Hello and welcome to Big Gay energy.
I'm Bree. I'm Fiora and I'm Caitlin come
along with us while we dive into the fun and nuances of queer
media representation matters. And we're here to talk about it.
We have made it. We have made it to part 2.
Part 2 of Paper Girls, gay stuff.
I'll just like, Christmas girls, gay stuff.
And we're going to jump right back into the cage and Maxine's
and my notes got out of order so I'm very sorry.
So we're going to head on back to episode two and talk about
like one of the first like KJ and Max solo scenes.
And that's when Max sneaks out of older Aaron's house to go see
her childhood home and find that.
It's just this giant pile of rubble, which is Major
foreshadowing for like mac this whole life.
And she's like, kind of Like contemplating her life sitting
on a park bench and cage a comes and scares her.
Because of course, KJ was following her in the middle of
the night because like Wanda, did you do as you as you do and
it's at first, it's very, very cute and kind of like Bond over
the fact that like, wow, like in the future Stony stream, where
they grew up is very different and like that teacher, we had is
probably dead and they start getting into like they're morbid
humor that they have. But then it starts getting into
like xenophobia territory with Mac because she's repeating
stuff. You said it home and I'll talk
more about that later. But what I wanted to mention
here is that I thought this was a significant scene between the
two of them because Max we've talked about this before when we
talked about Mac. But her armor has to do with
like a lot of like verbal insults that she throws at
people and In This Moment. She's doing that to KJ B KJ,
really like brings back the fact that like hey, words hurt Words
hurt, you know, not as much as a fist can, and they can be
dangerous. And when she starts going off on
this, like, xenophobia tangent, cages, like, have you ever heard
of the Holocaust? Like, maybe ask my grandmother
about this sometime. Because, remember, these this is
post WWII, like they're fresh out of that these kids.
And Mac brushes it off because like to Mac like hurling insults
is normal words. Don't hurt.
She's like this isn't Nazi Germany, like stop being
dramatic and cages like I'm not being dramatic, like somebody
drew Jew bitch on my locker last year like this hurt.
This is still, this is real so I love that.
It's a reality. Like the you know, that these
words mean something and to Mac, she's become so desensitized to
it because of her childhood that like the words, don't mean.
Anything. It's just like this just words
but and I love that like, instead of like doubling down,
like, some people just double down.
Like, well, that's a you problem that you were offended like mac
gets really quiet and admits like, well you know, I would
never do that. Like I would never go that far
kind of thing. So it's significant in the sense
that it's showing that like well Mac like kind of has this
Persona about her, she's willing to change and so it kind of like
foreshadows like her trajectory later and like how she changes
and, you know, changes her brother by extension.
It also shows that like again, once again, KJ isn't afraid to
be direct and stand up for herself, especially when it
comes to Mac, like his match, kind of like Bully her at first
and she's like, no, no you're not bullying, me and she calls
Mac out on her bullshit and I think that's an important
Dynamic, you know, sometimes you need somebody to call you out on
your bullshit because your, you don't see it and like, kg is the
one who's like, mac. Like double-check, like, stop
doing that and Mac, listen to her, which is huge and I love
that. They have that very early on.
I it's also hard on Words. It's been a long day, heart.
I like that. They did point that out because
things that happened. So long ago are still relevant
today and people are like well that happened back then it
doesn't happen now but it does. It does exactly.
It's don't talk about it or we hide it.
Starting to listen, the Enos is coming out now.
So like again, this is all really relevant and it's through
the lens of children. Who experience these things.
All these people are like we're protecting the kids.
It's like the kids are experiencing those two like it
affects everyone. You know you can't protect them
because then they won't know how to deal with it.
Totally. Totally.
I had this is going to be a rant in the later episodes.
Can't tell. So, before we go off tangent
into a different episode, we haven't recorded yet.
I want to go back to the mall. Seen, we brought up earlier
because this is one of kjzz gayest moments, ever.
And it's when she they're all bonding over the Debbie Gibson
concert at the mall and KJ drops in Vivid detail.
The First time she saw knocking the small and it's such a girl
to crush thing to like, remember like again, like he doesn't
realize she has a crush on back, but she like he's like I
remembered Vivid detail. The first time I saw you, like
it's so like again it's one of those moments later like when
she was having the the panic and the mirror.
She's like, oh yeah, the way I remember the first time I saw a
Mac, that's pretty gay, isn't it?
Like I don't question. Do you, do you guys remember the
first girl that like you really looked at?
Like that, you that we realized was a crush or that we do.
Not like you just. Yes.
Okay, so hi. There was this one girl in ninth
grade? I don't think I saw an eighth
grade, but ninth grade that I just could not stop staring at,
I was just like, she's really pretty.
I wouldn't be her friend and it wasn't until like I realized
everything in like, oh, No wonder like I was obsessed with
her. Yep.
Really up like yours or mine. It is literally like
girl-next-door situation. She was older than me played
Sports beautiful and I would like get jealous of my other
people. Other like neighborhood kids
would talk to her and I just like, I realized later on That's
why. Yeah.
Yeah, that's totally really relatable.
Yep. Mind you have I went straight
for the MILF damper your religion teacher, Miss fifth
grade teacher. Mrs. Hall was no damn taught.
Everything that's even super bill on everything.
And I don't I didn't know why at the time, but I was really glad
she was divorced. I don't know why I'm so happy
about this all the time. I just remember being obsessed
with my second grade teacher, but I don't know if that was
like, I don't know what that was.
If it was more of like a motherly type or what I do, I
still don't fully remember, all I know is I just wanted to hug
her. I love Bri.
I'm so glad. She's divorced.
That's the thing and you're like, I don't know why.
I think this. I love my school.
You don't understand that? Wow, we actually had to leave
the class. For an hour every day to go have
science class in the next class room.
And I was like, can't, why can't she just teach us this to?
And it was because they would switch off like her.
She was better in a subject and our other teacher was better in
science. So they would switch off.
I'm like, what I want Miss Hall. Did she teach me everything?
Me crackling. It's a lot about us.
Straight. Fifth grade teacher.
Hey, never know. Never know.
Yeah. Oh no.
No. Okay.
Sixth grade. Math teacher.
I was so upset that she was married.
So, okay. The opposite experience.
And so I was so pissed because I took me out of her math class
and put me in a lower mouth because I had my mom's boyfriend
doing my homework. because I couldn't understand it, but I
was so upset when they took me out of her car, And, you know, a
bunch of memories Halen's like, do my homework, so I can be in
this class. I'm gonna be a MILF, math, MILF.
Mad, that's it. I feel like that's great.
I feel like that's KJ in high school eventually she has
energy. Anyway, speaking of kidding.
I also love that Max response to hearing this like really Vivid
detail sheet. Looks like your let's be real
Mac didn't notice KJ at all. So to hear this in your like,
wow, you're a stalker, it's very creepy.
So to be on the receiving end of that you're like, huh?
Do you think that's what people think when I talk?
Yes. No.
When you bring up shit from bearing from the past?
Yeah, I do you think But like, I just wanted to know about each
again to just be on the receiving end of.
That is also like weird. You're like, that's really weird
that you remember that because I don't remember this.
But anyway, I love that. It's very human and very like a
kid with a crush thing and who doesn't realize that her Crush
All right, so from there we will jump to episode 6 back on track
to the the kg and Max rooftop scene.
So this is after KJ goes to the movie theater and talks to
Lauren and then Mac, I think had her blow up, blow up with Aaron
about like I have no future. So max like in her feels and
then KJ's on the roof goes up on the roof and it's a very, very
sweet scene between the two of them where they really both like
let their guards down fully with each other.
And they're both really, Paired to tell each other, very deeply
personal things that they've never said out loud before.
So I love this scene. and this the sad thing is like, Mac, Mac
gets to say her piece, but KJ hesitates while talking a little
too long cause she's like, again, trying to like psych
yourself up to be like, II have a guy like, because I love the
dialogue. Okay.
It's so so, so so good. Okay.
And I also have to point out that I love this conversation
that they're having like, their deepest darkest Secrets.
It's on this rooftop with each other alone because in the comic
books, they have a lot of emotional scenes with each other
on rooftops. So I love, this is like a homage
to the comic books. Why they're on a rooftop.
And in the scene like, hey, Jay basically tells Mac like I saw
myself. And this is when we get the
house, the clothes and the cars thing we talked about and I love
that, she says to Mac like because she's like, well, what's
going on with the future of you? And she says, well, I'm happy
now, and I luck. A, the delivery is again this
give feet out award for her role as Kate, because she just kills
it the way she says. I'm happy now.
Now in the future that pregnant pause before she says, now she
like drops her voice and the way she says it, it just conveys.
All the weight that young KJ is carrying about her doomed future
and it's almost like seeing herself as an adult and
realizing she's happy. It alleviates this giant weight
that's been sitting on her. And she sees that her older self
isn't burdened by living the LIE, her mother wanted his cage,
a keeps getting mad at lying because I think that's
internalized hatred because her mother's making her a live a lie
and she hates it and resents it. But she sees that when she's
older, she's not like she sees that she's Brave and she broke
out of this generational trauma that's happening at her house.
And, and eventually in the future, it's bright for her.
Like she will be free, and she will be happy and like, AJ knows
her future is better. And like, and I think that
happiness, like gives her the courage to like, Actually feel
things. And while she's saying that she
like looks at Mac and then like lingers and I think again, she's
starting to like click and she says, I think maybe older me
sorted, some things out, like a, she's looking at Mac, she's
delivering this and then she'd psyching herself up to say.
And she says, I think that maybe she might be, or, I guess, I
might be like and she's this is her admitting it and then Matt
cuts her off. So like she was going to say,
like, for the very first time out loud, like, she's psyching
herself up to do it, like, that's huge to even get to that
point. Never more annoyed with Mac than
I was at that point. Yes, exactly.
But also it's like the saddest thing ever because while KJ just
realized her future is bright and she's gonna be happy Mac
learned the complete opposite about herself.
And it's such a sad juxtaposition because Mac, you
know, basically tells her I'm never going to escape my shitty
life. Basically, she has four years
left to live and some of that's going to be battling cancer and
she's going to lose like her. Uphill battle is one that she
ultimately loses and she has this line that I really love in
there. Were she says it's weird and we
talked about this earlier but it's she says it's weird
whenever stuff gets really bad. I always tell myself to suck it
up and stick it out because I know it's going to be different
when I grow up. Second, I turn 18.
Gene. I'm leaving my shitty house,
getting the fuck out of Sony's dream.
And just thinking about that would make it okay.
It doesn't matter that life is shit now because one day it's
going to be so good, but that's bullshit.
This is it. And that's like such a like what
a heavy thing for a 12 year old to realize.
Because like that is so true. That is life.
Like sometimes like this is it and like you lie to yourself to
get through shitty situations. But sometimes they don't get
better and like to know that as a 12 year old, I can't even
imagine what It's like to even process that like how do you
even trust? Like it since it's actually
insane. Honestly, and what I love is
that kgs response to this because there's literally
nothing you can say to this and KJ, just hugs back, she doesn't
say anything like any time Mac is being like, truly by Kaitlyn.
Being being truly vulnerable. Like KJ doesn't say anything.
She just hugs her. And just comfort her and let
smack cry in silence like she did on the motorcycle and it's
just it's very sweet. That scene.
I like it. I love it.
It's just what a sad juxtaposition, the two of them
very much so yeah. You have any thoughts?
Caitlin about that, kind of got distracted?
Alrighty. Okay, uh, no.
All right so we'll move on to episode 7.
So after that, rooftop confession like the two of them
start like almost get glued to each other side after that.
And so they're wandering around town in like a.j. is trying to
convince Mac because when she hears about this cage he's like
makes it this personal mission to like help match.
You look, bad things happening. We have to stop it.
We gotta catch it early and in kg.
So, so determined to like, help her chin on her girl to die II
know. I know, and I love that.
She says, this line that like, in this case because Max like
no, no, there's nothing we can do.
Like, I'm gonna die like, that's it in cases, like, in this case
doing nothing, he's just Letting the worst possible thing happen.
And I love that because people forget that like in action is
also an action in and of itself like choosing to do, nothing has
consequences sometimes like people who are like, I'm not
gonna vote, it doesn't matter that actually has a consequence
like not doing something. So like again through the lens
of a child, I love this. Like the girl was very wise
behind her ear Beyond her years which I love and Mac, you know,
kind of confesses her point of view which I love to.
She's like, it's happening. But it's almost impossible to
believe. It doesn't feel real because
yeah, like how do you process this like you can't.
She's just like, I don't, how is this my life?
Like, it's so crazy. And I think that line to also
applies to KJ because she just had this big gay Awakening, that
was the exact same thing, which is like, this doesn't even feel
really how is this real? And so like again, they kind of
like relate here and I just, and I love that that KJ just
literally just wants her to be okay.
And she's like, hey, maybe admitting It's the first step
because like that was my gay Journey, like make sure you feel
that it's real. So you take it seriously.
And she's like pleading her. It's so cute.
She's just like, please please, please like, I want you to
exist, like it's so cute and like, I think, through this
interaction to Mac is starting to realize too.
That like other people not just her brother like other people
care about her, like you could hear it in KJ's voice like when
she's pleading with her. And like mac very slowly starts
to understand like no other other people care about me and
it starts with KJ which is so significant.
I love it. I'm just thinking about time
travel right now and having my good because technically
anything they do right now would affect their future and I don't
understand how it's not affecting it all at once and I
just have lots of issues but I think we'll get into that later
and I just That's where my brain is.
Focus on the cute gay stuff Caitlin.
Yeah. Okay.
So you have on my brain is in gay.
Yeah, look at how cute they are. You're so cute.
All right. And then and then after those
again to make it real the way they make it real is by going to
see Max grave, which also is so morbid, but like the two of them
have this weird dark humor that they like share in common and
that's what the scene is really about.
And there's Planes again I'm with them on the dark humor.
That's my that's the only that's one of my favorite kinds of
humor period. I had I wouldn't have gotten
through school without it school being like you won't find a
surgical person without a dark sense of humor.
I mean, it cutting into bodies, you don't cope with that
somehow. You know, I love the smell of
bone dust in the morning. I say that.
And it's creepy, but it's true. What does it smell like?
no, it's kind of like I don't know, you know, this like this
smell kind of like in a wooded place after it rains, kind of
reminds me. Interesting.
Like yeah. Interesting.
Not what I would have guessed and I guess what I guess, but
it's just got this, it's almost and I don't want to.
I don't know how to say. I was almost got this life smell
like it smells like That I don't know how to describe it.
But also people are the smelled xeroform.
So what a have fun? What's a good cleansing
sterilizing think they put? This is not like lots and lots
of goopy goop, yellow stuff that's good for your wound.
Thank you. I was thinking of chlorhexidine,
impregnated things. And that's not what it was.
Thank you. Well, I often look like this.
When they talk about medical stuff, X, I follow it.
I've been learning a lot anyway, speaking of things.
Yeah, back to the gate. So speaking of bones.
Okay. Things I love in the scene is
the sense of humor, but also they like remind the audience
even though they're dealing with all this heavy shit that their
kids and they do that by like having KJ point out, the name
butts on a grave every day that they're 12.
Like, remember, they're 12? And I won't have done that
though. All right, know who else would
Have done that. Whoo, Cody.
Yes, yeah, sorry Peter. So could have done that for
sure. If you're listening, Cody, yes,
you this would be you but I love.
I love that Mac. The dialogue after this is
really funny too because Max like, you're going to hell and
then cages like Naji. Does this like hand the thing
that like Grandma's Day? Like man I like Jews leave real
ago going to the same place. I just love she like Yeah.
Yeah. And then eventually they get to
the grave and that's like the real moment and that gets really
scared because you're looking at your dead self.
And so if you tries to deflect the way she always does by being
like, what do you think? I look like a, my just bones and
kg responds with us not by hugging her or like comforting
her. I think she just speaks Max
language here and uses twisted humor and she's like, well
depends on how good your cough and is, but your eyeballs are
definitely gone his worms. Face the way she's says, Allah
made. So but also, but Mac is just
like, I love this because this is Maxie engage a and saying it
out loud and she's just like people don't notice because
you're quiet but you're really fucked up and people don't
notice that and like People say that to me a lot that you're
fucked up. As though know.
Like as a quiet person myself, like I get that people are like,
wow, when you talk it's totally different.
So like I totally get that but it's very cute.
It's like an ICU moment. Yeah, I just love it.
I love it. And then see AJ.
If you think about KJ in her future, she's going to become a
filmmaker and to appreciate, like, great art and to make art,
I think you have to have like, sort of a fucked-up Part of
Yourself. Totally.
Yeah, that is very that tracks. Yeah, you're so absolutely.
I would love it if she makes dark comedies growing them,
damn. But the rest of this is really
cute too. So after that they kind of
exchange these smiles and then KJ, like keeps going with the
humor and she's like, I bet you were buried in a dress and Mac.
It's really I love kj4 that, I love that too.
And I also love the constant thing about Max a version, two
dresses because that is so fucking relatable.
Personally, I'm hating dresses. Like so I love that KJ keeps
digging It's very, very sweet and and, and the rest of this
whole sequence with them in the graveyard, with my cowl shows
up, and all that stuff, KJ keeps doing this stuff like, and it's
throughout the rest of this show like here at going from here
forward where she keeps like, doing tactile affectionate
things with Mac, like she'll like, touch her shoulder and
like touch her arm like to comfort her and stuff.
And it's, it's really cute and it just the rest of the the
season. Is it just is the cutest Okay,
last scene from this episode is KJ's.
Birthday gift to Mac because it's ironically its Max birthday
and they're seeing her grave and all this stuff and Mac has that
line. Yep.
July 5th. I'm a cancer.
How great is that Darkness? As a fellow cancer?
I hear you but then okay, that one is great.
But then cages gift is a bottle of Orange juice.
And I just love this because just imagine her looking through
the because again, she's worried about Max future and her dying
and so she looks through this whole convenience store.
Let's get her something for her health and she gets her a bottle
of orange to look. It's so fucking cute and such a
kid thing. Like, I love it.
I love it. It's so cute.
I'm just like in my brain. I just kept going.
Hey, it's o.j. from KJ. Sorry.
I was a child when this one on
my grandmother was obsessed with watching this.
I hated all of it. I only know the name.
Like I have no idea what happened basically.
He got off for murder. And the 12 biggest part of it
is, there's an actor / football player wearing his ex-wife.
Yep. Her friend.
Yeah, it was a fad. It was a very famous for hours.
It was an actor. Yeah, he was an actor to who's
more on the sports side at that time.
Yeah, that's time. Or yes, I totally just did not
pay attention to what? I don't even think you were born
yet. Yeah.
What year was it? Pressure is a 90s.
Yeah, the Bronco Chase. Yeah, the late 90s.
Anyway, Tourette's getting back to like orange juice OJ.
The last part of the scene that I really love aside from like
the gift is like the conversation they have here
because this is Max like coming to terms with the fact that
people care about her a moment cause like they just saw the
Stepmom on the anniversary of her death or her birthday.
Going to the Grave like again Mac was like she never really
cared about me. She was like, never there for me
as a kid. Why is she coming to my grave
and giving me like flowers? Like why is this happening?
and, It's just, it's sad because it's like it's impossible for
her to believe that like somebody loves her.
And we talked about this in the other episodes, but like Dylan
and Mac didn't really get expressions of healthy love.
And I think that changed when Mac got sick and she's
eventually, we'll see what real love is from Alice and from her
brother and so, but at this point she has no idea.
So she's having a hard time understanding like why are why
are people like caring about me and in cages the one who's like,
like she's like, oh, I think That is weird.
That people gave a shit about me and cages, like, well, I give a
shit about you basically, and like, it's cute because they're
sitting on the step and occasionally crosses into max
space and like nudges her when she does this.
Like, again, that tactile things she keeps doing and then she
says, I want you to live, you know?
And like I don't think Max ever heard that anything like that
before and that's when she more than a shit about her.
Well, yes, she did. She gave her orange juice.
That's cheap, that's code. Doesn't Valentines.
Yes, life about her because life about her butt up.
Like, that thing. You do to your crush.
You want to touch them as much as possible, even when you're at
thing. Yes, exactly.
You have no idea why you're doing it but she keeps doing it.
Yeah, I love a lot of kg stuff is so subconscious, but it's
just like, you can in this scene in particular, like after they
say all these things, they stare at each other and like, there's
a second or that's a lingering on KJ.
And you can just like, feel her Crush, like a being off of her.
It's like palpable like her Crush.
It's so cute. I love it so much and then Aaron
interrupts it and Tiffany because that's our Tiffany Hair.
You Know, Tiffany this. I was mad at Tiffany's like what
he let them let them. So it's like every time that
happens I just want to do this to the screen.
It's the debris. Just took the time to write that
and we didn't notice Thank you brave, for doing that.
We believe that Jimmy Page. We need that for future
episodes. Yeah.
I need the gay sign, pick a side.
All right, so and now we'll just go to like the final KJ Maxine's
in the last episode. So we get to like the time Loop.
I'm calling it The Time Loop in the in the barn scene.
So what we learned about this time, this time stuff that we
haven't really been talking about is that basically What's
Happening Here is it's not just time travel they're trapped in
this time Loop basically. So they learned in the last
episode that like basically what's happening in the future
is triggering events in the past.
It's older Tiffany calls it a predestination Paradox and
basically because these The events are codependent the
future in the past, it's causing things to just repeat over and
over again. And so like ultimately they're
trapped and they really can't change the future, they created
the future because the future created the past.
So there like trapped in this Paradox basically and Mac.
Here's this because her and she just had all this hope thrown at
her like people love me. Like maybe we can have a better
future. Like, and then here's, we're
fucked. And she says, and everything
that happened is gonna happen, and there's no changing it.
And she's like, I'm gonna die. I'm gonna die.
And like, KJ knows what's happening and like, immediately
starts like touching her and then Aaron gets on the
walkie-talkie because they're like, trying to talk to the
Future and is trying to warn like heck and all do in the
future and she starts repeating. You're going to die over and
over again, which triggers Mac and Mac runs away.
I mean understandably. So yeah, totally totally,
totally, totally, totally totally but I love that Mac goes
to the barn because Mac loves animals and so that's like a
safe place for her. She just starts like petting And
like a goat. Like I love that like relatable
I love animals more than people because people treated me like
shit my whole life. That's kind of like mac.
That's why shouldn't be a vet not a doctor.
And then who runs after her to the barn KJ.
And then we get this scene where Basically like the old-timers
are coming after them and cages like we gotta go because like
danger and but then you have enough time to have this moment
KJ like approaches her and then Mac puts her hand on KJ's and KJ
freezes because they Panic. Yep, hold up your sign free.
Because because I altered it to because gay 10/10 is happening
in. Plus k 2 plus k 2 plus K Temple
skip. And then, okay but then Matt,
what Matt tells KJ in my opinion is the best possible way to
declare your love for somebody. And she basically says, thank
you for being how you are, which was my collects a flashback of,
like, thank you for being you. Because Alexa said it to Clark
and it's just, it's the best way to say, I love you to somebody.
It's just like, I love you for who you are, is basically what's
happening in the scene and I just love it.
I love it. I love it.
And it works.
So well, here with the two of them because again, Max just
seems like the kind of person who doesn't love people like she
likes being the library and reading and she likes animals
and just here she is to like tell this person like thank you
for being you. Like that's a big deal for like
somebody like Max I like this is her like changing it to somebody
who's more loving and like caring, which is kind of seems
to be what happens when she gets her diagnosis.
But KJ is gay panicking. And and this is kgs realization,
like she's had this full process happen.
Like with like, okay, like how do I know if I'm gay?
It's just Lauren's, like, hey, you just gotta feel it.
When that feeling happens, just feel it.
The feelings are happening right now and you see on her face
because she gets really quiet and she's just like staring at
Mac and she's like, oh shit, I have a crush on a girl and it's
this girl and what the fuck do I do?
And Max just Are you okay? Because Katie's haven't heard
gay, real Association moment here, but then again, it's like
one step forward, two steps back.
So she like rips her hand away because she's like, wait,
because again, like it's a scary position to be in because you're
like, what? If you're not gay, you could
react badly. Like this is what like and she
starts rambling and rambling and she's like, I gotta, I gotta go
process, this is kind of like what she's getting at, but then
Mac just again was vulnerable for a second and then she's
like, oh, you're going to reject me?
me, when I'm like being honest with you and she storms into the
house, And it's time for the gay panic.
I know. I know I'm like, and like,
again, I think KJ gets mad at herself and you see her like
beating herself up in the barn like after it happens.
Because she's like, like fuck. Fuck fuck fuck.
Fuck like because like I mean I don't think she didn't want to
tell Mac because like on the roof like she wanted to tell her
like I would have been the first person she told and then she's
like oh wait the first person, I felt comfortable enough to tell
is the one I have a crush. I like it's a lot to process
mating. It's so scary.
Really like, oh my God, it's scary.
And then she's staring at her and she's like, are like, what's
going on? And she's like, I can't tell you
what's going on. I can't tell you what's going on
like black like fuck. And she's like, I just gotta I
need a second. I need a second.
Okay. Because it's like here's my
vulnerable vulnerable underbelly telling her she's gay and then
also here's my heart and it's like yes crash.
Oh my God. And then poor Mac because like
Max not used to like that was a big step for her to just even
say thanks for being there for me.
And Then she's like, oh wow, you're going to reject me.
Fuck this, yes. So it reinforces Max Yeah, it
was I wrong about with you like humans on this planet.
I know, it's so sad grrrr, I know.
And okay, and I need to point out one thing because it's like
a comic thing to the because the like Old Timers are coming the
disguise, I'll pink because, like, there's a folding
happening. And, so, the whole, the Hues in
this scene, are purpley, pinky. I have to point out that when KJ
and Mack have their, like, kiss on the rooftop in the comics,
that's the color scheme that's happening. and I love that, it's
like, The opposite of what's kind of and like that scene to
in the comics is when Matt like kgs already on board with being
gay in Madison Avenue, say about that scene.
Sure. You want to say it?
No, I just I don't understand that scene in the comics.
Oh, I can tell. Yeah, okay, I took me a while to
but um, it basically, what's happening in the comics is like,
okay. So I'll just tell the whole
thing because it makes more sense kjb.
So they sees a vision of the future where they're kissing on
the rooftop and it's got this purpley Hue of the, it's a very
distinct like back. Ground and she eventually her
and Mac end up together and going after the cancer treatment
and they're on the rooftop, in the sky doesn't look purpley
pink, but kg recognizes the rooftop.
She's like, oh fuck and Max like what's wrong?
And she tells her like hey so I had this vision of us being
romantic on this rooftop and Mac responds with homophobia,
because Mac has a lot of internalized homophobia.
And it's like, there's no way that's gross.
Keep that shit to yourself. But then they go through this
whole thing where, like, they're trying to get the cure for her
cancer. They find out.
There's not like KJ holds a knife to a doctor's neck.
Like like is like going at, like, trying does everything in
her power to try and save Mac and Mac Witnesses this.
And then when they get on the rooftop later, Basically Mac has
her realization about KJ that's what's happening internally.
And so she says the line, like I fit the line where she's
basically like is this where you saw it and cages like yeah, this
is where I saw like us kissing and then she says, well, I guess
it's going to happen kind of thing because Mac has her
realization about KJ right before it happens.
And then kisses her because, like, I didn't I didn't catch
the realization because it just seems like okay.
Oh, yeah, Mr. And then, and then cages like my girlfriend, I'm
like that. She's such a lesbian because,
like, that's your, she was immediately.
She's like my girlfriend. And it's like, you kissed.
Her once had no conversation about this.
Yeah, exactly. Like she's the gayest and the
kind of seems like Matt kiss her just because it was supposed to
happen, right? That's what it's like and that's
how I read it the first time and I'm like that, so weird.
But like, if you take into contact, what happened at me
like before that, like, all this shit that KJ went through just
for her like mac is realizing what they're having in this
conversation and I think that's what they're trying.
Linked with the color scheme. It's like this is the same
conversation but they're actually saying these things out
loud or Max like yeah, thank you for being you like and you for
caring about me and like comforting me and all that
stuff. And so she sees the KJ cares and
like that's a good thing. Yeah.
So but in the show KJ's having her oh shit, I like her moment,
whereas in the comics when this happens, it's Mac having her.
Oh shit. I like her moment like kind of
thing. But there's more, there's more
homophobia from Mac. In the comic that complicates it
that we don't really get in the show which kind of cool with but
maybe that's season two because they really haven't talked about
those. Yeah, but yeah, I just wanted to
know what would happen. I mean we all want to know what
happens. No but like even if like we
don't I mean we need. I'm sorry.
Can you tell? I'm getting really tired.
Like if for some reason, never mind.
All right, so the last part of this is like in the house.
So okay so again kg like beats herself up after like the
rejection piece and finally I think Matt goes inside and see
his Pirates and it's like oh fuck and then kg storms after
her to like I think tell her because she's like, hey, like
she comes in and says, hey, Mac and then like it gets cut off by
Pirates being the twat block. Do you, what do you guys think
KJ was gonna say? Like, because she seemed like, I
feel like she was gonna be like, fucking any teller and was gonna
go tell her and then I mean I think she wants to tell her.
She is. You're welcome, it's literally
in my nose. I mean that was my assumption
that she was about to tell her. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah. Which I wanted that seen pyrus
But what I want that seeing? Yes I want that scene.
But this whole scene super cute too because like pyrus is this
big intimidating presence and like KJ's first instinct when
she realizes what's happening is to position herself.
So she's like in this defensive stats stance with Mac behind her
and she doesn't the whole rest of the episode with these guys.
And it's you you it's so cute but take my lady.
Yeah. But it's so sad though because
like, mac is just over everything because she feels
betrayed by k.j. a minute ago. And then just like is like,
here's one, we came from like erase our brains.
I can't take this anymore. It's just so sad.
It's so sad. Yeah.
She's like, you want it. I think she takes a person like
wow, you want to forget me? Like wow.
Yeah, I thought we were making progress.
All right, then after this this is just like the end of the
episode. So that's kind of like the end
of like they're skiing's. Now, we'll just go to the end of
the episode, the end of the sewed with like grandfather
showing up. First of all, this is actor.
Okay. This actor I can't take him
seriously because he's too much I couldn't even I can tell you
is that when good place was supposed to come up.
Yes Eric thank you. We all I saw you're fired.
Sighs dress him differently. I might oh okay.
So I was like, why is he dressed like that?
That's how he's dressed in the comics honestly, like they.
Yeah, don't get it. But yeah, but this particular
guy in like that announcement, that to like, yes, he is so good
at it. They like not just see these
people and then draw them, we need to ask Yes, I need to ask
Cliff this. Yes, on out already.
Oh my God. But yeah, seriously, I can't
take this man, seriously. And but yeah, this is I'm Derek,
but this scene is sad too. Because just like, again KJ, it
just Mac asking for her just like brain to be scrubbed, but I
love it. The scene 2, because we get the
first like, mac drops. The nickname cage in the scene,
which is from the books are the comics and it's super cute
because, like, again, it's KJ like they're like, okay, we're
gonna go back to the past and he's like, wait a minute.
Can we go to the Future? Because she has cancer and I
want to save her life. And it's like, She calls her
cage was really, really fucking cute.
Is that how you're supposed to read it?
I thought they were just like spilling out KJ.
No. She says cage like it's in.
Yeah. That's they write it in the book
to cage. It's cute.
Yeah. But um, any more about the back
and like KJ stuff in that scene because if that will go to like
the end because I know Kaitlyn has a rant.
All right, let's go, let's go. We're ready.
Okay, last thing that lets thing about Mac towards the end is
like, okay, when they get in the house and they're all the girls
are in the basement. I love that Mac.
Finally, like tells everybody. What's going on about her like
this? Like, the ultimate character
growth for her like it took her a while to tell KJ.
And then she just tells everybody and it's really,
really sweet. So I love that character growth
from Mac and will come back to the scene in a minute like
later. But for now, I just wanted to
highlight that and the fact that when they're leaving the house,
so they make the decision to like go out together, kg like
leads the group. Like, she's the big Brave one,
like leading them out, and Max stops them to tell everybody.
Like, I don't want to forget you guys.
Look at what did you get to the point where she can like, be
honest with everybody and like, they reciprocate and I like, we
don't want to forget you to. And, and I think 2kj that's like
the apology that like, hey, like I didn't really want to forget
you like I was scared and just wanted to be done with this and
then KJ asked her full circle. Do you want to come to my bat
mitzvah? And then because there's other
people she's like I need you guys to all of you obviously.
I just love it. She's like you come to end
everyone also to the but Mitzvah and nmac gives gives her that
she's like, yeah, we'll go. And then she's like, but I'm not
wearing a fucking dressed and I just love it.
All right, I love them. I love it so much.
And then the end. Do you want me to explain the
end? Or do you want to just like rant
about the end Caitlin? I put it in here just for you?
The end. Well, I had the end of the
comics is the one that pissed me off the most.
Oh, okay, so oh yeah. Okay.
So Yeah, we can run home and what is the end of the show?
Basically the end of the show is just like just where the clip by
Caitlin where the Cliffhanger leaves us.
So like Pirates and so Pirates. Okay pirate patches this plan to
send them to another time because she's over the time War.
She's like, Fuck this. I lost my brother, I'm tired.
And when she learns that Tiffany is Tiffany quilt, and she's like
cool. If I send you to a specific part
in time, you can stop all of this.
Because you're part of the reason we're in this mess
because you quote-unquote invent time, travel.
And basically KJ, she like, gives them the pod that's going
to send them somewhere. She's like, you got two minutes
to run this pod, because drama and kg hesitates and tells
Pirates. I'm sorry for killing your
brother like, and it's really cute because Pirates was like,
look, I understand it wasn't really your fault and I was she
tries to like be like I get it kid just go but then chaos
ensues and sheep Iris ends up getting shot.
And then Aaron runs out of the Pod with the medic.
Bugs and tries to save her life and like the clock is ticking
this whole time and there's all this chaos and what ends up
happening in the end is that Mac and KJ, get trapped in the Pod
because kgs and athlete. Matt, never Mac never left the
Pod. She Sprint's back to the Pod and
the other two are like scrambling.
And it's just really sad scene where they like the, the four of
them. Like finally are like, yes,
we're a team and then they get divided the very end, and then
Mac and KJ, get sent somewhere. Where the fuck you think?
Oh, where do they go? When they all have their hands
on the glass, Justin. Hey, Jay and Max hands are on
top of each other, you know, so cute.
It's so cute. I'm gonna, it's so cute.
A bitch, the bus the bubble, I hated that fucking entire
saying, that's what I mean. I hate it.
Hot. I just like the hey it's okay if
your hands with you do not even care about the hands.
I'm like okay, it is dumb. I agree.
Okay, and then every night. Aaron and Tiffany go to 1950 and
that's the end. So, okay, Jacob, where did they
go? Where did they go?
I don't, I need a season 2 to
know where they went because they don't end up in 1950 like
Tiffany and earring. See where the other to go, but
we don't get them. Like, why what I mean, I
understand that like, Tiffany is like part of the reason for like
why are they more important than the other two?
I don't think that's the issue. I think what happened was when
the original pod was like getting sent like the other
old-timer people come in and one of them started messing with the
controls. So I think they send them
somewhere. They weren't supposed to even
go. I'm assuming they're going to go
to the far past judge, you? No, I just mean why did we Get
to see them, but not the I don't, I don't know.
Maybe that's the part that I have an issue and I think maybe
the writers haven't decided, where they go, and that's where
they're like, well, Drew show these guys maybe.
But yeah, I'm mad, too. I want to know, are they okay?
Maybe they get sent to wented same-sex marriage.
Get legalized. Maybe they send them to that,
and I great. Okay, what's your favorite?
That whole scene was dumb to me, like stop it.
Colourful, child decisions, stop beating on the stupid glass,
like that's a don't do that. It's futile.
It's a kid move. There are 12.
They're sad that they're getting separate, Darren, okay.
To be fair to be fair every to your point, aren't there buttons
inside that they could be Doesn't that have to be controls
on the inside, right? Like, because it's the Pod has
to go back of it. You think that they would build
these pods without an emergency cancel from the inside?
Boy, don't know how to work it. They've never seen that is
children, why don't you listen - big red button.
Maybe it was a big blue button, okay, bro, it's pretty even from
Scott, you don't hear me. This red button is bad.
Also Larry yelled at her when she tried to press it once.
For sure, maybe do something. I don't know.
I hate it. All right.
I just wanted I just want to know more.
I mean, obviously we all do. But like I just if we don't get
anything, I just want to at least know.
Where did they just give me? Where the hell they went?
Just answer questions. I need answers.
All right, Kaitlyn. So, what did you hate about the
comic ending? I just I don't, I can't spoil
that. It was Some Marvel movie and I
don't want to spoil it for people because people would kill
me but what it was Jeannine, he's an already out.
Yeah. Well then why the hell would you
not spoiling and you're not spoiling it?
Oh well I mean I don't know people keep people are crazy.
No yeah, fuck them. Save your spoiler for insert
Marvel movie skip. 30 seconds ahead if you don't want the
spoiler. Yeah and if you're right I wash
it by now your don't. You don't hear that much about
Marvel. Yeah.
Go ahead boiler friend, the last Spider-Man movie, where will
they go? They don't remember each other,
like all the friends, don't remember each other and because
They don't remember who Spider-Man is and I just hate it
because like, they were so close and then you just wipe the
entire storyline and so they send the four of them back to
their time. And they're like you'll have
dreams about it, but you'll forget it immediately when you
wake up and I just like it. So she's freaking stupid because
they met each other who they are.
And then, and then they go and do the first scene of like the
first paper. I'm like, oh, that's how they
got it. So, they did the ending.
Beginning of the show. Yeah, they did.
Yeah, but I'm not done yet. Okay, because I'm really pissed
about this. And then because they're just
like, they're just pretending like they don't know each other,
like how they did in the first thing, the Matt calls her.
What Tanya and I just they were still getting close and you
know, kju Mac they needed to be together and I know she's gonna
end up with Lauren but like I just don't understand like I
don't like it. And this is a really is my ring.
Aunt. And, and then they, they tribe
off. They, they, they they, they go
off in the four corners. And I don't like it.
But, but, but, but they don't, I don't, I don't think there's any
reasoning with her right now. No, no.
Don't you? Let us know when you're done.
Caitlin is Corner rant. Go
Flip the page that is blank and then gets the next one.
Inherits little spoiler alert for the end of the book and then
you just screw it. I threw it out there, they don't
remember each other, their brains get wiped.
There's like, puppy. We know we can ride together
till then to like sure what the hell.
Okay, well, there's no. Every one of the oars readers
feels like, that's the end of the
comics. Yeah.
Okay. And like there's nothing like
what happened Well, the implication is that, okay?
So there's interference by a time traveler that nudges Aaron
into doing that where she's like, hey guys, let's ride
together because they don't do that in the original timeline,
they explained it in the show and the books, they part ways
and they never see each other again after held a.
But here, they don't like cuz remember Aaron is the glue like
Aaron's, the one who keeps them all together.
So, like the fact that Aaron's like, hey guys, let's do this.
That's an implication that they will stay friends.
Like that's the that's what's being a Applied like their
future actually is going to change?
Yeah. Also I kind of wish they'd put
worry innit. I know that's why, that's why
I'm wondering, okay, yes, boiler.
I'm wondering if KJ and Mac are going to the prehistoric past
and that is gonna play out because remember, they were in
the comments there alone together in that hole.
Oh, yeah, period. That's what someone was messing
with it. And I wonder if they
accidentally go there AJ in it, the whole time of KJ.
Exactly if she was like somewhere else, I would have
been upset but yeah. Anyway, that's okay.
But I will say one thing about the end and the comics, that's
tragic and sad. And just, I love cigarette.
No, the, the Bat Mitzvah. The Bat Mitzvah.
So, we do get the buck misbah. Ok, so yeah, in the last episode
of the show, The the exchange for like, fixing the timeline is
that these girls get their memories erased and they go back
to their time, which ends up happening.
It's the inevitability of all those really, and So after it
happens, they have these like residual dreams.
Of like stuff and they wake up and it's held a and and then
like, basically it picks up where the comics first started
kind of, but now they've memories have been erased on
stuff kgs, dream is a joint drain.
She's having with mac and it's her, but Mitzvah she's in the
dress and Mac goes and they do flirting.
And then at some point KJ, recognizes this is a dream and
it's going to end and she's like, With me, like it's so cute
and she coaxes Mac and to slow dancing.
And this is really sweet moment between the two of them.
And as it's like ending, like basically, we almost get like,
the I love you from the two of them, and then they wake up and
it's sad because of all of that, but also cages like fall, but
it's awful. But also like KJ.
They all end up oversleeping kg / sleeps because her mom is
like, hey, you looked like you were having like the best dream
ever. And I didn't want to wake you
up, which how and Then Mac her. Brother's wakes her up and he's
like, you're oversleeping. What the hell.
And then calls, her makes fun of her and calls her Butch for her
jacket. So it's like she just had this
dream about KJ and then she's getting the home of a, it's just
that's their situation like yeah, it's just yeah, I just
sucks. It's, but it's cute.
Like, they get the Bat Mitzvah seen that, any?
Yeah. But it's the center spot submits
for scene at the end. I know, but it's sad but maybe
their future each is to say she doesn't Care.
I know. I like it because it's real.
But also, I love Lauren so I'm I'm cool.
That's where I'm torn. Where I'm like, I hate it but
Lauren I think you learn but Lauren wouldn't happen is
Lauren. I'm sorry, I'm not a matte cage
a shipper. I know.
I think they're cute but I want kg that.
The thing is we just did the gayness.
I think that's why we all like caging that to get things.
You just want the game. I don't want them to get
together. I like KJ's Journey with me.
A quill realizing who she is. I like that part.
One them to have the
romantically Parts. I just also the Childers.
Yeah, the weird. I want KJ College.
Yeah. Can we have caged in college, a
college. Let's just, let's just we got
them. They're very cute.
Yeah. But it's not.
It's pretty. Hey, we're greedy, we're greedy
hose. Yeah, we're greedy, little gaze,
pretty little guys. Okay, last part of this, that
will get it jump. Really really quickly.
So this can be just one episode of what can be done?
All right, who now we've concluded, all the gay stuff.
I just want to like conclude our talk about paper rose by just
talking about some themes that they had in the show that I
think they did really, really well.
And that stood out to me and Huh.
Okay. And one of those themes that
really stuck out was the way they accurately depict the dark
side of the 80s because in a time where like stranger things
is like a Big Show and it's always like, oh, look at how
Progressive the 80s was and wasn't the 80s, really cool.
I like that. They don't do that here.
They're like yeah it was fine or whatever but there's also bad
shit that happens. Like remember this wasn't that
far go in the past bad shit was still happening like mac, the
latchkey kid who has like No Parental supervision Asian like
accurately showing what Gen-X was like as kids their first
instinct, when all of this shit is happening in the first
episode is you see their Trauma from the Cold War like they
think? Oh, purple sky.
It's a nuclear bomb. Let's get Duck and Cover.
Like you hear the word Duck and Cover from Tiff because they had
nuclear bomb drills like and caging freaks out.
She's like don't even say that like again these are kids
traumatized from the Cold War like and that was so real.
Like that would have been a very real reaction from a Gen-X kid.
The time and the xenophobia, the way they did not shy away from
that, and it can show was amazing.
And I think this is the big Touch of realism that like
strangers things like kind of avoids, like the bigotry and the
homophobia, that happens here. Like it happens in the very
first encounter we have, we're like, Aaron is like tossing the
paper, she gives it to the wrong person, and the guy comes out
and calls her a thief, and a JAP, and all this stuff.
And she's like, I'm Chinese, but, like Tiffany, who is
experienced this before. It comes in and saves her.
And she's like, hey, a quarter isn't worth getting killed by
bigoted, again, it's so sad that she says it's a matter of fact,
but like that's right. That was reality at the time,
you know, and the other one, I really loved.
It's so heartbreaking is Aaron's Halloween story where they're
riding and they're talking about their Halloween costumes and
Aaron's. Like, I mean, I only
participated once and, and she's like she starts to kind of like
tell the truth that like, well, you know, my mom didn't really
last participate because she thought it was dangerous for us
to go out at night. And, and because we weren't like
we weren't and she Trails off, but and she's going to say like,
we weren't white, so it was scary, but she doesn't say that
and it's just scare. It's sad, that that's like that
was like, kids experience for her first Halloween and, you
know, and how the neighbors hate her mom.
Because of her English point out that Max stop trick-or-treating
at 3:00, no one to take her. What she thought of a Dylan
Dylan would have taken her. I mean, they seem to have
similar friends but also yeah, it's true.
He was bullying her to your right, especially in the car.
Yeah, that, yeah, it's much more blatant in the comics that he
bullied her. Yeah, I know.
It's really sad. I also have to point out that
KJ, the lesbian is, like, I was a hockey player, I was Wayne
Gretzky, I love her because she's okay, she's the best.
And then, I have to point out that the anti-semitic slurs from
KJ that KJ experience is start with Mac, after he ends up
saving KJ from those creepy teenagers and you hear the
teenagers making fun of kg they're like KJ KJ Randleman
Bank. Like again like she just gets
all this stuff thrown at her for like being Jewish and stuff and
like it's just in one cage. He's defending herself in that
scene. It's so like void of emotion
because like she here like these kids are kids but they get all
this bigotry thrown at them a lot like their 12 year old kids
and like it's really really sad. And just you know for Max
perspective she is very much like repeating what she hears at
home about. Like, you know, the Japs are
coming from a Dad's job and like where have we heard that before?
Like immigrants are coming from your for your job or whatever?
Like it's it was the same shit in the air.
These which is a different scapegoat different Boogeyman
and like, you know, Jewish people were demonized for like
hoarding money and all this stuff.
And so, like, Mac or PC, all these dog whistle things.
That our father says, and it's so sad that like, people like
her traumatizing, these people that later become her friends
because they're different and, you know, it goes to show you
that like kids understand like can kids understand bigotry and
like bigotry is not innate. It's taught like Matt learn Mac
learned it at home, and it was just normal and it just It's
really, really sad like that. That's like reality and but I
love that they show that they like hey, the 80s were fucked up
to, you know, it wasn't all just like, you know, back in the, my
day things were better. Like they don't shy away from
that in a kids show. And I like that, especially in
the era of stranger things where they don't do that, you know.
all right, and then I sorry. You said I agree.
Yeah. It was a little.
Yeah, it's very real. I agree.
It's very grounded and like what life is kind of like back them
and the biggest theme I think that happens in this show and
it's used as a metaphor through the time, War stuff is just
generation Warfare like older generation versus younger
generation. That's really what the time war
is. I think it's a it's a metaphor
because if you think about it the good guys are the stf The
Standard Time Fighters and they're like teenagers, they're
the youth, right? Like pyrus in the last episode,
describes them as terrorists who landed in her time and claimed
that everyone was guilty of making the future that they came
from. It isn't that like the younger
Generations who get screwed by the older Generations know like
you guys were all complicit in this and now we're fucked
because you fucked it up and then the old watch they call him
the old wash in the show but they're called The Old Timers
in. Comics because this is
generational stuff. They're basically all older
people and their mission is to maintain what's happening
because as Larry points out, he's like, they're the ones in
power, so they have an incentive to keep things going the way
they are, because they benefit from this, and that's like
Boomers versus Gen X gen Z Millennials.
That's the struggle were in. Right now, they're telling it
through this time War, how there's like Larry's, like oh,
there's like power. There's like wage disparities.
There's no resources and it's all because of this stuff.
It's being perpetuated and maintained by the old timers.
And it's like, Again, grounding stuff in reality through a Time
War. That's just youth versus older
Generations. It's like liberal thinking
versus conservative thinking and in the, for the older generation
are like, well, you can't, you can't mess with the past.
Like things are good now, but the younger generation is like,
no, no, we're going to make. We're going to get rid of all
the bad stuff and make things better.
But there's like good and bad to both of those mentalities.
And what we ultimately see is that like those two kind of
ideas, kind of need to coexist to keep things in balance a bit
because and that's why their dick trapped in this
never-ending cycle because ultimately, like one will not
win versus the other, they just keep like balancing each other
out. Anyway.
So, I love that. Because it's very timely to
where we're at right now and the, the metaphor they use for.
It is the mixtape metaphor in like, when when they talk to
grandfather, And I just, I love that because he's like, yeah,
you know, the original is the best, it's the best.
When you start messing with the original, like that's when
things get messed up and, like, eventually everything falls
apart and it's just like this metaphor for like, well, you
can't change stuff, but like that mentality has so much
hypocrisy attached to it all the time, and I love the exchange
later that KJ has with grandfather.
Where she basically is like, okay, you guys are all about.
You can't kill. You can't like mess with
timelines, but she's like, in the first episode we watched
pyrus kill a bunch of people and she's like, where did those
people important in their timeline?
So why is it cool for you to break the rules?
Like you tell us, you tell us we can't break the rules but you're
breaking the rules, like again, isn't that always true of the
people in power, create a bunch of rules and then they actually
secretly break all the rules that they impose on everybody
else and looks okay. Jeez pointing out this hypocrisy
that always happens in these. And then grandfather's like,
well, I don't make the rules. Like they're not my rules, like
the rules. The rules have always been here.
I'm just following the way things have always been.
Yeah. When you get called out, you
just you don't take responsibility, right?
And the cages, like wait a minute.
If you're not in charge, like who the fuck is in charge then
and he's like, I don't know. Everything.
Just happens for a reason. Like, it's just like cop.
There is no taking responsibility for the bad shit
that like the status quo is doing, and I love when he says
everything happens for a reason, and KJ has his awesome line
where she's like, I don't believe that.
That, I believe, people say that to absolve themselves of
responsibility but we make choices and if you can stop bad
things from happening you have to try and like what a fuck
about your KJ's 12, right? She's wise Beyond her years
while she was sleeping at school and she's the oldest actor in
the show. But I don't think she has a lot
of time to think about. I agree.
I think she strikes me as the type of hurt, like I really do.
Because I feel like she's The Quiet One, just observes things
and then like thinks about it and then like Jane Austen, who
just sits back and watches everything and kind of season
through silence and she sees their parents going through all
of these motions stuff. So she signed it, it's just
yeah, one of her face. She's lived it.
That's how her mom's imposing all this shit on her.
She's like this, it's just tradition.
This is the way it always is. To absolve themselves of like,
the responsibility that her mom is making her miserable by doing
this. Like she's lived this heard that
before. Yeah.
Exactly. So I love that because it's so
true. Yeah.
And then one of the biggest themes I love in this show is
just the found family aspect which at the end the four of
them even though they're all clearly very different through
this kind of shared experience with each other they they see
each other with their worst and Inform this really this family
with each other and it culminates, when they're trapped
in Larry's basement at the end and they have this Choice like
what do we do and mac and cage are kind of like, hey, they saw
us. So we'll go you guys escape and
live and then they ultimately decide.
Like no, we started this together.
We're in this together. Like we're paper girls.
We stick together. We're not going to change that
now. And like even when they get in
like the ship later and Paris is like I'm taking Tiffany, they're
like no, you're not. No, you're not, you're take her.
You can take all of us like it's It's very sweet and I love that
and that's very common theme in like, queer media.
So I'd love that here. It wasn't just like the queer
people. Forming a family is like all of
them doing that and it was just it's very cute to see that with
like younger kids like being able to form families with each
other that are strong. I didn't really have great ones.
Did we talk about the older versus younger Generations?
Yes. Yeah.
Did you have any question?
Sure? What was your younger self?
Think of you now? Well, how young am I my 12 year?
Olds up? I have someone who like the,
your younger self, who's dreaming of the future?
Yeah, my airsoft be like what the fuck happened?
Probably, what the fuck happened?
Yeah, my end result would be Kate.
I would have cage a storyline like that would be it'd be like
what happened. Like this is not, this is not
what you're supposed to be doing.
Yeah, same. Yeah.
Okay, what about you? I probably be impressed that
weird. I was able to get a car at 20,
like a new car and yeah, I'd be very impressed with that and
traveling. Yeah, for sure there's a lot of
things that I never thought I'd be.
Then also still living at home. You got a little blurry on your
camera. It might just be the record.
Maybe some Wi-Fi. I'm sorry, sorry.
Sorry, please jump Camp. Oh actually along the lines of
like the younger younger generational thing.
One thing I really love in the story is the way they tell this
theme of like expectation vs reality.
Through the lens of like younger.
Selves meeting old ourselves. this was so clever and I thought
was very clever use of time travel to like tell these kind
of characters stories like I love that.
It's a common thing for every single character in this story.
And it's so interesting to see us.
I'm glad you asked that because like, some people like they show
on the show react differently to seeing their future selves than
others like Tiffany's like, yeah, this makes sense.
This is cool. Aaron's like what the fuck
happened to me cages? Like, how did this happen?
Mac. It's this horrible.
Like so like learning about your future has to be like the
weirdest thing ever. And it's like I feel like you
wouldn't know how you'd react to it and it's a cool thing to
explore like a narrative. Plea.
Because like again the expectation as a kid was like,
oh my life's going to be great and look like this and then when
you see it you're like really this is reality.
I feel like part of myself and be like really proud of myself
and the other part is like we're still doing with right?
Exactly. Like it's just it's never going
to be what you expect, you know that age.
I'm like still going through some of the stuff that I went
through then and I'm just like when is it ever going to be
over? Yeah, totally and so it would
depend on like how young are you when you meet your older self?
How old are you as your older self?
And like it could. So if that scenario, there's
infinite possibilities. So it's a very fun writing
scheme. And last piece I want to talk
about is the representation of girls becoming women and so the
last thing I want to talk about before we wrap this all up is
the period scene because is there anything more real as a
woman than like getting your first period in the middle of
the time War? It's so fucking real and this.
Okay, so this is a thing they talked about in the comics but
it happens completely differently so it actually
happens. KJ when her Mac or like alone in
the prehistoric time versus like this scene, they devised for the
show which I fucking love and I think this is way better.
So it happens to Aaron and all four of them are together and
they have to navigate this by themselves and clearly nobody
has any knowledge of what to do. Like, there's clearly.
No sex ed happening in any of these schools.
Nobody has talked about this at home and they're just trying to
navigate it together. And it's just, I've never seen
anything like this either, and it's like it's a good thing.
It's like, Talk about this, make it normal.
And it's so, like, it's funny like picked Aaron though.
I don't know why they pick Aaron.
I think Aaron was a great choice because she's kind of feel like
personality why she's kind of in the middle.
Where's like because like how does it play out like Tiffany's?
The know-it-all who's like, let's just read the instructions
versus MAC. Who's like?
Yeah, I know what I'm talking about and has no idea what she's
talking about and kg who's just like what the fuck is happening?
How'd he get it out? How do you get it?
It out like but like everything that happens in the scene is so
real and funny. And so I just I love it.
Whoever came up with this kudos to you, it's an amazing fucking
scene. I just, I love it.
I have the opposite. I was like I mean like I get why
it's a great saying but I was like I don't I don't want it can
we not? I love it.
So the theme of these four episodes is Brie has the
opposite opinion and it's not about the heck that it's the
period. It's the the fact that I'm like
my Tiffany brain comes out microcrystalline chance.
I figured. Well let's talk about Nobody
knows what they're talking about at one point.
They're just like horses can cause periods.
And Tiffany's like, yeah, that's true.
I'd like because like she's trying to be the know-it-all and
feel like nobody knows what's going on.
Because her age, I knew what was going on Italy.
Y'all, it's so moaning. Well, I don't think there was
sex ed at all in these schools. I didn't have sex at a 12.
I know there are also 12. What would Age look?
Great is 12. Well, it's 1989 ig-88, idiot.
Yeah, I'm really things. Weren't was, was sex, ed allowed
in American schools at that time.
I thought that was newer. Hmm, I might be wrong.
I have no, I had sex ed in. I had that as a component of a
health class. Yeah, yeah.
I had it in elementary school. That's good.
Good. We should be having this
conversation. Is they didn't teach you dumb
stuff, right. Exactly.
Which like horses can cause periods.
And like, but again like they're just they can't that it's just
hilarious. They just they don't nobody
knows what's going on and poor and it's happening to poor Erin.
And she's like, it's timely saying that my that my feelings
of you point is not like not dumb, but like Like I get that.
It's just my irrational, feelings towards the scene where
I'm like, okay. Like I told you yesterday, I
just could have done without it personally.
Why wasn't? It was kind of just random.
I don't know, I just felt like it.
Like I feel like we need to have those conversations but I just
didn't like the scene. I just finished.
It would have been better. Yeah, in general, please give us
more scenes of like women being women like, yeah.
This kind of stuff should be shown.
Like it should be normal. He's likely.
I appreciate that about it a lot and it's like this weird
scenario where they have to bond over it all.
Also. But yeah, that was neat like
it's bonding was cool. Exactly.
I enjoy it and they didn't make
it gross or like it could have been gross and they did it.
They just Handle it in a very kid-friendly way which I liked
what I do like is when Max gets the tampon shoved in her nose
later. I also love that.
I enjoy that chefs. Gets to that.
I love when she says, I'll just get you a diaper.
Yeah, yeah, the end of it. Yes, I'm just getting you the
man. I think.
Okay, so a my brain. It's like, I like that the scene
happened. I just don't want to watch it if
that makes sense. That's fair, it's okay, it's
okay. Alright, thank you for sharing.
I'm sure there are some people who are uncomfortable, didn't
like it either in this, like I said, it's not about the period
thing because I think that we should absolutely talk about it
and that it's dumb that people I do that at work to my boss when,
when he makes misogynistic jokes, be not because he only
makes them because he knows that it will mess with me, of course,
and actually believe, like, I believe in the joke but I'm like
that was not necessary. So I'm going to do something
that's not Necessary to you and that's me talking about my
period in detail bitch beautiful.
I love that. Normalize it through, pensions
normalize it through Vengeance that and that's one of our
friends and that's a fan out and this is a great segue not at all
into. What were your overall likes and
dislikes for the episode for this.
Not episode for this whole palette paper, girls overall
likes and dislikes and Lauren all Tiffany with younger
Tiffany. Oh yes.
I love Lauren. I could I like the metaphor of
the time travel thing in the The Meta moment of it.
I just thought that it was sloppy personally and because of
reasons Like having to do so much and so little.
Yeah. Hi, I'm totally most of this
Like 700-page Comics was done an eight-episode.
Yeah, it's insane. It is insane.
The, what they fit in but it just didn't work for me.
Like, okay, it didn't capture me to the point where I was
watching it. I wanted to watch episode after
episode after episode, I had to break them up because we're
doing it for the podcast. And then I had to like sit down
and make myself Watch the episodes.
And then there were Parts. I really liked and parts.
I was just like Yeah, and if I have to freaking grandfather,
was the one thing I didn't like, every time he showed up in the
comics, I was like, oh, I know, I hate him in the comics.
He's so annoying no matter what. But yeah, like, I get where I
get sort of why you're here. I get why you're here.
But you're just so fucking annoying.
Yeah, I totally agree with that and I agree with all of your
likes. I think I like using the time
travel as a way to tell the stories between the characters
like younger selves old ourselves.
I really enjoy that. I thought it was very allowed
for clever storytelling. That's the thing.
I love the most KJ and particular all the Lauren stuff.
The thing I dislike Is Larry with you there.
I don't really like there either.
I don't like him and he, I have okay.
I don't understand what the hell happens with Larry, having read
the comic books because it was Larry in the comics books.
No, he's a new character. This is why I'm confused because
Larry the premise at the end is like, Hey, we're trapped in a
Time Loop. The events of the past or
triggering. What's the future is?
Triggering the past? Explain to me how we watch
Larry. Died in 2019.
Then we go to 1999 and he dies again.
How the fuck did that happen? I don't understand that.
Then how do we have Larry in 2019?
Giving them a robot if he dies in 1999.
It just bothers me what the fuck happened there, because in the
comics, they have like genetic duplicates that are happening.
But like Larry, admits that like when they meet him in 1999.
He's like, I just joined this and he's not from the future
like he's from this timeline. So I don't understand what that
was about in the show. So I don't like him because he
what the hell is happening there?
And then I have a question from Julie who never has questioned,
my wife who never has questions about television, anything that
I I watch. Hello, Julie.
Okay, she has a question because I made her watch some of us.
And then she was like, I don't want to watch this anymore
because she doesn't like sci-fi shit.
But anyway, she was like, okay? So in Larry's farm when were
there in 2019 The cars are driving up the driveway, and
when they approached the farm, he's got the spikes, right?
That stopped the cars and Julie's like, why the fuck
aren't those further up? The driveway, his driveway is
like two miles but he puts it right by the house and she's
like, why is that further down that?
They have to walk farther. Why would that's not an
effective defense mechanism and things Larry's dumb?
So and also, I think the what do you needed to do instead?
Ted was to make several like, what the hell.
Yeah, exactly very ineffective. He's you go on the grass and go
around it. If they know if they know it's
there, it's almost there but also get like what?
That was just, you see it? That was donated.
Multiple. No.
No, no because nothing to driving right before your drive.
Yeah, motion sensored. Yeah.
You know, put some multiple times but it's just, it's a lot.
Larry is dumb is on thing. That bothers me.
He's an adult. I do feel bad for Larry when
Aaron's beat him up what's-her-face.
Oh Fuck his like girlfriend, kind of that he gets we have to.
Yeah. Yeah, and didn't care about
that. I didn't either.
That's awesome. Alright, so now that we've gone
through this as a whole, for those of us that.
So if you've made it this far into the episodes, thank you.
If you've listened to us before typically at the end of our
episodes, we would do a big which energy board thing.
But we're not doing that anymore because we are no longer big
which energy. So instead of retiring that
entirely we're converting our new rating system to the, how
much would you hydrate for? Jesus question.
And so, this is a rating scale where we essentially will say,
on a scale of 1 to 10, how much would we hydrate?
How many cups of water would be hydrate from lesbian Jesus?
So, how gay was this episode, in our opinion?
Who wants to go first? I would have.
Two Peach Snapple 's for this episode.
I thought we were going with the numbers.
Yeah. One out of ten to so 22-piece
Snapples. Okay, fine.
I gave it 4 p. H tuples.
Okay. Feel like the whole show overall
force. Difficult.
Because I really love this. Like, are we saying like how gay
it was or how we felt about it? That's basically what we're
saying with this hydration scale.
That's yeah, how much did you like it?
That's okay. Alright.
Okay. I'll give it a 7 me too.
Here's why I give it five glasses of water for lesbian
Jesus, because of Lauren, like Lauren herself.
Just gets five glasses, like everything about her speech.
Her existence, she just gets five glasses of water for me and
then the rest of it is really because I love the way they KJ
storyline is like basically the other two because we KJ
storyline. She's yeah, well yes, I think
her story line was told so Dudley well and we it just
that's what really struck me about this piece of media was
just, I've never seen a queer storyline presented like that
before in a way that felt so organic and real and naturally
paste and just and the show itself it just it wasn't
centered around homophobia or like the conflict of the show
wasn't about being gay and like the out you know the backlash of
kjb. Being gay.
It was just her processing it and then realizing it.
And I've never seen that story ever, really, told like this
before, and just I thought it was a unique.
So it gets extra points just for being unique, but like the
Lauren stuff. Hi.
Well, that's basically the end of the episode.
So after timing Caitlin, I'd like to point out that I gave it
for peach topples, out of 10, because of Lauren and KJ, that's
yeah. Basically, I'm just like, I love
that movie scene and the scene in the bedroom so much that I
was like, I couldn't get any lower but I couldn't give it any
higher because it's not enough gay.
Yes, agreed yeah. Yep.
We're on the same pot, Snapples taken away for things.
Totally, was it Larry one of the things that it got Snapples
taken away? Could you tell Bree obviously,
and father grandfather, some things that Mack did.
Little area rant about. Yeah, probably Aaron and Lord of
Mighty Sea. It would have been more if if
they had enough. I'm just going to, I'm just
going to stop there. There were a lot of annoying
bits but those gay seems really just won my heart over just like
in my it for me it's like that's not enough for me.
Like I need to enjoy the show as a whole and that wasn't there
for me personal. See I don't know II like I'm
fine with kids and I'm that person though that watches only
the gay parts of shows. I tried to do that but then like
I don't care because I don't know, the characters know I care
because it's gay and I love gayness.
So if you're on the fence about it, for some reason, you haven't
watched paper girls, if you made it through all of this, like a
buddy, the gay stuff is very is top tier was what we're saying.
The cage a case do is top tier, but if you're any sci-fi, and
comics and stuff, check out the rest of it.
Yeah, I like sci-fi in comics, but it just wasn't my thing.
You know, I love It's totally fine.
Jody, like it's like Person of Interest didn't care about the
rest of the show. Only watch the gay Parts.
Enjoy those same they were top-tier.
Sam couldn't tell you anything about that show other than the
shoot other than the shoot stuff.
That's yep. Yep.
Alright and so with that that's been paper girls.
Everybody don't worry about a Caitlyn.
We're gonna sign off in a minute, but Caitlyn would you
like to announce what our next topic is going to be?
Am I capable of? Talking.
I hope so. Yes, you are your topic?
We Believe idiot. Okay, let me go through the
whole episode guys. Yay!
Oh my gosh! It's okay, we're gonna go with
number 12 but we got it, okay? So, You have heard brain,
theorists say that they're tired of the same coming out
storylines. But I also feel like they're
very important and like there's some that are very well done.
So my next topic, my first, the next episode is going to be all
about coming out and the storylines and the
representation how it makes you feel.
Whew, we made it guys. Thank you for sticking with us.
We hope you enjoyed and we will see you next time for are coming
out discussion. And with that we've been big gay
energy, if you liked this episode check out all of our
other episodes on whatever you're using to listen right
now. And please subscribe.
And like, all the things if you happen to be listening on Apple,
we'd really appreciate it. If you could leave us a review,
no matter how brief this is, what Apple uses in their
algorithm to help us gain a wider audience.
So please please please help us out.
Yes, and please feel free to reach out to us.
We'd love to hear from you about everything and anything.
And if we like it, we'll probably give you a shout out on
the air. You can find us at all the
things, Twitter at Big Gay, energy, pod Tumblr, big gay
energy, pod, Instagram, big gay, energy pod, or you can email us
at Big Gay energy pot at gmail.com until next time, stay
safe and hydrate for lesbian. Jesus.