Hello and welcome to the Weekly Scroll Podcast.
My name is Ryan and joining me today is the wonderful Will
Yost. How are you doing today, Will?
Hey, I'm so glad to be here and I have like a big reveal that I
have been saving, but I just want to show you that we're
wearing the same clothes right now.
Oh shit, we are wearing the same shirt, wearing the same dark
wizard. Is that why you turned your
camera off every time you stood up?
So that I couldn't see that you were the same shirt?
That's funny because you turned it off.
I'm around the bathroom with camera off.
I was like, OK, that works. OK, that's funny.
Yeah, I didn't even notice across the top.
Yeah, I thought a couple times and then, you know, we both got
the smartwatch on. We're matching today.
We're getting. There I just got to throw on a
hat and we're and we're chilling yeah for the last hour plus that
I've been fucking with audio issues the most I've ever had
before stream ever. I somehow in my rage did not
notice that we were wearing the exact same shirt.
But yeah, shout. Out world champ gameco Adam Vass
shout out Dark wizard. While on the call I bought the
new Dark Wizard poster which you can find at the is it a red
bubble? Is it a what?
What's the store called? Let me find it really quick, but
I he did a new like one piece tattoo poster just of all the
one piece characters and I got it.
Today, So yeah, you're a, you're a one piece.
You're one of those. I'm one of the yeah, I'm one of
those. I mean converted by the by the
best, you know, Tyler Chrome Ryan of of Tabletop World.
But dark wizard also did like a Warhammer collection too in like
American traditional tattoo style.
I'll send. You a picture?
OK, now you now now you got me one piece.
I'm like man, but like when you said Warhammer, I'm I'm I'm on
it. But OK, so will Yobst.
For those who may not know who the heck you are, who the heck
is Will Yobst? I'm a tabletop designer,
publisher, writer. I'm 1/2 of Good Luck Press with
Sub Pines. You might be familiar with my
recent games like this. Discord has Ghosts in it, A
Black Mass, and the forthcoming plasmodics Mutant Freaks in the
Weird Future. I've edited lots and lots of
games. Most recently I provided.
Yeah, there's a huge stack. Fuck yeah.
Most recently, I provided a couple comments in the Neopets
alpha that's on Google Docs right now.
So look, just to date this recording right now, it's that
was like yesterday. It makes me happy now.
And it's, it's, it's so, I love that everyone is just doggone.
It's so bad. They're like, how are we using
5E, which at its core is just a combat simulator for Neo pets of
all things? We indeed tabletop social media
kind of needed this as a family, like we needed this moment.
So this this is good. Just everyone finally like on
the same page about one thing briefly.
We can kind of blast off on this one.
This is OK, but yeah, I I think I like my design sensibilities
kind of embody kind of the weekly scroll vibe of like being
as widely played as possible and not like looking for
inspirations not just in only in DTTRP GS, but like far filled
with solo games, board games, war games, skirmish games,
etcetera. Yeah, yeah.
And so we've obviously we've said this forever on the show.
We are on Adivast and podcast, but you can't really be an
Adivast fan without knowing Also loving Will Yost with with the
brain trust with, I mean, half the stuff up there that is Adam
is also you. And it's shocking that we are
304 episodes in and and this is the first time you're coming on
the show. I know.
I'm so glad we got to hang out at PAX UA bunch and that was
really great. And yeah, we just clicked so
hard. It was like, I don't this
doesn't make sense on what the hell, but yeah, huge.
I'm a huge Adam Vast fan. Day one, you know, I got Oh my
God, I'm going to forget the name of the game.
The first Adam Vast thing I got was deals with demons.
Do you know this? It was like a little.
There's a collection of red envelopes that you can use for
your TTRPG. That was actually before me.
He's talked to me about those and it's like one of the only
things because I have more world champ than he does and it's one
of the things I don't have from him actually.
The archive, well, I'll, I'll have to find mine and send it to
you. So you have like the complete
archive. But yeah, you can.
Whenever a player dies or experiences like some kind of
horrific event, you give the player one of these little deals
that's in the red envelope and they open it and they decide
what to do. And I saw that and I was like,
I'm going to make Adam my friend.
That's how it's going to go. And so we met at a Zine meet up
at Gen. Con in like 2017 or something
like that, kind of before the kind of Zine seems just heavy,
but kind of Zine. Happy Zine quest, by the way,
everybody. But yeah, you know, brought
backpacks of zine's and traded Adam Shelcon and I, and that's
where it started. That's that's awesome.
We yeah, we talked yesterday. We have an episode that'll come
out on Monday where we briefly go over, yeah, Xenuari is what
we decided to call it because it should be fucking Zen Topia, Zen
Quest, Zen Month, Zemo, all the shit we're like, it's.
Xenuari. That is it for us.
From now on is Xenuari. Also shout out Adam, I'm
drinking a Gator bowl right now It looks like looks like
wastewater. It's awesome.
The PAX Gator Bowl crowd was was ridiculous.
No, my first thing from Adam. It's funny that we're having you
on the show then immediately talk about Adam.
I can't Fuck. I'm trying to remember what it's
called. It was, it was, it was a
collection of small games. There was like 2 Zenes on
Kickstarter that I was just like this couple.
Looks cool. And the other one, Wish you were
here. And the other one.
Yeah. What's the other one?
I Yeah. And that's where we like first
worked together. I I worked on one of our shared
loves as the show Lost. And so Adam has a game called
2815 that's about the, you know, flight hitting the island.
And there's another one called time capsule with a demon
inside, which is really special, like postcard game Adam Med.
And then we work together to kind of flesh it out to be a bit
longer. But yeah.
Adam Bass. What an artist.
What a what a what a guy what a what a what a what a pal.
Going to see him very soon so he's, you know, leaving to go on
tour for a month in Europe because the bastard can't just
be good at tabletop games. She also has to be a bass player
for one of my favorite bands. My.
Friend who's a rock star, Yeah. Yeah, just happens to also, you
know, make some of the best games in the TWG space.
We're going to see each other at Adepticon.
You should go into Adepticon. Where is.
It. It's fucking the Milwaukee, OK,
I want to say Milwaukee. I it's on my list because I know
Adam's going, I know you're going, I know witty goes to and
it's like it just would be cool to go hang all the war games and
and skirmish. DIY heads are so nice.
It's out of control, but I'm like taking a step back from
cons this year because I did like four or five last year that
included a lot of travel and it actually affected me mentally.
And basically, did you know that?
Did you know that this could happen You.
Seemed great at but you know, obviously like the time.
It's different too though, like I mean I worked PAX I guess but
really I just stood around talking about some of my
favorite games for like 3 days so like it didn't feel.
You're really good at it so that you're really good at selling
games in general and it can. PAX is great 'cause it's like 3
days and you're out. But the month before I did Game
Hole which was. Yeah, we, we, yeah, you
discussed game all it sounded great.
You got to go next year, you know, so.
Great. Yeah, but it's funny because I'm
doing the exact opposite. I only did a Depticon of packs
last year. So this year I'm going to like
four or five different things. Like I'm hitting a Depticon, I'm
going to go to under the dice, I'm going to go to packs, I'm
going to go to the between the Cairns con, between the cons.
That's one I like really want to go to and it's just a little bit
too far in Portland. Yeah, I was like pricing out
flight. Sounds like I really want to go
to this. This would be really cool.
Well, it's funny because it's that one's actually the only one
that's close to me because I live in Northern California, so
and Hunter lives in Oregon. Oh, so it's like the closest one
I would get. So every time I go to PAX, is
that exactly I I have to go from Northern California to
Philadelphia at the end of every year.
And yeah, it's planes get expensive once you cross like
the middle of the country, you know?
It's yeah, it's stupid. But it's, you know it, it is.
And then, and you know, I I've flown to Southwest forever and
now they're getting rid of their entire business model for no
reason whatsoever. That's an economic indicator.
I think that is a empire and collapse moment that's last
after like 45 years. Well, apparently someone bought
in a big chunk of the company enough to be able to make
decisions. And that's what happened.
I guess it's they're like, all right, we're we're we snatched
up a bunch of the stock. We're going to start making
decisions. And the decision was let's
striate and pay more, you know, for for the things that that you
fucking want. Whatever anyway, I don't wolf
anyway, Will yelps. So we talked about some of your
stuff, games that we've how many games have yours have we
reviewed on the show? Is it just what we only done?
Torque? I think torque, it wouldn't
surprise me if you talked about some things I've done with AD
like if campfire perhaps. But yeah, I think.
Torque the widest PDF in existence.
It's double, double wide because I use, you know, I use those
like Arctic glasses that are only a thin.
That a thin lines you can, you know, cut out all the
hallucinations from the the snow so you can see the the torque
PDF and. You by formatting it like.
Because it's a, it's a, it's already a sideways A5, basically
the same shape as cyber metal. And then the only PDF available
is in spreads, which is just means that the entire PDF is
this one. It's long style, Yeah.
It's like zooscope. That's what those called.
That when you like are have two binoculars on something and
you're like sliding a piece of paper around zootrope, that's
what it's a zootrope. There we go.
Yeah. I'm just making Zoetropes over
here, but yeah, that's a game that's like half minimalist like
tactics road rage game and then half like free form role-playing
set in like a post apocalyptic weird future kind of thing where
you play drivers who apply their trade in communities and trying
to survive on the way there. Have you Have you ever peaked
gas lands for Mike Hutchinson? Yeah, Gasolines is sick.
I haven't played it, but I did like a big survey of all of the
kind of car tactics games, and that one was just so pretty and
I loved the models that I saw people make for it.
It's cool because I saw torque well before I got into skirmish,
so as soon as I saw gasoline and I was like, oh, that's just
torque with more steps. That's what's happening right
there. I love the like because they
have the a couple placement things including like a throttle
meter deal which is very sick. That would be and that was an
originally Zine quest project. This is one of my specialties
which has kick starting a Zine and then making it over 100
pages. Impossible to be a Zine and it
takes 2 times as long to fulfill.
At least it's just going to. I'm not allowed anymore.
I'm not allowed to do it. You and Adam love those like
cloth mats, the the play mats you because I have the torque on
it. I'll just fucking grab it.
These things you guys love these.
So this is the one I have of yours.
This is the Torque mat, which is great, but Adam has about 18 of
these in his games, all made-up from like got like literally
half those back there have one of these in them.
Yeah, there's Cobwebs has one. We did one for Campfire, which
is like an anthology horror storytelling game.
We did one for a guide to casting phantoms in the
Revolution. That's like a big ass pentagram
and you play inside the pentagram.
Was there one for snow? Oh.
I feel like there is one for snow.
I feel like you play on the mat. It's a mat or a fold up paper or
something because you do play on it.
Yeah, I like having a play space that's specific.
It helps kind of hypnotize people at the table.
Yeah, I mean, I think it helps really bring focus in.
Like, I've never been a person who does theater of the mind.
Like, it's fine, but even when people play, there's something
where we've been on stream and we've done a little bit more
theater of the mind stuff. I'll pull out a posted note and
draw maps on it in my head because my, I have the worst
sense of direction ever. But it's like, so wait, so
there's a door in the front and there's a door in the back.
And then we went this way and then and I have to, you know, at
least do a little doodle or something to figure it out.
So when I always GM anything, I always have physical stuff.
Yeah, I was just running a dungeon last night from Valley
of Flowers in my Mythic Bastion land campaign, and it's a group
that we normally play story games with.
We've started to play more hex crawls and adventure games, and
in this one I found that they weren't exploring enough.
And so one of the solutions was like, I'm going to screenshot
the maps and show you all the doors.
You're not going in instead of like describing that you're not
going like something's happening where I know if you were in a
video game, you would be exhaustively searching this
area. Did it?
Did it make a difference? Yeah, yeah, huge difference.
They they checked it out. They were like, oh, there's a
door here. And it helps as like a game
runner to have players help remind you of the different
exits that there are instead of trying to, like, scan the
description of the room. Describe, you know, are you
going to describe doors? Are you not going to describe
doors? That's a big moment in every GM
slide. It's like I said, I I like
having playmats, I like having battle maps.
Like back when I was actually running 5 EA long time ago, I
even had the whole like TV laid flat into a frame kind of thing
so I could have like video stuff and I bought the things where
you could have like levels. So we did 1 battle in like a
treehouse. So I pulled out all these like
stands that were all different things.
And then people were like, are we going to use like, what is a
square? Probably square times C square?
Are we going to use Pythagorean theorem for like the distances
and stuff? And I'm like, no, fuck that.
Like 8 inches, like 8 inches is 8 inches.
Like I'm not worried about the, the diagonals of things.
But yeah, like, like I said, I, I prefer that.
And you know, skirmish really helps with that because then you
don't really do you know, skirmish theatre, the mind
stuff. So having the play space, I
think you and Adam like set me up to, to lead into skirmish
eventually with like the play mats and like all the physical
DIY stuff and everything. But before we dig into that,
because I'm sure we'll go around to that, let's, let's take it
all the way back. So when were you born?
No. So what got you into teach RPGs
kind of in the beginning? Like how did we, how did we get
here? Yeah, I started experimenting in
college. As as as we all do.
OK. And I had like known in the back
of my mind about TTRPG Dungeons and Dragons.
And I said I actually played like Hero Quest as a child.
And I have this very strong memory of like getting ganked in
a doorway by like a minotaur, which I think is a, you know,
classic Hero Quest moment. But I puzzled out the rules to
at that time 4th edition. I just turned 33 so do the math.
The 4th edition was out just. Just a baby look at you.
Yeah, thank you. I'm I'm, you know, I've been
telling everybody I'm like Christ Sage when it all popped
off. So that's good.
What I'm looking for my year of miracle.
When it all popped off. That's an interesting way
serious for a little guy. JC But I got interested in
tabletop from reading like Reddit posts of play reports and
there was like an earwolf podcast with like Brian Posain
and a lot of other alt comedians where they play it.
And so I got really interested in like the GM ING optimization
part of tabletop RPG is going so far as to like releasing blogs
and doing articles for like gnomes to all about, you know,
here's how you like can bring improv techniques into tabletop.
So I play with the same group that I started with in college.
Like to this day, that's the group that wouldn't go in the
other rooms in this in this castle.
But I basically, you know, you're the same way where you're
interested in DIY outsider art. Interesting, cool, sicko shit.
I was this way with music, with movies, and so it was easy to
graduate from, not that you need to graduate, not making a moral
judgment, maybe I am. But from moving from the Hasbro
D&D experience to more bespoke, strange, interesting, compelling
RPGs, Yeah, that's that was a start.
Yeah, interesting. Strange.
I mean, you know, you guys, you know, we talked about Adam.
Well OK, so then Adam Vast existed and how did you guys get
to start making a podcast and making the sicko weirdo shit?
This is gonna, there's gonna be a lot of wincing in this story.
So I just have to we want to we did a Kickstarter together for
the break Kickstarter project that was like a themed monthly
event for Kickstarter. You might know this thing called
Scene Quest where people make these small magazines or things
like Pocket Topia where you make something can fit in a pocket.
This was like a A1 off that they never did again, where you break
the rules of Kickstarter somehow to make an interesting campaign.
And so our Break Kickstarter campaign.
That we then later referred to, how can you break Kickstarter if
you're not willing to break yourself?
We would. We ran the campaign for a game
we did not know we were going to make.
And each week with different backer input, we would
calibrate, you know, what that game is, what the pitch is, what
the table experiences, what's included.
And each week during the campaign, it's I'm remembering
this like I'm Brooke Hauling like some dramatic memory right
now. Like it's getting very, very
vivid very quickly. But we did a weekly podcast
while the campaign was running. It was a 39 day campaign.
Did you know you could do it that long?
Maybe not. I've seen a 60 someone, some
crazy person did like it was somewhere between 40 and sixty.
Maybe it was all the way 60, but I know it was like 40 and I was
like, why you funded on day 4? You have a long way to go buddy.
But 39 is crazy. It's 39.
We had no idea what we were selling, so we would do a
different episode each week with a different guest.
So we had like Alex Roberts, we had Nathan D Paletta on, we had
Takuma Okada, we had Nell Robond, and they would also help
us kind of calibrate our pitch. And so through that process, we
came with Up with the Game a guide to casting Phantoms in the
Revolution, which is right over there.
And that is AGM less troop style game about revolutionaries in
1790s France summoning demons from their phantasmagoria magic
lamps to destroy the aristocracy.
And it's, it's good. I, we reviewed it a few maybe a
year ago to see like how to do a, a smaller briefer second
edition and I was just stunned with like how good a job we did
with this bizarre production method.
Yeah, no, it's great. It's in.
So when you go listen to the brain trust, like those are the
original episodes as they came out.
And what's really interesting listening to it much later is
and maybe you, maybe I'm completely wrong, but I
recognized a bunch of games you guys eventually made after
casting Phantoms. It felt like that story that you
hear about like picks, all the best Pixar movies were all done
in like 1 meeting like on the back of a napkin.
They had like 6. And it's just like, dude, I feel
like you talked about a game that eventually became Torque in
there. There was a bunch of stuff that
Adam talked about that I know eventually became there's
probably at least three or four more games that came out of the
ideas from that, which was really cool to hear after those
games existed where it's like don't know, like that's that's
you know, that's where it came from.
That's awesome. One of those is Big Grave
Fashion Fantasy, which you can go to biggrave.com for the
Kickstarter that'll be happening this year, but that's one that
I've just been continuously working on since that pitch.
Then that was maybe 9. How long ago that was.
It was a long time ago. It was a while ago.
You've been talking about that one for a very long time.
Yeah, yeah. It will exist.
It will, I played it a lot so someone else must play it at
some point. But but why so?
So take that back even one more step.
Like you, you said you met Adam at this Zine meet up or
whatever. How did you get from that to
running a Kickstarter that turned into the podcast?
Yeah, we exchanged stuff and then Adam invited me on the Wish
You Were Here Zine Quest while I was doing Black Mass for my Zine
Quest on Zine Quest One, which happened.
I want to feel old. Team Quest One happened 99 years
ago and they invited me on to collaborate on a couple of those
games and there was a bunch of like collab projects that
happened there. Adam has always been really
generous with their time and attention and mentorship.
It's just a very cool thing that they do.
I've I went to go visit Adam in between game hall and like
traveling home from game hall and then Adam was like, I'm
sorry, I just needed a second and then took a call just
mentoring like 2 artists that we're working on like AT shirt
Commission for a lot of speech. I was like, you just do this.
Like this is just something that is a is a huge part of your life
and you're so good at it. So yeah, there's this awesome
like counter inspiration that we have on each other where we're,
and you can like feel it in the podcast for sure when we're like
spinning out games, which is kind of the thing we do now that
we just kind of want to excite each other as much as possible
with oblique takes on design ideas and stuff like that.
But I mean, that's, I mean, that's what people should be
doing and that's where the space kind of used to be before.
Like I struggle. I really in my own mind and on
the show, we refuse to call it the indie TGRBG space anymore.
It's much more of the, I call it the small market space because
it it does. We talked about this a little
bit and we're not going to dig deep into it right now because I
dig deep into it now. But like, you know, the a lot of
the space that we currently inhabit, especially the primary
big indie TG RBG space on blue sky is very product focused, not
very like, I don't know, DIY, you know, innovative focused as
as it was, you know, kind of more so in the past, maybe pre
COVID or just after. So it's it's awesome.
Like that's you know, that's one thing that I've always loved
about Adam and always loved about you too, is you guys never
stopped making the weird freako shit, which is exactly the stuff
that I loved. And while we started doing the
show. So we need more of that.
It's I I think a tricky part is that that spirit exists in like
all art forms. Like that's going to come up.
And when you do have a lot of kick starters making six figures
plus on huge I PS like I'm thinking of I, I heard this
phrase the triple I space for for Indies, but like, you know,
your Magpies who are working in giant licensed products.
I don't think you can. They're even in the same weight
class. But there are the sickos out
there, and I'm thinking of groups like You are Beheld,
which has a Zine Quest project out right now making very freako
sicko games designers who just continue to be on their shit.
Like Tim Hutchings, who is just like you.
He'll never so you can never make him stop.
Just going to keep doing it. Jennifer Adcock, Aaron King is
in the chat. They're they're out there.
And I think a little bit of it could be like an optics problem
that there is not a way to, you have to do lots of digging or
just staying very close to the pulse of what's happening to, to
find that stuff out. And the more moneyed
organizations have a way of taking up a lot of air.
And yeah, post Ogli have no fucking idea what what the what
the deal is. I'm just gonna I I've stated my
opinion so many times on the show about that.
I'm gonna let that one go. But so but you so so we've
talked about you and Adam working together a lot.
But you you work. You have your own thing.
You are not world champ Gameco. You are good luck press.
How did that come to be? And you do that with Seb Pines.
Like, how did you guys get together and form?
Good luck, Press. Yeah, we did a Zine stream with
Shelcon who awesome artists I've mentioned a couple times but you
can find all of their stuff on Portable City Is currently
working on the new edition of Swords Without Master by
Unwritten Earths. Don't get mad at me, Epidiah and
Nathan. I forget the name of the
publisher, but we did a Zine stream together, which just
involved us talking about zines, maybe making a Zine on the show,
and then doing a show and tell at the end, and it was really
fun. We did that at the like,
beginning of the pandemic. Additionally, I met Seb at a
Zine exchange as well. Though I meet all these really
important people in my life. Here's the lesson you got to
take away from today's episode. Go to a Zine exchange.
You meet the most important people you'll ever meet.
Nurture the friendships. I got to I got to get I'm I am,
I am in an awful part of the country and I got to get to a
better part eventually and and actually meet some some people
that have culture besides red hats and white pickup trucks.
Yeah, but anyway, so so Z meet up.
Yeah, we, we met there and then we started collaborating on
stuff and mostly just like combining our shared interests
of games and both looking for a way to fund our work and make
our work. So Good Luck Press.
I like to compare it to like a boutique repertory theater that
you'd go to, you might not know what the movie is that's
playing, but you know that it was curated and it's interesting
and it's going to like be surprising in some fundamental
way. And so if you go to
goodluckpress.co right now, you'll kind of see here's
everything playing right now at Good Luck Press.
And there's a lot of like inventive mechanics all over the
place. There's a lot of challenging
themes. Recently said released We Shall
be Monsters, which is like a Mary Shelley's Frankenstein
inspired solo game where you're designing the perfect partner
and in the process you kind of destroy your own conception of
yourself and them for trying to even create such a thing such
like devastating. You've got like my upcoming game
Plasmodics, which is if you we had a we got a advanced reader
copyright here. Look at the app on the camera.
Look at that, look at that. Let me turn up that saturation a
little bit. You really gotta see that I.
Certainly did. Yeah, there we go.
That's nice and bright. That's what it really looks
like, yeah. Yeah, now that looks like RGB.
I guess I'm seeing an RGB, which is it was just great.
But anyway, that's my kind of love letter to 1st edition Gamma
World. And it's as if you put it in the
microwave for 90 minutes and then huffed on the fumes of of
whatever's left. Are you about to pull out a
first edition of Gamma World right now?
Why would I have that? Would I have the 1st edition of
Gamma World? Oh, I don't even have one.
That's it's going to be my gift to myself when I when it comes
to that. That looks so good.
Wow. Yeah, I spent too much money on
it. It looks, but it's there.
I also have I also have a boot hill.
Hey, we got to play go over here.
Oh, I want it really bad, especially because I kind of.
Nice. I got to meet, I got to meet Mr.
Traveller, Mark Miller at Game Hulk on.
That was my highlight. I want to reach out and be like,
come on, the show really bad. We've been meaning to do like a
so part Traveller episode for so long, but I made a game that is
like indirectly kind of like a grand great grandchild of Boot
Hill at this point. So like, I really want to play
it. Yes, you're you're remind me the
name. I have a copy.
Death cut in stone. Yeah.
Yeah, but yes, we got to play Boot Hill too.
I mean, I got all these fucking things here still sitting in
plastic so it protects them, and then I never get to play with
them. But where were we tangented
hard? Where do we tangent from game
world? Plasmodics.
There we go, plasmodics. We brought it back.
But yeah, Seb and I, we're going on our fifth year of Good Luck
press. So we've been doing it since
2021 and still going strong. We are full time game designers,
publishers and everyone who does such a thing knows that most of
our day is not doing game design, but we try our best to
make as much as much art as possible.
Yeah, and you also do a lot of editing.
We talked about the Neo pets thing a bit.
How do you as an editor and a game designer, obviously that's
going to cross a lot, but how do you kind of do both, especially
working with somebody else? Do you always have the editor
hat on? You always have the design hat
on? Like do you find yourself
editing your own design a bunch or like does it affect the way
that you design? Like how does that work doing
both kind of as much as you do? Yeah, so I come from like a
technical publishing background. I was like in tech editing for
like 5 years before doing it for RPGs.
And I find that like when people hire me, they kind of want the
mechanically, is this exciting? What's going on here?
Is this connected to like a, a stream of game design?
And I, I'd like to think because I am really widely played, like
I play lots of different types of things, I can recognize what
the authors are going for and bring in my perspective.
So like when I'm editing, you can see in the Neopets open
dock, I guess we should make up a name for who these editors
are. We're we're UN unwelcome to
guest editors. That's that's who we are.
But I'm kind of narrating what I'm thinking, my thought process
as I'm moving through the manuscript, trying to keep like
the author's goals in mind and, you know, being more true to
like what their vision is or as opposed to my personal taste.
Obviously, I cannot disconnect my personal taste from
something. So something comes up that I
think is either particularly like resonant and cool.
I'll be like, OK, here's how you double down and like, make this
a feature, a signature mechanic of your game or like, hey, I'm
not sure you should be able to water board people in the
Neopets TT or PGI. Don't know if it's 100%
necessary. I mean, at this point, why not?
You know what? I mean.
Yeah, why not? Is it the first?
Adventure, like having a battle in the woods or something and
I'm like what the fuck? It's happening.
Drunk too. That's anyway.
Some of these people honestly need to be taken out and beaten
at this point. Why?
Why are we like this? Why are we like this?
I would have let it you know why if I didn't see that at its core
there was some like labor dispute issue where someone was
not getting paid. So I'm like somebody call.
You gotta you gotta hop in. Yeah, I saw that like this work
has also not been paid or whatever.
And it's the whole thing this fucking this.
I'm just but like at the at the end of the day, realistically,
when you see that Neopets is going to be running on 5E like
you, it's got it was always going to be a train wreck like
and I'm so happy. It is such a, it is such a like
we all get to watch it. You know what I mean?
Like it is widely publicized train.
It's not a quiet train wreck. It is for all of us to see.
And I'm very happy at the very least that we get to all see
that together. Yeah.
It's man, man, why are we like this?
But we've. Yeah, through my editing, I've
gotten to work with some extremely cool artists and some
amazing games that I'm super proud of and people all over the
world. So it's, it's a very like
beautiful and connecting part of my job that I'm really happy
with. That's awesome.
And like I said, do you so like I, I found myself having a
problem on the show that I had to not on the show, but kind of
because of the show, because we do, we do critique review of of
stuff. You know, we used to do.
We used to have three episodes where we went page by page to
the books and I still miss those and love those.
But when people would send me stuff, my brain would
automatically click into like kind of that where like my, my
brain would bring up the metrics that we go and, and start going
through it. So I had to train myself to be
like, what kind of feedback would you like to hear on this
before I said anything that was a.
Cute thing I had to learn to do in play testing.
It's like literally that question.
So like, that's an incredible encapsulation of like some
growth that I had to go through too.
So that's what that's what I meant by like being an editor
and a designer and stuff. Like when someone does come to
you with something, do you fight like you find yourself being
like, hey, like just accept it and say thanks, I'll take a
peek. Or like, is that a battle you
have or or have you kind of absorbed that in?
I I think this is best answered in talking about a play test.
I played in one time at Metatopia where it was a great
group. It was an interesting game.
It was like a hex crawl inspired thing.
And during the feedback portion, there was some stuff that just
didn't click with my understanding of hex crawls.
And I asked in the feedback phase of like, have you played
one before? And the designers like, not yet,
Not yet. I haven't.
I was like, I don't have any feedback that nothing I could
say could help, really. Yeah.
So yeah, you always want to make sure you know, the the feedback
that you need to express is why we have group chats and the
feedback that's like the socially responsible safe, I
don't know what like what's acceptable as a form of
feedback. It's always good to like hear
designers goals. What are you trying to do?
And then evaluating on their own stuff.
So what I do in playtest and what I do in edits is just ask
upfront, what do you want this to do?
How's it going to happen? I'm actually gearing up to do
like a book cover review stream, like a clip stream on Monday.
And I made sure that like I only want to talk about work in
progress because evaluating something that's out is like
it's successful, like it's already out.
You know what, that why would I? I think then a thumbs up.
Like what really could you be asking for?
For that? Maybe, maybe that's just my,
yeah, my feeling. Like your view on like.
On what the goal of critique is like, I don't want to just wreck
somebody for the pleasure of wrecking them.
Yeah, I mean, you know, that we, we that's what we try to do here
on the show too. Like we don't, we very rarely
have done in like 300 episodes. I can think of maybe 3 or 4
games we reviewed that we just didn't like.
And most of the time it's because we realized after we had
already like Got Muscle V3 that we didn't like them and we
decided to do them anyway because some of them, and I
won't name them, we should have a counter for the 1
specifically. But it's because we wanted, we
were like, we love so many of these games that are hacks.
Let's look at the original system.
And then just did not really vibe with the original system,
but wanted to kind of understand why.
So we did that. But like we we have acted been
like, no, we won't review this because we just don't like
there's no reason to be mean on the Internet.
I'll be critical. I'll be blunt.
I'll be very honest, but I'm never going to just be mean.
Yeah. Yeah.
Exactly. And So what?
Yeah. So it's like, why?
Why, you know? Yeah.
And then when you like, it's important to mark when you have
those reactions that are like, I severely don't like this.
And here's why. That's for the group chat.
That's like for your cohort, you know, finding like groups of
like minded artists for you don't have to have everything
set in stone on blue sky or whatever it is.
It's very good to be able to fit and it's very necessary.
Yeah, just. The number of times I've like,
thought about writing a message and it's just like, Nope, that's
Adm. That is Adm.
To one of these three. People who will understand and
be just as mad as me and then we can get out of our system and
move on. Yeah, that is that is if I did
not have those one or two discord friends that I know
feels how I feel, it would be a lot different.
I I'm safer on blue sky for those people.
So I appreciate you, but but you know, it is, it is what it is
critique editing. I mean, there's a lot of
discussion about editing critique review, what should be,
what shouldn't be. You know, it is, it is, it is
what it is. I guess at this point, I mean,
there's obviously a very big difference between editing the
editing space and like the critique interview space.
I was gonna say 1's necessary. They're both necessary for,
like, good art, right. But you know, it, we again,
we're not gonna dig too deep into that one.
So one thing we've talked about multiple Times Now is
plasmodics. This is the one that is.
I mean, I have a copy. So it exists.
It's cooking. Everyone else is gonna get
their. I'll get another copy here soon.
Yeah. So let's say what's the deal
with that? Yeah, let's, well, let's talk
about plasmodics. I got, I got a pretty picture of
it now over here on the screen. So what, what is plasmodics?
What's going on with plasmonics and when?
When are we going to get all the all the plasmos, plasmoids and
whatnot? When are we getting the
plasmoids? Well, you've been getting there,
have been accumulating in your bloodstream this whole time.
So that's that's the deal, right?
So this is a sci-fi post apocalyptic adventure game where
you play the plasmodics. These are the mutant freaks that
are in the weird future. Then things you got to know
about the plasmodics is that they're weird in the body with
mutations and they're weird in the personality with nuances.
And so together you, you know, randomly roll up this
collection, this miserable collection of, of powers and
abilities and quirks, and you navigate your character through
the trials and tribulations of the the destroyed and
smithereens world. So Plasmodics is like a system
inspired by Into the odd and cyber metal using mechanics from
both. I think most notably is like
taking a lot of the cyber metal stuff here.
You can see this on the screen right now.
But yeah, I, I think both of them super influential and
important and you have mechanics like Fallout, that's which is a
cyber metal mechanic about the things you do affect the world
around you. So every role incurs some
fallout and I use into the odd like dice mechanics to kind of
make it even more furious and messy and goopy and weird.
Anyone familiar with Gamma World will know about things like the
artifact identification table, cryptic alliances, things like
that. I kind of took the feeling of
playing Gamma World First Edition very closely to the
rules at the beginning of the pandemic with a group of people
in the Braintrust Discord and kind of getting the game
experience out of that and how inventive and interesting it
was. And making a system that more
quickly accesses that feeling than the Gamma World, which if
you have any familiarity, there's like 20 matrices tables
you'd have to use for, for determining like radiation and,
and things like this. So the, there's an adventure in
the back of the book. I'm working on the adventure
collection right now, which is why we're delayed.
I am sending the final version to the editor to work on in a
few weeks. So we are like reaching the home
stretch. I just wanted to make sure that
when this came out there was like a lot of adventure content
for people to use, an experiment and both a challenge to myself
for writing that. We've got art by Zach Hazard,
Vopen behind Artist Find Liminal Horror, and some other
incredible games, including another bug hunt to the cover
for that, a couple other mothership things, and worked on
portraits for mutants that you can see about halfway through
the book in here. And additionally, I did the
layout. We've got editing by Sub Pines
here. There's editing by Seda, who's
an incredible editor for the Adventure Collection.
Yeah, there you go. On the screen we got some
freaking mutants. So the characters end up
becoming this constellation of unique powers, mutations,
nuances, and they all become like jokes or secrets or
surprises to reveal and play. And so it makes for like a
compelling, furious, strange, very human level of gameplay
whenever I get to play this game.
I mean, it's wonderful. How, how, how close is this
going to be to the one that I actually get?
Like I know you said you're working on the event collection.
Is the primary book like done at this point?
And that's what I'm physically holding.
Yeah, that's that. That's awesome.
So I will get 2 I will send I will send Hunter one if he
doesn't have one but. Yes, so the I can talk about
what the adventure collection is.
So plasmodics is the system and plasmods are like the world's
and stuff. So I describe it as like it is a
cartridge you plug in or like a modular synthesizer you're like
connecting to the rules. And so the one that comes in the
core book is called King Tide and that is a sun bleached and
flooded world. That tidal wave comes through
once every few days or once every hour, just like power
washing the world over and over again.
And so the first time it was a disaster.
The fifth time it was like a marvel and like the thousandth
time we began to live with it. We are figuring out what this
world is like and how to live in it.
So it's got like climate disaster acceptance and how do
we move on after things like that?
And so the adventure collection is called Firmaculture, which
takes place in the world of King tide.
But you can put it anywhere. And the assumption there is that
500 years ago, all of the billionaires of our current
world created bunkers to live in.
And each one of their bunkers not only were built to protect
them, but it was also to protect their how, how do you say their
outlook on the world. So to kind of freeze dry and
preserve what these people think the ideal version of humanity
should be. And so when the time is right,
they can release their ideology on the world and themselves.
Yeah, they've been surviving with, like, either cryosleep or
geriatric surgeries or things like this.
The time was never right. They have been fermenting in
their little bunkers and they are cracking open.
And you play the people shucking the bunkers open and finding the
culture rights. They're called cultures, finding
the culture rights, dealing with whatever's inside and
discovering like this intrigue mystery that's going on of where
the like mother culture is. Wow, you're and This is why
we're fans of of you and Adam and and everything that you guys
do like this is first of all, I mean, and people have said
before that art is great. The the graphic design
throughout this entire book, much like how beautiful torque
was, is absolutely stunning, but the substance of everything
you're talking as soon as you said billionaires create, I was
like, wait, wait, wait, oh, Nope, it's just ways to protect
themselves. Like that's wonderful and just
the idea. It's just like, OK, now when the
wave comes through, it's just Tuesday is such a, I don't know,
kind of condemnation on like our current like situation right now
is just like, oh, like we had yet another record-breaking
storm and a bunch of people died in a fire that like raged across
3 States and on to the next news cycle.
Is, is really, really prescient, which is which is and I, I would
say which is cool, but also like horrifying.
It's. Like I like the, the, the
feeling, the vibe that you get from like the places in
plasmonics, or at least I hope is that like, we're going to
keep on just like human beings. We're the same way that we are
now 2000 years ago, 2000 years in the future.
We're there's going to be sarcastic people.
There's going to be annoying people are going to be cool
people, right? It's we're going to act the same
way. And the thing that's going to
change our present circumstances.
And so with this like Klifi stuff, I like to push and torque
was a bit like this. I like to push as far as it can
go and see what kind of not post apocalyptic pessimism we have,
but like how we will live after the human era has ended.
And in doing like research for this, especially about like
bunker dudes and, and preppers, there's this understanding for
preppers that it's three days until cannibalism.
Like when the thing happens, whatever it is, it's three days
before we are tearing each other apart.
When in reality, we see in disaster zones all the time,
even in places where you think this, whatever your preconceived
notions are, that people come together, they collaborate, and
they work to make life better and easier.
And you can find it with like blackouts or like huge
snowstorms happening like this just happens on Earth.
And so the kind of perspective of plasmodics I hope that people
see is that it's a lot of kind of shaking off all these ideas
we had about what the future should be or what the end of the
world should be as the people who are inhabiting that future
and played for laughs, played seriously, all that stuff.
Yeah, no. And you're, I mean, it's really
true. And it's really interesting what
you said. Like everyone expects the worst
at all times. And unless you're 10 people up
on the top of a mountain, you know, with eight feet of snow
around you for days, usually it doesn't get to cannibalism.
Like a lot of bad things happen and you have to get pretty far
to get to cannibalism. But I mean, I live in
California, you know, and and in certain places I've lived,
they'll straight up say, like if this road gets like hit by the
earthquake, there's nothing coming to you.
You got 10 days before anyone will be able to get you.
You're not going to like just because of one O one goes down.
You're not going to suddenly like half a week later be eating
your neighbors like that's. Not how it works.
You're not figuring out like your neighbors weak spot.
Yeah, the worst of the worst will do the worst because that
does happen in natural disasters.
I know a lot of crazy shit happened in Louisiana after
Katrina and everything, but at the end of the day, most people
are at least not the worst people ever.
Not that they're all great people, but most of them aren't
the worst ever. And at the end of the day,
people like society exists and people want to hit an
equilibrium and at least be like, OK, and people will strive
to be just OK together if if they can all be OK.
So that's a really. It's a lucrative business to
sell this idea that the future will not be OK.
That the and these people, there's a book I read called I
think it's called Bunker or Sheltered or something like
that. I'll have to dig it up.
But take all these people, dread merchants.
They sell this feeling that it like we are on a knife's edge.
And you can prepare right now and you can prepare.
There's a right way to get ready for the future, which will be
horrible. Definitely a a right, if you
know what I'm saying idea. But listen, fear merchants are
are are are the way to to accrue in and and maintain power.
So it's not that that's that far off, right?
In in Vermiculture, we've got some of your favorite
billionaires represented, whether they are tech
billionaires or lifestyle Wellness gurus or we've got
we've got a couple. And yeah, this adventure that
you're looking through right now, the cruciform kind of is
inspired by the autonomous robots from Boston Dynamics and
the things they're meant for and the things they're used for and
the things that they the ideas that they sell.
So you there's a big confrontation like a choogy
startup office place this. Choogy startup office place.
You are young enough to use the term choogy.
I'm old enough to be offended by it, but.
It is they would. Does the designers think it's
choogy like that's how they made?
That's funny. I haven't.
It's been so long since I heard an actual person say that, not
just someone on Instagram. That that's funny.
So you said that specifically you you want to make the
vermiculture Zine as a challenge to yourself.
You know, we've talked a lot about the show.
We've talked a lot with like Adam and stuff about it on the
show too, where people will make a game and move on, where I love
games and I love playing games and I love mechanics and I love
systems. But a lot of people like finding
a system and playing with that system kind of like as their
thing, not just, you know, 5E, but a lot of them and people
wanting to support or people needing to support their systems
more. Was that any of the thought
process behind like why you're so adamant to get the adventure
out or or why are you so adamant that you said as a challenge to
yourself that you want to have that done before?
Yeah, to it's a thing that I feel like Indies here a lot,
which is you should support your game, don't just release it and
put it down. So I wanted to have playable
content for plasmodics the more another goal was to let's learn
how to design adventures and let's get like real feedback.
Let's use real techniques and let's test the fuck out of them.
For the case of the adventure of the back of the book
specifically. Like I ran it so many times, but
adventure writing is 100% has nothing to do with game design
in a system standpoint. It is like such a different
skill set. It is extremely fun, very
rewarding, very difficult. And I got into this seesaw
situation where I would figure out how to write it and then
test it and then get to the end of it and then find out that
like I've learned something. So now I have to go back here
and improve it. And then I this like gradual
increasing and increasing of quality and my own perception of
how I think it works and how it should work and my skills
basically improving in real time.
And so part of the delay is like, I simply just got better
at it at a rate where I didn't like what I wrote a month ago.
So that kept on happening. And adventures rock, they're
great. They're super useful.
I used to be like an improv only GM.
And the more burned out and busy I've gotten, the more I've used
adventures and the more I, I'm in awe of, like, how they work,
how people write them and what they can do at the table.
Yeah, adventures are. Interesting.
I think a lot of people have opinions in the space about
adventures. I think we need more good
adventures. I personally am not like.
I think adventures are a good tool to have in a lot of the
systems that I run. I'm kind of more of the improv.
Like you. I really love adventures that
are just give me the people and the places and and we'll tell
the story. You know, I my first game was 5E
and I read a lot of adventures that were just novels with dice
rolls. Yeah.
And I think a lot of my thought about adventures was kind of a
like flipping that 180, like just trying to go run in the
opposite direction of that. But I think adventures,
especially depending on the system you're in, you know,
like, like they're tools to use and depending on what you're
using them for and how much information they're giving,
they're, they're great. And we should have more
adventures in the space. You know, people have opinions
and they put them online about how adventures should be.
And I think if we all meet somewhere in the middle, we'd
all be better for it. But, but I'm excited to, to, to
get to that. Are you, do you think all of
your stuff kind of moving forward, you're going to kind of
try to learn more into design plus adventure or do you think
you're going to be more of a a systems person kind of forever?
Yeah, great question. I think I am.
My stated goal in making RPG's is to make one of each game.
It's kind of part of the project and part of that, like what does
a game include? Conception?
I have really tied, like what is the first session of gameplay
look like for this game I'm making?
What do I want the first session to be?
And I think the more I take that seriously and the more I want to
do experience design, like a little bit broader than just
adventure design or game design. What kind of experiences do I
want people to have at the table?
Some games just feel like they need this support setting, NPC
situation, scenario content and to like harken back to like I
used to be an improv only GM. I'm still improving the same
amount when running adventures. I just have to invent less
crucial idea chunks. And so it frees up a little bit
of processing power so I can inhabit a character better or
present a situation or like manicure the adventure to have
the pieces that I want coming to the forefront and compose or
arrange the composition from a musical standpoint.
But for Big Grave, I want to have like locations and then PCs
you can deal with. I don't know if it needs the
exact kind of room by room description that something like
Plasmodics needs, but I think to answer your question, I'm going
to tune it to whatever the design has in mind.
Some games it will never come up, and some games it'll be like
show me the dungeon straight up. Show me what's underground here.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, like I said, I
think, I think it really depends on what you're doing there.
There are games that are frameworks and there's games
that are experiences. And you know, I, I wish more
people in the space kind of realized that games are genres
and it's OK to not like metal and it's OK to not like jazz and
it's OK to like pop and it's OK to like this other thing.
But if all you do is listen to pop, it's really weird to get
all butthurt about metal, you know what I mean?
So. Nothing to do with each other
like. Right, so it's just like when
all you do is play story games when then butt talk shit on the
OSR like you, I don't know there, there's and vice versa,
obviously very much vice versa. But you know, it really depends
on the system. Likewise hearing some OSR
designers talk about what they think story games encapsulate
straight up spooky. Same way that hearings like pure
story gamers talk about what their impression of the OSR is.
It is like I don't. It just does.
It's not connected to my experience of playing both of
those things. Not to say that those
experiences didn't happen, but. That's the thing that's I mean,
and it's interesting. So like I said, system by
system, you know, I like adventures, but I think I'd
learn more in the systems I play into ones that are more
frameworks that kind of like give you tools and then you Add
all that stuff on versus games that are more like experiences
where you need the adventure would not necessarily need, but
the adventure is part of the experience and having that is,
is really important. So there's never going to be
like a, this is how it works. This is the right way to do a
thing. It really depends on the system,
depends on the genre. It depends on like everything
that you're doing. So like you said, it's really
interesting to hear plasmatics needs more than what your next
game could have. So as long as you're supporting
it with what it needs versus being like, I have to have this
for it no matter what and like shoehorning, I think that's, you
know, that's incredibly important.
So. Yeah, and I, I want to have
permaculture out with the core book.
So it's like I can step back from it understanding like I
made a complete experience here. I can make more if I want, if it
proves that like there's a want for it and a need for it.
But yeah, I'm, I'm excited to have it out there.
I'm also making like a pamphlet adventure called Whale Food.
That is the players are swallowed by a whale and have to
collect the psychedelic ambergris inside before they get
out. And then like inspired by
something Adam does all the time, there's like an adventure
designer notes Zine called Tetrapod that will come out as
well with it. So classic.
One book becomes four books. Classic.
Classic what? What?
So I mean, I don't want to put like a, you know, like obviously
we're not gonna have like a hard deadline on this, but how, how,
how are you feeling about how far along you are?
You know, when can we expect it? Or should we just, you know,
just be patient and then you'll get it when you get.
It oh I just started a new ADHD medication so we're hoping a
lots than I thought about a month ago but that's on.
Vyvanse now or what? They got me on Wellbutrin.
They're calling it Wellbutrin at this point.
Gotcha, Wellbutrin. There you go.
But that's to say, I was so burned out at the end of last
year. When you're running a
Kickstarter and you are late, although you're communicating
all your deadlines, it is a constant companion.
It's like a sword hanging over your head.
It's so cool. It's really good for you.
So that's to say I got super burned out at the end of last
year seven. I took some significant time off
in December to like disconnect from games like Recharge for
what's going to be a rocking and rolling 2026.
I think if everything goes amazingly, it's going to be like
Q1Q2 this year. Nick.
Yeah. I mean, even the end of Qi mean
that's, that's not, we're almost at the end of Q1 now.
So that means not very long. Hey, but then you got to get it
all printed, then it has to get distributed.
Then you got to talk to 100 people that don't have their
credit card information correct and all the people that change
their addresses and you know all of them.
Excited. That's going to be great.
One reason I'll never run a fucking Kickstarter, but I I
love that all of you guys do and I can back them.
I'm pushing towards 800 now. I'm getting there, Yeah.
But Aaron I, the Super backer of damically uses something that
has to end up on air. That is incredible, Aaron
motherfucking King. But, and you said, I mean,
that's when Plasmax is coming out and then you've been working
on your next game for years and years and years.
You have a time frame for that. I want to kick start it by
August. That would be sick.
My goal, I won't kick start it until it's done because I've
been in a cycle that like I think many creators can identify
with, which is asking money for something and then needing to
finish it after you've received the money for it.
Instead of like getting as far as you can and finishing
something and then starting this crowdfunding process.
It sounds so obvious. Thank you everybody.
It sounds the solution sounds really easy, but when with the
financial realities and how development works and how I've
learned that my own development works, it's just not.
It's not sustainable for me anymore.
I can't. I can't be burned out this way.
So I'm going to do everything I can to finish it.
I've got a couple other games in the hopper that I'm excited to
put out, including one I'm working on with Josh Hiddy
called Voronoi Tessellation, which is a megastructure
exploration game inspired by like, exactly.
Yeah, it's a blame game and Ghost in the Shell and other
like super far futuristic abstract landscapes and stuff
like that. So hoping there's some some of
that this year as well. That's a blame is incredible,
like hope you got some big megastructure art in there
because that's really, you know, we're going to pull it in.
That's sick. We have.
Some we have art from a speculative architect who works
at Fullerton. Actually, Speaking of
California, Brian Cantley, his shit is so cool.
So. This is the kind of shit people
bring in. People that are outside the
space that do cool stuff or inside the space, that's the way
to fucking do cool shit. Yeah, I got to explain to him
over the course of like 20 emails what RPGs even were.
So that's. You got to take those 20 emails
and put it in a blog post and just be like, this is how I
taught someone, added. Yeah.
This is how Brian knows now, But yeah, and editing wise, I'm
working on like some super exciting projects coming up,
including Realis, which is going to be so sick.
Very excited to get into that one and otherwise I'll be at PAX
U in November now. December it's only every couple
of years as it in November because of something with like
booking. Yeah, it's like, I think it's
like December. It's like the first week of
December, it's like the 4th or something like that.
Which honestly, it sucked because of Thanksgiving and the
marathon, but man it was not nearly as fucking cold.
The 1-2 years ago I remembered why I don't fucking live in
Pennsylvania anymore, but because I used to live outside
of Philadelphia and again I'm reminded every time I go to PAX
why I don't live there anymore. But I just moved here this year
or last year. Yeah, hey, it's a lot different
than when I was there, which is cool.
It is cooler. It is.
It is maybe my my I'm trying to be less in the past about how I
feel about Philadelphia, but. OK.
You live in Philadelphia now? Oh yeah.
You No, I live in Pittsburgh, but.
Same shit. It's that's right, like I mean 4
hour drive, but you know the other little spot of blue in
pencil Tucky is it gets you there.
It's a quick drive to Paxtel. That must be nice.
Yeah, that was. I got to get there.
I just basically raced Tyler Cromer.
I know him. That's how he did it.
There you go. Yeah.
And yeah, so lots of stuff in the works, lots of stuff coming
up. I mean, obviously, you know, go
grab everything from Good Luck Press.
And where can people find all of these things that we've been
talking about, your future stuff?
And where can people bug you about plasmatics?
Yeah, you can bug me on the comments of the Neopets Open
Public beta, but in reality I'm at Willy Oopst on Blue Sky.
You can also find me at goodluckpress.co.
We got a mailing list link there.
You'll hear about everything if you sign up there.
We've got some really cool stuff planned this year for Good Luck
Press, so sign the fuck up. OK, That's where you want to be.
Yeah. And join me on my quest to make
one of every game. Hopefully I'll make one that you
wanted me to make at some point, so.
Let's do it. Well, I mean, you already made
Torque, so I'm good. Quick question, like quiz
question. What kind of game is this?
What, what, what, what genre have you made this one?
What are you calling that? Yeah, I I guess it's like an NSR
game, but that's not enough really for what it is.
I guess it's like a mutant adventure game could be the
closest. Because I was going to say, if
you're going to make one over every game, I'd love to see the
list of every game that exists so you can you can tell me which
ones. But but yeah, this has been Will
Yolps. Thank you so much, Will.
I can't believe it's been so long.
Hopefully it's not this long before you come on again.
We'd love to have you back. Got to play some games, got to
run some games, got to talk about more games in the future.
So seriously, thank you so much for being here.
Yeah, thank you so much for having me.
I'm so glad we got to coordinate our outfits for the show.
Oh, boom. Look at that.
Yeah, we, we talked before about all this while we were doing the
audio difficulties. But yeah, once again, thank you
and thank you everyone in chat and thank you everyone that
listens, you know, go back all of Will's stuff and we will see
you all later. Bye.