1 00:00:04,480 --> 00:00:06,960 You're listening to Weird and Dead, the paleontology podcast 2 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:09,200 that tells evolutions most embarrassing and bizarre 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:10,840 stories. I'm Megan Wetherell. 4 00:00:10,920 --> 00:00:14,000 And I'm Amy Atwater, and we're two living scientists who are 5 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:15,920 weirdly excited about dead things. 6 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:20,520 We started season 3 with an episode about urine, which ended 7 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:24,160 with a terrible life altering reveal from Amy that some 8 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:25,840 turtles piss out of their mouths. 9 00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:29,440 Megan then had a full on crash out about it that we recorded 10 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:31,800 for Patreon. And we are now releasing it as a 11 00:00:31,800 --> 00:00:34,480 holiday gift for you. Horrible turtle facts for 12 00:00:34,480 --> 00:00:36,760 everybody. Speaking of Patreon, did you 13 00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:40,240 know that there is more than an entire season of full length 14 00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:44,080 exclusive episodes over there? You can binge them all for a 15 00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:47,440 mere $5 a month at patreon.com/weird and Dead 16 00:00:47,640 --> 00:00:49,840 Podcast. As always, we are disgusting, 17 00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:53,080 and on Patreon we feel even more confident about being more 18 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:55,600 disgusting, so pay close attention to the content 19 00:00:55,600 --> 00:01:00,280 warnings in the description. You brought up at the first 20 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:03,120 episode of this season, Amy, that there is a turtle that can 21 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:06,120 piss through its mouth and that you didn't have time to really 22 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:08,760 look into it. But that just blew my God damn 23 00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:11,160 mind. So I. 24 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:15,600 Blew that turtle's mouth. I did not find the one paper 25 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:18,400 from the 1880s that I really wanted to. 26 00:01:18,600 --> 00:01:21,840 I didn't have time to do that. But So what I will say is 27 00:01:22,680 --> 00:01:26,280 regarding that paper and regarding this paper, the paper 28 00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:28,920 that you read and talked about, or at least that you. 29 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:33,360 Skimmed briefly skimmed enough to be like, is this, is this? 30 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:38,280 I was like, it's legit enough I'm mentioning it. 31 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:42,480 Oh, yeah, no, it's, it's legit. And actually, the more that I 32 00:01:42,480 --> 00:01:45,360 read about their research methods, which I will be 33 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:47,880 summarizing for you today 'cause they are funny to think about, 34 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:50,240 they, they did a very thorough job. 35 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:55,080 But what is funny to me is so this paper is from 2012. 36 00:01:55,960 --> 00:02:00,760 It has 19 citations, most of which are the same author 37 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:03,880 publishing slightly different experiments on turtle 38 00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:08,960 mouthpissing. My career, my legacy, yes. 39 00:02:09,759 --> 00:02:13,520 And then like weird like pop science articles that are 40 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:16,120 somehow getting picked up by Google Scholar as citations. 41 00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:20,760 So like there has not been people have not lurked, looked 42 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:23,680 into other turtles. Opportunity. 43 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:28,640 Let me tell you a little bit about the history of what the 44 00:02:28,640 --> 00:02:30,280 fuck is going on with this turtle. 45 00:02:30,280 --> 00:02:34,960 So First off, this turtle is I think it just had a rename for 46 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:36,920 the genus. It's like trionics and it's 47 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:42,040 synesis synonesis, whatever. It's the Chinese soft. 48 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:44,000 Shell Trionics is soft shell, right? 49 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:49,760 We had those in Texas, yeah. And it's apparently the world's 50 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:54,000 most economically important turtle because it's eaten a lot. 51 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:58,800 This is like pigeons. Yes, it is just the turtle of 52 00:02:58,800 --> 00:03:00,920 pigeons. Yeah, or the pigeons of turtles. 53 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:10,720 So yes, it's pretty well studied, but when in the very 54 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:13,720 introduction of this 2012 paper, they talk about the fact that 55 00:03:13,920 --> 00:03:17,360 we've known since about the 1880s that something was fucked 56 00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:19,760 up with this turtle. The way you keep saying this 57 00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:23,560 really makes it sound like it's one individual turtle like this. 58 00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:28,080 Like this one creepy fucker. The reason I really wanted to 59 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:31,280 find this paper is because I cannot at this point in time 60 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:34,720 exclude that it is at least just one species of this, of turtles 61 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:39,200 like it. This 1880s paper said that they, 62 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:42,160 we noticed that it has these little dingly danglies in the 63 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:47,320 mouth and throat of this species of turtle and a few soft shelled 64 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:50,600 turtles. So maybe there are some other 65 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:53,440 species, but it seems to only be this particular species that 66 00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:56,000 people are studying it in, presumably because it's 67 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:59,920 economically valuable. And so it's easy to access, it's 68 00:03:59,920 --> 00:04:03,000 easy to get. They're the the laboratory baths 69 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:04,720 of turtles of soft. Shelled turtles. 70 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:10,800 I'm sorry, Trionics, that's. Pretty easy to acquire one of 71 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:14,560 these turtles, I guess I I did want to see what these looked 72 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:15,440 like. Yeah. 73 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:19,959 And so I did go and I found a paper that finally has an image. 74 00:04:20,519 --> 00:04:23,960 And before you Scroll down, I want you to tell me what you 75 00:04:23,960 --> 00:04:26,880 envision. I mean, in your head to back up, 76 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:28,640 to back up, in case you didn't listen to that episode. 77 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:31,520 I guess these are called bucopharyngeal viliform 78 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:33,080 processes. Fancy. 79 00:04:33,240 --> 00:04:35,360 These turtles excrete urine through their mouths. 80 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:38,600 More about that later, but they use these little dingley danglia 81 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:41,120 to do so. Now, given that, what were you 82 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:44,080 envisioning? Will you mean of inside their 83 00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:46,800 throat or the whole Organism? I mean not of the turtle. 84 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:49,160 I I know what a turtle looks like, but what did you think 85 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:54,520 that the. I guess I thought it looks like 86 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:58,520 maybe like the inside of a cave with a bunch of stalagmites and 87 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:02,040 stalagtites, kind of like growing from or like whatever 88 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:06,560 your little dingly dangly is just like but like multiplied by 89 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:09,400 like 100. How many by how many? 90 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:14,160 I guess when I was really no, no, I think in my mind's eye 91 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:17,200 when I thought about this turtle pissing through its mouth, I 92 00:05:17,200 --> 00:05:19,640 almost kind of thought of them as like utters inside their 93 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:22,520 mouth. So maybe like I don't know, 10 94 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:25,920 would be my like picture. That's what I was envisioning 95 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:29,960 for sure, was about 10 flesh stalactites hanging down from 96 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:36,640 the roof of the mouth. OK, so go to the image you can 97 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:40,320 Scroll down, it's the only one. I deserve this. 98 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:45,120 I deserve every bit of this after the pigeon fiasco. 99 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:50,840 I don't like it. Why don't you? 100 00:05:50,840 --> 00:05:53,560 Describe what you see on the right first. 101 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:57,640 I mean, that looks like the shit taking over the animals and 102 00:05:57,640 --> 00:06:01,640 creatures and Princess Mononoke. Like they're covered in these 103 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:06,080 like creepy, wormy fleshy things that are very dense. 104 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:09,280 And it's like almost like a fur, but it's like you can tell it's 105 00:06:09,280 --> 00:06:12,680 like fleshy and gross, but it seems to be quite fine, you 106 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:15,120 know, like a hair kind of texture there. 107 00:06:15,360 --> 00:06:20,400 And yeah, I mean, or, or even kind of like, you know how like 108 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:25,440 an an enemy or like a starfish will kind of cling to you with 109 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:29,640 their creepy little tube fingery things kind of like that, yeah. 110 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:36,120 OK so now in the panel on the left the the letter L is for 111 00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:40,560 lower jaw and the T stands for tongue to give you an ideal of 112 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:44,880 scale. So how these things are hair 113 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:48,520 hair size? They are they hair size and hair 114 00:06:48,520 --> 00:06:53,200 density? Like if I opened a turtle's 115 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:55,640 mouth for whatever reason, I don't know why I would, but if I 116 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:58,280 did and I saw this, I would assume it had a mold. 117 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:03,880 Infestation, I could see that I could see that it it or yeah, it 118 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:08,520 was it was sprouting straight up hairs or something like that. 119 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:11,360 I would not think it was. Well, that would definitely be a 120 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:13,280 conclusion was. No, you would think it. 121 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:14,440 You're sick. Yeah. 122 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:16,600 You poor. Yes, Yeah, it does. 123 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:18,880 It kind of looks like, I mean, it looks like like little 124 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:21,840 bacteria kind of sprouting off of everything, right? 125 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:25,280 Yeah, I think I was also envisioning kind of like what we 126 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:28,720 see in the the cloacas of turtles that do a lot of butt 127 00:07:28,720 --> 00:07:31,320 breathing, like right, you know, it's. 128 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:37,960 More intricate caverns. Yes, more caverns, less, less 129 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:40,320 fuzz. Yes, very fine. 130 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:42,840 Yeah, like it just swallowed a hairball. 131 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:46,720 It's it is the hair, It is the hair and it's going down the 132 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:51,760 throat like it's eucopharyngeal. It's not, it doesn't tip of the 133 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:54,560 mouth. It's going down into the back of 134 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:56,600 the back of the mouth, beginning of the throat. 135 00:07:57,600 --> 00:08:01,600 Yeah, pretty foul. Puffed soft. 136 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:07,880 Remarkably, they didn't say. I would assume so. 137 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:15,800 Beautiful piss fibers. Yeah, yeah. 138 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:19,080 So you said piss fibers, but initially when these were 139 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:21,840 discovered and reported, of course nobody knew what the fuck 140 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:24,640 they were for. But people had recently started 141 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:27,160 to theorize that turtles were butt breathing. 142 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:29,840 So if you can butt breathe, why not mouth breathe? 143 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:33,080 You know, the regular way. Except just, I guess not all of 144 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,320 the way. Oh, so butt breathing is what 145 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:37,000 inspired us to look in the mouth. 146 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:42,679 We started with the butt. I mean, at least it's what 147 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:46,240 inspired us to look at these things and be like, that's not 148 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:49,480 an infection that probably serves an evolutionary purpose. 149 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:51,800 What is the purpose? So some things that have been 150 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:54,560 theorized have been OK, well, they're really vascular. 151 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:58,000 Like it's just such a gross description. 152 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:00,440 It is for. Throat fibers, yeah. 153 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:03,240 Yeah, I don't like that. It's nasty. 154 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:05,520 So OK, maybe they're for respiratory use. 155 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:09,520 Maybe they're for regulating salt in water. 156 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:12,520 You know, like getting rid of it, adding it, whatever a turtle 157 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:14,560 needs to fucking do. Salt, Martha Stewart. 158 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:19,080 A little more salt, yeah? I don't know at what point they 159 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:22,640 started to think. I think that's for piss. 160 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:27,760 I wasn't able to track down that particular thought process, but 161 00:09:28,560 --> 00:09:32,600 I was able to track down that at around the 1990s they started to 162 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:36,760 notice some weird behavioral patterns in this turtle. 163 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:41,720 So in about the 1990s a paper emerges saying why the fuck are 164 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:45,480 these turtles gargling? My God. 165 00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:47,640 Like why do they gargle the water? 166 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:51,080 That seems a little odd. Mint tea, fresh breath. 167 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:54,680 Yeah, kind of right. Like so. 168 00:09:54,680 --> 00:09:56,200 Nope, the. Opposite. 169 00:09:56,400 --> 00:09:58,680 The fucking opposite. What was the way? 170 00:09:59,240 --> 00:10:00,760 Yeah. So they noticed that they're 171 00:10:00,760 --> 00:10:03,280 they're doing, they're gargling, they're moving their throat in 172 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:06,600 and out, and they're really only doing it in the water, like 173 00:10:06,600 --> 00:10:08,600 they're not doing it out of the water. 174 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:12,000 And they notice that they do it way more when you take them and 175 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:14,680 you don't come and physically hold them in the water. 176 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:19,440 So if you immerse the turtle again manually, yeah, you, you 177 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:21,240 get a lot more. My God. 178 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:22,400 Shocking. Well, right. 179 00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:23,920 Isn't that pretty normal? Right. 180 00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:26,920 You're like, I'm straight. I'm like making you drown like 181 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:29,480 this. Of course, that's like, I yeah, 182 00:10:29,480 --> 00:10:32,520 this is OK all right, All right. Not focusing on the why, 183 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,120 focusing on the how and the and the science. 184 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:36,520 Yep. Not the humans. 185 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:42,760 Not the humans. So in 2012, these authors 186 00:10:42,760 --> 00:10:45,960 decided to, I don't know where they got the piss theory from, 187 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:48,520 but they decided to test the piss theory, that this was 188 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:52,200 actually an adaptation for getting rid of urea. 189 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:53,320 Yeah. My RIA. 190 00:10:53,560 --> 00:11:02,280 And okay, so at this point I have two pathways for you as far 191 00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:04,800 as how you would like this information presented to you and 192 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:06,600 to the rest of the world. Oh, OK. 193 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:08,760 I thought it was going to be like how I'd like my urine to 194 00:11:08,760 --> 00:11:13,040 leave my body and. I mean, so that's option one. 195 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:16,840 OK, option one is let's, let's talk first about. 196 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:19,200 I couldn't decide what was the best way to present this 197 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:22,160 information. So option one is let's pause and 198 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:24,560 before we learn about turtles being strapped to tables. 199 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:26,240 Which? Sorry, everybody, it's a funny 200 00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:28,160 visual. We're going to go. 201 00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:32,000 And it is. They're, they're, they're fine. 202 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:38,360 They did. I don't know they did, but 203 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:43,200 anyways, okay, so the other so the first option is let's go 204 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:47,320 down the the weird channel that leads us to veganism or we can 205 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:50,360 talk more about this experiment. I think let's go veganism first. 206 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:51,600 We'll come. Okay, experiment. 207 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:54,160 All right, I guess I'd love to know how this is all. 208 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:58,720 Veganism then cruelty. Aren't those like? 209 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:01,720 Kind of the same. I mean, you know, not the same 210 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:05,800 not but you know, related. Same body of ideas. 211 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:08,240 Yeah, yeah. Let's talk about urea. 212 00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:15,120 So I at one point in my life for OMSI I witnessed a shark 213 00:12:15,120 --> 00:12:17,360 dissection. That's the Oregon Way. 214 00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:21,600 And I think they must have hit the bladder because all of a 215 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:25,560 sudden the world became unbelievably foul smelling. 216 00:12:25,560 --> 00:12:27,360 Like the shark didn't smell great before. 217 00:12:27,680 --> 00:12:31,760 But then we had a whole bunch of what was ammonia. 218 00:12:31,760 --> 00:12:32,520 Yeah, release. Right. 219 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:35,560 And that confused me for a long time because I thought from then 220 00:12:35,560 --> 00:12:38,160 on we peed ammonia. We do not. 221 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:40,720 We are not ammonia. Person I love that though. 222 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:44,560 I love your like empathy. You were just like the shark. 223 00:12:44,560 --> 00:12:49,440 We are one, we are the same. Yeah, which like, I've smelled 224 00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:52,160 my own piss on a regular basis, Kind of hard to avoid. 225 00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:54,000 It's not like I'm trying to do it deliberately. 226 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:56,920 But ammonia, That's not what my pee smells like. 227 00:12:56,920 --> 00:12:59,360 Because my pee, like your pee, is urea. 228 00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:04,720 I don't pee ammonia ammonia super poisonous, super toxic. 229 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:07,280 That doesn't mean that you don't your body doesn't make it. 230 00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:10,560 It does it's a waste product, but it does mean that if we were 231 00:13:10,560 --> 00:13:14,360 pissing ammonia in order to safely get it out of our bodies, 232 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:17,480 we would have to be consuming way more water because you 233 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:22,040 really have to dilute ammonia to safely remove it from your body 234 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:24,400 without I don't know. I don't know what it would do 235 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:27,160 burn through your ear burning everything. 236 00:13:27,760 --> 00:13:31,960 So we've got animals with P ammonia are almost entirely 237 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:34,320 aquatic. So things like sharks and fish. 238 00:13:34,560 --> 00:13:37,840 That's why sometimes if you have fish in a fish tank, you have to 239 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:39,320 be careful about the nitrogen levels. 240 00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:41,280 And when they say nitrogen levels, they're talking about. 241 00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:43,920 Ammonia. Right, because that could be why 242 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:49,520 all goldfish die. But exactly so with humans and 243 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:54,640 mammals, we pee urea out. So we actually take it and we 244 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:57,120 process it. Most of that transformation 245 00:13:57,120 --> 00:13:59,800 process happens in the liver to get rid of the ammonia. 246 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:03,000 It goes into some byproducts and then our kidneys turn it into 247 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:06,680 urea and we excrete it. And that's important because 248 00:14:06,680 --> 00:14:11,480 that means that the mouth pissing it is pissing out mostly 249 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:14,200 urea. And so it's taking kind of the 250 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:17,880 the function of the kidneys. It is kidney hair, not liver 251 00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:19,960 hair in this. I'm just, this is super 252 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:22,680 fascinating because in like pregnancy you have to be 253 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:24,880 monitoring kidney function a lot. 254 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:28,960 Like I had preeclampsia and then full blown eclampsia and that's 255 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:30,640 like also related to kidney function. 256 00:14:30,640 --> 00:14:33,200 And like you're just like overwhelming your kidneys with, 257 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:34,840 I think you're, I don't quite remember. 258 00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:37,680 I just know it could kill you. But so it's just very, yeah, 259 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:41,440 it's just like, OK, so different pathways of dealing with your 260 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:45,560 waste products. Yes, now there is 1/3 pathway 261 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:49,960 and this is the pathway of a lot of reptiles, turns out. 262 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:52,400 Not turtles, I guess, or at least not these turtles. 263 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:55,520 But they take it and they make it into uric acid, so they 264 00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:58,040 concentrate it even further. That's why you get the slurry, 265 00:14:58,200 --> 00:14:59,600 as we've discussed in the. Right. 266 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,640 Or we talked about the Komodo dragon cocaine poop. 267 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:05,360 That's like, I don't know if that's uric acid or if it's all 268 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:07,960 the calcium in the bones that they eat, but they just have 269 00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:12,600 like poop. The urine is like powder. 270 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:16,480 Yeah, I think it's it's mostly the calcium because not all 271 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,480 other reptiles do that. But yeah, so uric acid, it does. 272 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:23,080 It's very white and it makes kind of like for birds, it's the 273 00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:26,160 white component of the bird. Poop that's in the scat rap. 274 00:15:26,160 --> 00:15:30,800 The scat rap song I remember. Yeah, park your car in a by 275 00:15:31,400 --> 00:15:35,240 something or a field getting scat on your window shield full 276 00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:36,200 of seeds. Shield. 277 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:39,120 Wow. Something why you got bombed by 278 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:40,920 a bird in flight. I know the whole thing girl, 279 00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:41,960 Don't. Don't even. 280 00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:44,160 Don't even test it. Never memorized that. 281 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:46,760 So the whole thing really excited, yeah. 282 00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:50,200 Down by the cheek on a hollow log scat full of berries. 283 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:53,200 Bones of a frog up last night he was up the moon hunting. 284 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:54,800 Craw dies. It was Mr. Raccoon. 285 00:15:57,520 --> 00:15:58,680 Oh God. Yeah. 286 00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:05,320 OMSI did a dumper on both of us. One more content and you don't 287 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:08,000 want to wait, or maybe you don't want to hear ads like this? 288 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:11,080 Well, head on over to our Patreon for exclusive content, 289 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:13,800 early ad free episodes, and so much more. 290 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,840 For only $5 a month, you can hear outtakes, exclusive 291 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:20,120 episodes, and the stuff we cut for time, and also the stuff we 292 00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:23,240 cut because it was just too much for the general public. 293 00:16:24,840 --> 00:16:27,760 Looking for fresh fashion with a science twist? 294 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:30,440 Be sure to check out Geopedal Fabric, Megan's clothing 295 00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:32,480 company. These geek chic designs look 296 00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:35,200 fantastic and make for excellent conversation starters. 297 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,360 Plus, get 10% off using code weird and dead. 298 00:16:38,360 --> 00:16:41,400 Head on over to geopedalfabric.com now. 299 00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:47,000 I, I did go down a little bit of a separate rabbit hole because I 300 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:50,400 didn't want to figure out if Google AI was correct or not, 301 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:54,160 which of course it was not. It was more of a kangaroo rat 302 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:58,280 shaped rabbit hole because I was like, oh, OK, well, kangaroo 303 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:00,840 rats do a lot of concentration. Are they actually turning it 304 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:03,720 into uric acid and that's how they're peeing it out? 305 00:17:03,720 --> 00:17:08,200 And no, turns out they just have hyper concentrated urea. 306 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:11,160 So they are still using urea. Oh, and that's the, that's the 307 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:12,960 other issue. So if you're going from urea to 308 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:17,000 your uric acid, you are. Again, uric acid is 309 00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:20,319 metabolically harder to make, so it takes more steps. 310 00:17:20,319 --> 00:17:23,000 You burn more ATP, you're burning more energy to make it. 311 00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:27,079 But it does require less water to get rid of because it is less 312 00:17:27,079 --> 00:17:30,200 toxic. So it's like the path of poison 313 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:34,360 is basically from ammonia. OK, that's not so bad. 314 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:36,480 But if you're in water. But if you're not in water, you 315 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:37,720 need to use less water to get rid of it. 316 00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:41,320 So then you get urea. Urea can again be kind of toxic, 317 00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:44,840 so you do have to use some water to dilute it and the uric acid 318 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:49,280 you need even less to dilute it. So kangaroo rats have just taken 319 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:52,480 a completely different route to make their urine so hyper 320 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:56,120 concentrated and use less water. I don't know exactly what their 321 00:17:56,120 --> 00:18:00,200 route is, but I know they are pissing urea, not uric acid. 322 00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:02,840 Little crystals. Little urea crystals. 323 00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:05,440 There's probably some uric acid. I mean, we also have some uric 324 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:08,000 acid in our bodies. That's how you get gout is a 325 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:12,160 build up of uric acid, but primarily we're urea. 326 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:14,680 Let's talk about how this somehow. 327 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:17,920 Relates to veganism. As I was looking up ammonia and 328 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:19,920 urea and trying to figure out what the fuck the difference is 329 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:25,360 and why my piss doesn't smell like shark piss, I, I realized 330 00:18:25,360 --> 00:18:28,360 that like, OK, this is nitrogenous waste. 331 00:18:28,360 --> 00:18:32,920 This is nitrogen based waste. That's the sort of stuff you put 332 00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:35,440 on your plants. Again, I have to like, I'm 333 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:39,520 trying to like increase my crop yield of grass for my animals. 334 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:42,640 So I've been reading a lot about like crazy things I could be 335 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:47,480 doing to my 20 acres of grass in order to encourage grass growth 336 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:49,240 and remove rushes. And one of them was like 337 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:52,120 nitrogen and increasing your fertilizer and little. 338 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:54,400 Right. Which, like my animals poop out 339 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:56,000 there all the time because they're not fertilizing. 340 00:18:56,040 --> 00:19:00,600 Right. So I was like, oh, OK, piss. 341 00:19:01,120 --> 00:19:03,120 Do people use piss as fertilizer? 342 00:19:03,840 --> 00:19:06,360 And that's how we get to veganism. 343 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:11,120 OK, I I do love you. I don't understand anything 344 00:19:11,120 --> 00:19:13,680 that's happening right now. Yep. 345 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:18,600 OK, so I and I don't know fully why but so this is. 346 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:22,440 Is this like bat guano? Is that like related to all this 347 00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:25,280 anyway? I mean, bat guano is potentially 348 00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:30,000 fertilizer, but when I went and I looked up, OK, how do you use 349 00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:32,800 urea? Can you just pee on your fields? 350 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:37,760 The first thing that came up was a site talking all about how to 351 00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:41,240 use pee for your garden. And it was, of course. 352 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:42,840 From hippies. From Hippie. 353 00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:45,000 Vegans. Of course, I visited many of 354 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:47,720 these farms in Eugene. They are horrifying. 355 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:51,000 Yeah, they smell like piss. Yeah, I am shit. 356 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,000 Human shit. Yeah, good for you. 357 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:59,680 So I don't know 100% if the reason that this vegan, I don't 358 00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:02,160 know if it was just this one vegan webpage that was like, 359 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:05,800 yeah, everybody pissed on your plants or if they were looking 360 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:08,920 for ways to increase their crop yield that didn't rely. 361 00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:11,480 On fertilizer from animals, right? 362 00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:13,640 Because they're vegans. So if you're using poop from 363 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:16,560 cows. They won't even use fertilizer. 364 00:20:17,120 --> 00:20:20,360 Well, that's still encouraging the market for cows. 365 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:22,600 I mean, but probably. Fine market if all you're doing 366 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:25,400 is waiting for poop, but. Shouldn't we use all parts of 367 00:20:25,400 --> 00:20:29,400 the cow I just? I I don't know, I don't know if 368 00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:31,320 that's how they got there. I don't know actually how 369 00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:33,960 fertilizer is made. Maybe there's other animal 370 00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:35,520 byproduct parts in it. I. 371 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:39,160 OK, so that kind of OK, I can, I can I can see the connection 372 00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:41,040 between OK, all right, all right, sure. 373 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:44,760 Yeah, so I want you to know that down on this website they did 374 00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:47,240 have, even though they didn't talk about why the fuck they 375 00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:49,200 were getting to pee in the 1st place. 376 00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:51,280 I mean I guess it is something you have on hand. 377 00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:56,320 They had a whole subtitle said is this even vegan? 378 00:20:56,520 --> 00:20:59,440 Because it's human and. They say, sort of. 379 00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:03,120 My my God. It depends on how you use it and 380 00:21:03,120 --> 00:21:06,320 how you look at it. Using human urine isn't a plant 381 00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:09,320 based technique, so in its purest form it can't be 382 00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:13,000 considered plant based growing. Humans are animals, right? 383 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,920 Yeah. But on the other hand, it's 384 00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:18,800 yours, so you know if you're being manipulated into making. 385 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:22,880 Right, if it's cruelty or not, I mean, yeah, I do like to pee 386 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:25,240 outside. So I mean, that would be nice. 387 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:28,880 Well, if you would like me to come to your farm and pee on 388 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:31,320 your your crops, I'd be more than happy to. 389 00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:35,760 So the the subtitles on this website were some of the most 390 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:39,840 bizarre, like just mental tangents that are clearly 391 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,000 related but are just not things that would have come up for me 392 00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:46,520 and thinking about this stuff. And yeah, they had, they said 393 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:50,440 studies conducted in Sweden and then they listed 2 paper like 394 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,040 citations. But then they never gave us the 395 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:53,760 rest of the papers. So I don't know if these are 396 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:57,400 real papers or if they, just like Google AI came up with. 397 00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:01,560 Some 90s papers show that an adult's urine contains enough 398 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:06,080 nutrients to fertilize 50 to 100% of the crops needed to feed 399 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:08,880 one adult. They are not putting a number on 400 00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:10,920 how much urine. I don't know if that means we 401 00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:13,120 need to pee a full year. Right. 402 00:22:13,360 --> 00:22:18,280 Or this is this feels vague, this feels I have a lot of 403 00:22:18,280 --> 00:22:22,240 questions about all of those, Yes, of those numbers, yes. 404 00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:26,400 Yeah, so you can pee and use urine. 405 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,960 They had a using urine or using pee. 406 00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:34,680 A how to guide. OK, keep in mind that urine is 407 00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:36,840 high in nitrogen. Well, yeah, no shit. 408 00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:40,000 That's why we're using it. You may need to pee daily, but 409 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,000 your plants don't need your daily pee. 410 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,960 I'm sorry, pee daily. I pee way more than once a day. 411 00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:48,160 I that's actually. A good point. 412 00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:50,360 Maybe you wouldn't if you were a vegan. 413 00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:54,200 If you only pee once a day, there is something wrong. 414 00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:57,400 You need to go to a doctor and drink some fucking water. 415 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:03,080 OK, so you shouldn't be dousing the same plants with urine every 416 00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:04,480 day. That's what the point is. 417 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:09,320 Yes, yeah, in part because you can over fertilize plants and it 418 00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:11,120 can it can burn them essentially. 419 00:23:11,120 --> 00:23:14,240 So you can kill plants that way. As a basic premise, the urine 420 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:16,760 must be mixed with carbon rich materials in order for the 421 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,440 nitrogen to become accessible to the plants. 422 00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:22,400 So that includes things like leaves, straw, or just good 423 00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:25,400 quality earthy soil. So if you don't have any carbon 424 00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:27,800 in your soil, your nitrogen probably isn't. 425 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:29,040 I'm going to do. Too much. 426 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:31,320 OK Chemistry. OK. 427 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:35,160 Yeah, OK. So to avoid the problems of too 428 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:38,880 much nitrogen and to make sure that it is readily accessible to 429 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:42,600 the plants their first recipe, this is option #1. 430 00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:45,280 I love that it's a recipe. Grab a reclaimed plastic 431 00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:47,800 container and take a peek. Has to be re diluted. 432 00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:50,360 By the way, can we talk about that plastic was made out of oil 433 00:23:50,360 --> 00:23:52,200 products? But that's totally cool anyway, 434 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:54,840 sorry. That is technically, you know, 435 00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:57,440 maybe old animals. Well, it's mostly old plants, 436 00:23:57,440 --> 00:23:59,520 but. It's also fucking animals. 437 00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:03,280 It's foraminifera forever ago. So just saying Foraminifera. 438 00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:05,760 Yeah, just fucking saying. Yeah, plastic's not vegan. 439 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:12,280 Upset the industry. So then you dilute it with eight 440 00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:14,480 to 10 parts of water and apply it to the soil. 441 00:24:14,840 --> 00:24:18,160 Easy peasy. So yeah, you have to piss just a 442 00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:22,400 little bit into your plastic container and dilute it a lot 443 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,240 with water. Oh my God, this is just 444 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:27,000 bringing. Back this is safe so. 445 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:31,040 Many pregnancy memories. So many pregnancy oh, OMSI 20 446 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:33,560 the urine, urine. Oh yeah, so many times I got 447 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:36,080 peed on in the John Day River. Oh, I was just thinking of like 448 00:24:36,360 --> 00:24:39,960 long drives, like the counselors talking about all of the times 449 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,240 that they've had, like all the male counselors, like bragging. 450 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:44,200 About peeing in mountain. Bottles for some reason. 451 00:24:44,200 --> 00:24:45,120 Yeah. Yeah. 452 00:24:45,120 --> 00:24:46,800 Your brother's generation was fucking weird. 453 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:48,400 Yeah. Well, he still is. 454 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,360 It's still, it's still a problem. 455 00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,320 Yeah, But no, I mean, I don't know if I told, I'm sure I did 456 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:54,920 at the time. I have pictures of it because I 457 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:57,200 was like, I have to document this not of me peeing. 458 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:00,600 But again, I was pre eclamptic in pregnancy and now I'm 459 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:02,760 remembering it has to do with like protein in your urine, 460 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:06,120 which is not good because it means that your kidneys aren't 461 00:25:06,120 --> 00:25:08,360 able to like process everything. And it's a byproduct. 462 00:25:08,360 --> 00:25:10,200 And it's like overdoing it for your kidneys. 463 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:14,320 And they couldn't quite get like a good sample because I over 464 00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:17,840 nine months could never manage to pee in a cup sufficiently 465 00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:19,560 apparently. And like, you know, you go in 466 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:22,320 for your well every single time you have a checkup when you're 467 00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:25,200 pregnant, you the first thing they make you do is pee in a 468 00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:28,280 cup. And I just like I, I have never, 469 00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:32,080 I've never mastered that. It is just a fucking mess. 470 00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:36,200 It is just like, oh OK, Like it is just. 471 00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:39,600 You, you do you. Hold the cup to you. 472 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:43,240 That's that's been. Hey you know I think I tried a 473 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:44,920 lot of methods your. Crotch. 474 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:47,920 I just, I'll tell you it just never, I never got used to it 475 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:51,480 and I peed on my hands a lot. And so apparently like my pee 476 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:53,120 samples were pretty inconclusive. 477 00:25:53,120 --> 00:25:55,640 And so they finally were like, OK, well we can't tell. 478 00:25:55,640 --> 00:26:00,760 So you have to do a 24 hour urine collection and we will 479 00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:05,040 then analyze all of that pee. So I had this little thing that 480 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:07,600 I had to put in the toilet before I peed. 481 00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:10,080 I had to take it with me everywhere because also when 482 00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:11,840 you're pregnant, you pee all the time. 483 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:15,760 And then you could like pour it into these jugs and I quickly 484 00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,400 was like, mother fuckers, I don't you didn't give me enough 485 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:21,040 jugs. Like I was peeing so much. 486 00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:26,040 So by the end of the 24 hours I had like I think about 3 487 00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:30,880 gallons, like Oh my God. And I have this picture of me 488 00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:36,680 just holding up my urine jugs with just like 24 hours of piss. 489 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,160 And I don't even, I think even that they were like, it's kind 490 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,440 of inconclusive. I mean, the conclusion was I, I 491 00:26:42,440 --> 00:26:44,960 was like, not going to let these motherfuckers induce me. 492 00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,800 I was, I was still induced, but he was at least past his due 493 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,320 date by the time I finally, they didn't really give me a choice 494 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:52,760 at that point. They're like, we're not letting 495 00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:54,760 you go. But I was just like, he's 496 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:56,240 fucking fine. Stop it that you guys are 497 00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:58,080 stressing me out. That's why I just can't pee in a 498 00:26:58,080 --> 00:26:59,520 cup. Let's go back off. 499 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,160 But so, yeah, this is just reminding me of all the time. 500 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:03,920 I'm like, I should have been donating that year. 501 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:07,880 Also, dropping that off at the doctor's office was hilarious. 502 00:27:08,120 --> 00:27:09,880 It was so. Satisfying. 503 00:27:10,120 --> 00:27:14,800 To just like swap those like jugs on the counter and have 504 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,760 them like go put gloves on and grab my urine. 505 00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:22,080 And I mean like huge jugs, not my my jugs were also scared. 506 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:26,520 To like were these see. Through No, they weren't see 507 00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:27,560 through. I have a picture. 508 00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:31,440 I'm going to have to put it on the chat now because it is it is 509 00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:33,000 I'm. Really glad that you. 510 00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:37,320 I am I I document everything for better or for worse or for 511 00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:40,040 worse. Yeah, which is mostly for worse. 512 00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:42,840 But I was just like, this will be a funny story one day. 513 00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:44,520 So here's all of my. Urine. 514 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:46,480 It's funny. Yeah, but it's because I kept 515 00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:48,880 having, never mind, it's just too much information. 516 00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:54,000 But yeah, it was, yeah, it's not being pregnant and having to 517 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:56,320 yeah, the urine situation is a lot. 518 00:27:56,320 --> 00:28:00,120 So just I'm relating to this a lot and feeling a little bit 519 00:28:00,120 --> 00:28:04,240 better that mine wasn't quite, you know, I may have had to 520 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,280 collected my urine for 24 hours, but I didn't then go putting it 521 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:09,080 on my crops. That's true. 522 00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,160 Well, and that's good because you know you want to work it 523 00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:15,440 into the soil because you can't just dilute it. 524 00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:17,200 You have to work it into the soil. 525 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:21,360 Good point, Good point. They do not explain what that 526 00:28:21,360 --> 00:28:25,360 means or how you are supposed to do that, but you want to get it 527 00:28:25,360 --> 00:28:29,600 under the top layer of soil because the ammonia get so your 528 00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:35,960 urea can convert to ammonia gas. So if you cover it, it's less 529 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:39,280 likely to lose all of the ammonia I guess or the urea 530 00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:41,440 you're going to have. You're going to keep more of the 531 00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,560 piss in the ground if you put make sure it gets below the top 532 00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:48,040 layer of the ground because you don't want heat applying to it I 533 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:49,760 suppose. OK, OK. 534 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:51,920 Well, yeah, I mean, part of that kind of, oh, there's just a 535 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:54,920 picture of my boobs. Never mind, never mind. 536 00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,200 Those got those also turned into jugs. 537 00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:58,560 Those were. Oh, here it is. 538 00:28:58,880 --> 00:28:59,760 Here it is. Got it. 539 00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:03,720 I look so proud of myself. I look so OK. 540 00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:06,120 It's not 3 gallons. That's totally an exaggeration. 541 00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:10,440 It's like 1 1/2. But we can we can get AI to make 542 00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:12,360 it look like it's 3 gallons if you'd prefer. 543 00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:15,480 Yeah, I'll work on that. Yeah, let me see. 544 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:16,600 Are you texting this? To me, no. 545 00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:18,720 I'm going to just try to drop it in the chat. 546 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:20,480 Oh, I think it went above it, but there it is. 547 00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:24,560 Fuck the picture. Oh, it's on the Google. 548 00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:26,680 Yeah, the same one that you put your picture in. 549 00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:28,600 It's just above it now. Oh my God. 550 00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:32,640 Look how happy I am. That's my urine. 551 00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:35,760 Why are they different shapes? Because they've I ran out of 552 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:38,680 room and the only other one they had was like a different jug 553 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:40,520 because they were like, what? You're peeing this much? 554 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:42,520 And I'm like, I can't be the only pregnant woman pissing this 555 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:44,800 much. Yeah. 556 00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,560 I have them in a cooler. I have a picture of them like in 557 00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:51,000 a cooler because I had to keep. Them you had to keep it. 558 00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:52,640 Cool, I guess I had. To keep it. 559 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:57,600 And it just had my name and birthday on it, so I should have 560 00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,880 tried to sell it to some vegans obviously. 561 00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:04,960 God, what was I thinking? OK, so you know 2 giant jugs of 562 00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:05,320 urine. Yeah. 563 00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:08,800 So if you want to use urine as fertilizer, that's those are 564 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:13,680 recipes. One recipe 2 is you pee onto 565 00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:15,680 mulch and that helps to break it down. 566 00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:20,000 OK, OK. Or you could try and put your 567 00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,280 dilute urine, I guess in the mulch, but it's better to pee 568 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:24,040 directly on the mulch than directly on the plant. 569 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:26,720 And then I skipped a recipe I guess. 570 00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:31,120 But recipe #4 is called straw Bale bathroom. 571 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,160 You can urinate directly on a Bale of straw until the straw 572 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:37,560 decomposes. And then they did mention that 573 00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:40,680 they knew someone who then just planted things directly in the 574 00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:45,440 Bale of straw, which that's a lot of pee to put on a Bale of 575 00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:47,120 straw. Like saturated. 576 00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:52,400 I mean, I use straw to like, that's where the in when I have 577 00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:54,480 lambs, right? Like we put straw down, but I 578 00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:56,720 always have like a straw Bale and inevitably they end up 579 00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:58,840 learning how to jump on it and they pee all over it. 580 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:04,280 Even in months, lambs cannot pee enough to make a straw Bale 581 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:07,640 break all the way down. So I don't know how much pee 582 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:09,120 that requires, but it seems like a lot. 583 00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:14,280 And keep in mind that urine is high in salts. 584 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:17,520 It's not just that you're getting rid of urea and 585 00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:20,320 nitrogenous waste, you are also getting rid of a lot of salts. 586 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:23,480 So that's part of why you have to dilute it, I guess. 587 00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:26,880 But also I'm wondering if that means that if you've just had a 588 00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:29,560 bag of chips, don't fertilize your garden with your urine. 589 00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:31,040 You know, like I don't know, can. 590 00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:33,160 You eat chips. Though what the speed? 591 00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:39,480 The speed of salt processing right and also the. 592 00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:42,320 I'm so sorry. I just keep thinking about 593 00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:44,080 pregnancy. That was like the old school way 594 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,760 to tell if you were pregnant or not was you would like piss on 595 00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:54,640 piss on like flat, like, I don't know, something that was ready 596 00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:58,440 to bloom and if they fully bloomed, it was because you were 597 00:31:58,440 --> 00:31:59,600 pregnant. I don't know. 598 00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:03,760 I it's like an old school thing of like I'm I'm doing a 599 00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:04,680 horrible. Like. 600 00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:07,360 Because I'm not Googling it. Like the 1700? 601 00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:10,360 Yeah, yeah. No, like Catherine the Great, 602 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:14,080 like that kind of era of like figuring out if you were 603 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:15,880 pregnant or not. And you would, yeah, you would 604 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:19,080 just like, piss on some plants and see if they flowered. 605 00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:20,360 And if so, then you were pregnant. 606 00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:23,000 So. And it has something to do too 607 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:25,600 with, yeah, the composition of your pee, which makes me wonder, 608 00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:28,480 vegans, should you really just be hitting up pregnant ladies? 609 00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:32,760 Like is pregnant women pee more? Nutritious. 610 00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:36,400 Yeah, yeah. For the plants, because it's 611 00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:38,680 also baby pee. It's a mixture. 612 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:41,320 It's also your baby. No, no, that's not true. 613 00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:43,840 That's a total fucking lie. The baby's pee stays in the 614 00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:45,760 amniotic fluid. So when your water breaks, 615 00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:48,200 you're actually just like breaking your entire baby's 616 00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:53,880 urine for like 9 months of yeah anyway, if you were like, my 617 00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:55,920 water broke, it's like, bitch, it is not water. 618 00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:02,800 They also had two other notes that I want to read to you, one 619 00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:07,960 of which is of course avoiding illness because pee is not 620 00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:13,120 actually 100% sterile, and it's definitely not 100% sterile 100% 621 00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:15,360 of the time. So if someone has a UTI, they 622 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:18,240 should probably not be peeing that bacteria onto plants. 623 00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:23,640 You could, I guess, put said urine in a container and leave 624 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:27,160 it for a while until the bacteria died and then you could 625 00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:31,680 use it, but that seems like a lot of processing for just some 626 00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:36,520 pee when you pee regularly, so that doesn't seem useful. 627 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:40,000 Pass. And then the last one, which I 628 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:47,160 think is so goddamn funny because it just feels like, it 629 00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:50,040 seems like it's a problem I never would have contemplated. 630 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:53,480 And it makes me wonder if vegans are really unhealthy because the 631 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,400 last one is A. And I say last one. 632 00:33:56,640 --> 00:34:00,840 This was the first thing on the website to watch out for, but 633 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:02,600 I'm reading it last for dramatic effect. 634 00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:06,360 So it is avoiding fecal contamination. 635 00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:10,239 This is the most important step of safe use of urine. 636 00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,239 Well, P is almost always sterile, which is not really 637 00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:12,480 true. Yeah. 638 00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:14,480 No. Feces contain dangerous 639 00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:17,400 pathogens. Make sure you get a 100% stream 640 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:22,080 of pure urine. How are how's that a an issue? 641 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:25,280 Do you have a cloaca? Do you have a cloaca? 642 00:34:25,639 --> 00:34:29,000 Is veganism giving you such horrible diarrhea that you. 643 00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:35,040 Especially for people with penises, Like why, how you know, 644 00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:37,760 like there's at least some geographic distance there, 645 00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:39,719 hopefully for you. I mean, I don't know. 646 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:44,440 I don't know, it just makes me concerned for the vegans that 647 00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:46,280 this. EW, I mean, but I thought that 648 00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:49,239 these, I thought a lot of folks like all the farms, because I 649 00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:51,400 was in, I mean, I went through the hippie phase. 650 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,280 It's from, you know, that's what you do. 651 00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:56,040 That's what you do from Eugene. Yeah. 652 00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:59,040 I had an environmental science class where we would tour 653 00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:01,240 community supported agriculture farms. 654 00:35:01,240 --> 00:35:04,520 And yeah, there were quite a few that were composting their own 655 00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:08,120 waste and using it to fertilize the crops that they then they 656 00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:10,920 gave to people. And I was like, OK, all right, 657 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:12,240 OK. I don't know. 658 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:14,000 Yeah. So I'm like, I thought the poop 659 00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,600 was good, too. I thought it's like all parts of 660 00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:18,480 the Buffalo. I mean First off it's Eugene so 661 00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:22,880 who fucking, but second off I would assume that they are 662 00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:25,360 cooking the poop somehow. That they. 663 00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:27,680 Think heat. I think just by having it, yeah, 664 00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:31,080 I think that the accumulation like they would it let it be 665 00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:35,120 there for a while and then let it kind of naturally heat and 666 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,840 then then distribute amongst the plants. 667 00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:43,120 Yeah. So my guess is that the worry 668 00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:46,200 about vehicle contamination here is that you don't go through 669 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:48,960 that phase of baking your piss if you're peeing directly on a 670 00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:51,800 plant. But I I just don't see how 671 00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:56,120 that's a possible frequent cross contamination issue unless you 672 00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:58,280 have some serious. Plumbing issues. 673 00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:00,400 Diarrhea issues, right? Yeah, right. 674 00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:06,920 Anyways, that's my extremely long digression on veganism. 675 00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:11,280 And and pee pee and using it in your gardens. 676 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:13,320 But would they use other animals, Pete? 677 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:15,240 Granted, that must be so hard to collect. 678 00:36:15,240 --> 00:36:17,720 Like every time you describe trying to like, pregnancy test 679 00:36:17,720 --> 00:36:19,480 one of your animals, I'm just like, how? 680 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:24,920 How the fuck do you do that? Like it's it's something you 681 00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:27,800 definitely want to block out in your mind afterwards, but it 682 00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,320 involved a lot of chasing the cow with a Mason jar. 683 00:36:31,720 --> 00:36:35,440 God, Oh my God. Yeah, I had to. 684 00:36:35,840 --> 00:36:39,240 Trap you couldn't just like strap a little bag on her and 685 00:36:39,240 --> 00:36:43,520 just like wait until she. I mean, I wee wheeze and I I 686 00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:45,600 wanted to avoid the fecal contamination. 687 00:36:46,240 --> 00:36:48,560 So see, see, you're full of shit. 688 00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:49,800 Literally. Ha ha ha. 689 00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:52,720 You proved yourself wrong. They are shaved differently. 690 00:36:52,720 --> 00:36:55,200 Their butt hole is above piss hole so. 691 00:36:55,200 --> 00:36:57,120 Well, depending on what position you're in, Megan. 692 00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:03,280 That's true, but I'm not making a cow like sit stand on its 693 00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:03,760 back. Oh. 694 00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:07,200 My God, that is. So funny kissing in a jar even 695 00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:08,960 workout. Oh my God yeah I had to 696 00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:13,280 eventually trap Tinkerbell and then take the jar and the 697 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,320 directions are like massage gently and the animal will 698 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:18,720 urinate. But I just kind of smacked at 699 00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:22,960 her with my jar until she bit. Oh my God, you are not a vegan. 700 00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:28,600 You're. It's not a vegan, I am a 701 00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:30,520 monster. Me too, it's cool. 702 00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:33,920 I'm not a farmer either, clearly. 703 00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:36,880 Just. Going to tap in. 704 00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:38,880 Oh my God. Tap that ass. 705 00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:42,120 And I could tell you that as you know, when you're pregnant, man, 706 00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:44,280 that would have been irritating as all fuck. 707 00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,440 Someone's just like, I mean, it was me, every doctor's 708 00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:49,600 appointment. And I was just like, guys, I 709 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,880 just can't just please just find another way. 710 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:55,600 Maybe if I got one of those giant jugs she would have been 711 00:37:55,600 --> 00:38:00,040 more comfortable with it, but. Oh yeah, I just the, the final 712 00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:03,080 pee sample because they made me go to the hospital. 713 00:38:03,240 --> 00:38:06,400 I was like two or three days overdue, which again, I'm a firm 714 00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:08,800 believer in your baby, knowing what time your baby is supposed 715 00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:11,280 to come. So I was like, it's very common 716 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:14,160 for your first baby to come until 41 or 42 weeks. 717 00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:16,960 So I was in no rush, but they wouldn't let me go home. 718 00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:18,520 They forced me to go to the hospital because my blood 719 00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,680 pressure was high and they made me take a urine test. 720 00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:25,280 And I pissed. I think I got like a centimeter 721 00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:27,840 of pee in there. And it was enough for them to be 722 00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:30,320 like, Nope, they're strapping you in. 723 00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:34,080 You can't leave. And then it was a horrible, 724 00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:37,680 horrible 28 hours of Labor. And I don't recommend it to 725 00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:41,080 anyone except those who want to have a baby. 726 00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:44,840 All right, so turtles, this is this is a road trip. 727 00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:47,000 Yeah. I just, I needed to know about 728 00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,280 urea and then I got distracted by knowing about fertilizer. 729 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:52,720 And then I went back and I re read the paper. 730 00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:57,880 And so this paper, they really were very thorough because they 731 00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:01,200 did at least five separate experiments. 732 00:39:01,240 --> 00:39:06,440 And I will not say that they are particularly clear about whether 733 00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:09,480 they did different experiments on different turtles or if 734 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:12,680 multiple turtles were subject to multiple piss experiments. 735 00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:16,280 But yeah, lots of different tests in order to really 736 00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:20,760 establish is the piss coming out the mouth, is it urea? 737 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:23,440 Is it happening while they're also breathing? 738 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:25,840 Are they just gargling because they just want to breathe? 739 00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:28,720 And what's going on with the piss that comes out the back of 740 00:39:28,720 --> 00:39:30,560 the turtle? Because the back of the turtle 741 00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:36,720 also produces piss. So they're Omni peers? 742 00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:38,520 They are. They're Omni. 743 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:40,720 Peers. They're amidextrous. 744 00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:42,960 They're urine. Ampis Dextrous. 745 00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:46,840 Ampis dextrous. OH Oh my God, I was kind of 746 00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:49,160 wondering about that. I was like, these are mythical 747 00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:51,440 creatures. They they breathe out their butt 748 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:55,200 and pee out their mouth and please, please someone please 749 00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:59,240 tell me who the fuck design that Please please describe your 750 00:39:59,240 --> 00:40:02,240 divine fucking creator who was like, this is perfect. 751 00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:06,040 I love it. Come on, guys. 752 00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:08,040 Come on. Come on. 753 00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:10,920 Yeah, I don't feel like God wants to take credit for that, 754 00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:14,400 right? That's all dumb turtle evolution 755 00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:18,280 experiment number one. They wanted to know, First off, 756 00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:23,160 hey, how much do turtles pee? Like just generally what's like 757 00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:27,480 the baseline turtle piss when they're just living their lives. 758 00:40:27,720 --> 00:40:32,320 So they attached flexible tubing to their cloaca. 759 00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:35,800 So around their tail basically. Like basically they put like a 760 00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:38,080 vial of plastic all the way around there, so. 761 00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:41,040 Like I'm envisioning kind of like a like AI mean was it? 762 00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:45,120 I'm almost envisioning like a condom strapped on their yeah on 763 00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:47,080 their tail. Yeah, they gave them a little 764 00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:49,600 spacious turtle condom. OK. 765 00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:53,240 They were immersed in water for six days. 766 00:40:53,240 --> 00:40:56,080 And I I do think that there was a bit of a translation issue 767 00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:58,400 here because I'm pretty sure this was just the baseline. 768 00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:00,720 I don't think they drowned turtles for six days. 769 00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,880 I'm pretty sure what they mean is they just let them do their 770 00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:08,800 thing for six days and then they everyday took water out and they 771 00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:12,400 took the the tube. I don't think they were holding 772 00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:13,600 the turtles down this whole time. 773 00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:16,120 I think that they. Were just also that intern, that 774 00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:20,800 poor intern. I know, got to take the turtle 775 00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:25,800 piss. God I hope this gets me into 776 00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:29,240 grad school. Now for the second or second 777 00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:32,880 experiment, this is the one where I think it sounds pretty 778 00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:35,000 funny looking. You didn't sound that excited 779 00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:36,800 about it. But what they did is they wanted 780 00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:40,280 to see they they wanted to see if the experimental turtle, 781 00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:43,960 which is how they described it, would dip its head fully, could 782 00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:45,920 dip its head fully into the water at liberty. 783 00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:48,800 So they wanted to basically see whether a turtle will 784 00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:53,240 voluntarily use water whatever way it's using it, right? 785 00:41:53,240 --> 00:41:56,320 So these are these are turtles, they can live in and out of 786 00:41:56,320 --> 00:41:59,000 water. So they took the turtle. 787 00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:01,920 They wanted to make sure it couldn't fully immerse in the 788 00:42:01,920 --> 00:42:06,720 water, so they did strap it to a platform for six days, which, by 789 00:42:06,720 --> 00:42:08,960 the way, they gave extremely specific measurements of. 790 00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:12,000 Centimeters. This scientific method you have 791 00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:14,520 to reproduce this. Here's exactly the plywood we 792 00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:16,720 used. I don't know how big any of the 793 00:42:16,720 --> 00:42:19,080 turtles were, but I know how big the platform was. 794 00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:20,680 They strapped it to for six days. 795 00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:21,120 It's. Not. 796 00:42:21,240 --> 00:42:23,920 This is not this. Is not bad science. 797 00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:28,760 So, so they strapped it to the platform and they put basically 798 00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:32,040 like a little plastic water through in front of it so that 799 00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:36,120 if it wanted to, it could fully immerse its head and gargle, you 800 00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:38,760 know, didn't have to, didn't have to, didn't have to do that 801 00:42:38,760 --> 00:42:41,720 if it didn't want to. Not being forced to gargle. 802 00:42:42,120 --> 00:42:45,520 Not being forced to be. Strapped to a fucking plank for 803 00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:46,080 six days. It's. 804 00:42:46,080 --> 00:42:47,720 Just strapped it can't go anywhere. 805 00:42:47,720 --> 00:42:49,600 OK, you know it's held in place, but. 806 00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:52,200 I would stick my fucking head in a bucket of water too. 807 00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:57,440 They can specify that every day they were feeding these animals 808 00:42:57,720 --> 00:43:00,120 tiger prawns. So they're not vegans. 809 00:43:00,160 --> 00:43:03,160 You know, no, the turtles are meat eaters. 810 00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:06,520 But I mean I'm pretty sure a prawn is a a sea creature and 811 00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:08,400 these are very. Brackish. 812 00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:10,680 So like, they're getting spoiled with prawns. 813 00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:13,640 OK, one way of thinking about it, it's like my worst. 814 00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:18,240 Nightmare fucking I'll strapped to a board and force fed giant 815 00:43:18,240 --> 00:43:21,640 fucking insects. But they're not water boarding 816 00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:24,600 the turtle, they're allowing the turtle to water board itself, 817 00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:27,640 OK. That's right, To end its own 818 00:43:27,640 --> 00:43:29,280 life. Like exactly, you know. 819 00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:31,840 And then of course, they, you know, they got a cross compared 820 00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:34,160 to the piss. So right, they've got a piss 821 00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:35,320 through in the. Back. 822 00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:37,600 And they're emptying these out. My God. 823 00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:40,760 And they do, they do this experiment for six days. 824 00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:45,480 And over those six days they are measuring how much urea is in 825 00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:48,680 the water through how much urea is in the piss through, right. 826 00:43:48,720 --> 00:43:52,400 So like they're also measuring behavior to figure out what the 827 00:43:52,400 --> 00:43:55,160 turtle is doing. And what they found is that 828 00:43:55,160 --> 00:43:58,520 turtles would voluntarily gargle, and they would gargle 829 00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:02,840 for 20 to 100 minutes at a time. Kinky. 830 00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:06,600 Yeah, now with your theory, maybe this turtle was trying to 831 00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:07,880 drown itself. Yeah, yeah. 832 00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:12,360 Just fucking end it, yeah. And just failing and backing out 833 00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:15,240 like this is taking for. I wish I didn't. 834 00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:17,880 I wish I didn't know how to breathe out my ass and could 835 00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:20,080 just send this. It's prom timing. 836 00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:24,920 God damn it, fucking force bed. Okay, this animal is sticking 837 00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:27,760 its head underwater for 20 to 100 minutes at a time and 838 00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:30,560 gargling water. Well, I guess we'd better know 839 00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:33,760 whether or not it's breathing. Is it doing the butthole 840 00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:36,000 breathing at this point, or is it breathing the water? 841 00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:38,000 What? What is it doing right? 842 00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,360 Because you know, that's the alternative function. 843 00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:44,160 Maybe it's gargling because it's easier for it to burgle breathe 844 00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:46,280 than it is for it to breathe. Right. 845 00:44:46,440 --> 00:44:48,200 OK, fair. I want to tell you how to 846 00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:49,920 breathe. They take those turtles. 847 00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:52,440 It's not clear if these are the exact same turtles at the exact 848 00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:54,520 same time, but they only did three of them, which makes me 849 00:44:54,520 --> 00:44:56,920 think that they only had three of the probes that they were 850 00:44:56,920 --> 00:44:59,440 using to measure decreases in oxygen. 851 00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:02,800 So no, these are water probes. Don't make that face water 852 00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:07,560 probes. I was like, this is so fucked 853 00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:09,280 up. All right, so they've got these 854 00:45:09,280 --> 00:45:12,440 oxygen probes in the water that are telling them when it's 855 00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:14,080 decreased. So they know because I guess 856 00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:16,080 they're not sitting there watching the turtle 24/7. 857 00:45:16,720 --> 00:45:18,720 So they don't know what it's actively gargling. 858 00:45:18,720 --> 00:45:22,160 They I guess recorded it later, but they we go and they collect 859 00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:25,560 water samples and they because they wanted to do it before 860 00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:28,360 there was a chance that the oxygen would re oxygenate the 861 00:45:28,360 --> 00:45:31,760 water, right, so that they knew how much oxygen had been removed 862 00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:34,200 from the water. So they've got that one. 863 00:45:34,520 --> 00:45:36,680 They did find out that there was oxygen removed. 864 00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:41,600 So these turtles were breathing for sure while they're pissing, 865 00:45:42,680 --> 00:45:44,800 so they're doing. I mean, I guess I can do that 866 00:45:44,800 --> 00:45:46,600 too. That's true. 867 00:45:46,840 --> 00:45:48,520 You're not doing it with the same orifice, but you are 868 00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:51,760 capable of doing it. And don't start yourself short. 869 00:45:54,680 --> 00:45:58,240 That's important, too. Okay, so they're multifaceted. 870 00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:00,200 They can. They can multitask. 871 00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:06,040 They also experiment #4 they put something called fluoretin in 872 00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:09,600 the water. I guess in high doses, or if 873 00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:11,800 you're eating a high protein diet, like you're eating a whole 874 00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:15,520 bunch of tiger bones, it can cause you to not piss. 875 00:46:15,520 --> 00:46:17,840 So at least it causes you to not pass urea. 876 00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:21,040 It is a diuretic, so you will piss more, but you won't be 877 00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:24,920 passing urea. And I'm still not entirely sure 878 00:46:25,400 --> 00:46:27,360 why they did that. Oh no, I don't know what they 879 00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:28,640 did. They did that because they still 880 00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:31,440 noticed the gargling behavior. But during those experiments, 881 00:46:31,720 --> 00:46:34,160 the urea concentration in the water did not change. 882 00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:39,920 So that told them that this was a urea transport like channel 883 00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:42,640 basically, which is the same sort of thing as you find in 884 00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:44,840 your kidneys. So this wasn't that they were 885 00:46:44,840 --> 00:46:47,640 processing urea in their kidneys and then shunting it to their 886 00:46:47,640 --> 00:46:53,600 mouths, it's that the there is processing of basically 2 urea 887 00:46:53,720 --> 00:46:57,080 in the mouth itself and that that's what's happening I guess. 888 00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:03,920 Anyways, experiment #5 this is the one that's not so fun. 889 00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:06,680 Oh, cuz the other ones have been fun, Megan. 890 00:47:08,920 --> 00:47:13,280 They put a whole bunch of ammonium chloride urea or salt 891 00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:16,880 water depending on the turtle, gave it a shot directly into the 892 00:47:16,880 --> 00:47:20,720 stomach of the turtle. And then three hours later they 893 00:47:20,720 --> 00:47:23,920 anesthetized it so that they could swab its mouth and see how 894 00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:26,520 much urea I guess was in the mouth. 895 00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:29,040 Then they waited another three hours and did it again. 896 00:47:29,240 --> 00:47:32,240 Still not entirely sure why they did that, but at the same time, 897 00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:37,600 at the end they killed them and they took blood samples and they 898 00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:42,400 they looked for mRNA and like basically established that 899 00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:46,400 there's quite a lot of these urea transport proteins in their 900 00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:49,160 mouth. So those really are kidney 901 00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:53,480 functioning mouth viliform processes in addition to being 902 00:47:53,840 --> 00:47:56,480 able to breathe. But as they pointed out, if you 903 00:47:56,480 --> 00:47:59,840 need to piss by gargling water, you also need to breathe at the 904 00:47:59,840 --> 00:48:02,200 same time. So it kind of makes sense that 905 00:48:02,200 --> 00:48:05,040 maybe you're highly vascularized. 906 00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:08,280 Piss organs are also capable of collecting oxygen, because 907 00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:10,560 otherwise you'd probably drown while trying to take a. 908 00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:11,760 Piss. Oh my God. 909 00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:14,880 Oh my God. Yeah, OK, my like, yeah, that's 910 00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:16,680 fucked up. But my one question I'm still 911 00:48:16,680 --> 00:48:19,920 wondering is how do you inject anything directly into the 912 00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:22,360 stomach of a turtle? Isn't there like shells in? 913 00:48:22,520 --> 00:48:24,480 The way soft shell. Soft. 914 00:48:24,480 --> 00:48:28,400 Rude. Oh that is so fucked up. 915 00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:32,440 Oh that is so sad. They have bigger gaps on their 916 00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:36,120 side than a hard sell do. You still got to go for just go. 917 00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:37,800 Just it doesn't matter. You're like, could you at least 918 00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:39,520 give me a tiger prawn? You're about to die. 919 00:48:39,520 --> 00:48:41,640 You. Just give me one final tiger 920 00:48:41,640 --> 00:48:45,440 prawn before you stab me in the stomach and then murder me. 921 00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:50,200 Oh God. Well, well, so so why? 922 00:48:50,440 --> 00:48:52,680 They wanted to know if it was pissing out of no, no, no, but. 923 00:48:52,680 --> 00:48:55,200 Why did they think the turtles are pissing out their mouth? 924 00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:57,000 Ohk. OK, where are the turtles 925 00:48:57,000 --> 00:48:58,880 pissing out their mouth? Yeah, I've I've already 926 00:48:58,880 --> 00:49:01,080 established that man is evil. Like that's easy. 927 00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:08,520 So the thought is, remember that there's that dilution criteria, 928 00:49:08,600 --> 00:49:11,320 right? So like urea still does need to 929 00:49:11,320 --> 00:49:13,920 be diluted. And these reptiles, for whatever 930 00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:16,520 reason, they haven't fully adapted to using ammonia. 931 00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:19,440 And even though they're fresh water turtles, so you'd think 932 00:49:19,440 --> 00:49:22,720 that they'd have a lot of water, a lot of them live in kind of 933 00:49:22,720 --> 00:49:25,600 brackish freshwater. So not like perfectly fresh 934 00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:28,640 freshwater. So actually maybe they were able 935 00:49:28,640 --> 00:49:31,440 to get prawns on their own. I don't know, maybe that's why. 936 00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:34,280 Maybe they're I don't read but maybe they're prawn. 937 00:49:34,760 --> 00:49:37,520 Maybe they do love prawns. Yeah, I mean, they do love 938 00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:39,600 prawns, that was established, but they. 939 00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:41,960 Deserved. Some shrimp cocktail is their 940 00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:44,400 natural diet. Like maybe. 941 00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:46,920 Yeah. So in brackish water, if you're 942 00:49:46,920 --> 00:49:50,240 ingesting a whole lot of water, you also have to be capable of 943 00:49:50,240 --> 00:49:52,120 getting rid of all of the salt, right? 944 00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:57,720 And so I guess the idea is that this is a workaround to still be 945 00:49:57,720 --> 00:50:02,720 getting rid of urea because they aren't adapted for ammonia. 946 00:50:02,720 --> 00:50:06,880 And also because drinking that much water would potentially 947 00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:10,840 cause them to increase a whole bunch of salt and it would cause 948 00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:13,400 all of these problems. So instead of like full on 949 00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:16,280 taking water full of salt, passing it all the way through 950 00:50:16,280 --> 00:50:18,480 your system and all the way through your kidneys in order to 951 00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:22,440 piss, all you do is it's basically taking your kidney and 952 00:50:22,440 --> 00:50:24,800 shaking it in the water. So you don't even have to put 953 00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:27,320 water into your body, you can just mix it because your kidney 954 00:50:27,320 --> 00:50:29,440 is your mouth hairs and it's free floating. 955 00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:34,080 Would it make a kidney like transplant easier or harder? 956 00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:37,480 Do they still have kidneys? I mean, do they have kidneys? 957 00:50:37,640 --> 00:50:39,040 Yes. So what the fuck do their 958 00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:41,280 kidneys do? Sit around eating shrimp? 959 00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:43,920 They. Do pass some ammonia, so I guess 960 00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,560 turtles have or These turtles at least have both ammonia and 961 00:50:46,560 --> 00:50:49,480 urea. When they have the option to 962 00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:51,320 gargle. The only thing they're really 963 00:50:51,320 --> 00:50:54,560 gargling is urea. Very little if any ammonia is 964 00:50:54,560 --> 00:51:00,680 coming out of the turtle. The piss is mostly, but if 965 00:51:00,680 --> 00:51:04,320 they're not given the chance to gargle then their piss is urea, 966 00:51:04,560 --> 00:51:06,800 so they've got a backup system in the form of kid. 967 00:51:06,880 --> 00:51:11,320 That's beautiful. That's that's that's see, I 968 00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:15,080 don't, I find that a fucked up creation of God, but a beautiful 969 00:51:15,360 --> 00:51:20,240 tangent of evolution. Yeah, I'm like, wow. 970 00:51:20,760 --> 00:51:22,960 Also horrified. Wow. 971 00:51:24,280 --> 00:51:30,720 OK so this is an economic thing. Is this still related to trying 972 00:51:30,720 --> 00:51:32,200 to like keep them alive or something? 973 00:51:32,200 --> 00:51:34,560 Like why have they done so much research on this? 974 00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:38,080 Or is this literally just like someone has become completely 975 00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:42,320 fucking obsessed with this and made it their entire career? 976 00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:45,760 Or like what is the like bigger picture significance of trying 977 00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:48,640 to figure out if these turtles can piss through their mouth? 978 00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:51,600 Like why do they care? I think a big part of it is 979 00:51:52,080 --> 00:51:54,080 maybe it's because they're economically important, but I 980 00:51:54,080 --> 00:51:56,000 think it's also because they're economically available. 981 00:51:56,440 --> 00:51:59,040 Like if you're going to run an experiment on an animal, you 982 00:51:59,040 --> 00:52:02,400 need access to that animal. And if that animal is raised on 983 00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:07,000 farms, it's a lot easier to get turtles, right? 984 00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:08,920 Like. And so they just got lucky that 985 00:52:08,920 --> 00:52:12,200 this thing that they happened to already farm, it also was 986 00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:15,120 fucking weird. And they're like, let's figure 987 00:52:15,120 --> 00:52:17,560 out everything we can about this in crop milk, I mean. 988 00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:21,680 If I saw my sheep constantly going up to a water through and 989 00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:26,160 gargling, I would also be curious as to what the fuck they 990 00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:29,040 were doing. So I think it's just that they 991 00:52:29,040 --> 00:52:31,280 noticed some weird behavior because it's economically 992 00:52:31,280 --> 00:52:32,920 important. They noticed some weird anatomy. 993 00:52:33,280 --> 00:52:36,360 And yeah, literally over 100 years after they noticed the 994 00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:39,920 weird anatomy, a scientist was like, hey, I bet that's I bet 995 00:52:39,920 --> 00:52:41,960 that's for piss. Let's find out if it's Piss I. 996 00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:45,360 Bet that's for piss. Wow, yeah, I have a lot of 997 00:52:45,360 --> 00:52:47,680 feelings, so I can't even really describe. 998 00:52:47,680 --> 00:52:49,640 You just took me on quite the roller coaster. 999 00:52:49,720 --> 00:52:52,120 So like, I need to call my therapist. 1000 00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:55,440 Back and I know you don't think it's funny, but the idea of 1001 00:52:55,440 --> 00:53:00,200 these turtles strapped to tables gargling out of a through it's 1002 00:53:00,360 --> 00:53:03,800 it's really funny to. Me OK, baby, you should call a 1003 00:53:03,840 --> 00:53:05,760 therapist. I'm just saying. 1004 00:53:06,840 --> 00:53:12,600 I'm just saying. I mean, I yeah, yeah, yes. 1005 00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:15,200 It's good to find the humor in things. 1006 00:53:15,240 --> 00:53:18,960 I suppose. We already did it. 1007 00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:23,520 So find the yes. I mean, that's what motivates me 1008 00:53:23,520 --> 00:53:26,080 through every day of life. It's finding something to laugh. 1009 00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:28,440 At, I mean, I don't know, they're being strapped to a 1010 00:53:28,440 --> 00:53:30,680 table and given the option to gargle water. 1011 00:53:31,240 --> 00:53:34,640 Is that much worse than having a custom blood made for you? 1012 00:53:35,560 --> 00:53:39,240 Right, without your kids set like we don't speak. 1013 00:53:39,240 --> 00:53:42,280 Yeah, without your consent. And you're a wild turtle just 1014 00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:47,280 plucked from the wild like an alien and proved that's how they 1015 00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:49,080 determined oxygen. If you didn't listen to that 1016 00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:51,480 particular episode or all of the times we talked. 1017 00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:53,080 About it. So I mean, turtles are 1018 00:53:53,080 --> 00:53:56,520 definitely one of our like, definitely mascots of the shows. 1019 00:53:57,720 --> 00:53:59,680 They are very weird and they've been around a lot. 1020 00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:02,360 So they're very dead. And these ones are also dead. 1021 00:54:02,800 --> 00:54:04,800 Very fucking dead. Yeah, that's true. 1022 00:54:04,800 --> 00:54:06,880 These are dead. These these experimental. 1023 00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:10,640 Oh my God, but. These individuals are dead. 1024 00:54:11,160 --> 00:54:14,000 Right, but do you think that this adaptation is present in 1025 00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:18,360 other turtles? I I mean that 1800s citation 1026 00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:22,560 saying that it's in some some soft shelled turtles, I would 1027 00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:25,320 imagine it's in more than one species of soft shell turtles. 1028 00:54:25,320 --> 00:54:28,160 It seems like a pretty advanced adaptation as well. 1029 00:54:28,600 --> 00:54:31,440 So I mean, it's not something we could see in the fossil record, 1030 00:54:31,440 --> 00:54:34,880 but it's definitely, it seems pretty complicated to have 1031 00:54:34,880 --> 00:54:37,160 evolved exclusively in a single species. 1032 00:54:37,160 --> 00:54:39,720 I mean, I bet there's some mouth hair and a lot of soft water. 1033 00:54:39,840 --> 00:54:42,600 Soft shelled. We do have a good fossil record 1034 00:54:42,600 --> 00:54:45,440 of soft shelled turtles, so I do wonder if any of them are in 1035 00:54:45,440 --> 00:54:49,000 like a logger shot that would potentially have preserved, I 1036 00:54:49,080 --> 00:54:52,160 guess, soft tissue. Yeah, and you could actually. 1037 00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:55,280 But you'd have to be able to see the inside of the mouth too, you 1038 00:54:55,280 --> 00:54:55,480 know. But. 1039 00:54:55,480 --> 00:54:58,160 What if you like CT edit I? Maybe, I feel. 1040 00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:00,120 New gold is such a. Small character. 1041 00:55:00,120 --> 00:55:03,040 I didn't kill this turtle. Life did. 1042 00:55:05,360 --> 00:55:08,400 A volcanic eruption did. Let's CT its throat. 1043 00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:10,360 Why? Don't worry about it. 1044 00:55:10,520 --> 00:55:14,440 Don't worry about it. Thinking about it is just going 1045 00:55:14,440 --> 00:55:15,720 to disturb. You, yeah. 1046 00:55:15,720 --> 00:55:19,000 I assure you. One I just yeah, I wonder how 1047 00:55:19,000 --> 00:55:21,480 many I just I'm never going to look at a turtle the same way. 1048 00:55:21,480 --> 00:55:24,200 Most from either end. Any angle of a turtle. 1049 00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:29,560 I'm now just full of questions. Thank you for listening. 1050 00:55:29,560 --> 00:55:32,320 If you liked the podcast, be sure to rate and review us on 1051 00:55:32,320 --> 00:55:34,320 your listening platform of choice. 1052 00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:36,640 We really, really, really appreciate it. 1053 00:55:36,680 --> 00:55:38,080 If. You'd like to hear more and 1054 00:55:38,080 --> 00:55:40,520 support the show? You can follow us on Patreon for 1055 00:55:40,560 --> 00:55:44,120 some exclusive bits or on our various social media platforms. 1056 00:55:44,200 --> 00:55:47,920 You can follow Amy on Instagram at Mary Anning's Revenge. 1057 00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:52,080 And Megan on Instagram and Tiktok as Geopedal fabric or 1058 00:55:52,080 --> 00:55:55,360 both of us at Weird and Dead on Instagram and Tiktok. 1059 00:55:55,440 --> 00:55:57,600 Our theme song is Unlock Me by Proz. 1060 00:55:57,960 --> 00:56:00,640 Cover art was provided by Chris Spencer and the host. 1061 00:56:00,920 --> 00:56:04,200 And this has been posted and researched by us, Amy Atwater 1062 00:56:04,240 --> 00:56:06,160 and baby Weatherall. Thank you for listening.