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Welcome back to finding the edge
podcast. 

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I'm Garrett poem joined with 
Robert Fry and Garrett Baker. 

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Neither of us. 
Who's out? 

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Who's helping? 
Who wants? 

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What with, with, with our Frozen
degrees of freedom, between me 

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and Robert Barron? 
Yeah. 

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I don't know if I use that 
right, but Yeah. 

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I know, right? 
Well, you know, we're playing 

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around right now. 
So our agency. 

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Yeah. 
We're seeing gauging and some 

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serious player exploring. 
The exploring intro in a 

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different way right now and 
seeing, if at least anything and

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that's exactly the answer, all 
the stuff that's the intro right

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there. 
So like for this episode, we 

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riff off of a video by Ray 
Kelly, where he's doing a an 

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interview with John for Vicki, 
and they're talking about why 

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serious play is transformative. 
We discuss how this is 

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applicable to baseball in some 
ways, we're trying to help 

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people adjust to this idea of 
like we can actually play and 

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work and like get things done 
and like grow and it's not just 

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this distraction Yeah, and I 
think I would challenge anybody 

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listening to this, to hopefully 
have a different idea of what 

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Blake could potentially be 
verse, like, your typical idea 

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of play, but this idea which he 
gets into about serious play, 

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which again is near near dear to
my heart in my, my way of life 

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and kind of the way I approach 
coaching but just just to look 

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at it in a different light, 
Verso, they're just they're 

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screwing around so they're 
they're going and playing verse 

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like we're still working. 
In a way, but how we're aiming 

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to interact with our work, is 
through serious, play and 

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through some exploration. 
And as you'll see in the 

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episode, this idea of repetition
with variation and how that is 

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actually probably a better 
version of or definition of 

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play. 
So, to me, this is, this is a 

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concept that can transform one. 
Your own practice, whatever you 

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want to engage in to how you 
going coach. 

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I think this is this is an 
extremely extremely powerful 

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concept. 
No, I mean, that's that's the 

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thing is, like this. 
This intro, even though we're 

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going to chop it up, is more 
more would have been looking 

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for? 
I thought, you know, like just, 

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yeah, it's and it seems like, 
boy. 

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I'm that you were allowing us to
engage in serious play rather 

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than following a structure for 
the intro, well, which is what 

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we've been trying to get to 
write because this, this is a, 

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we want something that's more 
alive. 

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It's more ecological. 
And, you know, into like this, 

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This is what serious play does 
is it helps it gives life to 

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things, you know, because it 
going back to like what we'll 

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talk a little bit about in the 
episode when we you'll see the 

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episode was recorded a long time
ago with just me and Baker. 

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So so we're looking, we're 
looking at the episode here and 

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I just noticed that this episode
was recorded over a year ago. 

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So, it's so good. 
That it was, it took over a year

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in the making. 
Yeah, well into it was initially

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recorded as a, as Confessions of
a baseball coach episode, but 

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we're going to bring that. 
We're going to Port this one 

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over to finding the edge, which 
is the layer. 

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Oh yeah. 
I mean and we're also like way 

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different people than we were a 
year ago. 

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Yeah, I don't remember who I was
a year ago. 

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It's all right. 
I think it's good. 

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That we recorded a little bit of
an update. 

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And then when we're doing the 
intro recorded, A little extra 

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with Robert and in that, we had 
a little clip from inning by 

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inning where Auggie, Greedo 
talks about how like, they don't

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say, work baseball. 
They they talk about, let's play

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ball. 
And so to me, that's that's that

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whole the essence of what Auggie
is talking about. 

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There is about imbuing this 
thing with actual life, like 

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making it a lot and this this 
too is, you know, me. 

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It plays off this. 
Another video that I love by 

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Bruce Lee when he's working with
the student or whatever and I 

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want to pull it up but you know 
this is an intro so I don't want

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to get too long-winded on it but
anyways, so the video, the video

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is him working with the student 
and in it is like, kick me and 

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it throws the student, throws a 
kick. 

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He was like, what was that? 
We need emotional content. 

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And so like that's that's kind 
of like to me. 

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Emotional content is imbuing the
thing with life. 

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So you know, hopefully this this
episode is life giving to you. 

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I just, you know, you know, like
I don't, this is where like, 

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what's hard about this, right? 
Well, I mean, but here's the 

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thing, right? 
Here's what's hard about this 

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stuff, right? 
And did you even going back to 

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the video, right? 
He talks about like Rafe is 

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touching on something deep. 
This is why this episode was 

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initially recorded as part of 
Confessions of a baseball coach 

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because you can go so deep here 
and I think that's the thing. 

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That's that's hard for a lot of 
people in just our culture is 

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like that's so cliche. 
You know. 

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I hope this podcast like you 
know but I mean that's really 

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what it boils down to. 
I mean you know like we can we 

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can talk about passion or 
whatever it is you know like we 

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have to put it in different 
terms but like that's the thing 

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of like people. 
It's more engaging, you know, 

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than just the Hey, let's talk 
about this in a factual way 

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Bueller, Bueller, Bueller type 
of deal. 

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Like so anyways, I hope you 
enjoyed today's podcast with 

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Garrett Baker, Robert Fry, 
Garrett point, you wanna do you 

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So, yeah, I mean what, what's up

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cuz you guys pick up again 
rolling Baker and then Robert, I

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guess Robert we should start 
with Robert because I mean 

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that's the first I wonder is 
that like your first time you've

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ever seen this video? 
It is the first time I've. 

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All right, so what what was your
impression? 

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What stood out to you? 
I guess the the first impression

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that stood out to me was like, 
you know, the idea of repetition

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with variation and that's that's
the biggest thing that stood out

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to me because, you know, in a 
training environment or like, if

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I'm doing something where, you 
know, I'm super hyper, focus on 

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a certain task, like I feel like
There's there's less of growth 

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if I'm hyper focused on the past
rather than allowing myself to 

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play around and so like it 
reminded me of oddly enough me 

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playing a particular video game 
called Bioshock and big fan of 

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that game but like the advantage
with that was the reason why I 

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like it so much. 
Is it duck that game was like 

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amongst the first to allow you 
to have a deep sense of 

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exploration like you Don't have 
to be like, oh, you have to do 

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this past this path, this path. 
Like you can explore the world 

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and, you know, allow yourself to
solve that problem in the way 

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you see in different variations.
So as you can perceive multiple 

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affordances or different 
affordances, yeah, and within 

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the landscape or absolutely. 
So it's like, you know, it 

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allows you to kind of see a 
bigger picture is the way. 

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A, I'm kind of perceiving it. 
Is it allows you to see that 

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like there's not just one way to
do it. 

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There's more than one way and 
you know, for one person that 

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might be one thing for another 
person, might be another, oh, 

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you know, just being allow 
yourself to create that 

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reputation with variation. 
So that's kind of the big thing 

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I got out of that. 
Dile of a lot of that. 

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Like, what you picked up? 
I mean, because this is, this is

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some of the, like, even even 
with what you were saying of how

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when you are, given the freedom 
to explore. 

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And to me, I was thinking about 
like, you may perceive 

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affordances within the game that
the designer didn't even think 

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of when you're allowed the 
freedom to explore and and being

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more of a what I would like to 
call when you were talking about

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video game design, more of a 
sandbox. 

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It's right where you have more 
freedom to kind of do what you 

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want or interact with it. 
Rather in the way that that is 

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more along your style or you 
know, that that aligns with or 

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who you are, and how you want to
interact and how you with with 

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the game and you get to begin, 
like to you're saying like you 

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get to then try different things
too. 

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And the other element that I 
took out of that was you also 

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begin to understand or 
appreciate more of the game Brew

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through that exploration. 
When you find little, you make 

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little discoveries about the 
game. 

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You begin to appreciate the game
even more. 

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And through that you you get it,
you come to a deeper 

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understanding of how the game or
of the game rather and how the 

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game works and have a greater 
and deeper appreciation for for 

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the thing that you're doing. 
I mean spot on because it's it's

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the same concept of like how a 
deep sense of passion that's 

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created when problem solved. 
So like specific examples like 

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my experiences with coding like 
hmm I didn't follow like a 

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structured path. 
I didn't go, you know, in 

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classes at school. 
I didn't go. 

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Hey, you know, I'm going to do 
this. 

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This is this is I just allowed 
myself to explore and like 

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creative different things and 
I'm like, yeah, this is, this is

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awesome because, you know, I 
allowed Myself, at exploration 

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allowed myself to solve those 
problems. 

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So you so basically like you 
have a sense of ownership to of 

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like the stuff of what you did 
and what not. 

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So I think because I think 
that's the other part of it too 

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of when I look at an ecological 
approach that we give players 

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more ownership or we. 
It creates a environment to 

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allow that facilitates for 
ownership or for the player to 

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have ownership over their 
development. 

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And so that's that to me is what
it sounds like you're talking 

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about. 
There's like, you had ownership 

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over your learning, instead of 
it was something that was just 

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given to you by somebody else. 
Yeah, I don't know if I 

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articulated exactly how I wanted
it to, ya know, I think. 

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But anyways I think I mean, I 
think you're spot on it because 

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when you when you approach 
something with play like you're 

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going to be able to go and 
navigate it in a different way 

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if you then you approach it like
I need to do it perfectly or the

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maybe guardrails are too tight 
where there's nowhere to go and 

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it gets really boring and 
there's you don't feel like 

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there's any ownership of that 
because basically whoever was 

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telling you the task or gave you
a task basically guide. 

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You directly to the answer. 
And I like how you're supposed 

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have ownership of that. 
You can't 12 to jump in real 

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quick. 
It may not fit your personality 

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or who you are. 
That makes sense, right? 

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Like you know, like that's 
somebody else is, you know, like

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way of looking at it and like 
it, maybe their intention but 

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that's not your intention. 
Or that's not like what you 

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value, you know, how you want to
use it and interact with it, 

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sorry to cut you off. 
Nothing your thought on it. 

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I think like the video game 
ideas like perfect is why do why

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do people like video games so 
much? 

224
00:13:33,900 --> 00:13:36,200
Like why? 
I think there's more reasons 

225
00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:38,800
than just this but like you look
at like a game like Fortnight 

226
00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:43,800
like I think took off and every 
single round is different. 

227
00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:47,000
There's there's repetition with 
variation. 

228
00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,000
You can play a bunch of 
different game bunch of games 

229
00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:50,700
over and over and over. 
You had a bunch of repetitions 

230
00:13:50,700 --> 00:13:54,200
but every game because it's so 
Dynamic since there's 100 

231
00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:55,900
players or however many players 
are in it. 

232
00:13:55,900 --> 00:13:58,300
It's, it's going. 
To be different every single 

233
00:13:58,300 --> 00:14:02,400
time and how you aim to interact
like you you go this place this 

234
00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:03,800
time then you go to this place 
this time. 

235
00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:05,900
There's you make different gun 
even if you go to the same spot,

236
00:14:05,900 --> 00:14:08,400
this me a different gun there 
for you, as you need different, 

237
00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:10,800
different opportunities to 
explore the world in a different

238
00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:12,400
way. 
And that's where you kind of 

239
00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:16,100
play around in different Realms 
and it'd be different if the 

240
00:14:16,100 --> 00:14:19,700
game told you, you had to go 
here, then you had to go here 

241
00:14:19,700 --> 00:14:23,400
and it gives you parameters but 
even the Zone moves and changes 

242
00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:25,500
where it's going to end. 
So you're exploring different 

243
00:14:25,500 --> 00:14:28,100
ways. 
And I think that, Is what keeps 

244
00:14:28,100 --> 00:14:30,600
it so engaging and wanting 
people to go back and like, 

245
00:14:30,600 --> 00:14:34,300
people are willing to invest so 
much time in it and play, and 

246
00:14:34,300 --> 00:14:37,200
play, and play, and get reps, 
and Reps, and rep, because of 

247
00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:40,200
that, because of this 
repetition, with variations, I 

248
00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:44,300
think, actually, I say, I think 
I know, because I've done it, 

249
00:14:44,300 --> 00:14:46,500
I've done it with other people, 
but if you approach your own 

250
00:14:46,500 --> 00:14:50,000
development in this way, where 
you have repetition with 

251
00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:53,000
variation versus trying to get 
the perfect rep over and over 

252
00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:55,400
and over. 
You're going to be more engaged.

253
00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:57,500
So learning is going to be 
higher until you're going to 

254
00:14:57,500 --> 00:15:00,100
enjoy it more, like you're going
to, you're going to want to go 

255
00:15:00,100 --> 00:15:02,700
back and do more. 
And like, I think people have 

256
00:15:03,100 --> 00:15:05,800
just, in my opinion, like he 
talks about, like, everything 

257
00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:09,500
sits just Leisure and fun, there
is there's crappy play, if that 

258
00:15:09,500 --> 00:15:12,100
makes sense. 
Like, you can just screw around 

259
00:15:12,100 --> 00:15:14,800
and you can engage in this idea 
of crappy play where you don't 

260
00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:17,900
pick anything up and you're just
yours aiming to have a good 

261
00:15:17,900 --> 00:15:21,800
time, have fun Leisure, and what
the mind go and not, not really 

262
00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:25,600
worried about anything, but then
there's this Display where 

263
00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:27,900
you're fully engaged. 
You're trying to pick something 

264
00:15:27,900 --> 00:15:31,300
up and that's where this 
repetition with variation comes 

265
00:15:31,300 --> 00:15:32,900
in. 
And we're learning actually 

266
00:15:32,900 --> 00:15:35,300
happens and you can probably 
pick something up. 

267
00:15:35,300 --> 00:15:38,500
You never would have before if 
you did engage with serious play

268
00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:42,800
and it's, I'll stop with this. 
But there's a Neato saying he 

269
00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:44,500
says, never leave the 
playground. 

270
00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:47,200
And that's something I try to 
take to everything in my life 

271
00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:50,500
because if I approach everything
like a playground, like I'm just

272
00:15:50,500 --> 00:15:54,600
an Explorer in any way. 
I see fit in the moment and Find

273
00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:57,700
new ways to interact with that 
playground and all enjoy it. 

274
00:15:57,700 --> 00:16:01,700
And it'll be more fun verse. 
Like I have to do it this exact 

275
00:16:01,700 --> 00:16:05,800
way and this exact time, or 
whatever it may be and these 

276
00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:09,700
exact guidelines because then 
your creativity stifled which 

277
00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:13,000
again think about the benefits 
of being creative thinking about

278
00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:15,500
the benefits of having ownership
and had the benefits of just 

279
00:16:15,500 --> 00:16:21,000
like literally just wanting to 
go do it because that is just 

280
00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:22,300
one. 
You're going to get more reps 

281
00:16:22,300 --> 00:16:23,900
but to you're going to get more 
reps in a bunch. 

282
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:27,400
Different ways which think about
when the transfer the context 

283
00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:30,000
context is always changing 
within games where everything is

284
00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:33,600
a dynamical system. 
So the value of that is so high,

285
00:16:33,700 --> 00:16:36,000
I have I have something that's 
going to take me a second to 

286
00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:40,100
pull it up and looking for it 
was like Baker. 

287
00:16:40,100 --> 00:16:44,800
Keep talking, keep talking. 
Well I'm Sorry Miss we go here 

288
00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:46,400
we go. 
All I have to do is play the 

289
00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:52,700
first the very first part and 
you'll know exactly why I Why 

290
00:16:52,700 --> 00:16:55,000
did this? 
I'm not going to create a work 

291
00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:57,400
environment. 
This is you don't you don't hear

292
00:16:57,400 --> 00:17:00,300
the Empire, you know, and I know
there's an old cliche but when 

293
00:17:00,300 --> 00:17:02,500
you start the game he doesn't 
say. 

294
00:17:02,500 --> 00:17:05,900
Okay. 
Let's work baseball is let's 

295
00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:11,300
play ball. you know, like yeah, 
that's exactly what you're 

296
00:17:11,300 --> 00:17:20,000
talking about, you know, I keep 
it like, This is the game is 

297
00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:22,099
when we play baseball, we're 
playing a game. 

298
00:17:22,500 --> 00:17:24,700
I know guys are getting paid. 
Lots of money at the 

299
00:17:24,700 --> 00:17:28,500
professional level and all that 
sort of stuff, but at the end of

300
00:17:28,500 --> 00:17:30,200
the day you get paid to play a 
game. 

301
00:17:31,100 --> 00:17:34,600
And so, so guys don't get burned
out and so they play their best 

302
00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:37,400
baseball. 
You have to, you have to keep it

303
00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:38,700
fun. 
You have to keep it in again. 

304
00:17:38,900 --> 00:17:42,900
I mean because you look at their
our Esports right? 

305
00:17:42,900 --> 00:17:45,300
Going back to video games. 
Esports is now a thing and 

306
00:17:45,300 --> 00:17:48,000
there's lots of money in it and 
there are people who Are doing 

307
00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:53,400
it professionally. 
Like it just we are, we are in 

308
00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:57,100
an entertainment industry, like 
just plain and simple. 

309
00:17:57,100 --> 00:17:59,400
That's what, that's what it is 
that we are doing. 

310
00:17:59,500 --> 00:18:03,000
Especially, when you're talking 
about pro professional, baseball

311
00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:07,000
you are, you are in, you are in 
the entertainment business. 

312
00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:10,600
It's not any different than a 
video game in some ways, but it 

313
00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:14,100
is different because I also, I 
find, I get frustrated when some

314
00:18:14,100 --> 00:18:18,700
coaches over Coach players and 
basically coach them as if they 

315
00:18:18,700 --> 00:18:21,500
were playing a video game. 
Yeah, that's that. 

316
00:18:21,500 --> 00:18:23,400
That's the first. 
That's not my brother. 

317
00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:25,400
Yeah, it's not. 
The players playing the video 

318
00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:27,200
games, the coach by the vegan? 
That's the issue. 

319
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:29,200
Yeah. 
With the players, right? 

320
00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:30,600
Yeah. 
With real-life players. 

321
00:18:30,900 --> 00:18:35,900
Yes. 
Like but no, I think I think we 

322
00:18:35,900 --> 00:18:40,000
have to remember that and that 
that helps us Get the most out 

323
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:43,300
of her players like he's going 
back to to the Ray Kelly video 

324
00:18:43,300 --> 00:18:46,900
in him talking about at the 
beginning like what makes a good

325
00:18:46,900 --> 00:18:50,000
coach the first the first thing 
I think is the most important 

326
00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:54,200
thing have a deep care for the 
person's like right in front of 

327
00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:57,800
you, right? 
And so I think that's where 

328
00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:01,000
everything else flows from 
there, right? 

329
00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:02,900
If you have a deep care for the 
person in front of you and you 

330
00:19:02,908 --> 00:19:05,900
want to see the best for them. 
Part of your knowledge because 

331
00:19:05,900 --> 00:19:08,900
he had that like the tackle the 
Tactical knowledge or the 

332
00:19:09,300 --> 00:19:13,800
Strategic knowledge or the 
content specific knowledge that 

333
00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:17,000
you need to be able to help out 
that player becomes comes 

334
00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:19,600
important. 
You know, after that first 

335
00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:23,000
premise. 
And so, you know, that's where I

336
00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:24,700
see an ecological approach 
fitting. 

337
00:19:24,700 --> 00:19:28,000
Very well with that because you 
still what the biggest struggle 

338
00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:30,100
of when you have a deep care for
the person in front of you is, 

339
00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:31,800
how are you going to care for 
them? 

340
00:19:32,900 --> 00:19:35,100
I think that's like we don't, we
don't ask that question. 

341
00:19:35,100 --> 00:19:37,700
We don't think about that too 
much because sometimes how we 

342
00:19:37,700 --> 00:19:43,700
care for them is like we try to 
make sure That they eat their 

343
00:19:43,700 --> 00:19:46,300
vegetables. 
Type of a thing, you know like 

344
00:19:46,300 --> 00:19:54,000
force them to have what's best 
for them. instead of Carrying 

345
00:19:54,300 --> 00:19:55,800
instead of respecting their 
freedom. 

346
00:19:56,700 --> 00:20:00,800
I think it's different sometimes
like because we Baker you know 

347
00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:03,600
you you're working through this 
right now and I'm working 

348
00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:05,400
through this as parents right 
there. 

349
00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:09,100
Are some times where it's like 
no you you are doing this thing,

350
00:20:09,500 --> 00:20:12,800
right? 
Like you are you don't you have 

351
00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:18,000
you as a little three-year-old, 
two-year-old of zero concept 80 

352
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:21,400
and I understand you want to 
just play and play and play but 

353
00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:23,300
you got to eat your vegetables. 
You got to eat food. 

354
00:20:23,900 --> 00:20:26,500
No, you can't touch that. 
No, you can't do that right now.

355
00:20:26,900 --> 00:20:29,300
I have to teach you, you know, 
like it. 

356
00:20:29,300 --> 00:20:32,800
So I do have to, like, your 
freedom isn't isn't unlimited, 

357
00:20:33,100 --> 00:20:36,200
you know? 
But at times I need to respect 

358
00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:37,600
his freedom. 
You know what I mean? 

359
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:40,500
So there's this, this balancing 
act that we as coaches, when we 

360
00:20:40,500 --> 00:20:43,400
care for our players, I 
understand both sides of it of 

361
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:47,100
like, well, they don't know and 
we have to we have to and then 

362
00:20:47,900 --> 00:20:52,500
but I think as players get older
we have to respect their freedom

363
00:20:52,500 --> 00:20:56,400
or and so that's that's one of 
the things I think when we're 

364
00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:59,200
talking about having a deep care
for the person in front of you 

365
00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:02,900
is respecting their freedom and 
building their freedom to like 

366
00:21:03,100 --> 00:21:05,100
because they're like with the 
child. 

367
00:21:06,100 --> 00:21:11,500
Some of the things have like me 
disciplining, my son is so that 

368
00:21:11,500 --> 00:21:14,700
he can have freedom. 
Because if I let him Chase every

369
00:21:14,700 --> 00:21:17,900
women, desire that he has, he 
won't have freedom. 

370
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:21,500
You will be a slave to every 
whim. 

371
00:21:21,500 --> 00:21:24,500
Every little flashy thing that 
lies in front of him. 

372
00:21:25,300 --> 00:21:28,500
He won't have any self 
discipline to resist those 

373
00:21:28,500 --> 00:21:33,400
things and so like, but it, 
still comes back to that that 

374
00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:36,400
element of like, understanding 
that how this all Feeds back 

375
00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:40,600
into freedom but you have to you
know you know as a parent right?

376
00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:43,300
Like kids you're going to turn 
18 or whatever and leave the 

377
00:21:43,300 --> 00:21:45,700
house like we have to let them 
go. 

378
00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:49,300
Like that's that's that's I 
think the other element of it. 

379
00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:52,700
Yeah I would agree time 
navigating that as we speak and 

380
00:21:52,700 --> 00:21:55,000
learning up but I think that's 
constraints on behaviors right 

381
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:59,000
manipulating constraints. 
And I think it goes into a 

382
00:21:59,008 --> 00:22:01,800
little bit of guided exploration
to which goes right into this 

383
00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:05,600
idea of play like you're not 
necessarily telling me exactly 

384
00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:08,600
what to do but maybe nudging him
in a certain direction, to go 

385
00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:11,400
explore or interact with an 
environment in a certain 

386
00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:12,800
direction. 
Based on the constraints, we 

387
00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:16,700
place on your child or your 
player in front of you. 

388
00:22:16,700 --> 00:22:18,900
And I think that's again, that's
where the ecological approach 

389
00:22:18,900 --> 00:22:22,900
is, is so powerful because 
you're considering the person in

390
00:22:22,900 --> 00:22:27,000
front of you. 
But you're also not directly 

391
00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:29,200
telling because you think, you 
know exactly what this person 

392
00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:32,600
needs to go, do your place, 
skillfully place, constraints 

393
00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:37,200
within the environment to direct
Behavior or allow them to just 

394
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:41,300
go explore and or interact with 
an environment and potentially 

395
00:22:41,300 --> 00:22:45,000
different way to go discover 
something and engage in some 

396
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:47,900
serious, play over here and see 
what they figure out because 

397
00:22:47,900 --> 00:22:51,100
then they become their own 
unique authentic version of 

398
00:22:51,100 --> 00:22:53,300
themselves. 
Which I think is what we need to

399
00:22:53,300 --> 00:22:56,600
get to at the The end of the 
day, not great these robots but 

400
00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:59,200
their own unique authentic. 
Way of interacting with the 

401
00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:02,700
world which I think is not 
talked about enough but 

402
00:23:02,700 --> 00:23:05,300
extremely important, I think it 
ties right back in this. 

403
00:23:06,100 --> 00:23:08,800
If you engage in serious play, 
you're probably going to go find

404
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:14,400
that. 
Absolutely and it reminds me of 

405
00:23:14,700 --> 00:23:19,000
and I know boy, I'm just gonna 
love this thing, but Ryan's, we 

406
00:23:19,008 --> 00:23:24,300
have my Community College 
Mantra, a tank, shout-out start 

407
00:23:24,300 --> 00:23:27,300
here, finish anyway. 
And so that really goes in the 

408
00:23:27,300 --> 00:23:31,200
concept of you know got an 
exploration it's like hey here's

409
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:33,800
your starting point but we're 
going to allow you to go 

410
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:38,200
wherever you wherever you want 
to take the path and allows you 

411
00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:42,600
to you know, go from you know. 
Again, it goes to like one 

412
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,500
person could be going from point
A to point B. 

413
00:23:44,500 --> 00:23:48,200
Another particular going from 
point A to point x for all we 

414
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:52,000
know, it's just whatever that 
that path creates for them and 

415
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:57,400
allows exploration. 
Again, it leads into allowing 

416
00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:00,100
that person, one that creativity
but to like, they'll be more 

417
00:24:00,100 --> 00:24:02,600
engaged in the long run because 
they figure it out for 

418
00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:07,600
themselves rather than oh hey 
you have to do a b c then D then

419
00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:12,700
e the F and that's like at what 
point do they Get into the idea 

420
00:24:12,700 --> 00:24:16,000
or concept of like, burnout 
we're gonna do this, we're gonna

421
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:20,100
do this, you know, and then have
that mindset of rather than I 

422
00:24:20,100 --> 00:24:22,700
have to do this. 
It's I get it. 

423
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:28,400
Yeah, it's not just forcing a 
mindset, it's actually allow 

424
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:31,000
them to engage in a way where 
they actually get to instead of 

425
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:32,700
like, just write it on your 
mirror. 

426
00:24:32,700 --> 00:24:35,600
I get to do, I do this and then 
cram it down their throat which 

427
00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:38,900
is kind of what we're top as my 
background in sports psychology.

428
00:24:38,900 --> 00:24:42,400
It's kind of like a just like, 
no, you have to switch them out.

429
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:43,500
You guys? 
Put your mindset? 

430
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:45,600
That's all I got to do. 
So what's your mindset instead 

431
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:48,300
of have to get to? 
Well, if we change, how they 

432
00:24:48,300 --> 00:24:51,400
interact with the environment, 
they may actually say like, hey 

433
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,300
I get to do this verse just like
Having the force them to switch 

434
00:24:54,300 --> 00:24:57,300
the mindset, which maybe there's
times that it's needed in some 

435
00:24:57,300 --> 00:25:00,800
directions. 
But I think an actual engaging 

436
00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:03,400
environment where you can engage
in some serious play. 

437
00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:05,500
You're actually going to like I 
actually get to do this. 

438
00:25:05,900 --> 00:25:08,600
I don't have to go to the site, 
it's not work, it's play, it's a

439
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:17,000
little serious play. and I think
to going back to the Utilizing 

440
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:23,900
constraints to help people find 
exploration, sometimes to going 

441
00:25:23,900 --> 00:25:25,300
back to a little bit of the 
parenting stuff. 

442
00:25:25,300 --> 00:25:28,200
It's not just manipulating 
constraints but I find like 

443
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:32,400
oftentimes what I'm doing with 
my son is I'm educating his 

444
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:38,300
attention or I'm educating his 
attention or intention, sorry 

445
00:25:38,300 --> 00:25:40,900
educating his intention. 
And I think that's actually a 

446
00:25:40,900 --> 00:25:44,300
lot of times of like, hey, 
here's a constraint, like right 

447
00:25:44,300 --> 00:25:47,100
now, you can't Screaming or 
running around. 

448
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:52,000
So I have to re-educate his 
intention and try to take, you 

449
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:55,200
know, give him something else to
do else, something else to focus

450
00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:57,500
on. 
And I think that's, that's a lot

451
00:25:57,500 --> 00:26:00,400
of times to of like, I will 
oftentimes to say, to say to 

452
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:03,500
him, like not right now. 
I'm not telling you not forever 

453
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:05,500
and there might be a certain 
situation which you can do this 

454
00:26:05,500 --> 00:26:07,200
thing. 
But that thing is not right now,

455
00:26:07,900 --> 00:26:11,300
you know, and so like and is 
trying to figure out how to help

456
00:26:11,300 --> 00:26:14,900
him a tune to what is the 
specifying information in the 

457
00:26:14,900 --> 00:26:17,000
environment. 
Ain't that he can regulate his 

458
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:19,800
behavior on that, he can find a 
good fit, you know. 

459
00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:24,200
And I think that this is where 
like to me, like, I'm having fun

460
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:27,700
parenting, because like 
ecological Dynamics is just, 

461
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:32,100
it's omnipresent, you could say,
like, it works in all situations

462
00:26:32,300 --> 00:26:34,700
and so, like same thing with, 
with our players of like 

463
00:26:34,900 --> 00:26:38,800
sometimes it's it is, we are 
trying to help them. 

464
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:42,700
Like you're saying like, Okay 
how we adopt more of a get to 

465
00:26:42,700 --> 00:26:45,100
mindset. 
And so how do we facilitate 

466
00:26:45,100 --> 00:26:47,300
that? 
Or Like once when somebody is 

467
00:26:47,300 --> 00:26:49,600
like, you know, interacting with
the environment, we don't see 

468
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:53,300
that behavior or whatever. 
Like how do we how do we help 

469
00:26:53,300 --> 00:26:58,000
them by educating potentially 
their attention towards? 

470
00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:02,700
Like some sort of information 
that will help them educate. 

471
00:27:02,700 --> 00:27:05,500
Their intention more towards. 
I get to vs. 

472
00:27:05,500 --> 00:27:10,800
I have to You know, for sure. 
And we probably should be 

473
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:12,700
careful not rerecord the episode
here. 

474
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:17,000
Anyways, I hope you enjoyed 
today's podcast since one of the

475
00:27:17,900 --> 00:27:21,200
topics that we like to explore a
lot when it comes to coaching. 

476
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:26,600
And in some of our 
conversations, Garrett, we've 

477
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:29,100
talked about play and 
exploration. 

478
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,800
And I came across this video the
other day. 

479
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:39,000
I figured it might be something 
good to talk about, and how we 

480
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:43,100
can incorporate play into our 
own practice. 

481
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:52,200
Yeah, what makes a good coach, 
right? 

482
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:54,000
That's you. 
Yeah, at the heart of what I'm 

483
00:27:54,100 --> 00:27:57,800
interested in when I thought 
about this years ago on well, 

484
00:27:57,800 --> 00:27:59,700
the first thing that makes a 
great coach. 

485
00:28:00,900 --> 00:28:03,300
So I think actually that's 
that's the better topic. 

486
00:28:03,300 --> 00:28:04,600
What? 
Makes a great coach. 

487
00:28:04,700 --> 00:28:09,400
It's been a minute since I 
listened to this but I wonder I 

488
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:15,700
wonder maybe we should start 
there with. that question for 

489
00:28:15,700 --> 00:28:22,400
you, what makes a good coach If 
I were to say it's been an 

490
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,800
evolving evolving topic a lot 
and I think he'll get into it a 

491
00:28:25,808 --> 00:28:28,400
little bit. 
Do I know we both have watch 

492
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:32,800
this video but originally is 
very much, the guy with the best

493
00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:35,500
information. 
I think I've at least that was 

494
00:28:35,500 --> 00:28:37,100
my vision and that's what I 
chased. 

495
00:28:37,100 --> 00:28:40,400
I chased like he's the best 
information and all these 

496
00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,400
different theories and all these
different ways to maybe apply 

497
00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:45,200
these theories. 
And how can I make my players? 

498
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:48,800
The absolute best physically. 
And then I won't even say just 

499
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:51,200
That's a mentally, too. 
I mean, obviously, I don't mean 

500
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,500
the sport psychology, got the 
master's degree and as I got me 

501
00:28:54,500 --> 00:28:58,000
of my players, the best 
information, but at the end of 

502
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:01,700
the day, what I noticed is I 
made the best information. 

503
00:29:01,700 --> 00:29:06,400
But if guys aren't willing to 
listen or have a desire to truly

504
00:29:07,300 --> 00:29:09,900
be a speak poached by me and I 
know that's a big key to portal 

505
00:29:09,900 --> 00:29:11,300
topic. 
It's like when you find a good 

506
00:29:11,300 --> 00:29:12,900
coach, you don't care what he's 
teaching you. 

507
00:29:12,900 --> 00:29:14,400
You just don't learn whatever 
you wants to teach you. 

508
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:16,900
You're going to you're going to 
pick it up and what makes that 

509
00:29:17,500 --> 00:29:20,000
so appealing, why do you care? 
Even if it's not information you

510
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:22,000
wanted us to learn. 
If you find that good coach, 

511
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:23,000
you're going to want to learn 
from them. 

512
00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,300
And I think it one has to do 
with a relationship. 

513
00:29:25,900 --> 00:29:29,700
I think it's the ability to 
connect deeply and then to speak

514
00:29:29,700 --> 00:29:36,000
in a way of connecting, not just
to, I guess, the surface level, 

515
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:39,400
but more deeply and terms of 
like, I know we can get into 

516
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,900
like a deep diving like 
narrative and all that by 

517
00:29:41,900 --> 00:29:45,600
speaking with into their life, 
the no manner of story and 

518
00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:49,300
connecting to their their lives 
in certain ways that is Beyond 

519
00:29:49,300 --> 00:29:51,600
well, beyond baseball or 
necessary, the crap. 

520
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:55,100
And I think that's become become
overly apparent. 

521
00:29:55,100 --> 00:29:57,800
Its comes relationship. 
And really speaking of that 

522
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:01,000
person's life in a way, that can
connect not just on the baseball

523
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:03,400
side, but in the Life side, 
those were I've kind of gone 

524
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:08,300
with it as far as what makes 
good coach. yeah, it for myself 

525
00:30:08,300 --> 00:30:16,300
early on it was Similar to you 
in like information. 

526
00:30:16,300 --> 00:30:20,300
But for me it was a coach that 
got their athletes to perform 

527
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:24,000
and then the information, what 
was a part of that. 

528
00:30:24,500 --> 00:30:25,900
But it was more technique 
focused. 

529
00:30:25,900 --> 00:30:30,700
At least for me, like my mind 
was focused on my guys are going

530
00:30:30,700 --> 00:30:33,100
to have the best technique. 
And because we have better 

531
00:30:33,100 --> 00:30:35,200
technique, we're going to go out
there and we're going to perform

532
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:37,700
better, but then then the other 
team. 

533
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:42,500
And so that's kind of the main 
thing that I was chasing. 

534
00:30:42,700 --> 00:30:46,800
More was trying to learn the 
best techniques out there for 

535
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:52,200
ways of doing things. 
And now it's it's in some ways 

536
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:57,200
similar. 
I really liked the quote, the 

537
00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:02,000
best leader when his job is 
done, you know, is a match Eve, 

538
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:07,100
'd:wz people or his or their 
players will, basically say we 

539
00:31:07,100 --> 00:31:10,400
did it ourselves. 
And so that that is kind of been

540
00:31:11,100 --> 00:31:14,300
the Kind of more how I've 
thought about it. 

541
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:20,200
Lately is like, how do I get the
athlete to have more ownership 

542
00:31:20,300 --> 00:31:23,800
to essentially? 
I'm just their facilitating. 

543
00:31:25,900 --> 00:31:29,400
How to, how do I get them to 
basically, like Discover it for 

544
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:31,100
themselves? 
And I'm just facilitating, I 

545
00:31:31,100 --> 00:31:35,900
think that for me, the hard part
about that though is walking 

546
00:31:35,900 --> 00:31:38,500
that balance or at least I have 
this fear. 

547
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:46,000
That by doing so. 
I will basically not be valuable

548
00:31:46,100 --> 00:31:49,400
or the players won't players or 
other coaches won't see me as 

549
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:53,400
valuable because if you're doing
your job really well, your might

550
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:56,500
not be noticed. 
And and then how do you 

551
00:31:56,508 --> 00:32:00,800
differentiate not being noticed 
because you're doing a bad job 

552
00:32:01,100 --> 00:32:03,500
versus not being noticed because
you're doing a good job. 

553
00:32:03,500 --> 00:32:07,600
And so for me that's that's one 
of the things that I think I'm 

554
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:15,000
struggling to figure out how to 
How to kind of bridge that and I

555
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,900
do think it's kind of goes along
with what you were saying of 

556
00:32:19,500 --> 00:32:22,500
really. 
It's about relationships and 

557
00:32:22,500 --> 00:32:27,200
then, if you build a strong 
relationship with the players 

558
00:32:27,300 --> 00:32:32,800
with the athletes, then, you 
know that in a way, the players 

559
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:38,100
will value you, but I do think 
like, a good coaches is one that

560
00:32:38,100 --> 00:32:45,100
players look up to that connect.
With and, you know, someone that

561
00:32:45,100 --> 00:32:50,200
they actually want to be around.
But yeah those are those are 

562
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,700
kind of Maya. 
Initial thoughts. 

563
00:32:52,700 --> 00:32:57,000
I also think too. 
One other small ad before we 

564
00:32:57,300 --> 00:33:02,900
continue, the video is a coach. 
A good coach gets you to think. 

565
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:10,300
And helps you connect things and
discover new insights. 

566
00:33:11,900 --> 00:33:16,400
So I guess that's what I'll add.
As we continue here. 

567
00:33:17,500 --> 00:33:21,100
Is actually caring deeply about 
helping the person in front of 

568
00:33:21,100 --> 00:33:24,200
them solve their problems. 
The second thing that matters 

569
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:27,600
deeply is having the knowledge 
to help them and the third thing

570
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,800
is having the Charisma that 
allows you to create the 

571
00:33:30,800 --> 00:33:34,100
connection in the can convince 
and persuade them. 

572
00:33:34,500 --> 00:33:39,000
Yep, you Click execute until 
said present and to be to attend

573
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:43,900
to the lecture. 
So I think that's a you got a 

574
00:33:43,900 --> 00:33:45,300
good. 
I'll actually want to back that 

575
00:33:45,300 --> 00:33:46,800
up and just do that one more 
time. 

576
00:33:46,900 --> 00:33:49,400
Yeah. 
Thing that makes a great coaches

577
00:33:49,700 --> 00:33:52,700
actually caring deeply about 
helping the person in front of 

578
00:33:52,700 --> 00:33:55,800
them, solve their problem. 
The second thing that matters 

579
00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:59,200
deeply is having the knowledge 
to help them and the third thing

580
00:33:59,300 --> 00:34:02,400
is having the Charisma that 
allows you to create the 

581
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:05,800
connection in the convince and 
persuade Add them. 

582
00:34:06,100 --> 00:34:08,699
Yep. 
You exclusively execute until 

583
00:34:08,699 --> 00:34:11,199
said present and to be to attend
to the lecture. 

584
00:34:11,500 --> 00:34:14,699
So yeah, very often, the thing, 
it makes somebody an 

585
00:34:14,699 --> 00:34:19,300
extraordinary coach is much less
to do with their awareness of 

586
00:34:19,300 --> 00:34:24,199
the optimization sets and Reps. 
Kim has more to do with their 

587
00:34:24,199 --> 00:34:29,900
ability to get in deep rapport 
with this point or the or the 

588
00:34:29,900 --> 00:34:31,600
athlete. 
I think that's all sir. 

589
00:34:35,500 --> 00:34:39,699
So, out of out of that, what, 
what, what things stood out to 

590
00:34:39,699 --> 00:34:43,199
you, to start? 
I mean, the first time I heard 

591
00:34:43,199 --> 00:34:45,699
that I was like, I actually did,
I literally did what you just 

592
00:34:45,699 --> 00:34:48,300
did right there for everybody is
literally listen back to it, 

593
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:50,699
being happy. 
I might have to do it one more 

594
00:34:50,699 --> 00:34:53,600
time but yeah. 
It's literally, it's really that

595
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:55,000
good. 
But I think I kind of, I think 

596
00:34:55,000 --> 00:35:01,500
it kind of comes back to the the
idea of the self-discovery and 

597
00:35:01,500 --> 00:35:04,200
guiding and almost like having 
that Charisma that deep 

598
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:06,300
relationship. 
And there were four to guide 

599
00:35:06,300 --> 00:35:12,600
that person into wanting to 
discover it bursts just wanting.

600
00:35:12,600 --> 00:35:15,800
And I think I've struggled with 
this at times where guys just 

601
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:19,000
want to be a lot of times just 
because of a culture is 

602
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,400
nowadays, this want to be fed 
the answer and they honestly 

603
00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:25,800
want to be taught or they don't 
want to learn per say they just 

604
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:27,600
want the, they want the 
solution. 

605
00:35:27,900 --> 00:35:29,500
They want you to tell you how 
it's done. 

606
00:35:29,700 --> 00:35:32,100
And kind of almost goes back a 
little bit, we talked to you 

607
00:35:32,107 --> 00:35:35,500
about but the like they think 
they did it themselves, it's 

608
00:35:35,500 --> 00:35:38,100
gonna be a stickier to hear 
scale is going to stick your 

609
00:35:38,100 --> 00:35:42,300
whatever, whatever you're trying
to teach them and working on 

610
00:35:42,300 --> 00:35:44,400
that self-discovery. 
How do you, how do you work? 

611
00:35:44,500 --> 00:35:46,100
And that's the, this is 
something I've been playing with

612
00:35:46,100 --> 00:35:47,700
a ton and how do you get to 
that? 

613
00:35:47,700 --> 00:35:53,200
Charisma, that wants them to 
learn and wants them to go and 

614
00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:55,800
inspires them? 
I think it's a good word, we use

615
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:58,000
a lot obviously, it's because I 
work Inspiration Academy. 

616
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:00,800
That's one of our big words 
Nathan, how do we go out and 

617
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:05,600
Spire them, but want and go and 
discover and try new things and 

618
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:09,300
play around with ideas and then 
work through this process first,

619
00:36:09,500 --> 00:36:14,600
I just I'm just looking for the 
answer and a lot of it is very 

620
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:17,300
much a skill on the coach's 
guide to be able to do that, 

621
00:36:17,300 --> 00:36:19,800
have that deep connection you'll
learn to do that. 

622
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:24,000
And it's it's not easy and 
there's a lot of times like they

623
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:26,600
don't necessarily play or may 
not want it and that's on. 

624
00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:27,700
I've been playing with a lot. 
Okay. 

625
00:36:27,700 --> 00:36:30,300
Well, if the player isn't want 
it, I now have to Go find a new 

626
00:36:30,300 --> 00:36:34,400
route to go have this person 
want to start their own journey 

627
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:37,600
and on this self-discovery path 
where they're, they're trying to

628
00:36:37,607 --> 00:36:40,400
learn on their own first, just 
like a wanted to answer even if 

629
00:36:40,408 --> 00:36:42,700
that's all they want. 
And the pretty adamant about 

630
00:36:42,700 --> 00:36:45,700
that and they keep he died. 
I've had people dig in a little 

631
00:36:45,700 --> 00:36:47,400
bit, just like, well, what is 
it? 

632
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:49,100
What, what am I, what? 
I do, what I need more. 

633
00:36:49,100 --> 00:36:51,500
What do I need to do here? 
What I need to do there first, 

634
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:53,800
okay? 
Well, let me start guiding you 

635
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:55,500
and then you start going on this
journey. 

636
00:36:55,500 --> 00:36:59,500
You play with these ideas. 
So I mean, I think he raps that.

637
00:36:59,700 --> 00:37:02,400
Up stove. 
So nicely on what action makes a

638
00:37:02,408 --> 00:37:05,200
good coach but playing with 
those Concepts, I know, I know 

639
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:07,400
you probably have it, I have I 
thought about him a lot trying 

640
00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,800
to like, how do I work this and 
how do I work this thing with my

641
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:12,300
own players? 
How do I get to that level? 

642
00:37:12,300 --> 00:37:15,600
But I know your thoughts on 
that. 

643
00:37:18,700 --> 00:37:21,900
So I love how you talked about 
Discovery. 

644
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:29,100
I think that is the thing of 
like how do we get them to have 

645
00:37:29,100 --> 00:37:32,400
this desire to discover the 
answer for themselves? 

646
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:36,800
Like this is this whole idea 
where coaches talk about like we

647
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:40,200
want players who are passionate.
Well we have to facilitate that 

648
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:46,400
I think a lot of Athletes given 
given kind of like our societal 

649
00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:51,700
background through the education
system, Etc. 

650
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:56,400
They This Joy of discovering 
things for yourself. 

651
00:37:56,900 --> 00:38:01,600
His skin has in some ways been 
trained out of are trained to 

652
00:38:01,600 --> 00:38:08,300
out of us and And I think 
that's, that's where we have to 

653
00:38:08,300 --> 00:38:09,900
figure out a way to help 
rekindle that. 

654
00:38:09,900 --> 00:38:13,900
I know that for myself in some 
ways that's when when the system

655
00:38:13,900 --> 00:38:18,600
rewards you for the right 
answer, you all you do is you 

656
00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:20,900
just only want right answers? 
And then when it when it 

657
00:38:20,900 --> 00:38:26,900
punishes you for wrong answers. 
And so To help guys kind of 

658
00:38:26,900 --> 00:38:30,900
discover. 
The answers. 

659
00:38:32,300 --> 00:38:37,000
You have to create a safe to 
fail environment where they feel

660
00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:39,400
safe to explore to make 
mistakes. 

661
00:38:40,300 --> 00:38:43,900
And then to kind of move on from
that, I was trying to look up a 

662
00:38:43,908 --> 00:38:48,500
quote from a book that I just 
recently listened to on 

663
00:38:48,500 --> 00:38:55,400
perception and the the note that
I had picked up on it, is that 

664
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:59,400
in order for people to actually 
understand things they have to, 

665
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:02,200
especially if we're talking 
about skill acquisition Mission.

666
00:39:02,300 --> 00:39:07,400
They actually have to have a 
role in creating it and so if 

667
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:12,600
you want to have guys, take 
ownership of their own 

668
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:18,800
development, then you actually 
have to allow athletes to have a

669
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:25,000
role in, or rather a say in how 
they how their their development

670
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:30,000
plan, or what they do to develop
as a player is. 

671
00:39:30,100 --> 00:39:35,200
And so I think people sometimes 
take this one of two ways they 

672
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:39,300
met. 
Then go completely hands-off and

673
00:39:39,300 --> 00:39:42,800
then players don't feel like 
they have any sort of structure 

674
00:39:43,300 --> 00:39:45,700
or the coach goes to Hands-On 
in. 

675
00:39:45,700 --> 00:39:48,300
There's way too much structure 
and they don't have any freedom 

676
00:39:48,300 --> 00:39:52,000
to have any input or say in 
terms of creating it themselves.

677
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:56,900
And so, I the way that I think 
about it is I need to provide 

678
00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:02,400
structure to allow the athlete 
to begin to explore because if 

679
00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:06,500
they have no idea what the 
concept is in terms of like 

680
00:40:06,500 --> 00:40:09,400
trying to discover, how do I go 
about trying to discover things?

681
00:40:10,300 --> 00:40:13,200
They may be paralyzed. 
Some guys may totally love it. 

682
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:16,500
I think the best analogy I can 
think of is one of my buddies 

683
00:40:16,700 --> 00:40:20,700
who used to do political 
campaigns or was worked on a 

684
00:40:20,700 --> 00:40:23,000
political campaign, traveled 
around the country. 

685
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:24,800
He Because he didn't have a lot 
of money. 

686
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:27,600
He was always eating at Subway 
and got really sick of eating 

687
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:34,600
Subway and he started saying to 
the to the Sandwich Artist. 

688
00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:36,200
I think that's what Subway 
called them. 

689
00:40:38,300 --> 00:40:41,700
Make me a sandwich, just believe
in yourself, make me anything 

690
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:46,600
you want and there would be two 
types of responses. 

691
00:40:46,700 --> 00:40:48,800
People who had completely freeze
and just ask them. 

692
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:53,000
Well do you like this or that? 
And he'd be like just make me. 

693
00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:57,900
Whatever you want. 
And some people do he said would

694
00:40:57,900 --> 00:41:00,700
just absolutely love it. 
Be like, oh, sweet, all right, 

695
00:41:00,700 --> 00:41:03,100
and they just go to town on it. 
So I think you're going to 

696
00:41:03,100 --> 00:41:05,900
you're going to run into a 
similar thing with with 

697
00:41:05,900 --> 00:41:07,300
athletes. 
Some athletes are going to love 

698
00:41:07,300 --> 00:41:08,700
it, they're going to be able to 
run with it. 

699
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:10,600
Other athletes are going to 
really freeze and so you're 

700
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:13,100
going to need to give them some 
sort of structure to be able to 

701
00:41:13,100 --> 00:41:18,400
begin to explore. 
And so that's that's kind of my 

702
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:21,500
thought in terms of trying to 
Foster this desire for 

703
00:41:21,500 --> 00:41:25,200
discovery, And this goes back to
what I think Rafe was talking 

704
00:41:25,200 --> 00:41:27,100
about at the beginning of 
building relationships. 

705
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:29,700
I think that's where, where I 
normally start, I always try to 

706
00:41:29,700 --> 00:41:33,100
find out when I, when I first 
talked to an athlete, I try to 

707
00:41:33,100 --> 00:41:36,300
figure out like, what are their 
main drivers or motivations when

708
00:41:36,300 --> 00:41:39,000
it comes to baseball, like, what
are their goals and aspirations?

709
00:41:39,900 --> 00:41:42,900
I think, if you don't even know 
those basic things, it's really 

710
00:41:42,900 --> 00:41:50,300
hard to help an athlete like you
because you don't if, or 

711
00:41:50,700 --> 00:41:53,000
essentially you're working with 
the athlete blind as far as 

712
00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:54,500
like, what their motivations 
are. 

713
00:41:54,500 --> 00:41:57,000
And so trying to figure out 
like, what are the main 

714
00:41:57,300 --> 00:42:03,100
motivations for why the athlete 
is playing, I think, really 

715
00:42:03,100 --> 00:42:05,700
hampers your ability to connect 
with that athlete. 

716
00:42:05,900 --> 00:42:08,000
So that's normally where I 
start. 

717
00:42:10,100 --> 00:42:13,900
Do you ever feel or have you 
ever had the experience has just

718
00:42:13,900 --> 00:42:15,600
kind of playing off of that? 
There's a couple things like 

719
00:42:15,700 --> 00:42:16,900
I've kind of circle back to 
here. 

720
00:42:16,900 --> 00:42:21,100
But first one, have you ever had
athletes where you almost have 

721
00:42:21,100 --> 00:42:23,200
to take them through a 
self-discovery process of what 

722
00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:25,100
their aspirations are? 
Even like why are they even 

723
00:42:25,100 --> 00:42:27,500
playing the first place? 
So I feel like I've had that 

724
00:42:27,500 --> 00:42:30,700
right off the get-go where they 
don't even know and then I 

725
00:42:30,707 --> 00:42:33,300
almost have to guide them 
through a little journey of like

726
00:42:33,300 --> 00:42:35,300
why are you even playing the 
game and what are you actually 

727
00:42:35,300 --> 00:42:37,300
trying to accomplish? 
Why are you doing what you're 

728
00:42:37,300 --> 00:42:39,300
doing? 
Why are you going to have? 

729
00:42:39,300 --> 00:42:41,300
You had heavy. 
Had any experiences of that kind

730
00:42:41,300 --> 00:42:43,100
of like having to take them 
right off the right off the 

731
00:42:43,107 --> 00:42:44,900
get-go into that that 
self-discovery. 

732
00:42:45,500 --> 00:42:48,500
I mean I've definitely 
experienced what you're talking 

733
00:42:48,500 --> 00:42:51,100
about and getting kind of some 
vague answers. 

734
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:54,600
Yeah and even as I was kind of 
describing this I was thinking 

735
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,800
about what kind of other 
questions could I ask other than

736
00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:01,400
the stand standard like you 
know, how are you doing today 

737
00:43:01,500 --> 00:43:07,000
type of a question, you know, 
i-i've you that question of You 

738
00:43:07,008 --> 00:43:10,100
know like what are your goals 
you know with baseball you know 

739
00:43:10,100 --> 00:43:11,800
what are you what are you hoping
to achieve? 

740
00:43:12,100 --> 00:43:18,200
I almost think to then to go 
back to this this idea of play 

741
00:43:18,700 --> 00:43:25,100
enchantment asking like what was
was one of your favorite moments

742
00:43:25,400 --> 00:43:31,000
playing the game like and and I 
could be playing the game or 

743
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:35,600
just like what's Tell me, tell 
me one of your favorite baseball

744
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:38,600
moments and that could that 
might not even have to do with 

745
00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:39,800
them playing the game 
themselves. 

746
00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:43,800
That could simply be a baseball 
moment something that they've 

747
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:46,800
seen on another team whether 
it's professional Little League 

748
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:50,500
Etc. 
And I think that would give you 

749
00:43:50,500 --> 00:43:54,600
better insight into maybe what 
motivates them. 

750
00:43:56,400 --> 00:44:00,200
Yeah, that's really good. 
Um, not that I was gonna, I was 

751
00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:02,900
gonna ask though to, like, how 
how have you thought about 

752
00:44:02,900 --> 00:44:06,600
bridging that that issue when 
you run into that? 

753
00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:11,900
Yeah, a lot of it I think is, I 
want to make it sound like a 

754
00:44:11,900 --> 00:44:13,800
cop-out answer, but 
conversation, dependent, and 

755
00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:16,600
player dependent. 
And a lot of times, it's more 

756
00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:20,300
of, like, I'm trying to 
facilitate a journey where I'm 

757
00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:23,200
like, very carefully on in the 
moment, like, trying to 

758
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:27,000
intentionally, ask them 
questions of Really trying to 

759
00:44:27,000 --> 00:44:29,300
see and I think one of them is 
what are some of your favorite 

760
00:44:29,300 --> 00:44:30,600
moments. 
Like, I've definitely gone down 

761
00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:34,100
that route like connecting to 
like the bright spots of 

762
00:44:34,100 --> 00:44:36,700
baseball or maybe overcoming 
failure. 

763
00:44:36,700 --> 00:44:39,600
And I've gone down that right 
that route a little bit. 

764
00:44:39,800 --> 00:44:42,100
Something that makes you feel 
kind of like almost like a hero 

765
00:44:42,100 --> 00:44:45,600
archetype in a way like you over
overcame something within within

766
00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:50,000
the game and you like you felt 
you felt this, this a borderline

767
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:53,600
heroism, where you you were the 
you were the hero of the game or

768
00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:55,900
like you did something great for
your tribe. 

769
00:44:55,900 --> 00:45:00,700
Your He so I think I think that 
becomes a big piece of piece of 

770
00:45:00,700 --> 00:45:01,700
essence. 
That's where I think you start 

771
00:45:01,700 --> 00:45:04,700
finding meaning within the game 
or why you're going about. 

772
00:45:04,700 --> 00:45:08,900
Then that's like the question I 
always had with our larger 

773
00:45:08,900 --> 00:45:11,500
pictures last year. 
American International was like,

774
00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:14,700
first thing I would ask is like,
why why do you play the game? 

775
00:45:15,300 --> 00:45:18,000
And I tried to do in a group 
setting up first, and I got all 

776
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:20,500
those vague answers and they're 
all really weak. 

777
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:23,200
And then we have conversations 
later on and I was like, none of

778
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:25,900
that your answer. 
Do you think your answer would 

779
00:45:25,900 --> 00:45:26,700
take? 
Take you through now. 

780
00:45:26,700 --> 00:45:30,000
You're now you're struggling, 
real bad and and you're 

781
00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:33,000
currently on a streak where 
you're a spiff teen right now. 

782
00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:36,500
Like your girlfriend's, not very
happy with you guys are 

783
00:45:36,500 --> 00:45:40,100
struggling a relationship, 
you're having trouble back home 

784
00:45:40,300 --> 00:45:42,600
and nothing's going, right? 
Do you think that answer would 

785
00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:45,000
keep you in the game and just 
kind of like, you think you 

786
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:47,400
would keep really pushing hard 
for the game and all these 

787
00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:50,000
circumstances and then you kind 
of get some at least thinking 

788
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:51,600
sometimes and start working 
down. 

789
00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:54,600
Like, I why am I actually doing 
all this, like, why am I putting

790
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:58,200
other things aside to focus? 
This on this at the time and 

791
00:45:58,200 --> 00:46:01,600
then a lot of stuff on cover 
some sometimes they realize that

792
00:46:01,600 --> 00:46:04,200
they don't love it as much as I 
think and they're just doing it 

793
00:46:04,200 --> 00:46:05,400
because they're doing it other 
times. 

794
00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:09,700
They don't on folds, beautiful 
picture of why they're actually 

795
00:46:09,700 --> 00:46:12,700
doing this and what experiences 
have led them to this. 

796
00:46:12,700 --> 00:46:16,100
And sometimes it's like I'm 
doing this because I could be 

797
00:46:16,100 --> 00:46:19,800
doing this or this or I could be
going down this path and this is

798
00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:21,500
taking me away from that path. 
I've seen it. 

799
00:46:21,500 --> 00:46:24,800
So it's been a lot of those a 
lot of those conversations. 

800
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:27,100
Honestly. 
If I talk about A rapport and 

801
00:46:27,100 --> 00:46:29,100
kind of foster that 
relationship, like brings you 

802
00:46:29,100 --> 00:46:30,900
into a deeper, understanding of 
them. 

803
00:46:31,300 --> 00:46:34,200
And then honestly, I usually get
pretty, pretty open during that 

804
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:36,700
conversation as well, but those 
honestly are some of my favorite

805
00:46:36,700 --> 00:46:38,700
conversation. 
That was athletes. 

806
00:46:38,700 --> 00:46:40,000
Just like, why are you playing 
this game? 

807
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:42,500
What's the meaning to you? 
Like, why why did you go through

808
00:46:42,500 --> 00:46:44,800
all the crap? 
You go through the training and 

809
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:47,200
the weight room on the feel all 
this extra time? 

810
00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:48,500
Like a borderline of job for 
you. 

811
00:46:48,500 --> 00:46:51,100
Right now, you could be making 
money like, why, why did this? 

812
00:46:51,700 --> 00:46:54,000
So I think that's really fun. 
Honestly, that's one of the fun 

813
00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:56,700
parts of coaching my opinion. 
No absolutely. 

814
00:46:56,700 --> 00:47:02,200
And it just reminds me of Simon 
cynics or Simon sinek. 

815
00:47:02,200 --> 00:47:04,000
I don't remember how you 
pronounce his last name 

816
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:07,500
correctly, but his whole book. 
Start with why. 

817
00:47:07,500 --> 00:47:10,800
Yes. 
And when you have a strong, why 

818
00:47:10,800 --> 00:47:17,100
you're able to endure a lot of 
adversity and I think, you know 

819
00:47:17,100 --> 00:47:21,100
what, one thing that is they 
don't like about the game. 

820
00:47:21,107 --> 00:47:24,700
Is that? 
It it gets us to face adversity 

821
00:47:24,700 --> 00:47:33,200
in a non oftentimes Nan. 
I want to say life-threatening 

822
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:38,600
but like a nun you know, like 
extremely like dangerous type of

823
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:43,000
situation and and that's that's 
where I think the value of our 

824
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:46,800
sport is because there's so much
failure because it is so 

825
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:52,800
difficult and I, you know, I saw
that a lot not a lot but I saw 

826
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:57,200
that a little bit in when I play
it like we had a very talented 

827
00:47:59,100 --> 00:48:02,300
Underclassmen come in and he was
always really good in high 

828
00:48:02,300 --> 00:48:06,500
school and he just ran into a 
little bit of struggle and it 

829
00:48:06,500 --> 00:48:10,600
was just hard for him because he
was such a really good athlete. 

830
00:48:10,700 --> 00:48:12,600
And so he ended up quitting and 
just running track because you 

831
00:48:12,600 --> 00:48:19,500
super fast and I think that's, 
that's where the game is, is 

832
00:48:19,500 --> 00:48:23,400
humbling in the sense that I 
mean they've been seeing that 

833
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:25,900
plenty of times to wear a 
player's, just really high in 

834
00:48:25,900 --> 00:48:30,800
themselves and then, Whether 
it's the next half of the Season

835
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:33,500
or the next season, then they 
get really humbled. 

836
00:48:34,200 --> 00:48:38,400
And there's, there's a level of 
having some respect for the game

837
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:44,800
in the and in, in a way, doing 
the things the right way, but I 

838
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:47,900
was going to go. 
So the looping back to starting 

839
00:48:47,900 --> 00:48:56,300
with y and for me, Why. 
It's It's so useful to ask that 

840
00:48:56,300 --> 00:48:59,400
question to find out what really
drives a player is, because then

841
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:04,300
I can better help them like I 
Now, understand or can think of 

842
00:49:04,300 --> 00:49:08,500
ways that I can actually connect
with them to actually help them.

843
00:49:08,500 --> 00:49:11,900
So, for example, I've been 
asking our players just getting 

844
00:49:11,900 --> 00:49:15,000
to know them, you know what 
their aspirations are and into, 

845
00:49:15,000 --> 00:49:17,800
I even ask like, post baseball, 
what are you, what are your 

846
00:49:17,800 --> 00:49:20,800
aspirations, you know, at one 
Spaceballs over and then 

847
00:49:20,900 --> 00:49:23,100
especially for the ones that are
looking to be coaches? 

848
00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:27,700
Whether that is a Baseball, 
coach or a strength coach like, 

849
00:49:27,800 --> 00:49:31,200
hey, I have all these resources,
you know, if you, you know, 

850
00:49:31,300 --> 00:49:34,500
these are things that I can. 
Then start having more 

851
00:49:34,500 --> 00:49:38,800
conversations with them. 
Maybe about more of the pedal. 

852
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:42,500
The theory was going to try to 
go for the word headed. 

853
00:49:42,500 --> 00:49:45,400
Headed gut, pedagogy headache, a
logical. 

854
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:50,400
But anyways, you know, we can 
start talking pedagogy and, and 

855
00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:52,900
theories and all this sort of 
stuff such like, you know, e 

856
00:49:52,900 --> 00:49:55,100
Cody. 
Because in some ways I I look at

857
00:49:55,100 --> 00:49:57,600
the next generation of coaches 
that are coming up. 

858
00:49:57,600 --> 00:50:00,000
If you can give them, they're 
the ones that are going to 

859
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:03,600
actually be able to change more 
so than the older ones on a 

860
00:50:03,607 --> 00:50:07,400
large scale. 
And so, I kind of look at them 

861
00:50:07,400 --> 00:50:12,200
as being like, Oh hey, we can, I
can actually, maybe get you to 

862
00:50:13,500 --> 00:50:15,200
look into e. 
Cody, get you started early 

863
00:50:15,200 --> 00:50:17,500
because I mean again, I think we
might have met talked about this

864
00:50:17,500 --> 00:50:18,900
before. 
A lot of coaches coach based 

865
00:50:18,900 --> 00:50:22,600
upon how they were coached in 
what they learned to as players.

866
00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:28,700
And so trying to expand their to
give to set them up because I 

867
00:50:28,707 --> 00:50:31,500
think one of the other things 
that I really struggled with. 

868
00:50:32,900 --> 00:50:35,600
Especially starting out, and why
I went the strength and 

869
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:39,800
conditioning route was. 
I didn't see any good baseball 

870
00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:43,100
mentors for me. 
It doesn't mean that there 

871
00:50:43,100 --> 00:50:47,400
aren't good baseball coaches. 
I just didn't know of outside of

872
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:49,900
like the coaches that I worked 
with in college. 

873
00:50:50,500 --> 00:50:53,300
I didn't know of a whole lot of 
other really good, baseball, 

874
00:50:53,300 --> 00:50:58,900
coaches, local ones that I could
go kind of Be mentored by. 

875
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:02,600
I did end up finding, you know, 
where I ended up? 

876
00:51:02,600 --> 00:51:05,500
Coaching High School like it was
a good, baseball mind and all 

877
00:51:05,500 --> 00:51:09,500
that sort of stuff. 
But, you know, it was, it was 

878
00:51:09,500 --> 00:51:11,300
really hard. 
And so that's part of the reason

879
00:51:11,300 --> 00:51:13,300
why I went the strength and 
conditioning route was, there 

880
00:51:13,300 --> 00:51:15,700
was just way more people out 
there. 

881
00:51:15,900 --> 00:51:19,500
There's it felt like it was much
easier to have conversations and

882
00:51:19,500 --> 00:51:24,000
like just reach out to people. 
There are a lot more clinics all

883
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:26,100
that sort of stuff. 
So I just felt like, for me, 

884
00:51:26,300 --> 00:51:29,300
that, that area was a lot more 
Progressive. 

885
00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:31,700
I think that was the main thing 
to was that it was a lot more 

886
00:51:31,700 --> 00:51:33,900
Progressive. 
That there weren't a ton of 

887
00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:37,700
baseball coaches out there. 
It just it felt like at least 

888
00:51:37,700 --> 00:51:40,900
where I was, you know, being in 
Minnesota that it just didn't 

889
00:51:40,900 --> 00:51:44,000
feel like there were a lot of 
other good baseball, coaches 

890
00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:47,500
around me that were really 
pushing the edge that had 

891
00:51:47,500 --> 00:51:50,800
something different to say than 
what I had been brought up with 

892
00:51:52,200 --> 00:51:55,700
Yeah, I think it's bad thing. 
I mean there's all these about 

893
00:51:55,700 --> 00:51:57,800
to unpack. 
What you want to three to get 

894
00:51:57,800 --> 00:52:00,800
rolling on the video? 
Again I don't I could keep 

895
00:52:00,800 --> 00:52:02,900
unpacking this but I also got 
this because some good stuff 

896
00:52:02,900 --> 00:52:04,500
coming up here. 
So this is true. 

897
00:52:04,500 --> 00:52:08,100
I do want to actually do the 
mentorship. 

898
00:52:08,100 --> 00:52:11,100
I like concept. 
I do want to actually explore 

899
00:52:11,100 --> 00:52:13,600
that a little bit more since 
we're on that topic and then 

900
00:52:13,600 --> 00:52:16,100
let's then maybe a loop back to 
the video. 

901
00:52:16,100 --> 00:52:20,000
Unless you, do you have anything
on the mentorship work? 

902
00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:22,400
Because because I've been 
thinking about this like, This 

903
00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:27,000
is to me, one of the things that
I think is a challenge right 

904
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:29,600
now. 
It is that element. 

905
00:52:31,600 --> 00:52:35,100
And I do think it's tied in with
this thing of play, so maybe, 

906
00:52:35,700 --> 00:52:37,800
all right. 
I want a, my yeah, we can 

907
00:52:37,800 --> 00:52:40,300
explore a little bit and then we
can probably about right back in

908
00:52:40,300 --> 00:52:41,800
these. 
I do think I do think it's bad 

909
00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:44,500
because I was almost going to go
down that route but I was like, 

910
00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:47,400
almost like attacking another 
topic, but I do see how it's 

911
00:52:47,400 --> 00:52:49,500
going to tie back in, but this 
was really cool. 

912
00:52:49,500 --> 00:52:51,900
So, and I think you'll 
appreciate this law. 

913
00:52:51,900 --> 00:52:54,400
So our Inspiration Academy, 
right? 

914
00:52:54,400 --> 00:52:56,800
I mean, obviously, I've already 
used Inspire like that was the 

915
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:58,700
root word of our, like, to 
inspire. 

916
00:52:58,700 --> 00:53:02,100
But one of the biggest things we
call ourselves a If that model 

917
00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:07,300
and hmm it's innovate Inspire or
Inspire and Val know which ones 

918
00:53:07,300 --> 00:53:09,500
to come first and then Mentor in
the whole point. 

919
00:53:09,500 --> 00:53:14,800
We call it mentor to model. 
I mean it's basically we say 

920
00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:16,200
it's technically discipleship 
model. 

921
00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:18,400
So if you're, if you're going to
look at the Biblical term, it's 

922
00:53:18,400 --> 00:53:20,700
discipleship, but we don't use 
the word discipleship, just a 

923
00:53:20,707 --> 00:53:23,900
little more understandable but 
it's same concept either way 

924
00:53:24,500 --> 00:53:28,000
where I'll actually have 
opportunity as a coach to be a 

925
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:31,100
mentor, over a select number of 
our own players. 

926
00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:35,000
And we're going through pretty 
much any topic and what's lost? 

927
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:37,400
I think in society, a lot is 
having good mentors. 

928
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:40,000
And I don't know if you and your
kind of talk about you can find 

929
00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:43,800
many in the baseball realm, but 
I personally was like starving 

930
00:53:43,800 --> 00:53:47,000
for good, older mentor. 
And it's something like I 

931
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:51,300
almost, I would intentionally 
would pray about just finding a 

932
00:53:51,300 --> 00:53:53,200
good Mentor. 
Like, somebody just come into my

933
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:55,300
life. 
And I never really saw that 

934
00:53:55,300 --> 00:53:58,400
happen and nobody like I always 
thought it'd be somebody like 

935
00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:01,300
coming to me and wanting to 
Mentor me and that's where I 

936
00:54:01,300 --> 00:54:03,400
think. 
I thought it would take me but I

937
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:06,900
found a lack of that and a huge 
lack of that to the point where 

938
00:54:06,900 --> 00:54:10,400
I started having to seek it out 
and it almost became more peers,

939
00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:12,700
mentors and peers at a certain 
point because I was more 

940
00:54:12,700 --> 00:54:15,500
comfortable like bringing some 
of the topics up to my own 

941
00:54:15,500 --> 00:54:17,800
peers, then maybe somebody 
that's a little older gone 

942
00:54:17,800 --> 00:54:20,800
through stuff. 
But you hear all these stories 

943
00:54:20,800 --> 00:54:24,100
of like this person was at this,
this mentor and I think I mean 

944
00:54:24,100 --> 00:54:26,200
I'm Simon sinek. 
I forget his exact story but I 

945
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:28,600
mean he had an incredible Mentor
early in his life that changed 

946
00:54:28,600 --> 00:54:32,100
the course of everything for him
and you hear those Those and I 

947
00:54:32,100 --> 00:54:33,300
was like, I don't have any of 
that. 

948
00:54:33,300 --> 00:54:37,700
So like, mentors mentors for me,
became podcast, became books and

949
00:54:37,700 --> 00:54:41,300
it's like you can be mentored by
that to an extent and I think 

950
00:54:41,300 --> 00:54:42,500
you can get a lot of good 
information. 

951
00:54:42,500 --> 00:54:45,100
I got to get wisdom but that 
human connection that 

952
00:54:45,100 --> 00:54:49,300
relationship that working 
one-on-one which I'm so blessed.

953
00:54:49,300 --> 00:54:52,300
I'm a school that prioritizes 
that and like I can be a mentor 

954
00:54:52,300 --> 00:54:54,700
and I'm part of another 
mentorship group where I have a 

955
00:54:54,700 --> 00:54:57,200
mental over me. 
So like we're continually 

956
00:54:57,200 --> 00:54:59,700
feeding into somebody's feeding 
into me and I'm peeing in 

957
00:54:59,700 --> 00:55:02,200
somebody else and their job is 
to Over mentors. 

958
00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:06,300
Over younger people will like my
post grads a lot of our mentors 

959
00:55:06,300 --> 00:55:09,000
over these younger, these 
younger groups of their school, 

960
00:55:09,000 --> 00:55:11,200
we have 12th, 12th graders, 
sixth graders. 

961
00:55:12,100 --> 00:55:15,900
So it's it's a unique model, I 
would say. 

962
00:55:16,500 --> 00:55:19,900
But something that I think is 
lost, and I think needs to 

963
00:55:20,000 --> 00:55:23,800
definitely needs to resurface 
and I see the need more than 

964
00:55:23,800 --> 00:55:26,800
ever to have quality mentors in 
your life. 

965
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:29,600
And like, I just saw the Gap Gap
in my own. 

966
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,000
And now I'm almost like, on the 
Ernie like one. 

967
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:33,300
How do I seek out a better 
mentor? 

968
00:55:33,300 --> 00:55:34,900
And that's a question. 
I pondered myself. 

969
00:55:34,900 --> 00:55:38,600
Like how do I take the 
initiative and seek somebody 

970
00:55:38,600 --> 00:55:39,800
out? 
Obviously, I'm in a model that 

971
00:55:39,800 --> 00:55:42,100
gave me one. 
But without that, how do I go 

972
00:55:42,100 --> 00:55:43,100
get one? 
And the other one. 

973
00:55:43,100 --> 00:55:46,400
How can I approach? 
Somebody intentionally work in 

974
00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:50,000
their lives in a semi formal 
way, but again it's life. 

975
00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:52,500
Never that formal, I don't think
so. 

976
00:55:52,500 --> 00:55:56,800
How can you work your way into? 
Like hey like I'm here for you? 

977
00:55:56,800 --> 00:56:00,100
Like I'll be we can talk about 
anything and stuff things like 

978
00:56:00,100 --> 00:56:01,200
that. 
I think it happens organically. 

979
00:56:01,300 --> 00:56:02,800
And coaching a little bit. 
But how do you be more 

980
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:04,600
intentional that those are? 
Those are kind of two questions 

981
00:56:04,600 --> 00:56:06,700
I played with a good bit through
this journey. 

982
00:56:07,700 --> 00:56:10,300
Yeah. 
And like you said, there's 

983
00:56:10,300 --> 00:56:15,200
there's a lot there to unpack. 
I mean, the first Can a thing 

984
00:56:15,200 --> 00:56:21,400
for me, you know, similarly, I 
was looking for for a mentor and

985
00:56:21,400 --> 00:56:24,800
was hoping that someone would 
take me under their wing and it 

986
00:56:24,800 --> 00:56:30,500
kind of helped me along and 
yeah, that didn't seemingly ever

987
00:56:30,500 --> 00:56:33,000
materialized. 
So to speak, it did more so on 

988
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:34,100
the strength and conditioning 
side. 

989
00:56:34,100 --> 00:56:37,800
And so you know there was at 
least for me it seemed like the 

990
00:56:37,800 --> 00:56:41,700
path was a lot clearer on the 
snc side it was you know 

991
00:56:41,700 --> 00:56:45,500
internships like I just heard 
that ERM very early on and, you 

992
00:56:45,508 --> 00:56:47,000
know, looking into cressey 
performance. 

993
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:50,900
And then I kind of saw that that
was the model, The Way Forward 

994
00:56:50,900 --> 00:56:53,500
of like kind of learning 
underneath other people and 

995
00:56:54,300 --> 00:56:59,000
then, and then from that, I 
eventually kind of found 

996
00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:02,500
somebody to Mentor me and I 
specifically asked like hey 

997
00:57:02,500 --> 00:57:04,300
would you mind mentoring me? 
But they showed the 

998
00:57:04,308 --> 00:57:08,200
characteristics that that made 
me comfortable enough to even 

999
00:57:08,200 --> 00:57:11,100
ask that because they, they were
interested in learning 

1000
00:57:11,100 --> 00:57:13,300
themselves. 
They were always continuing to 

1001
00:57:13,500 --> 00:57:16,200
grow themselves and then they 
were, they were willing to meet 

1002
00:57:16,200 --> 00:57:18,800
up and to teach me, you know, 
some of the things that they 

1003
00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:21,500
were doing. 
And so, I mean, the one thing 

1004
00:57:21,500 --> 00:57:24,800
that that I really really struck
me. 

1005
00:57:25,800 --> 00:57:29,800
In or when I was at crécy 
performance was the fact that 

1006
00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:35,600
they did in Services weekly and 
I find that that's not super 

1007
00:57:35,600 --> 00:57:37,500
common. 
And so when I think about it 

1008
00:57:37,500 --> 00:57:41,800
from the standpoint of You know,
you have some of these really 

1009
00:57:41,800 --> 00:57:46,000
good older, you know, older 
coaches like how often are you 

1010
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:49,400
having a weekly in service where
you're presenting on something 

1011
00:57:49,400 --> 00:57:51,800
and you're trying to teach your 
younger player? 

1012
00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:55,000
Something, you know, obviously, 
you know, oftentimes how it 

1013
00:57:55,000 --> 00:57:59,600
works in coaching staffs is that
you just have former players be 

1014
00:57:59,600 --> 00:58:01,700
your coaches, because they 
already know your system. 

1015
00:58:01,700 --> 00:58:07,500
You don't have to pour into them
as much and you know, I think 

1016
00:58:07,500 --> 00:58:11,000
there's some value to that, but 
at the same point there, you 

1017
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:17,200
know, I I always wanted more 
structure and that was one of 

1018
00:58:17,200 --> 00:58:19,900
the things that I liked it being
at the division, one level, like

1019
00:58:19,900 --> 00:58:25,600
there were more more weekly 
meetings and to try to get on 

1020
00:58:25,600 --> 00:58:28,800
the same page. 
And and for me that's I think 

1021
00:58:28,800 --> 00:58:30,900
that's important because 
otherwise you just have a bunch 

1022
00:58:30,900 --> 00:58:34,300
of people just showing up doing 
their own thing and you hope to 

1023
00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:37,500
at some level you know, 
everybody's doing stuff in 

1024
00:58:37,500 --> 00:58:39,700
parallel and at some level you 
hope that everything kind of 

1025
00:58:39,707 --> 00:58:45,700
converges and works together and
I don't Oftentimes there, you 

1026
00:58:45,700 --> 00:58:51,000
just have risks and I think that
hurts the player experience, but

1027
00:58:51,200 --> 00:58:54,700
I digress a little bit. 
I so that was kind of my 

1028
00:58:54,700 --> 00:58:59,200
experience though when it came 
to mentorships and trying to 

1029
00:58:59,200 --> 00:59:02,100
find a mentor. 
And so that is something that I 

1030
00:59:03,500 --> 00:59:07,000
I want to see if we could maybe 
potentially figure something out

1031
00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:11,900
on that front. 
And and that got me thinking 

1032
00:59:11,900 --> 00:59:16,400
about like a Wonder because when
it comes to mentorship you know 

1033
00:59:16,400 --> 00:59:19,400
I've heard this saying that I 
got it from Tai Lopez and I know

1034
00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:21,500
Ty Lopez got it from somebody 
else. 

1035
00:59:23,500 --> 00:59:28,200
But this idea of having like you
know of your relationships, 

1036
00:59:28,200 --> 00:59:31,700
having a third, being people who
are older and wiser than you 

1037
00:59:32,500 --> 00:59:35,400
that that are kind of mentoring 
you and then the peer-to-peer 

1038
00:59:35,400 --> 00:59:37,800
another third being cured of 
pure mentorship. 

1039
00:59:38,300 --> 00:59:41,300
I've been finding that when it 
comes to Baseball and skill 

1040
00:59:41,300 --> 00:59:44,000
acquisition. 
I end up doing a lot more 

1041
00:59:44,000 --> 00:59:48,100
peer-to-peer stuff and then and 
then you also then you have like

1042
00:59:48,300 --> 00:59:52,900
the other third of relationships
where you are mentoring people 

1043
00:59:52,900 --> 00:59:59,200
who are I guess not not at your 
level yet or younger and just 

1044
00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:04,100
up-and-coming more novices. 
It's so that that's always kind 

1045
01:00:04,100 --> 01:00:06,700
of stuck with me, but I've 
always seem to find that it's 

1046
01:00:06,700 --> 01:00:12,500
much harder to find the top that
top third Is is really the more 

1047
01:00:12,500 --> 01:00:17,700
difficult one? 
so, what I've been kind of 

1048
01:00:17,700 --> 01:00:24,400
thinking around this of like 
trying to help and facilitate 

1049
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:30,000
mentorship is in a way. 
I think just having a hub where 

1050
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:33,000
people can interact and so that 
there is a way for people to 

1051
01:00:33,008 --> 01:00:35,800
connect and just see who clicks 
with you. 

1052
01:00:36,700 --> 01:00:40,100
So I've been thinking about this
in terms of Discord and trying 

1053
01:00:40,100 --> 01:00:41,800
to do something with the Discord
that I have. 

1054
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:45,800
I don't know if you've heard of 
it Garrett, I put together this 

1055
01:00:45,800 --> 01:00:52,300
thing called the coaches. 
Was it the I love how I don't. 

1056
01:00:52,300 --> 01:00:55,500
I don't have it like memorize 
right off the top of my head 

1057
01:00:55,500 --> 01:00:57,600
right now. 
I don't II am I am part of it 

1058
01:00:57,600 --> 01:01:01,500
back like this board. 
That's the only thing I got, is 

1059
01:01:01,500 --> 01:01:04,700
it baseball coaches clubhouse as
sounds, right? 

1060
01:01:06,300 --> 01:01:10,800
I'm trying to look at my. 
Just had yeah. 

1061
01:01:10,800 --> 01:01:14,700
Baseball, coaches Clubhouse. 
So, so I got I'm thinking about 

1062
01:01:14,700 --> 01:01:18,100
trying to, by the time we 
release this, right? 

1063
01:01:18,100 --> 01:01:20,000
The, by the time we release 
this, maybe we'll have something

1064
01:01:20,000 --> 01:01:22,600
in there. 
The plan is to start doing 

1065
01:01:22,600 --> 01:01:25,200
something with with the 
baseball, coaches Clubhouse, to 

1066
01:01:25,800 --> 01:01:27,400
create a place to connect 
people. 

1067
01:01:27,400 --> 01:01:30,100
And then also to Foster 
mentorship. 

1068
01:01:30,200 --> 01:01:36,800
Whether it's peer-to-peer, or I 
want to say What's a what's a 

1069
01:01:36,808 --> 01:01:40,000
better word peer-to-peer and 
then you have your wise mentor 

1070
01:01:40,000 --> 01:01:43,000
to mentee older older to 
younger? 

1071
01:01:43,100 --> 01:01:44,500
Yeah. 
Type of a deal. 

1072
01:01:44,500 --> 01:01:48,300
Wiser to less lies, we'll figure
out her. 

1073
01:01:48,900 --> 01:01:52,700
Yep, yep. 
But that's, that's kind of my 

1074
01:01:52,700 --> 01:01:55,800
goal there with or one of the 
other goals with with the 

1075
01:01:55,808 --> 01:02:01,000
baseball, coaches Clubhouse is 
is to provide a way for people 

1076
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:04,300
to connect for mentorship. 
I've seen this in In. 

1077
01:02:04,300 --> 01:02:12,700
So, Joel Credo, has as a big 
group me chat and, you know, 

1078
01:02:12,700 --> 01:02:15,700
people seem to connect, or just 
start rant like, serendipitous 

1079
01:02:15,700 --> 01:02:17,600
conversations in there. 
And that's, that's kind of the 

1080
01:02:17,600 --> 01:02:20,200
hope of starting serendipitous 
conversations and just kind of 

1081
01:02:20,200 --> 01:02:22,800
see who you naturally gravitate 
towards. 

1082
01:02:24,600 --> 01:02:29,100
But there's, there's this idea 
too that I think might come up 

1083
01:02:29,100 --> 01:02:33,000
with what Rafe and John Vicki 
are kind of talking about here 

1084
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:36,700
when it comes to play. and so, I
think this is a good segue to 

1085
01:02:36,700 --> 01:02:41,700
jump back over to the video 
because When it comes to growth,

1086
01:02:42,100 --> 01:02:44,900
I really think play is an 
important piece to that will 

1087
01:02:44,900 --> 01:02:46,700
kind of expand upon that here in
a second. 

1088
01:02:46,800 --> 01:02:50,000
Yeah, so I mean, I'm right up 
against this with trying to 

1089
01:02:50,000 --> 01:02:52,800
articulate what makes somebody a
good teacher and it's can't 

1090
01:02:52,800 --> 01:02:57,600
replace the wise use of Charisma
with just the, you know, the 

1091
01:02:57,600 --> 01:02:59,700
methodological application of 
technique. 

1092
01:02:59,700 --> 01:03:02,400
It's just not the same. 
Something happened to Media. 

1093
01:03:03,300 --> 01:03:08,800
All right, we got a, we got to, 
but God, I cover, just what he 

1094
01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:09,800
just said there. 
R. 

1095
01:03:12,300 --> 01:03:15,800
So I do want to back this up a 
little bit and talk I suppose we

1096
01:03:15,800 --> 01:03:18,600
got to talk a little bit about 
Charisma because I think that's 

1097
01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:22,200
one thing that we left out of 
those those those three pieces. 

1098
01:03:22,200 --> 01:03:24,600
So I think the first one that 
Rafe talked about was 

1099
01:03:24,600 --> 01:03:29,700
relationships and then the the 
second one was knowledge and 

1100
01:03:29,700 --> 01:03:35,200
then the third piece was 
Charisma to kind of pull all 

1101
01:03:35,200 --> 01:03:39,300
that in. 
And for myself, that is 

1102
01:03:39,300 --> 01:03:42,400
something that I really feel 
like I struggle, With is 

1103
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:46,400
charisma like to you? 
What how do you define Charisma?

1104
01:03:47,500 --> 01:03:52,600
But maybe describe someone who 
is very charismatic person to 

1105
01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:55,600
you. 
I think about a personal level 

1106
01:03:55,600 --> 01:04:00,400
here. 
I know I've interacted with kind

1107
01:04:00,400 --> 01:04:02,900
of think of a good example of 
somebody. 

1108
01:04:02,900 --> 01:04:05,500
I mean, I think when I think of 
charismatic I guess right off 

1109
01:04:05,500 --> 01:04:08,000
the rip. 
I think of like a very know, 

1110
01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:09,900
like a like a Pete, Carroll 
maybe. 

1111
01:04:10,300 --> 01:04:12,300
Like and I know, I know players 
love him. 

1112
01:04:12,300 --> 01:04:15,300
He's a very charismatic coach 
and I think he connects with a 

1113
01:04:15,308 --> 01:04:19,700
lot of players and he shows is 
your dad like, I mean for him. 

1114
01:04:19,700 --> 01:04:23,200
His care how we kind of displays
as like extreme passion 

1115
01:04:23,400 --> 01:04:27,100
excitement and I know he's been 
known as like a player's coach 

1116
01:04:27,700 --> 01:04:31,900
and he's very much very much for
his as for his players and he 

1117
01:04:31,900 --> 01:04:36,200
like gets extreme buy-in and 
almost like creates like he kind

1118
01:04:36,200 --> 01:04:38,300
of I know, Ray path. 
I thought it kind of creates 

1119
01:04:38,300 --> 01:04:41,200
those connections because of his
great Charisma. 

1120
01:04:42,700 --> 01:04:44,700
I think you're almost like any 
other side if you stay in 

1121
01:04:44,700 --> 01:04:46,100
football. 
Example, like Bill Belichick's 

1122
01:04:46,100 --> 01:04:49,300
actually opposite. 
You may not like I think in a 

1123
01:04:49,300 --> 01:04:52,300
traditional sense at least my 
brain if we went quickly go like

1124
01:04:52,300 --> 01:04:54,300
that's a charismatic Coast. 
But I think he isn't it just 

1125
01:04:54,300 --> 01:04:56,800
that a different way. 
And I think players talked to 

1126
01:04:56,800 --> 01:04:58,900
him in a similar light as be 
careful what they look 

1127
01:04:58,900 --> 01:05:01,900
completely different. 
But they're both able to create 

1128
01:05:01,900 --> 01:05:06,200
those connections to encourage 
their players to run their 

1129
01:05:06,200 --> 01:05:08,900
certain system completely 
different, how they how they 

1130
01:05:08,900 --> 01:05:11,600
play. 
But at the end of the day, 

1131
01:05:11,600 --> 01:05:15,100
they're both encouraging 
creating connections and getting

1132
01:05:15,100 --> 01:05:19,800
their players to play in a very,
very specific system and a very 

1133
01:05:19,800 --> 01:05:22,400
specific way and they're both 
having extreme success doing it.

1134
01:05:23,700 --> 01:05:27,700
So to me, it's a little little 
more out of egg side, but I 

1135
01:05:27,707 --> 01:05:30,000
think you see it displayed in 
different. 

1136
01:05:30,100 --> 01:05:31,600
Current ways. 
If you're kind of, if you're 

1137
01:05:31,600 --> 01:05:41,500
going to follow what I'm saying,
that yeah, and when I think of 

1138
01:05:42,000 --> 01:05:46,700
Charisma almost think of like 
personality, the person has a 

1139
01:05:46,700 --> 01:05:50,500
very Magnetic Personality into 
your points. 

1140
01:05:50,800 --> 01:05:53,900
You know, it can manifest itself
in in a couple of different 

1141
01:05:53,900 --> 01:06:00,900
ways, it can, it can be someone 
who is very outgoing, you could 

1142
01:06:00,900 --> 01:06:03,200
say, extroverted type 
personality. 

1143
01:06:03,600 --> 01:06:06,900
But some introverted personality
is because it sounded like Bill 

1144
01:06:06,900 --> 01:06:10,200
Belichick his personality sound,
a little bit more introverted. 

1145
01:06:11,000 --> 01:06:16,200
And that can still have a 
similar pull and I guess for 

1146
01:06:16,200 --> 01:06:19,400
myself, it's trying to figure 
out what is that personality 

1147
01:06:19,400 --> 01:06:22,500
because or what it for me, I've 
always struggled with like, 

1148
01:06:23,500 --> 01:06:26,800
okay, how can I have good 
Charisma? 

1149
01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:31,200
I always felt like to, it was a 
form of manipulation and in a 

1150
01:06:31,207 --> 01:06:36,400
way it is but That's I had to 
work through that. 

1151
01:06:36,400 --> 01:06:39,200
In terms of, if my goal is to 
help people get to where they 

1152
01:06:39,200 --> 01:06:43,600
want to go, then, is it really 
necessarily manipulation if it's

1153
01:06:43,600 --> 01:06:47,600
the thing that helps move things
forward in terms of, you know, I

1154
01:06:47,607 --> 01:06:51,000
used to look at physical touch 
as being a way that, you know, 

1155
01:06:51,000 --> 01:06:53,300
people would, you know, used to 
manipulate you. 

1156
01:06:53,400 --> 01:06:54,800
And then I started realizing 
well. 

1157
01:06:55,400 --> 01:06:58,500
People actually don't like, you 
could give them all the right 

1158
01:06:58,500 --> 01:07:01,200
information but they won't feel 
right about it. 

1159
01:07:01,200 --> 01:07:04,300
If you don't have like, if you 
don't shake on it, like that. 

1160
01:07:04,500 --> 01:07:07,200
It was, I was listening to a 
story of how, you know deals 

1161
01:07:07,200 --> 01:07:09,400
would fall through simply 
because somebody didn't take the

1162
01:07:09,400 --> 01:07:12,800
other person's hand and it just 
went to show the importance of 

1163
01:07:12,800 --> 01:07:16,800
physical touch it. 
And you know, the handshake is 

1164
01:07:16,800 --> 01:07:20,400
not the same as like pulling 
somebody in clothes and put on 

1165
01:07:20,400 --> 01:07:22,800
your hand around their shoulder,
you know, where to me, that 

1166
01:07:22,800 --> 01:07:26,700
that's always felt manipulative.
I was like, oh well, if if all 

1167
01:07:26,700 --> 01:07:29,900
the rest of the, this physical 
touch works the same way and 

1168
01:07:29,900 --> 01:07:33,000
just the fact that I've always 
taken physical touch, you know, 

1169
01:07:33,000 --> 01:07:35,700
even the way that I say that, 
Just sounds like it's very 

1170
01:07:36,600 --> 01:07:40,000
intimate which in a way it is 
but like that's the thing of 

1171
01:07:40,300 --> 01:07:41,900
when it comes to human 
connection. 

1172
01:07:41,900 --> 01:07:45,600
Like we need something to Anchor
to make it feel palatable. 

1173
01:07:45,600 --> 01:07:48,400
It just can't be logically 
correct? 

1174
01:07:48,400 --> 01:07:50,700
That's just not how we as humans
operate. 

1175
01:07:50,700 --> 01:07:54,400
And so once I understood that, 
oh, if I want somebody to 

1176
01:07:54,400 --> 01:07:57,400
actually accept something then I
actually have to deliver it in 

1177
01:07:57,400 --> 01:07:59,400
such a way that they will 
actually accept it. 

1178
01:07:59,600 --> 01:08:02,500
And so having Charisma having 
something that may seem 

1179
01:08:02,500 --> 01:08:06,200
manipulative actually is not 
It's the way it's the form. 

1180
01:08:06,200 --> 01:08:12,400
It's the currency by which we 
actually connect and adopt new 

1181
01:08:12,400 --> 01:08:20,200
ways of interacting and so. 
That that for me, helped me kind

1182
01:08:20,200 --> 01:08:22,399
of to shift my mind a little bit
on Charisma. 

1183
01:08:22,399 --> 01:08:26,500
But I guess the other part of 
Charisma that I think I've also 

1184
01:08:26,500 --> 01:08:31,300
struggled with is this idea of 
confidence, especially when for 

1185
01:08:31,300 --> 01:08:34,000
me, I don't want to ever like 
lie to athletes and give them a 

1186
01:08:34,000 --> 01:08:36,500
false picture of some things. 
And now the way that I've 

1187
01:08:38,500 --> 01:08:42,500
Rationalized it is sometimes 
they can't hit like I only got 

1188
01:08:42,500 --> 01:08:46,000
to give sometimes, I can't over 
inundate you with information, 

1189
01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:50,600
but what ended up happening, 
though, before is by not trying 

1190
01:08:50,600 --> 01:08:54,300
to lie to players and give them 
a false sense of like, hey, if 

1191
01:08:54,300 --> 01:08:56,500
you throw away, two balls, 
you're going to throw harder, 

1192
01:08:57,200 --> 01:08:59,700
you know, just throw these as 
hard as you can, you know, and 

1193
01:08:59,700 --> 01:09:02,899
just keep it as simple as that 
and like this be the end-all 

1194
01:09:02,899 --> 01:09:09,600
be-all or like what was for me? 
true at one point in time was 

1195
01:09:09,600 --> 01:09:11,700
just getting the weight room, 
you'll get better like old lift 

1196
01:09:11,700 --> 01:09:16,800
weights and It turns out the 
answer is way more nuanced than 

1197
01:09:16,800 --> 01:09:21,100
that and in the effort to get 
kids to do things that are going

1198
01:09:21,100 --> 01:09:23,399
to be for their best, infant it 
interest. 

1199
01:09:23,399 --> 01:09:28,700
Sometimes we oversell the merits
of a thing and then what 

1200
01:09:28,700 --> 01:09:31,300
inadvertently happens like, yes,
you get the buy-in right now, 

1201
01:09:31,300 --> 01:09:35,500
but the danger that I've always 
seen is that you get to buy in 

1202
01:09:35,500 --> 01:09:38,200
now. 
But then later on, they overdo 

1203
01:09:38,200 --> 01:09:41,100
it because they're running with 
that idea, and now, there's now 

1204
01:09:41,100 --> 01:09:43,399
they're becoming a weight room 
athlete, and now they're getting

1205
01:09:43,399 --> 01:09:44,399
better. 
At the weight room and they're 

1206
01:09:44,399 --> 01:09:46,200
not getting any better out on 
the field. 

1207
01:09:46,399 --> 01:09:52,100
And so this is, this is for me 
why I often times felt like I 

1208
01:09:52,100 --> 01:09:55,600
came off as less confident is 
because I was always hedging 

1209
01:09:55,600 --> 01:10:00,100
trying to hedge my answers. 
And now I've started to see it 

1210
01:10:00,100 --> 01:10:03,700
more as in frame, it in such a 
way of like, okay, here's the 

1211
01:10:03,700 --> 01:10:06,500
information you need right now 
and I'll give you that other 

1212
01:10:06,500 --> 01:10:08,700
information. 
But I've always, I think that 

1213
01:10:09,300 --> 01:10:10,900
just kind of how my mind has 
worked is. 

1214
01:10:10,900 --> 01:10:14,800
I'm always trying to counteract 
the Tended consequences. 

1215
01:10:14,900 --> 01:10:19,000
And so I've always tried to 
approach players in the sense 

1216
01:10:19,000 --> 01:10:21,600
of, well, if they never 
interacted with me, ever again. 

1217
01:10:21,800 --> 01:10:25,200
So I'm trying to set you up to 
not need me and then 

1218
01:10:25,900 --> 01:10:28,100
inadvertently, I over inundate 
you with information. 

1219
01:10:28,100 --> 01:10:32,100
Like, there's this thing of we 
have to allow athletes time to 

1220
01:10:32,100 --> 01:10:38,200
process what we say. 
And good coaches in the same way

1221
01:10:38,200 --> 01:10:42,300
as good speakers, good 
comedians, they allow the, it's 

1222
01:10:42,300 --> 01:10:47,300
all about timing providing time 
for the mind to kind of catch up

1223
01:10:47,300 --> 01:10:50,500
for it to sit, for a moment and 
then proceed and that's 

1224
01:10:50,500 --> 01:10:51,900
something that I'm still working
on. 

1225
01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:55,800
But now I'm much more aware of, 
like, the power of silence. 

1226
01:10:56,200 --> 01:11:01,100
And I feel like I've talked with
another coach today and he was 

1227
01:11:01,100 --> 01:11:07,100
mentioning that One of some of 
the other coaches they're always

1228
01:11:07,100 --> 01:11:08,800
saying something to their 
athletes. 

1229
01:11:08,800 --> 01:11:13,400
And so he feels that when they 
get out of the cage like if you 

1230
01:11:13,400 --> 01:11:16,300
wanted to help them out with 
something like there's just no 

1231
01:11:16,400 --> 01:11:21,200
there's the athlete has no more 
bandwidth to take any in any any

1232
01:11:21,200 --> 01:11:23,300
more information and he feels 
like the best thing that he can 

1233
01:11:23,300 --> 01:11:26,900
do as a coach for them is not to
say anything and that that just 

1234
01:11:28,300 --> 01:11:31,500
I could tell he was struggling 
just like I often do is like 

1235
01:11:32,000 --> 01:11:36,200
that is serving an important 
purpose then, but it makes you 

1236
01:11:36,200 --> 01:11:39,000
seem unimportant to the player 
because now the player is always

1237
01:11:39,000 --> 01:11:41,400
going to go look to the coach, 
who's who's always giving them 

1238
01:11:41,400 --> 01:11:44,200
information in and add something
that I struggle with to, right 

1239
01:11:44,200 --> 01:11:50,300
now, a little bit as well. 
Love Trying to balance that and,

1240
01:11:51,000 --> 01:11:54,000
you know, I give guys, more 
autonomy right now than I think 

1241
01:11:54,000 --> 01:11:55,700
some, some of our other coaches 
do. 

1242
01:11:56,800 --> 01:12:00,300
I'm hoping like, I mean, I plan 
on doing more but at the same 

1243
01:12:00,300 --> 01:12:03,500
point, I don't want. 
I know that you can over q a 

1244
01:12:03,500 --> 01:12:06,500
player and so that's super hard 
of trying to figure out like, 

1245
01:12:06,500 --> 01:12:08,800
how do you work that balance 
when you have to work together 

1246
01:12:08,800 --> 01:12:11,400
with another coach? 
And you're both coaching the 

1247
01:12:11,400 --> 01:12:14,700
same group of athletes. 
How do you not over Coach a 

1248
01:12:14,700 --> 01:12:17,400
player? 
When that's, that's super easy 

1249
01:12:17,400 --> 01:12:21,200
to do? 
But I digress. 

1250
01:12:21,700 --> 01:12:26,000
Yeah, no I think I feel like 
that that alone would resonate a

1251
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:28,500
lot of people, especially that 
are exploring. 

1252
01:12:28,800 --> 01:12:32,100
The LA Cody is I'm in the same 
boat. 

1253
01:12:32,100 --> 01:12:36,000
We will have technically three 
pitching Minds in our Academy 

1254
01:12:37,000 --> 01:12:39,200
and I'm probably the deepest. 
I think. 

1255
01:12:39,200 --> 01:12:42,800
I think our coaching staff as a 
whole has grown grown, a lot and

1256
01:12:42,800 --> 01:12:44,600
starting to understand some of 
these Concepts. 

1257
01:12:44,600 --> 01:12:47,400
I know Rob Graves new book has 
helped helped a lot 

1258
01:12:47,400 --> 01:12:50,000
understanding some of these 
concepts for I think. 

1259
01:12:50,600 --> 01:12:53,900
Now for coaches on staff have 
the book which has been awesome 

1260
01:12:53,900 --> 01:12:55,900
to be able to kind of dig 
through those topics and then 

1261
01:12:55,900 --> 01:12:58,800
start trying to apply them. 
But I've seen that too. 

1262
01:12:58,800 --> 01:13:01,900
Where I, I'll be like this kid 
just got queued up left and 

1263
01:13:01,900 --> 01:13:04,200
right. 
It's like, okay, where do we, 

1264
01:13:04,200 --> 01:13:07,100
where do I want to step in? 
Or I'll be working with them and

1265
01:13:07,100 --> 01:13:10,300
then I'll look, I'm a minute or 
two later and then he's getting 

1266
01:13:10,300 --> 01:13:13,600
queued up with a bunch of 
different thoughts and where my 

1267
01:13:13,600 --> 01:13:16,500
whole goal was to not even have 
the player think we're just 

1268
01:13:16,500 --> 01:13:19,000
gonna, we're going to create the
great, the environment and see 

1269
01:13:19,000 --> 01:13:21,300
if I can List It. 
Was it what I was looking for? 

1270
01:13:22,500 --> 01:13:28,200
Listen to the change, I was 
looking for and then the players

1271
01:13:28,200 --> 01:13:31,100
thinking through it and I feel 
like I'm always in the spot 

1272
01:13:31,100 --> 01:13:32,600
where, okay, well everything I 
just did. 

1273
01:13:32,700 --> 01:13:35,700
I want to say is useless but I 
feel like just got taken over 

1274
01:13:35,700 --> 01:13:39,100
because that's not gonna in my 
mind so I can transfer any more.

1275
01:13:39,500 --> 01:13:43,200
He is in a pressure situation, 
you don't have jobs at Portage 

1276
01:13:43,200 --> 01:13:45,400
to be thinking through this or 
this or this when your 

1277
01:13:45,400 --> 01:13:47,900
intentions are completely 
different than standing in front

1278
01:13:47,900 --> 01:13:52,900
of a screen, throwing a pliable.
So that's that's definitely 

1279
01:13:52,900 --> 01:13:57,400
something I think anybody in 
this in this, Ellie's this 

1280
01:13:57,400 --> 01:14:01,600
exploration of these theories 
will struggle with and I don't 

1281
01:14:01,600 --> 01:14:04,000
know if I have the answer yet 
and especially dealing with 

1282
01:14:04,000 --> 01:14:07,100
other coaches, that maybe our 
aren't as educated on it or 

1283
01:14:07,200 --> 01:14:10,900
maybe don't even that's a bye 
into the approach quite yet. 

1284
01:14:12,100 --> 01:14:14,800
And that's, I mean, that can be 
a whole nother topic of how even

1285
01:14:14,800 --> 01:14:17,400
how to even approach that and 
how to even go into things that 

1286
01:14:17,400 --> 01:14:20,600
we've done in the past. 
But that that is Is one of the 

1287
01:14:20,608 --> 01:14:22,900
harder ones. 
But I mean, tire back to the 

1288
01:14:22,900 --> 01:14:25,800
Charisma. 
It's how do you because? 

1289
01:14:25,800 --> 01:14:28,700
I think we're both and I could 
be wrong on this, but a little 

1290
01:14:28,700 --> 01:14:31,300
more little, more reserved, an 
introvert in some ways, 

1291
01:14:31,300 --> 01:14:35,000
especially on feel, you haven't 
seen you coach, but I think, and

1292
01:14:35,000 --> 01:14:37,500
I just based on a conversation, 
it would be more more of that. 

1293
01:14:37,500 --> 01:14:41,200
And I'm not a physical touch 
person by Nature, like I kind of

1294
01:14:41,200 --> 01:14:43,000
shy. 
I'm at Northeast, did that 

1295
01:14:44,100 --> 01:14:45,700
physical touch is, like, you 
touch me? 

1296
01:14:45,700 --> 01:14:46,700
I was like, what's going on 
here? 

1297
01:14:47,000 --> 01:14:48,500
Why don't we? 
What I know. 

1298
01:14:48,500 --> 01:14:50,000
How are you trying to manipulate
me, right? 

1299
01:14:50,100 --> 01:14:52,900
Now, what's going on? 
Yeah, yeah, super uncomfortable.

1300
01:14:52,900 --> 01:14:56,200
And I like Flinch away from the 
person instead of just, like, 

1301
01:14:56,200 --> 01:14:58,400
accept the fact that he's 
putting my hand on the shoulder 

1302
01:14:58,400 --> 01:15:01,100
and like trying, but what I 
noticed at times even though 

1303
01:15:01,100 --> 01:15:04,100
it's uncomfortable with it, 
there's times, especially as one

1304
01:15:04,100 --> 01:15:06,000
coach, when I was younger. 
He would. 

1305
01:15:06,200 --> 01:15:10,400
It was a very welcoming I guess 
touch to the shoulder as he 

1306
01:15:10,400 --> 01:15:13,300
greeted you or he's trying to 
teach you a concept or you're 

1307
01:15:13,300 --> 01:15:16,900
struggling a little bit, it 
almost like it would create a 

1308
01:15:16,907 --> 01:15:20,600
connection between between me 
and him and it almost I feel 

1309
01:15:20,600 --> 01:15:24,500
like he's he's with me on this 
journey and a lot of ways and I 

1310
01:15:24,508 --> 01:15:28,100
think that creates that 
connection that I sometimes will

1311
01:15:28,100 --> 01:15:30,700
act because I'm not willing to 
go and explore that physical 

1312
01:15:30,700 --> 01:15:32,400
touch. 
A lot of times just because like

1313
01:15:32,400 --> 01:15:34,900
that's how I grew up. 
That's what the me if I'm 

1314
01:15:34,900 --> 01:15:38,000
looking for an athlete and all 
the other options, I can to help

1315
01:15:38,000 --> 01:15:41,700
my athlete, the touching them on
the shoulder and trying to 

1316
01:15:41,708 --> 01:15:43,700
create that connection is not 
important at this point. 

1317
01:15:43,700 --> 01:15:45,900
If I wouldn't, if I could put it
in that terms, like that is not 

1318
01:15:45,900 --> 01:15:50,000
an option of mine, unless I'm 
intentionally thinking on that. 

1319
01:15:50,100 --> 01:15:51,800
But I do think it's extremely 
important. 

1320
01:15:51,800 --> 01:15:54,000
I have just just for our 
conversation and thinking 

1321
01:15:54,000 --> 01:15:57,100
through it, I remember specific 
times where it's like, I felt 

1322
01:15:57,100 --> 01:16:00,700
connected to that coach, I felt 
like there was this is open 

1323
01:16:00,700 --> 01:16:03,300
communication just based on him 
just putting his hand on my 

1324
01:16:03,300 --> 01:16:07,300
shoulder and it's like showing 
that hey, I'm with you or hey, 

1325
01:16:08,300 --> 01:16:10,000
how you doing, man? 
Like how was that things are 

1326
01:16:10,000 --> 01:16:11,300
actually going? 
It was very well. 

1327
01:16:13,000 --> 01:16:17,600
Yeah, and there's I have like 
two things 11 to do with like 

1328
01:16:17,600 --> 01:16:22,000
the first issue that you brought
up and then one on the 

1329
01:16:22,000 --> 01:16:28,700
connection piece because I think
when it comes to I hate when I 

1330
01:16:28,708 --> 01:16:31,800
do this. 
This is so like for for the the 

1331
01:16:31,800 --> 01:16:38,500
feel of Now, I remembered it as 
a, I hate, I hate though, when I

1332
01:16:38,500 --> 01:16:42,000
want to talk, I lose it. 
But this this actually Loops, 

1333
01:16:42,000 --> 01:16:45,400
in, in. 
Well, in terms of, when it comes

1334
01:16:45,400 --> 01:16:47,500
to the touch stuff, especially, 
because that's something that 

1335
01:16:47,500 --> 01:16:51,600
I've struggled with, you know, 
like, for me being reserved and 

1336
01:16:51,600 --> 01:16:54,300
when we're talking about 
Charisma, I think of Charisma is

1337
01:16:54,300 --> 01:16:56,900
something like you're really 
good at talking in front of a 

1338
01:16:56,900 --> 01:16:57,700
group. 
Yeah. 

1339
01:16:57,700 --> 01:17:02,900
And for me, I've continually 
recognized because I've failed 

1340
01:17:02,900 --> 01:17:05,700
so many times at it. 
It, I'm so bad at talking in 

1341
01:17:05,700 --> 01:17:10,400
front of a group. 
It's because I recognize that it

1342
01:17:10,400 --> 01:17:16,100
really helps players to have 
clear Direction when the coach 

1343
01:17:16,100 --> 01:17:19,800
is able to speak, well, to the 
group and generally speaking, 

1344
01:17:19,800 --> 01:17:22,200
I've always struggled with that.
There might have been a time 

1345
01:17:22,200 --> 01:17:25,700
where you know, I wasn't so bad 
at it and I think that when I 

1346
01:17:25,700 --> 01:17:28,600
think back it was when I was 
coaching Junior Legion, but for 

1347
01:17:28,600 --> 01:17:31,700
the most part, especially in 
more recent history, I've rare, 

1348
01:17:31,700 --> 01:17:38,100
I've really struggled With that.
And that kind of comes back to 

1349
01:17:38,100 --> 01:17:41,100
this this notion of being like 
good with Charisma. 

1350
01:17:41,100 --> 01:17:43,900
And I kind of Wonder, you know, 
for someone who is more 

1351
01:17:43,900 --> 01:17:50,100
introverted who isn't good as at
giving the rah-rah speeches I 

1352
01:17:50,100 --> 01:17:54,400
think. 
It's one of those things where I

1353
01:17:54,400 --> 01:17:58,100
looked at it in terms of well I 
just need more practice and so 

1354
01:17:58,800 --> 01:18:01,500
sorry guys. 
This is going to be brutal for a

1355
01:18:01,500 --> 01:18:08,500
while but that that just kind of
goes to the fact that I'm much 

1356
01:18:08,500 --> 01:18:11,100
better when I'm doing one-on-one
though. 

1357
01:18:11,400 --> 01:18:13,600
And the reason that I'm much 
better at doing one-on-one is I 

1358
01:18:13,600 --> 01:18:18,000
only have to manage one person 
or maybe to people's thoughts 

1359
01:18:18,000 --> 01:18:21,800
and I can because that's the 
thing that I am much more 

1360
01:18:21,800 --> 01:18:24,400
sensitive to is to like what 
other people are thinking. 

1361
01:18:24,500 --> 01:18:28,700
And like if one person is 
thinking X or whatever, then I'm

1362
01:18:28,700 --> 01:18:32,600
immediately drawn over there and
then when it's a whole group and

1363
01:18:32,600 --> 01:18:35,100
then you get the feel of the 
group then you're like, oh man, 

1364
01:18:35,100 --> 01:18:37,200
I'm now really. 
Distracted off my point, just 

1365
01:18:37,200 --> 01:18:39,600
because I'm looking around, I'm 
seeing, who isn't it? 

1366
01:18:39,600 --> 01:18:42,100
Connecting with. 
Well, I can't destroy. 

1367
01:18:42,400 --> 01:18:45,300
And so, I guess that for me is 
being someone who does much 

1368
01:18:45,300 --> 01:18:48,400
better on a one-on-one or a 
small group basis. 

1369
01:18:48,400 --> 01:18:51,400
I'm able to connect with 
everybody in the group and kind 

1370
01:18:51,400 --> 01:18:53,800
of divert and kind of go down 
different paths. 

1371
01:18:54,400 --> 01:18:59,200
Whereas in a large group setting
those constraints I don't do as 

1372
01:18:59,200 --> 01:19:01,800
well with and so I'm still 
trying to navigate through that 

1373
01:19:01,800 --> 01:19:04,500
and figure out. 
What's the appropriate way to 

1374
01:19:04,500 --> 01:19:08,900
kind of bridge that And this 
kind of Loops back though, to 

1375
01:19:09,100 --> 01:19:13,600
what we're talking about before 
with. what do we do when we're 

1376
01:19:13,600 --> 01:19:17,900
not on the same page, you know, 
or there's just a lot of other 

1377
01:19:17,900 --> 01:19:22,800
voices speaking to the athletes,
while you're trying to work with

1378
01:19:22,800 --> 01:19:27,400
them and what I've kind of how 
I've approached it right now is,

1379
01:19:29,400 --> 01:19:31,800
Really kind of have to die to 
the ego part because like some 

1380
01:19:31,800 --> 01:19:36,800
of its like and I I know that 
what this other person is saying

1381
01:19:36,800 --> 01:19:39,900
there are some down side effects
to this and now they're getting 

1382
01:19:39,900 --> 01:19:45,000
to internally focused Etc and 
now there's I think this is the 

1383
01:19:45,000 --> 01:19:49,200
biggest thing of over queuing is
that the athlete does because 

1384
01:19:49,200 --> 01:19:50,800
there's so much information 
being thrown at them? 

1385
01:19:50,800 --> 01:19:52,000
They don't know what to focus 
on. 

1386
01:19:52,000 --> 01:19:54,600
Yeah. 
This this was typified to me 

1387
01:19:54,600 --> 01:19:58,500
when I was coaching at a 
facility one time in a player, 

1388
01:19:58,500 --> 01:20:01,400
came in from a Bullpen. 
And he was frustrated and I 

1389
01:20:01,400 --> 01:20:02,600
asked him just like, hey, how'd 
it go? 

1390
01:20:02,600 --> 01:20:05,700
And he's like I don't even know 
and I asked him well what do 

1391
01:20:05,700 --> 01:20:09,100
what were you working on his? 
Like I have no idea and that 

1392
01:20:09,100 --> 01:20:14,600
just like That it just made 
something clicked in my mind of.

1393
01:20:14,900 --> 01:20:17,000
Wow, I was just ask them like, 
well, what did you work on? 

1394
01:20:17,000 --> 01:20:19,900
He listed off like five 
different things and it was 

1395
01:20:19,900 --> 01:20:22,600
like, okay that's why you had no
idea what you're working. 

1396
01:20:22,600 --> 01:20:24,000
I'm like what did you come here 
for? 

1397
01:20:24,000 --> 01:20:26,800
What would it be? 
What were your goals Etc? 

1398
01:20:27,100 --> 01:20:30,500
You know and because the coach 
had him throw a bunch of 

1399
01:20:30,500 --> 01:20:33,500
fastball just like my fastball 
is good for for my level. 

1400
01:20:34,200 --> 01:20:35,400
Like I need to work on my 
slider. 

1401
01:20:35,400 --> 01:20:38,400
I didn't throw a single slider 
and it was like okay this is 

1402
01:20:38,600 --> 01:20:40,700
this that was kind of that 
conversation made. 

1403
01:20:40,700 --> 01:20:45,500
It click of. 
We part of the reason why we we 

1404
01:20:45,600 --> 01:20:49,300
should be over, cueing guys, is 
the fact that they just don't 

1405
01:20:49,300 --> 01:20:52,300
know what they're working on 
anymore, after a certain point. 

1406
01:20:52,300 --> 01:20:58,700
And so what I then kind of now, 
see my job as a coach is, 

1407
01:20:58,700 --> 01:21:01,400
especially when I'm working with
a group of coaches is once the 

1408
01:21:01,400 --> 01:21:05,700
athlete gets done. 
When I talk to them, I have to 

1409
01:21:05,700 --> 01:21:09,000
only give them one or two things
and I go your next round, when 

1410
01:21:09,000 --> 01:21:10,400
it comes to hitting your next 
round. 

1411
01:21:10,400 --> 01:21:11,900
I only want you to focus on 
this. 

1412
01:21:12,500 --> 01:21:15,400
Or you know, with this one 
athlete, I gave him two things. 

1413
01:21:15,600 --> 01:21:17,900
I want you to focus on, hit the 
ball off, the top of the cage 

1414
01:21:17,900 --> 01:21:20,600
and I want to make and I want 
you to focus on making sure you 

1415
01:21:20,600 --> 01:21:23,600
don't stop moving. 
Don't don't come to a pause 

1416
01:21:23,600 --> 01:21:26,500
ever, you know, for when you 
when you're making the swing 

1417
01:21:26,500 --> 01:21:29,000
some some part of your body 
needs to be moving the whole 

1418
01:21:29,000 --> 01:21:31,500
time. 
And so I left them with those 

1419
01:21:31,500 --> 01:21:36,000
two things and you know, let the
other coach kind of, you know, 

1420
01:21:36,000 --> 01:21:38,300
interact with him as however he 
saw fit. 

1421
01:21:38,400 --> 01:21:43,600
But to me that That was a way of
trying to simplify it for, for 

1422
01:21:43,600 --> 01:21:46,100
the hitter. 
Now, I probably was pushing my 

1423
01:21:46,100 --> 01:21:48,500
luck a little bit too much. 
You know, given two things but 

1424
01:21:48,500 --> 01:21:50,400
this was this would be my 
recommendation. 

1425
01:21:50,400 --> 01:21:53,700
Like don't ever give a player 
more than two things to focus on

1426
01:21:53,700 --> 01:21:58,600
at any one point in time and so 
you know in an ideal world you 

1427
01:21:58,600 --> 01:22:02,500
just give them one and if it's 
not working like give yourself a

1428
01:22:02,600 --> 01:22:06,300
certain number of Reps for them 
to try to work it out and don't 

1429
01:22:06,300 --> 01:22:11,200
jump in the first, you know, as 
soon as they mess up like Let 

1430
01:22:11,200 --> 01:22:13,600
that like if you want them to 
discover the answer, if we go 

1431
01:22:13,600 --> 01:22:15,600
back to the beginning of this 
conversation, if you want them 

1432
01:22:15,600 --> 01:22:18,600
to be able to discover the 
answer, you have to leave them 

1433
01:22:18,600 --> 01:22:24,000
room to be able to do that and 
and so sometimes you can you can

1434
01:22:24,000 --> 01:22:26,400
let the athlete know beforehand 
because I see this all the time 

1435
01:22:26,400 --> 01:22:28,500
with hitting where they get in 
there and they're just going to 

1436
01:22:28,508 --> 01:22:31,500
take a bunch of reps and then 
you feel bad jumping at least 

1437
01:22:31,500 --> 01:22:34,800
for me I feel bad jumping in now
that they're five swings in and 

1438
01:22:34,800 --> 01:22:37,100
they're just rolling to like 
stop them in the middle of what 

1439
01:22:37,100 --> 01:22:40,300
they're doing. 
So generally, if I want to do 

1440
01:22:40,300 --> 01:22:42,600
that and I know Going to want to
change up. 

1441
01:22:42,900 --> 01:22:44,900
What they're doing. 
I'm going to say for the next 

1442
01:22:44,900 --> 01:22:48,900
like five or four swings, you 
know, I want you to focus on 

1443
01:22:48,900 --> 01:22:54,100
this and then just stop and like
let's have a conversation before

1444
01:22:54,100 --> 01:22:56,300
you take your next like four or 
five swings. 

1445
01:22:56,700 --> 01:22:58,900
And that's a good way to control
the round because like too many 

1446
01:22:58,900 --> 01:23:02,800
guys take way too many reps but 
I digress again. 

1447
01:23:02,800 --> 01:23:09,800
But that, that on the When it 
comes to working with other 

1448
01:23:09,800 --> 01:23:12,800
coaches who would there's a lot 
of voices. 

1449
01:23:13,700 --> 01:23:16,900
I I see like an easy way for 
someone to provide value and 

1450
01:23:16,900 --> 01:23:22,500
that space is to then distill 
that down and clarify for that 

1451
01:23:22,500 --> 01:23:24,800
athlete to bring it to a focal 
point. 

1452
01:23:24,800 --> 01:23:28,100
So that they can, they can have 
something very clear and 

1453
01:23:28,108 --> 01:23:34,200
tangible to focus on. 
And so I think that's what, 

1454
01:23:34,200 --> 01:23:36,700
what's going to be most helpful 
for athletes in that situation. 

1455
01:23:37,400 --> 01:23:42,400
Yeah, I think that's about all 
but so I think we kind of hit 

1456
01:23:42,400 --> 01:23:45,700
that Charisma Point really well.
I'm going to replay this point 

1457
01:23:46,800 --> 01:23:49,900
and then and we'll go through 
this because this is super easy 

1458
01:23:49,900 --> 01:23:51,600
Cody. 
Even though I don't know that 

1459
01:23:51,600 --> 01:23:57,800
he's a, he's super aware of it 
but I can imagine Verve a key is

1460
01:23:58,600 --> 01:24:03,200
Because I did you watch for make
you as part of that four 

1461
01:24:03,200 --> 01:24:05,700
horsemen. 
Yeah, I'm relation with Peterson

1462
01:24:05,700 --> 01:24:10,000
and Peterson was talking about 
Gigi Gibson and Verve. 

1463
01:24:10,000 --> 01:24:11,700
A key jumped in on that, 
anyways. 

1464
01:24:11,800 --> 01:24:18,600
Yeah, that's cool. 
For the u9 Gibsonia and people 

1465
01:24:19,500 --> 01:24:22,100
apologies. 
But you're going to hear us talk

1466
01:24:22,100 --> 01:24:25,900
a lot about Gibson. 
Hopefully at some point get in 

1467
01:24:25,900 --> 01:24:29,900
deep rapport with this student 
or the or the athlete. 

1468
01:24:29,900 --> 01:24:32,400
I think that's also, I mean, I 
brought up against this with 

1469
01:24:32,600 --> 01:24:35,000
trying to articulate what makes 
somebody the teacher and it's 

1470
01:24:35,300 --> 01:24:39,900
can't replace the wise use of 
Charisma with just the, you 

1471
01:24:39,900 --> 01:24:42,800
know, the methodological 
application of technique it's 

1472
01:24:42,800 --> 01:24:45,200
just not the same. 
Thing happened to me. 

1473
01:24:45,200 --> 01:24:47,700
The other night that is so in 
virgin with what you're saying, 

1474
01:24:47,900 --> 01:24:51,400
my partner and I, we were 
listening to some music and I 

1475
01:24:51,700 --> 01:24:54,800
sort of knew she liked the 
Moonlight Sonata and I sort of 

1476
01:24:55,000 --> 01:24:58,500
played it on my phone and then 
she stopped, he stopped, go and 

1477
01:24:58,500 --> 01:25:01,400
look up this, and look at the 
Moonlight Sonata by this person,

1478
01:25:01,700 --> 01:25:03,800
and she's a trained musician. 
I'm not. 

1479
01:25:03,800 --> 01:25:06,300
And so, I go and get this other 
one and I play it. 

1480
01:25:06,300 --> 01:25:08,900
And she's saying things like, 
notice how he's robbing a little

1481
01:25:08,900 --> 01:25:11,100
bit of timing from this note and
giving it to that. 

1482
01:25:11,100 --> 01:25:11,800
No. 
Notice. 

1483
01:25:11,800 --> 01:25:13,900
How its deep. 
And and she unfolds this 

1484
01:25:13,900 --> 01:25:17,900
appreciation, When I go, oh my 
gosh, this is so much better. 

1485
01:25:18,100 --> 01:25:23,200
The other was mechanical, right?
It's perfect technique, but it's

1486
01:25:23,200 --> 01:25:26,800
missing all of this, right? 
It's missing all of this other 

1487
01:25:26,800 --> 01:25:30,800
stuff. 
A lot of times the thing. so, I 

1488
01:25:30,800 --> 01:25:38,300
think Him bringing up, we can't 
replace Charisma, they may be 

1489
01:25:38,300 --> 01:25:40,100
correct me if I'm wrong, is he 
saying? 

1490
01:25:40,300 --> 01:25:45,100
We can't replace krismo with 
this scientific and I'm changing

1491
01:25:45,100 --> 01:25:47,900
the word slightly, the 
scientific perfect technique. 

1492
01:25:50,800 --> 01:25:54,800
Approach because I feel like 
that has been the approach for 

1493
01:25:54,800 --> 01:25:57,600
baseball and that was the 
approach that I took as a coach 

1494
01:25:57,600 --> 01:26:03,000
was you know what, I don't need 
to be manipulative when it comes

1495
01:26:03,000 --> 01:26:07,500
to you know, emotional appeals 
and you know having a ton of 

1496
01:26:07,508 --> 01:26:11,100
Charisma. 
Instead I can lean on technique 

1497
01:26:11,100 --> 01:26:15,900
instead and taking a scientific 
data driven approach to this and

1498
01:26:15,900 --> 01:26:20,500
this will make up for for that 
fact that I lack in this. 

1499
01:26:20,800 --> 01:26:27,100
Our area. and, And essentially 
prove a key here is saying that 

1500
01:26:27,100 --> 01:26:32,100
that that's not that's not the 
right approach like you can't. 

1501
01:26:33,000 --> 01:26:41,200
technique will not replace the 
skill in the art of Dexterity, I

1502
01:26:41,200 --> 01:26:43,100
guess you could say. 
I don't know. 

1503
01:26:43,100 --> 01:26:48,800
That's I'm trying to think of a 
kind of what the other side. 

1504
01:26:49,100 --> 01:26:50,800
Do you have the other side of 
what? 

1505
01:26:50,800 --> 01:26:54,300
Verve a key is actually arguing 
for, you know, because he is 

1506
01:26:54,600 --> 01:26:57,700
right there, he argued against 
perfect technique. 

1507
01:26:58,100 --> 01:27:00,400
And instead, what did he argue 
for? 

1508
01:27:01,100 --> 01:27:04,400
Yeah, I think I think I know. 
I think you're kind of, on the 

1509
01:27:04,400 --> 01:27:06,900
right track at least where my 
brain went with it. 

1510
01:27:06,900 --> 01:27:12,100
That you, you can't replace 
Charisma or creating that 

1511
01:27:12,100 --> 01:27:16,600
connection and almost like being
that guy that wants to pull the 

1512
01:27:16,600 --> 01:27:19,700
athlete towards doing something,
with just having the perfect 

1513
01:27:19,700 --> 01:27:22,800
technique or having these 
perfect schemes or perfect, 

1514
01:27:22,900 --> 01:27:25,000
perfect way to go about it. 
Again, like I would say the same

1515
01:27:25,000 --> 01:27:28,200
way that I started coaching like
it was I knew exactly how to 

1516
01:27:28,200 --> 01:27:30,500
train you. 
I knew all the all the ways that

1517
01:27:30,500 --> 01:27:32,900
are going to make you throw 
faster, throw a better 

1518
01:27:32,900 --> 01:27:35,700
curveballs, breaking ball 
changeup, whatever it may be. 

1519
01:27:35,700 --> 01:27:40,100
I knew how to do all that. 
But that's all I had and I 

1520
01:27:40,108 --> 01:27:42,900
didn't know how to great day off
because I think you had just 

1521
01:27:42,900 --> 01:27:45,000
have that you're never going to 
bring that Athlete on the 

1522
01:27:45,000 --> 01:27:48,200
journey along with you. 
You have all the information but

1523
01:27:48,200 --> 01:27:50,100
how's the athlete absorbing that
information? 

1524
01:27:50,100 --> 01:27:53,100
How's that athlete? 
Going on a journey to find what 

1525
01:27:53,100 --> 01:27:54,700
you're looking for out of that 
athlete? 

1526
01:27:54,700 --> 01:27:56,700
I think I think that's where 
he's going with. 

1527
01:27:56,700 --> 01:28:00,000
That is if you look at those 
three things that you talked 

1528
01:28:00,000 --> 01:28:02,600
about like knowledge Brave, talk
about knowledge is the second 

1529
01:28:02,600 --> 01:28:04,100
one. 
And then the third one is 

1530
01:28:04,100 --> 01:28:07,000
charisma and you can't you can't
take you can't put knowledge. 

1531
01:28:07,100 --> 01:28:10,500
Judge above the Charisma piece, 
you can't, you can't just care 

1532
01:28:10,500 --> 01:28:12,100
for the athlete. 
Have really good knowledge and 

1533
01:28:12,100 --> 01:28:15,200
not have good Charisma, to help 
actually connect those possibly 

1534
01:28:15,200 --> 01:28:18,700
two together and take this 
family or whoever it may be a 

1535
01:28:18,700 --> 01:28:21,800
long, long, and a journey and 
actually elicit the response or 

1536
01:28:21,800 --> 01:28:24,200
the engagement with the 
information that you're looking 

1537
01:28:24,200 --> 01:28:25,600
for. 
I think that's that's where my 

1538
01:28:25,600 --> 01:28:29,100
brain with that. 
And to now that I'm thinking a 

1539
01:28:29,100 --> 01:28:32,900
little bit more on it, there's 
this element what he's 

1540
01:28:32,900 --> 01:28:36,400
describing is Art. 
So there's the mechanic that 

1541
01:28:36,400 --> 01:28:39,000
mechanical Menace of Italy 
because I remember when I was 

1542
01:28:39,800 --> 01:28:45,200
you know, coming up and you know
playing baseball I started going

1543
01:28:45,200 --> 01:28:47,300
to a lot more clinics and then 
we everybody started talking 

1544
01:28:47,300 --> 01:28:49,400
about mechanics and then I got 
really focused on doing the 

1545
01:28:49,400 --> 01:28:51,700
drills because I thought that 
was going to be the thing that 

1546
01:28:51,700 --> 01:28:54,800
would get me ahead is doing all 
the drills. 

1547
01:28:55,200 --> 01:28:57,100
Doing the all the mechanics the 
right way. 

1548
01:28:57,300 --> 01:29:00,000
Because, you know what, I had 
heard from coaches is they want 

1549
01:29:00,000 --> 01:29:04,200
players who are coachable and 
so, my whole Focus was to do it.

1550
01:29:04,200 --> 01:29:06,000
Exactly. 
Then how they talked about it. 

1551
01:29:06,000 --> 01:29:11,200
And, you know, the funny thing 
was, is that also some coaches, 

1552
01:29:11,200 --> 01:29:13,500
but then also, a lot of the 
other players to are like, man, 

1553
01:29:13,500 --> 01:29:18,200
you're just like a robot and I 
mean, when you think about it, 

1554
01:29:18,200 --> 01:29:20,700
if you're talking about 
mechanics, that's how you're 

1555
01:29:20,700 --> 01:29:24,600
viewing, it is robotically. 
I mean that that's where 

1556
01:29:24,600 --> 01:29:26,600
mechanics comes out of like if 
we're talking about 

1557
01:29:26,600 --> 01:29:29,500
biomechanics, Nick's whatever in
your, I mean, in a way you're 

1558
01:29:29,500 --> 01:29:31,800
viewing things as as Machinery. 
Yeah. 

1559
01:29:31,800 --> 01:29:37,400
And so, It's just interesting 
but the reality is that we're 

1560
01:29:38,200 --> 01:29:41,700
we're live, organic animate 
beings, not robots. 

1561
01:29:41,700 --> 01:29:45,700
And so in that sense, what what 
I think for vehicie is talking 

1562
01:29:45,700 --> 01:29:52,100
about here, is that We need to. 
Make things come alive because 

1563
01:29:52,100 --> 01:29:54,800
what he was describing with 
playing the piano like, okay, 

1564
01:29:54,800 --> 01:29:58,700
yeah, you can play it in all the
technicality of it but it has 

1565
01:29:58,700 --> 01:30:03,600
no, I guess Charisma. 
It has no Charisma. 

1566
01:30:03,600 --> 01:30:06,900
It has no personality to it when
you do it that way. 

1567
01:30:06,900 --> 01:30:13,000
But when when you understand 
something so well that when you 

1568
01:30:13,000 --> 01:30:16,300
listen to this other artists 
play that same song as he was 

1569
01:30:16,300 --> 01:30:19,800
describing it, you know, his 
wife or not wife, but his, his 

1570
01:30:19,800 --> 01:30:21,900
significant other They're 
talking about how. 

1571
01:30:23,500 --> 01:30:28,100
This artist was taking time a 
little bit from one note, and 

1572
01:30:28,100 --> 01:30:32,300
giving it to another to give the
same piece or character and some

1573
01:30:32,600 --> 01:30:37,900
some actual life, some flow. 
And and I think that when we're 

1574
01:30:37,900 --> 01:30:42,500
talking about what it means to 
coach and what it means to 

1575
01:30:43,300 --> 01:30:49,600
create an environment where 
ourselves and the players can be

1576
01:30:51,100 --> 01:30:56,100
I guess what, 04 create an 
environment for our, for our 

1577
01:30:56,100 --> 01:30:58,300
players. 
And for ourselves to to Really 

1578
01:30:58,300 --> 01:31:02,800
flourish like we actually have 
to allow for this aliveness 

1579
01:31:02,800 --> 01:31:04,700
where there's a little bit give 
and take. 

1580
01:31:04,700 --> 01:31:08,200
Where one thing that was really 
interesting to me when I was in 

1581
01:31:08,600 --> 01:31:12,600
doing my undergrad in college, I
took this sport sport management

1582
01:31:12,600 --> 01:31:19,000
class and the tennis coach was 
the professor and he was talking

1583
01:31:19,000 --> 01:31:24,000
we had this one lecture on Iran.
I want to say deviance I think 

1584
01:31:24,000 --> 01:31:28,700
was was the was what it was on 
and how Iron sports teams are 

1585
01:31:28,700 --> 01:31:31,900
deviant to some extent. 
The question is how deviant are 

1586
01:31:31,900 --> 01:31:34,600
they? 
And he kind of helped, you know,

1587
01:31:34,600 --> 01:31:37,900
at least for me like realize 
like, oh deviance is part of the

1588
01:31:37,900 --> 01:31:39,300
game. 
It's a question of like, how 

1589
01:31:39,300 --> 01:31:42,600
much can you push the rules? 
Because the rules aren't always 

1590
01:31:42,700 --> 01:31:48,900
literally enforced. 
And so every team in every I in 

1591
01:31:48,900 --> 01:31:51,300
a way he made it seem like every
good team and every good player 

1592
01:31:51,300 --> 01:31:55,100
is always trying to push the 
edges of the rules in the 

1593
01:31:55,100 --> 01:31:59,800
boundaries to see what how the 
game is actually played, what 

1594
01:31:59,800 --> 01:32:03,800
are the actual boundaries. 
And so when I thinking about 

1595
01:32:04,600 --> 01:32:08,300
This analogy or this story that 
Verve a key is giving on the 

1596
01:32:08,300 --> 01:32:11,200
piano playing what the piano 
this artist. 

1597
01:32:11,800 --> 01:32:16,300
This really good artist is doing
is they're playing with the 

1598
01:32:16,300 --> 01:32:21,100
boundaries of the music. 
So let's say just as a to keep 

1599
01:32:21,100 --> 01:32:23,400
it simple, the song is still the
same length. 

1600
01:32:24,800 --> 01:32:29,100
But the artist borrowed a little
bit of time from one note to the

1601
01:32:29,100 --> 01:32:33,500
other two, actually. 
Try to push the boundaries of 

1602
01:32:33,500 --> 01:32:37,300
what the song could be to make 
it come more alive. 

1603
01:32:37,300 --> 01:32:40,800
And that is part of being alive 
is playing with these boundaries

1604
01:32:41,200 --> 01:32:43,700
and seeing what you can push, 
what you can get away with. 

1605
01:32:43,700 --> 01:32:48,400
And can you still get the peace 
to be in harmony to sound good 

1606
01:32:48,400 --> 01:32:53,700
to be pleasing? 
And when you think about it in 

1607
01:32:53,700 --> 01:32:56,500
terms of like playing the game, 
we're always trying to you know,

1608
01:32:56,500 --> 01:33:02,100
push the boundaries, push the 
edge and see what we can make of

1609
01:33:02,100 --> 01:33:07,000
it till like, find new heights 
to do to perform better too. 

1610
01:33:07,100 --> 01:33:09,900
I don't know. 
It's just, it's very trying to 

1611
01:33:09,907 --> 01:33:20,800
think of more Reaching words. 
Yeah, I mean, okay, so here, I 

1612
01:33:20,808 --> 01:33:22,900
don't know if you like that. 
Let me know if you factor this, 

1613
01:33:22,900 --> 01:33:25,700
but one way almost look at it, 
like trying to connect it back 

1614
01:33:25,700 --> 01:33:30,000
to the baseball a little bit. 
Like I think back in my I think 

1615
01:33:30,000 --> 01:33:31,800
it's like, first thing is, I'm a
listen to this video. 

1616
01:33:31,800 --> 01:33:35,700
My brain went immediately to 
remember that tag by Javier 

1617
01:33:35,700 --> 01:33:38,500
Baez. 
It was, I don't remember, it was

1618
01:33:38,500 --> 01:33:40,900
in the World Baseball Classic, 
maybe, and it was just, like, 

1619
01:33:41,100 --> 01:33:43,000
was not perfect. 
Technique whatsoever is like 

1620
01:33:43,000 --> 01:33:47,400
really flashy, but I mean it 
captured captured all of the 

1621
01:33:47,400 --> 01:33:50,100
Baseball and that everybody was 
playing it and everybody was 

1622
01:33:50,100 --> 01:33:54,300
amazed by it and it's like he 
created his own Flair into the 

1623
01:33:54,300 --> 01:33:57,600
game and the skillful way where 
he just it was just a tag. 

1624
01:33:57,900 --> 01:33:59,500
But if you're going to, if 
you're going to look at perfect 

1625
01:33:59,500 --> 01:34:01,100
technique, that's not perfect 
technique at all. 

1626
01:34:01,100 --> 01:34:04,400
No coach is going to teach that,
but because of his his 

1627
01:34:04,400 --> 01:34:08,000
abilities, he knew that was an 
affordance for him and he was 

1628
01:34:08,000 --> 01:34:12,400
able to play without with the 
out, the technique and break out

1629
01:34:12,400 --> 01:34:14,100
of the technique in a lot of 
ways. 

1630
01:34:14,500 --> 01:34:17,200
And you'll see guys like a like,
I think of Vlad Guerrero right 

1631
01:34:17,200 --> 01:34:19,300
away. 
I mean that guy at the dish, I 

1632
01:34:19,308 --> 01:34:20,900
mean with the ball was coming 
towards them. 

1633
01:34:20,900 --> 01:34:23,600
He has a chance to hit it and he
went outside your traditionally,

1634
01:34:23,600 --> 01:34:25,000
nobody's going to coach him like
that. 

1635
01:34:25,300 --> 01:34:27,700
And what coach is going to have 
tell him to be swinging at 

1636
01:34:27,700 --> 01:34:30,200
pitches that are bouncing at the
plate, or outside the zone, and 

1637
01:34:30,200 --> 01:34:31,500
that's where you're going to 
break him. 

1638
01:34:31,900 --> 01:34:35,400
But yeah, I mean that's what 
that's we're gonna try to keep 

1639
01:34:35,400 --> 01:34:38,700
my feet myself on folks here. 
But, like, the idea of these at 

1640
01:34:38,700 --> 01:34:42,800
these, athletes can play outside
of technique and create this, 

1641
01:34:42,800 --> 01:34:46,400
create this beautiful picture of
athleticism and what their 

1642
01:34:46,400 --> 01:34:50,300
capabilities are Our and I think
of, like this is this, it right 

1643
01:34:50,300 --> 01:34:55,200
here, not this one, but I mean, 
here's there's, there's it was, 

1644
01:34:55,400 --> 01:34:58,900
I mean, there's tags like that. 
I'm looking for it because this 

1645
01:34:58,900 --> 01:35:02,200
one had looked like it had the 
Baseball Classic and it here in 

1646
01:35:02,200 --> 01:35:06,800
here somewheres Is it at the 
end? 

1647
01:35:09,400 --> 01:35:15,600
I mean all these all these are 
like speaking - yeah, right? 

1648
01:35:17,300 --> 01:35:30,900
Boom. 
I mean I think that's that's one

1649
01:35:30,900 --> 01:35:33,400
of the things that's interesting
and just watching it like the 

1650
01:35:33,400 --> 01:35:35,000
no-look tag. 
Yeah. 

1651
01:35:36,700 --> 01:35:40,300
I mean why does he need to look,
I mean, okay, so this this is 

1652
01:35:40,300 --> 01:35:43,500
where it gets great from like a 
perceptual standpoint to write 

1653
01:35:43,500 --> 01:35:46,400
that. 
You don't To use your full 

1654
01:35:46,400 --> 01:35:50,700
perception and kinesthetic 
awareness and feel for like, 

1655
01:35:50,700 --> 01:35:54,400
where people are around you and 
to have a good sense of like, 

1656
01:35:54,400 --> 01:35:58,600
where things are. 
Like you kind of only need to 

1657
01:36:00,100 --> 01:36:02,400
like you need to have a sense of
the bag and a feel for the other

1658
01:36:02,400 --> 01:36:03,500
person. 
Yeah. 

1659
01:36:09,000 --> 01:36:11,200
I mean, so like I'm thinking 
about like, what information is 

1660
01:36:11,200 --> 01:36:13,100
he picking up? 
He's getting information out of 

1661
01:36:13,108 --> 01:36:15,900
his periphery they're like oh 
here we go. 

1662
01:36:16,200 --> 01:36:19,800
World Baseball Classic, right? 
Yeah, no. 

1663
01:36:19,800 --> 01:36:23,200
Look at that point, the catcher 
as he's catching a tag at this. 

1664
01:36:23,200 --> 01:36:34,000
Like, Yeah. it's so, Yeah. 
I mean these are the things 

1665
01:36:34,000 --> 01:36:37,200
where yeah it's not textbook 
perfect but at the same point 

1666
01:36:37,300 --> 01:36:39,600
that play is alive and that's 
what everybody is connecting 

1667
01:36:39,600 --> 01:36:45,500
with like that Charisma is 
drawing people in and and I do 

1668
01:36:45,500 --> 01:36:48,800
think to your point. 
It's it's the passion. 

1669
01:36:48,900 --> 01:36:51,600
The passion is the stuff that I 
think people actually connect 

1670
01:36:51,600 --> 01:36:54,400
with. 
You know, I've heard a lot of 

1671
01:36:54,400 --> 01:36:57,900
people talk about really what 
people are looking for players 

1672
01:36:57,900 --> 01:37:02,900
included is authenticity because
so much so much of our world Is,

1673
01:37:04,100 --> 01:37:07,700
you know, people putting on a 
front and and all that sort of 

1674
01:37:07,700 --> 01:37:11,500
thing. 
And it's it kind of goes back to

1675
01:37:11,500 --> 01:37:17,100
this idea that I heard from 
Keith David's of creating a safe

1676
01:37:17,500 --> 01:37:22,100
environment for uncertainty. 
Because that is most like when 

1677
01:37:22,100 --> 01:37:26,100
you're thinking about like, do 
you know a lot of what our world

1678
01:37:26,100 --> 01:37:29,800
has become is very ordered and 
things are safe because 

1679
01:37:29,800 --> 01:37:33,900
everything is ordered and and 
sometimes when things are a 

1680
01:37:33,900 --> 01:37:37,600
little bit more complex, though 
there's still a level of order 

1681
01:37:37,600 --> 01:37:40,000
to that. 
But then when you get into the 

1682
01:37:40,000 --> 01:37:43,800
real world, where there's a lot 
where the problems are a lot 

1683
01:37:43,800 --> 01:37:48,900
more ambiguous, then Things 
become a lot more difficult to 

1684
01:37:48,900 --> 01:37:50,500
figure out. 
Like, how should I behave, how 

1685
01:37:50,500 --> 01:37:55,200
should I go about solving this? 
And so, If we want players to be

1686
01:37:55,200 --> 01:37:57,800
able to thrive in that 
environment, where there's a lot

1687
01:37:57,800 --> 01:38:00,300
more ambiguity which is the game
of baseball, let's just be 

1688
01:38:00,300 --> 01:38:02,400
honest, because in the game of 
baseball, you can throw the 

1689
01:38:02,400 --> 01:38:05,000
pitch exactly where you want it 
to be in. 

1690
01:38:05,200 --> 01:38:07,600
Not get the result that you're 
looking for a guy, absolutely 

1691
01:38:07,600 --> 01:38:11,600
crushes. 
It, you can be a hitter and 

1692
01:38:12,300 --> 01:38:18,200
swing and take an ugly looking 
swing and it be a hit And into. 

1693
01:38:18,200 --> 01:38:20,800
If you do that enough enough 
times it get enough hits with 

1694
01:38:20,800 --> 01:38:22,500
it. 
Like is that is that really just

1695
01:38:22,500 --> 01:38:24,700
a mistake you're getting lucky 
or is that actually skill at? 

1696
01:38:24,700 --> 01:38:29,100
What point is it looking at what
point is it skill but point 

1697
01:38:29,100 --> 01:38:34,100
being is that the game operates 
in a level of ambiguity in terms

1698
01:38:34,100 --> 01:38:35,500
of what is correct. 
And what is it? 

1699
01:38:36,400 --> 01:38:39,300
Because like I found this and 
this is partially why I've 

1700
01:38:39,300 --> 01:38:43,400
gravitated towards an ecological
approach is I was always chasing

1701
01:38:43,400 --> 01:38:49,000
the latest And greatest 
mechanical aesthetic. 

1702
01:38:49,000 --> 01:38:52,100
Yeah, I guess for lack of a 
better word but like, always 

1703
01:38:52,100 --> 01:38:55,600
looking for the next thing in 
terms of what's the new secret 

1704
01:38:55,600 --> 01:38:57,700
to hitting from a mechanical 
standpoint? 

1705
01:38:57,700 --> 01:39:04,000
And it just got it's just like, 
man I I feel like I'm always 

1706
01:39:04,000 --> 01:39:07,800
like, chasing this, like chasing
my tail in a way or just like 

1707
01:39:08,700 --> 01:39:12,200
chasing the chasing this other, 
I guess, dog around. 

1708
01:39:12,500 --> 01:39:14,600
I don't know it. 
Maybe, maybe the better better 

1709
01:39:14,600 --> 01:39:19,400
example is talking about it in 
terms of Ecclesiastes in, like 

1710
01:39:19,400 --> 01:39:22,000
just it's just heavily. 
It's just a vapor it just like 

1711
01:39:22,000 --> 01:39:25,000
you feel like you got it and 
then there's something new and 

1712
01:39:25,000 --> 01:39:26,700
better out there. 
And in the way that we thought 

1713
01:39:26,700 --> 01:39:30,200
of doing things is now wrong. 
Like I guess that that is is 

1714
01:39:30,200 --> 01:39:33,200
probably the main thing. 
And this is where From an 

1715
01:39:33,200 --> 01:39:37,300
ecological perspective. 
I don't I don't I don't have to 

1716
01:39:37,300 --> 01:39:40,200
be married to a specific thing. 
Not that I don't believe in 

1717
01:39:40,200 --> 01:39:42,700
biomechanics and the importance 
of biomechanics. 

1718
01:39:43,000 --> 01:39:48,600
I just now view it through the 
lens of an ecological approach. 

1719
01:39:49,700 --> 01:39:52,500
And I only go into that 
mechanical or biomechanical. 

1720
01:39:52,500 --> 01:39:54,900
Toolbox. 
When I deem it, you know, when 

1721
01:39:54,900 --> 01:39:58,200
the athlete really needs it. 
We're looking for more power as 

1722
01:39:58,200 --> 01:40:02,800
an example, but I digress once 
again. 

1723
01:40:04,700 --> 01:40:07,300
Yeah I mean I feel like we're 
only what a couple minutes into 

1724
01:40:07,300 --> 01:40:11,200
this video and with but this 
isn't this is my point of like 

1725
01:40:11,200 --> 01:40:14,900
why for me it was never about to
be completely Frank. 

1726
01:40:14,900 --> 01:40:16,900
It was never about getting 
through the whole video as more 

1727
01:40:16,900 --> 01:40:22,200
about using these videos to 
facilitate a conversation that 

1728
01:40:22,200 --> 01:40:26,600
otherwise sometimes will get 
stale because we can always fall

1729
01:40:26,600 --> 01:40:28,200
back on the video. 
Yeah. 

1730
01:40:29,000 --> 01:40:32,900
To to use it to spark more 
conversation. 

1731
01:40:32,900 --> 01:40:35,000
That's my thought. 
Yeah. 

1732
01:40:35,000 --> 01:40:38,700
No, no. 
I the kind of go back to this 

1733
01:40:38,700 --> 01:40:40,100
circle back to a quick but like 
that. 

1734
01:40:40,100 --> 01:40:41,400
Then yeah, I'm safe and 
certainty. 

1735
01:40:41,400 --> 01:40:43,800
I think I think that there that 
was the point. 

1736
01:40:43,800 --> 01:40:44,800
That was a point. 
Yeah. 

1737
01:40:45,200 --> 01:40:47,700
Yeah. 
Safe and certainty to me to is 

1738
01:40:48,100 --> 01:40:52,100
like, you get to that spot 
that's uncertain to within 

1739
01:40:52,100 --> 01:40:54,200
within training with any within 
anything. 

1740
01:40:54,200 --> 01:40:58,400
Honestly and you'll notice like 
you are so much more engaged in 

1741
01:40:58,400 --> 01:41:02,700
what you're doing. 
And I think it can produce low 

1742
01:41:03,200 --> 01:41:07,200
and the Ability to get into a 
potential Flow State or to be 

1743
01:41:07,200 --> 01:41:09,100
fully immersed in whatever 
you're doing. 

1744
01:41:09,400 --> 01:41:11,700
Don't want to eat which it 
willing increase learning and 

1745
01:41:11,708 --> 01:41:14,800
all this stuff. 
If you have that little bit on a

1746
01:41:14,808 --> 01:41:18,400
little bit of uncertainty, just 
because once you're in a safe, 

1747
01:41:18,400 --> 01:41:21,100
certain environment, you're 
basically doing this like row 

1748
01:41:21,100 --> 01:41:24,600
repetition is basically like rep
after rep after rep. 

1749
01:41:24,600 --> 01:41:27,900
Which is I think the difference 
between me Cody and maybe like, 

1750
01:41:27,900 --> 01:41:30,600
a nympho processing like rep 
after rep here today gets very 

1751
01:41:30,600 --> 01:41:33,400
boring, I think it increases or 
decreases. 

1752
01:41:34,600 --> 01:41:37,800
The passion is going to be lost 
will be that Chris most probably

1753
01:41:37,800 --> 01:41:39,600
gonna be lost from it. 
But you live in that safe and 

1754
01:41:39,600 --> 01:41:42,600
certain spot where you can kind 
of create, and you have to solve

1755
01:41:42,600 --> 01:41:44,700
problems, and you have to 
explore a little bit. 

1756
01:41:45,400 --> 01:41:47,400
And I've noticed that with my 
own life, with my own training, 

1757
01:41:47,400 --> 01:41:50,700
with my own coaching, with 
coaching others, I think living 

1758
01:41:50,700 --> 01:41:53,000
with in that safe and certainty.
And you don't want to like 

1759
01:41:53,400 --> 01:41:55,800
that's across that outside of 
that safe are often. 

1760
01:41:55,800 --> 01:41:59,600
That's where sometimes turkey, 
making sure you're still in that

1761
01:41:59,600 --> 01:42:03,700
safe uncertain box, but I think 
that's, that's where it lives. 

1762
01:42:03,700 --> 01:42:06,000
That's It's alive. 
I would say probably the best 

1763
01:42:06,000 --> 01:42:09,000
word cord. 
Yeah, into I guess we're, I was 

1764
01:42:09,000 --> 01:42:12,200
trying to go with that is 
because the game has a level of 

1765
01:42:12,200 --> 01:42:16,300
uncertainty about it, especially
because the opponent Etc creates

1766
01:42:16,300 --> 01:42:23,000
a level of the unknown. 
This is why we need to train 

1767
01:42:23,000 --> 01:42:24,200
with that in mind. 
Yeah. 

1768
01:42:24,400 --> 01:42:31,100
Why we need to create a level of
the players need to feel safe. 

1769
01:42:31,900 --> 01:42:33,800
You know. 
Like it's so for example, for 

1770
01:42:33,800 --> 01:42:37,700
me, I understand why some 
coaches are really hard on their

1771
01:42:37,700 --> 01:42:39,500
players, right? 
Because the game is really hard 

1772
01:42:39,500 --> 01:42:42,300
on them, so we want to prepare 
them for that, but if the 

1773
01:42:42,300 --> 01:42:48,300
players can't don't feel safe 
around you then when it gets 

1774
01:42:48,300 --> 01:42:51,300
time for the game, now they have
two threats that they're worried

1775
01:42:51,300 --> 01:42:56,900
about The team out there and the
coaches in the Dugout and and 

1776
01:42:56,900 --> 01:43:00,100
that's where for for me it 
becomes. 

1777
01:43:00,300 --> 01:43:04,300
I want to be as a coach the 
place where they feel safe and 

1778
01:43:04,300 --> 01:43:06,900
I've got their back and then 
that frees them up like you're 

1779
01:43:06,900 --> 01:43:08,700
talking about that keeps them 
engaged. 

1780
01:43:10,400 --> 01:43:13,700
It frees them up to actually 
engage more with the, with the 

1781
01:43:13,700 --> 01:43:17,000
problem out there to band 
together that, hey, we're all in

1782
01:43:17,000 --> 01:43:19,600
this together. 
There's this big, daunting 

1783
01:43:19,600 --> 01:43:21,200
threat out there, which is the 
game. 

1784
01:43:21,300 --> 01:43:22,600
I mean, let's just be honest, 
right? 

1785
01:43:22,600 --> 01:43:26,600
The pitch is coming at, like, 
you know, now 105, right? 

1786
01:43:26,600 --> 01:43:27,900
You know if you're facing Aaron 
Hicks. 

1787
01:43:27,900 --> 01:43:30,100
Now, obviously, you know, in the
college setting or whatever in 

1788
01:43:30,100 --> 01:43:33,800
high school, you probably not 
facing 105, but, you know, to 

1789
01:43:33,800 --> 01:43:38,300
face 90 90. 
Plus, I mean, that is a very 

1790
01:43:38,300 --> 01:43:43,100
daunting task. 
For any amateur athlete. 

1791
01:43:43,600 --> 01:43:49,600
And so, To me, we have to create
an environment where they feel 

1792
01:43:49,600 --> 01:43:55,200
like we that the threat isn't 
also in the Dugout because the 

1793
01:43:55,200 --> 01:43:57,900
threat is definitely out there. 
There's a huge challenge that 

1794
01:43:57,900 --> 01:44:03,100
they face out on that field and 
if they don't feel supported and

1795
01:44:03,100 --> 01:44:06,600
safe, then they're not going to 
feel, they're always going to be

1796
01:44:06,600 --> 01:44:09,900
operating under threat mode and 
it just doesn't allow for the 

1797
01:44:09,900 --> 01:44:12,600
best to come out of out of 
players in my opinion. 

1798
01:44:12,800 --> 01:44:15,700
Yeah. 
So That's where I was going with

1799
01:44:15,700 --> 01:44:17,600
that. 
Yeah, I think. 

1800
01:44:17,600 --> 01:44:19,600
Yeah. 
It comes down to like almost 

1801
01:44:19,600 --> 01:44:22,900
encouraging failure in a lot of 
ways or having a safe space to 

1802
01:44:22,900 --> 01:44:25,600
fail and explore this. 
You're never going to, you're 

1803
01:44:25,600 --> 01:44:28,100
never you get the exploration of
your players or never get that 

1804
01:44:28,100 --> 01:44:31,800
willingness to thrive. 
Maybe try things, if they're not

1805
01:44:31,800 --> 01:44:35,500
willing to fail and then you can
that easily ties into the game. 

1806
01:44:35,800 --> 01:44:39,700
If you've already encourage 
failure and like your, you've, 

1807
01:44:39,800 --> 01:44:42,100
that failure is something that 
we're going to be about. 

1808
01:44:42,100 --> 01:44:44,300
We're going to be about failing,
learn from it and be able to To 

1809
01:44:44,308 --> 01:44:47,300
encourage that you come to a 
game family size that I think. 

1810
01:44:47,300 --> 01:44:50,600
I think too though the way that 
I would phrase it because I'm 

1811
01:44:50,600 --> 01:44:55,900
with other coaches, that might 
push back and be like What's 

1812
01:44:55,900 --> 01:44:58,000
this failure thing? 
Like we don't want to encourage 

1813
01:44:58,000 --> 01:45:00,300
failure. 
And so rather the way that I 

1814
01:45:00,300 --> 01:45:05,300
would frame it is that Don't be 
afraid to fail in seeking 

1815
01:45:05,300 --> 01:45:08,700
greatness. 
Yeah, you know, like I want you 

1816
01:45:08,708 --> 01:45:11,400
to attempt to try to do 
something that's slightly beyond

1817
01:45:11,400 --> 01:45:15,500
your ability, like find discover
an affordance discover something

1818
01:45:15,600 --> 01:45:18,800
that it that you think is 
possible in just beyond your 

1819
01:45:18,800 --> 01:45:24,100
reach or your grasp and it's 
safe to try for something great 

1820
01:45:24,500 --> 01:45:28,900
and to fall short. 
And and fruit to me as a coach 

1821
01:45:28,900 --> 01:45:33,800
my job, then is to after you, 
you make that, that effort, I'm 

1822
01:45:33,800 --> 01:45:35,100
going to encourage you to try 
again. 

1823
01:45:36,300 --> 01:45:38,800
And then when you when you make 
it, I'm going to celebrate, 

1824
01:45:38,800 --> 01:45:41,700
because here's the thing to 
sometimes you're going to try on

1825
01:45:41,700 --> 01:45:44,200
the first time for something 
that you have never done before 

1826
01:45:44,200 --> 01:45:46,900
and you're going to achieve it 
and we're all going to celebrate

1827
01:45:46,900 --> 01:45:50,100
with you. 
And so, for me, when we're 

1828
01:45:50,100 --> 01:45:53,800
talking about this failure 
thing, I think too many people 

1829
01:45:53,800 --> 01:45:58,500
have, and I understand to it 
took me a while to, to come to 

1830
01:45:58,500 --> 01:46:03,100
this conclusion, but too many 
people have made it sound, like 

1831
01:46:03,100 --> 01:46:06,200
failure is, okay, and, and I 
don't, and for the really Ali 

1832
01:46:06,200 --> 01:46:08,100
competitive. 
That doesn't, it doesn't make 

1833
01:46:08,100 --> 01:46:11,500
any sense, but if you're really 
competitive and you want to 

1834
01:46:11,500 --> 01:46:15,900
succeed, you have to understand 
that in order to succeed you're 

1835
01:46:15,900 --> 01:46:20,000
going to fail along the way 
towards that success and that 

1836
01:46:20,000 --> 01:46:24,200
failure is comes from you trying
to succeed and just 

1837
01:46:24,200 --> 01:46:26,200
understanding that. 
That is that process of you, 

1838
01:46:26,200 --> 01:46:29,200
trying to do something that 
you've never done before and to 

1839
01:46:29,200 --> 01:46:36,200
reach your full potential. 
And so that for me, is why I 

1840
01:46:36,200 --> 01:46:41,100
think we should frame it that 
way and and frame it as this is 

1841
01:46:41,100 --> 01:46:44,400
the road to success. 
And this is the because because 

1842
01:46:44,400 --> 01:46:48,000
it hinges on this whole idea in 
this notion of safe uncertainty 

1843
01:46:48,300 --> 01:46:50,800
because what is uncertain, is 
your success. 

1844
01:46:50,800 --> 01:46:52,200
Yeah. 
And so we want to create a safe 

1845
01:46:52,200 --> 01:46:55,400
environment for you to succeed. 
Yeah. 

1846
01:46:55,400 --> 01:46:57,200
Do I like that a lot? 
Because I think my brain 

1847
01:46:57,200 --> 01:47:01,000
immediately go through because 
I'm more in that where other 

1848
01:47:01,000 --> 01:47:02,700
people's aren't maybe the Eco 
D3. 

1849
01:47:03,300 --> 01:47:05,500
A lot of projects where you look
at like a skateboarder. 

1850
01:47:05,600 --> 01:47:09,000
And they, they knew try and they
fail and they fail, and they 

1851
01:47:09,000 --> 01:47:12,100
fail, and they fail, and they 
fail and fail, then they finally

1852
01:47:12,100 --> 01:47:14,200
hit it. 
And it's like the greatest hit 

1853
01:47:14,200 --> 01:47:16,700
but that it was that learning 
process and being willing to 

1854
01:47:16,700 --> 01:47:21,000
just absolutely eat it and fall 
over and over and over that, get

1855
01:47:21,000 --> 01:47:24,300
some to the more skillful 
attributes of have skateboard. 

1856
01:47:24,300 --> 01:47:26,900
So I guess that's where my brain
automatically goes to in like 

1857
01:47:26,900 --> 01:47:29,300
having environments that 
encourage that and you're 

1858
01:47:29,300 --> 01:47:32,700
willing to try something and 
you're willing to get outside of

1859
01:47:33,000 --> 01:47:38,100
what you originally thought was 
an informant per se and be able 

1860
01:47:38,100 --> 01:47:40,500
to play out plan the edges. 
I kind of like that term like be

1861
01:47:40,500 --> 01:47:43,600
able to play on the edges. 
A little bit of your own skill, 

1862
01:47:43,700 --> 01:47:47,700
but it is good point. 
It goes to this this topic of 

1863
01:47:47,700 --> 01:47:54,200
what this video is in. 
The whole point of playing is 

1864
01:47:54,200 --> 01:47:56,500
when you're playing with 
something, you are manipulating 

1865
01:47:56,500 --> 01:47:59,000
it, you are trying something 
slightly different, and seeing 

1866
01:47:59,000 --> 01:48:05,500
what happens. 
And so, To make a little note 

1867
01:48:05,500 --> 01:48:08,300
here, part of the reason that we
keep pausing, it is so that I 

1868
01:48:08,300 --> 01:48:10,900
don't think Rafe will have a 
necessarily hit us with a 

1869
01:48:10,907 --> 01:48:14,100
copyright or anything, but just 
for YouTube or whatever, when we

1870
01:48:14,100 --> 01:48:18,400
put it up it works better if we 
take more pauses and comment. 

1871
01:48:18,800 --> 01:48:21,700
And so I'm looking at this 
going, we're about halfway 

1872
01:48:21,700 --> 01:48:26,400
through. 
And so I'm going to play this 

1873
01:48:26,400 --> 01:48:28,100
forward a little bit. 
But this this goes through this 

1874
01:48:28,100 --> 01:48:31,300
idea though, of like what you're
talking about, like this is why 

1875
01:48:31,300 --> 01:48:36,400
we use this term play. 
Like we, this is how we learn, 

1876
01:48:36,400 --> 01:48:39,800
this is how we grow up. 
We, we all played when we were 

1877
01:48:39,800 --> 01:48:42,200
kids, and that's this, how we 
learn about the world. 

1878
01:48:42,300 --> 01:48:49,500
And so, in order for us to in in
my mind, unleash our full 

1879
01:48:49,500 --> 01:48:53,500
potential, to unleash the full 
potential of our athletes is we 

1880
01:48:53,500 --> 01:49:04,900
need to recapture and, I want to
say recapture and Re vitalize 

1881
01:49:05,600 --> 01:49:10,000
basically we need to re-inspire 
are our players to play? 

1882
01:49:11,100 --> 01:49:15,800
into play in practice because 
because practice is often times,

1883
01:49:15,800 --> 01:49:21,300
where players check out, I mean,
you can remember this This great

1884
01:49:22,200 --> 01:49:27,900
or this very memorable, famous 
football clip where a, I don't 

1885
01:49:27,900 --> 01:49:30,400
know which football player it 
was but you know, are we talking

1886
01:49:30,400 --> 01:49:32,600
about practice? 
We talking about the game. 

1887
01:49:34,300 --> 01:49:36,700
And I'm pretty sure it was in 
the context of like, why aren't 

1888
01:49:36,700 --> 01:49:38,800
you trying very hard and 
practice like, why are you not 

1889
01:49:38,800 --> 01:49:43,000
taking it seriously? 
And and this is just the notion 

1890
01:49:43,000 --> 01:49:44,600
because practice is boring like 
that. 

1891
01:49:44,600 --> 01:49:48,000
That's what I think that that 
player was saying is like this. 

1892
01:49:48,100 --> 01:49:50,600
I'm not getting better here. 
And I really, what matters the 

1893
01:49:50,608 --> 01:49:53,500
most is how I do on the field. 
So why are we talking about 

1894
01:49:53,500 --> 01:49:56,300
practice? 
And so, if we want to re-engage 

1895
01:49:56,300 --> 01:50:00,900
players in practice, we need to 
really, we need to re-engage 

1896
01:50:00,900 --> 01:50:05,800
them with play. 
So anyways, you have any other 

1897
01:50:05,800 --> 01:50:08,100
thoughts on that or do we want 
to try to? 

1898
01:50:09,800 --> 01:50:13,000
Well, if you more or Hammer, the
point home with the, with the 

1899
01:50:13,000 --> 01:50:15,900
video we in for a little better,
because I know they're out there

1900
01:50:15,900 --> 01:50:18,500
on the play a little bit. 
So probably a appropriate time. 

1901
01:50:19,000 --> 01:50:24,000
Sweet thing that helps you solve
complex problems. 

1902
01:50:24,300 --> 01:50:26,100
He's actually play. 
Yes, serious. 

1903
01:50:26,100 --> 01:50:30,100
Play back that up a second. 
All of this, right? 

1904
01:50:30,100 --> 01:50:31,800
It's missing all of this other 
stuff. 

1905
01:50:31,800 --> 01:50:36,200
A lot of times the thing that 
helps you solve complex problems

1906
01:50:36,500 --> 01:50:38,500
is actually play. 
Yes, seriously. 

1907
01:50:39,000 --> 01:50:41,400
As a martial artist, right? 
You can train, Technics, 

1908
01:50:41,400 --> 01:50:44,700
Technics Technics Technics for 
every day, all day you have a 

1909
01:50:44,700 --> 01:50:49,800
bigger set of techniques and 
nobody else, but it's the feel 

1910
01:50:49,800 --> 01:50:55,800
for how to create Solutions in 
Vivo with another person that 

1911
01:50:55,800 --> 01:51:01,800
allows you to have success. 
And that's So, one of the things

1912
01:51:01,800 --> 01:51:07,900
that I wanted to start with is 
play, helps us solve complex 

1913
01:51:07,900 --> 01:51:10,800
problems. 
And what is more, at least to me

1914
01:51:10,800 --> 01:51:13,900
a complex problem. 
Then trying to hit the baseball 

1915
01:51:14,600 --> 01:51:17,700
that's thrown and moving, but 
you can flip that since you're 

1916
01:51:17,700 --> 01:51:21,700
pitching coach, you know, what 
is more complex than trying to 

1917
01:51:21,708 --> 01:51:24,800
throw a pitch in to see if the 
hitter in to hit your spot or 

1918
01:51:24,800 --> 01:51:27,900
trying to get a hitter out? 
Let me both of those are equally

1919
01:51:28,200 --> 01:51:31,700
difficult. 
Yeah, yeah, harms that. 

1920
01:51:31,700 --> 01:51:35,000
And that's, that's where I don't
think a lot of people go into 

1921
01:51:35,000 --> 01:51:38,000
the train training, or they go 
into a cage where they go into a

1922
01:51:38,000 --> 01:51:40,900
bullpen and think they're 
playing at all at this point. 

1923
01:51:41,400 --> 01:51:43,800
I really, I really, I really 
think that's that's lost and 

1924
01:51:43,800 --> 01:51:46,800
it's it's kind of funny that 
they use in. 

1925
01:51:47,000 --> 01:51:50,700
We get into their term, any 
point here. 

1926
01:51:50,700 --> 01:51:53,900
But series play I think is is a 
gold term and it's kind of 

1927
01:51:53,900 --> 01:51:55,500
funny. 
So just give it. 

1928
01:51:55,500 --> 01:51:57,800
Give you a little story on this.
So I know we talked about a 

1929
01:51:57,808 --> 01:52:00,100
little bit, but I'll gonna bring
my brother a little bit since. 

1930
01:52:00,300 --> 01:52:02,500
He's a, he's a picture and 
division, one school right now 

1931
01:52:03,000 --> 01:52:06,900
and over covid, we had a lot of 
time, just reconnect and just 

1932
01:52:06,900 --> 01:52:10,200
literally play around and stuff 
is that is the definition of it 

1933
01:52:10,200 --> 01:52:14,100
and we started we basically ran 
this guy a new portal and just 

1934
01:52:14,100 --> 01:52:17,400
like the song was moving 
movement stuff and he was he was

1935
01:52:17,400 --> 01:52:19,300
fascinated by stories play 
around with it. 

1936
01:52:19,300 --> 01:52:23,500
And one thing he started doing 
in his catch play is just kind 

1937
01:52:23,500 --> 01:52:26,100
of running around doing 
different variations and trying 

1938
01:52:26,100 --> 01:52:28,500
to throw them all, a bunch of 
ways but still hey fill his spot

1939
01:52:28,500 --> 01:52:32,000
every single time and E.e. saw 
this thing on Twitter talking 

1940
01:52:32,000 --> 01:52:36,600
about this, this coach talking 
about how serious you should be 

1941
01:52:36,600 --> 01:52:40,500
taking taking every throw taking
time in between every throw 

1942
01:52:40,500 --> 01:52:43,000
trying to hit your spot working 
through things every single time

1943
01:52:43,000 --> 01:52:44,500
and my brother goes I don't 
think that's right I think 

1944
01:52:44,508 --> 01:52:48,500
serious I think you should 
approach it in more serious play

1945
01:52:48,500 --> 01:52:52,600
where we're still trying to hit 
her spot where you're exploring,

1946
01:52:52,600 --> 01:52:55,200
your trying different things and
he actually used the word 

1947
01:52:55,200 --> 01:52:57,700
serious but I'm not. 
I had not heard it before that 

1948
01:52:57,700 --> 01:53:00,600
and I don't know if you stole 
from somebody but he Is that and

1949
01:53:00,600 --> 01:53:05,200
then when Rafe and John use, 
there's why I was like that 

1950
01:53:05,300 --> 01:53:08,700
already connected with me a lot 
because I think getting it is 

1951
01:53:08,700 --> 01:53:12,300
it's not just like this term of 
your enjoyment and we don't 

1952
01:53:12,300 --> 01:53:14,200
really care. 
What happened was kind of joking

1953
01:53:14,200 --> 01:53:18,900
around like kids do, but we're 
going to solve complex problems,

1954
01:53:19,400 --> 01:53:22,200
but we're going to explore. 
We're going to allow different 

1955
01:53:22,300 --> 01:53:25,100
different variations. 
We're gonna work outside of 

1956
01:53:25,100 --> 01:53:27,100
techniques. 
We're going to have a have fun 

1957
01:53:27,100 --> 01:53:30,100
while we're doing it in a way 
and but funds not the best. 

1958
01:53:30,200 --> 01:53:31,500
At the goal at the end of the 
day. 

1959
01:53:31,500 --> 01:53:34,500
But yeah that Sears Sears. 
Plunked actually losses. 

1960
01:53:35,000 --> 01:53:37,400
I heard it used before. 
Not in the exact context. 

1961
01:53:37,400 --> 01:53:39,700
I think it's I think it's a gold
term, I think that's it. 

1962
01:53:42,300 --> 01:53:43,400
No. 
Absolutely. 

1963
01:53:43,400 --> 01:53:49,100
And it just as you're talking it
made me think of something Bruce

1964
01:53:49,100 --> 01:53:52,100
Lee was saying, but there's this
other other comment that kind of

1965
01:53:52,108 --> 01:53:54,900
came up. 
I was listening to actually The 

1966
01:53:54,900 --> 01:54:01,000
Joe Rogan podcast recently but 
but this doctor was on there 

1967
01:54:01,000 --> 01:54:07,200
talking about about something 
that should probably probably is

1968
01:54:07,200 --> 01:54:11,600
too too controversial to discuss
on here but anyways what he Did 

1969
01:54:11,600 --> 01:54:13,900
say though that, that struck me.
And I know I've heard other 

1970
01:54:13,900 --> 01:54:17,800
people talk about this is that 
when multiple people come to the

1971
01:54:17,800 --> 01:54:20,700
same conclusion that haven't 
necessarily been talking to each

1972
01:54:20,700 --> 01:54:23,200
other but have been working on 
kind of the same problem, you 

1973
01:54:23,200 --> 01:54:26,100
know, you're onto something or, 
you know, you're onto like the 

1974
01:54:26,100 --> 01:54:28,100
right thing. 
And so, regardless of whether or

1975
01:54:28,100 --> 01:54:32,500
not he heard it from, you know, 
the same person or somebody 

1976
01:54:32,500 --> 01:54:34,700
else. 
Like it's it's the fact that 

1977
01:54:34,700 --> 01:54:38,100
when you're engaged in this type
of thinking, you kind of come to

1978
01:54:38,100 --> 01:54:40,600
the same conclusions. 
Go, I've seen the same thing 

1979
01:54:40,600 --> 01:54:44,200
happen. 
In the, in a sec side of things,

1980
01:54:44,200 --> 01:54:48,700
like some of the things that 
I've been looking into back in 

1981
01:54:48,700 --> 01:54:52,200
2014, or 2015, or whatever into 
2016. 

1982
01:54:52,200 --> 01:54:55,800
Like, now, people are actually 
doing those things, like, when 

1983
01:54:55,800 --> 01:54:58,900
it comes to looking at Javelin, 
when it comes to developing 

1984
01:54:58,900 --> 01:55:02,900
pictures and increasing, 
velocity utilizing kettlebells 

1985
01:55:02,900 --> 01:55:10,100
for four hitters doing, 
isometrics overcoming isometrics

1986
01:55:10,200 --> 01:55:13,500
to increase or Basically 
potentiate a hitter to be able 

1987
01:55:13,500 --> 01:55:17,600
to to swing the bat faster. 
Like these are things that I'm 

1988
01:55:17,600 --> 01:55:21,200
seeing people now do and I was 
and I hadn't seen anybody doing 

1989
01:55:21,200 --> 01:55:23,100
it when I first come across 
these things. 

1990
01:55:23,400 --> 01:55:26,900
Nobody very few people were 
talking about it and I just knew

1991
01:55:26,900 --> 01:55:29,300
as a matter of time before 
people were just we're going to 

1992
01:55:29,300 --> 01:55:31,400
get there. 
I still don't think it's as big 

1993
01:55:31,400 --> 01:55:33,900
as it should be. 
But that's neither here nor 

1994
01:55:33,900 --> 01:55:37,600
there. 
I do want to play this one clip 

1995
01:55:37,600 --> 01:55:41,000
from Bruce Lee and I I'm going 
to probably when I'm going to go

1996
01:55:41,000 --> 01:55:44,200
back and edit this in post to 
just get to the point where he 

1997
01:55:44,200 --> 01:55:50,700
talks about what he's starting 
to talk about like a fight, a 

1998
01:55:50,700 --> 01:55:54,400
good fight. 
And and so we know I'm going to 

1999
01:55:54,407 --> 01:55:57,700
play this. 
And then to kind of hammer this 

2000
01:55:57,700 --> 01:56:04,400
point home a little bit more. 
By the way, if you haven't seen 

2001
01:56:04,600 --> 01:56:06,700
Bruce Lee stuff, you should go 
watch. 

2002
01:56:06,700 --> 01:56:09,200
Like all the clips that Bruce 
Lee is in. 

2003
01:56:09,300 --> 01:56:12,700
So if you go watch his movies, 
expecting it to be great acting,

2004
01:56:13,000 --> 01:56:15,500
you're going to be sorely. 
Disappointed only the scenes 

2005
01:56:15,500 --> 01:56:17,700
that Bruce Lee is in, have good 
acting in them. 

2006
01:56:17,700 --> 01:56:22,500
So you know, if you're feeling 
really bored, just I warned you 

2007
01:56:22,500 --> 01:56:24,900
ahead of time just skip to all 
the parts that he is. 

2008
01:56:24,900 --> 01:56:35,000
It Future. 
Let's see your talents have gone

2009
01:56:35,000 --> 01:56:40,000
beyond the mere physical level. 
Your skills are now at the point

2010
01:56:40,000 --> 01:56:44,500
of spiritual Insight. 
I have several questions. 

2011
01:56:44,800 --> 01:56:47,000
What is the highest technique 
you hope to achieve? 

2012
01:56:47,000 --> 01:56:49,300
To have no technique? 
Very good. 

2013
01:56:50,200 --> 01:56:53,600
But, you know, for copyright 
reasons we're just gonna we're 

2014
01:56:53,600 --> 01:56:56,500
just gonna comment on this 
because one that's that's 

2015
01:56:56,500 --> 01:56:59,700
fantastic right there. 
I mean, okay, so you know, just 

2016
01:56:59,700 --> 01:57:04,900
this whole thing of like the 
convergence Divergence thing of 

2017
01:57:04,900 --> 01:57:08,900
the fact that you have different
people Saying basically the same

2018
01:57:08,900 --> 01:57:12,000
thing. 
I mean, Verve a key. and I'm 

2019
01:57:12,000 --> 01:57:16,900
almost positive Rafe has you 
know is very familiar with Bruce

2020
01:57:16,900 --> 01:57:21,000
Lee and I wouldn't be surprised 
if her Becky is is as well, but 

2021
01:57:21,100 --> 01:57:23,000
but that didn't come up in their
conversation but that is 

2022
01:57:23,000 --> 01:57:27,600
basically what Rafe was there 
talking about there at that when

2023
01:57:27,600 --> 01:57:30,600
we when we oppose that previous 
video into what Vicky was 

2024
01:57:30,600 --> 01:57:34,300
touching on is that you can have
all these techniques but that 

2025
01:57:34,300 --> 01:57:38,700
doesn't necessarily mean that 
you're going to When you're 

2026
01:57:38,700 --> 01:57:44,500
actually dealing with a complex 
unknown problem, that you're 

2027
01:57:44,500 --> 01:57:48,200
actually going to be able to 
deploy that technique to solve 

2028
01:57:48,200 --> 01:57:53,100
your problem. 
And so, Essentially, here what 

2029
01:57:53,100 --> 01:57:56,100
Bruce is saying is that the 
highest technique is to have no 

2030
01:57:56,100 --> 01:57:59,700
technique, and he's going to 
kind of elaborate on that more. 

2031
01:58:00,100 --> 01:58:02,700
But I think coaches should kind 
of sit with that for a little 

2032
01:58:02,700 --> 01:58:04,900
bit to try to understand like 
what is he saying? 

2033
01:58:05,400 --> 01:58:08,900
I was listening to this book on 
perception and the difference it

2034
01:58:08,900 --> 01:58:10,800
was also talking about the 
difference between East and 

2035
01:58:10,800 --> 01:58:14,900
West, like the West has more of 
an analytical mindset and 

2036
01:58:14,900 --> 01:58:18,400
everything following from logic.
So very, very much from the 

2037
01:58:18,400 --> 01:58:23,100
Greeks and, you know, Socrates 
Plato Aristotle Everything kind 

2038
01:58:23,100 --> 01:58:26,300
of follows this this very linear
logical pattern. 

2039
01:58:26,400 --> 01:58:31,000
And so with that you have things
that always follow from a 

2040
01:58:31,008 --> 01:58:33,600
premise so you can't have two 
contradictory things. 

2041
01:58:33,900 --> 01:58:37,400
And so what Bruce just said 
there is very Eastern where they

2042
01:58:37,400 --> 01:58:40,000
very much will say something 
that seems kind of 

2043
01:58:40,000 --> 01:58:42,600
contradictory. 
You know, what's the highest 

2044
01:58:42,600 --> 01:58:44,500
form of technique is to have no 
technique. 

2045
01:58:44,500 --> 01:58:48,200
Well, that doesn't make sense. 
Like, how do you have? 

2046
01:58:49,200 --> 01:58:53,000
the best technique equaling, no 
technique, like these things 

2047
01:58:53,000 --> 01:58:56,400
don't, don't logically follow 
from one from another and so, 

2048
01:58:58,800 --> 01:59:02,400
There is a larger truth I think 
to to ponder it's designed to 

2049
01:59:02,407 --> 01:59:05,600
make you think. 
So I'm going to throw that out 

2050
01:59:05,600 --> 01:59:09,400
there before we proceed here 
what are your thoughts when 

2051
01:59:09,400 --> 01:59:11,900
facing an opponent days? 
No opponent. 

2052
01:59:12,900 --> 01:59:16,800
And why is that? 
Because the word I does not 

2053
01:59:16,800 --> 01:59:20,300
exist. 
Out of everything that Bruce 

2054
01:59:20,300 --> 01:59:23,000
says there, this is the only 
thing that I have zero idea. 

2055
01:59:23,300 --> 01:59:25,500
What the heck? 
He means by that. 

2056
01:59:26,300 --> 01:59:29,100
So do you have any ideas of what
he might be saying there? 

2057
01:59:31,000 --> 01:59:34,200
No, I mean, it's something maybe
I'll revisit and try to think 

2058
01:59:34,200 --> 01:59:35,800
through a little more but off 
the rip know. 

2059
01:59:36,900 --> 01:59:41,100
I mean I could, we could go on 
and on about, you know, the 

2060
01:59:41,100 --> 01:59:42,800
highest form of technique is to 
have no technique. 

2061
01:59:42,800 --> 01:59:45,700
I wrote a blog post on it for 
emergent, so if anybody wants 

2062
01:59:45,700 --> 01:59:50,100
the my thoughts on that, they 
can go check that out but I'll 

2063
01:59:50,100 --> 01:59:51,600
tell you all. 
I got nothing on this one. 

2064
01:59:51,600 --> 01:59:56,500
So. 
So, something new. 

2065
01:59:58,800 --> 02:00:05,500
A good fight, should be like a 
small play, but played 

2066
02:00:05,500 --> 02:00:10,100
seriously. 
Boom, my dad's. 

2067
02:00:10,100 --> 02:00:13,300
That's what I was thinking of 
when you're talking about 

2068
02:00:13,300 --> 02:00:19,200
serious play. 
Yeah, like and What did he say 

2069
02:00:19,200 --> 02:00:22,700
there will planets all play a 
good fight. 

2070
02:00:22,700 --> 02:00:29,000
Should be like a small play but 
yeah so a good fight should be 

2071
02:00:29,000 --> 02:00:31,800
like a small play and that's 
that's interesting in the sense 

2072
02:00:31,800 --> 02:00:36,900
that There's something else that
Bruce has talked about that. 

2073
02:00:36,900 --> 02:00:42,200
I very much have incorporated 
into my hitting philosophy. 

2074
02:00:42,400 --> 02:00:48,200
Is this notion of We need to 
have emotional content, and when

2075
02:00:48,200 --> 02:00:50,800
I think about a play, when you 
think about a play, it's very 

2076
02:00:50,800 --> 02:00:54,700
dramatic, like there. 
And so within it, there is 

2077
02:00:54,700 --> 02:00:58,000
emotional content. 
And so there's, there's a level 

2078
02:00:58,000 --> 02:01:00,800
of what he is saying, both in 
the sense of what we've been 

2079
02:01:00,800 --> 02:01:04,200
talking about that, we need to 
play with things but also within

2080
02:01:04,200 --> 02:01:07,300
that there should be a motion, 
there's some level of emotion, 

2081
02:01:07,300 --> 02:01:10,300
some level of aliveness some 
level of personality. 

2082
02:01:10,300 --> 02:01:13,100
I think that might be something 
better for players to connect 

2083
02:01:13,100 --> 02:01:15,800
with is that when you're 
playing, you should have some 

2084
02:01:15,900 --> 02:01:20,700
level of Personality involved. 
And but yet at the same time 

2085
02:01:20,700 --> 02:01:23,800
you're taking it seriously. 
You're not just playing around 

2086
02:01:23,800 --> 02:01:27,100
to goof around. 
Yeah, you're playing around to 

2087
02:01:27,400 --> 02:01:32,300
discover more about the drawer, 
the world that you inhabit in a 

2088
02:01:32,308 --> 02:01:34,400
way. 
But it's more specifically, 

2089
02:01:34,600 --> 02:01:37,300
you're trying to discover more 
about yourself within this 

2090
02:01:37,300 --> 02:01:42,600
environment within this context 
and how do you relate to the 

2091
02:01:42,600 --> 02:01:46,300
problem so to speak. 
And this this kind of leads me 

2092
02:01:46,300 --> 02:01:50,600
to this other little rant that I
have of by seeing things through

2093
02:01:50,600 --> 02:01:53,700
an ecological approach. 
I'd begun to appreciate more 

2094
02:01:54,400 --> 02:01:57,800
about relationships and that's 
the difference a to between, I 

2095
02:01:57,800 --> 02:02:00,800
guess to this, this perception 
book was talking about east and 

2096
02:02:00,800 --> 02:02:03,600
west east like it in Eastern 
cultures. 

2097
02:02:03,600 --> 02:02:06,300
They think very much more about 
like how things relate to one 

2098
02:02:06,300 --> 02:02:08,300
another. 
So if you were to give a list of

2099
02:02:08,700 --> 02:02:17,100
like love hand scarf, Westerners
would oftentimes pair scarf and 

2100
02:02:17,100 --> 02:02:21,800
gloves together and people from 
Eastern cultures would pair love

2101
02:02:21,800 --> 02:02:25,100
and hand together because 
they're looking more at the 

2102
02:02:25,100 --> 02:02:26,800
relationship between the two 
things. 

2103
02:02:26,800 --> 02:02:28,800
Like. 
So the glove covers the hand 

2104
02:02:28,900 --> 02:02:32,100
type of the thing. 
And so, an ecological approach 

2105
02:02:32,100 --> 02:02:35,500
kind of takes a similar view of 
like, it's very much looking at,

2106
02:02:35,500 --> 02:02:37,500
like, how do we relate to other 
things? 

2107
02:02:38,000 --> 02:02:41,200
And so, I mean, what did we talk
about at the very beginning of 

2108
02:02:41,208 --> 02:02:43,700
this conversation Ocean like 
building relationships. 

2109
02:02:43,700 --> 02:02:49,400
How do we relate to one another?
And so I think when it comes to 

2110
02:02:49,400 --> 02:02:52,700
play part of what we're doing 
when we are playing, is figuring

2111
02:02:52,700 --> 02:02:56,300
out how we relate to one another
or to other things around us 

2112
02:02:56,500 --> 02:03:00,200
into the world around us. 
Yeah, no I was I was even 

2113
02:03:00,200 --> 02:03:03,300
pondering that. 
I mean we just put some of the 

2114
02:03:03,300 --> 02:03:05,500
staff is a simple as we just 
went out and play Gold Spike 

2115
02:03:05,500 --> 02:03:09,500
ball and I think that game in 
itself, the interactions, the 

2116
02:03:09,500 --> 02:03:12,300
learning the fact that you have 
to learn your partner's, you 

2117
02:03:12,300 --> 02:03:15,200
have to basically, without 
without even talking, you're 

2118
02:03:15,200 --> 02:03:18,000
interacting with each other's of
own affordances, you have to 

2119
02:03:18,000 --> 02:03:20,900
learn their for dances was as 
you're working on your own 

2120
02:03:20,900 --> 02:03:24,500
because I'm not, I'm personally 
not that great at like hitting 

2121
02:03:24,500 --> 02:03:26,500
the ball into the net. 
Like that's probably why we like

2122
02:03:26,500 --> 02:03:29,700
I'm not I'm not like a sauce 
like a Game before, but like 

2123
02:03:29,700 --> 02:03:31,600
that's not my strong suit, a 
home away from the net and my 

2124
02:03:31,608 --> 02:03:34,200
struggle with that. 
But I know my partner's a lot 

2125
02:03:34,200 --> 02:03:37,700
better at that and I'm just 
like, working working alongside 

2126
02:03:37,700 --> 02:03:41,000
him and like learning him 
through the game in a way and 

2127
02:03:41,000 --> 02:03:44,700
learning his capabilities. 
And like, just just through 

2128
02:03:44,700 --> 02:03:48,800
play, I learned you learn all 
about like, his, his own 

2129
02:03:48,800 --> 02:03:51,200
movement is capabilities. 
You actually like him pick up a 

2130
02:03:51,208 --> 02:03:54,200
little bit about personality. 
I think Ray talks about that in 

2131
02:03:54,200 --> 02:03:58,300
his Riven by play, Ted talk, a 
little bit. 

2132
02:03:58,500 --> 02:04:01,800
Like, as you play, you learn a 
little bit about yourself where 

2133
02:04:01,800 --> 02:04:04,800
you should try to go in life and
you almost like, you're most 

2134
02:04:04,800 --> 02:04:10,100
like, figuring out what, what or
what half you should go down and

2135
02:04:10,100 --> 02:04:13,200
you're learning about yourself 
and are you risk-taker? 

2136
02:04:13,200 --> 02:04:15,600
Are you not a risk taker and 
like, just through play. 

2137
02:04:15,600 --> 02:04:17,200
It's going to expose those 
things. 

2138
02:04:17,200 --> 02:04:20,600
And are you going to be good 
with organizing things are going

2139
02:04:20,600 --> 02:04:23,800
to be good with just going out 
and trying to possibly like 

2140
02:04:23,900 --> 02:04:25,800
Grace up? 
There we go with Ation tips. 

2141
02:04:25,800 --> 02:04:28,300
Are you going to be good with 
whatever it may be but just to 

2142
02:04:28,300 --> 02:04:30,800
play gives you a really really 
strong in sight. 

2143
02:04:30,800 --> 02:04:33,000
Look at that. 
That was happening. 

2144
02:04:33,000 --> 02:04:34,600
I was just kind of like, we're 
just playing spikeball. 

2145
02:04:34,600 --> 02:04:36,200
I mean, maybe these things from 
be going. 

2146
02:04:36,200 --> 02:04:39,400
I'm a going through my head's 
worth playing hard playing game.

2147
02:04:39,700 --> 02:04:41,200
But like these other things, 
like, I'm pondering. 

2148
02:04:41,200 --> 02:04:43,400
As I'm, as I'm, like, 
interacting with him and we're 

2149
02:04:43,400 --> 02:04:46,400
like learning each other, and 
we're figuring out how to, how 

2150
02:04:46,400 --> 02:04:48,500
to best perform the task at 
hand. 

2151
02:04:48,500 --> 02:04:51,500
But we're, we're communicating 
in a way that's a nonverbal 

2152
02:04:51,500 --> 02:04:54,100
communication, as we're picking 
up each other's affordances. 

2153
02:04:54,100 --> 02:04:56,800
And that's it. 
It's fascinating, if you really 

2154
02:04:56,800 --> 02:04:59,300
kind of look at it at that and 
that point of view, I guess. 

2155
02:05:00,300 --> 02:05:07,300
Mmm, Yeah. 
And Like this just kind of goes 

2156
02:05:07,300 --> 02:05:13,600
plays into this this notion of 
embodied cognition how our 

2157
02:05:13,600 --> 02:05:18,500
movements help us make 
connections with other things. 

2158
02:05:19,200 --> 02:05:22,800
And so that's that's where like 
activity and movement and 

2159
02:05:22,800 --> 02:05:28,300
lifelong movement and play is so
beneficial for our growth. 

2160
02:05:28,600 --> 02:05:32,200
I mean, because if it was, it's 
kind of one of those things in 

2161
02:05:32,200 --> 02:05:35,500
strength and conditioning, there
is this big Obsession about 

2162
02:05:35,600 --> 02:05:41,800
about making the case for, These
Primal movements that everybody 

2163
02:05:41,900 --> 02:05:44,200
has in. 
This is like, look, a baby, a 

2164
02:05:44,200 --> 02:05:48,000
baby, you know, has really good 
rib cage. 

2165
02:05:48,100 --> 02:05:49,400
You know, the ribs are down in 
there. 

2166
02:05:49,400 --> 02:05:52,400
Don't have anterior pelvic tilt,
which makes no sense to me or 

2167
02:05:52,400 --> 02:05:53,900
whatever. 
Is my kid. 

2168
02:05:53,900 --> 02:05:58,900
Has massive anterior pelvic tilt
in this had it since since he's 

2169
02:05:58,900 --> 02:06:02,000
been upright walking around and 
like this is the thing of like, 

2170
02:06:02,100 --> 02:06:04,900
but everybody was couching their
arguments in, like our system is

2171
02:06:04,900 --> 02:06:08,300
designed around. 
Like how, child's our children. 

2172
02:06:08,300 --> 02:06:09,400
Develop? 
What? 

2173
02:06:09,500 --> 02:06:13,100
One of the Hallmarks of how 
children develop is play. 

2174
02:06:14,200 --> 02:06:18,500
And so if that if we've been 
going back to try to do physical

2175
02:06:20,100 --> 02:06:27,200
development and training around 
or rehab around how children 

2176
02:06:27,400 --> 02:06:32,200
theoretically develop in like 
crawl and roll and whatever. 

2177
02:06:34,500 --> 02:06:37,200
Then we actually need to also 
look at how they actually 

2178
02:06:37,200 --> 02:06:40,900
acquired all their other skills 
and that's that's how we acquire

2179
02:06:40,900 --> 02:06:44,900
skills and we need to get back 
to that and serious play. 

2180
02:06:44,900 --> 02:06:51,000
Is that form. 
Yeah, I'm going to, let's roll 

2181
02:06:51,000 --> 02:06:53,500
this for. 
Let's see if where they where 

2182
02:06:53,500 --> 02:06:57,900
they land the plane here. 
That's fundamentally the same 

2183
02:06:57,900 --> 02:07:01,200
thing in some sense as being a 
teacher as being a coach because

2184
02:07:01,200 --> 02:07:04,100
play is repetition with 
variation, right? 

2185
02:07:04,100 --> 02:07:07,000
Yes, the verb, I do tai chi 
Chuan, right? 

2186
02:07:07,000 --> 02:07:09,600
And the verb, you don't do tai 
chi that Chinese workers, you 

2187
02:07:09,600 --> 02:07:11,800
play it. 
But when you play music, right? 

2188
02:07:11,800 --> 02:07:14,900
Your Tai Chi player, and it's 
the same sort of thing, 

2189
02:07:15,100 --> 02:07:19,300
seriously is the way we go 
through these very difficult. 

2190
02:07:19,300 --> 02:07:22,800
Transformative, experiences 
therapy is a kind of serious 

2191
02:07:22,800 --> 02:07:25,700
play martial arts with an 
improperly are serious. 

2192
02:07:25,700 --> 02:07:27,300
Played. 
I would say, I think another 

2193
02:07:27,300 --> 02:07:31,200
disservice our culture has given
us is we've lost that category, 

2194
02:07:31,200 --> 02:07:33,500
serious play. 
Play has been assimilated to 

2195
02:07:33,500 --> 02:07:36,700
Leisure and to fun, we're right 
with. 

2196
02:07:36,700 --> 02:07:41,700
And, and some play is 
entertaining, and I'm not saying

2197
02:07:41,700 --> 02:07:46,200
we dispense with them, but we 
shouldn't reduce all play to 

2198
02:07:46,200 --> 02:07:50,100
entertaining play. 
Some play, is the serious play. 

2199
02:07:50,200 --> 02:07:54,200
That engages fundamental 
transformative processes for us.

2200
02:07:54,700 --> 02:07:59,300
I have Actually, that was a good
place to stop. 

2201
02:07:59,300 --> 02:08:06,700
Like play facilitates like 
transformation one at. 

2202
02:08:06,700 --> 02:08:09,500
One of the other things too that
I took out of there, like Rafe 

2203
02:08:09,500 --> 02:08:13,800
talked about play playing has a 
level of variation or play with 

2204
02:08:13,800 --> 02:08:19,200
variation in it and this is that
rep without rep approach, and I 

2205
02:08:19,200 --> 02:08:22,700
just think back to like when you
create a game when it starts 

2206
02:08:22,700 --> 02:08:25,700
out, all you're doing is 
something like I remember being 

2207
02:08:25,700 --> 02:08:30,900
over at my neighbors and In her 
garage they had like these golf 

2208
02:08:30,900 --> 02:08:33,500
balls you know for the car or 
whatever and they're just kind 

2209
02:08:33,500 --> 02:08:36,100
of hanging there and we just 
kind of sat there and I think 

2210
02:08:36,100 --> 02:08:38,600
maybe at first we just started 
swatting a back-and-forth and 

2211
02:08:38,600 --> 02:08:42,000
then it was like, wait I got 
some like paddles, like ping 

2212
02:08:42,000 --> 02:08:44,500
pong paddles or whatever. 
They're just sitting over here. 

2213
02:08:44,500 --> 02:08:46,200
And so we pick them up and we're
just like, going to smack him 

2214
02:08:46,200 --> 02:08:49,300
back and forth and eventually 
the ball like ends up wrapped 

2215
02:08:49,300 --> 02:08:54,000
around the, because it was 
hanging off of a shelving unit. 

2216
02:08:54,100 --> 02:08:56,800
And so, it ends up wrapped 
around the post that it's 

2217
02:08:56,800 --> 02:08:59,100
attached to. 
To we're like oh cool that's a 

2218
02:08:59,100 --> 02:09:01,200
point or whatever. 
And now this turned into this 

2219
02:09:01,200 --> 02:09:05,500
game like it starts out with 
something super mundane that 

2220
02:09:05,500 --> 02:09:08,000
you're just like oh there's this
thing here and I'm just kind of 

2221
02:09:08,008 --> 02:09:11,400
goofing around with it and then 
it morphed into something else. 

2222
02:09:12,100 --> 02:09:16,500
And I think that's so much you 
know that goes back to what for 

2223
02:09:16,500 --> 02:09:19,400
Becky was talking about there. 
At the end of how play ends up 

2224
02:09:19,500 --> 02:09:24,300
being transformative, was that 
perv a cure was that Rafe, I 

2225
02:09:24,308 --> 02:09:25,800
think that's I think it at the 
end. 

2226
02:09:26,100 --> 02:09:30,200
Yeah. 
And so like, to me, this is just

2227
02:09:30,200 --> 02:09:32,600
the perfect example of how, 
like, how things transform over 

2228
02:09:32,600 --> 02:09:35,600
time into this game. 
And then, through through games,

2229
02:09:35,600 --> 02:09:37,400
we can actually learn more about
ourselves. 

2230
02:09:40,000 --> 02:09:45,300
Yeah, I want to throw this over 
to you before I keep going and 

2231
02:09:45,300 --> 02:09:48,000
see what else that you picked 
out of that little bit there. 

2232
02:09:48,500 --> 02:09:52,000
Yeah, no, I think what I heard 
repetition with variation, I 

2233
02:09:52,000 --> 02:09:54,500
mean I was like I never heard 
nothing like going that way, but

2234
02:09:54,500 --> 02:09:56,400
I mean that's right. 
That's rough without rep in a 

2235
02:09:56,400 --> 02:09:59,500
spot on I mean that that is play
in a nutshell and that's what we

2236
02:10:00,200 --> 02:10:02,200
I guess. 
Bring it back to the baseball 

2237
02:10:02,200 --> 02:10:05,000
side is like that's what we try 
to encourage our guys to do. 

2238
02:10:05,000 --> 02:10:08,700
A lot of is like our cosplay. 
Let's, let's have repetition 

2239
02:10:08,700 --> 02:10:11,700
with variation. 
Like play around with this and I

2240
02:10:11,708 --> 02:10:15,100
my players actually get annoyed 
in this may be me not 

2241
02:10:15,100 --> 02:10:18,400
communicating as well, but like 
I'll give him a concept and I 

2242
02:10:18,407 --> 02:10:20,100
was like, all right, let's play 
around with this. 

2243
02:10:20,100 --> 02:10:21,600
And those are the verbatim 
words? 

2244
02:10:21,600 --> 02:10:24,800
I use a lot and like I haven't 
heard one of my players like 

2245
02:10:25,100 --> 02:10:29,600
like pretending to coach me up 
is like Yay, coach coach Baker. 

2246
02:10:29,600 --> 02:10:31,900
My try this and I just play 
around with this a little bit. 

2247
02:10:32,100 --> 02:10:35,700
Yeah I thought that's hilarious 
and I'm like okay maybe and 

2248
02:10:36,300 --> 02:10:38,900
maybe I might yeah, cueing it 
perfectly or maybe I'm not. 

2249
02:10:39,900 --> 02:10:41,700
Perfectly says that there's 
limes there. 

2250
02:10:41,700 --> 02:10:43,700
I heard him talking. 
Like I'm just so frustrated, 

2251
02:10:43,700 --> 02:10:46,400
just tells me to play around 
with this, but I think it goes 

2252
02:10:46,400 --> 02:10:47,900
into to fold where, like they 
want. 

2253
02:10:47,900 --> 02:10:50,200
Just the answer and they've lost
serious play. 

2254
02:10:50,600 --> 02:10:53,000
They've lost the ability to 
explore in a lot of ways. 

2255
02:10:53,000 --> 02:10:57,400
Since it's the system itself has
been more just like were spewing

2256
02:10:57,400 --> 02:11:00,700
out answers were looking for 
answers and we're just doing 

2257
02:11:00,700 --> 02:11:04,300
them Outburst like exploring. 
But I could be a little bit on 

2258
02:11:04,300 --> 02:11:08,300
me to like, how I'm encouraging 
the flavors just like just 

2259
02:11:08,300 --> 02:11:10,500
saying, hey go play around with 
this but how Am I creating that 

2260
02:11:10,500 --> 02:11:12,800
environment to actually allow 
them to explore? 

2261
02:11:12,800 --> 02:11:14,300
Is it a rich environment to go 
explore? 

2262
02:11:14,300 --> 02:11:16,400
Does it Inspire them to go 
explore? 

2263
02:11:17,000 --> 02:11:18,900
Is that is another thing that 
I've been, I've been kind of 

2264
02:11:18,900 --> 02:11:20,900
thinking a lot on. 
How do I do that better? 

2265
02:11:22,300 --> 02:11:24,300
Nothing serious plays it in my 
own life. 

2266
02:11:24,300 --> 02:11:27,300
I noticed like my own training. 
Like, when I engage in serious 

2267
02:11:27,300 --> 02:11:31,800
play, I've trained a heck of a 
lot more and I train a lot 

2268
02:11:31,800 --> 02:11:35,000
harder when I allow myself to 
engage in it, when I'm looking, 

2269
02:11:35,300 --> 02:11:38,800
when I'm looking for, maybe even
like I'm looking for information

2270
02:11:38,800 --> 02:11:41,000
on you. 
Logical and Dynamics or 

2271
02:11:41,300 --> 02:11:44,000
constraint, let approach. 
And I engage myself in series 

2272
02:11:44,000 --> 02:11:47,600
play with how I think through 
the ideas and work through some 

2273
02:11:47,600 --> 02:11:49,500
of the ideas. 
It's almost like a serious play.

2274
02:11:49,500 --> 02:11:51,800
As I work through the 
information in a way and when I 

2275
02:11:51,808 --> 02:11:54,900
do that verse, I'm just looking 
for the answer and just 

2276
02:11:54,900 --> 02:11:56,600
regurgitating onto a piece of 
paper. 

2277
02:11:56,600 --> 02:12:00,400
That's allows me to learn it and
interact with it and make it 

2278
02:12:00,400 --> 02:12:03,300
come more alive. 
So I think just that alone, that

2279
02:12:03,300 --> 02:12:05,900
Sears play and like being able 
to like the repetition of 

2280
02:12:05,900 --> 02:12:09,000
variation, I think it's spot-on.
And I've been, I've been 

2281
02:12:09,000 --> 02:12:11,600
pondering that That a lot in my 
own coaching and just even like 

2282
02:12:11,600 --> 02:12:13,300
my own life. 
Like how do I, how do I engage 

2283
02:12:13,300 --> 02:12:19,200
this plumber? 
Yeah, it just makes me want to 

2284
02:12:19,208 --> 02:12:21,600
go back to. 
I was looking up the whole thing

2285
02:12:21,600 --> 02:12:24,300
on like we need in order for us 
to understand something, we 

2286
02:12:24,300 --> 02:12:27,000
actually need to have a role in 
creating it. 

2287
02:12:27,000 --> 02:12:31,200
Yes. 
You know and and so, like 

2288
02:12:31,200 --> 02:12:35,600
there's this notion that we have
to self-generate Things in order

2289
02:12:35,600 --> 02:12:38,600
to learn more about them to 
actually have this embodied 

2290
02:12:38,600 --> 02:12:42,100
experience of the thing and 
there's this this notion and 

2291
02:12:42,100 --> 02:12:45,100
maybe we've talked about this 
before the idea of knowledge of 

2292
02:12:45,100 --> 02:12:47,300
something versus knowledge about
something. 

2293
02:12:48,400 --> 02:12:55,100
And so Feel like I had another 
point on that but like theirs. 

2294
02:12:56,500 --> 02:13:00,700
that to me, is kind of the When 
you're talking about like this 

2295
02:13:00,700 --> 02:13:05,200
idea, like I was thinking about 
this too when you said that 

2296
02:13:05,200 --> 02:13:10,000
they're kind of were making fun 
of you about it and I also think

2297
02:13:10,000 --> 02:13:12,800
that that's when things start to
kind of Click for guys is when 

2298
02:13:12,800 --> 02:13:14,900
it becomes me mobile. 
Yeah you know because that's 

2299
02:13:14,900 --> 02:13:17,300
basically what it is and you're 
like, okay now it's starting to 

2300
02:13:17,300 --> 02:13:19,400
stick a little bit. 
Yeah, you might not fully 

2301
02:13:19,400 --> 02:13:25,000
understand it yet but now it's 
enough of a meme that That like 

2302
02:13:25,000 --> 02:13:27,900
okay, this is a theme of. 
What's like, how we're going to 

2303
02:13:27,907 --> 02:13:31,400
begin to interact with this? 
And so I guess where I go from 

2304
02:13:31,400 --> 02:13:34,800
there is is maybe trying to pull
back the curtain a little bit in

2305
02:13:34,800 --> 02:13:37,900
terms of okay, what is play, 
what am I asking you to do? 

2306
02:13:37,900 --> 02:13:40,000
When I say play, this is what I 
mean by it. 

2307
02:13:40,100 --> 02:13:42,700
And if you don't understand it 
like let's maybe less dialogue 

2308
02:13:42,700 --> 02:13:45,800
about it. 
Like and and it is to your point

2309
02:13:45,800 --> 02:13:49,100
of the fact that guys so much 
want the answer and I was 

2310
02:13:49,100 --> 02:13:53,400
thinking about this in terms of 
I've been working with somebody 

2311
02:13:53,400 --> 02:13:56,100
for with with martial arts and 
we're trying to take an 

2312
02:13:56,100 --> 02:13:59,000
ecological approach but yet at 
the same time, he's struggling 

2313
02:13:59,000 --> 02:14:02,800
with things because he's like 
she says that there are certain 

2314
02:14:02,800 --> 02:14:05,000
things you're not going to find 
on your own and I think that's 

2315
02:14:05,000 --> 02:14:08,600
also what the player is is 
alluding to is when I play 

2316
02:14:08,600 --> 02:14:12,600
around with this stuff. 
Like I hit a wall I like there's

2317
02:14:12,600 --> 02:14:14,400
whatever the answer is that 
you're talking about. 

2318
02:14:14,400 --> 02:14:18,500
I just I'm not able to find it 
and so but the reason the thing 

2319
02:14:18,500 --> 02:14:21,600
is is like you do inadvertently,
find things when you start. 

2320
02:14:21,700 --> 02:14:23,500
Playing with other people 
because they have a different 

2321
02:14:23,500 --> 02:14:25,400
perspective, they have a 
different different life 

2322
02:14:25,400 --> 02:14:30,000
experiences Etc. 
And so through that, they are 

2323
02:14:30,000 --> 02:14:32,200
going to discover things that 
you're not going to discover and

2324
02:14:32,200 --> 02:14:34,800
when they discover that and if 
you're able to see it and or if 

2325
02:14:34,800 --> 02:14:39,000
they share it, then you have a 
new way of trying to interact 

2326
02:14:39,500 --> 02:14:43,400
with that thing that you're 
playing in a new intention and 

2327
02:14:43,400 --> 02:14:47,700
all that sort of stuff. 
And so for me that's that's how 

2328
02:14:47,700 --> 02:14:51,000
I approach of that. 
It's like you're going to try to

2329
02:14:51,000 --> 02:14:54,200
get You know, Explorer play 
around and get as far with it as

2330
02:14:54,200 --> 02:14:56,300
you can, and then I'll 
interject. 

2331
02:14:56,300 --> 02:14:58,700
I'll drop a little nugget in 
there for you too. 

2332
02:14:59,000 --> 02:15:01,000
Now play. 
Now you have something new to 

2333
02:15:01,000 --> 02:15:02,600
play with its in a way you 
could. 

2334
02:15:04,000 --> 02:15:05,400
You know, whether it's an idea 
or whatever. 

2335
02:15:05,400 --> 02:15:07,000
It's kind of like this new toy. 
All right. 

2336
02:15:07,000 --> 02:15:09,400
I'm dropping a new toy into the 
environment and now you have 

2337
02:15:09,400 --> 02:15:12,700
another way that you can 
interact with this problem that 

2338
02:15:12,700 --> 02:15:15,500
you're trying to solve or this 
landscape that you're trying to 

2339
02:15:15,500 --> 02:15:21,100
interact with. 
And so that's That's in a way I 

2340
02:15:21,100 --> 02:15:23,900
guess when I would talk to them 
I talk to them in terms of like,

2341
02:15:23,900 --> 02:15:26,000
all right, think about play, 
what is play? 

2342
02:15:26,300 --> 02:15:27,600
What are you doing? 
When you play? 

2343
02:15:27,900 --> 02:15:34,000
And if you're not fully aware, 
then then it's like because, I 

2344
02:15:34,000 --> 02:15:37,200
also think. 
Like, you do have to explain 

2345
02:15:37,400 --> 02:15:39,300
this. 
This idea of like, okay, when 

2346
02:15:39,300 --> 02:15:44,500
you played off into you ever do 
pretend, and when you pretended 

2347
02:15:44,500 --> 02:15:47,000
to be something or whatever, 
like what were you mimicking? 

2348
02:15:48,600 --> 02:15:51,300
And by mimicking like his, 
here's this notion of 

2349
02:15:51,300 --> 02:15:53,600
embodiment. 
We don't understand a thing 

2350
02:15:53,600 --> 02:15:56,800
until we interact with it and so
what do kids do, they mimic 

2351
02:15:56,800 --> 02:15:59,700
other Other things that they 
see. 

2352
02:15:59,700 --> 02:16:05,800
And so, for example, one day my 
kid is sitting at at the dinner 

2353
02:16:05,800 --> 02:16:08,800
table and is just going. 
No, no, it is. 

2354
02:16:09,300 --> 02:16:10,500
It's got the finger in there, 
too. 

2355
02:16:10,500 --> 02:16:13,100
And I'm like, what is he doing? 
Oh my gosh. 

2356
02:16:13,100 --> 02:16:18,400
He's mocking me and I'm like, 
but if it weren't for an 

2357
02:16:18,400 --> 02:16:22,000
ecological approach, I would 
have probably been really 

2358
02:16:22,000 --> 02:16:27,200
offended some like, Dig It by 
disciplining of my child has not

2359
02:16:27,200 --> 02:16:29,500
worked instead. 
Is just mocking me, which I 

2360
02:16:29,508 --> 02:16:31,200
guess is fair. 
Because I mock him all the time,

2361
02:16:31,200 --> 02:16:32,400
too. 
Sometimes when he's throwing a 

2362
02:16:32,407 --> 02:16:34,200
fit. 
So I guess it's only fitting, 

2363
02:16:34,200 --> 02:16:37,400
but What from an ecological 
approach. 

2364
02:16:37,500 --> 02:16:40,299
What I then understood it was 
like oh wait this is actually a 

2365
02:16:40,299 --> 02:16:43,600
good thing because now he can 
understand more when I'm doing 

2366
02:16:43,600 --> 02:16:44,900
this. 
What I mean? 

2367
02:16:45,400 --> 02:16:49,000
And like now he can feel like oh
dad is mad. 

2368
02:16:49,000 --> 02:16:52,600
You know and what by doing this 
like there's more energy and 

2369
02:16:52,600 --> 02:16:57,700
weight behind it. 
So this is to me this notion of 

2370
02:16:59,600 --> 02:17:03,600
Of playing. 
And when we play when we mimic 

2371
02:17:03,600 --> 02:17:06,700
other things, we actually get a 
deeper understanding of that 

2372
02:17:06,700 --> 02:17:08,500
thing. 
And this is the weird thing to 

2373
02:17:08,500 --> 02:17:11,700
like, have you ever tried 
dancing and, you know, you're 

2374
02:17:11,700 --> 02:17:13,700
just not getting it and then 
when you're just like, you know 

2375
02:17:13,700 --> 02:17:16,100
what? 
You come back later and somebody

2376
02:17:16,100 --> 02:17:18,799
else is dancing and you know, 
because you sucked at it, you're

2377
02:17:18,799 --> 02:17:20,799
like, all right, I'm going to 
mock you and then when you go to

2378
02:17:20,799 --> 02:17:23,500
mock them you like do it. 
You execute it like almost 

2379
02:17:23,500 --> 02:17:28,299
perfectly and it's kind of like,
what the heck when I get into 

2380
02:17:28,299 --> 02:17:30,500
this mocking mode. 
And I free myself. 

2381
02:17:30,500 --> 02:17:33,000
I loosing myself up to mimic the
other person and then I'm 

2382
02:17:33,000 --> 02:17:37,700
actually able to do the thing. 
I find that to be a, I don't 

2383
02:17:37,700 --> 02:17:40,400
know if anybody else has had 
that experience, but I've 

2384
02:17:40,400 --> 02:17:43,900
noticed whenever I try to make 
fun of something, whether it's a

2385
02:17:43,907 --> 02:17:47,799
voice or whatever, you actually 
hit it pretty well and this is 

2386
02:17:47,799 --> 02:17:53,200
this idea of acting. 
Yeah so it's very interesting, 

2387
02:17:53,200 --> 02:17:56,500
this notion of play and how we 
actually begin to have knowledge

2388
02:17:56,500 --> 02:17:58,500
of and better understand a 
thing. 

2389
02:18:00,000 --> 02:18:03,400
Bye-bye actually playing which 
is weird because like for 

2390
02:18:03,400 --> 02:18:10,900
vehicie is talking about is 
we've come to believe that play 

2391
02:18:10,900 --> 02:18:14,700
is just this entertainment some 
leisurely activity that we do. 

2392
02:18:15,100 --> 02:18:18,400
That has no seriousness. 
No actual application. 

2393
02:18:18,799 --> 02:18:22,900
You know that's what kids do. 
Real serious professionals don't

2394
02:18:22,900 --> 02:18:23,799
play. 
Yeah. 

2395
02:18:24,900 --> 02:18:27,799
And it's just this bizarre thing
where like the world is getting 

2396
02:18:27,799 --> 02:18:32,200
turned upside down and the 
things that we thought were the 

2397
02:18:32,200 --> 02:18:34,799
way to lead us to the most 
success. 

2398
02:18:34,799 --> 02:18:36,700
We're actually the things that 
we started with. 

2399
02:18:37,400 --> 02:18:40,500
Yeah exactly. 
And I mean I think right rape 

2400
02:18:40,500 --> 02:18:43,700
talks about it again back to 
that that sock is like bleh. 

2401
02:18:43,799 --> 02:18:47,400
Bleh will increase your ability 
to continue through something 

2402
02:18:47,400 --> 02:18:49,900
and it's not just displaying you
had this place is really 

2403
02:18:49,900 --> 02:18:53,400
important but play will increase
motivation and will continue to 

2404
02:18:53,700 --> 02:18:57,100
allow you to actually You strive
for whatever you're going for if

2405
02:18:57,100 --> 02:19:00,900
you have a play aspect of it and
I think that's I think that's so

2406
02:19:00,900 --> 02:19:02,799
important. 
I look at like baseball players 

2407
02:19:02,799 --> 02:19:05,200
like I mean you go to a college 
setting, you're working every 

2408
02:19:05,200 --> 02:19:08,700
single day and then you go 
especially like you look at nor 

2409
02:19:08,700 --> 02:19:11,500
like you're up north. 
I was just up north and we're 

2410
02:19:11,500 --> 02:19:15,200
inside for four or five weeks 
great. 

2411
02:19:15,500 --> 02:19:18,000
And if you're if you're not 
interacting with play like 

2412
02:19:18,000 --> 02:19:21,100
motivation and you're talking 
leading up the season motivation

2413
02:19:21,100 --> 02:19:24,500
can crash quickly if it's just 
wrapped up. 

2414
02:19:24,600 --> 02:19:27,900
After rep after rep and you're 
just like stuck inside this 

2415
02:19:27,900 --> 02:19:30,600
gymnasium, it looks nothing like
the game. 

2416
02:19:30,600 --> 02:19:33,900
It feels nothing like the game 
you compete maybe with like some

2417
02:19:33,900 --> 02:19:36,799
live settings but not really. 
That's your only play you really

2418
02:19:36,799 --> 02:19:38,200
get. 
Other than that, it's like brown

2419
02:19:38,200 --> 02:19:41,500
black process ground balls. 
Off a gym floor, like fly balls 

2420
02:19:41,500 --> 02:19:43,600
in a very confined space. 
Maybe we go outside, but you're 

2421
02:19:43,608 --> 02:19:46,299
not going too much fun. 
You're freezing grind to do it 

2422
02:19:46,299 --> 02:19:48,900
in the parking lot, or a little 
bit of turf, that's blown off 

2423
02:19:48,900 --> 02:19:52,400
and if we can't create 
environments where there's play 

2424
02:19:52,400 --> 02:19:56,000
Within that in your ear. 
Exploring things. 

2425
02:19:56,000 --> 02:19:58,700
The motivation is going to crash
my opinion and you're not going 

2426
02:19:58,700 --> 02:20:02,500
to you're not going to continue 
to have players engaged 

2427
02:20:02,500 --> 02:20:04,900
throughout your practices and 
how they guess that's a big 

2428
02:20:04,900 --> 02:20:06,200
question. 
Like how do you in your 

2429
02:20:06,600 --> 02:20:09,400
intertwined that with everything
and how do you, how do you even 

2430
02:20:09,400 --> 02:20:11,700
start that? 
Like, like might have talked 

2431
02:20:11,700 --> 02:20:13,900
about this, like, even from you 
starting to warm up like, how do

2432
02:20:13,900 --> 02:20:16,200
you, how do you start 
exploration from the war of? 

2433
02:20:16,200 --> 02:20:18,600
How do you create player 
autonomy in the warm up? 

2434
02:20:18,900 --> 02:20:21,400
The start that right from the 
get-go because if it's in the 

2435
02:20:21,400 --> 02:20:24,100
warm-up it's gonna be real easy 
and intertwined everything for 

2436
02:20:24,100 --> 02:20:25,300
players to Explorer listen to 
me. 

2437
02:20:25,300 --> 02:20:28,300
He's not going to be that much 
easier, but it's definitely 

2438
02:20:28,300 --> 02:20:31,300
gonna open up some Pathways for 
they're going to be able to play

2439
02:20:31,300 --> 02:20:33,700
around with other stuff because 
you started right off the 

2440
02:20:33,700 --> 02:20:35,000
get-go. 
And that's going to increase 

2441
02:20:35,000 --> 02:20:38,000
motivation, increased 
engagement, increase everything 

2442
02:20:38,000 --> 02:20:41,100
you're trying to do, and I guess
that may even come back to what 

2443
02:20:41,100 --> 02:20:42,900
we're talking about. 
Like that player-coach 

2444
02:20:42,900 --> 02:20:46,000
relationship a little bit. 
You're you're going to have an 

2445
02:20:46,000 --> 02:20:47,700
actual interaction. 
That's not. 

2446
02:20:47,700 --> 02:20:49,700
Just me telling you what to do, 
how to do it. 

2447
02:20:50,100 --> 02:20:52,600
It's just me. 
Guiding you with in this 

2448
02:20:52,600 --> 02:20:54,500
landscape that you get to know 
explore. 

2449
02:20:54,800 --> 02:20:56,700
And that's where I go back to my
brother. 

2450
02:20:56,700 --> 02:21:00,200
When you talk about series play,
like you went back to a school 

2451
02:21:00,200 --> 02:21:02,400
and you lost it. 
It was no longer seriously. 

2452
02:21:02,400 --> 02:21:04,900
It's like I feel like, I'm back 
at a job and I'm not doing as 

2453
02:21:04,900 --> 02:21:07,300
well anymore. 
Like, he, he was tearing it off 

2454
02:21:07,300 --> 02:21:10,200
when he when he was engaging in 
serious play was having was 

2455
02:21:10,200 --> 02:21:14,400
having a lot of I guess fun. 
But that led to a ton of 

2456
02:21:14,400 --> 02:21:18,100
motivation to just go out and 
just move and try things and 

2457
02:21:18,100 --> 02:21:21,100
throwing different ways and it 
led him to exactly what he was 

2458
02:21:21,100 --> 02:21:24,100
missing and then you went back 
to school and became a lot more.

2459
02:21:24,600 --> 02:21:27,500
Strict, and rigid and motivation
just went down. 

2460
02:21:27,500 --> 02:21:29,200
I can't even talking to him. 
He wasn't talking about 

2461
02:21:29,200 --> 02:21:32,100
baseball, same way anymore, but 
think that's, that's almost like

2462
02:21:32,100 --> 02:21:34,800
a passion for coaches in a lot 
of ways, like, how can you, how 

2463
02:21:34,800 --> 02:21:38,400
can you increase, exploration, 
and serious, play and fun and it

2464
02:21:38,400 --> 02:21:40,300
could be as simple as warm-ups 
catch play. 

2465
02:21:40,300 --> 02:21:42,000
That's really how do you 
increase that and catch play and

2466
02:21:42,000 --> 02:21:44,800
I think that's in cage work. 
Like, how do you do it in cage 

2467
02:21:44,800 --> 02:21:47,100
work, when maybe you're just 
doing the first round? 

2468
02:21:47,100 --> 02:21:49,300
But I mean, there's so many ways
to do it. 

2469
02:21:49,300 --> 02:21:51,900
It's just, how would you 
continue intertwine? 

2470
02:21:51,900 --> 02:21:54,300
And that's why I think everybody
should kind of ponder and they 

2471
02:21:54,300 --> 02:21:56,400
think Constance's. 
There's so many benefits for it.

2472
02:21:57,400 --> 02:22:03,000
Yeah, into the way that I was 
thinking about introducing it 

2473
02:22:03,200 --> 02:22:06,300
was you start with play? 
Yeah. 

2474
02:22:07,100 --> 02:22:11,400
And then you then take that and 
you go back to whatever. 

2475
02:22:12,100 --> 02:22:19,400
The actual thing is that you 
need to execute on and I think 

2476
02:22:19,400 --> 02:22:24,500
to I think the better way to 
kind of approach this is to go 

2477
02:22:24,500 --> 02:22:26,100
back to this idea of 
seriousness. 

2478
02:22:26,300 --> 02:22:29,000
So because what we're talking 
about is serious play because 

2479
02:22:29,000 --> 02:22:30,500
they're so this has been my 
experience. 

2480
02:22:30,600 --> 02:22:37,800
So I did I did Choir in high 
school and then I tried out for 

2481
02:22:37,800 --> 02:22:43,700
a scholarship for choir in 
theater and so because they're 

2482
02:22:43,700 --> 02:22:46,200
basically the same scholarship. 
I got the theater one and so 

2483
02:22:46,200 --> 02:22:49,400
they weren't going to give me 
the music one, but I went to 

2484
02:22:49,400 --> 02:22:52,900
choir to showed up for the choir
practice for like maybe a few 

2485
02:22:52,900 --> 02:22:57,600
days and it was just so weird. 
How much goofing around there 

2486
02:22:57,600 --> 02:22:59,500
was? 
Because the choir that I was in 

2487
02:22:59,500 --> 02:23:05,700
and one in high school was, was 
decently good and we'd actually 

2488
02:23:05,700 --> 02:23:09,200
done some of the same songs and 
I just remember like some of the

2489
02:23:09,200 --> 02:23:12,600
things that, you know, are my 
choir teacher in high school? 

2490
02:23:12,600 --> 02:23:15,500
You know said, like, hey, this 
is like, very immature was like,

2491
02:23:15,500 --> 02:23:18,600
happening at the, at the 
Collegiate level, I'm like, If 

2492
02:23:18,600 --> 02:23:21,600
you guys aren't going to take 
this seriously, like I am, I'm 

2493
02:23:21,600 --> 02:23:24,300
out of here. 
And so that's why I didn't stick

2494
02:23:24,300 --> 02:23:27,200
around for that because I just 
wasn't going to miss school, and

2495
02:23:27,200 --> 02:23:30,500
baseball, and all this sort of 
stuff for a group that wasn't 

2496
02:23:30,500 --> 02:23:32,300
didn't take pride in what they 
did. 

2497
02:23:32,500 --> 02:23:36,900
And so, when we're talking about
serious play, it's taking what 

2498
02:23:36,900 --> 02:23:39,700
you're doing, seriously. 
But you're exploring, you're 

2499
02:23:39,700 --> 02:23:43,000
having fun with it. 
There's a way to, I think that's

2500
02:23:43,000 --> 02:23:47,000
the thing that we need to 
because What I see right now is 

2501
02:23:47,000 --> 02:23:49,500
like, seriousness and rigid. 
Yeah. 

2502
02:23:50,200 --> 02:23:54,900
And then play and like 
everything's free rein and 

2503
02:23:54,900 --> 02:23:57,800
goofing around and completely 
unstructured. 

2504
02:23:58,500 --> 02:24:01,700
And you have these two extremes 
and what we're advocating for, 

2505
02:24:01,700 --> 02:24:04,300
is that middle ground of 
seriousness with play? 

2506
02:24:04,600 --> 02:24:07,500
That is purposeful, I think. 
I think that that might be 

2507
02:24:07,600 --> 02:24:11,400
another way of talking about 
this is purposeful play is 

2508
02:24:11,400 --> 02:24:17,400
different than Entertainment, 
you know for just pure enjoyment

2509
02:24:17,400 --> 02:24:22,100
goofing around and that's that's
what I think. 

2510
02:24:22,600 --> 02:24:26,500
I kind of wanted to talk about. 
So when we do serious play and 

2511
02:24:26,500 --> 02:24:29,500
you implement that within 
practice, what you are then 

2512
02:24:29,500 --> 02:24:31,600
doing is like, okay. 
Now we're exploring we're 

2513
02:24:31,600 --> 02:24:35,300
playing around and then when we 
come back to our typical 

2514
02:24:35,300 --> 02:24:38,800
ordinary drill type of a thing, 
even though I don't like the 

2515
02:24:38,800 --> 02:24:41,200
word drill, but let's say we 
come back to our traditional 

2516
02:24:41,200 --> 02:24:44,000
practice. 
Activity. 

2517
02:24:44,400 --> 02:24:47,000
You know, for example, if we're 
for an outfielder were goofing 

2518
02:24:47,000 --> 02:24:49,500
around with all the different 
ways that we can play, you know,

2519
02:24:49,500 --> 02:24:51,700
catch a ball off the wall Etc. 
Whatever. 

2520
02:24:51,700 --> 02:24:55,200
And then we go back to our 
standard, you know, Fly ball or 

2521
02:24:55,400 --> 02:24:57,200
field, the ground ball and throw
to a Target. 

2522
02:24:57,200 --> 02:24:59,500
Like because maybe before you're
just kind of like looking around

2523
02:24:59,500 --> 02:25:01,600
and seeing how many different 
ways could I throw it in? 

2524
02:25:02,000 --> 02:25:05,000
And then now, okay, we're going 
to do all the standard stuff and

2525
02:25:05,000 --> 02:25:07,600
you're going to try to figure 
out how many times we can still 

2526
02:25:07,600 --> 02:25:09,400
make a game out of it. 
How many times can hit the guy 

2527
02:25:09,400 --> 02:25:12,600
in the chest? 
you know, with even the basic 

2528
02:25:12,600 --> 02:25:17,600
stuff and just see how much How 
many times you can do that and 

2529
02:25:17,600 --> 02:25:21,600
see if like your performance in 
that setting improves even after

2530
02:25:21,600 --> 02:25:23,700
playing around maybe the first 
couple ones because you're 

2531
02:25:23,700 --> 02:25:27,100
trying to recalibrate maybe are 
not as accurate, you know, maybe

2532
02:25:27,100 --> 02:25:29,300
you have a warm-up phase like 
and Driveline, right? 

2533
02:25:29,300 --> 02:25:31,400
You don't when you get when 
you're going to check the ball 

2534
02:25:31,400 --> 02:25:33,000
as hard as you can. 
You don't start with the first 

2535
02:25:33,000 --> 02:25:36,300
one and cut it. 
Loose at 100% you go at 80 or 

2536
02:25:36,300 --> 02:25:39,700
whatever and so this idea a 
notion of recalibrating and then

2537
02:25:40,700 --> 02:25:44,700
Then taking it Taking It or 
taking a very traditional round.

2538
02:25:45,300 --> 02:25:47,700
And then seeing if your numbers 
improve over time or your 

2539
02:25:47,700 --> 02:25:50,900
performance improves over time 
because the whole idea of play 

2540
02:25:51,500 --> 02:25:57,600
and variability, within your 
practice setting is to actually 

2541
02:25:57,600 --> 02:26:01,900
improve the consistency of your 
outcomes or the consistency of 

2542
02:26:01,900 --> 02:26:07,500
your performance. 
Yeah, I think that's that's 

2543
02:26:07,500 --> 02:26:08,600
right. 
You have you heard the story of 

2544
02:26:08,608 --> 02:26:10,300
the? 
I forget who it is, but there's 

2545
02:26:10,300 --> 02:26:14,600
a shot putter, like one of the 
best shot Putters in the At the 

2546
02:26:14,600 --> 02:26:18,400
time, he was one of the best in 
the world and he essentially 

2547
02:26:19,100 --> 02:26:22,700
like just intentionally play 
with every variant of a shotput 

2548
02:26:22,700 --> 02:26:25,800
throw, he could possibly do. 
And that became all his training

2549
02:26:25,800 --> 02:26:30,700
was just these very weird ways 
to throw a shot put and just 

2550
02:26:30,700 --> 02:26:34,400
buried it almost every single 
wrap and like, you look at some 

2551
02:26:34,400 --> 02:26:37,900
of the videos with weird pauses,
he's I want honest front foot on

2552
02:26:37,900 --> 02:26:40,900
some of them he's like stopping 
the middle and then continuing 

2553
02:26:40,900 --> 02:26:44,600
he's doing like he's weird world
but that's how we Train, and 

2554
02:26:44,600 --> 02:26:46,900
that's all he did. 
Literally, I mean, I've defined 

2555
02:26:46,900 --> 02:26:49,500
it as serious play but he always
had the goal for as far as he 

2556
02:26:49,500 --> 02:26:51,300
could often these different 
variations. 

2557
02:26:51,900 --> 02:26:55,700
And I forget, I forget the exact
results, but he improved, and he

2558
02:26:55,700 --> 02:26:58,800
was already one of the best, 
like, just him doing that verse 

2559
02:26:58,800 --> 02:27:00,900
what he typically doing, and I 
believe he was diagnosed. 

2560
02:27:00,900 --> 02:27:03,700
I don't want to quote me on 
that, but I think your stagnant 

2561
02:27:03,700 --> 02:27:06,100
to that point and then he went 
with complete variability and 

2562
02:27:06,100 --> 02:27:10,200
his throw actually increased 
where the typical person said, 

2563
02:27:10,200 --> 02:27:13,400
there's no shot of that, like 
not training or technical model.

2564
02:27:14,100 --> 02:27:18,300
It produced the best within his 
best technical model but what he

2565
02:27:18,300 --> 02:27:20,900
did is he buried it up like 
crazy played around and did all 

2566
02:27:20,900 --> 02:27:24,800
these weird funky stuff and that
led him to his best result yet. 

2567
02:27:25,200 --> 02:27:27,800
Which I think is, I think it's 
really cool to hear. 

2568
02:27:27,800 --> 02:27:30,100
Because I think when you're 
thinking about distance, you're 

2569
02:27:30,100 --> 02:27:32,700
thinking technical model because
he's not necessary, hitting a 

2570
02:27:32,700 --> 02:27:35,800
target for say, he's just trying
to throw it as far as he can. 

2571
02:27:35,800 --> 02:27:38,900
And that actually improved it, 
which I think, I think more 

2572
02:27:38,900 --> 02:27:42,400
people and get on board with 
like, throwing in different ways

2573
02:27:42,400 --> 02:27:44,000
to hit a Target is going to 
increase. 

2574
02:27:44,100 --> 02:27:46,900
You see I think more people get 
behind that, but not as many 

2575
02:27:46,900 --> 02:27:49,900
people get behind and I was one 
that struggled with it, like not

2576
02:27:49,900 --> 02:27:52,700
as many people get behind like 
maybe your email for Harder by 

2577
02:27:52,700 --> 02:27:55,700
adding more variation to it and 
not chasing the technical model.

2578
02:27:56,500 --> 02:27:59,000
So I think was was really 
fascinating to kind of kind of 

2579
02:27:59,008 --> 02:28:02,200
learn about Yeah. 
I mean, I'm part of the reason 

2580
02:28:02,200 --> 02:28:06,400
to is Coaches for a long time 
have talked about like if you 

2581
02:28:06,400 --> 02:28:10,200
can repeat your mechanics, then 
that's what's going to allow you

2582
02:28:10,200 --> 02:28:13,000
to throw with greater 
consistency or with greater 

2583
02:28:13,000 --> 02:28:14,900
accuracy. 
And so, that's why I think of 

2584
02:28:14,900 --> 02:28:17,800
her for a lot of coaches. 
It's, it's really hard for them 

2585
02:28:17,800 --> 02:28:22,400
to switch because that's the 
Mantra, the common sense or the 

2586
02:28:22,600 --> 02:28:26,300
the conventional wisdom was 
repeatable mechanics lead to a 

2587
02:28:26,300 --> 02:28:28,200
repeatable result, and we're 
finding that. 

2588
02:28:28,200 --> 02:28:30,700
That's when you actually look 
at. 

2589
02:28:30,700 --> 02:28:33,600
And you do a full signal 
analysis now, I even talk. 

2590
02:28:33,800 --> 02:28:39,800
To Anthony, Brady at a CBA. 
A few years ago about this and 

2591
02:28:39,808 --> 02:28:42,400
he's like, for some for like, 
for example, the Japanese 

2592
02:28:42,400 --> 02:28:46,500
players their margin of error is
a lot smaller but the Dominicans

2593
02:28:46,500 --> 02:28:50,400
they have, they have a greater 
greater more greater 

2594
02:28:50,500 --> 02:28:53,400
variability, and by margin of 
error, I mean, like the standard

2595
02:28:53,400 --> 02:29:00,700
deviation or the The range at 
which their mechanics were, was 

2596
02:29:00,700 --> 02:29:05,800
a lot smaller with the Japanese 
players, then the the Dominican 

2597
02:29:05,800 --> 02:29:08,500
players as it as an example, as 
a comparison. 

2598
02:29:09,300 --> 02:29:11,700
But when I got out of Anthony 
was that there were still 

2599
02:29:11,700 --> 02:29:18,500
variation, within the Japanese 
players and in Drive Line, and I

2600
02:29:18,500 --> 02:29:21,500
believe Kyle is talked about 
this like, you know, it's a very

2601
02:29:21,500 --> 02:29:24,400
small window. 
That you're playing around with 

2602
02:29:24,400 --> 02:29:28,100
and he used that as evidence for
the fact that there is basically

2603
02:29:28,100 --> 02:29:31,400
no variation and that you need 
to repeat your mechanics. 

2604
02:29:31,400 --> 02:29:33,600
I don't think he's, I don't know
if he still believes that but 

2605
02:29:33,600 --> 02:29:35,200
that was the way that he was 
arguing it. 

2606
02:29:35,200 --> 02:29:38,900
Yeah, because that is, that is 
through the conventional lens 

2607
02:29:38,900 --> 02:29:42,100
that he was viewing it but four 
meetings, a logical perspective 

2608
02:29:42,100 --> 02:29:43,800
that's evidence for variance. 
Yeah. 

2609
02:29:44,100 --> 02:29:48,800
Like look it's not completely 
repeatable but there is this 

2610
02:29:48,800 --> 02:29:52,600
window and we need to be really 
good at being able to get to 

2611
02:29:52,600 --> 02:29:54,500
that window. 
From all these different 

2612
02:29:54,500 --> 02:29:58,300
positions. 
And so that's that's at least 

2613
02:29:58,300 --> 02:30:00,300
how I view if from an ecological
perspective. 

2614
02:30:02,400 --> 02:30:05,600
So, to kind of land the plane, 
do we want to finish this this 

2615
02:30:05,600 --> 02:30:09,300
video up and wrap it up there, 
or do you want to land the plane

2616
02:30:09,400 --> 02:30:13,400
somewhere in here? 
Feathering over what the rest of

2617
02:30:13,408 --> 02:30:15,300
the video. 
I think it's I think it's 

2618
02:30:15,300 --> 02:30:17,100
continues a little more on the 
serious Paulie side. 

2619
02:30:17,100 --> 02:30:21,600
So I mean I'm good I'm good 
either way but I think I think a

2620
02:30:21,608 --> 02:30:24,800
natural way to end it would be 
to just play it out to you know,

2621
02:30:24,800 --> 02:30:27,800
why not recognize within 
parkour. 

2622
02:30:27,800 --> 02:30:30,800
That it is in the these other 
practices that have come to 

2623
02:30:30,800 --> 02:30:35,000
build evolving play. 
That they there a way to engage 

2624
02:30:35,000 --> 02:30:39,200
in a serious practice of. 
So emaciated, you're going to 

2625
02:30:39,200 --> 02:30:42,800
find some novel. 
Challenge that you're going to 

2626
02:30:42,800 --> 02:30:45,600
test yourself at against and 
then you're going to play with 

2627
02:30:45,600 --> 02:30:48,800
it by adding Variations by 
moving things around by 

2628
02:30:48,800 --> 02:30:53,500
exploring it and ways. 
Yeah, this world that we exist 

2629
02:30:53,500 --> 02:30:59,600
in that has become so ordered in
certain ways, we need something 

2630
02:30:59,600 --> 02:31:02,600
that allows us to do that to 
reimagine play and to bring play

2631
02:31:02,600 --> 02:31:16,700
into our life and to engage with
it in a serious way. so, I'm 

2632
02:31:16,700 --> 02:31:17,500
going to. 
Yeah. 

2633
02:31:17,700 --> 02:31:19,700
Do you have any extra comments 
before? 

2634
02:31:19,700 --> 02:31:24,400
I kind of, Land the plane on 
one. 

2635
02:31:24,600 --> 02:31:26,800
One thought or try to Loop it 
back into something we talked 

2636
02:31:26,800 --> 02:31:28,500
about before? 
No, I think that. 

2637
02:31:28,500 --> 02:31:32,700
I mean, I progressed thumbs up. 
What we're already kind of tree,

2638
02:31:32,700 --> 02:31:36,100
were kind of barking on already.
I think that's sums it up fairly

2639
02:31:36,100 --> 02:31:37,200
well, and you got a nice little 
plug. 

2640
02:31:37,200 --> 02:31:39,100
It was company in there, so 
maybe I'll check them out. 

2641
02:31:39,100 --> 02:31:42,100
Call Folklife so young and Kim's
house Ali. 

2642
02:31:42,300 --> 02:31:46,100
Well, that was going to be part 
of my me Landing the plane. 

2643
02:31:46,100 --> 02:31:51,100
So Going back to. 
What I talked about before about

2644
02:31:51,100 --> 02:31:54,200
mentorship and why I think 
that's super important in what 

2645
02:31:54,200 --> 02:31:56,300
what I've kind of been looking 
for and I know I've talked to 

2646
02:31:56,308 --> 02:32:00,200
you about this idea, so I got a 
chance to go to actually one of 

2647
02:32:00,200 --> 02:32:02,900
rafe's Retreats. 
And so when I was at, that 

2648
02:32:02,900 --> 02:32:06,700
Retreat Rafe was kind of talking
about this idea of play and part

2649
02:32:07,400 --> 02:32:11,700
part of this in order for us to 
grow we need others to play with

2650
02:32:12,600 --> 02:32:15,200
And so when it comes to working 
through different ideas and 

2651
02:32:15,200 --> 02:32:18,700
Concepts especially as coaches, 
right? 

2652
02:32:19,200 --> 02:32:23,200
We need other people to play 
with to play with ideas to see 

2653
02:32:23,200 --> 02:32:26,400
what can we do with this data, 
this thought that we have are 

2654
02:32:26,400 --> 02:32:30,100
these ideas and Concepts, and so
this kind of Loops back to this.

2655
02:32:30,100 --> 02:32:34,500
I this whole notion of like why 
trying to put together some form

2656
02:32:34,500 --> 02:32:37,900
of a baseball coaches mentorship
and I don't want to call it a 

2657
02:32:37,908 --> 02:32:42,900
program. 
I really because I'm not like 

2658
02:32:43,000 --> 02:32:47,000
there's there's the general form
of like, all right, you know, 

2659
02:32:47,400 --> 02:32:49,700
this is a mentorship program 
that I'm putting on and then 

2660
02:32:49,700 --> 02:32:51,500
you're all come to me and I 
Mentor you. 

2661
02:32:51,800 --> 02:32:56,300
But rather, my thought is, I 
want to connect other people who

2662
02:32:56,300 --> 02:32:59,800
are looking for mentors and to 
be mentored or who want to 

2663
02:32:59,800 --> 02:33:02,700
Mentor other people and just 
create a hub, where people can 

2664
02:33:03,300 --> 02:33:06,900
connect interact. 
And in some ways 

2665
02:33:07,200 --> 02:33:11,500
serendipitously, or maybe we can
facilitate war in a more serious

2666
02:33:11,500 --> 02:33:15,300
way. 
Way of like hey I'm you know put

2667
02:33:15,300 --> 02:33:17,900
like what year you are like what
type of like, I don't know. 

2668
02:33:18,000 --> 02:33:22,400
You know like do kind of like 
you know, some way of like 

2669
02:33:22,400 --> 02:33:29,200
speed, Connecting speed dating 
type of a thing where people 

2670
02:33:29,200 --> 02:33:30,800
like get to interact with one 
another. 

2671
02:33:30,800 --> 02:33:33,900
See, if like, okay, I'm looking 
for a mentor or whatever and 

2672
02:33:33,900 --> 02:33:35,700
just try to find ways to 
partner. 

2673
02:33:35,700 --> 02:33:38,200
But I mean, it could be as 
simple as just facilitating 

2674
02:33:38,200 --> 02:33:40,300
discussions and just seeing what
shakes out from there. 

2675
02:33:40,300 --> 02:33:44,900
So that's kind of my idea of. 
We need other people in order to

2676
02:33:44,900 --> 02:33:48,600
fully grow to kind of play with 
someone who will enter in and 

2677
02:33:48,600 --> 02:33:51,500
play with the ideas and have a 
conversation with you. 

2678
02:33:51,500 --> 02:33:55,700
And the hope is that That they 
do it in good faith and then, 

2679
02:33:56,100 --> 02:33:58,800
you know, you can still play 
with somebody else who's coming 

2680
02:33:58,800 --> 02:34:03,700
in with negative intentions and 
you can still grow from that. 

2681
02:34:03,800 --> 02:34:06,600
But that's not, that doesn't 
create that that safe 

2682
02:34:06,600 --> 02:34:08,800
uncertainty. 
Because again, if you want to, 

2683
02:34:08,800 --> 02:34:12,400
if you want to have to go for 
why you need that safe. 

2684
02:34:12,400 --> 02:34:16,100
Environment is because what's 
on, certain is the ideas of what

2685
02:34:16,600 --> 02:34:20,600
what it looks like for them to 
play out and how all this stuff 

2686
02:34:20,600 --> 02:34:24,100
works, the uncertain is, how are
we going to coach our Athletes 

2687
02:34:24,100 --> 02:34:25,700
better. 
How am I going to deal with this

2688
02:34:26,000 --> 02:34:29,700
coaching problem that I have? 
And so this this in a way to 

2689
02:34:29,700 --> 02:34:33,800
fits well with what this podcast
is about, you know, the 

2690
02:34:34,200 --> 02:34:36,800
Confessions of a baseball coach 
make these are the struggles 

2691
02:34:36,800 --> 02:34:40,300
that I think that we are going 
through is finding other people 

2692
02:34:40,300 --> 02:34:42,100
to connect with. 
I mean, given the way that the 

2693
02:34:42,100 --> 02:34:45,400
world is now and how much stuff 
is online and all this sort of 

2694
02:34:45,400 --> 02:34:49,000
stuff in the different ways that
we have become increasingly 

2695
02:34:49,000 --> 02:34:53,900
isolated from one another. 
I think is great, is technology,

2696
02:34:53,900 --> 02:34:57,000
is you know, Garrett for us to 
be able to, you know, maybe a 

2697
02:34:57,000 --> 02:35:01,200
Minnesota and you be in Florida 
and to do this is great but 

2698
02:35:01,200 --> 02:35:05,500
there's there's still sometimes 
we don't we are not able to find

2699
02:35:05,500 --> 02:35:08,200
what we need where we currently 
are. 

2700
02:35:08,200 --> 02:35:12,600
And so the hope is to somewhat 
facilitate that I still think. 

2701
02:35:13,000 --> 02:35:15,900
Honestly, in person is the best.
And part of the reason in person

2702
02:35:15,900 --> 02:35:19,700
is the best is because David 
Snowden talks about this, we 

2703
02:35:19,700 --> 02:35:25,100
only can explain an articulate 
about 10%, maybe, I mean, and I 

2704
02:35:25,108 --> 02:35:26,600
have no idea how you come up 
with this number. 

2705
02:35:26,600 --> 02:35:30,100
But you know, we can only 
articulate. 

2706
02:35:31,100 --> 02:35:34,100
Only a portion a small portion 
of what we know in the rest of 

2707
02:35:34,100 --> 02:35:36,900
it is. 
Contextual to the things that we

2708
02:35:36,908 --> 02:35:39,700
go through in our day-to-day and
sometimes to some of the stuff 

2709
02:35:39,700 --> 02:35:41,000
we know, like we don't even 
know. 

2710
02:35:41,000 --> 02:35:46,200
We know because we just live it.
We do it and it isn't unless we,

2711
02:35:47,500 --> 02:35:50,700
you know, live and do life with 
other people that we actually 

2712
02:35:50,700 --> 02:35:54,000
pick up on the other lessons 
that people have to teach us. 

2713
02:35:54,900 --> 02:35:59,100
And so, you know, at the end of 
the day it's you know what I 

2714
02:35:59,108 --> 02:36:01,500
would say and encourage, you 
know, people that you end up 

2715
02:36:01,900 --> 02:36:04,500
finding as mentors. 
Even if you are a distance from 

2716
02:36:04,500 --> 02:36:08,600
one, another do take some time 
and work something out, such 

2717
02:36:08,600 --> 02:36:13,000
that you can go spend you know a
few days a week. 

2718
02:36:13,800 --> 02:36:16,700
You know with that other coach 
and just be a fly on the wall. 

2719
02:36:16,700 --> 02:36:20,400
Observe participate in what 
they're doing, you know, this is

2720
02:36:20,700 --> 02:36:24,600
I've heard other coaches talk 
about this and you know for For 

2721
02:36:24,600 --> 02:36:27,900
whatever we think about clinics 
like in the summer camps and all

2722
02:36:27,900 --> 02:36:30,300
that sort of stuff that has been
how other guys have gotten to 

2723
02:36:30,300 --> 02:36:33,300
see how other other people 
coach, because those camps. 

2724
02:36:33,300 --> 02:36:37,200
Usually, you know, are several 
days to a week long, Etc. 

2725
02:36:37,500 --> 02:36:41,700
And then you get to kind of see 
how everybody kind of works when

2726
02:36:41,700 --> 02:36:43,100
they, when they work with 
athletes. 

2727
02:36:43,100 --> 02:36:47,300
So, that would be my 
encouragement is to find a way 

2728
02:36:47,300 --> 02:36:53,500
to bring something that is 
digital into Into kind of the 

2729
02:36:53,500 --> 02:36:56,500
real world so to speak and so 
that you can be face to face. 

2730
02:36:58,700 --> 02:37:00,700
Yeah, that's good. 
I think yeah. 

2731
02:37:00,700 --> 02:37:03,700
Things like the even, like the 
ABC, a stuff like that and it's 

2732
02:37:03,700 --> 02:37:06,300
been a big, big resource for me.
Just an echo coaches playing 

2733
02:37:06,300 --> 02:37:08,300
with some of these ideas and 
actually getting that 

2734
02:37:08,300 --> 02:37:10,000
face-to-face. 
Let's go. 

2735
02:37:12,300 --> 02:37:13,900
I mean that's how we met first, 
right? 

2736
02:37:13,900 --> 02:37:18,300
Yeah. 
So, all right. 

2737
02:37:18,700 --> 02:37:20,300
Well, that's all we got for 
today. 

2738
02:37:20,300 --> 02:37:24,700
I hope hope you all enjoyed 
that, good Marathon. 

2739
02:37:24,800 --> 02:37:30,700
Yeah, long good though. 
But so that'll be the outro 

2740
02:37:30,700 --> 02:37:35,000
right there, right. 
Oh yeah. 

2741
02:37:35,000 --> 02:37:37,200
Whoever survived are lengthy 
conversation. 

2742
02:37:37,400 --> 02:37:41,200
We appreciate it. 
But yeah, I'll ever ever made it

2743
02:37:41,200 --> 02:37:44,300
to the end. 
Actually, for some updates 

2744
02:37:44,300 --> 02:37:49,100
though, if I ever do put out 
blog posts or whatever, or have 

2745
02:37:49,100 --> 02:37:52,000
little short riffs, I don't know
if I ever will have a short 

2746
02:37:52,000 --> 02:37:56,900
riff, but I'll put out some 
shorter content if especially, 

2747
02:37:56,900 --> 02:37:59,400
if I write a blog post, I might 
even read my Twitter post. 

2748
02:37:59,400 --> 02:38:02,700
I don't know like, Riff on that 
for a minute, but that probably 

2749
02:38:02,700 --> 02:38:06,700
won't be a minute either. 
So, I'm saying, I might not have

2750
02:38:06,700 --> 02:38:09,100
a short. 
I might not have a short riff, 

2751
02:38:09,100 --> 02:38:17,200
but I'll have a Shortridge. 
But yeah. 

2752
02:38:17,200 --> 02:38:20,900
Anyways, so that's that's all we
got hope you enjoyed today's 

2753
02:38:20,900 --> 02:38:24,900
podcast and where can you find 
people? 

2754
02:38:25,200 --> 02:38:29,300
Where should you look them up? 
Also also Baker Baker, do you 

2755
02:38:29,300 --> 02:38:32,800
want to let anybody know what's 
going on with you? 

2756
02:38:32,800 --> 02:38:37,300
Some some new updates or anybody
that life updates that we're 

2757
02:38:37,300 --> 02:38:39,200
trying to share with the 
listeners? 

2758
02:38:40,000 --> 02:38:44,400
Yeah, I've recently taken a job 
as an integration pitching. 

2759
02:38:44,600 --> 02:38:48,500
Coach with the Mets, which is 
basically means I'll be able to 

2760
02:38:48,900 --> 02:38:51,300
not just focus on the pitching 
side, but a little bit of form 

2761
02:38:51,300 --> 02:38:54,900
its side and then they, as it 
grows, it integrates a little 

2762
02:38:54,900 --> 02:38:59,600
bit more into, as, as you can. 
Imagine, all the things you need

2763
02:38:59,600 --> 02:39:03,800
to integrate within skill, as 
far as my title is, which is 

2764
02:39:03,800 --> 02:39:07,000
kind of a cool, a cool position.
But, yeah, I'll be starting that

2765
02:39:07,700 --> 02:39:11,700
depending on this put out, like 
in a couple weeks or you can 

2766
02:39:11,700 --> 02:39:13,600
forget about for Christmas about
2 weeks. 

2767
02:39:13,600 --> 02:39:15,900
If not then Then I might have 
our started. 

2768
02:39:21,100 --> 02:39:28,700
Additionally, Robert. 
And I both have Buy me a coffee.

2769
02:39:30,100 --> 02:39:33,200
Like if you if you like the 
podcast, you want to make you 

2770
02:39:33,200 --> 02:39:36,600
want to support us and give make
a one-time donation. 

2771
02:39:36,800 --> 02:39:42,500
By the way, the the donation 
thing that I have is for finding

2772
02:39:42,500 --> 02:39:45,200
the edge. 
So if you donate to us and you 

2773
02:39:45,200 --> 02:39:47,900
want it to go to a specific 
person, you know, for example 

2774
02:39:47,900 --> 02:39:52,000
like Baker or even Robert, just 
put a note in there that that's 

2775
02:39:52,000 --> 02:39:54,500
where you want it to go as 
specifically Baker, send it off.

2776
02:39:55,000 --> 02:40:01,500
Yeah. 
So perfectly So, you know, if if

2777
02:40:01,500 --> 02:40:04,000
you like somebody more than me 
but by all means put that in 

2778
02:40:04,000 --> 02:40:06,700
there, I'll put that. 
I'll send it off to them. 

2779
02:40:07,000 --> 02:40:09,800
And yeah. 
So if you want to support us, 

2780
02:40:09,800 --> 02:40:12,900
that's a way to support us. 
I'm thinking about, you can do 

2781
02:40:12,900 --> 02:40:15,500
some membership stuff in there. 
I'm thinking about potentially 

2782
02:40:15,500 --> 02:40:19,200
turning on membership and as you
can see it sometimes takes me a 

2783
02:40:19,208 --> 02:40:24,500
year to put out content of 
things that we have recorded on 

2784
02:40:24,500 --> 02:40:27,200
thinking, what I'd like to do at
the membership stuff is just 

2785
02:40:27,200 --> 02:40:30,600
like I'm going to just take the 
raw files and just Pop them in 

2786
02:40:30,600 --> 02:40:32,300
there. 
So if you want to be ahead of 

2787
02:40:32,300 --> 02:40:35,900
the game as far as when episodes
come out, what's going on with 

2788
02:40:35,900 --> 02:40:40,800
them and just get, you know, way
early access maybe even a year 

2789
02:40:41,300 --> 02:40:46,100
or more Early Access to stuff 
will turn on membership stuff 

2790
02:40:46,100 --> 02:40:49,500
and we'll figure something out 
there and I'll just throw 

2791
02:40:50,200 --> 02:40:54,000
unfinished content in there. 
I also have a thing from Brock 

2792
02:40:54,100 --> 02:40:58,000
me and Brock are first episode. 
I recorded something, if I can 

2793
02:40:58,000 --> 02:41:01,500
find it, I recorded us. 
Just riffing after the episode 

2794
02:41:01,500 --> 02:41:05,300
ended. 
So I got I got goodies tucked 

2795
02:41:05,300 --> 02:41:08,100
away. 
As far as content goes, if 

2796
02:41:08,100 --> 02:41:13,200
people are are interested, so 
that will be, that might be 

2797
02:41:13,200 --> 02:41:19,400
coming down the pipe. 
I might have a mentorship thing 

2798
02:41:19,400 --> 02:41:21,800
going. 
We need to do a whole episode on

2799
02:41:21,800 --> 02:41:24,700
that. 
Anyways, that sweet that I put 

2800
02:41:24,700 --> 02:41:29,400
out that got some traction and 
then, yeah. 

2801
02:41:29,800 --> 02:41:31,400
That's what's going on with me. 
Robert. 

2802
02:41:31,900 --> 02:41:36,100
What, what's going on with you? 
Yeah, like Garrett said, I have 

2803
02:41:36,100 --> 02:41:41,500
my own, buy me a coffee and, you
know, if you want to support me 

2804
02:41:41,500 --> 02:41:44,500
on your find the edge. 
Yeah, that's great. 

2805
02:41:44,600 --> 02:41:46,900
You can support me as well with 
my YouTube channel. 

2806
02:41:47,400 --> 02:41:50,900
All of my Social Links are 
integrated together. 

2807
02:41:50,900 --> 02:41:58,600
It's Robert Reich, 40 roberts10 
re y 40 and it applies to 

2808
02:41:58,600 --> 02:42:01,500
Twitter applies to YouTube, plus
the buy me a coffee. 

2809
02:42:01,500 --> 02:42:05,400
So if, you know, Robert Pro 48, 
get access to all of those. 

2810
02:42:05,500 --> 02:42:11,100
And I'm just kinda trying to 
create as much college, baseball

2811
02:42:11,100 --> 02:42:17,200
analyst they can, and for any 
NAIA coach listeners out there. 

2812
02:42:17,300 --> 02:42:23,500
I am doing my fourth year of 
spray charts at the NAIA loved 

2813
02:42:23,500 --> 02:42:25,600
ones. 
Feel free to contact me again. 

2814
02:42:25,600 --> 02:42:30,600
Robert priority on any of those 
platforms to learn about Hilton 

2815
02:42:30,600 --> 02:42:34,800
price. 
Sweet. 

2816
02:42:34,900 --> 02:42:38,800
I don't know if I got, we could 
go on forever but I know Baker. 

2817
02:42:38,800 --> 02:42:42,200
You got to get to something. 
So, I ended, I ended our last 

2818
02:42:42,200 --> 02:42:44,700
podcast, by the way, with 
whatever. 

2819
02:42:44,700 --> 02:42:47,200
Like, hey, I wish I probably 
need a should get some sleep at 

2820
02:42:47,208 --> 02:42:53,600
some point. 
I just ended, you know, one of 

2821
02:42:53,600 --> 02:42:58,100
these times you have to do. 
I Sopranos ask testing where, 

2822
02:42:58,500 --> 02:43:00,000
you know, you'll say, hey I got 
to go.