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Why is it essential that women 
learn about finance? 

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If you don't understand the 
mechanics of how to invest, how 

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to smartly save, how to smartly 
spend, it is the ultimate form 

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of repression. 
That's how I feel. 

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Financial literacy in women is 
shockingly low. 

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There's. 
Literally no excuse for not 

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going and doing that education 
piece. 

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Men are syndicating deals 
amongst themselves and we're not

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getting in on the action. 
What? 

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Would be your advice to any mum 
who maybe has taken time out for

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childcare? 
They haven't gone back to work 

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yet, but they've lost their 
confidence. 

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Mum is doing so many things. 
She was the original influencer.

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She knows who the best painter, 
decorator, tradesman is in your 

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area because she's the one 
that's employing them. 

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She also is the matchmaker. 
She knows who's single. 

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She does everything, so of 
course you can run a business 

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too. 
Welcome to Hot Girl Finance, a 

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podcast where we decode the 
crazy, sexy world of money 1 

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concept and business at a time. 
Today's guest understands the 

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power of money and why women 
need financial independence. 

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She helped build one of the 
biggest dating apps and has now 

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built the leading platform for 
connecting mothers. 

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Peanut. 
I'm speaking to Michelle 

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Kennedy. 
She understands better than 

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anyone the challenges facing 
mothers today. 

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She made the daring jump to 
leave the corporate world and 

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take the risk of start up life. 
She turned her idea into a multi

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$1,000,000 venture and today she
shares her insights. 

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And Michelle, I cannot tell you 
what a joy it is to have you on 

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Hot Girl Finance. 
Thank you so much for having me 

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to. 
Start with our favorite topic 

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being Money. 
What was your first relationship

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with Money? 
My dad is an electrician and so 

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I always remember him having 
cash, a lot of cash in hand kind

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of work and he would have little
roles that he would peel off 

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notes. 
And so my first impression of 

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money was you want to have the 
role of the notes. 

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And my second was, how do I get 
to be the person who holds the 

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role? 
Because it wasn't my mom, it was

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my dad who had the role of the 
notes. 

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And that wasn't say, my mom 
didn't work. 

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She worked really hard too. 
But it was he who had that cash 

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moment. 
And I suppose from there you 

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kind of become a bit obsessed 
with the notion of cash, which 

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is really strange now because 
I'd certainly my kids don't have

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it, but that was my first real 
like awareness of what money is 

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and feels like and looks like. 
And did it feel abundant or did 

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it feel, Oh no, this is hard to 
come by? 

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Yeah, it was never abundant. 
It was like it was hard fought. 

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There were times actually when 
my dad was out of work, like 

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there was big recession, 
building projects weren't 

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happening, and my dad was doing 
like the odd private job. 

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And there were times when it was
really hard, but it didn't feel 

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like you couldn't earn it. 
I can't explain that. 

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It was hard fought, but there 
was always a way to earn it. 

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And how do you now see that 
first impression has influenced 

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how you work with money now or 
potentially how you started to 

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understand and work with money 
from the moment you could get a 

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job? 
So I had a job from 15. 

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So I worked in a department 
store on a Thursday, after 

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school on a Saturday all day. 
And then at 17, I went to work 

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with money. 
I went to work in a bank behind 

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the counter on Saturday, so it 
was really important for me to 

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have my own money. 
And I knew I wanted that. 

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And I knew that I wanted to have
that feeling of like 

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independence and choice and I 
could buy something if I wanted 

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it. 
Because so often the answer was 

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couldn't have it. 
How does it influence me now? 

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A work ethic? 
Like I just know that you have 

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to work hard to make money. 
So I just work. 

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And I suppose it's that like I 
saw it and so I do it. 

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So you were the OG in dating 
app. 

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Some people tell me who 
basically created dating apps. 

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I will always say you and and 
obviously I think less people 

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know that because you know, they
know what your story of being a 

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lawyer. 
They obviously know that you 

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worked at Badu and then went on 
to build this humongous network 

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for women, but you were so OG in
the dating app game. 

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What did that experience teach 
you being so early on into an 

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industry and also working for 
that sort of corporation, like a

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very fast growing tech company? 
Yeah, I do. 

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You know what? 
I just loved it. 

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I still love it. 
I still get a buzz when I hear 

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something about dating and 
dating apps I'm still so 

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interested in grained in it. 
I really loved the whole notion 

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of learning that we can monetize
this thing that wasn't really a 

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physical products. 
That was amazing for me. 

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Like when I first joined Badoo 
the the thought of monetizing a 

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website was like. 
And just for people that don't 

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understand what Badou is, who 
was Badou and how did you even 

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find them to begin with? 
Yeah, So Badou was is an 

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enormous kind of European 
focused dating platform. 

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Think of the era of Plenty of 
Fish, match.com, eHarmony. 

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That was the arena, that was the
competitive landscape. 

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And so Badou was a slightly 
younger, skewing, more fun 

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platform where basically you 
would go online and you could 

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make connections, as we used to 
call it casual encounters. 

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So you can make connections. 
And there were games in it, so 

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you could see who looks at your 
profile, you could see who was 

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rating you in a certain way. 
Like it was, it was just lots 

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and lots of complicated 
gamification. 

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So you never left? 
And the founder was a guy called

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Andre Andreeve who had founded, 
I think this was his third 

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business. 
So he'd been a serial 

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entrepreneur, very successful. 
And Badoo started in Spain, and 

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when I met him there were 
52,000,000 users of this website

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I'd never heard of before. 
Wow. 

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Unbelievable what an incredible 
like what was the revenue tuned 

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to We firstly, we were 
profitable unheard of. 

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Most tech companies weren't even
making money, let alone being 

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profitable. 
It was just sub 100 and 100 

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million Yeah A. 100 million 
revenue and we're in 2011. 

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Exactly ten, 2011 and growing. 
Just this team of unbelievable 

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people who were just obsessed 
with and making it sticky, 

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making it fun, making it 
engaging, getting it into 

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different countries, localizing,
translation, all these different

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things and it was just so 
amazing. 

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It was fast-paced. 
He was very difficult to work 

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for. 
I think he will admit that. 

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How demanding. 
I was always on 2:00 AM, I'm on 

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like you're on. 
But he's a genius. 

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I do think that. 
And I think that, but for him, I

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wouldn't be here sitting talking
to you. 

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He changed my life in a way of 
thinking about products, 

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thinking about building, 
thinking about opportunity, 

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think about money. 
Actually, he said the first 

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thing to me when I worked for 
him was you spend my money like 

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it's your own. 
Wow. 

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Or you don't spend that money. 
You find the cheapest, you find 

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the most cost efficient, you 
find opportunities, you find any

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efficiency you can. 
And that's not to say he wasn't 

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extravagant. 
He is an extravagant person. 

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But in the right setting and in 
the right moment. 

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Always at the high, always at 
the top of up and to the right. 

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That is absolutely fascinating. 
I think it's for a lot of 

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entrepreneurs and founders. 
They may start their company so 

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young and actually they miss 
this learning ground where you 

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can learn from it. 
He sounds like a kind of a 

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brilliant genius in many ways. 
And how did you notice people 

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change when he was around? 
Was it that that it was just 

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more focused or the day isn't 
ended until you've completed a 

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task? 
Or kind of what leadership 

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skills were good and which ones 
actually wouldn't fly in this 

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time because I guess culture 
changed so much. 

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I mean, plenty of things that 
wouldn't fly. 

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Now, Andre, he never shouts. 
He's not a throw your weight 

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around kind of, in fact, very 
often you could be working and 

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he'd be at your shoulder and you
didn't know he was there. 

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Very unnerving, right? 
And you'd be like, hi, so very 

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kind of silently watching, 
observing. 

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He also made and pushed me to do
things that I just frankly 

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didn't want to do. 
And I was like, I've been to law

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school. 
I don't want to go out and hawk 

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your idea of naming Wi-Fi Badoo 
or whatever it might be. 

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And he was like, that's the task
today, so off you go. 

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And so from then there was 
nothing I couldn't do because I 

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kind of already had to do it. 
He broke down a lot of things, 

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so I never felt like I was too 
good to do anything. 

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I would do everything. 
And then gave you the 

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opportunity to be involved in so
much. 

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Interesting because this I feel 
was vital the beginning before 

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peanut started. 
So when you when did peanut and 

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the idea of a peanut start when 
you were in this kind of 

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training ground as such, and how
do you feel at your time at 

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Purdue influenced Peanut I. 
Loved what we were doing at 

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Purdue. 
It was new everyday. 

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It was exciting, it was fun, but
you're also not getting 

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opportunities other companies 
are thinking of because maybe 

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our brand that wasn't as strong 
or people didn't resonate with 

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the brand in the same way. 
So then you're thinking about 

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opportunities. 
What's the next story we have to

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tell? 
What's the next thing we can do?

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The opportunity to be in that 
environment. 

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It was very fast-paced. 
Also at the time, we have three 

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meals a day in the office, so 
there was food there all the 

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time. 
You really truly never had to 

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leave. 
There was everything, right? 

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Everyone becomes your friend, 
your drinks there on a Friday 

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night like it's your life and it
really does become your life. 

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On weekends I'm spending them 
with Andre and his, you know, 

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friends at his house. 
And so it is quite all 

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consuming. 
And I got pregnant and life 

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started to become a bit 
different. 

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And then I had Finn and I went 
back to work really quickly 

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after Finn and how quickly? 
Four months and which is quickly

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for the UK and probably 
luxurious for the US, 

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truthfully. 
But I went back after four 

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months and everything was 
different and we started working

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on something else and that 
something else became Bumble. 

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So that was an opportunity to 
start building something new all

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over again. 
That was exciting. 

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What a buzz. 
Now we're building something new

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and we've got new people in and 
we're like dreaming about what 

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this is going to be and the 
narrative and all these other 

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areas. 
And yet at night I'm going home 

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and searching my baby won't 
sleep and reading like Quora 

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answers from you know? 
To read it, yeah. 

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Right, and I was like, this is 
crazy because my life is is at 

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work so exciting and my personal
life is like I'm doing something

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that I think I wouldn't do for 
my skin care. 

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So why am I doing it about my 
baby? 

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But I don't know where else to 
get that kind of connectivity. 

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And my girlfriend's didn't have 
babies and, and so it was quite 

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isolating. 
So I had the idea of building 

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something better. 
But honestly, life's busy. 

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I was busy. 
Work was great. 

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I loved it and I didn't do 
anything with it. 

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I just sat on it for ages. 
And then it got to Finn was like

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2 1/2 and I was like, I've just 
got, it's not going anywhere. 

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Actually just need to speak to 
other women like me more, not 

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less. 
And it was that year that I was 

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like, I'm going to go and build 
something for myself. 

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And that was the scariest thing 
I think I've ever done. 

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Who gave you that confidence to 
leave a lovely paid job that had

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maternity leave, that, you know,
had all these, that had all 

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these benefits to suddenly go 
work for yourself, which to be 

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honest, you have no maternity 
leave because you work for 

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yourself, because you're in 
time, especially in this 

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refundable time of, you know, 
women's life where you're 

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juggling lots of plates. 
So part of it truly was naivety 

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because the other thing that 
people don't really talk about 

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that entrepreneurship is when 
you're working as someone in a, 

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in a bigger company, a bigger 
organization, you have status 

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and status actually is really 
important. 

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Status opens doors, it opens 
networks, it opens events, it 

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00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:58,480
opens opportunities that all of 
a sudden when you're a one man 

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band that doesn't really exist, 
you have to go at it to make 

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that happen again. 
And you cannot underestimate how

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00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:10,560
hard that is because when you're
coming from someone else's 

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business, there's like a little 
army behind you. 

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And ultimately, even if 
everything went wrong and you're

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00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:20,400
never going to let it go wrong, 
but it's like, but it's, it's 

234
00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:22,720
still a business that I work 
for. 

235
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Well, it's your thing and your 
business. 

236
00:13:26,120 --> 00:13:29,840
It's so naked because it's just 
you. 

237
00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:32,400
You don't have a little army. 
The army is you. 

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And you don't have all the perks
and the benefits and you don't 

239
00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:37,840
have the same status. 
You have to rebuild a different 

240
00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:40,560
type of status. 
So the confidence came from 

241
00:13:40,560 --> 00:13:44,520
naivety because I didn't 
appreciate any of that and I 

242
00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:47,040
felt that I wasn't going to be 
able to do the next thing that I

243
00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,600
really wanted to do at the do at
that point. 

244
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And I suppose I got a taste for 
it. 

245
00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:54,800
I saw what we were doing at 
Bumble. 

246
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I was like, yeah, I think I can 
do that. 

247
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And I didn't realise that that 
was totally different, not the 

248
00:13:59,920 --> 00:14:02,800
same thing at all as going out 
on your own and being like, so 

249
00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:05,920
now I need to hire engineers and
I've got restrictive covenants 

250
00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:09,080
which mean I can't or. 
So I've got to build a new 

251
00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:12,080
network and now I've got to 
raise money from venture 

252
00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:14,680
capital. 
OK, don't really know those 

253
00:14:14,680 --> 00:14:16,360
guys. 
When you worked with PE, better 

254
00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:21,200
do some homework on that. 
And it was just blind naivety, 

255
00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:23,160
which maybe was a good thing 
because maybe if I'd over 

256
00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:24,280
analysed I wouldn't have done 
it. 

257
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:28,560
So you've built your deck, 
you've built this idea for 

258
00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:32,320
Peanut, which is supporting 
women, connecting women, and you

259
00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:36,880
go out to raise for the first 
time in this process. 

260
00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:39,680
What do you think are the 
mistakes you made in it, and 

261
00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:41,880
what were your greatest 
learnings in it? 

262
00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:46,720
And then what actually happened?
The first mistake is I took the 

263
00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:49,120
first introduction that I got 
was a call. 

264
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,240
I had the call and I got a term 
sheet after a call. 

265
00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:54,560
I had no deck. 
Which is so unheard of. 

266
00:14:54,680 --> 00:14:56,920
Ridiculous. 
And a term sheet for anyone 

267
00:14:56,920 --> 00:14:59,640
who's listening is is. 
Basically, the terms on which 

268
00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:01,200
someone's going to invest in 
your company. 

269
00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:04,080
So the amount they're going to 
give you, which means how much 

270
00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:07,720
your company is going to be 
worth, how much of the company 

271
00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:11,720
percentage they're going to take
and other things that they 

272
00:15:11,720 --> 00:15:13,440
expect. 
Is there going to be a service 

273
00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:15,320
agreement? 
What else is going to be in 

274
00:15:15,320 --> 00:15:17,120
place for this investment to 
happen? 

275
00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:22,440
And So what usually happens is 
they will say your company is 

276
00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:28,640
going to be worth X, we're going
to take Y and of $1,000,000 

277
00:15:28,640 --> 00:15:32,440
round, we will give you half, 
for example, which means you've 

278
00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,800
got to go and raise the other 
half from other investors on 

279
00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:39,800
those terms, not on new terms. 
These guys set the terms. 

280
00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:44,360
Well, that happened to me and I 
was like, maybe I'm really good 

281
00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:46,080
at this. 
It's amazing. 

282
00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:49,440
I had that call with him and 
then I had a call with his 

283
00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:52,400
partners after that. 
Got the term sheet. 

284
00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:56,600
It was a beautiful term sheet. 
It was very vanilla, like 

285
00:15:56,760 --> 00:16:00,800
really, very simple. 
And I was like, wow, I didn't 

286
00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:03,400
even really know what I was 
looking at, to be honest. 

287
00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:06,480
I called someone who I knew who 
had worked in VC and I was like,

288
00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:09,240
can I send you something? 
And VC venture capital. 

289
00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:13,320
So someone who was doing those 
early stage deals called him and

290
00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:15,120
said can I send you something? 
We have a look at it. 

291
00:16:15,400 --> 00:16:20,240
He looked at it and said great 
fund, good terms, valuation is 

292
00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:22,960
low, but don't worry about it, 
you haven't got anything yet. 

293
00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:27,800
Go and raise the rest. 
And then it started and I was 

294
00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:30,600
like, right, so that was an 
anomaly. 

295
00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:34,720
That's not how it actually is. 
It turns out it's really hard to

296
00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:37,600
raise money. 
It's really hard to raise in the

297
00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:41,240
UK or Europe. 
When I had a term sheet from AUS

298
00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:44,760
Fund, they didn't like the 
valuation. 

299
00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:49,480
They didn't like how little 
their perception was that they 

300
00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:52,360
would get for taking an 
investment risk on something 

301
00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:55,960
which had no product. 
And it took me another six 

302
00:16:55,960 --> 00:16:59,160
months from that to raise the 
rest of the round. 

303
00:16:59,960 --> 00:17:02,560
And I never, ever knew that 
that's what would happen. 

304
00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:07,680
So I had to start building this 
product off my own capital with 

305
00:17:07,680 --> 00:17:11,280
my own money that I'd saved to 
do it, because I hadn't raised 

306
00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:15,760
enough at that point. 
Wow, how did you get your first 

307
00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:19,280
10,000 users? 
Two things happened when we were

308
00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:22,319
building Peanut. 
I would ask every woman who I 

309
00:17:22,319 --> 00:17:24,480
spoke to to introduce me to 
another woman. 

310
00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:28,079
So by the time I was ready to 
go, I had a kind of 200 women 

311
00:17:28,079 --> 00:17:32,320
that I've spoken to who I could 
e-mail and say it's ready, can 

312
00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:35,320
you go and have a look? 
So I knew I'd have 200 women to 

313
00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:37,560
download this app. 
And that's kind of what I 

314
00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:39,880
thought I needed, like just get 
that going. 

315
00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:43,400
But at the same time, one of the
very important things that I had

316
00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:46,480
learned along the way was how 
important storytelling is and 

317
00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:51,160
how important a story that 
people resonate with is. 

318
00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:54,680
And so I done a really big 
investment in press. 

319
00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:57,560
I had spoken to so many 
journalists to say this is what 

320
00:17:57,560 --> 00:17:59,000
I'm building, This is why it 
matters. 

321
00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:02,800
No one wanted to touch it. 
They were like, yeah, Mom's not 

322
00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:07,120
sure, don't know. 
And 1 journalist at the Evening 

323
00:18:07,120 --> 00:18:11,080
Standard was like, oh, that's 
cool dating. 

324
00:18:11,080 --> 00:18:12,760
And now Mom's, yeah, I kind of 
get it. 

325
00:18:13,360 --> 00:18:17,200
And she covered the story. 
And from that moment my 200 

326
00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:22,440
women went to 2000 women went to
5000 women went to 20,000 women 

327
00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:26,400
within like 36 hours. 
Wow. 

328
00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:29,440
And it was a. 
Press viral moment where I was 

329
00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:34,080
like, see people actually are 
interested in mums, but that was

330
00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:39,480
the moment I'd gone for that 200
seeding people who care and it 

331
00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:43,320
got like a bigger. 
Awareness because it's, it's 

332
00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:47,160
interesting. 
We, I was interviewing Georgie 

333
00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:50,960
Huddat, the founder of Panzagi, 
and she was also saying how she 

334
00:18:50,960 --> 00:18:53,640
just launched an Instagram 
account and started selling 

335
00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:55,240
these incredible swimsuits. 
Yeah. 

336
00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:58,080
And it is interesting. 
Like you said, would those 

337
00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:01,760
strategies still be replicated 
now if you were going to start 

338
00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:07,200
Peanut today, how do you think 
you'd build your first 10,000 

339
00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:10,120
people? 
But do you still think press has

340
00:19:10,120 --> 00:19:12,280
that ability? 
Or even when you look at growth 

341
00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:16,120
now, does press still play that 
lever? 

342
00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:19,360
It's so interesting and I think 
press is different now and I 

343
00:19:19,360 --> 00:19:23,040
think you have to think about 
what we consume now. 

344
00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:28,200
So we consume TikTok, for 
example, like we are consuming 

345
00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:32,680
television, it is broadcast and 
you are sitting there and you 

346
00:19:32,680 --> 00:19:36,120
are consuming little snippets. 
So I think I would think about 

347
00:19:36,120 --> 00:19:40,720
storytelling in that framework 
and how I could do that kind of 

348
00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:43,480
storytelling. 
So how, where are people getting

349
00:19:43,480 --> 00:19:46,400
stories from now and how can I 
be on that medium would be what 

350
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:48,480
I would do. 
And whether that's Peanut or 

351
00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:51,480
another product, it's always 
about where is the eyeball in 

352
00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:54,760
the audience I want to reach. 
And at the time 2017, when we 

353
00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:57,600
launched Peanut, they were 
reading press. 

354
00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:00,240
They were reading, I don't know,
male or Lite. 

355
00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:02,520
They were reading those things. 
That's where they were. 

356
00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:06,600
So you have raised a lot of 
money since that first million. 

357
00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:10,080
What do you look back? 
What do you feel you overspent 

358
00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:14,920
on or under invested in? 
I would say the following things

359
00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:18,160
raise more money than you think 
you're going to need because 

360
00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:23,320
it's going to be more expensive 
than you think and spend in a 

361
00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:26,600
more miserly fashion than you 
think is appropriate because 

362
00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:28,680
you're going to need that money 
and it's always going to cost 

363
00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:29,960
more than you think it's going 
to cost. 

364
00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:35,400
So don't be, you know, excited 
and overspending every classic 

365
00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:37,360
mistake you can think of. 
I've done it all. 

366
00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:41,720
I've hired the execs that have 
worked at Twitter and Google 

367
00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:43,920
because that's what everyone 
said would be the right move. 

368
00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:46,720
So I've fallen in love with the 
CV rather than the hands on 

369
00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:50,240
ability. 
I have invested and over 

370
00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:53,920
invested and been over reliant 
on performance marketing. 

371
00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:57,640
I fed that machine in a way that
you know, now when I think about

372
00:20:57,640 --> 00:20:59,320
it, I'm like, can't believe how 
much I. 

373
00:20:59,360 --> 00:21:02,360
Invested there when you say that
just you know, for people that 

374
00:21:02,360 --> 00:21:04,520
don't understand what 
performance marketing is 

375
00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:07,960
essentially you're feeding 
Facebook. 30% of all money 

376
00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:11,280
raises going back into crazy, 
right? 

377
00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:13,440
So we've all done that. 
I've done that. 

378
00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:17,080
I've kept team members who 
weren't good enough for longer 

379
00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:20,840
than I should have done because 
of misplaced loyalty and or 

380
00:21:21,120 --> 00:21:25,000
gratitude for the time that they
were there and or not being able

381
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:26,960
to face dealing with the issue 
afterwards. 

382
00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:31,560
I built parts of the product 
which were a fad because I 

383
00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:33,440
thought it was the right fad to 
follow. 

384
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:36,840
Everything you can think of have
made all of those mistakes and 

385
00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:42,960
the one thing that I wish I 
could redo is raising more money

386
00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:47,880
earlier and spending it in a far
more conservative way. 

387
00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:50,840
And then the second big thing, 
which I think actually is not 

388
00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:54,960
the market these days, I think 
it was very specific to 2017. 

389
00:21:55,680 --> 00:22:02,880
I ran Peanut for a very long 
time with no revenue 00 because 

390
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:06,040
the trend was tech companies 
don't need revenue, they just 

391
00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:09,360
need growth. 
So that's what I did. 

392
00:22:09,360 --> 00:22:12,120
And that was weird. 
And it was against the Andre 

393
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,520
Badou school of thought, by the 
way, because that wasn't the 

394
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,080
business I ran and I worked with
him on. 

395
00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:25,000
But that was the tech trend and 
it we turned on revenue much 

396
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:29,040
later than I should have done 
and the business would be 

397
00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:33,240
further along truthfully now had
I not have done that and had I 

398
00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,400
have run the business that I 
knew how to run from the start. 

399
00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:38,320
That is such an interesting 
point. 

400
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:42,040
And I have made that mistake 
myself multiple times. 

401
00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:45,000
And it really upsets me because 
even more recently than I care 

402
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:49,360
to admit, right? 
And it's so hard because I think

403
00:22:49,360 --> 00:22:53,680
that this is where I don't know 
whether this is a huge 

404
00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,640
generalization in terms of women
and men. 

405
00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:02,240
And I do think the trend too, 
but this idea that we should 

406
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:06,280
give so much free because, you 
know, we want to support a 

407
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:11,120
community, but actually we have 
kind of misinterpreted free. 

408
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,960
And if someone likes a product 
then they should be paid for it 

409
00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:19,400
because it's really expensive to
build and no company can run on.

410
00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:23,760
Teams, There is a difference 
between having a social 

411
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,920
conscience. 
We both have a social 

412
00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:31,080
conscience. 
I care passionately and deeply 

413
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:35,400
about Peanut, the work we do, 
the opportunities it creates for

414
00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:38,120
women, that women need a 
platform to connect, they need 

415
00:23:38,120 --> 00:23:40,080
safe spaces. 
Mums need to be heard. 

416
00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:44,520
I care about that so much. 
But it is not a charitable 

417
00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:49,960
foundation and even charities 
raise money and that's the 

418
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,800
truth. 
So there is a cost to having my 

419
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:56,200
incredible team. 
There is a cost to the product 

420
00:23:56,200 --> 00:24:00,240
looking as it does the 
functionality, the servers, all 

421
00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:03,120
of that has a cost. 
And that doesn't mean giving it 

422
00:24:03,120 --> 00:24:05,080
away for free. 
And I think that we did 

423
00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:08,640
misunderstand something to do 
with that social conscience, but

424
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:13,080
we also really lent into this 
trend of tech companies always 

425
00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,720
sort it out. 
And when the tide changes and 

426
00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:20,440
all of a sudden it's time for 
that company not just to make 

427
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:22,600
revenue, by the way, to be 
profitable. 

428
00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:27,200
The pressure is extraordinary, 
100%. 

429
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:28,880
If you do have a social 
conscience, I think you're 

430
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:33,280
battling against this totally. 
And actually, the more people 

431
00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:37,920
I've met recently who have tiny 
apps, but they just turned on 

432
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,480
monetization from day one, but 
they're so they're not stressed.

433
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:45,960
I think to myself, all these, 
you know, all these, you include

434
00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:49,680
it, you've built these 
incredibly huge social missions 

435
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,000
and put yourself under so much 
stress in order to serve your 

436
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:54,920
customer so much. 
That's it. 

437
00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:57,080
We care so much. 
I care so much. 

438
00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:02,200
And I I deeply, deeply care 
about what the result of what we

439
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:05,200
do is like. 
But for Peanut, what do those 

440
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:06,600
women do? 
Where do they go? 

441
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,440
How do they find support? 
How wait, all of those things 

442
00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:12,280
care. 
It's what makes me get up every 

443
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:16,480
day. 
But equally there that has 

444
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:19,440
value. 
And in order for us to value 

445
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:23,400
ourselves and the work we do, we
have to be able to monetize 

446
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:25,240
that. 
And what I think I should have 

447
00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:27,920
said at that point, and I wish 
pretty much daily I'd have said 

448
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,400
is actually, I know how I'm 
going to monetize. 

449
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:32,200
So I'm going to do it now 
because I always knew. 

450
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:34,760
So there was, it wasn't 
something that I needed to 

451
00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:36,600
figure out. 
I always had the answer. 

452
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:41,280
So that's hard so. 
What would you say in the three 

453
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:45,600
moments that changed Peanut? 
I guess 1 is that Evening 

454
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,080
Standard article that suddenly 
got your first 10,000 and then 

455
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:52,440
the last, you know, I guess you 
know, since you've been running 

456
00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:56,640
Peanut, what would you say the 
other two moments that happened 

457
00:25:56,920 --> 00:26:00,520
that changed the game in some, 
in some way, shape or form? 

458
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,360
So the second one was also 
pretty early on. 

459
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:10,920
It was like 6 months into Peanut
and Apple featured us at WWDC, 

460
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,440
which is like the big worldwide 
Developer Conference. 

461
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:19,640
And Tim Cook was on stage with a
little bobbing head of me 

462
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,560
because the App Store just 
changed and it was now going to 

463
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:27,360
be a Meet the Developer series. 
And that for me was it's 

464
00:26:27,360 --> 00:26:29,840
incredible for the team because 
we built a product that Apple 

465
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:32,640
recognised. 
It's not like I had millions of 

466
00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:35,400
users, I had 10s of thousands of
users. 

467
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:37,840
But they saw the work and they 
recognised it. 

468
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:42,440
And I have to say, when you get 
validation from a partner like 

469
00:26:42,440 --> 00:26:47,040
an Apple, it is an extraordinary
feeling because you're like, 

470
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:51,240
wow, they know what I do. 
They know us based in that 

471
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:55,600
little office down there and 
that was quite game changing in 

472
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:58,280
many ways. 
Actually I think it got me my 

473
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:04,280
term sheet for my next round 
based on inbound engagement. 

474
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,240
I think it really validated the 
team to make them really 

475
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:12,160
energizing and go harder and it 
meant, OK, we're off. 

476
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:15,560
It wasn't just proof of concept 
anymore like we're going. 

477
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,000
So I think that was really 
important. 

478
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:25,200
And then the third really like 
game changing was ATV show, 

479
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:28,640
which is called Sex Life on 
Netflix. 

480
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:33,440
And there was a woman who was 
interviewing for a role. 

481
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:36,400
The woman is talking about being
on Facebook and the woman who's 

482
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,480
interviewing her is like, oh, 
you're hilarious. 

483
00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:43,440
You remind me of my mum. 
Have you heard of Peanut and my 

484
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:46,160
like? 
Everything on my like Instagram,

485
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:48,040
my WhatsApp was popping off. 
Everyone was like. 

486
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:51,040
Oh my God, they're referencing. 
Peanut on sex life. 

487
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:53,360
I was like, what's sex life? 
Like I didn't even know what it 

488
00:27:53,360 --> 00:27:55,960
was. 
Everyone's messaging me and I 

489
00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:58,760
get the clip and I was like, we 
did it. 

490
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:03,960
Because I remember when one of 
the absolute targets for the 

491
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:07,360
Bumble days was we want Bumble 
to be dropped into everyday. 

492
00:28:07,360 --> 00:28:09,680
Like I want to see it on ATV 
show. 

493
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:13,800
I want to see it in a movie. 
And when it happened to Peanut, 

494
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,760
I was like, we've done it, we've
got the thing, we got the name 

495
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,560
check on the Netflix show. 
I didn't know about it, They 

496
00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:22,680
didn't ask me. 
It's not like I pitched for it. 

497
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:26,440
It just happened as that must be
a reference to like a cool mum 

498
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:30,120
thing. 
And that for me was like, we did

499
00:28:30,120 --> 00:28:32,640
it. 
What an amazing, amazing moment,

500
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:35,680
especially for that to be 
organic and amazing. 

501
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:37,520
Such validation for all your 
work. 

502
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,720
You've created a cultural 
movement of mothers being 

503
00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:45,000
recognized, and this brings me 
nicely into the real work of 

504
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:49,760
Peanut, which is you have 
supported women and mothers in a

505
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:55,240
time where they are mostly 
ignored and and experiencing new

506
00:28:55,240 --> 00:29:00,440
problems for the first time. 
Having met all these women that 

507
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,920
you have looked after for all 
these years, what has surprised 

508
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,560
you most about what they've 
said, and why does it keep you 

509
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:10,280
focused on this mission like 
it's not complete yet? 

510
00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:13,520
Some things have happened since 
2017 when we launched, which 

511
00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:17,680
have been incredibly positive. 
We now talk about fertility, we 

512
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:20,440
now talk about people's 
journeys, we talk about baby 

513
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,840
loss, we talk about 
endometriosis, PCOS. 

514
00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:29,640
There has been a change in what 
we now consider to be an 

515
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:33,800
acceptable conversation, and 
that didn't exist in 2017. 

516
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:36,080
I could barely get people to 
talk about motherhood, let alone

517
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:39,160
anything that in the lead up to 
or as part of. 

518
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:42,080
So that has been immensely 
positive. 

519
00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:46,400
And yet we are not supporting 
mothers in the way that they 

520
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,240
need to be supported and yet our
expectation of them is higher 

521
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:52,600
than ever before. 
So I remember very clearly 

522
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:57,200
diligently reading, leaning and 
I was leaning in so hard. 

523
00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:00,560
I was like, there's no, I'm not 
getting any help. 

524
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:02,400
But there is nothing here for 
me. 

525
00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:06,640
Childcare doesn't work, it's too
expensive, I can't afford it. 

526
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:09,400
I can't do what I need to do. 
Had to call my mum. 

527
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:12,480
My mum had to live with us 
Monday to Thursday and I would 

528
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:15,160
have Finn on a Friday. 
That's amazing that I had that 

529
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:16,960
opportunity. 
What about people who don't? 

530
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:19,680
What do you do? 
You don't have your mom who can 

531
00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:21,760
come and like dedicate her life 
to that. 

532
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:26,840
Childcare doesn't work. 
And yet societally, I was told 

533
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:30,520
lean in and you can have it all.
You can have the career. 

534
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:33,120
You can be at the top of your 
game. 

535
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:36,280
So I did all of the things to 
sacrifice to get to that. 

536
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:39,000
And then the sacrifice became 
even greater because it was 

537
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:40,800
like, do I work or do I have my 
baby? 

538
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:42,720
Or do I do both? 
And how do I do both? 

539
00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:46,080
And so that has not changed 
probably. 

540
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:49,880
And that is still a conversation
happening every single day on 

541
00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:54,320
Peanut. 
And that to me is so challenging

542
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:56,720
because it's happening in the 
US, it's happening in the UK, 

543
00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:59,480
it's happening in Australia. 
We do not have the solution for 

544
00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:06,360
how to marry up, the impact of 
expectations of women 

545
00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:11,080
contributing economically and 
the fact that we have to raise 

546
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:13,960
children too. 
I think from my research, it's 

547
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:17,080
maybe cited the number one 
reasons people don't want kids 

548
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:20,080
is because of the financial 
burden they bring. 

549
00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:29,200
And do you feel that it is just,
it's just so expensive or do you

550
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:33,920
think any part of it is we now 
also want to give our children a

551
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,920
better life that we that the 
fear of potentially not giving 

552
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:42,120
them a better life actually is 
the fear of it and, and means we

553
00:31:42,120 --> 00:31:44,120
don't want to have kids. 
What an amazing question. 

554
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,040
Are we self selecting because we
think that actually we can't 

555
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:49,120
deliver more than we would like 
to? 

556
00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:54,480
Maybe maybe also part of that is
maybe we can't even deliver what

557
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,440
we had right. 
There's another element to it. 

558
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:00,320
It's not even I can't give you 
better, maybe I can't give you 

559
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:04,320
the equivalent. 
And there is a value that we 

560
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:10,120
have placed as a society on 
certain status, which is not to 

561
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:14,880
do with happiness and health. 
And actually, if you think back 

562
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:19,040
to generations before us, what 
was valued actually was happy, 

563
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:21,520
healthy kids. 
Well, that the rest will figure 

564
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:24,680
itself out. 
But now we're in a situation 

565
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:28,600
where school is childcare. 
So you've got a massive gap 

566
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:31,520
between having the child and 
getting them into schooling 

567
00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:33,440
where you can have that 
childcare solution. 

568
00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:36,520
School actually not being 
childcare because school is 

569
00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:40,640
about education and learning but
needing this wrap around care. 

570
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,920
So you have breakfast clubs and 
you have two time clubs so that 

571
00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:48,280
parents can work and where and 
the impact of that on health and

572
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:51,880
happiness of child and parent is
extraordinary. 

573
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,680
So I do think that people do 
have an element of fear and self

574
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:59,480
selection and yet motherhood is 
wonderful and joyous and we 

575
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:03,160
don't talk about that part. 
So I think that there is so much

576
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:05,960
that we could be doing to 
support and acknowledge 

577
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:10,720
childcare and child rearing that
would mean that women feel 

578
00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:13,840
confident going into it, that I 
can do this and I'm going to be 

579
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:16,720
supported. 
What can we do? 

580
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:19,080
I don't have children yet. 
What can we have? 

581
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:21,520
People who are listening may 
have children, but what do you 

582
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:24,560
think from your perspective we 
can do on a personal finance 

583
00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:29,160
level that could potentially 
release some of this burden, and

584
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:31,560
I know a lot of it, the 
responsibility lies in 

585
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:36,160
government and policy, but from 
a personal perspective, what are

586
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,160
your thoughts I. 
Find it hard because we already 

587
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:43,560
carry a lot, we're already doing
a lot, We carry a lot of 

588
00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,080
responsibility. 
We already have pressure around 

589
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:48,600
home ownership. 
That pressure, by the way, is 

590
00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:50,720
not the same in European 
countries. 

591
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:54,040
The obsession that we have with 
home, home ownership here is not

592
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:56,360
the same. 
So we already have that 

593
00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:58,800
pressure. 
We also have cost of living and 

594
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:00,160
we have all these other 
elements. 

595
00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:02,600
And then for me to sit here and 
say, and by the way, the other 

596
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:05,280
thing you could be doing is 
saving a bit of money so that 

597
00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:07,920
you've got a childcare solution,
I think is really difficult. 

598
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:13,440
I think that what I can say is 
the times at which I really felt

599
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:18,440
like things were moving easier 
or in a way that I felt 

600
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:23,000
confident about my childcare 
situation, as well as being able

601
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:26,120
to work, were times when I was 
totally, totally honest about 

602
00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:27,800
what I needed with the people 
around me. 

603
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:30,600
And so saying to my mom, I love 
you so much. 

604
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:35,560
I if I'm going to go back and 
work, I need your help and just 

605
00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:37,040
saying it. 
And that's not an easy 

606
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:40,080
conversation either. 
You know, she's older, she had 

607
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:43,920
made like that's a hard thing, 
but being able to say that was 

608
00:34:44,199 --> 00:34:48,400
something speaking to other 
women to say, listen, I'm going 

609
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,159
to do this childcare solution. 
Do you want a pool resource? 

610
00:34:51,159 --> 00:34:55,639
I'm thinking actually about 
resourcing my personal life, 

611
00:34:55,639 --> 00:35:00,240
like I resource my business. 
If I can't afford that, I can 

612
00:35:00,240 --> 00:35:03,400
afford it as part of a shared 
opportunity. 

613
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:06,400
Maybe I can't share that office.
I can't have that office on my 

614
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:07,840
own. 
But if you want to come and 

615
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:09,520
share with me and our friend 
wants to come and share the 

616
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:11,960
office with me, all of a sudden 
that's affordable. 

617
00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:15,480
Well, actually, can I apply that
same logic to childcare? 

618
00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:19,120
Can we child's, you know, can we
call resource for childcare 

619
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:22,000
solutions? 
Is there an after school club 

620
00:35:22,240 --> 00:35:24,560
that they won't run? 
But if enough of us all come 

621
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:27,520
together and say we need that 
club, they'll run it for us. 

622
00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:31,800
So it's just trying to think 
about resourcing personal life 

623
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,760
like I do my business life has 
helped. 

624
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:38,320
And are you noticing that 
happening a lot on Peanut 

625
00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:41,880
saying, OK, I live in NW one, 
we're in London, I'm filming 

626
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:43,800
this. 
Who's around to potentially 

627
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,520
share a nanny? 
Totally, particularly in the US,

628
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:50,680
the US audience on Peanut do a 
lot of very innovative. 

629
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:53,880
Do you want a nanny share? 
Do you want to like share 

630
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:56,560
babysitting? 
How are you guys thinking about 

631
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:57,920
it? 
And I think that that is 

632
00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:00,600
necessity. 
They have gone back to work so 

633
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,480
early. 
The cost of childcare is 

634
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:07,480
exorbitant. 
Plus this is your child. 

635
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:13,520
You want to have good, reliable,
caring, nurturing childcare. 

636
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:16,640
And so, yeah, we see that a lot,
particularly in the US. 

637
00:36:17,240 --> 00:36:20,680
And that is such a, because I 
obviously always thought Peanut 

638
00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:23,080
is about, you know, bringing 
moms together because, you know,

639
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:25,640
especially during pregnancy, 
like, oh God, have you got this 

640
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:26,840
symptom? 
Have you got this symptom? 

641
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:30,040
But this idea that you can 
create these financial networks 

642
00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:33,920
where you can share this cost 
feels an enormous weight off 

643
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:36,480
people's shoulders. 
It's such an important thing. 

644
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:41,200
How are you finding people who 
are even on your wavelength that

645
00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:43,800
you could do that with? 
Like, where is that conversation

646
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,320
happening if not on peanut? 
And that is a really, really 

647
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:49,960
important point. 
What are we doing societally to 

648
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:53,400
empower women to have these 
conversations about? 

649
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:55,280
Actually, I do want to go back 
to work. 

650
00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:59,240
I worked hard for my career. 
I want to return, but the 

651
00:36:59,240 --> 00:37:02,920
current like situation doesn't 
support that. 

652
00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:06,720
Can we pull resource? 
And I mean, thank God it's 

653
00:37:06,720 --> 00:37:07,920
happening on Peanut. 
What? 

654
00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:12,960
Cost do you think is often 
people think children need X and

655
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,960
actually you think honestly you 
don't need to waste your money 

656
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:18,760
with that? 
The most important thing for me 

657
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:22,400
actually is giving them the 
opportunity to be engaged in 

658
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:27,600
activities and around people who
they can have fun and learn 

659
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:31,240
from. 
And that is something that even 

660
00:37:31,240 --> 00:37:34,360
if money was really tight when I
was growing up, but I said to my

661
00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:38,200
mum, I want to go to ballet and 
she was like, we're going to 

662
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:40,520
find the money for you to go to 
ballet, you know, and it was 

663
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:42,880
that kind of thing. 
And so giving them those 

664
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:45,640
opportunities, it doesn't have 
to be something every night, but

665
00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:49,600
an opportunity to do something. 
It makes us well-rounded, it 

666
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:53,000
makes us interesting, it makes 
us care about things. 

667
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:55,960
It breaks down barriers. 
Like there's no reason a girl 

668
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:57,200
from Peterborough should be 
going to ballet. 

669
00:37:57,200 --> 00:37:59,280
But I loved it. 
And now, you know, I want my 

670
00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:03,640
daughter to do it. 
And so it's it's just about like

671
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:08,360
it democratizes access to things
that you consider to be not 

672
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:11,640
accessible to you. 
But you saw someone once in a 

673
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:13,960
Tutu and thought, yeah, kind of 
want to do that. 

674
00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:15,880
So that I think is really 
important. 

675
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:17,600
And I don't regret it. 
And I do it for the kids. 

676
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:21,920
How do you stay skilled as a 
young mom if you're taking time 

677
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:25,440
out to do your own childcare? 
Because, it said, I read that 

678
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,040
five years after the birth of 
your first child, mother's 

679
00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:32,280
monthly earnings are on average 
42% lower than in the year 

680
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:33,880
before the birth. 
Yeah. 

681
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:38,560
AI has changed so much in the 
last year, so if I had taken the

682
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:43,000
last year out of work, I think 
I'd be very struggling right now

683
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:46,560
because so much of my work now 
is using different AI tools. 

684
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:51,960
How do you, what is your, what 
is your advice to women to kind 

685
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:56,920
of stay just a little bit 
potentially connected or how do 

686
00:38:56,920 --> 00:39:00,560
you, I guess not feel you've 
been locked out the employment 

687
00:39:00,560 --> 00:39:04,080
market during motherhood? 
So I think that part of where we

688
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:09,040
find ourselves locked out is 
there are lots of contributing 

689
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:10,960
factors, but one of them is the 
pension gap. 

690
00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:15,560
As soon as you are not in the 
workplace, you are not making 

691
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:19,200
contributions to your pension. 
So actually not only is your 

692
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:23,720
salary lower, but what you are 
able to access at a later point 

693
00:39:23,720 --> 00:39:26,720
in your life is dramatically 
reduced as well. 

694
00:39:27,040 --> 00:39:30,720
So there are all these different
things that happen whilst we are

695
00:39:30,720 --> 00:39:35,320
not stepping out of work because
you know, we don't fancy working

696
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:37,440
anymore. 
We're actually stepping out and 

697
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:42,240
working harder that than anyone 
who is in their kind of nine to 

698
00:39:42,240 --> 00:39:45,360
five, so to speak, because it is
all consuming and it is like a 

699
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:49,600
level of expectation. 
So I think that acknowledging 

700
00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:53,480
that that difference is not just
the promotions that men who are 

701
00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:55,840
an equivalent level will 
continue to receive and we're 

702
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:59,360
not receiving, it's also those 
future contributions that we're 

703
00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:02,360
not getting. 
And that is a really big problem

704
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:06,040
actually societally because what
are we doing with those women 

705
00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:10,000
when they hit retirement age and
they don't have the pensions in 

706
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:14,600
terms of then how do I make sure
that I stay in or keep connected

707
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:19,200
or don't feel like I'm going to 
be out of work by the time I'm 

708
00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:21,720
ready to re emerge? 
I think that. 

709
00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:25,480
There are two different answers 
to it, and part of that will be 

710
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:28,280
necessity. 
Some women will have to return 

711
00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:29,560
to work. 
We have no choice. 

712
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:32,840
We have to go back. 
And therefore you have to see it

713
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:35,520
as any other part of your life. 
You're going to eat the right 

714
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:38,720
food, you're going to get 10,000
steps in, and you're going to 

715
00:40:38,720 --> 00:40:41,720
make sure that you understand 
whether it's reading the news or

716
00:40:41,720 --> 00:40:44,440
staying in touch with something 
to really like through 

717
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,360
necessity. 
And then another part, perhaps 

718
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:50,520
it's more of a luxury, but it 
does exist. 

719
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:54,000
And we see it where something 
happens in motherhood, which is 

720
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:58,320
creativity becomes unlocked and 
you start to feel that you see 

721
00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:01,920
the world slightly differently 
and you have ideas and you can 

722
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:04,560
see things through a different 
lens and you feel creative 

723
00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:07,200
again. 
And that is also an opportunity 

724
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:10,680
to start building and evolving 
and educating a different part 

725
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:14,560
of yourself in order to be able 
to re enter the workforce, but 

726
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:17,600
in a different way perhaps. 
So I think that there are two 

727
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:20,800
different paths. 
Both are important actually. 

728
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:25,000
Again, societally, we need both,
but we really need to support 

729
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:29,720
those women who have stepped out
to perform an essential part of 

730
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:35,080
childcare in order to make sure 
that we don't suffer from brain 

731
00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:37,360
drain as a society. 
We're going to lose all these 

732
00:41:37,360 --> 00:41:41,120
brilliant women and they're not 
going to re enter the workforce.

733
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:44,960
What's the travesty? 
I absolutely love that point of 

734
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:49,280
motherhood being a creative 
unlock because I think on social

735
00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:52,240
media you can look at all, you 
know, the mothers being very 

736
00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:54,360
honest and they're very stressed
with young kids. 

737
00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:57,880
But I feel I don't see that 
narrative enough going hard on a

738
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:00,280
minute. 
Children have given me back time

739
00:42:00,720 --> 00:42:04,680
to think for myself and actually
do a complete pivot. 

740
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:07,720
We Jake about it at home, but 
like I'm the CEO at home, I am 

741
00:42:07,720 --> 00:42:09,600
the CEO. 
I'm making the decision, 

742
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:12,840
decisions about who's going 
where, when. 

743
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:15,880
Like I like where we're 
investing our time. 

744
00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:17,800
Are we doing that this term, 
whatever it is? 

745
00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:20,200
Like. 
A different part of your brain, 

746
00:42:20,200 --> 00:42:23,040
like from an organizational 
perspective, switched on. 

747
00:42:23,240 --> 00:42:27,120
But now I'm also thinking about.
I wonder how I can explain this 

748
00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:32,200
issue to my daughter, who's 6. 
How can I get down into that? 

749
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:35,200
So then you're creative and you 
start thinking about things and 

750
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:38,880
how to get on her level. 
Or she teaches me things because

751
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:41,720
she sees something in a way. 
And I'm like, wow, that's 

752
00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:45,760
amazing. 
Or my son came up with an 

753
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:49,080
amazing idea the other day and I
was like, Finn, wow. 

754
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:53,080
So it's just about it unlocks 
something else in you. 

755
00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:57,720
And we must not be shy about 
seeing what the amazing joyous 

756
00:42:57,720 --> 00:43:01,320
moments of motherhood are, 
because otherwise I think women 

757
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:04,520
do self select out. 
And there is a news cycle where 

758
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:08,080
we talk a lot about all of the 
difficulties and it's much 

759
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:09,760
harder to share the positive 
news. 

760
00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:11,880
And there are so many. 
Positives. 

761
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:16,720
I don't have the stat with me 
right now, but I know more often

762
00:43:16,720 --> 00:43:19,760
than most successful 
entrepreneurs are ones that have

763
00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:22,560
had kids and actually set up 
their business later on in the 

764
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,840
life. 
They're not the 24 year old 

765
00:43:24,840 --> 00:43:26,800
founder. 
Look at what we have to do. 

766
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:30,080
It's a time management. 
You're being resourceful. 

767
00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:35,040
You know, we we have like really
limited resource on our 

768
00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:37,120
finances, but we'll make it 
happen. 

769
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:40,320
Also, it is that thing of need 
something doing ask a busy 

770
00:43:40,320 --> 00:43:43,800
person like mum is doing so many
things. 

771
00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:47,560
She was the original influencer.
She knows who the best painter, 

772
00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:51,920
decorator, like tradesman is in 
the in your area because she's 

773
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:54,520
the one that's employing them. 
She also is the matchmaker. 

774
00:43:54,520 --> 00:43:57,920
She knows who's single. 
Like she was everything and 

775
00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:01,480
we've forgotten how integral 
that is and we've forgotten a 

776
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:08,280
little bit somewhere along the 
line that that is worthy of like

777
00:44:08,720 --> 00:44:11,920
complete plaudit and and almost 
worship. 

778
00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:14,760
She does everything. 
So of course you can run a 

779
00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:18,200
business too. 
What would be your advice to any

780
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:21,520
man who maybe has taken time out
for childcare? 

781
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:23,600
They haven't gone back to work 
yet and they've lost their 

782
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:26,320
confidence. 
The confidence gab is is real. 

783
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:30,120
I've seen it, I, I work with 
women where I've seen it on many

784
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:32,240
occasions. 
I think I wish I had just the 

785
00:44:32,240 --> 00:44:34,720
confidence of a very average 
man. 

786
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:39,400
I think that actually confidence
comes from an empowerment of 

787
00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:42,360
education. 
So resourcing yourself, doing 

788
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:46,360
the reading, doing the research,
feeling that you don't need to 

789
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:49,280
know it, but knowing that you've
done that part gives you 

790
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:52,680
confidence and networks. 
You know what gives me 

791
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:55,360
confidence? 
Other women, brilliant women who

792
00:44:55,360 --> 00:44:57,160
tell me, yeah, you've got this. 
You're amazing. 

793
00:44:57,160 --> 00:44:59,800
I loved when you did that. 
I walked in here and you told me

794
00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:01,120
three things about me that you 
loved. 

795
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:03,800
And I was like, you know, and it
makes you feel amazing because I

796
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,960
don't really care what other 
people like the genpop thing, 

797
00:45:07,160 --> 00:45:09,720
but I do care what other 
brilliant women think about me. 

798
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:13,160
And so surrounding yourself with
those networks is really 

799
00:45:13,160 --> 00:45:17,280
important and it makes you feel 
scene and it makes you feel 

800
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:20,160
relevant. 
And that's really important. 

801
00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:22,560
And it doesn't matter where you 
find that network, but if you 

802
00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:25,080
can have that, I think that's 
really important. 

803
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:28,520
So I would say like tooling 
myself with education and then 

804
00:45:28,520 --> 00:45:31,800
tooling myself with support 
network friends. 

805
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:35,840
Before I worked for Andre, I 
worked for an entrepreneur. 

806
00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:42,480
He was incredible. 
And he said to me, the first 

807
00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:46,960
million is your hardest to make,
and after that everything's 

808
00:45:47,160 --> 00:45:49,840
going. 
What he was trying to say is 

809
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:53,960
like that getting that first 
push is the hardest bit. 

810
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:57,240
And then after that, you kind of
understand what the triggers are

811
00:45:57,240 --> 00:46:02,440
and what the moments are. 
And I don't know if I agree with

812
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:07,400
him on all of that, but I do 
think that the most important 

813
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:11,480
lesson is everyone is constantly
reflecting on their own 

814
00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:16,120
financial position and success. 
So him to even say that to me 

815
00:46:16,520 --> 00:46:18,800
randomly, you know, the first 
millions are hardest and after 

816
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:23,440
that you'll be fine, means that 
that's kind of constantly his 

817
00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:27,880
self evaluation. 
And I think that as a result, I 

818
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:32,560
am constantly self evaluating. 
If like, where did I want to be?

819
00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:35,200
Where do I want to be? 
What are the things I need to do

820
00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:38,080
to get there? 
It was a very long way of saying

821
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:45,720
constantly thinking about my 
financial health and position is

822
00:46:45,720 --> 00:46:48,280
the most important lesson 
because the times that I didn't 

823
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:52,040
think about it other times or 
where I was a bit like this. 

824
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:56,320
Where I just. 
Felt young and not caring are 

825
00:46:56,320 --> 00:46:58,680
opportunities that I missed or 
mistakes that I made. 

826
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:00,400
So I'm constantly trying to be 
aware. 

827
00:47:00,400 --> 00:47:02,960
I'm conscious of it. 
Are you an investor? 

828
00:47:03,120 --> 00:47:04,520
Are you an? 
Are you a saver? 

829
00:47:04,920 --> 00:47:08,640
I'm an investor because I get 
excited I and you know, you can 

830
00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:11,800
invest in variety of things and 
whether it's stocks or whatever,

831
00:47:11,800 --> 00:47:15,120
but all investing companies or 
whatever you might be. 

832
00:47:15,160 --> 00:47:19,360
I am someone who likes the 
gratification of seeing like the

833
00:47:19,360 --> 00:47:23,440
success. 
So I would say that I've taken 

834
00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:28,800
lots of risks on investments, 
some ill advised perhaps, but I 

835
00:47:28,920 --> 00:47:31,600
I get that passion like get 
excited. 

836
00:47:31,720 --> 00:47:34,760
To have risk appetite. 
Risk appetite comes after the 

837
00:47:34,760 --> 00:47:37,560
first million, as Paul would 
say, like that, like you, you 

838
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:39,600
don't before that you don't have
any risk appetite. 

839
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:43,520
You can't afford to Saving is 
something really interesting 

840
00:47:43,520 --> 00:47:47,360
that that I was always a saver 
squirrel. 

841
00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:48,920
I used to call it the squirrel 
account. 

842
00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:50,760
I still got the squirrel 
account, right. 

843
00:47:50,760 --> 00:47:54,080
So you just like tuck things 
over and try and forget that 

844
00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:56,880
it's there and it's that rainy 
day like squirrel account. 

845
00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:03,240
But now I think I want money to 
work harder for me than just 

846
00:48:03,240 --> 00:48:06,760
sitting and tucking it away. 
And that's why I want to take 

847
00:48:07,200 --> 00:48:09,880
the investment risk because the 
reward is greater. 

848
00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:12,120
And that is something that I've 
learned over time. 

849
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:16,280
And who's taught you about? 
That a bit trial and error and a

850
00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:18,880
bit kind of seeing things where 
I've had money just sitting 

851
00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:22,240
there and it's not really doing 
anything, which over time means 

852
00:48:22,240 --> 00:48:23,560
that it's actually worth. 
Less. 

853
00:48:23,840 --> 00:48:27,400
It sounds such a simple point, 
but honestly I didn't even think

854
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:30,400
about that it that much. 
I'd have money in the bank that 

855
00:48:30,400 --> 00:48:32,720
was essentially dying on me. 
That's why I wasn't doing 

856
00:48:32,720 --> 00:48:33,800
anything. 
Because you're not, it's not 

857
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:39,440
working for you, right? 
And, and so that for me is 

858
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:41,200
something that you can't really 
understand. 

859
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:44,160
You've got to think about it in 
terms of whatever it is that you

860
00:48:44,160 --> 00:48:46,560
care about, whatever is the 
thing that you want. 

861
00:48:46,800 --> 00:48:50,120
OK, so I really like, I don't 
know, clothes. 

862
00:48:50,160 --> 00:48:51,360
I do actually really like 
clothes. 

863
00:48:51,360 --> 00:48:52,840
And I'm not trying to be like, 
frivolous. 

864
00:48:52,840 --> 00:48:55,440
And now it's a woman talking 
about money and she like I do. 

865
00:48:55,440 --> 00:48:58,640
That's the thing that I like. 
And I like to invest in them and

866
00:48:58,640 --> 00:49:01,040
I love them. 
And it makes me like hyper. 

867
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:05,360
And if I could buy that Elia 
jacket two years ago with the 

868
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:10,080
money I had in my savings, but 
today I can't buy it, that's 

869
00:49:10,080 --> 00:49:12,360
because the money hasn't grown 
with the market, right? 

870
00:49:12,440 --> 00:49:14,080
And and it because it's not 
working for you. 

871
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:16,440
And that's a problem. 
And that's a problem if you want

872
00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:18,520
to buy a house or a car, 
whatever The thing is that 

873
00:49:18,520 --> 00:49:21,040
you're trying to get. 
And that's how you have to think

874
00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:23,640
about it. 
So that's not to say that you 

875
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:26,000
shouldn't be prudent with where 
you're putting your money, and 

876
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:28,440
you should only take risk where 
you can afford to lose it. 

877
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:32,400
Do you actively teach yourself 
about the stock market and 

878
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:36,360
invest? 
In listen, it's really hard to 

879
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:40,040
all of a sudden go from not 
having an awareness to then 

880
00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:42,720
zoning in. 
And I'm a lawyer and you know, 

881
00:49:42,720 --> 00:49:45,960
we actually do deals where it 
can impact what, you know, 

882
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:47,760
someone's share price or 
whatever it might be. 

883
00:49:48,680 --> 00:49:51,320
And so yes, I think it's an 
important thing. 

884
00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:56,360
There is literally no reason 
that we all can't be reading and

885
00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:58,480
understand. 
You can go to your best friend 

886
00:49:58,480 --> 00:50:03,680
chat and ask her to explain like
a 5 year old what this certain, 

887
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:06,400
you know, movement, what's a 
bear market? 

888
00:50:06,760 --> 00:50:08,920
And she's going to give you an 
answer, which is probably better

889
00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:12,480
than I can give you right now. 
So there's literally no excuse 

890
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:14,440
for not going and doing that 
education piece. 

891
00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:15,920
And yes, we all should be doing 
it. 

892
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:19,920
Financial literacy in women is 
shockingly low. 

893
00:50:19,960 --> 00:50:25,200
Yeah, in there's 30% economists 
compared to 70% male economists.

894
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:31,800
Only 17% of the CFO in the CFO's
in the top Fortune 500 companies

895
00:50:31,800 --> 00:50:36,120
are winning. 
Why is it essential that women 

896
00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:39,080
learn about finance? 
If you don't understand the 

897
00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:46,960
mechanics of how to invest, how 
to smartly save, how to smartly 

898
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:51,480
spend, it is the ultimate form 
of repression. 

899
00:50:51,640 --> 00:50:55,600
That's how I feel. 
And I feel like in the same way,

900
00:50:55,760 --> 00:51:00,120
we were never really told how to
network properly, in the same 

901
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:03,240
way that we were never really 
told how to build a business. 

902
00:51:03,240 --> 00:51:05,480
But instinctively we had to do 
these things. 

903
00:51:05,960 --> 00:51:08,760
Just because it feels 
uncomfortable doesn't mean you 

904
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:11,520
don't need to know it. 
You have to go and understand 

905
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:15,760
it. 20 years ago we weren't 
talking about our gynaecological

906
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:18,360
health and now we are. 
You have to be. 

907
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:22,120
As confident and comfortable 
talking about your gut health, 

908
00:51:22,120 --> 00:51:25,080
your Ghana health as your 
financial health, it is so 

909
00:51:25,080 --> 00:51:28,800
important to not understand. 
It will be the thing that 

910
00:51:28,800 --> 00:51:33,800
unpicks you from being able to 
have the life that you are 

911
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:39,880
wanting to have building for. 
And there is a reason we didn't 

912
00:51:39,880 --> 00:51:41,240
know. 
We didn't. 

913
00:51:41,720 --> 00:51:44,600
We didn't hold the pen, we 
couldn't write the check, we 

914
00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:47,200
couldn't open the account. 
And now we can. 

915
00:51:47,720 --> 00:51:50,880
But we didn't do that bit in 
between to catch up with 

916
00:51:50,880 --> 00:51:54,920
understanding what that means. 
And now all of the tools are 

917
00:51:54,920 --> 00:51:57,240
there, and all of the 
information is there to make 

918
00:51:57,240 --> 00:52:00,960
sure that you can do it. 
That was I I'm so inspired. 

919
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:04,320
That was so well, perfectly, 
perfectly put. 

920
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:06,720
Do you talk about finance with 
your friends? 

921
00:52:06,720 --> 00:52:10,720
Because I think this is also 
another thing where I turn up to

922
00:52:10,720 --> 00:52:16,080
these men dinners and then 
making each other rich and 

923
00:52:16,080 --> 00:52:18,480
they're telling each other, oh, 
May, I've got this great deal. 

924
00:52:18,720 --> 00:52:21,400
And then I turn up to my girl 
dinners and I love them both. 

925
00:52:21,400 --> 00:52:24,720
But we get we don't get stuck. 
So I enjoy the conversation, but

926
00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:27,360
we talk about, Oh my gosh, no 
way did he break up? 

927
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:29,440
Like, you know, have you just 
broken up with him? 

928
00:52:30,320 --> 00:52:34,240
We go into emotional matters. 
We go into what our heart is 

929
00:52:34,240 --> 00:52:37,200
feeling, which don't get me 
wrong, is very important because

930
00:52:37,440 --> 00:52:39,440
men's mental health is 
struggling because they're not 

931
00:52:39,440 --> 00:52:42,520
having these conversations. 
But I think to myself, gosh, 

932
00:52:42,520 --> 00:52:45,360
women's bank accounts are really
struggling because we are not 

933
00:52:45,600 --> 00:52:47,600
actively talking about finance 
with our friends. 

934
00:52:47,840 --> 00:52:51,320
Is that an experience you see or
do you feel that you do talk 

935
00:52:51,320 --> 00:52:54,320
about finance with your friends?
Honestly, it's so frustrating. 

936
00:52:54,560 --> 00:52:58,400
Men are syndicating deals 
amongst themselves, they're 

937
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:01,120
sharing deals amongst themselves
and we're not getting in on the 

938
00:53:01,120 --> 00:53:05,840
action so that they know that 
the founder of a big fintech 

939
00:53:05,840 --> 00:53:09,560
company based in Sweden is doing
a secondary before he does his 

940
00:53:09,560 --> 00:53:13,920
exit and they're in on the deal.
I want to be in on the deal, but

941
00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:17,080
I'm not in on the deal. 
And we should all be angry about

942
00:53:17,080 --> 00:53:19,480
not being in on the deal. 
And we should be like banging on

943
00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:23,680
the door to say, let me in 
because I add value to or I can 

944
00:53:23,680 --> 00:53:26,520
write a cheque. 
And so surrounding yourself with

945
00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:29,360
the right people on that is so 
important. 

946
00:53:29,720 --> 00:53:34,360
I have a friend who is an 
investor who he's pretty good at

947
00:53:34,360 --> 00:53:40,600
bringing me in on deals. 
And but it's a he and he will do

948
00:53:40,600 --> 00:53:44,560
it when he thinks he can and he 
will like reference me and I'm 

949
00:53:44,560 --> 00:53:46,520
grateful for it. 
And you know what I do, I try 

950
00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:49,120
and like bring the women in too.
I'm like muscling in to be like,

951
00:53:49,120 --> 00:53:53,680
she's great too. 
So it is a real problem that we 

952
00:53:53,680 --> 00:53:57,280
are not getting the deal flow 
because they keep it there. 

953
00:53:57,280 --> 00:54:00,240
Another form of repression. 
If you want to know the truth. 

954
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:04,800
In my view, the conversations 
that we're having, yes, it is 

955
00:54:04,800 --> 00:54:09,200
hard because we do want to talk 
about emotional and real life 

956
00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:11,400
and we want to talk about those 
things, but we also want to talk

957
00:54:11,400 --> 00:54:14,560
about ideas and what we've read 
and what we're like. 

958
00:54:14,560 --> 00:54:18,560
That is who we are. 
We're multifaceted and sometimes

959
00:54:18,560 --> 00:54:21,960
I think it's just a lot of like 
nervousness of sounding dumb. 

960
00:54:22,240 --> 00:54:24,040
But have you ever, has your 
friend ever asked you a 

961
00:54:24,040 --> 00:54:25,240
question? 
You thought they were dumb? 

962
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:30,000
No, my girlfriend's asked me 
things and I'm like, oh, I 

963
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:31,920
actually don't know, let's find 
out. 

964
00:54:32,120 --> 00:54:36,560
I've never thought oh God you're
stupid for not knowing that or 

965
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:39,320
if I have known the answer and 
they haven't loved it. 

966
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:42,520
Everyone loves like showing off 
about what they know, so why 

967
00:54:42,520 --> 00:54:46,120
wouldn't you let them? 
So don't let your fear of 

968
00:54:46,120 --> 00:54:50,040
looking stupid mean that you 
don't ask the questions that you

969
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:52,960
need to know the answers to in 
order to get the deals. 

970
00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:56,560
And I think there's also links 
to that very important point you

971
00:54:56,560 --> 00:54:59,960
just mentioned being how 
important networking is, because

972
00:54:59,960 --> 00:55:04,520
networking and finances feel so 
much more intertwined that we 

973
00:55:04,520 --> 00:55:07,800
think they do. 
Because, you know, to a point, 

974
00:55:07,800 --> 00:55:09,760
you learn about the deals if you
have the network. 

975
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:14,680
Now you were born into no 
network by the sounds of it, and

976
00:55:14,680 --> 00:55:18,360
you created your network. 
How it sounds such a kind of 

977
00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:20,880
cringey question in a way, 
because that this idea of 

978
00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:23,000
networking immediately makes our
spine crawl. 

979
00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:24,920
Yes. 
And it's so embarrassing. 

980
00:55:26,080 --> 00:55:30,880
And yeah, I know you have. 
Built an incredible professional

981
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:34,160
and friendship network. 
I did it really late. 

982
00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:37,240
I didn't know. 
I didn't know we had to have a 

983
00:55:37,240 --> 00:55:39,200
network. 
I didn't know what was. 

984
00:55:39,520 --> 00:55:42,440
So I certainly had no value to 
place on it because I didn't 

985
00:55:42,440 --> 00:55:45,960
know, didn't understand that 
actually that person that I met 

986
00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:48,200
five years ago might be the 
person that writes me a term 

987
00:55:48,200 --> 00:55:52,280
sheet or whatever it might be. 
I didn't know and I cannot 

988
00:55:52,280 --> 00:55:54,480
stress to you enough, start 
today. 

989
00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:57,280
Start now. 
Any person that you meet in your

990
00:55:57,280 --> 00:55:59,320
life. 
It's not like I make it sound 

991
00:55:59,320 --> 00:56:03,880
like mercurial and it's not that
any person show an interest in 

992
00:56:03,880 --> 00:56:06,880
who they are, what they do, 
because you just don't know when

993
00:56:06,880 --> 00:56:08,960
that might be relevant to you in
your future. 

994
00:56:09,400 --> 00:56:14,040
And if you can introduce people,
be helpful to people, they'll 

995
00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:17,640
pay it forward. 
They'll remember and just not 

996
00:56:17,640 --> 00:56:22,160
being a taker and giving will 
reward you. 

997
00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:25,160
So start today, start now. 
I wish I'd have started so long 

998
00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:27,120
ago. 
Think about networks please. 

999
00:56:27,120 --> 00:56:29,800
It's the most important thing. 
So to the future, yeah. 

1000
00:56:29,880 --> 00:56:34,000
How does Peanut and how do you 
think about this AI boom? 

1001
00:56:34,120 --> 00:56:39,320
First thing to say is for anyone
who feels like mystified on AI 

1002
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:42,320
and just want to demystify, 
we've been using it for years, 

1003
00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:44,000
right? 
It just wasn't called AI in the 

1004
00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:46,560
way that we think about it now. 
And OK, it wasn't chat and it 

1005
00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:49,920
wasn't Gemini and it wasn't 
Grog, but it was, we were using 

1006
00:56:49,920 --> 00:56:52,200
it. 
Whether that is because we were 

1007
00:56:52,200 --> 00:56:54,920
creating predictive models and 
things. 

1008
00:56:55,960 --> 00:56:58,360
There were versions of it for 
moderation. 

1009
00:56:58,360 --> 00:57:02,040
If you used a dating app, a 
social network, Peanut, you've 

1010
00:57:02,040 --> 00:57:03,760
used AI. 
It's been in there in the 

1011
00:57:03,760 --> 00:57:06,600
background doing something. 
So now there's an evolution, 

1012
00:57:06,800 --> 00:57:09,360
something's changed, and we've 
got more opportunities. 

1013
00:57:10,200 --> 00:57:13,760
I think for us, the biggest 
opportunity is the fact that you

1014
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:17,720
can ask Chat or Gemini anything 
and she'll give you the answer. 

1015
00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:20,440
Love that. 
But how do you know that she's 

1016
00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:23,000
not hallucinating? 
How do you know that she's 

1017
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:25,920
giving you the right answer? 
How do you know you can trust 

1018
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:31,640
that answer, particularly in the
world of your child or your 

1019
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:35,280
fertile health or anything to do
with you? 

1020
00:57:36,320 --> 00:57:41,640
And so, Peanut, next year, we'll
be bringing you the opportunity 

1021
00:57:41,640 --> 00:57:44,680
to validate all of your answers 
through the community because 

1022
00:57:44,680 --> 00:57:49,200
the part that is missing from 
AIAI is incredible, but the 

1023
00:57:49,200 --> 00:57:51,880
validation from real experience 
is missing. 

1024
00:57:52,240 --> 00:57:54,720
And so we give you the 
opportunity to ask the question 

1025
00:57:54,720 --> 00:57:57,720
to get that quick answer, but 
then to validate it with 

1026
00:57:57,800 --> 00:58:00,240
millions of women who are at 
that same point who can say 

1027
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:04,040
correct, agree, disagree. 
Here's the nuance, because it's 

1028
00:58:04,040 --> 00:58:08,600
that contextual that is missing 
to AI and that's coming next 

1029
00:58:08,600 --> 00:58:13,600
year. 
Wow, that is unbelievably 

1030
00:58:13,600 --> 00:58:18,560
exciting because I've already 
experienced use cases of going 

1031
00:58:18,560 --> 00:58:22,440
online, asking questions and 
getting such crazy answers 

1032
00:58:22,440 --> 00:58:24,760
right. 
And when you're in that 

1033
00:58:24,760 --> 00:58:27,960
vulnerable state, especially 
when you're pregnant, you've got

1034
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:31,360
no idea what to believe, what 
not to believe in it you're up 

1035
00:58:31,360 --> 00:58:34,080
at night going through these 
crazy chat forums. 

1036
00:58:34,200 --> 00:58:37,400
I'm obsessed with this. 
This is what you need. 

1037
00:58:37,400 --> 00:58:41,160
You need to have. 
So you might, you've got a baby 

1038
00:58:41,160 --> 00:58:43,800
that won't sleep. 
Maybe the baby's got colic 

1039
00:58:43,800 --> 00:58:47,160
reflux, whatever it is, you've 
asked the AI what the what the, 

1040
00:58:47,320 --> 00:58:49,640
what the problem is and what the
solution might be. 

1041
00:58:50,080 --> 00:58:52,160
And are you going to leave it 
there? 

1042
00:58:52,200 --> 00:58:54,680
You're going to trust that or 
are you actually going to ask 

1043
00:58:54,680 --> 00:58:58,040
women who, how they're living 
it, knowing who can share their 

1044
00:58:58,040 --> 00:59:00,640
experience. 
So it's about authenticating and

1045
00:59:00,640 --> 00:59:03,280
validating. 
One particular psychologist that

1046
00:59:03,280 --> 00:59:07,720
goes on a lot of podcasts and I 
know that she distresses a lot 

1047
00:59:07,720 --> 00:59:12,800
of women about her very strong 
views on women essentially not 

1048
00:59:12,800 --> 00:59:17,160
going back to work. 
And to your point, it's 

1049
00:59:17,160 --> 00:59:19,680
absolutely unfeasible for most 
women not to go back to work. 

1050
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:24,440
And so all she's doing is just 
creating a lot of guilt and not 

1051
00:59:24,440 --> 00:59:27,120
with not really much positive 
outcome because it's really 

1052
00:59:27,120 --> 00:59:33,240
archaic what she's sharing. 
And I feel that I've heard 

1053
00:59:33,240 --> 00:59:38,840
stories of then Chachi Petit or 
these other AIAI platforms are 

1054
00:59:38,840 --> 00:59:42,840
validating these crazy 
viewpoints that are making women

1055
00:59:42,840 --> 00:59:46,080
feel even worse. 
The truth of the matter is 

1056
00:59:47,440 --> 00:59:53,720
anyone who is making a judgement
on what you decide to do from a 

1057
00:59:53,880 --> 00:59:59,880
motherhood, parenting, work 
relationship perspective is not 

1058
00:59:59,880 --> 01:00:03,640
a voice that you need in like 
singing in your choir. 

1059
01:00:04,320 --> 01:00:07,280
The only voices you need are 
people who support. 

1060
01:00:07,280 --> 01:00:11,000
They might ask questions. 
But who are supporting and 

1061
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:14,520
giving, offering their own 
personal experience as an 

1062
01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:17,360
example of this is how I made it
work. 

1063
01:00:17,640 --> 01:00:20,880
This is what worked for me. 
This was my experience. 

1064
01:00:21,080 --> 01:00:24,040
Because we're humans. 
We want to know what other 

1065
01:00:24,040 --> 01:00:27,240
people's lived experiences. 
I don't really just need to 

1066
01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:30,320
understand this is what you're 
telling me is the answer. 

1067
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:33,600
I don't need that. 
What I need is what did you do? 

1068
01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:35,960
How did you cope with it? 
How did you get through that? 

1069
01:00:36,160 --> 01:00:38,800
Is it normal? 
Did I experience the same thing 

1070
01:00:38,800 --> 01:00:43,000
you did? 
And that's really the there is a

1071
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:46,920
brilliant part of AI, but the 
part that really needs 

1072
01:00:47,600 --> 01:00:50,120
development. 
And where I see our role is 

1073
01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:53,760
making sure that it's 
authenticated by real lived 

1074
01:00:53,760 --> 01:00:55,840
experience of real women. 
God. 

1075
01:00:56,000 --> 01:00:58,560
I'll be using that. 
That is absolutely fantastic. 

1076
01:01:01,800 --> 01:01:04,640
So our final round is splurge or
save. 

1077
01:01:04,720 --> 01:01:08,320
Yes, Rimowa suitcases. 
Got 1 so splurge. 

1078
01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:12,560
Salmon sperm facials save. 
Airpods save. 

1079
01:01:12,560 --> 01:01:15,920
I like the wire at home. 
LED masks save. 

1080
01:01:16,040 --> 01:01:22,320
Taxi or tube taxi? 
Birkin bag splurge astrology 

1081
01:01:22,320 --> 01:01:26,560
readings Oh splurge Daily matcha
save. 

1082
01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:29,160
Most. 
Valuable phone subscription at 

1083
01:01:29,160 --> 01:01:31,120
the moment because I have quite 
bad insomnia. 

1084
01:01:31,120 --> 01:01:33,480
It's This American Life. 
I like to listen to all the 

1085
01:01:33,480 --> 01:01:37,640
podcasts, like the Extra Bits, 
because I'm obsessive about 

1086
01:01:37,640 --> 01:01:39,360
those things. 
Stocks or savings? 

1087
01:01:39,800 --> 01:01:44,840
Stocks renting or buying? 
Depends on the circumstance for 

1088
01:01:44,840 --> 01:01:45,800
me. 
Currently buying. 

1089
01:01:46,200 --> 01:01:47,880
Best book. 
The art of War. 

1090
01:01:48,280 --> 01:01:50,560
Why? 
A friend of ours gave it to me 

1091
01:01:50,680 --> 01:01:54,120
and you open it and there'll be 
a quote in there and you apply 

1092
01:01:54,120 --> 01:01:57,720
it to basically where you are in
your life right now. 

1093
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:00,680
It's it's actually phenomenal. 
So you'll read something and 

1094
01:02:00,680 --> 01:02:04,160
you're like, oh, contextualises 
things. 

1095
01:02:04,160 --> 01:02:06,800
It's quite, it's quite profound.
It's good. 

1096
01:02:06,920 --> 01:02:08,840
Most inspiring entrepreneur 
you've ever met? 

1097
01:02:09,120 --> 01:02:11,080
I'm going to say Andre because 
he changed my life. 

1098
01:02:11,520 --> 01:02:15,200
The real secret to success is. 
The people you surround yourself

1099
01:02:15,200 --> 01:02:17,040
with. 
My first paycheck was. 

1100
01:02:17,360 --> 01:02:20,920
From John Lewis. 
Thank you so much for being on 

1101
01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:24,000
Hot Girl Finance. 
You are a complete inspiration. 

1102
01:02:24,000 --> 01:02:27,920
Thank you so much and I cannot 
wait for Peanut in this new 

1103
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:31,680
iteration of AI to be helping so
many more women release the 

1104
01:02:31,680 --> 01:02:35,480
girl, find other people that 
feel the same and can give 

1105
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:37,480
advice. 
And thank you so much for what 

1106
01:02:37,480 --> 01:02:39,400
you do for women globally. 
Thank you. 

1107
01:02:39,400 --> 01:02:42,080
Want more tips on the crazy sexy
world of money? 

1108
01:02:42,200 --> 01:02:45,600
Subscribe to Stay connected, 
send it to your friends and rate

1109
01:02:45,600 --> 01:02:47,640
the show to help more women find
us. 

1110
01:02:47,920 --> 01:02:51,760
We need to empower everyone we 
know because this is a group 

1111
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:54,000
effort. 
Hot Girl Finance is now on all 

1112
01:02:54,000 --> 01:02:56,120
podcast platforms, Instagram, 
and YouTube. 

1113
01:02:56,360 --> 01:02:59,560
Send us Adm for any topics and 
guest suggestions you'd like us 

1114
01:02:59,560 --> 01:03:01,000
to cover. 
See you soon. 

1115
01:03:01,200 --> 01:03:04,360
Until next time, stay hot and 
look after your finances.