Well, lucky listeners. Have we got a treat for you
today? We've got our first caller in
Gary gum on from Crawley. Hi Gary.
Thanks for calling it to the show.
How are you? I'll be honest.
Ellen, I don't normally listen, but I'm currently disgusted at.
What used to Sir promoting to your woky Lefty fans?
Oh yes, girls that then what we promoting as if you don't know,
you looked as bad as a bloody nurses.
I think it's absolutely appalling.
That you have got the nerve to go on strike again.
You got your They offer, what more do you greedy?
Not one Burger. You know, some people would
argue, there's a lot more to it than just that you have a
monkey's to be like stealing, the Kings coronation is coming
up. We're supposed to be enjoying
this time and now I've got occupy my son Malcolm oh for
another day right on the lead-up to use year, six sets, because
you lot are too selfish to consider that Anya.
Oh Gary, what do you say to you? Perhaps the king could move his
bank holiday, which happens to take place on a day on the
actual week of the Satchel talking about your honestly, It
just you disgusting. How dare you insult our King
like that? Do you do you not think we can
take one day out to come together as a country for an
important event? Or is that too right wing for
you know Gary Gary I guess you're you're maybe right there.
Maybe you do have a point and the Kings coronation is actually
far more important than saving our failing education system.
Making sure that teachers are professionals can actually keep
up with inflation and can afford to heat their homes.
I truly believe that wearing red white and blue for a whole day
is far more important. Other than that and how dare we
be striking? God, Save the King.
Hello everyone. Welcome back to another episode
of teach sleep. Repeat, my name is Dylan and my
name is Hayden, and I'm quite pleased to interrupt me this
week. Aiden, thank you.
I was tempted. I must admit.
Well, you know what the script is to say every week apparently
and I'm really conscious of it. Now, I think maybe next week,
I'll try some, some kind of different introduction than what
it is. Now you know how I felt when
people you know, mocking the way I said my name back in episode 1
back in the day. Well do you remember dreamt
about then Back when TVs are black and white, it's crazy.
The single digits with it before you are double digits in a
scientist. Just now, when I was younger,
just made me think of this very quickly, very, really odd
tangent that we're going on, literally seconds into the
podcast. Did you ever have those select
quiz things? You believe when you're younger,
because you're a child and no one's ever explain it to you.
I got to about 9 or 10 years old before I realized that the
actual world wasn't black and white.
I thought the the actual planet with if Don was black and white
until that the 40s or 50s and then that's what I thought
happened. When gotta record eyes, I can't
think of any good ones now, but I know for a fact that they were
tons of those sorts of things, but growing up, you realize
these things. And you realize how silly it was
that you thought that thing for so long.
But I can't think any good examples of it, if they come to
me, I will just blurt them in this podcast to blurt them out.
And maybe we can ask people at home there, something similar in
that because it's such a common thing.
Like it almost is almost on par with, you know, genuinely some
children. I know it's a joke but they
genuinely don't think that teachers exist outside of
school, might be is no one's ever.
You know, when they see that illusion shattered, that was
actually one of the things that did that did genuinely happen
for me. I remember being in your to, and
having my world blown, when I found out that it wasn't true,
but I really genuinely believe that my teacher slept in the
Attic of the school. And she'd always point up to
this, like, you know, the classic square like Square Tile
rules, where you can just push them.
Obviously, she'd always say like, yeah, I sleep in there and
I fully believed it. I had no reason not to.
And then when I found out that wasn't true, I did.
Remember, we are raising a whole A generation of children who
believe that we're cousins. So, you know, they will believe,
whatever still happens. Every now and then someone says,
I was your cousin to admit it. So your brother.
I know they're talking about you, it's brilliant crazy.
But yeah. So this is the first week back
after halftime, and we actually carried on the podcast for at
the halftime. And only when you mentioned to
me, you're like, oh we could have had a break and I was like,
oh we could have, but we love doing it, we're back, we're
here. And many of you might know,
obviously, we don't record it on a Friday morning.
That would be ludicrous. Because it's really sunny Friday
morning. It's currently Wednesday
evening. So we just have three days and
how you feeling? Hey, Mark, you know what?
I'm exhausted. I'm exhausted.
It's be threat. I just please tell me.
If you're listening, please write in and tell me that it's
not just me. And maybe Dylan who once you
have a week off or two weeks off, in this case, I honestly,
I, it takes me like a week to adjust to go to going back to
working working full time at school.
It's just so exhausting, do you All the same.
Yeah, it's weird, isn't it? I may be other teachers can kind
of comment on this, but I feel like it's a constant wave.
I think the first week back is just hit you like a train,
doesn't it? And then I feel personally.
I really hit my groove week. 2 week 3, week 4 and then it kind
of slides. But it sounds pathetic, doesn't
it? I can imagine people listening
to this who have four weeks off a year and we talked about this
with director time. We don't need to go back in to
justify how much work we do. And how much time off we get
time off in. Ins.
But it, you know it's about sound crazy.
When I like, oh god, he has been which had two weeks off my three
weeks in. Now, we're just knackered.
It's like, but it's true. It's just so intense.
Isn't it scoffs? I get my voice like my throat
hurts? I don't know about you.
That always happens to me in week one always within the first
day or two, really really sore throat.
And I think it's just from you, just, you talk a lot.
You talk loudly a lot at school with kids and and is not normal
like you don't do that outside. So, he relaxed with seaweed and
normally You go back to just constantly speaking a bit louder
to lots of people. I've made that point before.
It's so true that you know what, your base level voice is a
teacher is twice as loud as any other time in your life ever.
Yeah. And I've said before and I've
said to the children because we talked about this, don't we
before about how personally, I know you're similar.
I don't like bellowing at the children.
I've always had this weird thing of I'm this, you know, imposing
old like old say old person. I'm not that old imposing
adults. With like a booming voice.
I want to have one. And the idea of me, bellowing
absolutely bellowing constantly at these children.
I just feel uncomfortable with doing that, but the why say to
the children is look, I don't like having a go at you guys.
Whenever I have to complain about something as I hate it, I
don't like complaining. And actually, when I use my
voice, it's for safety. John, we absolutely shout at
them. But then, I also made the point
to them because they were doing a performance.
And you know what children are like when they get their books
up to the front is so Oh sweet. Because for some children, just
standing at the front of the room, sit reading something,
they've written to their peers. That's enough for me.
I'm like cool. Fantastic, you know, you can
Mumble into your page, all you want because that's where you
are in terms of your public speaking and stuff.
But I remember stood in front of the children, making the point
of saying can you imagine speaking?
Like I'm speaking now sat at the table with your parents at
dinner like it's completely different.
Yeah. And when you come up to the
front, you use your normal talking points which is much
more soft because you just turn you just tell me you mates like
this, but listen to what I'm doing now.
Making sure my voice fills this room and they were like, oh
yeah. And they kind of all realized,
how a natural voice when you're teaching is, it's actually
really loud. It's interesting Paradox,
actually anyone's this thing. Anyone, any teachers will know
this children constantly pretty loud.
It can get quite frustrating, always trying to, you know,
quite in them down and it was during a lesson.
That's just a common thing. You ask them to read something
at the front of the class, and if you say to them, oh, could
you speak up, please? It's not loud enough, 100% of
the time. I'm, they will net.
They will not increase the volume of air voice.
I've never ever, ever actually experience a child going, oh
yeah, sorry, I'll be louder now. And then being loud up.
They don't do it. They look at you.
They're not. Hmm.
Carry on reading. Exactly the same volume.
If anyone's ever with something different, I don't know.
You might, you might want to be a bit worried because that's not
normal the best of it. The best thing they do sometimes
is they'll just lower their book slightly and I'm like, oh, okay
it's happening. Same couldn't hear it.
Come here. Sad the front next to them and
I'm like, what? Sorry Connie.
I'll bless them. But yeah, I mean, in terms of
first week back it's just, it's just crazy.
I felt really good actually during the way I love it.
When you see your class again, for the first time after a
break, I absolutely love it because I just want to just want
to see them. That's the first thing.
But also they're just full of beans.
They come in, they're making laughs, they're joking.
There's just so many funny moments, with the children off
the cuff, when they're just like, just saying hi for the
first time and they're just acting.
Cool. Trying to make you laugh.
And I just, I just love it. And when it got to Wednesday,
which is obviously today, because this is the only thing
that people always take the mick out as about is because we start
working on Wednesday. And I know we walk around God.
I'm knackered and they're like, yes I've got two more days of
this and already how long's it been since We've been doing
three days later I think a year and a half maybe I can't imagine
carrying on and again people listening to this or a teacher's
more than likely very, sorry it's Friday for you and you've
got your last day but it's just crazy.
You just fit what you're used to do.
Like I've kind of realized that you know whatever you're doing
at that time. You just like you will fit your
mind or just become exhausted by the end of it.
I think, with Dylan's trying to say to anyone, listening is.
Yeah, it's Friday. You're on your way to work.
We're not, we are sat home feet up, probably most likely Dylan
Only thinking about you guys and how you're doing is not we
having today. Actually, we're probably still
in bed, I'll be honest with you, so, yeah.
You know, it's tough doing three days a week.
We find it really tough. But enjoy your work Copy, Stop
it. Those are those that audience
size is going to shrink after that.
But I tell you what, it's a good chance if you're listening to
this and it is ATM on the Friday.
If there is a good chance, I just sat in bed post on
Instagram so there so just come out.
That's why. I get to buy a birthday C, says
he listens to it on, repeat to get more views.
All we've had five plays now for the Medellin.
I've actually gone out and bought for more phones.
So I can get four more unique listeners just cuz it makes the
device, any iPad called MTV, let if you are listening and you
wanna help us out by trying to reach a bigger audience,
obviously we love doing this and we want more people to listen
and write Us in story. So we can tell you funny stuff.
So check us out head to teach leap, peat pot on Instagram, or
you can - it teach sleep, repeat podcast at gmail.com that right
bit awkward because you've got the wrong there are where I'm
learning. I'm usually do this one thought.
Yeah, the one without the Gmail is longer because it doesn't
have the Gmail sounds. My reasoning is another Gmail.
So I'll just go for teach teach, repeat podcast and Instagram.
Teach seek repeat POD at gmail.com and I was just
thinking Hayden got a quick challenge for you before we play
the beat and just crying over the podcast.
Yeah, what percentage of our podcast now is I was Plugging
myself. Do you think 2010 follow us for
more? You remember, last week we
mentioned how we put the question to you, not going to
poke the Instagram again but that's where it was you
sometimes get access to some polls to see what we're going to
talk about. And the option was between
homework and teacher training homework, 1, and we're now going
to render that pole completely useless because this week as
you've seen from the title we're going to talk about teacher
training so you really voted on was the order that we're talking
about them and but yeah you've seen the title.
You quit on this. We have two types of listeners
by the way. It just actually from me saying
the insights, we get those repeat listeners.
Who will honestly click on anything?
We could say don't click on this and probably cooking.
Anyway, the listen to it. Now do the writing, you know,
anything? Anything they know we dig into
the habits but we've also got another group of people and this
is where sometimes are unique listeners fluctuate because they
might see a title. I think I'm going to click on
that. So this might be something that
you specifically clicked on because you want to learn about
it, you might be training to become a teacher.
So, Hayden, I'm gonna ask you a very simple question.
What is teacher training really like, wild Ellen?
If I asked that too, quickly than the podcast will be over
really quickly. Wouldn't so teacher training.
Well, it could actually reflect on my teacher training a little
bit or you know what you want me to do here, I want to talk to my
question. What is teacher training really
like stuff? I'll say that.
It's tough. It's not an easy year.
I do see posts from people and various Facebook groups that are
going through their kind of training year or they may be
there and easy tea. Used to be called nqt.
We'll talk about it later and that.
Yeah, there's a lot of them come to the realization.
I think that. Yeah, it's really, really,
really tough. I would say I had no life
whatsoever. Honestly, during my training
year, I was just 100% fixate on it which it was a good thing
because I was passionate the time that's all I wanted to do.
So it worked really well but it yeah you chose that lifestyle
right. It wasn't it.
I knew it. I knew it was going to be like
that I did the pgce As did you which is the one year teacher
training course there Are different options?
Of course you can. You can get into teaching a few
different ways. One of them being the kind of
classic three-year bachelor's degree at University teacher
training, but there are other routes for postgraduates as
well, such as a pgce or schemes like teach first where you might
even be able to be paid to actually come and do your
training. You, that's always a good option
for people. Yeah, we just did the classic
pgce and yeah, I got a few funny memories, I did, if you want me
to sort of go into these memories.
Now did it or if you wanted to talk about your introduction to
teaching. Now I think what we've got
Teacher training is an absolute Goldmine for stories.
I think we've got plenty this this week, which I'm really
looking forward to, but I kind of want to just dive deeper into
that the actual Logistics of it and give an impression of what
it actually involves because it's such a big thing.
And I'm thinking, people click on this might be thinking one
day, they might become a teacher, they only their
University student. And you spoke about pgce just to
clarify Hayden and I went to University and studied different
thing. I study history you studied film
radio and television. So putting that to good use here
the podcast. Really?
Yeah. But then obviously after that
he's you see, it's just one extra year.
It's like Masters credits and you become qualified teacher
status as well, but it's just, I think Weidman this up just
giving that kind of insight into you kind of touched on it.
There. It's really intense and what
really interests me is as two young people who went into it,
kind of fresh. We just worked a supermarket it.
We both of us yet separate supermarkets.
Because if Hayden eyes lives weren't, Not enough.
We also have the same job before I went into teaching, but we
were fresh. It's all we knew.
So we kind of dived into teaching headfirst, absolutely
loved it. Dedicated all the time to, it
didn't mind putting weekend time into it because it was our
passion. Like you said.
Yeah. And I think as the Times Gone
on, you, reflect back on your teacher training, you just think
that was so intense. And you can see why people
flounder a little bit and worry and get themselves into tears,
because you have to commit so much time to it.
And what really strikes me as something I really loved about
my teacher training and it was so helpful to me, is that very,
very quickly. We formed a kind of friendship
group of people who are going through at the same time as
well. And someone, we're really good
friends with both of us. Now who quit his job after
working for 20 years as an engineer to become a teacher.
And I'll always remember him saying Guys, you don't
understand how much work this is, but that that was and he was
in, you know, a very decent job very well, respected job as.
And he always he always grounds us and he says, listen boys, you
have no idea like because it was told it was normal.
And what I'd say to people training at the start of their
career is, I don't think we did this enough Hayden at the time
and looking back. Now, it's laughable, is to
really just listen to those more experienced people.
Whether it's more experienced, people who were Outside of the
profession telling you. No no you need to slow down
you're going to burn out like they know that but also those
teachers who've done it for 25 years.
So how do you think they've survived 25 years in this
profession back? Then it was like oh why are
they, what are they complaining about this new?
In this new thing SRT of introduced?
Where, you know, all we've got to do is spend an hour, putting
some marks into an Excel sheet, what's so bad about that?
And then the now honestly you look back and you just think
wow. If you're training to be a
teacher, listen to the experience.
And if you Even if you think you don't agree with them at that
moment, just take it in because it's valid.
And that's such a such a really want to hold on to that and I
wish I could tell myself that if I went back there, anything that
you'd want to tell yourself if you went back.
And just think just do this slightly differently.
Aw, it's a tough one. I think I don't know.
II got really obsessed, really obsessed with like particular
areas of knowledge. That sounds really silly, but I
don't know, I don't know where I got it from, but like I was what
do you mean like specific? Like such a privilege to teach
subject knowledge, which is really weird.
I don't know why I can't really remember where it came from.
But I look back now, and it's funny because that all that
subject on which I focused on back then it's probably like two
percent of the subject knowledge.
I now have because because you teach so much random stuff over
your career where you change your groups, you change schools,
you change topics, you change subjects.
You do different things. All the time, you're constantly
just learning and then teaching different stuff that you can't.
Just no all of it beforehand. You just kind of have to touch
up on these things. And I remember being Obsessive
like know this thing has told me.
I need to know the parts of a plant.
I need to know the model plant. I have it on my wall, I'll earn
a part of my plan and I also need to know this, like specific
geography thing. I have to know.
This is told me that I've got to do it.
The course. And then I look back now and I'm
like God, so naive like that was like one of about 400 different
topics. I've now, since taught, you
know, it's just so silly. Like, just chill out.
Like you said, I didn't need to sit there stressing about this
stuff. What I needed to focus on was
the pedagogy, which Still think is a really good.
Good advice for people. The important stuff was that
this is how you teach this is psychology, this is how it
works. These are the different ways
that children's brains will react in different situations.
You need to understand all of them so that you can identify in
a moment and be adaptable to a particular situation so that you
can provide the best learning experience for that.
Child that for me, like oh wait, I kind of put that on par with
all this random subject knowledge and to me now I'm like
cool. The subject knowledge is almost
like I'll learn that when I need to learn it.
It's fine. Okay, we'll pick that up.
I would just draw it very quickly.
I think, maybe you probably think the same thing, but there
are certain subjects on a job would put on the same part as
pedagogy I'm asking English, you know, it's a bit different, I'm
thinking, like, the plot, the plant stuff.
Yeah, of course, like mean there's no, it's almost scary.
Knowing that like that the names that specifically remembering at
that point, the, the names of like parts of plants.
I put that on the same level as also learning about, you know,
how the brain works. Yeah.
Safeguarding. And Yeah, it's just that.
If I could go back, I built it right?
Just chill out. Go.
And actually have an hour to yourself for a start.
Just forget about that stuff and how you can learn that later.
Okay. If you got a topic coming out
about plants, learn it. Then you'll be fine.
But right now, have an hour off and then focus on the, you know,
the more important stuff about how teaching actually works.
The bits that you really need to know to be a good teacher.
So in terms of teacher training, okay?
This is something we've touched on before, but I really want to
dive deeper into this now, if you were to break up teacher
training, Get into time at University time in school.
Yeah, time studying pedagogy like outside like in the books
outside of University and outside of school and literal
just throwing yourself into the community of the school, talking
to teachers, listening to them, chatting to them.
Informally, how would you rank them in terms of you personally,
how much you feel they mold you into a good to?
Yeah, that's a really good question.
So I reckon people give different answers to this one.
So for me and I think you might agree with this first part the
most valuable part of teacher training.
I don't know if this does this count, correct me if I'm wrong,
but it was the bit just after teacher training when I was
dumped in a school. And it was like that's your
responsibility now. But if I'm going back a
statement, let's say that b not included because like, I
technically have qualified by that point.
Yes, your most valuable part was the placements.
So, being in school was like, by far for me that I did the most
learning. Experience I had and I would put
s the pedagogy stuff. I personally really enjoyed
learning about like, you know, all the psychologists that come
up for our course and learning about that how this all works,
why stuff works, why we do certain things in schools and
also more importantly, I found the things to avoid.
There's a lot of natural things, I think that people would do,
and if someone random came into into the classroom, and I said,
they never taught anything before and I said, go on, teach
this subject are, they probably do a bunch of things that sit
there be like. Clear.
Don't know this little bit and I'd be thinking of some pedagogy
that I learned. I think it's really important.
I know other people might not value it as much, but no, I
think it's because there's got to be something that separates
us as professionals, right? Because realistically that's
strip it back. You talked about subject
knowledge, right? You don't need to know
everything off the top of your head for certain subjects, but
there are certain things in terms of math and English, we do
whatever. But my point here is that nearly
at, you know, every single adult in the professional world would
be able to teach themselves to stuff that we're teaching these
That your odds, right? We're in half an hour
beforehand, so yeah, that that you're absolutely right to me.
That's irrelevant. That is genuinely almost
irrelevant because cool. If I'm expecting an
eight-year-old to cross this, then I can still be a specialist
in certain things, but there's other stuff, which I can just
pick up, Average, Joe can pick them up.
There's got to be something that kind of separates us as a
profession and I think that pedagogy is a huge part of that.
It's like, you know, but I think also experience is a huge part
of that because you can be book smart when it comes to teaching,
right the zone of proximal development vygotsky.
It was brilliant on paper and as I cool, well, essentially boiled
down to was you need to challenge the children enough
that they're going to make progress, but not enough that
they're switched off and they can't access it.
Like that's basically what it boiled down to which made sense,
and it was brilliant to sit there and learn on these things.
But I would say, from my teaching experience working with
the children and equally if not more having unbelievable
teachers to watch to learn from. And to actually get insight from
and for me to be able to say and I've said it before, I know she
listens to the podcast and I'm going to name drop.
You don't have Donna. Donna, name-drop you Fran.
I don't to make you feel cold air.
And but I always say the same thing.
I walked in first date each training there, I remember it
vividly because it was that moment where I thought, I think
I'm in the right job. I walked in teacher training,
walked around the corner. Fran that's my teacher who I did
my first placement with. Handing out, lab coats and City
goggles because her class that morning were doing a class
assembly. And just watching the way she
was with the children, the Comanche had over them whilst
not being stressy, not being horrible, being lovely.
And then, as weeks went on watching her teacher and deliver
these lessons to different varying abilities.
Knowing the children Inside Out building, the bonds with them,
seeing how that all built together to this huge massive,
like thing, with all these moving parts that inspired me,
like as a as a teacher, I Take that as number one, like above
everything of me just going in the classroom, watching an
expert learning from an expert and then practicing at myself.
I put that way above uni and I think a lot of teachers do the
same thing because at University whilst it was fantastic.
And I did maths as my specialism as you know Hayden because I'm a
specialist and you are, I don't know.
I just have an education. Carry on.
Okay, cool. It was it maps to shut up.
Yeah. Anyway, but the point is, Some
fantastic stuff in University but also I'm not gonna lie.
Sometimes we go to Art University and we would just do
an art lesson. Like I'm not joking.
Like we get the lecturer who had talked for ten minutes about
what not lesson might be about. Cool.
Can you make a tortoise out of paper mache?
And I'm like, well, I gotta, but is this the best use of my time
right now? I thought, you know, this still
the same you've literally, like, not ruined but hilarious.
The kind of told a story that I was going to tell.
I had it written down. I'm gonna tell This was a funny
part of my teacher training was rdt.
I went to my it was like the one rdt session we got, because the
pgce was so cramped. Yes, he Stone different subjects
and a lot of it was actual practice, which is the best
thing. Like it was, it was put that
way, which is good. But yeah, like you said this one
session, I didn't really feel like I learn anything about
teaching whatsoever that I just had to make.
I just basically turn myself into a massive elephant
somewhere. I will find this picture for
you. I also had hair so that would be
more fun. There's a picture of me with
hair before I Shave. My head dressed up as an
elephant and that's all I did in that two hour session on my
team. My BGC, I didn't, I don't
honestly, I don't think I learned a thing, but I had fun
making an elephant. It was really good, fun.
It was really good fun, but that's not the point.
The point is actually, you know what, we've only got a year and
I think just in terms of teacher training, my goodness, get
yourselves watching some amazing teachers, because still to this
day, I find it the most valuable thing, as a teacher to go and
see someone else doing and be like, wow.
That was a, that was so good. And then I get excited.
I get excited. Then to go back to my children
and try the same thing. And I think the number one thing
that helped me. Personally, again in teacher
training, another reflection is just jumping diving head first
because it's scary at first. I remember the first time I went
into a school before my official teacher training, when I was
just going in to observe just to see if I'd like to the school
environment. If it's what I wanted to do, the
teacher asked me to read a story to the children.
And I said no, I was so scared. I was so nervous and it's absurd
to me at this point to think that it's nerve-wracking but it
is but all I can say is if you're going to teach training
or in fact, any kind of job where you're bit nervous, just
dive headfirst give it your best shot because actually in five
years, time, 10 years time, when you look back, you'll be
laughing at yourself because the idea of be getting nervous
reading a story to the children. Now, it's just crazy.
And I'm sure Hayden, if someone asks you your teacher training
to pretend to blow a blow dryer, one of the Because I didn't know
what I'm saying. I mean you'd be so nervous.
Well, I would have been like yes please.
I would have been really nervous and I was I just just to jump in
on that. I was also a for a long time.
To be honest. If you really, really, really
nervous about being in front of the kids.
I even into my actual, like first job, I still had that
proper nerve of like, oh my God, like, I'm actually gonna be in
front of this class, I'd say throughout my in QT.
Yeah, that's the, you know, it went throughout that year, but
it definitely wasn't instant, like, it took me a long time and
I was totally He faking the confidence for ages and then it
just you know it did just become natural like you said with
anything you do in life honestly just after a bit of time and you
just it just you know it doesn't become as nerve-racking.
I'm going to jump back to teacher training again because
one thing I thought about was you were talking was and you
mentioned mass and obviously what you know math we're bit
biased towards Mass. We both like maths is our
subject? You did a mass specialism and
it's always been a passion of mine as well and a.
But I found that I learned so much about Teaching and how to
teach through my mass training and and it was almost kind of
applicable to all the other subjects as well, but I felt
like Mass was the core of me. Like I understood so much about
how to present things to children in a way that they
actually understand it. How and how different that is to
how you present it to it. Someone has our age and how you
actually have to consider that in teaching but you can't just
that's why. I'll, you know, I'm the guy that
analogy about if I think if I just took a friend in to the
classroom and ask them to teach the same a subjective, I think
it would just be hilariously bad quite Naturally because I don't
think the average person has any understanding or doesn't have
much understanding I shouldn't insult.
Everyone. No, no, but you're right.
Have too much understanding of the pedagogy behind it and I
learnt so much of that pedagogy. And I come to so many
realizations when I was in those Mass lectures and learning about
like, no, no, you should present it like this because then you
can take this child on this journey.
And this is going to make these Connections in their mind
because they don't have anything to build on you're creating this
knowledge for them. Oh man.
I just I yeah, my mind was always blown in those math
sessions. I hugely values.
Those ones, but you are right, there has to be something that
separates us as a professional to someone who just knows how to
add numbers, but there has to be something there.
Elsewhere, not teachers, we're just regurgitating.
What degree would be, pointless, otherwise wouldn't it?
Yeah, exactly that. Exactly.
That, you know, I know most of the degree is just practicing
it, but there has to be some kind of differentiation.
And that's what we're good at. And I remember having a
conversation with one of my friends actually, About this who
kind of scoffed at the idea wasn't being rude or anything
but that and another one of their teacher friends had said
that they didn't know anything about.
I think it was ancient. It's something to of ancient
Egypt or something like that along those lines of history and
they kind of scoff did it to me. I was like, can you can you
believe this teacher? This teacher said they didn't
know about ancient Greek and they teach it in a year.
They didn't know anything about it.
Like, that's crazy. And I was just actually like,
well, it depends and there. Like what they didn't know
anything about it and I was and then their teacher friend had
said to them and Justified it by saying no I don't but, you know,
my jobs more about learning how to teach and then I can apply
that to almost anything and I think that's the core thing to
get out of your teaching year is actually, you are learning to be
a teacher. You are not learning things
else. You just be getting a degree in
history or a degree in math or something like that.
You have to be learning how to teach.
And then when you learn how to teach, I think I have got a lot
better. Being able to get a point across
simplified and, you know, that helps when I talk to adults or I
discuss or debate something, you know, when I get embroiled in a
pilot political debate, I feel because of my teaching degree in
my profession that I'm able to get a point across more
succinctly. Let's say and that helps me to
get my point across and really dive deep into something.
And what I feel like I'm good at as well as another thing that is
a result of learning how to be a teacher and being at school.
Is taking what is a 200-page national curriculum and being
able to kind of summarize what it means in a professional
discussion with our peers. You know that that's yeah that's
something that, you know, the skills are really big part of
teacher training, in my opinion. And I think you've made a really
good point there. About subject knowledge being
vital in some degrees but just to chill out a bit in others
because as a teacher, I think I could teach nearly anything.
To nearly any one given the amount of time for me to take in
information myself. So, I've actually got up here,
the Teaching Standards. Now for those that are
listening, if this is something you've planned and because
you're looking very, I'm so angry, like, in a really funny
way. Like when you say what, cause
you look like you've planned. So, I got this up on a whim.
You look like your plans is it. I was going to lead into a
discussion here about how we are judged on the teacher standards,
right? And I was going Quiz you on how
many of the eight you could remember.
I wish you had now because I've got the map in front of me, so
I've got, I've got a challenge if you don't mind then with the
teacher standards, right? And what we do is, I'm just
going to quickly go through them because we did actually mention
them in a previous video when we were talking about like, teacher
pay. And we were talking about
teacher hours and all that sort of stuff, right?
So go back and listen to episode.
If you're interested in how teacher pay and holiday and all
that stuff works. And how many hours we really do
do across the year. And one of the things I
mentioned was his teacher standards because It's a weird
job where we are only paid for a certain amount of hours, which
we call our director time. But actually, there are way more
jobs to do that, you can't physically fit in that director
time. So we have, this is this wider
net, which is called the teacher standards and we have to meet
these teacher standards. If we don't meet these teacher
standards, then we will be fired.
I'm just kidding. But if we have to meet these,
They just added as part of our role.
So the first there's eight of them.
I'm going to I'm going to read them out to you very quickly and
then I'm going to ask you you Dylan and it will be A hard one
to do. I want you to pick one.
The one teacher standard that you think is the most important
or this is already going to be horrendous lead.
It's obviously to be hard because they're all really
important as you listen to, hopefully understand.
These are really important standards, but I think, and then
reason I've asked you this sentence because I think there's
one for me that I think is kind of like Above the Rest.
This up, this will be good because half our audience, our
teachers and I reckon honestly, before I read them, what I've
been able to get all eight of the top of my head.
Maybe we're enough time. But I probably would have
forgotten one or two. Yeah, but also for our
non-teacher listeners this is a really good Insight actually
into almost our, you know, our kind of role has been condensed
into this A4 sheet, and these eight standards.
So it'd be nice to interact. Listen to the actual.
Okay, if you had to summarize the job.
It's these eight things. So I'm looking forward to this.
I'm going to try and justify it. Remind me of a dim, go on.
We have to meet these eight things, and if we can't do it,
do them in our director time, which we can't, by the way, you
have to do them anyway. And that's the way, the job
works. So, here we go.
Teacher standard number one set. high expectations, which Inspire
motivate and challenge pupils Teachers added number to
promote, good progress and outcomes by pupils.
Number three is demonstrate, good subject and curriculum
knowledge. Number four is plan and teach
well-structured lessons. Number five adapt teaching to
respond to the strengths and needs of all pupils Number six,
make accurate and productive, use of assessment number 7,
manage Behavior, effectively to ensure a good safe, learning
environment and number eight, fulfill wider professional
responsibilities. Good old T8.
They drop that one in there. Just so you know just scoop up
any other jobs they want you to do.
I can't believe that. I remember so vividly, by the
way that they wanted me to put in my training year, they asked
me to help out the Disco and said yeah.
It's because TSA Yeah, anything Falls in terms of this thing.
Oh, do I have to do? It's not a direct of time.
Well, she just had the date. You go fulfill what the
responsibilities. So it defines wide
responsibilities. No, so nice, I'm struggling.
I'm struggling because I've said it a million times.
A number one, most important thing for me is that the
children in our care are in a safe learning environment.
So, that's a nice straightaway Tyree clarify.
My question actually, because I feel like I set you up to not
succeed, very well there and it makes it really hard.
I think, what I mean, what I mean by my question is, I'm kind
of thinking along the lines. As of teacher training which is
the most important skill to develop as a teacher.
Yeah. From these colonies each, it's
hard. I'm probably gonna, I'm going to
say one. Okay.
I'm going to take the plunge and do the opposite of what I always
do, which is chat about all of them.
And then come to some kind of clear go for the say, one will
go from their plan and teach while structured Essence, cool.
Do you reckon that was my one or not?
Oh, I don't know. I think it was it wasn't.
Oh good. This is the think there was
another one, when you read them, I'm country which one it was.
Now where I thought he, I know, he'd like this one.
I saw your not along it. I so I know which one you're
thinking is. I literally saw use of Nod like,
can you read them again? Can you beat them?
A short break? So really quickly ready.
I'm going to go through them set high expectations.
Number one number to promote, good progress and outcomes by
pupils number three, demonstrated subject, knowledge
and Quick Knowledge. Number four was plan and teach
well-structured lessons. Number five is adapt.
To respond to the strengths and needs of all pupils.
Number six, is make accurate and productive, use of assessment,
number 7, manage Behavior, effectively, and number 84 for
wider, professional response, number two or number 6, right?
Oh no, it's not what it is. Well, I feel like, you know, for
me the most important skill that I feel has made me a good
teacher, is number five adapting that.
Oh, that's why I missed it. I thought that was six.
I thought that's the five. That's number five.
Where? Oh yeah, that one.
That was for me. Like yeah.
If I look back, I what I think is the most exciting So part of
my teaching career, I think it is the ability to because of all
the pedagogy that I learned and also the experience I now have
is the ability to like rapidly rapidly adapt what I'm doing,
based on how a child responds verbally or through body
language to what I'm teaching and adapting it so that they
learn better. Okay.
I guess my only response there is firstly.
They are all really important skills to learn and Actually
when you're doing your teacher training, it comes from this
sheet. I remember my observation
sheets, and they would have to directly linked to one of these
standards. Like, these are the eight things
that you're literally judged on, but I would say, one thing that
in terms of, in your teacher training year, I guess it kind
of overlaps a bit of plan and deliver while structured
lessons, because actually planning good lessons means
meeting the needs of your children and you're going to the
next level of course, which is just on the spot, which I think
is such an important skill. I Perhaps my response to that
would be that that kind of on the spot changing, what you're
doing having the confidence to do that and having the knowledge
of actually the curriculum and to say, okay we're going to go
slower because actually this is a priority and we need to make
sure we get this. So I'm going to respond to your
needs. I think that's something that
you develop over time. Whereas I think planning and
delivering well-structured lessons is something that
through good practice in your teacher training and a good
Mentor and a good school that you can pick up within that
year. So I guess in my teacher
training, I wanted to finish the and I feel like I did really
confident in someone giving me an objective and I'll be able to
produce a good lesson for that. Yeah.
Back in back in teacher training and maybe even your own key to
you. Thank you.
Tia when you have to certainly no teacher training when you had
to provide full written plan to remember, like you don't
generally, I don't think there are many schools in the country
where you have to provide or any schools really where you have to
provide a full written plan. Pearl.
Lesson per day, but when you are training, you do have to do
that. It's an enormous enormous
workload on top of the teaching because it takes a long time
like how do you feel about that kind of now on reflection and
also is that any different to how you felt about it at the
time doing those plot writing them out?
I think truly right now, I would think that they are vital to do
when you're learning how to plan a lesson, right?
And I think at the time, I'm I probably was slightly resentful
of them, but equally I found them really useful because it's
not like, you know, I didn't resent it that much because
number one I was fresh and I was passionate and number two, it
really helped me plan the lesson out.
You know, now, like this is what I mean about adapting and stuff.
We know the curriculum so well, we know, teaching, so, well, at
this point that I can open up a SMART Notebook, which is
basically a PowerPoint for teachers, and I can create a
lesson literally, from the top of my head, small.
Excusing resources that we've bought into as a school as part
of our scheme. Whereas absolutely could never
have got to that point in my opinion, without being.
So granular with the detail, the start of every step and why
we're doing it. And being able to justify that
step and having the piece of paper there to talk to him, my
mentor and say, well I'm doing a starter and I'm going to do the
starter on this and I've written down this because actually in
the lesson we need this skill to make sure the children can do
that in there in there in there actual lesson and saying that
out loud and writing. It was a huge workload.
You're absolutely right. Because it Did add a lot on and
if someone asked me to do it now I'd be I'd say no because I
don't need to it's as simple as that.
I think as a teacher, a trainee teacher, sorry when you're doing
a much reduced workload, as in terms of number of lessons
you're delivering tell me that that individual highly detailed
plan was so important and I would I would really from a from
a mental point of view. If I had a student I push them
and push them and push them to do that and and for their own
good and I'd be saying look this I promise you.
This is how eventually you're going to be able to do stuff at
the top of your own head. Yeah, well, I've got nothing to
add to cuz I honestly I feel exactly the same I would have
made the exact same point. So I'm glad we agree on that
one. I think so as well.
So on to maybe a just a more lighthearted part of teacher
training, I've actually got a funny story.
I just remembered something earlier whenever you know, that
I can look back on and laugh and laugh about an hour and probably
the class teacher I was with, at the time.
Probably laughed at it as well, but was really kind and never
made me feel silly. About it, just let me do my
thing. They actually told the story on
their podcast, have those me on, I would have told it myself, but
you might find this quite funny because it's just, it's just
classic me. Not being aware of my, but the
situation was just not okay, not having knowledge on something,
right? And so, when I was in my first
ever placement, first time I've been dropped in a school, like
it was terrifying. But exciting at the same time I
was with the year one, which if, you know me, I've always thought
a key stage 2 in my, in my career.
So, that's three. That's quite an odd experience.
For me, even now I'd find it quite tricky because I'm not
used to it, but I was in year one and something I really
wanted to do because part of the course was, like, think it was
telling me to look at like, Behavior Awards, what Behavior
Awards, and what like positive reward systems are there in the
school? And I, rather than, you know,
maybe just looking around the school and finding out what they
actually do. I just invented my own one.
I was like, awesome sauce has spent a whole evening to
inventing. This thing I was like, oh my
God, this teacher is going to be so Impressed with what I've
done. I've got this pedagogy backing
me up and because who knows better than a student on their
first place. Yeah, yeah, I thought they're
going to be really impressed with this.
I invented something called horse points.
Not even joking, not even joking.
I didn't even roll, wasn't even really aware of the connection
to house points which is like the really common thing that
schools use. I invented something called.
I will find a picture of this for you didn't buy in because
I've got some somewhere, I invented horse points, I spent
five hours, one evening, cutting out.
These little horses with like people riding them junkies in
card, and I laminated them. Cut them out.
And I made one for each table and then I met And laminated
this really janky big looking table in which all of the horses
started on one side and they all had a name for each of the
tables. And every time, you know, some
of this I go, they might have earned a horse point for that
table and that horse. Got to move one more along the
track again, wasn't it afterwards?
I realize this looked exactly what like, a gambling.
Like, you know, like horses moving along like in a race like
the horse racing like gambling thing.
I just created this little down bullying looking thing.
NG horse points for kids. I was so proud of myself at the
time and I never really understood.
Why the teacher wasn't that Blown Away by it?
Because I thought it was about, it wasn't always like, this is
immense. I spent hours on this is epic.
You stood there that classic they go, you know, when
someone's in a room watching you, it's not evasion or
something and you think you're doing something well, and you
end up looking at the person in the room more than the kids.
All right? He's staring at the guy.
I've got a horse. All right.
Look, Just imagine this point and it took the class who
already used to house points, you know, the widely accepted
thing across the school, probably like, uh, like talking
to the actual teacher Miss and I'm imagine me in the corner,
just watching this lesson. Miss, do I get, do I get a house
point for what? For this one and she has to walk
people, that know, but you you get your horse Point.
Go, hey, go. And put your horse point out.
Make sure you nail on the way out.
Mr. Stevens has come up with. That rule wasn't me for some
reason done' on the way up to put your point up.
I said Gallop Gallop, don't walk get up to the ball.
I might I might bring it back, you know, horse whinnies, don't
find it. It's just that one crafty kid,
just like in it break times taking bets.
Yeah, give you a hug. Give you okay.
Five mil cards of blue. Yeah.
Also, I made it like 10 points. It's like 10 points for a whole
table. They got it in like a day.
So stupid what was what was it was?
Just, I don't, I can't remember. I live in the last one.
I'll bring it. It doesn't string to this bow.
I just felt a good for making this thing.
I don't think I don't think I'd obviously hadn't thought I tell
you what, though Jokes Aside. Right.
It is absolutely lovely. When you get a student in who's,
like, really proactive like that.
That's a net. Good thing.
I know it's funny, Ha-Ha, but getting those people in who are
so genuinely interested. And I don't know about you, I
remember training me to Iowa. That's it in my point, you
remember Trey? I remember training as well, but
at the point, I was sad, you know, in your student teacher
and you kind of sometimes feel a little bit awkward wherever you
are because you're just about place, right?
Yeah. And at the best of times, even
when I work in a school, I just, I'm just awkward.
Yeah, I brought a joke. I'm the awkward guy.
And I just, you know, in the first school I worked at you
worked out with me. I should Sit in the corner and
it wasn't because didn't like anyone.
It's because I just wanted to sit like away from people.
I just anyway, what a lovely depressing picture to paint now?
Yeah, you sound like, come on, no one likes you.
That's why no. What I mean is I just, I'm
slightly awkward as you can tell.
But the but the the main point I'm making your favorite
awkward. Sometimes I remember being sat
in the back of the room and my student teach about the, the
teacher who I was with, who I was training with worse at her
computer and they Had meetings, right?
They'd had meetings going on and I think at the time as well,
something to do with pensions was changing or something to do
with pay something classic teacher mode when you want to
have a bit of a teacher moan and ice at the back with my folder
out, you know, probably pretending to do some work.
So don't feel awkward shade in the corner here.
And oh yeah, I'm just reading the teacher standards for the
15th time in a row because I'm just waiting for break time to
finish. And I walk we don't know what to
do, but they come in what one teacher kind of just burst in.
Obviously in see me at the back and goes to my teacher and it's
just like, honestly spends five minutes ranting about how
teaching is the worst job in the world.
I wish they never got into this job.
I can't believe it, you know, every single year just this is
being cut. That's been cut.
Funny how nothing changes in eight years, isn't it?
But anyway, I had this whole conversation and I remember her
face when she turned and saw me the student teacher at the back,
who's just paying, you know, 10 grand to go to university and
that's a teacher and I'm just like, yeah.
She's like, oh God, I'm so sorry.
It's usually about again. Why should it should have known
about the ancient me? Yeah yeah but no weed but I
thought you said we didn't listen to the experience I
should have walked out that door now what?
Like I'm being dramatic and but it's just funny it's just funny
how things are cyclic cyclic cyclic, ER cyclical sicker?
No no son Deft sick liquor, does it mean like kind of really
skinny? I think so.
Yeah. By the way guys, you can't see
this but Dylan and I are really happy because we're sat here
wearing are under 40. T-shirts.
Again, if you're listening to this in the future you can buy
it from merch store with listen to this now doesn't exist,
probably really? We just want to keep your
calendar. Look at your calendar if it ends
in 27, there's much though. Yeah.
If it doesn't then crack on. So we 31 this up here.
Yeah, go on, then. No, I let's say that this play
little jingle, shall we? All right, I'll do it myself
five. If you asking, boom.
Boom. After training, obviously one of
the most important things is to find an actual job was kind of
kind of worth nothing. Really you gotta find shelter.
I just thought we'd get in huge amounts of debt and not do the
job. Yeah, just do a podcast instead.
Guess we Fair cost money or that customer interaction on the
merch store looking at cast because we want to make that
podcast money. If we ask them, share it with
us. They know if we ask we probably
shouldn't ask them to share the podcast.
That we come across needed, so much so much 1982.
The please share it. Please.
No we won't we won't say that Dylan, that's an example, but we
won't say because it's needy. So we're going to tell them to,
please share it with your friends so they stay, they
listen and write stuff in any way jobs.
So, I had a bit of a rough experience.
I'll be honest with you, you know, walking in with my
portfolio of horse points. Another thing is that invented I
thought I'd walk into a job easily.
Excuse me, horse points and I've talked myself into an elephant.
Give me a job, please? Yeah, hello.
So I I did, I actually fell into quite a classic trap.
I know other teachers have talked about this and it's just
a trap I fell into and I did not listen.
So at the placement school that I was working in, which I had
developed a really nice relationship with, it was also
the school I went to as a child. So I had this lovely
relationship long-standing relationship this with this
school. I had just convinced myself that
I was going to get a job there. There was a job going.
My placement was going fine, you know, I was receiving good
grades. I was like cool.
That's my job then. That interview came up.
Obviously other people went for the job as well, outside of the
school and and I just didn't get it.
I didn't get the job, I didn't. And looking back, I did not put
enough effort in. I gave that into 90%, I think I
gave a lot to the the teaching part because you have put a lot
of time into that element, but the interview I completely
stuffed it up. I did not practice.
I did not, you know, look into what kind of questions I might
be asked. And I remember feeling
embarrassed because I just didn't know the answers to these
questions. Do you have more of the But left
after the interview that you had to get a.
Yeah, I did say even more Awkward because I had to, then
go back in the next day that literal next day.
Knowing, I didn't get the job and carry on doing my placement
working, there for free. What I was paying to work there
to learn so that was really awkward but you get over it.
If it happens to you, if you're listening to this and this
science come out, do you know what is I look back at it?
It's nothing to me now at the time it was horribly
embarrassing but this is I didn't care.
Hey, did we can't all get a job at the school that we worked out
with my trainer. Okay, we can.
All right. The first time, it's the first
time. Well you'll be pleased to know
that I do. I also found my second interview
as well, so you know, cutting weight and I think, you know,
just to is where I attended by 3 because I got my third, one
sure, he needed the Jolly of, it's okay.
I need it. I need it.
I need a job. So I just make it worse right?
In the pgce. We had to do an alternative
placement. So although we did most of our
placements at one school, we did have to go and spend two weeks.
Another school just to get a bit of experience somewhere else.
So Lo behold guess where I interview guess where I applied
for my Job. No, your contrast.
It was, it wasn't. It was the contrasting
placement, the alternative one. I was like, yeah, I was actually
there at the time of that one, as well.
Funny enough, I would just be in there.
Anyway, recently, I think I was, like, a couple of weeks out of
that placement. So, as far as a fresh face, went
to that one. And this is how I completely
mucked up this one. I'm prepared for my interview
this time. I like to talk, honestly, the
worst lesson I've ever taught my career in this in this
interview. It happens, guys, I just The
state did not reflect my teaching ability but I just
taught the worst lesson ever. And it was because I was being
far too adventurous. I recently discovered Singapore,
Mass, which was like the buzzword at the time and I was
like, oh bar modeling which again, was really kind of A New
Concept to a lot of us at the time.
I'm sure other people had experience with it, but it was
brand new for us and it was like, oh this is cool.
I'm going to, I'm going to wow these with this school with this
brand new pedagogy. I didn't really know what I was
doing because by modeling is one of those.
Things where you don't just, you don't just go in and teach a 20
minute lesson. Expect children to know how to
do it. It takes a long time to build up
that skill set with children. I would in there, the kids had
not a foggy assist of what on Earth I was talking about they
you know who else doesn't think anyone who's not a teacher this
thing. So it has to look up.
Look up with my modeling, is, doesn't matter.
Yeah, don't do that, anyway. It just just know this.
I went in there. I taught something that I
absolutely shouldn't have talked to has been waited Venture as it
was terrible lesson and I didn't get the job there, either I was
feeling a bit. After that, I didn't give up the
moral of the story is don't give up the moral of the story here
is if you're Hayden and you want a job, go to Sonny's, never seen
you actually teach four weeks and then don't do it.
The placement schools do it somewhere else.
I'll tell you what though from my point of view having got a
job at a placement school really like I'm kind of just having you
struggled. Massively helped me possibly
happen. Oh yeah.
Conference did it? No, no, not even not necessarily
the confidence but I didn't make you feel like a failure.
Yeah, it didn't make me feel like an abject failure.
Know what? Massively helped me was
everything. I kind of learn by osmosis and
the way they do stuff, I didn't have to go into another school,
not only having the pressure of being a brand new teacher in a
school, not only having the pressure of being a brand, newly
qualified teacher just in my the start of my career but then I
didn't have to learn from scratch the way the school does
stuff but that was that was hugely beneficial and the other
thing. Is heightened.
If you hadn't felt those two interviews, we might not be sad
here today, doing a hard class isn't that love?
Do you feel like, just kind of ignoring that, do you feel like
it's a net like game like positive or negative to get a
job in the only School? You trained in?
Firstly, it's never the only school because as you just said
you do have a contrasting placement.
So you you have always been in at least two schools in your
training, you. I understand what you mean,
because for 80%, at least of that time, Or in one school.
So you mean like in the school? You spent most of your time in,
right? Yeah.
I'm just saying you think it's like overall a good thing or bad
thing to? I think job because it's a
purple. What I'm saying is people might
argue that going to a completely fresh.
School is a subjective, a good thing because then you get to
learn more stuff that a new stuff there, and reflect on your
experience from the other school trained in.
I think it would be really stupid to give a blanket answer
to that, which is such a cop-out, but it's true.
If you had a really good experience.
Like I loved my trading year. I absolutely loved it because
I'm Punch myself into it. I felt like I made good
relationships with, you know, you but like a lot of people, a
lot of people in that school, I felt comfortable there from my
point of view of like, you know, the idea of starting a new
school is quite daunting, in terms of just having to rebuild
like those connections with brand-new people's stuff at the
start of my career. I've been more confident doing
now. I'm sure but like for me
absolutely was the right thing to do and also the thing is, you
know, having the confidence to make that Jump is a big thing.
And what I mean is by making the jump making the jump from your
training Year to nqt in another school, that's actually an
easier jump. I think what you did starting as
an ink UT or a newly qualified teacher ECT, whether it's called
now in a brand new school after training is easier in my
opinion, what's the hardest thing to do is to do your nqt
year, do your ECT year, and then have the guts to move.
Once you've really plowed in and you've become like a property.
John moving school. After two to three years.
That is a that is a big plunge because you're just starting
out, you're still learning, you're inexperienced.
That's just the fact and it can be quite daunting.
I've had a lot of people say to me, I'd like to move.
I'd like to try something else, but I'm going to stay in my
comfort zone and it takes them. A lot of time to build up the
confidence to make that jump. So, I would say if you're having
a really positive experience in your school that you're training
in, go for it states. That let's go.
There's a job. And if they give you a job,
brilliant, if you are having a less good for want of a better
word experience, some people call that - that's the word I'm
deaf. If you have an under the
experience at your school, you need to, in my opinion, look
house where you know, Branch out because then you can have raised
that, you know, be brave early getting somewhere else, learn it
while she still inexperienced because you can get stuck in
schools that is just the truth. Yeah, I think it was a blessing
in disguise that I Get the job in the placements called the
first one I really wanted to is that is that to thing that's
like a personal thing or do you think that extrapolates to do
you disagree with me? That's a good.
Now, I don't know, I think you're probably right in terms
of there isn't really a blanket answer for me personally, it
definitely was a good thing because I think there was
already a hint of complacency in me as you can tell from the
interview process already. I was starting to be a bit like
I you know I've got this job in the bag like know.
It really be woke me up. It may be like I gave 110% that
third interview. I did when I learned from my
first to the mistakes I made. I I gave everything to that to
that interview and that teaching process, like, I gave so much.
And then I, and I really valued the fact I got that job, I don't
know, maybe it, maybe it wouldn't be that different, but
I am glad that I didn't get a job there in the end and it and
I went somewhere else. And I was able to draw on that
experience, which was really different, by the way, to the
actual teaching experience. I then kind of gained at this,
you know, the school, that we both worked at where I work,
where I learned so much stuff about teaching, so much stuff
about teaching. Like, I had a brilliant verse
first. Yeah, I think maybe that the
kind of what will be a nice way to round this off.
Almost talk to you about talking about teacher training.
Maybe we could have a very, very quick just back and forth about
how actually I probably learned most of what I learned in my
first two years of being, an actual teacher.
Yeah, yeah, definitely. I learnt 80%, I'd say faster for
a random number on it. 80% of the, of the, my understanding of
how to teach. Well, came from my ink you to
you, for sure. So, you know, One finishing
their training here and thinking, oh, am I ready?
Honestly, probably not. But no one is no.
One is, no one's ready. Pasta salad, right?
I had that 100% hundreds of fake it till you make, it became the
justification for a lot of stuff.
I remember very quickly on this point of building up confidence,
right? And you know I finally you get
to the point where I'm from your class, you're fine because
they're your children that your first, you always remember your
first class, always will remember those children because
you make such a bond with them and it's such a emotional time
for you. You're given in so much of your
life in yourself. You'll never forget your first
class but I remember the first time this is so ridiculous.
These specific and I do love you Baby.
Have a similar memory and maybe other teachers this thing.
I remember the first time, I felt confident enough to shout
like as in raise my voice over the entire School in assembly.
I remember it because I did it and then I walked off and I was
like I was almost shaking. I was like shaking a bit like
with adrenaline because basically Lee they were very
loud coming out of assembly. I think it was you and I maybe
we'd be what we've been. We've been doing something you
were there, I think. But they're basically.
We were that, was it? We were giving out certificates,
just simple stood there, given a certificate just like, oh, and
this person's one this well done.
And they finished. And they stood up and it was
just really, really loud and like the head walked out or
something. I don't remember but there was
no like, you know, clear SLT leading and I would have been
really rude and really loud and I Rose I spoke up really that
raise my voice. Cut across, and they all went
quiet. And I remember, I'll always
remember kind of look to the side at one of the teachers, one
of the teachers, much more experience kind of just, like,
kind of smirked and give me the nod, like nice.
Like, yeah, the good world. I didn't expect that from you.
Yeah, too bad. You were crying at the time,
right? Dylan.
Before we finish up this podcast, I have prepared
something, you have no idea what this is, but I found a post.
You know what I do? I scroll through forums and all
sorts of things all the time. Looking for interesting.
Stuff. This was a nun Anonymous post
and I've any I thought so interesting.
I have to I have to just read this to you on the podcast and
get your thoughts on it because it really subverts some of the
kind of things we've had on here before.
So you're going to ask me a question or am I just going to
reply to this cold? Well my question I'd no, not
really, not really a question. It's just, I'm going to get your
reaction. I'm going to read you this some
of this panel to summarize it. Okay.
And see what you think. Cool it says, help.
I left teaching and I think I regret it.
I left my last school in a way, not too dissimilar from many of
the stories that we hear lots of shenanigans followed by an exit
agreement, just really bad terms.
You know, things have gone wrong support, plan, all that rubbish.
And now work for a charity it's only been a few weeks but I'm
just not enjoying it. I'm working from home, I'm flexi
time. I've got like an amazing role.
Amazing job, the pay is good. You know, things that people
dream for working from home, flexible time, however,
everything and everyone operates At snail's pace, there was no
hand over for my predecessor. There's lots of chatting about
abstract ideas and very much, very little doing.
The things are getting stuff, done, everything seems really
disorder than slow pace. And some days I just find myself
Source at the laptop kind of bored.
Like, there's not much happening, it's all very slow,
and this person then just goes on to just give a little bit
more detail about how they then. They're then Reminiscing on the
things they actually miss about teaching, which they didn't
consider when they were leaving teaching.
They were just thinking of the negative stuff and they said,
I'm kind of missing the drama. I miss the chaos, I miss how
speedy everything was at school. I missed the structure and the
clear objectives where you can actually see children learn
things. You can see that progress, I
missed the fact that something no matter how big or small would
make me laugh every single day, and that's true.
We've said this before, I miss the in the trenches karate with
some of my amazing colleagues. And I'm a bit better, that I
worked really hard towards building.
There's respected career, and then kind of packed it all in
because of the sort of negative experience I had at school and
they were left it with. I'm almost tempted to go back
into teaching, I'm not sure to to initial thoughts.
Firstly, I am kind of sad kind of always worried about this
sometimes when we talked on this because we get carried away in
the podcast, don't we, you know, classic like get into the rabbit
hole. I'm kind of sad that you store.
Thought, which is true. That that was like, almost the
antithesis of the kind of things we saying this podcast.
That that first, my first thought is our, that is sad
because I completely agree with that.
And what I'm going to say here again.
You know people can write in and tell us if we're being
hypocritical or anything here, but I don't think we are because
you're allowed to moan about something which you love you're
allowed to complain. And if anything even applying
for example, yeah, and I absolutely I can't even just say
that love just, it would just meet can't say that's it.
But I think for me, personally, I get more riled up, more
annoyed, more in search of answers, or wanting to fix
something, the more I care about it.
So when I, when I'm getting in a rut and I'm getting annoyed and
I'm getting frustrated and I why is this happening with teaching?
Why can't they give us a decent pay offer?
Why can't they fund the school's correctly?
Why can't these children get the absolute best that they possibly
can. Why are we not?
Prioritizing the Next Generation.
Why can't we give children free food because their children and
you know, nourishing them is an important step to their
development. Why can't we invest in
education? Why can't we become more
actually as a culture respectful and endearing towards this
profession? Why can't we just value these
professionals still going as they are why I hate it.
You know? I'll do it right now because I
love it and I am a teacher. I will never not be a teacher.
I will never not be. You'll never not be a teacher
because it's kind of a way of you doing stuff.
I love teaching children and seeing progress and helping
other people, right? I cannot imagine for a second
because guess what, I would have done it already, I would have
done it over. I would have quit teaching by
now, I would have done it and you no matter how much you gain
ground down. And the sad thing is, I can see
myself going past that line in the future.
If things don't change, okay, I can see that be Be perfectly
honest. But can you Hayden?
Imagine sitting 925 in an office job.
Not put anything against that, if that's what you do for your
job. You crack on, good on you.
But, but as a teacher, can you imagine transitioning to that?
Not? Not easily.
Because it is so different. And I think that's what that
person has come to the realization of, I think they've
realized that even though it within the chaos You know, there
were actually really great parts of the job and sometimes a lack
of chaos is boring and I think some people do naturally find
that I speak to so many people including teachers, who say to
me, I would honestly love to retire and just go and work in a
shop. And I like that.
So I'm happy with that. They're like that is a dream to
me and I'm like cool. Fair play to you.
I can't think of anything worse. Having worked in a shop.
Now, I don't want to do that anymore.
I found something else. I like doing which is teaching
and it is chaotic. I know I'm used to it, so I
couldn't go back. I this is this is what I do now
is just this chaos of teaching. So yeah, I think I'd find it
really hard and I can I related to that post even though I
haven't quit teaching and, like, being in that same situation.
I felt like I could understand it, I can put myself in the
shoes of You know what, like you I do get really frustrated this
job and I have become really frustrated this year of all
specially with all the politics going around around this job,
and it has made me think about those sorts of things.
I maybe a maybe, I will go past that line and tip over and maybe
I will be the one of those people that quits and in that
huge statistic of people that quit.
But I think I probably be a more like this person.
I reckon, I'd regret it. I really do.
I think I'd get bored. We spoke about it before,
haven't we? In?
Obviously, I know, we will see work full-time for many years.
We went part-time, That seems like a nice kind of Middle
Ground of, I can't imagine I can't just I just can't imagine.
Never having my foot in the classroom.
And I think that's why I really am passionate about fighting in
this political sense of these strikes these funding, because
I'm trying to fight to keep my passion and my love as something
that's worth my while doing and and is good enough to stay in.
As a profession, I want to finish up this little
discussion. Now by talking directly to one
of our - Richie sooner, who we know is one of our listeners,
right? So on behalf of the government,
I'm talking to the government now.
Wait, wait. On behalf of the government, not
on behalf the world. No, no, sorry.
He's on behalf of the government.
Okay, I'm I'm talking to Richie senac.
So, this is a statistic that came out of a very, very recent
study on teachers. And I think it is deeply related
to the story. We just read and the discussion.
We just had About teaching. Here's the stat, a quarter
twenty five percent of teachers and leaders reported, that they
were considering leaving the profession within the next 12
months. That's not surprising.
That's, you know, that's my first of all, not surprising,
but sad, sad, because a lot of those people won't want to leave
the profession. There is a difference.
Isn't there between saying I'm considering leaving this
profession and saying, Want to leave this profession and it is
a lot of people in the camp of considering who don't want to.
That's why I've got such a big turnout for strikes.
That's why we got such a big feeling behind this because
we're trying to save this profession that we love.
No one wants to get out of it, we would rather it be fixed.
I did actually find out in the studying.
I've got it right here. Like why what that what the core
reasons were? They got the top reasons.
I've not seen this. Trying yes them.
I bet I could tell you, I bet I could say that one workload.
One. Okay, as a three three separate,
there's three, three, three things yet workload, workload
one it's off to do workload. Really God while they up to.
So what code is number one ninety two percent of the people
that said that the said they were considering leaving what
and they stated the reason is because of increasing workload
76%. The people said because of
government initiatives or policy changes.
Mmm, and the third most popular. One 69%.
Said, pressures relating to pupil outcomes or inspection or
hostile. Basically should have got that
one. It's so true.
How much how much of the stress that you've experienced in a
school? If you look back is heavily
weighted to when your schools in a window frosted yet,
hilariously. I think all of it I think is
top-down all of it comes. That genuinely all of it.
I think the high workload comes as a result of leaders,
stressing out about ofsted coming in and doing and the
workload increases I really do. I think it's just yeah, it's it.
I don't know, something needs to change in my opinion but we can
talk about that. I think another episode that's
12 discussion, you know, it's happening.
Next week, right? Another strike.
So I'm sure we'll touch on this in the next podcast.
Yeah, let's do it. Will talk about ofsted will talk
about offset next week and those strikes.
Really nice chat there. I did love that.
I do love it when we just get our teeth into something and we
just get carried away, was really really good.
It's such a big part of, you know, my teaching experience was
that training because you know what, it helps me fall in love
with teaching because I realized it's something I really enjoy
doing and it's probably why we're so passionate now, aren't
we about trying to save this profession again?
One last thing before we go, guys, you've got this far and
you haven't already given us a five star review on Spotify or
wherever you, listen it. Is so helpful to us?
I can't tell you how many people.
I've had literally come up to me and say I can't believe how many
reviews you've got as out. Yeah, cuz I don't shut up about
it. I asked everyone who could
possibly listen. It's so helpful and if anyone's
a across the podcast and they see the reviews, they will click
on it. So thank you so much for
everything you've done so far. Follow re all that good stuff
and I want to say we don't say it enough, I guess because we're
being genuine. Thank you so much for listening,
guys. Thank you.
See you next time. See you next week, next time.
See you next week. Bye, guys.
That's right. But