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Welcome back to Finding the Edge
podcast. 

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I'm Garrett Boyam, joined with 
Kyle Dupic. 

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So as the resident pitching guy,
there's always a conversation 

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regarding velocity command 
trade-offs. 

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How do we train one? 
How do we train the other? 

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You sent interesting post on X 
to me the other day. 

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DM D You want to walk through 
the walk raid? 

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Why? 
Why was that interesting to you?

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Why did you send it to me? 
I think the thing that stood out

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to me the most because our 
season just ended and just 

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looking at like the struggle 
throughout the year and where 

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where just our, our team ended 
up, like our, the number of 

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walks that we gave up was 
significantly higher. 

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Yeah, we still had success this 
year, which which was great. 

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But I could see that this is 
like this is a place where we 

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could we could grow. 
And then also it's been a big, 

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it's something that's been 
thrown at people, you know, of 

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like, oh, you only develop, you 
know, Velo or stuff or whatever,

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but like they can't throw 
strikes. 

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So yeah, OK, you have great 
velocity, you have great stuff, 

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but you can't locate it. 
And then, you know, you're not 

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making it up, like you're not, 
you're not playing as much or 

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guys aren't moving up levels 
because they don't command the 

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ball well enough. 
And so it becomes a question of,

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you know, OK, now a guy might 
not have, you know, great 

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velocity, great stuff, but he 
has great command. 

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So do do organizations feel like
they can take a guy with great 

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command and develop velocity and
stuff? 

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Is that, is that where we're at 
now? 

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I don't know. 
But it still feels like the 

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thing that is getting most 
people noticed is Velo and 

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stuff. 
And then the command piece seems

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like it's getting a little bit 
forgotten, but now it's starting

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to come back. 
And at least from what I'm 

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seeing on social media, 
different people are starting to

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talk more about command 
Driveline being one of them. 

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Like, how do you develop 
command? 

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And So what was interesting 
about this T tweet from Tango 

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Tiger? 
I'm sure every analytics person 

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on Twitter knows who this is. 
But anyways, he put out this 

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really interesting tweet about 
the walk rate at the MLB. 

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I'm assuming this is the MLB 
level that year to year there's 

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no correlation between between 
the walk rate or the, the 

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correlation is really low. 
So basically what that means is 

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that one year's walk rate does 
not predict the following year's

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walk rate. 
So there's not really any 

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correlation between, you know, 
for example, the year that we 

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had this year, maybe we can 
chalk it up to just it being a 

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bad year. 
Like it's not a predictor for 

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how many guys we're going to 
walk next year, Which I think 

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that's kind of an encouraging 
thing of like if you have a, you

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know, if these stats are 
correct, then you know, if you 

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have a bad year where you walk a
ton of guys, is that necessarily

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this might not be necessarily 
indicative of you having a high 

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walk rate next year. 
Now we have to qualify this, 

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this is on MLB data. 
This might not be for other 

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levels because you know, at the 
Major League level, you have you

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have an abundance of talent. 
Like if you, if guys are 

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struggling with command, there's
somebody else very easily at 

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hand that you can find to 
replace. 

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So that might be the reason, an 
explanation for that. 

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But the other thing that I 
thought was really, really 

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interesting too with this was 
that in season correlation or 

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sorry, in season walk rate is 
more highly correlated to the 

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next. 
Like, you know, your walk rate 

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in the first month, as it's 
showing here is highly 

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correlated to the next month, 
then to the next month, to the 

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next month. 
And so the direction I'm 

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interpreting here, extrapolating
here, the direction that your 

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walk rate is going is more 
predictive of where it's going 

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to go next potentially. 
And as we look at this graph, I 

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think it'll be kind of 
interesting to see what we see 

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there. 
And then, then where I kind of 

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want to go with this is OK from 
an ecological perspective or 

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framework, can we understand, 
like how would we understand why

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this is occurring and then what?
And then is there anything that 

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we can do about it? 
So that's kind of where I was 

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thinking of starting our 
conversation today. 

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Yeah, right. 
May to June etcetera. 

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So couple month period each and 
and. 

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That's the one last one. 
July to October, See July, 

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August, October. 
Well, I guess that makes sense 

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because. 
October is last week. 

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Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 
It's Yep. 

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So it is and must teams near the
end of you know, September 

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baseball etcetera as well. 
That's the that's the other one.

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So walk through that one. 
What what's different that's 

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being communicated there that is
the year to year. 

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Is that something different? 
I'm trying to understand it 

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right now. 
Walk rate in. 

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In season correlation. 
So this is still in season? 

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Yeah. 
But what I'm what I'm struggling

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with is the percentages here 
walk rate in April, May or 

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March, April, sorry. 
And this is walk rate in May, 

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June and July and October, some 
kind of confused? 

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It looks, it looks to me like 
it's just a a different 

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graphical representation, right 
your X&Y axis? 

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Yeah, with the line being the 
correlation is 1 to 1 and so 

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it's how far off is, yes. 
But I guess that's why I'm guess

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I'm a little. 
And they said it was point .8 in

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the previous, so that would, you
know, be close to that one to 

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one, but not not exactly. 
OK. 

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If maybe I'm understanding this 
correctly, this here at the 

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bottom is correlated. 
So like what's the correlation 

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between these two? 
Like what's the correlation 

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between March and April versus 
May, June, July, October? 

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I think that's what's being, you
know, looked at so like for. 

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Example Early early to light. 
Yeah, like so July, October has 

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almost has a lower correlation 
to March, April maybe I don't 

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know like it's I'm not 100% sure
because like what are these 

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percentages? 
So if my percentage is my walk 

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percentage in July, October is 
7% and through the walk rate in 

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March, April is north of eight. 
It's got a low correlation. 

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I don't know. 
That's where I don't understand 

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what I'm looking at here. 
We need a we need, we need 

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Robert Fryer or somebody on this
one, Robert Fryer. 

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Maybe we'll cut that part out. 
But anyways, well, it's. 

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It's I think the the two things 
that jump out right away are 

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because you're asking the 
question why? 

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Why is it not correlated year to
year, but it is correlated 

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within the season And you're 
seeing it him saying that it's 

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essentially 0 and then .8. 
I mean that's, that's a from a 

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statistical standpoint that's 
huge. 

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So obviously part of it is, is 
unequivocally that guys are 

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pitching more, right? 
And they're in game like 

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environments, they're pitching 
in games more. 

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And so they're getting better at
the very thing that they're 

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doing. 
And yet the other thing though 

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that you said earlier that can't
be ignored and and there's 

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probably other reasons is if 
you're not very good at the 

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beginning of the year, they're 
just going to find somebody 

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else. 
And by the time kind of the year

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goes on, we know that injuries 
happen less. 

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And so you're probably going to 
find your core guys that you're 

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going to more and more, whereas 
in early of the year, you're 

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probably going to you're 
potentially going to see teams 

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explore a little bit more, 
figure out who who's especially 

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because bullpens can be 
volatile. 

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What starters kind of 
particularly in the back end of 

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your rotation, essentially who's
your core roster that you're 

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kind of running with for most of
the year, give or take a a 

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handful of guys that you're 
sending up and down or get 

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injured in the middle of the 
year. 

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So those are at least two of the
ideas that make sense to me, 

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both just the practical, you 
know, playing the game aspect, 

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but also the figuring out who 
your who your staff is and 

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running with the best guys that 
have shown that year, 

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particularly if there's not a 
correlation year to year, right?

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Like if it's not like, well, 
last year it was really good, 

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but we don't know what that'll 
look like this year. 

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We kind of know that in the 
bigs, bullpens can be volatile. 

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So they kind of figure out who's
having a good year and they just

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run with them. 
You know, and the other thing 

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too, that we have to remember 
when we're looking at this is 

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it's an aggregate, right? 
So a lot of teams are gonna look

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at, you know, a guy's history 
with walks, right? 

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You know, and so what's their 
walk percentage? 

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And it some of this comes back 
to the what I like about this is

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it's not it's not too macro. 
OK. 

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So like he's got it broken down 
into three different sections of

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the of the season and the first 
third versus the second third 

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and the last third. 
And what that, what this is 

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illustrating to me, and this 
makes sense even too like, and 

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some of this is just logic, but 
like it also fits with an 

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ecological approach. 
Is that right? 

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You're dynamic, you don't 
change, you're not static. 

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How you start is not how you 
finish. 

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And people have known this for a
really long time. 

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And it's a question of like, OK,
at what point how many data 

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points do I need before my, my, 
my data becomes, begins to 

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stabilize, right? 
And so like early in the year, 

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you know, might not be enough, 
you know, because there's all 

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these different factors, right? 
Getting re acclimated to playing

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games. 
The weather is also different at

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the beginning of the year versus
the middle of the year and the 

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end of the year. 
And so you have all these 

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different factors that probably 
play into into the fact of like 

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why guys walk rates are so much 
higher at the beginning of the 

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year versus versus the middle of
the year. 

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But what I think is interesting 
is that let's see, I I wanted to

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look at, OK, we're, it was 
interesting. 

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Let's see. 
Yeah. 

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OK. 
So in 2019, the walk rate 

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actually was higher at the end 
of the year than the middle of 

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the year. 
The middle of the year was a 

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little bit better at times then.
Yeah, yeah. 

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Then the, you know, you would 
assume that the best part of the

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year is the end, but it doesn't 
appear like that. 

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It appears like the middle of 
the year is where you have your 

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peak. 
More often than not you have 

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your peak like lowest lock rate.
That doesn't seem to be always 

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true, but it seems like 
sometimes the blue. 

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Line is pretty consistent the 
the earliest, that's always the 

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worst, Yeah. 
In fact, it's really hard to 

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find looking at the chart, a 
year other than what, 20? 

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21 it was the same between I 
mean, but that also makes sense 

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'cause you got 2020 right? 
So like that's a re acclimation 

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year. 
You're re acclimating to playing

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like everything got thrown off 
there, I would say, you know, 

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and so I don't know, I think 
that's really, really 

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fascinating that it kind of goes
either way. 

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And I, and the reason is, is 
that I think at the end of the 

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year, guys are starting to get 
fatigued, right? 

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Fatigue I think is, is 1 role 
for why guys will lose their 

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ability to command the baseball,
right. 

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As your central nervous system 
becomes more fatigued, it no 

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longer can one, you're going to 
have less resources to work with

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Two, your, the the resources or 
your, your system is going to 

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respond not as quickly. 
So therefore you can I guess 

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from an ecological perspective, 
your dexterity and your the from

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a standpoint of like degeneracy,
meaning the, the number of 

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possible configurations you have
goes down, right? 

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So you have a loss of degrees of
freedom, You have a loss of 

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degeneracy, meaning you have 
fewer movement solutions that 

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can work. 
Therefore, it would make sense 

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that you know, you're what's the
other word that I used? 

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Not dexterity, whatever. 
But anyways, so like all that 

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would go down, meaning leading 
to like less command, your 

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ability to put the ball exactly 
where you want as frequently as 

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you want want to. 
And so I think yes, pitching, 

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I'm jumping too far ahead. 
But basically, you know, they're

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I guess actually let's start 
with this. 

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OK, So that that's one problem, 
right is fatigue and so? 

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I don't know if you'd agree with
this, just, you know, heard it 

225
00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:24,680
in passing when I was working 
through, when I adopted the arm 

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care platform several years ago,
working through their resources.

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00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:33,960
Their claim was that, you know, 
a lot of people see like go 

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00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:36,600
well, fatigue is set in when you
see the radar gun go down. 

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00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:41,040
And they said our experience and
our data says that the first 

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00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:44,960
thing that goes down is not the 
radar gun, but the person's 

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00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:46,800
ability to command. 
I thought that was interesting. 

232
00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:49,600
That was different than what I 
had heard in the past. 

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00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:54,320
No, I mean, it's 100% right, 
because right velocity is the 

234
00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:58,440
result of you being able to 
again, velocity going back to 

235
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the, the more, the, the more 
ways that you have, the more to 

236
00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:07,200
'cause you don't, there's not 
just one way to produce 

237
00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:10,120
velocity, right? 
You can be quick or you can 

238
00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:13,720
apply force over a longer period
of time, you know, or you can 

239
00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:15,800
apply that force very quickly in
a short window. 

240
00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:20,720
So you have all these different 
ways to mask, you know, you can 

241
00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:23,720
muscle up and throw it harder or
you can be more relaxed, right? 

242
00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:25,640
So like there's all these 
different ways that you can 

243
00:15:25,640 --> 00:15:28,760
throw the ball harder. 
So you could probably mask a 

244
00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:34,680
velocity like drop for a while, 
like your fatigue, like your 

245
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system is fatigued, but you can 
mask the fact of like, you know,

246
00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:42,320
I'm just going to muscle up here
and, and give it, you know, 

247
00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:46,120
recruit more, more of my body to
be able to throw, throw this 

248
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:48,480
harder, right, and put more 
energy into it. 

249
00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:54,640
Whereas when this nervous system
is fresher, it doesn't, it 

250
00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:56,040
doesn't need to do all that, 
right? 

251
00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:59,720
It can very efficiently with 
less effort, throw the ball 

252
00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:02,560
harder, right? 
And so central nervous system 

253
00:16:02,560 --> 00:16:07,800
fatigue and the rate like you 
could say power, right, the loss

254
00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:11,280
of power, you know, the rate at 
which how fast you can contract 

255
00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:14,200
your muscles, probably it 
decreases. 

256
00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:16,280
Wave is going to decrease first,
right. 

257
00:16:16,280 --> 00:16:19,840
So even right from an SNC 
principal standpoint, speed in 

258
00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:23,440
terms of just pure Sprint 
velocity probably will drop 

259
00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:27,360
first, maybe not Sprint 
velocity. 

260
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:29,640
I, I actually think maybe like 
more, I like a tap test or 

261
00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:31,800
something like that might be 
more sensitive to that. 

262
00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:34,680
But your rate of force 
development is probably going to

263
00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:37,400
drop 1st and that's more related
to your central nervous system 

264
00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:40,960
fatiguing. 
And so that that would then make

265
00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:45,800
sense that command may be more 
sensitive to that, but that's 

266
00:16:45,800 --> 00:16:51,680
more because I think guys aren't
trained like it's much more, 

267
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:56,800
it's a lot harder to will a 
pitch to be a strike than it is 

268
00:16:56,800 --> 00:17:00,480
to just grunt harder and throw 
it harder, you know, which is 

269
00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:04,319
true in general of like, you 
know, developing velocity versus

270
00:17:04,319 --> 00:17:07,599
command. 
But I still think even if a 

271
00:17:07,599 --> 00:17:11,720
person is trained to locate, 
that's where I think you can use

272
00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:15,040
these two as corollaries because
sometimes I think those two 

273
00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:19,680
things would maybe actually map 
a little bit more. 

274
00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:25,079
But I think there's, you know, I
don't know if there's another 

275
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way to like assess, you know, in
game that a person is fatigued 

276
00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:30,600
necessarily. 
Sometimes you're just watching 

277
00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:33,400
them, you know, like do does it 
look like that was more effort? 

278
00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:37,560
You know, like that's where, you
know, pro teams, right? 

279
00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:39,680
They have Hawkeye and these 
other things and they can start 

280
00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:41,280
to measure some of these things 
a little bit. 

281
00:17:42,120 --> 00:17:46,760
But but you know, I well, I 
heard a podcast that, you know, 

282
00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:52,200
shell remain, shell remain 
remain. 

283
00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:56,000
Thank you, nameless. 
And and like, I get what they 

284
00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,360
were saying here, right? 
But you know, there's like, well

285
00:17:58,360 --> 00:18:00,960
we got somebody in our bio 
mechanics lab and we found that 

286
00:18:01,360 --> 00:18:05,760
they threw 98 plus all the time 
when their stride length was 

287
00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:09,320
105%, you know, of their body 
height. 

288
00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:13,000
But then what we saw was like 
during the game using all these 

289
00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:16,560
systems, the feedback they were 
getting is that it would go down

290
00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:20,400
to the 90 fours and the 90 twos 
and what not and their velocity 

291
00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:23,640
would drop. 
And the conclusion from that 

292
00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:28,480
was, so therefore we just need 
to get the guy to always go 105%

293
00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:32,280
disregarding. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

294
00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:35,080
Disregarding that, that, you 
know, I mean. 

295
00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:37,040
There's a reason for why it 
probably. 

296
00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:40,440
Yes, why yes, why was he 
changing the fatigue, etcetera, 

297
00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:44,120
like how he was interacting with
the game, how he was interacting

298
00:18:44,120 --> 00:18:47,080
with his own body, how you know,
like and and I think that that's

299
00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:50,440
something that we just don't so 
so even even with the tech that 

300
00:18:50,440 --> 00:18:53,520
we have, my sense is that a lot 
of people what they'll do is 

301
00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:56,000
like, oh, your your mechanics 
are are changing. 

302
00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:57,600
I go exactly. 
They have to. 

303
00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:01,480
That's the point. 
I know Rob Gray has talked about

304
00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:02,880
it. 
I've struggled a little bit with

305
00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:05,240
this and pitching been thinking 
about this lately. 

306
00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:06,800
What are the invariants and 
pitching? 

307
00:19:07,240 --> 00:19:15,440
Rob has thrown out the kinetic 
chain and a consistent release 

308
00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:21,640
point and the kinetic chain one 
makes sense to me, but I do 

309
00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:24,440
remember years ago it's actually
I don't know if he still. 

310
00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:27,120
Works makes a little less sense.
Depends what you mean by kinetic

311
00:19:27,120 --> 00:19:28,360
chain. 
I think you have to define it. 

312
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:33,760
Yeah, basically that, that the, 
the that you're working from the

313
00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:36,640
ground up and that those things 
are going to stack to transfer 

314
00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:38,560
force. 
That was one of his invariants, 

315
00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:42,560
which you know, as a person who 
doesn't know enough about that, 

316
00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:46,560
that that makes enough intuitive
sense. 

317
00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:49,760
I just remember, and this is 
more of a sidebar to get to the 

318
00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,720
second one, but I just do 
remember years ago sitting in a 

319
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:55,720
conference with a guy, I don't 
know if he's still in the Braves

320
00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:59,240
minor league organization, but 
he cited a paper that was 

321
00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:01,280
written in, I think it was like 
Japan. 

322
00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:02,840
And I could never find it in 
English. 

323
00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:05,640
But he said that there was 
something in the arm that. 

324
00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:08,720
Whether it was the shoulder 
elbow, I couldn't remember 

325
00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:11,960
exactly what it was, but that it
went out of order in the kinetic

326
00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:14,800
chain and I thought that was 
fascinating. 

327
00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:18,840
Setting that aside, the release 
.1 is one that I've struggled a 

328
00:20:18,840 --> 00:20:23,640
little bit with because the 
release point, you know, you've 

329
00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:25,720
heard people for years talk 
about having a consistent 

330
00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:27,960
release point. 
And, and yeah, I get it like 

331
00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:30,800
that helps, you know, where the 
ball is going more consistently.

332
00:20:31,120 --> 00:20:33,760
And yet even just from an 
ecological standpoint, I've gone

333
00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:36,080
yeah, but if you could throw 
multiple pitches out of multiple

334
00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:38,040
slots, like that would be harder
on the hitter. 

335
00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:40,960
So is that something that you 
can, is that actually an 

336
00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:43,600
invariant or is that something 
that we could train better to 

337
00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:45,960
get guys to throw from different
slots? 

338
00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:48,840
Or does it actually have to be 
the same release point? 

339
00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:53,000
And of course you have not just 
release point in terms of where 

340
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:56,720
your arm slot is, but release 
point in terms of vertical and 

341
00:20:56,720 --> 00:21:00,080
horizontal, you know, like it's 
a 3 dimensional space we're 

342
00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:04,400
talking about not just. 
So I will admit I don't know 

343
00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:07,840
necessarily what to think about 
that either. 

344
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:11,200
Just thinking through like, I 
think it would be useful as a 

345
00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:13,680
pitcher to throw multiple 
pitches out of multiple out of 

346
00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:16,720
multiple slots, but is that 
practical? 

347
00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:19,080
Can you do that? 
Could we still train command and

348
00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:20,560
have guys be good enough to do 
that? 

349
00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:23,960
The ecological side of me says, 
well, yeah, if we, if we create 

350
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:26,720
a more adaptable, robust athlete
has abundance of motor 

351
00:21:27,160 --> 00:21:29,800
solutions, then if that's how 
we're training them, then I 

352
00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:31,000
think they would be good at 
that. 

353
00:21:31,520 --> 00:21:34,360
In fact, I think they might be 
better at having a more quote UN

354
00:21:34,360 --> 00:21:37,200
quote consistent arm slot if we 
allowed them to explore a little

355
00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:41,320
bit instead of just saying, no, 
we have to have this one 

356
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:44,040
consistent. 
But there are several studies 

357
00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:46,440
that, you know, look at these 
professional players and say 

358
00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:50,720
they all move differently to get
to a more like it's the the 

359
00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:54,880
thing that varies the least is 
the released point. 

360
00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:58,200
And I can acknowledge that. 
And yet from my ecological side 

361
00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:00,280
of me, I'm going. 
But I wonder if we could push 

362
00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:02,240
that, You know, I wonder if we 
could train that differently. 

363
00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:07,640
And that's where I think, you 
know, if I'm being literal, yes,

364
00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:10,080
the release point is the most 
consistent, but it also still 

365
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:13,480
has variation in it. 
So for example, you could 

366
00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,640
probably, if you can manipulate 
your fingers and your hand and 

367
00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:20,120
your wrist, your pronation and 
the timing of that a little bit 

368
00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:24,400
that that also will manipulate 
where that ball ends up, even if

369
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:29,280
your hand right, is literally in
the same spot that it was 

370
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:31,680
before. 
But if your wrist orientation is

371
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:34,680
slightly different or how your 
fingers are and the pressure is 

372
00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:38,320
slightly different, it's going 
to have some effect on where 

373
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:43,000
that pitch is going to end up. 
And so that's where, you know, 

374
00:22:43,120 --> 00:22:45,960
I, I think it is starting to get
more out there of people 

375
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:48,280
understanding that like we, we 
don't repeat our mechanics. 

376
00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,360
Like I'm hearing more and more 
coaches understand that. 

377
00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:52,840
And so I think that's really 
good. 

378
00:22:54,360 --> 00:22:56,640
But then it becomes back to of 
like, OK, how do we get 

379
00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:01,200
consistency of performance? 
And so, but, and so I want to 

380
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:06,160
kind of transition to talking 
about, OK, what's the ecological

381
00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:10,840
view of like command? 
And, and I the way that I am 

382
00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:13,880
thinking, I think about is like,
we first have to understand the 

383
00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:18,080
problem. 
What is the problem that the 

384
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,680
pitcher is trying to solve in 
order to have what we call 

385
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:22,280
command? 
What I think we also have to 

386
00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:25,280
define that because right 
Driveline has talked about, 

387
00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:29,320
right, The average miss is what 
12 to 17 inches. 

388
00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:31,680
It's probably not 17. 
It's probably 12 to 15 or 

389
00:23:31,680 --> 00:23:34,120
something like that. 
Because I remember I looked into

390
00:23:34,120 --> 00:23:37,440
it because the plates like 17 
inches and I forget what the, 

391
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:43,400
the the diagonal is, you know, 
but so you, you have like a 

392
00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:48,480
decent miss pattern might. 
And so, OK, we can't 

393
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:52,000
necessarily, we tend to miss on 
average about that amount. 

394
00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:55,280
But what I think is missed in 
this whole conversation is the 

395
00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:57,640
fact that people can actually 
throw the ball exactly where 

396
00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:00,320
they intend to throw the ball. 
Like, I think we forget that. 

397
00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:04,000
Like, yeah, of course, most 
often times we do miss, but you 

398
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,160
can still actually throw the 
ball exactly where you're 

399
00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:09,760
intending to throw it. 
Like, you know, the whole thing 

400
00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:13,920
of even, you know, watching 
Ichiro, you know, knock over 

401
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:15,840
bats and different stuff like 
that, right. 

402
00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:19,200
Like, OK, you know, oh, well, he
missed 10 inches. 

403
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:21,080
Well, then he ain't hitting that
the bat that he's trying to 

404
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:23,920
throw at, you know, like, so 
it's like I, I just don't buy 

405
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,960
this whole thing that like, oh, 
it's so hard and it's just 

406
00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:29,840
random luck that you actually 
throw the ball to your intended 

407
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:31,800
target. 
Like that to me is complete, 

408
00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:36,760
complete bullocks. 
Like I, I just, I, I just think 

409
00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,440
like there's just too much 
evidence like of people actually

410
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:45,800
hitting their spot, you know, so
with with like, OK, yeah, maybe 

411
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:49,960
I missed it by like 11 like 
millimetre, you know, is move 

412
00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,240
just to, you know, that's to me,
it's that's close enough, right?

413
00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:56,080
That 10 inch miss is like, 
that's pretty significant, 

414
00:24:56,080 --> 00:25:00,200
right? 
So that's where I want it. 

415
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:02,080
Contextual, isn't it? 
Right. 

416
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:05,120
Like there's so much. 
I I guess here's where where I'm

417
00:25:05,120 --> 00:25:07,200
going with this too with from an
ecological perspective. 

418
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:10,360
All right, let's start with the 
ideal, OK, and then we can work 

419
00:25:10,360 --> 00:25:13,120
to like what the why the misses,
right. 

420
00:25:13,120 --> 00:25:17,000
So to me, in order for if I'm 
taking, if I'm thinking about 

421
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:21,440
this ecologically, OK, it is the
intention of the athlete 

422
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,960
attending to the right 
information connected to that 

423
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:26,560
information. 
Their movement is coupled to 

424
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:33,160
that and the whole thing self 
organizes around that connection

425
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:36,200
to that information. 
So for example, because we've 

426
00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,600
talked about this before of like
perspective control. 

427
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,040
So for me, this is where 
perspective control comes into 

428
00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:45,440
play for a pitcher is that as 
their body is moving in space 

429
00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:50,200
down the mound to deliver the 
ball to their target, their body

430
00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:53,560
is picking up and proceeding 
information about how are they 

431
00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:56,320
doing to be able to do that 
right? 

432
00:25:56,320 --> 00:26:00,240
And so you, you're having the 
feedback from the optical flow, 

433
00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:06,200
you're having optical flow, 
you're having your kinesthetic 

434
00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:10,960
awareness of where your body is 
in space and then when your foot

435
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:14,360
hits the ground, right. 
So like that, that information, 

436
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:17,360
plus, you know, you could say 
where your eyes and head are 

437
00:26:17,360 --> 00:26:20,600
relative to the target when you 
throw and then your, your sense 

438
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:23,680
of feeling of where your hand is
and the ball and all that sort 

439
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:27,040
of stuff. 
And so, and then how all that 

440
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:28,720
works towards the target and 
then once the ball is out of 

441
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:31,680
your hand, you know, then it's 
it's pretty much said and done 

442
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:35,600
at that point. 
But where what perspective 

443
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:40,280
control, I think helps me or 
like how I think it it plays in 

444
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:43,080
here is the body is self 
organizing, the closer. 

445
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:51,840
So like, I really like this that
like I want to say heuristic, 

446
00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:59,640
but like what's the word mantra?
I guess you could say that South

447
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:03,440
Carolina or Coastal Carolina had
one of the years that they went 

448
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:06,560
to the College World Series will
overskill, right? 

449
00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:08,040
So it wasn't about repeating 
your mechanics. 

450
00:27:08,040 --> 00:27:11,400
It was that you willed it. 
And so your body, right as we're

451
00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:14,960
moving to it towards our target 
is going to make adjustments 

452
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:19,800
based upon how how strong the 
intention is towards that. 

453
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:23,880
The body's going to try to 
correct any like any of those 

454
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,840
mistakes that are going on. 
Maybe you started a little bit 

455
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:29,040
too fast down the mound. 
Maybe you didn't get in your hip

456
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:32,560
as much as you did before or 
maybe you start whatever it is. 

457
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:39,200
You know, when your foot hit the
ground it it inverted yes, it 

458
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:41,920
inverted a little bit more 
because of how you hit the 

459
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:43,360
ground. 
You know, you start to roll the 

460
00:27:43,360 --> 00:27:46,000
ankle this way a little bit, or 
maybe it everted whatever it is,

461
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:48,480
right, and threw, threw 
something off up the chain. 

462
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:52,280
But you still are able to make 
an adjustment. 

463
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:55,920
Maybe your arm slot, you know, 
your, your arm swing was a 

464
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:59,440
little bit longer or whatever it
is, but your, your body makes an

465
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:03,600
adjustment for that to get the 
ball and that pitch to that 

466
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:05,560
spot, right. 
And so to me, that's that's 

467
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,880
where perspective control kind 
of comes into play, is that the 

468
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:12,160
system is actually able to in 
real time, as it's perceiving 

469
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:16,120
the information, make slight 
adjustments to achieve the 

470
00:28:16,120 --> 00:28:19,360
outcome that it wants. 
And, and yes, there are certain 

471
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:21,960
principles that make certain 
things more likely. 

472
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,840
Like this has just been even my 
own experience of like learning 

473
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:28,200
how to control my center of mass
down the mound and like finding 

474
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:31,200
a certain rhythm that like just 
made it feel like it was so much

475
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:34,160
easier to put the ball where I 
want. 

476
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:37,000
But that comes back to, again, 
from an ecological perspective, 

477
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:43,920
I'm having to learn how my body 
relates to the task in the task 

478
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:48,160
environment, right. 
And so and how and, and so for 

479
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,600
me, that's where an ecological 
approach changes how we're 

480
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:53,240
thinking about this. 
It's no longer about just 

481
00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,920
mechanics, you know, repeating 
my mechanics or, or hitting 

482
00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:02,200
certain mechanical checkpoints 
or, well, you know, my pelvis or

483
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,280
whatever, or my foot. 
Like that dictates everything 

484
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,960
else that's going to happen. 
And if you screw that up, then 

485
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:09,040
it's going to screw up the 
outcome. 

486
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:12,240
And that's why your outcomes are
not very good. 

487
00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:13,960
And it's like, yeah, maybe a 
little bit. 

488
00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:18,400
But I do believe like from an 
ecological approach, I think 

489
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:22,120
that intention and the fact that
the the body self organizes and 

490
00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:27,360
optimizes around the how strong 
of an intention, whatever 

491
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,520
intention is the strongest, it's
going to organize itself around 

492
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:32,760
that. 
So for example, what I mean by 

493
00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:36,880
intention there is that, OK, 
obviously every pitcher is 

494
00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:39,040
intending to throw to the 
target, but if they have fear, 

495
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:41,680
right, all of a sudden they get 
a little nervous or like they, 

496
00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:45,800
they feel like, you know what, 
I, I, I feel like I need more 

497
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:47,920
space here. 
Well, then that becomes more of 

498
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:50,600
the priority. 
That priority is higher than the

499
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:53,840
priority or the intention to 
throw to the target. 

500
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:58,840
And so then that might be why an
athlete, you know, doesn't 

501
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:01,120
actually execute what they're 
trying to execute, because the 

502
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:03,320
system is actually trying to 
self organize around a different

503
00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:09,920
priority. 
Wait, whenever I've heard 

504
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:17,200
coaches I respect talk about 
command and, and you sort of 

505
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:21,280
peel back the layers of what 
they really think will do it. 

506
00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:26,440
They wouldn't use this language,
but they always say something 

507
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:29,840
that relates to attention and 
intention. 

508
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:33,880
And, and as you're talking, the 
thing that comes to mind for me 

509
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:37,000
is, and, and you'll know this 
well as a hitting coach, when 

510
00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:40,360
I've had to throw batting 
practice, there will be times 

511
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:46,640
when I miss and I'll miss two or
three times in a row and I'll 

512
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:49,840
realize that I wasn't really 
focused. 

513
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:51,880
I was just throwing bag in 
practice to the guys. 

514
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:59,000
And if I become incredibly 
focused on the task at times, 

515
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:03,960
which is I need to hit this spot
because, you know, I, I want to 

516
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:07,200
move the ball around. 
So he learns to hit different 

517
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:09,280
locations as he's preparing for 
this game. 

518
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:14,560
But I also might and, and, and 
this is what you alluded to. 

519
00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:17,200
And this is what I'm sort of 
thinking in real time. 

520
00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:22,320
At times, I need to be, and I've
seen this be completely 

521
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:25,360
connected to the task, which is 
getting the hitter out, 

522
00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:28,440
connecting to their behavior, 
throwing a pitch that starts at 

523
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:30,920
the front hip and then sinks 
back into the zone where I'll 

524
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,040
use the behavior of the batter. 
And yet at other times, I 

525
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,640
really, really, really need to 
just connect to the target. 

526
00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:42,680
I need to simplify and sort of 
have this funnel vision towards 

527
00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:44,400
that. 
But other times, as you 

528
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:47,640
acknowledged, I remember at 
times pitching where I could 

529
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,440
feel when the ball would come 
off my hands. 

530
00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:52,840
I knew right away if it was a 
good off my fingers, if it was a

531
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:55,440
good pitch or not. 
And so I would start to become 

532
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,720
aware of, I'm sort of starting 
to talk about almost like 

533
00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:01,640
Newell's triangle, like how 
constraint shape behavior, 

534
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:03,440
right? 
And so some of those are task 

535
00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:08,960
oriented that I'm more intending
and, and paying attention to. 

536
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:13,640
Sometimes it's now when I pitch 
and I haven't pitched in a long 

537
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:17,160
time and I can start to feel my 
front hip and I have to be a 

538
00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:21,240
little bit more aware of how I 
adjust in order to land 

539
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:23,520
differently because I can't keep
landing. 

540
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:25,880
I'm not in shape. 
I don't, I don't throw all the 

541
00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:29,000
time. 
Sometimes, you know, having to 

542
00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:33,400
be and maybe this one isn't as 
clean, but man, like when you're

543
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:38,440
in a different environment, I 
I'm reminded of Billy Chappell. 

544
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,880
What's the movie with Kevin 
Costner for love of the game, 

545
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:43,960
right? 
He has the he has the phrase 

546
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:46,880
that he says clear the mechanism
and everybody, the environment 

547
00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:49,560
essentially is not bothering him
anymore. 

548
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:51,760
He's not worried about the 
crowd, right? 

549
00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:54,000
He's not worried about pitching 
in Yankee Stadium. 

550
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:55,520
There. 
He's just connected to the 

551
00:32:55,520 --> 00:32:57,520
batter of the umpire and his 
catcher. 

552
00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:05,600
And so for me, what that 
elucidates is that making an 

553
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:10,040
athlete who doesn't figure out 
what exactly they need to pay 

554
00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:13,800
attention to all the time and 
intend all the time, and they 

555
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:17,440
found the answer, but instead 
helping them be adaptable to be 

556
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:21,040
very connected, as you talked 
about prospective control, that 

557
00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:24,520
there's all this information 
that they can interact with and 

558
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,680
it might be different based on 
how they're feeling, where 

559
00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:31,720
they're pitching, what kind of 
hitters up, etcetera. 

560
00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:35,080
That's what it's making me think
of is, is making a highly 

561
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,120
attuned, adaptable athlete that 
they can pay attention to any 

562
00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:42,720
number of factors in order to 
adjust pitch to pitch if they're

563
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:45,360
making a mistake or repeat a 
pitch, find what's working that 

564
00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:47,840
day or what maybe worked a 
previous day. 

565
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:49,240
That's what it's making me 
think. 

566
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:51,640
It's not. 
Here's the answer. 

567
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:55,800
But instead we need to train the
athletes in in different ways 

568
00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:58,560
every day to go how can you 
command the ball better today 

569
00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:00,600
based on who you are today? 
And how will that change 

570
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:04,480
tomorrow and the next day? 
I think there's an interesting 

571
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:09,120
dynamic there between 
variability and I think I can't 

572
00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:12,120
remember if we talked about this
in another podcast. 

573
00:34:12,679 --> 00:34:15,719
While I'm on that, that point of
another podcast for those people

574
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:19,480
who are wondering about, you 
know, this, this random word 

575
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,960
that we threw out that I threw 
out there of perspective 

576
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:24,000
control. 
That's been mentioned a couple 

577
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:25,520
of times. 
There's an episode that we 

578
00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:28,960
recorded with Andrew Wilson 
specifically where we go over 

579
00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:31,639
and cover that. 
So I'd recommend people who are 

580
00:34:31,639 --> 00:34:35,320
wondering about that to circle 
back and look for that episode 

581
00:34:36,679 --> 00:34:39,840
because I want to I don't want 
to spend a ton of time trying to

582
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:42,719
elucidate or expand expound upon
that. 

583
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:46,880
But when it comes to 
variability, right, I think this

584
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:51,639
is the the thing that a lot of 
times what even to what I see in

585
00:34:51,639 --> 00:34:55,320
like pitching development, 
right, is like, OK, let's, let's

586
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,320
do different things all the 
time. 

587
00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:01,360
And I think the old school 
coaches kind of push, push 

588
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:02,560
against that. 
They're they're worried about 

589
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:04,720
that. 
And I, and I think in some ways 

590
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:08,120
rightly so. 
But what we are saying is like, 

591
00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:12,560
or rather how I nuance it and 
how I think about is, OK, 

592
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:16,480
there's a time to be focused on 
consistency of outcome and the 

593
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:18,280
variability is going to go down 
there. 

594
00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:23,600
But like it's going to go down 
in terms of how I'm thinking 

595
00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:26,240
about my practice design. 
It's not going to go down in 

596
00:35:26,240 --> 00:35:27,160
actuality. 
Why? 

597
00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:32,240
Because the athlete is dynamic 
and the environment is dynamic, 

598
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:33,880
generally speaking. 
And you're going to have these 

599
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:37,440
subtle changes and sometimes we 
want to be intentional about, 

600
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:41,560
you know, switching some things 
up and adding some variability 

601
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:43,640
in there. 
But like more specifically along

602
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:48,040
the lines of, of scenarios that 
the athlete would find 

603
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:51,320
themselves in the game, right? 
So they're different modes, 

604
00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:52,960
right? 
Like if I'm, if I'm going to, in

605
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:55,600
my mind at the beginning of 
practice, I'm going to have more

606
00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:56,880
variability. 
That's going to be less 

607
00:35:56,880 --> 00:35:59,240
representative, that's going to 
be more out there, more 

608
00:35:59,240 --> 00:36:03,120
exploration, that's going to be 
more on the edges of, of what an

609
00:36:03,120 --> 00:36:08,200
athlete's natural performance 
abilities are. 

610
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:11,520
Let's take for example Marcus 
Stroman, right? 

611
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:15,080
Most people have seen his warm 
up routine and how he'll throw 

612
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:17,520
in different ways as he's 
playing catch. 

613
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:22,320
But then as you get closer and 
closer to the game, the amount 

614
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:25,360
of variability and the amount of
exploration he's doing becomes 

615
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:29,200
less and less. 
I think this hurt. 

616
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:31,560
I don't remember because I'd 
never watched Nestor Cortez 

617
00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:35,640
pitch a ton, but I get the sense
that he doesn't goof around as 

618
00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:38,640
much as he used to in terms of 
his delivery and in game, 

619
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:42,280
whereas I don't know how much 
Strowman is still doing that 

620
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:46,480
too. 
But I think that's where those 

621
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:49,800
things were opening up degrees 
of freedom such that when he 

622
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,160
comes back towards the middle 
and there's, there's still some 

623
00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:55,080
variability there, but it's not 
as it as extreme variability, 

624
00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:57,400
right? 
And so that's, and it comes back

625
00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:03,640
more to that variability is 
being used to execute something.

626
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:08,400
So it's, it's, it's focused on 
the outcome, not just exploring 

627
00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:12,840
to understand, right? 
I think there's two, there's two

628
00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:16,520
like often when I'm exploring, 
I'm exploring to understand 

629
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:22,040
versus I am exploring to 
execute. 

630
00:37:22,440 --> 00:37:26,200
And then there's the third one 
of like now I'm just simply 

631
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:29,920
focused on executing and the, 
and that previous experience 

632
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:35,280
lends itself to an affordance 
basically to utilize something 

633
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,360
that I, I picked up in my 
exploration. 

634
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:41,360
Or it can be simply exploration 
can be simply helping us attune,

635
00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:45,440
you know, become attuned and 
calibrated to our, to our 

636
00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:46,920
environment. 
So there's a, there's, there's 

637
00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:50,280
multiple levels to that. 
And so I wanted to say that all 

638
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:55,840
that to say is that I think we 
also need to understand that you

639
00:37:55,840 --> 00:38:03,280
can be ecologically driven and 
also have what seems like less 

640
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:05,360
variability, but rather the 
focus shifts. 

641
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:10,080
When your focus shifts to 
performance and the execution 

642
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,080
side of things, the variability 
is naturally going to go down. 

643
00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:17,520
And that's how I if I'm going to
talk to a traditional coach or a

644
00:38:17,520 --> 00:38:20,560
traditional coach is going to be
like, I don't like that. 

645
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:23,440
You know what you're doing. 
It's two variable like whatever 

646
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:24,680
and like is kind of Pooh poohing
it. 

647
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:27,280
I can still maintain some 
variability. 

648
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:29,280
It's just going to look a little
bit different, but it's going to

649
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:32,680
be more execution focused and 
that's going to pull, it's going

650
00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:37,080
to kind of naturally pull the 
variability down when I, when I 

651
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:40,720
focus more on execution. 
So that's what I wanted at least

652
00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:44,320
throw in there as well. 
But I think there's a natural 

653
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:47,040
progression and that's some 
something that I, I hope we've 

654
00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:50,280
kind of elucidated throughout 
this podcast, you know, on, on 

655
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,360
like the episode of like serious
play and how do we integrate 

656
00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:56,920
things back the one, the one 
episode on for Veiki, Like it 

657
00:38:57,040 --> 00:39:01,600
was kind of trying to thread 
this of like there's a process 

658
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:06,880
by which we utilize exploration 
to help us in execution. 

659
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:12,520
And, and this is that there's 
what is that the, there's the 

660
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:15,920
post framework, the 
periodization of, you know, 

661
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:18,280
skill work. 
And there's there's multiple out

662
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:21,320
there that that follow that 
exact line of thinking that 

663
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:27,280
there is both a a daily 
exploration to performance as 

664
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:32,080
well as a more long term, when 
are the periods of higher 

665
00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:36,800
exploration versus more 
performance area oriented and 

666
00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:43,240
everywhere in between. 
But it does seem foolish to, 

667
00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:48,520
again, from an ecological 
standpoint to sit in one right. 

668
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:53,560
That's like for a college 
baseball, you know, to say, 

669
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:57,560
well, the fall is like kind of 
about performance, but also 

670
00:39:57,560 --> 00:39:59,160
getting better because it's the 
fall. 

671
00:39:59,160 --> 00:40:01,080
I'm trying to compete for a 
spot, but get better. 

672
00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:06,240
Once I get to my winter time, 
I'm all exploration and then I 

673
00:40:06,240 --> 00:40:10,840
get to the spring and I'm all 
performance that that's not 

674
00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:14,440
going to work. 
Or at least you're not. 

675
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:16,280
That's not optimized. 
I would say. 

676
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:18,720
Like, I think you're leaving. 
You're leaving something on the 

677
00:40:18,720 --> 00:40:20,880
table, right? 
It's, it's just like lifting, 

678
00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:22,840
right? 
Like, oh, OK, I'm gonna, I'm not

679
00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:26,560
gonna lift very much, you know, 
or hardly at all or not at all 

680
00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:29,680
in the fall. 
I'm gonna lift really hard in 

681
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:31,920
the winter and then I'm not 
gonna lift at all in the spring 

682
00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:34,160
like this. 
Like, you know, and and I see 

683
00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:36,480
that on the offensive side, 
like, oh, OK, I'll use weighted 

684
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:40,280
bats, you know, in the 
offseason, but I won't touch him

685
00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:43,120
at all in season. 
It's like, well, then, you know,

686
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:46,720
people don't realize in this to 
to loop this back to to 

687
00:40:46,720 --> 00:40:50,280
pitching, like weighted, 
weighted anything is weight 

688
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:52,280
training. 
It follows all the same 

689
00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:57,640
principles, including a. 
Regular oz fat and A5 oz ball 

690
00:40:58,120 --> 00:40:59,040
right? 
Right. 

691
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:00,680
Yeah, I mean it all has. 
Weight to it. 

692
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:03,480
Yeah, I mean, the only thing 
that doesn't have weight is air,

693
00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:05,520
right? 
Like there's nothing, there's no

694
00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:08,400
material that we've I don't know
that we're gonna use that has no

695
00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:09,640
weight to it or basically 
nothing. 

696
00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:13,480
So like I don't this whole thing
of like, oh, like weighted 

697
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:15,040
anything is bad. 
Makes no sense to me. 

698
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:19,360
But anyways, it's just how, how 
much right and for the 

699
00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:21,640
individual. 
But anyways, so the principles 

700
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:25,760
of of lifting, you have training
residuals as well known in the 

701
00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:29,280
SNC world, right? 
And so when it comes to these 

702
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:34,880
sort of things and the training 
residuals also apply to skill, 

703
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:37,800
right? 
And there's probably not as much

704
00:41:37,800 --> 00:41:42,200
research on on the training 
residuals when it comes to skill

705
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:45,640
work. 
And like, because really when 

706
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:51,040
you look at the work of David's 
and Arahu, forgive me if I got 

707
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:57,720
Arahu's name wrong, but there 
and I think so Michael's as 

708
00:41:57,720 --> 00:41:58,680
well. 
I can't remember. 

709
00:41:58,760 --> 00:42:03,440
But anyways, their paper on like
what is exactly acquired in, in 

710
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:07,600
skill acquisition or skill AC, 
they basically talk about like, 

711
00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:10,480
OK, ecological dynamics actually
views, we don't view things as 

712
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:14,040
skill acquisition, rather we 
view it as skill adaptation. 

713
00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:20,360
And that language maps very well
onto S&C principles because we 

714
00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:22,880
view what we're doing in the 
weight room as creating 

715
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:24,560
adaptations. 
The body is adapting to the 

716
00:42:24,560 --> 00:42:25,760
stress that we're putting it 
under. 

717
00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:29,080
And so the same principles are 
going to apply here to skill 

718
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:31,200
that the system is going to 
adapt. 

719
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:36,280
And now again, ecological 
dynamics, right, the body and 

720
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:39,520
the human system is dynamic and 
it's going to change over time. 

721
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:44,120
So like we have to understand 
that with all these sort of 

722
00:42:44,120 --> 00:42:46,640
things and what we're talking 
about, like what's your, to your

723
00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:50,680
point of exploration, right? 
That we don't just explore at 

724
00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:54,480
one time of the season that 
needs to be worked in throughout

725
00:42:54,480 --> 00:43:00,240
because it helps the sensitivity
and the adaptation and the to, 

726
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:03,840
to be able to like maintain, at 
least maintain, right? 

727
00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:07,200
Like so again, like the, when 
you go away from something, OK, 

728
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:11,120
there's a, there's a residual 
and how long does that residual 

729
00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:14,280
hang around before it starts to 
decay and disappear, right. 

730
00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:17,720
And so like the more we explore 
and add some little levels of 

731
00:43:17,720 --> 00:43:23,960
exploration in there, it's going
to maintain the, the potentially

732
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:26,960
either the attunement or the 
sensitivity, it's going to, you 

733
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:28,920
potentially are going to be able
to hold on to things longer. 

734
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:31,600
And also, you know, there are 
other benefits of like 

735
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:34,760
discovering, making new 
discoveries to maintain growth, 

736
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:38,120
all that sort of stuff. 
Well, even sticking with your 

737
00:43:38,120 --> 00:43:42,560
SNC example, this'll, this'll be
a little bit of a poor one, but 

738
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:45,200
trying to connect to it like if 
you're on a three day a week 

739
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:47,520
program, right? 
And those are your really heavy 

740
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:50,040
lifting days where you're trying
to create those adaptations. 

741
00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:52,880
In a sense, those are your 
performance days. 

742
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:55,240
And of course we wouldn't call 
them that because, you know, 

743
00:43:55,240 --> 00:43:57,280
you're always in the weight room
training for something. 

744
00:43:57,280 --> 00:43:59,960
But if we're just taking that 
because I, because I think the 

745
00:43:59,960 --> 00:44:03,960
SNC world is so good, because we
intuitively understand that you 

746
00:44:03,960 --> 00:44:06,440
have to push yourself and create
adaptations, not do the same 

747
00:44:06,440 --> 00:44:08,760
thing over and over, right? 
We intuitively know that, but 

748
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:10,200
then we don't apply it to other 
places. 

749
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:13,680
Well, how foolish would it be in
a sport like baseball where 

750
00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:17,080
you're playing 3-4 times a week 
and then you're in between 

751
00:44:17,080 --> 00:44:20,480
practices, You know, can be a 
little bit harder, especially if

752
00:44:20,480 --> 00:44:23,960
you're not a starting pitcher, 
where you're on a regular 

753
00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:26,520
regimen and you're just pitching
every Friday or every Saturday 

754
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:28,840
or whatever. 
And, and you have that space in 

755
00:44:28,840 --> 00:44:31,080
between, but you're a reliever 
or you're a position player, 

756
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:33,360
whatever. 
How foolish would it be if we 

757
00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:37,280
were in the S&C world and we 
treated our, you know, our 

758
00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:39,320
performance days in the weight 
room like, well, I can't do too 

759
00:44:39,320 --> 00:44:42,680
much here, I'll try to get 
better in the weight room in 

760
00:44:42,680 --> 00:44:44,360
between those days. 
Well, of course, that 

761
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:47,040
intuitively doesn't make sense. 
And so I think that's another 

762
00:44:47,040 --> 00:44:53,560
reason why exploration is so 
important is because you have to

763
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:56,480
like even on on our game days, 
right? 

764
00:44:56,480 --> 00:45:00,040
That might be your quote UN 
quote high day because you had 

765
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:03,800
to be ready to perform that day.
And so then you need to, to 

766
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:08,280
figure out what that looks like.
How do I continue to get better 

767
00:45:08,560 --> 00:45:10,800
during the year? 
If I didn't pitch that day? 

768
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:14,200
Do I throw after the game or do 
I throw the next day? 

769
00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:17,240
The point is, is how can I 
continue to make those 

770
00:45:17,240 --> 00:45:20,000
adaptations instead of just 
knowing if I went into the 

771
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:23,560
weight room every day and just 
kind of tried to, to hold serve,

772
00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:26,520
I would eventually just keep 
getting I, I would get worse. 

773
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:29,920
The same thing can happen during
a season where if you're not 

774
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,920
trying to continue to explore 
and make adaptations to become 

775
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:39,720
more adaptable, to me, there 
isn't really a, a holding serve 

776
00:45:39,720 --> 00:45:44,040
in that You're either continuing
to become more adaptable or 

777
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:46,520
you're becoming less adaptable 
and you're and you're finding 

778
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:49,160
yourself kind of in these ruts 
that are a little harder or 

779
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:50,400
you're just getting worse, you 
know? 

780
00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:55,400
And to to go to kind of make a 
connection with another episode 

781
00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:59,960
that we did before on the 
Vervecki episode on integrating 

782
00:45:59,960 --> 00:46:03,800
things back in. 
One of the things that we talked

783
00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:08,520
about was, you know, when it 
comes to machine learning 

784
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:13,760
models, right, like often times 
if you feed it too many 

785
00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:17,600
variables, it'll overfit to to 
certain things. 

786
00:46:17,720 --> 00:46:21,760
And so like the, the way to 
overcome that is to add noise 

787
00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:24,400
into the system. 
You know, again, like the, the 

788
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:27,840
overfitting is basically losing 
the forest through the trees. 

789
00:46:27,840 --> 00:46:31,360
Like you just get hyper focused 
on on one tree and like you miss

790
00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:33,960
the whole forest. 
And so like what exploration 

791
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:36,960
does it it, it provides a little
bit of noise. 

792
00:46:37,240 --> 00:46:40,160
It provides a little bit of 
something different, something 

793
00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:42,440
unique. 
But that also The thing is, is 

794
00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:46,760
that you have to be intentional 
about introducing a little bit 

795
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:51,600
of noise you because all of us, 
if we're doing exploration, 

796
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:53,840
exploration, whatever, because 
this is the thing that I've seen

797
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:57,840
with athletic throws. 
Athletic throws are basically 

798
00:46:57,840 --> 00:46:59,160
just jump throws. 
That's all they are. 

799
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:02,240
And you're like, there's not 
actually a lot of variability if

800
00:47:02,240 --> 00:47:03,600
all you're ever doing is just 
jumping. 

801
00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:06,160
It's literally the same thing 
the whole time. 

802
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:08,440
So it's really, is it really 
that athletic or are we just 

803
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:13,840
calling a jump throw an athletic
throw when really it's just one.

804
00:47:13,920 --> 00:47:16,360
There's not, there's not a whole
lot of exploration that's going 

805
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:21,000
on there. 
And so that's where we all fall 

806
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:25,880
into ruts essentially. 
Like our exploration can 

807
00:47:26,120 --> 00:47:30,720
actually become rote. 
And so you, that's where at some

808
00:47:30,720 --> 00:47:33,560
level you do have to be a little
bit intentional, but that's OK 

809
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:37,360
that you know, for for certain 
periods of time, like it's, it's

810
00:47:37,360 --> 00:47:40,240
a little, it's kind of familiar 
and comfortable. 

811
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:44,880
Your exploration. 
Like in the episode that we did 

812
00:47:44,880 --> 00:47:49,760
on transfer of training, we 
talked about repetition is the 

813
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:54,880
the ground or the soil in which 
spontaneity is birthed. 

814
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:59,280
And so understanding that too, 
like this, these attractor 

815
00:47:59,280 --> 00:48:05,160
states that we naturally find 
ourselves drifting towards when 

816
00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:13,960
we do exploration can sometimes 
spawn or or cause unique things 

817
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:16,560
to emerge, things that we've 
never done before. 

818
00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:19,040
So we have to understand like 
it's a both end and sometimes 

819
00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:21,760
you have to be intentional about
it, but other times it's simply 

820
00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:25,080
just going in there, doing your 
exploration and kind of flowing.

821
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:28,760
And then eventually something 
will naturally an affordance 

822
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:31,600
will naturally emerge from that.
And so I think that's OK. 

823
00:48:31,600 --> 00:48:33,800
Like, I think because this is 
the thing that I struggle with 

824
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:35,960
and the reason why I'm bringing 
this up and I'm kind of harping 

825
00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:39,800
on it is because so many of the 
people within the eco D space 

826
00:48:40,080 --> 00:48:42,920
talk about exploration as if I 
have to, I have to have to be 

827
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:46,400
super creative and come up with 
something novel every single 

828
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:47,760
time. 
And if I didn't come up with 

829
00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:51,640
something novel, it's it's a 
failure to adhere to the 

830
00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:53,600
principles and I'm doing 
something wrong. 

831
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:57,760
And when I come back to like 
what was ecological dynamics for

832
00:48:57,760 --> 00:49:00,760
me, it was freeing. 
And so for me, that causes a 

833
00:49:00,760 --> 00:49:02,800
level of stress. 
Thinking that I have to be 

834
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:07,440
unique and come up with 
something super novel adds a 

835
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,600
level of stress to this. 
And then that's why I think 

836
00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:14,960
people gravitate back towards a 
traditional approach and we'll. 

837
00:49:15,320 --> 00:49:17,080
We'll. 
We'll push away from an 

838
00:49:17,080 --> 00:49:19,800
ecological approach, whereas I 
don't think you need to go back 

839
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:25,320
to the traditional approach, but
rather understand how how these 

840
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:30,920
things work together to actually
allow for emergence, right? 

841
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:33,760
That like these ecological 
concepts and how all this stuff 

842
00:49:33,760 --> 00:49:37,280
plays together. 
Well, I think, I think that it's

843
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:40,040
easy to hear the word 
exploration and to think like 

844
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:43,600
really wide, like whatever you 
want. 

845
00:49:43,600 --> 00:49:47,920
And, and, and that can be 
actually very debilitating, 

846
00:49:48,200 --> 00:49:50,560
right? 
I'm, I'm sitting in trying to 

847
00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:53,520
pick my toothpaste and there's 
120 different types. 

848
00:49:53,520 --> 00:49:57,520
Like I'm, I'm more likely to 
make the wrong decision than I 

849
00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:01,720
am the right one, right? 
And so I'm just going to select 

850
00:50:01,720 --> 00:50:04,040
the one that I've always gone 
with or that my parents or that 

851
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:06,600
I grew up with, right? 
I'm just going to go with what's

852
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:11,120
easier because I face so much 
complexity and, and I've noticed

853
00:50:11,120 --> 00:50:13,280
that. 
So, So I think one thing that 

854
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:16,760
needs to be said there is that 
if if we're talking about I've 

855
00:50:16,760 --> 00:50:22,280
I've spoken about this like to a
lot of different people, like if

856
00:50:22,280 --> 00:50:25,760
we're talking about the 
traditional do the same thing 

857
00:50:25,760 --> 00:50:29,760
every day versus just a, you 
know, just Rob Gray said, like 

858
00:50:29,760 --> 00:50:31,600
variability is the lowest 
hanging fruit, right? 

859
00:50:31,600 --> 00:50:34,400
Just trying to do those things, 
but making them the them 

860
00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:37,880
variable, not really having any 
purpose to the variability, just

861
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:39,920
making it different. 
That's better for me. 

862
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:43,520
But to me, what's what's best is
purposeful variability, 

863
00:50:43,720 --> 00:50:47,960
variability that connects to who
that athlete actually is and 

864
00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:50,080
what they need in that day. 
And that's really hard. 

865
00:50:50,080 --> 00:50:52,960
And that's where you have to be 
connected as a coach to what's 

866
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:58,160
going on for them. 
And so I think I like, so when I

867
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:03,360
see my athletes, for example, 
playing catch and we are wanting

868
00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:06,640
them to play athletic catch 
play, exploratory catch, play 

869
00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:11,360
every single day. 
What I noticed early on is 

870
00:51:11,480 --> 00:51:18,280
because the options were so 
wide, they didn't really know 

871
00:51:18,280 --> 00:51:21,000
what to do. 
And so they would just do one 

872
00:51:21,000 --> 00:51:23,960
thing a few times and then they 
go back to what's normal. 

873
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:29,400
And so, so a couple times what I
did is I would, I would tell 

874
00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:32,800
every guy, hey, when you get 
your catch partner, bring them 

875
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:35,200
to me. 
You and your catch partner, I 

876
00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:37,800
have, you know, an activity for 
you today. 

877
00:51:38,960 --> 00:51:43,480
And in order to guide that 
exploration in a more meaningful

878
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:49,680
way, I said, hey, so Johnny is 
going to be the leader for the 

879
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:53,360
first 3 or 4 throws. 
He's going to do some type of 

880
00:51:53,360 --> 00:51:55,000
throw. 
I don't care what it is, 

881
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:56,880
whatever he wants. 
It can be a drill, athletic, 

882
00:51:56,880 --> 00:51:58,480
whatever he wants that he's ever
done. 

883
00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:03,520
Once he does that, Jimmy then 
has to copy it, but make it 

884
00:52:03,520 --> 00:52:05,680
unique in some way. 
And, and the only direction I, 

885
00:52:05,680 --> 00:52:09,360
I, I gave them, as I said, what 
I want is I want to see you 2 

886
00:52:09,360 --> 00:52:11,080
play catch for three times in a 
row. 

887
00:52:11,080 --> 00:52:14,640
And I want to go, gosh, those 
all look similar, but man, 

888
00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:16,320
they're just, they're just kind 
of different. 

889
00:52:16,720 --> 00:52:21,640
Once person A has finished their
three reps and the other 

890
00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:24,000
person's finished their three, 
now it goes to the other person.

891
00:52:24,520 --> 00:52:27,160
And now you're going to make a 
different throw and, and you're 

892
00:52:27,160 --> 00:52:28,560
going to kind of build off of 
his. 

893
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:31,720
And so I just want to continue 
for the whole catch all the way 

894
00:52:31,720 --> 00:52:33,960
out and all the way in. 
I just want you to use what 

895
00:52:33,960 --> 00:52:36,400
they're doing as your, as your 
guide. 

896
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:39,720
And then I, I just wanted to, I 
want you to explore within that 

897
00:52:40,600 --> 00:52:43,760
and not seem to help the guys 
because now all of a sudden 

898
00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:46,120
they, they didn't have to go, 
oh, I can just explore. 

899
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:48,320
It's like, Oh no, I'm just doing
what he does. 

900
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:50,080
I'm just doing it a little 
different. 

901
00:52:50,080 --> 00:52:52,760
Maybe I'll drop the arm angle or
go off a 1 foot or back pedal 

902
00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:55,400
and do the thing he did. 
And I saw a lot better 

903
00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:58,840
exploration in that. 
And so obviously we're talking 

904
00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:03,560
about command here, but I think 
that exploration we, we, we 

905
00:53:03,560 --> 00:53:07,080
believe is, is very helpful to 
becoming attuned and sensitive 

906
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:11,200
to different things going on. 
But I think also just those have

907
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:15,800
been small examples for me of 
how I've not even I can get 

908
00:53:15,800 --> 00:53:18,400
overwhelmed with variability 
exploration. 

909
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:22,040
How can I constrain that just a 
little bit so that they're 

910
00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:27,000
they're trying to do things 
within a bandwidth instead of 

911
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:29,960
feeling just totally 
overwhelmed, so to speak? 

912
00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:32,280
Yeah. 
And I have a couple of thoughts 

913
00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:39,040
on this one to to bring it back 
ecological for a second, what 

914
00:53:39,040 --> 00:53:41,560
you're describing there. 
And then this, this is, you 

915
00:53:41,560 --> 00:53:44,240
know, I hope to make it an 
episode in and of itself at some

916
00:53:44,240 --> 00:53:46,840
point. 
But this concept of constraining

917
00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:49,920
to afford, right, that's what 
you're doing there, right? 

918
00:53:50,120 --> 00:53:57,800
We're not, we're not in order to
get so we're we're, I'm looking 

919
00:53:57,800 --> 00:54:02,160
for novelty, right? 
To, to get novelty, you need to 

920
00:54:02,160 --> 00:54:07,440
properly constrain it to, to 
afford that novelty to appear. 

921
00:54:07,640 --> 00:54:11,200
And then also too, if you want 
it to be functional, you also 

922
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:14,840
need to constrain it such that 
it affords the possibility of 

923
00:54:14,840 --> 00:54:17,200
that. 
And it's not trying to force it 

924
00:54:17,600 --> 00:54:20,160
because I think that's where the
big mistake on the constraint 

925
00:54:20,160 --> 00:54:22,360
side of things is. 
People think like, oh, I need to

926
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:25,520
create the proper constraints to
force the outcome that I want, 

927
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:30,840
but rather it's about 
facilitating and allowing it to 

928
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:33,040
occur versus forcing it to 
occur. 

929
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:34,280
I think that's a big difference 
there. 

930
00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:36,440
And like this whole notion of 
constrained to a four. 

931
00:54:36,720 --> 00:54:39,000
And so when we start talking 
about freedom, it's this odd 

932
00:54:39,000 --> 00:54:43,360
dichotomy of like, in order to 
have true freedom, you actually 

933
00:54:43,360 --> 00:54:47,120
need to have the proper 
constraints that eliminate 

934
00:54:47,240 --> 00:54:50,600
possibilities. 
And that's, that's that goes, 

935
00:54:50,600 --> 00:54:53,440
that flies in the face of our 
modern understanding of freedom,

936
00:54:54,600 --> 00:54:57,720
because we think in order to be 
free and to explore and this and

937
00:54:57,720 --> 00:55:01,120
that, like that means that we 
should have the ability to do 

938
00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:02,880
whatever we want whenever we 
want. 

939
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:09,280
And that's not actually how 
we're getting our freedom and 

940
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:11,680
creating athletic flowy 
athletes. 

941
00:55:11,880 --> 00:55:14,600
It's, it's, it's very and that's
what I think makes it really 

942
00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:17,480
hard for a lot of people to 
understand in a grasp, we only 

943
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:24,240
understand freedom in the most 
libertarian sense or like 

944
00:55:24,680 --> 00:55:26,680
authoritarian control. 
Those are the 2. 

945
00:55:26,680 --> 00:55:29,600
Like it's like the two extremes.
And it's like actually as 

946
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:31,520
coaches, we're, we're looking 
for something that's a little 

947
00:55:31,520 --> 00:55:34,240
bit more in the middle. 
The other thing when it comes to

948
00:55:34,240 --> 00:55:36,960
your activity, like it sounded 
to me like you were describing 

949
00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:42,960
ad libbing. 
That's not what it's not exactly

950
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:46,160
the word that I was looking for.
What's it called when when you 

951
00:55:46,160 --> 00:55:49,520
when you go to the comedy club, 
what are they doing there? 

952
00:55:50,360 --> 00:55:53,920
It's called. 
But I had the word earlier is. 

953
00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:57,000
It like, is it like whose line 
is it anyway? 

954
00:55:57,000 --> 00:56:00,360
That type of thing where they're
they're giving them these. 

955
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:03,320
Yes, 'cause there's a, there's a
term for it because there's 

956
00:56:03,320 --> 00:56:05,080
guidance. 
Well, it's not even. 

957
00:56:05,200 --> 00:56:07,640
Yes, it it's. 
Or a topic or something. 

958
00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:09,040
Yeah, I said adlib already. 
What? 

959
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:12,840
What the heck is it? 
You know, if you go to what's it

960
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:15,040
called? 
They're like comedy clubs where 

961
00:56:15,040 --> 00:56:19,360
the where the people like they 
just just freestyle. 

962
00:56:20,240 --> 00:56:23,760
It is, I think it is ad Lib. 
But anyways, so anyways, so 

963
00:56:23,840 --> 00:56:27,080
you're you're the big thing in 
is when you're when you're doing

964
00:56:27,080 --> 00:56:30,160
these comedy sketches is you 
don't say no, right? 

965
00:56:30,160 --> 00:56:32,880
So when a person throws 
something out there, you, you 

966
00:56:32,880 --> 00:56:36,360
don't kind of shut it down or 
whatever, you take it and then 

967
00:56:36,360 --> 00:56:38,680
you, you kind of modify it a 
little bit, right? 

968
00:56:38,680 --> 00:56:42,640
And so like that to me is like 
those same principles is like, 

969
00:56:43,280 --> 00:56:50,280
you know, I was basically trying
to coin a coin a new term for 

970
00:56:50,720 --> 00:56:54,040
for for that activity and, and 
what not. 

971
00:56:54,480 --> 00:56:56,840
Yeah. 
Well, and not not make it a 

972
00:56:56,840 --> 00:56:58,720
drill. 
Yes, for sure. 

973
00:56:59,080 --> 00:57:04,080
What what from an ecological 
standpoint let's you know, 

974
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:09,960
'cause we've, we've talked about
the post and defining command 

975
00:57:09,960 --> 00:57:11,440
just a little bit. 
We've we've. 

976
00:57:11,520 --> 00:57:14,360
Yeah, we really do get a whole 
lot to on like how to develop 

977
00:57:14,360 --> 00:57:15,960
command. 
Now the question is, do we want 

978
00:57:15,960 --> 00:57:19,840
to do you want to dine into that
for the last, last bit here and 

979
00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:22,720
just yeah, just real. 
Quick like how would because for

980
00:57:22,720 --> 00:57:27,080
me, if we go all the way back to
the to the beginning, the the 

981
00:57:27,080 --> 00:57:30,400
question is and, and I think 
this is the best way to answer 

982
00:57:30,400 --> 00:57:33,040
it because there's probably a 
lot of good things out there 

983
00:57:33,040 --> 00:57:36,080
that people are saying regarding
how do you get better at 

984
00:57:36,080 --> 00:57:39,800
command. 
It feels like what would be best

985
00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:43,040
here is to say from an 
ecological standpoint, what 

986
00:57:43,040 --> 00:57:47,120
could we learn about how to best
influence guys having better 

987
00:57:47,120 --> 00:57:49,400
command? 
Well, from the very beginning, 

988
00:57:51,720 --> 00:57:55,280
people are are worse at the 
beginning of the year all the 

989
00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:57,840
time and they get better towards
the middle of the year. 

990
00:57:58,280 --> 00:58:05,720
So that seems to me to be 
screaming, representativeness, 

991
00:58:05,960 --> 00:58:11,960
screaming, trying to make your 
work that you're doing look, 

992
00:58:11,960 --> 00:58:14,560
feel and act more like the game.
I think that's the the lowest 

993
00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:20,400
hanging fruit that and the thing
I've always said is if your team

994
00:58:20,400 --> 00:58:24,640
gets better during the season 
and that's its main area of 

995
00:58:24,640 --> 00:58:27,240
growth, right? 
Like its main area of growth, 

996
00:58:27,520 --> 00:58:31,280
like you see them kind of 
stagnant during most of the rest

997
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:34,680
of the year except for when you 
scrimmage and and play, then 

998
00:58:34,680 --> 00:58:38,000
you're probably a terrible 
practice designer, right? 

999
00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:40,200
Because because your practices 
aren't helping people get 

1000
00:58:40,200 --> 00:58:41,920
better. 
And so I think the lowest 

1001
00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:44,400
hanging fruit for me from an 
ecological standpoint, how to 

1002
00:58:44,400 --> 00:58:47,720
improve command, get more 
batters in the box, try to make 

1003
00:58:47,720 --> 00:58:50,160
it a little bit more real. 
What is the information that's 

1004
00:58:50,160 --> 00:58:55,360
going to be that your pitchers 
are going to be connecting to in

1005
00:58:55,360 --> 00:58:58,640
the game and try to include 
that, even if it's just 

1006
00:58:58,640 --> 00:59:02,080
clarifying intentions of not 
just trying to throw a pitch to 

1007
00:59:02,080 --> 00:59:06,640
a location, but trying to throw 
a pitch in a way that a batter 

1008
00:59:06,680 --> 00:59:10,760
would interact with in a certain
way or having a batter there. 

1009
00:59:10,800 --> 00:59:14,760
You know, we've cut off bats 
and, you know, having catchers. 

1010
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:17,520
And it's it's not to say that 
throwing the targets is evil. 

1011
00:59:17,520 --> 00:59:19,360
We do it. 
It's not to say that some of 

1012
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:22,920
these other things that that you
can do are bad. 

1013
00:59:22,920 --> 00:59:24,520
But I think that's the lowest 
hanging fruit for me that I 

1014
00:59:24,520 --> 00:59:27,960
would say right away is like, 
how can we make what we're doing

1015
00:59:28,040 --> 00:59:30,640
as pitchers more representative 
so that we're training in those 

1016
00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:34,240
environments so we can see 
transfer instead of, oh, I'm 

1017
00:59:34,240 --> 00:59:36,160
just getting better 'cause I'm 
pitching in more games now. 

1018
00:59:37,320 --> 00:59:40,320
And I think that's the you have 
to ask the question of like, OK,

1019
00:59:40,320 --> 00:59:44,800
are we developing pitchers or 
are we just simply allowing the 

1020
00:59:44,800 --> 00:59:49,720
game to develop them for us? 
And even too, when you do that, 

1021
00:59:51,360 --> 00:59:57,280
they don't always like, yeah, 
maybe they get better, maybe the

1022
00:59:57,320 --> 00:59:59,520
game. 
Isn't always the best teacher 

1023
00:59:59,520 --> 01:00:01,520
right 'cause the game? 
It's not that fast, right? 

1024
01:00:01,520 --> 01:00:04,840
So like, obviously if you play 
the game a lot or you're gonna 

1025
01:00:04,840 --> 01:00:09,640
get better, but again, it comes 
back to, you know, intention and

1026
01:00:09,640 --> 01:00:12,040
attention. 
And I think this is kind of the 

1027
01:00:12,040 --> 01:00:14,160
thing too. 
Like I don't think this is where

1028
01:00:14,160 --> 01:00:17,280
I think, again, coming back to 
principles. 

1029
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:20,080
All right. 
So from an ecological 

1030
01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:23,800
perspective, I think the base is
looking at it from a constraint 

1031
01:00:23,800 --> 01:00:25,840
and constraint LED approach, 
right. 

1032
01:00:25,840 --> 01:00:30,920
So understanding you know, the 
the Organism, you know and the 

1033
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:34,400
the task and the environment and
how all those are interacting. 

1034
01:00:34,800 --> 01:00:39,040
And so when you, when you come 
back to that as your foundation 

1035
01:00:39,280 --> 01:00:42,040
and trying to look at it through
that lens and perspective, and 

1036
01:00:42,040 --> 01:00:46,680
also trying to put yourself in, 
in the problem, like embed 

1037
01:00:46,680 --> 01:00:49,560
yourself within the problem, you
know, one, from the athletes 

1038
01:00:49,560 --> 01:00:52,160
perspective, and then two, just 
from the problems perspective, 

1039
01:00:52,160 --> 01:00:54,120
like what is going on within the
problem? 

1040
01:00:54,360 --> 01:00:56,880
Because, OK, it's one thing to 
put yourself in the athlete's 

1041
01:00:56,880 --> 01:00:59,600
shoes, but then, OK, you're 
still missing something because 

1042
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:01,600
sometimes, often the athlete is 
missing something. 

1043
01:01:01,600 --> 01:01:04,920
So you have to be able as the 
coach to be able to understand, 

1044
01:01:05,160 --> 01:01:06,440
OK, what is it that they're 
missing? 

1045
01:01:06,800 --> 01:01:11,000
So for me specifically, you 
know, we had, we had talked 

1046
01:01:11,000 --> 01:01:12,880
about this before and to kind of
loop this back in. 

1047
01:01:13,840 --> 01:01:19,600
I think where we can help 
athletes is on the mental side 

1048
01:01:19,840 --> 01:01:24,120
because I think that plays in 
has a huge, massive impact in 

1049
01:01:24,120 --> 01:01:32,680
how the motor system organizes 
itself to execute a pitch and 

1050
01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:38,360
how and it's going to affect how
they are connecting with the the

1051
01:01:38,360 --> 01:01:41,680
task and the, and the pitch that
they're trying to execute. 

1052
01:01:42,040 --> 01:01:46,280
So for me, that's where like 
often times when I look at a lot

1053
01:01:46,280 --> 01:01:50,000
of pictures, when they're 
struggling, often times there's 

1054
01:01:50,000 --> 01:01:53,200
a lot going on up here. 
Like self what? 

1055
01:01:53,200 --> 01:01:56,080
Would you do because because 
again, from an ecological 

1056
01:01:56,080 --> 01:01:59,840
standpoint, like most people are
going to tell you, go read to 

1057
01:01:59,840 --> 01:02:03,720
this, go listen to this mindset 
podcast, go read the mental 

1058
01:02:03,720 --> 01:02:05,680
ABC's. 
Not that those things are wrong,

1059
01:02:05,800 --> 01:02:08,440
you know, not those things, you 
know, like becoming more aware. 

1060
01:02:08,440 --> 01:02:11,800
It absolutely I can have a part 
in it, but it's it's 

1061
01:02:11,800 --> 01:02:13,480
decontextualized from the 
environment. 

1062
01:02:13,480 --> 01:02:15,600
You're not actually practicing 
any of those skills and 

1063
01:02:15,600 --> 01:02:17,960
contests. 
So, So what would you do to help

1064
01:02:17,960 --> 01:02:21,320
somebody with the mental side 
that is in context? 

1065
01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:26,040
So I'm going to because my 
intention right here is to help.

1066
01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:29,800
I, I want us to think 
ecologically. 

1067
01:02:30,160 --> 01:02:31,400
So it's about the principle, 
right? 

1068
01:02:31,400 --> 01:02:34,080
So let's take, let's take the 
idea of using a book. 

1069
01:02:34,080 --> 01:02:40,280
The book becomes a constraint in
some ways or a an affordance, 

1070
01:02:40,280 --> 01:02:41,560
right? 
So it's it's constrained to 

1071
01:02:41,560 --> 01:02:43,360
afford. 
It is a constraint that we can 

1072
01:02:43,360 --> 01:02:46,400
use to afford a conversation, 
right? 

1073
01:02:46,400 --> 01:02:49,280
Like it becomes a platform by 
which we can use to create a 

1074
01:02:49,280 --> 01:02:51,800
conversation and some language 
around it. 

1075
01:02:52,280 --> 01:02:54,360
But some of it just comes back 
to having a conversation with 

1076
01:02:54,360 --> 01:02:57,960
the athlete, right? 
So like the way that I begin to 

1077
01:02:57,960 --> 01:02:59,880
think about it as simply of 
like, OK, what's the problem I'm

1078
01:02:59,880 --> 01:03:02,520
trying to solve, right? 
Like I took this from Brian 

1079
01:03:02,520 --> 01:03:04,520
Kane, right? 
When what's important right now,

1080
01:03:04,960 --> 01:03:06,520
right? 
And it comes back to, OK, what's

1081
01:03:06,520 --> 01:03:07,960
our goal? 
What is it that we're trying to 

1082
01:03:07,960 --> 01:03:10,240
execute on? 
And so it becomes the question 

1083
01:03:10,240 --> 01:03:13,400
of like, OK, from the mental 
side of it, where's your focus 

1084
01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:16,720
mentally? 
Is it on how I'm going to make 

1085
01:03:16,720 --> 01:03:19,360
an adjustment here? 
Do I have belief in the 

1086
01:03:19,360 --> 01:03:21,160
execution? 
Am I fully present, fully 

1087
01:03:21,160 --> 01:03:23,880
focused here? 
And then I work everything 

1088
01:03:23,880 --> 01:03:26,200
towards that end, which is 
again, self organization. 

1089
01:03:26,200 --> 01:03:29,040
It's, it's alive, it's adaptive.
I'm having to connect with the 

1090
01:03:29,040 --> 01:03:32,800
athlete and connect and try to 
sometimes too, right? 

1091
01:03:32,800 --> 01:03:36,600
Like, you know, for for people 
in like just relationships, you 

1092
01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:40,640
know, with spouses, you know, 
loved ones, etcetera, right. 

1093
01:03:40,640 --> 01:03:42,240
If you want to have a good 
relationship, sometimes it's 

1094
01:03:42,240 --> 01:03:45,160
simply realizing like, oh, the 
problem is emotional. 

1095
01:03:45,520 --> 01:03:47,760
It's not logical. 
Like I need to get to the 

1096
01:03:47,760 --> 01:03:51,840
emotional root of this issue and
like hear an athlete out on 

1097
01:03:51,840 --> 01:03:53,280
like, OK, what is this and 
whatever. 

1098
01:03:53,280 --> 01:03:56,680
And then like directly speak to 
that and then slowly work 

1099
01:03:56,680 --> 01:03:58,800
through it with them. 
And sometimes, like, you know 

1100
01:03:58,800 --> 01:04:01,360
what the nice thing too that I 
found just in working with 

1101
01:04:01,360 --> 01:04:05,880
athletes in my situation is like
I'm an authority figure because 

1102
01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:08,440
of the fact I also have the 
constraint of like playing time,

1103
01:04:09,000 --> 01:04:11,600
right? 
So like, it's not like, you 

1104
01:04:11,600 --> 01:04:14,440
know, Joe Schmo that I'm talking
to on the street or whatever, 

1105
01:04:14,440 --> 01:04:18,600
like this, you know, yes, it's a
voluntary interaction, but at 

1106
01:04:18,600 --> 01:04:21,640
the same point, like I have a 
lot more to to pull on, you 

1107
01:04:21,640 --> 01:04:25,320
know, and so I can kind of 
reiterate some things and like 

1108
01:04:25,720 --> 01:04:28,120
lay it out in such a way to 
understand like, OK, if your 

1109
01:04:28,120 --> 01:04:30,960
goal is you want to play more 
like you really got to face this

1110
01:04:30,960 --> 01:04:34,600
down, I can understand. 
Like I think that becomes then 

1111
01:04:34,600 --> 01:04:36,440
you then you can develop 
strategies around that. 

1112
01:04:36,440 --> 01:04:39,400
And sometimes sometimes, like 
good coaches know, like actually

1113
01:04:39,640 --> 01:04:41,920
you need to go far away from 
that. 

1114
01:04:42,440 --> 01:04:44,000
You know, we need to not touch 
that at all. 

1115
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:46,240
And we need to just like 
distract you over here, right? 

1116
01:04:46,240 --> 01:04:49,800
And so like, but that's, that's 
the thing of where I actually 

1117
01:04:49,800 --> 01:04:54,520
think we neglect that and we 
just go to a mechanical thing of

1118
01:04:54,520 --> 01:04:57,000
like, oh, just get your arm up 
or just like your chin or 

1119
01:04:57,000 --> 01:04:58,440
wherever it is your, you know, 
eyes. 

1120
01:04:58,480 --> 01:05:01,000
Yeah, all these things are true 
and they're like they're a piece

1121
01:05:01,000 --> 01:05:06,160
and a component. 
But I think the the system will 

1122
01:05:06,160 --> 01:05:09,640
self organize often times. 
And then when you want to go to 

1123
01:05:09,640 --> 01:05:12,640
those mechanical things, they're
going to work so much better 

1124
01:05:13,000 --> 01:05:18,520
when the person is more 
connected and is in a better 

1125
01:05:18,520 --> 01:05:22,920
headspace to fully connect with 
the, with the environment and 

1126
01:05:22,920 --> 01:05:24,960
they're going to be better able 
to interact with the problem. 

1127
01:05:24,960 --> 01:05:29,280
And so like that, I guess is for
me where often times I want to 

1128
01:05:29,280 --> 01:05:31,880
start with is just having a 
conversation with the athlete 

1129
01:05:31,880 --> 01:05:35,280
and get a feel for it. 
Like sometimes, you know, you 

1130
01:05:35,400 --> 01:05:38,320
you can simply ask because I, I 
don't know, everybody's 

1131
01:05:38,320 --> 01:05:42,440
different and feel free to 
interrupt me here, but everybody

1132
01:05:42,440 --> 01:05:46,160
is different in the sense that 
like, I don't want to, you know,

1133
01:05:46,480 --> 01:05:50,520
this one time I was I was at a 
tryout and the coach goes, are 

1134
01:05:50,520 --> 01:05:52,080
you nervous? 
I hadn't even thought about it. 

1135
01:05:52,080 --> 01:05:53,880
And I was like, oh, I guess I 
should be nervous. 

1136
01:05:54,000 --> 01:05:55,560
I wasn't nervous. 
I was like, oh, I get yeah, 

1137
01:05:55,560 --> 01:05:57,800
yeah, I'm nervous. 
And I totally cratered the whole

1138
01:05:57,800 --> 01:05:59,040
thing. 
I was just like, when I look 

1139
01:05:59,040 --> 01:06:03,520
back on that, it's like that, 
dude, what'd you just do there? 

1140
01:06:03,560 --> 01:06:06,320
Like you're supposed to be 
helping me, but instead you just

1141
01:06:06,360 --> 01:06:08,760
basically like cratered it. 
So I think there's you. 

1142
01:06:08,760 --> 01:06:12,440
We got to be careful. 
You know, sometimes when we, we,

1143
01:06:12,520 --> 01:06:15,280
we basically say some things 
sometimes, like there's a time 

1144
01:06:15,280 --> 01:06:17,520
and a place to be like somebody 
asked like you OK. 

1145
01:06:17,520 --> 01:06:19,120
And you're like, yeah, I'm 
totally fine. 

1146
01:06:19,120 --> 01:06:22,800
I was like, yeah, but you, you 
kind of seem nervous, you know? 

1147
01:06:22,800 --> 01:06:25,560
And like, so there, I think 
there's there's you can still 

1148
01:06:25,560 --> 01:06:28,800
have that, but you have to, I 
wouldn't lead with it, you know,

1149
01:06:28,800 --> 01:06:31,160
so to speak. 
And I'd more try to search out 

1150
01:06:31,160 --> 01:06:33,680
like, what is it? 
Let the like lead, have the 

1151
01:06:33,680 --> 01:06:36,680
athlete lead that conversation, 
especially when you're dealing 

1152
01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:40,000
with stuff like that. 
But yeah, so anyways. 

1153
01:06:40,520 --> 01:06:46,960
I I would jump in and say the 
thing that I've had a success 

1154
01:06:46,960 --> 01:06:51,200
with a modicum level of success 
and want to continue to expand 

1155
01:06:51,200 --> 01:06:56,200
and explore. 
I, I'm a sucker for, for 

1156
01:06:56,320 --> 01:07:03,240
categories, not necessarily, you
know, because I'm very plan 

1157
01:07:03,240 --> 01:07:05,920
oriented, but because I think 
sometimes just like the catch 

1158
01:07:05,920 --> 01:07:10,000
activity that I designed, it 
helps guys kind of explore that 

1159
01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:13,960
space and then sort of move on 
and explore another space and 

1160
01:07:13,960 --> 01:07:16,120
another. 
So one thing that I've done with

1161
01:07:16,120 --> 01:07:20,760
a handful of guys, both at the 
high school and and now here at 

1162
01:07:20,760 --> 01:07:23,320
the college level is trend. 
Athletics has like a mental 

1163
01:07:23,320 --> 01:07:28,560
course and and I think it like 
it just screams attention and 

1164
01:07:28,560 --> 01:07:31,760
intention, though they don't use
those language, that language, 

1165
01:07:32,440 --> 01:07:36,000
but what they do within it is 
they have this really cool part 

1166
01:07:36,000 --> 01:07:43,680
where they talk about they give 
you these two opposites that you

1167
01:07:43,680 --> 01:07:47,520
might exist on a continuum. 
And so it would be things like 

1168
01:07:47,520 --> 01:07:49,680
are you loose or are you 
aggressive? 

1169
01:07:49,800 --> 01:07:53,200
You know, and some of them 
relate to how you interact 

1170
01:07:53,200 --> 01:07:55,840
physically on the mound. 
Some of them relate to how they 

1171
01:07:55,840 --> 01:07:57,840
would, they would say, you know,
mentally on the mound or 

1172
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:00,600
psychologically or 
physiologically. 

1173
01:08:00,800 --> 01:08:05,000
What's your preparation phase 
like prior? 

1174
01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:10,560
Are you a guy who's more fun and
engaged with the game? 

1175
01:08:10,560 --> 01:08:12,520
Are you guy who's just leave me 
alone in the dugout? 

1176
01:08:12,760 --> 01:08:16,279
So I think they do all of they 
they do a good job of explaining

1177
01:08:16,279 --> 01:08:20,720
all these different things. 
And so my initial track with our

1178
01:08:20,720 --> 01:08:23,920
guys is just to go, Hey, where 
do you think you fall on this 

1179
01:08:23,920 --> 01:08:25,800
continuum? 
We start to identify those 

1180
01:08:25,800 --> 01:08:29,640
things, and then we start to try
to direct their intention and 

1181
01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:34,560
attention to how they often most
optimally perform. 

1182
01:08:34,560 --> 01:08:36,920
But the thing that, like, 
secretly I've never told them is

1183
01:08:36,920 --> 01:08:39,080
I actually don't want them to 
stay there. 

1184
01:08:39,319 --> 01:08:43,640
What I'd like is I'd like for 
them to learn to go, Hey, 

1185
01:08:43,640 --> 01:08:46,200
generally speaking, yeah. 
Where do I fall? 

1186
01:08:46,200 --> 01:08:50,880
And yet today, having that more 
aggressive mindset isn't 

1187
01:08:50,880 --> 01:08:53,319
working. 
And so can I explore being a 

1188
01:08:53,319 --> 01:08:58,000
little bit more loose and fluid 
and free and then can we start 

1189
01:08:58,000 --> 01:09:03,760
to train that down the road? 
Can I have a day where yes, I 

1190
01:09:03,760 --> 01:09:06,840
need my very strict regimen most
of the time to get ready. 

1191
01:09:06,840 --> 01:09:08,760
I got my 2 hour warm up before 
I'm a starter. 

1192
01:09:09,160 --> 01:09:12,240
What happens when that changes? 
What happens when we have a rain

1193
01:09:12,240 --> 01:09:15,920
delay or something happens that 
just the bus is late or, or 

1194
01:09:16,040 --> 01:09:18,680
we're going to play at the 
stadium that doesn't have the 

1195
01:09:18,680 --> 01:09:20,720
space. 
You know, we play at your 

1196
01:09:20,720 --> 01:09:22,960
conference tournament at a, at a
place, it's like, hey, you can't

1197
01:09:22,960 --> 01:09:25,040
be on the field until this time.
And it's really pretty grassy. 

1198
01:09:25,040 --> 01:09:26,680
You can't do these things. 
You got to be over in this 

1199
01:09:26,680 --> 01:09:27,880
locker room and there's less 
space. 

1200
01:09:27,880 --> 01:09:31,520
It's like, OK, so like can we 
train that as well to be more 

1201
01:09:31,520 --> 01:09:35,279
adaptable? 
So I really appreciate starting 

1202
01:09:35,279 --> 01:09:38,880
points for our guys with, you 
know, mental stuff like that to 

1203
01:09:38,880 --> 01:09:40,520
go. 
Where do you feel like you 

1204
01:09:40,520 --> 01:09:43,880
operate where? 
And that often really empowers 

1205
01:09:43,880 --> 01:09:46,880
the athlete to go, yeah, this is
more of who I am. 

1206
01:09:47,319 --> 01:09:51,000
And then once they figure out 
more of who they are, we can 

1207
01:09:51,000 --> 01:09:56,800
start working on getting being 
more adaptable around those. 

1208
01:09:57,240 --> 01:09:59,520
Whereas if I flipped it and I 
said, well, I just want you to 

1209
01:09:59,520 --> 01:10:01,080
be adaptable. 
You don't need a routine. 

1210
01:10:01,080 --> 01:10:06,200
It's like, well, we've got 
enough research that people 

1211
01:10:06,200 --> 01:10:10,000
really like routines, you know? 
And so, so that that's how I'm 

1212
01:10:10,000 --> 01:10:11,720
going to treat that. 
Like I said before, they're a 

1213
01:10:11,720 --> 01:10:13,400
constraint that affords other 
things. 

1214
01:10:13,880 --> 01:10:17,680
You know, like it how you know, 
we haven't talked about 

1215
01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:20,200
attractor states, but you know, 
essentially that creates an 

1216
01:10:20,200 --> 01:10:24,160
attractor state. 
How do you get into the zone? 

1217
01:10:24,720 --> 01:10:28,160
You need a routine because 
you're so different every single

1218
01:10:28,520 --> 01:10:33,760
like you may come from like, 
it's the thing because I asked 

1219
01:10:33,760 --> 01:10:36,200
actually, and this I was just 
getting into ecological dynamics

1220
01:10:36,200 --> 01:10:42,120
and I was with a lifting coach 
who like had guys that Olympic 

1221
01:10:42,120 --> 01:10:44,800
lifting, you know, gone to 
competitions and done really 

1222
01:10:44,800 --> 01:10:46,400
well. 
And I don't know all the levels.

1223
01:10:46,480 --> 01:10:49,080
I don't think it was necessarily
for the Olympics, but you know, 

1224
01:10:49,080 --> 01:10:52,600
all the like the high level 
competitions that you know, are 

1225
01:10:52,600 --> 01:10:55,760
maybe not Olympic level, but are
like, you know, that happened 

1226
01:10:55,760 --> 01:10:58,480
around the Olympics or whatever.
Maybe they they work into that. 

1227
01:10:58,480 --> 01:11:01,480
But anyways, he had trained a 
lot of like high level Olympic 

1228
01:11:01,480 --> 01:11:03,400
lifters and I was just like, 
there's not a lot of your 

1229
01:11:03,400 --> 01:11:06,320
ability here, right? 
All you do is clean and, you 

1230
01:11:06,320 --> 01:11:11,400
know, front squat, you know, 
like do all these like really 

1231
01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:15,080
basic repetitive exercises. 
But yet we know because I, you 

1232
01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:18,160
know, we even with Tyler, you 
know, I've talked with Tyler 

1233
01:11:18,160 --> 01:11:20,520
about this, you know, like, you 
know, because he's competed in 

1234
01:11:20,520 --> 01:11:23,240
some of these these events. 
It's like, yeah, the guys that 

1235
01:11:23,240 --> 01:11:26,120
trained in front of a mirror the
whole entire time, like you 

1236
01:11:26,120 --> 01:11:28,520
could tell when they got to the 
competition because they'd start

1237
01:11:28,520 --> 01:11:30,080
to wobble and all this sort of 
stuff because now that 

1238
01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:34,160
information isn't there. 
And like, you know, when I did a

1239
01:11:34,160 --> 01:11:38,400
little bit of martial arts, my 
dad was has been involved in 

1240
01:11:38,400 --> 01:11:39,800
that. 
And he was talking about, OK, 

1241
01:11:39,960 --> 01:11:43,520
when we train and you're doing, 
you know, preparing for to do 

1242
01:11:43,520 --> 01:11:48,880
Qatar, you need to not always 
face the same direction because 

1243
01:11:48,880 --> 01:11:51,840
when you get there, you might 
not be facing the same 

1244
01:11:51,840 --> 01:11:53,560
direction. 
So I was, I basically, it was 

1245
01:11:53,560 --> 01:11:56,840
asking this, this high level 
coach who was like, how do you 

1246
01:11:56,840 --> 01:11:59,280
deal with those facts? 
Do you do you implement that, 

1247
01:11:59,360 --> 01:12:01,440
that in training? 
Because I basically like 

1248
01:12:01,440 --> 01:12:02,680
watching their training 
sessions. 

1249
01:12:02,680 --> 01:12:04,720
Like doesn't look like they do 
any of that at all. 

1250
01:12:04,960 --> 01:12:07,640
It's like, no, we just basically
have a routine. 

1251
01:12:08,000 --> 01:12:12,000
We use a routine to basically 
nullify a lot of those effects. 

1252
01:12:12,320 --> 01:12:16,360
I was like, oh, so that, that 
for me, like got me to think 

1253
01:12:16,360 --> 01:12:19,680
more like, it changed my 
understanding of like routines 

1254
01:12:19,840 --> 01:12:23,760
and how a routine can actually 
make you more adaptable, which 

1255
01:12:23,760 --> 01:12:27,920
is kind of like it's, it's, it's
kind of counterintuitive and 

1256
01:12:27,920 --> 01:12:30,440
it's a, it's a both end, right? 
If your routine is too complex 

1257
01:12:30,920 --> 01:12:33,840
and it's not, it doesn't 
transfer well to different 

1258
01:12:34,080 --> 01:12:36,560
environments, then it's probably
not a good routine. 

1259
01:12:36,840 --> 01:12:40,200
But if you've got a routine that
can go with you across different

1260
01:12:40,440 --> 01:12:42,120
environments, you got a really 
good routine. 

1261
01:12:42,920 --> 01:12:47,760
And so and that's, that's where 
I, I see like some levels of 

1262
01:12:47,760 --> 01:12:49,680
transfer and like what you 
actually are trying to develop. 

1263
01:12:49,680 --> 01:12:52,560
And when when like, you know, I 
I'll listen to like MLB Network 

1264
01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:55,240
and I'm just my head, I'll just 
like want to shout at the screen

1265
01:12:55,240 --> 01:12:57,400
when everybody every single time
looks like, yeah, you need to 

1266
01:12:57,400 --> 01:12:59,240
have a routine and you need to 
develop your process. 

1267
01:12:59,240 --> 01:13:02,880
It was just like, man, that's 
just making guys so rigid. 

1268
01:13:03,360 --> 01:13:05,680
But they're the right too. 
Like that's the other thing that

1269
01:13:05,680 --> 01:13:08,600
I think is like really, really 
kind of interesting to me is 

1270
01:13:08,600 --> 01:13:13,640
like, it's, I feel like they're 
wrong and right all at the same 

1271
01:13:13,640 --> 01:13:16,240
time. 
And so that's where I, I think 

1272
01:13:16,240 --> 01:13:20,200
it is about for, for those guys 
at that level is like finding 

1273
01:13:20,200 --> 01:13:24,280
the right routine that's not too
complex, but that cuts through 

1274
01:13:24,280 --> 01:13:28,280
all the variability that gets 
you locked in, you know, that 

1275
01:13:28,280 --> 01:13:33,280
gets you into that, that state. 
And so I find that to be really 

1276
01:13:33,280 --> 01:13:35,480
fascinating and something that 
needs to be developed more. 

1277
01:13:36,720 --> 01:13:39,280
There's something there that 
you're acknowledging in terms 

1278
01:13:39,280 --> 01:13:42,480
of. 
It's ecological too though, like

1279
01:13:42,480 --> 01:13:43,600
that's. 
The thing it's like, well, I'm 

1280
01:13:43,640 --> 01:13:52,600
just just some part of it. 
That's players who seem to have 

1281
01:13:52,600 --> 01:13:56,760
that mental fortitude are often 
guys who have really trusted the

1282
01:13:56,760 --> 01:13:59,800
process and, and their 
confidence and their trusting 

1283
01:13:59,800 --> 01:14:01,520
themselves who's like, yeah, 
I've done the work. 

1284
01:14:01,520 --> 01:14:05,080
And and so there's certainly a 
part of that even again, trying 

1285
01:14:05,080 --> 01:14:09,120
to land this plane on how do we 
help command? 

1286
01:14:09,360 --> 01:14:13,240
I do think absolutely routines 
help because they can help focus

1287
01:14:13,240 --> 01:14:17,840
you in on on those things. 
Of course, not too rigid, having

1288
01:14:17,840 --> 01:14:20,440
some variability. 
I think, you know, like we said,

1289
01:14:20,440 --> 01:14:24,560
representativeness is important 
mental side, the attention 

1290
01:14:24,560 --> 01:14:26,800
intentions important, you know, 
routines. 

1291
01:14:27,280 --> 01:14:30,480
Is there anything else that you 
would throw out there that you 

1292
01:14:30,480 --> 01:14:34,040
think would be useful from a 
command side as we wrap up? 

1293
01:14:34,760 --> 01:14:37,120
Yeah, I wanted to at least touch
on, and I think I brought up 

1294
01:14:37,120 --> 01:14:40,640
before like Driveline, you know,
their shift towards developing 

1295
01:14:40,640 --> 01:14:46,360
command and they, I think we're 
always kind of near the 

1296
01:14:46,360 --> 01:14:49,640
forefront of trying to apply 
ecological principles, whether 

1297
01:14:50,360 --> 01:14:53,440
they always, you know, fully 
executed on it. 

1298
01:14:53,440 --> 01:14:55,280
There's some base that they've 
always had. 

1299
01:14:55,560 --> 01:14:58,240
And I think some of it even came
from Paul Nyman, from my 

1300
01:14:58,240 --> 01:15:01,600
understanding of, of, of 
listening to Paul Nyman talk and

1301
01:15:01,600 --> 01:15:05,280
even Kyle, I, I think 
acknowledging that they got the 

1302
01:15:05,280 --> 01:15:09,040
whole notion of intention from, 
from Paul. 

1303
01:15:09,600 --> 01:15:13,080
And So what you're seeing with 
like the, the command tracking, 

1304
01:15:13,280 --> 01:15:15,400
right, is you're shifting, 
you're, you're focusing the 

1305
01:15:15,400 --> 01:15:19,000
attention, right? 
So instead of the, the attention

1306
01:15:19,000 --> 01:15:25,160
being on velocity or how much my
pitch is moving now, the focus 

1307
01:15:25,160 --> 01:15:29,720
of attention is now on, OK, 
where am I throwing the ball? 

1308
01:15:29,760 --> 01:15:32,720
And, and so it's, it's shifting 
that it, so it's shifting the 

1309
01:15:32,720 --> 01:15:36,480
attention and intention, right. 
And so now the intent is to 

1310
01:15:36,640 --> 01:15:39,240
throw the ball to where you, to 
the location that you want to. 

1311
01:15:39,560 --> 01:15:41,040
And so it's changing the search 
base. 

1312
01:15:41,280 --> 01:15:44,400
You know, they're searching in a
different location for like a, 

1313
01:15:44,400 --> 01:15:47,360
a, for, for a, a new motor 
solution. 

1314
01:15:47,360 --> 01:15:51,640
And so I think that's what 
tracking like if we do, if we 

1315
01:15:51,640 --> 01:15:54,120
use tracking correctly, it helps
us. 

1316
01:15:55,200 --> 01:16:00,360
It, it, it, it, it educates our 
attention and then it also 

1317
01:16:00,360 --> 01:16:04,600
shapes our intention. 
And so, you know, I don't mind 

1318
01:16:04,600 --> 01:16:07,640
tracking, but I do think 
sometimes, right, like we've 

1319
01:16:07,640 --> 01:16:12,440
talked about the good hearts 
law, when the target becomes a 

1320
01:16:12,440 --> 01:16:16,880
measure, you know, like it, 
it's, it ceases to be a good a 

1321
01:16:17,120 --> 01:16:20,240
good measure. 
So like, I think that's, that's 

1322
01:16:20,240 --> 01:16:22,680
where we got to be careful. 
But if we start, this is where 

1323
01:16:22,680 --> 01:16:26,360
for me, like if we start 
understanding more like we go a 

1324
01:16:26,360 --> 01:16:28,400
layer deeper. 
And that's what I think 

1325
01:16:28,680 --> 01:16:32,880
ecological dynamics allows us to
do is to go a layer deeper and, 

1326
01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:36,640
and start to understand how 
these things interact so that we

1327
01:16:36,640 --> 01:16:43,640
can actually fully utilize these
tools and these concepts towards

1328
01:16:43,640 --> 01:16:46,440
our end goal of better player 
performance. 

1329
01:16:47,640 --> 01:16:51,200
And so now I also want to touch 
on a little bit too on the 

1330
01:16:51,280 --> 01:16:54,840
attunement piece and the 
calibration piece, right? 

1331
01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:57,560
So there's been some interesting
things, right? 

1332
01:16:57,560 --> 01:17:00,080
Like so we have the command 
balls, right? 

1333
01:17:00,080 --> 01:17:04,800
Like, so now we, we manipulate 
the, the equipment a little bit 

1334
01:17:04,800 --> 01:17:08,280
and why, right? 
It's to help explore because 

1335
01:17:08,280 --> 01:17:10,880
again, going back to the, the 
idea of overfitting, right? 

1336
01:17:10,880 --> 01:17:14,600
If we always using the same 
implement, you know, a baseball 

1337
01:17:14,640 --> 01:17:19,480
and the same type of ball, some 
guys may not have much feel 

1338
01:17:19,600 --> 01:17:24,200
because again, like you don't 
notice the, your clothing or you

1339
01:17:24,200 --> 01:17:26,440
don't notice your nose. 
Your nose is always in your 

1340
01:17:26,440 --> 01:17:28,280
field of view, but you don't 
notice it because it's always 

1341
01:17:28,280 --> 01:17:30,160
there, right? 
So it's kind of this thing of 

1342
01:17:30,160 --> 01:17:32,600
like part of the reason why I 
think some guys don't have feel.

1343
01:17:32,600 --> 01:17:36,440
And this goes back to why 
exploration is important is it 

1344
01:17:36,440 --> 01:17:40,840
allows the system to to pick up 
more information because now 

1345
01:17:40,840 --> 01:17:44,280
things are changing enough that 
we can begin to discern, right? 

1346
01:17:44,280 --> 01:17:46,840
So like the signal through the 
noise, the reason you need the 

1347
01:17:46,840 --> 01:17:48,320
noise is so you can pick up the 
signal. 

1348
01:17:48,960 --> 01:17:53,440
So that's where you know, using 
variable balls doesn't have to 

1349
01:17:53,440 --> 01:17:55,720
be a specific type of command 
ball. 

1350
01:17:55,960 --> 01:17:58,800
Like we've talked about this, 
you know, using utilizing 

1351
01:17:58,800 --> 01:18:00,800
different brands of baseballs, 
right? 

1352
01:18:00,800 --> 01:18:03,720
Like the difference like this is
house how attuned professional 

1353
01:18:03,720 --> 01:18:06,680
baseball players are, such as 
Justin Verlander, right? 

1354
01:18:06,680 --> 01:18:10,400
Verlander can tell the 
difference between a Major 

1355
01:18:10,400 --> 01:18:11,560
League ball and a minor league 
ball. 

1356
01:18:11,560 --> 01:18:14,160
And he could probably also tell 
the difference between, you 

1357
01:18:14,160 --> 01:18:17,600
know, the the the balls that are
juiced and the balls that are 

1358
01:18:17,600 --> 01:18:20,040
not right. 
Like that's how a tune those 

1359
01:18:20,040 --> 01:18:23,640
guys are. 
And so in talking with, when I 

1360
01:18:23,640 --> 01:18:27,000
was at Missouri State and 
talking with Jeremy Colonna, who

1361
01:18:27,000 --> 01:18:31,800
had, who had gotten, who had 
used the command balls with his 

1362
01:18:31,800 --> 01:18:37,040
athletes at Avalo, he noticed 
that his guys that were that had

1363
01:18:37,040 --> 01:18:39,520
really good command, the command
balls kind of messed them up. 

1364
01:18:39,840 --> 01:18:43,120
And the guys that didn't have 
good command, it actually helped

1365
01:18:43,120 --> 01:18:44,800
them. 
And So what he helped me 

1366
01:18:44,800 --> 01:18:47,680
understand is that or what I 
gleaned from it from an 

1367
01:18:47,680 --> 01:18:50,840
ecological perspective, is that 
the guys who are, who have 

1368
01:18:50,840 --> 01:18:53,000
command, who are really good at 
commanding the ball, they're 

1369
01:18:53,000 --> 01:18:56,880
already attuned and calibrated. 
And when you, when you give them

1370
01:18:58,960 --> 01:19:01,160
different, a different 
implement, it throws that off. 

1371
01:19:01,160 --> 01:19:04,120
It uncalibrates them that it 
changes their attunement because

1372
01:19:04,120 --> 01:19:06,680
then they start trying to attune
to these other things and it, 

1373
01:19:06,680 --> 01:19:09,360
and it kind of messes them up. 
Whereas the guys that are not 

1374
01:19:09,360 --> 01:19:12,560
attuned it, it creates enough 
noise that they can get the 

1375
01:19:12,560 --> 01:19:16,280
signal for, for the ball that 
they're using. 

1376
01:19:16,520 --> 01:19:19,720
And so that's, that's another 
thing that I think plays into 

1377
01:19:19,720 --> 01:19:23,120
command and developing command 
and something that we need to 

1378
01:19:23,120 --> 01:19:27,240
think about as like, OK, when do
we, do we use, you know, 

1379
01:19:27,280 --> 01:19:32,560
variable balls with everybody or
do we use them with specific 

1380
01:19:32,560 --> 01:19:35,240
people? 
And so, you know, going off of 

1381
01:19:35,360 --> 01:19:41,440
that anecdote that that Kelowna 
had given me, I tend to, I tend 

1382
01:19:41,440 --> 01:19:43,760
to learn more now, like, Oh, I 
don't believe everybody needs to

1383
01:19:43,760 --> 01:19:48,040
use this, you know, type of a 
thing that, and, and rather I 

1384
01:19:48,040 --> 01:19:52,320
would be more apt to like do 
more exploration with guys that 

1385
01:19:52,320 --> 01:19:55,240
are struggling. 
And not that I wouldn't do, 

1386
01:19:55,360 --> 01:19:58,080
would, wouldn't do exploration 
with guys that are like really 

1387
01:19:58,080 --> 01:20:02,560
good, but I might, I might be 
more apt to listen to an athlete

1388
01:20:02,600 --> 01:20:05,520
who's already really good. 
I mean, like, Nah, I'm not 

1389
01:20:05,520 --> 01:20:08,640
really that interested in that. 
Whereas a guy who's not that 

1390
01:20:08,640 --> 01:20:10,200
good, I'm going to push him a 
little bit more. 

1391
01:20:12,640 --> 01:20:14,160
Yeah, invite them to their own 
party. 

1392
01:20:14,560 --> 01:20:16,600
Yep. 
Yeah, I agree. 

1393
01:20:16,680 --> 01:20:23,040
That's good. 
Any, any, any any way to get us 

1394
01:20:23,040 --> 01:20:27,200
down or we call it good on that?
I think yeah, no, I think that's

1395
01:20:27,200 --> 01:20:30,680
good. 
I think that we you can go for a

1396
01:20:30,680 --> 01:20:35,760
long time on all the different 
tools and ideas of how to help 

1397
01:20:35,760 --> 01:20:38,680
improve command. 
But I think the the common 

1398
01:20:38,680 --> 01:20:44,320
thread that you were stringing 
there throughout is this 

1399
01:20:44,320 --> 01:20:48,160
principle of what are they 
intending to do and what are 

1400
01:20:48,160 --> 01:20:52,640
they paying attention to, You 
know, whether it's a a ball or a

1401
01:20:52,640 --> 01:20:57,000
target or, and we're tracking 
those things or trying to make 

1402
01:20:57,000 --> 01:21:00,520
it more representative so that 
they're having to attune to that

1403
01:21:00,520 --> 01:21:02,480
information. 
I think that's maybe the main 

1404
01:21:02,480 --> 01:21:06,280
take away for me here is 
anything that we're doing in 

1405
01:21:06,280 --> 01:21:08,480
terms of command has to help 
them pay attention. 

1406
01:21:08,480 --> 01:21:13,760
Even something as basic as 
coaches who are really stringent

1407
01:21:13,760 --> 01:21:16,480
on you always have to be thrown 
to a target. 

1408
01:21:16,480 --> 01:21:18,800
What are they really saying? 
You always have to be paying 

1409
01:21:18,800 --> 01:21:21,440
attention to where it's 
guffling, how you might make an 

1410
01:21:21,440 --> 01:21:26,040
adjustment pitch to pitch, how 
you're adapting from pitch to 

1411
01:21:26,040 --> 01:21:28,040
pitch based on different 
contacts. 

1412
01:21:28,040 --> 01:21:30,720
So I think that's probably the 
most important thing, paying 

1413
01:21:30,720 --> 01:21:33,880
attention, helping your guys pay
attention to the right to the 

1414
01:21:33,880 --> 01:21:36,320
right information. 
Awesome. 

1415
01:21:36,320 --> 01:21:39,040
All right, well, until next 
time.