Hello and welcome to the Kappa Podcast.
My name is Matt. I'm the Senior Practitioner for
Kappa First Response and I'm joined today as ever by our
Founder and CEO, Jane Griffiths. Hi, Jane.
Hey Matt, how you doing? So lovely to be here with.
You with me face to face. I know in your lovely flat
sunny. It's a rare treat, isn't it?
Fantastic. It you know what, It is a rare
treat. Yeah, I think it.
It's so lovely to be together to record this.
Yeah, I agree. I agree, it already feels a lot
more real. Yeah.
So this series is going to be
slightly different to what we've done previously, isn't it?
Do you want to say a little bit about about why we're doing this
series to begin with? Yeah.
Well, I mean, I guess our previous series that we we've
thought about, we've sort of been in conversation with or
we've been zooming and and speaking to particular people
about particular issues. This one is really designed for
families who feel a bit more isolated, whether that be via
location or through circumstances and their
experience, feel like they're unable to talk to people.
And we wanted to provide something that families could
access 24/7 regardless of their locations.
I also think it's really important to say that East
Sussex local authority sort of really commissioned us to do
this because they really wanted to support families living in
those rural outlying areas who found it really, really
difficult to get support. And we'll be offering, well, I
guess if we were to sit, Matt, and think about what would be
our top five or six strategies, we're sort of aiming to to sort
of think about those strategies for families, aren't we?
That's what the series is going to be about.
Yeah. So it's, it's a little bit more,
it's going to be a little bit, I mean, I think hopefully all, all
of our podcasts have been useful, but this is a bit more,
something a bit more tangible, a bit more solid that people can
use and put into practise. Yeah.
We're not thinking about, you know, this, these episodes
aren't for about us understanding what this issue
is. This is really let's go, what's
the support that we offer to families and let's share that,
Yeah. I think you said a minute ago
that these are like probably 5 or six of our top strategies
that we, we know are useful to quite a few different families
that we work with. But it's always really important
to say that nothing works all of the time.
And there isn't one thing that is going to work for every
single family. And if even if it works for that
family, it doesn't mean that it's going to work 100% of the
time. So it's just important that we
say that at the at the top, I think to say these are all ideas
that, you know, have a listen, keep it in mind.
Hopefully you think I'm going to give that a try.
But even if you think it's not going to work for me, it doesn't
feel quite right. Hopefully you'll still think
about the idea behind it. And even if you don't action
anything from it, you can think about why, why it might be
useful and why it might be important.
And hopefully there's some use in that as well.
Yeah. And and I think, you know, a
reminder that all of our work and all of our support to
families is tailored and bespoke.
You know, we speak to families and think what's happening for
them in their home and we can, you know, it could be that we
don't talk about any of these strategies, but generally what
we've found out is these strategies come into our support
at some point for families. And there will be somebody out
there listening to this and maybe think I can't, I can't get
on board with what Matt, I can't get on board with what that that
strategy that you've spoken about.
But I can really get on board with this other strategy.
And we we anticipate that and expect that.
I think what's important as well is that, you know, everything
and all everything we're going to be sharing on the in this
series, it's not necessary. It's not going to do any harm.
It's all about it's all relationship building.
And that's only a positive thing.
You may see things and we'll talk about that and what in one
of the episodes that we're going to be presenting about, you
know, what can happen if actually things do feel
different. My child has noticed something
different. What do I do then?
So, and we will we'll sort of address that weren't we want to
I think it's Episode 2 when we're thinking about our safety
Lanning. OK, so, so that's a little bit
about why we're doing it and you know, some of the things we're
going to be covering, but it's going to it's going to look a
little bit different from our other podcasts, right?
Yep, Yeah. So, you know, up until now it's
been us chatting, hasn't it, And having conversations.
Yeah. What we've decided to do with
this, which will look a little bit different, is the beginning
of every episode. We'll have a little explanation
around what we're doing. You know, this isn't about
explaining why this happens, because we've done that.
This is about sharing those strategies, how we would share
them with a family. So we're doing it separately.
So I'm going to be presenting three of them and thinking about
3 strategies and you're going to be presenting three of them and
support 3 strategies. But we're doing them solo.
So they won't have that opportunity of a back and forth.
And I think that that's going to be the main difference that
people will see. Yeah, and I think that's
hopefully will make it a little bit more useful because you can
follow along. It's not you're not listening to
a conversation like you're saying of us back and forth.
You're listening to us giving you a strategy as we would, you
know, in a session if, you know, as we were explaining it to you
and and kind of telling you why we're suggesting you do this,
what what the background is to it.
Is there anything else we've missed, Jane?
I think we, I don't think we have.
Hopefully we can just let's do it.
Let's go. All right.
Let's get into it. OK, so Jane, for this episode,
we're going to be talking a bit more about we'll be talking
about safety planning. Why is?
Why is this important? Listen, you know, safety
planning is really helpful for any family that we're supporting
because, you know, a child who is dysregulating or using
aggressive and, or harmful behaviours in the home towards
parent, they've created a narrative and that narrative
keeps them safe. And the moment we make some
tweaks to changing your responses towards your child,
that narrative's going to be wobbled and that narrative's
going to feel threatened. And we can't predict what can
happen for that. So I think it's really important
for us to consider safety planning, which we know can feel
a bit scary, but we'll we'll kind of talk through that a
little bit and what what that looks like and when it can be
really helpful. Yeah, and this isn't like an
exhaustive list, isn't it? When we come talking about
safety planning, it's things to keep in mind, but it's yeah,
yeah, yeah. OK.
So should we get into it? Yeah, OK.
I am here to introduce the idea of safety planning today.
Why is safety planning important?
Why is it helpful? Why do we do this for families?
Well, it can feel really daunting firstly to think about
needing a safety plan in your home, which should feel like a
safe space for you and everybody that lives there.
And safety plans can feel a little bit, gosh, that's really
serious. But safety plan is really,
really helpful when you're feeling maybe you're really
dysregulated and, and not sure what to do or what to go or what
am I going to put into place because you're not thinking.
A safety plan could just help you think about what do I do in
the moment? What, what's the most important
thing? A safety plan should be unique
to every family. It should be done in
collaboration with somebody. It's really helpful if you're
going to do a safety plan to visualise it, draw it, put it
down and maybe get somebody else to look at it, have a second
opinion. What, what does that look like
for you? This safety plan that we're
going to look at today and consider, it's not exhaustive.
It's, it's a starting point. It we're going to talk about
some basics to put on your safety plan to think about.
And not everybody is going to need a safety plan not, but it
can, it can reassure you, it can make you feel a bit safer.
And that is what it their safety plan is really all about making
you feel safer. So as I say, safety plans
individual to each family in each situation should be used
and maintained. Don't do a safety plan, leave it
in your bottom drawer and never come back to it.
Sometimes having a safety plan can having it somewhere visual
can be really, really helpful. So I recommend, you know, I've
just got an A four piece paper here and a pen and I'm just
going to draw out for me, what I like to draw out is, is like the
outline of a house because it reminds me, this is my home.
This is the place I'm keeping safe.
And we're not only talking about physical safety, we've also got
to consider our emotional safety and how we're feeling
emotionally and what that looks like.
So let's start with those sort of basic starting points of
what's in your safety plan. So this is dependent on the age
of your child and the behaviour that's happening in the home and
how do you feel? So that's all that's my starting
point. Now, As for some parents, I
might talk about bottom line, what's the thing that you can no
longer tolerate? What's the thing that's the
hardest thing for you to manage? And actually you just don't want
that to happen anymore. For some parents, they've said
to us, I just don't want to be hit anymore.
I, I, I can't be hit For other parents, it can be.
I can't be threatened. It's setting up what your bottom
line is. Again, you don't have to have a
bottom line. This is just a starting point.
But let's say for an example, your bottom line is no violence
in the home towards me. You can put into your safety
plan no violence. Maybe draw a line and if that
line is broken, what are you going to do?
Thinking about it in those real practical terms, when somebody
is dysregulating, when your child is dysregulating, they're
not going to feel safe. And if you're not safe, they're
not going to. If they don't feel safe, you're
not going to feel safe and potentially other people in the
house won't feel safe. So we can think of some really
practical things to put in our safety plan.
It could be if my child is dysregulating and I cannot talk
to them, I cannot, you know, it's not OK for me to approach
them, be close to them. What am I going to think about
doing? Well, firstly, the practical
things I want to do is I know my other children can feel really
unsafe by this. So I'm going to put, I'm going
to make sure that they go into a safe space.
If they're old enough, if it's appropriate me, it's suggesting
to the child, it's time to go up to your bedroom.
So you're keeping practically everybody safe.
If you've got, if your child is a teenager and they're bigger
and they're stronger and you feel in fear or frightened of
what they may do to you, it could be a really good idea that
you go into a space and close the door for some, for some
young people that can be like red rag to a ball.
So it's, it's knowing for you, it's knowing what your child is
likely to do. And is it OK for me to go to a
room and feel safe? Do you have somebody in your
network? Networks are really, really
important. Who in your safety plan are you
going to indicate on your network of people to call or to
lean on or get support from if things disreg, if things
escalate and things become really fearful in the home?
Now for some people that can be a neighbour, some people that
can be a family, another family member.
If there's 2, two adults in the home, one adult could
potentially be staying with the child and who, who's identified
to stay with the child? If they're dysregulating, is
that going to be you or the other adult in the home?
Then the other adult who isn't with the child maybe is making
sure the other children are safe.
If if you're by yourself and your child dysregulates and it
feels really unsafe, who else is in your network?
Aunts, uncles, friends, neighbour, somebody you can call
regardless of the day or night. Now for some people, that's just
not an option, not available. So who else could you call?
And we often talk about the police.
How do the police help us in these situations?
And would the police be somebody I would call?
I think it's important to say that the police are there to
keep us safe, but it can feel really daunting.
And for some parents, calling the police is not an option.
For some parents, they're really scared around criminalising
their child. We totally get that and this is
not the option for everybody. But if you were to call the
police, what could that look like?
What we do recommend to begin with is calling the police when
things aren't escalating, when nobody is in fear.
Having a conversation with them, talking to them about your child
is using behaviours in the home that sometimes can feel really
scary and you are potentially putting some things into place
that might escalate what's happening.
But you're, what you're trying to do is make it have a
relationship with your child that isn't based around violence
or harmful behaviours. But in order to get to that
point, you might put a couple of steps in place that may escalate
things. And it's unpredictable.
So you just want that to be referenced really.
You're not looking to criminalise your child, but
you'd like a reference number if that's available.
So if you do have to call, you will only be calling if things
are really difficult. If you do have to call, there's
a number you can call and somebody will know what is
happening. That can be a really good
starting point. It's also being clear, listen,
the, the, the, the police find this, this really difficult to
walk into too. Depending on where you're
located up and down the country, it can be really, really, you
know, the experience you get from the police can differ.
So I think one of the things for us to consider is what do you
want from the police if you do call them?
And it's been really clear that you're not looking the police to
come in and parent your child. You're not looking them to come
in and sort of right, OK, come on, let's, let's break this up.
Let's let's sit down and talk about this.
You're actually by having somebody else come into your
home, whether it be the police or a neighbour or a friend, it's
very much about stopping what's happening in that moment.
Because what often can happen is that that thread is broken.
That escalation is stopped by the presence of somebody else
coming into the home. And it's working and
collaborating with whoever is in your network, whether it be the
police or whether it's not. But sometimes the police is
necessary to keep you all safe, and sometimes having the police
come in can also trigger the right services coming in to
support you. And sometimes that's really,
really necessary and really, really helpful.
As scary as that may feel, I think by taking your own control
and agency around that can help you feel that this is the right
strategy to have. So I think it's important to
have that on your safety plan, whether it's who's in your
network, who can you call? Even if your child has said to
you, if you call anybody, you know what's going to happen and
that that's a reality and that can happen.
It's, it's what are you going to do in that situation if with
that threat and that intimidation.
So part of your safety plan is thinking about what happens in
that situation. Who am I going to call?
What's going to happen? So we have got a safe place
potentially to be in the home on your safety plan.
We're starting to think about the network of people around us
being on our safety plan as, as really key things to consider
and, and start thinking about what are you doing in yourself?
What's your reminder to yourself?
What could be? So let's think about that
emotional safety. You know, when things are
escalating around you, you are likely to be escalating with it
because you're going to become hypersensitive.
Your arousal system's going to be triggered and you're possibly
going to meet the child at that space.
So your safety plan can also include what are the things you
need to think about on an emotional level.
Now, as we go through the episodes, Matt and I are going
to be talking about what's going on internally for us.
So filling in the safety plan could come after we've think
thought about what what's going on for us emotionally.
But what do you need? What do you need on your safety
plan? OK, Is it a reminder to I need
to adjust? Take a deep breath.
I need to ground myself. Is it a reminder that my child,
what my child is doing is not OK, but this is the approach I
need to have towards what's happening.
Do you put a little reminder on your safety plan?
So your safety plan is for you. Your safety plan is devised to
help you in that moment, which is why I think having a safety
plan somewhere visual can be really, really helpful.
Whether it's in your kitchen, maybe inside a cupboard, maybe
it is in your bedroom, somewhere you can easily access it.
Is it a safety plan you want to share with the rest of your
family? Do you sit down with your other
children, potentially in an age appropriate way?
Obviously it would depend on the age of the child and share.
Listen, when things become a bit scary at home or when something
happens, I want us to consider the safety plan.
It could be talking to your other children about what would
make them feel safe, where would they like to go, how would they
like to feel so they feel included because it's really
scary for everybody in the home. It could even be that when the
child who was using aggressive or harmful behaviours towards
you, when they're where they are calm and regulated, it could
possibly be even including them in the safety plan.
What do they need when they are dysregulating or when they are
sort of feeling like they're going to dysregulate?
What do they need? Because they very well and often
children will tell you what they need.
Stay away from me, leave me alone.
I just want to go to my bedroom and be leave me alone.
Don't follow me around with. I've had so many parents who
have said to me, their children have said not to follow them, to
leave them. It's like, well, listen to that.
Listen to what your child is saying to you because they know
what they may need at the time of this rate.
It's not the time for you to go and say you've got to remember
to do this as part of your safety plan.
But it's a, it's a reminder of what we're all suggesting we
need. And when you're when you're
hyper vigilant and hyper aroused, sometimes you may
forget what's on your safety plan, which is why it's not,
it's a good thing to do it in a calm space.
Now listen, there's so many things we can cover in a safety
plan. All of what we speak about is
tailored and bespoke to you. It's about, I think, being
mindful of sitting down and thinking in the moment, what
would I like to be on a safety plan?
This isn't a plan for every family.
You may be. I can't do that.
I don't want to go to that place and think of a safety plan.
Totally get that. But for some families, it could
be really, really helpful. Remember, we're changing a
child's narrative. Your child who is using this
behaviour has created a narrative that keeps them
emotionally and physically safe. And what we're looking at in
these episodes is putting in some minor tweaks that's going
to change your child's narrative.
And we don't know that can be unpredictable.
So we just want to make sure you're being mindful, thinking
about OK, if things start escalating.
Oh, yeah. Jane and Matt spoke about this.
What does my, what do I want in my safety plan to help me?
What do I feel is going to help me?
So we're going to do a little, we're going to put a little
picture up at that to help you, to give you some ideas of what
that can look like. So have a look at that, see what
your thoughts are. Print off your own 1 you, we, we
can always send you a safety plan, a blank safety plan that
you can use as a starting point. If it's helpful.
Certainly e-mail us and ask us for one of those.
Speak to your friends if you're working with a professional,
talk to them about what does a safety plan look like?
What does it mean to you? What can I put on there?
It's going to be achievable. It's got to be simple and it's
got to be realistic. They're the three things I would
say about your safety plan. Me keeping them achievable,
realistic and clear. You know, there's no point in
trying to complicate it and have lots of different visuals on
your safety plan that make it feel like oh, what did I say
what I was going to do with my safety plan and try to keep it
as simple as possible because when things are difficult, you
want things to be simple. It could be that you've got 3 or
4 numbers on your safety plan. So they're really there and
accessible, right? Yes, Jim said I could call him.
I'm going to phone Jim or no, I absolutely cannot phone anybody.
I'm out in the middle of nowhere.
I have no community around me. So I, I'm going to call the
police or maybe somebody else in your community, if that's
available. And if not, how are you going to
keep yourself safe in home when potentially it's just you and
your child? What are the things that you can
do? And that can be the where the
emotional safety plan comes into place.
I hope that's really helpful. It's calm.
It's trying to, it's trying to simplify something that can feel
really complicated and really triggering for lots of people.
But that's a sort of little overview really of what I mean
when I talk about safety planning with parents.
But please take what you can from it.
Please keep it simple. And please do get in touch with
us if you want to explore this a little bit further or you want a
copy of a safety plan just to get you started.
OK, I'll see you in the next episode.