Hello, and welcome to Big Gay Energy.
I'm Bree. I'm Theora.
And I'm Caitlin. Come along with us while we dive
into the fun and nuances of queer media.
Representation matters, and we're here to talk about it.
Cheers, queers. That's on the big gay agenda
today, Caitlin. We are continuing our heart.
Stop our discussion. We sure.
Are so we're talking about or starting with season one episode
3 KISS, and there's two major kiss scenes we're going to talk
about. Before we dive into that fun
stuff, I want to talk really quick about how this episode
opens because it's amazing. So it opens with poor Nick
trying to figure shit out because Nick at this point is
like I don't know who I even am anymore.
Yes. And so in the modern era, how do
you figure out who you are? You take Buzzfeed's quizzes and
do a bunch of research. So Nick does a bunch of research
until, like, what is homosexuality?
And then he takes a quiz and finds out he is 62% homosexual,
which is objectively funny when you don't know what's going on.
But poor Nick. I feel so bad for him because
like he gets his results because he's like just I want to figure
out what is going on with me. I guess it's quiz and it's like
you're kind of gay but not entirely gay And a little single
tear comes out of his eye because he's just so frustrated
and just wants answers and can't find anything that fits how he
feels. Which has got to be like the
which is which is awful. Like it's just awful to be like
I don't know what's going on with me and I can't even find
the answers on the Internet, which is supposed to have all
the answers. Fuck you quiz.
It just makes a funny meme, which is why I laugh at it.
From the way that 62 percent, it's just it's really relatable.
I asked Theora if she took a quiz and she said they didn't
exist. No, So I did.
You did? Yeah, I did.
Was it a BuzzFeed quiz? I have no idea.
I think I took like at least five.
There are quizzes, plural out there.
People. Oh my God, there's so many.
You're just wondering. And basically if you are looking
for it, the answer is yes, that's that's also what I saw
when you look it up like that's there's like a Reddit thing like
if you have to research. It right, You're not a straight
person, but it doesn't tell. But Nick gets that percentage
that isn't 100%. He doesn't know what to do with
that because like you know when you grow up in a system that
enforces binaries, you know, like male or female, you're cool
or not cool, Like things that are very like black and white.
Nick doesn't know what to do with that, like.
Percentage that isn't 100%. He's like, wow, this can't even
give me like a straight answer Hydrate for that pun.
I even like puns. I do.
So like for Nick it's really sad because he like he he when
you're when you're grow up in like a binary system where you
don't know that things outside of those boxes exist like.
Nick at this point can't even imagine like anything else,
which is so it's so sad. It just makes him more
frustrated, just confused. While he's very he's, he's
trying so hard to figure himself out, He just can't those
quizzes. Don't help?
Well, of course that they're not real.
Like they're made by just randos on the Internet or buzzfeeding
people trying to make money. They're not scientific.
They're not from, like, queer universities, you know?
I I mean, I personally feel like when you're taking those
quizzes, there's like internalize.
I hope I'm not. Yeah, so like maybe that skews
your how you're answering because I feel like if you're
fully comfortable with it, you're not like caring, you're
like ohh it is what it is from my experience.
Like I relate to Nick in this. Instance.
Yeah, totally, totally. It just it sucks when you can't
find the answers you want. So I I feel for Nick here and
just the the the tear. Just see how frustrated he is.
It's heartbreaking. Anything else about the quiz?
I wanna know the science behind it and like how it came up with
62%. That's it.
Yeah, I wanna know how it works. We'll look into it.
If anybody knows that comment below.
All right. So the crux of this episode is
that Harry. Harry.
Remember him? White guy.
Super Super Rich White. Guy plays, plays the part of
like bully of the school rugby guy.
Yeah, it's his Sweet 16. So he's like, Nick, you go out
to come to my birthday because you're cool and I'm cool and
it's like, sure, whatever. And Harry's like bring cool
people and imaging over here is this and she's like, can I come?
I'm cool people. So Nick was like, sure brings
imaging and then we get a little heart from her which is poor
girl. And then he goes and invites
Charlie on the side. So the big thing is, Charlie's
coming to this Sweet 16 for this douchebag guy because Nick
invited him. But Harry's wealthier than the
Queen of England, apparently, and so rents out an entire hotel
somehow. Yeah, and has like basically the
entire school. That's cool come both schools,
grown boy school, come to this freaking party.
So that's the big thing, is this party.
And so there is one kiss. That happens at the party, but
before we get to the kiss of the party, we have to talk about who
kisses at the party. So Nick runs into, there's Tara
and Darcy. There's two kisses at the party.
Yeah. OK.
Yeah. But the first one's the girls.
Yes. Yeah.
So the girls are there. Tara and Darcy.
And so Tara and Darcy, Tara and Nick clear the air.
Because this is the whole the mystery of the last episode.
Does Tara like Nick? The boys are still think Nick
likes her. And so they're like, Nick, Go
get her. She's gonna be at the party.
And he's like. It's been three years.
Get over yourselves. So he talks to the tar and he's
like, listen, I don't know why everybody's pushing us together.
We were 13. This is stupid.
And so she's like, yeah, it's cool, I'm a lesbian anyway, and
poor Nick and this conversation is so cute because Nick's like.
Well, you know, you probably shouldn't tell people that if
it's not true. Like just to get people to leave
us alone. She's like, no, it's true.
See that idiot over there? That's my girlfriend.
Oh. Darcy and she's like throwing
food in the air and trying to catch it, but like and showing
off for a bunch of people. But, but Nick does that later.
Yeah, I know. Yeah, he has Darcy tendencies,
but no one is Darcy except Darcy.
No one could be Darcy. No.
And so, but they have a really cute.
Conversation. Because at this point Nick is
like, oh, well, I have a gay friend.
I have Charlie. Like, that's really cool.
Like, you know, and they talk and and Tara like, confesses to
him that, like, you know, we're not, He's like, are you guys
out? I think he asked.
And she's like, well, no, we don't.
Like Tars is basically like, I don't want this big public
announcement. Like, I just want to be me.
But me and me and Darcy have been talking about like, just
like being ourselves in public basically, versus like
announcing it to the world. So I wanted to see what you
thought about that because like traditionally with like coming
out, it's kind of like you have to then go through the process
like telling everybody and it's like it is feels like you are
doing a PSA like I'm gay, like you have to go announce it to so
many people versus TARS. Like I don't want to do that.
I just want to like exist and people will see it and figure it
out. Yeah, what?
Do you think about that? I don't know.
I feel like it's the it's a hard way just because it's all you're
always gonna get the stairs then and it's just it's like
basically wanting people to. I mean, it's like she doesn't
care if people find out, but like that's the way that people
are going to look at you more and gossip more.
Yeah, I feel like that's exactly what ends up happening to her.
Yeah, like you need to be able to control the narrative, which
is why I think so many celebrities post themselves, so
the narratives isn't getting out of hand.
Right. But I understand her sentiment
of, like, why is it my responsibility to tell the world
when when, like, straight people can just exist and they don't
have to do this? Why can't I just do that?
It's kind of what she's saying. So, like, get her.
I get her point here. She does end up posting on
social media and I wonder if that is her trying to be like OK
this is what it is when cuz everybody is already making a
big deal out of things right? Exactly.
That's like the post damage control, yeah.
But like, I understand, I understand her sentiment cuz
like, and then cuz Nick expresses this same kind of like
feeling about the coming out stuff that Tara does.
So I think it's interesting they're having the conversation
together. Cuz he says something similar to
he's like, I don't want to like, do this big announcement thing.
You know, I just want to be mean, like tell people who
matter and things like that, which is really cute that he's,
he comes to terms with later. So I found that really
interesting. It's not something like I've
seen really in media where they have these conversations between
like young queer characters. It's usually like the coming out
story or like Charlie's narrative where they're just
outed against their will and now they're dealing with it.
It's not that Charlie was insecure about his sexuality.
He's like, but like he was denied the opportunity to like.
Have his own narrative because he was outed, you know, versus
tar. He's like, I don't want to have
the narrative at all. I just want to exist.
So, like, I get, I do understand that sentiment.
Like it is fucked up, that like not straight people have to like
announce themselves versus like just existing freely.
And even the fact that you even have to think about that sucks.
It's like this extra mental toll, you know?
So I totally get where she's coming from, but they are at the
point where tar was like. Darcy's out, basically.
And TARS like, well, I kind of just want to.
We were talking more about just like being out in public,
basically not announcing it, but just like doing stuff.
And so then then in this episode, we get a public kiss
between the two of them and it's the cutest thing ever.
It's in the middle of the dance floor with all the colors of the
rainbow happening and like Nick is looking for Charlie.
Oh, wait, actually, hold on. I I can't.
Anyway, it's fine. We'll get through this first.
Yeah, it's it was about the other scene, but we're here now.
Next week for Charlie and he weaves through the He actually
runs into imaging and Gene's like, let's dance with me, He's
like, you're great and all, but I gotta go.
And he leaves. And as he's weaving through the
crowd, he finds Darcy and Tar and they're like dancing in
front of like the main light fixture.
That's like going out into the dance floor, because of course
they. Are, because of course they are.
And the music's blaring and everybody else is.
No one's paying attention to them.
They're just doing their thing and they just learn like, fuck
it. Let's kiss and they kiss a few
times and the rainbows that happen with the lights that are
present and the ones that they add later.
It's just the fucking cutest thing ever.
It is, It is give an Oscar or an Emmy to whoever directed that
scene. It's so cute.
And then they do their like individual like shots when
they're like dancing with each other and just the just the pure
joy in the scene. It just gets me because they're
just beating themselves. And like, they kiss and like
nothing bad happens and they're just like, yay, like we can just
be ourselves. And Nick is watching this.
And for him, like he's like, I'm really happy for them.
And then he's also like, that could be me, yeah.
So it's like a visibility and representation of why that
matters, because it gives Nick the courage to like, go after
Charlie right after the scene when he's watching it.
The lights flashing on his face is the bisexual colors.
Oh. Yes, and in the prior scene,
which is why I was interrupting myself, when they're having the
conversation, him and Tara about like, oh, you're a lesbian, oh,
you want to come out? Things like that.
Tara and Darcy are framed in the lesbian colors, and when you
shoot back at Nick, the bisexual colors are framing him.
Oh, interesting. And when Nick is looking for
Charlie throughout the party, he's on like the upper deck,
looking down. He's bathed in the bisexual
colors. Yeah, like multiple times
throughout that. But when they were talking, you
like lesbian colors, Bisexual colors, Yeah, they they like to
make sure the flag colors. Oh yeah.
They're like, in case you were confused, like they're very
obvious with the colors, That's why.
Yeah, who's most likely pansexual.
I don't know. I don't know cuz like there is a
scene. I don't think it's this one.
I think it was with Charlie and it's.
Charlie and Nick and they get the pansexual colors when I'm so
confused by that. But yeah, cuz they're very
deliberate about the colors, especially in this dancing.
It's just gonna happen. It's just gonna happen.
Caitlin, I'm sorry, but yeah. Sorry, alright anything below
like 42 I'll try to cut out. Alright, do you guys alright?
Do you have anything to add? I have stuff in the scene.
It's Caitlin's lighting corner. Yeah, let me find it.
I'm gonna hydrate for all the GSI for that scene though,
'cause that's one of my favorite scenes in the entire show.
I just love all the gayness. And the colors and just the joy
that is in that scene is so overwhelming.
I tear up every time I watch it, just them and being happy and
just Nick his face breaks me every time.
Like Kit is such an amazing actor, he breaks me every time,
which is how like. It's like a puppy dog.
He's like, yeah, my favorite people and it's just.
Cute. Oh my God, He you could tell
that he wants that. Yes, like you.
Like you just feel it wafting off of him.
He's like, that could be me and Charlie.
It's just so cute. Can't stand it.
This fucking show is amazing. It's.
Very cute. It's so cute.
Very Caitlyn. What you got So for the birthday
party they originally wanted to use the windows for and put
light up there to do like a moonlight effect, but they
weren't allowed to film there at night.
So it's actually in the daytime that they film there and they
use blackout curtains. Ohh interesting.
And they had to figure out how to light it to look like there
was some light outside. But they had curtains so.
Lighting is very, very technical and I struggle with it.
It's you need to be really, really good at it.
That's interesting because later when we get to the Charlie and
Nick kiss, like because all the curtains are closed in this
whole building if you pay attention.
And so when they're alone in their room, it they have like a
orange glow behind that window to make it look like sunsets
outside. That's crazy that they added
that specifically. Yeah, with blackout curtains.
Very cool. The lighting in the scene is
very fun. Like, clearly they had a lot of
fun with this one. Everything in this hotel is
really cool. See, The thing is, I'm thinking
some crew members had to have hated it.
Oh, I'm. Sure, because it's so precise
and stuff, but like the effect is is gorgeous.
What they did, what they pulled off something else.
No, you have to. We have to get to the other kiss
and then the scene after and then I'll tell you about it.
Yeah, that's well, because of so many people there and having to
figure out the lighting, they had to like deliberately.
So, like the cameras were more limited there.
The cast was more. They like to make sure that the
cast can move around and do and be free, which is why they have
the study Cam most of the time. Oh, that makes sense.
But this one, they had to hit the mark, so it was more limited
for them. And they played the song that
was actually playing there because Tar and Darcy had a kiss
right on. Yeah.
Is perfect. Yeah.
And I think one of the one of the crew members that was like
one of the main crew members started tearing up.
I think it's. No, they like nail it.
It's yeah, it's so cute. I was wondering too, because
there's no talking at all that happens, Which also makes it OK.
Here's something I fucking hate about party scenes.
Maybe you can speak more about this, but usually that.
I assume there's no actual music playing.
And people have to pretend they're dancing.
And so you can hear people talking, which makes sense
because we're trying to listen to conversations.
But the conversations are all clearly not realistic for people
at a party because they'll be talking at our level and not
screaming over the music. Yeah.
And so I'm like, what is this party?
Because these other people are like, so, like, I like that they
didn't. They did it this way because it
feels more real. We're like the two of them,
after they kiss, they don't say stuff to each other.
They just have this like Oh my God, like mouthing that they do.
Because like in real life, the music will be blaring because
they're by the speed those two are by the speaker.
Yeah. So like there's no way they'd be
able to talk to each other. And Nick doesn't say anything.
He just look. So I felt more real for like a
party scene for me. And I love that they actually
played the music because damn, they nailed it though, I love it
even more. So they'll probably if they pick
the music beforehand. Yeah, OK, that's a good point
too. Because what if they're like,
damn, we don't got the rights? That'd be awkward, though.
They would probably play some sort of music and then another
take they'll cut it and then just have the a beat and it's
like a very it's a base kind of and it's just to keep time.
So yeah, they can. Dance, I guess, and I just have
the same rhythm of it. Because otherwise it just looks
like fish out of water who are all doing different things.
There is one party scene for some like old movie where
clearly that wasn't happening and somebody pointed it out in
like some video and they're like, look at how crazy this
scene really is. Nobody is on the same beat.
Like obviously there was no music playing when they felt
this. Everybody is doing some other
different dance move. So it looks really bad, but it
was like the 50s. So nobody cared.
But like, yeah, yeah. So that's smart having at least
a beat that makes. Sense.
That's fine. No, thank you.
I always wondered that about party scenes because sometimes
they just feel super unrealistic when there's dialogue.
This one felt so real for a lot of reasons.
I love it. OK.
Thank you, Caitlin. Group scenes are just difficult.
I can only imagine. Oh my God.
Yeah. When we get to the rise of the
Pink Lady as well, I have questions about their Their
group scenes are massive, yeah. I'll tell you.
So yeah, I have questions, but let's get it finished.
Hard stuff that that show is gonna be my like special.
I can't wait and there's so much cool stuff in there but ohh damn
alright but this show so great alright.
Anything else about the the lesbian kiss before we get to
the One? I thought I had more, but it's
just like more in this episode. Alright, cool.
So let's move over to Nick and Charlie's first kiss.
OK, OK, so. First of all, this was the cute
the. So it's just the way that they
slow burn. Like not slow burn but really
like let these two have a slow natural feeling.
Romance is the best. It doesn't go zero to 100 and
they go through all the processing steps and these two
communicate with each other so well.
It's insane and I love it. So I love that they spent time
here and let them like act it out and like go through all the
steps of just. Charlie being like, wait, you
have a crush and it's well, what she like and Nick's like, why
would you assume it's a she? It's the obvious trying to
figure out yes, because poor. Charlie has been like, I don't
know, he flirts with me. Is he straight?
I don't think he's straight. He hugged me for 10 seconds.
That's really weird. He's like hot straight guy
hugged me for 10 seconds. What does it mean when a
straight dude hugs you for 10? What does that mean?
Yeah, so like Nick doesn't act like your typical straight guy
and so he lets like he. He keeps giving Nick an out
because I think he Charlie's also like, so traumatized by
fucking Ben that he's like, I don't want to push him and make
him regret it because Ben always seemed to regret it and like,
why can't I just find somebody who likes me for me?
And so he keeps giving Nick out by asking him questions where,
like, Nick would have to answer until finally he's, like,
leading him. He's like, would you kiss a boy?
Would you kiss this boy? Would you want to kiss me?
And then so finally Nick's like, yes.
And, like, actually says it. And then Charles, like, OK, this
is real and they just let them kiss.
And it's just, I like that they do the tight shots with them.
And again, it's like the handheld Cam.
So it feels very much like you're in that moment moving
with them and it's just adorable.
And they didn't get interrupted during.
This so freaking, so shocked. They're not lesbians.
I think it's a lesbian thing getting interrupted.
I think it's a lesbian thing. I'm sorry, we're more skewed
towards that media. We know what we know.
We know, we know, they do get interrupted in a sense, but
their kisses don't get interrupted.
They get interrupted by the rugby guys looking for Nick.
Before we go there, I just want to say that when they first go
into this room like Charlie makes.
A comment that they just have this like big empty room for
nothing and Nick responds with yeah, it's for Harry to cry when
his parents buy him the wrong color.
Lamborghini. It's just it makes me laugh so
low. I love it.
Harry is Harry. I don't think Harry's as bad of
a person as he's painted out to be either, but I think he's
playing. He's doing his best to play the
part of I'm the tough guy at school, but we'll get into that
later because of the way when his.
I think it's more apparent to me with his interactions with Tao
and also the way that when Nick stands up to him, he's always
like, it's like he wants to be Nick's friends, but he's always,
he's always surrounded by like 10 other guys and he's like, I
have to perform for these guys. Yeah.
So anyway, because it's Harry's
birthday. And like Nick, I think he
generally wants to be Nick's friend.
So that's why he keeps hunting Nick down.
And he's like, where'd you go? Where did you go?
I have, like he's like surrounded by 20 people.
Why does he care where Nick is? But he's always like, where are
you? But you have to be my friend.
Like, anyway, so Harry is like, where's Nick?
And, like, they hear this and Nick immediately gets up and
goes after the rugby guys to talk to them and leaves Charlie
by himself. And Charlie I think has like,
Ben flashbacks. He's like, oh, he kissed me and
now he's leaving. He doesn't really like me.
He's like, he only he did this because they forced him to and
he like, leaves. It calls his dad and like cries
in the car, which is super, super heartbreaking.
He's just traumatized. But I don't think Nick left
because he was ashamed of anything.
I think in my brain that Nick left because he's like, oh shit,
these are the guys that are they're gonna bully Charlie and
I don't want them to bully Charlie, so I'm gonna get rid of
them. I think that's what he was
doing. My tip would be a talk to the
person before you just leave. Just be.
Like I will be right back. This is not about you.
Yeah, though that would have been helpful.
Let me take care of this was his first time in this position and
I think he was so like hormonal from kissing Charlie and you
know like overwhelmed. That's like I can't make words
right now Fuck. And that's why he's like shit
that he just goes so and Nick ultimately is just confused like
even this conversation like he was just like see you can
clearly see by his answers he's still figuring shit out.
It's not there. None of those answers were no.
They were just like I don't. I don't know.
I don't know, maybe. Maybe like so.
Anyway, he's just confused and the episode ends like with Nick
showing up in the rain, which romantic to Charlie's house
because he's like, I want to sort this out when you do it in
person, which is good boyfriend behavior I assume.
I need to just but I have lighting stuff if you want do
it. OK, anything else for this
episode? It is your time to shine.
Yes, I am slowly shining in, but I don't.
I will adjust myself again in a second.
If you noticed that there is the light, it is shiny and bright
even though there's a darker room.
But when words brain when Nick is with Charlie, however, when
he goes to run. With Harry Boys, it's very mono,
monotone, monochromatic answer you.
Yes. And there's no brightness.
So there's no, it's, I believe his color is blue, yeah.
And Charlie's color is yellow. Yeah, you're right.
Yes. So theory.
Yeah, that makes sense. Whenever it's Ben or anybody
else, it's very one color darker.
Not bright at all. Yeah, it's like the world is
boring and then when it's Nick and Charlie, the world pops.
Even. But it's like anything that's
happy going, Yeah, that is true. Yeah.
So basically they use darkness and it's OK and monochromatic to
symbolize bad things going on. Yeah, versus like happy, hopeful
stuff. Yes, I love it.
I think that's all I have. That was the main thing alright.
Anything else for episode 3? Kiss for Move on 4.
No alright, episode 4 is secret and so this episode picks up
directly from episode 3. So Nick is out in the rain and
Charlie's like, what the fuck? Did you not even grab a jacket?
And it's like, oh, I just wanted to talk to you in person.
I just ran over here. He's like, get inside and they
go to Charlie's room and Charlie, like, once they're
behind closed doors, he immediately starts apologizing
to Nick because like he's word vomiting his trauma, basically.
Because, like, this would be his reaction from Ben.
Like if Ben did anything, Charlie would be like, I'm
sorry, like this is all my fault, that you're upset.
But Nick basically stops him by kissing him.
And then he's like, he says because like Charlie says, the
line, the most heartbreaking line for me is I don't want to
lose you because I did something stupid, because Charlie feels
like I kissed you now I ruined our friendship.
And like, you're important to me just period.
Not just because I think you're pretty and it's so sad And so
like Nick's like, no and Nick kiss kisses him and then he
apologizes for running away because he had a full on proper
gay crisis, which is one of my favorite lines for Nick.
And I want to use that in real life.
And this scene, I just want to highlight this scene because I
think it's really, really important.
And this is kind of like the tipping point from for their
relationship or at least solidifying the trust between
them. Because in this conversation,
like, Nick really expresses just like, how confused he is.
Because at this point he's been like dealing with us by himself,
like taking quizzes and like trying to like, figure shit out.
But it's like, it's hard to do it on your own.
Like sometimes it's more helpful to talk it through with somebody
else. And especially Charlie, who kind
of knows how to navigate this stuff as somebody who's gone
through the questioning phase, is out and has been living like
this. So he tells him he's like, I'm
just, I'm just confused. I kissed you and I was just, I
was just very confused. I don't know what to do.
And so in the scene, Charlie really gives him just like
unconditional, like, I'm here for you.
Like, I'm not going to push you one way or the other.
You need to figure your shit out.
And like, he doesn't, like, push Nick into a box.
He just lets him be and lets him figure his stuff out.
And so it's like a moment for Nick of like, I I'm safe with
you, kind of. Which is huge.
Like in relationships, that's so huge.
You know, he knows he's safe here.
And so they have, like, many cute hugs that are very, very
cute and sweet in this scene. But this is a really difficult
position to be in. And this is something I feel
like is common with, like, queer relationships, especially like
baby ones. Like when you're first figuring
your shit out. Not necessarily an age where,
like, you're figuring your shit out and the person you're
figuring your shit out with is the person you have a feelings
for. And so it puts both of them in
awkward positions. Because it's like, I really need
a friend who understands me right now and I need this to
slow down so I can figure my shit out.
But also like, we have something going on that's more.
And so it's just it's hard and I feel like it's common in queer
relationships. Yeah, because when you're.
I apologize to the audio people. I am adjusting myself because we
are sitting on a weird thing. We are.
When you're just coming out, I feel like you most likely don't
have them any clear friends. Yeah, so you are gonna rely on
them. And most times I feel like they
won't know that you have a crush on them.
But this this case is different. Yeah, this case it's the crush
happened 1st and then I was like, I need to figure my shit
out. Yes.
Yeah. So like in this moment, Nick
really needed a friend and Charlie is being like the best
friend possible. And it's a very sweet, I think
it's a big, like big moment for the two of them.
And so ultimately that conversation ends with them
deciding to like keep seeing each other like in secret, hence
the title, so that Nick can process all the Charlie under.
I think Charlie understands Nick's point of view more than
anybody. Not because he's gay, but
because he's like I never got the chance to do this.
I was this opportunity of like figuring my shit out.
Controlling my narrative was denied to me because Charlie was
outed. So Charlie's not the type of
person who would ever out another person.
He even says that with Ben later.
He's like, I would never do that to you, even though you would do
it to me if the the roles were reversed.
So he's not going to do that to Nick at all.
So. And it's hard for Charlie
because he's like, I want a boyfriend who is out with me who
like, it's not ashamed of me, basically.
Yeah. And so he thought that's what
was going on with Nick in the other episode.
But I think now he's much more like, OK, and I understand what
this is like, take your time. If you're questioning stuff, you
should figure it out on your own time.
Not because I I want a boyfriend.
Like you shouldn't rush herself to like.
Be out because I'm out kind of thing.
Which is really nice, because yeah.
I feel like if when he went through all that shit with Ben
that you'd be more like, oh, I can't do that again, right.
That's what I was, honestly, that's what I was really
expecting Charlie to do. Because I've seen this in other
media and it's like, it's understandable, you know, when
you're out and you're like, I don't want to be a secret.
I'm past that point in my life where I'm like having closeted
relationships and stuff like that.
Yeah, Sex Lives of College Girls does that.
Yeah. Sex Lives of college girls 100%,
Yes, the late and Alicia plotline is 100% that.
So I was almost expecting that from Charlie.
But no, he's like. No, part of me likes that.
And the other part of me is like, he's stuck and he still
doesn't value himself, right? Right.
So yeah, totally. I have conflicting feelings
about Charlie's position here, too, because it's almost like
you can read it as like he's being desperate to, like, just
have somebody. But at the same time, I feel
like they're almost like because of what Charlie said when Nick
first came in the room where he's like, I I don't want to
lose you because we took this to the next level.
Like, I think Charlie values him more as a friend, period, than
just like, oh, he's pretty and he wants to kiss me, which I
feel like that was Ben's relation.
They were never friends. And I think Charlie really saw
that. And we saw that in the pilot
where he's like, you don't care about me, You never cared about
my feelings. Like when they got into an
altercation where Nick was like, leave him alone, he said no, He
was telling, telling Ben, like, you never actually cared about
me. Like, he saw that, like, this
was never a friendship with, but with Nick they have a
friendship. So I think Charlie, at this
point, it's less like problematic for Charlie.
So I have a I have a better time understanding like why Charlie's
doing this versus like if this was Ben it would be much more
like I just I feel bad about myself and I just want to keep
you which is basically their entire relationship was so.
But yeah it's a shitty position for Charlie because he still has
to like hide and you shouldn't have to hide.
You know it's complicated. I.
Wish no one had to hide. I wish no one had to hide or
announce things like, yeah, it sucks.
And I like that this this show really examines that from
multiple angles with different, with multiple queer characters
like. So you get like the full, a very
well-rounded experience from all of these characters on how they
are because we're all kind of processing it at the same time.
You know what I mean? I have a question for you
personally. Did you, I don't know, like what
social media was like? Did you come out on social
media? Yeah, Myspace was the thing and
I came out. I don't know.
Myspace when I was 8 and Facebook just came out, like
when I went to call, like when I when Facebook.
When I got a Facebook, it was at the time you had to have a
college e-mail to use it. It was college students only.
And so yeah, I was like, already out.
So I was out on that too. Yeah.
I was just wondering, yeah, not that old.
No, I'm old. We have a nine year age gap.
So we do in technology world, but it's pretty that's slight
years. Yeah.
OK. But Speaking of Ben, in this
episode, there's a lot of like there's a lot of comparisons to
be made between Charlie and Ben and Nick and Charlie.
And I think Nick realizes that. And I think Nick does a lot, a
lot of internalizing with his behavior because a lot Charlie
is like, yeah, I understand, I will play along with the secret.
So the whole time he's like, don't worry, I won't, my friends
won't tell anybody, don't worry. Like, I won't tell anybody.
Don't worry. Like I I will keep the secret.
And like you see that it eats away at Nick.
And I think part of the reason it does that is because Nick
witnessed the relationship Ben and Charlie had and knows how
toxic it was. And I think he's like, wow, I'm
like Ben. So I think he does a lot of
mental comparing with his actions.
Which I mean. The Beginning was, yeah, no,
totally. And it's like there are
comparisons like you are making Charlie hide like.
It just wasn't malicious, right. It's not gaslight, the
gaslighting that Ben does, but I think that's part of like, what
pushes Nick along in his process is the fact that he really,
genuinely does care about Charlie and he's like, I don't,
I think internally he's like, I don't want to make you hide for
me. Like I just, I'm not ready.
I'm, I'm getting there. And I think it motivates him to
like figure stuff out versus like not and just get
comfortable in the closet, you know, which is totally fine if
if that's your deal. Like, it's no, no shame.
I just think that's what happens with Nick rather than like get
comfortable. He's like he he's motivated to
keep going on the journey, basically.
Yeah, yeah. So it's sad.
But like they're they're the how much they care about Charlie as
a person is completely different.
And in my mind it makes the situation totally different.
It's like, what is that like? Shit, because he feels bad.
It's kind of like when they say when a parent is, like, worried
about being a good parent. They're like, just because
you're worrying means you're going to be good.
Exactly. Because he's worried about this
means he's a good person, right? Exactly.
Whereas Ben was always worried they were going to get, he's
like he would say Charlie, don't worry, we're not going to get
caught. Like in Ben's mind, he's like if
other people see us this is bad, but if nobody sees this, it's
OK, you know, And Ben was never trying to figure his sexuality
out. He just wanted to have hook up
with Charlie and leave it at that.
And like never. And in public, I'm with a girl.
I don't have to figure anything out.
So it's it is completely different in those aspects,
although it looks similar on the surface.
It's kind of the thing. But you know, Nick wouldn't
force himself on. No, never.
Nick would never do any of those things.
He's too nice of a he's, he's a puppy dog.
He would never. He's a puppy, does want to hug
him, but somebody does force Nick into a situation kind of.
So at the end of the episode, poor Imaging corners Nick after
a rugby match where literally everybody that they know is
watching them and it's basically like, Nick, let's go out in
front of everybody and poor Nick who like doesn't want to
disappoint or hurt people. It's like, I don't know how to
say no. So yes, and unfortunately how
who hates Nick overhears this and he's like, God damn it, I
knew he was playing Charlie. So on the surface, it really
looks like what it looks like, what Ben did like very much on
the surface. And I don't even know if his
friends knew about Ben. Now I'm thinking about it.
His friends did Tao and Isaac and Elle know about Ben?
He never talked about Ben like to them that we heard.
So I don't even know if they knew about any of that.
Isaac knew. Isaac knew.
Yeah, let's be real. Isaac knew, but he's not gonna
say anything because he's Isaac. He never says anything.
Yeah. He does not out people, he
doesn't Isaac would never King Isaac.
Alright, anything else about SO 4?
Don't ask someone out in front of a bunch of people.
I love her confidence. But don't do this.
Yeah, don't do this. It's bad for everybody.
It's just you see that Nick's pressured into it because of the
situation versus if they were one-on-one.
It's just not good. Don't do that, PSA.
Don't publicly ask people out for the very first time.
And if you are gonna ask someone to marry you in front of a bunch
of people, make sure the person's gonna say yes.
Yeah, ask your friend to like low key.
Get the confirmation before. Don't you guys talk about
getting married first? I mean, we did.
Yeah, I feel like that's common amongst people.
I don't know, maybe heterosexuals, it doesn't work
like that. It's assumed, like your
sexuality and so they don't talk about it.
But like, you should talk about it ahead of time.
Don't like plan. Anyway, we're not a relationship
advice podcast. Let's move on to a friend 105.
All right. So in this episode, it's, I just
realized this it's 105 and it's Charlie's 15th birthday, which
well done everyone. And so he's like, hey guys, I
really want Nick to be there because he's now like, my best
friend. I mean, he's one of my friends.
Tau does not like that Tau does not like any of this.
So Tau throws a fit and they end up going to a bowling alley
slash arcade and Oh my God. And also like Nick, it's the
same day that Nick's supposed to go out with Imogene and he's
like, well fuck, I need to tell her I don't want to do this.
And so he's trying to tell her and she's like, my dog died,
which is not funny. It's not funny.
But poor Nick, who's like, ah,
fuck, like, I don't want to make her sad.
Yeah, her dog just died. I mean, and he he's a.
Big dog person, obviously. Exactly.
What if this he? Exactly.
So Nick's like, ah shit, I can't break up with you.
So we're just going to jump to the end.
We're resolve the imaging and stuff now before we get to the
birthday party. So what does he do?
He does the cutest thing ever. He meets imaging in private.
In a public park and brings Nelly.
Yeah, because to cheer her up. Yeah.
Which I don't know if that would cheer me up or make me sadder.
Yeah, I don't know. I love dog.
It's a cute thought. Yeah, I would.
I would be happy and be like, yeah, I'd be upset a little bit
and then pet the dog and feel a bit better because it's because
it's a dog. So he brings Nelly and basically
tells her he's like, listen, I think I don't have feelings for
you like that. I think we're better off as
friends. And that clears that up.
And because, like, and Emma, Jean's not crazy, not a crazy
girl, She's like, OK, and they get over that.
But I also love the conversation that Nick has with his mom
before this happens where he's like, no, I don't know what to
do. He's like, this girl asked me
out, but I don't. I don't know how to say no,
which is like, Oh my God, like, yes.
Learning how to say no is such a hard lesson.
Yeah. Holy shit.
Oh, I said some yes to some things, yeah, because I didn't
know how to say no. Haven't we all?
Oh. I love it.
Well, I don't love it. I love that they're covering
this because it's so important. Like setting boundaries for
yourself and learning how to say no is such an important life
lesson. And because you're not taught to
say no. You are not taught this.
And then especially like, think about it like, I love that the
gender reversal here, this is just really the girl being
coerced, not the boy. So I love that it's him being
like I don't know how to say no because my friends expect me to
say yes. And I don't know how to, like,
be like, stand up for what? Express my opinion instead of
groupthink, right. So I really love this lesson and
I love the conversation with his mom where like basically she's
like, you know, learn to say no, stand up for yourself.
And then at the end, she says delivers the heartbreaking line
after they like, figure that shit out where she's like, don't
worry, you'll find the right girl.
And poor Nick's like. I thought we were making
progress, mom. So it like reinforces to him a
little bit. He's like, I can't tell my mom
who I really like. It's sad.
Yeah, it's so sad. But I love this conversation and
love the lesson here of like, it's OK to say no to stuff.
It's OK to say no to people, you know?
Yeah, say no to people. Say no to people.
Just say, you know. Just say no.
But say yes if it's a party for your crush.
So let's go to the party. So this is cute because the Core
4 is bonding with Nick, which Isaac is thrilled.
L is also thrilled. I just want to mention that the
bowling pins had strings on them and I don't understand.
I don't get it. Is that a thing in England?
I don't know. Please, UK people comment below.
Is that a thing in bowling alleys for the pins to be tied
to strings? That's very odd in America.
It is not that I'm aware of, no. How is it?
I know there's like a whole machine that just like.
You swipe them up or they're magnets and they reset them,
basically. I don't know.
It doesn't matter. We're not bowling alley experts.
Well, those are the things I think about.
They do bowling and it's super fun.
And except Isaac is or not Isaac Tao is really pissed at Nick's
there because he's so team Charlie, he can't get over Nick
not being in their friend group. So he takes, he follows Charlie
in the bathroom Tao, and they have this big conversation where
Tao is basically like saying like, I don't hate him
necessarily. I'm just, I witnessed you get
bullied. And I'm afraid that he's going
to bully you because he fits the stereotype of the the guy that
would bully you or use you. And I'm that's what I'm worried
about. And NIT And you know, Charlie
throws it in his face. He's like, you're just worried
about being alone, which is true.
Tao is 100% worried about that. But like, he also, at the same
time, he does really, genuinely care about Charlie.
Tao is like the protect. He's like the grizzly bear mom
who's, like, overly protective of everybody.
In his friend group, that's what he acts like to a fault.
To a fault. Exactly.
So, like, I think it doesn't he tell him about the date with
Imogene in here, too, in the bathroom.
He's like, yes. Did you know he's going out with
a girl? They tell you that.
And Charlie's like what? What he would have told me, he
didn't tell you. So, like, he's so in doubt.
But at the same time, he's like, This is why I'm being like this.
Because I he didn't tell you. I'm worried he's going to hurt
you. So, yeah.
Anyway, so Nick overhears this because he he got coerced into
buying drinks and food for Isaac and Elle.
He's like, I'm gonna get as sorry as anybody want anything,
I'm paying. They're like, yes, buy us all
these things. And so he goes to buy it and
hears this. And later Nick goes up to Tao of
his own accord and like, it's like, let's clear the air kind
of Tao, like yells at him and he's like.
Sure. Like, basically he's like, don't
you dare hurt Charlie. And then he's like, you're a
good friend. He knows that he has to make
nice with the friends to be able to be with Charlie.
Yeah, and I think he can tell that Charlie's friends genuinely
love him. And he's like, I wish I had
friends that. Oh my gosh.
Loved me because his friends suck.
His friends suck and like that's part of like Nick doesn't just
go on like a sexuality journey, he goes on a full on identity
journey. With where he's like do I even
like my friends who are these people that I.
Because they kind of suck. Now that he sees like how
Charlie's friends behave with each other not just how he fits
with Charlie. He's like these people are so
much better than these people. Like I can be myself and and I
love that his mom even points that out to him.
She's like, Nick you're you're more yourself around.
Charlie. I've noticed he doesn't have to
perform. It's just yeah.
And I think he feels that he can see that with Charlie's friends.
So he is trying to make nice. For Charlie, but also because
like he, he sees a healthy friend group, which I don't
think he has. It's like when you finally see a
healthy family and you're like, what?
Can you adopt me? Yeah, no, that's that's the
friend version of what's happening with Nick 100%.
He's a puppy dog. He needs to be adopted by some
good friends. OK, so other things that happen
real quick in the arcade that I love, L and Tau.
Figure thing Elle figures out that is the crush a slow burn
thing. OK, but can we talk about how I
love that the heterosexual couple gets the slow burn That
never happens. It's usually the queers that are
having the subtext, the slow burn thing happen.
It's them. I fucking love it.
They don't even get together at the end, right?
Nope, no, no. They both realize amazing.
It's amazing. So we're the halfway point at
the halfway point of season when Elle figures out she likes Tau,
which is always with the queer, which is usually.
Queer stuff. And then at the very, very end,
how figures out, oh shit, I have a crush on L Which boy?
Yes, duh. Oh my God.
I thought they were together in the first episode.
I don't. Caitlin was like, wait, aren't
they together? Oh my God, they'll get there.
Don't worry, they're just they're the slow burn ship,
which I fucking love. And then I love when we find out
that Isaac is really good at that coin game.
In our case, I just relate to him as well.
I love Isaac. I love that coin game.
He's so good at it. He's got a fuck load of.
Coins by the end. I mean, it's it's a talent.
It's a talent. Isaac's just talented.
I love Isaac. I fucking love it.
Isaac. I can't wait to see more, Isaac.
It's me too. I'm super excited.
OK, so let's cut to Nick's gift. So Charlie, like, basically
sprung it on Nick too. He's like, tomorrow's my
birthday. Like, for Nick had like, no time
to get him a gift. So what did Nick give him?
A little photo of their snow day with Nelly looking at the camera
and it's adorable. And like the frame.
I think he like, painted on the frame.
Oh yeah, it's just the cutest fucking gift ever.
And Nick says he's like that was.
One of the happiest days I've ever had.
It's just quite cute. It probably was one of the
happiest days they had. I know it was so cute and big
moment in the scene too. Is that Nick kisses Charlie in
public for like the first time in the arcade.
Those huge machines behind them are very questionable.
Yes, set the designers. Why on earth did you in this?
Low key like rated G show name the arcade machines Max with
4X's like rated no. It was like Mac access X I
thought it was only two X and then.
Is that how it is? Yeah, dude, Because it was.
I know it was 3 and that's. What were you just thinking?
What were you just thinking that I was like, Donuts in it?
Yeah, there's the the Donuts, the Donuts stuffed, stuffed
Donuts, I guess. Toys.
Plush Donuts, yeah. And then I will say.
They were rainbows shooting through the machines.
That was great. But why the triple X that's in
the title? That's my question.
I do. Isn't that game for children?
Isn't this arcade for children? I'm just confused.
Well, that's just showing you how all the children's things
have subtext for the adults. Boom.
They did need the shit out of that arcade alright.
Anything else about friend? Friend.
Well, I mean, I just remember one thing.
What's up that This. The animated stars around L?
They're pixelated, but in her glasses they're not.
Ooh, which is odd. I don't know.
I just remembered reading that. I think that was also BuzzFeed.
Is there any reason I don't know?
I don't know either. I'm just gonna hydrate for all
the gay stuff real quick. Yeah, I have no reason for I ran
out of water. We gotta get you more water
before we get to the end of this.
Yeah. All right.
How are we doing on time? Around an hour 56, so this
episode is probably like 15 minutes so far.
So let's end this. All right, So we will stop it
here and then cover the last three episodes of Heart Stopper
in part three. So thank you for coming along
this journey. I hope you're having fun with
Heart Stopper. We'll get to the finale soon and
start getting super excited for Season 2, which is coming out
soon. Very soon, Very soon and a
month. In one month we're filming this.
You're not going to see this for probably another month.
No, you probably already have hard stopper season 2.
Yeah, So yeah, the discussions will probably go out.
Season One season. One season, One Season, 2
season. Two Season 2.
So yeah, there will be like, no time pass for you guys, but in
the meantime, we'll just be sitting here hydrating for the
G's eye. Yeah, all the G's eye.
All the G's Eye and what else would be doing?
Caitlin My training for Lesbian Jesus.
And getting it up all over the place.
Yep. So until next time, bye bye.
I got nothing. And with that, we've been big
gay energy. If you like this episode, check
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