Hello, ladies and gents Robert Sykes keto zappos.com.
And today I've got special, guest, client and friend.
Michael Dennehy on the line, we talked on the podcast last year,
after we had gone through a prep.
He'd gone through a prep with me and we had done an elk hunt
together in Colorado, and he actually just got finished doing
his elk hunt this year. I was not able to go do to rise
was birth and just simply having a lot of stuff here at the home
place but he just got back from that out, cut not too long ago
so I wanted to pick his brain. Rain and figure out how the Hunt
went to whether or not, he was successful.
What he'd learned from a nutritional standpoint based off
of the manipulations that we made in getting him, dialed in
for the hunt and honestly, just some of the training techniques
that he implemented to prepare for the hunt.
And we talked quite a bit about hunting ballistics kind of down
the rabbit hole ballistic but I really enjoy that stuff so
hopefully you find interested in as well but I just got a lot of
respect for Michael. He's a first-class fellow and I
truly enjoyed the conversation. I've got no doubt that you will.
Something from it. So that for their do sit back
relax and do the podcast with my good friend Michael Dennehy.
We are live. Michael Dennehy, how are you
sir? I'm doing well, how are you?
Robert and man, I'm good. It's a always, a pleasure
chatting with you man. We have worked together for
quite some time. Then we went on a hunting trip
together to last year and then I was not able to go on this
Colorado. Elk hunt with you this year due
to having a newborn, but I'll come there immediately
understandable. But man, I missed it, man.
I knew that you were at their hunting over, kind of get your
nutrition dialed in for the hunt specifically.
And just knowing that you're out there freaking humping and
putting two miles in, you know, carrying that pack carrying the
rifle, high, elevations, cold weather, like, I longed to be
there. Well, we missed you, for sure.
I tried to do you proud by getting as many miles in as
possible, but we completely understand, family comes first,
and it always should. So we've always got next year.
Hey, Kim and did you track your miles?
I did not track them specifically but I can tell you
what, according to the map. I didn't have an app per say,
I'm kind of a little bit more of an old-school type person, but I
can go linear distance on a map and we covered between 52 and 55
miles over a five-day hunt. Nice, a pretty much on par.
I don't know what we covered last year.
I want to say it was like I think it was 60 but that was
with my you know daily runs and everything to so probably about
the same from a hunting standpoint.
Yeah, it was about the same. In fact, we hunted a lot in the
same area and so we went to the top of the ELCA Dome just like
you and I did last year and glassed out from there.
But I'd say on average, I was putting in between you know 9 10
11 miles a day. We were really getting out there
as you know we're at Trailhead at 4:00 in the morning and
moving out for a couple hours from there and I think that had
a lot to do with this success. But we'll get into that.
A hundred percent, man. So we have had a podcast like
our last podcast was I don't have to go back and look at the
date, but I'm pretty sure we published that right after our
soon. After the hunt that we did last
year which was in tandem with pretty much the depth of your
cut in which you lost. How much weight did you lose
overall with last year's cut? 18:22.
I'm doing I'm doing math and 54 pounds.
Yeah, so quite quite a bit and then this year, we started you
started at 230 pounds, 31 to 31. And then right before the elk
hunt, let's see here. You were at like 2005.
It looks like and then you've been yep, trending Down Still.
And now you're coming in and like 20 1.6.
As of Of today tomorrow and for my further east and point and
so, oh, go ahead. Yeah, I was going to say I went
in at roughly about the same poundage both times.
Yeah. Do you feel like you know 200
205 pounds right around that ballpark is a pretty good
hunting wait for you because a lot of people I love people I
think we talked about this last time on the podcast but people
that are hearing is talking about hunting.
They may have an idea of you know sit in a deer stand, sit in
the truck roadside waiting for deer run across the road when a
dog something like that. And that is not what we do and
we're out hunting out west for Elk.
No, not at all. And and I'll add, you know, you
and I have had that conversation.
I'm a little bit more advanced in age having recently, hit my
50th birthday and you know, the truth of the matter is, I know,
I can compete candidly. I can compete against age group
and I appreciate, even when you saw me first hand, I'm not many
of your clients can see in person.
You and I were working out together.
ER, and you paid me the ultimate compliment.
When you said, hey man, I really think you can do some damage on
stage. I think you can be really
competitive but hunting is really become my passion,
passion and you and I had that conversation a couple months ago
where you said, hey after this hunt.
You know, where do you want to go?
Because six months ago, I said, hey, this is this is my
quote-unquote being onstage. Time is the hunt and I wanted to
be, we called it. We called that shot before.
Pitch was thrown. Why wanted to be 200?
2205 to answer your question. Yes, I think that that is a
perfect. I think that's a perfect weight
because there is a strength aspect involved, but there's
also an endurance aspect involved.
The reason why I went on about the, this being my quote unquote
sport is, it is very much an athletic event, Western spot.
In stock elk hunting at 10,000 feet.
Anywhere from, you know, 7502 10th are 7500 to 10,000 feet.
It is a huge athletic event their strength, there's muscular
strength endurance, and there's cardio all three of those
different forms of of conditioning and what I mean by
muscles muscular strength and endurance is not the vo2max, not
the climbing up a 45 degree pitch, you know until 12,000
feet, not talking about that necessarily.
I'm talking about. Can your legs really handle
climbing, 200-300, sometimes four hundred floors worth of
elevation in one day. That's what I mean by muscular
strength endurance. Not what you can squat, not how
fast you can run, 100 meters. But how long can you sustain
that? And it's not just one day.
Now, you're putting in five, six, seven days in a row and you
have to get up and you're sleep deprived.
And I'm going on a little bit here, but my point there being
is, this really is my passion and my sport.
This was the time for me to be quote, unquote on stage and I'm
already planning next year. For example, this is what I do.
Every single year 200 to 205 is a perfect weight for me to go
into this because I can carry my eight and a half pound gun.
I can carry my 35 pounds worth of equipment.
Man, I still have the body mass to really you know put the miles
on my body and not break down. I'm not Tulane.
I'd say I went in probably somewhere in the neighborhood of
13%. Twelve, thirteen percent body
fat, which I think is as healthy, I wasn't too depleted
and it worked for me man. Yeah, I think that's an
important. You know, thing to distinguish
the I feel like a lot of like it would do you No good to be you
know hiking at that elevation at 5% body fat and looking
bodybuilding stage ready. Because at that point, you're
sacrificing performance and endurance and Recovery because
you were so depleted at the same token it does you no good to be
significantly higher than that because then you're going to
suffer from a cardiovascular health and stamina standpoint.
So, I think that nice little middle ground of probably
between 8 and 13 percent body fat, 14 percent body fat right
there in that sweet spot. Got 220 205 pounds for you, you
know, your leaner, you have the conditioning, but you're not
depleted, and it may see it in starving to the point where
you're just, not able to put in the work.
Right. In a little bit of context, I'm
six foot four or so. You know, I'm not five foot two
and 205 pounds and six foot four, so, I'm not quite
triathlete, you know, world-class triathlete thin, you
know, those guys are, you know, 64 180 pounds.
I'm a little bit heavier than that but strong enough to carry
around that pack on that gun without a problem.
Yeah. And I feel I feel bad because I
feel like I at least have not been put to the true test and I
think you haven't years prior, but not not last.
When we hunted together of doing all of that then actually being
successful with the elk and having to backpack the elk out.
Yeah. It you know the way we hunt the
way you and I hunt in particular you're so far back.
Yeah. You know, you hit the trail head
up for, it was funny, I'll just share this quick little
anecdote, we come down and we hit the base camp at the base of
the mountain and we'd get out. And, hey, what are you guys
seeing this, that, and the other thing?
And it's funny to see all of these, the pumpkin patch, you
know, the guys, with the blaze orange, sweatshirts in the big
bellies and well, Haven't seen anything, I saw 125.
Yeah. And they'll look at you and say,
well, where are they? It's like, they're not next to
the trail. I'll tell you that.
And, you know, you're putting in two hours, straight line,
distance to our hike out, and that's just to set up on a
mountain and look for them before.
The sun comes out a true athletic event and then you
might have to hike another hour or so to get to where you think,
there might be a shot. Well, then you have to stop.
And think, if I shoot this animal, it's three to six hours
of work just to get a quartered. And then I have to walk out here
another four hours the next day just to pack it out.
So, that's actually consideration.
Yeah, and I feel like mean you, there's just so many variables
at play. Like, when you're out there
hunting, and then you've got to like you, you're glassing and
that mean glassing in and of itself is an extreme exercise
and discipline. Because if you're looking
through the lens for hours on end, For and you know trying to
pick out like an animal, you trying to pick out an antler, or
a hoof for a hind quickly, trying to pick apart, just what
you can see and then you find that and sometimes it's you know
a mile away and you got to hook it to that point and it's cold
outside but you get layers of gear on you get your backpack,
you get your gun, so your high, tell it to get to a vantage
point that's closer to the animal and you're out of breath.
You're climbing elevation at a rapid rate, and you've got to be
able to put a shot on there and maintain proper breathing to
place that, you know, well, A shot.
You just I mean it's very much. So an athletic event.
Like for people that are accustomed to sitting in a deer
stand on a truck. This is not that like you have
to legitimately be in great shape.
If you plan on putting yourself at a competitive advantage
against an animal, that is subjected to these elements
every single day, day in day out without fail, they have survived
and they're continuing to survive in that environment.
That harsh environment, you got to, you got to play in their
sandbox. Absolutely, I think it was
listening to Joe Rogan who himself.
He's a big al Connor. He said these animals Thrive and
conditions that would leave you. And I are, I dead in a 24-hour
period. We we would die and in their
conditions, and they're out there absolutely thriving.
I touched on it earlier. I asked Summit that this year I
saw 125 elk. So, in terms of that I consider
Very successful, elk hunt. The average guy down at base
camp was saying, he was seeing goose egg, nothing and or
something way off on a distant on the other Edge that he
couldn't possibly get a shot on, I would say, on average, I was
seeing an order of magnitude more elk than they were and it
all has to do with just what you were saying.
My Approach and what you helped me do is I trained for this as
if it is a purely athletic event, which it is pure.
Read end of story. It's the it's the ultimate
athletic event. You are literally trying to
physically compete with an animal and the stakes could not
be higher particularly for the animal, no pun intended.
I mean it's just a true acknowledgement of what it is.
You're out there doing. I don't treat it as Recreation.
I treat it as a full-blown athletic event and I actually
have a training plan that I've come up with.
I really like what you've done From a strength point of view
and I've tailored it a little bit to for lower body, muscular,
strength, endurance and cardio, and I'm happy to share some of
the training techniques. In particular that I've used
that got me to a point where or no kidding.
These guys are looking at me and saying, how far did you go and
back in one day? So I'm happy to go through some
of those if you'd like. Yeah, for sure, man, lay it on
us. All right, training in
particular, will get to the diet stuff later.
Kito, I think I'll just say Quito is an ideal diet.
It's an ideal eating system for hunting you, and I've covered it
and past podcasts. I'll just say that it is hands
down. It is the way to go to be fat
adapted out in the mountains. I was never at loss for any
energy whatsoever. Yeah.
All right, as far as the training goes about, I enjoy and
appreciate your new training system that you put me in other
clients on, which is the full body every day.
I like the fact that my, in particular, what I've noticed is
that my lower body, muscular strength and endurance.
In other words, how many squats can I do?
That's exploded. What I also like is that my
pull-ups which have always been very, very difficult exercise
for me again, six foot for the long lanky basketball type.
We're notorious for not being good at Pull-Ups for the first
time in my life, Rob, I did 15 pull-ups in a row at age, 50,
nice. So, yeah, it's, I mean, that's,
that's kind of a big deal also. What I love about that was I
think that, that approach you can, you can tailor it to do,
you can tailor to do powerful lists, you can tailor it to do
hypertrophic. Lifts but doing all the
different body parts at one time.
Every single day. I tended to focus it over the
last six weeks, more towards a lower weight, higher repetition.
And I think that paid off in the mountains for me and I didn't, I
didn't skip power but I didn't lose power.
I didn't lose strength. My Max reps were still pretty
high but I focused on more of a muscular strength endurance
specifically for the mountains. 100 days out, I adopt a protocol
on the StairMaster. I do maintain my cardio
throughout the year so this isn't building cardio from
Square One. However, StairMaster in
particular that is an event specific.
Excuse me, a yes, an event specific training technique and
after a few years in a row of using the StairMaster, I kind of
have it dialed in. Into what it's not just getting
on the StairMaster and doing 20 minutes.
There are certain ways and techniques to use it that I
think really paid off. So 100 days out, I would break
it into, you know, periods of 10.
So the first one through ten days.
The second one through ten days, the 20s, the 30s, the 40's Etc.
I'll just start with the ultimate goal.
The ultimate goal is to get to a point where you can do 30
minutes in a row. No hands.
And that's the key. You don't put any hands you
chuckle. I'm telling you, it is a now.
It's a different exercise with no hands.
It's a totally different exercise. 12, be careful.
Doing it. Do not bite off more than you
can chew because everybody thinks they're, you know,
they're, they're, they're Timmy tough guns.
And they're just going to, you know, Huff it and puff it.
You're not, you're going to start off.
You need to train up to that point where you can do 30
minutes? No hands at a level of six or
more. You think it's easy.
Oh, i'mi'm physique athlete and I pose on stage at 4%, body fat,
cool, cool, buddy, try that. You're going to fall on your
face and everybody in the gym is going to laugh at you.
Yeah. So what I do is so 0 through 10,
I will have my hands on the The rails to stabilize myself and
I'll do 20 minutes and I'll go every 30 seconds I will raise it
up. So for the first 10 days I tried
to get to level 4. So at 30 seconds I go from 1 to
2 at 60 seconds. I go from 2 to 3 and at 90
seconds, I'll go from Level 3 to level 4 and all I'm doing is
just conditioning my body. It's not much of a challenge at
all. I'll do that for 10 days.
From 11 through 20, I'll do that.
But go up to level 5, you know, 21 through 30.
I'll do the same thing. Except now I'm going up to level
6 after that. That's when I start doing, no
hands. All right.
So when I get to day 30 and up, that's when I start doing 0
hands, and I'll go back down to level 4 and the next day or the
next 10 days. Level 5, the next 10 days.
Level 6, Etc. When you get to a point where
you can do 20 minutes, no hands at 6 Plus level on the
StairMaster, you're doing pretty damn good.
You probably going to be sweating your cardio is going to
be hitting without the hands. Here's what's really getting
worked. That you're not going to work.
Nearly as much with hands, your glutes, your hips.
And you help me out here. You're the expert, the, the
muscles in the lower back, right above the waist about halfway up
your back right there, immediately, adjacent to the
spine. So it's going to be that, that
was listeria. That what what did you call it?
Basically all the, the lat, the lattice door, sigh, all the lat
I lost your whole back. Honest, let me just simply
training bending over, not bending over, keeping yourself a
Erect. Like your whole back, your
lumbar, you know? Like from a talking about terms,
like your whole back strap section is going to be.
Yeah, the backstrap. Yeah, your lungs out back strap.
Will you go hands off the first time?
And trust me the next day. You're going to feel in your
back strap, it hits your body particularly that posterior
chain in such a different way, but that is exactly the manner
in which you're climbing up the mountain.
You're not using your hands. You might as well throw your ear
shooting sticks away or at least have them packed up.
You're not going to use them as walking-sticks because you're
going to have both your hands around your weapon as you
should. You should have control of your
weapon at all times. You're not, you don't have free
hands out there. You're walking.
Pretty much erect pretty much up, right?
You're going up and down mountains, like that.
Once you get to a point where you can do 30 minutes on the
StairMaster, No hands at a level of 6 or higher.
I'd say you're you're doing pretty doggone good and I
wouldn't think you'd have any problems whatsoever out in the
mountains. I totally agree when I'm doing a
prep that the StairMaster pretty much my only source of cardio
and I'll often times go up to 20 minutes at level 15, 16 17, 18,
but I always do that level with hands, and it's a totally
different ball game without hanging.
I don't think I could do that. That without hands.
Like I would literally be sprinting at that point, and I'd
be busting my face. But yeah, doing it without
hands. I mean there's just a lot more
involved from a from an agility standpoint from like in honestly
doing so with good form. Like if you don't want to be
flat footing the StairMaster you want to be kind of kicking off
with your with your calves, you know, stepping off with your
toes, the ball of your feet like you want to have agility as
you're going through that and having strict form of control.
I mean honestly the StairMaster is definitely a cardio Of
equipment. But you are definitely getting a
lot of deep muscle tissue activation in your legs, your
glutes, your quads, your hamstrings, your calves.
If you're doing it properly. No.
Absolutely and there's a strong strong cautionary Tale in there
for your listeners. Do not use the StairMaster
without hands. If you're going purely for that
that Max VO2 Fitness cardio. It, it should not be taken
lightly that with hands off this.
This should be a controlled Tempo.
The whole point of the hands-off is that posterior chain training
and conditioning. It is not See what your VO2 max
is. If that's the case, you know,
they make they make those treadmills and or go outside,
but do not try that hands-free at level 18, level 18 is pretty
damn good. I mean, even with Hands-On if
I'm hitting 1213, I'm usually sweating it out pretty good.
Yeah, no, for sure. I freaking love it, man.
Like, I'm the me getting excited to do this.
Dare magic. And I'm not gonna stare master
in years, but I will, when I start my prep and I'm I'm
excited for the the cardio confessions, as they say, like
just simply be in there at the StairMaster Altar and sacrifice
and, you know, yeah. Well right after this podcast, I
had to the gym and today is a rest day in terms of the weight
lifting, but I'm going to do the Dubai tower on the StairMaster
and that's 130 floor. So I'm looking forward to that.
Actually. Nice nice.
That'll be good, man. Yeah, as far as the, the prep
towards Hunting is concerned, we can start talking about a little
bit before we hit record. But you had mentioned not
changing your attrition such that you're, you know, feeding
into that. Can you kind of elaborate on
that a little bit? Yeah, you know, I I went in and
I did an intuitive feeding, and I was like, Hey, for the week.
I've got so much of my time that's already been taken, and
I'm putting in extreme exertion out in the mountains.
It'll be okay if I do intuitive. Eating.
Well, I didn't need to do that one.
I was already fat adapted, my ketones were really starting to
go through the roof. And I think I set myself back on
my longer-term, goals by doing intuitive feeding.
If I had it all to do over again and, you know, I even brought a
scale with me. And I saw it at the time and I
thought, oh, this is just swelling and retention, and it
wasn't. I was like, I legitimately stop
losing weight. Even though I was putting in 10
miles a day out at Between eight and ten thousand feet when
you're on this protocol, this Kyoto Protocol with you follow
the instructions. No, pretty much no level of
physical exertion is going to Trump.
The macros that that you're on at the time.
Myself included and I stalled myself out.
And you know when you lose a week towards your progress,
towards your fat loss, I mean it's going to take you another
week to get back to where you were so you just lost Just two
weeks. And I regret having done that,
you know, I went to the Walmart. You remember the Walmart right
across the street, I want to the Walmart across the street.
I picked up chuck roast which, you know, it's that perfect.
Combination of I can control the fat with a chuck roast and it's
affordable and I didn't worry. And next thing, you know, I'm
looking at the scale to three days in.
I'm like, what happened? How got?
But I've got all this exertion that I'm going through, I should
be losing weight. And at the end of the day, what
it was. Was is I was overeating, I
didn't gain weight. I mean, that that's damn-near
impossible when you're at that level of physical exertion.
But I did not have to compensate necessarily for the amount of
physical activity. I was putting in.
I think I may have really messed up the Kentucky windage on that
one because I go to I go to the gym.
Every single day. I do cardio every single day.
And while I was still doing that out in the mountains, I think I
overcompensated. So I would say to your clients
who are listening, don't don't try to overcompensate by doing
an intuitive free feeding. I set myself back and I regret
having done that. Yes, really easy to do man.
I mean this this is why so many pregnant women put on a ton of
weight during pregnancy because they it's easy to fall into this
this modality of thinking of hey I'm eating for two.
To now, so I can like get away with a lot more.
But when you start to actually break down what your body is
expending, you know, calorically from exercise, you know, like
you've got 300 calories, you burn maybe through a cardio
session maybe you burn. 500 600 calories throughout the course
of a day via weight training session.
It's pretty freaking easy to put down 300 to 600 calories in the
handful of nuts are a couple spoonfuls of peanut butter.
Are a few more ounces of steak if you're not paying attention.
Right. And not to mention, I mean I
think you have my sheet open in front of me.
I was well over 2,000 calories. Yeah.
Under under, no circumstances in human history.
Would anybody have considered me to be starving at that time?
Right. And so that was an
overcompensation and I think that was just a moment of
weakness on my part or just a lack of judgment.
If I had go back and do it all over again, I would have
probably have preferred long-term to just have a higher
Ketone level and less food. And so I regret I didn't need to
do that and I did just ladies and gentlemen.
Trust Robert, he's got to cut, he's got you covered, I
shouldn't have, I shouldn't have quote-unquote, taking a break
and done intuitive feeding. So Ira do regret having done
that. What was interesting is last
year when I was with you, man, like we came home and it was
late and maybe it's just because it was late.
And I'm not used to eating that late, but I wasn't even that
hungry. Like like we would have, we
would pretty much Duo mad would probably like a brick or
something while we were out there.
In the field. But then the vast majority of
the calories was coming from that big meal at the end of the
day. But because we were trying to
catch up on sleep, he would just cook this big meal and then
pretty much immediately. Go to bed, which I don't
typically do either. And I honestly didn't really
have that much hunger. We were you pretty hungry or not
so much. No, I wasn't.
I was not hungry throughout the day.
I just wasn't concerned with counting the macros.
I didn't take any carbs. I didn't do anything.
Amnon Kido. I mean it was you know me it was
steak eggs and butter every night I just wasn't meticulous
with my macros plus macro counter.
That's all it was just a You know, when you're on, when
you're on keto and your ketones are flowing like that, are you I
don't know about the rest of your clients or, or even you,
but I never really get hungry until I'm really down on
calories and I wasn't at that time.
It was just hey, the chuck roast was one point eight pounds.
So I just, I grilled one point eight pounds.
Yeah. And I regret having done that.
Did you stay at the same? Vo Rio.
Not the same exact unit, but yes, the same exact complex,
which by the way you and I brought out free weights and
bands and all sorts of accoutrement, you know, there's
a gym there. No.
There is there is a gem there and anybody staying in.
By the way we you and I hunted Pagosa Springs Colorado if you
do a VRBO you're probably going to land in this particular
complex. Yeah there's a there's a YMCA
that is over rec center. That is open to all.
The renter's. Well, we were just going
hardcore thing because we you had your Bowflex adjustable
dumbbells. I brought that x 3 bar and band
set up and we were we were probably crazy but I like being
crazy. We would do all this hiking, all
this, all this track and then we'd come back, then we'd work
out in the living room of this VRBO over like a very small
amount of space and then we would eat and then we would call
it a day. But a lot of people I would have
to venture to say that most people that are putting in those
kind of Of miles would feel totally fine and not working out
when they got back. But I'm glad that we did because
when we did like I slept better because of it, I mean,
everything was just better like I didn't feel like I was deep
getting too much for my normal routine.
Anyways. Well, I would add two things
one. I think that that probably added
to the active recovery process. So I felt better after a workout
and I felt that it helped me actually Endure the the week
which can be very grueling 12. I remember coming back from that
trip getting into the gym and feeling like I had lost nothing
so you know even with the at that time being in a
quote-unquote cut and even not having access to a gym at a
minimum, getting those dumbbells out and really lifting hard.
And if I recall We were pretty much on a like a cross training
type routine, where we would switch back and forth and almost
like supersets. Yeah.
And everything, we were super efficient with the training but
I feel like we were, certainly not neglecting any body part.
Like everything was getting worked, perhaps.
So we were super setting heavy and then lightening up.
Lightening up, lightening up and down to the point that we were
doing push-ups when I got back to fall on proper.
Jim, I did not. I recall specifically I didn't
lose anything. Yeah.
Which, for a week in the mountains not not working out
quote unquote. We were certain at a minimum it
kept me from falling behind. Yeah, 100% 100%.
Did you speak in a Kentucky? Windage windage that you
mentioned. I had your new scope set up, do
and your binoculars that have the vortex binoculars at have,
the rangefinder built in. There were wonderful.
Unfortunately I had three shots presented tip for everybody.
Who's heading out west, you better damn be prepared for a
shot that you don't even think right now is possible.
If you are Eastern Whitetail, Hunter sitting in a tree stand,
there's no way in hell, right? I'm was a w Eastern Whitetail
Hunter from a tree stand. I took a shot at 647 yards will
get to that shot six hundred and forty, six hundred and forty
seven yards. That's a shot man.
You know even even with my Vortex scope set up, you know
full power at Power 24 that elk still looked pretty small in the
crosshairs. So that's the first the first
thing your specific question was how did my set up go?
I have on the big fan of Vortex as a brand and I have a new set
of binoculars called The Vortex Fury 5000 it Has a built-in
range finder and long story short, you can program into that
range finder through the app. This is my bullet.
This is my load here are my ballistics and you press a
button. And it will say, according to
our computer, you should be this higher this low.
If you take this shot at this distance and it gives you what
in the shooting world, we call the quote-unquote, the shooting
solution. So this many MOA up or this many
inches up, Whatever the case might be, so it's phenomenal to
be able to walk around and basically eliminate a piece of
gear and that that piece of gear would have been my Rangefinder.
So I could just walk around with this set of binoculars that are
strapped to my chest and I can look over and I can see.
Okay, on that Mountaintop, that is, you know, thirty seven
hundred yards away, that actually panned out for me when
I did get that. Seven, yard shot.
I was on the elk Dome. I got up 10,000 feet.
I looked to my West and thirty seven hundred yards away.
I saw a herd of elk and so having that piece of equipment,
let me know exactly how far away they were.
So I knew how much, you know, terrain I needed to cover before
they had moved. It's just nice.
It's nice to have that. I highly recommend.
Vortex equipment. I highly recommend this
particular piece of equipment. The Vortex Theory, 5000 was they
are expensive. Yeah, that is so beneficial,
because like, my I've got a rangefinder Vortex Rangefinder,
but the resolution is kind of one of their entry level models
and the resolutions. So piss-poor that it's hard to
even pinpoint what it is. You're trying to range.
Whereas, if it's super not Killers, the image quality can
be much, much better. Yes, and I'll tell you, you
know, just that benefit of not having to take your eyes off of
the game when you find them in your binoculars and you can
range fine without taking your eyes, off to go from a range
from a set of binoculars to a rangefinder.
And then to a scope, you're changing your, your view so many
times and you'll lose these. Yeah, they're 750 to 1,000 pound
creatures but they will, you'll lose.
Lose them, you know, moving back and forth between glass, so I
really appreciate that new piece of equipment.
The fact that it gives you this shooting solution where you can
turn and adjust your scope based upon what the computer feeds
back to you. That that's pretty phenomenal as
well. Yeah.
And you you were hunting with a new rifle and scope combination
to right? Yes, I loved it.
Little bit of Fitness humor that you do and I think some of your
listeners would appreciate So I have a custom gun and again, I'm
6 foot 4, so no gun over-the-counter, it is going to
fit me. So I had this custom stock
ordered and even on the largest custom stock that they have,
it's a Bell and Carlson, which is the top-of-the-line composite
stock. We still had to add three and a
half inches in order to get it like fit to me, right?
And then I put a muzzle brake on because it's a larger caliburn,
and I really don't like recoil I was a soldier for 21 years.
I shot a lot. I'm not a fan of getting kicked
in the shoulder by a mule 10,000 times.
So we put a muzzle brake on. So extended, the stock, we
extended the the barrel through the muzzle brake and I also use
a sun shade or sun bail on my scope.
So it makes the scope look really huge, right?
Does it really add that much weight to the gun?
No, not really. It's still a heavy.
Gun. It's eight and a half pounds,
but I mean, I work out, right? So I'm walking around the
mountains. We run into the pumpkin patch
and these guys go why, hey man, how come you don't get a lighter
gun and look, you know. I'm from New England, New York.
I can be a little cynical. I can be a little bit of a jerk.
Sometimes I said well why don't you just go to the gym instead
and so so making friends everywhere I go right again. 300
short magnum. I love the short Magnums because
they are they're lighter actions.
The irony there being actually lightened up the gun quite a
bit, I hand load. So there was a lot there that I
could play with. I'm pushing 2984 feet per second
out of that load with 180 Grand 180 grain bullet.
We're getting kind of technical right now and I love it.
It's like this. Yeah, this is great stuff I
have. Dialed in to where I am shooting
about half MOA. MOA is minute of angle minute of
angle. Roughly speaking is one inch at
100 yards, so theoretically when I pull a trigger, I'm going to
be within one half of an inch of where I aimed that did not
happen on my 647 yard shot. Yeah.
Well, do that. So, you know, they can cut it,
came out to you. Or west and thirty seven.
Thirty seven hundred yards or feet of distance that you two
close thirty-seven hundred yards of distance that we had to
close. So 4:00 in the morning, we start
hiking out. I get to the top of elk Dome and
I look out to my west southwest and I like, wow, what's going on
there? There just wasn't enough.
There was almost Like bushes moving I look out this Bald Knob
there about a don't know thousand feet higher than me and
I look out and just enough light came out and I arranged it and
sure enough, you know the bleached blondes, you remember,
the bleach balance bull elk have almost like a bleach blond, a
parents who are cow elk kind of have like a dirty blond
appearance and I'm like, no kidding.
I actually see some bleach. Blonde Zhao Out there I arranged
it was thirty-seven hundred yards.
So I look at Sean and I say, hey man, I see an elk herd and I
think it was it was upwards of 50 and this one heard.
Well, that's a problem when you stop and think about it because
now you're trying to beat 100 nostrils. 100 years and 100
eyes. Yes, there's 50 out.
That's, that's a big issue. So, I mean we hightail it man.
Like we pack everything. I won't excuse me.
Where are and even unpacked? I mean we were still we're still
packed up our bags were on our shoulders, the whole nine yards,
we move out like we're going for election and we get there.
Thirty-seven hundred yards, we probably crossed it now this is
in the Rockies, we crossed it in an hour.
I mean we were moving man. Once we got down the first
Mountain because we had to get Down, whenever you climb up, you
got to get down. And as, you know, from being out
there and on several trips going down, can actually be harder
than getting up in terms of whether or not you fall, taking
a route Etc, anecdote side side note.
Don't try to go out there with a pair of Eastern bow, hunting
boots, you will snap your ankles in half, we are not made for the
mountains. You need to get a top call.
I used a nurse, I used an ER, 8-inch, but get yourself a
top-quality Paramount boots, you'll thank me later.
So we cross the Mountain Valley, we get over there.
There's one mountain, just north of it and we set up and We saw
three shooter bowls. There were some, some
non-shooter bowls and we saw three shooter bowls and I set up
and I had trust and confidence in my equipment and we waited
probably about 90 minutes and I realized there's probably not
going to get a, I'm probably not going to get a better shot than
this. I set up, I took the shot, I
dial. I didn't exactly what I what I
believe the Moa adjustments to be.
And I actually completely missed and I felt this was nobody was
doing this to me. I was doing this to myself.
I felt over confident. I felt also at the same time
pressured because we were starting to approach the end of
the season and this would have been the second season in a row
that I didn't get a shot off on an elk.
I had a 331 yard shot and a 425 yard shot that I did not take
earlier in the hunt. Those were because they were
fleeting. I just wasn't wasn't 100%
confident. So I took this 647 yard shot and
it was I would be the first one to tell you I should not have.
Yeah I just felt pressured at the time it was the longest
shot. I've never shot over 500 yards
so it was 147 yards farther than any shot I've ever practiced at,
I was a call College athlete. If we're going to call this an
athletic event, let's go ahead and use an athletic analogy.
That'd be like me, shooting at half court.
Yeah, because I was really good at three point shots and and it
was a flat-out, say it was just waiting over confidence in
myself and the equipment 647 yards.
There was a cross when and it was about 8 degrees.
So a lot of those environmental factors were not ideal.
And I blew it. Now, here's the upside.
He was standing in the snow field and we scoured that snow
field and there was not a drop of blood.
In fact, when we got over to that mountain and scoured that
snowfield, I'm sure, let me interpret what I just said for a
lot of folks, there you being a fellow Hunter, you know, this,
if I'm going to miss, please don't let me have hit him but
make it a bad hit. It?
Yeah, I don't want a bad hit, I want to miss entirely, and I did
miss entirely. I know I missed entirely even
another indicator of that was, we crossed the mountain.
And no kidding that entire herd. They didn't leave country.
They just went 200 300 yards at the gun shop.
Yeah, they just went 200, 300 yards south and sure enough, I
watch that entire herd. Just post right up in the dark
Timber. I couldn't find.
The bowl or any one of those three bowls.
But sure enough, they they were not spooked off.
Had I hit one of them. There's no question that they
would have been spooked off to kind of give an indication of
how how much more training I would need to take that shot
again. I'm good out to 500 yards and I
thought ah I have my drop chart set as my lock screen by lock
screen. I mean on my phone, And you can
go to, it's called gun data dot org slash ballistics and you can
type in your specific load. So I typed in 300 short magnum.
This muzzle velocity 2984 180 grain bullet of this brand.
It's, it's all there and you can do this on your smartphone and
you just screenshot the graph, you set that screenshot as your
lock screen. And so at any point when you're
out in the mountains and you're like, shit man, I don't remember
what my bullet drop is at this distance, so you don't have the
fiery binoculars that I Of you can just set this as your lock
screen and boom, you're done. Yeah, so I'm looking at my lock
screen right now at 500 yards. It's a 34 inch bullet drop.
So, that bullet will drop 34 inches below where my crosshairs
are. If I don't adjust anything at
650 yards, it goes from 34 inches to seventy nine point one
inches. Wow, that is a massive
difference in Mass, right work. Yeah, that is a massive
difference between 500 yards and 150 yards that's like 5 feet
difference. So I put the money down on.
I don't have the school named off top.
My head. I'd have to go through my emails
to find it. But there's a, there's a long
range shooting school that I signed up for, in the, in the
month of February. It's a five-day long course.
I wish I hadn't taken that shot. I felt pressured.
And and in that moment of pressure, I was overconfident
and I'm just thankful that I didn't wounded animal that I'm
very, very grateful for But overall, it was a successful
hunt and I was prepared for it up until the moment that I
pulled the trigger. Yeah, well shooting, I mean, if
you hunt long enough like, you will make a bad shot, you will
wounded animal like that. Those are just things that come
with the territory of hunting but every time you do make a bad
shot, every time you make a shot that you regret every time you
you you make a mistake especially with the kind of
person that you are. There are people there like you
know, Quintessential redneck Hunters.
That that don't pay the animal to respect their do and that's
just not what hunting should be. But for people, like, you
people, like what I'm trying to Aspire to be like, when you take
this very, very seriously, you treated, with the respect that
it should be treated. When you have those moments and
you do make a bad decision, you do make a mistake, you do miss
the animal. Are you wounded animal even
worse that all kind of Aggregates to just your overall
perspective, your perception, your your reality went out in
the field. So the next time you're placed
in the similar situation, you've got that subconscious speaking
to you and you just know with that higher degree of certainty,
what the right decision is like all this compounds over years
and years and years of experience.
It does. And not only that, but you
always have to keep in mind, you're only as good as your last
shot, you're only as good as your last time on stage, you're
only as good as your last book, if you're an author that doesn't
that's experience. But you need is, you need to
stay sharp on these things. I used to be a Green Beret.
I used to shoot long range. I've never shot 647.
I've shot out to 500, my neighbor just qualified for the
the national long range. Sniper competition.
He just qualified this past weekend and I asked him what his
range is were. And he's like, you know, I had a
couple shots that were 700 yards but everything was under 500.
That's a guy who no kidding, just qualified for the national
sniper competition, long-range sniper competition and the
majority of his shots were not as long as the shot that I took.
You know, maybe I should have trained up for that a little bit
more. I'm not embarrassed by it.
I'm just I learned a valuable lesson.
You need to get the training in the at-bats, under your belt
before you do something like that live is something living on
the other end of those crosshairs.
And for that, you know, I carry that lesson forward.
Yeah, totally man. I'm interested in the, the
ballistic still, like, I feel like, what was it you were
hunting with last year, 7. Mm rent. 270 short magnum 27.
So, I need to weigh my rifle, like, you saw in the rifle that
I use, it's a 300 Winchester magnum with a bull barrel and a
big-ass scope on there. I would not be surprised.
If my gun weighs 11 pounds like it is obnoxiously heavy and that
sounds like nothing. You know when you're like
typically like you grab the 15 pound dumbbells to do some
warm-up on the curls, like 15 pounds is nothing, so you're
thinking L, 8 pound, pound pound Pound gun.
You can get that thing all day long.
My gun last year was kicking my ass walking, those 60 miles
hunting with y'all. Do the mountains?
And I've not honestly been super impressed with the consistency
of my current setup, so I may be Switching gears, and getting a
different rifle or scoped, rifle combination for the next time.
You're out hunting West. What are you doing for Anna?
Like, what did you get? It, are you doing commercial
off-the-shelf? I have been.
Yeah. Now I do want to reload.
I've got like my dad reloads, he shoots at 300 Weatherby Magnum
he reloads, and I was using a 200 grain, Hornady Precision ldx
round, and those are pretty pricey.
They're their ballistic tips, they're pretty solid rounds.
Yeah. But they're incredibly hard to
come by man, like I literally had to start special ordering
rounds for those. So Then I found 180 grain
Hornady round. Also, ballistic tips that I was
pretty happy with, but the I'm not been overly impressed with
just the consistency of my comp my scope and rifle setup.
I mean, I don't know. I'm the only one that uses it.
I haven't bumped it and I'll have it zeroed and then I'll go
shoot, you know, a couple weeks later and it will not be zeroed.
And that I don't think there's anything that's loose on the
scope with that. I mean, I got a pretty nice
scope so I don't think that there's so much.
Recall from the rifle, that's causing the scope to lose lose 0
because that can certainly happen with a lower grade scope.
But I think I might just help others which gears.
Sure. Okay.
You can we dive into that a little bit and you know if
you're if you feel it's not podcast material, maybe we could
edit some of it out. Now here's what I would say
about anything on the trunk is me and we can talk about this.
Okay. Yeah.
So the first I I would I would do is I would ask what type of
scope do you have? And you are correct.
There, glass is not glass, is not glass.
If it's a two hundred dollar scope, particularly with a 300
Magnum, you're talking about a significant amount of kick.
If I recall, you did not have a muzzle brake, is that correct?
Now I do have a muzzle brake. So I've got that bull barrel.
They have. You do have a muzzle brake
brake. There's honestly, I'm not that
much. Felt recoil from my gun.
Yeah, not with about not with a bull barrel and a muzzle brake
you shouldn't. So I would the first thing I
would do is just make take it to a gunsmith and make sure that it
is a professionally mounted. Everything is tight and secure.
If you don't have your own tool set, I would make sure that it
was the most consistent. Performing scope.
That was the first thing I would Look into the next thing I would
look into would be the ammo. A 200 grain bullet is is a
pretty heavy one might be heavier than I think.
You might need for anything. You're shooting in Arkansas.
You're never going to achieve the minute that the Moa
consistency with over the counter as you would with
handloading. So, I would spend some time with
your father you know, sit down with him.
Eugene up some loads and get into the most consistent load.
You can possibly find. That's the way that you're going
to get to the highest level of ammo.
Accuracy is by getting down to the fraction, the 100th of a
grain. To put that into perspective,
one, G is 14 grains and when I measure out my powder, I'm
measuring out to the hundredth of a grain that's how accurate
your you're going to be. You're just eliminating all of
those and consistencies. So, that's something to think
about is, is giving your hand loaded ammo.
Try before you swap out, do you mind telling me what kind of
scope you have? Yeah, it's a Leopold.
I think the model is like vx6 HD, like, it's one of the higher
end Scopes that Leopold offered, it's one of their it's a legit
scope of the scope. Like the old, you know, rule of
thumb is spend more on the scope than you do on the rifle.
And the rifle was not cheap in the scope is Than the rifles.
I mean, I can't imagine that the scope and that's I got a nice.
I got a bad apple, which is possible, but the scope, as it
sits from a spec standpoint, shouldn't be giving me this kind
of an accuracy. No, I would think that scope
would be something Leopold, that model.
I mean, you're talking about out a 4 digit plus scope.
I would think that that would not be the shoe, may be looking
to your ammo, do some hand loading and see if you can't
find a consistent wrap grain. There are other things we can
really, really get technical. Like the next thing I would ask
is, well, actually probably should have been the first thing
I asked, Do you know the twist rate on your barrel and for your
listeners? This is why that matters The
Twist rate on your Barrel. You have to match that up with
the grain weight of your bullet, if that makes sense at all.
Because some of your, some of your heavier, grain bullets,
they'll need to have a faster twist rate, like a one in 10 one
and eleven excetera, where some of your lighter grain bullets
are going to have a slower trip twist And I'm saying that in
public, and I always need to go look that one up, it might be
the exact opposite. So don't quote me, I know that
I, instead of memorizing things, I have them written down and
I'll go look it up, but your twist rate has to be matched
think of a football, right? Tom Brady, he throws a football
and it has a certain twist rate and that's what makes it as
accurate as it is, versus a slow twist rate which would make it a
lame duck flying through the air.
That's the analogy show-off. Are maybe in emails.
You can tell me what is look up? Your Barrel is going to be on
your Barrel somewhere. It's going to be 1 / this.
That's your twist rate in your Barrel.
The first thing, we need to figure out is what grain bullet
matches up with that twist rate and a 200 grain bullet you're
kind of leaning off towards the very heavy side of bullets.
It's not too heavy but most 30 calibers or 308, diameter bolt.
Let's which is what yours is a 300 Magnum.
That's going to be a 150. 165 180?
Is the normal bell? Curve.
You're pretty heavy at two hundred grains.
Yeah, for sure. And honestly I get most of the
ranges that I shoot in Arkansas. You know.
I can have a little bit heavier, bullet more, bullet drop, but
when it comes to twist, right? That's going to factor, I don't
know what my twist rate is off. The top of my head.
I get more. You know, foot-pounds of energy.
G with that heavier bullet, but I probably don't need the 200
grain bullet. That certainly don't need it for
anything in Arkansas. No, if you're looking at things
in Arkansas, your top I'm going about, you know your opt out
there it's going to be why the 300-pound boar.
Yeah, if you're taking a front shoulder shot on a 300-pound
feral pig, 180 grain bullet. I took my 300 and 300 pound
Russian boar, 350-pound. I guess you would be somewhere
in that neighborhood. I took them with 130 grain 270
short magnum, and it dropped them in his tracks.
Yeah, so let's take a look at that off.
Are just email me, what your twist rate is and I'll look it
up to see what kind of bullet we can match that up with that.
That may be. That may be something that could
kind of bring your MOA shot group tighter together.
Yeah, do you like the short mag? I like the short Magnums due to
the fact that they tend to get higher feet per second for the
same amount of powder. Yeah.
So you're getting a more efficient burn and what that has
to do with, if you look at the cross section of a carrot versus
the cross section of a console, all right, that that's kind of
the analogy. There are speaking analogies as
you've already picked up the short magnum.
It's it's shorter but it is a wider, it's a wider.
You know, cross section. So what that lends itself to is
it will burn powder fat more powder faster, which turns into
a higher velocity coupled with the fact that because it is a
short action, it shaves. Some, some of the action itself,
the action is one of the heavier parts of your gun.
So, in a way, it shaves off some of the ounces and pounds off of
your gun as well. So faster burning faster, bullet
And a little bit lighter of a gun.
That's why I like it. Yeah, plus the ballistics and
and iron, I can, yeah, I just have to add like, my very first
gun was a 270 short magnum. And, you know, I've just been
shooting them for years and if it's not broken, don't fix it.
So I just stuck with them. Yeah, I make the little sense,
man, that makes total sense Kimber.
So I've got a 243 Kimber which I've had since I was a kid that
was like my first really nice anything.
Like that was my first thing that I just fell in love with as
a kid and that, I mean, obviously is much lighter of
around that I would ideally hunt with, for any type of large
game. But it's at the Kimber brand
itself is just always spoken to me.
It's just incredibly accurate. I feel very confident with that
gun. So, I've thought of going the
route of the Kimber 300 short mag and then just having a much
lighter gun, first of all, but then, just the confidence that
comes with that brand gun as well.
Well. You can't go wrong with that.
I mean there's there's nothing else I can say for that brand.
It's it's popular for a reason. It's expensive for a reason but
it is one of those. You get what you pay for.
You're gonna get sub L, am a action out of a sum of a mo, a
performance out of a Kimber. The warranties that come with it
and I guaran-damn-tee T, if there's a problem with your shot
group moving forward, it ain't the gun not with a Kimber.
Yeah, they're just, they're just top the line.
I, I couldn't purchase a quote-unquote brand, name gun
because of my particular size, we had to build everything from
scratch. I long as they are there alone,
you oh, you would ask. What is 26?
My I met you, I don't know. I think mine is a 29 inch barrel
30 inch barrel when I mean, it's I mean, it's Again, I've had
multiple people who would walk by me in the mountains, and just
look at me like, oh my God, look at that thing.
It's light artillery. The hands because it has the
muzzle brake because it had because it has the extended
stock because it has the extended scope.
I mean, it looks like artillery but it's actually not that
heavy. That's cool man.
Well I most certainly excited about our next hunt together
man. I hate that I missed this year.
I've got my Petition prep Endeavors next year.
So we have to kind of play it by ear and see what because you you
are typically going to do third Rifle, right?
I think I'm gonna head out to Utah for bow season this coming
year. Yeah and just do early season.
Uh yeah. Yeah I'm going to try to line it
up, you know, I'm kind of taking a sabbatical year.
I resigned from this job that I'm in right now.
You know it's that it's that time of life and bought a small
farm up in New Hampshire, New York and heading.
Back home to spend some time with with Mom and Dad.
It's kind of that chapter of life where it's important to me,
too. Spend time with family and I'm
lining it up between the different over-the-counter tag
states to where I can do a bow hunt in one state and and
without, you know, spending six weeks out there, turn around and
just drive to the next state. Get another over-the-counter tag
and do a rifle hunt. So, my intent next year is I,
will do a bow hunt in Utah. Take a little bit of a few day
break and then do a rifle hunt in I do damn it.
Next year. I am going to get an elk.
I've got no doubt man. I'm excited for what next year
holds. I hope that the schedules
workout session. I can accompany you and if we go
to pogos, did you jump in the Pagosa Springs?
Afterwards? I did nice.
I did and I made the mistake of not taking a shower immediately
following and I smelled like sulfur for the rest of the day
and it's pretty potent smelling stuff for sure.
It is but it definitely is a nice little internet to a whole
bunch of hike and just jump in the Pagosa Springs and I don't
know, just letting beep be a peace with the whole situation.
Absolutely, you know, after this call email me, what your twist
rate is and what your competition dates are, and all
kind of look at some of the over-the-counter options, you
know, maybe you can join me and we'll head out to the mountains
either before or after your competition, that sounds like a
plan to me, man. Michael is always a pleasure.
I thoroughly enjoy working with you over the the time that we
have. I'm excited for what the future
holds. I'm excited to go hunting with
you. I feel like when you hunt with
somebody, when you stay with somebody, when you do hard,
Things with somebody just earn you just have a deeper
understanding of what that person is like and hate that we
couldn't hunt this year but having hunted with you last year
I can I can say nothing but good things about you, man.
Your work ethic could drive your intensity discipline,
dedication, all that stuff, your top flight and I am proud to
know you and proud to call you. My friend, man.
I am proud to call you my friend and not to belabor the
conversation, but I'm just going to elaborate on what you just
said. Adversity, will bring that
person out and when you see people under adverse conditions,
cold wet, tired and hungry, that's, that's if you have a bad
side. If you're an unethical, dude,
it'll show up at that time, the fact that you and I shared
adversity, and we walked away from it, both respecting each
other, even a little bit more. I think that says a lot about
the both of us. No, thank you for that kind of
percent ma'am. So, Mike where can people go to
find out more about you? Well, I'd prefer they go and
find out about where I still currently work.
Right now, I'm the director of communications at the National
Infantry Museum. So if they go to National and
for tree Museum dot-org, they can see what I do and that is
finding out a little bit more about me.
So as the Director of communications I deal with all
the interviews, I deal with all of the social media.
Media Etc. They can follow us on Instagram,
LinkedIn and Facebook at National Infantry Museum.
It's a wonderful place. Our our mission is to honor the
sacrifice and Legacy of the American Soldier.
We are the only place in the world that has all seven
thousand and fifty eight names lost in service since 9/11 in
the same place on one Memorial. So we can we consider it an
honor and a privilege to go ahead and honor their names.
And we want everybody to come down to Fort Benning, Georgia,
Columbus, Georgia, go to National Infantry Museum
dot-org. Look us up and come on down.
Awesome man. Well I will certainly linked at
that as a cause very worth celebrating and bringing
attention to so I can't thank you enough for your service.
Can't thank you enough for continuing to add service in
that way. And that way and I can't thank
you enough for the friendship. We have man.
I appreciate you in more ways than you realize and I look
forward to our next hunting and a man.
Next fall, buddy. Next fall.
Take care brother. Alright, see ya.
Next fall, buddy. Next fall.
Take care brother. Alright, see ya.