1 00:00:15,390 --> 00:00:17,590 Hello and welcome to the Weekly Scroll Podcast. 2 00:00:17,590 --> 00:00:20,790 My name is Ryan. And I'm the son of a deceased 3 00:00:20,790 --> 00:00:23,630 human clock maker, raised by a thieving Guild for my innate 4 00:00:23,630 --> 00:00:28,870 talents. And joining us today is Andre of 5 00:00:28,870 --> 00:00:30,510 Games Omnivorous. How you doing today, Andre? 6 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:33,360 Thanks so much for having me again. 7 00:00:33,480 --> 00:00:37,560 You never get sick of me and that pleases me so that welcome 8 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:40,400 back. Yeah, Never, never could, never 9 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:42,680 would, never will. It's been too long since you've 10 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:44,840 been on the show, though, so thank you for coming on. 11 00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:45,600 It's. Been a while. 12 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:47,600 It's actually been a while. So yeah. 13 00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:52,000 So thanks for having me. Really appreciate it. 14 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:54,440 I mean, love your show. Thanks. 15 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:56,640 You're one of those people that could come on every month and 16 00:00:56,640 --> 00:01:02,040 we'd be absolutely fine with it. So for those that don't know, 17 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:04,239 like what, like who, who, who are you? 18 00:01:04,239 --> 00:01:07,360 What is games omnivorous? What might people know Games 19 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:12,680 Omnivorous for? So yeah, so I'm the owner, lead 20 00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:15,000 game designer at Games Omnivorous. 21 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:17,720 Also the person that does the mail and logistics and 22 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:21,760 accounting and so on. Like I do everything related to 23 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:30,080 Games, Omnivorous people, games of New Verse has started as as 24 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:35,800 mostly a publisher or a publishing project in 2020. 25 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:41,760 And then we kind of redefined, reinvented the project last, 26 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:45,160 last year. But for the first five years we 27 00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:50,160 were, we were an indie RPG publisher mostly. 28 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:55,440 And people probably know some of of the games that we published 29 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:58,800 and worked on, like Mouse Rater, for instance, Vaults of Varn, 30 00:01:59,960 --> 00:02:02,400 Frontier Scum. So there's, there's, there's a 31 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:07,680 bunch of games that that kind of drew some attention and became 32 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:10,199 quite big in the past, in the past years. 33 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:14,040 And then precisely because of that, because they kind of like 34 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:19,560 got big and and the scale was, was a bit bigger than than I 35 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:23,960 could handle by myself. We kind of like redefined, 36 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:27,960 reimagined games of maneuvers. And now games of maneuvers is 37 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:33,080 not exactly a publisher per SE, but it's more like a game design 38 00:02:33,080 --> 00:02:36,400 studio. So I'm only working on games 39 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:41,360 that I'm creating myself right now or that I'm Co creating with 40 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:44,400 with with other with other with other people. 41 00:02:45,520 --> 00:02:48,640 This is the case for mouse rater, which is a Co creation 42 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:53,160 with Isaac Williams and and me here and frontier scum, which is 43 00:02:53,160 --> 00:02:55,920 called Druid as the lead main designer. 44 00:02:55,920 --> 00:03:00,760 And I'm mostly like a Co creator slash developer of the game. 45 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:04,040 So we're only focusing on a few games now. 46 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:08,800 And yeah, and this been this has been the case for one year now. 47 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:12,040 And this is yeah, this this is what it is. 48 00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:15,200 And like, I I think that the other day some somebody, 49 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:19,400 somebody pointed out that we were The Games on Reverse were 50 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:24,680 the first indie publisher in the world to have been nominated for 51 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:29,160 like an Emmy Award for five years in a row in at least one 52 00:03:29,160 --> 00:03:30,240 category. So that's. 53 00:03:30,680 --> 00:03:33,360 Yeah, that's kind of like our banner, a banner that that we're 54 00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:34,040 using. I don't know. 55 00:03:34,640 --> 00:03:35,480 Very cool. Yeah. 56 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:38,840 Yeah, yeah. I mean, I I discovered, I wonder 57 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:41,200 where the context is in this, because the first thing I ever 58 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:43,360 saw from games Omnivorous was the manifestos Omnivorous 59 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:46,080 adventures. Those were the first things. 60 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:48,040 And the first time I read one of those, I don't remember which 61 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:50,000 one was the first one, because then I had to have all of them. 62 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:53,960 I was just blown away by even just like ethos on the back 63 00:03:53,960 --> 00:03:55,240 where it's just like, these are the rules. 64 00:03:55,240 --> 00:03:58,120 This is like the unwritten rule. You know, This is why we're 65 00:03:58,120 --> 00:04:02,000 doing it. And and, you know, it's, it's I 66 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:04,040 don't know, it just something about it just blew me away. 67 00:04:04,040 --> 00:04:06,480 It felt so much, I don't know what I want to say like artsier, 68 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:08,520 but that doesn't sound that, you know, that sounds a certain way. 69 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:13,920 But I loved the ethos behind it. And then I think after that it 70 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:16,519 might have been John Davis when we played. 71 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:23,360 Oh gosh, why am I blanking on your like, like 17th century 72 00:04:23,360 --> 00:04:25,280 minimalist? Yeah. 73 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:31,240 That's like, yeah, that's right. It's basically when the company 74 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:34,880 started those two way, way back you've mentioned. 75 00:04:34,880 --> 00:04:38,360 Yeah. Yeah, so, yeah, so I so, so, so 76 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:39,680 yeah, I've been fan for quite a while. 77 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:40,960 Again, you've been on the show before. 78 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:43,160 It's incredible. I wanted to talk about a little 79 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:46,680 bit of the and you know, you, you, you broke the subject a bit 80 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:50,800 there at the start, the kind of switch to the current iteration 81 00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:52,840 of Games Omnivorous, because you guys, as you said, you're 82 00:04:52,840 --> 00:04:55,160 originally a publisher putting a lot of stuff. 83 00:04:56,360 --> 00:05:01,040 And so again, you talked about it a bit, but what kind of got 84 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:04,120 you to move from being a publisher to more of like a a 85 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:08,600 design studio? So as I was saying, the games 86 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:13,560 are restarted as a publisher and I think about 2/3 of my work, 87 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:19,600 somewhere between half of my work and 2/3 was like actually 88 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:24,960 working to towards having other creators published at Games on 89 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:26,240 Universe. So I was doing a lot of 90 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:30,600 editorial publishing work. I think, yeah, about 2/3 of the 91 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:36,200 stuff that we released until like 2024-2025 was other 92 00:05:36,200 --> 00:05:39,520 people's works. And then we, we kind of edited 93 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:41,400 them. Obviously we worked a lot. 94 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:43,880 I worked, I worked a lot with, with those creators. 95 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:48,440 But it was their vision mostly in, in these books and, and, 96 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:53,520 and, and games. And then I think that there 97 00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:56,240 were, there were a bunch of factors, but, but I think the, 98 00:05:56,240 --> 00:06:01,840 the main 1 is that some, some of the games really scaled up and, 99 00:06:01,840 --> 00:06:04,440 and got big. This was the case with mostly 100 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:10,600 mouse Ritter, also Frontier scum and and and and maybe 1-1 or two 101 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:12,280 others. But those were, those were the, 102 00:06:12,280 --> 00:06:15,040 the, the, the, the biggest are the main examples. 103 00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:18,200 And then all of a sudden I was in this position that I 104 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:22,840 couldn't, I couldn't handle everything that, that that came 105 00:06:22,840 --> 00:06:25,360 with, with, with a job. I couldn't be handling, like I 106 00:06:25,360 --> 00:06:29,600 couldn't be creating my games and also working with other 107 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:32,720 creators towards publishing their work and also handling 108 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:35,440 logistics and distribution and all. 109 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:40,240 You know, it was a bit, I was a bit all over the place And, and 110 00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:44,240 I remember having a conversation with, with Matt Kelly from 111 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:47,640 Exalted Funeral and he eventually told something that 112 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:52,080 kind of like resonated in, in, in my, in my head and kind of 113 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:55,120 stayed, stayed there a lot a while until I, I, I made the 114 00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:58,880 decision was you have to decide. I think I, I don't know the 115 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:01,600 exact words, but Matt told me you have to decide if you're in 116 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:05,120 the business of selling games or creating games. 117 00:07:06,360 --> 00:07:10,200 And this is this is this was a really, this was, this really 118 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:14,440 resonated and, and stayed with me for, for, for a few months, 119 00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:17,560 lingering on the back of my head like. 120 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:21,240 And then all of a sudden, yeah, I realized that I had to, to 121 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:23,240 make that decision. Actually, I had to make the 122 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:27,240 decision whether I was going to focus more on the publishing 123 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:32,240 aspect of, of, of the project. And I was, you know, and that 124 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:36,760 probably meant not doing my own games that much or kind of like 125 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:41,160 letting that that part go and focusing on actually getting the 126 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:44,520 stuff out there and doing more marketing and, you know, hitting 127 00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:46,120 conventions and that sort of stuff. 128 00:07:46,360 --> 00:07:52,800 Or I would outsource all of that and I would concentrate actually 129 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:58,360 on the creation and that process and that artistic, more artistic 130 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:01,520 or creative process. So I decided that I should do 131 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:03,960 that. So that's that's what it, that's 132 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:07,840 basically what it is. That's very cool that you moved 133 00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:10,360 in that direction. And for those keeping score at 134 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:15,080 home, last time you were on the show I believe was episode 123, 135 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:17,920 which was two years ago. Oh, wow, OK, wow. 136 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:19,640 It's. Been a while. 137 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:22,080 It's been so this the first time that you've been on the show 138 00:08:22,080 --> 00:08:24,520 since the since you kind of switched up and everything, 139 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:29,200 which again, it's been too long. I did get to run into you at was 140 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:31,480 it last packs or the packs before that were really 141 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:32,960 actually? Got to chat, I didn't go last 142 00:08:32,960 --> 00:08:34,120 year so it was the year. There you go. 143 00:08:35,159 --> 00:08:37,919 So yeah, packs two years ago was the last time I think we 144 00:08:37,919 --> 00:08:40,400 actually got to chat then, so it's been too long. 145 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:46,960 What did the job have anything to do with this at all too? 146 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:51,320 Because that was yeah, so. So how did that kind of affect 147 00:08:51,320 --> 00:08:54,520 it? I think that actually it was in 148 00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:57,840 Philadelphia that, that I had this conversation with Matt. 149 00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:02,440 So it was like like when, when we first met me and you, right 150 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:05,480 when we first met in person, it was actually when all of this 151 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:07,440 kind of like started brewing, I think. 152 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:11,760 And I, I, I, I made this decision, this decision 153 00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:16,280 obviously a couple of months after, but that's when things 154 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:21,440 started like, you know, I started thinking about it and 155 00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:25,120 then I realized that that I was going to, And then when I, when 156 00:09:25,120 --> 00:09:29,000 I made the decision, I realized that I was going to take a few 157 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:35,880 games with me into the new project, like just not carry on 158 00:09:35,880 --> 00:09:37,960 with some other collections and ideas that I had. 159 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:40,720 Which one, one of those you already talked about, which was 160 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:43,080 the manifestos, the manifestos omnivorous. 161 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:45,720 We, we kind of like ended that collection. 162 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:49,040 That's, that's, that's done because that was more on the 163 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:51,040 publishing aspect of the project. 164 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:54,160 I would, I would say. So when, when I decided, when 165 00:09:54,160 --> 00:10:00,120 we, when I decided to, to, to, to make this transition, I, I, I 166 00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:05,360 decided I was going to take four games to the new games of 167 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:07,880 nievers, let's call it that. And one of them was obviously 168 00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:11,160 Maseratier. The partnership with, with Isaac 169 00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:16,200 has been, has been incredible since day one. 170 00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:21,320 So it, it obviously makes sense to, to to carry on and, and 171 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:25,560 I've, I've been upgraded to the role of a Co creator. 172 00:10:25,560 --> 00:10:29,080 So I'm writing lots of things for the new junk city supplement 173 00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:32,040 and stuff. So it's been it's been cool. 174 00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:36,520 And then I decided to also, I, I talked to Carl, Carl Druid about 175 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:38,840 frontiers come and I said, look, I'm going to do this. 176 00:10:39,560 --> 00:10:42,480 Do you want to stay with me or do you want to, you want to move 177 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,680 on? And Carl Druid eventually 178 00:10:44,680 --> 00:10:48,880 decided that he was going to stay and, and, and then he 179 00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:52,440 wanted to be under the games omnivorous umbrella. 180 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:55,400 So it's a Co creation. Frontiers gum is a Co creation 181 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:58,720 between Carl and and now me, I'm more like a developer. 182 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:03,920 That's that's my role there. And, and then I, I also took two 183 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:09,360 of my original games that that are 100% mine and one of them is 184 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:14,080 the job precisely a classic. So, so the idea, the idea there 185 00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:19,120 being if I'm going to focus on the creative aspects and this is 186 00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:23,000 now a game design studio, I need to find partners to publish 187 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:26,720 this, this work, since I'm not going to be a publisher anymore. 188 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:29,800 So Moss Ritter went to Exalted funeral. 189 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:34,760 The job also is is with Exalted Funeral and then Frontier Scum. 190 00:11:34,760 --> 00:11:38,440 We'll have some news in one month or so, but it's going to a 191 00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:42,240 different publisher and now Flail. 192 00:11:42,240 --> 00:11:46,760 So I kind of redefined the project and I decided to invest 193 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:50,440 in these 4 main games right now. So that's the story. 194 00:11:50,440 --> 00:11:53,520 I don't know. Unless you really hone in on 195 00:11:53,520 --> 00:11:56,560 like just like a few specific things and you're, you just 196 00:11:56,560 --> 00:11:58,800 don't won't feel a spread out anymore, you know? 197 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:03,200 Exactly, that's exactly that. And I, I, I'm doing, I have a 198 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:08,400 lot of ideas, but somehow the ideas now fit more neatly into 199 00:12:08,920 --> 00:12:11,840 into these into one of these games. 200 00:12:12,440 --> 00:12:17,640 And I think that's also because one of the reasons also Ryan 201 00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:19,520 asked about the reasons why I did this. 202 00:12:19,520 --> 00:12:23,840 And I think also one of the reasons was that in terms of 203 00:12:23,840 --> 00:12:30,000 like a promotion or marketing or the face of the the company, I 204 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:32,000 think it was also a bit all over the place. 205 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,480 I think that some people knew what knew us for the more 206 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:38,400 artistic projects like the LP's or manifestos of nervous, but 207 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:40,800 had no idea that we were also doing Mouse Rater. 208 00:12:41,080 --> 00:12:43,440 And then there was a lot of people that knew us from Mouse 209 00:12:43,440 --> 00:12:46,480 Rater, but had no idea that we were also the people behind like 210 00:12:47,720 --> 00:12:51,000 Haunted Almanac or Isle of VIX or Vaults of Varn, you know, So 211 00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:53,600 it was a bit scattered. It was a bit all over the place. 212 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:56,720 So this was also a moment where we tried to redefine the 213 00:12:56,720 --> 00:13:00,600 identity and create a bit more coherent identity around and 214 00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:03,600 more clear identity, I would say around the project. 215 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:09,200 And yeah, and we, we also did Vaults of Varn originally. 216 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:13,200 So the, the 1st edition is, is, is published by Games and Rivers 217 00:13:13,720 --> 00:13:18,000 and we, I talked with, with Leo about Vaults of aren't 218 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:20,800 continuing with games and Reavers, but he decided to go on 219 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:22,960 his own. That's completely, completely 220 00:13:22,960 --> 00:13:24,880 fine. So we, there was a moment where 221 00:13:24,880 --> 00:13:27,560 we talked to the different creators we were working with. 222 00:13:27,560 --> 00:13:31,840 We explained the situation and some of them decided to go their 223 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:33,960 own route. Some of them stayed and it's 224 00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:35,040 fine. It's, it's all good. 225 00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:38,800 Like I I really like Leo, I love his work and I cannot wait for 226 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:41,000 the new Vaults of Orange edition to be honest. 227 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:43,240 Same. Yeah, it'll be interesting. 228 00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:47,120 We've had Leo on I guess more recently than you and we talked 229 00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:49,240 about Tui and got to play some of it and everything. 230 00:13:49,240 --> 00:13:52,880 So that's interesting. Couple of things I'm going to 231 00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:55,000 get back to #1 here. So let's go to number 2. 232 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:57,800 So Frontier Scum, Well also it's it's a cool spread that you 233 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:00,840 ended up with too, because mouse shooter is obviously like huge. 234 00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:03,280 It's it's own kind of thing. It's mice and everything. 235 00:14:03,560 --> 00:14:06,800 But between Frontier Scum and Flail and the job, you have a 236 00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:10,400 really nice spread. I would not consider those in 237 00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:14,000 any way, shape or form, like really similar. 238 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:16,360 The job is so different mechanically and aesthetically 239 00:14:16,560 --> 00:14:19,040 than flail, which is so different than frontier scum as 240 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:22,320 well. So it's nice to be able to kind 241 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:26,200 of like hone in on those 3 aspects or anything you want to 242 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:27,360 do that's kind of more historical. 243 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:29,560 You can go in frontier scum, anything you want to do that's 244 00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:31,880 more kind of fantasy. You got flail and and and most 245 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:37,320 are in the job, but you said master and the job are with 246 00:14:37,320 --> 00:14:39,640 exalted. What about frontier scum and 247 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:41,520 flail? Are you working with multiple 248 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:43,200 publishers or are you pretty much going to be paired with 249 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:46,720 Exalted only? No, So Frontier Scum will have a 250 00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:50,400 new, another publisher. It's the new print run is coming 251 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:52,840 in a couple of months, I believe. 252 00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:57,880 There's there's there's we me and Carl, we worked on on a new 253 00:14:57,920 --> 00:15:01,960 print run, but like it's more like an expanded edition, sort 254 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:04,160 of. So it has a bunch of more, more 255 00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:08,600 content, but that will go into another publisher. 256 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:15,040 I cannot reveal it yet because I don't have I, I legally I I 257 00:15:15,040 --> 00:15:18,000 cannot do it, but it's it's going there to a different 258 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:19,920 publisher. Yes, and flail. 259 00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:23,360 I decided to do the Kickstarter, the sorry, the backer kit 260 00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:30,640 campaign by myself and depending on, you know, how well it goes, 261 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:35,840 how you know, I, I, I need to evaluate first exactly how the 262 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:41,280 game does before I commit to a publisher or or not. 263 00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:46,720 So I haven't made that decision yet, but it will probably in, I 264 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:50,520 don't know. It's I think that most likely is 265 00:15:50,520 --> 00:15:54,600 I will fulfill the kicks the the backer kid campaign by myself. 266 00:15:55,400 --> 00:16:00,800 I will do a first print run by myself and then I will, I will, 267 00:16:00,920 --> 00:16:04,120 I will go out and search for like a publisher or a 268 00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:06,880 distribution network or something like that to, to work 269 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:08,080 with me. Yeah, OK. 270 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:10,800 And it's nice because yours and you get to make those decisions 271 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:14,480 and you have the experience from being a publisher previously. 272 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:16,680 So you have you have all of that down, which is really nice. 273 00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:19,200 It's not like you're getting in for the first time and and 274 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:20,520 putting a box out all on your own. 275 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:22,480 You've done that many times already, yeah. 276 00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:25,680 I know the trade that that that obviously helps, yeah. 277 00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:28,120 Yeah. One other big thing that's 278 00:16:28,120 --> 00:16:34,680 happened, Mouse Runner month, which was crazy how I guess kind 279 00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:39,040 of like a multi part of that is how did how does one get a month 280 00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:41,200 with backer kit and how did that go? 281 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:45,360 Like how did it feel having that much kind of like in one and I 282 00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:48,840 know you guys are doing so much with making it all kind of 283 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:50,600 happen at the same time with delivery. 284 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:56,240 How did that whole process go? So the the real pioneers here 285 00:16:56,240 --> 00:17:00,560 were were the folks Sean McCoy and the folks at Mothership, 286 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:03,120 right? They came up with the concept of 287 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:07,720 doing a month long event campaign with a bunch of of 288 00:17:07,839 --> 00:17:12,440 different projects and creators, each doing something for 289 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:16,000 mothership and kind of like creating an umbrella for that 290 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:21,920 within back cricket. So they did that in I think two 291 00:17:21,920 --> 00:17:25,680 years ago. Yeah, two years ago, so November 292 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:34,400 2024 and then kind of like the folks at at backer kids, I think 293 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:38,160 approached us or started talking about we should expand this 294 00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:43,080 concept to other games, other IPS that have like really strong 295 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:47,200 third party communities. And if you think about, you 296 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:51,440 know, a strong third party community in the RPG world, I I 297 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:54,040 think Mouse Ritter really stands stands out. 298 00:17:54,440 --> 00:17:59,960 You have mothership, you have, you have, I don't know how you 299 00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:04,200 have more. Obviously you have the, all the 300 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:09,280 people that do the Power Bay, the Apocalypse games also, but 301 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:13,720 Moss Rater is also very strong in that department. 302 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:19,000 We have like there's a, there's a database for all the stuff 303 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:22,880 that's been published by fans and 3rd party creators for Moss 304 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:26,080 Rater and it's over like 1500 supplements or whatever. 305 00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:30,360 So it's like, it's huge. So they approached this backer 306 00:18:30,360 --> 00:18:34,000 kid approached this and, and, and pitched the idea and we're 307 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:36,920 like, yeah, let's, let's do it. Because me and Isaac, we've 308 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:42,040 been, we at that point, we, we had already been working on, on 309 00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:45,280 the new supplement, new junk city supplement for like 1 1/2 310 00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:47,880 years at that point. So you're like, OK, maybe this 311 00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:53,120 is what we need for that extra final push to actually push this 312 00:18:53,120 --> 00:18:56,440 across the finish line and and really make this supplement. 313 00:18:57,240 --> 00:18:59,840 So we decided to that that was a good idea. 314 00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:05,200 And also because it really felt that the mouse richer community 315 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:08,920 and the third party community had growed ridiculously at it 316 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:13,840 grow beyond our wildest imaginations, mine or Isaacs. 317 00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:19,120 But we still didn't have like a moment where this community was 318 00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:23,440 truly celebrated as it deserved. And we realized that mouse 319 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:27,600 retirement was, was, was the place in the event to do that. 320 00:19:28,120 --> 00:19:30,240 So that's what that's that's what we did. 321 00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:35,520 And it was, it was a beast to logistically to, to handle. 322 00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:39,240 And still, I, just before this meeting I had, I had a meeting 323 00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:42,160 with Christine and we were trying to work out the massive 324 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:45,600 pledge manager thing, which is like a group shipping feature 325 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:49,040 that we, that, that we're offering, we're offering people 326 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:52,120 to save on shipping. But it's been, it's, it's, it's 327 00:19:52,120 --> 00:19:55,200 not, it's not as easy as setting up like your normal pledge 328 00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:59,480 manager, but it's been, it's, it, it was a phenomenal event. 329 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:03,760 Like we had incredible creators. I, I think it was 15 other 330 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:06,720 creators doing their own projects, really distinct 331 00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:09,920 projects with lots of personality, new takes on mouse 332 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,040 rater. Then we had a game jam. 333 00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:15,000 In that game jam, another, I don't know, 80 supplements 334 00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:19,560 flourished. Through that, through the that 335 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:23,480 each game jam and it was just a special moment, I think, for 336 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:26,360 Mouse Ritter, yeah. Very cool. 337 00:20:26,360 --> 00:20:28,040 Yeah. I mean, those third party things 338 00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:31,720 like continue to breathe so much life into a game. 339 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:34,080 It'll just live forever at that point, you know? 340 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:38,480 I agree, yeah. I think that's one of the things 341 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:43,120 that I, that I, that I like the best about Mouse Reiter is what 342 00:20:43,120 --> 00:20:44,480 everyone else does with the game. 343 00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:48,040 Yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, the thing 344 00:20:48,040 --> 00:20:51,440 about mouse reader 2 is from from day one, you know, Isaac 345 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:54,920 seems to have Isaac someone we we should have had on the show 346 00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:56,240 forever ago. We'll have to chat with him at 347 00:20:56,240 --> 00:20:59,720 some point. Has kind of built the game to be 348 00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:02,680 like incredibly approachable, even to the point where like 349 00:21:02,680 --> 00:21:04,400 it's free, like if you go to the website, you can just download 350 00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:09,560 it for free or like the the token maker thing that's on the 351 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:12,360 website is incredible. Like everything about it is 352 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:16,800 again, so approachable, so welcoming and it created a 353 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:20,480 community that, you know, as I think Hunter said, like self 354 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:24,640 perpetuates, you know, so many people find it, download it, 355 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:27,600 love it, play it and continue to make stuff for it. 356 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:33,360 Because I think was Isaac involved in the like library to 357 00:21:33,360 --> 00:21:35,360 start or was that like a community based project that 358 00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:39,040 someone like took and ran with? It was a communities project by 359 00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:41,200 Matt Morris Who. Is like, yeah. 360 00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:46,280 Yeah #1 fan of Yeah, the king of the Maseratri community. 361 00:21:46,360 --> 00:21:49,560 Yeah, and if there's one person you want to be your #1 fan, it's 362 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:52,560 it's Matt Morris, because he'll never stop making awesome stuff 363 00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:55,520 for your for your game. But you know, and he was and he 364 00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:59,120 was a big part of cuz he did rolling coast I believe for for 365 00:21:59,120 --> 00:22:02,120 master of the month as well. So when you create a thing that 366 00:22:02,120 --> 00:22:05,200 is so welcoming that people create more stuff for it, which 367 00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:07,320 gets more people to create more stuff for it. 368 00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:09,480 Again, you have this like self perpetuating thing that goes 369 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:10,760 forever. It's one reason I always argue 370 00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:12,440 on the show. You know, are you are you trying 371 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:15,000 to make money to put out a game or are you trying to build a 372 00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:19,160 community, which then eventually will, you know, bring in money 373 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:20,520 of it. You know, things like Karen, 374 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:23,400 things like mouse shutter, the the free version of of Merck 375 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:26,960 Borg exist. You know, those are when we talk 376 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:31,920 about some of the biggest communities in the indie space, 377 00:22:32,120 --> 00:22:37,120 Almost all of them have these free rules and make the game 378 00:22:37,120 --> 00:22:39,720 approachable, create a community and then develop a community in 379 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:42,600 it. So if you're looking for success 380 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:44,480 in a project, I think Mouse Raider is one of the ones to 381 00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:49,320 really model your entire kind of like ethos of what you should do 382 00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:51,360 with the game on. And it's it's been incredible 383 00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:52,320 Watch. I mean, I love master. 384 00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:56,040 I said this before, I think in certain metrics, I know you 385 00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:58,320 laughed a little bit when I said this is this art in a certain 386 00:22:58,320 --> 00:22:59,680 light. I think Master might be one of 387 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:04,920 the greatest role-playing game teach RPGs ever because of the 388 00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:07,880 community that it has the approach ability to the game for 389 00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:11,040 all ages, the depth that the game has. 390 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:14,480 Like if I if I when I have met people that have never even 391 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:17,640 heard of what AT RPG is, the first game I always play is 392 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:19,400 Mouse Rider. It's one of the three that I 393 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:21,200 would always pick, but Mouse Rider is the one. 394 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:22,800 If they're like pick one, I'm like it's always going to be 395 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:26,960 Mouse Rider. You know, I mean, I, I, I, I'm 396 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:29,800 happy that you say that. It was definitely not something 397 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:33,520 that we did by design. It just kind of came into 398 00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:35,920 existence that way or flourished that way. 399 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:39,560 I think also it has a lot to do with how the third party and 400 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,320 defense and the, the, the community surrounding Mouse 401 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:46,680 Rider kind of evolved and shaped the game in ways that we were 402 00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:50,840 not anticipating or didn't necessarily design that way. 403 00:23:51,360 --> 00:23:56,720 I remember, I always remember this, that Isaac when, when, 404 00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,760 when we were originally talking about mouse rater, he always 405 00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:02,920 said that this is, this is not a kids game. 406 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:06,360 In my, in my, in my head, you know, in my mind, this is like 407 00:24:06,360 --> 00:24:10,840 70% Beatrix spotter, 30% heavy metal. 408 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:15,200 And it's like, because it's a very cruel game in the sense 409 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:19,280 that you know, your, your, your mouse can be instantly killed by 410 00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:22,760 a cat or whatever. So it kind of like in his head, 411 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:25,200 it was a bit this that was going on. 412 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,920 But then the community kind of picked up the game and took it 413 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:33,040 in new directions and, and took it in more like a kids friendly 414 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,320 approach. And I think that's fine. 415 00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:39,200 That's wonderful. And we really embrace that. 416 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:44,160 And I think that the community also transformed how Isaac and 417 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:47,600 myself saw our own game. You know what I mean? 418 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:50,120 And that's really cool. That's, I think that's, it's 419 00:24:50,120 --> 00:24:53,840 precisely that back and forth between the fans, the community, 420 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:58,640 your readers, your players that really make make the game. 421 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:01,400 Yeah, I mean, I think the strength is the flexibility of 422 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:03,560 it though 'cause like, you know, some people can play with the 423 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:06,840 kids or you could be Matt Morris who ran like a multi year 424 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:09,960 campaign with multiple generations of mouse that were 425 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:13,040 like the next generation down. Or you can play like me and Ryan 426 00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:16,040 where we like absolutely tried to stab each other in the back 427 00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:18,760 at the end, like a really dark like Dungeness. 428 00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:22,480 Ryan did stab me in the back. He wants to direct. 429 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,120 Me. Well, I think that's like a 430 00:25:24,120 --> 00:25:26,520 beautiful thing about that game is like it's so flexible to 431 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:28,880 whatever. Flexible, yeah, I agree with 432 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:30,920 you. Yeah, it is very I think it it 433 00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:36,120 it will, it pleases like you can definitely make them really make 434 00:25:36,120 --> 00:25:38,840 the game a really good experience for kids, that's for 435 00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:41,360 sure embedded into into the game right now. 436 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:46,560 But you can also make it really fun for like old school dungeon 437 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:48,920 crawlers whatever. Absolutely, yeah. 438 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:52,720 Which is why I say it's one of the best because it's an all 439 00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:55,440 ages game. Not that you would play with 440 00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:58,600 like a 50 year old Grognar doing hardcore Duggan stuff with a 441 00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:00,120 child in the game too. It's just that you could do 442 00:26:00,120 --> 00:26:01,280 either. But I think one of the things I 443 00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:03,960 like about it, one of the things that it's not for kids kind of 444 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:07,440 is to me, it Harkins back to I think when most of us were 445 00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:11,000 younger, where I think people trusted kids a little bit more 446 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,800 with heavy stuff because Watership Down was a kids movie, 447 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:18,800 Red Wall were kids books. I think that there was more kind 448 00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:22,840 of like trust in kids to understand that the world has a 449 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,920 little bit more depth to it or like a little bit more darkness 450 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:28,560 to it than we do now with like the helicopter parents and 451 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:30,560 people being like a 20 year old as a child. 452 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:32,920 And it's just like, you know, I think when we were kids, things 453 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,240 were allowed to be darker when we were younger. 454 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,800 And and I think that's one of the things that Harkins too. 455 00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:41,440 And I also think that one thing that I always describe it as is 456 00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:45,560 fantasy literature has kind of ruined fantasy to an extent 457 00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:49,240 where like person thinks that they could beat a dragon. 458 00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:51,280 They're like, yes, I'm a hero. I could beat a dragon. 459 00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:53,920 But then when you give the same scenario and say, well, could a 460 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,080 mouse, one single mouse beat a cat, people like, absolutely 461 00:26:57,080 --> 00:26:59,000 not. I'm like, it brings that. 462 00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:01,000 It kind of reinvigorates in my mind. 463 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:04,520 It refreshes all of the fantasy tropes because it gives you new 464 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:08,520 context without kind of like all the rest of fantasy involved. 465 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:13,080 That to me kind of grounds it back into how I feel fantasy is. 466 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:14,240 Yeah. So. 467 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:15,800 So yeah, Mouse Rider. Great. 468 00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:20,480 Excited, excited for for all 16 projects to come to my door and 469 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:27,120 and get to do that. But so also, so, so the thing 470 00:27:27,120 --> 00:27:30,120 that we're we're we're talking about now, the thing that is 471 00:27:30,120 --> 00:27:34,640 coming up, we got flail. So tell, tell us, tell us. 472 00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:38,640 I also, I want to show this off to to to the crowd out there. 473 00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:40,160 I got this box. So. 474 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:43,080 So tell me what? What is flail and why? 475 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:44,440 Why? Why is flail? 476 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:53,000 So Flail is kind of, I think my love letter to the OSR genre or 477 00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:55,720 my take on the genre, let's let's say it. 478 00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:59,680 I've been, I've been obviously playing these games for, I don't 479 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:03,720 know, 15 years, 16 years, 17 years with I think the first one 480 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:07,200 that I played was Dungeon Crawl Classics, which is still 481 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:10,520 probably my favorite old school oriented game. 482 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,600 Then Labyrinth Lord. Then I played a bunch of I 483 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:17,440 played a lot of black. Heck, I played a lot of Then I 484 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:20,360 played Karen, obviously nave. So I've been playing these games 485 00:28:20,360 --> 00:28:25,240 for for quite a while now, and I've even I've even wrote or 486 00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:31,200 created a bunch of settings that were that were to be played with 487 00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:34,920 these these rule sets. I'm talking about the nine cents 488 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:40,400 bottle C bottle Frostland and the heck scroll tool box is not 489 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:42,240 exactly a setting, but it's but a supplement. 490 00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:49,120 And these these are these are hack scrolls that have their 491 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:53,000 that come with their own physical hack styles that you 492 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:57,880 place in you on the table and you create you create maps for 493 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,600 your players with those. So I've been, I've been kind of 494 00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:06,600 creating these settings for 4566 years now and I've been playing 495 00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:10,240 them with Denton quad classics. I've played them with, with 496 00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:12,680 black heck neighbor. I played, I played them into the 497 00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:15,880 odds as well. So I played these, these 498 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,480 settings with a bunch of rules. And then I realized that maybe, 499 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:22,200 you know, maybe I should write my own, my own rule set because 500 00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:27,920 I think that I, what I'm envisioning is something that is 501 00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:31,040 not quite been done or created yet. 502 00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:38,000 So I might have a go at it. So Flail is an old school OSR 503 00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:43,320 ish NSR. I don't know what to call it but 504 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:45,320 it's an old school oriented game. 505 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:47,320 Classic fantasy sword and sorcery. 506 00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:52,000 But it's my own take on the Chandra and it's very much 507 00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:58,520 Dungeon Call Classics vibe meets the simplicity and the board 508 00:29:58,520 --> 00:30:02,240 gaminess of Mouse Ritter. I think that's how I would put 509 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:07,080 it. Yeah, I mean, and I'm scrolling 510 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:10,200 through right now. I'm on the Bone Whisperer on the 511 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:14,160 screen and you can obviously see the, the what you call the board 512 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:16,560 gaminess. Like one of my favorite part, I 513 00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:18,920 think one of a lot of people's favorite parts of mouse Rider is 514 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:22,680 the, the tactile bits that the tokens on the board and, and 515 00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:26,400 everything like that. So what would you say it's 516 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:29,400 inspired by, you know, DCC and then the bits of Mouse Rider? 517 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:33,240 Like other than that it's fucking perfect. 518 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:37,160 Like why bring those parts of the mouse writer into your game? 519 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,280 Just it's the way you enjoy playing now since you play it so 520 00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:40,720 much. Yeah. 521 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:45,120 I mean, I think that for me at least, the thing that I like the 522 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:49,040 most mechanically in Mouse Writer is the inventory system. 523 00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:54,040 I've never been I I've never found a game where inventory was 524 00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:56,120 actually fun other than Mastriter. 525 00:30:56,120 --> 00:31:01,640 Let's let's put it this way, I or at least an old school ish, 526 00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:07,200 whatever RPG I've played, you know, all of these games that 527 00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:11,240 I've listed, it's it's not easy to track inventory and then you 528 00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:14,040 it's, it's always always a bit fiddly and then you have to 529 00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:18,080 erase your sheet multiple times and you it's so it doesn't 530 00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:23,160 really do what I wanted to do, which is I want an inventory 531 00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:26,160 system that is actually fun and engaging at the gaming table. 532 00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:29,840 And I think that mouse Ritter did that incredibly well and 533 00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:33,840 that was I think probably the biggest success of the game 534 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:38,640 because it's also very visual. Yes, absolutely can really 535 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:41,800 understand like you, you just need to show a picture and 536 00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:44,440 people immediately understand what the inventory system is. 537 00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:49,000 So it's it's really something that is very strong visually as 538 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,360 well. And I always wanted the game a 539 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:57,200 fantasy DCC, whatever Karen game that that that also did that. 540 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:01,960 So I decided by, OK, I have to, I have to create my own then 541 00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:04,080 because it doesn't, it doesn't exist. 542 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:10,400 So, so that's that's one of the aspects that that really pushed 543 00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:15,720 me to create this game. And the the other one is I also 544 00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:19,560 wanted a game that remained really, really, really rules 545 00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:23,960 like super simple. Like if if you look at the at 546 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,960 the rules for flail, the default, the main rules, they 547 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,120 fit into a single CHEAT SHEET. Basically. 548 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:33,560 It's really simple. You have a roll under system for 549 00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:35,800 the saves. You have a new combat system 550 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:40,280 that we can talk about in a bit. And it's very, very simple. 551 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:44,680 Like the rules are compressed in like no more than I think 4 or 5 552 00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:46,600 pages. That's mostly it. 553 00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:52,040 But I wanted a game like that, but that could also offer 554 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:57,760 players some depth in terms of customization so that the the 555 00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:01,800 same class didn't feel the same if played twice. 556 00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:05,440 And I think that's that's the real balance that I tried to 557 00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:10,320 achieve, which achieve here was a game that remained really 558 00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:16,600 simple, but could still offer players right from the character 559 00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:19,480 creation, meaningful choices. And I think that's that's, 560 00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:21,040 that's I think that the game does. 561 00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:25,040 Yeah, I think putting together the characters looks like it. 562 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:27,120 You can create a really interesting experience each 563 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:28,880 time. It's like I mentioned before, we 564 00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:30,920 got on how much I like the instant back stories. 565 00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:33,960 I use one as my opener. It's very interesting. 566 00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:38,640 But yeah, I love the the ability to jump out and kind of know who 567 00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:40,880 your character is a little bit immediately too. 568 00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:42,800 Yeah, yeah, that's also something. 569 00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:46,160 But that that I think that sort of thing also somehow is it 570 00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:49,400 exists in other games, but it's something that I really always 571 00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:54,240 liked is like, I don't I don't want, you know, a three page 572 00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:55,800 back story when I start the game. 573 00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:58,600 None of us do. Yeah, like 2 lines. 574 00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:01,360 Here's the concept. Go play it and we'll find out 575 00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:05,240 exactly what that means. You know so and it's cool cuz 576 00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:09,960 these backgrounds tweak the rules or bend the rules in one 577 00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:14,440 way or another. Like if you're a cut throat and 578 00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:20,199 you're somehow you're a lizard folk or whatever, you have an 579 00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:23,360 access to a reptile primal gift from the druid or stuff like 580 00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:24,600 that. So it kind of like gives you 581 00:34:24,639 --> 00:34:27,800 access to certain small things from other classes. 582 00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:30,840 So I think it's it's a neat way to do it, very simple and and 583 00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:34,600 clean way to to to actually make that interesting and fast as 584 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,480 well. What's interesting is on them 585 00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:40,080 yeah and we were just talking on our last review Flames of Orion, 586 00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:42,360 we just did the other day. One of the our favorite parts of 587 00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:45,239 that system and and games in general is when the core rules 588 00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:48,960 are really easy and all the crunches in customization like 589 00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:52,960 that is peak game to me like I know this is Adam left field, 590 00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:55,719 but Destiny one way back in the day where you had this massive 591 00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:57,880 tree you could have like 4 different versions of the 592 00:34:57,880 --> 00:34:59,320 character. It's true. 593 00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:01,840 It was when it was better and the more simplified they made 594 00:35:02,240 --> 00:35:07,040 the customization and the more heavy they made the actual like 595 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:10,120 gameplay It it is when it started veering, in my opinion, 596 00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:12,760 different directions. So that's exactly the kind of 597 00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:15,920 game I want to play where rules are easy, but customization is 598 00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:17,480 heavy. Our rules are lighter, 599 00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:20,040 customization is heavy and and you know it, it seems like 600 00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:22,440 exactly what you did here, which is, which is incredible. 601 00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:25,280 So you said we were going to talk about the combat system 602 00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:27,000 too, something that makes it a little bit different. 603 00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:28,280 So what? What's what's up with that? 604 00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:34,480 So the, I think that the combat system is probably the most 605 00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:37,560 innovative aspect of of of flail. 606 00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:42,680 I think that most other aspects is me. 607 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:47,200 It's like a heavy curation of all these cool games meshed 608 00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:54,240 together and a very personal and subjective distillation of all 609 00:35:54,240 --> 00:35:57,600 the ideas that that have been going around for like the last 610 00:35:57,720 --> 00:36:01,760 15 years in this space. And it was it was me kind of 611 00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:04,200 compiling the things that I like, the things that made sense 612 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:06,200 for my gaming table. Because when I write these 613 00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:08,240 games, I kind of write them for myself. 614 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:13,080 I think I I write them for this is what I want to play with my 615 00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:15,840 bunch. And maybe someone else will 616 00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:21,800 think that this is also cool. So I, I, I, this was like a 617 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:24,680 process of me curating all these, these ideas, as I was 618 00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:28,280 saying. But I think that the combat 619 00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:31,880 system is the thing that is really novel here and innovative 620 00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:38,400 and kind of like fresh and new in, in this in, in the OSR old 621 00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:42,960 school scene. And the combat system works with 622 00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:48,280 a dice pool. So it's not like it, it's not 623 00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:51,720 like Mastrator Into the Odd where you just roll damage and 624 00:36:51,720 --> 00:36:55,040 it's not like other games where you actually try to hit your 625 00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:59,240 adversary and then roll damage. I tried to do something new 626 00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:02,680 here. I tried to do something similar 627 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:06,040 to Into the Odd in the sense that there's only one role, so 628 00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:09,600 there's not 2 roles, 1 to see if you hit and another one for 629 00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:11,480 damage. There's only one role. 630 00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:14,040 And I think that Into the Odd did that perfectly. 631 00:37:14,240 --> 00:37:17,720 They, they, they invented the combat system with one role only 632 00:37:17,720 --> 00:37:19,520 basically. And I think that that was very 633 00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:21,560 clever. And I tried to do the same, but 634 00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:25,320 instead of rolling damage here, you actually rolled two hits 635 00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:29,240 your adversary. So you roll a bunch of a bunch 636 00:37:29,240 --> 00:37:33,040 of D sixes and the amount depends on your weapon and some 637 00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:35,400 skills. But usually between 4:00 and 638 00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:40,520 7:00 you roll a bunch of them and if you score 11 you do 639 00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:44,360 weapon damage and each weapon has their own damage value 640 00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:47,760 listed. If you roll 2 ones you do double 641 00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:52,720 weapon damage and if you roll 3 ones you eliminate your target 642 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,440 immediately. It's even if it's a dragon. 643 00:37:56,440 --> 00:38:01,120 I don't care if it's a dragon. So if if you face a dragon and 644 00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:06,960 you in your in your two hit rule, which is a dice pool of D6 645 00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:10,200 is rule three once you kill the dragon instantly. 646 00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:16,600 So this is how it works. And then I kind of started this 647 00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:20,600 was the system that, that, that that I thought of first. 648 00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:25,280 And then when I started playing, I realized that I was seeing a 649 00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:28,840 lot of cool combinations like triplets and sequences and full 650 00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:30,640 houses emerging from these roles. 651 00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:36,080 And I like, OK, but why don't I give these classes and come up 652 00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:39,720 with like cool unique legendary weapons that unlock further 653 00:38:39,720 --> 00:38:43,800 bonuses and stuff when players actually roll certain 654 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:47,760 combinations, like poker combinations in these two hit 655 00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:49,640 roles. And then kind of like the system 656 00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:53,520 grew from there. And now I, I think I'm calling 657 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:56,720 it the poker dice combat system or something. 658 00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:01,080 And it's been working. So like my players are so 659 00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:05,080 addicted in the best of ways to this that it's, it's ridiculous. 660 00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:09,920 They they say we don't ever want to play any other combat system 661 00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:13,480 other than because they they're, they're like for instance, they 662 00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:17,040 have one of them has a warrior and the warrior has like a cool 663 00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:19,080 unique item. And the unique item does 664 00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:21,440 something when when you roll a full house. 665 00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:24,840 And then they're they're built, does something when they roll a 666 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:27,440 sequence. And so they're always trying to 667 00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:30,440 like, it's really cool. It's really an addictive kind of 668 00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:36,600 like gambling almost mechanic. So it works really, really well, 669 00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:39,960 I think, yeah. Yeah, that's pretty cool. 670 00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:44,520 The game is called you. Your tagline is that it's like 671 00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:48,360 an old school brawler. And is that like, is that 672 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:51,480 brawler kind of label inspired by how combatants are playing 673 00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:55,960 out or? I think so I think that these I, 674 00:39:56,040 --> 00:40:00,800 I, I think that most old school games are pretty much trying to 675 00:40:01,240 --> 00:40:05,320 replicate that kind of like video game ish vibe where you're 676 00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:07,240 actually going into dungeons and. 677 00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:09,760 Slaying monsters and retrieving glutes. 678 00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:12,960 And that's kind of like how I envision these things. 679 00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:17,200 So I don't necessarily envision these games with, you know, very 680 00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:22,640 dramatic personal arcs or or, you know, lots of of drama and 681 00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:24,800 stuff like that. I think that other games do that 682 00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:26,880 better. So when I think of these, I 683 00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:30,080 think about, you know, going into dungeon remote places and 684 00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:32,440 fighting Wizards and monsters and that kind of stuff. 685 00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:35,440 So for me, that's, that's what it is. 686 00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:38,520 It's a fantasy brawler. That's that's, that's what I 687 00:40:38,720 --> 00:40:44,240 what I think of it, yeah. Yeah, and you so yeah, the 688 00:40:44,240 --> 00:40:47,280 dicing is I mean, I can imagine why people really like that. 689 00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:50,080 It's one of the things that I really like about the inventory 690 00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:53,120 system with Mazda and and what you have here is that it it 691 00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:56,520 creates a system that kind of forces you to be present kind of 692 00:40:56,520 --> 00:40:59,200 in what you're doing, but also has that tactility to really 693 00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:01,280 like pull you into it as well. Like you're not going to be 694 00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:02,800 sitting on your phone when you're also, when you're 695 00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,600 instead, you know, looking at like your inventory tokens and 696 00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:07,920 things like that. And the dice mechanic feels the 697 00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:10,360 same way where like every time you roll, it's not just like, 698 00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:12,760 oh, I, I, I rolled an 18 or whatever. 699 00:41:12,760 --> 00:41:15,040 It's like, you have to be like, no, like I also got these two 700 00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:16,920 and then this. And so I put A2 pairs together 701 00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:18,920 and it did a whole thing. So I feel like it, it really 702 00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:21,360 pulls people more mercifully into the mechanics, which sounds 703 00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:22,080 really interesting. Yeah. 704 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,160 It's like rolling dice is fun again. 705 00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:29,840 That's what I realized. And this is yeah, this. 706 00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:32,480 So as you would say, oh, I don't, I cannot show this 707 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:35,400 because my screen can you, can you show the the character 708 00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:37,600 sheets? Yeah, Ryan, I'm on the Warrior 709 00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:38,400 one right now. Yeah. 710 00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:43,440 So, but, but you have them, do you have them there physically? 711 00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:47,640 Oh, yes, absolutely. Because I'm trying to show them, 712 00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:51,200 but they're like because of the background. 713 00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:54,920 So you have the character sheet. Those are the player reference 714 00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:57,440 booklets. So each these are the the stuff 715 00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:01,280 that you give to, to a, to a player that's playing a Druid, 716 00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:03,040 for instance, that's the one that you're showing. 717 00:42:03,240 --> 00:42:05,560 And it has all the stuff that you need to play a druid that 718 00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:09,600 that's the thinker. So that's all, all the stuff 719 00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:13,520 that you need to play a Druid is is basically here in this, in 720 00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:16,520 this in this booklet. And then do you have the 721 00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:19,640 character sheets also? So not not the those aren't like 722 00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:21,280 the player book list. Would you have the character 723 00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:24,640 sheets? If it's in this box, I do. 724 00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:28,640 Maybe your box didn't have them. These guys in the back, you're 725 00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:31,080 talking about these guys. Yeah, that those are the 726 00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:33,280 character sheets. Yeah, they're like dry erase. 727 00:42:33,640 --> 00:42:37,080 And you actually what what you do, what are you doing This game 728 00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:40,440 is you pick up the you see, there's there's the slots there 729 00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:43,240 for the inventory and you have the item cards. 730 00:42:43,240 --> 00:42:44,560 Do you have the item cards there too? 731 00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:46,360 OK. And you have these little 732 00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:50,320 tokens, item cards like you like, you know, a classic board 733 00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:52,960 game and you place them on on your inventory sheet. 734 00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:54,400 And I think that's that's really cool. 735 00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:58,440 So it's like the inventory is really fun and engaging. 736 00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:02,200 I think in flail and it's not I, I didn't invent this, this, this 737 00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:05,920 came from, from my work and, and the work that, that, that I did 738 00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:07,760 with, with Isaac Williamson, mouse Raider. 739 00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:12,120 But I think that also in flail, the combat is really, really 740 00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:15,320 engaging and really fun and, and rolling the dice and you're like 741 00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:17,640 really, you know, hoping to get a combination. 742 00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:21,560 And I had like really incredible moments where with this, where I 743 00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:24,600 was like, there was once that that I had, I designed kind of 744 00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:26,400 like a tomb of horrors sort of thing. 745 00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:31,040 It was like a goblin goblin. It was not, it's not that one, 746 00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:36,960 but it's like a goblin merchant built like a cruel funhouse, 747 00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:39,720 Playhouse or whatever. And he was paying people to go 748 00:43:39,720 --> 00:43:43,840 in and if they were able to come out, they would be rewarded with 749 00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:47,200 some sort of like unique item or a special magic item or 750 00:43:47,200 --> 00:43:49,960 whatever. So my players went went in and 751 00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:52,720 then they're in one of the last rooms. 752 00:43:52,720 --> 00:43:59,280 The like a big boss creature, like it was a massive Peacock, a 753 00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:02,640 Ruby plump Peacock. And I and I really hyped the 754 00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:05,640 encounter with lots of words, lots of gestures. 755 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:09,120 I think like, you know, you're completely, I was trying to 756 00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:12,160 convey that you're completely fucked now to, to to to my 757 00:44:12,200 --> 00:44:15,920 players. And then like the warriors said, 758 00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:20,240 OK, I'll hit and instantly rolled that blow. 759 00:44:20,640 --> 00:44:24,520 So rolled 3 ones and I was like, I never felt so silly in my life 760 00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:26,640 as the GM. I was like really hyping this. 761 00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:30,160 And like, all of a sudden, you know, the big bird is, is gone. 762 00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:35,560 And I think that it's probably one of the only games out there 763 00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:37,960 that does something like this. And I think that's cool. 764 00:44:37,960 --> 00:44:42,120 You know, it's a, it's a It's a new way to to have fun with this 765 00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:44,240 sort of thing, I think. Yeah. 766 00:44:44,720 --> 00:44:46,520 It's great because those are the kind of things that people are 767 00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:48,000 going to talk about like 6 months from now. 768 00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:49,680 They'll be like, remember when you killed that Peacock? 769 00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:51,560 Next time you see there's like a Peacock rocket on the road, 770 00:44:51,560 --> 00:44:54,560 you'd be like, the warrior pulls out like a giant Peacock feather 771 00:44:54,560 --> 00:44:55,880 or something. You're like, yeah, that's right. 772 00:44:55,880 --> 00:44:57,760 I did this. So you know it. 773 00:44:57,800 --> 00:44:59,280 Yeah. It's, it's a game that that 774 00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:01,360 definitely sounds fun and definitely sounds like it. 775 00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:04,200 It, it is serious, but doesn't take itself seriously, which is, 776 00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:06,200 which is exactly what you want from a game. 777 00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:09,800 One thing that I, I did notice about the, the customizations 778 00:45:09,800 --> 00:45:12,720 too, that I like a lot. And I know that hunter scoffed 779 00:45:12,720 --> 00:45:17,120 when I said destiny last time, but these talent trees are 780 00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:18,920 fantastic. I love. 781 00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:21,800 So talk to me about kind of like when you're making a character, 782 00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:23,920 when you get to this combat talent tree, because on the 783 00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:26,680 warrior I'm looking at right now, there's four different 784 00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:29,440 options. And then within that there's a 785 00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:31,120 whole tree of talent. So how? 786 00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:32,600 How does that kind of get incorporated in the? 787 00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:38,960 Game so the each each glass has at least one skill or one part 788 00:45:39,040 --> 00:45:42,120 of of it that is really customizable, right. 789 00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:45,200 So in the case of of the Bart, for instance, and I'll get to 790 00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:48,200 the worry, but in case of the Bart, you're you're going to be 791 00:45:48,200 --> 00:45:52,200 choosing your music instruments and you're also going to be 792 00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:54,360 choosing some stuff from other classes. 793 00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:59,600 So a Bart can choose a wizard's spell or a thinker's gadget or a 794 00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:01,440 cutthroat tiffing talent per level. 795 00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:04,520 But mostly it's the customization comes from from 796 00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:08,200 the the music, the music instruments that they choose. 797 00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:11,360 So this will make and there's a bunch of them like a thin 798 00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:13,120 whistle of spontaneous combustion. 799 00:46:13,120 --> 00:46:16,160 I think it's my favorite 1. You can imagine what that does, 800 00:46:16,520 --> 00:46:18,960 obviously. And the thing with the bar 801 00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:22,640 that's cool is that when they fail to perform the instrument, 802 00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:25,680 the instrument still plays, but it does completely random 803 00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:28,240 things. So you can instantly combust 804 00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:30,840 your, your your friend or ally or whatever. 805 00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:33,360 So that's, that's something that that I found. 806 00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:36,440 I find very Bard like in the sense that bards are supposed to 807 00:46:36,440 --> 00:46:40,200 annoy other player characters. So that's, that's, that's what I 808 00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:44,280 tried to do here, But you know, you, if you're a cutthroat, you 809 00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:47,280 have to choose your Guild and that comes with a bunch of 810 00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:50,480 different ways that you can spend your, your, your, your, 811 00:46:50,840 --> 00:46:54,640 your cutthroat or guilt tokens. The cleric, you're going to have 812 00:46:54,640 --> 00:46:59,040 to choose the religion and that will impact the prayers, slash 813 00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:02,440 spells that you have access to in the druid class. 814 00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:06,200 You, you're going to choose primal gifts from different 815 00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:09,720 animal kingdoms. So there's five animal kingdoms 816 00:47:10,200 --> 00:47:12,200 and you're going to choose, you're going to be choosing 817 00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:15,440 primal gifts from, from, from these kingdoms. 818 00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:20,280 You can choose from anyone. And then the, when you shape 819 00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:24,040 shift into a beast into a large animal, you're going to be shape 820 00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:28,160 shifting into, into, into, into an animal that belongs to the 821 00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:30,200 Kingdom in which you have the most gifts. 822 00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:33,960 So that's also, and it can also evolve because you can have more 823 00:47:33,960 --> 00:47:37,800 gifts on one animal Kingdom at level 1, but then at Level 3, 824 00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:40,600 it's another Kingdom that that we invested in. 825 00:47:40,600 --> 00:47:42,760 So this can change and I think that's cool. 826 00:47:43,240 --> 00:47:46,720 And then the wizard has to choose like a wizard master to 827 00:47:46,720 --> 00:47:48,800 apprentice under. And there's a bunch of them you 828 00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:52,800 can choose from and they give access to custom spells that can 829 00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:56,800 only be accessed by choosing that that master and the 830 00:47:56,800 --> 00:47:58,560 warrior. What I did with the warrior to 831 00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:03,080 make it customizable and, and, and to make, to make the warrior 832 00:48:03,080 --> 00:48:08,520 different from table to table or from, from game to game is 833 00:48:08,520 --> 00:48:12,480 precisely that combat talents thing that, that, that you 834 00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:15,960 mentioned. The idea being there's four. 835 00:48:15,960 --> 00:48:20,720 It's if, if people play Diablo, the computer, the video game, 836 00:48:20,720 --> 00:48:24,960 it's kind of what, what, what it is in, in, in in a sense. 837 00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:30,120 So they have to choose one basic, the basic telling from 838 00:48:30,120 --> 00:48:34,600 one of those trees at level 1. And each tree is connected or 839 00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:36,600 associated with a different type of weapon. 840 00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:40,600 So there's one for for one handed weapons, there's another 841 00:48:40,600 --> 00:48:44,120 for bigger weapons, 2 handed weapons, The third one I think 842 00:48:44,120 --> 00:48:46,160 it's for bows. And then there's another one 843 00:48:46,560 --> 00:48:49,200 that it's I think it's called the martial artist. 844 00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:52,320 And it only works if if the warrior attacks bare handed, 845 00:48:52,320 --> 00:48:54,480 which which I think is is also funny. 846 00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:58,080 So at level 1, the player will hot will choose one of the one 847 00:48:58,080 --> 00:48:59,920 basic talent from one of these trees. 848 00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:04,400 And then at level 2, they can go down these trees and become an 849 00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:08,720 expert in this, in this combat tree and then a master or they 850 00:49:08,720 --> 00:49:11,840 can they can choose another tree and they become more of an all 851 00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:14,560 around sort of worry. So I think what what is cool 852 00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:18,120 here is that if you want your warrior to be really specialized 853 00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:22,160 in bows, you can be like a total maniac with bows. 854 00:49:22,160 --> 00:49:26,000 And that's possible with this game or with two handed weapons. 855 00:49:26,920 --> 00:49:30,480 But if you also want to be more of an all around sort of warrior 856 00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:34,680 that is kind of good with bows, but also kind of good with 857 00:49:34,680 --> 00:49:37,600 smaller weapons, it's also possible with this game. 858 00:49:37,600 --> 00:49:40,320 And I think that's that's what makes it cool and unique. 859 00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:42,400 I I would say yeah. Yeah. 860 00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:46,000 I mean, not only that the the you said customization, you got 861 00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:50,120 a lot of it because if people were keeping count as we went, 862 00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:53,920 that's eight different character classes, right, Plus all the 863 00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:56,600 customization. So even just like you said, if I 864 00:49:56,600 --> 00:49:58,960 build a warrior and hunter build a warrior a couple levels in, 865 00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:02,240 statistically it is incredibly unlikely that we have the same 866 00:50:02,240 --> 00:50:07,080 character, which is fantastic. And then how did you did you 867 00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:11,680 worry about I know this is this word gets gets disdained a lot. 868 00:50:12,040 --> 00:50:14,920 Did you worry about balance at all with the asymmetry of the 869 00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:19,160 classes or are they is a game kind of built in a way where it 870 00:50:19,160 --> 00:50:22,400 doesn't? There's only so much that you 871 00:50:22,400 --> 00:50:24,880 can do with each one so none of them like is really game 872 00:50:24,880 --> 00:50:29,000 breaking or anything. I mean, I, I didn't worry too 873 00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:33,080 much, but I've been playing this game for like 1 year now and 874 00:50:33,080 --> 00:50:39,400 it's kind of like the way I treat this is like the 20th 875 00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:42,080 version of each class as you can imagine. 876 00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:45,920 So like it came, it came to a point where I didn't feel the 877 00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:49,120 need to keep tweaking them from session to session. 878 00:50:49,120 --> 00:50:51,560 So it kind of felt like this was okay. 879 00:50:51,880 --> 00:50:56,640 I think there might be some classes that are more powerful 880 00:50:56,640 --> 00:50:59,760 than others, but I think that they're all fun and engaging in 881 00:50:59,760 --> 00:51:03,160 one way or another to play. So I think that's enough for me. 882 00:51:03,160 --> 00:51:07,560 And one thing that I really like about this design and game is 883 00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:13,760 that right from level 1, the players, the characters, they 884 00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:16,680 can do a lot of stuff. They have a lot of tools. 885 00:51:16,680 --> 00:51:20,960 They have like each class has four different skills that can 886 00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:24,080 be particularly powerful. And they have access to, you 887 00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:27,040 know, cool weapons, cool skills, this customization. 888 00:51:27,040 --> 00:51:29,800 They have a lot of tools. They have a lot more tools than 889 00:51:29,800 --> 00:51:34,800 average at their disposal right at level 1 to start playing the 890 00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:38,040 game. And I know that some people 891 00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:42,640 might find this a bit, that they're a bit overpowered, I 892 00:51:42,640 --> 00:51:45,360 would say. But one thing that I like about 893 00:51:45,360 --> 00:51:48,800 this game, this game is that yes, you can be a bit more 894 00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:53,040 powerful or a bit more overpowered than the average OSR 895 00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:58,560 game, but you're only always one that blow away from complete 896 00:51:58,560 --> 00:52:00,920 strategy. And it doesn't matter if it's 897 00:52:00,920 --> 00:52:05,040 like you can be hit by that blow, but you can be hit with a 898 00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:09,800 that blow by like the weakest gobbling in in the pack and 899 00:52:09,800 --> 00:52:13,000 that's it. You know, so it's what I like 900 00:52:13,000 --> 00:52:16,320 about this game is that players have a lot of stuff and they can 901 00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:21,240 be powerful, but it's also very tense in the way that it can all 902 00:52:21,240 --> 00:52:25,520 go wrong really, really fast. And I think that's a good design 903 00:52:25,520 --> 00:52:32,000 spot to be on, I would say. That's actually specifically how 904 00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:35,280 I like the games that I play like I like when like my players 905 00:52:35,280 --> 00:52:37,560 or that I run my players get really powerful. 906 00:52:37,720 --> 00:52:40,520 But at any point in time, yo, you can still die. 907 00:52:40,720 --> 00:52:42,680 Doesn't matter. You can be the strongest person 908 00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:45,880 in the world, but you know a a knife to the gut might put you 909 00:52:45,880 --> 00:52:50,200 out and. Like in this game, the the hit 910 00:52:50,200 --> 00:52:54,520 points do not increase as as levels go progress as as 911 00:52:54,520 --> 00:52:58,240 characters progress in levels. So it's, that's also another 912 00:52:58,240 --> 00:53:03,200 factor of why I think this, this the game is always tense, 913 00:53:03,520 --> 00:53:06,720 regardless of how powerful the players can be. 914 00:53:06,720 --> 00:53:10,200 And I think that's that's, that's a cool, a cool, a cool 915 00:53:10,400 --> 00:53:13,160 design feature of the game and a cool feature of the game. 916 00:53:13,680 --> 00:53:20,320 And I think that also makes me, I think that aspect also helped 917 00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:24,640 me get rid of something that I never quite liked in, in 918 00:53:24,640 --> 00:53:28,600 adventure design is to create certain models for certain 919 00:53:28,600 --> 00:53:31,120 levels. I've never really appreciated 920 00:53:31,120 --> 00:53:38,120 that I and, and by getting rid of the the hit points growth and 921 00:53:38,120 --> 00:53:42,520 by having this system implemented where everything can 922 00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:46,840 go wrong pretty fast and and powerful creatures are always 923 00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:51,200 powerful and less powerful creatures are always a bit less, 924 00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:55,880 less powerful, but they can always hit you with with that 925 00:53:55,880 --> 00:53:59,000 blow. I think that's that that design 926 00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:02,200 allowed me yeah. To to to not have the necessity 927 00:54:02,200 --> 00:54:05,240 to write modules for certain levels. 928 00:54:05,240 --> 00:54:08,720 And I think that's preferable in my, in my, in my style and the 929 00:54:08,720 --> 00:54:13,040 way I play. I play role-playing games, yeah. 930 00:54:13,680 --> 00:54:16,400 I mean, yeah, it's it's like you said, rules like customization 931 00:54:16,400 --> 00:54:19,400 heavy death is ever present. I mean, there's definitely I 932 00:54:19,400 --> 00:54:21,520 know you said like who knows what the fuck they call things 933 00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:23,080 now? OSR, NSR, it's all marketing 934 00:54:23,080 --> 00:54:27,600 terms at this point anyway. It means nothing, but it still 935 00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:30,400 has some of that OSR ethos, which is not really old school 936 00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:34,920 anyway. But that death, you're not doing 937 00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:37,720 an OC generator so that you can have a character that's gonna 938 00:54:37,720 --> 00:54:40,680 live for six years with No Fear of death at all, right? 939 00:54:41,720 --> 00:54:47,360 When you say DCC, it definitely feels that a little bit of it's 940 00:54:47,680 --> 00:54:50,680 a lot of fantasy tropes which are always inherently like a 941 00:54:50,680 --> 00:54:54,880 little bit goofy sometimes like tin whistle of like of what do 942 00:54:54,880 --> 00:54:56,520 you say? Like a spontaneous combustion. 943 00:54:56,520 --> 00:55:01,280 That's exactly, you know, the bringing the fun into a game. 944 00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:04,360 You know, it's a game that like I said, it it it sounds like it 945 00:55:04,560 --> 00:55:06,840 it can be serious, but it doesn't take itself seriously. 946 00:55:06,840 --> 00:55:08,720 Like it's fun. The dice mechanics bring back 947 00:55:08,720 --> 00:55:12,440 the fun. The inventory is fun and and 948 00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:15,240 yeah, I can imagine literally being the guy that kills like 949 00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:17,840 the the Peacock with a three roll or whatever and the very 950 00:55:17,840 --> 00:55:19,960 next session, yeah, a goblin just like poking me with a 951 00:55:19,960 --> 00:55:21,640 little dagger and I immediately die like. 952 00:55:21,960 --> 00:55:23,440 That's. That's fun. 953 00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:25,000 That's fun. I mean, I guess it's not gonna 954 00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:28,800 be fun to some people, but for, for for the people that that 955 00:55:28,800 --> 00:55:31,080 this genre is geared towards like this is fun. 956 00:55:31,080 --> 00:55:34,000 This is like fun fantasy. This is like a game that I, I, I 957 00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:39,080 really want to play. So, so, so Flail's coming out 958 00:55:39,080 --> 00:55:41,800 soon. It is heading to, it's going to 959 00:55:41,880 --> 00:55:44,200 be a backer kit, right? Backer kit, correct? 960 00:55:44,200 --> 00:55:45,080 Yeah. So. 961 00:55:45,120 --> 00:55:47,160 So how long do we have until until that drops? 962 00:55:47,160 --> 00:55:50,680 Because you have a date now. It's the 7th of April. 963 00:55:51,360 --> 00:55:55,440 OK, that's when the the campaign goes live. 964 00:55:56,680 --> 00:56:01,480 And if people are curious about this game, you only need to 965 00:56:01,480 --> 00:56:06,120 follow the backer kit page and you can download the game, the 966 00:56:06,120 --> 00:56:10,360 rule book entirely for free. It's it's beauty. 967 00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:14,200 Just take it. It's the the rule book has 120 968 00:56:14,200 --> 00:56:17,880 something pages and I've decided to just give it for free to 969 00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:20,880 everybody who follows the page. And there's also a bunch of like 970 00:56:21,600 --> 00:56:25,000 cool resources. So if you go, if you go to 971 00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:31,880 gamesomnivorous.com and you click on Flail, there's a 972 00:56:31,880 --> 00:56:37,000 resources folder you can, you can follow through by going by 973 00:56:37,000 --> 00:56:40,760 going through there. There's a resources folder that, 974 00:56:40,880 --> 00:56:45,520 that, that, that has character sheets, hexcroll maps, hexcroll 975 00:56:45,520 --> 00:56:50,120 sheets, hireling and construct sheets, all the item cards for 976 00:56:50,120 --> 00:56:53,560 print at home, the player reference booklets, a bunch of 977 00:56:53,560 --> 00:56:56,040 quest scenarios and, you know, a bunch of stuff. 978 00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:57,840 So it's completely free. You can take it. 979 00:56:58,040 --> 00:56:59,840 That's that's, that's what it is, yeah. 980 00:57:01,280 --> 00:57:03,040 We already talked about that a little bit like this is how you 981 00:57:03,040 --> 00:57:04,720 build a community. You make a sick game that people 982 00:57:04,720 --> 00:57:07,040 are going to want to play. You make it where people can 983 00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:10,360 actually play it. And then people will like your 984 00:57:10,360 --> 00:57:12,600 game and play it and make stuff for it, which will just make 985 00:57:12,600 --> 00:57:15,640 people like your game and make stuff and, and, and play it. 986 00:57:15,640 --> 00:57:18,520 So like this is, you know, it, it sounds like you're wanting to 987 00:57:19,920 --> 00:57:23,720 fail to exist so that you can play it and build community with 988 00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:25,320 it. Is that kind of like one of the 989 00:57:25,320 --> 00:57:27,720 focuses for it? Yeah, yeah, for sure. 990 00:57:27,720 --> 00:57:34,120 That's, that's, that's I, I think that I mean, myself as a 991 00:57:34,120 --> 00:57:38,520 creator, I never really developed that. 992 00:57:38,640 --> 00:57:42,960 I, I, I was never really involved in the, this community 993 00:57:42,960 --> 00:57:48,360 building aspect of, of, of, of the industry, let's say, because 994 00:57:48,400 --> 00:57:52,440 I with mouse rater, it was mostly Isaac doing that. 995 00:57:53,120 --> 00:57:58,560 And then people like Matt Morris came and help obviously, but it 996 00:57:58,560 --> 00:58:01,360 was, was very much Isaac doing for frontier scum. 997 00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:05,000 It was Carl Druid building that community and doing that. 998 00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:08,400 Obviously I was always behind the scenes supporting and doing 999 00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:12,840 work for it and, and doing what I could to make the, the, this 1000 00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:16,720 community grow and flourish. But I was never really the face 1001 00:58:16,720 --> 00:58:20,240 of it or, or the main creator or you know what I mean? 1002 00:58:20,240 --> 00:58:24,440 It's like I was, it was something that I was not 100% 1003 00:58:25,000 --> 00:58:29,320 involved in as like the, as leading that process. 1004 00:58:29,320 --> 00:58:32,840 And now that I, when I decided to do flail, I decided that I 1005 00:58:32,840 --> 00:58:38,440 was going to, to, to do that. I was finally going to myself as 1006 00:58:38,440 --> 00:58:40,440 a creator. I was going to drive the 1007 00:58:40,440 --> 00:58:43,600 community, create a community for the game and be very much 1008 00:58:43,600 --> 00:58:46,360 hands on in that process and managing it and doing. 1009 00:58:46,360 --> 00:58:50,040 And it's been incredible so far. So I, I have, I have a patron 1010 00:58:50,040 --> 00:58:54,320 now and there's already like, I don't know, 150 people 1011 00:58:54,920 --> 00:58:57,080 supporting. So I, I didn't even know that 1012 00:58:57,640 --> 00:59:00,200 that many people like, like me personally. 1013 00:59:00,200 --> 00:59:04,600 I mean, it was a bit strange to find out, but in a, in a good 1014 00:59:04,600 --> 00:59:08,840 way. And then the discord is, is 1015 00:59:08,840 --> 00:59:13,640 been, is been, we have a discord for at games of rivers and it's 1016 00:59:13,640 --> 00:59:16,160 been going great. Lots of really, really cool 1017 00:59:16,160 --> 00:59:21,320 people coming in, talking about the game, asking questions, and 1018 00:59:21,320 --> 00:59:23,880 a lot of people are already doing hacks of the game and 1019 00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:26,320 building stuff for the game and creating content for the game. 1020 00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:27,960 And it's, it's, it's amazing to see. 1021 00:59:27,960 --> 00:59:32,640 So I, I, I the game doesn't even exist yet, but I've decided to 1022 00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:36,920 create or doesn't exist. It's kind of exists, but it, it 1023 00:59:37,000 --> 00:59:39,400 hasn't been released yet properly. 1024 00:59:40,280 --> 00:59:44,840 The campaign comes in in about a month, but I've decided to open 1025 00:59:44,840 --> 00:59:48,440 a game jam and each game jam for for Flail. 1026 00:59:48,800 --> 00:59:52,320 And there's already, I don't know, 15 or 16 people that have 1027 00:59:52,320 --> 00:59:54,800 joined and that that have their ideas going. 1028 00:59:55,000 --> 01:00:00,520 So it's really, really humbling and and fantastic to see this 1029 01:00:00,520 --> 01:00:04,360 community grow so quickly. And and, and I think that's 1030 01:00:04,360 --> 01:00:10,080 definitely something that hadn't been involved directly yet, but 1031 01:00:10,080 --> 01:00:13,040 I'm very happy to be doing this at this point. 1032 01:00:13,120 --> 01:00:16,160 Yeah, very cool. Well, we, I mean, we talked 1033 01:00:16,160 --> 01:00:19,920 about this on the show a bunch and I won't get too deep into 1034 01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:22,680 it, but this is kind of the difference between making a game 1035 01:00:22,680 --> 01:00:24,400 and making a product, in my opinion. 1036 01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:26,600 Like when you make a game, you've talked over and over 1037 01:00:26,600 --> 01:00:28,360 again like you made this game because this game you want to 1038 01:00:28,360 --> 01:00:31,320 play, you've played it a bajillion times to get it to 1039 01:00:31,320 --> 01:00:35,000 where it is now, to the way that you want to play it. 1040 01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:37,920 And you're not worried. You're not like worried about 1041 01:00:38,400 --> 01:00:41,240 how people are going to you know, you're not making a 1042 01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:44,000 product, you're making the game, you're not making it gearing it 1043 01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:45,440 to what other people are going to want. 1044 01:00:45,680 --> 01:00:47,560 You made something that you enjoy and if other people enjoy 1045 01:00:47,560 --> 01:00:49,880 it, that's great. The PDF again, it's already free 1046 01:00:49,880 --> 01:00:51,120 out there. You've already got a game, 1047 01:00:51,120 --> 01:00:54,640 you've already got it going. It's accessible, it's available 1048 01:00:54,640 --> 01:00:58,160 again, this is this is a game, not a product, and I love that. 1049 01:00:58,160 --> 01:01:00,640 And that's what we tried. We tried to talk about games on 1050 01:01:00,640 --> 01:01:03,520 the show, not products, you know, and this is exactly why 1051 01:01:03,880 --> 01:01:05,760 I've always been a huge fan of yours, but we've always been 1052 01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:07,160 such a big fan of games. I'm nervous. 1053 01:01:07,320 --> 01:01:09,480 You know why you got to come on the show again, you got to come 1054 01:01:09,480 --> 01:01:11,720 on and do an AP of flail here coming up. 1055 01:01:13,680 --> 01:01:17,040 One thing last thing really to to get to the the box that I 1056 01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:19,120 got, which is again great. Thank you so much. 1057 01:01:19,360 --> 01:01:21,840 This is basically going to be what people are going to get 1058 01:01:21,840 --> 01:01:25,400 from the backer kit, right? That's an advanced prototype and 1059 01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:29,760 it's it's only one of ten that exist in the world and you got 1060 01:01:29,760 --> 01:01:32,960 1. So yeah, I really appreciate it. 1061 01:01:32,960 --> 01:01:37,080 Like really it's it's a form of saying thank you for for all the 1062 01:01:37,080 --> 01:01:39,160 support and love. I really appreciate it. 1063 01:01:40,000 --> 01:01:44,040 But yeah, that's that's kind of like what people can expect to 1064 01:01:44,040 --> 01:01:47,080 get. So it's it's it's a box set with 1065 01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:53,040 with the book will be a hardcover book, 120 so pages. 1066 01:01:54,200 --> 01:01:56,640 It will have the player reference. 1067 01:01:56,640 --> 01:02:00,280 Yeah, that's the book. Then it will have the player 1068 01:02:00,280 --> 01:02:04,560 reference booklets, which is the thing that you need to give your 1069 01:02:04,840 --> 01:02:06,520 your player. Like if a player is playing a 1070 01:02:06,520 --> 01:02:08,720 Druid, for instance, just give them that booklet. 1071 01:02:08,720 --> 01:02:10,480 They don't need to open the book again. 1072 01:02:11,960 --> 01:02:13,960 Then there's the character sheets. 1073 01:02:14,360 --> 01:02:18,560 All of them are, are finished. Yeah, they have like a matte 1074 01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:20,640 lamination finish or whatever it's called. 1075 01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:23,320 So they they, they are fitting for. 1076 01:02:24,200 --> 01:02:27,360 So you can use a dry erase marker on them and you can reuse 1077 01:02:27,360 --> 01:02:28,240 them. Exactly. 1078 01:02:29,240 --> 01:02:32,640 And then you have the, sorry, the item cards as well. 1079 01:02:33,320 --> 01:02:35,920 You have the item cards. There's a lot of stuff there, 1080 01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:40,120 like legendary weapons and like armor and gear and whatever you 1081 01:02:40,120 --> 01:02:44,000 can think of. And then there's the adventure 1082 01:02:44,000 --> 01:02:45,280 module. Yeah, exactly. 1083 01:02:45,320 --> 01:02:50,440 And then there's this is the first flail official adventure 1084 01:02:50,440 --> 01:02:53,400 module. It's called town tomb of 1000 1085 01:02:53,400 --> 01:02:55,920 years. And it's like a paranoid known 1086 01:02:55,920 --> 01:02:58,680 inventor designed his own resting place. 1087 01:02:58,680 --> 01:03:04,640 So that's only like someone who could break into it and and 1088 01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:07,560 surpass all the challenges and traps and puzzles. 1089 01:03:07,560 --> 01:03:11,480 Only only only then someone could claim his ultimate price. 1090 01:03:11,480 --> 01:03:13,360 Whatever. So this is this is like kind of 1091 01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:17,480 the, the, the setup and the way I think of modules is it's more 1092 01:03:17,480 --> 01:03:20,040 or less these like it's, it's more or less in the same format 1093 01:03:20,040 --> 01:03:23,160 as mouse rater. I think of them as like postcard 1094 01:03:23,160 --> 01:03:27,560 trifolds. So things that require low prep 1095 01:03:27,560 --> 01:03:32,280 or no prep almost and that you can pull off or whenever 1096 01:03:34,200 --> 01:03:38,840 instantly almost and play them right on on the fly without 1097 01:03:39,000 --> 01:03:41,800 really having prepared them previously. 1098 01:03:42,080 --> 01:03:45,320 And I, I, I think I'm calling these modules now the grab and 1099 01:03:45,320 --> 01:03:48,360 go format. So you just like, if you're 1100 01:03:48,360 --> 01:03:51,520 exploring like a big map or hex scroll and then all of a sudden, 1101 01:03:51,520 --> 01:03:53,800 OK, they found like a tomb or whatever. 1102 01:03:53,800 --> 01:03:57,080 What what can I put here? You just pull, pull out the 1103 01:03:57,920 --> 01:04:00,040 whatever, like tomb of 1000 years and there you go. 1104 01:04:00,360 --> 01:04:03,640 So this is how I've been designing also these modules. 1105 01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:08,080 And on patron I'm I'm dropping one of these modules per month. 1106 01:04:09,560 --> 01:04:11,240 I think there's already three there. 1107 01:04:11,240 --> 01:04:16,240 The next one is coming next week, so I'm dropping one per 1108 01:04:16,240 --> 01:04:19,920 month there. If you pledge like $3 per month, 1109 01:04:19,920 --> 01:04:21,360 you're gonna get this. So yeah. 1110 01:04:22,600 --> 01:04:25,320 Yeah. And I mean this, this is very 1111 01:04:25,320 --> 01:04:27,560 similar format to what you guys have been doing with the Master 1112 01:04:27,560 --> 01:04:30,520 Adventures forever, which I think is one of the most perfect 1113 01:04:30,520 --> 01:04:33,600 divinger formats ever. Like the wide like like a 1114 01:04:33,640 --> 01:04:37,720 5:00-ish style trifold pamphlet. And then you know when you do 1115 01:04:37,720 --> 01:04:39,920 mouse or you get the tokens are are there going to be future 1116 01:04:39,920 --> 01:04:42,480 ones where you get like the token sheet you need for for the 1117 01:04:42,480 --> 01:04:44,080 modules with? With yes for sure. 1118 01:04:44,320 --> 01:04:46,480 For sure, for sure. Perfect. 1119 01:04:47,680 --> 01:04:49,000 So yeah. So that's what what you can 1120 01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:51,000 expect to get from Flail and it's, again, it's crazy. 1121 01:04:51,000 --> 01:04:52,920 The game isn't even out yet and it's out. 1122 01:04:53,120 --> 01:04:54,280 People are already making stuff for it. 1123 01:04:54,280 --> 01:04:55,600 There's already a community built for it. 1124 01:04:55,600 --> 01:04:57,920 You already have like 3 modules that exist before the game is 1125 01:04:57,920 --> 01:04:59,200 out. So that's that's incredible. 1126 01:04:59,200 --> 01:05:02,240 Again, like, you know, I I I can't wait for I mean, I have 1127 01:05:02,240 --> 01:05:06,680 little I get I got one who said guys, but but I'm, I'm I'm very 1128 01:05:06,680 --> 01:05:09,560 excited for for it to be out, for it to exist and everything 1129 01:05:10,440 --> 01:05:14,040 and and for everything that's going to be for the future of 1130 01:05:14,040 --> 01:05:14,760 games. I'm nervous. 1131 01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:16,000 So as of right now, games, I'm nervous. 1132 01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:18,520 This is we've we've discussed already, like it's going to be 1133 01:05:18,680 --> 01:05:20,840 more frontier scum stuff coming out in the next 6 months. 1134 01:05:20,840 --> 01:05:23,440 It's going to be more mouse writer stuff, which is always 1135 01:05:23,440 --> 01:05:25,200 incredible. There's going to be flail and 1136 01:05:25,200 --> 01:05:29,320 then I know the job Did. Did I get the box set for the 1137 01:05:29,320 --> 01:05:34,640 job yet or is that still coming? Out so that's I I've basically 1138 01:05:34,640 --> 01:05:38,160 did everything in terms of the creating the game design. 1139 01:05:38,160 --> 01:05:42,000 Now it's in exalted funerals hands mostly for production in 1140 01:05:42,000 --> 01:05:45,080 this contribution. I think it's going to finally go 1141 01:05:45,080 --> 01:05:48,360 into production I think next week or so ish. 1142 01:05:48,360 --> 01:05:51,720 I, I believe we've already settled on where it's going to 1143 01:05:51,720 --> 01:05:55,240 be produced. So that's that's that's I think 1144 01:05:55,240 --> 01:05:57,600 it's going to go into production very, very soon. 1145 01:05:57,800 --> 01:06:01,040 Probably we're looking at the early summer fulfillment, yeah. 1146 01:06:01,840 --> 01:06:03,120 Interesting. Great. 1147 01:06:03,120 --> 01:06:04,560 It's going to be the Summer of Games. 1148 01:06:04,560 --> 01:06:05,840 Omnivorous is what it sounds like. 1149 01:06:05,840 --> 01:06:08,080 It might be like 3 things for you guys all at once. 1150 01:06:09,400 --> 01:06:11,680 So so that's what's coming up. That is gaming on nervous. 1151 01:06:11,680 --> 01:06:13,360 That's flail. Definitely go back to that. 1152 01:06:13,360 --> 01:06:14,680 I'll make sure. Obviously the links are are 1153 01:06:14,680 --> 01:06:16,760 where you think you are and and everything like that. 1154 01:06:16,960 --> 01:06:20,200 But but for if people are looking for all of those links 1155 01:06:20,200 --> 01:06:21,840 are for games on nervous for everything. 1156 01:06:21,840 --> 01:06:25,680 Where can people find find you, find the Patreon, find your 1157 01:06:25,680 --> 01:06:29,840 website, everything. So if if you go to our website, 1158 01:06:29,840 --> 01:06:34,920 gamesomnivorous.com, you will have everything that you need. 1159 01:06:35,560 --> 01:06:39,080 If you want to sign up to the sign up, the newsletter, you 1160 01:06:39,080 --> 01:06:42,440 just Scroll down until you see a Big Blue forum. 1161 01:06:42,680 --> 01:06:46,800 If you want to check any of the games, the four games that we've 1162 01:06:46,800 --> 01:06:51,280 been working on, you just hit the VR games section in the 1163 01:06:51,280 --> 01:06:53,480 website. If you want to buy stuff, it 1164 01:06:53,480 --> 01:06:56,240 says store, and if you want to support the patron, it says 1165 01:06:56,240 --> 01:06:58,200 patron. So it's very straightforward. 1166 01:06:58,200 --> 01:07:01,560 Just go to givemivers.com and you will find everything you 1167 01:07:01,560 --> 01:07:02,880 need. If you want to follow us on 1168 01:07:02,880 --> 01:07:06,680 social media, we do Facebook, Blue Sky and Instagram. 1169 01:07:07,480 --> 01:07:11,440 That's it. Awesome, Andre it two years has 1170 01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:13,720 been two years too long since you've been on the show. 1171 01:07:13,960 --> 01:07:16,240 You got to come back. Please come back anytime you get 1172 01:07:16,240 --> 01:07:18,960 something going. Just just hit me up and and we'd 1173 01:07:18,960 --> 01:07:20,840 love to have you on and chat with you all the time. 1174 01:07:20,840 --> 01:07:22,800 You are a wonderful person. There's a reason that people 1175 01:07:22,800 --> 01:07:25,360 support you and why you have so many Patreon supporters. 1176 01:07:25,480 --> 01:07:27,320 You're awesome. The stuff you make is awesome 1177 01:07:27,640 --> 01:07:31,080 and and it's really great to see these kind of things still being 1178 01:07:31,080 --> 01:07:33,920 made in the TRBG space, which is is something to look forward to. 1179 01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:35,200 So seriously, thank you so much for coming on. 1180 01:07:35,200 --> 01:07:37,240 We really appreciate it. I don't know. 1181 01:07:37,240 --> 01:07:38,520 I appreciate you guys. Thanks. 1182 01:07:38,520 --> 01:07:40,440 Thanks so much, Ryan. Thanks very much. 1183 01:07:40,680 --> 01:07:43,240 This is one of my favorite shows, so thank you so much for 1184 01:07:43,280 --> 01:07:44,200 having us. Glad to hear it. 1185 01:07:44,680 --> 01:07:46,680 Yeah, it's always nice, the weather. 1186 01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:49,640 We're on the list of anyone's favorite shows. 1187 01:07:51,040 --> 01:07:54,120 Anyone who watches us at all is is is great, but we appreciate 1188 01:07:54,120 --> 01:07:55,720 it when Someone Like You. So thank you. 1189 01:07:55,720 --> 01:07:56,960 So that's going to be us for today. 1190 01:07:57,320 --> 01:07:59,560 Again, go back, flail, click the links below, do all that kind of 1191 01:07:59,560 --> 01:08:01,560 stuff and thank you so much. Have a good day everybody. 1192 01:08:01,560 --> 01:08:02,680 Bye. Bye.