You have to be so open because you don't know what's going to
happen. You don't know who's going to
show up on your on your DNA matches.
And it's I feel like everyone wants to know where they come
from. I have so many friends who were
adopted and want to know where they come from, who their family
is. And if you get the chance to
find out, you got to you got to grab it because you might not
have that chance again. So if I can be, if I can be that
person for anybody that shows up on my my DNA matches, even
though my siblings don't agree, I'm going to be that person
because I know people want to know where they came from.
Welcome to DNA Surprises, a podcast that explores the life
altering world of unexpected DNA discoveries.
I'm your host Alexis Oursalt. This show centers the stories of
people who've experienced NP, ES or non paternal events.
In other words, people who've learned that their biological
father isn't who they thought he was.
We'll also hear from adoptees donor conceived people and the
families navigating these discoveries.
Get ready to follow the incredible journeys that begin
with a simple DNA test. This is DNA surprises.
For some people, one of the trickiest things about DNA
surprises is that they force us to see our parents as human.
It can be uncomfortable to come to terms with infidelity in a
marriage or that your parent would lie to you.
In this week's episode, Anne reveals how she uncovered 4 DNA
surprises in her family. As the found family member in
each surprise, Anne shares what she felt it was important to be
open to the new people in her life.
Thank you for sharing your story, Anne.
Name is Anne. I am from Salt Lake City, UT and
I just turned 60. My father is my father, my
mother is my mother. I have five siblings.
We're all full siblings. So we thought, you know, you
didn't think anything else would come of it about and my father
passed away 18 years ago and he, my parents divorced in the mid
to late 70s. He, you know, she always said he
cheated on me since day one. So you probably have siblings
out there. So about six years ago, I found
a a match that I didn't know. And so I contacted her and she
said, oh, you need to talk to my mom.
So I talked to her mom and her mom turns out to be my niece, my
half niece. I guess we just call her my
niece. And she said that her mom didn't
know who her father was and gave all sorts of names that were not
my father. But then when she was cleaning
out her mom's, I guess her grandma's, they found a note
that had my dad's name and that he was a Barber.
And I'm like, well, that sound, that's my dad.
And so then Jay, we'll just call her Jay, did her DNA test.
And then I contacted her mother and they're estranged and her
mother T lives about 3 hours South of where I live.
And so I drove down there and I took the DNA test and asked her
to take it. And she did.
And she's my half sister. So she, you know, we met that
one time. She asked if our dad left
anything and I said a wallet full of debt, do you want some?
And she did not. And I haven't spoke to her
since. OK, so you you uncover a sister.
That's kind of a big deal. How were you feeling when you
put those pieces together? Well, I'm the kind of person
that like, oh, we, we are related.
The DNA tells us we are family. Now, I love you, but I'm also
really good at like, boundaries. And it's like, no, I'm not gonna
give you money. And no, you know, we're not
gonna, you know, we're not gonna move in and take care of you
kind of thing. But talking to her daughter,
Jay, who we are super, super close, my new niece and I, that
was exciting too, because she's just a few years older than my
oldest daughter or my only daughter.
And so being around her felt like she just belonged to us.
And it still feels that way six years later.
She just belongs to us. I have three brothers and two
sisters. I'm the youngest.
My brother that's the youngest also speaks with Jay.
And when she comes to town, we all see her.
Nobody else wanted to really get to know her besides me, my
husband and our kids and then my brother and his family.
But the other siblings didn't want to have anything to do with
it, which is sad. But you know, that's there's so
many different varieties of how you you deal with your father
cheating on your mom, because T JS mom is between my oldest
brother and my middle brother in age.
So I mean, you first, you have to, I guess, be real with what
were your dad was like. You know, he just spread his
love everywhere, regardless of his marital status.
So you have to come to terms with that.
And then you have to come to terms with you have this sibling
and all they want is money. So you don't really want to have
anything to do with them. But then you take the good,
which is my niece and her kids, she has a grandchild.
And so that's the good part. And you just take the good and
you just kind of like disregard the the other stuff.
Yeah. I mean, did you go through a
process in terms of accepting this information about your dad?
Because usually I interview people who are on the other side
of this, the people who maybe took a test and found their
biological father. It's interesting that you say
that she was mostly interested in money because a lot of the
people that I talked to, they say like, that is what the new
family thinks that I'm after. But I'm I'm really not.
I just want to know him or, or I want to know about him.
But in your experience, that was actually her goal was to get
some money it. It seems to be we've invited
her. We had like when we first found
out we had invited her, my uncle was having his 80th birthday
party. And so we invited her up to come
to that and meet the family. My, this, this would have been
my, it's my dad's brother. And she just didn't want any
part of meeting anybody. She just didn't, she didn't want
to know about any kind of health history.
She didn't, I mean, my, my niece did and she met, she's met
everyone and she wants to know, she wanted to know about health
history and stuff like that, but T did not.
And, and she's never reached out.
We're, we're, she has my e-mail, we're friends on Facebook.
I know she's undergone some health issues in the last year
and a lot of those were health issues on my dad's side of the
family, but I guess she just didn't want to reach out to us.
And when we reached out to her, she wasn't interested.
So as far as like dealing with, I mean, my dad was who he was,
you know, there's no changing that.
And, and maybe because I'm the youngest, it doesn't bother me,
but that's just who he was. So I just go with it.
There's nothing you can do about it.
Yeah, what about the rest of your siblings?
Did they accept that? They just basically ignore that
the fact that we have other people in in the family except
for my one brother who is who is also close to Jay, then Denise.
They just don't. They don't want to meet anybody.
They don't want to talk to anybody.
I know my one brother, my middle brother feels like my dad didn't
have these flaws 'cause I know when my mom has said something
negative and we're all adults, it's not like we're little
children. If she says anything negative
about my dad, my brother gets kind of grumpy of with her.
And and that's just, you know, their dynamic, you know?
OK, so you find this one sister and it's not a positive
relationship with her, but you do end up having a positive
relationship with her daughter. You're niece.
You're half niece technically, but you're niece.
What happens next? Well, when they come to town, we
get together, we text each other all the time.
We're on Facebook. We have a very like, it's not an
everyday text message, but every so like I would say every few
weeks we are in contact and talking and she'll be out in a
couple weeks and we're going to get together for dinner at our
house. And, and so she's just family.
I mean, that's, that's all there is.
She, she fits in her morals, her dynamic, her humor, you know,
she's just family. That's that's all there is to
it. So, so that's the first one.
That's the first surprise. OK, so, so, so your first
surprise kind of it sounds like it, it didn't shock you too
much. You know.
Who your dad was and got a a niece out of it.
Maybe not a sister, but you did get a a niece relationship.
What's the next DNA surprise? About two years after that,
there was another like I guess would be the second generation,
another DNA match that I didn't know.
So I contacted her and she's like, well, I was adopted, but
this is my biological mom and my biological grandma never knew
her who her father was. And so my guess is we're related
through that way. And I'm like, yes, we are.
I can tell that that's where you, you, you matched on my
dad's side. Maybe I can just call her and
talk to her. And I called and so she took the
DNA test. And so I have another half
sister. So this is The funny thing about
this half sister. So we're in Utah.
She grew up in Utah. We grew up in Utah.
My oldest full sibling, let's just say her name's Jessica.
Jessica lives two states away, and she was a real estate agent
for years. Her name is Jessica.
She goes by Jess. New sister is Jessica, and she
goes by Jess. And she lives in the same state,
and she was a real estate agent. Wow, so.
Remember the old Bob Newhart show?
You're probably too young to know this this this is my
brother Daryl and this is my other brother Daryl.
We went around saying that for for a very long time.
This is my sister Jess and this is my this is my other sister
Jess, 'cause they have the exact same names and.
Wow. And that is your relationship
with with her life. With new sister then that's what
we call her new. We have old sister Jess and new
sister Jess. New sister Jess looks like my
aunt, my dad's sister. She sounds like her, her
mannerisms are exactly like my aunt.
And so it's it's pretty crazy and and she is a lot like Jay
where my niece where she just she she really fits in her sense
of humor. She's very artistic.
I sew and embroidery and do little markets and sell my
stuff. She makes beautiful coats out of
she upcycles like sweaters and things and makes beautiful,
beautiful coats. And she does markets too.
So that creativity aspect is there.
So, you know, we connect on a lot of levels and and just like
Jay, she's just family. Even though she was far away, we
still stay in contact so. If I heard you correctly, both
of your sisters, your new found sisters, both of them knew that
the person who was raising them was not their biological.
Parent. Do you know if your dad knew
that he had these other children out there?
I don't think he did. He did say that when he was in
high school, his old girlfriend in high school got pregnant and
they sent her off to have the baby and he was placed for
adoption. We've never come across that.
We've never found any records or anything that indicates that.
And so he thought he had a son that was older than our oldest
sibling, but he, he never mentioned anybody else.
But why would he? He wouldn't want us to know
about, you know, his philandering, I'm sure.
And so he would have had to say, oh, yeah, I cheated on your mom
all the time. So he so as far as we know he
didn't know. Which is kind of weird that
neither of them would tell him. You grew up with five siblings
and now you have two. Two more.
One is close. Tell me more about what that's
been like or how it's affected you.
We don't often hear from your side of the equation, the people
who have been discovered. You kind of touched on this, but
why do you think that you were more open to a relationship than
your siblings? Oh, I don't know.
I think it's just because I'm very outgoing.
I'm, I'm way more outgoing, very social, and I just feel like me
more than my siblings are just, I'm just more open to the
connection with just other people in general.
Just the, I don't know, I feel like everyone is connected
together. The the universe connects us in
some ways and I think we have more in common with other people
than we think we would. And you won't know that unless
you are open to exploring that relationship.
And they're just, they're just old and grumpy.
I know. Do you have any questions for
your dad? Like if you could ask him
anything, what would you ask? I would probably like to know
more about like, not that I want to know about his his personal
life, but I kind of like to know, you know, what does he
know? How many women have he has he
been hanging out with that could produce more children so that I
could like keep an eye out or like, I don't know.
Are you my brother? I don't know.
But if you could say, if you could say, Oh, there was this
one girl in Reno and then, you know, then then we'd have more
information. I think that's the big thing is
just, you know, you did this stuff, be honest and then
everybody will be better off for it.
Yeah, I know. You mentioned another DNA
surprise, so you've had two. There's actually two more the
same thing, Ancestry. I see a woman on there who's two
years older than me and we are cousins, 2nd cousins.
And I've never heard of her before.
And so I, I messaged her. Do you know how we're connected
on my dad's side? So at that point I was thinking
like my dad's uncles had a child out of wedlock or one of his
nephews. Not putting a lot of, of
research into our connection, just more like spitballing like,
hmm, I wonder where this child came from.
I contacted her, we talked a little bit and then I just, I
woke up at 3:00 in the morning thinking, I think this is my
cousin's baby now. My cousin would be the same age
as my sister and so we wouldn't have been close at all.
I mean, she'd be thirteen years older than me.
I just woke up it's like 3 in the morning thinking I wonder if
this baby belongs to cousin and she has since passed.
She passed away at that point she was already gone.
I messaged her brother and his wife and said do you know
anybody who placed a baby for adoption in 1967 who was
biracial? And I swear, as soon as I sent
send, my cousin called me and said, that's my sister's baby.
And so we did find an adopted child that they've been looking
for her. They didn't know about her
because my cousin was a lot younger than his sister and
their, their sister has dementia and accidentally said something
about so and so's baby. And they're like what?
And, and she had a baby and then she backtracked.
And no, no, I, I don't know what you're talking about.
And so they, they had been looking for her for years and I
didn't know this. So he did the DNA test and yes,
this is his niece and, and she lives in Washington.
And that's another one that another person who like whenever
we're up in Seattle or wherever, whenever she's down here, we get
together. And it's just like that
connection, just being around somebody you are, you are
related to, even if you didn't grow up with them or know them,
that connection is just so strong.
And you know, we've gone to like the gardens and walked around
together. And, and so when we're together,
it's just like, we could be like little cousins hanging out, but
now we're adults hanging out. And, and I treasure her.
She acts so much and looks so much like her mom.
And it just feels like we got a piece of her mom back because
her mom was always so vibrant and and exuberant and just the
life of the party and was just so loving to everyone.
And she never had any other kids.
And I had asked her once if she ever wanted kids, not knowing
she had a child, and she said no.
I'm just going to be the best aunt I can be.
It's just not for me right now. It's just not in the cards for
me to have a child. And I just and she looked so sad
and I remember that. And then now it all makes sense.
And so so everything's been really positive.
I don't have anything negative. I mean, like T is kind of
negative, but that's on her. That's, that's her deal.
That's her bag. And so everybody else has been
so great. So.
Yeah. And it doesn't have to be a
negative experience. Like it's, that's good that it's
been positive for you and that you've really gotten more family
out of this. That's how I feel.
The 4th one, this is the big one again.
Somebody shows up on Ancestry and it shows up as my nephew and
I'm like what? I have three brothers.
So I contacted my mom because at first I thought, oh, my dad,
dirty dog, you know, hey, he would have been old by then
because S, we'll just call him. S is like 35.
And so my dad would have been like, Nope, I just can't
visualize that. Let's get away from that.
And so I contact, I called my mom.
I said, will you just look on your ancestry and tell me how
you are connected to this person?
And or tell me if he's on your connection, because if he was on
hers, then I know that he's not my dad's.
He would be a nephew. And she's like, Oh yeah, I see.
Who is it? Like, I'm not sure yet, but I'll
let you know. And so then I contacted my
middle brother's son and asked him what his connection was.
And it was first cousin. And then I looked at my son's
and their connection was first cousin and then my youngest
brother, their connection was nephew, uncle.
So I knew it had to be my oldest brother's son.
And so I just kind of text him and said, if you had any kids
out there, would you want to know?
And he's like, no, I don't want to know.
My oldest brother was in the Navy during Vietnam.
He has never been married. He's had girlfriends throughout
the years. He never wanted kids.
And so he's just, you know, living his life and he never
wanted kids and he doesn't want to know.
And so I did tell my mom that, you know, this is this is my
oldest brother's son and this is how I know this.
And then my family got really irritated with me and said, why
are you out looking for people? Why do you want to find these
people? And I'm like, they're just
showing up on Ancestry. I'm not out.
You act like I'm out there looking in dumpsters for people
who need a home. It's it's not like that.
I'm not out looking for people. They just show up.
And so this one kind of got to everybody and nobody wants to
have contact with him but me and my my husband and kids and my
mom would like to meet him 'cause it's her grandson.
But all my other siblings were kind of pissed that he showed
up. And I'm like.
Why is that? Why do you why do you think that
there's anger around it? I think because they're
protective of my brother, which he's gone through some health
issues and he's on dialysis now. And I think that's part of it is
that they're protective of him, which I, you know, I understand
that too. And I did talk to him a little
bit more about it because he has grandkids.
That's what gets me. I adore my grandkids.
They are my life. And now he has grandkids, but he
doesn't want any part of it. And so I did approach it again
and he said, what kind of woman would have a kid and not not
tell the dad? And I'm like probably the kind
of woman you would date 'cause that's, you know, they met at a
barbecue. And the reason she didn't think,
she didn't think he was the dad, she was with like 4 guys in a
two week period. Her husband, her husband's
friend, some other guy and my brother.
And they were all white. My brother's Hispanic.
My nephew has like green eyes with like a blue-green eyes like
my brother. My brother has Hazel eyes and he
has lighter, lighter skin, lighter hair.
And so she kept saying, Oh no, it's not him, 'cause he's
Mexican. You don't look Mexican.
Well, you know, I don't know what to say.
We're, we're kind of a light colored, colored Mexican.
So yeah. Well, Mexicans come in all
colors. Yes, absolutely.
Did your nephew then think that somebody else was his father?
Or did he know? That.
No, he didn't know. He knew there were 4-4
possibilities. So he started with the husband
who she, his mom, was married to at the time and it wasn't him.
They did a paternity test, you know, when he was born.
I think then he contacted this other guy, and I think he's
since passed away. And then he contacted somebody
he thought would have been his sister.
And this was years ago. And she's like, oh, that's
great. I have a brother that's
wonderful. And then they finally spent like
$500 to do a test, and it wasn't.
And so then he tried to track my brother down through the
information from his mom, but she didn't really have any
information other than the first name.
And so for years he just didn't know he had zeroed out everybody
else. The other three guys were were
not the father. And so he got the DNA test like
a year or so ago from as a gift. I think it was a Christmas gift
or something. And then, and here he is.
I know it's his story, but how is he dealing with the
rejection? Well, I think he started off
just kind of wanting to know where he came from.
And so I gave him a lot of medical information and just a
rundown of the family. I've sent pictures and he's sent
pictures. So I think it, it's hard to tell
with text message. We've talked on the phone, but
we mostly text. I he, he just wants to know
where he came from. And it makes me really sad that
my brother won't, you know, at least acknowledge that he has a
son and, and just talk to him. You know, he's not asking for
anything other than, you know, let's just talk on the phone.
I want to know, you know, I want to hear your voice.
And, and that's heart. That's heartbreaking.
That's heartbreaking, especially with with kids.
He has he, you know, they have a grandpa that they'll probably
never meet or know. I do throw some little tidbits
out there for my brother to just kind of Mull over.
And I'm hoping, and my mom hopes too, that he'll change his mind.
But in the meantime, you know, we talk and I've, I've sent his,
his kids some little like some things that I've embroidered for
like Valentine's Day and Halloween, things like that to
send him a little, little gifts. And so there's that he would
like to come out and meet the people who want to meet him and,
and just, you know, spend some time with family.
He's he's like in the middle of the country.
And so he'd have to come out here, but I, I do, I feel sad
because, you know, and it kind of makes me angry.
And just like my brother is like, you just want to kind of
shake him and say, you know, you have a kid, you know that.
And that's exciting because he's family and you have grandkids
and grandkids are amazing. He just doesn't have the desire
to have a family or I don't know, but that one makes me sad.
Yeah. Are you hoping to build more of
a relationship with your nephew or are you following his lead?
How is that going? We, we text message, I'm so far
away, I don't know what else we can do other than just stay in
contact. It it goes both ways.
We both, you know, sometimes I'll reach out to him and we'll
talk for like a good couple of days with long text messages and
then then sometimes he reaches out to me and then it'll be the
same. So I mean, that's where it's at.
And I remind him, you know, I'm here if you have any more
questions. He can always ask us more
questions too, if he has questions about family history.
I did go over a lot of the family history just because we
have a really rich family history in northern New Mexico
dating back hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years
with the Pebble Revolt and stuff like that.
And so I filled him in on a lot of that because it's just a very
rich history and and I'm super proud of it and I hope he can be
proud of it too. I think just the big thing is
like you have to be so open because you don't know what's
going to happen. You don't know who's going to
show up on your, on your DNA matches.
And it's, I feel like everyone wants to know where they come
from. I have so many friends who were
adopted and want to know where they come from, who their family
is. And if you get the chance to
find out, you got to, you got to grab it because you might not
have that chance again. So if I can be, if I can be that
person for anybody that shows up on my my DNA matches, even
though my siblings don't agree, I'm going to be that person
because I know people want to know where they came from.
Yeah, absolutely. What advice do you have for
found family member, somebody who grew up in the house, they
they knew who their parents were, but then they uncover an
unknown sibling who maybe wants to reach out and build a
relationship with them. What advice do you have?
Do it, do it. Just accept them and accept them
on a healthy and healthy boundaries.
But still you can still have a really good relationship.
You don't have to take care of them.
You don't have to give them your inheritance.
All they want is probably information, somebody to connect
with and in your life. I, I feel like, especially with
my niece Jay, I feel like my life is, is so much richer
having her in my life. And new sister Jess also and my
new nephew, I feel like they're all all three of them.
And my, my cousin, they all have given me different, like
different components to, to make you who you are because that,
you know, different connections with different people.
But that kind of like plugs into who you are and enhances that
you don't know what this new person can bring into your life
that will make your life even better or richer.
And I think people get so hung up on, Oh my, my dad cheated
that they don't see the big picture that there's just more
room, more room for everyone. Awesome.
And I'm really curious about this because you are kind of the
the found family member. What advice do you have for
someone who is looking for their family or just found a
connection, whether it's through being an N P/E, A adoptee or or
otherwise? What advice do you have for them
about reaching out to their new found family members?
Be bold. You know, if an e-mail doesn't
work, find their phone number. Or if they're older and they're
not on social media, find somebody in their family that's
a little bit younger that can navigate that.
But I think a lot of people are afraid of rejection.
But if you don't, if you don't take the step to connect, you'll
never know how it's going to turn out.
And if it turns out poorly, it doesn't mean it's over.
It means like maybe they need a little time.
And that's what I'm hoping with my brother is maybe maybe just
letting it sink in and and try again.
And thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today.
Thank you for DNA surprises in your life.
And I feel like you have taken them all pretty much in stride,
which is pretty remarkable on behalf of of people who are NP
ES or who have found a family, you know, thank you for just
being so open. I think that's the best outcome
that that most of us want was for somebody to just be
accepting and open and, and freely sharing information.
And it's amazing that you've been able to do that, You know,
not not once, not twice, but four times.
So I hope that your brother has a change of heart too.
But in the meantime, it's awesome that you're being there
for your nephew. So I wish you the best in the
future. Thank you and thanks for letting
me share my crazy story. And who knows what's going to
happen. I could get another one next
month, who knows who. Knows maybe we'll have a Part 2.
Thank you. Thanks again to Anne for sharing
her story. If you have Adna Surprise that
you'd like to share, please submit your story at
dnasurprises.com and for early ad free access to episodes, join
me over on patreon@patreon.com/DNA
Surprises. Until next time, DNA Surprises
is hosted, produced and edited by me, Alexis Oursalt.
It is mixed and mastered by Josh Oursalt of Siren Recording
Studios.