1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,120 It's called Throne Science and it's woop for your. 2 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:05,920 Throne Oh, like a. Toilet, a toilet gadget. 3 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:07,280 Yes. And you know you have situations 4 00:00:07,280 --> 00:00:10,680 in California too with Eric Swalwell, like like really like 5 00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:14,360 just don't cheat on your spouses like don't do it with people 6 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:16,760 that work for you. Like how is that hard? 7 00:00:16,760 --> 00:00:19,680 Have you been sort of quietly doing climate investing at all 8 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:22,800 in this period where it's sort of out of favour in the 9 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:25,640 headlines? Yeah, so, Eric, it's no longer 10 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:27,400 called climate tech, it's called energy. 11 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:29,960 Tech. Or it's called like the RE 12 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:32,240 industrialization. Of America. 13 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:38,320 War against climate change. Does this feellikethe.com boom? 14 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:43,000 Different. Katie Jacobs Stanton and I were 15 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:46,640 one of the few voices in the tech industry when ICE was 16 00:00:46,640 --> 00:00:49,520 brutalizing Minnesota. To stand up and say that 17 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:51,520 something had gone terribly wrong. 18 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:53,360 Makes sense. She'd worked in the Obama White 19 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:56,520 House, and like me, we've been deeply troubled by everything 20 00:00:56,520 --> 00:00:58,080 happening in the Trump administration. 21 00:00:58,080 --> 00:01:01,080 She's a former Twitter executive, so we dug into what 22 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:04,519 Elon Musk has done into Twitter. She's worked at Google, Yahoo 23 00:01:04,519 --> 00:01:06,520 Color and the US State Department. 24 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,960 She was once the person trying to get the government using 25 00:01:09,960 --> 00:01:12,720 Twitter. Now I guess she has some regrets 26 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:15,320 of how it's panned out. She's a lone VC who says she 27 00:01:15,320 --> 00:01:18,640 still tracks diversity numbers and and wants to think about 28 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:20,960 recruiting underrepresented founders. 29 00:01:20,960 --> 00:01:23,320 This is the Newcomer podcast. I'm Eric Newcomer. 30 00:01:23,320 --> 00:01:26,560 Please follow along at our substacknewcomer.co and enjoy my 31 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:28,400 conversation with Katie Jacobson. 32 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:37,560 Twitter is very different, but also still very much the same. 33 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:41,720 Like Twitter is still the place for breaking news, it is still 34 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,120 the the place for public discourse. 35 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:48,400 It is still the place where authenticity and distribution 36 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:51,680 matter. It's a very different place in 37 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:55,560 that different voices are louder and more powerful. 38 00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:58,880 Captured looms large. Yeah, like, you know, doge 39 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:03,320 anything and like, and so like a lot of memes and the product is, 40 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:07,480 you know, so more well, fine-tuned to different things 41 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:10,840 to kind of amp you up. And I can feel it like I'm not 42 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:12,680 following that account. Like where'd that account come 43 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:14,880 from? And like, why is this, you know, 44 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:17,360 post making me mad? And so it's a very a different 45 00:02:17,360 --> 00:02:20,080 kind of a product. A lot of people that I used to 46 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:23,320 follow are no longer there. They're on different platforms. 47 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:25,000 But I can't live without Twitter. 48 00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:27,480 Do you use? Blue sky and threads too. 49 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:30,160 Or are you loyal to Twitter? I'm pretty loyal to. 50 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:32,080 Twitter or you have I. Call Twitter some other call 51 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:35,240 decks when I'm mad at it. I think Nikita, who you know, 52 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:37,400 runs product. Who's amazing by the way, Like 53 00:02:37,480 --> 00:02:41,280 big fan. He he refer, he used tweet as a 54 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,440 verb like in the last month or so. 55 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:48,080 So clearly even people deep in X world can't help but it was such 56 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:50,240 a good name. Like I I'm shocked that they 57 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:52,680 abandon it. I mean, you were dealing with 58 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:55,320 the media specifically, like using Twitter, right? 59 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:59,040 I mean, I think there was this recent blow up about, you know, 60 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:01,880 like the New York Times not being sort of, you know, a top, 61 00:03:01,880 --> 00:03:06,720 I don't know, creator account on Twitter despite sort of having a 62 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:09,120 lot of followers. What do what do you make of 63 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:10,320 that? I guess, like the Nikita 64 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:12,720 argument was like they're just doing, they're just like putting 65 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:16,240 out news headlines and expecting that to go off, which I guess is 66 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:19,400 out of touch with Twitter, But that's also sort of what they 67 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:20,680 do. I mean, they I think the 68 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:23,960 particular fight was that they had this big story on Iran. 69 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:27,840 It was like exclusive. It was clearly like relevant and 70 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:29,760 the story wasn't like doing well on Twitter. 71 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:32,320 So yeah, I guess I would push back on this idea that it's a 72 00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:34,640 great vehicle for news right now. 73 00:03:34,640 --> 00:03:37,880 It's a great vehicle for like angst about things happening in 74 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:38,800 the world. But is it? 75 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:42,760 Is it still good for news? I think both of those things are 76 00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:46,120 still true. I still think that the algorithm 77 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:50,800 has changed quite a bit and has pushed down a lot of, you know, 78 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:54,320 older, more left-leaning institutions and has pushed up 79 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:56,280 more right. I definitely believe that is 80 00:03:56,320 --> 00:03:58,280 true. I also believe it's probably 81 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:00,880 true that the New York Times may not be using it to the best of 82 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:03,000 its ability. So I think, you know, it's it's 83 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:05,960 complicated, dedicated. And I also think we have a 84 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:09,640 general trend of power going from institutions to individuals 85 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:13,160 like you're probably super successful on Twitter or X or 86 00:04:13,160 --> 00:04:15,360 any of these programs because like you do need. 87 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:19,200 Substax, so it's a, you know, and, and turning down links like 88 00:04:19,200 --> 00:04:21,880 I think I have a strong Twitter presence, but it's always one of 89 00:04:22,280 --> 00:04:26,080 great anxiety because when I launched, even though I think 90 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:28,920 when I launched what I probably have like almost 50,000 91 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:32,600 followers now, maybe when I launched I had 20,000 ish. 92 00:04:32,600 --> 00:04:35,880 But it was enough that like you could be like I'm announcing the 93 00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:38,960 sub stack and people would retweet it and it was like 94 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:41,400 willing to send people elsewhere. 95 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:44,920 But now it doesn't feel like Twitter's as eager to, like, let 96 00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:47,920 you use your fame on Twitter to do other things. 97 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:51,360 Yeah, I I feel that too. And but I can't live without it. 98 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:53,200 I mean, it's a love hate relationship, right? 99 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:56,840 And I mean, Twitter's like this cockroach of a product, like it 100 00:04:56,840 --> 00:05:01,240 just can't be defeated, like it is who it is in spite of itself. 101 00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:03,840 No matter who the leader is, right, it's still going to 102 00:05:03,840 --> 00:05:06,880 exist. I mean, Threads, it's fine, it's 103 00:05:06,880 --> 00:05:08,760 good. But I also don't want to go to a 104 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:12,440 place that this feels very right on Twitter, Threads feels very 105 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:14,880 left and blue sky, who knows? And. 106 00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:16,120 Like, well, I can't. Yeah. 107 00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:19,920 I feel like both blue Sky and Threads, my mom is like, you 108 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:22,720 know, is a little bit to the left of me or she'd probably 109 00:05:22,720 --> 00:05:25,520 further to the left of me. She's on blue sky a lot. 110 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:28,440 I feel like I'm always telling her if I spent a lot of time on 111 00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:31,800 blue sky, it'd probably make me more conservative because you 112 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:34,920 sort of you, you know, I don't know if you're an independent 113 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:38,200 minded thinker, you want to react, you know, to the dumb 114 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:40,080 things you read. And so you see a lot of dumb 115 00:05:40,080 --> 00:05:42,600 conservative things. I think it makes me like, all 116 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:45,160 right, I'm definitely, you know, not not with those people. 117 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:47,920 But if I was on Blue sky, I don't know, watching sort of, I 118 00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:50,720 don't know, random cancellation circles now it'd probably, you 119 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:52,400 know, shift me slightly to the right. 120 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:57,240 So there can be weird dynamics with having a sort of one sort 121 00:05:57,240 --> 00:05:59,480 of political ideology in charge of a platform. 122 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:00,720 Exactly. It's not healthy. 123 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:03,560 And so maybe we just be off all of that, right? 124 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:06,160 Maybe should talk to each other. Do you delete Twitter from your? 125 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:08,760 I feel like I occasionally try and delete it and then I'm like, 126 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:10,440 but I wanna know or I go on vacation. 127 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:13,840 I'm like, I'm away from the policy is like, I'm gonna use it 128 00:06:13,840 --> 00:06:16,800 only on my computer, but then, you know, I'm away from my 129 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:19,520 computer and I need it back. Yeah, I haven't deleted Twitter 130 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:22,520 from my phone, but I've deleted others from my phone and I've 131 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:25,400 actually moved Twitter from the first page of my phone to like, 132 00:06:25,400 --> 00:06:27,160 I have to really dig for it or search for it. 133 00:06:27,160 --> 00:06:29,640 So. And I think it just becomes a 134 00:06:29,640 --> 00:06:31,480 habit, right? Like when you joy, you get that 135 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:34,160 dopamine hit and you're getting a lot of engagement, like you're 136 00:06:34,280 --> 00:06:36,560 inspired to do it again. And if you tweet something, 137 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:38,800 nobody sends anything back. And like, I feel like a loser. 138 00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:40,080 Maybe we'll just take a break from it. 139 00:06:40,080 --> 00:06:43,160 So like I think sort of the reinforcement mechanisms of it 140 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:44,880 just influence your behavior quite a bit. 141 00:06:45,440 --> 00:06:48,000 So for better, for worse. Right, Yeah, it's built to be 142 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:52,480 yeah, somewhat addictive. You know, you're investing in 143 00:06:52,480 --> 00:06:54,800 the earliest of early stage companies. 144 00:06:54,800 --> 00:06:57,080 To what extent are you searching for the next Twitter or like, 145 00:06:57,080 --> 00:07:00,200 are you are you looking for a lot of social companies these 146 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:01,240 days? Do you think there's much 147 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:04,120 opportunity? What are you seeing on sort of 148 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:08,040 the yeah, I'm sure everything is AI inflected, but are you 149 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:11,800 getting any interesting? Like we'll be the next online 150 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:14,040 sort of discussion platform type pitches. 151 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:16,040 Yeah, to be honest, I have 0 interest. 152 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:18,160 You're like run away. It's right. 153 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:20,640 Don't. Build it patterns like, I don't 154 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:23,640 know, like obviously I feel like we're due for something new. 155 00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:26,160 Like these things come in waves and there's going to be a 156 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:29,160 different way. But I also think we have 157 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:32,600 oversteered things. You know, we have kids who have 158 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:37,520 your screen addictions and a lot of anxiety and they're anxious 159 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:40,320 and the entire anxious generation, like having another 160 00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:43,240 social network I can't imagine is gonna make the next 161 00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:46,160 generation better. So I think we almost need to 162 00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:48,680 take a step back. Like how do you were talking 163 00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:50,240 earlier about how do we go outside? 164 00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:51,760 You know, how do we enjoy spring? 165 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:53,880 How do we enjoy seasons? How do we enjoy each other? 166 00:07:54,080 --> 00:07:55,400 How can we have more humidity? Where's? 167 00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:59,160 The tech money to be made on that, you know, it's a sincere 168 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:01,640 question, right? How do you, you know, your job 169 00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:04,120 is to sort of make money. You either, I guess you invest 170 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:07,600 in other categories, but is there an opportunity to, yeah, 171 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:11,960 find profit and steering people away from being on their phones 172 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:14,080 too often? Maybe, I mean, I met a founder 173 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:16,280 recently who's actually trying to invest in that. 174 00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:19,600 Like what are better therapies to help kids with anxiety, 175 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:21,040 getting them off of their phones? 176 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:23,720 I think that's really noble and very worthy. 177 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:26,760 You know, there are some startups helping you find 178 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:30,120 camping grounds and you know, how do you enjoy the outside 179 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:32,720 more than there's a question of being venture backable? 180 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:35,080 Is this a really good business versus like, you know, it's just 181 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:37,880 the next entropic? Probably not, but there's still 182 00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:39,960 a lot of ways to make money and do good in the world. 183 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:42,960 Whereas poor business people, you're like, you're at work 184 00:08:42,960 --> 00:08:45,560 already, you're going to be using the Internet, we'll fund 185 00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:47,800 Internet. Are you mostly investing in 186 00:08:47,800 --> 00:08:50,720 enterprise companies right now? Mostly, yeah, there's some that 187 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:54,440 are, most of them are you know B to B in some capacity, but there 188 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:58,720 are few that are B to C We invest at Moxie and mostly early 189 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:01,720 stage companies AI for blah, blah, blah. 190 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:03,800 You know the vertical applications of AI, everything 191 00:09:03,800 --> 00:09:06,640 is AI right now, right? If you replace AI with software, 192 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:10,240 that's basically what it is. And, and at least we are 193 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:13,800 generally investors. For me personally, I love AI and 194 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:16,200 healthcare. There's so much opportunity, 195 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:20,320 there's so many challenges. And actually the one, the one 196 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:24,160 that I will share with you that is a direct to consumer product 197 00:09:24,160 --> 00:09:25,480 and you're not going to see this coming. 198 00:09:25,480 --> 00:09:28,400 So bear with me. It's called Throne Science and 199 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:30,080 it's woop for your. Throne. 200 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:32,000 Throne. Oh, like a toilet. 201 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:34,800 A toilet. Gadget yeah, so looking down, 202 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:39,320 obviously, but you know, now we have this this sort of tailwind 203 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:41,440 of the personalization of how thick air, right? 204 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:44,880 Like you have your oar rings, your whoops function, health, 205 00:09:44,880 --> 00:09:48,440 all these different ways that people are starting to change 206 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:51,320 their behavior based off of data, right? 207 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:53,760 Like, you know, I stopped drinking like I'd have a glass 208 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:55,360 of wine and I like, this is all fine. 209 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:57,480 And then my oar rings were like, don't do that. 210 00:09:57,480 --> 00:09:59,480 Like that's bad. It's gonna affect your sleep. 211 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:03,120 And so I've made like my own personal changes and we invested 212 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:05,440 in this company called Throne. And when our team first saw it, 213 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:08,080 we're like, we'll never do this. What's the Tam of this? 214 00:10:08,200 --> 00:10:10,600 All right, what's the, I mean huge Tam because you know every. 215 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:12,880 Everybody poops, as many children's books will take. 216 00:10:13,680 --> 00:10:16,280 Yeah, and but, you know, are people comfortable with this? 217 00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:18,120 And it's hardware. Hardware is hard. 218 00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:19,440 You're selling direct to consumer. 219 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:22,840 That's hard. So we initially said, no, we 220 00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:26,400 never met this founder, Scott Hickel, who is so brilliant, so 221 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:28,960 smart and so weird. Like you've got to be weird to 222 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:31,080 like build your business, you know, a shit business. 223 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:34,640 And like, and, and then also I'm like, he sold me. 224 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:36,200 Like, this is kind of the future, right? 225 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:40,520 Like here is data you literally flush away every day. 226 00:10:40,680 --> 00:10:43,240 What does it tell you? So it tells you things like 227 00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:45,280 hydration, how's your gut health? 228 00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:47,960 It can also detect blood. And that's actually the most 229 00:10:47,960 --> 00:10:50,480 important thing, especially with younger Americans. 230 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:54,000 The only cancer that's actually growing is, is colon cancer. 231 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:57,320 And you know, statistically, we, you know, live in this 232 00:10:57,320 --> 00:11:00,200 healthcare world, which says like, OK, you turn 40, you 233 00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:01,640 should have your first colonoscopy. 234 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:04,200 Well, what if you had blood in there and you didn't see it and 235 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,080 you didn't know about it? You wait till 30. 236 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:09,640 Like how can you do earlier and faster detection? 237 00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:12,440 So that's one of the things that you can test for are. 238 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:15,160 People paying for the device, yeah, or not. 239 00:11:15,160 --> 00:11:17,960 Not health insurance or. Not health insurance yet and so 240 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:20,280 you know the next steps are how do you get it to be HSA 241 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:23,120 reimbursable, maybe get your insurance company pay for it. 242 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,800 So these guys are so well. Hypochondriac first. 243 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:28,000 It's perfect. It's. 244 00:11:29,120 --> 00:11:32,320 The most anxious, like whoever's really worried every signal 245 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:35,080 you'll, you know, two St. Yeah, exactly. 246 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:36,960 Totally, but. What's it called again? 247 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:38,160 Sir, a throne. Throne. 248 00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:39,280 We'll send you one. Do you want one? 249 00:11:39,680 --> 00:11:41,720 Maybe. What stage business is it? 250 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:44,720 Seat, seat, Yeah, so. How big is it? 251 00:11:44,720 --> 00:11:46,840 It's like a little camera, just. Yeah, it's a little camera. 252 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:49,120 It's like this big and obviously points down. 253 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:51,240 My husband was like, you're not putting out of the house. 254 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:54,000 I like don't worry. And you know, it goes down and 255 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:57,400 not up and and you know, when you go in, it's different for 256 00:11:57,400 --> 00:11:59,480 everybody. So it'll just I'll know what you 257 00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:01,120 versus your wife. Versus your kid. 258 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:02,760 Tell it can tell. Yeah, Bluetooth, because 259 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:04,920 everyone brings their phone. Oh, I see it. 260 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:05,600 It's. Kind of weird. 261 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:08,880 Yeah, fascinating. How long ago did you invest in? 262 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:13,320 That a little bit less than a year ago and and one of the Co 263 00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:17,520 founders of woop is also a Co founder of throne, which is 264 00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:20,160 great because he has built this before. 265 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:22,880 You know, he understands hardware, he understands 266 00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:26,880 consumers, He has his own health issue that has made this his 267 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:29,320 life's mission, which is always so important when you find 268 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:31,680 founders. So that's the only company we've 269 00:12:31,680 --> 00:12:34,280 done that's in healthcare and direct to consumer, again, 270 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:36,640 because it's really, really hard, but I think these guys 271 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:38,400 have a great job. What's your favorite non direct 272 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:40,080 to consumer health investment right now? 273 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:42,120 Well, it's like my. Children I don't have. 274 00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:44,400 Not your favorite, but one that's fun to talk about. 275 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:47,160 I'd say like one that was recently in the news called 276 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:51,400 Luminae, which is workflows for healthcare systems. 277 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:53,760 They just announced A partnership with the Cleveland 278 00:12:53,760 --> 00:12:56,840 Clinic. Something like 25 to 30% of all 279 00:12:56,840 --> 00:13:00,880 healthcare system budgets go towards administrivia and you 280 00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:04,880 know, claims, prior auth, referrals, pain doctors, all 281 00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:07,560 these things. Awesome for AI, awesome for 282 00:13:07,560 --> 00:13:09,840 agents. And healthcare systems 283 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:11,640 understandably are very conservative, right? 284 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:14,200 They don't want to like let into any of these agents without like 285 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:16,840 control. And this team is really 286 00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:18,720 incredible. The founder grew up in southern 287 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:22,640 India coconut farming family gets a Rubik's Cube at the age 288 00:13:22,640 --> 00:13:25,760 of 12 years old, becomes India's national champion. 289 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:29,480 The sets a Guinness Book of World Records for Rubik's Cube 290 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:32,800 like becomes this American dream story comes to Silicon Valley. 291 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:34,640 And he's just great at solving problems, right. 292 00:13:34,640 --> 00:13:36,720 And so this became, you know, his mission. 293 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:39,080 He was very interested talking to a lot of these customers. 294 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:40,640 And so he they're just on their way. 295 00:13:40,640 --> 00:13:43,760 So it's really interesting to see, you know, both this founder 296 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:48,560 grow and solve puzzle and great institutions like the Cleveland 297 00:13:48,560 --> 00:13:51,880 Clinic that are like, we want to be on the forefront of, you 298 00:13:51,880 --> 00:13:55,560 know, if we can improve workflows, we can improve health 299 00:13:55,560 --> 00:13:57,760 outcomes. And so that's a direct 300 00:13:57,760 --> 00:13:59,440 correlation. So they're working with a lot of 301 00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:01,240 these healthcare systems, which is great. 302 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:05,560 And then one other favorite founder is Pharaoh's health, 303 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:08,160 which is doing they're really early. 304 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:10,720 This is maybe the most like charming founder you've ever 305 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:12,240 met. And having a British accent 306 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:17,000 helps, but they had worked with hospitals in the UK and the NHS 307 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:21,840 to use AI, machine learning, to look at patient safety data. 308 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:25,520 So meaning that if you go in the hospital to deliver a baby, you 309 00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:28,000 don't leave with sepsis. And there are a lot of things 310 00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:30,440 that you know, happen unfortunately, at hospitals. 311 00:14:30,440 --> 00:14:33,800 And so another great thing for healthcare systems to automate 312 00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:37,000 and not have nurses for let nurses work with patients and 313 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:41,280 let AI work with paperwork. And so, so this team, you know, 314 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:44,120 again, very, very early, they just signed their first contract 315 00:14:44,120 --> 00:14:46,800 with a major healthcare system. So it's really exciting to see 316 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:51,000 in the next 5 years, Healthcare is going to dramatically change. 317 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:53,720 And so seeing like, what is that tech stack going to look like? 318 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:54,880 It's not just going to be epic, right? 319 00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:56,640 They're going to be all these other systems. 320 00:14:56,800 --> 00:15:00,920 I was watching a TikTok earlier this week and there was an 321 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:03,760 influencer, John Green, talking about his brother Hank Green. 322 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:07,280 Is that a lot of like, the good news happened slowly, right? 323 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:10,600 Like it's like, you know, you make these like incremental 324 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:14,320 improvements to human health and like over time, we're 325 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:18,120 drastically reducing the number of infants that die and people 326 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:21,440 that die and improving life expectancy around the world. 327 00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:25,200 That happens very slowly. And the moment in time headline 328 00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:29,000 is like, Oh my God, a school shooting or something terrible. 329 00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:32,640 And that dichotomy just has a really I don't know how did you 330 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:36,520 yeah, I mean, you live that sum again from like being in Twitter 331 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:39,360 world and then also, you know, working in government, you know, 332 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:41,560 you're helping what the the White House figure out how to 333 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:43,640 use social media. You're. 334 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:45,960 Sorry about that. Yeah. 335 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:48,680 You grew up in a kind of worms. Does it seem innocent? 336 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:51,960 Yeah. I mean, I don't know. 337 00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:56,440 The media is often blamed for for this phenomenon. 338 00:15:56,440 --> 00:15:59,760 I guess I'm sort of articulating in a way that it's like human 339 00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:01,680 nature and sort of the way things happen. 340 00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:05,680 When you were in government and working on the tech side, did 341 00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:10,360 you see answers to this of ways to make sort of positive moments 342 00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:12,880 resonate? Or do humans just love like 343 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:16,120 negative moments? Yeah, I mean, you know, from 344 00:16:16,120 --> 00:16:18,240 media, like, if it bleeds, it leads, right? 345 00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:21,440 And unfortunately, people get drawn to this rubber necking of 346 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,240 terrible things that happen, but we have to change that. 347 00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:27,240 Like, I mean, a part of it is human nature, but part of it 348 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:30,120 does need some intentionality. Like, how do we shine a bright 349 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:32,640 light on the things that make us great? 350 00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:36,080 I mean, I think we saw that in the past week with Artemis 2. 351 00:16:36,440 --> 00:16:40,400 What a moment, right? Everybody, nobody talk like it's 352 00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:43,040 right, it's left, it's north or South or whatever. 353 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:46,560 Like that was a great time for all of us to come together and 354 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:51,320 see like look what happens when we apply our imagination, our 355 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:56,400 ingenuity, like our resources to learn and to explore and to 356 00:16:56,400 --> 00:17:00,880 celebrate the win of these four amazing astronauts and see their 357 00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:03,880 camaraderie and how the way how they talk to each other, how 358 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:06,960 they talk to us. Like we need more Artemis 359 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:11,240 celebrations of what we can do when we just focus on the prize 360 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:13,599 and the things again that can advance our society and. 361 00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:16,160 Is that a matter of political leadership and you have to 362 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:19,200 create, I guess, in the real world, these actual moments that 363 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:22,160 people get excited about? Or is there a level of, I don't 364 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:25,160 know, social media savvy that can that can do it? 365 00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:27,400 Yeah, it's, I think it's everyone's responsibility, 366 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:30,520 right? Like, I think we, we expect too 367 00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:33,880 much from our politicians. I think, you know, I get how 368 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:36,800 people have given up. It's really sad, you know, that 369 00:17:36,800 --> 00:17:39,200 we don't make it easy for good people to run. 370 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:42,880 And as a result, we don't have a lot of great leaders. 371 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,120 We do have some, which is great. We need to empower them. 372 00:17:45,120 --> 00:17:47,600 But I think it's everybody's responsibility. 373 00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:49,160 It's each of us. It's A tag and. 374 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:51,000 I agree with that. You're not saying directly, but 375 00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:53,560 nobody wants to blame the electorate or like sometimes it 376 00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:57,800 is like the news consumer and the voter has some culpability 377 00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:00,840 and it's not always productive to like point it back. 378 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:04,400 And but yeah, sometimes it's like people, you know, people 379 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:07,360 get the politicians that they they vote for on some level and 380 00:18:07,360 --> 00:18:10,680 get the media that they decide to consume. 381 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:14,880 Obviously platforms you know can can be regulated and changed, 382 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:16,120 but. Totally. 383 00:18:16,120 --> 00:18:19,040 I mean, also, like, you know, it's easy to complain and, and, 384 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:22,640 and inflamed the rhetoric, but how many people who are 385 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:25,640 complaining actually ever served in office, have ever 386 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:28,520 volunteered, have served the military, have served their 387 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:31,200 government, right. Like unless you do it, it's 388 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:33,800 really like we we all have to step up. 389 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:35,560 We all have to shine a brighter light. 390 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:38,680 And it's sometimes it's harder to come up with the ideas to 391 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:42,840 like fix the world than I think people sometimes think 392 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:44,720 complaining online because sometimes I'm just like, oh, 393 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:48,320 what is what is the idea that you that somebody wants? 394 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:50,600 I don't know, it can be a little abstract. 395 00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:53,640 One thing, you know, we both you, you know, spend time in the 396 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:56,040 Obama administration. I think both, you know, 397 00:18:56,080 --> 00:19:01,640 democratically aligned. This week, Axios reported that 398 00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:06,800 the DNC was telling its staffers not to use like, Chachi, BT and 399 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:08,160 Claude. I don't know if you saw this. 400 00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:11,840 They said they can use Gemini. I don't quite get the balance. 401 00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:15,400 But do you worry that there's this like, I mean, America 402 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,240 overall is very concerned about AI. 403 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:21,880 But then, yeah, I don't know where you see the Democratic 404 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:24,960 Party going with AI. Do you have a general sense of 405 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:29,240 like, you know how how you think this technology is being 406 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:32,040 received outside of Silicon Valley? 407 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:35,120 I mean, I think the Democratic Party has bigger things to worry 408 00:19:35,120 --> 00:19:38,440 about than AI, honestly. Like, what is the message? 409 00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:41,480 Like, what do you stand for? Like, who's next? 410 00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:45,400 Like, how do we talk normally to the American people and not at 411 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:47,720 the American people? So I think the Democratic Party 412 00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:50,800 has a lot more, you know, bigger things to, to really work. 413 00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:55,120 On but in some ways populism is very of the moment and like 414 00:19:55,120 --> 00:20:00,440 being anti AI, anti business, like anti tech is a path into 415 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:02,760 the into populism. I mean, it's not it's not what I 416 00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:05,480 want, but if I were just to like to read the tea leaves and be 417 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:09,440 like, oh, what's gonna make for a sort of compelling campaign? 418 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:12,880 Also, if you wanted to attract some of the MAGA people, it's 419 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:15,200 somewhat bipartisan to hate the tech industry. 420 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:17,160 I don't know. Do you, do you see sort of a 421 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:21,120 populist wave? Coming for AI, we're already 422 00:20:21,120 --> 00:20:23,040 seen sort of the data center resistance. 423 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:24,320 Exactly, I was going to mention that. 424 00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:27,440 So I think you're, I forgot the stats, but there was a survey of 425 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:30,880 how younger people feel about AI to some like 30 to 40%, like 426 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:32,640 hate it. Like that's huge. 427 00:20:33,240 --> 00:20:35,880 That's a big, big number. And even, you know, I have kids 428 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:39,120 who are, you know, in their early 20s and like they're also 429 00:20:39,120 --> 00:20:41,880 even having a mom who like, you know, raised them in Silicon 430 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:43,560 Valley. They're like, I don't know, like 431 00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:44,920 a little bit nervous and cautious. 432 00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:47,200 And I think it's really interesting you see this in 433 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:51,000 Indiana where there's a local council and someone shot, you 434 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:54,680 know, at his house and left a note that said no data centers. 435 00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:58,280 People are mad. And I think we need to listen to 436 00:20:58,280 --> 00:20:59,920 that. And people are nervous. 437 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:01,640 They're worried about their jobs. 438 00:21:01,640 --> 00:21:05,000 They're worried, I mean, will AI probably take away more jobs and 439 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:07,360 create them probably. And no one's having a 440 00:21:07,360 --> 00:21:10,040 conversation about that. And I think we need everyone to 441 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,840 kind of have that conversation. Like, what does that future look 442 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:15,280 like? And also immediately, like, how 443 00:21:15,280 --> 00:21:20,040 do we, we retrain the next generation, you know, to work in 444 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:23,720 the trades, how to leverage AI, how to be prepared? 445 00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:26,480 I mean, I remember taking like typewriting class at school. 446 00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:28,120 It seems like that's really aging myself. 447 00:21:28,120 --> 00:21:29,880 They're like, obviously no one needs that anymore. 448 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:31,200 Like everyone grows up in these things. 449 00:21:31,360 --> 00:21:34,600 I was clearly a few years later, but when we'd have what the 450 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:38,080 typing classes you have to do word puzzles or whatever, you 451 00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:39,680 know you're just supposed to type to get clues. 452 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:41,880 And I just remember we'd memorized all the answers. 453 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:44,760 Like we could see right any sequence of blanks I'd like. 454 00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:48,200 I know what the answer to this. I've done the same wrote work 455 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:51,600 over and over again. But yeah, I don't I don't Well, 456 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:53,800 like, you know, in New York right now, you know, there's 457 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:58,040 this fight over self driving cars and Waymo's pilot, I think 458 00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:04,280 was not renewed. I just find, yeah, the the anti 459 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,560 self driving car position to be like abhorrent. 460 00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:09,480 I mean it's. I agree, I love Waymo. 461 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:11,760 Right. I know it's amazing, but I mean, 462 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:14,760 if you're sympathetic on the jobs front, then there's this 463 00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:20,160 impulse to slow down any technology that threatens jobs 464 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:23,280 and you know, other Uber drivers and truck drivers and everything 465 00:22:23,280 --> 00:22:27,960 else that eventually face a threat from self driving cars. 466 00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:31,760 And I just think ultimately, you know, we want to be a culture 467 00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:36,520 that embraces progress. And I, I think anyone who's been 468 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:39,000 in a self driving car, I mean, especially for like the elderly 469 00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:43,120 and people with mobility issues or, you know, and people just 470 00:22:43,120 --> 00:22:45,600 care about safety and don't want drunk drivers. 471 00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:48,960 Everything Like I, I just feel like it's insane that we've, I 472 00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:51,560 think we're gonna look back and we're gonna be like, it's insane 473 00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:55,880 that for, you know, 100 plus years, we let humans like drive 474 00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,800 around in these like sort of big hunks of metal and like ram into 475 00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:02,400 each other and like ingest substances and then get on the 476 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:03,840 road. I, I don't know, it feels like 477 00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:08,600 it's going to be a weird blip, not the human way of operating. 478 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:10,480 I agree. I mean, there are these products 479 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:13,200 that are living and serving in the future, right? 480 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:16,240 Like same thing with Airbnb. I'm not going to, why would I 481 00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:18,800 ever rent somebody's house? And now it's just part of the 482 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:22,240 fabric of how we travel. Same with, you know, Uber. 483 00:23:22,360 --> 00:23:24,880 Same with Waymo. Once you're in a Waymo, you 484 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:27,200 realize it's safer, it's cleaner. 485 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:30,240 It's about the same cost for the elderly, for, you know, people 486 00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:33,040 who have, you know, sick issues, you know, and need an extra 487 00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:35,080 hand. Like Waymo is incredible. 488 00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,120 I'm only in a Waymo when I'm in San Francisco. 489 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,600 I see this with throne. You know, it's early, but like 490 00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:43,080 living in the future, at some point we'll look at the fact 491 00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:46,200 that we sort of flush away all this data and not really analyze 492 00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:49,240 it to inform how we're doing, You know, do we have a food 493 00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:51,280 allergy? Like, you know, do we have blood 494 00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:53,160 going on? Like, so these are the things 495 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,000 that, you know, this has regulation gone a little bit too 496 00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:59,000 far in New York and not really thinking about the benefits to 497 00:23:59,120 --> 00:24:02,120 all New Yorkers, just, you know, a certain category of people who 498 00:24:02,120 --> 00:24:06,440 feel threatened. What what keeps you sort of, I 499 00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:10,800 guess, excited to the extent you are about like the left and 500 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,440 liberal politics in an era where Silicon Valley is swung to the 501 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:15,560 right? Some of the things we're 502 00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:20,200 touching on, like, you know, Democrats can be more anti 503 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,920 capitalist at times, more resistant to technology, 504 00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,840 somewhat more skeptical to some of the company, you know, just 505 00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:29,200 like less inclined to be like, oh, there's there's something 506 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:30,920 there. I don't know what, what, what, 507 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,360 what do you think is sort of the positive message and what 508 00:24:33,360 --> 00:24:37,760 excites you about like what the American left has to offer right 509 00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:39,840 now? I would say I'm excited. 510 00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:44,480 I'd say I'm cautiously optimistic that that a new 511 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:49,000 generation of leaders are starting to evolve that are just 512 00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:52,880 normal and sensible and understand the political 513 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:54,080 realities of what they're dealing with. 514 00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:56,680 Like I look at Daniel Laurie, the mayor of San Francisco. 515 00:24:56,960 --> 00:24:59,440 Amazing what a turn around, right? 516 00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:01,360 Like. We we had him speak at the 517 00:25:01,360 --> 00:25:04,840 Cerebral AI Summit and yeah, he was by far the most popular 518 00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,040 speaker. I think we had all these CEO's 519 00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:10,600 and, you know, it's like a sort of a politician that's like, I 520 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,760 appreciate the hard work you're doing in industry, but we need 521 00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:15,200 to bring everybody along with us. 522 00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:17,720 It's such a winning message. Yeah. 523 00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:22,120 So like how is it that position? Like, he's just, he's in it for 524 00:25:22,120 --> 00:25:25,440 the right reasons. He's sensible, he's centrist. 525 00:25:26,120 --> 00:25:30,720 You know, he is very honest and direct about the challenges in 526 00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:34,360 front and when things go wrong, to be straightforward about it. 527 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:38,720 Americans are just so sick of being, like, spun and lied to. 528 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:42,520 And, you know, we're gaslighted like nobody's business. 529 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,320 I feel terrible for younger Americans growing up. 530 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,600 And they must think like, this is normal. 531 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:50,440 Like, this is not normal. This is bad, you know. 532 00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:53,880 What's not like growing up in sort of the Mac a year or people 533 00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:56,600 have only sort of known Trump? Yeah, They've only known Trump 534 00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:59,920 and they've only known this like, kleptocracy, frankly. 535 00:25:59,920 --> 00:26:02,880 And they've only seen like these extremes. 536 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:05,240 And they're seeing the other side just kind of give up. 537 00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:07,680 Like be like, it's too hard. I'm just going to do my own 538 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:09,040 thing. I'm not going to pay attention. 539 00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:11,360 Like, you know, we'll wait another couple of years and 540 00:26:11,360 --> 00:26:12,760 that's not healthy either, right? 541 00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:16,720 Like we should encourage debate. Like we should encourage the 542 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:20,560 transparency and openness and looking at the data to help us 543 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:23,760 inform, like what is a better outcome for everybody in this 544 00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:25,200 community? We're never going to be able to 545 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:29,080 please everybody, but at least let's be honest and direct about 546 00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:30,160 it. And, you know, you have 547 00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:33,360 situations in California, too, with Eric Swalwell, like, like, 548 00:26:33,360 --> 00:26:37,080 really, like, just don't cheat on your spouses. 549 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,240 Like, don't do it with people that work for you. 550 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,040 Like, how is that hard? You know, like, no wonder people 551 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:46,080 are just sick of politics. We had Matt, I had Matt Mahan in 552 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,200 that chair. I don't know, 3 or 4 weeks ago. 553 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:53,040 I like him. I mean, now he's maybe second, 554 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,280 third place in the primary with Swalwell out. 555 00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:00,800 It's not the most exciting message, like in an era of like 556 00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:03,560 Trump. And, you know, I think Zoram 557 00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:07,120 Amdani is doing like a pretty good job both in what he's 558 00:27:07,120 --> 00:27:11,920 delivering and messaging. And, you know, I'm a built in 559 00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:14,800 sort of mayhem supporter. It's like I like the tech 560 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:16,760 industry knows a lot of the same people. 561 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:22,560 I knew him like a decade ago. I it's not the most like flashy 562 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:26,720 message and it's just like, it's hard to win is a centrist 563 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:28,920 without some. You know, you literally have Tom 564 00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:32,720 Steyer right now. He's gonna like, I mean, I don't 565 00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:34,400 know why I'm laughing. I'm somewhat sympathetic. 566 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,920 But like, jail, you know, some of the people who worked in ICE 567 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:41,000 and use like, the power of power of California, you know, to go 568 00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:45,800 after, you know, ICE officers. So I don't know, it's hard. 569 00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:47,240 Have you? I don't know if you've donated 570 00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:48,480 to Mahan or anything. I haven't. 571 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:51,840 Do you have a view on the race or who's left? 572 00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:55,640 Not really just kind of watching it, but, you know, like, where 573 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:58,000 are the reasonable people? Like, how do we make it easier 574 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:00,920 for the reasonable people to serve more of their 575 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:04,160 constituencies? And, you know, just be honest 576 00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:06,680 and straightforward and honorable. 577 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,720 And yeah, I haven't. I mean, the challenge is, I 578 00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,520 mean, this is what I sort of pushed on him about. 579 00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:17,440 I just sort of like kept coming back to Trump that it's, it's 580 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:20,960 hard to be just sort of like middle of the road when you have 581 00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:23,360 to react to the stuff you described before, which is like 582 00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:28,400 a kleptocracy and sort of just the, I don't know, degradation 583 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:32,320 of our government and culture. And so I, I don't know, I do 584 00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,000 think you sort of need a politician who's pretty upset 585 00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:38,200 about that and says we really need to like work hard to go 586 00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:41,880 back the other way. And so it's hard to strike this 587 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:46,080 like, I don't know, super chill, like bring everyone together a 588 00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:50,120 message when it we need some. I don't know, we really need to 589 00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:55,160 work to to undo some of the damage that's been done. 590 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:57,680 Yeah, and especially in tech, right, it's a in California is 591 00:28:57,680 --> 00:28:59,280 very tricky, right. I mean, it's the like the 592 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,280 largest economy in the world. Like I think of ranks like 4th 593 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:07,480 or 5th, whatever, but but an embrace of tech, but also, you 594 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:10,320 know, some distance from it too and making sure that, you know, 595 00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:13,800 tech leaders understand their power and their influence. 596 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:17,200 Like you think about American superpower, but if you fold in 597 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:21,720 American platform superpower, NVIDIA, alphabet, meta, like 598 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:24,320 they're in the top GDPS in the world, right? 599 00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:28,360 Like we have such an influence on the world, but we're not 600 00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,040 elected. You're like, there needs to be 601 00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:32,920 AI. Think a tougher conversation and 602 00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:35,920 A and a more vibrant conversation with how we work 603 00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:37,080 attack. We saw what happen. 604 00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,520 The Biden administration didn't embrace a lot of these leaders 605 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:43,680 and as a result, they like went another direction and then they 606 00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:46,120 got their feelings or they got mad and they're, you know, 607 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:47,520 whatever. And they went different 608 00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,920 direction because they were just kind of they weren't listened 609 00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:52,320 to. And I think we just need a 610 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,040 leader or set of leaders in California that are just going 611 00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:57,960 to be, again, reasonable, thoughtful, honorable and 612 00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:01,360 attentive to what are the advantages of these new emerging 613 00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:05,080 technologies and what are the implications to, you know, 614 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:07,960 everyday Americans and and citizens around the world as 615 00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:08,960 they emerge. Yeah. 616 00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:11,720 What do you make of, you know, the lack of backbone, I guess, 617 00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:14,040 in tech? I mean, we both were, you know, 618 00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:18,040 incredulous, I don't know, morally outraged when, you know, 619 00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:21,160 ice was, you know, killing people in the street. 620 00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:24,920 And it really felt like a moment where a lot of people, you know, 621 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,400 in the business community in tech were were too silent. 622 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:32,160 You know, I I called Tim Cook a quisling at that point in time, 623 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:34,000 like, I don't know, we sort of moved on. 624 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:38,800 You know, I think, you know, Trump de escalated somewhat and 625 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:42,800 I guess the reaction was sufficient to get some change 626 00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:43,560 there. It's not clear. 627 00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:45,840 We're totally out of the woods with ice. 628 00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,960 Maybe we've just moved on in terms of our attention. 629 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:52,760 But yeah, what do you make of sort of the lack of leadership 630 00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:56,080 from, I don't know, the big tech CEOs? 631 00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:59,360 Yeah, it was appalling. Like it was absolutely 632 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:02,200 appalling. And you know, and I think I, I 633 00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:05,160 forget the timeline, but you know, maybe it was like a week 634 00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:08,640 or a couple weeks earlier all the tech leaders were in DC, 635 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:10,200 right? And they're all sitting at 636 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:12,960 President Trump's table and all fanboying him, right? 637 00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:15,560 And so they were all there. They had plenty to say. 638 00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:20,880 And yet two Americans who are exercising their freedom of 639 00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:24,480 speech and protesting against ice in Minnesota. 640 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:29,880 A poet, Renee Good and Alex Pretty, an ICU nurse who had the 641 00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:35,360 bravery and the courage to protest, got shot and killed in 642 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:38,600 pure daylight. With all the video surrounding 643 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:42,200 it. It was clear as day and the 644 00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,560 Trump administration calling them terrorists. 645 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:48,240 And it was one of the most disgusting things I feel like 646 00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:50,400 I'd ever seen in my lifetime. And so, you know, I tweeted 647 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,080 something about like, this is appalling, this terrible and, 648 00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:56,840 you know, these poor families. And and then I think you wrote 649 00:31:56,840 --> 00:31:58,520 the right, you know, this amazing article. 650 00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:00,480 And I wasn't totally paying attention at the time. 651 00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:04,120 So I read your article that Jeff Dean, David Hornick, maybe a 652 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:05,760 couple other people, and that's it. 653 00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:09,480 And like, everyone was silent. I'm like, how can everyone have 654 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,720 an opinion about, you know, these ridiculous things? 655 00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:15,960 And I don't know, like if you have a platform and you have 656 00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:18,280 this privilege, you have to speak up. 657 00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:20,480 Like, tech is no longer neutral on things. 658 00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:25,800 I mean, even Fast forward to this past weekend where we saw 659 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:30,360 Sam Altman's house attacked, Molotov cocktail. 660 00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:32,520 Two days later, three days later, someone shot his house. 661 00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:34,480 Terrible. That should never happen. 662 00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:37,480 Nobody should live in fear. You know, no matter what they 663 00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:40,240 do, if they're Sam Altman or, you know, Sam Johnson, like 664 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:43,440 everyone like needs to be respectful and safe. 665 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:46,320 And so that was terrible. But also, and everyone Silicon 666 00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:48,360 Valley had an opinion like why that was bad. 667 00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:50,560 They're absolutely right. That was bad and they should 668 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,000 speak out. But why this disparity, right? 669 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,000 Like we should, you know, speak out when we see things that are 670 00:32:56,000 --> 00:33:01,280 wrong and, and we have this, I know we have all this power and 671 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,920 privilege, like we have to use it in the most constructive way. 672 00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:10,000 Yeah, no, that's so well put. I mean, it does feel like they, 673 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,080 well, first of all, that, you know, it's strategic to them to 674 00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:16,640 defend ACEO in the way that sort of being across the Trump 675 00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:18,640 administration doesn't help them. 676 00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:22,240 But I, I also feel like there's this sort of like class defense 677 00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:25,960 where it's like the CEO, like me, I need to defend them. 678 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:29,120 But yeah, I was it's, it's a very dark contrast. 679 00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:32,560 And you can see how countries slip into fascism. 680 00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,520 It's like, oh, the business community does sort of line up. 681 00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:37,880 They they see what they get out of the administration. 682 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:40,800 They play, they're experts that sort of playing the game on the 683 00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:42,320 field. They're like, oh, these are my 684 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:44,800 incentives. And people just sort of drift 685 00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:47,160 into it. I mean, yeah, it's, it's a dark 686 00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:50,760 realization about, I mean, that almost gives them too much 687 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:52,640 forgiveness because it's sort of like, well, that's how these 688 00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:55,400 things go. But yeah, I'd, I'd like to see 689 00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:59,360 more leaders in tech. I mean, how much do you think 690 00:33:59,960 --> 00:34:05,400 just like the political tide shifting will will sort of help 691 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:08,560 people find their backbones? I mean, if Democrats start to 692 00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:12,199 gain power in like the midterms, do you see movement there or do 693 00:34:12,199 --> 00:34:16,159 you see people starting to try to reposition themselves? 694 00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:18,199 I think so. I think that there are, you 695 00:34:18,199 --> 00:34:21,000 know, I'm on a bunch of tech threads, you know, signals of 696 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:25,080 people that, you know, are just being like, careful and watching 697 00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:28,920 and are hopeful. I also feel a lot of collective 698 00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:31,520 exhaustion. You know, we just live in this 699 00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:35,679 frenzied world that every day like what is happening. 700 00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:37,639 Right. I mean, the first Trump 701 00:34:37,639 --> 00:34:40,040 administration, there was this sense like, we're going to 702 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:42,440 resist it, yes. And that will solve everything, 703 00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:44,840 yes. And then I feel like people lost 704 00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:48,800 all the will to, you know, resist, I guess, the second time 705 00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:51,080 around because it's like, oh, it was a lot of complaining that 706 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:52,400 didn't do much. Right. 707 00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,600 But I think you are starting to see, you know, groups like this 708 00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:59,960 is too far, like Marjorie Taylor Green stepping up, this is too 709 00:34:59,960 --> 00:35:01,360 far. Fascinating, right? 710 00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:02,720 Like. Tucker Carlson. 711 00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:05,520 Megyn Kelly. Like, sometimes I listen to 712 00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:07,080 Megyn Kelly now. I agree with her. 713 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:08,520 Like, wait, what? What is happening? 714 00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:11,760 And like, and so you're seeing people, I mean, the stuff this 715 00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:14,680 past week against the Holy Father, like, really, we're 716 00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:17,440 going to take on the Pope, the beloved Pope. 717 00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:20,520 Like, that's insane. Like, especially with, you know, 718 00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:21,960 you know, Christians and Catholics. 719 00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:24,720 I grew up Catholic and man, would I love to have a family 720 00:35:24,720 --> 00:35:28,760 reunion right now with my representatives and everybody 721 00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:30,920 else. Like, you know, you know, he's 722 00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:33,000 gone too far, like over and over again. 723 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:35,640 But I think more and more people are starting to feel it. 724 00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,360 So you can and there are the cracks in there. 725 00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:41,320 And I think it is a moment in time. 726 00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:44,640 Like, again, how do we bring people more Artemis moments, 727 00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:46,960 right? How do we, you know, who is the 728 00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:50,320 Artemis candidate, you know, to help us, you know, heal some of 729 00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:53,160 these wounds and go back in the world and heal these 730 00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:57,160 relationships that, you know, he is decimated with many of our 731 00:35:57,160 --> 00:35:59,280 allies. We just have a lot of work to 732 00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:02,160 do. This this is a big question, 733 00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:06,080 maybe too much to ask, but like if you had to say what like you 734 00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:10,960 think the positive vision for like America should be like, are 735 00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:14,560 you it's like sort of abundance, like grow, grow, grow. 736 00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:17,680 Does that fully capture it because it allows this sort of 737 00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,440 like, I don't know, it's just like build more tech companies 738 00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:24,400 Or do you how how would you put like what we should be sort of 739 00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:27,920 aspiring to and what the message you want to hear? 740 00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:32,480 Yeah, I think, you know, again, because we have this unique and 741 00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:38,000 amazing abundance of technology and resources and innovation, 742 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:40,560 and, you know, Americans who are the best of their game. 743 00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:43,160 If it's in healthcare, if it's in economics, if it's in 744 00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:45,840 construction, if it's in space, like that's awesome. 745 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:47,200 How do we leverage that for good? 746 00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:50,040 And how do we make, of course, more Americans benefit? 747 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,480 But it can't just be just Americans. 748 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:56,240 We live in this global world where we're all interconnected. 749 00:36:56,400 --> 00:37:00,960 How can we use our privilege, our power, our resources to help 750 00:37:01,160 --> 00:37:04,080 you find earlier detection of cancer in treatments? 751 00:37:04,240 --> 00:37:07,400 How can we ensure that we have enough natural resources for 752 00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,600 everybody to benefit? How do we ensure that we have a 753 00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:13,120 better, more protected climate? You know, we have a home in 754 00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:16,240 Colorado. It has been 60 to 70° almost all 755 00:37:16,240 --> 00:37:18,480 winter. There is no snowpack, which 756 00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,760 means there's no water, which also means there are more fires. 757 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:23,720 And this is happening all over the world. 758 00:37:23,720 --> 00:37:26,040 This is not just a Colorado or an American problem. 759 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:27,800 This is a, you know, like global problems. 760 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:30,880 So how can we leverage all the tools and the, you know, the 761 00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:33,520 tools of the 21st century to address the challenges of the 762 00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:36,280 21st century around the world? So that is my hope. 763 00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:39,640 Well put. Climate is a funny one. 764 00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:41,800 Yeah. I feel like there are two things 765 00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:44,160 we never hear about, like climate and DI. 766 00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:46,760 And I want to touch on both of the OR we don't hear about it. 767 00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:48,440 We haven't heard about them in the last, I don't know, two 768 00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:51,000 years. Climate. 769 00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,120 Somebody was making the point to me literally at lunch before 770 00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:58,840 this that because of the war in Iran, it's like you're starting 771 00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:01,200 to hear like at least energy is a concern again. 772 00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:03,600 It's like we need other energy sources. 773 00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:07,680 So even if people because of, you know, the Trump agenda, 774 00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:11,400 don't want to frame it in like environmentalism terms, they're 775 00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:14,600 suddenly oh, yeah, we it's good not to just be dependent on 776 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:18,640 Middle Eastern oil. But yeah, I mean, are you, do 777 00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:21,920 you seem, have you been like, have you been sort of quietly 778 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:25,840 doing climate investing at all in this period where it's sort 779 00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:28,320 of out of favor in the headlines? 780 00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:31,320 Yeah, so, Eric, it's no longer called climate tech, it's called 781 00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:32,280 energy. Tech exactly. 782 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:34,000 Right. Or it's called like the 783 00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:36,520 reindustrialization of America. Yeah. 784 00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:40,920 War against climate change? Kill. 785 00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:44,080 People with their solar panels. Yeah, exactly. 786 00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:46,360 So there is kind of rebranding, right. 787 00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:49,520 And I think that's really important and we have a number 788 00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:52,440 of companies in our portfolio that are in that category and 789 00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,360 they're crushing it. We have one company called 790 00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,560 Overstory and it's AI for vegetation management that's 791 00:38:57,560 --> 00:39:00,440 addressing that. We have, you know, a heating or, 792 00:39:00,720 --> 00:39:04,200 you know, heating, sorry. Yeah, the heating planet. 793 00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:08,520 And and as a result, we have more fires and utilities cause 794 00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:12,920 something like 50% of fire or no, 11% of fires and 50% of the 795 00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:16,600 economic destruction, right. So it's a huge, huge problem. 796 00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:19,400 We see this certainly in California, Colorado in New York 797 00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:22,240 has had fires like it's crazy. Anyway, so Overstory works with 798 00:39:22,240 --> 00:39:25,840 utilities to help them use AI satellite data, all this other 799 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:29,400 interesting stuff to be able to get ahead of these things. 800 00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:32,920 So which of their assets need to, you know, cut back trees? 801 00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:35,040 Where should they reinvest things? 802 00:39:35,240 --> 00:39:37,760 So, and utilities have adopted this like crazy. 803 00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:39,880 We, we LED this around a few years ago. 804 00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:43,680 They are now this market leader of grid resilience, So not 805 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:47,960 climate tech, grid resilience. And, and it is a huge business. 806 00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:50,480 They are growing really fast. They're crushing their numbers 807 00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:52,800 and, and it is so exciting to see. 808 00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:55,840 So here's a great practical use of AI that is going to save a 809 00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:57,680 lot of people's lives. It's going to save businesses a 810 00:39:57,680 --> 00:39:59,800 lot of money. It's the company's actually 811 00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:01,880 based on the Netherlands. The CEO is American. 812 00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:05,680 And it's been we laugh about the words, but there is a degree to 813 00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:08,280 some that is sort of what the Trump people wanted, right? 814 00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,600 Like if you look at Dodge, they were literally searching for 815 00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:12,360 particular words. And we're like, we don't like 816 00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:14,760 those words. Like instead of soft words, 817 00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:17,880 please use hard, tough guy words and like that. 818 00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:23,560 So DEI, diversity, equity and inclusion, like how much is that 819 00:40:23,720 --> 00:40:26,680 truly gone versus you? You think there are still 820 00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:30,280 efforts going on that just like people don't want to talk about? 821 00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:33,480 Yeah, there are still efforts for sure, which is great, but 822 00:40:33,720 --> 00:40:35,840 people don't use them, right. And people don't talk about 823 00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:37,280 them. People don't report on them. 824 00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:39,800 I do. We send our investor updates 825 00:40:39,800 --> 00:40:43,160 every quarter and I track and I report on how many of our 826 00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:46,840 founders are, you know, black, brown, female, immigrant, 827 00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:49,680 whatever. And so I think it's important. 828 00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:52,640 And you know, we don't invest in companies just because they fit 829 00:40:52,720 --> 00:40:56,080 a certain category, but I do want to make sure that we're 830 00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:58,720 building products and backing founders that reflect the 831 00:40:58,720 --> 00:41:01,920 customers that they serve. And so, you know, it isn't as 832 00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:04,240 widespread as maybe it used to be, but I still think it's 833 00:41:04,240 --> 00:41:05,000 important. It's amazing. 834 00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:08,400 We live in an industry, you know, that loves to think from 835 00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:11,280 first principles. Yes, yet first principles, but 836 00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:12,920 yet they're totally socially reactive. 837 00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:15,840 It's like you were doing not you, but everyone else like 838 00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:19,240 doing DEI before. Now that it's out of favor, you 839 00:41:19,240 --> 00:41:22,280 don't talk about it at all, yet you're a first principles 840 00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:23,800 thinker. Like it's. 841 00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:27,520 Yeah, the herd mentality on this one is pretty gross. 842 00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:28,760 I. Mean ultimately, like do what 843 00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:30,920 you think is right, and if you think it's right, you should do 844 00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:33,120 it. You know, there's obviously a 845 00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:36,120 lot of merit, a lot of data that suggests that, you know, diverse 846 00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:39,560 companies and diverse teams will have better outcomes. 847 00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:42,720 So the data is there, the feeling is there, the outcome is 848 00:41:42,720 --> 00:41:44,320 there. So, you know, for us, we're 849 00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:47,040 still going to do it. The sort of emphasis on it, like 850 00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:51,560 were there any legal, like, I don't know, they've no you, you 851 00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:55,320 feel like safe, safe doing it. I mean, come at me because I 852 00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:58,600 report on that like you're. Just disclosing data around, you 853 00:41:58,600 --> 00:41:59,760 know, yeah. It's just data. 854 00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:03,240 And yeah, I mean, I, yeah, I mean, I think, you know, 855 00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:05,760 sunlight is the best disinfectant kind of thing. 856 00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:09,640 Like, you know, have the data, you know, be honest about what 857 00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:13,600 that data means and you know, and hopefully use that data in a 858 00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:17,080 really good positive way. Do you think sort of minority 859 00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:19,920 founders and women are are getting less funding now? 860 00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:24,960 Or what's your sense on how much sort of not talking about DEI is 861 00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:26,840 translating into a lack of funding? 862 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:28,560 Yeah, it's still bad. Yeah. 863 00:42:28,560 --> 00:42:30,120 Like I don't know where the. It was bad. 864 00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:31,520 It is bad. It's still bad. 865 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:35,480 Yeah, like it's, I remember, I think it was in 2016, I was a 866 00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:38,880 group in a group called Hashtag Angels, which was a group of 867 00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:40,520 girlfriends. We're still very close to this 868 00:42:40,520 --> 00:42:42,760 day. And we banded together to become 869 00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:45,760 better investors and we started to see the cap tables of these 870 00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:48,080 companies that we're backing. And we're like, look, there's 871 00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:50,920 really not a lot of women and they're really not a lot of 872 00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:54,240 under represented, you know, people in these cap tables. 873 00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:58,760 And we worked with Carta to actually look at the data and 874 00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:01,400 Henry Ward, the CEO and Co founder of Carta was great. 875 00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:04,160 He was like, OK, I'll use our data science team and I forget 876 00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:08,120 the exact stats, but it's something like 6500 cap tables 877 00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:12,760 at the time. And only 9% of the capital went 878 00:43:12,760 --> 00:43:15,920 to women. And that was across founders and 879 00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:21,080 employees, early employees, VC's and, and maybe one or two other 880 00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:23,640 categories. And, and that was terrible. 881 00:43:23,640 --> 00:43:26,160 It's kind of what we thought it was, but at least we knew where 882 00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:27,680 to start. And we get, you know, to always 883 00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:29,840 ask questions going forward. Like, is it better or worse? 884 00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:32,200 And I haven't seen the data since then, but I'm pretty 885 00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:34,240 certain it's not much better sadly. 886 00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:38,240 It is, you know, I program conferences. 887 00:43:38,240 --> 00:43:40,560 You know, we have speakers. We're doing a voice event right 888 00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:46,760 now, and it's like, yeah, we want more female speakers, but 889 00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:49,560 we also want, like, voice company CEOs in it. 890 00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:50,920 Yeah. I mean, it's the classic, you 891 00:43:50,920 --> 00:43:52,200 know you don't. Want to be a great one for? 892 00:43:52,200 --> 00:43:53,640 You, you do daily. Great. 893 00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:54,760 OK, what is it? Tell me. 894 00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:59,360 About it, so it's API for voice and audio, so it's a dev tool, 895 00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:01,640 but you know. This is exactly what I was. 896 00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:04,240 It's like, give me solutions, You know, I'll have people be 897 00:44:04,240 --> 00:44:05,600 like, you need more women. And it's like, all right. 898 00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:08,440 I don't know women. Give me a specific one and like, 899 00:44:08,440 --> 00:44:10,600 we'll think about it. We'll see, You know, how much 900 00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:13,680 money they've raised. I mean, the challenge is, yeah, 901 00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:16,680 you, you want, I want, I don't want to call anyone out. 902 00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:19,000 But one time, you know, we programmed, I mean, we've 903 00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:20,800 programmed. Well, one of the women we 904 00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,920 programmed was like, I'm shocked that I get to be included among 905 00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:26,240 these other people. And you're like, you almost want 906 00:44:26,240 --> 00:44:28,720 to be like, no, act like you're, you're supposed to be there. 907 00:44:28,720 --> 00:44:31,360 Like we want, we don't want it to be sort of like you're, 908 00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:33,160 you're the one that didn't sort of make the cut. 909 00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:35,080 You're like, you're in the list, you're on the stage. 910 00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,800 I don't know it it's it's it's a funding is somewhat different 911 00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:42,000 than speaking in that we are sort of like tracking, you know, 912 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:44,280 the people before I don't know this is. 913 00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:46,360 But I I think you're right. Like I remember once Kara 914 00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:49,480 Swisher called me and asked me to be like speak on something. 915 00:44:49,480 --> 00:44:50,920 And my kids were little at the time. 916 00:44:50,920 --> 00:44:52,600 I was like, I can't do it. I'm really busy. 917 00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:55,880 And she called me up and Kara has Kara like, she doesn't mince 918 00:44:55,880 --> 00:44:57,960 words, right. And she was like, what the fuck? 919 00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:00,480 You know, she was like, Katie, you need to take your space. 920 00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:01,600 And I was like, what does that mean? 921 00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:03,960 She's like, I'm giving you this opportunity. 922 00:45:04,160 --> 00:45:07,160 Take it and like, don't sit back because you have to watch the 923 00:45:07,160 --> 00:45:08,240 kids. Find someone else to watch the 924 00:45:08,240 --> 00:45:10,920 kids, like do it. And like, it really stuck with 925 00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:12,240 me. Like 1st, I don't want to be on 926 00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:13,880 Kara's bad side because she could be mean. 927 00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:15,120 She's so. Good at it. 928 00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:16,640 You know what? She's literally I just saw on 929 00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:18,400 the podcast she's. So good. 930 00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:21,040 And like, and, and I respect her and I admire her. 931 00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:23,800 And she has like, been in this arena for a long time. 932 00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:25,680 And she has made such a positive dent. 933 00:45:25,680 --> 00:45:27,920 And so, yeah, when Kara's Swisher asked you to do these 934 00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:30,000 things, like, you do it. But like, she's right. 935 00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:31,800 Like, take your space. And I think a lot of women 936 00:45:31,800 --> 00:45:34,480 especially, you know, you might be early in your career and you 937 00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:35,320 have kids. You have a lot of 938 00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:37,120 responsibilities. Maybe you're caregiving for your 939 00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:38,760 parents, too. And you're like, I can't 940 00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:41,600 possibly do it. But if you're listening, saying 941 00:45:41,600 --> 00:45:43,040 do it. Take your space. 942 00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:45,920 Man, you need to Cara, Cara, you need to internalize this or I 943 00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:48,960 want to ask Cara for advice on how she, like books such great 944 00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:50,560 speakers. She's like, oh, I just, I just 945 00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:52,920 asked them, you know? Yeah, no, there's a lot more to 946 00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:55,960 it. She's so good at being like real 947 00:45:55,960 --> 00:45:58,760 and like, you know, that you remember it and that it stands 948 00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:02,120 out and that she was like sort of pushed through sort of, you 949 00:46:02,120 --> 00:46:04,320 know, it's so easy, just like ask over e-mail and it's like 950 00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:08,640 take whatever the answer. And she's, she's good at that. 951 00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:11,320 Yeah, she might send a hitman after you too, so there's that. 952 00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:15,240 It's like I have a long memory. Yeah. 953 00:46:15,720 --> 00:46:18,160 Any other. So I mean, we talked through 954 00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:20,520 health, we hit a little bit on energy. 955 00:46:20,720 --> 00:46:23,320 Any other sort of interesting startup categories that you're 956 00:46:23,320 --> 00:46:26,320 watching right now? Have you invested in any like I 957 00:46:26,320 --> 00:46:27,880 don't know, foundation model companies? 958 00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:30,880 Are you staying away from that category given all the money 959 00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:32,920 going into Open AI and Anthropic? 960 00:46:32,960 --> 00:46:35,840 Yeah, I think we're mostly staying away from that category. 961 00:46:36,560 --> 00:46:38,920 You know, we're always looking for, you know, great companies 962 00:46:38,920 --> 00:46:42,600 that are solving real problems. And that can be in, again, 963 00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:47,880 healthcare, it can be in finance, it can be in legal 964 00:46:47,880 --> 00:46:49,280 tech. So we have one company called 965 00:46:49,280 --> 00:46:52,040 Spellbook, which is AI for lawyers, like, yeah. 966 00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:56,240 And it's I mean legal tech, the most boring category that you 967 00:46:56,240 --> 00:46:58,040 can imagine like several years ago. 968 00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:00,840 And now it's like this race. It's so sexy. 969 00:47:00,840 --> 00:47:03,760 So we have, you know, spellbook we invested in, which is only 970 00:47:03,800 --> 00:47:05,080 two he. Threw a boy in investors. 971 00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:06,960 He is that's. Funny, that's bridging. 972 00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:09,000 I know two different political ends with the. 973 00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:12,160 Spectrum on this project. I think he talked about it here 974 00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:13,000 too. Oh, good. 975 00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:14,480 Yeah. And he's a great company and 976 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,040 they're crushing it. And you know, this is a great 977 00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:18,800 one. You know, their customers love 978 00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:21,000 them and they're growing very fast. 979 00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:23,520 They're based in Canada, so it's a great Canadian win. 980 00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:26,360 We have another company here in New York City called, which is 981 00:47:26,360 --> 00:47:29,320 an AI native law firm. This founder, I met her here in 982 00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:31,880 New York at a New York tech event and she had just left 983 00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:34,800 Cooley. And this almost never happens 984 00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:37,000 when you're at an event, you talk to somebody and you're 985 00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:39,960 like, this person has just something special. 986 00:47:39,960 --> 00:47:41,840 Like tell me more. I think we're going to invest. 987 00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:44,800 And the more I got to know her, like the more excited I got. 988 00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:46,840 She's the winner. Like she was got in every 989 00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:48,920 college. She she goes to Vanderbilt, she 990 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:51,880 becomes valedictorian. She was a Marshall Scholar 991 00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,760 applies to every law school, gets in every law school, goes 992 00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:56,680 to Harvard, you know, free ride all these things. 993 00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:57,920 And like she just knows how to win. 994 00:47:57,920 --> 00:48:00,400 And she's just so good. And so it's really fun seeing 995 00:48:00,400 --> 00:48:03,480 like, you know, her and, and Scott from Spellbook, just like 996 00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:07,920 grow these businesses that were not in like not in anyone's 997 00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:11,720 imagination like 5 to 6 years ago and you're solving really 998 00:48:11,720 --> 00:48:14,680 hard problems. The The Who, What was the 999 00:48:14,680 --> 00:48:16,120 company of the founder? You were just. 1000 00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:17,480 Talking about, I'm sorry, it's called. 1001 00:48:17,480 --> 00:48:20,960 Soxton I'm sorry, what's it do? So it's an AI native law firm 1002 00:48:21,720 --> 00:48:23,640 and of course they have lawyers on the team, but. 1003 00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:26,200 Very involved now. Well, obviously Krosky has 1004 00:48:26,240 --> 00:48:27,920 raised a bunch of money in this category. 1005 00:48:28,080 --> 00:48:32,560 Yeah, yeah, they have and, and, but what Soxton is doing, 1006 00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:34,840 they're working with early stage startups, right? 1007 00:48:34,840 --> 00:48:36,920 And I see this all the time. It's such a big problem. 1008 00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:40,320 You see the startup and they're spending thousands of dollars 1009 00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:43,880 working with any of the major firms on incorporation docs and 1010 00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,320 thousands of dollars on, you know, their their safes, their, 1011 00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:48,560 you know, their price round notes. 1012 00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:51,080 That is not what they should be spending their money on, right? 1013 00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:53,360 And so they're going to need that money for compute and 1014 00:48:53,360 --> 00:48:55,600 everything else. And so Saxon does this at a 1015 00:48:55,600 --> 00:48:58,960 fraction of the cost and really fast and and that team is just 1016 00:48:58,960 --> 00:49:02,000 off to the races. So another New York winner for 1017 00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:03,280 you. So if you're a start up, go to 1018 00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:06,840 Saxon dot AI. What a What fund is Moxie on 1019 00:49:06,840 --> 00:49:07,840 right now? Fund 3. 1020 00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:10,480 So what? That's, that's, so you've made 1021 00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:12,080 it. You've made it to Fund 3, which 1022 00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:14,760 is always the sort of test for a new manager. 1023 00:49:15,120 --> 00:49:16,720 I don't know. We live in this world of venture 1024 00:49:16,720 --> 00:49:20,480 capital where Andreessen Horowitz, Lightspeed, General 1025 00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:24,040 Catalyst feel like they're sucking up so much of the money, 1026 00:49:24,040 --> 00:49:26,440 so much of the attention. Like what? 1027 00:49:26,440 --> 00:49:28,840 What have been the lessons you've learned trying to build a 1028 00:49:28,840 --> 00:49:32,280 new, smaller, sort of early stage focused firm? 1029 00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:36,040 And yeah, how do you sort of survive amidst all the giants? 1030 00:49:36,200 --> 00:49:39,280 Yeah, I think #1 is just stay focused, you know, play your 1031 00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:41,600 strengths. And so for us, it's, you know, 1032 00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:45,320 we look to invest 1.5 on 15,000,000, maybe up a little 1033 00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:47,720 bit or down a little bit. That means we also have to get 1034 00:49:47,720 --> 00:49:50,160 there really early. Can we compete with these $100 1035 00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:51,600 million seeds? Nope. 1036 00:49:51,800 --> 00:49:55,000 Like skip it. Like, it's really easy to get 1037 00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:58,880 this FOMO and just try to do these things, but the fun math 1038 00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:00,600 doesn't work. Like you just have to stay 1039 00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:03,920 really focused. You have to stay really early 1040 00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:08,720 and you have to be really fast. And so, you know, when I met 1041 00:50:09,040 --> 00:50:12,000 Logan Brown at Saxon, I met her that night and I sent her a term 1042 00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:15,760 sheet a few days later. And like, I needed to do that 1043 00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:19,080 before Andreessen or any of the other bigger guys, you know, saw 1044 00:50:19,080 --> 00:50:20,440 her and met her. And that's OK. 1045 00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:22,760 I mean, and found her right after this and trying to close 1046 00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:26,320 these deals as quickly as possible and also help them get 1047 00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:28,840 to the next level. Because if Andreessen and Lights 1048 00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:33,040 and all these other great firms like you at seed, I promise you 1049 00:50:33,040 --> 00:50:36,040 they're gonna like you even more at a when you have more product 1050 00:50:36,040 --> 00:50:38,720 market fit, when you have more revenue, when you have more data 1051 00:50:38,720 --> 00:50:41,760 to make a good decision. But it's a very much a 1052 00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:44,400 bifurcated market. Are you taking board seats ever? 1053 00:50:44,440 --> 00:50:47,480 No, it's too hard to scale. It's too early. 1054 00:50:47,480 --> 00:50:51,920 I mean, sometimes we do, we try not to because each fund will 1055 00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:55,160 have roughly 30 to 35 companies and that just doesn't scale. 1056 00:50:55,360 --> 00:50:57,280 So we always get information, right. 1057 00:50:57,280 --> 00:50:59,680 So we have as much information as the board members. 1058 00:50:59,960 --> 00:51:01,280 But you know, we're like, it was Spellbook. 1059 00:51:01,280 --> 00:51:03,800 We were, we actually sat on the board of Spellbook early. 1060 00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:05,880 And then Keith came, we're like great. 1061 00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:08,960 Like Keith is a lawyer. He's a very good VC. 1062 00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:12,760 Let him help you take it to the next level. 1063 00:51:12,760 --> 00:51:15,200 So there's a little bit of a pass the baton that happens. 1064 00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:18,160 You're you are on the board of Yahoo, right? 1065 00:51:18,240 --> 00:51:19,920 Yes, that one. I said yes too. 1066 00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:23,400 I had another like this podcast. I saw that with Jim Lanzone. 1067 00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:24,880 He was on this podcast. He's. 1068 00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:26,960 The best? How, what what do you make of 1069 00:51:27,080 --> 00:51:29,320 sort of the progress they've made and yeah, I don't know, 1070 00:51:29,320 --> 00:51:30,960 what do you, what do you think they've been able to do? 1071 00:51:31,160 --> 00:51:34,200 It is awesome. So you were talking to earlier. 1072 00:51:34,200 --> 00:51:38,120 Yahoo was the first job I ever loved and coming full circle to 1073 00:51:38,120 --> 00:51:40,000 work on this and the 1st. Job you ever loved? 1074 00:51:40,000 --> 00:51:43,040 It's like I was a banker. Not the first job I ever loved. 1075 00:51:43,040 --> 00:51:45,160 Definitely not that. One and then product 1076 00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:49,600 manager@yahooin1999yes.com.com. Mania. 1077 00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:51,840 Yeah. You know, Webvan, like it was so 1078 00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:54,200 great. And and it was funny because I 1079 00:51:54,240 --> 00:51:57,640 met Jim when I worked at Google and he was at ask Jeeves and he 1080 00:51:57,640 --> 00:52:00,160 was the biggest pain in the ass. Like he asked us the hardest 1081 00:52:00,160 --> 00:52:01,680 questions. I was like, oh God. 1082 00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:03,880 And nobody at Google knew how to answer. 1083 00:52:03,880 --> 00:52:05,520 And they were just, you know, try to push back. 1084 00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:07,760 And I was like, you know what, this guy is right? 1085 00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:10,480 Like I never want to be in the opposite side of this guy. 1086 00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:13,120 Like he is so smart and so thoughtful. 1087 00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:14,520 And so we became friends and stayed in touch. 1088 00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:16,400 And then when he asked me to join the Yahoo board, I was 1089 00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:18,960 like, what an honor. Like even though I never take 1090 00:52:18,960 --> 00:52:22,400 board seats, I have to do this and have a front row seat to, 1091 00:52:22,840 --> 00:52:27,200 you know, the the reimagination of Yahoo, it's been awesome. 1092 00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:30,200 He has up leveled every single part of that team. 1093 00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:32,880 He has really refocused the company. 1094 00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:36,560 Like what really matters, search mail finance. 1095 00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:41,160 So fun to see Yahoo finance still kicking around and it is 1096 00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:44,320 still a market leader. Like this is a beloved brand. 1097 00:52:44,520 --> 00:52:47,240 Like, and it's funny too. You look at Twitter and X and 1098 00:52:47,240 --> 00:52:49,440 it's got like it's been kind of punched in the face, right? 1099 00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:50,880 If you're like, I don't trust it. 1100 00:52:50,880 --> 00:52:53,840 I don't really like it. And then you see Yahoo, when you 1101 00:52:53,840 --> 00:52:56,400 talk to anyone about Yahoo, they're like, I love Yahoo. 1102 00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:59,200 It's. Funny, I mean, it has the burden 1103 00:52:59,200 --> 00:53:02,520 of like it's old or like people, you know, you know, I don't 1104 00:53:02,520 --> 00:53:06,080 know, 30 plus. It's like it's it's old, but 1105 00:53:06,080 --> 00:53:07,640 like I think you have a positive. 1106 00:53:07,640 --> 00:53:09,280 Yeah, exactly. People don't. 1107 00:53:09,800 --> 00:53:12,920 Have a negative association and then once you drill into 1108 00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:15,960 specific things that it does like finance, you're like, Oh 1109 00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:18,280 yeah, it's probably the best like way to get financial 1110 00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:20,520 information. Or obviously some of the like 1111 00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:22,280 fantasy draft. I mean, there are lots of 1112 00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:24,200 categories where it's still pretty strong. 1113 00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:26,200 It's so great. And I don't know if you've tried 1114 00:53:26,560 --> 00:53:28,280 Yahoo Scout, which is, you know, yeah. 1115 00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:31,000 Obviously he's a prep for. It, it's cool, like it's really 1116 00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:35,400 good and, and so you know, it's been really fun. 1117 00:53:35,400 --> 00:53:37,880 The Apollo team has been amazing, and seeing how you know 1118 00:53:37,880 --> 00:53:40,920 Apollo has, you know, helped contribute to the success of 1119 00:53:40,920 --> 00:53:44,280 Yahoo has also been really fun. Do you? 1120 00:53:44,560 --> 00:53:45,680 This is probably my last question. 1121 00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:49,960 Do you use like AI in venture capital? 1122 00:53:49,960 --> 00:53:53,520 Like do you think like how, how is it changing how you do under 1123 00:53:53,520 --> 00:53:56,200 capital or perhaps it's? Venture capital, it's great like 1124 00:53:56,360 --> 00:53:58,120 for us, and we're a very small team. 1125 00:53:58,120 --> 00:54:01,120 My partner Alex, he is the smartest person in the room that 1126 00:54:01,120 --> 00:54:02,880 never acts like it. He's a engineer. 1127 00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:05,320 He was head of engineering at Twitter, where we suffer 1128 00:54:05,320 --> 00:54:08,040 together and built together and he's great. 1129 00:54:08,080 --> 00:54:11,640 And he has integrated all these different agents and tools into 1130 00:54:11,640 --> 00:54:13,800 how we work so we can just move faster. 1131 00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:15,480 You know, how do we prep our day? 1132 00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:18,800 How do we diligence companies, how do we look at, you know, the 1133 00:54:18,800 --> 00:54:21,760 competitive set, you know, what are like better questions. 1134 00:54:21,760 --> 00:54:26,400 So like it has totally helped us just get smarter so we can spend 1135 00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:29,000 more time, you know, face to face with founders and really 1136 00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:32,200 understand them as human beings and making sure the marketing. 1137 00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:35,000 AI is good at like flagging startups that you might want to 1138 00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:37,680 invest in, or it's more of the prep once you're sort of 1139 00:54:37,680 --> 00:54:41,080 actually in diligence. Not at seed per SE, because 1140 00:54:41,080 --> 00:54:43,600 usually it's like the idea. There's like really not a lot of 1141 00:54:43,600 --> 00:54:46,520 data to crawl maybe on the industry. 1142 00:54:46,720 --> 00:54:50,480 Like what are the signs that the market is pulling an idea like 1143 00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:52,840 this forward or a product like this forward? 1144 00:54:53,760 --> 00:54:56,120 Why have other companies failed in the past? 1145 00:54:56,120 --> 00:54:59,480 Was it the right, you know, the wrong team at the wrong time 1146 00:54:59,480 --> 00:55:00,720 with the wrong idea? I don't know. 1147 00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:04,000 So it's good at some things, but not necessarily on the history 1148 00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:05,920 of the company. OK. 1149 00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:09,000 This is my last question. Yeah, does this feellikethe.com 1150 00:55:09,000 --> 00:55:11,400 boom. Different. 1151 00:55:11,640 --> 00:55:16,200 It feels similar in that there's such a frenzy and the prices are 1152 00:55:16,200 --> 00:55:21,960 rising so fast and so high that just don't feel sustainable and 1153 00:55:21,960 --> 00:55:24,760 you know it's going to crash and you don't know when and how 1154 00:55:24,760 --> 00:55:26,760 badly. So that is true. 1155 00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:30,440 But but the crash is coming and the gas is coming. 1156 00:55:30,480 --> 00:55:34,800 But like, so you're just kind of bracing but different that the 1157 00:55:34,800 --> 00:55:40,160 opportunity is so much bigger. Like it is so huge and nobody 1158 00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:42,920 really understands it. And it really has so much 1159 00:55:42,920 --> 00:55:45,400 promise, but it's so uncontrolled. 1160 00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:48,880 That is a bit scary. And so, you know, everyone's 1161 00:55:48,880 --> 00:55:50,640 kind of building on quicksand a little bit. 1162 00:55:50,640 --> 00:55:54,000 So how do we just make sure we're prepared for that and 1163 00:55:54,200 --> 00:55:57,640 setting it up for success? Katie, Jacob, Stan, thank you so 1164 00:55:57,640 --> 00:55:59,520 much for coming on the show. Thank you so much for having me 1165 00:55:59,520 --> 00:56:01,000 so honoured. That's our show. 1166 00:56:01,000 --> 00:56:04,160 Thanks for listening. Please like, comment, subscribe. 1167 00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:05,840 We're a new channel and we can use all your support. 1168 00:56:05,840 --> 00:56:09,160 Go watch some of the old videos. You can follow along on the Sub 1169 00:56:09,160 --> 00:56:13,960 Stack newcomer.co. Or if you've got endless time on 1170 00:56:13,960 --> 00:56:17,080 your hands, go watch the Super Bowl Valley show, my chat show 1171 00:56:17,320 --> 00:56:18,760 with Max Child and James Wilserman. 1172 00:56:19,120 --> 00:56:20,640 Thanks for watching. See you next week.