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And welcome everybody to another
episode of smart money Circle. 

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I'm your host, Adam, sorry. 
Han with me today is CC legged 

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or whose co-founder of options 
AI which is a new brokerage firm

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that makes options, spreads 
enjoyable and straightforward 

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with an easy-to-use visual, 
which I love visual platform CC,

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welcome, welcome to the smart 
money Circle and thank you for 

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coming on the show. 
Great to meet you. 

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So likewise so CeCe, can you 
tell us a little about your 

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story and how you got to where 
you are today? 

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They sure so, well, I was an 
options Market maker but right 

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now, the college. 
And so, you know, I was in New 

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York on the floor of the 
American Stock Exchange way. 

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Back when before everything was 
completely computerized and you 

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know, I did that for years and 
then at some point, I left that 

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and I was doing a lot of options
and trading education was 

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working with some, you know, 
some people that are on CNBC and

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things like that and started 
seeing the Action space 

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particularly in the trading 
space through the eye of the 

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retail investor a little bit 
more when you're on the options 

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Market making side. 
You know you're essentially it's

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all sort of faceless like you 
can see if something's from 

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Goldman Sachs you can see if 
something's retail you don't 

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really get a sense of like the 
intention behind all of that 

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order flow and then, you know, 
working with a little bit, you 

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know, as an educator and working
with a retail audience and 

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seeing how people were using 
options. 

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And seeing that there was like, 
You know, sort of a big void in 

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a big difference between the way
institutions is options in the 

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way, you know, retail investors,
everyday investors, use options,

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seeing that difference was sort 
of the inspiration behind 

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options II, which was, you know,
options trading, platforms and 

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brokerages, haven't really 
changed in 40 years. 

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I mean, there were 12 and 
whistles and all, but it's still

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this focus of, you know, 
platforms that don't really look

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that different than You know, 
back when I was on the trading 

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floor walls of numbers options 
Chains, It's Greeks, it's all of

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this sort of, you know, like 
esoteric knowledge. 

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That's really intimidating for 
the retail audience. 

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And unfortunately what comes 
from that is that, you know, 

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retail investors reach for the 
things in options that they can 

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understand really quickly. 
And that tends to be things like

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buying call. 
Al's or buying puts and things 

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like that. 
And so what that ends up looking

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like from an order flow 
perspective is retail order. 

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Flow is generally, looks like 
lottery tickets, right? 

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It's people being like you know,
scanning and options. 

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Chain saying I can afford a $1 
call what if this stock went up 

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right? 
I've been worth $2. 

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Yeah that ugly and whereas 
institutional option order flow 

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is much more you know sort of 
well thought out. 

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You know, for lack of a better 
term. 

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It's you know, it's sort of 
using options as a plan it's 

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using options around portfolios,
existing positions, its 

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positioning for a move in a 
stock that they like, or hate, 

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you know, in the case of a hedge
fund, in a way where it's like, 

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you know, this, we want to 
position for this stock going, 

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15% higher over the next few 
months. 

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We don't want to waste money 
thinking that it could go up 

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50%, right? 
Because that the chances of that

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happening are unlikely. 
So that so what ends up looking 

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like is the way, institutional 
order flow looks, it's multi 

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like options trades. 
It's, you know, it's creating 

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zones of profitability and 
defined risk lost it in the 

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options chain if you can imagine
that. 

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Yeah, so yeah, it's interesting.
You and I but to some people 

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it's a, it's a real blind spot. 
They don't look at that side of 

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the equation, right? 
And so when we went and sat 

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down, To build options, AI. 
We were like, alright, well 

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let's sort of tear up the 
entire, you know, game plan up 

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until that point. 
We purposely did not look at a 

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lot of other products and we 
started thinking, you know, like

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how do we how do us like 
ourselves as experts, see the 

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options market and we see it 
much differently than a wall of 

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numbers are at least most of us.
And it's more, you know, we 

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decided that this should be 
highly visual. 

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You know, most investors and 
most Traders are looking at 

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stock charts, right? 
And then I would love to buy the

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stock down here. 
Where's the stock went up here? 

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I'd probably sell right. 
We're here, I'm confused and I'm

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not quite sure what I would want
to do, right? 

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And the options Market provides 
all of that, those sorts of 

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opportunities to buy low, sell 
High, create income from a stock

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going sideways. 
And all of those things you can 

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really picture. 
It's, you start to think of the 

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options chain out into the 
future as sort of these levels 

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of, you know, where I could, you
know, be a seller or buyer or 

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you know, ad Bridge, you know, 
all of those sorts of things. 

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And so what we did is we based 
everything around a 

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visualization of the options 
market. 

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So at options. 
AI, you see the historical chart

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and then you do a visualization 
of the future. 

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And that future is basically all
the options chain drawn out with

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expectations from the options 
market. 

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And then based on the side, the 
has expectations are based on 

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the Greeks or add. 
They how do you bases 

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expectations. 
Yeah so it's basically it is and

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Even thinking, you know, how you
got to the Greeks is basically 

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just buyers and sellers, right? 
Okay. 

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So the same way that the 
historical stock prices were 

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buyers meeting Sellers and you 
know, Finding consensus. 

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And then, you know, one side of 
the trade name wrong, right? 

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Yeah. 
It's Market is doing the same 

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thing and in the beauty of the 
options Market is, it's 

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incredibly efficient, right? 
And it includes every person 

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from the Robin Hood Trader with 
$500 in there. 

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All the way up to Goldman Sachs,
right? 

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And it's all of those people's 
expectations out into the future

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and so when you get into like 
sort of the Greeks and things is

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the options Market creates 
something that you know, options

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Traders, call the expected move,
right? 

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The expected move the easiest 
way to think of that and to 

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visualize that is it is 
basically like the point spread 

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on a football game. 
So if a stock is $100 and 

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they're about to report Quarter 
earnings. 

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Then the options Market is doing
a price of. 

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We're all of those expectations 
in the future, think that stock 

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could move higher or lower and 
that comes out as the expected 

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move. 
And so let's say a 100 dollar 

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stock, the options Market is 
expecting a move of eight 

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dollars on earnings. 
Well, that means that we can 

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draw that out into the future 
for that week of earnings and 

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say, you know, the options 
Market is pricing to move 

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anywhere from 90 to die. 
Is to $108 right now, that 

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doesn't mean that it's going to 
happen, right? 

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That means that's where 
everybody has put their options.

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That's a consensus and S sounds,
right? 

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Yeah, so to go to do any sort 
of, you know, we would make the 

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argument before you do any 
investment or any trade or 

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particularly any options trade. 
How could you not like first 

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look at that information, right?
Because if you're like, oh I'm 

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really bearish this company's 
done. 

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They're you know they're going 
to miss It's like, all right. 

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Well is $92, right? 
Because if you think it's going 

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to be much worse than that, the 
nuts opportunity in the options 

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market right now. 
So very much like that, sort of 

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sports sports betting analogy, 
is, you need to know what the 

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options markets pricing before 
you even like weighed in. 

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And if you are going to buy that
stock and they've got an 

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earnings coming up or you know, 
something like that. 

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It's like well my risk the 
options Market is pricing my 

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risk, basically down 8%. 
Right? 

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And I should know what that 
means. 

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Colonel monetarily to my 
position. 

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If that happens, right? 
And yeah. 

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So anyway, it's and then what we
do on options. 

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AI is vegan then do those 
options trades? 

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Do those, you know, adding 
income, you know, using them for

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leverage, adding protection and 
you can see that on the chart 

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and then instantly. 
See as you drag these things 

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around on the chart which is 
essentially your options 

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positions, you know, what is my 
risk? 

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What is my reward? 
What is the Probability of our 

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that's cool. 
It'll adjust accordingly. 

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Yeah, G-Dragon. 
That's good. 

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Yeah. 
So it's basically taking all of 

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that intimidation factor from 
the options chain and making it.

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You know, options are basically 
can be intimidating because you 

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get into all of this sort of 
nuanced, right? 

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But that Nuance is like 10 5 to 
10% of options trading. 

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The other like 90% is really 
straightforward math. 

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It is You know, is this stock 
going to be above or below this 

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break? 
Even, you know, in two weeks or 

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two months or a year? 
Yeah. 

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And that's where everybody 
should start as if they 

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understand those sorts of 
breakevens and which side of 

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that brave. 
Even in my on they can get to 

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the Nuance later but that's the 
core of like an options position

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and it just makes my show on the
chart basically just explain to 

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the audience. 
What's he saying here is that 

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options at by expiration their 
binary either winner You lose. 

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So if you buy a call option 
let's say it 108 and expires in 

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two weeks that two weeks from. 
Now, when that time comes, if 

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it's above 108 and you own the 
call you win, if it's below 

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their you lose more or less - 
the premium, all that kind of 

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stuff. 
So having the ability to 

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understand that in mind, takes 
80 to 90%. 

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You said of the equation. 
I like the confusion out of it. 

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Yeah. 
And I stayed with a doubtful. 

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They look at me like I'm crazy 
sometimes. 

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I feel like it is not you know 
people are like oh you were in 

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options Market. 
You must be something like math 

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whiz and I was like I'm not 
really, it is not it's not a ton

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of variables, the core of 
options, you know. 

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There are there are some little 
like nuanced variables that I 

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think that, you know, only a 
professional options Trader 

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could like understand and then 
you're getting into like second 

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level Greeks and things like 
that, but for that's only that's

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mostly just important for 
somebody. 

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That's professional options, 
Market maker jobs like that on 

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Wall Street. 
You where you have the million 

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positions for somebody that's 
looking to go long apple and it 

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should concern themselves with 
the basics and right, gross, 

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they're going to trip themselves
up and they're going to make, 

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you know, bad decisions because 
they're going to be missing the 

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forest for the trees. 
Yeah. 

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Yeah. 
Sorry. 

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It's almost like trying to learn
division before you learn 

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addition. 
Subtraction. 

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It's just a lot of Education. 
You know, they start with like 

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the Greeks and things and I'm 
like, you just wait on that 

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stuff, you know, like, figure 
out basic probability. 

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I love that. 
So let's talk. 

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I'm interested in several 
things. 

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You've got going on CC, first 
talk to me about the money maker

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options Market maker, not 
moneymaker, but the market maybe

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it's his 40th slip, their the 
market making activities. 

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And when you saw it on the 
exchange, what was that, like 

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from being there and then now 
being removed from it? 

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Do you feel that there's an edge
to being there, or is it, 

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they're not an edge? 
And how does that work a little 

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bit can explain what that you're
not like and so on and so forth.

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So just to sort of Plane that 
market-making job in general. 

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So, if somebody goes to like 
most of your audience, you know,

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everybody's probably bought 
stock and sold stock, and all 

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when you go to buy shares of 
apple, or spy, or something like

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that, you probably are looking. 
At the same time you were buying

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Apple shares. 
Someone else is selling Apple 

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shares, somewhere out there. 
Right being matched up, right 

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with options, there are 
thousands of strikes And, you 

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know, dozens of expirations. 
So you can imagine the chances 

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of you putting in a call by, in 
apple, you know, twenty dollars 

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away, two months out and meeting
somebody doing that exact same 

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behavior selling that. 
At the same time, it's close to 

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0, right? 
So, what market makers in 

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options do is they're generally 
on the other side of every 

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single one of your trades. 
Oh, wow. 

227
00:12:30,100 --> 00:12:32,300
Yeah. 
And so I, you know, there's, 

228
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there's, you know, chases like 
if you're trading like spy, By 

229
00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:40,700
and QQQ you know, there's 
there's a lot more at the money 

230
00:12:40,700 --> 00:12:43,100
that week, right? 
You will your super super 

231
00:12:43,100 --> 00:12:44,000
liquid. 
That's what you mean. 

232
00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:45,700
Right, opposed to sons that 
aren't liquid. 

233
00:12:45,700 --> 00:12:48,900
Okay, got you make again, good 
or your, or your buying and 

234
00:12:48,900 --> 00:12:51,100
somebody's already gone in order
breast in there, right? 

235
00:12:51,100 --> 00:12:54,300
So, but other than that, in 
general, most of, like, a team, 

236
00:12:54,300 --> 00:12:55,600
let's say I'm making up a 
number. 

237
00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:59,200
But let's say, 80% 90% of the 
you're trading with a market 

238
00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:01,900
maker, is what a market maker is
doing, is providing the 

239
00:13:01,908 --> 00:13:05,200
liquidity in the options Market.
That wouldn't be there otherwise

240
00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:10,700
and Way that job works is, 
you're essentially taking all of

241
00:13:10,700 --> 00:13:15,200
that order flow buying selling 
and you're reacting in real time

242
00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:20,400
to it because you don't want to 
be take on a massive position 

243
00:13:20,900 --> 00:13:24,700
based upon getting caught 
sleeping and everybody suddenly 

244
00:13:24,700 --> 00:13:26,600
buys a bunch of options from 
you. 

245
00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:30,200
In some biotech company that you
didn't even know was about to 

246
00:13:30,208 --> 00:13:32,200
have FDA approval on something, 
right? 

247
00:13:32,300 --> 00:13:33,800
Right. 
Because you're generally not 

248
00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:35,900
even following the news and all 
of these stuff. 

249
00:13:36,100 --> 00:13:38,900
Yes. 
Much too much going on, right? 

250
00:13:39,100 --> 00:13:42,200
So and yeah, you see something 
order from Goldman Sachs and 

251
00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:44,600
some biotech stock, you know, 
something's up, right? 

252
00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:48,500
Right. 
So the so that options marker, 

253
00:13:48,500 --> 00:13:52,800
market-maker all day long. 
As a career is basically trying 

254
00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:58,400
to stay as neutral as possible. 
So you'll hear like delta 

255
00:13:58,400 --> 00:14:01,100
neutral options trading because 
they don't want to be taking big

256
00:14:01,100 --> 00:14:03,900
Market risks overnight. 
They're also trying to say 

257
00:14:03,900 --> 00:14:08,800
somewhat neutral as to their net
cells And buys of options, which

258
00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:11,600
is called gamma and Vega and 
things like that. 

259
00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:17,200
And they're basically making 
their money with either in two 

260
00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:20,300
different ways. 
The more sophisticated and 

261
00:14:20,300 --> 00:14:24,000
fancier way of explaining the 
job would be the they're buying 

262
00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,400
low volatility and selling High 
volatility and what they're 

263
00:14:27,400 --> 00:14:31,000
doing that is over time as 
latvala slowly goes low. 

264
00:14:31,100 --> 00:14:33,400
They'll be a little bit longer 
and is it goes higher there'll 

265
00:14:33,400 --> 00:14:38,400
be a little bit shorter because 
it's mean, Hurting really what 

266
00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:42,400
they're doing. 
Is all of those trades intraday 

267
00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:44,100
on all of those different 
strikes. 

268
00:14:44,100 --> 00:14:49,800
They're getting tiny different 
prices based upon their fair 

269
00:14:49,800 --> 00:14:54,700
value of those options. 
So if somebody sells you a 100 

270
00:14:54,700 --> 00:14:59,600
call at, you know, one dollar 
and you have a fair value price 

271
00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:03,600
of a dollar five. 
You're unlikely to then, just be

272
00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:06,600
able to go flip that option, but
some other options strike. 

273
00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:10,400
Somebody might be paying you 50 
cents and you have a fair value 

274
00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:13,700
of 45 cents. 
So that options Market maker has

275
00:15:13,700 --> 00:15:19,300
just created 10 cents of edge 
now that ten cents of edges and 

276
00:15:19,300 --> 00:15:21,200
guaranteed. 
Because then you've got this 

277
00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:24,100
whole thing has to pull it out 
fast, right. 

278
00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:27,900
But it's like that's how they're
making money day-to-day got it. 

279
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:31,500
So it's the sophistication of 
being a traitor. 

280
00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:34,600
Get stalked up a lot but really 
what they're doing is all that 

281
00:15:34,600 --> 00:15:38,100
intraday, you know, sorts of 
things like, we're just creating

282
00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:41,800
Edge every day and then managing
their positions to hope. 

283
00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:44,800
Hopefully capture as much of 
that edge by expiration as 

284
00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:46,900
possible. 
So you said there's two ways 

285
00:15:46,900 --> 00:15:49,400
they make money. 
The first is its by vol 1 is low

286
00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:51,400
and sell fall when it's high the
second. 

287
00:15:51,900 --> 00:15:55,200
Yeah and the second was what was
scalped was the difference 

288
00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:57,400
between basically scalping Edge,
stopping it. 

289
00:15:57,500 --> 00:16:00,500
So it's not wears a like 
somebody making markets in a 

290
00:16:00,500 --> 00:16:04,900
stock they can buy buy the stock
for $100 and they can sell it at

291
00:16:04,900 --> 00:16:08,600
100 dollars and five cents and 
that's just that's like 

292
00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:09,900
guaranteed money. 
Yeah. 

293
00:16:09,900 --> 00:16:13,100
Options Market maker doesn't 
have that opportunity that often

294
00:16:13,300 --> 00:16:15,200
right? 
So they bought something that 

295
00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:19,400
they valued at $1 and then sold 
something that they valued at $1

296
00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:23,700
five room, you know whatever and
they've created five cents in 

297
00:16:23,700 --> 00:16:27,600
Edge which is the capture by not
messing up their positions in 

298
00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:29,300
the next three weeks or 
something. 

299
00:16:29,500 --> 00:16:31,100
I love that. 
So basically what you with 

300
00:16:31,100 --> 00:16:34,100
options Not really what you can 
but most of the time you try to 

301
00:16:34,100 --> 00:16:37,000
buy the midpoint or somewhere in
between where it's going. 

302
00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:39,000
So it's a lot of flexibility 
with respect to where you get 

303
00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,300
executed where stock you kind of
get filled. 

304
00:16:41,300 --> 00:16:43,600
There's a been asking it's 
really straightforward but with 

305
00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:45,400
options is it's more of a new 
ones. 

306
00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,700
So that Nuance is where the 
market maker comes in and that's

307
00:16:48,700 --> 00:16:51,500
their Edge because they can Buy 
Here, Sell their Buy Here, Sell 

308
00:16:51,500 --> 00:16:53,500
their or cell by itself, 
whatever they want to do. 

309
00:16:53,700 --> 00:16:57,400
Is that yes, without getting 
feel like, I've got a little too

310
00:16:57,400 --> 00:17:00,300
far into the weeds there, but 
like, there's a great lesson in 

311
00:17:00,300 --> 00:17:05,400
what I just said. 
Yeah, so the options Market are 

312
00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:07,599
wider right than Equity, 
markets, right? 

313
00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:10,800
Let's there's less liquidity, 
there's less retail Traders on 

314
00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:12,200
each side of it. 
Yeah. 

315
00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:17,800
So you may see a let's say you 
saw a call and it was $1 at 

316
00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:21,700
$1.39, right? 
So the midpoint is, you know, a 

317
00:17:21,708 --> 00:17:26,200
dollar fifteen, mmm, that one 
dollar and 130 is what those 

318
00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:29,600
market makers are showing, but 
you're going into a competitive 

319
00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:32,600
options Market. 
Where if Bunch of people have 

320
00:17:32,600 --> 00:17:36,900
priced that in their models. 
Some people might have priced 

321
00:17:36,900 --> 00:17:42,100
that that they're willing to pay
115 for that or 110 and so it's 

322
00:17:42,100 --> 00:17:45,100
a really good lesson for people 
that are going to when they get 

323
00:17:45,100 --> 00:17:47,700
to the point of actually 
executed in options trade. 

324
00:17:47,700 --> 00:17:53,000
They should price discover in 
between those bid bids and asks 

325
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:57,100
because there are computers and 
algorithms at all of these 

326
00:17:57,100 --> 00:18:01,300
market-making firms that all you
need is you know, you might get 

327
00:18:01,500 --> 00:18:04,800
Executed really close to the 
midpoint of an options thing 

328
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,400
sometimes that sometimes you 
won't, and you really have to 

329
00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:10,200
keep going down towards the dead
or up towards the offer, but 

330
00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:13,200
you've got it, you know? 
And we do that on options AI. 

331
00:18:13,400 --> 00:18:15,900
We try to provide a lot of 
these, like, sort of nudges 

332
00:18:15,900 --> 00:18:19,600
through the platform and that is
one of them is our ticket 

333
00:18:19,700 --> 00:18:23,300
encourages to cancel, replace 
cancel and replace until you 

334
00:18:23,300 --> 00:18:27,200
find that, you know, that price 
that liquidity and what we don't

335
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:31,400
even offer a market buy or sell 
button. 

336
00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:35,700
Our ticket because we came from 
that side of the business. 

337
00:18:35,700 --> 00:18:37,400
You know. 
That's ya know. 

338
00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:41,000
There's yeah within that bit and
ask, you know, in general, and 

339
00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,500
sometimes there isn't but, you 
know, it depends what your 

340
00:18:43,500 --> 00:18:45,600
trade, you know? 
So I love this. 

341
00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:48,100
So basically, you were able to 
what you're able to now with 

342
00:18:48,100 --> 00:18:49,600
options. 
AI is kind of where I was going 

343
00:18:49,600 --> 00:18:51,100
with that. 
You thank you for diving in deep

344
00:18:51,100 --> 00:18:54,900
there and very helpful for us to
understand the market makers 

345
00:18:54,900 --> 00:18:56,800
roll. 
It's really critical but with 

346
00:18:56,800 --> 00:19:00,000
options that when you come to 
get executed, there's a wider 

347
00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:02,800
spread and you can hit The bid 
at the ass but you can go 

348
00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:05,700
somewhere the midpoint. 
So with options AI you have that

349
00:19:05,700 --> 00:19:07,700
tool built in to help the 
individual. 

350
00:19:07,700 --> 00:19:11,900
Investor find a better price 
than just getting the market 

351
00:19:11,900 --> 00:19:14,400
order and buying it outright 
exactly. 

352
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:16,700
Like Greg, you're not want 
people to submit its 

353
00:19:16,700 --> 00:19:19,200
particularly because we 
specialize in multi, like 

354
00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:21,400
options, spreads or all of those
things. 

355
00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:23,900
I just talked about compound, 
right? 

356
00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:27,500
When you're doing a oh you know 
selling a call and buying a call

357
00:19:27,500 --> 00:19:32,000
simultaneously then you've just 
taken two spreads and You know, 

358
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:34,600
you double the size of the 
entire spread for your order. 

359
00:19:35,100 --> 00:19:39,100
So in that case, you absolutely 
want to be working that order, 

360
00:19:39,100 --> 00:19:42,000
you know, like you started that 
we, you know, we encourage on 

361
00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:45,000
the ticket, it starts at the 
midpoint and it's a 

362
00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:48,200
instantaneous pretty much 
instantaneous cancel and replace

363
00:19:48,700 --> 00:19:51,000
so you can just sort of walk it 
down until you find that 

364
00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:52,300
liquidity. 
I love it. 

365
00:19:52,300 --> 00:19:54,900
Well, thank you. 
That's a beautiful, fantastic. 

366
00:19:55,100 --> 00:19:59,400
Okay, next question CC for you. 
Let's dive a little bit deeper 

367
00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:01,100
into options. 
They I can you tell us about the

368
00:20:01,100 --> 00:20:03,400
business? 
Enos and the value people get 

369
00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:06,000
from using it and how it differs
competitive advantages, you 

370
00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:07,100
know, speak to that a little 
bit, please. 

371
00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:10,000
Yeah. 
So, you know, we positioned 

372
00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:12,300
ourselves, you know, going back 
to like what I was saying 

373
00:20:12,300 --> 00:20:18,600
earlier that most retail options
trading is basically being used 

374
00:20:18,600 --> 00:20:22,600
as a lottery tickets, and we've 
actually seen statistics, we 

375
00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:27,200
were in an article a couple of 
months ago and CNBC where, you 

376
00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:31,800
know, they mentioned Robin 
Hood's order flow and I do Don't

377
00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:34,100
mean to pick on Robin Hood or 
anything but it's the most 

378
00:20:34,100 --> 00:20:37,500
retail of retail, you know, 
great poster child. 

379
00:20:37,500 --> 00:20:38,800
Yeah, right. 
Exactly. 

380
00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:44,000
And so 99% of their order flow 
is single leg options. 

381
00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,000
And so when I see that somebody,
that's an Insider, you know, 

382
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:50,100
sees that statistic, it 
basically means that most people

383
00:20:50,100 --> 00:20:52,900
are doing YOLO called buying, 
right? 

384
00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:57,900
It'll probably be very low will,
you know, guaranteed a very low 

385
00:20:57,900 --> 00:21:01,900
probability of profit which 
means they're looking at A 100 

386
00:21:01,900 --> 00:21:04,800
dollar stock and they're saying 
wouldn't it be amazing if it 

387
00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:09,600
went to 125, right? 
So institutional order flow 

388
00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:14,700
looks almost exactly opposite 
and it looks like the most but 

389
00:21:14,700 --> 00:21:18,500
one of my co-founders he came 
from the institutional options 

390
00:21:18,500 --> 00:21:22,700
brokerage side of the business 
and he's like I never see any 

391
00:21:22,700 --> 00:21:28,500
institution to a single leg 
options order and if they do 

392
00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:33,800
it's probably guaranteed against
Some big, you know, stock 

393
00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:38,000
position from even and they 
still use spreads right? 

394
00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:42,100
And so anyway like you never see
that, you know, their mirror 

395
00:21:42,100 --> 00:21:45,200
opposites right? 
And so options AI, it's 

396
00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:48,800
basically, you know, in a few 
clicks I can say, you know, I'm 

397
00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:52,900
bullish, bearish neutral or I 
can create levels on the chart 

398
00:21:52,900 --> 00:21:56,200
and options AI is immediately 
putting a few options trades, 

399
00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:59,500
you know, in front of you. 
Now, some of them are calls and 

400
00:21:59,500 --> 00:22:02,900
puts, you know, occasionally you
Do just want to do that. 

401
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:06,100
But for the most part, you know,
people are singing. 

402
00:22:06,100 --> 00:22:09,300
Oh you know, I could do a call 
spread that in this case in this

403
00:22:09,300 --> 00:22:14,200
stuff that I like and or I could
even sell a car that put spread 

404
00:22:14,300 --> 00:22:17,000
meaning I'm like taking other 
side of like you know I'm 

405
00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:20,300
basically just positioning the 
stock does not go lower. 

406
00:22:20,300 --> 00:22:23,600
Right right, you know and with 
with those kinds of Trades, you 

407
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,600
see that probability of profit 
like for instance that credit 

408
00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:30,600
put spread might have a 65 
percent probability of profit 

409
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:32,100
which makes Sense. 
Right? 

410
00:22:32,100 --> 00:22:36,900
Like the probability of a stock 
going down. 80 calories is 

411
00:22:36,900 --> 00:22:39,100
better than 50%. 
Right? 

412
00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:41,700
If you're buying something for 
the stock to go higher, you're 

413
00:22:41,700 --> 00:22:44,900
going to be less than 50%. 
You need the stock to move eight

414
00:22:44,900 --> 00:22:47,400
dollars, right? 
And so those sorts of things and

415
00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:51,000
what ends up happening is when 
you get those trades in front of

416
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:55,200
that audience, they immediately 
clicks and they're like, oh man,

417
00:22:55,300 --> 00:22:57,400
you know? 
Like now that I see like there 

418
00:22:57,400 --> 00:23:00,200
were four different ways to 
express this view. 

419
00:23:00,500 --> 00:23:03,400
I'm going to like Like you know 
I really like this up another 

420
00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:07,300
one and I wouldn't have I would 
have needed the intent of to do 

421
00:23:07,300 --> 00:23:10,900
that trade on another platform. 
I mean I would have needed to go

422
00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:14,200
to my E-Trade platform or 
whatever and said, I want to do 

423
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,200
a credit put spread and you're 
out which credit put spread. 

424
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:19,100
I wanted to do it with options, 
are I? 

425
00:23:19,100 --> 00:23:21,900
You've just said, I think you 
know I'm bullish right. 

426
00:23:21,900 --> 00:23:24,900
Like here's one of the options 
is a credit put spread. 

427
00:23:25,100 --> 00:23:29,300
And so what ends up happening is
about 80 to 85 percent of our 

428
00:23:29,300 --> 00:23:35,200
order flow is multi like Okay. 
And so that means that we are 

429
00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:39,000
the mirror opposite of Robin 
Hood and our order flow. 

430
00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:41,800
Looks a lot more like 
institutional order flow and 

431
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,300
it's kind of hilarious. 
Because when you're on the 

432
00:23:44,300 --> 00:23:47,800
market, making side of things 
that has a name, and it's called

433
00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:52,200
toxic, right toxic, okay, toxic 
order flow because you're going 

434
00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:55,800
to lose most likely, right? 
The market market makers were 

435
00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:58,300
this, right? 
Because they think it's smart 

436
00:23:58,300 --> 00:24:01,500
money. 
And what's funny is that If 

437
00:24:01,500 --> 00:24:04,900
somebody's doing those sorts of 
Trades from a retail, brokerage 

438
00:24:04,900 --> 00:24:07,200
the market makers, it's very 
difficult for them to tell the 

439
00:24:07,208 --> 00:24:09,400
difference, which right, and 
look right. 

440
00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:13,400
So, you know, a lot of a lot of 
our Twitter flow and when it 

441
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,700
might, it might be a lot 
smaller, but it's the same 

442
00:24:16,700 --> 00:24:20,900
strategies that institutional, 
you know, hedge funds, mutual 

443
00:24:20,900 --> 00:24:24,200
funds, big money, management 
companies, and things like that.

444
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:27,400
It's their type of water flow 
looks like it, which is sort of 

445
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:28,700
funny. 
So we've always thought about 

446
00:24:28,700 --> 00:24:31,300
using that, in branding is like 
be toxic order flow. 

447
00:24:31,900 --> 00:24:34,200
Right? 
It's like yeah, it's that's 

448
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:35,900
awesome. 
So basically what you're doing 

449
00:24:35,900 --> 00:24:38,400
with options AI is you're 
helping the retail investor 

450
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:42,200
think and execute orders like 
the Institutional Investor 

451
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,500
almost been the money smart, 
money kind of parallel. 

452
00:24:44,500 --> 00:24:47,300
Take helping people come into 
the smart money, Circle, part of

453
00:24:47,300 --> 00:24:50,900
the pun there and you're 
creating smarter orders and 

454
00:24:50,900 --> 00:24:52,700
accomplishing the same goal, but
just doing it in a more 

455
00:24:52,700 --> 00:24:54,600
efficient and smarter ways that 
correct. 

456
00:24:54,700 --> 00:24:56,900
Exactly. 
And so, you know, we can't 

457
00:24:56,900 --> 00:24:59,900
obviously, you know, trading 
investing this hard, right? 

458
00:24:59,900 --> 00:25:01,300
And you take losses and you're 
wrong. 

459
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:05,700
Wrong and things like that, but 
what we want to do is like set 

460
00:25:05,700 --> 00:25:09,400
people up for the highest 
probability of success. 

461
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,500
And at the same time, we only 
offer, you know, this is some 

462
00:25:12,500 --> 00:25:17,200
another decision that we made is
we don't think retail Traders, 

463
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:20,600
should be doing things with 
unlimited risk, and so, on 

464
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:23,100
options. 
AI everything is defined risk, 

465
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:27,300
right? 
So you there are no abilities to

466
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:31,900
get into a trade and not 
understand your risk and It's 

467
00:25:31,900 --> 00:25:33,900
all defined. 
It's like this trade. 

468
00:25:33,900 --> 00:25:37,700
I understand this. 
I have a 60% probability of 

469
00:25:37,700 --> 00:25:41,100
profit. 
I'm risking $400, I'm sorry, I'm

470
00:25:41,100 --> 00:25:45,800
risking $600 to make $400 on 
something that is slightly more 

471
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,700
than 50%, you know, chance of 
happening, right? 

472
00:25:48,700 --> 00:25:51,400
And I get that. 
And what that does, you know, to

473
00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:55,100
your, you know, your area of 
expertise was like psychology 

474
00:25:55,100 --> 00:25:59,800
and all is that we want, you 
know, all of us as humans are 

475
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,000
really bad at decision making 
especially Specially Under 

476
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:05,600
Pressure, right? 
And it's a huge thing. 

477
00:26:05,700 --> 00:26:08,100
I've always said, it's funny 
with the title of your book. 

478
00:26:08,100 --> 00:26:10,400
I've always said it's like I 
started a hedge fund. 

479
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:13,200
I would hire like, psychology 
Majors, not Finance Majors, 

480
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:17,300
right? 
And so the like, you know that 

481
00:26:17,300 --> 00:26:21,700
that the those ways to use 
options like to add income to a 

482
00:26:21,700 --> 00:26:25,700
portfolio, to hedge, a 
portfolio, like in times like 

483
00:26:25,700 --> 00:26:28,700
this, there's that you can sleep
at night, not only sleep at 

484
00:26:28,700 --> 00:26:33,400
night and make better decisions,
but when the Down 30%, you've 

485
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:37,000
set yourself up so that you're a
buyer down 30%, not a panic 

486
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:38,700
seller. 
Right, right. 

487
00:26:38,700 --> 00:26:42,200
And those those are the ways 
that like options should be used

488
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:45,000
because that's exactly the way 
that like hedge funds are using 

489
00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:47,400
options, right? 
They're not setting themselves 

490
00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:52,200
up for unlimited losses because 
you can't be that guy that blew 

491
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:53,800
up the hedge fund. 
Right? 

492
00:26:54,100 --> 00:26:59,200
So retail the retail you know 
investing everyday investor 

493
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:01,200
should be thinking about options
the same way. 

494
00:27:01,300 --> 00:27:05,000
It's like, how do I, you know, 
how do I, if you're an active 

495
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:08,500
investor, you goal is to beat 
the market, right? 

496
00:27:09,100 --> 00:27:11,200
Or else, you wouldn't be doing 
it, or it's just a hobby and 

497
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,500
it's fun, right? 
I think didn't care about these 

498
00:27:14,500 --> 00:27:16,800
things. 
You would just be invested in a 

499
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:18,900
Index Fund, right? 
You want to wait until you play 

500
00:27:18,900 --> 00:27:21,300
the game to win, you're playing 
the game to win, right? 

501
00:27:21,300 --> 00:27:25,000
And so why not play it exactly 
like the professionals are doing

502
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:28,900
which is you know, using options
not as like wouldn't it be great

503
00:27:28,900 --> 00:27:31,000
if this happened? 
It's like it's probably not 

504
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:33,500
going to And so let me do it 
this way, right? 

505
00:27:33,500 --> 00:27:36,400
It's again yeah, it's I go 
ahead. 

506
00:27:37,300 --> 00:27:40,600
No, I mean I was going to say it
sounds. 

507
00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:44,100
I mean, we started around the, I
started the 90s and it sounded 

508
00:27:44,100 --> 00:27:46,800
like you wrote my book because 
that's wrong on the outline here

509
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:50,000
in the book and actually TCL 
taking a step further, since we 

510
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:51,600
have this psychology thing in 
common. 

511
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,800
See, this is the first Finance 
book, that I know of at least 

512
00:27:54,900 --> 00:27:58,600
that has cartoons in it. 
So I'll digress for a second. 

513
00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:02,300
I've got a dumb money Beast, 
which is the Tasmanian Evil, an 

514
00:28:02,300 --> 00:28:05,000
emotional creature that runs 
around and then the smart money 

515
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:07,400
superhero. 
And the whole idea is to help to

516
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,600
bring out the smart money 
superheroes that you can step 

517
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,900
back and make the rational not 
emotional decisions with your 

518
00:28:12,900 --> 00:28:16,800
money and what without a spoiler
alert for the book but one of my

519
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,100
most important rules is to 
respect risk, right? 

520
00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:21,600
So always defense first before 
you enter know where you're 

521
00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:23,300
going to exit, how much you 
going to risk, if you're wrong 

522
00:28:23,300 --> 00:28:25,800
and yada yada yada. 
But I love what you're saying is

523
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:27,600
this is really powerful. 
So, to be able to do that with 

524
00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:31,200
options and have a platform 
that's visually friendly. 

525
00:28:31,500 --> 00:28:34,200
Is, I mean, that's genius my 
mind's eye because I don't think

526
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:37,400
that's ever been done before. 
Like, is that correct? 

527
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:39,600
Exactly. 
And it comes from our 

528
00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:42,100
experiences and it's, you know, 
being in a professional, like, 

529
00:28:42,100 --> 00:28:47,000
derivatives trading firm the 
best traders in The Firm where 

530
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:50,400
the guys whose emotions were 
like that, right? 

531
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:53,400
History line across and they 
never got to buy in the never 

532
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,100
got too low. 
They were the guys that guys and

533
00:28:56,100 --> 00:28:58,600
gals that played my wife, that's
where I met my wife. 

534
00:29:00,300 --> 00:29:02,900
They were the You know, they 
were the types of people, you 

535
00:29:02,900 --> 00:29:05,900
know, looking for singles and 
doubles every single guy singles

536
00:29:05,900 --> 00:29:07,700
and doubles every single day, 
right? 

537
00:29:07,700 --> 00:29:11,200
And you could tell that person 
that walks into, you know, and 

538
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:13,900
I'm sure this happens at every 
hedge fund, every big trading 

539
00:29:13,900 --> 00:29:15,900
desk at a big bank. 
And I mean, you could tell the 

540
00:29:15,900 --> 00:29:18,100
people that look like they're 
going to blow up the firm, 

541
00:29:18,100 --> 00:29:19,100
right? 
Yeah. 

542
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:21,300
And they're the types that think
they have. 

543
00:29:21,300 --> 00:29:25,800
It figured out, see patterns, 
where there are no patterns, and

544
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:29,300
don't trust, you know, you that 
humility, right? 

545
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:33,000
Yeah, it's really important. 
In investing and trading, right?

546
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:36,600
Because everyone no matter how 
good you are at this. 

547
00:29:36,900 --> 00:29:40,700
You had a, you had a recent 
horrible experience, like I'm 

548
00:29:40,700 --> 00:29:44,100
sure Warren Buffett than a 
percent horrible experience in 

549
00:29:44,100 --> 00:29:46,800
the last 3 months, right? 
So investment is probably 

550
00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:48,000
tanked. 
Yeah. 

551
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:53,300
And that kind of, you know, 
humility is what you need to be 

552
00:29:53,300 --> 00:29:56,100
successful over time. 
And so what we would say with 

553
00:29:56,100 --> 00:29:59,400
like options trading is, you 
know, unfortunately, most 

554
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:04,500
people's entry into the Ian's 
Market is, it's being sold to 

555
00:30:04,500 --> 00:30:08,200
them as a get-rich-quick scheme 
and it's, it shouldn't be that 

556
00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:10,200
way. 
It should be an overtime 

557
00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:13,900
strategy of, you know, there's 
an options Market that could 

558
00:30:13,900 --> 00:30:15,800
potentially add in come to my 
portfolio. 

559
00:30:16,100 --> 00:30:18,700
There's an options Market that 
could help me sleep at night on 

560
00:30:18,700 --> 00:30:21,300
my portfolio. 
There's an options Market where 

561
00:30:21,300 --> 00:30:25,000
if I'm really geeked up on some 
stock that down, you know, like,

562
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,000
for instance, take like a 
Shopify or something right now, 

563
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:31,200
it's down like 85% and it's 
like, whoa. 

564
00:30:31,300 --> 00:30:35,100
I'm going to put a bunch of my 
money in Shopify or do I want to

565
00:30:35,100 --> 00:30:37,900
like take a shot and Shopify. 
So if I want to take a shot in 

566
00:30:37,900 --> 00:30:40,500
Shopify, then there's like, all 
right. 

567
00:30:40,500 --> 00:30:43,600
I can do some defined risk 
options trade where I get like 

568
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:46,100
this, you know, I get a chance 
and if I'm wrong I'm wrong. 

569
00:30:46,100 --> 00:30:49,200
And I don't like, you know, it 
doesn't ruin my year, right? 

570
00:30:49,500 --> 00:30:52,300
So those sites types of things 
or the way that people should be

571
00:30:52,300 --> 00:30:54,700
seeing the options Market. 
I love that. 

572
00:30:54,700 --> 00:30:57,400
So earlier today, actually, I 
was watching TV in the morning 

573
00:30:57,400 --> 00:30:59,700
which I don't normally do, but 
Michael, no regrets was on. 

574
00:30:59,700 --> 00:31:03,100
He was talking about crypto. 
And he had a big tattoo of Luna 

575
00:31:03,300 --> 00:31:05,800
and Luna wanted to cryptos at 
120 or something like that, 

576
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:07,200
imploded or whatever. 
Right? 

577
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:10,100
So he the the lady on TV, ask 
them. 

578
00:31:10,500 --> 00:31:12,500
What about the tattoo you regret
getting it? 

579
00:31:12,700 --> 00:31:15,400
He's like, no, he fired back 
instantly saying it's a good. 

580
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:17,400
Reminder that you're not always 
right? 

581
00:31:17,700 --> 00:31:19,200
Yes. 
That you're going to have 

582
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:22,400
losses, you going to be wrong so
on and so forth and that speaks 

583
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:23,800
to your point right there, 
right? 

584
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:26,500
Where you everybody. 
He's a multi, he's a self-made. 

585
00:31:26,500 --> 00:31:28,800
Billionaire that guy. 
Anyway, took ages, took it on 

586
00:31:28,808 --> 00:31:31,500
the chin. 
So yes so powerful if you Fact 

587
00:31:31,500 --> 00:31:34,300
risk and you do that right over 
time, how you can compound your 

588
00:31:34,300 --> 00:31:35,500
wins? 
I love you too. 

589
00:31:35,500 --> 00:31:38,200
So much to do is look down on 
his arm. 

590
00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:42,100
It's, it's right there. 
It's all right. 

591
00:31:42,700 --> 00:31:44,900
Yeah, I love that. 
So, okay, that's how you handle 

592
00:31:44,900 --> 00:31:47,600
risk. 
Let's talk about the business. 

593
00:31:47,700 --> 00:31:50,200
Some Timeless lessons. 
You've learned along the way. 

594
00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:52,300
See, see that you like to share 
with the audience could be 

595
00:31:52,300 --> 00:31:55,400
training lessons, life, lessons,
relationship, whatever you want.

596
00:31:55,700 --> 00:31:59,400
Yeah. 
So, What we were just talking 

597
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,700
about is interesting because it 
can sort of take it one step 

598
00:32:01,700 --> 00:32:04,100
further, which is zooming out, 
right? 

599
00:32:04,300 --> 00:32:09,700
And this is one of those like 
trading lessons that I think 

600
00:32:09,700 --> 00:32:12,100
everyone who's like, you sort of
actively done it either 

601
00:32:12,100 --> 00:32:16,500
professionally or at home, you 
know, like those times when 

602
00:32:16,500 --> 00:32:19,300
you're like, zooming in So Close
like on the chart, like from the

603
00:32:19,300 --> 00:32:21,800
last half an hour trying to 
sleep pattern, you're going to 

604
00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,900
let us keep going. 
Yeah, you know, it's like it's 

605
00:32:24,900 --> 00:32:27,200
like oh my gosh. 
Like your flip. 

606
00:32:27,300 --> 00:32:29,500
Being a coin, right? 
Yeah. 

607
00:32:29,500 --> 00:32:33,200
And like trying to like predict 
the market intraday and trying 

608
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:34,900
to predict the stock and all 
that sort of thing. 

609
00:32:34,900 --> 00:32:38,500
And so then when you realize 
look back at your history when 

610
00:32:38,500 --> 00:32:42,400
you zoomed out and solve a big 
picture, you made such much more

611
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:46,400
clear decisions, they did they 
didn't have to be as precise, 

612
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:47,900
right? 
Like, you know, when you're 

613
00:32:47,900 --> 00:32:50,800
zoomed in on a stock chart, if 
you've got to get the next 20 

614
00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,400
minutes, right, right? 
Yeah, 100%. 

615
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,800
When you zoom out, you're like, 
alright, well, the markets, you 

616
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:57,200
know, for instance, the market 
right. 

617
00:32:57,400 --> 00:33:01,900
Now, what was it down 30-some 
percent last week or two weeks 

618
00:33:01,900 --> 00:33:05,300
ago or something like that. 
I mean, traditionally if I told 

619
00:33:05,300 --> 00:33:07,800
me, like, if I woke you up from 
a coma after year, and I was 

620
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:10,600
like the markets down 30-some 
percent, would you be bearish or

621
00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:11,600
bullish? 
Right. 

622
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:13,300
You want to buy cheaper 
understood? 

623
00:33:13,300 --> 00:33:15,400
Yeah. 
You'd rather write, I mean, not 

624
00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,200
that, I'm not saying that this 
is the bottom. 

625
00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:20,500
It could be worse or whatever, 
but it's certainly 30% cheaper 

626
00:33:20,500 --> 00:33:23,800
than it was fun of me yet. 
Value investors we bullish the 

627
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:25,900
technicians with bearish but I 
get your point. 

628
00:33:25,900 --> 00:33:28,700
You're like hey yeah, takes you 
So when you're zooming out, your

629
00:33:28,700 --> 00:33:31,200
all of a sudden, all right, well
now the big picture is I can't 

630
00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:33,200
predict what's going to happen 
over the next two weeks. 

631
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:36,700
But I do know that my longer 
term, things are now cheaper, 

632
00:33:36,700 --> 00:33:38,100
right? 
Like if I'm thinking about 

633
00:33:38,100 --> 00:33:42,200
longer term investments in my 
shorter term strategy is focused

634
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,200
on the current volatility. 
Right? 

635
00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:44,900
Right. 
Instantly. 

636
00:33:44,900 --> 00:33:48,200
You know, like I should be 
thinking about like how do I not

637
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:51,900
get run over in this market? 
Short-term and how do I have the

638
00:33:51,900 --> 00:33:55,200
bullets to like take advantage 
of the, you know, something like

639
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:57,700
this long-term, right? 
And so that's sort of you Now, 

640
00:33:57,700 --> 00:34:01,400
all the sudden informs that zoom
in, right? 

641
00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:06,000
So by I mean out for use, you 
know, focused on the what to do 

642
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:07,100
that day. 
Really. 

643
00:34:07,100 --> 00:34:09,699
Yes. 
So I think that's like a great 

644
00:34:09,699 --> 00:34:11,000
lesson. 
That's something you learn, is 

645
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:14,800
she like your trade is like you 
realize you're zoomed in 22 to 

646
00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:18,000
Lofton, right? 
Couldn't agree that like I don't

647
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:20,800
know, there's like a metaphor 
for Life there, I guess there 

648
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:22,699
is. 
So again I'm going to I can't 

649
00:34:22,699 --> 00:34:24,199
believe the over the parallels 
here. 

650
00:34:24,199 --> 00:34:27,100
So when page 82 my book, I talk 
about it. 

651
00:34:27,300 --> 00:34:29,699
I have a thing you're familiar 
with Arbitrage right? 

652
00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:30,900
Yep. 
Concept of Arbitrage. 

653
00:34:30,900 --> 00:34:34,000
So for those for the audience 
it's just a discrepancy in price

654
00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:36,699
and let's say gold is really 
high in Gold stocks are down, 

655
00:34:36,900 --> 00:34:39,800
you can sell one by the other 
and then eventually, I mean 

656
00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:44,000
verts and that's that. 
So I have that in zooming out, I

657
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:48,100
call it time Arbitrage, I see 
most people training, they lose 

658
00:34:48,100 --> 00:34:51,100
because in looking at the forget
the they've see the famous the 

659
00:34:51,100 --> 00:34:54,000
forest, they forget, the trees 
they're looking at the leaves on

660
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:56,199
the trees because we're looking 
at a chart of the half hour 

661
00:34:56,199 --> 00:34:59,500
chart, even Daily charts most 
days, just don't matter. 

662
00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:03,300
So I call it time Arbitrage 
where the long-term investors 

663
00:35:03,300 --> 00:35:05,600
when because they're able to 
step back and they don't care 

664
00:35:05,600 --> 00:35:08,500
about the 20 minute chart or the
one minute chartering that kind 

665
00:35:08,500 --> 00:35:11,300
of stuff and they're they're 
aligning themselves with longer 

666
00:35:11,300 --> 00:35:14,500
term uptrend that kind of stuff.
So that's a really really 

667
00:35:14,500 --> 00:35:19,100
powerful concept. 
Another option is there's very 

668
00:35:19,100 --> 00:35:22,900
specific ways that this plays 
out and what I was sort of 

669
00:35:22,900 --> 00:35:25,500
describing like longer term 
position in a short term 

670
00:35:25,500 --> 00:35:28,800
position in this is We're 
options market makers, for 

671
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:31,200
instance. 
Like right now volatility is 

672
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:34,300
high, right? 
They want to be net short 

673
00:35:34,300 --> 00:35:39,500
volatility across their entire 
portfolio because eventually who

674
00:35:39,500 --> 00:35:44,400
knows when the vix is going to 
go from 30 back to 15, right, at

675
00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:47,300
some point and 19 is like its 
historical meeting or something 

676
00:35:47,300 --> 00:35:51,700
like that, but you've got to 
survive for, however, long it 

677
00:35:51,700 --> 00:35:54,200
takes for it to do that, right? 
And so is an options. 

678
00:35:54,500 --> 00:35:57,900
So it's an option relatives 
Trader or, you know, You're not 

679
00:35:57,900 --> 00:36:01,400
betting everything on 
volatility, going back to 

680
00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:04,000
nineteen immediately because you
were going to get run over in 

681
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:05,500
the meantime. 
Right. 

682
00:36:05,700 --> 00:36:09,900
So in and so there's lessons 
from that as to like what to be 

683
00:36:09,900 --> 00:36:13,700
doing as an investor at all in 
times like this, which is being 

684
00:36:13,700 --> 00:36:16,600
really, really careful and 
protecting yourself short term 

685
00:36:16,700 --> 00:36:19,500
and trying to start to think 
about the long-term, right? 

686
00:36:19,500 --> 00:36:21,200
Got it. 
Yep, that's it. 

687
00:36:21,500 --> 00:36:23,000
I love that. 
Let's talk about Timeless 

688
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,300
mistakes, where some Timeless 
mistakes, you've seen people 

689
00:36:25,300 --> 00:36:27,100
make, or you've made. 
And you know, how do you avoid? 

690
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:31,200
Boy them who we um you can get 
more than 18. 

691
00:36:31,300 --> 00:36:34,800
Well, mention the phrase earlier
like seeing patterns where there

692
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:36,000
are no patterns. 
Right. 

693
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,200
This is one of those like 
cognitive biases and I'm sure in

694
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:40,800
your book. 
Yep it's an Imodium. 

695
00:36:41,500 --> 00:36:44,100
I love those lists with 
cognitive biases because it is 

696
00:36:44,100 --> 00:36:47,200
exactly when you are like 
Trader, a professional Trader 

697
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:49,800
and every investor should have 
this as well. 

698
00:36:49,900 --> 00:36:53,400
Is you see that you have to 
recognize the cognitive biases 

699
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:57,100
in yourself and that goes back 
to what I was saying. 

700
00:36:57,300 --> 00:36:59,600
The best Traders, you saw. 
And that sort of even 

701
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:02,500
temperament with that. 
Even temperament was hiding was 

702
00:37:02,500 --> 00:37:04,500
a lot of that, like, 
self-reflection and 

703
00:37:04,500 --> 00:37:08,400
meta-analysis, and it's like 
staring at the Luna tattoo. 

704
00:37:08,500 --> 00:37:11,800
Yeah, it's sort of like, I, why 
am I making mistakes? 

705
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:15,100
Like, what am I doing right now?
Right now, I feel like the 

706
00:37:15,100 --> 00:37:18,000
mistakes. 
You see, people make is, is 

707
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,300
feeling like they've figured it 
out, right? 

708
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:22,300
I'll keep the other side of it. 
Okay? 

709
00:37:22,300 --> 00:37:23,800
Got it. 
There's not have it is the 

710
00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:27,100
mistake is like seeing those 
patterns and fit in. 

711
00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:31,100
And you know, we used to, you 
know, options Market, making and

712
00:37:31,100 --> 00:37:34,400
trading. 
It tends to be a Young Person's 

713
00:37:34,500 --> 00:37:39,500
profession and there's a reason 
for that is, as you get older my

714
00:37:39,500 --> 00:37:43,600
age, you start to like some of 
those things creep in right? 

715
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:47,100
You you get set in your ways a 
little bit, you're you're less 

716
00:37:47,100 --> 00:37:51,400
some sort of open to the 
randomness of it, all right? 

717
00:37:51,700 --> 00:37:55,200
And when you're young, it's like
oh this is just straight math 

718
00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:57,100
and probability. 
As you get older, you're like 

719
00:37:57,300 --> 00:38:00,300
Oh, you know I think I've got 
this kind of figure it out and 

720
00:38:00,300 --> 00:38:01,700
then you don't right. 
Right. 

721
00:38:01,700 --> 00:38:06,400
And so that humility and you 
know stepping back and seeing 

722
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:10,200
the randomness of it all and 
trying to like think of the big 

723
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,600
picture is very important and 
thinking you have it figured out

724
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:15,500
again like going back to like a 
Warren Buffett. 

725
00:38:15,500 --> 00:38:19,400
I'm sure he seems like a really,
he seems very humble on those 

726
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:21,800
fronts, right? 
Like he, he probably, he's not 

727
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:24,900
the type of person going out 
saying, like, I have this all 

728
00:38:24,900 --> 00:38:26,800
figured out and I, you know, 
think it look at all these 

729
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:28,300
great. 
Investments and everything like 

730
00:38:28,300 --> 00:38:30,300
that. 
He's like, he probably uses 

731
00:38:30,300 --> 00:38:33,400
words, like, we got really, you 
know, we happened to get great 

732
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:35,800
timing on this investment, and 
we got really lucky and his 

733
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:38,000
investment. 
So I trust people that use the 

734
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:41,900
word lucky, right? 
A lot more than like, I crushed 

735
00:38:41,900 --> 00:38:44,800
it because I'm so smart. 
You're so right. 

736
00:38:44,900 --> 00:38:47,300
I've interviewed countless 
people on the show and I'm 

737
00:38:47,300 --> 00:38:49,600
fascinated with the smart money.
And, you know, you don't get a 

738
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:51,600
six pack by accident. 
You don't become a billionaire 

739
00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:53,500
by accident. 
You don't join the smart money 

740
00:38:53,500 --> 00:38:55,600
Circle by accident, right? 
There's certain things you do 

741
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:58,500
and then you get the six-pack or
Over the you win, right? 

742
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:02,800
So one of the Golden Threads or 
the pick up a tree, trunk, 

743
00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:04,800
you've got different branches, 
people do different things, your

744
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:06,100
options and other guy might be 
stock. 

745
00:39:06,100 --> 00:39:08,300
Another guy might be 
fundamentals technicals and it 

746
00:39:08,300 --> 00:39:11,600
all comes back to the trunk of 
the tree, which is some version 

747
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:15,800
of humility and, or knowing, I 
don't know, which is what I 

748
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:18,700
said, let me try one job, which 
is to learn, and I'm content and

749
00:39:18,700 --> 00:39:20,600
doing this. 
It's a labor of love, I love it.

750
00:39:20,900 --> 00:39:25,600
And once you cross that line of 
saying, oh, I know, and I'm 

751
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:27,400
great. 
And then, you know, all that 

752
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:30,100
cubism yada yada kicks in game 
over. 

753
00:39:30,100 --> 00:39:32,700
I mean, it's not one of my 
favorite movies, I'll digress 

754
00:39:32,700 --> 00:39:34,800
for a second but you're there 
with me because the link back to

755
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:38,300
the options trading, is from a 
line from Nicolas Cage in the 

756
00:39:38,300 --> 00:39:41,600
movie, Lord of War and he was an
arms dealer, interestingly 

757
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:45,400
enough from Ukraine, and in the 
movie, there's a great scene, he

758
00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:48,400
built himself up and blah blah 
blah at the very top before the 

759
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:51,000
downfall. 
He says I suffer the curse of 

760
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:55,400
invincibility right? 
That was so unbelievably 

761
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:57,900
powerful when the Traders are, 
you know, Like deal with one of 

762
00:39:57,900 --> 00:40:00,200
Traders and investors. 
Once you start pulling out the 

763
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:02,600
calculator and typing in, how 
much one am going to make that 

764
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:04,600
trade. 
Almost always. 

765
00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:06,900
It goes right against you at 
that moment or shortly 

766
00:40:06,900 --> 00:40:08,700
thereafter. 
Exactly. 

767
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,200
Exactly. 
You saying about humility and 

768
00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:14,300
then there's the flip side of 
the coin is, you know, you want 

769
00:40:14,300 --> 00:40:16,200
to be doing that constant 
meta-analysis. 

770
00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:18,300
You want to be questioning, you 
know everything. 

771
00:40:18,900 --> 00:40:21,500
There's a way to go, too far on 
that to write this. 

772
00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:25,600
So you can have like, you can be
paralyzed by meta-analysis to 

773
00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:27,000
the point where you can no 
longer. 

774
00:40:27,100 --> 00:40:30,200
Commit to something, like an 
investment, or something like 

775
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:32,400
that. 
And I've seen this with people 

776
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:36,900
that they're, they're unable to 
hang on to Winners. 

777
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:40,000
Yes. 
Or they they're doing something 

778
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:43,700
that is an initial loss or 
something like that. 

779
00:40:43,700 --> 00:40:47,200
And, you know, going back to the
zooming out and they're sort of 

780
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:50,200
paralyzed by all of that doubt 
and those things. 

781
00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:53,600
So you have to be humble but 
confident, I guess it's like the

782
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:56,700
best way to put it is like it's 
like you've done your research, 

783
00:40:56,700 --> 00:40:58,500
really? 
Like this stock or you really 

784
00:40:58,500 --> 00:41:01,500
like this option strategy and 
it's been, you know, it's worked

785
00:41:01,500 --> 00:41:04,100
for you, great in the past, 
like, making decisions like 

786
00:41:04,100 --> 00:41:08,300
that, you know, don't start 
necessarily like overanalyzing 

787
00:41:08,500 --> 00:41:10,000
that part. 
Correct. 

788
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,500
Right. 
And because you can, you know, 

789
00:41:12,500 --> 00:41:15,900
I've seen people that like, 
yeah, like they make investments

790
00:41:15,900 --> 00:41:18,100
and then like a month later, I'm
like, how's that thing going? 

791
00:41:18,100 --> 00:41:21,000
And I got, man, I gotta sing it 
with the week, and you're like, 

792
00:41:21,300 --> 00:41:24,100
not even a few months that you 
loved it. 

793
00:41:31,400 --> 00:41:36,200
So that's really, really good. 
Next question for you, what 

794
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:39,100
makes a great leader and I'm 
going to follow it up with what 

795
00:41:39,100 --> 00:41:40,900
makes a great Trader or 
investor. 

796
00:41:40,900 --> 00:41:43,700
So, there's two questions there,
I guess maybe three years. 

797
00:41:43,700 --> 00:41:47,200
So leaders interesting, because 
now being in, you know, like 

798
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:51,500
sort of the tech startup World 
kind of interesting. 

799
00:41:51,500 --> 00:41:54,100
I mean, this is the comes at the
same time in my life where I 

800
00:41:54,100 --> 00:41:57,000
have young children, not so 
yeah. 

801
00:41:57,200 --> 00:42:02,500
With their 10 and 12 and 
coaching them in sports is 

802
00:42:02,500 --> 00:42:05,400
really interesting because I 
would say, one of the lessons 

803
00:42:05,400 --> 00:42:08,600
would like leadership with a 
company in a small company. 

804
00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:12,500
In particular, I guess at a big 
company would be on on every 

805
00:42:12,500 --> 00:42:18,300
level is like, hire smart people
and get out of their way, right?

806
00:42:18,600 --> 00:42:22,800
And so, I see this a lot in, you
know, coaching, I see so much, 

807
00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:27,000
like, over coaching. 
I was a played lacrosse. 

808
00:42:27,100 --> 00:42:30,400
Crossing college and I coach you
know like my son's lacrosse team

809
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:33,100
and I see it you know, sometimes
some of the other side lines and

810
00:42:33,100 --> 00:42:36,500
things where it's like the 
coaches are literally shouting 

811
00:42:36,500 --> 00:42:40,200
at the kids like every step of 
the way what to do. 

812
00:42:40,500 --> 00:42:44,500
And like by the time a kid on a 
field has processed what just 

813
00:42:44,500 --> 00:42:48,900
came in audibly from a sideline,
like a moment past, right? 

814
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:52,600
And so what you want to do, as a
leader and coach or whatever is 

815
00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:57,500
to get them to the point where 
you given them that decision. 18

816
00:42:57,500 --> 00:42:59,900
ability before they've gotten 
under the field. 

817
00:42:59,900 --> 00:43:02,900
So what you should be working on
with your leading, a company and

818
00:43:02,900 --> 00:43:05,100
everything. 
Like that is I want to hire. 

819
00:43:05,100 --> 00:43:10,200
I want to find smart people and 
I want them to I want to trust 

820
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:12,600
their decision-making. 
So I want to sort of give them 

821
00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:16,700
how decisions are made in this 
company or, you know, this 

822
00:43:16,700 --> 00:43:18,600
group, this organization, 
whatever it is. 

823
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:21,600
And then I want them to when 
they come to me. 

824
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:25,100
The best people that, you know, 
I work with. 

825
00:43:25,100 --> 00:43:29,300
They come to me with a A 
question that needs solving and 

826
00:43:29,300 --> 00:43:31,900
they already have a solution 
that they want to pitch me 

827
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:34,700
right? 
Oh nice and I love it because 

828
00:43:34,700 --> 00:43:39,000
I'm like, basically me giving 
them the okay, Yandy percent of 

829
00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:41,600
the time to proceed in the way 
that they are already thinking 

830
00:43:42,100 --> 00:43:45,900
rather than coming to me sort of
paralyzed by doubt. 

831
00:43:45,900 --> 00:43:49,200
And right, you know, sort of 
saying, you know, I think we've 

832
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:51,800
run into this problem, you know,
what should we do? 

833
00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:55,100
Because then what that does is 
that turns into days and days of

834
00:43:55,300 --> 00:43:58,400
meetings and the more people you
bring in In the slower, it goes 

835
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:00,800
and you don't necessarily even 
get to the better solution. 

836
00:44:01,100 --> 00:44:04,000
The best person to make that 
decision is the person working 

837
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:05,900
on that. 
Yeah, that's really good. 

838
00:44:06,200 --> 00:44:09,500
Yeah. 
So what about trading and 

839
00:44:09,500 --> 00:44:11,000
investing? 
What makes a great Trader? 

840
00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:13,000
An investor. 
Is it the balance that you 

841
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:16,800
mentioned earlier of knowing 
thyself, but not overanalyzing. 

842
00:44:16,900 --> 00:44:19,800
So now we need to pray. 
Yeah. 

843
00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:23,100
Not to like sort of rehash, 
that, that sort of that, that 

844
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:28,700
being in between meta-analysis 
meta analysis, paralysis and 

845
00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:32,100
overconfidence in like thinking,
you figured it out, that is The 

846
00:44:32,100 --> 00:44:34,200
Sweet Spot. 
You know, you have to figure out

847
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:38,700
your own personality as well. 
That's our show A great point is

848
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:41,000
see different personalities, 
right? 

849
00:44:41,300 --> 00:44:44,800
Particularly professionally and 
you have to trade and invest 

850
00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:47,100
based upon your personality, 
right? 

851
00:44:47,100 --> 00:44:51,300
So I've always been the type 
that can really kind of like 

852
00:44:51,500 --> 00:44:55,800
handle stress and it might have 
come from sports, right? 

853
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:58,900
Like, you know, like missing the
game winning basketball shot, 

854
00:44:58,900 --> 00:45:00,300
and then getting over it very 
quickly. 

855
00:45:00,500 --> 00:45:04,900
Yeah, that kind of mentality. 
Like, served me well in trading,

856
00:45:05,100 --> 00:45:09,200
but you might be trading, right?
A person that has that opposite 

857
00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,500
personality, where the ones 
like, you know, always thinking 

858
00:45:12,500 --> 00:45:15,000
of the risk and what could go 
wrong at all, which is great 

859
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:19,100
too, because I'm not great at 
seeing the risk necessarily in 

860
00:45:19,100 --> 00:45:23,000
the future, right where somebody
else might be better, you know, 

861
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:26,700
like well what if we go into 
hyperinflation or whatever? 

862
00:45:26,700 --> 00:45:29,300
Right, right, well, that never 
happens and it's like well, what

863
00:45:29,300 --> 00:45:31,900
if it does, right? 
You know, and so that person's 

864
00:45:31,900 --> 00:45:35,100
importance of, they need to 
figure out their own personality

865
00:45:35,100 --> 00:45:37,600
versus my personality. 
So my personal Ellie would be 

866
00:45:37,600 --> 00:45:40,900
like, oh man, I guess that is 
this, it's a small chance but I 

867
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:44,400
should be treating that as a 
Black Swan, right? 

868
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:47,200
That person needs to figure out 
their own personality me. 

869
00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:50,300
Like I'm always worried about 
the black salon, right, right. 

870
00:45:50,300 --> 00:45:54,700
So they need to like adjust 
their you know sort of paranoia 

871
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:57,000
intercept my optimism. 
Right. 

872
00:45:57,000 --> 00:45:59,600
Because we both probably 
slightly wrong, right? 

873
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:01,900
Yeah. 
And so like adjusting your sort 

874
00:46:01,900 --> 00:46:04,700
of investing and trading 
strategy to your own personality

875
00:46:04,700 --> 00:46:06,900
is really huge because then 
you're going to find out what 

876
00:46:06,900 --> 00:46:10,700
your Right. 100%, you know, 
doing options, you know, 

877
00:46:10,700 --> 00:46:13,900
market-making, we see this right
on the platform. 

878
00:46:13,900 --> 00:46:16,600
Like you can, there's certain 
people that are just, I'm just 

879
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:20,600
this type of options Trader. 
I buy stocks and I sell call 

880
00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:24,200
spreads against my stock and I 
do it over and over again, or I 

881
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:28,200
love selling iron Condors. 
Yeah, you know, in stocks and I 

882
00:46:28,200 --> 00:46:31,200
just love to collect that income
and I react really well, because

883
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:34,000
if it's about to go outside, I 
know to close it. 

884
00:46:34,100 --> 00:46:37,200
If it stays inside, I'm really 
good at keeping it, like you No,

885
00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:40,200
making the most money out of 
that income trade, right? 

886
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:42,200
Yeah. 
But that's a very specific 

887
00:46:42,200 --> 00:46:45,500
personality, right? 
And so over then there's the 

888
00:46:45,500 --> 00:46:48,900
people that are like, you know, 
I just love movements, you know.

889
00:46:48,900 --> 00:46:51,400
Stocks are stocks, I like, or 
down 25%. 

890
00:46:51,400 --> 00:46:54,800
I love to get in, and just do 
like a leverage play for its 

891
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:57,600
bounce 10%. 
And that's that person's 

892
00:46:57,600 --> 00:47:00,600
personality. 
And so finding like who you are 

893
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:04,100
and what you're good at and then
sort of like, you know, you even

894
00:47:04,100 --> 00:47:07,000
see the people like they go back
to the stocks that they know. 

895
00:47:07,300 --> 00:47:09,700
Right. 
And there's a danger of like 

896
00:47:09,700 --> 00:47:12,800
seeing patterns where there are 
no patterns, yet the Comfort 

897
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:16,500
level that allows you to surgeon
making to be, you know, if I, if

898
00:47:16,500 --> 00:47:20,400
somebody just told me to go 
trade a stock that I've never 

899
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:22,900
heard of, and I have no clue to 
the mystery, right? 

900
00:47:22,900 --> 00:47:25,700
And not going to be confident 
and again, and I'm probably 

901
00:47:25,700 --> 00:47:28,900
gonna make bad decisions, but if
somebody's like, oh, trade apple

902
00:47:28,900 --> 00:47:31,600
and I'm like, I've traded Apple 
a million times in my life like,

903
00:47:31,600 --> 00:47:34,200
right, you know, I kind of 
uncomfortable. 

904
00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:36,300
I have a good confidence. 
I would comfort level. 

905
00:47:36,400 --> 00:47:38,100
Yeah. 
I love that. 

906
00:47:38,200 --> 00:47:40,500
Actually in the book, I talk 
about the to find, here's a 

907
00:47:40,508 --> 00:47:42,800
strategy, but they all the best 
traders in the world. 

908
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:46,000
Top, 1% of Traders, they develop
their own trading strategies and

909
00:47:46,000 --> 00:47:47,500
they have anyone who wants his 
in their own way. 

910
00:47:47,600 --> 00:47:51,000
Find a way that works for you. 
Now, I know some of that may be,

911
00:47:51,900 --> 00:47:56,900
it may be very subjective and 
objective, like it might be 

912
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:59,300
correct that they have the 
confidence in that. 

913
00:47:59,300 --> 00:48:03,200
And so they make clear decisions
because I comfort level and I 

914
00:48:03,207 --> 00:48:05,400
know you may not believe that 
they actually found the one 

915
00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:08,600
thing, they're really good at 
they The one thing that they 

916
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:11,900
believe that they're good at and
there's nothing wrong with that.

917
00:48:11,900 --> 00:48:14,400
There's very little difference 
between the two right? 

918
00:48:14,500 --> 00:48:16,700
100% agree. 
Okay, beautiful. 

919
00:48:16,900 --> 00:48:20,800
So final question here is what's
the best piece of advice? 

920
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:22,500
You'd like to share with the 
audience? 

921
00:48:24,300 --> 00:48:32,300
So I would say, from from an 
options standpoint, I would keep

922
00:48:32,300 --> 00:48:39,500
going back to, there is a fear 
of the options market and there 

923
00:48:39,500 --> 00:48:42,700
is a misunderstanding of the 
options market. 

924
00:48:42,700 --> 00:48:47,200
And so the misunderstanding of 
the options Market is the casino

925
00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:50,400
and a lottery and it's a place 
to get rich quick, right? 

926
00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:53,800
So I would love people to sort 
of You know, disavowal 

927
00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:57,900
themselves of that view and then
at the same time that other 

928
00:48:57,900 --> 00:49:03,000
figure of the options Market, 
which is they, it is a place 

929
00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:07,300
where people can go and, like, 
lose their house, right? 

930
00:49:07,300 --> 00:49:11,500
It is both of those things, but 
it doesn't need to be, right? 

931
00:49:11,600 --> 00:49:14,700
So, I would say like that lesson
to, you know, to Circle back 

932
00:49:14,700 --> 00:49:18,800
entirely to the platform. 
Is, we hope that we've built 

933
00:49:18,800 --> 00:49:22,300
something that helps people see 
the options Market in that way? 

934
00:49:23,500 --> 00:49:26,200
It's neither a casino nor does 
it necessarily need to be 

935
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:30,400
something that you don't 
understand the risk of got it so

936
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:34,500
well, that was less questions. 
And I'm going to guess ask 

937
00:49:34,500 --> 00:49:37,300
another question, but this is a 
different take care. 

938
00:49:37,600 --> 00:49:39,200
So I love what you said, see see
here. 

939
00:49:39,200 --> 00:49:41,500
How do people find you get 
involved? 

940
00:49:41,500 --> 00:49:44,500
Use options a i.com. 
I know you have free tools 

941
00:49:44,500 --> 00:49:46,300
there. 
Can, you know, tell us a little 

942
00:49:46,300 --> 00:49:49,300
about the website and what 
people can do and how they get 

943
00:49:49,300 --> 00:49:51,900
involved and open up accounts 
and I'll as of work. 

944
00:49:52,200 --> 00:49:54,800
Yeah. 
So there's you know, we are 

945
00:49:55,100 --> 00:49:59,100
brokerage platform, right? 
So there's an you can apply to 

946
00:49:59,100 --> 00:50:02,600
The Brokerage and you have to 
like qualify for an account. 

947
00:50:02,700 --> 00:50:07,000
It's right now, we only offer 
options level 3 accounts, which 

948
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:11,000
means that you have enough 
experience trading and 

949
00:50:11,000 --> 00:50:15,500
particularly you've traded some 
options before that you qualify 

950
00:50:15,500 --> 00:50:17,600
to be able to trade multi like 
options. 

951
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:21,900
And there's a long story that I 
could go into on the regulatory 

952
00:50:21,900 --> 00:50:26,400
aspects of that. 
That are questionable not 

953
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:29,000
questionable. 
I see why they the the industry 

954
00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:31,700
does it, but it's basically, the
problem is that most people's 

955
00:50:31,700 --> 00:50:34,700
experience experience in options
is the very basic low 

956
00:50:34,700 --> 00:50:37,000
probability trades. 
Because the only thing that 

957
00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:40,800
allowed to start with, right? 
We are there to meet them at 

958
00:50:40,800 --> 00:50:43,000
that moment. 
They're ready to graduate to 

959
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:45,800
that next level of higher 
probability trading, right? 

960
00:50:46,200 --> 00:50:51,200
So you mentioned the free tools,
you know, and people can go on 

961
00:50:51,200 --> 00:50:52,900
options. 
Add a common read about Well, 

962
00:50:52,900 --> 00:50:55,300
you know, the brokerage and read
about the platform and watch 

963
00:50:55,300 --> 00:50:59,100
some videos and all and then I 
also write it at learn options, 

964
00:50:59,700 --> 00:51:04,100
a i.com board .ii. 
And you know, I do some 

965
00:51:04,100 --> 00:51:06,600
educational, I stand some weekly
previews. 

966
00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:10,500
I think I'm learn options on 
Twitter and so people can sort 

967
00:51:10,500 --> 00:51:13,800
of follow me that way with some 
of the more educational content.

968
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:16,300
You mentioned the free tools. 
We offer a couple of free tools 

969
00:51:16,300 --> 00:51:18,800
at the moment, like an earnings 
calendar which shows you the 

970
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:22,600
expected moves and what that 
stock did its past few. 

971
00:51:22,700 --> 00:51:25,400
Things like that. 
We offer something where you can

972
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:28,200
see the expected move like just 
type in a symbol and see the 

973
00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:32,000
expected move over time, we are 
planning on launching, hopefully

974
00:51:32,000 --> 00:51:38,500
by the end of the summer, a 
subscription version of options 

975
00:51:38,500 --> 00:51:43,500
AI, which would essentially 
allow you to use, you know, all 

976
00:51:43,500 --> 00:51:48,000
of the parts of options. 
A I was like Building Trades. 

977
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:51,800
Seeing trades, comparing, traits
traits scanner, all of these 

978
00:51:51,800 --> 00:51:55,300
visualizations. 
And things like that, you know, 

979
00:51:55,300 --> 00:51:59,800
even if you didn't want to fully
commit yet to a brokerage 

980
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:03,700
product or you're in Canada and 
you can't anyway you know like 

981
00:52:03,700 --> 00:52:05,900
those sorts of right. 
Right coming down. 

982
00:52:05,900 --> 00:52:08,400
That's coming within the next 
we're actually working on it 

983
00:52:08,400 --> 00:52:10,900
right now and that's going to be
really cool because it's going 

984
00:52:10,900 --> 00:52:15,400
to basically be you know every 
we're going to be offering what 

985
00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:18,800
we feel like is a revolution in 
this market and a completely 

986
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:20,400
different way to see this 
Market. 

987
00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:23,500
We're going to basically be you 
know of its To be available to 

988
00:52:23,500 --> 00:52:28,400
everyone and then what we were 
pretty confident that you know 

989
00:52:28,400 --> 00:52:31,200
you're going to see options a I 
then look at your existing 

990
00:52:31,200 --> 00:52:35,000
brokerage platform and be like, 
yeah, I want that. 

991
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:36,900
I want the new one. 
Hello. 

992
00:52:37,100 --> 00:52:39,800
So the more people we get in 
front of the better, you know? 

993
00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:42,000
This is awesome. 
Well, I love your mission, I 

994
00:52:42,000 --> 00:52:44,100
love what you built. 
And if I could buy calls and 

995
00:52:44,100 --> 00:52:46,700
options, they I would, it's 
fantastic. 

996
00:52:46,700 --> 00:52:49,100
I wouldn't buy single like calls
because now they know my calls 

997
00:52:49,100 --> 00:52:54,600
or any other key, exactly, but 
Your Twitter's options with an S

998
00:52:54,600 --> 00:52:57,300
learn at options. 
Learned just to be clear is that

999
00:52:57,300 --> 00:53:03,000
you learn actions, learn options
you want to check because I did 

1000
00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:04,900
you. 
I just want to double check 

1001
00:53:04,900 --> 00:53:06,700
before just solid you. 
Yeah. 

1002
00:53:06,700 --> 00:53:09,100
So it's options learned. 
That's why I'm asking I followed

1003
00:53:09,100 --> 00:53:10,100
you back. 
Yeah. 

1004
00:53:10,100 --> 00:53:12,500
It's a table to know my own 
Twitter feed. 

1005
00:53:12,500 --> 00:53:15,900
It's okay at options. 
Yeah it's options. 

1006
00:53:15,900 --> 00:53:18,500
Learn so at sign and then 
options with an S and them 

1007
00:53:18,500 --> 00:53:19,500
learn. 
Yeah. 

1008
00:53:19,700 --> 00:53:20,600
Wonderful. 
We'll see. 

1009
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:22,200
See, thank you so much for 
coming on the show and 

1010
00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:23,300
hopefully, we'll see. 
See you again soon. 

1011
00:53:23,300 --> 00:53:25,000
This is awesome. 
Excellent. 

1012
00:53:25,000 --> 00:53:26,400
Great to meet, you had to hang 
up. 

1013
00:53:26,700 --> 00:53:24,000
Likewise See you again soon. 
This is awesome. 

1014
00:53:24,300 --> 00:53:26,100
Excellent. 
Great to meet, you had to hang 

1015
00:53:26,100 --> 00:53:27,200
up. 
Likewise