Hello and welcome to Big Gay Energy.
I'm Bree. I'm Theora.
And I'm. Caitlin, come along with us
while we dive into the fun and nuances of queer media.
Representation matters, and we're here to talk about it.
Cheers, queers. Today on the big Gay Agenda, the
three of us are going to talk about girls like Girls, The
novel by lesbian Jesus, Guys. Excited.
You just put up five Fingers. I did this.
Oh, it looks completely fine. Three.
Amazing. I just used two hands.
It's not. I am excited because I've been
waiting for this book for a long time.
Hell yeah. But before we jump into all the
fun stuff about this book, it's been a while since we've shout
out. Did a shout out to our financial
supporters, Caitlin, would you like to take that away?
So the members of our Chaos crew this month are Frida, Sapphire,
Sandy, and Mackenzie. If you want to support a
Patreon, we have different tiers that will give you early access
to. Add free episodes, exclusive
bonus content, a special keeping up with Big Gay Energy After
Dark podcast to get up to the to get to know us so much more and
see more of us messing up and so much more.
So come join your KS crew. It's fun and it's chaotic.
Yeah, And just a big thank you to everyone who stuck with us
through our hiatus and the newcomers.
And we're just we're happy to have you.
That's part of the big gay energy agenda.
Welcome. Welcome.
Yeah, So do you want to become a Patreon join?
We have so much more that we do, and we give it all to our
Patreon members. But on that note, we'll dive
into today's big gay agenda, Girls Like Girls, and a little
bit of background on this book, if you didn't know.
So this is a novel written by Haley Kyoko, Lesbian Jesus.
And it's her first novel ever, which if you read it, it's a
little surprising she wrote it so well and originally though so
this a little history on girls Like girls period.
So it started out as a song that translated into a music video
which you may or may not have seen.
It is on YouTube. Go watch it.
It's awesome and. Haley spent like, I think five
to seven years like trying to make this a feature film.
Like, she tried and has talked about this in interviews.
And just like getting a movie made is a lot harder than it
sounds. And we actually just did an
interview with a group who's trying to make a short film and
they kind of talked about that product, that project.
If you want to learn more, go check that out.
But this, like, ultimately the movie dream didn't pan out, so
Haley turned it into a novel. And that's how we got the book,
yes. Yeah, but hopefully it will be
made into a feature now that the book's out.
That would be cool. That would be cool.
That would be. Cool.
No. Well, with Rutgers strikes and
acting strikes, no. But maybe in the future, if you
know this gets enough attention. It's been on the New York Times
bestsellers list for a couple of weeks now.
So it so far so good. Yeah, But Speaking of music.
Music. Well, there is the music video
about girls like girls. Music itself clearly played a
big role in the book. There's several music
references. Throughout the book.
And so we put together a playlist that goes along with
the book and incorporates some lesbian Jesus music.
Because, like, let's be real, she made so many references to
her own songs in this book, we put together a playlist.
So if you're interested in listening to the audio version
of this book in music, check out our playlist.
We'll link it below and probably post it on our socials before
this evening comes out. And I3 of the songs in this
whole playlist. So it's for educating Caitlyn as
well, and we are going to educate Caitlyn at the very end
because spoiler Caitlyn has not seen the Girls Like Girls music
video by Haley Kyoko. So if you're a Patron member at
the end of this episode, we are gonna educate Caitlyn on some.
Lesbian Jesus music and music videos.
Yeah, I don't. I have.
Not heard a lesbian Jesus, so you shouldn't even be allowed on
the podcast, but I. Love you so.
Oh my God. That was so.
Horrible. Caitlyn's gone dark on us, Miss.
Not after dark anymore. She just went dark.
It's OK, Caitlin. After this episode, we won't be
able to sit and use that joke ever again because you will have
seen and listen to lesbian Jesus music.
Yeah. So stay tuned or become a patron
if you want to check that out. I want us to.
Go to a church and be like have you heard Lesbian Jesus's music?
Yes, passing out burned CD's because that would be
appropriate for this Book it. Would but before we jump.
Into the book. If you have not read the book,
we're going to give a trigger warning now about some of the
material in this book and I'm just going to read what Haley
said which because she kindly, kindly, kindly put a trigger
warning in here. It says.
Please note that this book contains themes about non
graphic reference to suicide, so if that is triggering to you.
Really skip this episode and just go watch the Girls Like
Girls music video? Which I did.
Not see that when I started reading this book by the way.
Yeah, but if you're on the if that does is that's not a deal
breaker to you. And you're kind of like I don't
know maybe I'm just gonna read the dedication because I think
it's super cute And this is also the main the main theme of the
book. So Haley says this is dedicated
to anyone who has ever felt hopeless and didn't believe they
could have a happy ending. You are worthy.
And then she put 3 rainbows because she's lesbian Jesus.
So you have been warned in the bad stuff and the good stuff.
Yeah. All right.
And so with that, we will jump into the book.
So this book. Yeah.
This book is a first person point of view book told through
our protagonist Coley. Which we're never really told
what that that nickname stands for.
There's an assumption it's Nicole, but it's never
confirmed. Yeah.
But I love it.
And Coley at the start of the book just moved from San Diego
to Bumfuck Nowhere Oregon. Her words with her deadbeat dad,
Curtis, after she just lost her mother to suicide.
And this is where. Coley's heads at when we first
start the book, but that changes over time.
And one thing I super love about where she lives.
She lives in Cliff's Edge, Dr. Yes.
And I literally dropped the book and yelled.
Those two are so excited about it and I have no idea.
It's a songs. It's a song and it it.
We're going to watch the music video for the Patriot members,
Caitlin, But the gist of that song is it's about like it's a
metaphor, like Cliff's edge. You know if you're on a cliff's
edge, you could jump and take a leap.
Like a leap of faith is the metaphor.
Or just stay to stay safely on the cliff's edge like.
You know, not take the chance kind of thing.
And it's about loving somebody and taking the chance and that's
what this book is about. So like, I love that she
incorporated her songs and stuff into the book and this was like
the first one. So I like smiled real big when I
was like, of course she lives on Cliff's Edge.
Dr. I love it. So, absolutely.
It's so cute. But on a not cute note, Coley
like at the start of the book. You know, it's very fresh off of
losing her mother to suicide. Her mother, you know, took her
own life and she has a lot of, like, survivor's guilt about it
and is grappling with how to really cope with losing her mom,
you know, without like forgetting her and like dealing
with the the the guilt of like, well, if I had gotten home
sooner and things like that. So she's not in a great.
Mental place when we first start the book and she moves in with
her dad who also like hasn't been in her life since she was
three years old. So she doesn't really know him
and doesn't really. She was three years old when it
happened and doesn't fully understand.
Why? Her parents really split up how
that all really panned out. She just have.
This has a three-year old's perspective and the later years
of all I had was my mom. We were a team.
My mom is now gone and I'm forced.
This guy is now taking care of me because he's forced to.
Like, she has that feeling of like nobody wants me.
I wasn't enough to keep my mom alive.
I'm not enough. I wasn't enough to keep my dad.
And now she's like backed into a corner because she's 17 years
old, so she's still like a minor.
And can't really live on her own without going to like a
government foster care system. So she's really not in a good
place. And Haley uses this repetitive
language in the beginning where she keeps mentioning using the
term low bar for everything, like there's a low bar for her
dad being a dad. There's a low bar for, like,
happiness is what she's kind of getting at to signify that,
like, holy is in a mentally low state.
When we first meet her, yeah. So it was a I just think about
how difficult that would be for everyone involved.
And I there's one thing that I wish we did get a little more
info on, but it's not something that was necessary to the story.
So I know why it's not there. I did want to know more about
why, how that went down with them breaking up.
We get to like, he talks about it a little bit, but he doesn't
really expand on it later on. But anyway, yeah, so I do like
the metaphors throughout the book that you can pick up on.
I just, I like how she put those every like you were saying with
the low, low bar, that kind of thing.
And yeah, it's a very interesting.
So it reminded at first I was like this reminds me of, God
forbid, Twilight a little bit, but better.
In what way do you mean just like the the characters going to
live with their dads in the middle of like a rural title?
Really nowhere. Yeah, N Pacific Northwest.
And not really being super and having like having a dad that
was never a dad, really not knowing them and like having to
get to know them. But I really, really actually
enjoyed Curtis this entire book. He was one of only two male
characters that I liked and There you go.
I think we're only meant to like to.
Actually. Use the other ones, no.
To be fair, I later on I like her coworkers.
The the gay couple that Yeah, like the coworkers later on, but
we don't get to see enough of them, no.
No, no, they're tertiary characters.
But I felt like. Her situation was relatable, you
know. Relatable to us during our
hiatus, too. Like that low bar for happiness
kind of thing that that feeling is relatable of.
Just like, I'm so low that just like I'll take the crumbs that I
can get, my bar is low. In terms of like, joy.
I also like that she wasn't like she was angry, but she wasn't
angry to the point where that was her only the only aspect of
her character that like she was and and she shows it to Curtis.
At first, she's more dismissive of Curtis than anything to his
face. And in her in her in her
monologue, too, yeah. So she is like I I liked that it
wasn't just her being mean to him like that was.
I think that whole the relationship at the start was
was done well to where you saw why she was mad, but at the same
time she wasn't just like a total, just totally mean.
Yeah, from the jump. Coley is very realistic.
Hey Haley. I get the vibe that this was
based on a true story for Haley because it feels too real for
me. For sure, yeah.
OK, so after we're introduced to Coley, like, we start up the
story and she's in Miller. Nowhere, doesn't know anybody.
There's like no A/C at her house.
It's like the middle of summer and her dad's like, go make it
sounds like the actual fucking worst, OK?
The air is. On here and I'm so.
Hot that it's hard. It's hard to do anything.
OK, but imagine then your dad's like.
Get on your bike and go outside and make friends.
That sounds. Like something my dad would tell
me to. Do.
Right. And it's like, oh, it's hot
inside, go outside. So Coley is like fine.
And so she goes to like the strip mall, I guess cuz it's a
small town, there's nothing going on.
It's the strip mall. And she tries to like, park her
bike before going outside where they're going inside where
there's air conditioning. And she almost gets unalived by
Trenton, the absolute worst human being in the world.
I'm sorry, but I'm calling him Trent because he hates that the
character hates being called Trent, so I'm calling him that
for the rest of the time. Perfect.
Let's do it with the utmost disrespect.
Trent is your typical sis. Head frat boy.
Douche dude who doesn't know the meaning of the word?
No, exactly. Or that not he doesn't own the
world and his white SISDU privilege or.
In his brain he does because of the way he treats everybody,
particularly Sonia, who will be at a second, like property,
yeah. Yeah, so you get the, you get
the vibe. That he's your typical man who
only has one emotion, which is anger.
And violence? Yes, which there.
Was that? Coley says.
I can't remember exactly where it was.
Says something at one point about how he could be the kind
of person to take it that far. And so you just, you know, like
this is going to blow up and do some physical damage to
somebody, somebody. So yeah, Trent can go jump in
the lake and yeah. You have any thoughts on when
you first met Trent Caitlin? Trent Pisses.
Me off. Yeah, And that is an appropriate
reaction. And that's why I don't like
people. Yeah, Trent.
Is a, is a. If you were trying to like get
people or get if you're an alien race and you came to and you're
trying to get anti human humanity companions going, he's
your poster child, let's put it that way.
But we get the opposite of that when Coley meets Sonia and by
meets gay stares at for like 20 seconds.
So Coley is showing her hand immediately when she meets.
So yeah, geez Coley. Like the the teen angst,
queerness is just rolls off the page and slaps you in the face.
Oh, Coley radiates lesbian energy the whole time, which I
appreciate. I do too.
Going into a Haley Coco novel, I didn't expect anything less.
So. We meet the love interest Sodia
for like a hot 2nd and then Sonia's like, hey, I'm sorry
this Trent almost killed you. Would you like to?
Come to the lake with us. Exactly.
Come, come. Hang out with the dude that
almost killed you. I thought it was very lucky with
that. They were getting in the car and
then she just turns her. I was like, are you coming?
Like why would she think that she was invited?
First of all, I it's weird. Well, I yeah, I don't get that
either because like they go in the arcade for like a hot 2nd
Coley kind of like does more gay staring and at the end, so I'm
just like, you're coming, right? Like what it was.
It was a bit fast, yes. She's just assumed.
But I think it's part of coming. I think it's part of Soja's.
Personality too, at the beginning.
So like, whereas Trent is the I get my way all the time
character from a male perspective, Sonia kind of has
that from a female perspective because she has like, I they
never gave us true details about her.
I assume it's like rich white girl privilege where she's like,
you're going to do what I want, right?
It's kind of we're getting at and Cole's your useless lesbian
who's like, who does she think she is?
OK, that was most of her inner dialogue about Sonia.
Yeah, it's it's really is like, and I think it's also from the
perspective of Sonia's, just that person that attracts a lot
of people, whether it be from a friendship perspective or a more
perspective, and is used to people wanting her and doing
things for her. Yeah, she's pretty, pretty white
girl privilege where she's like, she gets.
Her way. Exactly.
And through this Collie. So Collie is a useless lesbian.
So she's like, OK, I'll go with these strangers.
And this is where she observes the friend group.
And so we get to meet Sonja's other friends, one of which is
SJ. And my initial impression of her
is she's like that one friend who's like a cold hearted bitch
to everybody. But if you're unless you're her
friend, If you're her friend, she's right.
Or die for you. That was my initial impression
of that's Jay. Yeah.
She's, I think she's very skeptical about any outsiders
until and she's skeptical about Coley, obviously until she finds
out that they have something in common later on so.
I mean, I'd be skeptical too of this girl you picked up in a
parking lot. It's kind of weird.
And an arcade, like, weren't they?
They were like in an arcade or something.
And I'm like because I remember talking about how it she went
there because it was advertised to have air conditioning and
turns out it was a fan that didn't even oscillate.
And that's gross since we're having 105 degree weather.
It really. About me.
Yes. You should also point out that
this book takes place in the early 2000s, yes?
It's a period piece, period piece from our our childhood.
Yes, this is this was based. This gave me so many nostalgia
feels, but also all of the gay angsty feels from May 17 to 19.
Yeah, no, Haley knows it. Did you have any thoughts about
SJ when you first met her, Caitlin?
Do you remember SJ and Brooke? Confused.
I know I liked SJ better than Brooke.
Yeah, S. J's the good friend, but she
like, comes off as cold when you when like Holy first meets her.
But she's just protective of her friends.
All right, we'll jump into Brooke.
Then there's Brooke, who's the opposite of SJ.
And to me, Brooke came off as a pick me because of the way she
like. Is always cooing after Trent.
And to me it came off as like, I don't know that she liked him
necessarily or like the social capital that came with him
because he's the privileged male of the group.
And like, she doesn't hide, hide it at all that like she's really
there to get him versus like be friends with Sonja and like SJ.
Yep, she like, she doesn't even have to know what's going on in
the situation. She just walks in and is
immediately on Trent's side and end of story.
And I'm like why are, why are just?
Why no? No, it never changes.
It's. I mean, unfortunately, it's like
it's a social role for like, women.
And I assume Christian households where your job is to
be emotional, just emotionally take care of these whiny bitch
men and make them feel better. And that's what she does over
and over again, repeatedly with Trent.
So, like, she's just playing that role to a tee.
And if I didn't hate the character of Trent already, when
he every time he does do something stupid and get
everyone pissed off at him, he turns it around and blames it on
pretty much Coley. Because the times it does it,
it's always Coley and you're like, will you just they should
have left him. They should have left him in the
lake, So I'm going to say. Yeah, like in the scene.
Yeah, that. Trent basically dunks her in a
lake by accident. And like you said, he blames
her. But he does that over.
And that's a typical, that's a male thing, like in this hyper
patriarchy thing where men for some men have to be perfect and
so they can't admit that they're flawed or admit they don't take.
They abdicate responsibility and just blame other people.
He does it not just to her, but he does it to so many other
characters where you blame Sony. He's like, oh, it's your fault,
yeah. So it's it.
This is just. This is honestly a typical
social thing. He's a lot a classic.
He has the markings of a classic abuser.
Or narcissistic tendencies as well.
He's got Darvo out the butt, like course of control kind of
relationships. Yeah, but we get another
character that's the opposite of that, that I was very happy
about, which is Alex. Who actually seems like off the
bat, seems like a genuine nice guy.
Not nice guy and air quotes, but an actual nice human being and
just like straight up chill vibes.
He's the one that like, keeps the group calm.
He brings the weed, he's the chill friend you want to talk to
and like well actually listen. And he's supportive.
I feel like Alex shows up a lot of times when like he's he's
just kind of hangs on the periphery and then he shows up
when you need him a lot of times.
He's like a golden retriever, yeah.
Like when you he's just yeah. What is happening?
What do you mean? We're talking about Alex.
What did you think about? I know that.
I like golden retrievers. Yeah, wasn't Alex kind of like a
golden retriever? He was like, really nice and
protective and you kind of want to hug him.
I think he was way more chill than a golden retriever, though.
What? Did you say he was an
apologizer? Yeah, for Trent.
Because he had to, like, make up for.
Everything that. He did, Yeah.
Like, definitely the big like, because you get the sense that
Alex is a good friend. Yeah.
And he's kind of like, well, this is how.
Trent kind of it. But like, there is times when he
like when Trent tries to push things too far in front of Alex.
Or Alex is like, you need to stop.
And it's the typical male thing where like Trent feels like he's
above the women so he can just be like, no, I'm right, you're
wrong. But when Alex pushes back,
that's the only time he's like, he actually stops because he's
like, oh, another guy is telling me I need to stop.
But of course, he, like, doesn't still won't own it.
But yeah, Alex is like, it's clear from their dynamics, like
Alex is the only one that clicked get Trent to stop and
then yeah, but yeah. Yeah, that's the friend group.
So at the lake, despite the bullshit with Trent, Sonia and
Coley still kind of have more stuff together.
Because like. Coley's like, fuck this shit him
out and she leaves because, I mean, who wouldn't?
And some douche bag just don't do in a lake.
Like, fuck this shit, Friends are not worth it.
It was my take on the scene and Coley goes to leave and like,
get her bike and get the fuck out of there.
But Sonia follows her, then proceeds to flirt with her bike
and gives Coley her number and her AOL Instant Messenger
account And like. I.
Almost lost it at the AIM account thing because that was
my life growing up. So I was just like, yes, yes.
And I And like when I read it, I could hear the like the noise of
someone going offline or coming online because it was very
distinctive door opening, door closing if you went on on and
offline. Yes, it was like, oh, in my
head. Because I happen like it was
just one of those things, that one of those noises that stick
in your brain when you're through your formative years
with you, you use AIM so much. And and the fact that Live
Journal is in here too. Because yes, I was writing fan
fiction on Live Journal back in the day.
So live. Journals know what that one is.
Yeah, Live Journal is a little bit before my time too.
It was like the before Tumblr was kind of things like ancient
Tumblr in a way, because you can like post things and comment and
like write essays. It was it.
There was no, there was no like reblogging or it was literally
just a journal that people. It was like a journal site and
you did entries and you could do them privately or publicly and
then basically people would comment.
But it turned into a social media platform actually, where
people would interact with all of that.
And Fandoms, That's where Fandoms gathered for a while,
because it was like one of the only places.
So there'd be like these. Yeah, I wrote Grey's Anatomy fan
fiction on there back in the day.
And Buffy, anyway. Moving on.
I'm surprised by the Grey's Anatomy one really.
Why Kelly and Arizona beaches I had yeah it's I still have fan
fiction out there who knows where but it it was just one of
those things. So back back then you had two
choices you they either made an actual forum for the fandom so
like the one they did for the queer characters and Buffy was
the kitten, the witches and the bad wardrobe and everyone posted
their thoughts and fan fiction on a forum or you did live
journal. Those are your choices in the
early days. That sounds tough.
That was pretty cool actually. Made a lot of friends, lot of
exgirlfriends spite of. Like girlfriends.
So Coley and Sonia, this is the start.
Let's be honest. And my favorite thing about this
particular interaction is the way Coley and her inner
monologue just describes. What's happening?
First of all, Kaley Kyoko. Beautiful.
You can tell she's a lyricist by the way she writes.
Which I love. Her imagery and her emotive
language is so very spot on, But just the how gay this is, it's
just OK. It was really hard to pick my
favorite description, so I'm going to give my top two from
this interaction because it was just the gayest.
So they basically get off on the wrong foot, obviously, and then
I think they hug and then Sonia asks.
Coley, can we start over and I'm just going to read what Haley
writes? She asks again, right in my ear.
And I think this is how I'm going to die.
Just shiver into pieces here on the road.
That is 1. Of the gayest sentences I've
ever heard of my life. Gay, gay drama.
Right. That's just gay dramatics.
And I love it. Just useless lesbian energy.
Useless teenage lesbian. And then my other favorite is.
Her touch is a jolt that made everything inside me buzz alive
like spring has come and I'm I've been hibernating in a
denial cave with a grief boulder blocking the entrance.
Just the. Cave yes.
Just. It's just.
The Cave I. Love it so much.
Denial Cave. Amazingly, it's just it's just
the game. That's some shit.
It's some shit I would have written on my live journal back
in the day. Just it's wonderful.
But aside from how gay it is, the other things that I picked
up just from this conversation, which is kind of one of their
first real conversations, is like through their dialogue you
can get a sense of their defense mechanisms, which is like
shaping the character and making them threedimensional.
So Coley seems to be the one who deflects with humor, and that's
kind of her emotional armor because she, again, we've
established the meaning is low emotionally.
And so she she gets people to laugh and that's kind of her
like, defense mechanism and how. And she also has this persona
that she's tough and so nobody messes with her because you
know, she's hurting and doesn't want to be hurt anymore.
Yeah. On the other hand, Sonia does
the opposite. Instead of just like being
reserved and like. She's more she overcompensates
by being dramatic. So she's like overplaying the
part of being OK and the happy, perfect girl and she'll say
things like darling, it's called romance.
And like she like even in her like I hate.
I'm so glad we had that recorded.
That's my favorite theorem impression so far.
Even. But like, she says that too
coldly in this conversation. But even like later in her Live
Journal entries, she will use overly dramatic language where
she's clearly overcompensating her persona of Everything's fine
and perfect and happy having absolutely be.
It's very and it's also very kind of indicative of the kind
of even she's a dance girl, so. She is.
I knew all like I played sports with all the dance team girls
and this was like really true to life on my experience with them
in general. So it was again just like this
whole book is like watching a part of high school like late
high school for me and which was very interesting and it made me
really get into the characters more.
And it's it's like I I knew knew Sonia, you can see her in a lot
of girls that I that I knew back then.
So that was something I appreciated.
These characters are just super real.
Caitlin, did you have any thoughts about Sonia when you
kind of first we get introduced to her?
I don't remember. That's OK.
That's OK That's OK. There's not.
She's very, I don't know, one-dimensional.
When you first meet her, you just the first impression is
pretty girl, my brain doesn't work and then she's just being
overly nice despite this horrible situation of like the
tread bullshit. But.
The darker side of it that we first get a glimpse into here is
that Sonia is the type of girl who doesn't know how to say no.
And that's we talked about that in another episode, that that's
a very hard lesson to learn and it's not something you're taught
how to just set boundaries and say no.
And it's kind of apparent in the fact that Coley confronts her
about Trent throwing her in the lake.
And she's like, why didn't you stop him?
And Sonia says, like, I didn't know how.
And like, Cole doesn't let her finish that sentence because
she's pissed off at this point. But like, that's really
indicative of Sonia the person. And like, again, that social
role of perfect girl playing the female role that like men get
their way all the time. So but for Sonia, it's like the
first hand, but we get into it later.
It's it's much deeper than that for her.
Yeah, that she's the She goes along with things just to, you
know, get along with life, and this is what she has to do to
get to where she wants to go, basically, is the general idea
of it. And she's rationalizing all of
this behavior from Trent and other people so she doesn't have
to confront her actual feelings. And I don't mean like, for
Coley. I mean in general, like what are
her real feelings about Trent when he does XYZ or Trent in
general or even Brooke when Brooke is trying to get, you
know, Trent to notice her instead of Sonia or is jealous
of Sonia. So, like, there are all of these
emotions that Sonia has that she just refuses to acknowledge and
ignores them and just goes along with everything, which is an
easier route for some people, and we kind of see why how she
got into that later on when it talks about her mother.
And I had another thought that I cannot freaking remember right
now, but it's it was something about Dad Gummit.
Maybe I'll remember it at some point.
Oh well. Yeah, we'll jump into the Sonia,
how she's indoctrinated into this behavior when we get to her
mother, because it's straight up indoctrination.
All right, before we move on, I just want to point out one more
thing from the conversation with Coley.
And Sonia is one of the things that Coley notices is her nails,
Sonia's nails, and they're periwinkle and.
If you get the hardcover book and take the cover off, the book
is periwinkle colored. So that's.
Not where I thought. You were going with that
statement, dear Caitlin. Where did she think I was going
with that statement? I think there's only one other
Paul Osible place where that could go.
So I mean. What?
Coley was looking at her nails for once.
It wasn't me. I have been.
Corrupted enough in this podcast to be able to make those jokes
now. And our comments actually.
Oh my God. But yeah, so I love that I was.
She kept describing the color, kept coming up, and I was
holding the book and I'm like, God damn it, that girl attention
to. Detail, yes.
So. I could never that detail.
That made me so happy. I also am somebody who doesn't
like to read hard covers with the book sleeve on cuz I don't
want it to get messed up while I'm reading so I would lose it.
I love that Theora is like the book.
The book sleeve is there to protect the book, but I wanna
protect the book sleeve. I will take care of my books.
They don't like it's meant to take care of the book and where
I I totally get where you're coming from because I almost
did. I almost do it all the time too.
But then I'm like but I'll lose it.
Nah, I have them like they think they sit on display because like
that's what's it doesn't matter. It's like I don't want to take
seeing a therapist. You need to take care.
Of yourself taking. Care of someone else, exactly.
Thank you all for coming on this book therapy journey.
Anyway. Anyway, after we noticed the
periwinkle, Sonia and Coley hang out a lot.
Like, so much so that Sonia's friends are like, where the fuck
are you? It's typical.
So typical. The honeymoon stage, shall we
say. Yeah, when they haven't
confronted anything, but it's all there.
And it's like they're in a relationship, but they're not in
a relationship and they're not talking about it, getting to
know each other. It's super cute.
I'm surprised it didn't mention that they passed.
Uhaul store on I know right Does this.
Town Even have one, Caitlyn. That's a good question.
I don't know. What time?
Like what year is this? 2006 one?
2006 Something in? There it.
Says it on the Live Journal entries.
Pretty sure that's right, it does 2. 1006.
Yes, 2006, June 2. 1006 That's when this is happening.
Through August, yeah. So Uhaul existed.
New Hall did exist because I was already moving at that point,
all right. But I think one of the reasons
that they're hanging out a lot and in that get to, they're in
the Get to Know you stage so much is because I think both of
them start dropping their facades.
That takes a lot of energy to keep up, and there's something
clever that. Haley does, when writing this,
to note that that's what Coley is doing.
And so anytime Coley isn't talking about Sonia like the
real Sonia, the one that she keeps hidden behind this mask,
if she'll use an italicized her. Anytime she's talking about
that, like the real Sonia and hold on.
And she says, I I, you know, she says like, I like that the best.
And she has this line where she says all I really want to do is
see her italicized. That's why I'm here.
That's why I let her drag me out of my house and into shoplifting
and down those railroad tracks and then back here.
And it's just like that thing where you're just like, I got it
bad. And it's like a drug.
And it's like I'm doing all these things out of character
for me because I'm just addicted to, like, seeing her, you know?
And Coley mentions it multiple times where she's like, she gets
her to laugh. And like, it's a real laugh.
And she's like, I noticed it's not fake and it's not overly
dramatic. And it's like that's real.
And she has these lines where these inner monologue lines
where she's like, I never knew what Triumph was until I got her
to laugh like that. It's like that drug thing where
it's like. I just want to keep you being
normal to do with friendships like.
You just how addicted are you? Yeah.
No, this this was when I was younger.
I had a friend that was like bad influence and I don't know if it
was just like a friendship or anything so.
No, but if you're like, I'm not so much addicted to my my
friends. It's like a there's a different
component. I mean, you can still just be
friends and have that component, but it it kind of goes beyond a
it goes beyond a normal friendship, if you will, even if
you don't call it anything else. To be fit.
That wouldn't broke up with me, so.
Yeah. So the whole situation is weird.
Let's continue. Oh, I remember what I wanted to
say earlier. A miracle.
I liked the the the reason that Sonia gets so into Coley so
quickly to me, was that Coley just gives her shit in a way
that no one else does from the start, and just doesn't react to
her the same way that other people do.
Even though. Inside, Coley is super into her
from the start and I just, I liked that aspect that Sonia was
almost addicted to that. It seemed like that kind of
thing that Coley does to her, like makes those, makes those
real moments come out. Sonia likes being challenged.
That's what it is. Because no one challenges her.
She's like queen bee and everyone gives her what she
wants because she's playing that role of the perfect girl,
perfect daughter where she people give her what she wants
as long as she plays the part. And here's somebody who comes
along, he's like, no, I'm not going to give you what you want.
I'm going to tease you. And she does purposely slowly
does tease her and she's like. I I feel like when I was
watching, I'm not watching but reading those scenes where
Coley's like purposely like she wants me to give in, but I'm not
going to give her that. I'm just going to watch her.
Let her let her chase me because that's fun.
I felt like I was reading the Feelings music.
Video because that's what Haley's Haley's great at begging
and music videos and that's what the whole video was about, so.
I was like, yeah, this, this. I'm like this feels a little too
real. That dynamic.
Was. Very relatable.
So but like the it's clear that Sonja's going to be into
something like that because like the first live journal entry she
writes is I'm bored. Nothing ever changes here.
So here comes somebody who just is.
Like, no, I'm going to challenge you.
Like it's who shakes things up. That's that's what she wanted
for real. So always when you write that,
that something's going to come and change, it's almost like
Haley. Knew almost like she wrote this.
It's almost like it's on purpose.
But yeah, like so those things, you're speaking into existence.
She did. Sonia spoke.
Spoke all the shit into existence.
And Speaking of Live Journal. So like her Live Journal is
like, I found this to be clever. A clever way of giving us
Sonia's point of view, because the story is told through
Coley's like point. It's first person.
So like you get her inner thoughts, she is speaking, you
see everything through her lens. But through the live journals
you get to see Sonia's thoughts, both public thoughts and private
thoughts. Right Without like the her
switching point of views of the characters.
You kind of get that gist from these live journal entries,
which I thought was clever a way to do that.
And you notice over time, especially during this honeymoon
period, the way her, her journal entries start changing.
And it's not the public ones. The public ones are the same
where she's using that dramatic language and that like, hey,
guys, love my friends and like all that kind of stuff.
None of that really changes. So, like the the mask she's
wearing doesn't change at all, even her, like, online version.
But the private entries 100% start changing and I love that.
You can really see the difference in like who she
presents herself as and who she actually is in little details
like the music choices she chooses to put.
Because like in the live journal entry is like it's like mood and
then music and then whatever you're going to write.
And if you notice like the music she puts publicly is all this
like pop top ten hits kind of music, like crowd pleasy music
versus like her private music is like Rilo Kiley and it's like
not mainstream kind of band. So it's more like stuff you're
into that you wouldn't like, say out loud because you're afraid
your friends would be like, that's dumb, that's lame.
So like, you kind of see like Sonia definitely has the split
personality thing happening because of who she responds as.
It's absolutely relatable. And I love how like angsty or.
Like private entries are which is like Linkin Park and like she
starts like going down this like eggs to music rabbit hole.
I wish I knew the music. Because I I I just kept skipped
over that part. Listen to the playlist you will
you will be like you'll get. I did an order view where you
get like her public entry, private entry.
It's like black and white, like the.
Music. It's wild.
Like if you go, let's do it. It sounds disjointed.
The the journal entries remind me of several people are typing,
yeah, me too. But I hate it when people switch
point of views because it just it messes with me too much and I
I have trouble focusing in general.
So this separate point of view, I'm just like, no, I want to
stay with this person, stop pushing me over to that person.
But that that was a good touch and also helped me read easier.
Yeah, I thought it was clever. It also keeps you in the time
period too, so I like that element also.
Yeah, I didn't pass it to that details whatsoever.
There is one thing that struck me not about the something with
Curtis and and Coley is when she comes home that one night and
he's making the jewelry. And basically she finds out that
the necklace that her mom was wearing when she committed
suicide was one that Curtis made her.
And I don't know, that was just that.
That one got me that. And afterwards she has this like
whole internal monologue where she's talking about loneliness
and. Being a trapped animal and being
scared that she'll lose herself to and that or that she'll never
find herself at all. And that was super relatable as
well, because the the fear of never being okay or the fear of
slipping into that super dark place and not coming back is a
really, that's a really scary one, especially in the wake of
your mother just doing that. Exactly.
And like, she fights a lot of the stuff with her dad is very
much fighting the fact that she's like her mother.
And I don't think she knows how to deal with that because it's a
lot. So yeah.
This book like attacked me from a lot of angles, so.
Because it's like, it was like my life back in the early 2000s
and also my life now. Thanks a lot, Haley.
Damn you. Anyway, I wish I knew life.
Look, I got a little bit of this stuff, but I was just too little
to actually know it. So I have no idea what you guys
are talking about. You just like Leapfrog.
On technology. So this is like primitive social
media, That's all. Yeah.
That's all. I joined at the very end of AIM.
I spent most of high school on AIM.
It's good times. College.
I was 17 in 2001 and so
basically The thing is Caitlin, like we couldn't text because
texting cost a fuck load of. No, I got.
I was still, I was still there. So that was our texting.
Well, texting became free first, right?
It doesn't matter. But I was still there in like
call after nine, and texting is awful.
It was bad. Anyway, Speaking of parents, one
of the things that happens over summer is that Coley meets
Sonia's mother, Tracy. So I'd like to take this time to
unpack Sonia's mommy issues because they are vast and
horrible. To be quite frank, I don't know,
do you want me to go first? Does everybody want to go first?
So this mommy issues. Listen, Sonia is one of those
people that make me want to scream and I don't even know.
Because they're the people that think you have to be one way and
that that's the only way to go through life any other and and
the fact that they think that is bad enough.
But then they put that on their children and give them
impossible expectations to live up to a hollow image of what a
person should be, rather than letting them be themselves.
And that is that is very it. It's a trap and it's terrifying.
And the fact that Sonia sits there and has to watch her
sister, her little sister, go through this same process and be
afraid for her as well. I mean, it's no wonder she's
terrified to be herself because she's been taught her entire
life that being herself is not A enough or B ever going to get
her where she wants to go. So fuck you, Tracy.
That's all. Can you give me a small recap of
what Tracy did? Oh, yes, I got you.
Don't worry. Thank you.
This is an example of what indoctrination actually looks
like. So, Tracy, Basically, when Coley
first meets Tracy, Tracy doesn't seem pleased that Coley's there.
But Coley notices that she puts on this, like, fake, really fake
smile and is pretending like everything's okay.
She's one of those people who values politeness and
appearances over actual kindness and actual affection.
And you get the sense from Sonia that she's very, like, afraid to
step out of line. And then it all kind of stems
from her mother. And that becomes really, really
apparent with Emma, her little sister, because she mentions to
Coley that, like, sometimes that she's like, yeah, my mother, she
had me like looking in front, like when I was little.
I would, like, look in front of the mirror and like, look for
flaws. And she's like, and I see my
little sister doing that. I know that came from my mother.
And there's a scene where basically they're on the couch
watching the movie because Emma's obsessed with this movie,
the never ending story, and watches it like a million times
a day. And they're babysitting Emma,
and they're talking. And something happens where
like, Sonia is basically, like, coaching her how to lie.
And the little sister says something.
She's like, oh, have you watched this?
This is the first time you're watching this movie today.
And I was like, no. And so I'm just like, that's
that's bad. You need to learn how to lie
better. And, like, she jokes with her,
But, like she says to Coley later, she's like, that's the
only way she's going to survive my mother.
So, like, it's awful. So she's like, trying to protect
her little sister from, like, becoming what she's was forced
to become. And I call this perfect girl
syndrome because her mother seems like the type of person
who's extremely controlling and has a concept in her brain for
what a daughter supposed to look like behave.
She's supposed to be quiet and not talk.
And like Sonja explains all of these things to like holy and
like it's supposed to be a do feminine things like dance and
date the alpha male at school and you know, just take whatever
affection you get and just don't step out of line.
The type of person to have the children should be seen and not
heard Poster And yeah, that was that was Sonia's childhood.
Like she's mentioned. She's like the reason my mother
threw me into dance is so that I would get all that energy out so
I wouldn't be so talkative and like things like that.
But I I want to mention the dollhouse thing that's going on,
which is like another way you can really see this very clearly
right off the bat. And Sonia makes the comparison
way later in the book. But like, it's right here in the
beginning when Coley first goes into her room, The description
of the stuff in the room, there's like a canopy bed,
ballerina, pink bedspread. She's like.
This is this room is not what I expected now that I know who you
are. So it's like, very clear that,
like, her mother staged all of that because it looks like a
dollhouse. Like it's got all these Pretty
Little things and like super feminine.
And Cole is like, this doesn't match the person that I know
her. I telesized her.
So it's very, very clear. Her mother is super controlling
in her life. And for Sonia, she's also a
child of divorce and gets along mostly with her dad's like bio
biodad and then stepdad. But she doesn't see them often
because like her mother is controlling her and keeps her
most of the time. So it's like.
She She is. So the the fact that you brought
up Coley feeling trapped, they are both trapped.
They are just trapped in different ways.
And I think that's what they're really bonding over, is
together. They're free to be themselves
around each other. And that once you get a taste of
that, it's just that's the ultimate drug.
There's no going back from that once you know what that's really
like. Yeah.
So Tracy puts Sonia in this position where she's surviving
and not living her life. And yeah, the tragedy of it is
really Emma because like, Sonia sees it happening right in front
of her eyes with Emma now that she knows what all of that
really was about. It's just she's like, I'm trying
my best to stop it. But Sonia doesn't know how to,
like, set boundaries, Like, and it's difficult when you're the
minor in your like, how do you set boundaries with your sole
caregiver? Like, you know, even as an
adult, it's difficult, right? Yeah.
And so it's it's very sad. Like that dynamic is really sad
to watch Emma, like, be next in line for this bullshit.
Really. Yeah, and.
Little Emma. Yeah, that was just that was one
of the like great tragedies in the book was just, you know that
this kid is going to be. Going through exposed to the
same stuff Sonya was and you're just well that sucks.
And I feel like it's not uncommon.
This is a this is traditional family values wrap to the
extreme you know so but on a completely different note let's
get off the let's get off that and talk about something happy.
Let's talk about the post it note.
Let's talk about the post it note and the live journal.
Audrey, let's let's talk about that.
I could not believe she actually posted that when I was reading
it. I'm like, this is a private
entry. This is a private entry.
It. Was like this haiku is so gay I
literally wrote in my book. Oh my God, she actually posted.
This. What does it say?
All right. Well, okay, let's set up.
Let's set up. Do you remember how we got to
the Postit note entry brief? Do I?
Remember for anything. She's asking me to recap for
Caitlin. I.
Apologize and I'll read the entry when we get there.
When they were babysitting him, a basically Long story short,
Sonia goes to the bathroom, she doesn't feel well and then when
Coley comes to check on her, she does like, yeah, I just don't
feel well, blah blah blah. And so Coley's like, all right,
I'll leave and but before she does, she goes back and grabs
some postits. And writes her AIM messenger
name on it her handle and then slips it under the bathroom door
where Sonia is and then leaves. And then later on, Sonia posts a
live journal entry which is a haiku poem about the post it
note. And she does it publicly, Yes.
And also, to be fair, she was drunk, yes, when she was in the
bathroom and like throwing up. And Coley also, like, left her
water and she's like, here's my digits.
Yeah, she came, And there's some water on the side table.
I gotta go. She's like, here, I left you
water, so she's taking care of her.
So that's important because just OK, I'm going to read the haiku
and then the first few lines that Coley writes in the next
chapter, because it's all perfect.
OK, so the journal entry says. Oh my God.
I love that song, by the way. Actually, let's read the whole
thing because it's pretty gay. OK?
Mood, poetic music. Lover spit by Broken Social.
It's one of my faves. Go ahead, post it.
Bolded. Here's the poem.
Little yellow square secret slipped under the door, drunk on
you and me. And then Coley, What does it
mean? That's all I can think over and
over, skipping in between the few instantly memorized lines of
Sonia's poetry. What does it mean?
It's so real. Yeah, I think I also was like,
wait a minute, that's, that's public.
Yeah, it was public. Yeah.
I couldn't believe she did that. And then literally, like Coley's
gay, immediate gay panic was the best.
Because I'm like that's so. Just what it is.
She's like. She's like, well, she was drunk.
Is that a play on words? Is it being?
Is she being literal? Like, what is it?
What does it all mean if she became the meme before there
were memes? Man, and I like there's a line.
There's a couple of things in this section that I liked, and
that was that Coley calls Sonia a girl made-up of lots of
questions and few answers. Yeah.
Which is very accurate. And then I love that Sonia likes
that Coley gets all of her references.
Like that's something I related to as well.
Because like when you're in that, like getting to know you
phase and you realize that you connect those little those bits
and it just feels if it is a drug you do be getting high off
that shit. Yeah, it's true.
When somebody else gets your references, it's just again,
because it's like you see me. Exactly kind of thing, you know.
Yep, Okay. Should we pause and wait for
Caitlin? Should we get the dog Future
Caitlin edit this out. I'm trying so hard and just
things to get so crazy. I'm very sorry, but speaking,
sorry. Go ahead.
Speaking of animals. Not actually.
I'm surprised there were no animals.
We're going to hop on over to the barn party.
Let's let's not bring up the lack of animals, OK?
Someone needs to have a dog. We're sorry.
I'm. Sorry, At least a cat.
Come on, why is there no barn cat?
I thought you guys were in the sticks.
There's a barn cat. They just didn't mention it.
Maybe Haley's? Not a cat lesbian?
Who knows? I'm not.
I'm going to ask her. I have so many questions for
her, it doesn't matter anyway. So in the barn party, many
things happen. But one thing that happens
that's I think is important is we meet Faith for the very first
time. And this is somebody who is a
year older than Sonia and is a dancer.
Also, she seems like when you first made her, she's like, too
cool for school. And like, I immediately started
getting queer vibes from her based on the way Sonia was like
speaking to her. Almost like like Faith has
Gaydar and she's like girl, I see you and Sonia that she's
not. About that.
Because Sonia. Warns Coley to stay away from
Faith because, but for two reasons.
One, she's jealous and two, she's like, the gay is
contagious, basically. Oh yes, that's why that's.
Why? You're gay, right?
She's like, so you shouldn't hang.
You shouldn't hang around with her because, you know, she's one
of those girls. And I'm like, Sonia, you're one
of those girls. Oh my God, Internalized
homophobia is a hell of a drug. I guess that.
And I I felt so bad for Coley because anytime she said shit
like that, just that. And like internalized
homophobia, stuff like that's so real too.
When you're like. It hurts, man.
That hurts, man. I thought we were friends.
What the? Fuck, why you gotta be a bigot.
I thought we were getting somewhere and I thought that
that we yeah, the fact that you think that is is just crushing,
but. Yeah, like he said, fate it is.
Fate sees right through Sonia. And Sonia to Sonia, that's a
threat. So you know she can't be having
that. And of course Trent is going to.
Trent is going to ruin everything again with the
absinthe. Oh my God, he classed.
In with his lighter classic male.
He's like, I know what to do. Almost sets the barn on fire
like. Coley, like saves everybody with
her quick thinking and that leaves Sonia pulls Trent away to
go dance and then Faith and and Coley have a little talk and
then you get the the whole Sonia looking over and being jealous
and mad. And it's like, oh, she does
like, I've just have those. I've had those moments where
it's like, oh, she does care and then but it's still a fucked up
situation. It's definitely a fucked up
situation. Anyway, yeah, so the ultimately
the barn party gets a busted by the popo and so everybody runs
away and Long story short, they end up like waiting in a sea of
poison poison oak. Yes.
And this is the poison oak, huh. This is the West Coast.
It's the West Coast. Yes, on the West Coast.
I grew up on the East Coast. For me, it's Poison Ivy.
Anyhow, so that. So of course.
Of course. What do gal pals do?
They have to put technew on each other.
And then your one bed afterwards, obviously like I was
reading this whole thing and I'm like, what is the AO3?
Am I reading right? Now that's like, this is every
fan fiction I've ever read. Haley's read fan fiction.
That's all, absolutely. And I will say people who have
read and written fan fiction write the best kind of scenes
like this because it it's just the best.
And yeah, but like, Oh my God, that whole scene Or she's that.
But it's also like she nails the torture element of all of that
really well, because you're really like this.
Scene. And tell us why, Caitlin.
I don't. It's just the gay panic.
Probably because probably because it reads like fan
fiction. Yeah, yeah.
No. Just like she's.
It's like she's touching me. Oh my God, she's touching me.
And it's just like, but it's. The fact that she was trying to
get out of the house so much all.
She wanted to do was leave and get out of there.
She's like. Shit, she's she's not done.
Every reason I handle this? Yeah, that's Sonya.
She she really wanted to share that bed with Coley.
But like when we're in the tech news stage where they're doing
the lotion, it just OK Just being a baby gay and not knowing
if your crush is also a baby gay adds another layer to all of
that. Because you're like, can I react
to this? Can I not react to this?
Like, it just, it adds more psychological torture than it
would normally if, like, they were, if they were, if they were
straight people, either opposite sex or same sex.
Like there's another layer in there of just like emotional
torture that's going on. And like, Coley's inner
monologue really nails all of that.
And I appreciate that because it's so real.
It's just because Haley's been there and she knows how to for
sure. How to write.
Yeah, but like, damn, that was just straight up torture.
And then the bed scene. OK, the bed scene.
The bed scene Jesus. Was Sonia awake or not?
Take a poll. Yes, yes, I'm.
I'm like, I sleep like the dead. Was she awake during the
cuddling is what I'm asking? She was awake.
She had to be. I agree.
She just would never admit it. And she knows that the only way
that she can get close to Coley in this moment in the
circumstance is if she is asleep.
I think she was asleep and she woke up like that, but then
she's just like, I like it here. I'm just going to go back to.
Sleep without Yeah, that's the second option.
That's a good option too. That's a.
Really. Good question.
I've done that. Before I woke up and I'm like,
oh I. OK, I just stay here like this
there. Is no.
Way. Stay here.
That happens with me and my golden dude.
Are you ready? Oh, I love Kendra.
That is so accurate, Kendra insists.
Kendra is my goldendoodle. Oh, no.
I'm sorry. Go ahead.
I was just going to say that
that this scene really, really got to me because I literally my
senior year of high school, I was that bitch.
Better never watch this podcast. I was totally in love with my
best friend. And I would spend the night over
her house and we would be in the same bed.
And I'll just be laying there like, I'm not gay.
I just want to hold her. It's okay.
That's not gay, right? Just she's right there.
Can I? I just want to know.
Can't do that torture. And then she would do things
like show me her shoulder muscles because she was a
pitcher, because of course we played softball and one of them
was her pitcher. Her pitching arm was the muscles
on that side were bigger. And so she would be like, hey,
would you rub this techno? What techno but like?
Icy hot. Whatever.
On. And then she really it's okay
because you're not gay. Yeah, and then we ended up to
both be queer. So anyway, I related to this
scene. I relate to this in the opposite
way, where like had to share a bed with like a crush for like
sports reasons and just being like I can't move at all when
I'm sleeping because this is a straight person and that would
not be cool. And like, there's so that I
couldn't sleep. So it's the worst.
Well, no, that's what I did. Because I couldn't, like,
gradually reach out and didn't nothing like we didn't get to
cuddle. Yeah, it's just like the horror.
Because they're just like, God, no, it's awful.
It is awful. It's an extra layer present in
queer stuff that the queer experience, why we're all need
therapy. Yeah.
And fan fiction. And we need the AO3.
Fan fiction is therapy. Sometimes it.
Sure is all right. So slightly off topic, but did
you see they're like making a bill to like not like allow AO3
or something like that? I've been waiting for that,
Yeah. I've been waiting for ETQ stuff
on the Internet. Basically just weird.
Anyway, let's continue with the actual gay stuff.
Well, we're pivoting away from the actual gay stuff and we're
going to talk about another set of meeting the parents, which is
when the immediate after the sharing the one bed.
Of course you have to go meet your future father-in-law.
So Sonia goes to me, it's Curtis.
And up until this point, Sonia's only heard about Curtis through
Coley's point of view, which is mostly like, oh, he's not I, I
she doesn't even call him dad. She calls him by his first name,
and he's like, he doesn't know that's what he's doing.
He's not her dad. He's her dad.
But, like, he's not her dad, right?
And then that's the way Haley's showing that.
But like, when Sonia gets there, she's like, I don't understand
what you've been saying. Like, he's actually, he's trying
like, he offers to make them pancakes.
He makes small talk with her and like, he he wants to be
involved. But like, Coley is like, no,
like shutting him out basically hardcore.
So like, Sonia's like, the math's not mathing here from
what you're telling me and what he's showing me.
And also I have to say the excuse of like why they were
late or whatever, Sonia says that we're playing capture the
flag. Is that the new gals being pals?
Because that was a great one. I'm going to I'm.
Going to miss that we were playing capture the flag and
this just means gals being cows. Exactly.
Is your imagination ended? The flag equals feels.
Sure. Kaylin.
Sure. That's what it means.
OK.
And so, like, after Sonia kind of like delivers that line,
which is the book says can, she continues smoothly.
So I just love that line. Basically, Sonia stays and they
like her and her dad like Bond and Cole's kind of witnessing
this. And then she says, like, the
saddest thing ever, but it's just adorable.
Now she's watching this, she says.
Is this what it's like when you have a girlfriend?
Do you just get to grow up and move in with them and wake up
with them and eat breakfast with them and be happy?
Like that was the saddest fucking lie at that point in the
book. But like, there's many, many an
instance in this book where Haley drives from the point
that, like, representation really matters.
And, like, seeing normal people out in life, just being gay and
having it not be a big deal is everything.
Because like, this little baby gay is like, that.
Can't even think that she can have these things because she's
like, well, you're no, being gay, Like is not the norm.
And like, has never seen a healthy gay relationship.
So she's like, I didn't even know I could have this basically
until it's like, happening in front of her and she's like,
wow, could this really, could I have something like this?
I didn't even think that was possible.
Like, it's just sad and it's fucked up.
And that's why representation matters.
That's why we're here. That's why we're here.
That's why it's queer. That's not why we're queer.
Because do you know we just are. But never mind.
Not going to say anything? All right, cool.
So let's move out to really queer shit.
Let's talk about the train track, kisses and.
Oh my goodness, the payoff? But the it's messed up.
What's messed up? The thing that happens
afterwards is messed up. Oh my God, yes.
The preceding rest of the book is fucked up until the end.
We're going to revel in the the the good part for a second and
then we'll go to the depression. So yeah, well basically Sonia is
about to get hit by a train and the Coley's like, hey, bitch,
she get. Off the tracks.
And has to tackle her as and then they end up in the grass
and gay shit happens. They they have a a chat.
A real deep chat. As well.
So there's that. But I like that there's a
champagne analogy because we had champagne show up earlier in the
book and then it comes back in the form of I'm a shaken
champagne bottle exploding everywhere.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's good. Yeah.
It was very good. I liked that description and
analogy because it really. Like you know that feeling when
you first kiss somebody and there's that crazy rush of it's
happening and then it just explodes.
So 10 out of 10 description and the mode of description is just
it is it's very impressive for her first novel.
And basically what has happened is that Coley has told Sonia
about her mom. And she had been kind of waiting
for Coley to reveal that information for some time now.
And so she feels like she's like she's gotten beyond a wall with
Coley, and Coley has let her in. Which makes what happened sex
even more fucked up. But it's not just that.
It's that the way that Sonia reacts to Coley letting her in.
I the kissing and getting closer and the intimacy.
Coley says that she is like she sees Sonia like the real Sonia
is not just in glimpses. Right now she's getting her
nonstop in in this time, so which is both lovely and sad.
And that's when all of juice happens, because.
Cause Sonia says I'm really happy that you're here with me
and that I get to know, and that I get to know you and that you
trust me enough to tell me. And then it's just kind of super
sweet and gay until Sonia says, hey all of juice.
And Collie's like the fuck what? What?
And so she slows it down and says I love juice.
I love you, is what it means. And that makes Coley laugh.
And it will make me laugh too. I'm going to say that.
That is some shit that I would say so.
Yeah, so I got this jogger for like a good 5 minutes during the
scene trying to figure out the olive juice thing and like
saying it's slow and trying to figure out the right
pronunciation of it, and then also getting distracted by
olives. Whoever said that you want a DHD
is saying anyway. It's just it's so cute.
It is like, finally, Sonia's being super real and saying the
things that she wants to say. It's stuff that she would say in
her private journal. But she's saying it to Coley
finally, so it's like, Hallelujah.
I want to point out though though in this scene their
location matters, so this train track area has become their
private spot throughout. The summer.
And so I think that that's important because.
It's their it's like their bubble.
So like in their private bubble, they can drop the masks, drop
the facade and learned, and they learn to trust each other in
these private moments, away from the eyes of literally everybody
else in this really small town and throughout the book.
Sonia mentions, and I think in her live journal, obviously the
live journal a couple of times that like about you mentioned
like she wanted to know about Coley's mom but wouldn't push
her. And she says her rights very
explicitly, like she's like, I need to earn her trust.
So Sonia understands that she has to get Coley to trust her.
And so when that happens, it's like, wow, she trusts me.
That's huge. So yeah, it makes the betraying
later super fucked up because like, Sonia's aware of like, how
big this is and that this is a trust issue.
And it's easy for us, the audience, to get really sucked
into this moment with them and be like, oh, it's so great.
But like, if you take a step back, you're like, yeah, it's
great because they're alone and like.
There's no, there's no need to have a mask.
But if there's an audience, then the masks come back up in this
moment doesn't happen. So it's like it's fragile is
what I'm saying. Like it's very honest and it's
it's great, but it's fragile at the same time because it's it's
happening in their little Eden that's not connected to their
world that they're living in. Absolutely, Yeah.
So. Back in reality, back to
reality. Back to reality.
So the betraying happens, or Coley?
Finds that the betraying. Happens.
You keep. Saying back to reality.
And then my brain went to the TikTok Trend song thingy.
Or it might have been just mine went to Eminem, no.
No in my. Brain, it was saying back to
reality. Oh that goes gravity.
That's that's Eminem. That's Eminem.
Because. I only know it from social
media. Sorry.
Continue. That's okay.
So at the kickback party, what? And that's what it's called.
I forget what the fuck it was actually about.
It doesn't matter. Coley gets betrayed in multiple
ways. First of all, Sonia drops the
bomb that she's going to dance camp like tomorrow and didn't
like again in their private bubble.
She could have been like, hey, I need to tell you this doesn't
tell her this and she's like, leaving.
It is bullshit. Right.
I was like how they. Gonna do this book.
This is the middle of the book. Sorry, the book still happens.
So Sonia's going to dance camp did not tell Coley anything at
all. She was just like I assumed all
my friends know, which is oh man, bullshit, that's what.
That is, I was getting really pissed off at this girl at this
point. And then the worst part is that
Coley finds out through somebody else that Sonia.
Let it drop about her mother committing suicide and she finds
it out from somebody else, not Sonia.
And she's like, well, there's only one person I told and
wonderful. So like it's a giant betrayal of
just trust. It's not so much that I need to
be in the closet to be with you thing.
Which, again, being somebody's secret is never great, but like.
Coley's like, not fully out herself yet.
And so it's like they're kind of in the same place when it comes
to that. But this is actually just like
person to person trust betrayals.
It's bigger than that. I don't know if you any comments
on that. I have a few more things about
this whole party that I found interesting.
Yeah. Pisses me off.
Yeah, this party's terrible, Yes.
All right, so it in the middle of this party, basically Coley's
like, fuck the shit, I'm out. So he's like no, no, no, come
with me kind of thing. Let's recreate the magic.
And basically takes her into her broom and starts like force
feeding her the strawberries and cream liqueur or whatever the
fuck it was. And while she's doing this
alcohol in this book, I know they're very weird, it's very
strange and. The fact that this girl has such
easy, the girl is clearly has problems because she's always
drinking and she's like underage in America and it's very.
Happened to the boxed wine that hadn't.
Been a thing at that point, right?
Was it? No.
This is like stuff that we did when I was a kid, Like we were
just stealing because like, you're just stealing.
Like going to your parents liquor and you're like, what are
they not going to miss? Right.
Yeah, the weird shit. Exactly.
It's like my mom got this weird. Schnapps, right?
Get the weird shit. They're not going to miss
exactly. I mean, that's what we did when
we were kids. Yeah, but she's like, she drinks
a lot and it's kind of compared that she's got, she's got
problems. And in this scene, I think this
scene is really important. She's monologuing to Coley and
not really. She's like not hearing what
Coley saying or like paying attention.
It's she's just monologuing her and her thoughts because she's
already like trashed. And the reason she drinks is
pretty apparent. She says here, like, basically
she's like feeding Coley some of those.
Stirs and cream stuff. And Sony says this is the sacred
healing drink of ancient times. Each time, basically you
swallow, it'll like turn you into gold and all this stuff and
she says Your old self, the one you're stuck in, it will melt
away with each sip, and you'll get closer and closer to the
person you're meant to be. And so it's like.
This girl is developing a drinking problem because she has
all this internalized homophobia that's been placed on her by her
mother and she thinks her friends, which some of them
Trent sure are imposing this like idea of what a woman's
supposed to be on to her. And so, like, it's her coping
mechanism. And so she's like, you drink
too, and we'll just go back to just being happy and like we can
escape into our little champagne.
Dream kind of thing. If we just get drunk and like
Coley's like, no, I'm over this basically.
Like then Sonja tries to get her to dance in her room because of
course you leave your own party. Go dance with your gal like in
your room. That's great.
And Trent catches them basically.
And or like the and like yells at her.
And then she tries to leave. And then Sonia's like, fuck, I
have to amp up my heterosexuality and so gross.
So that's all I have to say. Gross Coley catches them, about
to get her, Sonia and Trent in the Blonder room. 5 seconds for
fucking and it's really disturbing.
No, thank you. Like, no thank you.
I'm glad we didn't hear the end of that or where that was
actually headed. Thank you, Haley, Because ill.
It's like just ill Good reason we're following Coley.
Yeah, so that I don't. Like it?
No, I don't like it at all. It was fucked up and super.
It's just like Sonia was just very much on the.
She's again acting and acting outward and overcompensating for
her own feelings, just and just. It's almost like OKI hate to say
this, but it's almost like what Trent does in a way, because
Trent can't deal with responsibility, so he just or
feelings and he just acts out his feelings on other people or
just blames other people for his own shortcomings.
Whereas Sonia kind of like. Through her acting out in
herself, Preservation ends up hurting other people as well,
but she's self aware she's doing it.
And Trent isn't like she hates herself and she doesn't want to
Like she hates herself is really the bottom line.
She does not love herself, which is the big problem, which is a
big problem and relatable. It's like loving ourselves is
like the one of the hardest things you, and nobody teaches
you how to do this, but like it's it's hard to love you for
who you are. Because like, we're constantly
comparing ourselves to other people and like what other
people want us to be. And so Sonia is super fucked up
because of all of that. So it's like you can't blame
her. But like when you're in Coley's
head, it's like you're hurting Coley, you're hurting me.
Like this is super fucked up, but it's self preservation and
she's scared and panicking and doesn't know what to do.
She only knows like, well this is what I'm supposed to be.
Why can't I just be like this? You know, so it's very sad to
watch someone self destruct like that.
Yeah, and then poor Coley kind of ends up in that situation
with Alex when he's being nice to her and she kisses him.
Any thoughts about that? Listen, Coley girl, I get it.
You just you you were like, all right, well, he's here.
He's nice to me. I guess I'll just try.
Guess what? No Gay.
She's 100% homosexual, not 62%, which is, you know.
Girl. You and that 60. 2% Theora.
I'll never let it go. What is the 62%?
Yeah, that's right. Heart stopper?
Jesus. It became a.
Meme later like 62% homosexual
and it's like the character takes a BuzzFeed quiz.
He's like am I gay? And he his answer is 62%
homosexual. He's turns out to be bisexual,
but so it's it's on point. But, like, it's just like it
became a meme for a while after that came out.
That's hilarious. OK, well, so no, I was Holly.
Holly Dunn got the 100. She did, because if she was
going to like get with anybody male in this book, the only
option was really Alex. Who is also maybe queer.
Yes, I really. I think Alex is a unabashed
bisexual myself. I hope so Normalized.
Bisexual men, please. Or, you know, maybe he doesn't
want to label. You never know.
So unfortunately at this party,
while she was dancing with Sonia, Coley dishes her jacket,
her mom's gene jacket. And so when she gets the fuck
out of there a few days later, the next day she's like, oh fuck
yeah, I need to, I need to go get that.
That's missing like and I need that because fuck everybody
else. Like, that's mine.
That betraying bitch is not going to get to keep this
affectionate because, like, she's still, like, fuck her, but
I love her kind of thing. So Curtis is like, you don't
seem, OK, let me drive you. We'll go get dinner.
And how about I you go do your errand and then we'll go to
dinner together? Because I want us to start
creating our own memories and creating our own, like,
traditions and stuff and being a family kind of thing.
And Chloe's like, yeah, whatever.
I guess I just want my jacket. So she goes there and I have to
find the the. This made me so angry because it
was just like the insanity that comes with like straight girl
crushes, where like they gaslight you and basically like
Sonia pretends like nothing again.
She's like, overcompensating and just like playing up the
heterosexual. Perfect girl Persona, so much
that she's basically, like, gaslighting Coli and being like
nothing happened. I don't know what you're talking
about. I I was always going to dance
camp. I didn't need to tell you.
You're my friend. You should just know that kind
of stuff. And Coli ends up leaving this
exchange and goes home and she's like, I can't think.
I can't think about being crazy. She starts thinking she's crazy
because the girl's just gaslighting her and she's like,
I know I'm not. I know what happened was real
and it's like. It's one of those, like, it
feels like a street girl crush kind of scenario that she's
having where it's like, was this real?
Am I crazy? Like, is she crazy?
It was crazy in this scenario, you know, I hate that feeling.
It's awful. It's it's uniquely A queer
thing. That's just the denial of
reality. And I don't know it's it just
is. I think it was, I think it was
also really a really big thing for that time period too because
it was getting a little bit easier to be out in public.
But it was still you know, you still had more.
You know you can still get the shit beat out of you easily for
being out in public, especially small town.
Small town, Don't fuck nowhere, America.
Like that's scary. The Ogrefeld decision didn't
happen yet. Gay marriage was not legal yet.
Like so. Yep.
But yeah, I just. That the gas lighting is what
pissed me off. I was just like, she's denying
it herself, but also saying, no, this didn't happen.
Coley, don't. Correct, Right.
It's one thing to deny it because, and that's what pissed
me off about her betraying Coley by like telling about her
mother. Because it's like, it's one
thing to deny your trauma. It's a whole other thing to like
shit on somebody else's, you know, or like, share it without
your without their permission. And that's kind of what she's
doing here. She's just, she's making her
feel like she's crazy when she's not, you know, It's just.
I hated that. Yes, it's because she never.
She's not going to say it out loud, but as long as Coley is
okay with things not being, with, not actually naming what's
going on and it happening when no one's looking, then they're
cool. But the moment Coley's like, no,
it's fucking Sonia's got to shut that down.
And she does it in the most cruel way.
It's yeah, cruel. Is the perfect descriptor.
It's just yeah, I don't like it. I don't like it.
I understand why. I just hate it.
Yeah, and I like that. The embarrassment hits me with a
bewildered rush. I want to protest.
I want to fight for, I don't know, us.
But she's saying there isn't any us, that there never wasn't us.
That I'm imagining it. I'm not.
And that's when she's like, I know you told your friends about
my mom. Because that's really fucking
awful. Yeah, like, fuck you.
Which Sonia's just, like, silent.
And then Coley's like, are you even going to apologize for
betraying my trust? And then is you just like, Nope,
just silent. And that's when I love that,
Coley says. You're making really shitty
choices, she just tells her. Yeah, no, she is.
And like before that too, we already talked about it, but
like the the. OK, so like Sonia and Trent had
a thing or whatever, and Trent thinks they still have a thing
even though they don't. And I'm pretty sure he's hooking
up with Brooke. And he thinks he owns Sonia
because she's like the prettiest girl at school or their friend
group or whatever The fuck. So he feels like he owns her or
whatever, and so her Coley picks up on how she behaves around him
immediately and the way he she just excuses his behavior, his
shitty behavior. And Coley very much points out
she's like, you're you're choosing to behave like this.
So you do realize that, right? Like.
Yeah, so he's like, no, that's just, this is what love is.
You just take what you can get, or like, whatever.
And like, he's, you know, it's whatever.
Like, boys are like this. This is what love is.
And Cole was like, no, no, no. You're like choosing to like go
along with all this stuff. And so, like, this was like,
really just the big breaking point for her.
She's like, you as a whole are just making really bad decisions
and you're gonna regret this shit one day.
And I love me too much to deal with this, So I'm gonna go.
Yeah, fuck the shit. I'm out is basically what closes
it. Well.
Holy really learns the I learns how to love herself, which is
you can't truly love another person until you really love
yourself. Honestly, yeah.
She's like only a really only really awful person doesn't
apologize when they've done something like that.
And she's like, it's unforgivable.
Yeah, it definitely is. So, Speaking of bad choices,
while Sonia's at dance camp, Coley meets Blake.
Blake. I thought Blake was fun,
Especially like when they first meet and she's like, you can
steal that champagne, I'll give a fuck.
And she's like, I don't know, they were kind of a mess
together. But did Blake know that Coley
was stealing? Oh, yeah.
Oh yeah. She just didn't give a shit.
She's like, whatever, you don't pay me enough to give a fuck
about this place. Like she gave me those times.
She's like, I'll give a fuck. See ya.
Yeah, she didn't care because she brings it up later, like
they have the conversation, like whatever.
But that whole thing basically starts where it's like gaydar,
first of all. That's how that starts.
And. Coley's in this position where
she's like, well, Sonia's never going to love me.
Like for real, because she just threw a bomb on my life and fuck
that. So I need to just move on
because being hung up on her is only going to hurt me in the
long run. But with and, it's like knowing
that is one thing. But when you're emotionally not
ready for that, it leads to poor decision making that ends up
hurting other people. And Coley is kind of learning
this lesson the hard way with Blake, because they start kind
of like getting together a little bit and like Coley's just
like all I can think about is Sonia.
And like, I don't even know if I really like this girl.
I'm just trying to be nice. And in in the end, she's.
Like I'm just going to hurt her and because I'm not mentally and
emotionally here basically. And it's just it's like coping
when you're. Not really ready to like you
know it's coping takes time no matter what it is that you lost.
And Coley up until this point has lost a lot that you can say
that she's probably lost the two people who mean the most of her
have ever meant the most of her at this point in her life.
Her mom and Sonia. And you know, that kind of loss
takes time for you to process and just and heal because it's
like a it's like a big giant wound that like it needs time to
just. Heal and she's just like rushing
into this thing with Blake and it's like to try and get the
healing to happen faster. And it's like, that's not how it
works, dear Coley, how it works. You can't rush.
You can't rush the healing process, unfortunately, Yeah.
It's such a human thing to do, to just try to push yourself
through the grief and the pain to get to the result.
And you're like, listen, if I do this, maybe I will just
magically everything will be okay and glued back together.
But yeah, and I'm still there, staring you in the face after
you realize. Like I relate to Coley in this
I've been in this position. That.
Not fun for anyone and like. And Coley learns the big lesson,
which is like. Jumping into another
relationship doesn't fix anything.
When it came to like relationships falling apart, and
particularly when they're not your fault, when it's really, it
really was the other person had their shit to figure out and it
really like it's not Coley's fault that it fell apart.
It is 100% the other person and it's really hard to deal with
that and acknowledge that especially it just is very hard
and so. Sometimes it just takes a lot of
time and you have to just like learn to love yourself and like
learn that like other people loving you is not you know
that's not the ultimate validation like you you loving
you and just yell of you first and and Coley kind of gets there
towards the end of the book and like this was just kind of like
the experiment of can I just relationship my way out of this
and. The.
Answer is no, no, no honey, you got to go through it.
No, no no it don't work like it don't work like that it.
Don't work like that. But one relationship where it
does work out is her and her dad, because they've through the
through the summer while Sunny's away, they they clear, clear the
air, which is really great because Coley's kind of been
avoiding, like, talking about her mom.
And avoiding really like letting her dad in.
But slowly they start like going to dinner at the Hibachi place
together. And like, Coley was kind of even
afraid of that because she's like, I think her mom's
Japanese. And I think that was why they
were mentioning this. And she's like, this reminds me
of Mom's food and like, you know, and you must remind my dad
of that. Maybe that's why he goes here.
And they finally have the conversation where they like
hash out their past where like he really tells her what
happened. And why he wasn't involved.
And it's because he was like, I was waiting for your mom to come
back and she never did. Like, I didn't give up.
I mean, he did, but he's like, I didn't give up on like loving
you guys. I was just like waiting for her
to sort her shit out and then come back to me and he says some
line where he's like, oh, I think I I noted it because I
really liked it. Where he?
Said one second. Nope, Nope.
That's on it. He said something where it was
like, if I sit around, basically it was like if I could do it all
again. Like I I learned that I need to
like actively do something and not wait for things to come to
me kind of thing. So it's like the the big lesson
that Coley needs to learn for like the Sonia stuff to get
resolved was here. Because the tragedy of that was
he's like, it seems like her mother still loved her father
because she wore the necklace the day she died that her dad
made her. She kept the Jean jacket, which
Coley finds out. It was Curtis's jacket.
Her mom took it and just kept it and kind of wore it to the to
the. She wore it so much, it was
like, she mentioned that like, oh, the Jean jacket is like,
it's like thin because it was so worn all the time.
So, like, her mother, like, clearly, like still loved her
dad. But like, whatever happened,
neither of them made an action to resolve it.
And so it ended up with them being split apart for like 14
years. And they never got to resolve
that. And so I think that's a lesson
that Coley takes to heart and is like, yeah, I don't want that to
be me. Exactly.
And like, either consciously or subconsciously, that's what
drives her back to Sonia. And there's the part where she's
talking to him about Sonia and how and, like, breaking down
because of the grief. And she's finally telling Curtis
pretty much what's going on. And then he says something that
I was like, holy shit, you're being a dad, Curtis.
Fuck yeah, good job. Because he says you were the
good part of whatever you had with her, Curtis says fiercely.
You were the good part of everything, sweetie.
We can't control what people do, how they betray us, or even why
how they leave our lives. So many people are running
scared and sometimes they run back to us and earn back our
trust. But the ones that don't come
back or won't work. To earn back what they lost from
us, we have to learn how to let them go.
I needed to read that in that. I need you to read that.
Thanks, Haley. Thank you, Curtis Hydrate.
For lesbian. Jesus, everyone hydrate for
lesbian Jesus. I started crying when I read
that. I don't cry when I read books.
Ever. Curtis is drinking.
So intensely right now. I know your eyes were so like,
you were really hydrating. For a lesbian and Jesus
dehydrated, I need lesbian Jesus.
Don't we all, we all need lesbian Jesus?
You know who? Needs lesbian Jesus the most,
though Sonia does, so let's hop on over to her Live Journal
entries. Wait, Jesus?
Oh my God. From dance camp.
Oh my God. OK, first of all.
So I essentially have this much time to write though.
Oh, she explains it, basically. She's so brief overview of
what's happening in dance camp. She's fucking up, really,
because her brain is back in bum fuck nowhere with Coley and the
way she fucked up. And so she's fucking up dance
camp to the point where, like, her dance coach tells her mom.
And so she takes all these extra lessons and like basically just
like hides from everybody because she's like, embarrassed
that she like, used to be the star and now she's not the star.
And she kind of does what Trent does.
Or she's like this is all faith's fault and it's like
girl. No.
You done fucked up. So she's doing this at night and
she like sneaks into the computer room because remember,
you don't have, you can't do this on your phone, There's no
laptop. She has to go to the computer
lab on site at night when nobody else is using it, and she's like
journaling at night. This is what's happening.
And so she's flitting between like.
Her overly enthusiastic fake shit of like, yeah, I'm killing
it for her friends on the public entry.
And then just like Angsty Emo is fucked out of her private
entries. My favorite one is the one where
she has, like the Linkin Park numb.
Song I. Love that song, first of all.
And then OK, then she's basically being like, wow, this
is all Coley's fault. I can't believe this shit.
And she's mad about Faith because Faith is living her best
gay life right in front of Sonja's face.
And Sonja's pissed about that because that's what she wants
and can't feels she cannot do. And so she says in her live
journal entry about Faith. I wouldn't be so proud if I were
her. I heard her mother doesn't even
speak to her anymore. Her parents split up because of
her. Her dad took her side and her
mom. Love isn't very unconditional,
no matter what they say. I learned that when my mom and
dad split up, a family breaks and it doesn't leave a scar.
It's a wound. Sometimes it doesn't heal.
So, like, the thing she's really afraid of is, like, losing
everything, right? And like, even though her mom is
the worst, she's like, she's still my mom, and I don't want
to lose her. I don't want to lose at, like,
seeing my sister Emma. What if they take Emma away from
me? What if my dad's leave me
because? I'm like faith, like I'm
different and I'm gay and they can't deal with that.
So, like, it's not. So it's it.
It is the stuff that her mom's imposing on her.
But she's like, if I do reveal that I can't be, it's like
Beatrice from worry or not. If I can't be the thing you're
trying to force me to be, you know I'll never get love from my
family. I'll never like they'll leave
me. Like, that's what she's really
worried about. That's the thing.
It's not that she's afraid of, like.
Who she is, she's afraid of. When that gets out of the bag,
she'll lose it all and you know, kind of thing.
She doesn't want to be the thing that splits her family up.
And just because she can't control her gayness.
Yeah, exactly. And I think that the characters
named Faith, because I think Faith is the literal and
representation of a leap of faith.
Because for Sonia, she's seeing. Sony's on the cliff's edge.
Let us say she is. She's got the feels.
She's. Made out with the girl.
Cat's out of the bag. She's on the cliff's edge, and
on the other side she sees Sonia.
The person she she could be. She's out.
Doesn't give a fuck. Still has friends.
Her family split up. Her.
Which Sonia girl? Your family already split up.
Like, what are you afraid of? And Sonia's got a dance
girlfriend and she's like, well, that could be me.
But it's it's safer for me to be on this, on this side and not
take that leap quite yet. So, like, I think that Tony's
faith is the temptation, right? She's the leap of faith.
This is what I could be if I if I just do it.
Your. Name is faith because you got.
To have faith of faith, faith. Yeah, it was true.
You have to have the faith that everything's going to be like
you know that you're going to be OK and in the end, like you
might go through some rough patches, but in the end you'll
be you and. You are worthy of love, which is
the point of the book. I yes, I love that she went from
Hold on. I love that she went from
Maneater Nelly Furtado to numb Linkin Park.
That's. What I'm saying it's just just
love it. It's You gotta listen to my
playlist And then and then and then from Vanessa Carlton 1000
Miles to I know that. One fucking chasing cars.
Freaking chasing cars. It's what was pop.
It's popular stuff that people love and then it's how she's
actually feeling, which is like chasing cars is such a such a
freaking emotional fuck around song.
Yeah, I can't listen to that song anymore.
Trauma. Yes.
Is a relationship. Take your word for it.
Yeah. All right.
Any more about Sonia at dance camp?
You pretty much you got it. You nailed that.
All right, so while Sonia is getting her cliff's edge on,
Coley decides. To she she's.
Bonds with Curtis over the summer and she decides to get a
summer job working at the Hibachi Place.
Because she wants to be distracted, huh?
She needed for sure. Well, first of all, she needs
money because don't we all. And she needed to get out of the
house, meet people and it's a place that her and her dad were
starting to go to. And she's like, oh, this place
is pretty nice. I like the vibes, like, yeah,
let me get a new family. So work, family and.
They do this cute thing, the employees where they do family
dinner at at the end of the day. If you work the evening shift
where the chef makes everybody food that you just eat family
style where you like share amongst each other and that's
when they like bond with each other.
And I don't have notes in the section, you guys do I.
So the really important part about this, besides the fact
that Coley has like this this thing in her life now that gives
her some something to do and somewhere to direct her energy
and you know, something that she's good at because you can
obviously tell from the the how it's how it's written that she
really falls in with these people.
And it it is like one of those work family things and she's
good at her job and she wants to be good at it.
She enjoys the work. She enjoys having that purpose.
And then during a family dinner at the at the end of the shift,
her boss Kendrick boss Kendrick's boyfriend Ty, shows
up and the way that they are with one another just shows
Coley. What a a loving queer
relationship can be. And when it's just normal and
accepted because nobody bats an eye and Coley's like anybody
else, see that? Interesting.
And it's just the way that, So Ty had brought mushrooms for
Chef, and Chef is just like. Oh, special mush.
Not special mushrooms. You know what I mean?
Like, they're like really fancy heirloom mushrooms or some shit.
I don't know about mushrooms, but obviously they have this
whole experience where obviously Ty has heard a lot about Coley
and so it just makes her feel so included.
And to see this freaking them holding hands, just being normal
at dinner and everybody is just like chill, it just shows her
what it can be. This was my note.
Ty and Kendrick normalize it. Representation matters.
Yeah, because yes, she's just like she sees them hold hands
and then she's like, she's trying not to look because
again, you're just like, yay. But also, I can't stare at you.
It's. It's such a good reflex.
It's just like it's such a wild, yeah.
But like, also she's like, why is No, she's like, I'm cool with
this, but no, why does everybody else seem cool with it?
Yeah. She's like everybody else here
seems cool that like what? That's a reality like this can.
Be a thing. This can be a thing.
And you know what? It was the exact same thing that
was earlier when I forgot to mention.
Are you saying something? Caitlyn with me?
Yes. With Faith.
When Sonia watched Faith and Orion.
What a name. Kiss.
And she's like, oh shit. Is this is it?
I'm pretty sure that's like a common thing, Theora.
They look so beautiful that it looks so right.
Because fucking representation matters, guys.
It just. Writes because I'm sure that
they're that's in this book as well.
I borrowed books from theorists. I don't think I wrote that in
there. I don't know, but I've.
Seen it somewhere in one of the books that I took.
Oh. Yeah, maybe it is that book
because it's not going to be a big Swiss because they were
just, they were queer and they didn't give a flying fuck in
that book. It was great and that's why I
love it. Yeah, so.
Caitlin. What is your note, please?
There's a note in here. Say it, he said.
I miss family breakfast. You know, we used to eat
together in Vancouver. It's important.
Bonding. Food.
Bonding. Yes.
Theora's. Eggs.
Bonding. Yes, I'm.
Italian food and bonding. It's means everything.
I make them like you now, but they're not the same.
Theora can make a poached egg with nothing.
Yeah, Pure will. I did it too.
You did? I did.
That's right. We will have eggs again one day.
So unfortunately we can't stay at family dinner with all those
cool people that she worked with.
We have to. I wish family dinner was longer.
I do too. And I wish we didn't have to go
back to Sonia's really annoying friends.
But we do, because she gets invited to a party.
It's. OK, so I was like, I was Coley
in the scene where, like, SJ finds her and she's like, oh, I
want to invite you to a party. And Coley's like, does she know?
Does she know? Like, because who does this?
Unless they're like I understand, my friends in love
with you and you guys are having problems.
You know, try to play. Matchmaker a little.
Bit. And Coley's like, fuck that
shit. I'm not going to go to a party.
I'm not going to the party. I'm not going.
And then she's like, I already knew before I biked home.
I was going, yeah. I.
Just love her. SJ does explain to to Coley
about Sonia telling her about Coley's mom because she wanted
to make sure her reaction was supportive and and good enough.
She didn't want to, you know, have she wanted to be there for
Coley, and she knew that SJ had a unique viewpoint on that since
SJ's sister had tried to commit suicide and survived.
So SJ explains that that's why Sonia told her, and that Brooke
just happened to overhear it, and then that's how the
information got out. She knows Trent hates Coley, and
she's like, let me spread this rumor.
That's all. She's.
Pick me. She runs off and blabs to
everyone about Coley's mom. Which why would that make anyone
not like Coley? She's dumb.
Brooke is dumb. I mean, I know she's just trying
to score points with Trent by like, hey, Trent, guess what?
But anyway, fuck that shit. I guess we're going to the
party. Yeah, so we go to the party and
of course the gayest thing happens.
So when you like, opens the door for Colleen Knox or something
ridiculous, it's just like, what the fuck?
So yeah, poor Coley can't, like mentally, like, prepare herself
to like, I'm just going to walk in and I'll mingle and then I'll
find her. Because her mission, Coley's
mission, is to talk to Tonya, talk to Sonia because she's
like, fuck this, like, aim shit. She's like, we need to talk in
person because you can't hide from me when we're in person.
So yeah, so she, like, immediately sees her and then is
like my brain is blank. What is my name?
Where do I live? What is going on?
Fuck.
Fuck, that's all she does now.
But then she gets they get their little conversation, gets
interrupted by who else? That asshole.
Trent. Go away, Trent.
Go away, you absolute homophobic asshole.
Oh my God, yeah. We forgot to mention this whole
scene we're recapping is literally the music video from
girl like girl, Yes, but it was a dialogue.
So yeah, Cole goes to this party and then like.
I don't know, Wanders around for a bit.
I forget what happens. I just know that Sonia leaves
and go to the pool. Sonia gets, so here's what
happens. Trent drags Sonia off at 1st and
Sonia's like doesn't want to go with him, but she's like
literally dragging her. And then Coley kind of wanders
around for a while and she decides, well fuck this, I'm
going to go since I'm not going to get her alone.
And then that's when she's goes outside and see.
Or she sees Sonia through the window, I think, sitting by the
pool. And that's when she goes outside
and is like finally I'm going to get to have this conversation
with her. And that's where it starts, that
the the big scene from the music video and the book.
Because guess what? Trent interrupts #2 at coming
up. Just trigger warning on that
because they they actually have a conversation.
The She and Cole have a conversation for fucking.
Once after dance camp, and Sonia leans her head on Coley's
shoulder and they're about, then they're about to kiss because
Coley's like, you could basically.
She's saying, hey, you could have me.
Like, we could have this. You just need to like, be brave
and do it. And so go over the cliff's edge,
basically, is what she's saying. Jump off the.
Cliff and Sonia's like, okay. Maybe I can, maybe I can.
And so they're about to kiss when Trent grabs Coley by the
hair and she slams her head, Slammed her head.
And then he starts screaming at Sonia and grabs her chin.
And it's like, I can't believe you did this to me, etcetera,
etcetera, do she ass shit and like hurts her.
And Coley sees Sonia in pain physically because she predicted
all the way back in the beginning of the book when she
met Trent, that he would be the kind of guy that would get
violent. And so that triggers something.
And Coley to where she's like, oh fuck no, I have love.
And like on my side, and she starts beating the shit out of
Trent and of course. Bitch.
Exactly. And then she gets pulled off of
Trent because they have to actually physically pull her off
of Trent. And of course, the friends are
like what happened and Sonia's like he hit her first.
And Brooke's like. Oh fuck that trick.
You're hurt, but. I'm like, fuck off, Brooke.
So while all of that craziness is going on, Coley is like, I
think this is my moment to exit. So I I have, I have put myself
out there and it's now her turn. And so Coley goes to get her
bike and before she can pedal away.
Who comes running after her but Sonia?
And then she's like, OK, yes, let's do this.
Kiss, kiss, kiss. And then the iconic Coley riding
on her bike with. The split lip with the split lip
at the beginning and the end of the Yeah.
So fabulous. This whole thing, my brain was
like, what the hell? What?
What is happening? Just what you'll see.
It in the music video, yeah. Caitlin, the music video is more
confusing if you don't read this because there's no context for
any of it. It's just, yeah, but yeah, the
ending scene was the music video.
But she kisses her while she's just like, blood.
Yeah, No. It's just a split lip.
It's just she's. Like the book, it makes it sound
like. Like her face is bloody, no, the
back of her head. And she has like a split lip.
You'll see. It's really good.
Caitlyn. We're going to educate Caitlyn
after this. We're so excited.
Education. Yay.
Education I did. I did have one last note.
Do it. This was this is my favorite
from this scene. I kiss her one more time.
A sweet, simple kiss that we've never shared before.
The kind of kiss you get to have.
When it's not sad or worried or weighted by anything bad.
The kind of kiss that says hi and I love you and I miss you
and I'll always be next to you. Yeah, it.
Doesn't matter if there's blood on my face, I will kiss you
forever. Now I want to know yes, hurting.
And then Matt, in my wounds, so gay.
It's just a 03. But yeah, no, that's important
because like, up till now it's just been all this, like,
heightened emotional stuff. And so it's like, now you can
just be free and just be me. And it's beautiful.
So thank you, Haley, for writing that.
It was great. Any other notes you wanted to do
Bree before we just jump into like no discussion?
I was just trying to find. More on how bloody she is for
Caitlin Burning. She's Not.
You'll see it in the music video.
It's just a split lip. It's fine.
All right. So general discussion time.
So overall, So that was Girls Like Girls, The book.
We just spoiled literally everything about it.
What did you guys think? Did you like it?
Would you read it again? I'd love to punch me in the
fields and I will be reading it again multiple times.
Go Caitlin. Go Caitlin, Contrary to what you
might think, because I barely spoke in this episode, I did
like the book because it was really easy to read and I I
could understand everything. And it's very easy.
It's just something that you read out and about.
Yeah, it's it's like you can read it in one day.
Yeah, I think I talked my friend into reading it.
Fine, yeah, It was pretty easy. I'm like you read it one day.
It felt real though. The way she wrote it, it felt
like based on a true story is like the the vibes I got from
this because it just, it felt very real.
And since it was from like the time of Theora and I kind of
growing up, it was we were kind. I was a little bit older, but we
were in the same kind of age bracket as Haley when she's
writing all of this. Like that time period in her
life, we were all kind of the same age.
So it is just like such a freaking blast from the past of
being almost back there in your fields.
But then at the same time for me it was like also because of
current situations like a being present in in other there were
just like so many things that you.
My point is, it doesn't matter how old you are, there's there's
something in there you'll relate to as far as like love and.
Awesome. And just being a teenager, Yeah,
that's actually really funny. I didn't realize.
I think Haley's a year older than me.
I think it's Haley, me. And then after us is Taylor
Swift which is really funny 878089.
Yeah, you guys are like the same age as my little sister.
Yeah, cool. Yeah, I like the book.
I would read it again. Like I said, contrary to the
media we keep doing, I'm not super huge on high school stuff.
I want adults being messy and ridiculous.
But I know this is really cute the way I just love the way she
wrote it. Honestly, I was really.
I didn't know what to expect going into the book.
I was like, I'm going to read it.
It's Haley Kyoko's book. But I was really impressed with
her emotive language. And like it reads like I was
like this is a lyricist writing this.
Yes, it shouldn't be a surprise, but I was very I was pleasantly
surprised by how well it was written and how it read.
Very. It just felt so real.
Especially Coley's inner monologues.
And it's usually the inner monologues and first person
point of view that just pissed me off after a while and they
get really repetitive. She did not do that.
She wrote that character really, really well.
And I and I like the live journal entries in there because
I like when we. I like skipping point of views
personally, but I like this because Sonia, Sonia is a
mystery to Coley and Sonia kind of still stays a mystery because
you're only privileged to what she's choosing to write and
choosing to, you know share on Live Journal.
So I did like that aspect. It kept that, kept that
character still complicated and if somebody you want to figure
out the way Coley wants to figure it out.
So it it read really well from her point of view, like the
whole book. And I really, really like the
way she wrote it. I agree.
Alright, yeah. So as we mentioned at the very,
very beginning of this, Haley spent many, many, many years
pitching this as a movie and trying to get it made and it
just did not pan out. So.
We're going to play a little game and play the We're the
casting director. Oh my God, Caitlin, what is?
This. She's.
Showing. She's showing everyone our pics.
All right, so we're going to cast the movie.
I'll go first. So for Coley, I picked Medora.
Frenchies. She.
Yes, Caitlin. I didn't know who it was until I
looked up the names. That's why I was going to
explain who the people are. But this works too.
So she is, She plays, she plays Alicia on sex lives of college
girls. And so I picked her because
she's half Asian. That's not the main reason I
picked her. I picked her because she's
somebody who could play Coley, because Coley is somebody who
has big gay energy, first of all and can play the like soft and
sweet and then also like edgy, tough and she's 5 foot two.
So I was like, she's perfect because the whole scene with
Trenton, when she goes to fight him and I was just, I just got
her being like I'm 5 foot 2, the way that she like, starts fights
with people like I was like, she's perfect, She can play that
role. Alicia would be great.
As soon as I saw this, I was like, oh shit, that's perfect.
No, she's. Perfect.
What are we going to do after that exactly, Caitlin?
Anyway, continue Theo. Just cast.
Do you want to cast? All right.
And then for Sonia, I would cast Zendaya, because she's Zendaya
and I think she can play the, you know, perfect girl very well
who's also super complicated. And she could bring that, like,
emotion to the table. She's like, she has the range.
Is what I'm saying for the theatrics.
I just, she's just, I grew up with her.
Her acting is beautiful. I think that they would work
well together. So she's my Sonia Zendaya and
then I wanted to cast Blake. Because I thought it would be
fun. And so I chose Liv Houston
because I think they could play Blake like no other.
Liv plays Teen Van and Yellow Jackets.
They've been in a bunch of things.
They've been in a bunch of things and I think that they
could do like the I I broke into your trailer to steal your weed.
Really. Well, I was like, Lou would be
so firm. Make sure this there by Blake
and I would like to see live in Midori, do stuff together.
Were they part of the gay couple and let it snow?
Yes. Oh yeah, we should watch that
movie one day. It's pretty good.
Yeah, I never actually finished that movie.
I'd like to watch it. Yeah, now lives in that lives.
Fucking. I love Santa Claria Diet.
I love everything lives in. No, I tried to.
Watch that it was just. It was.
Very, very weird. It's so good though, man.
So good. Anyway, so for Trent, I was
like, who has the most punchable face of all times?
And so I picked Jack Gleason, who played Joffrey in Game of
Thrones. I think, unfortunately, this man
has the most punchable face because he doesn't want to punch
Joffrey Brathian. I do.
Sorry, Jack, You're my Trent. And for Alex, I picked Taylor
Zachara Perez, who is playing Alex Claremont Diaz in the red,
white and royal blue movie. So he was in the brain.
I was like, you're the perfect Alex.
Hey, he's. I love him because he has that,
like he could be fiery and feisty but also like really
sweet and listen and so like he gave me that vibe.
He could be the chill Alex and then the fuck you Trent kind of
Alex so. But I love how your people are
all are all in like the 30s. Listen, I don't know young
actors and I was looking for people who could bring it with
their acting skills. Age is irrelevant.
OK. You're trying to go next
Caitlyn? Yeah, Let's go, Caitlyn.
Wow. You did the whole thing.
Let's go, let's go. Oh yeah.
So this started out as me saying I have no one cast, and then
throughout like the past few hours, I have like literally the
entire book cast. Alright, so I was struggling
with Coley because Theore told me to just picture Haley Kyoko
when I was reading. So.
That's no, literally like I if a Dreamcasting is Haley Kyoko is
Coley. But like if we had to cast
somebody else. So I picked Paris.
I can't say the last name Baroque.
She's put in a few things you guys are not going to know.
Most of my people, I feel like, because they are younger and
that's OK. Shows that I grew up with like,
so she was in Lab Rats and Alexa and Katie on Netflix for Sonia.
I picked McKenna Grace because this girl can like literally do
anything and she's just amazing. I love her.
So yes, that's my reasoning for that.
She has tiny vibes for sure. For all right, SJI picked J.
Like this is a good SJ. Joey, I feel like Joey and
McKenna, I think they actually are friends in real life.
But they would play friends pretty well.
Yeah. And she looks like she could cut
a bitch. So that's what we need for SJ.
Yeah. It's very versatile as well,
right? No, not Brooke.
I have Jennifer. Sega.
Yeah. Alright, I think.
Oh man. Poor Jetta.
Jenna. I think Jenna could do it.
Jenna. I know she could do it, but
yeah, I for for Brooke. I saw someone with like dark
hair and like this. So I I picked Jenna because I
saw her name and I was like, well, I know she can do shit for
Blake. Theore brought up Bella Ramsey.
Yeah, that was my second choice. And I.
Was like, well they need to be in here somewhere, so yes.
Blake. But I don't know.
See, like Ramsey could what, 100% steal weed out of
somebody's house? Like.
They have such a baby face, but
then you get here and you're like, OK, a little.
More rugged. I'm saying I look at.
Them in the suit, like, yes. Oh my gosh, Don't.
Don't pitch that. Don't pitch the interview like
that. If we ever, I'm just saying
because like Blake comes off as like cool and like.
I want. I want see The thing is, this is
what I know Bella as very very different than what the hell is
her name. Elastomus, right?
Different than what? Yeah, Ellie.
Oh, Ellie. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know Bella
from Game of Thrones, which is even more out there than what
you're talking about. So, Yep.
But yeah, Brooke, good choice. But I feel like you could easily
make him look very punchable. All right, so for Trent, I
picked Milo Manheim and he was in Disney Zombies and I don't
know, I he's usually like the good.
Oh, no. Yeah, I would punch his face.
Look at him. Yeah.
So sorry, Milo. I'm sure you're a great dude,
but I think you could pull it off.
And then for Alex, I don't. I've never seen this actor, but
I was doing research and I picked Noah.
Snap, snap, snap. I don't know.
But from. Stranger Things.
Oh, from Stranger Things. Oh my God, yeah.
He's a great Alex, great choice. And they just found out that
he's out. So.
Oh yeah, yeah, he's. There.
You go, he is. Sorry.
Oh, he got into you, Pen. That's.
Good for you. Good for you.
I love your casting, Caitlin. Great job.
Thank you. All right, Bree, who you got?
Well, you guys did better than me because I was just working
off of. I don't know my brain.
So here's my Coley because Fivel Stewart is in my brain.
I have always seen her as somebody that can have is really
good at acting with that defense, like sarcasm, defense
mechanism, type deal that Coley has.
To where she's like automatically on the defensive
in in like all these conversations with new people
and I think that she's capable of playing of you know playing
the more awful grief emotions as well.
And then for Sonia Isabella Gomez because good Lord, that
woman I know she could do it. I know she could do it.
And she's also I also took in the height difference into
consideration. I mean just look at like when we
we know her mostly from playing Elena in one day at a time.
Right. But if you see her in her like,
oh her own self, you it's just like, yes, I could see her being
that girl that everybody wants but that has has the range to be
like the to play the the scenes that Sonia has to play and then
I love her. Excellent choice.
So Trent, Because he's the only other one I cast.
So from Wednesday? Oh yes, Hunter doing.
Good, Joyce. What?
Remember this dude? He was like, the main romance
interest for that whole season. You.
Know what's funny? Is he gay?
I have no clue. I don't know.
Anyway, so that's gonna pick because he's really good at
acting. Hunter Doohan do Hunter Doohan.
He's really good at acting Douchey because he did that to
his character was to turn Douchey in the end of that.
But he's also like that super, you know, has that Allamerican
handsome boy look too. I just saw him as a good.
Good. All right guys.
Yeah, that's a good fit. The duality of just like
presenting as like perfect, perfect boy and then being a
complete trash on the other end. Yeah, he hunter can do it for
sure. Good.
Well, hopefully if this book stays on the New York Times
enough, we may get the movie one day.
Who knows? All we can do is hydrate to
lesbian Jesus and manifest, manifest, manifest.
Finish that show. All right, before this goes off
the rails, let us actually. Hydrate for lesbian Jesus on our
hydration scale in her honor it for her book.
So how much would you hydrate for lesbian Jesus for lesbian
Jesus's? Book 10 Cups.
Damn. 10 cups, 8. All right.
I'm gonna give it a nine. I love it.
Yep, it's lesbian Jesus. As usual, I have no idea what
I'm basing my number off of. There was no dog, Kayla.
I was surprised I got an 8. Yeah.
I'm always. The lowest one for some reason.
Well, I think it's just that you could read.
It was just like I think it was a book that that was easily
relatable. So I think that number makes
sense. For sure.
All right, so that wraps up this book club.
Caitlin, would you like to announce what we're doing next
time on book Club? Sure.
Because theore can't do it because I still learn book.
He did. So next month we are reading
Rainbow Islands by Devon Hardnois, I think that's how you
say? It noise.
So. I'm excited to read this book
because of the book. And I have.
Fiora's notes in it Yeah, it's a it's another like book that's
easy to read like this one was. I read it for the Trans Rights
Readathon like I really I've mentioned it multiple times on
some something related to this podcast.
But a friend of mine who transitioned this book meant a
lot to them when they were going through that.
So we read it and it's. It's.
Sure, read the summary. Can you continue what you said?
No, go go for it. OK, 16 year old Jason chooses
exile and expects A hardscrabble life, but instead finds a
thriving, supportive community. While exploring his identity as
a transgender boy. He also discovers adventure
cracking attacks, naval battles of flying island built by
asexual people. And a daring.
Escape involving glow in the dark paint.
I hope that makes sense once you read this.
Ohh it does. This book is so fun.
He also has a desperate crush on Sky, a spirited Buccaneer girl.
But fear keeps him from expressing his feelings.
When Jason and his companions discovered the Republicans ohh
God are planning a war of extermination, they rally the
people of the Rainbow Islands to fight back.
Shy, bookish Jason will have to find his inner courage or
everything and everyone he loves will be lost forever.
I mean, it's great. It's true.
It's great. No, it's great.
And it's it's it's a happy story.
It's happy. My grandmother read it.
Ken's grandma read it. In a day.
So that'll be our next book club I think for November, August,
August. Is it August?
Yeah, that we're skipping a month.
We're skipping September. Is that what we're doing?
We'll talk about it. We'll.
Let you know on social, we'll let you know.
When this is happening. But this will be the next book
we're going to read because we're doing the spooky book in
October. Right, Yeah.
I thought this was September. Doesn't matter.
All right, so this will be next time we'll be skipping some
month. We'll let you know.
Yeah, it might change too, because of some stuff coming up.
Yeah, spoiler. Spoiler.
That's not. A spoiler.
It's not a spoiler until next time.
I dream for lesbian Jesus. OK.
It'll fall over the place. Bye.
And with that, we've been big Gay energy.
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