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Cycle was released in 1960 as 
one of Alfred Hitchcock's 

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greatest triumphs, a low budget 
experiment that became an all 

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time classic. 
The film is the story of Marion 

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Crane $40,000 In the fateful 
Mortal, she checks into one 

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stormy California night. 
My name is John, and the guys 

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who wouldn't even harm a family 
are Matt. 

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Let's put it this way, she might
have fooled me, but she didn't 

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fool my mother. 
And Westie. 

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Her son is a poor substitute for
a lover. 

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It's Fairfield, CA and the ATRM 
are checking in to talk toilets,

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showers and the Bates Motel. 12 
cabins, 12 vacancies. 

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What could possibly go wrong? 
Hello and welcome to all the 

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right movies where we all go a 
little mad sometimes as we tell 

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the story of Hollywood one film 
at a time and this time out it 

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is an absolute all timer. 
Isn't it? 

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Certainly is. 
Hitchcock screeching strings. 

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The madness of Mother. 
Strap in, we're telling you the 

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story behind Psycho. 
Massive. 

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Yeah. 
Huge. 

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Before we pull off the highway, 
though, should we talk about our

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own little roadside operation? 
Let's do that, yes? 

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Not quite as creepy, hopefully. 
It's. 

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Perfectly safe. 
I mean, the way you've described

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it is, let's be honest. 
Little roadside operation. 

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Don't like that? 
Well, if you like all the right 

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movies, you can help support us 
by becoming an ATRM Patron. 

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Patrons get access to our bonus 
podcast episode called Double 

28
00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:50,560
Feature where we talk 2 films to
decide which makes the shortlist

29
00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:53,880
for our main show, as well as 
the watch list where we review 

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00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:57,080
new releases and hidden gems. 
And you also get to vote on 

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00:01:57,080 --> 00:01:59,720
future episodes, get your 
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the Month as well as become part

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00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:04,640
of our fantastic community of 
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Wow, loads more as well. 
So to find out more, visit 

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patreon.com/all the Right Movies
or you can subscribe directly on

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Apple Podcasts, Spotify or 
YouTube. 

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Yes you can. 
A better investment than $40,000

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in an envelope even. 
Oh yeah, that's much better. 

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So back to today though, it is 
psycho. 

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You put this one up, Matt. 
So why are we talking about it? 

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I mean, first of all, this is 
only the second time we've 

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covered Hitchcock, so if we're 
going to cover them again, where

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else would we go but Psycho? 
Because how many films can you 

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genuinely say it just completely
ripped up the real book of what 

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to expect? 
Because this is certainly one of

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them for so many reasons. 
We'll get into cinema was just 

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never the same after this one. 
And it's a film where even if 

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you haven't seen it, you have 
seen it because it influences 

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everywhere. 
The music, the shower scene, 

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Norman Bates, we all know about 
this one. 

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And ultimately, John, to be 
honest, we don't even need the 

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section why we talked about 
Psycho, because it's Psycho. 

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Yeah, well, I'll just skip it 
then, should I? 

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Yeah. 
Yeah, skip it. 

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That miles easier. 
Just three 10s. 

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That's it. 
Wrap it up. 

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You'll find out. 
Sure, just whatever. 

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Yeah, I mean, this is one of 
those films that probably, like 

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a lot of people, I knew Lords 
about before I ever saw it, knew

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about Norman Bates, his mother, 
the motel, the shower, 

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obviously. 
And when I did first watch it, 

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like in my 20s, I think it kind 
of felt like watching a museum 

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piece in some ways. 
All these images that I knew 

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that were just like burned in 
the popular culture. 

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I've also read the source 
material as well, the original 

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novel. 
But it's the movie that everyone

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knows, obviously. 
And I mean, in terms of status 

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of a film, they say it's about 
as big as it gets. 

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One of Hollywood's most 
legendary directors at the peak 

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of his powers, possibly his most
acclaimed film, massively 

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influential. 
One of the most famous single 

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scenes to ever come out of 
Hollywood and plenty of others 

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in there as well. 
And one of the most famous 

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villains. 
And for us, a great one to go 

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behind the scenes on because how
Hitchcock came to be involved 

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and then the craft behind what 
he did. 

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It's all fascinating and I've no
doubt we're going to have some 

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huge opinions on this as well, 
so if all that's your thing, 

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stick around for it. 
Definitely. 

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And Westie, how about you and 
Psycho? 

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Very similar to you guys. 
I'm just going to echo the 

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statements to be totally fair. 
I mean, it was huge film. 

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I watched this one when I was 
about 9 or 10 I think. 

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Wow, get this on cycles on 
right. 

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Great. 
And I had just remember vividly 

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just trying to guess what was 
going on, guess who, who was 

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going to be the psycho. 
And it was just like a really 

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exciting film for us to watch at
that age. 

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I'd seen like Night of the 
Living Dead, I think around 

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about the same time. 
So I was like the black and 

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white films and that kind of old
feel to it. 

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But I mean, it is so 
influential. 

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It is so brilliant. 
It is so accomplished. 

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It is so confident. 
I mean, Hitchcock's known for 

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his suspense in his horror work.
This is his first horror film. 

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It's just a real RIP roar of a 
ride. 

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It's two films in one, if you're
into that. 

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It's it's just it's got 
everything. 

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It's absolutely fantastic piece 
of work. 

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So Psycho was produced by 
Chamelee Productions, 

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distributed by Paramount 
Pictures, and released on 

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September the 8th, 1960. 
Filmed at Universal Studios and 

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on location around California 
and Phoenix, AZ. 

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It was directed by Alfred 
Hitchcock, written by Joseph 

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Stefano, based on Robert Block's
novel of the same name, and 

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stars Janet Lee as Marion Crane,
Anthony Perkins as Norman Bates,

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Vera Miles as Lila Crane, John 
Governors, Sam Loomis and Martin

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Balsam as Milton Arborgast. 
Arbo, Gassed, as I'll be calling

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him. 
Arbo, Yeah. 

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I love that sheriff, he's great.
Yeah, he's amazing. 

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Let's get checked in then, shall
we? 

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Let's do it. 
Let's do it. 

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It's a Friday afternoon in 
Phoenix and $40,000 is about to 

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go missing. 
It's the beginning of Psycho. 

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The beginning. 
Psycho opens with one of the 

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most famous first acts in 
cinema. 

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We're going to be talking about 
the base motel and our 

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introduction to its proprietor, 
Norman. 

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But first, it's the heroine side
of the story. 

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It is. 
So we begin in a hotel room with

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real estate office worker Marian
Crane on her lunch break with 

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boyfriend Sam Loomis. 
Marian steals $40,000 from her 

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boss as you do, hits the 
highway, is tailed by a cop and 

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buys a new motor. 
Yeah, an eventful opening for 

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Miss Crane, Matt. 
So let's start at the start, 

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should we? 
Let's do it. 

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I mean, yeah. 
I mean, first of all, that 

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credit sequence, it's like 
you're being assaulted by the 

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music straight away. 
And those visuals, that credit 

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sequence, you're just pummeled 
into the back of your signal. 

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Like, where is this going 
straight away at this pace? 

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And then you just follow that up
with that elaborate camera, move

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into the hotel room where we see
Marian and Sam have been having 

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some afternoon delight. 
And I mean, Marian, she can lick

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my stamps every day of the week.
That's absolutely. 

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Fine. 
Didn't know where that was going

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there. 
It's a. 

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Good job. 
He said it really quickly. 

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Just in case you have to put it 
out. 

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Yeah. 
But so you see, this would have 

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been so shocking for a 1960s 
audience. 

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I mean, that is practically full
nudity by those standards back 

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then, Like in the having an 
extramarital affair. 

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Even if Sam is technically not 
with his wife. 

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This is scandalous stuff. 
And then considering the film's 

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title, it just leaves so many 
possibilities of where this 

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could go. 
I mean, Psycho, is that going to

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be the wife? 
Is it Sam? 

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So much intrigue already. 
And considering the day that 

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comes up on screen, Friday, 
December 11th, is this 

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technically a Christmas film? 
I know. 

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Yeah. 
I think it could be. 

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Yeah. 
I mean, it's a stunning opening 

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shot, that Phoenix cityscape. 
The book actually starts with 

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Norman reading a book, getting 
shouted at by his mother. 

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But different medium, obviously.
And Hitchcock does what he does 

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all the way through. 
He makes it cinematic with that 

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wide shot. 
But, yeah, the opening scene 

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between Marion and Sam in 1960, 
Right, Mark? 

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This had to be one of the 
sexiest openers ever, surely? 

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It's sizzling. 
But then narratively, it's all 

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about setting up Marion's 
motivations. 

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I think because Sam's broke, he 
can't marry her. 

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He only meets her in cheap 
hotels on lunch breaks. 

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Sleazy fella. 
So when the $40,000 turns up 

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later, you kind of get why she 
do what she does. 

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And when that happens back at 
the office, Tom Cassidy, the guy

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with the 40K, now he's a sleazy 
fella. 

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Stinks. 
Marion's got no time for his 

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shit. 
No, none at all. 

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She goes to say Larry, your boss
to tell him she's poorly and 

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going home. 
And Tom, just like, interrupts 

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Larry and says, yeah, she can 
go. 

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What's it got to do with him? 
Yeah. 

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I'm taking him out drinking, he 
owns the place. 

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The only thing is what Marian 
says. 

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I'm going to spend this weekend 
in bed. 

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I can't believe Tom doesn't make
some sleazeball comments about 

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it. 
She doesn't give them time to 

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straight out the door. 
But it's all great set up. 

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In 2 scenes we get Marian's love
life, her professional life, a 

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situation and a motivation for 
taking the money. 

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It's great, like tight writing 
and always engaging as well. 

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And she's miserable everywhere. 
Nobody knows. 

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Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. 
And those animated opening 

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credit sequence that was created
by Saul Bass, the legendary 

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Hollywood graphic designer. 
He'd already worked with 

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Hitchcock and done the credit 
sequences for Vertigo and North 

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00:08:36,400 --> 00:08:38,480
by Northwest. 
And on Psycho. 

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Bass created the titles to 
animate in and out with what he 

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called a shredding effect, which
he said was to represent a 

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stabbing knife. 
And also Norman split 

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personality. 
Brilliant that. 

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How great. 
All those credits. 

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It's often like a black screen. 
The first thing we hear are the 

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00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:55,720
screeching strings on the score.
I'm on edge before I've ever 

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00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:57,160
even seen anything. 
Yeah. 

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00:08:57,280 --> 00:08:59,880
And the titles by Boss. 
It's just music, words and some 

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00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:02,280
fairly simple animations. 
But somehow it's like, 

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00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:05,280
terrifying. 
Just brilliant work from Boss. 

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00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:07,000
We'll come back to him quite a 
bit in this episode. 

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00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:09,760
They couldn't get rid of him. 
He does a bit, yeah. 

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00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:12,960
Direct loads, isn't he? 
Yeah, apparently. 

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00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:16,720
Hitchcock originally wanted the 
opening shot to be a sweeping 

205
00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:18,760
helicopter shot flying over 
Phoenix. 

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00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:21,600
It would zoom in from above the 
streets, through an open window 

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00:09:21,600 --> 00:09:24,200
and right into the bedroom where
Marion and Sam are on the bed. 

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00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:27,160
The technology didn't exist at 
the time, though, so Hitchcock 

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00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:30,160
and his Day P John L Russell had
the idea to shooting in a series

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of dissolves getting closer to 
the hotel, which was the 

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Jefferson Hotel in Phoenix. 
Yeah, still works well, doesn't 

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00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:37,040
it? 
Of course it does. 

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00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:38,960
Incredible. 
It's a bit jittery, but I mean, 

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00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:40,360
I'm not going to say anything 
about that. 

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00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:42,600
It's 1960. 
Yeah, yeah, Yeah, it is a bit, 

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00:09:42,920 --> 00:09:46,400
although Gus Van Zandt pulled 
off in his 1998 remake, so 

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better. 
Obviously only thing he did pull

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00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:52,840
off in the remake. 
Also, on that opening shot, I 

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love the title cards of location
and date, like sliding in and 

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00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:56,360
out. 
Yeah. 

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00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:58,320
And then the pan and zoom into 
the hotel window. 

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00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:01,320
Surely that's inspired by the 
opening of last weekend by Billy

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00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:03,000
Wilder. 
It was so similar. 

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00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:03,600
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

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00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:07,240
Yeah, and one of Hitchcock's 
famous trademarks as a director 

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was that he usually appeared 
somewhere in his films in the 

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00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:12,120
small cameo. 
And as Camio, he comes at the 

228
00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:13,800
start of the scene in Marion's 
office. 

229
00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:16,800
We've mentioned when Marion 
walks in, we see Hitchcock 

230
00:10:16,800 --> 00:10:18,840
through the window, standing on 
the pavement outside. 

231
00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:22,120
We do. 
He's wearing a cowboy hat like 

232
00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:23,120
he does. 
Yeah, ludicrous. 

233
00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:25,560
In there. 
That's great, isn't he? 

234
00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:27,440
Yeah. 
But so an interview with 

235
00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:29,960
Hitchcock where he said by this 
point in his career, people were

236
00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:32,400
always looking for the cameo, so
he'd always do it early just to 

237
00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:34,240
get it out of the way and stop 
distracting people from, like, 

238
00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:35,240
the narrative. 
Fair enough. 

239
00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:35,800
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

240
00:10:35,920 --> 00:10:38,240
So he's straight in. 
There's no way else he could 

241
00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:40,120
possibly fit in this film, let's
be honest. 

242
00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:43,440
There's there's really no, no. 
Unless he's like buying a car or

243
00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:45,520
something in the background. 
But then even at that point the 

244
00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:47,840
tensions up, isn't it? 
So yeah, yeah, it's the right 

245
00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:49,480
place. 
Yeah, it absolutely is. 

246
00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:52,960
And we see a second Hitchcock 
cameo in the same office scene, 

247
00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:56,040
but it's not Alfred this time. 
His daughter Patricia plays 

248
00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:59,960
Marion's Co worker Caroline. 
She does his only child and she 

249
00:10:59,960 --> 00:11:01,480
says about Tom. 
He was flirting with you. 

250
00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:03,040
I guess he must have known it as
my wedding ring. 

251
00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:03,840
That's. 
Brilliant. 

252
00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,160
The confidence. 
Yeah, obviously I'm. 

253
00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:08,120
I'm gorgeous. 
Yeah, because I'm married. 

254
00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:08,840
You're not. 
Yeah. 

255
00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:10,160
Yeah. 
That's amazing. 

256
00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:13,280
I love her confidence. 
She was also in Hitchcock, Stage

257
00:11:13,280 --> 00:11:16,080
Fright and strangers are trained
Patricia three of his films. 

258
00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:18,840
Yes, yeah. 
In the opening scene with Sam, 

259
00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:22,120
we see Marian is wearing a white
bra, then gets dressed in an all

260
00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:23,800
white outfit with a white 
handbag. 

261
00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:26,920
But after she steals the money, 
we see her at home getting ready

262
00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:30,160
to leave and she's dressed in a 
black bra with darker outfit. 

263
00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:33,120
The costume supervisor was Helen
Colbig and she said the colour 

264
00:11:33,120 --> 00:11:36,560
change was to signify Marian's 
shift from innocence to being a 

265
00:11:36,560 --> 00:11:38,280
criminal, which is brilliant. 
Love that. 

266
00:11:38,680 --> 00:11:40,200
Subtle, isn't it? 
George Lucas. 

267
00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:43,560
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
Black and white foam as well, 

268
00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:48,920
really subtle, no grey area. 
But that scene in Marion, how 

269
00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,320
good are the visuals? 
I mean, John Lee and I brought, 

270
00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:53,680
obviously, but we panned down 
from Marion to reveal the 

271
00:11:53,680 --> 00:11:56,320
$40,000 on the bed. 
So she's kept it and then away 

272
00:11:56,320 --> 00:11:57,840
to the left to show her packed 
suitcase. 

273
00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:00,000
So she's doing one. 
Love that in one shot. 

274
00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:02,200
Yeah, he does that all the way 
through the film, doesn't he? 

275
00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:03,880
He does. 
It's very similar one for that, 

276
00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:06,000
yeah, Yeah. 
So straight after that, she's 

277
00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:08,280
taking the money, she's on the 
run, and she's got to ditch this

278
00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:11,280
car because there's a lovely 
moment when that cop turns up 

279
00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:12,560
and there's a little bit of back
and forth. 

280
00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:14,320
But I love the kind of cat and 
mouse. 

281
00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:16,200
He's in the rearview mirror. 
He's following her. 

282
00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:18,520
She's got to get out of there. 
How it says Arizona on her 

283
00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:21,360
license plate, and he just turns
off the road just at the right 

284
00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:23,080
time. 
Yeah, it's kind of tension 

285
00:12:23,080 --> 00:12:24,000
building. 
I love that. 

286
00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:25,800
But it's the back and forth 
here. 

287
00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:27,960
I mean, California, Charlie, 
what a boy. 

288
00:12:28,560 --> 00:12:30,520
What a name. 
He's some boys. 

289
00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:33,760
He just leans out of the office 
with his Bobo tire. 

290
00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:36,480
Who are you going to say? 
He's great? 

291
00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:38,640
Absolutely love him. 
But I love the way she gets the 

292
00:12:38,640 --> 00:12:40,720
newspaper she's reading that 
that's what's going to hide the 

293
00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:42,760
money in later on. 
So it's ramping up the paranoia.

294
00:12:42,760 --> 00:12:45,320
That's really good. 
Do anything you have in mind. 

295
00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:47,280
You're a woman, you're going to 
it's like, well, come on, it's a

296
00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:51,600
bit forward straight away, but 
she is in this hurry and it's 

297
00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:54,080
great because you've got the cop
then turns up and he's standing 

298
00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:56,320
on the other side of the street.
And when I watched this and I 

299
00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:58,920
was like 9 or 10 years old, I 
was like, that's him, that's the

300
00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:01,560
psycho, that's the cop there. 
He's going to going to start 

301
00:13:01,560 --> 00:13:03,160
killing everybody. 
It's going to be like maniac 

302
00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:05,480
cop, which I've seen around the 
same time I think, which is 

303
00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,040
insane. 
It's great because you there is 

304
00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:10,400
this tension ramp domain. 
She does buy that car incredibly

305
00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:12,480
quickly. 
I mean, she gets a new 1 + 700 

306
00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:14,320
dollars. 
Then it's just these like, 

307
00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:15,800
little questions that really 
work. 

308
00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:17,400
It's kind of, can you prove this
car is yours? 

309
00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:19,280
Yes, I've got everything. 
And you just think, well, this 

310
00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:22,080
is obviously so suspicious, but 
she explains her way out of it 

311
00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:24,160
perfectly. 
Is it not all right to just be 

312
00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:25,880
in a hurry and get another car? 
Like what? 

313
00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:27,960
What's the problem? 
So yeah, but it's not normally 

314
00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:30,960
what would happen. 
Everything's just so guilty, but

315
00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:34,080
there's just no evidence, which 
I think is really brilliant 

316
00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:35,800
about this scene because you 
can't stop her. 

317
00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:38,360
But at the same time, you know 
that something is definitely 

318
00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:39,960
wrong. 
We know it's definitely wrong 

319
00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:42,640
because all these three guys 
line up when the when the 

320
00:13:42,640 --> 00:13:45,120
mechanic puts a suitcase in, 
you've got the mechanic, you've 

321
00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:47,400
got California Charlie, and then
you've got the the cop and they 

322
00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:51,520
stand as like 3 bad guys. 
They're just blaring down on her

323
00:13:51,520 --> 00:13:53,240
and just want to just prove 
something. 

324
00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:55,680
Absolutely brilliant setup. 
And you just, you're on her 

325
00:13:55,680 --> 00:13:56,560
side. 
Even though she's done 

326
00:13:56,560 --> 00:13:58,400
everything wrong, you're still 
on her side. 

327
00:13:58,400 --> 00:13:59,880
And that's the setup from this, 
this scene. 

328
00:13:59,880 --> 00:14:03,000
It's it's great, great stuff. 
Yeah, there's some beautiful 

329
00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:04,520
motors at the car dealers, isn't
there? 

330
00:14:04,520 --> 00:14:05,560
Oh, yeah. 
Unreal. 

331
00:14:05,840 --> 00:14:07,600
Yeah. 
But I love this whole stretch of

332
00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:09,240
the film where Marion's got the 
money because it's all 

333
00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:11,280
narratively about Marion being, 
like, on the run. 

334
00:14:11,560 --> 00:14:14,200
Larry sees her in the car after 
she said she was ill and the 

335
00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:16,480
cops following her about she 
part exchanges the car. 

336
00:14:16,680 --> 00:14:18,600
I think what it's doing is 
building Marion's guilt and how 

337
00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:21,400
much like, eating away at her. 
And that's why the cops stalking

338
00:14:21,400 --> 00:14:22,960
her. 
He doesn't know what she's done,

339
00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:25,800
but she does, so he's like the 
personification of her guilt, 

340
00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:28,080
following it everywhere. 
Just like genius stuff. 

341
00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:29,760
Yeah, with the black eyes as 
well. 

342
00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:31,280
And there's no, there's no soul 
there. 

343
00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:32,880
Well, that's it. 
That close up with the cops face

344
00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:35,240
when he finds Marion in the car.
That's one of the creepiest 

345
00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:37,320
moments in the film. 
Those like mirrored sunglasses. 

346
00:14:37,520 --> 00:14:39,680
Yeah. 
And he sees to her plenty of 

347
00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:41,400
motels in the area just to be 
safe. 

348
00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:44,120
Worst advice ever in the film 
that surely? 

349
00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:46,000
It's up there, yeah. 
Definitely, yeah. 

350
00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:49,560
And the car dealership Marion 
visits is called California 

351
00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:52,720
Charlie's, as we've said, but it
was founded a real dealership 

352
00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:55,840
called Harry May's used car lot,
which was in North Hollywood. 

353
00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:59,080
And you may have noticed that a 
lot of cars in the lot are made 

354
00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:01,360
by Ford. 
And this is because Ford Motor 

355
00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:04,640
Company was the sponsor of 
Hitchcock's TV show, Alfred 

356
00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:07,160
Hitchcock Presents. 
So the car lot was intentionally

357
00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:09,240
packed with their cars. 
All right, nice. 

358
00:15:09,920 --> 00:15:12,080
Replacement. 
But what's interesting is that 

359
00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:13,600
Marion's doing nothing wrong in 
that moment. 

360
00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:14,920
Like you're saying Westy, but 
Hitchcock. 

361
00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:17,360
Someone makes us feel like she's
like robbing the players blind 

362
00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:19,040
or something. 
Yeah, it's they just want to 

363
00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:20,880
just just going to pull a 
shotgun out as a yeah, yeah, 

364
00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:22,200
yeah. 
I'll tell you what, a Ford 

365
00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:24,040
sponsored that. 
There was not one used car in 

366
00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:24,880
that lot. 
I'm sorry. 

367
00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:28,520
Pristine. 
Yeah, there isn't. 

368
00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:32,640
California, Charlie. 
Some of the most famous shots 

369
00:15:32,640 --> 00:15:35,840
from the film are the close-ups 
on Marion as she's driving often

370
00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:38,080
with the voiceover could 
basically explain what's going 

371
00:15:38,080 --> 00:15:39,760
on in her head which I think a 
fantastic moment. 

372
00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:41,280
Very 60s though but very 
Hitchcock. 

373
00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:44,200
So when the film that get a 
proper actions and facial 

374
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:46,840
expressions, Hitchcock would be 
behind the camera telling Janet 

375
00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,760
Lee what she was doing and 
thinking at every point in the 

376
00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:50,680
shot. 
Great. 

377
00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:52,760
Amazing, yeah. 
With those scenes in the car 

378
00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:54,480
close up on channel. 
Yeah, the voice over where 

379
00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:56,640
Marion's like, imagining 
everyone's found out what she's 

380
00:15:56,640 --> 00:15:57,720
done. 
So good. 

381
00:15:57,760 --> 00:16:00,040
The guilt just like eating away.
That's such a brilliant way to 

382
00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:01,480
do it. 
Didn't you do that? 

383
00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:04,080
When you're driving and say I've
got the radio on, you just start

384
00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:06,720
spinning everything you've done 
in the last 20 minutes. 

385
00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:08,440
It's like, oh, did I say the 
right thing? 

386
00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:10,520
If I'm pissed off this time, 
yeah. 

387
00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:16,240
So that's Marion on the run. 
A white bra, $40,000 a black bra

388
00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:17,640
and a cop in the rearview 
mirror. 

389
00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:20,280
I think she needs somewhere to 
stop for the night, don't you? 

390
00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:23,040
That's the last thing she needs.
Yeah, just keep on driving. 

391
00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:25,760
Safer with California Charlie in
the toilet. 

392
00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:32,880
Caught in the downpour, Marion 
pulls off the highway and sees a

393
00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:35,720
flickering neon sign. 
Bates Motel vacancy. 

394
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,680
She checks in and it's here we 
meet the guy who runs it, Norman

395
00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:39,960
Bates. 
Actually, some of the most 

396
00:16:39,960 --> 00:16:43,000
famous scenes in the film as 
Norman talks to then spies on 

397
00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:45,960
Marion. 
Yeah, he's a strange chap, 

398
00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:46,920
Norman. 
Isn't he mad A. 

399
00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:49,560
Little bit, yeah. 
But how are the first scenes in 

400
00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:52,880
the motel? 
I mean, how great is that reveal

401
00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:56,200
if the house on the hill just 
looming over the motel it's. 

402
00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:58,520
Pretty great. 
Just looks malignant. 

403
00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:01,840
And I think having the house and
the motel separate, but they're 

404
00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:03,560
still linked together really 
closely. 

405
00:17:03,960 --> 00:17:06,760
I think it's just this great 
visual representation of Norman 

406
00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:09,920
and his mother because he can go
to the motel to work as often as

407
00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:12,200
he wants to, but he'll never 
truly escape her. 

408
00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:14,480
She's always watching over him 
from that house. 

409
00:17:14,839 --> 00:17:16,400
It's like a church in a 
graveyard, isn't it? 

410
00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:17,880
It. 
Is it's totally got that vibe 

411
00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:20,920
that it totally does. 
And then in retrospect, like 

412
00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:24,400
it's so chilling when Marion 
sees mother as we think walk 

413
00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:27,079
past the window and silhouette 
because it just looks so 

414
00:17:27,079 --> 00:17:28,960
innocuous. 
But no one it's actually Norman 

415
00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:30,800
dressed up. 
It's just spine chill and stuff 

416
00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:33,560
when you come back. 
It's not Michael Jordan cut out 

417
00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:39,320
from home alone. 
And then we probably meet 

418
00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:40,840
Norman. 
And at first he's got all the 

419
00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:43,880
powder and charming, all the 12 
cabins, 12 vacancies thing. 

420
00:17:44,360 --> 00:17:47,200
But it just starts to chip away 
slowly at this first perception 

421
00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:49,920
that this guy's all right. 
I mean, the way he hesitates 

422
00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:53,480
over the number three key before
giving her number 1 so she could

423
00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:56,000
be next to the parlour for 
reasons we'll shortly talk 

424
00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,640
about, and then showing around. 
And he, he can't bring himself 

425
00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:01,160
to say the word bathroom. 
He can't even look at it. 

426
00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:03,960
Just Jesse's at it and kind of 
goes right. 

427
00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:06,960
Yeah, great introduction to him.
It really is. 

428
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:09,520
It's just a master class in like
building dread for me because 

429
00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:12,120
you've got Marion driving in the
rain, just the rain hammering on

430
00:18:12,120 --> 00:18:13,960
the windshield. 
It's such a great visual anyway.

431
00:18:14,360 --> 00:18:16,920
And then the music cuts, the 
Bates Motel sign comes into 

432
00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:19,280
view, and suddenly it's like 
somewhere else entirely. 

433
00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:22,040
And the check in itself, I find 
that quite tough to watch now, 

434
00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:23,520
probably because we know what's 
coming. 

435
00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:25,680
But that moment you mentioned, 
Matt, when Norman wishes for the

436
00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:28,000
key for Room 3. 
As he does that, Marion says 

437
00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:30,600
she's from Los Angeles, and 
Norman then goes for Key 1 

438
00:18:30,600 --> 00:18:32,720
instead. 
So is that the moment he decides

439
00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:34,560
to kill her or just the moment 
he decides to spy on her? 

440
00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:36,760
I'm not sure. 
But either way, minding the 

441
00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:39,400
gunner for Norman, and I mean 
Anthony Perkins. 

442
00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:41,440
We'll talk about him properly, 
obviously, but from the first 

443
00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:43,880
scene he is perfection as 
Norman. 

444
00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:46,800
He is. 
So the scene after the check in,

445
00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:49,800
Marion goes to her room and over
he's Norman arguing with his 

446
00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:51,640
mother. 
We find out he's arguing with 

447
00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:54,560
himself, obviously, but to hide 
the twist, Hitchcock did some 

448
00:18:54,560 --> 00:18:56,120
things to misdirect the 
audience. 

449
00:18:57,320 --> 00:18:59,200
She's got a loud voice, Missus 
Bates, hasn't she? 

450
00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:02,320
Booming voice right the way down
to the motel. 

451
00:19:03,200 --> 00:19:04,760
It's funny when Norman's like 
mother. 

452
00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:07,440
She's just a stranger. 
As if men don't desire 

453
00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:12,240
strangers. 
So Hitchcock had a chair on set 

454
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:14,720
throughout filming which had 
Missus Bates written on the back

455
00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:16,880
of it. 
So anyone visiting thought that 

456
00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:18,360
the was an act was playing the 
part. 

457
00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:21,360
And he told the press that 
either Helen Hayes or Judith 

458
00:19:21,360 --> 00:19:23,400
Anderson would be hired to play 
Missus Bates. 

459
00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:26,680
She played in Missus Danvers in 
Rebecca, Judith Anderson, so 

460
00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:29,680
there was a link there. 
And apparently Norma Varden, who

461
00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:32,240
was in Strangers on Our Train, 
she read those reports and 

462
00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:33,560
thought they were real. 
And she got on Twitch with 

463
00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:35,600
Hitchcock to say that she wanted
to play Missus Bates. 

464
00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:37,720
Right. 
Yeah. 

465
00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:40,320
Fooled by? 
It and the voice of Mother that 

466
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:43,760
we hear was provided by three 
different performers, Virginia 

467
00:19:43,760 --> 00:19:46,640
Greg and Jeanette Nolan, who had
both appeared on Alfred 

468
00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:49,120
Hitchcock Presents, and Paul 
Jasmine, who had been 

469
00:19:49,120 --> 00:19:51,800
recommended by Anthony Perkins. 
That's right. 

470
00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:54,000
So their voices were sometimes 
mixed together to give it a bit 

471
00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:57,480
of an off kilter sound, right? 
A lot of it was Virginia Greg 

472
00:19:57,480 --> 00:19:58,920
though. 
She delivers the famous 

473
00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:02,200
monologue in the final scene and
she also did the voice of Mother

474
00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:04,840
in Psycho 2 and Psycho 3 as 
well. 

475
00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:07,000
Right, right. 
Was it not Thomas S Wilson? 

476
00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:08,840
She did the voice of his 
grandmother in About the Future 

477
00:20:08,840 --> 00:20:09,560
2. 
Yeah, yeah. 

478
00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:11,480
That's. 
A massive RIP of. 

479
00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:13,600
Good food tanning. 
Good food tanning. 

480
00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:20,520
So from there, he offers to make
us some food, you know, nothing 

481
00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:22,760
much, just sandwiches and milk. 
I mean, I would like I'll leave 

482
00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:23,880
the milk if that's all right 
with you. 

483
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:25,240
That sounds that sounds 
horrible. 

484
00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:27,080
To be fair, in cling film as 
well. 

485
00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:31,800
Now, going in the parlour, this 
should be a bit of a red flag. 

486
00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:33,440
There's just stuffed birds 
everywhere. 

487
00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,600
It's a massive owl leer and over
his shoulder like he stuffs 

488
00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:38,840
things. 
But there's so much of A reveal 

489
00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:41,800
about the character here. 
I mean, you say that that Norman

490
00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:45,280
Bates as a character is perfect 
from the start, and this whole 

491
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:48,600
sequence just adds to it and 
just adds layer upon layer of 

492
00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:51,280
confusion, but at the same time,
real sympathy for him. 

493
00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:53,920
But you know, you get everything
you need to know on the second 

494
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,760
watch from this moment. 
They're both completely lost. 

495
00:20:57,080 --> 00:20:58,440
They both want to find something
else. 

496
00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:00,320
They both want to disappear. 
They're both unhappy with the 

497
00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:02,720
lives. 
She tries to move on the best 

498
00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:04,760
way that you can, and she can't 
at the end of it. 

499
00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:06,720
And she ultimately repents and 
wants to go back. 

500
00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:10,400
Norman can't escape and he 
really wants to and the way that

501
00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:12,720
he talks about stuff in the 
birds because the passive to 

502
00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:15,720
begin with, he just attacks the 
passive things that are around, 

503
00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,080
which is what she is. 
He describes her as a bird. 

504
00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:20,720
So you or it's already this set 
up that she's going to be 

505
00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:22,920
killed. 
It's just absolutely fantastic. 

506
00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:25,520
And then when he starts talking 
about his mother, that switches 

507
00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:27,640
to that shot and that shot's 
fucking excellent where he's 

508
00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:29,680
just in the bottom right hand 
corner of the flame in that 

509
00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:32,640
owl's over his shoulder. 
There's a security camera which 

510
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:34,960
represents his mother watching 
over him. 

511
00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:38,240
So, so brilliant. 
And what this does is it really 

512
00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:41,320
sells the mother as a character.
You then believe that this 

513
00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:43,960
person exists. 
You believe that you're going to

514
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:46,080
see this person. 
And it just ends on one of the 

515
00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:47,760
most famous lines. 
You know, we all go a little mad

516
00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:51,000
sometimes and we're all in the 
same boat and we're all the same

517
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:53,600
at the end of the day. 
It's a brilliant back and forth.

518
00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:56,680
Really, really creepy. 
Loads of red flags in there. 

519
00:21:56,680 --> 00:21:58,160
A boy's best friend is his 
mother. 

520
00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:00,160
Get the fuck out. 
Leave. 

521
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:04,360
Leave immediately from that. 
Like, I mean, yeah, you would 

522
00:22:04,360 --> 00:22:06,640
probably think that, but there's
no way you would say that to a 

523
00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:07,440
girl. 
Well, that you're quite 

524
00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:08,600
attracted to that. 
You've just met. 

525
00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:11,360
You've given her a sandwich. 
Oh, me Mum's be best made by the

526
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:12,880
by the way. 
Oh, really? 

527
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:14,760
Your stuffed birds and stuff. 
Yeah. 

528
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:15,840
You're here by yourself. 
Yeah. 

529
00:22:15,840 --> 00:22:16,880
There's nobody else here. 
No. 

530
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:17,680
Right. 
I'll see you later. 

531
00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:21,160
And the way that it's played 
back to him as well by Janet Lee

532
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:23,920
is just incredible. 
Both of them are absolutely 

533
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:26,040
fired and all cylinders here and
you buy it. 

534
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,280
Hook, line and singer. 
You're into this film from this 

535
00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:30,120
point. 
Absolutely. 

536
00:22:30,120 --> 00:22:32,680
I mean, it's just two people 
talking and barely moving it 

537
00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:35,240
all, but it's so tense and so 
well put together. 

538
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:38,000
It's how the scene develops A 
narrative that blows me away 

539
00:22:38,120 --> 00:22:40,160
because this is where the 
narrative starts to shift and 

540
00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:42,600
where Hitchcock transfers the 
role of main character from 

541
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:45,520
Marion to Norman, which is 
basically at the start, just two

542
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:48,160
static shots, one on Norm and 
one on Marion. 

543
00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:50,360
But the way they develop it 
visually is great. 

544
00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:52,720
The first time Marion mentioned 
Mother, you mentioned the West. 

545
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,000
He had cuts to a different shot 
of Norman, that one framed under

546
00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:57,280
the owl. 
Then it switches again when 

547
00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:00,000
Marion suggests putting Mother 
in some place, I think she says.

548
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:02,840
And then Norman's shot from this
really weird low angle where 

549
00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:05,400
Marion's shot at high level. 
So she shot from Norman's point 

550
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:07,360
of view, but Norman isn't shot 
from hers. 

551
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:09,840
So it's visually starting to put
us in Norman's shoes. 

552
00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:11,560
Yeah. 
And this is when Marion makes 

553
00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:14,280
her decision to go back home, so
her arc's basically done. 

554
00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:17,560
And then she tells Norm her 
name's Crane when he knows she's

555
00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:20,080
written Samuels in the logbook, 
so he knows there's a good 

556
00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:21,480
chance no one knows where she 
is. 

557
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:23,000
So it's all there in the writing
as well. 

558
00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:25,760
Yeah, which is also a bird. 
It's a formed bird. 

559
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:28,240
And it's weird when he's when 
he's leaning against it and he's

560
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:30,240
like a hobby should take some of
the time, not all of the time, 

561
00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:31,800
but he's just stroking one of 
them. 

562
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,600
Get the fucking. 
Out get another red flag, yeah. 

563
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:38,280
Yeah. 
But it's all just masterful. 

564
00:23:38,360 --> 00:23:40,320
It's like the example if I was 
switching narrative from 

565
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:42,760
focusing on one character to 
another and it's all done in 

566
00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:44,120
just one scene. 
It's crazy. 

567
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:46,280
Absolutely, there's so many red 
flags in this. 

568
00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:47,480
It's a good job it's a black 
mite. 

569
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,720
And then after this, she goes to
her room and then we see Norman 

570
00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:55,320
being a dirty little Peeping 
Tom. 

571
00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:58,680
He's a peeping Tom. 
He's a peeping Tom. 

572
00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,800
As we're saying, red flags with 
this guy out of the chimney, to 

573
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:04,440
be honest, but this is the first
one. 

574
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:07,360
We think this is actually 
dangerous now and Marion is in 

575
00:24:07,360 --> 00:24:10,240
big trouble. 
And just that huge close up of 

576
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:12,640
his eye staring at Marion. 
That might be the most 

577
00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:15,800
Hitchcockian image ever. 
Yeah, those close up was 

578
00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:17,920
Norman's eye. 
How good are those shots? 

579
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:20,040
They're ridiculous. 
How many times have you seen 

580
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:21,840
those as a film makers copy that
as well. 

581
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:23,840
Yeah, too many. 
Scorsese. 

582
00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:25,040
He uses it in good feathers, 
doesn't he? 

583
00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:28,480
He does, yeah. 
Norman spies on marrying by 

584
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:31,160
taking a patent off the wall to 
reveal the people behind it. 

585
00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:34,680
The painting is Susanna and the 
Elders which is a great name for

586
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:36,520
an all female punk band if 
you're looking for a name. 

587
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:38,360
It really is. 
That's absolutely. 

588
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:44,120
Which was by William Van 
Milleris and either 1691 or 

589
00:24:44,120 --> 00:24:47,040
1731. 
It shows the Old Testament story

590
00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:50,280
of two elderly men spying on a 
young woman bathing, reflecting 

591
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:52,680
Norman, spying on Marion. 
Disgusting. 

592
00:24:53,120 --> 00:24:55,760
Yeah, so it was from Hitchcock's
own personal art collection, 

593
00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:56,760
apparently. 
It was. 

594
00:24:56,920 --> 00:24:59,280
Yeah, yeah. 
No idea how to use it the same 

595
00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:01,960
way Norman does. 
People all behind it, who knows?

596
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,960
And then after marrying eats 
with Norman, she adds up the 

597
00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:08,480
money she has on a piece of 
paper and then flushes it down 

598
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:11,080
the toilet. 
Now, the haze cord was still in 

599
00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:13,880
practice at the time and 
restricted toilets being flushed

600
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,120
on screen for some reason. 
But the writer Joseph Stefano 

601
00:25:17,120 --> 00:25:20,160
wanted to break that taboo. 
So Hitchcock told him make it 

602
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:22,240
integral to the plot so that it 
couldn't be removed. 

603
00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,920
And this is the first film that 
shows the target being flushed 

604
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:26,360
on screen. 
Wow. 

605
00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:29,120
Yeah, more shocking than the 
murder it was at the time. 

606
00:25:29,120 --> 00:25:30,360
How mad that. 
Yeah. 

607
00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:34,680
People gaspered, probably 
gaspered at how simple that 

608
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:38,040
fucking sum was for the grand 
-700 dead dead. 

609
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:40,120
Straightforward that. 
Terrible at maths marriage. 

610
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:43,400
Isn't it? 
Oh fucking I've ripped this up. 

611
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:47,360
Well, before we head for a much 
needed shower, we've got a 

612
00:25:47,360 --> 00:25:49,080
question from our ATR and 
patrons. 

613
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:51,880
It's on the parlor scene and it 
comes from Nathan Lang. 

614
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:53,760
Hello, Nathan. 
Hello, Nathan. 

615
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:56,960
So Nathan says Psycho has to be 
my favorite Hitchcock. 

616
00:25:57,120 --> 00:25:59,800
His use of foreshadowing and 
symbolism is so rich and best 

617
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,520
exemplified in the conversation 
between Marion Crane and Norman 

618
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,280
Bates. 
What are some of your favorite 

619
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:06,440
scenes in movies with just two 
people talking? 

620
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:10,120
It's a good question, Matt. 
So what are your favorite 2 

621
00:26:10,120 --> 00:26:12,560
Honda scenes? 
So I've gone for three. 

622
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:16,120
One of them comes from boyhood, 
the link later film, and there's

623
00:26:16,120 --> 00:26:17,520
lots of talking seeds and that 
obviously. 

624
00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:20,080
But the one I've gone for is 
where Mason, he's gone on a 

625
00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:22,920
fishing trip with his dad, Ethan
Hawke, and they're just talking 

626
00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:25,920
about Star Wars and if they'll 
be any more because that when 

627
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:27,640
they filmed it was before the 
sequels. 

628
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,960
And it's a such a lovely time 
capsule of a moment. 

629
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:33,440
And it perfectly sums up that 
the kind of father son 

630
00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:35,440
relationship at that age. 
I think that's a really 

631
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:38,920
beautiful scene next to be 
amazed at Wesley hasn't got 

632
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,600
these, but from Zodiac, 
obviously Tusky and Grace Smith 

633
00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:45,440
in the diner at the end. 
Grace Smith outlined in this 

634
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,640
theory why it's Arthur Lee Allen
and he's got an answer for every

635
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:51,560
single one at Toski's questions.
I walked it. 

636
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:56,040
Jesus Christ, just amazing. 
Door to door, it's great door to

637
00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:56,840
door. 
Yeah. 

638
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:58,320
Thank you. 
Thank you for breakfast. 

639
00:26:58,480 --> 00:26:59,800
Yeah, every time you're that 
one. 

640
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,640
And then last one is the Shining
Jack and Grady in the bathroom. 

641
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:07,360
How the balance of power just 
shifts between those two 

642
00:27:07,360 --> 00:27:09,480
characters. 
Yeah, nice, because Grady sorts 

643
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:11,760
off all Bond and oh, sorry, Sir,
because he spilled the drink on 

644
00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:13,520
him. 
But he just becomes more and 

645
00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:16,520
more evil and he gets Jack under
his complete control by the end 

646
00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:18,600
of it, when he's talking about 
his wife and children, killing 

647
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:21,280
them. 
I corrected them too. 

648
00:27:22,120 --> 00:27:24,120
Yeah, it's that red on the 
walls. 

649
00:27:24,120 --> 00:27:27,000
It's incredible use of colour. 
Yeah, yeah, amazing, brilliant 

650
00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:29,360
ones for me. 
I haven't got any of them. 

651
00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:31,960
Oh wow, really it? 
Isn't so I've got I've got 

652
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:35,800
another four that that I felt 
was so cliched that you might 

653
00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:37,200
have had them anyway. 
So I was kind of like, we're 

654
00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:39,960
going to cross on this. 
My favorite 2 hander is hands 

655
00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:41,280
Lander. 
What do you think of that one? 

656
00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:44,600
So Inglorious Basterds, the open
sequence, of course, Christopher

657
00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:47,960
Wilson and Dennis Minoche is 
absolutely fantastic that. 

658
00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:49,640
One of the best. 
Back and forth of power is 

659
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:51,880
unreal. 
The scene we're all waiting for 

660
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,920
was Pacino and De Niro. 
Button heads in heat of course 

661
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:57,040
in the cafe. 
Absolutely love that scene. 

662
00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,840
It's incredible. 
Hopkins and Foster, the first 

663
00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:03,240
time that she meets Hannibal 
Lecter in Silence of the Lambs, 

664
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:07,160
I think to absolutely shine in 
that wonderful. 

665
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:09,000
And another back and forth 
that's beautifully written by 

666
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:12,080
Tarantino again is Hopper and 
Walking and True Romance. 

667
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:15,760
I think that's is absolutely 
wonderful. 

668
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:16,720
Yeah. 
One of my favourites. 

669
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:18,560
Yeah, check them out. 
Absolutely brilliant. 

670
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:20,040
Some great ones there. 
Yeah. 

671
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:23,080
So Maureen has made her decision
to go back to Phoenix. 

672
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,560
She's eaten her sandwich and 
she's worked out her maths. 

673
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:27,880
Time for a shower before she 
heads back home. 

674
00:28:28,360 --> 00:28:30,400
Easy, right? 
Yeah, she'll be knackered after 

675
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:31,560
all that. 
That's skip it. 

676
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:39,560
The director. 
The director of Psycho was one 

677
00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:42,280
of the biggest film making names
in Hollywood, Sir Alfred 

678
00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:44,960
Hitchcock. 
Psycho was his 51st futurist 

679
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:47,760
director with many classics 
under his belt already before 

680
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:50,400
this. 
Some titles, The 39 Steps, 

681
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:53,800
Suspicion, Shadow of a Doubt, 
Notorious Rope, Strangers on a 

682
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:57,680
Train, Dial In for Murder, Rear 
Window to Catch a Thief, The Man

683
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,800
Who Knew Too Much, The Wrong 
Man, Vertigo, and North by 

684
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:03,720
Northwest. 
Wow, not a bad filmography I. 

685
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:05,760
Thought you're going to do all 
51 there. 

686
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:08,320
Don't do the silent ones, that's
fine. 

687
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:09,240
Stop. 
Stop for breath. 

688
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:11,680
I always do the famous ones, and
there were just too many. 

689
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:13,240
Yeah. 
Lords, yeah. 

690
00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:16,600
So Matt Hitch, what do we think 
of his work as director on 

691
00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:19,080
Psycho? 
I mean, I think it's exhibit, 

692
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,680
AY, he was called the mass of 
suspense, isn't it? 

693
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:25,440
And it's the way he manipulates 
the audience for me, because we 

694
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:28,000
start off with marrying, as we 
said, scandalous that she's 

695
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:31,280
having an affair with a married 
man and then she becomes a thief

696
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:33,320
and goes on the run. 
But Hitchcock makes us so 

697
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:36,920
sympathetic that we are 
complicit with her crimes. 

698
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,480
We want her to get away. 
And then she has this change of 

699
00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:42,680
heart and you think, OK, that's 
where her orc is going until no,

700
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:44,880
Hitchcock brutally murders her 
off our way through. 

701
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:47,680
But even then, he doesn't change
the narrative. 

702
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:50,840
So we follow her grieving sister
or the boyfriend or the private 

703
00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:53,000
detective. 
He puts us firmly in the 

704
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:55,480
perspective of the guy who, as 
far as we know at this point, 

705
00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:58,760
has covered the murder up. 
And then we end up really liking

706
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:00,480
him. 
We don't want Orbigas to find 

707
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:02,600
out the truth, we want Norman to
get away with it. 

708
00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:05,720
And then he just flips it all on
his head again at the end when 

709
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:07,320
we find out what's really been 
going on. 

710
00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:10,160
And it's just sleight of hand 
after sleight of hand where he 

711
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:13,120
makes us look one way and then 
completely blind sides us. 

712
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:16,800
And the last thing that I always
get from Psycho, Hitchcock 

713
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:18,720
thinks this is just hilarious to
him. 

714
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:22,000
This is a black comedy. 
Like, the audience is shrieking 

715
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:23,800
and screaming. 
I think he's just got a big 

716
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,240
smile slowly spreading across 
his face. 

717
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,160
I mean, as I said, Norman 
dressed up as as his mother, 

718
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:30,960
walking back and forth talking 
to himself. 

719
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:32,760
It's the funniest thing he's 
ever heard of. 

720
00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:34,840
But he's going to scare us with 
it at the same time. 

721
00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:37,880
And if anyone doubts that, just 
go and watch the original 

722
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:40,640
trailer for this because it's 6 
minutes long and it tells you 

723
00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:42,720
everything you need to know 
about how Hitchcock viewed this 

724
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:44,920
film. 
And it is undisputedly one of 

725
00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:47,280
his masterpieces. 
Yeah, yeah. 

726
00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:49,920
When I was writing notes for 
this section for a while, I was 

727
00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:53,640
like, way on earth, do I start? 
It's just so much, isn't there? 

728
00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:56,880
Yeah, too much. 
The director who did too much, 

729
00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:00,040
that's Hitchcock. 
Something that always strikes me

730
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:03,720
on Psycho, though, is how lean 
it is as a film to compare like 

731
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:06,720
Vertical or North by Northwest. 
Both incredible, but they're way

732
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,400
more like lavish than this cycle
is. 

733
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:11,760
Like Usain Bolt. 
It's like out the gates, done, 

734
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:13,840
boom. 
There's not a wasted second, but

735
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:16,040
it never feels rushed or like 
it's missing anything either. 

736
00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:19,040
And I think that's because when 
the big scenes come, they're all

737
00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:21,000
very different. 
Like the parlour scene we talked

738
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:22,920
about does take its time. 
That's the first time it feels 

739
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:24,320
like we're allowed to breathe in
the film. 

740
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:26,640
Then the shower sequence. 
Absolute chaos. 

741
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:28,920
Arbor gas on the stage is all 
tension. 

742
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:32,000
He knows exactly when they like 
turn the screw and went to step 

743
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:34,480
off the gas a bit more. 
Hitchcock's just like a master 

744
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:38,120
at framing scenes and WADLUP as 
well is just his vision for the 

745
00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:39,800
film. 
The most famous director on the 

746
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:42,200
planet by a long way at this 
time at a time he could be 

747
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,280
coasting. 
He goes, I'm going to make this 

748
00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:47,840
on a fraction of the usual 
budget in black and white, huge 

749
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:49,680
creative choices. 
And I think it's because he 

750
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:51,720
knows the craft. 
He has complete confidence in 

751
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,640
his mastery of the overall skill
of film making. 

752
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:56,800
He might be the best at that. 
I mean, we'll talk about some 

753
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,320
specifics as we go through the 
film, but it all just feels so 

754
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:01,880
fresh as well. 
I mean, Hitchcock was like 60 

755
00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:04,560
years old when he made this, but
it feels like it's still like 

756
00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:07,200
cool and exciting feeling. 
It was made by a talented 30 

757
00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:08,640
year old or something. 
Yeah. 

758
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,160
I mean, yeah, most great 
directors have probably one film

759
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:12,840
where you can go. 
That's his masterpiece. 

760
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:15,360
Hitchhike has about four, and 
this is one of them. 

761
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:17,960
It's just sensational direction 
for me. 

762
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:19,680
Yeah. 
That first thing I've got 

763
00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:22,280
written down is seems like it 
was directed by a younger man 

764
00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:24,600
with more energy and more vigour
and more. 

765
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:27,480
It's just the energy that's 
attached to this is just the 

766
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,200
confidence, like I said, at the 
top, but it's just the 

767
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,800
cleverness as well. 
And he is on top of his game at 

768
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:34,920
this point. 
I mean, 51 films, you're not 

769
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:37,720
supposed to be doing it this 
quickly or have this much 

770
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:39,840
confidence in what you're doing.
You're supposed to be retiring 

771
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,400
by that point easily. 
Just thinking I cannot be 

772
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,440
bothered with this anymore. 
Jesus. 

773
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:47,040
And I've got to do it on a on a 
strip back budget and I've got 

774
00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:48,080
to shoot in black and white 
again. 

775
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:51,120
It's a breath of fresh air. 
It's just like he's taken in a 

776
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:54,440
new release of life. 
There's a new breath of oxygen 

777
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:56,720
here, and he's just absolutely 
filling his lungs with it. 

778
00:32:57,040 --> 00:32:59,360
And what I get from the 
direction of this film, it's not

779
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:02,760
built around the big sequences. 
Then big sequences came later 

780
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:06,240
through audience participation, 
through audience reaction. 

781
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:08,680
He didn't go right. 
I need people there for the 

782
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:10,560
shower scene because otherwise 
it won't work. 

783
00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:13,880
Doesn't matter because you've 
got all of them are peppered 

784
00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:15,680
between. 
Then they've just got incredible

785
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:17,560
scenes that bridge them all 
together. 

786
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:19,880
There's, like John said, there's
not a bit of fat on this. 

787
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:23,240
It zips through and even if you 
miss a couple of scenes, it 

788
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:24,720
doesn't matter. 
You can kind of catch up with 

789
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:25,800
it. 
It's just that clever. 

790
00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:28,080
He hits you with that shower 
sequence and then lets you sit 

791
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,960
with it for a long, long time, 
which was unbeknownst at that 

792
00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:34,320
point in that in 1960. 
To sit with something like that 

793
00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:36,640
and just see the aftermath of it
was just incredible. 

794
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:38,760
For an audience to sit through 
with a hat, to sit through it 

795
00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:40,840
and he made them do it. 
It's staggering. 

796
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:42,800
I mean, we've talked about it 
already, but that parlour 

797
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:44,840
sequence, that back and forth 
between them would be a 

798
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:47,080
standout. 
And pretty much any other film, 

799
00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:49,760
that introduction of none. 
But it was just, it doesn't get 

800
00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:50,920
better. 
Then it just goes downhill from 

801
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:51,720
there. 
But it doesn't. 

802
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:54,480
It goes up and it keeps going up
and it keeps getting better. 

803
00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:57,120
Literally, it goes uphill, yeah.
Of course it does massively. 

804
00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:59,880
It just, it just gets better and
better and better and builds on 

805
00:33:59,880 --> 00:34:01,840
it. 
But the thing about Psycho is it

806
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:05,080
knows it's amazing, but it's 
nowhere near pretentious enough 

807
00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:06,880
to be. 
And then that's the whole point.

808
00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:09,320
He's not being pretentious with 
it, he's just being clever. 

809
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:12,040
He knows exactly what he wants 
to do with the film and he knows

810
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,280
he wants people to be scared, 
and that's exactly what he does.

811
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:17,840
Yeah, this is so much better 
than it had any right to be. 

812
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:20,080
Oh yeah, should be so throw. 
Away it. 

813
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,280
It should be. 
You remember that cycle 1 he did

814
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:24,679
wasn't. 
Yeah, it went on his TV show, 

815
00:34:24,679 --> 00:34:26,360
which obviously I think he 
nearly did. 

816
00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:28,400
And there was lots of elements 
that brought it all together. 

817
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:31,800
But I think he just went in this
with in the excitement of a 

818
00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:34,800
child, just like I'm going to 
make something scary and that's 

819
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:36,320
it. 
And that's exactly what he did. 

820
00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:38,320
That passion is still burning 
there so you can see it. 

821
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:43,880
Even now, yeah, it's brilliant. 
So the novel Cycle was written 

822
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:47,960
by Robert Block and published by
Simon Schuster in 1959. 

823
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:50,639
When it came out, it got a 
glowing review in the New York 

824
00:34:50,639 --> 00:34:53,360
Times. 
Alfred Hitchcock's PA Peggy 

825
00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:55,880
Robertson saw the review. 
She read the book and then 

826
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:58,840
showed her the Hitchcock. 
Yeah, Anthony Boucher had 

827
00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:00,960
written that review. 
He was a well known mystery 

828
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:03,200
writer and critic at the time, 
so his approval was like a quite

829
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:06,840
a big deal I think at the time. 
Yeah, and then in the late 50s, 

830
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,280
Hitchcock had seen two film 
projects fall through. 

831
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:13,120
He abandoned an adaptation of a 
book called Flamingo Feather 

832
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,360
when it became a logistical 
nightmare, and he'd also been 

833
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:17,840
planning to make a film with 
Audrey. 

834
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:21,160
Hepburn called No Bail for the 
Judge, but that stopped when 

835
00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:23,920
Hepburn fell pregnant. 
It was at this time Cycor 

836
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:26,120
dropped on his desk and he 
bought the rights from Robert 

837
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,160
Block for $9500. 
Nice. 

838
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:31,000
Hepburn and Hitchcock together 
at last. 

839
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:32,600
Nearly never worked together, 
did they? 

840
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:33,680
I. 
Know that would have been 

841
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:35,880
amazing, yeah. 
But when Hitchcock first bought 

842
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:37,520
the rights to Psycho, we did it 
anonymously. 

843
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:39,840
I think if Bloke had known who 
he was selling it to, he might 

844
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:40,960
have asked for quite a bit more 
money. 

845
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:42,720
Oh, you'd have. 
Ramped it up slightly I think. 

846
00:35:42,720 --> 00:35:45,560
Might have been Yeah. 
And the Wrights report to Shamli

847
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:48,240
Productions, which was 
Hitchcock's own company and he 

848
00:35:48,240 --> 00:35:51,880
was inspired by William Castle 
and he was AB movie director who

849
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:54,800
had hits in the late 50s with 
the likes of House on Haunted 

850
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:57,760
Hill and The Tingler Horrors 
made on shoestring budgets. 

851
00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:02,040
Yeah, that came from the Psycho 
screenwriter Joseph Stefano. 

852
00:36:02,240 --> 00:36:04,480
He said the first time he met 
Hitchcock he was praising those 

853
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:08,040
Castle films, but said just 
imagine if somebody good made 

854
00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:13,760
one. 
You know, like slammed. 

855
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:17,280
Paramount had passed over the 
book when it came out, but as 

856
00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:20,000
they had Hitchcock under 
contract for one more film, he 

857
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:22,560
took Psycho back to them. 
They didn't like the novel, but 

858
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:24,080
Hitchcock said he'd make it for 
cheap. 

859
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:26,760
He also said that he'd devote 
his normal quarter of a million 

860
00:36:26,760 --> 00:36:30,880
salary and put up the 806,000 
production budget himself. 

861
00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:34,160
In exchange, he asked for 60% of
the film's profits and getting 

862
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:35,600
the film distribution rights 
back. 

863
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:38,400
After Paramount made their money
back, Paramount thought it would

864
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,360
never be a big hit, so they 
agreed. 

865
00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:44,800
Fools. 
Apparently, Bonnie Balaban, the 

866
00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:47,360
president of Paramount at the 
time, he said about Psycho. 

867
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:49,640
It's unfilmable. 
It's about a queer killing 

868
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:52,440
people in his mother's dress. 
He aged like milk. 

869
00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:54,280
That quote in more ways than 
one. 

870
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:56,080
Hitchcock had the last. 
One. 

871
00:36:56,080 --> 00:36:57,160
You know what it's about, 
though. 

872
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:01,840
And North by Northwest had cost 
over $3,000,000. 

873
00:37:01,840 --> 00:37:04,720
So working with a budget much 
less than he was used to, 

874
00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:07,040
Hitchcock came up with ways of 
cutting costs. 

875
00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:09,760
So instead of going with his 
usual feature film crew, as we 

876
00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:12,840
mentioned, he hired crew members
from his TV series Alfred 

877
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:14,600
Hitchcock Presents instead. 
Nice. 

878
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:17,080
Yeah. 
And he shot it at Review 

879
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:20,520
Studios, the TV arm of MCA, 
rather than on the Paramount 

880
00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:22,520
stages, because it was cheaper, 
presumably. 

881
00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:24,640
Yeah, Yeah. 
So it had all the resources of 

882
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:26,760
television. 
But this does not look like ATV 

883
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:28,200
movie at all. 
Not. 

884
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:30,720
One little. 
Bit not for one second no 

885
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:33,200
better. 
Than every other movie came out 

886
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:38,000
that year to be honest. 
And he also came up with a very 

887
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:40,880
short shooting schedule of about
3 months and had the script 

888
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,480
changed so that they needed as 
few sets as possible. 

889
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:46,560
Yeah, I'm not sure a scheduled 
man that could get the crew 

890
00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:49,680
cheaper too. 
The whole crew cost $62,000. 

891
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:53,440
The crew that made Psycho, How 
much is that ridiculous? 

892
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:55,760
Yeah. 
Hitchcock knew the importance of

893
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:57,640
keeping the reveal about Norman 
a secret. 

894
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:00,280
On the first day of filming, he 
had made each cast and crew 

895
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:04,000
member stand in front of him, 
raise the right hand and say I 

896
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,480
promise I shall not divulge the 
plot of Psycho. 

897
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:11,280
He stopped Janet Lee and Anthony
Perkins doing any press for the 

898
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,120
film in case they gave anything 
away. 

899
00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:16,320
And there's a famous story that 
Hitchcock had Penny Robertson 

900
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:19,080
buy up as many copies of the 
novel as they could so people 

901
00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:21,760
couldn't read what happens. 
And he refused to release the 

902
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:23,880
plots and officers to the press 
Amazing. 

903
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:26,200
Yeah, secretive man. 
The only other director who'd 

904
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:29,320
ever done that was Cecil B De 
Mille, who apparently refused to

905
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:31,480
tell a report as the plot of the
10 Commandments. 

906
00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:35,960
I think we kind of know what 
happens in that one, to be 

907
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:38,880
honest, Cecil. 
Cecil's revealed there's only 90

908
00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:40,000
What the? 
Fuck yeah. 

909
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:42,640
Go out and buy every copy of the
Bible you can find. 

910
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:48,760
Yeah, sure. 
Well, Hitchcock famously never 

911
00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:50,320
won the Best Director of Academy
Award. 

912
00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:53,080
He was nominated for Psycho, 
though, his fifth and final 

913
00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:55,640
nomination. 
Do you know who we lost out to? 

914
00:38:56,680 --> 00:38:59,400
I do know this one because this 
one's a tough one because it was

915
00:38:59,400 --> 00:39:02,240
Billy Wilder for the apartment. 
It was indeed. 

916
00:39:02,720 --> 00:39:04,480
Yeah, that's competition. 
I know that's superb One. 

917
00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:06,560
Yeah. 
So no major award. 

918
00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:09,480
But in creating one of the most 
iconic and influential films to 

919
00:39:09,720 --> 00:39:12,240
ever come out of Hollywood and 
somehow on a budget of less than

920
00:39:12,240 --> 00:39:15,040
$1 million, did all right pitch,
didn't it? 

921
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:16,640
Yeah, it's all right, isn't it? 
Just a bit. 

922
00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:24,640
Yeah, the cast. 
I like the film. 

923
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:26,280
The cast of Psycho is a lean 
one. 

924
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:28,960
In this section, we're going to 
be discussing Anthony Perkins as

925
00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:32,120
Norman Bates and Veera Miles as 
Lila Crane, but we're starting 

926
00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:34,200
with Norman's tragic victim. 
We are. 

927
00:39:34,880 --> 00:39:37,800
So Janet Leigh plays Marion 
Crane, a Phoenix real estate 

928
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:40,160
secretary, where he watches. 
Marion enjoys some afternoon 

929
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:42,640
delight with her boss, Sam 
Loomis, before deciding to 

930
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:46,200
pocket $40,000 of her boss's 
money, skip town and meet her 

931
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:50,400
demise at the Bates Motel. 
A classic Hitchcock blonde mat 

932
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:52,640
that was Janet Leigh as Marion 
Crane. 

933
00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:55,760
I feel a bit sorry for her 
actually, because I think when 

934
00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:58,640
people talk about this film, 
they'll talk about Perkins in 

935
00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:01,520
the shower scene and the twist. 
I think she just gets a bit 

936
00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:05,160
taken for granted along the way.
Like her performance only really

937
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:08,760
gets talked about in relation to
the shower scene, but she brings

938
00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:11,400
so much moderate than that. 
I mean, part of the reason that 

939
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:14,000
scene is so shocking is because 
of how likeable Marian is. 

940
00:40:14,720 --> 00:40:17,280
And considering, as we've been 
saying, she's the thief and 

941
00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:19,680
she's having an affair with the 
married man, that's all down the

942
00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:21,200
league's performance. 
How much we like her. 

943
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:23,960
I mean, that scene we've talked 
about where she's driving away 

944
00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,280
and imagining all the 
conversations other people are 

945
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:29,280
having about her, so many 
conflict and emotions playing 

946
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:31,800
across her face. 
You know, there's regrets this 

947
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:34,840
fee of the consequences if she 
does go back, but there's also 

948
00:40:34,840 --> 00:40:37,800
like an undeniable joy at what 
she's done at the same time. 

949
00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:40,400
Like, why doesn't she deserve a 
better life with Sam? 

950
00:40:40,720 --> 00:40:42,400
That businessman wasn't 
Uttaprixa. 

951
00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:44,760
He deserves it. 
And she's kind of enjoying this.

952
00:40:45,080 --> 00:40:47,960
So I think that scene, the Paula
scene where she treats Norman 

953
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:51,120
with such kindness, the all 
contribute what a well drawn 

954
00:40:51,120 --> 00:40:53,120
character Marian is. 
And that's why her death is so 

955
00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:55,320
impactful. 
And Lee's performance needs a 

956
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:56,760
lot more praise than he usually 
gets. 

957
00:40:57,600 --> 00:40:59,360
Yeah, and once she gets the 
money, he says to her. 

958
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:01,720
Like, I never carry more than 
I'm prepared to lose or I can 

959
00:41:01,720 --> 00:41:03,600
afford to lose, so he can afford
to lose. 

960
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:05,840
Exactly. 
Like it's expendable stuff. 

961
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:07,480
Yeah, totally get why she 
gambles on her. 

962
00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:09,120
Every thought in her head is 
totally. 

963
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:10,680
Believable for her performance, 
Yeah. 

964
00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:13,280
Yeah, I think of all the cast 
members she brings to star 

965
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:15,400
quality. 
She is a classic Hitchcock 

966
00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:17,240
blonde. 
She's glamorous, elegant. 

967
00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:19,640
The camera loves her. 
From her very first shot, lying 

968
00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:21,800
on the bed in the hotel, you see
why Hitchcock wanted her. 

969
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:24,320
She looks great and it'll be a 
massive shock to see I get 

970
00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:27,240
butchered, basically. 
But she's not just a pretty face

971
00:41:27,240 --> 00:41:29,400
like you're saying, Matt. 
Janet Lee's got the acting chops

972
00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:31,280
as well, for sure. 
She's got to sell the whole 

973
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:33,240
first act of the film on her 
own, basically. 

974
00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:35,800
And she does. 
I believe Marion is a decent 

975
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:38,760
person who gets pushed far 
enough to make a mistake, and 

976
00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:40,840
then I believe that when she 
comes to her senses and changes 

977
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:42,320
her mind. 
I mean, we talked about the 

978
00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:44,880
parlor scene and I think Lee's 
excellent in that. 

979
00:41:45,160 --> 00:41:47,480
She barely even moves, but you 
can kind of see her making the 

980
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:49,800
decision to go back. 
It's all been like a mannerisms 

981
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:53,440
in the face, really subtle. 
But then she's like gone, which 

982
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:56,080
I still find it quite shocking 
now in 1960. 

983
00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:58,880
It must have caused meltdowns. 
The biggest name in the film 

984
00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:00,480
lying dead on the bathroom 
floor. 

985
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:02,920
It's horrific. 
And what makes it work is the 

986
00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:05,360
work that's been done to that 
point to make us relate to and 

987
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:07,360
care about Marion. 
That's in the writing, it's in 

988
00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:09,480
the directing, and it comes from
Janet Lee as well. 

989
00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:11,800
I think it's all around great 
character building. 

990
00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:14,680
Yeah, it is. 
Yeah, I mean, she's just, for 

991
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:17,600
me, really, really fantastic 
performance. 

992
00:42:17,600 --> 00:42:20,280
Because it if without her, you 
haven't got the impact, like 

993
00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:21,800
Matt says, you don't have a 
film. 

994
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:24,120
You need a character that you 
can follow, that you are just as

995
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,040
confused as she is. 
You are just as guilty as she is

996
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:29,440
because you're seeing this all 
through her point of view and 

997
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:32,440
you understand her back story 
without going too far and you 

998
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:34,840
kind of sympathise. 
And it really does work. 

999
00:42:35,160 --> 00:42:37,240
And thinking of Janet Lee as 
well, at this point in my 

1000
00:42:37,240 --> 00:42:39,960
career, she's read this script. 
She knows what's going to happen

1001
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:42,160
and she's put the groundwork in 
here. 

1002
00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:44,640
She could have easily formed 
this in and nor she's going to 

1003
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:46,800
get a really good death scene 
and not be in the rest of the 

1004
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:48,480
film. 
And she could have been bitter 

1005
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:51,240
and a little bit annoyed by 
that, but she definitely isn't. 

1006
00:42:51,240 --> 00:42:53,520
She acts in the start of this 
film like she's going to be 

1007
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:57,520
there when the credits roll, and
that's the best thing about it. 

1008
00:42:57,520 --> 00:43:00,240
And it really does work. 
It's almost like she didn't know

1009
00:43:00,240 --> 00:43:03,320
she was going to get killed as 
an actress and as a character. 

1010
00:43:03,720 --> 00:43:05,840
It's just I'm in this all the 
way through Hitchcock. 

1011
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:07,760
No, no, no. 
It almost feels like that. 

1012
00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:09,000
That's how much she brings to 
it. 

1013
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:11,960
She brings this like she's the 
she knows she is. 

1014
00:43:12,240 --> 00:43:15,680
She convinces us that she is, 
and then she's wiped out 

1015
00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:17,680
spectacularly. 
Or I mean, that reach out to the

1016
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:19,760
shower curtain. 
There's nothing more iconic. 

1017
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:21,880
She looks the part, She acts the
part. 

1018
00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:24,880
I do think, yeah, it's 
criminally underrated how good 

1019
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:27,280
this performance is because you 
wouldn't have a film without 

1020
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:29,040
Janet Lee. 
Absolutely. 

1021
00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:31,280
Yeah. 
So before Janet Lee was cast as 

1022
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:33,640
Marion, there were lots of names
that Hitchcock apparently 

1023
00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:36,120
considered. 
So Eva Marie St. 

1024
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:40,120
Lee Remic, Angie Dickinson, 
Piper Lorry, Shirley Jones, Lana

1025
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:43,360
Turner, Dina Merrill and Jane 
Simmons who all discussed. 

1026
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:46,680
Eva Marie St. was in North by 
Northwest. 

1027
00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:47,200
Wasn't she? 
Yeah. 

1028
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:50,880
Yeah, and Angie Dickinson, she 
plays a Marion Crane type in 

1029
00:43:50,880 --> 00:43:53,480
Dressed to Kill, which is kind 
of Brian De Palma's homage to 

1030
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:54,120
Psycho It. 
Is. 

1031
00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:55,360
Yeah, that's right. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1032
00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:57,680
Yeah, one of many Brian De Palma
homages to Psycho. 

1033
00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:00,040
Every film that Brian De Palma 
made. 

1034
00:44:00,240 --> 00:44:02,360
Yeah, Far from Scarface, 
obviously. 

1035
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:07,760
But Hitchcock liked the idea of 
casting Janet Leigh after seen 

1036
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:10,760
it in Orson Welles Touch of Evil
in 1958. 

1037
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:13,840
So he sent out a copy of Robert 
Block's novel with a no team. 

1038
00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:16,520
Please consider the part of Mary
Anthony. 

1039
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:19,120
Perkins is said to play a Norman
Bates and she never had her 

1040
00:44:19,120 --> 00:44:22,120
audition. 
Yeah, she also had one film left

1041
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:24,160
on her, seven pictures here with
Paramount, Janet Leigh. 

1042
00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:26,520
So I imagine they put her 
forward to Hitchcock as well. 

1043
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:29,840
And he actually agreed to do it 
for 1/4 of a usual salary, which

1044
00:44:29,840 --> 00:44:32,640
was like $100,000. 
So she must have been keen on 

1045
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:34,560
Hitch. 
Yeah, yeah, definitely. 

1046
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:37,000
We're keen to work with him. 
I mean, yeah, she wasn't turning

1047
00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:38,520
down Tony curtains for him. 
I doubt. 

1048
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:41,840
Wouldn't have thought. 
So stranger things have 

1049
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:44,760
happened. 
And Lee said that when she was 

1050
00:44:44,760 --> 00:44:48,120
cast, Hitchcock briefed her 
before filming By saying I hired

1051
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:51,680
you because you were an actress.
I will only direct you if a you 

1052
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:55,320
attempt to take more than your 
share of the pie, B you don't 

1053
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:58,720
take enough, or C you are having
trouble motivating the necessary

1054
00:44:58,720 --> 00:45:00,840
timed movement. 
All right. 

1055
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:05,640
Andy made her take the eye. 
Will not spoil Psycho auth, 

1056
00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:07,400
presumably. 
Yeah, that'll be it. 

1057
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:09,040
Yeah. 
And Janet Leigh did say as well 

1058
00:45:09,040 --> 00:45:10,880
that she created the whole back 
story for Marion. 

1059
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:13,320
She knew what she was like in 
school, what her favorite colour

1060
00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:15,440
was, what made her laugh, all 
that kind of stuff. 

1061
00:45:15,720 --> 00:45:18,880
And it kind of shows because I'm
always surprised how fleshed out

1062
00:45:18,880 --> 00:45:20,240
she feels, like almost 
immediately. 

1063
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:24,200
And other crew members fed into 
the character as well. 

1064
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:27,720
Marian was dressed by the 
costume designer Rita Riggs and 

1065
00:45:27,720 --> 00:45:31,280
costume supervisor Helen Colvig.
They bought the clothes from a 

1066
00:45:31,280 --> 00:45:35,520
Beverly Hills boutique called 
Jax JAX, based on photographs 

1067
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:38,400
given to them by the assistant 
director, Hilton A Green. 

1068
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:41,680
Yeah, so apparently Hilton Green
found a young woman somewhere 

1069
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:44,680
who much luck he had in his head
for Marian, and he took photos 

1070
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:47,240
of all of her clothes and gave 
him to the costume team. 

1071
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:49,720
Really weird. 
Buffalo Bill, but. 

1072
00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:53,280
Yeah, it sounds like I'm getting
Norman Bates or Buffalo Bill if 

1073
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:55,400
you ask me. 
You're 12, right? 

1074
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:01,080
Lee was only on set for three 
weeks, and one week of that was 

1075
00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:03,840
filming the shower scene. 
But the film had a big effect. 

1076
00:46:04,080 --> 00:46:06,280
After the film came out, she 
received some threatening 

1077
00:46:06,280 --> 00:46:08,920
letters from men detailing what 
they would like to do to marry. 

1078
00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:12,760
And Crane 1 was so bad she 
passed it on to the FBI and they

1079
00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:14,640
investigated it and found the 
culprit. 

1080
00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:16,680
It's gone. 
It's awful, isn't it? 

1081
00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:19,240
Yeah, Yeah. 
She also said that the film made

1082
00:46:19,240 --> 00:46:21,880
her feel really vulnerable in 
the shower from then on, and she

1083
00:46:21,880 --> 00:46:23,680
would always as Bast, if 
possible, for the rest of her 

1084
00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:24,400
life. 
Yeah. 

1085
00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:25,520
Wow. 
Yeah. 

1086
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:28,360
Well, for a performance as 
Marion Crane, Jana Lee was 

1087
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:30,480
nominated for best actress in 
the supporting role of the 

1088
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:32,880
Oscars. 
She lost out to Shirley Jones 

1089
00:46:32,880 --> 00:46:35,880
for Elma Gantry. 
OK, surely Jones has been 

1090
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:37,440
running for Marion as well, like
we said. 

1091
00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:40,240
Yes, right. 
So no Wayne, but we think 

1092
00:46:40,240 --> 00:46:42,600
generally brings the star 
quality as Marion and with the 

1093
00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:45,640
shock of her exit 1 of the 
classic Hitchcock blondes. 

1094
00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:51,720
Iconic performance, yeah. 
Yeah, definitely. 2nd in our 

1095
00:46:51,720 --> 00:46:54,360
cast list is arguably the most 
famous performance in the film. 

1096
00:46:54,560 --> 00:46:57,960
Anthony Perkins is Norman Bates.
We meet Norman as the lonely 

1097
00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:00,600
young man who runs the Bates 
Motel and see him murder Mario 

1098
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:03,960
and then Pi Arborgast before 
finding out he is mother and 

1099
00:47:03,960 --> 00:47:05,480
seeing him locked up for his 
crimes. 

1100
00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:08,920
You might fool him, Matt, but 
you won't fool his mother. 

1101
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:13,280
All right, So how's Anthony 
Perkins and Norman Bates? 

1102
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:16,880
Again, I feel a little bit sorry
for him as well because after he

1103
00:47:16,880 --> 00:47:19,920
did this, he was so typecast as 
Norman for the rest of his 

1104
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:21,760
career. 
No one could see him as anybody 

1105
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:22,760
else. 
Yeah. 

1106
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:25,360
Having said that, the reason 
he's typecast is because he is 

1107
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:29,280
so brilliant as Norman. 
Like, you never know where you 

1108
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:31,120
are with this character when you
first meet him. 

1109
00:47:31,120 --> 00:47:33,520
As I said, he's got this easy 
charm for him, He thinks very 

1110
00:47:33,520 --> 00:47:35,600
likable. 
Then you see that's just on the 

1111
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:39,200
surface, and there's this whole,
like, ocean of anxiety and 

1112
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:42,560
nervousness to the character. 
He's so incredibly awkward in 

1113
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:45,480
his own skin, but that's because
really, that skin belongs to 

1114
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:47,080
someone else, and there's 
someone else in there. 

1115
00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:50,320
And you do get these moments 
where I think you can see mother

1116
00:47:50,320 --> 00:47:53,680
bubbling to the surface, like 
when he pushes Marian's car into

1117
00:47:53,680 --> 00:47:55,280
the swamp to dispose of the 
body. 

1118
00:47:55,600 --> 00:47:58,400
That's just like the hint of a 
smile on his face, like he's 

1119
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:02,040
enjoying this, which Norman 
isn't, but mother is, and that's

1120
00:48:02,040 --> 00:48:04,080
what we're seeing. 
And it's this constant conflict 

1121
00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:06,160
between the two. 
And whenever he has to talk to 

1122
00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:08,760
somebody, he's a nervous wreck. 
And yes, it's a shame he was 

1123
00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:10,200
typecast. 
But if it's going to happen to 

1124
00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:12,800
you as an actor, at least make 
sure it's for something as 

1125
00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:16,440
memorable as this. 
Yeah, I mean, it's iconic, isn't

1126
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:17,960
it? 
Part of Hollywood history? 

1127
00:48:18,240 --> 00:48:20,920
I mean, as a character, Norman's
interesting because he's not a 

1128
00:48:20,920 --> 00:48:22,720
cartoon. 
He's grounded because on the 

1129
00:48:22,720 --> 00:48:25,360
surface he's shy and awkward. 
He does seem like he wouldn't 

1130
00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:27,400
harm a family. 
But as it gets a norm, it 

1131
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:30,280
becomes obvious he's disturbed 
and then had a split identity. 

1132
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:32,600
I think what's really 
interesting is how we're clearly

1133
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:35,160
supposed to relate to him 
because we see how lonely he is.

1134
00:48:35,160 --> 00:48:36,600
We're here as embarrassment with
mother. 

1135
00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:39,400
The way they hand over the role 
of main character from marrying 

1136
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:41,840
the Norman that's done so well 
that by the time he comes to 

1137
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:43,920
clean up the murder, I kind of 
feel this panic. 

1138
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:46,120
Such a complex villain, I think 
Still. 

1139
00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:49,440
And Anthony Perkins just takes 
what's on the page and makes 

1140
00:48:49,440 --> 00:48:53,000
Norman totally 3 dimensional. 
He does that shy, sweet thing 

1141
00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:56,040
well. 12 cabins, 12 vacancies, 
every single time. 

1142
00:48:56,480 --> 00:48:58,120
It's living with that. 
It's so good. 

1143
00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:01,120
But then when the switch flips, 
he's pretty terrifying. 

1144
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:04,000
He manage his support for you. 
Norman's totally unhinged, but 

1145
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:06,720
doesn't raise his voice once, 
just the way that he stands, the

1146
00:49:06,720 --> 00:49:08,880
way he holds himself. 
And yeah, those shots next to 

1147
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:11,280
the swamp with no words, and 
then that smile that he gives to

1148
00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:13,360
Arborgast after he drives away 
because he thinks he's getting 

1149
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:15,040
away with it. 
It's so good. 

1150
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:18,320
I mean, what can you say? 
It's Norman Bates in Psycho, 1 

1151
00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:20,560
of the great characters in 
Hollywood, and it's in the 

1152
00:49:20,560 --> 00:49:23,200
writing and it's also in what 
Anthony Perkins brings as well, 

1153
00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:25,920
his old timer stuff. 
I love him. 

1154
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:28,400
I love him. 
I love Sweetheart. 

1155
00:49:29,240 --> 00:49:32,400
He's great in the first like 30 
seconds. 

1156
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:34,800
Is there one of them people 
who's like you really like when 

1157
00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:37,480
you first move in and then he 
gets a little bit creepy as your

1158
00:49:37,480 --> 00:49:39,520
neighbor and then you end up 
just waving and then you just 

1159
00:49:39,520 --> 00:49:41,120
don't come out. 
If he's at the car, you just 

1160
00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:43,920
wait a little bit longer. 
It's that kind of character. 

1161
00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:45,840
But it's just, it has this 
believability. 

1162
00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:47,880
And I think what you guys were 
talking about there, like when 

1163
00:49:47,880 --> 00:49:50,920
he's happy with himself, I 
always see it as like how happy 

1164
00:49:50,920 --> 00:49:52,600
his mother would be at his 
actions. 

1165
00:49:53,120 --> 00:49:55,760
Not necessarily her as a person,
but she would be proud of him. 

1166
00:49:55,760 --> 00:49:57,680
Like he's making that proud by 
doing this. 

1167
00:49:57,880 --> 00:50:01,320
He hasn't got his own mind. 
He doesn't oversell everything, 

1168
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:02,920
but he doesn't undersell it 
either. 

1169
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:06,560
The fact that he spends all of 
his time just stuffing birds. 

1170
00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:08,440
And I don't mean that as a 
euphemism. 

1171
00:50:08,960 --> 00:50:10,720
Literally. 
He wishes. 

1172
00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:13,800
I think his wardrobe's great. 
He's just looks really clean. 

1173
00:50:13,800 --> 00:50:15,320
He's really crisp. 
He's really fresh. 

1174
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:17,080
He's just really zippy as a as a
guy. 

1175
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:18,520
So he's got some good gags in 
there. 

1176
00:50:18,520 --> 00:50:21,040
Like you said there, John, like 
12 covers, 12 vacancies, candy. 

1177
00:50:21,320 --> 00:50:23,560
And he's just got these little 
moments where it's just it's 

1178
00:50:23,560 --> 00:50:25,600
just so well measured and so 
well played through. 

1179
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:27,920
You believe it. 
You believe every single step of

1180
00:50:27,920 --> 00:50:30,080
it all the way through the film.
And that's so important. 

1181
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:33,120
But that's Perkins performance. 
He is fantastic. 

1182
00:50:33,120 --> 00:50:35,200
I guess the only negative, like 
you said there, Matt, is how it 

1183
00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:37,480
affected Perkins himself, 
because he did become totally 

1184
00:50:37,480 --> 00:50:38,920
typecast, didn't he, As Norman, 
Yeah. 

1185
00:50:39,280 --> 00:50:41,880
If you're that good though, you 
there's no way else you can go. 

1186
00:50:42,000 --> 00:50:44,280
Once you do this, that's it. 
Yeah, absolutely. 

1187
00:50:44,320 --> 00:50:45,720
It's a shame in his career so 
far, yeah. 

1188
00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:48,960
So in the novel, Norman is 
described as being a pudgy, 

1189
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:51,120
balding, middle-aged man in 
glasses. 

1190
00:50:51,520 --> 00:50:54,080
Some writers who knew Robert 
Block have said that an 

1191
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,240
inspiration for Norman was 
Calvin Thomas Beck, who was a 

1192
00:50:57,240 --> 00:51:00,280
publisher of a horror magazine 
called Castle of Frankenstein. 

1193
00:51:00,720 --> 00:51:03,680
Apparently he was a socially 
awkward mama's boy who was 

1194
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:05,560
dominated by his overprotective 
mother. 

1195
00:51:05,560 --> 00:51:07,960
Sounds very familiar. 
Yeah, imagine that, though. 

1196
00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:09,800
I've based a character in you in
my new book. 

1197
00:51:10,080 --> 00:51:12,240
Oh, have you? 
I can't wait to say that. 

1198
00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:15,360
Massively insulting. 
He's a massive fat wet letters 

1199
00:51:15,360 --> 00:51:18,800
of living man Oh class. 
Thanks for that. 

1200
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:21,240
And it seems like there was 
never anybody else considered to

1201
00:51:21,240 --> 00:51:24,280
play the part of Norman. 
Joseph Stefano said that he was 

1202
00:51:24,280 --> 00:51:27,200
initially reluctant to right 
cycle and told Hitchcock the 

1203
00:51:27,200 --> 00:51:29,920
problem was the character of 
Norman in the novel was just 

1204
00:51:29,920 --> 00:51:32,960
impossible to sympathise with. 
And Hitchcock said, well, what 

1205
00:51:32,960 --> 00:51:34,120
have we got? 
Tony Perkins? 

1206
00:51:35,520 --> 00:51:38,200
Yes, Stefano would recently seen
Perkins on stage in a play 

1207
00:51:38,200 --> 00:51:39,720
called Look Home. 
What Angel? 

1208
00:51:39,880 --> 00:51:41,280
And he said. 
When I saw him, I thought, 

1209
00:51:41,320 --> 00:51:43,160
that's exactly who I want Norman
to be. 

1210
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:44,000
Right. 
Right. 

1211
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:46,160
So he knew straight off, yeah. 
Fair enough. 

1212
00:51:46,320 --> 00:51:48,960
And like Janet Leigh, Perkins 
saw a paramount the picture 

1213
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:51,400
under his contract, which meant 
his fate was well below his 

1214
00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:54,600
usual rate. 
He got paid $40,000 to play a 

1215
00:51:54,600 --> 00:51:57,360
Norman. 
In contrast, Cary Grant had been

1216
00:51:57,360 --> 00:52:03,560
paid $450,000 for North by 
Northwest. 40 grand for Norman 

1217
00:52:03,560 --> 00:52:05,920
Bates is a bargain. 
Yeah, really is, yeah. 

1218
00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:07,560
Maybe that's why Marion stole 
that much. 

1219
00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:08,520
Paying for him. 
Exactly. 

1220
00:52:08,520 --> 00:52:09,520
Yeah. 
Just take it straight out of the

1221
00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:11,160
safe. 
He didn't put it in the boot 

1222
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:13,480
after all, did he? 
Or the Trump or whatever you 

1223
00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:15,800
want to call it. 
Well, Perkinsley, I said as well

1224
00:52:15,800 --> 00:52:18,880
that on set Hitchcock would 
always refer to him as Master 

1225
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:20,800
Bates of. 
Course he did. 

1226
00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:24,360
Hitchcock did get accused of 
harassing some cast members, 

1227
00:52:24,360 --> 00:52:26,680
like Tippi Hedren most famously 
didn't he on The Birds. 

1228
00:52:26,680 --> 00:52:28,880
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 
Well, before we finish and 

1229
00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:31,440
Anthony Perkins and Norman 
Bates, we've got our next ATR 

1230
00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:34,080
and Patreon question and it 
comes from Gareth Binmore. 

1231
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:35,320
Hello, Gareth. 
Hello, Gareth. 

1232
00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:38,520
Gareth says what makes Norman 
Bates one of cinema's most 

1233
00:52:38,520 --> 00:52:41,320
enduring psychological villains?
And how does the film portray A 

1234
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:44,480
dissociative identity complex 
one from Gareth? 

1235
00:52:44,480 --> 00:52:48,320
Matt Biz, what's your take? 
Why does he endure it? 

1236
00:52:48,320 --> 00:52:49,920
I think because he's so 
sympathetic. 

1237
00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:53,680
Like, even though we really like
Marian as a character, I still 

1238
00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:55,400
don't really hate Norman for 
killing her. 

1239
00:52:55,640 --> 00:52:58,960
I I still feel sorry for him 
because we understand what an 

1240
00:52:58,960 --> 00:53:00,520
abuse of an lonely childhood he 
had. 

1241
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:03,160
Now, ultimately, he's not in 
control of his actions. 

1242
00:53:03,520 --> 00:53:05,800
And that's what separates him 
from the likes of, you know, 

1243
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:09,080
Michael Myers or Jason Foys, who
go in their space because they 

1244
00:53:09,080 --> 00:53:11,480
want to. 
Norman doesn't want to do any of

1245
00:53:11,480 --> 00:53:13,920
these murders. 
He's helpless and it's a mother 

1246
00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:15,760
who wants to do them, and he 
can't do anything to stop her. 

1247
00:53:16,240 --> 00:53:18,720
And the other thing about in 
which the two direct sequels 

1248
00:53:18,720 --> 00:53:21,880
lean into, it's that sense of 
knowing something is going to 

1249
00:53:21,880 --> 00:53:24,200
trigger him off, but you don't 
know when and you don't know 

1250
00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:26,280
what. 
So that's what really kind of 

1251
00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:28,400
makes him so interesting. 
Like, what's going to like, flip

1252
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:29,680
that switch in his head when he 
goes? 

1253
00:53:29,880 --> 00:53:32,680
You never know who's safe around
him because some people are, but

1254
00:53:32,680 --> 00:53:35,200
some people aren't. 
So think how does it betray 

1255
00:53:35,200 --> 00:53:38,200
their identity is something to 
feel a bit sorry for as well as 

1256
00:53:38,200 --> 00:53:41,560
be scared about. 
Yeah, I think you're right. 

1257
00:53:41,560 --> 00:53:44,160
I think Norman is written to be 
sympathetic because horror films

1258
00:53:44,160 --> 00:53:46,920
before Norman were usually 
monsters, like literally like 

1259
00:53:46,960 --> 00:53:49,440
Frankenstein and Dracula, like 
the Universal stuff. 

1260
00:53:49,720 --> 00:53:52,840
Norman's the guy next door. 
He's really normal, normal 

1261
00:53:52,840 --> 00:53:54,800
baits. 
Until he's not, obviously. 

1262
00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:57,280
But by that point it's kind of 
too late because we're already 

1263
00:53:57,280 --> 00:54:00,240
empathising with him to some 
extent on the dissociative 

1264
00:54:00,240 --> 00:54:01,640
identity side Gareth asked 
about. 

1265
00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:04,920
I mean, psycho isn't a textbook,
obviously, and the psychiatry 

1266
00:54:04,920 --> 00:54:06,840
seen at the end simplifies it 
massively. 

1267
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:09,880
I think we'll get to that. 
But from what experts seem to 

1268
00:54:09,880 --> 00:54:13,000
say, what it does get right is 
the idea of one personality like

1269
00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:15,400
swallowing another. 
Because Norman's not pretending 

1270
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:17,680
to be his mother. 
In his head, she's real, and 

1271
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:21,080
she's in charge. 
So is Norman evil, or is one 

1272
00:54:21,080 --> 00:54:23,200
part of him evil? 
And if that evil part of him 

1273
00:54:23,200 --> 00:54:26,120
just came about entirely through
years of abuse, as the film kind

1274
00:54:26,120 --> 00:54:28,600
of implies, where does that 
leave us in judging Norman? 

1275
00:54:28,840 --> 00:54:31,480
It's so great for 1960. 
This is villain writing, like, 

1276
00:54:31,480 --> 00:54:34,160
ahead of its time, I think. 
I mean, it's barely been much 

1277
00:54:34,160 --> 00:54:35,440
since I think. 
Yeah. 

1278
00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:39,360
I think, yeah, because he is. 
And you do endure it because 

1279
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:43,000
you'd kind of in a weird way, 
see a little bit of yourself in 

1280
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:44,640
him. 
Like if you've ever been bullied

1281
00:54:44,640 --> 00:54:47,160
or if you've ever felt low, or 
if you've ever felt this lack of

1282
00:54:47,160 --> 00:54:50,080
confidence and this frustration 
that you have where you just 

1283
00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:51,880
want to lash out or you just 
want to do something. 

1284
00:54:51,880 --> 00:54:53,400
It just you just want something 
to disappear. 

1285
00:54:53,400 --> 00:54:54,960
You just want something to go 
away. 

1286
00:54:55,320 --> 00:54:57,720
And he has that desperation. 
It is very black and white. 

1287
00:54:57,720 --> 00:55:00,120
It's there's no, like you said, 
there's no grey area for him. 

1288
00:55:00,280 --> 00:55:02,520
His man wants it to happen. 
He's got no say in it. 

1289
00:55:02,520 --> 00:55:03,760
He's very much in the middle of 
it. 

1290
00:55:03,920 --> 00:55:06,600
Again, it's the performance, 
whether you like it or not, you 

1291
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:08,480
will see a little bit of 
yourself in that character 

1292
00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:12,040
because he does try and act as 
normal as society deems it to 

1293
00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,520
be. 
What is normal to act this way 

1294
00:55:14,640 --> 00:55:17,760
and how the film portrays the 
disassociate of identity 

1295
00:55:17,760 --> 00:55:20,560
specifically, I think it does it
very cleverly through certain 

1296
00:55:20,560 --> 00:55:22,320
techniques. 
And one of the most obvious is 

1297
00:55:22,320 --> 00:55:24,920
that Norman is never ever seen 
as a reflection in the mirror. 

1298
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:28,640
Every other character is. 
So you never ever see another 

1299
00:55:28,640 --> 00:55:30,240
side room. 
You never see that duality. 

1300
00:55:30,240 --> 00:55:33,400
You have to come up with that 
yourself, but ultimately I think

1301
00:55:33,400 --> 00:55:35,960
it's just because the character 
is relatable, whether you like 

1302
00:55:35,960 --> 00:55:38,400
it or not. 
He is to probably everyone just 

1303
00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:39,760
about I would think. 
Yeah. 

1304
00:55:40,120 --> 00:55:42,560
For his performance as Norman 
Bates, Anthony Perkins received 

1305
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:45,160
no recognition at the Oscars, 
not even the nomination. 

1306
00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:47,760
Now that is madness. 
That is mad. 

1307
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:49,440
Yeah, yeah. 
But I just don't think they knew

1308
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:50,120
what they had at the. 
Time. 

1309
00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:51,800
No. 
Oh, not sure they didn't know 

1310
00:55:52,640 --> 00:55:54,960
Bert Lancaster won that year, 
also for Elma Gantry. 

1311
00:55:55,240 --> 00:55:57,760
But for us, decades later, 
Anthony Perkins is pretty 

1312
00:55:57,760 --> 00:56:00,400
extraordinary as Norman Bates, a
performance that defined an 

1313
00:56:00,400 --> 00:56:03,720
actor, a character and one of 
the most influential roles in 

1314
00:56:03,720 --> 00:56:05,240
Hollywood. 
Absolutely. 

1315
00:56:05,240 --> 00:56:10,200
There's a lot to it, yeah. 
The last but by no means least 

1316
00:56:10,200 --> 00:56:12,920
member of our cast we're going 
all in on is Vera Miles, who 

1317
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:15,560
plays Lila Crane, Marion's 
younger sister. 

1318
00:56:15,560 --> 00:56:18,080
Lila doesn't turn up until 
nearly an hour into the film, 

1319
00:56:18,080 --> 00:56:20,160
but ends up piercing together 
what's happened, Eventually 

1320
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:23,000
finding herself face to face 
with mother, then Norman in the 

1321
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:25,600
fruit seller. 
Yeah, Patience doesn't run in 

1322
00:56:25,600 --> 00:56:27,840
her family, Westie, So we best 
got to move on. 

1323
00:56:28,080 --> 00:56:31,280
Vera Miles is Lila Crane. 
I mean, she's fantastic, 

1324
00:56:31,280 --> 00:56:34,240
arguably the biggest star in 
this film at this point, but she

1325
00:56:34,240 --> 00:56:37,160
really does bring it. 
I mean, she's just so, so good. 

1326
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:39,400
And the thing that I get from 
her performance is you 

1327
00:56:39,400 --> 00:56:43,400
completely believe her and 
Marian's relationship that it's 

1328
00:56:43,400 --> 00:56:47,000
not perfect, that the kind of 
speak but that don't quite get 

1329
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:49,320
on as well as they should. 
And you, there's this element of

1330
00:56:49,320 --> 00:56:52,240
guilt that she has all the way 
through the film that they 

1331
00:56:52,240 --> 00:56:54,080
should be closer. 
She should know what's going on.

1332
00:56:54,280 --> 00:56:57,360
But the performance itself, I 
mean, there's just such a 

1333
00:56:57,360 --> 00:56:59,280
contrast between who she's 
acting with. 

1334
00:57:00,680 --> 00:57:03,960
When you cut Leila and Sam in 
the same scene, it's like she's 

1335
00:57:04,040 --> 00:57:06,920
it's just head and shoulders 
above nearly everybody else. 

1336
00:57:07,200 --> 00:57:10,920
It's just fantastic. 
But what an actress to sell the 

1337
00:57:10,920 --> 00:57:12,680
actual point that needs to be 
sold. 

1338
00:57:13,000 --> 00:57:16,120
But she's just so intelligent as
well as a character and totally 

1339
00:57:16,120 --> 00:57:17,880
believable within that 
intelligence. 

1340
00:57:18,320 --> 00:57:21,840
If just like if, if Marian had 
just maybe reached out a little 

1341
00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:24,000
bit, I think Lila could have 
helped her a lot more than she 

1342
00:57:24,000 --> 00:57:26,320
feels that you could have. 
I don't know how much they would

1343
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:28,400
have spoke gently and Vera Miles
about it. 

1344
00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:29,680
Look, this is where we've come 
from. 

1345
00:57:29,680 --> 00:57:31,360
This is who we are. 
Feels like they had a 

1346
00:57:31,360 --> 00:57:35,040
conversation about the kind of 
blueprint of how these two grew 

1347
00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:36,800
up. 
And like I say, it's a wonderful

1348
00:57:36,800 --> 00:57:38,880
performance from Janet Lee. 
But again, not taking anything 

1349
00:57:38,880 --> 00:57:42,360
away from Vera Miles, she picks 
up the baton and runs with it 

1350
00:57:42,360 --> 00:57:45,040
right till the end and succeeds.
She really does. 

1351
00:57:45,080 --> 00:57:47,120
I mean, she comes into it late, 
but yeah, I think she's really 

1352
00:57:47,120 --> 00:57:48,760
good. 
She's got a bit of a thankless 

1353
00:57:48,760 --> 00:57:50,560
job here. 
Vera Miles, because she's 

1354
00:57:50,560 --> 00:57:53,000
playing the character, doing the
investigation heavy lifting in 

1355
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:55,320
the back half of the film. 
She has to essentially take over

1356
00:57:55,320 --> 00:57:57,120
from Janet Lee, which is no 
small ask. 

1357
00:57:57,440 --> 00:57:59,600
Plus she has to put up with Sam 
for far too long. 

1358
00:57:59,600 --> 00:58:00,960
Not. 
Far too long. 

1359
00:58:01,360 --> 00:58:04,000
What makes my life good is how 
capable she is, I think. 

1360
00:58:04,160 --> 00:58:06,440
Like, yeah, all big ass gets 
himself killed. 

1361
00:58:06,560 --> 00:58:09,000
Sam's pretty useless, The 
sheriff's totally useless. 

1362
00:58:09,280 --> 00:58:11,200
So it's Lila who kind of gets us
to the reveal. 

1363
00:58:11,560 --> 00:58:13,520
And Vera Miles doesn't have an 
easy either, because she's 

1364
00:58:13,520 --> 00:58:16,080
basically just walking from one 
room to another, asking 

1365
00:58:16,080 --> 00:58:18,200
questions a lot of the time. 
But she does bring, like, 

1366
00:58:18,200 --> 00:58:20,160
charisma and presence of the 
part. 

1367
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:21,760
I like it. 
In Sam's hardware store. 

1368
00:58:21,760 --> 00:58:23,960
We are gasses to her. 
I might just believe that. 

1369
00:58:24,120 --> 00:58:26,840
And Lila, just like I don't much
care if you believe me or not. 

1370
00:58:27,120 --> 00:58:30,080
Yeah, yeah. 
I think Miles is smart enough to

1371
00:58:30,080 --> 00:58:32,320
make the character likeable, 
which means that Marion's death 

1372
00:58:32,320 --> 00:58:34,280
hits even harder because of what
Lila's lost. 

1373
00:58:34,520 --> 00:58:35,000
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

1374
00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:37,160
Only thing, and I mean, they 
couldn't have done it, really, 

1375
00:58:37,320 --> 00:58:39,880
but I would love to have seen 
one scene in the first act 

1376
00:58:39,880 --> 00:58:41,720
between Janet Lee and Vera Miles
somewhere. 

1377
00:58:41,720 --> 00:58:43,280
That would have been brilliant 
somehow. 

1378
00:58:43,320 --> 00:58:45,400
Yeah. 
But yeah, brilliant supporting 

1379
00:58:45,400 --> 00:58:47,400
performance, I think. 
And she kind of feels like the 

1380
00:58:47,400 --> 00:58:50,320
lead by the end. 
I would have liked that if she'd

1381
00:58:50,320 --> 00:58:52,200
get, like, turned up and just 
given her half the money. 

1382
00:58:53,040 --> 00:58:55,360
Yeah, I'm leaving. 
Like, give her 20 grand. 

1383
00:58:55,360 --> 00:58:56,880
What's this for? 
She's like, don't ask any 

1384
00:58:56,880 --> 00:58:58,560
questions. 
I will not see us again. 

1385
00:58:58,560 --> 00:59:00,400
And then she takes 20, and 
they've got to try and, like, 

1386
00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:01,480
match it up. 
Yeah. 

1387
00:59:01,600 --> 00:59:02,960
To kind of bind them both 
together. 

1388
00:59:03,080 --> 00:59:04,840
And would it be because even 
though they don't share a scene,

1389
00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:06,360
I can totally see their 
relationship? 

1390
00:59:06,640 --> 00:59:09,120
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I can. 
I can see them on the phone to 

1391
00:59:09,120 --> 00:59:10,480
each other just being like, 
well, why don't you tell us 

1392
00:59:10,480 --> 00:59:12,160
what's going on? 
So it's none of your business? 

1393
00:59:12,240 --> 00:59:13,880
Totally. 
It's it's really good, really 

1394
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:16,040
works. 
Yeah, I think she's really good,

1395
00:59:16,040 --> 00:59:18,840
but I've got Thankless written 
down as well, John, because 

1396
00:59:18,840 --> 00:59:21,600
there is a little bit aspect to 
it, you know, she's the worried 

1397
00:59:21,600 --> 00:59:23,840
sister and that's about it for 
most of it. 

1398
00:59:23,840 --> 00:59:25,400
I mean, her and Sam are very 
similar. 

1399
00:59:25,400 --> 00:59:28,200
They've got a dry fall with the 
plot in the second-half. 

1400
00:59:28,200 --> 00:59:31,120
Once marrying an Arbor cast are 
killed, but she doesn't have 

1401
00:59:31,120 --> 00:59:33,800
much of an arc to it. 
And I think maybe Hitchcock 

1402
00:59:33,840 --> 00:59:36,800
really wanted the more memorable
performance to come from Perkins

1403
00:59:37,040 --> 00:59:39,400
and he doesn't want anyone to 
take the spotlight away from him

1404
00:59:39,760 --> 00:59:41,720
because that's the ironic twist 
of the film. 

1405
00:59:41,720 --> 00:59:44,920
The person you end up investing 
in the most is the murderer at 

1406
00:59:44,920 --> 00:59:47,360
the end. 
Having said that, she is great. 

1407
00:59:47,360 --> 00:59:49,880
I mean, you are screaming at her
not to go into the house at the 

1408
00:59:49,880 --> 00:59:52,360
end because you don't want her 
to meet the same fate as her 

1409
00:59:52,360 --> 00:59:54,360
sister. 
So it's just instantly likeable.

1410
00:59:54,760 --> 00:59:57,400
There's limits as to what Miles 
can do with his character, but 

1411
00:59:57,400 --> 00:59:59,480
she elevated a lot. 
Definitely, yeah. 

1412
00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:01,760
She pushes to the limits of what
you'd expect the character to 

1413
01:00:01,760 --> 01:00:02,720
do. 
Definitely, yeah. 

1414
01:00:03,080 --> 01:00:04,720
Like we're saying about the 
film, I think she does more than

1415
01:00:04,720 --> 01:00:06,640
you could ever reasonably expect
it to do with it. 

1416
01:00:06,760 --> 01:00:09,120
Yeah, definitely just a little 
looks to Norman as well when the

1417
01:00:09,120 --> 01:00:11,480
checkmate just a little. 
Yeah. 

1418
01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:14,360
Who the fucks this game? 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

1419
01:00:15,280 --> 01:00:16,760
Should be more sensible than 
Marion, yeah. 

1420
01:00:18,080 --> 01:00:20,600
So before Beer and Miles, there 
were other actresses in the 

1421
01:00:20,600 --> 01:00:23,920
running to play Leila. 
Felicia Far, Carolyn Jones, 

1422
01:00:24,240 --> 01:00:27,320
Caroline Corney, Eleanor Parker 
were all considered for the 

1423
01:00:27,320 --> 01:00:30,560
role, and Kim Stanley was 
offered the role but apparently 

1424
01:00:30,560 --> 01:00:32,840
turned it down due to 
reservations about working with 

1425
01:00:32,840 --> 01:00:36,320
Anthony Perkins. 
Yeah, she was known mostly as a 

1426
01:00:36,320 --> 01:00:38,480
staging TV actress at the time, 
Kim Stanley. 

1427
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:40,720
And apparently she had a problem
with Perkins, although it's not 

1428
01:00:40,720 --> 01:00:42,680
reported what that was. 
Right. 

1429
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:44,120
Yeah. 
Too much candy for crunch, 

1430
01:00:44,440 --> 01:00:45,600
probably. 
Yeah, maybe. 

1431
01:00:45,800 --> 01:00:48,560
Yeah. 
But cycle wasn't the first time 

1432
01:00:48,560 --> 01:00:50,400
Hitchcock had came across Vera 
Miles. 

1433
01:00:50,680 --> 01:00:54,400
She'd starred alongside Henry 
Fonda in The Wrong Man in 1956, 

1434
01:00:54,840 --> 01:00:57,440
and then Hitchcock had cast her 
alongside James Stewart in 

1435
01:00:57,440 --> 01:00:59,160
Vertigo. 
But that didn't happen. 

1436
01:00:59,160 --> 01:01:01,160
As Miles pulled out when she was
pregnant. 

1437
01:01:01,640 --> 01:01:04,600
Hitchcock replaced her with Kim 
Novak, and according to Miles, 

1438
01:01:04,800 --> 01:01:07,000
when she told him she was 
pulling out, Hitchcock said 

1439
01:01:07,240 --> 01:01:09,520
Don't you know it's a bad taste 
to have more than two children? 

1440
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:14,120
Because he only had one. 
Yeah. 

1441
01:01:14,440 --> 01:01:15,120
Amazing. 
Yeah. 

1442
01:01:15,120 --> 01:01:16,640
I mean, I know that's bad taste,
Alfred. 

1443
01:01:16,640 --> 01:01:18,000
Yes, that. 
Definitely. 

1444
01:01:18,400 --> 01:01:19,920
Is, yeah. 
But yeah, it's quite interesting

1445
01:01:19,920 --> 01:01:23,480
because Grace Kelly retired from
acting in 1956 and Hitchcock 

1446
01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:26,840
apparently saw Miles as his next
main female lead and he signed 

1447
01:01:26,840 --> 01:01:29,520
her to a five year contract and 
had her Paramount stylist get to

1448
01:01:29,520 --> 01:01:31,600
work on her style to turn her 
into a Hitchcock blonde. 

1449
01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:33,800
So yeah, she was lined up for 
Vertigo. 

1450
01:01:34,440 --> 01:01:36,960
Right. 
Wow, could it make matters 

1451
01:01:36,960 --> 01:01:38,760
worse? 
Miles had just filmed the war 

1452
01:01:38,760 --> 01:01:43,160
film called 5 Branded Women 
about Yugoslav women punished 

1453
01:01:43,160 --> 01:01:46,000
for consorting with German 
soldiers, and she'd shaved her 

1454
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:48,160
head for that role. 
So turned up to film Psycho 

1455
01:01:48,200 --> 01:01:51,280
basically bald. 
So she's wearing a wig in the 

1456
01:01:51,280 --> 01:01:51,840
film? 
Yeah, wow. 

1457
01:01:51,840 --> 01:01:52,960
Wow. 
Could never. 

1458
01:01:52,960 --> 01:01:54,160
Tell Dad. 
Never knew that, Yeah. 

1459
01:01:54,280 --> 01:01:55,440
Good job wasn't here in the 
shower. 

1460
01:01:55,440 --> 01:01:56,960
No one would have got the shock 
of his life. 

1461
01:02:00,880 --> 01:02:02,800
She's going to take the wig off 
at the end of the film, then 

1462
01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:11,240
she's like a dad. 
Well, for a performance as Lila 

1463
01:02:11,240 --> 01:02:13,640
Crane, Vera Miles received no 
recognition in the Academy 

1464
01:02:13,640 --> 01:02:15,640
Awards. 
No great surprise given Janet 

1465
01:02:15,640 --> 01:02:18,560
Leigh took the supporting slot. 
But in carrying the second-half 

1466
01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:21,640
of the film and turning Lila 
into a role with real substance,

1467
01:02:21,800 --> 01:02:24,320
some top stuff from Vera Miles. 
Yeah, absolutely. 

1468
01:02:24,320 --> 01:02:26,520
Yeah, Top draw. 
So that's our main cast. 

1469
01:02:26,760 --> 01:02:29,120
We've talked about Janet Leigh 
as Marion, Anthony Perkins as 

1470
01:02:29,120 --> 01:02:33,040
Norman and Vera Miles as Lila. 3
very different performances, but

1471
01:02:33,520 --> 01:02:35,520
some top casting from Hitchcock 
in Psycho. 

1472
01:02:35,600 --> 01:02:44,440
Yeah, brilliant stuff. 
All the right movies will be 

1473
01:02:44,440 --> 01:02:47,000
back shortly. 
Thank you for supporting us by 

1474
01:02:47,000 --> 01:02:48,840
listening to this episode. 
Sponsors. 

1475
01:02:51,960 --> 01:02:53,600
Thanks for listening to our 
sponsors. 

1476
01:02:53,800 --> 01:02:59,240
Now back to the show. 
The middle. 

1477
01:03:02,080 --> 01:03:04,200
Heading into the midsection of 
Psycho and we're going to the 

1478
01:03:04,200 --> 01:03:07,160
most famous moments of all. 
We're going to be talking about 

1479
01:03:07,160 --> 01:03:10,000
Arborgast's arrival of the motel
and his own grizzly fate. 

1480
01:03:10,200 --> 01:03:13,200
But first, we've got 45 seconds 
of Hollywood history to get 

1481
01:03:13,200 --> 01:03:14,760
into. 
We'll do. 

1482
01:03:15,360 --> 01:03:17,920
Having made her decision to go 
back to Phoenix, Marion decides 

1483
01:03:17,920 --> 01:03:21,040
to have a shower before bed. 
Norman, though, our mother has 

1484
01:03:21,040 --> 01:03:23,360
other plans. 
He burst into the bathroom, 

1485
01:03:23,360 --> 01:03:25,680
butchers the tragic Marion, 
leaving her murdered on the 

1486
01:03:25,680 --> 01:03:29,040
tiled floor. 
One of the most famous scenes in

1487
01:03:29,040 --> 01:03:31,560
all of cinema. 
Westie, is it for good reason. 

1488
01:03:32,720 --> 01:03:34,240
It absolutely is, for good 
reason. 

1489
01:03:34,280 --> 01:03:36,400
This would have been incredibly 
shocking. 

1490
01:03:36,760 --> 01:03:39,360
If you're watching this 960, 
you're sitting in that audience.

1491
01:03:39,360 --> 01:03:40,360
It's the first time you've seen 
it. 

1492
01:03:40,360 --> 01:03:43,480
You haven't heard anything about
it, but just imagine that music 

1493
01:03:43,480 --> 01:03:48,440
coming out. 
That's that silhouette creeping 

1494
01:03:48,440 --> 01:03:50,200
up. 
You've got no idea what's going 

1495
01:03:50,200 --> 01:03:51,920
on. 
The reveal from that shower 

1496
01:03:51,920 --> 01:03:54,080
curtain pulling by the sound 
design is incredible. 

1497
01:03:54,240 --> 01:03:58,280
The water still hitting down, 
you're already thinking, well, 

1498
01:03:58,280 --> 01:04:01,320
this is a little bit too much 
nudity that I've already seen, 

1499
01:04:01,320 --> 01:04:03,840
so you'd be bothered about that.
You've already seen a bra in the

1500
01:04:03,840 --> 01:04:05,840
first scene, so you're already 
reeling about that. 

1501
01:04:05,840 --> 01:04:07,280
You have no idea where this is 
going. 

1502
01:04:07,640 --> 01:04:09,400
See the toilet flushing? 
Toilets flush. 

1503
01:04:09,440 --> 01:04:12,040
At this point, it's like 
watching A Serbian Film, like in

1504
01:04:12,040 --> 01:04:17,480
1960. 
But it's just the editing here, 

1505
01:04:17,480 --> 01:04:21,000
just the frenicity of it, just 
the the confusion of the whole 

1506
01:04:21,000 --> 01:04:22,960
scene, just the different angles
that come up. 

1507
01:04:23,680 --> 01:04:25,880
The thing that really freaks me 
out is why do people in films 

1508
01:04:25,880 --> 01:04:28,080
just get in the shower 1st and 
then turn it on? 

1509
01:04:28,200 --> 01:04:29,760
I don't understand why that 
happens. 

1510
01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:31,960
Nobody ever does that. 
Ever. 

1511
01:04:32,120 --> 01:04:35,200
No, it's too cold again. 
Does it and this to do it in 

1512
01:04:35,200 --> 01:04:37,000
Groundhog Day he learns his 
lesson in Groundhog Day he 

1513
01:04:37,000 --> 01:04:39,240
doesn't do it again. 
That's probably why she gets 

1514
01:04:39,240 --> 01:04:42,320
stabbed to be honest. 
But for me it's Hitchcock here 

1515
01:04:42,320 --> 01:04:44,640
and how he just sits with the 
aftermath. 

1516
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:48,120
You just that water runs and 
you're just sitting there going,

1517
01:04:48,560 --> 01:04:51,000
can I leave now? 
Can I get out of here because 

1518
01:04:51,000 --> 01:04:52,720
I'm so uncomfortable? 
Can I breathe? 

1519
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:56,000
There's that blood coming down 
and into the drain and then that

1520
01:04:56,000 --> 01:04:58,280
amazing transition from the 
drain to the eye and then it 

1521
01:04:58,280 --> 01:05:00,200
pulls back and then he's still 
seen her on the ground. 

1522
01:05:00,600 --> 01:05:02,160
It's just punched you in the 
face. 

1523
01:05:02,800 --> 01:05:06,360
It's a kangaroo kicking you in 
the face for 30 seconds and then

1524
01:05:06,480 --> 01:05:09,280
stroking your back to life for 
like an hour and a half. 

1525
01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:13,080
Really strange image that. 
Yeah, Kangaroo. 

1526
01:05:14,080 --> 01:05:16,040
Yeah, it is a strange image, but
I'm sticking with it. 

1527
01:05:16,120 --> 01:05:17,520
I'm sticking with it. 
Yeah. 

1528
01:05:17,520 --> 01:05:20,040
It's a massive punch in the face
and then a stroke of the hair. 

1529
01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:21,720
It's just so well done by 
Hitchcock. 

1530
01:05:21,920 --> 01:05:24,280
If I had a time machine, I would
go back and watch the audience 

1531
01:05:24,280 --> 01:05:27,800
watch this first shown 1960. 
No one knew what was going. 

1532
01:05:27,880 --> 01:05:29,240
That would just be incredible. 
Yeah. 

1533
01:05:29,920 --> 01:05:31,840
Oh, it really would. 
I mean, not just one of the most

1534
01:05:31,840 --> 01:05:34,280
famous scenes in Hollywood. 
This is one of the best pieces 

1535
01:05:34,280 --> 01:05:35,760
of film making I think I've ever
seen. 

1536
01:05:36,160 --> 01:05:38,200
Literally every frame there for 
a reason. 

1537
01:05:38,200 --> 01:05:41,120
It's an extraordinary thing. 
Firstly, when Norman pulls back 

1538
01:05:41,120 --> 01:05:43,600
the shower curtain and Marian 
spins round, they do like a 

1539
01:05:43,600 --> 01:05:46,680
classic thing, an American cut, 
I think it's called, like when 

1540
01:05:46,680 --> 01:05:48,680
the monster revealed or 
something, and it goes wide 

1541
01:05:48,680 --> 01:05:50,800
shot, mid shot, close up, like, 
bang, bang, bang. 

1542
01:05:51,040 --> 01:05:51,960
Yeah, it does that. 
Yeah. 

1543
01:05:51,960 --> 01:05:54,320
Wide shot Marian to a face, 
screaming, but just a mouth. 

1544
01:05:54,560 --> 01:05:56,800
It could look really cheesy if 
you don't get it right. 

1545
01:05:57,000 --> 01:06:00,440
This one is unbelievable. 
It's out outrageous. 

1546
01:06:00,640 --> 01:06:02,320
It's the pace of it. 
It's perfect, isn't it? 

1547
01:06:02,400 --> 01:06:05,800
It is the shots themselves are 
just perfect and then we're in. 

1548
01:06:05,800 --> 01:06:07,840
It's total chaos. 
I think the average shot length 

1549
01:06:07,840 --> 01:06:10,760
of the attacks, about 3/4 of a 
second, which let's just get 

1550
01:06:10,760 --> 01:06:12,880
away with far more nudity than 
you would have otherwise I 

1551
01:06:12,880 --> 01:06:15,240
think. 
But the quick cutting, it's like

1552
01:06:15,240 --> 01:06:18,200
an assault on us watching. 
It's just a barrage of all these

1553
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:21,400
horrific images. 1 after the 
other, the knife or marrying, 

1554
01:06:21,400 --> 01:06:23,880
screaming or a body being 
stabbed different. 

1555
01:06:23,880 --> 01:06:25,800
Your brains like catching up 
with one another. 

1556
01:06:25,800 --> 01:06:28,320
One gets thrown in front of you.
And we often talk about breaking

1557
01:06:28,320 --> 01:06:31,480
the 180 grey rule on here. 
Yeah, yeah, Hitchcock's breaking

1558
01:06:31,480 --> 01:06:33,880
the 360° rule doesn't exist. 
Yeah. 

1559
01:06:34,200 --> 01:06:37,280
Living about all over the place.
It feels frantic as hell, which 

1560
01:06:37,280 --> 01:06:38,800
is obviously the exactly the 
idea. 

1561
01:06:39,320 --> 01:06:41,400
I love how we treat it as its 
own short film almost, because 

1562
01:06:41,400 --> 01:06:44,120
we get bookend shots. 
The first shot of the scene, 

1563
01:06:44,120 --> 01:06:46,560
looking up at the shower and it 
ends with that same shot as 

1564
01:06:46,560 --> 01:06:47,760
well. 
Same shot. 

1565
01:06:47,840 --> 01:06:50,440
And it feels totally different 
both times you say it. 

1566
01:06:50,560 --> 01:06:52,720
I love that. 
I think as a director, having a 

1567
01:06:52,720 --> 01:06:56,000
vision for a moment in the film 
and then executing it, this, 

1568
01:06:56,280 --> 01:06:59,080
it's hard to top. 
It's horrific to watch. 

1569
01:06:59,200 --> 01:07:01,720
But creatively, I'm just in 
total, all of it. 

1570
01:07:01,920 --> 01:07:03,920
And I didn't even mention the 
score and. 

1571
01:07:05,640 --> 01:07:09,240
That was the fastest I've ever 
heard you talk about anything in

1572
01:07:09,240 --> 01:07:15,560
25 years. 
Yeah, I mean, 45 seconds, 45 

1573
01:07:15,560 --> 01:07:18,400
seconds in cinema has changed 
forever after this. 

1574
01:07:18,520 --> 01:07:21,880
That's all it takes. 
I mean it's not lost one bit of 

1575
01:07:21,880 --> 01:07:24,880
it's power to shock and again, 
like Wesley out do anything to 

1576
01:07:24,880 --> 01:07:27,960
go back to 1960 and see this for
an audience for the first time. 

1577
01:07:27,960 --> 01:07:31,000
I mean it's scandalous in 
itself, borderline just the 

1578
01:07:31,000 --> 01:07:32,960
notion of seeing the woman in 
the shower. 

1579
01:07:33,160 --> 01:07:35,640
So that's going to play you off 
killer and then that to lead 

1580
01:07:35,640 --> 01:07:38,880
into the most brutal murder 
probably ever in cinematic 

1581
01:07:38,880 --> 01:07:40,480
history. 
At that point, they must have 

1582
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:45,400
lost their absolute minds 
because this plays into the fact

1583
01:07:45,400 --> 01:07:47,960
that this is when someone is at 
their most vulnerable naked in 

1584
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:50,360
the shower. 
But also, it's the place where 

1585
01:07:50,360 --> 01:07:52,480
you should be at your most 
comfortable, because what's 

1586
01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:54,400
scary about taking a shower? 
Everyone does it. 

1587
01:07:55,040 --> 01:07:57,560
Hitchcock just obliterates all 
that comfort. 

1588
01:07:57,920 --> 01:08:01,040
And it's maybe the greatest 
example of the suggestive power 

1589
01:08:01,040 --> 01:08:03,680
of cinema ever. 
People think the C nudity, the 

1590
01:08:03,680 --> 01:08:05,880
don't. 
People think the C the knife P 

1591
01:08:05,880 --> 01:08:08,560
is flesh, the don't. 
It's all because of the editor, 

1592
01:08:08,560 --> 01:08:12,400
because of that music and how 
Hitchcock saw this in his head, 

1593
01:08:12,880 --> 01:08:15,280
translated it to the edit, added
the score. 

1594
01:08:15,480 --> 01:08:18,080
It is absolute genius of the 
highest order and it still 

1595
01:08:18,080 --> 01:08:20,200
scares the absolute shit out of 
me every time. 

1596
01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:23,000
I think it is filmmaking genius.
It's about as good as it gets. 

1597
01:08:23,160 --> 01:08:25,439
Yeah. 
So the shower scene was shot in 

1598
01:08:25,439 --> 01:08:30,680
six days, from December 17th 
through December 23rd, 1959, but

1599
01:08:30,680 --> 01:08:33,200
it had to be postponed twice as 
Janet Lee was poorly. 

1600
01:08:33,760 --> 01:08:37,640
It's 45 seconds long, 50 
different camera angles and had 

1601
01:08:37,640 --> 01:08:40,680
78 setups. 
It was storyboarded in full, but

1602
01:08:40,680 --> 01:08:43,560
Hitchcock bought a Moviola 
editing machine on the set so he

1603
01:08:43,560 --> 01:08:45,680
could see what they were making 
as they were filming. 

1604
01:08:46,160 --> 01:08:47,920
Storyboard. 
What was it, a fucking flick 

1605
01:08:47,920 --> 01:08:50,920
boot? 
Yeah, it's really fast. 

1606
01:08:51,600 --> 01:08:54,279
That influenced what footage 
they would shoot on the fly. 

1607
01:08:54,279 --> 01:08:54,920
Amazing. 
Wow. 

1608
01:08:55,240 --> 01:08:56,800
Yeah, you need to see it. 
Surely don't. 

1609
01:08:56,800 --> 01:08:59,200
Yeah, the cooks are that quick. 
You can't storyboard this and 

1610
01:08:59,200 --> 01:09:02,000
nail it on the page. 
Surely it's just genius stuff. 

1611
01:09:02,200 --> 01:09:04,319
Yeah. 
Yeah, and Anthony Perkins wasn't

1612
01:09:04,319 --> 01:09:06,680
present at all during the 
shooting of the shower scene, 

1613
01:09:06,960 --> 01:09:08,720
and a stand in played mother 
instead. 

1614
01:09:09,120 --> 01:09:12,120
Some reports say it Perkins was 
rehearsing a Broadway show 

1615
01:09:12,120 --> 01:09:15,319
called Green Willow in New York 
at the time, but that's not why 

1616
01:09:15,319 --> 01:09:17,680
he wasn't there. 
Hitchcock kept him away as he 

1617
01:09:17,680 --> 01:09:20,160
didn't want any chance that the 
audience might be able to spot 

1618
01:09:20,160 --> 01:09:23,279
that Norman was Mother. 
So instead Mother is played by 

1619
01:09:23,279 --> 01:09:26,040
two stunt women called Margot 
Eppe and Anne. 

1620
01:09:26,040 --> 01:09:27,240
Dore. 
Yeah. 

1621
01:09:27,240 --> 01:09:29,800
So Margot Eppe is the one who 
rips the shower curtain. 

1622
01:09:29,800 --> 01:09:31,240
Auburn. 
And then for the rest of it, 

1623
01:09:31,240 --> 01:09:32,880
apparently it's Anne Dore, 
right? 

1624
01:09:32,880 --> 01:09:34,720
I mean, we can't tell. 
Obviously, her face has been 

1625
01:09:34,720 --> 01:09:36,160
made-up because it's like, pitch
black. 

1626
01:09:36,279 --> 01:09:37,720
There's no features there, is 
there? 

1627
01:09:37,720 --> 01:09:40,040
It's crazy. 
Is that an influence on Star 

1628
01:09:40,040 --> 01:09:43,399
Wars? 
Andor I got that out. 

1629
01:09:43,399 --> 01:09:44,760
That was the worst joke I've 
ever put. 

1630
01:09:47,840 --> 01:09:50,960
Janet Lee wore mole skin pads 
and strips to cover herself 

1631
01:09:50,960 --> 01:09:54,120
while filming the scene, and she
had a body double called Marley 

1632
01:09:54,120 --> 01:09:56,920
Renfrow. 
Renfrow was a model and a dancer

1633
01:09:57,280 --> 01:09:59,360
and said that when she 
auditioned, she had to strip 

1634
01:09:59,360 --> 01:10:02,200
naked for Hitchcock and Janet 
Lee so they could review her 

1635
01:10:02,200 --> 01:10:04,000
body. 
Ridiculous, She said. 

1636
01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:07,200
She spent hours a day naked on 
the set, and at one point 

1637
01:10:07,400 --> 01:10:09,920
Hitchcock attached a measuring 
tape to the camera and put the 

1638
01:10:09,920 --> 01:10:13,280
point of it on her breast just 
to make sure it was going to be 

1639
01:10:13,280 --> 01:10:14,840
in focus. 
Which is a normal thing for a 

1640
01:10:14,840 --> 01:10:17,120
focus bullet to be honest, but 
not the director. 

1641
01:10:18,520 --> 01:10:20,440
I'll do that. 
I'll do that one. 

1642
01:10:20,680 --> 01:10:21,960
You take a break. 
Where is this from? 

1643
01:10:22,440 --> 01:10:24,720
A&Q Is it? 
To be fair, she said he was a 

1644
01:10:24,720 --> 01:10:26,440
gentleman and went out of his 
way to make her feel 

1645
01:10:26,440 --> 01:10:27,720
comfortable. 
So I mean, that's, that's all 

1646
01:10:27,720 --> 01:10:30,320
very nice, but still. 
Yeah, fair enough. 

1647
01:10:30,600 --> 01:10:32,720
Well, according to Molly 
Renfrow, whenever we're looking 

1648
01:10:32,720 --> 01:10:35,440
at a shot where we can't see 
Janet Lee's face, it's her that 

1649
01:10:35,440 --> 01:10:37,560
we're seeing, right? 
And when Norman wrapped 

1650
01:10:37,560 --> 01:10:40,280
Maureen's body up and carries 
out of the car, Anthony Perkins 

1651
01:10:40,280 --> 01:10:41,880
is carrying Molly Renfrow, 
right? 

1652
01:10:42,160 --> 01:10:44,240
Yeah. 
She only made about $500.00 for 

1653
01:10:44,240 --> 01:10:46,360
the film, apparently. 
And she went on to become one of

1654
01:10:46,360 --> 01:10:48,200
the first Playboy Bunny girls as
well. 

1655
01:10:48,200 --> 01:10:50,960
Molly Renfrow So. 
Some legacy, right? 

1656
01:10:51,120 --> 01:10:53,840
Fair enough. 
And obviously, one of the most 

1657
01:10:53,840 --> 01:10:56,800
famous parts of the shower scene
is the shrieking strings in the 

1658
01:10:56,800 --> 01:11:00,400
score written by Bernard Herman.
Hitchcock had originally told 

1659
01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:03,120
Herman that he wanted the scene 
without any music at all, but 

1660
01:11:03,120 --> 01:11:05,720
Herman disagreed. 
So it just brought music for it 

1661
01:11:05,720 --> 01:11:07,400
anyway. 
And when Hitchcock was 

1662
01:11:07,400 --> 01:11:10,280
disappointed with how the scene 
was turning out, Herman showed 

1663
01:11:10,280 --> 01:11:12,920
of his composition. 
Hitchcock was so impressed that 

1664
01:11:12,920 --> 01:11:15,520
he used the score in the film. 
And when Herman asked why he 

1665
01:11:15,520 --> 01:11:18,720
hadn't wanted music in the 1st 
place, Hitchcock said it was an 

1666
01:11:18,920 --> 01:11:21,640
improper suggestion. 
My boy, improper suggestion. 

1667
01:11:23,240 --> 01:11:26,480
Yeah, I mean, to say Herman was 
right goes without saying. 

1668
01:11:26,480 --> 01:11:27,480
A. 
Little bit, yeah. 

1669
01:11:27,600 --> 01:11:29,520
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
Another bit in the score that 

1670
01:11:29,520 --> 01:11:32,520
blows me away is after the 
attacks done and Marion's alone 

1671
01:11:32,520 --> 01:11:36,320
and like dying and the music is 
that like Babble Babble. 

1672
01:11:36,880 --> 01:11:38,280
Yeah. 
That represents Marion's 

1673
01:11:38,280 --> 01:11:40,800
heartbeat, surely, because it 
gets slower and slower, then 

1674
01:11:40,800 --> 01:11:44,920
stops as soon as she collapses. 
That is beyond genius. 

1675
01:11:44,920 --> 01:11:46,360
Yeah, get out. 
Yeah. 

1676
01:11:46,440 --> 01:11:48,320
Get the hell out, Bernard. 
Yeah. 

1677
01:11:49,160 --> 01:11:51,960
We mentioned Saul Bass earlier 
as he did the opening title 

1678
01:11:51,960 --> 01:11:54,640
sequence, obviously, and he was 
involved in the shower scene 

1679
01:11:54,640 --> 01:11:56,520
too. 
He storyboarded the scene and 

1680
01:11:56,520 --> 01:11:59,120
eight days before the film was 
shot, Bass filmed test footage 

1681
01:11:59,120 --> 01:12:01,760
of the shower scene with Marley 
Renfrow and editor George 

1682
01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:03,680
Tomasini as a demonstration. 
Hitchcock. 

1683
01:12:04,560 --> 01:12:05,880
Yeah. 
So it was like a proof of 

1684
01:12:05,880 --> 01:12:08,280
concept basically to show how 
the quick cutting would work. 

1685
01:12:08,520 --> 01:12:10,600
I mean, usually proof of 
concepts are when they're using 

1686
01:12:10,600 --> 01:12:12,960
new technology. 
This needed a proof of concept 

1687
01:12:12,960 --> 01:12:15,360
because they were just 
innovating film making itself. 

1688
01:12:15,760 --> 01:12:19,680
Just fantastic. 
But there was some controversy 

1689
01:12:19,680 --> 01:12:23,200
later in 1970 when Sol Bass said
he didn't just storyboard the 

1690
01:12:23,200 --> 01:12:25,200
shower scene, he directed it as 
well. 

1691
01:12:25,440 --> 01:12:27,480
But this was denied by some crew
members. 

1692
01:12:27,720 --> 01:12:30,840
Hilton Green, the assistant 
director, said Bass was never on

1693
01:12:30,840 --> 01:12:33,520
set and said he later confronted
Bass about it. 

1694
01:12:33,520 --> 01:12:36,560
And Janet Leigh went on record 
to say I was in that shower for 

1695
01:12:36,560 --> 01:12:38,880
seven days. 
And believe me, Alfred Hitchcock

1696
01:12:38,880 --> 01:12:42,240
was right next to his camera for
every one of those 70 odd shots.

1697
01:12:43,440 --> 01:12:46,160
I bet he was. 
Yeah, with the tape measure. 

1698
01:12:46,480 --> 01:12:48,840
Yeah. 
Even when everyone had gone 

1699
01:12:48,840 --> 01:12:50,800
home. 
And Joseph Stefano called Bus's 

1700
01:12:50,800 --> 01:12:52,920
claim the most shocking thing 
about Psycho as. 

1701
01:12:53,440 --> 01:12:56,560
Well, I'm not surprised. 
Yeah, I directed the shower 

1702
01:12:56,560 --> 01:12:59,840
scene because Oh yeah, amazing. 
Bastard do the storyboard 

1703
01:12:59,840 --> 01:13:01,360
though. 
If you see nose they are 

1704
01:13:01,360 --> 01:13:03,040
outstanding. 
Oh, there will be. 

1705
01:13:03,040 --> 01:13:04,120
Yeah. 
Because that's what he's good 

1706
01:13:04,120 --> 01:13:04,600
at. 
Yeah. 

1707
01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:05,760
Yeah. 
Yeah, exactly. 

1708
01:13:06,360 --> 01:13:08,560
Just seeing your storyboarded. 
It that's still an amazing 

1709
01:13:08,560 --> 01:13:11,280
claim, yeah. 
And John mentioned how to see 

1710
01:13:11,280 --> 01:13:13,360
this book ended by two shots 
looking up at the shower. 

1711
01:13:13,640 --> 01:13:15,400
And these shots needed a custom 
prop. 

1712
01:13:15,680 --> 01:13:18,240
Hitchcock wanted the camera to 
be in the middle of The Jets of 

1713
01:13:18,240 --> 01:13:21,640
water, so a six foot diameter 
shower head was made-up and the 

1714
01:13:21,640 --> 01:13:24,240
central jets placed so the water
sprayed past the camera. 

1715
01:13:24,240 --> 01:13:26,840
No wonder Gently was scared of 
showers after there's Six 

1716
01:13:26,840 --> 01:13:31,160
footers war the worlds. 
Trigger happy TV shower? 

1717
01:13:31,280 --> 01:13:32,360
No. 
Isn't it massive? 

1718
01:13:32,840 --> 01:13:33,680
Shoot. 
Hello. 

1719
01:13:33,680 --> 01:13:39,640
No, I'm in the shower. 
But another nice deal about his 

1720
01:13:39,640 --> 01:13:42,440
shot is a during the attack it 
seems like more, but we only 

1721
01:13:42,440 --> 01:13:44,960
actually see two shots of the 
knife touching Marion's body, 

1722
01:13:45,240 --> 01:13:46,800
one's where it seems to go into 
her stomach. 

1723
01:13:46,800 --> 01:13:49,080
And they did that by pressing 
the knife against Leigh's or 

1724
01:13:49,080 --> 01:13:51,720
maybe Molly Renfrow's body, 
pulling it away, and then 

1725
01:13:51,720 --> 01:13:54,440
playing that shot backwards, 
which is cool. 

1726
01:13:55,040 --> 01:13:57,120
Yeah, yeah. 
And with the film being shot in 

1727
01:13:57,120 --> 01:13:59,920
black and white, the production 
used chocolate syrup instead of 

1728
01:13:59,920 --> 01:14:01,920
blood because it showed up 
better on camera. 

1729
01:14:02,400 --> 01:14:05,840
Some reports say it was Bosco 
chocolate syrup, while Molly 

1730
01:14:05,840 --> 01:14:08,680
Renfrow said it was Hershey's. 
An important distinction. 

1731
01:14:09,200 --> 01:14:12,520
Yeah, doesn't matter. 
Well, you mainly see a bird 

1732
01:14:12,520 --> 01:14:13,640
running down the drain, don't 
we? 

1733
01:14:13,640 --> 01:14:14,760
That's what we say, I think, 
yeah. 

1734
01:14:14,920 --> 01:14:17,960
Yeah, and more food was used to 
create the scene. 

1735
01:14:18,240 --> 01:14:20,680
The sound the knife makes 
whenever marrying the stabbed is

1736
01:14:20,680 --> 01:14:22,640
a knife stabbing A cassaba 
melon. 

1737
01:14:22,840 --> 01:14:26,480
One of the props crew called Bob
Bourne lined up a Lord of Melons

1738
01:14:26,720 --> 01:14:29,000
and they're all stabbed in 
sequence, with Hitchcock 

1739
01:14:29,000 --> 01:14:30,680
choosing the one he thought 
sounded best. 

1740
01:14:31,160 --> 01:14:33,600
One of the things they also 
tried was steak, and when 

1741
01:14:33,600 --> 01:14:36,280
Hitchcock didn't choose that, 
Bob Bourne said he just took it 

1742
01:14:36,280 --> 01:14:37,440
home and had it for his dinner 
of. 

1743
01:14:37,920 --> 01:14:39,080
Course he did. 
She would do. 

1744
01:14:39,400 --> 01:14:42,480
It Yeah, well, apparently 
Hitchcock closed his eyes and 

1745
01:14:42,480 --> 01:14:44,800
Bourne went along the table 
stabbing like melons and 

1746
01:14:44,800 --> 01:14:48,800
cassavas and and at the end 
Hitchcock just went cassava. 

1747
01:14:52,760 --> 01:14:55,200
Final shot is the extreme close 
up where we transitioned from 

1748
01:14:55,200 --> 01:14:58,120
the shower drain to Marion's eye
and the shot has two errors. 

1749
01:14:58,280 --> 01:15:00,600
As Marion has died, a pupil 
should be dilated. 

1750
01:15:00,800 --> 01:15:03,440
Janet Lee was going to wear 
contacts to make our eyes look 

1751
01:15:03,440 --> 01:15:06,400
that way, but when Hitchcock was
told it would take six weeks for

1752
01:15:06,400 --> 01:15:08,720
our eyes to acclimatize, he 
ditched the idea. 

1753
01:15:09,040 --> 01:15:11,560
And then after filming, 
Hitchcock's wife Alma reveal 

1754
01:15:11,840 --> 01:15:14,640
spotted that Lee took a breath 
towards the end of the take. 

1755
01:15:14,640 --> 01:15:17,640
So that's why we cut away to the
shower and then back to Marion 

1756
01:15:17,640 --> 01:15:19,360
again. 
Yeah, such a shame because it 

1757
01:15:19,360 --> 01:15:21,840
would have all been one shot. 
That was the plan, yeah. 

1758
01:15:22,000 --> 01:15:23,640
Because, yeah, he'd be. 
Then go straight from there back

1759
01:15:23,640 --> 01:15:25,160
to the money on the night stand,
don't we? 

1760
01:15:25,440 --> 01:15:27,080
Yeah. 
Just kind of feels totally 

1761
01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:28,760
meaningless. 
It does, yeah. 

1762
01:15:28,800 --> 01:15:31,480
They're pointless, yeah. 
After this has happened, Norman 

1763
01:15:31,480 --> 01:15:34,000
has to clear it up. 
And the thing about the scene 

1764
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:36,920
and it took so long for it to 
click with me is how efficient 

1765
01:15:36,920 --> 01:15:38,560
Norman is to doing this. 
Yeah. 

1766
01:15:38,640 --> 01:15:40,360
Yeah, how many times has he done
this? 

1767
01:15:40,360 --> 01:15:43,640
Exactly, this is not the first 
body he's had to get rid of. 

1768
01:15:43,720 --> 01:15:47,680
He's so like nor fuss about it. 
And there's this moment of pure 

1769
01:15:47,680 --> 01:15:50,320
Hitchcock when he's pushed the 
car into the swamp and it floats

1770
01:15:50,320 --> 01:15:52,720
for a bit and you just think, oh
God, it's not going to sink. 

1771
01:15:53,160 --> 01:15:56,320
You shouldn't want it to sink. 
But Hitchcock has put you 

1772
01:15:56,320 --> 01:15:59,760
entirely your Norman side in you
field, just as much relief as he

1773
01:15:59,760 --> 01:16:01,120
does when it does finally 
disappear. 

1774
01:16:01,720 --> 01:16:03,720
I think it's such a strong 
choice just showing that scene 

1775
01:16:03,720 --> 01:16:06,840
because it's a good 10 minutes 
of no dialogue, just following 

1776
01:16:06,840 --> 01:16:09,720
Norman round, doing not all that
much really, but I can't see my 

1777
01:16:09,720 --> 01:16:10,800
eyes off it. 
It's crazy. 

1778
01:16:11,000 --> 01:16:13,160
Yeah, yeah. 
After the murder and clean up, 

1779
01:16:13,160 --> 01:16:16,160
Norman hides Mariano's body by 
putting it in the boot of the 

1780
01:16:16,160 --> 01:16:19,440
car and sinking it in a swamp. 
This was filmed on the Universal

1781
01:16:19,440 --> 01:16:21,920
back lot. 
A hydraulic lift was submerged 

1782
01:16:21,920 --> 01:16:24,560
in a small lake and that's how 
they created the effect of the 

1783
01:16:24,560 --> 01:16:26,520
car stopping, sinking and then 
starting again. 

1784
01:16:26,760 --> 01:16:29,680
Yeah, and the $40,000 goes in 
there as well, doesn't it? 

1785
01:16:29,920 --> 01:16:30,680
Yeah, it does. 
Yeah. 

1786
01:16:30,680 --> 01:16:32,640
So it's like he's not just 
getting rid of marrying, He's 

1787
01:16:32,640 --> 01:16:35,200
getting rid of the entire first 
half of the film is like, none 

1788
01:16:35,200 --> 01:16:36,640
of it left. 
Money means nothing. 

1789
01:16:36,680 --> 01:16:38,760
Yeah. 
So marrying's gone, the money's 

1790
01:16:38,760 --> 01:16:41,960
gone, Norman's cleaned up, sunk 
the car, and as far as he knows,

1791
01:16:42,080 --> 01:16:44,800
he's got away with it. 
However, a certain private 

1792
01:16:44,800 --> 01:16:46,920
investigator has other ideas. 
Yeah. 

1793
01:16:47,200 --> 01:16:52,640
He certainly does. 
Arborgast with Marion missing 

1794
01:16:52,640 --> 01:16:55,440
her sister Lila gets involved. 
She heads to Sam's Hardware 

1795
01:16:55,440 --> 01:16:58,200
store where they're joined by a 
third party Pi, Milton 

1796
01:16:58,200 --> 01:17:01,520
Arborgast, hired by Tom Cassidy 
to find his $40,000. 

1797
01:17:01,960 --> 01:17:04,200
In the scenes that follow away 
with Arborgast as he heads to 

1798
01:17:04,200 --> 01:17:08,960
the Bates Motel, meets Norman, 
and then meets Mother Matt. 

1799
01:17:09,120 --> 01:17:12,280
How does the investigation go 
with Arborgast? 

1800
01:17:13,680 --> 01:17:17,360
I mean, he turns up to question 
Norman, and is there anyone who 

1801
01:17:17,360 --> 01:17:20,040
could be any worse in this 
situation than Norman? 

1802
01:17:20,560 --> 01:17:23,600
I mean, he is absolutely 
rubbish. 

1803
01:17:23,640 --> 01:17:26,680
The slightest bit of gentle 
questioning and he just falls to

1804
01:17:26,680 --> 01:17:29,040
pieces. 
He becomes this stammering, 

1805
01:17:29,040 --> 01:17:31,640
nervous wreck and it becomes one
of the funniest scenes in the 

1806
01:17:31,640 --> 01:17:34,560
film for me because he's chewing
on his candy as usual. 

1807
01:17:34,840 --> 01:17:37,200
And it just gets more and more 
intense and you get this 

1808
01:17:37,200 --> 01:17:39,760
incredible shot. 
And it never feels to make me 

1809
01:17:39,760 --> 01:17:43,080
laugh when he leans over to see 
Marian's signature in the book 

1810
01:17:43,080 --> 01:17:46,120
and in the the one that Albert 
Gaster's got to like, compare. 

1811
01:17:46,440 --> 01:17:50,440
And it's this massive close up 
of him in his jaw is going 10 to

1812
01:17:50,440 --> 01:17:52,320
a dozen just grinding that 
candy. 

1813
01:17:52,480 --> 01:17:56,000
And you can see in his head he's
going fuck, fuck, fuck. 

1814
01:17:56,200 --> 01:17:57,760
I've been rumbled, I've given it
away. 

1815
01:17:58,360 --> 01:18:01,160
But what love is? 
Albert Gaster's so amused by how

1816
01:18:01,160 --> 01:18:03,520
easy this is. 
He's like, who is this guy? 

1817
01:18:03,520 --> 01:18:06,880
He's like giving this 
information up so easily, but 

1818
01:18:06,880 --> 01:18:09,480
it's all a lovely bit of sleight
of hand because Norman is so 

1819
01:18:09,480 --> 01:18:11,120
nervous. 
You think, well, there's no way 

1820
01:18:11,120 --> 01:18:14,120
he could do a brutal murder, 
surely, no way, this guy. 

1821
01:18:14,520 --> 01:18:16,240
And like I say, I think it's 
such a funny scene. 

1822
01:18:16,240 --> 01:18:18,600
And that's a great contrast to 
what we know is going to happen 

1823
01:18:18,600 --> 01:18:22,280
to Arbogast shortly. 
It is another great dialogue 

1824
01:18:22,280 --> 01:18:23,920
scene. 
It's also pretty strange 

1825
01:18:23,920 --> 01:18:27,200
structurally as well, because we
get the intros to Lila and 

1826
01:18:27,200 --> 01:18:29,840
Arbogast in Sam's hardware 
store, and it's pretty odd 

1827
01:18:29,840 --> 01:18:32,800
because Lila just turns up and 
then Arbogast just turns up. 

1828
01:18:32,960 --> 01:18:36,560
Like skulking in the doorway. 
Really weird from here. 

1829
01:18:36,560 --> 01:18:38,640
These are our main characters 
and it should feel like a really

1830
01:18:38,640 --> 01:18:41,160
jarring sort of handover, but I 
don't think it does. 

1831
01:18:41,760 --> 01:18:44,200
And the tone shifts because we 
go from Norman cleaner with the 

1832
01:18:44,200 --> 01:18:47,560
swamp, which is all quiet and 
tense, straight into this snappy

1833
01:18:47,560 --> 01:18:49,680
three-way dialogue scene. 
It kind of feels like the 

1834
01:18:49,680 --> 01:18:52,280
curtains dropped and then opened
again to reveal the hardware 

1835
01:18:52,280 --> 01:18:53,840
store. 
And it works. 

1836
01:18:53,840 --> 01:18:55,760
It's all just really well judged
by Hitchcock. 

1837
01:18:56,360 --> 01:18:59,200
But in Arborgas at the motel 
with Norman 12, Cabin 12 

1838
01:18:59,200 --> 01:19:01,440
vacancies, obviously. 
Obviously straight in there with

1839
01:19:01,440 --> 01:19:02,760
that. 
That's the power shifts and the 

1840
01:19:02,760 --> 01:19:05,040
conversation that are great 
because Norman is all cocky at 

1841
01:19:05,040 --> 01:19:07,760
first, but Arborgas kind of 
picks his story apart. 

1842
01:19:07,960 --> 01:19:10,360
I think Perkins is really good 
because there's Norman's story 

1843
01:19:10,360 --> 01:19:12,280
unravels. 
He starts getting all nervous 

1844
01:19:12,280 --> 01:19:14,840
and jumpy and Norman just 
totally gives himself away. 

1845
01:19:15,120 --> 01:19:17,760
As soon as he changes his mind 
about not remembering Marion, he

1846
01:19:17,760 --> 01:19:20,680
looks guilty as sin. 
Yeah, and the line that does it 

1847
01:19:20,680 --> 01:19:23,840
is when he says I'm not capable 
of being fooled, not even by a 

1848
01:19:23,840 --> 01:19:25,960
woman. 
That's a great line because it's

1849
01:19:25,960 --> 01:19:28,080
like he thinks women are more 
intelligent than him, but also 

1850
01:19:28,120 --> 01:19:29,600
deceitful. 
So brilliant. 

1851
01:19:29,600 --> 01:19:32,840
From Perkins and Martin Balsam 
as Arborgast and great writing. 

1852
01:19:32,840 --> 01:19:35,160
I think it's another brilliant 
dialogue scene. 

1853
01:19:35,440 --> 01:19:37,360
Arborgast is played by Martin 
Balsam. 

1854
01:19:37,520 --> 01:19:39,520
He'd made his way up on the 
stage before breaking into 

1855
01:19:39,520 --> 01:19:43,320
films, and he was suggested to 
Hitchcock by Joseph Stefano, who

1856
01:19:43,320 --> 01:19:45,080
knew him from the New York stage
world. 

1857
01:19:45,280 --> 01:19:48,200
Stefano told Hitchcock that 
Balsam had a particularly 

1858
01:19:48,200 --> 01:19:51,680
unfriendly smile. 
Which he kind of, yeah. 

1859
01:19:52,200 --> 01:19:54,680
Yeah, 12 Angry Men was his first
major film role, wasn't it? 

1860
01:19:55,080 --> 01:19:57,640
I think he's an excellent actor.
Dialogue scenes especially. 

1861
01:19:57,760 --> 01:20:00,120
He's got this really like 
natural style in his delivery, I

1862
01:20:00,120 --> 01:20:01,840
think, and it works really well,
yeah. 

1863
01:20:02,960 --> 01:20:05,640
And when filming this scene 
between Or Bogas and Norman, 

1864
01:20:06,080 --> 01:20:09,080
Hitchcock directed Balsam and 
Perkins to overlap each of this 

1865
01:20:09,080 --> 01:20:10,680
dialogue to make it seem more 
natural. 

1866
01:20:11,080 --> 01:20:13,440
And the scene worked so well 
that the crew burst into 

1867
01:20:13,440 --> 01:20:15,080
applause when Hitchcock shouted 
Cut. 

1868
01:20:16,160 --> 01:20:17,960
Yeah, what they do as well, if 
you've noticed, is that through 

1869
01:20:17,960 --> 01:20:20,520
the whole scene, the camera is 
almost always on the listener 

1870
01:20:20,680 --> 01:20:22,320
rather than the speaker. 
Yeah. 

1871
01:20:22,600 --> 01:20:24,520
Which is great for an 
interrogation scene because the 

1872
01:20:24,520 --> 01:20:26,160
reactions that kind of tell the 
story. 

1873
01:20:26,160 --> 01:20:28,160
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
And there's all kinds of camera 

1874
01:20:28,160 --> 01:20:30,360
angles and different framing. 
I mean, I'm not counted, but 

1875
01:20:30,360 --> 01:20:33,320
apparently there's 99 cuts in 
this one scene, like for a 

1876
01:20:33,320 --> 01:20:34,360
dialogue scene. 
Yeah. 

1877
01:20:34,640 --> 01:20:36,520
Wow. 
So, I mean, we've been 

1878
01:20:36,520 --> 01:20:38,440
introduced to him, but he's out 
of there. 

1879
01:20:38,720 --> 01:20:42,440
Yeah, he's not in long. 
Unfortunately, I mean, you set 

1880
01:20:42,440 --> 01:20:45,560
up with that phone call, he's 
called back any kind of England 

1881
01:20:45,560 --> 01:20:47,480
he's got about the case. 
He reports it back, which is 

1882
01:20:47,480 --> 01:20:49,120
really good. 
Then that sets it up later. 

1883
01:20:49,120 --> 01:20:51,200
Surely he would have got back 
and it gives them the motivation

1884
01:20:51,200 --> 01:20:54,520
to go looking for him. 
And he goes in, he's looking for

1885
01:20:54,520 --> 01:20:57,240
him, he's not there, checks the 
safe and then he's going to that

1886
01:20:57,240 --> 01:20:59,000
house and you're thinking hat 
off. 

1887
01:20:59,200 --> 01:21:01,200
I love that. 
He's just like really, really 

1888
01:21:01,200 --> 01:21:03,880
polite. 
And then he starts creeping up 

1889
01:21:03,880 --> 01:21:07,120
the stairs and you get that 
lovely cut where it goes. 

1890
01:21:07,480 --> 01:21:09,760
The door just cracks open and 
that bit of light comes out at 

1891
01:21:09,760 --> 01:21:13,200
the top of the stairs and then 
boom, you just get that overhead

1892
01:21:13,200 --> 01:21:15,040
shot. 
The strings come back in. 

1893
01:21:15,520 --> 01:21:18,200
Isn't you know, there's mother, 
there's the knife outcomes from 

1894
01:21:18,200 --> 01:21:20,320
nowhere. 
Amazing that to have that as an 

1895
01:21:20,320 --> 01:21:22,800
overhead. 
Really love that she's gone at 

1896
01:21:22,800 --> 01:21:26,560
them straight down his face, 
right, cut down his face, which 

1897
01:21:26,560 --> 01:21:28,360
is quite, you know, that is 
quite jarring. 

1898
01:21:29,000 --> 01:21:31,440
But what isn't Jordan for me is 
that rear projection. 

1899
01:21:31,440 --> 01:21:33,520
But I mean, that's just 
unintentionally funny. 

1900
01:21:33,520 --> 01:21:36,640
Now he's just flailing around. 
But what really makes up for the

1901
01:21:36,640 --> 01:21:40,280
scene is when he hits the floor 
and she's just on him and that 

1902
01:21:40,280 --> 01:21:43,000
is shocking from that angle. 
That really works. 

1903
01:21:43,160 --> 01:21:45,600
So I can kind of forgive that 
because it's Hitchcock thinking 

1904
01:21:45,600 --> 01:21:48,120
it was going to be more 
impactful than it actually is 

1905
01:21:48,120 --> 01:21:50,200
now. 
Maybe at the time, I think it's 

1906
01:21:50,200 --> 01:21:52,960
just the flailing of the arms 
and the kind of that looks a bit

1907
01:21:52,960 --> 01:21:55,680
too close to camera. 
Maybe if it hadn't pushed with 

1908
01:21:55,680 --> 01:21:58,000
him as well. 
It kind of and let them just 

1909
01:21:58,000 --> 01:22:00,360
fall down. 
I don't know, but what a way to 

1910
01:22:00,360 --> 01:22:02,040
go out. 
What a great character. 

1911
01:22:02,400 --> 01:22:04,920
Another shocking sequence that's
really well done, really well 

1912
01:22:04,920 --> 01:22:06,720
played through. 
We don't have as many cuts here.

1913
01:22:06,720 --> 01:22:09,080
It's not as frantic as we have 
seen in the shower, but it's 

1914
01:22:09,080 --> 01:22:12,800
still just as impactful. 
It is the second murder scene 

1915
01:22:12,800 --> 01:22:15,240
and we talked about how good the
first one was and I'm not sure I

1916
01:22:15,240 --> 01:22:17,440
can say this is at that level. 
I mean, what is? 

1917
01:22:17,680 --> 01:22:19,680
But this is still incredible 
film making. 

1918
01:22:19,960 --> 01:22:23,120
Firstly, when Abergas pulls up 
at the motel, he gets out the 

1919
01:22:23,120 --> 01:22:25,560
passenger side door of his car. 
Have you noticed that? 

1920
01:22:25,960 --> 01:22:28,400
Really strange. 
You see Norman Walken, don't 

1921
01:22:28,400 --> 01:22:29,640
you? 
And he disappears as Abergas 

1922
01:22:29,640 --> 01:22:31,040
pulls up, which is a really nice
move. 

1923
01:22:31,120 --> 01:22:32,800
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
I didn't realise he gets out the

1924
01:22:32,800 --> 01:22:34,640
passenger side. 
Yeah, he shovels across. 

1925
01:22:35,320 --> 01:22:37,920
So once we're in there, it's a 
staircase, obviously, so good 

1926
01:22:37,920 --> 01:22:40,240
cutting from Arbor Gas slowly 
creeping up the stairs to the 

1927
01:22:40,240 --> 01:22:42,120
door at the top, like sliding 
open. 

1928
01:22:42,480 --> 01:22:45,000
It's also measured and like, 
tense. 

1929
01:22:45,000 --> 01:22:47,720
And then it's just like, bang, 
we cut that over headshot. 

1930
01:22:47,720 --> 01:22:50,240
Looking down at the landing, his
mother comes racing out. 

1931
01:22:50,480 --> 01:22:52,960
You don't get an angle like that
anywhere before this, so it hits

1932
01:22:52,960 --> 01:22:55,360
you like a truck, especially 
with the screeching strings. 

1933
01:22:55,360 --> 01:22:58,160
Again, I mean, that's short. 
And the closer the Barber guys 

1934
01:22:58,160 --> 01:23:00,040
falling down the stairs are the 
ones that get talked about. 

1935
01:23:00,280 --> 01:23:01,280
And I think they're both 
brilliant. 

1936
01:23:01,520 --> 01:23:03,880
But I'm also freaked out Westie 
by that moment when Mother leaps

1937
01:23:03,880 --> 01:23:05,040
on him at the bottom of the 
stairs. 

1938
01:23:05,360 --> 01:23:07,800
You just see the knife. 
It's just horrible. 

1939
01:23:07,960 --> 01:23:09,520
It's. 
Just like the boots coming in as

1940
01:23:09,520 --> 01:23:11,080
well. 
It's like it's just Panther, 

1941
01:23:11,080 --> 01:23:12,520
like it's horrible. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1942
01:23:12,840 --> 01:23:14,920
Brilliant though. 
Yeah, I mean, I think always 

1943
01:23:14,920 --> 01:23:18,280
worth remembering that for all 
it's reputation, Psycho only has

1944
01:23:18,280 --> 01:23:21,040
two murders in it. 
But I think that's tribute to 

1945
01:23:21,040 --> 01:23:22,760
how brilliant and shocking the 
both are. 

1946
01:23:22,760 --> 01:23:25,800
And considering how iconic 
Marion's murder is, it says a 

1947
01:23:25,800 --> 01:23:27,800
lot about this one that it's 
nearly as scary. 

1948
01:23:28,200 --> 01:23:30,640
And I think there's just some 
wonderful misdirection nearby. 

1949
01:23:30,640 --> 01:23:33,040
Hitchcock, he can't give the 
game away at this point. 

1950
01:23:33,600 --> 01:23:36,400
So if he shot this from behind, 
mother, it totally would, 

1951
01:23:36,400 --> 01:23:38,000
because he'd be asking, well, 
what's he hiding? 

1952
01:23:38,240 --> 01:23:39,840
Why is he shooting, shooting 
from behind? 

1953
01:23:40,240 --> 01:23:42,440
But you shoot it from that 
angle, that bird's eye view, 

1954
01:23:42,440 --> 01:23:44,120
There's nothing suspicious about
that. 

1955
01:23:44,600 --> 01:23:47,160
And even if you start thinking 
about it, you can tie it in with

1956
01:23:47,160 --> 01:23:50,240
the fact that we've seen so many
stuffed birds in the parlour. 

1957
01:23:50,480 --> 01:23:53,240
This is just a thematic link 
more than anything else. 

1958
01:23:53,240 --> 01:23:55,680
It's brilliantly done. 
And I think because you've only 

1959
01:23:55,680 --> 01:23:58,200
got these two murders in the 
entire film, it needs to 

1960
01:23:58,200 --> 01:24:00,400
contrast with Marian's. 
And I think the contrast is the 

1961
01:24:00,400 --> 01:24:03,720
speed of it, because with her 
murder, you see Mother sneaking 

1962
01:24:03,720 --> 01:24:06,480
up on her, so you're expecting 
the same AE, you're expecting 

1963
01:24:06,480 --> 01:24:08,280
Mother to sneak out and get over
gas. 

1964
01:24:08,520 --> 01:24:11,680
But the speed at which he comes 
charged out of that room and 

1965
01:24:11,680 --> 01:24:14,360
then the strings kick in, that's
what makes it really scary. 

1966
01:24:14,880 --> 01:24:16,520
Yeah. 
Also, surely being a private 

1967
01:24:16,520 --> 01:24:18,600
investigator doesn't give 
Arbogast the right to just 

1968
01:24:18,600 --> 01:24:21,080
wander into people's house. 
Does it go where he wants? 

1969
01:24:21,560 --> 01:24:23,040
Yeah. 
Yeah, but when the scene was 

1970
01:24:23,040 --> 01:24:25,680
scheduled to be shot, Hitchcock 
was away from set due to 

1971
01:24:25,680 --> 01:24:28,640
illness, so the shoot was 
overseen by two others. 

1972
01:24:28,640 --> 01:24:31,280
Hilton Green and Salt Bass were 
on the set managing. 

1973
01:24:31,280 --> 01:24:34,080
It bass in there again. 
Yeah, that's what he can claim, 

1974
01:24:34,080 --> 01:24:35,600
yeah. 
Ridiculous claims, no doubt. 

1975
01:24:35,680 --> 01:24:37,880
Apparently Hitchcock was 
supervising via telephone as 

1976
01:24:37,880 --> 01:24:39,680
well, so he was still involved. 
Right. 

1977
01:24:39,760 --> 01:24:41,600
Right. 
Reining in bass, I bet. 

1978
01:24:43,160 --> 01:24:46,240
He's everywhere. 
So it was all in the can. 

1979
01:24:46,240 --> 01:24:48,560
But when Hitchcock returned, he 
scrapped the whole thing. 

1980
01:24:49,000 --> 01:24:52,600
Bassett storyboarded insert 
shots like close-ups of Arbogas 

1981
01:24:52,600 --> 01:24:55,280
hands on the banister and his 
feet climbing the stairs. 

1982
01:24:55,440 --> 01:24:58,080
But Hitchcock didn't like them. 
He said that shodded to make 

1983
01:24:58,080 --> 01:25:00,640
Arbogas look like an intruder. 
Yeah. 

1984
01:25:00,840 --> 01:25:01,960
Which he was. 
Get out. 

1985
01:25:04,200 --> 01:25:07,920
Hand off or not? 
Yeah, Hitchcock said they made 

1986
01:25:07,920 --> 01:25:10,240
him look like the killer in the 
scene rather than the victim. 

1987
01:25:10,720 --> 01:25:12,800
He said The Telegraph that 
something was about to happen as

1988
01:25:12,800 --> 01:25:14,120
well. 
OK, fair enough. 

1989
01:25:14,200 --> 01:25:16,120
Yeah, I mean, if you there's 
that many close-ups and it's 

1990
01:25:16,120 --> 01:25:17,920
creepy. 
Yeah, you don't need it. 

1991
01:25:18,360 --> 01:25:19,240
Yeah, exactly. 
Yeah. 

1992
01:25:19,520 --> 01:25:22,560
The close up shot of Abercast 
fallen backwards down the stairs

1993
01:25:22,560 --> 01:25:25,000
was filmed with rear projection.
As we've talked about South 

1994
01:25:25,000 --> 01:25:28,080
Martin Balsam was filming, 
sitting on a chair and waving 

1995
01:25:28,080 --> 01:25:31,440
his arms around as if losing his
balance in front of a screen, 

1996
01:25:31,440 --> 01:25:33,920
projecting a Dolly shot moving 
down the stairs. 

1997
01:25:33,920 --> 01:25:37,000
Which yeah, it works, but I 
don't know if it really works. 

1998
01:25:38,560 --> 01:25:41,160
I mean, having two death scenes 
though this famous in the same 

1999
01:25:41,160 --> 01:25:43,360
film, that's just ridiculous, 
yeah. 

2000
01:25:43,560 --> 01:25:44,440
Yeah. 
Unreal. 

2001
01:25:44,800 --> 01:25:47,840
And to feel the audience by 
mother's identity, Hitchcock had

2002
01:25:47,840 --> 01:25:50,720
yet another person play. 
When Arbogast is killed, he 

2003
01:25:50,720 --> 01:25:53,800
hired a short actor called Mitzi
Kersner, who had appeared as a 

2004
01:25:53,800 --> 01:25:56,320
Munchkin in The Wizard of Oz, 
and he played his mother in the 

2005
01:25:56,320 --> 01:25:58,640
attack. 
So some sources called Mitzi 

2006
01:25:58,640 --> 01:26:00,440
Kersen are male and some say a 
female. 

2007
01:26:00,440 --> 01:26:04,520
So it's all a bit murky, but I 
mean, that's what, 6-7 different

2008
01:26:04,520 --> 01:26:06,080
people playing mother in the 
film? 

2009
01:26:06,200 --> 01:26:07,880
I mean, no one that no one saw 
it coming. 

2010
01:26:07,880 --> 01:26:08,560
No. 
Exactly. 

2011
01:26:08,760 --> 01:26:09,400
Yeah. 
Exactly. 

2012
01:26:09,920 --> 01:26:11,800
So that's two main characters 
down. 

2013
01:26:11,800 --> 01:26:14,440
Norman's running out of places 
to hide bodies, and back at the 

2014
01:26:14,440 --> 01:26:17,200
hardware store, Lila's waiting 
for a call that's not going to 

2015
01:26:17,200 --> 01:26:19,520
come. 
She might have to go and sort 

2016
01:26:19,520 --> 01:26:27,640
this out herself it looks like. 
Yeah, thank God, the crew. 

2017
01:26:30,280 --> 01:26:32,640
We're getting into the crew now 
and there's a lot to talk about 

2018
01:26:32,640 --> 01:26:34,960
where Psycho was testing of 
achievements arguably as 

2019
01:26:34,960 --> 01:26:38,280
influential as the film itself. 
We're going to be talking about 

2020
01:26:38,280 --> 01:26:41,200
Bernard Herrmann score and John 
L Russell's cinematography. 

2021
01:26:41,360 --> 01:26:44,120
But first we're starting with 
the man who took a pulpy novel 

2022
01:26:44,120 --> 01:26:46,080
and turned it into an acclaimed 
screenplay. 

2023
01:26:47,000 --> 01:26:50,080
So Joseph Stefano had barely any
feature credits to his name when

2024
01:26:50,080 --> 01:26:53,160
he landed Psycho with experience
on Broadway and TV. 

2025
01:26:53,160 --> 01:26:55,840
He moved to film with a Co 
writing credit on French Italian

2026
01:26:55,840 --> 01:26:59,080
comedy and Out of Brooklyn and 
his first solo feature was The 

2027
01:26:59,080 --> 01:27:02,600
Sophia Loren starring The Black 
Orchid, both 1958. 

2028
01:27:03,240 --> 01:27:05,920
So Psycho was just his second 
full feature screenplay. 

2029
01:27:07,000 --> 01:27:09,840
Matt shall we? 
How was the screen writing on 

2030
01:27:09,840 --> 01:27:12,320
Psycho? 
I mean, we'll get on to the 

2031
01:27:12,320 --> 01:27:15,640
changes they made in a minute, 
but to me, this is a prime 

2032
01:27:15,640 --> 01:27:19,080
example of how you do adapt 
something and how what you take 

2033
01:27:19,080 --> 01:27:21,560
out is maybe more important than
what you leave in. 

2034
01:27:21,920 --> 01:27:24,920
Because this is pared back to 
the bone, which it absolutely 

2035
01:27:24,920 --> 01:27:27,440
needs to be. 
Every character in this needs to

2036
01:27:27,440 --> 01:27:30,520
be in it, and every character is
in it for exactly the right 

2037
01:27:30,520 --> 01:27:32,240
amount of time that they need to
be. 

2038
01:27:32,680 --> 01:27:34,320
No one is cluttering up the 
narrative. 

2039
01:27:34,320 --> 01:27:37,400
There's no scene in this film 
where I'm checking my watch and 

2040
01:27:37,400 --> 01:27:39,160
wanting to get a move on to the 
next scene. 

2041
01:27:39,760 --> 01:27:42,600
Even that arsehole businessman 
at the start, he's in it just 

2042
01:27:42,600 --> 01:27:46,000
enough to make him memorable and
make you glad Marian steals his 

2043
01:27:46,000 --> 01:27:48,200
money. 
But he's not in it so long that 

2044
01:27:48,200 --> 01:27:50,120
you sort of wonder, well, how is
he going to tie into the rest of

2045
01:27:50,120 --> 01:27:52,520
the film to see the cycle? 
Is that why he's in it so much? 

2046
01:27:52,960 --> 01:27:54,920
It makes all these right 
decisions? 

2047
01:27:54,920 --> 01:27:56,840
There's no plot details that 
don't matter. 

2048
01:27:57,200 --> 01:28:00,200
Every scene, every line in this 
film is completely relevant to 

2049
01:28:00,200 --> 01:28:02,400
the finished article. 
It's a really ruthless 

2050
01:28:02,400 --> 01:28:04,960
adaptation. 
I agree, Yeah. 

2051
01:28:05,120 --> 01:28:07,680
I mean, for me, the structure 
alone is impressive basically 

2052
01:28:07,680 --> 01:28:10,400
because of how unusual that is. 
Because like we talked about, it

2053
01:28:10,400 --> 01:28:11,880
starts with Marion as a 
protagonist. 

2054
01:28:11,880 --> 01:28:14,680
Like a simple classic 
protagonist, beautiful Hitchcock

2055
01:28:14,680 --> 01:28:16,960
blonde gone astray. 
And then halfway through, she 

2056
01:28:16,960 --> 01:28:18,800
gets killed. 
The main character switches to 

2057
01:28:18,800 --> 01:28:21,160
Norman even though he's a 
murderer, which is weird. 

2058
01:28:21,440 --> 01:28:24,560
But then Lila and Sam come into 
it, and the focus moves to Lila 

2059
01:28:24,560 --> 01:28:27,000
as a protagonist. 
And by the climax, Norman's back

2060
01:28:27,000 --> 01:28:29,560
to your classic antagonist, just
the guy who needs to be stopped.

2061
01:28:30,000 --> 01:28:31,960
It's like switching points of 
view all over the place. 

2062
01:28:31,960 --> 01:28:34,440
It's madness. 
It should feel like chaos, but 

2063
01:28:34,520 --> 01:28:36,440
we don't even notice, I don't 
think, do we? 

2064
01:28:37,080 --> 01:28:39,320
It's not jarring or confusing. 
I don't think I've seen that 

2065
01:28:39,320 --> 01:28:41,480
done anywhere before. 
Not as successfully as this 

2066
01:28:41,480 --> 01:28:43,600
anyway. 
It's some piece of writing, but 

2067
01:28:43,600 --> 01:28:45,480
also there's loads of little 
technical touches from the 

2068
01:28:45,480 --> 01:28:47,680
writing that I love. 
Like we said, lots of the 

2069
01:28:47,680 --> 01:28:50,200
exposition is told through 
voices in Marion's head. 

2070
01:28:50,400 --> 01:28:52,480
That's such a clever way of 
telling us what's going on back 

2071
01:28:52,480 --> 01:28:55,000
home without having to cut there
and killing the pacing. 

2072
01:28:55,560 --> 01:28:58,120
And in terms of the books, the 
following does keep its core but

2073
01:28:58,120 --> 01:29:00,720
changes quite a lot. 
We'll talk about what changed. 

2074
01:29:00,920 --> 01:29:03,840
But he takes a pretty grimy 
horror novel about a murderer in

2075
01:29:03,840 --> 01:29:06,800
his mother's clothes and turns 
it into what is still that, but 

2076
01:29:06,800 --> 01:29:10,520
also a more tragic sympathetic 
character study of a split 

2077
01:29:10,520 --> 01:29:12,760
personality. 
And the dialogue seems to be 

2078
01:29:12,760 --> 01:29:15,200
taught about the parlor and 
Arbogast with Norman. 

2079
01:29:15,320 --> 01:29:18,280
They are fantastic pieces of 
dialogue, scene writing, the 

2080
01:29:18,280 --> 01:29:19,920
whole thing. 
It is just a master class. 

2081
01:29:19,920 --> 01:29:22,480
I agree in adopting a novel. 
Sensational piece of screen 

2082
01:29:22,480 --> 01:29:24,400
writing for me. 
Yeah, I think it's just 

2083
01:29:24,400 --> 01:29:26,960
wonderful how this feels like 
it's more than one film and it 

2084
01:29:26,960 --> 01:29:28,240
doesn't feel tacked together 
either. 

2085
01:29:28,440 --> 01:29:31,720
It feels like 2 separate 
journeys almost with the same 

2086
01:29:31,720 --> 01:29:34,880
goal because kind of a remake of
the first half in the 

2087
01:29:34,880 --> 01:29:36,960
second-half without it seeming 
weird. 

2088
01:29:37,280 --> 01:29:39,840
It's just like you say, it's 
very, very easy to follow, but 

2089
01:29:39,840 --> 01:29:41,560
at the same time it's quite non 
linear. 

2090
01:29:41,560 --> 01:29:43,640
It does kind of bounce around. 
To me. 

2091
01:29:43,640 --> 01:29:45,880
It just feels like when you 
watch Domino's get knocked over 

2092
01:29:45,920 --> 01:29:48,400
without the next one. 
It just feels like, but it never

2093
01:29:48,400 --> 01:29:50,080
goes back to the first domino 
and repeats it. 

2094
01:29:50,280 --> 01:29:52,880
All of the numbers of the 
Domino's are individual and it 

2095
01:29:52,920 --> 01:29:55,360
takes you through that. 
And the best thing about the 

2096
01:29:55,360 --> 01:29:57,640
writing here is the dialogue 
spot on. 

2097
01:29:57,880 --> 01:30:00,440
Every character's fleshed out. 
Every character seems to have a 

2098
01:30:00,440 --> 01:30:03,040
real motivation to move forward 
in the story. 

2099
01:30:03,240 --> 01:30:05,240
Like you say, nobody feels that 
they're just put there for the 

2100
01:30:05,240 --> 01:30:07,800
sake of it in less as writers 
hands. 

2101
01:30:07,800 --> 01:30:09,920
That guy at the start who lost 
the money would come back with 

2102
01:30:09,920 --> 01:30:11,720
Abergath and he would then be 
investigating. 

2103
01:30:11,720 --> 01:30:13,680
He would then be killed. 
You'd be happy that he'd been 

2104
01:30:13,680 --> 01:30:16,640
killed and then you'd be. 
That's why he was there at the 

2105
01:30:16,640 --> 01:30:17,720
start. 
It just doesn't happen. 

2106
01:30:17,720 --> 01:30:19,520
Doesn't need to come back. 
He comes back in the voice over 

2107
01:30:19,520 --> 01:30:21,280
and that's enough. 
And think the best thing about 

2108
01:30:21,280 --> 01:30:23,880
the writing is that it's not 
patronising at all to the the 

2109
01:30:23,880 --> 01:30:26,120
audience. 
It's really brave, it's really 

2110
01:30:26,120 --> 01:30:28,600
forward thinking and it's just 
it's really intelligent writing.

2111
01:30:29,360 --> 01:30:30,800
I totally agree. 
It is all those things. 

2112
01:30:31,200 --> 01:30:33,760
And Robert Block was a pulp 
writer who'd been selling 

2113
01:30:33,760 --> 01:30:37,440
fiction to the classic horror 
and fantasy magazine Weird Tales

2114
01:30:37,600 --> 01:30:41,240
since he was 17. 
And in 1957, he was living in 

2115
01:30:41,240 --> 01:30:44,840
Wisconsin, about 35 miles away 
from where serial killer Ed Gein

2116
01:30:44,840 --> 01:30:47,240
was arrested. 
And those murders revealed a 

2117
01:30:47,240 --> 01:30:50,320
house full of furniture made 
from human remains and Gein's 

2118
01:30:50,320 --> 01:30:52,360
dead mother's bedroom, perfectly
preserved. 

2119
01:30:52,800 --> 01:30:55,480
On the back of this block wrote 
a manuscript for a horror novel 

2120
01:30:55,480 --> 01:30:58,840
called Psycho in about 6 weeks, 
and Simon and Schuster published

2121
01:30:58,840 --> 01:31:02,840
it in 1959. 
So Block later said that he knew

2122
01:31:02,840 --> 01:31:05,760
almost nothing about Ed Gein 
when he wrote Psycho, right? 

2123
01:31:05,920 --> 01:31:08,120
I mean, like 30 odd miles away, 
loads of similarities. 

2124
01:31:08,120 --> 01:31:10,520
Like a year later and he goes, 
no, I made it all up. 

2125
01:31:10,800 --> 01:31:12,760
Yeah. 
If so, that's one hell of a 

2126
01:31:12,760 --> 01:31:15,800
coincidence. 
Block. 

2127
01:31:18,720 --> 01:31:21,200
And game was apparently an 
inspiration for The Texas 

2128
01:31:21,200 --> 01:31:23,400
Chainsaw Massacre and The 
Silence of the Lambs as well, 

2129
01:31:23,400 --> 01:31:24,720
wasn't he? 
Yes, he was, yeah. 

2130
01:31:25,160 --> 01:31:27,360
After Hitchcock bought the 
rights to Blocks novel, the 

2131
01:31:27,360 --> 01:31:30,080
first person he hired to adapt 
the screenplay was an Emmy 

2132
01:31:30,080 --> 01:31:33,840
award-winning TV writer called 
James P Covener who had worked 

2133
01:31:33,840 --> 01:31:35,720
with Halpert Hitchcock Presents 
on the TV show. 

2134
01:31:35,720 --> 01:31:39,360
He had a reputation of being a 
master of black humor, but he 

2135
01:31:39,360 --> 01:31:42,160
had never written a screenplay. 
His draft was rejected by 

2136
01:31:42,160 --> 01:31:45,000
Hitchcock, who said it was like 
ATV horror short story. 

2137
01:31:45,880 --> 01:31:48,840
Imagine being the guy that got 
rid of from a psycho Pete Best. 

2138
01:31:52,280 --> 01:31:55,920
Pete was. 
But then Hitchcock went to Ned 

2139
01:31:55,920 --> 01:31:58,080
Brown, who was literary agent 
that he really respected. 

2140
01:31:58,080 --> 01:32:00,600
Apparently he said he was 
looking for a writer, and one of

2141
01:32:00,600 --> 01:32:02,840
Ned Brown's clients was Joseph 
Stefano. 

2142
01:32:03,280 --> 01:32:06,040
So the rest of history. 
Fair enough, and we've talked 

2143
01:32:06,040 --> 01:32:08,760
about some changes that Stefano 
made to the book around how 

2144
01:32:08,760 --> 01:32:12,280
Norman looked and renaming Mary 
as Marion, but there were others

2145
01:32:12,280 --> 01:32:13,560
as well. 
Yeah. 

2146
01:32:13,560 --> 01:32:15,880
So just before you start, Matt, 
the reason they changed Mary to 

2147
01:32:15,880 --> 01:32:18,440
Marion is that the way 
apparently two people living in 

2148
01:32:18,440 --> 01:32:21,480
Phoenix at the time called Mary 
Crane and the one who avoid any 

2149
01:32:21,480 --> 01:32:24,160
potential litigation issues. 
Right, right. 

2150
01:32:24,360 --> 01:32:26,040
I think Marion Crane sounds 
better anyway. 

2151
01:32:26,480 --> 01:32:27,960
It does. 
Yeah, miles better, yeah. 

2152
01:32:28,000 --> 01:32:31,320
Well, in the book, Mary Crane 
only appears in two chapters, 

2153
01:32:31,640 --> 01:32:33,920
Stefano said in his first 
meeting with Hitchcock, he 

2154
01:32:33,920 --> 01:32:37,440
pitched the 1st 25 minutes of 
the film, which fleshes Marion 

2155
01:32:37,440 --> 01:32:39,000
out into a more developed 
character. 

2156
01:32:39,600 --> 01:32:41,160
That kind of makes the film, 
doesn't it? 

2157
01:32:41,480 --> 01:32:42,280
Totally makes the. 
Film. 

2158
01:32:42,280 --> 01:32:44,040
That's where it becomes killing 
the leading lady. 

2159
01:32:44,400 --> 01:32:46,760
Not to open with Norman either 
and keep him in the wings. 

2160
01:32:47,040 --> 01:32:50,800
Yeah, yeah, exactly. 
And Marian's murder scene is 

2161
01:32:50,800 --> 01:32:53,680
less violent in the film. 
In the novel, Norman doesn't 

2162
01:32:53,680 --> 01:32:56,480
just stab Mary to death, he 
decapitates her and mutilates 

2163
01:32:56,480 --> 01:32:58,640
her corpse. 
Stefano raced this with 

2164
01:32:58,640 --> 01:33:01,440
Hitchcock and said even if the 
Haze Code allowed that they 

2165
01:33:01,440 --> 01:33:04,600
shouldn't do it. 
Decapitates that mutilates the 

2166
01:33:04,600 --> 01:33:05,840
corpse. 
Don't know anything about I'd 

2167
01:33:05,840 --> 01:33:07,720
gain my own. 
Exactly. 

2168
01:33:07,720 --> 01:33:09,200
Mean finish her out of her what?
Yeah. 

2169
01:33:11,440 --> 01:33:14,600
IKEA. 
Well, yes, the final said that, 

2170
01:33:14,600 --> 01:33:16,840
Hitchcock said. 
Oh no, we can't cut Janet Lee's 

2171
01:33:16,840 --> 01:33:19,040
head off. 
I mean, I certainly don't want 

2172
01:33:19,040 --> 01:33:20,800
to say that either. 
Definitely not. 

2173
01:33:21,120 --> 01:33:23,040
Definitely. 
Not and the novel gives his 

2174
01:33:23,040 --> 01:33:26,320
mother's name, Norma Bates, and 
the full back story of Norman's 

2175
01:33:26,320 --> 01:33:29,320
relationship with her. 
Norma's lover Joe Considine 

2176
01:33:29,320 --> 01:33:32,600
convinces her to start the Bates
Motel and gave her the money to 

2177
01:33:32,600 --> 01:33:34,960
start it. 
Norman gets jealous and kills 

2178
01:33:34,960 --> 01:33:38,400
both Considine and his mother by
poisoning them with strychnine 

2179
01:33:38,400 --> 01:33:40,600
in their tea and then takes over
the motel. 

2180
01:33:41,000 --> 01:33:43,720
This back story's hinted at in 
the film when the sheriff and 

2181
01:33:43,720 --> 01:33:46,320
his wife tell the story, but 
from the point of view that they

2182
01:33:46,320 --> 01:33:48,320
don't know Norman killed them. 
Yeah. 

2183
01:33:48,680 --> 01:33:51,040
Yeah, and when Norman burst into
the cellar at the end, he 

2184
01:33:51,040 --> 01:33:53,000
shouts. 
I'm Norma Bates, but it's really

2185
01:33:53,000 --> 01:33:54,600
hard to make it out. 
It is, yeah. 

2186
01:33:54,600 --> 01:33:55,720
Yeah, got to listen for her, 
Yeah. 

2187
01:33:56,320 --> 01:33:58,920
Also, at the time of writing, 
Joseph Stefano was apparently in

2188
01:33:58,920 --> 01:34:01,480
therapy dealing with issues 
relating to his own mother. 

2189
01:34:01,720 --> 01:34:03,440
Right. 
That must have fed into what he 

2190
01:34:03,440 --> 01:34:04,520
was putting into the script 
here. 

2191
01:34:04,520 --> 01:34:06,680
Oh, my God. 
Yeah. 

2192
01:34:08,440 --> 01:34:13,520
Matt's shocked. 
Mom, do you know what I've done 

2193
01:34:13,520 --> 01:34:15,320
to kind of get over issues? 
I wrote this. 

2194
01:34:15,320 --> 01:34:17,760
What do you think? 
You're all right, son. 

2195
01:34:19,200 --> 01:34:22,160
And in the final act of the 
novel, Sam Loomis ends up 

2196
01:34:22,160 --> 01:34:25,640
falling in love with Lila Crane.
But Stefano removed the subplot 

2197
01:34:25,640 --> 01:34:27,520
and said it made Sam's love seem
cheap. 

2198
01:34:27,960 --> 01:34:29,720
Just a bit. 
Just anyone will do. 

2199
01:34:30,120 --> 01:34:32,040
Any Crane sister? 
I'll have your sister and said 

2200
01:34:32,040 --> 01:34:34,360
yeah. 
Yeah, it does seem that way. 

2201
01:34:34,360 --> 01:34:36,320
Though when you see them 
together, it does seem like they

2202
01:34:36,320 --> 01:34:38,520
are developing like a bond 
together. 

2203
01:34:38,960 --> 01:34:41,240
It's not explicitly explained, 
but it is there. 

2204
01:34:41,760 --> 01:34:43,200
Yeah. 
I mean, I guess at that time 

2205
01:34:43,200 --> 01:34:45,360
especially would be pretty 
typical for that to happen, 

2206
01:34:45,360 --> 01:34:46,720
wouldn't it? 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

2207
01:34:46,880 --> 01:34:49,840
When Stefano delivered the first
draft of the script, Hitchcock 

2208
01:34:49,840 --> 01:34:51,520
gave it to his wife to read, 
too. 

2209
01:34:51,800 --> 01:34:55,920
As he always did, he fed back 
Stefano by saying Alma loved it.

2210
01:34:56,160 --> 01:34:59,200
The only significant note he 
gave was to make the highway 

2211
01:34:59,200 --> 01:35:02,000
patrolman the tales Marion more 
threatening and less 

2212
01:35:02,000 --> 01:35:04,280
flirtatious. 
Right, just everyone flirting 

2213
01:35:04,280 --> 01:35:05,920
with Marion. 
Fair enough. 

2214
01:35:06,200 --> 01:35:09,120
Just make him terrifying. 
For his work on Psycho, Joseph 

2215
01:35:09,120 --> 01:35:11,560
Stefano received no recognition 
in the Academy Awards. 

2216
01:35:11,720 --> 01:35:14,160
Not nominated. 
That's the real crime, yeah. 

2217
01:35:14,440 --> 01:35:15,920
Yeah, it is. 
His mother would have been 

2218
01:35:15,920 --> 01:35:20,840
furious. 
The winner was Richard Brooks, 

2219
01:35:20,840 --> 01:35:22,920
who adapted Elma Gantry and won 
a few that year. 

2220
01:35:22,920 --> 01:35:23,720
That one. 
Right. 

2221
01:35:23,720 --> 01:35:25,840
Yeah, Big one. 
Joseph Stefano would never reach

2222
01:35:25,840 --> 01:35:28,280
his psycho heights again as a 
screenwriter, but in turning a 

2223
01:35:28,280 --> 01:35:31,360
horror novel into a radical 
psychological acclaimed 

2224
01:35:31,360 --> 01:35:33,840
screenplay, this film doesn't 
exist as it is without. 

2225
01:35:34,280 --> 01:35:35,200
Him. 
Absolutely not. 

2226
01:35:37,480 --> 01:35:41,720
Look next, the composer and what
a composer Bernard Herman that 

2227
01:35:41,720 --> 01:35:44,680
had been scoring films in 
Citizen Kane in 1941. 

2228
01:35:44,840 --> 01:35:49,240
What a bad place to start and 
cycle with his 32nd feature. 

2229
01:35:49,560 --> 01:35:51,680
Other previous highlights 
included The Magnificent 

2230
01:35:51,680 --> 01:35:54,080
Ambisons, The Day of the Earth 
Stood Still and The 7th Voyage 

2231
01:35:54,080 --> 01:35:58,240
of Sinbad and this was his sixth
collaboration with Hitchcock, a 

2232
01:35:58,240 --> 01:36:00,440
fairly handy little partnership 
going on by this point. 

2233
01:36:00,440 --> 01:36:02,760
Westie. 
So Bernard Herman score for 

2234
01:36:02,760 --> 01:36:06,800
Psycho, What do we make of it? 
I think Bernard Hermann knows 

2235
01:36:06,800 --> 01:36:09,360
this film better than Hitchcock 
knows it at this point when he's

2236
01:36:09,360 --> 01:36:11,760
making this music lovely, 
because he knows he knows 

2237
01:36:11,760 --> 01:36:16,040
exactly what the tone needs to 
be to bring it out of this TV 

2238
01:36:16,040 --> 01:36:18,840
movie area that Hitchcock was 
probably so used to doing. 

2239
01:36:19,240 --> 01:36:22,600
And without Bernard Hermann 
making this a cinematic score, I

2240
01:36:22,600 --> 01:36:25,000
don't think the film would have 
seemed as cinematic as it 

2241
01:36:25,000 --> 01:36:27,680
definitely does. 
And not only does he have them 

2242
01:36:27,680 --> 01:36:30,640
beats where it totally makes the
shower scene and totally makes 

2243
01:36:30,640 --> 01:36:33,080
them jump scares when Mother 
shows up when that bird's eye 

2244
01:36:33,080 --> 01:36:37,720
shot, but I also remember the 
the dreamlike score that he does

2245
01:36:37,720 --> 01:36:39,760
when she's reminiscing and the 
thoughts are in her head. 

2246
01:36:39,760 --> 01:36:44,840
And it's all, it's all. 
And it's just got this WAVY feel

2247
01:36:44,840 --> 01:36:46,120
to it. 
And it's very romantic. 

2248
01:36:46,120 --> 01:36:49,520
But also at the same time, it's 
quite, it's full of guilt and 

2249
01:36:49,520 --> 01:36:52,200
Norman's got this kind of 3 N 
theme that goes through that's 

2250
01:36:52,200 --> 01:36:54,200
really foreboding and really 
scary. 

2251
01:36:54,440 --> 01:36:56,600
But it's always just hinted at 
under the surface. 

2252
01:36:56,600 --> 01:36:59,160
And it's just this duality as 
well to the score where it's 

2253
01:36:59,160 --> 01:37:01,600
just got so many elements to it,
but it just seems to be two 

2254
01:37:01,600 --> 01:37:03,120
sided. 
But like we're talking about 

2255
01:37:03,120 --> 01:37:05,520
with this shower scene. 
I mean, he's just, I don't want 

2256
01:37:05,520 --> 01:37:07,920
any music in this. 
He's like, yeah, OK, man, 

2257
01:37:08,320 --> 01:37:11,600
whatever, whatever else, I'll be
back in 20 minutes. 

2258
01:37:11,600 --> 01:37:13,880
And then he turns on. 
He's like, fucking put this to 

2259
01:37:13,880 --> 01:37:14,360
it. 
All right. 

2260
01:37:14,640 --> 01:37:17,880
You cannot understate how 
important Bernard Hermann was 

2261
01:37:18,040 --> 01:37:20,840
not only to this film. 
Go to the landscape of cinema 

2262
01:37:21,000 --> 01:37:24,720
going forward from here. 
He absolutely nails this to the 

2263
01:37:24,720 --> 01:37:28,200
wall and probably one of the 
only people who I'll stand up 

2264
01:37:28,200 --> 01:37:31,600
and say at this point in cinema 
history was just as important as

2265
01:37:31,600 --> 01:37:33,240
Alfred Hitchcock. 
Why was that? 

2266
01:37:34,320 --> 01:37:36,200
I mean, yeah, when you're 
talking composers who made a 

2267
01:37:36,800 --> 01:37:39,240
contribution to a film that goes
above and beyond what you can 

2268
01:37:39,240 --> 01:37:41,880
ever like, reasonably expects, 
you've got like, John Williams 

2269
01:37:41,880 --> 01:37:44,920
and Jaws or Ennio Morricone and 
The Good, The Bad and the Ugly 

2270
01:37:45,240 --> 01:37:47,600
and Bernard Hermann. 
Psycho is right in that 

2271
01:37:47,600 --> 01:37:50,680
conversation, no problem. 
It's about as iconic as film 

2272
01:37:50,680 --> 01:37:53,640
scores get, I think. 
I think firstly, Herman's 

2273
01:37:53,640 --> 01:37:56,440
creative decision to score the 
whole thing with just strings is

2274
01:37:56,440 --> 01:37:57,600
incredible. 
I love that. 

2275
01:37:57,600 --> 01:38:00,800
And the kind of ostinato style 
of the melodies he writes, like 

2276
01:38:00,800 --> 01:38:03,080
the opening credits that we 
talked about, gives the film 

2277
01:38:03,080 --> 01:38:05,360
this constant sound of being 
furious. 

2278
01:38:05,640 --> 01:38:08,720
It just sounds feels angry, but 
it's all the way through. 

2279
01:38:08,720 --> 01:38:11,240
Like Marian's driving scenes are
scored with the title music, 

2280
01:38:11,240 --> 01:38:13,440
which sounds great. 
And that also means that when 

2281
01:38:13,440 --> 01:38:16,400
Hitchcock decides not to use 
music, it stands out even more, 

2282
01:38:16,640 --> 01:38:19,040
like Norman cleaning up after 
Marian's murder or singing in 

2283
01:38:19,040 --> 01:38:21,360
the car in the swamp they 
carried out to basically 

2284
01:38:21,360 --> 01:38:23,480
silence. 
It's so unusual, but makes the 

2285
01:38:23,480 --> 01:38:26,640
whole thing feel like real. 
It's just the perfect choice for

2286
01:38:26,640 --> 01:38:28,360
me. 
I mean, obviously it's the music

2287
01:38:28,360 --> 01:38:30,320
in the shower scene that gets 
taught about the most, 

2288
01:38:31,000 --> 01:38:34,000
understandably because those 
screeching one note strings, the

2289
01:38:34,000 --> 01:38:36,320
transcender film, they're known 
outside of cinema. 

2290
01:38:36,720 --> 01:38:40,120
That's incredible by itself. 
But also the whole score, it's 

2291
01:38:40,120 --> 01:38:43,120
just film composition on another
level, I think from Bernard 

2292
01:38:43,120 --> 01:38:46,200
Hermann A. 100%. 
Yeah, I mean Herman's gave 

2293
01:38:46,320 --> 01:38:49,000
Hitchcock this score and 
Hitchcock just, he uses it like 

2294
01:38:49,000 --> 01:38:50,760
a weapon. 
Like I said, the the opening 

2295
01:38:50,760 --> 01:38:52,920
credit, it's it's like being 
assaulted by the music. 

2296
01:38:53,320 --> 01:38:55,360
I mean, I think, I mean you've 
mentioned John, I think it's 

2297
01:38:55,360 --> 01:38:57,400
biggest influence is obviously 
on Jaws. 

2298
01:38:57,880 --> 01:38:59,800
And I think about those scores 
in the same way. 

2299
01:38:59,800 --> 01:39:02,400
Like what sound goes through 
with shark's head when it's 

2300
01:39:02,400 --> 01:39:04,520
swimming towards it's spear? 
Well, it's the Jaws thing, 

2301
01:39:04,520 --> 01:39:05,960
obviously. 
That's the sound of it. 

2302
01:39:06,520 --> 01:39:07,520
Yeah, he's in Shark Tale, 
anyway. 

2303
01:39:10,520 --> 01:39:12,840
What sound is going through 
someone's head in a brutal knife

2304
01:39:12,840 --> 01:39:13,960
attack? 
Well, it's the theme from 

2305
01:39:13,960 --> 01:39:15,600
Psycho, obviously. 
That's what that sounds like. 

2306
01:39:15,600 --> 01:39:17,920
Like I said, it's that's what 
rage sounds like. 

2307
01:39:18,520 --> 01:39:20,680
That's how well it fits. 
But as you're saying, it's not 

2308
01:39:20,680 --> 01:39:22,400
just the famous bit, it's 
everything else. 

2309
01:39:22,400 --> 01:39:24,680
It's the way it sits under so 
many scenes because as we've 

2310
01:39:24,680 --> 01:39:27,520
been saying, there's lots of 
scenes without dialogue because 

2311
01:39:27,520 --> 01:39:29,120
it's either just marrying or 
it's Norman. 

2312
01:39:29,360 --> 01:39:32,160
But the skull fills the gap and 
it gives it that constant sense 

2313
01:39:32,160 --> 01:39:34,320
of her knees constantly putting 
you on edge. 

2314
01:39:34,800 --> 01:39:37,160
But then when it ramps up for 
the big moments it is like 

2315
01:39:37,160 --> 01:39:39,600
someone jumping out at you with 
a knife. 

2316
01:39:40,280 --> 01:39:40,880
Brilliant. 
Work. 

2317
01:39:40,880 --> 01:39:42,480
It is, Yeah. 
I mean, those screeching strings

2318
01:39:42,480 --> 01:39:44,640
are so good, they can be taken 
in different ways, like you said

2319
01:39:44,640 --> 01:39:46,000
there, man. 
It's like the sound of what's in

2320
01:39:46,000 --> 01:39:47,760
the killer's head. 
I was thinking the sound of 

2321
01:39:47,760 --> 01:39:50,440
what's in Marion's head, just 
like sheer terror about what's 

2322
01:39:50,440 --> 01:39:52,120
about to happen. 
And it also sounds like the 

2323
01:39:52,120 --> 01:39:54,160
sound of the the knife itself 
maybe itself. 

2324
01:39:54,160 --> 01:39:56,520
Totally, Yeah. 
Bernard Herman had worked with 

2325
01:39:56,520 --> 01:39:58,640
Hitchcock five times before 
Psycho. 

2326
01:39:58,760 --> 01:40:02,000
The other films were The Trouble
with Harry, The Man Who Knew Too

2327
01:40:02,000 --> 01:40:05,760
Much, The Wrong Man. 
Vertigo and North by Northwest 

2328
01:40:06,120 --> 01:40:08,280
Because of the lower budget, 
though, Hitchcock was worried 

2329
01:40:08,280 --> 01:40:10,440
that he might not be able to get
Herman on board. 

2330
01:40:10,800 --> 01:40:13,520
Herman was reluctant at first, 
but agreed to sign on at a 

2331
01:40:13,520 --> 01:40:17,520
reduced fee, and Hitchcock later
said that 33% of the effect of 

2332
01:40:17,520 --> 01:40:21,320
cycle was down to Herman's 
score. 33% I don't agree with. 

2333
01:40:22,200 --> 01:40:24,200
More than that. 
I think it's more than that. 

2334
01:40:24,200 --> 01:40:27,080
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
So Herman went from, oh, not 

2335
01:40:27,080 --> 01:40:29,160
sure about this one to, oh, go 
on then. 

2336
01:40:29,160 --> 01:40:30,520
I'll just write the best score 
ever. 

2337
01:40:30,880 --> 01:40:35,080
Yeah. 
I mean one of the great director

2338
01:40:35,080 --> 01:40:36,720
composer collaborations though, 
surely? 

2339
01:40:36,720 --> 01:40:38,880
Hitchcock, Herman, isn't it? 
100% up there, yeah. 

2340
01:40:39,280 --> 01:40:41,760
Been working with the reduced 
budget, one of Herman's first 

2341
01:40:41,760 --> 01:40:44,680
ideas was that he wanted the 
film to be scored entirely by 

2342
01:40:44,680 --> 01:40:47,880
string instruments. 
So he had an orchestra of 50 

2343
01:40:47,880 --> 01:40:50,760
musicians, but no brass, 
percussion or woodwind. 

2344
01:40:51,120 --> 01:40:54,160
All fifty of them want stringed 
instruments, and Herman said the

2345
01:40:54,160 --> 01:40:57,320
idea was he wanted to create a 
black and white sounding score 

2346
01:40:57,320 --> 01:40:59,200
to match the visuals. 
Yes. 

2347
01:40:59,200 --> 01:41:04,400
So 26 violins, 10 violas, 8 
cellos and six bases was the 

2348
01:41:04,400 --> 01:41:06,920
breakdown apparently. 
Right, But down to the reduced 

2349
01:41:06,920 --> 01:41:08,200
budget, isn't it? 
Yeah. 

2350
01:41:08,200 --> 01:41:10,440
And Herman just turns into like 
an advantage, an artistic 

2351
01:41:10,440 --> 01:41:12,320
advantage. 
That's just a great composer 

2352
01:41:12,440 --> 01:41:12,920
right there. 
Oh. 

2353
01:41:13,080 --> 01:41:15,120
Yeah, 100%. 
Yeah, all the things give us the

2354
01:41:15,120 --> 01:41:17,760
sound of the score just slicing 
through the visuals all the way 

2355
01:41:17,760 --> 01:41:19,120
through the film. 
Yeah, yeah. 

2356
01:41:19,440 --> 01:41:22,120
For his work on Psycho, Bernard 
Herman received no recognition 

2357
01:41:22,120 --> 01:41:24,400
at all of the Academy Awards. 
What's going on here? 

2358
01:41:24,680 --> 01:41:26,440
Did the Academy forget Psycho 
existed? 

2359
01:41:26,440 --> 01:41:28,080
Must hate. 
Hitchcock. 

2360
01:41:29,240 --> 01:41:31,240
Too scared to nominate it to 
scare them too much. 

2361
01:41:31,920 --> 01:41:34,600
The winner was Ernest Gold, who 
scored Exodus, the Ottawa 

2362
01:41:34,600 --> 01:41:37,120
Preminger historical drama. 
Right, OK. 

2363
01:41:37,440 --> 01:41:39,600
Hitchcock, though he doubled 
Herman's salary on Psycho 

2364
01:41:39,600 --> 01:41:41,160
because he was so pleased with 
the music. 

2365
01:41:41,600 --> 01:41:43,920
It's not fair enough. 
Yeah, and it was one of the 

2366
01:41:43,920 --> 01:41:46,880
great and most influential film 
scores to come out of Hollywood.

2367
01:41:47,120 --> 01:41:49,800
Yeah. 
Yes, 100%, Well, 33%, yeah. 

2368
01:41:54,160 --> 01:41:57,120
Finally, in the crew, it's the 
director of photography, John L 

2369
01:41:57,120 --> 01:41:59,880
Russell. 
Cycle was Russell's 32nd feature

2370
01:41:59,880 --> 01:42:02,200
as cinematographer, but the bulk
of his career had been in 

2371
01:42:02,200 --> 01:42:04,960
television. 
He'd also be in DP for Orson 

2372
01:42:04,960 --> 01:42:09,400
Welles on Macbeth in 1948, and 
reportedly Orson Welles called 

2373
01:42:09,400 --> 01:42:12,600
him, get this, the greatest 
camera operator in Hollywood 

2374
01:42:12,600 --> 01:42:14,520
history. 
Wow, yeah. 

2375
01:42:14,880 --> 01:42:18,160
So it is. 
Quietly impressive CV Westie How

2376
01:42:18,200 --> 01:42:20,200
is John L Russell's work on 
Psycho? 

2377
01:42:20,280 --> 01:42:22,360
I think as an operator, you can 
see that. 

2378
01:42:22,400 --> 01:42:24,880
You can see when he's just 
taking the camera to the places 

2379
01:42:24,880 --> 01:42:26,840
you he wants the audience to 
discover. 

2380
01:42:27,120 --> 01:42:31,240
But again, this screams to me, 
we're on a budget here boys, and

2381
01:42:31,240 --> 01:42:32,440
we've got to try and make this 
work. 

2382
01:42:32,760 --> 01:42:35,400
But it definitely does work. 
I mean, they used Mitchell BNC 

2383
01:42:35,400 --> 01:42:38,120
cameras, which were a little bit
cheaper at the time, and he shot

2384
01:42:38,120 --> 01:42:40,400
everything on A50 mil. 
Well, they say everything. 

2385
01:42:40,400 --> 01:42:45,040
I would say 90%, ninety 2% of 
this film was shot on A50 mil, 

2386
01:42:45,280 --> 01:42:47,840
which gives it like the 
equivalent of the human eye when

2387
01:42:47,840 --> 01:42:50,880
it's shot on 35 mil film. 
So that's kind of what you would

2388
01:42:50,880 --> 01:42:52,280
see. 
And it was shot on Bosch and 

2389
01:42:52,280 --> 01:42:55,920
loom bolt lenses, which were 
again a little bit cheap. 

2390
01:42:55,920 --> 01:42:59,000
I mean, the £145.00 now for the 
same lens, if you want to buy it

2391
01:42:59,000 --> 01:43:00,680
on eBay, you know, it's next to 
nothing. 

2392
01:43:00,680 --> 01:43:04,080
So that's basically what what he
was dealing with, which is why 

2393
01:43:04,080 --> 01:43:07,840
it feels so creepy, why it feels
so immediate and why it feels a 

2394
01:43:07,840 --> 01:43:10,640
little bit nasty at times 
because it's just, it's almost a

2395
01:43:10,640 --> 01:43:12,240
point of view from your point of
view. 

2396
01:43:12,480 --> 01:43:15,200
So you just, you can't escape 
it, which again is just 

2397
01:43:15,200 --> 01:43:18,240
incredible work. 
I mean, it's shot on Tri X5233 

2398
01:43:18,240 --> 01:43:20,520
film, which is really 
contrasting. 

2399
01:43:20,520 --> 01:43:23,360
So that really accented the 
black and white, but it also 

2400
01:43:23,360 --> 01:43:25,520
accented the shadows and the 
highlights. 

2401
01:43:25,680 --> 01:43:27,960
This film is very black and 
white, like the shadows are 

2402
01:43:27,960 --> 01:43:30,640
pitch black. 
You're absolutely lost in them. 

2403
01:43:30,880 --> 01:43:32,200
And I think that's what 
Hitchcock wanted. 

2404
01:43:32,200 --> 01:43:34,920
He wasn't looking for any middle
ground, and John El Russell was 

2405
01:43:34,920 --> 01:43:37,440
integral in that. 
Yeah, he surely was. 

2406
01:43:37,440 --> 01:43:39,560
I mean, he had a lot of 
experience at this point, John 

2407
01:43:39,560 --> 01:43:41,280
Russell. 
And I think you can see that in 

2408
01:43:41,280 --> 01:43:43,280
his influences because the 
lighting here with the black and

2409
01:43:43,280 --> 01:43:46,440
white, it looks like those 
classic German Expressionism 

2410
01:43:46,440 --> 01:43:48,480
films. 
You see all the harsh angles and

2411
01:43:48,480 --> 01:43:50,640
those deep shadows. 
One of the best examples, I 

2412
01:43:50,640 --> 01:43:52,480
think, are those shots of Norman
by the swamp. 

2413
01:43:52,760 --> 01:43:55,400
He's barely layered, all almost 
a silhouette against the war. 

2414
01:43:55,400 --> 01:43:57,640
Dad could be from, like, 
Nosferatu or something. 

2415
01:43:57,800 --> 01:43:59,120
Yeah. 
And tapping into those early 

2416
01:43:59,120 --> 01:44:01,720
horrors which go for this like 
primal terror, it's surely 

2417
01:44:01,720 --> 01:44:03,680
intentional, because that's what
Psycho does as well. 

2418
01:44:03,760 --> 01:44:05,880
Yeah, but doesn't ramp it up 
with like a small machine in the

2419
01:44:05,880 --> 01:44:08,240
background, anything like that. 
Just keeping it really simple 

2420
01:44:08,240 --> 01:44:09,880
though. 
It's like, let's just use that, 

2421
01:44:10,160 --> 01:44:12,160
but then just keep it as 
realistic as possible. 

2422
01:44:12,600 --> 01:44:13,640
Yeah, yeah. 
And it works great. 

2423
01:44:13,640 --> 01:44:14,800
Yeah. 
I mean, what I like is how some 

2424
01:44:14,800 --> 01:44:17,400
of the shots are really odd, 
like the opening shot of Marian 

2425
01:44:17,400 --> 01:44:20,200
lying on the bed from this 
really strange angle, like below

2426
01:44:20,320 --> 01:44:21,480
her. 
And there's a famous shot of 

2427
01:44:21,480 --> 01:44:24,040
Norman looking at the log book 
with Arborgast when Norman's 

2428
01:44:24,040 --> 01:44:26,480
shot from below and we're 
looking like open his chin it. 

2429
01:44:26,480 --> 01:44:27,880
Just moves around with him, 
doesn't it? 

2430
01:44:27,880 --> 01:44:30,200
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
Again, I think that's Lugery as 

2431
01:44:30,200 --> 01:44:31,400
well. 
It's like, where can we put the 

2432
01:44:31,400 --> 01:44:33,520
camera to get everything in this
shot with this lens? 

2433
01:44:34,120 --> 01:44:35,520
I mean, a typical director has 
hands. 

2434
01:44:35,520 --> 01:44:36,760
I'm not sure any of that would 
work. 

2435
01:44:37,000 --> 01:44:39,120
Yeah, it doesn't just work. 
It's really striking. 

2436
01:44:39,800 --> 01:44:41,800
Another great shot. 
When Norman leaves Marion's and 

2437
01:44:41,800 --> 01:44:44,240
goes home, he sits at the 
kitchen table and he's framed in

2438
01:44:44,240 --> 01:44:46,240
the doorway. 
Looks like he's caged by the 

2439
01:44:46,240 --> 01:44:47,760
house or what the house 
represents. 

2440
01:44:47,760 --> 01:44:49,800
How good that? 
Yeah, like the reverse of the 

2441
01:44:49,800 --> 01:44:52,600
searches. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

2442
01:44:52,600 --> 01:44:55,000
He's trapped, yeah. 
And after Sam goes to the motel 

2443
01:44:55,000 --> 01:44:57,240
alone and then back to the 
hardware store, that shot of 

2444
01:44:57,240 --> 01:45:00,000
Lila in silhouette running 
towards the camera, Yeah, get 

2445
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:01,120
out. 
Far too good. 

2446
01:45:01,560 --> 01:45:03,400
Yeah. 
So working with the constraints 

2447
01:45:03,400 --> 01:45:05,560
of television, I mean John L 
Russell under Hitchcock's 

2448
01:45:05,560 --> 01:45:08,520
extreme guidance, I would guess 
you managed to produce all of 

2449
01:45:08,520 --> 01:45:09,800
this. 
Literally some of the most 

2450
01:45:09,800 --> 01:45:12,880
famous images in all of cinema. 
I can't believe they did that on

2451
01:45:12,880 --> 01:45:16,000
the TV budget with ATV crew. 
I think it might be one of the 

2452
01:45:16,000 --> 01:45:20,040
great unsung DP jobs there is. 
And ATV camera with ATV lens. 

2453
01:45:20,880 --> 01:45:22,480
It's crazy. 
It doesn't look like it at all. 

2454
01:45:24,440 --> 01:45:27,200
It's so precise. 
There's not a wasted shot here 

2455
01:45:27,200 --> 01:45:29,800
and evidence to a point. 
The amount of visual 

2456
01:45:29,800 --> 01:45:33,000
storytelling or tonal said and 
done by the Cinema Trophy is 

2457
01:45:33,000 --> 01:45:35,120
incredible and it's always 
served in the sorry. 

2458
01:45:35,120 --> 01:45:38,440
I mean, the way that motorcycle 
cop is framed, he's usually 

2459
01:45:38,440 --> 01:45:41,440
either in that huge close up or 
he's in that wide when he's 

2460
01:45:41,440 --> 01:45:43,040
observed and marrying from 
across the street. 

2461
01:45:43,360 --> 01:45:45,480
Both of them put you on edge 
because he's never framed 

2462
01:45:45,480 --> 01:45:47,560
normally like a regular 
character race. 

2463
01:45:47,600 --> 01:45:50,160
There's always something off 
about him and there's one 

2464
01:45:50,160 --> 01:45:52,360
repeating visual motif which is 
so effective. 

2465
01:45:52,360 --> 01:45:54,400
And, and Wes, he's mentioned the
mirrors already. 

2466
01:45:54,840 --> 01:45:57,360
But what I picked up on from 
that, it's whenever Norman is 

2467
01:45:57,360 --> 01:46:00,200
talking to someone at the motel 
reception, he's on the right at 

2468
01:46:00,200 --> 01:46:01,800
the frame, the other person's on
the left. 

2469
01:46:02,280 --> 01:46:05,160
The mirror's hanging on the wall
between them and it always 

2470
01:46:05,160 --> 01:46:07,560
reflects the other person. 
It happens with Sam, it happens 

2471
01:46:07,560 --> 01:46:11,400
with Orbigas, so visually Norman
is always outnumbered in these 

2472
01:46:11,400 --> 01:46:14,000
situations. 
He's always ganged up on, which 

2473
01:46:14,000 --> 01:46:16,800
makes us feel sympathy for him 
because there's only one of him.

2474
01:46:17,000 --> 01:46:19,560
But it's all done subliminally, 
it's all done through the 

2475
01:46:19,560 --> 01:46:21,200
cinematography. 
It's amazing work. 

2476
01:46:21,440 --> 01:46:23,360
Yeah. 
Yeah, really, really clever 

2477
01:46:23,360 --> 01:46:24,240
that. 
Yeah. 

2478
01:46:24,240 --> 01:46:26,560
I wonder if that's meant to 
signify how Norman feels as 

2479
01:46:26,560 --> 01:46:27,880
well. 
He always feels the victim. 

2480
01:46:28,280 --> 01:46:29,160
Totally does. 
Yeah. 

2481
01:46:29,240 --> 01:46:31,600
That's the sense he gives you. 
And that's just you can't see 

2482
01:46:31,600 --> 01:46:33,760
his other side, his other 
persona either. 

2483
01:46:33,760 --> 01:46:35,480
You can see exactly what else 
his other side is. 

2484
01:46:35,600 --> 01:46:38,240
It's very cleverly done because 
you can just, you can explore 

2485
01:46:38,240 --> 01:46:39,960
that all day, just out of them 
shots. 

2486
01:46:39,960 --> 01:46:41,240
Amazing. 
Yeah, you could. 

2487
01:46:41,360 --> 01:46:43,760
Absolutely. 
Hitchcock's 10 films before this

2488
01:46:43,760 --> 01:46:46,360
had all had the same director of
photography, Robert Burks. 

2489
01:46:46,840 --> 01:46:49,320
Due to the budget, Hitchcock 
couldn't afford Burks this time 

2490
01:46:49,320 --> 01:46:52,200
so turned to John L Russell who 
was the main cinematographer on 

2491
01:46:52,200 --> 01:46:54,400
the TV show Alfred Hitchcock 
Presents. 

2492
01:46:54,480 --> 01:46:57,000
He came on board with most of 
the camera crew he worked with 

2493
01:46:57,000 --> 01:47:00,600
on the show as well. 75 episode 
of Alfred Hitchcock Presents he 

2494
01:47:00,600 --> 01:47:03,880
shot and that's a lot, yeah, but
working with the same crew we 

2495
01:47:03,880 --> 01:47:05,720
knew so well, that must have 
helped as well. 

2496
01:47:05,720 --> 01:47:07,440
I'd imagine 100. 
Percent, yeah, would have kept 

2497
01:47:07,440 --> 01:47:08,880
the budget down, would have kept
the morale up. 

2498
01:47:08,920 --> 01:47:10,440
Everything would have moved a 
lot faster. 

2499
01:47:10,680 --> 01:47:12,480
And it'd be loving it. 
Working on a Hitchcock film, I 

2500
01:47:12,480 --> 01:47:13,840
bet, yeah. 
It would have been great. 

2501
01:47:14,280 --> 01:47:16,960
And Hitchcock had made eight 
films in colour by this point 

2502
01:47:16,960 --> 01:47:19,680
but went back to black and white
for Psycho, 1 of the main 

2503
01:47:19,680 --> 01:47:22,000
reasons being it was just 
cheaper to shoot in black and 

2504
01:47:22,000 --> 01:47:24,000
white. 
But another factor was it meant 

2505
01:47:24,000 --> 01:47:26,360
he could show more blood on 
screen without getting censored.

2506
01:47:26,760 --> 01:47:29,000
Yeah, or chocolate sauce, 
without anyone realising. 

2507
01:47:29,040 --> 01:47:31,280
Yeah, exactly. 
But apparently John Russell 

2508
01:47:31,280 --> 01:47:33,400
complained to Hitchcock about 
not shooting in colour because 

2509
01:47:33,400 --> 01:47:35,760
at the time colour was like a 
sign of prestige. 

2510
01:47:35,760 --> 01:47:38,680
Yeah, and Hitchcock said to him,
but dear boy, it would have so 

2511
01:47:38,680 --> 01:47:40,120
much more impact in black and 
white. 

2512
01:47:41,040 --> 01:47:42,720
Don't think he was wrong. 
Definitely. 

2513
01:47:42,720 --> 01:47:44,480
Not exactly. 
I mean, I wouldn't have argued 

2514
01:47:44,480 --> 01:47:45,960
with him like we're going to 
shoot in colour. 

2515
01:47:45,960 --> 01:47:49,080
It just wouldn't have worked in 
colour, not at all. 

2516
01:47:49,360 --> 01:47:52,560
And another influence was a 
French director called Enri Jos 

2517
01:47:52,560 --> 01:47:54,880
Clouseau. 
He made a black and white horror

2518
01:47:54,880 --> 01:47:58,840
film in 1955 called Le 
Diabolique, and it was based on 

2519
01:47:58,840 --> 01:48:02,280
a novel called She Who Was No 
More that Hitchcock had also 

2520
01:48:02,280 --> 01:48:04,320
tried to buy the rights to. 
Yeah, you had. 

2521
01:48:04,960 --> 01:48:07,640
It also features a murder in a 
bathtub as opposed to a shower. 

2522
01:48:07,760 --> 01:48:10,000
Right. 
Yeah, and no spoilers, but the 

2523
01:48:10,000 --> 01:48:12,920
endively Diabolic it's not a 
million miles away from Psycho 

2524
01:48:12,960 --> 01:48:13,840
either. 
Right. 

2525
01:48:14,000 --> 01:48:15,640
No. 
It's a great film and it's very,

2526
01:48:15,640 --> 01:48:17,760
very Hitchcock. 
You can see why he wanted to do 

2527
01:48:17,760 --> 01:48:18,640
it. 
Right. 

2528
01:48:18,960 --> 01:48:21,640
For his work on Psycho, John L 
Russell was nominated for Best 

2529
01:48:21,640 --> 01:48:23,480
Black and White Cinematographer 
the Oscars. 

2530
01:48:23,720 --> 01:48:26,280
That was still a thing. 
Then he lost out to Freddie 

2531
01:48:26,280 --> 01:48:28,120
Francis for Sons and Lovers, 
right? 

2532
01:48:28,480 --> 01:48:30,440
No win, but he deserved 
nomination. 

2533
01:48:30,440 --> 01:48:33,120
And for us in Psycho, John L 
Russell pulls off some of the 

2534
01:48:33,120 --> 01:48:36,160
most striking and influential 
black and white cinematography 

2535
01:48:36,200 --> 01:48:37,480
out there. 
Oh, it's definitely up there, 

2536
01:48:37,520 --> 01:48:38,320
yeah. 
Incredible. 

2537
01:48:38,680 --> 01:48:40,960
So that's our crew. 
We've taught Joseph Stefano's 

2538
01:48:40,960 --> 01:48:44,000
innovative screenplay at Bernard
Herrmann's legendary score and 

2539
01:48:44,000 --> 01:48:46,960
John L Russell's effective 
cinematography. 3 massive 

2540
01:48:46,960 --> 01:48:49,720
contributions, 2 of them 
possibly all of them with career

2541
01:48:49,720 --> 01:48:51,480
best work. 
I would say so, yeah. 

2542
01:48:51,880 --> 01:48:54,120
Hitchcock surrounded himself 
with some pretty good people on 

2543
01:48:54,120 --> 01:48:55,560
this one. 
Yeah, he knew what he's doing. 

2544
01:48:55,680 --> 01:49:00,440
Yes, he did. 
The end. 

2545
01:49:02,960 --> 01:49:05,800
Into the final act of cycle and 
the Bates Motel walls are 

2546
01:49:05,800 --> 01:49:08,600
closing in around Norman. 
We'll be talking about Lila's 

2547
01:49:08,600 --> 01:49:11,480
solo trip up to the Bates house 
and down to the food seller, but

2548
01:49:11,480 --> 01:49:13,720
before that is Lila and Sam 
teaming up. 

2549
01:49:14,520 --> 01:49:16,560
There is. 
So, with no contacts from 

2550
01:49:16,560 --> 01:49:19,240
Barbagast, Lila and Sam decide 
to take matters into their own 

2551
01:49:19,240 --> 01:49:21,360
hands. 
First they visit Fayville's 

2552
01:49:21,360 --> 01:49:24,360
Sheriff Chambers and his wife 
Eliza, before checking into the 

2553
01:49:24,360 --> 01:49:27,760
Bates Motel themselves. 
Norman's being investigated yet 

2554
01:49:27,760 --> 01:49:30,280
again, Matt, how did Lila and 
Sam deal with it? 

2555
01:49:30,520 --> 01:49:34,200
Well, they do a bit better, you 
know they're not dead. 

2556
01:49:34,320 --> 01:49:35,360
Put them. 
Out exactly. 

2557
01:49:35,400 --> 01:49:40,440
Couldn't do much fucking worse. 
Yeah, but all of about the 

2558
01:49:40,440 --> 01:49:43,160
scene, it's exposition, but it's
exposition done really well 

2559
01:49:43,160 --> 01:49:45,360
because it's piling up the 
questions at the same time. 

2560
01:49:45,920 --> 01:49:48,560
When they say our wall gas was 
going to Cressy and Mrs. Bates, 

2561
01:49:49,120 --> 01:49:52,280
the sheriff's wife was so 
happily surprised Norman took a 

2562
01:49:52,280 --> 01:49:56,480
wife. 
What's really clever is when Sam

2563
01:49:56,480 --> 01:49:59,600
goes no with his mother, it's 
just a facial reaction from the 

2564
01:49:59,600 --> 01:50:02,440
sheriff and his wife that just 
don't jump straight in with, oh,

2565
01:50:02,440 --> 01:50:05,280
can't be her, she's dead. 
It's just really drawn out for 

2566
01:50:05,280 --> 01:50:08,360
maximum effect, building up the 
tension of, well, something 

2567
01:50:08,360 --> 01:50:10,120
isn't right, but we don't know 
what yet. 

2568
01:50:10,520 --> 01:50:13,160
You know, the sheriff is more 
suspicious about Arborgas and I 

2569
01:50:13,160 --> 01:50:14,960
love the way he delivers that 
line at the end. 

2570
01:50:15,560 --> 01:50:18,000
Norman Beats, his mother has 
been dead and buried in 

2571
01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:20,680
Greenlawn Cemetery for the past 
10 years. 

2572
01:50:21,000 --> 01:50:24,440
And it's like, that's all that's
missing. 

2573
01:50:24,720 --> 01:50:26,280
Great stuff. 
Because what the hell is 

2574
01:50:26,280 --> 01:50:28,400
actually going on with Norman? 
It's like Harry wasn't there to 

2575
01:50:28,400 --> 01:50:30,360
save those men because you 
weren't there to save Harry. 

2576
01:50:30,640 --> 01:50:32,360
Harry. 
Yeah, amazing. 

2577
01:50:33,120 --> 01:50:34,080
Yeah. 
I mean, this whole stretch of 

2578
01:50:34,080 --> 01:50:36,760
the film kind of opened with 
Norman carrying Mother down to 

2579
01:50:36,760 --> 01:50:38,720
the food seller. 
How good's that shot? 

2580
01:50:38,720 --> 01:50:41,400
The camera follows him up the 
stairs and spins round above the

2581
01:50:41,400 --> 01:50:43,280
door to watch Norman carrying 
her down. 

2582
01:50:43,440 --> 01:50:45,000
Yeah. 
And she's like, you think I'm 

2583
01:50:45,000 --> 01:50:46,920
fruity, huh? 
Puns from Mother. 

2584
01:50:47,400 --> 01:50:50,120
Yeah. 
And then Sheriff Chambers. 

2585
01:50:50,120 --> 01:50:52,800
He's played by John McIntyre, 
who'd also been in a few Alfred 

2586
01:50:52,800 --> 01:50:55,440
Hitchcock Presents episodes. 
And he was married to Jeanette 

2587
01:50:55,440 --> 01:50:57,640
Norman, who we mentioned being 
one of the actresses who did the

2588
01:50:57,640 --> 01:51:00,040
voice of Mother. 
So couple of things. 

2589
01:51:00,520 --> 01:51:02,560
But he's furious about being 
woken up in the middle of the 

2590
01:51:02,560 --> 01:51:05,240
night and he offers no help 
whatsoever. 

2591
01:51:05,400 --> 01:51:08,240
No, Lila's like we want you to 
do something about it. 

2592
01:51:08,520 --> 01:51:12,120
Like what? 
Look into all these people who 

2593
01:51:12,120 --> 01:51:13,760
keep going to the motel and 
vanishing. 

2594
01:51:13,800 --> 01:51:16,520
Maybe, yeah, but just nothing. 
He's back to bed. 

2595
01:51:17,080 --> 01:51:18,800
Yeah, it's great, though, 
because you totally feel like 

2596
01:51:18,800 --> 01:51:20,960
he's on Norman's side and that 
these people are nuts. 

2597
01:51:21,120 --> 01:51:21,920
Yeah. 
You do? 

2598
01:51:21,920 --> 01:51:23,280
Kind of, yeah. 
It's like what you're coming 

2599
01:51:23,280 --> 01:51:25,280
into our small community for 
making trouble. 

2600
01:51:26,000 --> 01:51:28,640
Yeah, it just also sort of fill 
that plot all of why don't they 

2601
01:51:28,640 --> 01:51:30,880
just go to the police? 
Well, because they're pretty 

2602
01:51:30,880 --> 01:51:33,520
rubbish, yeah. 
Yeah, so from there they learned

2603
01:51:33,520 --> 01:51:36,400
Sam just decided to take things 
in their own hands and they go 

2604
01:51:36,400 --> 01:51:37,640
to the hotel and the meet 
Norman. 

2605
01:51:37,880 --> 01:51:40,880
And I absolutely love this 
moment because I love the choice

2606
01:51:40,880 --> 01:51:43,880
of it being in broad daylight, 
which is a really nice contrast 

2607
01:51:43,880 --> 01:51:45,680
to everything else. 
Like our guys goes there, it's 

2608
01:51:45,680 --> 01:51:49,040
night time, it's mysterious. 
You can see everything. 

2609
01:51:49,040 --> 01:51:50,320
You can see Norman at the 
window. 

2610
01:51:50,440 --> 01:51:52,880
So there's he's not necessarily 
hiding anything again, which 

2611
01:51:52,880 --> 01:51:55,080
makes this even better as a 
mystery because they're looking 

2612
01:51:55,080 --> 01:51:57,720
for something in broad daylight 
and they still can't find 

2613
01:51:57,720 --> 01:52:00,480
anything. 
I do like Sam here as a 

2614
01:52:00,480 --> 01:52:02,640
character. 
I like the way he just kind of 

2615
01:52:02,640 --> 01:52:05,280
takes control and he's pressing 
and he does seem quite clever 

2616
01:52:05,280 --> 01:52:06,960
for about two seconds, 3 
seconds. 

2617
01:52:07,880 --> 01:52:10,400
And I really like that because 
to be clever in front of Norman 

2618
01:52:10,400 --> 01:52:12,840
is not a big feat, is it? 
It's not a hard thing to pull 

2619
01:52:12,840 --> 01:52:15,320
off. 
And all of the dynamic shift, 

2620
01:52:15,320 --> 01:52:19,400
the way it becomes that Leela is
the brains and then Sam's the 

2621
01:52:19,400 --> 01:52:22,000
brown. 
In private, she's like telling 

2622
01:52:22,000 --> 01:52:23,920
him what this is where we need 
to go, this is what we need to 

2623
01:52:23,920 --> 01:52:25,480
do. 
And then they go into the first 

2624
01:52:25,480 --> 01:52:27,400
cabin, which is great. 
And I love Sam is straight in 

2625
01:52:27,400 --> 01:52:28,800
the drawers. 
That's all he's good for. 

2626
01:52:29,320 --> 01:52:32,600
Draw there, draw there, I'm out.
Nothing. 

2627
01:52:33,120 --> 01:52:34,640
No more ideas, Yeah. 
Yeah, yeah. 

2628
01:52:34,640 --> 01:52:36,160
And then she goes into the 
bathroom. 

2629
01:52:36,160 --> 01:52:38,200
We've got the toilet again. 
The audience must have been 

2630
01:52:38,200 --> 01:52:39,520
gasping. 
Please, like, don't fucking 

2631
01:52:39,520 --> 01:52:41,320
flush it twice. 
I can't handle this. 

2632
01:52:41,840 --> 01:52:45,200
Don't do it again. 
It's just really convenient that

2633
01:52:45,200 --> 01:52:46,840
you pick, sit up and say it's 
$40,000. 

2634
01:52:46,920 --> 01:52:48,200
I was looking at you this tiny 
bit. 

2635
01:52:48,200 --> 01:52:49,680
He puts it in his wallet, it's 
fine. 

2636
01:52:49,960 --> 01:52:52,360
Then when she goes up to the 
house from there, it's just an 

2637
01:52:52,360 --> 01:52:55,280
incredible moment. 
But just that dynamic between 

2638
01:52:55,280 --> 01:52:57,200
them all, between all three of 
them, I think it's just great to

2639
01:52:57,200 --> 01:52:58,920
see all three of them just 
bouncing off each other. 

2640
01:53:00,040 --> 01:53:02,440
Yeah, we get that little scene 
before this at the Fairville 

2641
01:53:02,440 --> 01:53:04,240
church, don't we? 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

2642
01:53:04,240 --> 01:53:05,880
The sheriff's still there doing 
nothing. 

2643
01:53:06,200 --> 01:53:08,240
Yeah. 
It just starts to feel like we 

2644
01:53:08,240 --> 01:53:10,680
might be in danger of the plot 
star in the saga base. 

2645
01:53:10,680 --> 01:53:13,080
But then Lila and Sam are 
checking into the motel, and 

2646
01:53:13,080 --> 01:53:14,560
suddenly we're back in business.
Yeah. 

2647
01:53:14,560 --> 01:53:17,680
And after all the discussions 
about Norman, seeing Lila come 

2648
01:53:17,680 --> 01:53:19,720
face to face with him for the 
first time, I think it feels 

2649
01:53:19,720 --> 01:53:21,920
really powerful. 
The attention of their talking 

2650
01:53:21,920 --> 01:53:24,400
is incredible. 
It does very much to me feel 

2651
01:53:24,400 --> 01:53:27,320
like the calm before the storm, 
which we know obviously that's 

2652
01:53:27,320 --> 01:53:29,600
what it is. 
This is around the time that Sam

2653
01:53:29,600 --> 01:53:32,040
Loomis started to play a bigger 
part in the film and when 

2654
01:53:32,040 --> 01:53:34,200
looking for the actor to play 
him, Hitchcock had been 

2655
01:53:34,200 --> 01:53:37,520
interested in some well known 
actors like Stuart Whitman, Tom 

2656
01:53:37,520 --> 01:53:41,200
Tryon, Brian Keith, Cliff 
Robertson and Rod Taylor. 

2657
01:53:42,400 --> 01:53:44,320
Yeah, they'd have been too 
expensive, presumably. 

2658
01:53:44,840 --> 01:53:46,720
And John Gavin plays Sam, 
doesn't he? 

2659
01:53:46,880 --> 01:53:50,160
Do we like him in there? 
I mean, Sam's a bit crap, isn't 

2660
01:53:50,160 --> 01:53:50,680
he? 
That's what. 

2661
01:53:50,800 --> 01:53:53,400
He's saying just a bit. 
Just a bit, you know, and, and 

2662
01:53:53,400 --> 01:53:54,840
Gavin, you know, some 
performance. 

2663
01:53:54,840 --> 01:53:57,280
He's functional. 
I don't think Hitchcock has any 

2664
01:53:57,280 --> 01:53:58,880
great interest in him as a 
character. 

2665
01:53:58,880 --> 01:54:00,760
He is. 
So he fulfills the brief. 

2666
01:54:00,760 --> 01:54:03,240
But when you talk about the 
performances and Psycho, you go 

2667
01:54:03,240 --> 01:54:06,080
Janet Lee, Anthony Perkins, 
Martin Bolts and very Miles. 

2668
01:54:06,760 --> 01:54:09,160
Oh, yeah, John Gavin. 
You know, there's a reason he's 

2669
01:54:09,160 --> 01:54:10,680
#5 on the cast list. 
Yeah. 

2670
01:54:11,360 --> 01:54:13,520
Yeah, I know at the time 
universally been trying to turn 

2671
01:54:13,520 --> 01:54:16,200
John Gavin into like a Rock 
Hudson style leading man. 

2672
01:54:16,400 --> 01:54:17,680
Yeah. 
And because they already had him

2673
01:54:17,680 --> 01:54:19,960
under contract, it seems like 
Universal put the squeeze on 

2674
01:54:19,960 --> 01:54:22,760
Hitchcock a bit to cast him. 
Yeah, maybe like, oh, cast John 

2675
01:54:22,760 --> 01:54:24,760
Gavin and we'll give you this 
Ripes deal that you want or 

2676
01:54:24,760 --> 01:54:26,160
something like that. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

2677
01:54:26,160 --> 01:54:28,040
He looks very Rock Hudson in 
this film as well. 

2678
01:54:28,040 --> 01:54:28,640
He does? 
Yeah. 

2679
01:54:28,640 --> 01:54:29,920
You're going to wear a suit in 
this bit. 

2680
01:54:29,920 --> 01:54:30,840
OK. 
Do I have to? 

2681
01:54:30,840 --> 01:54:35,200
Yes, you do. 
And Stephen Rebello, who wrote 

2682
01:54:35,280 --> 01:54:38,520
Alfred Hitchcock in the making 
of Psycho, said that Hitchcock 

2683
01:54:38,520 --> 01:54:40,640
agreed to John Govan being cast 
with the words. 

2684
01:54:40,920 --> 01:54:43,520
I guess he'll be all right. 
He wasn't happy with his 

2685
01:54:43,520 --> 01:54:46,160
performance or and referred to 
Gavin as the Stiff. 

2686
01:54:46,520 --> 01:54:48,480
Yeah, he is a bit warden, isn't 
he? 

2687
01:54:48,720 --> 01:54:50,040
He is. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

2688
01:54:50,400 --> 01:54:53,320
He had a big year though. 
Also in 1960, he played Julius 

2689
01:54:53,320 --> 01:54:55,200
Caesar in Spartacus. 
Yes. 

2690
01:54:55,320 --> 01:54:56,320
Yeah, Yes, that's right. 
Yeah, I. 

2691
01:54:56,400 --> 01:54:57,640
Wonder what Kubrick said about 
him? 

2692
01:54:58,400 --> 01:55:01,880
Yeah, back to our narrative. 
And Lila and Sam are booked into

2693
01:55:01,880 --> 01:55:04,560
the Bates Motel as a married 
couple and they have a plan. 

2694
01:55:05,120 --> 01:55:07,040
Should we talk about them 
putting it into action? 

2695
01:55:07,120 --> 01:55:12,360
Let's do it. 
Right, here we go, the climax. 

2696
01:55:12,960 --> 01:55:15,720
Sam keeps Norman occupied with a
chat in the motel office while 

2697
01:55:15,720 --> 01:55:17,360
Lila heads to the Bates 
residence. 

2698
01:55:17,800 --> 01:55:21,880
What follows is tense Lilac 
explores the empty house, Sam 

2699
01:55:21,880 --> 01:55:24,400
gets decked, and we end up in 
the food seller for one of 

2700
01:55:24,400 --> 01:55:28,480
cinema's most famous reveals, 
Lilacs in the house, literally 

2701
01:55:28,480 --> 01:55:30,760
and figuratively. 
Westie, what are your thoughts 

2702
01:55:30,760 --> 01:55:33,000
on this? 
My thoughts on this always 

2703
01:55:33,000 --> 01:55:34,480
combat a Texas Chainsaw 
Massacre. 

2704
01:55:34,960 --> 01:55:37,520
Every single time I watch it, it
feels like this is the house 

2705
01:55:37,520 --> 01:55:41,240
from Texas Chainsaw Massacre 
before it got sold to Shell the 

2706
01:55:41,240 --> 01:55:42,520
threw chickens in the front 
room. 

2707
01:55:44,320 --> 01:55:47,240
It just feels like you need that
sliding door that Norman's going

2708
01:55:47,240 --> 01:55:50,040
to build that in about 20 years 
time, stop putting faces on and 

2709
01:55:50,040 --> 01:55:52,520
just have things squeal like a 
pig when people walk in. 

2710
01:55:53,160 --> 01:55:55,600
And I get that real feel to it. 
But there's just, I love that 

2711
01:55:55,600 --> 01:55:58,160
back and forth between Sam and 
Norman, which is a distraction. 

2712
01:55:58,160 --> 01:55:59,440
You keep cutting back to that 
scene. 

2713
01:55:59,440 --> 01:56:01,760
Then you get cut by Elila. 
She's looking around the house. 

2714
01:56:01,760 --> 01:56:03,120
She's going to deal with an old 
woman. 

2715
01:56:03,520 --> 01:56:05,640
If she gets face to face with 
Norman's mother, there's going 

2716
01:56:05,640 --> 01:56:08,120
to be a bit of a scuffle here. 
And like, she could probably 

2717
01:56:08,240 --> 01:56:10,520
take her, I think, because she 
understands her. 

2718
01:56:10,800 --> 01:56:13,680
But once she gets upstairs, man,
some of the stuff that you see, 

2719
01:56:14,000 --> 01:56:16,880
it's just really unsettling. 
But settling. 

2720
01:56:16,920 --> 01:56:19,560
You make it unsettling yourself 
because Hitchcock doesn't show 

2721
01:56:19,560 --> 01:56:22,120
you in an unsettling way. 
Like you're looking literally 

2722
01:56:22,120 --> 01:56:24,320
looking around somebody's house 
and you shouldn't be there. 

2723
01:56:24,320 --> 01:56:26,000
So you feel a bit, I feel a bit 
creepy. 

2724
01:56:26,000 --> 01:56:28,320
I feel a bit sick when she's 
kind of walking around. 

2725
01:56:28,560 --> 01:56:31,240
And again, we get that 
incredible mirror shot, which 

2726
01:56:31,240 --> 01:56:33,120
we've seen all the way through 
the film, but that actually 

2727
01:56:33,120 --> 01:56:35,680
scares her. 
And that could be somebody else 

2728
01:56:35,680 --> 01:56:38,200
reflected in these mirrors. 
And it just shows that she's 

2729
01:56:38,200 --> 01:56:40,400
cemented and who she is. 
She doesn't have a split 

2730
01:56:40,400 --> 01:56:42,200
personality. 
She is definitely just one 

2731
01:56:42,200 --> 01:56:44,160
person. 
And then you go into Norman's 

2732
01:56:44,160 --> 01:56:46,680
room or the child's room, or you
would imagine that's where 

2733
01:56:46,680 --> 01:56:48,880
Norman's sleeping. 
And then obviously, Sam, 

2734
01:56:48,880 --> 01:56:50,400
straight out of the fucking 
idiot. 

2735
01:56:50,680 --> 01:56:51,680
Where's that woman that you came
with? 

2736
01:56:52,680 --> 01:56:54,520
Bang. 
He's about 8 foot tall. 

2737
01:56:54,520 --> 01:56:56,000
He's massive, went to the hard 
way. 

2738
01:56:56,000 --> 01:56:58,560
Still, that seems cut off. 
All the blood to his brain. 

2739
01:56:58,560 --> 01:57:00,440
I can't even think properly with
that tie on. 

2740
01:57:00,960 --> 01:57:03,280
So Norman's knocking him out. 
He's straight up to the house, 

2741
01:57:03,400 --> 01:57:04,160
you think? 
Right. 

2742
01:57:04,200 --> 01:57:05,760
So there's going to be two 
against one. 

2743
01:57:05,760 --> 01:57:08,480
Now, you get Norman coming into 
the house, as we've seen before,

2744
01:57:08,800 --> 01:57:11,600
and he decides to go upstairs. 
We don't know where she's going,

2745
01:57:11,600 --> 01:57:13,480
We don't know what she's doing 
at this point, and it's 

2746
01:57:13,480 --> 01:57:16,600
completely wide open. 
Yeah, it is. 

2747
01:57:16,600 --> 01:57:19,120
I mean, it's just Hitchcock is 
the most of suspense, isn't it? 

2748
01:57:19,200 --> 01:57:20,840
Yeah. 
Cutting back between Sam with 

2749
01:57:20,840 --> 01:57:23,400
Norman Delilah swimming about 
the house is about the most 

2750
01:57:23,640 --> 01:57:25,560
tense part of the film, which is
seeing something. 

2751
01:57:25,600 --> 01:57:28,000
And how many times has that 
happened since this film though?

2752
01:57:28,240 --> 01:57:28,920
Yeah. 
Oh yeah. 

2753
01:57:29,040 --> 01:57:32,280
Every time, yeah. 
And Sam, I'll keep Norman 

2754
01:57:32,280 --> 01:57:34,680
occupied, will you? 
Will you know you've? 

2755
01:57:35,760 --> 01:57:37,720
Got 8 lines of pattern. 
That's it. 

2756
01:57:38,520 --> 01:57:41,480
That conversation, he's like, 
would drive me crazy being here 

2757
01:57:41,480 --> 01:57:43,120
alone. 
I'd do anything to get away, 

2758
01:57:43,240 --> 01:57:45,840
wouldn't you? 
Doing his absolute best to give 

2759
01:57:45,840 --> 01:57:48,920
the game away to Norman. 
But the bits with Lila are just 

2760
01:57:48,920 --> 01:57:51,400
superb film making. 
The shots as Lila's walking up 

2761
01:57:51,400 --> 01:57:54,040
to the house, cutting between 
her and her point of view. 

2762
01:57:54,200 --> 01:57:55,000
Brilliant. 
Yeah. 

2763
01:57:55,000 --> 01:57:57,200
And then once we're in the 
house, it's like every shots 

2764
01:57:57,200 --> 01:57:59,400
doing work. 
The hallway now looks massive 

2765
01:57:59,560 --> 01:58:02,560
and the staircase looks massive.
How Big's mother's indentation 

2766
01:58:02,560 --> 01:58:05,040
on the bed. 
Yeah, Looks like Wiley Coyote's 

2767
01:58:05,040 --> 01:58:06,560
fallen off a Cliff and just 
landed there. 

2768
01:58:06,920 --> 01:58:09,520
It's ridiculous. 
And I think here Miles is great,

2769
01:58:09,600 --> 01:58:12,880
she's got no dialogue, but the 
tension she manages to inject 

2770
01:58:12,880 --> 01:58:15,760
just by reacting to things, a 
look of disgust as she looks at 

2771
01:58:15,760 --> 01:58:17,440
things and yeah, shocks herself 
in the mirror. 

2772
01:58:17,440 --> 01:58:19,400
That's great. 
But we do get some more back 

2773
01:58:19,400 --> 01:58:22,240
story I think here as well in 
the visuals, because Mother's 

2774
01:58:22,240 --> 01:58:26,120
room is all huge and ornate, but
Norman's childhood room is 

2775
01:58:26,120 --> 01:58:27,960
really small. 
Seems like he was stuck away in 

2776
01:58:27,960 --> 01:58:29,560
the corner, which is quite 
clever. 

2777
01:58:30,080 --> 01:58:32,280
And I think a shout out to 
Robert Clatworthy as well. 

2778
01:58:32,280 --> 01:58:35,040
He was the art director. 
He created lots of the interiors

2779
01:58:35,040 --> 01:58:37,480
of the Bates house. 
Just fantastic from him. 

2780
01:58:37,880 --> 01:58:41,520
It's all fantastic. 
Just come on, Sam, you had one 

2781
01:58:41,520 --> 01:58:44,720
job. 
And there's some small details 

2782
01:58:44,720 --> 01:58:47,360
we see in Norman's house which 
mean more than they might see. 

2783
01:58:47,840 --> 01:58:50,640
At one point, Lila picks up a 
book and looks horrified when 

2784
01:58:50,640 --> 01:58:53,680
she looks inside. 
We don't see what she sees, but 

2785
01:58:53,680 --> 01:58:56,440
the book tells us that Norman 
was a collective pornographic 

2786
01:58:56,440 --> 01:58:59,080
illustrations. 
So apparently Hitchcock wanted 

2787
01:58:59,080 --> 01:59:01,680
to show she was looking at 
pictures of half naked African 

2788
01:59:01,680 --> 01:59:04,040
tribes like you might see in the
National Geographic. 

2789
01:59:04,120 --> 01:59:06,320
Right, Get your name in the 
National Geographic. 

2790
01:59:06,720 --> 01:59:08,800
But either way, it probably 
wouldn't have got past the Hayes

2791
01:59:08,800 --> 01:59:09,680
code. 
I wouldn't. 

2792
01:59:10,160 --> 01:59:12,200
Know you know. 
But I think it might work better

2793
01:59:12,200 --> 01:59:13,720
that we don't see what it is, 
surely. 

2794
01:59:14,840 --> 01:59:17,440
What the Hell's in that book? 
Yeah, exactly. 

2795
01:59:17,560 --> 01:59:19,840
Imagine we've seen a page from 
that book which is like an 

2796
01:59:19,840 --> 01:59:23,040
illustration of 1/2 naked woman 
being flushed down the toilet. 

2797
01:59:25,320 --> 01:59:28,080
I lost the minds. 
Doing terrible maths. 

2798
01:59:30,800 --> 01:59:33,520
And when Lila is in Norman's 
bedroom, the camera holds on a 

2799
01:59:33,520 --> 01:59:37,160
record player that has Beethoven
Symphony #3 on a turntable. 

2800
01:59:37,520 --> 01:59:40,800
That piece is called eroica, 
which means heroic in Italian, 

2801
01:59:40,920 --> 01:59:44,200
maybe reflecting Lila's bravery.
Also, with a glance, I think it 

2802
01:59:44,200 --> 01:59:45,760
kind of looks a bit like 
erotica. 

2803
01:59:45,760 --> 01:59:47,320
Yeah, maybe that's why it's 
there. 

2804
01:59:47,640 --> 01:59:49,160
I think Hedgecock would have 
definitely chosen it for a 

2805
01:59:49,160 --> 01:59:51,040
reason, because that's what he 
does, isn't it? 

2806
01:59:52,200 --> 01:59:54,920
And the Bates House itself is a 
big presence from the time 

2807
01:59:54,920 --> 01:59:58,160
Marian gets to the motel, and 
Hitchcock had lot of work put 

2808
01:59:58,160 --> 02:00:01,000
into the creation of it. 
The way it Looks was modelled on

2809
02:00:01,000 --> 02:00:05,160
a 1925 painting by the classic 
American artist Edward Hopper, 

2810
02:00:05,320 --> 02:00:09,320
called House by the Railroad. 
And that is the same painting 

2811
02:00:09,320 --> 02:00:11,720
that Charles Addams used when he
created the Addams Family 

2812
02:00:11,720 --> 02:00:13,400
Mansion in the 30s. 
Right. 

2813
02:00:13,640 --> 02:00:15,680
I think the influence of that 
painting on Psycho and the 

2814
02:00:15,680 --> 02:00:17,560
Addams Family is obvious when 
you see it. 

2815
02:00:17,560 --> 02:00:21,200
Yeah, it looks exactly the same.
And Hopper's biographer, GAIL 

2816
02:00:21,200 --> 02:00:24,120
Levin, said that Hopper and his 
wife, Joe were delighted that 

2817
02:00:24,120 --> 02:00:25,480
Hitchcock put the house in the 
film. 

2818
02:00:25,920 --> 02:00:28,680
And Hopper's painting was 
apparently based on a real house

2819
02:00:28,840 --> 02:00:33,000
in Haverstraw, NY, which was 
built in 1885 and is still there

2820
02:00:33,000 --> 02:00:35,360
today. 
It's the Bates house when you 

2821
02:00:35,360 --> 02:00:36,120
see it. 
Yeah. 

2822
02:00:36,120 --> 02:00:37,840
Not sure I'd fancy living there.
No, I. 

2823
02:00:38,200 --> 02:00:42,520
Don't love it me. 
And the set for the house and 

2824
02:00:42,520 --> 02:00:44,720
the motel were built on the 
universal back lot. 

2825
02:00:45,160 --> 02:00:48,440
Hitchcock always preferred a 
film indoors, so only the wide 

2826
02:00:48,440 --> 02:00:50,600
shots of the house were shot 
outside on the back lot. 

2827
02:00:51,040 --> 02:00:53,800
Another set of just the house 
porch was built indoors in the 

2828
02:00:53,800 --> 02:00:56,520
sound stage. 
So those shots were Lila 

2829
02:00:56,520 --> 02:00:58,520
approaching the house. 
We're cutting between shots of 

2830
02:00:58,520 --> 02:01:00,960
both of those sets, right? 
I mean, not that you can really 

2831
02:01:00,960 --> 02:01:03,240
tell the magic of film making. 
Yeah, brilliant. 

2832
02:01:03,320 --> 02:01:09,040
The 8's house cost $15,000 to 
make and was built as a facade 

2833
02:01:09,080 --> 02:01:11,560
only. 
It had no right side or back, as

2834
02:01:11,560 --> 02:01:13,120
we never see that in the wide 
shots. 

2835
02:01:13,360 --> 02:01:16,680
They were both added in 1964, so
the house could be added to the 

2836
02:01:16,680 --> 02:01:19,400
Universal Studios too. 
Yeah, it was built on the same 

2837
02:01:19,400 --> 02:01:22,280
sound stage where Universal had 
filmed Phantom of the Opera in 

2838
02:01:22,280 --> 02:01:24,960
1925, the LON Chaney classic. 
Right. 

2839
02:01:24,960 --> 02:01:26,720
Yeah. 
Oh yeah, and again, the house is

2840
02:01:26,720 --> 02:01:28,520
still there at Universal. 
What? 

2841
02:01:28,520 --> 02:01:31,040
Sure, that must be Wow, 
Christmas do. 

2842
02:01:31,040 --> 02:01:34,720
Let's go. 
It's that Christmas, so might as

2843
02:01:34,720 --> 02:01:36,000
well might as. 
Well as well, yeah. 

2844
02:01:36,120 --> 02:01:37,640
Go there for Halloween. 
Just stay for Christmas. 

2845
02:01:37,960 --> 02:01:41,560
Yeah. 
So Lila's in the house. 

2846
02:01:41,560 --> 02:01:44,600
There's only one place to look 
now and here we go the 

2847
02:01:44,600 --> 02:01:48,280
revelation to end all 
revelations and again just put 

2848
02:01:48,280 --> 02:01:51,040
yourself in the shoes have seen 
this for the first time in 1960.

2849
02:01:51,040 --> 02:01:54,480
Like the feeling of thinking 
what on earth is going on here 

2850
02:01:54,520 --> 02:01:57,680
what she going to find. 
I mean they must have been on 

2851
02:01:57,680 --> 02:02:00,760
the absolute edge of their seat 
and that's what this scene plays

2852
02:02:00,760 --> 02:02:03,280
in do brilliantly. 
I mean, because Lila going into 

2853
02:02:03,280 --> 02:02:06,560
the food seller, on one hand you
really, really don't want it to 

2854
02:02:06,560 --> 02:02:08,760
because there's definitely 
nothing good down there waiting 

2855
02:02:08,760 --> 02:02:11,080
for her. 
But on the other hand, you do 

2856
02:02:11,080 --> 02:02:13,240
really, really want it to go 
down there because it's the only

2857
02:02:13,240 --> 02:02:14,920
way you're going to find out 
what's going on here. 

2858
02:02:15,360 --> 02:02:17,720
And this is what I mean by 
Hitchcock manipulating the 

2859
02:02:17,720 --> 02:02:18,960
audience. 
It's like when you've got a 

2860
02:02:18,960 --> 02:02:22,160
piece of string with a kitten 
and you just dangling it and 

2861
02:02:22,160 --> 02:02:25,040
then yanking it away just to 
tease it at the last minute. 

2862
02:02:25,320 --> 02:02:27,520
And let's face it, this should 
be silly beyond belief. 

2863
02:02:27,520 --> 02:02:30,640
I mean, if you read this on the 
page, the corpse of Norman's 

2864
02:02:30,640 --> 02:02:33,640
mother swings around in a chair.
Well, he comes charging into the

2865
02:02:33,640 --> 02:02:35,440
room dressed up as her. 
You go? 

2866
02:02:35,440 --> 02:02:37,480
No, Surely not. 
That can't work. 

2867
02:02:38,400 --> 02:02:40,440
And yet it does. 
And it's because Hitchcock's got

2868
02:02:40,440 --> 02:02:43,880
the audience in the palm of his 
hand, and he's got such control 

2869
02:02:43,880 --> 02:02:46,120
over everything that he can pull
this ending off. 

2870
02:02:46,200 --> 02:02:48,600
And it's not laughable. 
It's absolutely terrifying. 

2871
02:02:49,640 --> 02:02:50,800
Yeah. 
I mean what a scene. 

2872
02:02:51,080 --> 02:02:53,160
Love that shot when Norman comes
in the house and runs up the 

2873
02:02:53,160 --> 02:02:55,880
stairs and we track back to Lila
hiding in one shot. 

2874
02:02:55,920 --> 02:02:57,920
That's great. 
And yeah, when she looks down 

2875
02:02:57,920 --> 02:03:00,040
the stairs to see the cellar 
door, that's such a clever 

2876
02:03:00,040 --> 02:03:01,120
choice because there's an 
audience. 

2877
02:03:01,120 --> 02:03:03,120
You're like, she can't not go 
down there. 

2878
02:03:03,200 --> 02:03:05,880
Maria might be in there, but if 
she does, she's trapped. 

2879
02:03:06,360 --> 02:03:08,760
So it's really good. 
And the reveal of mother, surely

2880
02:03:08,760 --> 02:03:11,600
the best single shot reveal 
there is spinning around in the 

2881
02:03:11,600 --> 02:03:15,080
chair, grinning, horrific. 
The sound design's brilliant. 

2882
02:03:15,080 --> 02:03:17,200
Vera Miles scream is absolutely 
massive. 

2883
02:03:17,200 --> 02:03:19,640
And then Lila hits the light 
bulbs would create this really 

2884
02:03:19,640 --> 02:03:21,720
unsettling, like sway in the 
lighting. 

2885
02:03:22,040 --> 02:03:24,480
Just inspired stuff. 
But I remember watching this for

2886
02:03:24,480 --> 02:03:26,720
the first time, and when we hear
Norman's footsteps coming 

2887
02:03:26,720 --> 02:03:29,120
thundering down the stairs, I 
remember, like, catching me 

2888
02:03:29,120 --> 02:03:31,200
breath. 
And that was, like, decades 

2889
02:03:31,200 --> 02:03:32,360
after it came out. 
Yeah. 

2890
02:03:32,560 --> 02:03:35,080
Also a nice touch that I love is
everything we've seen Norman in 

2891
02:03:35,080 --> 02:03:37,640
the film, he's left-handed 
because Anthony Perkins was 

2892
02:03:37,640 --> 02:03:39,120
left-handed. 
But everything we've seen, 

2893
02:03:39,120 --> 02:03:41,520
mother, she's holding the knife 
in her right hand, right? 

2894
02:03:41,760 --> 02:03:42,880
Right. 
Wow. 

2895
02:03:43,080 --> 02:03:44,880
But in 1960 we'd see nothing 
like this. 

2896
02:03:44,880 --> 02:03:47,480
Surely audiences must have been 
pissing in the seats. 

2897
02:03:50,280 --> 02:03:52,360
Hitchcock wanted the 
coordination of Mother spinning 

2898
02:03:52,360 --> 02:03:55,040
around in the chair, then Lila 
hitting the light bulb to be 

2899
02:03:55,040 --> 02:03:57,120
perfect. 
The props man was sitting below 

2900
02:03:57,120 --> 02:03:59,720
the frame spinning the chair, 
and he and Vera Miles had to do 

2901
02:03:59,720 --> 02:04:01,840
it again and again until 
Hitchcock was happy. 

2902
02:04:02,280 --> 02:04:04,680
Also, Bernard Herrmann had 
composed a piece of music 

2903
02:04:04,680 --> 02:04:07,400
specifically for the moment 
Norman bursts into the cellar. 

2904
02:04:07,840 --> 02:04:11,000
Hitchcock got rid of it and told
Herman he wanted something based

2905
02:04:11,000 --> 02:04:12,600
around the shower scene theme 
instead. 

2906
02:04:13,000 --> 02:04:15,920
Yeah, much better that way, 
surely, because it works as a 

2907
02:04:15,920 --> 02:04:17,840
call back. 
But also just in case anybody 

2908
02:04:17,840 --> 02:04:20,400
was in doubt about the twist and
if Norman was the guy in the 

2909
02:04:20,400 --> 02:04:22,400
shower scene, Hitchcock tells us
through the music. 

2910
02:04:22,600 --> 02:04:24,440
It's the same music because it's
the same guy. 

2911
02:04:25,240 --> 02:04:28,200
And Mothers Mummified Corpse was
created by the make up 

2912
02:04:28,200 --> 02:04:31,600
supervisor Robert Dawn at 
Universal's make up department. 

2913
02:04:31,920 --> 02:04:35,480
He apparently worked on top of a
real human skull, and after 

2914
02:04:35,480 --> 02:04:37,960
production wrapped, Hitchcock 
mailed the skull to the 

2915
02:04:37,960 --> 02:04:41,400
Cinematech Francais Film Museum 
in Paris, where it is still on 

2916
02:04:41,400 --> 02:04:43,720
display. 
Yeah, Hitchcock apparently said 

2917
02:04:43,720 --> 02:04:46,160
an American museum would 
probably sell it or lose it. 

2918
02:04:46,440 --> 02:04:48,240
Please send it off to Paris. 
Probably, yeah. 

2919
02:04:48,880 --> 02:04:51,080
But a real skull? 
Where did they get these things 

2920
02:04:51,080 --> 02:04:52,640
from? 
Just like dig someone up. 

2921
02:04:53,040 --> 02:04:55,840
Yeah, yeah. 
No, I didn't know anything about

2922
02:04:55,840 --> 02:04:58,040
Ed Gein, honestly. 
Yeah, exactly. 

2923
02:04:58,680 --> 02:04:59,760
Do you need a skull? 
I can get your. 

2924
02:04:59,760 --> 02:05:01,120
Skull. 
Yeah, I can get your skull with 

2925
02:05:01,120 --> 02:05:05,320
nail Bully. 
And Mother's corpse was dressed 

2926
02:05:05,320 --> 02:05:07,440
by costume supervisor Helen 
Colvic. 

2927
02:05:07,920 --> 02:05:11,040
She said she made 12 different 
dresses made in various sizes 

2928
02:05:11,040 --> 02:05:13,120
because of all the different 
people that played Mother. 

2929
02:05:13,560 --> 02:05:16,120
She said Hitchcock wanted Mother
to be dressed normally as it 

2930
02:05:16,120 --> 02:05:18,920
would be scary that way. 
And Colvic said it was a lot of 

2931
02:05:18,920 --> 02:05:20,800
fun to do. 
Yeah, looks it. 

2932
02:05:21,040 --> 02:05:22,800
Yeah, it's black and white, but 
we know the colour of that 

2933
02:05:22,800 --> 02:05:25,640
dress, don't me, because Eliza 
Chambers tells us earlier when 

2934
02:05:25,640 --> 02:05:28,040
she says she helped Norman pick 
out the dress and periwinkle 

2935
02:05:28,040 --> 02:05:30,680
blue, she says yeah, yeah, yeah.
And there's a story, does the 

2936
02:05:30,680 --> 02:05:32,640
rounds as well. 
But to test the corpse out, 

2937
02:05:32,800 --> 02:05:35,280
Hitchcock placed it in Janet 
leaves dressing room to scare 

2938
02:05:35,280 --> 02:05:37,680
her. 
I'm not sure how true that is, 

2939
02:05:37,680 --> 02:05:38,840
but I wouldn't put it past him. 
I. 

2940
02:05:38,960 --> 02:05:40,840
Wouldn't put it past him. 
Yeah, that would have worked. 

2941
02:05:42,840 --> 02:05:45,080
The twist is revealed and 
Norman's caught, but we're not 

2942
02:05:45,080 --> 02:05:47,320
finished just yet. 
Back at the police station, we 

2943
02:05:47,320 --> 02:05:50,720
get two final scenes, one final 
look at Norman in his cell, but 

2944
02:05:50,720 --> 02:05:54,000
not before psychiatrist doctor 
Fred Richmond, played by Simon 

2945
02:05:54,000 --> 02:05:56,440
Oakland, is brought in to 
explain what's been going on. 

2946
02:05:57,480 --> 02:05:58,800
The contentious scene with 
Richmond. 

2947
02:05:58,800 --> 02:06:01,600
Matt, what are our thoughts? 
Yeah, I mean, not a lot of 

2948
02:06:01,600 --> 02:06:03,800
people don't like this scene 
because it is 5 minutes of 

2949
02:06:03,800 --> 02:06:06,520
something explaining why 
Norman's done what he's done, 

2950
02:06:06,880 --> 02:06:08,480
but I've never had a problem 
with it. 

2951
02:06:08,480 --> 02:06:11,600
And the reason is I need this 5 
minutes to just decompress a 

2952
02:06:11,600 --> 02:06:14,080
bit. 
Like after everything we've just

2953
02:06:14,080 --> 02:06:16,920
seen that scene in the future. 
Like I need 5 minutes just to 

2954
02:06:16,920 --> 02:06:19,560
take a breath, calm down a bit, 
let the nerve settle. 

2955
02:06:19,800 --> 02:06:21,720
And I think that's what this 
scene does really well. 

2956
02:06:22,080 --> 02:06:24,520
I mean, yeah, it over explained 
some stuff, but it's still a 

2957
02:06:24,520 --> 02:06:27,720
time for one last little shiver 
down the spine when he asks if 

2958
02:06:27,720 --> 02:06:29,880
they have any unsolved missing 
persons case. 

2959
02:06:30,080 --> 02:06:33,160
Yes, two young girls and just 
leaves her to that. 

2960
02:06:33,920 --> 02:06:36,000
Yeah, we do get some new deals 
out of it, like we find out 

2961
02:06:36,000 --> 02:06:38,200
about the two of the girls, so 
we know Norman was a serial 

2962
02:06:38,200 --> 02:06:40,440
killer. 
But aside from that, I do think 

2963
02:06:40,440 --> 02:06:43,080
it over explains Norman's 
motivations too much. 

2964
02:06:43,080 --> 02:06:46,040
I mean, we've seen the reveal. 
Do we need 8 minutes of getting 

2965
02:06:46,040 --> 02:06:48,840
explained back to us? 
Yeah, although I do quite enjoy.

2966
02:06:48,840 --> 02:06:50,760
I would start with Sheriff 
Chambers saying Delilah. 

2967
02:06:51,000 --> 02:06:52,920
Well, if anyone gets any 
answers, it'll be the 

2968
02:06:52,920 --> 02:06:55,560
psychiatrist. 
Well, yeah, it certainly won't 

2969
02:06:55,560 --> 02:06:56,000
be you. 
Will it? 

2970
02:06:56,000 --> 02:06:57,400
It won't be. 
You did nothing. 

2971
02:06:58,800 --> 02:07:01,440
Yeah. 
I mean, I think to be fair, we 

2972
02:07:01,440 --> 02:07:04,200
don't really need this now. 
But I think the audience, if you

2973
02:07:04,200 --> 02:07:06,960
sat through this in 1960, you're
going to need a little bit more 

2974
02:07:06,960 --> 02:07:09,400
of an explanation about why 
you've just been shook to your 

2975
02:07:09,400 --> 02:07:14,160
very core through everything 
that you've just witnessed for 

2976
02:07:14,160 --> 02:07:16,120
the first time. 
And I think it's Hitchcock just 

2977
02:07:16,120 --> 02:07:18,600
nailing it into the audience's 
mind so that when they leave the

2978
02:07:18,600 --> 02:07:20,200
theatre, they won't stop 
thinking about it. 

2979
02:07:20,720 --> 02:07:23,040
They'll be driving home like 
Marion Crane, and all they'll be

2980
02:07:23,040 --> 02:07:25,160
hearing in the head is the whole
film of Psycho. 

2981
02:07:25,400 --> 02:07:27,160
And he's telling you, yes, 
you're right. 

2982
02:07:27,160 --> 02:07:30,160
You have seen the psychopath on 
screen, you've witnessed it. 

2983
02:07:30,320 --> 02:07:33,080
Deal with it. 
Yeah, so this scene has been 

2984
02:07:33,080 --> 02:07:36,320
criticized over the US for being
unnecessary, but it was added to

2985
02:07:36,320 --> 02:07:39,880
the film by Joseph Stefano, who 
was trying to satisfy Production

2986
02:07:39,880 --> 02:07:43,480
Code expectations that horrific 
events be explained properly. 

2987
02:07:43,920 --> 02:07:46,880
In the book, Sam figures out 
Norman's condition and explains 

2988
02:07:46,880 --> 02:07:49,560
it to Lila. 
Simon Auckland apparently nailed

2989
02:07:49,560 --> 02:07:52,520
his monologue in one take, and 
Hitchcock shook his hand and 

2990
02:07:52,520 --> 02:07:54,200
told him he'd just saved the 
picture. 

2991
02:07:54,600 --> 02:07:55,880
Wow. 
Great. 

2992
02:07:56,080 --> 02:07:57,720
I'll be slightly more impressed 
by that. 

2993
02:07:57,720 --> 02:08:00,440
If Simon Oakland was brilliant, 
I'm not sure he is. 

2994
02:08:00,760 --> 02:08:03,160
He's a bit theatrical for me. 
Yeah, he's a bit happy. 

2995
02:08:03,160 --> 02:08:05,160
The bit where Lila is like did 
he kill my sister? 

2996
02:08:05,160 --> 02:08:10,040
And Richmond goes yes and no. 
Awful, Yeah, awful. 

2997
02:08:10,680 --> 02:08:12,480
Might be a lad the more in The 
Simpsons going. 

2998
02:08:12,560 --> 02:08:14,080
These stories are completely 
true. 

2999
02:08:14,080 --> 02:08:18,320
And by true, I mean false. 
But also, we mentioned earlier 

3000
02:08:18,320 --> 02:08:20,720
that Joseph Stefano was in 
therapy himself, wasn't he? 

3001
02:08:20,720 --> 02:08:23,640
I wonder if that influenced his 
bringing this scene in maybe. 

3002
02:08:23,760 --> 02:08:26,160
Yeah, yeah. 
Well, from there we closed out 

3003
02:08:26,160 --> 02:08:29,200
with Norm in his cell. 
Now totally consumed by mother, 

3004
02:08:29,200 --> 02:08:31,720
we get one final monologue from 
the lady herself. 

3005
02:08:31,960 --> 02:08:34,280
Yeah, less controversial, this 
one, Wesley. 

3006
02:08:34,480 --> 02:08:37,880
Yeah, great though it is. 
I just love it when it's kind of

3007
02:08:37,880 --> 02:08:43,680
taking this blanket and say, no,
sure, I'm finished with them, 

3008
02:08:43,680 --> 02:08:47,480
whatever my work's done. 
And they just walk in and just 

3009
02:08:47,480 --> 02:08:50,160
the way they hold the shot from 
the corridor and Scorsese, he's 

3010
02:08:50,160 --> 02:08:51,520
like, I'm using after taxi 
driver. 

3011
02:08:51,520 --> 02:08:52,560
We're not going to say what's 
going on. 

3012
02:08:53,040 --> 02:08:54,560
And then you get mother's voice 
with that. 

3013
02:08:54,640 --> 02:08:57,640
Thank you, that's wonderful. 
I love that. 

3014
02:08:57,960 --> 02:09:00,400
And then you're in with him and 
you get that wonderful low shot.

3015
02:09:00,840 --> 02:09:03,040
Perfect. 
You know, Nolan used on the joke

3016
02:09:03,040 --> 02:09:06,400
when he's in the cell, it's the 
same, same kind of shot and it's

3017
02:09:06,400 --> 02:09:09,760
just that slow creep up. 
And again, he starts repeating 

3018
02:09:09,760 --> 02:09:11,920
things in his head, much like 
we'd seen marrying at the start 

3019
02:09:11,920 --> 02:09:13,360
of the film. 
So you're just thinking, yeah, 

3020
02:09:13,400 --> 02:09:15,600
I've seen the same film. 
It isn't 2 films separated. 

3021
02:09:15,880 --> 02:09:18,400
And it's just that wonderful 
moment where he looks up and 

3022
02:09:18,400 --> 02:09:19,680
he's trying to justify 
everything. 

3023
02:09:19,680 --> 02:09:21,320
He wouldn't hurt a family in the
start. 

3024
02:09:21,320 --> 02:09:24,520
You know, the shot of the skull 
in the face and then the music, 

3025
02:09:26,760 --> 02:09:29,200
the cars getting pulled out, the
end just at the bottom. 

3026
02:09:29,320 --> 02:09:32,600
Fantastic way to end the film. 
Very confident and very modern 

3027
02:09:32,600 --> 02:09:34,640
for the time. 
Yeah, yeah, it is a very modern 

3028
02:09:34,640 --> 02:09:36,240
looking shot. 
I think that's ending his goal. 

3029
02:09:36,240 --> 02:09:39,680
It's basically a masterpiece, 
That shot that slowly pushes in 

3030
02:09:39,680 --> 02:09:41,320
on Norman. 
It's beautifully framed with 

3031
02:09:41,320 --> 02:09:42,920
Norman just offset from the 
sender. 

3032
02:09:43,440 --> 02:09:45,760
And then the sculpt results of a
Norman's face, the horrible 

3033
02:09:45,760 --> 02:09:48,440
little smile he gave us and the 
final line, She wouldn't even 

3034
02:09:48,440 --> 02:09:50,320
harm a family. 
It's just perfect. 

3035
02:09:50,600 --> 02:09:53,520
No notes. 
Yeah, I mean think Perk and see 

3036
02:09:53,520 --> 02:09:56,160
was just incredible. 
All those little nods he's given

3037
02:09:56,160 --> 02:09:59,600
to himself is he's even with his
voice, the way his eyes dot 

3038
02:09:59,600 --> 02:10:03,080
about when she says they're 
probably watching me, and then 

3039
02:10:03,600 --> 02:10:07,720
to end with him breaking the 4th
wall, that slow grain across his

3040
02:10:07,720 --> 02:10:09,560
face. 
I mean, he's gone from those 

3041
02:10:09,560 --> 02:10:13,280
kind of babyish good looks to 
looking genuinely terrifying for

3042
02:10:13,280 --> 02:10:15,440
the first time. 
And then that line. 

3043
02:10:15,600 --> 02:10:18,920
She wouldn't even harm a family.
I mean, anyone still want to 

3044
02:10:18,920 --> 02:10:21,040
tell me Hitchcock just doesn't 
find this hilarious? 

3045
02:10:23,480 --> 02:10:26,240
The only thing for me, why is 
that not the final scene? 

3046
02:10:26,400 --> 02:10:28,520
Because we could back to the car
being dragged out the swamp. 

3047
02:10:28,520 --> 02:10:30,200
Which is fine, the narrative 
kind of needs it. 

3048
02:10:30,400 --> 02:10:32,480
But put that before Norman 
surely? 

3049
02:10:32,760 --> 02:10:35,320
I can't believe the last thing 
we see isn't Norman looking into

3050
02:10:35,320 --> 02:10:36,840
the camera. 
Fade to black. 

3051
02:10:36,840 --> 02:10:38,800
Best fade to black ever. 
Is that just me? 

3052
02:10:39,320 --> 02:10:41,120
Maybe there might have been too 
much for people. 

3053
02:10:41,600 --> 02:10:44,640
Yeah. 
Burned in the mind completely. 

3054
02:10:45,000 --> 02:10:47,400
You get the complete closure. 
Then I think it's full circle. 

3055
02:10:47,640 --> 02:10:49,600
You start with marrying, you 
kind of end with marrying. 

3056
02:10:49,760 --> 02:10:52,840
Yeah, fair enough. 
And Hitchcock actually wasn't 

3057
02:10:52,840 --> 02:10:55,520
convinced about superimposing 
Mother's skull on top of 

3058
02:10:55,520 --> 02:10:58,360
Norman's face at the end, so 
apparently send out different 

3059
02:10:58,360 --> 02:11:01,360
versions for screenings. 1 had 
the end in receipt today and 

3060
02:11:01,360 --> 02:11:04,640
another had no dissolve at all. 
And that's why some old 

3061
02:11:04,640 --> 02:11:07,560
audiences sometimes swear they 
never saw it first time around. 

3062
02:11:07,920 --> 02:11:10,920
Yeah, it wasn't some like 
Mandela Effect or anything like 

3063
02:11:10,960 --> 02:11:11,880
that. 
Exactly, Yeah. 

3064
02:11:12,160 --> 02:11:14,400
Yeah, I like to dissolve, but I 
don't think it needs it 

3065
02:11:14,400 --> 02:11:15,600
necessarily. 
Or does it? 

3066
02:11:15,800 --> 02:11:17,520
No, I don't think it needs it. 
No, no, I agree. 

3067
02:11:17,520 --> 02:11:19,200
I don't think so. 
It's it's a nice little touch, 

3068
02:11:19,200 --> 02:11:21,000
but it could have been even more
subtle, to be honest. 

3069
02:11:21,080 --> 02:11:22,880
Yeah. 
So that's it. 

3070
02:11:23,040 --> 02:11:26,240
Norman's a corpse, Norman's in 
custody, poor Marian's been 

3071
02:11:26,240 --> 02:11:28,840
found, and as ever, mother has 
the last word. 

3072
02:11:29,960 --> 02:11:33,640
Overall, for us, the final act 
of psycho is one for the ages. 

3073
02:11:33,800 --> 02:11:35,440
Well, absolutely. 
It still delivers of. 

3074
02:11:35,520 --> 02:11:36,840
Course it does. 
It's all the right. 

3075
02:11:36,840 --> 02:11:38,360
No, it might not be in the right
order. 

3076
02:11:43,520 --> 02:11:48,640
Reception and awards. 
So that's the film itself, the 

3077
02:11:48,640 --> 02:11:50,360
making, the murders and the 
mother. 

3078
02:11:50,600 --> 02:11:53,640
But how was Psycho received when
landed in cinemas on September 

3079
02:11:53,640 --> 02:11:57,040
the 8th, 1960? 
Well, a box office's best friend

3080
02:11:57,040 --> 02:11:59,920
is Matt, so here he is to give 
us the rundown. 

3081
02:12:00,200 --> 02:12:06,320
Go for it, please, Matt. 
So production budget of $807,000

3082
02:12:06,400 --> 02:12:10,680
and on that cycle was a huge 
financial success, taking just 

3083
02:12:10,680 --> 02:12:14,600
over $32 million worldwide. 
It was the second highest 

3084
02:12:14,600 --> 02:12:17,160
grossing film of 1960 behind 
Spartacus. 

3085
02:12:17,280 --> 02:12:20,400
So Goodyear for John Gavin, it 
went on to be the most 

3086
02:12:20,480 --> 02:12:23,440
commercially successful film of 
Alfred Hitchcock's career. 

3087
02:12:23,680 --> 02:12:26,480
And at the Oscars, as we're 
saying, Psycho got nominations 

3088
02:12:26,480 --> 02:12:29,320
but no wins. 
Janet Leigh was nominated for 

3089
02:12:29,320 --> 02:12:32,600
best actress in the supporting 
role, Alfred Hitchcock nominated

3090
02:12:32,600 --> 02:12:35,880
for best director, John L 
Russell nominated for the best 

3091
02:12:35,880 --> 02:12:39,280
cinematography, black and white,
and Joseph Hurley, Robert 

3092
02:12:39,280 --> 02:12:43,560
Clapworthy and George Milo were 
nominated for best art direction

3093
02:12:43,800 --> 02:12:45,520
and set direction, black and 
white. 

3094
02:12:45,920 --> 02:12:47,920
Yes. 
So from the deal Hitchcock cut 

3095
02:12:47,920 --> 02:12:51,240
with the studio we talked about,
he ended up making $15 million 

3096
02:12:51,360 --> 02:12:52,280
from Psycho. 
Wow. 

3097
02:12:52,320 --> 02:12:54,480
Wow. 
In 1960 money as well. 

3098
02:12:54,480 --> 02:12:56,640
So yeah. 
Laughing at the bank, yeah. 

3099
02:12:57,120 --> 02:12:59,000
Yeah, it was a bit joke for him,
wasn't it? 

3100
02:12:59,160 --> 02:13:00,000
Yeah. 
Oh yeah. 

3101
02:13:00,760 --> 02:13:03,480
Hitchcock filmed an official 
trailer, which was him giving a 

3102
02:13:03,480 --> 02:13:07,040
guided tour of the Bates Motel. 
It ran for 6 1/2 minutes and 

3103
02:13:07,040 --> 02:13:09,200
ended with Hitchcock pulling 
over the shower curtain to 

3104
02:13:09,200 --> 02:13:12,240
reveal a woman screaming. 
Janet Lee wasn't available when 

3105
02:13:12,240 --> 02:13:14,720
they shot it, though, so Vera 
Miles stood in for her wearing a

3106
02:13:14,720 --> 02:13:15,920
blonde wig. 
Brilliant that. 

3107
02:13:16,680 --> 02:13:18,440
Yeah, it's a great trailer. 
It's fantastic. 

3108
02:13:18,440 --> 02:13:19,760
Yeah, you mentioned it before, 
man. 

3109
02:13:19,760 --> 02:13:20,960
Check it out if you've not seen 
it. 

3110
02:13:21,080 --> 02:13:23,200
Yeah. 
Also something I absolutely love

3111
02:13:23,280 --> 02:13:26,040
is the Psycho logo. 
Yeah, that like, block sans 

3112
02:13:26,040 --> 02:13:27,800
serif font with the crack 
through the middle. 

3113
02:13:27,960 --> 02:13:30,440
Yeah, it was actually designed 
for the book by a designer 

3114
02:13:30,440 --> 02:13:32,560
called Tony Palladino. 
And Hitchcock just kept it 

3115
02:13:32,560 --> 02:13:33,840
right, as he should have. 
Fair enough. 

3116
02:13:33,960 --> 02:13:35,760
Yeah, Usually it's in yellow as 
well, Wesley. 

3117
02:13:35,800 --> 02:13:39,880
Yeah, there you go. 
And in 1960, movie audiences 

3118
02:13:39,880 --> 02:13:43,320
would pay once and then have 
access to a day screen into the 

3119
02:13:43,320 --> 02:13:46,600
theatre, so people would just 
often come into a film halfway 

3120
02:13:46,600 --> 02:13:48,920
through. 
But Hitchcock wanted people in 

3121
02:13:48,920 --> 02:13:52,280
their seats when Psycho started,
so a cardboard display was sent 

3122
02:13:52,280 --> 02:13:55,200
to theaters to be displayed in 
their lobby in Detroit. 

3123
02:13:55,200 --> 02:13:58,480
Hitchcock pointing at his watch 
and said the manager of this 

3124
02:13:58,480 --> 02:14:01,840
theatre has been instructed, at 
the risk of his life, not to 

3125
02:14:01,840 --> 02:14:03,840
admit to the theatre any 
persons. 

3126
02:14:03,840 --> 02:14:07,600
After the picture starts, any 
spurious attempts to end by side

3127
02:14:07,600 --> 02:14:10,760
doors, fire escapes or 
ventilating shafts like John 

3128
02:14:10,760 --> 02:14:15,000
Mcclane will be met by force. 
The entire objective of this 

3129
02:14:15,000 --> 02:14:18,120
extraordinary policy, of course,
is to help you enjoy Psycho 

3130
02:14:18,120 --> 02:14:19,720
more. 
Alfred Hitchcock. 

3131
02:14:22,480 --> 02:14:24,480
Yeah. 
In the studio was also give the 

3132
02:14:24,480 --> 02:14:27,080
theatre as a record to play in 
the foyer with background music 

3133
02:14:27,080 --> 02:14:30,120
and a voiceover saying 10 
minutes to psycho time. 5 

3134
02:14:30,120 --> 02:14:31,440
minutes to psycho time. 
Really. 

3135
02:14:31,440 --> 02:14:33,800
Amazing and. 
The marketing around this is 

3136
02:14:33,800 --> 02:14:36,440
just ludicrously good, isn't it?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

3137
02:14:36,440 --> 02:14:37,280
Great. 
Yeah. 

3138
02:14:37,280 --> 02:14:39,640
I mean, this is really the start
of the whole formalising of like

3139
02:14:39,640 --> 02:14:41,960
definite start and end times in 
cinemas, I think. 

3140
02:14:41,960 --> 02:14:42,960
Yeah, Huge. 
Yeah. 

3141
02:14:43,120 --> 02:14:45,560
Hitchcock letter said that after
the film came out he received an

3142
02:14:45,560 --> 02:14:48,320
angry letter from the father of 
the girl who had refused to have

3143
02:14:48,320 --> 02:14:52,760
a bath after seeing Lead 
Diabolic in 1955 and now she 

3144
02:14:52,760 --> 02:14:55,400
refused to have a shower after 
scene cycle. 

3145
02:14:56,040 --> 02:14:58,800
Hitchcock sent a note back that 
said send her to the dry 

3146
02:14:58,800 --> 02:14:59,800
cleaners. 
Amazing. 

3147
02:15:01,360 --> 02:15:03,320
She was in about huge 6 foot 
shower head. 

3148
02:15:03,640 --> 02:15:04,960
This will sort her out. 
Exactly. 

3149
02:15:04,960 --> 02:15:08,360
Yeah, absolutely stank. 
Stand her through a car wash. 

3150
02:15:09,920 --> 02:15:12,120
And from that feedback, we can 
dive straight into the critics 

3151
02:15:12,120 --> 02:15:14,480
comments, starting with the 
great Roger Rebut. 

3152
02:15:14,960 --> 02:15:17,640
Although one caveat, his review 
was a retrospective, not from 

3153
02:15:17,640 --> 02:15:20,480
the original release because he 
wasn't a critic in 1960. 

3154
02:15:20,480 --> 02:15:23,240
Yeah, yeah. 
So what do we reckon Roger gave 

3155
02:15:23,240 --> 02:15:25,960
Psycho out of four full for 
easily? 

3156
02:15:25,960 --> 02:15:28,440
Of course it was. 
And, he said, What makes Psycho 

3157
02:15:28,440 --> 02:15:31,080
immortal, when so many films are
already half forgotten by the 

3158
02:15:31,080 --> 02:15:33,520
time we leave the theatre, is 
that it connects directly with 

3159
02:15:33,520 --> 02:15:36,240
our fears of the police, our 
fears of becoming the victim of 

3160
02:15:36,240 --> 02:15:38,920
a madman and, of course, our 
fears of disappointing our 

3161
02:15:38,920 --> 02:15:41,080
mothers. 
No other Hitchcock film had a 

3162
02:15:41,080 --> 02:15:42,520
greater impact. 
Yeah. 

3163
02:15:42,800 --> 02:15:44,520
Yeah, hard to argue with Roger 
on that. 

3164
02:15:44,880 --> 02:15:46,880
Roger may have had a domineering
with that too sounds. 

3165
02:15:47,560 --> 02:15:48,400
Like it? 
Yeah. 

3166
02:15:49,240 --> 02:15:51,520
Bosley Crowther in the New York 
Times, however, at the time of 

3167
02:15:51,520 --> 02:15:53,800
release gave Psycho a more 
lukewarm reception. 

3168
02:15:54,280 --> 02:15:57,240
He said there's not an abundance
of subtlety or the lately 

3169
02:15:57,240 --> 02:15:59,840
familiar Hitchcock bent towards 
significant and colourful 

3170
02:15:59,840 --> 02:16:02,480
scenery in this obviously low 
budget job. 

3171
02:16:02,800 --> 02:16:04,520
Right. 
I mean, no, there's no colourful

3172
02:16:04,520 --> 02:16:05,800
scenery. 
It's in black and white. 

3173
02:16:06,040 --> 02:16:08,240
Yeah, exactly. 
And David Parkinson in the 

3174
02:16:08,240 --> 02:16:11,320
retrospective Empire magazine 
review gave Psycho the full 5 

3175
02:16:11,320 --> 02:16:14,760
stars over the five, of course, 
saying timeless classic, superb 

3176
02:16:14,760 --> 02:16:17,520
performances and the infamous 
shower scene make this the 

3177
02:16:17,520 --> 02:16:20,120
perfect nightmare. 
Yeah, Yeah, I think The Perfect 

3178
02:16:20,120 --> 02:16:22,280
Nightmare is a pretty good 
description, pretty much. 

3179
02:16:22,320 --> 02:16:23,600
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
You won't shake it. 

3180
02:16:23,720 --> 02:16:25,640
Yeah. 
And today in Rotten Tomatoes, 

3181
02:16:25,920 --> 02:16:30,520
Psycho has a 95% audience 
approval rating and 97% from 

3182
02:16:30,520 --> 02:16:33,680
critics. 
And on IMDb it currently sits 

3183
02:16:33,680 --> 02:16:39,120
with a rating of 8.5 out of 10, 
placing it 36 on the IMDb top 

3184
02:16:39,120 --> 02:16:41,559
250. 
And that is one place below 

3185
02:16:41,559 --> 02:16:44,480
Grave of the Five Flies, and one
above The Lion King. 

3186
02:16:45,520 --> 02:16:48,400
Yeah, there's a trilogy I. 
Was going to say, not real bad 

3187
02:16:48,400 --> 02:16:52,080
fellows those things. 
Sandwich between 2 animated Tia 

3188
02:16:52,080 --> 02:16:53,760
Jaggers. 
Yeah, 2 right, Yeah. 

3189
02:16:54,120 --> 02:16:57,360
So Cycle was a phenomenon, the 
biggest of Hitchcock's career, 4

3190
02:16:57,360 --> 02:17:00,160
Oscar nominations, a marketing 
campaign that reinvented how 

3191
02:17:00,160 --> 02:17:03,200
audiences watch movies, and the 
critical legacy that's only 

3192
02:17:03,200 --> 02:17:05,840
grown over the years. 
Seems like the world worked out 

3193
02:17:05,840 --> 02:17:07,600
pretty quickly. 
This was something special. 

3194
02:17:07,719 --> 02:17:12,719
Yeah, I think so. 
Sequels and influence. 

3195
02:17:15,320 --> 02:17:18,280
A film of Psycho Stature doesn't
just spawn sequels, it's spawned

3196
02:17:18,280 --> 02:17:20,760
franchises, remakes, TV series, 
and more. 

3197
02:17:21,200 --> 02:17:22,520
Let's start with the sequels 
though. 

3198
02:17:22,680 --> 02:17:26,160
Three direct ones. 
Psycho 2 came out in 1983 with 

3199
02:17:26,320 --> 02:17:28,879
Anthony Perkins back as Norman 
after he gets released from the 

3200
02:17:28,879 --> 02:17:33,920
Asylum, Psycho 3 in 1986 and 
Perkins himself directing and 

3201
02:17:33,920 --> 02:17:38,160
Psycho 4 the Beginning in 1990 
is a prequel made for TV, also 

3202
02:17:38,160 --> 02:17:41,440
written by Joseph Stefano. 
Less of acclaimed in the 

3203
02:17:41,440 --> 02:17:43,559
original Westie. 
But what do you make of the 

3204
02:17:43,559 --> 02:17:46,400
Psycho sequels? 
I'll go for Psycho 2 if I may. 

3205
02:17:46,400 --> 02:17:49,360
Lovely. 
I loved Psycho 2, based 22 years

3206
02:17:49,400 --> 02:17:52,760
after the first film. 
So he's coming out of the asylum

3207
02:17:52,879 --> 02:17:55,080
and if you haven't seen it, I 
would highly recommend checking 

3208
02:17:55,080 --> 02:17:56,440
it out. 
I think it's really good 

3209
02:17:56,440 --> 02:17:58,320
writing. 
The directions obviously nowhere

3210
02:17:58,320 --> 02:18:00,920
near Hitchcock's level, but the 
acting's good. 

3211
02:18:01,120 --> 02:18:03,639
Obviously Perkins is great in 
it, he's just bringing that back

3212
02:18:03,760 --> 02:18:06,280
as if he'd never left. 
Very underrated sequel. 

3213
02:18:06,639 --> 02:18:08,320
I think it's really good. 
Lovely. 

3214
02:18:08,480 --> 02:18:11,680
Yeah, so picking up from that, I
think Psycho 3 is worth a watch 

3215
02:18:11,680 --> 02:18:15,040
if you've not seen it, right. 
It's definitely got the 80s vibe

3216
02:18:15,040 --> 02:18:17,120
through with, you know, a lot of
unnecessary nudity. 

3217
02:18:17,120 --> 02:18:19,920
But it does have this real kind 
of sleazy, neon drenched 

3218
02:18:19,920 --> 02:18:21,959
atmosphere. 
The kills are well done. 

3219
02:18:22,000 --> 02:18:24,760
It's got a one with ice cubes. 
I must have seen this really 

3220
02:18:24,760 --> 02:18:26,680
young and it's been stuck in my 
head since. 

3221
02:18:26,959 --> 02:18:28,840
I thought you meant ice Cube. 
I was like seeing it. 

3222
02:18:31,879 --> 02:18:33,920
Been around a while. 
Before boys, no. 

3223
02:18:34,639 --> 02:18:38,240
See, that one's worth watching. 
And then for the beginning, I 

3224
02:18:38,240 --> 02:18:40,959
mean, it's very much ATV movie 
from the 90s. 

3225
02:18:41,000 --> 02:18:43,680
It's filling in a lot of stuff 
we don't need filling in. 

3226
02:18:44,000 --> 02:18:46,760
Henry Thomas plays the young 
Norman and he's no Anthony 

3227
02:18:46,760 --> 02:18:48,680
Perkins, to be fair. 
All right. 

3228
02:18:48,760 --> 02:18:51,680
It's just beating you over the 
head with all the subtext from 

3229
02:18:51,680 --> 02:18:52,600
the first film. 
Like on. 

3230
02:18:52,760 --> 02:18:54,280
Did you get the incest 
undertones? 

3231
02:18:54,280 --> 02:18:55,680
Did you get that? 
Did you get that? 

3232
02:18:55,959 --> 02:18:57,639
Yeah, I've got got that on the 
first film. 

3233
02:18:57,840 --> 02:18:59,360
Yeah. 
Yeah, It's just a bit dull. 

3234
02:18:59,360 --> 02:19:01,639
It's a bit enough. 
And if you want to explore the 

3235
02:19:01,719 --> 02:19:04,600
early life of Norman and his 
mother, I'd recommend watching 

3236
02:19:04,600 --> 02:19:07,680
the Bates Motel TVCVS instead. 
So I did it a lot better. 

3237
02:19:07,879 --> 02:19:10,280
Yeah, yeah. 
Yeah, that was 2013, wasn't it? 

3238
02:19:10,280 --> 02:19:13,160
Freddie Highmore's Norman Vera 
Farmiga played mother. 

3239
02:19:13,520 --> 02:19:14,639
She's. 
Brilliant in it. 

3240
02:19:14,840 --> 02:19:16,320
Yeah, she is. 
That is worth a look. 

3241
02:19:16,320 --> 02:19:18,959
Yeah, for sure. 
How about the impact, though, of

3242
02:19:18,959 --> 02:19:21,400
the first Psycho and everything 
that came after it that wouldn't

3243
02:19:21,400 --> 02:19:23,799
exist without it? 
Matt, what do you think of the 

3244
02:19:23,799 --> 02:19:26,559
legacy of Psycho? 
I mean, how long have you got? 

3245
02:19:27,559 --> 02:19:30,400
It's arguably the most 
influential film ever made, 

3246
02:19:30,400 --> 02:19:32,760
certainly up there in the 
conversation, the birth of the 

3247
02:19:32,760 --> 02:19:35,040
slasher movie. 
There were movies before this 

3248
02:19:35,040 --> 02:19:38,360
that had big twists, but cycles,
probably the first one that made

3249
02:19:38,360 --> 02:19:40,360
the twist the the huge part of 
the market. 

3250
02:19:40,360 --> 02:19:42,160
And I think he said don't give 
away the end. 

3251
02:19:42,160 --> 02:19:46,240
And it's the only one we have 
like, say the trailer playing 

3252
02:19:46,240 --> 02:19:48,360
the music in the lobby that 
we've just talked about. 

3253
02:19:48,360 --> 02:19:50,240
As you said, this is the film I 
made. 

3254
02:19:50,240 --> 02:19:54,400
Film started at a specific time.
It really did change the 

3255
02:19:54,400 --> 02:19:55,800
industry and then the film 
makers. 

3256
02:19:55,800 --> 02:19:58,600
I mean, this one is definitely 
in Spielberg's DNA, but 

3257
02:19:58,600 --> 02:20:01,160
definitely in Jaws. 
The way he creates suspense. 

3258
02:20:01,600 --> 02:20:05,000
And the light bulb definitely 
went off over Brian De Palma's 

3259
02:20:05,000 --> 02:20:06,720
head the first time he watched. 
It really did. 

3260
02:20:07,120 --> 02:20:10,360
I'll, I'll just remake this for 
my entire career, I think in one

3261
02:20:10,360 --> 02:20:13,040
way or another. 
And then the amount of film 

3262
02:20:13,040 --> 02:20:15,080
makers who watch this and 
realise Hitchcock did this on 

3263
02:20:15,080 --> 02:20:18,840
the small budget really quickly.
Sam Raimi, Evil Dead, The Corns 

3264
02:20:18,840 --> 02:20:20,480
with Blood Simple, The Blair 
Witch Project. 

3265
02:20:20,560 --> 02:20:22,800
Yeah, yeah. 
It is endless the influence of 

3266
02:20:22,800 --> 02:20:25,160
this one. 
Yeah, you're right Mark. 

3267
02:20:25,160 --> 02:20:27,000
The influence of Psycho is 
enormous. 

3268
02:20:27,000 --> 02:20:29,000
Obviously so big it is like, 
where do you begin? 

3269
02:20:29,280 --> 02:20:31,960
Yeah, for me, there's maybe 3 
main things I find interesting. 

3270
02:20:32,520 --> 02:20:35,000
1st, the slasher genre. 
Without Psycho, I don't think we

3271
02:20:35,000 --> 02:20:39,480
get Halloween in 1978 and Friday
the 13th and scream the whole 

3272
02:20:39,480 --> 02:20:42,800
template of the slasher, like 
the mass killer and knife, the 

3273
02:20:42,800 --> 02:20:45,440
suburban setting, the woman 
victim, the final girl. 

3274
02:20:45,440 --> 02:20:48,160
All of that is in Psycho. 
Yeah, I mean, in Halloween, 

3275
02:20:48,160 --> 02:20:51,800
Donald Pleasence's character is 
called Doctor Sam Loomis the 

3276
02:20:51,800 --> 02:20:54,040
Stiff. 
Yeah, yeah, John Comlin knew 

3277
02:20:54,040 --> 02:20:55,120
what he was doing. 
Yeah. 

3278
02:20:55,160 --> 02:20:57,760
Also the crafting techniques 
being ridiculously influential. 

3279
02:20:57,760 --> 02:21:00,440
The shower scene alone gave the 
master class in how to use 

3280
02:21:00,440 --> 02:21:03,120
montages to create terror in 
chaos. 

3281
02:21:03,400 --> 02:21:06,760
I know against Scorsese model 
the montage and Raging Bull when

3282
02:21:06,760 --> 02:21:09,000
Jaylen Mona was getting his 
brains beaten out from Sugar Ray

3283
02:21:09,000 --> 02:21:11,720
Robinson on the shower scenes. 
Editing like shot for shot, he 

3284
02:21:11,720 --> 02:21:13,920
said. 
And just as placed in popular 

3285
02:21:13,920 --> 02:21:15,880
culture is as big as about any 
film. 

3286
02:21:15,920 --> 02:21:17,920
Those screeching strings 
transcend the film. 

3287
02:21:18,080 --> 02:21:21,440
Everyone knows what that means. 
It's been parodied by Mel 

3288
02:21:21,440 --> 02:21:25,240
Brooks, by National Lampoon, by 
The Simpsons, even Looney Tunes 

3289
02:21:25,240 --> 02:21:28,520
to the shower scene and it's 
mentioned and We Didn't Start 

3290
02:21:28,520 --> 02:21:30,560
the Fire by Billy Joel. 
That's all he did. 

3291
02:21:31,200 --> 02:21:33,480
Should we check a psycho bell in
the Congo? 

3292
02:21:33,840 --> 02:21:35,840
If that's not a measure of 
cultural impact, I don't know 

3293
02:21:35,840 --> 02:21:37,440
what is. 
Neither do I. 

3294
02:21:39,000 --> 02:21:40,440
Yeah, exactly the same as you 
guys. 

3295
02:21:40,440 --> 02:21:43,600
I think for me, the biggest 
influence is not how it was 

3296
02:21:43,600 --> 02:21:45,840
made, but how it was viewed. 
I mean, arriving at the cinema 

3297
02:21:45,840 --> 02:21:47,720
on time. 
Can you imagine that now people 

3298
02:21:47,720 --> 02:21:49,840
just walk in and out the halfway
through a film? 

3299
02:21:50,360 --> 02:21:53,320
No, no. 
It just absolutely baffles me. 

3300
02:21:53,600 --> 02:21:57,320
And I think without that rule in
place, then you can't have 

3301
02:21:57,840 --> 02:22:00,760
necessarily the record of the 
ticket sales and you can't have 

3302
02:22:00,760 --> 02:22:03,280
the record of how many people 
it's been to see it and how many

3303
02:22:03,640 --> 02:22:05,840
views it's had and how much 
that's turned over and how that 

3304
02:22:05,840 --> 02:22:07,760
marketing works. 
And then you get Star Wars and 

3305
02:22:07,760 --> 02:22:09,440
then you get Jaws, then you get 
the Blockbuster. 

3306
02:22:09,440 --> 02:22:12,640
Then you get start getting the 
success of film based on an 

3307
02:22:12,640 --> 02:22:15,920
actual blueprint that Hitchcock 
set up because he didn't want 

3308
02:22:15,920 --> 02:22:17,280
people to miss the end of the 
film. 

3309
02:22:17,600 --> 02:22:20,080
Some of my favorite films. 
I don't think you'd have Misery 

3310
02:22:20,080 --> 02:22:22,040
without this. 
I don't think you'd have Silence

3311
02:22:22,040 --> 02:22:24,080
of the Lambs without this. 
Texas Chainsaw, I've already 

3312
02:22:24,080 --> 02:22:27,240
mentioned we could do a full 
podcast on the legacy of Psycho 

3313
02:22:27,240 --> 02:22:29,520
and the influence of Psycho. 
That's how big it is. 

3314
02:22:30,160 --> 02:22:32,600
Absolutely. 
And Psycho was first scheduled 

3315
02:22:32,600 --> 02:22:36,800
to air on US television in 1966.
Just before that, though, 

3316
02:22:36,840 --> 02:22:40,160
Valerie Percy, who was the 
daughter of a US senator, was 

3317
02:22:40,160 --> 02:22:42,080
stabbed to death by an intruder 
in their family. 

3318
02:22:42,080 --> 02:22:43,560
Whore. 
It was huge news. 

3319
02:22:43,560 --> 02:22:47,240
And as a result, cycle was 
shelled from TV until 1970, 

3320
02:22:47,440 --> 02:22:49,040
right? 
Yeah, the Valerie Percy murder 

3321
02:22:49,040 --> 02:22:50,720
still unsolved. 
Really sad. 

3322
02:22:50,720 --> 02:22:51,440
Really. 
Really. 

3323
02:22:51,800 --> 02:22:54,880
Yeah, but in 1969 cycle was re 
released in theatres. 

3324
02:22:54,880 --> 02:22:57,880
It did really well and that led 
to the 1970 screening. 

3325
02:22:57,880 --> 02:22:58,720
Right. 
OK, OK. 

3326
02:22:59,000 --> 02:23:01,280
So Cycle's influence is pretty 
hard to calculate. 

3327
02:23:01,400 --> 02:23:04,440
Just about every horror film 
since 1960 has its fingerprints 

3328
02:23:04,440 --> 02:23:07,680
somewhere and basically the 
foundations of an entire genre. 

3329
02:23:08,000 --> 02:23:10,600
A new way of screening films and
a new way of thinking about 

3330
02:23:10,600 --> 02:23:13,080
cinematic film making. 
Pretty big influence. 

3331
02:23:13,320 --> 02:23:15,360
Yeah, forget about it. 
Made with ATV crew. 

3332
02:23:15,960 --> 02:23:21,480
Yeah, unbelievable. 
All the right movies ranking. 

3333
02:23:23,440 --> 02:23:26,960
And we've nearly checked out of 
Psycho. 109 minutes of black and

3334
02:23:26,960 --> 02:23:29,360
white Hitchcock horror. 
Now it's time for the moment we 

3335
02:23:29,360 --> 02:23:32,040
put a number on it where we each
rate the film out of 10. 

3336
02:23:33,040 --> 02:23:35,000
Matt, your choice. 
Get us started, please. 

3337
02:23:35,120 --> 02:23:36,880
Your summary in school for 
Psycho. 

3338
02:23:37,560 --> 02:23:39,800
Yeah, no, great. 
Need to elaborate on this one. 

3339
02:23:39,800 --> 02:23:41,920
For me, I think everyone knows 
where this is going, probably 

3340
02:23:41,920 --> 02:23:44,520
for all of us. 
Sometimes I'll give a film A10 

3341
02:23:44,520 --> 02:23:47,680
because it's got a real personal
and nostalgic importance to me. 

3342
02:23:47,680 --> 02:23:51,280
Sometimes I'll give a 10 because
the film is just so entertaining

3343
02:23:51,280 --> 02:23:52,760
I can't find anything to bring 
it down. 

3344
02:23:52,760 --> 02:23:55,200
And sometimes I give a 10 
because of its place in 

3345
02:23:55,200 --> 02:23:57,160
cinematic history and it can't 
be denied. 

3346
02:23:57,160 --> 02:23:58,480
And it's impact, it's beyond 
measure. 

3347
02:23:58,840 --> 02:24:01,360
Psychotics, all three of those 
boxes to be honest. 

3348
02:24:01,400 --> 02:24:04,560
So I really should be giving it 
30, but it can't. 

3349
02:24:05,160 --> 02:24:08,000
But it's got one of the easiest 
turns I'll ever give a film. 

3350
02:24:08,320 --> 02:24:10,400
Yeah. 
Yeah, I think one of the things 

3351
02:24:10,400 --> 02:24:12,480
for me is just how fresh this 
still feels. 

3352
02:24:12,800 --> 02:24:16,600
Hitchcock was 60 years old, 51 
films in, and it's black and 

3353
02:24:16,600 --> 02:24:19,000
white, but it still feels modern
in lots of ways. 

3354
02:24:19,000 --> 02:24:21,720
And there's some moments like 
scenes or shots or characters 

3355
02:24:21,720 --> 02:24:23,040
they have. 
I saw them in a film now. 

3356
02:24:23,240 --> 02:24:24,720
I'd still be like, oh, that's 
new. 

3357
02:24:24,840 --> 02:24:26,080
Oh, that's cool. 
Yeah. 

3358
02:24:26,080 --> 02:24:28,160
I mean, some of the creative 
choices are incredible. 

3359
02:24:28,480 --> 02:24:31,560
He kills the star, he switches 
to protagonists, he shoots the 

3360
02:24:31,560 --> 02:24:34,480
toilet flushing outrageous and 
craft wide. 

3361
02:24:34,480 --> 02:24:36,720
It's non-stop. 
The opening pound into Phoenix 

3362
02:24:36,720 --> 02:24:39,320
is still superb. 
The Saw bus titles and Bernard 

3363
02:24:39,320 --> 02:24:41,960
Herman score stuff for the 
Hollywood Hall of Fame. 

3364
02:24:42,160 --> 02:24:45,880
And then Janet Lee, Anthony 
Perkins, 0 Miles, all brilliant 

3365
02:24:45,880 --> 02:24:47,400
and iconic. 
There's so much more. 

3366
02:24:47,400 --> 02:24:50,240
You just can't fit it all in. 
One misstep maybe for me with 

3367
02:24:50,240 --> 02:24:53,560
the psychiatrist scene, but the 
rest is so incredible it easily 

3368
02:24:53,560 --> 02:24:55,520
carries it. 
I mean, it's one of the most 

3369
02:24:55,520 --> 02:24:58,960
famous and influential films in 
the history of the whole medium,

3370
02:24:59,040 --> 02:25:03,200
so it's an easy one for me. 12 
cabins, 12 vacancies, 10 hour 

3371
02:25:03,200 --> 02:25:04,280
10. 
Nice. 

3372
02:25:04,640 --> 02:25:07,280
Nice and Westie, your submarine 
score for Psycho, please. 

3373
02:25:07,440 --> 02:25:10,640
Yeah, I mean, what else can you 
say? 

3374
02:25:10,640 --> 02:25:12,880
It's just incredible. 
I mean, just one lens, that's 

3375
02:25:12,880 --> 02:25:14,560
enough for me for a 10, let's be
honest. 

3376
02:25:16,240 --> 02:25:17,960
And then everything else on top 
of that. 

3377
02:25:17,960 --> 02:25:21,120
I mean, this was just a film 
that wasn't necessarily born of 

3378
02:25:21,120 --> 02:25:23,640
we need to make money, we need 
to turn over screenings. 

3379
02:25:23,640 --> 02:25:25,960
We need. 
It was just Hitchcock needed to 

3380
02:25:25,960 --> 02:25:27,840
make something that he really 
wanted to make. 

3381
02:25:28,080 --> 02:25:31,400
It was a film of creative 
necessity done on a budget with 

3382
02:25:31,400 --> 02:25:34,040
his TV crew who wanted to make 
something scary. 

3383
02:25:34,200 --> 02:25:36,920
And we had this idea for 
something and everybody brought 

3384
02:25:36,920 --> 02:25:38,800
their A game to something that 
didn't deserve it. 

3385
02:25:39,240 --> 02:25:41,440
And what we got was something we
didn't deserve either. 

3386
02:25:41,600 --> 02:25:43,160
But I'm so glad that we do have 
it. 

3387
02:25:43,280 --> 02:25:44,880
I'm so glad that it still works 
now. 

3388
02:25:45,040 --> 02:25:47,560
And I'm so jealous for anyone 
who hasn't seen it, It's such an

3389
02:25:47,560 --> 02:25:49,840
easy 10 for me. 
It'll stay with you for the rest

3390
02:25:49,840 --> 02:25:52,080
of your life. 
So that's not goes in and of 

3391
02:25:52,080 --> 02:25:55,040
course we also have some from 
our ATRM patrons should we see 

3392
02:25:55,040 --> 02:25:56,480
what they have to say about 
Psycho. 

3393
02:25:56,880 --> 02:25:57,640
Yeah, go through. 
Do it. 

3394
02:25:57,800 --> 02:26:00,120
First up, it's Dane de Josie. 
Dane says. 

3395
02:26:00,120 --> 02:26:02,160
One of the easiest 10s I've ever
given. 

3396
02:26:02,320 --> 02:26:04,560
I wish I had a time machine to 
go to one of the original 

3397
02:26:04,560 --> 02:26:07,000
showings of Psycho going in 
completely blind. 

3398
02:26:07,240 --> 02:26:09,320
It must have blown viewers tops 
off at the time. 

3399
02:26:09,680 --> 02:26:12,360
This is one of those films that 
simply changed movies forever. 

3400
02:26:12,520 --> 02:26:13,960
Yeah, nice. 
That's brave. 

3401
02:26:13,960 --> 02:26:15,480
Going in blind though. 
I'd want to know what was going 

3402
02:26:15,480 --> 02:26:16,560
on. 
And I just watched other people.

3403
02:26:17,280 --> 02:26:20,800
Yeah, yeah, fair enough. 
Next up, Shazzap, who said it's 

3404
02:26:20,800 --> 02:26:22,480
a nine for me. 
Superb film. 

3405
02:26:22,480 --> 02:26:24,280
Yet I find The Birds more 
terrifying. 

3406
02:26:24,440 --> 02:26:26,400
Right. 
OK, The Birds is a good shout. 

3407
02:26:26,400 --> 02:26:27,840
Also great in its own rice. 
Great. 

3408
02:26:27,840 --> 02:26:29,120
They're in this one. 
They're just stuffed. 

3409
02:26:29,960 --> 02:26:31,920
Yeah, the prequel. 
Yeah. 

3410
02:26:33,520 --> 02:26:35,080
Yeah. 
And finally, Oliver Betts said 

3411
02:26:35,080 --> 02:26:37,080
it's my favorite. 
Hitchcock had a humongous 

3412
02:26:37,080 --> 02:26:39,000
influence on the horror genre, 
which I love. 

3413
02:26:39,200 --> 02:26:41,720
And being partied by The 
Simpsons on more occasions than 

3414
02:26:41,720 --> 02:26:42,880
any other film. 
Right. 

3415
02:26:42,880 --> 02:26:45,000
It's a stone cold classic. 
And 10 on 10. 

3416
02:26:45,200 --> 02:26:47,000
Nice. 
If it's good enough for The 

3417
02:26:47,000 --> 02:26:48,120
Simpsons, it's good enough for 
me. 

3418
02:26:48,480 --> 02:26:50,960
Absolutely, yeah. 
And the scores are in from our 

3419
02:26:50,960 --> 02:26:52,360
paid runs. 
What do you think they gave it 

3420
02:26:52,360 --> 02:26:53,880
out of 10 I'm. 
Going to say 10. 

3421
02:26:54,120 --> 02:26:55,840
Oh full whack, I'll go 10 as 
well. 

3422
02:26:56,120 --> 02:26:59,680
It has to be. 
It was a huge 10 out of 10. 

3423
02:26:59,680 --> 02:27:00,960
Beautiful. 
There we go. 

3424
02:27:00,960 --> 02:27:02,440
Which gives Psycho the full 
whack. 

3425
02:27:02,440 --> 02:27:06,000
It does 40 out of 40 joining a 
very special list, that one. 

3426
02:27:06,080 --> 02:27:07,280
It is indeed. 
Yes, it should. 

3427
02:27:07,400 --> 02:27:09,080
So for now that's Psycho doing 
Dusted. 

3428
02:27:09,360 --> 02:27:11,840
Hopefully you've enjoyed it, 
hasn't made you go a little mad.

3429
02:27:12,320 --> 02:27:14,280
Yeah. 
Well, we all do sometimes, yeah.

3430
02:27:16,160 --> 02:27:18,320
Well, next time out, Matt and 
Westie will be creating the 

3431
02:27:18,320 --> 02:27:20,960
Bathe Motel for the two of us, 
and we'll be joined by Luke. 

3432
02:27:21,360 --> 02:27:25,240
It's all happening as you talk 
1970s American rock and Cameron 

3433
02:27:25,240 --> 02:27:27,520
Crows Almost famous. 
Yes. 

3434
02:27:27,760 --> 02:27:30,320
Yes, yeah, 3 golden gods there, 
right? 

3435
02:27:30,520 --> 02:27:32,120
Yeah. 
On top of the roof. 

3436
02:27:32,120 --> 02:27:34,400
I'm only the fucking lead 
singer. 

3437
02:27:38,440 --> 02:27:40,840
But before we sign off, one last
reminder about Patreon. 

3438
02:27:41,080 --> 02:27:43,000
If you've enjoyed today's 
episode, you can help support 

3439
02:27:43,000 --> 02:27:45,880
what we do and get loads more 
bonus content by becoming an 

3440
02:27:45,920 --> 02:27:49,240
ATRM Patreon. 
So visit patreon.com/all the 

3441
02:27:49,240 --> 02:27:52,280
Right Movies to find out more or
subscribe directly on Apple 

3442
02:27:52,280 --> 02:27:54,840
Podcast, Spotify, or YouTube. 
Yep. 

3443
02:27:56,000 --> 02:27:58,640
Also, don't forget to follow us 
across our social platforms. 

3444
02:27:58,640 --> 02:28:02,400
We're on X at AT right movies 
and on Instagram threads, blue 

3445
02:28:02,400 --> 02:28:05,920
sky, TikTok, YouTube, and we've 
got a fantastic community on 

3446
02:28:05,920 --> 02:28:09,240
Facebook as well. 
Go for all that and we have a 

3447
02:28:09,240 --> 02:28:11,200
website at all the way 
movies.com. 

3448
02:28:11,360 --> 02:28:13,760
Yep, harder to not find us, 
let's be honest. 

3449
02:28:13,760 --> 02:28:14,560
Exactly. 
It is. 

3450
02:28:15,680 --> 02:28:17,800
We're all off now to find out 
what's really behind that 

3451
02:28:17,800 --> 02:28:20,920
painting on Matt's wall. 
Yeah, and pull his car out of 

3452
02:28:20,920 --> 02:28:25,480
the swamp, I want to say. 
Find that North by Northwest 

3453
02:28:25,480 --> 02:28:27,960
picture behind. 
Yeah, that's fitting, isn't it? 

3454
02:28:28,160 --> 02:28:30,200
Yeah. 
Come back for Almost Famous and 

3455
02:28:30,200 --> 02:28:31,840
until then, thanks for listening
everyone. 

3456
02:28:31,840 --> 02:28:32,880
Yes. 
Thank you so much, guys. 

3457
02:28:32,880 --> 02:28:34,360
Take care. 
Thanks for listening guys.