Hello and welcome to Big Gay Energy.
I'm Bree. I'm Theora.
And I'm Caitlin. Come along with us while we dive
into the fun and nuances of queer media.
Representation matters, and we're here to talk about it.
Cheers, queers on today's Big Gay Agenda.
We are talking with Sophia. Holtquist from the talented
Drummond Lace. Sophia is a music composer in
the film industry and has worked on many projects including the
new Red, White and Royal Blue movie.
Welcome to the podcast. Sophia of.
Course, thanks for having me. This is very exciting to get to
talk to both of you. We are so excited to talk to you
too, by the way. The soundtrack for red, white
and royal blue is like the most beautiful looking thing I've
ever. Seen it's so pretty.
You mean the vinyl or? Like yes.
Yeah, yeah. The vinyl is gonna be really
good. And there might be another
surprise. I don't know if I you know what?
I'm gonna say it because I think the fans deserve to know so.
But yeah, the vinyl is beautiful, and a lot of people
have been asking it is the Union Jack on the other side because
the photo only shows the American flag on one side, but
obviously the other side has the Union Jack.
It's so amazing. I love it, Yeah.
Yeah, they did a good job. I just approved things.
I wish I could take the credit for that.
Yeah, but it's mostly nice to have like the tangible like.
You know, I actually, I haven't seen it in person yet.
I'm hoping to get it before the general public, but I have a
feeling that I'll just be receiving it when everyone else
does, which I think is in December.
At least that's what it says on Amazon when you order it.
So not not too much longer. Hopefully fans will still be
excited for it. I think so.
I'm sure they will perfect. Holiday present.
Yes. Oh, what?
If that's why they did it, that is perfect.
Yeah. And I couldn't believe the other
day I saw there's like a full Amazon store.
And I was like, I can't believe they haven't said, yeah, there's
like socks and tshirts. And I was like, well, I first of
all, I was like, wow. Second of all, I was like, why
haven't they send me any of it? I'm like, kind of.
Offended. Why?
Where are my Red Wings and real blue socks?
Ford's sweat and tears into this mood.
No, I really didn't. Well, I did, but not it.
It wasn't. It wasn't a struggle.
It was a wonderful experience. But yeah, I was like, I want my
socks. Where are my socks?
Yeah, I mean anything that comes out, you have a right to right.
I mean, that's what you just think.
All right. But before we jump too much into
because we obviously want to talk to you about that specific
project for listeners at home that may not be familiar with
your specific profession, what is a music composer and how?
How did you get started in the entertainment industry?
So. What I do is essentially I write
music for film, television, all sorts of media, you know,
anything that's sort of music to picture.
And I really fell into it while going to music college.
So I got into College in Boston and I'm originally Italian.
I don't sound like it, but so, you know, I went all the way
from Italy to Boston to Berkeley College of Music, and originally
I wanted to be a performer. And I think it was one of those
syndromes of like, I was like the big fish in my small kind of
city, and I got to Berkeley. And of course there were like, I
mean, people that were just so talented, like such talented
singers, such talented. And I just kind of realized that
I just didn't have what it took to like, do it professionally.
So I was looking around at the majors and I was like, well, I
love film and I'd never. And it was one of those clear,
like I'd never thought about that as a career because it
wasn't as like commonplace. And also it's like, you know, so
many career choices you only decide to do when you have a
role model. And they're just like, really
weren't, wasn't anyone, but like white men scoring movies.
So I was like, well, I never even thought about this.
So I kind of started doing that and then all of a sudden I had a
degree in film scoring and it took a while.
I did a bit of a detour away from it because I didn't at the
time want to move to LA and. Was completely kind of like
against all of that, but I'd say maybe in like 2016.
So it's like 8 years ago kind of like went back into it and
started scoring documentaries and now you know it feels like a
kind of overnight thing. But it really it's taken years
and years and and I love what I do.
You know I get to work in a lot of great TV shows and movies
also write my own music. So it's.
It's a really it's it's a really great form of art that I'm very
glad to have fallen into that to say.
That's a really cool. Yeah, this is your.
Process for composing for film and TV.
It's it's always a little bit different.
So there's been times when I've been brought on when they
haven't shot the film yet or the TV show and it's just that a
script phase. And at that point I'm meeting
with the director or the showrunner and.
Sort of like writing music based on like a feeling and based on
our conversations and then adapting those themes that we
kind of wrote beforehand. Once there's picture, that's one
way that it's been done. Another time.
It's like I get brought in when they start to edit once they
shot the movie and then, you know in the case of red, white
and royal blue too, they already had like a first cut.
So when I got hired. They'd already put together the
first assembly cuts, which I think notoriously is the one
that Matthews been mentioning on, you know, online that was
like 3 hours long, you know, the first assembly cut or whatever.
And and to be honest, and I don't know if this is public
knowledge, I don't think it's like a bad thing.
But I was actually replacing a composer.
So the previous composer had been let go.
So they were already kind of deep in the process and I got
brought on in December. But as everyone who's been
following the movie, they shot last summer, so, you know, like
I was kind of like came in towards the end of the process.
But yeah, so usually like once I'm brought on, I'm either sent
a script or the movie. And then, you know, the hardest
part is the getting started because you just kind of sit at
your computer with like a blank session in, you know, the music
software that I use. And there's a couple that people
use and you just kind of start writing and you just hope for
the best. And every time that you get
started, it's like, you're like, can I, can I do this?
You know, every time you have to, like, cite your, you'd be
like, come on. Because it's like learning to
ride a bike all over again every time.
But then the moment that you get on, you're like, oh, I know what
I'm doing. But at the beginning you're
like, it's terrifying. And there's nothing better than,
like once you turn that corner and you're like, the director
likes it and everyone's kind of on board.
And that's like the best feeling when you kind of like at the
beginning of like being in it. And yeah, and then you just keep
writing and then record and you know, it's it's it's for me,
it's like very like seamless. And it's like, you know, but I'm
sure people that don't do this profession probably have 1000
questions about it. Yeah.
Just feel like it's. I couldn't imagine just like
sitting there be like, OK, well. I don't even know.
What one note to put. To put in there.
Yeah, I mean with red wine and royal blue specifically, it was,
I felt it was extra challenging because.
People already loved these characters so much that it was
like, how do you do justice by these characters?
And like people already love them so much?
And then they they both come with such like a strong
background. You know, whether it's like like
family backgrounds, like diverse backgrounds and it's like how do
you combine it so that their themes can work together.
And that's something that Matthew and I talked to at the
very beginning about how. They have to have sort of like
separate themes but then they have a haptop theme together.
And I think like the what I sold him on was like you know it
would be cool if then their two themes can actually play at the
same time and work together which ultimately happens and for
example like the last cue of the movie called We won like at the
very end and other bits. So it's like their their themes
are made, are written. To be essentially played by two
people in the pan at the same time, just so so that it could
represent them like separately and then coming together.
So these are like, you know, those really big considerations
which like when you sit down at the beginning and you're like,
all right, let's write themes for these like highly beloved
characters. But the feedback from everyone
has been extraordinary and I I see how much people are
listening to the soundtrack on Spotify so.
I think it worked out. Oh, it definitely did, yeah.
I have a question though, since you brought up that the piano
scores in like the source material since like this is a
project that came with like a book and then got a film attic.
Just a bunch of source material like music is is a big part in
the book. That's particularly with Henry
who likes to play the piano was. What did that factor in at all
with like your instrument choice when scoring this?
1000%, yeah. I mean, that's why Henry's
instrument really is pianos. And there's actually, I feel
like maybe I know and it might not be like super obvious, but
there's actually a couple different types of pianos being
used in the Henry themes. And then the Henry cues, like,
for example, when he's with Alex and you know, he says or else
I'll vanish right before they go to Paris.
That's actually like a couple two different pianos playing and
different octaves. And ultimately, like, I don't
know how it ended up happening, but Alex's instrument is
essentially the guitar. And I think it was like a way to
pay heritage to, you know, like to pay heritage, but also
because he's more like contemporary.
And I feel like it was an instrument that worked well with
more of like a plucky sound. But yeah, music is so huge.
I mean, the music supervisors did such a good job.
And I know that people are disappointed because, you know,
London Boy isn't in it and Elton John isn't in it, but like.
Trust me, the amount of work that they did for like even just
the New Year's scene was so many songs that like, I I feel like
you guys should have a music supervisor on because their job
is crazy having to like deal with artists and negotiating.
I mean it's it's wild so, but it was it was hard because the
score had to work with the songs, right?
So it it had to be like, kind of classically inclined enough to
like, feel like a big romantic score, but also contemporary
enough to stand up to all the amazing songs that are in it.
But but yeah, music's really, I've come to learn even more so
important seeing Casey's playlists as well that they've
shared since the movie's been out.
That's awesome. Thank you for the recommendation
for music supervisor. We're always looking for new
people and jobs to interview. So.
Yeah, we can like showcase people working on these films,
but also let the audience know how much work goes into these
movies. Because it's.
I mean, you can literally. Literally talk to Maggie and
Kristen, who music supervises red, white and royal blue.
I'm sure they'd be thrilled to chat about it.
And Maggie specifically does so many movies.
Maggie Phillips So oh. Caitlyn left us.
She went to go get Maggie. Yeah, yeah, she she's writing
things down. She's getting it done.
Oh, that's interesting that it would have just cut off.
Can you imagine if she can still hear us and?
They're like hello. She might be able to, actually.
Oh. Could you hear us, Caitlyn?
Oh, you actually got kicked out? I kicked myself out.
You get Maggie. You write down Maggie.
And who? Maggie and Kristen if you I can
I can follow up with their names, but if you go in IMDb and
you look up, you should find their contacts.
And everything too. Yeah, that's an excellent do you
And so I assume like cuz like I in my brain like composing and
and the music supervising are obviously different roles.
Do you guys collaborate at all? With them, I guess the pieces of
music you're working on for a project, or is it more?
It's it's pretty, it's pretty separate in that the only time
that there's like an intersection is if, for example,
I'm working, if they're working on it with an artist on an
original song, for example, like, oh, this didn't happen in
red, white and row blue. But like, if I'd have to, you
know, if they wanted some parts of the score to be part of, like
what Vagabond was doing, then that's where the music
supervisor would have brought us in together.
I mean, it's more just having like somebody in your corner.
And the two of them, you know, they, they're the ones who
brought me out to this project because I worked with Maggie.
I think I worked with both of them.
Or maybe it was just Maggie on a movie called Roslyn.
Oh yeah. That was up on Hulu, but then
was part of the bunch of movies that Disney took down.
For. Tax reasons or whatever, Yeah,
let's let's just not even go there, but.
Yeah, the music supervisors just have this like really big power,
just because they can kind of talk to the producers and
directors and just kind of recommend people that they've
worked with that they know will work, that will do a good job.
So, but yeah, there's not too much intersection.
I've never worked on a project where the music supervisor has,
like, necessarily given notes unless the director feels so
inexperienced where they need help.
On Dickinson, we did work. With the music supervisor more
often, just because I don't know if you guys ever watched that
show. Could be.
Sure. Oh, we have.
Questions about it we do, Yeah. I mean, I.
Had it, yeah, given the yes, actually.
Stupid question for me to ask but no on that.
You know there's like in season three there's a sing along and
there's just like so that. And then I think it's also in
season three, the Billy Eichner jazz thing.
So there there was a lot more. There's a lot more kind of
communication with Devo Yates, who's the music supervisor on
that. But yeah, but music supervisors
generally just awesome people. You have composed.
So many amazing things, and there's a lot of instruments.
In it? How many?
Instruments do you play and which is your favorite?
So first and foremost, I'm a vocalist.
So I use a lot of vocals and most of the scores that I do,
and even in scores where you don't hear me like singing, you
know, laws and oohs and whatever, there's still sort of
like vocals uses pads. And this is the case in red,
white and royal Blues, where you'd never really hear vocals
and like the way that you hear in Dickinson, for example.
But it's still there. And I think we are so like
attuned to the human voice, since it's our mode of
communication that I think. Adding layers of vocals just
innately like adds kind of like a organic and like a connection
to listeners. At least that's my theory.
But I do that. And then, you know, a lot of the
work that as composers that we do kind of like originates on a
keyboard, just because a lot of the instruments that we're
playing are like virtual instruments.
So they're, you know, they're in the computer.
So I'm an OK piano player. I'd say I can like hold my own,
but I'm definitely not. Like if you put like a Mozart
piece in front of me, it's not like I can sight read it.
But I do enough to do this. I'm an awful guitar player, I
will say that. And I am married to the guitar
player. So kind of, like stopped caring
about that altogether. And honestly, the other thing
that I guess I'm like, decent at is just percussion, percussive
stuff. I mean with the name like
Drummond Lace I kind of have to be right.
So the percussion and just. I guess it's an instrument.
But I'm. Pretty good at like synthesis
and like synthesizers and anything that's kind of like
electronic based. But I wish I played more like I
wish I'd played like the saxophone or the trump, you know
like something a little bit more like that.
And I definitely don't play any strings, which is something that
I think I'm going to push on my daughter so that then she can
help. But we'll see.
I mean, I think with what I play, it's enough to.
Then be able to hire friends and other musicians and then play
those instruments that I can't. And as much as it would be great
to be like a multi, you know, somebody that can play all
instruments, it does actually foster more collaboration to
bring in other people. And I think as artists are so
precious about doing everything themselves.
But there really is something in like building a community of
people that can up because then it's just more people to uplift
a project, right. So for example in this.
Latest movie with red, Red and World Blue.
I worked with the London Contemporary Orchestra who I'd
worked with on a bunch of stuff in the past, and they're just
this incredible ensemble that has played anything from like
Phantom Thread to, you know, things for Curtis or Hilder.
Steph goes in a dot tier. I can never say the name, but
she she's like one of the only women I've ever won an Oscar
and. I don't know.
They just do a lot of really cool stuff.
But yeah, so I think is the fact that I can't play as many as I
wish actually is a good thing in the long run now that it now
that I can afford to pay people to do so, I guess.
That's true. Then you get different artists,
kind of like collaborating, like you said.
Does that lead to any kind of like workshopping when you're
trying to like put the piece together or do you come with
like the final piece? To the collaborators.
Yeah, that's a great question. It's a little bit of both.
I think that for a lot of things, for other movies, like a
horror movie. I have a horror movie that came
out in July called Cobweb, and for that one I had my friend
Rowe. They're an incredible cello
player. I had them do a session
beforehand where we recorded like some string effects and
just kind of things in different keys.
And then from there I was able to take what we recorded and
sampled it throughout the score. And then at the very end once
the score was approved, I did a remote recording in Macedonia
with like a 40 piece ensemble. But like by then everything was
like approved and done because it's just you know if you're a
huge composer then you can afford to just do these inter
interim sort of like string sessions and then change things.
But like at the level that I'm at, it's like you want to be
sure that everything is just like done but.
I do. I love bringing people into the
process early because at least it's like it helps establish
kind of like the sound of the film in a way.
And and so I've done that a lot. I feel like red white and red
blue. I didn't really have much time
to just kind of like experiment. It was kind of like a let's go
thing. Which is why also like the piano
was a great thing that I could definitely do myself.
And then any guitar that was too complicated for me to play, then
I. Actually had my husband, who's a
guitar player, play those parts, so I was able to keep it kind of
like in the household, which is. Kind of nice.
So how? Does music impact a scene?
Oh my goodness. I think in the career that I do,
I the what? The way I tend to think about it
is that if you're watching a movie or are you watching
something and the music sticks out, then it's not working.
It has like, whereas if you watch a scene and you're like,
oh, that was so beautiful, then like all to get all the elements
come together, then it's doing the right thing.
I think that a lot of the biggest that the, the biggest
thing that Hollywood doesn't do is that I think sometimes there
needs to be more silence. I do think that there's like an
overuse of music and I think sometimes it's actually to to
the detriment of what you're watching and it's something I'm
very conscious of. But then it's a really hard
thing to bring up because somebody who writes music as a
job, you saying, I think this doesn't need music comes off as
like you trying to get out out of like writing stuff.
And it's like it's never that. It's just like sometimes the
scene just doesn't need music. But I think I think it just, it
depends. I mean I think it can just kind
of like elevate a scene so much and I think that that's sort of
like what being a film composer entails.
You know, you're like trying to essentially amplify and reflect
the vision of the director or showrunner and you're trying to
do it in a way that feels true to them, true to kind of like
everything. And oftentimes, and I think This
is why, like a lot of times, you know, people, artists get hired
to score, but then it's like it doesn't work out.
And I think it's because artists, people that are just
artists, are so used to be able to be like, this is my thing.
I'm going to do what works for me.
Whereas like with film composing, composing, it's very,
it's a very humbling experience. It's like, you know, you can, I
can write the thing something that I think is like the best
thing in the world, but if it's not serving picture, then it's
useless. You know, if the showrunner
director who have been living in this script and in this world
don't like it, then like I need to just check my ego and do
something that works for the picture, even if it's not like
my favorite piece of music. So I think that that's sort of
also shows how important music is, where it's like it can
really, if it's the wrong music, it can kind of just like ruin a
really important moment I think. Yeah, I definitely.
I agree with what you're saying about the overuse of music.
Like sometimes I almost feel like less is more in order to
really get that impact that like as the audience member, like
sweeps you into the scene. Because music, when it's done
correctly, can really just like transport you into that moment
with those characters. And it's there's nothing like it
when that like clicks correctly. Yeah, I agree.
Yeah, and red, white and royal blue really did that, especially
like, I feel like the, the romantic element of it, like the
music really helps like elevate and enhance that.
Like as a watcher. And it's, yeah, you forget
you're watching a movie sometimes.
It's so well done. There's there's a lot of parts
in red, red and whirl blue or is really hard to especially like
sneak music in slowly like without giving anything away.
And I mean, I'm assuming anyone who's watching this has
hopefully seen the movie and this isn't like a crazy spoiler,
but like the Q first kiss, like the way it comes in is like so,
so quiet. And I think actually in the
final mix they might have taken away because there used to be
like these pads that kind of lit into it.
And I think they might have like either muted them or made them
so quiet. So like you kind of just hear
piano notes come in and but it's like something like that.
It's it's so delicate and you have to be so careful because
it's like if you come in too strong, then like you're
misleading or I don't know. So it's it's a very delicate
balance with stuff. But you know that I'm trying to
think if there's any other, I mean in good hands, you know
like the first time they Make Love, like have sex with love,
that one was also that's definitely the cue, the music
that went through the most revisions.
And I think it's probably the scene that went through the most
revisions because I think it was very important to Matthew,
obviously to portray that in a way that felt authentic and not
sensationalist and actually felt like, I mean, I think it ended
up more tasteful than heterosex that you see on screen.
I think it's so passionate and beautiful and tastefully done.
And the music had to be the same.
So I think and every time the cut changed, the music had to
change. But I think we might have gone
to version like 7 of that cue by the time we recorded it, which
you know, for big superhero movies they get to versions like
20, whatever. But for the work that I did with
this, I think we usually got to like versions 3 or 4 on things.
But this one definitely was the most.
But you know the bad music there would have ruined it, right?
Yeah, yeah, an electric guitar comes in.
No. Yeah.
I understand the guitar is very Alex, but like at that moment,
yeah, not not really. And it's funny in in that
particular scene we often not really for piano.
At one point there's a harp and it was actually Matthew's idea
because he was like, you know it's it's an in between of like
a piano and a guitar where it's like a plucked instrument but
it's still considered like a keys.
So it was kind of like, and that was like Matthew had a lot of
these like little things where like once in a while I'd turn
around and be like, huh, like that's a really.
And I think he's really music, a tune.
But then he kept acting like he wasn't.
But then he'd call me out on things that I was like, you
clearly know music more than you're letting on.
And I still wonder if it's a test.
I don't know. It's massive.
It might be, but but yeah. Definitely pass the tense.
Yes, you you pass the. Flying colors, yeah.
With rainbow colors, yes. You keep talking about pads.
And music. And I just wanted to ask.
What you mean by that? Yes, actually, I can see how
that would not be an easy thing. So pads are essentially in music
are anything that has like sustained chords or anything
that kind of sounds like. It's just kind of like a
sustaining kind of like pillow to everything.
So a lot of the times what you play on a synth, if you're
holding down notes and it's just kind of like playing something
but it literally it's it's literally like a pillow to
music. I feel like I'm trying to think
of of a place where it's like very obvious maybe in the in the
movie that there's. But yeah it's it's essentially
just like held notes that have like a longer resonance than
like a piano. You know because like a piano
that the sound dies out quickly, whereas with the pad it's like
usually held out and it's used a lot.
You know, it's it's a synthesizer type kind of sound
and you can achieve it with other instruments, but it's
usually like more of like a digital instrument term, yeah.
That makes sense. OK, so we we kind of mentioned
this a little bit and you brought it up to that you you
have worked on Dickinson also, which was one of our favorite
shows. I'm glad you brought it up
organically. We wanted to know what was your
experience like working on that show?
Oh my God, I wish Dickinson could go on forever.
It was just. So do we.
Honest, I mean, I I really respect Elena for like the even
from when we got hired, it was always gonna be three seasons.
It was always gonna be, you know, like the introduction.
And then essentially like the Sioux, the Sioux season and then
the Civil War season. It was always gonna be that.
And it's like when you're starting on and you're like, oh,
we have two more seasons, like, whatever, it's fine.
But then by the last one, I swear I cannot watch the last
episode. I cannot hear the last cue, the
last two cues of the third episode, without crying.
Like thinking about it makes me cry like it was just it was such
a beautiful experience and I feel like it's such an
underrated show. And I think Apple did a it's
incredible that they did that, they made it.
But at the same time I think they weren't expecting it to be
as big of a hit maybe Or. And I think when people see it
in the way was marketed, was marketed just like as a comedy,
just because they're, you know, especially season one has like a
lot of slapsticky comedy. Because I think the film makers
and even musically, I think everyone was trying to find
their footing, which you know, I think in season two really
works. And then season three, I think
it's just like everything just clicks together.
But I think it was just kind of marketed as like something for
teenagers to like 20 year olds. But instead it's like I think
it's just a show for everyone and it's just so beautiful.
Anytime that we saw an episode, it was just like the costuming,
the the scenery, the acting. I mean, I don't know.
And it was just the most wonderful experience and I wish
that I every project was a Dickinson and I wish that every
fan base was a Dickinson fan base.
And I just love the fact that Dickinson fans like the show.
Dickinson fans like made Emily Dickinson's like poems end up in
like the New York Times bestseller because like with
red, white and royal blue it's like it was already kind of in
there before Dickinson Emily Dickinson poems to be back and
like people are like, but you know it was just and I mean
Elena's brilliant. I just we're both our birthdays
are one day apart. So we're both like super
aquariuses. And I feel like the first time
we met we both like looked at each other and I was like when's
your birthday? And we like totally guessed it.
So we're Aquarius sisters and I don't I don't know.
I I mean, I could just keep going about all the things I
love about it. And musically, I think with my
husband Ian, we were just able to, like, really create the
sound that wouldn't have been possible without the visual and
the the idea of doing music that was contemporary for them.
And I think the reason why it works so well, it's just like
Emily's way of thinking was so, you know, so ahead of her time.
And I still feel like the kind of openness and the kind of like
open mind that her character and like Emily Dickinson must have
had is just like just so be ageless and timeless and beyond
anything. So I love that we were able to
bring a bit bit of like a punk influence into her because
essentially punk is all about you know transgression and and
that's I mean more than anything it's like with the the type with
a theme the main theme that that's I think we're personifies
it's the most Emily thing I think is the main titles of
Dickinson like to. Think I feel like music was.
Even more important in that show like it was more prevalent, you
noticed it more but like it made it even better.
So and that one was super thematic.
I mean the the, you know, the Meet Me and the orchard like Arp
Arpeggiated thing that like, I feel like anytime people heard
it, all of a sudden it was like, you know, this was like a Sue
and Emily moment or there's this one cue that we views in every
season. But I think it was only on the
first season soundtrack called Railroad Fever.
And it's kind of like a vocal hawket thing and it's when it's
when they take the Railroad to go out to see through Thoreau in
the In the Woods and I think it's season one.
John Mulaney out in the cabin. Season one, yeah.
But that that cute. It's like one of those that in
retrospect I get people emailing being like I like the version
from season 2 where is it? And I was like well put it out.
But no, I mean it was I think what it did to for just like
LGBTQ visibility overall. And it's, it's a lot of the
things that I work on have kind of like this, this, like desire
to want to like tell these diverse stories, which I think
is also why I love what I get to do.
Because they get to like, you know, whether it's Dickinson,
red, white and row blue, they slashed them, which, you know,
it's not like the greatest slasher movie of all time.
But I think the intention behind it was really great.
And yeah, but yeah, I could, I mean, I could talk hours just
about Dickens and stuff, but did you have any like specific
questions or anything? You kind of answered one but I
guess kind of branching off. So like you mentioned that the
the punk influence for Dickinson and and to like a person who has
never seen the show, that seems odd given like Dickinson was
like a period piece from like the 1700s and so in a typical I
guess period piece since that one was more like contemporary
mix. Does the the time period
influence how you would compose? Like what instrument you might
use or like I guess style of composition.
Like normally, yeah, normally you would.
And I feel like I got to do that in Roslyn, which was also like a
period piece. But then with that, what
ultimately ended up happening is kind of like creating this, what
was kind of coined by everyone is like Renaissance pop.
So like all of the cover songs that were done for that movie
used actual Renaissance instruments.
So like harpsichord, these very specific like different types of
flute, the harp. So it's like in that one it was
very important to keep maintain that like sound that still was
like a renaissance kind of like sound.
Whereas in Dickinson it was kind of like anytime we tried to go
down the route of making it kind of like periods appropriate, it
was like kind of rejected. So I think it like it was very
intentionally not supposed to be that at all, which I appreciated
because it was fun to experiment.
And I think the three biggest influences at the beginning of
season one for Dickinson was Missy Elliott, The Prodigy and
Phoenix. So those were like the three
bands artists that kind of like shaped a little bit of like the
spectrum of the musical thing. And I think like my vocal added
to it then ended up becoming like a huge part of the score,
obviously, you know, as like Emily's externalized like
feelings and stuff like that. I love that.
That's so that sounds so fun to be able to like, play with like
this. I guess two sides of like, time
periods and artists. That's fun.
That's why I wish every project was like Dickinson.
I mean, it was just so it's so nice when you work on a project
and you feel appreciated. And I mean I've been lucky that
99% of the projects that I've worked on I've felt appreciated
and not like I was being told exactly what to do.
And I think it's also just the kind, the kind of music that I
do. But, but when it starts to
happen or when it's like a very there's like very specific
studios and production companies that kind of like are notorious
for micromanaging music and you just like, I don't know if I
want to work with you again, you're.
Just. Like, that's not fun.
Yeah, I get that. Yeah.
You've worked on SO. Many successful projects.
I mean, again, we've been geeking out over Dickinson and
red, white, royal blue. But of all the pieces you've
composed. Which one are you most?
Of funny enough, I mean I I'm proud of everything that I've
worked on. I think it's like pride in
different different ways. Like I think that the score that
I can't believe that I kind of like pulled off that is in the
direction of what I would like to do is for the horror movie
Cobweb, just because it's like it uses string effects and it
uses a huge ensemble and it's just it's so dark.
And I think the music for that I described kind of like as a dark
fairy tale and but you know the genre isn't for everyone.
So then it's like it's very specific music, but in terms of
like my favorite score right now, I would maybe have to say
that one in terms of like if its effect on people and just like
the way that it makes me feel listening back to it.
I do think it might be Dickinson season three, just because
there's like so many pieces in that that anytime I think about
it, I just it just it's it's just so powerful, you know, the
way that the storytelling works. Trying to think if there's other
shows. I mean I I love what we did for
Good Girls because I thought it was really quirky and weird.
But that show was so heavy with needle drops and with songs that
it didn't really allow for more than like honestly like maybe 10
minutes of score at most per episode which you know was
totally the show runners choice and and I respect it but and you
know that one too we we were supposed to have more seasons
and then they couldn't negotiate with the actors and then the
pandemic and then it kind of like just fall fell apart.
But yeah I think the the it's always sort of like the newest
project as the one that you're the most proud of because you're
pushing yourself to a bigger step every time.
But yeah I would say Kabubb and Dickinson season three might be
my favorites. And then there's also a movie
called Summering which I really like the score but it's a
completely different vibe. I don't know if you guys have
heard the music or the the movie's OK.
It did OK. I love the.
Yeah. It did OK.
But the score is like kind of like ambient end of summer
vibes, so very appropriate for right now.
Yeah. But yeah.
I think we just need to. Do a marathon of all of your
work. And then?
Just see the difference from each project.
Yeah, I mean all of them are very different, even even
Dickinson and Roslyn have a lot of similarity, similar
similarities. But then the fact that Roslyn
has like a string ensemble and has these instruments, it's just
it's it's all like you can see the through line, but then
they're all very different. I do think red, white and royal
blue is the most sort of like traditional traditional of the
scores that I've done. Just because like the the the
way that the harmonies and the way that the melodies work
together had to be something that was like relatable to more
people. Just because of the scope of I
think the book and of the project is just so much bigger.
You know that the more niche the project, the more weird you can
get because you're like well this demographic that this movie
is for is gonna like this but for red, white and royal blue,
where the ages are. I mean it's rated R, but really
I would call it like 4/14/15 to you know, 9900 and three since
Iris AFO is 102. So like just whatever like the
whole. So when you're doing that, it
just has to appeal, like, and you know theoretically, like the
music just needs to appeal to more people.
Which is why, like, I think it's the more traditional of scores.
And yeah, and it. But I.
But it's fun to have gone to do that too because then it's like
you get to work on like beautiful sweeping pieces like
the museum score, which is my personal favorite.
And I guess it's Matthews's favorite, too, because when we
were trying to decide which track to kind of like pushed to
Spotify, that's the one that I think we both decided on.
But yeah, so they're all different.
They're all different babies. And they're babies to be proud
of. Yeah.
Well, Sophia, it has been an
absolute delight getting to know you better and just to hear
about all of your amazing projects.
We now have a new Spotify list to, like, listen to after this
is over. Thank you very much.
But before we sign off, do you have any final words for the
listeners at home? I mean, right now with
everything that's happening in Hollywood, you know, with the
writers strike, actor strike, I don't know.
I think it's really important for people to support filmmaking
and to still go and like watch movies.
And I don't know, I feel like I hope things come back soon.
I don't, I don't necessarily have any tips.
I just have like. I stand in solidarity with with
actors and the writers and hope that the future filmmaking can
be fair for everyone, including composers.
And I don't know, I just, I think there's so much great
cinema that's still left to be made and so many voices that
still haven't been heard. And I think we're just at the
beginning of allowing and not even allowing, but like just
being OK with anyone's perspective to be heard and film
and everything. But and yeah, if anyone, if you
know, if you have any followup questions, if anyone ever needs
to get in touch with me, I'm pretty accessible on social
media. So that's what I usually try to
tell people if anyone has any pressing questions about stuff.
Yes, please go follow Sophia on all the social media things and
if for some reason you haven't. Watched or listened to the Red
White and World Blues soundtrack.
Roslyn Dickinson, All of them. Please go check them out.
We definitely will be doing that after this.
So thank you to everybody listening.
Thank you again Sophia. Until next time everybody
hydrate for lesbian Jesus and gay it up all over the place.
We'll see you next time. Bye, bye bye.
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