1 00:00:01,200 --> 00:00:04,560 Hello folks, this is Princess. You are listening to the 2 00:00:04,560 --> 00:00:07,760 Millennial Mustard Seed podcast. Thanks for listening. 3 00:00:07,760 --> 00:00:09,600 Don't forget to share with your friends. 4 00:00:11,200 --> 00:00:12,960 That's tough. We're in a very tough spot. 5 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:17,840 I think that what we're doing right now is a great benefit and 6 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:19,520 virtue because. It's an end. 7 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:23,720 Around between this whole corrupt informational system, 8 00:00:23,720 --> 00:00:27,480 media system, we claim to believe in a God who spoke the 9 00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:31,200 universe into existence and literally raised himself from 10 00:00:31,200 --> 00:00:34,040 the dead. And yet we're not going to 11 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:37,520 believe that anything else exists in the spirit realm, even 12 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:39,200 though His word tells us that they do. 13 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:43,640 Their bodies weren't permitted to go to sleep like humans do, 14 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:47,760 and they weren't permitted to go to heaven, so they wander the 15 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:50,520 earth. You know, I've seen the eyes 16 00:00:50,520 --> 00:00:53,880 turn black to unknown tongues being spoken. 17 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:57,200 These Giants would love way up in the Highland. 18 00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:00,800 The young Braves, the young men would might have been the trees. 19 00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:03,040 They wait for one of these 12 footers to come. 20 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:06,040 Walking down the bath and. They would jump on them and kill 21 00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:08,640 them, drag them back to the village, and the village would 22 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:16,320 feast on the body. Then people start to get 23 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:18,360 weapons, they start to get armor, they start to build 24 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:20,080 cities, they start to fortify their cities. 25 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:23,640 Now God looks down and there's violence everywhere. 26 00:01:24,320 --> 00:01:28,000 The battle, this war that we are at, is not against each other, 27 00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:30,680 it's against these principalities and these rulers 28 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:32,280 and these archons in the high places. 29 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:35,040 It's really worthwhile to read the Bible yourself. 30 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:40,160 Fear is one of the primary drivers of mind control because 31 00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:44,000 we have to take every thought captive and resist fear. 32 00:01:46,960 --> 00:01:51,880 You're going to have a testimony that is a justice case against 33 00:01:52,040 --> 00:02:25,280 the Kingdom of darkness. Welcome Music to the Days of 34 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:28,840 Noah podcast where we talk all things biblical, supernatural, 35 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:34,440 and strange. Luke, myself and Rod Smith from 36 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:37,640 the Millennial Mustard Seed podcast conclude our 37 00:02:37,640 --> 00:02:40,920 conversation on the deconstruction and 38 00:02:40,920 --> 00:02:43,760 reconstruction of our church meetings. 39 00:02:44,640 --> 00:02:49,120 Understanding that there is a huge gap between how we were 40 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:53,720 meant to meet and the fully functioning body of Christ and 41 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:58,920 the limitations and the potential sapping man made 42 00:02:58,920 --> 00:03:03,800 traditions that have been added to how we meet as believers. 43 00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:09,560 We try to flesh out, even just briefly, many of those bullet 44 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:14,280 points that need deconstruction, those man made things, and then 45 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:19,600 contrast that to how we are meeting as some of us are 46 00:03:19,600 --> 00:03:23,760 meeting in homes. Not that the home is a 47 00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:28,840 necessity, but that it is conducive for that face to face, 48 00:03:28,920 --> 00:03:33,760 eyeball to eyeball, every member participating church meeting. 49 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:37,920 Guys, thanks so much for being out there listening. 50 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:41,360 We do appreciate each and everyone of you coming back week 51 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:44,800 after week. If you enjoy this content and 52 00:03:44,800 --> 00:03:48,080 you would like to support us, the easiest way to do that is to 53 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:53,000 simply take a moment to leave us a five star or positive written 54 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:58,000 review on your favorite podcast platform and then share the link 55 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:02,160 to family and friends. With that, let's conclude our 56 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:06,480 conversation about the fully functioning body of Christ. 57 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:15,160 You know, overarching in the Bible, God tells us subdue the 58 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:16,839 earth, conquer, procreate, right? 59 00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:18,839 So we know that we're supposed to have land, we're supposed to 60 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:21,600 have houses. Doctor Monzo goes through and 61 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:24,840 shows that in the Hebrew, there's the construction that 62 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:29,080 the pictograph at the ancient Hebrew even demonstrates every 63 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:34,520 root letter and meaning equates to the same value of a house, a 64 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:38,280 family and land. So I just want to challenge, and 65 00:04:38,280 --> 00:04:40,640 this is not for your individual question, Luke. 66 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:44,040 This is for the zooming out to the macrocosm of this issue. 67 00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:48,040 How many churches own buildings in your local city? 68 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:50,960 Now I want you to start to look at the cities as you travel 69 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:54,440 across your state. You know I'm in literally the 70 00:04:54,440 --> 00:05:00,920 population census of New York City to Washington DC, huge 71 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:03,480 population. If I was to do a search on how 72 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:08,640 many churches own a building and what that building generates tax 73 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:11,880 credit wise, the maintenance of that building, right? 74 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:17,480 And I was to reflect and look for any of that in the Bible, I 75 00:05:17,480 --> 00:05:20,320 can't find it. But what I can find is the 76 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:24,960 absence of a highly detailed edifying structure that God has 77 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:29,240 created for the pruning of the perfecting of his body, which is 78 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:32,120 fivefold ministry. So I would start to say things 79 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:35,360 like, if you have a building that's paid off, maybe sell it 80 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:40,000 and get land, right and pop up some small buildings with a rec 81 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:41,640 center in the middle, middle of that land. 82 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:45,160 Why are there so many churches that own buildings? 83 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:48,520 And I'm saying this with a right heart because literally it's 84 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:52,040 just like being meek, reserving my power, right? 85 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,400 I could come for the jugular of so many people and do it 86 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:58,160 righteously and with an anointing on me. 87 00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:02,240 But I'm reserving myself in a gentleness to say, listen, let's 88 00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:05,160 think about what is wrong here, right? 89 00:06:05,160 --> 00:06:09,040 Because God is, is going to in his perfect timing, move a 90 00:06:09,040 --> 00:06:12,840 generation of people to be completely in agreement with 91 00:06:12,840 --> 00:06:16,320 this idea that we have been institutionalized and the 92 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:20,800 function of the institution, the tax credit and the dynamic of 93 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:27,440 the what do you call this denominational preferences is is 94 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:31,640 not found in the Bible. So I would say get land. 95 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:34,760 If you have a big building and it's paid off, sell it, get 96 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:38,320 land, get a smaller building and encourage a biblical model of 97 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:40,240 meet ups. That's from my perspective. 98 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:41,800 Not everybody's going to agree with me. 99 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:44,560 You know, the whole cult thing that you brought up where 12 100 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:45,960 people. I think that that's a little bit 101 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,520 religious and strict. I think there needs to be a 102 00:06:48,520 --> 00:06:51,360 period, almost like a honeymoon, where you're figuring out what 103 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:53,840 are the highs and lows. Can I really trust you? 104 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:56,160 You know, I wrote this little quote in my book, Luke. 105 00:06:56,160 --> 00:07:01,120 It's it says trust is built when you're in danger and I get 106 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:03,280 closer to you rather than running away. 107 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:07,360 That's the premises of love. So like when you're going 108 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:08,520 through it, you're in the gutter. 109 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:11,320 And this is what the men's prayer group does that that God 110 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:13,400 has given me. This is why we're so involved. 111 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:16,400 This is why we're driving to meet and sharpen and just 112 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:20,440 engaging with each other on a daily, weekly basis is because 113 00:07:20,440 --> 00:07:23,280 you have the opportunity to show yourself a soldier of Christ 114 00:07:23,320 --> 00:07:25,840 Jesus bearing each other's burdens and so fulfilling the 115 00:07:25,840 --> 00:07:28,800 law. So like as it grows, we're 116 00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:32,680 busting out the seams. You said, OK, well then let's 117 00:07:32,680 --> 00:07:36,600 look for land first because there's obviously SRA survivors. 118 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:40,440 There's real widows out there who have lost their spouses, who 119 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:44,040 have not opened up their legs to any and everybody walking by who 120 00:07:44,040 --> 00:07:47,120 are a true biblical widow. And there's true orphans out 121 00:07:47,120 --> 00:07:50,720 there who have been disconnected from their their mother and 122 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:52,480 their father. Their bloodline has been cut 123 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:56,160 short of having that role model who need that's good and perfect 124 00:07:56,960 --> 00:07:58,320 understanding that God is giving us. 125 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:01,280 So I'm I'm my whole thing. God has been planning into me 126 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:04,040 land and it the land belongs to the people. 127 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:08,600 We've been usurped. We have abdicated our authority 128 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:11,800 in so many ways that we're sitting here trying to play 129 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:14,960 minus and plus in the construction of what is ensnared 130 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:17,640 us, rather than zooming out and just saying God, are you doing 131 00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:19,400 something new? What is happening? 132 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:23,080 What do I do? There's something like 300 133 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:28,280 billion billion dollars worth of real estate that churches have 134 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:32,000 in, in this country alone, United States. 135 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:38,400 Do we really think that our couple hours a week and maybe a 136 00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:44,720 few midweek activities is worth that, that multimillion dollar 137 00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:48,240 mortgage in most cases when there are these people 138 00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:52,640 suffering, like Rod says, I mean, our, our group in our 139 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:55,640 living room, there's only two or three of us that actually give 140 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:59,280 to this out of a dozen regularly that is. 141 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:04,320 But I have a savings and we've been able to bless people with 142 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:08,200 benevolence when they have a need or a ministry opportunity. 143 00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:09,760 Boom. What do you guys think? 144 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:13,000 By consensus, not democracy, consensus. 145 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:16,480 That's how you discern where to go with these funds. 146 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:21,520 I, I think we have, I think Satan loves the traditional 147 00:09:21,600 --> 00:09:25,040 church model, even though it's doing good, even though God 148 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:27,840 blesses it because people's hearts are willing towards him 149 00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:31,960 because it hinders it. And, and maybe this is a good 150 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:35,280 point where we can kind of switch gears to kind of the pros 151 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:40,760 and cons of, of these different deconstruction reconstructing 152 00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:43,920 things. So let me just jump through this 153 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:47,560 list quick and we'll unpack some of these. 154 00:09:47,560 --> 00:09:51,320 And then I have a few quotes too from Frank's book Reimagining 155 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:54,240 Church. So these are some things I I 156 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:58,960 jotted down before we recorded last time with Rick Ecclesia 157 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:02,840 versus church, right, or you could say it organic church 158 00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:06,400 versus institutional. So as we're just talking about, 159 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:10,800 right, we have the building, we have the cost, we have the 160 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:13,560 function of a stage versus spectators. 161 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:20,160 So we're creating passivity. We have a over arching, a over 162 00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:25,560 reliance on this elder board, this pastor or team of pastors 163 00:10:25,560 --> 00:10:31,400 to teach us the right stuff. So what what ends up being, oh, 164 00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:35,320 we want to protect against bad doctrine actually entrenches it. 165 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:39,440 We have a professional clergy which you do not see in 166 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:41,520 scripture. That's something that came about 167 00:10:41,520 --> 00:10:45,600 man made where they are the ones with the answers. 168 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:51,160 They are the ones we pay. And just to unlock those funds, 169 00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:53,520 if we didn't have to pay for the building, if we didn't have to 170 00:10:53,520 --> 00:10:57,640 pay for the pastor, I mean the church here in my hometown. 171 00:10:58,400 --> 00:11:01,880 Yeah, I'm still confused on that one though, because like I gave 172 00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:05,360 the example of a missionary, what if an individual has the 173 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:09,880 giftings of a of a shepherd and wants to do that full time? 174 00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:13,880 So like actually being sent out or his day-to-day? 175 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:16,160 Let's say the the the mission field. 176 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:18,440 Let's let's go back to the missionary. 177 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:22,960 So instead of me going to Iraq to minister. 178 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:25,880 I do it in my big. City supported by Yes. 179 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:28,080 OK. Then, then, then, then gather 180 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:31,200 around as a body and and pray on that and do it. 181 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:34,960 But do it because you're going to give that guy 60 grand a year 182 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:39,640 and not 60 grand a year plus and an administrator and a youth 183 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:43,000 pastor and $1,000,000 mortgage, right The. 184 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:46,960 Apostle Paul, he even says not all of you should be doing like 185 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:49,840 getting married, right? So he's talking about because 186 00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:53,040 when you get married, your first ministry is your wife and your 187 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:55,080 household before you can minister outside of that. 188 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:58,160 So like these are also things we need to consider with that 189 00:11:58,160 --> 00:12:00,120 question because that's an excellent question. 190 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:02,960 And Luke, Luke, you're on point with some of the stuff because 191 00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:06,280 I, you're, you're literally going through it in your mind 192 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:08,720 like and then well. Well, Pete, like if if you're 193 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:11,720 you're home church or you're Rod, you're you're home church. 194 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:18,080 They identified a gifting in you guys where you don't have to go 195 00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:20,960 to the 9:00 to 5:00 anymore to make ends meet. 196 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:26,720 The body is going to support you, you know, financially so 197 00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:29,360 you can still put food on the table and have a family. 198 00:12:29,640 --> 00:12:34,560 But you now you're taking your effort that you were doing at 199 00:12:34,560 --> 00:12:36,880 the 9:00 to 5:00. Now you're devoting yourself to 200 00:12:36,880 --> 00:12:40,000 prayer and to praise and to growing in the Lord. 201 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,560 You're you're growing those giftings that you have that 202 00:12:42,560 --> 00:12:46,600 other people have identified in you because they see, you know 203 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:50,520 what, if this guy could go full time, it's going to benefit the 204 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,880 whole group because they are going to sharpen their skills. 205 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:56,480 No, this is fantastic. I've never thought of this this 206 00:12:56,480 --> 00:12:57,760 way. Luke, this is awesome. 207 00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:00,080 Think about this. Isn't that what what we're 208 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:03,400 trying to do right now in the traditional church is an 209 00:13:03,400 --> 00:13:06,480 individual has not necessarily and. 210 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,240 We're not necessarily. Let me let me let me paint the 211 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:13,200 picture here. So at the, the the local non 212 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:16,200 denominational evangelical church that I was on the worship 213 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:19,560 team for 15 years, that's down the street from me that we left 214 00:13:19,560 --> 00:13:22,360 four years ago. OK, their budget, I don't know 215 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:27,400 what it is today, let's say a half, $1,000,000 a year, OK, I 216 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:31,200 guarantee you. Well, let me rephrase that. 217 00:13:31,560 --> 00:13:35,720 They paid off the mortgage a few years ago, OK, They still have 218 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:38,000 overhead, they still have staff, all that stuff. 219 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:44,680 The budget for a couple decades was dominated by that building, 220 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:50,040 its needs, and the growing staff for a growing church. 221 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:55,600 What if you took a half $1,000,000 and identified 8 or 222 00:13:55,600 --> 00:14:01,480 10 people that got 50 to $70,000 a year to do those full time 223 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:04,840 things and you didn't have to pay for that building. 224 00:14:05,160 --> 00:14:09,560 Now, instead of a pastor, a youth pastor and an 225 00:14:09,560 --> 00:14:13,200 administrator and all the overhead of a building, you just 226 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:18,360 equipped eight people or 10 people to full time. 227 00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:19,960 And now think of it this way, too. 228 00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:24,200 Do you really get that much value from your pastor sermon? 229 00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:26,720 I mean, really? Yeah. 230 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:29,120 If you don't, read on your. Own if you don't read on your 231 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:32,320 own, then you then I I hate it. I'm sorry if anyone says this. 232 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:35,440 I hate it when people say I I'm not getting fed there. 233 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:38,760 That's not why you're there. You're supposed to give. 234 00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:44,440 OK, fed, yes, but give. But no, I I think Luke, you're 235 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:47,080 on to something. Honestly if someone is really 236 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:49,000 gifted. Our listeners that have followed 237 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:51,880 us for a while and heard Tim Bentz talk about money and 238 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:55,200 stuff. So look at it like the way he 239 00:14:55,200 --> 00:15:00,280 described, especially that church that that as a body 240 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:04,480 looked at everybody's financial needs, right? 241 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:07,920 And you had that one individual that he testified that got 242 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:10,240 themselves. She was the biggest giver in the 243 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:12,120 in the church, in the organization. 244 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:14,440 But. But she got herself, she had a 245 00:15:14,440 --> 00:15:18,120 need and she went to the traditional route and got 246 00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:21,240 shafted, you know, by high interest and stuff. 247 00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:24,560 But what if the body you're you're describing your church 248 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:27,560 paid off building. Now they're going to look 249 00:15:27,560 --> 00:15:33,320 internal, They look at all the needs amongst the body, but also 250 00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:36,440 there's needs in the community. So now you have this extra 251 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:39,920 revenue because people are still working and and stuff like that 252 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:42,840 now. Now you could turn that on its 253 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:47,200 head and pay off everybody's debts in the whole place. 254 00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:51,520 Let me tell you something, Luke. That's why we left when they 255 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:53,400 announced they paid off the mortgage. 256 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:58,400 This was 2019-2020. I think my question at the 257 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:03,480 business meeting was, hey, you've got 15102 grand a month 258 00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:06,360 now freed up in cash flow, whatever their payment was. 259 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:09,360 What are you going to do for evangelism? 260 00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:10,920 What are you going to do for the community? 261 00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:15,320 Oh, well, we've, we've hired a A-Team and they're going to come 262 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:18,400 look at our campus and they're going to help us project what 263 00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:21,160 what we're going to need here in the next 5 to 10 years. 264 00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:25,200 I said, what about outreach? Well, you know, 2 Sundays a 265 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:29,160 year, they pretty much come to us, Christmas and Easter. 266 00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:34,560 That was the answer I got from the lead pastor and one of the 267 00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:38,240 elders. I said I'm out, I can't support 268 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:42,200 that. So you're absolutely right, 269 00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:45,120 Luke, if we did those kind of things when we paid off a 270 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:47,480 mortgage at a building, maybe it would happen if. 271 00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:53,720 You look at the books of Acts, there was nobody that had needs, 272 00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:57,800 those that had much and those that had little. 273 00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:02,960 I mean, in modern terms, it would be like a a culture, you 274 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:05,240 know, was a compound, you know. A commune. 275 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:09,040 A commune. But but in a in a healthy 276 00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:15,040 biblical way, everybody sharpened everybody and you 277 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:17,160 know. And. 278 00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:20,920 I I love the scriptural basis where a debt's got erased every 279 00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:23,839 5050 years. You know, that's kind of a. 280 00:17:23,839 --> 00:17:28,160 Whole. Yeah, but the early church did 281 00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:30,960 exactly what Tim Bents was kind of describing. 282 00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:36,040 You know, they internalized what they had, the benefits they 283 00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:41,560 could help to their neighbors and every big everyone was a 284 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:44,400 beneficiary of it. That's. 285 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:47,880 Literally what I was jumping at the seams to say what you just 286 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:52,400 said, Luke, because it says in Acts they all came together and 287 00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:55,000 met each other's needs with the likeness of mind. 288 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:58,480 And so it's like instead of the institution having all this 289 00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:01,360 money, you have the giver. They go into debt. 290 00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:04,480 You know, somebody with the best heart ever goes into debt. 291 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:09,360 Because I mean, what about even having a system where the the 292 00:18:09,360 --> 00:18:12,920 church feeds back into you when you're in hardship and look, 293 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:16,840 looks at your track record like okay, you're not in hardship 3 * 294 00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:19,480 a year because you just make poor decisions on everything you 295 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:21,760 do in life. You might need more help than 296 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,360 just a handout. But seriously, something 297 00:18:24,360 --> 00:18:27,600 traumatic happens like you've been doing, like, you know, in 298 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:32,200 my case, I was doing good for 10 years on top of the world Dream 299 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:34,600 girl, dream car building, my family. 300 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:37,680 I literally get my employment pulled out from underneath of me 301 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:43,120 and I have to reinvent myself and walk on this this Cliff 302 00:18:43,120 --> 00:18:44,600 where it looks like I'm going to fall off. 303 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:46,560 And God is faithful. I'm telling you right now, He 304 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:48,880 came through. He continues to come through, 305 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:51,880 not because of anything Ioffer, but this is just the testimony 306 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:56,400 building right, But what if the the body, the ecclesia at large 307 00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:58,360 was going? You know what, Pete, you've been 308 00:18:58,360 --> 00:19:00,680 doing the right thing and good for so long, man. 309 00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:04,600 What's an elimination to free up some more of your time? 310 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:08,920 Why can't you fly over to Philly and hang out with Rod into a 311 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:12,120 live podcast in person? Why can't you guys go, right, 312 00:19:12,120 --> 00:19:15,120 because I'm doing this local stuff, going to Ohio, going all 313 00:19:15,120 --> 00:19:17,760 around and we're, we're seeing people are getting baptized. 314 00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,840 People are literally crying and coming out and like, why can't 315 00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:23,760 we do that together, right? And it's like, oh, because I 316 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:27,440 have my 9:00 to 5:00 and I have a mortgage and I have so I think 317 00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:30,840 allotting the money to the right place and saying, man, you, 318 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,720 you've been in the gutter. Like I've been in the gutter 319 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:35,880 doing this. People have no idea, right? 320 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:39,600 The last four years, especially the last year, Oh, Lord have 321 00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:42,280 mercy. If I would have known, I might 322 00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:43,960 have gave up. I might have really gave some 323 00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:46,360 stuff up on what this calling is. 324 00:19:46,360 --> 00:19:48,840 But yeah, I know you want to get back to your list, Pete. 325 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:52,400 But what I'm saying is if we all came together and and the 326 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:57,320 meeting was not about a new sidewalk on the building, but it 327 00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:00,600 was about how to free up time for somebody who's been battle 328 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:04,160 tested and is trustworthy. And he has fifty men who look, 329 00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:06,760 who can look you in the eye and say this is a man of God. 330 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:09,600 I've been I've been locking arms with his brother for 18 months. 331 00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:12,560 He's fearless. Let's unleash him in California. 332 00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:16,040 Let's send him over there that. Is a game changer. 333 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:18,680 That and and that's exactly what the early church did. 334 00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:24,840 The apostles identified and they called them elders like these 335 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:30,880 individuals are going to help us so we can focus our time on 336 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:36,040 prayer in the word. But it was the bleeding of the 337 00:20:36,040 --> 00:20:41,360 Lord that led to that decision. And it was the fruit in these 338 00:20:41,360 --> 00:20:46,440 individuals lives that got them promoted to the elder. 339 00:20:47,360 --> 00:20:50,400 I mean, it, it's kind of a mix of what we do traditionally, but 340 00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:52,480 yet it was, I mean, it was a new thing. 341 00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:55,960 It was the early church. It had never been done before. 342 00:20:56,560 --> 00:21:00,240 So I know that's kind of where we're trying to take this is 343 00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:04,240 where have we gone wrong? And how can we fix it and get it 344 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:09,560 back to its its true. It's we need Elon Musk on the 345 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:15,680 church Doge to bring efficiency and cut out the the excess fat. 346 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:20,120 Yes, course corrections. Essentially what we have guys is 347 00:21:20,120 --> 00:21:24,520 we have old wineskins, right? And and like your example, Luke, 348 00:21:24,520 --> 00:21:27,400 with the cell church thing and the things that went wrong, 349 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:30,960 they're trying to put new wine in an old wineskin. 350 00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:33,080 You can't do that. It doesn't work. 351 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:36,080 You have to tear the whole thing down and start from scratch. 352 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:39,920 So let me jump through these things. 353 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:43,040 So we mentioned the building, we mentioned the clergy lady class, 354 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:49,320 non participatory spectators, the few leading the many ritual 355 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:52,800 versus relational, right? Do you want to stare at the back 356 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:54,520 of someone's head for an hour and a half? 357 00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:58,240 Or do you want to look eyeball to eyeball and go, how was your 358 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:00,480 week going? How is your prayer time going? 359 00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:05,240 How can I pray for you? Hierarchy, you know, and there 360 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:09,360 may be some debate about this in in Matthew 23, whether he was 361 00:22:09,360 --> 00:22:13,640 talking to his disciples, Jesus was or if this is an instruction 362 00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:15,680 for all. I guess I haven't looked into 363 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:18,000 that. But when he said to him, his 364 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:23,280 disciples do not let anyone call you father or rabbi, for you 365 00:22:23,280 --> 00:22:27,080 have one father and he is in heaven, nor nor are you to be 366 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,400 called instructors. You have one instructor, the 367 00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:35,120 Messiah. We mentioned last time, my last 368 00:22:35,120 --> 00:22:38,560 recording on the spirit leading versus the soul. 369 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:42,760 I think a lot of the things that we do in a modern church service 370 00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:50,640 are soulish and they mask what may be brokenness in our spirit 371 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:54,640 in our week that we just went through and we got songs and 372 00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:57,080 it's like, I can't even talk to anybody. 373 00:22:57,080 --> 00:23:01,840 No one knows the real me and I'm just anonymous here sitting in 374 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:04,640 the back. And a real quick I want to just 375 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:08,960 mention an anecdote as far as that goes because we have a girl 376 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:13,520 who's been meeting with us on our church group for a couple 377 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:18,000 months now who's a non Christian who doesn't have any measure of 378 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:19,600 faith. By her own words. 379 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:26,480 She did it because a significant other had some form of faith, at 380 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:30,720 least enough to say I want this in my future wife. 381 00:23:31,120 --> 00:23:36,200 That was enough motivation for her to come meet with us and she 382 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,480 loves it. She this is someone who grew up 383 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:44,040 in foster homes her whole life shows, so she recognizes the 384 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:48,000 spirit of family when we're together and looks forward to it 385 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:50,360 every week, even though we're talking about all sorts of 386 00:23:50,360 --> 00:23:52,480 Christian stuff that she doesn't buy yet. 387 00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:57,200 And she said when we she first started coming, she's like, 388 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:00,240 yeah, there's churches around, but that's a little too much. 389 00:24:01,360 --> 00:24:04,640 It's intimidating. But she was like, you know what? 390 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,960 I could dip my toe in when my wife put out a post on the 391 00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:11,600 community page advertising kind of what we do. 392 00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:13,960 And we don't do this very often. We've probably only done this 393 00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:17,200 three times in a year and a half that we mentioned of the 394 00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:19,440 community. Hey, this is what we do. 395 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:23,400 Come, come visit if you want. That's how she found us. 396 00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:27,480 She's like, I can do that. I can see myself doing that. 397 00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:31,280 Let me keep going down the list here. 398 00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:34,720 Perfunctory order and elements of the worship service once 399 00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:39,240 again kind of having everything just polished and perfect and no 400 00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:43,080 room for the spirits leading limits. 401 00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:46,840 Christ and the spirit instead of the full expression of his body. 402 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:52,760 So we're seeing a lopsided expression of his body where 403 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:56,480 every member is not functioning. The sermon, it's a monologue 404 00:24:56,480 --> 00:25:00,680 versus a dialogue. It's meant to be a dialogue. 405 00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,720 And I think Luke, we mentioned on the last recording where 406 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:08,240 there's a section that Paul says if someone is giving a word and 407 00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:12,160 someone else has a revelation, the first person is supposed to 408 00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:14,520 sit down and let the second person speak. 409 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:19,640 And, and I think it's awesome that you said last time that 410 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:22,280 you've experienced that even in traditional churches. 411 00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:25,360 But by and large, that's not, that's not normal. 412 00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:28,040 You're going to get scolded by the pastor if you try that one. 413 00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:32,720 This is a big one. This next one, entrenchment of 414 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,920 bad doctrine and tradition. You know, some people think if 415 00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:40,760 you have a denomination or you have a covering, this whole idea 416 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:45,840 of spiritual covering is not biblical and and it entrenches 417 00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:49,600 bad teaching. And we rely on these people that 418 00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:54,840 have gone to seminary and learn these, you know, pre agreed on 419 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:59,000 summations of Scripture. They've learned systems instead 420 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:00,800 of learning how to read the Bible. 421 00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:06,320 And now we have outsourced our sense making to someone else, to 422 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:11,600 use Kevin Thompson's term, to do the work for us and go, oh, 423 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:14,960 that's what that verse means. Instead of doing the work for 424 00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:17,600 ourselves and going. I don't see it that way, pastor. 425 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:18,960 This is what I'm getting out of it. 426 00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:25,240 Another thing, slow moving, institutionalized, difficult to 427 00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:28,320 changed, difficult to change and centralized. 428 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,320 You know, I think it was a Chuck missler we mentioned last time 429 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:38,520 that was quoting somebody says, I think the attack on the on the 430 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,680 people of God is going to come from the institutional church in 431 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:46,640 the future, that there's persecution coming and we need 432 00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:52,640 to be nimble and decentralized consolidated power, which 433 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:56,440 corrupts, right? How much do we know about that 434 00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:02,280 creation of the secular versus sacred, you know, having that 435 00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:04,960 religious divide? I think at least in our group 436 00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:11,080 Rod, when we meet a chunk of the time is talking about, you know, 437 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:15,640 someone's car breaking down or you know, what went on at work 438 00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:17,880 with Co workers. Like we're doing life like 439 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:22,840 that's it's it's funny because it's not spiritual at all for, 440 00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:26,680 you know, a good portion, but that's a part of us. 441 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:30,520 We are body, soul and spirit. We're trying to minister to all 442 00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:36,080 three, right. The damage to the one man LED 443 00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:39,520 church too much to take on there man. 444 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:44,600 You want to look into pastors getting burnt out trying to care 445 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:49,840 for these flocks is never meant it for one man to take on all of 446 00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:53,800 this burden. Here's another big one. 447 00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:57,960 Christ is supplanted as the head and his body impotent to 448 00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:02,840 function as it was intended. We put a human head, just like 449 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:05,520 Luke you mentioned back in the Old Testament. 450 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,120 Hebrews were freaked out by God. Nope. 451 00:28:08,120 --> 00:28:11,440 Give us a a human head. You're scary. 452 00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:16,520 It discourages real relationships and covers up our 453 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:21,360 real selves, warts and all. And it's a financial burden and 454 00:28:21,360 --> 00:28:24,120 wasteful spending that we've already kind of touched on. 455 00:28:24,120 --> 00:28:31,160 So those are just some of the bullet points for what what we 456 00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:37,280 need to deconstruct and why. And if I could read just one of 457 00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:39,840 these quotes and then you guys jump in with comments. 458 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:44,320 I have a few sections here from Frank Viola's Reimagining 459 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:48,280 Church. He says institutional churches 460 00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:51,320 are a lot like trains. They're going in a certain 461 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:54,600 direction and they'll continue to go in that direction for a 462 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:58,160 good long time, even if all hands try to make them stop. 463 00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,360 As with trains, the options for turning the direction of 464 00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,720 institutional churches are limited at best. 465 00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:09,880 If a switch or siding is available, the train could turn. 466 00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:13,040 Otherwise it's just following the tracks. 467 00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:16,680 So everyone on board had best hope that he is on the right 468 00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,040 train, headed in the right direction. 469 00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:22,600 Organic churches, like those in the New Testament, are 470 00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:25,120 different. They're not like trains, but 471 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:27,720 more like groups of people out for a walk. 472 00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:32,360 These groups move much more slowly than trains, only a few 473 00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:36,040 mph, but they can turn at a moment's notice. 474 00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:40,560 And more importantly, they can be genuinely attentive to the 475 00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:44,440 world around them. Does that seem like an apartment 476 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:48,800 analogy? You know, you think about 477 00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:51,360 institutions, Luke. We talked about it with Rick 478 00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:54,360 last time. You know, the Heart Association, 479 00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:59,000 Cancer Society, These things are institutions that are slow to 480 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,520 change. You know, if if they, how many 481 00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:05,640 years were they telling us, you know, fats are bad. 482 00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:07,640 Now they're coming around saying, oh, well, actually 483 00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:10,600 natural fats are good. It's like they're slow to 484 00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:13,400 change. They're institutions versus a 485 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:16,600 group of people out for a walk. We can pay attention and go, oh, 486 00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:19,360 I see a need over there. Let's help that need. 487 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:23,040 That's that's why I kind of was jokingly talking about Elon Musk 488 00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:29,680 and Doge because I mean, he when he bought Twitter, he fired 80% 489 00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:33,520 of the staff and it's running better and more efficient 490 00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,160 because all that extra stuff wasn't needed. 491 00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:41,520 And you know, Trump's looking to use him with the federal 492 00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:45,040 government. But if but if you're but if 493 00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:50,880 you're looking at it from the church standpoint, you obviously 494 00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:58,880 can't fix corporately, right? But if but if from the 495 00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:03,440 grassroots in an organization that 150 whatever size church 496 00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:08,600 you know, starts to have this epiphany, we want to do 497 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:10,600 something different. We want to do something like the 498 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:14,480 book Acts. Let's change the paradigm. 499 00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:17,520 How can we more be a more efficient with our, our, our 500 00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:21,440 money and, and the offering that that comes in and, and the 501 00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,400 outreach and all that type of stuff. 502 00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:26,520 You are one individual feeling that at your local church. 503 00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:31,640 But what if you would have had allies that were right next to 504 00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:35,360 you in the pews that actually would have got the pastor to 505 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:38,240 listen? You know, then you're then 506 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:39,840 you're actually getting somewhere. 507 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:44,880 I mean quicker you're still getting somewhere, but I get 508 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:46,520 your. Point but that but that's what 509 00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:50,720 we're discussing. I mean in year 2 experience you 510 00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:54,760 up and left the traditional church and are starting a new 511 00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:58,560 thing. That might not be the case for 512 00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:02,400 everybody. No, I don't think it's the case 513 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:05,080 for everybody or nor would I prescribe it. 514 00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:09,920 But yeah, if someone is coming across this this information, 515 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:13,040 they read Pay in Christianity and then his reconstructing 516 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:17,360 books on organic church and they go, yeah, I can see this. 517 00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:20,120 These are things that are man made that we have added. 518 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:25,560 You know, having this clergy, this pastor that I pay is 519 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:28,200 actually damaging to me. Having this building in this 520 00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:33,760 mortgage is, is damaging me. I mean, there's no substitute 521 00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:37,840 that's we've, I can't speak to it to the level that Rod has, 522 00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:44,200 but even just some of the things that we've experienced, I can't 523 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:47,720 say has ever happened in a small group or in a church service. 524 00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:51,320 You know, some of the things that we're able to really get to 525 00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:56,320 the heart of ministering to people and, and insight and 526 00:32:56,840 --> 00:33:00,240 it's, it's so amazing. We'll, we'll have a theme almost 527 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:03,000 every Saturday that will come out. 528 00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,200 No one planned it. No one planned. 529 00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:07,080 This is the topic. This is the sermon. 530 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:11,400 And yet one by one, we're all talking about the same thing, 531 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,640 that, that, that is the focus, you know, whether it's a 532 00:33:15,640 --> 00:33:18,760 relationship in the family or whatever. 533 00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:22,680 And it's, it's just amazing how that comes out organically. 534 00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:27,960 So I think, you know, the last thing that I really want to just 535 00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:34,360 get out to both of our audiences is I want you guys to think how 536 00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:39,760 many pastors on record stood up in front of their congregations 537 00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:46,360 and encouraged the shots over the last few years. 538 00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:49,680 And now that information is inverted. 539 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:53,960 It's a it's a no go. Big time bad, bad news, 540 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:59,840 dangerous. Look at the control and the 541 00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:03,480 influence that one person had over each one of those 542 00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:08,280 buildings, and I want each one of you to go show me one example 543 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:11,040 of that in the Bible. Wow. 544 00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:16,199 Yeah, it's a bit like people saying, oh, Jesus was a 545 00:34:16,199 --> 00:34:20,159 socialist. He would want, he would want to 546 00:34:20,159 --> 00:34:23,280 us to give our money to the government so we can distribute. 547 00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:24,840 The government can distribute it. 548 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:29,320 It's like, no, no, he was what can you do individually out of 549 00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,159 the goodness of your heart? Yeah. 550 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:37,520 This is another section from Frank, Frank Faiola's 551 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:44,480 Reimagining Church that kind of paints another analogy to how 552 00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:49,800 God has a design for how he wants his body to function. 553 00:34:52,159 --> 00:34:57,680 And again, we said at the very outset here, the disclaimer that 554 00:34:57,720 --> 00:35:02,240 a lot of good things do happen in the institutional church. 555 00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:06,840 A lot of wonderful people are doing amazing things for God's 556 00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:08,600 Kingdom. We're not saying they're not. 557 00:35:09,720 --> 00:35:14,920 But here's an analogy that kind of paints this picture of maybe 558 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:18,880 how we're missing the mark from how our church gatherings are 559 00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:23,080 supposed to be. So he says, imagine a general 560 00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:26,560 contractor, and I believe he got this from a friend of his, I 561 00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:30,720 think it was Hale Miller. Imagine a general contractor who 562 00:35:30,720 --> 00:35:34,360 purchases 20 acres of land by which to build a housing 563 00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:36,280 complex. And after the houses are built, 564 00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:39,560 he wishes to have a landscaped garden at the entrance. 565 00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,480 This is his goal. So he hires someone to plant 566 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:45,760 beautiful trees. Another one to lay large rocks, 567 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:50,040 another to plant beautiful flowers, another to plant shrubs 568 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:53,880 and bushes. And so the person who plants 569 00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:56,960 trees comes and plants them randomly throughout the complex. 570 00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:59,360 The one who lays rocks does the same. 571 00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:02,240 So does the person who plants the flowers. 572 00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:05,760 The person who plants the shrubs and bushes also does the same. 573 00:36:06,240 --> 00:36:09,040 When the contractor observes what they have done, he's very 574 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:12,040 disappointed. His goal was a landscaped 575 00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:15,440 garden. Instead he sees the flowers, 576 00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:20,200 rocks, trees, shrubs and bushes are all disconnected and 577 00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:25,680 scattered about haphazardly. Is it good to plant trees? 578 00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:28,480 Yes. Is the planting of flowers a 579 00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:29,920 positive thing? Certainly. 580 00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:34,320 But these things in themselves were not the contractors goal. 581 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:39,680 He wanted a landscaped garden and that describes the Kingdom 582 00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:42,920 of God today in the institutional church. 583 00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:46,840 Many good deeds, but an overwhelming disconnection from 584 00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:50,920 God's ultimate goal, which happens to be from Him, through 585 00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:55,200 Him, and to Him. Thoughts on that at all guys? 586 00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:01,800 I don't know me, I was kind of picturing, you know, the 587 00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:04,760 traditional church and the landscaping that you might have 588 00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:08,080 there and stuff. And like you said, you know, how 589 00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:13,520 much do we really get out of one day service, you know, hour or 590 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:17,680 two or whatever. So to me it, it, it seems like 591 00:37:17,680 --> 00:37:23,600 it's, it's more important that relationship wise with your 592 00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:27,200 fellow believer in your community that you're connecting 593 00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:30,920 on a, on a regular basis, more regular basis than once a week. 594 00:37:31,720 --> 00:37:38,240 Because that's where in my mind, there's more value than coming 595 00:37:38,240 --> 00:37:43,640 to 1 central place once a week. Because if you don't have those 596 00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:46,760 type of relationships throughout the week, you, you show up, it's 597 00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:49,320 just small talk. How many people really come 598 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:54,440 early, stay late, really get to the heart of the matter when it 599 00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:56,400 comes to talking to your brother and sister. 600 00:37:56,960 --> 00:38:00,160 It's, it's all chivalry, you know, it's all just fluff. 601 00:38:00,720 --> 00:38:04,480 And then you leave there and you might leave there still wounded 602 00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:08,680 or your needs are not met and the need could have been met by 603 00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,200 your brother and sister sitting next to you. 604 00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:15,720 But if you had that relationship throughout the week, you know, 605 00:38:16,920 --> 00:38:20,840 you can help one another. So I think that I think that's a 606 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:24,960 failure in traditional churches and probably in the 607 00:38:25,120 --> 00:38:30,760 untraditional churches that you guys have experienced, that you 608 00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:34,080 need that relationship to to flourish and to grow. 609 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:39,440 And hopefully it it, it, it happens, you know, more than 610 00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:42,960 once a week. Yeah, that that's the goal. 611 00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:45,040 And we're so broke and busy these days. 612 00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:47,840 It's so hard and. We got and we got limited time. 613 00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:50,880 You know, I get it. I mean, even Pete, our own 614 00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:55,640 family, you know, I live out of state and how often do I talk 615 00:38:55,640 --> 00:39:02,400 and connect with which I, I, I saw this, this TikTok and this 616 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:04,720 individual had epiphanies. Like, yeah, when you get 617 00:39:04,720 --> 00:39:09,280 married, your your spouse is your immediate family, your 618 00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:11,960 parents and your brothers sisters are now your extended 619 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:14,760 family. You know, so you do get consumed 620 00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:17,760 in that bubble of who you're around the most. 621 00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:23,080 It, it, it, I don't know. That's just what I was picturing 622 00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:25,200 when you were describing that. Sure. 623 00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:29,440 Well, let me mention this too. So we have probably half of the 624 00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:35,480 group that meets with us go to a traditional Sunday church and 625 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:40,320 they actually meet with us because of the connections that 626 00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:44,440 we have, the things that we are free to talk about that they 627 00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:49,520 can't and don't have on Sunday. And you choose to meet on a day 628 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,400 that doesn't interfere or actually benefit. 629 00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:53,840 Yeah. So I mean, you guys could have 630 00:39:53,840 --> 00:39:58,200 met on a Wednesday potentially. And and that's, I think that's 631 00:39:58,200 --> 00:40:01,200 awesome. It brings an added benefit to 632 00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:03,960 the the body of Christ in your community. 633 00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:07,320 I think what what you're mentioning there, Luke, you're 634 00:40:07,320 --> 00:40:11,120 touching on is, is the unity. You know, Jesus prayed. 635 00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:14,640 I wish that that they would have the same unity that I have with 636 00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:18,640 you as the Father. And then the Trinity has right 637 00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:21,520 one of equality, but varying roles. 638 00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:25,640 And I think that's that's kind of what we're all talking about 639 00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:31,400 is, is a lot of these things, they're good, but the good can 640 00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:37,880 be the enemy of the best. And you know, we want Jesus to 641 00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:41,000 be the central figure, figure and functionally head of his 642 00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:47,160 body, But we can quench it when when things are are man made 643 00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:52,120 structured there. There was a quote I heard, I 644 00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:54,600 think in in Frank's book. I don't can't remember someone 645 00:40:54,600 --> 00:41:01,560 famous said this God made man is in in his image and man returned 646 00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:06,520 the favor we we made him in our image. 647 00:41:06,520 --> 00:41:10,960 You know we make the church like a business or all these 648 00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:16,920 different models yeah you know there there's just so much 649 00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:22,200 damage to to denominations. Think about that guys, where we 650 00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:28,840 craft a statement of faith like Rod you were mentioning, and 651 00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:33,280 this is what we adhere to. And if you join, then sometimes 652 00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:36,280 strictly, sometimes not strictly, you're expected to 653 00:41:36,520 --> 00:41:43,600 believe these things, affirm these things and we divide, you 654 00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:45,320 know, even the word denomination. 655 00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:46,960 Think about like a fraction, right? 656 00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:50,600 In math class, you have a numerator denominator. 657 00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:57,840 The denominator is what divides. So this denomination says, oh, I 658 00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:01,880 think baptism saves you literally salvifically. 659 00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:08,120 Oh, I think that the body and blood literally becomes Christ 660 00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:12,400 when the priest says something. All these denominations has has 661 00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:15,120 divided us. And I can say maybe this is a 662 00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:18,880 good question for you, Rod. I can say in our group we have 663 00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:25,280 very different differing opinions on some big, some big 664 00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:30,760 theological issues. We try not to talk about those 665 00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:32,800 because they're not the central thing. 666 00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:38,160 We don't want, you know, when it when before we kind of launched 667 00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,320 this experiment to do this church out of our home. 668 00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:45,120 And I don't even consider myself a church planter, but maybe 669 00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:47,120 that's what happened when we did this. 670 00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:49,880 I was reading a lot of Frank's stuff because I was trying to 671 00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:53,520 figure out what are the pitfalls, what do I need to 672 00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:55,760 watch out for? And he had a lot of good 673 00:42:55,760 --> 00:43:00,440 information on that. He said, don't let it become, 674 00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:07,080 you know, church mini, you know, where you you just try to find a 675 00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:08,400 pastor. And now he's going to give a 676 00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:12,920 sermon right in the living room. Don't make it about like a pet 677 00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:16,400 doctrine, like, oh, everyone's got to be into the end times. 678 00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:18,080 And that's what we're all going to talk about. 679 00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:25,320 So we keep the main things, the main things, and we don't want 680 00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:29,720 to get into that statement of faith, 'cause it divides. 681 00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:33,280 Yeah, I mean, I set except on the essentials, but even on 682 00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:36,560 that, it's like we have an unbeliever in our midst. 683 00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:40,880 But maybe Rod, you can speak to kind of how do you guys? 684 00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:44,040 No, you, you're asked. I want to hear your question, 685 00:43:44,280 --> 00:43:49,600 but it popped into my head. Some of these groups in in Asia 686 00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:54,800 that were we're doing house church and they would they would 687 00:43:54,800 --> 00:43:58,880 have an ashtray in the center of their their meeting because you 688 00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:01,280 had all kinds of different people that would show up. 689 00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:06,640 And it wasn't about excluding anybody. 690 00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:10,640 It was except about accepting everyone, but focusing and 691 00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:14,600 leading everybody to the truth of who Christ is. 692 00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:18,400 And even if it's not establishing, this is our 693 00:44:18,400 --> 00:44:22,360 mission statement and everybody must adhere to this at some 694 00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:25,800 point. You know, it's got to be 695 00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:27,880 welcoming enough. And it seems like, Pete, you've 696 00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:32,800 done that in your home with the community posts and stuff that 697 00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:36,160 people that were on the fringe are afraid of traditional church 698 00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:39,880 is willing to, you know, go through your doors, which is 699 00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:45,040 which is awesome. And in fact, in fact, even the 700 00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:48,280 first people, when I very first put it out there a year and a 701 00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:52,440 half ago in kind of, I kind of put it out in a provocative way, 702 00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:56,640 like is the way we do traditional church not the best? 703 00:44:56,640 --> 00:45:01,120 And I, I forget how I put it. And, and the, the couple ladies, 704 00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:04,240 one of them still still comes. The other one decided that her 705 00:45:04,240 --> 00:45:06,840 family wanted to go to a traditional church. 706 00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:09,880 So she's doing that now, but they weren't going at all, which 707 00:45:09,880 --> 00:45:11,960 is why she started joining. But the other one's still 708 00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:18,080 coming. Both of them felt ostracized and 709 00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:20,040 alienated from the traditional church. 710 00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:26,280 They hadn't gone in years and but they but they enjoy the 711 00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:30,440 fellowship that we have. A third person used to go to the 712 00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:34,880 the church in town that I used, used to go to, used to be on the 713 00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:36,680 worship team with me in the band. 714 00:45:37,600 --> 00:45:44,200 And and she too kind of felt cast aside, didn't fit in, you 715 00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:47,400 know, no one to really talk to, no one to really understand her 716 00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:51,520 situation in life. So, yeah, there's a lot of 717 00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:56,560 people that are slipping through the cracks that we're not 718 00:45:56,560 --> 00:46:01,920 ministering to because we've got a service, we have a program 719 00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:06,440 that needs to run Florida State. But yeah, I was if you want to 720 00:46:06,440 --> 00:46:08,320 comment on that, Rod. Now I was just going to ask 721 00:46:08,320 --> 00:46:12,680 about kind of how how churches for you with different beliefs 722 00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:21,680 or or how you deal with it, but. Well, so I don't want to, I 723 00:46:21,680 --> 00:46:23,640 don't want to really do this, but I'm going to. 724 00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:25,920 I'm going to answer with a question. 725 00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:30,960 OK. Now I'll save that for the the 726 00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:33,080 last part. Actually, this is a this is a 727 00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:38,760 point that I can put in front of that Peter talks about first. 728 00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:45,120 Peter 2, four and five is talking about these living 729 00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:49,640 stones that that builds the spiritual house, the church. 730 00:46:50,240 --> 00:46:55,640 And he says as you come to him, a living stone rejected by men, 731 00:46:55,960 --> 00:46:59,880 but in the sight of God chosen and precious, you yourselves, 732 00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:04,720 like living stones are being built up as a spiritual house to 733 00:47:04,720 --> 00:47:09,360 be, to be a holy priesthood, to offer spiritual sacrifices 734 00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:11,560 acceptable to God through Christ Jesus. 735 00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:15,080 So each believer is a living stone. 736 00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:18,240 We're contributing to the construction of a spiritual 737 00:47:18,240 --> 00:47:21,560 house, a body that God dwells in. 738 00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:26,960 He moves in and threw us. If the same spirit reside in you 739 00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:28,240 that raised Christ from the dead. 740 00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:31,840 So the diversity is fine. I have no issues with that. 741 00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:36,480 You know, my question really just to put in the audience's 742 00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:38,360 ear. I'm going to build this for all 743 00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:41,760 of us. If you are attending a building, 744 00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:47,080 OK, Luke, maybe you are right on on the regular, Would you feel 745 00:47:47,080 --> 00:47:54,200 comfortable taking once a week the list of people you've 746 00:47:54,200 --> 00:47:56,160 interviewed on this podcast over the years? 747 00:47:57,000 --> 00:48:01,400 Say every week you're taking a guest with you and you have to 748 00:48:01,400 --> 00:48:03,400 go through the list of people that you've interviewed. 749 00:48:03,640 --> 00:48:05,920 You got to take Ryan Peterson. You got to take Gary Wayne. 750 00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:07,840 You got to take me at some point in time. 751 00:48:07,840 --> 00:48:09,520 Don't let me get the microphone if I show up. 752 00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:12,640 Just kidding. Would you feel comfortable doing 753 00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:15,200 that at your location? Right. 754 00:48:15,200 --> 00:48:19,680 And and now to Pete, it's in, it's in your court too. 755 00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:22,200 And the listeners, it's in your court too. 756 00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:27,280 I'm only asking you guys this so that you'll evaluate. 757 00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:33,680 Do I have to live in a dual manner to be true to my calling? 758 00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:39,200 Is there a limitation on the building where my creativity, 759 00:48:39,200 --> 00:48:42,560 what God has put down inside of me, the the function of my 760 00:48:42,560 --> 00:48:49,360 living stone, is it being hindered or restricted by any 761 00:48:49,360 --> 00:48:50,760 means? The Bible has a lot to say about 762 00:48:50,760 --> 00:48:52,400 that. I'm going to spare us the time 763 00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:55,960 to go through all those verses, but I've done that. 764 00:48:57,280 --> 00:49:02,480 I'm not 200 episodes into most of you guys on Air Lord, the 765 00:49:02,480 --> 00:49:04,520 first podcast. I think we did like 50. 766 00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:08,440 I can't even tell you how many conversations I've had. 767 00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:12,200 I can't even tell you how many times I've went to church with a 768 00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:16,400 simple question to a building and and was ran out myself. 769 00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:18,760 I don't know if I could take Gary with me. 770 00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:21,080 So do you know? If I could take LA with me. 771 00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:24,400 Let me let me clarify just so I understand your question. 772 00:49:24,480 --> 00:49:28,640 Are you saying take them with you and have them experience 773 00:49:28,640 --> 00:49:32,120 what goes on? Or are you more saying take them 774 00:49:32,120 --> 00:49:37,840 with you and introduce and let them be a speaker and let them 775 00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:40,680 talk on the things they talk on? Would the church, would the 776 00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:46,800 church welcome him, her or her? However you see it OK, however 777 00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:49,800 that affects the listener who's listening to this and you 2 as 778 00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:54,320 individuals. I know if I took, let's say, 779 00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:58,960 Gary Wayne with me and we're sitting there in service and 780 00:49:58,960 --> 00:50:03,600 you're doing a meet and greet, let's just say if he's being 781 00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:08,520 genuine to who he is, as is an encyclopedia for the weird, let 782 00:50:08,520 --> 00:50:13,320 some questions fly, you know, and then I believe Gary would be 783 00:50:13,320 --> 00:50:15,600 true to himself. I don't think he would put on a 784 00:50:15,600 --> 00:50:18,880 different face because he's in a building, although I mean, you 785 00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:21,120 never really know. But for the benefit of the 786 00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:25,080 doubt, I would imagine, 'cause if you get me in church or out 787 00:50:25,080 --> 00:50:27,840 in the Walmart parking lot or on a podcast, you're getting the 788 00:50:27,840 --> 00:50:31,600 same person regardless. Like I, I don't have a different 789 00:50:31,600 --> 00:50:35,200 face to put on when I go to the, the corporate building versus at 790 00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:37,560 home. And, and it took development for 791 00:50:37,560 --> 00:50:41,320 that because I felt small, insignificant. 792 00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:44,240 It's not important. I'd ask or make statements and 793 00:50:44,240 --> 00:50:46,160 it would literally be cast to the wayside. 794 00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:48,280 But I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. 795 00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:51,680 God told me this was important. And instead of me getting angry 796 00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:53,880 with you, I'm going to move on. And I played that game for so 797 00:50:53,880 --> 00:50:54,960 long. I was just over it. 798 00:50:55,040 --> 00:50:56,680 I was just like, done with it, right? 799 00:50:57,880 --> 00:51:00,840 But the question really holds true. 800 00:51:01,640 --> 00:51:06,600 Taking guests or close friends of yours in this fringe space 801 00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:11,840 into the church environment, to the building and keeping them in 802 00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:15,800 their genuine natural state. How? 803 00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:20,160 How many times could you take a guess there before you may be 804 00:51:20,160 --> 00:51:23,920 asked not to not to protect? No, I think you bring up an 805 00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:27,880 interesting concept as I'm thinking about your question 806 00:51:28,240 --> 00:51:35,320 that how much, how much of going back to the train analogy, 807 00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:38,800 right, The institutional churches on these tracks, you, 808 00:51:39,160 --> 00:51:43,880 Frank says you better hope that that church is going the right 809 00:51:43,880 --> 00:51:46,000 direction, the right destination. 810 00:51:48,520 --> 00:51:53,480 How much of the body of Christ is actually being prepared for 811 00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:59,840 what's coming in the earth? Who has a worldview that is 812 00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:02,920 compatible with reality, even if it's weird? 813 00:52:02,920 --> 00:52:05,440 Because guess what? Truth is stranger than fiction, 814 00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:09,640 right? You had supernatural questions, 815 00:52:09,640 --> 00:52:13,200 Rod, that were Pooh poohed at best. 816 00:52:15,240 --> 00:52:18,440 People don't have a place to deal with these deep dark 817 00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:22,280 things. So how much are we failing by 818 00:52:22,280 --> 00:52:27,560 having this single person LED institution for preparing the 819 00:52:27,560 --> 00:52:32,280 body of Christ? How much are we not teaching 820 00:52:32,280 --> 00:52:35,920 people how to fish by actually looking at their Bible 821 00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:39,800 inductively and observing the text, not bringing their own 822 00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:44,120 biases to the text? How much are we trying to tell 823 00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:45,960 them? Oh, here's a system of thought 824 00:52:45,960 --> 00:52:49,360 you can apply to the Bible instead of just reading for what 825 00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:54,360 it says. You know, we, we boiled 826 00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:57,960 everything down. So I think to your question, how 827 00:52:57,960 --> 00:53:03,440 much damage has been done by we hope the guy up front has the 828 00:53:03,440 --> 00:53:05,480 most important word for this week. 829 00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:08,600 And sometimes he does. I mean, there's some there's 830 00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:11,520 some superstars. I mean, Luke, you got John 831 00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:13,000 Kilpatrick. He's awesome. 832 00:53:13,480 --> 00:53:15,560 OK. I'm sure the people that go to 833 00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:19,000 Jonathan Cahn's church are, are pretty well blessed with his 834 00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:21,480 messages. There's great people out there. 835 00:53:21,480 --> 00:53:25,320 We're not saying they're not, but you better hope they're 836 00:53:25,320 --> 00:53:28,040 filling in all the blanks. And that's why I think it's such 837 00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:32,920 an exciting thing to be in this day and age with podcasting Rod, 838 00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:39,000 that we can bring on the Gary Wayne's, the LALA Marzulli's and 839 00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:42,240 the Tim Benz's and go, OK, tell me about your walk with the 840 00:53:42,240 --> 00:53:44,320 Lord. OK, tell me about UFOs. 841 00:53:44,600 --> 00:53:46,760 Well, I think. From one episode, I think we've 842 00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:50,200 we've covered the fact that you can't get all that you need in 843 00:53:50,440 --> 00:53:54,840 one Sunday service. You know, even my pastor, John 844 00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:58,760 Kilpatrick, for the first time in his ministry, how many 845 00:53:58,760 --> 00:54:02,520 decades he's been a pastor, has taught the whole Book of 846 00:54:02,520 --> 00:54:04,360 Revelation. And he did it on a Sunday 847 00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:07,920 morning, which he knew was going to be controversial because he's 848 00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:10,120 never done that before. He did that at Brownsville 849 00:54:10,120 --> 00:54:13,480 before, but it was like a midweek service. 850 00:54:14,080 --> 00:54:18,640 But to do it as the main message, you know what I'm 851 00:54:18,640 --> 00:54:22,680 saying, He's never done that. So and there's all these 852 00:54:22,680 --> 00:54:24,960 different, you mentioned, you know, these different guests, 853 00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:28,000 would we bring them into our our fellowship? 854 00:54:28,640 --> 00:54:31,440 I think they if, if they're good guests, if they're asking the 855 00:54:31,800 --> 00:54:36,520 the right questions, you know, whether it's on a Saturday 856 00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:39,000 morning or a midweek or something with it, you should 857 00:54:39,000 --> 00:54:42,360 have a healthy environment where you bring in those conversations 858 00:54:42,520 --> 00:54:44,000 because we talk about it all the time. 859 00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:49,400 The supernatural has been lost or pushed out the door by 860 00:54:49,400 --> 00:54:52,000 traditional church. They don't want to talk about 861 00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:54,000 the things they don't understand. 862 00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:59,400 They, you know, but OK, then let's meet on a Tuesday night 863 00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:03,520 and let's discuss it. You know, let's break the mold. 864 00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:10,200 Let's do something different so. Yeah, and that's what we hope to 865 00:55:10,200 --> 00:55:12,600 do on our show, right? Right. 866 00:55:13,840 --> 00:55:16,280 Let's have those conversations on your show, Rod. 867 00:55:16,880 --> 00:55:19,880 Let's have those conversations. Yeah. 868 00:55:20,000 --> 00:55:23,280 So I mean, hopefully, you know, everyone listening, you guys 869 00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:26,320 have some food for thought if you haven't considered these 870 00:55:26,320 --> 00:55:32,240 concepts of of what institutional versus organic 871 00:55:32,240 --> 00:55:33,840 church. And I think even the phrase 872 00:55:33,840 --> 00:55:38,440 organic church, I think it was T Austin Sparks that coined that. 873 00:55:38,440 --> 00:55:41,880 If I remember Frank saying that correctly. 874 00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:45,760 And I got I got to dig into hit some of his stuff. 875 00:55:45,760 --> 00:55:51,200 I guess Watchman Knee was mentored by T Austin then those. 876 00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:54,520 It was the other way around. T Austin was the other T Austin 877 00:55:54,520 --> 00:55:57,400 Sparks was went meant. Did you say T Austin Sparks was 878 00:55:57,400 --> 00:56:01,960 mentored by Watchman Knee? No, no, he mentored Watchmen. 879 00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:03,640 I thought, I thought, didn't Watchmen learn? 880 00:56:03,680 --> 00:56:05,200 I thought it was the other way around. 881 00:56:05,200 --> 00:56:09,000 I think Watchmen was But anyways, yes, they did have a 882 00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:11,800 connection. Yeah, there was a connection 883 00:56:11,800 --> 00:56:14,040 and. And Pastor Doug Riggs, who 884 00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:20,120 really dug into T Austin Sparks and used his material 885 00:56:20,280 --> 00:56:25,440 methodically in his messages because he just, he was one of 886 00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:28,680 those individuals in the body of Christ, like Watchman Knee or 887 00:56:28,680 --> 00:56:33,880 the Apostle Paul that just got amazing downloads of revelation 888 00:56:33,880 --> 00:56:37,120 and was able to expound it. And I, I need to get into it as 889 00:56:37,120 --> 00:56:40,880 well, But I know we don't have much time left. 890 00:56:40,880 --> 00:56:44,360 Pete, let's let's kind of recap some of the deconstruction 891 00:56:44,360 --> 00:56:47,760 because I know you wanted to do a Part 3 on construction. 892 00:56:48,120 --> 00:56:51,840 Is there anything else that we need to hit on bullet point wise 893 00:56:52,320 --> 00:56:56,280 that we didn't deconstruct? I tried to take it from a basic 894 00:56:56,280 --> 00:56:59,960 standpoint of 150. Congregation, how would you 895 00:56:59,960 --> 00:57:01,040 break it down? Yeah. 896 00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:05,000 But I don't know, is there anything else that we need to 897 00:57:05,000 --> 00:57:07,200 talk about on the deconstruction side? 898 00:57:08,160 --> 00:57:10,880 Well, let me let me mention a few things and Rod, feel free to 899 00:57:10,880 --> 00:57:16,040 jump in. You know, I just, I want to hit 900 00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:19,200 on and we'd have talked about it, just the damage that has 901 00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:23,560 happened and we can't possibly encapsulate the damage that has 902 00:57:23,560 --> 00:57:27,680 happened over hundreds of years of of doing church in this way. 903 00:57:28,360 --> 00:57:32,440 But some of the things that have happened in the past, If anybody 904 00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:36,560 knows about this, look up the persecution of the Anabaptists. 905 00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:44,480 They were literally killed. They were zealous for God. 906 00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:48,200 They didn't have all of their theology perfect, but they were 907 00:57:48,200 --> 00:57:50,520 literally killed because they were going against the 908 00:57:50,520 --> 00:57:54,160 establishment of traditional doctrine. 909 00:57:55,720 --> 00:57:59,200 Similar abuses happened in the prior to the Reformation where 910 00:57:59,200 --> 00:58:01,560 common people were not allowed to read the Bible. 911 00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:04,680 They only had ordained ministers to do that. 912 00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:11,200 You know, I think of, if you guys know the band Primus, they 913 00:58:11,200 --> 00:58:14,680 had a song called to Defy the Laws of tradition. 914 00:58:15,560 --> 00:58:18,000 It's a crusade only of the brave. 915 00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:21,360 He said. Such a great lyric. 916 00:58:22,760 --> 00:58:24,880 That's that's kind of what we're talking about. 917 00:58:25,000 --> 00:58:29,800 If you've ever seen fiddler on the Roof tradition, we're we're 918 00:58:29,800 --> 00:58:34,920 going against tradition here. The the status quo does not like 919 00:58:34,920 --> 00:58:36,760 this stuff. And we said this last time, 920 00:58:36,760 --> 00:58:41,160 Luke, that that that wonderful quote that somebody came up 921 00:58:41,160 --> 00:58:44,640 with. It's very difficult to get 922 00:58:44,640 --> 00:58:48,160 someone to understand something when their livelihood depends on 923 00:58:48,160 --> 00:58:53,320 them not understanding it. So this kind of stuff is not 924 00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:57,320 going to be popular if you talk to your traditional pastor about 925 00:58:57,320 --> 00:59:00,000 it. But yeah, I think the biggest 926 00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:06,720 things for deconstruction, if we were to recap, is that the body 927 00:59:06,720 --> 00:59:11,480 of Christ is meant to express Christ in his fullness with him 928 00:59:11,480 --> 00:59:18,560 being the head led by him. And when we meet, we, we want to 929 00:59:18,600 --> 00:59:23,120 have the freest, fullest expression of that with the Holy 930 00:59:23,120 --> 00:59:27,240 Spirit's discernment. So essentially when we meet as 931 00:59:27,240 --> 00:59:32,440 believers, each one of us with the Holy Spirit, all of those 932 00:59:32,440 --> 00:59:37,120 Holy Spirit in dwelt people come together and their collective 933 00:59:37,120 --> 00:59:40,720 discernment helps guide and direct what happens in that 934 00:59:40,720 --> 00:59:42,920 meeting. What's said, what's not said, 935 00:59:42,920 --> 00:59:47,520 what's song, what's asked, you know the direction of it. 936 00:59:47,680 --> 00:59:50,040 It's discerned as a collective body. 937 00:59:51,600 --> 00:59:55,080 And we've touched on a number of the damage that looking to a 938 00:59:55,080 --> 00:59:58,440 single person or group of people can have. 939 00:59:58,520 --> 01:00:00,760 You better hope they're going in the right direction. 940 01:00:00,920 --> 01:00:05,040 And are you free to have your gifts function if you're if 941 01:00:05,040 --> 01:00:07,720 you're kind of passive and waiting on that person. 942 01:00:08,840 --> 01:00:15,720 So that's kind of how the every every member functioning meeting 943 01:00:15,720 --> 01:00:19,160 is supposed to work. And when you have a sermon? 944 01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:24,000 Which comes from Greek rhetoric. When you have a pastor, a 945 01:00:24,000 --> 01:00:27,720 clergy, which is a holdover from the priesthood of the old 946 01:00:27,720 --> 01:00:31,040 covenant. When you have a building that is 947 01:00:31,040 --> 01:00:35,160 faced like an auditorium where the action happens up front and 948 01:00:35,160 --> 01:00:38,880 everyone else is passive. When you have a burden of 949 01:00:38,880 --> 01:00:45,360 seventy, 8090% of your church budget is going to overhead with 950 01:00:45,360 --> 01:00:48,160 10 or 20% left for actual ministry. 951 01:00:49,360 --> 01:00:52,240 You really have to question how much are you getting out of 952 01:00:52,240 --> 01:00:55,720 those two hours? You know, I used to think, and I 953 01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:57,520 still kind of do. Wow. 954 01:00:57,520 --> 01:01:00,480 I've listened to thousands of sermons over the years. 955 01:01:00,600 --> 01:01:03,160 That's pretty good. I I bet I've got a lot of truth 956 01:01:03,160 --> 01:01:04,440 out of that, and I probably have. 957 01:01:06,120 --> 01:01:14,440 But is it worth what I paid? Was it worth me not doing my own 958 01:01:14,440 --> 01:01:16,000 work? Probably not. 959 01:01:16,800 --> 01:01:19,360 Probably not. I think we all have to take 960 01:01:19,360 --> 01:01:26,560 responsibility for our own learning, our own growth, and 961 01:01:26,560 --> 01:01:32,360 realize that this clergy system, this building, these 962 01:01:32,360 --> 01:01:35,880 denominations, God doesn't approve of this stuff. 963 01:01:35,880 --> 01:01:39,360 He blesses it. He does, but he doesn't approve 964 01:01:39,360 --> 01:01:41,440 of it. This is not how his body is 965 01:01:41,440 --> 01:01:46,600 meant to function. And to deconstruct to Luke's 966 01:01:46,600 --> 01:01:50,000 question, if you have 150 person church, I don't know where to 967 01:01:50,000 --> 01:01:51,400 start. That's a tough one. 968 01:01:51,400 --> 01:01:55,120 You'd have to ask God. But for me and my family, it was 969 01:01:56,440 --> 01:01:59,200 the right time to do this. I was actually, I actually came 970 01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:02,600 across Francis Chan letters for the church and Frank Viola, 971 01:02:02,600 --> 01:02:05,760 Pagan Christianity probably like 8 years ago. 972 01:02:06,680 --> 01:02:10,280 And I was convinced at that time, but my family wasn't 973 01:02:10,280 --> 01:02:14,160 ready. I wasn't ready and it was more 974 01:02:14,160 --> 01:02:17,960 recently when as I mentioned that that church meeting, that 975 01:02:17,960 --> 01:02:21,840 budget meeting, hey, we paid off the mortgage where I, I started 976 01:02:21,840 --> 01:02:24,680 to dig into this again. At the same time, I came across 977 01:02:24,680 --> 01:02:30,480 the book that from Tim Kurtz called Leaving Church Becoming 978 01:02:30,480 --> 01:02:33,360 Ekklesia, which I highly recommend, where he mentioned 979 01:02:33,360 --> 01:02:39,960 that among other mistranslations in the KJV, the King James 980 01:02:39,960 --> 01:02:46,760 translators mistranslated ekklesia as church, and that was 981 01:02:47,080 --> 01:02:49,040 what we're meant to be as an ekklesia. 982 01:02:49,200 --> 01:02:53,560 It's a ruling body, a an assembly, a ruling council 983 01:02:54,800 --> 01:03:00,520 taking dominion on the earth. And when we supplant Christ by 984 01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:04,520 having these human heads, we're missing quite a bit. 985 01:03:04,920 --> 01:03:09,560 So yeah, it's messy. We're only a year and a half in. 986 01:03:09,560 --> 01:03:14,520 We're still figuring it out. But I would, I would, I would 987 01:03:14,520 --> 01:03:19,120 preface that I mean, God uses people, God uses human heads, 988 01:03:19,720 --> 01:03:22,960 and God uses the frailties of all of us. 989 01:03:25,080 --> 01:03:30,040 And there's a lot of good individuals in the traditional 990 01:03:30,040 --> 01:03:35,800 church. So God grace the body of Christ 991 01:03:35,960 --> 01:03:41,480 to fulfill its mandate and to be fiscally responsible, you know, 992 01:03:41,600 --> 01:03:45,040 because we talk about money a lot and this subject, you know, 993 01:03:46,080 --> 01:03:51,280 because it's supposed to be his, you know, from the family's 994 01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:54,840 budget to the church's budget, it's supposed to be God's. 995 01:03:55,000 --> 01:03:59,000 And we want to be good stewards with, with said funds. 996 01:03:59,640 --> 01:04:05,520 So I think I think the best thing out of this is we're 997 01:04:05,520 --> 01:04:09,200 asking the questions. You know, you asked the question 998 01:04:09,200 --> 01:04:11,800 to your old pastor. Maybe if he would have gave you 999 01:04:11,800 --> 01:04:16,280 a different answer, you guys would still be there, you know, 1000 01:04:17,280 --> 01:04:21,680 Or at least, hey, let's have a discussion about this as a body, 1001 01:04:22,040 --> 01:04:25,560 as a church, what we should do with the funds. 1002 01:04:26,280 --> 01:04:28,120 And that and that. Let me say this real quick, 1003 01:04:28,120 --> 01:04:30,600 Luke, that's what I wanted. I didn't want to jump ship. 1004 01:04:30,640 --> 01:04:34,560 I would rather fix the ship and repair the holes now. 1005 01:04:34,560 --> 01:04:37,880 Now I see it with new eyes that no it's old wineskins. 1006 01:04:37,880 --> 01:04:41,600 It couldn't have worked, but I. But that's why I asked the 1007 01:04:41,600 --> 01:04:43,960 question. You know, the 150 church from 1008 01:04:43,960 --> 01:04:46,720 the top down, they want to re they they're willing to 1009 01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:49,000 deconstruct the whole thing, the whole shit. 1010 01:04:50,080 --> 01:04:53,520 How how do you do it? And I don't know that Frank, I 1011 01:04:53,520 --> 01:04:56,520 don't know that this author has all the answers, but he asks a 1012 01:04:56,520 --> 01:04:58,800 lot of questions that are that are valid. 1013 01:05:00,440 --> 01:05:03,800 Yeah, and he and he's lived in this organic setting for 1014 01:05:03,800 --> 01:05:08,560 something like 3-4 decades now. So it's really just a wealth of 1015 01:05:08,560 --> 01:05:10,680 information. So I highly recommend going 1016 01:05:10,680 --> 01:05:14,480 through his books. Neil Cole is another one that 1017 01:05:14,480 --> 01:05:19,160 that does this kind of thing. And then someone that my wife 1018 01:05:19,160 --> 01:05:23,200 and I have gotten to know personally, I forget his last 1019 01:05:23,200 --> 01:05:26,400 name, but Gavin and his wife Carla. 1020 01:05:27,120 --> 01:05:30,160 And they have a something called simple Church, I believe it's 1021 01:05:30,160 --> 01:05:33,000 called. And he's been a mentor to us. 1022 01:05:33,320 --> 01:05:35,920 So kind of a shout out to to him. 1023 01:05:35,960 --> 01:05:40,440 But Rod, why don't you give us any final word there as we wrap 1024 01:05:40,440 --> 01:05:42,480 up? Appreciate you coming on. 1025 01:05:43,600 --> 01:05:46,440 Yeah, well, thank, thank you both for inviting me. 1026 01:05:46,440 --> 01:05:49,720 I always enjoy the opportunity to sharpen and learn from each 1027 01:05:49,720 --> 01:05:54,160 other and and grow. For I consider that the 1028 01:05:54,160 --> 01:05:57,680 sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared 1029 01:05:57,680 --> 01:06:01,360 with the glory which shall be revealed in us. 1030 01:06:02,040 --> 01:06:06,360 For the earnest expectation of the creation eagerly waits for 1031 01:06:06,360 --> 01:06:09,520 the revealing of the sons of God. 1032 01:06:10,520 --> 01:06:16,600 For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but 1033 01:06:16,600 --> 01:06:21,160 because of Him who was subjected to it in hope, Because the 1034 01:06:21,160 --> 01:06:24,920 creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of 1035 01:06:24,920 --> 01:06:29,720 corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 1036 01:06:31,320 --> 01:06:35,320 For we know that the whole creation groans and laborers 1037 01:06:35,320 --> 01:06:39,120 with birth pangs together until now. 1038 01:06:39,800 --> 01:06:45,720 Not only that, but we also who have the first fruits of the 1039 01:06:45,720 --> 01:06:49,840 Spirit, even we ourselves, grown within ourselves, eagerly 1040 01:06:49,840 --> 01:06:55,240 waiting for the adoption, the redemption of our body. 1041 01:06:56,520 --> 01:07:01,320 Romans 818 through 23. It's always an honor to be here 1042 01:07:01,320 --> 01:07:02,640 with you guys. Thank you. 1043 01:07:02,800 --> 01:07:03,800 Yeah. Thanks, Rod. 1044 01:07:04,520 --> 01:07:06,040 Thanks, Luke. This was great. 1045 01:07:07,440 --> 01:07:12,440 I hope that this was interesting and edifying and and thought 1046 01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:16,400 provoking for the audience. If if it was, if you guys have 1047 01:07:16,520 --> 01:07:21,000 questions, comments, disagreements, or yeah, just 1048 01:07:21,000 --> 01:07:24,160 good questions to really dig into this and say what about 1049 01:07:24,160 --> 01:07:27,120 this in this situation? What about that? 1050 01:07:28,320 --> 01:07:33,560 E-mail us the days and old podcast@gmail.com or e-mail Rod 1051 01:07:34,520 --> 01:07:39,200 head over to the Millennial Mustard Seed podcast and check 1052 01:07:39,200 --> 01:07:42,480 out his stuff. So thanks so much guys. 1053 01:07:42,480 --> 01:07:46,920 And hopefully we can do it again with a Part 3, focusing more on 1054 01:07:46,920 --> 01:07:52,000 the reconstruction of of what it is from both personal experience 1055 01:07:52,040 --> 01:07:56,480 and things that we've gleaned from those like Frank and Neil 1056 01:07:56,480 --> 01:07:59,160 that have gone before us to do this kind of thing. 1057 01:08:00,800 --> 01:08:04,520 And even not that the New Testament is a blueprint per SE, 1058 01:08:05,160 --> 01:08:07,040 that would be a mistake to think of it that way. 1059 01:08:07,040 --> 01:08:12,880 But there are plenty of good clues to how they met and what 1060 01:08:12,880 --> 01:08:17,279 sort of things were going on that we can take from and learn 1061 01:08:17,279 --> 01:08:20,680 from. So with that, we will wrap up. 1062 01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:22,520 Thanks guys. God bless. 1063 01:08:39,200 --> 01:08:42,680 Straight from the heavens, you really owe me. 1064 01:08:42,680 --> 01:08:46,439 All of my life I was beating up. All in my life I didn't handle 1065 01:08:46,479 --> 01:08:48,720 hope. All in my life I was stuck in no 1066 01:08:48,720 --> 01:08:50,960 trap. All in my life I didn't handle 1067 01:08:50,960 --> 01:08:53,120 rap. I didn't know why my life was 1068 01:08:53,200 --> 01:08:55,399 away. I didn't know why my life was 1069 01:08:55,520 --> 01:08:57,760 alright. I didn't know why I couldn't get 1070 01:08:57,800 --> 01:08:59,240 up. I was so stuck. 1071 01:08:59,240 --> 01:09:01,479 And the monkey was stuck till I found out. 1072 01:09:01,479 --> 01:09:03,600 And I broke everything till I found out. 1073 01:09:03,600 --> 01:09:05,960 And they took everything until I was hurt. 1074 01:09:06,120 --> 01:09:08,399 My heart was straight. Yeah, I was broken. 1075 01:09:08,399 --> 01:09:10,399 I had all this pain. Held on home. 1076 01:09:10,479 --> 01:09:13,520 It got harder. Then I went to the side of the 1077 01:09:13,520 --> 01:09:15,840 smoke. I had no truth but to look to my 1078 01:09:15,920 --> 01:09:17,359 guy. He gave me to me. 1079 01:09:17,359 --> 01:09:19,600 Your foam in my eyes. He gave me earrings. 1080 01:09:19,600 --> 01:09:22,479 And he told me I'm blessed. He told me he just believe in 1081 01:09:22,479 --> 01:09:24,720 this time. I told him I can't change all of 1082 01:09:24,720 --> 01:09:27,040 my ways. He said I got you to look at 1083 01:09:27,040 --> 01:09:29,359 this time. I looked at him and he showed me 1084 01:09:29,359 --> 01:09:31,520 his ways. Then he just told me how I am 1085 01:09:31,560 --> 01:09:33,720 this time. Then he just told me you're not. 1086 01:09:34,479 --> 01:09:36,640 He told me I'll come from the heavens above. 1087 01:09:36,640 --> 01:09:39,120 I'm a new creature. I come from the sun, from the 1088 01:09:39,120 --> 01:09:41,319 one and only straight from the heavens. 1089 01:09:41,319 --> 01:09:43,479 You really owe me. I came from the sun. 1090 01:09:43,479 --> 01:09:46,240 I was really with them. And heavenly places I'm sealing. 1091 01:09:47,000 --> 01:09:50,720 Y'all can't even go that way. Y'all don't even know that way. 1092 01:09:51,560 --> 01:09:54,840 Y'all want to play like Patty Kay, but this ain't no game but 1093 01:09:54,840 --> 01:09:58,360 the star, right? You wipe this on bake when you 1094 01:09:58,360 --> 01:10:00,400 walk under me and I know you're a snake. 1095 01:10:01,560 --> 01:10:03,840 You think you can beat me but you got no power. 1096 01:10:03,880 --> 01:10:07,960 You all in a way I take out that chopper, I'll put on your 1097 01:10:08,000 --> 01:10:09,440 chopper and I'll prank on your face. 1098 01:10:10,760 --> 01:10:13,040 I see you laughing. You think that you got me but 1099 01:10:13,040 --> 01:10:16,920 you got no way. The evil you said for my life is 1100 01:10:16,920 --> 01:10:18,480 OK because it's made for my good. 1101 01:10:19,640 --> 01:10:22,680 My God is created. He created you so you really is 1102 01:10:22,720 --> 01:10:25,400 good. I said all these things because 1103 01:10:25,400 --> 01:10:32,240 I know what is true and you know you don't like when I know the 1104 01:10:32,320 --> 01:10:34,280 things that's going to happen to you when you die. 1105 01:10:36,240 --> 01:10:38,880 You didn't live in your life because you know you can never 1106 01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:41,720 go and get safe. You know it's crazy. 1107 01:10:41,720 --> 01:10:44,320 His mercy was too from you when you're my son in the pot. 1108 01:10:44,320 --> 01:10:48,480 I thought you can take on my God's spot now, but you can die 1109 01:10:48,480 --> 01:10:50,120 hot. You was really tweaking. 1110 01:10:50,320 --> 01:10:53,280 I come from the sun, from one and only straight from the 1111 01:10:53,280 --> 01:10:54,640 heavens. You really owe me. 1112 01:10:54,880 --> 01:10:57,240 I came from the sun. I was really with him and 1113 01:10:57,240 --> 01:10:58,960 heavenly places I'm still living.