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Hello everyone, welcome to 
another episode of Teach Sleep. 

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Repeat. 
My name is. 

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Dylan, and my name is Hayden. 
It's not. 

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It's nasal, man. 
No. 

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It's nasal whistle. 
Man, can you hear this? 

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I've got a whistle this time. 
According to a bunch of our 

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listeners, we can hear it. 
Really. 

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Whistle at 51 minutes, Hayden. 
All right, Andrew, our Clayman 

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knows this time. 
Bloody listen to you do your 

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talking with your nasal passage.
Shall we go on? 

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Yeah, anyway, Hello. 
You sort it. 

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Yeah, yeah, I think so. 
Yeah. 

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I guess I'll find out. 
What they're writing in, 

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actually, I heard your diesel 
passage going 47 seconds. 

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Don't care. 
Centre Parks. 

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Ohh, God, the centre box maybe 
she just stepped straight in. 

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Yeah, that's been half time and 
I was actually gonna start with 

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this. 
So maybe I get your opinion. 

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I did a poll on Facebook and I 
didn't, I didn't, I don't know, 

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Facebook. 
Maybe I'll get your opinion. 

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I'm below the age of 40, so I 
don't go into the whole podcast 

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where you just refused to give 
me your opinion. 

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Do you think? 
What do you think anyway, on 

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Instagram? 
Because like I said, I'm not a 

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boomer. 
I did a little poll because we 

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get an extra week off in this 
half of them. 

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One of these phenomenas where 
you in in education where some 

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schools put all their insects. 
They back-to-back SO5 insects. 

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Don't know what I said. 
What did I say? 

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You said you put the S You 
pluralized insects rather than 

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days. 
Insects, they they just one day 

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really long. 
Day. 

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All of the insects in one day. 
We put all our inset days in a 

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row so we get an extra week off,
but the payoff is obviously 

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normally on it. 
They have to do training. 

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So our payoff is you have to do 
a club, you know, school and and

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you know, apparently it all 
works out. 

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Looks at the calculator directed
time and. 

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Stuff and we do it Twilight 
every. 

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Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
So we do training but we get an 

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extra week off. 
And so I just put a thing out 

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there about clubs. 
I said who does clubs then? 

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Because it's kind of leads on 
with the fact we're gonna get 

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this extra week off. 
We get to go centre parks where 

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the price is lower. 
Like it works out really well 

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for everyone. 
And anyway, I did this thing 

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about clubs and it really 
interested me that what 

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percentage of people do you 
think don't do a club and don't 

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have to? 
7080%. 

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Yeah, it was only 50. 
Ohh. 

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I was really shocked. 
I thought it would be much. 

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Higher. 
I thought school was I I've 

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never heard of it before. 
Yeah, we went to our school. 

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I was like, oh this is a weird 
thing that no one else. 

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Does so a whole bunch of people 
have said on this poll that they

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have to do a club and and that 
was 20% of people and I thought 

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one in five schools, one in five
teachers. 

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I just told yeah, you have to do
a collab and that that really 

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shocked me. 
And then we had a whole another 

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bunch about 18% said they don't 
have to, but they do a club 

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anyway. 
Right. 

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Classic. 
Yeah. 

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And then and then, oh, it's 
bumped up to about 60% now. 

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No, and I don't have to. 
I just was interesting. 

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What would you rather then? 
Cause we've done both. 

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Would you rather have to do a 
club? 

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Hmm. 
And then get an extra week off? 

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Yeah. 
Or that one or where you don't 

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have to do a club, but you have 
to do is. 

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Take the week off every time. 
Yeah, honestly, it's it's. 

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Something about time off being 
clumped together, which feels so

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much. 
Better in term time, like you 

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said, everything's cheaper. 
Yeah, that's basically it 

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really. 
Everything's cheaper. 

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I can actually go on holiday and
not be really annoyed and bitter

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the entire time. 
You're paying three times as 

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much as anybody else. 
It's kind of let me going to the

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dentist and being an NHS 
patient. 

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Sorry, dentist dental listeners,
can you? 

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Please listen, you just need to 
switch off dentists bit like 

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that. 
Isn't it really me going and 

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paying extra for the same 
procedure the guy got just 

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before me? 
Yeah, it's just like that, 

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Hayden. 
You remotely bitter about? 

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No, I'm not. 
I don't. 

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I don't even think about it 
anymore. 

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You know, it's great. 
I saw Labour doing some some 

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local like canvassing around 
this area and it's hilarious. 

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Like, whatever you think about 
politics, it's so funny when 

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people are trying to get your 
vote, yeah, because they just 

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say. 
Stuff. 

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Yeah, let's say anything. 
They just, they just say stuff 

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and it's and there's no 
explanation how they're gonna do

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it. 
And on top of the list for this 

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local area was we'll get you a 
dental. 

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I literally saw that as well. 
And you know when I saw it, how 

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the honest to God, the day that 
I was going to dentist, I'm not 

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even joking. 
And I was like I. 

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Can't see why because people 
like you would see him go, yeah,

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yeah, I'm gonna vote for you. 
And it's. 

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And honestly, you just see 
straight through now you're 

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like, yeah, what do you mean 
you're going to get me a dent? 

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What? 
What on earth? 

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Yeah, what are you talking 
about? 

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Speaking of politics, just for a
minute. 

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I know we're gonna talk about it
loads anyway, but I know I sent 

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you this last night, but I just 
have to shout out on TikTok. 

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Labour and Conservative have 
both made Tik Toks recently, OK?

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And obviously they've just got a
bunch of young people making 

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them because they're proper. 
Just silly. 

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Like proper meme culture. 
And I was cracking up last night

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looking through the. 
Label they actually funny. 

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They're genuinely funny, 
genuinely. 

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They obviously have stuff 
interspersed with like real 

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little clips, like try to get 
people to actually vote for 

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them. 
But there's so many memes on 

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there, and one of them that I 
just couldn't stop laughing. 

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What does Labour may have made 
this meme of Rishi Sunak. 

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And he's writing in something. 
So they were like ohh Rishi 

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Sunak diary. 
This is actually risky writing 

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in something. 
Yeah, just like a stock footage 

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of him writing some other way 
what he's actually. 

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Right, probably one of his 
actual videos. 

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Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 
But they were like cutting away 

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to like an over the shoulder 
shot. 

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And it was just him like in 
terrible handwriting, writing 

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about like really bad policies. 
Like he was like going to go to 

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going to go to Wales or Ireland,
wherever he went to and and 

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asked him about the rugby or 
something like that in brackets.

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Didn't know they they didn't 
qualify. 

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And it was, it was just 
absolutely rinsing him for this 

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stuff. 
And, and the, and the Tories 

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have now obviously been like got
to do it as well and they've 

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started making memes back. 
The problem is it's boomers 

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making them. 
You can really tell as well. 

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It's so funny. 
And they're just like copying 

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the Labour ones, but doing it 
back. 

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And everyone's like, come on, 
you're getting roasted in this 

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TikTok. 
War And also, who do they think 

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they're pandering to? 
Like, you can't simultaneously 

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tell them they have to sign up 
for national service. 

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But also, here's a funny meme 
though. 

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Here is a funny meme. 
Surprise, surprise, We see that 

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18th birthday today. 
You've got to go to war. 

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Surprise, surprise. 
So yeah, really, really funny if

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you want to talk. 
Check out the Labour page. 

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I just see one because 
obviously, you know, politicians

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do ridiculous things simply just
to get in the news during all 

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the build up. 
So they're like like I think 

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Keir Starmer was serving ice 
cream the other day and Ed Davey

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was like falling off a paddle 
board and all this kind of 

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stuff. 
It was one where Labour made a 

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meme out of it and it was Rishi 
Sunak went to a football day and

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was was dribbling around these 
codes. 

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I want to point the ball hit the
cone and stopped him and he was 

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like he got knee tripped over. 
And the caption was when when 

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you're trying to convince people
you can run the country but you 

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get tackled by a code. 
That's so good. 

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So basically apparently right, 
the Conservatives obviously well

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annoyed that getting rinsed on 
TikTok. 

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They've they've spent loads of 
time complaining and like 

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reporting all of the labour 
videos to get as many of them as

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removed as possible really. 
So Labour obviously now taking 

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the Mick out of that. 
They're like ohh, spending all 

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your time in the country are you
or or or trying to get all silly

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means removed on TikTok Like 
what's wrong with you? 

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Saw that, didn't you? 
No, I didn't. 

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I didn't. 
I didn't. 

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No, I never. 
Swear. 

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OK, no, the other one was Rishi 
Sunak went to Southampton to 

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like on the second day of this 
thing to launch like his 

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campaign and it was wet like 
where the Titanic was built or 

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something. 
Ohh Ireland, mate. 

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No, went to Ireland where the 
Titanic was built. 

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A reporter just said, is it is 
it a good metaphor for your 

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campaign that you're in the the 
birth place of the most famous 

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sinking ship in history? 
He was like OHH bearing him on 

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the day before he announced the 
general election in an absolute 

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downpour. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

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What? 
Analogy. 

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The only thing I'd seen 
beforehand of these Tik Toks 

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were from like my job. 
I listened to like my podcast 

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and you know. 
You listened to your podcast My.

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God, I can't speak my politics 
podcasts. 

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Yeah. 
And it's the the rest is 

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politics. 
Alastair Campbell, Rory Stewart.

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And the only thing I heard was 
from them and they were like, 

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this seems quite juvenile. 
Really. 

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Seems quite, quite is is it a 
bit like childish, really 

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serious politics? 
Is I think yes, of course. 

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That's the point. 
It's not for you. 

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It works for Labour cause all 
their voters are like under 20 

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so. 
Exactly. 

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You know what? 
I saw a fact. 

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Well, finish this little chat 
about politics right now. 

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Yeah. 
We. 

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For this for this second, but I 
saw a stat in it. 

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It was astounding to me. 
And this, I think this was true 

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in the last election. 
If only people under what age do

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you think? 
Hmm. 

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So if we only allow people under
a certain age, you're gonna 

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guess what age is to vote. 
Yeah. 

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At what point would we have to 
cut it off? 

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And then Labour would win. 
Labour would get more. 

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Votes. 
I see what you. 

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Mean So let's say obviously if 
you cut it off at under 20, 

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yeah, Labour would have a huge. 
Huge. 

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But if it was, if it was under 
80, right, then actually you 

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begin a huge population. 
Of So what point do you think? 

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At what age do you think the 
tide turns over where more more 

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there'd be more conservatives? 
Let's think about this. 

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Millennials, I imagine normally 
up to 40 of I think up to 40 

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safe, I'm going to go 45. 60. 
Ohh, really? 

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00:08:37,610 --> 00:08:41,710
More than I thought. 60 So if, 
if, if only people under 60 

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vote, Labour would would come 
would have more votes than the 

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Conservatives. 
The Conservatives win because 

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00:08:46,930 --> 00:08:48,360
old people go and vote. 
Well, how many? 

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What's the other? 
What the population splits like 

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how many? 
How much of our population is 

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over? 
60 There's a lot of, there's a 

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lot of people who are over 60 
cause of ageing population and 

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stuff, but the biggest 
contributing factor is the fact 

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that they've got nothing else to
do. 

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They retired, They, they live 
for this stuff. 

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00:09:01,070 --> 00:09:02,810
They read the Daily Mail every 
day and they go and vote on 

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00:09:02,820 --> 00:09:05,230
Boxing Day. 
Young people don't go and vote. 

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And that, that's one of the 
biggest points that already the 

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biggest point now to be made 
from that is that if you're 

229
00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:12,660
listening to this and you'll 
think, Oh yeah, I don't really 

230
00:09:12,670 --> 00:09:14,740
like conservatives because my 
life is absolutely crap for the 

231
00:09:14,750 --> 00:09:17,520
last 15 years, registered to 
vote and then go and vote for 

232
00:09:17,530 --> 00:09:19,700
someone. 
Like honestly, if more people 

233
00:09:19,710 --> 00:09:21,890
did it, it would, it wouldn't 
even be close. 

234
00:09:22,020 --> 00:09:25,350
It just, it blew my mind. 
Go and vote for care. 

235
00:09:25,980 --> 00:09:30,100
And this is, I say one more 
thing and the thing that's 

236
00:09:30,110 --> 00:09:34,000
annoying me slightly because I 
suppose five years ago in the 

237
00:09:34,010 --> 00:09:35,840
last election, I was very pro 
Labour. 

238
00:09:36,180 --> 00:09:39,050
I liked a lot of the policies 
that Corbyn was coming out with 

239
00:09:39,060 --> 00:09:41,530
in terms of social mobility and 
yeah, and, and helping poor 

240
00:09:41,540 --> 00:09:43,350
people. 
I'm, I'm very much for that 

241
00:09:43,420 --> 00:09:46,290
currently. 
I, I don't think that there's 

242
00:09:46,300 --> 00:09:49,210
many policies for Labour that 
are exciting me at all. 

243
00:09:49,260 --> 00:09:52,170
Like the, the prospect of a 
Labour government doesn't fill 

244
00:09:52,180 --> 00:09:54,430
me with like actual excitement. 
What's going to happen? 

245
00:09:54,540 --> 00:09:56,510
What fills me with excitement is
getting rid of the Tories. 

246
00:09:56,560 --> 00:09:59,250
And what kind of annoys me a 
little bit is when people, 

247
00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:02,100
you'll see me say something like
if you don't like the Tories, 

248
00:10:02,110 --> 00:10:04,520
make sure you vote them out. 
And then they go, ohh, another 

249
00:10:04,530 --> 00:10:06,720
pro Labour left thing. 
Or do you think Labour are gonna

250
00:10:06,730 --> 00:10:09,410
do anything? 
It's like, I never said that and

251
00:10:09,420 --> 00:10:11,340
not and not. 
No, I don't, I don't know. 

252
00:10:11,380 --> 00:10:14,030
I don't know that. 
But what I do know is I don't 

253
00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:16,580
want these guys to carry on. 
These guys who completely rinsed

254
00:10:16,590 --> 00:10:19,530
us and took like if you look at 
anything they've done, honest to

255
00:10:19,540 --> 00:10:21,560
God. 
And you mentioned the contracts 

256
00:10:21,570 --> 00:10:23,720
and stuff. 
That alone is enough for me to 

257
00:10:23,730 --> 00:10:26,140
be like, Oh my goodness me, get 
all of these people the 

258
00:10:26,150 --> 00:10:28,420
contracts. 
Yeah, the PPE contracts, COVID 

259
00:10:28,430 --> 00:10:30,200
contracts where they just 
literally lined the pockets of 

260
00:10:30,210 --> 00:10:32,220
their mates. 
They made-up companies like and 

261
00:10:32,230 --> 00:10:34,540
within two months they were 
getting a contract for PPE that 

262
00:10:34,550 --> 00:10:36,030
was never delivered. 
And she made for the. 

263
00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:38,600
Hundreds of millions. 
Yeah, it's like, cool, that's 

264
00:10:38,610 --> 00:10:40,630
enough goodbye. 
And they're really trying their 

265
00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:41,880
hardest to separate out, aren't 
they? 

266
00:10:41,930 --> 00:10:45,240
Like wishes a new guy. 
And what fascinates me is 

267
00:10:45,250 --> 00:10:48,380
Rishi's coming out now, like 
we've got this amazing new GP's 

268
00:10:48,390 --> 00:10:50,140
policy, we're going to get all 
the what? 

269
00:10:50,150 --> 00:10:52,810
What have you been doing? 
Yeah, you've had 14 years. 

270
00:10:52,820 --> 00:10:55,440
Today you have done that. 
Six months ago, three months 

271
00:10:55,450 --> 00:10:58,320
ago, you decided to make this 
election come up. 

272
00:10:58,390 --> 00:11:01,140
You could have not made this 
election come up and done done 

273
00:11:01,150 --> 00:11:03,930
this stuff. 
You're saying it's anyone buy 

274
00:11:03,940 --> 00:11:06,490
this stuff is beyond me. 
Yeah, it's mental anyway, but I 

275
00:11:06,500 --> 00:11:08,100
feel the same with with Labour 
as well. 

276
00:11:08,110 --> 00:11:09,790
Like like, you know, we're 
joking about the dentist. 

277
00:11:09,800 --> 00:11:12,310
Yeah, yeah, sure. 
I, I read that pamphlet I got 

278
00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:14,560
from my daughter, had the five 
things that he was going to do. 

279
00:11:14,570 --> 00:11:17,070
And I was like, I, I don't 
believe any of this. 

280
00:11:17,310 --> 00:11:19,210
Like you might do. 
It would be nice if you did, but

281
00:11:19,220 --> 00:11:21,670
every, everyone running is 
obviously going to say this. 

282
00:11:21,750 --> 00:11:25,810
Who would run and not say that? 
And not being funny. 

283
00:11:25,820 --> 00:11:28,810
Meaningless that our local 
candidate for Labour. 

284
00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:32,040
Who would be the one to replace?
The Conservative candidate is 

285
00:11:32,050 --> 00:11:36,350
one person out of 650 MP's, but 
she might stand up and be like, 

286
00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:38,520
we need dentists in Granny sit 
down. 

287
00:11:39,990 --> 00:11:41,850
Sorry, sorry. 
Would take everything else we're

288
00:11:41,860 --> 00:11:44,120
going to do. 
It's it's just not it's not 

289
00:11:44,130 --> 00:11:45,520
gonna happen. 
It's not gonna happen. 

290
00:11:45,530 --> 00:11:48,680
But I just my my final point. 
I just want this current 

291
00:11:48,690 --> 00:11:50,110
government to not be the 
government anymore. 

292
00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:51,460
Yeah. 
Then we can reset and moan at 

293
00:11:51,470 --> 00:11:52,440
the next stop. 
OK. 

294
00:11:52,450 --> 00:11:54,060
Yeah, I know not much is going 
to change. 

295
00:11:54,150 --> 00:11:56,680
No, but I realised that I'm not 
going to sit on the moment about

296
00:11:56,690 --> 00:11:58,340
online. 
I'm just gonna OK, Obviously 

297
00:11:58,350 --> 00:12:00,440
it's gonna be quite similar, but
I'd rather have people have a 

298
00:12:00,450 --> 00:12:02,540
go. 
Anything else happened this 

299
00:12:02,550 --> 00:12:04,980
week? 
Let me just check my notes. 

300
00:12:04,990 --> 00:12:07,720
Oh yeah, The funny thing about 
you. 

301
00:12:07,850 --> 00:12:12,850
So we went on, we, we went on a 
night out with our, with our 

302
00:12:12,860 --> 00:12:14,510
tutoring business. 
We took our tutors out. 

303
00:12:14,520 --> 00:12:16,630
Not all of them could come, but 
we took we took a good bunch of 

304
00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:17,600
them out. 
Yeah, the good ones. 

305
00:12:17,610 --> 00:12:20,210
Good. 
All the good ones came ohh. 

306
00:12:20,440 --> 00:12:22,450
No, that's not that's not true. 
The local ones. 

307
00:12:22,460 --> 00:12:23,830
The local ones, yeah. 
And. 

308
00:12:24,710 --> 00:12:27,070
Actually, don't. 
We do all over the country. 

309
00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:29,510
We do all over the country. 
We're global, we're not. 

310
00:12:30,420 --> 00:12:32,640
And we went to somewhere called 
Boom Battle Bar. 

311
00:12:32,680 --> 00:12:35,080
So if you've heard of that. 
It would have sounded more 

312
00:12:35,090 --> 00:12:37,590
boomer. 
Let me just check my notes from 

313
00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:40,230
my spectacles. 
But that's what. 

314
00:12:40,350 --> 00:12:43,670
It turns out they did some fun 
things at this place activities.

315
00:12:43,710 --> 00:12:45,480
Anyway, it's pretty cool. 
We're just Max hurrying. 

316
00:12:45,530 --> 00:12:50,440
We did some darts, we did some 
crazy golf, shuffleboard and a 

317
00:12:50,450 --> 00:12:52,300
bit of karaoke at the end. 
But we made a bit of a 

318
00:12:52,310 --> 00:12:54,150
competition was eight of us and 
we. 

319
00:12:54,300 --> 00:12:55,500
Think it was taking it 
seriously. 

320
00:12:55,510 --> 00:12:57,260
Well, I don't know, because on 
the way there, it's funny 

321
00:12:57,270 --> 00:12:59,060
actually, because you kept going
on about how it was a 

322
00:12:59,070 --> 00:13:01,390
competition between me and you. 
We're going to have three others

323
00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:02,920
with each of us and teams of 
four. 

324
00:13:03,970 --> 00:13:08,420
Dylan, honest, he's quite 
competitive and I will say he's 

325
00:13:08,430 --> 00:13:10,540
generally pretty good at stuff. 
Like you're good at ohh, you 

326
00:13:10,550 --> 00:13:12,400
gotta sports and you play a lot 
of sports and you're very 

327
00:13:12,410 --> 00:13:13,580
competitive. 
You like them. 

328
00:13:13,630 --> 00:13:15,350
We go squash and I play squash 
rages. 

329
00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:17,220
You play squash for two weeks 
and then start beating me and I 

330
00:13:17,230 --> 00:13:20,140
get really annoyed. 
Absolutely dreadful. 

331
00:13:20,190 --> 00:13:22,640
Like you lost. 
You lost literally everything. 

332
00:13:22,650 --> 00:13:24,860
Like you got you became 8th 
place in most stuff. 

333
00:13:24,930 --> 00:13:29,890
Yeah, I, I've through, I threw 
10 axes in a row, right? 

334
00:13:30,010 --> 00:13:33,900
And I didn't land one after my 
second act, so I had to 8 times 

335
00:13:33,910 --> 00:13:36,560
in a row, walk up on your own 
when you're an actor and 

336
00:13:36,570 --> 00:13:39,090
obviously with everyone else 
watching you, eight times in a 

337
00:13:39,100 --> 00:13:40,740
row to throw out. 
It just bounced out right. 

338
00:13:40,750 --> 00:13:43,180
Just progressively was like my 
smile is getting less and less. 

339
00:13:43,190 --> 00:13:45,050
It was convincing, really 
awkward because I got eight in a

340
00:13:45,060 --> 00:13:45,780
row. 
Bang. 

341
00:13:45,790 --> 00:13:48,360
Like literally, you were three 
points, three points, three 

342
00:13:48,370 --> 00:13:49,900
points, bang in the middle. 
Then you came second. 

343
00:13:49,970 --> 00:13:51,660
Did in the end, yeah. 
And then? 

344
00:13:51,730 --> 00:13:54,220
Andrew, Mr Knows wisely points 
her outer. 

345
00:13:54,370 --> 00:13:57,170
When we said, when we said the 
good ones could come. 

346
00:13:57,270 --> 00:14:03,620
Well, but yeah, the he, he 
brought a game with him that we 

347
00:14:03,630 --> 00:14:05,830
were playing and it's called 
don't get got where you get a 

348
00:14:05,840 --> 00:14:08,040
secret mission basically. 
Well, you get 6 secret missions 

349
00:14:08,050 --> 00:14:10,350
that you got to try and complete
drawing the night. 

350
00:14:10,460 --> 00:14:12,550
And once you get three, you win 
or something like that. 

351
00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:15,150
But the person running our game 
who was like our host for the 

352
00:14:15,160 --> 00:14:21,600
evening, she was called Chloe. 
Andrew just decided randomly 

353
00:14:21,610 --> 00:14:25,990
during our axe throwing halfway 
through to give her a a secret 

354
00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:27,590
mission. 
Just one Just let you go. 

355
00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:29,030
We're doing this. 
And it was random. 

356
00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:30,170
He just. 
Completely random. 

357
00:14:30,180 --> 00:14:32,530
The bag, yeah, had a had a bag 
proper teacher had like a 

358
00:14:32,540 --> 00:14:34,770
plastic wallet full of them. 
Yeah, really organised and he 

359
00:14:34,780 --> 00:14:36,700
took one out. 
And so she took it and we just 

360
00:14:36,710 --> 00:14:38,730
obviously forgot about it. 
Finished our game. 

361
00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:41,110
Andrew won. 
Who came last? 

362
00:14:41,270 --> 00:14:43,870
You came last place. 
You out of everyone. 

363
00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:47,510
And so she said, right, Kate 
winner, who was it? 

364
00:14:47,520 --> 00:14:48,810
And it was Andrew put his hand 
up. 

365
00:14:48,820 --> 00:14:50,670
Cool. 
Comes to the front, loser. 

366
00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:52,340
Who was it? 
And I was like, yeah, I'll put 

367
00:14:52,350 --> 00:14:55,220
my hand up. 
And she went right come to the 

368
00:14:55,230 --> 00:14:57,340
front. 
And then she got they had like 

369
00:14:57,350 --> 00:15:00,440
these jugs of water that you 
could press down to add pressure

370
00:15:00,450 --> 00:15:03,280
and it shot water out. 
Yeah, so lucky bottle right on 

371
00:15:03,290 --> 00:15:06,200
North. 
You gotta. 

372
00:15:06,210 --> 00:15:09,300
Remember. 
A spray bottle. 

373
00:15:10,010 --> 00:15:11,780
Of water which when applied 
pressure. 

374
00:15:11,790 --> 00:15:13,970
Before you press this button and
it just like sprayed out. 

375
00:15:13,980 --> 00:15:16,480
It was crazy. 
You air pressure or something? 

376
00:15:19,060 --> 00:15:21,670
So she gave it to Andrew and 
said, right, winner gets to 

377
00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:24,010
spray the loser. 
And I was like bloody caught, 

378
00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:26,910
pretty difficult. 
So Andrews there, he sprays me, 

379
00:15:26,980 --> 00:15:30,430
water all over my face. 
And then Chloe just goes, yeah, 

380
00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:32,270
made that completely. 
That's my secret mission. 

381
00:15:34,070 --> 00:15:37,020
So her secret mission was to get
someone else to spray someone 

382
00:15:37,030 --> 00:15:39,270
else in with water in the face. 
Yeah. 

383
00:15:39,330 --> 00:15:42,180
And and and she did it like, and
it was just everyone fell for 

384
00:15:42,190 --> 00:15:42,540
it. 
And I was. 

385
00:15:42,550 --> 00:15:44,840
And so that wasn't even a thing.
So I'm stood there with water 

386
00:15:44,850 --> 00:15:46,750
dripping off my face. 
And I was like, well, so this 

387
00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:48,460
isn't this isn't a normal thing 
to happen. 

388
00:15:48,470 --> 00:15:50,220
No, no, It's just soaking wet. 
Thank you. 

389
00:15:50,230 --> 00:15:53,660
She just happened to have a 
spray bottle filled with water 

390
00:15:53,670 --> 00:15:55,040
there. 
And I was like, why do you even 

391
00:15:55,050 --> 00:15:56,760
have that if it's not for like 
some sort of force? 

392
00:15:56,770 --> 00:15:58,590
They watered and she was like, 
yeah, we just, we just spread 

393
00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:00,500
down the board. 
And I was like, that's so funny 

394
00:16:00,510 --> 00:16:03,020
that you had you got that card. 
It was perfect for you. 

395
00:16:03,330 --> 00:16:05,070
And Dylan was wet. 
And then from that point, you 

396
00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:07,070
just carried on losing. 
And the best bit was the the 

397
00:16:07,080 --> 00:16:10,580
moment that I saw your soul 
leave your body like your eyes 

398
00:16:10,590 --> 00:16:12,050
sort of like they're, they're 
they were dead. 

399
00:16:12,060 --> 00:16:14,460
I was there was nothing there. 
There was nothing left right 

400
00:16:14,470 --> 00:16:16,360
when we're playing crazy golf, 
which was like three or four 

401
00:16:16,370 --> 00:16:20,290
games in at this point. 
And and Dylan spent a solid like

402
00:16:20,300 --> 00:16:24,150
30 seconds completely ripping 
one of our shooters for all they

403
00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:26,170
had to do What you had to hit 
the ball at this hill that was 

404
00:16:26,180 --> 00:16:30,420
maybe like 22 foot with this 
massive wide opening to go into 

405
00:16:30,430 --> 00:16:32,110
this metal tube. 
It was just a silly one at the 

406
00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:33,470
end. 
She missed like five in a row. 

407
00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:34,010
It was. 
Funny. 

408
00:16:34,020 --> 00:16:36,920
Missed 5 and at one point even 
like managed to chip the ball on

409
00:16:36,930 --> 00:16:39,640
top of this metal thing and we 
will see laughing at her. 

410
00:16:39,650 --> 00:16:43,520
And Dylan was really taking the 
Mick went up last and honestly 

411
00:16:43,530 --> 00:16:46,860
did the exact same thing. 
He was like 5 or 6 times chipped

412
00:16:46,870 --> 00:16:48,760
on top of the thing. 
She was lovely and she was 

413
00:16:48,770 --> 00:16:51,410
absolutely rinsing you back. 
And I just, I just looked at him

414
00:16:51,420 --> 00:16:52,840
thinking this is the man that 
plays golf. 

415
00:16:52,850 --> 00:16:55,900
This is the man that bought a 
nice, nice set of golf clubs and

416
00:16:55,910 --> 00:16:58,140
goes to the driving range and he
can't hit up. 

417
00:16:58,150 --> 00:17:01,080
He can't put a ball too foot 
into a massive hole. 

418
00:17:02,610 --> 00:17:04,670
Good fun, Hayden. 
And the last thing I will say 

419
00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:07,910
about that evening is we ended 
in karaoke and we're a bunch of 

420
00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:10,329
teachers saying the karaoke 
room, having a drink and we 

421
00:17:10,339 --> 00:17:13,470
found cauliflowers fluffy on the
karaoke machine and made it real

422
00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:15,089
about it. 
Go to our Instagram at Teach St 

423
00:17:15,099 --> 00:17:17,970
repeat podcast. 
Five teachers sat there, I've 

424
00:17:17,980 --> 00:17:21,390
got the mic and we're literally 
seeing cauliflowers fluffy and 

425
00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:23,349
cabbages green, and then you 
just go. 

426
00:17:25,150 --> 00:17:28,300
In the video. 
Because obviously there's no 

427
00:17:28,310 --> 00:17:29,960
idea what's on our socials. 
Yeah, watch that. 

428
00:17:29,970 --> 00:17:32,190
Watch it. 
Yeah, I thought that was, I was 

429
00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:33,300
really funny. 
That was really. 

430
00:17:33,310 --> 00:17:33,730
Funny. 
Yeah. 

431
00:17:33,740 --> 00:17:37,960
So good night out. 
Yeah, and, and jokes aside, our 

432
00:17:37,970 --> 00:17:40,530
tutors are unbelievably good, 
all of them, aren't they? 

433
00:17:40,620 --> 00:17:42,760
Yeah, brilliant. 
Yeah. 

434
00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:44,600
Trying to be sentimental for a 
minute. 

435
00:17:44,980 --> 00:17:47,100
They are great and we're very. 
Lucky and we're really 

436
00:17:47,110 --> 00:17:51,120
passionate, I think about 
providing tutoring opportunities

437
00:17:51,130 --> 00:17:54,740
to these people because we know 
how, I don't know about you, but

438
00:17:54,750 --> 00:17:57,540
in terms of teaching, I just 
think it's unbelievable the 

439
00:17:57,550 --> 00:17:59,330
amount of work you do for the 
money you get paid for this kind

440
00:17:59,340 --> 00:18:00,430
of stuff. 
So providing those 

441
00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:04,320
opportunities, I hope they I 
hope they think that it's a good

442
00:18:04,330 --> 00:18:05,860
deal. 
I'm sure it isn't, but they're 

443
00:18:05,870 --> 00:18:06,720
great. 
They're amazing. 

444
00:18:07,020 --> 00:18:10,360
If they don't, as far as Dylan 
sentiment goes. 

445
00:18:10,370 --> 00:18:16,090
You're a teacher, suck it up. 
Yeah, So alright anyway, I hope 

446
00:18:16,100 --> 00:18:20,880
you all get the gist of this 
like hearted funny joking thing.

447
00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:25,570
Dylan said to me before this 
episode hidden stop waffling. 

448
00:18:25,580 --> 00:18:27,540
You gotta stop waffling so much 
because I when I make the old 

449
00:18:27,550 --> 00:18:29,910
clips for Instagram, you know, 
you often go on it. 

450
00:18:29,920 --> 00:18:31,810
Look listen to. 
Him Let's move on to the main 

451
00:18:31,820 --> 00:18:36,720
bulk of our episode. 
Hayden play the Jingle, right? 

452
00:18:36,730 --> 00:18:40,060
So you've seen the title of the 
episode, Do we need a new 

453
00:18:40,070 --> 00:18:42,220
national curriculum? 
It's been about 10 years since 

454
00:18:42,230 --> 00:18:44,620
the last one was introduced. 
Obviously it was introduced by 

455
00:18:44,630 --> 00:18:47,530
the previous coalition 
government from 2010 who were 

456
00:18:47,540 --> 00:18:49,910
working on it for a few years. 
Michael Gove spearheaded it. 

457
00:18:50,990 --> 00:18:55,320
Lots of Flack at the time from 
people in education, but it's 

458
00:18:55,330 --> 00:18:57,640
just feeling now that perhaps 
with the new government coming 

459
00:18:57,650 --> 00:19:00,560
in it, would it be something 
sensible to do? 

460
00:19:00,570 --> 00:19:03,950
So before we dive into the 
actual realistic side of it, 

461
00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:07,320
which will be the bulk of this 
conversation just on the surface

462
00:19:07,330 --> 00:19:10,050
level of our current national 
curriculum. 

463
00:19:10,090 --> 00:19:11,800
Hmm. 
And what are your thoughts on 

464
00:19:11,810 --> 00:19:13,110
it? 
Is it suitable? 

465
00:19:13,120 --> 00:19:15,360
Do you think that it does the 
job or do you think that it 

466
00:19:15,370 --> 00:19:18,240
should be replaced? 
I don't think it's a bad 

467
00:19:18,250 --> 00:19:20,000
national curriculum. 
I don't want to jump in and be 

468
00:19:20,010 --> 00:19:22,570
like, Oh yes, obviously because 
the Tories made it or you ever 

469
00:19:22,580 --> 00:19:25,690
made it, whatever. 
I think there are some areas 

470
00:19:25,700 --> 00:19:28,900
that could definitely be 
changed, some areas that could 

471
00:19:28,910 --> 00:19:31,040
be maybe improved and some areas
that could be scrapped. 

472
00:19:31,050 --> 00:19:32,380
So I don't think it's a terrible
curriculum. 

473
00:19:32,390 --> 00:19:35,110
If I think about our kids, 
right, the average kid, they, 

474
00:19:35,120 --> 00:19:37,410
they get a pretty decent 
education, especially through 

475
00:19:37,420 --> 00:19:38,760
primary school. 
I suppose we can't really talk 

476
00:19:38,770 --> 00:19:40,650
too much about secondary school.
We know a little bit about the 

477
00:19:40,660 --> 00:19:43,890
curriculum, but primary school 
is our thing. 

478
00:19:43,930 --> 00:19:45,590
I don't know, That's my guy. 
It's a bit all over the place, 

479
00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:46,900
you know, It's not very good 
answer, sorry. 

480
00:19:46,910 --> 00:19:48,780
But how are you feeling about it
then? 

481
00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:51,880
This thing wasn't really 
something I was thinking about 

482
00:19:51,890 --> 00:19:53,600
until someone else brought it up
again. 

483
00:19:53,610 --> 00:19:55,720
I think it was people who aren't
in education. 

484
00:19:55,760 --> 00:19:57,770
They were talking about general 
election because obviously loads

485
00:19:57,780 --> 00:19:59,480
of content out there at the 
minute, people just talking 

486
00:19:59,490 --> 00:20:01,540
about what's going on at the 
minute because there's gonna be 

487
00:20:01,550 --> 00:20:04,280
a new government. 
And it was something someone 

488
00:20:04,290 --> 00:20:07,760
mentioned again who wasn't in 
school and they said they were 

489
00:20:07,770 --> 00:20:09,190
asked the question in a Q&A 
special. 

490
00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:10,700
They're just like a political 
analyst. 

491
00:20:11,230 --> 00:20:13,420
And the question was should we 
have a national curriculum? 

492
00:20:13,430 --> 00:20:15,440
It's been 10 years, is getting a
bit old. 

493
00:20:15,450 --> 00:20:18,010
Could we update it could be 
modernise it and it's very much 

494
00:20:18,020 --> 00:20:21,370
in the prism of pure. 
I guess is where the question 

495
00:20:21,380 --> 00:20:23,790
comes from. 
It was like pure utopian kind of

496
00:20:23,850 --> 00:20:26,290
view of the curriculum of, you 
know, of course we could have a 

497
00:20:26,300 --> 00:20:27,810
new curriculum. 
Do you think we could, we could 

498
00:20:27,820 --> 00:20:30,270
modernise how we teach history 
in our in our role in the world,

499
00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:33,030
move away from the whole empire 
thing and not have a Britain 

500
00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,830
centric thing where Britain was 
always amazing and look at these

501
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:38,310
things we did. 
And and like, I couldn't really 

502
00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:40,480
disagree with anything this 
person was saying in terms of it

503
00:20:40,490 --> 00:20:42,980
would obviously modernising the 
curriculum in that way would be 

504
00:20:42,990 --> 00:20:45,350
good because even though only 10
years ago, I would argue it's 

505
00:20:45,360 --> 00:20:46,570
quite an old fashioned 
curriculum. 

506
00:20:46,620 --> 00:20:48,350
Yeah. 
Think Gove was rooted in his own

507
00:20:48,360 --> 00:20:51,280
experiences of education and the
private schools, you know, that 

508
00:20:51,290 --> 00:20:54,080
he went to and and that kind of 
it was almost it was almost like

509
00:20:54,090 --> 00:20:56,980
coined a Victorian almost kind 
of a Victorian era one. 

510
00:20:56,990 --> 00:21:00,540
I think someone mentioned before
one part of this new push of the

511
00:21:00,550 --> 00:21:03,910
the curriculum was like it was 
literally given as an example by

512
00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:07,440
the government to how you could 
punish children as a sanction 

513
00:21:07,450 --> 00:21:10,760
would be laps around the field. 
Like like the whole thing was 

514
00:21:10,770 --> 00:21:13,780
like, I mean people basically 
saying this is so old like, of 

515
00:21:13,790 --> 00:21:17,000
course you shouldn't punish have
have exercise as a punishment is

516
00:21:17,010 --> 00:21:18,060
so backwards. 
Yeah. 

517
00:21:18,110 --> 00:21:19,980
And that kind of sticks with me 
a little bit. 

518
00:21:19,990 --> 00:21:22,120
And I was like, cool. 
And on, on the surface, I, I 

519
00:21:22,130 --> 00:21:25,430
don't think anyone suggesting we
should change the curriculum. 

520
00:21:26,060 --> 00:21:28,370
I don't think you could say to 
someone that's automatically 

521
00:21:28,380 --> 00:21:30,090
bad. 
And I, and I would argue that 

522
00:21:30,100 --> 00:21:33,470
you could make it good, but then
you end up in the realm of like 

523
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:35,970
realism and, and it's like, OK, 
well, how would we make sure it 

524
00:21:35,980 --> 00:21:38,290
was actually good? 
What would be defined as good? 

525
00:21:38,300 --> 00:21:39,810
Like what, what should we get 
rid of? 

526
00:21:39,820 --> 00:21:42,130
What should we do? 
That's where it gets murky. 

527
00:21:42,140 --> 00:21:44,850
I think what do you think needs 
more attention, the core 

528
00:21:44,860 --> 00:21:47,730
curriculums or the wider 
curriculum stuff in your 

529
00:21:47,740 --> 00:21:49,540
opinion? 
Like if anyone listening is not 

530
00:21:49,550 --> 00:21:50,700
maybe in the teaching world 
correctly. 

531
00:21:50,710 --> 00:21:54,240
We're talking about maths and 
English mainly and also science,

532
00:21:54,250 --> 00:21:56,480
even though that's kind of, to 
be honest with you, been sort of

533
00:21:56,490 --> 00:21:58,640
pushed out of the core 
curriculum really. 

534
00:21:59,270 --> 00:22:00,570
So let's just think about 
English. 

535
00:22:00,580 --> 00:22:01,480
What do you think needs more 
work? 

536
00:22:01,490 --> 00:22:03,730
Maths and English or kind of 
everything? 

537
00:22:03,740 --> 00:22:07,120
Else, I think they both need, I 
think they both need work that's

538
00:22:07,130 --> 00:22:10,620
very different and I think it 
should be separated completely. 

539
00:22:11,210 --> 00:22:13,700
So in general, you know, do we 
need a national curriculum? 

540
00:22:13,710 --> 00:22:16,620
I don't think we need one, but I
think it could be done really 

541
00:22:16,630 --> 00:22:18,620
well. 
So now we're going to like you 

542
00:22:18,630 --> 00:22:20,170
saying, think about what 
actually needs to be done. 

543
00:22:20,180 --> 00:22:23,210
Then I would separate maths and 
English to the to the rest of 

544
00:22:23,220 --> 00:22:25,350
the curriculum, honestly would 
especially for primary. 

545
00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:27,690
And anyone who looks at the 
curriculum will kind of probably

546
00:22:27,700 --> 00:22:29,050
know what I'm gonna say straight
away. 

547
00:22:29,120 --> 00:22:32,350
Because if you look at the 
national curriculum there, the 

548
00:22:32,360 --> 00:22:34,850
national curriculum is about 200
pages long for primary school. 

549
00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,530
OK, I'm, I'm gonna rough 
spitball here. 

550
00:22:37,580 --> 00:22:41,720
Around 60 odd pages of maths, 
around 6070 odd pages in 

551
00:22:41,730 --> 00:22:44,610
English, and then there's quite 
a few pages for science as well.

552
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:47,010
Yeah. 
And then when it comes to the 

553
00:22:47,220 --> 00:22:50,090
wider curriculum, the geography 
curriculum is literally one or 

554
00:22:50,100 --> 00:22:52,110
two sides. 
The history curriculum is one or

555
00:22:52,120 --> 00:22:54,710
two, the whole of primary. 
So we're talking like one 60th 

556
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:56,860
of the maths. 
So when you ask me what we 

557
00:22:56,870 --> 00:22:59,890
should do for core curriculum, 
English and maths, my gut 

558
00:22:59,900 --> 00:23:02,090
instinct is it needs to just 
simply be stripped back. 

559
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:05,690
Yeah, I, I think the content, 
there's nothing on there that I 

560
00:23:05,700 --> 00:23:07,170
think it's bad. 
I think it all makes 

561
00:23:07,180 --> 00:23:09,610
progressions sense. 
I think it's fine. 

562
00:23:09,700 --> 00:23:11,990
What I would say is though, it 
probably goes up to, I reckon 

563
00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:13,790
year eight or nine. 
Like what? 

564
00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:17,330
Honestly, I would add some extra
stuff obviously in 7-8 and nine,

565
00:23:17,340 --> 00:23:19,760
but not just that curriculum, 
but there are certain things in 

566
00:23:19,770 --> 00:23:21,630
this English and maths 
curriculum I would spread out 

567
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:23,080
and I would drop from primary 
school. 

568
00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:27,440
Now, my problem with that is, 
although I think most teachers 

569
00:23:27,450 --> 00:23:30,260
will be in agreement with that 
statement, that will never 

570
00:23:30,270 --> 00:23:31,620
happen when a new government. 
Does. 

571
00:23:31,630 --> 00:23:33,330
Of course it won't. 
Well, why not tell me that? 

572
00:23:33,340 --> 00:23:35,260
There's an obvious reason why, 
but you you tell. 

573
00:23:35,270 --> 00:23:37,620
Me, it would be such an easy 
thing to do, right? 

574
00:23:37,630 --> 00:23:39,620
In terms of wouldn't really cost
anything. 

575
00:23:39,870 --> 00:23:42,090
You would just say to teachers, 
look, don't do this, focus on 

576
00:23:42,100 --> 00:23:44,420
the other stuff, which teachers 
are pretty much probably doing 

577
00:23:44,430 --> 00:23:47,530
anyway. 
The problem is it's horrendous 

578
00:23:47,540 --> 00:23:49,640
optics. 
Yeah, if you're a government and

579
00:23:49,650 --> 00:23:52,830
you come in and you know, 
whether Labour want to try and 

580
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,570
do something for education or 
not, if they if they come in and

581
00:23:55,580 --> 00:23:58,000
literally go to teachers and 
say, well, what do you want? 

582
00:23:58,120 --> 00:23:59,690
You want English and maths 
stripped back? 

583
00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:01,340
OK, yeah, just drop all that 
stuff. 

584
00:24:01,620 --> 00:24:03,420
Crack on. 
An easier curriculum. 

585
00:24:03,460 --> 00:24:05,850
Horrendous. 
Yeah, an easier curriculum. 

586
00:24:05,900 --> 00:24:08,330
Can you imagine what the Daily? 
Mail Yeah, I'll be the Tories 

587
00:24:08,460 --> 00:24:10,760
that de skilling our children. 
Yeah. 

588
00:24:10,770 --> 00:24:12,880
That's what they say. 
They wouldn't hear any at the 

589
00:24:12,890 --> 00:24:13,600
end of it, would you? 
And. 

590
00:24:13,610 --> 00:24:15,930
There's no way they do that. 
They they, they they literally. 

591
00:24:16,020 --> 00:24:17,970
Really political suicide, even 
though hilariously is kind of 

592
00:24:17,980 --> 00:24:20,280
what's needed. 
I think we're, I think about, I 

593
00:24:20,290 --> 00:24:22,520
mean, English is, is actually 
the more obvious one to me 

594
00:24:22,710 --> 00:24:25,660
having having taught year 6 
English for a couple of years 

595
00:24:25,670 --> 00:24:28,480
now. 
I just, I just can't get over 

596
00:24:28,490 --> 00:24:30,630
the fact that they have to be 
perfect writers by the end of 

597
00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:32,670
year six. 
I'm not exaggerating if you're 

598
00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:34,110
not in education. 
I'm not just being the old 

599
00:24:34,120 --> 00:24:36,480
classic teachers moaning, 
exaggerating about the of course

600
00:24:36,490 --> 00:24:38,160
not perfect writers. 
They've got years of secondary 

601
00:24:38,170 --> 00:24:39,340
school yet. 
I'm not joking. 

602
00:24:39,410 --> 00:24:42,270
They have to be to be expected 
at the end of year six. 

603
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:44,100
You're. 
Writing age expected age 

604
00:24:44,110 --> 00:24:46,930
expected any child should. 
Be all supposed to achieve. 

605
00:24:46,940 --> 00:24:48,280
They're supposed to achieve 
that. 

606
00:24:48,350 --> 00:24:51,550
You have to be a perfect writer.
You have to have mastered all 

607
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:54,470
punctuation, your sentences. 
Sentences have to be 

608
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:58,490
consistently perfectly coherent 
with a wide variety of sentence 

609
00:24:58,500 --> 00:25:01,370
structures. 
I just, it's just mad to me. 

610
00:25:01,380 --> 00:25:04,780
I always think, and maybe I 
could be humbled by a secondary 

611
00:25:04,790 --> 00:25:07,840
school teacher, but I genuinely 
don't understand what they do at

612
00:25:07,850 --> 00:25:09,590
secondary school after that is 
like, what's the point? 

613
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:12,650
Some of the writers in my class 
now, I look at them, I think, 

614
00:25:12,700 --> 00:25:15,350
cool, I, I couldn't write at 
that level by university level. 

615
00:25:15,420 --> 00:25:17,610
I just couldn't, I just couldn't
do it yet. 

616
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:19,070
And they're already writing on 
that level. 

617
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:20,940
And I'm like, I don't. 
Know that's a bad thing though, 

618
00:25:20,950 --> 00:25:21,880
that you couldn't write that 
like. 

619
00:25:21,890 --> 00:25:23,210
That maybe, yeah, because they 
can. 

620
00:25:23,220 --> 00:25:25,390
And maybe maybe if I was pushing
a different way I could have. 

621
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:26,800
There's always that counter 
argument. 

622
00:25:26,810 --> 00:25:29,410
But what I don't understand is 
what on earth are we supposed to

623
00:25:29,420 --> 00:25:31,650
do in second school after that? 
And you don't mean secondary 

624
00:25:31,660 --> 00:25:34,410
school aren't doing anything? 
No, you mean we've done it? 

625
00:25:34,420 --> 00:25:35,770
We've done. 
We've completed writing. 

626
00:25:35,780 --> 00:25:39,790
And, and the problem with that 
is not, I don't actually think 

627
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:41,230
many children are getting to 
that level. 

628
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:43,490
We've got this aid expected. 
And the whole idea is all 

629
00:25:43,500 --> 00:25:45,860
children or as close to as all 
children as possible are 

630
00:25:45,870 --> 00:25:47,110
supposed to be able to reach 
this standard. 

631
00:25:47,150 --> 00:25:50,330
But realistically, I don't 
think, I think less than 50% of 

632
00:25:50,340 --> 00:25:52,040
children can actually reach that
standard. 

633
00:25:52,050 --> 00:25:54,930
We've just got this crazy high 
bar and we can talk about all 

634
00:25:54,940 --> 00:25:57,190
the reasons that, you know, 
maybe the stats still look all 

635
00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:00,210
right, like the national average
is like 70 odd percent still. 

636
00:26:00,220 --> 00:26:02,910
And I'm like, yeah, because 
teachers are on their knees 

637
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:05,790
bending rules to make to make 
this writing look good. 

638
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,070
It's like then the kids aren't 
really that level. 

639
00:26:08,140 --> 00:26:10,140
We're just pretending. 
So it would look terrible if 

640
00:26:10,150 --> 00:26:12,910
Labour terrible if Labour came 
in or whoever comes in probably 

641
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:14,120
be Labour, realistically. 
Yeah. 

642
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:16,690
And we're like, oh, we recognise
this problem. 

643
00:26:16,700 --> 00:26:19,090
They're very logical head on. 
We can see actually that the 

644
00:26:19,100 --> 00:26:21,490
standards for six children are 
just absurdly high. 

645
00:26:21,500 --> 00:26:23,930
It puts loads of pressure on 
teachers, encourages cheating 

646
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:25,730
because no one can actually 
reach this standard to a 

647
00:26:25,740 --> 00:26:28,410
national average of 70% or 
whatever, really. 

648
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,250
So we're going to strip it back.
We've realised that they've got 

649
00:26:31,260 --> 00:26:33,670
another six years of school 
after this, so we can probably 

650
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:36,840
slow down a little bit and the 
Year 6 standard is now more like

651
00:26:36,850 --> 00:26:38,800
maybe the end of year 4 standard
and you just need to get them 

652
00:26:38,810 --> 00:26:40,340
really, really good at these 
things. 

653
00:26:40,410 --> 00:26:43,660
And maybe more creative and more
interesting and and and more 

654
00:26:43,670 --> 00:26:45,900
imaginative with their. 
Writing, I always compare that, 

655
00:26:45,910 --> 00:26:48,200
and I know I've said this 
before, but I always compare my 

656
00:26:48,210 --> 00:26:51,340
year seven books with what the 
kids do now because I just think

657
00:26:51,350 --> 00:26:53,820
it's fascinating how when I was 
at school it was about 

658
00:26:53,830 --> 00:26:55,930
creativity. 
And that's one thing that was 

659
00:26:55,940 --> 00:26:58,640
good about my writing in year 
seven, was really creative, had 

660
00:26:58,650 --> 00:27:00,800
nice ideas in it, but the 
spelling, punctuation wasn't 

661
00:27:00,810 --> 00:27:02,580
that good. 
I still had lots of things to 

662
00:27:02,590 --> 00:27:04,630
learn and I learned them at 
secondary school slowly. 

663
00:27:05,420 --> 00:27:07,320
And I just think, I look at that
and I compare it with some of 

664
00:27:07,330 --> 00:27:09,690
the kids writing now, which is 
really robotic, extremely 

665
00:27:09,700 --> 00:27:11,530
formulaic, but perfectly 
punctuated. 

666
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,450
No creativity. 
They struggle with creativity so

667
00:27:14,460 --> 00:27:16,730
much. 
Because it's not built in to to 

668
00:27:16,740 --> 00:27:19,680
teach them how to be creative. 
Yeah, we can't sit and moan as 

669
00:27:19,690 --> 00:27:22,360
teachers and be like, oh God, 
they can't have any ideas 

670
00:27:22,370 --> 00:27:24,130
themselves. 
So, yeah, because we spent the 

671
00:27:24,140 --> 00:27:26,410
last three weeks talking about 
where prepositions go in a 

672
00:27:26,420 --> 00:27:28,880
sentence and how to add to our 
word to make it past tense. 

673
00:27:29,570 --> 00:27:31,270
Like what? 
What do you, what do you think's

674
00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:33,160
gonna happen? 
Honestly, that's all they're 

675
00:27:33,170 --> 00:27:35,870
thinking about is the, the 
actual, you know, building 

676
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:37,680
blocks of how to build that 
sentence. 

677
00:27:37,690 --> 00:27:40,340
Yeah. 
They've got no outer level stuff

678
00:27:40,350 --> 00:27:42,160
of thinking of the whole 
picture, because we do. 

679
00:27:42,170 --> 00:27:44,850
So much sentence level work and 
how to make the colon go in the 

680
00:27:44,860 --> 00:27:45,730
right place. 
Ohh. 

681
00:27:45,740 --> 00:27:47,320
Because Collins have to join two
things together. 

682
00:27:47,330 --> 00:27:48,660
OK, cool. 
What's actually going to go in 

683
00:27:48,670 --> 00:27:50,370
your sentences though? 
Yeah, that's the interesting 

684
00:27:50,380 --> 00:27:51,440
bit. 
I mean, a lot of anxious kids 

685
00:27:51,450 --> 00:27:56,370
over the years, a lot of anxious
kids who are so, so drilled into

686
00:27:56,380 --> 00:27:58,570
them that they have to get the 
punctuation and like, structure 

687
00:27:58,580 --> 00:28:02,140
right, that they actually just 
feel afraid to just explore and 

688
00:28:02,150 --> 00:28:03,850
be adventurous with their 
language and stuff because they 

689
00:28:03,860 --> 00:28:05,790
know they'll get ripped apart. 
Because the curriculum 

690
00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:09,590
encourages ripping apart kids 
who aren't doing the punctuation

691
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:11,690
stuff right rather than ohh, 
well done. 

692
00:28:11,700 --> 00:28:13,430
This is really creative. 
Let's just not worry about the 

693
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:14,610
Commons for now. 
Learn that in another. 

694
00:28:14,620 --> 00:28:19,090
Year, yeah, I've always found it
really interesting how writing 

695
00:28:19,100 --> 00:28:21,610
in year six, OK or any year 
group I suppose, but we're 

696
00:28:21,620 --> 00:28:23,390
talking about year six end of 
key stage two. 

697
00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:27,620
There's almost this bell curve 
right of there's children at the

698
00:28:27,630 --> 00:28:30,090
what would be regarded as the 
lower end of the assessment who 

699
00:28:30,100 --> 00:28:32,860
might be below or working 
towards not right at the level. 

700
00:28:33,210 --> 00:28:35,700
And they would be kind of one of
the big things that might be put

701
00:28:35,710 --> 00:28:37,760
to them is that your your 
writing's not coherent. 

702
00:28:37,770 --> 00:28:39,020
It doesn't follow the rules 
properly. 

703
00:28:39,030 --> 00:28:40,660
It doesn't it doesn't have full 
stops in the right places. 

704
00:28:40,670 --> 00:28:43,040
He's not full sentences. 
This doesn't quite work, doesn't

705
00:28:43,050 --> 00:28:45,320
quite make sense. 
Then you enter the bulk of the 

706
00:28:45,330 --> 00:28:47,360
bell curve where you know, 
children have worked really hard

707
00:28:47,370 --> 00:28:49,650
to make sure it makes sense. 
There's not much reward for 

708
00:28:49,660 --> 00:28:51,960
imagination or anything like 
that, but they're using the GPS 

709
00:28:51,970 --> 00:28:53,580
rules correctly. 
It's awesome. 

710
00:28:53,590 --> 00:28:55,600
It makes sense. 
Like nicely ticked all the boxes

711
00:28:55,610 --> 00:28:57,540
you're expected. 
Then the bell curve comes back 

712
00:28:57,550 --> 00:29:00,220
down again and it's almost like 
we enter the realm of before 

713
00:29:00,230 --> 00:29:03,720
expected where now greater depth
children, as long as they've 

714
00:29:03,730 --> 00:29:06,960
shown they can do all that stuff
in the middle to obtain greater 

715
00:29:06,970 --> 00:29:09,950
depth, which is insanely hard to
the end of year six and actually

716
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:12,340
be greater depth. 
You've kind of got to regress 

717
00:29:12,350 --> 00:29:15,650
and and challenge those norms 
and experiment with things and 

718
00:29:15,660 --> 00:29:18,800
add what people always say 
flare, which is this really 

719
00:29:18,810 --> 00:29:21,580
undefined term, which just what 
do greater depth writers need to

720
00:29:21,590 --> 00:29:24,560
have flare? 
It could be, you know, 

721
00:29:24,630 --> 00:29:26,610
experimenting with word meaning.
It could be experience with 

722
00:29:26,620 --> 00:29:28,030
vocabulary. 
It could be experimenting with 

723
00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:31,100
sentence length, could be 
experimenting with, you know, in

724
00:29:31,110 --> 00:29:33,430
speech, not quite using the 
right spellings because you're 

725
00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:35,650
writing down an accent. 
Yeah, the formality change, the 

726
00:29:35,660 --> 00:29:37,750
formality shift, and it's like, 
cool. 

727
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:41,650
So we recognise that that kind 
of going against the grain and 

728
00:29:41,660 --> 00:29:43,150
really pushing. 
The being creative. 

729
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:46,570
And being creative is an 
incredibly vital skill to be in 

730
00:29:46,580 --> 00:29:48,770
a well-rounded writer. 
Yeah, but we completely ignore 

731
00:29:48,780 --> 00:29:50,780
it until children can do all the
robotic things. 

732
00:29:50,790 --> 00:29:52,810
Yeah, well, and it just seems so
backwards to. 

733
00:29:52,820 --> 00:29:53,950
Me the building blocks are 
wrong, aren't? 

734
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:55,910
They Yeah, completely wrong 
because what we should be 

735
00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:59,640
encouraging is a love for 
reading right, separately and 

736
00:29:59,650 --> 00:30:02,360
reading lessons and a love for 
novels and a love for children's

737
00:30:02,370 --> 00:30:05,120
writing, which a lot of the and 
doesn't follow these really 

738
00:30:05,130 --> 00:30:07,240
archaic rules that we have to 
follow in our own writing 

739
00:30:07,290 --> 00:30:09,130
because I've had children. 
But the hand and say there's 

740
00:30:09,140 --> 00:30:12,030
there's no comma after that 
fronted verbial in this book by 

741
00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:15,260
an award-winning, winning 
writer, you know, Michael 

742
00:30:15,270 --> 00:30:17,900
Morpurgo. 
It's like, yeah, well, maybe 

743
00:30:17,910 --> 00:30:19,980
it's not that important and it's
yeah, you're right. 

744
00:30:19,990 --> 00:30:21,510
It's just so backwards. 
And I think we should be 

745
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:24,120
building this up at the same 
time, you know, if children are 

746
00:30:24,130 --> 00:30:27,020
showing that they're developing 
their imagination and they're, 

747
00:30:27,030 --> 00:30:31,180
you know, comma understanding of
like, OK, well, clearly when 

748
00:30:31,190 --> 00:30:33,850
this child wrote a news report, 
that was very different when 

749
00:30:33,860 --> 00:30:35,910
they wrote an adventure story, 
which was also very different to

750
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:39,180
when they wrote a non fiction 
text, like a fact file that 

751
00:30:39,190 --> 00:30:41,100
that's that's awesome. 
And, and also they're, they're 

752
00:30:41,110 --> 00:30:43,400
kind of developing their use of 
capital letters and they're 

753
00:30:43,410 --> 00:30:45,110
developing their use of commas 
in the right place. 

754
00:30:45,900 --> 00:30:48,190
That should be the progression. 
It feels like at the minute. 

755
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:50,250
Simply just look at the GPS 
scale. 

756
00:30:50,260 --> 00:30:52,030
Are they doing all of the GPS 
things correctly? 

757
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:53,300
Oh my God. 
Only thing that's improved. 

758
00:30:53,310 --> 00:30:55,010
They built this entire tower 
properly. 

759
00:30:55,020 --> 00:30:56,450
First. 
We should probably add some 

760
00:30:56,460 --> 00:30:58,320
imagination and some flare into.
This Yeah. 

761
00:30:58,330 --> 00:31:01,120
And you know what? 
Good teachers around the country

762
00:31:01,130 --> 00:31:04,190
do that genuinely. 
And but my problem with the 

763
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:09,690
system is I don't think it 
should rely purely on really, 

764
00:31:09,700 --> 00:31:13,050
really, really good, like 
English teachers who just. 

765
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:17,040
I know that sounds silly. 
But take it into their own. 

766
00:31:17,090 --> 00:31:18,980
Yeah, like. 
That's one of the points are 

767
00:31:18,990 --> 00:31:20,700
gonna make up the curriculum. 
So let's make that point right 

768
00:31:20,710 --> 00:31:22,100
now. 
You think you're making a really

769
00:31:22,110 --> 00:31:24,180
good point. 
And and it's almost a reason why

770
00:31:24,190 --> 00:31:27,000
we don't necessarily need a new 
national curriculum is because 

771
00:31:27,070 --> 00:31:28,970
teachers really know this 
curriculum like the back of 

772
00:31:28,980 --> 00:31:30,640
their hand. 
Now we we understand it well, 

773
00:31:30,650 --> 00:31:33,120
we've put a lot of work into 
this curriculum, especially in 

774
00:31:33,130 --> 00:31:35,540
the first few years, you know, 
moving mass to a mastery 

775
00:31:35,550 --> 00:31:36,750
approach and going for it that 
way. 

776
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:39,120
Mastery, mastery, when my 
Northern roots came out then 

777
00:31:39,190 --> 00:31:42,140
and, you know, in English, like,
you know, the, the spelling rule

778
00:31:42,150 --> 00:31:44,780
completion and the new writing 
assessment stuff, teachers have 

779
00:31:44,790 --> 00:31:48,350
really taken it and I would 
argue moulded it so that we're 

780
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:50,710
still meeting the national 
curriculum, but in a way which 

781
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:52,580
is suitable for our children. 
And essentially what you're 

782
00:31:52,590 --> 00:31:54,340
saying there is, I don't think 
there are many teachers out 

783
00:31:54,350 --> 00:31:56,970
there who actually completely 
ignore the imagination aspect. 

784
00:31:57,020 --> 00:31:59,310
No, but the problem we have 
here, the beef we have is it's 

785
00:31:59,320 --> 00:31:59,960
not rewarded. 
Yeah. 

786
00:31:59,970 --> 00:32:02,130
The default, the default 
position if you're just in the 

787
00:32:02,140 --> 00:32:03,310
curriculum, doesn't encourage 
it. 

788
00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:05,020
So maybe you could, maybe you 
could expand on what you're 

789
00:32:05,030 --> 00:32:06,930
saying there. 
Because in general, I would say 

790
00:32:06,940 --> 00:32:09,500
one of the arguments against the
whole new national curriculum is

791
00:32:09,510 --> 00:32:11,710
we're, we're we're kind of 
finally now in a pretty good 

792
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,480
place with the curriculum where 
lots of work's been done. 

793
00:32:14,490 --> 00:32:16,330
Teachers know what they need to 
do. 

794
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:19,050
We're doing it. 
So what would you say to someone

795
00:32:19,060 --> 00:32:21,050
who says let's not change it? 
Then we kind of know. 

796
00:32:21,060 --> 00:32:23,260
Yeah, I agree. 
Because the massive, massive 

797
00:32:23,270 --> 00:32:25,450
biggest con to this is workload,
isn't it really? 

798
00:32:25,460 --> 00:32:28,390
We're, we're, we're at a tipping
point in teaching already where 

799
00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:31,110
people are going on strike 
multiple times because workload 

800
00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:35,890
is so dire in this job. 
Realistically, if we take out of

801
00:32:35,900 --> 00:32:38,030
the ideology of all of this and 
actually just think about the 

802
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:40,520
real world, the last thing 
teachers need right now is a 

803
00:32:40,530 --> 00:32:42,990
complete overhaul of the entire 
curriculum like maths, English 

804
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,860
and all of the wider stuff. 
That would be mental really, 

805
00:32:45,870 --> 00:32:46,960
wouldn't it? 
You know? 

806
00:32:46,970 --> 00:32:50,580
So I guess if you ask me in a 
realistic point of view whether 

807
00:32:50,590 --> 00:32:52,940
I think we need a new 
curriculum, my answer is no. 

808
00:32:54,530 --> 00:32:56,390
And that's not because I don't 
think it can be improved. 

809
00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:57,410
It's purely because at that 
point. 

810
00:32:57,420 --> 00:32:59,720
And, and, and I would add to 
that, I suppose that what you're

811
00:32:59,730 --> 00:33:03,180
saying there, if it is a 
workload related thing, the only

812
00:33:03,190 --> 00:33:05,660
way we could really fix that is 
to strip back the curriculum, 

813
00:33:05,700 --> 00:33:07,370
which the new government will 
never do. 

814
00:33:07,410 --> 00:33:09,390
So it's like, OK, well, here are
the two options. 

815
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:13,180
OK, neither of them are good. 
The increased curriculum 

816
00:33:13,190 --> 00:33:15,460
completely changed is not good 
for our workload and retention, 

817
00:33:15,470 --> 00:33:17,750
which is in crisis. 
But then the actual thing we 

818
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,260
need, which is a strip back 
curriculum, that's bad for the 

819
00:33:20,270 --> 00:33:21,680
government who are government 
optics. 

820
00:33:21,690 --> 00:33:24,590
So it never needs to happen and 
unfortunately. 

821
00:33:24,660 --> 00:33:26,620
The government optics will 
always matter more than what 

822
00:33:26,630 --> 00:33:29,240
children need so completely into
them, yes. 

823
00:33:29,250 --> 00:33:31,320
So it will never ever, ever not 
be the case. 

824
00:33:31,330 --> 00:33:34,520
Do you think very generic 
question here, I don't expect a 

825
00:33:34,570 --> 00:33:38,660
long answer, but do you think if
Labour gets voted in and we have

826
00:33:38,670 --> 00:33:40,820
a brand new government, do you 
think things will actually 

827
00:33:40,830 --> 00:33:45,170
change the teaching? 
No, we said this term we didn't 

828
00:33:45,180 --> 00:33:50,770
have before and after talking 
just I've just lost faith in 

829
00:33:50,780 --> 00:33:53,210
humanity, not humanity in this 
government, I think because 

830
00:33:53,220 --> 00:33:56,560
we've lived our entire adult 
lives under the Tories. 

831
00:33:56,630 --> 00:33:58,920
And just it, it felt like every 
year was eating away. 

832
00:33:58,930 --> 00:34:00,810
Yeah, getting progressive. 
Nothing was getting. 

833
00:34:00,820 --> 00:34:03,160
Better it's, it's just, I don't 
know, to me it's just it's gone 

834
00:34:03,170 --> 00:34:03,980
too far. 
It's gone. 

835
00:34:03,990 --> 00:34:05,380
I think we needed, we needed 
fix. 

836
00:34:05,470 --> 00:34:08,179
We needed it to be fixed like 10
years ago if we had a chance. 

837
00:34:08,190 --> 00:34:10,650
It's like global warming and how
they say it's kind of gone past 

838
00:34:10,659 --> 00:34:12,739
the point of no return. 
Now we can only just like help 

839
00:34:12,750 --> 00:34:14,909
to make things better. 
I kind of feel like that now as 

840
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:18,719
well. 
I don't I can't see a way that 

841
00:34:18,770 --> 00:34:20,960
that any government could come 
in now and actually fix anything

842
00:34:20,969 --> 00:34:25,380
because we are in so much debt. 
We've got into such bad state 

843
00:34:25,389 --> 00:34:28,489
with the of the country where 
money is just being drained out 

844
00:34:28,500 --> 00:34:31,370
of every possible orifice of 
this country. 

845
00:34:31,380 --> 00:34:32,870
You know what I mean? 
This is a horrible, horrible 

846
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:34,270
analogy. 
I don't know. 

847
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:35,570
I just, I just don't know what 
labour can do. 

848
00:34:35,580 --> 00:34:38,219
Like people often say, where's 
that magic money tree and they, 

849
00:34:38,230 --> 00:34:39,870
you know, taking place? 
But there is also that part of 

850
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:41,510
me that's like, yeah, I don't, I
don't know. 

851
00:34:41,580 --> 00:34:42,909
I don't. 
Know magic money trees being 

852
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:44,850
used to send 18 year olds on 
national service. 

853
00:34:44,860 --> 00:34:47,280
Yeah, unfunded, yeah. 
Like, you know, I'm sure they 

854
00:34:47,290 --> 00:34:49,469
could claw back a bit, but I'm 
like, I don't know what we need 

855
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:51,949
to do because NHS is on its 
knees. 

856
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:55,010
This is the thing, we don't live
in a bubble of just education. 

857
00:34:55,960 --> 00:34:58,830
All public services are 
absolutely, completely, 

858
00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:02,500
completely and utterly destroyed
in terms of budget and we've 

859
00:35:02,510 --> 00:35:04,650
already had to make it work on 
the terrible budget and it's 

860
00:35:04,660 --> 00:35:06,190
still failing. 
It's like there's like a double 

861
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:10,180
whammy of they'd need so much 
money to to make to fix it. 

862
00:35:10,190 --> 00:35:12,860
So we need more staff and they 
all need more paying and we need

863
00:35:12,870 --> 00:35:14,280
all the equipment and resources 
as well. 

864
00:35:14,290 --> 00:35:16,280
Like for all of these public 
services, like we've lost out on

865
00:35:16,290 --> 00:35:18,080
all of it. 
We need it all at once to make 

866
00:35:18,090 --> 00:35:20,020
it good. 
It's not going to happen, so 

867
00:35:20,030 --> 00:35:21,300
it's not going. 
To happen, I don't know, it 

868
00:35:21,310 --> 00:35:22,940
fills me of a bit of anxiety 
actually. 

869
00:35:23,450 --> 00:35:26,200
Yeah, this is. 
This is why I think they might 

870
00:35:26,490 --> 00:35:29,580
edge towards introducing a 
curriculum because from their 

871
00:35:29,590 --> 00:35:33,440
point of view, a Pro is that 
it's it's kind of a cheap way of

872
00:35:33,450 --> 00:35:36,680
going about making change. 
Like OK, of course you need to 

873
00:35:36,690 --> 00:35:38,680
pay people to create the 
curriculum and implement it and 

874
00:35:38,690 --> 00:35:42,750
stuff like that, but the overall
budget spend on introducing a 

875
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:45,930
new curriculum would be much 
more manageable than actually 

876
00:35:45,940 --> 00:35:47,880
fixing the retention. 
Of you also just don't need to 

877
00:35:47,890 --> 00:35:50,000
pay them because that's what the
government, that's what we're 

878
00:35:50,010 --> 00:35:51,790
used to in terms. 
Of but they won't pay teachers 

879
00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:54,030
to do it actually, but they'll 
need to pay, you know, people to

880
00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:56,530
write to them and, and, and 
things to go in there like that.

881
00:35:56,540 --> 00:35:57,920
It would obviously have a cost 
associated. 

882
00:35:57,930 --> 00:35:59,290
I don't pretend it would be 
free. 

883
00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:02,850
But when we compare with what we
actually need, which is if if 

884
00:36:02,860 --> 00:36:05,330
you were to restore teachers pay
to where it would be just in 

885
00:36:05,340 --> 00:36:07,850
terms of in line with inflation,
right, that that is an 

886
00:36:07,860 --> 00:36:10,060
incomparable figure. 
It couldn't happen, no. 

887
00:36:10,110 --> 00:36:12,060
And and that's why I feel quite 
pessimistic. 

888
00:36:12,070 --> 00:36:13,560
Actually, yeah, that's why 
that's what I mean about. 

889
00:36:13,570 --> 00:36:15,750
It's too far gone. 
We could never repair it now 

890
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:18,500
because our, you know, teachers 
wage and educational staff wage 

891
00:36:18,510 --> 00:36:21,520
has been eating away out for so 
long it's now impossible to get 

892
00:36:21,530 --> 00:36:22,900
back to where. 
It was, but that's what winds me

893
00:36:22,910 --> 00:36:24,900
up because they kind of, you 
thought you, you hear Labour 

894
00:36:24,910 --> 00:36:27,800
talk about this and rightly or 
wrongly, probably rightly to be 

895
00:36:27,810 --> 00:36:30,150
fair, they say, you know, with 
junior doctors going on strike, 

896
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:34,520
especially as another example, 
they want a 35% rise in their 

897
00:36:34,530 --> 00:36:35,880
pay. 
And that's, that's not a figure 

898
00:36:35,890 --> 00:36:38,220
plucked at us in air. 
That is where their pay should 

899
00:36:38,230 --> 00:36:40,740
be if they hadn't been squeezed 
so badly over the last 10 to 15 

900
00:36:40,750 --> 00:36:41,170
years. 
Yeah. 

901
00:36:41,180 --> 00:36:42,910
So that's what they want, pay 
restoration. 

902
00:36:42,980 --> 00:36:44,770
That's the big thing. 
And if teachers want pay 

903
00:36:44,780 --> 00:36:47,010
restoration, I think we're in 
the 20s of percent or something 

904
00:36:47,020 --> 00:36:47,960
like that. 
Yeah. 

905
00:36:48,180 --> 00:36:50,420
Huge amount of money. 
And the problem I have is 

906
00:36:50,430 --> 00:36:53,250
currently Labour can kind of 
rightfully turn around and say 

907
00:36:53,260 --> 00:36:55,950
that's unreasonable. 
We don't we don't have that 

908
00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:57,880
amount of money right now. 
We're, you know, the economy is 

909
00:36:57,890 --> 00:37:00,730
not growing very well. 
And, you know, we, we can't fix 

910
00:37:00,740 --> 00:37:03,450
10 years of cuts in one fell 
swoop. 

911
00:37:03,500 --> 00:37:04,900
Yeah. 
And I'm like, cool. 

912
00:37:04,980 --> 00:37:06,870
But then that is kind of the end
of what they say. 

913
00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:09,320
They're just like, so we won't 
nothing. 

914
00:37:09,330 --> 00:37:15,960
And it's like 10% then 5%, yeah.
Bonus like a 10. 

915
00:37:15,970 --> 00:37:19,910
Year plan, you're stripping back
our workload maybe, but no. 

916
00:37:19,980 --> 00:37:23,690
And in terms of the in terms of 
the health thing, Labour have 

917
00:37:23,700 --> 00:37:25,750
simply said no, sorry, that's 
unreasonable. 

918
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:28,400
By the way, we're going to clear
the backlog, We're going to 

919
00:37:28,410 --> 00:37:29,850
clear the NHS waiting list 
backlog. 

920
00:37:31,090 --> 00:37:33,430
How? 
We're gonna get staff, we're 

921
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:37,410
gonna pay, we're gonna pay 
doctors to work overtime like do

922
00:37:37,420 --> 00:37:39,850
evenings and weekend clinics to 
clear the backlog. 

923
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:41,550
Unbelievable. 
On Question Time the other day, 

924
00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:43,510
a doctor was in the audience, 
right? 

925
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:46,610
And she, she's put hand up 
because they're shadow health 

926
00:37:46,620 --> 00:37:48,670
secretary Wes Streeting, who 
will be our health secretary of 

927
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:51,310
labour. 
When she basically said to him, 

928
00:37:51,430 --> 00:37:54,390
I'm working loads already 
because of what teachers do. 

929
00:37:54,540 --> 00:37:58,230
But I, I work an extra 10/15/20 
hours a week anyway. 

930
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:00,460
And you know, we're still under 
huge pressure. 

931
00:38:00,470 --> 00:38:03,790
And so who do you think exactly 
will take up these extra, these 

932
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:06,430
extra hours when I'm already in 
the GP surgery doing extra 

933
00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:08,420
stuff? 
And the answer was just you. 

934
00:38:08,530 --> 00:38:10,940
Well, I've seen it work in my 
local hospital. 

935
00:38:11,010 --> 00:38:13,440
And it was just like, sorry, 
there's a doctor in the 

936
00:38:13,450 --> 00:38:14,460
audience, right. 
Yeah. 

937
00:38:14,470 --> 00:38:15,840
Yeah. 
Telling you it wouldn't work. 

938
00:38:15,850 --> 00:38:17,940
Yeah, OK. 
You've lost all credibility. 

939
00:38:17,950 --> 00:38:21,500
Yeah, immediately. 
And that's where already I'm 

940
00:38:21,510 --> 00:38:24,060
just like those people who say 
it's just the same. 

941
00:38:24,070 --> 00:38:27,280
I'm like, I can see why you 
think that because they are 

942
00:38:27,290 --> 00:38:27,710
very. 
Similar. 

943
00:38:27,720 --> 00:38:30,360
Probably the closest to being 
the same it's ever been in terms

944
00:38:30,370 --> 00:38:33,500
of Labour and Conservative. 
I would say so, but I still 

945
00:38:33,510 --> 00:38:36,870
don't think they're the same. 
I still think that, but see why 

946
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:38,160
people. 
Have different people backing 

947
00:38:38,170 --> 00:38:40,740
them, you know, it doesn't do 
make an impact but but yeah, 

948
00:38:40,750 --> 00:38:41,960
they are close as ever, aren't 
they? 

949
00:38:41,970 --> 00:38:44,390
Yeah, well, that's the whole 
point of what's happened 

950
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:46,390
recently with, you know, moving 
towards the centre. 

951
00:38:46,990 --> 00:38:50,960
So you know what I would say, 
thinking about this conversation

952
00:38:50,970 --> 00:38:54,000
in general, umm, I would say we 
could both get behind the 

953
00:38:54,010 --> 00:38:56,000
curriculum change. 
We could both understand why it 

954
00:38:56,010 --> 00:38:59,440
might be needed, but what 
teachers say would be needed in 

955
00:38:59,450 --> 00:39:01,740
this curriculum change to what 
might be actually be implemented

956
00:39:01,750 --> 00:39:03,080
by the government for various 
reasons. 

957
00:39:03,090 --> 00:39:04,290
I don't think there's much of an
over. 

958
00:39:04,300 --> 00:39:06,690
No, not really. 
And I think that teachers have 

959
00:39:06,700 --> 00:39:08,880
done enough of this curriculum 
to make it worthwhile. 

960
00:39:09,370 --> 00:39:12,640
My, my general answer to that 
would be no, not at the minute. 

961
00:39:12,710 --> 00:39:15,100
Just just leave it. 
They've got a lot to fix before 

962
00:39:15,110 --> 00:39:16,560
we just dive in and do a 
curriculum. 

963
00:39:16,610 --> 00:39:19,080
Like you said, recruitment and 
retention, But what it comes 

964
00:39:19,090 --> 00:39:23,750
down to them is if we're saying,
OK, let's let's not change this 

965
00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:25,250
curriculum, then let's not do it
right now. 

966
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,490
It would be crazy for us to say 
a new government come in and 

967
00:39:28,500 --> 00:39:30,890
let's not do anything. 
Yeah, so we, we speak enough 

968
00:39:30,900 --> 00:39:33,950
about what needs changing. 
So I guess this question has 

969
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:36,270
evolved now into what would you 
want to happen then? 

970
00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:39,460
What should we change in? 
Education, I think for a start. 

971
00:39:39,470 --> 00:39:42,770
I don't know if this is just a 
previous previous point, but I 

972
00:39:42,780 --> 00:39:44,080
know it comes with funding 
everything. 

973
00:39:44,090 --> 00:39:46,130
I'm just ignore the fact that 
everything comes with money that

974
00:39:46,140 --> 00:39:51,060
doesn't exist, but it would be 
nice to have some equipment, end

975
00:39:51,070 --> 00:39:53,640
of sentence. 
It would be nice to have some 

976
00:39:53,650 --> 00:39:57,970
equipment in this school that 
isn't from the Blair government.

977
00:39:58,070 --> 00:39:59,750
Do you know? 
I mean like just just a bit of 

978
00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:01,140
an. 
Upgrade would be nice and stuff,

979
00:40:01,150 --> 00:40:03,420
you know, lots of schools of 
iPads and laptops and things 

980
00:40:03,430 --> 00:40:05,520
like this. 
That was one push that why we 

981
00:40:05,530 --> 00:40:06,870
did. 
There was an iPad push like 

982
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:08,780
around the new curriculum time 
about 10 years ago. 

983
00:40:08,790 --> 00:40:11,320
I get that we're still using 
those iPads like the first 

984
00:40:11,330 --> 00:40:14,360
generation Apple things. 
I don't know, just I always 

985
00:40:14,370 --> 00:40:15,980
think, I always think of the 
school hall. 

986
00:40:16,180 --> 00:40:17,870
Every school hall in the UK 
looks the same. 

987
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:20,000
They've all got the wall 
equipment, they've all got the 

988
00:40:20,010 --> 00:40:23,430
benches from 1994. 
Like they're it's all the same 

989
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:25,750
stuff. 
And I would just like a a bit of

990
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:29,550
effort into being like, OK, it's
not Victorian times anymore. 

991
00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:31,480
What do modern kids actually 
want? 

992
00:40:31,490 --> 00:40:33,740
What's going to make them want 
to come to school and enjoy 

993
00:40:33,750 --> 00:40:35,790
their time at school? 
A school that's not crumbling 

994
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:38,030
because of the rat problem, or 
maybe, maybe a school where it 

995
00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:40,370
doesn't leak. 
Yeah, we, we just do accept, 

996
00:40:40,380 --> 00:40:42,630
don't we, of our school 
buildings that they are absolute

997
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:43,310
crap. 
Yeah. 

998
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:45,150
And there's no money to repair. 
And this is what I mean about 

999
00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:46,990
earlier about again, point, 
point of no return. 

1000
00:40:47,180 --> 00:40:48,770
They needed to be fixed 10 years
ago. 

1001
00:40:48,780 --> 00:40:50,570
Yeah, and we don't have the 
money to. 

1002
00:40:50,580 --> 00:40:53,050
If we fixed them all now, 
because they're so beyond 

1003
00:40:53,060 --> 00:40:55,310
repair, it would cost so too 
much money. 

1004
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:56,910
There's just unfathomable amount
of money. 

1005
00:40:56,920 --> 00:40:58,010
We just wouldn't be able to. 
Do it well. 

1006
00:40:58,020 --> 00:40:59,760
The breaking point are we are 10
years of neglect. 

1007
00:40:59,770 --> 00:41:01,130
Yeah, I said I was gonna happen 
like what? 

1008
00:41:01,140 --> 00:41:02,870
What? 
What actually happens when, 

1009
00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:04,930
Because the schools are just 
getting worse and worse in terms

1010
00:41:04,940 --> 00:41:07,460
of like the structure of them, 
they are just going to fall 

1011
00:41:07,470 --> 00:41:09,190
down? 
Well, if you look at the problem

1012
00:41:09,200 --> 00:41:13,100
with the rack, the the concrete,
that yeah, the whole point of 

1013
00:41:13,110 --> 00:41:16,140
that is that is the ultimate 
version of this problem where 

1014
00:41:16,150 --> 00:41:17,560
that's horrendous. 
And this should have been 

1015
00:41:17,570 --> 00:41:20,870
flagged up and fixed ages ago, 
but it wasn't because the whole 

1016
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:23,530
school rebuilding scheme was cut
and it just didn't happen. 

1017
00:41:23,540 --> 00:41:24,990
Right. 
That's the ultimate version of 

1018
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:26,100
that. 
What you've got to imagine is 

1019
00:41:26,110 --> 00:41:28,980
everything that comes below that
level of small things in the 

1020
00:41:28,990 --> 00:41:31,140
school getting broken. 
Yeah, if a boiler gets broken in

1021
00:41:31,150 --> 00:41:34,320
the school, right, which is 
really just random, isn't it? 

1022
00:41:34,690 --> 00:41:37,180
That has to come out the budget 
and something else gets, you 

1023
00:41:37,190 --> 00:41:40,030
know, dropped because of it. 
And my point is all of these 

1024
00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:43,320
small things and and I saw BBC 
article the other day overhead 

1025
00:41:43,590 --> 00:41:47,380
who is now the janitor as well. 
So they don't have a site 

1026
00:41:47,390 --> 00:41:48,380
manager anymore. 
Wow. 

1027
00:41:48,430 --> 00:41:49,760
Because they wanted to save that
money. 

1028
00:41:49,770 --> 00:41:52,890
The head does the site manager 
duties before and after his 

1029
00:41:52,900 --> 00:41:56,670
headship and during lunch time. 
Tricky, because his point was if

1030
00:41:56,680 --> 00:42:00,960
I hired a site manager, I'd have
to get rid of maybe a teaching 

1031
00:42:00,970 --> 00:42:02,910
assistant. 
I'd have to lower the resource 

1032
00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:04,210
budget. 
We wouldn't have the same thing 

1033
00:42:04,220 --> 00:42:06,610
for kids. 
So as a head teacher, he had to 

1034
00:42:06,620 --> 00:42:11,630
sit there and decide, yeah, I'm 
gonna take this work on for X 

1035
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,940
amount of value because it means
the kids can get their phonics 

1036
00:42:14,950 --> 00:42:16,520
scheme next year or something 
like that. 

1037
00:42:16,530 --> 00:42:19,230
That's crazy. 
And it's like that's completely 

1038
00:42:19,240 --> 00:42:22,920
broken the that that that there 
is, you know, let's not faff 

1039
00:42:22,930 --> 00:42:26,970
around venue curriculum, OK? 
All of our, you know, thought 

1040
00:42:26,980 --> 00:42:29,530
processes and stuff should go 
into fixing this issue where 

1041
00:42:29,540 --> 00:42:30,550
that's seen as. 
That's higher. 

1042
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:33,380
That's my idea. 
A site manager that's that's all

1043
00:42:33,390 --> 00:42:35,510
the budget. 
We've got enough budget to fix 

1044
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:37,670
that one. 
Giving that site manager money. 

1045
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,770
But I just thought it was. 
And we've worked in schools 

1046
00:42:39,780 --> 00:42:42,740
where every school has this. 
And if you work in a school, you

1047
00:42:42,750 --> 00:42:45,020
probably can think of that one 
or two people right now in your 

1048
00:42:45,030 --> 00:42:47,850
school who do this, where they 
honestly have five jobs. 

1049
00:42:47,950 --> 00:42:49,940
Yeah. 
And if, if that person were to 

1050
00:42:49,950 --> 00:42:53,780
leave the school, mm-hmm. 
It you, your school would would 

1051
00:42:53,790 --> 00:42:57,760
suffer huge amounts because you 
would either have to get rid of 

1052
00:42:57,770 --> 00:42:59,900
those jobs, they don't exist 
anymore and hire one person 

1053
00:42:59,910 --> 00:43:03,320
because they're on one salary, 
or pay five people to do those 

1054
00:43:03,330 --> 00:43:05,110
jobs and your budget would be 
decimated. 

1055
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:07,020
Yeah, yeah. 
Just lucky that someone does it.

1056
00:43:07,030 --> 00:43:10,640
Yeah, we've got, you know, I'm 
thinking about it. 

1057
00:43:10,650 --> 00:43:12,430
Just does everything. 
And it's like, you know. 

1058
00:43:12,440 --> 00:43:14,500
What does every Sunday? 
Every Sunday. 

1059
00:43:14,510 --> 00:43:17,310
When that person leaves, it's 
like those jobs are all 

1060
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:19,390
essential though someone. 
Do them. 

1061
00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:20,930
Yeah, they just opened the score
in the morning. 

1062
00:43:20,980 --> 00:43:23,300
Yeah, that's basically do site 
manager's job alongside our 

1063
00:43:23,310 --> 00:43:26,010
actual site manager. 
Yeah, Does basically do the SN 

1064
00:43:26,020 --> 00:43:26,710
job. 
Yeah. 

1065
00:43:26,720 --> 00:43:28,390
Is basically a deputy head 
teacher. 

1066
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:30,170
You know, it's like they're five
jobs. 

1067
00:43:30,180 --> 00:43:32,390
Yeah, yeah, It's unbelievable. 
Just relies on it. 

1068
00:43:32,400 --> 00:43:34,680
Our our school system is so 
propped up, isn't it? 

1069
00:43:34,690 --> 00:43:37,380
I just imagine this goodwill, 
imagine this picture of like all

1070
00:43:37,390 --> 00:43:39,670
these shaky foundations like 
that going to crumble at some 

1071
00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:40,830
point and the whole thing is 
going to. 

1072
00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:42,890
Come it's because on the top we 
can just place new curriculum. 

1073
00:43:42,940 --> 00:43:45,560
Yeah, just checking in. 
So think about that then. 

1074
00:43:45,570 --> 00:43:49,560
So let's go back to the 
ideological world where we can 

1075
00:43:49,570 --> 00:43:52,090
afford to have a new curriculum.
And that's I think we need. 

1076
00:43:52,130 --> 00:43:54,270
I think one of the things I do 
just because it's always bugged 

1077
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:57,820
me and you might feel the same 
about maths, is actually do the 

1078
00:43:57,830 --> 00:44:02,010
whole curriculum. 
I feel like, yeah, like in 2014 

1079
00:44:02,020 --> 00:44:04,740
when all this mastery curriculum
came in, it's like they got to 

1080
00:44:04,750 --> 00:44:07,510
year 6. 
They're like, right, our money 

1081
00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:09,670
ran out of money, ran out of 
time and then they kind of just 

1082
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:10,750
never carried on. 
No. 

1083
00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:14,630
So now up to year six, the key 
stage one and two curriculum are

1084
00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:17,030
amazing. 
I think in terms of the mastery 

1085
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:18,730
approach, I really like what 
they've done with it. 

1086
00:44:18,740 --> 00:44:21,290
I'm sure there's a few things we
can fix, but then the kids go to

1087
00:44:21,300 --> 00:44:23,980
year seven and, and, and I've 
heard from so many parents over 

1088
00:44:23,990 --> 00:44:25,920
the years to come back and be 
like, yeah, my kids kind of 

1089
00:44:25,930 --> 00:44:27,820
bored maths now because they 
just haven't done anything new 

1090
00:44:27,830 --> 00:44:29,720
for a year. 
I'm like, oh, that's annoying 

1091
00:44:29,730 --> 00:44:32,890
because I spent ages trying to 
get them to like be like amazing

1092
00:44:32,900 --> 00:44:35,130
at maths and and be ready. 
And I hear that a lot. 

1093
00:44:35,140 --> 00:44:37,070
And basically the secondary 
school curriculum. 

1094
00:44:37,610 --> 00:44:40,500
I could be wrong, I'm not you 
know, but it doesn't seem to 

1095
00:44:40,510 --> 00:44:42,990
follow on. 
I think you have to wait until 

1096
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:46,290
this year 10, yeah, to to get 
into the really nitty gritty. 

1097
00:44:46,300 --> 00:44:48,740
Stuff, well, easy, easy, Nagy, 
we, me and you, literally 

1098
00:44:48,750 --> 00:44:51,140
because we were looking at GCSE 
stuff, the foundation, but we 

1099
00:44:51,150 --> 00:44:54,260
looked at the foundation, which 
is the easier of the GCSE. 

1100
00:44:54,270 --> 00:44:57,560
Maths but it's still you've you 
know, you do a foundation paper 

1101
00:44:57,570 --> 00:44:58,740
that's. 
Very fine. 

1102
00:44:58,790 --> 00:45:00,480
Yeah. 
You're still doing it at GCSE 

1103
00:45:00,490 --> 00:45:01,970
level, which is, I always forget
what year it is. 

1104
00:45:01,980 --> 00:45:06,770
You're 1110, isn't it was 
confused and we worked for it, 

1105
00:45:06,780 --> 00:45:10,210
didn't we? 
And I'd say 80% of the questions

1106
00:45:10,220 --> 00:45:12,070
were just end of year six 
questions. 

1107
00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:15,210
And I would argue the rest of 
this questions were of the level

1108
00:45:15,220 --> 00:45:16,840
that we could teach. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1109
00:45:16,850 --> 00:45:18,080
We didn't teach it. 
Yeah. 

1110
00:45:18,090 --> 00:45:19,220
Or at least yeah, seven, they 
could do it. 

1111
00:45:19,230 --> 00:45:20,610
Like what is it? 
What are they doing then? 

1112
00:45:20,650 --> 00:45:22,690
So I don't know, just as mental.
I'd actually love to. 

1113
00:45:22,700 --> 00:45:24,310
I'd never do it because a waste 
of time and it's not the 

1114
00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:26,090
curriculum. 
But it would be very fun if I 

1115
00:45:26,100 --> 00:45:29,150
just had a spare day, right, to 
give some of my mathematicians 

1116
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:31,900
in year six expected level 
mathematicians, but just given 

1117
00:45:31,910 --> 00:45:34,390
the GCSE Foundation paper and 
see if they get enough marks to 

1118
00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:36,690
pass it without knowing the 
stuff they don't know yet 

1119
00:45:36,700 --> 00:45:38,640
haven't been taught because that
would just be. 

1120
00:45:38,650 --> 00:45:40,630
Mad and again, I don't know, 
actually use foundation, just 

1121
00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:42,200
one paper or two or three, I 
don't know. 

1122
00:45:42,210 --> 00:45:45,000
But this one, we found it was 
genuinely like, what are the 

1123
00:45:45,010 --> 00:45:48,840
common factors of 12 and 18? 
And it was like, that's year 

1124
00:45:48,850 --> 00:45:50,090
four. 
And you know what? 

1125
00:45:50,100 --> 00:45:52,080
And that's fine because you're 
testing the whole of the 

1126
00:45:52,090 --> 00:45:54,020
curriculum. 
It's the same one in the Sats 

1127
00:45:54,030 --> 00:45:55,560
paper. 
If you see year three question, 

1128
00:45:55,670 --> 00:45:57,960
no one goes. 
That's year three counting in 

1129
00:45:57,970 --> 00:45:59,560
sevens. 
Yeah, OK. 

1130
00:45:59,570 --> 00:46:01,420
But it's a key stage two paper 
GCSE. 

1131
00:46:01,430 --> 00:46:03,310
We're still testing to see if 
they can still do that stuff. 

1132
00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:06,710
I mean, that's fine, but you're 
right, the screening we very 

1133
00:46:06,720 --> 00:46:08,830
quickly rapidly get to year six 
level hmm. 

1134
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:11,380
And then it it feels like the 
rate at which we're adding to 

1135
00:46:11,390 --> 00:46:13,640
that knowledge does slow down. 
Yeah, massively. 

1136
00:46:13,650 --> 00:46:15,580
The first thing I'd probably 
look at and just make sure the 

1137
00:46:15,590 --> 00:46:18,600
curriculum is actually fluent 
all the way from the beginning 

1138
00:46:18,610 --> 00:46:20,850
to the end of school. 
Anything you want to jump in 

1139
00:46:20,860 --> 00:46:23,230
with? 
Us, I heard on that that they 

1140
00:46:23,240 --> 00:46:26,220
did, they kind of ran out of 
money and time, but also that 

1141
00:46:26,230 --> 00:46:28,870
they then just decided to shove 
it all into key stage two. 

1142
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:31,730
So apparently, from what I 
heard, again, feel free to 

1143
00:46:31,740 --> 00:46:34,130
correct me, is that a bunch of 
the stuff that we find in the 

1144
00:46:34,140 --> 00:46:36,540
key stage two curriculum for 
maths actually initially would 

1145
00:46:36,550 --> 00:46:39,550
have stretched over to 7898. 
So that kind of backs up what 

1146
00:46:39,560 --> 00:46:41,560
we're thinking of getting to 
that foundation level. 

1147
00:46:41,670 --> 00:46:44,160
We would add stuff in 7-8 and 
9:00, but they kind of went, 

1148
00:46:44,170 --> 00:46:46,100
ohh, we ran out of money, just 
whack it. 

1149
00:46:46,110 --> 00:46:48,750
Yes, six ends in year six, which
is why a lot of people say now, 

1150
00:46:48,760 --> 00:46:52,400
especially been teaching for a 
long time that you know what 

1151
00:46:52,410 --> 00:46:55,610
we're teaching kids in year six.
We used to teach them in 

1152
00:46:55,620 --> 00:46:58,000
secondary school and what we're 
teaching kids in year 4 is what 

1153
00:46:58,010 --> 00:47:00,550
we use to teach in year six. 
Everything got smashed. 

1154
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:01,420
Down. 
It's true to an extent. 

1155
00:47:01,430 --> 00:47:02,920
There was stuff that got pushed 
out as well, isn't it? 

1156
00:47:02,930 --> 00:47:04,160
I can't think of a good example 
now. 

1157
00:47:04,170 --> 00:47:06,170
In proportion maybe. 
Yeah, that used to be in the. 

1158
00:47:06,580 --> 00:47:09,170
Median. 
Yeah, median mode range, 

1159
00:47:09,180 --> 00:47:12,030
different stages that used to be
in year six and that got pushed 

1160
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:13,510
into secondary. 
So I do think there was a little

1161
00:47:13,520 --> 00:47:15,980
bit of thought there, which I 
think is a good thing that they 

1162
00:47:15,990 --> 00:47:18,120
went out because year six kids 
don't need to know those things 

1163
00:47:18,130 --> 00:47:19,930
to be honest. 
We still teach the mean average 

1164
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:21,600
year six. 
They don't need to know that. 

1165
00:47:21,610 --> 00:47:23,630
They don't need to not they 
could do it in year 7. 

1166
00:47:23,640 --> 00:47:27,390
Year 8-9, the question in the 
SAT is always honestly just like

1167
00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:28,920
find the mean. 
Yeah. 

1168
00:47:28,930 --> 00:47:32,090
And it's very simple. 
They're not. 

1169
00:47:32,150 --> 00:47:34,100
I don't think they're actually 
applying it for what it's. 

1170
00:47:34,110 --> 00:47:36,290
Useful for no. 
Actual stats actually finding 

1171
00:47:36,300 --> 00:47:38,010
out the average of something for
a reason and then for 

1172
00:47:38,020 --> 00:47:39,060
justifying. 
I agree. 

1173
00:47:39,070 --> 00:47:41,350
So it's it's very much just like
here's a procedure, learn it. 

1174
00:47:41,360 --> 00:47:43,870
It's like very standard and 
pointless really, because I 

1175
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:45,570
think math should be embedded in
what we're actually. 

1176
00:47:45,580 --> 00:47:49,130
Using context and yeah, problem 
solving and real life context as

1177
00:47:49,140 --> 00:47:51,490
well. 
I do want to move on to another 

1178
00:47:51,500 --> 00:47:54,780
point. 
They kind of didn't go past core

1179
00:47:54,790 --> 00:47:57,090
curriculum earlier. 
Yeah. 

1180
00:47:57,100 --> 00:47:59,560
We kind of talked about me. 
I mean, strip it back a little 

1181
00:47:59,570 --> 00:48:00,010
bit. 
Yeah. 

1182
00:48:00,020 --> 00:48:02,890
So what would you change with 
the wider curriculum? 

1183
00:48:03,260 --> 00:48:06,750
Because I'm talking history, 
geography, you know, and we've 

1184
00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:09,870
already mentioned how the 
curriculum is so tiny for those 

1185
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:10,970
subjects. 
Yeah. 

1186
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:13,330
And, you know, that's quite 
broad. 

1187
00:48:13,340 --> 00:48:15,950
Teachers can kind of interpret 
it, a lot of it, however they 

1188
00:48:15,960 --> 00:48:18,490
like. 
In terms of they might get OK in

1189
00:48:18,500 --> 00:48:19,890
history. 
You have to go down British 

1190
00:48:19,900 --> 00:48:23,330
history over this time and an 
ancient civilization from around

1191
00:48:23,340 --> 00:48:25,580
the world that's not extremely 
broad. 

1192
00:48:25,590 --> 00:48:27,950
But then what you do with it, 
it's kind of up to you almost as

1193
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:30,240
long as you go through these 
strands of civilization and 

1194
00:48:30,250 --> 00:48:32,430
power and invasion and. 
Stuff like, yeah, I'm gonna say 

1195
00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:33,890
something. 
I'm gonna lead on to a point 

1196
00:48:33,900 --> 00:48:35,490
that I reckon is quite 
controversial and I reckon 

1197
00:48:35,500 --> 00:48:38,340
you'll definitely disagree with 
wider curriculum. 

1198
00:48:38,350 --> 00:48:40,090
My favourite kind of point, 
yeah. 

1199
00:48:40,100 --> 00:48:43,870
I don't know if this has come 
from the curriculum, from the 

1200
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:46,620
government down or it's just 
like a culture that we've 

1201
00:48:46,630 --> 00:48:47,770
created in teaching or 
something. 

1202
00:48:47,780 --> 00:48:50,280
But I think the wider 
curriculum, although subjects 

1203
00:48:50,290 --> 00:48:53,470
you just mentioned has become 
horrendously, horrendously 

1204
00:48:53,480 --> 00:48:56,890
knowledge based to the point 
where it is just like the only 

1205
00:48:56,900 --> 00:49:00,130
thing that matters is 
remembering some stuff. 

1206
00:49:00,180 --> 00:49:01,610
And that's what we said, just a 
memory test. 

1207
00:49:01,620 --> 00:49:04,690
And I'm, I hate that. 
And I don't actually, I'm not, I

1208
00:49:04,700 --> 00:49:05,990
don't think that comes from the 
curriculum. 

1209
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:09,220
And I think because the 
curriculum is so vague, it has 

1210
00:49:09,230 --> 00:49:12,520
allowed for this weird culture 
to come in and be like, this is 

1211
00:49:12,530 --> 00:49:14,050
how we this is how we do history
now. 

1212
00:49:14,110 --> 00:49:16,970
Retrieval Retrieval Everyday 
Five questions Retrieval Who was

1213
00:49:16,980 --> 00:49:18,760
it that found King Tutankhamun's
tomb? 

1214
00:49:18,770 --> 00:49:20,600
Who was it that Henry the Eighth
married for the? 

1215
00:49:20,610 --> 00:49:22,280
4th And I think that's because 
there probably some big 

1216
00:49:22,290 --> 00:49:24,280
companies that have come in and 
filled that gap of where there's

1217
00:49:24,290 --> 00:49:26,430
literally just no curriculum and
the claims like teach them 

1218
00:49:26,440 --> 00:49:28,880
history and stuff and it's OK, 
that's the one I. 

1219
00:49:28,890 --> 00:49:30,870
Think I would argue the 
curriculum is actually quite 

1220
00:49:30,880 --> 00:49:33,040
specific in that it wants you to
look at the skills. 

1221
00:49:33,050 --> 00:49:35,360
More yeah. 
So this is what I find really 

1222
00:49:35,410 --> 00:49:38,360
hard to understand because I 
think if anything, if you're 

1223
00:49:38,370 --> 00:49:40,560
going to make any stance on the 
curriculum, it actually doesn't 

1224
00:49:40,570 --> 00:49:42,600
say to do the whole knowledge, 
the whole knowledge cramming 

1225
00:49:42,610 --> 00:49:45,330
thing it actually says teaches 
them about chronology, you know,

1226
00:49:45,340 --> 00:49:49,070
history, teaches them about 
democracy and how that's changed

1227
00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:51,170
over thousands of years like 
that call that, I think that's 

1228
00:49:51,180 --> 00:49:52,760
quite cool. 
But I think what's happened is 

1229
00:49:52,770 --> 00:49:55,860
because the curriculum is so 
vague, companies come in because

1230
00:49:55,870 --> 00:49:57,610
schools are desperate for 
schemes because we can't plan 

1231
00:49:57,620 --> 00:49:59,410
all this stuff individually. 
It's mental, right? 

1232
00:49:59,470 --> 00:50:01,370
And schemes come in and say, oh,
we've created, we've done it 

1233
00:50:01,380 --> 00:50:03,100
this way and it works. 
And then that just kind of goes 

1234
00:50:03,110 --> 00:50:05,010
around other schools and 
suddenly everyone's doing this 

1235
00:50:05,020 --> 00:50:07,870
crazy knowledge based stuff. 
So here's my controversial 

1236
00:50:07,880 --> 00:50:09,640
point. 
I don't think there should be 

1237
00:50:09,700 --> 00:50:12,650
anywhere near as much freedom as
that as it currently is to teach

1238
00:50:12,660 --> 00:50:14,800
the curriculum the way it is. 
I think it should be 

1239
00:50:14,870 --> 00:50:17,880
considerably more prescriptive 
so that there's actually some 

1240
00:50:17,890 --> 00:50:20,730
standardisation across schools. 
And just one point, because I 

1241
00:50:20,740 --> 00:50:21,960
let you come back to all of 
this. 

1242
00:50:22,030 --> 00:50:25,000
One point that makes me feel 
like this in general is, is that

1243
00:50:25,010 --> 00:50:27,920
I hate the fact that you can 
work in two schools in this 

1244
00:50:27,930 --> 00:50:30,300
country and one of them, you'll 
end up having a mental breakdown

1245
00:50:30,310 --> 00:50:32,600
at the end of it because the 
workload is terrible, right? 

1246
00:50:32,610 --> 00:50:34,090
You'll be, you'll be off work 
sick. 

1247
00:50:34,130 --> 00:50:35,420
And the other one is like, oh, 
it's great. 

1248
00:50:35,430 --> 00:50:38,760
It's cushy here. 
I work 8 till 4:30 every day and

1249
00:50:38,770 --> 00:50:41,530
my life make my workloads great,
my mental health is great. 

1250
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:43,490
I hate the fact that that can 
happen. 

1251
00:50:43,500 --> 00:50:45,640
It's the same job, you're 
getting paid the same thing. 

1252
00:50:45,650 --> 00:50:47,710
And do you think that's down to 
the fact the afternoon 

1253
00:50:47,720 --> 00:50:49,210
curriculum is open to 
interpretation? 

1254
00:50:49,220 --> 00:50:51,630
Not entirely, but I do think 
that's that. 

1255
00:50:51,700 --> 00:50:55,740
I think the lack of systems, I 
think the the, the openness from

1256
00:50:55,750 --> 00:50:57,040
the government, like, yeah, just
do what you want. 

1257
00:50:57,050 --> 00:50:59,400
Schools, you've just got these 
crazy expectations to meet. 

1258
00:50:59,410 --> 00:51:01,790
Off you go. 
OK, so my point on that would 

1259
00:51:01,800 --> 00:51:04,400
be, firstly, you talked about, 
you know, external companies 

1260
00:51:04,410 --> 00:51:06,750
coming in and providing schools 
with schemes because it's so 

1261
00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:08,210
vague. 
Hmm, I understand that 

1262
00:51:08,220 --> 00:51:10,320
completely. 
I think schemes, again, it 

1263
00:51:10,330 --> 00:51:12,470
depends on the scheme. 
The scheme could be great, Some 

1264
00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:14,280
you can just pick up and run 
with and it could save you a lot

1265
00:51:14,290 --> 00:51:16,030
of workload. 
I would argue though, there's 

1266
00:51:16,040 --> 00:51:19,360
another strand that makes it 
problematic and that's Ofsted. 

1267
00:51:19,800 --> 00:51:23,040
So it's insane the system that 
we currently have where our 

1268
00:51:23,050 --> 00:51:25,040
history curriculum is honestly 
two sides long. 

1269
00:51:25,110 --> 00:51:28,060
Like if you've not looked at the
history quickly in a while, just

1270
00:51:28,070 --> 00:51:30,950
Google the national curriculum 
for primary and scroll past the 

1271
00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:32,920
hundreds of pages until you get 
history and there's like 2 

1272
00:51:32,930 --> 00:51:35,360
pages. 
Geography 2 pages DT like one 

1273
00:51:35,370 --> 00:51:36,940
page something insane. 
Like that? 

1274
00:51:36,950 --> 00:51:40,820
Yeah. 
The issue is then Ofsted have a 

1275
00:51:40,830 --> 00:51:44,880
framework that's almost longer 
than the curriculum, right? 

1276
00:51:44,890 --> 00:51:46,440
So the framework might be two 
sides. 

1277
00:51:46,450 --> 00:51:49,220
So we're looking for this and 
then offset have this 

1278
00:51:49,230 --> 00:51:53,120
unbelievably high standard and 
scores will hear stories of 

1279
00:51:53,130 --> 00:51:55,190
Ofsted coming in. 
We've experienced this by the 

1280
00:51:55,200 --> 00:51:59,700
way, offset coming in and 
saying, OK, what kind of 

1281
00:51:59,710 --> 00:52:02,150
materials did they use in this 
in the Bronze Age? 

1282
00:52:02,160 --> 00:52:03,620
What did they use That, 
obviously. 

1283
00:52:03,630 --> 00:52:06,380
Bronze, Yeah, yeah. 
But they might ask a very 

1284
00:52:06,390 --> 00:52:09,510
specific question. 
OK, well previously what did 

1285
00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:10,700
they use? 
How did that change? 

1286
00:52:10,710 --> 00:52:11,960
And OK, well, what do they use 
now? 

1287
00:52:11,970 --> 00:52:14,520
What kind of what kind of 
weapons might they use that's 

1288
00:52:14,530 --> 00:52:16,060
knowledge based? 
Yeah, like and that. 

1289
00:52:16,070 --> 00:52:18,110
When the kids don't know the. 
Kids might not know and they'll 

1290
00:52:18,120 --> 00:52:20,820
mark it down as a curriculum 
that's not enhancing them. 

1291
00:52:20,830 --> 00:52:23,800
So I would argue that the 
problem comes from things like 

1292
00:52:23,810 --> 00:52:28,080
offset where those incredibly 
high standards are set for 

1293
00:52:28,090 --> 00:52:31,230
knowledge and schools panic and 
schools buy into schemes. 

1294
00:52:31,240 --> 00:52:32,890
Good point actually, I didn't 
really think about that. 

1295
00:52:32,900 --> 00:52:34,700
It's not a curriculum, It's the 
Ofsted framework that does 

1296
00:52:34,710 --> 00:52:36,800
impact a lot of. 
I would argue what we've just 

1297
00:52:36,810 --> 00:52:40,060
said there is the curriculum is 
pretty good and I like the idea 

1298
00:52:40,070 --> 00:52:43,480
of as professionals, as teachers
having that openness. 

1299
00:52:43,490 --> 00:52:46,050
And I would be reticent. 
I wouldn't like what you're 

1300
00:52:46,060 --> 00:52:48,520
saying. 
Whereas incredibly prescriptive.

1301
00:52:48,530 --> 00:52:50,220
I think we get enough of that 
from us in English. 

1302
00:52:50,230 --> 00:52:53,360
And I understand why because 
they are vital skills to to, you

1303
00:52:53,370 --> 00:52:56,500
know, being a member of society.
You need to be able to interpret

1304
00:52:56,510 --> 00:52:58,620
a timetable to get to work. 
You need to be able to buy stuff

1305
00:52:58,630 --> 00:53:00,560
when you go, when you go 
shopping, you need to be able to

1306
00:53:00,570 --> 00:53:04,560
read, to do literally anything. 
So all of that stuff, OK, fine. 

1307
00:53:04,570 --> 00:53:05,780
I get why that's so 
prescriptive. 

1308
00:53:06,560 --> 00:53:09,690
I like the idea that when it 
comes to history, if anything, I

1309
00:53:09,700 --> 00:53:13,200
want to give schools, you know, 
much more freedom to kind of go 

1310
00:53:13,210 --> 00:53:16,540
down roads they want to go down.
I want I wanna let them, you 

1311
00:53:16,550 --> 00:53:19,510
know, do an extra term on the 
Roman Empire because actually 

1312
00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:22,110
down the road from them, maybe 
Richard the Third was excavated,

1313
00:53:22,120 --> 00:53:23,880
not Roman Empire. 
But you know, something local 

1314
00:53:23,890 --> 00:53:26,030
has sure, sure. 
Where it's like we can really 

1315
00:53:26,040 --> 00:53:27,620
jump on that. 
And there it doesn't allow for 

1316
00:53:27,630 --> 00:53:30,590
local study. 
But all I'm saying is I think 

1317
00:53:30,600 --> 00:53:33,790
let's interpret the curriculum 
as it is, then let's actually 

1318
00:53:33,800 --> 00:53:38,670
just do history for the sake of 
inspiring the children and 

1319
00:53:38,680 --> 00:53:40,910
getting them to like these 
afternoon subjects. 

1320
00:53:40,920 --> 00:53:42,450
I would argue that's the most 
important thing. 

1321
00:53:42,460 --> 00:53:44,040
Yeah. 
With maths, most important thing

1322
00:53:44,050 --> 00:53:45,830
they can do the maths. 
I get whites, prescriptive. 

1323
00:53:45,900 --> 00:53:47,830
With English, most important 
thing, they can read. 

1324
00:53:47,900 --> 00:53:49,430
I understand that's really 
important. 

1325
00:53:49,480 --> 00:53:51,550
And I'd say the writing, the 
most important thing is that 

1326
00:53:51,560 --> 00:53:53,950
they enjoy writing their 
imaginative and eventually they 

1327
00:53:53,960 --> 00:53:55,090
get there. 
That's why we want to do the 

1328
00:53:55,100 --> 00:53:55,990
changes. 
Yeah. 

1329
00:53:56,000 --> 00:53:59,570
I would say again, when it comes
to the core curriculum, do they 

1330
00:53:59,660 --> 00:54:02,530
find history interesting? 
That should be the core. 

1331
00:54:02,580 --> 00:54:04,090
Yeah, Yeah, sorry. 
The curriculum that should be 

1332
00:54:04,100 --> 00:54:05,460
the core of everything we're 
doing. 

1333
00:54:05,470 --> 00:54:06,910
Yeah. 
It's the only thing that should 

1334
00:54:06,920 --> 00:54:09,230
matter is at the end of that 
history curriculum, have they 

1335
00:54:09,240 --> 00:54:10,970
been inspired to go and find out
more? 

1336
00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:12,590
Yeah. 
Or at least did they enjoy the 

1337
00:54:12,600 --> 00:54:15,770
process of learning that story 
And, and also, can we then make 

1338
00:54:15,780 --> 00:54:18,070
the links of what's happening 
today or make the links with 

1339
00:54:18,080 --> 00:54:19,230
what they learned last year? 
In history. 

1340
00:54:19,240 --> 00:54:22,280
So can I come back on that 
because I think I 100% agree. 

1341
00:54:22,290 --> 00:54:24,350
I mean, you've heard on this 
podcast, I'm very, very 

1342
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:26,600
passionate about the enjoyment 
of the subject is number one. 

1343
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:29,540
So just controversially, I 
guess, again, I think the 

1344
00:54:29,550 --> 00:54:31,930
government could do that. 
I think there could be a system 

1345
00:54:31,940 --> 00:54:35,060
where it's like the government 
are quite strict on this is how 

1346
00:54:35,070 --> 00:54:36,940
we teach these subjects and 
you've got to stay within these 

1347
00:54:36,950 --> 00:54:38,530
boundaries rather than it's 
completely open. 

1348
00:54:38,540 --> 00:54:40,510
And then everyone ends up buying
in schemes to do the complete 

1349
00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:42,290
opposite. 
I think they could be a lot more

1350
00:54:42,300 --> 00:54:45,420
like neatly packaged with the, 
with the wider curriculum, 

1351
00:54:45,430 --> 00:54:46,980
longer, more in depth 
curriculums. 

1352
00:54:47,030 --> 00:54:49,900
Not prescriptive in terms of you
have to teach Romans, but 

1353
00:54:49,970 --> 00:54:54,000
prescriptive in terms of the 
things that get rid of the the 

1354
00:54:54,010 --> 00:54:56,370
the the knowledge based 
curriculum that we buy in that 

1355
00:54:56,380 --> 00:54:58,240
we don't actually like that much
where it's like, no, no, no, 

1356
00:54:58,250 --> 00:55:00,230
that doesn't fit the national 
curriculum because National 

1357
00:55:00,240 --> 00:55:04,090
Crime is way more detail them 
and you can understand it more. 

1358
00:55:04,100 --> 00:55:05,790
It's like it, it actually says 
in it. 

1359
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:07,390
If you're not doing local 
studies, that's rubbish. 

1360
00:55:07,510 --> 00:55:09,210
It's like, Hey go, everyone has 
to do that now because we all 

1361
00:55:09,220 --> 00:55:09,910
agree that's. 
Good. 

1362
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:12,270
So who do you trust more to 
create a creative curriculum 

1363
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:14,220
that kids enjoy, the government 
or the teachers? 

1364
00:55:14,230 --> 00:55:15,850
Well, that's the problem. 
That's the problem, isn't it? 

1365
00:55:15,860 --> 00:55:17,410
I mean, my ideological world 
again. 

1366
00:55:17,420 --> 00:55:19,260
And I actually don't think the 
government will do it. 

1367
00:55:19,270 --> 00:55:21,380
So. 
So my point here is then, yeah, 

1368
00:55:21,390 --> 00:55:23,250
I want the same outcome as you. 
Yeah. 

1369
00:55:23,260 --> 00:55:26,730
I think it should be very open 
curriculum, which is leaves room

1370
00:55:26,740 --> 00:55:29,590
for inspiration for those, for 
teachers to do good things that 

1371
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,100
you're good at. 
I think what needs to change is 

1372
00:55:32,110 --> 00:55:34,100
the office how how it's how it's
judged. 

1373
00:55:34,110 --> 00:55:35,880
Yeah, yeah. 
Changed the Ofsted framework, 

1374
00:55:35,890 --> 00:55:37,800
change what we're actually 
looking for so teachers aren't 

1375
00:55:37,810 --> 00:55:39,640
pressured into doing that 
rubbish. 

1376
00:55:39,650 --> 00:55:42,520
Why do we feel pressure to do 
these retrieval questions? 

1377
00:55:42,530 --> 00:55:44,220
Why do we feel pressured by 
these schemes? 

1378
00:55:44,230 --> 00:55:46,120
In two reasons. 
One, workloads huge. 

1379
00:55:46,470 --> 00:55:49,380
Two, because offset gonna rinse.
Yeah, we heard from local 

1380
00:55:49,390 --> 00:55:50,880
schools. 
Ofsted rinsed that school for 

1381
00:55:50,890 --> 00:55:52,700
this thing. 
So now we buy a scheme that they

1382
00:55:52,710 --> 00:55:56,680
asked one of the students who, 
you know Anne of Cleaves enjoyed

1383
00:55:56,690 --> 00:56:00,020
seeing on on her downtime and 
they didn't know. 

1384
00:56:00,070 --> 00:56:01,960
So we need to know all of the 
facts about all of the things. 

1385
00:56:02,120 --> 00:56:03,100
Great trip. 
We need to. 

1386
00:56:03,140 --> 00:56:03,810
We need to teach. 
This. 

1387
00:56:03,820 --> 00:56:06,760
And I think why I got history 
all the time is because I did a 

1388
00:56:06,770 --> 00:56:07,960
degree in history. 
Yeah. 

1389
00:56:07,970 --> 00:56:10,920
I have a university degree in 
history, yeah. 

1390
00:56:10,930 --> 00:56:14,320
And I would argue that the most 
important things I learned at 

1391
00:56:14,330 --> 00:56:19,920
university were how to interpret
sources, umm, the wider changes 

1392
00:56:19,930 --> 00:56:23,040
that came about because of, you 
know, people's opinions on 

1393
00:56:23,050 --> 00:56:26,340
things or governments or, you 
know, religious beliefs and 

1394
00:56:26,350 --> 00:56:29,950
stuff like that. 
And the stories, I remember the 

1395
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:31,750
stories. 
But, and, and, and it's about 

1396
00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:33,760
being critical. 
I think when you, when you look 

1397
00:56:33,770 --> 00:56:38,050
at history, if it boils down to 
Britain invaded this country and

1398
00:56:38,060 --> 00:56:40,750
then Britain made sure this 
thing happened and we traded 

1399
00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:42,250
with that. 
And then Henry the Eighth 

1400
00:56:42,260 --> 00:56:45,100
seceded from the church. 
Cool. 

1401
00:56:45,230 --> 00:56:48,120
You can find out whenever you 
want if you're a child in a 

1402
00:56:48,130 --> 00:56:49,560
classroom. 
Hmm. 

1403
00:56:49,630 --> 00:56:51,560
Or you will really care about is
the story. 

1404
00:56:51,630 --> 00:56:53,320
Yeah. 
Make it a really interesting 

1405
00:56:53,330 --> 00:56:55,270
story. 
Hook them, hook them on it. 

1406
00:56:55,280 --> 00:56:58,260
If they want to find out more, 
they can and do the important 

1407
00:56:58,270 --> 00:57:00,280
stuff. 
Like we could modernise the 

1408
00:57:00,290 --> 00:57:02,200
history curriculum. 
In my opinion, it could be very 

1409
00:57:02,210 --> 00:57:05,380
much a away from, you know, 
Britain ruling the world. 

1410
00:57:05,390 --> 00:57:07,420
It it could be a really 
enriching experience for the 

1411
00:57:07,430 --> 00:57:07,960
children. 
Sure. 

1412
00:57:07,970 --> 00:57:10,560
Different cultures and stuff. 
Just just encourage them. 

1413
00:57:10,570 --> 00:57:13,460
Just enrich them and make it 
more interesting. 

1414
00:57:13,530 --> 00:57:16,820
Sure. 
So back to my ideology, I think 

1415
00:57:16,830 --> 00:57:18,630
there's a wider I want to 
discuss it more because I think 

1416
00:57:18,640 --> 00:57:20,140
you'll disagree with me. 
I just kind of want have those 

1417
00:57:20,150 --> 00:57:23,710
conversations. 
So I I was thinking about no the

1418
00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:26,030
government systemizing stuff 
more not. 

1419
00:57:26,850 --> 00:57:30,400
Just. 
My whistling noise and not just 

1420
00:57:30,410 --> 00:57:32,520
the quickly I think I think your
point really actually I agree I 

1421
00:57:32,530 --> 00:57:36,260
I that conclusion was good but 
in terms of other areas that the

1422
00:57:36,270 --> 00:57:38,840
government things the government
consistently wrong again Yeah 

1423
00:57:38,850 --> 00:57:41,060
probably here you go How about 
this idea. 

1424
00:57:41,420 --> 00:57:44,140
I hate this. 
I think the government should 

1425
00:57:44,150 --> 00:57:48,500
provide schools with a 
suggested, doesn't have to be 

1426
00:57:48,510 --> 00:57:52,770
followed, a suggested timetable 
that fits in. 

1427
00:57:52,870 --> 00:57:55,650
Ohh. 
That actually fits in OK. 

1428
00:57:55,660 --> 00:57:57,810
Basically they take, I think the
government should take the lead 

1429
00:57:57,820 --> 00:58:00,830
on saying, oh you know, you 
know, we tell you to do 900 

1430
00:58:00,840 --> 00:58:03,270
hours of stuff a week. 
Well, rather than us just 

1431
00:58:03,280 --> 00:58:06,410
leaving it at that, here is how 
we think it can actually be done

1432
00:58:06,420 --> 00:58:08,890
and giving schools a suggested 
timetable to work from. 

1433
00:58:08,900 --> 00:58:11,230
They don't have to follow it, 
but the idea is look, it can be 

1434
00:58:11,240 --> 00:58:15,530
done in like a standard 9 to 
3/3/15 way. 

1435
00:58:15,540 --> 00:58:17,610
This is how we would do it. 
You can adapt it how you like. 

1436
00:58:17,620 --> 00:58:19,610
Obviously schools are different 
in terms of their times. 

1437
00:58:19,960 --> 00:58:23,300
So you can adapt it or not. 
You can adapt it, but I think 

1438
00:58:23,310 --> 00:58:24,300
they take the lead on it, I 
think. 

1439
00:58:24,310 --> 00:58:26,520
This is a fantastic thought 
experiment that would never 

1440
00:58:26,530 --> 00:58:28,610
happen because I actually really
get your point here. 

1441
00:58:28,660 --> 00:58:32,650
Because what, what essentially 
you're saying is we don't, we 

1442
00:58:32,660 --> 00:58:34,770
don't actually want this 
timetable from the government. 

1443
00:58:34,780 --> 00:58:37,290
What we want them to realise is 
their expectations are insane. 

1444
00:58:37,300 --> 00:58:39,970
Yeah, because, because what I 
would argue is this timetable 

1445
00:58:39,980 --> 00:58:41,170
doesn't exist. 
Yeah. 

1446
00:58:41,180 --> 00:58:43,270
So then doing it would strip 
back the expectations. 

1447
00:58:43,280 --> 00:58:45,090
Exactly, I completely get what 
you mean cause that kind of 

1448
00:58:45,100 --> 00:58:47,410
comes in with the fact that the 
one thing we do need is a strict

1449
00:58:47,420 --> 00:58:49,990
back curriculum, which will 
never happen because of optics. 

1450
00:58:50,130 --> 00:58:52,990
The government will never give 
us a suggested timetable because

1451
00:58:53,000 --> 00:58:55,520
it simply does not work. 
And it would be them admitting 

1452
00:58:55,530 --> 00:58:57,450
that the current curriculum 
doesn't work and these stripping

1453
00:58:57,460 --> 00:59:00,270
back, and then when they don't 
strip it back, that that's just 

1454
00:59:00,280 --> 00:59:02,160
either way, they're screwed. 
Yeah. 

1455
00:59:02,170 --> 00:59:05,100
Yeah. 
So I I you've worded it in a way

1456
00:59:05,110 --> 00:59:06,190
where I actually don't. 
Disagree. 

1457
00:59:06,200 --> 00:59:09,090
Yeah, now I change it as I was. 
Saying no because, because what 

1458
00:59:09,100 --> 00:59:12,880
what we're basically saying is 
here, OK, if you ask me to do 

1459
00:59:12,890 --> 00:59:15,720
all of this stuff, prove to me 
it can be done and they can't, 

1460
00:59:15,770 --> 00:59:17,330
OK. 
And if they did, and if they 

1461
00:59:17,340 --> 00:59:20,130
did, it would be awesome. 
Yeah, if they came out like a 

1462
00:59:20,140 --> 00:59:22,790
three-week timetable, if you 
follow it, it's quite strict. 

1463
00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:25,210
But if you do it to the minute, 
you do actually get all of your 

1464
00:59:25,220 --> 00:59:26,830
allocated time in. 
For what subjects? 

1465
00:59:26,840 --> 00:59:30,300
Do you know what I'd be like? 
Let's do it, let's do it, let's 

1466
00:59:30,310 --> 00:59:32,720
find out, let's do it and see. 
Because you need to have a bit 

1467
00:59:32,730 --> 00:59:34,110
of an open mind, this kind of 
stuff. 

1468
00:59:34,160 --> 00:59:36,850
If they did that and they were 
like, we are literally the 

1469
00:59:36,860 --> 00:59:39,430
government, by the way, and we 
literally inform Ofsted what to 

1470
00:59:39,440 --> 00:59:41,310
inspect. 
I know hospital independent, but

1471
00:59:41,400 --> 00:59:44,990
we are in charge of this. 
Yeah, we're gonna judge you by 

1472
00:59:45,000 --> 00:59:47,030
this. 
OK, cool. 

1473
00:59:47,160 --> 00:59:50,190
Because the problem that was 
current and problem, by the way,

1474
00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:53,650
one way, the current, the 
current problem we have is that 

1475
00:59:53,760 --> 00:59:56,650
we all sit around and pretend 
everything's OK. 

1476
00:59:57,020 --> 00:59:59,970
And then it's all dandy pandy. 
And this, this, this lovely 

1477
00:59:59,980 --> 01:00:01,170
curriculum. 
Can we fit in? 

1478
01:00:01,180 --> 01:00:02,350
Ohh. 
It's we've got all the time. 

1479
01:00:02,820 --> 01:00:05,200
We all know. 
That can't happen, but we all 

1480
01:00:05,210 --> 01:00:06,860
still just crack on and pretend 
it can. 

1481
01:00:07,030 --> 01:00:10,060
And when Ofsted coming in, we 
all put on a show. 

1482
01:00:10,120 --> 01:00:11,100
Hmm. 
No. 

1483
01:00:11,150 --> 01:00:14,780
Very rarely will anyone have the
balls to say this doesn't work, 

1484
01:00:14,790 --> 01:00:16,840
by the way. 
Yeah, I'm pretending. 

1485
01:00:16,900 --> 01:00:19,500
I'm pretending for you right now
because this doesn't actually 

1486
01:00:19,510 --> 01:00:22,220
work. 
Because you want to see advanced

1487
01:00:22,230 --> 01:00:24,940
progress in this child's 
reading, The only way we can do 

1488
01:00:24,950 --> 01:00:27,440
that is to do afternoon 
interventions with this child 

1489
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:29,850
during their history time. 
So I'm gonna pretend because 

1490
01:00:29,860 --> 01:00:31,880
you're in this room that we 
never, ever take them out of the

1491
01:00:31,890 --> 01:00:34,200
core curriculum because it's so 
important and we know it can't 

1492
01:00:34,210 --> 01:00:35,620
possibly the curriculum. 
Yes. 

1493
01:00:35,630 --> 01:00:39,580
Sorry, that's wrong. 
I just see the curriculum 

1494
01:00:40,210 --> 01:00:41,720
school. 
But when we don't take them out 

1495
01:00:41,730 --> 01:00:43,510
of the question, we take them 
out of history in the afternoon.

1496
01:00:43,520 --> 01:00:46,090
No, cause of course we don't. 
We got history is so important. 

1497
01:00:46,100 --> 01:00:48,300
Yeah, but we do because we need 
to make sure they can read. 

1498
01:00:48,310 --> 01:00:49,560
Cause you gonna judge me on that
instead? 

1499
01:00:49,570 --> 01:00:51,770
Such a fun. 
So we all just pretend it's just

1500
01:00:51,780 --> 01:00:55,000
this make believe world where 
everyone has a timetable in 

1501
01:00:55,010 --> 01:00:56,590
school which doesn't actually 
work. 

1502
01:00:56,640 --> 01:00:58,690
And please let us know if you 
have one that does work. 

1503
01:00:58,700 --> 01:01:02,370
But I'm pretty sure when you say
it works, part of that will be. 

1504
01:01:02,380 --> 01:01:04,790
We don't really do worry that 
doesn't work. 

1505
01:01:04,800 --> 01:01:08,850
Then obviously is not a. 
Time to let us know and keep 

1506
01:01:08,860 --> 01:01:10,770
going down this rabbit hole and 
keep getting you getting you 

1507
01:01:10,780 --> 01:01:13,260
thinking Next one the government
are going to do in my made-up 

1508
01:01:13,270 --> 01:01:17,540
world is they are going to be 
extremely strict on workload 

1509
01:01:17,550 --> 01:01:20,780
policies and it's enforced. 
It's not like a it's not a what 

1510
01:01:20,790 --> 01:01:22,980
it currently is, which is always
had a meeting about it and we 

1511
01:01:22,990 --> 01:01:25,270
think schools should consider 
these things to manage work like

1512
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:26,960
this. 
No, no, no, this is completely 

1513
01:01:26,970 --> 01:01:28,960
enforced now and you're 
completely accountable for it. 

1514
01:01:29,030 --> 01:01:31,420
This is the world of policy for 
the UK, for teachers. 

1515
01:01:31,430 --> 01:01:34,120
Every school has to adhere to 
this and if you don't often 

1516
01:01:34,130 --> 01:01:35,800
doing your. 
Part, it doesn't work because 

1517
01:01:35,810 --> 01:01:37,760
offset are gonna rip you apart. 
Do you date to it? 

1518
01:01:37,840 --> 01:01:39,980
Because if you do a date to that
workload policy, right. 

1519
01:01:39,990 --> 01:01:42,680
Any workload policy let's 
introduce for teachers will 

1520
01:01:42,690 --> 01:01:45,120
decrease the amount of work 
teachers do by definition. 

1521
01:01:45,130 --> 01:01:47,120
Yeah, because we're saying this 
problem, we do too much work. 

1522
01:01:47,170 --> 01:01:49,490
So any workload policy that 
comes in will come with a 

1523
01:01:49,500 --> 01:01:52,600
decrease in work, which comes 
with a decrease in output, which

1524
01:01:52,610 --> 01:01:54,540
comes with a decrease in 
standards for our children. 

1525
01:01:54,550 --> 01:01:56,790
Well, it's just like a managing 
change policy or it's like you 

1526
01:01:56,800 --> 01:01:58,780
still get things done. 
It's just as sort you're now 

1527
01:01:58,790 --> 01:02:02,200
completely accountable for. 
Whatever it's dressed up as, 

1528
01:02:02,300 --> 01:02:04,540
right? 
Just honestly, the only way we 

1529
01:02:04,550 --> 01:02:07,160
fix workload is to produce work.
So if you're spreading out 

1530
01:02:07,240 --> 01:02:10,170
whatever you think you can call 
it, whatever you want, the only 

1531
01:02:10,180 --> 01:02:13,100
way to reduce workload is that 
teachers do less work, right? 

1532
01:02:13,110 --> 01:02:16,490
So in the same time frame, less 
stuff gets done, whether it's a 

1533
01:02:16,500 --> 01:02:17,920
year, two years, three years. 
OK. 

1534
01:02:17,930 --> 01:02:19,860
So yeah, managed workload, 
instead of a year, we did over 

1535
01:02:19,870 --> 01:02:20,970
three. 
So how do you make a call? 

1536
01:02:20,980 --> 01:02:23,050
Everything that you have done in
year two and three you're not 

1537
01:02:23,060 --> 01:02:24,990
doing. 
So it is less work, right. 

1538
01:02:25,160 --> 01:02:28,950
And that does not work until we 
go back to the root system, 

1539
01:02:29,020 --> 01:02:30,490
which is how we're judged as 
teachers. 

1540
01:02:30,720 --> 01:02:32,990
So it's all well and good. 
And This is why, This is why the

1541
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:35,210
government will never take it 
seriously because it comes down 

1542
01:02:35,220 --> 01:02:37,530
to two things, like this kind of
scheme that we've got here. 

1543
01:02:37,620 --> 01:02:39,430
We need budget stripped. 
Well, no. 

1544
01:02:39,440 --> 01:02:41,750
We need a we forget budget. 
Right. 

1545
01:02:41,800 --> 01:02:43,350
I'm thinking of ways we could 
actually do this. 

1546
01:02:43,360 --> 01:02:44,730
Yeah, sure. 
We could strip back the 

1547
01:02:44,740 --> 01:02:45,590
curriculum. 
Yeah. 

1548
01:02:45,660 --> 01:02:47,280
And we could change how estate 
judge scores. 

1549
01:02:47,290 --> 01:02:47,890
Yeah. 
OK. 

1550
01:02:47,900 --> 01:02:50,040
They're the two things that if 
we're not got budget to 

1551
01:02:50,050 --> 01:02:52,910
increase, that they have to 
change to actually reduce 

1552
01:02:52,920 --> 01:02:53,790
workloads. 
Yeah. 

1553
01:02:53,800 --> 01:02:56,890
And until those two things 
change, if we keep those the 

1554
01:02:56,900 --> 01:02:59,530
same, but we have the government
going, Why don't you do less 

1555
01:02:59,540 --> 01:03:01,270
work? 
Because there's a problem. 

1556
01:03:01,560 --> 01:03:03,190
Why don't you? 
You're going to pay us more? 

1557
01:03:03,200 --> 01:03:04,930
No. 
Are you going to stop judging us

1558
01:03:04,940 --> 01:03:06,630
in the same way? 
No. 

1559
01:03:06,980 --> 01:03:08,050
OK. 
Well, I can't do less. 

1560
01:03:08,120 --> 01:03:10,120
Working, it's like a try, you 
know, the classic triangle. 

1561
01:03:10,130 --> 01:03:12,300
So it's like, pick any two 
things exactly of the three, 

1562
01:03:12,310 --> 01:03:14,160
yeah. 
It's like you're with adulthood.

1563
01:03:14,170 --> 01:03:18,130
It's like sleeping time. 
And in this one it's literally 

1564
01:03:18,140 --> 01:03:20,310
like funding. 
And then the two things you just

1565
01:03:20,320 --> 01:03:24,370
said, which was Ofsted, Ofsted 
judgement, lowering probably and

1566
01:03:24,380 --> 01:03:25,900
stripping back the curriculum, 
managing work. 

1567
01:03:25,910 --> 01:03:27,450
But two of those things. 
Pick two of those things. 

1568
01:03:27,460 --> 01:03:29,080
You can have any 2. 
Or just one thing. 

1569
01:03:30,540 --> 01:03:32,670
Just give us. 
So if if funding can't budge, 

1570
01:03:32,680 --> 01:03:37,150
which is the which is the whole 
thing, we've got the anti fancy 

1571
01:03:37,160 --> 01:03:37,890
nice things. 
Ohh. 

1572
01:03:37,900 --> 01:03:39,510
Well we're going to come in and 
do a new guy. 

1573
01:03:39,520 --> 01:03:41,890
We're gonna look after teacher. 
None of that matters unless you 

1574
01:03:41,900 --> 01:03:44,330
give us more money or strip. 
Back on time if Ofsted was 

1575
01:03:44,340 --> 01:03:46,310
sorted out though right? 
If teachers were judged 

1576
01:03:46,320 --> 01:03:48,310
properly, would you? 
Would you be up for that idea? 

1577
01:03:48,320 --> 01:03:50,490
Having government LED enforced 
1. 

1578
01:03:50,500 --> 01:03:53,370
Percent Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
Because because to me anymore 

1579
01:03:53,420 --> 01:03:58,030
all all I see there right 
Enforce OK, so if someone wants 

1580
01:03:58,040 --> 01:04:00,540
to do something I think would be
insane to tell them they're not.

1581
01:04:00,550 --> 01:04:01,490
Allowed to do of. 
Course. 

1582
01:04:01,500 --> 01:04:03,330
So when you say. 
In full, but like you but by 

1583
01:04:03,340 --> 01:04:06,250
enforced I mean the policy is 
we're not slot aren't allowed to

1584
01:04:06,260 --> 01:04:09,270
tell you to go. 
And do this thing and all I see 

1585
01:04:09,280 --> 01:04:12,210
that as right is just making us 
in line with pretty much any job

1586
01:04:12,220 --> 01:04:13,050
ever. 
Yeah. 

1587
01:04:13,060 --> 01:04:16,300
So, yeah, of course, of course 
it's fine because you know what?

1588
01:04:16,310 --> 01:04:21,130
You could be in school from half
seven till half four, right. 

1589
01:04:21,180 --> 01:04:22,250
Let's think about that for a 
minute. 

1590
01:04:22,260 --> 01:04:24,850
That's nine hours straight away.
Teachers work for their breaks 

1591
01:04:24,860 --> 01:04:26,320
all the time. 
Might get half an hour to eat 

1592
01:04:26,330 --> 01:04:28,090
your lunch while you're doing 
something else, maybe. 

1593
01:04:28,100 --> 01:04:29,870
Or even you block it out and 
you're really good. 

1594
01:04:29,910 --> 01:04:32,420
That's still longer than a 
normal day's work, OK. 

1595
01:04:32,760 --> 01:04:36,400
And that is simply delivering 
lessons and marking your books 

1596
01:04:36,490 --> 01:04:38,980
and prepping your lessons, OK? 
No planning. 

1597
01:04:39,230 --> 01:04:43,120
No planning involved. 
So it's it wouldn't work. 

1598
01:04:43,270 --> 01:04:45,050
It just wouldn't work straight 
away. 

1599
01:04:45,150 --> 01:04:47,340
You know, we get into this 
profession because we don't mind

1600
01:04:47,350 --> 01:04:48,960
doing the extra. 
Stuff it's. 

1601
01:04:49,030 --> 01:04:51,460
So pay us more, is that? 
That's what you have to do. 

1602
01:04:51,470 --> 01:04:53,720
You have to keep paying. 
And if pay gets chipped away, 

1603
01:04:53,730 --> 01:04:56,200
we're at that balance now where 
it's like, cool goodwill runs 

1604
01:04:56,210 --> 01:04:57,760
out. 
Yeah, the counter arguments, my 

1605
01:04:57,770 --> 01:05:00,820
own point there, because you 
just made me think of it, is is 

1606
01:05:00,990 --> 01:05:04,480
this is the classic example, but
on a massive wider scale of when

1607
01:05:04,490 --> 01:05:09,130
the head teacher comes round to 
you at 5:00 and says go home, I 

1608
01:05:09,140 --> 01:05:10,640
wanna work. 
Doesn't actually go away. 

1609
01:05:10,650 --> 01:05:13,200
Even if the policy does tell me 
to go home and have weekends and

1610
01:05:13,210 --> 01:05:15,160
I can't work at the weekend. 
So I gotta get the freaking work

1611
01:05:15,170 --> 01:05:16,800
done though, isn't it? 
So yeah. 

1612
01:05:16,810 --> 01:05:18,820
So yeah, all of these things 
come with lots. 

1613
01:05:18,830 --> 01:05:21,040
Of, and This is why I don't 
think This is why actually I 

1614
01:05:21,050 --> 01:05:23,860
don't think there's a solution 
because I do honestly think it's

1615
01:05:23,870 --> 01:05:26,800
either funding that won't 
happen, lowering the standards 

1616
01:05:26,810 --> 01:05:29,080
for our children that won't 
happen because it's optics is 

1617
01:05:29,090 --> 01:05:30,310
terrible. 
Whether that's stripping out the

1618
01:05:30,320 --> 01:05:34,040
curriculum, lowering offset 
expectations, that won't happen.

1619
01:05:34,090 --> 01:05:36,300
So we're left with the third 
one, which is what's currently 

1620
01:05:36,310 --> 01:05:38,330
happening, which is everyone 
closes their eyes and hopes 

1621
01:05:38,340 --> 01:05:40,530
teachers just make do. 
Yeah, we we just advise the 

1622
01:05:40,540 --> 01:05:43,270
government advises teachers to 
do this knowing that they can't 

1623
01:05:43,280 --> 01:05:45,210
really do it, but just saying 
come on, I'll just. 

1624
01:05:45,220 --> 01:05:48,100
Fit all this into the timetable,
I'll just do a bit less if we 

1625
01:05:48,110 --> 01:05:49,160
actually got you to sit down 
and. 

1626
01:05:49,170 --> 01:05:52,670
Manage your workload. 
Come on, we're not going to 

1627
01:05:52,680 --> 01:05:54,590
enforce it. 
We know literally can't happen, 

1628
01:05:54,650 --> 01:05:56,530
but just manage it. 
Just managing. 

1629
01:05:56,540 --> 01:05:58,670
OK, last one from me, then we'll
end this conversation. 

1630
01:05:58,770 --> 01:06:01,330
Another government come along 
and say we are now taking 

1631
01:06:01,340 --> 01:06:05,210
control of this marking 
policies, marking that we have a

1632
01:06:05,220 --> 01:06:07,550
UK way of marking now. 
It's not up to schools anymore. 

1633
01:06:07,560 --> 01:06:09,180
Some of you got your fancy pants
ways of marking. 

1634
01:06:09,190 --> 01:06:11,410
Some of you draconian Victorian 
ways of marking. 

1635
01:06:11,460 --> 01:06:13,210
This is how we mark in the UK 
now. 

1636
01:06:13,300 --> 01:06:15,110
We've decided research says this
is best. 

1637
01:06:15,210 --> 01:06:16,910
Every school now must mark like 
this. 

1638
01:06:16,960 --> 01:06:18,630
I don't like it. 
I don't like I don't like 

1639
01:06:18,640 --> 01:06:20,740
anything which is topped down. 
You have to do this from the 

1640
01:06:20,750 --> 01:06:24,640
government and and the look, 
this is it's it's a double sided

1641
01:06:24,650 --> 01:06:26,490
coin because with that freedom, 
right? 

1642
01:06:26,580 --> 01:06:29,630
We currently have that freedom, 
I'd argue, but it's completely 

1643
01:06:29,640 --> 01:06:32,610
broken because the freedom is do
how you want, but you need to do

1644
01:06:32,620 --> 01:06:34,640
all of these things are really 
high level, but not very. 

1645
01:06:34,650 --> 01:06:36,250
Much because they come in and 
they will judge. 

1646
01:06:36,260 --> 01:06:39,530
It's a classic government, kind 
of especially conservative in 

1647
01:06:39,540 --> 01:06:41,850
the last 10 to 15 years. 
It's like we're gonna give all 

1648
01:06:41,860 --> 01:06:43,310
the power to the local 
authorities. 

1649
01:06:43,400 --> 01:06:46,010
You're an Academy trust. 
You've got all the power now. 

1650
01:06:46,060 --> 01:06:48,210
But here's your money part, and 
it doesn't cover everything, but

1651
01:06:48,220 --> 01:06:49,920
you've got all the power to do 
what you want with money. 

1652
01:06:49,930 --> 01:06:51,690
Yeah. 
So when you decide not to hire a

1653
01:06:51,700 --> 01:06:53,270
site manager, that's not down to
me. 

1654
01:06:53,320 --> 01:06:55,090
Yeah, but it is because you give
them less money. 

1655
01:06:55,140 --> 01:06:56,850
So I see the same problem here, 
right? 

1656
01:06:56,860 --> 01:06:58,910
Yeah. 
Schools right now can have 

1657
01:06:58,920 --> 01:07:00,240
whatever marking policy they see
fit. 

1658
01:07:00,250 --> 01:07:02,640
Ofsted won't have a specific 
marketing policy they want to 

1659
01:07:02,650 --> 01:07:05,390
see as long as it's consistent 
and the outcomes are good and 

1660
01:07:05,400 --> 01:07:06,750
it's consistent across the 
school. 

1661
01:07:06,880 --> 01:07:09,110
Like, that's all well and good. 
OK. 

1662
01:07:09,540 --> 01:07:12,980
But, you know, the, the, the 
government then coming along and

1663
01:07:12,990 --> 01:07:16,000
saying, no, you have to do it 
this way is equally insane to me

1664
01:07:16,050 --> 01:07:18,000
because there might just be a 
school where things worked 

1665
01:07:18,010 --> 01:07:18,860
really well. 
Yeah. 

1666
01:07:18,870 --> 01:07:21,080
And there might be a mixed way 
of marking where actually, you 

1667
01:07:21,090 --> 01:07:22,440
know, there's no written 
feedback. 

1668
01:07:22,450 --> 01:07:24,880
But maybe there is just a bit on
their independent writing 

1669
01:07:24,890 --> 01:07:26,510
because we find that really 
works well. 

1670
01:07:26,520 --> 01:07:27,400
Our children. 
Yeah. 

1671
01:07:27,410 --> 01:07:30,100
Or you've got the flexibility as
a teacher to be like, you know 

1672
01:07:30,110 --> 01:07:33,260
what, today, tomorrow, the next 
day, it's kind of a flow of 

1673
01:07:33,270 --> 01:07:34,740
learning. 
I don't really need to assess 

1674
01:07:34,750 --> 01:07:36,520
them because I'm gonna carry on 
this lesson tomorrow. 

1675
01:07:36,530 --> 01:07:38,500
I'm gonna have a whole week of 
doing money. 

1676
01:07:38,610 --> 01:07:40,820
Me individually assessing every 
day is kind of pointless. 

1677
01:07:40,830 --> 01:07:42,920
I'm going to assess them at the 
end of the week because I can 

1678
01:07:42,930 --> 01:07:44,990
see where they've got to and I'm
gonna react as the as the week 

1679
01:07:45,000 --> 01:07:46,630
goes on. 
Next week, however, I'm just 

1680
01:07:46,640 --> 01:07:48,890
doing a shape standalone lesson 
I really want to have on there. 

1681
01:07:48,900 --> 01:07:51,120
So I'm gonna assess them. 
That's fluid and that's good 

1682
01:07:51,130 --> 01:07:52,610
teaching. 
That's good assessment. 

1683
01:07:52,900 --> 01:07:55,050
Top down of saying you have to 
do it like this. 

1684
01:07:55,060 --> 01:07:57,350
There will be points where it's 
not suitable and that would be 

1685
01:07:57,360 --> 01:08:00,460
silly. 
My my overall point here, we 

1686
01:08:00,470 --> 01:08:02,980
need freedom as teachers to 
exercise our professional 

1687
01:08:02,990 --> 01:08:04,880
judgement because we are 
professionals and we've had 

1688
01:08:04,890 --> 01:08:07,440
training and a lot of us have 
been doing this for a long time 

1689
01:08:07,550 --> 01:08:09,360
and we know what's good for the 
children. 

1690
01:08:09,530 --> 01:08:13,820
However, until those you know, 
what the government can do, 

1691
01:08:13,830 --> 01:08:16,899
which doesn't cost any money, 
but it looks bad optically. 

1692
01:08:16,950 --> 01:08:19,880
Yeah, is kind of to strip. 
Things summarise what I think. 

1693
01:08:19,890 --> 01:08:22,029
I think you made really good 
points there and that was a good

1694
01:08:22,040 --> 01:08:23,819
discussion. 
So I'm seeing this as the 

1695
01:08:23,830 --> 01:08:25,939
freedom is good, we should 
maintain the freedoms that 

1696
01:08:25,950 --> 01:08:29,240
schools have, but if we want to 
fix the problems that are that 

1697
01:08:29,250 --> 01:08:31,840
do this, which is which is my 
overall point, really, it was 

1698
01:08:31,850 --> 01:08:34,510
that I kind of want schools not 
to be unbelievably different to 

1699
01:08:34,520 --> 01:08:38,060
work in, which is true. 
It's the undercurrents that 

1700
01:08:38,069 --> 01:08:40,880
affects the pressure and the 
culture that we experience that 

1701
01:08:40,890 --> 01:08:44,370
actually push schools to make 
these decisions, which we're 

1702
01:08:44,380 --> 01:08:46,479
deeming as mental, which I'm, 
you know, are the reasons I'm 

1703
01:08:46,490 --> 01:08:48,439
thinking maybe the government 
needs to step in and stop this 

1704
01:08:48,450 --> 01:08:50,149
happening. 
Actually, the freedom is good. 

1705
01:08:50,189 --> 01:08:53,180
The government needs to step in 
and help to change the culture. 

1706
01:08:53,250 --> 01:08:55,180
They need to sort out Ofsted. 
They need to give us more 

1707
01:08:55,189 --> 01:08:56,819
funding. 
They need to stop teachers. 

1708
01:08:56,910 --> 01:08:58,880
They need, I think they should 
come in like they're doing right

1709
01:08:58,890 --> 01:09:02,399
now with the workload and and 
work life balance policy and 

1710
01:09:02,410 --> 01:09:04,470
stuff and just be a bit more 
hard on that in terms of like, 

1711
01:09:04,479 --> 01:09:06,220
yeah, actually it is really, 
really important. 

1712
01:09:06,229 --> 01:09:08,140
We change the culture we're 
gonna make, we're gonna really 

1713
01:09:08,149 --> 01:09:09,880
encourage all heads to think 
it's really, really, really 

1714
01:09:09,890 --> 01:09:11,520
important. 
And you can kind of do with it 

1715
01:09:11,529 --> 01:09:14,000
how you will. 
But yeah, changing the culture 

1716
01:09:14,010 --> 01:09:16,130
really important. 
Let's not pretend we can do less

1717
01:09:16,140 --> 01:09:18,010
work though. 
No, have the same. 

1718
01:09:18,060 --> 01:09:20,210
No, no standards you're 
completely agree with. 

1719
01:09:20,220 --> 01:09:21,569
So we're funding. 
It's kind of like that. 

1720
01:09:21,580 --> 01:09:23,560
Fixes a lot of that. 
More people and more people is 

1721
01:09:23,569 --> 01:09:25,630
better. 
Two people can do the same. 

1722
01:09:25,680 --> 01:09:28,350
This one job, you got 12 hours, 
OK, two people do it, six hours 

1723
01:09:28,359 --> 01:09:30,990
each, done fine. 
Just give us the money to get 

1724
01:09:31,000 --> 01:09:32,910
the people in to do it, 
basically. 

1725
01:09:32,960 --> 01:09:35,880
So depressing ending really is 
that none of this can possibly 

1726
01:09:35,890 --> 01:09:38,590
happen because the government 
will never be the funding. 

1727
01:09:38,600 --> 01:09:39,689
It's too far gone, the 
fundraise. 

1728
01:09:39,700 --> 01:09:42,470
The Tories have stripped back 
education so, so badly now that 

1729
01:09:42,479 --> 01:09:46,920
it's irreparable. 
Um, the curriculum can't be 

1730
01:09:46,930 --> 01:09:49,990
stripped back because we again, 
the Tories have made it so 

1731
01:09:50,160 --> 01:09:52,880
ridiculously overweight and you 
need to learn so much stuff now 

1732
01:09:52,890 --> 01:09:55,380
that the only possible way now 
is backwards to actually make 

1733
01:09:55,390 --> 01:09:56,450
the curriculum good for our 
kids. 

1734
01:09:56,460 --> 01:09:58,190
And that will always look bad 
for government, so they'll never

1735
01:09:58,200 --> 01:10:00,390
do it. 
And then what is the Third Point

1736
01:10:00,400 --> 01:10:02,830
was about Ofsted? 
Yeah. 

1737
01:10:02,840 --> 01:10:04,310
It was like it probably could 
fix that one. 

1738
01:10:04,320 --> 01:10:06,710
Yeah, I think we could fix 
Ofsted start there. 

1739
01:10:07,060 --> 01:10:08,670
Yeah. 
That's the issue we're currently

1740
01:10:08,680 --> 01:10:10,000
facing. 
I think there are some things we

1741
01:10:10,010 --> 01:10:11,270
can do. 
I think schools need more 

1742
01:10:11,280 --> 01:10:14,220
autonomy. 
I think the pressures, pillars, 

1743
01:10:14,230 --> 01:10:18,920
basically government, Ofsted, 
SLT, yeah, Honestly, as a 

1744
01:10:18,930 --> 01:10:21,000
teacher you don't really have 
control over those things. 

1745
01:10:21,130 --> 01:10:24,680
So do what you can do as a 
teacher and apply pressure where

1746
01:10:24,690 --> 01:10:27,000
we can to these three pillars. 
Hopefully it changes. 

1747
01:10:27,230 --> 01:10:29,420
Will it change? 
Am I quite confident that in 

1748
01:10:29,430 --> 01:10:32,350
five years time, at the end of 
the next parliament, do I think 

1749
01:10:32,360 --> 01:10:33,880
that we will transform the 
education? 

1750
01:10:33,940 --> 01:10:36,480
Absolutely. 
Not, no, absolutely not. 

1751
01:10:36,490 --> 01:10:39,560
So let's finish up then. 
Dylan, I'll ask you the title of

1752
01:10:39,570 --> 01:10:43,120
the podcast again. 
Do we need a new national 

1753
01:10:43,130 --> 01:10:44,770
curriculum? 
New. 

1754
01:10:44,920 --> 01:10:46,810
All right, guys, thanks very 
much for joining us. 

1755
01:10:47,300 --> 01:10:50,490
Really, really depressing ending
to the episode. 

1756
01:10:50,500 --> 01:10:53,210
No, I actually enjoy the 
conversation and let us know 

1757
01:10:53,220 --> 01:10:55,190
what you think. 
Please get in touch at each seat

1758
01:10:55,200 --> 01:10:56,850
podcast. 
I say so quickly. 

1759
01:10:56,860 --> 01:10:59,910
I worry that. 
This is a teach teach sleep, 

1760
01:10:59,920 --> 01:11:02,460
repeat podcast on Instagram. 
That's where we see everything. 

1761
01:11:02,470 --> 01:11:04,710
Sent us a message. 
Come along for the ride. 

1762
01:11:04,720 --> 01:11:08,620
We're off to centre box now so 
they'll probably be an episode 

1763
01:11:08,630 --> 01:11:11,400
next week, don't know. 
Yeah, we can reflect in our week

1764
01:11:11,440 --> 01:11:14,580
swimming and pretending that 
it's gonna be a really nice they

1765
01:11:14,590 --> 01:11:16,790
actually we've got two babies 
under a year, so I'd be really. 

1766
01:11:16,800 --> 01:11:18,500
Stressful. 
Ohh, no nice. 

1767
01:11:18,600 --> 01:11:20,850
Well joining next week because 
it will be we'll definitely have

1768
01:11:20,860 --> 01:11:22,610
a reflection on the fact that we
took two babies on holiday. 

1769
01:11:22,620 --> 01:11:24,070
It'll be it'll be a good. 
Laugh, it'll be a good laugh. 

1770
01:11:24,080 --> 01:11:26,410
See you. 
Then see you later, bye bye bye.

1771
01:11:26,450 --> 01:11:27,570
See you now. 
Bye bye. 

1772
01:11:28,560 --> 01:11:30,290
See you later. 
Bye bye. 

1773
01:11:30,300 --> 01:11:30,720
See you.