I'm Jessica and this is Taba K Rambles, where a couple of
friends review Korean dramas and we're back for another sports
drama episode review. We're going to be reviewing Hot
Stove League and for this episode I am joined by Emily and
Raquel from the Play On K podcast.
How are you ladies? We didn't plan that.
Just like that. Sorry.
How are you guys doing? And for those who don't know
your podcast, maybe just introduce yourselves and
introduce what maybe you're watching lately.
Just just a little primer. All right, Raquel, you go first.
OK, OK. Hi, I'm Raquel with Play on K
Right now for the podcast. We are watching study group over
at Play on K. We watch 2 episodes at a time
and review it and so anyone who's interested around the time
this comes out, go back to our study group episodes because we
are having a blast with that show.
It is. It's so weird and off the wall
and we've loved it so far and it can be found on Vicki.
What else have we been watching? We've slowed down a lot recently
because our schedules are like especially M schedules are super
jam packed. But I'll I'll let you, Emily,
like see what else we might be watching.
What else it have we recently watched in the past?
We started Family by Choice because we thought we were going
to watch it for the podcast and we both didn't care for it.
We decided to avoid that one. Yeah, Before that, we recently
finished Youngsung Creatures Season 2.
Season 1 was one of Raquel's all time favorite shows.
It's a banger. And season 2 was fine.
So that was. OK, yeah, I love your face when
you said that. Yeah, I have heard so many great
things about Study Group and I can't wait to watch later in the
year when the hip hop podcast season is over.
I usually leave about 3-4 months at the end of the year to just
binge my way through everything that came out in the current
year and study group is on my finish the year 2025 list of
dramas, so I'm really excited to do that.
And Kyung Song Creature, yeah, I don't think I ended up pressing
play on it because it was slated for a season 2.
So I was like, that's a back burner drama for me, if that
makes any sense. Yeah.
Also, it was like really dark and I'm a mood watcher so I was
like, I'm not feeling this right now.
But and then what was the other one?
Family by choice? I refuse to watch Family by
Choice until I've watched the original sea drama, which is Go
ahead. I didn't know that it was
originally a sea drama. Oh girl, yeah, that was a sea
drama. A very famous, well regarded C
drama. What?
Yes. And so they created Family by
Choice based on that C drama. And I just refused on principle
to watch Family by Choice until I've watched Go Ahead.
That's so valid. I think that's fair.
I'm doing the same thing with Pachinko and the book where I'm
like, I know in my heart I am going to read this book.
And so I cannot press play on this show until I've read it.
I did get a little bit of inspiration because one of my I
like met my high school English teacher for coffee recently and
we recommended it to her and she actually reads.
She actually reads. So as it turns out, and she
texted me the other day and she was like, I finished the book
and it's one of the best things I've ever read.
I'm enamored. I love it.
Yeah, it's a big book. It's thick.
I want to read it. I have not been a reader for
many years because I used to work in publishing, and so I
used to do a lot more reading and writing and building, like a
books, basically. And so I was really jaded after
a while and like, didn't read. Yeah, it like, stunted my
reading basically for a long time.
And even though I've bought books recently, I haven't even
cracked them open. So I feel horrible.
I resolved to read Pachinko. In the two years since, I've
watched Season 1, and yeah, that still hasn't happened.
So I am horrible. I'm horrible.
I'm following through on that. But I did watch Season 2.
Amazing, amazing. Love that Apple TV Plus show.
Highly recommend it. I can't wait to hear from you
guys when you finally watch it. But yeah, there's so many shows,
so many great shows, so little time.
Yeah, yes, 100. Percent and we're going to talk
about 1:00 today. But before we do, if this is
your first time listening, go ahead and subscribe on your
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Thank you so much for supporting the show.
OK, are you guys ready? Let's do it.
OK, so we're going to talk about hot Stove league like I said in
the previous episode, which is the C drama Nothing But You.
I love a good sports drama and we have covered quite a few on
the Tiba Ki Ramble's show. We've covered 2521, fencing,
prison playbook, also baseball. Love all play, badminton,
weightlifting, fairy Kimbok, Drew.
Obviously weightlifting in swimming run on which is track.
It's at this point that I have to say I freaking love sports
dramas and I am so self indulgent.
And so I was like, oh nothing but you I want to do and I also
want to do hot stove league. Why the hell not do them
back-to-back? So here we are.
Look at you. Yeah, look at me, look at me.
So here's the My Drama List synopsis for Hot Stove League.
This is about the preparation period of a Major League
Baseball team. The drama focuses on a loser
team that prepares for an extraordinary season upon the
arrival of their new general manager, and each episode will
focus on a problem they have as they prepare to become a
stronger team. Say Young is the youngest head
of the management team of Dreams, a cellar dwelling
baseball team. Cellar dwelling baseball team.
She's highly recognized for her perseverance and intense passion
for the team. One day, Song SU is appointed as
a general manager. Although he's been working in
sports field, the teams he has led to the championship were
unpopular and some of them were even disbanded after winning the
league due to the financial difficulties of their parent
companies. Would this unlucky new general
manager be able to steer Dreams to the championship with
passionate Seiyong? And I think I'm just going to
stop right there. This show aired in December 2019
through February 2020. It is 16 episodes long and
directed by Jung Dong Yun. And this guy has directed,
Wouldn't you know it, Young Song Creature 1 and 2.
I was like oh they mentioned Kyung song creature.
He's also directed It's OK to not be OK.
This is a questionable 1 though because it's listed on MDL only
and so perhaps maybe he was an assistant director on It's OK to
Not be OK. So it's not quite confirmed that
this director worked on It's OK to not be OK.
Also unconfirmed that he might have worked on heart surgeons
from 2018. Kind of a weird resume anyway.
Fates and Furies from 2018, Exit from 2018, which is a
miniseries, but for sure Kyung Song, Creature one and two from
Netflix most recently I see Fist Pumping.
Yeah. So you guys have the most
experience with this director? Yeah.
And honestly, when you said he directed it's OK to not be OK,
but that's questionable. I thought you were saying the
show is questionable, like that one's OK.
And I was like, I'm sorry, are we going to fight right now?
Because I think the three shows those top three on his resume to
me, bangers. Yeah.
Gun sung creature one and two. It's OK to not be OK.
This man can do it all for me. He is untouchable at this point.
Right. It's what I'm saying is
questionable is whether or not he's worked on the show.
We just covered it recently on the podcast like 2 episodes ago
by the time you're listening to this.
And that was a really crushing recording because the Kim Suhyon
drama is still, the scandal is still ongoing.
It was very interesting to come back to that drama, rewatch it
and kind of unpack that one. So if you want to go back in
your podcast feed and listen to it, you can.
This director, Zhang Dong Yoon, is not listed as a director in
that episode, obviously. But, you know, hopefully, like,
that gets cleared up. Maybe as he does more work, they
can kind of solidify what other stuff he's done, maybe as an
assistant director or, you know, producer or something like that.
Hot Stove League was written by Ishenhua.
This is their only project. This is the only thing they've
written. Really.
One and done. I mean, once you're like.
Why mess with perfect? It is so shocking.
Nothing else to compare it to. I, I, I don't know, it's crazy.
This show stars Nam Kong Min, who plays Peck Song Soo.
He's the general manager that we were talking about in the My
Drama List synopsis. He's done about 26 TV shows,
including our movie from this year.
I think it's going to come out sometime this year in 2025, but
I think everyone knows him best from my dearest that came out in
2023 and there is a big deep dive on the tip out feed for my
dearest $1.00 Lawyer. The Veil awakened Dr. Prisoner.
Good manager. A girl who sees smells. 12 years
promise. In need of romance 3.
Chung Dung Dung Alice from 2012 becoming a billionaire.
What's your guys experience with this actor?
Incredibly. This is our first time seeing
this man I. Know I'm sorry going to hang out
she's like you're off my bad fast. 300 Thank.
You guys, goodbye. Never.
Well, what did you guys think of
him? I thought he was great in this
role. I really, really liked him in
the, like, he's a pretty stoic character for most of it, but he
was, I think, able to outside. Like sometimes when someone
plays a stoic character, it can come off as emotionally stunted
in like a like, there's not as much range that can be given to
the role, I guess, is what I'm trying to say.
I feel like he gave plenty of range well, while maintaining
the core of the character. So I thought he did a really
good job. Yeah.
Fully agreed.
Pakkun Bin plays the Co lead in Isayoung.
She obviously has been a child actress.
She's got 33 TV credits to her name.
Hyperknife is currently airing right now.
In the year 2025 she was in Castaway Diva.
In 2023 she is the Extraordinary attorney Wu from 20/22 she was
in the King's Affection. Do you like Brahms?
And so many more. I have a couple of reviews up,
so one is for Extraordinary Attorney Wu and the other one is
for Do You Like Brahms If you want to scroll back in your
podcast feed. She is amazing.
I love her as an actress. What do you guys think of Paco
and Vin? We're going to go 0 for two on
this. 1 Yeah, we hadn't. So obviously very aware of
Extraordinary Attorney Wu that has been in the zeitgeist.
If you're in anywhere near K dramas, as we have been, you
obviously know about that drama. So yeah, for sure, I've had some
level of familiarity with her. She comes up on my feed a lot.
But yeah, we never watched. We never actually sat down and
put in the time with Extraordinary Attorney Wu.
So we again, yeah, have not seen her before, but.
Loved her. There's so many dramas that I've
pressed play on and watched 2 episodes and then said we got to
watch this for the podcast and then we never did because our
podcast takes so long so. Deep diving every two episodes,
it takes so much time and effort, and it is quite a feat.
So I completely understand why a lot of dramas don't make the cut
for your show. Like, you have to be choosy, for
sure. Well, I love her, and I think
that you should definitely give a couple of these a shot,
whether or not they end up on your podcast.
Do you like Brahms? It's really sweet, really chill.
It's a music show. I think she's a violinist.
Violinist in that one, and she has dreams of being, you know, a
professional violinist, but she doesn't have the talent to kind
of back that up. So it's one of those about
pursuing dreams. But, you know, at what cost of
what time do you give up, Right, Because it's not sustainable.
So plus it's a love story. So, you know, OK, It's good.
Yeah, it's good. That is sold.
Sold. Really sweet show.
I would recommend that one probably over extraordinary
attorney boot, to be quite honest with you, even though
that one's the bigger acting showcase for her.
Oh Jiang Say is to round out our trio here.
He is the nephew of the owner of the baseball club.
He plays Kwong Kyung Min. He's got 55 movies to his name,
about 37 TV shows he is appearing or has appeared in
When Life Gives You Tangerines, When the stars Gossip, both from
2025. Mr. Plankton Sweet Home 3.
Queen of Tears as a cameo in episode 1 Deaths Game.
Sweet Home 2. Revenant Little Women It's OK to
not be OK, which we covered in depth.
When the Camellia blooms set your heart missing 9.
You throw a rock. He's been in a drama.
Yeah. What do you guys think about Oh
Chung say? We did it.
We got one. Yeah, we've seen a lot of stuff
with him in it. Nice, nice.
Yeah, my personal favorite being Little Women, but I'm trying to
recall his character even he must have played someone kind of
far in the background or I'm self reporting as someone with a
terrible memory but like. Usually Raquel's good at this.
Though yeah, I feel like yeah, usually I'm really good at.
It and him fully for not being that memorable.
How dare you do this to me personally.
Rude. Live on air, Rude.
Yeah, I don't look. I don't remember who he was
either in Little Women. I mean, I can look it up, but I
think that's counter intuitive at this point.
There is an episode review on Little Women, so you can scroll
back in your podcast feed and listen to a much clearer Jessica
talk about Little Women right when she finished watching
Little Women. But Jessica today does not
remember who Oh Jeong Sei was. I just remember there's a lot of
like financial crime in Little Women.
That was the whole thing. That was the plot.
But. It's one of our favorite shows
of all time. It's so good.
Yeah, it's really atmospheric. There was like a poison flower
or something like that. So that's like broad strokes
what I remember. I don't know if you guys no, or
if I have ever said on the podcast before, I have a
horrific memory. I have the memory of a goldfish.
And so the blog, like the Tabaki Rambles blog and then now the
podcast is as much about preserving what I think about a
show as much as it is about having fun and talking to people
about K dramas. Because I don't remember like
after a certain period of time, it's gone.
I don't remember specifics. I don't remember characters.
I feel so. Sane.
I love this. God, so get it while you can get
it while it's hot basically is with the the name of the game
here with Tampa gay rambles. But we've come to the end of the
cast list. There's definitely more casts
that we can talk through if you guys would like.
You know, the players, the people behind the scenes, the
management, all these people. But I'm just going to skip ahead
and ask you guys, what did you guys think of Hot Stove?
League you go first time. Oh, OK, I hit you up first.
I liked it. I do think I would have liked it
better if it were 12 episodes. I think there were a few
storylines that I could have done without, and if they had
been cut, the show would have been perfectly paced.
I would have been interested from start to finish in every
single thing that happened versus the 16 episode format
that is pretty typical 4K dramas.
I liked it, but there was a few too many storylines that I could
have done without and I was kind of half watching those parts
being like, it's fine, we'll get through them.
Yeah, but overall the highs were high.
Like when we were up, I was fully invested and I was so
excited to be part of this baseball team for the short
lived time that this drama lasted.
I really enjoyed the fun parts of it.
There were just some slow bits that I was like cut.
Gotcha. I, I am very similar in the
sense that like, I guess to specifically identify it because
I also I like sports dramas. I like sports shows and stuff,
but we don't watch a whole lot for our podcast.
This is actually I think is our first one that I can think of as
far as like K dramas go, which was really cool.
But I think like there's stuff that have, I mean, they're so
popular in Western media like we have Ted Lasso was the most
direct comparison I could give as far as.
Something that is an ongoing series about a sports team and
like the people within it. And I think that where this the
what, like maybe what and what have identified as the slow
parts. But for me are just like where
the interest fluctuates is the hardcore politics.
Sports politics were a little tough for me sometimes where I
was like, can we just watch the inspirational people do
inspiration? Like, this one's tough, this
one's tough when I just want to watch the good boys play
baseball and be good boys sometimes.
But I do think that they had a good balance in there where it
helped with my focus fluctuation, where all of a
sudden they were like, now look at this character, throw an
incredible pitch and the people around him that want to help him
or whatever. And then I'm like, I'm back.
I'm back, baby. Oh, I think we do have different
slow parts because I really liked the business stuff.
That's kind of my bread and butter.
I, I'm a business student and so I was like, give me all the
politics of how to make this trade, what stuff had to be
negotiated in what stuff people felt like they were losing in
the trade versus what they were gaining.
And obviously I did not keep up with the statistics of this
person's ETR was .45. And so I don't know what's
happening at all here, but the trade negotiations of these
people as baseball players was so fascinating to me.
And I liked that they kind of lost me with character
backstories sometimes. That's where it slowed down for
me. I loved the PowerPoint
presentation parts. That's the politics I can get
behind. Is a good PowerPoint right?
Break it down for us. Yeah, I come from a 4th of July
Rocky marathon family. You know what I'm saying?
Like, I love sports movies. I love the underdog story.
I was riding high last year with the Challengers movie, The
Zendaya threesome movie that was like, Oh my God, Coming from A2
Summers taking tennis lessons kind of person.
The Challengers movie was like, Oh my God, it was like a drug.
I love sports movies. The Iron Claw, there's so many
movies. Jerry Maguire, bring it On.
Like so many movies, our sports movies and Rudy Radio.
I'm just like reading through here.
Stick it. You ever seen stick it?
Stick it. Are you, do you know who you're
speaking to? Wimbledon.
I love that movie love and basketball.
Like I am constantly over here loving sports movie dramas.
And so when I realized that this drama was basically Moneyball
but make it a K drama, I was like sign me up, sign me up.
I was all in. I was locked in.
Oh my God, I was locked in. I was like, give me the nuclear
codes cuz I'm gonna be here a while like this.
This was literally right up my alley and I loved all the
business aspect. I loved all of the players
aspect. I loved when they were talking
shop and they were talking stats.
Listen, I don't know anything about stats.
I don't know what means what. Give it to me anyway.
Just throw numbers at me. I was living for it.
I loved the Wheeling and dealing and there was so much that was
entertaining to me, that was surprising to me.
And there was something about the team that was really sad and
pitiful. Like it was like an Angels in
the Outfield team. It was like a Bad News Bears
team. Like they were just goofy.
They were awful. They had no talent.
And I was like, yes, there's only one way it's up.
I can't wait. So this show excited me.
It entertained me and I completely understand how you
feel Emily, that you were like it was dragging because I was
watching at a 1.5 speed and that was the perfect speed to watch
it at. How do you do that?
Smart. Oh, there's a plug in on Google
Chrome OK. Yes, we need the plugin.
We need the. Plugin to add to your Google
Chrome and that will change the speed on videos for you.
Pro tip. So because Vicki doesn't have
that feature, no, to change the speed because they're in the
Sony age, but that's neither here nor there.
Anyway. I was watching it at 1.5 speed.
Wonderful speed to watch it at because I think these episodes
should have been 4540 minutes. Yeah, that was a sweet spot for
these episodes. And I'm not sure if anything
could have been cut out. I just think they could have
tightened it up, you know what I'm saying?
So I'm somewhere in between because I liked everything, but
they just needed to move quicker.
Yeah, that makes any sense. Something that probably impacted
my viewing it, it always does. I have this terrible habit of I
never read the synopsis of a show I'm about to start.
I don't know. I I go only on vibes.
I never know what it's actually about.
I hit play and I was listen, smooth brain over here.
I didn't know what a stove leak was.
I had no clue that this show. Thought I knew what a stove leak
was. You're giving me too much
credit. You're giving me way too much
credit. That was the first Google, that
was the first thing, that was the first thing they put on the
screen when you press play on episode 1.
They defined what the stove league was.
And I was still like, let me Fact Check.
Let me Fact Check what the stove league is.
So I mean, I'll just give it to you guys.
Like right now what? The stove league is a stove
league, according to Google's AI overview, refers to the baseball
offseason period when teams make trades, sign free agents and
discuss the upcoming season. The term originated from
baseball and players gathering around literal hot stoves in the
winter to discuss the sport. Because baseball is not played
in cold months. So OK, that says stove league.
That that last little detail I had completely missed.
I also when they gave us the definition, I kind of skimmed
it. It was one of those things where
it's like Vicki tells you and you're like, OK, OK, context.
Cool. Love it.
Yes, I spent way too long being like, all right, when are we
going to play some baseball? Oh man, that's the thing, They
weren't going to play. Baseball exactly because they
was the. Baseball.
It was the stove league. That's what it was, the stove
league. Is the offseason, Yeah, yeah.
They're prepping and changing things around around.
Episode 6 I was like, oh. Never.
They're never going to play some baseball.
Not you getting almost halfway through the show and then being
like a weight. We're not going to have any
games. Like they're not going to play
baseball. Yep, about halfway through when
I was like, well, maybe half of it is like the the offseason and
half of it they'll like show them succeeding.
No, still no. Raquel, come on.
OK, that's fine. That's fine.
Yeah, an absolute fool. I love how you brought up Nam
Kunmin and his sort of stoic portrayal of this general
manager, because that's kind of different to his character in My
Dearest, who's very charismatic and he's got like, I know that
rizz equals charisma, but like, he's got a lot of rizz.
In My Dearest, he doesn't have no rizz in the show at all.
Yeah, you guys are shaking your head.
So I was wondering for a little bit of the show if he had, you
know, if he was on the spectrum or something like that, and that
was going to be some sort of reveal later in the show.
But they never do talk about his feelings and how his persona is.
Maybe the reason for it is something deeper.
I don't know if that was a flaw of the show or if that was a
positive of the show. Because you have like this
enigma of a man who's just making moves.
You know what I'm saying? I don't know.
Yeah, I love doing that with K drama characters because I do
actually think that comes up a lot where there's someone who's
like emotionally unavailable and sometimes it really is in the
portrayal because I've never seen outside of maybe the
extraordinary attorney Woo, I've never really seen a whole lot.
Oh, and it's OK to not be OK. There's not a bunch of like
identification of if someone's on the spectrum, but there have
been multiple instances where I've just the way a character is
reading, I'm like, there's no way they aren't.
Or if they are, that's very frustrating because I don't
know. It's, it's one of those things
where it's like if you're operating outside of general
social norms and kind of trampling people's feelings, and
it's not that you don't understand the social cues, I
think that just makes you a jerk.
It's like if you understand the social cues and you're still
being like, kind of right. But if if you're on the spectrum
and you're just kind of functioning like with the
information that you have, then it's kind of, oh, that makes you
like a cool, interesting, diverse character that is not
being a jerk just to be mean. But I also think he was a jerk,
too. Yeah, because he was very astute
and understood why people were upset with him when he didn't.
You know, he kept saying, like towards the end of the show,
like, I'm not that soft. You know, I'm not softening
anything when I give you things to do, when I say my opinion,
when I'm telling you what's going to happen.
I've realized that to inspire trust, I have to tell you why
I'm making these decisions. And I think it's important for
his character's growth as well to see him do these things,
change his routine, and it garners trust and rallies all of
these team members around him to support him and his decisions.
That's why I was like on the fence about whether or not
because there was a complete understanding of what he was not
giving these people. That's true.
So maybe he was just kind of a jerk, but it's one of those,
have you ever seen that chart of the United States where it's
like this section acts nice and is nice.
This section acts nice is mean. This section he's very like,
acts mean, is nice kind of guy where it's like he's doing the
right thing. At the end of the day, he's just
a huge jerk getting there. Yeah, he has no bedside manner.
Yeah, yeah. And I think my frustration, and
I'll try and keep this as non spoilery as possible, came when
they introduced his back story in the middle of the drama.
And they were like, This is why he's a jerk.
He's been through some stuff. And they just kind of left that
there. They just dropped it on our
doorstep and we're like, we're never going to talk about it
again. I was like, oh, so he's just
mean because he's been through some stuff.
That's not OK. I put him on the spectrum and
I'll like him better. That's where I'm at.
Yeah. We could talk about that in
spoiler section, because I totally agree that that was like
a weird thing to do. And then they didn't unpack it
at all. Yeah.
But that's why he's mean, because if you go through a hard
thing, you can just be rude to people, to your life.
Yeah, pack and bin. A very plucky, kind of average,
sort of female lead character in this show.
But she loves baseball. That's how.
Like, her only shtick is that she absolutely adores this team,
has a strong affinity for it, and no amount of money is going
to make her leave to go to another team.
I'm like, OK, OK sis, like calm down.
Look, if I got a call from a rival team and they're trying to
scout me, I would at least take the call, OK?
I would at least see a contract before.
I'm like, no, definitely not. I love dreams.
Don't call me lose my number. But Bakun Bin in this is
softening Nam Kun Bin's character Sung Soo, and she just
understands it. Like after a few altercations in
the first few episodes, she is completely on his side and like,
trusts him. She trusts his judgement.
What did you think of Paco and Ben's Seiyong?
Pretty pretty bland for me. They liked her but I don't think
they could have done the show without her.
But also I've got no notes on her.
She was just kind of there for me.
I think I kind of agree. I almost feel like she was bland
in the way that people describe the protagonist of a lot of
young adult fantasy novels, where she kind of was the
vehicle with which we were experienced or the lens through
which we were experiencing the show in a lot of ways.
So I almost appreciate the like anchor that she provided to the
show in being very expected, behaving in very expected ways
or very like pure do it for the love of the game kind of way
where it she is anchoring like all of the moving parts of the
politics and everything. And she's like, we're here for
dreams and I'm like, we are here for dreams.
Yes, exactly. Aujang says character who is
super, super interesting. What would you like to say about
this man and the menace that he is throughout?
The show I have so many feelings a lot of them I will reserve for
the spoiler section because I don't want to rail too hard now
and spoil anything so but what I will say is when I first saw him
in the show, when I first because again, I read nothing I
reviewed nothing. I hit play and went into it, and
when I saw him show up, not knowing, you know, what type of
character he was going to play, who he was going to be, all I
could think was, oh, they're. For real.
With this show, like they, they
got the actor, yeah. I have to say, when I resolved
to cover the show and also to cover It's OK to not be OK, I
had no clue that Ojeng Sei was in hot stove league.
Obviously knew Ojeng Sei was in It's OK to not Be OK.
I did not know that he was in hot stove league.
So when he popped up, I was like, oh shit, we're doubling up
on Ojeng Sei in this season of tebak.
He is really brilliant. He's so hateful in the show and
we can talk more about all his infractions in the spoiler
section. I have to say they put him in
like a he's got kind of like reddish hair, almost like Auburn
ish hair in the show. And then they put him in like a
maroon suit at one point and I was like, are they cosplaying
Joker here or like what is? I don't know why, but it felt
very cartoonish but toned down villain to me.
But they must have only done it like two or three times that he
had this color suit on. It made such an impression on
me. All the suits, every suit.
So much, yeah. Every suit was a lot.
It's giving Korean web comic to me where the villain has like
the same color hair as their eyes and their outfit and
everything and you're like, OK. This is real life.
Yeah, I agree. Were there any other characters
that you wanted to point out right now?
Maybe a TE Donkyo In this show he plays you Minho, who is one
of the younger pitchers. He has a smile that beams into
your soul. He's potato boy from
nevertheless, and I also had no idea that he was in this show.
So when he popped up, I was like, Oh my God, Dan Dong Heelp
is in this because he was the star of love all play, which is
a badminton K drama that we have also covered on the feed.
So I was like, Oh my God, doubling up on sports dramas
with hey Dong heel. What what is this?
What is this? He's precious in this.
And I don't think it's much of A spoiler to say like he had, he
had yips, which I feel like yips, you throw a rock, you hit
somebody who has gone through the yips in the K drama or like
a sports K drama, pervasive issue with athletes.
So yeah, poor kid, but real cute.
Real cute in this. Just such a small supporting
role. Yeah, if that's your deal.
If you like Che Zhong help, then don't miss out.
You know he's in a baseball. Here he's smiling, he's
charming, all of us. He's so cute.
I think you guys wanted to talk about the chemistry.
Yes. Is that spoiler ific or do you
want to talk about it now? I don't think it's spoilery.
Yeah. Like Raquel did Google it when
she started watching the show. She's like, is there romance in
this drama? So.
It was like the first thing. Won't read the synopsis will
Google. Is there romance in this drama?
OK. Because the chemistry lends
itself in our little monkey brains to this is going to turn
into a romance. This is going.
We found it, the perfect sports meets romance drama as not
charismatic, quote, UN quote, as Big Sunsu is.
He has the riz like he's. It's so quiet.
It's subdued in this drama, but I still think he has it.
Yeah. So we were convinced there's a
lot of people with chemistry in this drama.
We were convinced there's going to be some sort of love
storyline. And maybe it's spoilery.
Skip ahead 15 seconds if you don't want to know if there is
one or not. There's not one.
No romance, dry drama, but the chemistry is still there.
Everyone works so well together. These actors just knew each
other and we loved to see it. Yeah, and there's like interest
between characters without their ever.
It's very ambiguous, similar to us not definitively knowing if
Sung Tzu is on the spectrum or not.
We also they gave us. Crumbs throughout where they
were like, maybe, perhaps, you know, perhaps these two.
Yeah. But then they said that's not
what this is about. This is about the hot stove
league. Write your fanfics on the web,
OK? Yeah, we're not here to write
them for you. Keep it in your pants.
So the last thing I'll say before we kind of break for
spoilers is that this show, as I said, aired from December 2019
to February 2020. And I think it just got
overshadowed because I don't know if you remember what
happened in December 2019 through February of 2020.
A little show, I don't know if you've heard of it, Crash
Landing on You aired at the exact same time.
So I think Hot Stove League got the short end of the stick here
and was just crushed, just crushed by the Crash landing on
you. And I think that's unfair.
Completely unfair. I had a wonderful, exhilarating
time with Hot Stove League. I don't know if you guys had any
thoughts about why it's been so sort of underrated the past few
years. I mean you just told me the
reason all. Right.
Because I feel like if you missed that premiere window,
then it's really hard to come back from it.
Yeah, it's definitely about timing.
And like you said, the crash landing on you was a Goliath.
There was nothing they could have done other than just know
that they were going up against something.
They couldn't have known what they were going up against as
far as like viewers and stuff goes.
Yeah, Cuz yeah, I had not heard of it before.
You said like, hey, should we watch hot stove league?
And I was like, sure, absolutely will not read about it.
Can't wait. I have not heard anything.
Yeah. And so, yeah, I that is kind of
the only thing I can think that would have kept it out of at
least mentions and reels and clips and stuff, is that, yeah,
people were sleeping on it. They were.
They were busy watching the romance between a North Korean
and a South Korean. Yeah, that's all I'll say.
There is a big old episode on Crash Landing on you from season
1 if you guys want to listen back to it.
That is with Rico, my OG Co host and yeah, Chloe Biggin.
It's a Biggin. And I feel horrible for hot.
So bleak. I feel horrible that I haven't
watched it because this is this has me written all over it.
Like evidently this was made for me.
I'm a huge fan of Moneyball. It's like one of my favorite
sports movies ever and that is about rebuilding A-Team.
It is about the modern era of baseball and statistics and
building a team is because of this era of moneyball.
Highly recommend Brad Pitt, Jonah Hill, I.
Think my boyfriend was watching it just the other day and I was
like OK well I'll go up and watch some K.
Drones watching it, it's so good.
It's so. I love Moneyball, so as soon as
I realized I was like, yes, let's get to our ratings and
then we'll break for spoilers. I don't know who wants to go
first, but how many Soulju bottles would you give Hot Stove
League can? We do half.
Points. Yeah.
Yeah, you can. Give half points.
Yeah. I'm at 3.5.
We didn't have to talk about it.
It's where we're. At we're up there, all right,
3.5. I'm going to give it a four,
maybe even 4 1/2 because I had some a great time with it.
It was so, so much fun. It didn't lag too much for me,
but again, I was watching it at 1.5 speed.
That's not what they intended for us to do.
So I'm going to go with four. I'll stick with four out of
five. Hold you bottles.
And with that, we're going to break for spoilers right now.
Excuse me? I can't, you know I am.
I'm sorry, what? All right, we're on the other
side of spoilers. We're going to spoil Hot Stove
League, so if you care to be spoiled, please stop now and
return later after you've watched the show.
If you don't care, then welcome. We're going to talk about the
chemistry between characters and who were we rooting to be
together? Who Who are the ships in this
show? Top Obviously big Sung SU, Lisa
Young. Yeah.
They were just so good together. She believed in it from the
start. It was instant chem.
But there was also that little tiny question mark on Lisa Young
and her subordinate. Her.
The chairman's grandson. Yeah, he where it's like, I
don't know, they've got that. Maybe a little too bickery, but
could be sort of enemies to lovers, a relationship.
I don't know, It's just there. That one was the one that was
hinted at the most, that he had feelings for her, 'cause I think
even at one point he said something like I'm here for love
and work or something. I take both very seriously.
When he followed them to America to do recruiting, at which point
I was kind of like, oh, I did not see this coming.
You guys were very sibling coded until this moment.
And now I kind of I'm kind of feeling it all of a sudden.
Oh. I see, I see.
Yeah, I wasn't shipping nobody, and I guess that's just me.
Like reading the show, I guess really surface level because I
wasn't shipping anybody. I didn't want Pakumvin's
character Seiyoung to be with Jehi, who's her subordinate, and
I didn't want her to be with Sung SU, her boss.
I was like, no, she's by herself, fine.
Everyone's just by themselves is fine.
So I don't know. I just took a very simplistic.
Of a normal person, yeah. Yeah, one of my, I guess, like
my problematic favorite trope. The trope I acknowledge is
problematic, but I love the storyline of is office romances
because in real life I'm like, stay away from them.
That's messy you gross, but in pretend K drama land where it's
not real people suffering consequences of power dynamics,
I'm like let's go fall in love. Oh.
My God, see, I'm like the opposite.
Because as soon as you throw in an office romance, I'm like,
Jack, please, I don't like it. I don't like office romances.
I have a dark history with shipping characters because I've
just been burned so I don't do it anymore largely.
Fair. I'm going to switch gears
because you one of you brought up the trip to America.
I have so many notes on this because I was like, what the
hell is going on here? First of all, this is like an
episode 4 early episode. They have this business trip to
the United States to scout and sign a replacement for in
pitcher. They fly first class, it's a
first class flight to America and they land what I think is
they land in LAX even though they don't show LAX.
So they're in California is what my assumption is because that's
the license plate on the Ford pickup that picks them up.
It's a California plate. Then they're driving down the
road. It's the PCH.
Like I'm not crazy. It's the PCH.
They're going South on the PCH since the Pacific Ocean is on
their right hand side. So I'm like, OK, if they flew an
international flight and they landed in LAX, now they're on
the PC. This is several hours, right?
I'm like, is this the same day like that?
It takes several hours just to get to where they're at, and
they're going South on the PCH and it's unclear to me where
they get dropped off because now their scout, the person they're
scouting, is in some urban area. Yeah.
So I'm like, did they go to San Diego?
Like, are they in Baja California?
Like I had all these questions. There were just multiple times
where I was like, I listen, I've never been to Hawaii.
I don't know that this is the case.
But every time they were like around the palm trees in the
urban area, I was like, that doesn't really look like
California. Wait, but it does look like
Hawaii. I'm getting there, so just
follow me, follow me. So then they stay overnight at
this ratty motel. Like ratty what?
I was like, what is this? Is this the same K drama?
So then I was like, are they in the boonies?
Like where are they that this guy that they're scouting is at?
They should have flown business. They really should have like put
some of. This like they flew like so high
class and then they're staying at this motel.
It didn't fit. It didn't fit.
The interior shots of the motel that they're staying at
comically, in no way, shape or form match up to the exterior of
the motel. I was like, there's no way that
this is the same motel. Then cut to the next morning,
they eat breakfast outside at a Denny's on Kappa Hulu Ave.
Oh, you spotted it. You scoped.
It I was like, where the hell is this?
This is in Hawaii. Let's go.
I've never been, but I know how to identify it visually.
This is in Hawaii, OK, clearly. And I looked at the location
like Denny's on Kapahulu Avenue. I was like, this is it?
This is the Denny's. So I was like, where the what
the fuck is going on here? So bad?
I was so impressed. There's another exterior shot in
this episode. They're at a restaurant, Blue
Point Coastal Cuisine on 5th Ave.
This place is in San Diego, CA. It is now permanently closed.
I was like OK so it must have closed during the pandemic
because they filmed this obviously before the pandemic.
I'm not even done. Then they eat ramen at Robert's
house. He's the guy that they end up
signing, the pitcher that they end up signing.
Robert's house is in no way, shape or form an American house.
Yeah, it looks like the shelves, like with the open door.
That looked very East Asian architecture to me.
It looked like every other Korean house interior and then I
was mad because the only thing that differentiated it was the
Route 66 metal wall decor that they put in the dining room.
That looks so ridiculous. I couldn't believe that they
thought that would suffice. They were like America.
Literally, literally, they were like, get some American decor
just like whatever, and they got a Route 66 sign.
I was like, I am offended on behalf of my whole culture.
Then this is the last thing I have about this episode.
They run out of gas at the end of the episode and they're in
like this valley, That's the fucking Jurassic Park Valley.
Yes 100% it is. The only thing I remember though
about that scene is that they're driving on a road and I know
they did this for some kind of symbolism where they put a dead
end sign. Dead end sign.
On a road that stretches for miles in both direct like the
dead end, they're actually going like they run off in the
direction of the gas station they start.
Running at full speed. Away from away from their truck,
but like in the direction the truck was going.
Towards the dead end. Toward the dead end, or they
were coming from the dead end, at which point it's like, wow,
what? It made no sense.
And then so this, this valley is the where they film Jurassic
Park. It's, oh, I'm going to butcher
this Kahawa Valley, which is one of the most iconic locations at
Kualoa Ranch, located in the eastern part of Oahu, Hawaii.
So I had all these questions. I was pausing the show to figure
out where they were because I was angry that they were
location hopping. Yeah, to an embarrassing degree.
Where it didn't have to happen. You could have just said, let's
say that the baseball player is training in Hawaii and then will
go to Hawaii and then there's a million different things they
really could have done there. Instead of saying we're going to
say it's California, we're going to go from LAX to a place in
Hawaii using a clip from someone else driving on the Pacific
Coast Highway. Like insane.
I'm like, so in my feelings right now because I grew up in
Southern California. I clocked none of this.
We had such a different experience.
I was like, Yep, looks like California to me.
That's where I grew up. That's my home.
All of it looks good. We're all above board here.
I'm having a good time. I just love how they had the
Denny's. I was like, Denny's in Hawaii.
You could have done Denny's in San Diego and nobody would have
been the wiser. But why Denny's in Hawaii?
I I was. Because I knew I wouldn't clock
it. I am the target audience, the
dumbest person alive. You're supposed to sit there and
not clock any of this. Anyways, sorry I took us on like
a wild like chase. I thought it was.
I am also obsessed with it. I also feel like.
Do you have a career in like set QA for K dramas?
No, but I should. You should.
They should hire me. Send them this clip.
Send someone this clip. Because this is embarrassing.
If you want to have a market in the international sphere, don't
do this shit, OK? Please make it believable.
Just try at the very least. Have someone look at it and just
like take a quick review to say like, does this look like Hawaii
or California? OK, so switching gears, I think
you guys wanted to talk more about Ho Jung Sei's foul foul
company man who just keeps sabotaging the team.
Yeah, throughout the series I. So The thing is, is that he's
such an incredible actor. Like I said, when I saw he was
in it, I was like, oh, this is a like, we're for, we're doing
this, we're going hard, This is serious.
And it's going to be a work of art because he's in this.
Yeah. And then as time went on, I
just. So sometimes I think that the
best villains are the ones where there's kind of a Gray area
under which they are functioning or, you know, they're not the
good guy, but they make some compelling points.
Or if none of those things, then they've got to be the bad guy,
right? Like they've got to be like,
there's no one up above them making them do this.
There's no one. They are just committed to what
they believe and it's bad. It's all bad.
But he was kind of none of those things.
And I found him to be a very, I, I could not connect with him as
a villain because every time they tried to give his kind of
pitiable back story of like, well, his dad is poor because he
cares so much about the people around him and gives them all of
his money. And he had to go to the military
like every other non tribal, non like.
He's not. A true son of the conglomerate
Because he's not a draft Dodger. Yeah, right.
Exactly where I was. Just like, Oh no.
Let me play you the tiniest violence.
The whole time, every time they were like, look at how sad he is
because his younger cousin is a jerk to him.
And I was just like, I don't care, quit your job.
But he had to ask for money to go to school from his rich
uncle. Isn't that sad?
He had to beg for his tuition fees.
Not me out to pay back. Yeah, not me out here still
paying back my student loans 10 years later.
And he's like, my rich uncle paid for my school.
And what shame that carries for me.
I'm just like, I don't care, man.
Like I don't care. But I do feel like his arc was
good by the end. It was very believable that he
has this turn around, becomes a human and starts feeling
feelings again. I I don't know, I like the kind
of redemption of his character. It just took 15 episodes for
them to do anything with it, it was so long.
Yeah. It took a minute for him to kind
of gain a conscience because he knew what was right and wrong.
He knew he was agitating people throughout the show.
He knew that he was acting on these feelings of feeling
inferior, right. He always had this inferiority
complex, and I mean flouting his status in front of Nam Kumin's
character. He didn't like being
disrespected. He hated the general manager, He
hated that the general manager was good at his job.
He hated that the general manager didn't take direction,
didn't take orders, and he hated that he was lesser in his own
house, like in his own family. At one point he says it's much
easier to crush those below you than to fight those above you.
And that's in episode 11. And that's like his whole
philosophy throughout the show is that he's like, well, if I
can't have what I want in a professional sense, it within my
own freaking family conglomerate, then I'm going to
like bitch and moan and stomp on people below me in this ball
club that my father loved. Yeah.
That I had a wonderful childhood and grew up around just because.
Yeah. Like it's so petulant.
It was so petulant and it was it made him so hard to understand
in the sense that it was like, sorry, did you get an immense
outpouring of affection from the people that you are now
committing You're you became a corporate shill for or like
because like his family isn't good to him.
His parents seem to want to have some kind of connection with
him. I don't know.
There was just like, so many moments where it was just like,
I can't even feel like this is entirely believable because he
has every reason to want the club to succeed.
And he's still like, no, I need to impress my rich uncle.
And it's just, it's a lot. And yeah, his redemption was
kind of, there was only kind of 1 moment of it that really sold
it for me. And it was when he was speaking
with the kind of sleazy scouting, not team lead, but the
like Co lead or whatever of the scouting team after he was
trying to get him to commit all the different infractions within
the company or within the baseball club.
And then the kind of the very end, he says, can I just go back
to doing my old job? He being the the scouting
assistant Wade, he says, can I go back to doing my old job?
I would like to do real work and not sabotage people anymore.
And that was kind of the moment where you could see there was
like a a little mechanism turning in his head.
And that was kind of the only moment that that really sold the
he finally had a reason to change because all of the other
reasons had always been there. And he was kind of a brat about
those two. They didn't seem very compelling
for him to change. But it was just interesting that
that there was like that one moment where he was like, oh, I
could be a normal person about this.
This was after this guy also saved his keepsake which was the
signed baseball. Yes, I forgot about that.
Yeah, he like pulled it out of the trash and gave it back to
him. Yeah, it's like 6 episodes
before that that he was visiting the baseball stadium and an
older groundskeeper or something was like, hey, you're that kid
that used to come here. Your dad was the best guy I've
ever worked for in my entire life.
And you think, you think in that moment that Kwan Keung Min is
going to change a little bit, that he's going to be like, Oh
yeah, my dad isn't just a poor piece of shit, he's a nice
person. Despite what my uncle has been
telling me, brainwashing me with for the past 20 years since he
got my dad to quit. My dad was a good person and I
should be a good person. Nope, no change for like the
next 6 episodes. He's like, I'm going to keep
being shit. Yeah, I totally understand where
he's coming from though, because in the culture, well, first of
all, this is a conglomerate family and he is money hungry
the whole show. Like he is constantly putting
people down and equating things to money if they they're not
valuable because they're worth less money and yadda, yadda,
yadda. He's constantly talking about
money. And that's what that's all fine
and good. You add on to that.
His father's poor. His father is righteous but
poor, not very educated, was not good as a businessman, and that
equals unsuccessful and embarrassing in the Korean
culture. Not to mention the uncle is a
successful conglomerate owner. So to to this guy, to O Jiang
Sei's character, he's like, yeah, I don't want nothing to do
with my dad because my dad is an embarrassment.
So it makes no difference that the dad had a wonderful heart
for people and he's well loved in the community or that he was
well respected by these peasants.
Like they don't matter. Like, you know what I'm saying?
Like it it made no difference to him.
So I totally understand where he was coming from.
To me, the disconnect happened when he at the beginning of the
show, he sets up. I want you to create a
championship team. I brought you in specifically
because I loved your resume. You created a championship team
multiple times, and then the owners were able to disband and
sell the team. You increased the value of the
team. Yeah.
So I'm like, OK, me and my business mind, I'm like,
perfect. I understand exactly where he's
coming from. He wants to increase the value
of the team, make it attractive for when he goes to sell it in a
year after the next season. Got it.
Except he kept fucking sabotaging every single thing
that would lead to a stronger team, a stronger season.
So that was when I was like, I don't understand if he was his
own worst enemy. Yes, 100%.
I was the same where I was like, what does he do?
Like what? What do you mean you don't want
him to make them champions? And then kind of near the end,
they started doing a lot of him and his uncle and everyone were
like, there's no point in selling it.
And I was like, that also doesn't seem very business
minded in the sense that like obviously they also were like,
he's been trying for years and he hasn't been able to do it.
But that was, like you said, way later in the show.
Revealed that he had. Tried for many years to sell
this team and nobody in the region wanted to sell it.
It's worth noting this is not a team out of Seoul.
This is not a capital team. This is out of Tongjin City and
Dongjin City. I looked it up is apparently the
AI overview says it's most likely refers to Chong Dongjin,
a town near Kongnun, South Korea, most famous for its
sunrise views in the train station practically on the
beach. I looked up where that is.
It is clear on the other side of South Korea.
So it's on the East Coast of South Korea and that does track
with what they say about this team.
It is like a provincial baseball team.
They already have like three sets of ball clubs out of Seoul.
The rest of the ball clubs are out of these different provinces
and different regions in South Korea.
And this region, they had a strategic interest in putting a
ballclub there all those years ago because of their business.
They were a consumer first facing business.
And so they were like, perfect, let's create a ballclub and
create all this buzz and good feelings towards our chaise on
conglomerate with this ballclub, the dreams.
And so now that they're stuck in this podunk region, they're
like, Oh, no one wants to buy a ballclub on the East Coast, that
all that we have is a nice sunset and like, loyal fans.
Yeah, and our ball club is dog shit.
And our ball club is dog shit. So I can understand like why,
but again, that wasn't a thing. A through line that they had set
up that he was like trying to sell it and was unsuccessful.
It was like on on the last couple of episodes he was like,
good luck selling it because I've tried and no one wants to
take the ball club. Yeah.
So it's like, yeah. Which it if they made it a
through line and that would have explained so much about the
desperate. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
But because they didn't, it was just kind of like a what do you
mean you don't want to make it more valuable?
This is so weird that you're trying to stop him from doing
everything that you wanted. There was 1 episode where they
cut the budget by 30% and that wreaked havoc on the
negotiations with the players. And I think when we wanted to
talk about paying these players minimum wage and stuff like
that, like it was wild. They were doing wild things in
the show. Insane things like criminal
things. I feel so passionately.
I just have. I've had the conversation with
my boyfriend recently because he's a huge hockey fan.
Our team is the Colorado Avalanche and we watch a lot of
Colorado Avalanche games, but a recent this ties in a lot to
what's happening in hot stove league.
A recent thing that came up was that a long time player ended up
being traded because he wanted a higher salary.
It wasn't really in the cards for them.
They're kind of strategically like doing stuff with their
salary. It was a huge bummer for the
team because he was a probably not fully a franchise player,
but very like Dong Yu type. People knew his name.
He was one of their starters. And so it was a huge bummer.
But he also, my boyfriend was telling me like back maybe a
year or two before the Colorado Avalanche won the Stanley Cup,
their actual franchise player that everybody loves took a
smaller salary. So a higher salary could be
allocated to recruiting high value teammates.
And that was very, I kept thinking about that during the
salary negotiation episodes because there was elements of
that, that there's like a purity in that like do it for the game,
do it for the team. And I really loved that.
And then I saw how little these people were being paid and I was
like, oh, no, I think sports players should get paid a lot
less than they do. I don't think that they should
be paid like $5.00 an hour. I think that's really bad.
Yes. So they came up with some sort
of algorithm to figure out their worth based on their performance
from the previous couple of seasons.
And I think the worst one was the relief pitcher who was going
to retire. He's an older pitcher and they
were going to give him like the equivalent of $42,000 for the
season. It was like crazy talk.
It was wild. He was like, you know what, They
want me out. I see the writing on the wall.
They they don't want me here. They I'm going to retire.
And it's really disheartening to see how and, and you know, Nanku
Min's character says this as well.
He's like, I didn't like how I had to play dirty to get all
this shit done and get this budget approved.
Shortchange all of these passionate players who deserve
way more just because you arbitrarily talking to Ucheng's
character. You arbitrarily wanted to drop
the budget by 30%, which is a outrageous #30%.
Insane. No, no.
So there's no way that he could have run the ball club based on
a 30% deficit in the budget. I mean, the fact that they even
tried, I was like, this show is nuts.
Like, yeah. Yeah, I think Human Ho or at
least some of the newer players were signing for like $23,000 a
year. Yeah, they were getting nothing.
Nothing. I don't know what cost of living
in dungeon is, but it cannot be. It can't.
It cannot be meeting any cost of living that I am aware of.
That's insanity. And he smiled at the end when
they upped it from like $23,000 per year to $27,000 per year.
And I was like, babe, no. Don't.
Don't let them do this. Yeah, it looked like me getting
my first salary job when I was younger and it was like not good
pay, but I would brag about it because I didn't know about
salaried and like how that. It's absolutely true.
Yeah, God, painful. But yeah, those salary
negotiations were painful. And the the conversations I
would say that happened between Old Chung SE and Nam Gumen are
really interesting and powerful because these two guys are
disrespecting each other. You can see how Old Chung say
even the way he speaks is disrespecting.
And he's not talking in the elevated speak.
He's not ending his sentences with like, you're the polite
you're. He is calling him punk.
He's saying like, yeah, like, hey, you.
He's very disrespectful even. He's talking down to him
constantly. And I had this conversation in
episode 10 that I wanted to go over before we kind of back it
up and talk about a couple more things before we get out of
here. And it's this tent bar
conversation that he has with him.
Do you remember this conversation?
I don't have it all because it's really long, but Nangu Min says
to decide what is important and what is not.
Is money the only standard of measurement for you?
And oh, Jiang says yeah, hey, why are you so rude anyway?
Why don't you ever listen, you punk?
And then he says back, If I do listen, does the way you people
treat me change all of these? Like they're constantly
challenging each other, Nungumin says.
If I listen well, you keep telling me to do things that are
unjust in order to keep your hands clean.
He's like, you're a hypocrite. He says.
Any organization that is even a little bit proper, even if
someone doesn't listen, as long as they do a good job, they
leave that person alone. He's saying you're an asshole.
You're even, you're messing with innocent people, even if they're
doing what you want them to. These are humans.
They're people, yeah. All Jiang says, says This is why
all you will ever be is a general manager at the main
headquarters. I'm managing director and
running hotels, EU punk. So again, throwing his status,
his weight around, he's like, I've managed multimillion dollar
companies and you're just, you know, managing a ball club.
It doesn't even matter. So he again, he's such a
freaking elitist, Nam Guman says.
So do you know any baseball? Which is in itself and
condescending question because he's been running the ball club
behind the scenes. He's been acting as the proxy
for his uncle, as the owner of the ball club.
So he says, yeah, I ran the ball club for years.
How can I not know baseball? You were a general manager of a
handball team until last year. How dare you?
So Nan Kunmen quotes Barry Swiser and says some people are
born on third base and go through life thinking they hit a
000. So good mic drop moment.
And then he says, well, I guess this isn't necessary, but seeing
you be so prideful, it's embarrassing for me to see.
He said. You're embarrassing thinking
that you actually earned all of this shit, that you have your
position, and that you're actually good.
So proud of him for this. He said you're embarrassing.
I loved it. I.
Loved it. Felt so.
That was like the moment that was practically a PowerPoint
presentation for me. Yes, I loved how they were
battling each and every one of the setbacks that they had that
whether it was Ultron, say, or some other thing that was going
on. Did you guys have a favorite
like episode or problem that they had to solve throughout the
show? Yeah, I was pretty obsessed with
the Robert Gill arc. Like besides the fact that the
location would switch between California, Korea and Hawaii
every 30 seconds, the arc in and of itself I thought was really,
really good in that it was twist after twist after twist.
And they were able to subvert expectations constantly while
keeping you interested and keeping that underdog theme that
the show was built on of like, we're trying to get Miles.
We want to sign him, but we keep meeting hurdle after hurdle and
it just doesn't seem like it's going to happen.
And then right when they're at the finish line, they're like,
no, can't get him. And you think that's the end of
it. And then there's this turn
around where suddenly there's a new pitcher in the game and he's
been there the whole time. He's their guy, he's their
friend Robert Gill. And not only is he a killer
pitcher, he's he can be the foreign player because of all
these weird laws, and there's still problems with that because
he's a traitor to his own country.
But like. He is a draft Dodger and he's.
Not a tribal, and that sucks, but for a good reason.
He was saving a life and it's like all of it is just.
I liked the intrigue, I liked the twists and that in part,
although Nan Kun Min Big Sung Soo says he's not a humanist,
there is that feeling throughout this arc that he is a humanist
and that he does it obviously because Robert Gill is a killer
pitcher, but also because he's a good person and he's like, I
want to work with you. I want to work with someone who
cares about baseball almost more than anything, but not more than
anything, because family is the most important.
Yeah. How big song, Sue?
I knew you would say that. You're a big softy.
Yeah, softy teddy bear. Something that he says during
the press conference also kind of Harkins back to like, yeah,
the the draft dodging. I love that he calls it out
during the press conference where it was like, I don't know,
like looks one of the journalists in the eyes.
And he's like, it's almost like if a the son of an owner of a
journalism company like didn't do their term in the army as
well, which makes. Me think that specific
journalist, yes, some draft dodging or something, has been a
draft Dodger, yeah, because he looked down embarrassed.
Yes, which I loved. And then I loved that that was,
I mean, he just stands on business and I literally love
that. Yeah, yeah.
Speaking of standing on business, let's talk about the
brother that was in a wheelchair.
Oh yes, he was a great character.
No, you go ahead. No, he was a great character.
He applies for the sabermetrics job, which is basically some
sort of analytics job on the team.
I think this whole episode is for us westerners.
It might be considered rage bait, but it it's tough to get
through because the analytics team leader who ends up being
like a really nice guy like by the end of the show, but this
guy is set in his ways. He's he's a traditionalist.
He doesn't think that a person who has never played baseball
should be on this analytics team.
He thinks that you need that experience, he says during the
interview process for the brother who has been paralyzed
and is in a wheelchair. Well, you'll know once you've
played baseball. Behind the numbers, there are
many different reasons in baseball, period.
And I was like, stop right there, stop right there.
It is such a condescending and ableist way to say how and when
to use analytics correctly. Even if the tone that he set it
in was really even like he wasn't, he didn't say it with
any sort of attitude or obvious malice.
I was like, this is so brilliant because as an audience member,
you're and I think the Korean audience as well.
They want you to sympathize with the person in the wheelchair,
right? With the brother.
They want you to think like Puck and Bin's character is thinking.
They want you to think like her, which you shouldn't say that
that's wrong, That's offensive. But the Korean populist probably
thinks the way that he does. Right, man, I didn't.
Yeah, because like you said, it is very like rage baity
specifically for Westerners that are like you can't.
That's illegal. Yeah, this is.
Very illegal. This is very, like you said,
ableist. This is so frustrating that he
is able to speak this way in an interview and not immediately go
to jail. Or get a suit later on, get a
letter in the mail. Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah, it keeps going. That interview is kind of
painful. And that guy is so provocative,
like offensive and unprofessional and provocative
because he doesn't feel period, that this position that they're
hiring for that they should even hire for a position in in
sabermetrics or whatever the term is.
And so he's taking it out on this guy who's in a wheelchair
and he's assuming he's never played baseball.
Yes, an extra layer of frustration, right?
They're making these just really wild, rampant assumptions that
he has never touched a baseball bat, that he have no clue how he
ended up in a wheelchair. Right, right.
But also they're like, yeah, it's so condescending.
It's so frustrating. Yeah, yeah.
But you get some flashbacks during this time where you see
beforehand what what transpired beforehand.
He was playing baseball, he was in high school.
He had this conversation with Nam Kung Min's character, his
Hyeong. And Nam Kung Min is rude as
fuck. In the flashback, he says you
cannot be as good as at your studies as you are at playing
baseball. You don't have the brains for
it. Yeah, so he got it from both.
You're not smart enough to do this, but also flip side, you
haven't played baseball enough to do this.
And it's like, what do you mean? Yeah.
Can he win ever? Yeah.
It. I mean, it's frustrating enough
for that character, the brother character whom I loved.
But I do feel like I was distracted because this was the
start of Nam Ku Min's back story, which was, to me, a
heinous mess, a crime against the whole show.
But yeah, in his brother's part, it's, I think, kind of written
off where his brother's just like, I am smart enough and I
have played baseball, so problem solved.
Win, win. And then he gets the job and he
does great and he even changes his boss to be a normal person
who no longer harasses his employees to the point of
quitting. It's a win, win, win, honestly
for that guy. Yeah, I mean, in that interview,
he even says that he likes Jackie Robinson, the first black
player in the MLB. He likes that story.
He likes that history and admires that perseverance
despite the abuse and discrimination.
And his quote is, it sounds ridiculous.
Now, if I were to become a disabled analyst, I will
probably be the first. It will be good to release news
articles about this touching story.
So he's even, like, pitching to them.
Hey, this is a feel good story. It's good PR.
Yeah, it's good PR and I'd be good at my job.
You don't lose. Anything right?
Right. Yeah, But it's Puckenben who
says the thesis that the writer is putting forward, which is
dreams. The ball club won't discriminate
based on the fact that you're different.
Hell yeah, our girl, the lens with which we are watching this
show. You're a decent.
Person. That's the message.
Yeah, just be nice. So let's talk quickly about Nan
Ku Min's back story. Because I think that we didn't
like that they didn't expound upon it and it seems like he had
no I'll effects after a while. It was that he lost a child.
He lost. Everything.
He lost everything this same Saturday.
He. Was like.
Hey little bro, Well, good luck at your baseball game because
you've got nothing else going for you in life.
So play hard. And his brother's like, I'll
play so hard I almost die. Does that freak dad almost dies
in another freak accident? The what was it the dad
collapsed or something? Yeah.
When his brother had the freak
accident during the baseball game and then his wife also had
a miscarriage or wife or girlfriend.
I don't know. We.
It's unclear all like in the same at the same time then he.
Loses his job. Yeah.
Oh my God. It's so a lot happening for him
and I, I don't know. I don't know.
Yeah, it seems like giving a character a tragic back story is
supposed to serve the purpose of allowing audience members to
feel seen within that character. But I think if you give them
five different tragic backstories, then people don't
feel seen in that. They're like, oh, I went through
this tragic thing as well, and wow, he went through it.
Oh, but he went through that and that and that and OK, we're
playing the Paine Olympics now, and I have lost.
He's winning. He's the most tragic person I've
ever seen. And you lose that connection
with the audience. So then what's the point?
What's the point of making him the saddest man to exist?
I don't get it. Yeah, like, I just didn't see
the point of it. It was like hit after hit after
hit all in the span of like one or two episodes.
They finish it out and then they just keep on going with the rest
of the hot stove league and all the machinations and they're
just like, yeah, that sucked, right?
Yeah. That was it.
Like that was it. I think we even got like the
final goodbye from his girlfriend before we knew that
she had like miscarried and that's why their relationship
was so complicated and heavy. And so it was like, we didn't
even get to process her being like, we shouldn't keep doing
this on the same day anymore in a way that made sense or like in
a linear way where we were like, this is closure.
This moment is closure. Because at that moment it's, it
feels so like what, you don't know what happening with these
two people. Yeah, We just don't know what it
means. We don't know who she is.
Is she a wife? Is she an ex?
Like, what is she a sister? Like, I don't know because we
just don't know her relationship to him.
And he's so closed off. So many more questions and
answers. And then we finally do get the
answers. We're like, I thought this was
multiple choices seen, like fill in the blank, like, you know
what I'm saying? It was like too much.
Too much, too, yeah. Yeah.
And then at the very end, they just like his character.
Yeah. How do we reconcile where he
started and then how it all ends for him?
It's all very ambiguous. It is very ambiguous.
They kick him out again. Well, first of all, the last
episode, they do find a buyer for the team and it's Ejayan.
Yeah, what? I screamed.
I like screamed that cameo. Yeah, I don't recognize anybody
and I recognized that guy. Yeah, yeah, Tech bro cameo, the
tech amazing. So good.
Yeah. And he said, hey, I'm going to
buy the team. Everybody on my team is saying I
shouldn't. It's probably not a good idea,
but I'm fine anyway. But you can't come.
Sorry, why? I And then the reasoning was so
shaky, like that was so wobbly. It was so shaky.
You're too good at your job. He said your history, he said
something about your history and I don't know what he meant.
The only thing I could think of is the whistleblower thing.
What? And what's crazy to me, though,
is that whenever someone is talking about like, oh, you'll
never get hired again because you're a whistleblower, to me,
I'm like, Oh, no, that's very indicative of are you?
Committing crimes. You won't hire a whistleblower
because you're committing crimes like anyone who won't hire a
whistle you. Have to hide.
Yeah, like they should be investigated.
I I agree. This is crazy.
You just admitted to a crime. Not on my watch.
So I was confused about why he kicked him out.
But it kind of goes, I guess, with his flighty nature, that he
just comes in, fixes something, he puts something on the right
path. He put them on the path to being
champions, even though at the end they weren't.
They were just kind of like doing better.
And I didn't like that either. I was like, where's the trophy?
Where's the trophy? You have to tell us he did a
good job that you don't have to tell us where he got employed.
He doesn't even have to work on the team anymore, but at least
tell us they won the championship.
Like please. It would have been such a great
moment if they did like a crossover.
There's so many sports dramas in K drama land.
If they showed, I don't know, weightlifting fairy Kimbok drew,
all of a sudden I'd be like, Oh my God, it's a crossover
movement. No, they didn't even try and
create a sort of a shared universe.
No, he just like, goes through a weird mysterious door and
disappears into the sports fear and I I guess he's on to the
next shot. Like, on to the next one.
OK. Yeah, it again feels like why
give him the most tragic back story I've ever seen in any
drama, only for his ending to be like, he found a family, he got
his place, he's got a workplace with people who absolutely adore
him, and he was forced out again.
Goodbye. Like.
The end just. Give me a happy ending.
Yeah, yeah. I agree.
And his speech about it being the first thing he was able to
protect and that will give him a lot of strength was beautiful
and emotional, but it still was kind it.
I'm still in the. Why did you have to do it like
this? I was still on where are the
prizes, where, where, what sport are you on next?
And I was waiting for him to just come back because it had
been at least a season, right? They were they at the end of the
season? I I couldn't tell if it had been
several years at that point. So because Pac-Man had a whole
different style, like she had a style evolution at the Yeah.
She took great. Yeah.
I was like, is that years? Is that three months?
What? What is that?
They had to have promoted her to general management.
I I was trying to do everything that you did correctly with
figuring out the location situation in America.
I was the same way. But about that moment where I
was like, OK, her hair is longer, but it's also
straightened. So we can't say that it's
definitively been that long. They're still wearing coats.
Everyone's wearing coats and jackets.
No one's in their summertime clothes.
Is this just because it's their business attire, or are we still
in? Is it the fall?
Yeah. Or.
Or is it the fall? Yeah.
I don't know idea. Who's to say?
Not me, I don't. Know not me, I'm not about to
tell you exactly when the show ends, but there is a time jump.
I just don't know how much time has passed.
That is a little bit frustrating.
I I just, I don't think it's enough to again, take points
away from the show. But it wasn't exactly a home
run, no pun intended. At the end of the show.
It was more like we got bases loaded kind of thing, like just
general excitement. So can't wait for season 2.
I'm just kidding. It's only been five years.
Like where's the Season 2? Never do season twos.
Oh God. Oh, I have a couple of stray
notes here. These are always fun.
So in episode 1, there's a fight in the dugout.
They're down by 9 points and there's a fight in the dugout.
The Korean children in the stands are crying.
And I'll tell you one thing, this makes Korean children look
real soft because American kids would be living if there was a
fight in the dugout. OK.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
If I went to a baseball game and there was a fight in the dugout,
oh, my God, let me tell you, That would be a story I would
tell to my grandkids. OK?
I'd be like, I went to a game, and then these players started
fighting, and there was, and the coaches got in on it.
It was crazy. So no, I was not following the
despair that was running through the crowd.
When the dream started infighting, I was like, fuck
yes. Like, bring it on.
Yeah. I the the kids seemed pretty
soft. I also like if they had just
kept it at the adults were like embarrassed because they didn't
want their kids hyping up the violence.
That would have been fine. And if they had kept it at y'all
should be embarrassed to be doing this when you're 9 points
down right and starting a fistfight with each other.
What's happening here? Like that's hilarious like and
understandable if they were like that's where the disappointment
was coming from. But I totally agree those kids
look like such. I was like what is this?
This is a great so entertaining worth the price of a hot dog so.
You really watch hockey? Exactly, exactly.
They couldn't handle hockey. So any last words before we get
out of here? None from me.
No, I've had a good time. Thank you for having us on.
Yes. Thank you SO.
So nice. Yeah, I'm so glad you guys were
able to come. We could talk about hot Stove
league, a Little baseball offseason show.
Opening season was literally like a few days ago, you know?
Whoa, no. I didn't and I should have.
I got invited to go to like a local baseball game recently and
I didn't realize it was because the season just.
Opened when I saw my because my friends are a couple of friends
of mine are Red Sox fans and you know, Red Sox fans are crazy.
So they were posting all kind of things for Opening Day, and I
was like, Oh my God, I just finished watching Hot Stove
League and it's opening day. And yeah, so I was feeling all
kinds of things, but so timely. So timely that we did this show.
Yeah. We did it in the stove league in
the. Stove at the end of the stove
league. Yes, exactly.
So again, thank you guys for coming on the show.
Where can people find you online?
We're at a couple of places. We've got our e-mail that we ask
people to reach out to us if they, I don't know, just want to
say hi or talk about more about the drama that we just reviewed.
That's play on k.podcast@gmail.com.
Yeah, and we've got a website that has all of our episodes.
You can find all of our links to everywhere that's play on k.com.
And then just our Patreon, which is linked on our website, but
don't forget about that guys. Yes, please, please support play
on K podcast, Emily and Raquel. They are wonderful and that's
our show. I'm Jessica and this has been
the Tiba Kay Rambles podcast.