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Welcome back to Finding the Edge
Podcast. 

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I'm Garrett Boyam joined with 
Garrett Baker. 

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It's been a it's been a minute 
since you've been on and today 

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we wanted to go over we we all 
have seen the sport movement 

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skill conference and these two 
were were at it. 

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Baker presented at it. 
So we wanted to do just a a 

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debrief or yeah on it and like 
kind of promote, promote the 

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event people should come next 
year and all that sort of stuff.

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But yeah, so have have on 
Baker's fellow Co worker AJ 

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Ferrara, I don't know if you 
guys want to do a little brief 

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intro especially for you AJ 
because we haven't had you on 

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the podcast before. 
So who Who's AJ? 

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Sure, Al. 
First boy, and thanks for having

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me. 
Garrett, good to see you. 

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The way I got connected with 
with Baker is I was kind of his 

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his henchman analyst guy working
with the Mets and so we had some

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great discussions kind of 
chatting about eco D frameworks 

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and playing parkour together 
doing everything under the sun. 

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So pleasure to be on here, kind 
of continue the conversation, 

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play ball D3 ball back at Johns 
Hopkins and then I studied 

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engineering, was kind of doing 
some software engineering right 

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out of college, transition more 
into analytics role and kind of 

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thanks to Baker got my mind 
looped around the idea of 

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integrating eco D more into 
sports and live. 

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So I've been pretty fascinated 
by that recently. 

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I guess I I owe your apology for
pulling you, pulling you down 

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down into this. 
But no, I mean we we've had 

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probably and if anybody goes and
watches the SMSC and sees my 

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talk, my, my training, my 
parkour training partner which I

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talk about a little bit tied in 
with baseball was AJ the the 

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entire year. 
So we basically just moved 

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around jumped on walls looked 
kind of look kind of foolish. 

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The random onlookers on on 
Florida just going for their 

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nice Florida morning stroll down
in Port Saint Lucie. 

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But we've had some nice nice eco
detox and then here we are 

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wrapping up the the SMSC which 
again like I mean Garrett talked

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about and we'll talk about as we
go forward here I'm sure. 

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But like great, great event and 
I highly suggest anybody to go 

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go check it out, not just 
because I spoke, but because 

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like there's good talk after 
good talk. 

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And now they set it up 20 
minutes at a time, which is 

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really good. 
So if you don't have a ton of 

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time, like you can grab 20 
minutes worth of a talk and then

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come back later for more. 
I'm a little Ted talk style. 

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So I think I think the event was
really well done and a lot of 

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good, a lot of good ideas 
shared. 

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Do you want to briefly because 
there was an in person part this

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year, Do you kind of want to 
talk about like your guys's 

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experience real quick of like 
what what was your guys overall 

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experience especially being at 
the in person part Because I 

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think you know hopefully in the 
future you know there's more 

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people that come to the in 
person part because there 

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there's something about being in
person being able to to really 

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interact with others really 
creates a different experience. 

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You know and you you learn you 
can learn so much more by being 

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there in person. 
And so I don't, I want to kind 

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of hear what was your guys's 
experience with that because I 

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think this is the first year 
that they've done it like, you 

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know, part online and part in 
person in such an intimate 

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setting. 
Yeah, the first one was all in 

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person, all that sort of stuff. 
But I think I'm kind of curious 

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like what's your guys's 
experience with this was? 

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Was it, was it similar to, you 
know, other ones like in person 

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or what was? 
Was there anything unique about 

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this set up? 
This was the first in person 

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I've been to, so maybe Garrett 
can add some more context, but I

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thought it was really good from 
the standpoint of the Ted tile. 

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Ted Talk style presentations 
were great exposure to different

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concepts. 
But where you really learn and 

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start to integrate them into 
your own framework is when you 

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actually get to interact with 
them with other people keeping 

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those conversations. 
I know that in the in person we 

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did a bunch of that chatting 
with people, getting to hear the

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things that they're working 
through with other participants.

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And then also we had our back 
channels as well where both 

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Garrett's, we had great 
conversations off the sides. 

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And that's really where you 
start to integrate it into your 

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actual knowledge base and find 
ways to apply it is by 

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interacting with those ideas 
you're exposed to in the actual 

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sessions. 
Yeah. 

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The in the in person I think 
compared to most in persons is a

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lot more intimate and it's 
really cool since you it's kind 

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of like kind of like a hot stove
type deal where you go through 

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all these talks throughout the 
day and then you meet up in a 

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little more intimate group 
setting. 

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And it you can either talk 
through some of the concepts 

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that you heard today or that day
or you can talk through just 

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anything on your mind. 
And I think the one cool thing 

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that Sean and Tyler did is 
really take us through some 

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practical things even like they 
took us through an entire warm 

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up and how they may potentially 
structure or warm up or how they

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may potentially structure some 
kind of practice design. 

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And it wasn't there on the 
football side of things. 

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But then they opened it up for 
any other coach there to present

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to their practice design. 
And then all the other coaches 

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can pitch in and ways they could
potentially make it a little bit

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better. 
And basically it was a big, 

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there's a big like group 
discussion, a roundtable 

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discussion around coaching 
around these ideas of eco D 

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about pretty much anything, 
anything was on the table. 

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So it was, it was unique in that
in that front where it's very 

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informal, there was, there was a
loose structure to it, but there

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wasn't anything like an agenda 
you have to follow. 

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That allowed us to kind of guide
the sessions a little bit more 

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than your typical conference 
where there's a certain agenda 

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they want to get through these 
exact topics versus like we were

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able to give and take in 
different ways where we could 

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present some of our ideas and 
also take while other people 

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were talking about their own 
ideas or just like some of the 

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theory or just stuff they heard 
that really resonated him for 

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that day. 
So I think that was that was 

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really cool and in my opinion it
was one of the the more 

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impactful in person conferences 
that I've actually been to, even

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though that was only a small 
portion of of the actual event. 

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Well, good deal. 
So if you guys want to check out

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the Sport Movement Skill 
Conference 2023, make sure to 

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head over to Emergent Movement 
MV mt.com. 

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I'll throw a link in the 
description. 

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And also if you want to save 7% 
on it, make sure you make sure 

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to use the Code Edge 7. 
So without further ado, I hope 

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you enjoy today's podcast. 
I think that's kind of some of 

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this. 
The thing of I've had to learn 

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that though. 
I think that for me is just 

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being so tied to the ideal that 
you kind of don't compromise. 

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But I think this is hopefully 
this get get us started on 

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something. 
Because I mean for me that's 

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where even with some of the 
ecological dynamic stuff like 

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I'd, it was helpful going 
through what I did at Missouri 

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State and then just having some 
stuff like change on the faith 

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side of things and just being 
able to find a way to learn how 

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to, like you could say submit to
authority in a way, but also not

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give up on what you believe in, 
but find a way in what in 

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somebody else's system, how to 
apply an ecological approach. 

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Because once you really, to me, 
once you understand the ideas 

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and the concepts, you can always
find a way to make it to, to 

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operate within an ecological 
approach. 

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And so for me, it was, you know,
little things of, like finding 

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what a person was already doing 
and finding a way to help them 

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with what they were already 
doing to have success. 

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And like, hey, here's a way that
you can do this better, even if 

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even if it was not, you know, 
respected or, you know, if it 

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was what's the word, you know, 
it was decoupled. 

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You know, they're hitting off of
AT or whatever. 

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It's like, hey, you know, here's
how we could do this a little 

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bit better. 
Here's how I could make it a 

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little bit like, you know, 
manipulating constraints. 

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And that's The thing is the you 
know because constraints are 

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always present I can always 
manipulate them and help guide 

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the the athlete to be better at 
whatever it is that they're 

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doing. 
And so I think that that helped 

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me build build some trust with 
the athletes so so that I could 

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be able to kind of build a 
relationship. 

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But also I think the other thing
you know taking a learner 

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centered approach and I always 
said you know what, but find 

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what works for you. 
I always said that to them and 

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gave them the freedom so that it
wasn't like, well, you have to 

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do what I just told you to do, 
or rather find a way to make 

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this work for you so that you 
have success. 

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Yeah, I think that's the biggest
thing is we're, I think in the 

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ecological space, like we're 
viewed as like we're trying to 

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change everything. 
We're just trying to blow up, 

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blow up everything you're doing 
and you're doing it wrong and 

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you have to do it this way. 
But I think as I've matured 

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through these ideas, it is very 
much like, hey, I'm not trying 

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to, we're not trying to change 
everything. 

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We're trying to just make it a 
little better. 

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Like, how can we potentially 
make this a little better? 

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And while tying one of the talks
here, like Tyler Yerby's talk, I

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think was really practical on 
that, on that front in the SMSC,

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because he talked about just 
like, guiding, guiding one 

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search. 
And that was the biggest thing, 

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like asking questions. 
And it's like, to use a 

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practical example, I forget 
exactly what to use for for 

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baseball. 
But it's a similar question that

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he asked. 
It's like in a bullpen setting. 

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We're already throwing the 
bullpen, and we're going to be 

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throwing fastballs. 
So I could guide one searches 

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like, hey, show me how you would
strike somebody out with this 

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fastball up in the zone. 
And now you're guiding one 

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search to an area of where you 
could potentially throw this 

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ball to getting out. 
And now you're coupling it to 

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the actual problem at a little 
bit higher. 

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Even if I don't stand in, even 
if it's just in the bullpen, but

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you're just making it that 
little bit better. 

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And I think Tyler did a really 
good job of explaining that. 

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Or like, hey, show me how you 
can use your fastball in 

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different ways to get inside or 
jam a hitter. 

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And just simple things like that
changes, changes their 

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intentions, which changes their 
search, which again, like now 

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we're kind of starting to couple
it to it like a problem solution

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dynamic versus just like hey, 
we're just doing rote 

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repetition, fastball, fastball, 
fastball or something along 

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those lines, which I think is a 
really good way. 

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And again, it's not, we're not 
changing what we're doing, we're

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just making it a little better. 
And I think that's a simple way 

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to do it in an ecological 
approach. 

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Yeah I I think the two on that 
point the the whole question of 

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show me. 
I have to remember that 

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sometimes partially because you 
know in my context sometimes 

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I've had conversations with with
with my head coach of like hey 

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we need to we can't just let 
them just figure it out. 

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Like sometimes like we got to 
give them answers, you know, 

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like they come here to us, you 
know, to you could say get 

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better, like you know, to have 
some sort of answers. 

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It's like, OK, you know, that's 
that's not really how. 

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But at the same point I was 
like, all right, you know what, 

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I'll just take this and and and 
feel like I have the freedom to 

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speed up the process. 
Because a lot of times I was 

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just asking questions and having
them, like, try to answer and 

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they had no idea how to answer 
the questions that I'm asking of

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like, well, you know, like, for 
example, all right, let's begin 

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to think of the problem of 
hitting. 

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So like what? 
You know, what dictates where 

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the ball goes on the field. 
Like just different, like, or 

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like how many different ways, 
blah, blah, blah. 

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And so like these things they 
just had no answers for like how

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could, how else could you get to
this inside pitch right to using

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that as an example because 
that's, you know, you pitchers 

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want to throw it inside and up 
and in and it's like, OK, how do

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you, how do you get the barrel 
there? 

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You know show me some different 
ways and they just have zero 

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clue. 
So sometimes I'll I'll be like 

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hey here's one way that you 
could do it. 

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And so sometimes I would give 
them the answer but I wouldn't 

225
00:12:29,560 --> 00:12:32,520
tell them that this is the only 
answer and that they have to do 

226
00:12:32,520 --> 00:12:37,560
it they this way. 
And I think for me that's kind 

227
00:12:37,560 --> 00:12:41,480
of how I'd I found kind of a 
happy medium with that of. 

228
00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:46,160
But at the same time sometimes 
when I, if I if I'm explaining 

229
00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:49,280
too much I think that's where 
it. 

230
00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:52,040
I always have to go back to the 
thing that Tyler said a long 

231
00:12:52,040 --> 00:12:54,720
time ago is like show, show, 
don't tell. 

232
00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:59,040
You know so when instead of like
the athlete, you know coming 

233
00:12:59,040 --> 00:13:02,120
back and like hey, you know what
what happened there, you know 

234
00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:04,360
and I go what could you do next 
you know next time and they 

235
00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:06,400
start to explain. 
I go no, no, show me. 

236
00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:12,760
And I think that that is an 
important piece because, you 

237
00:13:12,760 --> 00:13:15,920
know, I might have said this on 
a podcast once before, but like,

238
00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:19,480
what's the language of the body?
You know, is it thoughts is a 

239
00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:22,600
word, What language does it 
speak? 

240
00:13:22,880 --> 00:13:27,600
And usually where we kind of 
work to is like body doesn't 

241
00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:30,280
understand thoughts. 
You know, it can kind of 

242
00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:32,600
understands feeling. 
But really what it really, 

243
00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:34,320
really truly understands is 
movement. 

244
00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:38,520
And so if you want to make a 
change, you actually, a lot of 

245
00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:42,880
times you actually have to feel 
what it is that you want to do 

246
00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:49,600
or you know, Yeah. 
And so that that for me is, is 

247
00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:53,800
what I have to remind myself of 
like show don't tell especially,

248
00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:57,560
you know this whole idea and 
this concept of knowledge of 

249
00:13:57,680 --> 00:14:00,600
versus knowledge about. 
And so if we're, if we're 

250
00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:04,480
talking about it like we are now
we're we're in the realm of 

251
00:14:04,480 --> 00:14:09,080
knowledge about. 
And if we want to get into how 

252
00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:12,520
the game is played and it's 
because the game is embodied, 

253
00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:16,160
then it needs to be knowledge 
of. 

254
00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:21,920
And so knowledge of is 
demonstrated in terms of how it 

255
00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:25,400
actually shows up in the game. 
And so to me that that means 

256
00:14:25,400 --> 00:14:30,160
that that's going to be, you're 
going to have to move because 

257
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:31,840
that's that's how it's expressed
in the game. 

258
00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:33,520
That's how the knowledge is 
expressed. 

259
00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:37,440
So therefore if you want to make
a change we need to actually 

260
00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:43,360
move and I've and when guys do 
it and really fully buy in and 

261
00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:47,960
really work at it, it's amazing 
how fast the changes occur. 

262
00:14:48,400 --> 00:14:52,480
You know it might take a guy 5 
swings to figure out an 

263
00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:55,400
adjustment. 
I can by by them working on 

264
00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:57,800
their fuel reps they they can 
get that down to like two or 

265
00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:02,960
three you know and and that I 
think makes a huge difference 

266
00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:09,320
when it comes to you know 
helping guys make adjustments 

267
00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:13,400
and and find success. 
Yeah. 

268
00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,680
I think I think to kind of kind 
of circle back on some of the 

269
00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:20,800
some of those thread to start 
pulling up on the the show me 

270
00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:24,640
thing I think is extremely 
powerful because it it doesn't 

271
00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:29,960
demand a verbal answer it it's 
asking for an actual action it's

272
00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:32,680
asking for movement. 
So it's like when you say show 

273
00:15:32,680 --> 00:15:35,960
me it's not you're not asking 
for them to tell you some 

274
00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:38,520
knowledge about it. 
You're actually having them show

275
00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:42,560
you and gain knowledge of the 
environment and they show me how

276
00:15:42,560 --> 00:15:44,320
you would potentially go do 
this. 

277
00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:46,600
And I think the verbiage there 
is extremely important where 

278
00:15:47,040 --> 00:15:50,480
where they you kind of you 
giving them one answer. 

279
00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:52,680
I think again time skills are 
extremely important on that. 

280
00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:54,720
If we don't have a ton of time 
like you're headed into the 

281
00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:57,960
season and it's February like 
and we don't have all the time 

282
00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:01,040
in the world just to explore and
have them fail and just kind of 

283
00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:04,720
surf, surf the surf the 
landscape and try to find any 

284
00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:07,960
possible solution. 
I think starting them in one 

285
00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:10,920
spot kind of opens everything up
and kind of speeds the process 

286
00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:15,240
up. 
But the idea of showing you 

287
00:16:15,400 --> 00:16:18,480
versus just having them dictate 
it back, I think just opens 

288
00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:20,240
everything up. 
And then how you could 

289
00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:22,640
potentially do it. 
I think has been so powerful for

290
00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:24,840
me. 
Is it, It kind of like opens it 

291
00:16:24,840 --> 00:16:25,920
up. 
It's like, hey dude, I'm not 

292
00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:27,560
telling you I don't have the 
answer here. 

293
00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:29,280
Like I don't know how you could 
potentially do this. 

294
00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:31,840
I'm hoping you actually find an 
answer that I didn't even see 

295
00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:34,440
because then you're finding it 
in your own unique way and 

296
00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:36,120
you're kind of becoming your own
unique mover. 

297
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:39,520
And I think anybody who is 
anybody in sport, like, knows if

298
00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:42,480
you're unique in solving 
problems and you probably have 

299
00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:45,720
an advantage since the average 
isn't that special anymore. 

300
00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:48,640
Like, we're looking for unique. 
We're looking for novel ways. 

301
00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:51,680
He's like, as a pitcher, like if
I'm finding a new way to solve a

302
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:55,040
problem, like, it's that much 
harder for a hitter if I'm doing

303
00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:57,440
what every other pitcher's 
doing, like they've seen it a 

304
00:16:57,440 --> 00:16:59,520
million times. 
It's like allowing them to 

305
00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:04,160
explore in kind of like open up 
the landscape and just try to 

306
00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:06,119
find their own ways. 
Even if I have to nudge them to 

307
00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:09,319
start like in saying hey show me
how you could potentially do it.

308
00:17:09,319 --> 00:17:13,880
I think changes everything in 
practice because it goes from, 

309
00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:16,359
it goes from like this this 
person who's and I think 

310
00:17:16,359 --> 00:17:19,040
actually like I'm going to I'm 
going to try to pull a pull a 

311
00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:23,280
quote from Alex Last Alex 
Laskew. 

312
00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,520
She said she started her talk 
off and she said like in I think

313
00:17:27,520 --> 00:17:30,560
it was from 1A paper, but it was
like like an ecologist create 

314
00:17:30,560 --> 00:17:33,320
conditions for athletes to 
exploit and flourish during 

315
00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:35,320
development. 
So you're just like creating 

316
00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:38,160
these conditions, you're not 
directly telling you and that 

317
00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:42,120
makes you the learning designer.
And it's like coaches do not 

318
00:17:42,120 --> 00:17:44,560
need to intervene or nourish the
athlete. 

319
00:17:44,560 --> 00:17:48,240
We just create these 
environments for them to go and 

320
00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:51,880
explore and then you can simply 
have them, you can nudge them 

321
00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:54,640
where they could go explore or 
in a way they could. 

322
00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:57,160
And there's a let them go and 
kind of find their solutions, 

323
00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:00,400
which I think is so much more 
powerful than just being the 

324
00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:02,960
person who just tells them 
exactly how to go do it. 

325
00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:05,080
Since you're you're basically 
confining them to that one 

326
00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:08,480
solution first, like finding 
their own potential way of going

327
00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:12,400
to do that. 
I want to ask you guys, you guys

328
00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:15,640
a question about that. 
So when it comes to the show me 

329
00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:18,480
aspect, I I think it is very 
valuable. 

330
00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:21,800
But I could also see in a 
pitching scenario how it could 

331
00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:25,480
pull the pitcher out of the 
actual competition, where if you

332
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:30,800
say, hey, show me how you'd get 
this batter out with XY pitch or

333
00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:34,360
set up this batter with XY 
pitch, do you think that that 

334
00:18:34,360 --> 00:18:38,520
leads the pitcher to sometimes 
focus more on kind of displaying

335
00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:42,360
the action for you rather than 
focusing on the competitive 

336
00:18:42,360 --> 00:18:45,120
aspect of trying to beat the 
batter and letting that thing 

337
00:18:45,120 --> 00:18:47,600
emerge? 
Well, I guess what when I'm 

338
00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:50,440
saying show me, show me how you 
would go do this. 

339
00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:52,480
I'm trying to connect him to the
batter, right. 

340
00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:56,000
So it's like, show me how you 
would go get inside with your 

341
00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,600
fastball. 
It's it's directly trying to 

342
00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:02,040
connect them to potential ways 
to jam the hitter, right? 

343
00:19:02,360 --> 00:19:05,440
So it's like trying to trying to
bring them actually there. 

344
00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,200
So it's typically like pitchers 
don't live in that space like 

345
00:19:08,200 --> 00:19:11,600
we're we're target throwers 
we're not we're not out getters 

346
00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:13,880
typically but you're just trying
to you're just throwing your 

347
00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:15,680
your best stuff as hard as you 
can. 

348
00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,320
Which if you look at Bernstein, 
Bernstein talks about that like 

349
00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:22,120
one of the lowest levels of 
skill is just doing it as fast 

350
00:19:22,120 --> 00:19:24,560
and as hard as you possibly can.
Like you're not. 

351
00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:28,240
You're not you're not overly 
what's the what's the term he 

352
00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:31,560
uses. 
I forget exactly how how he 

353
00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:33,680
phrased it. 
But like he you're basically 

354
00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:36,200
showing that your skill isn't 
that high since you have to go 

355
00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:38,520
Max out every single time like 
you're not. 

356
00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:42,840
You're basically using all your 
energy sources versus this idea 

357
00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:46,280
of like, hey, let's let's find 
different ways where I can 

358
00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:49,560
actually potentially go and get 
you out where I'm not completely

359
00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:52,360
just emptying the tank every 
single time to go do that, if 

360
00:19:52,360 --> 00:19:56,000
that makes sense. 
Yes, the the definition of 

361
00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:59,720
dexterity that which he he 
coined. 

362
00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:04,680
Is it's efficient. 
You know, so it's you know I 

363
00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:07,600
think that's an element of and I
think that's a really good point

364
00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:11,080
bigger of you know this this 
lower level of skill of like 

365
00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:13,760
it's Max effort. 
It's like and and this is kind 

366
00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:16,160
of the thing of like, you know, 
especially for pitchers, if you 

367
00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:21,120
want to be able to be out there 
a long time and to pitch three 

368
00:20:21,120 --> 00:20:23,240
times through the through order,
you can't. 

369
00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:29,520
You can't just go and just try 
to pump 100 the whole game. 

370
00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:33,320
Like it's just not or I don't 
know, 105, I guess, right. 

371
00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:35,840
You know it. 
Depends who you are, Depends who

372
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:37,600
you. 
Are right and I think 105 

373
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:41,080
probably does have more more 
play to it but even 100 now like

374
00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:47,960
guys guys can hit 100 like 
that's not that's not as to your

375
00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:52,840
point novel anymore. 
And so yeah I think that's 

376
00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:58,760
that's a a key piece of it. 
It's important to to be 

377
00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:03,400
efficient you know and actually 
you know to to the point of I 

378
00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:05,320
think it's about being 
intentional. 

379
00:21:05,560 --> 00:21:11,040
You know exploring how can I 
begin to interact with the to to

380
00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:13,680
to be competitive because you 
can add that element in. 

381
00:21:14,360 --> 00:21:17,280
Because when you start thinking 
about OK, when I'm competing 

382
00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:21,000
what is what is my goal what's 
directing and shaping the 

383
00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:22,600
movement like what are my 
intentions. 

384
00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:28,720
And sometimes the intentions 
might not be to like how how can

385
00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:32,240
I throw a guy inside. 
But if you're wanting to expand 

386
00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:37,320
his capabilities you may need to
spend some time exploring that 

387
00:21:37,320 --> 00:21:41,360
question how can I do this can I
even do this. 

388
00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:45,160
And so to me there there's 
there's levels of in practice 

389
00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:49,240
we're exploring our action 
capabilities and we're trying to

390
00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:53,800
find the whole thing is about 
finding a functional fit. 

391
00:21:54,240 --> 00:22:00,600
So how can I functionally relate
to this problem or to this task?

392
00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:04,840
And how many different ways can 
I can I begin to relate to this 

393
00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:08,360
and functionally or find this is
going back to this idea of 

394
00:22:08,360 --> 00:22:12,160
dexterity or degeneracy. 
How many different ways can I 

395
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:16,080
solve this problem so that when 
I get into situations and and I 

396
00:22:16,120 --> 00:22:18,240
and I start encountering 
different constraints. 

397
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:22,400
I've already explored the you 
could say the the space the the 

398
00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:29,360
task space so that I I know you 
because to me that for because a

399
00:22:29,360 --> 00:22:33,680
lot of the the task space or the
what's the the the other space 

400
00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:35,840
the the motor landscape. 
OK. 

401
00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:40,200
So if you think about it like a 
map, you know if you are a 

402
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:45,240
delivery driver, you really want
to know your route and like the 

403
00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:48,880
surrounding streets around your 
route and the the surrounding 

404
00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:51,600
area. 
The more you know it, the more 

405
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,920
you know as construction or 
traffic or whatever shows up, 

406
00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,600
the more that you're able to 
actually navigate around that 

407
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:02,040
and find different ways to still
make your delivery show up on 

408
00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:04,400
time and stuff like that. 
And so to me that's that's kind 

409
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:09,160
of what this analogy is of like 
during practice we're going to 

410
00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:11,760
explore all these different ways
so that when we get into the 

411
00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:15,400
game and you know, different 
constraints show up. 

412
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:17,400
I don't have a good example off 
hand right now. 

413
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:18,960
But you know you have a Rd. 
closure. 

414
00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:22,000
You know you know how to get 
around that. 

415
00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:26,920
You know and what are the other 
ways to to get to the result 

416
00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:29,840
that you want you know, as let's
say for example here here is 

417
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:32,960
actually a good one. 
The umpire, the umpires stops 

418
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:34,280
calling a certain part of the 
zone. 

419
00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:37,600
Well then you know big league 
hitters like they should pick up

420
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:40,400
on that because they're all 
about their walks and on base 

421
00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:42,920
and swing decisions, whatever. 
You should pick up on the fact 

422
00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:44,360
that all right he's not calling 
this. 

423
00:23:44,360 --> 00:23:48,760
I can eliminate this pitch now 
and what if that's an effective 

424
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:51,480
pitch for the pitcher all of a 
sudden up and in is not being 

425
00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:54,960
called like it's it's a totally 
different game when the umpire's

426
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:57,920
calling that up and in pitch 
then now you actually might have

427
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,080
to swing at it. 
Well now I can just eliminate 

428
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,080
that one and so it's different 
things like that. 

429
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,600
OK what do you do if a certain 
pitch isn't being called. 

430
00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:08,640
What happens today if I get a 
blister on my finger and I can't

431
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:12,560
throw this pitch you know that I
that's that's really effective 

432
00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:14,920
for me. 
Well, do I have other pitches 

433
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:19,200
that I can go to, you know, to 
to mitigate that. 

434
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:23,560
And so that that to me is kind 
of the whole purpose of what 

435
00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:26,320
Baker is describing of like, 
hey, show me how many different 

436
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:30,840
ways or how could you, you know,
throw a guy inside and make that

437
00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:32,960
be effective? 
Because it always comes back to 

438
00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:38,040
The whole purpose of the search 
is to find something, to find a 

439
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:40,720
functional way of interacting 
with the problem. 

440
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:43,880
Yeah. 
And I think, I think that was 

441
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:47,080
kind of like the first pulling 
on the last thing you were 

442
00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:48,560
talking about. 
Like the one of the first things

443
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:52,280
I was trying to display within 
my talk was the idea like skill 

444
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:54,600
acquisition versus adaptation. 
And what we're chasing after are

445
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:57,280
we chasing like this fixed skill
and we're just trying to acquire

446
00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:01,480
this fixed state where I now 
have this quote UN quote skill 

447
00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,640
and I just plug it in anywhere. 
Which again doesn't work. 

448
00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:08,480
If you if you saw my talk based 
on my parkour experience or 

449
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:12,560
skill adaptation where we're 
able to adapt to the environment

450
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:14,280
say like you're talking about 
you have that blister on the 

451
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:15,720
finger or the zones changing 
whatever. 

452
00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,600
Do you have a solution to those 
or do you not? 

453
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,200
Do you just have this one set 
way of going to do it which I 

454
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:26,320
think is very often have what 
what pitchers and hitters are 

455
00:25:26,360 --> 00:25:29,240
chasing after is skill 
acquisition. 

456
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:32,800
Acquiring this direct state of 
this is my movement that 

457
00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:36,040
produces my best outcome or my 
best pitch or my best swing 

458
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,120
first. 
Like going out and trying to 

459
00:25:39,120 --> 00:25:42,840
adapt to ever changing 
environments and trying to find 

460
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:45,960
solutions or having skillful 
interactions with the 

461
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,680
environment across all these 
different conditions. 

462
00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:52,160
Which again if you think about 
the the the best athletes they 

463
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:54,960
are the most adaptable like you 
would you would I think any 

464
00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:57,600
coach would say that like 
they're adjustable adaptable 

465
00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:00,640
however they may say that and 
like how you're setting up your 

466
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:02,640
learning environments and what 
you're exposing them to their 

467
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,120
practice. 
And I think the the idea of like

468
00:26:05,120 --> 00:26:08,440
a show me how you could 
potentially go do something is 

469
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:12,440
exactly what we're talking about
expanding that toolbox and then 

470
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:16,280
we have more potential options 
like if that up and in is not 

471
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:18,120
there. 
Well I have a solution to go get

472
00:26:18,120 --> 00:26:21,000
out even though that's my best, 
my best solution typically for 

473
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:23,080
this this situation, well it's 
not there. 

474
00:26:23,360 --> 00:26:25,520
So now what? 
Do I have something, Do I not 

475
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:27,320
have something? 
And I think it comes down to how

476
00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:30,600
you train and what your training
environments actually do look 

477
00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:33,600
like. 
That's that's actually a really 

478
00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:37,360
interesting, like, evaluative 
framework in my mind. 

479
00:26:38,360 --> 00:26:42,600
In my head, I have Craig Kimbrel
when it was in the NLCS. 

480
00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:46,120
And so he walked a few guys and 
was getting some really getting 

481
00:26:46,120 --> 00:26:50,400
squeezed by the umpire ran into 
that conflict and that solution 

482
00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:52,720
he was trying to use didn't work
and then he just started 

483
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,920
throwing all fast balls. 
So, like, I'm thinking about an 

484
00:26:56,080 --> 00:27:00,520
evaluative framework of when you
kind of hit adversity or one of 

485
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:04,920
your solutions isn't working, do
you either go towards using more

486
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:09,600
different solutions or do you go
like revert towards your 

487
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:12,480
preferred single solution? 
That would be interesting. 

488
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:16,200
Like if you look at an inning of
a pitcher, oh, he there was a 

489
00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:17,480
bad call. 
He's getting squeezed. 

490
00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:18,800
The guy made an error behind 
him. 

491
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:22,640
Does that cause him to solve 
problems differently and more 

492
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:25,520
creatively? 
Or does he kind of kick, excuse 

493
00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:28,040
me, kick into the reversion 
mindset of I'm just going to go 

494
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:30,520
back to this one solution. 
His degrees of freedom of 

495
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:34,560
solving problems just dries up. 
I think, I think there's there's

496
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:39,400
two elements of it because you 
have to be kind of careful and 

497
00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:42,960
this, this I took this from Sean
when he was working with Everson

498
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:47,640
because they spent all this time
on exploring explore explore 

499
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:48,840
explorer. 
That was why I think one of 

500
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,920
their themes, one of the years 
and then Shawn recognized 

501
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:55,880
because too Everson I think was 
near, was in the later part of 

502
00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:59,880
his career. 
And so you know his when you're 

503
00:27:59,880 --> 00:28:02,480
when you're in your, when you 
get older, especially in the NFL

504
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:06,400
like your playing time starts to
like you, you have to now earn 

505
00:28:06,400 --> 00:28:08,280
it, right. 
If you're in the middle of your 

506
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:11,240
career and you're like one of 
the best players, like you know,

507
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:16,320
it's kind of like it's a lock. 
But so he just remembers like, 

508
00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:21,120
OK, during the pre season when 
he needs to like lock down a 

509
00:28:21,120 --> 00:28:25,480
spot, he's watching, He's like, 
man, he's still out there 

510
00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:27,600
exploring different ways to be 
doing things. 

511
00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:31,360
He's like, dude, you need to go 
out there and just like you need

512
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:33,760
to, you need to solve this 
problem right now. 

513
00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:35,720
You don't need to be trying to 
figure out how many different 

514
00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:39,360
ways can you do it. 
And so for me, that's kind of 

515
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,480
the important piece of 
remembering like, OK, we're in 

516
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:45,160
competition, right? 
You're in the NLCS. 

517
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:48,920
Well, right now is not the time 
to try something different. 

518
00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:53,000
It's OK based upon my task, 
experience, what do I know works

519
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:55,680
like we need, we need to shut 
this down and we need to get out

520
00:28:55,680 --> 00:29:01,120
of this and so there, but OK, so
there's that element of it. 

521
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:09,520
Now on the flip side is, has an 
athlete been trained or is 

522
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,840
attuned to be able to pick up 
the specifying information in 

523
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:16,560
the environment and be able to 
adjust based upon that 

524
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:18,880
information? 
That I think is the other 

525
00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:21,960
element of it, of that allows 
you because the whole purpose of

526
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:26,160
exploration is to be able to 
become more attuned or sensitive

527
00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:29,520
to the specifying information in
the environment or to 

528
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:31,520
information within the 
environment that you can use to 

529
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:35,680
exploit, to find or to be able 
to have functional solutions. 

530
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,760
And So what that comes back to 
is like, OK, our pictures, we're

531
00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:40,840
just talking about pictures 
here. 

532
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:46,520
Are they picking up on how how 
batters are making adjustments 

533
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,000
to them? 
You know, are is a hitter 

534
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:52,200
sitting on certain pitches? 
Like how how are how is the 

535
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:56,680
batter reacting or responding? 
I want to use the word reacting.

536
00:29:56,920 --> 00:29:58,960
How are they swinging? 
Like, what are what are swings 

537
00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:01,920
telling me about? 
You know, how are they getting 

538
00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:03,720
on me? 
Like, is there a certain pitch 

539
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:05,960
actually that I should be 
throwing here based upon the 

540
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:09,160
swings that I'm getting? 
Like all that sort of stuff is 

541
00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:12,560
is important pieces, you know, 
in addition to like what's the 

542
00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:15,280
umpire calling, you know, and 
what what do I have a feel for? 

543
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:19,760
And I think that's the element 
that we need to help players 

544
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,840
with, is being able to pick up 
all the different pieces of 

545
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,680
information in the environment 
and know what to do with them 

546
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:28,720
and how to exploit that 
information for their benefit. 

547
00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:32,280
Yeah, I, I'm, I'm going to tie 
in another quote from the SMSC 

548
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:35,000
here, so I think this is really 
good, Marion Davis said. 

549
00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:38,840
Experienced learners or 
experienced learners know the 

550
00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:41,960
meaning of the information, 
which I think is is extremely 

551
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:43,920
powerful because I think that 
that's the that's the 

552
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,760
difference. 
Because it's not, it's not just 

553
00:30:46,760 --> 00:30:49,560
you, you can pick up information
and we can we as coaches can 

554
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:53,320
direct a direct attention to 
certain bits of information. 

555
00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:57,160
But until they know the meaning 
of the information, how to act 

556
00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:01,040
based on what they're they're 
picking up in the environment, 

557
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:04,200
it really doesn't mean anything.
So again, like that that kind of

558
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:07,120
just speaks to like in in these 
practice environments like 

559
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:10,720
exposing them to these bits of 
information and allowing them to

560
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:14,760
explore and interact with them 
allows them to Start learning 

561
00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:16,560
the meaning of them. 
Like it. 

562
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:20,360
You can see a hitter hitter act 
in a certain way based on your 

563
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:23,160
pitch type, but you may not know
actually what that actually 

564
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:25,040
means. 
It's like, OK, he did this and 

565
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:26,920
then he did that. 
He stepped out-of-the-box and 

566
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,160
then this is this is how he 
practiced his swing after that. 

567
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:30,680
It's OK. 
So what is all that telling you?

568
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:34,880
How I should now go act to try 
to go get him out and like you 

569
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:36,840
could pick up that information? 
I think that's a start. 

570
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:40,800
But until they've experienced 
that and tried things based on 

571
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:44,280
that information and explored, 
OK, so this happened, I'm going 

572
00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:47,000
to go explore here. 
OK, well that didn't work. 

573
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:50,680
OK, so now I'm I'm, I'm exposed 
to that same type of 

574
00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:52,520
information. 
No2 problems are the same but 

575
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:54,920
something similar. 
And now I go explore it in a 

576
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:56,880
different way. 
OK, that worked. 

577
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,080
And now you're starting to kind 
of learn what the information 

578
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:03,360
actually means to actually act 
upon skillfully, which I thought

579
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:06,880
that quote was was extremely, 
extremely good. 

580
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,040
Because I think there's a big 
difference in like just picking 

581
00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:11,560
up the information, which I 
think is a start. 

582
00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:15,000
But actually, like, having your 
athletes know what that 

583
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,800
information actually means is 
completely different. 

584
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:22,400
And I and I've been a kind of on
a football kick a little bit 

585
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:24,880
with the Patriots struggling, 
Max Jones just falling apart. 

586
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,160
I should put a thread about it, 
just because I've been so 

587
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:29,520
fascinated by by the quarterback
position recently. 

588
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:32,400
But when you look at a 
quarterback and all these 

589
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:35,400
different, all these different 
defenders are moving pre snap 

590
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:37,520
like they're showing different 
looks, but they're acting in 

591
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:41,080
certain ways ahead of time and 
then they move post snap. 

592
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:44,480
And then you being able to pick 
up that information and actually

593
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:48,720
know what it means in lieu of 
what your route combos are or 

594
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,920
what your athletes capabilities,
your receivers capabilities are 

595
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,600
along with your capabilities of 
your line and and so forth. 

596
00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:58,560
And so that's what makes a good 
quarterback in my opinion and 

597
00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:00,200
that's what I thought. 
We potentially had Mac Jones of 

598
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:02,160
the Patriots. 
But again right now he's just 

599
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:03,960
not picking that information up 
at all. 

600
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:07,000
He's missing that bits and not 
not acting skillfully because of

601
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:09,720
that he doesn't know the meaning
of the information or he's just 

602
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:11,520
not able to pick up that 
information at all. 

603
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:14,640
And I think that's a that's a 
super interesting way and I 

604
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:17,840
don't in my opinion I never has 
talked about in pitching except 

605
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:20,600
for like you listen like Greg 
Bannock's talk maybe like I've 

606
00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:23,160
listened to him talk a couple 
times and like he he you could 

607
00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:26,760
tell he's really in tuned with 
the with the information. 

608
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:29,440
But again like how do we foster 
that? 

609
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:31,920
Like was that something everyday
Oh that was just natural. 

610
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:34,480
It's OK Well same with some guys
we throw really hard that's 

611
00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:36,600
natural too but we're also 
teaching guys how to throw 

612
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,560
really hard. 
So can we teach pictures to pick

613
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:41,000
up this information and act 
skillfully. 

614
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:43,120
And I think that's the question 
like I've been on the search the

615
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:45,360
kind of answer and how I could 
potentially answer him. 

616
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:47,640
Not saying I have the answer to 
that question, but I think 

617
00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:50,680
that's that's something I don't 
think is explored within our 

618
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:57,160
community nearly as much. 
And to to kind of I guess you 

619
00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:00,600
could say take that piece that 
you had there and twist the, 

620
00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:02,880
the, the diamond just a little 
bit so you can see a different 

621
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:06,000
side of it. 
The other thing I think you know

622
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,639
with that quote, I think that 
quote is is awesome of like OK, 

623
00:34:08,639 --> 00:34:13,040
what does this information 
actually mean and AJI think that

624
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:17,040
also works well for you as an 
analyst, right? 

625
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:18,800
There's all this, this number, 
this data. 

626
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:19,920
Like, what does it actually 
mean? 

627
00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:26,159
But I think to to use something 
that that Sean and Tyler talk a 

628
00:34:26,159 --> 00:34:28,040
lot about is like, OK, where 
does this live and breathe. 

629
00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:29,000
OK. 
I think. 

630
00:34:29,159 --> 00:34:32,120
I think with information part of
the meaning, there's not just 

631
00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:37,520
one meaning, OK, you know, that 
you have to understand how where

632
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:39,880
does this information actually 
live and breathe and like, how 

633
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:44,239
does it, how does it? 
Because, for example, you can 

634
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:48,400
understand, oh, all right, If I 
do this, I get this sort of 

635
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:50,040
result. 
And that's like a super 

636
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:53,239
superficial understanding. 
If you really want to understand

637
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:57,440
where it lives and breathe and 
all its different facets, it it 

638
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,760
actually takes more. 
There's a higher level to 

639
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,560
understanding meaning, right? 
You can understand the meaning 

640
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:07,480
of a word, but really how to use
that word and where all the 

641
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,080
places that that word really 
works and can connect with 

642
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:14,440
somebody. 
That takes time, you know, just 

643
00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:16,880
thinking about my kids, right? 
You know, you give them a word 

644
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:19,040
and then they just start using 
it all over the place and it's 

645
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:21,240
like, yeah, it doesn't really 
fit there, but that's that's 

646
00:35:21,240 --> 00:35:24,320
kind of where I'm going here. 
If like early on when somebody 

647
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:27,920
picks up on something, you know,
an exploit, so you could say, 

648
00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:30,320
you know, and it works. 
They just use it all the all the

649
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:32,800
time for everything. 
It's like and then they find 

650
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:35,200
out, oh, you know, it doesn't 
actually work here. 

651
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:39,520
And then it it it, it grows. 
And so that's that's where I 

652
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:42,200
think that that's taking it to 
the next level of like what is, 

653
00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:48,880
what is it getting to the deeper
meaning of this whole concept of

654
00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:54,160
what is this information mean I 
think is getting to understand 

655
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:58,360
all the different facets of how 
you can use it and utilize it 

656
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:03,760
and exploit it. 
Did did you guys watch the 

657
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:07,000
corresponding Ted talk that went
with that quote that Marianne 

658
00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:09,320
talked about? 
I don't. 

659
00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:13,680
Know say the gist of it I 
actually it what? 

660
00:36:13,720 --> 00:36:15,320
What is it? 
What's the Ted Talk? 

661
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:18,320
Sorry, What's the Ted Talk? 
What's the Talk? 

662
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:20,800
It's called. 
Where do I have it? 

663
00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:24,680
Oh, it's called the reason to be
afraid of AI. 

664
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:30,120
Nice, nice. 
So the the basis of the Ted talk

665
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,600
was there was this robotics 
engineer and he talked about 

666
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:37,760
that there was a machine 
learning algorithm that would 

667
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:42,640
essentially try to identify if a
photo is either a dog or a wolf.

668
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:47,800
And it was it was pretty good 
and then at a certain point it 

669
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:51,760
identified a Husky as a wolf. 
And so then the programmers 

670
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:56,720
essentially probe the node of 
the decision tree that sent it 

671
00:36:56,720 --> 00:37:00,600
down the way of a wolf rather 
than a dog and what the 

672
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:04,440
algorithm was looking at as the 
information that specified that 

673
00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:07,960
was the snow. 
And so it just so happened that 

674
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:12,400
all of the training data set, 
all the images of wolves had 

675
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,960
snow in the background. 
And so the computer essentially 

676
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:20,760
thought that snow equated to a 
wolf and that potentially lack 

677
00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:23,160
of snow equated to a dog. 
And so when it saw the Husky in 

678
00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:25,480
the snow, it said, oh that's a 
wolf. 

679
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:27,040
Why? 
Because there's snow. 

680
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:33,800
And I actually think that that's
a really interesting support 

681
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:38,120
argument for Rep without Rep as 
well, where being able to have 

682
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:44,080
as many different representative
environments prevents you from 

683
00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:48,640
making connections with 
specifying connections with 

684
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:50,320
information that's not 
specifying. 

685
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:54,600
So by varying all the different 
ways that you can have things 

686
00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:57,920
and having a very diverse quote 
UN quote training set for the 

687
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:00,680
human. 
OK, in in one circumstance it's 

688
00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:03,040
Oh my fastball. 
Got guys out here. 

689
00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:04,760
I'm just going to always use my 
fastball. 

690
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:08,040
Well, maybe that actually won't 
work in all situations. 

691
00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:11,760
So having a variety of different
situations allows you to connect

692
00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:15,520
with the things that are 
actually important and can 

693
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:18,960
hopefully have you be more 
correct and accurate in choosing

694
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:21,240
your solutions to the the 
problem at hand. 

695
00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:24,480
But I think that's that's 
important. 

696
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:34,360
It the the some of our, I think 
sometimes we fall into what is 

697
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:40,720
easiest logistically and I think
the the thing that perturbs us 

698
00:38:40,720 --> 00:38:42,960
that allows us to actually 
search for a better solution. 

699
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:44,480
I think this is true for 
athletes, right. 

700
00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:49,160
If something's really working 
for them, you have like in order

701
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,880
for somebody to search for a new
solution there has to be 

702
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:55,560
something wrong or they have to 
be encountering some difficulty 

703
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:58,120
that causes them to search. 
And so this is the whole concept

704
00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:02,160
of why we want challenging 
practices at times like that are

705
00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:07,760
more challenging than normal to 
allow the athlete to start to 

706
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:12,560
search for new ways of 
connecting with with the problem

707
00:39:13,080 --> 00:39:16,480
and and so or and sometimes it's
not even about making it more 

708
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:18,640
difficult. 
It's simply like changing the 

709
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:23,000
problem to your point because 
you want to create this you know

710
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:27,360
some some instability so that 
they actually have to search for

711
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,600
a new way of connecting. 
And these are all these things I

712
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:33,480
want to say this at, you know, 
all these things are things that

713
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,120
people have intuitive, 
intuitively known, you know, 

714
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:38,280
coaches, right? 
Like, we're not saying anything 

715
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:41,960
that isn't known. 
You know, a lot of guys, coaches

716
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:44,040
be like, yeah, I want them to 
fail, so then they'll listen to 

717
00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:45,440
me. 
That's a version of what I'm 

718
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:49,080
saying, right, Of like, when 
guys start to struggle, then 

719
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:52,080
they become more open to finding
new ways of doing things. 

720
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:56,320
We're just saying that we don't 
think it's appropriate to try to

721
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,480
force them down a certain path, 
you know, to make it, you know, 

722
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,440
make them fail so that. 
And they will just do exactly 

723
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:07,920
what I say, but rather when they
fail, we will help them find a 

724
00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:13,480
new and better way of of of 
solving the problem or finding 

725
00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:16,600
success. 
And so to me that's that's where

726
00:40:16,720 --> 00:40:19,480
you know, when people hear this 
like, Oh yeah, you know, we've 

727
00:40:19,480 --> 00:40:21,360
been doing that forever. 
It's like yes. 

728
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:26,360
But do you understand why and 
how to, how to utilize that more

729
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:29,000
and more effectively? 
How do you stay more in that 

730
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:37,600
area of to me it's this idea of 
the 8020 rule, you know 20% of 

731
00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:39,600
what you do gets you 80% of the 
results. 

732
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:43,280
OK, So what is that 20% so we 
can make sure that we're doing 

733
00:40:43,280 --> 00:40:46,280
that enough. 
Because I the way that I see it 

734
00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:49,760
of like programs and you could 
say dynasty is how they kind of 

735
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:51,600
or where where a program has 
success. 

736
00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:55,480
They don't always know what why 
they got the success and then 

737
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:58,760
the program declines over time 
and you're like well what 

738
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:02,080
happened there and I think some 
of that comes back to is they 

739
00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:04,960
they lost sight of what actually
made them really good. 

740
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,840
And some of it is, is that you 
know what got you success in one

741
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:14,280
year because everybody else, you
know the your competition is 

742
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:16,040
constantly adapting and 
evolving. 

743
00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:20,200
So what worked one year might 
not continue to work the more 

744
00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:23,840
you do it over time because of 
the fact other people, you know,

745
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,680
other programs are starting to 
do other things that maybe 

746
00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,880
either counter it or are using 
the same things now. 

747
00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:33,080
And so that that advantage that 
you had begins to disappear. 

748
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:37,160
And so if you don't know how to 
iterate it in a way that gets 

749
00:41:37,160 --> 00:41:41,120
you more of the the stuff that 
you're doing that is good, then 

750
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:45,720
eventually everybody else 
catches up and you kind of start

751
00:41:45,720 --> 00:41:47,600
to go on the decline. 
And so to me, that's that's the 

752
00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:50,120
whole point of why. 
OK, yeah, you're hearing like, 

753
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:53,680
oh, yeah, You know, we've, we've
done that, Like that sounds like

754
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:54,880
something that we've already 
done. 

755
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:58,240
It's like, good Do more of it 
here. 

756
00:41:58,240 --> 00:42:00,440
Here's, here's more ways of 
building it out and thinking 

757
00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:02,360
about it so that we can 
continue. 

758
00:42:02,360 --> 00:42:07,920
You can continue to have success
and maintain your edge over your

759
00:42:07,920 --> 00:42:09,760
competition. 
Yeah, I'm. 

760
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:11,080
I'm going to pull on two things 
here. 

761
00:42:11,080 --> 00:42:14,240
One is that I've heard that 
argument a lot for the, the 

762
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:16,640
ecological framework. 
It's like, oh, good coaches have

763
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:18,840
been doing that for years. 
It's like, OK, well, if good 

764
00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:21,000
coaches have been doing that for
years, Oh yeah, we do a version 

765
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:22,840
of that already. 
Well, if you already do it. 

766
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:24,680
And so you already believe in it
somewhat. 

767
00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:27,520
And if good coaches have been 
doing that for years and you're 

768
00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:29,640
calling them good coaches, 
usually they call them great 

769
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:32,320
coaches. 
But we're giving you basically a

770
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:35,440
framework for how some of the 
greatest coaches have been doing

771
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:36,600
it. 
Maybe they didn't have this 

772
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:38,600
framework, but they kind of 
intuitively knew it. 

773
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:44,000
And now we had kind of have this
framework of how these coaches 

774
00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,080
have potentially put this 
together, but an actual theory 

775
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:49,400
behind it and how you could 
potentially build it out. 

776
00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:51,520
So like, that argument I always 
hate, I always hated. 

777
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:53,680
I was like, this is actually 
like, you're actually telling me

778
00:42:53,680 --> 00:42:56,200
there's a ton of value in what 
I'm saying and how we could 

779
00:42:56,200 --> 00:42:59,400
potentially go build it out now 
that we have a theory showing 

780
00:42:59,400 --> 00:43:02,720
you why this stuff worked when 
great coaches deployed it, 

781
00:43:02,720 --> 00:43:04,960
right? 
So I think that that, for one, I

782
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:09,880
think is always interesting. 
And two, I think there there's 

783
00:43:09,880 --> 00:43:12,320
something, another talk I want 
to pull from in the SMSC, from 

784
00:43:12,320 --> 00:43:15,240
Keith David's. 
He talked a lot about this idea 

785
00:43:15,240 --> 00:43:18,200
of innovation, creativity and he
talked about the intelligent 

786
00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:20,840
performer and the idea of the 
intelligent performer. 

787
00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:23,520
And every every coach wants an 
intelligent performer because 

788
00:43:23,520 --> 00:43:26,800
this is somebody and he says it 
can solve problems by the use of

789
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:29,440
information. 
And they they show creativity 

790
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:32,280
and innovation. 
And he talked a lot about in 

791
00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:35,920
like this idea encourages a ton 
of Rep without Rep and kind of 

792
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:37,760
exploring the perception action 
couplings. 

793
00:43:38,200 --> 00:43:41,320
But I I think one thing when I 
was reading up on Bernstein's 

794
00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:45,480
paper, he talked about the 
biggest piece or the last piece,

795
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:47,640
and he thinks the most important
piece of dexterity is 

796
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:50,480
resourcefulness and this idea of
quick wittedness or 

797
00:43:50,480 --> 00:43:54,800
intuitiveness. 
And like those two things, I 

798
00:43:54,800 --> 00:43:59,480
think right there is where you 
start seeing this person who can

799
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:02,360
solve all these all these 
different problems, but they're 

800
00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:05,160
always are quick witted, even 
when they're exposed to 

801
00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:07,360
something new. 
And they always have this 

802
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:09,680
intuition about how to 
potentially go change how 

803
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:11,280
they're doing something. 
And that that could be a coach 

804
00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:14,200
too, like how they change their 
program like that they have all 

805
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:16,640
these success all these years. 
Well, they know how to 

806
00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:19,880
continually to adapt and change 
and they're super resourceful 

807
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:21,960
with how they go about and 
behave. 

808
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:24,800
And that's no different with a, 
with an actual athlete. 

809
00:44:24,800 --> 00:44:27,160
And I think it's really 
interesting because Bernstein 

810
00:44:27,160 --> 00:44:29,920
always talked about dexterity as
the highest level, right? 

811
00:44:29,920 --> 00:44:32,000
Like everybody wants a dexterous
mover. 

812
00:44:32,240 --> 00:44:35,080
Well, a piece of that is this 
idea of resourcefulness. 

813
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:37,320
And it's like, again, like, are 
you just born at that? 

814
00:44:37,320 --> 00:44:41,280
Or can we continue to kind of 
foster that quick wittedness in 

815
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:45,360
this intuitive intuitiveness 
within the athletes so they can 

816
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:49,040
continually kind of solve these 
problems by the use of the 

817
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:51,520
information and continually kind
of adapt to it. 

818
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:54,240
And like the whole idea again, 
what Burns he's talking about is

819
00:44:54,240 --> 00:44:58,400
like it's not repeating the 
means of just the movement, but 

820
00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:00,480
solving the problem over and 
over. 

821
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:02,840
And that's the Rep without Rep, 
which what we're kind of talking

822
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:05,320
about, which I think that's 
that's key. 

823
00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:07,520
And I I've kind of been sitting 
on that for a while. 

824
00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:10,040
It's like, OK, so how do we, how
do we kind of help our athletes 

825
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:12,360
become more resourceful? 
And even like me as a coach, how

826
00:45:12,360 --> 00:45:16,040
do I become more resourceful and
actually have that kind of when 

827
00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:18,080
I see something in the 
environment, How do I 

828
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:21,760
continually challenge myself to 
be able to be a little more 

829
00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:25,360
quick witted and to be able to 
kind of maneuver the the 

830
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:27,920
landscape or change the learning
environment or manipulate these 

831
00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:30,800
constraints in different ways? 
To have the athlete or meet the 

832
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:33,600
athlete at their actual 
challenge point a little more 

833
00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:35,840
consistently or just manipulate 
the information they're 

834
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:36,880
interacting with? 
Right. 

835
00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:42,960
And I think that therein lies 
the highest level of skill. 

836
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:45,640
But again, like something I 
don't hear talked about a ton, 

837
00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:47,440
but something I've been kind of 
ruminating on. 

838
00:45:47,800 --> 00:45:52,160
But like this whole idea and I 
think where the SMSC is kind of 

839
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:55,520
like this idea of art and 
science and like the this, the, 

840
00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:59,160
the art piece of this whole 
thing is like the you see these 

841
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:00,760
athletes. 
And like I think everybody would

842
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:02,160
say the best athletes are most 
creative. 

843
00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:05,000
They have these creative ways of
getting out of situations where 

844
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:06,680
they come up with a movie you've
never seen before. 

845
00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:10,440
But like the that's the art 
being displayed on field with 

846
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:13,160
this theoretical backing, which 
is maybe a little more of the 

847
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:18,000
science scientific piece of it. 
But like the art this displayed 

848
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:22,280
is only shown, I think if 
they're allowed to explore, be 

849
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:26,360
exposed to this Rep without Rep 
and not put inside these silos 

850
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:29,000
or these boxes that they have to
perform within. 

851
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,240
Or they're they're kind of stuck
within these because you'll 

852
00:46:31,240 --> 00:46:34,240
never see a resourceful athlete 
if you're telling them what to 

853
00:46:34,240 --> 00:46:36,360
do or how to do it, or giving 
them the solution. 

854
00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:44,360
I agree that I guess I want to I
want to kind of throw this over 

855
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:47,880
to to Aja little bit more I want
to get him talking a little bit 

856
00:46:47,880 --> 00:46:49,560
more. 
I mean the other thing too I I 

857
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:53,880
should mention like this is the 
I really liked you know Sean 

858
00:46:53,880 --> 00:46:56,360
does a really good job coming up
with I'm assuming it's Sean 

859
00:46:56,640 --> 00:47:01,280
coming coming up with the with 
the themes for the for the sport

860
00:47:01,280 --> 00:47:04,280
movement skill conference. 
And I think this is kind of the 

861
00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:07,400
the thing, you know, because 
I've also heard people knock 

862
00:47:07,400 --> 00:47:10,560
like, ah, it's just a theory. 
There's no, you know, when it 

863
00:47:10,560 --> 00:47:18,840
comes to like the, the 
computational or the the, I 

864
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:23,400
think it's computational ways of
thinking about or computational 

865
00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:27,640
theories of or information 
processing, theories of, you 

866
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:29,680
know, how the brain works, all 
this sort of stuff. 

867
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:33,320
You know, there's all this more 
science behind this and versus 

868
00:47:33,320 --> 00:47:36,840
that. 
And I think people don't take 

869
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:39,760
for granted that well there's 
there's an art to this as well 

870
00:47:39,760 --> 00:47:41,720
like and I everything. 
I think people are too wrapped 

871
00:47:41,720 --> 00:47:45,680
up in the the academic stuff of 
like oh, I'll only believe it if

872
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:47,520
it no, there's science behind 
it. 

873
00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:50,000
Not that there isn't science 
behind this stuff too but it 

874
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:55,200
just I I find that a little bit 
frustrating in the sense that 

875
00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:58,080
when you start getting down to 
like OK, how do I actually help 

876
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:01,360
an athlete? 
To me this is where just from 

877
00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:03,760
experience this seems to make 
more sense. 

878
00:48:03,760 --> 00:48:07,320
Like an athlete seems to have 
more success, transferable 

879
00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:12,480
success and the the last piece I
guess I wanted to loop this in 

880
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:17,320
before. 
What I have seen where an 

881
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:22,440
athlete has the most success is 
when, you know, I kind of help 

882
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:24,880
guide their search a little bit.
But then I let them go. 

883
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:29,880
Like I might help, you know, 
educate their attention here or 

884
00:48:30,440 --> 00:48:33,720
help them, you know, with their 
intention or whatever. 

885
00:48:34,560 --> 00:48:39,960
And then I step back and I let 
them just like kind of figure 

886
00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:42,000
out like, OK, what do they 
actually want to work on? 

887
00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:44,440
We give them space to explore. 
And then I just sit there and I 

888
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:47,280
observe what are they doing, how
are they trying to interact with

889
00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:48,880
the problem. 
And then I come back in, like I 

890
00:48:48,880 --> 00:48:51,120
said before of like, OK, what 
are they currently doing? 

891
00:48:51,320 --> 00:48:55,680
How do I help them to the next 
step for them to be successful? 

892
00:48:56,160 --> 00:48:59,520
And then I come in and I leave 
and it we just have this because

893
00:48:59,720 --> 00:49:05,000
a lot of times guys will they 
might go off on like following 

894
00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:08,920
some guy on the Internet who is 
really focused on some sort of 

895
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:11,360
mechanical cue. 
And I don't think I'm ever going

896
00:49:11,360 --> 00:49:15,520
to be able to prevent a guy from
going that if they're inclined 

897
00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:17,000
that direction they want to go 
that direction. 

898
00:49:17,000 --> 00:49:20,320
I think you have to let a guy go
explore where they want to go 

899
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:23,280
explore. 
But then for me it's about 

900
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:28,120
helping them reintegrate that 
back into them being successful.

901
00:49:28,120 --> 00:49:31,560
And I had that conversation with
with one of our hitters of he's 

902
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:34,640
really down the the teacher man 
rabbit hole and like now half 

903
00:49:34,640 --> 00:49:38,040
the team like I'm watching them 
like coil and do one legged 

904
00:49:38,040 --> 00:49:42,320
stuff and whatever and it's fine
because there's some value 

905
00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:44,160
there. 
So it's like hey let them let 

906
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:46,520
them find the value and how it 
works to them. 

907
00:49:46,520 --> 00:49:49,680
But then I have, I've, I've come
back and I've told them, like to

908
00:49:49,760 --> 00:49:51,760
to the guys that start to 
struggle with some of his, like,

909
00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:54,200
hey, man, you know, are you, 
where are you? 

910
00:49:54,200 --> 00:49:55,240
Where's your focus? 
Are you? 

911
00:49:55,240 --> 00:49:58,560
So you're so wrapped up and 
coiling over your back hip and 

912
00:49:58,560 --> 00:50:01,640
making sure this or whatever. 
Like, you know, like I asked, I 

913
00:50:01,640 --> 00:50:03,680
asked one. 
I was like, you know, do you 

914
00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:07,920
feel free or do you feel like 
you're you're constrained, 

915
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:10,280
you're chained, you know? 
Or do you feel not free? 

916
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:11,400
It's like, yeah, I don't feel 
free. 

917
00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:15,280
It's like, hey, man, like you 
need to like, allow yourself to 

918
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:17,680
focus on, like, you know, 
because we had this 

919
00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:19,960
conversation. 
Well, actually a long time ago. 

920
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:23,560
You know, I tried to step in and
try to like tell him, you know, 

921
00:50:23,560 --> 00:50:25,720
like, hey, man, you know, if 
like you're not having success, 

922
00:50:25,720 --> 00:50:27,440
Like, what's the definition of 
stupidity? 

923
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:30,000
You know, trying the same thing 
over and over again and, you 

924
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:32,000
know, and then it just, it 
didn't, it didn't land with him.

925
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:34,960
But I because he he just 
remembered being like telling me

926
00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:37,040
no, no, like the whole reason 
I'm like chasing this thing 

927
00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:40,160
right now is this worked really 
well for me in the summer and 

928
00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:43,760
it's like I felt so calm and I 
was thinking about it later. 

929
00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:46,640
I was like, oh, that's it right 
there, that calm feeling. 

930
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:49,480
And so like, anyways, I looped 
that back in and I was like, hey

931
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:53,480
man, like you told me before, 
you know, like you felt super 

932
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:55,160
calm. 
Like do you feel calm now when 

933
00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:56,720
you're just focused on this back
hip? 

934
00:50:56,720 --> 00:51:00,040
And I was like, no, it's like, 
hey, man, like this maybe. 

935
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:04,360
Maybe, you know, like I told 
him, hey, you need to understand

936
00:51:04,360 --> 00:51:06,960
there's this ideal space. 
You need to understand where you

937
00:51:06,960 --> 00:51:08,600
are right now and how you're 
relating to it. 

938
00:51:09,720 --> 00:51:14,440
And so, you know, it's how you 
need to figure out when it comes

939
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:18,960
to, you know, other people's 
stuff, you know, like the back 

940
00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:20,440
hip or whatever. 
When is it that you need to 

941
00:51:20,440 --> 00:51:22,120
focus on that? 
And when is it that you need to 

942
00:51:22,120 --> 00:51:24,920
just be fully present in the 
moment and focus on just hitting

943
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:28,960
the ball and just being free and
then knowing when to grab that 

944
00:51:28,960 --> 00:51:31,160
thing and to use it and to be 
successful. 

945
00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:33,480
And like that's the thing that's
you know going back to what you 

946
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:36,120
were saying Baker of like the 
meaning like when does this 

947
00:51:36,120 --> 00:51:38,120
matter? 
When do you need to bring this 

948
00:51:38,120 --> 00:51:40,240
in and focus on. 
Because from my own personal 

949
00:51:40,240 --> 00:51:45,240
experience, I actually have to 
use mechanical cues of like you 

950
00:51:45,240 --> 00:51:46,920
know I'm getting too tilted this
way. 

951
00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:48,800
So I need actually need to get 
my back hip more. 

952
00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:51,640
I need to actually let my my 
front hip and that helps get my 

953
00:51:51,760 --> 00:51:54,880
my ball up doing this whole 
thing of like I'm just focused 

954
00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:58,080
on on staying connected whatever
and blah blah blah. 

955
00:51:58,080 --> 00:52:01,640
Like I didn't get enough success
but I found I'd get moments of 

956
00:52:01,640 --> 00:52:04,480
success for that next pitch that
would get me back to. 

957
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:07,240
I didn't need to focus on it. 
I just need to focus on you know

958
00:52:07,240 --> 00:52:09,680
like my army needs to go through
this window or whatever it is. 

959
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:13,040
Like I now know like what are my
little mechanical things that I 

960
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:15,720
need to go to to make the 
adjustment but I don't. 

961
00:52:15,720 --> 00:52:20,680
But I found if I keep focusing 
on them, I this the the 

962
00:52:20,680 --> 00:52:23,920
effectiveness goes away. 
And so I was kind of trying to 

963
00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:27,480
help him understand where does 
this, where do these things that

964
00:52:27,480 --> 00:52:30,960
you, you that you pick up on the
Internet, like how do you 

965
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:37,080
actually incorporate them into 
your toolbox and how to be able 

966
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:38,520
to effectively pull those things
out. 

967
00:52:38,560 --> 00:52:41,120
And so anyways to me that's 
that's kind of the thing of like

968
00:52:41,200 --> 00:52:44,840
you know coaches you know get 
all hung up on like all this guy

969
00:52:44,840 --> 00:52:47,520
is wrecking him whatever, you 
know because he's all focused on

970
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:49,520
mechanical whatever. 
But if this is what a guy is 

971
00:52:49,520 --> 00:52:52,680
interested in, like I just need 
to help them figure out how to 

972
00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:58,480
integrate this back and you on 
my long rant to try to tie it 

973
00:52:58,480 --> 00:53:01,920
all the way back. 
What I tend to find is that they

974
00:53:01,920 --> 00:53:06,640
will naturally begin to interact
with the stuff that I was 

975
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:09,120
talking about. 
When I give them the space and 

976
00:53:09,120 --> 00:53:11,960
the freedom and they go on their
on their own way and they 

977
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:15,920
explore this other thing, 
they'll eventually over time 

978
00:53:16,240 --> 00:53:19,520
like come back and explore that 
and be like, oh, this is how it 

979
00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:22,280
works. 
But it has to come in its own 

980
00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:24,760
timing. 
You can't force the timing of 

981
00:53:24,760 --> 00:53:30,640
when, when what you brought to 
them when it comes and it finds 

982
00:53:30,640 --> 00:53:34,880
its full fruition, you know. 
And so that that for me is the, 

983
00:53:36,520 --> 00:53:38,760
the thing that I think is 
important is giving guys space 

984
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:42,160
to where you just step back and 
you let them explore and kind of

985
00:53:42,160 --> 00:53:44,440
do their own thing and like kind
of figure it out on their own. 

986
00:53:45,920 --> 00:53:48,880
Yeah, I I think there's actually
something really profound in 

987
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:50,400
there and it relates back to 
what? 

988
00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:56,280
Baker talked about of having the
dexterity as as a coach as well.

989
00:53:57,360 --> 00:54:01,040
In my mind, it's kind of a a 
fallacy to think, oh, we don't 

990
00:54:01,040 --> 00:54:04,440
want our players to plug and 
play solutions like we have one 

991
00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:07,880
technique that we apply to all 
problems and if you flip it on 

992
00:54:07,880 --> 00:54:10,520
the same way, it also shouldn't 
be the same with a coach. 

993
00:54:10,520 --> 00:54:13,680
There shouldn't be a one way of 
coaching or going about things 

994
00:54:14,320 --> 00:54:16,200
that you apply to every single 
athlete. 

995
00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:20,120
And personally that's that's 
very convicting to me to be able

996
00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:23,080
to have that open mind and being
able to experiment. 

997
00:54:23,080 --> 00:54:25,960
If we want our athletes to be 
creative and experiment within 

998
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:29,080
practice, we also need to have 
the grace to be able to 

999
00:54:29,080 --> 00:54:33,080
experiment with our own style of
coaching and developing practice

1000
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:37,120
as well. 
And that's something where going

1001
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:41,280
back to kind of the art and 
science aspect of the the 

1002
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:43,640
conference, if you think about 
art and science, they're both 

1003
00:54:43,640 --> 00:54:46,560
experimentation. 
You know, they both kind of are 

1004
00:54:46,560 --> 00:54:50,680
experimenting different ways 
that I can use in art, say, 

1005
00:54:50,680 --> 00:54:53,200
whether it's painting, different
ways, I can use colors to 

1006
00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:57,520
generate some sort of some sort 
of image in science, it's oh, 

1007
00:54:58,080 --> 00:55:00,880
what different ways can these 
variables interact together that

1008
00:55:00,880 --> 00:55:04,120
we can kind of find something 
kind of beautiful through it. 

1009
00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:06,880
And I think that core of the 
experimentation, keeping the 

1010
00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:11,200
open mind and OK, I have all of 
these constraints and tools and 

1011
00:55:11,200 --> 00:55:15,400
abilities at my disposal, How 
can I potentially shift those in

1012
00:55:15,400 --> 00:55:18,480
different situations? 
And I think from a coaching 

1013
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:22,280
standpoint, if we're asking our 
athletes to do that, it kind of 

1014
00:55:22,280 --> 00:55:25,120
needs to also fall back on us 
for us to keep that same sort of

1015
00:55:25,120 --> 00:55:27,840
mindset and be able to apply 
that in our coaching as well. 

1016
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:32,640
Yeah, for sure. 
And I'm a playoff of the idea of

1017
00:55:32,640 --> 00:55:35,760
the art and science Music kind 
of sprung a thought in my mind 

1018
00:55:35,760 --> 00:55:37,600
that actually came off of 
Bernstein's paper. 

1019
00:55:38,480 --> 00:55:42,640
The idea of like a really good 
artist, if he's if he's doing a 

1020
00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:47,360
painting and he accidentally 
drops a glob of paint somewhere 

1021
00:55:47,360 --> 00:55:50,680
on his painting, like, is that 
painting done? 

1022
00:55:51,160 --> 00:55:54,480
Or With really good artists, 
he's able to see what now it 

1023
00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:57,680
just got created because of that
mistake and create something 

1024
00:55:57,680 --> 00:56:01,400
completely different, but 
potentially even better because 

1025
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:05,440
of his ability to be a little 
more resourceful, quick, witted 

1026
00:56:05,520 --> 00:56:09,680
and act, act a little bit, a 
little bit more like what you 

1027
00:56:09,680 --> 00:56:12,640
would of course say is a little 
more dexterous within within his

1028
00:56:12,640 --> 00:56:14,120
time. 
And I think that's the same with

1029
00:56:14,880 --> 00:56:17,320
within any kind of athlete or 
with any kind of coach. 

1030
00:56:17,720 --> 00:56:21,440
It's it's this idea of like you 
you have some kind of mistake or

1031
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:24,480
there was a mess up or something
like how quickly can you go 

1032
00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:26,960
correct this. 
And based on the new information

1033
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:29,160
that's within the environment. 
And I think that's that's really

1034
00:56:29,160 --> 00:56:31,720
interesting. 
And I think, again, I'm going to

1035
00:56:31,720 --> 00:56:33,560
tie another talk in here on the 
SMSC. 

1036
00:56:33,560 --> 00:56:36,160
But Jim Haberstrom I think did a
really cool job. 

1037
00:56:37,120 --> 00:56:39,280
I I loved his talk it. 
It talked about the technique 

1038
00:56:39,280 --> 00:56:41,880
takes care of itself. 
But one of the first things he 

1039
00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:45,200
talked about was being a 
musician for a bunch of years. 

1040
00:56:45,200 --> 00:56:48,120
Like he he was a professional 
musician, trumpet player, that 

1041
00:56:48,680 --> 00:56:50,280
and that. 
And I I wrote this quote down 

1042
00:56:50,280 --> 00:56:53,680
and he said he wasn't. 
He got to a point where he was 

1043
00:56:53,680 --> 00:56:56,320
the best trumpet player when he 
said he was not worried about 

1044
00:56:56,320 --> 00:56:58,840
playing the trumpet, just 
playing music, which I thought 

1045
00:56:58,840 --> 00:57:02,800
was absolutely fascinating. 
It's it's his idea of like he 

1046
00:57:02,800 --> 00:57:05,840
wasn't no longer like focus on 
all the techniques and all these

1047
00:57:05,840 --> 00:57:07,440
perfect ways he has to play the 
trumpet. 

1048
00:57:07,680 --> 00:57:09,400
He was just trying to play the 
music. 

1049
00:57:09,800 --> 00:57:12,920
And I think there in lies again,
Garrett, some of what you're 

1050
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:17,360
talking about like this, the 
person who's so focused on their

1051
00:57:17,360 --> 00:57:20,200
technique and how they they have
to move this way or that way, 

1052
00:57:20,520 --> 00:57:23,760
they're so worried about just 
swinging versus playing 

1053
00:57:23,760 --> 00:57:25,840
baseball. 
And I think that's that's a 

1054
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:28,640
massive difference. 
And like when you can get the 

1055
00:57:28,640 --> 00:57:31,160
person again like what he talks 
about it have the technique take

1056
00:57:31,160 --> 00:57:33,680
care of itself. 
Again it it Darren, I think to 

1057
00:57:33,680 --> 00:57:36,720
your point, I think there there 
is time where like playing with 

1058
00:57:36,720 --> 00:57:39,920
different different kind of 
mechanical quote UN quote cues 

1059
00:57:39,920 --> 00:57:43,120
or whatever could have some 
potential value for that person.

1060
00:57:43,120 --> 00:57:47,000
But at a certain point like that
you're going to self organize in

1061
00:57:47,000 --> 00:57:50,320
your best solution are are you 
adding action capabilities or 

1062
00:57:50,320 --> 00:57:53,000
effectivities in ways you could 
potentially move by practicing 

1063
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:53,760
some of that? 
Sure. 

1064
00:57:54,160 --> 00:57:56,560
But then once you're back into 
it and you're just playing 

1065
00:57:56,560 --> 00:57:59,880
baseball, like the technique may
potentially take care of itself 

1066
00:57:59,920 --> 00:58:03,640
in a better way. 
And he kind of talks about in, 

1067
00:58:03,640 --> 00:58:05,920
in in. 
I would highly suggest anybody 

1068
00:58:05,920 --> 00:58:07,800
who hasn't got in the 
conference. 

1069
00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:10,480
Like even if it's just like for 
a couple of these talks I 

1070
00:58:10,480 --> 00:58:12,840
brought up, this is 1 great one.
Because he talks about his 

1071
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:17,160
journey as a coach and like how 
he how he was talking about 

1072
00:58:17,160 --> 00:58:19,440
these perfect techniques. 
Like even just like, hey, this 

1073
00:58:19,440 --> 00:58:20,760
is exactly how you have to bend 
your knees. 

1074
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:22,480
And then you're seeing all these
different kind of ways of people

1075
00:58:22,480 --> 00:58:24,640
bending the knees. 
And then he, he added some 

1076
00:58:24,640 --> 00:58:26,840
different constraints like 
jumping, jumping over something 

1077
00:58:26,840 --> 00:58:28,840
and how they landed. 
OK, so the technique kind of 

1078
00:58:28,840 --> 00:58:30,680
took care of itself. 
That's exactly where I want you 

1079
00:58:30,680 --> 00:58:33,440
kind of to be, But it's because 
you landed and then you were 

1080
00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:34,800
there. 
Or then he started using 

1081
00:58:34,800 --> 00:58:37,000
different analogies. 
He talked about Nick Wiggleman's

1082
00:58:37,000 --> 00:58:40,160
book and, like, he was getting 
so frustrated with their 

1083
00:58:40,160 --> 00:58:42,560
athletes not being able to do 
what he wanted to do. 

1084
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:46,280
And then changed it to this 
different kind of game and kind 

1085
00:58:46,280 --> 00:58:47,520
of was a little more quick 
witted. 

1086
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:50,480
Like, hey, these young kids love
cutting people in line and watch

1087
00:58:50,480 --> 00:58:52,880
what they do on skates. 
When they cut them in line, it's

1088
00:58:52,880 --> 00:58:55,440
like, OK, so like let's have 
them try to cut people in line 

1089
00:58:55,440 --> 00:58:58,160
while they're trying to gain an 
advantage, trying to go, I 

1090
00:58:58,160 --> 00:59:03,120
forget what he calls it. 
I were, yeah, he called it 

1091
00:59:03,120 --> 00:59:05,520
creating angles. 
And it's like I'm trying to get 

1092
00:59:05,520 --> 00:59:06,920
him create angles. 
But I tell him just to cut the 

1093
00:59:06,920 --> 00:59:08,800
guy in line as he's skating, 
like I'm going to see it. 

1094
00:59:08,800 --> 00:59:11,640
And then what emerged is the 
technique he was looking for. 

1095
00:59:11,640 --> 00:59:13,880
And I thought that was a really 
cool way. 

1096
00:59:14,200 --> 00:59:16,960
And kind of how he talked about 
his journey and like how he was 

1097
00:59:16,960 --> 00:59:19,960
frustrated with the verbal cues 
he was using, trying to get 

1098
00:59:19,960 --> 00:59:21,560
this. 
And then he was like, well, this

1099
00:59:21,560 --> 00:59:24,480
isn't working, obviously. 
And then just seeing it was open

1100
00:59:24,480 --> 00:59:26,920
to what is within the 
environment, hey, like cutting 

1101
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:29,080
cutting's kind of emerging what 
I want to see. 

1102
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:31,320
Let's use that and see if that 
kind of gets it. 

1103
00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:32,680
And it did, which is really 
cool. 

1104
00:59:35,640 --> 00:59:42,720
Two I want to plug plug for for 
anybody now who's listening SMSC

1105
00:59:42,720 --> 00:59:46,000
23 you guys should check it out.
Hopefully this gives you like 

1106
00:59:46,000 --> 00:59:48,440
some ideas of which talks. 
I mean I we should have. 

1107
00:59:48,440 --> 00:59:51,400
We should have if I had if I had
done this open this the way that

1108
00:59:51,400 --> 00:59:55,800
I I should have of like an 
actual podcast episode. 

1109
00:59:57,720 --> 01:00:00,920
I would have put this in here of
like you know started the 

1110
01:00:01,480 --> 01:00:04,800
started us with hey what were 
your favorite speakers because I

1111
01:00:04,800 --> 01:00:08,240
think some of it is for people 
like you know knowing like you 

1112
01:00:08,240 --> 01:00:11,840
might not know all the names 
like oh you know who's who's Jim

1113
01:00:12,040 --> 01:00:13,960
what was his last name I can't 
starts with an HI think. 

1114
01:00:14,360 --> 01:00:15,800
It's Haverstrom. 
I could be saying it wrong. 

1115
01:00:15,800 --> 01:00:17,400
Haverstrom. 
Yeah, You know, like, who's 

1116
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:18,920
who's that? 
I've never heard of him, you 

1117
01:00:18,920 --> 01:00:19,520
know. 
Right. 

1118
01:00:19,520 --> 01:00:22,360
But like once you begin to see 
like, oh hey, we're finding a 

1119
01:00:22,360 --> 01:00:24,600
ton of value, like hey, this is 
a talk that you want to go 

1120
01:00:24,600 --> 01:00:28,360
listen to. 
You guys should pick this up and

1121
01:00:28,360 --> 01:00:34,520
if you want a a discount on it, 
use Edge 7 to get a 7% off. 

1122
01:00:34,520 --> 01:00:37,080
OK. 
So if you're wanting to save a 

1123
01:00:37,080 --> 01:00:39,360
little bit of money too and get 
this or if you want to pay full 

1124
01:00:39,360 --> 01:00:43,120
price and and support emergence,
by all means don't use it. 

1125
01:00:43,840 --> 01:00:48,000
So with that being said, yeah, 
what what were some of your 

1126
01:00:48,000 --> 01:00:54,520
guys's favorite talks that you 
guys hold a lot of good info on 

1127
01:00:54,960 --> 01:00:56,680
and slightly I'm getting off 
topic here. 

1128
01:00:56,680 --> 01:00:59,120
I'm going to back up just a 
second to go off of what you 

1129
01:00:59,120 --> 01:01:01,000
were just saying Baker. 
That's exactly. 

1130
01:01:01,000 --> 01:01:05,840
I just listened to that talk 
with Jim when when this guy was 

1131
01:01:05,840 --> 01:01:10,600
getting all domed up on on his 
on his rear hip coil. 

1132
01:01:11,120 --> 01:01:15,760
And so I was, you know, like 
that's where I would say for 

1133
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:18,520
people that talk for sure you 
need to listen to because it 

1134
01:01:18,520 --> 01:01:21,040
was, it was really helpful for 
me to be able to connect with my

1135
01:01:21,440 --> 01:01:25,240
one of my players and really 
help him and just kind of like 

1136
01:01:25,240 --> 01:01:28,000
he had a kind of an aha moment. 
It was just fun to watch him go 

1137
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:30,680
back in there and like he's miss
hitting balls, all this sort of 

1138
01:01:30,680 --> 01:01:34,440
stuff and all. 
And like our machine we have a, 

1139
01:01:34,520 --> 01:01:37,360
we have a a poor man's version 
of an eye pitch. 

1140
01:01:37,920 --> 01:01:41,920
And because all our balls are 
different states of quality. 

1141
01:01:42,200 --> 01:01:45,720
So, you know, there's sometimes 
it'll throw you a good, a good 

1142
01:01:46,480 --> 01:01:48,880
fastball and other times it'll 
throw you a splitter, change up,

1143
01:01:48,880 --> 01:01:53,000
whatever. 
And it was fun to watch him be 

1144
01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:56,160
able to now all of a sudden 
adjust to those off speed 

1145
01:01:56,160 --> 01:01:58,440
pitches and hit them. 
So he's hitting the fastball and

1146
01:01:58,440 --> 01:02:02,400
he's being able to adjust it to 
to the off speed pitches that it

1147
01:02:02,400 --> 01:02:04,400
was throwing in that. 
That's where it's like, yeah, 

1148
01:02:04,400 --> 01:02:07,040
man, because this is this is the
thing, the other thing too for 

1149
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:10,720
me when it comes to this stuff. 
You know, I know there is a 

1150
01:02:10,720 --> 01:02:12,920
process where like, yeah, your 
performance might dip a little 

1151
01:02:12,920 --> 01:02:16,960
bit, but in my opinion, when you
get it right and the athlete's 

1152
01:02:16,960 --> 01:02:19,120
able to connect with the 
environment, it clicks. 

1153
01:02:19,200 --> 01:02:22,160
It's not a it's not this whole 
like, hey, you're going to suck 

1154
01:02:22,160 --> 01:02:25,560
for a for a long time like what 
we're trying to do. 

1155
01:02:25,560 --> 01:02:27,800
When I'm trying to guide your 
search, I'm trying to guide you 

1156
01:02:27,800 --> 01:02:30,200
to a place where you have this 
functional fit. 

1157
01:02:30,440 --> 01:02:33,360
When we find the functional fit,
it clicks it. 

1158
01:02:33,360 --> 01:02:36,800
It's not this. 
It's not this whole like suck 

1159
01:02:36,800 --> 01:02:40,760
for a while and then get better.
It's it's I'm trying to help you

1160
01:02:40,760 --> 01:02:42,280
better relate with the 
environment. 

1161
01:02:42,280 --> 01:02:45,280
And so when we find the thing it
we should start, we should see 

1162
01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:49,280
success, we should start to see,
you know, we should start 

1163
01:02:49,280 --> 01:02:52,080
trending towards success. 
Maybe we don't see success right

1164
01:02:52,080 --> 01:02:54,200
away, but we start trending in 
that direction. 

1165
01:02:55,000 --> 01:02:59,560
And so to me that's that's where
I, I think, you know some folks 

1166
01:02:59,560 --> 01:03:01,760
who you know in order to get a 
player to buy in will say, oh, 

1167
01:03:01,840 --> 01:03:04,960
you need to suck, you know, 
you're going to suck or 

1168
01:03:04,960 --> 01:03:09,840
whatever. 
It's like I I kind of, I dislike

1169
01:03:09,840 --> 01:03:14,000
the underlying implications or 
insinuations there. 

1170
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:16,680
I think no, if I'm going to give
you something you should find 

1171
01:03:16,680 --> 01:03:20,480
success. 
I I like this thing that Donnie 

1172
01:03:20,480 --> 01:03:22,360
Ecker said. 
You know they try hey try this 

1173
01:03:22,760 --> 01:03:24,840
and it doesn't work. 
I was like, yeah, let's pretend 

1174
01:03:24,840 --> 01:03:27,240
that never happened. 
We'll never do that again. 

1175
01:03:27,440 --> 01:03:30,680
I I I think there's something to
that of like what I give you 

1176
01:03:30,680 --> 01:03:35,320
should you know should help you 
work towards success. 

1177
01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:38,520
And sometimes yes, it's true I 
give it it's actually 

1178
01:03:38,520 --> 01:03:40,720
inappropriate time. 
But I sometimes you do just have

1179
01:03:40,720 --> 01:03:43,520
to introduce it and you just 
kind of walk away and you just 

1180
01:03:43,520 --> 01:03:46,600
kind of like revisit it and it 
does take time. 

1181
01:03:46,600 --> 01:03:49,680
It does have that. 
So I don't, I don't fully hate 

1182
01:03:49,680 --> 01:03:52,120
it, but I I don't think we 
should lean on that too much. 

1183
01:03:52,120 --> 01:03:55,440
Anyways, to the, to the, to the 
other question of like what were

1184
01:03:55,440 --> 01:03:56,720
some of your guys's favorite 
talks? 

1185
01:03:56,720 --> 01:03:59,480
Hey. 
Go ahead. 

1186
01:04:01,080 --> 01:04:04,720
I mean, there's a ton of ones I 
really, really enjoy. 

1187
01:04:04,720 --> 01:04:06,840
Obviously at Haversham's I've 
already, I've already shouted 

1188
01:04:06,840 --> 01:04:07,880
out. 
I've shouted out a few of them 

1189
01:04:07,880 --> 01:04:09,960
and I think it really depends 
what you're interested in right.

1190
01:04:11,800 --> 01:04:13,760
Me as I think a lot of them took
different ways. 

1191
01:04:13,760 --> 01:04:15,960
But I mean I I would be remiss 
if I didn't bring up Keith 

1192
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:18,080
David's and that Keith David's 
again like he he's a little 

1193
01:04:18,080 --> 01:04:20,760
heavy in theory at times. 
So if you're a little more 

1194
01:04:20,760 --> 01:04:23,840
experienced with the ideas like 
Keith Davis is a no brainer even

1195
01:04:23,840 --> 01:04:25,960
if you're not just to get 
exposed to them. 

1196
01:04:26,680 --> 01:04:30,080
I thought he he did a really 
good job and it may be something

1197
01:04:30,080 --> 01:04:32,480
you have to listen to if you you
you're not familiar with these 

1198
01:04:32,480 --> 01:04:35,960
ideas a few times. 
But that's how I kind of started

1199
01:04:35,960 --> 01:04:38,240
learning these ideas like I had 
to listen things over and over 

1200
01:04:38,240 --> 01:04:41,640
and over like some of these some
of these type talks and then I 

1201
01:04:41,640 --> 01:04:43,960
started kind of like oh I see 
that oh I'm sorry to understand 

1202
01:04:43,960 --> 01:04:45,600
that. 
So I think he's he's really 

1203
01:04:45,600 --> 01:04:48,320
good. 
Tyler Tyler Yerby's was super 

1204
01:04:48,320 --> 01:04:50,560
practical. 
I think anybody can grab 

1205
01:04:50,560 --> 01:04:52,880
something from that super 
quickly and again I already 

1206
01:04:52,880 --> 01:04:56,040
brought him up again Sean runs 
the whole thing. 

1207
01:04:56,040 --> 01:04:59,640
So I think, I think he he's. 
I thought was good too. 

1208
01:04:59,720 --> 01:05:01,840
Yeah, he talked through his 
paper and there's a lot of 

1209
01:05:01,840 --> 01:05:04,920
theory in there, but I I like 
that one that you can go back to

1210
01:05:05,240 --> 01:05:07,200
the paper. 
And two, like it is really 

1211
01:05:07,200 --> 01:05:09,960
practical at the same time. 
Like, he did a really good job 

1212
01:05:09,960 --> 01:05:11,920
of still making it practical, I 
mean. 

1213
01:05:11,960 --> 01:05:14,720
If you don't understand any of 
the words like the whole, the 

1214
01:05:14,720 --> 01:05:18,320
whole, his whole talk was like 
being being at one or being one 

1215
01:05:18,320 --> 01:05:19,720
with the environment like you 
don't. 

1216
01:05:19,720 --> 01:05:23,040
You don't need to understand 
technical terms to understand 

1217
01:05:23,040 --> 01:05:24,800
that concept of being one with 
the environment. 

1218
01:05:25,080 --> 01:05:27,280
Yeah, yeah, for sure. 
I just, I just know when I 

1219
01:05:27,280 --> 01:05:30,120
started, I would get lost. 
Like I start bringing up terms I

1220
01:05:30,120 --> 01:05:32,600
wasn't familiar with. 
Like when you start talking 

1221
01:05:32,600 --> 01:05:34,520
about system degrees of freedom,
I didn't know what the heck that

1222
01:05:34,520 --> 01:05:37,200
went right. 
So it's like just being aware 

1223
01:05:37,200 --> 01:05:39,880
that there may be some concepts 
you may have to wrestle with a 

1224
01:05:39,880 --> 01:05:42,920
little bit or re listen to or go
read the paper afterwards and 

1225
01:05:42,920 --> 01:05:45,960
that's how you're going to grow.
I just wanted to at least at 

1226
01:05:45,960 --> 01:05:48,240
least throw that out. 
What was that? 

1227
01:05:48,240 --> 01:05:51,160
Bernstein paper, by the way, 
that you kept you keep reckon. 

1228
01:05:51,200 --> 01:05:54,040
Just dexterity in development is
his classic dexterity in his 

1229
01:05:54,040 --> 01:05:57,680
development. 
Like I found APDF version of it,

1230
01:05:57,680 --> 01:06:00,560
I think baseball wise like Rob 
Gray, obviously. 

1231
01:06:00,560 --> 01:06:02,600
Like I think most people who 
listen to this are baseball 

1232
01:06:02,680 --> 01:06:03,960
people. 
So I think Rob Gray's a no 

1233
01:06:03,960 --> 01:06:06,400
brainer, like go listen to Rob 
Gray's. 

1234
01:06:06,640 --> 01:06:09,440
I'm not going to say listen to 
mine instead of be prideful, but

1235
01:06:09,440 --> 01:06:12,080
I was the only other baseball 
talk on there, so feel free. 

1236
01:06:12,080 --> 01:06:13,920
But I also talked about parkour 
healthy bit. 

1237
01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:17,440
So you're also into parkour like
then definitely listen to it. 

1238
01:06:17,720 --> 01:06:20,840
But I'll stop there because I'll
let AJAJ happen there if there's

1239
01:06:20,840 --> 01:06:24,760
any that spoke to you. 
Yeah, I mean, didn't you didn't 

1240
01:06:24,760 --> 01:06:26,240
need to do the pridefulness 
yourself. 

1241
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:27,680
I was going to pitch yours. 
Obviously. 

1242
01:06:27,680 --> 01:06:30,120
I I was kind of there when 
you're going through it and 

1243
01:06:30,120 --> 01:06:32,520
working through the ideas and 
and it was awesome kind of being

1244
01:06:32,520 --> 01:06:36,520
able to connect baseball to 
parkour and be able to talk 

1245
01:06:36,520 --> 01:06:39,160
about the synergies that is this
in between was was pretty 

1246
01:06:39,160 --> 01:06:43,720
awesome something that really 
jumped out at me was was Tom 

1247
01:06:43,720 --> 01:06:45,880
Parry's one. 
I know that one was maybe kind 

1248
01:06:45,880 --> 01:06:49,040
of buried in there on day one, 
but something I'm really 

1249
01:06:49,040 --> 01:06:53,200
fascinated with recently is kind
of how these different 

1250
01:06:53,600 --> 01:06:57,600
constraints of kind of the 
stories about how people view 

1251
01:06:57,600 --> 01:06:59,760
themselves impact the way that 
they play. 

1252
01:07:00,360 --> 01:07:03,160
And that kind of ties in a 
little bit into Kirsten Wings 

1253
01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:06,720
and Chris Mccoskirs as well. 
But kind of talking about, well,

1254
01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:09,160
like, what is the national 
culture you're a part of? 

1255
01:07:09,160 --> 01:07:11,120
What's the soccer culture you're
a part of? 

1256
01:07:11,160 --> 01:07:14,320
In Tom Parra's example, what are
those different cultures, and 

1257
01:07:14,320 --> 01:07:16,360
how does that kind of shape the 
way you play the game? 

1258
01:07:16,360 --> 01:07:19,960
I know Baker, you'll know with a
lot of the guys on the Mets 

1259
01:07:19,960 --> 01:07:23,800
where there's a lot of Hispanic 
players, and that really shapes 

1260
01:07:23,800 --> 01:07:25,800
the way they play. 
A lot of their upbringing kind 

1261
01:07:25,800 --> 01:07:29,720
of shapes their attitude and the
solutions that they find on the 

1262
01:07:29,720 --> 01:07:32,400
field and I'm really fascinated 
about how we can learn more 

1263
01:07:32,400 --> 01:07:36,760
about that and be able to help 
them understand how that context

1264
01:07:36,760 --> 01:07:39,760
fits into the problem solver 
they are as an athlete. 

1265
01:07:39,760 --> 01:07:42,680
So that was something that has 
been really fascinating to me 

1266
01:07:42,680 --> 01:07:44,520
recently. 
And I know that's less of the 

1267
01:07:45,160 --> 01:07:47,960
activity based setting up 
practice type of things, that's 

1268
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:51,360
more pre work stuff. 
But I find that incredibly 

1269
01:07:51,360 --> 01:07:56,120
fascinating of how that drives 
the practice design and also 

1270
01:07:56,120 --> 01:07:58,560
just how you relate to your 
athlete and how it helps you put

1271
01:07:58,560 --> 01:08:01,040
yourself in their shoes to 
understand why they're going 

1272
01:08:01,040 --> 01:08:03,720
about different solutions in 
different ways. 

1273
01:08:04,400 --> 01:08:05,880
So that that was a big one for 
me. 

1274
01:08:05,880 --> 01:08:09,680
And then honestly anything that 
kind of opened up different 

1275
01:08:09,680 --> 01:08:13,080
portals that Stu McMillan talked
about things that were different

1276
01:08:13,080 --> 01:08:15,640
or that I hadn't seen before and
kind of sent me down different 

1277
01:08:15,640 --> 01:08:19,120
rabbit holes was was huge. 
Stu obviously had a few of 

1278
01:08:19,120 --> 01:08:21,200
those. 
Austin Yoakam had a bunch of 

1279
01:08:21,200 --> 01:08:25,040
those, but just something that 
kind of pops up in the 

1280
01:08:25,040 --> 01:08:27,760
environment, so to speak, that 
you can pick up on and say, oh 

1281
01:08:27,760 --> 01:08:30,319
man, I never thought about it in
that way. 

1282
01:08:30,319 --> 01:08:34,040
How can I maybe do a little bit 
more research on this on my own 

1283
01:08:34,040 --> 01:08:37,800
to be able to integrate it into 
how I view the world and kind of

1284
01:08:37,920 --> 01:08:40,120
what my framework is? 
Where does this fit? 

1285
01:08:40,120 --> 01:08:43,319
I think those were things that 
really got me excited, was kind 

1286
01:08:43,319 --> 01:08:46,680
of open up the affordances for 
me to pursue by myself as well. 

1287
01:08:47,080 --> 01:08:50,279
Yes, stews is great and so same 
with yocums I think. 

1288
01:08:50,479 --> 01:08:52,200
Yes. 
And see like for sure go listen 

1289
01:08:52,200 --> 01:08:54,319
to yocums. 
I thought, I thought he did a a 

1290
01:08:54,319 --> 01:08:59,319
really good good job of kind of 
like his old way of thinking, 

1291
01:08:59,319 --> 01:09:01,080
which I think is the most 
traditional way of thinking 

1292
01:09:01,080 --> 01:09:02,760
versus how he's viewing the 
world now. 

1293
01:09:02,760 --> 01:09:05,880
I thought that was really good. 
And yes, stews, I mean Stew, I 

1294
01:09:05,880 --> 01:09:07,960
don't think I've ever heard Stew
talk and him not crush it. 

1295
01:09:08,560 --> 01:09:11,680
And there were some quotes in 
there that like I, I, I use 

1296
01:09:11,680 --> 01:09:14,279
almost daily nowadays because 
it's so it's so powerful. 

1297
01:09:15,560 --> 01:09:18,319
Yeah. 
I mean, I hate to say it, but 

1298
01:09:18,319 --> 01:09:22,279
like as I I've listened to the 
talks like maybe two or three 

1299
01:09:22,279 --> 01:09:25,520
times certain ones and as I go 
back through it, I'm like, oh, I

1300
01:09:25,520 --> 01:09:27,040
really like this one. 
Oh, I didn't pick up anything 

1301
01:09:27,040 --> 01:09:28,560
from this one. 
But now I actually picked up a 

1302
01:09:28,560 --> 01:09:33,399
lot from stuff like that. 
So I would say, I mean you could

1303
01:09:33,399 --> 01:09:35,560
start anywhere honestly and 
you're probably going to get 

1304
01:09:35,560 --> 01:09:37,640
good stuff. 
Anything we've mentioned I think

1305
01:09:37,760 --> 01:09:41,840
like naturally like spoke to us 
a little bit but I even think 

1306
01:09:42,319 --> 01:09:44,080
like I'll shout out Andrew 
Wilson too. 

1307
01:09:44,080 --> 01:09:47,000
He was on the on this podcast 
already like he's his was an 

1308
01:09:47,000 --> 01:09:51,240
incredible talk talking about 
the role of science within sport

1309
01:09:51,240 --> 01:09:54,360
and how like they are actually 
could be partnering with us 

1310
01:09:54,720 --> 01:09:58,400
versus like us as practitioners 
or coaches like we see almost 

1311
01:09:58,400 --> 01:10:00,440
ourselves as odd like what the 
heck do they know, right. 

1312
01:10:00,800 --> 01:10:03,200
We kind of talked about like how
they could actually be impactful

1313
01:10:03,200 --> 01:10:06,880
and then some of the examples 
later like so, so practical like

1314
01:10:06,880 --> 01:10:08,760
His Doors example, like I'll 
leave it there. 

1315
01:10:08,760 --> 01:10:11,280
I mean we could talk about it, 
but like I would highly suggest 

1316
01:10:11,280 --> 01:10:14,040
going to listen to that just 
just for that example so that 

1317
01:10:14,040 --> 01:10:16,120
that will that will connect with
people like right away. 

1318
01:10:16,480 --> 01:10:18,800
I think that was a super 
practical example. 

1319
01:10:19,640 --> 01:10:21,160
But yeah, there's so many good 
talks honestly. 

1320
01:10:21,960 --> 01:10:25,840
And and I would always suggest 
like listening to a multiple 

1321
01:10:25,840 --> 01:10:29,080
times because I've listened to a
couple, three or four times and 

1322
01:10:29,080 --> 01:10:31,440
I realized that my suction for 
notes on that talk wasn't big 

1323
01:10:31,440 --> 01:10:32,760
enough. 
And I'm like in the margins now.

1324
01:10:32,760 --> 01:10:35,000
And there's stuff that didn't 
speak to me the first time, 

1325
01:10:35,000 --> 01:10:37,480
spoke to me the second time or 
third time, which is, which is 

1326
01:10:37,480 --> 01:10:40,600
always really cool. 
The other one that I think we 

1327
01:10:40,600 --> 01:10:43,280
haven't mentioned yet, and I I 
just listened to this one 

1328
01:10:43,280 --> 01:10:45,760
yesterday and I really liked it,
was Ben Franks. 

1329
01:10:45,960 --> 01:10:50,720
Ben Franks is always good but 
like his stuff was more relevant

1330
01:10:50,840 --> 01:10:53,040
I think too because it's 
baseball adjacent. 

1331
01:10:53,040 --> 01:10:56,120
He was he was talking about 
cricket and cricket batters and 

1332
01:10:56,120 --> 01:10:59,240
I was like well so if you're I 
mean this has been pitching 

1333
01:10:59,240 --> 01:11:04,400
heavy but if you're if you're 
into hitting Ben Franks Ben 

1334
01:11:04,400 --> 01:11:08,040
Franks's talk I thought was was 
really really good and 

1335
01:11:08,040 --> 01:11:12,400
interesting and you know when he
was talking about specifying 

1336
01:11:12,400 --> 01:11:16,200
information because this is this
is some of the stuff I think you

1337
01:11:16,200 --> 01:11:19,840
have to to me this is kind of 
impart the art and the science 

1338
01:11:19,920 --> 01:11:22,560
right. 
There's the the because this is 

1339
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:26,400
where also too I like Ben's talk
you know he he's talking about 

1340
01:11:26,400 --> 01:11:31,720
you know he's not such a 
hardcore ideologic or idealist 

1341
01:11:31,720 --> 01:11:34,400
when it comes to eco D anymore. 
You know, he's like, I got, I 

1342
01:11:34,400 --> 01:11:36,080
got, I got away from that a 
little bit. 

1343
01:11:36,520 --> 01:11:37,840
You know, part of it helped, he 
said. 

1344
01:11:37,840 --> 01:11:40,000
Getting off Twitter and you know
stop getting in those Twitter 

1345
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:43,640
spats. 
And I think for me that's that's

1346
01:11:43,640 --> 01:11:48,160
where it's it is you do have to 
get there because for me the cue

1347
01:11:48,160 --> 01:11:52,480
part of like focusing on my back
hip whatever I was like this is 

1348
01:11:52,480 --> 01:11:55,480
an ecological, it's like, but 
I'm like, but it works. 

1349
01:11:55,720 --> 01:11:59,160
So I kind of to me this is the 
art and the science of 

1350
01:11:59,160 --> 01:12:02,480
understanding. 
To me, ecological dynamics gives

1351
01:12:02,480 --> 01:12:07,920
me a framework to understand how
where to put like where things 

1352
01:12:07,920 --> 01:12:10,480
live and breathe. 
And so like each each of these 

1353
01:12:10,480 --> 01:12:13,440
things has a place that it fits 
ecologically. 

1354
01:12:13,440 --> 01:12:15,680
So for example, you know, I'm 
talking about these cues. 

1355
01:12:16,000 --> 01:12:18,920
I understand because of the 
ecological approach that I 

1356
01:12:18,920 --> 01:12:24,240
really need to be focused on my 
connection to the problem in the

1357
01:12:24,240 --> 01:12:26,120
environment. 
And it needs to be, you could 

1358
01:12:26,120 --> 01:12:29,480
say for a lack of a better word 
for people who are a little bit 

1359
01:12:29,480 --> 01:12:31,000
more familiar with this 
external. 

1360
01:12:31,600 --> 01:12:36,840
But it's interesting and I don't
know, you know, maybe it has to 

1361
01:12:36,840 --> 01:12:38,840
do with the different streams of
the brain. 

1362
01:12:39,320 --> 01:12:44,280
But you can you can hold two 
things kind of in in intention, 

1363
01:12:44,600 --> 01:12:47,560
you know. 
So for example when I'm throwing

1364
01:12:47,560 --> 01:12:50,760
BP or whatever, I still am going
to be connected to my target and

1365
01:12:50,760 --> 01:12:54,880
focus on that, but I might I 
might focus on my hip a little 

1366
01:12:54,880 --> 01:12:56,520
bit more. 
So it's actually kind of like 

1367
01:12:56,520 --> 01:13:01,120
there's the I have it's kind of 
split in two, but I keep one 

1368
01:13:01,120 --> 01:13:03,920
more primary. 
I have to remember that my 

1369
01:13:03,920 --> 01:13:05,640
primary focus has to stay 
external. 

1370
01:13:05,760 --> 01:13:11,320
And this is just a a point that 
I have to, you know, feel and 

1371
01:13:11,320 --> 01:13:14,240
kind of focus on it. 
But then after I do it once or 

1372
01:13:14,240 --> 01:13:16,800
twice or whatever, I can start 
to let that go and I can start 

1373
01:13:16,800 --> 01:13:19,880
to focus more and be even more 
external. 

1374
01:13:19,880 --> 01:13:23,920
Because to me, from an 
ecological perspective, it's all

1375
01:13:23,920 --> 01:13:27,080
about our relationship and how 
are we relating to the 

1376
01:13:27,080 --> 01:13:29,840
environment, to the problem part
of that relationship. 

1377
01:13:30,440 --> 01:13:33,000
It involves like, OK, how am I 
relating to myself? 

1378
01:13:33,000 --> 01:13:35,840
How is my body right now 
relating to the problem, or how 

1379
01:13:35,840 --> 01:13:38,160
am I relating to my body and to 
the problem? 

1380
01:13:38,360 --> 01:13:44,200
And so sometimes I have to, you 
know, interact with my body to 

1381
01:13:44,200 --> 01:13:46,880
help it connect and relate to 
the problem better. 

1382
01:13:47,240 --> 01:13:49,960
But it's it's not. 
Because the old school way of 

1383
01:13:49,960 --> 01:13:53,480
thinking I used to think this 
way, is if I just got my 

1384
01:13:53,480 --> 01:13:56,400
mechanics perfect, the results 
would take care of themselves. 

1385
01:13:56,960 --> 01:14:02,320
And it turns out that while that
is true, sometimes the system 

1386
01:14:02,320 --> 01:14:04,920
itself will not. 
You could say, you know, because

1387
01:14:04,920 --> 01:14:08,160
of entropy, no, it tends to move
towards disorder. 

1388
01:14:08,320 --> 01:14:12,400
So even if you can get it into 
that spot of like that per SE 

1389
01:14:12,400 --> 01:14:14,680
and it feels like that, I don't 
think that's really what's going

1390
01:14:14,680 --> 01:14:15,960
on. 
I think the system gets attuned 

1391
01:14:15,960 --> 01:14:18,760
and calibrated and so you have 
that attunement that's going on.

1392
01:14:18,760 --> 01:14:21,320
Your nervous system is highly 
sensitive to everything that's 

1393
01:14:21,320 --> 01:14:24,920
going on and it gives you that 
feel of you know, I my mechanics

1394
01:14:24,920 --> 01:14:27,000
that just said it and but 
there's some there's some 

1395
01:14:27,000 --> 01:14:31,280
element of truth to that too. 
Anyways because you know there 

1396
01:14:31,280 --> 01:14:34,920
are higher order variables that 
we can that we attune to and if 

1397
01:14:34,920 --> 01:14:38,280
you can figure out these higher 
order principles, everything 

1398
01:14:38,280 --> 01:14:40,880
becomes more simple. 
And I think that's that's the 

1399
01:14:40,880 --> 01:14:44,560
other element of this of how 
this all starts to pull and and 

1400
01:14:44,560 --> 01:14:50,080
come together is actually when 
you become more of a master 

1401
01:14:50,080 --> 01:14:53,840
things actually get more simple 
because the information 

1402
01:14:53,880 --> 01:14:58,440
basically specifies what to do 
and you have like these these 

1403
01:14:58,440 --> 01:15:00,840
principles and you know how to 
properly order things. 

1404
01:15:01,160 --> 01:15:05,880
So what what I mean by that is I
know that being external is the 

1405
01:15:05,880 --> 01:15:13,200
higher principle and so it's so 
the this internal focus of 

1406
01:15:13,200 --> 01:15:14,960
attention actually sits down 
here. 

1407
01:15:15,160 --> 01:15:16,560
So I don't get hyper focused on 
it. 

1408
01:15:16,560 --> 01:15:20,080
I just know when to bring this 
in to help me connect better 

1409
01:15:20,080 --> 01:15:22,800
with my external environment and
then I can let it go. 

1410
01:15:23,400 --> 01:15:26,200
And I and I know that this is 
the primary thing. 

1411
01:15:26,560 --> 01:15:29,120
And so when you when you have, 
when you can begin to understand

1412
01:15:29,120 --> 01:15:31,800
what are the the bigger 
principles, everything becomes a

1413
01:15:31,800 --> 01:15:33,960
lot more easy. 
I think of it and I'll analogize

1414
01:15:33,960 --> 01:15:40,680
it with this is I used to think 
that you know I this hopefully 

1415
01:15:40,680 --> 01:15:43,040
is not a knock on Cressy. 
But like you know you needed to 

1416
01:15:43,040 --> 01:15:46,040
have it a program, right. 
If you didn't have the program 

1417
01:15:46,040 --> 01:15:48,040
written out and handed to a guy,
you're letting a guy down. 

1418
01:15:48,040 --> 01:15:51,040
And that was like, you know, if 
it's just a guy's head that's 

1419
01:15:51,040 --> 01:15:55,280
like super lowbrow and whatever.
But then you begin to find out, 

1420
01:15:55,280 --> 01:15:58,840
like Louis Simmons, some of the 
best strength coaches literally 

1421
01:15:58,840 --> 01:16:01,320
had nothing written down and you
just come to them. 

1422
01:16:01,320 --> 01:16:03,600
They'd they would be watching 
the sets, whatever, and they'd 

1423
01:16:03,600 --> 01:16:05,480
tell you exactly what the next 
thing you're supposed to do. 

1424
01:16:06,200 --> 01:16:08,720
What I realized is that's 
actually the highest level of 

1425
01:16:08,720 --> 01:16:12,240
coaching is they are adapting 
what they're doing on the fly. 

1426
01:16:12,240 --> 01:16:16,320
They know from experience and 
from, like their understanding 

1427
01:16:16,320 --> 01:16:17,800
all of it. 
They're pulling it all together 

1428
01:16:17,800 --> 01:16:20,000
to know in that moment exactly 
what to give a guy. 

1429
01:16:20,920 --> 01:16:25,160
And so that to me is where 
you're trying to get to with all

1430
01:16:25,160 --> 01:16:27,600
this stuff of like that 
adaptability of like, OK, 

1431
01:16:27,600 --> 01:16:29,400
something slightly shifted. 
No problem. 

1432
01:16:29,400 --> 01:16:32,560
Because I understand 
conceptually in my framework of 

1433
01:16:32,560 --> 01:16:34,960
like how all these things play 
together and what's actually the

1434
01:16:34,960 --> 01:16:37,760
most important thing and how to 
get me to that that place. 

1435
01:16:38,080 --> 01:16:41,400
Last analogy here, Lord of the 
Rings. 

1436
01:16:41,400 --> 01:16:44,960
I this one of my favorite books.
I remember that. 

1437
01:16:45,160 --> 01:16:49,360
So the story of the minds of 
Moria OK Gandalf takes the the 

1438
01:16:49,360 --> 01:16:53,120
fellowship into to the minds. 
He doesn't have a perfect map 

1439
01:16:53,120 --> 01:16:56,840
and know where he like how to 
navigate through this exactly. 

1440
01:16:57,280 --> 01:17:02,880
But instead Tolkien talks about 
he knew what direction he wanted

1441
01:17:02,880 --> 01:17:06,880
to go and so he he steered the 
fellowship based upon his 

1442
01:17:06,880 --> 01:17:09,720
understanding of like where we 
need to go and kind of like 

1443
01:17:09,720 --> 01:17:13,120
through the feel and and kind of
his his old memories of it and 

1444
01:17:13,400 --> 01:17:16,880
and so to me that's kind of the 
thing of like I might not know 

1445
01:17:16,880 --> 01:17:21,040
exactly where I'm going but I 
have an idea of where where 

1446
01:17:21,040 --> 01:17:24,040
north is. 
I'm steering myself towards that

1447
01:17:24,320 --> 01:17:27,040
that true north. 
And so to me that's kind of the 

1448
01:17:28,360 --> 01:17:31,600
how this this to me kind of 
works is like I have that goal 

1449
01:17:32,280 --> 01:17:34,480
and I know and I'm trying to 
figure out OK, where are my 

1450
01:17:34,480 --> 01:17:37,120
relationship to that goal. 
And as long as I'm working 

1451
01:17:37,120 --> 01:17:39,920
towards it even if I'm ending up
going I know I need to go up. 

1452
01:17:39,920 --> 01:17:42,760
But I'm going up this way while 
I'm slightly moving closer, so 

1453
01:17:42,760 --> 01:17:46,840
as long as I'm moving closer, 
even if it's not exactly linear,

1454
01:17:47,240 --> 01:17:49,120
I'm still making progress 
towards that thing. 

1455
01:17:49,360 --> 01:17:53,880
And so to me that's kind of the 
the how I look at like the 

1456
01:17:53,880 --> 01:17:56,800
ecological approach and this 
whole notion of like non 

1457
01:17:56,800 --> 01:17:59,680
linearity and how the all these 
things play together to help me 

1458
01:17:59,920 --> 01:18:03,920
get to my intended goal of the 
performer being able to be 

1459
01:18:03,920 --> 01:18:05,760
successful in any given 
situation. 

1460
01:18:06,080 --> 01:18:10,280
So to me it's like, you know, if
you, if you can divine define 

1461
01:18:11,360 --> 01:18:14,320
what it is that you're trying to
do, everything else begins to 

1462
01:18:14,320 --> 01:18:16,480
organize itself around that that
thing. 

1463
01:18:16,480 --> 01:18:19,240
And so you have to figure out 
what's that highest, highest 

1464
01:18:19,240 --> 01:18:22,120
thing that's going to give you a
lot of all the other things It's

1465
01:18:22,120 --> 01:18:23,720
kind of this whole notion of 
constrained to afford. 

1466
01:18:23,720 --> 01:18:30,600
Anyways, that's my my long rant.
Yeah, I think, oh, go ahead, 

1467
01:18:30,600 --> 01:18:31,080
babe. 
Go ahead. 

1468
01:18:31,080 --> 01:18:33,200
No, no, you got it. 
That was going to say I think 

1469
01:18:33,200 --> 01:18:38,360
something that really jumped out
of me in there is that being 

1470
01:18:38,360 --> 01:18:40,640
being open to kind of where 
different things come from. 

1471
01:18:40,640 --> 01:18:42,640
I know those kind of a little 
bit earlier and then you kind of

1472
01:18:42,640 --> 01:18:45,320
work towards how does that all 
fit in the framework. 

1473
01:18:45,640 --> 01:18:48,800
But I think that's really 
important where, like Baker 

1474
01:18:48,800 --> 01:18:51,800
said, he was able to take 
something different and 

1475
01:18:51,800 --> 01:18:55,360
something new from every 
presentation And even in 

1476
01:18:55,360 --> 01:18:56,640
presentation where he originally
was. 

1477
01:18:56,640 --> 01:18:59,120
Like, you know, I'm not really 
connecting with anything, but 

1478
01:18:59,120 --> 01:19:02,040
going back through it did. 
And I think that's really 

1479
01:19:02,040 --> 01:19:05,560
important is whether it's 
something that you know exists 

1480
01:19:05,560 --> 01:19:08,680
in the way of your way of 
viewing the world, whether it's 

1481
01:19:08,680 --> 01:19:11,120
in the ecological dynamics 
framework or not. 

1482
01:19:11,320 --> 01:19:15,160
There is some sort of kernel of 
value in there somewhere that 

1483
01:19:15,160 --> 01:19:17,680
can relate into your own 
framework in a way. 

1484
01:19:17,720 --> 01:19:21,280
And so it's kind of figuring, 
OK, how can I keep an empty 

1485
01:19:21,280 --> 01:19:24,880
enough of a cup to allow for 
those things that at first might

1486
01:19:24,880 --> 01:19:27,960
not seem like it's something I 
agree with or something that it 

1487
01:19:27,960 --> 01:19:30,960
fits into my way of being? 
How can I see? 

1488
01:19:31,320 --> 01:19:35,200
Is there any kernel of this that
can fit into the framework that 

1489
01:19:35,200 --> 01:19:38,880
I can use to be able to Orient 
towards the goal of achieving 

1490
01:19:38,880 --> 01:19:40,280
something? 
You know, some people might 

1491
01:19:40,280 --> 01:19:44,120
think that there's one way to do
something and someone else has 

1492
01:19:44,120 --> 01:19:46,600
another way, but they're all 
trying to achieve the same 

1493
01:19:46,600 --> 01:19:47,720
thing. 
It's just a different way of 

1494
01:19:47,720 --> 01:19:49,760
going about it. 
And so how can you create your 

1495
01:19:49,760 --> 01:19:52,960
own unique framework of 
orienting toward that North Star

1496
01:19:52,960 --> 01:19:54,440
goal? 
Yeah. 

1497
01:19:54,440 --> 01:19:57,040
And I think, yeah, I think it's 
lost face. 

1498
01:19:57,040 --> 01:19:58,320
You never stepped in the same 
river twice. 

1499
01:19:58,320 --> 01:20:01,360
I think that's a lot of what 
goes on when when somebody like 

1500
01:20:01,360 --> 01:20:03,640
me goes back and listens to a 
talk like. 

1501
01:20:04,600 --> 01:20:07,480
My recent experience is what 
I've been looking into, what 

1502
01:20:07,480 --> 01:20:09,800
else I've been reading on the 
side, just how my life has been 

1503
01:20:09,800 --> 01:20:13,480
playing out, all that kind of 
stuff is now shaping how I'm 

1504
01:20:13,480 --> 01:20:17,560
interacting with these talks a 
little bit different every 

1505
01:20:17,560 --> 01:20:19,760
single time. 
And things are speaking to me 

1506
01:20:19,760 --> 01:20:22,880
differently, or the same things 
speaking to me in a different 

1507
01:20:22,880 --> 01:20:25,800
way than it was previously, 
which I think is it shouldn't be

1508
01:20:25,800 --> 01:20:29,600
important. 
Is that that can easily tie into

1509
01:20:29,760 --> 01:20:33,040
like a the performer environment
relationship where where you're 

1510
01:20:33,040 --> 01:20:35,520
just going to practice. 
Like it may the the same problem

1511
01:20:35,520 --> 01:20:37,840
may speak to an athlete 
completely differently based on 

1512
01:20:37,840 --> 01:20:40,440
what he's been doing or who he 
is that day. 

1513
01:20:41,320 --> 01:20:44,120
Because I think that's that's 
super interesting when you can 

1514
01:20:44,120 --> 01:20:46,400
view yourself. 
And I think this is something 

1515
01:20:46,400 --> 01:20:49,760
I've been trying to do a little 
more myself as kind of that 

1516
01:20:49,760 --> 01:20:52,640
learner. 
And as I'm going through things 

1517
01:20:52,720 --> 01:20:55,280
and as I go through a journey, 
even like me trying to learn 

1518
01:20:55,280 --> 01:20:58,560
Spanish this offseason. 
Like me going through those 

1519
01:20:58,560 --> 01:21:02,080
experiences and learning. 
Like the the app I'm working 

1520
01:21:02,080 --> 01:21:04,560
through actually challenged me a
little Rep without Rep. 

1521
01:21:05,320 --> 01:21:07,480
And things are starting to click
a little more because, like, I'm

1522
01:21:07,480 --> 01:21:11,160
challenged to use phrases or 
words in new context. 

1523
01:21:11,160 --> 01:21:12,280
Like, I know just don't learn a 
phrase. 

1524
01:21:12,280 --> 01:21:14,720
And then we move on. 
Like I learned a phrase and then

1525
01:21:14,720 --> 01:21:16,920
I have to say in a different 
context, in a different 

1526
01:21:16,920 --> 01:21:20,000
conversation later on in the 
same lesson, which is helping 

1527
01:21:20,000 --> 01:21:20,920
me. 
And then I get stuck. 

1528
01:21:20,920 --> 01:21:23,600
And I I was like, oh, I didn't, 
I'm not adaptable with that yet.

1529
01:21:23,960 --> 01:21:28,000
Like, I yeah, I acquired that 
phrase for that exact one 

1530
01:21:28,000 --> 01:21:32,360
situation, but I I haven't 
actually gained skill yet with 

1531
01:21:32,360 --> 01:21:34,360
that phrase because now I can't 
go use it in all these 

1532
01:21:34,360 --> 01:21:36,400
situations. 
Like, it's actually not a usable

1533
01:21:36,400 --> 01:21:38,640
phrase for me. 
And just being able to connect 

1534
01:21:38,640 --> 01:21:40,640
that again, like I talked about 
that a little bit of my talk 

1535
01:21:40,640 --> 01:21:42,600
when I learned that through 
parkour, it's like, oh, I 

1536
01:21:42,600 --> 01:21:44,720
learned this move. 
And like, yeah, this thing's the

1537
01:21:44,720 --> 01:21:48,000
same height but the environment 
so differently that it's 

1538
01:21:48,000 --> 01:21:50,160
speaking to me in such a 
different way that I can't even 

1539
01:21:50,160 --> 01:21:53,120
go perform it anymore. 
Or maybe that it looks the exact

1540
01:21:53,120 --> 01:21:55,360
same, but like I'm gonna do 
something different, since who I

1541
01:21:55,360 --> 01:21:57,040
am that day is a little bit 
different. 

1542
01:21:57,040 --> 01:22:00,240
But I think that kind of 
sparking that idea for me and 

1543
01:22:00,240 --> 01:22:02,960
like, I think that's really 
important for coaches as you 

1544
01:22:02,960 --> 01:22:06,000
kind of just view anything. 
Like you go listen to a podcast 

1545
01:22:06,000 --> 01:22:08,400
you've listened to before, 
you're gonna pull something 

1546
01:22:08,400 --> 01:22:11,360
differently than you did the 
first time, which I think is 

1547
01:22:11,360 --> 01:22:13,040
really cool. 
So it's like you can, you can 

1548
01:22:13,040 --> 01:22:14,440
literally, it's same as reading 
books. 

1549
01:22:14,440 --> 01:22:17,720
Like you could, you could read 
all these different books and 

1550
01:22:17,720 --> 01:22:19,680
change books every single time. 
But if you literally go back to 

1551
01:22:19,680 --> 01:22:22,840
the same book you read two years
ago and you were gonna pick up 

1552
01:22:22,840 --> 01:22:25,800
so many different things and you
didn't pick up the first time, 

1553
01:22:26,040 --> 01:22:28,120
or you're gonna read the same 
thing and it's gonna speak to 

1554
01:22:28,120 --> 01:22:30,520
you so differently. 
I think too. 

1555
01:22:30,520 --> 01:22:33,040
Or it's gonna remind you, 'cause
I know there's sometimes it's 

1556
01:22:33,040 --> 01:22:35,120
like, oh man, I forgot about 
this like, very true. 

1557
01:22:35,120 --> 01:22:39,960
How did I get away from this? 
And it just, yeah, so good point

1558
01:22:40,400 --> 01:22:42,640
AJ or. 
Buenos in your Baker. 

1559
01:22:47,720 --> 01:22:52,200
So I don't know if you guys want
to wrap there, but I also wanted

1560
01:22:52,200 --> 01:22:56,520
to see like are there, are there
any other things though before 

1561
01:22:57,120 --> 01:23:01,040
potentially wrap it up of that 
you wanted to talk about like 

1562
01:23:01,040 --> 01:23:04,200
things like concepts, whatever 
that came up in the talk that 

1563
01:23:04,480 --> 01:23:07,960
either you wanted to flesh out 
more or you didn't understand. 

1564
01:23:09,360 --> 01:23:12,240
I guess that's kind of what I at
least wanted to see from you 

1565
01:23:12,240 --> 01:23:16,160
guys. 
Yeah, I mean, personally, I 

1566
01:23:16,160 --> 01:23:19,120
there were two things that kind 
of jumped out in the tickler 

1567
01:23:19,120 --> 01:23:21,880
file that I want to talk with. 
You guys thinking one's kind of 

1568
01:23:21,880 --> 01:23:25,640
more procedural and one's kind 
of more about practice design. 

1569
01:23:25,640 --> 01:23:27,600
I guess we can start with the 
practice design first. 

1570
01:23:27,600 --> 01:23:31,520
But the question that's been 
taken up residence in my mind 

1571
01:23:31,520 --> 01:23:34,720
recently is do we have enough 
opposition in our practices? 

1572
01:23:35,000 --> 01:23:39,200
Like, I think about baseball and
everything you do, there is 

1573
01:23:39,200 --> 01:23:42,120
always an opponent, There's 
always opposition. 

1574
01:23:43,000 --> 01:23:46,920
And if you look at a time 
breakdown of how we spend our 

1575
01:23:46,920 --> 01:23:50,400
practices, the time spent with 
an opponent there is very 

1576
01:23:50,400 --> 01:23:52,200
minimal. 
Like I I look back to my own 

1577
01:23:52,200 --> 01:23:55,200
playing days and I would go 
dominate bullpens, but then as 

1578
01:23:55,200 --> 01:23:57,920
soon as I go get out into the 
game, I would really struggle 

1579
01:23:57,920 --> 01:24:00,640
because there's an alive human 
being in the box doing things 

1580
01:24:00,640 --> 01:24:03,040
that I did not expect that was 
going to happen in the bullpen. 

1581
01:24:03,440 --> 01:24:08,280
And obviously, we can simulate 
different intentions that Baker 

1582
01:24:08,280 --> 01:24:11,920
talked about in bullpens, but it
nowhere comes close to having 

1583
01:24:11,920 --> 01:24:14,640
the same sort of opposition. 
I think baseball is definitely 

1584
01:24:14,640 --> 01:24:17,720
behind in that area and I'm 
curious to hear your guys's 

1585
01:24:17,720 --> 01:24:20,240
thoughts and in ways that we 
could potentially integrate that

1586
01:24:20,240 --> 01:24:25,160
more into practice. 
I mean I think it's it's simple.

1587
01:24:25,160 --> 01:24:28,720
I mean I don't know if we've 
talked about it Baker, but like 

1588
01:24:29,560 --> 01:24:32,640
I'm 100% with you. 
The thing that I, I want to more

1589
01:24:32,640 --> 01:24:37,160
start with is like, why is it 
the way it is And I think we we 

1590
01:24:37,160 --> 01:24:41,800
already have enough success in 
doing what we're doing that 

1591
01:24:41,800 --> 01:24:44,000
there's no, there's no reason 
to. 

1592
01:24:44,280 --> 01:24:46,160
Right. 
Because nobody else is doing it.

1593
01:24:46,160 --> 01:24:48,880
Like, why Also logistically it's
it's harder. 

1594
01:24:49,760 --> 01:24:54,800
Like I I have in my mind exactly
how I'd want to do it. 

1595
01:24:54,800 --> 01:24:58,280
But you have to integrate. 
You have to integrate your 

1596
01:24:58,920 --> 01:25:04,400
offense and defense together. 
Like going back to you know 

1597
01:25:04,400 --> 01:25:06,440
eventually I'll get I'll 
directly answer your question. 

1598
01:25:06,760 --> 01:25:11,880
But the going back to you know 
things that successful coaches 

1599
01:25:11,880 --> 01:25:13,720
have done in the past they 
scrimmage. 

1600
01:25:14,240 --> 01:25:15,600
Right. 
Like a lot of their fall ball 

1601
01:25:15,600 --> 01:25:18,720
was just scrimmages and like 
they got way better. 

1602
01:25:18,800 --> 01:25:22,080
Well, why is it just, you know 
are they just playing the game. 

1603
01:25:22,080 --> 01:25:22,640
Yeah. 
Sure. 

1604
01:25:22,640 --> 01:25:25,240
I mean there's ways to again the
ecological approach helps you to

1605
01:25:25,240 --> 01:25:28,760
not just we're not just playing 
the game like all of a sudden. 

1606
01:25:28,960 --> 01:25:30,000
For example. 
OK. 

1607
01:25:30,000 --> 01:25:31,480
Let's use the scrimmage as an 
example. 

1608
01:25:31,480 --> 01:25:33,600
OK. 
And to me this is the highest 

1609
01:25:33,600 --> 01:25:34,080
level. 
Right. 

1610
01:25:35,200 --> 01:25:37,320
All right. 
We're scrimmaging now. 

1611
01:25:37,320 --> 01:25:40,840
We're going to create different 
slices, you know, OK, we're 

1612
01:25:40,840 --> 01:25:42,320
going to create different 
scenarios. 

1613
01:25:42,320 --> 01:25:46,040
We're going to just start 
throwing in different game 

1614
01:25:46,040 --> 01:25:48,760
scenarios. 
This is the thing of, yes, 

1615
01:25:48,760 --> 01:25:52,320
random is fine, That, like, you 
know, all of a sudden you have 

1616
01:25:52,320 --> 01:25:55,080
a, some random dude just run 
through the middle of the field 

1617
01:25:55,080 --> 01:25:56,480
during the during your 
scrimmage. 

1618
01:25:56,480 --> 01:25:58,560
OK, all right. 
You know, something, something 

1619
01:25:58,560 --> 01:26:03,800
or you, you know, throw a, a a 
physio ball on the field and 

1620
01:26:03,800 --> 01:26:07,160
like smack a guy, OK, you know, 
while he's doing like, OK like 

1621
01:26:07,240 --> 01:26:09,200
something like completely crazy 
off the wall. 

1622
01:26:09,760 --> 01:26:12,360
You can do that. 
And there might be some small 

1623
01:26:12,360 --> 01:26:16,320
marginal benefit there to help 
guys find better solutions. 

1624
01:26:16,840 --> 01:26:20,880
But eventually, because this is 
the whole thing, I was talking 

1625
01:26:20,880 --> 01:26:24,280
to another coach and maybe I'll 
release this podcast at some 

1626
01:26:24,280 --> 01:26:26,000
point. 
Bobby, Bobby Tewksbury is on. 

1627
01:26:26,000 --> 01:26:29,560
He's like, look, the game is not
completely random. 

1628
01:26:29,560 --> 01:26:30,880
Everybody talks about this 
randomness. 

1629
01:26:30,880 --> 01:26:33,920
I'm totally with with him on 
this of like, yeah, you're 

1630
01:26:33,920 --> 01:26:35,680
right, the game is not 
completely random. 

1631
01:26:36,080 --> 01:26:39,440
There's not just like, you know,
again you're not going to just 

1632
01:26:39,440 --> 01:26:45,080
have like a a physio ball just 
like fly in and hit a guy in the

1633
01:26:45,080 --> 01:26:46,920
middle of the game. 
That's not going to happen. 

1634
01:26:47,280 --> 01:26:49,400
You know, all of a sudden the 
ball is not going to fall 

1635
01:26:49,400 --> 01:26:51,640
straight down from the sky and 
it's going to have to like an 

1636
01:26:51,640 --> 01:26:53,000
hour quick swing and like hit a 
ball. 

1637
01:26:53,000 --> 01:26:56,200
Like it's not those types of 
things are not going to show up 

1638
01:26:56,200 --> 01:26:59,880
in the game. 
So the game is predictable. 

1639
01:26:59,880 --> 01:27:02,920
There is, there is some 
predictability to the game. 

1640
01:27:02,920 --> 01:27:05,280
Otherwise you wouldn't. 
You need the proper constraints.

1641
01:27:05,280 --> 01:27:07,440
Constraints actually create 
predictability. 

1642
01:27:07,440 --> 01:27:09,440
If you didn't have the 
constraints, you won't be able 

1643
01:27:09,440 --> 01:27:11,720
to play the game because it's 
too like if the umpire just 

1644
01:27:11,720 --> 01:27:14,000
started changing the zone a ton,
right? 

1645
01:27:14,000 --> 01:27:16,440
That's why I like guys get 
pissed off. 

1646
01:27:16,680 --> 01:27:20,160
It's because it's like, well, 
that wasn't a strike, you know, 

1647
01:27:20,160 --> 01:27:23,400
an inning or two ago. 
All of a sudden the zone just 

1648
01:27:23,400 --> 01:27:26,880
completely changed and it's like
changing, like the game would 

1649
01:27:26,880 --> 01:27:31,160
not cease to function, right. 
So because of that we we 

1650
01:27:31,160 --> 01:27:36,120
actually have to constrain 
things to the point that you do 

1651
01:27:36,120 --> 01:27:39,240
get some level of consistency, 
but it's about the variation. 

1652
01:27:39,880 --> 01:27:43,280
And so anyways this is where I'm
going with this of on that long 

1653
01:27:43,280 --> 01:27:47,880
rant side rant, we can create 
slices of the game, OK and so we

1654
01:27:47,880 --> 01:27:51,440
can have guys do different 
passes through certain areas of 

1655
01:27:51,440 --> 01:27:53,800
the game more frequently if 
that's what they need to work 

1656
01:27:53,800 --> 01:27:55,000
on. 
OK. 

1657
01:27:55,360 --> 01:27:58,320
And so this intervention, this 
whole thing of like, oh, we just

1658
01:27:58,320 --> 01:27:59,520
sit back and we don't do 
anything. 

1659
01:27:59,520 --> 01:28:03,680
No, we can come in and we can 
intervene and change the what's 

1660
01:28:03,680 --> 01:28:06,800
going on, you know, maybe do 
more stuff with two outs, 

1661
01:28:06,840 --> 01:28:09,720
runners in scoring position, 
etcetera, higher pressure stuff,

1662
01:28:09,920 --> 01:28:11,520
right. 
All stuff that people have known

1663
01:28:11,520 --> 01:28:12,760
before. 
But these are the things that 

1664
01:28:12,760 --> 01:28:14,640
you can do more of. 
I think that's my point. 

1665
01:28:14,960 --> 01:28:16,160
OK. 
So this is the highest level 

1666
01:28:17,200 --> 01:28:18,960
Baker. 
Do you want to throw anything 

1667
01:28:18,960 --> 01:28:24,040
else in there before I I get 
into like specifically answering

1668
01:28:24,040 --> 01:28:26,240
his question of like, OK, 
because to me it's all about 

1669
01:28:26,240 --> 01:28:28,520
logistics. 
When we get down to this of like

1670
01:28:28,520 --> 01:28:32,680
why is it that people do what 
they do the way they do it now 

1671
01:28:32,960 --> 01:28:36,440
versus what we're talking about,
I think comes back to logistics.

1672
01:28:36,520 --> 01:28:40,600
It's all about logistics. 
I'll hop on the backside, I'll 

1673
01:28:40,600 --> 01:28:41,840
let, I'll let you finish your 
rant here. 

1674
01:28:43,160 --> 01:28:46,160
Well, because I So to me, as 
you're going to your question of

1675
01:28:46,160 --> 01:28:48,080
like, OK, how do we, how do we 
integrate this more? 

1676
01:28:48,080 --> 01:28:51,080
You already were starting to say
it like, OK, put a batter in 

1677
01:28:51,080 --> 01:28:53,840
there. 
You know, like now we need to 

1678
01:28:53,840 --> 01:28:57,160
like have a batter and throwing 
to batters, like, to me this is 

1679
01:28:57,160 --> 01:28:59,480
like, duh, right? 
That's step one. 

1680
01:29:00,280 --> 01:29:04,120
But if you want to scale it up, 
OK, how do we make it more game 

1681
01:29:04,120 --> 01:29:07,280
like for both? 
This is true for both the hitter

1682
01:29:07,280 --> 01:29:09,000
and the pitcher. 
You need an umpire. 

1683
01:29:09,720 --> 01:29:15,160
But the umpire now needs to 
become the coach, needs to not 

1684
01:29:15,160 --> 01:29:19,520
call the zone a perfect zone. 
He does not do that. 

1685
01:29:20,600 --> 01:29:22,920
You actually have to be 
intentional. 

1686
01:29:22,920 --> 01:29:25,640
I think at the highest levels of
you need to change the zone, 

1687
01:29:26,200 --> 01:29:28,960
whether it's within session or 
session to session. 

1688
01:29:29,600 --> 01:29:33,320
It can't be like and that's hard
having tried to do it, it is 

1689
01:29:33,320 --> 01:29:35,600
hard. 
It's hard to do and you need to 

1690
01:29:35,600 --> 01:29:38,800
be disciplined because you're 
going to fall back to your 

1691
01:29:38,800 --> 01:29:43,520
preferred zone and you have to 
be intentional and set the 

1692
01:29:43,520 --> 01:29:46,640
intention of OK, this is the 
zone that I'm going to call 

1693
01:29:46,640 --> 01:29:49,080
today. 
And sometimes you do have to get

1694
01:29:49,080 --> 01:29:52,240
in there and feel it out of 
like, you know, we are our guys.

1695
01:29:52,240 --> 01:29:55,000
You know where like you know 
kind of feel the room and get to

1696
01:29:55,000 --> 01:29:58,000
read the room and figure out 
like OK, what what type of zone 

1697
01:29:58,000 --> 01:29:59,280
actually needs to get called 
today. 

1698
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:01,280
You know and like how do I want 
it. 

1699
01:30:01,280 --> 01:30:06,200
But you, but you do have to 
maintain awareness of what that 

1700
01:30:06,200 --> 01:30:10,880
zone is And that is I think for 
you know a lot of people that 

1701
01:30:10,880 --> 01:30:13,560
that's going to be difficult. 
Some people who are like really 

1702
01:30:13,960 --> 01:30:16,440
type A and on top of it, I don't
think they won't struggle with 

1703
01:30:16,440 --> 01:30:18,640
this. 
But I do think for from 

1704
01:30:18,640 --> 01:30:24,160
observation of just trying to 
implement this stuff and using 

1705
01:30:24,160 --> 01:30:27,640
it as the specific example of 
calling his own, We like, I've 

1706
01:30:27,640 --> 01:30:30,960
tried to do things ecologically 
and eventually you just fall to,

1707
01:30:33,400 --> 01:30:36,040
you fall back to certain things 
and then it becomes all the 

1708
01:30:36,040 --> 01:30:38,360
same. 
Like I, I, I find that happening

1709
01:30:38,360 --> 01:30:41,360
a lot of like or I want 
something that has all this cool

1710
01:30:41,600 --> 01:30:44,080
variability wrap without wrap. 
But we were like we just hit off

1711
01:30:44,080 --> 01:30:47,920
the machine a lot you know and 
that's but you know and we fall 

1712
01:30:47,920 --> 01:30:49,680
back to these certain things. 
And so This is why I'm saying 

1713
01:30:49,680 --> 01:30:53,920
like you have to be very, very 
intentional if you want to have 

1714
01:30:53,920 --> 01:30:57,200
things. 
If you want to be able to 

1715
01:30:57,200 --> 01:31:00,160
explore things and you have to 
be kind of paying attention and 

1716
01:31:00,160 --> 01:31:03,120
it and it's a lot of work 
because it's all about logistics

1717
01:31:03,480 --> 01:31:07,040
in my mind and and that's what's
going to play into what you can 

1718
01:31:07,040 --> 01:31:11,040
do is like OK, if your if your 
system is not set up for your 

1719
01:31:11,040 --> 01:31:13,920
pitchers to throw to hitters 
consistently guys aren't built 

1720
01:31:13,920 --> 01:31:15,200
up. 
Your pictures aren't built up to

1721
01:31:15,200 --> 01:31:17,160
handle that workload you can't 
do it. 

1722
01:31:17,960 --> 01:31:19,800
You know like that. 
That I think is a big 

1723
01:31:19,800 --> 01:31:24,560
prerequisite of you need to have
pitchers who's who are 

1724
01:31:24,560 --> 01:31:29,400
conditioned and their arms can 
handle it to be able to throw at

1725
01:31:29,400 --> 01:31:30,960
the level that they're able to 
interact. 

1726
01:31:30,960 --> 01:31:34,000
Because it's a question of like,
you know like basic things of 

1727
01:31:34,000 --> 01:31:38,000
like number of repetitions, like
how many passes or opportunities

1728
01:31:38,000 --> 01:31:40,480
are you going to get at this 
thing and we begin to break it 

1729
01:31:40,480 --> 01:31:41,960
down like the number of 
opportunities. 

1730
01:31:41,960 --> 01:31:44,000
The way the current system is 
set up for pitchers is 

1731
01:31:44,800 --> 01:31:49,400
incredibly low. 
You know, oh, once a week, you 

1732
01:31:49,400 --> 01:31:52,920
know for 25 pitches how many 
like that's what maybe 3 batters

1733
01:31:54,200 --> 01:31:58,880
like that's that's really low 
number of like repetitions like 

1734
01:31:59,080 --> 01:32:03,120
like so how much can you really 
explore when you're only facing 

1735
01:32:03,120 --> 01:32:05,840
3 batters. 
There's not like you can't work 

1736
01:32:05,840 --> 01:32:08,880
on very many things if you're if
you're only going through three 

1737
01:32:08,880 --> 01:32:12,240
batters. 
So it to me, that's where it's 

1738
01:32:12,880 --> 01:32:15,640
it's all about logistics. 
You can't you have to have 

1739
01:32:15,640 --> 01:32:18,640
certain prerequisites met before
you can actually scale it up to 

1740
01:32:18,640 --> 01:32:24,920
be able to do something that is 
truly like what this looks like.

1741
01:32:24,920 --> 01:32:28,680
And that's why I said in a tweet
a long time ago like ecological 

1742
01:32:28,680 --> 01:32:32,440
dynamics is is for specifically 
baseball but just in general for

1743
01:32:32,440 --> 01:32:36,120
sports is in its infancy. 
Like we have not fully fleshed 

1744
01:32:36,120 --> 01:32:38,280
out like what this looks like 
and that's where it's it's 

1745
01:32:38,280 --> 01:32:40,600
really cool. 
I mean to me you do kind of hit 

1746
01:32:40,600 --> 01:32:43,720
a point at some point maybe 
maybe I don't know where it's 

1747
01:32:43,720 --> 01:32:48,000
like you kind of you kind of hit
like the the the gains become 

1748
01:32:48,000 --> 01:32:50,720
more incremental right. 
Like we're, we're early enough 

1749
01:32:50,720 --> 01:32:53,120
on the curve that if you do 
something, the amount of 

1750
01:32:53,760 --> 01:32:56,000
benefits you're going to get 
from it is going to be there's 

1751
01:32:56,000 --> 01:32:58,480
a, there's a big return for your
that. 

1752
01:32:58,480 --> 01:33:00,400
And I feel like with with 
analytics, you're we're kind of 

1753
01:33:00,400 --> 01:33:04,400
hitting that peak too of like 
the more you go, the less you 

1754
01:33:04,400 --> 01:33:07,480
get now from it. 
Whereas before when we first 

1755
01:33:07,480 --> 01:33:10,320
introduced analytics to the game
like there were big massive 

1756
01:33:10,320 --> 01:33:12,680
jumps and advantages that you 
can get, not that you still 

1757
01:33:12,680 --> 01:33:15,120
can't. 
You have to work a lot harder 

1758
01:33:15,120 --> 01:33:17,160
though now to get that. 
So anyways, that's kind of where

1759
01:33:17,160 --> 01:33:19,440
I'm going with this is like, 
we're still in our infancy when 

1760
01:33:19,440 --> 01:33:24,800
it comes to this of like. 
So that's at least my start of 

1761
01:33:24,800 --> 01:33:31,640
like 2 very specific examples 
that are I think fairly easy to 

1762
01:33:31,640 --> 01:33:34,040
integrate a batter and an 
umpire. 

1763
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:39,680
Very, very simple stuff. 
I mean, yeah, so those are my my

1764
01:33:39,680 --> 01:33:43,400
basic thoughts. 
I'll, I'll just jump in quick 

1765
01:33:43,400 --> 01:33:46,760
here, but I, I, I 100% agree 
logistic logistics are the issue

1766
01:33:46,760 --> 01:33:49,520
with the with the whole thing. 
So I think that that brings up 

1767
01:33:49,520 --> 01:33:51,360
the questions like one. 
OK so you say you can't get a 

1768
01:33:51,360 --> 01:33:53,040
batter and you can't get an 
umpire. 

1769
01:33:53,040 --> 01:33:55,760
Like what are the workarounds? 
Like how can we still make it 

1770
01:33:55,760 --> 01:33:58,280
more alive since I think a lot 
of people are struggling with 

1771
01:33:58,280 --> 01:34:00,840
that. 
Like I, I, you look at back some

1772
01:34:00,840 --> 01:34:05,240
of my TJC posts and I'll just, 
I'll just point that out for 

1773
01:34:05,240 --> 01:34:08,400
anybody who wants to go back and
look at those like simple way 

1774
01:34:08,400 --> 01:34:10,120
you could potentially add an 
umpire in. 

1775
01:34:10,120 --> 01:34:11,760
Like you have a bunch of 
pitchers standing around like 

1776
01:34:11,760 --> 01:34:14,480
they could become your umpires 
and you can tell them what zone 

1777
01:34:14,760 --> 01:34:17,760
you potentially want, especially
especially if you know like 

1778
01:34:17,760 --> 01:34:18,960
certain guy struggles or 
something. 

1779
01:34:18,960 --> 01:34:21,800
Or you just want your pictures 
of tuning to a different 

1780
01:34:21,880 --> 01:34:24,960
different zone like hey like hey
you're going to call ball ball 

1781
01:34:24,960 --> 01:34:27,520
outside here right. 
So give them a ball out every 

1782
01:34:27,520 --> 01:34:30,720
single time or like hey I want I
want a low zone today and like 

1783
01:34:30,720 --> 01:34:34,200
you tell that pitcher that and I
think it's one it's helpful for 

1784
01:34:34,200 --> 01:34:36,760
those other pitchers to get the 
different vantage point and like

1785
01:34:36,760 --> 01:34:40,640
they they start trying to try to
like oh is that a strike is that

1786
01:34:40,640 --> 01:34:42,880
a ball and they start actually 
tuning to the zone. 

1787
01:34:42,880 --> 01:34:45,040
I mean from a different 
perspective but at least it's 

1788
01:34:45,040 --> 01:34:46,960
better than just standing around
right. 

1789
01:34:47,480 --> 01:34:50,440
And two, it's like the pitchers 
are actually throwing are are 

1790
01:34:50,440 --> 01:34:53,600
starting to attune to like the 
changing zone. 

1791
01:34:53,600 --> 01:34:57,120
Hopefully they don't always. 
But now you as a coach can start

1792
01:34:57,120 --> 01:35:00,200
guiding like hey, what have you 
noticed about those last last 

1793
01:35:00,200 --> 01:35:02,800
two calls on outside? 
It's like, oh, I just, I got 

1794
01:35:02,800 --> 01:35:05,000
them, OK. 
So now that you're 1-2 in this 

1795
01:35:05,080 --> 01:35:09,160
hypothetical count where could 
you potentially go assuming that

1796
01:35:09,160 --> 01:35:10,960
he took those pitches and looks 
frustrated. 

1797
01:35:11,160 --> 01:35:14,120
So you can kind of add those 
layers in there of like you can 

1798
01:35:14,120 --> 01:35:17,120
kind of like mention like what 
how the batter's potentially 

1799
01:35:17,120 --> 01:35:20,520
responding so they're acting at 
least in accordance somewhat of 

1800
01:35:20,520 --> 01:35:22,880
a problem, even if you don't 
have a batter. 

1801
01:35:23,840 --> 01:35:26,000
I think the other thing that 
kind of came came into my mind 

1802
01:35:26,000 --> 01:35:28,560
sometimes you have a, a really 
good pitcher like a dude that's 

1803
01:35:28,560 --> 01:35:31,200
gonna blow the guys doors off 
every single time or just has a 

1804
01:35:31,200 --> 01:35:33,120
wipeout breaker or something. 
And the batter's just not at 

1805
01:35:33,120 --> 01:35:35,440
that level. 
And I think that's and we talked

1806
01:35:35,440 --> 01:35:39,600
about that in the in person. 
Aji think Sean or Tyler brought 

1807
01:35:39,600 --> 01:35:42,480
up the example that they they 
use with some of their, some of 

1808
01:35:42,480 --> 01:35:46,520
their NFL guys when they have a 
guy there was against the 

1809
01:35:46,520 --> 01:35:47,680
college guys a lot better, 
right. 

1810
01:35:47,680 --> 01:35:50,800
But there's ways to give an 
advantage like shrink that zone 

1811
01:35:50,800 --> 01:35:53,720
like crazy for that pitchers a 
lot better than that hitter and 

1812
01:35:53,720 --> 01:35:56,200
have them explore new ways of 
potentially getting out. 

1813
01:35:56,200 --> 01:35:59,200
So you're still expanding their 
capabilities in a different way,

1814
01:35:59,200 --> 01:36:02,680
but you're getting better within
a smaller zone, which they may 

1815
01:36:02,680 --> 01:36:04,720
potentially face. 
Or if they don't face it, they 

1816
01:36:04,720 --> 01:36:07,600
just got better in zone, like 
they're controlling their self 

1817
01:36:07,600 --> 01:36:09,960
better in zone and it gives the 
hitter A slight advantage. 

1818
01:36:09,960 --> 01:36:12,280
Or vice versa, right? 
Like it could be, could be a 

1819
01:36:12,280 --> 01:36:13,360
hitter way better. 
The pitcher? 

1820
01:36:13,360 --> 01:36:15,720
Well, OK, well, the zone's going
to expand a little bit. 

1821
01:36:15,720 --> 01:36:18,240
We're going to try to open your 
capabilities up as a hitter to 

1822
01:36:18,240 --> 01:36:21,360
have to go a little further out.
So the simple ways you can 

1823
01:36:21,360 --> 01:36:24,920
manipulate that kind of stuff. 
But yeah, I think what do you 

1824
01:36:24,920 --> 01:36:26,560
what? 
Do you think on that I want to I

1825
01:36:26,560 --> 01:36:29,320
want to dive into that because I
don't love that and the reason 

1826
01:36:29,320 --> 01:36:33,280
is is that hitting his if a 
guy's got a good sweeper like he

1827
01:36:33,280 --> 01:36:35,680
might chase it anyways. 
Don't matter that you shrink the

1828
01:36:35,680 --> 01:36:38,840
zone like the advantage is still
to the pitcher. 

1829
01:36:38,840 --> 01:36:41,160
That's where I I don't know how 
you and. 

1830
01:36:41,520 --> 01:36:42,880
Which? 
Which which example are you 

1831
01:36:42,880 --> 01:36:45,920
talking about? 
Like what is it for the pitcher?

1832
01:36:46,360 --> 01:36:48,720
Yeah, well, no, no. 
Meaning the advantages to the 

1833
01:36:48,720 --> 01:36:51,240
pitcher and generally speaking, 
the advantage is to the pitcher 

1834
01:36:51,240 --> 01:36:56,440
because like where, where, 
where, where are you going to on

1835
01:36:56,440 --> 01:36:59,120
the development scale? 
I think it's easier to develop a

1836
01:36:59,120 --> 01:37:02,680
pitcher than it is to develop a 
hitter Just in the, in the 

1837
01:37:02,680 --> 01:37:05,600
current way of doing things 
right, we can, you know, pitch 

1838
01:37:05,600 --> 01:37:09,800
design, all this sort of stuff. 
Velo, it's the contactability 

1839
01:37:09,800 --> 01:37:13,560
stuff is not there for hitters 
yet as far as I can tell. 

1840
01:37:13,560 --> 01:37:17,440
Like most people are not focused
on developing guys who can hit 

1841
01:37:17,440 --> 01:37:20,640
nasty stuff. 
So if your stuff is nasty, it 

1842
01:37:20,640 --> 01:37:24,040
don't matter if you, you know, 
if you can't lay off of it, you 

1843
01:37:24,040 --> 01:37:26,520
know what I'm saying? 
Like it's the integer still 

1844
01:37:26,520 --> 01:37:28,680
going to be to the pitcher. 
Like I don't need to throw it in

1845
01:37:28,680 --> 01:37:30,120
the zone, he's just going to 
swing at it. 

1846
01:37:30,360 --> 01:37:33,520
And so like to me it's, it's a 
question of like I guess, I 

1847
01:37:33,520 --> 01:37:35,120
guess. 
Are you saying like you don't 

1848
01:37:35,120 --> 01:37:37,560
like it for, say, the pitcher's 
better than the hitter and we 

1849
01:37:37,600 --> 01:37:40,320
shrink the zone? 
Yeah, I it's a question of like,

1850
01:37:40,320 --> 01:37:43,440
OK, how do I play with this idea
of we start trying to 

1851
01:37:43,440 --> 01:37:46,240
disadvantage the pitcher to get 
it more on par so that the 

1852
01:37:46,240 --> 01:37:48,280
hitter has a chance. 
And the only thing I can think 

1853
01:37:48,280 --> 01:37:50,400
of now what I'm starting to 
think about is like, I don't 

1854
01:37:50,400 --> 01:37:52,440
know, eliminate pitches. 
Like the pitcher can't throw a 

1855
01:37:52,440 --> 01:37:53,840
sweep for sure. 
You. 

1856
01:37:54,840 --> 01:37:56,280
Know what I mean? 
But that doesn't in the end, 

1857
01:37:56,280 --> 01:38:00,040
like, I mean, I will do this for
our hitters anyways is like, I 

1858
01:38:00,040 --> 01:38:03,040
will. 
I will start to when I'm 

1859
01:38:03,040 --> 01:38:06,520
throwing to them, I'll change, 
you know, like I'll limit the 

1860
01:38:06,520 --> 01:38:08,800
number of breaking balls or I 
might go fastball heavy. 

1861
01:38:09,400 --> 01:38:12,000
So, like, there might just be a 
whole stretch where I just throw

1862
01:38:12,000 --> 01:38:14,160
a bunch of fastballs. 
I did this to one guy, like one 

1863
01:38:14,160 --> 01:38:16,080
of our better hitters. 
He was just struggling to. 

1864
01:38:16,120 --> 01:38:18,640
He's just always under it. 
And I was just like, oh, you 

1865
01:38:18,640 --> 01:38:20,720
know what? 
This is like a game too, right? 

1866
01:38:20,760 --> 01:38:22,840
I'll probably. 
He's just going to just see 

1867
01:38:22,840 --> 01:38:24,960
fastballs because he can't prove
that he can hit it. 

1868
01:38:24,960 --> 01:38:26,400
So I'm just going to feed him 
fastballs. 

1869
01:38:26,400 --> 01:38:27,840
And I know he's a good enough 
hitter. 

1870
01:38:27,840 --> 01:38:29,200
Like he'll figure it out 
eventually. 

1871
01:38:29,680 --> 01:38:32,560
It took him probably like 4 
rounds before he actually got 

1872
01:38:32,560 --> 01:38:33,560
it. 
And then he was on it. 

1873
01:38:33,840 --> 01:38:36,760
And then it turned out like I'd 
actually helped him get a little

1874
01:38:36,760 --> 01:38:38,560
bit. 
And I mean I kind of then was 

1875
01:38:39,000 --> 01:38:41,880
more nasty to him afterwards, 
but it it seemed to hold a 

1876
01:38:42,760 --> 01:38:45,440
little bit better out. 
You know some of it too is I got

1877
01:38:45,440 --> 01:38:48,040
in the pattern and so I like 
threw him a pitch. 

1878
01:38:48,040 --> 01:38:50,800
I was like why did I throw that 
pitch there he was like he's 

1879
01:38:50,800 --> 01:38:52,720
hitting those now. 
So it's kind of interesting. 

1880
01:38:52,720 --> 01:38:56,240
But anyways, my point is, is 
maybe to cheer point of like, I 

1881
01:38:56,240 --> 01:38:58,680
just needed to work through it a
little bit of like, OK, how do 

1882
01:38:58,680 --> 01:39:03,520
I, how do I, how do I gain a 
little bit more parity when we 

1883
01:39:03,520 --> 01:39:06,560
do have that mismatch? 
Like it's easy to me to make it 

1884
01:39:06,560 --> 01:39:10,800
harder for the hitter, you know,
like I can, even though I don't 

1885
01:39:10,800 --> 01:39:12,680
think of anything offhand. 
But there are just different 

1886
01:39:12,680 --> 01:39:15,480
ways of like I move them closer.
That's going to automatically 

1887
01:39:15,480 --> 01:39:19,200
make it harder, you know, if a 
pitcher is struggling, like. 

1888
01:39:19,680 --> 01:39:21,320
Depending depending on what 
they're making this look. 

1889
01:39:21,320 --> 01:39:23,520
Bigger or whatever. 
Like these, It's easier for the 

1890
01:39:23,520 --> 01:39:26,720
hitter, but to me, for the 
pitcher, when the pitcher has 

1891
01:39:26,720 --> 01:39:31,680
the advantage, I think that's 
harder to help help, help give 

1892
01:39:31,680 --> 01:39:34,880
the advantage back to the to the
hitter or to make it, to level 

1893
01:39:34,880 --> 01:39:37,760
it out, just because it's so 
much about being able to contact

1894
01:39:37,760 --> 01:39:40,280
the ball for the hitter. 
Yeah. 

1895
01:39:40,280 --> 01:39:42,280
And I think I think I kind of 
constrained myself and just 

1896
01:39:42,280 --> 01:39:45,840
using his own example. 
But in my, in my mind, like if 

1897
01:39:45,840 --> 01:39:48,040
I'm going to take the advantage 
away like I'm, I'm going to take

1898
01:39:48,040 --> 01:39:50,880
away a lot of this like shrink 
the zone a little bit. 

1899
01:39:50,880 --> 01:39:53,560
I may, I may have the pitcher 
now he's going to explore 

1900
01:39:53,560 --> 01:39:55,600
different ways to say he's got a
nasty sweeper, but he never 

1901
01:39:55,600 --> 01:39:58,240
front doors a sweeper, but 
that's a way to landing in the 

1902
01:39:58,240 --> 01:40:00,840
zone. 
So it's like at the same time, 

1903
01:40:00,840 --> 01:40:04,240
like the hitter's not as good, 
but I'm expanding his potential 

1904
01:40:04,240 --> 01:40:07,680
options that he may not explore.
Because he's going to get chases

1905
01:40:07,680 --> 01:40:10,480
all the time away, and he's 
going to get that outside corner

1906
01:40:10,480 --> 01:40:12,480
potentially away. 
But I'm going to take that away.

1907
01:40:12,480 --> 01:40:15,160
So like, the hitter now knows, 
like, hey, the zones in a little

1908
01:40:15,160 --> 01:40:17,960
bit don't potentially have to 
swing at those away. 

1909
01:40:18,160 --> 01:40:19,640
Now the pitcher has to find a 
new solution. 

1910
01:40:19,640 --> 01:40:21,440
That's kind of where my brain 
went with something like that. 

1911
01:40:22,560 --> 01:40:26,160
That's that's also where I think
the Athlete Co design comes in 

1912
01:40:26,160 --> 01:40:29,080
as well where a lot of what 
we're saying is oh what what can

1913
01:40:29,080 --> 01:40:31,120
we change that would make it 
easier for the batter. 

1914
01:40:31,120 --> 01:40:34,440
Sometimes the batter knows kind 
of what he's not picking up on 

1915
01:40:34,440 --> 01:40:38,120
or what he needs and so kind of 
putting the keys in his hand to 

1916
01:40:38,120 --> 01:40:40,120
make some changes and 
recommendations. 

1917
01:40:40,760 --> 01:40:44,680
Not only on the complexity side 
but I also think it comes in on 

1918
01:40:44,960 --> 01:40:47,920
representative in this side like
giving your athletes the keys of

1919
01:40:48,280 --> 01:40:51,320
anytime during this drill. 
If this doesn't really feel like

1920
01:40:51,320 --> 01:40:54,480
a game, you have freedom to go 
make adjustments to this 

1921
01:40:54,480 --> 01:40:56,080
activity to make it feel like a 
game. 

1922
01:40:56,360 --> 01:41:00,680
Like anything that you do is, is
you're you're part of this 

1923
01:41:00,680 --> 01:41:02,840
practice design. 
You can a coach can set 

1924
01:41:02,840 --> 01:41:05,760
something and you know to an 
athlete he'll say this is close 

1925
01:41:05,760 --> 01:41:08,480
but it's missing this. 
All right well add it in like 

1926
01:41:08,480 --> 01:41:10,680
that's that's all yours to go 
for and and fix. 

1927
01:41:10,720 --> 01:41:12,600
They know what's best because 
they're actually in the moment 

1928
01:41:12,600 --> 01:41:14,560
doing it. 
Yeah, that's a good point. 

1929
01:41:15,040 --> 01:41:16,520
And I think, I think that's a 
big piece, too. 

1930
01:41:16,520 --> 01:41:17,680
It's like, OK, So what? 
What? 

1931
01:41:17,920 --> 01:41:19,880
What do you think we need to 
take away from the pitcher as a 

1932
01:41:19,880 --> 01:41:22,800
hitter, like or like, as a 
pitcher like, OK, So what? 

1933
01:41:22,800 --> 01:41:24,720
What should we take away and 
give you a disadvantage and see 

1934
01:41:24,720 --> 01:41:25,880
what they come up with, 
honestly. 

1935
01:41:26,000 --> 01:41:28,200
And then we could potentially 
play off of that. 

1936
01:41:28,200 --> 01:41:30,760
And they they probably come up 
with better ideas than we as 

1937
01:41:30,760 --> 01:41:33,240
coaches do. 
And a lot of times they're 

1938
01:41:33,240 --> 01:41:35,000
living. 
They're actually within the 

1939
01:41:35,000 --> 01:41:37,200
environment. 
The knowledge of is higher than 

1940
01:41:37,200 --> 01:41:40,720
what we're going to have. 
And I think too they're for the 

1941
01:41:40,720 --> 01:41:44,240
people that might be like the 
naysayers, partially because 

1942
01:41:44,520 --> 01:41:47,080
this has been my experience a 
little bit like I think working 

1943
01:41:47,080 --> 01:41:50,520
with pro guys, pro guys know 
that have a lot more experience 

1944
01:41:50,960 --> 01:41:53,880
working with junior college guys
who are just fresh out of high 

1945
01:41:53,880 --> 01:41:55,000
school. 
Yeah, I know. 

1946
01:41:55,000 --> 01:41:57,840
But like there there's more, 
there's more percentage, right. 

1947
01:41:58,280 --> 01:42:03,320
But with with the, with the guys
that I run into and you know to 

1948
01:42:03,320 --> 01:42:06,200
your point AJ that yeah, 
sometimes even the pro guys 

1949
01:42:06,560 --> 01:42:11,600
don't don't really know. 
But I find that OK with the 

1950
01:42:11,600 --> 01:42:13,520
young guys that I have to 
remember, they don't have a ton 

1951
01:42:13,520 --> 01:42:17,240
of experience. 
So therefore, you know, coaches 

1952
01:42:17,240 --> 01:42:18,720
will be like, well, they don't 
know. 

1953
01:42:18,720 --> 01:42:20,480
Like I asked them the question, 
they just don't know. 

1954
01:42:20,640 --> 01:42:23,560
I think I have to remember this 
too. 

1955
01:42:24,000 --> 01:42:29,360
But like, you have to teach them
or invite them to start thinking

1956
01:42:29,360 --> 01:42:30,920
in this way. 
They're not going to get it 

1957
01:42:30,920 --> 01:42:31,840
right away. 
They're not going to have 

1958
01:42:31,840 --> 01:42:34,320
answers for you right away. 
But it's about the environment 

1959
01:42:34,320 --> 01:42:39,120
that you create and you keep 
that invitation open for them to

1960
01:42:39,440 --> 01:42:42,080
give input. 
And sometimes you have to 

1961
01:42:42,080 --> 01:42:44,320
override that input because the 
other element of it too is like,

1962
01:42:44,320 --> 01:42:46,240
sometimes guys will just change 
it to make it easier and they 

1963
01:42:46,240 --> 01:42:47,560
just want to be comfortable the 
whole time. 

1964
01:42:47,560 --> 01:42:49,920
So like you're like, no, you 
have to, it has to be 

1965
01:42:49,920 --> 01:42:52,760
challenging still. 
Like you can't just go over 

1966
01:42:52,760 --> 01:42:56,240
there and just, you know, do 
easy, easy front toss and like 

1967
01:42:56,240 --> 01:42:59,840
easy beeps like or just like for
a lot of times too, like guys 

1968
01:42:59,840 --> 01:43:02,840
will just set the machine to 
something kind of slow that they

1969
01:43:02,840 --> 01:43:05,640
can just sit there and mash and 
it's like, come on, like we need

1970
01:43:05,640 --> 01:43:07,120
to. 
If you actually want to get 

1971
01:43:07,120 --> 01:43:08,560
better, we have to make this 
more challenging. 

1972
01:43:08,560 --> 01:43:10,960
You got to turn the machine up. 
You got to let the ball spray a 

1973
01:43:10,960 --> 01:43:13,280
little bit more. 
Like you can't, you can't just 

1974
01:43:13,280 --> 01:43:15,760
groove it right down the middle.
And so like these are things of 

1975
01:43:15,760 --> 01:43:19,680
like we have to figure that out 
of like what's that balance? 

1976
01:43:19,680 --> 01:43:21,920
Because even too, like this is 
from like a parenting 

1977
01:43:21,920 --> 01:43:24,960
standpoint, like I kind of heard
this, this example of like OK 

1978
01:43:24,960 --> 01:43:28,600
with the kid, you can't have the
reins just pulled real tight all

1979
01:43:28,600 --> 01:43:29,920
the time. 
Like you got to let the reins 

1980
01:43:29,920 --> 01:43:32,720
out a little bit sometimes. 
So like, you know, there are 

1981
01:43:32,720 --> 01:43:36,360
different, for example, when I 
did or weighted bats this, this,

1982
01:43:36,360 --> 01:43:39,880
this go around, I made sure that
the machine was not set to super

1983
01:43:39,880 --> 01:43:42,040
hard because one, if they're 
going to get the value out of 

1984
01:43:42,040 --> 01:43:44,280
the way to bats, they need to 
hit the ball. 

1985
01:43:44,600 --> 01:43:46,440
So if it's too hard and they're 
not hitting the ball and they're

1986
01:43:46,440 --> 01:43:48,960
swinging missing, like it's like
this isn't working. 

1987
01:43:49,960 --> 01:43:53,200
But I also don't believe like we
should be doing, you know, front

1988
01:43:53,200 --> 01:43:56,640
toss and hitting off AT either 
like then I'm not, yeah, I'm 

1989
01:43:56,640 --> 01:43:58,960
building bat speed, but I'm not 
building the ability to hit the 

1990
01:43:58,960 --> 01:44:01,200
ball. 
So I wanted something that was, 

1991
01:44:01,800 --> 01:44:06,320
you know, like easy ish, like 
close to BP ish, but maybe just 

1992
01:44:06,320 --> 01:44:08,880
slightly harder than BP part 
part of our machine is just 

1993
01:44:08,880 --> 01:44:11,360
going to be that. 
And so, but I didn't want it to 

1994
01:44:11,360 --> 01:44:13,520
be spraying all over the place 
and I wanted it to be something 

1995
01:44:13,520 --> 01:44:16,560
that was doable. 
So like what we did is we did 

1996
01:44:16,560 --> 01:44:20,920
like a, you know, we set the 
machine at like upper 70s, low 

1997
01:44:20,920 --> 01:44:23,600
80s. 
I kind of wanted it at 75, but 

1998
01:44:23,880 --> 01:44:26,800
we ended up being like 77 I 
think on average. 

1999
01:44:27,200 --> 01:44:30,280
And then we did a slow a slow 
breaking ball machine in the 

2000
01:44:30,280 --> 01:44:33,680
other cage. 
And so I had kind of and but the

2001
01:44:33,680 --> 01:44:37,840
goal was not for it to be nasty.
It was just to be something that

2002
01:44:37,840 --> 01:44:40,080
was doable. 
And I think there there's a time

2003
01:44:40,080 --> 01:44:43,680
and a place for that to to like 
find those places where you can 

2004
01:44:43,680 --> 01:44:47,760
let those guys do that 
comfortable thing where it's 

2005
01:44:47,800 --> 01:44:51,720
where like it doesn't matter 
that it's like super high in a 

2006
01:44:51,720 --> 01:44:53,920
representativeness. 
It can be a little bit lower and

2007
01:44:53,920 --> 01:44:56,520
there can be a space for that 
And I think, but you can't let 

2008
01:44:56,520 --> 01:44:58,000
guys just stay there the whole 
time. 

2009
01:44:58,000 --> 01:45:00,960
I think that's kind of the you 
know that that give and take and

2010
01:45:00,960 --> 01:45:04,400
finding out like OK where where 
can we do those things of like I

2011
01:45:04,400 --> 01:45:06,720
can let the reins out a little 
bit and we can go you can kind 

2012
01:45:06,720 --> 01:45:08,960
of do that and I think there is 
a space for that. 

2013
01:45:10,840 --> 01:45:12,760
So at least I would, I just 
wanted to put that out there of 

2014
01:45:12,760 --> 01:45:15,960
like you know, for those people 
who are like, you know, are you 

2015
01:45:15,960 --> 01:45:18,160
saying that has to be like this 
the whole time or like what 

2016
01:45:18,160 --> 01:45:23,800
about this, you know, yeah you 
you do have to you have to find 

2017
01:45:23,800 --> 01:45:29,000
that happy balance with with 
guys you know and you can't give

2018
01:45:29,000 --> 01:45:31,200
up on it though. 
I think that's the biggest thing

2019
01:45:31,520 --> 01:45:33,920
of like if you're not getting 
the response, if you believe in 

2020
01:45:33,920 --> 01:45:35,120
the thing, you can't give up on 
it. 

2021
01:45:35,120 --> 01:45:36,480
You got to figure out how to 
foster it. 

2022
01:45:48,520 --> 01:45:52,360
So anything that you want to 
close on? 

2023
01:45:55,360 --> 01:45:57,440
No, I I I think that's a pretty 
good wrap up. 

2024
01:45:57,440 --> 01:45:59,000
Boy, that was a good, nice 
little you. 

2025
01:45:59,000 --> 01:46:01,040
Had a you had one other thing. 
I don't know how much time you 

2026
01:46:01,040 --> 01:46:06,360
have left Baker you got you got 
like 5/10/15. 

2027
01:46:06,360 --> 01:46:08,040
What's your, What's your, what's
your cap? 

2028
01:46:09,360 --> 01:46:11,880
But I think for the safety 
amount being probably like 5. 

2029
01:46:12,480 --> 01:46:16,400
OK. 
I don't know, AJ do you have 

2030
01:46:16,920 --> 01:46:19,320
like what is the procedural 
thing question second-half of 

2031
01:46:19,320 --> 01:46:21,560
your? 
Yeah, I mean this is like this 

2032
01:46:21,560 --> 01:46:23,960
is more like out of curiosity 
like with with you guys. 

2033
01:46:23,960 --> 01:46:27,480
But I was thinking about an act 
after action review and I was 

2034
01:46:27,480 --> 01:46:30,400
wondering if like if that's 
something that's worth it in a 

2035
01:46:31,040 --> 01:46:33,520
in in a team setting. 
So I'm thinking about, say, a 

2036
01:46:33,520 --> 01:46:37,480
pro or college program. 
You obviously go through a game 

2037
01:46:37,480 --> 01:46:40,400
and then you kind of pick out 
some certain aspects and walk 

2038
01:46:40,400 --> 01:46:44,120
through it with your team. 
I wonder if that loses things 

2039
01:46:44,120 --> 01:46:46,200
because again, you're out of, 
you're out of context, you're 

2040
01:46:46,200 --> 01:46:48,440
just watching it on a screen. 
I was curious if you guys 

2041
01:46:48,440 --> 01:46:51,200
thought that has value that, you
know, maybe it's a conversation 

2042
01:46:51,200 --> 01:46:54,600
for a different day, but that 
was something that I've been 

2043
01:46:54,600 --> 01:46:56,360
kind of kicking around in my 
mind recently. 

2044
01:46:57,160 --> 01:46:59,080
Baker, what are your What are 
your initial thoughts? 

2045
01:46:59,400 --> 01:47:00,440
Are you talking like game 
review? 

2046
01:47:01,480 --> 01:47:04,160
Yeah, like a game review style 
of thing where certain things 

2047
01:47:04,160 --> 01:47:07,920
come up and kind of talk about, 
well, well, maybe why do we do 

2048
01:47:07,920 --> 01:47:09,760
things this way or why did this 
happen? 

2049
01:47:09,760 --> 01:47:12,960
Like, is that useful? 
I know that in the military, 

2050
01:47:13,040 --> 01:47:16,200
after every single mission, they
go through an after action 

2051
01:47:16,200 --> 01:47:18,640
review, things that went well. 
What didn't go well, what could 

2052
01:47:18,640 --> 01:47:21,440
have gone better? 
Like, I was curious if that's 

2053
01:47:21,440 --> 01:47:25,520
something that's useful in the 
sporting context to try to drive

2054
01:47:25,520 --> 01:47:28,320
some sort of learning based off 
of what you did instead of it's 

2055
01:47:28,320 --> 01:47:30,640
like, oh, this happened, all 
right, we're just going to jump 

2056
01:47:30,640 --> 01:47:32,600
to the next game and just hope 
it doesn't happen again. 

2057
01:47:33,040 --> 01:47:34,080
Yeah. 
No, I think it's, I think it's 

2058
01:47:34,080 --> 01:47:36,680
extremely valuable and I think 
it's how you go through it and 

2059
01:47:36,680 --> 01:47:39,120
how what language you use while 
you're doing it in my opinion 

2060
01:47:40,240 --> 01:47:42,120
really, really matters. 
Again what you're. 

2061
01:47:42,120 --> 01:47:45,560
I think in baseball, if we're 
just looking at baseball, your 

2062
01:47:45,560 --> 01:47:48,640
typical one is you're going to 
be looking at the just specific 

2063
01:47:48,640 --> 01:47:50,360
actions of the athletes. 
I think that's how it's 

2064
01:47:50,360 --> 01:47:53,760
typically done and I think there
could be obviously there are 

2065
01:47:53,760 --> 01:47:55,800
times where there could 
potentially have value. 

2066
01:47:56,560 --> 01:47:59,760
But I think that gets dangerous 
compared to looking through. 

2067
01:47:59,760 --> 01:48:02,280
And you can kind of understand 
especially if you're you're 

2068
01:48:02,280 --> 01:48:05,520
talking through it with an 
athlete or with athletes like 

2069
01:48:05,520 --> 01:48:09,280
what they potentially were 
seeing or why they weren't 

2070
01:48:09,280 --> 01:48:11,680
behaving in the way they were. 
And one, you can kind of 

2071
01:48:11,680 --> 01:48:15,040
understand them better and you 
can kind of point out things 

2072
01:48:15,040 --> 01:48:17,760
they may have potentially missed
where they could go explore in 

2073
01:48:17,920 --> 01:48:20,880
future practices. 
So I think there's a ton of ton 

2074
01:48:20,880 --> 01:48:24,360
of value in that and just kind 
of like fleshing out wide things

2075
01:48:24,360 --> 01:48:27,840
potentially unfolded the way 
they they did since stuff you 

2076
01:48:27,840 --> 01:48:32,000
won't get in game visit you 
can't just be with the athlete 

2077
01:48:32,000 --> 01:48:34,000
and ask them what they saw after
every play, right. 

2078
01:48:34,000 --> 01:48:36,600
Like why they behaved or what 
they were connecting to where 

2079
01:48:36,920 --> 01:48:38,720
that kind of time, what can be 
helpful. 

2080
01:48:38,720 --> 01:48:41,000
And two, you can point out 
things that may have potentially

2081
01:48:41,000 --> 01:48:46,120
been missed or like like hey, 
because of this like you could 

2082
01:48:46,120 --> 01:48:48,440
have potentially or you could 
throw it back on them. 

2083
01:48:48,440 --> 01:48:50,640
It's like what you could you 
have potentially done. 

2084
01:48:51,000 --> 01:48:53,240
And it's kind of like just 
educating their attention or 

2085
01:48:53,240 --> 01:48:56,280
intention, obviously not on 
field, but that can be later 

2086
01:48:56,280 --> 01:48:59,440
brought to the practice setting 
based on what you saw and it 

2087
01:48:59,440 --> 01:49:02,080
kind of just like here's them 
into what you may have them 

2088
01:49:02,080 --> 01:49:06,520
interact with later. 
No, I know I'm, I'm right there 

2089
01:49:06,520 --> 01:49:08,880
with you and I think there 
there's value to it. 

2090
01:49:10,200 --> 01:49:13,280
I just think you have to have 
some feel as to when, where and 

2091
01:49:13,800 --> 01:49:18,240
where and when to put it because
I do think like right after a 

2092
01:49:18,240 --> 01:49:21,560
game, yeah, it's more fresh. 
But guys are also depending on 

2093
01:49:21,680 --> 01:49:24,840
how long the day was, all this 
sort of stuff, there might not 

2094
01:49:24,840 --> 01:49:28,920
be as checked in, you know, 
because those things can get 

2095
01:49:28,920 --> 01:49:30,960
kind of long. 
You know if you're doing a, 

2096
01:49:31,320 --> 01:49:34,520
you're doing a good debrief like
it that that can take some time.

2097
01:49:34,520 --> 01:49:38,560
So I think I think you have to 
figure out where that works best

2098
01:49:38,760 --> 01:49:44,120
and like not get to, you have to
figure out like, OK, where you 

2099
01:49:44,120 --> 01:49:46,640
know, I want to touch on this 
thing after the game, you know, 

2100
01:49:47,120 --> 01:49:48,760
and just spend a little bit of 
time on this. 

2101
01:49:48,760 --> 01:49:51,560
But there are other things and 
I'll cover that other stuff like

2102
01:49:51,560 --> 01:49:53,240
it's not as important. 
You know what I mean? 

2103
01:49:53,240 --> 01:49:56,840
Like there's that nice balance I
think that you have to figure 

2104
01:49:56,840 --> 01:50:00,120
out of where this lives and how 
it, how to actually implement 

2105
01:50:00,120 --> 01:50:01,360
it. 
But I think it's it's highly 

2106
01:50:01,360 --> 01:50:08,320
valuable just for the the mere 
point of like you you there's 

2107
01:50:08,320 --> 01:50:11,800
value in spending some time like
like Stu Macmillan was talking 

2108
01:50:11,800 --> 01:50:14,840
about asking that what if 
question what if you know like 

2109
01:50:14,840 --> 01:50:17,640
what if we had done this and 
playing these different 

2110
01:50:17,640 --> 01:50:20,240
scenarios out so that next time 
you go out there you can begin 

2111
01:50:20,240 --> 01:50:24,680
to your your attention. 
You're able to pick up different

2112
01:50:24,680 --> 01:50:27,000
things in the environment that 
you weren't able to before and 

2113
01:50:27,000 --> 01:50:30,480
maybe see ways, different 
affordances, opportunities for 

2114
01:50:30,480 --> 01:50:34,080
action to be able to interact 
with with that problem 

2115
01:50:34,080 --> 01:50:37,040
differently. 
Different solutions, you know, 

2116
01:50:37,040 --> 01:50:39,640
might emerge for you. 
So that's kind of my thought 

2117
01:50:39,640 --> 01:50:45,120
there. 
So where can people find you 

2118
01:50:45,160 --> 01:50:49,840
guys if this ends up being an 
episode like that You know where

2119
01:50:49,840 --> 01:50:52,200
can people find you what what do
you guys got going on? 

2120
01:50:52,200 --> 01:50:55,720
I know Baker you're you're back 
with the the Mets and then AJ 

2121
01:50:55,720 --> 01:51:00,200
you're you're currently a free 
agent trying to trying to find 

2122
01:51:00,200 --> 01:51:03,440
out or get connected with with 
folks and so where can people 

2123
01:51:03,440 --> 01:51:05,360
connect and see more of your 
work. 

2124
01:51:08,600 --> 01:51:12,880
Yeah, I mean, for me, I I check 
it sparingly, but kind of on X 

2125
01:51:12,880 --> 01:51:15,880
or Twitter or whatever it's 
called at AJ Ferrara. 

2126
01:51:17,200 --> 01:51:17,960
Nice. 
Nice. 

2127
01:51:18,320 --> 01:51:20,920
I guess for me it's at Coach G 
Baker. 

2128
01:51:21,160 --> 01:51:23,840
Neither Twitter or X or 
Instagram. 

2129
01:51:24,280 --> 01:51:25,840
Probably I'm more on Twitter 
more. 

2130
01:51:26,400 --> 01:51:30,080
Honestly, I'm less most both of 
them less now than ever. 

2131
01:51:30,400 --> 01:51:33,440
But I'll still be beyond both. 
And e-mail, same thing. 

2132
01:51:33,440 --> 01:51:36,200
Coach g.baker@gmail.com. 
If you want to want to hit me up

2133
01:51:36,200 --> 01:51:39,480
on e-mail, I. 
Mean most people never listen to

2134
01:51:39,480 --> 01:51:45,480
the end so but you guys should 
definitely get the Sport 

2135
01:51:45,480 --> 01:51:51,320
Movement Skill Conference 2023 
and or any of the other ones and

2136
01:51:51,320 --> 01:51:56,880
if you want a discount use use 
the code edge 7 to get 7% off. 

2137
01:51:57,040 --> 01:52:01,040
OK so there's that plug. 
Hope you guys found some good 

2138
01:52:01,040 --> 01:52:05,680
stuff out of this and good 
takeaways and till next time.