In this episode, we're going to talk about what transformation
might really look like in our youth ministry settings.
This is the youth ministry mindset podcast.
Hey everybody. Welcome back to another episode
of the youth ministry mindset podcast with voices from Alpha
and why disciple out of net Ministries.
I'm your host, Josh danis joined by co-hosts Jordan Barry and
Annie grindell and today we're going to be unpacking a topic
that I'm so excited for this is actually the one I've been
looking forward to the most of all these.
And that is, what does it look like to experience
transformation? This whole series has been About
the concept of moving from transactional Ministry to
transformational Ministry and now we've laid out all the
lenses, we've had some great data and some great stories from
experts. Now let's dive into
specifically, how will things be different for us as we
experience transformational Ministry in our youth settings?
Yeah, I mean and for me it comes down to a lot of what the title
of this podcast is, is we're talking to youth ministry
mindset and while the Things in our ministry are going to change
its are also our mindset around it.
One of my favorite books, mindset, the new psychology of
success by dr. Carol dweck, I love it.
It's to me. It was just, it was, it was
revolutionary concept, but the idea is there's two mindsets
that we have a growth mindset or a fixed mindset.
Fixed mindset says, I can't and we don't strive to change or
challenge ourselves because we don't want to be seen as not
having all the answers. And the other mindset is a A
growth mindset that I'm learning.
I talk to my kids all the time like smart people don't know,
all the answers, smart people actually love when they don't
know the answer because they get to learn something new, they get
to stretch themselves, is that growth mindset?
And that's what we're talking about here in Ministry is having
a growth mindset in Ministry. There are some things that are
fixed, right? The sacraments we're not asking
anybody to change anything about the Sacramento.
We're not asking anyone to change anything about the
Liturgy or doctrine or morality. What were what were asking
people to look through is Lens of transformation that the how
matters. Yeah that our culture has
transformed dramatically in the last five years and and the way
we engage that culture in particular the way we engage
youth culture, we need to look at and be honest and say is what
I'm doing effective and is it transformational?
Yeah so we as those who minister to youth we have to be as as st.
Paul says in the scriptures be transformed by the renewal of
Our minds, we have to enter into this new time, this new space
and allow the spirit to continue to transform us as we also
continue to work and create the systems and create the support
by which the holy spirit will work to transform the hearts and
minds of young people. Yeah.
So they get it. I love how the Lord will lead
you to, where he actually wants you to go and where he wants you
to take others with. And so this transformation
process it is. As much as it is going to be,
you have to let the culture of your youth ministry, grow into
this, the Lord is going to lead you in this as well, and and you
can't. I keep saying Minnesota, the
Overflow of your heart and what it basically, I'm saying is this
isn't real for you don't even try like this has to be real for
you, and because that's what students are looking for.
Hmm. I also like the example of the
Eucharist Rite, we talked about the Eucharist as both, the
source and the summit of our Christian faith.
And the truth is that we Could go to the Eucharist every week
or even, we could go every day and it could just be an activity
for us. It could just be a box that were
checking, that's transactional. Yeah.
But if it's going to become the summit for us, then it's the
source that we enter into in receive.
And we become transformed. We become like Christ in the
Eucharist and so, that's, that's a journey.
It's not just an activity, it's a journey.
And the activity is a movement forward in the journey.
So likewise in our youth ministry and frankly, all of our
ministry, it's not just Just things that we do, it's
something that we're becoming him.
So how do we apply this with some specifics?
How can we make this more real for folks?
Yeah, and I think as you're becoming and as you see in your
culture shift that you will come across some different challenges
along the way. But you got to hang on to the
Small Things, the small wins the small moments where you can
celebrate and I'll give one of examples.
And so there was a time when one kid was Literally we we put this
protocol in place where if you have a kid that's totally acting
out. You you first thing is you just
request. Hey, can you chill?
And when they can't, the second thing you do is you receive them
and receipt them in a circle whatever and typically that
solves 99.9 percent the problems because you're not next to the
repairs better go they like have to take a step back from the
rest of the circle. No you literally put them in
different spot in the circle. Okay?
Like like you literally receipt them or we seat them.
Okay. Yeah.
So it's request receipt. Eat.
And then the third one is removed.
Now, it's not as drastic as sounds basically.
Remove is Big Bad. Jordan comes in and says, hey
come hang out with me. So there's one time this one
kids actually doing that. And, you know, he's a really
troubled kid and we knew that from the beginning and he does
leader comes to me, says look like he can't, he can't make it
today and I was like, oh, I'll go hang off them's.
Okay, let's go play some ping-pong.
I'm just gonna didn't name him Bob.
Okay, hey, Bob no kids named Bob, but hey Bob's, go play some
ping-pong so we wouldn't play. Ping pong and he clearly was not
having it and I was like, oh that's go.
So we go sit down next to each other said, hey Bob how can I,
how can I pray for you? And he immediately starts
crying. We literally starts bawling in
front of me and he tells me because I'm telling you what's
happening. He said, his dad is incarcerated
and was actually just stabbed and died and he just found out
that his mom has cancer. So he has to live with his aunt
and I'm looking at him like Yeah, I think I would be just as
acting out at all levels like you and and I'm what if I was in
the situation where I just told him get your stuff together man,
you have to get in line. Let's go sit down in that
Circle. Stop like you, what would he
feel in the moment I was able to minister and say hey let's pray
about this. Thank you for telling me this.
Tell me more. How you feeling what's going on?
And and I think that was a moment.
I was a little small breakthrough for that and then
the same kid I had this. Other Mom call me and it was
like yeah she asked me he said what kind of kids you got going
to your ministry and I was like ones that need Jesus.
Like what am I supposed to say? I mean but in the end and then
the moment I was realizing that oh I have to teach others to
extend Grace, just as much as I'm asking my leaders and other
students to extend Grace and those are shifted in the church.
It's like we need to extend Grace to our young people.
Our young people are Getting we need to extend Grace.
Yeah, I think of a time when there is, there is a small group
that was meeting at another coffee shop in town.
And this, it was a it was a student that was interested in
getting it started reached out to this adult in the parish and
said hey will you be our Mentor invited several of her friends
to be part of this small group and after a few weeks, the
leader realize that too Of the young women in the group, didn't
go to church. This wasn't terribly unusual,
but in particular these girls their families had stopped going
to church over Scandal. There had been something
scandalous that it happened in the church and there was hurt
and and their parents said, no, but they started going to this
small group because, because the young woman who invited them was
their friend, she was safe and the coffee shop was safe.
That it if it had been on our Turf.
There's a good chance we never would have seen these girls
because their parents were like, yeah, no, we want nothing to do
with this. But this, this Mentor was
walking with these young women in and through this hurt.
And one day at at Easter Mass, I turned around.
I was an overflow seating with all my kids, you know, making a
racket. And I turned around to deal with
one of my kids and here's one of these families.
The whole family is there at mass and it started because it
was a safe place for them and it was a place of invitation and it
was a place of relationship. It didn't start with.
Oh guys, you don't go to church, you should be going to church.
You should be going to church next week.
This was this was a probably a year into this small group and
the relationships that they had built.
And that that leader was faithful and Loved These Girls
and encourage these girls and still invited them to come to
mass and it took a long time but eventually it happened and and
the thing when I think transformation, I think slow.
So often we think Paul getting knocked down on the road to
Damascus and then becoming the greatest apostle that happens
sometimes but more often transformation is slow and it's
a gradual process that we don't even see happening in the
moment. Yeah.
Yeah, I had an experience with confirmation timo's, helping out
with last year and similar Dynamic showed up.
Beginning and actually lucky me, I got all the cool kids, right?
And they know they're the cool kids and they're too cool for
school and they're they're all having a great time with it and
I'm terrified of. But I noticed that just by kind
of just relaxing and not taking everything.
So seriously and allowing one week to build on another and I
didn't define success as having a A breakthrough one week.
I just define success as they're coming back and the journey
going to keep going. And then, as we're approaching
the time, when we were getting ready for confirmation, we
started having more serious conversations.
It was clear that they were learning content, but I want to
know what's really going on there.
I wanted some proof that A change is happening.
And so I'm asking, hey, what's going on?
Where are you? What does this mean to you?
And one young young men in particular Bob, of course, and
up apologies. If there actually is When
you're, of course, there might be some problem apology to them.
But to this young man, Bob, he turned to the group and he said,
I got to be honest guys, I don't know yet.
How I feel about all this Faith stuff, but I know that this
group of all of you on our time together here is important to me
and it wasn't, I'm having fun at I'd rather do this than
something else. It was, it was important at the
time. I kind of walked away a little
bit dejected but the more I reflected, I thought, no this Is
this is one small step in a larger process of transformation
and I have to be okay with that. Yeah.
And you have to guard it and it's protect it and you have to
continue to nurture it because it's not you can't there's no
Silver Bullet to this. You have to Champion it and it
takes time and you just have to continue to battle and battle
and battle in such a way that you're fighting for something
and you're fighting for this generation because these are the
things that actually will cultivate into lasting impact.
Austin. Yep.
And that transformation is on all levels.
It's personal conversion. It's that slow transformation
from the adult. Being the volunteer with a
textbook, in a classroom, to them being a mentor to young
people. That's, that's a slow
transformation. It's a slow transformation.
Getting our parishes to understand what this is going to
be, but it happened step by step by step.
Jordan, I heard you use a great word in there.
You just said, Silver Bullet. He said it's there's no Silver
Bullet. It and that word.
I have a love-hate relationship with the expression, silver
bullet because I totally agree with you.
There are no silver bullets. And yet sometimes when we see
people having recorded testimonies about their love for
Alpha, they described it as a silver bullet and I just know
it's not a silver bullet. Okay, why disciple is the
But I'd love to invite you Jordan to unpack for us.
What is it? We want to see happen.
So here's the thing you can run Alpha and Alpha and bodies.
All things were talking about but you can run Alpha and miss
it. You can miss all of this and you
can run Alpha because it's good content and we paid a couple
million dollars to produce it because the guys are engaging in
discussion format but you can run it and it Be OK.
And then then it just be okay and not go anywhere.
And the thing is with Alpha is is you have to run it and they
need to work at these pieces of this culture.
You have to do the work of developing this.
In the ministry of being real, a being relational, being Reliant,
and being reproducible, you have to do that work.
And if you do that work, you will find that you will see a
lot of young people coming to Jesus and becoming lifelong
Disciples of Jesus, because this is what gen Z is looking for.
Now, I think we said earlier, the These are just some of the
big rocks. I think there are a lot of the
big rocks that were talking about, they're not, I wouldn't
say they're all of them but they're probably a majority of
them. These are the big ones, and if
we get them right, I think we will see a generation rather
than walking away. They'll walk toward.
And then they'll bring all their friends with him.
Yeah. And how about, for why disciple?
What do you want to see in as why disciple works with young
people? Yeah, I mean, I agree with that.
That same concept like If you think you're going to get
something that you're going to just press play, and you're
going to make disciples, you're going to be grossly
disappointed. If you're looking for a, for a,
for a product that has all the answers, you can be grossly
disappointed not just in this, but in any product because it's
not the product, it's not the, it's not the resource even, the
content is great, and I'm very proud of the the direction,
we're taking the content, but that still doesn't matter.
Because it's the Flesh and Blood person in the room, it's the
culture in which this Happens that matters.
That's why one of the things we're really committed to is
putting out just as much training content as we are
putting out content for teens because it's funny that you guys
are using the name. Bob Bob is like the Avatar in
our office. He's Bob the small group leaders
who we talked about like I want to break into that guy's world.
The guy who volunteered because he felt guilty that they were
making another Pulpit announcement, want to teach him
how to be a disciple maker, but it, but it's more than just the
resource and it's That that context of small group
discipleship and we want to give people tools to disciple young
people. But ours isn't the only tool and
you would say the like why disciple an alpha carry this
culture. But if you're intentional with
it it can flourish. Yes.
Absolutely. And the truth is that really any
tool out there if used with the right transformational
mentality? Yeah can't do this.
Now we have worked intentionally in our development of Alpha and
our development of why disciple to try to make them tools.
That compliment, that assist you, in driving the culture of
transformation that we hope that you want that, we know that we
all want, but ultimately, if you are dead set in a transactional
mentality, these won't help you. And for that matter, if you're
dead set in a transformational mentality, you can take pretty
much any tool and it's going to help you and you can apply these
to any kind of content and it will work and you won't be
asking, you know, Alpha for our beta and you won't be asking why
disciple to crank out more stuff, you know like Like it'll
be, it'll be different. Yeah, I hope you guys have heard
throughout all this content that we're not trying to pitch or
trying to convince you to utilize the alpha content of the
widest table content. But we did discuss briefly
together. What would it look like to
invite people? Because obviously, we're always
about partnership, always about finding ways to effectively work
together. And so if a church did want to
utilize Alpha and why disciple in conjunction with each other,
and what do you think that would look like?
Yeah, it's funny because the very first conversation that
Arden. And I had, we saw this interplay
between what we do. Because in the process of
conversion, the first thing that happens, one of the first things
that happens is evangelization and that's what, that's what you
all do. So well, in explaining the
Catholic faith to somebody, who has no the Christian Christian
faith to somebody who has no context for it.
But that's, that's step one. And we've always described
ourselves is the step to that, discipleship isn't the first
step that there's an encounter. Ants on a retreat or event or
going through something like Alpha.
And then why disciple is here to give you the tools to accompany
young people and give them the basics of living that Christian
Life. And so you and I were talking
about the interplay between what we do and we got off the, got
off, the zoom call and I got on canva, which is like one of my
favorite tools out there for like design and I drew up, just
this little, we keep calling it. The flow chart of what it would
look like. If Alpha and why disciple were
working in tandem with one another in this kind of
transformational culture, not just as side-by-side programs,
that's not going to do it. So what we were talking about
was first, you know, the first step in the process is
evangelization. So so run Alpha, run Alpha youth
with your with your students so that they have a chance to
encounter the person of Jesus. And then, because Alpha is
Designed in these tables right where its hospitality, and
they've got these groups that they're with throughout their
entire Alpha experience that they've experienced some
vulnerability with. They're already in there
stretching, those muscles and Faith sharing those very
quickly, very easily could turn into a discipleship group and
they stay continuing to journey together and honestly disciples
start to desire to make other disciples.
So taking those students who have Grown in their, their
Journey as as Christians and having them become table leaders
and run Alpha like a can become this this cycle not of content
after content after content but of expanding culture.
My one of my favorite things that that Jim beckman's said,
when I went to his first training on why disciple so many
years ago, and I said that would never work.
He said, discipleship isn't linear.
It is sick. Euler, Circular with penetrating
depth. Hmm.
I think we're, we talked about this, we're good at doing the
circular thing, but we missed that penetrating depth.
And and so that was just this Vision we've had.
And then the, my favorite part is not just like, hey, we came
up with this idea, and now, we're doing a podcast, you're
welcome. But we started talking about
this and then out of nowhere, I'm not kidding you.
Every time I would talk to Jordan that day.
Or the next day, every time I would get a call from a youth
Minister, who would say we've Running Alpha Youth and we see
why disciple being you know where we can take our tables.
Next, I got a call from somebody else.
Saying, hey, we've been running my disciple and now I want to
have my kids who've been in, why disciple start leaving tables
for Alpha. Are we crazy?
I mean, it was, it was every single time we would have one of
these meeting. Another youth Minister would pop
up and say, I have this idea and there's so there's people out
there who are actually doing that.
Sounds great. You want to add to that Jordan?
Yeah. Those people doing this and I
think we're just talking about it.
It and and then maybe we can just encourage you and say just
give it a go try it. You know, you don't have to use
Alpha, you don't have to use y disciple but do these things
because we know this is working, you could let Alpha and - I will
help you guide you in that culture.
But this culture is the thing that's going to matter and if we
can do this together we can see a whole generation come to Jesus
and follow him and it would be electric for the whole church.
Have you only thing I'd want to add is we aren't coming with a
perfectly formulated. Process that we would expect
people to implement on the contrary.
We're frankly coming with more questions than we are with
answers. Yep, we presented a possibility
and we would love for you as youth ministers and youth
leaders to Tinker and to play and to improve upon and most,
especially make it organic, so that you can respond to the
specific needs of the young people in your situation.
And, of course, make it Spirit lead, pray and discern.
How is God asking you to utilize why disciple resources Alpha
resources or One else has resources out there or your own
resources that you're working on in creating because the Holy
Spirit has been guiding you in such a way as to build a
transformational culture. All right guys, we're in this
special transformation, Focus session.
But that doesn't mean we're going to slide away from my
favorite question to end things with.
If you got 10 minutes to sit down with adult youth leaders,
To talk about this concept of transformation with them.
What is the last point? You want to make sure to leave
them with the most important thing in all of this because it
can feel like drinking from a fire hydrant.
Right? You know, there's so much and
and we can say on one side. Like that's that's so much, I
can't have time for that. I'm just going to maintain the
status quo and then on the other side, there's there's the
concept of trying to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Right. Like, I'm going to throw my
entire Ministry and we're going to do.
X, Y, or Z? You know why disciple?
Alpha told me he's like oh no, no, no.
You did not say that but my encouragement is just to start
small to to take time and discern.
Where the Lord is calling you to transform.
Yeah. Start start small but don't stay
small. Hmm we always talk about.
We talk about My disciple, think mustard seed to movement, right?
Start with one small thing and then let it grow from there
because know the Lord wants to do something big with it.
He wants to do something big with it, but first, we need to
do one thing. What's one area of your ministry
where you're going to apply this?
You were telling us earlier about a book called The one
thing. Yeah.
One of my favorites. It's by Dan Keller of Keller
Williams Realty so it's not better.
Yeah. Okay.
It's not a Christian book. All only author I've ever
written a book to and said this changed everything for me.
I got a car back so that was kind of cool but the concept is
that as specially as westerners we have a tendency of trying to
do all the things right and multitasking is considered a
virtue but when we multitask we actually do nothing.
Well and in the main thread in the book is what is the one
thing? What is the one thing that I can
do? Do in fill in the blank in, in
my Ministry, in my my exercise in my marriage, in my work.
What is the one thing that I can do that by doing that one thing
makes everything else easier or unnecessary?
Hmm, one thing. And I started to ask that
question in Ministry and it and my Ministry started to shift and
it started to improve and some things became easier and other
things became unnecessary. That's fantastic.
I think for me, the One thing I would want to leave our youth
ministry Leaders with is to just be hopeful, we have covered so
much ground, we've explored so many ways in which we can begin
to improve our systems and our vision and our orientation.
As we strive to serve the 21st century church.
And frankly, we could take a mentality that this is daunting.
But this is way too hard for all of us.
We could see how far we could potentially have to go and just
be deflated by it or Or we could remember that this is a Spirit
Led exercise and that the holy spirit is giving us great dreams
and giving us great visions and is inspiring us to go where we
have the potential to go. And as long as we're doing it,
one more thing at a time, building, and building and
building. Then there's no reason we
shouldn't be encouraged and hopeful about everything that
could be possible for this church.
Hmm. How about you Jordan?
There's lots of things that run through my mind, maybe if I,
I'll get to one thing. But it's art.
We'll just we'll just record it all over again.
Yeah. But I just want to encourage
everyone, listening that what you do matters, what you do, it
matters. It matters a lot and you may
feel discouraged right now but as maybe I'm the voice coming
through, whatever you're listening to that, what you do
matters and hopefully, this was encouraging to you.
But if I was to do the one thing like, say of all this that we
just talked about maybe one thing, May I suggest that you
lean in to the Holy Spirit, lean into Reliance in the holy spirit
because that will be the beginning of how all the rest of
this will unfold. And because God wants to lead
you where he wants to take you and where he wants to take
others. And so we have to go there
first. So, that's what I would say.
For a for you, one thing, lean into the holy That rely on the
Holy Spirit. What does that look like for
your ministry? Personally, for your ministry,
for your family? If you're a dad, like me, was it
mean for your family? Yeah.
All of it. Why don't we go ahead?
Then and close this out. Can I ask each of you to pray
for all of our listeners? All of our guests?
Yeah. And inviting the Holy Spirit.
Come Holy Spirit. Come Holy Spirit.
Holy Spirit, we ask that you you
rain down On all of the people who are dedicated to serving
young people in the church that you inspire the hearts of your
faithful to reach out in new ways, with new Artur, bringing
them back to the same gospel. because we know that that a
young person's life is better with Jesus in it than without we
ask that you inspire those people in the trenches.
Volunteer, paid everything in between.
To be committed to transformation in their
Ministry. Whatever that's going to look
like in their context Lord that you would be king and they would
lean on your inspiration in all that they are doing.
Hello. Are we pray for renewal?
what we do, pray that you would fill every person listening to
this podcast With Your Love. God, did you refresh them?
That you would in some way show them again that you are living
water. Lord, we need you.
This generation needs you. Give us courage, Lord.
Help us. Help us as we lean in.
Would you guide us and give us strength?
Would you would you highlight others that we can walk with in
this? And bring about something for
this generation. Feels like a tsunami but a
really good one. So Rises the Tide Lord, we need
it. And we ask all this with an in
Jesus Christ, Our Savior, amen. Well, thank you guys so much for
joining us throughout this journey of the youth ministry
mindset podcast. I've been your host.
Josh danis joined with Jordan Berry and any grandal.
It's been a lot of fun for us to have these conversations and
we're looking forward to your questions and your thoughts,
your stories and hopefully to connecting with you online,
social media, and even in your city as well.
You've been listening to the youth ministry mindset podcast,
Thanks again, we'll see you soon.
This has been a youth ministry mindset podcast, a limited
series with voices from Alpha and why disciple to view the
show notes from today's episode or to submit a question for our
host visit youth ministry. Mindset.com, be sure to stay
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connect with Alpha on Facebook at facebook.com slash alpha or
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church through Retreat. And discipleship Ministry, 2.2
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mission of net Ministries or to book a net Retreat.
Visit net usa.org, we'll see you next time.
Why disciple leader or at why? Disciple.com the youth ministry
mindset podcast is sponsored by net Ministries.
Net, Ministries, challenging young, Catholics to love Christ
and embrace the life of the church through Retreat.
And discipleship Ministry, 2.2 million young people reach since
1981 to learn more about the mission of net Ministries or to
book a net Retreat. Visit net usa.org, we'll see you
next time.