1
00:00:15,290 --> 00:00:17,530
Hello and welcome to the Weekly 
Scroll Podcast. 

2
00:00:17,530 --> 00:00:21,370
My name is Ryan. 
And I'm Christian. 

3
00:00:22,930 --> 00:00:27,650
And today we are going to be 
looking at hammers from John 

4
00:00:27,650 --> 00:00:32,600
Davis of Civic Sanctum, the Bell
Book in Candle Edition, a play 

5
00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:36,000
test of horrific old school 
system tools. 

6
00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:38,320
Yeah, mine's got a little 
signature. 

7
00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:41,080
You have a signed copy. 
Yeah, well, because I yell at 

8
00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,040
John every time he sends me 
something that's not signed. 

9
00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:48,080
Mine's a home print I just drove
my notes straight into. 

10
00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:51,480
There you go, this. 
It's probably scary to anyone 

11
00:00:51,480 --> 00:00:53,440
who's ever had something edited.
This is just notes though. 

12
00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:54,560
I just happened to use a red 
pen. 

13
00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:57,280
These aren't the red is not a 
signifier that these are all 

14
00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:01,200
negative. 
Yeah, you know me, I would have 

15
00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:03,040
to buy a whole nother one just 
to write in it. 

16
00:01:03,760 --> 00:01:06,400
So that's not happening. 
But so. 

17
00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:08,440
So Kristen, you've been on the 
show before, but for those that 

18
00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:12,320
might not know or seen those 
episodes or know who you are, 

19
00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:15,720
who the heck? 
Who the heck are you? 

20
00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:19,560
Why? 
Why should they even listen to 

21
00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:21,120
me or care is what you're 
saying? 

22
00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:24,200
People probably know me online 
as Meat Castle. 

23
00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:28,440
I put out all my game stuff as 
Meat Castle gamewear or you 

24
00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:32,160
might see Christian Sorelli and 
as a name in books for the 

25
00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:34,520
freelance stuff that I do. 
But I've done like mothership 

26
00:01:34,520 --> 00:01:37,360
adventures. 
I edited the Shrike that Leo 

27
00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:41,080
hunt adventure that was like up 
for an any of this last any time

28
00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:43,840
period. 
You know, people can go to my 

29
00:01:43,840 --> 00:01:48,760
website and see, but basically 
editor, game editor, writer, dev

30
00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:52,520
editor for a handful of things. 
But I put up my own stuff as me 

31
00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:55,320
counseled game, right. 
I've done mothership stuff and 

32
00:01:55,320 --> 00:01:57,920
have my own games, cooking and 
things like that. 

33
00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:01,280
But people probably if they're 
in your if they're in the space 

34
00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:04,480
where they're listening to 
weekly scroll, they may very 

35
00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:06,800
well have something with my name
on their shelf. 

36
00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:09,639
I would say Cloud Empress have 
done a lot of stuff with Cloud 

37
00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:11,400
Empress. 
I'm doing some stuff with Watts 

38
00:02:11,400 --> 00:02:14,640
new game Rust wings that's 
coming up now, which I think is 

39
00:02:14,640 --> 00:02:16,520
going to be really cool and all 
that kind of stuff. 

40
00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:18,800
So yeah, I'm, I'm around. 
Yeah, sure. 

41
00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:20,840
Yeah. 
Expect to hear more about Rust 

42
00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:25,680
Wings here at some point. 
But but yeah, I mean, obviously,

43
00:02:25,680 --> 00:02:28,320
you know, I have gosh, I think 
that red box is all you. 

44
00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:31,960
This one right here. 
The Meat Castle Box I. 

45
00:02:31,960 --> 00:02:33,720
Remember the meat castle box? 
Yeah. 

46
00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:37,640
And and like you said, you were 
editing for a long time for kind

47
00:02:37,640 --> 00:02:40,840
of jump back in and ALM is 
still, is still cooking as well,

48
00:02:40,840 --> 00:02:43,280
right. 
It is unfortunately very slow 

49
00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:45,200
last year, but it is definitely 
slow cooking. 

50
00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:49,400
Yeah, that's one of like two 
goals for this year. 

51
00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:55,200
I'm giving myself some more, you
know, less ambitious goals and 

52
00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:58,400
just focusing on like 2 to three
things this next year because, 

53
00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:02,280
you know, it's one of those 
things where life always gets in

54
00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:06,080
the way when you're not 
designing full time. 

55
00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:08,120
You know, for a while I was 
doing this full time and that 

56
00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:09,800
was awesome. 
And it, that was like when I'm 

57
00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:13,600
started and then life shifted 
like it does, especially for 

58
00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:16,200
like indie creators, right? 
That stuff's always changing of 

59
00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:19,320
maybe someone now can do it full
time and maybe they don't. 

60
00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:21,480
And it's like, yeah, but it's 
still very much there. 

61
00:03:21,480 --> 00:03:24,320
I'm actually playing through the
remake of Final Fantasy Tactics,

62
00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:27,640
so I've right now. 
So I've been having tactics on 

63
00:03:27,640 --> 00:03:30,600
the brain again for sure. 
So yeah, still coming. 

64
00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:34,800
Yeah, this is, you said goals 
for the year. 

65
00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:37,600
I don't know why I'm holding an 
egg of of Silly Putty. 

66
00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:39,160
I'm going to put that down. 
I thought it was AI, thought it 

67
00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:44,040
was a weird cherry tomato. 
No, I I got AI got Silly Putty 

68
00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:46,840
to use his like mask for when 
I'm painting miniatures, but it 

69
00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:50,000
came in A5 pack so now it's just
become like a new fidget toy. 

70
00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:52,880
Yeah, a new fidget. 
Yeah, just have an egg of Silly 

71
00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:59,200
Putty in every room. 
But first review of 2026, that's

72
00:03:59,200 --> 00:04:01,200
that's what this is. 
You know, you're the second one 

73
00:04:01,200 --> 00:04:04,880
on, but the first review, but 
you said you got two goals for 

74
00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:07,600
for 20261 is is what's the other
one? 

75
00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:11,440
Well, I haven't made this 
specific list yet, but I would 

76
00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:13,800
say 1 is on. 
I'd say of the if I have three 

77
00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:18,760
want to be getting technicians 
of on at least content finished.

78
00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:23,520
I'd really love to get it like 
text finished and send it into 

79
00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:28,080
layout. 
And then my other two are, I'm 

80
00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:30,680
working on this thing called 
Stranger Stars, which I'm 

81
00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:32,880
calling a Mothership total 
conversion mod. 

82
00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:36,800
The idea of going for like the 
old PC gaming total conversion 

83
00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:39,240
mod thing of like, hey, if you 
have Mothership, you've played 

84
00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:42,960
Mothership, you're familiar with
Mothership, this will be 95% the

85
00:04:42,960 --> 00:04:45,800
same, you know, sort of the way 
people say like, oh, it's 

86
00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:47,480
Powered by the Apocalypse or 
something, right? 

87
00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:51,000
I'm just saying this huge even 
more closely to its mothership, 

88
00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:54,880
but I'm building it around a 
bespoke setting, which is very 

89
00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:58,720
like the opposite of Mothership,
you know, motherships doing the 

90
00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:01,640
anti Canon thing. 
I'm doing the no, I want to I 

91
00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:04,840
want to make Taylor a version of
mothership specifically to a 

92
00:05:04,840 --> 00:05:07,400
setting that's sort of more 
space opera. 

93
00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:11,880
It's really inspired by Eve 
Online, which I know only people

94
00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:14,160
typically who've played Eve 
Online or familiar with EVE 

95
00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:16,840
Online. 
But the idea, the idea of being 

96
00:05:16,840 --> 00:05:20,080
the we found a way. 
Humanity found a way to get to 

97
00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:23,080
another Galaxy. 
And then that wormhole collapsed

98
00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:27,840
and now it's, you know, hundreds
of years after that and Earth is

99
00:05:27,840 --> 00:05:29,000
gone. 
We like, there's no way. 

100
00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:31,320
There's no faster. 
There's not that kind of faster 

101
00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:33,560
than light travel. 
It's like you're not getting 

102
00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:36,120
back to the Milky Way. 
No way home. 

103
00:05:36,680 --> 00:05:39,000
Humans have had to splinter off 
that kind of thing. 

104
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:41,080
So working on that. 
And then I have a game that's 

105
00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:46,480
like 85% done called Void 
Breakers, that's a mix between a

106
00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:48,720
Panic Engine game and Call of 
Cthulhu. 

107
00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:51,920
It's sort of like my ideal 
version of an investigation kind

108
00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:53,360
of game. 
Little liminal horror, a little 

109
00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:55,960
Call of Cthulhu. 
That's pretty much already 

110
00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:58,200
written for the most part. 
So I just need to do some of the

111
00:05:58,200 --> 00:05:59,920
final leg work on it. 
But I'd love to get that out 

112
00:05:59,920 --> 00:06:00,960
too. 
But we'll see. 

113
00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:04,160
There you go. 
And then you can come on, play 

114
00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:06,800
it, show it off, talk about it, 
do all that kind of stuff. 

115
00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:11,320
Because much more system, much 
more system focused goals for 

116
00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:13,360
me. 
Typically I'm I'm I'm much more 

117
00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:16,360
an adventure writer editor than 
than systems where I'm trying to

118
00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:18,240
get a few under my belt even 
though they're way harder. 

119
00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:20,800
Which is funny because people 
who make systems all the time 

120
00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:23,120
feel the other way. 
Like they'll be like, I don't 

121
00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:24,040
know how you guys write 
adventures. 

122
00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:25,880
I can't do it. 
And I'm like, I feel the same. 

123
00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:27,880
The other, the opposite now 
where I'm like, I don't know how

124
00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:29,360
you guys put out systems so 
much. 

125
00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:32,720
Yeah, too much. 
Yeah, I mean, you know, we're 

126
00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:34,880
we're systems. 
We're we're really a systems 

127
00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:36,240
podcast. 
We talked about that a little 

128
00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:39,200
bit before the show started. 
So definitely excited for that. 

129
00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:44,640
I saw you putting out some panic
table stuff for for your mother 

130
00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:45,520
ship. 
Fuck. 

131
00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:47,400
What's it called? 
Stranger stars, Stranger stars 

132
00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:49,320
and definitely very excited for 
that. 

133
00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:51,480
So because I you know, I have 
thoughts on mothership. 

134
00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:54,320
We talked about it. 
It's there it's a game. 

135
00:06:54,320 --> 00:06:57,040
It's right here. 
It is. 

136
00:06:57,040 --> 00:07:01,880
But but yeah, so yeah, that's 
that's Christian back on the 

137
00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:05,360
show. 
I you know, I I can only assume 

138
00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:07,280
you you're going to be on a 
couple of times this year. 

139
00:07:07,280 --> 00:07:09,280
If not for your own games. 
I'm going to I'm going to 

140
00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:12,440
convince you to come on for more
reviews if if Hunter ends up 

141
00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:14,840
getting back into school again 
with all those multiple jobs. 

142
00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:17,560
So. 
Yeah, I mean, I always like 

143
00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:22,280
talking about games, so it's 
easy to convince me. 

144
00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:25,960
It's just it's, you know, it's 
that time zone thing that's 

145
00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:27,160
really good. 
That's true. 

146
00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:29,880
That's going to get us. 
But yeah. 

147
00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:32,960
So today, today, like I said, 
we're looking at hammers. 

148
00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:36,040
This is from Jon Davis over at 
Civic Sanctum. 

149
00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:41,440
Hammers is an old school dungeon
crawler inspired by the likes of

150
00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:44,760
Meatheads, Wolves of Palma Coast
and Troika. 

151
00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:48,800
Hammers was released on Itch 
about a year ago on January 

152
00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:53,080
28th, 2025. 
As I said, this is the Bell Book

153
00:07:53,080 --> 00:07:57,640
and Candle Edition. 
It is a play test edition. 

154
00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:00,120
I want to say that very loud and
clear at the beginning. 

155
00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:05,000
This is not a complete game. 
I don't even know if John would 

156
00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:08,760
consider this an alpha. 
It is a play test version. 

157
00:08:09,680 --> 00:08:13,720
It is a text only rule set. 
There are plans for a future 

158
00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:17,000
version that will include 
artwork, tools for referees, and

159
00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:20,240
a sample adventure, and you can 
find it right now at Civids 

160
00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:23,920
Dash, sanctum dot itch dot IO 
slash hammers. 

161
00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:27,200
And obviously the links will be 
where they are on the Internet, 

162
00:08:27,520 --> 00:08:30,480
wherever you're reading. 
Just Scroll down probably or 

163
00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:34,039
watching. 
And that's, and that's hammers. 

164
00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:41,000
Yeah, quick, before we get into 
no, let's just, let's get into 

165
00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:42,720
it. 
Why don't we just fucking get 

166
00:08:42,720 --> 00:08:43,880
into it? 
Let's look at it first. 

167
00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:45,760
Sure, let's do it. 
Boom. 

168
00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:50,200
So this is the cover of Hammers.
First of all, that font, John, I

169
00:08:50,200 --> 00:08:52,920
need you to send it to me. 
It's gorgeous, it's perfect. 

170
00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:57,160
It speaks to my little heart. 
It is a, a very much a, you 

171
00:08:57,160 --> 00:09:00,960
know, kind of fancy black 
letter, little scruffy looking 

172
00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,000
situation. 
I'm a big fan. 

173
00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:07,920
And you got 2, you know, armored
figures on horseback. 

174
00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:10,920
I really like the way that the 
one in the foreground is dark 

175
00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:12,240
and on the background's kind of 
light. 

176
00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:15,280
That's an interesting way to to 
to. 

177
00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:18,520
Yeah, feels like there's like 
some depth to it, like there's 

178
00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:20,440
fog in the distance or 
something, right? 

179
00:09:20,720 --> 00:09:25,840
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
And as I said, it is a play test

180
00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:27,960
of horrific old school system 
tools. 

181
00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:32,640
So we're gonna let's just 
fucking let's just hop into it. 

182
00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:35,400
So usually we start with the 
rules breakdown, but today we're

183
00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:38,120
going to start with character 
generation because it is very it

184
00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:41,320
is very small and then the rules
kind of feed off of that. 

185
00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:45,600
So, Christian, why don't you hit
us with with character 

186
00:09:45,600 --> 00:09:49,680
generation for hammers? 
Yeah, so character generation, 

187
00:09:49,680 --> 00:09:52,360
as we said here, is very simple.
So your characters are all 

188
00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:56,560
called hammers, and that sort of
will reveal itself as we go 

189
00:09:56,560 --> 00:09:59,240
through the rest. 
But the big things to know going

190
00:09:59,240 --> 00:10:01,680
into this game is basically 
you're all clergy, you're all 

191
00:10:01,680 --> 00:10:06,480
clerics, paladin, you know, 
whatever sort of religiousy 

192
00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:09,000
fighter type of character you 
want to put it. 

193
00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:12,000
In Finder kind of thing. 
Yeah, witch hunter, that kind of

194
00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:13,480
thing. 
You're all clergy of some 

195
00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:16,120
aspect. 
The reason you're called hammers

196
00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:18,640
comes up I believe later, which 
we'll talk about. 

197
00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:23,360
But the idea is that is in 
impure for you to carry a bladed

198
00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:26,800
weapon. 
So you you all use blunt weapons

199
00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:30,240
only, which is why you're called
hammers, which is it's also just

200
00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:32,440
cool. 
It's a cool thing to call the 

201
00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:34,640
characters hammers. 
So I like that. 

202
00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:36,880
But yeah, the actual character 
creation is really simple. 

203
00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:40,680
You're just going to, it just 
says grab an index card or scrap

204
00:10:40,680 --> 00:10:44,880
of paper, 3 sided, 36 sided dice
and pencil. 

205
00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:48,280
And then you're going to roll 
3D6 to determine your only 

206
00:10:48,280 --> 00:10:51,960
ability, which is piety. 
And then based on whatever you 

207
00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:56,360
roll from that, you get sort of 
some sub stats like minor 

208
00:10:56,360 --> 00:10:59,760
statistics, which are willpower,
healing, turning, and flock. 

209
00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:01,760
And there's a little table here 
that adjusts. 

210
00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:04,240
So it really is that's character
creation. 

211
00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:07,240
As I was going through and 
reading this, I did a sample one

212
00:11:07,600 --> 00:11:09,600
to bring it up. 
But in that case I rolled 

213
00:11:09,680 --> 00:11:14,200
A2A6A4, which gives me a piety 
of 12 and 12 falls right in the 

214
00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:16,040
middle of that bell curve for 
the 3D6. 

215
00:11:16,040 --> 00:11:18,760
So I have no adjustments. 
So basically all I have to write

216
00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:21,640
down is I got a piety of 12 and 
everything else is just going to

217
00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:25,520
be a straight roll for me. 
And then, yeah, you begin play 

218
00:11:25,520 --> 00:11:32,280
with 3D 6 * 10 ducats and then D
6 / 2 languages. 

219
00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:36,880
And actually I thought this part
was kind of cool because 

220
00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:41,360
normally you would think, OK, 
well, 3D 6 / 2, I'm going to 

221
00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:43,280
just round down, round up or 
whatever. 

222
00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:46,680
But actually you can half know a
language, which is cool. 

223
00:11:46,680 --> 00:11:49,400
It has half known languages, 
cannot be read or written, but 

224
00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:52,280
can be spoken well enough to act
as an interpreter. 

225
00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:56,680
So it's like if you half know a 
language, you speak it, but you 

226
00:11:56,680 --> 00:11:58,040
can't read or write it, which is
cool. 

227
00:11:58,080 --> 00:11:59,640
Yeah. 
Yeah, I think. 

228
00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:08,000
John put the same thing in Oh my
God, John, what is your what is 

229
00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:09,840
the Wild West game called? 
Why is it in the light of a 

230
00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:11,920
setting sun? 
There was some mechanic when we 

231
00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:13,920
played that on the campaign and 
I same thing. 

232
00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:16,080
I really like that. 
I like the half language kind of

233
00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:16,760
it. 
It makes sense. 

234
00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:20,080
And then yeah, it has here 
hammers can choose a language 

235
00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:22,640
when first encountered instead 
of selecting it in care at 

236
00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:25,400
character creation. 
And unless I missed it, I don't 

237
00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:28,600
actually believe there are any 
languages like laid out in the 

238
00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:30,680
text. 
I assume that's either something

239
00:12:30,680 --> 00:12:32,800
that would come up in your game 
or later when there's like 

240
00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:34,960
beastiality and other elements 
like that added. 

241
00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:36,080
So it really is just that 
simple. 

242
00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:41,480
So in my case, I happen to roll 
12 piety 12/9 ducats and I roll 

243
00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:43,960
A6. 
So I get 3 languages, which I 

244
00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:48,480
think specifically in the clergy
element, the language potential 

245
00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:52,720
language focus is cool because 
to me that is very like medieval

246
00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:55,240
Middle Ages, right? 
It's like I you have language 

247
00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:59,240
that is accessible only to you 
and you barter in only because 

248
00:12:59,240 --> 00:13:02,200
you are learned language in a 
way is like the average person 

249
00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:04,800
isn't. 
So that's at least the thing I 

250
00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:06,480
would probably lean into if I 
was running this book. 

251
00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:11,920
That's that's really that that 
is at least this point of 

252
00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:14,640
character creation. 
And then, you know, we can do 

253
00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:17,280
you want me to keep rolling 
along through or we want to talk

254
00:13:17,280 --> 00:13:20,840
through the. 
Yeah, I mean, if you want to, I 

255
00:13:20,840 --> 00:13:22,600
can touch on Hit Dice. 
Unless you want to, but also 

256
00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:25,120
there's the Holy Orders as well.
That's true. 

257
00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:25,680
Yeah. 
Yeah, I can. 

258
00:13:25,680 --> 00:13:26,960
I can go through the next few 
pages here. 

259
00:13:28,680 --> 00:13:31,880
Yeah. 
So then after that, it uses hit 

260
00:13:31,880 --> 00:13:33,520
dice. 
So hammers have hit dice a 

261
00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,720
number of D sixes that determine
your HP. 

262
00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:40,640
So every new character begins 
play with one hit die. 

263
00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:44,400
So you're just going to roll AD 
6 to determine your starting HP.

264
00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:48,840
In my case, I roll the six, 
which was great. 

265
00:13:49,560 --> 00:13:52,760
And then it according the number
of hit die you have determine a 

266
00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:54,560
few other things. 
And there's little table here. 

267
00:13:54,560 --> 00:13:58,400
So, you know, if you have four 
hit die once you've advanced and

268
00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:01,560
sort of the equivalent of 
leveling up later, you might get

269
00:14:01,560 --> 00:14:03,440
a bonus. 
You'll have two actions instead 

270
00:14:03,440 --> 00:14:06,480
of just one action in combat, 
you get a little bonus. 

271
00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:10,080
You can attack a number of one 
hit die creatures equal to your 

272
00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:12,560
hit die, right. 
So OK, well if I have 4 in that 

273
00:14:12,560 --> 00:14:16,520
case, that means I can attack 
four hit die worth of creatures 

274
00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:19,960
in one action. 
You have a saving throw base off

275
00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:24,320
of that. 
And then yeah, the primary means

276
00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:27,720
of sort of advancement come out 
of this, which is through hit 

277
00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:30,200
dies with this thing called 
sworn oaths. 

278
00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:34,080
And there's also friendly 
wagers, which is sort of ways to

279
00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:41,800
risk reward, call your shot in 
play and see if it pays off, and

280
00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:45,120
maybe boost yourself, like 
during session, you know, mid 

281
00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:49,600
session, which is cool. 
But in terms of actually 

282
00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:51,720
creating the character, that's 
really all you're going to do is

283
00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:55,720
just roll that one HD and take 
that as your HP. 

284
00:14:56,800 --> 00:15:00,840
And yeah, whenever you get a new
hit die, you roll those and see 

285
00:15:00,840 --> 00:15:03,840
if it goes above your HP and 
then your HP races as well. 

286
00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:07,720
Big one from sort of like the, 
you know, I think, I think it 

287
00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:11,320
would have a big impact on play,
especially in the game world, is

288
00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:14,480
holy orders. 
So you pick one of three holy 

289
00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:16,640
orders to be a part of as your 
hammer. 

290
00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:20,720
So the three here are the Black 
Lodge secret occultists and 

291
00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:25,000
alchemists in the tradition of 
Paracelsus, Nicholas Flamel and 

292
00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:28,000
John D opposed to the white 
chalet. 

293
00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:32,320
Then there are the Hermeticists,
unaffiliated bounty hunters 

294
00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:35,080
looking to line their own 
pockets, and then the white 

295
00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:39,280
Chalet, monastic clerics and 
healers bent on the spread of 

296
00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:42,880
their gospel and the banishment 
of unholy forces opposed to the 

297
00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:46,480
Black Lodge. 
And then this is kind of one of 

298
00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:50,360
the bits in here, I think that 
gives us a best, a good sense of

299
00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:53,680
the world that we're cooking in 
with hammers. 

300
00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:58,720
You know, Black Lodge are in my 
mind kind of like clergy looking

301
00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:01,240
like hunting for hidden 
knowledge. 

302
00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:06,640
The white chalet are sort of 
like the controlling clergy. 

303
00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:09,360
You know, they're like, no, 
we're getting, we're purging the

304
00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:12,600
unclean or whatever. 
We're like destroying the things

305
00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:15,760
that we don't want you to know. 
Whereas the Black Lodges may be 

306
00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:17,960
indulging in that. 
And then hermeticists are kind 

307
00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:22,000
of those in between more 
standard, you know, that they 

308
00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:24,960
feel more standard adventurer 
maybe than clergy. 

309
00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:26,760
But I think there's also, that's
probably where you have 

310
00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:32,440
potential as players to, to be 
some sort of more out there or 

311
00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:37,000
off the wall beliefs and weird 
esoteric characters and stuff. 

312
00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:39,800
Yeah, that's interesting that 
you're. 

313
00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:43,000
So when I, when I read these 
three, I kind of read it as, 

314
00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:47,120
yeah, the Watch LA being the 
primary controlling church 

315
00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:49,400
aspect of it. 
The Black Lodge being definitely

316
00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:53,080
those like the guys that get in 
trouble in church for maybe 

317
00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:56,200
digging a little too deep into 
like the miracles or the 

318
00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:59,080
Exorcist or something like that.
And then I really saw the 

319
00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:01,560
hermeticist this kind of like 
the the witch Finder kind of 

320
00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:05,119
people that are just like, I 
have a permission to murder 

321
00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:07,440
people for for God. 
So I'm going to go out and 

322
00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:11,040
fucking do it so. 
Like an Inquisitor type or yeah,

323
00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:15,319
like a like some sort of 
traveling, traveling, yeah, 

324
00:17:15,319 --> 00:17:19,440
healer or something. 
This sort of in between, yeah. 

325
00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:22,640
And the in between this does 
come up does come up later. 

326
00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:27,200
Yeah, in some interesting ways. 
And sort of, I guess the last 

327
00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:31,040
thing, unless you had something 
you can say, I was going to say 

328
00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:34,960
the last character creation bit 
there is Insight where you can 

329
00:17:35,360 --> 00:17:37,000
sort of push the luck on the 
roll. 

330
00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:41,400
You roll through 3D6 again and 
if it's equal to or greater than

331
00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:45,600
the piety score you originally 
rolled, you get to increase that

332
00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:51,000
score by AD 3. 
And if it isn't, you die and 

333
00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:53,840
then you are consumed by the 
Children of the Night roll 

334
00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:56,640
again. 
So it's kind of going for that 

335
00:17:56,640 --> 00:18:00,600
like, hey, you can, you know, 
see if you can boost your stat. 

336
00:18:02,120 --> 00:18:05,000
You don't. 
And if it doesn't work out, you 

337
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,160
die and I, you know, you 
restart. 

338
00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:10,720
It's always kind of funny to me 
to have death and character 

339
00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:15,520
creation. 
I do think here I would because 

340
00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:18,960
it is just kind of like it's so 
quick that it almost makes me 

341
00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:20,400
think well, if I died, I would 
just roll it. 

342
00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:23,120
Like it makes me feel like I'd 
fall into this cycle of just 

343
00:18:23,120 --> 00:18:25,280
rolling and re rolling and 
rolling and re rolling. 

344
00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:29,880
I almost think the insight would
be a bit more fun if it was like

345
00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:34,360
if you if you roll under, you 
take AD three penalty to your 

346
00:18:34,360 --> 00:18:36,160
piety and you just have to live 
with it. 

347
00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:40,520
That's maybe like the way I 
would roll with it at my table 

348
00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:45,200
based on this, because I do 
think it's there's not as much 

349
00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:49,240
story in the character creation.
Like say, you know, something 

350
00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:52,160
like the the you die during 
character creation. 

351
00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:53,960
I always think of as classic 
traveler, right? 

352
00:18:54,720 --> 00:18:57,360
But at that, by that point 
you're like, OK, my guy's been 

353
00:18:57,360 --> 00:19:00,240
he's done. 
He had this job and then that 

354
00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:04,520
job he's done his third tour of 
Space Marine duty or whatever, 

355
00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:05,960
and he's going to go fight 
another war. 

356
00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:07,960
Let me put him through his 
fourth. 

357
00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:10,440
And then you die and then you at
least come out with like a mini 

358
00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:12,520
story. 
I don't get the sense that I'm 

359
00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:16,520
coming out of character creation
here with a mini story so fun 

360
00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,120
that it's in there. 
But I wonder if there could be a

361
00:19:19,360 --> 00:19:24,200
better alternative to death as a
as a hey, you can, you can, you 

362
00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:25,640
know, you can take the leap of 
faith. 

363
00:19:25,720 --> 00:19:29,160
I think a game, a favorite game 
with lots of leaps of faith 

364
00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:33,280
potential mechanically is cool, 
but I almost wanted to be like, 

365
00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:35,840
if it doesn't go wrong, you got 
to live with it in a way. 

366
00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:38,400
I, I completely agree. 
I think that's, you know, first 

367
00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:40,560
of all, I think insight, I would
probably just call it leap of 

368
00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:42,520
faith. 
I think that's a better 

369
00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:45,520
indicator of what it is. 
But I completely agree with you.

370
00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:48,720
When I, you, you obviously when 
you see this right away, the 

371
00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:50,800
first thing popped in my head 
is, is classic traveler. 

372
00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:53,920
But when you're making a classic
traveler character, it's almost 

373
00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:56,760
like a solo game just making the
character. 

374
00:19:56,760 --> 00:20:00,240
So if you happen to die, you're 
already probably like 1520 

375
00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:01,880
minutes in and you had fun 
making the. 

376
00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:06,160
I, I completely agree with you 
on the the insight bit is that 

377
00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:11,240
if I would just do this every 
time no matter what, and then 

378
00:20:11,600 --> 00:20:15,000
and then just like just take the
best one. 

379
00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:18,560
If they die, they die. 
Yeah, it's, it's and because 

380
00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:22,280
it's so easy to roll piety, you 
just can just roll 36 and then 

381
00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:24,600
roll again, OOP, they died. 
And then I roll again and then I

382
00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:26,920
roll again, OOP, they died. 
So I completely agree with you. 

383
00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:33,560
I would rather take AD through 
penalty to my piety as then then

384
00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:35,000
to just die and kind of have 
that. 

385
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:37,640
I just don't think there's 
enough depth to to this. 

386
00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:39,840
There should, like you said, I 
think there needs to be a little

387
00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:43,160
bit more there in order to make 
it, yeah. 

388
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:44,720
Yeah. 
And like you said at the 

389
00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:48,400
beginning too, right, it's you. 
We were saying that this is sort

390
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:52,520
of like a collection playtesty 
collection of tools. 

391
00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:55,600
So I would say, you know, I'm, 
I'm saying that all based on 

392
00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:59,160
what's here right now that that 
of course could change in a 

393
00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:00,920
final version. 
You could say, oh, well, you 

394
00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:04,000
know, maybe in the final version
you're picking your you've got 

395
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:07,360
like your holy order and a few 
little sub options with that and

396
00:21:07,360 --> 00:21:10,040
your languages and all that. 
And maybe you are hitting this 

397
00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,360
point with a little bit more of 
a story behind your character. 

398
00:21:12,360 --> 00:21:17,080
But as is, as it is written 
here, yeah, I would say if I go,

399
00:21:17,120 --> 00:21:21,160
oh, I died, I don't feel like 
I'm leaving that with like a 

400
00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:25,280
full character or story yet. 
So to me it I want you know, 

401
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:27,520
either some something with a 
little bit more interesting 

402
00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:29,760
flair there to it. 
Yeah, completely agree. 

403
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:33,160
And then the last sort of 
character related thing is this 

404
00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:35,400
next option. 
But you go, you go ahead. 

405
00:21:35,720 --> 00:21:37,160
No. 
Go for it because I would love 

406
00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:39,520
for you to to explain that 
because you know, I'm going to 

407
00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:41,040
go through the the rules 
breakdown. 

408
00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:42,440
So let's talk about the 
character bit stuff. 

409
00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:46,600
Yeah, I was going to say the, I 
think it's, yeah, it's pretty 

410
00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:49,200
much the last before we get into
that the like more mechanical 

411
00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:50,520
stuff. 
The last sort of character 

412
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,400
creation option is this 
Meditonia section. 

413
00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:57,840
So this is basically like funnel
play. 

414
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,600
Generate 4 hammers per player. 
Don't roll for insight, you just

415
00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:05,200
roll for like. 
Don't roll for that push your 

416
00:22:05,200 --> 00:22:07,280
luck thing we just talked about.
You're just going to roll bass 

417
00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:10,680
piety. 
All the characters have D3 HP. 

418
00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:14,120
They're effectively hit dice 0 
characters. 

419
00:22:15,360 --> 00:22:18,760
They don't start with any money,
they just have robes to cover 

420
00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:23,000
their naked shameful bodies. 
And then you don't have a flock,

421
00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:26,080
which at this point in the text 
we don't really even know what a

422
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:29,280
flock is, but we've read the 
rest of it that will come up 

423
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:30,440
later. 
But it's essentially like 

424
00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:32,120
followers. 
You know, you're supposed to be 

425
00:22:32,120 --> 00:22:36,720
a cleric of some renowned. 
You've got, you know, people 

426
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:41,520
who've start to follow you a 
little as this person of God. 

427
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:45,080
But as an initiate in this sort 
of funnel play, you don't have 

428
00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:47,200
that. 
So you're just basically 4 weak 

429
00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:52,760
nothing characters, and then 
when you survive a session, then

430
00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:58,200
they go up to 1 HD, you gain a 
boost to your piety, and then 

431
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:01,320
you can start to have members of
your flock. 

432
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:03,800
And that could even be some of 
these other characters you've 

433
00:23:03,800 --> 00:23:06,240
rolled. 
It could be like, OK, well I'm 

434
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:09,440
just going to have one of these 
guys go to 1 HD and then two of 

435
00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:11,320
them are going to fall into my 
flock, that kind of thing. 

436
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:17,000
But yeah, basically just an even
more simple basic character 

437
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:19,400
creation, but where you're going
in with a bunch of people and 

438
00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:23,160
going to see who The Who the 
gods let live. 

439
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:28,000
Yeah, going with like, you know,
three players, 12 dudes rolling 

440
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,240
in before you have a flock and 
and are your hirelings. 

441
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:33,600
So, yeah. 
So that's that's basically 

442
00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:36,520
character generation. 
I'm going to cover maybe touch 

443
00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:39,560
on a little bit of that again as
we go through kind of the rules 

444
00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:43,200
breakdown real quick. 
But as we said at the beginning,

445
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:48,000
this is a playtest document. 
It's really kind of a toolbox, a

446
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:52,800
list of procedures and mechanics
and stuff to use for the game. 

447
00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:57,400
So this is a was a little bit 
harder to kind of give like a, a

448
00:23:57,680 --> 00:24:01,600
good breakdown in mechanics 
because there's not really like 

449
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:04,640
I've questioned about like the 
game loop and stuff like that. 

450
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,240
But anyway, so the gist of the 
game, as we've already 

451
00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:10,800
discussed, kind of it's an old 
school dungeon crawler where the

452
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,840
players are these 1700 ish, you 
know, players and stuff. 

453
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:17,400
Christian already tucked on 
touched on piety. 

454
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:19,880
You know your 4 stats, 
willpower, healing, turning in 

455
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:25,200
flock, and already touched on 
Hit Dice, which we'll discuss at

456
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:26,840
length because I have lots of 
questions about that. 

457
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:32,080
Because Hit Dice does give you 
your actions, your bonuses, your

458
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:36,960
saving throws, your a lot of 
stuff based on just the 2 rolls 

459
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:38,400
you get between piety and hit 
dice. 

460
00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:40,920
Cuz really, that's all character
generation is like 2 of them, 

461
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,160
yeah. 
And then you hit dice, you're 

462
00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:46,120
really just rolling, yeah, 
you're just rolling to get your 

463
00:24:46,120 --> 00:24:48,920
HP. 
But then everything else is sort

464
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:52,080
of just comes off of that, yeah.
Yeah, like character generation 

465
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,840
is basically 46 and then you're 
done. 

466
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:59,240
Yeah, yeah. 
OK, so you have the hit dice. 

467
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:02,160
So there really isn't, like I 
said, it doesn't really feel to 

468
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:05,080
me like there's like a base role
in the game. 

469
00:25:05,360 --> 00:25:09,040
Like everything you do kind of 
is its own procedure. 

470
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,880
The core dice you need for the 
game obviously are D sixes, at 

471
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:15,600
least in character generation, 
but that continues throughout 

472
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:20,040
the rest of the game. 
Everything is 1D62-D63D6 usually

473
00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:22,400
like AX and six chance of 
things. 

474
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:25,960
You know those kind of stuff 
which is confusing we'll talk 

475
00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:30,920
about later. 
So saving throws you roll. 

476
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,200
Let's let me let me Scroll down 
a little bit. 

477
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:37,440
So saving throws you roll 2D6 
higher than your saving throw 

478
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:41,920
value, which is determined by 
your HD Π D tests. 

479
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:46,360
You roll one D 6 + π D and it 
has to be equal to or greater 

480
00:25:46,360 --> 00:25:51,080
than 20, but you can push with 
another D6 or get 1D3 in aid 

481
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:55,040
from each hammer that helps you.
We'll, we'll touch on piety 

482
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:56,320
tests. 
We'll touch on a lot of this 

483
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:59,720
stuff again after the kind of 
the run through leveling 

484
00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:05,480
advancing as Christian said is 
is gaining and losing HD, which 

485
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:09,880
is done by completing sworn 
oaths, which seem incredibly 

486
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:12,120
difficult. 
We'll we'll go over the math of 

487
00:26:12,120 --> 00:26:16,040
that a little bit later as well,
but that's one of the core kind 

488
00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:20,800
of non dungeon crawl loops. 
I mean can be part of it, but 

489
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:22,720
like it's it's the mechanical 
loop. 

490
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:26,000
Outside of it is. 
Yeah, it could be in any at any 

491
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,320
point in play, whether or not 
you're like in combat or in a 

492
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:30,240
dungeon. 
Yeah, but that's kind of like 

493
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:33,920
the core of gaining. 
It's a daring personal goal that

494
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:37,400
grants HD after accomplishment 
that showcase your faith in 

495
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:40,360
bombast and it's a piety test 
without anyone being able to 

496
00:26:40,360 --> 00:26:42,400
help you. 
We'll go over the math of that a

497
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:46,200
little bit later. 
The other and and the HDS up and

498
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,480
down is is part of it. 
One of the other things that you

499
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:53,600
can do is friendly wagers, which
I know you were a big fan of. 

500
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:57,040
We'll talk about that too, but 
basically you can wager someone.

501
00:26:57,040 --> 00:26:59,160
One of the examples here is who 
can make it to the village 

502
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:01,440
before nightfall. 
So you can wager with as many 

503
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,800
other hammers as you want, and 
the winner gets 1 HD and the 

504
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:09,600
loser loses 1 HD, which is again
interesting. 

505
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:13,360
We'll talk about and. 
I think it's fun. 

506
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:17,400
It's it reads to me it's 
potentially fun if you're in a 

507
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:21,120
party with mixed affiliations 
for your clerics. 

508
00:27:21,120 --> 00:27:23,560
I see both the sworn oaths and 
the friendly wagers as sort of 

509
00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:27,200
being that like like, you know, 
the white chalet guy being like,

510
00:27:27,360 --> 00:27:31,360
my God will see me safer back to
town than yours. 

511
00:27:31,360 --> 00:27:34,320
Screw off, Bozo. 
And then he goes running off and

512
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:37,680
then when he when he loses, it's
it's you know, it's like it 

513
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:41,760
feels very like that, like you 
feeling like your faith is 

514
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:44,000
paying off or not in the back 
and forth of that. 

515
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:45,720
So it seems like it has fun 
potential, but you would 

516
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:50,760
obviously need to hit die to 
wager which the spin up could be

517
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:53,920
a little bit there. 
Which, yeah, again with the 

518
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:57,440
interplay between that and some 
other things is one of my kind 

519
00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:00,320
of core, I don't want to say 
issues, it's questions with the 

520
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:01,880
game. 
So that's definitely something 

521
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:05,960
we're we're going to talk about.
You talked about flocks. 

522
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:08,440
You can have a flock of hench 
men, hirelings and specialists 

523
00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:13,240
that follow and assist you when 
you get to combat. 

524
00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:21,640
The combat uses matrices a la 
Troika and whatnot. 

525
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:24,720
I know we both have opinions on 
that, we'll talk about that. 

526
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:29,720
But here is the combat matrix 
for for the comment matrix, HD 

527
00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:31,600
on one side, AC across the 
other. 

528
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:39,960
So if you have HD one and they 
have AC-5, you need to roll A7, 

529
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:42,760
right? 
And then there is a damage 

530
00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:46,160
matrix as well. 
You would just roll AD 6 if you 

531
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:49,280
successfully hit and you will 
look at the weapons list on the 

532
00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:51,920
side here versus the roll across
the top and it'll give you 

533
00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:54,920
damage. 
So if you have an arc bus and 

534
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,880
you roll A6, you're going to do 
18 points of damage. 

535
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,520
So those are that's it's, it's 
interesting. 

536
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:04,600
It's one of those things that 
is, in my opinion, interesting. 

537
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,960
I think it's very much like a, a
love it or hate it kind of 

538
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:08,960
thing. 
I don't know a lot of people 

539
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:13,200
that are middle of the line on 
on matrixes matrices. 

540
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:17,680
Yeah, I mean my, you know, when 
I was going through it, it's 

541
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:23,200
like my knee jerk reaction is 
that I don't like them. 

542
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:27,160
Same. 
But I don't necessarily think 

543
00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:32,640
that I have a good reason for 
that, which is to say, I think I

544
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:36,680
honestly think it's because when
I started playing RPGs, they 

545
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:41,240
were a sign to me of an 
antiquated game, but not 

546
00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:43,680
antiquated enough that I found 
it interesting, if that makes 

547
00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:46,800
sense. 
It's like like when I like I, 

548
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:49,840
you know, there was that sort of
era of trad game in like the 

549
00:29:49,840 --> 00:29:54,280
late 90s, it was still sort of 
stuck in the past in a bad way. 

550
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,680
And I feel like that's when I 
first encountered them was like 

551
00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:00,280
me being like, wait, you mean I 
don't just roll and it tells me 

552
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:01,640
my damage. 
I have to like look at this 

553
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:04,720
table every time. 
But I think in practice, like 

554
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:07,760
they they probably aren't really
any slower or faster. 

555
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:11,240
I know some people really don't 
like the like math, you know, 

556
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:14,640
while rolling, like they don't 
like having to go plus this 

557
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:17,720
modifier plus that or let me add
up these four dice. 

558
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,240
I do think from the damage, the 
damage matrix, it is cool that 

559
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:26,360
it lets all the weapons have 
different, you know, different 

560
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,280
scales of damage. 
I think it's cool that's 

561
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:31,440
something you couldn't replicate
easily with dice rolls. 

562
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:34,160
At least, you know, if, if the 
arc bus or whatever, you 

563
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:39,040
couldn't just say, well, roll, 
you know, saying it's not the 

564
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,120
same as saying roll 4D6 for 
damage isn't the same as saying 

565
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:44,560
roll D6. 
And maybe the sixth option is 

566
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:47,600
like 28 damage and the first 
step option is 1. 

567
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:51,080
You know, it lets you have a 
more interesting and very 

568
00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:53,360
damaged scale between weapons. 
So I think that's kind of cool. 

569
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:56,920
But I think in play, I think 
this would be, I would be fine 

570
00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:58,800
with them. 
But yeah, my, for some reason, 

571
00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:02,160
my knee jerk is it's like it 
feels kind of like, you know, 

572
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:03,880
sometimes you see a character 
sheet and you're like, this 

573
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,120
looks like a tax form. 
Yeah, like not in a fun way. 

574
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:10,760
So that's that's my thought. 
But I think that they're fine 

575
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:12,000
here. 
I think they would be fine. 

576
00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:14,680
I feel somewhat similar. 
My knee jerk is I'm not a fan, 

577
00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:17,280
but it's also one of those 
things where I'm not not enough 

578
00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:21,520
of a fan that like 20 minutes 
into the game, it would just be 

579
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:24,800
a thing that exists. 
It would no longer be a problem.

580
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:26,320
You know what I mean? 
Like it's a little bump that 

581
00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:28,120
would be easily sanded over. 
You know what I mean? 

582
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:29,520
It's not an issue. 
Yeah, I'm like you said. 

583
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:33,840
Yeah, it just, it just means I 
have this page open in front of 

584
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:36,200
me as I play. 
Yeah, and you don't even. 

585
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:38,920
You could even have a new 
character sheet with your with 

586
00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:41,680
your weapon. 
You could even just have just 

587
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:44,600
your line of of damage written 
down on it too. 

588
00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:48,080
You don't even need that. 
So I mean it is interesting 

589
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:50,280
because with combat 2, if you 
roll a crate, you get double 

590
00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:53,720
damage. 
So if you roll an arc bus at 18 

591
00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:58,640
damage and then roll A6, you're 
doing whatever 18 into a 36 

592
00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:03,000
points of damage, which is 
insane because this is not a 

593
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:07,320
very high HP game. 
So weapons are deadly, you know,

594
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:11,000
that's part of it. 
So, so combat, they use matrices

595
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:15,120
on attack roll. 
You roll 2D6 to attack and you 

596
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:20,160
get movement and an action, but 
maybe more actions. 

597
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,000
It's not addressed in combat. 
The only time the number of 

598
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:27,560
actions you have in in a turn is
addressed is in the table that 

599
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,200
talks about how many actions you
get. 

600
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:31,160
So there's we're we're going to 
talk about the clarity 

601
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:33,360
throughout the the document 
coming up. 

602
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:35,840
But to finish kind of running 
through this, the other things 

603
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:40,240
you can get are obviously your 
clerics, you can turn unholy. 

604
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:44,120
There are prayers called Hail 
Marys, which we will discuss 

605
00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:46,720
because I think we both have 
kind of a lot of questions about

606
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,080
that. 
And then everything after that, 

607
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,880
really, again, we're not going 
to go too deeply into this. 

608
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:55,240
We're not going to read it page 
by page. 

609
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:59,320
But there are holy relics. 
You can do research. 

610
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:02,360
You can have feasts, which is 
the only way you can have an 

611
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:05,440
option for a debt saving throw 
is if you had a feast that day, 

612
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:08,760
which is interesting and then 
everything after that pretty 

613
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:10,720
much you know, it is a dungeon 
crawler game. 

614
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:15,760
The core loop then becomes 
raiding layers to kill unholy, 

615
00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:19,240
and the vast majority of those 
mechanics are pretty classic old

616
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:22,280
school dungeon crawling. 
Like there's, you know, there's.

617
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:25,600
What are you going dungeon 
tables? 

618
00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:29,920
Yeah, all that kind of stuff. 
And my, my, my issue, you know, 

619
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,360
you know, we'll, we'll, we'll, 
we'll, we have a whole set of 

620
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:35,640
mate of metrics to talk about to
get to the issues. 

621
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:38,200
But that's kind of it. 
There's options for hench men. 

622
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:40,800
There's options for having, you 
know, like a stronghold, AKA 

623
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:44,760
like a sanctum, which is here, 
traps, hazards, morale, you 

624
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:48,080
know, all sorts of stuff. 
So kind of the whole second-half

625
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:51,560
is really classic dungeon 
crawling, which which is an 

626
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:57,280
interesting kind of thing to 
have a party of clerics that go 

627
00:33:57,280 --> 00:34:02,480
dungeon crawling in the world I.
Well, it's kind of it's, yeah, 

628
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:03,880
it's flavored a little 
differently. 

629
00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:08,280
It's flavored as layers and the 
like LAYIR and the idea being 

630
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:12,639
that it's like you because, you 
know, we said it's this playtest

631
00:34:12,639 --> 00:34:14,000
doc. 
So there aren't things like 

632
00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:15,600
there's not a bestiary here and 
stuff. 

633
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:17,080
But I get the feeling that there
would be lots of. 

634
00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:19,400
There is a mention I think at 
one point of werewolves, there's

635
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:23,360
a mention of vampires. 
It feels a little like Witcher, 

636
00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:26,320
vampire hunter, that kind of 
vibes. 

637
00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:28,560
So it's like I get the feeling 
that this isn't so much like, 

638
00:34:28,679 --> 00:34:31,080
let's go down to the old temple 
and just see what we see. 

639
00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:34,560
It's more like we have heard the
villagers are dying to some 

640
00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:37,639
beast in the night and we've 
been told it lives here, let's 

641
00:34:37,639 --> 00:34:41,840
go down and find it, which is 
cool. 

642
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:44,560
But yeah, I mean, we can talk to
it more as we go through that. 

643
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:48,679
I think to me out of everything 
on my initial read through, the 

644
00:34:48,679 --> 00:34:53,719
differentiator, like the unique 
aspect here is I think leaning 

645
00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:57,720
into the cleric thing. 
I think that having followers 

646
00:34:57,720 --> 00:35:03,120
each each NPC, each PC having 
NPC followers like more or less 

647
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:07,320
from the jump is cool. 
The shifting up and down. 

648
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,360
It also has, you know, you know,
a lot of games do this where 

649
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:14,080
they kind of recommend like have
someone make the map, have 

650
00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:16,160
someone, whatever. 
Here it kind of calls out 

651
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:18,920
specifically like, hey, there 
are roles, player roles. 

652
00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:21,800
It's like caller, which is the 
person who's deciding where you 

653
00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:27,360
go and when, like overall 
mapper, quartermaster, which is 

654
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:32,040
the person who's tracking like 
time, goals, arrows you fired, 

655
00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:34,000
foes you vanquished, hammers, 
loss. 

656
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:37,440
And then shepherd, which is like
the person who's tracking like 

657
00:35:38,240 --> 00:35:41,920
money, the names of your of 
everyone's flock, the locations 

658
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:44,920
you visited. 
And to me, I think that's kind 

659
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:47,080
of the juice. 
That's the juice that's here is 

660
00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:51,840
really leaning into that like 
clerical aspect in a traditional

661
00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:54,320
sense. 
Like I want to feel like a monk 

662
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:57,120
playing this and that means that
I want to be like, let me open 

663
00:35:57,120 --> 00:36:01,440
my tome. 
Yes, Edgar the Edgar the the 

664
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:04,680
puny. 
He's joining your flock today. 

665
00:36:04,720 --> 00:36:10,480
And we have to pay 100 ducats to
keep our sanctum up and stuff 

666
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:12,480
like that. 
So I think that's the cool 

667
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:15,600
differentiator here because at 
least in my experience, all I 

668
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:19,200
know a lot of a lot of general 
games have hirelings and stuff 

669
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:20,960
like that, but normally I'm 
always playing with enough 

670
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:23,120
people that we don't really ever
use them. 

671
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:28,520
But I like the idea here of 
like, you're always sort of this

672
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:32,640
weird band of religious misfits 
with followers that come and go.

673
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:35,560
And those relate to some things 
like as you, you know, if you do

674
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:39,320
a sworn oath and you fail, your 
flock leaves. 

675
00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:42,520
Like it's like you're like, 
you're like, my God will see me 

676
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:45,480
through this unharmed. 
And then you the werewolf 

677
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:48,520
slashes you and you bleed and 
they go, why am I following this

678
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:49,360
guy? 
And they have leave. 

679
00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:53,160
And you know, like that's the 
thing I think most reading it 

680
00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:56,000
that appealed to me is like 
it's, that's a pretty unique 

681
00:36:56,000 --> 00:37:01,440
angle, I think within that sort 
of classic dungeon crawly frame.

682
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:05,880
Yeah, no, for sure. 
I think so. 

683
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:07,640
So, yeah. 
So, so that's, that's game 

684
00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:08,840
mechanics, that's character 
creation. 

685
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:10,720
We're getting into like our 
thoughts before we get into the 

686
00:37:10,720 --> 00:37:12,720
metrics. 
And and you've hit, you've hit 

687
00:37:12,720 --> 00:37:15,960
on a bunch of them. 
What why don't we go through the

688
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:18,280
rest of kind of like your, you 
know, we have our notes here, 

689
00:37:18,280 --> 00:37:21,160
like what were your general 
thoughts that, you know, aren't 

690
00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:22,880
really going to be covered in 
the metrics a little bit? 

691
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:25,200
And then when we go through the 
metrics, I definitely want to 

692
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:26,640
hit on some more specific 
things. 

693
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:30,680
But is there anything else that 
you thoughts like likes, 

694
00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:34,320
dislikes, miscellaneous bits, 
things that stick out about 

695
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:38,280
about hammers? 
Again, as a playtest document 

696
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:40,200
for those listening. 
Yeah, yeah. 

697
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:43,240
I was going to say it's you 
know, I think it's got a pretty 

698
00:37:43,240 --> 00:37:47,400
tried and true core in that way 
of like if you've played that 

699
00:37:47,720 --> 00:37:50,080
old school dungeon stuff, you're
going to see a lot of things 

700
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:54,080
here that are that are standard 
or like standard within that 

701
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:57,760
pantheon of everyone has their 
own little house Rouille 

702
00:37:57,760 --> 00:37:59,760
variance. 
You know, this is like clearly 

703
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:04,640
someone's pick up those. 
But the things that I like who 

704
00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:07,760
kind of like I said, that wager 
friendly wagering the oaths, the

705
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:11,000
flock, the sanctum. 
There's cool stuff like you have

706
00:38:11,000 --> 00:38:14,440
to have, you know, if you have a
sanctum of a certain size or 

707
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:17,600
certain area, you have to pay 
not only money every month to 

708
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:22,840
keep it secure and up to keep it
up, you also need to denote some

709
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,640
of your flock members stay there
to keep it secure. 

710
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:30,920
So almost like that management 
layer that like you are trying 

711
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:34,640
to sort of build a religious 
following and always sort of, 

712
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:39,480
you know, take these leaps of 
faith and show how your God or 

713
00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:42,360
your way of worshiping your God 
or whatever is better than the 

714
00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:45,600
other allies in your party. 
That to me is the stuff that 

715
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:48,960
like I would hope when this goes
further down development, it's 

716
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,040
like that's the stuff to me. 
And it's like what shines here. 

717
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:53,320
That's why I would go here 
rather than someplace else. 

718
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:57,120
And some interesting stuff. 
Like I said, it's cool that it 

719
00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:00,080
calls out specifically like holy
relics and it's like, hey, magic

720
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:04,440
swords are pretty common. 
You can't use them. 

721
00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:08,400
You're a cleric. 
Like that's a that's an unholy, 

722
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:11,000
that's an unclean weapon to you,
but your flock can use them. 

723
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:13,760
And it's like, there's something
really interesting to me about a

724
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:17,200
game going, Hey, it's pretty 
common that you're going to find

725
00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:19,520
magic swords, but you can't use 
them. 

726
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:23,520
Like that's interesting. 
And it's not really like there 

727
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:25,520
aren't options for like, well, 
what if I want to use them? 

728
00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:27,320
It's just like you don't use 
them. 

729
00:39:27,960 --> 00:39:30,120
And you know, you could probably
dictate that at your table if 

730
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:34,400
you wanted, But I think there's 
some cool stuff there of like of

731
00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:36,600
the game basically suggesting 
that you're going to find loot 

732
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:40,240
that you don't immediately 
benefit from, but maybe you give

733
00:39:40,240 --> 00:39:43,640
it to your flock and maybe your 
flock or two guys with, you 

734
00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:48,040
know, +2 flaming magic swords 
and you're just a little meek 

735
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:52,480
cleric with a hammer in front. 
So that to me is the kind of 

736
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:53,760
cool stuff. 
I think in terms of like 

737
00:39:53,760 --> 00:39:56,320
negatives, which may come up to 
when we talk about the thing I, 

738
00:39:56,440 --> 00:40:01,040
I do think it's the, it's mostly
just related to the fact that it

739
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:05,400
does feel like a play test dock 
with those various procedures 

740
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:07,800
stacked in, you know, just put 
into a dock. 

741
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:09,800
So some of those things are out 
of order. 

742
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:14,000
Like coming through our first 
read I'm seeing mentions of I'm 

743
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:16,640
seeing like 3 or 4 mentions of 
flock before I'm getting what a 

744
00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:19,560
flock is. 
Some weird things where you know

745
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:22,160
where it says oh if your hit die
is this amount you get plus 3 

746
00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:24,760
flock. 
Or +2 flock, but it isn't 

747
00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:27,520
actually +2 members to your 
flock. 

748
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:30,920
It's like you're the maximum you
can have in your flock goes +2. 

749
00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:34,360
So little things like that of 
like, well, how many do, how 

750
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:36,080
many flock members do I have to 
start? 

751
00:40:36,280 --> 00:40:38,000
Do I have any? 
Do I not have any? 

752
00:40:39,200 --> 00:40:42,000
Those little questions that in a
final thing you would expect to 

753
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:47,080
be ironed out aren't. 
So, you know, that was my those 

754
00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:49,680
are my main takeaways. 
And I think that comes up 

755
00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:52,800
especially around the Hail 
Marys, which you talked about 

756
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:55,480
are almost sort of these like 
once per, I think once per 

757
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:56,840
session, if I'm remembering 
correctly. 

758
00:40:56,840 --> 00:40:59,520
But they're like, you know, 
these kind of rare, like we 

759
00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:03,840
really need this to pay off. 
I'm really beseeching my God for

760
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:07,240
the benefit. 
But it isn't really clarified 

761
00:41:07,240 --> 00:41:11,360
here to me very well in the text
of how and what they are. 

762
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:14,680
But they kind of say they have 
like a 5050 shot by default of 

763
00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:17,280
happening. 
They typically involve A to hit 

764
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:22,320
die, but sometimes they're, you 
can do it, a Hail Mary and an 

765
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:24,520
attack. 
So that part was like, I don't 

766
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:26,040
really. 
I couldn't really get a sense of

767
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:28,200
what they were, what they do, 
yeah. 

768
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:30,960
Like was it? 
Yeah, like was it double damage?

769
00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:33,800
Is it triple? 
Is it like could you use your 

770
00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:36,960
Hail Mary just to like slay in 
it like a boss outright? 

771
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:40,520
Like I'm just going to, I'm 
going to put it all out there 

772
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:43,640
and hope I cut this thing's head
off in one go or so. 

773
00:41:43,720 --> 00:41:46,440
That was probably the bit, those
like sort of sub procedure that 

774
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:49,960
was most confusing to me as 
written that I didn't see, I 

775
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:51,160
didn't think was communicated 
well. 

776
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:54,400
Yeah, yeah. 
I mean clarity, clarity is going

777
00:41:54,400 --> 00:41:57,920
to be a big thing that comes up 
in the the metrics real quick. 

778
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:01,120
But my kind of thoughts 
initially before we hit the 

779
00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:03,560
metrics is I think, you know, 
there's a lot of interesting 

780
00:42:03,560 --> 00:42:08,240
stuff here, but the core of the 
game, I mean, there's OD and D 

781
00:42:08,240 --> 00:42:10,560
aspects to it, right? 
But it feels kind of convoluted 

782
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:18,360
or even missing like it is a 
play test doc, but they're it's 

783
00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:21,600
been nixed in favor of miracles.
Let's put out a 1.1. 

784
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:23,400
I have a lot of questions about 
this. 

785
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:25,120
So it's a play to stock, but I 
feel it's more like a list of 

786
00:42:25,120 --> 00:42:29,080
ideas and procedures as opposed 
to kind of like a complete game,

787
00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:31,200
which again, it is a toolkit is 
a play to stock. 

788
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:35,760
That's fine. 
But outside of a of a layer and 

789
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:39,000
the layer delving rules, I'm 
kind of struggling to understand

790
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:45,320
the game loop or, you know, the 
way that some of the core kind 

791
00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:50,160
of things work like piety tests 
and sworn oaths. 

792
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:52,080
So what's, why don't we hit that
when we go through the metrics? 

793
00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:53,640
But we'll talk about that a 
little bit because that's going 

794
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:55,920
to come up in usability and and 
rule set a bunch. 

795
00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:58,360
So art and layout. 
It's again, it's a playtest doc.

796
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:01,040
Really the only art in the 
entire thing is slow graphic 

797
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:04,560
here of a, of a dude playing 
harp to to another dude wearing 

798
00:43:04,560 --> 00:43:09,480
a pelt and the cover. 
But also there is on each page I

799
00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:15,000
did bring it up. 
There is a the proposed cover 

800
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:17,720
for the final bit which is vibe 
as fuck. 

801
00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:19,680
I mean it looks incredible. 
Black, white and red is always 

802
00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:21,360
going to be the correct choice. 
That's. 

803
00:43:21,360 --> 00:43:23,120
Your that's your wheelhouse for 
sure now. 

804
00:43:23,240 --> 00:43:25,720
That is for sure. 
And so this is very much like a,

805
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:29,080
you know, 1700 dish. 
It's giving you that kind of 

806
00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:34,160
like Pilgrim with the the the 
tall pointy hat, you know, 

807
00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:37,880
probably buckles on their shoes.
How it ringing a bell very much 

808
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:43,840
hits me with a witch Finder kind
of puritanical puritan. 

809
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:45,920
That's exactly thank you. 
That is the word I've been 

810
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:47,760
trying to find for like the 
entire time we've been we've 

811
00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:52,960
been doing this in black and 
white above in front of a black 

812
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:55,280
and red background. 
It looks fire. 

813
00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:57,040
It looks incredible. 
This would be great for a cover.

814
00:43:57,040 --> 00:43:58,960
Good fucking job. 
So there's not really a whole 

815
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:00,680
lot to say about art and layout.
It's a plate to stock. 

816
00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:06,160
So that's it Next is usability. 
So I mean, even in playtest 

817
00:44:06,160 --> 00:44:08,360
docs, there's no hyperlinks, 
there's no bookmarks, there's no

818
00:44:08,360 --> 00:44:11,840
table of contents with how 
scattered a lot of the rules 

819
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:13,520
are, that would be a little bit 
helpful to have. 

820
00:44:15,240 --> 00:44:19,200
And there's a lot of stuff 
throughout that we don't need to

821
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:22,160
talk about, but an editor will 
find like there's, you know, 

822
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:25,760
tense shifts, there's some 
capitalizations of things. 

823
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:33,480
The, the order of it is just, it
really makes it difficult to get

824
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:34,600
those loops kind of going 
through. 

825
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:37,240
There's times where, as I said, 
you know, there's things where 

826
00:44:37,240 --> 00:44:41,520
Hit Dice has a number of actions
listed here and never is that 

827
00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:44,440
ever addressed again in the book
when you get to combat and it 

828
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:47,120
says you can take an action, it 
doesn't say like, you know, it 

829
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:49,400
doesn't remind you, hey, you can
take, that means you can take 2 

830
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:52,160
combat actions if you have HD-4 
and, and stuff like that. 

831
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:59,120
So there's a lot of stuff with 
with clarity throughout this. 

832
00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:03,000
Yeah, things like things that if
you're like as if you're a 

833
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:06,560
pretty experienced GM, 
especially in the style of game,

834
00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:10,880
I can definitely, I definitely 
feel as if I could easily 

835
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:13,600
outside of like that one, you 
know, the Hail Mary section we 

836
00:45:13,600 --> 00:45:15,080
were talking about. 
But even then, I could come up 

837
00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:16,880
with a ruling on the fly. 
I definitely feel like I could 

838
00:45:16,880 --> 00:45:21,920
play test this and have fun with
it, but you know, I'm in that 

839
00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:24,560
position of being like, well, I 
can probably cook up a 

840
00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:27,560
connective tissue between two 
things on the fly if I need to, 

841
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:30,520
but you don't want to have to 
feel like you need to do that. 

842
00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:32,240
But like we said, this is a play
test talk. 

843
00:45:32,240 --> 00:45:35,200
But but that is that that's kind
of my feeling too of going like,

844
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:38,760
OK, you know, it does say if 
this table says I have plus 

845
00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:42,440
what, 2 actions? 
I assume that just means when it

846
00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:45,000
says I can do an action in 
combat that I actually can do 3 

847
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:46,320
now. 
But it doesn't, you know, 

848
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:49,080
specifically state that. 
But the big thing for me was 

849
00:45:49,080 --> 00:45:54,400
that order of yeah, mostly the 
order of that information, how 

850
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:56,800
that information is presented 
was the biggest thing that I 

851
00:45:56,800 --> 00:46:00,560
think in it, even in its play 
test form, you could swap some 

852
00:46:00,560 --> 00:46:03,440
of these things around. 
Now I knew, you know, it's a 20 

853
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:05,280
page doc or something. 
You know, it's not, it's not 

854
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:06,960
that long. 
I just made a note. 

855
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:10,320
I was just like, what's flock? 
I'm going to keep reading. 

856
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:14,160
Oh, OK, in three pages. 
Now I know what a flock is, not 

857
00:46:14,160 --> 00:46:16,120
the end of the world from a play
test standpoint, but you could 

858
00:46:16,120 --> 00:46:18,640
reorder some of those things, 
introduce concepts a little 

859
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:21,280
differently to make it read more
smoothly for sure. 

860
00:46:21,720 --> 00:46:24,280
Well, even especially if you're 
putting on a document to get 

861
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:27,040
feedback, which this, this, I 
mean, on this page it says like 

862
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:28,600
this is put out to get feedback 
and stuff like that. 

863
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,480
I think 1, I think it's too 
terse. 

864
00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:34,680
I think there is a complete lack
of clarity for most things. 

865
00:46:34,680 --> 00:46:37,320
There are no examples really of 
pretty much anything. 

866
00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:39,920
There's no explanation of things
that would be incredibly 

867
00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:41,760
helpful. 
I think this is the kind of doc 

868
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:45,440
where it's OK to over explain 
and you can pull that back for 

869
00:46:45,440 --> 00:46:48,680
the primary doc to, to get the 
wording you want versus under 

870
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:52,560
explaining when you're trying to
communicate something like 

871
00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:56,040
specifically, like you said, the
Hail Mary's and, and, and John 

872
00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:57,840
said that that's getting 
replaced with miracles and 

873
00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:00,320
stuff. 
But there was there's a lot of 

874
00:47:00,320 --> 00:47:03,480
other clarity issues. 
I have a little pet peeve 

875
00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:08,600
whenever I read a book when 
there are tables and or not even

876
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:12,640
tables when there are directions
to information because of how 

877
00:47:12,640 --> 00:47:17,080
often layout changes that. 
So it'll be like look below for 

878
00:47:17,080 --> 00:47:19,000
this, but in a book, it's the 
tables to the right. 

879
00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:21,400
And that happens a bunch through
here. 

880
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:24,600
Like you can scroll like 10 
pages down and it'll say, see 

881
00:47:24,600 --> 00:47:27,960
the piety table above and it's 
the piety tables like 20 pages 

882
00:47:27,960 --> 00:47:30,040
ago. 
So there's, there's that kind of

883
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:32,360
stuff through that. 
Well, again, we'll get clarified

884
00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:35,560
later, but wouldn't it wouldn't 
be bad to kind of go through 

885
00:47:35,560 --> 00:47:38,120
this entire document, rearrange 
some stuff, clarify some stuff, 

886
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:42,720
add some examples, add a lot of,
you know, kind of more 

887
00:47:42,720 --> 00:47:46,560
explanation to really portray 
some of the the stuff that you 

888
00:47:46,560 --> 00:47:48,240
want. 
Like I have a lot of questions 

889
00:47:48,240 --> 00:47:51,240
going into rule set specifically
about a number of things. 

890
00:47:52,680 --> 00:47:54,840
You know, I, I personally think 
it's really interesting how much

891
00:47:54,840 --> 00:48:03,120
incentive is built into the game
with the way that play, whether 

892
00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:05,600
narratively or mechanically, 
seems to be dictated 

893
00:48:05,600 --> 00:48:15,600
specifically around like sworn 
oaths and, and, and wagers, 

894
00:48:15,800 --> 00:48:18,880
right? 
Almost all of that is all 

895
00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:21,440
incentivization, but I have an 
issue with kind of the de 

896
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:23,640
incentivization of things 
specifically. 

897
00:48:23,640 --> 00:48:26,800
And this is a question I'll ask 
you and, and John's here in chat

898
00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:30,680
with us, so we'll talk about it.
But my issue with sworn oaths is

899
00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:35,760
that it's kind of the core part 
of after character creation, the

900
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:37,240
way your character kind of 
works. 

901
00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:41,120
It is a way that you can 
increase your HD and I want to 

902
00:48:41,120 --> 00:48:42,880
specifically bring up a couple 
of things about it. 

903
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:48,800
You know, you said, you know 
with wagers and things your HD 

904
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:51,400
can go up and down. 
But there's a section here at 

905
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:57,800
the beginning where it 
specifically says when a hammer 

906
00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:02,120
games new hit dice through sworn
oaths, they reroll all their hit

907
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:04,520
dice together and can do their 
new HP. 

908
00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:08,240
To me that says that healing 
friendly wagers, all the ways 

909
00:49:08,240 --> 00:49:12,800
you can increase and decrease HD
have no effect on your HP. 

910
00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:15,080
It's just something that goes up
and down which. 

911
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:19,520
Is if rules had written, yeah. 
If rules has written so my, all 

912
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:21,240
of the things that I'm going to 
talk about now are rules as 

913
00:49:21,240 --> 00:49:22,800
written. 
And this is kind of just I'm 

914
00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:25,120
bouncing off of you bouncing off
of John to kind of get this out.

915
00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:29,840
So my issue kind of with the 
sworn oath is mathematically if 

916
00:49:29,840 --> 00:49:35,040
I start with less than 10 piety,
the only way I can ever succeed 

917
00:49:35,320 --> 00:49:41,320
on a piety test or on an on a 
sworn oath is if I crit, if I 

918
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:46,680
roll my D6 and then push and 
then roll another D6. 

919
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:49,720
Because if you have looking at 
the math and we said we're gonna

920
00:49:49,720 --> 00:49:52,840
talk about this earlier when we.
Yeah, you need to meet or exceed

921
00:49:52,840 --> 00:49:55,840
21. 
So technically you could roll A5

922
00:49:55,840 --> 00:50:00,720
or A6 on that second die. 
Only if you have a 10 or higher,

923
00:50:00,720 --> 00:50:04,680
because on a setting you would 
need 2 sixes which is still a 

924
00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:06,560
crit. 
But if you have an 8 or less to 

925
00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:10,120
start, you can never increase 
your HD with sworn Oath, which 

926
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:13,160
rules has written means you can 
never increase your HP 

927
00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:15,360
regardless of how much your HD 
goes up and down through 

928
00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:17,160
friendly wagers and things like 
that. 

929
00:50:17,400 --> 00:50:23,240
So mathematically, if you start 
with piety of eight or less or 9

930
00:50:23,240 --> 00:50:27,040
or less, you have to crit and 
even getting to 10, you have to 

931
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:31,920
you have to push with a six and 
then get a 5 in order to to 

932
00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:35,320
succeed on a sworn oath. 
And for me, the sworn oath is 

933
00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:38,760
something that when I read this,
I see that would be the way that

934
00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:42,440
I would really lean into the 
game narratively is through my 

935
00:50:42,440 --> 00:50:48,440
sworn oaths making it where for 
like 10 or less is the vast 

936
00:50:48,440 --> 00:50:51,400
majority of like 18 points. 
So you can potentially have 

937
00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:54,360
right 17, I guess because you 
can't well, 16 because you can't

938
00:50:54,360 --> 00:50:57,600
have less than a 3. 
It's impossible. 

939
00:50:57,600 --> 00:51:00,360
You can't, you can't you can't 
succeed with the sworn oath. 

940
00:51:01,200 --> 00:51:07,080
The other thing is I kind of 
don't really get sworn oaths at 

941
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:08,800
all. 
Like is it a narrative thing or 

942
00:51:08,800 --> 00:51:10,280
is it a mechanical thing? 
Right. 

943
00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:16,640
So like if if I'm I'm declaring 
a personal goal and in play 

944
00:51:17,480 --> 00:51:19,920
narratively I succeed at that 
goal, right? 

945
00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:22,520
Say my goal is to kill like a 
super big boss and we go in, we 

946
00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:24,880
kill that super big boss, the 
boss is dead. 

947
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:30,280
Am I then rolling a sworn oath 
roll to see if I completed my 

948
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:32,640
sworn oath or not? 
Because narratively it already 

949
00:51:32,640 --> 00:51:34,400
happened. 
So how am I explaining that 

950
00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:38,200
mechanically then mixing it with
the narrative to do it? 

951
00:51:38,200 --> 00:51:41,840
And if not, can I just always 
just roll for a sworn oath 

952
00:51:41,840 --> 00:51:43,680
without hitting the narrative 
beat to it? 

953
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:46,800
So it feels like a kind of like 
a like a more narrative 

954
00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:51,920
mechanic, but then you have this
mathematic mechanic on top of it

955
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:56,080
that for less than a nine piety 
is impossible anyway, so. 

956
00:51:56,880 --> 00:51:58,040
Yeah, I know. 
You're saying it's not. 

957
00:51:58,080 --> 00:52:02,040
It's not a yeah, it's not a 
straightforward boast. 

958
00:52:02,040 --> 00:52:04,680
It's not me saying it's not me 
saying I will. 

959
00:52:04,680 --> 00:52:09,280
We will kill the dark beast in 
The Cave outside of town. 

960
00:52:09,320 --> 00:52:12,160
I will do this and then you go 
and do it so. 

961
00:52:12,840 --> 00:52:16,720
Then you get an HD. 
Yeah, you have to roll rules as 

962
00:52:16,720 --> 00:52:18,160
written. 
You still have to roll this 

963
00:52:18,160 --> 00:52:20,720
almost impossible role in order 
to gain it. 

964
00:52:21,160 --> 00:52:24,280
So it almost makes me think, 
yeah, that the way I guess that 

965
00:52:24,280 --> 00:52:26,800
I would. 
I guess yeah, I do think that 

966
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:29,080
there is some like you said, 
there is a lack of clarity there

967
00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:31,160
for sure. 
I would probably I would 

968
00:52:31,160 --> 00:52:35,720
probably run it as the me going,
but meet my I'm going to attempt

969
00:52:35,720 --> 00:52:39,760
to slay the the monster is the 
sworn oath roll. 

970
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:42,000
But not everything applies to 
that like you say, because that 

971
00:52:42,000 --> 00:52:44,120
could be like, you know, your 
clerics. 

972
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:48,520
That could be like I will I, we,
I will bring clean water to the 

973
00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:51,160
village, a source of clean 
water, right? 

974
00:52:51,160 --> 00:52:53,160
We're going to we're going to 
help the people in the village. 

975
00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:55,960
How are you roll? 
Maybe you don't have to roll for

976
00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:57,760
that. 
Maybe that's, you know, you 

977
00:52:57,760 --> 00:53:00,560
spent time and you spent time 
and other resources exploring 

978
00:53:00,560 --> 00:53:05,760
and you found a natural spring. 
Cool, or sometimes, you know, 

979
00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:09,360
you could complete an oath after
you should have maybe rolled for

980
00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:12,920
it to, you know, like you could 
it could resolve it. 

981
00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:14,080
It could resolve a different 
way. 

982
00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:17,720
So I do think I do think, like 
you said, that that contention 

983
00:53:17,720 --> 00:53:19,800
is there of going well. 
Is it always a role? 

984
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:22,640
Does it have to be a role? 
Or maybe they're meant to be a 

985
00:53:22,640 --> 00:53:25,840
more short term and that's why 
there's a role attached. 

986
00:53:25,840 --> 00:53:28,280
But we need that communicated a 
little better because if it's 

987
00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:30,320
supposed to be short term, maybe
it maybe it literally supposed 

988
00:53:30,320 --> 00:53:32,560
to be that. 
It's supposed to be like you are

989
00:53:32,600 --> 00:53:34,920
in a layer. 
You see a trap, you see a 

990
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:39,320
trapped hallway and you go, my 
God will see me safely to the 

991
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:42,320
end of this hallway. 
You roll a test, and the test 

992
00:53:42,320 --> 00:53:44,480
determines whether you get to 
the end of the hallway safely or

993
00:53:44,480 --> 00:53:46,360
not. 
See and if that's, that's but. 

994
00:53:46,360 --> 00:53:47,840
It's not communicated super well
well. 

995
00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:50,400
It's not even just that it's not
communicated, but I think that 

996
00:53:50,640 --> 00:53:54,840
like at that point it becomes, 
well, there's a lot of friction 

997
00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:56,880
in between the narrative and the
mechanic, right? 

998
00:53:56,880 --> 00:54:00,640
There's a lot of games that like
Dragon Bane, for example, like 

999
00:54:00,640 --> 00:54:05,320
there are things that you can 
you can gain a heroic feat or 

1000
00:54:05,320 --> 00:54:08,640
whatever from doing a thing, but
like you just have to 

1001
00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:11,720
narratively kind of like do the 
thing or declare the thing 

1002
00:54:11,720 --> 00:54:13,680
succeed at doing the thing, 
which has a lot of other 

1003
00:54:13,680 --> 00:54:16,840
mechanical bits into it, right? 
Like if I say I'm going to kill 

1004
00:54:16,840 --> 00:54:20,040
that bad guy, there's a million 
roles between me and killing 

1005
00:54:20,040 --> 00:54:22,400
that bad guy. 
And then when I actually get to 

1006
00:54:22,400 --> 00:54:25,240
it is a thing. 
So I think there's a there is a 

1007
00:54:25,320 --> 00:54:28,840
friction here between is this 
narrative, is this mechanic. 

1008
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:34,160
And I don't know if there's a 
reason to have it be both as 

1009
00:54:34,160 --> 00:54:37,680
opposed to one or the other, 
especially since all you get 

1010
00:54:37,680 --> 00:54:41,120
from this is one hit dice. 
And then we get into things 

1011
00:54:41,120 --> 00:54:44,280
like, OK, how about friendly 
wagers, right? 

1012
00:54:44,280 --> 00:54:47,200
So friendly wagers and you can 
only do this one per session 

1013
00:54:47,200 --> 00:54:53,120
friendly wagers. 
There's no, there's no limit on 

1014
00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:55,760
it. 
So we could, we could fucking 

1015
00:54:56,240 --> 00:54:59,720
DraftKings this shit wager all 
goddamn day and I get into 

1016
00:54:59,720 --> 00:55:02,840
session with 20 fucking HD 
right? 

1017
00:55:02,840 --> 00:55:05,720
And you could end with 0HD 
really easily. 

1018
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:13,880
At that point, where is the 
diegetic or endogenous reason to

1019
00:55:13,880 --> 00:55:15,200
ever fuck with sworn oaths at 
all? 

1020
00:55:15,200 --> 00:55:18,200
Like in character there's always
like, well cuz your character 

1021
00:55:18,200 --> 00:55:19,200
would do that, that's kind of a 
thing. 

1022
00:55:19,200 --> 00:55:23,600
But like out of character, why 
would I ever risk dropping HD if

1023
00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:28,520
I need to get if I have to do an
almost impossible role to get a 

1024
00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:32,640
sworn oath to you mean? 
You're saying why would I mess 

1025
00:55:32,640 --> 00:55:37,320
with friendly wagers? 
Yeah, because then if I. 

1026
00:55:37,320 --> 00:55:38,640
Yeah, why? 
Why would you mess with friendly

1027
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:41,840
wagers if your hit die if the 
gaining hit die is so hard? 

1028
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:42,440
Yeah, yeah. 
And. 

1029
00:55:42,440 --> 00:55:45,520
Not only that, yeah, then you 
have to look at healing too. 

1030
00:55:45,520 --> 00:55:47,920
So we talk about healing. 
Clerics heal. 

1031
00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:50,720
There's a whole faction whose 
entire description literally 

1032
00:55:50,720 --> 00:55:53,480
says they're healers. 
But when you heal someone you 

1033
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:59,520
lose a hit dice, which why would
I ever do that in game or out of

1034
00:55:59,520 --> 00:56:02,760
game if once again, I have an 
impossible role to get me back 

1035
00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:05,800
up and and I know John Ted and 
chat that you can do. 

1036
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:09,680
You can do research, which is 
sort of like a downtime way to 

1037
00:56:09,680 --> 00:56:12,600
guarantee to, well, not 
guaranteed, but like to get more

1038
00:56:12,600 --> 00:56:16,880
steady, steady advancement. 
Yeah, but that isn't necessary. 

1039
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:19,440
Yeah, like you're saying that 
isn't necessarily the most 

1040
00:56:20,680 --> 00:56:28,640
interesting or fun thing to to 
come in with a piety 9 character

1041
00:56:28,640 --> 00:56:32,040
and go I'm going to have to 
spend 4 sessions researching 

1042
00:56:32,560 --> 00:56:35,000
between, you know, for wheat 
months before I'm good enough to

1043
00:56:35,000 --> 00:56:38,360
even maybe get my sworn out. 
Yeah, like I think I think the 

1044
00:56:38,360 --> 00:56:43,040
juice is in the hit die. 
Like honestly, if I was not just

1045
00:56:43,160 --> 00:56:45,800
if I was not play testing this 
for play test purposes in terms 

1046
00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:47,960
of like giving feedback and 
stuff like that in the discord 

1047
00:56:47,960 --> 00:56:50,400
or something. 
If I was like, I want to have a 

1048
00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:53,200
fun time at the table, I'm 
probably starting everyone at 

1049
00:56:53,200 --> 00:56:57,520
three to four hit dice 
characters and being like, let's

1050
00:56:57,520 --> 00:56:59,440
go. 
And I'm probably going to run 

1051
00:56:59,440 --> 00:57:01,440
the sworn oaths. 
I'm probably going to run the 

1052
00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:05,200
sworn oaths as more like I said 
that in the moment, they're like

1053
00:57:05,840 --> 00:57:08,840
you declare it and you make a 
role and the role is just 

1054
00:57:08,840 --> 00:57:12,120
determining how how it plays out
or not. 

1055
00:57:12,120 --> 00:57:14,880
Maybe it's mid boss fight. 
Maybe it's that, you know, maybe

1056
00:57:14,880 --> 00:57:18,400
it's like you go to see the 
leader of a town and the guards 

1057
00:57:18,400 --> 00:57:21,040
won't let you. 
And you turn to your party and 

1058
00:57:21,040 --> 00:57:24,760
say, we will speak to the mayor 
before this day is done. 

1059
00:57:24,760 --> 00:57:26,760
And you roll. 
And if you fail, you don't. 

1060
00:57:26,760 --> 00:57:28,440
And if you succeed that role, 
you do. 

1061
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:33,120
Because to me, I think that the 
fun is that the system is so 

1062
00:57:33,120 --> 00:57:37,920
lean that I want there to always
be that shift. 

1063
00:57:37,920 --> 00:57:40,600
Like, I want to have to look at 
the HD table a lot because I 

1064
00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:44,520
want to like, within a session. 
I start at 3:00, by the end of 

1065
00:57:44,520 --> 00:57:46,680
the session, I'm at 5. 
The next session I healed 

1066
00:57:46,680 --> 00:57:50,880
someone and I, you know, made 
another wager and now I'm back 

1067
00:57:50,880 --> 00:57:53,480
at 2. 
And the same way your flock 

1068
00:57:53,480 --> 00:57:54,640
grows. 
So it's like, I think that's 

1069
00:57:54,640 --> 00:57:58,960
where the juice is in the game. 
So I do think, like you said, I 

1070
00:57:58,960 --> 00:58:03,800
do think it should be a little. 
I would prefer that it was more 

1071
00:58:03,800 --> 00:58:06,800
a pro. 
It was more likely that you 

1072
00:58:06,800 --> 00:58:10,560
could succeed A sworn oath every
session. 

1073
00:58:11,240 --> 00:58:14,920
Yes. 
See so my issue I think, and I 

1074
00:58:14,920 --> 00:58:16,920
think this is percolating and 
finally came to a head. 

1075
00:58:17,440 --> 00:58:21,080
I think to me, Sworn Oaths feels
a little bit like or my issue 

1076
00:58:21,080 --> 00:58:25,320
with him is the same issue I 
have with Mothership 1 E in that

1077
00:58:25,880 --> 00:58:32,680
the IT there's there's 
disincentivization that I think 

1078
00:58:32,680 --> 00:58:36,120
is counterproductive to what the
game is trying to do in that, 

1079
00:58:36,240 --> 00:58:41,320
for example, Mothership 1 E. 
It is this game that wants to be

1080
00:58:41,320 --> 00:58:46,480
OSR, but is built on this panic 
engine that requires you to roll

1081
00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:50,320
on a table, but tells you 
constantly to not do the things 

1082
00:58:50,320 --> 00:58:52,640
to get you to roll on the table.
But rolling on the table is the 

1083
00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:55,840
fun part. 
So I know a lot of people that 

1084
00:58:55,840 --> 00:59:01,160
will start with like 5 panic or 
whatever just so that you can 

1085
00:59:01,160 --> 00:59:03,600
get to those roles on the table 
quicker and faster because 

1086
00:59:03,600 --> 00:59:06,560
that's the fun part. 
Which at that point then like 

1087
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:10,400
again, your you created this 
system that has friction in it 

1088
00:59:10,400 --> 00:59:14,120
where you try to avoid doing the
things to get you to roll on it.

1089
00:59:14,120 --> 00:59:16,160
But rolling on it is the part 
that you want to do. 

1090
00:59:16,160 --> 00:59:19,160
So with sworn oaths. 
If the sworn oaths is supposed 

1091
00:59:19,160 --> 00:59:21,960
to be a a thing that you want 
the game to center around, 

1092
00:59:21,960 --> 00:59:25,480
making it nearly impossible to 
do seems counter in 

1093
00:59:25,520 --> 00:59:27,360
counterproductive to having it 
that way. 

1094
00:59:27,560 --> 00:59:30,440
You could almost just fix it by 
making it a 2D6 role and then 

1095
00:59:30,440 --> 00:59:32,560
being able to push it or 
whatever, because then you can 

1096
00:59:32,560 --> 00:59:35,400
just succeed at it. 
But sometimes you will fail. 

1097
00:59:35,640 --> 00:59:37,640
I don't know if mathematically 
that would help or even just 

1098
00:59:37,640 --> 00:59:41,000
being able to do D3. 
But you know, the other part too

1099
00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:44,320
is again, like I, I think you're
right in that the HD moving up 

1100
00:59:44,320 --> 00:59:46,360
and down and constantly being 
like, oh, I have three actions 

1101
00:59:46,360 --> 00:59:48,760
now or I have this. 
Having it kind of be like a 

1102
00:59:48,760 --> 00:59:50,800
favor of your God kind of bit 
and stuff too. 

1103
00:59:50,800 --> 00:59:54,400
But having it be where the HP 
only changes when you succeed on

1104
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:57,080
a sworn oath, which you can only
do once, allows that HD to 

1105
00:59:57,080 --> 00:59:59,360
bounce up and down through your 
wagers and stuff like that, 

1106
00:59:59,360 --> 01:00:00,600
which would be really 
interesting. 

1107
01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:06,680
It's just making the sworn oaths
so difficult to do. 

1108
01:00:06,680 --> 01:00:10,000
I think we'll just encourage 
people to not heal people and to

1109
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:15,800
wager a lot more. 
Especially because even when you

1110
01:00:15,800 --> 01:00:20,160
do increase your hit dice with 
going up by 1, re rolling your 

1111
01:00:20,160 --> 01:00:22,560
HP doesn't even guarantee you're
going to get more HP. 

1112
01:00:22,560 --> 01:00:24,400
Make one at least. 
Right? 

1113
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:26,600
But the higher you get, not so I
think. 

1114
01:00:26,640 --> 01:00:28,560
I think the fix 2 is even. 
Like you said, starting with 

1115
01:00:28,560 --> 01:00:31,200
more HD gives you more to gamble
with. 

1116
01:00:31,240 --> 01:00:34,480
Like if you go to the casino 
poor you can't gamble very much.

1117
01:00:34,680 --> 01:00:36,920
And if the kind of the system is
built around this kind of 

1118
01:00:36,920 --> 01:00:39,800
gambling aspect, you know, 
giving to people a little bit 

1119
01:00:39,800 --> 01:00:43,240
more to gamble with at the start
might be a little bit more 

1120
01:00:43,240 --> 01:00:45,080
interesting. 
But I think it to me in the, in 

1121
01:00:45,080 --> 01:00:49,720
the, in the, in the loop outside
of the exploration layer stuff 

1122
01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:52,360
that, that was the part that 
seemed like it had the most 

1123
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:56,280
friction to me is the HD part 
feels like that would be the 

1124
01:00:56,280 --> 01:00:58,480
funnest part. 
And I feel like there's a lot of

1125
01:00:58,760 --> 01:01:01,520
there's just friction in the way
you're going to gain and lose 

1126
01:01:01,520 --> 01:01:04,680
and use, especially in the sworn
oaths section. 

1127
01:01:05,000 --> 01:01:06,080
So. 
Yeah. 

1128
01:01:06,120 --> 01:01:10,520
And I think that that, yeah, 
it's, it's like the clearly the,

1129
01:01:10,880 --> 01:01:14,840
the game with the pieces that 
are here now wants HD to be 

1130
01:01:15,120 --> 01:01:18,440
essentially a resource, but 
we're trickling those out. 

1131
01:01:18,440 --> 01:01:19,560
So. 
Because I would say the other 

1132
01:01:19,560 --> 01:01:23,160
side too, of the the piety and 
everything that we've that you 

1133
01:01:23,160 --> 01:01:26,320
were bringing up, the other side
of that is say you roll those 

1134
01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:29,240
3D6 and you know, I know this is
a super small chance, but say 

1135
01:01:29,240 --> 01:01:34,560
you're a 16 to an 18 piety, 
you're gaining hit dice like 

1136
01:01:34,560 --> 01:01:36,800
crazy because now that rolls 
really easy. 

1137
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:41,520
So, and not to say, you know, I 
don't want to, you know, 

1138
01:01:41,600 --> 01:01:43,480
everyone has different design 
goals when they come into 

1139
01:01:43,480 --> 01:01:45,160
things. 
I don't think a game needs to 

1140
01:01:45,160 --> 01:01:47,240
guarantee. 
I don't, I definitely don't. 

1141
01:01:47,240 --> 01:01:49,720
My philosophy is I don't think 
guarantee should guarantee good 

1142
01:01:50,120 --> 01:01:51,800
results for everyone all the 
time. 

1143
01:01:52,040 --> 01:01:55,640
But The thing is, you could see 
maybe like 4 players, maybe one 

1144
01:01:55,640 --> 01:02:00,360
guy is able to swear oaths all 
over the place because he 

1145
01:02:00,360 --> 01:02:01,920
happened to get a good piety 
roll. 

1146
01:02:01,920 --> 01:02:03,960
The other people don't. 
Maybe you spend down. 

1147
01:02:03,960 --> 01:02:09,160
Yeah, it's like it could even 
just be a simple like you said, 

1148
01:02:09,160 --> 01:02:12,960
you know, I mean, I guess not to
get down, especially with 

1149
01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:13,960
something that's a play test 
doc. 

1150
01:02:13,960 --> 01:02:16,040
You know, I never want to get 
too much in like armchair design

1151
01:02:16,040 --> 01:02:18,720
mode. 
But yeah, I would say to me, the

1152
01:02:18,720 --> 01:02:24,520
cool stuff here is that up and 
down your flock growing and 

1153
01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:27,400
dying and your strength 
increasing and not especially 

1154
01:02:27,400 --> 01:02:29,160
because it also kind of leans 
into that cool. 

1155
01:02:29,160 --> 01:02:33,280
Like how much of this is like 
your God is actually empowering 

1156
01:02:33,280 --> 01:02:35,320
you, You're falling in and out 
of favor with your God. 

1157
01:02:35,320 --> 01:02:37,280
How much of it is like it's 
placebo, right? 

1158
01:02:37,280 --> 01:02:40,120
It's like you're stronger today 
because you think you're in your

1159
01:02:40,120 --> 01:02:42,680
God's good graces or not. 
You know, like there's there's a

1160
01:02:42,680 --> 01:02:46,920
lot of really cool juice there. 
But I can imagine a lot of 

1161
01:02:46,920 --> 01:02:50,960
people taking this to the table 
and maybe playing three sessions

1162
01:02:50,960 --> 01:02:52,920
and hardly getting to experience
that. 

1163
01:02:53,160 --> 01:02:56,000
And you know, most people, most 
games are getting, if they're 

1164
01:02:56,000 --> 01:02:58,840
getting played, I would say 
under 5 sessions. 

1165
01:02:58,840 --> 01:03:02,320
So don't you know what, you, you
don't want to leave the good 

1166
01:03:02,320 --> 01:03:03,880
stuff. 
I feel like you don't want to 

1167
01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:07,840
have the tabletop version of the
RPG thing, like a video game 

1168
01:03:07,840 --> 01:03:11,800
where people go, Oh well, if you
just get 40 hours into Final 

1169
01:03:11,800 --> 01:03:15,400
Fantasy 8, it's awesome. 
It's like you never want to hear

1170
01:03:15,400 --> 01:03:17,680
that. 
And that's again, why is the 

1171
01:03:17,680 --> 01:03:20,040
same issue that I have with 
mothership where I think it 

1172
01:03:20,040 --> 01:03:23,360
really lends itself to arcs and 
toward campaigns because of the 

1173
01:03:23,360 --> 01:03:24,720
build up of panic and things 
like that. 

1174
01:03:24,720 --> 01:03:27,600
But as one shot you have to 
tweak it in order to really 

1175
01:03:27,600 --> 01:03:29,560
interact with the system the way
that you want to do. 

1176
01:03:30,560 --> 01:03:35,040
I mean I think also another fix 
would just be I think you could 

1177
01:03:35,040 --> 01:03:38,240
do with piety what you did with 
the with the matrixes, right? 

1178
01:03:38,240 --> 01:03:41,240
Like if you have where you want 
it to be in balance the way you 

1179
01:03:41,240 --> 01:03:44,720
want the fact that you could 
literally have between 3 and 18 

1180
01:03:44,720 --> 01:03:50,240
piety and everything is built on
that one number with that big of

1181
01:03:50,240 --> 01:03:52,840
a span. 
But every mechanic in the game 

1182
01:03:52,840 --> 01:03:59,680
is based on AD 6 is I, I, I 
think it's, it's too big of a 

1183
01:03:59,680 --> 01:04:02,080
role. 
Again, like Mothership's panic 

1184
01:04:02,080 --> 01:04:04,120
table should be AD 10. 
It doesn't need to be AD 20. 

1185
01:04:04,880 --> 01:04:08,400
I don't like why wouldn't? 
For example, this could just be 

1186
01:04:08,400 --> 01:04:15,760
a 2D6 table and you could have 
piety of like two through 12 or 

1187
01:04:15,760 --> 01:04:21,280
less, or even break it down into
like 1234 as opposed to two 

1188
01:04:21,280 --> 01:04:25,360
through 18, and then just tweak 
some of the rolling 2D6, rolling

1189
01:04:25,360 --> 01:04:28,160
1D6. 
I just think the spread of your 

1190
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:32,600
ability to do things based on 
the one role you do at the very 

1191
01:04:32,600 --> 01:04:37,320
beginning of the game 
mathematically creates what 

1192
01:04:37,320 --> 01:04:38,600
could be incredibly different 
games. 

1193
01:04:38,600 --> 01:04:41,280
Like, so for example, let's say 
you, you play this game with 

1194
01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:44,200
your players and there's not a 
single person that rolls above a

1195
01:04:44,200 --> 01:04:47,880
nine piety, right? 
The experience your players are 

1196
01:04:47,880 --> 01:04:51,200
going to have, honestly, with 
the way it's written, is going 

1197
01:04:51,200 --> 01:04:56,280
to be much more difficult. 
And than say I play the game and

1198
01:04:56,280 --> 01:04:59,040
I don't have anyone that rolls 
below a 12, right? 

1199
01:04:59,200 --> 01:05:01,040
They're going to be doing 
swornos like crazy. 

1200
01:05:01,040 --> 01:05:03,600
They're going to be getting HD 
up and down like crazy, which 

1201
01:05:03,600 --> 01:05:05,640
means they're going to be 
gambling more with their wagers 

1202
01:05:05,640 --> 01:05:08,640
and doing stuff like that. 
The spread of the experiences 

1203
01:05:08,640 --> 01:05:10,560
that you can have with this 
game, if you want it to be that 

1204
01:05:10,560 --> 01:05:15,160
big, I just think it's 
incredibly unrewarding to anyone

1205
01:05:15,160 --> 01:05:19,760
that rolls under half, 
basically, because you're not 

1206
01:05:19,760 --> 01:05:22,160
going to be able to interact 
with the cool mechanics of the 

1207
01:05:22,160 --> 01:05:24,840
game nearly as much. 
Yeah, which is why. 

1208
01:05:25,080 --> 01:05:28,640
I think. 
Which is why a lot of games like

1209
01:05:28,640 --> 01:05:31,400
for example, like 5 fucking E or
like a lot of the standard D and

1210
01:05:31,400 --> 01:05:34,600
DS is you roll that 18 and then 
it gives you a modifier number 

1211
01:05:34,800 --> 01:05:39,920
which gives you a less of a a 
kind of a more controlled room 

1212
01:05:39,920 --> 01:05:41,800
to grow with. 
So if you want to do 3 through 

1213
01:05:41,800 --> 01:05:46,280
18, why not then just have it be
1 through 6 as the modifiers 

1214
01:05:46,280 --> 01:05:48,800
that get off of that and build 
build around that with since 

1215
01:05:48,800 --> 01:05:52,880
everything else is D sixes. 
Yeah, I think there's a, there's

1216
01:05:52,880 --> 01:05:55,400
a bunch of different, you know, 
ways that could be handled at 

1217
01:05:55,400 --> 01:05:58,000
that level. 
I would say to me, the positive 

1218
01:05:58,000 --> 01:06:01,600
though, as a thing that is a 
playtest doc that's been put out

1219
01:06:01,600 --> 01:06:04,120
in this way, right? 
The positive to me, which I have

1220
01:06:04,240 --> 01:06:07,640
only read this right, but the 
positive to me on reading it is 

1221
01:06:07,640 --> 01:06:12,120
that I'm like the I can see I 
the cool stuff is here. 

1222
01:06:13,360 --> 01:06:15,960
It's just about that shift and 
how that makes its way into the 

1223
01:06:15,960 --> 01:06:18,880
final form, you know, So that 
would be that that would be the 

1224
01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:21,680
big, that would be my thought, 
right, is if like if I'm in a 

1225
01:06:22,120 --> 01:06:24,680
looking at this in like a 
development standpoint, like it 

1226
01:06:24,880 --> 01:06:26,800
was a freelance thing I was 
working on or something, that 

1227
01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:30,720
would be my big thing is being 
like, I think this is the, it's 

1228
01:06:30,720 --> 01:06:34,080
got a really cool identity and a
unique stuff in there. 

1229
01:06:34,080 --> 01:06:38,440
It's just making sure that's at 
the forefront, not at the back, 

1230
01:06:38,440 --> 01:06:41,000
you know, which I do think can 
easily happen between here and a

1231
01:06:41,000 --> 01:06:44,680
1.0 with a shift, like I said I 
would. 

1232
01:06:45,000 --> 01:06:48,760
It's it's honestly, you know, 
the of course, inescapable to 

1233
01:06:48,760 --> 01:06:52,120
not reference 5 E like you said,
but it's like the D&D thing of 

1234
01:06:52,120 --> 01:06:56,360
like a lot of people just start 
their campaign at 3 at Level 3, 

1235
01:06:57,040 --> 01:06:59,680
level 1 and 2 suck, you know, 
boring. 

1236
01:07:00,560 --> 01:07:02,360
It's kind of like that, You 
know, I'd say that's that's what

1237
01:07:02,360 --> 01:07:04,680
I get the feeling here is 
there's there's that other 

1238
01:07:04,680 --> 01:07:08,160
legwork of like clarifying 
editing order of information, 

1239
01:07:08,160 --> 01:07:11,120
but I think mechanically it's 
really just that it's like, hey,

1240
01:07:11,120 --> 01:07:14,960
how can you just how can you 
just shift of the stack here? 

1241
01:07:14,960 --> 01:07:19,320
So we're starting at we're 
starting at the cool unique 

1242
01:07:19,440 --> 01:07:22,080
angle. 
And then you go from there to, 

1243
01:07:22,440 --> 01:07:26,280
you know, it's cool too, to 
think of your piety 18. 

1244
01:07:26,280 --> 01:07:29,640
You've done all this research, 
whatever, you've got eight hit 

1245
01:07:29,640 --> 01:07:31,880
die. 
Your followers are all kitted 

1246
01:07:31,880 --> 01:07:35,720
out in magic swords and armor, 
and that's really cool. 

1247
01:07:35,720 --> 01:07:41,240
But just starting with enough, 
you know, hit die in your wallet

1248
01:07:41,680 --> 01:07:43,400
to start gambling and throwing 
around. 

1249
01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:46,520
I think same with healing. 
It's like, I like that healing 

1250
01:07:46,520 --> 01:07:49,400
has a big cost, but you don't 
want it to have such a big cost 

1251
01:07:49,400 --> 01:07:51,120
that you're just going to let 
the guy next to you die. 

1252
01:07:52,160 --> 01:07:55,880
You know, you want it to be, you
want it to be like, OK, well, I,

1253
01:07:56,680 --> 01:07:59,960
I, my sworn oath paid off this 
session, but I really don't want

1254
01:07:59,960 --> 01:08:02,200
Bob the cleric next to me to 
die. 

1255
01:08:02,200 --> 01:08:04,560
That's my friend. 
I'm gonna spend that. 

1256
01:08:04,560 --> 01:08:07,240
I'm gonna use that hit die to 
keep him alive, that kind of 

1257
01:08:07,240 --> 01:08:10,000
thing. 
If you didn't feast, Bob didn't 

1258
01:08:10,000 --> 01:08:12,280
feast today. 
Yeah, I think it's kinda cool 

1259
01:08:12,280 --> 01:08:15,880
you have to feast every day to 
get a saving throw cuz it's like

1260
01:08:15,880 --> 01:08:18,160
it has a little cost like maybe 
you're gonna feast before you go

1261
01:08:18,160 --> 01:08:21,399
into a layer. 
But then also, it always says 

1262
01:08:21,399 --> 01:08:23,840
the feasts are done in honor of 
a specific St. 

1263
01:08:24,040 --> 01:08:26,200
And I like the idea of making up
all these Saints. 

1264
01:08:26,200 --> 01:08:28,680
Maybe the final book will have, 
like, a table of Saints. 

1265
01:08:28,680 --> 01:08:31,880
But I think it's more funny. 
I think it's funnier to be like,

1266
01:08:32,000 --> 01:08:34,319
who are you feasting for today? 
And then you just make your 

1267
01:08:34,319 --> 01:08:36,920
table to be like, oh, this is 
for Saint Bartholomew, the 

1268
01:08:36,920 --> 01:08:39,120
patron St. of Moles. 
Yeah. 

1269
01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:42,439
I love, I love the idea of like 
in world, them having to be 

1270
01:08:42,439 --> 01:08:44,160
like, listen, we have to feast 
because we're fighting the 

1271
01:08:44,160 --> 01:08:46,399
fucking vampire. 
But like, who? 

1272
01:08:46,399 --> 01:08:47,800
What the fuck We feast into 
today. 

1273
01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:49,720
It's like Thursday, the 
whatever. 

1274
01:08:49,720 --> 01:08:51,279
It's like, and it's like, all 
right, let me pull my book out. 

1275
01:08:51,279 --> 01:08:54,040
And it's like, OK, well, today 
is the Saint of like foot 

1276
01:08:54,040 --> 01:08:56,359
fungus. 
We have to feast to this guy so 

1277
01:08:56,359 --> 01:08:58,319
that we can do a thing. 
Yeah, it's great. 

1278
01:08:58,319 --> 01:09:00,120
I mean, that's the thing. 
So moving from ruleset into 

1279
01:09:00,120 --> 01:09:02,760
originality, I think that's The 
thing is you said over and over 

1280
01:09:02,800 --> 01:09:04,279
again, there's a lot of fucking 
Jews here. 

1281
01:09:05,560 --> 01:09:11,080
I just think that it's it just 
needs the right kind of squeeze 

1282
01:09:11,279 --> 01:09:14,040
for originality. 
I would love to play an all 

1283
01:09:14,040 --> 01:09:17,040
player game of like witch 
finders that are kind of 

1284
01:09:17,040 --> 01:09:19,840
dimension that are like opposed 
to each other working together 

1285
01:09:20,120 --> 01:09:24,040
to kill werewolves and monsters 
in a kind of 1700s ish, you 

1286
01:09:24,040 --> 01:09:26,800
know, whipping around their arc 
buses and and stuff like that. 

1287
01:09:26,800 --> 01:09:29,760
So for originality for me, I 
think this is this is pretty way

1288
01:09:29,760 --> 01:09:31,080
up there. 
I think there's a lot of really 

1289
01:09:31,080 --> 01:09:33,200
fun, interesting mechanics. 
There's a lot of ways that this 

1290
01:09:33,200 --> 01:09:36,399
can be dialed into something 
that's really, really fantastic.

1291
01:09:36,720 --> 01:09:40,279
And I I think as a playtest 
document, this is an incredible 

1292
01:09:40,279 --> 01:09:44,439
list of fun ideas and 
procedures, and I can't wait to 

1293
01:09:44,439 --> 01:09:49,160
see it kind of dialed in and and
yeah. 

1294
01:09:49,160 --> 01:09:50,800
Do you have thoughts on 
originality? 

1295
01:09:52,000 --> 01:09:53,359
Yeah, I would I would say the 
same thing. 

1296
01:09:53,359 --> 01:09:57,760
That's that was the the thing I 
had seen John put stuff about 

1297
01:09:57,760 --> 01:10:00,640
this on like Blue Sky before and
I just kind of took it as like, 

1298
01:10:01,280 --> 01:10:03,600
not that I wasn't interested in 
reading it at all, but I took it

1299
01:10:03,600 --> 01:10:06,960
as that like, OK, this is this 
is one of those it's a person's 

1300
01:10:06,960 --> 01:10:09,440
sort of specific collection of 
old school house rules. 

1301
01:10:10,440 --> 01:10:12,160
You know, they're just making a 
dock of their house rules. 

1302
01:10:12,320 --> 01:10:14,160
But then when I was like, wait, 
it's an all cleric game. 

1303
01:10:14,160 --> 01:10:17,480
I love being a cleric. 
Clerics are like my favorite DND

1304
01:10:17,480 --> 01:10:19,120
class growing up. 
I played like tons of them. 

1305
01:10:19,120 --> 01:10:21,760
Like I played a cleric all the 
way to level 18, one in one 

1306
01:10:21,760 --> 01:10:24,640
campaign. 
So that was the really cool 

1307
01:10:24,640 --> 01:10:26,560
thing to me. 
And then I do think that, yeah, 

1308
01:10:26,560 --> 01:10:29,440
the more you lean to those 
angles, it's the same thing with

1309
01:10:29,440 --> 01:10:31,760
like the sanctums and having 
followers guarded. 

1310
01:10:31,760 --> 01:10:35,280
And there's a chance, even if 
it's guarded every month, that 

1311
01:10:35,280 --> 01:10:39,520
like on Children of the Night 
might come and raid it. 

1312
01:10:39,520 --> 01:10:41,920
And that idea, yeah, like you 
said, of being these sort of 

1313
01:10:42,520 --> 01:10:45,960
monks or witch hunters that have
your little base and you're 

1314
01:10:45,960 --> 01:10:48,160
going out and helping the 
surrounding thing. 

1315
01:10:48,160 --> 01:10:51,360
And you have followers that come
and go and die or you die. 

1316
01:10:51,360 --> 01:10:54,320
And now your lead flock you it 
has a thing in there where it 

1317
01:10:54,320 --> 01:10:56,960
calls for you to you name an 
error that it's like if I fall 

1318
01:10:56,960 --> 01:11:02,480
in battle, you know, Amelia is 
going to step up. 

1319
01:11:02,600 --> 01:11:04,160
She's she becomes the new 
hammer. 

1320
01:11:05,920 --> 01:11:08,120
That feels really cool. 
And I and I do think unique and 

1321
01:11:08,120 --> 01:11:11,240
having it be something where you
could definitely play more like 

1322
01:11:11,240 --> 01:11:14,480
middle age medieval. 
You could play all the way, like

1323
01:11:14,480 --> 01:11:19,040
you said, up to sort of like, 
you know, early Victorian. 

1324
01:11:19,720 --> 01:11:21,840
If you wanted, you could go into
gun territory, I mean. 

1325
01:11:22,360 --> 01:11:24,200
There's guns in the in the book,
so. 

1326
01:11:24,840 --> 01:11:27,000
There's like you could go. 
In there, yeah. 

1327
01:11:27,080 --> 01:11:28,720
Go that way with it. 
I think it's cool. 

1328
01:11:28,720 --> 01:11:32,080
So yeah, definitely, definitely 
original and fun and and cool. 

1329
01:11:32,680 --> 01:11:34,760
Yeah, I would love to play this.
I mean, we've talked to John 

1330
01:11:34,760 --> 01:11:37,120
before about coming on 
Impossible Planet, so we'll talk

1331
01:11:37,120 --> 01:11:40,760
about that next value. 
It's 2 fucking bucks for the 

1332
01:11:40,760 --> 01:11:42,480
PDF. 
I mean, even with everything 

1333
01:11:42,480 --> 01:11:46,080
that we were talking about, like
it's a great set of tools. 

1334
01:11:46,080 --> 01:11:52,000
So even if you just grab it 
right now to have some home 

1335
01:11:52,000 --> 01:11:54,960
brewed stuff to add into your OD
and E campaign or whatever, kind

1336
01:11:54,960 --> 01:11:57,320
of like old school game you want
to do for two fucking bucks, 

1337
01:11:57,320 --> 01:11:59,640
it's way more than worth it. 
But also like I can only assume 

1338
01:11:59,640 --> 01:12:01,960
that as John keeps developing 
this, there's going to be 

1339
01:12:01,960 --> 01:12:03,840
updates to it. 
So probably a good idea to grab 

1340
01:12:03,840 --> 01:12:06,280
it right now and it's only $2.00
because then you get those itch 

1341
01:12:06,280 --> 01:12:09,440
updates and and I did get the 
printed copy. 

1342
01:12:09,720 --> 01:12:15,360
It is $9 I think plus plus 
shipping, which is like 5 bucks.

1343
01:12:15,360 --> 01:12:19,160
So for a 20 something page Zine,
nice quality. 

1344
01:12:19,720 --> 01:12:21,040
I obviously was going to snag 
it. 

1345
01:12:21,720 --> 01:12:23,840
It's total of $14.00 for 
shipping and everything, which 

1346
01:12:23,840 --> 01:12:25,600
is a great deal. 
Anything less than 10 bucks for 

1347
01:12:25,600 --> 01:12:28,800
a Zine, it's fantastic. 
If you pay in now, you'll have 

1348
01:12:28,800 --> 01:12:32,040
access to the full version 2. 
Fucking I was actually. 

1349
01:12:32,720 --> 01:12:34,480
I'm glad John's in the chat 
because I was going to ask that.

1350
01:12:34,480 --> 01:12:36,080
I was like. 
I think 2 bucks is definitely 

1351
01:12:36,080 --> 01:12:38,760
worth it. 2 bucks is especially 
worth it if you get the full 

1352
01:12:38,920 --> 01:12:40,600
whatever the end version for 
being for sure. 

1353
01:12:40,600 --> 01:12:44,320
Yeah, that's crazy. 
And then vibes, I think we kind 

1354
01:12:44,320 --> 01:12:47,280
of hit it on already. 
I mean, I think the this is a 

1355
01:12:47,280 --> 01:12:50,120
game that I really want to play 
one because I really want to see

1356
01:12:50,720 --> 01:12:54,000
how it plays, you know, because 
again, I do have a lot of 

1357
01:12:54,000 --> 01:12:57,120
questions kind of about this HD 
loop that we're in. 

1358
01:12:57,880 --> 01:13:00,760
But I think the vibes are strong
and could be stronger. 

1359
01:13:00,760 --> 01:13:05,280
I think that the parts that I 
think are really cool sound 

1360
01:13:05,280 --> 01:13:08,720
really fucking cool, but I think
leaning into those parts a 

1361
01:13:08,720 --> 01:13:10,200
little bit more would be really 
fantastic. 

1362
01:13:10,200 --> 01:13:12,400
I think art obviously would be a
huge help, but again, this is a 

1363
01:13:12,400 --> 01:13:17,040
playtest document. 
But I think, you know, all the 

1364
01:13:17,040 --> 01:13:21,800
things that would increase those
vibes are things that I think 

1365
01:13:21,800 --> 01:13:25,520
are playing to come, like 
adventures, layers, you know, 

1366
01:13:25,520 --> 01:13:29,080
beast area, like all that kind 
of extra bits are the parts 

1367
01:13:29,080 --> 01:13:31,880
where a lot of the flavor gets 
to come in tables and relics and

1368
01:13:31,880 --> 01:13:33,960
all that kind of stuff. 
So there's a lot of flavor and 

1369
01:13:33,960 --> 01:13:39,240
stuff that is all the parts that
would be added to this to kind 

1370
01:13:39,240 --> 01:13:40,880
of route it out to a full game. 
What do you think? 

1371
01:13:42,440 --> 01:13:45,120
Yeah, similarly, I would say the
parts just by lieu of where it 

1372
01:13:45,120 --> 01:13:48,400
is in development and as a 
playtest doc, sort of the least 

1373
01:13:49,040 --> 01:13:51,960
the flavorful parts are what's 
here. 

1374
01:13:51,960 --> 01:13:54,880
Like what would be the least 
flavorful parts of a full game 

1375
01:13:55,280 --> 01:13:57,080
are what's here. 
We get a little bit of it and 

1376
01:13:57,080 --> 01:14:00,080
you know, the names of the 
stats, like Piety Flock, those 

1377
01:14:00,080 --> 01:14:03,040
kind of things. 
But with a game like this, 

1378
01:14:03,040 --> 01:14:05,320
really most of those are going 
to come out from like, oh, 

1379
01:14:05,320 --> 01:14:09,560
there's a holy relics list, 
there's a bestiary, there's 

1380
01:14:09,720 --> 01:14:11,600
yeah, I said maybe a sample 
adventure. 

1381
01:14:11,600 --> 01:14:14,760
There's maybe there's a table on
the feast page with a list of 

1382
01:14:14,760 --> 01:14:18,240
example patron Saints. 
You know, that's where you're 

1383
01:14:18,240 --> 01:14:22,320
really going to get it. 
The vibe is going to amp up. 

1384
01:14:22,640 --> 01:14:25,800
I can easily imagine though, 
with what's here, how I would 

1385
01:14:25,800 --> 01:14:28,200
lean into that. 
But same thing, right? 

1386
01:14:28,200 --> 01:14:33,000
You can imagine maybe there's 
like a NPC table or list for 

1387
01:14:33,000 --> 01:14:34,920
people in your flock, right? 
Like what kind of people are in 

1388
01:14:34,920 --> 01:14:37,960
your flock? 
A bandit who's turned away from 

1389
01:14:37,960 --> 01:14:42,200
his life of crime and wants to 
be better or, you know, an ex 

1390
01:14:42,440 --> 01:14:46,240
prisoner, like I've been escaped
prisoner who's taken up the, you

1391
01:14:46,240 --> 01:14:50,240
know, the kindness of the clergy
to to get out of the law. 

1392
01:14:50,280 --> 01:14:52,040
You know, you can imagine a 
bunch of these possibilities. 

1393
01:14:52,040 --> 01:14:56,560
So it's like, I think as those, 
you know, the mechanical core of

1394
01:14:56,560 --> 01:15:02,280
a game is always the least vibe 
of it saying, well, 3B6, it 

1395
01:15:02,280 --> 01:15:04,960
doesn't have much, yeah. 
So but there is a good, there's 

1396
01:15:04,960 --> 01:15:07,080
a decent chunk of that here. 
But I do think that that will 

1397
01:15:07,080 --> 01:15:10,600
come in even more later. 
But it's easy to imagine using 

1398
01:15:10,600 --> 01:15:12,440
the sparks that we have of those
vibes here. 

1399
01:15:12,840 --> 01:15:14,400
Absolutely. 
And I, you know what? 

1400
01:15:14,440 --> 01:15:17,080
You know what this game is to me
though, because I mean, my brain

1401
01:15:17,080 --> 01:15:18,400
is this is where it's at right 
now. 

1402
01:15:19,120 --> 01:15:26,520
This is this is Dark Heresy to 
me, basically like the fact how 

1403
01:15:26,520 --> 01:15:32,720
easily you could run this as an 
inquisitor with their acolytes 

1404
01:15:32,720 --> 01:15:35,400
and stuff like that. 
You know, War Warhammer 40K for 

1405
01:15:35,400 --> 01:15:36,800
those that don't know what the 
fuck I'm talking about. 

1406
01:15:37,080 --> 01:15:40,480
How easily you could have your 
flock be just your dudes and 

1407
01:15:40,480 --> 01:15:43,520
actually run your hammers as 
straight up fucking inquisitors 

1408
01:15:43,880 --> 01:15:46,040
and literally just have the 
three different factions of 

1409
01:15:46,040 --> 01:15:49,000
inquisitors, the different Ordos
be the different Ordos that you 

1410
01:15:49,000 --> 01:15:54,400
are in the in the holy orders. 
I mean, that's that's what I 

1411
01:15:54,400 --> 01:15:56,760
would immediately hack this into
is just actually running as 

1412
01:15:56,760 --> 01:15:57,840
inquisitors because in dark 
hair. 

1413
01:15:57,840 --> 01:15:59,080
So you don't even get to be the 
inquisitor. 

1414
01:15:59,080 --> 01:16:01,520
You're the inquisitors homies, 
like you're his little buddies 

1415
01:16:01,520 --> 01:16:03,600
or whatever. 
But actually being able to run 

1416
01:16:03,600 --> 01:16:07,200
this as as inquisitors as is 
with just changing some names 

1417
01:16:07,200 --> 01:16:09,920
and stuff, barely even doing 
that, you know, just armors now,

1418
01:16:09,920 --> 01:16:16,080
power armor kind of it it it fox
like, you know, so yeah, what? 

1419
01:16:16,080 --> 01:16:19,680
You're saying is you're asking, 
you're asking John, you're, 

1420
01:16:19,680 --> 01:16:23,080
you're saying once you finish 
hammers, star hammers. 

1421
01:16:23,640 --> 01:16:26,120
Star Hammers. 
That's exactly what's happening.

1422
01:16:27,000 --> 01:16:28,400
Exactly. 
You need star hammers. 

1423
01:16:30,120 --> 01:16:31,440
Yeah, that's that's what I 
envisioned. 

1424
01:16:31,440 --> 01:16:33,080
You know, power hammers is good 
too. 

1425
01:16:33,360 --> 01:16:35,600
Yeah, that's what I envisioned 
as well was like, yeah, it's, 

1426
01:16:35,600 --> 01:16:38,200
it's that Inquisitor vibe. 
Whether you take that sci-fi 

1427
01:16:38,200 --> 01:16:41,760
like 40K or just literally like 
we are the Inquisition rolling 

1428
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:43,120
around. 
It's cool. 

1429
01:16:43,120 --> 01:16:46,360
It's also interesting because I 
think at the table you could 

1430
01:16:46,360 --> 01:16:49,520
decide how you want to play that
as the GM or as the table. 

1431
01:16:49,520 --> 01:16:53,240
Like do you want to be like 
actual Inquisitors, which is 

1432
01:16:53,240 --> 01:16:57,080
like, we're going to go hunt the
witch and it's just like a woman

1433
01:16:57,080 --> 01:17:01,200
living in a cave or do you want 
it to be like she's really an 

1434
01:17:01,200 --> 01:17:04,360
evil witch or both? 
I I think I would almost be cool

1435
01:17:04,360 --> 01:17:08,400
to have that be part of play as 
the party needing to determine 

1436
01:17:08,400 --> 01:17:12,120
if this is a real threat, a 
supernatural threat, or just 

1437
01:17:12,120 --> 01:17:14,240
like a problem to deal with. 
You know, this is an 

1438
01:17:14,240 --> 01:17:16,200
interpersonal problem. 
They just call them this lady a 

1439
01:17:16,200 --> 01:17:17,120
witch because they don't like 
her. 

1440
01:17:18,160 --> 01:17:20,560
But I think you could lean into 
that too, which is cool. 

1441
01:17:21,040 --> 01:17:25,480
And like you said there, there 
is no, I mean, the picture kind 

1442
01:17:25,480 --> 01:17:27,120
of again, gives you that Puritan
a little bit. 

1443
01:17:27,120 --> 01:17:30,960
But the fact that as written 
right now, you can go everything

1444
01:17:30,960 --> 01:17:37,360
from medieval to like Puritan 17
hundreds, 1800s kind of thing to

1445
01:17:37,400 --> 01:17:41,840
fucking 40K inquisitors with 
really not changing anything at 

1446
01:17:41,840 --> 01:17:45,280
all in this is also, I think a 
fantastic addition to the vibes 

1447
01:17:45,280 --> 01:17:48,640
and to to the game overall. 
Like having it not necessarily 

1448
01:17:48,640 --> 01:17:53,080
be set in a very specific time 
frame, but more giving you the 

1449
01:17:53,080 --> 01:17:57,120
vibes of those time frames is 
really I think beneficial to to 

1450
01:17:57,120 --> 01:17:59,280
allow tables to do a lot with 
with what they have. 

1451
01:17:59,280 --> 01:18:06,800
So. 
So yeah, that's that's hammers. 

1452
01:18:07,160 --> 01:18:09,400
That's that was good. 
It was fun. 

1453
01:18:09,400 --> 01:18:15,680
We should do that again. 
Any final wrap up thoughts on on

1454
01:18:15,680 --> 01:18:18,840
hammers from John Davis? 
And again, we will drop that 

1455
01:18:18,840 --> 01:18:22,360
into the to the links below 
where you can find it. 

1456
01:18:22,360 --> 01:18:25,040
Grab it now while it's $2.00 
because then you'll get the full

1457
01:18:25,040 --> 01:18:26,840
version later. 
But wrap up thoughts. 

1458
01:18:26,840 --> 01:18:30,520
Are we we about done Christian? 
No, I mean, I'm super interested

1459
01:18:30,520 --> 01:18:34,000
to see how it continues to 
develop. 

1460
01:18:34,080 --> 01:18:37,800
I think that, you know, 
especially in like we're in the 

1461
01:18:37,800 --> 01:18:42,000
land of like reviews and like 
things, people putting things 

1462
01:18:42,000 --> 01:18:43,560
out there. 
I think putting stuff out like 

1463
01:18:43,560 --> 01:18:46,640
this is cool. 
Reading stuff like this is cool.

1464
01:18:46,640 --> 01:18:49,440
Thinking about it, even if 
you're a person who isn't like 

1465
01:18:49,440 --> 01:18:52,560
in my side of things, like 
you're not a person who's making

1466
01:18:52,560 --> 01:18:55,080
stuff and you don't have any 
interest to make things, making 

1467
01:18:55,080 --> 01:18:58,880
games yourself. 
This is interesting and cool the

1468
01:18:58,880 --> 01:19:02,320
way that maybe, you know, like 
an old DVD, watch the behind the

1469
01:19:02,320 --> 01:19:05,360
scenes of a movie. 
I think I would encourage, I 

1470
01:19:05,360 --> 01:19:08,240
guess more people generally, 
even if you're just like, I'm a,

1471
01:19:08,600 --> 01:19:11,840
you know, final fit and finish 
product kind of person. 

1472
01:19:12,480 --> 01:19:14,920
I do think it's always cool to 
take a peek at these early 

1473
01:19:14,920 --> 01:19:16,480
things. 
And I think it's cool when 

1474
01:19:16,480 --> 01:19:22,000
people like John in this case or
put it out into the world to see

1475
01:19:22,000 --> 01:19:24,080
what people make of it. 
So I think if nothing else, it 

1476
01:19:24,080 --> 01:19:28,640
is an interesting way to look at
a collection of tools and see 

1477
01:19:28,640 --> 01:19:30,600
this early form and then compare
to later. 

1478
01:19:30,600 --> 01:19:34,200
But yeah, I think definitely 
made makes me hyped to see how 

1479
01:19:34,200 --> 01:19:36,720
it develops. 
And I think it's going to have a

1480
01:19:36,720 --> 01:19:40,240
lot of those, the particularly 
unique cool elements of the sort

1481
01:19:40,240 --> 01:19:43,960
of shifting and character going 
up and down and your followers 

1482
01:19:43,960 --> 01:19:45,280
going up and down. 
And having that be like an 

1483
01:19:45,280 --> 01:19:49,400
expected standard aspect of play
as everyone probably has 

1484
01:19:49,400 --> 01:19:52,480
followers or you're gaining them
quickly if you don't, or losing 

1485
01:19:52,480 --> 01:19:55,600
them, I think is making me think
of whole different ways you 

1486
01:19:55,600 --> 01:19:59,040
could, you know, run these kind 
of games, which is cool. 

1487
01:19:59,800 --> 01:20:03,000
Absolutely. 
I mean 22 parts to that one. 

1488
01:20:03,000 --> 01:20:05,440
This kind of stuff is my 
favorite shit on my shelf. 

1489
01:20:05,440 --> 01:20:08,960
Like the playtest docs, these 
early alpha prints, all that 

1490
01:20:08,960 --> 01:20:10,760
kind of stuff. 
The some of my favorite things 

1491
01:20:10,760 --> 01:20:13,600
and all of the shit behind me. 
These are what they are. 

1492
01:20:13,600 --> 01:20:17,160
I have the 1st 12 years ever 
made before it even hit 

1493
01:20:17,160 --> 01:20:18,640
Kickstarter. 
I have a bunch of stuff like 

1494
01:20:18,640 --> 01:20:20,160
that and. 
I couldn't agree more. 

1495
01:20:20,160 --> 01:20:22,160
I wish more people put out 
things like this. 

1496
01:20:22,160 --> 01:20:25,920
I wish people just made some 
like quick cheap thing and, and,

1497
01:20:25,920 --> 01:20:29,480
and let it get into people's 
hands and stopped waiting until 

1498
01:20:29,480 --> 01:20:32,800
it was fucking polished into a 
diamond to let people see it. 

1499
01:20:32,800 --> 01:20:35,640
Because you know, I dropped my, 
you know, alpha doc for the 

1500
01:20:35,640 --> 01:20:39,920
thing that I'm working on and 
hearing people read it has, I've

1501
01:20:39,920 --> 01:20:42,480
done 2 fucking updates to it 
already, which I wouldn't have 

1502
01:20:42,480 --> 01:20:43,760
done. 
I would have put it in layout 

1503
01:20:43,760 --> 01:20:46,520
and printed it and done all this
thing and been pissed when I got

1504
01:20:46,520 --> 01:20:48,600
it and saw like the typos or 
things like that. 

1505
01:20:48,600 --> 01:20:51,920
So I wish more people would do 
more kind of like DIY stuff like

1506
01:20:51,920 --> 01:20:53,720
this. 
I wish people would release more

1507
01:20:53,720 --> 01:20:55,480
draft stuff. 
No one's going to steal your 

1508
01:20:55,480 --> 01:20:56,760
shit. 
You don't have an IP. 

1509
01:20:56,760 --> 01:20:58,640
Trust me. 
There's nothing you're making 

1510
01:20:58,640 --> 01:21:00,360
that's going to make you a 
millionaire right now. 

1511
01:21:00,360 --> 01:21:01,920
If you're listening to this 
fucking show. 

1512
01:21:02,120 --> 01:21:04,720
Stop worrying about people 
stealing your mechanics or like 

1513
01:21:05,000 --> 01:21:07,000
blurring all of your stuff. 
Let people play with your 

1514
01:21:07,000 --> 01:21:09,760
fucking game. 
Get people excited, you know, 

1515
01:21:09,760 --> 01:21:11,760
because when they buy the 
physical games where you can 

1516
01:21:11,760 --> 01:21:13,200
actually make the money on it, 
so. 

1517
01:21:13,600 --> 01:21:16,800
But it's cool like in it's cool 
in both ways, Like it makes me 

1518
01:21:16,800 --> 01:21:19,280
more interested in the final 
form hammers takes, and then it 

1519
01:21:19,280 --> 01:21:24,760
also feels like it adds to my 
tool kit as a as often the GM as

1520
01:21:24,760 --> 01:21:27,880
a player, right. 
It makes me think, Oh, maybe in 

1521
01:21:27,880 --> 01:21:32,000
my normal, in my standard 
dungeon crawl game on critical 

1522
01:21:32,000 --> 01:21:38,280
failures, I make the hirelings 
rule morale and they ditch when 

1523
01:21:38,280 --> 01:21:40,560
you critical fail because 
they're like, I don't care how 

1524
01:21:40,560 --> 01:21:41,920
much you're paying me. 
I don't want to be, you know, 

1525
01:21:42,240 --> 01:21:44,240
like it's it gives those gears 
turning in interesting ways. 

1526
01:21:44,240 --> 01:21:47,760
So even just as a player as AGM 
for more of like AGM advice 

1527
01:21:47,760 --> 01:21:52,520
thing, it's like reading stuff 
like this helps improve your 

1528
01:21:52,520 --> 01:21:56,880
brain scape of games and. 
Then, you know, and then moving 

1529
01:21:56,880 --> 01:22:00,480
from game design into actually, 
you know, being a, a seller of 

1530
01:22:00,480 --> 01:22:02,320
things and trying to make money 
off of a thing. 

1531
01:22:02,520 --> 01:22:05,000
What do you think that person 
who got to read that playtest 

1532
01:22:05,000 --> 01:22:08,640
doc, it was inspired to change 
something at their table because

1533
01:22:08,640 --> 01:22:10,240
of what you wrote? 
What do you think they're going 

1534
01:22:10,240 --> 01:22:11,880
to do when you release a thing? 
They're going to be like, oh, 

1535
01:22:11,880 --> 01:22:14,320
yeah, I love that thing. 
We play this because of that. 

1536
01:22:14,320 --> 01:22:16,040
Like they brought it to their 
table. 

1537
01:22:16,040 --> 01:22:18,240
They got like three other people
to talk about that thing that 

1538
01:22:18,240 --> 01:22:19,960
you made because you dropped the
playtest doc. 

1539
01:22:19,960 --> 01:22:23,760
I don't know, I I I'm always I'm
I'm very much a release stuff 

1540
01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:25,520
for free as PDF. 
Make your money on the book 

1541
01:22:25,520 --> 01:22:26,720
thing. 
But if you're not going to do 

1542
01:22:26,720 --> 01:22:29,920
that, release your alpha copy so
people can get excited for it 

1543
01:22:30,120 --> 01:22:31,360
and then do whatever you want 
with it. 

1544
01:22:31,360 --> 01:22:34,360
But you know that it is what it 
is. 

1545
01:22:34,360 --> 01:22:38,000
I don't remember the other point
that I made, but I think I think

1546
01:22:38,000 --> 01:22:40,760
that's a good stop. 
Any I think we talked about at 

1547
01:22:40,760 --> 01:22:43,520
the top of the show, but where? 
Where can people find you and 

1548
01:22:43,520 --> 01:22:48,400
your stuff, Christian? 
Yeah, people can find all my 

1549
01:22:48,400 --> 01:22:56,200
stuff at Meet Castle Gamewear. 
It's where like Ware my wares. 

1550
01:22:57,120 --> 01:22:59,560
Meet Castle gamewear.com got a 
blog on there. 

1551
01:22:59,560 --> 01:23:03,080
I've been doing posts on. 
I have my monthly newsletter, 

1552
01:23:03,080 --> 01:23:05,160
which I'm getting back to 
actually really being monthly. 

1553
01:23:05,160 --> 01:23:09,400
It was not monthly last year and
then also as part of my most 

1554
01:23:09,400 --> 01:23:11,800
recent newsletter. 
My main thing right now is I 

1555
01:23:11,800 --> 01:23:16,160
have pre-orders up for my 3rd 
annual Zine, which basically 

1556
01:23:16,160 --> 01:23:19,360
collects all the little free 
supplements and tool kits and 

1557
01:23:19,360 --> 01:23:21,200
all that kind of stuff that I 
put out as part of my 

1558
01:23:21,200 --> 01:23:22,760
newsletter. 
And this one has an additional 

1559
01:23:22,760 --> 01:23:25,120
thing I had just put on itch for
free that wasn't part of the 

1560
01:23:25,120 --> 01:23:28,520
newsletter in it into a nice 
print Zine that's going to come 

1561
01:23:28,520 --> 01:23:29,440
out. 
So I'm going to order those 

1562
01:23:29,440 --> 01:23:31,440
probably in about a week. 
And then as soon as I get the 

1563
01:23:31,480 --> 01:23:33,120
print run in, they're going to 
go out to people. 

1564
01:23:33,400 --> 01:23:37,880
And you can also get the annual 
number one and annual #2 on 

1565
01:23:37,880 --> 01:23:39,480
there. 
They've got like this one has 

1566
01:23:39,480 --> 01:23:42,000
like went down and sort of a 
Karen rabbit hole this last year

1567
01:23:42,000 --> 01:23:45,160
in 2025. 
So it's got an adventure for 

1568
01:23:45,160 --> 01:23:47,880
Karen and a player class. 
And then it also has some 

1569
01:23:47,880 --> 01:23:51,600
mothership module type stuff. 
It has a one page RPG like a 

1570
01:23:51,600 --> 01:23:55,640
honey hack, Honey Heist hack 
that I actually made for a job 

1571
01:23:55,640 --> 01:23:57,840
interview, as weird as that 
might sound. 

1572
01:23:59,320 --> 01:24:04,160
Not an RPG job, by the way, just
a marketing job interview. 

1573
01:24:05,160 --> 01:24:09,120
And yeah, so that's my current 
thing that I'm doing. 

1574
01:24:09,120 --> 01:24:12,560
And then I'm gonna be keeping 
down in the future into more 

1575
01:24:12,560 --> 01:24:15,440
things like Stranger Stars and 
Tacticians updates and that kind

1576
01:24:15,440 --> 01:24:16,840
of stuff. 
Awesome. 

1577
01:24:16,840 --> 01:24:19,120
Yeah, I love your annuals. 
I think it's fantastic. 

1578
01:24:19,120 --> 01:24:23,000
Again, we talked about this. 
I wish stop, stop, stop, stop 

1579
01:24:23,000 --> 01:24:26,040
making everything so polished. 
Everybody like Christine is such

1580
01:24:26,040 --> 01:24:29,160
a perfect example of like, have 
an idea, put out the idea, let 

1581
01:24:29,160 --> 01:24:31,680
it bounce around at the end of 
the year, put it together, 

1582
01:24:31,680 --> 01:24:33,640
Nazine, throw that out there. 
Let people see all of your 

1583
01:24:33,640 --> 01:24:36,320
stuff. 
I mean, I'm excited for #3 I 

1584
01:24:36,320 --> 01:24:38,880
have number one and two of the 
of your collected stuff. 

1585
01:24:38,880 --> 01:24:41,320
And between the newsletter, 
between those and between all 

1586
01:24:41,320 --> 01:24:44,080
the little stuff you put out, 
there's just so much cool stuff 

1587
01:24:44,800 --> 01:24:47,480
and more people need to make 
small cool things and just 

1588
01:24:47,480 --> 01:24:49,520
release it to the people. 
And I think you're such a 

1589
01:24:49,520 --> 01:24:52,240
perfect example of that. 
So yeah, thanks so much for 

1590
01:24:52,240 --> 01:24:54,320
coming on the show again. 
I expect you to be on multiple 

1591
01:24:54,320 --> 01:24:56,640
times this year, whether it's 
playing a game, talking about 

1592
01:24:56,640 --> 01:24:58,120
your game, or reviewing another 
game. 

1593
01:24:58,120 --> 01:25:01,160
So really appreciate it. 
Yeah, thanks for having me. 

1594
01:25:01,320 --> 01:25:03,360
Always fun under talking. 
Good excuse. 

1595
01:25:03,360 --> 01:25:04,520
You were like, what do you want 
to review? 

1596
01:25:04,520 --> 01:25:06,600
And I was like what about this 
Hammers thing? 

1597
01:25:06,960 --> 01:25:08,160
Yeah, heard something about 
this. 

1598
01:25:08,160 --> 01:25:10,280
So it was a good reason to get 
me to actually sit down and read

1599
01:25:10,280 --> 01:25:12,920
stuff rather than, you know, 
doing whatever else over the 

1600
01:25:12,920 --> 01:25:15,040
holidays I would have been 
wasting time with SO. 

1601
01:25:15,240 --> 01:25:17,320
There we go. 
So yeah, so like I said, expect 

1602
01:25:17,320 --> 01:25:19,680
Christian back multiple times 
and that's going to be us for 

1603
01:25:19,680 --> 01:25:21,840
today. 
We will see you all later. 

1604
01:25:21,840 --> 01:25:25,080
Bye. 
Bye.