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Do it Danny. 
I'm here with Oak and I'm Danny 

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and we're here to bring you our 
very first episode of this 

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podcast. 
We do you want to give us a 

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little intro about yourself. 
Yes I do. 

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Thanks for asking I'm Oak my 
pronouns. 

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Are she her? 
And I think we're going to go 

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through and do these little bits
of intro these sections and we 

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can go back and forth so we 
Don't talk too long. 

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If that works for you Danny. 
Yeah, let's do it. 

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So I am an aspiring astrological
Guru. 

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I am currently novice because I 
don't think that anyone actually

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even considers themself a grew 
in astrology, feel like everyone

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feels like they're novice, but I
am definitely a novice, but my 

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big three signs would be sad. 
Son, Scorpio moon in Scorpio 

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Rising. 
So I feel like that puts me 

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somewhere in the Outgoing yet 
esoteric a cult minded space 

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somewhere like you take 
Wednesday from Wednesday, the TV

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show, most recently done 
Wednesday and her roommates. 

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You put those two together I 
feel like that would give you a 

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sense of my point of view. 
But what about you Daddy? 

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Yeah. 
So I am a mom of two real life 

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which my kind of thing is that I
really do a lot of like folk 

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magic and stuff. 
So astrology is definitely not 

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in my wheelhouse. 
Think it's amazing, think it's 

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great but my big three 
astrological signs. 

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I'm a cancer. 
Son. 

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Don't all collectively side 
together and Aquarius Moon, and 

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a Leo rising. 
And so I think for me, Me those 

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things kind of show up as 
somebody who is both really 

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empathetic towards other people.
Really seek to know, and 

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understand but also very, let's 
get things moving. 

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Let's do something big. 
Let's do something really great 

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and I tend to be a chatterbox. 
So that's me in a nutshell. 

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I, yeah, I concur. 
That is absolutely you as I know

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you. 
We've known each other for One 

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plus years that right? 
Yeah. 

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Yeah. 
That's right. 

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On par. 
Yeah. 

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I guess. 
I guess we should have had it 

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anniversary. 
Oh my gosh, we didn't even like 

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take each other out or anything.
Oh, I'll get you flowers next 

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time. 
I see you. 

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I think that we can go into the 
spiritual, maybe self 

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identifiers. 
It's weird to put yourself in a 

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box because, you know, no one 
wants to live in a box. 

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Of isolation or segmentation 
because we were ever evolving 

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ever-changing people, but I 
think it's at least helpful for 

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us to Define kind of where we're
starting from. 

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In this conversation, can you 
hear my squeaky as chair? 

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I did hear a little squiggly. 
I, I like, I like antique 

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furniture if you can't tell. 
So if I collapsed to the ground,

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that's my six-year-old chair 
even out. 

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Okay. 
So spiritual boxes Definitely 

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identify as Pagan which is a 
super large umbrella term. 

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As we know, I would say that I'm
a hard polytheist and that, I 

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believe in multiple gods, not a 
monotheistic point of view and I

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believe in many gods. 
And I believe that they are 

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actually real entities that 
exist somewhere in some space. 

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And I think we've talked about 
this Danny where it's like, very

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He much American Gods 
illustrates my point Angela 

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where I think? 
Yeah, everybody's gods are real 

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to them, whatever you think's 
going to happen to you after you

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die. 
That's what happens to you. 

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So, that's where I'm at. 
I am a currently Seeker on a 

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traditional Wiccan path and so 
we'll talk more about that. 

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But yeah, that's, that's where 
that's the Box. 

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I'd put myself in. 
Where would you put yourself? 

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Yeah, I think you and I are kind
of in the same Realms, so I'm 

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definitely Pagan and I do kind 
of believe in this hard 

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polytheism in the sense that I 
think the energy that has been 

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put into things kind of that 
American. 

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God, belief is has created, 
these entities whether 

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intentional or not and I really 
love. 

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I guess. 
From that same perspective, the 

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idea that like a god in one 
place, may not be the same. 

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Kind of personality that that 
God has an another place 

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depending on how they're 
worshipped, how their venerated 

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you know, all of those things. 
And I do also I guess have kind 

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of a pantheist view on things. 
I think there is a spiritual 

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sense to all things. 
I think we're not like here by 

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happenstance I guess. 
So I don't believe in like a 

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One, true God or anything like 
that, but I think everything has

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a Divinity to it and I am also a
seeker and a traditional Wicked 

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path. 
Yeah. 

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This is where we reveal that 
were in and out of court 

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together or we want secret. 
Okay. 

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I think, I just don't know a 
better time to do it since we're

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going to probably keep 
referencing that so yeah, let's 

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do. 
Yeah, yeah. 

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So Oak and I are in an outer 
Court together, currently for a 

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garden Aryan, outer core. 
Or and it has been an absolute 

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pleasure to do this process with
her. 

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I was mortified when I started, 
it was just me because everyone 

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else is so much further along 
and like, they had way better 

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ideas of what was going on and 
then didn't Danny. 

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And then oak came in and she, oh
my God, revealed, we're also not

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using her. 
Real name's Danny, there's so 

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many Secrets being revealed In 
the first episode. 

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What are we doing? 
We're terrible at keeping 

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secrets. 
Literally, the worst would be 

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worse. 
Yeah. 

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Yeah. 
So Oak and I are in the same 

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outer Court together for a 
garden area and path and I am 

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just so thankful that she is 
going down this road with me. 

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I think when I first joined the 
outer Court, it was literally 

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just me. 
I was the only secret and that 

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was a very awkward. 
I really Thrive with Alien ship,

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it's probably my cancer sun. 
And so, I was really excited 

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when they told me that somebody 
else was kind of joining the 

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group and that we'd be kind of 
running this process along. 

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Side, each other parallel to 
each other, and it has been 

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phenomenal to be going through 
this process with Oak. 

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Yeah, I think we should talk 
more about that for sure. 

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I think that's a worthy topic to
talk about like the connections 

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that you build an outer court. 
And yeah, Special delivery to 

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your wonderful. 
Okay, let's do this. 

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Tell me if you want to kind of 
keep going on the topic here of 

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like, yeah, your spiritual past 
and like what kind of brought 

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you to Witchcraft Wicca 
paganism, all of that species. 

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So I hear I am originally from a
pretty Christian Appalachian 

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Family. 
Ali. 

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So my family has this kind of 
weird. 

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We don't talk about it, but we 
all acknowledge it thing where 

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very few people in my family 
would call themselves, outwardly

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witches. 
But so many of them are, in 

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fact, practitioners they would 
call themselves superstitious. 

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Not a little stitches, but 
superstitious totally. 

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Yeah. 
But like, it's, I didn't realize

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tells older that it was very 
abnormal to like, It in your 

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mouth water. 
Like the rest of the world's not

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doing that, but that's very 
normative where my family is 

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from. 
My grandmother is a witch that 

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unfortunately I don't have a lot
of connection with because she 

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is also severely mentally ill. 
And so that piece of her is 

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really kind of lost to me. 
My aunt is also a witch and 

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outwardly, would call herself a 
witch and then my other aunt is 

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again just superstitious And 
that's really kind of where I'm 

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from. 
I grew up in a, not very 

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Christian home. 
My mom from her childhood 

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experiences has come just 
rejected, religion in general 

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because of kind of how she grew 
up and issues with her mother 

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and so I really began delving 
into more mainstream witchcraft 

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kind of deciding that maybe the 
Falk way was maybe not the 

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normative way about three years 
ago and Then have kind of gone 

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down this more traditional path,
about two years ago with 

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traditional Wicca and then have 
now kind of come full circle 

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into folk magic and coming back 
around to the roots and what 

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kind of currently speaks to me 
and then I'm currently seeking 

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initiation and the same outer 
Court as Oak. 

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That's such a cool story. 
You're so cool. 

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You know, but what's going on 
with you? 

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Okay, tell me your background. 
Give it to us. 

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What do we need to know about 
you? 

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Yeah, well, I definitely group 
Southern Baptist. 

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My grandmother was a born again,
Christian as she was recovering 

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from alcoholism. 
And so she definitely, you know,

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At the bottle and turn to Jesus 
and she was super devout. 

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So I think that's really where I
got my initial exposure to 

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religion in general and so 
definitely have read the Bible 

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multiple times in that space. 
Think that there's a lot of 

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interesting things in the Bible 
that are useful and then I would

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say, probably the next piece was
that I went to Catholic school, 

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which I was like, super excited 
about because it was in the 90s 

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and the crap came out and They 
were uniforms and it looks real 

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cute. 
So I went to Catholic school for

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a few years. 
Loved all of the drama. 

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Love, the end sense. 
Love the choreographed bits of 

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it and all the holy water and 
all those good witchy things. 

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Um, and yeah, and then my mom 
became born again as well. 

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And so, she actually started 
attending a non-denominational 

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church, which was It's so 
interesting. 

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They call it Dawn to nomination.
I think it's just because it's 

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like, just take the extreme 
version of Christianity and it's

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that. 
Um, so they would like to speak 

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in tongues and it was very 
intense. 

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It was very like either you're 
for God, or you're against God, 

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and they had strict lines in the
sand about what was good and 

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what was bad. 
So it was a really interesting 

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point of view to see kind of 
that religious zealousness and 

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then on the other end of the 
spectrum, you know, my dad is 

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super atheist and I would Was 
put them on the spectrum of like

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being nihilist. 
I'd love to get into those 

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definitions and another point 
because I think there's, you 

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know, from pantheist to 
acknowledge sticked atheist. 

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It's think there's a lot of 
definitions there. 

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And I love a definition because 
my burger is in Capricorn, but I

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won't bore us with those 
definitions. 

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But yeah, I mean I grew up in 
the 90s because true girl is 

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over 40 and so in the 90s 
witchcraft was, you know, 

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Obviously a topic of pop culture
and but I think it also just 

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really sparked a general 
interest in religion. 

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So like Buddhism. 
And I mean even Christianity, I 

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think it's really interesting. 
There's a lot of beautiful 

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truths in it so I am always 
because of all of my Scorpio 

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placements been looking for the 
answers you know and what's 

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hidden. 
But I started exploring Wicca 

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via a uu Church uu Church you 
Nazarian. 

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Universalist probably like in 
the early aughts and I stayed 

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with them for like a half a year
or so and then I ended up moving

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to another place and that wasn't
really on my radar anymore. 

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But I circled back around, you 
know, I don't know ten years 

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later and found my way into like
an outer court that was also in 

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a traditional path. 
It's more of a offshoot of 

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garden. 
Aryan wicked witch but not going

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Aryan and learned a lot from Um,
that group a ton really. 

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The outer Court was super 
educational base, lot, like 

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hours and hours of teaching. 
So I learned so much from that 

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group, the group kind of 
included as they do from time to

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time and so that I ended up 
being solitary for another 

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couple of years and I had 
actually reached out to our high

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priest and who runs our outer 
Court. kind of the start of the 

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pandemic but of course the pain 
demek happened and so I didn't 

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really pursue it and so I really
was I think doing like Outreach 

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to our HP for probably a year 
before we actually ended up 

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meeting and doing the initial 
interview if you will to see if 

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I'm worthy of meeting the other 
court and So that is, yeah, I 

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mean it was really solid of 2021
that I started with the outer 

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court and you were what was was 
it Beltane for you? 

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Was it? 
When did you start with it was 

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right at? 
Yeah, it was right at Beltane. 

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Hmm, okay. 
I guess it's that was 20 21 for 

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you than it would have been a 
2021 for me. 

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Yep. 
Yeah, I think I really started 

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focusing back on the craft and 
practicing it. 

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Oh, I guess it would be six 
years. 

226
00:14:44,900 --> 00:14:49,400
Now it was there was an 
astrological event actually that

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00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:52,100
I use to Mark the occasion, 
which we can talk more about 

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00:14:52,100 --> 00:14:56,600
that. 
Yeah, so that's that's what led 

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00:14:56,600 --> 00:15:00,000
me here. 
I'd be interested. 

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00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:01,700
I think the next thing that we 
said that we wanted to talk 

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00:15:01,700 --> 00:15:04,400
about was, you know, what are 
you currently obsessed with? 

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I think obviously a lot of this 
podcast is going to be 

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influenced by what selfishly we 
want to talk about and what we 

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00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:13,500
want to nerd out about. 
So that's probably useful. 

235
00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:16,500
So what are you focusing on 
right now Danny what's here with

236
00:15:16,500 --> 00:15:20,100
your current Obsession? 
Yeah so I think you know as part

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00:15:20,100 --> 00:15:23,100
of this kind of coming full 
circle thing, I really am coming

238
00:15:23,100 --> 00:15:27,600
back to the folk magic pieces 
and trying to like really delve 

239
00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:29,600
into like, where did these 
practices come from? 

240
00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:32,400
Where did they originate? 
How did they kind of meld 

241
00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:35,800
together to become what they are
and Appalachian? 

242
00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:40,000
Oh, and so that is like, my 
current obsession is trying to 

243
00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:42,900
find kind of the roots of some 
of These quote-unquote 

244
00:15:42,900 --> 00:15:46,900
superstitions and these, you 
know, cures for the 

245
00:15:46,900 --> 00:15:51,400
superstitions and that's kind of
my new obsession is reading 

246
00:15:51,700 --> 00:15:53,300
everything. 
I could get my hands on which is

247
00:15:53,900 --> 00:15:57,400
also surprisingly little for 
this area. 

248
00:15:57,400 --> 00:15:59,800
There's, there's a lot about 
folk magic out there, but very 

249
00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:03,800
little about Appalachia, as a 
whole and like how these 

250
00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:08,100
practices kind of came to be. 
So that's a big focus of mine 

251
00:16:08,100 --> 00:16:13,800
right now as someone who cooks a
lot, A lot and also has celiacs 

252
00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,200
and so can't eat a lot of 
things. 

253
00:16:16,900 --> 00:16:18,500
I am really into kitchen 
witchery. 

254
00:16:18,500 --> 00:16:21,600
I do a lot of cooking, and so I 
think it was just kind of a 

255
00:16:21,608 --> 00:16:26,100
natural offshoot of both folk 
magic and needing to cook a lot.

256
00:16:26,100 --> 00:16:30,100
And being a witch that I kind of
have gotten into this kitchen 

257
00:16:30,100 --> 00:16:35,300
witchery Vibe lately, but then 
also just ritual ization. 

258
00:16:35,700 --> 00:16:38,900
I think as you and I are working
through an outer core, just 

259
00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:43,900
really finding like purpose in. 
I think a lot of times it's you 

260
00:16:43,900 --> 00:16:47,800
get into this, just do it. 
We're like okay, I've got the 

261
00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:51,000
materials and I got, you know, 
some words and I just just need 

262
00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:54,100
to do the thing. 
And then at the end you can be 

263
00:16:54,100 --> 00:16:57,500
really kind of dissatisfied with
the way that it went because you

264
00:16:57,500 --> 00:16:59,200
haven't really thought through 
all the pieces and thought 

265
00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:01,200
through the. 
Why am I using this? 

266
00:17:01,700 --> 00:17:04,599
Do I like this verbage it does 
this really speak to me? 

267
00:17:04,599 --> 00:17:06,900
Makes sense to me and definitely
something we talk about in a 

268
00:17:06,907 --> 00:17:11,200
future podcast is you know if it
doesn't make sense it's probably

269
00:17:11,200 --> 00:17:12,599
not going to be Your best 
working. 

270
00:17:12,599 --> 00:17:16,599
So it has to make sense to you 
as to really work for you. 

271
00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:21,099
For it to work. 
For instance, spell jars for the

272
00:17:21,099 --> 00:17:24,900
purpose of manifesting things 
don't work for me because they 

273
00:17:24,900 --> 00:17:26,800
logistically, don't make sense 
to me. 

274
00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:29,100
Totally. 
I would you bottle up something 

275
00:17:29,100 --> 00:17:33,400
that you want to work that you 
want to put out there that you 

276
00:17:33,408 --> 00:17:37,500
want to create and and multiply 
and it for me mentally. 

277
00:17:37,500 --> 00:17:40,100
It doesn't make sense and that's
why they don't work for me. 

278
00:17:40,100 --> 00:17:44,400
So really Delving into ritual 
ization and what did the things 

279
00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:49,000
mean and how does it show up in 
my workings Oak? 

280
00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:50,900
What are you obsessed with right
now? 

281
00:17:51,700 --> 00:17:54,500
Well, I'm obsessed with you the 
whole time. 

282
00:17:54,500 --> 00:17:56,000
I wanted to be like a huh? 
Yep. 

283
00:17:56,100 --> 00:17:58,400
Oh my gosh, that's so cool. 
But I don't think that that 

284
00:17:58,400 --> 00:18:00,900
actually translates well in this
medium. 

285
00:18:00,900 --> 00:18:04,600
But yeah, I mean, I've 
definitely benefited from all of

286
00:18:04,600 --> 00:18:10,800
your kitchen, which Focus cause 
I also need to be gluten-free. 

287
00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:14,700
I'm certainly not. 
A Celiac Spectrum, but I also 

288
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:16,700
would identify as needed to be 
gluten-free. 

289
00:18:16,700 --> 00:18:21,400
And so I've have benefited 
multiple times from your your 

290
00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:23,600
baking and cooking and 
delicious. 

291
00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:26,500
So there's that. 
I support you and your kitchen 

292
00:18:26,500 --> 00:18:30,800
witchery. 
I, yeah, obviously, the ritual 

293
00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:37,800
construction and, and thinking 
about, you know, how to create 

294
00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:41,600
ritual and space, that makes 
sense to me, you know, I think, 

295
00:18:42,300 --> 00:18:45,400
Right now, obviously, we are in 
the outer Court. 

296
00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:50,900
Practicing Ritual from that 
point of view, I think I'm also 

297
00:18:50,900 --> 00:18:54,400
trying to preserve, you know, a 
personal practice within that 

298
00:18:54,400 --> 00:19:02,500
space and continue to hold onto 
like my triggers of what I keep 

299
00:19:02,700 --> 00:19:06,400
personal. 
So ritual construction, just, 

300
00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:10,000
you know, learning the outer 
Court Danny's experiences, but 

301
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:13,500
I'm like, somebody that needs 
Needs to know the meaning of 

302
00:19:13,500 --> 00:19:15,700
every word. 
And why are we saying that 

303
00:19:15,700 --> 00:19:20,000
versus this? 
And so really microscope level 

304
00:19:20,100 --> 00:19:26,300
evaluation of ritual. 
And then, as I already said 

305
00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:30,900
astrology, I mean, between those
two things I could spend a 

306
00:19:30,908 --> 00:19:35,100
lifetime. 
So, but yeah, I mean, I think of

307
00:19:35,100 --> 00:19:39,100
those right now astrology being 
such a big topic and one that 

308
00:19:39,100 --> 00:19:45,900
I've avoided for so long. 
Taking up most of my my study 

309
00:19:46,900 --> 00:19:52,100
yeah yeah I totally agree can 
concur that you do need to break

310
00:19:52,100 --> 00:19:54,200
things apart into all of its 
pieces. 

311
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:57,600
But that is also what I love 
about you because you like force

312
00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:00,000
me to ask questions. 
I would not normally have even 

313
00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:01,500
thought to ask because I'm like,
I don't know. 

314
00:20:01,500 --> 00:20:04,100
Just that's just how I do it. 
That's just how it's which is 

315
00:20:04,100 --> 00:20:06,800
also just in my nature with folk
magic like somebody is passed it

316
00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:08,200
down to me and said, this is why
we do it. 

317
00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:11,600
And I'm like, Wait, maybe I 
should be asking why. 

318
00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:15,800
So I do love that about you is 
that you really forced me to 

319
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:18,300
look at things and be like, are 
we just doing this? 

320
00:20:18,300 --> 00:20:20,500
Because someone said we should, 
are we doing this? 

321
00:20:20,500 --> 00:20:25,200
Because it makes sense for the 
working and I'm like, you have 

322
00:20:25,300 --> 00:20:27,500
really excellent points. 
You really excellent points 

323
00:20:27,500 --> 00:20:30,000
there. 
I, you know, I didn't take that 

324
00:20:30,300 --> 00:20:33,000
point of view like that makes 
such that makes so much sense, 

325
00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:35,300
right? 
Like your background of folk 

326
00:20:35,300 --> 00:20:39,200
magic being like the information
that's being passed down to you.

327
00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:40,900
Is a gift. 
So, like, don't question the 

328
00:20:40,900 --> 00:20:43,900
gift just kind of like accept it
and work with it and I didn't 

329
00:20:43,900 --> 00:20:45,900
make that connection. 
That's really interesting. 

330
00:20:45,900 --> 00:20:50,300
Yeah, I mean for me I'm just 
like I wouldn't say I'm like 

331
00:20:50,300 --> 00:20:54,200
rebellious and I don't think I 
am like I pushed back against 

332
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:58,200
tradition obviously because I'm 
like seeking a traditional path.

333
00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:03,100
But I definitely am somebody who
questions because I've benefited

334
00:21:03,100 --> 00:21:07,100
and been, I think praise 
honestly for questioning things,

335
00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:12,100
I've not really kept myself in 
places where questioning 

336
00:21:12,100 --> 00:21:15,300
something is a bad thing. 
I think we're in a place in 

337
00:21:15,300 --> 00:21:18,300
society where we know that like 
when people question things, 

338
00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:20,800
It's not a bad thing. 
It's it's actually them seeking 

339
00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:22,800
to understand something on a 
deeper level. 

340
00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:29,100
So they I'm a pain in the ass, 
but I really like somebody 

341
00:21:29,100 --> 00:21:30,200
people way. 
Okay good. 

342
00:21:30,300 --> 00:21:33,100
Yes, I love it so much. 
No, absolutely. 

343
00:21:33,100 --> 00:21:36,900
I think, you know, it just 
develops like further 

344
00:21:36,900 --> 00:21:38,300
understanding. 
And that's what I really 

345
00:21:38,300 --> 00:21:40,400
appreciate. 
Like, when you do push back on 

346
00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:44,800
things and I'm like, yeah, no, I
exactly see what you mean and 

347
00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:46,700
where you're coming from. 
And so I that's one of the 

348
00:21:46,700 --> 00:21:48,300
things I really love about 
working. 

349
00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:50,800
I'm with you is that your brain 
just works in a different way 

350
00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,300
than mine? 
Where most will be like oh well 

351
00:21:53,300 --> 00:21:55,800
we just we just don't work the 
same way and I'm like, no, I 

352
00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:59,400
love that so much because it 
really just gives me this full 

353
00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:01,400
perspective of things. 
And really makes me think about 

354
00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,900
things on a deeper level and 
really delve into those things 

355
00:22:06,300 --> 00:22:09,100
kind of trying to match your 
brain power and where you're at.

356
00:22:09,100 --> 00:22:11,600
And so it kind of forces me to 
think about things in a 

357
00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:13,400
different way and kind of 
broaden my horizons. 

358
00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:18,500
No, thank you. 
I feel I still seen and accepted

359
00:22:18,500 --> 00:22:23,900
I think like, We're totally 
attracted to each other 

360
00:22:23,900 --> 00:22:25,700
magically. 
We have we have magic crushes on

361
00:22:25,700 --> 00:22:28,000
each other. 
Yeah, I'm just always inspired 

362
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:32,200
by so I have explained 
everything through astrology. 

363
00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:40,800
So I have my, my North Node is 
in cancer, right? 

364
00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:47,400
Which is your son. 
So the nurturing side of you and

365
00:22:47,700 --> 00:22:51,200
how you thrive in relationships,
like not just one relationship 

366
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:52,500
at multiple relationships. 
Chips. 

367
00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:56,000
And the fact that you're just so
nurturing is really really 

368
00:22:56,000 --> 00:23:00,300
interesting to me because that's
like just not who I am. 

369
00:23:00,300 --> 00:23:02,600
I generally have like, really 
intense individual 

370
00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:05,400
relationships. 
I wouldn't describe myself as 

371
00:23:05,900 --> 00:23:08,800
nurturing to everyone. 
Like no one would ever call me 

372
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:14,600
nice and no, I mean, but it's 
cool because I'm not, that's not

373
00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:16,500
my goal in life is to be 
likeable. 

374
00:23:16,500 --> 00:23:18,400
My goal is to be meaningful, 
right? 

375
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:26,300
And so, and I think that your 
Organic accepting an approach to

376
00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:32,000
the practice is probably a 
really good bit of chill to my 

377
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:36,000
intensity and also not that 
anybody will ever see this 

378
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:39,700
through this medium. 
But I have really enjoyed 

379
00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:42,800
watching you move in circle. 
And when you've been doing like,

380
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:45,300
the high priestess things, you 
have really beautiful hand 

381
00:23:45,300 --> 00:23:46,700
movements. 
I just want to say I've a hand 

382
00:23:46,700 --> 00:23:52,000
crush on how you present not to 
make you like self. 

383
00:23:52,700 --> 00:23:58,200
Aware and therefore nervous in 
the spaces but you move 

384
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:02,900
beautifully move like a dancer. 
You know, I several people have 

385
00:24:02,900 --> 00:24:05,000
told me that I have dancers 
feet. 

386
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:10,800
I really just think it's because
I have child size feet but no 

387
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:15,800
one's ever said that to me. 
So people are like, oh wow, you 

388
00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:22,900
have a soccer player feet. 
There is a lot of Fine motor 

389
00:24:22,900 --> 00:24:25,400
skills and dexterity required 
for that, though. 

390
00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:28,700
So bergna, fair. 
I'm gonna, I'm definitely a 

391
00:24:28,700 --> 00:24:30,500
jock. 
You're definitely, you know, the

392
00:24:30,500 --> 00:24:33,400
pretty truly an artist. 
So I'm here for it. 

393
00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:36,300
It's good balance, right? 
That's exactly what we're here 

394
00:24:36,300 --> 00:24:37,700
for. 
Life is all about balance. 

395
00:24:37,700 --> 00:24:40,900
I'm a firm believer in that, 
love it. 

396
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:46,500
So I thought to continue. 
So we have an intro episode 

397
00:24:46,500 --> 00:24:48,800
where we enter it ourselves, 
which makes sense. 

398
00:24:49,300 --> 00:24:52,000
I thought we would take the 
Inception step. 

399
00:24:52,100 --> 00:24:57,300
Further and have a podcast 
reviewing other podcast. 

400
00:24:57,300 --> 00:25:02,600
Clearly there is a really 
healthy community of witchy 

401
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:06,600
podcasters out there. 
And I'm certainly not trying to 

402
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:15,600
necessarily fill in any missing 
space, in the, which cast sphere

403
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:18,000
of reality there. 
I think we have a lot of things 

404
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:21,000
already covered. 
Selfishly, the reason that I'm 

405
00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:25,000
wanting to Do this podcast is to
hold myself accountable. 

406
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:31,700
I am as Gretchen Rubin, would 
describe a holder where if I 

407
00:25:31,700 --> 00:25:34,800
have to deliver information to 
other people, it actually helps 

408
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:38,400
me have ownership over it and it
helps motivate me. 

409
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:42,700
So I see this as kind of a 
motivation, but I wanted to call

410
00:25:42,700 --> 00:25:47,200
out all of my Inspirations and 
the podcast that I have really 

411
00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:51,100
enjoyed and honestly I assume 
that will be referencing and 

412
00:25:51,100 --> 00:25:57,500
paying homage Zh / stealing 
things from other podcasts as, 

413
00:25:57,700 --> 00:26:00,400
you know, as any good artist. 
Does you steal? 

414
00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:03,800
What works? 
And so I think we'll be playing 

415
00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:06,500
some of these things into our 
own structure. 

416
00:26:06,500 --> 00:26:08,500
So I wanted us to talk through 
that. 

417
00:26:08,500 --> 00:26:12,000
I know that you are an avid 
podcast consumer. 

418
00:26:12,500 --> 00:26:16,200
Mmm. 
Yeah, I definitely believe one 

419
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:19,600
in Reckoning these things away. 
There just is, like you said so 

420
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:23,600
much good media out there. 
And so many Frameworks that are 

421
00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:25,400
really do. 
Appreciate, of course, things 

422
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:27,400
out there that I think we all 
hate. 

423
00:26:27,700 --> 00:26:32,400
Shout out to ads directly in the
middle of someone speaking, but 

424
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:36,200
there are so many things that I 
do love that are out there and I

425
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:39,100
would like to, you know, call 
out some of those those great 

426
00:26:39,100 --> 00:26:42,800
spaces that exist. 
So for me, first one, I've got 

427
00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:44,800
up here one of my absolute 
favorites. 

428
00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:47,500
I mean, I could gush about these
guys all day long. 

429
00:26:47,500 --> 00:26:50,900
I feel like a socially, we are 
BFFs. 

430
00:26:50,900 --> 00:26:52,500
They just they don't know it. 
Yet. 

431
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,200
But I love coffee and culture 
ins. 

432
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:57,100
Okay? 
It is one of those things that I

433
00:26:57,100 --> 00:27:01,400
turn on, on my way home when I 
just need to unwind for my day 

434
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,900
and just have like two great 
hosts who are just going to 

435
00:27:04,900 --> 00:27:08,700
laugh at each other and have a 
great time and kind of give me 

436
00:27:08,700 --> 00:27:11,400
little insights into their 
brains at the moment. 

437
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:14,800
But that podcast is ran by Robin
Valentin. 

438
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,600
She's the author of magical Taro
and Maria. 

439
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:21,500
The Arcane, they are both tarot 
readers which I think is awesome

440
00:27:21,500 --> 00:27:25,900
because of Who dabbles in Tarot,
but is definitely not at that 

441
00:27:25,900 --> 00:27:28,100
level. 
I just like, seeing how their 

442
00:27:28,100 --> 00:27:31,700
brains work in relation to those
cards and two different decks 

443
00:27:31,700 --> 00:27:35,600
and all of that. 
They also in kind of the 

444
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,300
structure of their episodes. 
They cover a tarot card each 

445
00:27:38,300 --> 00:27:42,800
episode along with the current 
astrological kind of placement 

446
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:46,100
at that moment. 
And then also this lovely little

447
00:27:46,100 --> 00:27:50,700
section called what stirring 
your cauldron, which I really 

448
00:27:50,700 --> 00:27:53,900
love because they really kind of
call out what's happening in the

449
00:27:53,900 --> 00:27:57,500
which sphere right now and what 
is not, so great in our 

450
00:27:57,500 --> 00:27:59,700
community but also what is 
wonderful. 

451
00:27:59,700 --> 00:28:01,800
And the kind of uplifting those 
ideas. 

452
00:28:02,700 --> 00:28:06,600
And then they also do the 
segment at the end about shops 

453
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:08,600
and artists and art that they're
loving. 

454
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:13,200
And these are completely like 
non-paid for advertisements and 

455
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:14,500
recommendations. 
These are just things that 

456
00:28:14,500 --> 00:28:17,300
they've kind of organically 
found out there that they're 

457
00:28:17,300 --> 00:28:21,100
like, hey, take a look at this 
and I have found so many other 

458
00:28:21,100 --> 00:28:23,800
great witches. 
Many other great shops. 

459
00:28:24,100 --> 00:28:28,600
So many other avenues of like 
art and creativity through that 

460
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:32,800
that got to pay homage to that. 
Because I really appreciate how 

461
00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:37,800
much they kind of broaden, my, 
which Horizons totally. 

462
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,500
I totally had to start. 
Yeah, I had to start following 

463
00:28:40,500 --> 00:28:43,800
them when you mentioned them 
because I think I had found them

464
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:47,400
early on and follow them on 
instead I somehow they just kind

465
00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:51,500
of got out of my algorithm on 
Spotify, that's where I consume 

466
00:28:51,500 --> 00:28:54,700
all of my Podcast. 
The I started listening to them 

467
00:28:54,700 --> 00:29:00,500
and I do really love that story 
in the coldren that segment and 

468
00:29:00,500 --> 00:29:02,900
they're in their podcast and 
they do have such a lovely I 

469
00:29:02,900 --> 00:29:07,300
think compliment back and forth.
The fact that they're both tarot

470
00:29:07,300 --> 00:29:10,000
readers, reviewing Taro is what 
I really appreciate. 

471
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:14,800
I yeah I totally understand the 
idea of using a podcast as of 

472
00:29:14,808 --> 00:29:18,400
like a way of forcing yourself 
to study things because I think 

473
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:23,600
we'll probably do that but I 
really Free sheet, you know, 

474
00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:27,100
people who are veterans at 
something who have been doing 

475
00:29:27,100 --> 00:29:29,800
it, you know, for more than five
years and even make money off of

476
00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:33,000
these things, bringing their 
Points of View to a deep dive, 

477
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:34,600
right? 
Like how many episodes Have you 

478
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:40,300
had like novice intro. 
I'm not going either baby which 

479
00:29:40,300 --> 00:29:44,600
because I find that offensive 
but you know folks that are 

480
00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,600
definitely would not identify as
professionals talking about 

481
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:51,400
tarot to for me it's like I 
don't need to know what Asus me 

482
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:54,400
and I don't need Need to know 
what the suit of Cups means. 

483
00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:58,300
Like I appreciate a deeper dive,
so thanks for reminding me about

484
00:29:58,300 --> 00:30:00,700
coffee. 
And cauldrons, of course, of 

485
00:30:00,700 --> 00:30:03,200
course. 
I think I'm gonna kind of ping 

486
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:05,800
pong over to you, what? 
Okay, one of your podcast that 

487
00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:08,100
you're obsessed with. 
Okay. 

488
00:30:08,100 --> 00:30:11,700
So we're going to do like no 
particular order and I thought 

489
00:30:11,700 --> 00:30:14,300
it was really cool too because 
when I'm looking at your list on

490
00:30:14,300 --> 00:30:18,200
the show notes Here we only had 
one that overlapped which will 

491
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:23,400
have to get to but the first I 
think podcast That I found 

492
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:28,000
myself just super excited about 
number one, going through all of

493
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,900
the episodes. 
I think she was already on like 

494
00:30:31,900 --> 00:30:34,900
season two. 
So there was a number of 

495
00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:38,400
backlogged episodes, I could 
consume but was Pam Grossman. 

496
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:44,300
So she's the author of seeking 
know she's author of which wave 

497
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:47,000
and shit. 
I didn't even forget to actually

498
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,600
see the title of her book off to
find it on my shelves while 

499
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:54,300
you're talking, but she is. 
Is she's out of New York. 

500
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:57,900
So she has that amazing like New
York, sensibility. 

501
00:30:57,900 --> 00:31:00,200
That's like totally to the 
point. 

502
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:04,700
However, she is and was really 
influential and the New York art

503
00:31:04,700 --> 00:31:09,400
scene and cultivating kind of 
The Craft artists points of 

504
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:11,800
view. 
She speaks about really amazing 

505
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:16,500
artist and has content creators 
and witches and people who are 

506
00:31:16,500 --> 00:31:20,100
maybe slightly outside of that 
Spectrum, but play into the 

507
00:31:20,100 --> 00:31:22,500
archetype of the, which she 
talks a lot about the The which 

508
00:31:22,500 --> 00:31:27,800
archetype so she also brings in 
like writers and musicians. 

509
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:32,000
She's just, I think tapping into
a really great space in art, the

510
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:37,700
cross-section of Art and 
Witchcraft and oh my gosh, this 

511
00:31:37,700 --> 00:31:44,500
woman is So eloquent and how 
such a beautiful speaking voice 

512
00:31:44,500 --> 00:31:49,600
and it's like all the things 
that I just won't be ever as a 

513
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:54,000
podcaster. 
And so I definitely have a total

514
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:58,700
crush on her speaking voice and 
the Cadence, at which she speaks

515
00:31:58,700 --> 00:32:01,800
and how she mean, she's clearly 
a writer and how she strings 

516
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:04,800
together words. 
So it's been really fun to 

517
00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:09,000
follow her on her journey 
because she's now a full-time, 

518
00:32:09,500 --> 00:32:11,900
you know, content. 
Creator wears before she had 

519
00:32:11,900 --> 00:32:15,100
initially started with a day 
job. 

520
00:32:15,700 --> 00:32:18,000
And so it's been interesting 
just at, just to watch her grow 

521
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:23,100
and to read her book. 
She actually fun, fact did some 

522
00:32:23,100 --> 00:32:25,500
Consulting work on the new 
craft. 

523
00:32:26,100 --> 00:32:28,700
Oh yeah. 
Right. 

524
00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:30,900
Yeah. 
So maybe. 

525
00:32:30,900 --> 00:32:34,700
If we ever get to talk with her 
I'll be like two steps removed 

526
00:32:34,700 --> 00:32:39,800
from the craft was crap really 
like living out your childhood 

527
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:40,900
dream. 
Truly. 

528
00:32:40,900 --> 00:32:43,300
Oh my God oh my God, I'd be so 
amazing. 

529
00:32:43,300 --> 00:32:44,200
Yeah. 
All right. 

530
00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:45,300
What about you? 
What's your next one? 

531
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:49,500
So the next one I have up is 
invoking witchcraft. 

532
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:53,500
So Jay Alan Cross the author of 
American brujeria. 

533
00:32:53,500 --> 00:32:56,300
And Britain, Boyd, the author of
her brain book. 

534
00:32:56,300 --> 00:33:00,800
Just recently came out Earth 
which they host that podcast. 

535
00:33:01,100 --> 00:33:04,400
If I really kind of fell in love
with it because they have this 

536
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:09,800
focus on folk magic Earth. 
Magic magic from different 

537
00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:12,400
Teachers. 
And then also some Epsilon 

538
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:16,700
episodes that are kind of 
outside of the Witchcraft box. 

539
00:33:17,100 --> 00:33:19,700
I think there's an episode about
Bigfoot and they're like, so 

540
00:33:19,700 --> 00:33:22,300
there's some other stuff in 
there to kind of keep you love 

541
00:33:22,300 --> 00:33:24,200
that did. 
Yeah, you know and some 

542
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:28,600
different things. 
However, heads up that they did 

543
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:32,600
just recently announced kind of 
the end of their podcast which 

544
00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:36,700
is very sad for me Britain Boyd 
recently had a baby and a jail 

545
00:33:36,700 --> 00:33:39,600
crosses kind of getting into 
some new projects and so they've

546
00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:41,800
decided to kind. 
Kind of not create any more 

547
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:44,200
episodes, however, they're 
leaving up all their previous 

548
00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:47,100
episodes. 
So there's still all of this 

549
00:33:47,100 --> 00:33:49,200
value, an done all of these 
episodes. 

550
00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:51,300
That really, you know, just keep
it fun. 

551
00:33:51,300 --> 00:33:53,900
Keep it light. 
I think they come from two 

552
00:33:53,900 --> 00:33:59,200
different ends of the Witchcraft
spectrum and I really just 

553
00:33:59,500 --> 00:34:01,700
appreciate hearing their 
different points of view on 

554
00:34:01,700 --> 00:34:05,000
things and how those points of 
view, kind of crisscross and 

555
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:10,900
intersect. 
I have not started listening to 

556
00:34:11,699 --> 00:34:13,900
all of their episodes and I 
totally appreciate. 

557
00:34:13,900 --> 00:34:18,800
Like the idea of, you know, when
you start a podcast, there's 

558
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:22,400
obviously a pretty big 
commitment and, you know, if you

559
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:25,100
recently had a child or you're 
going to have a child, like the 

560
00:34:25,100 --> 00:34:27,000
idea of trying to do both of 
those things. 

561
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:29,900
Well, it seems to me quite 
difficult. 

562
00:34:29,900 --> 00:34:32,400
So I love just the 
acknowledgement of like, hey, 

563
00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:34,400
the place of my life has 
changed. 

564
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,100
And therefore, I'm going to 
change and not Holding yourself 

565
00:34:37,699 --> 00:34:39,699
to previous decisions. 
Love that. 

566
00:34:40,100 --> 00:34:42,000
That's so real. 
And so true. 

567
00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:44,100
We have to do that all the time 
in our own practice. 

568
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:47,300
Yeah, absolutely. 
Yeah, I love that. 

569
00:34:47,300 --> 00:34:49,300
Okay. 
What I did find that for you 

570
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,199
yeah, I found I was looking 
through my library here. 

571
00:34:52,199 --> 00:34:56,000
If you could hear me creaking 
around waking the which is Pam, 

572
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:58,800
Grossman's book, it's so stupid.
Good. 

573
00:34:59,700 --> 00:35:03,500
It talks about, you know, all of
the which archetypes and pop 

574
00:35:03,500 --> 00:35:05,500
culture. 
So highly recommended have you 

575
00:35:05,500 --> 00:35:07,400
read that one? 
No, I haven't. 

576
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:11,200
I have to add it. 
Okay, NeverEnding Library list I

577
00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:12,900
never stopped reading literally 
never. 

578
00:35:12,900 --> 00:35:19,400
Okay, I mean I hear you and but 
I'm like just go ahead and make 

579
00:35:19,400 --> 00:35:21,500
an endorsement that it should 
move to the top of your list 

580
00:35:21,500 --> 00:35:24,700
because it's so easy to read. 
I am a person that struggles 

581
00:35:25,300 --> 00:35:30,000
often with reading like hard 
old-school, old-fashioned paper 

582
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:33,600
ebooks and I totally read this 
whole thing cover to cover like 

583
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:35,600
in a week which is unheard of 
for me I'm definitely. 

584
00:35:36,300 --> 00:35:40,000
An audiobook connoisseur. 
So but yes can't speak. 

585
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:43,500
Highly enough about him. 
Grossman also, I'm in sales. 

586
00:35:43,500 --> 00:35:47,800
Have you tell I'm like totally 
selling you Grossman like, let 

587
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:49,700
me tell you why you should 
upgrade actually do the 

588
00:35:49,700 --> 00:35:53,500
hardcover version. 
Let me like, what would be your 

589
00:35:53,500 --> 00:35:55,200
objection here to reading this 
book? 

590
00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:58,600
Let me go ahead and address your
concerns at any rate. 

591
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:03,000
So, and I next one that again, I
think this is the same. 

592
00:36:03,300 --> 00:36:06,700
I haven't seen Vibe here like, 
when I started to listen, This 

593
00:36:06,700 --> 00:36:09,800
podcast, I got into the space 
where I was just excited for 

594
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:13,000
them to have their releases. 
I think that they do this, 

595
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:15,100
maybe, bi-weekly or weekly. 
I'm not sure. 

596
00:36:15,100 --> 00:36:18,800
The I can't remember the 
frequency, but is bonfire 

597
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:20,000
Babble. 
Had you heard of this one? 

598
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:23,100
I have heard of it but I have 
not picked it up yet. 

599
00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:27,000
Okay, so what's really funny is 
this one, and the next one that 

600
00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:33,400
I talked about, they have this 
Dynamic that's created between 

601
00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:37,400
kind of like a younger older 
which I Not that much age 

602
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:40,500
difference, but there's very 
different personalities. 

603
00:36:40,500 --> 00:36:42,900
One's kind of more maternal and 
the other person is less 

604
00:36:42,900 --> 00:36:45,700
maternal. 
And I don't know if hey, I've 

605
00:36:45,700 --> 00:36:48,900
never seen that compilation of 
people before ever. 

606
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:54,000
I yes, yes. 
So Corey and data they live in 

607
00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:56,600
Seattle. 
First thing that I love that 

608
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,700
they do is they do land 
acknowledgements? 

609
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:01,700
Which we're going to steal, 
right? 

610
00:37:01,700 --> 00:37:05,900
We talked about that, 100%. 
Yeah, I think it is. 

611
00:37:05,900 --> 00:37:09,400
So, Involved that we are 
continuing to address the fact 

612
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:14,700
that we're on Stolen land and 
that we benefit from this idea 

613
00:37:14,700 --> 00:37:20,400
of, you know, putting ization, 
we owned property which is just 

614
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:23,900
a nonsensical idea, which is all
problematic. 

615
00:37:24,100 --> 00:37:32,800
I think we both probably cried 
out of out of Shame and and 

616
00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:35,800
pain. 
We read braiding Sweetgrass, 

617
00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:39,100
right? 
Just wait guilt all day. 

618
00:37:39,700 --> 00:37:41,900
But yeah. 
So if we can just at least 

619
00:37:42,100 --> 00:37:45,700
acknowledge that we have you 
know we're on land that was 

620
00:37:46,300 --> 00:37:49,300
populated and cared for by other
folks it comes out, it's really 

621
00:37:49,300 --> 00:37:50,700
meaningful and we're going to do
that. 

622
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,300
The other thing that I like is 
that the both I think have a 

623
00:37:55,300 --> 00:38:00,000
passion for storytelling and see
that as like a spiritual 

624
00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:03,700
practice and how that can 
definitely add magic to your 

625
00:38:03,700 --> 00:38:05,700
life. 
They're also like beautiful 

626
00:38:05,700 --> 00:38:08,000
trained. 
Calista have this intro song, 

627
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:11,700
where they both sing together, 
the song that they wrote. 

628
00:38:11,700 --> 00:38:15,900
And every time it comes on, I 
totally singing along with them,

629
00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:17,800
which I assume that they know 
that that happens. 

630
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:20,800
But if they don't, well, I hope 
they listen to this because I 

631
00:38:20,808 --> 00:38:22,300
totally am singing along with 
them. 

632
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:27,400
We are not doing that to be 
clear right now that God around.

633
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:32,800
Yeah, Zero Tolerance in the 
singing Spirit. 

634
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:37,800
The the other thing that they 
do, I really like is they do 

635
00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:40,700
great book, reviews, like book 
reviews, where they're not 

636
00:38:40,700 --> 00:38:43,500
trying to give you every point. 
But I think they're they're 

637
00:38:43,500 --> 00:38:45,000
pulling out the most meaningful 
points. 

638
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:48,600
And I think that generally 
reflects things that I have also

639
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:51,000
taken away from books, that 
they've reviewed that I've also 

640
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:53,500
read. 
So I really appreciate that. 

641
00:38:53,500 --> 00:38:57,000
And they also, I think point out
the references, like, oh, 

642
00:38:57,000 --> 00:39:00,200
they're clearly pulling from 
from this reference and talk 

643
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:03,200
about the things that are 
potentially problematic or just 

644
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:08,600
a point of view, not fact, Love 
their book reviews and there's 

645
00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:11,500
also this other interesting 
thing that's going on which is 

646
00:39:13,300 --> 00:39:15,900
Cory is going through, you know,
she's in the time of her life 

647
00:39:15,900 --> 00:39:19,500
where she's having a lot of 
Transitions and I think having a

648
00:39:19,500 --> 00:39:23,200
public experience of what those 
transitions are like trying to 

649
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:28,900
find boundaries and just create 
the life that is most healthy 

650
00:39:28,900 --> 00:39:30,900
for her and she like shares 
about that. 

651
00:39:30,900 --> 00:39:36,100
So I love that that she's like 
being vulnerable and sharing her

652
00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:44,500
Of path and data is she has 
these fits of the feminine rage 

653
00:39:44,500 --> 00:39:47,300
over like social issues. 
And I'm just so here for it. 

654
00:39:47,500 --> 00:39:51,000
Dad saying she goes from 
talking, like I love talking 

655
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:54,000
with trees and she's like death 
to the oppressors and I'm just 

656
00:39:54,000 --> 00:40:00,500
like, it's such a change of 
speed from like, her normal tone

657
00:40:00,500 --> 00:40:06,100
to like, then her angst-filled 
rage fits. 

658
00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:08,800
It's amazing. 
So yeah, highly represent 

659
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:11,200
bonfire Babble. 
They do really fun segments to 

660
00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:14,300
we're like, they start off with 
a topic where they go through 

661
00:40:14,300 --> 00:40:18,400
the citations of a topic. 
They also then get into the 

662
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,300
actual content. 
So citations or major. 

663
00:40:21,300 --> 00:40:25,800
I mean, making sure that you're 
clear around who you're 

664
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:28,500
referencing and where you got 
information to, then Empower 

665
00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:33,300
readers or listeners to find 
their find, the content that 

666
00:40:33,300 --> 00:40:36,100
they themselves can get to the 
source. 

667
00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:38,800
Us and not just take your 
interpretation of that I think 

668
00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:42,200
is super important and we have a
responsibility to do that so 

669
00:40:42,700 --> 00:40:45,300
leather citations. 
Yeah. 

670
00:40:45,700 --> 00:40:48,200
Yeah I love when people like 
note where they getting stuff 

671
00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:51,900
from because so many times I've 
been like that is literally 

672
00:40:51,900 --> 00:40:56,000
contrary to what I know or what 
I've read and so then I can be 

673
00:40:56,008 --> 00:40:57,900
like oh I see where you're going
with this. 

674
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:00,700
Okay I can see what you mean. 
Yeah so I really really 

675
00:41:00,700 --> 00:41:03,900
appreciate when people like cite
your work essentially you know 

676
00:41:03,900 --> 00:41:05,700
let's go back to ninth grade 
high school. 

677
00:41:07,100 --> 00:41:10,000
Let's just say we're we're 
getting it from so that we can 

678
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:13,700
have he'll be more educated. 
Give credit where credit's due. 

679
00:41:13,700 --> 00:41:16,700
You don't have to be the first 
person to think of something to 

680
00:41:16,700 --> 00:41:19,500
then leverage it. 
Like there's beautiful ideas out

681
00:41:19,500 --> 00:41:22,500
there and so long as we give 
shout outs to the creators and 

682
00:41:22,500 --> 00:41:25,600
then also give access to that 
original content. 

683
00:41:25,900 --> 00:41:27,200
I mean, that's kind of what 
we're doing here, right? 

684
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:29,700
We're going to steal some shit 
from other podcasters, but we're

685
00:41:29,708 --> 00:41:31,600
going to say, yeah, where it 
came from. 

686
00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:33,700
So love that, what's next on the
list. 

687
00:41:34,100 --> 00:41:38,000
Oh yeah. 
So I have Which Wednesday's with

688
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:41,100
Steph and Tara originally 
started with both co-host and 

689
00:41:41,100 --> 00:41:43,600
then now they've kind of moved 
to where stuff is really like 

690
00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:46,700
running the show Tara makes 
appearances but then staff also 

691
00:41:46,700 --> 00:41:48,400
has other people kind of come 
on. 

692
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:53,600
They are two witches who are 
also lawyers and their regular 

693
00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:56,800
day today. 
So that is a very interesting 

694
00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:59,700
perspective. 
I think to have two people who 

695
00:41:59,700 --> 00:42:04,200
have this very working within 
the beauty that is the American 

696
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:09,300
justice system and Kind of been 
also working within the system 

697
00:42:09,300 --> 00:42:13,700
of paganism of Witchcraft and 
it's just really interesting to 

698
00:42:13,700 --> 00:42:15,300
see. 
Two people kind of coming from 

699
00:42:15,300 --> 00:42:18,700
those two different Playing 
Fields, find each other one and 

700
00:42:18,700 --> 00:42:23,600
be so like not the same, they're
very kind of perpendicular to 

701
00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:28,200
each other and the way they kind
of, really beautifully mesh 

702
00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:33,100
together and they also have 
really what I really appreciate 

703
00:42:33,100 --> 00:42:35,600
about their podcast. 
When I originally came to it was

704
00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:39,600
they start Art very beginner. 
So they start with very like, 

705
00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:42,300
these are your tools. 
What is salt? 

706
00:42:42,300 --> 00:42:49,000
Why do we use it? 
Basic astrology, Concepts basic 

707
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:52,500
divination Concepts and then as 
time has gone on, they've really

708
00:42:52,500 --> 00:42:55,200
built and built and built. 
So if you followed them from the

709
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:57,500
beginning, you've really like 
built. 

710
00:42:57,500 --> 00:43:01,700
This base knowledge that has 
gone from foundational to now, 

711
00:43:01,700 --> 00:43:06,700
being a lot more abstract to 
really like pulling Together 

712
00:43:06,700 --> 00:43:11,500
loosens and really building 
something different and I just 

713
00:43:11,500 --> 00:43:14,300
love that I love, you know, 
being able to kind of follow a 

714
00:43:14,308 --> 00:43:17,700
podcast from its Inception and 
from its starting point. 

715
00:43:17,700 --> 00:43:21,500
And then that relationship 
really developing over time to 

716
00:43:21,500 --> 00:43:26,800
really build out something 
unique, but also a lot deeper on

717
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:31,100
a lot deeper level. 
What that there's some we should

718
00:43:31,100 --> 00:43:38,400
maybe do an episode on attorney 
which is that this just sparked 

719
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:41,400
an idea for me. 
Like I have a few folks that I 

720
00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:46,800
know are influential which is in
the space that, you know, maybe 

721
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:48,800
have been in the space since the
70s. 

722
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:53,200
Yeah, I love about love about 
attorney which here for it. 

723
00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:55,300
Right. 
Yeah absolutely. 

724
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:01,800
Okay so for me Which space is 
the next one to talk about. 

725
00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:05,200
We have Gemini and Scorpio 
again. 

726
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:10,800
There's like the nurturing mom 
and the and the more like Brash 

727
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:14,000
to the point opinionated not 
interested in being identified 

728
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:17,500
as being nice personality. 
Which, you know, I can begin to 

729
00:44:17,500 --> 00:44:19,700
ever heard of that, that 
compilation. 

730
00:44:21,700 --> 00:44:25,100
Oh my gosh, I love it. 
And they're they're located in 

731
00:44:25,100 --> 00:44:27,600
the Hudson Valley. 
So we get this really great. 

732
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:32,200
Don't know that it's Jersey or 
New York and I know that there's

733
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:34,200
a major difference and some 
people are going to be triggered

734
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:35,800
by me. 
Not even knowing the difference,

735
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:38,700
but I know Scorpio has that 
amazing accent. 

736
00:44:38,700 --> 00:44:42,600
I'm just, I love and so it 
scorpion Jim and I are there the

737
00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:49,400
to co-host and again they do 
amazing book reviews and they've

738
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:53,000
been at it for a minute, so they
have I think just a lot of 

739
00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:55,100
maturity in the content that 
they bring and their 

740
00:44:55,100 --> 00:44:57,700
relationship is clearly 
developed. 

741
00:44:58,100 --> 00:45:01,800
So, So I've been you know, 
following them forever, they 

742
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:04,700
talk a lot about paradigms. 
They nerd out on the recent 

743
00:45:04,700 --> 00:45:08,800
episode about the kind of 
overlap of psychology in 

744
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:12,600
Witchcraft and how young was a 
contemporary of Gerald Gardner. 

745
00:45:13,900 --> 00:45:16,700
My bum. 
I was like, oh shit, they were 

746
00:45:16,700 --> 00:45:19,700
worth the same time. 
They were referencing each other

747
00:45:19,700 --> 00:45:22,700
like you love that. 
So yeah. 

748
00:45:22,700 --> 00:45:26,400
So they are I think one of them 
is a scientist. 

749
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:30,300
I think the other ones a teacher
or once a scientist, teacher at 

750
00:45:30,300 --> 00:45:35,200
any rate there, wonderful, 
brilliant humans and I love 

751
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:37,900
their podcast. 
Nice nice. 

752
00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:42,100
The next one I have up is one of
those that I think is just a 

753
00:45:42,108 --> 00:45:45,300
little bit more. 
The wall and listen, I love 

754
00:45:45,300 --> 00:45:47,300
things that challenge my 
perspective. 

755
00:45:47,300 --> 00:45:52,800
I love things that are like very
different from who I am or 

756
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:54,300
different, from the way my mind 
works. 

757
00:45:54,900 --> 00:45:59,200
And so, this podcast is the real
witches of the end times hosted 

758
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:03,500
by mana mana aelin. 
And the thing that I love about 

759
00:46:03,500 --> 00:46:10,900
them is they are just so 
authentically, informal and just

760
00:46:10,900 --> 00:46:13,200
whatever comes to mind, that's 
what they're going to say. 

761
00:46:13,900 --> 00:46:16,200
And I love that. 
So they are also at are Rito 

762
00:46:16,300 --> 00:46:19,300
reader. 
Most of their episodes have a 

763
00:46:19,300 --> 00:46:23,500
guest that has some kind of 
different specialty that they 

764
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:26,200
kind of use that episode to both
educate. 

765
00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:29,400
And like broaden people's 
understanding of that topic and 

766
00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:34,500
those topics range from like my 
gosh, possession to 

767
00:46:34,500 --> 00:46:41,800
ghost-hunting to werewolf like 
subculture, like just all over 

768
00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:48,900
the place and I love it so much.
The episode titles are just like

769
00:46:48,900 --> 00:46:53,200
a clip of the actual episode 
itself, and it's just like a 

770
00:46:53,200 --> 00:46:55,000
verbage from that. 
So you really don't know what 

771
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:56,400
you're clicking on. 
Exactly. 

772
00:46:56,700 --> 00:47:01,300
Unless you read the sub notes 
and I just love it so much. 

773
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:04,900
I love things that like are just
kind of off the wall and let me 

774
00:47:04,900 --> 00:47:09,300
kind of get my Wheel of Fortune 
knowledge together, you know, 

775
00:47:09,300 --> 00:47:12,100
just random whatever comes to 
mind. 

776
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:16,900
I she ate them so much and I 
really enjoy like logging in to 

777
00:47:16,900 --> 00:47:20,500
the next episode and not having 
any idea what rollercoaster I'm 

778
00:47:20,500 --> 00:47:23,200
about to be on. 
That's so fun. 

779
00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:25,800
I love about I love that 
person's name. 

780
00:47:25,800 --> 00:47:28,100
Say that again, it's Manna 
what's management. 

781
00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:30,300
So they don't normally use their
last. 

782
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:33,700
Well, what's listed as a last 
name aelon they just hey, it's 

783
00:47:33,700 --> 00:47:36,400
Mana. 
So as I was typing that was 

784
00:47:36,400 --> 00:47:38,700
like, I don't know if I've ever 
heard them, say their last name.

785
00:47:38,700 --> 00:47:41,900
So hopefully, aylan is correct. 
If not, you can totally come on 

786
00:47:41,900 --> 00:47:44,400
our podcast. 
An amazing nail us. 

787
00:47:45,100 --> 00:47:47,700
Yes. 
Come to clarify your name for us

788
00:47:47,700 --> 00:47:54,000
and I actually, you know, 
peeking Your notes before this 

789
00:47:54,000 --> 00:47:57,600
episode, I had not heard a 
single episode of this podcast 

790
00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:02,700
so I had to check it out on my 
walk this morning and they had I

791
00:48:02,700 --> 00:48:05,000
chosen episode again not knowing
what it was going to be about. 

792
00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:08,500
But Pennsylvania, Dutch magic, 
did you hear that episode? 

793
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:10,700
Yes. 
Oh my gosh, so cool. 

794
00:48:10,700 --> 00:48:12,400
I didn't even realize that the 
Pennsylvania. 

795
00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:14,700
Dutch. 
Were not Dutch, right? 

796
00:48:14,700 --> 00:48:16,800
So interesting. 
Yeah, so interesting. 

797
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:21,400
Yeah, I love that. 
I love having a totally new 

798
00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:22,800
point of view. 
On some topics. 

799
00:48:22,800 --> 00:48:27,200
And yeah, I'm certainly I'm not 
a fantasy person. 

800
00:48:27,700 --> 00:48:31,100
I'm not, like I'm not, it's I 
know that's polarizing. 

801
00:48:31,100 --> 00:48:33,100
Like I'm not here for Lord of 
the Rings. 

802
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:40,200
You might have heard people. 
I know, I know, but so I'm like,

803
00:48:40,300 --> 00:48:42,800
hmm, werewolves? 
I feel resistance, but maybe, 

804
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:45,200
that means, I should listen to 
it, right? 

805
00:48:45,500 --> 00:48:47,300
Yeah. 
Like I, you know, it's just not 

806
00:48:47,300 --> 00:48:51,300
something I've ever picked up 
and honestly on my own of my own

807
00:48:51,300 --> 00:48:55,300
choosing, I don't know. 
I would pick it up, but kind of 

808
00:48:55,300 --> 00:48:58,100
loving that podcast has kind of 
been, like, well, let me just, 

809
00:48:58,100 --> 00:48:59,900
let me just hear it. 
We're just here at someone has 

810
00:48:59,900 --> 00:49:01,300
to say about it. 
Let me just see how. 

811
00:49:01,600 --> 00:49:03,900
And then I learn all this stuff 
that I'm like, cool. 

812
00:49:03,900 --> 00:49:06,500
Well, at least now I have that 
again, foundational knowledge, 

813
00:49:06,500 --> 00:49:10,800
that if somebody is like, I'm 
really into werewolf mythology, 

814
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:12,400
cool. 
Let me tell you everything that 

815
00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:16,200
I've learned from my friend Mana
here and there guess, right? 

816
00:49:16,700 --> 00:49:20,500
Yeah, and I think it's too, it's
often like I can hear a message 

817
00:49:20,600 --> 00:49:24,500
more easily. 
If I, I trust the person who's 

818
00:49:24,500 --> 00:49:28,600
delivering the message and I 
think that this person is a 

819
00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:31,700
Smart Cookie who's presenting 
with percent some interesting 

820
00:49:31,700 --> 00:49:33,100
facts and I love that. 
Yeah. 

821
00:49:33,900 --> 00:49:35,900
Okay, so I'm going to go to the 
next one. 

822
00:49:35,900 --> 00:49:40,200
Again, these are in no 
particular order, this podcast 

823
00:49:40,200 --> 00:49:45,300
comes out very infrequently 
which, you know, as somebody who

824
00:49:45,300 --> 00:49:49,000
can see this being a daunting 
task, I can understand why they 

825
00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:52,000
would want to not. 
Try to over-deliver. 

826
00:49:52,200 --> 00:49:55,700
Frequency of their podcast, but 
this one is which with books. 

827
00:49:56,600 --> 00:50:01,400
And so the primary presenter is 
Jason Mann Ki and the host 

828
00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:05,200
Meghan Rosen. 
Breyer, I believe is how you say

829
00:50:05,300 --> 00:50:14,200
their last name they are two 
very learned' which is Jason is 

830
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:18,100
a prolific author for Llewellyn 
and is just constantly writing 

831
00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:22,000
and Meg is also, I believe she's
even lie. 

832
00:50:22,100 --> 00:50:25,200
A librarian if I want to 
misquote that, somebody can fact

833
00:50:25,200 --> 00:50:28,100
check me, I can come back and 
edit this if that's not true. 

834
00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:34,100
But so they have a just review 
books, they talk about, you 

835
00:50:34,100 --> 00:50:37,500
know, different seasons book. 
Releases what new books are? 

836
00:50:37,500 --> 00:50:41,800
They talk about some neighboring
authors on and talk about their 

837
00:50:41,800 --> 00:50:46,900
works and their points of view. 
And so yeah, if I can get, like,

838
00:50:46,900 --> 00:50:50,200
hyped up about a book and like 
know where the authors coming 

839
00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:52,700
from and their point of view and
know like Where those points of 

840
00:50:52,700 --> 00:50:55,500
view, contrast and get other 
people's thoughts on the book 

841
00:50:55,500 --> 00:50:58,700
before I even approach a book, I
feel like it's easier for me to 

842
00:50:58,700 --> 00:51:01,900
dive into the content. 
And because I'm so questioning 

843
00:51:02,600 --> 00:51:04,600
about everything, like, well, 
where'd you get that? 

844
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:06,200
What's your citation, is that 
your opinion? 

845
00:51:06,200 --> 00:51:08,600
Is that a fact, right? 
Like all of those things are 

846
00:51:08,600 --> 00:51:11,500
always going through my brain. 
When I'm reading a book, being 

847
00:51:11,500 --> 00:51:16,200
able to have a kind of intro to 
the book before I read, it is 

848
00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:18,200
really useful. 
So I just I really love this 

849
00:51:18,200 --> 00:51:23,100
podcast and I've read many a new
book that I would have not 

850
00:51:23,100 --> 00:51:26,600
otherwise known about because of
them so love it. 

851
00:51:26,900 --> 00:51:31,100
JC I think he's also a really 
fun author in a really 

852
00:51:31,100 --> 00:51:34,600
approachable way. 
His work on the horned. 

853
00:51:34,600 --> 00:51:37,200
God's is really influential to 
me. 

854
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:40,500
So, love that. 
Love a good. 

855
00:51:40,500 --> 00:51:42,900
A good podcast. 
That just makes my ever-growing 

856
00:51:42,900 --> 00:51:44,900
list of books. 
Just even longer, you know, what

857
00:51:44,900 --> 00:51:47,300
I mean? 
Enough books to last me the rest

858
00:51:47,300 --> 00:51:52,000
of my lifetime, oh my gosh, that
list is so long. 

859
00:51:52,900 --> 00:51:55,900
And then I think the next one up
for me is the one that kind of 

860
00:51:55,900 --> 00:51:58,900
intersects for both of us. 
And so, if you are an avid 

861
00:51:58,900 --> 00:52:03,700
podcast listener, particularly 
in the garden Aryans fear, this 

862
00:52:03,700 --> 00:52:07,200
one probably shouldn't be a 
surprise to anyone. 

863
00:52:07,900 --> 00:52:14,500
So for me, seeking witchcraft is
such a great podcast because 

864
00:52:14,500 --> 00:52:19,400
it's really what kind of led me 
down this path to where I am in 

865
00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:21,900
traditional really Wicca? 
Yeah, yeah. 

866
00:52:22,100 --> 00:52:25,100
Yeah. 
I was you know podcasting and I 

867
00:52:25,100 --> 00:52:27,700
you know just listening to 
different points of view trying 

868
00:52:27,700 --> 00:52:32,900
to get out of the folk magic 
sphere and trying to listen to 

869
00:52:32,900 --> 00:52:35,500
things that are just different 
and get some different 

870
00:52:35,500 --> 00:52:37,400
perspectives. 
And so when I came across 

871
00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:42,500
Ashley's podcast she came up, 
very came out just very 

872
00:52:42,500 --> 00:52:46,400
authentically her very you know,
real with words that she didn't 

873
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:50,300
like try to misrepresent herself
as being a witch with all of the

874
00:52:50,300 --> 00:52:52,900
knowledge and all of the Had 
perspective. 

875
00:52:52,900 --> 00:52:55,100
She was like, Hey, I'm a seeker 
and these are the things I'm 

876
00:52:55,100 --> 00:52:56,700
learning. 
Here are some other people who 

877
00:52:56,700 --> 00:52:59,500
are kind of where I'm at and are
learning the same things and 

878
00:52:59,700 --> 00:53:03,300
here's our thoughts, and I think
it's been really awesome to 

879
00:53:03,300 --> 00:53:06,000
watch. 
Ashley kind of grow with her 

880
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:08,900
podcast and, you know, double 
back later and episodes and say,

881
00:53:08,900 --> 00:53:11,800
hey, I think we said this 
earlier, but this is actually, 

882
00:53:12,100 --> 00:53:15,600
you know, more accurate are, 
these are things that I said 

883
00:53:15,600 --> 00:53:17,200
than that. 
Now, maybe I've changed my mind 

884
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:20,500
about in the face of other 
facts, other points of view, 

885
00:53:21,000 --> 00:53:25,200
which I think more people should
do, you know, in the face of 

886
00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:28,700
things that are, maybe not who 
you are anymore. 

887
00:53:28,700 --> 00:53:32,000
You know, as you grow and 
changer, maybe someone has 

888
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:34,500
brought it to your attention, 
that things are problematic, 

889
00:53:34,900 --> 00:53:38,100
great, change your mind, okay? 
Right. 

890
00:53:38,100 --> 00:53:40,300
That is the tenant of critical 
thinking. 

891
00:53:40,300 --> 00:53:41,600
Let's do it more often, you 
know. 

892
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:45,900
And so I just, I really loved 
this podcast because you kind of

893
00:53:45,900 --> 00:53:50,500
followed her from Seeker to 
initiate to now managing, and 

894
00:53:50,500 --> 00:53:54,500
running her own coven. 
And Just it's been this really 

895
00:53:54,500 --> 00:53:59,100
great ride to kind of follow 
along as I am kind of following 

896
00:53:59,100 --> 00:54:01,500
that same path. 
What about you Oak? 

897
00:54:01,500 --> 00:54:03,000
How are you feeling about? 
My God. 

898
00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:06,800
Damn, you had the such a like 40
and moment there where you're 

899
00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:09,900
like she's managing a covenant. 
I love it. 

900
00:54:12,100 --> 00:54:14,600
She's The High Priestess of the 
coven, but I love that you're 

901
00:54:14,600 --> 00:54:17,500
like there's a bunch of fucking 
Logistics and the shit's hog. 

902
00:54:17,700 --> 00:54:20,300
You're dealing with people and 
I'm sure it's a shit show and 

903
00:54:20,300 --> 00:54:21,900
it's just management. 
I love it. 

904
00:54:22,100 --> 00:54:26,300
As a people manager myself, that
is 100%. 

905
00:54:26,300 --> 00:54:28,200
My brain goes is, I'm like, 
alright. 

906
00:54:28,200 --> 00:54:31,300
So we gotta hurt all of these 
people and ideas, and thoughts 

907
00:54:31,300 --> 00:54:34,500
and it schedules all into the 
same place and make them all 

908
00:54:34,500 --> 00:54:36,500
work together. 
Yes. 

909
00:54:38,300 --> 00:54:43,400
So I am and have been for a long
time, like a self-help junkie. 

910
00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:49,700
You know, I came from a very 
traumatic and, and difficult 

911
00:54:49,700 --> 00:54:55,100
childhood and so the Way that I 
have approached, my life often 

912
00:54:55,100 --> 00:54:59,100
is through the lens of self-help
and like I was watching Oprah 

913
00:54:59,100 --> 00:55:02,400
when I was like, you know, 12 
and 8. 

914
00:55:02,900 --> 00:55:08,800
So I am really big self-help 
person and so that led me early 

915
00:55:08,800 --> 00:55:13,500
on to a lot of podcasts when 
that was kind of a new medium to

916
00:55:13,500 --> 00:55:15,600
listening to. 
A lot of people interview 

917
00:55:16,100 --> 00:55:19,500
thought leaders in the self-help
space and so I am very 

918
00:55:19,500 --> 00:55:26,700
particular About how people are 
interviewed to a fault, like my 

919
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:32,000
have unrealistic expectations of
interviews and therefore, you 

920
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:36,200
know, for me, it would be kind 
of intense. 

921
00:55:36,200 --> 00:55:39,000
And, and may be nerve-wracking 
for me to interview somebody 

922
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:41,000
just because I was holding it up
to these like really high 

923
00:55:41,000 --> 00:55:43,800
standards of like Oprah. 
Interviewing if I can like 

924
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:49,400
Deepak or Eckhart Tolle like, 
you know, she's kind of the 

925
00:55:49,400 --> 00:55:52,300
best, so, Right, you probably 
weren't gonna do that. 

926
00:55:52,300 --> 00:55:56,400
So here he's someone, I mean to 
me, as you said, you know, she's

927
00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:59,800
definitely grown with her 
podcast and heard the initial 

928
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:04,000
episodes, you know? 
Like we're her interviewing 

929
00:56:04,000 --> 00:56:07,900
people and the way that she did 
it in perfectly but continue to 

930
00:56:07,900 --> 00:56:12,400
move forward confidently and 
unapologetically, it's really 

931
00:56:12,400 --> 00:56:16,500
inspiring honestly to that 
sounds also like an underhanded 

932
00:56:16,500 --> 00:56:19,300
compliment like oh you're so 
brave. 

933
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:24,800
I'm super bitchy but really 
like, I think it opened up my 

934
00:56:24,800 --> 00:56:28,000
point of view because I was 
still able to hear the message 

935
00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:30,100
clearly from the people that she
was interviewing. 

936
00:56:30,500 --> 00:56:34,400
And she's definitely gotten 
better at it over the seasons 

937
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:37,000
and episodes. 
And so I appreciate her 

938
00:56:37,000 --> 00:56:40,400
confidence in the and not being 
perfect and being flawed. 

939
00:56:40,400 --> 00:56:44,700
So, yeah, I mean, to me that's 
really commendable and the 

940
00:56:44,700 --> 00:56:46,800
people that she interviews as 
well. 

941
00:56:47,700 --> 00:56:50,600
I have really enjoyed learning 
from her. 

942
00:56:50,800 --> 00:56:53,900
A high priest and her High 
Priestess has easels, really an 

943
00:56:53,900 --> 00:56:56,200
interesting person. 
That I'd love to probably 

944
00:56:56,200 --> 00:56:59,400
interview more and now she has a
high priest that she's working 

945
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:01,400
with Sheamus. 
No, no. 

946
00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:04,500
The other way around her High 
Priestess Sheamus and her now 

947
00:57:04,500 --> 00:57:07,300
high priest that she's working 
with her partner, is as easily 

948
00:57:07,300 --> 00:57:14,500
as easel has a podcast called 
Feast of torches, and he is a 

949
00:57:14,500 --> 00:57:16,400
really knowledgeable person. 
Have you listened to that one? 

950
00:57:16,900 --> 00:57:19,900
Yeah, yeah. 
Okay, but we have to get his 

951
00:57:19,900 --> 00:57:24,300
easel like a microphone or a 
program because the volumes all 

952
00:57:24,300 --> 00:57:27,700
over the place, but he is so 
smart and has such good 

953
00:57:27,700 --> 00:57:30,100
information, so highly recommend
it. 

954
00:57:30,300 --> 00:57:34,100
You might have to play with your
own volumes settings to get 

955
00:57:34,100 --> 00:57:34,600
through. 
Some of those. 

956
00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:37,000
Yeah, do not recommend in the 
car. 

957
00:57:37,600 --> 00:57:40,300
Where said that, you like blow 
your speaker's out and then all 

958
00:57:40,308 --> 00:57:42,000
of a sudden, you're like, I 
can't hear what's going on. 

959
00:57:43,000 --> 00:57:45,900
But again, I know and I hate to 
be like, I mean, because 

960
00:57:45,900 --> 00:57:48,700
honestly, on some level, we're 
reviewing these podcasts to be. 

961
00:57:49,500 --> 00:57:53,000
We want you to come on our 
podcast, want you, and we want 

962
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:55,200
to go on your podcast. 
And so we're totally being like 

963
00:57:56,000 --> 00:57:59,300
on one hand cutting their house.
On the other hand being like, so

964
00:57:59,300 --> 00:58:01,300
like your volumes. 
You're gonna have to like work 

965
00:58:01,300 --> 00:58:06,500
on that, but I think it's 
important to retain a critical 

966
00:58:06,500 --> 00:58:09,300
point of view and not just kiss 
people's asses. 

967
00:58:09,300 --> 00:58:11,000
So I think they'll appreciate 
her honesty. 

968
00:58:11,200 --> 00:58:14,400
But yeah. 
So meaningful the Garden area 

969
00:58:14,400 --> 00:58:17,900
and topics that they cover 
really useful to your point 

970
00:58:17,900 --> 00:58:21,400
around. 
Ashley changing her mind. 

971
00:58:21,500 --> 00:58:24,000
Like starting are you. 
I'm specifically the thing that 

972
00:58:24,000 --> 00:58:26,900
sticks out to me is her take on 
Sky plat and how she took us 

973
00:58:26,900 --> 00:58:29,600
through the Journey of being 
like really resistant to the 

974
00:58:29,600 --> 00:58:33,500
idea of nudity and ritual nudity
and then kind of coming around 

975
00:58:33,500 --> 00:58:35,800
and changing her mind. 
Was that the thing that you're 

976
00:58:35,800 --> 00:58:38,900
thinking about no actually sir. 
I was thinking about they did a 

977
00:58:38,908 --> 00:58:42,400
wheel of the Year episode where 
they were talking about kind of 

978
00:58:42,400 --> 00:58:48,700
some of the column base level 
but some of the like, slap on 

979
00:58:48,800 --> 00:58:52,700
That titles for those sabbats. 
And so yeah very confidently was

980
00:58:52,700 --> 00:58:55,300
like am a bond and this is and 
then she had a future episode 

981
00:58:55,300 --> 00:58:58,200
where she was like actually met 
bonds made up that's not a 

982
00:58:58,200 --> 00:59:01,000
thing. 
Someone just slap that name on 

983
00:59:01,000 --> 00:59:03,700
there. 
So then just like coming back 

984
00:59:03,700 --> 00:59:05,500
and doing a whole episode about 
hey, we presented this 

985
00:59:05,500 --> 00:59:09,300
information and now we'd like to
like build out that information 

986
00:59:09,300 --> 00:59:12,200
and make sure that you guys have
a more in-depth understanding 

987
00:59:12,200 --> 00:59:14,200
about like where did these 
titles come from? 

988
00:59:15,100 --> 00:59:18,300
How quote-unquote. 
Legitimate are they and what are

989
00:59:18,300 --> 00:59:20,700
maybe some Some other things 
that are out there that you 

990
00:59:20,700 --> 00:59:23,600
should know about. 
And she has so many of those 

991
00:59:23,600 --> 00:59:26,800
examples though where I just 
really appreciate someone kind 

992
00:59:26,800 --> 00:59:30,800
of diving back in and saying, 
oh, you know what some something

993
00:59:30,800 --> 00:59:34,500
or someone has made me wiser. 
And now I'd like to share that 

994
00:59:34,500 --> 00:59:36,800
wealth of knowledge with you 
instead of like a doubling down 

995
00:59:36,800 --> 00:59:42,200
on being wrong. 
I love that totally totally, 

996
00:59:42,200 --> 00:59:47,900
yeah, I feel like with this 
sabbats, you know, in astrology.

997
00:59:48,200 --> 00:59:51,300
Well, Good. 
Fuck. 

998
00:59:51,500 --> 00:59:54,300
Okay. 
Come back to astrology. 

999
00:59:57,200 --> 00:59:59,400
Okay. 
So, but legitimately and 

1000
00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:04,500
astrology, one of the big like, 
bust your bubble Revelation 

1001
01:00:04,500 --> 01:00:07,200
moments is that there's 
different house systems. 

1002
01:00:07,200 --> 01:00:10,200
So, you know, of course, there's
the planets and there's the 

1003
01:00:10,200 --> 01:00:13,100
astrological signs, and then 
there's like, how systems, 

1004
01:00:13,100 --> 01:00:14,700
right? 
So one first, I'll second house 

1005
01:00:14,700 --> 01:00:18,300
their house all is that, are you
familiar with all those ideas? 

1006
01:00:19,000 --> 01:00:21,600
Yes. 
As a very base level 

1007
01:00:21,600 --> 01:00:25,700
understanding if your novice I 
am like whatever is below that 

1008
01:00:26,700 --> 01:00:30,300
but you've heard the word. 
Yes I'm familiar with a base 

1009
01:00:30,300 --> 01:00:35,800
level constant, so the how 
systems it's a pluralization, 

1010
01:00:35,800 --> 01:00:40,500
how systems there's multiple 
systems which means that there's

1011
01:00:40,500 --> 01:00:44,700
placidus there's whole sign. 
Their tropical there are 

1012
01:00:45,400 --> 01:00:49,500
different schools of thought 
about what actually and Where 

1013
01:00:49,900 --> 01:00:53,800
and how much, how large a house 
system in terms of the degrees 

1014
01:00:54,700 --> 01:00:58,000
exist? 
And so, the reason I say, all of

1015
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:04,000
this is to say that in 
astrology, there's differing 

1016
01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:06,300
points of view and on some 
level, you get to a place where 

1017
01:01:06,300 --> 01:01:11,900
you're like, how are all of 
these quote-unquote gurus, 

1018
01:01:12,100 --> 01:01:15,900
experts people who have been in 
the space so long Masters 

1019
01:01:15,900 --> 01:01:18,100
really? 
How can they have a different 

1020
01:01:18,100 --> 01:01:19,600
point of view? 
Like there has to be one real 

1021
01:01:19,600 --> 01:01:24,500
truth and I kind of approach 
that suspension of disbelief or 

1022
01:01:24,500 --> 01:01:28,100
the not needing a right answer 
in how I look at the sabbats 

1023
01:01:28,100 --> 01:01:31,900
right where wait, mabon is in me
Bond. 

1024
01:01:32,100 --> 01:01:35,400
What do you mean somebody made 
that up in the 60s to like fill 

1025
01:01:35,400 --> 01:01:38,300
a spot? 
What that can be a real like 

1026
01:01:39,100 --> 01:01:42,000
throw the baby out with the 
bathwater moment if it like jars

1027
01:01:42,000 --> 01:01:43,900
you to the point where like oh 
should I been lied to? 

1028
01:01:43,900 --> 01:01:47,700
But it's like I approach 
religion as as I say it's 

1029
01:01:47,700 --> 01:01:50,400
possible that it has a Whose 
Line Is It. 

1030
01:01:50,400 --> 01:01:53,500
Anyway, approach where, you 
know, the points don't matter 

1031
01:01:53,500 --> 01:01:57,800
and it's all made up like it's 
possible that this is all just 

1032
01:01:57,800 --> 01:02:01,000
made up. 
And and and it doesn't matter so

1033
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:04,600
long as it has meaning. 
But yeah, I think the whole 

1034
01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:08,600
mabon take is real funny to me 
it reminded me of like, wait, 

1035
01:02:08,600 --> 01:02:10,800
there's multiple house systems 
with the fuck? 

1036
01:02:13,300 --> 01:02:16,100
Yeah. 
Yeah, so that's, you know, 

1037
01:02:16,100 --> 01:02:19,600
that's what I really appreciate.
I guess about that podcast is 

1038
01:02:20,200 --> 01:02:23,200
the the willingness to be wrong,
man. 

1039
01:02:23,200 --> 01:02:25,600
I love that. 
I love that in people to just in

1040
01:02:25,600 --> 01:02:28,400
general, like the willingness to
be like, this is what I thought 

1041
01:02:28,500 --> 01:02:31,500
and I don't think that anymore. 
So here we are. 

1042
01:02:31,600 --> 01:02:36,400
Well, I thought that we would 
have be able to fill an hour but

1043
01:02:36,400 --> 01:02:39,100
I was wrong and look at us never
should. 

1044
01:02:41,500 --> 01:02:45,000
Hopefully I mean I don't know. 
I'm not a person that Cares 

1045
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:46,700
about how long a podcast is, 
right? 

1046
01:02:46,700 --> 01:02:49,900
Look, I'll listen to it in 
chunks and so hopefully, our 

1047
01:02:50,000 --> 01:02:53,000
listeners feel the same and, you
know, maybe we won't have 

1048
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:56,600
blisters, is it fucking matter, 
but I'm fine with it. 

1049
01:02:56,600 --> 01:02:59,300
Hour-long episode, I don't know.
We didn't talk about the 

1050
01:02:59,300 --> 01:03:01,400
acceptable length of an episode 
or you in the same boat. 

1051
01:03:01,400 --> 01:03:03,600
Or do you feel different? 
Yeah, no I mean I think you read

1052
01:03:03,600 --> 01:03:04,800
all these things out there right
there. 

1053
01:03:04,800 --> 01:03:09,000
Like the average most successful
episode is 22 minutes long and 

1054
01:03:09,000 --> 01:03:11,800
I'm like that is just enough 
time for you and me to like tell

1055
01:03:11,800 --> 01:03:13,400
you where I'm at mentally for 
the day. 

1056
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:15,900
I don't remember. 
Enough time to do it. 

1057
01:03:18,100 --> 01:03:20,700
So, yeah, I don't have any 
preference. 

1058
01:03:20,700 --> 01:03:23,800
Of course listeners, if you 
would like to give us your 

1059
01:03:23,800 --> 01:03:26,200
opinion. 
Yeah, please write us and review

1060
01:03:26,200 --> 01:03:30,300
us. 
However, I just want to put all 

1061
01:03:30,300 --> 01:03:32,800
of that information out there 
rather than give people kind of 

1062
01:03:32,800 --> 01:03:37,200
these Snippets of information 
that are very depersonalized in,

1063
01:03:37,200 --> 01:03:40,200
aren't you know, you and me come
sitting back and forth enjoying 

1064
01:03:40,200 --> 01:03:45,200
this time in the space. 
Yes, yes, yes, I love this. 

1065
01:03:45,200 --> 01:03:47,400
So if they tell us, they wanted 
to be shorter, it will just say 

1066
01:03:47,600 --> 01:03:51,700
you know, you can do stopped in 
the middle, there's any come 

1067
01:03:51,700 --> 01:03:54,900
back to it because right? 
ER we have things to say, okay, 

1068
01:03:54,900 --> 01:03:59,800
we're here we're queer. 
We have things to say and that's

1069
01:03:59,800 --> 01:04:02,700
okay, all of those things are 
accurate to. 

1070
01:04:05,700 --> 01:04:08,800
All right cool. 
Well we also we talked about 

1071
01:04:08,800 --> 01:04:14,000
crowdsourcing a What's the 
opposite of an intro? 

1072
01:04:14,000 --> 01:04:22,300
An extra of farewell, write a 
story to tell it. 

1073
01:04:22,700 --> 01:04:28,900
I think I should wait episodes 
about actual construction and 

1074
01:04:28,900 --> 01:04:31,400
maybe screwing up and circle, 
maybe a whole episode. 

1075
01:04:31,400 --> 01:04:34,400
I'm like ways. 
You can mess up like lighting 

1076
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:38,100
your garments on fire or any of 
those things which have really 

1077
01:04:38,100 --> 01:04:39,400
had. 
One of the one of the like 

1078
01:04:39,400 --> 01:04:43,700
number one rules and podcasting 
is don't have I'd suggest don't 

1079
01:04:43,700 --> 01:04:47,300
know about and we just I think 
we're breaking all of the roles.

1080
01:04:47,300 --> 01:04:53,500
We are such Rebels were so brave
or dining room. 

1081
01:04:53,600 --> 01:04:59,800
Okay, we should do a temporary 
placeholder hanging out Pro. 

1082
01:04:59,800 --> 01:05:04,700
Okay, what's the opposite of N 
Out outro? 

1083
01:05:04,700 --> 01:05:06,100
It's called an outro. 
Thank you. 

1084
01:05:06,400 --> 01:05:07,900
That's why they pay you the big 
bucks Danny. 

1085
01:05:08,600 --> 01:05:10,100
That's why they put you in 
charge of people. 

1086
01:05:11,700 --> 01:05:14,500
You're so smart. 
It's just thick. 

1087
01:05:14,500 --> 01:05:17,800
It's not my brand. 
Yeah, that big ol bernier's. 

1088
01:05:18,200 --> 01:05:22,000
Thanks for joining us. 
This has been to real witches. 

1089
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:24,300
I'm Oak. 
And I'm Danny. 

1090
01:05:25,200 --> 01:05:31,500
And until next time lastly A and
B. 

1091
01:05:31,500 --> 01:05:36,100
Well, okay, blessed, be and be 
well. 

1092
01:05:37,300 --> 01:05:38,000
Okay, I'll stop now.