Hello and welcome to Big Gay energy.
I'm Bree. I'm Fiora and I'm Caitlin come
along with us while we dive into the fun and nuances of queer
media representation matters. And we're here to talk about it.
Hello. Hello, welcome back.
This is see you again Tiara. Yeah, same, thank you.
Everybody at home for joining us.
What are you doing today? Caitlin, we have a super super
special video. So special, like everyone's been
begging for this? No, they have not an utterly, no
one. No one has asked for it.
Today we are going to be talking about the best show in the world
that has no issues whatsoever. No Glee Glee.
So when was the first time you watch Glee?
I watched it since the beginning.
Like when it first aired because like this show.
Sounded so appealing to me because it's like oh it's about
like I didn't know what a glee club was.
But I got from like the original trailer from what I can
remember. I got like theater Club Vibes
and I was like okay cool like high school theater.
Like that's awesome. We never get to actually see
into that world like that'd be super fun.
Let's do it. Because like I grew up watching
musicals Like I'm from New York. Originally, I used to go to
Broadway as a kid, like I love musicals like, yeah.
I finally like a TV show about that, kind of stuff.
And yeah. So I was watching it from the
beginning and boy did this show evolved over time, which we will
get into but like, yeah, I like it very much appeal to me from
the very beginning. I think I was in elementary
school and started. I can't remember time periods
but yeah it was 2009 now so I was just entering Middle School.
And so I think I was like slightly too young right in the
beginning but then I was a theater kid so I don't know how
I've just, I never saw the show until the pandemic and the whole
reason. Yeah, it took me forever weird.
Oh, I thought you were seated earlier because it's like know
your jam and Tino and I watched the first, okay?
So a lot of things happen like this.
I have to be like fully committed to Watching something
to actually get into it because I A lot of times I watched the
first episode and just stop because I had I think I was
like, forcing myself to watch it.
I can't force myself to watch things.
Yeah. Just doesn't work. but, I was
obsessed with Melissa was is past tense.
Let's just say, is because every time I see her, then I become
really obsessed. I so I think I tried watching it
for her, but I knew she wasn't in it till the fourth season so
I got I didn't get past the first episode.
It's like screw it. I'll just watch the fourth
season so I watched the four and a half of five.
Interesting. Yeah so I have had no idea what
happened other than 4 and half of 5.
Then one day I was like I guess I will watch the whole thing and
then I fell in love with the show.
This is 20:21 the summer of 2021.
Yeah, these are watching it during the Glee Renaissance that
was happening. Basically.
Yeah, but I was actually not aware that everybody else is
everyone else, watched it? And then a few months later
because some other things happened in real life and I
think it was like right before the year anniversary of Nia that
I actually like fell in love. The show and I fell in love with
Nia. She's amazing.
And this whole time, I will not say anything past tense with her
ex. I refuse to Everything is as it
should be in my mind. Yeah, but anyway, this show made
me very, very depressed. Just which is weird for a
comedy. So right now I have made me very
angry. So all you are discovering Lee
during the Glee Renaissance in the locked out.
I was revisiting Trauma from the show that I had suppressed with,
like, there's like podcast coming out about it and I was,
like, listening. I was like, oh God, yeah.
Like you're expressing all of my feelings that I've had penned up
about the show because like, damn, the trauma.
But, so we'll get into all that. So I'm glad the Good Bad and the
Ugly that is our was Glee which was like, it was a Worldwide
phenomena and like, we'll get into it.
Yeah. Okay.
Out of control. I'm glad that you watched it as
it came out. So I have no idea what the world
was like, when Glee was airing. I barely heard about it.
But it's also depends on when you watch it in life so I have
different experiences from you. Yeah between Age and what was
going on in the world? Yeah we'll get into it.
Why it like at the time it was a it was a big deal for a lot of
reasons and we'll kind of jump into that we like jump into the
show and throughout this episode maybe two episodes because
depending on how much we scream about this show It might be
multiple parts will have compilation clips that we found
on YouTube and patreon. You'll see us react to it.
YouTube, we're going to cut most of it out just because it get
too long and I don't want to deal with copyright because, but
since we are found to be wanting to be like the YouTube version,
yes. Okay, so full reaction /.
A trip down memory lane with YouTube video, with the YouTube
videos will be available on the patreon and you'll get a little
taste. If you're watching on YouTube or
listening on audio podcast also especially for audio.
There's some things that are confusing but will try to read
as much as if it is the first video.
Since we're an lgbtq+ media podcast, I titled this section.
Everyone is gay. Perfect.
So what do you think? Is everybody gay on the show?
No, I don't think everybody is gay on the show.
I think there's a lot of insanity that went on the show
as the show evolved over time and like there are other podcast
at have like super gotten into detail with likely, but like one
of the big problems with the show is there's so many writing
and consistencies and so there's no like consistency with like
characters from like episode to episode.
Episode. So like all their plot lines,
get all kinds of weird. So yeah I can see like if you
really searched through the whole show you could find.
It's as if everybody acting really gay when they may not be
a gay character because like the it's almost like the writers and
talk to each other when they were at the show.
And so it's like it's a know, it is like it's such a hot mess.
Like they will have a whole episode dedicated to one thing
about one character and then the next episode, completely forgot
about it. And like never bring it up,
again. That's true.
And then they'll contradict themselves later, correct?
Yeah. It's like they didn't talk to
each other. So, yeah, you can have I'm going
to be like, yeah, I think Artie's fruity and like have one
Offline that he has and never talk touch it ever again, so
like maybe they were but maybe they weren't because the writers
on the show did not talk to each other.
Well, speaking of that, I guess we'll skip down a little bit
because we have a video just for that.
It's such a, this show is such a disaster sometimes.
Okay, history of Joe run, Joey run first.
So the history of Glee and why it just gets more and more.
Ridiculous overtime is like if you you may not be aware.
Like if you if you came in during the Renaissance of Glee
during the pandemic and you're like whoa this show you have to
understand that this show was like novel.
Before its time. So first of all, it was a
syndicated show. So it was on broadcast TV on Fox
network, that's who had Glee, which doesn't make a lot of
sense. If you've heard the term Fox,
because Fox as a company is very, very right-wing
conservative. So this show was on a right-wing
conservative Network, which is crazy to begin with.
And it had all that even happened.
How did I even happen did the jokes over?
Heads or I don't know that, I don't know.
But yeah. And so it had openly queer
characters in prime time which was very rare at the time
especially on this network so it was a huge deal and after its
first season it blew up like this at one point in time was
the most popular television show in the world like globally and
it very much got to the creators heads and instead of making it
About the show, they started doing things like trying to sell
songs on iTunes and just the show became less about what it
originally was, which was a satire and everybody forgets.
It's a satire. So it's making fun of this
theater culture and like of children, like growing up in
that culture, that's really what it is.
And it started taking itself way too seriously as a television
show and was trying to tackle like Teenage issues, real world
issues, like we get unique. Later.
And it's about like, you know, being trans and then or about
like homelessness, there's one whole episode dedicated to like
Sam and his family struggling and homelessness.
So they tried to like, take themselves way too seriously and
like tackle big topics, but they forgot what they were which is a
satire about basically, whatever culture they were in, which is
America, middle of nowhere. Like Ohio is like a middle state
in America, if you're not familiar with America, But, you
know, and then kids, small town have dreams of getting out going
to the big city that kind of stuff.
So it's supposed to be like not being serious about that, but
being a satire about that and then you have like the burnout
mr. Shue.
Who like forgo that dream to like, be a teacher for whatever
reason, and like, it's supposed to be making fun of itself.
Not taking itself too seriously. So as it started taking itself
too, seriously as the show is like gaining popularity.
It got way too full of itself and like again that's where you
started getting all these inconsistencies that were
happening the show was trying to make money off the so what they
would do is they would essentially like the Glee club
would do a cover and then they would sell that song on iTunes.
This is before like free streaming was more mainstream
and they would sell it so they were making a ton of money off
that. So then the show became less
about the show and more about like having hit song like
centered around hit songs they could sell which is why as you
watch the show there becomes more hit song.
It's just like centered around putting hit songs in the show so
they can sell it. So it just lost its way and as
it started doing that, it started declining in popularity
to the point where nobody talked about the show anymore because
it got so bad. Whereas it used to be a show
that like rival the Super Bowl, as opposed to like, how many
people were watching this show? Like, it was the most watched
television show, and it just lost its mind, as it, you know,
it's a great metaphor for capitalism it.
Be lost its mind and then people are like, this isn't what I
signed. And up for and stop watching it
and just fizzled out. So that's Glee.
So run. Joey run is like the most
quintessential Glee thing on Glee because that is what Glee
actually is. Like, it's Rachel basically
trying to make something. She thinks is super cool, which
is a music video. If I call the guys that are into
her, that she's in do, and she thinks it's really cool.
And it's like, it's like edited, like, the way, like somebody
would minimal technology would have like an 80s edit kind of
thing, and she's so proud of this.
And He's like, what are you doing with those reasons?
Trash, we hate this, but like that's what Glee was, that's the
most Glee thing on Glee and like they keep making fun of it again
because it's a show that makes fun of itself.
That's part of the satire of it and they keep bringing it up
because like at the audience hated it but like I think the
audience forgot and Glee eventually forgets what Glee
actually was because it just it loses its mind.
And yeah it just it just became a way to sell iTunes songs.
Over time and just that's why it just stopped making sense.
And Rachel became way too serious.
About her like everybody becomes way too serious about themselves
and it's like that's not what this show actually is run, Joey
run, is what the show actually is, but they constantly bring it
back and make fun of it. Because like everybody
throughout Glee was basically, I think that makes sense.
Sorry for why I do like four and five because that's what I
started with. So those were the more serious
Seasons. So I'm used to Glee as a not,
okay? So it can never be serious but
no, it's a more serious show. which is why when I went back to
the first like, I tried the first episode first and it just
didn't work and So I guess I get what that's also why I have a
different Viewpoint of the show in general because I started in
the middle. Yeah.
You started in the middle and like for me for is when I
stopped watching because for repeated what was happening in
the first season but made it too serious.
And I was like and it fucked up a lot of shit that I was mad
about and I was like, I'm not watching.
This is what it even is the show anymore.
And if you weren't watching it live at the time, like it was a
big deal that that was even on TV and fox of all things.
So that made it more of a leg cultural phenomenon that was
happening. And it was making, like, theater
more mainstream people are like, yeah, this is actually pretty
cool and a pretty hard thing that people are doing and it
made it more relatable to people who didn't really know what
theater culture was or I didn't know what a glee club was, but I
knew its theater culture was so it just it was very
revolutionary at its time. But then like, yeah, for you,
Later it went off the rails and it was just trying to make
money. I couldn't with the show
anymore. So basically I said, I would say
there's like three or even four different errors of Glee because
halfway through five, they get rid of half their caste which
I'll talk about later again. It's just that makes no sense
and then six is a brand-new show itself again and six I stopped
at six because I could barely get through it.
Yeah, they took. Yeah.
But what are we going to go through the what are we going
through? The eras of Glee.
Um Maybe in the next part. Like when we talk about the new
kids and stuff because we'll just But do you want to talk
about your favorite character right now?
My favorite character. I have two favorite characters.
Why Anna? And Sue?
Yeah, those are exactly one it sue because we're still in the
problematic section of Glee. Is that we're doing, okay,
there's so many problems with Glee.
Most of them are seasoned for for me.
But I don't think Sue Sue is not problematic to me.
Sue is like the rational person in the room because this is,
again, it's a satire, which is like over-exaggerated in certain
aspects and Sue is usually like the voice of reason who's like
colleagues only person calls mr. Shue out for being the villain
of the show. He's the villain.
Okay? Like the writers, try to make
him be like, he's the protagonist.
He's really not. He's a lot of the problems and
the show's stem from him being selfish, and trying, A teenager
again. Like he's so creepy and weird
and Sue is just like keeping it real all the time.
So I love Su and I just I love so I don't have bad things about
her. Sometimes she's those
problematic you, but I don't care because to me, she is the
voice of reason and you gotta shout out Jane Lynch.
Queer actress. Absolutely love her.
She's probably the most iconic and successful person from this
show like in this show. Wouldn't it be have done what it
did without her in it and literally nobody else can Taesu
like Jane Lynch is so talented. Like she was absolutely the
perfect person for this role. I love Jane Lynch.
I'm just not the biggest fan of Sue.
She has funny moments. I just I don't know all the
adults it's because you came in and sees if you're again went
off the rails and that's not who suits they tried to paint her as
the villain when she's really not like Glee lost its mind like
yeah so I again my viewpoint is very different.
Because of coming in at 4:00, I came in when everyone else
stopped, anytime I'm sad or need the laughs.
I literally just go on YouTube and watch, like, best moments of
Sue, Sylvester, and just laugh. Because she's, she's just the
best. Her lines are so Great Khali
out. Mostly to shoot his bullshit.
Would you like to see some of her times?
Yeah, let's do it. If you want to let you know,
we're talking about. Please like join us on this
journey, patreon members. while I get the screen share up, I
will let the ads play This video, who is the most
problematic character? It's okay.
Well, again you saw the outline, you could have said that Sue's
not problematic and think she can be read as problematic, the
most problematic character issue.
He just, he's so he's next. Don't worry, you can, you can
do, okay? So actually, I did not see him
as creepy the first time until and then, I kept hearing
everybody say that. He's so creepy.
I'm like, did I just I did not care about him so I didn't pay
attention when he was on the screen and that's how it should
have been. He should have been so like I
don't need to pay attention to him but he just he constantly
kept getting centered and stuff and it's like this is not about
you but his whole story line in the first season I hated I hated
his wife. Terry, I believe she pissed me
off all the adults in the show. Really pissed me off.
So I just did not pay attention to them Pillsbury.
Yeah, yeah. Emma was great until everything
got way too serious. The oven and it got weird.
Yeah. I love Kurt's dad, though.
Oh yeah, he's a great guy. Let's talk about shoe.
Do we have to? I mean I kind of feel like we
need to do, even though I don't like him, I hate him.
He is the most problematic character in the show.
And again, like, Ryan Murphy very much tries to Center shoe
as like, oh he's the good guy. He, this is that, but he does so
much shit like he's centers himself in everything and it's
like this is a group of like high school kids who are trying
to find their place their community and like he constantly
centers himself in like their world and it's weird instead of
like being a good teacher and like supporting them, he sent
her some self constantly and he does it in super inappropriate
ways, like there's that one episode in season one, I think,
where they Glee Club gets to do the assembly and he has them do
this like, Forget the song but it's like this sexy
inappropriate dancing and he's in it with his underage teenage
kids. Was that the song?
The push it song? Yes.
It's the push it song. And it's like why are you adult
married man? Dancing with these miners in a
sexually suggestive and he doesn't more than once in the
show. Like it's just creepy and like
pedophile e and like a Zuri and it's just like and that's why I
love suit. Casue calls him out for being a
creepy weirdo and inappropriate with his students, which he
constantly is, and it's just great.
You know, what those things do happen in real life, which is
stupid because, and I'm aware of that.
But, like, the writers Centre him as the good guy in these
scenarios and it's like, no, he's being extremely
inappropriate with his students. And like, please portray it for
what it is, which is Is highly problematic instead of making
him the hero of the episode. That's the problem I have with
it. Not that they're showing these
things but they're elevating him to the good guy protagonist, and
they want you to root for him in this really inappropriate
situation. And it's like maybe that's why
it's on Fox Igor. See the Baptist Church if you
don't know what I'm talking about.
They're super node for this kind of crap.
I think it should. His storyline should have ended
with him being on trial and then everyone testifying against him,
and then he gets put behind bars.
Personally, I think his story line should have ended when the
original cast graduated high school and we get less of mr.
Shue person. Oh yeah, something.
Well, he came back for a reason. Yes, is not a know, we'll get
there when we get to the Why? I stopped watching Glee, but I
think there's a he just is constantly being centered as a
main character, and it's like why this show is not really
about you anymore, but he's hella problematic.
And like, he just, he basically just wants to be thin and he's
trying to like the she live. His high school Glory Days and
like, okay, the discovery. Can we go k the discovery of fin
as a singer again right off the bat shoe being stupidly creepy.
In is of the football but he's supposed to be the jerk who also
is an artist kind of deal and he gets discovered by accident
quote, on quote. I hope because shoe, just
wanders into the boys locker room, shoo, the Spanish teacher,
/ Glee, Club, founder, or whatever.
Just meanders into the miners locker room where the football
team is showering and like creeps on, Finn straight-up
naked. And showering and listens to him
saying and he like lingers there for like a hot man at while.
This minor is singing in the shower, I used to cry.
It's so creepy like it's like this is not as this isn't bad
because not I'm the okay let me get my thoughts out.
So I'm about to relate this to a scene, but the scene that I'm
relating it to isn't bad because it's not a teacher and a student
but it reminds me of that Pitch Perfect scene when Right.
Yeah, sneaks into the shower, I think she's like, what are you
doing? So that's just what writes me
of. Okay.
But they are both the same age less creepy than your no future.
Without your consent cream. Like Finn doesn't know he's in
there. Creeping on it.
Like it's just the creepiest, I go to be less creepy if like
Kurt was in there because he got out of gym and need to get
something from his locker and heard Finn.
Why was it mr. Shue creeping in the boys locker
room. Like what a?
And then again the writers are portrayed as like what a good
thing he found a star male singer know.
It's like you're an adult creeping on children.
Showering like that is so weird. I actually just chose not to
think about it too hard because the writers don't frame it that
way. They they don't they just they
luckily excuse every bad thing shoe does in the way they write
and frame his character and that's what drives me nuts about
him. He's not a good person like he's
just not. He's very inappropriate with his
minor students and it's never portrayed that way.
The only person who calls him how to sue you.
Well, actually, there is another person And we have one who calls
about the most consistently issue.
It's sushi beginning soon shoe. All right.
Anyway, I hate him. Do you have anything to say
about, you know, I choose not to because you just, you could see
the problematic stuff, I just ignored him because I just
didn't like him. So, I have no words.
A lot of this is just like I have no words for which does not
translate well for a podcast. He's just he's the worst you
just again, that's hims just centering himself.
He does it all the time. It's very annoying and like
again it goes Santa Ana for actually calling him out on his
bullshit because very few people doesn't he just constantly gets
away with it. It just, it's annoying.
He's very, he's very, very, very does anybody like him?
The Euro? I don't know if he likes shoe.
Why? Why he's not a good person.
There are better adults in this show.
See Kurt's dad probably the best adult in the show.
Yes we all need a Kurt's. Dad in our lives are better
adult. Now, I think you can come on.
Yes, he is. The best of all he is constantly
supporting Kurt. Always like he is the best adult
in the show. Yeah.
He's he's such a great, dad. He's the best stuff.
Tastes the best. I love him.
But all right, I think that's enough, mr.
Shue talk like that guy. Yes.
Yes, please. No more.
Mr. Shue, I'm so bored with him right now that I'm just like,
No, well everybody do do we want to talk about how it foreshadows
real life events or do you want to talk about what sounds like
in real life? Do the foreshadowing because
likely basically took on the role of The Simpsons, where the
Simpsons Simpsons ran for like decades.
And essentially got to the point where, like eight was predicting
crap that happened in the future, like a trump presidency
and things like that and Glee foreshadowed like its own
internal stuff, because there's a lot of fuckery that went on
with the cast, the creators of the show and it like predicted
its own Own bullshit which is wild.
Yeah, yeah. There's some horrible things
that happened with Glee that they predicted for their actors
and there is a lot of like sex candles and hooking up that
happen with cast members and there's the writers put their
lives on glasses. Really fucked up.
Yeah, they did that with Naya's boob job, yes.
Like you're taking something that she was proud of her, like,
like comfortable in her own skin and like making it a negative
thing. That's so wrong.
They were fucked up and what's also fucked up to in like the
casting of these characters, which always bothered me is like
Cory Monteith is like 30. and he was supposed to play like a
sixteen-year-old and it's like, You do that a lot?
Why I hate when they do that, especially cause like, not all
the actors were in their 30s. Like some of them were like,
young 20s, bordering teenagers, and it's like, this is really
weird that you're doing. Oh, well, speaking of you want
to talk. Everything sucks on Netflix.
That age Gap was ridiculous was weird because it was like 13 and
Luke 21, I think. Yeah.
And it looks it. So it does it.
Yeah, it does. It's really weird.
I don't know who approve that. Yeah, but that's another child.
That was a good show. But yeah, the bit, the age that
gap between the leads was fucking weird and there's no
need for that. Like if they had a younger, they
replaced the older ones. Younger one Gators.
Yeah, it would have been a lot better, but that shows weird.
Yep, it was a good show, but that was weird.
But this is weirder because it's like a lot of the characters are
like that. Anyways, we don't like, why'd
you high school? TV shows because it's like
always played by adults and that's like, which I get but it
has to be young adults. Yeah, like, get them in like, I
don't know why are there younger?
There's younger actors. So she has two younger people
like that are teenagers because of it's just dumb legal stuff,
but it's down to deal with parents don't, but then they
always make them do adult plotlines, and that's like
they're supposed to be 15 like, yeah, just dumb.
I like, who's the audience? Really?
The audience is really adults, not like the teenagers, I just,
I don't like it. I'm past, like watching high
school stuff. Personally if you're into it,
no. No shade.
I'm over it like because they always make them do stuff that
college kids do, I'm like, just put it in college.
Why are we doing high school? Then there, that's just me.
Gosh, there's, there are a lot of problematic stuff in Glee,
but it's just still makes me laugh.
And this part like with it being unrealistic, like I'm fine with
this part being like Hollywood eyes because it is a TV show.
And like, yeah, It's fine. Like, what them?
Embellishing sets and like, embellishing the music and the
singing, like, that's fine. That's supposed to happen.
That's supposed to have it. Suppose to be like fantasy, like
a fantasizes, the television show and makes it unreal, which
is okay with me. Like I'm okay with that part of
the story that they those choices that they make, because
like, it would be weird on TV to watch what you just played like
I want to watch that. Yeah, it's nice to have those
videos with the laughs that in the fruit, your free time, but
I, you definitely need the unrealistic of the music because
yeah, it is on the Dozer Dan. It's a big city theater eat
because they're like, you know, if we could do this is what we
would love to do as the theater apart department.
Like, I appreciate that and the fact that they call it out for
being unrealistic in the show like their self aware.
That like we understand this is unrealistic were doing for
entertainment because like Sue again we had the clip or soon as
I close this is how much money your set would have cost like
how silly can make fun of it. So it's I remember those jokes
are why I really love Glee because I love when characters
are self-aware of like the stupidity of the stuff they do.
And that's again, and that's Glee for what it is.
That's what it's supposed to be. It's a satire about itself like
yeah, this is what the Glee club with love to do and they're
showing you that, but then being like, yeah, this is unrealistic
like making fun of it. Elf.
That's at the core. What Glee really is.
So like yeah, those moments are really great and it also
showcased like all of the actors are very talented when it comes
to singing dancing and doing their choreography on itself.
So it is nice to see like what that height of that could be for
them through like these like crazy sets and stuff, like, it
gets crazier over time but like, it's okay.
Like for me, it's okay in the, in the genre of what they're
trying to do. I mean, we talked about a lot of
primary stuff. Obviously, there's more we can
get into everything. Well, you have to figure out how
do you have a favorite performance that they did?
Or like a favorite song or anything, the everything.
I'll let you know at the end because I need I need the video
that we're going to watch to help me.
Okay, so I have a bunch of favorites but I one of my
favorite song. Favorite adverbs episode song,
favorite songs. They did was, I think it's the
episode where Santana gets outed by Thin and it was at the time
rumor has it? Yes.
It was at the time where the treble tones were still a thing.
Which to me, I like them better than one direction.
I know. Other way better.
Because again we got to hear more than Rachel Berry and you
directions not One Direction as a new directions.
You said One Direction I meant news right.
Sorry? Yeah, your actions, it is
harder. So the trouble tones and it was
the trouble zones which consisted of like, Amber, Riley
is Mercedes. Nia as Britney or not.
Nia Heather. And I think some of the newer
girls I think. Yeah, I think.
Yeah. Sugar was.
And they were led by this one of the stupidest plotlines ever
Rachel's. Actual biological mom, who's
played by Indiana Menzel, who is like one of the greatest show
sound so much alike though. She was, she was the original
Elphaba in Wicked. She was like in rent, like she's
one of the biggest Broadway stars of all time.
Iconic, human being. She played Elsa and Frozen like
she's iconic. Yes, that's again.
That's how much pull this show had that it got Crazy big stars
because that wasn't the season one.
Yeah they got her in the be and Kristin Chenoweth was also in it
who played Glinda, the Good Witch in Wicked, she's another
like iconic brought. These are like legitimate start
thanking them and it still pisses me off that they never
put them together in a single. Same like I would love to see
them together sort of like they had, I think they were both in
an episode where the kids sing Defying Gravity.
Yeah man. And I was just like the saying
it rather than have them sing something together.
Just actually say hi to each other because it's just so weird
to have them. Both are in the same episode and
it just like not say anything. Okay?
But like, I have two favorite songs actually do.
I'm thinking about more Rumor, Has It was one of them because I
love the way they did. The Adele songs, all of the
Adele songs were really great. This one of your big like
Rolling in the Deep but that's probably because Like the
characters who are singing it. I like that song, too, but this
one I thought was better and I like the way they overlaid like
Nia with Amber singing together they're just they sound so
fucking good together, they needed more sexy.
And then my God, she was a tree graph.
The two of them are my two favorite singers, but the way
they choreographed it and they have like an aisle looking at
like, Heather during it. Like, it just that, love the way
that was done. The dancing, the singing, all
it. My second favorite, that will
always like, Always like bring a fond memories to me is when
Brittany and Santana. We're trying to figure out how
they felt about each other. Like, Brittany news and I was
still figuring it out. Lance life.
Yeah. So that Landslide and that was
an episode with quite as Paltrow I think what her character's
name was but she was like peace and love kind of like character
who is like facilitating them communicating and just it was
very emotional the way. It was like sung And it was just
so good. Episode should be Season 2
Episode. 16, I love that. Whole episode is one of my
favorite episodes Rumors by Fleetwood Mac.
That was one of that was one of their best episodes ever was the
Fleetwood Mac episode. I love that episode, I love it.
Okay, so I love When the tick tock.
Song and Brittany throwing up. I'm Leah.
That was and I love that. She got to film that on her
birthday. That was good.
I'll take um, Hold on. I'm trying to think of this.
What's not good. River Deep Mountain high.
Oh God, that song to again, but Nia the Nia a songs kill it.
Those two together are so iconic.
I love that song River Deep Mountain High.
I had I bought that song on iTunes and like, listen to it
all the time. There it is so good.
Oh my gosh, Jess. And like another.
I got most of my favorite episodes are like, I think
season to season one sees, do the Britney.
Britney episode was also fantastic.
Oh, yes, that's it. All, All the like the Brittany
focused episodes are my favorite.
Actually, I just remembered good.
You and I was gonna say what's I agree?
And what's amazing about that is that both Brittany and Santana.
We're just supposed to be characters with no lines.
They were just was be background characters, but because those
actresses, like acted their asses off, they got promoted to
like speaking roles and then we got these amazing episode.
They weren't supposed to exist, but those two like seriously
work their asses off. So like in a sense like some
She's got downgraded for absolutely no reason.
These two got elevated for a very good reason, like they work
their asses off and became speaking characters.
And then we got these, their episodes are some of the biggest
oncotic episodes. Just because like those
characters were so fun, especially for see.
Brady was hilarious. Well, okay, we'll get to hurt a
little bit. I can't wait to just figure out
because, but I've spawned one of my like, everything about her.
Sorry. We'll get this crew.
Don't worry. I have it.
It's all in all caps. Let the screaming convinced
we're gonna get there really soon.
One of my favorite songs is you have more friends than you know
and this is in season four. So I don't know if you know it
but it's Melissa Marley wrote the song and it's when mr.
Shue was being so rude to all of them and you know, what do you
want to hear it? No.
Okay, but you don't have to you'll hear some of it.
But it's just it's such a great song in unique is in it, and
Blaine and Sam, I believe so it's like It's just everybody
who like they were being really rude to at the time and it's
just a very sweet song about just you have more people around
you. There's people who love you even
when it doesn't seem like it and it's just it's just so very
sweet and I love it. Okay, so there's a good stuff
about Glee. I promise there is our artists,
it just got it, lost its mind and got problematic.
And just had problematic elements from beginning, like
soup or shoe. She was another, she she wasn't
surprised how to do, but Sue was funny.
She was not funny. He was just, I was reading Sue
and shoe. Right next to each other and it
was like, very confusing. I'm like, wait a minute.
Do you just feel shoe with suit with an H?
But no, there's a c in there, too.
I just their names are so close together.
Did they do that on purpose or something?
Maybe, Okay, so We've gone through.
Quite a bit of problematic things, but I also found a video
that's called important lgbtq+ moments in Glee, and this is by
Shannon, and there are some moments that I think are really
important. Now, I'm going to put a trigger
warning in front of this of stuff.
We might talk about and the stuff.
In this video, I might cry in it because there is some real
stuff. So, Everybody warned.
And just and like for contacts to we were talking off mic but
like I compared the lgbtq stuff that went on with Glee to like
the L word in the sense that it was novel at the time and a big
deal because a big network was was airing this at Prime Time
like prime time it got the prime time slot so like everybody was
watching it. So all the subjects and
characters they were showcasing. Like you rarely saw this kind of
character on a mainstream Network so it was a big deal
that it was a Even that even exists but in hindsight some
things did not age. Well, just like the L word so
just keep that context in mind for some of the stuff, you know,
what to say, my heart is so heavy right now with it.
It was that was the roller coaster, that just keep going
down and then a little up. And in the back down, I mean
they did a good job of encompassing again, a lot of
different again, it became too self-aware and it's Just trying
to tackle issues versus like using the characters, tell a
story. So like with Kurt there's a lot
more epic examples with Kurt and his journey like telling his dad
first boyfriend, first homophobic bullying.
That's a closet case other bullies that are maybe closet
cases. Maybe not just like weak men
looking to like use their fists Express themselves.
Kind of deal, there's a lot more examples of current because
that's what Glee started with. And, you know, you can see the
Ernie through Kurt versus like unique comes in later and
they're like, okay, let's use this episode to tell about like
unique real quick and then we'll look move on next episode.
So it's a much more disjointed and like it just it felt more
performative like as they went on not to say that the issues
and the character stories were not important is just the way
they chose to tell them is very disjointed and weird.
And there are more like, okay, you get this episode, This Is
The Traveler don't like, basically they would do stuff
like that. And it's like, it felt
disingenuous versus Having the character establish and like,
seeing more of the progression of their.
They also did that with Santana, like she got multiple episodes
to figure stuff. She was there from the beginning
and like the Brittany Santana thing was, it started with AN
offhanded line between Heather and Nia and that evolved into a.
Okay. Let's actually explore this kind
of thing. Wait, so did they come up with
that line? Like I can't remember if it was
scripted or not, but it was like, it was like a supposed to
be a joke where I feel What was going on going to see it.
Don't worry, we have it anyway but yeah, it started with that
line and season 1 and like, then the writers are like, huh, let's
see. Let's let's explore as they were
because again, they were just mostly background characters
when that line was delivered and they're like, okay, maybe let's
actually give them more screen time in like let that play out
and it turned out to be very interesting cause you got to see
it Santana. Pre-post like you got to see her
Evolution. Same thing with Brittany who
like again was more of a open book but still like had a
journey that Progress versus like plopping in almost like
Tolkien characters and trying to tell a story, very disjointed,
lie to just like again, mostly centered around this
performance. That's going to happen versus
like a natural story where you it became less character Focus.
That's really why I couldn't keep going with the shows.
Like, what are we doing? So, why did you stop like was
there? One reason, there's many reasons
the biggest was, so, I Was very into the show.
Like I was big team Britannia like I was I was very invested
in this show because it was novel at the time to like see
queer people on prime-time television, like portraying
stories like that I could really do like you know it wasn't the L
word, which have you seen the L word?
It's The awards, not realistic. Like it's just that you don't
just like, go up to people randomly, they're just happy to
be gay and you like to fuck them in a car like that was basically
that weren't everybody's clear and just like ready to go at
anyone. It was like the weirdest show
ever. It was nice because you got
representation, but it was like unrealistic representation in
verses like this was more relatable because you had
characters who were like, you know, in the small town,
America, quote, unquote, trying to, like, navigate that with
their families, with their friends.
And, and They were trying to figure out the next steps of
their lives. Like I found a community here in
glee club but like what happens after and so for me I was very I
was like where they lost me was when I got the season for
because it season 3 that was when like they were the main
cast was mostly getting ready to graduate.
This is probably high school shows and this is where a lot of
shows fail is when you go from high school to Beyond and I also
did not start them in freshman year, we do, they start usually,
usually you start talking. More year.
That's how high all his Shooters do this, you start sophomore
year. So sorry, sophomore year, but
that he was some characters who didn't graduate.
Like, Brittany didn't graduate Blaine was like a junior.
So like not everybody was graduating but like the, the
cast we started with which was Kurt Mercedes.
Rachel Santana thin Puck. I guess Polk was weird because
he kept like failing and kind of not graduating also but like
that And Quinn that was like the main cast we started with so
they were all graduating. And again the beginning of Glee
was mostly a satire that focused around these characters and you
saw them grow and develop and then they're graduating.
So for me, I was like this would I thought they were going to do
what normal television shows do which is you follow those
characters when they graduate in their next phase of life and
it's like how did the Glee Club? Prepare them for what they're
doing? Like, Rachel Kurt and Santana
are all going to New York together.
I'm A great follow them and see what their life is like, but no,
they spent way too much time in high school and it's like the
show never moved on and I was like, what are we doing?
And then they brought in all these new characters like Marley
and Jacob was a the love interest which basically Jacob
was a combination of Finn and Puck and then Marley was like
Quinn and Rachel. So it's like they just recycled
characters, gave them new faces new like identities.
There was another character for Quinn.
Marley wasn't could, but I meant like, more just saying, people
looser than Rachel. I'm just saying they recycled.
Plotlines, put new faces and new like subcategory like again,
they became token characters like Jacob was like black and
Jewish. So now we had like black and
Jewish plot lines, we could explore through this character
versus Marley who had she was like, Rachel and a Quinn hybrid
but with her own sub-genre of stuff.
So they re like again, becoming to issue focused with the show
and trying to like have You can get in my mind token characters
to tell token Stories versus playing out the ones you already
established. And again, I don't know if that
was so that they could be issue Focus or so or so they can keep
shoe relevant because once they graduate, who cares about him
anymore? Like we just faced they were
stuck way to in high school for me and the go.
Sorry she wasn't supposed to thing.
Huh? Shoo?
Yeah shoe that's Finn stepped in and was the teacher.
And she was going away for a job that's why I loved Finn as the
teacher. Like he was like such a good
Mentor to Marley. I just like their scenes
together and then when Corey unfortunately died, the guy who
played shoe agreed to come back and Morrison.
Yeah, so that's why we have him again.
But it's like, we wouldn't need any of that food and spend so
much freaking time at the Glee Club in high school and the
episode that really pissed me off the most was in one episode
in season four. So, in season 3, they spent all
this time, establishing all the couples.
So all the couples finally got together.
You had Quinn and a coin, Finn and Rachel.
You had Blaine and Kurt and Brittany and Santana, they all
get together and then graduation happens.
Then in one episode, in the beginning of season 4, they
break all of them up in one episode and I was What is the
point of this? This was so stupid.
And like, they kept having episodes where, like, they kept
coming back to high school. I'm like these people live.
Thousands of miles away, why? Like she's like super point that
she's like, do you guys to teleporters?
Like why do you keep coming back here?
Like it just the way they started telling stories was
absolutely stupid. And I was like, I cannot keep
watching this because there's no substance to this anymore.
It's just we're trying to tell token stories and it's it was
just terrible. I could it.
That was at the point where they were trying to maximize like
iTunes. Oh yeah, I got some way through
season 4 and then I just couldn't anymore because I was
like this is not the show that I liked it just destroyed
everything I like about the show and I just got in anymore.
The Marc Jacobs stuff. All seems so forced and just, it
was just like we're repeating the Quinn.
Rachel Finn Puck triangle, just with two people and like they
brought in there some other white dude there too.
So they created a love. Try turning Marley.
Sure, we don't talk about him. We do not touch asleep.
What was the point of this? It was just dumb.
I just cut. It was Dumb.
And then like didn't they make Emma more of a character?
And like she got more crazy and that there was a her trying to
marry will it's just like it was a do get married.
Yeah but like that she had like cold feet at one point like it
was a bit back and forth. He kind of like mmm plot line
for a while. Was my point?
It was just tear it just got me. Yeah.
Okay. And again, I started in for so
I'm sorry again and I watch for Melissa.
So as long as she was in it I was fine.
I get it care about any of the couples when they broke up.
I didn't know who they were. You already invested in them.
Yeah. So and now like you have the
same opinion as a lot of people. So I always feel wrong for
liking the show because I don't have the same experience, and
that's but I loved it because I love Melissa.
But again, we'll get to that later.
Um, I, Was once I started watching the show again, when
Heather left at the end of four, I got really sad and then I was
like, okay, but Melissa stolen it and so is Nia.
So halfway through five, they just get rid of them which will
talk about again later as so, Melissa's gone.
I'm like, all right, we got st. At it.
That's it. That's all of watching for
Santana, leaves. At the end of five, there's
literally no reason for me to watch six and they Dover with
brand new characters except they bringing Kitty as well.
Back in and I think unique comes back as well but so it's just
like too many changes and they done the changes three times
because halfway through five, they go fully to New York I
believe and then six they're back in the high school and this
is where I'll try to tell you what happens in six.
So they go back to the high school.
They run the Glee Club but they're going.
Oh, they as in the the group, like, Wasn't good.
Rachel Quinn. Who's left Rachel Quinn?
But no, I think it was just Rachel and Kurt Kurt, Kurt Kurt
probably. Curtis.
It sounds like they were the protagonist at that point, just
those two. Yeah.
And then I think watches Sue starts at glee club or
something. I don't, I don't remember.
Sue has been to start trying to start League clubs since the
beginning, that's funny. Yeah.
And then Santana comes back and so does Britney.
I'm getting I'm trying so hard to not flip between the real
people's names and that's hard. Oh my gosh.
They get engaged and they get married to try.
It is obsessed with clean and gets them back together by
locking them in an elevator. And then they have a double
wedding and Besa storylines in season 5 so I don't know what
happens in season six. There's new kids.
They do some storylines and then I don't know what happened and
then at the end, they bring everybody back except Melissa.
At the for the final scene. Fantastic cheers, too.
Busy flying. She's too busy, being Supergirl
actually having a gonna show you she went on from that show.
She's like yeah I'm just gonna be better then with this is
right now. Yeah, it was terrible.
So yeah I is a season six. I was like there's no reason I
just can't I it took me everything in me not to just
skip to the Britannica episodes and Sears stronger than me.
I only watch that nurses. To YouTube look I mean I was
like I'm way too invested in this now and you had more years.
So I was just like Benji I did other things while watching it
so I was like play a game on my phone or something.
So it's not like I was just doing that.
I don't think I could do it. No.
But to your point that of them just trying to sell music.
I think you can tell in for they were doing a lot of like popular
songs. Yeah I know they were going
through what was top 10 hits at that time on the radio versus
Beginning when you go, it's more show, tunes because theater and
then it became how do I sell Rebrand, what's already popular
right now? Make money.
Hence, like, literally watch that song with like I forget who
it was Rachel and whoever in the bathroom singing, the only
reason they were singing that song is because that was a top
10 hit at the time that aired and they were trying to resell
it as a Glee cover. And I want Susan to actually or
season oh that was like three four.
It's definitely not floor because Has.
She is in high school. Oh yeah, I think three maybe
maybe to, I don't know. But like again that's where it
started. They were they slowly got away
from show tunes into what is popular on the radio right now.
And how do we make money off of it?
And again, they were just centering storylines around
these songs that don't make any sense in the show is just to
make money and like that Glee got to fold itself for numb, for
that reason, and then trying to solve the world problems with
each episode. And it really light lost itself.
It's To be a satire and it just bought it took itself too.
Seriously and it just loss itself and the right is
definitely different shows with in that show.
And it all depends on when you come in, you know most people
start with season 1, maybe I wonder what my views would have
been like if I started with season one.
I don't like nine just like the show so and know and that's
that's totally fine. Like again it's a completely by
the time you get to season 4 it is a completely different show.
It's not what Glee supposed to be anymore.
It's something it's more like a just a regular drama at that
point that has singing in it. Yes, that it did because there's
like this whole episode with a school shooting and that that
episode got to me. Me just okay, because Melissa
was crying, you know, like I don't want her.
If she don't want her to be hurt, that's basically what it
was. But yeah.
But I will say, one of the in speaking of that episode, one of
the things that I did like later and throughout the show was was,
like, you mentioned earlier, Sue's relationship with Becky
and Becky's storyline in general.
I really liked and hers kept evolving a past, like the, you
know, the Inception of the show. And I really did enjoy that
character and her Dynamic with Sue.
A humanized sue but also like it.
She was an important character that kept growing over time that
I really really liked and they didn't put her in a box.
No, they didn't. They let her be a full-fledged
fucking person at any time. Somebody tried to put her in a
box, Sue would call them out. On it.
They're like, why are you giving her special treatment?
Like she's a person like everybody else like I like and
yeah, I like the actress who played Becky was amazing.
Like I really enjoyed Becky, I thought she was really great.
I thought the handle the writers for once handle, a sensitive
topic. Ah, potentially two people.
Very, very well and they just let her be.
They just let her be in. Yeah.
Teenager like, it was great. I really enjoyed that character.
I absolutely hated was Jacob, the fucking reporter because he
got very pervy and sexual assault e stalkery overtime in
the in the name of the news and just he became just like this
outrageous character versus like a person over time as they wrote
him and he so far I don't typically like the characters
that he plays he also went on to be and Wizards of Waverly Place.
Lace. And I don't like his character
in that either, he just the characters he's given is just
not great. I feel bad for him and a shade
to the actor, I don't like the way he and the beginning was
much better. They just they made him more of
a caricature that a person as time went on and he just got
really annoying and stalkery and stuff.
Anyway, we got away with everything as a character, leave
the writers. Just listen.
I mean, the writers picked and choose their battles and some
stuff they just wrote off as whatever when it was hella
problematic and they should have focused on it and just you know
yeah he's one of them we're getting as a characters now
which I think is a good place to stop this part.
All right? We can pick up actually
screaming about the things that we love in the next part.
So we'll see you next time. Yeah.
And We talked about what we love next time on gleep.
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