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Hello, ladies and gents Roberts.
Alex Quito Savage that 

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commented, they have got special
guest Marjorie Lucas on the line

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and she is one of my clients 
we've been working together for 

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years. 
I've helped to go through 

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multiple competition preps all 
with a ketogenic approach and 

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she is amazing. 
She's looked better every single

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time. 
She's at Grace, the stage, and 

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I've referenced her on several 
podcasts. 

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So I figured I'd just have her 
on the podcast because how we've

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gone about her reverse diet, and
how strategic and conservative, 

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and slow, and controlled. 
We've done, In this reverse that

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has been really eye-opening to 
me to see what's possible from a

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compositional standpoint from a 
metabolic standpoint, from a 

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hormonal standpoint with a slow 
and controlled reverse diet. 

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So I wanted to bring her on the 
show, talk about her experience,

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with the prep, with the reverse 
with all that stuff in my 

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mindset standpoint from a 
physical standpoint, all that 

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good stuff, all things, 
competition prep and reverse 

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diet-related. 
So without further Ado, sit 

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back, relax and enjoy the 
podcast with my good friend and 

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client Marjorie. 
And we are live. 

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Marjorie, how are you? 
I'm doing well, Robert. 

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Thank you so much for having me.
Yeah, I'm excited to chat with 

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you. 
So you are a client of mine. 

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We've been working together for,
how long have you been working 

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together? 
You're probably one of my 

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longest standing clients for 
sure. 

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Since 2019 since I started my 
bodybuilding Journey. 

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Yeah, it's been a long time for 
sure. 

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And you visits been cool to 
work, Them because I've seen all

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this change unfold over that 
entire period of time. 

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And I've referenced you on 
multiple podcasts as of late 

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because of your reverse diets 
and kind of how we've gone about

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that. 
Reverse that, which I think a 

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lot of people would benefit from
hearing, but before we dive into

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the reverse that can you give us
a little back story as to, what 

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got you interested in competing 
in the first place? 

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And kind of just bring us up to 
date. 

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As far as, you know, when you 
started competing what the 

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motivation was behind competing 
and how that's impacting. 

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Your life directly. 
Yes, definitely, Robert. 

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So what kind of got me into 
competing in bodybuilding shows?

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I used to be a long distance 
Runner. 

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And when, when I was like, 26, 
Yours old hats when I had to 

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stop running altogether only 
because my knees would lock up. 

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So that's not certainly good. 
And honestly just me training 

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and doing running. 
I wasn't able to train as hard 

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as I wanted to and that really 
just discouraged me to continue 

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on in the sport of long-distance
running. 

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So I really had to go into a 
different sport because I love 

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Fitness and I love fitness and 
health in general so I want that

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to be part of my life and so So 
in honestly bodybuilding and 

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competing and shows that with 
something in the back of my mind

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for a while, I knew that my 
nutrition was going to be 

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involved, so I even did my own 
like How It Fits your Macros. 

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And I did, I've done all those 
things and I've even even done 

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some tracking when I was about, 
maybe like 26, 27 years old and 

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I just continued that on. 
And and then even when I worked 

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as a A fitness kickboxing 
instructor. 

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I met more like-minded people 
and fitness and be start talking

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about you know, bodybuilding 
shows. 

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And that's how you know I looked
up things on YouTube of how 

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late, you know, bodybuilders how
they weigh their food, how they 

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track their macros and how they 
do training and how they kind of

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balance that with their life and
and honestly in 2019 that's when

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I just decided to just to go 
into that space and just say, 

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okay I'm going to do it. 
I'm going to Pete. 

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Yeah, no, totally. 
I think a lot of people when 

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people get into running, I feel 
like, especially I feel like 

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with females, a lot of females 
run to lose weight, to lean out 

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to have this trim, toned 
physique. 

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And I feel like there's a lot of
misunderstanding around women in

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weightlifting, and they just 
afraid afraid of getting jacked 

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in yoked and putting on too much
muscle looking like Arnold 

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Schwarzenegger. 
After a few weeks of lifting. 

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Was that ever a concern in the 
back of your mind? 

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Or did you not? 
I think that way at all 

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honestly, getting getting bulky 
from lifting weights, that was 

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never and as part of my mindset 
and for me as a mindset as a 

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runner like Iran, just so I can 
place like top five in my age 

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and late age category. 
Like, I remember the first 10k 

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race Iran. 
I think I've got, I want first 

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place in my age group, which I 
was like, I didn't think I was 

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capable of. 
So, That's when I just started 

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you like competitive running. 
Like yeah, like I trained for 

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for 10K races. 
I think that was like, my 

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favorite distance. 
But yeah, and then getting into 

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more, like the fitness 
kickboxing. 

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I just kind of like that work 
out because I was so used to 

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doing like, hit training and it 
was a great Outlet, especially 

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to, you know, get out anger 
because I worked a job that I 

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didn't really like, so going to 
kick boxing after work, really 

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helped. 
And then when I started to go, 

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go into weightlifting. 
It's funny cuz I All this cardio

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and kickboxing and stuff, but 
I've honestly like wanted to 

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have like a muscular body and by
that I know Bret Contreras the 

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he has like a booty training 
program I guess. 

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And I would look at his clients 
and I'm like I wish I can look 

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like that but these girls like 
they lift heavy and that's 

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something I didn't like know how
to do or that was something that

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That I didn't know how the 
training program would go. 

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Like, yes. 
Like I think there was a time 

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where I kind of stopped doing 
some cardio and I went to the 

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gym, but I was in the gym for 
two hours and do you like every 

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machine? 
Because I thought, that's what I

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had to do one, really? 
Yeah, when really it was and 

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when really, I really need to 
have a training program though 

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is really targeted to glutes and
shoulders. 

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Yeah, totally. 
I feel like, there's so much 

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misinformation around. 
You know what's needed to build 

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up like the booty. 
Specifically, you know, I feel 

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like there's just Everybody 
wants that that curve that 

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curvature and you're not likely 
going to get it doing hours on 

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end on the elliptical or the 
treadmill. 

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But you put yourself on the 
squat rack. 

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And that's where the magic 
happens. 

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Mhm, yes. 
So what exactly happened with 

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the running? 
So you said your knees were 

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locking up. 
Like what? 

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What kind of injuries 
specifically where you're 

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dealing with their? 
Well, because I'm not a huge fan

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of going to the doctor. 
So I, oh no, it's just me. 

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Like, with my with my training 
as far as running goes. 

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I just noticed. 
Like no matter and also no 

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matter how much rest I took from
running like my knees would just

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lock up and my training sessions
were not even that effective. 

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Like I couldn't do the Sprints 
like I wanted to, I couldn't do 

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the long-distance running like I
had wanted to and like my 

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running pace just started to 
slow down and for me that was 

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like very discouraging because 
like I'm used to like running a 

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mile like in seven minutes and 
so and so The I time like 

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decrease and only because of 
this wear and tear of my knees, 

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like it was just very 
discouraging. 

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So I just knew from there like I
had to do like a different form 

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of exercise and that's where I 
kind of found like Fitness 

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kickboxing because you're still 
getting that cardio. 

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And it was like and it was just 
like a different style workout 

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that I really loved. 
Yeah. 

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Any type of MMA or you know 
kicking sport or striking 

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support, like it's amazing how 
intensive that really is that 

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we've been doing MMA with our 
employees one. 

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As a week here at the compound 
and it's crazy. 

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Like I, oh, I'll be going at it 
for, like, 30 seconds on the mat

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with somebody. 
Yeah, what? 

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Like, I can do a leg workout, 
that takes two hours and I feel 

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like I'm more whoops. 
In 20 seconds going all out with

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these striking Sports. 
Yes, the I definitely love was 

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something I loved about. 
Kickboxing was definitely 

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learning the kicks, especially 
like roundhouse cooks and just 

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like feeling, so like powerful 
and strong, like ball hitting 

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the bag and yeah, like it just 
makes you feel Powered. 

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And that's why it kind of really
love that workout and not only 

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that. 
Like, when I started to do 

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kickboxing, I started to notice 
like my body, just like 

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gradually, like slim down, like 
it was so crazy like I was 

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getting more. 
I was getting more definition 

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but definitely not growing 
muscle from that workout. 

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It is pretty empowering to like 
have good quality control over 

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your limbs. 
I feel like when you're pursuing

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doing kicking like you have to 
have good balance, you have to 

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good flexibility. 
Like you have to really get 

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those those Honed in and I feel 
like doing a striking sport, 

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like that's a worthwhile 
Endeavor for that. 

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Plus you just feel more 
confident capable as someone 

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that can be self-sufficient and 
protect oneself if you need to, 

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you know, yes exactly. 
All right, so from there you get

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into the resistance training and
you decided to jump into the 

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world of, you know, figure 
competition and you reached out 

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to me. 
But what in the world made you 

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want to go kedo? 
I mean, because we started 

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working together as a 19 and 
when you're looking at all these

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magazines, In talking to other 
people that are competing and 

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looking at the glute programs 
and whatnot. 

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They're probably not doing 
Quito. 

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Yes. 
So I actually was keto way 

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before I started to do 
bodybuilding way before I 

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started to even want to do any 
sort of weight training. 

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So my journey and Aikido it's 
really funny because I think 

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I've started keto may be back in
2016 that was kind of like a 

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rough start. 
So I started yukito a Oh and I 

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didn't last for like 3 months. 
I think I lasted for two and a 

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half months and I like couldn't 
do it anymore. 

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I think one reason that maybe 
was you kito's I saw Drew 

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Manning on dr. 
Oz of course. 

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And and I was like so like 
profound at like the keto diet 

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because of course it's geared as
a weight loss diet and it's 

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like, oh so you can eat all the 
fats you want and not gain 

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weight even though that's really
not the truth. 

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I learned that the hard way and 
so And so yeah, that's when I 

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did he do. 
And when I attempted to do the 

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diet in 2016, it was very hard 
for me to like, stop eating 

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bread and like, honey and 
bananas. 

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Only because that will, those 
Foods were something. 

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I was very used to, especially 
being a fitness kickboxing 

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instructor, like I needed to 
have those cards to get me, 

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like, through my day and to 
teach classes and everything. 

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So, yeah, that was very hard. 
So then I decided, okay, next 

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year, 2017. 
Let me try the key. 

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No diet. 
Again, I remember I was actually

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getting out of a I was coming 
out of a trip from San Antonio, 

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visiting a friend, and then I 
came back home and that's when I

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started. 
And so, and I kind of did more 

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research on what foods you 
should incorporate. 

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So I really did that. 
I kind of did an overhaul of all

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the foods I was eating and I 
really kind of start to like 

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having a bulletproof coffee. 
I was in love with almond 

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butter. 
I think I still use a lot of 

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vegetables at Time. 
Like I was seeing a lot of 

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broccoli, spinach mixed greens 
and like bell peppers. 

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I tease. 
I didn't really have a lot of 

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protein at first, so I think 
that was like something I really

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did not get a grasp of how much 
protein you needed on keto. 

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And then I think I was in Quito 
for, like, a good three months. 

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And then I remember this was 
like the light bulb effect that 

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I had when I'm going through my 
day at home. 

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Home like doing chores. 
I go with meal prepping and I 

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was doing laundry and then some 
just doing chores out, chores 

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all day and so, I had a light 
bulb moment when I came into my 

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room, to grab my clothes, and I 
was walking through the hallway 

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and I'm just like, I feel so 
good right now. 

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Like the way I'm breathing and 
like, my mental Clarity, like, 

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it felt like I was breathing 
like fresh air, like from the 

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mountains, like, everything was.
So crisp and it just dawned on 

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me like I've been doing keto for
three months and I have all this

225
00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:21,300
energy. 
It was something that I was not 

226
00:12:21,300 --> 00:12:23,900
used to. 
And then and then I started to 

227
00:12:23,900 --> 00:12:26,600
remember that feeling throughout
my day and throughout the, like,

228
00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:28,700
the next piece to come and I 
started to realize, like, in the

229
00:12:28,708 --> 00:12:32,200
morning, I am like on my feet, 
like, in my kitchen, getting 

230
00:12:32,200 --> 00:12:37,600
myself ready and I'm not tired. 
Because I remember before, when 

231
00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:41,100
I used to have carbs for 
breakfast, I remember just like 

232
00:12:41,100 --> 00:12:45,300
sitting at my dining room table 
and drinking coffee and Just 

233
00:12:45,300 --> 00:12:49,500
having no energy at all like 
being sluggish and then when I 

234
00:12:49,900 --> 00:12:53,500
was doing keto for like, three 
months, that's when I realized, 

235
00:12:53,500 --> 00:12:55,900
like I have so much energy in 
the world right now. 

236
00:12:55,900 --> 00:12:59,400
So I think from that from that 
point on, I was like there's 

237
00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:02,500
probably no turning back to 
eating carbs now. 

238
00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:04,700
Yeah, it's crazy. 
Like when you eat a bunch of 

239
00:13:04,708 --> 00:13:08,400
carbs, like you just have this 
lethargy that just kind of 

240
00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:11,200
follows you around everywhere, 
like the whole stereotypical 

241
00:13:11,300 --> 00:13:15,100
post Thanksgiving meal food, 
coma thing, and And you know, 

242
00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:17,500
there's definitely times now 
we're I'm tired like, oh, wake 

243
00:13:17,500 --> 00:13:20,400
up tired. 
I'll be tired, but it's not like

244
00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:25,500
this extreme weariness that is 
just leaving me totally immobile

245
00:13:25,500 --> 00:13:28,300
and give an incapacitated. 
Like I can, I can easily like 

246
00:13:28,300 --> 00:13:32,500
flip a switch and get up and 
hustle, even if I'm lacking 

247
00:13:32,500 --> 00:13:35,300
sleep, and I'm often times 
lacking sleep and I feel like so

248
00:13:35,300 --> 00:13:38,100
much that it just simply 
stemming from the fact that my 

249
00:13:38,100 --> 00:13:40,800
body always had a pretty pretty 
good source of fuel, that 

250
00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:43,400
happened to with stored body fat
because it knows how to. 

251
00:13:43,700 --> 00:13:46,100
And I feel like if you're not 
Fan adapt, if you're not doing a

252
00:13:46,100 --> 00:13:48,900
ketogenic diet, all of that is 
just totally Greek to your body 

253
00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:53,000
and you're just never going to 
perform, you know, from a 

254
00:13:53,008 --> 00:13:56,200
longevity standpoint, nearly as 
well. 

255
00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,900
Like, just simply having the 
mental sharpness is worth its 

256
00:13:58,900 --> 00:14:01,800
weight in gold for me. 
Yes, exactly. 

257
00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:03,400
I totally agree with you, 
Robert. 

258
00:14:04,100 --> 00:14:07,100
What about your switch? 
You said, when you first 

259
00:14:07,100 --> 00:14:10,900
started, you were doing fewer 
protein, or less protein and a 

260
00:14:10,900 --> 00:14:12,200
lot of veggies. 
And I feel like that's 

261
00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:15,400
oftentimes the case I feel like 
people, you know, Art diving 

262
00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:19,100
into Quito and they have this 
this association with vegetables

263
00:14:19,300 --> 00:14:21,600
being a really necessary thing 
for health. 

264
00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:25,900
So that incorporate a lot of 
them and it seems as though as 

265
00:14:25,900 --> 00:14:29,100
people stay keto, their 
vegetable intake, more or less? 

266
00:14:29,100 --> 00:14:32,000
Kind of declines over the years.
I was eating a lot of veggies. 

267
00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,600
When I first started and I'm not
necessarily corner for like you 

268
00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:36,600
don't have to be carnivore by 
any means, but it seems as 

269
00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:40,600
though the longer you're doing 
keto for many people, they wind 

270
00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:42,500
up eating less vegetation over 
time. 

271
00:14:42,500 --> 00:14:47,300
It seems Yes, and really like 
when I started keto, like I just

272
00:14:47,300 --> 00:14:52,000
did this all on my own I never 
really even had like keto ketone

273
00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:57,100
strips or whatever I was trying 
just to get my body like I guess

274
00:14:57,100 --> 00:15:00,700
fat adapted. 
And like I had no like tools to 

275
00:15:00,700 --> 00:15:02,500
see like oh if I'm in ketosis or
not. 

276
00:15:02,500 --> 00:15:05,600
So I kind of just went over like
how my body is feeling and as 

277
00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:09,300
far as the vegetables go because
you know, I was switching from 

278
00:15:09,300 --> 00:15:12,600
the standard American diet and 
Taquito like I just kept veggies

279
00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:16,000
in because I Of course, everyone
says, vegetables are good for 

280
00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:18,700
you and of course you know, and 
I had a lot of like broccoli and

281
00:15:18,700 --> 00:15:20,000
cheese. 
I think that was probably like 

282
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:23,300
I'm one of my favorite meals, 
but like I really didn't start 

283
00:15:23,300 --> 00:15:27,500
turning into a carnivore or 
like, keto carnivore until I 

284
00:15:27,500 --> 00:15:31,300
started doing bodybuilding, 
until I was actually coached by 

285
00:15:31,300 --> 00:15:35,700
you Robert because of course. 
I mean like I honestly wish I 

286
00:15:35,700 --> 00:15:39,100
had a coach when I started keto 
instead of going in there 

287
00:15:39,100 --> 00:15:41,000
blindly. 
But you know, I've definitely 

288
00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:44,400
learned so much being coached by
you and And like hitting these 

289
00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:47,600
true like keto macros. 
I think it's really helped me a 

290
00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:49,600
lot. 
As far as I keto journey goes. 

291
00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:51,800
Well I think like appreciate 
that. 

292
00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:54,100
First of all, but I think a lot 
of people when they're when 

293
00:15:54,100 --> 00:15:56,300
they're attacking it from like a
performance standpoint. 

294
00:15:56,300 --> 00:15:59,200
Like you are, like if you're 
lifting, if your training if 

295
00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:01,700
you're tracking, if you're 
getting your sleep, dialed in if

296
00:16:01,700 --> 00:16:04,100
you're getting your if you're 
using like you're lifting 

297
00:16:04,100 --> 00:16:07,500
metrics as a proxy for Progress.
You start playing around with 

298
00:16:07,500 --> 00:16:10,900
the vegetation and taken. 
It seems as though you know, any

299
00:16:10,900 --> 00:16:14,400
increase in vegetation doesn't 
really have a Corresponding 

300
00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:17,000
increase in performance. 
Like I don't really feel any 

301
00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:20,800
better when I'm eating more 
veggies, but what I do notice is

302
00:16:20,800 --> 00:16:25,000
that my digestion seems to be 
more irregular less consistent, 

303
00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,500
less favorable when I have a lot
of veggies. 

304
00:16:27,500 --> 00:16:30,700
And I'm assuming that's 
probably, you know, that may be 

305
00:16:30,700 --> 00:16:33,300
different for people like if 
they're eating more veggies, you

306
00:16:33,300 --> 00:16:35,600
know, and a normal Baseline 
they're probably going to have 

307
00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:39,200
more gut microbiome you know 
they're in place for fermenting 

308
00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:42,200
that food but if you look at it 
from a performance standpoint 

309
00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:45,100
from a calorie intake 
standpoint, It from a fuel 

310
00:16:45,100 --> 00:16:47,500
standpoint. 
There's not a whole lot to gain 

311
00:16:47,500 --> 00:16:50,400
from a bunch of veggies from 
like a performance standpoint. 

312
00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:55,100
It seems yes. 
And actually what actually made 

313
00:16:55,100 --> 00:17:00,000
me like stop eating veggies is 
that I actually started doing 

314
00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:04,200
egg fast and so that like make 
fast is for the general. 

315
00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:07,500
Rule is you're supposed to just 
have, you know an equal ratio of

316
00:17:07,500 --> 00:17:11,400
like a fat source to two eggs. 
Those typically like my whole 

317
00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:16,700
day, I was just eating You know,
ba butter, a little bit of 

318
00:17:16,700 --> 00:17:20,700
cheese and some eggs, I think 
doing egg fast like that. 

319
00:17:20,700 --> 00:17:22,599
Help me like, stop eating 
vegetables. 

320
00:17:22,599 --> 00:17:25,900
And I just realized like it's 
like not having vegetables in my

321
00:17:25,900 --> 00:17:30,000
diet, like my digestion was 
absolutely fine and then I think

322
00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:33,100
doing an egg pass, just kind of 
helped me be and the deeper 

323
00:17:33,100 --> 00:17:37,500
state of ketosis because I had 
crazy energy that I had felt in 

324
00:17:37,500 --> 00:17:41,600
a while and like my mental 
Clarity was like insane. 

325
00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:43,500
So I think it just, you know, 
push me. 

326
00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:46,700
I'm more into ketosis more. 
And you know, and my energy 

327
00:17:46,700 --> 00:17:49,000
levels were, of course, you 
know, they were still really 

328
00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:52,000
good. 
Yeah, I think egg fact, I think 

329
00:17:52,300 --> 00:17:54,500
you introduce me the egg fast 
honestly, I feel like I never 

330
00:17:54,500 --> 00:17:57,500
really done one prior to talking
to you about it and then I gave 

331
00:17:57,500 --> 00:18:01,400
it a shot and from a from a 
volumizing your food standpoint 

332
00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:04,400
and like if you're doing a bunch
of scrambled eggs like you can 

333
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:07,700
get a whole bunch of volume on 
your plate for yes whole lot of 

334
00:18:07,700 --> 00:18:09,700
calories. 
So from a, you know, competition

335
00:18:09,700 --> 00:18:11,900
prep standpoint when calories 
are low, there towards the end. 

336
00:18:11,900 --> 00:18:14,600
If you want to make a You 
significant portion of your 

337
00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:15,800
calories come from scrambled 
egg. 

338
00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:18,900
That's probably the best way to 
get a bunch of volume in and 

339
00:18:18,900 --> 00:18:22,400
your body's going to assimilate 
that egg nutrition a lot better 

340
00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:25,700
than it would from the same 
amount of volume coming from, 

341
00:18:25,700 --> 00:18:27,200
you know, big salad or 
something? 

342
00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:30,300
Yeah, exactly. 
In fact, I think that was like 

343
00:18:30,300 --> 00:18:34,200
one of the main differences 
between my first competition 

344
00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:36,500
prep, in my second year of 
competing. 

345
00:18:36,900 --> 00:18:40,600
I remember the first competition
prep I did. 

346
00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:44,900
I was eating a lot of big salads
and stuff and My digestion was 

347
00:18:44,900 --> 00:18:48,800
all over the place and then the 
second year of my competition 

348
00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:51,800
prep, I was doing more of like, 
keto carnivore, you know, eating

349
00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:53,200
eggs. 
I was eating a lot of ground 

350
00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:57,100
beef actually, and I just found 
that my stomach did so much 

351
00:18:57,100 --> 00:18:58,900
better. 
Yeah, I'm definitely kind of 

352
00:18:58,908 --> 00:19:01,500
like, a ground beef and eggs 
kind of guy when it comes to 

353
00:19:01,500 --> 00:19:05,400
like the staple of my nutrition.
And then from there, I add or 

354
00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:08,300
subtract, you know, keto brick 
butter, heavy cream, 

355
00:19:08,500 --> 00:19:11,400
occasionally some veggies if I 
want to just mix it up but I 

356
00:19:11,408 --> 00:19:13,500
don't really do that from a 
performance standpoint, but 

357
00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:15,700
Making ground beef and eggs. 
Pretty much. 

358
00:19:15,700 --> 00:19:17,900
The staple has always worked 
really well for me. 

359
00:19:18,500 --> 00:19:20,500
Yes, exactly. 
I completely agree with you 

360
00:19:20,508 --> 00:19:23,000
there Robert. 
So I guess your spreadsheet 

361
00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:25,300
pulled up, I kind of want to get
a listener some context. 

362
00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:32,500
So we started this last prep on 
1228 of 2020 and you were coming

363
00:19:32,500 --> 00:19:36,700
in at 137 pounds in and you were
starting your, we actually 

364
00:19:36,700 --> 00:19:38,000
started, increasing your cash 
for bit. 

365
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:40,900
So you started at about 2000 
calories and then we increased 

366
00:19:40,900 --> 00:19:49,200
you up to looks like 2420 yet 
2400, I think is where it peaked

367
00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:52,800
and then we started, I guess we 
technically started like that 

368
00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:54,900
whole time. 
There was trying to figure out 

369
00:19:54,900 --> 00:19:57,400
what your true maintenance 
intake is kind of getting your 

370
00:19:57,700 --> 00:19:59,200
higher caloric intake, dialed 
in. 

371
00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:04,100
And then we started your true 
true prep on 3121. 

372
00:20:04,100 --> 00:20:07,200
So, March 1st of last of, yeah, 
last year. 

373
00:20:07,500 --> 00:20:09,900
And you were 133 pounds at that 
point. 

374
00:20:10,500 --> 00:20:13,400
And we started at 2365 on the 
couch. 

375
00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:16,300
He's, you know, about eight 
percent of calories, come from 

376
00:20:16,300 --> 00:20:21,700
fat and then we slowly chip that
away until showed a. 

377
00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:26,800
And your first show was on 813 
you've weighed in at 1:17 on 

378
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:31,600
show day then and your calories 
were like, you know, 1350 you 

379
00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:34,900
had a real feat of 1700. 
So your average for the week was

380
00:20:34,900 --> 00:20:39,500
about 1,400 calories and then 
you did a couple shows yet 

381
00:20:39,500 --> 00:20:45,000
another show on 8:28 and that 
was weighing of 119. 

382
00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:47,800
And let's see here. 
That was pretty much that was 

383
00:20:47,800 --> 00:20:49,200
your last show, right? 
The one on 8:20. 

384
00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:54,200
Yeah, I did, I did another show 
in September light in 2021. 

385
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:57,600
I did at all three shows so my 
last show should have been in 

386
00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:00,000
late September. 
Okay. 

387
00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:01,700
Do you happen to remember the 
date on that one? 

388
00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:06,800
Um, cause I wanna say it was 
like one of the last 925, that's

389
00:21:06,800 --> 00:21:07,600
what it was. 
Yeah. 

390
00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:08,300
Yeah. 
The light. 

391
00:21:08,300 --> 00:21:09,400
Yeah. 
One of the last weekend's in 

392
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:12,100
September and what's crazy. 
Is that, okay? 

393
00:21:12,100 --> 00:21:15,700
So that first show you weighed 
in at 17 and your average intake

394
00:21:15,700 --> 00:21:18,600
was 1,400 calories. 
Counted the briefie your second 

395
00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:21,600
show was two weeks later, you 
weighed 119 and your average 

396
00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:26,100
intake was 1341. 
And then few weeks go by the 

397
00:21:26,100 --> 00:21:30,100
whole time, we're doing refeeds,
keto refeeds, and then your show

398
00:21:30,100 --> 00:21:37,700
in September 1925, you weighed 
112 pounds and then from here. 

399
00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:41,000
Yeah. 
So you lost quite a bit, the 

400
00:21:41,700 --> 00:21:45,600
felt like the book. 
So my book, You are the the the 

401
00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:49,500
model modeling, the bikini shots
and those photos were taken at 

402
00:21:49,500 --> 00:21:52,000
which of those shows. 
Do you remember the last one in 

403
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:53,800
September? 
Okay, so that was when you were 

404
00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:57,700
the lightest and that was a 
stage weight of 112 pounds. 

405
00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:02,800
And with the refeed you're right
at about 1,300 calories as it 

406
00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:07,900
averages out at that point, like
your refeed was 1759 calories 

407
00:22:08,300 --> 00:22:10,100
and then your intake was like 
12:00. 

408
00:22:10,100 --> 00:22:12,700
So it averages out your roughly 
about 1,300 calories which is 

409
00:22:12,700 --> 00:22:17,600
pretty much the To take any of 
my clients and then and that's 

410
00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:19,500
when it gets interesting. 
So this is where I really want 

411
00:22:19,500 --> 00:22:25,300
to kind of conversation because 
we wanted to do, I think you 

412
00:22:25,300 --> 00:22:29,900
mostly want to do a just really,
really slow, controlled reverse 

413
00:22:29,900 --> 00:22:31,400
diet. 
And when it comes to reverse 

414
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:33,300
dieting, like some, there's like
two trains of thought. 

415
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:36,100
So, something like she, I guess 
they're straight change of 

416
00:22:36,100 --> 00:22:37,200
thought. 
Three trains of thought. 

417
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,200
Some people just want to say 
screw it all and then eat 

418
00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:41,300
whatever. 
And that doesn't really go over 

419
00:22:41,300 --> 00:22:43,200
too well like they put on a 
bunch of body fat. 

420
00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:45,400
They Lose that conditioning 
really, really quickly. 

421
00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:49,100
And they, oftentimes have a 
negative rebound effect. 

422
00:22:49,100 --> 00:22:51,200
They gained more weight than 
they were when they started the 

423
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:53,100
prep. 
It just not a pretty picture. 

424
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:56,400
That's what happened to me. 
My first show, I had a bunch of 

425
00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:58,800
eating disorders that develop 
from that's just not good. 

426
00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:02,400
And then other people, the other
two trains of thought are like, 

427
00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:07,300
having a strategic reverse diet,
and most people want to kind of 

428
00:23:07,300 --> 00:23:10,000
return to some degree of 
normalcy soon. 

429
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:11,100
They've been prepping for a 
while. 

430
00:23:11,100 --> 00:23:13,400
They've been tracking the macros
tracking their training, 

431
00:23:13,500 --> 00:23:15,900
Everything dialed in. 
They want to return to more 

432
00:23:15,900 --> 00:23:19,100
time, and intuitive approach, 
and they're willing to sacrifice

433
00:23:19,100 --> 00:23:21,900
some conditioning and some 
definition to return to that 

434
00:23:21,900 --> 00:23:24,200
degree of normalcy sooner, 
rather than later. 

435
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:27,900
So, we'll be a little bit more 
aggressive with the reverse you 

436
00:23:27,900 --> 00:23:31,800
were of the opposite opinion and
that you wanted to be, you 

437
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,900
wanted to retain that 
conditioning as long as possible

438
00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:39,000
but still increase in calories 
that you're training, wouldn't 

439
00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:42,600
be hindered really and you were 
fine to continue to track and 

440
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:45,400
keep things down. 
Old in Rat, the entire reverse, 

441
00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:48,900
which a lot of people are not 
but you like that style of that 

442
00:23:48,900 --> 00:23:51,200
lifestyle. 
So it worked really well. 

443
00:23:52,500 --> 00:23:54,100
I don't want to steal your 
thunder here because I want you 

444
00:23:54,100 --> 00:23:56,900
to dive into this. 
But okay, what's interesting? 

445
00:23:57,200 --> 00:23:59,400
Just from a high level for 
people, listening is at your 

446
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:03,400
show date on 925 you wait 112 
pounds from there. 

447
00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:06,900
We showed increase in calories, 
so your average intake then was 

448
00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:09,900
you know, 1300 calories. 
Once you factor in the refeed 

449
00:24:10,100 --> 00:24:13,300
and then we only increased 
calories from that. 

450
00:24:13,500 --> 00:24:18,400
Point, however, your weight 
continue to drop, I'm trying to 

451
00:24:18,408 --> 00:24:22,500
find your lowest weights in the 
reverse that and it's looking 

452
00:24:22,500 --> 00:24:24,800
like it was remember off the top
your head. 

453
00:24:25,300 --> 00:24:28,500
I want to say, I think that was 
like, one time where I weighed 

454
00:24:28,500 --> 00:24:31,400
myself and I was like, maybe 
like 105. 

455
00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:37,000
Like yeah, like way below like 
110 like yeah, like 107 108 or 

456
00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:40,300
something like that. 
There's a 10-4 on 1228 you would

457
00:24:40,300 --> 00:24:44,500
104. 
Yeah, like 28, Hmm, which is 

458
00:24:44,500 --> 00:24:46,100
crazy. 
I mean like when you start 

459
00:24:46,100 --> 00:24:50,000
looking at in the laws of 
thermodynamics calories in 

460
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:52,100
calories out, energy balance, 
all that stuff. 

461
00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,300
Like we mean, your 
superstructure like you have a 

462
00:24:55,308 --> 00:24:58,700
job, you have, you know, like a 
standard, you know, clock in 

463
00:24:58,700 --> 00:25:00,400
clock out of time. 
You have your cardio that you're

464
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:03,500
tracking every training that 
you're tracking and we are only 

465
00:25:03,500 --> 00:25:06,800
increase in calories and from 
925 when you were eating around 

466
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:15,500
1300 and Wade, 112 on that 12:28
when you 104 your average 

467
00:25:15,500 --> 00:25:18,300
intake. 
At that point is almost 1,900 

468
00:25:18,300 --> 00:25:20,100
calories. 
So, a pretty significant 

469
00:25:20,100 --> 00:25:22,400
increase in calories. 
Let yet you've reached your 

470
00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:25,200
lowest weight, which is pretty 
freaking crazy. 

471
00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:28,200
Mmm. 
Yeah. 

472
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:32,500
Like I don't even know like how 
that happened to be honest with 

473
00:25:32,500 --> 00:25:34,700
you. 
Yeah, because and I think it's 

474
00:25:34,700 --> 00:25:41,400
because I think the pressure was
just off of, you know, me being 

475
00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:45,400
so hyper-focused on my physique.
I think something that really 

476
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:47,600
did help us that ice did start a
new job. 

477
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:50,400
And I just knew like all my 
focus is going to have to go 

478
00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:55,100
towards this job because I 
really want to do well and I 

479
00:25:55,700 --> 00:25:58,100
really want to get promoted. 
I'm still working on getting 

480
00:25:58,100 --> 00:26:04,200
promoted and so I just knew that
like all my thinking and my and 

481
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,100
my focus had to go towards my 
new job. 

482
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,600
It's right. 
And I think that really kind of 

483
00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:14,500
took off a lot of pressure from 
me from, you know, looking 

484
00:26:14,500 --> 00:26:17,500
myself in the mirror and be like
Oh I'm Eileen enough in my stage

485
00:26:17,500 --> 00:26:22,200
ready or whatever. 
As long as I as far as my 

486
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:26,600
journey in bodybuilding goes, 
while I was in my reverse 

487
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:30,300
dieting phase as long, I just 
checked the box as long as I got

488
00:26:30,300 --> 00:26:34,600
enough sleep, as long as I was, 
you know, tracking my meals and 

489
00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:36,400
meal prepping. 
And as long as I got, My 

490
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:40,200
workouts in like I was happy 
like those were the three things

491
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:44,200
that I just need to check off 
every day. 

492
00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:48,700
Just to make my reverse diet, 
you know, just to be successful,

493
00:26:48,700 --> 00:26:51,600
my reverse diet and as long as I
was okay with getting those 

494
00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:55,400
three things in my focus was on 
my new job. 

495
00:26:55,500 --> 00:26:58,500
But I think you know, starting a
new job that really just help me

496
00:26:58,500 --> 00:27:01,800
with my reverse dieting and as 
far as the weight loss, go like 

497
00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:04,300
I don't know, maybe because I 
was using my brain for like the 

498
00:27:04,300 --> 00:27:08,100
first time. 
Think I'm thinking like my brain

499
00:27:08,100 --> 00:27:10,700
probably pick up a lot of 
calories like has to do a lot of

500
00:27:10,700 --> 00:27:18,000
thinking about my new job and 
and yeah and it's funny how my 

501
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:22,300
weight drops because even my 
coach I mean she took out cardio

502
00:27:22,500 --> 00:27:24,800
from my training session. 
So all I was doing was, you 

503
00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,000
know, resistance training, all 
he was doing was weightlifting 

504
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,800
and I felt and after my last 
show was weird, because I felt 

505
00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:31,700
really strong and really 
recovered. 

506
00:27:31,700 --> 00:27:37,200
So I mean, every week, I had 
PRS, I mean, Yeah, like I was 

507
00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:41,400
lifting heavy, but like my 
weight was still dropping, but 

508
00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:45,300
in my head I'm just like, I'm 
just like, I didn't really think

509
00:27:45,300 --> 00:27:47,600
too much of it because I was 
increasing calories. 

510
00:27:48,100 --> 00:27:52,400
So, like I don't know, like, I 
don't know what kind of, I don't

511
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:55,600
know what kind of led to my B 
losing weight, but I think 

512
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,000
probably the main part is 
because, like, I wasn't 

513
00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:02,600
pressured to look a certain way 
as far as my intimacy goes. 

514
00:28:02,700 --> 00:28:05,000
Yeah, I would imagine your 
body's flushing out some 

515
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:07,400
inflammation weights. 
No, some water retention, simply

516
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:10,900
from all the stress and anxiety 
that worrying about your 

517
00:28:10,900 --> 00:28:14,800
physique can bring on. 
You know, if you remove the 

518
00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:17,200
cardio, you're losing that form 
of expenditure but then you're 

519
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:19,500
probably able to pour more into 
your weight training. 

520
00:28:19,500 --> 00:28:22,400
So you're burning probably more 
calories than plus, you're 

521
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:24,900
getting more calories in, you 
know, from the increase in food 

522
00:28:24,900 --> 00:28:27,200
in the macros. 
So you're probably training with

523
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:30,700
a higher degree of intensity. 
But yeah, it was just, it was 

524
00:28:30,700 --> 00:28:34,200
really interesting to watch that
unfold because most people, they

525
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:37,200
finish a prep and they've been 
just obsessing About macros and 

526
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:39,200
tracking, and training for 
months. 

527
00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:42,600
So they just kind of have this, 
screw it mentality and they eat 

528
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:45,900
everything inside that only have
a plan, but you are so hyper 

529
00:28:45,900 --> 00:28:50,600
focused on something, totally 
outside of bodybuilding is that,

530
00:28:50,700 --> 00:28:52,800
you know, you were kind of just 
checking the boxes when it came 

531
00:28:52,800 --> 00:28:54,900
to body building which I think 
was, you know, great. 

532
00:28:54,900 --> 00:28:58,000
It worked in your favor because 
you weren't obsessing about it, 

533
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:02,400
which made your natural hunger 
cues, probably more legitimate 

534
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:04,800
as opposed to having this 
Feeding Frenzy mentality that 

535
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:07,800
comes with obsessing over food. 
And so you're able to just let 

536
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,200
your body take what you were 
giving it make the most of it. 

537
00:29:11,300 --> 00:29:13,800
And lo and behold, you kept 
leaning out despite the steady 

538
00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:17,600
increase in calories, which is 
not the norm but awesome that it

539
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:21,100
happened so much. 
So the point that when I do my 

540
00:29:21,100 --> 00:29:25,800
next prep, I'm going to also 
adopt this ridiculously slow, 

541
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:30,400
reverse diet that you did and 
honestly, like it was slow, but 

542
00:29:30,900 --> 00:29:35,400
we, let's see here. 
So we were increase in calories 

543
00:29:35,700 --> 00:29:36,300
and there were times. 
Times. 

544
00:29:36,300 --> 00:29:38,800
We were only increase in like 
five grams of protein a week. 

545
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:41,500
Sometimes we would do like a 
biweekly adjustment. 

546
00:29:42,500 --> 00:29:44,400
But I mean, your body responded 
perfectly to it. 

547
00:29:44,408 --> 00:29:46,300
Like you were losing weight. 
You didn't start actually 

548
00:29:46,300 --> 00:29:52,000
gaining weight until probably 
January. 

549
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:54,800
Yeah, I guess. 
Probably about January 

550
00:29:54,800 --> 00:29:57,700
mid-January. 
Later January started, slowly 

551
00:29:57,700 --> 00:29:59,700
moving the other direction. 
But how many weeks are you 

552
00:29:59,708 --> 00:30:06,000
post-show now I want to say, 
like, like 40, it's going to be 

553
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:10,600
49, so it's almost gonna be like
one year since my last show. 

554
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:12,100
Yeah. 
Which is crazy. 

555
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:18,000
And your current intake is one 
I'm sorry you were starting to 

556
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:21,300
cut out there a little Robert. 
Your current caloric intake is 

557
00:30:21,300 --> 00:30:22,400
Nat. 
What do we have you at this 

558
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:29,600
week? 
Oh 2575 2575 and your weight. 

559
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:33,600
Now you're at 1:30 now roughly 
which is still about seven 

560
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:37,200
pounds under what you started 
the prep and so you're eating 

561
00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:39,900
more your way and less but your 
composition is significantly 

562
00:30:39,900 --> 00:30:41,900
improved, you've got more lean 
tissue. 

563
00:30:42,100 --> 00:30:45,600
One thing that I think is truly 
awesome with the ketogenic prep 

564
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:47,700
that I don't really see. 
Happening so much with 

565
00:30:47,700 --> 00:30:52,100
traditional prep protocols is 
that as calories are dropping 

566
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:55,200
and your training and your 
trying to maintain the same type

567
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:57,300
of overall volume and attend to 
that. 

568
00:30:57,300 --> 00:31:01,000
Your you did in the offseason, 
you never really lost any 

569
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:02,500
strength. 
And that's been the case with 

570
00:31:02,500 --> 00:31:04,100
me. 
What I'm doing my prep, that's 

571
00:31:04,100 --> 00:31:05,700
been the case with all my other 
clients. 

572
00:31:06,100 --> 00:31:09,500
It definitely gets harder to 
train, you know, with that 

573
00:31:09,500 --> 00:31:12,200
degree of intensity when 
calories and lower but it's not 

574
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:15,800
like your top deadlift Max drops
in half. 

575
00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:19,500
It's not like your Losing a lot 
of real strength and I feel like

576
00:31:19,700 --> 00:31:23,100
because of that you're able to 
reserve that lean tissue much 

577
00:31:23,100 --> 00:31:25,600
better and then when you do 
Transition back into reverse 

578
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:28,800
diet with the focus of building 
more muscle, you're not having 

579
00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:31,500
to make up for lost ground. 
Like you pretty much just start 

580
00:31:31,500 --> 00:31:32,400
right? 
Where you left off. 

581
00:31:35,100 --> 00:31:38,000
Yeah, that's very true. 
In fact, I was so surprised 

582
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:43,300
during this second prep that I 
had like, I could not believe 

583
00:31:43,300 --> 00:31:47,700
like how many PR's I was still 
doing, even up until showed a 

584
00:31:47,700 --> 00:31:50,800
like it was so crazy. 
And yes, like some days were 

585
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:54,000
hard, like, I still had days 
where I would go into the gym 

586
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:58,000
and grit my teeth and get the 
workout done, but it wasn't 

587
00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:01,400
like, I was rushing myself and 
be like, oh my gosh, hurry up 

588
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:03,000
for this workout to get done. 
It was more. 

589
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:07,400
So I was still meant We and 
focused like in the zone and was

590
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:10,900
still, you know, pushing myself.
They're all my workouts to get 

591
00:32:10,900 --> 00:32:15,200
these quality Lipson and yeah, 
like I have to, I definitely do 

592
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:17,400
agree with you there. 
Robert like definitely like 

593
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:20,100
doing. 
I mean, I've never done any sort

594
00:32:20,100 --> 00:32:24,600
of bodybuilding protocol with 
like the standard American diet 

595
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:28,300
or anything like that, but 
definitely like with keto, like 

596
00:32:28,300 --> 00:32:31,900
my performance in the gym, never
hindered while I was in prep, 

597
00:32:32,500 --> 00:32:34,100
what about your overall 
relationship? 

598
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:35,900
And ship with food. 
I feel like that's something 

599
00:32:35,900 --> 00:32:38,900
that people oftentimes struggle 
with, like, how did, how did you

600
00:32:38,900 --> 00:32:41,200
adopt a healthy relationship 
with food throughout your prep? 

601
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:43,600
Like, was that something that 
came pretty easily? 

602
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:44,900
It was their challenge of points
there. 

603
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:52,600
Honestly because I'm not going 
to pay that easy but I want to 

604
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:54,800
say the dieting phase and calm 
prep. 

605
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:58,600
I want to say it's easy to stay 
on track only because you have 

606
00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:02,000
like a time that like deadlines 
and then you're always 

607
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:04,800
constantly looking at your body.
You're always constantly 

608
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:08,200
thinking like am I, you know, am
I going to be stage ready? 

609
00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:12,400
So I feel like that's easy but 
even like, going through my prep

610
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:17,000
until 2021 even before I stepped
on stage for my first show, And 

611
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:19,500
I just remembered, you know, the
feeling of being hungry, and I 

612
00:33:19,500 --> 00:33:22,500
just remembered like Marjorie, 
The Works. 

613
00:33:22,500 --> 00:33:26,100
Not done even after this 
competition season because I 

614
00:33:26,100 --> 00:33:30,000
have to reverse diet. 
And so, I already knew that the 

615
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,900
reverse side was going to be the
hard part because, of course, my

616
00:33:32,900 --> 00:33:38,100
first set of competitions was 
back in 2019, and after my first

617
00:33:38,100 --> 00:33:41,300
year competing, like, Robert 
like you had mentioned before, 

618
00:33:41,300 --> 00:33:45,600
like, after your first show, you
had, you kept been binge eating 

619
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:49,000
and you felt like you Q like 
developed a like eating 

620
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:52,500
disorder. 
I fell into that same boat to 

621
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:56,400
after my first year of 
competing, like like I know how 

622
00:33:56,400 --> 00:33:58,700
that feels to have that 
uncontrollable sense of hunger 

623
00:33:58,700 --> 00:34:01,300
and like you're just eating so 
much food, but the hunger won't 

624
00:34:01,300 --> 00:34:04,900
stop. 
So I just felt I learned so much

625
00:34:04,900 --> 00:34:08,199
from failing. 
My first reverse diet to wear 

626
00:34:08,199 --> 00:34:10,900
the second time around. 
Like that's why I kind of wanted

627
00:34:10,900 --> 00:34:14,900
to do a slow approach because 
I've never successfully 

628
00:34:14,900 --> 00:34:20,199
completed a reverse dieting. 
For me as an athlete, especially

629
00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:23,600
since I want to do bodybuilding 
for, I don't know for how many 

630
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:26,400
years, but I definitely want to 
keep going in the sport. 

631
00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:30,400
It was important for me to kind 
of gather the data my reverse 

632
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:33,699
diet. 
Because how do I not know, like 

633
00:34:33,699 --> 00:34:37,100
what my maintenance is like, how
do I not know? 

634
00:34:37,100 --> 00:34:40,300
Like, like 0, at this point of 
calories, I felt my Hunger cues 

635
00:34:40,300 --> 00:34:42,199
come back. 
Like I don't, I didn't have the 

636
00:34:42,199 --> 00:34:44,300
data to kind of, like, back 
myself up. 

637
00:34:44,300 --> 00:34:46,500
So, that's so definitely this 
time. 

638
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:48,400
Around, that's why it was so on 
point. 

639
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,600
And so on track just so I can 
have this data and so I can 

640
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,800
better myself, you know, within 
the years of bodybuilding that I

641
00:34:54,808 --> 00:34:56,500
do. 
Yeah, 100% agree. 

642
00:34:56,500 --> 00:34:59,300
I feel like, you know, having 
that data at your fingertips is 

643
00:34:59,300 --> 00:35:02,700
super empowering and I feel 
like, you know, looking at the 

644
00:35:02,700 --> 00:35:06,500
the prep the show day is like, 
the finish line is just not a 

645
00:35:06,508 --> 00:35:08,900
healthy thing in general. 
Like if you look at it rather 

646
00:35:08,900 --> 00:35:11,900
through the lens of, you know, 
you're at the peak of a mountain

647
00:35:12,100 --> 00:35:14,900
but you still have to climb down
the mountain and get back home 

648
00:35:14,900 --> 00:35:16,500
like that's probably the best 
way to look. 

649
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,700
But if you don't have that 
mentality, you're going to cross

650
00:35:19,700 --> 00:35:21,100
that Finish Line. 
You're going to think 

651
00:35:21,100 --> 00:35:22,700
everything's, okay. 
And you're going to screw 

652
00:35:22,700 --> 00:35:25,900
yourself over. 
Whereas, if you have that, you 

653
00:35:25,900 --> 00:35:28,100
know, Mountaintop approach where
like you're climbing up the 

654
00:35:28,107 --> 00:35:30,900
mountain, that's your prep. 
You have the show day, that's 

655
00:35:30,900 --> 00:35:33,500
the peak. 
And you slowly go down off the 

656
00:35:33,500 --> 00:35:36,800
mountain and not Rick's risk. 
Jumping off a cliff, you're 

657
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,200
probably going to be way better 
off for the Long Haul. 

658
00:35:40,300 --> 00:35:42,500
Yes, I totally agree with you 
there, Robert. 

659
00:35:42,700 --> 00:35:47,000
I mean, definitely, after just 
like bailing. 

660
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:50,700
My first reverse diet, like, I 
learned, you know, I completely 

661
00:35:50,700 --> 00:35:52,900
learned from all my mistakes 
this time around. 

662
00:35:52,900 --> 00:35:56,900
So I just knew like, even while 
I was in competition season, I 

663
00:35:56,900 --> 00:36:00,900
just kept telling myself like 
the work is not over, just 

664
00:36:00,900 --> 00:36:04,000
because you get just because 
you're done with your show, 

665
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:06,800
definitely the reverse diet. 
I feel like that's where most 

666
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:10,900
bodybuilders probably do lose 
themselves because You know, 

667
00:36:10,900 --> 00:36:12,700
there is a thing called 
post-show blues. 

668
00:36:12,700 --> 00:36:15,400
And you in there is all 
suddenly, you know, not that 

669
00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:18,900
dedicated time frame to look, 
you know, show ready. 

670
00:36:18,900 --> 00:36:22,700
And I feel like this the 
improvement season is where that

671
00:36:22,700 --> 00:36:25,800
can make or break you as a 
bodybuilding athlete. 

672
00:36:25,900 --> 00:36:28,200
Yeah, 100% exactly. 
In the day like you want it to 

673
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:31,500
be a healthy sport, you want it 
to be a lifestyle you want to 

674
00:36:31,508 --> 00:36:34,400
keep getting better with every 
year that passes and if you like

675
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:38,200
come out of the show and then 
you have all these you know - 

676
00:36:38,300 --> 00:36:41,600
relationships with food disorder
Tendencies you let yourself blow

677
00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:43,700
up, put on a bunch of 
unnecessary body fat, you screw 

678
00:36:43,700 --> 00:36:46,000
your metabolic rate, your 
hormones, etc, etc. 

679
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:51,300
What could be a really healthy 
sport now becomes a sense of, 

680
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:55,100
you know, not health. 
I mean, like you're literally it

681
00:36:55,100 --> 00:36:58,200
becomes a sense of demise to 
you, in the sense in the sense 

682
00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:01,200
that your brain screwed up. 
Your hormones are screwed up 

683
00:37:01,207 --> 00:37:03,700
your relationship of food 
screwed up and you've just 

684
00:37:03,700 --> 00:37:07,200
thrown away a great opportunity 
to become better and likely to 

685
00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:09,300
becoming worse for. 
And if you can bypass all that, 

686
00:37:09,300 --> 00:37:12,400
by simply Having some structure 
in the offseason. 

687
00:37:12,600 --> 00:37:14,800
Post-show, you're going to be 
way way better form. 

688
00:37:15,700 --> 00:37:18,200
Yeah, and I completely agree 
with you there, Robert. 

689
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:21,200
I mean, yeah. 
Because even just like failing, 

690
00:37:21,300 --> 00:37:26,700
my diverse diet during my after 
my first year of competing like 

691
00:37:26,800 --> 00:37:30,200
I just after gaining like so 
much weight and everything, like

692
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:33,500
even I would look at myself in 
the gym, I had I actually like 

693
00:37:33,500 --> 00:37:36,600
develop some body dysmorphia. 
And I really thought I was like 

694
00:37:36,700 --> 00:37:39,700
going to developed or have 
developed an eating disorder. 

695
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:44,200
It was so scary when I failed 
that reverse diet the first 

696
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:46,500
time. 
Like, if I ever needed like 

697
00:37:46,500 --> 00:37:50,200
discipline like man, it was 
during that first field reverse 

698
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:52,900
diet. 
It was like, I had to, like 

699
00:37:52,900 --> 00:37:56,600
fight for every inch of 
discipline that I had to, like, 

700
00:37:56,600 --> 00:38:00,800
not overeating to not become, 
like a victim towards, like, my 

701
00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:05,100
Hunger signals and everything. 
And I remember when I was 

702
00:38:05,100 --> 00:38:08,500
constantly feeling my reverse 
diet, and just feeling hungry, 

703
00:38:08,500 --> 00:38:12,100
and just being like, Like, well 
f it, well, let's, let's see, 

704
00:38:12,100 --> 00:38:16,800
whatever I want and I remember 
doing that enough days to wear. 

705
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:20,700
Like I think it would like 
finally caught up with me and 

706
00:38:20,700 --> 00:38:24,100
I'm just like, sitting in my 
kitchen like, just eating, you 

707
00:38:24,100 --> 00:38:27,300
know, like peanut butter with 
like sausage or whatever, just 

708
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:30,000
eating whatever and it just 
dawned on me. 

709
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:34,200
Like, I'm not hungry, but for 
some reason, I just kept eating 

710
00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:37,400
it and that feeling for me was 
so scary. 

711
00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:41,200
Like I just felt so out of 
control and From that point on, 

712
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:44,600
I knew it wasn't a hunger issue 
but it was more of like a like a

713
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:48,600
mental issue at some point. 
So for some reason, like 

714
00:38:48,700 --> 00:38:52,600
hormones were off and, you know,
and I think something I learned 

715
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:56,200
from that day was like, calories
is not the issue. 

716
00:38:56,200 --> 00:39:01,800
I think it was just not getting 
enough rest and not optimizing, 

717
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:05,500
you know, sleep and rest and 
doing the cardio that you're 

718
00:39:05,500 --> 00:39:07,400
supposed to do. 
Because the first time when I 

719
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:10,600
feel my reverse diet, I remember
like doing Extra cardio 

720
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:12,600
sessions. 
I remember I told my coach that 

721
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:18,600
and she got so mad at me and it 
was like, Another like light 

722
00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:21,900
bulb effect happened there and 
it was like, I was not giving my

723
00:39:21,900 --> 00:39:24,000
body rest. 
I was not giving it sleep when 

724
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:27,500
it needed to. 
So I so I kind of took that as a

725
00:39:27,508 --> 00:39:32,300
lesson and took that into a 
competition prep, which, you 

726
00:39:32,300 --> 00:39:35,100
know, I listen to my body. 
I gave myself extra sleep. 

727
00:39:35,100 --> 00:39:40,300
I gave myself rest and even you 
know, still optimized my sleep 

728
00:39:40,900 --> 00:39:43,500
and rest days. 
During this reverse side that 

729
00:39:43,500 --> 00:39:46,900
I'm doing and everything, just 
worked better. 

730
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:52,600
I was able to, you know, control
my hunger and I was able to, you

731
00:39:52,600 --> 00:39:55,400
know, PR my workouts only 
because I was really 

732
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:58,600
prioritizing sleep and rest this
time around. 

733
00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:01,000
Yeah, I think making sure that 
your sleep styled in and that 

734
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:03,700
you're truly, you know, having 
periods of time where you're in 

735
00:40:03,700 --> 00:40:06,100
a parasympathetic State. 
Because I mean when you're in a 

736
00:40:06,100 --> 00:40:08,700
deficit and you're in a prep 
like that, that's very taxing on

737
00:40:08,707 --> 00:40:10,700
the body. 
So like if you're going hard in 

738
00:40:10,700 --> 00:40:14,300
that sector of your life, you 
have to, you know, make up and 

739
00:40:14,300 --> 00:40:17,000
compensate in other ways and 
really optimizing sleep. 

740
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:22,400
Is a is a pretty tangible win in
order to do that but you made 

741
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:25,100
one of the really good point and
that's that, you know, your 

742
00:40:25,100 --> 00:40:28,000
first show you went off the 
rails, your second show you had 

743
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:32,400
much more control and I feel 
like that holds true with a lot 

744
00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:33,600
of people. 
Like, when you do your first 

745
00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:36,000
show, you have no perspective 
because you've done it before. 

746
00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:39,500
And that fear, the unknown 
screws with your head and your 

747
00:40:39,500 --> 00:40:42,200
that much more likely to go off 
the deep end. 

748
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:44,900
Whereas, and because of that, a 
lot of people know don't ever do

749
00:40:44,900 --> 00:40:47,700
a second show, because it's only
a - and Their life. 

750
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:50,100
But after you've done the first 
show and you start doing the 

751
00:40:50,107 --> 00:40:53,300
next prep in the next prep, like
you gain more prospectively to 

752
00:40:53,300 --> 00:40:56,000
prep that you go through and 
then just becomes more familiar 

753
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:59,000
to you and then you don't really
tend to operate on The Fringe 

754
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:02,300
extremes because you know, it's 
not necessary to do so and 

755
00:41:02,300 --> 00:41:04,400
you're able to just make the 
entire process that much more 

756
00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:08,800
enjoyable to begin with. 
Yes, yeah, I definitely agree 

757
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:10,900
with you there. 
I remember like when I was 

758
00:41:10,900 --> 00:41:15,100
failing, my reverse diet that 
was, that was when 2020 happened

759
00:41:15,100 --> 00:41:17,800
and, you know, everyone's like, 
you know, I get home. 

760
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:20,000
I hear old stories like, you 
know people you know, put on 

761
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:21,400
weight and everything else on 
here. 

762
00:41:21,700 --> 00:41:24,700
Here I am like, you know, really
just trying to like hold my life

763
00:41:24,700 --> 00:41:28,200
together but this reverse diet 
and doing my workouts, indoors, 

764
00:41:28,200 --> 00:41:32,000
at my home gym and like really 
in 2020, I think that's when I 

765
00:41:32,008 --> 00:41:35,100
started listening to other 
bodybuilding podcast and start 

766
00:41:35,100 --> 00:41:39,600
looking at other ICB bikini pros
and how they do their preps, 

767
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:41,100
because shows were still going 
on. 

768
00:41:41,100 --> 00:41:44,200
So, you know, and since you 
know, my head was still in my 

769
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:46,800
reverse side, I started to look 
into different podcasts. 

770
00:41:47,100 --> 00:41:51,200
One podcast I really loved is 
the bikini in the brain podcast,

771
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:57,100
which is by coach, Adam Bonilla 
and, and Ashley caught wasser 

772
00:41:57,100 --> 00:41:59,800
there from Team Elite physiques.
But I mean, there are saying the

773
00:41:59,808 --> 00:42:02,400
same stuff that you're saying 
Robert that like, you know, they

774
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:04,400
have athletes that come out of 
their first show and because 

775
00:42:04,400 --> 00:42:07,800
they don't have that expectation
of reverse diet, they're going 

776
00:42:07,800 --> 00:42:09,900
to say, they're going to give 
every excuse in the world 

777
00:42:09,900 --> 00:42:12,800
saying, bodybuilding ruin their 
life and now they hate the 

778
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:14,200
sport. 
They hate exercise. 

779
00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:17,000
The you know, they can't get 
back to eating healthy. 

780
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:20,400
It's because, you know, you 
know, you don't have that 

781
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:24,400
mindset of being, you know, like
the work is not done just 

782
00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:27,700
because you get off show like 
you have to have like you you 

783
00:42:27,700 --> 00:42:31,400
have to have a plan after, you 
know, after your show. 

784
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:33,800
So that way you're still 
successful and you can still 

785
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:36,600
compete after. 
Yeah, I think, I think it's 

786
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:39,400
really important to just never 
have enough switch. 

787
00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:43,100
Yes, there's times at which 
you're going really hardcore, 

788
00:42:43,100 --> 00:42:44,800
your track and everything to the
T. 

789
00:42:45,100 --> 00:42:48,200
And you know, you've got a very 
specific Date in mind for 

790
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:51,800
peeking you know for like a 
competition for instance but 

791
00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:54,600
that doesn't mean that there's 
ever an off switch to that in 

792
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:58,400
its entirety like you're never 
ideally you know for going all 

793
00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:01,500
training all healthy eating 
habits, like you don't want to 

794
00:43:01,500 --> 00:43:03,000
just totally go off the deep 
end. 

795
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:06,300
And I feel like, you know, I 
don't remember who I heard his 

796
00:43:06,300 --> 00:43:08,900
friend but they said rather than
it being like a, an on-off 

797
00:43:08,900 --> 00:43:11,800
switch think of it like a dimmer
switch where you're scaling. 

798
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:14,200
It's like on a sliding scale to 
the degree of intensity, you're 

799
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:18,100
targeting with things and if you
do it that way, if Is never an 

800
00:43:18,100 --> 00:43:20,200
off switch. 
You're still building your 

801
00:43:20,200 --> 00:43:23,400
day-to-day, you know, function 
off of the healthy habits that 

802
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:25,300
you've built that have led to 
the success. 

803
00:43:25,300 --> 00:43:29,300
You've seen thus far with the 
sport and if you're able to dim 

804
00:43:29,300 --> 00:43:31,900
that switches opposed to turning
it off, you're likely going to 

805
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:36,700
retain some degree of these 
healthy habits and that that 

806
00:43:36,700 --> 00:43:40,000
will likely bode well for making
sure that you don't, you know, 

807
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:43,800
go off on an extreme and that 
that in itself makes us much 

808
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:45,900
more sustainable and I feel like
that should be the key with 

809
00:43:45,900 --> 00:43:47,900
anything. 
Because you don't ever want it 

810
00:43:47,900 --> 00:43:51,100
to be a - like, I mean, if it 
becomes a negative in your life 

811
00:43:51,100 --> 00:43:54,400
than what's the point, you know,
um, guys especially, you know, 

812
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,100
if you still want to be, you 
know, competing and making those

813
00:43:57,100 --> 00:44:00,300
improvements to get better. 
Like I know I have a big goal to

814
00:44:00,300 --> 00:44:04,800
you to be on the national show 
National stage next year, for 

815
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:08,400
the NPC. 
So, you know, for me, like I'm 

816
00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:12,600
still very much like, on in this
Improvement Season. 

817
00:44:12,600 --> 00:44:15,500
I don't like to call the 
Improvement Season offseason 

818
00:44:15,500 --> 00:44:19,200
only because, you know, Things 
really like turned off, like I 

819
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:22,600
feel like I'm still eating the 
same Foods on prep, but just in 

820
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:25,700
bigger volume and plus like I 
can have a little bit more like 

821
00:44:25,700 --> 00:44:28,600
fun foods like, you know, 
different nut Butters and I can 

822
00:44:28,600 --> 00:44:30,500
have like higher cuts of 
protein. 

823
00:44:30,500 --> 00:44:33,500
You know, such as like chicken, 
thighs and I can have Salman 

824
00:44:33,500 --> 00:44:35,900
again. 
So, pretty much like just 

825
00:44:35,900 --> 00:44:39,600
because, you know, you're in a 
caloric Surplus, doesn't mean 

826
00:44:39,600 --> 00:44:41,700
you can eat whatever you want 
that. 

827
00:44:41,700 --> 00:44:44,700
You know, I'm still eating the 
same foods like I am on prep, 

828
00:44:44,700 --> 00:44:47,700
but just in bigger portions. 
Yeah, I think that's That's huge

829
00:44:47,700 --> 00:44:51,200
to like you don't ever have to 
sacrifice the types of foods 

830
00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:55,700
your for me with a you know like
a traditional approach, like a 

831
00:44:55,707 --> 00:44:57,800
traditional carb road that 
approach. 

832
00:44:57,900 --> 00:45:00,600
Like, if the pending on they're 
doing flexible dieting or not, 

833
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,400
but a lot of them will just, you
know, do a super clean bro, diet

834
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:06,600
and then skip out on all those 
junk foods, but then, when the 

835
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:09,600
show is over, they feel deprived
of those Foods, they bring them 

836
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:12,600
back in excess. 
If you're doing a flexible 

837
00:45:12,600 --> 00:45:15,600
dieting approaching, you're 
eating more of those junk Foods 

838
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:16,900
because you're working in them 
into your mouth. 

839
00:45:17,100 --> 00:45:20,100
Crows. 
Then it's probably not the most 

840
00:45:20,100 --> 00:45:22,000
nutrient-dense source of food to
be consuming. 

841
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:25,400
Why in the context of a deficit,
which is not likely optimal with

842
00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:28,300
the ketogenic approach. 
You're eating the most 

843
00:45:28,300 --> 00:45:32,800
nutrient-dense foods, and 
ideally becomes a lifestyle for 

844
00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:34,000
you. 
So you don't feel like you're 

845
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:37,100
sacrificing it all by not having
the cupcakes and Pop-Tarts. 

846
00:45:37,500 --> 00:45:40,000
And then when the show is over, 
you don't feel like you've 

847
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:42,500
deprived yourself by not having 
those so you don't really need 

848
00:45:42,500 --> 00:45:45,200
to introduce him again. 
And you just continue to eat the

849
00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:46,900
foods that, you know, your body 
responsibility. 

850
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:50,900
Well, to you just, you know, 
moderate the intake, exactly. 

851
00:45:50,900 --> 00:45:53,500
I think, definitely something, 
this go around. 

852
00:45:53,500 --> 00:45:56,700
Since I've kind of like move my 
eating habits to more. 

853
00:45:56,700 --> 00:46:01,600
Keto, carnivore approach was the
key word here, nutrient-dense 

854
00:46:01,600 --> 00:46:06,600
Foods because now that I am, I'm
not eating any like, processed 

855
00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:08,600
foods. 
In fact, I don't even have foods

856
00:46:08,600 --> 00:46:11,000
that have like certain like gums
in there. 

857
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:14,600
Like like I know like my heavy 
whipping cream had like agile 

858
00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:16,500
and gum in there. 
I got rid of that, I found a 

859
00:46:16,508 --> 00:46:19,500
better brand. 
But even foods with additives 

860
00:46:19,500 --> 00:46:24,900
like that, it's so crazy how 
like it can make you like 

861
00:46:24,900 --> 00:46:28,700
addictive to a certain food. 
But, you know, since I've kind 

862
00:46:28,700 --> 00:46:31,600
of adopted a more ketogenic 
carnivore approach. 

863
00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:36,600
When I was doing bodybuilding, I
no longer really have cravings 

864
00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:41,300
for like Oreos or Pop-Tarts or 
ice cream or anything like that.

865
00:46:41,300 --> 00:46:43,600
It's more. 
So like I have a craving for 

866
00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:48,500
like a steak and I think just 
eating like Giant dense foods is

867
00:46:48,500 --> 00:46:54,100
definitely helping me in my 
lifestyle overall, which will 

868
00:46:54,100 --> 00:46:59,000
only lead to, like, longevity. 
Like I know when I go older, I 

869
00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:01,100
don't know how long I'll be 
doing bodybuilding, but, you 

870
00:47:01,100 --> 00:47:05,300
know, as I get older and my 60s,
and 70s, or whatever, like, I 

871
00:47:05,300 --> 00:47:09,300
know that like, my organs will 
be fine because I'm not pumping 

872
00:47:09,300 --> 00:47:12,400
my body with all these food 
additives. 

873
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:14,600
Well, I've got no doubt that 
you'll keep getting better. 

874
00:47:14,600 --> 00:47:17,600
I mean every should have seen 
you in been able to A role in 

875
00:47:17,600 --> 00:47:19,000
like you look better. 
Every single time. 

876
00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:21,600
I step onstage. 
You're super detail. 

877
00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:23,700
Toying with your training with 
your nutrition. 

878
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:26,700
So I've got no reason to believe
you won't keep getting better. 

879
00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:30,500
So, I hope you're stepping on 
stage when you're, you know, 78 

880
00:47:30,500 --> 00:47:35,800
years old and still kicking. 
Yeah, I mean, just like I like I

881
00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:38,800
really don't know how long 
they'll be doing bodybuilding, 

882
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:41,500
but right now, like the 
definitely like the short-term 

883
00:47:41,500 --> 00:47:45,900
goal right now is just to get 
myself on the national stage and

884
00:47:45,900 --> 00:47:49,400
like, just even the thought of 
me, going to Nationals because 

885
00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:52,900
last year, it was funny because 
on that last show I did in 

886
00:47:52,900 --> 00:47:55,600
September. 
I remember like, one of the last

887
00:47:55,600 --> 00:47:57,200
things I kind of yelled out to 
my family. 

888
00:47:57,200 --> 00:47:59,200
As we're, like, driving to the 
venue. 

889
00:47:59,600 --> 00:48:02,300
I was like trying to get some 
rest, and like, everyone's 

890
00:48:02,300 --> 00:48:03,900
feeling, like, talk in the car, 
whatever. 

891
00:48:03,900 --> 00:48:05,900
I'm just like, I just need to 
close my eyes. 

892
00:48:05,900 --> 00:48:10,400
Like, I'm trying to get nasty 
qualified here and lo and behold

893
00:48:10,400 --> 00:48:13,100
on that last show. 
I actually did become nationally

894
00:48:13,100 --> 00:48:16,400
qualified. 
So, I mean, if I really did want

895
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:21,000
to do National show, I could do 
it this year, but I really chose

896
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:24,900
to stay in my improvement 
season, of course, to know build

897
00:48:24,900 --> 00:48:27,300
a little bit little bit more 
because honestly when I see 

898
00:48:27,300 --> 00:48:34,600
these girls get on the national 
stage For bikini, it's like holy

899
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:37,100
crap. 
Like, you have to look the part 

900
00:48:37,100 --> 00:48:42,500
of an ifbb Pro and honestly, I 
don't think my body's quite 

901
00:48:42,500 --> 00:48:45,400
there yet, but I feel like with 
all the improvements I've been 

902
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:49,700
doing so far, like, I will get 
there for next year. 

903
00:48:49,700 --> 00:48:52,900
But the only. 
So, the thing, how the NPC works

904
00:48:52,900 --> 00:48:56,900
is that once you Nashi qualify, 
I think it your, your National 

905
00:48:56,900 --> 00:49:00,000
qualification only lasts for 
like that year in the upcoming 

906
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:02,100
year. 
So next year, Have to become 

907
00:49:02,100 --> 00:49:06,000
nationally qualified again which
I think I will be if I got nasty

908
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:08,200
qualified with the physique I 
had last year. 

909
00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:11,000
So I just have to become 
nationally qualified again and 

910
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:13,000
then I can get onto the national
state. 

911
00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:15,800
Yeah that's honestly one of my 
biggest frustrations with many 

912
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:19,500
of these federation's. 
Like if you do a pro qualifying 

913
00:49:19,500 --> 00:49:21,900
show you earn a pro card. 
You become nationally qualified 

914
00:49:21,900 --> 00:49:23,300
be able to compete at the 
national level. 

915
00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:26,600
They put this time stipulation 
on there, but oftentimes it's 

916
00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:30,800
within such a short window of 
time that competitors are, you 

917
00:49:30,800 --> 00:49:33,400
know, pretty much A push to 
compete again within 12 months. 

918
00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:36,000
Yeah. 
And that's not really optimal if

919
00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:39,100
you're trying to have a building
phase, especially if your 

920
00:49:39,100 --> 00:49:40,800
natural competitive. 
Like, if you're a natural 

921
00:49:40,800 --> 00:49:43,900
athlete, and you just spent six 
months prepping and you got to 

922
00:49:43,900 --> 00:49:46,500
do a reverse dyin, I mean 
there's no time at all to build 

923
00:49:46,500 --> 00:49:49,800
before you get it started again 
to maintain that window of 

924
00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:53,400
qualifications. 
So I wish Federation start 

925
00:49:53,400 --> 00:49:56,800
broadening vent a bit more but 
who knows. 

926
00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:58,700
I'm in a lot of these 
federation's like the NPC. 

927
00:49:58,700 --> 00:50:01,100
I mean a lot of those 
competitors are not natural so 

928
00:50:01,100 --> 00:50:03,600
they're able to Kind of shorten 
those windows by, you know, 

929
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:05,800
edition of performance-enhancing
drugs. 

930
00:50:06,500 --> 00:50:10,200
But you know for people that do 
want to keep things natural and 

931
00:50:10,200 --> 00:50:12,300
you know make this a healthy 
sport from a longevity 

932
00:50:12,300 --> 00:50:14,100
standpoint you really need more 
time. 

933
00:50:15,200 --> 00:50:19,300
Yeah and I really do see that 
especially when I do watch these

934
00:50:19,300 --> 00:50:23,900
ifbb bikini Pros like try to 
qualify for the Olympia which it

935
00:50:23,900 --> 00:50:27,200
kind of like raise my eyebrows a
little bit like being an amateur

936
00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:30,900
in the sport and I see all these
iife Pros like they're competing

937
00:50:30,900 --> 00:50:33,900
almost Be weaker, like, almost 
like every two, to three weeks, 

938
00:50:33,900 --> 00:50:35,900
they have a show. 
And I like, always felt like, 

939
00:50:36,100 --> 00:50:39,200
why are they competing so much? 
And it's because they have to 

940
00:50:39,600 --> 00:50:42,300
qualify. 
Let's see if you don't because I

941
00:50:42,308 --> 00:50:45,500
think one of the ways you can 
for sure qualify to get into the

942
00:50:45,500 --> 00:50:49,800
Olympia is if you if you place 
first in the show, well, there's

943
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:52,100
other and I think this year, 
they have it. 

944
00:50:52,100 --> 00:50:55,500
So, there's point. 
So I think, I think if you place

945
00:50:55,500 --> 00:51:00,000
like first or like first, second
third, you get Olympia 

946
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:03,200
qualification point. 
So, Actually all of these girls 

947
00:51:03,200 --> 00:51:07,300
they kind of know. 
They're competing like five six 

948
00:51:07,300 --> 00:51:10,500
times a year just to get those 
points just so they can qualify 

949
00:51:10,500 --> 00:51:14,100
for Olympia. 
But I've seen some really smart 

950
00:51:14,100 --> 00:51:17,300
pros and there's you know, 
there's one pro that I follow 

951
00:51:17,300 --> 00:51:20,200
her name's Morgan dead and 
Miller and she actually 

952
00:51:20,200 --> 00:51:23,100
qualified for the oh last year. 
So I'm not mistaken. 

953
00:51:23,100 --> 00:51:26,400
She got top 10 and everyone was 
so excited for her and I think 

954
00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:29,300
she did the Arnold as well. 
And then I think after the 

955
00:51:29,300 --> 00:51:32,700
Arnold's this year, I'm not sure
if this is correct or not but 

956
00:51:32,700 --> 00:51:36,600
she said she wouldn't be 
competing in the 0 because she 

957
00:51:36,600 --> 00:51:40,600
want to work on her physique and
I think Lauren Dan Miller was 

958
00:51:40,600 --> 00:51:44,300
one of the IP Pros. 
I did follow a lot during 2020 

959
00:51:44,300 --> 00:51:49,000
as far as her competition season
goes and like I honestly like I 

960
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:54,100
like how she attacks her. 
Her overall training, like not 

961
00:51:54,100 --> 00:51:56,800
just called print but also you 
know, her Improvement Season 

962
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,000
everything I think she's, I 
think she's very balanced and 

963
00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:02,300
she has she has an awareness of 
her body of When it needs rest 

964
00:52:02,300 --> 00:52:05,300
and you know you know, when 
needs food and everything like 

965
00:52:05,300 --> 00:52:08,300
that. 
And and the fact that she's 

966
00:52:08,300 --> 00:52:10,700
actually taking like the rest of
your office, not cooking the, 

967
00:52:10,700 --> 00:52:15,700
oh, this year, was I found that 
to be, you know, I kind of look 

968
00:52:15,700 --> 00:52:18,800
up to her for that because like 
she knows because she knows that

969
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:22,900
she wants to like be up there, 
like, in the top five for bikini

970
00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:25,800
Olympia. 
I just like, I know she wants 

971
00:52:25,800 --> 00:52:27,800
it, so she's gonna like, you 
know, take the time off and 

972
00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:33,000
develop like to develop. 
To be better on stage for the oh

973
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,100
the next time. 
So, I mean, I really do commend 

974
00:52:35,100 --> 00:52:37,300
her for that for taking the year
off because everyone thought she

975
00:52:37,300 --> 00:52:40,900
was going to do it again. 
But yeah, I mean like, like you 

976
00:52:40,908 --> 00:52:44,000
said Robert unfortunately with 
NPC and I Phoebe there's so many

977
00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:47,400
people that do the Peds and 
steroids and like I feel like 

978
00:52:47,400 --> 00:52:52,100
for for the bikini Pros I can 
tell which girls are Juiced or 

979
00:52:52,100 --> 00:52:56,000
not and it's and it's so funny 
when I see like the like the 

980
00:52:56,000 --> 00:52:59,100
natural girls when they go up 
there and they do place like 

981
00:52:59,200 --> 00:53:02,100
when they do get like a first 
place or they Place like top 

982
00:53:02,100 --> 00:53:05,900
three because I know like, okay,
like it is possible but you have

983
00:53:05,900 --> 00:53:09,300
to do the, you have to do the 
work in your improvement season 

984
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:11,600
to get there. 
Yeah. 100%. 

985
00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:14,400
And I feel like it's admirable 
that people at that high level 

986
00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:17,100
are taking that time off me and 
vocal about it because I feel 

987
00:53:17,100 --> 00:53:18,600
like more people need to hear 
that for sure. 

988
00:53:18,600 --> 00:53:22,400
Because there's just so much 
ignorance around what is and is 

989
00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:25,900
not possible naturally on both 
sides of the spectrum. 

990
00:53:25,900 --> 00:53:28,600
Like like a lot of people are 
disillusioned to the point of 

991
00:53:28,600 --> 00:53:31,200
thinking that you know the 
elite. 

992
00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:33,200
Level mr. 
Olympia bodybuilder natural 

993
00:53:33,200 --> 00:53:36,600
which is not the case, but on 
the same Spectrum are on the 

994
00:53:36,600 --> 00:53:38,700
opposite of the same Spectrum. 
There's a lot of people out 

995
00:53:38,700 --> 00:53:41,000
there that assume that in order 
to have any muscles at all, you 

996
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:44,000
got to be taking steroids, which
is also not the case at all. 

997
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:46,700
So that's why I'm so passionate 
about the sport or natural 

998
00:53:46,700 --> 00:53:49,300
bodybuilding, as a whole, like 
really pushing your body's 

999
00:53:49,300 --> 00:53:52,400
natural capability to see what 
it's capable of from a physical 

1000
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:53,800
standpoint. 
But also from a mental 

1001
00:53:53,800 --> 00:53:56,500
standpoint to maintain that 
degree of consistency and 

1002
00:53:56,500 --> 00:53:58,400
discipline. 
It's just, it's just awesome. 

1003
00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:00,900
So for people like you that are 
doing it naturally that are 

1004
00:54:00,900 --> 00:54:02,600
doing it right? 
They're doing it with a proper 

1005
00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:04,400
diets. 
Proper building phase proper 

1006
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:06,700
cutting phase. 
It's just awesome for me to be 

1007
00:54:06,707 --> 00:54:08,300
able to have the opportunity to 
work with you. 

1008
00:54:08,600 --> 00:54:12,100
And I've always said this. 
But with my competitive clients,

1009
00:54:12,500 --> 00:54:15,700
you know, I watch you go through
all these changes. 

1010
00:54:15,700 --> 00:54:18,800
I want you go to the mental 
struggles, the mental highs, the

1011
00:54:18,800 --> 00:54:23,200
mental lows, and when you do 
that, it's just it's just so 

1012
00:54:23,200 --> 00:54:24,900
cool. 
Like seeing people faced with 

1013
00:54:24,900 --> 00:54:28,100
adversity, and how they respond 
in the face of that. 

1014
00:54:28,100 --> 00:54:30,900
Adversity is one of the most 
fulfilling things that I've ever

1015
00:54:30,900 --> 00:54:33,100
had the opportunity. 
Opportunity to, you know, be a 

1016
00:54:33,100 --> 00:54:36,700
part of so I can't thank you 
enough for letting me be your 

1017
00:54:36,700 --> 00:54:40,500
coach for as long as you have. 
I'm honored to do it incredible 

1018
00:54:40,500 --> 00:54:42,400
athlete. 
You've looked better with every 

1019
00:54:42,600 --> 00:54:44,900
time you stepped on stage and 
I'm just super excited for what 

1020
00:54:44,900 --> 00:54:47,800
the future holds for, you know. 
Well, you're welcome Robert. 

1021
00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:48,900
Yeah. 
And it was great to, you know, 

1022
00:54:48,900 --> 00:54:52,500
have you as a coach? 
I know I knew like, once I got 

1023
00:54:52,500 --> 00:54:55,200
into bodybuilding, especially 
since I was keto before 

1024
00:54:55,200 --> 00:54:58,300
bodybuilding, like I just knew I
needed to have someone in my 

1025
00:54:58,300 --> 00:55:01,200
corner so you know, to help back
me up with a ketone. 

1026
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:04,600
Like approach to bodybuilding 
and so you know definitely doing

1027
00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:07,400
my research and then seeing you 
Robert since Lee you know you 

1028
00:55:07,400 --> 00:55:10,100
compete. 
I think but I mean like for me 

1029
00:55:10,100 --> 00:55:12,800
like having coaches that compete
is important because it means 

1030
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:15,500
you know, they're still there 
still knowledgeable, the sport 

1031
00:55:15,500 --> 00:55:18,900
and all the recent changes and 
everything and you know and plus

1032
00:55:18,900 --> 00:55:23,900
like when I have a leader that 
can actually like does like does

1033
00:55:23,900 --> 00:55:26,100
the job themselves like 
bodybuilding compete? 

1034
00:55:26,100 --> 00:55:28,900
Like that's something that you 
know I can look forward to and 

1035
00:55:28,900 --> 00:55:31,200
you know, Roberts been great to 
have you as a coach as well. 

1036
00:55:31,300 --> 00:55:34,000
Well, I know by know before you 
had mentioned to me, you know, 

1037
00:55:34,100 --> 00:55:38,800
if it if if you're still like 
necessary in my life, even after

1038
00:55:38,900 --> 00:55:43,300
my even during this improvement 
season, because I know you told 

1039
00:55:43,300 --> 00:55:45,700
me, like we won't be like, 
tweaking macros as much. 

1040
00:55:45,700 --> 00:55:49,900
And of course, like I still feel
like I need you as a coach 

1041
00:55:49,900 --> 00:55:52,700
Robert because definitely like 
there's not a lot of people 

1042
00:55:52,700 --> 00:55:57,600
around me that I can like share 
and relate all my thoughts to. 

1043
00:55:57,600 --> 00:56:01,200
So definitely having someone in 
my corner where I can talk. 

1044
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:04,800
You know, anything in the keto 
diet or any changes that I'm 

1045
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:08,100
experiencing in this improvement
season, if I can share that with

1046
00:56:08,100 --> 00:56:10,600
someone and get feedback. 
It's great. 

1047
00:56:10,600 --> 00:56:14,800
So I definitely still love 
having you as a coach Robert, I 

1048
00:56:14,808 --> 00:56:16,800
certainly appreciate that love 
having you as a client and I'm 

1049
00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:19,200
excited because we both be 
prepping at the same time next 

1050
00:56:19,200 --> 00:56:20,800
year. 
So so that'll be. 

1051
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:25,400
That'll be pretty intense. 
Yeah, it'll be good. 

1052
00:56:26,000 --> 00:56:27,600
Marjorie will where do people go
to find out? 

1053
00:56:27,600 --> 00:56:28,800
More about you? 
Follow along? 

1054
00:56:28,800 --> 00:56:31,200
Watch the prep unfold. 
Watch the building Faison. 

1055
00:56:31,300 --> 00:56:33,200
Fold, just get more information 
on you and general. 

1056
00:56:34,100 --> 00:56:35,800
Okay, that's a great question 
Robert. 

1057
00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:39,200
So I do have a public Instagram 
page so it's pronounced. 

1058
00:56:39,200 --> 00:56:41,900
It's bacon, but it's spelled 
differently. 

1059
00:56:41,900 --> 00:56:47,900
So it's going to be itz 
underscore be a 3 C 0 n 

1060
00:56:47,900 --> 00:56:50,000
underscore. 
Can I have bacon in there 

1061
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:51,800
somewhere? 
Yeah. 

1062
00:56:51,800 --> 00:56:56,400
Exactly like yeah, because I did
have like a I did have a private

1063
00:56:56,800 --> 00:57:01,500
Facebook page but I change. 
I got a public one since I You 

1064
00:57:01,500 --> 00:57:05,500
did last year to kind of like 
showcase my my journey in 

1065
00:57:05,500 --> 00:57:07,700
bodybuilding and definitely with
this page. 

1066
00:57:07,900 --> 00:57:11,300
I definitely wanted to showcase 
the reverse dieting phase 

1067
00:57:11,300 --> 00:57:15,600
because again it's it's a phase 
where not a lot of people. 

1068
00:57:15,600 --> 00:57:19,700
See, I feel like with the 99% in
general population, not a lot of

1069
00:57:19,700 --> 00:57:24,100
people know about, you know, the
reverse diet or what happens to 

1070
00:57:24,100 --> 00:57:26,400
a competitor like after they 
compete, you know. 

1071
00:57:26,700 --> 00:57:29,800
So I feel like if I can provide 
this background information this

1072
00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:32,800
knowledge, you know, not Thing 
is about, you know, being lean 

1073
00:57:32,800 --> 00:57:36,000
and all the Glam but you have to
put the work in the background 

1074
00:57:36,000 --> 00:57:39,700
order to really Shine On Stage. 
Totally agree and I learn a lot 

1075
00:57:39,700 --> 00:57:43,900
in working with you like how 
your body is responding to this 

1076
00:57:43,900 --> 00:57:46,700
particular type of reverse diet 
going as slow as we have. 

1077
00:57:46,900 --> 00:57:49,800
That's exactly how I'm going to 
implement my future, reverse 

1078
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:52,700
diet in the light of what I've 
learned in coaching you. 

1079
00:57:53,400 --> 00:57:56,300
So yeah, I think the reverse 
that portion of the fate of the 

1080
00:57:56,300 --> 00:57:59,100
prep, you know, people need to 
have more awareness there. 

1081
00:57:59,100 --> 00:58:00,700
They need to learn more about 
that. 

1082
00:58:01,300 --> 00:58:04,100
And I've referenced you on 
multiple podcast multiple 

1083
00:58:04,100 --> 00:58:07,000
Communications with other 
clients because you've done it, 

1084
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:09,500
right? 
Your body has responded 

1085
00:58:09,500 --> 00:58:12,900
correctly and you're a perfect 
Testament to what happens when 

1086
00:58:12,900 --> 00:58:15,600
you do. 
Have some degree of you know, 

1087
00:58:15,600 --> 00:58:18,200
strategy, post-show post cut and
I feel like everybody should 

1088
00:58:18,200 --> 00:58:20,100
have been a bit would benefit 
from that. 

1089
00:58:20,600 --> 00:58:22,400
So thank you for jumping on the 
podcast. 

1090
00:58:22,400 --> 00:58:24,100
Thank you for letting me use you
as an example. 

1091
00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:27,100
And I'm just excited to keep 
working with you and see how the

1092
00:58:27,100 --> 00:58:29,800
next prep turns out Marjorie. 
So keep killing it, and keep 

1093
00:58:29,800 --> 00:58:31,900
staying the Savage. 
You are Are. 

1094
00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:34,000
All right, thanks so much Robert
for having me. 

1095
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:36,000
You had a pleasure talking on 
your podcast. 

1096
00:58:36,100 --> 00:58:37,200
You bet take care.