1 00:00:01,690 --> 00:00:03,650 Hey, friend. Welcome to another episode of 2 00:00:03,660 --> 00:00:06,080 the podcast. Allison, thanks for joining me 3 00:00:06,090 --> 00:00:07,280 today. Happy to be here. 4 00:00:07,290 --> 00:00:10,180 And thank you for preaching. Yesterday we were back in 5 00:00:10,190 --> 00:00:14,640 Matthew Chapter 1 and Advent Week 2 and talking the whole 6 00:00:14,650 --> 00:00:17,880 service, talking about I can never remember what Advent Week 7 00:00:17,890 --> 00:00:19,040 2 is. Peace. 8 00:00:19,050 --> 00:00:21,600 Yeah. No, I always, I always have to 9 00:00:21,610 --> 00:00:23,960 double check. Like just where does love go? 10 00:00:23,970 --> 00:00:25,490 Where does joy go? Where does peace go? 11 00:00:25,500 --> 00:00:27,500 Where does hope go? Every single year, no matter 12 00:00:27,510 --> 00:00:29,840 what, always. Also, my homemade Advent 13 00:00:29,850 --> 00:00:32,520 calendar or Advent candle at home melted. 14 00:00:32,530 --> 00:00:33,850 The whole thing melted last night. 15 00:00:33,860 --> 00:00:36,570 I also always forget what the purple one every year. 16 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:38,960 I think it's the. Joy 1 so I do. 17 00:00:38,970 --> 00:00:40,620 We do the pink 1, so yeah, I can't remember. 18 00:00:40,630 --> 00:00:44,600 Pink the pink 1. So first one is hope, that's 19 00:00:44,610 --> 00:00:47,290 purple. Second one is purple also, that 20 00:00:47,300 --> 00:00:50,650 is peace. 3rd. Is third is joy pink and then 21 00:00:50,660 --> 00:00:52,270 you go back to purple and then you go to white. 22 00:00:52,890 --> 00:00:54,280 Yeah, but every year I have to check. 23 00:00:54,350 --> 00:00:57,490 Because somebody decided to make our lives complicated and that 24 00:00:57,500 --> 00:01:00,390 can be the intro Great. We're happy that you're 25 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:03,880 listening and happy that hey, we might be finding you even now on 26 00:01:03,890 --> 00:01:05,540 your way to your Christmas vacation. 27 00:01:05,550 --> 00:01:07,760 Some people already started to say goodbye on Sunday. 28 00:01:07,770 --> 00:01:10,580 Be like, we'll see you in the new year was like lucky for you. 29 00:01:10,630 --> 00:01:12,840 Wow, like that. Yep, that's great. 30 00:01:12,970 --> 00:01:17,060 Going away for a few weeks. I've got 3 questions and what I 31 00:01:17,070 --> 00:01:21,540 wanted to do this week is keep our podcast as practical as 32 00:01:21,550 --> 00:01:23,640 possible. So for each of these questions 33 00:01:23,650 --> 00:01:27,870 for you, listener, I'm gonna pose a question for you to 34 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:30,950 reflect on and for you to think on, and then a follow up 35 00:01:30,960 --> 00:01:33,840 question for us to discuss, which is more application based. 36 00:01:33,850 --> 00:01:36,020 So we're not going to answer all of the questions, but we're 37 00:01:36,030 --> 00:01:38,910 going to try to wrestle out some of the more practical things for 38 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:41,970 people as they're wrestling out these bigger picture questions. 39 00:01:42,010 --> 00:01:44,110 So we'll see how that goes. If it works, let us know. 40 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:45,830 If it doesn't work, also let us know. 41 00:01:45,960 --> 00:01:48,230 Either way, we hope to hear from you. 42 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:53,930 But Advent week two, I thought it was a great message and I'm 43 00:01:53,940 --> 00:01:57,920 still even wondering through the like, what is God calling each 44 00:01:57,930 --> 00:02:03,930 of us to opt into and to to to kind of choose our way into in 45 00:02:03,940 --> 00:02:07,380 through the rest of the Advent season and even into the new 46 00:02:07,390 --> 00:02:08,729 year. So we were talking off camera. 47 00:02:08,740 --> 00:02:10,240 Like, I thought you had this great wondering. 48 00:02:10,250 --> 00:02:14,020 And we'll start here around, like, what would Joseph's life 49 00:02:14,030 --> 00:02:18,900 have looked like had he chosen to not enter into the story? 50 00:02:18,970 --> 00:02:22,280 Right there is this decision that he has to make. 51 00:02:22,350 --> 00:02:24,340 And like, God is gonna do what God's gonna do. 52 00:02:24,390 --> 00:02:27,080 Yeah. But Joseph is like, are are you 53 00:02:27,090 --> 00:02:28,580 in or are you out? Like, am I in? 54 00:02:28,590 --> 00:02:32,610 Am I out? And so often I think that's like 55 00:02:32,620 --> 00:02:35,870 that's the position that many of us are left in when we face 56 00:02:35,880 --> 00:02:38,720 these interruptions. And I felt like it was helpful 57 00:02:38,730 --> 00:02:42,530 to highlight, at least for me, like that. 58 00:02:42,540 --> 00:02:44,140 That's a really, it's a hard choice. 59 00:02:44,150 --> 00:02:45,980 It's a costly choice he's making. 60 00:02:45,990 --> 00:02:48,940 And so I don't want to diminish that. 61 00:02:49,020 --> 00:02:52,260 And yet sometimes that's all that we're seeing. 62 00:02:52,330 --> 00:02:56,080 And so I also wanted me to pay attention to and asked to pay 63 00:02:56,090 --> 00:02:59,540 attention to that. Look what he would have missed 64 00:02:59,550 --> 00:03:01,620 out. Like look what he actually gets 65 00:03:01,630 --> 00:03:03,480 to be part of. Yeah, right. 66 00:03:04,270 --> 00:03:07,520 You know, I was sharing something with you a couple 67 00:03:07,530 --> 00:03:09,080 weeks ago. Got to be part of a thing. 68 00:03:09,090 --> 00:03:11,160 A bunch of us from church were helping out a family, right? 69 00:03:11,250 --> 00:03:13,860 It was costly. People gave up time, had 70 00:03:13,870 --> 00:03:15,460 babysitters for a bunch of stuff. 71 00:03:15,510 --> 00:03:18,860 But like the joy of being part of that day together and being 72 00:03:18,870 --> 00:03:22,040 like on mission together. That's how I left that day. 73 00:03:22,050 --> 00:03:24,820 I didn't leave going like, whoa, I really gave up my stuff. 74 00:03:24,830 --> 00:03:28,140 I left going, Oh my gosh, I got to be part of this thing that 75 00:03:28,150 --> 00:03:30,270 was that's just like a tiny example, but. 76 00:03:30,330 --> 00:03:32,060 Can I share, like, the one line that you sent? 77 00:03:32,070 --> 00:03:32,470 Sure. Yeah. 78 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:34,930 In the text message, because that was a great text message. 79 00:03:34,940 --> 00:03:38,370 I think you said this might have been my favorite day as part of 80 00:03:38,380 --> 00:03:40,180 the church. And it didn't even happen inside 81 00:03:40,190 --> 00:03:41,090 the building. That's right. 82 00:03:41,100 --> 00:03:43,170 Which was incredible. And that's what we hope for, 83 00:03:43,180 --> 00:03:44,810 along for. And what we do inside the 84 00:03:44,820 --> 00:03:46,370 building matters. Absolutely. 85 00:03:46,420 --> 00:03:49,910 But only, I would argue only to the extent that it is 86 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:53,330 transforming people's lives outside the building, which is 87 00:03:53,340 --> 00:03:55,140 what exactly what we saw on that day. 88 00:03:55,150 --> 00:03:56,370 And I mean, like, here's the other thing. 89 00:03:56,380 --> 00:04:00,110 Like I wasn't there. And so like it's it's pretty 90 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,720 incredible start getting those kinds of messages in be like, 91 00:04:02,730 --> 00:04:04,350 this was my favorite day. It didn't have inside the 92 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:07,820 building like and you weren't. There you weren't. 93 00:04:07,830 --> 00:04:09,420 There and you were there. Well, no, and that's what it 94 00:04:09,430 --> 00:04:10,580 said. I think you said you guys were 95 00:04:10,590 --> 00:04:13,200 you weren't even there. And but like, that's, that's 96 00:04:13,210 --> 00:04:15,740 such a gift as a pastor of a church to be able to see people 97 00:04:15,750 --> 00:04:20,339 embracing those types of costly decisions for the sake of 98 00:04:20,350 --> 00:04:25,190 someone else and for the sake of, you know, people inside of 99 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:27,690 our church and outside of our church and wonderful thing. 100 00:04:27,700 --> 00:04:31,050 And I think that's just, it is like so often, I think we don't 101 00:04:31,060 --> 00:04:34,010 see beyond the cost, right? We don't see beyond what we 102 00:04:34,020 --> 00:04:37,650 would have to give up and recognize like actually what 103 00:04:37,660 --> 00:04:40,620 would we miss out on? Like what could be possible? 104 00:04:40,630 --> 00:04:44,760 What might we get to experience? Another time that stands out to 105 00:04:44,770 --> 00:04:48,390 me is when I've had really rich experiences of being in 106 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:49,930 community. It was particularly when I was 107 00:04:49,940 --> 00:04:51,850 on staff with university and the staff team. 108 00:04:51,900 --> 00:04:55,590 And we actually all chose to kind of let go of some of our 109 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:57,890 own rights, if you like. We all decided to kind of put 110 00:04:57,900 --> 00:05:01,430 our hats in about housing and give up basically our ideas 111 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:03,160 about where we're going to live and how we're going to live 112 00:05:03,170 --> 00:05:05,390 because we felt and moved to think about some kind of 113 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:08,810 Community Housing arrangement. So on the one hand, that's like 114 00:05:08,980 --> 00:05:12,830 it was costly. Like it was hard to let go of 115 00:05:12,840 --> 00:05:14,980 where we lived and what we were doing and what that was going to 116 00:05:14,990 --> 00:05:17,570 look like. And also costly to give 117 00:05:17,580 --> 00:05:21,490 ourselves to a communal decision making process to let other 118 00:05:21,500 --> 00:05:24,850 people influence how we were going to spend our money and 119 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:27,100 where we were going to live and who we were going to live. 120 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:30,720 And yet we gained so much, right? 121 00:05:30,730 --> 00:05:35,640 Like we gained family out of that, we gained depth of 122 00:05:35,650 --> 00:05:39,620 understanding and insight and relationship and we had a place 123 00:05:39,630 --> 00:05:42,640 to welcome students and like so much that we received. 124 00:05:42,650 --> 00:05:45,540 And so I do think holding both of those things like not 125 00:05:45,550 --> 00:05:50,660 diminishing the cost, but also recognizing that there is joy in 126 00:05:50,670 --> 00:05:54,630 that, right? It's not just a like sort of 127 00:05:54,640 --> 00:05:58,750 drudgery obedience. It's like, actually, look what 128 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:01,030 we get. To be part of and it in so in so 129 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:05,590 many ways it captures the invitation to any follower of 130 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:08,890 Jesus right now yeah so you get lines in in the Bible like take 131 00:06:08,900 --> 00:06:11,820 up your cross just says you know anybody who wishes to follow me 132 00:06:11,830 --> 00:06:14,830 must deny themselves take up their cross and actually do the 133 00:06:14,840 --> 00:06:18,050 thing follow me. And I think a lot of people can 134 00:06:18,060 --> 00:06:22,370 get trapped in that well that that sounds terrible right. 135 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:28,140 I like pick up a cross like what a what a horrible image in for 136 00:06:28,150 --> 00:06:31,420 the early church to wrestle out absolutely when every single day 137 00:06:31,430 --> 00:06:35,400 they saw criminals crucified on crosses along the roads in and 138 00:06:35,410 --> 00:06:39,100 out of cities. Like how you know how striking 139 00:06:39,110 --> 00:06:42,320 an image for Jesus then to say, hey, if you want to really do 140 00:06:42,330 --> 00:06:44,640 this, you also have to pick up your cross. 141 00:06:45,030 --> 00:06:49,820 And and so we get hung up on that imagery and and rightly so, 142 00:06:50,090 --> 00:06:54,320 there is a significant cost, but there's life on the other side 143 00:06:54,330 --> 00:06:58,260 of picking up your cross and following Jesus and he down. 144 00:06:58,270 --> 00:07:02,060 Jesus never says that it's going to be an easy Rd. but he says it 145 00:07:02,070 --> 00:07:04,720 will be a a life that is truly life. 146 00:07:04,970 --> 00:07:07,400 And so I think that would like the church we do, we need to get 147 00:07:07,410 --> 00:07:10,090 better at telling the stories of where life is truly life. 148 00:07:10,100 --> 00:07:13,320 That's right. And those stories almost always 149 00:07:13,330 --> 00:07:15,260 come on the other side of something significant, like a 150 00:07:15,270 --> 00:07:20,480 significant cost, a significant moment where, you know, I think 151 00:07:20,490 --> 00:07:23,980 like Joseph, Joseph is invited into the life that's truly 152 00:07:23,990 --> 00:07:28,540 really life. And he chooses to obey, which I 153 00:07:28,550 --> 00:07:32,490 think is just that simple step at the end, like to to wrap up 154 00:07:32,500 --> 00:07:35,560 that message. He said like he, he just, he 155 00:07:35,570 --> 00:07:40,370 does the thing that's right. He names Jesus, Jesus, he obeys. 156 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:44,860 And look then what unfolds. And we didn't name this 157 00:07:44,870 --> 00:07:49,470 yesterday, but this, this choice of obedience is also actually 158 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:52,280 coming after a lifetime of faithful choices, right? 159 00:07:52,290 --> 00:07:54,690 Like we learned that he is somebody that follows the law 160 00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:57,070 like that. There's a faithfulness to him 161 00:07:57,190 --> 00:08:02,100 already, and yet this decision subverts everything kind of that 162 00:08:02,110 --> 00:08:05,640 he knows or thinks. So it's a huge change to that. 163 00:08:05,650 --> 00:08:08,320 But there's also, there's already a character of 164 00:08:08,390 --> 00:08:11,600 faithfulness basically that is already there that I think 165 00:08:11,610 --> 00:08:14,600 probably equips him to make the decision that he does. 166 00:08:14,650 --> 00:08:18,980 So I think helpful to notice in that, you know, I think as 167 00:08:18,990 --> 00:08:24,820 Christians we can often beat up on like the law and we can, you 168 00:08:24,830 --> 00:08:28,970 know, kind of fall into this trap of saying, well, like New 169 00:08:28,980 --> 00:08:33,730 Testament Jesus, no law. And kind of forget the fact that 170 00:08:33,740 --> 00:08:36,390 Jesus said, hey, I actually haven't come to abolish this 171 00:08:36,400 --> 00:08:38,110 thing. I've come to fulfill it. 172 00:08:38,299 --> 00:08:41,510 Fulfillment looks very different than living under it. 173 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:45,570 Like absolutely there is a substantive shift in the way 174 00:08:45,580 --> 00:08:48,590 we're meant to live our lives in relation to the law. 175 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:53,460 But I think what we see in Joseph is that the law like 176 00:08:53,470 --> 00:08:57,700 obedience in that way. And what I would say is like, 177 00:08:58,690 --> 00:09:01,140 I'll say small carefully. And if you're listening, I'm 178 00:09:01,150 --> 00:09:04,370 doing sort of air quotes, like a weak attempt at air quotes here, 179 00:09:05,310 --> 00:09:13,300 but like small everyday routine wrote obedience to the law 180 00:09:13,310 --> 00:09:19,020 probably prepared him, yeah, to make a large leap of obedience. 181 00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:22,530 And it's kind of like I think I was preaching on prayer few 182 00:09:22,540 --> 00:09:26,460 weeks ago and quoted someone who I'm not off the top of my head 183 00:09:26,470 --> 00:09:27,880 now going to be able to remember. 184 00:09:27,890 --> 00:09:31,860 But you know, so we we focus far too much on praying for the big 185 00:09:31,870 --> 00:09:36,700 things without cultivating a daily rhythm and habit of prayer 186 00:09:36,710 --> 00:09:39,450 in the everyday, normal, mundane sort of small things. 187 00:09:40,110 --> 00:09:44,500 And so, so he says, forget it. Like you can't, you can't focus 188 00:09:44,510 --> 00:09:48,900 on praying for these big God. What do I do in this moment and 189 00:09:48,910 --> 00:09:54,100 expect for those moments to actually bear tremendous fruit 190 00:09:54,110 --> 00:09:57,100 in your life. You have to focus on every 191 00:09:57,110 --> 00:10:01,160 single day cultivating small habits and rhythms of prayer and 192 00:10:01,170 --> 00:10:04,880 of conversation with God and of asking and offering and bringing 193 00:10:04,890 --> 00:10:09,640 to God these small things so that hey, the big things don't 194 00:10:09,650 --> 00:10:14,000 feel as big, but you actually have some momentum there when 195 00:10:14,010 --> 00:10:15,660 you when you arrive at the big moments. 196 00:10:15,670 --> 00:10:18,270 And that's yeah, absolutely. That's what Joseph. 197 00:10:18,490 --> 00:10:20,760 I think that's what we see. That's what we see for so many 198 00:10:20,770 --> 00:10:24,920 people in the New Testament who make I think of like Zachariah 199 00:10:24,990 --> 00:10:28,540 and Anna in the temple and all of these people who like 200 00:10:28,550 --> 00:10:33,940 witnessed Jesus's birth everyday faithful slowed down some small 201 00:10:33,950 --> 00:10:41,210 again careful obedience is what positioned them for their then 202 00:10:41,220 --> 00:10:43,450 experience of Jesus arrival like they were ready. 203 00:10:43,860 --> 00:10:46,970 And we still see that, right? Like, as you're talking, 204 00:10:47,030 --> 00:10:49,730 specific people are actually coming to mind for me, right, 205 00:10:49,740 --> 00:10:53,670 who have gone through horrific things that like are your worst 206 00:10:53,680 --> 00:10:56,070 nightmare. And yet in those moments, you 207 00:10:56,080 --> 00:11:00,800 see something coming out of them that you're like, there's like 208 00:11:01,090 --> 00:11:03,140 that is only coming from what's already there. 209 00:11:03,150 --> 00:11:06,360 You can't put that on in that worst moment, right? 210 00:11:06,370 --> 00:11:09,860 Like it's only your what's already in you, what you've 211 00:11:09,870 --> 00:11:13,700 already built and those faithful little choices, Like that's what 212 00:11:13,710 --> 00:11:16,240 you're drawing in in those moments, right? 213 00:11:16,250 --> 00:11:19,350 Like there's no sort of preparing for that exam or well, 214 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:21,180 there is the preparing for that exam or moment. 215 00:11:21,190 --> 00:11:25,060 And it is in those like small, small faithful choices. 216 00:11:25,550 --> 00:11:29,360 So OK, just jumping off that because we're going to end with 217 00:11:29,370 --> 00:11:32,810 obedience again, but I've got 3 questions. 218 00:11:32,820 --> 00:11:36,900 I think one of the questions that you hope people are 219 00:11:36,910 --> 00:11:40,000 wrestling with, and I hope, you know, I was listening to your 220 00:11:40,010 --> 00:11:42,610 sermon yesterday thinking about our church. 221 00:11:42,940 --> 00:11:45,320 One of the questions that I hope people are wrestling with is 222 00:11:45,330 --> 00:11:46,650 this. And I wrote them down so that 223 00:11:46,660 --> 00:11:49,710 I'm just going to read them. But where might God be showing 224 00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:56,770 up in the messy or inconvenient parts of your life right now? 225 00:11:56,830 --> 00:12:01,860 So again, I don't think for us to answer those, but for you 226 00:12:01,930 --> 00:12:07,030 listener, to be thinking about and even better, talking with 227 00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:10,570 somebody about how God might be showing up in the messiest parts 228 00:12:10,580 --> 00:12:13,650 of your life or what you see right now is most inconvenient. 229 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:17,560 So even in like my own head, I'm going, Oh yeah, OK, tight 230 00:12:17,570 --> 00:12:19,800 timeline. Like I've got sick kids at home. 231 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:22,290 That's inconvenient. Like what's the invitation? 232 00:12:22,550 --> 00:12:24,780 And that's like a little thing, right? 233 00:12:24,790 --> 00:12:28,110 That's not a a big thing. So various levels of 234 00:12:28,180 --> 00:12:33,200 inconvenience, various levels of messiness, life is not, it 235 00:12:33,210 --> 00:12:35,580 doesn't go the way we plan it to. 236 00:12:35,710 --> 00:12:38,960 And at times I go, hey, thank God it doesn't. 237 00:12:39,050 --> 00:12:41,970 And other times like banging ahead against the wall trying to 238 00:12:41,980 --> 00:12:45,870 figure it out for our people, though that I think what might 239 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:51,920 be really helpful is how do you or how have you learned to start 240 00:12:51,930 --> 00:12:56,020 to respond with obedience and trust? 241 00:12:56,270 --> 00:12:59,780 I think trust is, you know, I think those sometimes you can 242 00:12:59,790 --> 00:13:01,660 respond with trust that leads to obedience. 243 00:13:01,670 --> 00:13:04,260 Sometimes you can respond with obedience that eventually works 244 00:13:04,270 --> 00:13:09,080 itself out as trust. But trust obedience instead of 245 00:13:09,090 --> 00:13:12,580 what I think our default response is often, which is fear 246 00:13:12,830 --> 00:13:20,060 and worry, anxiety, those types of heightened emotions where 247 00:13:20,070 --> 00:13:22,320 we're like, I don't even know what to do now. 248 00:13:22,330 --> 00:13:27,090 So how do you push against fear? How do you work toward trust 249 00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:31,770 when you start to experience interruptions in your life? 250 00:13:33,490 --> 00:13:39,930 I think one thing I am learning and I would say I feel like I've 251 00:13:39,940 --> 00:13:44,540 actually been learning this through my parents in a a in the 252 00:13:44,550 --> 00:13:46,520 last couple of years and a particular challenge they've 253 00:13:46,530 --> 00:13:49,890 been facing. My mom will say this is that 254 00:13:49,900 --> 00:13:53,830 like hard things happen, but that God is with us in them. 255 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:58,830 And I think I've spent a lot of the last 10 years really railing 256 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:01,230 against the hard things and wrestling with those. 257 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:09,310 And I think being able to settle a little bit in hard things 258 00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:14,170 happen and God is with us and how do we look for the ways that 259 00:14:14,890 --> 00:14:18,000 whether the mess we're in is what we chose or something that 260 00:14:18,010 --> 00:14:21,940 happened to us like beyond our like, however we got into it, 261 00:14:22,390 --> 00:14:28,270 how is God showing up in it? Because he really is faithful in 262 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:33,980 the midst of it and shows up in in small and other ways. 263 00:14:33,990 --> 00:14:37,260 Like I don't know if this is works as an example, but this 264 00:14:37,270 --> 00:14:39,780 week as I was trying to get ready to preach, I had a lot 265 00:14:39,790 --> 00:14:42,280 going on. And then I got a migraine, which 266 00:14:42,290 --> 00:14:45,620 happens to me from time to time. And I'm just going, OK, so we'll 267 00:14:45,630 --> 00:14:49,010 call that the interruption. And I'm like this, this is like, 268 00:14:49,020 --> 00:14:51,720 I was already working really hard to try to like do 269 00:14:51,730 --> 00:14:52,970 everything I needed to do this week. 270 00:14:52,980 --> 00:14:55,410 I don't have time to have a migraine right now. 271 00:14:55,420 --> 00:14:58,030 Like this is this is not going to work for me. 272 00:14:58,140 --> 00:15:02,310 And I reached out to a couple of people and asked them to be 273 00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:03,890 praying for me as I was preparing. 274 00:15:04,020 --> 00:15:07,170 And when I wrote to ask them to be praying, I found out they had 275 00:15:07,180 --> 00:15:10,210 already been praying for me. And I just was like, wow, that's 276 00:15:10,220 --> 00:15:12,510 really cool. And then was struggling with my 277 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:14,950 migraine going like, I think something like this would really 278 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:17,450 help, but I don't have it. My uncle showed up at the door 279 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:20,030 and my aunt had sent him on a mission to because she knew I 280 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:21,310 had a migraine to like deliver it. 281 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:24,730 And I just like they were such small things, but that to me was 282 00:15:24,740 --> 00:15:29,760 such an example of like, you know, we could get into a whole 283 00:15:29,770 --> 00:15:32,660 to godsend the migraine. Did he allow like that's a whole 284 00:15:32,670 --> 00:15:34,500 other thing we don't necessarily need to get into. 285 00:15:34,750 --> 00:15:37,120 The fact was I was interrupted with a migraine. 286 00:15:37,290 --> 00:15:41,880 And also I could see these places where God was showing up 287 00:15:41,890 --> 00:15:44,210 in it. And I think if we're talking 288 00:15:44,220 --> 00:15:47,020 practical, like this isn't rocket science. 289 00:15:47,030 --> 00:15:49,320 It's not something people haven't heard before. 290 00:15:49,390 --> 00:15:54,420 But I do think the practice of gratitude can be really 291 00:15:54,430 --> 00:16:00,710 profound, especially when we are in those times where it can be 292 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:03,810 really consuming the interruptions, like we can't see 293 00:16:03,820 --> 00:16:07,390 past them or we're just aware of how much we are struggling or 294 00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:10,830 suffering. And so I think the discipline of 295 00:16:10,900 --> 00:16:13,430 pulling back and actually thinking about the things that 296 00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:18,970 we are thankful for, you know, scientists have shown that this 297 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:20,580 wires our brain differently, right? 298 00:16:20,590 --> 00:16:22,610 Like that there's actually something to that. 299 00:16:22,620 --> 00:16:27,280 And so I found in seasons where I have just like a little 300 00:16:27,290 --> 00:16:30,610 notebook and at bedtime, I'll try to, I have no number. 301 00:16:30,620 --> 00:16:31,890 I don't have to fill in a certain number. 302 00:16:31,900 --> 00:16:33,810 I just try to think of like, what are a few things I'm 303 00:16:33,820 --> 00:16:36,810 grateful for today? It's part of that practice. 304 00:16:36,820 --> 00:16:40,010 I think of examine that you have laid out in one of the Advent 305 00:16:40,020 --> 00:16:43,150 practices going back over your day and thinking about where 306 00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:46,770 have I seen God at work? And it just, it just offers some 307 00:16:46,780 --> 00:16:49,410 perspective that I think is really significant. 308 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:52,790 Almost laughing I so I pulled out my notebook. 309 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:56,130 This is like my back pocket notebook and I carry this for 310 00:16:56,140 --> 00:16:58,370 two reasons. One, I reach for it before I 311 00:16:58,380 --> 00:16:59,810 reach for my phone now. Hmm. 312 00:16:59,850 --> 00:17:03,220 So, and it throws people off because like even on Sunday, I 313 00:17:03,230 --> 00:17:05,490 was exchanging like phone numbers with somebody and I had 314 00:17:05,500 --> 00:17:08,319 my phone on me and I gave him the notebook and I was like, 315 00:17:08,329 --> 00:17:09,810 here, just write it down in this. 316 00:17:10,060 --> 00:17:16,390 And so I, I do so not only gratitude, but what I found it 317 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:20,290 to be so helpful for is exactly that because I have a harder 318 00:17:20,300 --> 00:17:24,349 time thinking through like, and I think we all naturally do this 319 00:17:24,359 --> 00:17:28,020 like, but by the time I get to the end of my day, I want to 320 00:17:28,030 --> 00:17:31,740 look back on where I was grateful as opposed to like when 321 00:17:31,750 --> 00:17:34,740 I try to think of, OK, how was I throughout the day, I can really 322 00:17:34,750 --> 00:17:36,390 easily focus on the negative things. 323 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,400 Like I didn't respond well here. Oh, I lost my patience there. 324 00:17:39,410 --> 00:17:41,280 Oh, that was, you know, that was too bad. 325 00:17:41,290 --> 00:17:43,240 I should have said this or done that differently. 326 00:17:43,410 --> 00:17:46,570 And so instead, what I've started to do is in the moment, 327 00:17:46,580 --> 00:17:50,030 I'll try to write down what I'm grateful for and the things I'm 328 00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:53,940 thankful for because then I can look back on my day and actually 329 00:17:53,950 --> 00:17:55,940 read through, Oh yeah, I was thankful. 330 00:17:55,950 --> 00:17:58,970 And I still am thankful. So I'm laughing like carrying a 331 00:17:58,980 --> 00:18:01,130 notebook around has seriously changed. 332 00:18:01,460 --> 00:18:03,430 Like, I'm not going to say it's changed my life. 333 00:18:03,620 --> 00:18:07,910 It is changing my days for sure. Well, and and it really is 334 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:12,470 rewiring our brains like like I would find Even so, I love that 335 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:13,740 that you're doing it throughout the day. 336 00:18:13,750 --> 00:18:17,000 I think that's fantastic. But I would find that even if I 337 00:18:17,010 --> 00:18:20,570 was just doing it at night, it changed my day, right. 338 00:18:20,580 --> 00:18:22,350 I would be going through my day being like, Oh, I have to 339 00:18:22,360 --> 00:18:25,080 remember that one for handy if I had notebook to write it down, 340 00:18:25,090 --> 00:18:27,660 but I'd be like, Oh, I have to. And it helped to shift to be 341 00:18:27,670 --> 00:18:29,550 like, Oh, that's something I'm grateful for. 342 00:18:29,660 --> 00:18:30,870 Oh, I'm going to remember that thing. 343 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:34,490 Oh, look, it just reframed how I was, how I was looking at it. 344 00:18:34,690 --> 00:18:41,720 And, and I think that that I think it sounds simple, but I 345 00:18:41,730 --> 00:18:44,720 think we don't want to underestimate how valuable that 346 00:18:44,730 --> 00:18:46,770 kind of practice can. Be yeah, the one thing before 347 00:18:46,780 --> 00:18:48,980 you move on to the next question that I would encourage people to 348 00:18:48,990 --> 00:18:54,060 try to is in your gratitude. I've shifted away from saying 349 00:18:54,070 --> 00:18:58,240 I'm thankful for and saying to God, thank you for. 350 00:18:58,630 --> 00:19:03,360 And that for me has changed my I, I never found like practicing 351 00:19:03,370 --> 00:19:08,610 gratitude really like transformative or impactful on 352 00:19:08,670 --> 00:19:12,940 my own, like mental health or psyche, like whatever. 353 00:19:12,950 --> 00:19:18,030 Like I until I shifted away from saying I'm thankful for because 354 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:20,730 I'm still like, I'm still the subject there. 355 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:23,750 I'm still, it's still about me. Yeah, I'm, I am thankful. 356 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:26,590 And so the, and I can't remember who it is not my idea. 357 00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:30,290 I heard somebody talk about this shift and I started doing it, 358 00:19:30,350 --> 00:19:35,230 said God, thank you for and that eliminated me from entirely from 359 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:38,070 the equation. So I'm, I'm thanking God. 360 00:19:38,260 --> 00:19:42,020 And then very often I'm thanking God for a specific person who 361 00:19:42,030 --> 00:19:46,200 is, you know, maybe through whom I'm experiencing something or 362 00:19:46,210 --> 00:19:51,650 seeing God at work or, you know, even if it's just like naming 363 00:19:51,660 --> 00:19:55,810 people that I'm grateful for each day, It's I'm, I am 364 00:19:55,960 --> 00:20:00,310 grateful toward God, grateful to God for this individual. 365 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:02,610 Yeah. And that that has changed my 366 00:20:02,620 --> 00:20:05,390 relationship, I think, to gratitude and in general. 367 00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:09,450 So I would encourage people to write it that way as a prayer 368 00:20:09,650 --> 00:20:11,280 like God. Thank you for. 369 00:20:12,290 --> 00:20:14,120 One more thing. Before you move on, yeah. 370 00:20:15,230 --> 00:20:19,430 OK, changing gears, but I feel like I'd be remiss to not name 371 00:20:19,440 --> 00:20:22,540 this as like because you asked like, how do you, I can't 372 00:20:22,550 --> 00:20:25,400 remember exactly how you put it, but how do you respond in? 373 00:20:26,290 --> 00:20:28,400 Trust and not. Fear and that you trust and not 374 00:20:28,410 --> 00:20:34,920 fear again, community, right? Like there are definitely, 375 00:20:34,990 --> 00:20:38,020 definitely times where I have leaned on the faith of other 376 00:20:38,030 --> 00:20:39,860 people when I have not had my own. 377 00:20:39,950 --> 00:20:43,680 And so I've talked about borrowing hope from people when 378 00:20:43,690 --> 00:20:46,900 I feel like I've run out and I'm like, I know that they have hope 379 00:20:46,910 --> 00:20:49,700 for me and that they can see through the other side of this. 380 00:20:49,780 --> 00:20:53,900 And I'm going to choose to lean on, I think these are wonderful 381 00:20:53,910 --> 00:20:57,390 people I respect and love. No, I'm not feeling the things 382 00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:00,000 that they are saying, but I'm going to choose to trust and 383 00:21:00,010 --> 00:21:04,330 believe and borrow their hope and borrow their faith when mine 384 00:21:04,340 --> 00:21:06,570 feels really weak. And then I've had experiences of 385 00:21:06,580 --> 00:21:09,050 actually getting to do that for other people too. 386 00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:11,990 And I remember again, sitting with a friend in a really, 387 00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:14,370 really low moment and I could see through it. 388 00:21:14,430 --> 00:21:17,320 I could see through her situation and know that there 389 00:21:17,330 --> 00:21:21,370 was like, I had hope for her. And I said that to her too. 390 00:21:21,380 --> 00:21:24,530 I said, like, you can borrow, you don't have to have it for 391 00:21:24,540 --> 00:21:26,290 yourself. And I just think there's such 392 00:21:27,410 --> 00:21:30,030 such strength of that in community, right, is that we 393 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:32,520 don't actually have to muster it up ourselves. 394 00:21:32,530 --> 00:21:34,870 I feel like that's our world is off to talking about like, you 395 00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:37,740 know, what we have to like muster up from within us and 396 00:21:37,750 --> 00:21:40,400 it's OK if we don't have it. And that's the gift of being in 397 00:21:40,410 --> 00:21:42,480 community. But again, kind of like what we 398 00:21:42,490 --> 00:21:45,300 were saying before, it really does help if you've actually 399 00:21:45,310 --> 00:21:49,240 nurtured those relationships already that you then have 400 00:21:49,250 --> 00:21:52,100 people that you can lean on in those times and moments. 401 00:21:52,110 --> 00:21:55,480 Of course, you can also build that and you go deeper in 402 00:21:55,490 --> 00:21:57,900 relationship in those moments with people for sure. 403 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:01,230 But when you have some of those relationships with people that 404 00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:03,560 you go, yeah, I'm not feeling it. 405 00:22:03,570 --> 00:22:05,670 I don't really get it. I don't know how this is going 406 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:06,760 to be. OK. 407 00:22:06,890 --> 00:22:09,480 And and I think the other thing that happens in those 408 00:22:09,490 --> 00:22:12,020 relationships is you get the opportunity to build the 409 00:22:12,030 --> 00:22:17,190 language out, right. So even just for, for groups of 410 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:20,490 people, for communities to start talking about borrowing hope, 411 00:22:20,500 --> 00:22:25,750 Yeah, gives you language in moments to say, hey, I need to 412 00:22:25,760 --> 00:22:28,940 borrow some hope right in this. Like that's how, that's how I'm 413 00:22:28,950 --> 00:22:29,690 feeling. Yeah. 414 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:34,850 Or alternatively, to come in and say, hey, like, let me share 415 00:22:34,860 --> 00:22:37,290 some with you. I'm not trying to fix your 416 00:22:37,300 --> 00:22:41,370 situation, but sounds a little bit like you need to hear that 417 00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:46,250 that there are moments of hope and other reason why it's so 418 00:22:46,260 --> 00:22:51,110 important to tell our stories and to tell them to ourselves 419 00:22:51,120 --> 00:22:54,870 and to retell them and to tell them to others and to write them 420 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:56,780 down and. Here's another example of what 421 00:22:56,790 --> 00:22:59,680 Ken fuel costly like. It can feel hard. 422 00:22:59,690 --> 00:23:02,100 It can sometimes feel like a choice of obedience or 423 00:23:02,190 --> 00:23:05,900 definitely vulnerability. And yet look at what we gain 424 00:23:05,950 --> 00:23:07,920 from from that. Yeah. 425 00:23:08,130 --> 00:23:12,480 So let's shift a little bit, but still on the theme of 426 00:23:12,550 --> 00:23:17,240 interruption and obedience. Joseph, we don't, I don't think 427 00:23:17,250 --> 00:23:19,900 need to get into all of this, but Joseph finds himself in a 428 00:23:19,910 --> 00:23:24,320 interruption that is in, I would say entirely of God's design. 429 00:23:24,910 --> 00:23:30,830 And you know, that's the reality of his big interruption. 430 00:23:31,820 --> 00:23:34,850 Not all of our interruptions are God's design. 431 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:39,410 Some are our own making, right? And some are situation and 432 00:23:39,420 --> 00:23:43,950 circumstance we're in not of anything we've done, but that 433 00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:48,290 are equally not God's like specific doing. 434 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:55,650 So I I mean, the the question was, is every interruption from 435 00:23:55,660 --> 00:23:58,310 God or not? I think the answer to that is 436 00:23:58,320 --> 00:23:59,000 no. Yeah. 437 00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:05,750 But let's talk a little bit about how you have started to 438 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:08,790 discern that is an interruption from God. 439 00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:13,850 Is it not from God? To what degree does that matter? 440 00:24:13,980 --> 00:24:18,400 Yeah. And then what if it does or 441 00:24:18,410 --> 00:24:21,420 doesn't matter? Yeah, I'm glad you raised that 442 00:24:21,430 --> 00:24:24,840 because I definitely was feeling some of the tension of that in 443 00:24:24,850 --> 00:24:27,330 this story. Like when when we're trying to 444 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:30,750 like there's I think there's tons for us to learn about how 445 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:32,890 we live in our stories from this story. 446 00:24:32,940 --> 00:24:35,610 But I did feel the tension of like, OK, this is a particular 447 00:24:35,620 --> 00:24:39,350 moment in history of like God doing this crazy thing for Mary 448 00:24:39,360 --> 00:24:40,670 and Joseph. And that is. 449 00:24:41,180 --> 00:24:44,610 So yes, we can learn from that. And also it isn't the same as 450 00:24:44,620 --> 00:24:47,770 most of the things that we face and live with every day. 451 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:52,790 So I felt I felt that tension. Yeah, as you're as you're asking 452 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:55,850 the question, I think that is the thought that comes to mind 453 00:24:55,860 --> 00:25:02,880 is maybe it doesn't matter only in that I think probably the 454 00:25:02,890 --> 00:25:07,350 response is the same. And I wonder if in walking. 455 00:25:07,360 --> 00:25:11,290 So the response being that we draw near to God, we draw near 456 00:25:11,300 --> 00:25:15,940 to community, we ask him where he is in this, we look for the 457 00:25:15,950 --> 00:25:21,210 places of how he is at work. The express, like the Psalms 458 00:25:21,220 --> 00:25:25,970 teach us really well to express our anger, our frustration, our 459 00:25:25,980 --> 00:25:30,610 doubt, our like we, we stay in communication with God about 460 00:25:30,620 --> 00:25:33,610 those things. And I think that that's probably 461 00:25:33,620 --> 00:25:39,530 true regardless of if it's a, like, divine interruption or 462 00:25:39,540 --> 00:25:43,130 just a reality of the life that we're in, world that we're 463 00:25:43,140 --> 00:25:44,270 living in. Yeah. 464 00:25:46,660 --> 00:25:49,610 Yeah, no, I think that's good. I'm just, I'm writing down so I 465 00:25:49,620 --> 00:25:52,840 don't lose the thought. Yeah, because I I think that 466 00:25:52,900 --> 00:25:56,650 it's really important just to say I, I agree. 467 00:25:56,660 --> 00:26:00,790 I don't think that it matters as much as we think it matters 468 00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:04,810 because I do think that we get stuck in the is this from God or 469 00:26:04,820 --> 00:26:09,650 is this not from God And that we you listen like. 470 00:26:09,660 --> 00:26:14,680 I think that's a good question to ask and pose, but I think we 471 00:26:14,690 --> 00:26:20,240 can get so often stuck in that. How could God cause this to 472 00:26:20,250 --> 00:26:25,460 happen? And that is this massive ocean 473 00:26:25,470 --> 00:26:30,780 of both chaos and calm. Like it it it is. 474 00:26:30,790 --> 00:26:35,130 There's so much to wrestle through once you go down that 475 00:26:35,190 --> 00:26:39,150 that road and at times in life, like like I've done it, you've 476 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,100 done it like we need to, you need to wrestle that out. 477 00:26:42,290 --> 00:26:45,020 But I don't know that that's like every single thing you're 478 00:26:45,030 --> 00:26:47,160 like, did God cause us to God not cause this? 479 00:26:47,170 --> 00:26:51,910 I think what is important is, and I'm this is, I want to be 480 00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,550 very careful here. So this is like, OK, baby heresy 481 00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:57,930 territory because it's not in the Bible, like it's not in 482 00:26:57,940 --> 00:27:03,150 Joseph's story. But I can imagine Joseph asking 483 00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:07,300 that question like, OK, God, Like God, is this actually from 484 00:27:07,310 --> 00:27:08,470 you? Is this not from you? 485 00:27:09,120 --> 00:27:13,300 And then there's another question if if it's from you, 486 00:27:14,260 --> 00:27:17,830 what am I to do? If it's not from you, same 487 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:19,490 question. Yeah, what am I to do? 488 00:27:19,540 --> 00:27:23,610 So I think the, the faster we can get to that question with 489 00:27:23,620 --> 00:27:25,830 God, the better off we're going to be. 490 00:27:25,870 --> 00:27:30,670 And, and acknowledging that, yes, in season you, every single 491 00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:33,830 one of us needs to wrestle out the did God cause this to 492 00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:35,750 happen? Did God allow this to happen? 493 00:27:35,820 --> 00:27:37,740 And if so, what does it say about me? 494 00:27:37,750 --> 00:27:40,910 What does it say about God? Like how are we, how am I to 495 00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:44,650 make sense of of the, the, the horrible things that happen 496 00:27:44,940 --> 00:27:49,190 inside of the world That is part of your faith journey. 497 00:27:49,420 --> 00:27:53,010 But I think in terms of every, like thinking about all of the 498 00:27:53,020 --> 00:27:55,570 ways in which life is interrupted, the faster we can 499 00:27:55,580 --> 00:28:00,080 get to asking God specifically whether whether this is your 500 00:28:00,090 --> 00:28:03,590 design or not, whether this is from you or not, what, what's 501 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:05,800 the step that you are calling me to take in it? 502 00:28:05,870 --> 00:28:07,860 I think that's the step that Joseph gets to. 503 00:28:08,210 --> 00:28:12,160 I also think it's often like, OK, again, this is a different 504 00:28:12,170 --> 00:28:14,760 situation, like Angel telling them what's going on, different 505 00:28:14,770 --> 00:28:18,800 situation in our situations. I often think it's it's not even 506 00:28:18,810 --> 00:28:21,540 possible to know. I think sometimes we have to 507 00:28:21,550 --> 00:28:23,920 walk through it and then we get a better sense of like, oh, that 508 00:28:23,930 --> 00:28:27,020 really was from God or like, Nope, but he was with me in 509 00:28:27,030 --> 00:28:30,390 that. And I think there's, I think 510 00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:33,030 that there's some. So the response I think, is the 511 00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:34,520 same as what we're seeing. Yeah. 512 00:28:34,580 --> 00:28:37,330 And I do think that sometimes you figure it out as you go. 513 00:28:37,380 --> 00:28:41,240 Sometimes it remains a mystery. But I think sometimes we're 514 00:28:41,250 --> 00:28:43,570 desperate. I know I am at the outset of it 515 00:28:43,580 --> 00:28:46,110 to try to figure it out and make sense of it. 516 00:28:47,820 --> 00:28:50,690 I'm definitely guilty of like trying to make sense of what is 517 00:28:50,700 --> 00:28:54,830 this that's happening here. And I think sometimes, and 518 00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:58,330 that's hard, but sometimes we actually just can't, can't know. 519 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:04,430 So to think about a third question, and maybe we'll leave 520 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:09,190 these in the description just to help people follow each three or 521 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:13,490 each question, we see this. So Joseph doesn't have the full 522 00:29:13,500 --> 00:29:18,890 picture, but he gets to that point where he's able to obey 523 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:23,000 and he does get to a point where he's able to walk through it. 524 00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:26,310 And like, like you said, like maybe it's in hindsight that 525 00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:29,570 he's wrestling it out. Maybe it's in real time. 526 00:29:29,660 --> 00:29:33,570 Different than like unless an Angel appears exactly and says 527 00:29:33,580 --> 00:29:37,470 something very specific to you. Yeah, you're going to have to 528 00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:39,310 wrestle it out a little bit different than Joseph. 529 00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:42,170 But he does obey. He does take a step. 530 00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:47,040 He does name the baby Jesus, which I think is this Like it's 531 00:29:47,050 --> 00:29:49,640 almost like he's he's planting the flag. 532 00:29:49,650 --> 00:29:54,300 He's saying like, OK, I am going to choose to do the exact thing 533 00:29:54,370 --> 00:29:55,810 that you've called me to do. Yeah. 534 00:29:55,820 --> 00:29:58,040 And we will see what happens. Right. 535 00:29:58,050 --> 00:30:00,840 Like, it feels a little bit like that kind of moment for Joseph. 536 00:30:01,750 --> 00:30:09,530 Have you found any like really practical plant the flag. 537 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:15,250 This is what I'm going to do in order to signal to myself and to 538 00:30:15,260 --> 00:30:17,950 God. I am choosing to trust and I'm 539 00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:21,110 taking a step of obedience. Steps might all look different 540 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:24,170 all the time. I'm thinking like, you know, is 541 00:30:24,180 --> 00:30:28,250 it is it that you name it to somebody, right? 542 00:30:28,380 --> 00:30:30,090 You're like, this is what I'm in. 543 00:30:30,210 --> 00:30:32,420 This is what I'm feeling and experiencing. 544 00:30:32,430 --> 00:30:34,890 Here's the interruption. Here's what I'm gonna do. 545 00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:37,330 Like maybe just naming that to somebody else. 546 00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,780 That's I think like a we're going to plant the flag kind of 547 00:30:39,790 --> 00:30:42,790 moment and say God, I'm going to choose to obey. 548 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,930 Take a step. Anything that's been really like 549 00:30:45,940 --> 00:30:49,910 practically helpful for you to signal steps been taken. 550 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,910 Yeah, I think definitely naming it for somebody, I think there's 551 00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:57,230 there's significance and power in that. 552 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:02,500 And then later when we're not sure or we're doubting, we have 553 00:31:02,510 --> 00:31:06,000 somebody we can go back to who's like, no, remember why, you 554 00:31:06,010 --> 00:31:08,400 know, like This is why this is what was happening for you. 555 00:31:09,380 --> 00:31:12,870 In a similar way, I think writing some of that stuff down, 556 00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:18,980 I'm an inconsistent journaler, but I do think the times where I 557 00:31:18,990 --> 00:31:22,480 can look back and be like, wow, look at what how I was trying to 558 00:31:22,490 --> 00:31:23,700 respond. I mean, sometimes I look back 559 00:31:23,710 --> 00:31:28,730 and go, whoa, OK, thank you Lord for changing me and moving me 560 00:31:28,740 --> 00:31:30,670 through. But also look back and be like, 561 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:32,800 wow, I really was trying to be faithful there. 562 00:31:32,810 --> 00:31:36,860 And this is where that came from and how I was hearing God in 563 00:31:36,870 --> 00:31:44,030 those moments. We we remember an essence of it, 564 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:46,270 but I don't think we remember all the depth of what's 565 00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:49,410 happening in those moments. And I think there can be, yeah, 566 00:31:49,420 --> 00:31:53,640 can be really huge value in us writing it down. 567 00:31:53,730 --> 00:31:58,000 Yeah, so I think I I think name, name a step to somebody super 568 00:31:58,010 --> 00:32:01,740 powerful, write it down, also really powerful. 569 00:32:02,070 --> 00:32:06,480 And you know, you might look back and go, oh, I didn't do the 570 00:32:06,490 --> 00:32:08,990 thing I said. I was like I said I was going to 571 00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,740 do her felt God calling me to do didn't take that step. 572 00:32:12,450 --> 00:32:15,470 I think naming it to somebody just gets it outside of 573 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:18,280 yourself. Writing it down gets it again, 574 00:32:18,290 --> 00:32:22,660 like outside of yourself. And I think the, you know, if I 575 00:32:22,670 --> 00:32:26,050 could suggest in order, I would say write it down and then name 576 00:32:26,060 --> 00:32:30,030 it to somebody. And I've found that that so 577 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:36,310 often is, you know, if I've got alright, sensing God calling me 578 00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:40,500 to do this in this moment, write it down and then take that to 579 00:32:40,510 --> 00:32:43,240 somebody and say, hey, this is so you're not changing it on the 580 00:32:43,250 --> 00:32:45,300 fly. You're not like there's no 581 00:32:45,310 --> 00:32:47,820 backing down from it. It's it's written down, you've 582 00:32:47,830 --> 00:32:52,000 named it and then name it to somebody else and away you go. 583 00:32:52,050 --> 00:32:54,920 There's, I don't, I don't know exactly, you might help me 584 00:32:54,970 --> 00:32:57,170 translate this, but there is that Old Testament practice, 585 00:32:57,180 --> 00:32:59,560 right where people would have these profound encounters with 586 00:32:59,570 --> 00:33:02,180 God and they would mark the place, they would name it, 587 00:33:02,190 --> 00:33:04,520 they'd like build a pile of stones there. 588 00:33:04,590 --> 00:33:06,620 And I think there's something in that, right? 589 00:33:06,630 --> 00:33:09,270 Like something in sort of marking and naming, something 590 00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:11,690 happens, something with me and God happened here. 591 00:33:12,060 --> 00:33:15,040 And so I don't know exactly what the equivalent of that would 592 00:33:15,050 --> 00:33:18,150 look like for us today. I don't know, you know, 593 00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:22,320 sometimes this, again, probably not a great example, but there 594 00:33:22,330 --> 00:33:25,470 was this Christmas sermon I heard years and years ago with 595 00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:28,500 this profound idea that like just stayed with me. 596 00:33:28,570 --> 00:33:31,910 And one day I was out at like 10,000 villages or something and 597 00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:35,460 saw this ornament that to me represented that idea. 598 00:33:35,530 --> 00:33:38,500 So this is maybe trivial, but I was like, you know, I think I'm 599 00:33:38,510 --> 00:33:41,890 actually going to by that ornament and it's one of 600 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:46,230 actually only a few, but that when I look at it, it reminds me 601 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:47,390 of that truth. Yeah. 602 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:51,210 And so I think, yeah, if there are ways to to market, to name 603 00:33:51,220 --> 00:33:55,010 it, to build that pile of stones, maybe we plant a tree, 604 00:33:55,020 --> 00:33:58,190 maybe it like. But I think that there can be a 605 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:01,710 helpful physical outlet to doing something tangible or having 606 00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:05,770 something to look at that reminds us of of that. 607 00:34:06,100 --> 00:34:11,500 No, absolutely. Yeah, I, funnily enough, like 608 00:34:11,510 --> 00:34:13,310 Connie and I have done the exact same. 609 00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:15,850 We have ornaments and Christmas ornaments that we've purchased 610 00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:21,010 and started when we were on our journey of longing to have kids 611 00:34:21,020 --> 00:34:23,750 and it not working out for that season. 612 00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:27,850 And so we had bought ornaments during that season. 613 00:34:28,300 --> 00:34:32,530 And then when when Anna was born, we bought an ornament as 614 00:34:32,540 --> 00:34:34,570 well. So it, it wasn't, yeah. 615 00:34:34,580 --> 00:34:40,170 It was just a, a practice that that was with us in seasons of 616 00:34:40,179 --> 00:34:42,030 grief, yes. And sorrow. 617 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:45,590 And then we carried it through into seasons of hope and 618 00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:47,770 anticipation. And then yeah, into. 619 00:34:47,780 --> 00:34:49,010 What? And it probably actually gives 620 00:34:49,020 --> 00:34:51,510 you a way to tell that story now to your girls too, right? 621 00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:53,550 Yeah, because they look, they're like, well, I know this one's 622 00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:55,050 mine, then they have that language. 623 00:34:55,060 --> 00:34:56,650 But who's this? One right? 624 00:34:56,690 --> 00:34:57,930 Right. So we have that. 625 00:34:58,060 --> 00:35:00,230 The other thing I did, and I'm not suggesting this at all, and 626 00:35:00,240 --> 00:35:02,430 this might, we might cut this one out from the podcast, but I 627 00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:05,200 get asked all the time why I have a tattoo on my arm and it's 628 00:35:05,210 --> 00:35:06,540 that same story. Yeah. 629 00:35:06,610 --> 00:35:10,170 So for me, it was a way of marking, literally marking a 630 00:35:10,180 --> 00:35:16,840 moment where I said, yeah, like I, I, I want there to be a very 631 00:35:16,850 --> 00:35:20,840 definitive mark. That's right, of both God, 632 00:35:20,850 --> 00:35:24,990 you're faithfulness in the midst of deep sadness and sorrow and 633 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:29,120 in the midst of exceptional joy and celebration. 634 00:35:29,230 --> 00:35:34,280 And for me, it was a way of saying again, the, the verse is 635 00:35:34,580 --> 00:35:38,160 essentially for me what it is saying or what it is declaring 636 00:35:38,170 --> 00:35:42,690 is this my, my posture toward God is going to be the same in 637 00:35:42,700 --> 00:35:45,400 these moments of deep sadness and sorrow as it is in the 638 00:35:45,410 --> 00:35:48,690 moment, deep cloudiness and deep joy and celebration. 639 00:35:48,980 --> 00:35:52,230 And so whatever that is, I will bless the Lord at all times. 640 00:35:52,270 --> 00:35:54,230 So God's praise gonna be on my lips. 641 00:35:54,240 --> 00:35:56,830 That's how I'm gonna choose to be, even though that's not how I 642 00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:59,740 feel. So I love that I think choose 643 00:35:59,750 --> 00:36:02,490 something not, not suggesting that everybody goes and gets a 644 00:36:02,500 --> 00:36:05,010 tattoo. That is absolutely not what I 645 00:36:05,020 --> 00:36:09,590 want you to hear. But I have a physical, tangible 646 00:36:09,640 --> 00:36:13,250 declaration of, OK, this is how we're going to choose to be. 647 00:36:13,300 --> 00:36:16,790 I think is a very significant thing to do. 648 00:36:17,050 --> 00:36:20,110 Yeah, I want to say thanks. Thank you for preaching. 649 00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:25,210 Thanks for bringing peace. I think, I hope, I pray into 650 00:36:25,220 --> 00:36:29,810 people's lives and in the midst of what feels may be messy and 651 00:36:29,820 --> 00:36:32,610 inconvenient. And I think those small steps of 652 00:36:32,620 --> 00:36:36,730 obedience is what leads you more toward experiencing God's peace. 653 00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:39,850 So thank you and thanks for those of you listening. 654 00:36:40,020 --> 00:36:44,570 We'd love to hear from you. And in the meantime, pray that 655 00:36:44,580 --> 00:36:47,390 you continue to practice your way toward Christmas. 656 00:36:47,460 --> 00:36:50,270 Build your little Advent wreaths with candles. 657 00:36:50,980 --> 00:36:56,140 Practice, evening meditation, prayer, reflection, the evening 658 00:36:56,150 --> 00:36:59,710 examine and all of the things that that we're hoping and 659 00:36:59,720 --> 00:37:04,040 praying for you into God's hope and peace and joy and love this 660 00:37:04,050 --> 00:37:07,480 season. So until next week, blessings on 661 00:37:07,490 --> 00:37:07,890 your week.