1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:03,320 Once there was a Porter's spree in Balanamore. 2 00:00:04,240 --> 00:00:07,120 The fee was very heavy and the native lads were unable to 3 00:00:07,120 --> 00:00:09,960 enter. The boys were jealous and they 4 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:12,760 proposed to ambush the goods which were going to Balanamore 5 00:00:12,840 --> 00:00:16,360 that night. They did ambush the goods and 6 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:18,680 they had a great feast in spite of the others. 7 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:23,120 They pretended that they put the goods into a boat and they let 8 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:27,240 it sail down the Shiven. The following is a story 9 00:00:27,240 --> 00:00:29,600 composed to tell of that incident. 10 00:00:32,750 --> 00:00:35,830 The night was dank, cold, blue, the wind and thickly fell the 11 00:00:35,830 --> 00:00:38,550 rain. A publican in Ballygar, an 12 00:00:38,550 --> 00:00:43,270 order, did obtain an order from some swanky boys who was English 13 00:00:43,270 --> 00:00:46,990 to the core for a Porter's spree and a grand party to be held 14 00:00:46,990 --> 00:00:50,430 near Balnamore. The shop man took his pen in 15 00:00:50,430 --> 00:00:54,190 hand to write those items down. A dozen bottles of whiskey pure, 16 00:00:54,350 --> 00:00:56,630 the best in all the town, the brand. 17 00:00:56,630 --> 00:01:00,790 It must be Jamison's of 10 years old or more for a Porter's spree 18 00:01:00,790 --> 00:01:03,230 and a Swank party to be held near Balanamore. 19 00:01:04,069 --> 00:01:08,030 Case of Wine was ordered next to ladies for to treat and also jam 20 00:01:08,030 --> 00:01:09,830 and butter as a substitute for meat. 21 00:01:10,030 --> 00:01:13,190 Some fresh bread from the bakery and biscuits in the box for a 22 00:01:13,190 --> 00:01:16,070 Porter's Spree and a Swank party to be held near Balanamore. 23 00:01:16,910 --> 00:01:20,070 A box of players was ordered next to say they were not proud 24 00:01:20,270 --> 00:01:23,190 to grant the ladies one request. No pipes would be allowed. 25 00:01:23,590 --> 00:01:26,750 Some tea and sugar then were weighed for a favorite cup to 26 00:01:26,750 --> 00:01:30,050 pour for a Porter's spree and a Swank party to be held near 27 00:01:30,050 --> 00:01:32,890 Balamore. A barrel of stout was next 28 00:01:32,890 --> 00:01:35,010 rolled out to say that they weren't rude. 29 00:01:35,410 --> 00:01:38,570 They said it was for the Roughs who might by chance intrude. 30 00:01:38,970 --> 00:01:42,170 The goods were packed into a cart that waited at the door and 31 00:01:42,170 --> 00:01:44,290 the driver. He sat up on the deck and drove 32 00:01:44,290 --> 00:01:47,370 for Balamore. The night was dark as dark as 33 00:01:47,370 --> 00:01:50,730 pitch, the weather was severe, and some good boys made-up the 34 00:01:50,730 --> 00:01:54,290 plan these goods to commandeer. They lay an ambush at the 35 00:01:54,290 --> 00:01:58,120 bridge, where the torrents loud did roar and out they popped and 36 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:00,360 the driver stopped on his way to Baminamore. 37 00:02:01,320 --> 00:02:04,200 They told the driver then to stop and bade him subdue. 38 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:07,800 The goods were packed into a craft that sailed for Killaloo. 39 00:02:08,280 --> 00:02:10,600 They told them then to go his way, his loss. 40 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:13,920 He did the plore with a broken heart and an empty cart he 41 00:02:13,920 --> 00:02:17,200 sailed for Baminamore. No wonder the Athlone police did 42 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:19,480 shudder at the very scene for this war. 43 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:21,920 They saw that very nice a German submarine. 44 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:25,720 They quickly two their barracks ran and sandbagged all the doors 45 00:02:26,180 --> 00:02:29,340 and wired for reinforcements to their friends in Bala, Namore. 46 00:02:29,980 --> 00:02:32,780 Next morning on the banks of Claire, as the bells rang out 47 00:02:32,780 --> 00:02:36,500 for mass, some boatmen by the Shannon saw a floating object 48 00:02:36,500 --> 00:02:38,820 pass. They pursued it down the river 49 00:02:38,820 --> 00:02:42,100 and examined it all. Or it was labeled extra Porter 50 00:02:42,260 --> 00:02:43,860 from the spring near Bala Namore. 51 00:02:44,580 --> 00:02:48,340 Now young men all on you, I call for, I think, his only right to 52 00:02:48,340 --> 00:02:51,540 extend your deepest sympathy to the victims of this night. 53 00:02:51,900 --> 00:02:56,300 It was no joke to pay 5 Bob and a ticket to procure to go there 54 00:02:56,300 --> 00:02:59,020 then and get sucked in the spree near Balmore. 55 00:02:59,700 --> 00:03:04,580 And that comes from collector Kwaveen de Burka aged 14, a 56 00:03:04,660 --> 00:03:07,340 address a targar in County Galway. 57 00:03:07,500 --> 00:03:09,500 And that's from the national folklore collections. 58 00:03:09,500 --> 00:03:11,660 Ducas Archives from the school collections. 59 00:03:14,860 --> 00:03:16,860 Hello and welcome to the Fish Oaks podcast. 60 00:03:16,860 --> 00:03:22,140 Long time no chat, no Erin with me today, but I missed you, so I 61 00:03:22,140 --> 00:03:26,630 just said I'd I'd pop back in and and what better subject for 62 00:03:26,630 --> 00:03:32,030 today's episode than Stout Porter having a feast of pints, 63 00:03:32,270 --> 00:03:34,790 A spree of pints. Crack is flowing. 64 00:03:35,190 --> 00:03:39,270 The crack is on draft, but I've wanted for a long time to do an 65 00:03:39,270 --> 00:03:42,550 episode on Stout or Porter, considering that it's so 66 00:03:42,550 --> 00:03:45,590 synonymous with Ireland. Baby, let's not drink in. 67 00:03:45,630 --> 00:03:47,590 Let's talk about it for the next hour. 68 00:03:47,950 --> 00:03:52,230 We're also going to look into the darker side of the black 69 00:03:52,230 --> 00:03:55,550 stuff's history. Oh, very sexy. 70 00:03:55,830 --> 00:03:59,950 This is this is clickbait contact creation and its finest. 71 00:04:00,710 --> 00:04:03,110 You're witnessing a master at work. 72 00:04:03,590 --> 00:04:04,870 But Speaking of which. What? 73 00:04:04,950 --> 00:04:12,150 What the hell is the difference between stout and Porter as 74 00:04:12,150 --> 00:04:15,470 synonymous as Porter and stout is with Ireland now in? 75 00:04:15,470 --> 00:04:20,269 Our in our collective consciousness as Porter is a 76 00:04:20,269 --> 00:04:25,920 style of beer that was developed in London, England boom in the 77 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:29,200 early 18th century. Porter was first mentioned in 78 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:33,160 1721 as a development of the brown beer already being 79 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:36,760 produced all across London and delivered to publicans to age 80 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:38,520 and blend to the customer's taste. 81 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:42,440 It would be developed whatever in a brewery, maybe on a 82 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:47,960 slightly smaller scale, and then brought and aged in in the 83 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:51,120 individual Republicans pub, which I think is a bit crazy. 84 00:04:51,870 --> 00:04:55,190 And the innovation is attributed to Ralph Harwood, a Brewer at 85 00:04:55,190 --> 00:04:56,790 the Bell Brew House in Shoreditch. 86 00:04:56,910 --> 00:04:59,390 He's the mastermind behind Porter. 87 00:04:59,790 --> 00:05:03,150 Before 1700, London Brewers sent out their beer very young as 88 00:05:03,150 --> 00:05:07,590 Miles Annie, aging into stale styles was either performed by 89 00:05:07,590 --> 00:05:11,190 the publican or a dealer with blends of miles and stales, 90 00:05:11,190 --> 00:05:14,150 often sold to the public. Porter was one of the first beer 91 00:05:14,150 --> 00:05:16,910 styles to be aged at the brewery and then dispatched in a 92 00:05:16,910 --> 00:05:19,230 condition fit to be drank immediately. 93 00:05:19,660 --> 00:05:22,580 It was also a style that could be made on a large scale, so 94 00:05:22,580 --> 00:05:25,180 Porter is almost synonymous with this sort of, I suppose, 95 00:05:25,180 --> 00:05:28,820 development of the alcohol industry. 96 00:05:28,860 --> 00:05:31,860 As it were, the popularity of Porter was significant. 97 00:05:32,020 --> 00:05:34,740 It became the first beer style to be brewed around the world 98 00:05:34,740 --> 00:05:37,820 and production quickly commenced in Ireland, North America, 99 00:05:37,820 --> 00:05:40,860 Sweden and Russia. By the end of the 18th century, 100 00:05:41,300 --> 00:05:44,340 early London porters were very strong beers by modern 101 00:05:44,340 --> 00:05:47,500 standards, at least early trials with the hydrometer. 102 00:05:47,820 --> 00:05:49,060 I don't leave the house without mine. 103 00:05:50,660 --> 00:05:55,220 A hydrometer is in 1770s. A recorded Porter is having a 104 00:05:55,220 --> 00:05:58,940 gravity of 6.6% alcoholic content, and I think Guinness 105 00:05:58,940 --> 00:06:03,780 now is what, like 4.55%. I think if you're wondering why 106 00:06:03,780 --> 00:06:06,740 it's called Porter, very interestingly, it's because when 107 00:06:06,740 --> 00:06:09,940 it was originally brought out, it was incredibly popular with 108 00:06:09,940 --> 00:06:12,580 porters, so those who would be carrying bags around or 109 00:06:12,580 --> 00:06:15,780 welcoming people at hotels or apartments. 110 00:06:16,190 --> 00:06:18,310 In terms of the difference between stout and Porter, 111 00:06:18,630 --> 00:06:22,110 depending on who you ask, the same thing with a few little 112 00:06:22,110 --> 00:06:25,910 changes here, here and there. The history of stout and Porter 113 00:06:25,910 --> 00:06:28,550 are intertwined. The name stout used for a dark 114 00:06:28,550 --> 00:06:32,270 beer, it came about because stronger porters were marketed 115 00:06:32,270 --> 00:06:36,790 as stout porters and later just been shortened to a stout. 116 00:06:42,670 --> 00:06:47,150 Once Upon a time there was a man who wanted a wife, so one day he 117 00:06:47,150 --> 00:06:50,070 sent his mother looking for a wife for him and she got him 118 00:06:50,070 --> 00:06:52,430 one. The next day they bought the 119 00:06:52,430 --> 00:06:54,950 wedding. They bought a barrel of Porter 120 00:06:55,270 --> 00:06:59,190 and a bag of loaves, and the mother killed a goose, not for 121 00:06:59,190 --> 00:07:02,550 any reason. Next morning she went for the 122 00:07:02,550 --> 00:07:04,350 woman. Before she went, she left the 123 00:07:04,350 --> 00:07:07,910 goose down in a pot to boil, and she told Tom, who was a foolish 124 00:07:07,910 --> 00:07:10,790 sort of fellow, to look after everything until she would 125 00:07:10,790 --> 00:07:14,620 return. When she was gone, Tom looked at 126 00:07:14,620 --> 00:07:16,860 the goose to see if it was cooking all right. 127 00:07:17,500 --> 00:07:19,780 The steam burned his finger and he put it in his mouth. 128 00:07:20,620 --> 00:07:23,620 He thought the soup tasted good, so he took up a mug of soup and 129 00:07:23,620 --> 00:07:26,500 drank it. After a while he got very hungry 130 00:07:26,620 --> 00:07:29,500 and he went to the pot again and took up the goose and ate her, 131 00:07:29,540 --> 00:07:32,700 and he drank all of the soup. He was sorry now, though, when 132 00:07:32,700 --> 00:07:35,100 he had the goose eaten, because he said to himself that they 133 00:07:35,100 --> 00:07:36,580 wouldn't have anything for the party. 134 00:07:38,260 --> 00:07:41,300 Lucky enough for Tom, they had a goose hatching and he brought 135 00:07:41,300 --> 00:07:45,170 her in and killed her as well. Without even plucking her. 136 00:07:45,210 --> 00:07:47,610 He put her in the pot to boil but asked. 137 00:07:47,610 --> 00:07:49,570 He went to the barrel and drank a mug of Porter. 138 00:07:50,170 --> 00:07:52,210 He didn't know how to turn off the tap and all. 139 00:07:52,210 --> 00:07:54,210 The Porter began to run along the floor. 140 00:07:54,810 --> 00:07:57,970 He said his mother and wife would get all wet and so he got 141 00:07:57,970 --> 00:08:01,130 the bag of oats for the loaves and put them here and there all 142 00:08:01,130 --> 00:08:04,810 around the room as steps. He thought that the eggs on 143 00:08:04,810 --> 00:08:07,490 which the goose was sitting would be cold and he sat on them 144 00:08:07,490 --> 00:08:09,890 himself. When the mother and wife came 145 00:08:09,890 --> 00:08:12,090 home, Tom was still sitting on the eggs. 146 00:08:12,430 --> 00:08:15,870 And when his intended wife saw him and all about, she turned 147 00:08:15,870 --> 00:08:18,070 away and went home, leaving Tom to his mother. 148 00:08:18,790 --> 00:08:23,430 That came from collector Mary Jo Nolan from Kaluli County Galway. 149 00:08:23,430 --> 00:08:25,070 Lots of Galway stories this time around. 150 00:08:25,070 --> 00:08:27,710 And she got that story from informant John Tiernan, who was 151 00:08:27,710 --> 00:08:30,270 63 upon the time recording that story. 152 00:08:30,870 --> 00:08:33,789 And he's from Kilsala and County Galway. 153 00:08:34,549 --> 00:08:37,590 Strange little tale there. Obviously Tom was a hapless 154 00:08:37,590 --> 00:08:38,789 sword. I'd say the amount of people 155 00:08:38,789 --> 00:08:42,330 getting married back in the day that that did not deserve the 156 00:08:42,330 --> 00:08:44,850 person they were getting with just because of these sort of 157 00:08:44,850 --> 00:08:48,490 weird organized like his mother went out and found a wife. 158 00:08:48,610 --> 00:08:52,210 I don't like the term. Tom was left to his mother and 159 00:08:53,850 --> 00:08:55,890 really just feels like they were trying to fop this fellow off 160 00:08:55,890 --> 00:08:58,530 anywhere they could. And who and who would blame 161 00:08:58,530 --> 00:09:02,650 them? I thought as well, if he didn't 162 00:09:02,650 --> 00:09:05,050 know how to turn off the the Porter, that he was just going 163 00:09:05,050 --> 00:09:07,890 to do some sort of like Looney Tunes action on it where he 164 00:09:08,290 --> 00:09:13,030 drank the whole thing. But now I just affect oats all 165 00:09:13,030 --> 00:09:15,590 around the floor and start to sit on some eggs. 166 00:09:18,750 --> 00:09:21,390 So within a few decades, a Porter breweries in London had 167 00:09:21,390 --> 00:09:24,310 grown beyond any previously known scale for breweries at the 168 00:09:24,310 --> 00:09:27,790 time, large volumes were being exported to Ireland. 169 00:09:27,910 --> 00:09:32,190 Maybe it's no surprise by 1776 that an industrious Arthur 170 00:09:32,190 --> 00:09:34,270 Guinness was concocting something. 171 00:09:34,270 --> 00:09:38,430 In the 19th century, the beer gained its customary black color 172 00:09:38,750 --> 00:09:42,310 through the use of black patent malt, giving it its stronger 173 00:09:42,310 --> 00:09:44,590 flavor. And this would be what would 174 00:09:44,590 --> 00:09:48,390 become the flavor and taste and look we associate with Guinness 175 00:09:48,390 --> 00:09:53,670 stout, particularly originally the adjective stout for 176 00:09:53,670 --> 00:09:57,750 describing something meant proud or brave, but later, after the 177 00:09:57,750 --> 00:10:00,790 14th century it took on the connotation of just strong. 178 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:04,280 So the first known use of the word stout for a beer was 179 00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:08,160 documented in 1677. The expression stout Porter was 180 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:12,120 applied during the 18th century for strong variations of Porter. 181 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:15,280 In the UK it was possible to find a stout, pale ale for 182 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:18,720 example, but later all of that other frills would be dropped 183 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:21,240 and stout was just associated with Porter. 184 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:24,960 Today the term stout and Porter are used in different breweries 185 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:29,330 almost interchangeably just to describe a dark beer, but there 186 00:10:29,330 --> 00:10:31,490 are some people will decide on distinctions. 187 00:10:31,490 --> 00:10:35,010 I think the distinction is some people use stout to describe 188 00:10:35,010 --> 00:10:38,010 maybe more that burnt sort of very guinnessy flavor. 189 00:10:38,210 --> 00:10:42,010 Whereas if you ever had a milk Porter or milk stout, but I 190 00:10:42,010 --> 00:10:43,210 think it's. I don't know, there's something 191 00:10:43,210 --> 00:10:46,170 gross sanding about it. Now technically this next story 192 00:10:46,170 --> 00:10:51,490 has nothing to do really with Porter or stout, but I couldn't. 193 00:10:51,490 --> 00:10:55,950 But leave it in and it's a cure, of course. 194 00:10:56,270 --> 00:11:02,430 And this person, It's a cure from Fart Farton Fart Han Farton 195 00:11:02,430 --> 00:11:04,830 County. Go with and. 196 00:11:05,630 --> 00:11:08,310 The. The address of this of this cure 197 00:11:08,390 --> 00:11:12,150 makes sense when you when we we dive into into the nitty gritty 198 00:11:12,150 --> 00:11:15,910 details here. So a cure for measles, get some 199 00:11:15,910 --> 00:11:19,390 sheep's manure and put it in water and drink this in 200 00:11:19,390 --> 00:11:23,070 quotation marks soup. This was called Porter in order 201 00:11:23,070 --> 00:11:26,900 to get us to drink it. It was found to be a great cure 202 00:11:26,900 --> 00:11:30,420 for measles. No whiskey in that time, which 203 00:11:30,540 --> 00:11:33,260 obviously seems to have been maybe the more preferable cure 204 00:11:33,260 --> 00:11:35,420 for measles. I didn't realize whiskey had 205 00:11:35,420 --> 00:11:39,700 anti measle qualities. Another cure for measles was to 206 00:11:39,700 --> 00:11:42,780 boil rusty nails and drink the juice out of them. 207 00:11:42,940 --> 00:11:47,460 It's still another great cure. Another cure they listed for 208 00:11:47,460 --> 00:11:52,180 ringworm was old soot and salt and men's urine and tobacco torn 209 00:11:52,180 --> 00:11:54,700 up. Steep all these together and put 210 00:11:54,700 --> 00:11:57,660 it in a jar and keep this as a use for cures. 211 00:11:57,660 --> 00:12:01,700 For ringworm, I assume you just apply that to your to wherever 212 00:12:01,700 --> 00:12:04,260 the ringworm was. And maybe all that stuff's just 213 00:12:04,260 --> 00:12:09,180 so toxic that it that it that it makes life inhabitable for the 214 00:12:09,180 --> 00:12:11,180 ringworm. But yeah, this person's variety 215 00:12:11,180 --> 00:12:14,740 of cures are hardcore. They're drinking sheep's manure, 216 00:12:15,100 --> 00:12:19,660 rusty nail water and they're applying all soot, salt and piss 217 00:12:20,140 --> 00:12:22,300 and tobacco. Very strange. 218 00:12:22,300 --> 00:12:26,020 That comes from informant Jude Henry, who's 76 year old and 219 00:12:26,860 --> 00:12:30,700 clearly a very hardcore woman from Farton County Galway. 220 00:12:30,700 --> 00:12:31,820 I'm sure I'm pronouncing that wrong. 221 00:12:31,820 --> 00:12:34,780 It's probably Fartan, Fartan, County Galway. 222 00:12:39,820 --> 00:12:43,700 So at the opening of the podcast we had that beautiful We song 223 00:12:44,100 --> 00:12:49,580 about a spree in Balanomore and the English lads in the area 224 00:12:49,580 --> 00:12:55,620 hosting a big soiree and the drink getting commandeered by 225 00:12:55,620 --> 00:13:00,780 the by the native Irish sort of classic sort of underdog 226 00:13:01,300 --> 00:13:03,540 underdog. Narrative song that we love. 227 00:13:04,020 --> 00:13:07,220 And in that story I believe there's a line in which they say 228 00:13:07,620 --> 00:13:11,060 that they bought stout or Porter to sort of keep the commoner 229 00:13:11,060 --> 00:13:12,780 happy. And I think that's some of the 230 00:13:12,780 --> 00:13:16,620 success of Porter or stout as well, as well as it being mass 231 00:13:16,620 --> 00:13:21,670 produced and not aged in the pub and thus being able to consume 232 00:13:21,670 --> 00:13:23,950 it quicker. I think it was also quite 233 00:13:24,190 --> 00:13:27,470 affordable too. So I think when we're 234 00:13:27,470 --> 00:13:30,910 considering why it might be popular here or the world over 235 00:13:31,270 --> 00:13:34,070 and why it's spread, one, they were able to produce a whole 236 00:13:34,070 --> 00:13:37,670 pile of it and two the cost was quite reasonable as well. 237 00:13:39,590 --> 00:13:42,390 During our afterlife episode where we discussed wakes and 238 00:13:42,470 --> 00:13:47,510 assert of the the events that surround a funeral and awake as 239 00:13:47,510 --> 00:13:50,190 well as with the Ren boys, we kind of touched on the straw 240 00:13:50,190 --> 00:13:54,470 boys, the straw man who would attend weddings and but you can 241 00:13:54,470 --> 00:13:57,950 kind of see if you go on to ducas and type Porter or stout, 242 00:13:58,070 --> 00:14:01,750 how much the drink was associated with these sort of 243 00:14:01,750 --> 00:14:06,510 events maybe by proxy of it being a sort of economically 244 00:14:06,510 --> 00:14:10,070 sound beverage to to supply for an event. 245 00:14:11,630 --> 00:14:14,070 The tradition if if you've ever been at a wedding where 246 00:14:14,150 --> 00:14:17,570 essentially a pilot, a pile of men come in dressed up in straw 247 00:14:17,570 --> 00:14:21,890 sort of weird outfits and do a weird dance around at the the 248 00:14:21,890 --> 00:14:25,610 newly married couple and they usually get steamed drunk. 249 00:14:25,610 --> 00:14:29,890 Then that's not so far removed from what used to happen back in 250 00:14:29,890 --> 00:14:32,650 the day. But it seems that I had a 251 00:14:32,650 --> 00:14:35,410 weirder it had a different suit of origin. 252 00:14:35,650 --> 00:14:38,210 Maybe that like the closer people to the family would be 253 00:14:38,210 --> 00:14:41,170 invited to the wedding and they wouldn't be donned and straw 254 00:14:41,910 --> 00:14:45,950 both those in the local area who may not have known the the 255 00:14:46,550 --> 00:14:49,910 husband or wife too well. They would almost appear like 256 00:14:49,910 --> 00:14:55,310 spectres of of straw some. In some stories the morning of 257 00:14:55,310 --> 00:14:59,950 the wedding and in some stories like at the reception and it was 258 00:14:59,950 --> 00:15:02,830 almost like you'd give them no more than with trick or treating 259 00:15:03,790 --> 00:15:07,550 and offering of of Porter. And in some stories they stay at 260 00:15:07,550 --> 00:15:10,230 the wedding and they kind of like, I suppose there's like 261 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:14,320 there's a little pile of drink that the the straw men are are 262 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:16,720 sort of appeased with in some stories. 263 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:20,440 If I can find them now, it's almost like they arrive and like 264 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,080 a torment and then are given their offering of drink and then 265 00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:25,120 they like go away with the drink and drink it. 266 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:28,800 In one story I saw that like a field beside the venue and they 267 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:33,880 they had their Porter and stout. A short times ago, two people 268 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:36,880 got married. The girl was from my village and 269 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:39,640 the man was from Westport and they were married in Bala. 270 00:15:41,060 --> 00:15:43,260 A couple always get married in the girls parish. 271 00:15:44,460 --> 00:15:46,100 They went to the church in a motor car. 272 00:15:46,820 --> 00:15:49,300 There was an old shoe tied to the back of the motor car to 273 00:15:49,300 --> 00:15:52,940 bring them look. Cannon Ryder Bala married them. 274 00:15:53,780 --> 00:15:56,180 They were married in Bala because this girl was from Bala 275 00:15:56,180 --> 00:15:58,820 parish. That night there was a marriage 276 00:15:58,820 --> 00:16:02,140 feast held in the girl's house. The man invited all of his 277 00:16:02,140 --> 00:16:04,700 friends to the house and the girl invited all of hers. 278 00:16:05,620 --> 00:16:06,900 The house was filled with people. 279 00:16:07,610 --> 00:16:10,450 There was a half barrel of Porter and a bottles of whiskey 280 00:16:10,450 --> 00:16:13,250 for the men, and they had teas and wine for the girls. 281 00:16:14,290 --> 00:16:16,890 A man went around the house with a bucket of Porter and a mug, 282 00:16:17,050 --> 00:16:18,690 and he gave each man some Porter. 283 00:16:19,370 --> 00:16:22,210 There was the music of the melodion and a fiddle, and they 284 00:16:22,250 --> 00:16:25,690 all danced in the kitchen. The girls danced reels, jigs, 285 00:16:25,690 --> 00:16:28,410 waltzes, horn pipes, and half sets and sets. 286 00:16:28,410 --> 00:16:32,330 At about 1:00 that night, when all the people were enjoying 287 00:16:32,330 --> 00:16:34,610 themselves, the straw boys came to the house. 288 00:16:35,910 --> 00:16:38,510 The captain of the straw boys knocked at the door and went 289 00:16:38,510 --> 00:16:41,110 into the house. Others followed. 290 00:16:42,390 --> 00:16:45,110 The captain danced with the bride and the others danced with 291 00:16:45,110 --> 00:16:47,950 the other girls. When they were finished dancing, 292 00:16:48,150 --> 00:16:50,710 they went outside the door and they were supplied with drink. 293 00:16:51,430 --> 00:16:54,070 They then went away wishing well to the newly married couple. 294 00:16:55,190 --> 00:16:56,910 They were dressed in soldier straw. 295 00:16:57,550 --> 00:17:00,950 Each straw boy had a band of straw around his waist, a band 296 00:17:00,950 --> 00:17:03,630 around his knees and a tall straw hat on his head. 297 00:17:04,329 --> 00:17:07,650 And that comes from collector Paddy Kerr from the newly County 298 00:17:07,650 --> 00:17:11,569 Mayo informant John Kerr, aged 50. 299 00:17:11,890 --> 00:17:13,970 Also from the newly probably is Papa. 300 00:17:16,849 --> 00:17:21,410 Wine and tea for the women and Porter and whiskey for the men. 301 00:17:21,730 --> 00:17:23,490 I'd love to see some straw girls. 302 00:17:23,490 --> 00:17:24,530 That would be a cool thing to do. 303 00:17:24,530 --> 00:17:27,089 Now, sort of flip the flip the switch. 304 00:17:27,089 --> 00:17:29,730 I'm sure people have done that already, but it would be cool at 305 00:17:29,730 --> 00:17:31,570 a wedding. Have a gang of women done up in 306 00:17:31,570 --> 00:17:32,330 straw. Instead. 307 00:17:32,830 --> 00:17:35,190 Make that happen. Women of the world. 308 00:17:35,510 --> 00:17:37,910 But of course, we couldn't talk about the black stuff without 309 00:17:37,910 --> 00:17:40,030 talking about Guinness. It's hard when you think of the 310 00:17:40,030 --> 00:17:42,630 word stout. For me, it's the first thing I 311 00:17:42,630 --> 00:17:45,070 think of. It's gotten to that sort of a 312 00:17:45,070 --> 00:17:50,550 iconoclast position. Guinness no more than Vaseline. 313 00:17:51,190 --> 00:17:53,230 So people say tato for everything. 314 00:17:53,230 --> 00:17:56,030 I think that confuses things. I understand you're a great 315 00:17:56,030 --> 00:17:59,790 nationalist if you say tato for. Every brand of crisps. 316 00:18:00,030 --> 00:18:02,070 But I just think it's needlessly confusing. 317 00:18:02,980 --> 00:18:04,620 Anyway, I'm, I'm digressing. I'm digressing. 318 00:18:04,620 --> 00:18:08,860 Let's talk about Guinness. Okay. 319 00:18:08,860 --> 00:18:10,860 So if you're listening to this now, this is actually maybe a 320 00:18:10,860 --> 00:18:12,660 week after I originally recorded. 321 00:18:12,780 --> 00:18:17,180 Maybe you can taste the sands of time and my current tombra was a 322 00:18:17,300 --> 00:18:19,940 little bit of a tongue twister. Hell hell yeah. 323 00:18:20,060 --> 00:18:21,380 But. We're moving on to the Guinness 324 00:18:21,380 --> 00:18:25,220 family. As said, I lost all the audio. 325 00:18:25,420 --> 00:18:29,410 From this part, but sure look. Isn't it no different than just 326 00:18:29,410 --> 00:18:32,650 giving us just giving it a once over a practice run? 327 00:18:35,050 --> 00:18:37,490 It is without saying. I'm sure you've heard already. 328 00:18:38,290 --> 00:18:41,210 That the Guinness family were correctly and are correctly. 329 00:18:41,210 --> 00:18:44,370 Viewed as being extremely enlightened employers, and that 330 00:18:44,370 --> 00:18:47,370 was no different in the past. You can make the argument that 331 00:18:47,370 --> 00:18:50,010 Guinness did it to prevent there was a lot of unionizing at the 332 00:18:50,010 --> 00:18:51,530 time. They were like the Googles of 333 00:18:51,530 --> 00:18:54,370 their time. They made their workplace very 334 00:18:54,370 --> 00:18:59,630 tolerable to be in Imagine. From the late 1800s onwards, the 335 00:18:59,630 --> 00:19:02,630 brewery built quality homes for its workers and provided them 336 00:19:02,630 --> 00:19:05,790 with free health care. Guinness actually had wages at 337 00:19:05,790 --> 00:19:09,510 20% higher than the Dublin average, at the time, 20%. 338 00:19:09,510 --> 00:19:10,990 That's a huge amount. They were one of the first 339 00:19:10,990 --> 00:19:14,470 companies in Ireland to provide pensions to their staff and 340 00:19:14,470 --> 00:19:17,790 pensions not just for staff but for their widows too. 341 00:19:19,070 --> 00:19:22,270 Those widows would also receive. A preferences when job vacancies 342 00:19:22,270 --> 00:19:24,820 came up. Free dinners for their kids once 343 00:19:24,820 --> 00:19:28,020 a week, and this would encourage the kids then to attend school. 344 00:19:28,020 --> 00:19:31,860 And in 1870, Guinness opened up a medical dispensary to provide 345 00:19:31,860 --> 00:19:34,500 free Doctors Consultations and Medicines for the sick. 346 00:19:35,780 --> 00:19:39,420 In 1890, the Ivy Trust, originally the Guinness Trust, 347 00:19:39,700 --> 00:19:42,180 was established to provide. Homes for the poor in both 348 00:19:42,180 --> 00:19:46,420 London and in Dublin, but all. Of this is aside to just the 349 00:19:46,420 --> 00:19:49,220 little sort of extras employees received during the working day. 350 00:19:49,220 --> 00:19:51,060 As I said, very like a Google Vibe. 351 00:19:51,870 --> 00:19:55,310 This included three meals in the dining room, A2 pint, beer 352 00:19:55,310 --> 00:19:58,710 allowance or script as it was called, and this could be 353 00:19:58,710 --> 00:20:02,670 exchanged for goods at the Co. Op store for those employees. 354 00:20:02,670 --> 00:20:04,590 Who had wives who had recently given birth? 355 00:20:05,110 --> 00:20:07,870 Something called snipes were given free snipes. 356 00:20:07,950 --> 00:20:11,510 Small bottles of Guinness egg would have vitamin B rich yeast 357 00:20:11,510 --> 00:20:14,550 sediment for nutrition for mother and baby. 358 00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:22,040 It's funny because you do hear that Guinness is good for 359 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:24,840 pregnant women. That's the old slogan. 360 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:26,480 Guinness is good for pregnant women. 361 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:30,120 I actually one of the first times I had Guinness and the 362 00:20:30,120 --> 00:20:37,080 first pint I ever had in a pub. I was 1617 at the time and me 363 00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:40,560 and my friend wanted to try Guinness and he suggested 364 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:43,360 because he found the. Taste of it the first time he'd 365 00:20:43,360 --> 00:20:47,440 sampled it foul. That he suggested having Ribena 366 00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:49,880 and Guinness mixed. So the publican kind of. 367 00:20:50,360 --> 00:20:53,840 We asked sheepishly, but I think you asked sheepishly if you're 368 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:58,240 1617 as is and we made it and the next thing a friend came in 369 00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:01,640 and he had just a slightly older friend and he arrived in the 370 00:21:01,640 --> 00:21:04,040 door and he went lads, lads, lads. 371 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:06,400 That's what pregnant women do, be drinking. 372 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:11,120 And he was right, it is. But funny in hindsight, haven't 373 00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:19,470 had one since. There has been an excess of 374 00:21:19,470 --> 00:21:23,670 noises this time around recording children, police 375 00:21:23,670 --> 00:21:26,670 sirens. They just hit the same cord in 376 00:21:26,670 --> 00:21:28,790 me. They really microphones, 377 00:21:29,230 --> 00:21:34,710 microphones, drink children and sirens like no man's business. 378 00:21:38,630 --> 00:21:41,550 Aside from that, as early as the 1900s, Guinness employees 379 00:21:41,550 --> 00:21:45,360 received social benefits from free train tickets for trips to 380 00:21:45,360 --> 00:21:50,280 the countryside to Guinness Athletic Union for sports and as 381 00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:53,640 well as a bicentenary center with a theater and swimming 382 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:56,560 pool. It's been mentioned on previous 383 00:21:56,560 --> 00:21:58,680 episodes that the Guinness family. 384 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:01,760 Have provided a lot with regard to green and cultural. 385 00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:05,720 Spaces at to Dublin City and we have Guinness to thank for 386 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:08,270 Stevens Green. Stephens Green are the earliest 387 00:22:08,270 --> 00:22:10,790 iteration of St. Stephens Green was originally a 388 00:22:10,790 --> 00:22:14,510 medieval leper hospital, now St. Mercer's Hospital, dedicated to 389 00:22:14,510 --> 00:22:16,110 St. Stephen on nearby Stephens 390 00:22:16,110 --> 00:22:18,110 Street. Until 1663, St. 391 00:22:18,110 --> 00:22:21,030 Stephens Green was sort of just a marshy common area on the 392 00:22:21,030 --> 00:22:23,790 edges of Dublin back when the city was a bit smaller. 393 00:22:24,380 --> 00:22:27,460 It was approximately 60 acres and used for grazing until the 394 00:22:27,460 --> 00:22:30,860 Dublin Corporation decided to enclose the center of the common 395 00:22:30,860 --> 00:22:33,260 and seller at the land around the perimeter of it for 396 00:22:33,260 --> 00:22:35,220 building. The center was then enclosed as 397 00:22:35,220 --> 00:22:38,780 a park with a wall in 1660. Four so quickly since Stevens, 398 00:22:38,780 --> 00:22:40,860 Green and the green in the middle became somewhat of a. 399 00:22:40,860 --> 00:22:45,150 Resort for the better off of the city after the death of Prince 400 00:22:45,150 --> 00:22:47,790 Albert, Queen Victoria actually suggested that St. 401 00:22:47,790 --> 00:22:51,350 Stephen's Green be renamed Albert Green and have a statue 402 00:22:51,350 --> 00:22:53,910 in his honor at the center and even at this time. 403 00:22:53,910 --> 00:22:57,550 This suggestion was rejected with indignation by a Dublin 404 00:22:57,550 --> 00:23:00,110 corporation. Access to the Green, as we were 405 00:23:00,110 --> 00:23:04,910 saying, was restricted to local residents until 1877, when 406 00:23:04,910 --> 00:23:07,230 Parliament passed an Act to reopen St. 407 00:23:07,230 --> 00:23:10,590 Stephen's Green to the public. This was an initiative set about 408 00:23:10,590 --> 00:23:14,180 by Sir A E Guinness, a member of the Guinness Brewing family. 409 00:23:14,660 --> 00:23:17,540 He would later pay for the layout of the Green in 410 00:23:17,540 --> 00:23:21,100 approximately its current form. So as you see since Stevens 411 00:23:21,100 --> 00:23:24,820 Green today and how it's landscaped, I don't think a 412 00:23:24,940 --> 00:23:27,780 Guinness was out there himself. It would shovel and spade but he 413 00:23:27,780 --> 00:23:29,940 had a hand in the setup. The same setup you see in 414 00:23:29,940 --> 00:23:34,100 Stevens Green is the same as the plans which took place in 1880. 415 00:23:34,940 --> 00:23:38,340 It was then given to Dublin Corporation as representatives 416 00:23:38,340 --> 00:23:40,700 of the people of Dublin and given as a gift to the people of 417 00:23:40,700 --> 00:23:43,990 Dublin by way of thanks of course, the City Commission the 418 00:23:43,990 --> 00:23:46,390 statue which you can see. It faces the College of 419 00:23:46,390 --> 00:23:47,990 Surgeons. And you know what? 420 00:23:48,070 --> 00:23:50,110 A Guinness wasn't the only guy that fancied. 421 00:23:50,110 --> 00:23:52,230 Himself to have a bit of a green thumb. 422 00:23:52,430 --> 00:23:55,150 And what a large green thumb. Because these were these were 423 00:23:55,190 --> 00:23:58,430 public barks. These boys were building and Ivy 424 00:23:58,430 --> 00:24:01,230 Garden. Ivy Garden has an interesting 425 00:24:01,230 --> 00:24:03,910 history. Originally one of the the 426 00:24:03,910 --> 00:24:07,070 Guinnesses Sir Benjamin Lee Guinness Co, founded at the 427 00:24:07,070 --> 00:24:11,630 Dublin Exhibition Palace and Winter Garden Company, which was 428 00:24:11,630 --> 00:24:14,910 a private business. But that took place on the 429 00:24:14,910 --> 00:24:17,710 grounds of what is now Ivy Gardens and the surrounding 430 00:24:17,710 --> 00:24:21,030 buildings. Sir Benjamin Lee's son in 1870 431 00:24:21,190 --> 00:24:25,310 brought the whole plan a step forward, Edward Cecil Guinness, 432 00:24:25,470 --> 00:24:29,070 who later became Lord Ivy. Despite attempts to make the 433 00:24:29,070 --> 00:24:32,910 site still an exhibition of Irish arts, it wasn't a success 434 00:24:32,910 --> 00:24:35,070 and the gardens reverted back to private ownership. 435 00:24:35,350 --> 00:24:39,710 In 1883, Edward Cecil Guinness would sell the buildings the Ivy 436 00:24:39,710 --> 00:24:42,810 Garden Buildings to the Royal University, which was 437 00:24:42,810 --> 00:24:46,090 subsequently adapted into University College Dublin. 438 00:24:46,250 --> 00:24:49,450 Mr. M and Debbie Lehrer. Who was both a tee shock and 439 00:24:49,450 --> 00:24:53,290 chancellor of UCD at the time, which is kind of scary notion? 440 00:24:55,370 --> 00:24:59,370 He inquired to the second Earl. Of Ivy As to whether they'd sell 441 00:24:59,370 --> 00:25:02,930 Ivy House back to the Irish State as well as the Gardens 442 00:25:02,930 --> 00:25:07,250 complex initially in 1937, the second Earl of Ivy declined. 443 00:25:07,810 --> 00:25:11,290 However, he had a change of heart by 1939 and wrote to AIM 444 00:25:11,290 --> 00:25:13,410 and Devalera, offering the Ivy complex. 445 00:25:13,610 --> 00:25:15,450 As a sort of gift for the nation. 446 00:25:15,610 --> 00:25:19,330 But one thing which is really admirable about Lord Ivy's 447 00:25:19,330 --> 00:25:22,730 decision was that he was kind of concerned about the future. 448 00:25:22,730 --> 00:25:25,690 Of the site, he said he'd give it to the public under the 449 00:25:25,690 --> 00:25:29,690 conditions that the Ivy Garden site remain unbuilt on and be 450 00:25:29,690 --> 00:25:38,120 kept as a long for Dublin. Now the harp's long been 451 00:25:38,120 --> 00:25:41,120 associated with Ireland. Obviously it's an instrument we 452 00:25:41,120 --> 00:25:44,400 play, and if you listen to our episode Invention of Music, 453 00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:48,360 you'll hear about how important the harp is in terms of our 454 00:25:48,360 --> 00:25:51,350 national identity. And furthermore, if you listen 455 00:25:51,590 --> 00:25:54,310 to our episode on Owen Rowe O'Neill, you'll know that one of 456 00:25:54,310 --> 00:25:57,550 the first times you would have seen the Green Flag with the the 457 00:25:58,030 --> 00:26:01,590 Golden Harp joining the fight between Owen Rowe O'Neill and 458 00:26:01,590 --> 00:26:05,110 Cromwell in the 14th century. That harp is also known as the 459 00:26:05,110 --> 00:26:07,830 Brian Brew harp, which is now preserved in the. 460 00:26:07,990 --> 00:26:12,310 Library of Trinity College, Queen Elizabeth the 1st and 461 00:26:12,310 --> 00:26:16,550 indeed Cromwell both saw the negative in the harp as a symbol 462 00:26:16,550 --> 00:26:19,830 of Irish identity Cromwell was stringing up. 463 00:26:19,910 --> 00:26:23,350 Computer harpists because the relationship between passing on. 464 00:26:23,430 --> 00:26:27,230 Music, history and Irish identity were all intertwined in 465 00:26:27,230 --> 00:26:29,870 these figures. So, as said, in the earliest 466 00:26:29,870 --> 00:26:33,870 days Guinness adopted, I think it was in 1860, They adopted the 467 00:26:33,870 --> 00:26:36,110 O'Neill style harp to their Guinness glass. 468 00:26:36,230 --> 00:26:39,670 That's where the sort of flat edge of it is pointed. 469 00:26:39,670 --> 00:26:42,430 It's on your it would be on your left as you're looking at the 470 00:26:42,430 --> 00:26:47,110 harp. And as early as 1862, Guinness 471 00:26:47,150 --> 00:26:50,190 trademarked this symbol of the harp and the. 472 00:26:50,470 --> 00:26:53,870 Irish Free State, which was formed in 1922, couldn't use it 473 00:26:53,870 --> 00:26:57,070 anymore. The state actually had to change 474 00:26:57,310 --> 00:26:59,510 the traditional. Shape of the harp that they flip 475 00:26:59,510 --> 00:27:02,310 it around the other way so that the flat edge, if you look at 476 00:27:02,310 --> 00:27:05,470 your passport or anything now sits along the right hand side. 477 00:27:05,830 --> 00:27:09,950 So obviously pretty harmless in in in Truth, but I think it's 478 00:27:09,950 --> 00:27:15,420 amazing to think that the Irish state had to bend to Guinness's. 479 00:27:16,220 --> 00:27:18,500 It's funny to think that Guinness has lived for longer 480 00:27:18,500 --> 00:27:27,980 than Irish independence has. In 1797, Arthur Guinness was 481 00:27:27,980 --> 00:27:31,020 named by the Union Star newspaper as suspected former 482 00:27:31,020 --> 00:27:34,220 against Irish rebels. He was described as a Brewer at 483 00:27:34,220 --> 00:27:37,220 James's gate. An active spy United Irishman 484 00:27:37,220 --> 00:27:40,860 will be cautious of dealing with any publican who sells his 485 00:27:40,860 --> 00:27:45,020 drink. Historian and author Paul. 486 00:27:45,020 --> 00:27:47,700 Rig og O'Rourke noted of the Guinness family. 487 00:27:48,140 --> 00:27:51,340 Arthur's successors in Saint James's Gate were definitely 488 00:27:51,340 --> 00:27:53,700 steadfast in their loyalty to the British Crown. 489 00:27:53,980 --> 00:27:59,780 His descendant, Lord Ivey donated £100,000 the UVF Arms 490 00:27:59,780 --> 00:28:03,140 Fund, in 1913. So all well and good. 491 00:28:03,140 --> 00:28:05,860 To hear about lovely Lord Ivey and such and all the great 492 00:28:05,860 --> 00:28:09,950 things that Guinness did. For their staff, and I think 493 00:28:09,950 --> 00:28:12,590 Guinness wanted the best for Ireland as a country, but within 494 00:28:12,630 --> 00:28:16,670 a certain outlook, they wanted the best for an Ireland which 495 00:28:16,670 --> 00:28:19,630 existed under British rule. Generally speaking, companies 496 00:28:19,630 --> 00:28:23,150 who are doing well favor the circumstances of the position 497 00:28:23,150 --> 00:28:25,550 they're in too. So if Guinness is doing well and 498 00:28:25,550 --> 00:28:29,270 Britain is ruling Ireland, then Guinness is happy. 499 00:28:30,030 --> 00:28:33,940 So in response to this large donation to the UVF, many 500 00:28:33,940 --> 00:28:36,820 nationalists organize a boycott of Guinness products, Michael 501 00:28:36,820 --> 00:28:40,100 Conway, later an IRA commandant in Limerick, remarked. 502 00:28:40,620 --> 00:28:43,340 For a time, only Murphy's stout was consumed locally. 503 00:28:43,340 --> 00:28:45,700 But. After a while the boycott eased. 504 00:28:48,660 --> 00:28:50,780 I know that the drinks are from there, but you still see a 505 00:28:50,780 --> 00:28:54,020 preference towards a Murphy's or a Beamish down in Monster. 506 00:28:54,060 --> 00:28:56,420 I ordered it once and they had to change the keg just to give 507 00:28:56,420 --> 00:29:00,900 me one and I was like. Oh buddy, I'm not feeling so 508 00:29:00,900 --> 00:29:02,700 political anymore. Or geez. 509 00:29:07,830 --> 00:29:10,110 In the run up to the Easter Rising, members of the Irish 510 00:29:10,110 --> 00:29:13,230 Volunteers who worked in Guinness were discouraged from 511 00:29:13,270 --> 00:29:16,110 openly parading or expressing their political views. 512 00:29:16,390 --> 00:29:19,030 Frank Henderson, a captain, and the Irish Volunteers who took 513 00:29:19,030 --> 00:29:21,870 part in the host gun running after the Easter Rising, said 514 00:29:21,870 --> 00:29:25,190 Guinness's staff were wary that they may be victimized in the 515 00:29:25,190 --> 00:29:27,830 workplace, joining the actual fighting of 1916. 516 00:29:28,090 --> 00:29:31,410 Trucks used by Guinness were converted into improvised 517 00:29:31,410 --> 00:29:34,050 armored fighting vehicles. These were used by the British 518 00:29:34,050 --> 00:29:37,730 Army against Republican forces. One such vehicle was made by 519 00:29:37,770 --> 00:29:41,570 bolting 4 boilers onto the rear of a Guinness flatbed truck. 520 00:29:41,810 --> 00:29:43,690 It believed that these would have been among the first 521 00:29:43,690 --> 00:29:47,170 armored cars he used in Ireland. Now it's quite conflicting the. 522 00:29:47,170 --> 00:29:50,690 Reports whether these vehicles were offered up and donated by 523 00:29:50,690 --> 00:29:54,200 Guinness Company during the fighting or just commandeered. 524 00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:58,520 By British forces, but with the context of knowing that Guinness 525 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:02,520 were anti Irish rebellion and pro a British crown, you know 526 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:04,520 they certainly weren't complaining. 527 00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:08,640 On the 29th of April 1916, the Royal Dublin Fusiliers murdered 528 00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:13,600 civilians William John Rice and Algernon Lucas along with two 529 00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:15,760 off. Duty British soldiers This was 530 00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:17,240 on the grounds of the Dublin Brewery. 531 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,080 The Sergeant who had ordered this execution claimed there 532 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:23,770 were members of Sinn Fein. 2 of the men were Guinness employees. 533 00:30:24,330 --> 00:30:28,810 Guinness company director HW Rennie Phil Young said there was 534 00:30:28,810 --> 00:30:32,010 nothing in the evidence of the recent court martial to justify 535 00:30:32,170 --> 00:30:35,890 any suggestion the staff were in any way connected with or in 536 00:30:35,890 --> 00:30:39,530 sympathy with the Sinn Fein. So it's good to hear. 537 00:30:40,530 --> 00:30:41,730 Good to hear him coming out the bat. 538 00:30:41,730 --> 00:30:44,290 For for his boys. And I wonder if they were. 539 00:30:44,290 --> 00:30:48,020 Or not. Either way, In any event, the 540 00:30:48,020 --> 00:30:51,100 company took a hard line with anyone displaying any form of 541 00:30:51,100 --> 00:30:54,820 support for Irish republicanism, nationalism or Sinn Fein. 542 00:30:55,060 --> 00:30:58,300 Following the 1916 Rising. Guinness was one of a number of 543 00:30:58,300 --> 00:31:01,420 companies which dismissed staff suspected of involvement in the 544 00:31:01,420 --> 00:31:04,700 rebellion or sympathetic. To those who took part in a 545 00:31:04,700 --> 00:31:06,780 statement to the Bureau of Military History, Robert 546 00:31:06,780 --> 00:31:09,860 Hallard, a member of the Irish. Republican Brotherhood, who 547 00:31:09,860 --> 00:31:13,620 fought with the Irish Volunteers in 1916, described the dismissal 548 00:31:13,620 --> 00:31:17,140 at Guinness as a form of censor for their disloyalty to His 549 00:31:17,140 --> 00:31:20,140 Majesty. GS&W Railways have gone further 550 00:31:20,140 --> 00:31:22,780 and evicted families of men dismissed from their dwellings 551 00:31:23,300 --> 00:31:25,180 Arthur Guinness and other companies. 552 00:31:25,420 --> 00:31:28,900 Followed suit. Charles Sarin, a member. 553 00:31:28,900 --> 00:31:31,500 Of the Dublin Brigade of the Irish Volunteers was one of a 554 00:31:31,500 --> 00:31:34,740 number of Republicans marched past the Guinness brewery at the 555 00:31:34,780 --> 00:31:38,180 end of the Easter Rising, having spent the night previous under 556 00:31:38,180 --> 00:31:40,740 armed guard in the grounds of the Rotunda Hospital, he 557 00:31:40,740 --> 00:31:45,470 described the scene going past the office of Arthur Guinness 558 00:31:45,510 --> 00:31:48,550 and Co Shirtsleeved officials were leaning out of their 559 00:31:48,550 --> 00:31:52,630 windows, looking at us with superior, contemptuous smiles. 560 00:31:54,390 --> 00:31:57,990 All of this is in, I suppose, the not so distant past. 561 00:31:58,830 --> 00:32:01,870 But we have to remember a lot of people really didn't want to 562 00:32:01,870 --> 00:32:05,350 shake up the status quo jory in 1916. 563 00:32:05,670 --> 00:32:07,830 I'm not. I know scholar on it, but I know 564 00:32:07,830 --> 00:32:10,000 I heard. People would literally, you 565 00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:12,880 know, reef the the proclamations out of people's hands at the 566 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:14,240 GPO. They didn't want to hear about 567 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:15,840 it. You know, people, the public 568 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:19,480 just saw it as a big mess. So yeah, you can imagine back in 569 00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:21,000 the day, not everyone is a rebel. 570 00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:22,560 Whatever. You'd like to imagine that 571 00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:24,560 everyone's going to be up the front of the lines, but I think 572 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:27,960 the majority of people probably would have just been looking 573 00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:31,360 after their own. What's a little bit more 574 00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:37,780 uncomfortable for me is in the stories from the 1980s. 575 00:32:38,300 --> 00:32:39,580 Now that's. Very recently. 576 00:32:39,700 --> 00:32:43,780 That's very recent, As recent as the 1980s. 577 00:32:43,780 --> 00:32:46,860 The Guinness Corporation was willing to cast off and thinking 578 00:32:46,860 --> 00:32:49,860 about casting off long associations with Ireland. 579 00:32:50,460 --> 00:32:54,340 Edward Guinness, A descendant of the Guinness family directly and 580 00:32:54,340 --> 00:32:58,140 a pure guru for the company at this time, said that he was no 581 00:32:58,140 --> 00:33:02,300 longer sure the association with Ireland was helpful due to the 582 00:33:02,300 --> 00:33:05,260 conflict that was occurring in the north of Ireland and the 583 00:33:05,260 --> 00:33:08,020 refusal of the Irish. Government to back the British 584 00:33:08,180 --> 00:33:13,740 during the Falklands War, Edward Guinness said the brewery may 585 00:33:13,740 --> 00:33:17,740 have to emphasize facts, such as that Guinness was an English 586 00:33:17,740 --> 00:33:21,180 company. Now I don't know that you. 587 00:33:21,340 --> 00:33:24,060 I think you couldn't pay Guinness enough money. 588 00:33:25,140 --> 00:33:27,700 I don't think they take. They simply wouldn't call 589 00:33:27,700 --> 00:33:29,420 themselves an English company today. 590 00:33:29,980 --> 00:33:34,440 That being said, as much as. We're aware of all the good that 591 00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:36,560 Guinness has done for Ireland and for Dublin. 592 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:40,560 Maybe it's not emphasized how much Ireland has done for 593 00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:45,480 Guinness because in the current in 2023, as I've said, I think 594 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:50,480 the cultural stake of associated in oneself, with the harp and 595 00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:54,200 with Irishness and with Ireland. And you know, I don't think 596 00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:56,920 Guinness ever comes out and suggests it was some sort of 597 00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:00,080 rebel at any point or republican outfit. 598 00:34:00,370 --> 00:34:04,930 It certainly avoids at least the topic of its past. 599 00:34:05,170 --> 00:34:07,770 Arthur's Day for instance, that was held in Dublin. 600 00:34:07,770 --> 00:34:10,330 It's not longer done as a festival anymore. 601 00:34:10,449 --> 00:34:14,889 It always was a kin and sold as like a second Paddy's Day, and I 602 00:34:14,889 --> 00:34:16,850 think it's just good to. Be aware of this stuff when we 603 00:34:16,850 --> 00:34:21,850 look at icons. Of our time once again, there's 604 00:34:21,850 --> 00:34:26,610 no denying how much that Guinness has done for Ireland 605 00:34:26,610 --> 00:34:27,770 and. Particularly Dublin. 606 00:34:28,830 --> 00:34:31,790 And they have continued to do so and I'm glad that they will 607 00:34:31,790 --> 00:34:34,830 continue. To do so, but on the same note, 608 00:34:34,909 --> 00:34:39,190 I think what Ireland has done for Guinness, particularly in 609 00:34:39,190 --> 00:34:42,190 light of its past and family past and, as I said, as recent 610 00:34:42,190 --> 00:34:46,590 as the 1980s considered. Reversing that, he's saying 611 00:34:46,590 --> 00:34:50,870 let's remind people here we're at English company it ain't so 612 00:34:50,870 --> 00:35:00,720 hot. I don't like it, but I will 613 00:35:00,720 --> 00:35:04,160 politely step off my soapbox now and my Guinness keg. 614 00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:09,320 And as a little tonic to my poo pooing as some rusty nails to 615 00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:13,960 your water as the boiled sheep's manure to your measles, I will 616 00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:16,520 reach you. A tonic of a story from. 617 00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:20,200 The Duke as archives. Once Upon a time, a mouse fell 618 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:21,440 into. A barrel of Porter. 619 00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:24,720 The cat put his paw down and tucked the mouse up. 620 00:35:25,950 --> 00:35:29,750 He was just going to eat him when the mouse said if you let 621 00:35:29,750 --> 00:35:31,990 me go now, I'll come back when I'm dry. 622 00:35:33,590 --> 00:35:37,070 All right, said the cat. You can come to me tomorrow. 623 00:35:38,150 --> 00:35:41,950 Weird deal. Then the mouse went into his 624 00:35:41,950 --> 00:35:44,310 hole. Next day, the cat was at the 625 00:35:44,310 --> 00:35:46,150 hole. The mouse was coming out. 626 00:35:46,230 --> 00:35:48,270 But when he saw the cat, he came no further. 627 00:35:49,150 --> 00:35:51,510 The cat said. Are you coming No further. 628 00:35:52,710 --> 00:35:57,350 No, said the mouse. And I thought you told me that 629 00:35:57,350 --> 00:36:01,550 when you would be dry, you would let me eat you, said the cat. 630 00:36:02,910 --> 00:36:07,670 I did set the mouse. But sure, there's no mind in a 631 00:36:07,670 --> 00:36:13,350 man when he's in his liquor, and that is that. 632 00:36:14,590 --> 00:36:17,910 Thank you so much for listening. To the Pitch Rocks podcast, and 633 00:36:17,910 --> 00:36:22,230 not the most folkloric one. This time around, me and Aaron 634 00:36:22,230 --> 00:36:24,630 will be back. I say this at the end of every 635 00:36:24,630 --> 00:36:29,890 episode, completely teasing you, but we have plans for an episode 636 00:36:29,930 --> 00:36:32,650 cooking up. So don't wait up, Don't wait up, 637 00:36:32,650 --> 00:36:36,930 baby doll. The absolute, the. 638 00:36:37,370 --> 00:36:40,170 Absolute gall of us to even pretend that there's. 639 00:36:40,610 --> 00:36:43,570 There's a schedule as to this show, but thanks to all the new 640 00:36:43,570 --> 00:36:46,210 listeners. One thing I mentioned, if you 641 00:36:46,210 --> 00:36:49,490 made it this far, do leave a rating on Apple Music. 642 00:36:50,010 --> 00:36:52,650 Wherever you get this, it really does help. 643 00:36:53,630 --> 00:36:56,910 If you subscribe or follow or whatever it is to see when new 644 00:36:56,910 --> 00:36:59,750 episodes come up, as long as it doesn't, you bother yourself. 645 00:36:59,750 --> 00:37:03,230 It actually just helps our stats and stuff a lot better. 646 00:37:03,390 --> 00:37:05,470 Me and Aaron don't really pay attention to any of those 647 00:37:05,470 --> 00:37:08,070 things. It's it's a labor of love this 648 00:37:08,070 --> 00:37:10,950 podcast anyway and I enjoy the research and the work that goes 649 00:37:10,950 --> 00:37:11,990 into it. But. 650 00:37:12,910 --> 00:37:17,110 We probably should get a bit more on top of our our marketing 651 00:37:17,630 --> 00:37:21,730 and such and so I need a little bit of help pointing, pointing 652 00:37:21,730 --> 00:37:27,010 us, pointing us towards faces and ears and and all all manner 653 00:37:27,010 --> 00:37:29,170 of our. Offices that you think would be 654 00:37:29,210 --> 00:37:32,770 interested in enlisted to the podcast, please. 655 00:37:33,290 --> 00:37:38,170 Feel free. But I am now off to have a nice 656 00:37:38,170 --> 00:37:41,930 cold beverage, a suck of Guinness, and I hope that the 657 00:37:41,930 --> 00:37:45,130 drink isn't mad at me for for calling us a W Bridge, 658 00:37:45,130 --> 00:37:47,250 essentially, but but Guinness. I love you. 659 00:37:47,250 --> 00:37:49,640 You're you're. You're a good boy. 660 00:37:49,680 --> 00:37:52,840 You were just misunderstood. And you know, I, I love the 661 00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:55,840 park. I love love walking around and 662 00:37:57,520 --> 00:38:00,800 there's a Heron in there. It's pretty cool, but. 663 00:38:12,630 --> 00:38:15,870 And I wouldn't be found a drinking, but when I go at it, I 664 00:38:15,870 --> 00:38:21,350 do go at it awful and very had. I do have 40-5 pints in about 665 00:38:21,350 --> 00:38:24,410 two hours. I'd have a packet of Crips Thin 666 00:38:24,410 --> 00:38:28,250 and maybe an old packet of peanuts, and I'd go for 667 00:38:28,250 --> 00:38:32,490 probably, and I'd have 10 more on there and then I'd get up the 668 00:38:32,490 --> 00:38:36,170 final morning and morning, have the fry on and I'd go ahead 669 00:38:36,170 --> 00:38:38,570 again and there'd be no fucking stuff for me. 670 00:38:38,570 --> 00:38:40,290 I'd take the short of any man's back. 671 00:38:40,930 --> 00:38:41,530 Bastards.