1 00:00:12,530 --> 00:00:14,460 Welcome to studying law Around the world. 2 00:00:14,690 --> 00:00:17,540 I'm Claudio Klaus. In each episode, I talk with 3 00:00:17,550 --> 00:00:20,510 lawyers, law students, and professors from different parts 4 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:24,780 of the world to talk about legal education, careers, and what the 5 00:00:24,790 --> 00:00:26,480 profession looks like in real life. 6 00:00:27,190 --> 00:00:30,300 We talk about the hard parts, the surprises, and the decisions 7 00:00:30,310 --> 00:00:33,430 that shaped their paths. Whether you're planning to study 8 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:37,050 abroad, thinking about working in another legal system, or just 9 00:00:37,060 --> 00:00:41,190 curious about how law works around the world, this podcast 10 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:46,490 is for you. Whether you're studying law in 11 00:00:46,500 --> 00:00:49,870 Mumbai or practising in Manhattan, Rev can help you 12 00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:52,910 transcribe and analyze all your case materials with 13 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:59,240 verifiablecitations.learnmore@rev.com. Today we have the opportunity to 14 00:00:59,250 --> 00:01:02,900 listen to Peter Hawkings. Peter spoke a lot about 15 00:01:02,910 --> 00:01:06,750 networking in the past and who is a great mentor to people who 16 00:01:06,760 --> 00:01:08,240 are wanting to learn more about it. 17 00:01:08,330 --> 00:01:10,280 Thank you so much for joining us today, Peter. 18 00:01:10,290 --> 00:01:13,320 I am delighted to be here. Thank you very much for inviting 19 00:01:13,330 --> 00:01:15,360 me. To introduce you to our 20 00:01:15,370 --> 00:01:17,080 audience, would you mind introducing yourself? 21 00:01:17,130 --> 00:01:22,400 Sure, I'm happy to. So I am the co-owner of who is 22 00:01:22,470 --> 00:01:25,560 the Brazilian in the mix. I am Co chair of the Brazil 23 00:01:25,570 --> 00:01:28,940 Canada Chamber of Commerce, which I just got reelected, 24 00:01:28,950 --> 00:01:33,380 which is always nice. And I'm a mentor to newcomers, 25 00:01:33,470 --> 00:01:36,820 women reentering the workforce, new grads and really anybody 26 00:01:36,830 --> 00:01:40,380 without a network. What I found was in my own 27 00:01:40,470 --> 00:01:44,860 career and then with Mellanox specifically, we hire newcomers 28 00:01:44,910 --> 00:01:47,600 and in fact I'm the only Canadian born person in the 29 00:01:47,610 --> 00:01:49,740 company. Everybody is from somewhere 30 00:01:49,750 --> 00:01:52,720 else. And since they had terrible 31 00:01:52,730 --> 00:01:56,580 stories of how they got here and and what they had to go through, 32 00:01:56,630 --> 00:02:00,000 I decided I would make it my mission to tell people, OK, this 33 00:02:00,010 --> 00:02:03,160 is what you can do. These are the strategies you can 34 00:02:03,170 --> 00:02:05,820 use so you don't have to go through all that terrible crap 35 00:02:05,830 --> 00:02:08,620 to get here. And I've actually spoken to lots 36 00:02:08,630 --> 00:02:12,900 of young lawyers and, you know, Brazil has a real sophistication 37 00:02:12,910 --> 00:02:16,180 when they're bringing, when lawyers are immigrating here. 38 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:20,480 And those who have actually done all the training to be both 39 00:02:20,490 --> 00:02:24,980 legal in Brazil and legal here are really, really good, really 40 00:02:24,990 --> 00:02:28,020 sophisticated. However, everybody needs help 41 00:02:28,030 --> 00:02:30,100 networking and I'm happy to do that. 42 00:02:30,150 --> 00:02:32,060 That's amazing. Thank you so much for your 43 00:02:32,070 --> 00:02:34,820 willingness to be here in the podcast today and also for all 44 00:02:34,830 --> 00:02:38,890 the work you do for for people all around the globe really who 45 00:02:38,900 --> 00:02:42,180 are coming here to Canada. And I've, I took the liberty of, 46 00:02:42,190 --> 00:02:44,640 you know, putting some questions together here. 47 00:02:44,750 --> 00:02:47,980 I watched a few of your previous podcasts as well, and I love 48 00:02:47,990 --> 00:02:50,920 learning about your story. From what I understand you, you 49 00:02:50,930 --> 00:02:53,540 grew up in somewhat of a countryside, part of the country 50 00:02:53,610 --> 00:02:57,060 and, and came to an industry that you didn't know much about. 51 00:02:57,130 --> 00:03:00,320 So it's amazing that you've, you know, just really built that for 52 00:03:00,330 --> 00:03:03,020 yourself and solve that first. Hand Well, you know, it's funny. 53 00:03:03,030 --> 00:03:05,440 I come from New Brunswick, which is a small province. 54 00:03:05,510 --> 00:03:08,620 I actually, it's funny I say that, but I only lived there in 55 00:03:08,630 --> 00:03:11,320 my teenage years. As a kid, I lived in Nova Scotia 56 00:03:11,330 --> 00:03:14,020 and then I went to Dalhousie University in Nova Scotia. 57 00:03:14,070 --> 00:03:17,340 But in those formative teenage years where you build your 58 00:03:17,350 --> 00:03:19,940 friends and you build your connections. 59 00:03:19,950 --> 00:03:23,140 And it's quite funny because it is a very rural area and my 60 00:03:23,150 --> 00:03:25,660 parents had retired by that point, living in a farm and my 61 00:03:25,670 --> 00:03:27,720 sister has an organic farm next door. 62 00:03:27,730 --> 00:03:31,790 But when when you know, Facebook, suddenly I was 63 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:34,690 reconnected to all the people I graduated from high school with 64 00:03:34,770 --> 00:03:38,090 and they went on to have successful lives in politics and 65 00:03:38,100 --> 00:03:41,060 business and in farming. It was wonderful to reconnect 66 00:03:41,070 --> 00:03:44,550 with those people, but it was also wonderful to see that the 67 00:03:44,620 --> 00:03:48,730 world now could connect online. It didn't have to be there. 68 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:53,400 And then in the next part of the career move is I came to came W 69 00:03:53,410 --> 00:03:55,950 to Ontario because everybody comes to Toronto looking for 70 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:58,370 jobs. And once we're here, I found 71 00:03:58,380 --> 00:04:03,120 myself, you know, at odds and did all the bartending jobs and 72 00:04:03,130 --> 00:04:04,980 all the waitering jobs and all that stuff. 73 00:04:05,210 --> 00:04:08,400 And I got a job at McClelland Stewart Publishers, a very 74 00:04:08,410 --> 00:04:10,510 beautiful publisher with lovely books. 75 00:04:10,730 --> 00:04:13,440 But we did The Handmaid's Tale. We did The English Patient Wants 76 00:04:13,450 --> 00:04:16,820 a big, big, lovely books and bright and early played a small 77 00:04:16,829 --> 00:04:18,720 part in them. And it worked there for 10 years 78 00:04:18,730 --> 00:04:20,880 and loved it. And however, we were brought by 79 00:04:20,890 --> 00:04:24,700 a German company and suddenly I was 40 years old, was out of a 80 00:04:24,710 --> 00:04:27,620 job and I was really overpaid in a dying industry. 81 00:04:27,630 --> 00:04:31,070 And so, you know, said, look, I want to start this straight 82 00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:33,520 forwarding company and I need you to be there. 83 00:04:33,610 --> 00:04:36,540 And so we started it and he actually started it. 84 00:04:36,550 --> 00:04:39,220 Then I, I sulked for four months and then I joined. 85 00:04:39,550 --> 00:04:42,520 And then, so then it's, it's funny, I barely knew what 86 00:04:42,530 --> 00:04:45,150 freight forwarding was. And then I owned the company and 87 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:48,230 so it was, it was crazy to learn about international shipping and 88 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:50,270 how it works and all this kind of stuff. 89 00:04:50,340 --> 00:04:53,950 And, but ultimately then as we started hiring people, we 90 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:57,130 realized what we needed and what we needed was that international 91 00:04:57,140 --> 00:04:59,490 expertise. We needed people who knew the 92 00:04:59,500 --> 00:05:02,390 home markets. We needed people who had a great 93 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:05,690 facility with language. And once that all got in place, 94 00:05:05,740 --> 00:05:09,570 I realized that my real value too was helping those people and 95 00:05:09,580 --> 00:05:14,090 others negative navigate what happens here in Canada, how we 96 00:05:14,100 --> 00:05:17,770 do business, you know, being kind of the gringo and the mix 97 00:05:18,490 --> 00:05:20,150 it. And we've never looked back. 98 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:24,640 It's been 20-3 years and it's been a wonderful ride with the 99 00:05:24,650 --> 00:05:26,690 company. And in addition to that, though, 100 00:05:26,700 --> 00:05:30,110 and it was Brazilian, and so they had lots of access to 101 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:34,590 Brazilian stuff, and that got me volunteering in different 102 00:05:34,750 --> 00:05:36,950 organizations, including the Brazil Canada Chamber of 103 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:41,510 Commerce, the BBC, and other communications. 104 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:44,130 And that's been really rewarding as well. 105 00:05:44,140 --> 00:05:47,350 Sometimes careers are completely accidental, no matter what you 106 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:48,650 do, no matter what you try to do. 107 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:51,330 Absolutely. And going into the topic of 108 00:05:51,340 --> 00:05:54,090 today's podcast, I'd love to hear a little bit about your 109 00:05:54,220 --> 00:05:58,950 views and your commentary specifically starting up on 110 00:05:59,020 --> 00:06:02,850 online presence and LinkedIn. So I've, I've heard some of your 111 00:06:02,860 --> 00:06:05,930 great comments about, you know, people should do this and that 112 00:06:05,940 --> 00:06:08,230 for a picture on LinkedIn, people should do, you know, 113 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:10,630 different, different things. And I love how practical those 114 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:12,660 are. So I'd love to start by asking 115 00:06:12,670 --> 00:06:16,180 what's something lawyers often do on LinkedIn that maybe looks 116 00:06:16,190 --> 00:06:19,520 strategic but could backfire when it comes to, you know, 117 00:06:19,530 --> 00:06:22,980 building trust, actually getting work, getting business? 118 00:06:22,990 --> 00:06:25,480 So there's a couple of things here that I think are very 119 00:06:25,490 --> 00:06:28,740 interesting. COVID was the great equalizer. 120 00:06:28,790 --> 00:06:32,580 Once COVID kicked in and people are working from home, you no 121 00:06:32,590 --> 00:06:36,720 longer had to reach out through the people who keep the gates 122 00:06:36,730 --> 00:06:39,290 closed. You suddenly could access the 123 00:06:39,300 --> 00:06:43,480 actual decision maker. And with that in play, I found 124 00:06:43,490 --> 00:06:46,880 more and more people could access the decision maker, but 125 00:06:46,890 --> 00:06:50,520 they weren't ready to access the decision maker because no matter 126 00:06:50,530 --> 00:06:53,640 how professional you were in person, no matter how good you 127 00:06:53,650 --> 00:06:57,410 are person, if your online presence doesn't make you look 128 00:06:57,420 --> 00:07:00,670 professional, then when you're reaching out, the other person 129 00:07:00,680 --> 00:07:02,790 is thinking, my God, who is this? 130 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:05,070 You know, they're just dying a little bit. 131 00:07:05,140 --> 00:07:08,590 So I try to get everybody to understand that we do judge a 132 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,740 book by its cover. And so you have to make sure 133 00:07:11,750 --> 00:07:15,410 that your LinkedIn and your other communications are all 134 00:07:15,420 --> 00:07:19,230 completely professional. And I am a big believer in 135 00:07:19,300 --> 00:07:20,990 understanding what you can control. 136 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:24,410 You can control this. These are, you know, people say, 137 00:07:24,420 --> 00:07:25,910 oh, well, it's out of my control. 138 00:07:25,920 --> 00:07:28,400 No, it's not. If you spent two hours on your 139 00:07:28,410 --> 00:07:32,800 LinkedIn profile, two hours, you could change the way people 140 00:07:32,810 --> 00:07:35,290 perceive you. Alright, that that is it Because 141 00:07:35,300 --> 00:07:37,890 while you're sleeping, people snooping and they're looking at 142 00:07:37,900 --> 00:07:39,290 your LinkedIn. But if you're LinkedIn is 143 00:07:39,300 --> 00:07:44,100 incomplete or if it's got links on it that don't connect to 144 00:07:44,110 --> 00:07:46,310 anywhere, if you've got, you know, some portfolio you haven't 145 00:07:46,320 --> 00:07:49,530 checked in ages, if you yourself haven't posted in weeks or 146 00:07:49,540 --> 00:07:51,070 months, that that's all ridiculous. 147 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:55,390 And so I always say, first of all, do the background banner 148 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:57,730 image and that's that long horizontal image. 149 00:07:57,780 --> 00:08:00,670 It is 20% of the profile we see on the screen. 150 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:05,170 So if you are a lawyer and you are an internationally trained 151 00:08:05,180 --> 00:08:08,390 lawyer who can work in Canada, then I want to see your home 152 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:10,330 flags. I want to see Canadian flags. 153 00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:13,310 I want to see handshakes. I want to see images that 154 00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:17,170 reinforce that. OK, I do not want to see nature, 155 00:08:17,180 --> 00:08:20,490 don't want to see flowers, don't want to see ME buttons, don't 156 00:08:20,500 --> 00:08:22,550 wanna see a quote from Nelson Mandela. 157 00:08:22,620 --> 00:08:26,770 I want to see something that really does make me think that 158 00:08:26,780 --> 00:08:28,860 you are a lawyer. OK. 159 00:08:28,900 --> 00:08:31,040 And we're talking about law in this particular case. 160 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:34,929 The next thing is the photo. Lawyers always do that very 161 00:08:34,940 --> 00:08:40,090 severe non smiling pose and and with the hands folded, right? 162 00:08:40,100 --> 00:08:43,030 They always do the hands folded. And I'm always saying, OK, 163 00:08:43,100 --> 00:08:45,790 that's not the lawyer I want. I want the lawyer who is 164 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:49,930 welcoming to me. And so I say smile, keep your 165 00:08:49,940 --> 00:08:52,310 hair under control. Wear a jacket. 166 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:56,220 For guys that's a white shirt and maybe a tie and a dark 167 00:08:56,230 --> 00:08:58,830 jacket. For women it is a simple blouse 168 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:01,950 and a jacket. Jackets are what professionals 169 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:04,450 wear. And then and just a pleasant 170 00:09:04,460 --> 00:09:07,270 warm smile. And all that does is make me 171 00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:10,130 stop two or three seconds longer on your profile when I'm 172 00:09:10,140 --> 00:09:12,930 shopping around for lawyers, if I'm shopping around for staff, 173 00:09:12,980 --> 00:09:15,510 if I'm shopping around for somebody who is professional, I 174 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:19,070 want them to look professional. And so in the names, I want one 175 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:21,490 first name, one last name. Brazilians have a gazillion 176 00:09:21,500 --> 00:09:23,760 names. And you know, when I look at the 177 00:09:23,770 --> 00:09:27,290 list of the BCBA, which is an organization I love, and then I 178 00:09:27,300 --> 00:09:29,900 see those names that I'm thinking, Oh my goodness, who 179 00:09:29,910 --> 00:09:32,410 the hell has five names? Well, plenty of people here. 180 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:34,590 So one first name, one last name. 181 00:09:34,700 --> 00:09:37,910 And then very important too, on your headline, which is the 182 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:40,090 characters under your name or something else. 183 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:42,110 LinkedIn doesn't really like it, but I like it. 184 00:09:42,180 --> 00:09:45,710 Put your credentials, your, your, the, the letters of your 185 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:49,020 degrees right beside your name because I want to see it front 186 00:09:49,030 --> 00:09:52,700 and centre what you've trained, been trained for because that 187 00:09:52,710 --> 00:09:55,600 shows me that you have the dedication to do it. 188 00:09:55,670 --> 00:09:57,700 So I want to see that right beside your name. 189 00:09:57,870 --> 00:10:00,820 Then under the underneath your headline, you have 260 190 00:10:00,830 --> 00:10:04,000 characters. I want to see the keywords, you 191 00:10:04,010 --> 00:10:06,400 know, if you, what kind of litigation you do, what kind of 192 00:10:06,410 --> 00:10:08,440 networking you networks you belong to. 193 00:10:08,450 --> 00:10:11,100 I want to know if you're multilingual, all of that stuff. 194 00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:13,410 Don't put your company name and your school name. 195 00:10:13,420 --> 00:10:16,700 Again, that's already going to show up on the right hand side 196 00:10:16,710 --> 00:10:19,690 of your profile. So in that 260 characters that 197 00:10:19,700 --> 00:10:23,050 goes to 4 lines. You can jam a lot in there. 198 00:10:23,130 --> 00:10:25,800 Then under contact information, fill it out. 199 00:10:25,890 --> 00:10:28,640 Please give me a phone number, please give me an e-mail. 200 00:10:28,650 --> 00:10:31,090 Don't give me your birthday, not gonna send you any gifts. 201 00:10:31,100 --> 00:10:33,440 I always said when I see people put their birthday and I think, 202 00:10:33,450 --> 00:10:36,410 well, I can steal your ID now. So don't put your birthday in. 203 00:10:36,500 --> 00:10:39,730 And in fact, I know plenty of people when your birthday comes 204 00:10:39,740 --> 00:10:42,830 up, that's when they delete you, OK, because you've got so much 205 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:45,090 activity on your profile and you're not going to notice. 206 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:48,410 So don't, don't give reason people a reason to say no. 207 00:10:48,500 --> 00:10:52,610 I also it's, it's funny, I've seen plenty of people who say, 208 00:10:52,620 --> 00:10:54,330 Oh, I don't like that person. They're Capricorn. 209 00:10:54,380 --> 00:10:57,670 And so if you have, you know, don't give people a reason to 210 00:10:57,680 --> 00:10:59,750 say no, That's what I say over and over again. 211 00:10:59,820 --> 00:11:02,420 So good contact, complete contact information. 212 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:06,710 And then from there, I think everybody should just remember 213 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:11,230 to have a complete about essay. And we really want to know 214 00:11:11,300 --> 00:11:13,740 something about you. You can have it both in 215 00:11:13,750 --> 00:11:17,120 paragraph form and in point form and just the key things that 216 00:11:17,130 --> 00:11:21,460 matter to you and make it long enough so that when I click read 217 00:11:21,470 --> 00:11:26,110 more, the algorithm of LinkedIn shows that you are that there's 218 00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:28,040 activity on your profile. Alright. 219 00:11:28,110 --> 00:11:30,400 And so you need it to be long enough that that happens. 220 00:11:30,490 --> 00:11:32,720 And then otherwise you're going to put your experience on there, 221 00:11:32,730 --> 00:11:34,430 you know, in reverse chronological order. 222 00:11:34,690 --> 00:11:38,140 If you have some outstanding volunteerism that happens at the 223 00:11:38,150 --> 00:11:42,100 very end of your profile, put it up in your essay and maybe even 224 00:11:42,110 --> 00:11:43,720 reference a little bit in your headline. 225 00:11:43,810 --> 00:11:47,780 OK, because the BBC is my volunteer work, but it's very 226 00:11:47,790 --> 00:11:49,680 definitely one of my key credentials. 227 00:11:49,750 --> 00:11:52,400 So I put it up at the very top and make sure that that is 228 00:11:52,490 --> 00:11:54,440 something front and centre that people can see. 229 00:11:54,510 --> 00:11:57,370 But it's, it's funny, I mean, I'm giving all these very 230 00:11:57,380 --> 00:12:01,130 practical comments, but I want to remind people why they're 231 00:12:01,140 --> 00:12:02,450 doing LinkedIn. All right? 232 00:12:02,860 --> 00:12:06,760 Number one, you're doing it so that people can find you online 233 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:10,130 and it'll be more likely they'll look there than they will on a 234 00:12:10,140 --> 00:12:13,290 website for your law firm. And the other thing that I think 235 00:12:13,300 --> 00:12:17,470 is super important for people to remember is that you can pick up 236 00:12:17,530 --> 00:12:21,870 all kinds of clients and business by having that profile 237 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:24,190 there, OK? I think that's something that's 238 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:29,090 very, very important. You know, as we've been hearing 239 00:12:29,100 --> 00:12:32,210 from lawyers around the world on this show, one thing that's 240 00:12:32,220 --> 00:12:35,690 universal is the challenge of managing massive amounts of case 241 00:12:35,700 --> 00:12:37,690 materials. Whether you're dealing with 242 00:12:37,700 --> 00:12:41,570 witness statements in Sydney or reviewing contracts in Chicago, 243 00:12:41,620 --> 00:12:45,550 the volume can be overwhelming. That's why I wanted to tell you 244 00:12:45,560 --> 00:12:49,750 about Rev. Instead of analyzing documents one at a time, you 245 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:54,890 upload everything to 1 workspace PDF's, audio recordings, video 246 00:12:54,900 --> 00:13:00,350 depositions, transcripts, Revs. AI analyzes them altogether and 247 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:04,030 spots connections you'd never catch working file by file. 248 00:13:04,100 --> 00:13:07,290 Every insight comes with clickable citations that take 249 00:13:07,300 --> 00:13:10,280 you right back to the source. So when the AI finds a 250 00:13:10,290 --> 00:13:13,500 contradiction between witness statements, you can verify it 251 00:13:13,510 --> 00:13:15,900 instantly. Whether you're a law student or 252 00:13:15,910 --> 00:13:19,460 practicing attorney building your international career, Rev 253 00:13:19,470 --> 00:13:22,700 Insights gives you that edge our guests always talk about. 254 00:13:22,710 --> 00:13:28,100 Check it out at rev.com. Perfect. 255 00:13:28,150 --> 00:13:31,960 Well, something that I, that I taught you go forward is also in 256 00:13:31,970 --> 00:13:34,320 this context of being a law student, right. 257 00:13:34,390 --> 00:13:37,820 So there's multiple different ways of being a law student 258 00:13:37,830 --> 00:13:40,780 right now in Canada, be it an internationally trained lawyer 259 00:13:40,790 --> 00:13:44,840 who is currently going through some additional credentials in 260 00:13:44,850 --> 00:13:46,560 Canada in order to become a lawyer here. 261 00:13:46,630 --> 00:13:49,640 And that doesn't have a lot of experience back home or in 262 00:13:49,650 --> 00:13:51,990 Canada. And you know, there's all these 263 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:54,290 different scenarios that we could put up here. 264 00:13:54,300 --> 00:13:57,320 But overall, what I hear a lot from law students is that they 265 00:13:57,330 --> 00:14:01,160 feel like they either don't have anything to post about or they 266 00:14:01,230 --> 00:14:04,490 can't post because they don't have, you know, a specific point 267 00:14:04,500 --> 00:14:07,220 of view or something like that. And, and you just mentioned that 268 00:14:07,230 --> 00:14:10,580 it would be important to keep up to date, you know, having posts 269 00:14:10,590 --> 00:14:13,240 going, have, you know, some activity going on. 270 00:14:13,370 --> 00:14:16,900 So I wanted to ask you, what's 1 type of post that maybe could 271 00:14:16,910 --> 00:14:20,260 work better for people who don't have necessarily some work 272 00:14:20,270 --> 00:14:24,060 experience or some specific point of view or something to, 273 00:14:24,070 --> 00:14:26,740 to necessarily teach? Is there, is there anything 274 00:14:26,750 --> 00:14:28,390 you've seen people doing that works? 275 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:31,050 Or is there something in your personal experience you believe 276 00:14:31,060 --> 00:14:33,920 that would be beneficial? I see people all the time post. 277 00:14:33,930 --> 00:14:36,400 I've just been promoted to this. I've just learned this 278 00:14:36,410 --> 00:14:37,900 certification. Great. 279 00:14:38,230 --> 00:14:42,880 However, I believe that if you were to post a decision just 280 00:14:42,890 --> 00:14:48,260 came down on X and I think that they clearly considered these 281 00:14:48,270 --> 00:14:50,560 issues as being more important than something else. 282 00:14:50,750 --> 00:14:54,810 So if in other words, you're posting a commentary on some 283 00:14:54,820 --> 00:14:58,120 decision that's in the news, alright, that makes you 284 00:14:58,190 --> 00:15:01,130 thoughtful, it makes you interactive with the LinkedIn 285 00:15:01,140 --> 00:15:02,880 algorithm. And I can't impress upon you how 286 00:15:02,890 --> 00:15:05,320 important that is because just because you're on LinkedIn 287 00:15:05,330 --> 00:15:07,410 doesn't mean your name is going to come up for anything. 288 00:15:07,420 --> 00:15:10,460 The algorithm works that the person who is more active on 289 00:15:10,470 --> 00:15:13,720 LinkedIn will rise higher than ones who aren't. 290 00:15:13,780 --> 00:15:16,580 So the best qualified person is not the person who gets the job. 291 00:15:16,650 --> 00:15:19,380 It is the person who has the balanced amount of activity. 292 00:15:19,670 --> 00:15:24,280 So I think if you spot someone else who has posted something 293 00:15:24,290 --> 00:15:27,880 about some topic that is hot, that is in the news, that is 294 00:15:27,890 --> 00:15:31,380 relevant, then sharing that with your comments. 295 00:15:31,430 --> 00:15:34,450 And so you know, saying, I'm just trying to think of a 296 00:15:34,460 --> 00:15:35,580 decision that might have come down. 297 00:15:35,660 --> 00:15:38,870 It can be anything from green space to there has been an 298 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:43,140 increase in unqualified people claiming to provide what could 299 00:15:43,150 --> 00:15:47,970 be conceived as legal advice. It, you know, how useful is 300 00:15:47,980 --> 00:15:50,190 small claims court, What are the differences? 301 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:52,140 You could even talk about what the differences are between 302 00:15:52,150 --> 00:15:54,870 Brazilian law and Canadian law or any kind of law around the 303 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:57,810 world, because I think the topics are actually endless. 304 00:15:58,100 --> 00:16:02,330 And here's the thing, ChatGPT is your friend. 305 00:16:02,420 --> 00:16:06,790 And So what I would do is certainly put in some prompts of 306 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:10,210 your opinion, your viewpoints and see what Chachi BT 307 00:16:10,220 --> 00:16:12,200 generates. And I can tell it ChatGPT 308 00:16:12,210 --> 00:16:17,750 article right away because it's 1000 words or it's 500 words, 309 00:16:17,820 --> 00:16:21,110 but you want the post that is 75 wins. 310 00:16:21,180 --> 00:16:22,680 OK. And then you're gonna look and 311 00:16:22,690 --> 00:16:25,710 see what CPT generates. You're going to tweak that to 312 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:27,100 make it. And really you're looking for 313 00:16:27,110 --> 00:16:28,670 the structure that it's providing. 314 00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:32,010 You're going to tweak it. And I think in 20 minutes you 315 00:16:32,020 --> 00:16:35,370 can have a post and doing 20 minutes once a week, you can 316 00:16:35,380 --> 00:16:37,550 have a very interesting post on something. 317 00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:40,700 So you know, you're going to cut and paste part of an article and 318 00:16:40,710 --> 00:16:44,180 you're going to say, I would like to comment on this. 319 00:16:44,190 --> 00:16:46,110 I agree. And I think they consider the 320 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:48,530 following points and then see what it generates. 321 00:16:48,580 --> 00:16:51,240 And then you have a post because people are always saying I don't 322 00:16:51,250 --> 00:16:52,810 have time. And they're also saying I'm 323 00:16:52,820 --> 00:16:55,280 worried about my English. The fact is that you do have 324 00:16:55,290 --> 00:16:58,190 time because everything is being done for you nowadays. 325 00:16:58,290 --> 00:17:02,430 And in my communications, I have 3 or 400 mails a day. 326 00:17:02,620 --> 00:17:06,030 No one can deal with three or 400 emails a day, not at all. 327 00:17:06,079 --> 00:17:09,010 So I am whipping through things as fast as possible. 328 00:17:09,099 --> 00:17:13,910 And I absolutely have many AI templates that I use for 329 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:16,380 different communications to make sure that things are speed up as 330 00:17:16,390 --> 00:17:18,640 quickly as possible. Because by and large, people 331 00:17:18,650 --> 00:17:21,500 have the same kind of problems. But in terms of the posts that 332 00:17:21,510 --> 00:17:24,950 you can do, and you can even do a post about your international 333 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:27,410 experience, the fact that you came to this country, why did 334 00:17:27,420 --> 00:17:29,690 you come here? You know, because if we're 335 00:17:29,700 --> 00:17:31,960 talking about Brazilians, we're talking about people who love 336 00:17:31,970 --> 00:17:34,710 their country, but they came to this country for some reason or 337 00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:36,510 other. So let's hear why. 338 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:41,370 Let's, it can be good and bad. It has to be short, it has to be 339 00:17:41,380 --> 00:17:44,630 relevant. And so you can do plot 340 00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:46,790 leadership, which means that you're going to write an article 341 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:49,020 about something new. You can do commentary, which 342 00:17:49,030 --> 00:17:51,680 means you've seen an article and you're commenting on it or 343 00:17:51,690 --> 00:17:54,230 you've seen someone else's post and you're commenting on it. 344 00:17:54,460 --> 00:17:58,140 And I will tell you that's a great strategy because that is 345 00:17:58,150 --> 00:18:01,890 also the way that you do connecting that your network. 346 00:18:01,960 --> 00:18:03,670 So let's talk about that for a second. 347 00:18:03,860 --> 00:18:08,450 The the way to network and online networking is really 348 00:18:08,500 --> 00:18:12,510 effective as you start identifying who you want to 349 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:15,670 target, whether it's a law firm and someone in that law firm or 350 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:17,840 it's a large organization and you were looking to be their 351 00:18:17,850 --> 00:18:20,270 counsel or whatever it is you're looking for. 352 00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:24,240 You find those individuals and if they post, you're going to 353 00:18:24,250 --> 00:18:27,000 not press connect or not. You're going to follow them, but 354 00:18:27,010 --> 00:18:29,480 you're not going to press connect and you're going to 355 00:18:30,770 --> 00:18:34,480 comment on whatever they posted. It is going to be thoughtful, it 356 00:18:34,490 --> 00:18:37,640 is going to be upbeat and it's going to have an open-ended 357 00:18:37,650 --> 00:18:39,620 question, non yes or no question. 358 00:18:39,670 --> 00:18:43,540 So somebody posts, my company is now doing XXX and you know, it's 359 00:18:43,550 --> 00:18:46,890 one of those banal, you know, boring posts and you're going to 360 00:18:46,900 --> 00:18:48,900 comment. It's so exciting that you moved 361 00:18:48,910 --> 00:18:51,840 in that direction. I have often thought that that 362 00:18:51,850 --> 00:18:53,980 would be the next thing you would do. 363 00:18:54,350 --> 00:18:56,410 What made you come to that decision? 364 00:18:57,370 --> 00:19:00,980 OK, And suddenly you're having a connection with this person. 365 00:19:01,270 --> 00:19:06,400 If they answer, then you actually have a warm connection 366 00:19:06,450 --> 00:19:10,520 when you press connect, OK. And so this is how you are 367 00:19:10,730 --> 00:19:13,540 treating it like a conversation and you're being a human being. 368 00:19:13,910 --> 00:19:17,800 And the, the how question, how did you come to that response? 369 00:19:17,810 --> 00:19:20,820 How did you feel when you, when this particular thing happened? 370 00:19:20,830 --> 00:19:24,320 Whatever it is, you can, you're, you're, you're really engaging 371 00:19:24,330 --> 00:19:28,300 people and you should do two or three a day, OK, Because again, 372 00:19:28,370 --> 00:19:32,080 the, how much you use LinkedIn and how much externalization and 373 00:19:32,090 --> 00:19:36,240 how much LinkedIn members come to you raise your profile. 374 00:19:36,330 --> 00:19:38,620 And I talk about LinkedIn all the time because it is our 375 00:19:38,630 --> 00:19:41,310 professional profile. Like people say, well, I'm a 376 00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:43,110 lawyer and a doctor, I don't really need it. 377 00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:45,230 Yes, you do. People are looking. 378 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:47,790 People are looking. And so make it as professional 379 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,590 as possible so that we can understand what you're doing. 380 00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:52,850 And it is a great way to connect with people. 381 00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:56,410 When you do the connect request, you're always send a note. 382 00:19:56,620 --> 00:20:01,450 And that note is never resume. That note is always asking its 383 00:20:01,460 --> 00:20:03,270 greet. Hello, Peter Hawkins, 384 00:20:03,340 --> 00:20:04,990 Compliment. You're terrific. 385 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:08,430 And ask for advice. I would like to know how to get 386 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:10,010 a job in Canada, whatever it is. OK. 387 00:20:10,200 --> 00:20:12,790 So yeah, it's great. Compliment, ask for advice. 388 00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:15,790 But before you do that, you're going to thoughtfully comment on 389 00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:17,200 their posts. What do you think of? 390 00:20:17,210 --> 00:20:19,210 That sounds amazing. That sounds like a great 391 00:20:19,220 --> 00:20:22,810 framework and as I said, so very actionable. 392 00:20:23,130 --> 00:20:25,530 That makes it especially valuable for people who are 393 00:20:25,540 --> 00:20:28,160 listening to this and who are maybe have exactly those 394 00:20:28,170 --> 00:20:30,580 objections, you know, thinking, hey, I have to juggle my 395 00:20:30,590 --> 00:20:33,360 billable targets. I have exams to take care of, 396 00:20:33,430 --> 00:20:36,620 but these are just small, consistent habits that can build 397 00:20:36,630 --> 00:20:39,990 up connections and can build up that network. 398 00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:43,140 And as you said, thought leadership commenting, so many 399 00:20:43,150 --> 00:20:44,850 options. You can get a good mix of 400 00:20:44,860 --> 00:20:47,200 everything there, right? I thought you just transition 401 00:20:47,210 --> 00:20:50,260 here moving forward to the end of our conversation today. 402 00:20:50,330 --> 00:20:53,880 I wanted to ask you also about we do build those connections 403 00:20:53,890 --> 00:20:57,920 and start getting people kind of rolling into my LinkedIn page, 404 00:20:57,930 --> 00:20:59,460 getting those conversations going. 405 00:20:59,470 --> 00:21:03,480 What's the good point of it? Do you feel like most of these 406 00:21:03,490 --> 00:21:06,100 conversations as they're fruitful and all of that, they 407 00:21:06,110 --> 00:21:10,040 should be moved into an into an in person interaction after 408 00:21:10,050 --> 00:21:13,440 that, should we, you know, be scheduling coffee chats and then 409 00:21:13,510 --> 00:21:16,800 getting to know those people in one-on-one settings, in person 410 00:21:16,810 --> 00:21:18,920 and all of that? Is that what you feel like the 411 00:21:18,930 --> 00:21:22,280 the natural transition should be and what young Laura should be 412 00:21:22,330 --> 00:21:24,620 striving for as they connect to more people? 413 00:21:24,790 --> 00:21:27,600 I'm going to say yes or no and I'm going to start with the no. 414 00:21:27,750 --> 00:21:32,730 I get asked to have a coffee chat five times a day and I 415 00:21:32,740 --> 00:21:35,400 don't have time for any of them. And they say, well, you drink 416 00:21:35,410 --> 00:21:37,560 coffee. Yes, I drink coffee at my desk. 417 00:21:37,650 --> 00:21:44,200 And So what I try to do is if a group of people want to contact 418 00:21:44,210 --> 00:21:47,900 me, I say, let's set up a zoom And even, you know, I can tell 419 00:21:47,910 --> 00:21:50,940 you a date and we can recruit everybody and you can all we can 420 00:21:50,950 --> 00:21:53,210 do a group Zoom and you can answer your basic questions 421 00:21:53,220 --> 00:21:55,320 there. And then we can decide what to 422 00:21:55,330 --> 00:21:57,380 do next. Because sometimes the coffee 423 00:21:57,390 --> 00:22:00,110 chat is an informational chat. They're not asking for job, 424 00:22:00,120 --> 00:22:01,460 they're looking For more information. 425 00:22:01,530 --> 00:22:03,920 But people do want that personal touch. 426 00:22:03,930 --> 00:22:06,270 I'm one person and I can't talk to everybody. 427 00:22:06,380 --> 00:22:10,280 You know it, it has been, I've actually mentored more than 428 00:22:10,290 --> 00:22:13,340 10,000 people in the last 15 years. 429 00:22:13,350 --> 00:22:15,760 And so I, you know, I don't have time. 430 00:22:15,850 --> 00:22:18,870 That's all there is to it. So I don't think an in person 431 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:23,940 meeting is valuable unless there is a real movement forward in 432 00:22:23,950 --> 00:22:26,920 some particular action. You're up for potential 433 00:22:26,930 --> 00:22:30,960 interview, you're doing some coaching, there's something you 434 00:22:30,970 --> 00:22:33,200 can work together and you'll have to remember too. 435 00:22:33,210 --> 00:22:36,100 It's a give and take. You can't just be asking for 436 00:22:36,110 --> 00:22:38,460 something, you have to be offering something. 437 00:22:38,550 --> 00:22:41,820 And what people do to me, which I just die over what they offer 438 00:22:41,830 --> 00:22:46,600 me is more people who need help. I'm always like, don't do that 439 00:22:46,610 --> 00:22:48,980 to me. You help them, now you can help 440 00:22:48,990 --> 00:22:50,740 them. You don't need me, you can do 441 00:22:50,750 --> 00:22:52,320 it. And so that is something that 442 00:22:52,330 --> 00:22:56,110 makes me cringe. However, on the other side of 443 00:22:56,120 --> 00:23:00,980 things, where the, the, the connection is really valuable is 444 00:23:00,990 --> 00:23:05,860 if you identify an event where you both can go and meet at that 445 00:23:05,870 --> 00:23:07,140 event. OK. 446 00:23:07,230 --> 00:23:11,220 And then in those cases, when you go up, be sure and say your 447 00:23:11,230 --> 00:23:14,220 first name and your last name. The number of people who come up 448 00:23:14,230 --> 00:23:17,640 to me and say, hi, I'm Shuang. And I say wonderful. 449 00:23:17,710 --> 00:23:20,680 I know more than 30 Swans. Which one are you? 450 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:24,420 And because I've only met people online or on Zoom and you look 451 00:23:24,430 --> 00:23:27,980 very different in person. And it is going to those 452 00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:31,750 introducing yourself and again, looking like your picture. 453 00:23:31,810 --> 00:23:34,850 So don't do a glamour shot with all kinds of makeup. 454 00:23:34,860 --> 00:23:37,230 Look like your picture, OK? If you wear glasses, wear 455 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,570 glasses in the picture. And so then you can come in and 456 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:42,710 make that connection and say hello. 457 00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:45,270 And then people see if they really like you. 458 00:23:45,420 --> 00:23:47,690 And that's when, of course, you need your elevator pitch. 459 00:23:47,700 --> 00:23:52,310 And your elevator pitch is also the first line of your European 460 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:56,170 essay. So Hi, I'm Peter Hawkins, and I 461 00:23:56,180 --> 00:23:59,930 was a lawyer in Brazil, and now I'm studying here, Osgood, and I 462 00:23:59,940 --> 00:24:01,670 am looking for opportunities here. 463 00:24:01,740 --> 00:24:06,790 OK, You make it very, very clear and very short. 5 seconds, OK? 464 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:10,090 Because it's how you greet yourself and how you greet the 465 00:24:10,100 --> 00:24:12,060 new person. So for instance, Claudia, how 466 00:24:12,070 --> 00:24:15,200 would you cover yourself with if I came up and you saw me and you 467 00:24:15,210 --> 00:24:16,340 were coming up, what would you say? 468 00:24:16,350 --> 00:24:18,280 I'll probably. Say hi, I'm Claudia Claus. 469 00:24:18,290 --> 00:24:22,420 I was a lawyer in Brazil and now I'm student at UFT and I'm about 470 00:24:22,430 --> 00:24:25,900 to start my articling in real estate and corporate law and I'm 471 00:24:25,950 --> 00:24:27,800 really interested in knowing more people in the. 472 00:24:27,810 --> 00:24:28,870 Field. Fantastic. 473 00:24:29,130 --> 00:24:30,140 That's it. Simple. 474 00:24:30,150 --> 00:24:32,320 I know exactly who you are. Nice smile. 475 00:24:32,410 --> 00:24:35,340 That's that's all you need. But going to a networking 476 00:24:35,350 --> 00:24:38,360 function, going to any public function and not shaking the 477 00:24:38,370 --> 00:24:41,640 hand of every person there means you failed. 478 00:24:41,690 --> 00:24:44,460 OK, I don't know if you ever saw me in action, but I say hello to 479 00:24:44,470 --> 00:24:46,440 everybody. I was going to ask about that, 480 00:24:46,450 --> 00:24:49,200 you know, to wrap up today's episode, if that was natural to 481 00:24:49,210 --> 00:24:51,620 you. If you put an effort and now 482 00:24:51,630 --> 00:24:55,310 it's it happens more and more and how can more people do that? 483 00:24:55,380 --> 00:24:57,600 You just do it. You everybody wants to meet 484 00:24:57,610 --> 00:24:59,630 somebody. If you stand in the corner and 485 00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:03,370 talk to the person you came with the entire time, you failed, OK, 486 00:25:03,420 --> 00:25:05,370 At every event. Hello. 487 00:25:05,380 --> 00:25:06,870 Hi. I'm Claudio Claus. 488 00:25:06,980 --> 00:25:10,590 You know, I was Laurie in Brazil and now I'm at UT, you know, and 489 00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,230 you know, especially interested in real estate if you bought a 490 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:16,930 house lately, you know, and just talk to everyone, shake their 491 00:25:16,940 --> 00:25:19,250 hands, ask a follow up question, OK. 492 00:25:19,300 --> 00:25:22,250 It's a minimum 2 questions and it's a minimum of 7 minutes with 493 00:25:22,260 --> 00:25:24,830 each person, OK? Which makes it hard to shake 494 00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:27,110 hands with everybody, but you're still going to work the room. 495 00:25:27,120 --> 00:25:29,640 If you're a 2 hour event, you have time to shake hands with 496 00:25:29,650 --> 00:25:31,070 everybody in the room. OK. 497 00:25:31,140 --> 00:25:33,470 And the other thing too is I break up groups. 498 00:25:33,540 --> 00:25:34,910 Group is talking. I break in. 499 00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:38,200 Hi, everybody, I'm Peter. Shake hands and I just take 500 00:25:38,210 --> 00:25:40,170 over. It is and then I go to the next 501 00:25:40,180 --> 00:25:42,130 group and then go back talking about whatever they were talking 502 00:25:42,140 --> 00:25:44,470 about. But the fact is I am their 503 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:46,330 networking. Everybody will know who I am and 504 00:25:46,340 --> 00:25:48,510 I finished in that room. Everybody should know who you 505 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:49,830 are. Everybody should know who 506 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:51,970 everyone is and your audience, OK. 507 00:25:52,020 --> 00:25:54,910 That is what networking is, making sure they know who you 508 00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:57,630 are, they know what you have to offer and they like. 509 00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:00,630 You, and I must say this to people who are listening and who 510 00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,750 are maybe going to go to an event where Peter is, he's 511 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:05,850 amazing at introducing you to other people too. 512 00:26:05,860 --> 00:26:08,150 I've, I've found that you have that superpower of being a 513 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:09,460 connector. You're like, oh, you're 514 00:26:09,470 --> 00:26:10,700 studying. Well, let me introduce you to 515 00:26:10,710 --> 00:26:12,120 the lawyers who are here in the event. 516 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:14,430 And you just did that. It was just fantastic. 517 00:26:14,500 --> 00:26:17,110 I'm so glad you said that because what I tried to do with 518 00:26:17,120 --> 00:26:19,980 everybody, when we do organize those events, I have these 519 00:26:20,030 --> 00:26:24,520 ambassadors, the, that my volunteers who were all trained 520 00:26:24,530 --> 00:26:26,860 to do just that too. They find, you know. 521 00:26:26,870 --> 00:26:28,970 Oh, so you're a lawyer. Let me introduce you to somebody 522 00:26:28,980 --> 00:26:30,920 else. No one should stand alone and 523 00:26:30,930 --> 00:26:33,180 you should never, you know, be talking to the person who 524 00:26:33,190 --> 00:26:35,500 brought you. OK, So we go ahead and just pull 525 00:26:35,510 --> 00:26:38,440 them in, have a conversation. And I try to give that in, you 526 00:26:38,450 --> 00:26:39,840 know. So what do you do? 527 00:26:39,850 --> 00:26:41,980 Oh, I sell widgets. And what do you do? 528 00:26:41,990 --> 00:26:45,460 I do contracts and I say, great, he sells stuff. 529 00:26:45,470 --> 00:26:47,740 You create contracts, have a conversation. 530 00:26:47,810 --> 00:26:50,040 And are you, you know, are you looking for a place to sell? 531 00:26:50,050 --> 00:26:52,060 Maybe they have some contacts there too. 532 00:26:52,070 --> 00:26:54,860 And then I just walk away and let them do it because again, as 533 00:26:54,870 --> 00:26:56,910 a connector, I'm not the guy who's going to run the 534 00:26:56,920 --> 00:26:59,980 conversation. I can, but it'll be about me and 535 00:26:59,990 --> 00:27:02,130 it should be about you. Well, that's amazing. 536 00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:04,840 Thank you so much for all these insights, Peter. 537 00:27:04,890 --> 00:27:08,300 Much appreciated to to get to know a little more about know 538 00:27:08,310 --> 00:27:12,660 your thoughts and how you operate as well in that that 539 00:27:12,670 --> 00:27:15,020 scenario that feels like you're a very natural chew. 540 00:27:15,070 --> 00:27:17,200 So really appreciate your thoughts and and really 541 00:27:17,210 --> 00:27:19,280 appreciate your time to be here in the podcast today. 542 00:27:19,290 --> 00:27:22,040 Claudia is my absolute pleasure and I, I hope people find it 543 00:27:22,050 --> 00:27:25,740 valuable and it's been a real delight to talk to you and to 544 00:27:25,830 --> 00:27:27,280 learn a little bit more about you. 545 00:27:27,350 --> 00:27:32,580 I was actually at a BCBA call and people were saying the 546 00:27:32,590 --> 00:27:35,260 nicest things about you. You know, congratulations, 547 00:27:35,270 --> 00:27:36,700 you're, you're doing something right. 548 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:38,820 That's, that's very good to know. 549 00:27:38,910 --> 00:27:41,220 Thank you so much and thank you all for tuning into today's 550 00:27:41,230 --> 00:27:42,720 episode and we'll see you on the next one.