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Welcome to studying law around 
the world I'm Claudio Claus in 

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each episode, I talk with 
lawyers, law students, and 

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professors from different parts 
of the world to talk about legal

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education, careers, and what the
profession looks like in real 

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life we talk about the hard 
parts, the surprises, and the 

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decisions that shaped their 
paths whether you're planning. 

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To study abroad. 
Thinking about working in 

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another legal system or just 
curious about how law works 

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around the world? 
This podcast is for you. 

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Hey listeners, the largest 
gathering of internationally 

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trained lawyers in Canada is 
happening at the ITIL conference

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in Toronto on April 24th and 20.
5th. 

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Secure your spot at the 
conference and gala today by 

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registering on 
www.itlconference.ca. 

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See you at the Marriott 
Downtown. 

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Today I'm interviewing Steven 
Schneider, he is the CEO of Trio

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SCO and I'm so excited to be 
interviewing him and learning a 

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little more about the SEO and 
the the world of marketing and 

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all that can be done with it. 
Thank you so much for making the

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time to be in the podcast today,
Steven. 

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Of course I'm excited to hear. 
Awesome. 

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And she started us off. 
I'd love for you to introduce 

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yourself and tell us a little 
bit about what you. 

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Do yeah. 
So we are kind of a unique 

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space. 
We actually as a SEO agency 

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that's kind of how we drive 
traffic. 

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But our core competency is 
actually building lead magnet 

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funnels, which is kind of unique
to other agencies, especially in

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the law space. 
But we design and develop custom

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tools such as calculators and 
quizzes that are predetermined 

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by keyword research and are 
intended to attract your ideal 

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customer to your site via ISEO 
or organic SEO. 

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And then give them a really low 
friction way to engage with your

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company and brand and be sent 
some sort of report or kind of, 

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you know, outputted kind of like
reactional form. 

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And then in that process, it 
actually pre qualifies them 

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based on the inputs. 
And then on the back end, you 

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collect all that information and
kind of have that that you're 

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ready to engage with them and 
kind of continuing conversation.

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I've, I've read a little bit of 
about the work you do and, and 

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what you post about on LinkedIn 
and all of that. 

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And I saw something about, you 
know, SEO not being only about 

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traffic, it being about systems 
that, and how lead generating 

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happens through that. 
So I think you explained a 

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little bit of like how that 
comes about, but I want you here

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a little more, you know, how 
does that work? 

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What does that really mean? 
And I'm sure that in every 

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field, even though, you know, 
we, we always prefer to hire a 

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professional, you kind of want 
to know what's going on behind 

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the scenes. 
So can you tell us a little more

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on that? 
Yeah, of course. 

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So before I started the agency, 
I used to Co own a portfolio of 

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about 40 different brands and 
scale that up to about 7 figures

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and had a crazy run with 
publishing content and doing 

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SEO. 
There's a lot of fun. 

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Back in the day, traffic was 
kind of the gold standard and 

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kind of if you build it, they 
will come sort of mentality. 

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But nowadays it's completely 
flipped around, especially with 

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AI and how people are starting 
to engage with brands and how 

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they want to learn more about 
your company or testimonials or 

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reviews before they even start 
the conversation on a sales 

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process. 
And so the entire system I would

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say nowadays has to be flipped 
upside down where getting 

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traffic to your site is the easy
kind of almost baseline must 

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have to compete. 
But then the next question I 

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always ask clients or prospects 
is what, what's the next step 

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once they land? 
How are you pulling them into 

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your site? 
And nine times out of 10, that's

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what we have this contact form 
and they fill out this form and 

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that's it. 
But there's nothing, one, more 

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awful than a contact form. 
And two, it's a pretty big ask 

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for somebody who is very, very 
fresh to your brand, maybe there

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in the discovery phase. 
It's essentially cold traffic. 

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And so by creating these lead 
magnet tools, you're able to 

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warm up that traffic faster and 
have it feel not so salesy. 

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But at the same time you get 
information, they get 

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information and then you can 
kind of go from there. 

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So that's the system. 
That play fantastic. 

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No, I really appreciate you 
explaining it a little more in 

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detail and and bringing it 
specifically in should the legal

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space. 
What do you think that you know,

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how does that work? 
You know, in the in the law firm

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an area. 
So why do you think that many 

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law firms invest in websites and
content, but there is a struggle

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in in generating qualified 
inquiries. 

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Yeah, so. 
This is where it gets really 

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interesting is that I actually 
had a call with an attorney the 

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other day and I was showing her 
the keyword landscape in her 

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space. 
And she was like, people are 

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actually searching for this. 
Yeah, funny enough, I mean, I'm 

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looking at the sheet right now. 
Depending on whether you're in 

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family law or personal injury or
criminal defence or medical 

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malpractice, the list goes on 
and on. 

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But you know, for example, like 
personal injury settlement 

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calculator has about 1000 
searches per month. 

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So if you have that calculator 
on your site, obviously that's 

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going to be a very, very high 
intent tool for anybody who 

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finds it to go and engage with. 
And then when they get a report,

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quote UN quote, that information
gets sent to them, the 

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information gets sent to you, so
on and so forth. 

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And then depending on which 
state you're in, there's a whole

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kind of sub genre of state by 
state calculators. 

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So you know, if you're looking 
at California, for example, you 

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could have a California child 
support calculator which has 

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3400 searches per month. 
And so people are actually 

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looking for these tools, they're
looking to engage with these 

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tools. 
And if you have that on your 

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site, that's just three-way to 
kind of pull those people into 

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your ecosystem, nurture those 
conversations and pull them into

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your brand. 
Amazing. 

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So if you were advising a small 
or mid-size law firm today, what

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would you tell them to focus on 
specifically? 

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I feel that a lot of the law 
firms that I interact with have 

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a lot of focus on having like 
the informational part, having 

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some kind of blog where, you 
know, all the lawyers have the 

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opportunity to to share a little
bit of what they know. 

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But what does actually matter 
when he comes to, you know, 

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actually generating work? 
Out of that, yeah, the, the 

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blogs are great. 
I would say that they're a 

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foundational part of every site,
that those tools work well 

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because then they are able to be
promoted within each blog. 

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So if you have, you know, how to
choose an attorney or what I 

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must know is there going through
this process sort of 

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informational piece, then 
there's a very natural next step

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to promote that tool. 
As a baseline though, to your 

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question, I would say that they 
should have blogs, they should 

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have a strong authoritative 
website. 

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So backlinks, a local presence 
for sure, a Google business 

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profile. 
Those are kind of all of the, 

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you know, bare essentials. 
And then kind of once you get 

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that ball rolling, you can kind 
of start to layer on these 

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advanced strategies, such as the
calculators they're running, 

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this quizzes, so on and so 
forth. 

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Amazing. 
And and that's like a very 

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interesting thing when it comes 
to, you know, websites and, and 

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generating leads and all of 
that. 

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But I can see how, you know, 
lawyers and law firms could have

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other goals as well overall. 
So I'm curious. 

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You should hear if you know, for
example, when it comes to, you 

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know, building authority, 
building a brand, when you're 

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talking more like on a personal 
sense, and maybe even know when 

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you want to make a brand, either
to have more options in the 

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future. 
You're sure, you know, working 

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at all firm, but you want 
options in the future or even 

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shoot, you know, scale your your
opportunities in in the many 

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different areas that brand can 
bring. 

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What is different, you know, 
between building a presence of a

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firm institution versus a person
and their personal brand? 

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Yeah, the personal brand is such
an important piece of the puzzle

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because it really reinforces the
entire SEO strategy in your 

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website strategy. 
And So what Google really looks 

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at is your expertise, your 
authoritativeness, the 

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trustworthiness that you 
display. 

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And so if you have an active 
residence on LinkedIn and 

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Facebook, et cetera, and all of 
that links back to your website,

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well then you kind of have this 
ongoing brand that will flywheel

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and then ask people find you or 
find your brand. 

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It kind of reinforces the trust.
If you see me on LinkedIn and 

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then you go to my website and 
you see my face and 

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testimonials, those are all 
going to compound on top of each

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other. 
So you really want to be active 

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on all places, like everywhere 
at once. 

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And then as you pull people in, 
you can kind of start to figure 

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out what their pain points are 
and how you can really help them

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solve those cases on a kind of 
natural fit for if it's a good 

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fit for both. 
Cases so I see very, very 

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interesting and you just 
mentioned that blogs are usually

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a good idea overall. 
So I'm curious to hear, you 

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know, I, I really understand 
that lawyers are trained to 

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write, you know, for courts, 
they're trained to write in a 

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very specific space. 
So is it is also my 

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understanding that writing for 
good SEO, writing for conversion

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can look a little different. 
So I'm, I'm really curious of, 

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of how that process works. 
You know, is it you as a 

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professional come in and you and
you help to shape those written 

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blogs? 
Is it something that happens 

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more in the back end? 
So there's no changes to the 

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actual text, but there's like 
information maybe that's not 

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seeing on the page. 
How how does that actually work?

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What's the the engine like? 
Yeah, so we have a great writer 

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who can kind of help facilitate 
a lot of that. 

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Now, the writing in the legal 
space is very touchy and 

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sensitive in some cases. 
It's really important to 

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remember that people on the 
receiving end aren't lawyers. 

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They're general people just 
trying to find information. 

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And so it really should be 
presented in a clear cut, easy 

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to understand. 
We always recommend a 5th to 8th

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grade reading level so that a 
complex topic can be simplified.

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And there's not a lot of jargon 
or kind of legal terms that are 

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going to confuse them because if
they're confused, they're just 

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going to leave and go somewhere 
else. 

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So the entire goal is to present
information in such a way that 

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keeps them on the page, keeps 
them learning more and reading. 

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And then at a natural point, 
there's a transition to work 

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with the team, play with the 
calculator, take the quiz. 

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It's a very natural next step 
from that process overall. 

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Very interesting. 
Thank you for sharing that. 

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I also wanted to know, you know,
many lawyers will also be in the

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profession for for a long time. 
So you think about the long term

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UX, you know, short term when it
comes to market. 

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But I wanted to hear from your 
experience what actually 

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compounds if you're looking 
over, you know, 5-10 years if a 

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professional really wants to 
build their authority and that 

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consistent inbound. 
Work. 

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The most overlooked strategy is 
podcasting. 

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Without a doubt. 
I would say that if there is a 

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way for attorneys to go on and 
do two to three to four podcasts

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on a weekly basis and have some 
sort of assistant find those and

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kind of keep that content coin, 
that's incredibly valuable to 

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not only your personal brand, 
it's incredibly valuable to your

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website, to your SEO in that 
process. 

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It's very likely that as the 
show goes live, they'll link in 

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the show notes from that website
back to your website, which 

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counts as a authoritative 
backlink for your SEO. 

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And so it really kind of opens 
the door to this multi win 

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approach where your networking, 
your meeting people, you're 

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getting content for your website
and brands, they're getting 

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website content for their own 
podcast. 

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It kind of just is this really, 
really overlooked strategy that 

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I don't think a lot of people 
are acting on. 

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But you play it for 5-10 years, 
you look back and you're very 

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happy with the results. 
Amazing. 

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No, that's, that's so 
interesting. 

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I really appreciate you sharing 
that. 

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You know, a lot of my audience 
here, Steven, are young lawyers 

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or early career professionals 
who are looking into different 

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things, right? 
So we talked a little bit about,

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you know, how to make your brand
stand out and all of that. 

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But I'm curious to hear, you 
know, if there is any kind of 

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advice that you give for a 
lawyer who is starting out, 

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who's trying to figure this out,
be it, you know, in the firm 

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setting or starting their own 
thing or really just trying to 

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compound on their brands. 
What are some of the main things

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that you would say in and you'd 
recommend from, you know, a 

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marketing SEO standpoint that 
they should be doing a 

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consistently? 
Yeah, I would say work with a 

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local SEO who has experience 
doing law and attorney SEO. 

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It's not like it's a unique 
practice, but the familiarity 

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around the terms and the 
keywords and that sort of stuff 

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will definitely give you an 
upper hand. 

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A local SEO is definitely a 
unique part of the SEO industry.

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And so knowing that you can 
trust somebody is very, very 

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wise. 
Next thing I would say is 

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growing your personal brand and 
your overall website authority 

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and just kind of the Internet 
ecosystem of who you are, what 

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you do and how you represented. 
All of that's going to compound 

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for years down the road. 
And I think the really like 

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added layer to that is just 
networking, meaning as many 

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individuals and lateral 
divisions or partners or content

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creators, anybody that can kind 
of help scratch your back while 

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you scratch theirs is going to 
be somebody you want on your 

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team long. 
Term leasing a really appreciate

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you taking the time to coming to
podcast, share some of your 

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insights and share a little bit 
about, you know, what you do 

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day-to-day. 
Thank you so much. 

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Absolutely. 
Thank you for having me on.