This is identity at the center. Welcome to the Identity of the
Center podcast. I'm Jeff, and that's Jim.
Hey, Jim. Hey, Jeff, how are you?
Not so bad yourself. Great.
Look, we're here at Authenticate 2025.
We'll give it away. Listen, sometimes a little slow
in the uptake, but I think things are starting to come
together for me, right? We're major themes at the
conference are things like, hey, the attacks are still the things
they've been phishing, social engineering, things like that to
get your password right now, how do we solve that?
I think the answer has been pass keys, but it continues to evolve
to now include identity verification.
So you need this technology to solve this non-technical way
that the hackers are working. At the same time, there's also a
theme where AI is playing a role not only for the good guys, but
for the bad guys as well. So I think there's this AI arms
race going on. I don't know.
All these things are like, This is why you come to conferences,
right? It's like there's the theme,
there's information, you sit there and then that ticket for
some point, at some point for everybody.
It's just like, yeah, that aha moments.
Like I get it. I think I get it.
You think you're getting it? I think I'm getting it OK.
So identity verification I would say is huge, but I don't think
it's just a technology because what is identity verification?
It's verification of typically at least in most of these
scenarios, a document and what is that document?
Something government issue, right?
Something that is or maybe financial institution or
education. So I think there is an
opportunity for partnership here between a whole bunch of
different entities to try and make this better for people.
And I think that's what we're seeing in a great confidence.
Well, there's a lot of attendees from a lot of different
industries and verticals and technologies.
And but it's not just technology vendors, it's also banks,
education, I think Healthcare is here, you know, higher Ed I.
Don't know if there's. Government here, we can ask our
guests of that, but I think all those need to come together to
really make this something that actually takes off and really
flies. Yeah, there's a lot of
practitioners here, so we can see the the progress is
happening already, but more and more organizations are drinking
the kool-aid and saying, all right, we need to do this as
well. You know, when I think about the
identity identity verification, I think where it hits home for
me is we've talked a lot in the past about this unhappy fast,
right? So that most of the hacks don't
go through the front door. It comes down to the unlocking
of a forgotten or a lost pass key for in this example, what if
you could go back to a verified identity?
You could do identity verification to unlock your
passkey. Now that's horrible, yes.
So I'm a fan of passkey, so I've got every time I see it, I set
it up. So why don't we just, like, get
into it with the man, the myth, the legend himself, Andrew Shiki
are sitting across the table from us.
Yeah. Executive director, executive
director and CEO. I, I, I feel like I've been
butchering your title for a long time because this you've been on
as long as you. Have it you?
Can call me whatever you want 10 Times Now like. 10 times I'm
really here just to pad my league.
And and you are doing a fine job on my I, I was talking to Jim
yesterday during your keynote and say, all right, we got to
wait, do something for and go, we go.
On this is play, I appreciate this.
If I keep having my lead, I don't know if I'm like the Cal
Ripken of Inac or LeBron. I'm near as athletic or, you
know, as strong as you're those guys.
But I'm I, I take pride in this, this record and I do intend to
keep it. Well, it's definitely a career
highlight as far as I'm. Concerned.
There's that. It is.
Why don't we start with where we're at, right.
The authenticate this 2021, one of my favorites of the year and
it's been a great conference so far.
But I'm curious before we get to that, like you, you I well,
let's let's get into that as well.
But yeah, your keynote yesterday.
Yeah, it was it was a little bit of kind of making everything.
It was like, all right, here's where we've been and then here's
where we're going. Yeah, we start with kind of I.
Tried to have a narrative, yeah. Right, right.
That's like those are summary, right?
Well, first. I mean, let's talk about the
elephant in the room, I answered to her.
Yes, I. Got AI, got a good.
Chuckle up, kid. Yeah.
So that was. The and we're using Max, so I've
been told you're not a massive. I mean, it's all, it's all
there. So I'm open minded and changing,
evolving through the years. Yeah.
So it's great to have an opportunity to kind of help set
up the the vision for we're heading as an alliance for the
next, you know, next year or so. I talked about where we're
coming or what we've done and where we're coming from and
where we're going. So the first message was around
Passkey in progress with Passkey's.
The fact of the matter is, I mean, Jeff, I love what you
said. Like when you see a pass key,
you, you, you enroll, you use it, you love them.
And I do too. And I, I mentioned I still get a
thrill every time I see like the pass key, like signing, like I
love it. And I love the fact that when I
meet random people, like on the golf course or something, that's
what I do. I can actually say, ever use a
pass key? Like, yeah, of course I have.
And then that's what I do, you know.
So is there something like so tangible about it?
And the progress is so real that it, that it's fantastic.
So the past couple years we've got these counting statistics
like, well, we estimate, you know, 4 billion in total
accounts can use pass keys and the 7 billion and the 10 billion
and it says, you know, we can't do that anymore because the the
rollouts are so grown and we know the big brands are doing
this. But there's no point, you know,
quantifying the total, you know, number of accounts that could
use it. What I did share is that we
estimate over 3 billion actual pass keys are being used to
secure accounts. That's a big 3 billion in three
years, less than three years. That's fantastic progress.
OK, so we're really happy with that progress.
But we also realized that like our job's far from done like I
might firmly believe that, you know, passkeys are inevitable,
right for consumer sign in. We will look back at passwords
as a thing as a relic, right as as a as a Rotary phone.
It'll take a while to get there. We want to make sure that we
stay on that path to inevitability.
And so we have work to do That's what I've talked about things we
need to improve on. One is on US improvements.
I talked about making sure that, you know, passkeys are fully
capable and effective in the enterprise for workforce and
these are things we'll work on. And the last thing I talked
about was a need for practitioners to really
contemplate the broader security picture, not just for signing,
which is where you know, passes are closing the front door to
attackers, but also they're removing knowledge based
credentials for recovery. All right.
So if you if you have, there's a reason why a lot of companies
keep passwords around with pass uses.
You know, it's very complex to get rid of them all together,
but you're putting them further and further in the corner,
further and further in the background is what we need to do
to lead their ultimate demise. Because as long as they're like
readily accessible for recovery, there is a back door that's open
to attackers, right? So that's another imperative we
have for 2026. So we're going to push on all
those things as we look to, you know, see more and more
adoption, better adoption, better deployments that with
passkeys in the market. I find interesting that you
mentioned the user experience for passkeys.
I feel like it's already pretty good.
Yeah. And you bought and you you've
spent a lot of time and I've ever building out the Fido
standards for the user experience and you have a whole
bunch of documentation. Yeah.
What is? So when you say make it better
like what do you mean? Well, so I mean it's, it depends
on your pass key experience, but the fact of the matter is that
every pass key experience needs to be an excellent experience,
full stop. And often times you don't sign
in through the front door, right?
Not everyone enters a website through the front.
There's a lot of adjacencies where you enter, say an Amazon
or a PayPal or some of these flows are not always for the
front door. They come in different ways.
There's a lot of things to contemplate on how someone comes
to sign it. There's also surprisingly large
amount of combinations of browsers and operating systems
and devices where there's still some inconsistencies.
There's some UX flows that are inconsistent with security keys
and things like that. So like we're aware of these and
it's a, you know, top priority is to identify them, figure out
how to solve them and, and to solve them.
And I, I appreciate the fact that you think it's a good
experience and you know that we've done good work on this,
but there's always, you know, always work to be done.
Yeah, that's user experience to me is a lot about ubiquity and
consistency. I like as you go from place to
place pass keys everywhere, but if they do it differently then
that's going to automatically confuse people.
Yeah, choosers, right. So then the fact of the matter
is you can enroll multiple pass keys for a service.
And I often do this. All right, so I live a very
heterogeneous life. I'll be on honorable passkey on
my iPhone. I'll do one on my windows, you
know, for Windows Hello, and I'll do one for my third party
credential manager. And sometimes, you know, the the
site doesn't know what to present it with.
All right, so there's things we can, you know, improve on that.
And I think again, it's all attainable.
And I think it's always important to bear in mind, we've
been at this for only a couple of years and we're seeing great
progress. And and these are, you know what
I'll call lower case G, lower case P, growing things, all
right, feel really good about the progress, but there's always
work to be done you. Just need a better way theme
music right for the wrong bands? So we talked about, we talked
about progress in that front, but the other question we get,
so not just counting statistics, but qualitative statistics.
So we introduced the past the index you mentioned that this is
in response to really a desire for benchmarks and I talked to
companies a lot who are deploying and they might be
early in the rollout like hey Andrew, look we have a you know
say 35% enrolling rate. Is that good?
You know, our, we've cut our signings, you know, time by, you
know, 75%. Is that good?
You know, I'm not making those numbers up, but like, how do you
quantify these things, right? It's kind of like a stick in the
space. If there's no, you know no
context around it, how do you know how you're doing?
It feels better, but yeah. You know, but the fuel is
important, but you know, quantitative data is even
better, right. So we're starting to be one
start providing benchmarks in the industry.
So we, we launched a passkey in this, which is an initiative
comprised of Fido member relying parties, you know, major service
providers who have had rollouts in market for a bit.
And it's only, it's a small in. So it's only 9 companies
contributed to this, but we took their, an average of their
aggregate data, right? So nothing's depended, you know,
directly to a company, but you know, each company's average
signed a success rate and time to sign in and a number of
metrics. We boiled that down into, you
know, some benchmarks that people can be aware of and shoot
for. All right.
And so this is our our first step of this initiative and we
intend to, you know, let this grow over time, both as a
service to the industry to let people know what they should
shoot for, but also as a benefits of members, right?
So I think that generally, you know, members who contribute
data to this can get data out of it.
There's a lot of data that we held back from publishing.
So we want to make sure that you know, our our community at
large. We're also our membership
community has what they need to be successful, but they're past
year olds. Yeah, that's really cool.
And he's talked about the passkey index this week.
We're here at the conference authenticate 2025.
Tell us about it. How's it going so?
Far I've been thrilled, you know, so we have more people
than ever. I think we have around 750 on
site maybe which is I think we're around 6:50 last year.
So you know, nice growth and number of attendees.
We have a lot of people attending remotely as well.
We're one of the few conferences that still offer a fully remote
attendee Which. Is great, fully support that.
Which is great. So hey, look, if you just want
to get the content, you know, attend remotely and if you can't
travel, attend remotely also, you can get the content.
We archive all the content, make it available first to people who
do register and pay. So, you know, we're very
cognizant of that as well. But the people on site get the
whole benefit of being part of the community.
And it sounds like such a cliche and kind of cheesy, but there is
something pretty special here. And you mentioned this before,
like there is a real sense of community here and people are
here to help each other. And like, if you are interested
in authentication and pass keys, like we're not going to find
more capable, smarter people that are going to find here in
our halls. And the content is fantastic
with the hallway con is always a highlight, right?
Seeing people connecting, you know, seeing someone who gets to
talk about their deployment, spend like half an hour talking
to people, have questions about it.
You know, there's this real sense of goodwill and, and, and,
you know, urgency to help each other be successful that really
permeates, you know, the whole event here.
So I think it's been a good event and numbers a couple of
their data points. I think the, and Jimmy mentioned
this, there's a bigger practitioner audience here than
years past. And we saw this kind of
anecdotally as the registrations came in, but I'm hearing it from
our vendor hall that they're having, you know, more, you
know, interesting conversations with people who are further
along their deployment, their their purchasing journey, very,
you know, have very poignant questions about how to roll out,
you know, Fido infrastructure. So you know, more of a
practitioner audience. And generally, you know,
conversations has gotten more and more up level while also
leaving room for new attendees. So I think we have around 45%
new attendees this year, right? That doesn't mean they're new to
pass keys means they're new attendees.
But you know, people have all skill sets who are coming here
to learn to advance their deployments and then move
forward as well. So been really happy on that
front with the show so far. Yeah, I wrote the practitioners.
That's the one thing I'd say I felt that is the most different
from past years. Yeah, like a.
Whole bunch of people who are new to the conference.
In the beginning of the show, I kind of tried to think out loud
about what I'm kind of holding all these pieces together to
paint the picture of what authenticates all about how
close did I come? What would you change?
But I think you hit it on the head.
I mean, so it's, it's about, you know, well, the name of the show
is authenticate. So it's about authentication.
I mean, it's at its core, it's about authentication.
So I want to talk about what we're doing next, next.
So it's a place to learn about all things authentication with a
focus on the Fido approach. I think that's our our mission
statement. And so no matter where you are
in your pass key journey, your authentication journey, you're
going to learn something here, right?
You're going to learn something by listening to practitioners
give case studies. We're going to learn about
different use cases. We're going to learn about
futures. You're going to learn about
adjacencies, you're going to learn about authorization and
new standards and payments and agentic AI and all these things
that are, you know, you need to authenticate first to sign into
things to take advantage of this.
But these are all the things we're covering.
You know, one thing we've changed through the years and
some of the feedback we got last year is like, OK, I get it,
pass. These are great, but I don't
need case study after case study saying like passkeys are
amazing. So we actually got more
selective. It's not just like a, a
cheerleading session. We turned down some amazing case
studies that would have been fantastic.
But like we can only do so much of like I use passkeys, I save
money as you know. So there's only so much that we
could do. So we try to get sharper with
some of the angles looking up. People are coming back a second
time talking about what's happened, you know, on stage 2
of their deployment. So you know, we've evolved the
kind of message we have around this as our audience has matured
also. And then the other key theme
we're seeing here are the adjacencies.
So part of my keynote that you mentioned is Jeff, I talked
about like where we've come from and where we're heading.
I guess kind of the headline here is that we are, you know,
intentionally kind of broadening our focus to look at digital
credentials. And so we've been focused on
like the broader identity life cycle for a couple years now,
but their IDV certificate, identity verification
certification, which allows for like what Jim was talking about
for possession based onboarding and recovery and, you know,
certifying products against that.
But the digital credentials and wallet space is an area where
you've got a lot of feedbacks at where we could probably add some
value. All right, I think everyone can
understand the value and the vision of digital credentials
for like literally your wallet, your physical wallet is
digitized like no different than like right now, you do mobile
payments, that's a digitization of your, of your credit card,
but why not your identity and your passport and your diploma
and your fishing license, whatever else you need to have
digitized is all there, right And accessible to you, rooted
in, you know, a trusted, you know, proof of real world
identity that allows you to, to leverage this in a, in a very
nimble, you know, efficient fashion.
So everyone's had this vision for literally for decades.
We have governments, we have pushing on this to happen.
You know, a lot of states have mobile driver's licenses here in
the United States, more famously than Europe.
You know, the European Union is pushing every member state to
have digital wallets by the end of 2026.
So what's been holding us back is not, you know, vision or
ambition, but what's been holding it back, I think is, you
know, there there's things that we could do to unlock this,
right? And then I think that's what
we're focused on doing is bringing the three things that
Fido Alliance does and does very well into this space.
You know, we do as an alliance, you know, we create technical
specifications, we run marketing and enablement programs, and we
run a certification program that really unlocks the value of open
standards. So you think about passkeys,
right? We have CTAP and web auth N we
certified products against those B to B products people can
deploy against and enablement. And that was a passkey moment.
All right, So like web auth and five O 2 existed before
passkey's. But when we came up with the
passkey, you know, the brand, the logo program, the user
guidelines, all of a sudden they gave a name and some commonality
to what people have been doing. And it really spurred all the
growth that we've been seeing that with passkey's.
So we've been talking to major issuers, digital credentials,
major consumers, digital credentials about, you know,
what do they see hold the market back?
And and yeah, we think there's opportunity for us to provide
value there alongside partner organizations like Open ID
Foundation and ISO. So you mentioned Europe and Jim
and I were at the EIC conference in Berlin.
Yeah. Earlier this year.
Great. Conference, what struck me is
how far ahead they are when it comes to digitalization of their
credentials. So you mentioned, you know, the
the EU and a member nations need to have something in place.
One of the things I learned there was there's actually a
financial implication if they don't do it, it's some sort of
fine or tax or something that, you know, the country has to pay
if they don't do it. By that time I was like, OK,
well, that's that's one way to get people motivated.
I don't know if that works, right.
Yeah, I don't know how that would work in the US because we
see the fragmentation with mobile drivers license, for
example. So trying to get, you know, 50
States and territories plus territories, right, to try and
get on the same path I think everyone wants.
To do that, like what? Do you see as holding back like
that specific theory? Is it just that the politics and
or is it something else? No, I think.
It's the one thing we want to look at doing is providing some
sort of wallet certification, right?
And so there's different protocols out.
There's ISO protocol, there's Openty foundation protocol, We
have a protocol that can be used for, you know, credential
presentation across devices. These are all things that can be
used for as, as part of a wallet.
And I think that there's a lack of, we feel like there's a value
to be added like by by launching A certification program, you
know, for wallets, for the wallet providers and for the
relying parties as well. And that's the type of thing
that could start to kind of help catalyze the space a little bit
to help move things forward. So wallets are one area.
I think there's also like no one's focused on usability, not
enough folks on usability. There's been some great work
like on the, on the US front, like the mobile driver's license
front, you know, STA Secure Technology Alliance has done
some really good kind of sessions on talking about NBL
use cases, how there's been some inner OPS that have happened.
But it's, it's, you know, it's part part, you know, pieces
here, pieces there. And I think that, you know,
final lines brings to the tables, right, sort of
stakeholders to work with. Companies like that,
organizations like that just bring greater focus on the
enablement aspects of of making digital credentials a reality,
you know, throughout the world. Feels like you had some early
adopters. I know the one company, I know
it's not their full name, but Docomo, you know, if they, they
were the early adopters, then you had a lot of big tech
adoption where basically all the platforms bought in on on this
passkey process. To me, like that's the the head
of Steam that needs to get around everything.
But now that you're at that point, it seems like it's just
going to roll. Yeah, absolutely.
With Pat. I mean, I feel like we're making
really good progress with Passkey's and it's the set of
stakeholders that we have in the alliance that helps makes this
happen. I think we're, you know,
incredibly unique in the sense that we're very fortunate to
have a broad set of organizations, right.
So all the major platforms, the device manufacturers, leaders
and identity and you know, security technology governments
or members of Fido Alliance. And then last but not least,
like the service providers who need Fido to succeed, right.
And then they've really driven a lot of the use cases and driven
a lot of the adoption of passkeys in the market.
And so then we as a life, you know, look at what we've done
and we've also done other work also like in credential exchange
powder device on board. So we've proven that we can
execute on passkeys, but also, you know, adjacent spaces.
So as our stakeholders got together, you know, then they
talk about what what you know, where are some other common pain
points. You know, one of them was around
digital credentials, right? And they feel like, you know,
they like collaborating inside a fighter alliance.
We want to be more collaboration and that's really they're the
ones really pushing for us to take on this very important work
and we will take on this work and we'll execute against that.
Do you think that for this to move forward, you still need to
continue to have the major players like Google, Apple,
Microsoft, right? They when those three died
involved with pass keys, that was like, OK, now we're getting
somewhere. Is it similar for wallets?
Obviously Apple Pay is huge. You've got Samsung wallet,
you've got Android wallet. I don't think Microsoft has a
wallet. And so much infrastructure
actually. So Apple, Google, Microsoft,
Samsung Paytal, Visa, MasterCard, anti to Docomo,
different mobile operators. And in Korea we have SK Telecom.
Yeah, well, so like, literally. Like, right.
If you forget one, then we'll yeah, yeah.
There's a lot we have a lot of, but like really those are the
the types of companies that have a very vested interest in, in
seeing this space. A lock.
Right. And, and, and it's a never as
interest to see this space mature and, and happen, You
know, this stands to increase commerce and reduce fraud,
right? And so I think one of the
biggest challenges that like payment networks have, or, you
know, payment companies like a PayPal is, is fraud, right?
And also they want to be wallet, they can beat wallet providers.
So they're supposed kind of cost savings and financial
opportunity with digital credentials.
And so, you know, to be clear, these companies wants to do
this, you know, not, you know, yes, it's for the sake of
society, but it's for their benefit as well.
And that's, that's the whole point of standards, right?
Standards are not all about altruism.
It's about, you know, basically deciding like, hey, look, we're
going to commoditize a certain level of technology and compete
on top of that so that we can all be more efficient in in how
we invest our R&D and how we compete and how we deliver
better services to the world at large.
And that's what standards are about.
That's what Fido's about. And that's where that's where
we're doing pass keys that that will aim to do with our partners
in the ecosystem with Wallace and credentials.
That predictability is a big, big part of this, right?
Is here's what to expect. You know it's going to be this
format or whatever, right process, and having the ability
to count on that is such a big part of the experience.
Yes, yeah, absolutely. So the conference is called the
Fennecate. Yes.
Now we're moving into identity verification.
Are we keeping the name authenticate or are we going to
try to come up with something new like how's that going to?
Work. Yeah, we, we don't, we don't
have plans to change the name authenticate, but I think.
Oh, you don't have the domain name right, So.
But. But I think that, you know, it's
important for us to get the word out as we plan for next year's
show that we'll be talking about authenticate and more
authentication and more. And actually, if you look at the
agenda this year, there's a lot of good content on visual
credentials, on agentic AI, on payments, on automotive, right?
So other things, again, authentication is the front door
for a lot of these things. Passkeys are a front door for a
lot of these things. But also there are other
applications, other use cases and full, full adjacencies to
passkeys that we will address. And we'll want to get the word
out to people that if you want to talk about those things, you
know, authenticate's a great place to come to talk about them
with the experts. So you've got other conferences
as well, right? So this is the one that's in
Carlsbad. Yes, there's one in Asia.
I think that's going to take one.
Yes. Well, we are announcing this
week, so will have been announced by the time this airs
that we are launching authenticate APEC in Singapore
in June of 2026, I think June 2nd through 4th.
Double check those dates before you book travel Tuesday through
Thursday in Singapore. Yeah.
So we're very excited to expand the brand into Asia.
In 2023 and 2024. We had something called the Fido
EPAC Summit. The first one is hosted in
Vietnam, the next one in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia.
Both are fantastic events, kind of regional events.
We had probably 3-4 hundred people attend both of those,
which is very inspiring to see, you know, traveling halfway
around the world to see people who are super interested to
learn about Fido and how to deploy Fido and how to deploy
pass keys. So we're basically just kind of
extending the Fido and the Authenticate brand into that
activity, tying into our member meeting that happens at the same
time in Singapore next year. So we're very excited to kind of
take that next step at this conference and with our broader
Fido community. So last question is this, what
do you notice as a is the biggest difference between the
US audience when it comes to fight alliance and pass keys and
not any verification versus audiences in other parts of the
world you've had these conversations like do you notice
anything different? But the audiences?
Yeah. I mean more like is their
interest in different spots? Are they having different
messages? Like what's the?
Yeah, I don't. It's hard.
To generalize, you know, like you said, like in Europe for
example, and lots tied to digital identity, like what can
I do like closer to kind of government oriented
applications. Although you know, I talked to
the good folks from Abalka, you know, the Spanish bank, they
were here this week and you know, they're expanding their
pass key rollout. So a lot of the same consumer
applications are happening, you know, in Europe as are happening
here, but it's probably more of a kind of regulatory lean in
Asia, you know, there may be some more mobile first type
experiences and Southeast Asia has some more emerging country
emerging opportunities. But we were down in Australia
this year in February in like Australia, just like, you know,
on the bleeding edge of a passkey adoption.
All right. So like U Bank, which is the
subsidiary of NAB, A&Z Bank, you know, are also committing to or
supporting passkeys. Now there's conversation today
from Vicroads, which is like the equivalent of the state of
Victoria's DMV about how they've moved to like they're moving
towards 80% adoption of passkeys.
So if the adoption in Australia is phenomenal.
So long answer short, it's hard to generalize, but the good news
is we're seeing adoption go all over the place.
And the one area that we've yet to really engage with where
there's a lot of activities in Brazil, right?
So to take part in the open banking, open finance activity
in Brazil, you need to have a Fido 2 certified server.
So there are dozens of banks in Brazil that are now Fido
certified. Every mobile payment there is
using the passkey or a body mobile payment, I shouldn't say
every, a lot of mobile payments they are using passkeys, just
pay as a new member of Fight Alliance, they're driving a lot
of that work along with Visa in Brazil.
So there's a lot of activity in South America as well.
So look, I think what we've done as an alliance with our
stakeholders is, you know, put great technology out to market,
you know, make it available to people, building in devices that
everyone can use. And as a result, you know, we
collectively are starting to address the password problem,
which has really plagued the role for decades, decades.
Yeah. Really.
Literally. Yeah, like.
Yes, it's a very dawn of. Time, yeah.
Yeah. And The thing is like we've been
aware of the the challenge for you know, 20 something years,
which is when the MFA first started coming out, right.
And the answer has always been like how to make passwords Sup
less with more, more layers. And that's that's a good short
term answer was as we know that's not sustainable.
So passkeys are a password replacement.
And you know, the reason we're seeing adoption at the scale
we're seeing it is because they work, they provide returns.
And again, that's where we're starting to quantify with the
passkey index. We're trying to reinforce that
was shows like this with things like Passkey Central to help
companies and organizations move their passkey implementations
forward so that ultimately you know, this is all you know in in
the name of, of creating a safer Internet.
It's been an amazing ride for the last few years and I, I just
want to say thank you for your support of this show.
You know, had it been on so many times.
I know you're a busy guy, so trying to carve out time for you
with this type of thing is always fun.
We did Fido feud you did last night.
It ended in a tie. I'm not sure how to feel about
it yet. The guarantees to repeat for.
I kind of think it was fixed. We certainly can't cut fight a
few now. Right now has to come back
because there's a tie, you know, so.
We have to come up with like Brandy for it.
I'm I'm already kind of leaning to fight a feud, fight a feud
2026, the rematch of the rematch.
Oh well, there's something like rematch, but your your team has
been great to work with. Give a shout out to Adrian.
She was awesome with all time and she she manned the sound
effects. So I don't think by the time
this episode goes like people won't have that as an episode,
but we'll help to get that out by the end of the year.
But it was so much fun. So thank you for.
Letting us we have a great team of Fido Alliance and I couldn't
think more highly my colleagues. It's really an honor to work
with them. Also, everyone's very passionate
about what we do. We believe what we're doing.
You know, ask everyone who works with us to, you know, first of
all, sign up to believe in the mission and be missionary about
it. And everyone is.
And so we take a lot of pride in what we do.
And I think it shows here at the show and everything that the the
Fido team does, it's. Been great.
So we'll go ahead and leave it there.
I think for this week, idcpodcast.com, idcpodcast.tv
for the YouTube and the all that good stuff.
So like and subscribe. Let's bring back Andrew for 11
probably in a couple months and yeah, we'll leave it there.
So thanks everyone for watching and are listening.
Andrew, thank you for your time. Thanks guys.
And we'll talk with everyone in the next one.
You've been listening to Identity at the Center.
We hope you've enjoyed the show. Make sure to like, rate and
review, and we'll be back soon. But in the meantime, hit the
website at identity@thecenter.com.
See you next time on Identity at the Center.