1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,360 Hi, Ofsted, just a quick one from me. 2 00:00:02,360 --> 00:00:04,560 Teacher here. Just wondering, saw the 3 00:00:04,560 --> 00:00:07,160 announcements this week of how you're making reforms to how you 4 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:10,160 judge schools and we are just wondering what on earth are you 5 00:00:10,160 --> 00:00:11,800 thinking? Raising standards, that's what 6 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:13,720 we do. We are fixing education. 7 00:00:13,720 --> 00:00:14,240 Right. OK. 8 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:15,600 So let's just rewind for a second. 9 00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:17,960 If you think that's what's happening, you did, I think a 10 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:19,760 while ago you called it a listen or was it? 11 00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:21,800 No, it wasn't just a listen. It was a big listen. 12 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:25,240 We listened big to you guys. You did, but did you hear 13 00:00:25,240 --> 00:00:27,440 anything we said? Because I'm pretty sure when 14 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:29,080 teachers were typing away saying, oh, instead of 15 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:31,040 listening, isn't that nice, this isn't that lovely, and we type 16 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:32,680 it away. I'm not sure this is what we 17 00:00:32,680 --> 00:00:34,480 asked for. What do you take us for? 18 00:00:34,480 --> 00:00:36,040 Of course we listened. We listened to big. 19 00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:37,640 Did you not hear that? OK, We listened big to 20 00:00:37,640 --> 00:00:40,680 everything you said and you told us get rid of those one word 21 00:00:40,680 --> 00:00:42,360 judgments. It's too much pressure and 22 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:44,080 overall judgement for our school. 23 00:00:44,160 --> 00:00:45,800 That's nasty. So do you know what we did? 24 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:48,120 We scrapped them, didn't we? Yep, that was good and we were 25 00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:49,800 very, very grateful. I think back at the time we were 26 00:00:49,800 --> 00:00:51,720 all over like, wow, we're still on the same page as we're 27 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:53,840 getting rid of those one word judgments. 28 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:56,640 Thank you. Also, you got rid of those 29 00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:59,520 outstanding labels and requires improvement. 30 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:00,400 And we thought you, you know what? 31 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:02,120 This is a step in the right direction. 32 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:03,680 But then we saw what you replaced it with. 33 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:06,120 Well, we replace it with a much better system. 34 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:09,040 We got rid of those one word judgments that were horrible and 35 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:11,680 putting all this pressure and crushing schools, and we 36 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:15,120 replaced it with nine different standards in which we attach a 37 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:17,640 colour. Okay, and the colours have a one 38 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:18,800 word attachment. OK, it's cool. 39 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:21,320 So just to clarify what's happened here, you've got rid of 40 00:01:21,320 --> 00:01:24,520 one overall judgement, which is scary and horrible, replaced it 41 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,080 with a much more granular system where we can still get judged on 42 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:29,000 individual things massively over the top. 43 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:32,280 And instead of just having a word, you've got rid of the word 44 00:01:32,760 --> 00:01:34,640 change it for a colour. So we've got a nice lovely Nando 45 00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:36,840 system. And then when we had the colour 46 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:39,160 you thought, you know what these colours need one word, attach 47 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:41,000 them. That is exactly what we did 48 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:44,560 because we listened to you and that is what you wanted. 49 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:45,960 You're never, ever going to change, are you? 50 00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:51,360 We changed for the. Hello everyone, and welcome back 51 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:53,040 to another episode of Teach Sleep Repeat. 52 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:55,000 My name is Dylan. And my name is Hayden. 53 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:59,040 We are here to listen to you and you are listening to us, Hayden. 54 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:01,080 You snap out of the skit now you're not. 55 00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:03,880 You're not an absurd Ofsted spokesperson trying to justify 56 00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:05,360 the most insane changes we've ever seen. 57 00:02:05,360 --> 00:02:07,120 I'm so sorry, I really got into character. 58 00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:07,960 That's fine, don't worry about it. 59 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:09,520 We're going to talk about it more a bit later on. 60 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:12,320 OK, So if you click on this episode, we will dive into it 61 00:02:12,320 --> 00:02:15,240 and I'm sure you're waiting to hear exactly what we have to say 62 00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:20,120 about the new what's in dubbed Nando's card system before 63 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:23,680 judging your absence is Lemon and Herb. 64 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:26,000 Anyway, let's have a quick catch up. 65 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:28,920 I wanted to talk first, hey there about something rather 66 00:02:28,920 --> 00:02:32,400 exciting because I'm not sure what's happened in 2025 at the 67 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:34,560 podcast. I don't know, behind the scenes 68 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:38,440 someone is just sharing us to an unreal platform or just being 69 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:41,640 pushed out there or maybe just simply we are growing. 70 00:02:41,640 --> 00:02:48,240 But the podcast has reached #12 in the UK education charts and 71 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:53,000 to me, when I see the people around us huge podcasts, I find 72 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:53,480 it insane. But. 73 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:56,480 Considering we weren't even in the charts, you know, even just 74 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:59,160 like a couple of months ago. We've flirted with the charts 75 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:01,320 before, we've been in and around, we've been in the top 76 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:05,240 150, baby, let's go. But in the last few weeks it's 77 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:08,240 gone insane. So I just wanted to say a huge 78 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:09,520 thank you to everyone who's been listening. 79 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:12,480 Not only 12 in the Apple education charts for the UK, 80 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:14,920 we're in like the top 30 for Spotify as well. 81 00:03:14,920 --> 00:03:16,280 That's incredible. It's just mad. 82 00:03:16,400 --> 00:03:17,720 That's a harder 1 to get into, isn't it I? 83 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:19,760 Think so I think their algorithms are a bit like 84 00:03:19,760 --> 00:03:22,000 different how they judge I don't know but at the end of the day 85 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:26,600 these these big huge platforms for podcasts are ranking guys at 86 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:29,880 29 and at 12 and it's just my. I just think it's mad because I 87 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:32,560 don't know how people that listen could actually help us do 88 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:34,800 that because they clearly are doing something and I wonder 89 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:36,640 what that thing is that they're. Doing maybe it's because they're 90 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:38,760 rating us and sharing us and doing all those good things. 91 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:40,160 So that's what I wanted to say first. 92 00:03:40,160 --> 00:03:42,080 Just a very quick thank you. I'm not trying to blow around 93 00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:45,080 Trumpet too much, but you know, we have done nearly 100 episodes 94 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:47,640 now and this, you know, it takes up a chunk of our week. 95 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:51,000 We love doing it, but seeing almost like the rewards being 96 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:52,400 reaped in that way, it's really nice. 97 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,320 And I do have one shout out. I've not done a shout out in a 98 00:03:55,320 --> 00:04:01,200 while, but I got a message and basically I wanted to just 99 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:04,880 mention three of our favourite listeners, three of our biggest 100 00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:10,600 fans, and those people are Theodore, Ivy and Alice. 101 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:14,080 Now, if you're listening to this in the car, it's because you 102 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:15,560 have chosen to listen to teach sleep. 103 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:18,200 Repeating. Because your mum says every time 104 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:20,519 it comes on in the car and you put something else on the 105 00:04:20,519 --> 00:04:24,040 Spotify, you 3 or complain and moan and say go I want to put 106 00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:26,520 teach, sleep repeat on. Hang on, how old are these? 107 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:30,520 These are children in their mum's car who want to listen to 108 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:32,720 teach Sleep, repeat and they always ask to listen to the 109 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:35,440 Undearth story or rewind back and have all the funny bits. 110 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:38,640 So you three, I want to say you are three legends. 111 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:41,400 Your mum, she's 4th on the list but she's a legend as well. 112 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:44,760 But you 3 a huge thank you and I think I think it's use for you 113 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:46,400 has caused us to be this high in the charts and I. 114 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:48,080 Can't believe it. Top listeners, we'll stick 115 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:49,720 around because we've got a really funny story for you in a 116 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:50,880 moment. Really funny story. 117 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:51,800 I thought you were going to take the Mick. 118 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:53,560 Then when you started that, I was like, here we go, it's going 119 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:55,480 to be Rishi Sunak. Again, top listeners. 120 00:04:55,480 --> 00:04:57,840 And it was serious. I love that for about 6 months, 121 00:04:57,840 --> 00:04:59,880 I think we had four listeners and one of them was Rishi Sunak. 122 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:00,760 It was. It was. 123 00:05:00,840 --> 00:05:02,320 Yeah. Well, that's pretty cool. 124 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:03,320 Yeah, that's really. Really nice. 125 00:05:03,360 --> 00:05:05,240 So anyway, quick, quick shout out for those guys. 126 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:07,320 Appreciate you so much and everyone else has been 127 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:09,000 listening, whether you've been listening for a long time and 128 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:10,920 you know on what on earth Hayden was talking about when he 129 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:13,240 mentioned Rishi Sunak. If you you been around for a 130 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:16,040 while, but if you don't, well, why don't you go back and have a 131 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:18,200 listen anyway? Right, Dylan, I'm jumping in 132 00:05:18,200 --> 00:05:19,960 here because I want to talk about my week, okay? 133 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:22,160 And I want to a very specific thing happened in my week I've 134 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:23,240 been looking forward to sharing on. 135 00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:25,480 Couldn't think what that is. And I'm sure you couldn't 136 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:28,120 because it definitely doesn't have to do with you ruining my 137 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:31,680 day going. SO I was teaching PE this week 138 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:33,640 and I had, you know, I went outside, we're doing some 139 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:35,440 tennis. It was fantastic using the whole 140 00:05:35,440 --> 00:05:38,400 playground, brilliant kids learning, all because of my 141 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:41,720 fantastic PE guidance, because I'm such a PE specialist. 142 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:43,400 You see, I'm a specialist in every subject because I'm a 143 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:46,400 primary school teacher And. And I just happened to be 144 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:50,560 standing near Dylan's classroom. Yeah, we can see out into the 145 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:51,800 playground. And I thought, well, I don't get 146 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:53,160 too. I told, I told my kids. 147 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:55,080 I said, oh, guys, come back a little bit. 148 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:57,000 I said, I don't wanna go too close to those classrooms. 149 00:05:57,000 --> 00:05:59,040 Don't disturb their learning because, you know, they'll get 150 00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:01,240 annoyed at me for constantly hitting tennis balls at that 151 00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:04,200 window or whatever. Next thing I know, door opens, 152 00:06:04,280 --> 00:06:06,320 extremely dramatic. Whole class at the windows like 153 00:06:06,320 --> 00:06:08,440 this, like, as if they're like, oh, no, we're trying to escape. 154 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:13,160 OK, Child bombs it at me and shows me a picture. 155 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:14,720 It's me fall in half. I'm thinking, what on earth is 156 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:15,800 he doing? So can you sign this? 157 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:17,440 Can you sign this? I need your signature. 158 00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:19,120 We need your autograph. The whole class needs your 159 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:22,600 autograph. Open it up, Dylan. 160 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:23,920 Take over. What was inside? 161 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:27,400 It was a picture of our good friend the priest Keith Hebden. 162 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:32,760 We we who looks astonishingly like you. 163 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:35,880 And we we had printed this picture. 164 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:38,720 We were doing RE lesson all about we're doing Christianity 165 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,760 at the minute and we were talking about how in the lead up 166 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:44,640 to Holy Week and Easter's coming up, we've talked about Keith 167 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:49,200 Hebden, who is a priest who went on a hunger strike and runs food 168 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:52,360 banks and his big push was how to help people who need it the 169 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:53,440 most. I know I did it. 170 00:06:53,440 --> 00:06:57,520 I'm telling me for. Well, the point is, I'd printed 171 00:06:57,520 --> 00:07:01,160 off some like clues about him to dot around the classroom when we 172 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:03,400 were like gathering information, so one of them was just a 173 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:05,960 picture of him. But he very clearly looks like a 174 00:07:05,960 --> 00:07:07,760 priest. He has got the dog collar on and 175 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:10,000 he does bear a striking resemblance to you, like he's 176 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:12,680 bold, You've got a similar face and you've got the dog collar on 177 00:07:13,120 --> 00:07:16,800 and, and I and I don't. Normally wear that. 178 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:19,080 Just to clarify, I don't normally wear the collar at 179 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:19,560 school. You don't. 180 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:23,160 You don't believe it's funny because you're not religious at 181 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:24,320 all. This is why it's funny. 182 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,440 Anyway, I printed off some clues like some some quotes from him, 183 00:07:27,440 --> 00:07:28,760 whatever. And we spread them round and the 184 00:07:28,760 --> 00:07:33,040 kids came in from lunch and this child said to me, are we 185 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:34,600 learning about Mr Stevens this afternoon? 186 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:37,720 Because he saw the picture And I was like, Oh my God. 187 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:40,040 And it wasn't even just like, oh, he's bored. 188 00:07:40,040 --> 00:07:41,960 Isn't that funny? It was like he literally thought 189 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:43,240 it looked like. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 190 00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:45,240 That's so funny to me. So anyway, we're doing our 191 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:48,280 lesson on Keith, Keith Hebden. And his story is quite amazing. 192 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:49,680 Really. Like, genuinely, the kids were 193 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:50,800 like, that's really cool, isn't it? 194 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:52,760 Yeah, no problem. But this one kid couldn't let go 195 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:54,360 of the fact that this person really looks like. 196 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:56,040 And the picture of him was stuck on my wall. 197 00:07:56,240 --> 00:07:58,080 Yeah. And he put his hand up. 198 00:07:58,080 --> 00:07:59,960 I was obviously in the flow of teaching, and I was just not 199 00:07:59,960 --> 00:08:00,640 thinking. I was like, yeah. 200 00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:03,200 And he went, can I take the picture out to Mr Stevens, 201 00:08:03,200 --> 00:08:05,680 please? And I said and and to be fair, I 202 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:08,920 looked and you were like mid modelling amazingly. 203 00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:10,440 Can I say how to serve a tennis ball? 204 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:13,160 I mean, I didn't think you'd be able to do it, but you look like 205 00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:15,560 a mini Roger Federer out there. Yeah, this is amazing. 206 00:08:15,840 --> 00:08:18,840 And I was like, no, we can't. Look, we're in the middle of our 207 00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:21,120 lesson. And I was just saying all this 208 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:21,680 stuff. Really. 209 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:23,720 I was like, you're just busy. I was like, OK, not right now. 210 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:27,160 He was like, oh, OK, So we then carried on and just for context, 211 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:28,520 we've done maths and English in the morning. 212 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:30,360 We're doing an RE lesson and we're trying to fit in two 213 00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:32,400 lessons in the afternoon. It's an intense day for the 214 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:35,000 kids. And obviously after you've done 215 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:36,760 a bit of input, the kids were just practising, doing their 216 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:38,080 drills and you're just kind of walking around. 217 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:38,919 And I was like, do you know what? 218 00:08:38,919 --> 00:08:40,960 Do you know what? I'm going to make this happen. 219 00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:42,919 This is the moment. So I took I took the picture off 220 00:08:42,919 --> 00:08:46,600 the wall, I folded it. And I said, guys, listen, you're 221 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:48,560 working really hard, OK? You're working really, really 222 00:08:48,560 --> 00:08:50,360 hard. So after this, you're going to 223 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:51,840 come in, we're going to do it. We're going to finish up our 224 00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:53,160 tasks, then we're going to do some DT, OK? 225 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:54,200 We're going to get ready for tomorrow. 226 00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:55,520 And they're like, yeah, OK, why is it with me? 227 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:58,160 So I got the kid over and I said, here you go. 228 00:08:58,560 --> 00:09:01,400 Give this. Go out to Mr Stevens now, take 229 00:09:01,400 --> 00:09:03,680 this pen and ask him to sign the picture of him. 230 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:07,320 So he, this kid has never been more excited. 231 00:09:07,680 --> 00:09:09,840 My whole Class A sudden like what, what, what? 232 00:09:09,840 --> 00:09:11,440 And that's what they're doing. Like they stood up and like, 233 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:13,680 it's okay, I can sacrifice 3 minutes of this afternoon to 234 00:09:13,680 --> 00:09:15,480 give them something to hold on to, a bit of fun. 235 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:19,040 So he bombed it out. He got to the door and I was 236 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:21,320 like wait, wait, wait, wait. And I checked you were OK and I 237 00:09:21,320 --> 00:09:22,920 was like, yeah, OK, go on then. And he? 238 00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:26,040 Did you should have seen his face? 239 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:28,640 Honestly, if you ever want to get your children to run more 240 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:32,240 quickly, do something like this. He was running like that, Yeah, 241 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:35,400 straight up to you. And then he put it back in and 242 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:37,360 you had signed it. But you didn't decide it, did 243 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:38,760 you? I can't remember what I put. 244 00:09:38,760 --> 00:09:41,160 What am I right? You put Saint Stephen's the 245 00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:42,920 third. Oh yes, I was like, I'm going to 246 00:09:42,920 --> 00:09:44,680 do. So now it's on a whiteboard. 247 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:47,880 It lives there now. And honestly, the kids were so 248 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:49,800 engaged afterwards, they did their work. 249 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:52,520 We cracked. And I think the whole story here 250 00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:56,080 is just, you know, what? If you have those moments with 251 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:59,680 your kids, it's OK. You know, don't feel guilty. 252 00:09:59,680 --> 00:10:01,280 Don't feel what if this, what if that? 253 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:03,160 You know what? It was 3 minutes. 254 00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:05,600 There'll be sometimes where it's absolutely not the right thing 255 00:10:05,600 --> 00:10:07,120 to do. You want to control your class 256 00:10:07,120 --> 00:10:09,000 wherever you're fine. But do you know, there are some 257 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:11,000 moments where as a professional, you can just choose to do 258 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:12,120 something like that? And it was funny. 259 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:13,800 Especially when it's at my expense. 260 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:15,240 Exactly. You know what I mean? 261 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:17,400 It's much funnier. I almost take the disruption to 262 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:19,120 my lesson. If it's at your expense, you 263 00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:20,360 know what? That's that's a sacrifice. 264 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:22,800 I'm willing. So my year sixes obviously were 265 00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:24,360 a bit like what Earth has just gone on there. 266 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:26,240 They were trying to play tennis, looking at me thinking what's 267 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:27,800 going on? They said what was that about? 268 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:29,560 I said, oh, just kids trying to get my autograph. 269 00:10:29,680 --> 00:10:31,440 They were like what? I said what were you signing? 270 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:33,040 I was like, oh, just a picture of a priest. 271 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:34,960 They were like what? I was like, don't worry about 272 00:10:34,960 --> 00:10:36,680 it, don't worry about it. Just practise yourself. 273 00:10:36,680 --> 00:10:38,880 There's. Too much to explain, They just 274 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:42,000 wouldn't get it to explain it. Obviously it was so funny, but 275 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:44,720 you know what? It was funny and it made my day 276 00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:46,240 as well because it was hilarious. 277 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:48,440 And the idea that those kids just had a few moments of fun 278 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:49,920 and then back to latitude or whatever. 279 00:10:50,400 --> 00:10:52,880 No, back to the actual lesson of of the guy. 280 00:10:52,880 --> 00:10:54,520 Nice lesson. Yeah, but yeah. 281 00:10:54,680 --> 00:10:56,240 And he actually looked like you. That was so funny. 282 00:10:56,240 --> 00:10:58,440 That's what was so funny about it is you dressed as a priest 283 00:10:58,440 --> 00:11:01,320 like the most, the biggest oxymoron I can think of you 284 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:03,320 being a whole. Can you imagine? 285 00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:06,560 Imagine me as a priest. Oh dear. 286 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:09,800 Anyway, yeah, we had a message from someone this week. 287 00:11:09,800 --> 00:11:12,200 I wanted to reflect on it and I wanted, I wanted to kind of open 288 00:11:12,200 --> 00:11:14,680 this not kind of worms, let's say, but almost challenge 289 00:11:14,680 --> 00:11:17,240 ourselves a bit because the the message did challenge us a bit 290 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:19,320 as well. And it was from someone saying 291 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:22,280 they loved the podcast, they they'd seen how we're climbing 292 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:23,400 the charts now. It's great. 293 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:25,680 I love that you're reaching more people right now, a really 294 00:11:25,680 --> 00:11:27,640 positive message. And part of that positive 295 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:29,920 message is, and part of the thing we love with you guys 296 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:31,920 listening is when you challenge what we say a bit. 297 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:36,360 And and the main bulk of his message was, oh, and by the way, 298 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:38,200 he said you'll have to pass this on to Hayden because he knows 299 00:11:38,200 --> 00:11:39,600 Hayden does absolutely nothing for the podcast. 300 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:41,400 He said yeah, yeah, he said that bit. 301 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:42,640 Yeah, yeah. He's very specific. 302 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:44,320 So I'm trying to make sure that, you know, it's because you do 303 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:45,440 nothing. I'm bring it up now. 304 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:47,920 So. So in general, he basically 305 00:11:47,920 --> 00:11:50,840 asked, you know, he said you guys seem so passionate about 306 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:53,400 leading maths, which we are really passionate about teaching 307 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:55,680 in general, which we are. We absolutely love helping the 308 00:11:55,680 --> 00:11:57,880 kids out. It's like Our Calling, almost. 309 00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:04,840 But when we talk about SLT in general, this person's part of 310 00:12:04,840 --> 00:12:08,880 SLT, and he just feels a bit like he he doesn't like how we 311 00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:12,080 use the term. And I thought, you know, we've 312 00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:12,720 talked about this. Yeah. 313 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:15,360 He's probably right, He's probably right because we have 314 00:12:15,560 --> 00:12:17,280 because you know what, at the end of the day, this podcast, 315 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:18,600 right? A lot of what we do in this 316 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:20,560 podcast is we call out the rubbish. 317 00:12:20,560 --> 00:12:23,400 We call out the toxicity in this sector. 318 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:27,320 And unfortunately, unfortunately for SLTA lot of that toxicity 319 00:12:27,560 --> 00:12:29,600 starts at the top. So we quite often talk about 320 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:33,160 this notion of toxic. SLTI have tried to in the past, 321 00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:34,920 but I mean, you'd have to go back some episodes when we 322 00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:37,880 really focused on this, try to say a few disclaimers along the 323 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:39,760 way of like, by the way, we don't think this about 324 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:42,360 everybody, but we are just here to call out the ones that are 325 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:43,800 doing a bad job. Do you know what I mean? 326 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:45,480 Is that what he was getting out of the face? 327 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:47,600 It was a bit. Because the message, the message 328 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:49,840 essentially was saying how completely understands how there 329 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:53,080 are totic totic SLT out there. But but from his point of view 330 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:56,000 as SLT who feels like he's trying to do the right thing. 331 00:12:56,360 --> 00:12:58,320 And I'll so many of leaders out there do that. 332 00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:01,240 And it is such a tough job. It did just make me stop and 333 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:02,840 think for a second like, do you know what? 334 00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:04,720 I'm not, I'm not going to stop calling out the stuff I don't 335 00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:06,760 think we ever should. I think it's a big reason why 336 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:09,360 lots of people are listening to us because it validates what a 337 00:13:09,360 --> 00:13:10,360 lot of people think and feel like. 338 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:14,600 They can't say, but I do think there is room for, for sure for 339 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:16,680 us to talk about really good leaders. 340 00:13:16,680 --> 00:13:18,720 Yeah, definitely. And one example of that is the 341 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:21,400 fact we got a comment this week on our Instagrams simply saying, 342 00:13:21,800 --> 00:13:24,600 do your SLT know about your social media presence and what 343 00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:26,280 you're doing? And I replied saying, do you 344 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:27,000 know what? Yeah. 345 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:29,480 And they, we talk about it sometimes and they very much 346 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:31,720 know what's going on. They respect that we have the 347 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:34,920 the the opinions that we do and we want to talk about in the way 348 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:37,920 we do because we're not disrespectful to them at all. 349 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:41,800 I think they understand that although we might not always 350 00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:45,280 match up completely on what we think, we're a professional and 351 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:46,520 we're allowed to have an opinion. 352 00:13:46,680 --> 00:13:49,800 And, and it kind of, it struck me because the reply was, wow, 353 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:51,280 that's great. I don't think many would agree. 354 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:55,200 And I just thought, I don't think anything we say really 355 00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:58,960 crosses a line other than I don't want you to say that. 356 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:01,880 You know, I can't imagine SLT saying, oh, that's horrendous. 357 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:04,160 That's being really rude and personally horrible to me. 358 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:07,880 I'm but no I'm just my opinion is that we shouldn't have to do 359 00:14:07,880 --> 00:14:09,680 6 hours of work at the weekend. Yeah. 360 00:14:09,680 --> 00:14:10,440 And even should you? Yeah. 361 00:14:10,440 --> 00:14:12,760 That's the thing we always say isn't it is like we don't ever 362 00:14:12,760 --> 00:14:15,080 say, but SLT should. Yeah. 363 00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:17,440 Head teachers should be doing all this extra work. 364 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:19,320 They should bear the burden. You know, that's not actually 365 00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:21,640 what we're saying, I think. I think when you go up ladders 366 00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:24,560 in general, in jobs you do generally, you are generally 367 00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:27,120 paid more because there is more of a burden to to bear. 368 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:29,680 I understand that idea. So do you know what it might 369 00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:32,880 transpire that actually SLT and heads maybe do do a bit more of 370 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:34,880 that outside of school and they feel like, oh, I should do it 371 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:36,640 though, because I'm being paid 70 grand a year. 372 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:38,960 Do you know what I mean? Like a bit, but it's but I would 373 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:43,520 never sit here and say teachers, we don't have to do any of this 374 00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:47,760 stuff. But SLT, you might use your 375 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:49,440 fault. So you should be going home and 376 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:51,040 doing all my marking. I'm not saying that. 377 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:52,920 I mean, we're never saying. I hope that doesn't come across. 378 00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:57,120 And I think a big thing is like attitude of SLT is what we talk 379 00:14:57,120 --> 00:14:59,440 about a lot. And I just think that if, if 380 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:02,160 your base attitude is, you shouldn't be saying that. 381 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:04,800 I was like, OK, can we look at what I'm saying rather than 382 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:05,960 whether I should be saying it or not? 383 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:07,880 Yeah, Yeah. Can we can we look at the actual 384 00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:10,000 substance of the conversation we're trying to have? 385 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:13,600 And I think I'm just going to say now because of what this 386 00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:16,080 person has said, I do think there are so many amazing 387 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:16,800 leaders out there. Yeah. 388 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:20,080 And to be honest with you, when we post on social media and I 389 00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:22,240 see you don't obviously because you don't have anything to do. 390 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:26,200 I don't have anything. So what I see a lot of are, you 391 00:15:26,200 --> 00:15:29,160 know, heads commenting, yeah, a lot of heads saying, John, I 392 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:30,360 wish I could do this for my staff. 393 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:31,600 The budget restraints are horrible. 394 00:15:31,760 --> 00:15:33,560 Or I do this for my staff. I push. 395 00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:36,080 I push this as much as I can. I see a lot of positive 396 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:39,600 leadership out there. And I I just want those amazing 397 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:42,920 leaders to know that when we talk about SLTI, hope you you 398 00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:46,000 don't take it personally. And I hope that your overriding 399 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:48,280 thought is, wow, I'm never going to be like that. 400 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:50,800 Yeah, rather than all these guys are calling me now because I'm 401 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:52,120 absolutely not. Yeah, yeah. 402 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:53,280 And at the end of the day is a scale. 403 00:15:53,320 --> 00:15:57,320 You're not a toxic SLT or an amazing SLT like there is. 404 00:15:57,320 --> 00:15:59,160 You know what the realistic side is. 405 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:01,760 There probably is a huge middle ground where where people are 406 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:03,400 trying their hardest to do the right thing. 407 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:05,800 But because of the constraints of this system, which we 408 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:07,360 constantly say is broken by the way. 409 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:11,040 And we know that you're kind of forced to maybe do things that 410 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:12,240 you don't even really want to do. 411 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:14,720 But it's like, unless I do, the kids don't even get taught this 412 00:16:14,720 --> 00:16:16,640 week. So I do get it that there's a 413 00:16:16,640 --> 00:16:18,920 there's a space in that middle there of like people trying so 414 00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:20,840 hard to do the right thing. But occasionally being that, you 415 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:24,240 know, that they're forced to do perhaps an approach that isn't 416 00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:26,360 even really what they want to do in an ideal situation. 417 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:28,200 So that is different. We're not, we're not calling you 418 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:29,320 out. We're calling out the people who 419 00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:32,560 are literally wake up in the morning and like, like, I'm 420 00:16:32,560 --> 00:16:35,640 going to be toxic and I'm going to continue to promote a toxic 421 00:16:35,640 --> 00:16:38,480 culture in my school. Because I'm in charge and what I 422 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:40,920 say goes and I'm going to make sure it changed because I saw 423 00:16:40,920 --> 00:16:43,840 this thing and I'm going to have no absolute thought for what 424 00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:46,280 it's going to do to affect you. It's better for my school, I 425 00:16:46,280 --> 00:16:47,760 think. So I've decided we're all doing. 426 00:16:47,760 --> 00:16:48,840 It Yeah. Do you know what the big one of 427 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:51,360 the biggest indicators for me is is when people, when people 428 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:54,080 genuinely, and I think many do is when they genuinely, 429 00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:57,320 wholeheartedly believe the only thing, the only thing that 430 00:16:57,320 --> 00:16:59,320 matters in the school is the progress of the kids. 431 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:03,080 Yeah, when someone has that as the only thing, it's like, OK, 432 00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:04,720 this is probably not going to be a good place to work. 433 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:06,160 I think it should be a big thing. 434 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:07,560 That is literally, it's kind of our jobs. 435 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:09,319 I get it, all right. But when it's your only thing 436 00:17:09,319 --> 00:17:12,040 you think about as an as an SLT member, you're going to end up 437 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:13,520 being toxic. I'm just going to say that. 438 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:15,880 So the fact that this person's even commenting and thinking 439 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:18,640 about it, the fact that you're even reflecting tells me 440 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:20,280 immediately you're not those, You're not that person. 441 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:22,720 You're not that person. Those people aren't listening to 442 00:17:22,720 --> 00:17:24,000 this. They don't care. 443 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:25,720 They don't. They literally do not care. 444 00:17:26,839 --> 00:17:31,560 And it's that it's that almost toxic use of phrases like, you 445 00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:35,160 know, getting better never stops, or we can always do more 446 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:39,920 or there's no standing still. And it on the surface again, if 447 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:43,000 it seems amazing, but this job really is a bottomless pit. 448 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,040 So when you are only driven by data and data points and moving 449 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:49,120 children doing this, you become like the Academy trust leaders 450 00:17:49,360 --> 00:17:52,440 who decide to exclude children because they're worse for data. 451 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:55,760 Like when you are only thinking about data and we say, oh, it's 452 00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:58,600 our job to think about data. Do you know what in that expect 453 00:17:58,600 --> 00:18:01,480 it's absolutely not our job. Our job is to look after those 454 00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:04,520 children who you've decided to exclude because your data will 455 00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:06,760 look worse. You have failed those children. 456 00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:09,720 So it does become it gets to the point where just focusing on 457 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:12,840 data is actually detrimental as well, rather than making the 458 00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:16,400 school look good on ADFE chart that you could go to and point 459 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:18,480 to fantastic. But you know what what about 460 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:19,840 this? What about the welfare? 461 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:22,480 What about your staff? And I just think it's just such 462 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:27,360 a big, big picture that it's just, it's too simplistic to 463 00:18:27,360 --> 00:18:29,400 just be like, well, my data is good, so everything I do is 464 00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:30,560 justify. It it's kind of like a last 465 00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:32,400 episode, isn't it, where we're talking about different metrics 466 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:34,720 to measure, Like what What makes good, what makes education good? 467 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:36,520 Is education good for children these days? 468 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:39,080 We talked about it and we're like, yeah, it is if you just 469 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:40,600 focus on the metrics you want to focus on. 470 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:42,040 Do you know what I mean? It's exactly the same idea, 471 00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:43,400 isn't it? Well, my school's great because 472 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:44,360 my data is great. It's OK. 473 00:18:44,560 --> 00:18:46,160 Your your teachers hate being there, though. 474 00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:47,920 And the children aren't even that happy. 475 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:49,640 They're getting good data, but they're not happy. 476 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:51,600 Do you know what I mean? Like, you don't measure those, 477 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:52,720 Don't measure those. So it doesn't matter. 478 00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:56,840 And we're not saying for anyone who likes to see us mention one 479 00:18:56,840 --> 00:18:59,440 thing and then make it think that we ignore everything else. 480 00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:02,080 We're not saying data is pointless. 481 00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:03,400 We're not saying that. We're saying it's a bigger 482 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:04,640 picture. This happened this week. 483 00:19:05,080 --> 00:19:09,200 OK, We, we, I did a reel from last episode about this amazing 484 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:12,280 PPA initiative for teachers. And if you listen to last week, 485 00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:15,080 you might remember it, but it was basically that this school 486 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:18,840 had to given staff a day a week of PPA instead of half a day. 487 00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:23,120 And that was, it could happen because they do Forest School 488 00:19:23,120 --> 00:19:26,680 that day, they do PE and they do art with a specialist teacher. 489 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:29,880 And the point was that the school had invested in this. 490 00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:31,520 We can talk about the budget separately. 491 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:32,600 I mean, I'd love to see that budget. 492 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:35,960 I'd love to see what's going on. But the point being that it was 493 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:39,040 an amazing initiative for teachers because teachers PPA 494 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:40,560 doesn't cover the extra work they have to do. 495 00:19:40,840 --> 00:19:45,320 And just so we're all clear, we know that teachers are expected 496 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:46,720 to do work outside of the classroom. 497 00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:48,440 It's literally part of our contract. 498 00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:51,520 We have directed time and we also have that clause which says 499 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:54,160 also there is a reasonable amount and the whole debate 500 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:56,440 comes into what's reasonable, there's a reason about our work 501 00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:58,480 we have to do outside of directed time to meet the 502 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:00,680 standards, etcetera. And that's what's abused by 503 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:03,480 people a lot of the time. So we already know PPA for half 504 00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:06,160 day isn't enough. So this half day it was just 505 00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:09,280 like a feel good post about this head who's thinking about the 506 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:14,680 well-being of his staff. 70% of the comments on that reel. 507 00:20:15,120 --> 00:20:18,360 Were from teaching assistants, support staff people do an 508 00:20:18,360 --> 00:20:22,520 amazing job in school, but almost being immediately angry 509 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:26,000 and and they were saying things like, oh, well, that's great for 510 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:27,760 the teachers, but what about the Tasmania? 511 00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:30,640 OK, that's fantastic. But I've I'm ATA and I've got to 512 00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:31,960 do this and I don't get any prep time. 513 00:20:32,120 --> 00:20:34,080 Oh, it'll just be the Tasmania covering what about their 514 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:36,320 well-being? And I just thought to myself, 515 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:39,200 that is not what I'm talking about. 516 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:43,880 Like this is a reel about APPA situation for teachers. 517 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:48,360 That's really good for teachers. We have no idea if TAS are at a 518 00:20:48,360 --> 00:20:49,720 detriment because of this policy. 519 00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:52,560 I didn't mention them. I can't talk about everything in 520 00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:55,200 one reel. I didn't talk about admin staff. 521 00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:57,880 I didn't talk about SLTI, didn't talk about office staff. 522 00:20:57,880 --> 00:20:59,320 I didn't talk about the caretaker. 523 00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:01,680 There are so many amazing people in school who do really 524 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:03,440 important jobs, but I can't mention all of them in every 525 00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:05,800 single reel I do. And I'm a teacher, so I'm 526 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:07,360 talking about my experience and what I would like. 527 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:10,440 Like, I can't mention it. Like if it's like someone 528 00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:13,160 commenting honestly and saying, oh, don't you care about animal 529 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:16,360 cruelty? Yeah, of course I do. 530 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:18,360 Yeah, all the teachers getting their PPA. 531 00:21:18,360 --> 00:21:20,000 Do you know how many animals suffered whilst they're doing 532 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:21,200 that? Do you know how many? 533 00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:23,600 Do you know how many worms were? Stepped on in forest school yeah 534 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:27,760 OK that's also bad Like I get it don't extrapolate because what I 535 00:21:27,760 --> 00:21:31,200 think what more than anything was the almost suggestion that 536 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:36,160 we don't care about TA's support stuff are amazing and. 537 00:21:37,320 --> 00:21:39,880 But you know what, I thought, let's let's take a moment 538 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:41,880 because my thought on that is I can see what is a bit like, oh, 539 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:43,080 it's annoying because I missed the point. 540 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:44,680 Yeah. But you know what, There is a 541 00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:46,080 point though, and let's just give them some love for a 542 00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:47,040 minute. Yeah, We don't talk about 543 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:49,760 Tasmania loads on this podcast. We occasionally big them up and 544 00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:50,880 say, yeah, you're doing a crazy job. 545 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:52,480 But we talk about teachers because we're teachers, all 546 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:53,840 right? We talk about teachers because 547 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:54,760 we're teachers. We're talking about our 548 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:56,760 experience. But Tasmania, do you know what 549 00:21:57,440 --> 00:21:59,400 they are incredible. We often say that, you know 550 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:01,680 that, but but the situation that Tasmania are in. 551 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:03,320 So if you're listening, you're a teaching assistant. 552 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:06,000 We, we feel you. We understand the situation 553 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:09,760 we're in because the pay has been stagnated for Tasmania just 554 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:12,160 as much, if anything worse than it has for teachers. 555 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,400 I know that at the moment the unions are fighting for £3000 to 556 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:17,560 be added, which isn't even like a crazy amount really. 557 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:19,480 The fact that there's even going to be pushback on that is 558 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:21,880 insulting to you because you are the backbone of our schools. 559 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:25,520 We can't do, we can't function in a school without the support 560 00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:26,960 of Tasmania. It's impossible. 561 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:28,640 I work with IS already as teachers, it's already 562 00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:31,040 unmanageable. So anything the TAS are doing to 563 00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:32,840 support in the classroom, to support outside the classroom 564 00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:36,080 besides the classroom, whatever it is your role is, we need you 565 00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:39,360 in the schools and we know that you end up covering as well in a 566 00:22:39,360 --> 00:22:41,200 lot of schools. This is like something I'm going 567 00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:43,920 to call out as just, it's just crazy part of our system. 568 00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:47,360 A lot of Tas end up basically being teachers because they're 569 00:22:47,360 --> 00:22:51,320 cover supervisors. Classic HLTA cover supervisors. 570 00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:53,160 Okay, what do I do? Well, on the odd day you might 571 00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:54,680 have to be pulled out of class to cover a lesson. 572 00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:56,040 You know what happens five days a week? 573 00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:58,760 You're covering 3 lessons a day and you end up doing as much as 574 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,080 a teacher and then you don't get any PPA yourselves. 575 00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:03,960 So I get it. Like these are all issues that I 576 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:06,480 think are dreadful and I'm sure you agree with this and we 577 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:08,240 should do something about it. So just giving you a little bit 578 00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:11,040 of love at the moment and saying that we hear you and we do with 579 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:12,680 a big listen and go back into office mode. 580 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:14,120 The big listen here, we're listening. 581 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:16,000 But in all seriousness, we know it. 582 00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:19,040 We know it's dire, just as dire for TA as it is for teachers. 583 00:23:19,120 --> 00:23:21,720 Yeah. This, this two kind of prongs to 584 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,640 this for me because I also think we need to absolutely go out of 585 00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:25,960 a way to help well-being for teachers. 586 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:28,800 Sorry for teaching assistants and support staff in general, 587 00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:30,920 whether it's the family liaison office or whoever it is, support 588 00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,360 staff in general. But there are two prongs to 589 00:23:33,360 --> 00:23:35,720 doing that for me. And I think maybe because we 590 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,280 work in a school where I think it does take it quite seriously 591 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,880 at TAS contract in general, I think that that is really seen 592 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:44,400 as OK. Look, the first way we can 593 00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:47,600 really help with teaching assistant well-being is that we 594 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,640 absolutely do not expect you to do anything outside of your 595 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:51,280 hours. Yeah. 596 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:54,760 So if it, if it comes to prep for a group that I've got to do 597 00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:58,440 I, I absolutely would never, ever, ever expect a teaching 598 00:23:58,440 --> 00:23:59,920 assistant to have to go home and prep that. 599 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:03,240 No, I would build in some time within their contract, even if 600 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,440 it means I'm coming out of the classroom path now because I've 601 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:08,720 decided if this group is that important, I value your time too 602 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:10,520 much to expect anything for free from you. 603 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,000 So the first problem would be to really respect a teaching 604 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:15,360 assistants contract. That's one way to go about 605 00:24:15,360 --> 00:24:17,760 fixing this because it sounds to me as from the comments, 606 00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:20,600 teaching assistants and support staff are being completely 607 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,040 exploited. I had one person mention they're 608 00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:25,360 a teaching assistant and they have a read write in Group and 609 00:24:25,360 --> 00:24:28,160 they have 12 kids and they're just doing the teacher job. 610 00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:29,000 They're literally. Just. 611 00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:31,440 Teaching, they're just prepping. They're just teaching phonics. 612 00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:34,360 They are they I say just what I mean is they're literally a 613 00:24:34,360 --> 00:24:36,800 teacher. The school have gone Oh, that's, 614 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,240 that's a nice cheap teacher. They're prepping, they're 615 00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:41,920 marking, they're assessing. They're just doing a group as a 616 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:43,360 teaching assistant. Hang on, what the school's done 617 00:24:43,360 --> 00:24:45,080 is they've gone. Are those kids going to get us 618 00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:46,800 the right data? No, they're a little bit, 619 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:48,080 they're a little bit too low ability. 620 00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:50,240 Shove them with the TA, cheap TA. 621 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:52,240 Let's crack on with the kids who are key marginals. 622 00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:53,960 They're really close to getting our data. 623 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:55,320 Let's give them. We talked about last week. 624 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:57,360 That's probably what. Happened and it's it's 625 00:24:57,360 --> 00:24:59,880 horrendous because that teaching assistants probably doing an 626 00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:02,760 amazing teaching job, not on the teaching salary. 627 00:25:02,800 --> 00:25:05,120 No should not be expected to do anything extra at all. 628 00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:08,360 And the other flip side like you just said is HLTAS or Tasmania 629 00:25:08,360 --> 00:25:11,400 in general who are covering basically all week should get 630 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:14,080 some PPA. I've got a story when I started 631 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:18,440 my teaching as a newly qualified teacher or an ECT, you get your 632 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:21,400 half day PPA every week, but you also get an extra half day. 633 00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,480 And we called it NQT time. I don't know what it's, maybe 634 00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:24,960 it's called ECT time now, I don't know. 635 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:27,640 But just time basically because you're really just getting your 636 00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:29,680 foot in the door and learning. Here's a bit of extra release 637 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,720 time. So as as a, as a, a new teacher, 638 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:34,440 you get the equivalent of a day out every week. 639 00:25:35,120 --> 00:25:37,720 And it's almost like what we're saying all teachers should get. 640 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:39,080 But it was really, really useful. 641 00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,800 And I remember there was a HLTA at our school that I started 642 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:46,440 teaching at who was like the mother of the school. 643 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:47,920 I know exactly who you're talking about. 644 00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:51,720 The most amazing woman. I still, like, just think I'm in 645 00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:53,520 awe. Like, as a new teacher, watching 646 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:54,760 her with the kids and stuff. Yeah. 647 00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:57,680 She was, like, one of the top five teachers in the school. 648 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:01,400 And she was a HLTA on a teaching assistant wage, completely 649 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,120 exploited every week because you'd walk into the staff room 650 00:26:04,120 --> 00:26:05,760 and you'd see the cover board. Yeah. 651 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:10,800 And her initials were genuinely on every single half of every 652 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:13,120 single day so that she'd be covering in this class in the 653 00:26:13,120 --> 00:26:15,720 morning on Monday, that class in the morning in the afternoon on 654 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:17,960 Monday, next for same for Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, 655 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:21,920 Friday, all let's say 10 slots of ampm during the five day week 656 00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:25,080 she was covering. And I, I went up to her. 657 00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:27,760 I remember I had a conversation with her and I just said, you're 658 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:32,120 teaching more than me right now. You're, you are teaching more 659 00:26:32,120 --> 00:26:34,120 than I am. And I am on a teacher's wage 660 00:26:34,120 --> 00:26:37,080 that is basically double yours, and you're teaching more than 661 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,320 me. Is that not crazy? 662 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:42,040 And she basically went, yeah, yeah, yeah. 663 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:43,040 It's on. But you know what? 664 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:45,120 Yeah. It's my job. 665 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:46,720 You know, I just, I love, I love teaching the kids. 666 00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:50,320 I'm just going to crack on. And it's that amazing attitude 667 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:54,280 that is exploited up and down this country that I just get so 668 00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:55,960 angry with. And then when people get annoyed 669 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,760 at us for being negative or anything, I don't care. 670 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:02,480 Because that amazing woman who does an unbelievable job, if 671 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:04,960 it's negative for me to say that she should be treated with a bit 672 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:07,680 more respect to be given time to do something, all the money for 673 00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:10,800 the job she was doing, then call me negative because I do not 674 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:13,160 care because that should be called out and fixed 675 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:14,480 immediately. It's disgusting. 676 00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:17,120 I agree, I agree and someone might. 677 00:27:17,120 --> 00:27:18,400 Do you know what someone come along and say? 678 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:20,520 Didn't have to plan those lessons though, did she? 679 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:23,080 At the weekend covering. OK, Yeah. 680 00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:25,480 Do you know what, though? Start to prep them, prep them, 681 00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:28,120 teach them and mark them. Which is like at least 2/3 of 682 00:27:28,120 --> 00:27:30,640 that of that job for half the pay. 683 00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:33,160 Yeah, exactly. No PPA, no time out, no break. 684 00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:34,600 You could even argue with the pay. 685 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:37,520 Just give some time to just get your heading gear. 686 00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:39,640 Just look through some. When is she looking through the 687 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:40,520 lessons? I know. 688 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:41,880 Yeah. Because you're not not only is 689 00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:44,200 it just like, OK, I'm in year 4, another year 4 curriculum. 690 00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:45,760 I don't really need to prep too much. 691 00:27:45,760 --> 00:27:48,120 Oh, I'm doing determiners. I've done determiners before. 692 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:50,000 How difficult going to be? Take me 5 minutes. 693 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:53,240 Often the HRTAS are teaching themselves the lesson 694 00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:54,720 beforehand. So even if they didn't have to 695 00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:57,320 plan it, here it is. Here's the smart. 696 00:27:57,320 --> 00:27:59,680 And the amount of times I've spoken to A10, they've gone, oh, 697 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:01,120 can I just look at tomorrow's lesson, please? 698 00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:02,400 Because I'm not sure what we're doing. 699 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:04,200 And I talked them through it. That is. 700 00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:05,440 That's prep. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 701 00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:07,680 That counts as prep. And just add to that across 702 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:09,520 multiple year groups, you just said when you're in your own 703 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:11,400 year group, you kind of get confident because you're, you 704 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,240 know, I'm know that I'm going to be in year 6 tomorrow and the 705 00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:16,000 day after year 2, then year 6, then year 3, then year 4, then 706 00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:17,360 year one. It's like, that's mad. 707 00:28:17,360 --> 00:28:20,080 And then just to, just to finish this off, the, the biggest 708 00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:23,240 insult is the HLTA is supposed to be prestigious, right? 709 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:26,520 Comes with more pay. It's negligibly more than like 710 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:28,520 just not being an HLA, isn't it? Less than a pound? 711 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:29,920 An hour? I have no idea, but I. 712 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,520 Know it's I know when back then because I remember I remember 713 00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:33,520 talking to her, she was quite open. 714 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:39,080 It was like 1500 lbs more a year than just being ATA, just 715 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:41,520 supporting in the classroom as normal to be a HRTI was like, so 716 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:44,960 you're going from zero teaching to teaching every single day all 717 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:49,240 week and you've been paid £1500 more a year for this, like on 718 00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:51,040 top of your like 14,000 lbs salary. 719 00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:54,280 It was, it was just so insulting for what this person was doing. 720 00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:56,880 When I'm sat there thinking I'm a new teacher, a teaching car, 721 00:28:56,880 --> 00:28:58,600 not even as much as you because you're actually covering my 722 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:00,400 lessons this week for one of them because I'm, I get time out 723 00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:02,760 because I'm a newly qualified teacher and I'm being paid like 724 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,560 15 grand more than you. And you know I loved about. 725 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,160 This person in particular was always had a smile on their 726 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:11,120 face, was the nicest person in the world, so supportive and I 727 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:13,760 feel like when I look back at my journey and starting off as a 728 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:15,600 teacher. I got lots of help from 729 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:18,560 teachers, don't get me wrong, but it really was specifically 730 00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:22,000 those motherly TA figures. And I think of a few from that 731 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:25,280 school to be honest with me who I really felt kind of took me 732 00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,120 under their wing and, and helped me and kind of shielded me from 733 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:30,800 all the rubbish that comes with it early on because they took on 734 00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:32,200 so much of it and really helped me. 735 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:35,120 So I'm so appreciative. And I think a big part of my 736 00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:38,200 reaction to lots of those comments was I don't think you 737 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:40,040 understand how much I love and care about Tasmania. 738 00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:41,080 And I really think it's a problem. 739 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:43,720 So please don't assume because I'm talking about one thing that 740 00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:46,440 it means the other thing is like not important because it really 741 00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:47,240 is. You've nailed it on the head 742 00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:47,720 there. That's. 743 00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:49,800 That's where it feels a bit like a oh, I'm getting your back up 744 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:51,520 because it's like, no, because I agree with all you guys and 745 00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:52,720 you're all commenting as if I don't. 746 00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:55,280 Yeah, I get it. But yeah, big love to Tasmania. 747 00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:57,120 We think you're amazing. I think it's an incredible role 748 00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,760 in schools. It needs fixing as along with 749 00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:01,280 everything else. So we're sorry that it's not 750 00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:03,400 being fixed as quickly as it should be now. 751 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,000 Going. Against the popular belief that 752 00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:10,240 I don't do anything for this podcast, we had a submission 753 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:11,320 this week. Dylan, did you know that it's 754 00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:12,480 listening, saying it as well? Sorry. 755 00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:13,320 Sorry, did you? No, not just. 756 00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:13,920 This. It's just you. 757 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:15,440 Wait, Sorry, wait. We had a submission. 758 00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:17,280 This week, how did? You know, did you know that? 759 00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:18,760 Dylan The. Answer is no you didn't because 760 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:21,160 I saw it, because I do check our emails, I say now. 761 00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:24,120 We had about 40 submissions each week, so right well, one of 762 00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:26,000 them. One of them I intercepted 763 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:27,600 because I saw it come through on her e-mail. 764 00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:30,160 Joking no seriously picked up on ping up my phone and I was like 765 00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:31,440 this is really good did you delete it? 766 00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:32,520 I deleted. It I put it in the. 767 00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:34,600 Archive in our In our because I didn't want you to see it. 768 00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:36,880 So I I've got it on my phone because I thought the password 769 00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:39,520 for the e-mail. No. 770 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:41,680 What is it? Yeah, so it's a really short 771 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:42,680 submission. It made me laugh. 772 00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:44,680 And I thought this is perfect to tell them on the podcast because 773 00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:47,960 it'll make you laugh. OK OK so someone said I emailed 774 00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:49,520 this in and said I work in A2 form. 775 00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:51,960 Oh, sorry, not that bit. That's. 776 00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:53,240 The funny bit. No, the funny bit's coming up. 777 00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:55,560 OK, sorry. I work in A2 form mainstream 778 00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:57,600 school. That's the funny bit. 779 00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:58,840 Oh sorry I missed you. Missed it. 780 00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:00,960 Anyway, I'll carry on. I work in A2 form mainstream 781 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,400 school and we have daily occurrences of racist, 782 00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:06,080 homophobic language, fat shaming, children, telling staff 783 00:31:06,080 --> 00:31:09,120 to F off, calling them names, children going berserk in class, 784 00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:11,440 throwing things, flipping furniture, storming out. 785 00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:12,400 Sorry, where's the funny? Right? 786 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:13,640 Hang on, hang on, it's coming up. 787 00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:17,640 But luckily that guy on Instagram told you that teachers 788 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:18,960 aren't leaving for behaviour so it's all good. 789 00:31:20,440 --> 00:31:21,360 You. Would love you remember you. 790 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,000 You took the Mick out of that Instagram comment. 791 00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:23,920 That was that person. Oh. 792 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:25,920 My God. OK, All right. 793 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:30,000 When you say I've got a funny message and the first half is 794 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:31,960 that I was like I was waiting for your face to. 795 00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:33,680 Drop I was like, I'm going to say this and Dylan's going to be 796 00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:35,320 like, Oh no, Hayden, we need to delete this whole episode 797 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:37,280 because you're wrong. Just. 798 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:43,480 These things aren't funny yeah that was insane like I I this 799 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:46,360 isn't really a rile up, but I'm going to not be riled up so I'm 800 00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:49,440 going to really control myself here, but that was insane and I 801 00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:51,720 think we've we've referenced this before that's hilarious 802 00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:53,880 that person seen. Are. 803 00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:56,520 You the real about how a teacher said they left because of 804 00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:59,120 behaviour and what their comment was teachers aren't even because 805 00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:00,520 of behaviour. Yeah, and that's exactly. 806 00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:03,240 All there are. There are 20 people in the 807 00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:04,880 comments saying they left because of behaviour. 808 00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:06,640 The person in the real, the teacher left because of 809 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:07,840 behaviour. But you're you. 810 00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:11,080 You just have this ideological like stance in your head. 811 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:12,360 Then it's not because of behaviour, it's because 812 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:13,760 everything else doesn't exist. Don't know it's. 813 00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:14,840 Because of behaviour. Because you know. 814 00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:18,080 What when someone throws a chair at me that might make me not 815 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,600 want to come to work? Actually like, and I'm laughing 816 00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:23,080 because it's so stupid. I'm not laughing at the 817 00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:25,000 situation in the same way we're not laughing at the fact that 818 00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:28,600 this person obviously works in a really challenging school 819 00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:30,720 behaviour wise. But he was just, he was, you 820 00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:32,800 know, he was being ironic and taking the Mick out of the fact 821 00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:34,760 that he's going, you know, completely squashed though, 822 00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:36,480 because someone on Instagram said no, no, you don't. 823 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:39,160 So, oh, OK, thank you, Mike. Thank you for invalidating my 824 00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:40,840 entire life and existence. Exactly. 825 00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:44,360 Their point was. That it's, it's not behaviour, 826 00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:46,040 it's pay. There's always a line that 827 00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:47,840 people would take because they'll take the amount of money 828 00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:49,320 to do it. Like if someone paid you 829 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:50,680 £1,000,000 a year, do you know what? 830 00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:52,160 Yeah, OK. Throw a chair at me for 831 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:53,920 £1,000,000 a year. Throw a chair at my head every 832 00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:54,720 day. I'd. 833 00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:56,560 I'd take that probably. I can't wait to work a million. 834 00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:58,640 Pounds because I don't know I'll be spending it on anyone out 835 00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:00,320 there wants to pay me. £1,000,000 a year to throw a 836 00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:03,080 chair at my head every day. Get in touch, OK, teach, steep, 837 00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:05,840 repeat pod@gmail.com whatever. I don't even know what the 838 00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:08,160 e-mail is. It's in the episode I do because 839 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:09,640 I actually. Inserted it and it is exactly 840 00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:12,800 what you just said. But yeah, I mean, it's just 841 00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:14,440 like, get a grip and and do you know what? 842 00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:18,920 There's a wider point when a teacher or someone in education 843 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:22,440 says their experience in a school, what happened to them? 844 00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:26,320 OK, the reply, You can have a chat about how widespread it is. 845 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:29,640 You can have a chat about whether it's a problem or not, 846 00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,280 like, or you can say, oh, well, in general, maybe this or maybe 847 00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:33,240 that, Maybe you could have done that. 848 00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:37,880 What you can't do is just say to that person that, yeah, no, no, 849 00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:40,920 didn't, no, didn't happen. Doesn't happen because you just 850 00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:43,680 look and seem insane. OK, you cannot like something. 851 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:46,680 You can be uncomfortable with someone's opinion on something, 852 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:48,800 but you can't tell them that that's not their opinion. 853 00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:51,080 Or what literally happened to that is that is called we call. 854 00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:52,920 That gas lighting, it happens a lot in education. 855 00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:54,600 And you know, and you know what, because I know we're getting 856 00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:56,560 into this episode, but I just want to finish this section. 857 00:33:56,800 --> 00:33:58,600 I've got a few while outs, but I just want to do one. 858 00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:00,840 I've got one thing I saw and it kind of links to that SLT 859 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:02,880 conversation. And This is why I want to speak 860 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:04,920 to that person again. Even though we know there's 861 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:07,360 loads of good SLT out there, this is the kind of thing this 862 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:09,520 submission here that makes us go on a rant. 863 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:12,800 OK, because someone said, someone asked the question in a 864 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:16,520 forum saying is it the norm to have a book look every single 865 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:19,880 week and then receive an e-mail every single week criticising 866 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:22,800 everything that we do based on what they see in the books. 867 00:34:23,199 --> 00:34:25,320 And then we change all those things based on what the head 868 00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:28,639 wants to be shot down further and criticised again, again and 869 00:34:28,639 --> 00:34:30,280 again. It's just a constant, constant 870 00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:33,560 negative down downwards trend. That's what someone asked. 871 00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:34,239 Yeah. Yeah, that. 872 00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:37,560 What what it is, is right. What I guess we can extrapolate 873 00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:39,239 this to nearly every industry ever. 874 00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:41,440 OK, Yeah, it's just bad leadership. 875 00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:43,480 I really just think it's bad leadership. 876 00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,080 And I think specifically because we're teachers and we're in 877 00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:47,760 education and that's what we're talking about. 878 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:52,239 If you just, I can just think of the average teacher and the 879 00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:55,840 amount of extra stuff they do just to stay afloat and exist, 880 00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:59,720 right? That should always, always trump 881 00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:02,320 everything when you're giving feedback to someone because you 882 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:05,320 have to start off by thinking, OK, wait a minute, I want to 883 00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:07,280 criticise what they did sometimes, right? 884 00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:10,560 What teachers do has to be criticised and it has to be 885 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:14,600 improved, correct? There is a way to do it and it 886 00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,520 should always come with the caveat of but you know what? 887 00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:19,800 Yeah, okay, I don't quite like how this person is doing this. 888 00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:22,040 It does go against our policy that we all agreed on because we 889 00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:23,640 have a good way of making policy, et cetera. 890 00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:29,040 But you have to just think that person did do 4 hours of extra 891 00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:31,600 planning on Sunday though, because we decided to change 892 00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:33,760 this big part of the curriculum and they're putting a lot of 893 00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:35,280 effort into this job. And do you know what? 894 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:37,840 They're going well above and beyond their contract. 895 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:39,640 Yeah. So if they could do much less 896 00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:42,760 work and still be within their contract or their job, Yeah. 897 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:46,080 So maybe within the job and we have these policies and rules 898 00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:48,840 set, if they're not quite meeting those aspects of it, 899 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,480 maybe we should just think that there's a bit of a balance going 900 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:53,600 on here. And maybe the conversations that 901 00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:56,400 we have shouldn't be rooted in constantly criticising what they 902 00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:59,480 don't do. Maybe if it's 70 to 80% of the 903 00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:02,160 conversation is about how amazing they are or helping 904 00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:04,360 their workload or seeing what they can reduce and seeing what 905 00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:08,160 they can change, those criticisms sit better in the end 906 00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:10,160 and are more likely to resonate with them. 907 00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:12,800 And actually, I'll go, John. Yeah, this, this amazing leader 908 00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:15,640 has helped me so much. So when they pick up on this not 909 00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:17,800 quite being right and they give a reason for it and they treat 910 00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:20,280 me like a professional, I actually want to help them. 911 00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:21,400 I want to run for a war for them. 912 00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:23,160 And I'm already doing loads. So I'm going to make these 913 00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:25,600 little tweaks here. Thank you for showing me that if 914 00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:28,000 it's constant, you just turn off and you think, OK, do you know 915 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:29,080 what? Not only am I turning off to 916 00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:31,800 this criticism, I'm completely disengaged in this job now and 917 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:33,560 I'm not going to do all this extra stuff that I was doing 918 00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:36,000 anyway. It's going to end up turning 919 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,240 people off the other way of other things rather than fixing 920 00:36:39,240 --> 00:36:40,480 what you want to fix. I agree. 921 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:42,520 There is a level to how? Much criticism you can give 922 00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:44,000 before it. No one, no one cares anyone, no 923 00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:45,120 one listens. It just turns them off. 924 00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:47,920 I recently have been planning some English. 925 00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:49,560 I've been I've been spending so much time. 926 00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:51,640 This is a classic example, like our school at the moment, we're 927 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:53,440 revamping our English because you know what, it needed 928 00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:55,080 revamping. It just it was get a bit. 929 00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:56,440 We all knew that. We all knew that. 930 00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:58,120 We knew it needed some time. And that is our, that is our 931 00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:00,800 primary focus this year. But it does come with a lot of 932 00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:01,760 workload. And you know what? 933 00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:04,440 Schools can't then magic up an extra 10 hours a week to go and 934 00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:05,480 do that workload. I get it. 935 00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:07,120 So guess what? It's me at the weekend planning 936 00:37:07,120 --> 00:37:09,880 it, right? I spent absolutely honestly, 937 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,680 like two whole days of the holiday, one in the holidays and 938 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:15,560 one at a weekend planning this three-week unit for English. 939 00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:17,480 It was on something completely unfamiliar to me because we've 940 00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:19,280 just genuinely not done it before, or at least in many 941 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:20,560 years. It was on a balanced argument, 942 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,560 quite a hard text type to do and and we've been doing it 943 00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:25,240 recently. And do you know what some of the 944 00:37:25,240 --> 00:37:28,440 lessons I are on reflection, I've been like, I wouldn't do 945 00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:30,120 that next year. I would change it to do this, 946 00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:32,240 this and this. So they've not been like exactly 947 00:37:32,240 --> 00:37:33,480 what I wanted. It's a little bit annoying 948 00:37:33,480 --> 00:37:36,360 because I've spent so much time on them and the idea that like a 949 00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:38,720 member of SLT, which they haven't just to really made that 950 00:37:38,720 --> 00:37:40,720 clear, they haven't. But the idea that a member of 951 00:37:40,720 --> 00:37:43,560 SLT comes and looks at that planning and just goes, that was 952 00:37:43,560 --> 00:37:45,120 rubbish, that didn't work. Look at the kids books. 953 00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:47,080 This is this is terrible. You need to change it for next 954 00:37:47,080 --> 00:37:49,040 week. I would, honestly, at this point 955 00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:51,120 in my career, I would tell them where to stick it. 956 00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:53,400 Yeah, the problem is. Ten years ago, I wouldn't. 957 00:37:53,400 --> 00:37:54,360 I would have just gone home and cried. 958 00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:56,400 So sorry I cried and you know. Whatever, cancel my. 959 00:37:56,400 --> 00:37:57,360 Football that I've got this evening. 960 00:37:57,360 --> 00:37:58,640 'Cause I'll change it, but right now if. 961 00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:00,720 Someone did that because of bad leadership 'cause they're not 962 00:38:00,720 --> 00:38:02,800 thinking about me as a human. Like actually they did spend 10 963 00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:04,600 hours doing this at the weekend, even though it didn't give them 964 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:05,400 the quite the outcomes they want. 965 00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:08,200 I would honestly it, it would be, it would be a bloodbath of 966 00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:12,960 words and and like. You're clearly a very competent 967 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:13,840 teacher as well. Yeah. 968 00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:16,000 So these mistakes and these things that are going wrong, do 969 00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:17,400 you know what sometimes the question is? 970 00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:19,440 The question is why are they going wrong? 971 00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:22,760 What's happening here that I can do to help this person? 972 00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:25,520 Rather than that's bad, just say that's bad, fix it. 973 00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:26,920 That's yeah, fix it. So do you know what? 974 00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:29,560 When I spent 10 hours doing it, if I knew it was bad then I 975 00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:31,080 would have fixed it. It's like what do you mean just 976 00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,160 fix it? If I knew how to just fix it 977 00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:35,040 straight away I would have done it in the first place. 978 00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:36,480 Sometimes you have to teach it before you know. 979 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:38,160 How to fix exactly that? A few of those lessons. 980 00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:40,680 It was just like, OK, now I've done the class, I can see 981 00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:42,760 exactly what elements they're finding tricky. 982 00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:44,280 I can I would tweet that next time. 983 00:38:44,520 --> 00:38:46,520 But yeah, it's just to just to back up that that whole thing. 984 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,040 That's brilliant. OK, we've. 985 00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:50,600 We've I think we've talked about 74 different things we have. 986 00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:52,000 Should we get to the actual point of the year? 987 00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:53,560 Yeah, we love that. Book them in. 988 00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:58,200 Don't we? We did a skip this week. 989 00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:01,320 It's not often these days that we do a little scare at the 990 00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:02,560 start. When we started, we do what 991 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:04,120 every week. I know it was a lot of effort. 992 00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:05,760 It was so. Fun, but we. 993 00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:09,680 We felt that we had to do on this week because of the changes 994 00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:12,120 that we saw from Ofsted. Now our podcast releases on a 995 00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:14,520 Monday. So a few times what's happened 996 00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:16,160 is we've released the podcast on a Monday. 997 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:18,440 We're like, let's talk about this really important issue. 998 00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:20,240 And then it's released and in the morning, it's like the 999 00:39:20,240 --> 00:39:22,240 government and Ofsted have announced this huge change. 1000 00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:25,520 OK, we're a week behind, but we we had to reference this. 1001 00:39:25,520 --> 00:39:29,760 We had to talk about it. So Hayden, in a nutshell, what 1002 00:39:29,760 --> 00:39:31,960 have Ofsted done? Because there's been this huge, 1003 00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:34,080 big lesson. They've got a new leader come 1004 00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:36,240 in. They were talking about making 1005 00:39:36,240 --> 00:39:38,800 change because it's, you know, we're listening to staff, you 1006 00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:42,640 know, we're gonna do what needs to happen to make Ofsted a force 1007 00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:45,560 for good. So what's gone on this week? 1008 00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:49,120 So in a nutshell, they. Quote unquote listened to 1009 00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:51,480 teachers feedback and the biggest bit of teachers feedback 1010 00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:53,920 was these one word judgements are crushing. 1011 00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:58,240 They put so much unnecessary pressure on teachers and it's 1012 00:39:58,240 --> 00:40:01,480 not fair to capture the school. In a word or two, yeah. 1013 00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:03,800 And and it's. Specifically, what they started 1014 00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:05,200 off with was the headline judgement. 1015 00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:07,240 I think that's important because still now schools are getting 1016 00:40:07,240 --> 00:40:10,400 one word judgements on the individual aspects that's been 1017 00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:12,080 broken down. But the big one they immediately 1018 00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:14,280 said was, you know what? What is really, really harmful 1019 00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,880 is that one word judgement for an entire school. 1020 00:40:17,080 --> 00:40:19,480 And that's simplistic and it doesn't hit the mark. 1021 00:40:19,480 --> 00:40:22,040 And it's just that was causing a lot of anxiety, wasn't it? 1022 00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:23,240 Which I completely agree with it. 1023 00:40:23,240 --> 00:40:25,480 Was, you know, and they did, they have got rid of that 1024 00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,720 overall one word judgement for school because it isn't fair. 1025 00:40:28,720 --> 00:40:32,200 It doesn't make any sense when it's a school is so complex to 1026 00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:34,600 have one word that summarises the whole thing like what a 1027 00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:36,680 stupid system. And the other part, the other 1028 00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:39,000 huge thing was about was about deep dives. 1029 00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:41,040 Sure. So this idea that, you know, we 1030 00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:42,760 talked about it before, Oh, we're all just suddenly 1031 00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:44,800 specialists, are we? In every single subject. 1032 00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:47,440 What planet do you live on? Of course we're not. 1033 00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:50,800 It was adding deep dives were adding on so much pressure to 1034 00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:54,280 teachers and it was massively, massively negatively impacting 1035 00:40:54,280 --> 00:40:56,840 smaller schools as well. Yeah, because smaller schools, 1036 00:40:57,040 --> 00:40:58,600 less teachers, they take on more stuff. 1037 00:40:58,600 --> 00:40:59,720 I think we need fewer teachers, mate. 1038 00:40:59,720 --> 00:41:01,280 You need to. Require improvement on your 1039 00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:03,400 English I'm afraid. And now your whole school is 1040 00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:05,120 requires improvement because you don't have to do grammar 1041 00:41:05,120 --> 00:41:07,000 properly. And you know, jokes aside, 1042 00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:08,680 that's exactly. How it was, you know, your whole 1043 00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:10,400 school is now requires improvement and it was 1044 00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:11,640 ridiculous. So they've, they've got rid of 1045 00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:14,160 this idea of deep dives as well. We're not going to come into a 1046 00:41:14,160 --> 00:41:16,760 school and scrutinise you for three days on your on your 1047 00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:19,160 scrutinise your history lead for three days. 1048 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:20,120 Can I just pick up on that quick? 1049 00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:22,800 Because what really annoys me about that is like what we said 1050 00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:26,200 before, where management might say this is a really important 1051 00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:28,720 initiative and if you're not doing it, then I'm going to pull 1052 00:41:28,720 --> 00:41:30,640 you up. Imagine if a school didn't put 1053 00:41:30,640 --> 00:41:32,760 hours and hours and hours into preparing for a history deep 1054 00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:35,520 dive or hours and hours in geography, and then Offset came 1055 00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:36,800 and said, we're doing geography deep dive. 1056 00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:38,840 This isn't good enough. Your school's bad. 1057 00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:40,520 One word, judgement. Awful. 1058 00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:42,960 What's kind of annoying is that now they're saying, oh, yeah, 1059 00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:44,720 that was bad, wasn't it? Yeah. 1060 00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:46,600 You should never have done it because we've already got all 1061 00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:48,760 the hard work done. We've already spent hours and 1062 00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:50,840 hours of our own time pretending to be a geography specialist 1063 00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:53,720 when we're not putting hours and hours into courses doing loads 1064 00:41:53,720 --> 00:41:56,240 of folder prep work because we. Oh, you shouldn't have to do 1065 00:41:56,240 --> 00:41:57,520 that for Ofsted. No, we shouldn't. 1066 00:41:57,520 --> 00:41:59,160 But we do, don't we? And you know, we do. 1067 00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:01,600 And when you come in and perpetuate that, this is normal. 1068 00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:05,160 This is you being terrible. So it winds me up, even though 1069 00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:07,440 they're doing the right thing to get rid of deep dives, it's 1070 00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:10,280 really, really wound me up because the damage is done and 1071 00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:12,920 you need to listen sooner. We are professionals, We're not 1072 00:42:12,920 --> 00:42:14,760 just moaning. We work hard already. 1073 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:17,760 If we moan about something, it's usually because it's stupid. 1074 00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:19,840 I agree. So one of the biggest. 1075 00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:21,680 Ironies that we'll look at a good rant by the way. 1076 00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:23,320 Sorry, I thought I've got nothing to add to that. 1077 00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:27,120 One of the biggest ironies is that is that they did, they did 1078 00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:29,720 listen in a way, and they did say, OK, all right, we get it, 1079 00:42:29,720 --> 00:42:32,040 deep dives. OK, It adds unnecessary pressure 1080 00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:33,840 on because there's far too many subjects, right. 1081 00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,600 So every teacher in the school the with the way Ofsted works, 1082 00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:38,800 not knowing what they're going to deep dive until literally the 1083 00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:40,880 day before every school was there. 1084 00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:43,200 Therefore saying like, right, everyone needs to imagine that 1085 00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:44,520 you're going to be the one that getting offset it. 1086 00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:46,840 So every single person has equal pressure, which is horrendous 1087 00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:49,000 amount of pressure because there's too many areas that we 1088 00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:51,320 need to be expert in. I'm going to quote that again. 1089 00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:54,200 There's too many areas that they that they might look at anyone 1090 00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:56,040 time. So, so in all of these too many 1091 00:42:56,040 --> 00:42:58,920 areas that we have to focus on, it's causing us too much stress 1092 00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:01,960 because there's too many areas at once to think about. 1093 00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:03,560 So very quickly. So they've got. 1094 00:43:03,560 --> 00:43:04,680 Rid of deep dives. That's true. 1095 00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:06,680 Yeah. OK, so they've done a couple of 1096 00:43:06,680 --> 00:43:09,360 big things, right? But you're talking, I don't know 1097 00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:10,760 why I keep mentioning about too many areas. 1098 00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:12,720 Maybe we'll come back to that very soon. 1099 00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:16,320 But so this week then, because those changes, the big, you 1100 00:43:16,640 --> 00:43:19,000 know, headline change that was very quick that got dropped 1101 00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:21,480 talking about deep dives not being anything anymore. 1102 00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:23,320 OK, be annoyed as we want. It's a good thing that we're 1103 00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:25,520 getting rid of them. So what was the big news this 1104 00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:27,840 week then? Because it seemed like when we 1105 00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:29,360 spoke about it, you said, oh, is this news? 1106 00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:32,040 I, I, we thought this was happening anyway because there 1107 00:43:32,040 --> 00:43:33,720 was a bit of a lean a few months ago. 1108 00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:35,560 What's been confirmed now, right. 1109 00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:38,480 So what's been confirmed is. One the scale, the sliding scale 1110 00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:41,040 that they're going to be using to I'll go get to the the 1111 00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:42,960 categories in a minute. The sliding scale they're going 1112 00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:45,400 to be using that replaces the one word judgments from before, 1113 00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:47,280 you know, there's four one word judgments that we had before 1114 00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:49,680 standing good they. Replace that with five one word. 1115 00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:52,600 Judgments now, but rather than being an overall judgement, it 1116 00:43:52,600 --> 00:43:55,120 just judges in a specific smaller subcategory, right? 1117 00:43:55,120 --> 00:43:57,240 Because currently there are 4. Categories that get judged, 1118 00:43:57,240 --> 00:44:00,520 yeah. And we're making that up to 11. 1119 00:44:00,520 --> 00:44:02,800 Yeah, up to 11, depending. On your school, so one of the 1120 00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:04,760 categories might be sixth form. Obviously not every school has 1121 00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:06,320 that. One of the categories is early, 1122 00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:07,680 early years. Not every school has early 1123 00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:09,040 years, right? But there's nine sort of core 1124 00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:10,880 ones in the middle that all schools will have, yeah. 1125 00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:11,960 All schools will have so it just. 1126 00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:14,680 Like this is the, this is my biggest criticism, criticism of 1127 00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:17,040 the whole thing is this idea that they've they've said, Oh 1128 00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:20,120 yeah, OK, so the problem with deep dives was it was too much 1129 00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:22,240 pressure at once because there's too many areas to be looking at 1130 00:44:22,240 --> 00:44:24,120 at once. And it's not fair for teachers 1131 00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:25,720 on top of their jobs to be thinking about all of these 1132 00:44:25,720 --> 00:44:27,520 different areas. So what we're going to do is 1133 00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:29,560 we're going to scrap what it was before and we're going to make 1134 00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:31,280 loads of different areas that we're going to look at instead. 1135 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:33,080 And we're going to really like sub categorise them. 1136 00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:35,480 And you're going to be graded on all of them at once, by the way. 1137 00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:38,160 So we got rid of deep dives. We'll pick one out of the 10, 1138 00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:40,360 all of them now, all nine of these things. 1139 00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:42,080 So we're not subject. They're not subjects. 1140 00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:43,560 So you know there is. An argument to say, well, come 1141 00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:45,360 on, come on, Hayden, calm down. They're not subjects. 1142 00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:47,640 They're all essential things anyway, which, you know, we can 1143 00:44:47,720 --> 00:44:49,920 have a discussion about. But my point is here, my 1144 00:44:49,920 --> 00:44:53,560 overarching point is they didn't listen to the idea that teachers 1145 00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:55,800 are overwhelmed, right? They didn't listen to the idea 1146 00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:58,600 that there's too much pressure on teachers. 1147 00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:01,640 And that is what is driving teachers out of this job because 1148 00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:04,640 what they've done is they've made a system that puts too much 1149 00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:08,120 pressure on teachers in so many different areas at once. 1150 00:45:08,280 --> 00:45:11,640 It's the same thing repackaged in terms of the perspective from 1151 00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:13,240 a teacher. There's no teacher. 1152 00:45:13,240 --> 00:45:15,280 And we'll look at the data in a minute that is looking at that 1153 00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:19,560 thinking, oh, I'll be so much less, fewer stressed now. 1154 00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:23,520 I'll be so much less stressed now because of this new system. 1155 00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:25,040 They're just going to be thinking, oh, I'll be stressed 1156 00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:27,000 in a different way. It's scrutiny, isn't it? 1157 00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:28,400 It's. It's scrutiny where we 1158 00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:30,840 completely need to be scrutinising schools and 1159 00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:33,560 teachers. But like, like you said, what is 1160 00:45:33,560 --> 00:45:36,400 the role of Ofsted? Like is the role of Ofsted to 1161 00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:38,680 just come along and point a finger and say that's bad? 1162 00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:40,000 Yeah, yeah. And come along and point a 1163 00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:43,080 finger and say that's good? Or is the role to actually try 1164 00:45:43,080 --> 00:45:45,360 and raise standards? And it's just like their mantra 1165 00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:48,240 and what they say they stand for just isn't what they're doing. 1166 00:45:48,240 --> 00:45:50,080 And this was a real chance to kind of shift that. 1167 00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:52,680 And I feel like all they've done is repackage what's already 1168 00:45:52,680 --> 00:45:56,080 there, make it not look like what what they'll oh, guys, it's 1169 00:45:56,080 --> 00:45:58,440 completely different now. We're not going to say that 1170 00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:00,000 you're requires improvement in something. 1171 00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:03,600 We're going to say that it's red and you're causing concerns 1172 00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:08,040 like, OK, you've done the most fundamental like top level 1173 00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:10,720 change that you possibly could whilst apps actually really 1174 00:46:10,720 --> 00:46:12,760 changing nothing. That kind of says what I want to 1175 00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:13,640 say. About this, and we'll come to 1176 00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:16,680 the 9 things in a minute or the 11 things potentially, but I 1177 00:46:16,680 --> 00:46:18,440 just want to say this is what's happened in my head. 1178 00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:22,160 There is this circle of where Ofsted operates from it within, 1179 00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:23,960 right. And within this circle, whatever 1180 00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:26,120 they were doing, they were like, oh, this is bad though. 1181 00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:29,480 And what they've done is they've said OK, let's just reinvent 1182 00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:32,040 this circle in a different way. Let's stay within the confines 1183 00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:34,160 of how we were already operating, but let's just 1184 00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:36,320 repackage it in a different way. Get rid of few things, add a few 1185 00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:38,400 things. And what they needed to do, if 1186 00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:41,720 they listened to teachers in this big lesson, is they needed 1187 00:46:41,720 --> 00:46:43,960 to reinvent the circle. They needed a square. 1188 00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:47,640 They needed to go away from the circle and completely reinvent 1189 00:46:47,640 --> 00:46:49,360 the system. And that's what they failed to 1190 00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:52,000 do, which is why everyone is so annoyed at this. 1191 00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:54,120 Yeah. Do I think this is better than 1192 00:46:54,120 --> 00:46:56,280 the old system? Yes, I do. 1193 00:46:56,320 --> 00:46:59,360 I do think it's marginally, marginally better. 1194 00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:00,760 OK, All right. And we'll go into why in a 1195 00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:01,120 minute. Sure. 1196 00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:04,280 But do I think it it's enough for an enormous government 1197 00:47:04,320 --> 00:47:06,600 funded body of millions of pounds and spent on this to for 1198 00:47:06,720 --> 00:47:09,440 them to be like, yeah, we fight. It took us, you know, 5000 years 1199 00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:11,840 to do this and we've finally reformed it. 1200 00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:14,960 And they've come out with the most like meek, worst possible 1201 00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:17,400 outcome really, of a reform you could call a reform. 1202 00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:20,720 I'm like, come on. Like it's just so insulting the 1203 00:47:20,720 --> 00:47:23,200 idea of Ofsted going. Into like a pyramid and watching 1204 00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:26,240 an ancient Egyptian lesson and then it being the same of 5000 1205 00:47:26,240 --> 00:47:29,120 years later. So I think that. 1206 00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,440 Jumped out at me that really really just it made me laugh in 1207 00:47:32,440 --> 00:47:36,320 a way that I'm just I just despair is is that they have 1208 00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:38,760 genuinely changed outstanding for exemplary. 1209 00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:42,440 They have genuinely changed good for either strong or secure. 1210 00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:44,360 So more chance to be positive I suppose. 1211 00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:46,360 As 2 is 3 now, I've added in an extra. 1212 00:47:46,360 --> 00:47:48,920 One isn't it and it? And we've got we've got a darker 1213 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:50,840 green rather than a light green. Isn't that lovely? 1214 00:47:51,240 --> 00:47:53,880 And they've instead of requires improvement, it's attention 1215 00:47:53,880 --> 00:47:57,560 needed or causing concern. What is wrong with you? 1216 00:47:57,560 --> 00:48:01,000 Like that is the most like it. It's the most. 1217 00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:03,040 Are they are they trying to gaslight us? 1218 00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:04,440 Yeah. Into thinking they've changed 1219 00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:06,160 something because they just go well, the words are different. 1220 00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:08,320 Yeah. Then you have not listened. 1221 00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:09,760 Like you have genuinely not listened. 1222 00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:11,960 Or save your little little. Feelings by not calling you 1223 00:48:11,960 --> 00:48:14,680 inadequate anymore, we'll just say causing concern. 1224 00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:18,040 Causing concern. There's big alarm bells ring now 1225 00:48:18,040 --> 00:48:19,720 when they come, they have a little they have they have to do 1226 00:48:19,720 --> 00:48:21,760 you know all of the inspectors now have to wear this little 1227 00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:24,520 thing on their shoulders. It has 2 red bells on it right 1228 00:48:24,520 --> 00:48:28,080 that go an alarm goes off when they when they feel they're 1229 00:48:28,080 --> 00:48:30,200 causing to like green and. Amber like is it? 1230 00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:31,320 Is it? No, it's only. 1231 00:48:31,320 --> 00:48:33,160 No, they can't do. The good things, they just they 1232 00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:35,040 just kind of get ignored. But when something's bad, they 1233 00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:37,360 and, and it says, yeah, because, because obviously Offset expects 1234 00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:40,200 to have had training now it says to them, don't cause stress, 1235 00:48:40,360 --> 00:48:42,520 don't cause stress. So the Offset inspectors are 1236 00:48:42,520 --> 00:48:44,880 reminded, oh, let's not cause any stress to these teachers 1237 00:48:44,880 --> 00:48:47,080 when we call, when we're saying that this area is causing 1238 00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:48,600 concern. They've had training because 1239 00:48:48,600 --> 00:48:50,360 when they. Say it's causing concern. 1240 00:48:50,560 --> 00:48:53,520 They say it in a nice way. Yeah, yeah, guys, your school, 1241 00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:56,040 it's causing concern. Little round of applause. 1242 00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:58,440 Smile and it feels. Great and it's just changed 1243 00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:00,320 everything. Yeah, I want to very quickly 1244 00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:03,160 then we've got some teacher tap data we'll come into later and 1245 00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:05,240 we've been in touch and we've just wanted to teach tap they've 1246 00:49:05,240 --> 00:49:08,480 got some really cool data as to the reaction to this but let's 1247 00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:11,080 just dive a little bit deeper. Sorry for using the term diving 1248 00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:12,440 deeper. No, we don't do that anymore my 1249 00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:13,720 little rings. No, no, we can't. 1250 00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:15,840 We can't dive deep. Let's scuba low. 1251 00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:18,200 We'll call it that instead because that's not the same. 1252 00:49:18,280 --> 00:49:23,000 We're going to scuba low down here into the the what? 1253 00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:25,040 What is happening in terms of what we're judging them on now? 1254 00:49:25,040 --> 00:49:27,920 So we've talked about the, the one word judgements have 1255 00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:29,720 changed. So the red, red to green, 1256 00:49:29,720 --> 00:49:32,600 exemplary, etcetera. Yeah, but what are we actually 1257 00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:33,600 judging them on then? What? 1258 00:49:33,600 --> 00:49:36,680 What are these 9 to 11 things that you've been talking about? 1259 00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:37,920 Yeah. So fortunately, you'll be 1260 00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:39,040 pleased. To know they got rid of teaching 1261 00:49:39,040 --> 00:49:39,800 and learning. They stopped. 1262 00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:41,560 They stopped. They stopped. 1263 00:49:41,640 --> 00:49:43,480 Bear with me. They stopped judging teaching 1264 00:49:43,520 --> 00:49:46,240 and learning. It's now developing teaching and 1265 00:49:46,240 --> 00:49:47,600 curriculum. Oh, they're separate. 1266 00:49:47,600 --> 00:49:48,960 What I'm trying to say, I'm joking, is this. 1267 00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:50,720 It's the same thing. They've just repacked. 1268 00:49:50,720 --> 00:49:52,320 You looked at me so panicked then like, no, they didn't, 1269 00:49:52,320 --> 00:49:53,160 Hayden. No, no, they didn't. 1270 00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:54,200 I wasn't panicked. I was thinking. 1271 00:49:54,240 --> 00:49:57,560 What on earth for them? Yeah, No, they didn't. 1272 00:49:57,560 --> 00:49:58,880 No, they didn't at all. They didn't really change 1273 00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:00,960 anything to honestly, they just, they just sub categorised it a 1274 00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:02,720 bit more. So the 9 things I'm looking at 1275 00:50:02,720 --> 00:50:05,440 plus the extra 2, the sixth form in the early years are they'll 1276 00:50:05,440 --> 00:50:08,040 look at achievement and give you one of those five gradings, 1277 00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:11,920 leadership and governance, OK attendance. 1278 00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:15,080 Do you want to do you want to go off on that or no, not 1279 00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:17,000 particularly because we've. Said it before, we've done this 1280 00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:19,400 before. I just think the the problem 1281 00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:21,680 here, the problem I see straight away is just it's going to have 1282 00:50:21,680 --> 00:50:25,080 the same old problems as before where there'll be leadership 1283 00:50:25,080 --> 00:50:27,040 panicking. Yeah, this isn't going to stop 1284 00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:29,240 schools panicking from wanting to impress Ofsted because we 1285 00:50:29,240 --> 00:50:31,120 still feel like we need to get these report cards. 1286 00:50:31,120 --> 00:50:33,720 Of course, instead of it just being so old, we need to get to 1287 00:50:33,760 --> 00:50:34,640 outstanding. We are. 1288 00:50:34,640 --> 00:50:37,400 We need to get to exemplary. And all that will happen now 1289 00:50:37,400 --> 00:50:39,480 instead is there's nine ways for people to get stressed. 1290 00:50:39,560 --> 00:50:40,480 I just don't. I don't get it. 1291 00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:42,320 I don't know. Before I was like teaching and 1292 00:50:42,320 --> 00:50:43,480 learning. I was like, OK, well just skip 1293 00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:45,480 behind that now. It's like developing teaching 1294 00:50:45,480 --> 00:50:47,840 specifically. It's like, cool, I get the idea. 1295 00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:49,280 Because the government and offset are trying to put 1296 00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:51,680 pressure on to schools to do well in these things. 1297 00:50:51,840 --> 00:50:54,120 So the only reason attendance is there is because attendance is 1298 00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:56,600 awful. So the only reason it's there is 1299 00:50:56,600 --> 00:50:59,120 because they absolutely know what they're doing. 1300 00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:01,000 They're not doing it. They're not doing it to help 1301 00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:02,480 schools. This is what winds me up. 1302 00:51:02,720 --> 00:51:06,400 None of this is to help schools. The only reason attendance is on 1303 00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:09,800 this list is because they want to put pressure on schools to 1304 00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:12,680 push themselves to the limit with no extra budget being put 1305 00:51:12,680 --> 00:51:15,800 in for it to fix attendance. Same with inclusion. 1306 00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:17,720 They they want to make, Aren't we? 1307 00:51:17,720 --> 00:51:20,640 Aren't we? Aren't we amazing Ofsted and the 1308 00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:24,240 government because we're making inclusion the front 'cause that 1309 00:51:24,240 --> 00:51:27,200 we're really pushing and now it's got its own thing in our 1310 00:51:27,200 --> 00:51:29,640 Ofsted judgement. No, no no, no, you're horrible 1311 00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:33,440 gaslighting idiots who just want to say that because you know 1312 00:51:33,440 --> 00:51:36,360 schools will then panic and put all of their effort into it by 1313 00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:39,040 working themselves to the bone. Because we really, really, 1314 00:51:39,040 --> 00:51:41,320 really care about our kids and we really do care about 1315 00:51:41,320 --> 00:51:42,640 inclusion. We want to help as many kids as 1316 00:51:42,640 --> 00:51:44,560 we can. All you're doing is making it 1317 00:51:44,560 --> 00:51:46,400 even more stressful for us because we're now going to be 1318 00:51:46,560 --> 00:51:49,880 really harshly judged on it in a system where you are also in 1319 00:51:49,880 --> 00:51:52,280 charge of the funding and the money we get for it and you are 1320 00:51:52,280 --> 00:51:54,600 not giving us enough. So you are not helping us 1321 00:51:54,680 --> 00:51:57,200 remotely. You are adding pressure so that 1322 00:51:57,200 --> 00:51:59,840 you can look like you can wear a badge saying aren't we great, 1323 00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:02,400 this government helping out and doing the best we can with 1324 00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:05,120 Ofsted. No, you're increasing pressure. 1325 00:52:05,240 --> 00:52:08,240 You are not helping remotely because if you were helping and 1326 00:52:08,240 --> 00:52:11,080 were listening to teachers, you'd be whacking up investment 1327 00:52:11,120 --> 00:52:13,080 in these areas. You'd be helping us with some 1328 00:52:13,160 --> 00:52:16,320 support and you'd be taking these children seriously who 1329 00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:18,200 can't even get a diagnosis for three years. 1330 00:52:18,480 --> 00:52:20,560 It's disgusting. This is not helping. 1331 00:52:20,720 --> 00:52:23,400 This is just labelling something so you can say you're helping 1332 00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:25,400 and hope someone else picks up the Flack for you because 1333 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:26,760 they'll be the ones getting judged on it. 1334 00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:29,320 It's horrible, it's disgusting. I think there's one more element 1335 00:52:29,320 --> 00:52:30,640 as well. Of this just listening to you 1336 00:52:30,640 --> 00:52:33,280 talk about that, that they've been really smart with this play 1337 00:52:33,560 --> 00:52:35,560 of just saying, well, we'll just put attendance in the report 1338 00:52:35,560 --> 00:52:38,120 card. It's because they don't want to 1339 00:52:38,120 --> 00:52:40,440 do The Dirty work. Exactly what what they don't 1340 00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:43,560 want to. They want schools to to put 1341 00:52:43,560 --> 00:52:45,400 their necks on the line. They want schools to go in and 1342 00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:47,880 you can be the controversial ones who put in some draconian 1343 00:52:47,880 --> 00:52:49,600 measures because you're so panicked about attendance now 1344 00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:51,400 doing things that maybe you think are even wrong. 1345 00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:53,360 But because you've got this report card now it's kind of 1346 00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:55,440 forcing your hand. We don't want to say it as off 1347 00:52:55,440 --> 00:52:58,080 said because do you know what we know we'll get a bad, bad light 1348 00:52:58,080 --> 00:52:59,760 for it in the press because actually what we want to take 1349 00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:02,440 what we want to say is, OK, we're going to start fining kids 1350 00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:04,160 for not coming in. We're going to come pick you up 1351 00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:05,760 every single day. We're going to do all these 1352 00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:08,040 other like draconian kind of things, but we don't want to say 1353 00:53:08,040 --> 00:53:09,920 that, as I said, even though be much easier for us just to say 1354 00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:11,440 it from top down and everyone just does it right. 1355 00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:13,920 We want the schools to make those decisions so they look 1356 00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:15,480 bad. They're putting they're at risk 1357 00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:17,240 of looking bad if the parents don't like it. 1358 00:53:17,480 --> 00:53:19,480 But you know what? Overall though, yeah, some 1359 00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:20,560 schools will look bad because of it. 1360 00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:22,920 But attendance will go up though, and who's going to take 1361 00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:25,640 the credit? We put it on a report card, 1362 00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:27,600 guys, and it's got better. So it does. 1363 00:53:27,760 --> 00:53:29,280 No, it's not. It's disgusting. 1364 00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:32,920 And the more and more I think about it, it's the entrenched 1365 00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:35,360 system of what we have, which is just horrendous. 1366 00:53:35,640 --> 00:53:39,080 And this does nothing for that. And I think that's why I teach 1367 00:53:39,080 --> 00:53:40,720 so exasperated because do you know what I think? 1368 00:53:41,280 --> 00:53:44,360 I think if you just look it on the surface level, right, and 1369 00:53:44,360 --> 00:53:46,560 that there is an argument you could have where you're saying, 1370 00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:48,200 well, I think it's slightly better because of this. 1371 00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:50,880 I also really think you could say it's worse because of the 1372 00:53:50,880 --> 00:53:53,280 reasons we've said as well. So what, you know, we can look 1373 00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:55,120 into the Teach Tap data now. Maybe that'd be really 1374 00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:56,960 interesting. But I guess my overall point is, 1375 00:53:56,960 --> 00:54:02,200 I think where the most anger and disillusionment comes from is 1376 00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:04,960 that we were gaslit for two years into thinking they were 1377 00:54:04,960 --> 00:54:05,960 listening and they were going to change. 1378 00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:07,960 They were going to do something. I, for one, never thought that 1379 00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:09,680 was going to happen. No, I never, ever thought that 1380 00:54:09,680 --> 00:54:11,400 was going to happen. And I'm glad I didn't fall into 1381 00:54:11,400 --> 00:54:12,920 that trap because here's what's happened. 1382 00:54:13,160 --> 00:54:15,640 It's just repackaged into nonsense. 1383 00:54:15,640 --> 00:54:17,240 Yeah, it's, it's do you know what? 1384 00:54:17,240 --> 00:54:20,680 And and people will come back to us and say, well, don't you care 1385 00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:23,280 about these things? Isn't it good that we're caring 1386 00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:25,680 about these things? I care about these things more 1387 00:54:25,680 --> 00:54:28,920 than anyone because I love teaching, because I love my 1388 00:54:28,920 --> 00:54:30,680 kids. I love education, I love my 1389 00:54:30,680 --> 00:54:33,120 classes, I love helping them as much as I can. 1390 00:54:33,240 --> 00:54:36,000 The only reason I care is because I care so much. 1391 00:54:36,160 --> 00:54:38,360 The only reason I care about these changes is because I want 1392 00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:42,040 it fixed so bad. So when these artificial changes 1393 00:54:42,040 --> 00:54:44,920 come in that literally do nothing to help the fundamental 1394 00:54:45,040 --> 00:54:48,760 cogs in our education system just so that someone can get 1395 00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:52,080 some political clout, it winds me up so much. 1396 00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:54,920 Easiest analogy here right is. As your your teachers right now 1397 00:54:54,920 --> 00:54:56,840 put your imagine Ofsted. Is the teacher OK in this 1398 00:54:56,840 --> 00:54:59,360 situation? Do you improve things in your 1399 00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:05,280 class by measuring them? Is it and my point here? 1400 00:55:05,280 --> 00:55:07,320 Is they're not doing the next bit. 1401 00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:09,800 I measure stuff all. I measure stuff all the time and 1402 00:55:09,800 --> 00:55:11,760 then I do something about it and I raise standards. 1403 00:55:11,760 --> 00:55:13,840 As the teacher, I take responsibility for that thing 1404 00:55:13,840 --> 00:55:16,640 that I'm measuring and I do everything I can in my power and 1405 00:55:16,640 --> 00:55:19,040 my time and the money I have to the budget I have, whatever it 1406 00:55:19,040 --> 00:55:21,360 is the situation I'm in to do something about it and raise 1407 00:55:21,360 --> 00:55:24,120 that standard. This is why I don't like Ofsted. 1408 00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:26,360 They don't do the bit that they say they do. 1409 00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:29,080 It's like, well, we're measuring attendance now. 1410 00:55:30,160 --> 00:55:32,680 OK, So what you so you already know it's bad. 1411 00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:34,920 We already know that. So well done. 1412 00:55:34,920 --> 00:55:36,200 You found information that we already know. 1413 00:55:36,200 --> 00:55:38,400 So that's done Nothing. What are you doing about it? 1414 00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:41,720 Well, stop there. OK, Brilliant. 1415 00:55:41,720 --> 00:55:43,400 Cool. Let's just measure more stuff. 1416 00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:44,960 That's what we're doing. Measuring more stuff. 1417 00:55:45,000 --> 00:55:46,320 It's like what we said about leaders. 1418 00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:49,360 Earlier who just criticise and moan and say things are bad, 1419 00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:52,440 that is the exact same thing. If Austin are just coming in and 1420 00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:56,520 saying that's bad, like thanks, OK, cool. 1421 00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:58,600 We do need to be called out sometimes, like I said earlier. 1422 00:55:58,920 --> 00:56:01,320 But can, can we please like have a supportive environment where 1423 00:56:01,320 --> 00:56:04,480 you're helping us do this thing or again, just political clout? 1424 00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:06,480 Let's finish up the list. I'm going to start. 1425 00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:08,960 Again and give you the 9 areas on the top of sixth form and 1426 00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:11,080 early years. So it's achievement, leadership 1427 00:56:11,080 --> 00:56:15,120 and governance, attendance, curriculum, behaviour and 1428 00:56:15,120 --> 00:56:20,440 attitudes, developing, teaching, inclusion, personal development 1429 00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:22,400 and well-being. And that's the last one because 1430 00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:24,120 then it's at 6th, 1:00 and then there is one that. 1431 00:56:24,120 --> 00:56:27,120 You've missed, but it's just a, it doesn't, it doesn't come into 1432 00:56:27,120 --> 00:56:29,560 this starting category, which by the way, I think is a good 1433 00:56:29,560 --> 00:56:30,520 thing. Yeah, this is a good change. 1434 00:56:30,640 --> 00:56:34,400 Safeguarding is simply, you've met it or you haven't and 1435 00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:35,440 separate. And you know what? 1436 00:56:35,440 --> 00:56:36,720 Yeah, it's separate. And you know what that is? 1437 00:56:36,720 --> 00:56:38,280 That is what safeguarding should be. 1438 00:56:38,400 --> 00:56:40,760 You, you either are a school meeting the safeguarding demands 1439 00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:42,120 or you're not. And you know what, if you're 1440 00:56:42,120 --> 00:56:43,360 not, you need to be called out on it. 1441 00:56:43,360 --> 00:56:43,600 Yeah. Yeah. 1442 00:56:43,720 --> 00:56:45,560 Because it is so serious. Yeah. 1443 00:56:45,720 --> 00:56:48,000 And I think that's, I think that's important. 1444 00:56:48,200 --> 00:56:50,600 I think we can still talk about the consistency of, you know, 1445 00:56:50,600 --> 00:56:52,120 judgments and etcetera, etcetera and all that. 1446 00:56:52,120 --> 00:56:53,520 That's always going to be a problem When you have a 1447 00:56:53,520 --> 00:56:56,040 judgement system and there are individuals who are going to do 1448 00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:57,360 it, that's always going to be a problem. 1449 00:56:57,360 --> 00:57:00,440 But I think that's a good thing. And I think the safeguarding of 1450 00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:03,400 our children is paramount. And I think that's, I agree with 1451 00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:04,840 that. I think if safeguarding was 1452 00:57:05,120 --> 00:57:07,680 secure or strong, like what are you talking about? 1453 00:57:07,680 --> 00:57:09,640 It's just, it's so important that you're either doing it or 1454 00:57:09,640 --> 00:57:11,560 you're not. I would go as far as saying. 1455 00:57:11,760 --> 00:57:15,040 That it's the only part of what I've said do that is actually 1456 00:57:15,040 --> 00:57:17,320 worthwhile at the moment, in that kind of terms of just. 1457 00:57:17,320 --> 00:57:19,640 Criticising and judging, yeah. As in looking at safeguarding 1458 00:57:19,640 --> 00:57:20,920 honestly. I think all of that stuff, they 1459 00:57:20,920 --> 00:57:23,640 could put all that in the bin. Yeah, OK with themselves and 1460 00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:25,840 just leave a couple of members to come around with their little 1461 00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:28,160 special. Yeah, because whistles and their 1462 00:57:28,160 --> 00:57:30,120 and their, you know, shoulder pads and come around and 1463 00:57:30,120 --> 00:57:31,600 honestly just look at safeguarding because that is the 1464 00:57:31,600 --> 00:57:33,160 only bit that they're doing, which is right. 1465 00:57:33,160 --> 00:57:34,720 I agree with you. It's like, hey, get rid of the 1466 00:57:34,720 --> 00:57:36,360 rest. Can you those have a 9/11 areas, 1467 00:57:36,360 --> 00:57:37,800 get rid of them. Can you just come and look at 1468 00:57:37,800 --> 00:57:39,280 safeguarding until you've thought of a better system 1469 00:57:39,280 --> 00:57:41,240 please on how to actually raise standards because you know 1470 00:57:41,240 --> 00:57:43,320 you're not doing it. Like when you judge attendance. 1471 00:57:43,400 --> 00:57:46,360 We said this before. Is it just going to be like, oh, 1472 00:57:46,360 --> 00:57:49,320 it's 96%, so it's green. Yeah, of course it's number. 1473 00:57:49,320 --> 00:57:51,040 It's 89%. So it's orange. 1474 00:57:51,040 --> 00:57:53,640 Like that's so maybe it won't. Maybe. 1475 00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:56,280 Maybe it'll be a bit more you know, consider considerable of 1476 00:57:56,280 --> 00:57:57,920 like the what you're doing the area. 1477 00:57:57,920 --> 00:57:59,240 I don't know. Maybe your school has 1478 00:57:59,240 --> 00:58:01,800 notoriously bad attendance and you're you're, but you've 1479 00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:02,680 actually. Raised it a bit. 1480 00:58:02,680 --> 00:58:04,720 And they're like, OK, you know, this is an exemplary example of 1481 00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:08,080 how to raise attendance from 40 to 50% if your attendance. 1482 00:58:08,080 --> 00:58:10,400 Like if I take an actual figure that might be realistic in the, 1483 00:58:10,480 --> 00:58:12,840 in the most like tricky of areas, let's just say your 1484 00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:16,200 attendance is like 87%, right? Let's just say may I don't, I 1485 00:58:16,200 --> 00:58:17,840 don't know what they are, but let's just say it's like that 1486 00:58:18,320 --> 00:58:21,560 and your leadership and your and your school have taken it to 1487 00:58:21,560 --> 00:58:24,800 93%. To me that, that that would 1488 00:58:24,800 --> 00:58:27,440 scream exemplary. That would scream like, wow, you 1489 00:58:27,440 --> 00:58:29,720 are moving the dial. That's you could not do more 1490 00:58:29,720 --> 00:58:31,040 than that. Because at the end of the day, 1491 00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:32,880 it's not you have to get the kids into school. 1492 00:58:32,880 --> 00:58:34,240 And all we had to do was fire all of our. 1493 00:58:34,240 --> 00:58:37,600 TAS buy seven cars and we go and pick up all the kids now. 1494 00:58:37,720 --> 00:58:38,800 So it's so much better, isn't it? 1495 00:58:38,800 --> 00:58:40,840 Because this metric has improved My school now I think they've 1496 00:58:40,840 --> 00:58:42,520 bought 8 cars. Seven, we used to pick up kids 1497 00:58:42,520 --> 00:58:43,840 and one of them was the maternity. 1498 00:58:43,960 --> 00:58:46,040 Maternity. One of them was the MAT CEO who 1499 00:58:46,040 --> 00:58:48,680 just got the car. Yeah, yeah, a little bonus. 1500 00:58:48,840 --> 00:58:50,520 Yeah, I don't know anyway, but there's there's the areas. 1501 00:58:50,520 --> 00:58:51,720 Let's talk about teacher tap, shall we? 1502 00:58:51,720 --> 00:58:52,520 Yeah. So this this. 1503 00:58:53,120 --> 00:58:54,680 Teacher Tap, by the way, quick shout. 1504 00:58:54,680 --> 00:58:57,920 Unbelievable. We've been speaking to them and 1505 00:58:57,920 --> 00:59:00,280 they've been offering us up some data, which is so useful. 1506 00:59:00,280 --> 00:59:02,400 So in the future podcast as well, you might see us do a 1507 00:59:02,400 --> 00:59:04,720 little bit of a teach tap of giving us these insights. 1508 00:59:04,720 --> 00:59:08,160 They sent us these blogs and they've had some reaction 1509 00:59:08,160 --> 00:59:11,240 already to these changes because like I said, we're a bit behind 1510 00:59:11,240 --> 00:59:13,440 because this was announced when we really started that last 1511 00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:16,760 episode. So first up, straight up, I 1512 00:59:16,760 --> 00:59:20,120 wanted to mention something to do with school staff and who 1513 00:59:20,120 --> 00:59:23,320 they are in a school. Head teachers were the most 1514 00:59:23,320 --> 00:59:25,160 likely to have read the plans, which makes sense, of course. 1515 00:59:25,160 --> 00:59:26,480 Head teachers have given the race to the ground. 1516 00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:28,440 It's them. They're the ones ultimately have 1517 00:59:28,440 --> 00:59:31,280 the, you know, the the judgement resting on their shoulders so 1518 00:59:31,280 --> 00:59:32,720 they've properly read through the Ofsted. 1519 00:59:32,720 --> 00:59:35,680 Plan exactly so head teachers. Are way more likely to have read 1520 00:59:35,680 --> 00:59:39,840 here, but they are also the most likely to feel negatively about 1521 00:59:39,840 --> 00:59:42,600 these reforms. So 43% of head teachers surveyed 1522 00:59:42,600 --> 00:59:46,520 by Teacher TAP said that they felt very negative and 24 1523 00:59:46,520 --> 00:59:50,880 percent said somewhat negative. That is 67 percent, 2/3 of head 1524 00:59:50,880 --> 00:59:54,360 teachers had a negative reaction to these reforms. 1525 00:59:54,800 --> 01:00:00,760 At what point do we look at that and do we say these reforms are 1526 01:00:00,760 --> 01:00:02,760 bad? Then like by definition, you, 1527 01:00:02,880 --> 01:00:05,120 you can look at that and maybe someone in the government. 1528 01:00:05,120 --> 01:00:06,560 No, no, no, we're driving standard. 1529 01:00:06,560 --> 01:00:08,840 We're doing well, we're doing some spokesperson for us said, 1530 01:00:08,840 --> 01:00:10,640 no, no, it's because of this. It's because of that. 1531 01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:15,600 If your head teachers have 2/3 of them saying. 1532 01:00:16,080 --> 01:00:19,360 That this is bad reform. Yeah, it's probably bad reform. 1533 01:00:19,360 --> 01:00:20,640 Of course it is. And it was the year before when. 1534 01:00:20,640 --> 01:00:22,160 They asked them and the year before and the year before and 1535 01:00:22,160 --> 01:00:23,760 the year before. But what politicians are very 1536 01:00:23,760 --> 01:00:26,440 good at is going, OK, what is 1/3 of all the head teachers? 1537 01:00:26,440 --> 01:00:27,840 Is it a couple of thousand? OK, cool. 1538 01:00:27,840 --> 01:00:30,040 Use that stat. Thousands of head teachers think 1539 01:00:30,040 --> 01:00:31,680 that this reform is great. There you go. 1540 01:00:31,680 --> 01:00:34,040 Politicians win, Gaslight everyone like they always do, 1541 01:00:34,040 --> 01:00:35,360 Repeat the cycle. It's depressing. 1542 01:00:35,400 --> 01:00:36,000 Yeah. Yeah. 1543 01:00:36,120 --> 01:00:37,040 Honestly. Absolutely. 1544 01:00:37,160 --> 01:00:39,960 Absolutely. So in general, when asked and 1545 01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:43,560 teach TAP as people who work in schools, how do you feel about 1546 01:00:43,560 --> 01:00:46,280 these plans? What percentage, Hayden, do you 1547 01:00:46,280 --> 01:00:48,480 think felt very positive about these plans? 1548 01:00:48,520 --> 01:00:50,000 Oh, let me guess without looking at the. 1549 01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:53,240 Screen in which I know is it 00 percent? 1550 01:00:53,240 --> 01:00:55,240 Yeah. Zero, no one feels very positive 1551 01:00:55,240 --> 01:00:59,520 about these changes. 6% feels somewhat positive and so and the 1552 01:00:59,520 --> 01:01:02,200 rest of it is either neutral or negative or they haven't seen 1553 01:01:02,200 --> 01:01:04,040 the plans yet. Don't get me wrong, a big chunk 1554 01:01:04,040 --> 01:01:05,080 of people hadn't seen the plans yet. 1555 01:01:05,080 --> 01:01:07,360 I think it was close to 40% people hadn't seen the plans. 1556 01:01:07,360 --> 01:01:10,480 That's fair enough. But if we look at the the 1557 01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:13,520 percentage saying that it's positive or very positive, it's 1558 01:01:13,520 --> 01:01:16,320 6% and this is 10,000. Teachers, by the way, just to 1559 01:01:16,320 --> 01:01:19,280 clear, make that really clear, 10,000 teachers did this, not 1560 01:01:19,800 --> 01:01:21,120 0%. So a. 1561 01:01:21,440 --> 01:01:25,320 Significantly low amount of people, close to zero, thought 1562 01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:27,520 that this was yeah enough that it got rounded. 1563 01:01:27,520 --> 01:01:31,520 Down to 0% like right? Almighty 21% said neutral, I 1564 01:01:31,520 --> 01:01:34,040 think. I think if you, if there wasn't 1565 01:01:34,040 --> 01:01:35,960 this huge push in the last couple of years for it to really 1566 01:01:35,960 --> 01:01:38,280 reform and change and the horrible situation with Ruth 1567 01:01:38,280 --> 01:01:40,440 Perry and this people feeling really strongly about it, I 1568 01:01:40,440 --> 01:01:42,280 think there'd probably be more in the neutral camp. 1569 01:01:42,280 --> 01:01:44,880 I think there'd be more like saying what didn't do anything 1570 01:01:44,880 --> 01:01:46,480 neutral. I think the again, the the 1571 01:01:46,480 --> 01:01:49,400 pushing of the negative stuff is just people saying, well, this 1572 01:01:49,400 --> 01:01:51,800 does nothing. The fact it's neutral makes me 1573 01:01:51,800 --> 01:01:53,520 negative about it because what was the point? 1574 01:01:53,520 --> 01:01:54,320 Yeah, it's true. Do you know what? 1575 01:01:54,320 --> 01:01:55,760 When I did this. Teacher's app because obviously 1576 01:01:55,760 --> 01:01:57,160 I did it on my phone. Download the app yourself. 1577 01:01:57,160 --> 01:01:59,400 You can do it as a teacher. I think I put neutral at the 1578 01:01:59,400 --> 01:02:01,640 time and I kind of wish I could change it now, but because I was 1579 01:02:01,640 --> 01:02:04,920 feeling like, yeah, I haven't read read through them properly 1580 01:02:04,920 --> 01:02:05,920 yet. I've seen a few headlines. 1581 01:02:05,920 --> 01:02:08,200 I was like, OK, well, we talked about them before the leaked 1582 01:02:08,200 --> 01:02:10,000 versions. I was like, well, I'm just in 1583 01:02:10,000 --> 01:02:11,160 the middle. I don't think it, I don't think 1584 01:02:11,160 --> 01:02:13,320 it's any better. Sure, I think I think it's worse 1585 01:02:13,320 --> 01:02:15,080 in some aspects, but I think it's better in some aspects. 1586 01:02:15,080 --> 01:02:17,680 I'm like, it's just, it's just the same thing repackaged. 1587 01:02:17,680 --> 01:02:20,000 But having this had this conversation now, I think I'd 1588 01:02:20,000 --> 01:02:22,040 probably go down one and put somewhat negative. 1589 01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:23,200 That's probably where I'd really vote. 1590 01:02:23,640 --> 01:02:26,000 OK, so the the vast. Majority of school staffing that 1591 01:02:26,000 --> 01:02:28,280 and again, like we said about the head teachers saying mostly 1592 01:02:28,280 --> 01:02:31,760 negative the school in general, like come on, this is this is 1593 01:02:31,760 --> 01:02:34,520 enough data for you to look at and you should be thinking 1594 01:02:34,520 --> 01:02:37,080 that's bad. And if you were actually working 1595 01:02:37,080 --> 01:02:39,840 for staff and education in general, if you had that as your 1596 01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:43,000 forefront, you would make changes now you'd be like, OK, 1597 01:02:43,000 --> 01:02:44,920 this is wrong. But but they already had the big 1598 01:02:44,920 --> 01:02:46,280 listen. They already chose not to do it 1599 01:02:46,280 --> 01:02:48,640 because we know the path again joined to be a politician again. 1600 01:02:48,640 --> 01:02:49,160 Ready. Yep. 1601 01:02:49,320 --> 01:02:52,120 Well, actually we've seen that 38% of teachers didn't even 1602 01:02:52,120 --> 01:02:54,760 bother to read our plans. Teachers do not care. 1603 01:02:54,960 --> 01:02:57,560 They don't care about driving standards up, but we do. 1604 01:02:57,680 --> 01:02:59,600 I think that's more a daily. Mail spokesperson. 1605 01:02:59,600 --> 01:03:00,760 Yeah, yeah. But yeah, they would look at 1606 01:03:00,760 --> 01:03:01,800 that. And they'd be like, well. 1607 01:03:01,800 --> 01:03:03,840 Look, no, it's just a communication thing. 1608 01:03:04,280 --> 01:03:05,760 This is what wines went more than anything, right? 1609 01:03:05,760 --> 01:03:08,280 When people go, no, no, you know, you just don't understand. 1610 01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:10,320 I had someone comment on Instagram, I've got to say this 1611 01:03:10,320 --> 01:03:15,280 quickly because I was talking about multi Academy trusts and 1612 01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:17,680 CEOs and stuff like that. And I get that I'm way more on 1613 01:03:17,680 --> 01:03:21,480 one side of this argument and there's other sides to it, but I 1614 01:03:21,480 --> 01:03:24,160 simply held my case against someone who was defending them 1615 01:03:24,160 --> 01:03:25,720 and saying why they're good. And I was like, no, I get all 1616 01:03:25,720 --> 01:03:27,960 that. But I think overall, I think 1617 01:03:27,960 --> 01:03:30,800 it's this, this and this. And one of the replies I got was 1618 01:03:31,920 --> 01:03:34,120 what what you're doing there is confirmation bias because 1619 01:03:34,120 --> 01:03:36,800 you're, you're seeing it in, in play and you're, you're 1620 01:03:36,880 --> 01:03:38,240 extrapolating that to everything. 1621 01:03:38,240 --> 01:03:40,600 And don't, don't worry about it. Everyone has confirmation bias. 1622 01:03:40,600 --> 01:03:42,200 And I was just like, I had to reply. 1623 01:03:42,200 --> 01:03:44,520 I'm like, no, I'm not. I'm literally saying that I 1624 01:03:44,520 --> 01:03:47,760 understand that you can't just dismiss my opinion because you 1625 01:03:47,760 --> 01:03:50,720 framed it as something that's bad and yeah, you've now framed 1626 01:03:50,720 --> 01:03:52,480 it as confirmation bias and oh, it's OK. 1627 01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:53,600 Don't worry about it though. We all do it. 1628 01:03:53,600 --> 01:03:55,160 I don't. Yeah, I don't do it, but we all 1629 01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:56,120 do it. So don't worry about that. 1630 01:03:56,120 --> 01:03:57,680 But I don't do it. So you're my point of view is 1631 01:03:57,680 --> 01:03:59,880 right and yours is completely wrong because I've decided it's 1632 01:03:59,880 --> 01:04:01,840 confirmation bias. That's what people will do this. 1633 01:04:01,840 --> 01:04:03,480 They'll go, oh, it's a communication thing. 1634 01:04:03,560 --> 01:04:05,320 People don't really understand what's going on. 1635 01:04:05,320 --> 01:04:06,720 No, no, I really do understand it. 1636 01:04:06,720 --> 01:04:08,720 I've read through all of these blogs that you posted. 1637 01:04:08,720 --> 01:04:10,920 I've read through the education statement from the government. 1638 01:04:11,200 --> 01:04:13,200 I do understand it. And I think it's bad. 1639 01:04:13,200 --> 01:04:15,520 Yeah, so that's the end of the conversation in terms of you 1640 01:04:15,520 --> 01:04:18,000 can't detriment my opinion. I'm a teacher and I think it's 1641 01:04:18,000 --> 01:04:18,920 bad. Let's talk about it. 1642 01:04:18,920 --> 01:04:20,360 I find it so funny when because people do. 1643 01:04:20,360 --> 01:04:22,560 This in all walks of life, when people use confirmation bias to 1644 01:04:22,560 --> 01:04:24,920 therefore go one step further and say therefore it doesn't 1645 01:04:24,920 --> 01:04:26,280 exist, I'm like, what are you talking about? 1646 01:04:26,280 --> 01:04:27,840 You know, the confirmation bias. Fair enough. 1647 01:04:27,840 --> 01:04:28,760 That might be a thing. Yeah. 1648 01:04:28,880 --> 01:04:31,360 But it does still confirm, though, from my own experiences 1649 01:04:31,360 --> 01:04:33,480 and people around me, that this thing does exist. 1650 01:04:33,480 --> 01:04:34,920 Yeah. Maybe I'm misrepresenting how 1651 01:04:34,920 --> 01:04:35,880 much it exists. Sure. 1652 01:04:35,960 --> 01:04:38,160 But when someone says, oh, it's just confirmation bias, so 1653 01:04:38,160 --> 01:04:40,400 you're completely wrong. It doesn't even exist what 1654 01:04:40,400 --> 01:04:41,960 you've experienced. It's just confirmation bias. 1655 01:04:42,080 --> 01:04:43,440 So what do you mean the word confirmation? 1656 01:04:43,520 --> 01:04:45,200 It's in it. It's in it, OK. 1657 01:04:45,200 --> 01:04:46,280 It's a bias. See what happen? 1658 01:04:46,440 --> 01:04:47,920 Yeah, Yeah, no. It's not existing, it's just. 1659 01:04:47,920 --> 01:04:51,200 Confirmation bias. So no, no, I'm confirming that I 1660 01:04:51,200 --> 01:04:53,800 that I have seen this happen. It's just that I might be not 1661 01:04:53,800 --> 01:04:55,840 seeing it not happen because I'm surrounded by people. 1662 01:04:55,960 --> 01:04:57,480 Just shut up. What you talking about? 1663 01:04:57,640 --> 01:04:59,040 Yeah, it's just such a nice way of. 1664 01:04:59,040 --> 01:05:01,320 Trying to shut down an argument with someone just because I have 1665 01:05:01,320 --> 01:05:03,120 a different opinion to you doesn't mean I don't know what 1666 01:05:03,120 --> 01:05:04,240 I'm talking about. It's a classic. 1667 01:05:04,400 --> 01:05:07,320 Oh, I'm just, I'm better. Than you don't worry, Hun. 1668 01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:08,600 Don't worry, don't worry, Don't worry. 1669 01:05:08,600 --> 01:05:09,320 Love it. Don't worry, love. 1670 01:05:09,320 --> 01:05:11,240 It's just confirmation bias. We've all been there. 1671 01:05:11,240 --> 01:05:13,280 You probably didn't know what it was called, but now you know, 1672 01:05:13,680 --> 01:05:15,200 Point Wink. Next time you'll be all right, 1673 01:05:15,720 --> 01:05:16,880 Right, Let's take a look. Want to take? 1674 01:05:16,880 --> 01:05:20,680 A look quickly just say the data here in terms of the five tier 1675 01:05:20,680 --> 01:05:23,520 system you know from causing concern to exemplary because we 1676 01:05:23,520 --> 01:05:25,080 spoke about how insane we think it is. 1677 01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:29,600 Do we think that it is a good thing? 1678 01:05:29,640 --> 01:05:32,200 Will it will it provide a fairer picture? 1679 01:05:32,200 --> 01:05:34,960 What's the question for schools? So will it, will it do what it's 1680 01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:37,520 set out to do and be fairer for schools? 1681 01:05:38,000 --> 01:05:39,760 Much fairer. What percentage always freeze 1682 01:05:39,760 --> 01:05:41,600 numbers gone then one. Percent think it's going to be 1683 01:05:41,600 --> 01:05:46,320 much fairer. Somewhat fairer, 24% decent 1684 01:05:46,320 --> 01:05:49,280 chunk and I can see why because the idea being instead of just 1685 01:05:49,480 --> 01:05:52,480 teaching and learning, maybe it's fairer because you know 1686 01:05:52,480 --> 01:05:55,480 what, we're good in both. It's not just hiding something 1687 01:05:55,480 --> 01:05:58,200 and some schools may be behind. Maybe it's fairer because it's a 1688 01:05:58,200 --> 01:06:00,640 more accurate and the argument from the government is no, no, 1689 01:06:00,640 --> 01:06:03,480 this is more detailed, this is what parents want and there is 1690 01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:05,800 an argument to say that, OK, do you know what? 1691 01:06:05,800 --> 01:06:08,960 Will it be fairer? Maybe because it's showing well, 1692 01:06:08,960 --> 01:06:11,280 it also really simplistically. I'm just not even making this 1693 01:06:11,280 --> 01:06:14,120 complex. It is objectively fairer because 1694 01:06:14,120 --> 01:06:15,200 there's five now instead of four. 1695 01:06:15,240 --> 01:06:17,520 Yeah, doesn't mean it's better. Yeah, sure, it is fairer. 1696 01:06:17,520 --> 01:06:19,800 So of course it's fairer because now I've got three chances to 1697 01:06:19,840 --> 01:06:22,680 not be labelled as rubbish rather than two. 1698 01:06:22,840 --> 01:06:24,680 So it's like it's almost not even a point. 1699 01:06:25,320 --> 01:06:27,280 It's like, yeah, it's somewhat. I think I put somewhat fairer. 1700 01:06:27,280 --> 01:06:29,600 I'm like, yeah, because 5 is more than 4, not better. 1701 01:06:29,680 --> 01:06:31,880 I think it's a stupid system. It's like if you said is it 1702 01:06:31,880 --> 01:06:33,520 fairer now, we've now got a 10 point system. 1703 01:06:33,520 --> 01:06:36,240 I'm like, Oh yeah, OK. It's a bit bit. 1704 01:06:36,240 --> 01:06:38,480 Fairer because there's more points you could be at, but 1705 01:06:38,520 --> 01:06:40,280 we're not talking about the. Implementation. 1706 01:06:40,280 --> 01:06:41,720 Yeah, that doesn't make sense. So. 1707 01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:44,760 So 40, sorry, 63% said no difference. 1708 01:06:44,760 --> 01:06:46,840 Yeah, I can really understand that point because it's just 1709 01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:49,360 like what it is no different. You're still judging everything 1710 01:06:49,360 --> 01:06:52,000 in a school on the same way you did before and you're choosing a 1711 01:06:52,000 --> 01:06:53,960 different word this time. Yeah, yeah, somewhat less fair 1712 01:06:53,960 --> 01:06:56,440 and much less fair only counted for about 12%. 1713 01:06:56,440 --> 01:06:59,080 So in general, we can see here people think it's more fair or 1714 01:06:59,080 --> 01:07:00,320 the same. Do I get that? 1715 01:07:00,320 --> 01:07:02,040 That's kind of your argument earlier where you say, well, is 1716 01:07:02,040 --> 01:07:03,720 it a bit better maybe than the previous one? 1717 01:07:03,720 --> 01:07:06,280 A bit, I guess in this respect, you know, depends how you 1718 01:07:06,280 --> 01:07:08,320 interrupt with that question. I think yeah, sure. 1719 01:07:08,320 --> 01:07:09,880 But really? The the massive one there was. 1720 01:07:09,880 --> 01:07:11,640 No difference because it is literally the same thing. 1721 01:07:11,680 --> 01:07:13,280 So exactly that and and the last. 1722 01:07:13,280 --> 01:07:15,840 One is just about inclusion, and I think this just nod towards 1723 01:07:16,000 --> 01:07:18,880 what politicians are saying, like we really care. 1724 01:07:18,880 --> 01:07:20,360 So inclusion has its own thing now. 1725 01:07:20,400 --> 01:07:23,040 And that sounds great. That sounds fantastic, right? 1726 01:07:23,040 --> 01:07:24,720 But you know what's going to really help with inclusion in 1727 01:07:24,720 --> 01:07:26,880 the school? Yeah, funding stuff properly so 1728 01:07:26,880 --> 01:07:30,320 that we can actually help our children get diagnosis, get the 1729 01:07:30,320 --> 01:07:33,240 support they need. This having it on a strong, 1730 01:07:33,240 --> 01:07:37,160 secure, exemplary base is not going to impact how I help my 1731 01:07:37,160 --> 01:07:38,880 children and how I have inclusivity. 1732 01:07:38,880 --> 01:07:40,480 And well before you do the stats of this right, I want. 1733 01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:43,320 To really just root this again, and if you said to me, do you 1734 01:07:43,320 --> 01:07:46,520 think putting attendance on the report will improve attendance, 1735 01:07:46,520 --> 01:07:50,120 my answer would be yes. Not for good reasons. 1736 01:07:50,440 --> 01:07:51,920 I don't think it's driving standards. 1737 01:07:51,920 --> 01:07:53,640 I think we'll do it because it puts that horrible pressure on 1738 01:07:53,640 --> 01:07:55,240 schools. It comes with a huge price. 1739 01:07:55,240 --> 01:07:56,880 Sure. So I kind of take this question 1740 01:07:56,880 --> 01:07:59,920 the same way, you know, do you think inclusion, do you think 1741 01:07:59,920 --> 01:08:02,000 adding inclusion on the on the report will lead to meaningful 1742 01:08:02,000 --> 01:08:05,280 improvements on how schools support disadvantage the S&D 1743 01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:06,560 people? I'm going to slightly push back 1744 01:08:06,560 --> 01:08:07,960 because I. Don't think there's much extra 1745 01:08:07,960 --> 01:08:09,760 room for what schools are doing right now. 1746 01:08:10,200 --> 01:08:13,120 It suggests that there's more we can do on what we've got. 1747 01:08:13,520 --> 01:08:15,800 So in saying that it will improve because it's now in this 1748 01:08:15,800 --> 01:08:19,319 form what it's suggesting that we can do more, but we're not at 1749 01:08:19,319 --> 01:08:22,000 the minute. And I kind of my point here is I 1750 01:08:22,000 --> 01:08:24,040 kind of think we're doing as much as we possibly can. 1751 01:08:24,040 --> 01:08:26,920 Like I get what you mean in terms of maybe you'll do even 1752 01:08:26,920 --> 01:08:28,359 more because something else will drop off. 1753 01:08:28,359 --> 01:08:30,240 That's what I'm saying. But there's still 9 things like 1754 01:08:30,240 --> 01:08:32,840 what's going to drop off like is attendance going to drop? 1755 01:08:32,840 --> 01:08:34,880 Is teaching and learning is leading government is like it's 1756 01:08:34,880 --> 01:08:37,399 all there covered. So something else might drop 1757 01:08:37,399 --> 01:08:38,479 off, but it will still be on that chart. 1758 01:08:38,479 --> 01:08:39,840 OK. And all I'm saying is. 1759 01:08:39,920 --> 01:08:42,439 That's thing is teacher well-being, it just goes back 1760 01:08:42,439 --> 01:08:43,920 to, yeah, do you know what's going to drop off? 1761 01:08:43,920 --> 01:08:46,200 It's just teachers, even more teachers, more teachers are 1762 01:08:46,200 --> 01:08:47,800 going to quit. More teachers are going to get 1763 01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:49,600 the burnout. More teachers are going to have 1764 01:08:49,640 --> 01:08:51,800 breakdowns in school because this is completely unmanageable. 1765 01:08:52,000 --> 01:08:53,800 That's kind of what I'm saying. So I think it, I think it will 1766 01:08:53,800 --> 01:08:56,040 improve. I think the support schools give 1767 01:08:56,040 --> 01:08:58,319 the disadvantaged pupils will improve off of the back of 1768 01:08:58,319 --> 01:09:00,240 teachers again and other staff in the school. 1769 01:09:00,680 --> 01:09:03,160 And it's just, it's just like it doesn't work because what we 1770 01:09:03,160 --> 01:09:05,319 really need, like you said, is the funding to do that and 1771 01:09:05,319 --> 01:09:08,640 that's, you know, the resources. So 53. 1772 01:09:08,640 --> 01:09:10,880 Percent, Eva said. Probably not or definitely not. 1773 01:09:10,880 --> 01:09:12,160 So it won't actually make a difference. 1774 01:09:12,160 --> 01:09:14,240 I think those I think those people are just saying what I'm 1775 01:09:14,240 --> 01:09:16,279 already doing. I can't possibly do anymore or 1776 01:09:16,279 --> 01:09:19,399 something anything unsure. 30% of people are just like probably 1777 01:09:19,399 --> 01:09:21,040 disillusioned. I think that's the big feeling 1778 01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:22,279 from this disillusioned. Yeah. 1779 01:09:22,279 --> 01:09:24,800 It's like OK, whatever, we don't do anything and then probably 1780 01:09:24,800 --> 01:09:26,920 will make it fairer or definitely is 16%. 1781 01:09:26,920 --> 01:09:28,760 So I think that's your line there. 1782 01:09:28,760 --> 01:09:32,560 But it probably will help in this way, but it's not the way 1783 01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:33,840 to fix things. Just a lump more. 1784 01:09:33,840 --> 01:09:35,319 It'll probably be help because you know what it's. 1785 01:09:35,359 --> 01:09:37,399 Going to make me do an extra hour of work at the weekend, 1786 01:09:37,399 --> 01:09:38,920 right? Unless I quit, that's how it's 1787 01:09:38,920 --> 01:09:40,040 going to happen. Yeah. 1788 01:09:40,240 --> 01:09:43,000 And and and. I think just just to summarise 1789 01:09:43,000 --> 01:09:44,600 that that's, that's what Ofsted have done. 1790 01:09:44,640 --> 01:09:47,600 That is the, you know, outlook, that's the outlook we've got. 1791 01:09:47,880 --> 01:09:50,640 You know, I think I think the reason why I'm pushed towards 1792 01:09:50,640 --> 01:09:54,480 more of a negative feeling is because I just think they really 1793 01:09:54,480 --> 01:09:56,200 egged up how much they were going to listen, how much they 1794 01:09:56,200 --> 01:09:58,040 were going to change. We've got a new government in 1795 01:09:58,040 --> 01:10:00,120 who were really big enough, education's going to be top of 1796 01:10:00,120 --> 01:10:02,760 the list, blah, blah, blah. And I think it is really 1797 01:10:02,760 --> 01:10:06,080 demoralising to see that these huge changes that have been put 1798 01:10:06,080 --> 01:10:09,600 in place are making such a negligible difference as to what 1799 01:10:09,600 --> 01:10:12,720 the actual problems are. And I think that's driving the 1800 01:10:12,720 --> 01:10:16,520 reaction that we're seeing to this, which is just simply what 1801 01:10:16,520 --> 01:10:20,120 are you doing? What is wrong with you to 1802 01:10:20,120 --> 01:10:22,040 summarise? The only good parts from this 1803 01:10:22,040 --> 01:10:24,640 for me are getting rid of the one word judgements for the 1804 01:10:24,640 --> 01:10:26,840 overall school. I think that was a really stupid 1805 01:10:26,840 --> 01:10:27,880 thing and I'm glad I got rid of that. 1806 01:10:28,120 --> 01:10:30,640 And making safeguarding a kind of its own separate thing. 1807 01:10:30,760 --> 01:10:32,520 And it's just like you were doing it or not and keeping it 1808 01:10:32,520 --> 01:10:35,240 away from like it's not just banded together of everything 1809 01:10:35,240 --> 01:10:36,360 else. It's like it's no safeguarding 1810 01:10:36,360 --> 01:10:37,520 so important. It's his own thing. 1811 01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:40,360 But everything else that we've discussed I just think is even 1812 01:10:40,360 --> 01:10:42,440 more of the same or actually just worse. 1813 01:10:42,440 --> 01:10:44,000 It's going to add pressure to schools. 1814 01:10:44,200 --> 01:10:45,880 It's going to squeeze schools even further. 1815 01:10:45,960 --> 01:10:47,400 We'll be more squeezed than ever. 1816 01:10:48,000 --> 01:10:49,040 Teachers will leave more than ever. 1817 01:10:49,040 --> 01:10:51,080 I'm calling that right now. Come back to this episode when 1818 01:10:51,080 --> 01:10:53,280 in two years time, the data is even worse. 1819 01:10:53,280 --> 01:10:54,760 Teacher attention data is even worse. 1820 01:10:54,760 --> 01:10:56,640 Will you be one of them? Probably. 1821 01:10:56,760 --> 01:10:58,720 Honestly. Probably at this rate, Yeah. 1822 01:10:59,320 --> 01:11:00,000 Yeah. My God. 1823 01:11:00,320 --> 01:11:02,240 Right, let's finish up there. Thank you so much for listening 1824 01:11:02,520 --> 01:11:05,320 and we'll see you next time. It's not not much of an episode 1825 01:11:05,320 --> 01:11:06,560 next. Oh yeah, no. 1826 01:11:07,320 --> 01:11:10,720 I'll, I'll, I'll contain my excitement for episode What's 99 1827 01:11:10,720 --> 01:11:11,560 + 1? I don't know. 1828 01:11:11,560 --> 01:11:13,800 I can't bridge past. No, no, you can't speak 1829 01:11:13,800 --> 01:11:14,320 properly. And you? 1830 01:11:14,320 --> 01:11:15,640 Can't bridge past. I think actually you need this 1831 01:11:15,640 --> 01:11:17,840 report card I think. I think causing concern. 1832 01:11:19,080 --> 01:11:20,920 See you next. Time yeah, for episode. 100 bye.