Welcome back to finding the edge podcast.
I'm Garrett volume, and today we have on Chad Longworth.
This is Chad second time on the podcast, and if you haven't
already listened to his first episode, we encourage you to
check that out. I'll have a link for that in the
description. Also, if you enjoy today's
podcast and what Chad has to say here, then we'd also encourage
you to follow Chad on social media and check out his website.
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So if you want to support Chad and you like what he has to say
here, make sure to check the link in the description for all
that. Regardless, we are super excited
to share this this conversation today with you.
We have this conversation back in the spring of 2022 and so
some of the stuff we discussed might be a little bit.
Dated we're talking about the shift for a moment and maybe
some of the stuff we said there that ship might have sailed.
But regardless, today's episode is Jam-packed with good stuff.
Start to finish. So, without further Ado, I hope
you guys enjoyed today's podcast, with Chad Longworth
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Chad, it's great to have you back.
Yeah, dude. Sell what, where's your?
Where's your head been at lately.
Like what have you been? Mulling over.
Did you see me the other day? What DM did you send me the
other day on Twitter like hornets.
Nests on Twitter lately? Fair enough, although no one I
sent you was about wearing a helmet and yeah, but but that
also is linked to you talking about wearing different sort of
sunglasses and in some ways I wish I wish you could get Jared
Fuller on here because he was talking about colors Robert
about colors. Yeah.
Before but I haven't seen any studies on it like that's where
I really want to see the studies but this gets Into a bunch of
stuff about like you could, you could test this stuff out.
As far as what colors work best for people through muscle
testing, so yeah, those really since I talked to Robert
Riggins, year ago, on my podcast, it just like this
endless Rabbit Hole of perception, like, perception in
training and like, how athletes are interacting with with
Pitches lights. And my son, who's 8 played weeks
ago, three weeks ago. Maybe I can't remember, but he
didn't, he didn't he like, swung and missed a lot that day, and
never speak to mrs. A lot, but he swung and missed a
lot that day. Is this first games of the year?
He's a nervous, whatever, but I asked you what to do, I'm not
mad. You struck out.
But why, why are you swinging missing so much today?
Like what do you think was going on today?
That I couldn't see the ball too bright.
And so I just kind of whatever man, whatever.
That's just an excuse, but then, you know, I've been thinking
about that like, since that day and then I saw the sunglasses
tweet and I was thinking like we hit if you training inside a
lot, like we hid inside a lot. In your processing, visual
information inside in a cave. And then I imagine like night
games are similar to the light conditions that are inside of
the cage. But then what if you play during
the day? So, what if you train inside in
that light and then you play during the day?
Are you is your is the information processing that you
did inside even valuable? Or you know when the sunlight is
different, High Sky, no clouds bright middle of the Day game.
Are you processing information? The same way that you did when
you train and so is it even valuable?
Train or how do you match the light conditions closer to the
environment you trained in in a day game?
Where we sit me down the rabbit hole of Oakley lenses and likely
how they build lenses to filter light?
And you know, contrast seem contrast.
That's hitting though, like to me that's hitting like those
rabbit holes of. Like, trying to understand.
It's not think anybody that listens to this podcast, at
least, it's not like you can't draw every conclusion to this
one set of mechanics that ideal style.
The reason why you hit It's like there's a lot of things have
reasons why you don't hit and it's hard to pinpoint one of
them and that, that that that those like condition things and
sunglasses. While you hit something that I
found, really interesting. Anyway that he what the hell
going on with something that also derived from my kids, it's
like, you know, you've got this and I think I read something.
There's I think there's a study or something out there about
About. Like how your vision focuses
with something over top of your eyes versus not interesting?
It's so like should hitters always hit with something over
top of their eyes like either hat or a helmet, even the
helmet. Like should you do lips with a
helmet on because your field of vision, you want to have the
same field of vision? The same thing that you have in
a game you know, tracking ball flight I'm in again, is another
perception equation that Yeah, absolutely well and that's
that's where I'm trying to send over a few images that I took
out of a book and I haven't looked at them a long time so I
wanted to use it kind of deals with some of the things that you
brought up with. So yeah there's just so much
there it's like where to start but I would start with I think
this is why again I'm going to keep harping this ecological
Dynamics. I think ecological Dynamics or
has can can at least help guide us and kind of help our search
process. So for example Right?
One of the main main things is complexity right and so we're
Dynamic complex or dynamic. What is it or adaptive complex
systems or dynamically adaptive complex systems and so therefore
That means that. Just because you put in one
input, doesn't necessarily mean that you're going to get, you
know, a plus b equals c. Like sometimes there because
there are other factors in there even though you put in a or b
you don't always get see and and there's an element of
non-linearity to it. And so that I think we have to
remember that we're dealing with complex adaptive systems and I
don't think people realize that maybe they don't actually even
understand what, what that means.
It's just a buzzword and so I don't know if that's something
that needs to get broken down or not.
But what are your your thoughts on unjust that basic idea and
concept? Yeah I don't think that I don't
think that people grasp how complex like the human system is
like in general like I think they know it's just like scan
over you know people just think that things work because they
work you know. Yeah but they think it's like
the computer. I turn the computer on and I
could type the numbers in and whatever simple oh but don't
get, don't get me started on. I've just started reading this
book. On the mind. and how people have
equated it to a machine and how that that actually isn't Is that
the best way to describe it? Because it's really not a
machine. Right.
You know, I was thinking I was in Florida.
My daughter had cheer competition in Florida this past
weekend and I'm walking, I'm walking it.
We went to Disney World for two days before the competition, and
I'm walking Force. That's what this world can walk.
And I'm thinking as I'm walking, like, how amazing walking is
like the fact that you can not fall over, Is amazing.
Like what? No one Falls over walking but
people take that for granted. It's like walking is amazing.
The fact that we can just not fall on.
Two legs is crazy. You know we cannot fall we like
stepping a pothole and not fall. You can step on an uneven ground
and not fall but that and you're not even thinking about it like
your body's not even, you're not even.
You just adapting to whatever you're on, it's like, people
take that for granted, you know, that's another thing that people
take for granted. It's funny because we got into
speaking of blogging and Disneyworld, my daughter was
talking about how funny she thinks somebody we know walk and
she was kind of kind of like walking like him.
Hmm. As it will.
Does he fall over? He's like no.
And why does it matter how? How he walked he doesn't fall
over you know everybody walks uniquely to their style but if
the first principle is don't fall over and he doesn't fall
over. What is the difference?
Does matter how he walked? You know you walk like you I
walk like me and our bodies in this constant state of finding
balance. Automatically in its no one
Falls over. It's like, amazing is amazing
and that may sound geeky or whatever, but it really is like,
One of the simplest tasks that you think is so simple, like you
learn to do at such a young age and your body figures it out.
Well, and that goes back to this, like, how do we know
things? Like I think people take for
granted or don't really realize how we actually know and
understand things we all think about it.
Oh it's just up here in my brain and yeah think about it in terms
of the way that they think and the the internal dialogue that
goes on and there's so much in our life that like our knowledge
is actually. So there's this idea of
distributed cognition and how the our knowledge The world is
actually embodied and it resides within our body.
It's not just in our brain and so When it comes to sport, it's
very much. Like, I don't know if we've
talked about this before, but it's like, I don't know how to
explain it. I just know how I can just show
you like, hey, let's just do this together.
So it's this, this, it's more about participatory knowing
versus explanatory or head knowledge.
And So, within ecological Dynamics, you have this idea of
knowledge about versus knowledge of And knowledge about being
head, knowledge and knowledge of being experiential knowledge.
Why do you think that, why do you think that people draw?
That's interesting, but do you think that people draw the
conclusion that if you learn about mechanics or whatever,
like you're going to be able to do them?
Well, that's something that people forget.
It's there are thinking of learning in from slowly because
of the school system. Well, think of like, right that
if you think about the income, the culture that we've been
embedded in, right? Western culture, very
scientific. Everything is about in the head
if you can't scientifically prove it.
Then it kind of isn't real. So then we dismiss or even
though we forget that anecdotes are you know, still a Arm of
evidence. It might not be the strongest
form of evidence, but I think it's because of that we dismiss
very easily because it's not the highest form of edit evidence
anecdotes and personal experience.
And so in the, you know, based upon our like culture, Like we
tend to dismiss a lot of the experiential stuff as being not
very like we minimize it. And I think that's the reason
why people assume that the best way to teach something because
of our education system is head knowledge.
I mean, what is most of school just here?
I say something to you and then you have to memorize it or read
a textbook and then regurgitate it back to me.
And it's way different like the yes that's at least my theory.
I mean, people think that Because people think that mean,
I'll give you an example. And I talked about this on
Twitter, a little bit recently, I haven't put the numbers date
out quite yet, but I got to train a high school.
A homeschooled high school team this past offseason.
Every player all the coaches. Everybody came in.
Everybody did what I wrote coaches were involved on the
floor. No one gave.
Anyone any explicit instructions other than just Bring the bat
fast. Try to hit the ball hard, not on
the ground. And here's, here's a bunch of
different tasks do that. Here's the offset machine.
Here's the to play timing. Here's the long bat.
Here's the short bat, here's the skinny bats, here's the plyos.
Here's some flips. Here's the randomized machine
and no one told anyone how to do it.
They were up like four runs a game from last year. you know,
their offensive production was Almost three times as good and
no one quote fingers. I don't know if this is a video
podcast or not but Pope fingers learned.
Anything they learn anything because they don't need to learn
anything I use it. I do they learn smart guy.
Didn't learn the way that that nationally people would rush
stand. Yeah.
Right? And that's why I use my quote
fingers. They didn't learn anything.
I didn't teach them about Annex but they they improved clearly.
I've got the data that shows how much they improved in the gym
and then when they went to the field, what they're run
production and offensive stats were on the field, you know, So,
it's like, but but in my world and I, it's funny because I was
thinking about this the other day, too.
I get all's emails text messages every day about them, her,
somebody wanting less. Mmm.
And I usually just ask for video and then just kind of tell them
something about on the video. So it's saved me like an hour of
my time that I could be spending with my kids because that's kind
of they just I guess one security blanket of knowing
Something. And so I just give them
something because that's all they're digging for it anyway.
But people that do come train with us and it's like they gonna
they come in thinking, they're going to learn again.
Learn something. I'm going to teach them
something biomechanic wise, you know, and I don't, but you
improve. So what are you after?
What do you actually want to be a better player?
You want to learn something? Because you don't have to and I
you I was going to make this point.
I use this guy a lot in my conversation, he may be a smart
guy. Doesn't strike me as a real
smart guy, that's why I use him, but he might be, I don't know.
Yasiel Puig probably doesn't know much about Mechanics he
probably couldn't but he he's a pretty darn good hitter.
You know, in his time people say why it's not a baseball now?
It's like the dude was amazing and he you know, he licked his
back and so yeah probably doesn't know anything but it's
like you don't have to be smart or learn anything.
Again, I'm generalizing Yasiel Puig only make that is he like
licked his Bat did all this crazy stuff on the field as just
Somebody that doesn't know anything, but can just destroy
baseballs at the highest level of baseball or Manny Ramirez,
like your body May these, another one like Manny gets on,
you know, he goes to teacher man, and he goes to all these
people now and he's like, you were the one that can explain
what I did. And it's like, Any why does it
matter? Why does it matter how wide how
anyone can explain anything? You mashed 600 homers or
whatever. However when you hit as probably
one of the Bree greatest, right-handed, hitters of all
time. Why does it matter that anyone?
Can I can explain what you did. You hit 600 homers?
On just oftentimes balls that no human being should be able to
hit much less hit argue hit out. It's like maybe you were just a
good at the task of, for whatever reason, who knows why,
you know, who knows why, you know, I can, I can speak as
somebody who made it to pro ball, who was an average pro
ball player with top-level athleticism skills, my dad was a
division. One basketball player I worked
out with major Leaguer, Andre Ethier with my workout partner,
in at, in Arizona, in the offseason, when I went, I went
to Athletes Performance, which is now x 0.
So train there in the offseason, there's nothing athletically
that I could do that. Anyone else could do.
But I did, but I couldn't, I couldn't like play the game
well, and they could and, you know, at the time I thought my
lack of knowledge. So I tried to learn a lot about
the swing or hitting or whatever and it's like, it wasn't that at
all, you know, it wasn't that at all.
It was fact that when the picture got on the mound and he
was throwing me bitches just couldn't adapt well enough, I
had the skills, I had the tools, I had the bat speed, there were
some physical things that I know now that I would have Oregon
would have tried to improve on, which is kind of down another
Rabbit Hole of, like, why? No one caught these things then
because but I don't think we tied them to maybe performance
just kind of something like some limitations.
I had in my low back in my hips that I couldn't get to certain
balls that I if I would have been anatomically different,
maybe not different. But like physically different,
maybe a little more, maybe a little more on the Loose mover
side than the tight mover side, I could have gotten to better
think that's why I didn't pull balls very well.
This, my hips were so locked up specially my left one because
I'm a right-handed hitter that could get to them to pull them
physically. So, you know, it wasn't my lack
of knowledge, like I thought it was known, it wasn't man, he had
no knowledge again, clearly, he talks about it now but he
couldn't even explain what he did.
I said this before on podcast. If you gave Major Leaguers truth
serum, you gave them. You seen Ant-Man and wasp?
Truth serum? You can truth serum and ask
them, like, what, how do they hit the ball?
They would all say, I have. No, just kind of get up there
and get in my stance. Try to be on time and for some
how I swing where the ball is. All that block.
I don't know how, I don't know how I had Blake treinen to do
steamer, but I do. Well, I mean you put you
personally have had that experience where you been there.
You're like I don't know how I hit that ball like that.
Had some I saw Uncle Wicked movement at the end of just I
hit it, you know, or like I was I was thinking fastball and I
hit the curveball Like, I know I've done it, I've experienced
it. Yeah and that's that's the thing
of to me, I think it can be explained by this idea and
concept of flow. like when you're in a flow State, when
you're fully immersed, in what you're doing, like you you lose
all sense of time, you lose sense of self, you become one
with the environment. And and to me that's that's the
state that you're in. You're not it's not a highly
cognitive intellectual State. And I think that's the part
where, for example, why certain coaches are way better than
others, because they might not know, all the most technical
information, but to keep it really simple for the athletes
that are able to connect with them, on an emotional level like
there. To me, like an ecological
approach, kind of helps explain this, their perceptually attuned
to the athlete, to the environment, how the energy in
the environment. There's an energy exchange
that's going on there and they're able to be sensitive to
that and are able to help nudge and kind of manage that
environment to help the athlete perform their best.
And that doesn't always mean giving them right.
Something mechanical or it does well because they, you know,
going back to what you're talking about the truth serum.
Well when you talk to those guys, they'll tell you stuff as
far as how they hit whatever like you talk to Albert, Pujols
or Alex Rodriguez, will tell you they swing down to the ball.
Even Mike Trout says all this, why would you ask?
Why do they say this stuff when they don't do it?
Because that's what coaches, their coaches have told them?
That's what they do. And that's how they hit really
well. Like yep.
So charging throwing, you know, it's the it's the burnt Nikolai
Bernstein the repetition of outcome and not the rib dish.
Of movement or repetition repetition.
It's it's like they they pulled themselves enough over and over
and over again, that they felt this way when they got the
outcome they wanted. So it had to be because they
felt this way and it's like, nah I mean I know you felt that way
and I'm not, I will never tell you you're wrong because you're
not wrong. That's how you failed a few
hundred percent felt that way, but not everybody should.
Should try to feel that way because that may not give you
the repetition of outcome, you're looking for.
You got a hit, you got to hit rocket line drives like you have
to you're going to play the game for.
As long as you can play it, you have to hit rocket line drives.
You have to get in fastball counts and hit fast balls for a
rocket line drives. That sometimes go over the
fence, sometimes they fall for doubles, sometimes they're
rocketed through the six hole. Sometimes they're hit, ask
somebody but you got hit a bunch of them.
However you feel doing that. You're free to develop, you
know, clearly a rod and proud. All these guys say these things.
They're not wrong. That's how they feel.
That's how they got the outfit and I think, no, I talked to
Fred laters about this. You know, some guys need to feel
up, some guys need to feel down. Like you need to feel all the
ways to get the outcome. You're it's about the outcome,
like it's about the batted ball outcome.
No. Caleb says that a lot like why
don't we just not always start at the batted ball outcome and
work back. It gives you the outcome.
Well, we also use did what every on that.
Not everybody agrees on that but that's their replies in agree.
On what the principles are. Right.
We can't agree that swinging the back fast.
It's a good thing because whatever you know I kind of been
harping on that lately on Twitter's like come on like
there's bad speed is tremendous Advantage.
If you're going to stand out in front of Scouts and evaluators
you want to stand out like a sore thumb, hey massive bat
speed. But I think it's also Lord
rattling. Okay so this was might be a good
good back and forth. I'm not I'm not saying that I'm
against bat speed, but I would say I'd prize contact ability
first and then bat speed because I can develop bat speed much
easier. It's much more of a linear
progression to develop at speed than it is to develop contact
ability. yeah, so for sure because That's pretty good.
Bat speed is going to take so long to develop that along the
way like basketball skills or something that You should if the
whole picture is back speed then like back to ball skills, along
the way should be the, I'm gonna use my quote fingers, should be
the focus because we're it's a given like we're trying to hit
all the research. All the studies that have been
reviewed done on back on way to bats and bat speed like 100 150
swings is you and I have talked about this because like we're
trying to hit back number with a different Batman of way to Bath
and a lot of different ways and a lot of different paths.
We're just trying to hit that number and within that number,
you know, I've got the Lefty swag inch and a half diameter
way to bath. Now that we hit plyos with So
that's attached challenge that we're developing back to ball
skills. You know, we're doing to Plate
offset machine. Fastball, we did three play
yesterday with smaller spacing between the plates and witching
way more. Often that was with the axe bat,
long Matt short bat set, which is back to ball skills, but it's
also way too bad. We're trying to hit that bat
speed number for training. These things aren't like done
Standalone. Like they aren't done.
That's be, we do some raw bat speed stuff where we're not
hitting a ball but like we're not just going to do that.
Like, there's always going to be some passion talent and people
people on Twitter say, you know, why is he guys that have massive
fast speed? The can't hit.
Well, yeah, of course. That's true too.
You know, if you just hit, if you just train, raw, bat speed.
And all you ever do is just kind of like, Daddy hack raw bat
speed off the tee. Then, of course your basketball
skills are not going to be very Duh, of course not but don't
generalize everybody that that has to train for bat speed has a
bat speed. Grand picture to just you know
taking daddy hacks off the tee and just chasing bats.
Be like, that's not what we're doing.
Nope, maybe I could paint that picture bet.
Well, and that's that. I think is the point like of the
messaging in the same way that for the longest time with
Driveline on V Lo it was like, okay everybody's chasing.
Well actually this is a better analogy weight room.
You got to get in the weight room.
You're really strong great. Yeah.
And then I have kids that and I know that I've guys who have
gotten so good in the weight room that they're not, they're
not the best player on the field anymore because we Sold them.
I'm going to be like, I'm going to put it bluntly.
I guess, we sold them this lie. That if you get really strong in
the weight room, you will be better on the field.
So then they spent all this time, get really good at the
weight room and they say, they stopped focusing as much on the
field and then and then it and then they ended up not playing
as much and now they're powerlifters.
It's like great man, like you up but that wasn't why you went
into the weight room. And so, I guess that's kind of
the same thing with with a lot of these different things of
going. What you said, first principles
of agreeing on, what is the outcome that we're looking for?
And so when you go back to and you break it down because I feel
like ecological, an ecological approach really helps you hone
in because like what some of its basic fundamentals is
understanding the problem. And we can understand the
problem, then you can then you can like you said before you
just engine reverse, you reverse engineer it.
And so for example, okay let's just say, hit the ball really
hard on a line, you know, with and see this is it goes back to
messaging, right? And some of it is When, when we
have to understand the context in which the messaging occurred,
right? Hit the ball in the air.
Right. And then the flyball Revolution.
Well that was in the context of everybody hitting ground balls
when it's not like when I say no wind drives you know what
everybody's been saying that forever like that that is not
new and and that's where in some levels.
It's kind of just really strange in the sense of How is it that
we got away from something that was super, super fundamental
forever ago. I've just hit hard line drives
like everybody used to agree on that.
You know how it's like, because of flyball Revolution backside
ground balls, but it like that. Also happened in the context of
guys pulling the ball in the air or whatever and hitting like
weak stuff. But then it's so that's where
though if you start breaking down.
Okay, that's the outcome we want.
All right well, what's baked into that premise?
You have to hit Ball and then but to me, not when you start
thinking about things from an ecological approach, will really
what is it that you want actually more so than just hit
the ball hard on a line? Well, actually, you want to
reach base /. You want to score runs.
So how do you score runs? Because that's really the
problem that you're trying to solve.
And to me, that's the only, you know, that's, that's the thing I
said, yesterday, we were talking about the coaches.
Yesterday, I said, you know, at the end of the day, you build a
team, which is whoever trains Me individually.
Whoever puts in individual time, Should be your goal.
Like how can I best help the team?
How can I best produce the runs that are going to help the team?
Because that's like at the end of the day, the only thing that
matters like how many runs did you score?
You know, if we had done all this training with this high
school team and they had scored the exact same amount of runs
that it would last year, had been like, I don't need help at
all. We did nothing, you know.
Well yeah, Chad taking the other side of this like I could have
focused all my time on Making every player swing the bat a
particular way, right? And if I had achieved that then
somebody could say, well, they didn't improve their own
Productions. Like yeah, well, we weren't
working on that. We were working on their swing
and that'll come. The runs will come later.
Like that's kind of the things that get thrown around in
baseball, right? We had to make their swing good
first. And then, the runs would come.
but there are seasons over and they did they did win a lot of
games and so like I don't have time for later, you know, and I
think that's like the disconnect between The perception of what I
do individual development because yes, I trained
individual players but I always want them to go to their teams
and be valuable commodities for their teeth.
We don't understand this concept at the highest level in Major
League Baseball for minor league players like Lisa to Kyle talked
about like run offices and orgs and things like we don't don't
even really know how to develop valuable assets for but we've
talked to me mad, but I've know I've talked about this before
but like How can you not invest a thousand dollars into a minor
league player and praying him in?
Then you have nothing to lose train him to become a million
dollar asset. Like that's the greatest gift in
business, but we don't do this. Actually runs is again run.
Producers is only thing matters. Be the score them and drive them
in the number one correlation between.
Well, Bubba run production. Everything on the planet is exit
velocity. It's so obviously top-end exit
velocity but also like average eggs velocity like can't be
happy and 108 in your average is 72, you know, you just chasing
top in numbers. Like, if you're copying this
108, your average is like 98. Then you're probably producing a
ton of runs your offensive. Number your batting average,
probably good, you know, your Euro beep, he's probably good,
you know, whatever. Because you, if you're scoring,
The ball up that much. You're probably making good
swing decision. Probably not swinging it.
A lot of bad pitches. Bad pitches being quote fingers
is like not not optimal pitches. Maybe a better word, you know,
it just in counts where you could get a better pitch, I
don't know. Well, that's where like for
example the school. Well for example, any Rosario
everybody used to knock on him about oh his Chase is too high
and blah blah blah this and that and you go look at his stats, he
like leads the team. In RBIs, ok.
So what that has robbed everage is not is like I don't know, 272
or 260 to 280. So what the dude drives in the
most runs on the team or he has like, I don't know, is like 90
to 100 RBIs. I would say that you're really
productive player. Because those are the things
that matter RBIs and runs and that's what this guy is doing
and then to you, actually watching a game.
Yeah, he'll Chase pitches out of the Zone, but now, especially
more now. But I think it was in the, maybe
the past couple of years. He's starting to hit those
pitches even though they're out of their Zone.
I saw him hit a fastball at like, 96.
That was like, younger three balls off the plate.
Like, all right on taku. I was going to make I was going
to make this point a minute ago, I was in a Twitter discussion
about self toss or self bounce or like Ryder, left hand toss
something. And somebody said well I don't
like that because it it a lot of times here's get on their front
foot and I'm like oh why is that bad?
Well, you know, we don't want them to Lunge at it like but
they're going to lunch at it. No matter what we do though.
Wouldn't it be of benefit to like have hit a ball lunging at
it? Like tried to hit a ball hard
lunging at it like once once or twice.
Again, I don't know if we ever will be honest.
I don't know if we ever in my lifetime.
I'm getting ready to be 39. It like a bunk.
I mean, I probably got I'm halfway done, you know, on
average I'm halfway there. In my next half do we do we do
we escape and mechanics first ideal mechanics first approach
to hitting. I'm not sure, I don't know.
I like it'll taste good but Mystic right in what you told,
Caleb. Right.
You got to go somewhere where you can prove that it works and
I think that is the most difficult thing is to convince
people who have already because it like this.
What they've learned and what other people create each already
in my draft about Caleb's Improvement in their offensive
number one my grass. Yeah, I mean that's where again
this goes back to its I think people also need to move beyond
the idea of mechanics because it's actually more forms and
styles, right? So for the whole thing of like
not be out on your front foot. Well, that's not mechanically
driven that's like a style thing, right?
And like because people are what they Is on average.
Is that people who are out on their front foot, roll balls,
over hit weak ground balls, all this sort of stuff, okay?
But then when I was coming up and and playing in like high
school, there's this one kid who all he would do is just drift
forward and just absolutely Mash balls and it's like you're doing
it wrong, you're doing it wrong but he's got there hitting
doubles and just absolutely just mashing the base, right?
And so is it really? Yeah.
Really doing it wrong in our trip.
Yeah. Our good friend.
Nick down at Georgia Tech. I watch Kevin pirata hit and I
wonder if we're still in the world in professional baseball.
In prod is probably going to go the top 10.
Well, I mean, if you look at the war thing that that that
Driveline put out, best part of the country.
Yep. He's the best player in the
country. I'm wondering though, if we're
still in the world and something tells me that if he goes to the
wrong place, that we probably are, where somebody will hail
him and Beyond him, that that won't work at this level, you
know. Yeah, somebody your problem.
You're probably old enough to remember, Khalil green played at
Clemson, you know, he hit with his feet together like started
with his feet together. Hmm.
And mash, Like one player the year like mash and I remember it
was my senior year of high school, you know, I remember
watching Clemson games and the announcers being like, you know,
that's not going to work at the next level.
You know, that he's going to have to make changes yada.
Yada yada yada yada and it's but but why, like, why do you feel
that way? You know, I hope they leave, you
know, brought his got this, this setup where the bat, the end of
the baths. Like, down next to his right,
paw Pocket in his front, elbows almost in front of his face.
He's feeder narrow, but then he kind of flows into some Rhythm
and hits the barrel obviously all the time and you know he
hits for a bra. Hi whoa he's got a ton of
homers, he's catch but who is somebody going to steal?
Tell him in 2022 and I think about this a lot.
You know that that's that won't work here.
That won't work at this level. You're going to have to make the
X y&z adjustment. It's like man.
Is that real? Is that true?
Like I don't know that that's true.
Maybe he'll go to a Nord that won't do that because there are
certainly those out there now versus when I play and all the
orders were like that, Darrell Ward's.
Now that Will let him go and let him do him, if he, you know, and
support him in that. You know, I think a lot of what
these unique Styles. I think they fail in some ways
because people in steel self-doubt in them, you no doubt
in them. For the first time they start
doubting themselves, they start doubting like what they're
doing. It's not the style per se, but
it's like the self-doubt that they Have how been maybe the
because he's gonna hit the skids, he's gonna struggle, he's
going to slump. Obviously.
That's what what happened to probe.
All you teachers, better stuff. Better.
When he hits the skids, does he is that self-doubt start
turning? Maybe they're right.
Maybe my style won't work. Maybe I do need to change and he
starts to change and I don't know but I would No.
I mean there's there's an element of I thought this was
very pernicious or there's something off about this.
I don't think it's necessarily bad especially from an
ecological perspective of failure.
Forces us to change in find a more functional fit with our
environment. But a lot of coaches intuitively
understand, hey, when guys failed then they'll actually
listen to me. But if they succeed then then
they're going to tell me off and so they use it as a way of like,
well I hope they fail. So then they can, then they can
then I can basically a knock your inundate them or brainwash
them into believing my stuff. And then it's it's like will
write it hurt my important, which makes me feel good, you
know, as the code writing it to make my self important.
Hmm, you're not well and then your whole job is there to help
the athlete. And so to me it's like what is
actually best and most beneficial and if I am bringing
my preconceived notions to it, then what?
I might give them might not be optimal because like I don't
always know what's right? But that's where to me.
If you go with Annie A logical approach.
It's not about me. It's not about me having the
right answer. It's about me, providing a path
or a process forward by which we can find the right answer for
you. And to me that's what makes an
ecological approach. So, powerful is that it really
comes down to what works best for you.
We're going to search and find out.
You're going to move differently.
We're going to try all these different things, you know,
whether it's a teacher man thing.
Whether it's said, I'm trying to even think who else is, is Big
name as far as you know, to expiry thing or whatever like
we're going to we're going to try all these different things
that all these different people have put out there.
And or just maybe maybe something different like
whatever connects with that player, you know?
I'm really I really dislike Chuck it.
I really think that's that's not a good use of time, but if that
guy, if that's what helps an athlete and yeah, great.
But you also have to understand the limitation of that like
they're like we've talked about this on with me and Robert Fry
of how and to with Caleb, this idea of the Hawthorne effect,
we're just simple. LT may help you in the short
term but eventually your production just goes back to
Baseline and then so with the with the Hawthorne experiment
they decrease the light or something and then the
production went up in the factory and then they did a
proper study and they went back and they they did the reverse
they raise the light and the production went up and they're
like Okay, so this is interesting, so it's just more
the fact that we change the environment.
And then people got more productive.
I mean, when you think about it, when somebody goes to a new
organization, why is it that they sometimes tend to perform
better when you change the environment.
And so, it's just little things like that of like, yeah, like
because right? Well, if you think about it from
a strength and conditioning perspective, right?
You do the same workout, it's all the all the time, eventually
you're going to get diminishing returns and you're not going to
get any returns and you might even regress from doing the same
thing over and over again. And the from the skill side of
things, the exact same thing is true because so, one of the
things from an ecological perspective, Perspective.
One of the viewpoints is and principles is skill.
Adaptation. A'ight.
So now we view the system as an Adaptive system that based upon
what we do in adapts to what we're doing in the most easiest
way for, I think for a lot of coaches, because strength and
conditioning has been out there for a lot longer within the
baseball coaching world and people understand it better.
Well, adaptation is adaptation in the principles work.
The same, right? You apply a novel stressor to
the system and it adapts the same thing is true when it comes
to skill development, Now for sure it's also a bit frustrating
though for people and players for the constant need of
something new. It's like yeah there's some
acceptance of you have to accept that.
Some of this is just going to be necessarily boring because I
think an achievement and I think Kyle's talked about that a
little bit. It's like they're just
necessarily born. Piece that you're going to have
to be mentally, tough enough tough being micro fingers, tough
enough to deal. Do the boring stuff because we
constantly can't constantly like iterate.
Make up new challenges just to keep you engaged every two
weeks, you know, or every week. It's so yeah for sure, I get
that but it's also like You're not going to make it if it has
to be new all the time. Like there's some acceptance of
I'm just going to do the boring stuff because boring stuff is
what's going to get me. Get my skills and get me where
I'm going and we haven't, we, we do different things.
I would say, different things with hitters, meaning we put in,
we we, we do to Plate machine. We alternate between a high high
high machine, in a low machine, on the low machine.
We try to turn up the spin, so it's bladder, even maybe giving
them the perception that is rising a bit.
That's the kind of balance out like hitting a lot of breaking
balls because if you hit a lot of breaking balls, you swing up
a lot. So we balance we go high or low
machine offset, right? Or left side, two plates and we
go to plates we put them. 24 to 36 inches apart.
If we go three plates, we put them like 12 to 18 inches apart
and switch them every swing. I mean, but we're doing the same
thing. Roughly, we're in the cage,
we're working on fastball timing within these three baths.
That's not necessarily new. I don't know if you agree with
that or not, but like, no, but I think we like a challenge.
What was that? That's what novelty is, right?
So like when I go back to like, what Eric cressey said, a long
time ago when it came to training?
Well, all we have to do is change one, small thing with the
program, and we'll get new adaptations out of it.
Whether it's you change, the, exercise selection, but you
could change something as small as this sets and Reps, you could
change something as small as the load and you're going to see a
new adaptation. And so, that's where all you
have to do is tweak one little thing and you can Pull more out
of it. But to me the this is where the
ecological Dynamics rabbit. Hole.
Gets way more, I guess you get way more down the rabbit hole is
To me there is a process. So exploration is part of
learning and this is something that we've always done naturally
from as kids. And and one of the things to
with that is when you play a game and this is something that
I think Ryan Parker is talk to, or at least kind of got me
thinking about way back when of, like, video game design how much
replayability does a game have and how much time will a person
spend playing the same game. You know, it's a, it's a back to
your kind of boring part, I guess, yes, but also wonder if
it's, if it's more, if it's more game-like, will people naturally
just play it? Like his?
When I've talked to different people about like how they got
good, well, they just played different types of games that
were baseball. Like, whether it was baseball
itself or you know, Backyard, Baseball, Wiffle, ball different
sorts of games with other people of Big like just playing these
different games, you learn different skills, you learn how
to again, be fully immersed, in a moment pressure.
All these sorts of other things that you don't get necessarily
when you're just hitting hitting hitting like you know overhand
BP or you know about traditional BP, I think is the word I was
searching for there and so to me that's that's weird.
Right. Especially with young people,
that is just and I think you probably fall in the same
category as I do is I am not the best at gamifying.
Yeah they are. We're I like Falls somebody like
David Morgan who's really good and has really good at is about
like, gamifying development because I'm like you, I'm like
in the weeds guy of like the task convocation and like we're
gonna hit this but like Grandpa points on it.
We're not going to like play game with it.
We're just going to hit it to try to hit it, you know, just
try to achieve the challenge and that's boring to a lot of people
in there. Again, they're not going to keep
doing it. It's like the video game piece,
like if the game is Just tedious monotonous, they're just not
going to continue playing with continuing to play it and
continuing to chase. It is like the most important
thing you have to be curious enough to continue to chase it.
That matters more than anything. Yeah, absolutely.
Um okay. So I wanted to transition just a
little bit and So I know you've been looking into ecological
Dynamics because you've been posting a lot of really good
infographics. What what has been that
experience? Like for you going down that,
that rabbit hole? What have you learned?
What have? So some of us, like what have
you learned and what what, what has been challenging or maybe?
You know, when I talked with some other people they're like I
don't know if I'm all the way bought in on on some of this
stuff so if like, if there's certain things that you're not
all the way bought in on What are those things that are
Hang-Ups or challenges about some of the some of the stuff
that you have read about ecological Dynamics?
You. And I talked about this on my
podcast a little bit, like this is not new in any bright.
Yes, these things. These interactions are not new.
This is not a new thing. These things throughout the
years, have just happened organically and I think I said
this on my podcast, like I see part of my position now as like
restoring things. Ecologically to the way they
used to be not. Today, we have better
information, we have better tools, we have more bunny tools.
Everything about today is better except for the fact that
somewhere along the way we lost. like the ecological interaction,
the natural interaction, that young people had with baseball
softball whatever and so I think the things that I post I want
people to understand that stop stop paying or stop searching
for one perfect way to do this, because there are a lot of ways.
There are a lot of and interact in ways to do this.
The game is hard, the game is humbling and it always has been
that there's baseball, has baseball or softball, it hasn't
changed at all. You know, we talk about data and
Analytics. The ladies are ruining the game,
and yada yada yada. And all this other stuff is,
like, go back to hitting the hitting hard line.
Drives is still the best thing to do.
Like if you can figure out how to hit a hard line drives at
abundance of different ways, that's good.
The problem is, today, somewhere along the line coach has stepped
in. Well, I know how to help you
best do this. Like, you don't like that moment
in Moneyball, we're in the movie where Brad up.
It tells the Scout like you think, you know, but you don't
like the coach this step since like I know the perfect style
for you to hit whatever. So you don't, you know, because
whether or not whether or not you agree with the principles
Beck, logical, Dynamics or whatever.
And I'm certainly not the most educated person on this.
I'm constantly learning, but the simple fact of the matter is,
whether you agree in principle or not, it's always real quick.
It's all it's happening. With Caleb said that, on my
podcast, self-organization is happening whether you agree with
it or not. Mmm, you know, you're either
yourself a task constraint or you're trying to stay out of the
way and not being an additional task, constraint on a player
like an informational constraint.
And so I just want to restore and give players back.
In my environment, like you can own a facility and you can train
players and not become an informational task constraint,
that gets in their way to self-organize and adapt and
become a good hitter. You, I said that in, not so many
words yesterday on Twitter. I think was like, you can 1000%
make hitters better by just by just telling them.
Hey, let's try to hit the ball hard and let's try hit a line
drive. And then if you have enough
tools and you have enough, you have Eerily tools.
Like you could just create enough like real interactions
with pitches whatever it is. I would, I would from a motor
learning perspective, I would encourage you to at least change
the back, you know, a lot of, you know, not swing this thing
back because you're not going to get it again.
It's about adaptations, building adaptation.
You're going to get more adaptations and more.
I heard it. Somebody said one time.
To me. You know it's like a it's like a
like a big Highway and you're just trying to build on ramp to
the highway like the more on ramps.
You can get on the lot hard Line Drive Highway like the better
they're going to be Again, it's just the principle of like the
natural interaction that you got.
I got I got it. Like, I got that.
I didn't have it. You know, people say people say,
we'll just think if you'd had, you know, coaching or whatever
when you work is like, I might not have made it.
You know, I think somebody that is hardest thing for people to
hear. I bet somebody had disrupted, my
natural athleticism and my natural.
My natural cause defeat to get balls.
I may not have made it now, I may not have.
I wasn't a better hitter. I was not a better hitter. this
is this is a story that I may draw one to one relationship to
and it may not even be that The like, I led the state of in high
school. I led the state of Virginia in
every, at every level, every offensive category, as a High
School, junior like a maze, like I hit everything homers RBIs
slugging on my everything. My senior year I was not as
good, not even close to as good, which makes no sense going in
the draft that I signed a power 5 Division, 1, scholarship, yada
yada yada. What was the difference?
Well. Because of all these things for
the first time in my life, I thought I had to start searching
for the right mechanic. And so I was reading a lot of
things, like trying a lot of things with my swing, like, it
made me worse and like, I was never what I was previous to
that. Now After High School, obviously
pitching gets better. So my offensive numbers aren't
the same because I'm not interacting with the same path
but like, my search process was never the same, you know, I I
never just hit you know I got into pro ball and everybody said
Duty work so I didn't unti work like that.
That really what I needed to know and work for somebody else
so it should work for you. Right, right.
You know, so Again, from from the original question, I just
put this all the stuff that I post, I just want people to know
that. Stop pigeonholing or cornering
players into this singular swing idea.
You know we have a player like we have a player who scissors.
Hmm, a lot you know, he seizes the cage, he had to pull side
double the other day in a game he does this whatever, you know.
I think I think Parker said that about trout, he's been in the
case with trout trout doesn't ever like Caesar in a game or in
the cage but he doesn't a game. It's like just one of these
natural occurrences that allow these things to not.
You can be a good coach. Like you can be a really good
poke and not give players instructions on on how to do
things every other swing. Like, you can still be a good
coach, but you can still increase a high school team run
production by over four, runs the game and not say anything to
any of the player. And say anything nothing.
I just allowed them to naturally interact.
It's funny. I got a remote client.
This spring from from DC and he's a young kid and the
immediate need that the dad wanted to address was back to
ball skills. My son's back to ball.
Skills are not good. We want to improve the
basketball skills and and I said, well, you know, send me
some video. Not that I'm going to break the
video down and put you next to Mike Trout and say, well, here's
the positions, you need to be any audio.
I just just want to watch you swing.
Just want to watch a. Well the video he sends me is
the kid hitting off the tee. And so, I said, you know, I said
it's nicely. As I can tell you We need to get
rid of the T. Like I'm not jokingly saying
that like I'm not I'm not I'm taking the matter very seriously
that you want to that you want to.
It's not a joke. When I say burn the teeth like I
for most people. I mean I mean it but get the
ball off a tee. I said, I don't care what you
got to do. I don't care.
If you gotta buy a bucket of tennis balls and he's got a
bounce them and hit them into a net.
I don't care if you got a side toss them to him because you
don't have much space, you know, I don't care if you got a side.
Also from different angles, I don't care what it doesn't have
to be a perfect toss tie and actually if it benefits the
worst off, if it's not consistent in worst, probably
better because a lot of parents get hung up on.
Like I can't toss good. Okay.
What's your point like toss the ball at it?
He's got to figure out how to hit it anyway and so it's funny
because along the way this kid this kid has improved his back
to ball skills, like a lot. And the dad now makes the joke
of who knew that hitting a moving ball more made, you
better at hitting a moving ball, you know, right.
Yeah. Like who knew, you know, who
knew that trying to swing the bat bath.
Like makes you swing the bat fast.
It's funny because I see a lot of facilities post like first
lesson bat speed second lesson bat speed.
Well Huh, of course because most of the kids that I see, don't
swing the bat as hard as they can, because they've been
attuned to just make contact. So they swing the bat at some
speed of like whatever and they think that that's their highest
effort. And then they just see somebody
that says, hey man, like let it eat and they're bad.
Speed goes up like eight miles an hour.
Okay, I didn't do anything other than kill him between carbon and
he did and his back sweetie. I did nothing.
Now again, this goes back to the conversation of back of all
skills but like it is swinging harder now.
And so It's funny. It's a funny world.
We live in this coaching universe.
Yeah. Um so I want to be respectful of
time. I don't know if what your what's
your time window? I'm good.
Okay good. All right because I did have one
at least other other direction to go in.
I'm trying to well. Okay, so it if we go back to
what we were talking about before with the the helmets and
then the glasses Right? So, if we go back to that on how
our perception changes, when we put a helmet on and it's not
just It's not just the fact that like, it changes your vision but
now, sensory like kinesthetic. Now you have that kinesthetic of
having that on your head and then that feel and then having
to deal with that because what if the helmet is a little loose
in a falls off that's going to mess with, right?
Like that's going to change how you move that's going to affect
how you move and how you interact with the problem.
How big the helmet is in terms of, like more padding, less
padding, all these different things.
Things are going to affect a player's movement and that's the
thing we are. I don't think we appreciate that
enough. Like we let guys get away with
I'll just hopping in the cage without a helmet on and hitting,
and it's like, hey, do you go and hit without a bat?
So it's to me, it's like the military, right?
You should always be going around with your rifle.
And I asked one of our guys, who's in the National Guard.
I'm like, hey, okay. I hear this thing about, you
know, you should always have your rifle on you, you know,
especially when you're training and all this other stuff.
What about your helmet? He's like, oh yeah, we're
supposed to wear that thing all the time.
Doesn't even matter. Like, if I'm working on a truck
or whatever, I'm supposed to be wearing my helmet.
Like okay so why is it that the military understands these guys
got to go around in their gear all the time, like they're ready
to ready for combat. But we don't have the same
mentality, like it's fine. You can you can just, you know,
where or no hat or a hat. In the cage, whatever.
Not a helmet, right? What you wearing a game?
So to me, that's right. I think I saw Brock Hammett like
I think I saw Brock heimet post about he may, I don't know if
you know, Brock and Brett but no, yeah, he made Brett like
start wearing a helmet in the cage, like, all the time and I
laugh because like he's wearing a, he's wearing a helmet in
front flips, which is funny to look at.
But like you said, it's like why.
And even today with my kids, my daughter play softball rights,
she has to wear them. Math.
And it's like, I should make her wear, her helmet with the mask
on it all the time. Because even the mask in front
of your face, changed, your perception of ball flight.
Ya know, and that's, that's especially if you have a C flat.
Don't know what are your comments guilty?
yeah, I'm guilty of Don't know why?
I don't know why. You don't do it.
It's easier because I told my dad I had to tell my son the
other day. It's like, man.
I'm not telling you to put a helmet on because I'm going to
hear you. I'm not nahi.
I just need you to wear a helmet.
Good because that my mind was going at that time of this.
We need to wear a helmet all the time because you wear a helmet
in a game and you need to perceive the ball flight.
The same way you perceive the ball flight in the game.
This goes to the light conditions.
Also, we tried need to try to match the Conditions, you need
to try to best match. The like conditions that you
that you trained in. Then then you play in and so if
it's bright you didn't train in that and so your information
processing will not be. I actually sent that to a couple
of coaches that I consult with that have really good chances,
in college play in the last game.
Of the season, the last series of the season.
I said, if these games are during the day and I know that a
lot of your training occurs inside, you need to look into
this because if these games are during the day, and you have to
win the last game, or the last series of the Year, this would
be something stupid to knock not.
To not cover a based on these are real.
Is it not? I don't know.
But again it's the principles of the matter like they
ecologically. I think you said this earlier,
think it's the guiding set of principles or the anecdote.
You talked about the anecdote anecdotally, it makes good
sense. I don't know that.
That's a real thing but that would be a really stupid base,
not cover. If it was a real thing, wind
chill. We already know that guys have
different day night splits, that's why in the pros, they
have not. Like it's I mean, at a very
basic level. We know that this, this
relationship exists, but it goes back to me.
The whole reason why people don't do it is it's harder.
Oh now I have two guys will start complaining because
they're so used to this and now they can't go out and hang out
with friends now that, you know, their schedule got changed and
blah, blah, blah. And like I just don't want it.
I get it. But At some point it comes back
to. Do you really want to win?
How bad do you want to win, right?
And to me, that's you think I had a thought I was going to ask
you. Do you think that?
Oh I remember what I was gonna say.
You probably know this. I don't know this because I have
found it. But I said this yesterday, I
think there's a study. I think there's a study and I
could be completely making this up about like Latin American
players, like players in the Dominican players in Cuba
players and, you know, That they're better.
They're better because they hit more not because the intent of
hitting more outside, but it's something about light,
sensitivity in their eyes. I either saw that, I maybe even
making that up, but like, now that I see the sunglass thing
like that makes a lot more sense that like players that hit more
outside or more attuned to information processing in
natural light versus light that is in a cage because mmm. well,
I mean, if they do, is different information to be picked up
potentially, or is different information is revealed based
upon the lighting conditions and so, I mean, to me that you're
part of it, but I haven't leaves everything completely different.
Well, that's where. If this thing won't break on me,
I was going to show you. I'm having trouble with the
keeping it connected here. but this one, But it's these,
there's something in this one book.
I was reading and I haven't really looked.
I just remember that, okay. So, Driveline was doing the eye
stuff and looking at the eyes and gaze behavior.
And so they're talking about saccades and how we're basically
blind when we have a cicada. It turns out that's actually not
true. One of the things that it's
somewhere in here. You can actually pick up
contrast your contrast Sensitivity.
I think like you can see the contrast is still picked up in.
Let's see, might not be an absolute absence of visual
perception during saccades, but rather that contrast sensitivity
might be lower during during saccades, this modern account of
saccades suppression. Argues that contrast sensitivity
is reduced to such an extent under that under natural
conditions. Nothing would be perceived
during a secure aid but that if contrast is very high then
Vision can proceed. so at least to me that that says that if we
can improve somebody's ability to perceive the contrast like
for example to me the seems you can somehow improve the contrast
sensitivity to the seams And to me this is I might be inferring
here. but maybe contrast sensitivity is something is a
trainable quality because if it's about the perception or the
pickup of information, the more like, there's probably a way to
train it and I don't know exactly how it probably take a
while to figure out, but I think you could probably train
contrast, contrast, sensitivity, and And so that's something, you
know, whether it is that you're using glasses, here's my one, my
one hang up on the glasses is what happens if they break,
right? I don't you don't want it to be
such a crutch that if you don't have it, you like you're
absolutely screwed. But at the same point that you
train with it enough that, okay, you're good with it and you're
good without it. And so like it can be a, it can
be a training aid at sometimes 22.
To help guys, become more sensitive to the contrast to see
it more clearly and then to go back without it until like
alternate back and forth. I think that to me would be the
safer way. Because so remember when Robert
was talking about earplugs or Jared, talking about earplugs.
My biggest thing is, okay, that's great.
But now you just reduced or took away like if you can't wear or
if you wear them in games, all you did was now you took away
one, one of their perceptual senses that as can actually be
useful and important. Say for example you're on S,
right? So you hit or whatever are you
going to leave them in? Maybe you take them out after
you get on base, but You know, you got a double or whatever and
you can't hear the guy, the trail Runner or not Runner.
But first baseman, he had a double trailer and I'm yelling
trailer and you got, you got those earplugs in, you're not
going to hear that you're not going to even hear me go, go,
go, go. When, you know, so this is where
to me on a practical sense. Okay, great.
That this helps improve this one element but does it, does it
then hinder you when you're doing other elements of the
game. So to me, auditory is huge.
Just take that away. So to me, it's just a training
aid, to help get you to experience.
So, for example, under load bats experience of going fast, and
then you go back to your game bat, which is heavier.
But now you understand how to move fast and what moving fast
feels like so to me. Yeah.
When you use these different training AIDS, if you if they
are, if they feel like shortcuts, the probably are
shortcuts and that means that you can't perform without them.
And so to me it's it's using it more as a way to help blend and
get to transition back to what it is.
Your game state is so I don't have a problem with using these
different things. But I think this is something
that Caleb. Oh man killed get into this all
the time about Band-Aids. All that's a mental crutch
having a mental routine and to me, I don't think so.
I think having a very gradual one but to him, it's just Just a
Band-Aid off. You should be psychologically,
strong enough. And I'm probably creating a
little bit of a slime in here, but that to me is the perception
of this back. Yes.
Like your anecdotal principle of flow, you know, if a middle
routine gets you to flow into a flow State, then it is
important. Yes.
You know, if you're mentally tough enough where you don't
need them into routine and you could get into a flow State then
great through that. It's like the tea before the
game Freddie Freeman has to do the tea.
Well, the game in order to get into a flow state that he can
compete in the game than he has to do the tea because that's
what he has to do to get himself to that.
So it goes back to the your--for.
Your I think you're very first point of like the flow state
dog. You about this though and I'm
listening to do. Do you think in training?
This is trying. This might be a Band-Aid to you.
Talk about not being able to play in without glasses.
Should we be using glasses in training?
That, that changes the light sensitivity, like you can use
yellow lens glass To make the room brighter and hit you, can
you content them and you know, make more red light and make the
training environment. So, you build a more robust
sensitivity is not the same light all the time.
What I'm getting at in a training center so that you
build this more robust ability to without glasses or without
anything. Thank you bit least experienced
this, you know it's like the front foot hitting or it's like
experience in swinging at a breaking ball.
It's like this is not optimal but at least you've experienced
this to have some sort of, you know, connection to what's
happening. No, no, I think that to me is
what practices about is creating those, a different experience at
a better way to to your point of it might be a crutch and if the
glasses break you can play, is it something that you should
install in practice that? I think so.
Yeah, I don't, I don't have a problem with using them at all.
I just think that if Everybody has this early on more is
better, and I don't think there's a problem with that in
the sense of we don't know what at what point it becomes not
better. So part of So to me, this is
again going back to why. I like, I want to demonstrate
ecological and ecological approach is, is a, is a very
like, it's all-encompassing, it's very pervasive, it
permeates there's the work, it permeates through breath,
everything in the sense of if you just take the basic
principles of how we learn things.
Well, you need and what you want to explore to find out what the
limits are of the thing is and to find out how the thing
actually works. So you know, early on like let's
use it a ton and if you can use it in game great, but you also
you'll probably end up finding out and just as just to me like
your run the thought of experiment.
Okay, if I use this all the time, okay, there's this benefit
but what happens in the worst case scenario, am I still going
to be able to perform? And that to me is the analysis.
There is, there's nothing wrong with using it in game, right?
What there's no rule saying you can't.
So why wouldn't you if it's going to give you an edge?
But if that edge is suddenly taken away from you, are you
going to completely collapse? And so, I think from a coach
standpoint to me, it's about making the player aware look, I
also need you to train without it sometimes even though you got
really comfortable with it, you perform really great with it,
but I want we're going to have to take that away.
So just in case it happens in a game where that gets taken away
from you, you're not up, you know, up the creek without a
paddle, you know, like it. Like that's so that to me is
where As a coach, it to me, I feel responsible to then have to
train the athlete, to be able to use without it.
But say, you can absolutely use it in game, but if something
happens, you're, you know, you're super chill.
And it's like, no problem. I'm super adaptable dextrous and
it doesn't matter. And so to me, that's that's
where like an ecological approach, like permeates
everything that you do, all the way from how you you interact
with the new idea, a new Concept to how you are.
You coach the athlete? Do you think I've had this
thought to in a lot of, a lot of the, you know, a lot of the
people need, I think Trevor said this one time.
Hmm. These people need the belief
that there is a one ideal style to do it.
They need that because when they fail, which ultimately, they'll
do visually in baseball, like no one plays forever?
So, ultimately, there's a time where the game passes you by
They need they just need the security blanket of like there.
There was one way to do it and I didn't find it instead of like
faith in reality of like I just was no longer good enough to do
it. The game, I couldn't interact
with the game good enough to do it.
It's just an easier pill to swallow.
If you believe you had this firm belief of, there's one way to do
it. I didn't find it.
I just should have kept looking. That was my belief, I think,
when I first came out of baseball, was that guy you have
something to blame Yeah, it's like the most people can't
swallow the pill of like I wasn't good enough.
And so they just they just they just blame it on something.
It helps them get over it and helps them get over.
You know, it helps them get over their own career shortcomings or
whatever. So they then they then they
regurgitate that to other people who have the same insecurities
and it turns into this culture of people.
Eventually that again, like like you said, I'm just not mentally,
Pella mentally, strong enough. It just accept that.
I was a good enough and they move on.
I mean, that's how I am about my, I don't talk about my
playing career today because ultimately, I was not good
enough, it wasn't because I didn't find the swing it wasn't
because I did. Already others wasn't good
enough, I didn't play good enough.
Well I also wonder the other ball any other than my own, why?
I also wonder at your kid will be the same way.
Like if my kids career fall short, it will be because
they're not good enough. Well, it depends what you like?
How do you define? What is not good enough and in
some ways because here's where I'm going.
Is that? Within every person, there's
there's potential, right? And so as a coach and even as as
a player you're trying to pull out your fullest potential.
So the question was it's a word that's like maybe my least
favorite word ever who by the way somebody tells me that
somebody has potential like right.
Awesome. You know so does everyone else
know but I think that's why I like coaching like I'll work
with the worst player on the team because I think that within
within them there is the ability to Be a good ball player and
because, Yep, they're there to me what becomes interesting and
ecological approach doesn't get you all the way there, but it
gets you close. Is you want to look at the whole
person. And so when we start talking
about this like what's holding you back?
Well it could be mental, could be physical.
It could be all these different things, but at the same point at
some level, There to me and I could be wrong on this.
There's sometimes it's a psychological thing, right?
Like, there's some sort of mental block that's preventing
you from taking that next step of like overcoming what it is
because right? When you encounter failure, what
is happening? Oftentimes is you're coming up
against especially when it's repeated failure.
You're coming up against your shortcomings, right?
Like maybe we talked about this with business, right?
The only person, the only reason like especially when you're in
business for yourself, the only reason, Not moving forward as
you. And so you have to face the your
usual bombings single player game.
Hmm. Like the single player game from
Lake Nation. Yeah, yeah.
And so the to me the the thing is is that once you to me
there's a process. So like I think you've followed
Gary Vee Right up. Yeah, so I mean his his whole
thing a while back was he loves the game, once he figured out
the game. And that part of improvement was
overcoming his shortcomings and like dealing with him Square on,
and like, if he can get through this, this thing that's holding
him back or whatever. Like, I think he was away more.
I don't like a, like, the feeling that you got from him
like it because it's still there a little bit, but I think it's
changed more and more over time as he sort of figure out, hey, I
can make more money if I am what more if I'm a better human
being. So in before it was just sell,
sell sell. And however, I sell No works.
But and so, so he got like a little bit of like a used car
salesman feel to them or like that East Coast kind of edgy
feel to it. And but it's been interesting to
see, like, you listen to him. It's like, oh, he learned that
there's a game to this. If I can overcome these things
within me and become a better person, then I can pull out more
of my, my fullest potential. And I think that's the thing
where people going back to I need to feel good.
Well, you did then don't understand.
How to get where you want to go to, some of this goes more to
your boredom Point, like, that's not it.
You don't feel great when you're doing this monotonous stuff in
the same way, when you encounter your weaknesses and have to
overcome them. That's, that's painful, that's a
very painful process. But if you can, if you want
where you're going more and if you want to see your fullest
potential, then you have to work through that.
But if you're if you're okay with not then you have to do
that. Whole thing of telling yourself,
different lies, and all this sort of stuff.
But where I was going the larger picture to me from an ecological
perspective. When you can understand how do
the game that is being played, so to speak of, it's about a
process and the process. Is about exploration and
learning, and being adaptive and all this sort of stuff.
Once you understand this process, it kind of it pulls you
out of this, this negative Loop and it creates a positive Loop.
Like everything is, you can find a ways to grow in everything
that you do and to me, then that allows more of your fullest
potential to come out. And so that to me is maybe it
was the frame that we were working in Was what was limiting
us? And that's where, you know, this
is a good segue into the other thing that we were trying to do
and I don't I might not include this in the podcast.
But anyways, remember so we talked you talked about trying
to create like an about hitting Mastermind group to figure out,
how are we going to solve? So the the problems that we're
facing in hitting because I don't think I can, I can do it.
I mean, maybe I could do a lot of it by myself, but I think it
would take, you know, ten years to 20 years for me too.
To get all that put down organized in such a way to then
distribute to other people. Like I could maybe figure it out
for myself because there are things that each of us
intuitively know but cannot explain to other people, and
that's great. So you can use it and be
successful with it, but it's really hard for us for it to be
replicated. And so I think what, I'm what I
am trying to do or what I would like to do is figure out how to
get a group of people together to actually Start figuring out,
how can we develop language around this?
How can we develop a culture around this?
Like I took it from this book Finding Superman which is about
flow States. I don't know if you've have.
You heard that book. Always have heard the book.
I don't haven't read it. I think it's in my, on my Amazon
wishlist I try to just when I hear things, I try to go in
there. I go to the bookstore Wonder
around but things my Amazon wishlist, hoping I get an email
one day that they're a dollar 99 on Kindle and right, well
because like II just have the audio book.
This is sorry, I got the title wrong, the rise of Superman, but
to me, this is so I don't even know if this is going to play in
the right spot, but Did the story was that for these guys to
do the most amazing so that the book is on action adventure
sports and so these guys that you know, you said, you couldn't
free climb, you know, I'm trying to think of the mountain but it
basically like, you know, I think it's like elcapitan like
the some of these or Yosemite, right?
Like you can't do these all good.
These sort of crazy things are guys who are going off, skis
doing back jumps and then parachuting out after, you know,
off of cliffs that, you know, you normally couldn't cook to
ski down. They talked about how there were
what caused an explosion in advancement of like human
advancement. Was the fact that people were
going to this, there's this one base camp I think, at the base
of Yosemite where these were some climbers started or one guy
just like, went all in and just started living there.
And then eventually other people would hear about like the things
that he was doing and they'd come there.
And then they would, they basically developed a community
where They were teaching each other.
Like hey I learned this blah blah blah and that led to a
group Flow State which allowed the advancement of the sport for
them to do things that people thought weren't humanly
possible. And so in my mind, if we're
going to solve the hitting problem and try to catch up to
pitching. In my mind, the best way to do
that is to try to get a group Flow State and to try to create
a community around trying to solve this problem.
But it's going to be hard in the sense of part of the reason why,
you know, I reach out to you to Jared and to the other guys in
the group, generally speaking is there's really low ego among
that that group of people because if your mentality and
I've been around other people like this, if your mentality is,
I need to keep these things secret.
And I don't want to share with other people.
Because you know, they could steal my ideas make money blah
blah. Then I think yeah I think we're
going to then limit our ability to solve this problem.
Like at least for me like I don't care.
I really like Chad. If you go and make tons of
money, then you're going to do the Joe Rogan thing and have a
Joe Rogan studio in your facility and it's going to be
great, you know, like That's my crazy plan of like, my dream of
like what I would like to do. In the in the near future.
It's try to figure that out of like how can we have those types
of conversations because it's going to take time but I think
it will advance Advance like our ability to.
To change the game. Right.
And again I could be wrong but I don't I probably am.
It's like it's like I would like to ask Kyle.
I would like to ask Kyle Bode on my podcast.
Would you look back at Driveline five years ago and think that it
is? I mean, you are you've been
around the like even probably three or four years ago And
think that it's up compared to now.
And he probably say yes. I think like in, but we all
thought three or four years ago that all this is the, this is
amazing. Like, this is the top of the
mountain here like, but they've gone further in like where they
were now. If, if Driveline was driving,
what it is now versus what it was three or four years ago,
would be like it sucks. So, the idea that I have today
probably won't play out but some some form of it may, but I think
it goes back this this whole thing this group and they spent
a These thing is, how do the biggest challenge.
The number one challenge is, how do we get?
How do we get two people to agree on like the foundational
principle to? Players to hit hard line drives
are good later. Do that more often get the
harder. It's blowing the air.
We can agree on the principle of the matter.
Like if we were going to do a group and we were going to grow
this, this bottle if we start from the agreed upon principle
of this, then it opens your mind to the possibility that You
know, there's maybe not one ideal perfect style to do this
by, because of these reasons. You know, but until I mean, my
hang up. I thought I thought five years
ago, When I really started to because I think you said this, I
think you said this, I might somebody said this on my
podcast, we felt about. We felt about bat speed the way
we used to feel about people throwing 90 miles an hour.
It's like something new here. I had her.
Yeah, and yeah, and preachers had arrived at the principle of
the matter. It's like throwing 90 miles an
hour is trainable and attainable.
I can do this. You know, it's going to look
like some Foreman bat speed power is completely trainable,
and completely attainable and having more bat speed and
hitting the ball hard, and having more power is a very,
very, very good thing and you can train it.
I can try, I can train, you can training, everybody can train
it. And until we agree that, like,
that's a good thing, like, that's the thing we should be
chasing then. Obviously back to ball skills.
You know I'm not overlooking back to ball skills.
Like in order to hit for power you have to hit the ball and it
goes back to my original point of like while bat speed and
power. And all these is the maybe the
grand picture along the way back to ball skills is kind of really
the day-to-day focus. And so Well, that's your area
that well, I mean, that's, that's a hurry on, but it's a
language thing, right? And so, the, the, the main thing
of this is personally. I think and there's, there's a
TED Talk. I listen to, but I like the
book. Good to great.
I thought it articulated at well, I don't know if you've
heard of that one. Yeah, yeah, he talked about when
you and maybe it's in principles, Ray dalio is book
principles as well. Like When you're a part of an
elite group man, you argue all the time like in the sense of
you argue and you have these conversations and it's okay like
you have these debates and in it you're you're you're arguing for
the best ideas and you're working through stuff.
And you know, I might want to actually play a little a little
clip from from this other thing that I was listening to even
though it's a little religious, he was talking about when when
you're having these discussions because this is happening to
with you know, Jordan Pederson. I don't know if you Any of his
stuff Jordan Peterson up Sam Harris, Bret Weinstein.
Like there's there's all these conversations going on where
there in John Verve a key, Paul dander, clay, Jonathan Pidgeotto
all these conversations that are occurring.
And these guys are trying to work out these complex problems
and things that they thought, you know, had nothing to do with
each other religion and all this science stuff, but they're
they're now starting to have conversations and what John
Verve, a key or not for Becky. Sorry.
Paul Van clay was talking about is he's he's Illuminating the
process by which you begin to get on the same page essentially
and you begin to work together and there's this process by
which you're having conversations in your trying to
figure out. Okay.
How are we going to have this the same conversation?
Let me see if I can pull up this this little clip.
Okay. Okay, so another way this, this
to me I think was really really quite interested in Sunday.
We had some people came into church and two marks came in.
One was a quiet Mark and one was a one was a more of a chatty
Mark. And he asked, what is the frame
problem? And so I just kind of walked
through a little bit of what the frame problem is the world is
too complex for us to process. We are small limited beings and
in order to process the world we filter, so So filter is sort of
a metaphor this way. And this is key to part of what
Jordan tried to get across to Sam Harris and their talks
didn't make what's much Headway I think, partly?
Because often in events like this people sort of get on stage
and they have all these little sets peaches and when they hear
something, that sort of triggers, one of their set
speeches, they give their said speeches, and it's very hard for
people, especially with very minimal experience conversing
with each other to really dig. And and get stuff done.
You might say Well then why don't people just have regular
regular repeated conversations. Well, people often do why not
what conversations? Like this part of the difficulty
is that if two people keep talking, they keep making
progress like this, but somewhat, but you have to be
there for all the conversations to sort of continue to follow
them. And even then there's a lot of
loss. So that's just the challenge of
conversation. So pre-show is making the
comment here about not only the frame problem but also the
quality problem and the the level problem, let's call it.
So I think that he explained really well like when you're
trying to work together on a problem and solve a problem at
first we're just going to be interacting I guess with our are
stump speeches and then eventually we'll start digging
deeper but I I'm kind of curious.
If like what were what were some things that stood out to you?
Because I heard you chuckle there a little bit.
No, he dogged about those two guys, and funny.
No, I I think I was thinking about how we don't want it.
Certainly don't have to get into my views, on religion, or
whatever church and all these other things.
But I think a lot of the controversy and those things
also derive from not being able to identify like, what is the,
what is the, like, the What is the core principle to this?
You know, it's like travel team churches and they all break off
because they disagree on like what is the core principle?
And so hitting the hitting group fractures because we can't we,
there's not a for there's not like a core principle and
hitting should be simple, like, pitching should be simple.
You know, the principles, the core principles should, it
should be simple to understand. Now we can have covered their
certainly lat I can't talk to people because I'm not going to
argue about the core principle. I'm not I'm just not.
I don't have time if you're not going to convince me that I
should teach mechanics first like I should teach this ideal
say to mechanics and then we're going to go we're going to learn
this. We're going to spend all this
time on this set of mechanics. And then we're going to go we're
going to You're not going to convince me of that.
Like that's not that's not that's not.
What's going to make you a good hitter?
Like trying to hit the ball hard and actually hitting the ball
hard if you need to refine and reiterate that a lot?
Yes, there are a lot of ways to do that.
Yes, we've discussed that in this podcast, we can a disagree
on that we can disagree on like Ryan johanns.
I had Ryan Johansen on a podcast, like it hasn't come out
yet. He gave me an idea about the tea
that I didn't hate. Mmm, and I'm like, And so I can
do with that like I actually have gone with that.
There have actually been a couple kids since I had that
conversation that I've actually gone back to some of the things
that I used to do with you implementing and using the tea.
A little like 1 or 2 player because I think it may help them
like his idea was very good but it wasn't like he was trying to
convince me of a different principle of anything.
He and I agreed on the principle that, you know, it's about
perception and it's about conversation tonight.
Outpatient, all these things around speed and power.
This is just another way to think about.
Actual do good idea about how the tea can be, you.
I was like, I don't hate that. Like, I don't hate that idea,
it's one of those anecdotal. Thing goes back to when you make
the point about anecdotes, like sometimes if they're rooted in
good ideas and principles can be, can be worth exploring.
You know, it was you it was your idea.
I think we were talking about a minute ago and I had an idea.
Oh I had an idea about like covid in like I think covid like
I'm not discrediting the seriousness of what covid is or
was but it kind of really illuminated that the like the
Tendencies of people to either follow, what the gatekeeper says
more look, objectively Information.
And it's like these two people fought on the internet all the
time and it's like I know what side I stand on.
But like how did the people that just want to follow the
gatekeeper and want to be spoon-fed information?
Like How do you convince those people that social proof search
for your own information? Like you can search for like
people that want to be spoon-fed a swing versus like the people
that see the information and like want to develop some
anecdotal ideas about the information and chase them and
see where they go. They did the people that want to
be spoon-fed a swing ever, really want to take ownership to
explore and search. How do you get them to their?
I don't know. People that that like just
wanted to listen to again, regardless of where you felt
about covid, One of the data points that I think you can
really look at is like whether mask work or not did a mask
actually work and like, The Gatekeepers told you that you
had to do. It feel like the information
wasn't that black and white that you had to do it.
And it's like if you disagree with a gatekeeper because the
information is like you, you want people to die now.
No, I believe me. I hate dying.
I hate this. Little subtlety is not is not
Get. Yeah, but like, right, it's like
it's the same thing with swings. It's like you disagree with
teacher man than you sucked at at training hitters, like, yeah.
But like, there's a lot of examples of like people that
don't swing that way and people that don't do that.
And so that's where that's where to me.
I guess that ecological Dynamics, kind of bridges that
Gap, maybe, but people want to be spoon-fed a swing.
Maybe, maybe they never disagree.
I don't know how, I don't know how you can watch a game or
listen to hitters talk and not even be curious about there.
Actually may be more than one way to do this.
Well I mean once you actually start watching video, right Ru
you say certain things and you actually go and you watch the
video and then you look you start looking your like I don't
know like everybody said we swung down and then I remember
seeing a thing of Ichiro like a picture that had like all the
different phases of where his Bat was that you're like he's
not doing it right, right? It Rose not doing it, right.
You know, but that's it. Caleb.
This thing the other day of a guy talking about how he would
rather have Trey Turner swing, then Mike Trout, swing.
But this is where we are. This is where we are at this
guy. Actually on the internet saying
he would rather have great earners Wing then Mike Trout.
Swing like who cares about? Like there's wings I would just
rather be Mike Trout. Just give me everything my Trout
Scott. How he swings how he bends.
How he adapts? Give me that like why would I
want to betray turn away? I can beat Mike Trout.
But again, it's like all about the swing like this fascination
with the swing, The Gatekeepers of the swing.
I'm not and I'm not bagging Jared Diamond, he wrote the
swing Kings, he sent it to me a copy of it.
I flipped through it. It was fine.
I'm just not. I'm not worried.
These one idea these guys, it's not thought that interested in
that, what I'm interested in is like How the rising tide can
lift all the boats? Like how to improve player
performance in a variety of ways.
So yeah. I don't know how we ended up
talking about covid and mask, that's why all those, because a
good analysis. It can be.
I mean it's hard though for up for other people.
Just like I knew that this might be an issue of playing a clip
from a religious person talking about religious topics because
it can write, it can, it can distract from the from the
larger point, right? That you're making about covid
or not about covid. But but like the illustration,
the analogy that you're trying to use and I think a lot of
people going back to the clip that we watch it.
About how we hear certain words and we get triggered.
And then our own biases, come in and they Cloud.
So that like, so for example, from an ecological perspective,
it's all about an information exchange and actually being
connected to the information that is being exchanged, right?
So, You know, talking past each other.
Now we're not actually talking on the same topic and why does
that happen? So it comes back to like if
we're going back to, how are we going to solve the problem of
hitting? Well of the things that Paul Van
Der clay laid out we early on. When we first start talking,
we're going to have our stump speeches.
The things that we're really comfortable with part of it too.
That I don't think he talked about is sometimes it's
unintentional. Sometimes, it's or some
sometimes it were unaware. It's subconscious of like we
only want to talk about things that we're really comfortable
with because we don't want to look bad in front of others.
And it's not a, it's not something that you consciously
think about. That's just like, a normal way
that we all operate. And in.
So there are different things in terms of like.
So for example right now, okay it's being recorded that's going
to influence, how we're going to talk.
Now if we turn it off or whatever, we may have a
different type of conversation. So in the same way that the
frame really sets up the conversation, that is going to
be had. And then from that over time,
initially early on, we're going to be having our stump speeches
and we're going to be talking past each other but the more we
interact and the more that the relationship is built built in
terms of the other person is talking in.
Good faith. He's not out there.
Trying to, you know, it's about his ego and trying to screw the
other person in score points and stuff like that.
Then there's potential for people to actually start talking
to each other and then it becomes about the ideas.
Because if the idea is in some way shape or form in form and
direct our attention and where we're going and influence, how
we interact with the world and how we interact with players,
how we Players Etc. Then then we can actually start
discussing that and get back to the whole business of what it is
that we're here trying to do. As far as, you know, helping
players and creating guys that absolutely mash it mash, it a
high level or hit a high level, maybe it.
Maybe I want to go back to that because like to me hitting is
more than just mashing the ball as hard as you can.
Sometimes that that works, sometimes you can hit it really
softly and and score runs, right?
Get on base and create Havoc. It like yeah, well sure on
accident. Whatever.
Like yeah I like to think. Yeah.
Well it depends what? Like from a like over swing down
because you pick swing. You know, I had.
We had a kid today. Sent me a video of a check swing
single work. Well I think to check swing
double-o. You look at trout.
What do you have like a check swing triple.
I mean this is this is the thing though.
It goes back to an intention though.
But I guess for me, it's not, it's not an accident in the
sense of this is why I really like, Georgia Tech's, whatever
their Mantra wreak havoc. All right, if that's your
intention to wreak havoc, then that opens the door for check
swings. That opens the door for soft
hits. It's not saying that that's all
you ever do. And that's your focus.
No wreak havoc. So anything that satisfies that
intention is. Okay and that's that's where I I
go back to an ecological approach.
Frees you up for that? I think to ecological approach
and bat speed and we talked about all these instances where
you miss hit the ball softly and it quite some hit or check swing
and equates to hit this was the point that I tried to hammer
home with the High School coaches, that I had the team
with this false, like, We talked about hitting a lot in, in like
singular moment, singular event. And the only way that you can
really identify a player's value is like, Let It All Play out,
like let the whole season play out, and then let's look at it,
you know, I try to tell them like, like if we increase your
team's didn't mean, this is a simple step that I've pulled out
a lot. If you increase your team's
average eggs, velocity by 5 miles an hour, your team batting
average will go up 50 points. Roughly, that's a, that's kind
of broken down in Major League stat.
There's some gaps that are wider.
There's some gaps in average is not always the best way to do
it, but It's pretty proven that if your average x velocity goes
up over the course of the body of work your offensive, that's
are going to go up, but like we can't see that like you can't
explain that because they can't, they can feel I'm not again, I'm
not against manner. All these people that are online
like I respect people more, that are just like boots.
Barry. Who is sharing his work more
than he's going after people? Don't go after people.
Just share your work and asking questions.
He's taking the Socratic method. It's so powerful. but, It's
easier to grasp like a singular swing idea, right now than it is
to like, Let It play out because the uncertainty of letting it
play out is uncomfortable for people.
You know, it's uncomfortable for our parents when they come in.
It's like I'm not teaching them anything.
So if like, I'm not learning anything right now, it may not
help me right now and it's you can't talk about hitting right
now because in One Singular at that, There are thousands of
things that could work, you could check swing.
You could roll over. Both the six hole, you can hit a
rocket bullet day to the center fielder.
He catches it. You'd be out on your front foot.
You could can't look at it that way.
You have to, you have to take like, what's going to make my
body of work valuable And then like once you can get
comfortable with like knowing what the body, how do you make
the body of work valuable? then you're okay with like, Not.
Teaching coaching like every single moment because that play
right there. It's like Kevin Parada like that
guy. Right there has the tools and
ability to put together a phenomenal body of work.
Is it? Is it going to look bad?
Sometimes short is, I mean that's like my baseball's hard
like as a fan you go and you buy a ticket we went and watched the
Hawks in the Warriors. Play stiff, didn't play, but
like you buy a ticket for the Hawks in the Warriors.
Steph's, probably going to put up 30 or Klay Thompson's
probably going to put up 20, you know, you go buy a ticket for
the Chiefs games, Pat Mahomes gonna throw for 300 and you
know, he's probably gonna throw a no-look underhanded pass and
the crowds going to and aw go to an angel skein, buy ticket for
an Angels game and you go and you sit down and Mike Trout
could punch out three times and like rollover grounded out 63
the shortstop and Go 0 for 4, it did look at good over for with
three punches and a 63, you know, I remember I remember
vividly, I remember vividly when Dansby Swanson played in The
College World Series remainder Bill.
He just gone number one, and, you know, the pressure of going
number one. Then it goes to the Constable
Susan. I think he's like 1425.
And people are like, oh my gosh, I can't believe he went number
one, you know? Why did he go number one?
He's hitting 025 in the college was least terrible.
I mean, they've been watching for probably like two years,
those skills and those tools are going to play, they know that
and like look at dance me know, but we react to these baseball
you can't react to Proud. So for game that you spent $300
to go watch him play. Any went 0 for 3 with three
punch outs in because his tools, his tool belt is big enough that
like, you look at it into the air and he's the best player in
baseball year in year out. Not because he went over for the
game that you saw. I mean, that's why people argue
about bunting because one time they saw bunt that were You
know, and it worked it worked. And so there forever.
Belief is yeah. But like you didn't see anything
instances. Are you don't draw anything.
This is where it didn't work. Not post about that Florida.
Couple weeks. Yeah, I'm gonna bonneted and got
me. Well, I mean that's the thing is
like Point those things wrong. No, I mean, to your arrogant or
prove my point for like these things don't work also.
Well, that's the thing is like in baseball.
Nothing works 100%. And and I might be the wrong.
I might be saying this to the wrong person, but I'm not
against bunting. I, there's a time and a place
for all of it. Get it, get it.
I don't this, I don't not understand it.
I understand it. I even can I even can and
understand like why people do it?
Just and and like they're I think I like to think of things
in percentages and sorry. I like I like finding things.
So for instance, I'll give you an example.
I got really into, I don't, I don't gamble a large sums of
money, but I like, but I like gambling because I like to find
odds and percentages that are in my favor.
And so I was trying to we're talking about betting on
college, basketball moneyline. And like looking at, you know,
this team is according to the ESPN thing, is 91% 91% predicted
to win this teams. Like 85% addicted to win and
this teams like 88%. Predicted to win you parley.
Them together. Probability that this hit is
like 71%. Am I am I comfortable getting
these odds and putting $50 on a 71 percent probability of course
I am. Like of course like my odds are
good. There's 29 percent chance that I
may not win and certainly I didn't win all the time nobody
does but that's that's like bunting. it's like, It works.
Thirty percent of the time or third.
I don't know, I don't know. The probabilities right off the
top of my head, but the statistics are that.
You're not going to score if you but but There is the other
probability like you will score. When you bug, there's like a
decent probability, you will, but whatever you're comfortable
with in that moment, that's like how people misrepresent
analytics. Like it's just the information
to drive a decision. But that's all it is.
But you make your decision based on what you feel.
Just know that You know, if you put $50 on this, 71 percent
probability of this parlay hitting you might lose.
But at 71%, it's worth playing that odd.
And I think that's what people don't understand about the anti
bunting, they're just playing the odd, that's more in the
favor of not bunting. Like, I mean, you know that
you're smart guy but yeah, this is our bunting doesn't work.
This is depends on the situation, isn't it?
Depends on the situation like you know like a guy on second
moving them to the third kind of depends.
Like it's so for example like Arjuna bunts a lot right now
because we can't You know, we get you guys, you guys as you
know like and we just KK, you know, twice and then maybe like
a short pop flying. You're like that's not going to
get the job done. We need to get him to Third and
we'll just Bunch them to Third and will bunt them in like
because you guys clearly can't get it done this other way and
we need a score. So they comes back to the other
thing that I like about bunting. If you're just talking about
playing the game I show bunt right now.
Now, all of a sudden, I bring the third baseman, and if you
can hit the ball hard right now, all the sudden I can now give
myself more of the field to work with.
I think that, you know, like this is where I disagree with
Joey, Gallo Banning the shift. No, man, and somebody put posted
like Joey Gallo bunting. We begrudgingly bunting for 2
minutes, straight for getting base hits.
Some of them were also him scoring runs like, dude, they
literally shifted on you, and there's a guy on third base.
What's your what? What it like this.
This is the thing of, like, our head coach.
And I agree with him on this team, baseball.
And what is team baseball? It's about scoring runs.
It's not about your average. Oh cool.
You hit a double. All this sort of stuff, blah,
blah blah man. If the defense gives it to you,
let's take it. Let's score that run but it's
like and that's the thing of I get it.
You know, like me and somebody else got into it as far as not
got into it, but he poked me on on this of like talking about,
well, you know, wanting I can't remember what it was about, but
he was like, well, what if they're not doing it for that
reason? You know, like we talked about
team baseball, but what if they're not there for that?
What if they're there for them to go to the next level?
And, you know, it's about them, they want the glory and all that
sort of stuff. It's like I get it, but I mean,
I don't know to me at the highest level, you're not going
to win a championship. If you're all about you, like
you can't have like nine guys were.
It's all about them, Billy. It's just, not gonna, maybe you
can have one asshole. Like, I've heard, there's the
one asshole rule, it can have on a team, maybe one maybe two
assholes. And the team can can can live
with that, but more than that, like, it just function.
Yeah. Yeah.
And so, That's where we chose that goes into the conversation
through of like in in in education with Coach about Bill,
Belichick written by David halberstam which is really,
really good. Belcheck was the defensive
coordinator. I think for the Giants when they
beat the bills in the Super Bowl and all they wanted to do was
invite them who run the ball with Thurman Thomas.
For the whole game. And so they gave it to them.
They gave them the run and then, you know, they would stop them
on third down. They could score.
They he knew they couldn't stop, they're passing attack and so he
invited them to run and they took it every time and they lost
the game. Like, if you invite Joey Gallo
to bunt, you are preventing him. You are giving up one run
preventing him from scoring to You know, and so like I've only
maybe like what's the percentage you have to play the percentages
though. Like you know, how many how many
how many balls go out? What's the percentage of all
balls? That a person hits that go out?
Like it's not that high like rats where it is you would if
you had What If instead of Buck Showalter walking Barry Bonds
with the bases loaded. Hmm, he would have liked I don't
know put everybody in the Outfield and just invited him to
hit. A ground ball into the infield
somewhere or bunt or something, you know, where I could have
resulted in and out. Maybe, maybe.
I mean, I love that video though.
On a different standpoint of Barry Bonds.
I can't remember what it was that All-Star game or something
hits, a curveball, and his move to solve that problem.
It was a flyball warning track out, but the fact that he
crushed it curveball and did this like, weird thing with his
Feet. It went like this, and like
that. And then he kind of stayed on.
It was able to buy himself time for the ball to get to him and
hit it go. You know, that's your point but
at the same time, which is again, which is again, why pop
in Bat speeds really important? Because you can, you can, like,
do that and still have enough bat speed in the tank from that
position to be able to do that. It's like the ball.
He hits out against gagne in the bat against the, legendary
at-bat against gagne, where he's turning around. 100 mile an hour
fastball in his kitchen and gagne dumped him like a 3-2
slider. And he kind of like a salsa to
out to kind of Center left center field off of But it's got
enough battery to do that from that position.
Again, if you got back to being in the tank, you can do that.
Well, I mean that's that's when I go back to The.
I remember where I was going with it.
There's a talk about the bonds in the All-Star Game.
We're talking about shifting, and Bunting and putting,
although yeah, things to do it, for bonds, the opportunity to
bunt, like, I dare you to bunt well, it is done.
Well, I mean that some of that dough is like knowing how hot a
player is like. It's different bonds is not the
same person as Joey Gallo one time.
I asked Nick one time. I said Nick, if the guy the
play, if the guy on the mound is a plus it's a plus Is like great
sink plus you know, it's ground. Ball inducement is really high,
you're late in the game, the guy the plate hits ground balls at a
monster rate. He's got a negative attack angle
like you have all this information.
You got Runners on first and second in the last inning with
nobody out. One out.
Chances are if the guy hits it, it's going to be a double play.
Do you bunt him? Niggas like no way.
Like I think I do Nick. Like I think I really do because
I would rather give up one out then to, in this in this
scenario, right? I know chances are going this is
where odds come in with all the information that I have and the
analytics that I have to answer probably pretty high.
This guy's going to hit a ground ball to get What is a ground
ball to the second baseman? Shortstop, we have two outs
instead of one which is where one out is way better.
Yes. Well that's where I can play in
playing some of the scenarios that you would like if we just
play this out a little bit, Joey Gallo different than bonds bonds
has the ability to spray the ball and hit it hard to all
Fields. What?
Okay so to Gallo far well and then and then to like, A single,
right? Let's say you went with the
scenario. You put all the guys in the
Outfield, okay? A ground ball to the Outfield
can score two runs like we see this all the time in the pros
around Bali. Outfield.
Two runs score is like those guys are generally speaking.
Those guys are fast off of second base, see it through.
I like let me literally then it changes the strategy.
Guys in the feel like you got first and second or even Bases,
Loaded, boom. Ball on the ground.
You're Off to the Races. Like it's you only have to think
about it. You're gone.
And, and so then to me, whereas A bunt and it's just, maybe
shifted. Okay, maybe that's one run with
a first and second or so, sorry. Second and third, or here's,
here's another thing that can open up to Joey Gallo.
They shift on him like that. What if you figure out how to
push? But push bunt, it pretty hard
Third Base. Burn the third baseman.
Now, you get a double out of that, you know what I mean?
Like, What if double bunts were a thing?
Like that would just be because this is to me where it's like,
no don't ban the shift so much more interesting things in the
game could happen. That would just blow your mind
that you would think like that just shouldn't happen.
But now because you're doing these weird things, it now opens
up in a Ford's new ways of playing the game.
That could be really, really interesting.
This is where I like to me the Japanese because they're artists
right? The martial artists.
Like there is this more part of their culture.
They actually liked bunting they had like a whole like game to
move into it and you're just like okay then you have Ichiro
who's like I could hit home runs but I think it's harder and more
fun to hit. Singles are like okay but you're
always you know what I mean? Like yeah, he showed a
completely different side to the game and this is where I'm not
opposed to all this stuff that we're talking about bats.
And all this sort of stuff, right?
This is where it goes back to again.
Good faith. Argument some people.
They just have an agenda. It's like, no, I want like let's
put all this on the table. Let's have a conversation.
And like this is the one thing that I took away from inning by
inning, with Augie garrido in terms of what somebody said
about. It's like, here's this game of
baseball and let me make it more beautiful for you.
I'm like that's a great mentality like and why I like
ecological Dynamics because I think it, it makes the game way
more beautiful, way more interesting, way more cool.
Way more. Awesome.
For sure. No, good morning.
I mean I have two kids and a son and a daughter.
And the mortgage think the game is the better.
You know, I want them to like it.
I want them to play it, yada yada yada, but yeah, but he
goes, I mean to have this conversation about gallo and it
It goes to players like Juan again, it goes to coaches
wanting to connect the dots between the, you know, the gate
just being spoon fed information, Gatekeepers versus
the search and experimentation of information, it go.
It will go to players. Wanting to build a better tool
belt. You know, it would I got have a
hard time believing that the organism that is Joey gallo.
In the right in past in the right environment with the right
tools as hypersensitive and as good as he is, as athletic as he
is. Hmm.
But it developed a more robust tool belt.
Like couldn't develop the ability to improve his back to
ball skills. Hit balls the other way, you
know, but balls drag bunt balls, first pitch?
No first pitch, you know, fastball whatever he could just
like do something with it. If He practicing was afforded,
the opportunities in environment to do that.
I mean, I believe he's a bill player.
Why would he not have the ability to do this?
Yeah. Yeah, he could do, it could want
to do, you know? I don't know.
You know, it's like it's like if
we want to cut down, strike out in the big leagues and we got to
make the practice environment part, which again you're dealing
with guys and people listen to this podcast to probably never
really interacted with a pro player.
Not. But your mean, if you have, you
understand that like, The confidence is kind of bravado,
it takes to get to that level. They're like really hard to talk
to because they can't really tell them anything because their
self belief is off the charts, because it has to be gears that
belief to get to that level has to be off, guard has to be.
And so to say, man, like I think that we can improve your
basketball skills. We just made your training
environment harder which is going to invite you to fail more
in this but But it's going to improve your batch of all skills
Fillmore in. You, you develop this a more
robust ability to do these things.
It's like the uncertainty of the whole picture.
Like I don't know, man. I'd rather just like do what I
do because I got here and I don't want to mess this up
because it's a pretty good deal. Don't blame you for that.
But like it's kind of the, its kind of the Like the Russian
Roulette of baseball. Think it's going to end.
Like it's going to end. So I think if people understood
that fact, it's like number one, you everybody sucked.
Okay. Some people just suck less than
other people, but everybody's back in hitting everybody's
back. Your challenge is just to be
less pain and so challenging practice, like help you be less
bad, but it's going to make you look bad.
You know into like it's going to be over the what what what is
the drawback of taking chances? It's going to be over, you know
what is what is the drawback of like Pushing your cards all into
this head into the middle of the table.
Like what's the drawback going to be over anyway?
Do maybe you extend your career. Through your for five more
years. Maybe you extend your journey
from high school to college, maybe you in your journey from
JV to Varsity, you weren't a varsity player.
I mean, I had a kid like that he wasn't a varsity player, it was
nice. Going to sit on the end of The
Varsity. Pink came in as a 9th grader,
with an exit velocity of like, 60 miles an hour.
He's a junior now and he's like playing darting and getting to
play. Because he took chance, he took
a risk chance like made himself a better player.
I think everybody should have broached that one.
You know, I think everybody should approach most things in
life that way because it's going to be over.
What are the chances of being? What are the woods?
What's the difference of being right and wrong?
You know, it's going to end anyway.
So you took some changes in you were wrong.
Oh well. Well, I mean it's that whole
thing that that Donnie occur likes to say practice dirty to
play clean. I mean to me practice who nobody
nobody is there watching. Generally, speaking 8 know, even
even if the media is, there are your ears are there.
You know, next thing ya years are there and so you know like
like I could tell when we could use polish but we can use like
Bryce Harper, like Bryce Harper wants to look Look like a
buffoon, you know, in the cage before the game in front of the
rookies or even in the offseason, like Bryce Harper
wants to come to a cage with college players and look like a
total buffoon. Yeah I get that but that's the
thing with like minor league but you can't get minor.
Leaguers practicing hard environments in front of people
you can't. They don't want to look like
total crap front of regular people, they don't I get it rid
of minor Leaguer wondering you want and wanted to hit off the
machine and just struggled he could get out fast enough.
Yeah, no. I mean but that's a thing of
like how do we help? How do we help guys have like a
stronger mentally? I think it comes back to.
This is the other thing of why is it that players are resistant
to change this different, all this different stuff.
It's like, it's the going back to what we talked about earlier.
The frame problem, like how they're looking at the game.
They just don't understand in my, at least to me.
Okay. If I present it to you you
understand it and you go. Nah, nah, then it's like, okay.
At least you write informed consent.
Right? If we're going back to the covid
stuff, informed consent. At least you understood.
And you rejected it because you understood.
But, you know, to me when you actually understand and come
back to like, well what is the game?
What is this game that if you want to keep playing and playing
at a high level? If you can figure out what the
game is and I know there's multiple different games being
played, right? There's the game itself and then
there is how an organization looks at the game and how they
understand the game and how they value, you based upon their And
this is to those are two separate games, but if you just
understand like the baseball game side of it, like what you
got to do to be successful. I mean, it's much broader.
I think that's the thing that I want to say is much broader than
most people. They actually have a limited
view that restricts them and to me it's like no we you need to
discover the full. The full length, or the full
breadth of what the game is. And that gives you so many more
options, like, you don't get to so many people get pissed off.
I hit it bad. Well, did you hit it where they
weren't? Yeah, you get on base.
Yeah, right then chill out. It's fine.
You know, like you don't have to I made this analogy to our
players because they're getting pissed and they're like hitting
the ball decently. Well, it's like and just
struggling and maybe a little bit.
I'm like, guys. This game is so hard and you're
going in there. Like you're a fighter and
getting pissed off that you didn't knock the guy out with
every single punch. You threw like, dude, play the
game like you, do you understand a fight?
You're just not every single punch.
You throw as a knockout punch. Like sometimes you hit him in
the ribs or whatever and you're like, you're playing the game.
You're each at-bat. At least to me is like, don't
think that? Oh, I struck out there.
Did you learn something? Did you get a little bit better?
You're getting your timing down because you're going to use that
information. It's going to go into the next
step. Set it up just in the way like
your boxing, like you set things up, like you sometimes do
things, you might lose this round, or this little
interaction, so that you can win the next one.
If you like that's to me, where guys just don't understand and
they view it like you were talking about, they're not
looking at the whole body of work, they don't understand the
full game there. So stuck in the little moment
game in, like, oh, I have to win this one.
Yeah, I mean you should but if you don't, can you still gain
and and set you up to be successful?
Us fall in the next one. Please for me, it's a it's a
frame problem for a lot of players.
They don't understand the full game and I need to get better at
figuring out, like, how can I help with that?
Because I actually think poachers are back to what we
talked about before. Coaches are probably part of the
problem. It's the frames that they put on
the players and then the players eventually includes me.
That includes me and you also yes.
No. 100 years, not? Yes, yes, looting.
Our self from the right? Yes, I am part of the problem.
Well, not should be less of a problem.
My old daily goal like can I be less of a problem and it takes
humility to recognize that. I think a lot of coaches don't
have the humility, like his, right?
We're back to the whole thing that you said before the
security blanket. Like I need to feel as though
I'm actually helping because if I don't like now I'm going to
beat myself up. I this is where for me it's like
look in our head coach said this and I want to say this to like
look, you're going to have to perform in spite of me.
You're going to like I'm going to tell you things that are not
going to work, they're going to hurt you and be bad for your
career and you're going to have to perform in spite of that.
But every coach and I mean because it's true of all of us
player included. They're going to be things that
you're going to try. They're going to hurt your
career and just mentalities things, whatever, and the coach
same way. So you're going to have to
overcome all of that. But there's also going to be
things in there that are going to help you.
So what you're going to throw out all this stuff.
Well then you throw it yourself and your throat other people
trying to help you. Like you have to, you have to
develop a system by which you can discern.
What is useful absorb what is useful?
Discard what is not add? What is uniquely your own?
Do you know, to quote Bruce Lee, if you have to have some sort of
system, some sort of a process by which you can filter.
Right. I think that goes from just
general understanding of What are the what are the principles
of the matter? What are the principles of the
matter? And then, you know, built our
information through that like actual information?
Like not, I mean, maybe anecdotes because like you said
any of those can sometimes be useful if it agrees with the
principal Well and to exploring the other thing to on the
principal side of it this is to me a principle.
You should test every principle to see.
Does it actually hold up? Because as you big, get those
little anecdotes while anecdotes that pile up over time become
like a large body of evidence and then you may have to.
So then you begin to understand. Well, how does the principal
live and exist in the in the world?
Is it just purely theoretical? And it was just a, you know, a
pie in the sky Ivory Tower concept that has no Basis in
reality is just like a nice, you know, intellectually consistent
thing. But it's not how reality
actually works because to me, that's where reality is the best
teacher in the sense of like, that's where all the truth,
actually lies. A lot of this stuff is
theoretical but we, that's what to me.
You always should take the theories.
You're like, hey, this makes sense.
Let's cool. Let's go take it into the lab.
Let's test it out. Let's apply it.
Let's see how much at least to me.
How much does it? Hold water like everything.
That's the whole reason I have this conversation.
Ation with you and for you to disagree with me as like how
good are these ideas? Do they actually hold water?
For sure. No, no, I'm totally with you and
I think you can be good. I work by myself a lot.
I know, you know, I'm I'm by myself.
So I've become quite good at like questioning my own ideas,
you know. And and I think that can be a
tool for a lot of coaches, like, question yourself question.
What, you know, you know, I think they coaches say, well, I
can't, because I can't appear as less than whatever to my play.
Layers, which is fine, which is fire.
Your challenges is a coach or greater greater than that.
You know. If anything, you know, I don't
know. I don't know.
Tony vital. Oh, my sister works at UT is
athletic director at UT. I don't know.
Tony. Vital of never met him.
But what appears to be true in how they play and how they is
that, he empowers them to be confident in who they are and in
like comfortable in their own skin enough to play the game in
a way that they're not questioning themselves all the
time. And so what you see culminate is
way more important than anything he could ever do or say or Or
adjust or feel stretched easily or fundamentally or whatever he
just like in powers. Like that's his most important
job. It's like and you Empower your
plate. Be confident in their own skin
and I think coaches missed that. There's so many layers to be a
coach. It's like Yeah, you got good
players. So part of your job is to make
them good and then Empower them to play at whatever Peak
Performance. And then, you know, Challenge
them to question what they are doing or what I mean.
That's I think that's what I do to do well with players.
It's like I challenge you to question and coaches to.
I mean, Chase with tell you this people that have been around me
and worked with me in the eyes. Like you may be right but I will
make you think about it. Like I'll make you think about
your position like are you sure? I agree with you but why are you
sure that what you just said is right, or true?
You know, I feel that way with players to players who say
things and I'll say, you know, are you sure like why?
Why? And then they have to defend
their position. Okay, we can go with that.
Because I don't long as you play good, I don't care, right?
But if you're not playing good then we have to ask question.
And that's that's where it's hard for hitters though, right?
You hit a couple ground balls or you strike out and you're like
well that didn't work. You can be right back to the
whole thing of you like let's look at a whole body of work.
I don't know what that number is like, that's where it becomes
really hard. You know, this year, we've only
played, I think I don't even know if we're at might be be at
like 20 games right now. Like it's really hard, some guys
numbers started to pick up a few weeks ago and then, you know, we
played it a tough team, some numbers held.
Okay. And then other guys like their
numbers drop way down again. It's like, I mean, I don't even
know if anybody. I don't think anybody has 100
at-bats. We might, but somebody might be
closer to honor plate appearances but like that's,
that's rough. I think that's the thing though
that goes into, like information.
And what coaches use? You know what coaches used is,
is to justify their decision to stay with a guy, or is it maybe
they use game information, maybe these stats from the fall in the
belief that they think the kid can hit.
So they're going to stay with him.
You practice information. Wrap Soto hit track blast.
He shows these plus qualities, we're going to stay with him,
these bad ball. Tendencies were going to stay
with him because if that we think we can Empower and him, he
can get, he can get himself into the right mental space.
He's got the tools inability to do it.
We that that's, you know, that was one of the things that for
me, was illuminated early on whenever started using a lot of
Technology, like there a lot of swings that are good enough.
It just good enough like your swing is good enough.
Now let's go try to Break it in as many ways possible.
That's what the game is trying to do.
You know, that's what's great about inventing thing.
You know, if you want to invent things, Like the spinner, you
know, and then spare, a building arm care tool.
It's been reiterated 10 times because people broke it in
interesting ways that I wasn't thinking about.
Do you have to go back and you have to look at what you did?
And it's like, okay well we'll fix will make this better.
If you never break your swing or your approach in.
You never never gets broken. Then you should never get the,
you never get the opportunity to fix it.
You should be trying to break it, right?
I got a lot. I think this goes back to what
you're talking about to with ideas like in our Concepts and
whatnot. Like, for example, things won't
work and then Everett somebody be just like, oh it's garbage.
Just Touch Chuck. It I'm like no yeah if the
premises were good and you need to go back and analyze.
What about what I did? You know?
Like you have to, you have to examine it.
Maybe if I tweak some things, then it will actually work the
first time, Thomas Edison's. Light bulb broke.
Right? Stupid, light bulb.
Yeah, not gonna work. This is dumb idea.
Let's go work on candles. Yeah, we would never I mean we'd
probably arrived at life, but it wouldn't mean from Thomas
Edison, right, right. And that's a beauty but we the
Thomas wins the beginning. Well, that's what's hard though,
right? Because of the somebody that had
a long Thread about coaches and maybe they're talking about
Petey's, but it's like, everything is about winning.
So you have a short time span to, like, figure it out and I
get it because, you know, sometimes we get focused on the
wrong thing to. And so, it's better sometimes
that we get fired because then we take Deeper examination of
our own processes and our own systems.
And we actually then make some shifts in some changes.
But I mean, similarly people also take the wrong
interpretation and Chuck things that were actually good and not
let go of them. So it's a it's a constant battle
and this is where to me it's running those different thought
experiments. Like we just ran unlike the
whole bunting conversation that we had.
You know, of there are it's this is where I had to me.
It's All about the nuance and until you have these types of
conversations that we're having, you can't work out that Nuance
on Twitter, like nobody reads past the first maybe couple
tweets. Anyways.
Right, like this is where to I don't mind saying some
interesting things way buried in the comments because I know
nobody's really going to see those.
And so, yeah, you can, you can let out your deepest Secrets.
Sometimes your, your, your best idea is way deep in the comments
and nobody's really going to steal them because most people
don't actually go down in there and read.
So the effort to go down that far, it's too much work.
Well, why are you even on Twitter?
I just to scroll. Okay?
So then everything that you have is going to be a super
superficial understanding of things, and that's where I
actually see a lot of, you know, you could talk about the
problems, right? If I'm always on to the next
newest thing. And blah blah blah.
Well, you only have a superficial understanding of
these things and so you you really there's no depth to what
it is that you're doing and I think young players, they can't
discern that early on, but the longer that you stay in the
game, the more I think you'll have a sense of like, okay, this
coach just pull stuff off Twitter and Instagram and
doesn't really understand what he's doing and is only going to
give you a really superficial answers, but then you run into
coaches that have a deeper understanding and can actually
explain things at a deeper level and can really help you out.
I think that's where the separation is, but it's really
hard in the sense of, you know, maybe we Talk about this when I
was on your Pat podcast, I struggle with the superficial
stuff because like I'm just I'm a deeper person and so the only
time where I can really I guess in some ways I feel like people
can really see who I am is through a longer interaction.
You can't like in a short-term whatever I'm just not going to
impress. I'm not going to be very
impressive in a short interaction.
No me either. No me neither.
It's funny. You said this on my podcast and
the been I regurgitate a lot is the degrees of freedom problem
on the internet. Yeah.
And Coach chase a lot of super visual information on the
internet. One of the coaches that I
consulted with and worked with this past fall.
You had a chance to play in the last game of the year, you know,
got away from I think what he asked me whether he founded
accidentally, whether he he founded purposefully something
that really really worked well for him chasing information that
he saw on the internet. And so I come in and my job is
just go in, like observe practice and just tell him what
I think. And I told him that, like, if I
do this This, I'm just going to tell you what, I think, like
whether you hate it, whether you like it, whether you use it, I
have no idea. But he says, he says, you know,
in our time working together, he says, you know, a lot of the
stuff you said we used to do and for some way we got away from
doing that, you know, and he said, maybe I was chasing things
that I liked on the internet. Well, maybe not, maybe whatever,
but but again, The the information I gave him about his
practice. Just kind of go to hit the ball
hard. You got to hit the ball off the
ground. These are kind of the things
that the task, constraints and environmental constraints that I
would do to try to facilitate self-organization to those
things. He just didn't know that.
And, you know, he just didn't know that, that, that was what
was happening when he was doing those things that were good.
They were like positive adaptation to the practice task.
And so again, it goes back to like an understanding of the
batted ball outcome and then working backwards.
They're doing really well. This year though.
I think he's kind of God back to what?
He, when he observed in a previous time to work.
Well, that is again on the Internet is Chase.
Some things that he thought was a good idea, but weren't rooted
in something. That was going to create the
good. Past meditation.
I had my headphones died so I can actually hear you.
So I had to do a little bit of lip reading there and I feel so
bad because you just went, you probably spent.
You said a lot of really good things that I just did.
Get, no, just tell the story about hope.
The people can hear the story because I think it's good about
yes. The degrees of freedom problem
on Twitter and a coach that I work with, in the fall, chasing
some super visual things that he saw on Twitter and kind of
getting away from the principles of You know, that of all
outcomes and working backwards and positive attitude, creating
past challenges that kind of illicit in a Ford positive
adaptations to achieve the best of all outcome versus whatever
they're doing. Well, the hopefully he's going
back to those things because he when I go and I can do the when
I work with these people. I just tell them my observation
then perspectives and that's what I try to do on the internet
though. Hmm, let's try to tell people
what I think like I do. Or why I think it no don't try
to belong to the crowd, which is why you.
And I kind of get along and though he would get along.
Absolutely not trying to belong to a crowd of whatever, just
trying to do the best work I can.
No, absolutely. Um I guess to wrap up then.
Are there any is there any things that you would encourage
people to, you know, look into resources, doesn't even have to
be baseball related. I know I probably asked this
question all the time, but I'm just curious if there's anything
new that you would encourage people to look into on their
own. um, I mean I have been Obviously, Rob Graves podcast.
That's pretty, I think, people, listen, this probably know that
I've been listening to Andrew huberman, a lot.
Mmm. Human lab is good.
I picked up the book, dopamine niggas, don't mean Nation.
Hmm, I'm trying to trying to get a better better.
Understanding of Why parents are crazy around Youth Sports and I
think dopamine response. Is a lot to do that.
So I'm trying to understand that a degree to a better degree,
think it's called dopamine Nation thing.
Somebody talked about it recently and I grab it, I don't
know. Nothing.
Nobody really knew. I think.
Curating your Twitter feed is really important.
You know what you mean by that? Just by Avery I think if people
understand the way that I used Twitter, Is I spend more time on
tweetdeck, then I do Twitter on the website because you can set
on tweetdeck, I can not only, I can.
And I do, I follow your likes. The tweets that you like,
sweets, that Caleb, like tweets that Devin likes tweets, that
dry likes people that I like their ideas.
I also follow things they like on Twitter, And so, but it
doesn't give you that functionality.
I have to go to your profile and I have to look at your likes but
like on tweetdeck you can just set a column of like things that
Garrett likes and you can set it.
Here's a column of Garrett Williams.
Like is that a NASA are traveling during that, Jitter
desktop thing just on the desktop.
Just just on the tweetdeck website.
And so I try to use tweetdeck more than use Twitter.
So I can see more stuff because Twitter is we've talked about
this. It's a, it's an amazing place.
It is an amazing place to get information.
You can get the fights out of there, find people you like, and
then, like you're sitting at a desk computer all day, just pull
up tweak that set your tweetdeck to be whatever and then you will
get so much more value out of Twitter is using tweetdeck, then
the native Twitter application, Phone.
Though enough I only have it on my phone now because I have to
upload the energy drink review and I'm on my hot spot and so
it's only reason I have to learn my phone, that's the only reason
I have any social media, my phone so I can upload the energy
when I'm not on Wi-Fi. I mean, that's where I don't
know. I got rid of Facebook on my
phone and I like to get rid of other social media apps.
But the thing is, is that if you're going to be good at this
like baseball business stuff, I feel like you have to be on
social media. You just have to, yep.
And you have to be on it all the time, which is again, this is a
whole nother conversation of like, yeah, what are good uses
of this from that perspective? We need to be out.
That's, that's a next time, conversation.
But I'm not sure that I'm good at that, I don't know.
I mean, Chad you have way more followers than I do.
Yeah, yo your research here is much earlier.
It goes back to thank you and I made talked about this Kevin
Kelly's, thousand, true fans. If there's always room,
references, Kevin Kelley's thousand, true fans.
I don't think I've done that. And so my, my own questioning of
my own methods are, like, why haven't I been able to connect
with 1,000 people through all this time?
Well, I mean here's well. Okay.
Is this an exercise that I think?
Well, I have no idea. But here's here's the thing that
I know that you've seemed to do. Well, I don't know because I
don't, you know, we can talk about this offline but okay, I
want to plug. I want to plug your stuff.
For example, you got you have to podcast, you got your your, you
know, members only components like all your different product
like, so tell me a little bit. It just briefly for so people
know where to find your stuff and like, what do you have, what
you're offering. Because I know that you've got a
lot of good resources. Where can people find those?
And what are those? I think the challenge is an
interesting conversation that I've been on stumbling a into
lightly. I think the challenge because
everybody has such a superficial understanding of things.
They're not going to go to a website and dig.
Hmm. So how do you get with the atom
one or two clicks information to people?
They want to flick and when they get there.
The supervision is out of. It is interesting enough that
they scroll. And so I have a website.
It's not useful. It's not what I've been doing
lately is developing the link trees that you can put in the
bayou that when you click it open something that has seven or
eight highly visible buttons on it.
That has topics in headlines that you can just click.
Now, is that work better for you?
So it's super easy. So it's super easy.
So I have like, I'm developing a link tree for our in gym parents
because I can hang a, QR code in the facility and say because we
got pretty decent QR codes. You know, if you want to get two
more online in for, because that's a thing of struggle
within the facility is getting people to online information.
Here's a QR code that will pull up a link tree.
That's got eight. Links on it, it's simple.
Scan the code opens, the link tri-band, click the link.
Here's the, here's the six or seven links.
I want you to see. Anyway, you know, it's hard in
the facility to get people to follow.
You on social media like you hang up, the QR code, and for
more information, scan the QR code and they scan the QR code
because they're sitting there just doing nothing.
It gets them to a link tree, that'll get them to five or six
pieces. I want them to go to anyone.
Same thing with Twitter, I've got a Twitter so General
reference link tree that gets you to four or five things that
hopefully simple will get to the point that, you know, that I
visible enough that you want to help and support the work that I
do. Yada yada yada again.
It's not perfect. I remote client.
I've gotten really good with the two or three platforms.
I think with remote clients now, it's how do you recruit more
remote clients and so developing a link tree that you get you to
information that will get Like a 10 minute at most maybe five
minutes, education on what we're going to try to do and how we're
going to try to attack it and you know, body out, I think
using link trees is like a good thing.
Like how you can get people to links and information more
links. And more information from social
media Again, I could be wrong about that.
We could talking in through three months and I could have
changed my mind about that, but that's what I want to do.
It's all about how you use the tool.
I've seen people inappropriate lose, use it as a way to put
everything in there. I'm like, no, that doesn't work.
It's got to be to your point. Maybe eight Max, you know, like
to me if you have like, 20 things in there, oh, that's
overwhelming. You look at it, you're like, oh
my gosh, I don't even know, right?
Like it, so disorganized, I mean, that's how websites are in
a lot of ways. People just want to scroll.
You know, they just want to scroll on this one.
Click button and I question sometimes in business, like are
we so far into the degrees of freedom information that these
platforms are even useful anymore?
You know, it's all about ease of use.
Why is it that people use Apple products over windows?
It's because it's easier to use it's more intuitive and like,
but that's, that's an art in and of itself.
But anyways, so but make sure to go follow Chad.
I want to plug your your podcast and Twitter, my Twitter, my
Instagram, all the things I've tried to make it simple to find
just search my name. Everywhere you go, Chad
Longworth, they'll Link tree there.
You're interested in more of the work that you want to dig into
the link will get you to link 3. It'll get you down, whatever
maybe I should do more. Maybe I should do last.
I'm not sure, but we're running with this idea right now that
help people easier get to things that I do.
Well of it and then we deck use tweeted.
Yes. Follows people of them, follow
their like dig into their work. I try to like things that I try
to like things that people would find interesting also.
So that's it. Alright, thanks again for coming
on. Like it's always, it's always
great having you on and and exploring all these different
ideas and stuff is good.