Corporate crash out? Will you cash in or crash out?
Katie, do you read books? Not really.
I try. I always get some from like
Barnes and Noble and I keep getting them but I don't really
read them so. What kind of books do you buy?
Like are you buying like like a ROM com?
Are you buying like a thriller? Are you buying like weird self
help books that are like make $1,000,000 before you're 23?
None of those, actually. I have figured that if I'm going
to go through the lengths to actually read, I might as well
learn something. So I only buy like nonfiction
books, which kind of deters my reading in general.
So then I just don't end up reading the nonfiction books I
got, especially during school. I feel like it's really hard
because you're already learning so much.
Like, fuck, I don't want to learn anymore, you know?
OK. I do agree that like it's hard
while you're in school and you're like reading like long
cases and like give a shit ton of homework and that sort of
thing. That's usually like reading
heavy. But hear me out.
My senior year of yeah, my senior year of college, I
randomly, I don't know why I started reading again, but
randomly I just like, picked up a book one day and read and then
like I have been able to stop reading since.
And then like I segued into nonfiction.
Like you got to start like as smutty as it gets.
It's like a gateway drug. You don't like, you don't start
out with like heroin. You got to start by smoking a
little bit of pot. You can't just like go straight
for the nonfiction. Katie, this is where you're
failing. No, I think you're.
Right. No, I think you're right.
I think I need a gateway book. What's my gateway book?
I've read after but that's it. Yeah, I I think we're going to
need something a little more gateway ask, but I fully don't
understand how these frat men are out here and like honestly
like grown ass men to just like straight up reading either books
about like the revolution or like like weird ass self help
books. Do you know what I'm talking
about? Yeah, I mean, my boyfriend read
like a finance book and he said he's read it, but he hasn't and
then just sits there and now it's like what he uses to prop
up his monitor because his monitor is kind of short.
So that's kind of what it's getting used for at this point.
But no, I work. We also have a book club they're
trying to start for the women. I don't know, it's like, you
know how they have those women groups?
Well, ours is trying to start a book club.
So it's, I don't know. We'll see how it goes.
I think that's fun, like a book club definitely makes
accountability, but I don't know, I love reading.
To get everyone to read and especially if you don't like the
book, then that's the worst thing.
I can understand if you don't have time.
Like sometimes my grandma, she has a book club too, but it's
like once a month they read a book and it's like really low
stakes and they all get to like alternate picking but with
corporate. I think that's super cute.
I, I watched this movie on Netflix and it was about these
like old ladies and they have this book club and they've all
had it since like they were our age and they all like were super
successful in their careers. 1 was like a judge. 1 was like a
really high-powered attorney, one I can't remember.
They all like were really successful in life.
And then they just like, had this book club, like into their
late 70s, and every month a different person would pick a
book and they would get together and read it.
And a lot of other things happen.
I won't spoil it, but it was one of the cutest movies I've seen
in forever. That's so cute, we should do
that, but then I have to read. Maybe with an audio book?
If podcasting fails, me and Katie will then launch our
audiobook collection where we'll just read to you guys get.
Ready. I wanted to do that.
I wanted to like be the voice person on an audiobook but I
don't think anyone would hire me so the maybe one day.
You know, honestly, I hate to break it.
Katie, I'm not sure if you have the voice for that.
I was going to say, hopefully someone would listen to our
podcast and be like, wow, this is the best voice I've ever
heard and she needs to write a cover for like the audio, but
whatever, I don't care. I really hate when I talk to
people about like at work, like what they do and people are
like, oh, I read and then I asked them what?
And they're like, oh, I've been getting into Steinbeck recently
and I'm like. Katie, nowhere is this
happening. Nowhere is this happening.
At my work, I literally talked to somebody and they're like,
yeah, I've been really getting into.
Steinbeck My gosh, have you seen the new Speaking of books, the
new Netflix movie that dropped on Friday my Oxford year.
No. OK, so the premise is like this
girl, she is really smart. She gets a degree at Cornell.
I want to say she has a job with Deloitte.
Wow, I'm really good at telling this story.
OK, she has a job at like a really good company like
Deloitte ask it's not Deloitte, but maybe like Blackstone.
OK, KPH summed up something like that like a household name of
like business money vibes and but she like defers her like job
offer for a year, which first of all, that's not realistic.
You can't just, like, defer your job offer for a year.
But she defers her job offer for a year to live out her dream of
spending the year at Oxford studying poetry.
That's a talk about job offers and not ones that you can just
magically defer for a year to go study at Oxford.
That's true. I mean, I have heard like some
places if they have two start dates like February and August,
I know some of the big companies have those, they'll pay you
sometimes to start at a different date if they don't
want to take on so many people at once or if they don't have
the room to take you. So they'll like we'll pay you a
little bit of a stipend to push your start date if there's like
a hiring freeze or something. I have heard of that, but I
haven't heard of like just that's oh, I don't really want.
To start. Mine too low key.
OK, so applications, Claire, you've never really shared your
story of applications and kind of what internships you did
undergrad. So I kind of want to hear
because I know you just did accounting, but.
Well, I did share last week about my HR interview for
internships. But anyways, my sophomore year,
I actually didn't work in accounting Katie for my
internship. So sophomore year, I feel like
it's really hard to get an internship and I like applied to
a million different places and then I was in, I didn't keep
track. I'm not organized like you.
And I was just like getting ghosted or getting rejected.
And I was like, like, I had like dried up all of Saint Louis and
like where I'm from in Central Illinois, which is not a ton of
internships. Like farming it?
Was like literally cold emailing like the most random ass people
like I would do anything. And then finally like randomly
one of our sorority sisters put a message in the group chat and
was like if anyone wants to live in Boston with me for the
summer, like I have an extra room at my house and like my
parents aren't going to be home a lot.
So I like called her and I was, I was like, hey, I'm into
Boston. I wasn't really close with this
girl at this point. So that was like kind of a
choice. But now she's my best friend.
So yeah, it depends on the day. I'm kidding, I'm kidding.
But but no. Anyway, so I ended up interning
at this oil and gas company and I was like a rebate and
reconciliation intern. And if you don't know what that
means, basically this company was like a oil and gas
distributor and also owned various chains of gas stations
throughout the East Coast and South Atlantic.
And So what I was in charge of is like, OK, we sold this many
Pepsi's. Pepsi's will give us like a
rebate like Pepsi, the supplier will give us a rebate like of a
dollar or whatever per unit. So I'd have to like do like
these huge data files or like units of sales and then like
send like rebate invoices to vendors.
And it was really boring, but I got really good at Excel and
Tableau. OK, Tableau.
I really love Tableau, so that was a plus for me when I did my
sophomore internship. But yeah, somewhere here it's
probably like the hardest I feel like freshman is I, I think most
people just volunteer for a nonprofit or do something like
that. That's what I did.
And I found my freshman year on check internships, which I don't
think exists anymore, but they used to post internships.
They used to post internships that were like, I would search
for the lowest commitment one like 5 hours a week, and I would
do that and put that on my resume.
And then I went and worked at an ice cream shop to make money.
And then sophomore year, I had to apply to like over 200 jobs.
I want to say. Like it was insane.
Just because I was hired. I was applying mostly to tech
and that was during the huge tech freeze when like SpaceX was
taking back all their offers and saying that they didn't have
space and into it was like crumbling.
Not into it. Which one was it?
I don't know one of those. So.
So yeah. So I was kind of stressed out
and didn't find anything till like April.
But that is really typical, honestly.
Sophomore year. When did you find out about
yours, Claire? Sophomore year.
Yeah, probably about the same, like probably March or April.
And I was like, yeah, definitely moving.
And like it was the first week of June that it started.
It's definitely only two months before.
So I think that's pretty normal, but yeah.
And I think you pointed out something great too about
sophomore, like sophomore year you have to apply to more than
one place. Like I was trying to apply
everywhere in Atlanta and I just couldn't.
Like I ended up getting something in Atlanta, but it was
after I already got like a Saint Louis offer.
So you have to apply to multiple locations in my opinion.
I think so Like probably your college and then where you
actually like residentially live.
I don't know if you agree with that.
No totally, that's definitely was one of like the best summers
of my life too. It's just like you can just pick
somewhere random. I don't think people realize how
many like least takeovers and like options for summer housing
are available. I know that my friend who did an
internship in New York City like ended up being able to find
super cheap housing like with a doorman in lower Manhattan and
it was specifically designed for women interns in town for the
summer. So I feel like a location should
never really be a deterrent because you can always sublet
your place and pay for a different place.
Yeah, 100%. I think it just like also
depends how much money you have and if they're paying you.
But other than that, yeah, we'll get into a different episode
that talks about location and which companies to pay you guys
for relocation during your internship or full time.
So we will cover that too. But yeah, I think that's a great
point, jumping into the applications and interviews.
I know when we talked, Claire, you said that you didn't really
organize your application. I remember the first time
actually Katie showed me her organizational tool for
applications. I was like who is this bitch?
Like I could never be so organized.
Which is hilarious because I have the most type A job but
like my life if you know me is type B.
Like this is Katie. This is literally my To Do List
for like the next two weeks. They're.
Just like just like random ass like scribbles and then like I
did a one day over here. But like, that's how I keep
track of my life. And why don't you just put it on
a notes app or something? I have a friend that does a
Google doc and she like writes everything she has to do
everyday on a Google doc. I think that my promise, if I
actually wrote out everything that I need to get done in my
life, like I would just like have a panic attack and fall off
my balcony, I'm not gonna keep trauma dumping anyways.
But Katie has a really beautiful spreadsheet that she uses to
keep track of her internships. And maybe we'll link a template
in the link tree. Katie, maybe?
Yeah, if you guys are interested, follow us and then
we can send it a link to you guys via e-mail via Instagram DM
or TikTok DM. Can you send an Excel file on D
Ms. I don't know. We'll find out.
Yeah, I think. We can send the Google Excel
link thing Google Sheets. Oh yeah.
So I could look at it on my phone too.
And then I could be like, I got rejected again, but I'm not.
But yeah, for sophomore year, definitely keep track of all the
places you applied to and then also all the positions you
applied to. So that's also going to be
really important because sometimes with the company, they
tell you, you know, you got an interview, but they don't
mention which position it was under.
And then you're like, wait, how do I find this information
again? Or sometimes you do know the
position, but you don't know any of like the information about
the position. And so in that case, what you're
going to do is since you kept track of like the exact title,
you're going to type that in and then type in like job
description. And hopefully Indeed or one of
those old pages will come up. And then you're going to find
the job description. You probably won't be able to
find it on like LinkedIn, but with Indeed and some of those
older ones that keep the postings up even after they're
recruiting, you might be able to find what specifically the
position asks for so you can bring it up in your interview.
But anyways. Yeah, I feel like even copying
and pasting all of that into a Google doc would be a good idea
because you really need to practice for your interview with
the job description in mind. Yeah, I mean, that's what I used
to do if I ever interviewed. For a job I.
Would make a Google doc and then I would write what position it
is, what the job description is, who's interviewing me, and
anything I should know about who specifically is interviewing me.
And then I could go back and like, if I get another
interview, I could be like, Oh yeah, I actually interviewed
with this person last time, or I could do whatever.
But just keeping track of all that information is really
necessary. So yeah, see.
I would do that like 15 minutes before an interview.
I would jump on a Google doc and just do like a word dump.
Like based on their website and stuff. 15 minutes, maybe 30.
Claire, there's some. I literally started doing that a
week before the interview. Like if I was bored in class, I
might do it sooner. Like I would, like, put like,
their core values and like, look through their website and see
what kind of people they're trying to find and that sort of
thing. And like, have thought out
already, like, why do you think you would be a good fit at this
company? And I would already have that
thought out based on like, the job listing and like, whatever
values and different things I can find out.
Especially if you like their LinkedIn page or their website.
Yeah, I think. Specifically, you brought up a
good point with like core values.
I think that's something or like current news about the company
or core values or something like that shows that you actually did
research into the company and aren't just there and just
showing up and don't really care about the company itself and
just want an offer because that's very transparent if you
don't know anything about the company.
So you're going to kind of want to know like what lines of
business they have or lobs, you know, if they're a public
company and you're doing finance specifically really from them,
you might want to like glance over at 10K or 10Q or whatever.
But yeah, that's a really good point of just some stuff to have
on there. And then again that why do you
want to work here? Why do you want this position?
You should have those like prepared as well as, you know,
tell me about yourself and all those questions.
But I think those are the three main ones you just want to have
ready. So let's see if you guys are
really in a bind at the end. Let's say it's April and you
guys haven't started looking for an internship yet.
Startups and nonprofits are gonna be your best friend.
You probably won't get paid anything, but if you're just
desperate to get an internship, at least there is that option
and you can kind of negotiate, like I said, down to like not
necessarily 40 hours a week, but you can be like, oh, I have 10
hours a week and they kind of have to like deal without or I
could do 20 hours a week during the summer or something like
that. Yeah, which is and then you.
Can always do a part time job to supplement if you like need
money. One thing I'll say is I actually
worked on a startup just for fun when I was a freshman and
sophomore in college. And then I also worked in our
school's entrepreneurship center, which was like
connecting startups with VC, like fostering the startup
community at our campus and that sort of thing.
And they are constantly looking for people like, if that's one
thing I learned from that experience.
And I definitely think that like you shouldn't discount it too
much because whenever I, I don't have it on my resume anymore,
But when I had the startup on my resume, like people thought that
was so cool and they always wanted to hear more about it.
And that's actually somewhere where you're gonna learn maybe
even more than some of these bigger intern programs where
you're just kind of running through their programming
motions. Like that's I feel like where
you're actually going to gain some like real technical skill
that's like unique to you. But that could just be my love
for startups of my pitch for why you should join them.
No, I definitely agree with that.
I think especially our school was really strong in this
because we did both go to Business School, but there were
startups that were heavily connected to our school.
And that's actually really common among a lot of different
schools, you know, like people that create startups just kind
of look for talent there and look for support.
And so if you want to not necessarily be directly
affiliated with your university, but kind of work for somebody,
you can easily find that usually through your university or
e-mail your Career Center and ask what kind of startups came
out of your school recently. So you can e-mail them and they
usually really are receptive to people who have are in still in
school and you know, want to work.
So that's always a great point. I also want to say for the
finance people, one of the best jobs you can also get is working
for your school's hedge fund, so.
You know how every school has an endowment and they have to
invest obviously in it, and that's what drives like a lot of
money and growth over time. If you're in finance and
actually really want to do kind of like money management or
anything on that route, it looks actually really amazing to work
for your school's endowment. I will say for at least our
school, it's almost a year prior that you have to apply.
So if your school's like that, you might have to still apply
pretty early. But it is regarded as a pretty,
pretty solid position, especially early in your career.
If you know you work, you know anywhere honestly.
And it doesn't even necessarily have to be your school.
It can be schools around you and other endowments, but it does
look pretty good. Yeah.
And it's well regarded, especially in, you know,
investment banking or anything like that because you kind of
understand the insurance and outs of deals and again like
private equity or. Yeah, yeah.
Also nonprofits on the same note.
Yeah. I feel like they like always
need help and are rarely going to turn you down.
And also something that looks super good on a resume.
Yeah, And I think with nonprofits too, especially early
in your career, you can kind of ask for what kind of work you
want, which is really helpful. So, you know, if you're trying
to break into finance, I know for me, like it was so hard to
get a finance job starting out. So really asking like nonprofits
if I could help do their budgeting or help with any, you
know, files they needed sent to investors or anything like that.
That was a big help to me just to break into that space.
And yeah, again, it doesn't have to be a nonprofit necessarily in
your area. You could also do a virtual job.
That's what I did. I actually did mine out of
Minnesota. So the leader would meet with me
and I would meet with him and it was cool and pretty easy.
Slay. OK, so Claire, do you want to
talk about timelines and like when people should apply for
internships and full time jobs? Yes, Katie, I'm so glad you
asked because the crazy thing is how far out people are
recruiting right now. It's like, I know it's going to
be a little bit different for each industry, but if you're not
locking in your internship for the next summer by like
September I would start to be a little worried.
Low key. Not to scare anyone, but I feel
like that's when the good ones go.
Not saying that you can't still find a good one, but it's never
too soon to start looking. Just like maybe once a week look
at LinkedIn pages or indeed pages or whatever form you like
to look at and just kind of scroll and then one day
something will pop up and then just have your stuff ready so
you can apply. Yeah, I think one of the biggest
things too is like talking to friends about where they're
applying, because I didn't do that a lot, but I realized a lot
of us are applying to the same places.
And it's like, OK, well, when's the deadline for this?
When is the interview process for this?
Because a lot of people know things that maybe you don't
know, or know that they're going to ask questions and interviews
that you didn't know they were going to ask.
And that's been super helpful. For me, no, absolutely.
But yeah, so I think especially we talked about this in a
previous episode, but consulting and investment banking jobs are
notorious for really far out. Also some accounting jobs like
Deloitte we talked about that recruit really far out.
PwC sometimes as well. I've seen some really great
graphics online showing the timelines for different
industries. So I feel like if even if you're
applying for multiple industries just to kind of Google it and
there's great resources out there that tell you when and to
have that like on your mind. Yeah yes, even ChatGPT honestly
has been pretty helpful, at least for me and it's like OK,
what goals should I set? Cuz I think the problem is
everyone's like this is such a big deal like it's so annoying
to try to figure out what jobs I'm going to apply to how often
to the work on this like how often should I look at LinkedIn?
I think it's good to have goals set like, oh, I'm going to apply
to two jobs this week or three jobs this week and things like
that that help keep you motivated.
So I also think that with those timelines, it's good to, like
Claire said, do your research and keep goals for yourself.
Speaking of other people applying at the same time like
your friends, have you seen the feature on LinkedIn that's like
there is 54 applicants right now for this job?
I hate. That I hate that and I'm always
like that always makes me feel so rushed or it'll be like be an
early applicant. Only two applicants so far and
I'm like is this scamming me? I know 'cause I'm like, OK, if
there's not many applicants, is this a bad job?
But if there's too many applicants, I'm like, I'll never
get the job. But again, guys, don't let that
discourage you just 'cause there's a lot of applicants.
Like it's way better to over apply than under apply, you
know? So motivational, Katie, I love
it. Yeah, it's so annoying though to
like, see how many people have applied and it'll be like, oh,
if I posted this an hour ago and then there will be 2000
applicants and I'm like, what are you guys doing?
But I guess some people have like bots that do it for them
now, which is insane that we're living in a world like this,
that it's this hard to get a job.
I wish that like getting a job, I guess like LinkedIn is kind of
like this, and there are some features on Indeed that mimic
what I'm about to say, but I wish it was kind of like the
college app, Common app. I talk about that like, so much.
I was talking to my dad about that the other day.
I think it would just like make why don't we centralized the
talent pool? Yeah, no, I totally agree it
because that just bothers me too, because I don't really
know, you know, what each company is about, You know,
would I like the people there, the culture, everything like
that. Like college is way more focused
on those things. And then it's very much, I feel
like more of a matching process. And it is like, OK, you got
accepted or denied. Everyone says it's a matching
process, but it's really not. And I think you should have,
like, early apply where you, like, only apply to one company
that you're really, really interested in.
And that's the only one you apply to until a certain day.
And then if you get in, you're definitely gonna accept that
company. Like, I don't understand why we
don't do that because there are some companies I'm really,
really passionate about. And then it's like, OK, well,
now everybody's applying. I think there should be some
distinction. The only thing from the
perspective of the company is I think some common system like
this would really create like volume problems.
Like there's no way the company could get through as many
applications as what happened because just like myself, I know
I would apply to more jobs if I had a tool like that.
Yeah, I mean, I agree, but at the same time, I feel like
there's better applications there as well.
It's all these people that you might not have gotten the chance
to look at. But yeah, you're right.
I think they're just not, especially for some of the
smaller companies there's they just don't have the systems to
handle that. Yeah, and I feel like with like
these chat bots and like, online application processes and how
everything's working right now, I think there's like a big
talent problem in connecting, like recruiters processing and
digging through everything to find the real people.
It's so difficult. I've only met, I've met very few
good recruiters. And I just want to say that too,
because some recruiters totally forget who I am.
Like I'll have a conversation with them a week later.
They're like, who is this? I think, who is this?
Oh, what's your major? Oh, like, Are you sure you're
18? Whatever.
And I'm like, we literally just talked last week and went
through all this. And it's kind of frustrating,
but I think a good recruiter changes the game.
I've had somewhere I'll apply for two positions at a company
and they say, I really like you for this position.
Is it OK if like we move forward with this?
I think you're much stronger here and they kind of also work
for you. I think those are the good
recruiters. But you know, not every
recruiter is going to be a good recruiter.
And so again, like it's not necessarily that you got
rejected because of the the company doesn't want you.
Sometimes it's just the way things work out based on their
recruiting systems, which is unfortunate, but that does
happen. I do think that I'm seriously
going to flip a switch if one more recruiters slides into my
LinkedIn DMS with a vague ass job that they're trying to sell
me on. Yeah, I kind of get annoyed by
that too. I get a lot of masters programs
though, and I'm like, you can look at my bio.
I'm already in a master's program, so I don't know why
they bother sending me those anymore.
But. No, it's really been, it's
really been pissing me off lately.
I get at least three a day and I think it's because there's such
a drought and talent for the accounting industry right now.
But I'm just like, leave me alone.
You're like, you're kind of burning a bridge with me if I do
find a job and then like have to go back to you and you've sent
me 3 LinkedIn DMS like each a day apart.
No thanks. Yeah.
Oh, the other thing, I know we were talking about moving cities
and things like that. I would encourage everyone to
move to a different city at some point, whether that's junior
year or that's somewhere else some other time.
I think that's super important just because a lot of people
tend to stay in their city and they don't branch out.
But this is kind of the first time you can experience a new
city and live there for 10 weeks without having to fully commit.
So I think that's really important also to just branch
out, try something new. I've personally loved my
experience in a different city right now.
So yeah, would 10 out of 10. Recommend 100% new bars, new
places, new fun things to do, new friends to be made.
Yeah. And my other thing is I don't
think unless you really love a company and are 100% ready to
work there full time, that you should go back to the place you
interned prior. Like if you enter in a place
sophomore year, you just want to do kind of like the easy thing
and an intern there junior year, again, it's harder because you
don't have any options. If they don't want to hire you
back full time, let's say they have a hiring freeze, whatever,
you don't really have anything else.
And it's also just good to experience new things because
you might like it more than your other internship.
I've definitely had that happen to me where, you know, I really
liked an internship. I wanted to go back, but I
pushed myself to go somewhere else and it taught me a lot
about what I like and what I want to do.
I agree, I think that that's super important to think about.
Like unless you've already accepted a job there and they're
like do you want to do 1 less internship just for shits and
gigs and like go for it. But cuz that's definitely, yeah,
cuz I've definitely seen where people are like I accepted a job
there, but I still have my junior to see in your summer to
kill. So they'll go back to the
company they were at. And I think that that's probably
good cuz you can continue to build your relationships and
stay at like the front of their mind.
Anyways, Katie, what I wanted to ask you is what's your favorite
place to apply to jobs? Do you like LinkedIn?
Do you like Google jobs? Do you like Indeed?
I like LinkedIn and sometimes I use Google search for a specific
area, but otherwise I use mostly LinkedIn and then I apply it on
the website. I don't even use like the easy
apply. I think that it's just, I know
it's easier, but I think applying on the website actually
make sure you get in where they need you to on their back end,
so. That's why I agree.
I usually use like the platforms to find the job and then I go to
their website because then you can also scroll through all of
their job listings and make sure that like you're finding the
best one that you can. Yeah.
And the other thing is too like sometimes they, I don't know why
they do this, but sometimes they'll retire one job listing
and then we'll start like a new job listing that's really
similar, you know what I'm talking about and then.
I don't understand that either. I I honestly don't get it but I
just apply to like around 3 for each company.
If I'm really excited about a company, I apply to three, and I
wouldn't apply to more than that because then it just looks like
you've no idea what you're doing and you just want to do
anything. So kind of pick the three that
you think you're the strongest candidate for and that you were
the most interest in and then apply to those.
Well, thank you guys for listening so much.
This episode, I know, is a little content heavy this time,
but yeah, we really appreciate you guys.
Please, please write in with anything you guys have questions
on or if you have any crazy corporate stories, we'd love
hearing from you guys. So make sure to write into our
listener inbox or just DMR Instagram if that's easier for
you guys. Slay, see you all next time.
See you next time.