1 00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:16,700 Welcome to loud and clear on this. 2 00:00:16,700 --> 00:00:19,800 Now, the fourth episode of the second season of the larimar 3 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:23,600 podcast podcast, created for people who give a shit about 4 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:24,500 advertising. Today. 5 00:00:24,500 --> 00:00:27,800 We have Christopher Farrell who needs no introduction. 6 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:31,100 He was one of our guests on previous episode, the role of ad 7 00:00:31,100 --> 00:00:32,600 agencies in the time of open them. 8 00:00:33,100 --> 00:00:37,500 This time Chris is accompanied by another Chris, but Owens who 9 00:00:37,500 --> 00:00:40,400 is a brand strategist at the richest group, and I think 10 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:43,900 ending for the group in general, delivering I open and inside for 11 00:00:43,900 --> 00:00:47,400 Brands and inspiring talks to the rest of us from time to 12 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:49,500 time. I remember a couple of really 13 00:00:49,500 --> 00:00:52,700 good talk that I came out inspired by for those of you who 14 00:00:52,700 --> 00:00:55,500 follow the podcast. Mr. Owens is responsible for 15 00:00:55,500 --> 00:00:58,700 bringing Michael fan. Well, to talk with us about his 16 00:00:58,800 --> 00:01:02,200 stop making sense. Book a couple of episodes ago. 17 00:01:02,300 --> 00:01:03,800 Thank you. Uh, Chris for that. 18 00:01:03,800 --> 00:01:06,300 And thank you both for being here. 19 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:09,700 We are still recording this from the distance of our homes. 20 00:01:09,900 --> 00:01:13,100 And this time, exploring a new technology, which now allows us 21 00:01:13,100 --> 00:01:15,700 to see each other. Welcome guys. 22 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:17,500 Thanks for having us. Yeah. 23 00:01:17,500 --> 00:01:20,300 Thank you by back. No, thank you. 24 00:01:20,308 --> 00:01:23,300 It's great to have you the last time it was the first week that 25 00:01:23,300 --> 00:01:25,400 the country was shutting down because of covid-19. 26 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:28,500 And now, we're just looking back. 27 00:01:28,500 --> 00:01:32,300 I can't believe that it was just yesterday that two months ago. 28 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:36,200 When, when this episode came out, we've been on lockdown for 29 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:38,600 two months. And this week, think seems, at 30 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:43,000 least here in Texas, during the starting or intending to open 31 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:46,000 up. There's been many covid industry 32 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:48,400 reports. There's been brainstorms. 33 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:52,000 There's been povs and some surviving campaigns that we 34 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:54,500 could opening things up partially at least here. 35 00:01:54,500 --> 00:01:56,200 And we did promise that we were going to be back. 36 00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:58,600 And here we are. We know what's going on the 37 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:02,300 world, somehow somewhat, but do we know what's happening in? 38 00:02:02,700 --> 00:02:04,200 Sizing. What have we seen? 39 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:09,000 Do we have a better definition of the role of Ad Agency after 40 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:11,200 two months of being stuck into this. 41 00:02:11,300 --> 00:02:14,300 I think the only thing we know for sure is that nothing is the 42 00:02:14,300 --> 00:02:18,200 same as it was pre-pandemic crisper and I have talked a 43 00:02:18,208 --> 00:02:22,300 bunch about this. I think we have to fully Embrace 44 00:02:22,300 --> 00:02:27,100 just how significantly businesses our customers and 45 00:02:27,100 --> 00:02:32,000 people have changed because of this whatever you thought was, 46 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:35,500 right. Or upside down or left or right 47 00:02:35,500 --> 00:02:37,500 about your customer before the pandemic. 48 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:40,700 There's a good chance that it's totally different now and we'll 49 00:02:40,700 --> 00:02:42,300 be Christopher. I don't know if you want to 50 00:02:42,300 --> 00:02:46,100 touch on but this notion of pre-pandemic and post pandemic 51 00:02:46,100 --> 00:02:49,100 marketing might be an interesting starting point, 52 00:02:49,300 --> 00:02:52,900 regardless of what time it is, or what era we've been in there, 53 00:02:52,900 --> 00:02:56,300 you're always going to find a group of people, whether that be 54 00:02:56,300 --> 00:03:01,300 consumers or clients who just for whatever reason, nostalgic, 55 00:03:01,300 --> 00:03:06,000 Lee loves the way things. Is to be and assume that there 56 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:10,400 were some kind of stasis or normalcy that they could rely on 57 00:03:10,400 --> 00:03:13,200 and patterns that they could just kind of draft off of and 58 00:03:13,200 --> 00:03:15,800 always hope that things can just always be that way. 59 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:17,800 And then there's always another group of people who are, like, 60 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:22,000 sort of a creative destruction assists, who can't wait to say 61 00:03:22,300 --> 00:03:24,700 everything's different. And we need to rebuild 62 00:03:24,700 --> 00:03:28,000 everything right now and, and then Anna, and you know, how how 63 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:30,400 many times have we seen the book, you know, the end of 64 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:32,800 advertising be published or something like that? 65 00:03:32,900 --> 00:03:36,000 Us and the death of this and the death of that and things up 66 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:39,200 every generation wants to be the author of that book, right? 67 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:43,800 The same kind of I don't know tribal Tendencies or ideologies 68 00:03:44,500 --> 00:03:47,500 are just representing themselves here in the pandemic and that 69 00:03:47,500 --> 00:03:51,600 there's a lot of clients and consumers who just can't wait 70 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:54,100 for things to get back to quote unquote normal. 71 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:58,700 And they're willing to try and pantomime as much normalcy as 72 00:03:58,700 --> 00:04:00,600 possible in order to convince themselves. 73 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:03,600 That things are normal and there's There's another group 74 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:07,100 who just can't wait to hit the reset button and get back up 75 00:04:07,100 --> 00:04:09,900 into his kind of startup mentality, but they were always 76 00:04:09,900 --> 00:04:13,000 that way, you know, and this is just gives them a new excuse to 77 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:16,300 kind of play out these different ideologies that they have. 78 00:04:16,300 --> 00:04:18,899 And I think what Chris and I have talked a lot about is 79 00:04:18,899 --> 00:04:21,500 really where most everything then lands is kind of in the 80 00:04:21,500 --> 00:04:25,200 messy middle somewhere in-between those two opposite. 81 00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:29,500 Polar valence is never really play out to the degree or to the 82 00:04:29,500 --> 00:04:32,800 Fidelity in which these people want them to but there's always 83 00:04:32,900 --> 00:04:36,900 Something, you know, in the middle, I think perhaps for a 84 00:04:36,900 --> 00:04:41,600 lot of people listening to this, you've on the left side of this, 85 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:43,500 I kind of think. Well, not really left or right. 86 00:04:43,500 --> 00:04:47,000 I shouldn't put it that way, but on the side, who wishes things 87 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:51,600 could get get back to normal. You'll find that they're they 88 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:54,700 have this kind of stop drop and roll approach to what to do 89 00:04:54,700 --> 00:04:57,900 right now, which is kind of like cut cancel or hold your media in 90 00:04:57,900 --> 00:05:00,500 your messaging, right? And they do. 91 00:05:00,500 --> 00:05:03,900 So the whole piece is the one that Sends me the most because 92 00:05:03,900 --> 00:05:06,800 hold waiting for what. Well, then they have to come up 93 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:08,500 with some kind of metric or rash. 94 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:11,800 Chanel's to win. That might be when inevitably 95 00:05:12,400 --> 00:05:15,000 the whole country didn't shut down all at once, the whole 96 00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:17,700 country won't start back up all at once. 97 00:05:18,500 --> 00:05:22,500 So you're need to be more flexible and more Dynamic. 98 00:05:22,500 --> 00:05:26,500 And more adaptive has never been tested more than right now. 99 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:28,600 Yeah, I think that's a good point. 100 00:05:28,600 --> 00:05:30,100 Right? Like when you see something 101 00:05:30,100 --> 00:05:32,700 coming in and I think we discussed this was like, dear. 102 00:05:32,900 --> 00:05:36,600 And a headlight, you don't know, really what to do when the 103 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:39,900 sentiment of people in general is. 104 00:05:39,900 --> 00:05:43,600 We know we've stopped because we have to, but there are certain 105 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:45,500 things. We're still consuming, right? 106 00:05:45,500 --> 00:05:47,200 We're still consumers, were still leaving. 107 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:49,500 We're still consuming entertainment. 108 00:05:49,500 --> 00:05:52,600 We're still having breakfast lunch and dinner. 109 00:05:52,700 --> 00:05:54,800 We're still laughing. We're still loving. 110 00:05:54,900 --> 00:05:58,600 What's the role of Brands there, right and agencies, how can we I 111 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:02,000 think the biggest challenge at least for me has been putting up 112 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:05,500 in a very Rational way for clients that, it still makes 113 00:06:05,500 --> 00:06:08,400 sense to have an approach with consumers and that life goes on 114 00:06:08,700 --> 00:06:12,900 regardless and how do we reinvent if necessary their 115 00:06:12,900 --> 00:06:14,900 brand? But continue with the plan that 116 00:06:14,900 --> 00:06:18,000 probably was already there and just a lot of things have just 117 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,200 accelerated like, e-commerce and certain things. 118 00:06:21,100 --> 00:06:25,100 Yeah, feels like we're, we talk. So often about at least in the 119 00:06:25,108 --> 00:06:27,500 marketing world, the impact that covid-19. 120 00:06:27,500 --> 00:06:31,000 It has had on businesses, but I wish and perhaps the role of 121 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:33,700 agencies is to push the conversation about People and 122 00:06:33,700 --> 00:06:37,700 just how significantly, this is impacted customers and consumer 123 00:06:37,700 --> 00:06:43,100 Behavior because the level of need that someone has today 124 00:06:43,100 --> 00:06:45,500 versus 10 weeks ago, is radically different. 125 00:06:45,500 --> 00:06:47,700 The things that they want, more of the things that they want, 126 00:06:47,700 --> 00:06:50,500 less of the things that they want from businesses and things 127 00:06:50,500 --> 00:06:52,000 that I want less from businesses. 128 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:55,400 That's a really good important starting point, because I keep 129 00:06:55,400 --> 00:06:59,000 be crisper brought it up this sort of desire to go back to 130 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,700 normal, but I don't think there's any going back. 131 00:07:03,100 --> 00:07:07,600 What it was before the pandemic, I think they're certainly we're 132 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:10,300 going to be human. We're still going to have all of 133 00:07:10,300 --> 00:07:12,300 the needs Francisco that you laid out. 134 00:07:12,300 --> 00:07:17,900 But I think there's a new way of approaching how Brands can be 135 00:07:17,900 --> 00:07:21,400 most meaningful to people moving forward. 136 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:24,500 And that's kind of this messy middle that that I think we need 137 00:07:24,500 --> 00:07:28,000 to embrace and figure out because, you know, if this is 138 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:32,700 uncertain and chaotic, I mean, the natural tendencies. 139 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:35,500 I want order in to want to restore some semblance of 140 00:07:35,500 --> 00:07:37,600 predictability. We see it everywhere. 141 00:07:37,900 --> 00:07:41,500 But I think right now they're just so many new places and 142 00:07:41,500 --> 00:07:43,700 spaces that people are trying to figure out. 143 00:07:43,700 --> 00:07:46,500 And on top of that health and safety concerns, that just 144 00:07:46,500 --> 00:07:50,600 didn't exist in many pockets. At least in America eight to ten 145 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:52,700 weeks ago. I wish we talk more about more 146 00:07:52,700 --> 00:07:56,300 about people is kind of, I think the role that agencies can do a 147 00:07:56,308 --> 00:07:59,400 lot more of. Yeah, I think that's almost all 148 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:02,600 responsibility, right? Like to as agencies. 149 00:08:02,900 --> 00:08:05,100 You know, we tend or the conversation is to look at 150 00:08:05,100 --> 00:08:08,500 Brands, but it's almost like we should be shifting or 151 00:08:08,500 --> 00:08:11,700 conversation of like you're saying to people so that were 152 00:08:11,700 --> 00:08:15,000 able to come up with Solutions and bring to the Brand's 153 00:08:15,100 --> 00:08:17,800 Solutions of what we're seeing as far as how people are 154 00:08:17,800 --> 00:08:19,400 behaving. A lot of this. 155 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:23,200 I'm curious to see what you guys are thinking, but we save The 156 00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:26,800 New Normal how things have changed, but a lot of this our 157 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:29,900 behaviors that we had with technologies that were already 158 00:08:29,900 --> 00:08:32,700 available like, you know, the conference that we're now. 159 00:08:32,799 --> 00:08:36,400 Having or e-commerce or click and pick their certain things 160 00:08:36,400 --> 00:08:39,500 that were already there that with this, just kind of 161 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:45,600 exponentially took took it to adoption in human behavior. 162 00:08:45,700 --> 00:08:46,700 What are you guys thinking there? 163 00:08:46,900 --> 00:08:48,700 There's a ton of stuff that's accelerated. 164 00:08:48,700 --> 00:08:51,400 Adoption that, you know, we're already the seeds of we're in 165 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:53,500 the making. I mean this exact meeting that 166 00:08:53,500 --> 00:08:56,700 we're having face-to-face on Microsoft teams, and we do it on 167 00:08:56,700 --> 00:08:59,900 zoom and it's just fascinating. See the rise of Technology. 168 00:08:59,900 --> 00:09:03,100 That's existed for years. Now all of a sudden Fully 169 00:09:03,100 --> 00:09:05,800 Embrace out of necessity. And I think on the other side, 170 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:10,100 there's a rapid acceleration of cracks that already existed in 171 00:09:10,100 --> 00:09:12,800 various systems that are now even more apparent. 172 00:09:12,800 --> 00:09:18,900 But I don't think many of the symptoms that the pandemic has. 173 00:09:18,900 --> 00:09:24,100 Highlighted our new there, just now more apparent, both both 174 00:09:24,100 --> 00:09:26,500 good and bad. Yeah, we always talk about 175 00:09:26,500 --> 00:09:29,100 particularly a strategist, you know, how about the importance 176 00:09:29,100 --> 00:09:32,300 of cultural relevancy and cultural currency? 177 00:09:32,300 --> 00:09:36,900 And Adding the Top Spin on this and that and you know that this 178 00:09:36,900 --> 00:09:39,300 is a cultural moment. I think that should go without 179 00:09:39,300 --> 00:09:44,500 saying but you start to find out how variable that is take. 180 00:09:44,500 --> 00:09:47,600 For example videoconferencing. I mean, it's always been 181 00:09:47,700 --> 00:09:51,300 relevant for a number of reasons whether that be oh you can't pay 182 00:09:51,300 --> 00:09:53,800 for air travel or how do you stay more kind of ambiently or 183 00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:56,400 remotely connected to people? It's kind of some semblance of 184 00:09:56,400 --> 00:10:00,600 one-on-one but the cultural relevance when the culture 185 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:04,300 shifts to pandemic culture. The relevant skyrockets. 186 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:06,700 And so then there's also culturally relevant sites. 187 00:10:06,900 --> 00:10:10,900 Where there are certain things that in fact had a lot more 188 00:10:10,900 --> 00:10:15,200 utility and usefulness pre-pandemic, and as that 189 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:19,100 culture has shifted, then the amplitude of the relevancy is 190 00:10:19,100 --> 00:10:22,500 either gone up or down on things as culture. 191 00:10:22,500 --> 00:10:25,400 It goes to kind of shelter in place culture, you start to see 192 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:28,800 these, you know, interesting little anomalies lets, you know, 193 00:10:28,800 --> 00:10:32,600 let's bake bread baked bread, all day and watch. 194 00:10:32,800 --> 00:10:36,900 Ouch, you know, docu-series and Animal Crossing and all this 195 00:10:36,900 --> 00:10:39,000 stuff and things. Don't necessarily kind of hit 196 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:42,000 that level at the amplitude. In free roam culture. 197 00:10:42,300 --> 00:10:44,900 Meanwhile, when you've got free roam culture, you see people 198 00:10:44,900 --> 00:10:48,600 almost like want to leave the home for home sake and just 199 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:51,000 drastically want something different than what their what 200 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:52,700 their yesterday was. Whether it's good for them or 201 00:10:52,700 --> 00:10:55,000 not. And thus, then other things 202 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:57,900 start to kind of pop up and down and so these things are always 203 00:10:58,300 --> 00:11:00,400 changing. It just so happens that culture 204 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:05,600 has shifted so dramatically. At certain aspects of business 205 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:08,300 technology client wants and needs products. 206 00:11:08,300 --> 00:11:11,500 And services, have either like totally benefited in ways that 207 00:11:11,500 --> 00:11:15,400 you would have never imagined or have just completely depleted 208 00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:19,200 past the point of efficacy or usefulness or profitability in 209 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:20,900 ways that you would have never imagined. 210 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:22,200 Yeah. Yeah. 211 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:24,100 Yeah, I think that so I highlight that. 212 00:11:24,300 --> 00:11:28,100 I don't know if you guys saw the Rene redzepi and Noma his 213 00:11:28,100 --> 00:11:31,300 restaurant in Copenhagen Michelin star. 214 00:11:31,300 --> 00:11:32,600 Number one, restaurant in the world. 215 00:11:32,700 --> 00:11:37,400 Old for the past several years. They reopened but as a no 216 00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:43,700 reservation Burger Bar open to all individuals in Copenhagen 217 00:11:43,700 --> 00:11:46,700 that just need a burger and a beer. 218 00:11:46,700 --> 00:11:50,300 And so like I think just think about that for a moment, a 300 219 00:11:50,300 --> 00:11:57,500 dollar a plate restaurant on top of the world reopens as a burger 220 00:11:57,500 --> 00:12:01,200 bar, those to me are the types of decisions that are actually 221 00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:02,600 the most meaningful and Powerful. 222 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:08,400 Of like, reimagining your brand and your business because the 223 00:12:08,400 --> 00:12:11,200 consumer need is different now, right? 224 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:14,900 Talk about recognizing the perhaps you are now irrelevant 225 00:12:14,900 --> 00:12:18,800 and people thing the way you do business to become, you know to 226 00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:23,400 go from the relevant to relevant and the question of being 227 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:27,700 irrelevant or being disruptive by tone-deaf, right? 228 00:12:27,700 --> 00:12:32,000 The sphere of actually putting your voice out there and not 229 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,500 kidding. The Mark on tone and and just 230 00:12:34,500 --> 00:12:36,500 being afraid. But what is the risk of being 231 00:12:36,500 --> 00:12:39,600 silent to write if this restaurant in Copenhagen, but 232 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:43,200 mostly say, okay. Well, let's just wait and not do 233 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:46,300 anything. Would it mean that the people 234 00:12:46,300 --> 00:12:49,500 they did right now with a burger and a beer that in the future? 235 00:12:49,500 --> 00:12:52,300 When things look at better and you have a better sense of where 236 00:12:52,300 --> 00:12:53,900 things are going, that they could not be. 237 00:12:53,900 --> 00:12:56,100 But again, to be that high end restaurant. 238 00:12:56,400 --> 00:13:00,900 Yeah, and I think what I admire most about that decision is they 239 00:13:00,900 --> 00:13:06,600 didn't think about Starting. They thought about starting like 240 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:09,900 they thought about launching a brand-new concept. 241 00:13:09,900 --> 00:13:13,600 Like it wasn't opening at limited capacity this and trying 242 00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:17,400 out their old price point and trying to figure out ways to fly 243 00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:21,700 in people that otherwise would be visiting their reservations 244 00:13:21,700 --> 00:13:24,700 in the past is like, no, we're going to be a very different 245 00:13:24,700 --> 00:13:27,100 concept right now, and I don't know. 246 00:13:27,100 --> 00:13:29,700 The business was also that like, I don't know if it's been 247 00:13:29,700 --> 00:13:33,800 successful or not, but I think it's it takes Like that level of 248 00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:38,200 bravery and courage right now to, to help to move the world 249 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:40,800 forward Francisco to your point. It's something. 250 00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:44,200 I thought of my team a bunch about but this is a time of fear 251 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:47,300 and uncertainty and that's okay. That's totally normal, but fear 252 00:13:47,300 --> 00:13:50,500 and uncertainty does one of two things that forces a choice, you 253 00:13:50,500 --> 00:13:54,400 can either let it feel you or let it paralyze you. 254 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:57,700 And I think that's kind of the binary decision to be made right 255 00:13:57,700 --> 00:14:00,500 now. Yeah, it also kind of exposes 256 00:14:00,500 --> 00:14:02,600 some of the paralysis that already pre-existing. 257 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:05,900 Whether they knew it or not, I mean, these giant monolithic 258 00:14:05,900 --> 00:14:10,600 companies with John and upfront, inflexible, media buys, or all 259 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:14,600 contractually locked in with no agility whatsoever. 260 00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:18,500 And it exposed just, I think some of the inherent in 261 00:14:18,500 --> 00:14:21,400 flexibility of the old ways of going to Market. 262 00:14:21,900 --> 00:14:26,000 If you don't learn the lesson from having much more flexible 263 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:29,400 planning and being much more adaptive, with regards to, when 264 00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:32,600 and how to adapt your media and your message. 265 00:14:32,700 --> 00:14:35,700 I mean that should be one of the big takeaways and hopefully make 266 00:14:35,700 --> 00:14:38,400 a lot of these more. Inflexible companies, a bit more 267 00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:42,400 yogic in their ability, to stretch our one of our media 268 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:46,600 principles said the other day, you know, all media is local and 269 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:50,700 this really exposes that given that every single dma and Market 270 00:14:50,700 --> 00:14:54,700 is at a different level of reopening and are closing or 271 00:14:54,700 --> 00:14:58,100 shut down based on all sorts of inevitable. 272 00:14:58,100 --> 00:15:00,900 Epidemiology. There's reasons as to why 273 00:15:00,900 --> 00:15:02,600 they're doing what they're doing. 274 00:15:03,100 --> 00:15:05,400 And then there's irrational reasons as to why they're doing 275 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:08,400 what they're doing. But all those things in affect 276 00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:11,500 the culture and those markets. So then if you're a brand who is 277 00:15:11,500 --> 00:15:14,900 important in those markets, what are you going to do to adapt to 278 00:15:14,900 --> 00:15:19,200 Market a versus B versus C? When all three are approaching 279 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:22,500 it differently, culturally, or systematically, or 280 00:15:22,500 --> 00:15:26,700 governmentally? And if you only had one approach 281 00:15:26,700 --> 00:15:29,000 to them all together in aggregate, will, you can't turn 282 00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:31,400 that on across all of them now, right. 283 00:15:31,700 --> 00:15:33,600 So, you know how, How do you then? 284 00:15:33,700 --> 00:15:36,800 Adjust and become much more flexible to adapt? 285 00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:40,100 So as opposed to just kind of waiting for things to get back 286 00:15:40,100 --> 00:15:42,400 to business, as normal for you to kind of Hit the same button. 287 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:44,000 You've always hit to turn things on. 288 00:15:44,300 --> 00:15:47,700 It's it's that nice analogy with that, you know, that 289 00:15:48,100 --> 00:15:51,000 Scandinavian restaurant he referred to is that how do you, 290 00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,200 how do you reset certain aspects of your business? 291 00:15:53,700 --> 00:15:56,500 And you know, the ideas of like being agile and Nimble? 292 00:15:56,500 --> 00:16:00,400 It almost had become cliche and just how advertising agencies 293 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:02,600 and marketing plans kind of presented themselves. 294 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:09,100 But now, that is kind of acutely out on point as to what 295 00:16:09,100 --> 00:16:11,300 companies and clients can and can't do right now. 296 00:16:11,900 --> 00:16:15,000 Yeah, we talked about the companies and clients. 297 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:18,400 And normally we're like, well, they're not Nimble enough or 298 00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:20,500 they're very traditional in their media approach. 299 00:16:20,500 --> 00:16:25,100 But I think that has also kind of, we have got adopted that as 300 00:16:25,100 --> 00:16:25,500 well. Right? 301 00:16:25,500 --> 00:16:28,500 Like, we've with adopted the passiveness, a like, waiting for 302 00:16:28,500 --> 00:16:31,300 a brief or things like that. And right now I think the 303 00:16:31,300 --> 00:16:35,600 approach is With them, especially that we have a point 304 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:38,400 of view from the outside. Going back to the consumer on. 305 00:16:38,500 --> 00:16:41,200 How do you write a brief and how do you reinvent yourself? 306 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:43,800 Right? We see ourselves at Lerma trying 307 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:46,100 to have conversations with clients of the opportunities. 308 00:16:46,100 --> 00:16:50,600 We see in the short future and in the mid and long-term future, 309 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:53,400 right? Like if at least, speaking of 310 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:56,300 povs, as we were talking at the beginning of the podcast, 311 00:16:56,700 --> 00:16:59,700 sending out povs, or actionable items that we see are 312 00:16:59,700 --> 00:17:02,000 opportunities. That, that could come to us. 313 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:04,700 We've talked about Cinco de Mayo for the Hispanic. 314 00:17:04,700 --> 00:17:07,800 The Multicultural Market was right in the middle of the 315 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:11,400 shutdown, right Cinco, de Mayo and some Brands took advantage 316 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:13,800 of its own Brands. Didn't some Brands did it right? 317 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:17,500 And some Brands didn't do it as good, but nobody really burned 318 00:17:17,500 --> 00:17:20,099 themselves for having some sort of action out there and speaking 319 00:17:20,099 --> 00:17:22,900 to the consumer. While they're at home, trying to 320 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:28,600 keep living and keep being happy with what they have, that side 321 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:32,100 of Brands and companies of being kind of like trying to figure it 322 00:17:32,100 --> 00:17:32,700 out. I think. 323 00:17:32,900 --> 00:17:37,200 Need to play and super Vigor, roll on us, having conversations 324 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:38,800 with them and showing those opportunities. 325 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:41,100 Do you guys see that also happening? 326 00:17:41,100 --> 00:17:42,800 I mean, from a brand planning perspective. 327 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:44,900 I think that must be huge, right? 328 00:17:44,900 --> 00:17:48,600 Like, this is what consumers are doing and the opportunity and 329 00:17:48,700 --> 00:17:50,700 where you where we see you going. 330 00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:53,100 Yeah. I mean, I think kinds always 331 00:17:53,900 --> 00:17:56,500 appreciate whether they know it or not in the moment, a good 332 00:17:56,500 --> 00:18:01,300 sparring partner, a good Devil's Advocate to come in and kind of 333 00:18:01,308 --> 00:18:03,100 stress test their ideas. Has. 334 00:18:03,300 --> 00:18:06,100 I think we act as a check and balance to a lot of the things 335 00:18:06,100 --> 00:18:08,400 that they want to do and we see in the absence of checks and 336 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:10,000 balances. You can kind of convince 337 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:12,100 yourself that this is what you need to do. 338 00:18:12,100 --> 00:18:15,300 And clients are using their agencies that way right now are 339 00:18:15,300 --> 00:18:18,200 perhaps getting far more value from those interactions than 340 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:20,900 they have in the past. Simply because the sheer amount 341 00:18:20,900 --> 00:18:25,500 of options of what to do, almost seem endless, depending on who 342 00:18:25,500 --> 00:18:27,100 you talk to. It's very easy to be the victim 343 00:18:27,100 --> 00:18:31,000 of your last conversation and alas, Libor news b or conference 344 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:33,600 or whatever, you know, thing that you Picked up off the 345 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:37,800 ticker thus being able to have more conversations to than way 346 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:41,500 those different possibilities and realities because any one of 347 00:18:41,500 --> 00:18:44,300 those decisions could completely make or bake or break your 348 00:18:44,300 --> 00:18:47,300 tomorrow. We need to have those that 349 00:18:47,300 --> 00:18:50,600 ability to kind of step in and we don't always know what's 350 00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:51,900 right and wrong. I mean, that's it. 351 00:18:51,900 --> 00:18:54,600 That's the one thing I can tell you that I've learned in 25 plus 352 00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:58,300 years of agency experience. But what I can tell you is that 353 00:18:58,300 --> 00:19:01,000 I would I would rather not try and strive to be perfectly, 354 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:02,600 right. I would rather be useful. 355 00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:08,400 That's what filter right to put. Yeah, and so and trying to just 356 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:12,300 trying things and seeing what happens and learning from those 357 00:19:12,300 --> 00:19:16,500 things as opposed to waiting, so long for some giant monolithic 358 00:19:16,500 --> 00:19:19,700 solve and then enacting it by the time it's too late. 359 00:19:19,700 --> 00:19:21,900 And then and then you don't don't really know what what 360 00:19:21,900 --> 00:19:25,800 happened. So yeah, on my side, what I am 361 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:28,300 noticing which is, just absolutely. 362 00:19:28,300 --> 00:19:30,900 Fascinating. Is for the past. 363 00:19:30,900 --> 00:19:34,300 I don't know. 45. Years, at least in my career, 364 00:19:34,300 --> 00:19:41,400 this warm blanket that we call data has been the thing that 365 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:44,700 drives a lot of decisions and that's perfectly understandable 366 00:19:44,708 --> 00:19:46,900 and will continue to play a role. 367 00:19:47,500 --> 00:19:51,900 However, in this moment right now, a lot of our data sources, 368 00:19:51,900 --> 00:19:57,600 I would say three quarters to ninety percent of our data 369 00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:02,200 sources. Are six to 12 months behind in 370 00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:05,100 terms of the The data that's reporting on consumers. 371 00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:10,300 So what that means is it is not reflective of the pandemic and 372 00:20:10,300 --> 00:20:14,600 so we have we certainly do have some tools that let us see more 373 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:17,400 real time. But I think we have to help our 374 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:21,100 clients understand that they can't look at your every year 375 00:20:21,100 --> 00:20:22,400 stuff for. They can't. 376 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:27,100 Look at you eight weeks ago was was day Zero, and that's kind of 377 00:20:27,108 --> 00:20:29,400 the new Benchmark that you kind of need to work against. 378 00:20:29,700 --> 00:20:33,200 And so, I think one other piece we can help our It's worth it. 379 00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:36,200 Just help them understand which pieces of data are most valuable 380 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:38,300 right now and which stuff. Frankly we maybe just throw out 381 00:20:38,300 --> 00:20:41,400 the window or set aside or at least just put in the back 382 00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:43,800 burner to not drive decisions. Like steak. 383 00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:47,400 For example, household income data that we might be getting 384 00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:52,100 from various Partners based on the unemployment rate. 385 00:20:52,100 --> 00:20:56,100 No longer good reduce wages. Like yeah, that that dated shit 386 00:20:56,100 --> 00:20:58,800 right now. That's so like we have to help 387 00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:02,200 paint that story. Like I attended it an awesome. 388 00:21:02,700 --> 00:21:06,800 Even our yesterday on Zoom that the forays put on with Rashad. 389 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:12,600 Tobacco Walla and he gave a lot of really awesome anecdotes. 390 00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:15,000 But yeah, his book you guys at restoring, the soul business 391 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:17,900 will plug that. It's a good read. 392 00:21:19,500 --> 00:21:23,200 He he talks a lot of that book. Francisco about this need to 393 00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:26,800 strike a balance between the story and the spreadsheet. 394 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:30,600 And we've kind of lean too far into the spreadsheet to bring 395 00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:34,800 back that that Human Side. That's The the story side of 396 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:36,500 what we do. And I feel like we can't talk 397 00:21:36,500 --> 00:21:39,500 about that enough because that's that's like such a huge machine 398 00:21:39,500 --> 00:21:42,100 ingredient right now. That's great. 399 00:21:42,700 --> 00:21:45,100 Yeah, there's going to be data points today that are like, you 400 00:21:45,100 --> 00:21:48,100 know, it's like a wine. That's too young. 401 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:51,100 You know, it's we need to put that on the shelf for a couple 402 00:21:51,100 --> 00:21:54,400 quarters or a year. And then only then can we go 403 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:57,200 back and Trend that against historical data to see where 404 00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:01,500 these changes really happened. But right now it's just useless. 405 00:22:02,700 --> 00:22:05,600 So, let's let's go put that in the cellar and we'll wait, you 406 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:08,000 know, what will give it a quarter bottle, turn every 407 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:11,400 couple of weeks. But but but but meanwhile this 408 00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:14,800 thing right here is just kind of glowing red or blinking green. 409 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:19,700 And we really have to respond, you know, to this aspect of 410 00:22:19,700 --> 00:22:21,900 what's going on. Yeah, one of the pieces of 411 00:22:21,908 --> 00:22:24,600 research we did was look at Social conversation related to 412 00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:27,900 covid-19. And as you'd imagine at least 413 00:22:27,900 --> 00:22:32,300 here in the US, conversations fight massively. 414 00:22:32,900 --> 00:22:37,500 In the last week of March and early April, but week over week, 415 00:22:37,500 --> 00:22:42,000 since then it's actually decreased direct mentions of 416 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:46,500 covid-19 and coronavirus and all related sort of mentioned 417 00:22:46,500 --> 00:22:47,800 shelter in place that sort of thing. 418 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:53,100 And so it's clear is that people are still thinking about 419 00:22:53,100 --> 00:22:56,100 covid-19. But there's other things that 420 00:22:56,100 --> 00:22:59,700 are filling their likes comments and shares and things they 421 00:22:59,700 --> 00:23:02,000 talked about directly. And so there's this interesting. 422 00:23:02,700 --> 00:23:06,200 A trend that we're seeing that, although it's clearly top of 423 00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:07,300 mind. That's that's that. 424 00:23:07,300 --> 00:23:09,400 It, datapoint doesn't suggest that it's not something that 425 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:11,300 people are thinking about everyday or every hour every 426 00:23:11,300 --> 00:23:15,400 minute, right? It's kind of creating this new 427 00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:20,800 opportunity from a conversation perspective about what does 428 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:22,700 grab. I mean we've seen, you know, 429 00:23:22,700 --> 00:23:26,500 Tiger King in the early days of the pandemic and we've seen the 430 00:23:26,500 --> 00:23:30,400 Last Dance more recently. I mean, there's just a hunger 431 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:34,800 for shared experiences. Right now, Travis Scott and 432 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:36,100 Fortnight. I mean, there's just these 433 00:23:36,100 --> 00:23:40,300 massive moments that across the board whether his gaming or live 434 00:23:40,300 --> 00:23:42,600 entertainment. We're seeing live streaming 435 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:45,000 records being absolutely smashed. 436 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:48,300 Incredible, heavy. Yeah, so there are data points 437 00:23:48,300 --> 00:23:51,000 that are pointing this whole new world and that's kind of The 438 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:54,000 Perfect Storm of accelerate adoption of Technology. 439 00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:57,300 This void that people have the need to connect. 440 00:23:57,300 --> 00:24:01,100 We are Human After All and then just this shared experiences 441 00:24:01,100 --> 00:24:04,200 that we can have, you know, Relations and whether that's 442 00:24:04,300 --> 00:24:08,900 around the the virtual water cooler or in other places, but 443 00:24:08,900 --> 00:24:12,300 that's just something really interesting that we're seeing 444 00:24:12,300 --> 00:24:15,900 unfold and I think will continue to be so I guess, I guess from 445 00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:21,100 from a human inside perspective, coffee is not immune to the fact 446 00:24:21,100 --> 00:24:22,900 that we get bored. Right? 447 00:24:22,900 --> 00:24:24,500 Right. And we want to move on. 448 00:24:25,100 --> 00:24:25,900 Yeah. Yeah. 449 00:24:25,900 --> 00:24:27,600 Yeah. That's if if I were the virus 450 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:32,000 that's how I would want my host populace to think and believe. 451 00:24:33,500 --> 00:24:35,700 How do I keep it covid? Is now thinking, how do I do 452 00:24:35,700 --> 00:24:37,600 have to keep relevant, right as people? 453 00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:40,200 Yeah, try to move on and forget them. 454 00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:41,800 Yeah. They're they're their strategic 455 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:43,300 agency. Seems to be doing a pretty good 456 00:24:43,300 --> 00:24:46,000 job. That's right. 457 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:51,400 How how do we see advertising agencies moving forward within 458 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:52,600 the model? Know we I think I've heard 459 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,000 several things like, obviously digital. 460 00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:58,000 It's a huge thing. Like a lot of the resources that 461 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:01,900 humans are or consumers are jumping into our digital. 462 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:05,800 Put the model. Do you guys have any thoughts on 463 00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:10,600 how it's going to look in six months, a year of how we 464 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,900 operate? And I think the best analogy 465 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:17,200 I've heard it's been shared by a number of folks, but I first 466 00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:19,900 started from the governor of California. 467 00:25:19,900 --> 00:25:24,400 He talked about how this is not a light switch. 468 00:25:24,700 --> 00:25:28,500 This is a dimmer that will solely be turning up and down in 469 00:25:28,500 --> 00:25:32,600 terms of level of restrictions placed with shelter in place. 470 00:25:33,300 --> 00:25:38,700 And so I think that is our best model to look at. 471 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:43,000 And if we're being realistic, all the places that are quote 472 00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:48,500 reopening, it's only at 25 percent capacity allowed 473 00:25:48,500 --> 00:25:51,300 maximum. Most businesses can't sustain 474 00:25:51,300 --> 00:25:56,500 their pre-pandemic operations at 25 percent capacity. 475 00:25:56,700 --> 00:26:01,900 It's just not sustainable and even if we get to optimistically 476 00:26:01,900 --> 00:26:04,500 from an My perspective, 50% capacity. 477 00:26:04,500 --> 00:26:09,400 That's still not all that great. And so that's the next 6 8, 10 478 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:14,300 12, maybe 18 months and I don't think we'll see any of that. 479 00:26:14,300 --> 00:26:18,100 Change until there is not just a vaccine, but a lot of 480 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:21,600 distribution of said vaccine before we see a different kind 481 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,600 of post pandemic. And so between now and then, I 482 00:26:24,608 --> 00:26:27,500 mean, we're talking about, I don't know, 10 to 18 months of 483 00:26:27,500 --> 00:26:29,200 this. What Kristen are calling the 484 00:26:29,208 --> 00:26:31,700 messy middle. And that's what we're going to. 485 00:26:31,700 --> 00:26:35,500 Just be Trying to figure out is because how do you help a brand? 486 00:26:35,500 --> 00:26:37,600 If you're just talking about a business perspective and I'll 487 00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:40,600 bring in the plug for meeting consumer needs. 488 00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:48,000 But how do you find a way to provide an unmet need that can 489 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,800 help float your business for the next 10 days, 18 months. 490 00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:54,200 We, that's the big question and something we should ask 491 00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:56,400 ourselves as and they as a business ourselves, right? 492 00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:59,600 Like, like as agencies, do we keep Nimble? 493 00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,100 How do we keep flexible? How do we work with this dimmer? 494 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:06,000 Or as as Chris Owens was put in it, was I thought it was 495 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,800 interesting that Breakers, right? 496 00:27:07,900 --> 00:27:09,600 Going up and down, shutting up and down. 497 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:12,600 And you know, you want to talk a little bit about that. 498 00:27:12,900 --> 00:27:16,800 Yeah. I mean, I think getting back to 499 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:21,900 local store marketing and really appreciating the regional 500 00:27:21,900 --> 00:27:27,000 differences that that different consumer behaviors and different 501 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:31,000 kind of marketplaces present. I think it's going to be 502 00:27:31,008 --> 00:27:34,800 something a lot of agencies are We are focusing on right now. 503 00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:37,300 Some of them have been forced to focus on it. 504 00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:42,300 And I think, you know, that's where we will probably start to 505 00:27:42,300 --> 00:27:47,100 kind of drive, you know, even more recommendations toward, you 506 00:27:47,100 --> 00:27:49,200 know, whether it's the dimmer or the circuit breaker. 507 00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:51,600 I think you know, dimmer is a great analogy if you think of 508 00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:56,500 the country as a whole but I think when you get down to these 509 00:27:56,500 --> 00:27:59,900 dma levels, there's going to be certain points where they decide 510 00:27:59,900 --> 00:28:02,500 they can reopen based on some kind of criteria. 511 00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:05,500 Huh, whether it's just the way they feel or whether it's 512 00:28:05,500 --> 00:28:07,700 science-based. And then there's going to be 513 00:28:07,700 --> 00:28:10,400 other breaking points where they're going to have to kind of 514 00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:14,200 re instant reinstate, kind of new criteria. 515 00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:16,100 And and these things are going to be going up and down. 516 00:28:16,100 --> 00:28:19,400 Like I said kind of across the country at different intervals 517 00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:23,000 and different places. And so your ability to turn on 518 00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:26,200 One National message all at once. 519 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,500 You're just going to be, you know, super Irrelevant in 520 00:28:29,500 --> 00:28:31,900 certain markets when you're saying, hey, come out and try 521 00:28:31,900 --> 00:28:33,200 and get this new. Thing. 522 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:38,200 When in fact, you still have 70% of the population staying home. 523 00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:44,300 I think relying on a lot of Mobility, indices and kind of 524 00:28:44,300 --> 00:28:48,100 Geo locational data where you can start to see, literally 525 00:28:48,100 --> 00:28:51,400 certain trade areas, open up and close down over time. 526 00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,700 Just based on the data that's being collected off of mobile 527 00:28:54,700 --> 00:28:57,700 devices in aggregate. You're probably going to see a 528 00:28:57,708 --> 00:29:01,400 lot more planning that's going to be using that type of an of 529 00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:04,100 an indicator to determine Determine when to go on and off 530 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:09,000 in the absence of that simply understanding what a government 531 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:12,000 is telling their local population to do, actually isn't 532 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:16,000 a good indicator of what that populations actually doing for 533 00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,300 your point. I think this week, I was looking 534 00:29:18,300 --> 00:29:21,400 at some more listening to some maths and they're already 535 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:23,200 speaking like this has passed, right? 536 00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:26,500 The, the welcome back. And at least from my moods, I 537 00:29:26,500 --> 00:29:29,800 didn't feel I was connecting with that, but it's exactly what 538 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:31,200 you're saying right as a consumer. 539 00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:34,000 That's how I felt it. And I think those are the 540 00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:39,300 decisions that get made over. Zoom calls in comfortable 541 00:29:39,300 --> 00:29:42,100 shelter in place settings at without an appreciation. 542 00:29:42,100 --> 00:29:47,100 For the individuals that are forced to go to work whether 543 00:29:47,100 --> 00:29:49,400 it's because they're an essential worker. 544 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,800 They're working in healthcare or they just are simply trying to 545 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:57,400 find new ways to provide for their families. 546 00:29:57,400 --> 00:30:03,900 So I think there's a lot of need to To have discussion about the, 547 00:30:03,900 --> 00:30:06,700 I mean the trend that we're calling a shelter and privilege 548 00:30:06,900 --> 00:30:11,600 but his talk a lot about how there's so many large pockets 549 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:16,000 and populations and individuals that are in very different 550 00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:20,200 places that that their biggest need is not which office chair. 551 00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:24,900 Should I task desk chair. Should I buy for my home office? 552 00:30:24,900 --> 00:30:29,200 But you know, I just got laid off or I just lost half my 553 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:31,100 shifts, what I'm going to do now. 554 00:30:31,100 --> 00:30:35,600 I mean, those are those are some very Very real needs that people 555 00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:39,100 have right now and so many of our Brands provide products and 556 00:30:39,100 --> 00:30:43,000 services that those individuals rely on or at least would be 557 00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:45,600 receptive to. And so I think those yeah to 558 00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:49,600 your point that the ads that make it seem like this is over 559 00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:53,500 or so off there. So it's and that's why it's so 560 00:30:53,500 --> 00:30:54,600 important. What? 561 00:30:54,700 --> 00:30:58,700 Mr. Roland saying is really look at a local from a local point of 562 00:30:58,708 --> 00:31:02,400 view and be able to be, you know, play with the reality of 563 00:31:02,500 --> 00:31:06,300 Of that of that market, right? It's crazy. 564 00:31:06,300 --> 00:31:10,200 Yeah, the shelter in privilege knowing that only 20 percent are 565 00:31:10,300 --> 00:31:13,000 living this pandemic. Like probably owes three, right? 566 00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:15,900 Like with some meetings and working from home and other ones 567 00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:18,000 there. So most of the people really 568 00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:20,500 have to go out there and hustle, and still risk. 569 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,100 That's, that's an inherent danger in itself. 570 00:31:23,100 --> 00:31:26,700 If you think about, you know, are, you know, the penetration 571 00:31:26,700 --> 00:31:29,500 of people are in that shelter, in privileged population? 572 00:31:29,500 --> 00:31:31,500 It's a lot of our clients and guess what? 573 00:31:31,500 --> 00:31:35,000 It's us. And so, you know, we're back in 574 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,100 our own little Echo chamber. Talking about, you know, what 575 00:31:38,100 --> 00:31:41,400 the rest of the world is thinking and are feeling when in 576 00:31:41,500 --> 00:31:44,600 a lot of instances, you know, it couldn't be more starkly 577 00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:47,200 different and and guess what? It's always kind of been that 578 00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:50,700 way. Anyway, I mean, yeah, agency 579 00:31:50,700 --> 00:31:54,700 industry culture, and client, corporate marketing culture has 580 00:31:54,700 --> 00:31:59,100 always in some ways, kind of obscenely prided the sense in 581 00:31:59,100 --> 00:32:01,700 which it acts and behaves sort of differently. 582 00:32:03,700 --> 00:32:06,800 Assuming smartphone versus people know it's an example. 583 00:32:07,500 --> 00:32:08,200 Right? Right. 584 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:14,300 So so, you know again, it's just taking a, you know, something 585 00:32:14,300 --> 00:32:16,600 that's already existed in Amplified, it and just kind of 586 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:19,600 kind of dial it up. So our need to try and pay 587 00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:24,100 attention to what, you know, what's going on, you know, to to 588 00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:25,900 mr. Farrell's point with with the 589 00:32:25,900 --> 00:32:30,200 real people, you know, are are feeling, you know, consumers 590 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,100 have always been real people, you know. 591 00:32:32,900 --> 00:32:35,800 Whenever we started to think of them as just some kind of just 592 00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:39,400 wallet to robber or mouth to fill, you know, that's when 593 00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:42,100 we've we've taken a step too far. 594 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,800 And I think the sensitivity to that right now is should 595 00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:48,700 probably much much higher than than it's ever been, for obvious 596 00:32:48,700 --> 00:32:52,400 reasons. Yeah, talk of national message. 597 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:54,700 Mr. Owens. You were talking about natural 598 00:32:54,700 --> 00:32:58,100 message and help to local life at some point where you know 599 00:32:58,100 --> 00:33:01,500 that YouTube video that has the analysis of All Brands, you 600 00:33:01,500 --> 00:33:05,400 know, they I mean, of the covid, message with the piano. 601 00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:06,700 What did you guys think about that? 602 00:33:06,700 --> 00:33:10,600 And yeah, that's so, you know, was there an unmet need for 603 00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:13,800 melancholic, you know, piano ballots that, you know, the 604 00:33:13,808 --> 00:33:16,300 industry collectively tried to deliver against me. 605 00:33:16,300 --> 00:33:17,600 That's been. Yeah. 606 00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:19,800 It's been kind of the, we've been though sort of the, but of 607 00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:24,500 the pop cultural, you know, washing machine cycle right now, 608 00:33:24,500 --> 00:33:28,600 about how things are happening. And I think, you know, in terms 609 00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:33,700 of sort of pallets of responses, whenever I go back to, you know, 610 00:33:33,700 --> 00:33:38,200 what it was like working agency, post 9/11 to the recession. 611 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:41,100 Etc. There's always been this. 612 00:33:41,100 --> 00:33:47,000 Well, do we become kind of somber and humble or do we 613 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:53,800 become, you know, uplifting and motivational and or do we risk 614 00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:57,100 becoming Pollyanna all then we default back to the, to the 615 00:33:57,100 --> 00:34:01,400 humble and and so, you know, that's that's something that I 616 00:34:01,408 --> 00:34:03,200 think everybody wants it. A certain level. 617 00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:06,300 It's just do you need it in Mass. 618 00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:11,800 So carbon copied from one spot to the next while you're trying 619 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:15,699 to escape and enjoy your, you know, the voice or whatever it 620 00:34:15,699 --> 00:34:17,199 is that you know, you know, you're watching. 621 00:34:17,900 --> 00:34:20,699 I mean people need that true at a human one-to-one level and 622 00:34:20,699 --> 00:34:22,400 they want to hear that from their peers and their friends 623 00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:25,300 and their families. But when that becomes this, this 624 00:34:25,300 --> 00:34:29,699 kind of giant shout from all the different National marketers 625 00:34:29,699 --> 00:34:35,199 that you all at once, really does start to He'll disingenuous 626 00:34:35,199 --> 00:34:37,199 very quickly. I mean American consumers in 627 00:34:37,199 --> 00:34:40,300 particular of always had a love-hate relationship with 628 00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:45,000 advertising in general and thus you know again just throw 629 00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:48,900 another another wound or scab perhaps kind of made fresh. 630 00:34:48,900 --> 00:34:53,800 Once again like Chris like, mr. Farrell said one time in the 631 00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:57,500 presentation is nobody gets up in the morning excited about 632 00:34:57,500 --> 00:35:00,000 what they're going to see that they, right. 633 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:02,300 Yeah. So do you guys have any closing? 634 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,100 Thoughts that you guys would like to leave the audience. 635 00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:08,200 Well, I'll just, you know, I think messy middle has probably 636 00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:11,400 a point that we made a quite well here, both in our 637 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,200 conversation and points. And it's clear that you know, 638 00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:17,100 there is no certainty on a lot of things. 639 00:35:17,100 --> 00:35:22,100 And and I think think we Embrace that and and and just recognize 640 00:35:22,100 --> 00:35:24,900 we need to take it day by day and look at everything that we 641 00:35:24,908 --> 00:35:28,900 have in front of us and make the best decisions possible, but you 642 00:35:28,908 --> 00:35:32,300 know in doing so trying to resist the simple kind of bye. 643 00:35:32,500 --> 00:35:35,600 Very responsive, just do it the old-fashioned way. 644 00:35:36,500 --> 00:35:40,100 It's all really in in respect of that and knowing that we aren't 645 00:35:40,100 --> 00:35:42,600 in control of everything. Never have been, never will be, 646 00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:46,900 but our clients are paying us to be in control or some semblance 647 00:35:46,900 --> 00:35:51,200 of control of how their budgets and creative resources are 648 00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:53,400 spent. So to that degree are coping 649 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:56,600 strategies, really are looking in front of us and seeing what 650 00:35:56,700 --> 00:36:00,400 what we think is right and and then presenting it and trying it 651 00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:01,800 and then testing it and measuring it. 652 00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:04,500 And proving. It and and just keep on 653 00:36:04,500 --> 00:36:06,900 iterating. Mr. Farrell. 654 00:36:06,900 --> 00:36:10,500 Yeah, I'll first answer your question about the covid-19 655 00:36:10,500 --> 00:36:12,500 impact report. So it's our second edition. 656 00:36:12,500 --> 00:36:15,800 If anyone's interested in it. I think the easiest way to get a 657 00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:22,600 copy is to send me a message at my Twitter profile at Chris 658 00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:29,000 Farrell. Chrisser71 copy there on 659 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,000 SlideShare. If you prefer a PDF copy I can 660 00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:33,300 send you that link to the They'll think we're trying to do 661 00:36:33,300 --> 00:36:35,500 is turn that into a newsletter. Again. 662 00:36:35,500 --> 00:36:38,700 If you're interested, we'll give you the means to sign up for 663 00:36:38,700 --> 00:36:40,400 that. Give a little more commentary 664 00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:44,200 And Timely news and notes. And then, yeah, I guess closer. 665 00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:48,900 No marks message. I left with our digital strategy 666 00:36:48,900 --> 00:36:53,700 team last week against all share with the listeners right now. 667 00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:58,100 There's been a lot of really tough unfortunate events that 668 00:36:58,100 --> 00:37:00,800 have happened and you know, we've laughed during this 669 00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:06,100 conversation, but I think to bring some seriousness to the 670 00:37:06,100 --> 00:37:10,700 discussion that the changes that have happened across so many 671 00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:15,400 areas of our world and has impacted individuals from a 672 00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:17,900 personal standpoint, professional standpoint, you 673 00:37:17,900 --> 00:37:21,000 know, it is cause understandably, a lot of 674 00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:25,500 frustration, a lot of fear, a lot of uncertainty, but on an 675 00:37:25,500 --> 00:37:30,000 optimistic note of how we might turn the page, my grandpa who's 676 00:37:30,300 --> 00:37:35,500 no longer with us, but he I grew up in Nebraska where I'm from 677 00:37:35,900 --> 00:37:38,300 has some words of wisdom to help help us. 678 00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:41,100 Maybe turn a page and start to look forward. 679 00:37:41,100 --> 00:37:46,500 And he said, Chris never let a hangover last more than a day. 680 00:37:48,300 --> 00:37:52,500 That is excellent. And so I think in his sense 681 00:37:52,500 --> 00:37:56,000 minute, I think the only way we can move forward is making that 682 00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:58,900 decision that I kind of brought up earlier that choice really of 683 00:37:59,100 --> 00:38:00,300 either. Let the fair fear and 684 00:38:00,300 --> 00:38:02,200 uncertainty paralyze you or let it feel. 685 00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:05,500 All you then. So I hope we have enough people 686 00:38:05,500 --> 00:38:10,800 in our industry that that find Hope and inspiration and and the 687 00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:14,400 only way we get better as a society is to help hopefully 688 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:20,000 make some positive decisions and meet those unmet needs of real 689 00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:22,700 people of consumers. And that's the way that our 690 00:38:22,700 --> 00:38:27,800 brand the business will get back to positive economic growth, but 691 00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:31,900 more importantly, a better better World, hopefully, so I 692 00:38:31,900 --> 00:38:34,900 guess I'll Even on that cool. No, I love it. 693 00:38:35,900 --> 00:38:38,200 So you mentioned your social handles. 694 00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:41,500 I think you also mentioned on the past on the past episode. 695 00:38:41,500 --> 00:38:43,400 But mr. Owens. 696 00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:47,000 Do you know do you have any any place where people can follow 697 00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,000 you or reach out to you and social media in case they have 698 00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:51,400 any further questions. Yeah. 699 00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:54,300 I've been stuck super open on Facebook. 700 00:38:54,300 --> 00:38:56,000 Actually, you don't just have to be my friend. 701 00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:57,700 I have tons of students and Industry. 702 00:38:57,700 --> 00:39:01,500 People have kept up with for, for forever and that's probably 703 00:39:01,500 --> 00:39:02,800 where I'm most. Active. 704 00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:08,200 And so in which then I'm fairly easy to find, Christopher Owens 705 00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:11,100 and the one that's working at the Richard's group cool. 706 00:39:11,300 --> 00:39:14,400 And so yeah, share things there, you know, that our had certainly 707 00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:18,100 been pertinent to this to this conversation as much as people 708 00:39:18,100 --> 00:39:22,600 can do if they can open up and talk about the situations that 709 00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:25,900 they're in professionally or personally and realize. 710 00:39:25,900 --> 00:39:28,600 And recognize that there are a lot of other people out there in 711 00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:32,500 the exact same situation, and simply have a chance to You're 712 00:39:32,500 --> 00:39:34,800 each other out on how you're dealing with that. 713 00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:38,900 That one simple little little act I think provides as much 714 00:39:39,300 --> 00:39:42,900 pain relief and hope and inspiration or I'd kick in the 715 00:39:42,900 --> 00:39:46,500 ass as you probably need. You just need to be reaching out 716 00:39:46,500 --> 00:39:50,200 for it and and listening, you know, nobody ever learned with 717 00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:52,500 their mouths. Open something I once heard. 718 00:39:52,500 --> 00:39:55,600 And so, you know your chance to be able to kind of listen and 719 00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:57,600 take in other points of view and processing. 720 00:39:57,600 --> 00:40:01,700 All I think now are probably if you can if you've always been 721 00:40:01,700 --> 00:40:03,100 able to do that. Batman, you're ahead of the 722 00:40:03,100 --> 00:40:04,600 game. But if you have it now is the 723 00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:07,100 time to really exercise and practice that. 724 00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:10,300 I think that's beautiful and I think it would be beautiful. 725 00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:16,400 If Wireless company would take on that message of listening and 726 00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:18,300 talking which is the greatest power. 727 00:40:18,300 --> 00:40:21,300 They have a lot of them are focused on networks right now 728 00:40:21,300 --> 00:40:25,600 and 5 G, but that's just the such a simple message that it 729 00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,400 could really come good for the world. 730 00:40:28,700 --> 00:40:32,200 So thank you Kris Kris and Kris, Kristofferson and Chris. 731 00:40:33,100 --> 00:40:38,700 This has been loud and clear the podcast, the for people who give 732 00:40:38,700 --> 00:40:41,600 a shit about advertising. My name is Francisco Cardenas. 733 00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:44,100 I am a digital strategist at Lerma. 734 00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:48,800 Please listen to us on Spotify, Apple podcast, Google or 735 00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:50,300 whatever. You listen to your podcast and 736 00:40:50,300 --> 00:40:52,800 you can comment on up a apple podcast. 737 00:40:53,300 --> 00:40:55,600 Subscribe. Tell us what you think. 738 00:40:55,800 --> 00:40:59,700 And we'll be on the lookout. We have some special guests 739 00:40:59,700 --> 00:41:02,200 coming from Nike to see how they have handled. 740 00:41:02,300 --> 00:41:06,100 Add the pandemic from within the company and we're excited to 741 00:41:06,100 --> 00:41:09,100 share that here soon. I really appreciate the presence 742 00:41:09,100 --> 00:41:12,000 and I enjoy a lot working with you guys week over week. 743 00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:16,000 So I thank you very much. Yeah, likewise having us.