And I think that's the frustrating part too, is just my
mom knowing all of this stuff, right?
My mom approached me at my birth certificate, father's funeral
and said the most bizarre thing to me, you know, and said she's
first of all, never told me she loved me my whole life.
And she chooses this to be the time and walks up to me.
I mean, we're standing there. It's like open casket still,
everything's happening. And she's like, who?
You know, Kimmy, I I know we don't get along very well, but I
love you and you shouldn't have to be dealing with this.
And I was like, well, that's an odd thing to say you.
Know like. And so I think for me, a lot of
that just lies within the lies that my mom kept and watching me
struggle with my abandonment issues with my birth certificate
father. Like I look at my own daughter
and I would never want her to to struggle in life in any way,
shape or form, you know, and my mom watched that my entire life.
You basically like we, we all know what abandonment issues
lead to right leads to dating the wrong men.
You're chasing people you shouldn't be chasing, But it
kind of just creates these crazy patterns.
And and I just wish she had like, watching me go through all
of this, like took a step back and and think about herself in
the moment, protecting herself, but protecting me as her child.
Welcome to DNA Surprises, a podcast that delves into the
world of unexpected DNA discoveries.
I'm your host, Alexis ourselves. In July 2021, my life took a
surprising turn when I found out that I'm an NPE, a person who
has experienced a non paternal event.
In other words, my biological father isn't who I thought he
was. Join me as we explore the
stories of NP, ES, adoptees and donor conceived people and their
families. Get ready to unravel the
astonishing journeys that begin with a simple DNA test.
This is DNA surprises. After three years of making this
podcast and speaking to people who've experienced life altering
DNA surprises, I've noticed several trends. 1 trend is that
oftentimes the biological father is someone a guest knew from
childhood. Another trend is a tumultuous
relationship with the mother. In this week's episode, Kim
shares her emotional journey after discovering a family
secret through genealogical research.
She discusses the shock and clarity that came with this
revelation, her strained relationship with her mother who
kept the secret, and the dynamics with her siblings and
other family members who knew the truth but were sworn to
secrecy. Kim also speaks candidly about
her efforts to build a relationship with her biological
father, who she knew, and how the presence of this secret
created issues throughout her life.
Kim first told her story a few years ago on NPE Stories, hosted
by Lily Wood. Her episode is LinkedIn the Show
notes. Thank you Kim for sharing your
story. I Kim My age is 45 and I'm from
Livingston, Mt. I discovered my DNA story about
four years ago now, I would say probably May of 2020, so just
after lockdown. And the reason I discovered it
is just my love for genealogy and history.
And so I did a Ancestry DNA test like 2 years before that, but I
didn't really do anything with it.
I didn't log into Ancestry or do anything with it really.
And so when lockdown happened, I decided that I would take it a
step further and do some family research.
My grandmother on my birth certificate, father's side was
adopted and I wanted to try to find the rest of her family.
And that's kind of how I ended up down this rabbit hole of my
DNA not matching with anyone else with the same last name as
me. And I found that to be
surprising. Along the way, what was
interesting to me, I told my mom that I was doing this because I,
you know, wanted to find my grandmother's family.
And she did tell me then that she didn't think it was a good
idea and kind of became standoffish with me.
And so I should have known at that time that there is
something more to my DNA story, but I didn't think anything of
it. And then over time, I was
getting messages from people. I was connecting with these
people, I didn't know their last names, they weren't familiar to
me asking how we might be related or where that connection
is. And we went over both of our
families genealogy and just could not figure it out.
And I did bring that up to my mom again and and she told me,
you know, I wouldn't want to find out any secrets.
I said, I think I'm going to uncover a big secret here.
Like I think your dad had an affair and I was all into it.
I was like putting my investigator hat on and ready to
dive in. And over time, I did start
connecting with a last name that was familiar to me from my
hometown that was interesting to me.
And I reached out to a person I know with that last name on
Facebook, his name Steven. And I sent a message and I said,
hey, I, I'm noticing. I did a ancestry DNA test and
I'm noticing that I'm matching with people who have the same
last name as you. And I said, do you think we're
distant cousins or, or do you know how we might be related?
And at that point it was about 10 minutes later in my, I got, I
received a text from my mom who said she needed to talk to me.
So he didn't write me back. And so I ended up going for a
walk. It was during lockdown so I just
needed to get outside anyway. So I called my mom and she was,
she started crying immediately and just said you're you're
going to hate me. Steven called me after you
reached out to him and asked me if you weren't aware that he was
your real father. Oh wow.
Yeah, and I was just completely blown away.
I I think my initial reaction actually, I started laughing
because I didn't know. I mean, I mean, I, I think I
started laughing for a few reasons, like I didn't really
expect the news, but at the same time it, it checked a lot of
boxes for me and it made everything make sense.
It sounds like this blindsided you.
You were like, I'm going to find out stuff about my mom.
I'm going to, you know, uncover other stuff, and then you find
this out. It sounds like hindsight is 2020
and things came into focus. What came into focus for you?
I think what really brought it, what, what came into focus for
me was the fact that I, I'm the youngest of six kids and we all
supposedly had the same father and he didn't want anything to
do with me growing up. This was somebody that I
struggled with. I had abandonment issues over
this person. I went to therapy with those
abandonment issues, just not understanding why my dad just
really didn't take an interest in me after my parents got
divorced. And I think that was something
that immediately I was like, OK, yeah, that made that makes sense
to me, you know, and, and over time, you know, as I as I
learned more, I found out that he knew he didn't know that I
wasn't his biological daughter. And so he he did put a lot of
distance there with me. And unfortunately, you know, as
children, that impacts us greatly.
And we take it on into our adulthood, right?
I had some clarity around that, and I was able to forgive him
entirely. He'd already passed away by this
point, but there was a sense of relief on that end, I guess you
could say. Yeah.
Was your mom apologetic or what was the conversation with her
like? No, she was not.
I mean, she still has yet to apologize.
The conversation with her was really around her, how she was
in an unhappy relationship and and basically placing blame on
my birth certificate father. I think she hit it all these
years and wanted it to remain that way because of the shame,
right, that she was feeling. And ultimately I learned that my
biological dad was someone she was in love with and he didn't
love her back. They had a brief affair and then
she divorced, got divorced from my birth certificate father when
I was 11 months old. I think there was probably some
conversation. According to my bio dad, there
was some conversation after the facts about moving their
relationship forward and he just was not.
He didn't have the same feelings for her.
He did offer to help take care of me but she said no.
I think at that point in time, she just decided she was going
to keep it a secret forever and ever and take it to the grave
with her, you know, But at the same time, she didn't realize
there were many people who knew. So over time, you know, with
having six siblings, I found out that my oldest three siblings
all new, that's news as well. How did you find that out?
I found it out by bringing my news to them.
Like my discovery, those three oldest siblings just came
straightforward with me and said they always knew.
They definitely wanted to protect me and the best way they
could. I don't think they knew how they
were all in high school and younger when this occurred.
And one of my brothers ultimately moved out and moved
in with their their dad because they were upset with our mom
about it. And you know, I think that's
something my mom doesn't realize is how much the secret impacted
everyone and, and not just her, right.
And so overtime they just, they opened up about it to me.
My sister told me she found a letter that my mom had written,
my bio dad laying it all out there and she confronted, I
think she, my sister was 16 at the time and she confronted my
mom and my mom swore her to secrecy.
And that's something you know, I brought up to my mom and my mom
doesn't remember that or so she says, right?
I'm sure you've heard this interviewing.
The number of people you have is the mothers in the situation.
A lot of them can be narcissistic or you uncover the
true narcissism that exists there.
And that's something that I've learned about my mom.
I always knew it to some extent, but once the secret was
uncovered, it was just, it became more exhausting to have
conversations with her about it because she made it all about
her and she's the victim in this.
I don't think I'm ever going to get an apology and I don't know
that I need one. What do you do to get to that
place of closure? I started reading I I found this
great book that was called I think it's Adult Children of
Emotionally Immature Parents. It's a good book.
And I don't know if you've heard of that.
Yeah. And it it just really helped me
understand my mom being this complex character that she is.
My relationship is not great with my mom.
I'm just in a better place mentally where I'm I'm not
questioning everyday. Like when I first discovered it
was constantly on my brain. I feel like, and wanting to get
to the bottom of it with her. Like I was really like, we're
going to talk about this, you know, and she just, she wasn't
going to and she wasn't going to take ownership of her actions.
When you're learning about narcissistic parents overtime,
like you realize like you're just not going to get that
apology that you're hoping for. So.
Yeah. I just been able to cope with it
that way. And it's also just knowing that
I'm not going to has helped me create better boundaries with
her because I know what kind of person I am and I know what kind
of person she is. People always say this, right?
Like your mom's still your mom, you know, or like, wow, I can't
imagine what she went through back then.
You know, I get that a lot from people, which is interesting.
In those days, you know, divorce wasn't a thing or you know, it.
It's just honestly helped me create boundaries with her that
I needed to probably create long before I had this discovery.
Even growing up, she was not nice to me.
And like we talked about in the beginning here, finding this out
just, you know, checking some boxes for me, that was one of
them. My mom would say incredibly mean
things to me, like how I wasn't wanted or, you know, just very
weird jealousy things with me my entire life and never happy for
me, right? Like it's almost like she didn't
want to see me succeed in life. So once you find out something
like this, and if you're going through struggles with your mom
like that, you know, finding out a discovery like this can be
pretty eye opening to why they treated you so, so poorly
growing up. What does your relationship look
like with your mom? Now you've talked about
boundaries. Do you keep her like arm's
length? Do you talk to her often?
What does your relationship look like?
Yeah, it's it's then a bit difficult just because my
stepdad had a stroke last year and, and ultimately, you know, I
ended up being someone who is taking care of him and getting
him set up in Hospice and that sort of thing.
So, you know, I had to talk to my mom quite a bit obviously
during all of that. And it wasn't easy because she
just is not an easy person. That means she's not an even
feel like she's she's either at a zero or she's at a 85 and
especially under something so stressful like that.
And so I think for me, it's just she wants a reaction.
A lot of the time from any of her texts, she feels like I
haven't reached out and well, you know, I'll get a mean text.
Well, I just don't text back, right.
I don't play into whatever tactic it is that she's trying
to use to get my attention and she'll do that.
I mean, she posts passive aggressive things on Facebook.
And so I, for me, it's just not responding.
And I'll give I, I just won't call her for weeks at a time and
she's behaving that way and, and she kind of will come around and
be like, you're right, I haven't been in the best mindset.
But at the same time, she's elderly and I feel like as the
youngest, I'm, I'm stepping up a lot just to, to make sure she's
taken care of. So, you know, though I have
those boundaries, it is difficult, yeah, to manage at
times. But, you know, I think just
protecting your peace means so much in these situations.
Because she hasn't apologized. Like, I don't feel like I owe
her anything. The things that I'm doing for
her are just because of the person I am, and I want to be
doing them right. Thank you for for talking about
that because it's really important.
And also just something I feel like we're just recommending
this book to everyone to read, but you know, they talk about
how, you know, emotionally if people have something traumatic
in their life, right happen, that's typically like around the
time that they stop maturing emotionally wise, right?
And so my mom, when I'm dealing with her it, it truly is like
she's a 17 year old petty high school girl.
It's not a easy conversation when you want to have some depth
to it. Because she feels attacked and
she's just not capable emotionally or her maturity
level is just not there still at 80 years old, right?
And that's the hardest part is because I really like at first,
I really just wanted to like, sit down and hash this out and
like talk about everything. Like I wanted to know
everything. And she just wasn't capable of
doing that and still still isn't.
I mean, if I were to talk about it with her today, I mean, she's
going to say the same thing and she's going to blame my birth
certificate father for cheating on her all those years, even
though, you know, she obviously cheated as well.
But she was not the bad guy in the situation.
It was him. And that's honestly all I get.
So it's not an apology. It's just so and so pushed me to
this. But like keeping it a secret,
you know, like I, I truly don't think she understands that
impact because it's also I'm from a smaller town.
It gets even better, right, Because my bio dad ended up
marrying one of her best friends later in life who when my mom
retired, she went and worked at her jewelry store alongside with
her and her brother was my godfather.
And I found out like all those people knew, right?
But like the fact that my mom like there's to me and now that
I'm when I look back on it, I find it so odd that she was so
close to my bio dad's wife and like helped her through.
I mean she had pancreatic cancer and ended up passing away.
I was like there for her the whole time and around my bio dad
all the time. And I just think how bizarre
that like, that was happening, but like, you knew the like,
this person was my biological dad.
Yeah. And I remember him being around
my whole life. What has happened there with the
with the new found family? It's been a few years now.
We met up in person once and it was, you know, that was great.
Feel like I'm kind of the one like probably trying to to build
a relationship or keep a relationship moving.
He does like reach out to me on holidays, messages me.
He wants me to call him dad. When we first met up in person,
you know, he did tell me. It's like, well, I want you to
know that I love you, you know, and I think this is what I tell
people about that. It's like, it's almost like when
you're on a first date and you're just getting love bombed
by someone. Yeah, yeah.
You're like, whoa, like slow down, right?
Like it's like, you know, but. And he had known your whole life
is. He had known my whole life.
And so for him, maybe it's like this like pent up excitement.
I but I'm curious, you know, what did he really have to say
about the fact that he did know for so long?
I know obviously it didn't work out with your mom.
He wasn't interested in a relationship there.
But what did he have to say about his absence as a father in
your life? Ever since he got back from
Vietnam, he told me he was not in a good place at that time
when when this affair happened with my mom because he worked
with my birth certificate father and they were friends.
And he just keeps saying, you know, I was not a good person
back then. He said that I did, I did offer
to be there for you and to financially, you know, take care
of you and your mom just said no, my birth certificate father
was just going to take me on his his own, which probably because
she didn't tell him, but you know, I think he probably would
have had my mom not wanted to keep it a secret.
But the whole reason behind that was she just didn't want to be
outed. I don't think she realized
though, my birth certificate father did know.
I mean, he had a vasectomy after my, my last brother, who's like
2 year, a year and a half older than me.
And you know, my mom said, oh, the doctor said it can happen.
And I was with my birth certificate father when he was
passing away in Hospice. And you know, at this time
didn't know any of this, but he did try telling me something
when he was at that time was inveritable and could barely
talk. But he pulled me to him and was
trying to say something. And and the siblings that knew,
you know, later now in life have told me.
That they knew he was trying to tell me the truth.
And so I don't know, I, I, I wish my mom would have let my
bio dad step in and try to be a part of my life because I think
it just would have saved a lot of heartache in the future for,
for not only myself, but, you know, my birth certificate
father and, and my siblings and, and I, you know, again, don't
think she realized the impact that I had on, on so many.
But you know, when I first met up with my bio dad, he did ask
me. He was like, what do you want
from me? I don't have any money.
Oh, interesting. Yeah.
And I was like, no, that's not Yeah, that's not at all.
Why? And again, you know, once you
read that book, I can look at him too and see he definitely
went through his traumatic experience, whether it was
Vietnam. And so he has like the same
maturity level as my mom, which is really interesting.
Where are things at a few years in?
Because I think a lot of people, they have that initial burst of
excitement you kind of talked about like maybe some love
bombing kind of thing going on where it's just super, I want to
get to know you and let's make up for all the lost time and,
and all of that. And then now you're a few years
out. What does it look like today?
Today it just looks like just a lot of Facebook messages and,
you know, just banter on Facebook.
I've reached out to aunts and uncles, so his siblings who I'm
connecting with, and I'm actually planning to travel to
Arizona to see one of his brothers this next year.
He's been great. He's been so open about it and
I'm going to go meet them. So we just had that
conversation. So there's no plans set in
place, but we're really hoping to get together.
But you know, you still you more in like missing out on not
knowing who your true family is, you know, biological family.
And I do think that's something that I've dealt with.
I don't know if you had a similar situation or if you're
connected with all of your, your bio family now, but I think you
just wonder like, who am I? You know, who do I look like?
And that's something I still do, right?
Like I constantly want to dive through Facebook photos of his
siblings and just see if I can see any old pictures of like, my
grandma I never got to meet, you know?
So it's pretty. It's really interesting.
And I never, I don't look like any of my siblings.
And so it makes sense. Yeah, That makes sense.
No, too. So.
Speaking of your siblings, I mean they carry that burden.
They carry the weight of the secret for a very long time and
and you've talked about how it it affected them having to keep
that secret to the point where some of them didn't even want to
really be around your mom for a period of time.
What is your relationship like with them now and what is the
family dynamic like with your mom and them and everyone?
With my siblings, for the most part, we all get along really
well. Definitely.
I think it brought us closer in ways.
One particular sibling who when I told him I was doing the
ancestry test, like, he did say a few things that made me think,
like, he would always just tell me.
He's like, I just want you to know, like, you belong here.
Like you belong here. And he would always say that to
me. And I was like, well, thank you,
You know, like, thank you. I am glad I'm here.
You know, he knew I was going to find out someday.
Do I wish he told me directly? Probably, but at the same time I
learned how much it impacted him because he hated my mom for what
she did and cheating on his dad, right.
He was very, very close to my birth certificate father and I
think it he definitely had some mom issues and still does to
some extent with that and my siblings too.
I mean, my sister, you know, I think for her to be sworn to
secrecy at 16, you know, she got married very early.
She was married and moved out of the house by 18 because she said
it was just too toxic to be there with my mom.
But it sounded like my mom after that became quite a partier and
wood forest my sister to babysit my brother and I.
And so, you know, for her to have that knowledge and then see
my mom just kind of like partying all the time and not
really taking an interest and, and me or my next closest
sibling was really frustrating for her.
And then when I end ultimately ended up having my own daughter.
And my sister told me at that time, she she thought about
talking to my mom and telling her that she needed to tell me
the truth. My daughter has my last name now
because I raised her as a single mom.
And that last name that we carry is my birth certificate
father's. And so I think my sister was
like hoping my mom would be truthful at that time and she
she didn't say anything. How do you feel about that
carrying that name and and have you felt any like desire to
correct your birth certificate or your name or anything like
that? Yeah, I have.
I mean, my daughter and I both joke about it like coming up
with their own new last name and and it is something I think
about, you know, I don't know that I want to change it to my
bio dads either. I don't know how I feel about
that. But it does feel weird to carry
a name of someone who isn't. Wasn't your father.
And then I found out most of his family knew too, right?
Yeah. Can can you talk about that
feeling? You know, I've talked to a few
people on the podcast now who have had to reckon with the idea
that basically everyone in their lives knew except them.
What did that feel like and how did that affect you?
I don't live in Livingston anymore, but you know, I live
like 25 miles away and I, I don't like going back to my
hometown. There's something about it with
all, you know, all of the people finding out that, that knew
it's, it's hard to discover that you're a secret that you didn't
even know about, right? Like you kind of just go through
your past and in your mind. It's just so interesting.
It's almost like an out of body experience, right?
Yeah. You're kind of just like, step
away from it all. And you're just like, so weird
that I was like the secret that most everyone knew about.
And I was like, you. You almost feel like the butt of
a joke. Yeah.
And if also, you know, now that you know, now that people know
or I know they know on both sides.
I get approached like at my stepfather's funeral a few
months ago, some of the people on my birth certificate,
father's side, you know, cousins pulled me aside and.
And they're like, we understand, you know, now.
And I just want you to know, like you'll always be your
cousin. You're always part of our
family. And that to me almost is like, I
I would rather them not approach me.
Yeah. And say that.
Do you know what I mean? Because it's just like a.
Reminder that they knew and you didn't or something.
It is, it is. And, and also like it's not that
easy to just, I think when I first started telling people my
story, they were like, oh, well, it's not a big deal.
Like you'll always be, I'm not going to say my last name
because, you know, for privacy purposes, you know, I think
people say that a lot to, to those who are in the situation
is, oh, well, you're always going to be their sister, you're
always going to be their cousin, you're always going to be their
daughter or whatever the case may be.
And it's easier said than done when you discover this.
I'm sure over time it gets better and it has for me.
I just don't, I don't think people understand that it is all
different now, right? Like you go back and question
your entire life and your entire personality and who you are as a
person. And it's just it's it's not as
easy, I don't know, to just move forward and act like nothing
happened. But you're and you're still
going to be family with everyone who you thought was your family,
right? There's more to it.
Yeah. How would you compare the first
time you went on a podcast with with Lily and you shared your
story and it was much more fresh at that time.
Now you've had some space, What would you say is is different or
how are you doing compared to that time?
I've just kind of now come to terms with the fact that, you
know, my mom's not going to ever apologize to me.
So I would say in that way, like things have gotten better, but
I, I feel like I went from 1 abandonment issue to another,
right? Because I feel like I'm the one
trying to create a relationship with my bio dad.
And though he is like engaging and what not, I mean he's he's
older too, so and he's not very healthy.
And so I think that's part of not being able to get together.
But I know he goes and he plays bingo.
My, my daughter plays bingo every Wednesday in her hometown.
And he does too. And they sit literally like
back-to-back and she's super shy anyways, but like he is too.
And he's never approached her. Where to me, it's like that
could be a easy way to build a relationship.
I mean, seeing each other as often as they do.
And so, you know, I think I was hoping for for more out of a
relationship there. And, and that's OK.
I mean, it's probably not going to happen.
I'd like to see old pictures of family members.
Like I said, I love history and genealogy.
So a lot of what I've been doing is just like finding out stuff
on my own on that side of the family, you know, utilizing
ancestry and then his his siblings, right?
I think probably back when I was on Lily's podcast, I thought I
would be further along in a relationship with him at this
point. Do you feel like you've made
peace with the lack of connection there, or is it
something that you're still hoping for?
I think I've made peace with it. And I think a lot of that comes
from, you know, my stepdad was basic, was my dad.
He married my mom when I was 2. I don't even know if he knows
this DNA story. I have a feeling he doesn't or
never did because like I said, my mom didn't want anyone to
know. But again, I don't think he
would have told me, but he was he was so special to me and you
know, is with him at the end. And you know, we just we had
some special time together. But I think just realizing who's
important in your life versus trying to chase that false hope,
I guess having that false hope that you're going to reconnect
with your bio dad and just realizing like my stepdad was my
dad. I think that's helped me
immensely and having that special bond with him.
Yeah. It it definitely has brought me
some peace. So many of our stories have
these unanswered questions, questions we will never be able
to ask or maybe trust the answers for.
Do you have any of those as it relates to your story?
I'm sure I do. I do question why my bio dad
knowing me as long as he did my entire life, seeing me grow up
in front of him, why he didn't make a bigger effort.
And you know, his his wife, who I knew very well, he told me
that she knew and that was it was a point of contention in
their marriage. And, you know, I just, I do kind
of wish that like somebody just spoke up and I grieve not
needing, you know, a grandma who sounds amazing, you know, and I
think there's grief there in that because she was alive up
until I was, I think she passed away when I was in my late 20s.
And for my daughter, you know, and I think one of the other
biggest things, right, is our genetic health.
My, my birth certificate father passed away from cancer.
And there's a lot of cancer on his side of the family.
And my sister's currently battling cancer, sadly right
now. And every time I went to the
doctor, like it was on my chart all over just my cancer history,
but that wasn't my history. So when I found out my bio dad's
history, there's no cancer on his side, you know.
And so, you know, I think just for those purposes too, for for
people to know their genetic health.
And now I understand like some of my own health issues right
around like really arthritis and things like that, like
definitely coming from my bio dad.
And I think that's the frustrating part too, is just my
mom knowing all of this stuff, right?
My mom approached me at my birth certificate, father's funeral
and said the most bizarre thing to me, you know, and said she's
first of all, never told me she loved me my whole life.
And she chooses this to be the time and walks up to me.
I mean, we're standing there. It's like open casket still,
everything's happening. And she's like, who?
You know, Kimmy, I, I know we don't get along very well, but I
love you and you shouldn't have to be dealing with this.
And I was like, well, that's an odd thing to say, you know,
like, and so I think for me, a lot of that just lies within the
lies that my mom kept and watching me struggle with my
abandonment issues with my birth certificate father.
Like I look at my own daughter and I would never want her to,
to struggle in life in any way, shape or form, you know, and my
mom watched that my entire life. Me basically, like we we all
know what abandonment issues lead to right leads to dating
the wrong men. You're chasing people you
shouldn't be chasing, but it kind of just creates these crazy
patterns. And and I just wish she had
like, watching me go through all of this, like took a step back
and then think about herself in the moment, protecting herself,
but protecting me as her child, you know?
Yeah, What advice do you have for a parent who may be keeping
adna surprise from their child? As hard as it is probably for
them to to tell the truth, it's the best thing they can do for
their their children and their loved ones.
I know it's hard to feel that shame or, or let that shame out.
And also like I have a feeling that telling the truth is going
to set them free. So that's my that's my advice
there. And what advice do you have for
someone who just uncovered Adna surprise?
Yeah, it's OK to to feel the feelings and and you're probably
going to feel like you're in an out of body experience a little
bit like you're not yourself, you don't know who you are.
There's like an identity shift and I experienced that on many
levels. It's just a reminder like to,
to, it's OK to feel the feelings that you're feeling because it
is complicated and it's, it's scary and it's hurtful and, and
it's all those things. But again, just leaning in on,
you know, the MPE network that exists and connecting with
people and just having conversations around it.
Incredibly helpful for moving forward.
Kim, thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today.
I really appreciate you sharing your story.
And I will be sure to link your NPE Stories episode in the show
notes for people to listen to. But it's so good to kind of
check in with people and hear how they're doing after a few
years. So I hope that things continue
moving in a positive direction and that you keep those
boundaries going. And I just wish you the best.
Thank you so much, Alexis. It was great to meet with you
today. And you know, thanks for doing
this again, holding space for others to tell their story.
Thanks again to Kim for sharing her story.
If you have Adna Surprise that you'd like to share, please
submit your story at dnasurprises.com.
Until next time, this episode of DNA Surprises was hosted,
produced and edited by me, Alexis Ourselt.
It was mixed and mastered by Josh Ourselt of Siren Recording
Studios.