politics of Ice and Fire 
blog is Warden of the West. 

2154
01:54:47,800 --> 01:54:49,880
Lord George Stormsville the 
Cunning is Lord of the Chiliad 

2155
01:54:49,880 --> 01:54:52,720
and Warden of the East. 
Kabeth the Unfrozen is Lord of 

2156
01:54:52,720 --> 01:54:55,280
the Bricks and Castle Crimson 
Light, Defender of the Old Gods 

2157
01:54:55,280 --> 01:54:58,120
and Warden of the North. 
Lord Brendan Lannister is the 

2158
01:54:58,120 --> 01:55:01,440
Blood Lion, ruler of Castle 
Everroar, Warden of the South. 

2159
01:55:02,200 --> 01:55:04,960
Lord James Tuttle is King of the
Stepstones and the Narrow Sea 

2160
01:55:04,960 --> 01:55:07,360
commander of the Royal Fleet, 
consisting of the Narrow Fleet 

2161
01:55:07,360 --> 01:55:10,960
led by flagship Caraxes and the 
Bloodstone Fleet led by flagship

2162
01:55:10,960 --> 01:55:13,480
Prince Damon. 
He does not understand all this 

2163
01:55:13,480 --> 01:55:15,720
bickering over the Step Stones. 
If he were to come for the Step 

2164
01:55:15,720 --> 01:55:18,600
Stones, they would be his in a 
short order. 

2165
01:55:19,240 --> 01:55:21,960
King beyond the Wall, Sydney 
Jesse is the fall born, Lord of 

2166
01:55:21,960 --> 01:55:23,360
Blue Spring in the Haunted 
Forest. 

2167
01:55:23,360 --> 01:55:26,000
Wield the dagger of dragonglass 
and the Valyrian steel blade. 

2168
01:55:26,000 --> 01:55:29,480
Red Frost, he says, send black 
fire up there to him. 

2169
01:55:29,720 --> 01:55:32,880
He could make much better use of
it than those silly black fires 

2170
01:55:32,880 --> 01:55:35,560
themselves. 
Lady Sarah Connelly, the Willful

2171
01:55:35,560 --> 01:55:38,560
is says wit beyond measure is 
man's greatest treasure and she 

2172
01:55:38,560 --> 01:55:41,680
is Jenny's patron. 
Our White Walker patrons include

2173
01:55:41,680 --> 01:55:44,160
Arraya Flint of the Mountain 
Flints, captured by the Weeper 

2174
01:55:44,160 --> 01:55:46,640
only to be raised in the Valley 
of the Milk Water, Blue Eyes, 

2175
01:55:46,720 --> 01:55:49,760
Golden memories. 
Alexander Greyblood is first of 

2176
01:55:49,760 --> 01:55:53,240
the First Men now crowned in ice
called Silence, Bringer, Wood 

2177
01:55:53,240 --> 01:55:57,000
Blinder and the Snow of Night, 
wielder of the Ice Ford great 

2178
01:55:57,000 --> 01:56:00,440
sword, Pale Frost. 
Our Small Council includes Lord 

2179
01:56:00,440 --> 01:56:03,360
Daniel, the sneaky Russian 
Master of Ships, Lord Benjen of 

2180
01:56:03,360 --> 01:56:06,680
House Hornwood, Master of Laws, 
Lord Fabian Flowers, the Bastard

2181
01:56:06,680 --> 01:56:10,400
of Greenshield, Master of Coin, 
and Lord Johan of House Orcos is

2182
01:56:10,400 --> 01:56:13,160
called Shadowhawk. 
He's Master of Whisperers. 

2183
01:56:13,800 --> 01:56:16,840
Lady Dial is of Castle Nachi is 
the alpha patron, Lord Dan of 

2184
01:56:16,840 --> 01:56:18,880
the Red Mountains and Castle 
Great Bell is breaker of the 

2185
01:56:18,880 --> 01:56:20,960
second stone. 
Gregor the Toasty is Lord of the

2186
01:56:20,960 --> 01:56:23,520
Bread Fort. 
Lord Ryan of Castle Stonegate is

2187
01:56:23,520 --> 01:56:26,480
guardian of the Rocky Mountain 
Pass Ashland Winter is the Hawks

2188
01:56:26,480 --> 01:56:29,640
eye lady of Castle Skyfall. 
Lady Mckell of Moonacre is 

2189
01:56:29,640 --> 01:56:31,560
leader of the Weirwood 
Protectorate Alliance. 

2190
01:56:31,800 --> 01:56:34,480
The Lord of the Hill of the 
Halls rather of Castle Hillcrest

2191
01:56:34,720 --> 01:56:36,400
is wielder of the Valyrian steel
machete. 

2192
01:56:36,400 --> 01:56:39,760
Everglades Lord Alistair 
Whittaker is Lord of the Dawn 

2193
01:56:39,760 --> 01:56:41,760
Hold. 
Lord Bemi Snuggle Bunny is 

2194
01:56:41,760 --> 01:56:43,840
guardian Ranger of the hidden 
100 acre weirwood. 

2195
01:56:43,840 --> 01:56:46,360
Dual wielder of the Valyrian 
short swords, Glorious morning 

2196
01:56:46,360 --> 01:56:49,040
and little light, wise 
sharpshooter of the weirwood and

2197
01:56:49,040 --> 01:56:51,560
ironwood laminated Longbow. 
Todd von Oben. 

2198
01:56:51,840 --> 01:56:54,440
When you fear things cannot get 
worse, Snuggle Bunny enters the 

2199
01:56:54,440 --> 01:56:56,520
fray. 
The Bastard of the Wolf Wood is 

2200
01:56:56,520 --> 01:56:59,200
first forester of the old God, 
sworn to house Iron weirwood. 

2201
01:56:59,400 --> 01:57:02,600
Listen for the silence. 
Lady Liana Kelly of Wolf Iron 

2202
01:57:02,800 --> 01:57:05,240
Wolf Island, Excuse me, is 
protectors of the Steel Hold. 

2203
01:57:05,560 --> 01:57:09,280
Lady Casey Stark of I'm sorry, 
Casey Stark is of House Acres. 

2204
01:57:09,280 --> 01:57:10,400
There's no lady attached to 
that. 

2205
01:57:11,000 --> 01:57:14,280
Lady K of House Archer is Lady 
of Earth Dog, a hall huntress of

2206
01:57:14,280 --> 01:57:16,880
the Wolfswood and guardian of 
Matty Squirrel's Bay and the 

2207
01:57:16,880 --> 01:57:20,280
mighty Dire Ween. 
Lady Raywin of House Dils Dane 

2208
01:57:20,280 --> 01:57:23,240
is the star Spear. 
Peter Rivers is the Pale dragon 

2209
01:57:23,240 --> 01:57:26,040
and heir to Bloodraven. 
Lady Carlin Carey of Castle 

2210
01:57:26,040 --> 01:57:30,280
Stone Sharp, whose horses shot 
in Valyrian steel, is Lady Rider

2211
01:57:30,280 --> 01:57:33,600
of the Rising Hills. 
Lady Maura of how Stark is arch,

2212
01:57:33,600 --> 01:57:36,640
mistress of apothecaries and 
woods witch her castle features 

2213
01:57:36,640 --> 01:57:38,480
Where would doors with painted 
moons. 

2214
01:57:39,200 --> 01:57:42,000
Our King's justice is Sir Troy, 
the Steady wielder of the 

2215
01:57:42,000 --> 01:57:43,520
Valyrian steel blade. 
Fate. 

2216
01:57:44,360 --> 01:57:47,360
Our Queen's how high council is 
bloody? 

2217
01:57:47,360 --> 01:57:49,320
Ben Blackwood, master of 
whisperers. 

2218
01:57:49,320 --> 01:57:52,080
Rupaeus, star eyes, Lady of 
waves and mistress of ships, 

2219
01:57:52,240 --> 01:57:55,080
Captain of the Iron Shadow Cat. 
In these shadows we bear our 

2220
01:57:55,080 --> 01:57:57,360
claws. 
Catherine the Wise of House 

2221
01:57:57,360 --> 01:58:00,600
Trondheim is Master of Coin. 
Grand Maester Elizabeth is 

2222
01:58:00,600 --> 01:58:03,160
middle daughter of Lana Mormont,
First Lady to forge both the 

2223
01:58:03,160 --> 01:58:04,560
silver and Valyrian steel. 
Link. 

2224
01:58:04,840 --> 01:58:08,240
You you could tell yourself that
the Queen's High Council was all

2225
01:58:08,240 --> 01:58:12,120
getting ready for our meeting in
about 5 minutes. 

2226
01:58:13,760 --> 01:58:15,640
No, in actuality, I just wasn't 
ready. 

2227
01:58:16,600 --> 01:58:19,960
And Laura Burrows is the Lady of
Infinity, Master of Laws, our 

2228
01:58:19,960 --> 01:58:22,960
Kingsguard led by Lord Commander
Miriamar, backed by Sir Glennon 

2229
01:58:22,960 --> 01:58:26,320
of House Leon called Lion Cloak,
longest tenured white sword, Sir

2230
01:58:26,320 --> 01:58:28,880
Dean the White Knight of the 
Black Star, Sir George of House 

2231
01:58:28,880 --> 01:58:32,040
Pepsi, the beverage Knight 
Gregor Snow called Snow Bear, a 

2232
01:58:32,040 --> 01:58:35,160
Bastard of Winterfell, Sir Jen 
Seaworth, Knight of the Southern

2233
01:58:35,160 --> 01:58:37,440
Snows, and Lisa Water, Witch of 
Dorn. 

2234
01:58:38,120 --> 01:58:41,800
Our Red Wedding band is led by 
Sir Newt of the Rock wielding 

2235
01:58:41,800 --> 01:58:43,320
Dwiemer Mote. 
Gwiemer Knote. 

2236
01:58:43,320 --> 01:58:46,200
Rather a whale. 
A where would loot with Valyrian

2237
01:58:46,200 --> 01:58:49,840
steel strings. 
Our Queens guard is should I 

2238
01:58:49,840 --> 01:58:50,640
read that one or are you? 
Yeah. 

2239
01:58:51,320 --> 01:58:52,880
OK. 
Lord Captain Commander. 

2240
01:58:52,880 --> 01:58:54,280
Hey. 
Mahelmith is the cell sword 

2241
01:58:54,280 --> 01:58:57,120
Sentinel Alexander of House of 
Tradies from the seat of Dune. 

2242
01:58:57,120 --> 01:58:59,160
I must not fear. 
Fear is the mind killer. 

2243
01:58:59,400 --> 01:59:02,400
Sir Rambo Knight of House Gannon
is first blood. 

2244
01:59:02,880 --> 01:59:05,600
Sir Leon of House Walker, 
wielder of the twin Valyrian 

2245
01:59:05,600 --> 01:59:08,800
steel blades fire and ice and 
the where would bow rain, Amber,

2246
01:59:08,800 --> 01:59:11,720
the Adamant, the Knight of the 
Mist and Mother of squids, The 

2247
01:59:11,720 --> 01:59:16,000
wintry Wolverine motto. 
We finish what you begin and 

2248
01:59:16,000 --> 01:59:20,040
Nora Neko, our beard guard, is 
led by Lord Commander George the

2249
01:59:20,040 --> 01:59:23,520
Golden, backed by Sir Joshua 
Oakhart, the White Oak, Lady 

2250
01:59:23,520 --> 01:59:26,440
Rita of the Copper Mane, the 
Unbound Dance, the Fervor. 

2251
01:59:26,600 --> 01:59:30,080
Sir Jeff, Warden of the IAC is 
wielder of Triad, the multi 

2252
01:59:30,080 --> 01:59:32,560
faceted beard of platinum, red 
and brown. 

2253
01:59:32,680 --> 01:59:35,880
Stay frosty. 
Sir Tim Corgile is mad boy of 

2254
01:59:35,880 --> 01:59:38,760
the Western Desert. 
A few recent joiners. 

2255
01:59:38,760 --> 01:59:40,720
Yeah, real quick. 
Yeah, why don't we have a cat 

2256
01:59:40,720 --> 01:59:42,920
guard? 
A cat guard. 

2257
01:59:43,080 --> 01:59:45,680
Yeah, I thought of it because 
the big reason I'm distracted is

2258
01:59:45,680 --> 01:59:48,400
I have Xerxes just rolling 
around on me. 

2259
01:59:48,400 --> 01:59:50,640
It's a pretty good idea. 
I bet people would join the cat 

2260
01:59:50,640 --> 01:59:51,600
I. 
Don't know it has to be cat 

2261
01:59:51,600 --> 01:59:53,440
guard. 
It could be a cat, something 

2262
01:59:53,440 --> 01:59:54,640
well. 
Something to do with cats, yeah.

2263
01:59:54,640 --> 01:59:57,120
Exactly. 
But you know, tell us your 

2264
01:59:57,120 --> 02:00:00,320
suggestion, Xerxes, once. 
I don't know the cat. 

2265
02:00:00,880 --> 02:00:02,840
Mistress I I don't know. 
He wants love. 

2266
02:00:02,840 --> 02:00:04,480
He doesn't need guarding, is my 
point. 

2267
02:00:04,480 --> 02:00:06,600
He wants just love and 
affection. 

2268
02:00:06,840 --> 02:00:10,280
And treats. 
Yeah, we also have Sir Mikkel of

2269
02:00:10,280 --> 02:00:12,560
House Redwood, wielder of the 
Valyrian steel blade, forest 

2270
02:00:12,560 --> 02:00:15,440
fire and a Redwood Longbow. 
Reese the Renewer, the Lady of 

2271
02:00:15,440 --> 02:00:17,800
Ash in Rebirth. 
Archmaester Austin, whose ring 

2272
02:00:17,800 --> 02:00:19,800
and rod mask are made of oily 
Blackstone. 

2273
02:00:19,800 --> 02:00:23,040
That's cool, Maester. 
Luscious of the Alluvia Lady 

2274
02:00:23,040 --> 02:00:26,240
Kelly, mistress of the old Bay 
of Crabs bullwear the purple of 

2275
02:00:26,240 --> 02:00:29,880
heavenly myth head house Taurus 
Ricky Ale belly of house Bell 

2276
02:00:29,880 --> 02:00:34,640
motto ring the bell House Azura 
of elsewhere touch not a cat 

2277
02:00:34,640 --> 02:00:37,720
bought a barge. 
Justin the patcher called salty 

2278
02:00:37,720 --> 02:00:41,960
Justin, healer of salt shore. 
And last but not least, the 

2279
02:00:41,960 --> 02:00:47,280
history of Westeros Nights Watch
led by Lord Commander benjin 

2280
02:00:47,280 --> 02:00:51,240
Umber the silent giant wielder 
of the Valyrian steel great 

2281
02:00:51,240 --> 02:00:55,680
sword Winters Kiss first builder
Magor Snow AKA Magor the Cool, 

2282
02:00:55,760 --> 02:00:59,120
the fire in the snow, 1st Ranger
source Sir Delica of House 

2283
02:00:59,120 --> 02:01:02,800
Gramercy and a couple others 
like Sleepless Jacob Snow, the 

2284
02:01:02,800 --> 02:01:05,160
Celtic hedge knight, eater of 
the Salmon of knowledge. 

2285
02:01:05,440 --> 02:01:09,560
Sir Adam the loyal Lady Estrada 
of the Green wielder of Roses 

2286
02:01:09,560 --> 02:01:12,200
kiss dual crossed Valyrian steel
blades. 

2287
02:01:12,720 --> 02:01:16,040
Thanks again everybody. 
Thanks again to Steven and Shaya

2288
02:01:16,040 --> 02:01:19,960
and everybody who came live. 
We'll see you again soon, Valar 

2289
02:01:19,960 --> 02:01:21,240
Ririus.