Hello, ladies and gents Robert Sykes get us a.com.
Today I have special guest, Kathleen Shredder on the line.
We dive all into the Weeds about mindset and habit forming
especially when it comes to training and getting on a proper
exercise nutrition protocol. Like how do you make that stick?
How do you make it into a daily habit?
That's something that many people that have not grown up
with that or have that ingrained in their daily ritual.
Have a hard time sticking with. So we talked about how to make
things that you enjoy. Become a part of your day-to-day
routine thoroughly. Enjoy the conversation.
We are speaking the same Language when it comes to the
books, that we read, the mindset, all that.
So I have no doubt that you will take something from this without
further Ado, sit back, relax and do a conversation with Kathleen
Trotter. And we are live, Kathleen
Trotter. How are you?
Oh, I'm fantastic. I love talking about health and
wellness and it's a beautiful sunny day.
So many pockets of joy and things to be grateful for.
I love it. I love it when it comes to
health and wellness and like, Fitness and training
specifically. I feel like your area of
expertise or one of your area of expertise is kind of figuring
out how to I guess evolve, or adapt the training Style.
Based off the individuals preferences and, you know, their
needs their enjoyment. Cuz I feel like if you're bored
with your training regimen, you're probably not going to
stick with it. And as you and I both know,
being able to sustain it for the long haul is where the magic
quote, unquote magic really happens.
So, I want to dive into that for sure.
But before we even get into that, I mean, what was, what was
your interest for health wellness fitness training that
where'd all that stem from to begin with You know, I think
that phrase all researchers me search kind of thing.
I was not an active child. That sort of has a very, very
understatement of this of the situation.
So that all start from the beginning.
I grew up single mom, we moved around a lot.
I'm 6 feet tall, which is now an amazing thing, but growing up
was not and I would go to all these new little towns but my
mom was an actress. So we would move right a
classical theater actor. So not like television so much
is more. Like we would move around, so
she go. Two different theaters to act.
And I meet new people and I was awkward.
And so I just I got heavier and heavier and less and less fit.
And and I would show up at these new schools, that people would
think I was a substitute teacher.
And you know, I my mom would try everything.
She put me in softball, and hockey and dance, and I hated
everything. And I would lie to get out of
gym class and any way. Slowly, slowly slowly became
somebody who just like hated myself, more and more.
And I really, you know, I didn't respect myself and I was going
through that shame spiral that we all often.
Do which is like every day I wake up and be like, hey this is
the day that I'm going to get more fit.
I'm going to have more friends, I'm going to be popular.
I'm like I said of conflated health, and wellness and being
pretty with like having friends and this was this whole mess and
then every day, you know, I eat all the sugar and lie together
to gym class, and I snuck food a lot because my mom's such a
healthy human. So I know what it feels like to
be stuck in that trap of wanting.
So desperately to find your fit and then just not being able to
get out of your own way. So eventually, what my mom said
to me, was okay, Kathleen, I think we're trying to fit a
square peg into a round hole meaning like, I'm trying to get
you to do all the things that quote normal teenagers and kids
do. So why don't we instead of
trying to, you know, what makes for everybody else work for you,
why don't we try to find what works for Kathleen?
And that's where it all started. And that's why my first book is
finding your fit and this is why I'm so dedicated to this idea
of, when a Comes in what can I get them to do in that moment?
Because it can always spiral upwardly Spiral but you just
have to get going. So what my mom did was she got
me a membership to the YMCA because the demographic was sort
of over 40 and under five, and I was more comfortable with people
older than myself because I'd grown up in the theater with my
mom and I started walking on the treadmill.
And I walked for 10 minutes, which turned into 20, I started
doing some sort of strength, you know, machines at the gym I
started taking some Aerobics classes and then I started
teaching some aerobics classes and it just, you know, it
spiraled over years. Obviously this was not overnight
and then eventually instead of becoming a lawyer ended up doing
a masters in exercise science and you know, became a life
coach and all these things but it really just started from my
mom saying it doesn't matter what works for anybody else.
Like it doesn't matter. What works for your dad, he
plays hockey, it does matter. What works for me.
My mom does yoga Gardens and she's just like an active
naturally. Much more naturally active
human. She's like all Matters is what
works for you and so that's what I try to do with all.
My clients is, instead of thinking with the perfect
workout or the best workout or, you know, even where they want
to be in 5 10, 20 years, I think, okay, like what can you
do now? Because if we get you going, you
can always upwardly spiral into more better more active
lifestyle. But if you just don't do
anything, then you're stuck there forever.
So I think, yeah, what you said, you know about helping my
clients, find find the fun. And find about what's planets
about what's convenient, but it's really about what you can
do consistently, right? And it's mostly just about doing
something like, getting out of your own way and being like what
in this moment can I do and then doing it?
I don't know. Does any of that kind of land
for you? Yeah.
No, for sure it's pronounced that your mom had that foresight
early on to like, let you discover that yourself.
Cause it's like a lot of parents.
They have this idea of what they want their kids to do and become
and they kind of push that are forced out of And oftentimes
backfires like what she wanted, I mean, and very beginning, was
she trying to kind of persuade you to go the route of theater
like, like she took or was that ever a conversation?
It doesn't. Okay, so I just want to tell you
that. I've done many, many podcasts,
my life and no one has ever asked me about that about
theater and if my mom pushed me into it, my mom is amazing.
Amazing woman, she's definitely an inspiration.
She absolutely never pushed me into theater, because theater is
a very hard life, especially if it's the, you know, the Theater
theater versus like acting in movies and television now she's
done that as well, maybe even TV.
But I think what my mom would say to you is if theater and
acting is your absolute calling. If it's your thing, then for
sure do it. But if it is not your thing then
run as far away from it, as you can, like, it has to be the
thing that gives you the most joy.
And I see that in my mom. So I'm actually when she turned
60, she went back to school and she became psychodynamic
Psychotherapy is for like six years.
School. And so now she does that as well
as acting. But it's interesting to me
because she's so good at the therapy but she doesn't love it
in the same way she acts. So you know, when she does act
you can just see this joy that lights up in her eyes.
And I find that fascinating because, you know, I'm sure I'd
be a very good lawyer. But I don't think I'd have that
joy and that whereas with my job like I can have worked a 12-hour
day and I can be exhausted but I haven't lost the joy and there's
just Something about it that lights me up and it's sort of
how I know I'm in the right profession.
And it doesn't mean that every day is easy.
But but yeah, my mom always wanted me to have that joy and
she knew that that theater enacted gave her something, but
I don't think that it ever gave me any of that, like, in any of
the school plays or anything like that, and then she could
see that. And she's, she's a big proponent
of letting me be me. And I think she's really proud
of my individuality and my uniqueness but I think being
Unique, when you're a kid is hard.
It's sort of slightly easier as you get older but a lot of my
mom's philosophy has really inspired My Philosophy with
health and wellness and that idea of looking for people's
uniqueness like what makes them what is their unique?
Why, you know if they have grandkids do they want to get
down on the ground and play with your grandkids, okay?
So then we create a program around that you know if they
want to play hockey like my dad plays hockey.
So you know, we do balance training for him and Ankle
strength. Tough.
And because that's his why like he doesn't want to do balance
and strength that, but if I say to him, you haven't that's going
to help you, you know, be on the ice for the rest of your life.
He's like, okay, I can do that. So, I try to look at each person
as individual. Like, my mom did for me and
figure out, like, what is their thing that kind of likes them up
from the inside and then how can I get them to use that to push
themselves forward? How long would it take you to
figure out what your thing was like what you have in the kind
of experiment and with a variety of different Outlets to see if
it's stuck or not like how men Progression.
Wow, so fantastic question because I think that is
something that people get to people's way.
It's like oh well if I don't know, my passion right now, you
know, I must be a failure words, you know, Kathleen knows her
passion. And why don't I?
And again, we just get in her own way so much.
No, I would say the answer to that is I absolutely didn't know
my passion. In fact, it took years of being,
then I was a personal trainer and I was doing it.
I went to undergrad Kinesiology but I always said like I'm
coming to do this because you can do anything.
In your undergrad and then you can go to law school and I was
like well this is a good way to put myself through school to
make some money. I'll do kinesiology I'll do
personal training but I always was planning to go back a law
school or go to law school because I thought that that's
the thing. I would want more than anything
because I watched lawyers on TV and they all had money and they
looked really stylish. And, and one day, I was
training, one of my clients and I was talking about law school
and she looked at me, she's like why would you go to law school?
You love this and you're good at this.
And there is this moment and I was Like I do love this, I am
good at this but I actually really truly.
Don't think I knew until that moment.
And I think that sometimes this is amazing ability for other
people to see you clearer than you see yourself.
And yeah that conversation I will never forget that client.
Her name is Ava and she just was like you have a unique gift
Kathleen, use it. I don't know what a number of my
clients have this phrase. They say to me I think it's a
Yiddish phrase but in Bush at something.
Like you can see a fly on somebody else's shoulder but you
can't see the bear. You can't feel the bear on your
own back, and I think there's there's something to that like
that client saw saw the bear on my back and saw the fly on my
shoulder, and he was like, you know, why don't you try this as
a career. So yeah, it's an interesting, an
interesting experience, being a human and just understanding
this idea of like you don't have to be great to start, but you do
have to start to get great and I think that's Anything, I think
that's figuring out what you want to do for the rest of your
life, but it's also figuring out fitness.
Like I think it's very easy to get in our own way and think,
well, I'm not perfect. I don't know exactly what I'm
going to do is my life. I don't know exactly how I'm
going to exercise. I don't know exactly, you know
how to eat well. So then we don't really do
anything and it would have been easy for me to, you know, not go
to the Y and not try things, but I think ultimately just have to
try a bunch of stuff like throw a crapload of spaghetti on the
wall and see what sticks. It's and everything's just a
learning experience. So if you do, try something,
like, if you go do it Zumba class and you're like, oh, I
hate that, that's not my passion, I don't like that.
That's like, okay, well, that's great data as opposed to it
being like a failure of an experience and again like I
think yeah, I think people just are very scared.
They're scared to do it wrong. Instead of thinking like, oh
well, I'll try this, I'll go for a run or I'll go for a walk.
I'll try Zumba tribe dance and then just sort of see what I
like. What's convenient?
What's my joy? I don't do.
You have an exercise Joy? An exercise Joy.
What what, how do you define an exercise Joy?
Well, like something that when you do it with, like physical
with your body that you're just like, this feels okay, I'll put
it this way. I love to run outside in the pub
in nature. It calls to me, whereas I don't
love to swim. I don't dislike swimming but
like swimming on a little I get a little bit cold, like I have
to push myself more to go for a swim.
Whereas, if I see a beautiful Park it's like says to me Kev
Clean come run. You'll love it.
You'll have so much fun. It's like like something calling
to me if you have something that calls to you, but yeah, I love
Bonnie buildings. Like the act of, you know, the
weight trainers and that's certainly my forte but like a
port from that, that's kind of interesting because it started
out as a passion. And now it's kind of become my
career and my lifestyle and a lot of times that results in
people, you know, losing that passion because it has all this
demand that's placed on it and a lot of people lose that desire.
Yeah, you lose. Joy and it becomes your life.
Yeah, the haven't noticed that like, I still love Bonnie
building that I've been able to shape my life and career path
around my passion that stands. But apart from that, I'm also an
avid Hunter, and I don't rely on Hunting to provide an income or
anything like that, but the act of hunting and like, hiking 60
miles out and, you know, the Western mountains like that
that's quite a physical feat. So there's a there's a physical
aspect to that that I take great pleasure.
That sounds glorious, the idea of that hiking.
So What I love about hearing that.
So if you were a client and you came in and you said, okay so
these are my two loves and then I would say to you, okay?
So there's sort of three pillars of Health and Wellness in the,
in the fitness field and in the zone of.
So you got the strength component, you got the
flexibility component and you got the cardiovascular component
and most people tend to not always but tend to have one of
those three that they love more than the other.
So for me it's running that's cardiovascular and so for you
the body building The strength of the you get some cardio in
the hiking but that's a lot of strength as well and then it
tends to be like if you love one of the pillars, more than
others, it's harder to make yourself, do pillar, two and
three but they all really support each other, right?
Like, if you don't have enough ankle Mobility or not being able
to squat properly, and then you're going to hurt your back.
If you don't have good shoulder mechanics, you're not going to
be able to do a pull-up properly, right?
So the mobility aspect really complement the strength aspect
of in your bodybuilding. Same thing with the hiking.
Like again if you don't have income Mobility, when you're
going up a hill, you're going to have to hike up through your hip
and you're going to hurt your back.
So I like to use these loves and say to people, okay, if you want
to hike properly for the rest of your life without injury or you
want to play hockey like my dad, then you have to make sure that
your routine is balanced and do the mobility work or do the core
work or do the cardiovascular, you know, element of whatever.
I decided that three pillared table is not being represented
in your in your program. So I use that a lot that idea of
like what do you love? What do you want to do for the
rest of your life? And how can we use that to make
you do the things that you don't love as much?
Yeah, I like that. I like the concept of viewing it
through three primary pillars and you kind of have one that
you naturally gravitate more than the others, but all benefit
the whole. Yeah.
I feel like. Yeah.
And so go ahead. Oh no.
It's going to feel like you see that we're people.
Example who like love yoga and they're super flexible so that
they actually really don't need as much yoga.
What they need is like to balance out the three pillars
and do more strength or do more cardio.
So normally we tend to gravitate toward the thing that we're good
at, like I have a lot of slow twitch muscle fibers.
So running for me is like just, you know, for long distances.
It's not that hard partly just because of my nature of what I
was born with, but also, just cuz I do it a lot to them gets
easier but normally whatever we do a lot of we tend to be the
best at and therefore At the other end parts of the pillar
are going to be weaker and eventually it will end up that
causes us injury. Yeah, totally green.
I feel like a lot of people, as you said, they gravitate to what
they're good at and I think with it was certain that there's a
lot of technicalities with, you know, proper running form,
proper mobility and flexibility and retrain.
There's a lot of like, a lot of people have an aversion to
weight training because it's scary.
They don't know how to do the proper technique that worried of
you know, risking injury so there's a lot more technicality
probably in A training resistance form resistance
training form. I feel like that's probably one
of the main reasons, many people, you know, kind of step
away from it, but I feel like if you get that down, then once you
build confidence in it, and once you start seeing a benefit from
it, it's much easier to fall in love with it.
I completely agree. And I think the key for me would
be to make sure people understand that you can't get
confidence and things that you don't do.
So when you know people listening, I want them to hear.
If you've never done something, you're supposed to be bad at it.
Like so many of us, we don't like being bad at things and we
try something once and they're like oh I'm not good at that.
I'm not going to do it again. And what I would say is to get
better, you just got to do it. Repetition is the mother of all
skill and the more you do it the more you teach your brain that
you are actually competent at this thing.
And the more competent, you feel the more confidence you build,
and then it becomes more fun as you do it.
And I think that's a really unfortunate part of our world,
like, people are so afraid of being bad, afraid of having
that, A beginner's mind and afraid of sort of tripping over
their feet and instead of just thinking like, okay well if I
trip that means I have to use my balance and my quarter right
myself again. So that's actually a good thing
and that goes back to that. Sort of like how is this a
growth process? What can I learn from Ed?
And also we were all born, not even being able to walk, right?
And that doesn't make us failures.
That just is like how Evolution occurs and everything is a
process, and you start and, you know, starting grade 1 math, and
you moved to, you know, grade 12 or whatever, you progress
through the game. Grades, you need to go to
progress through the grades of everything you try and fitness.
So if you've never done bodybuilding, okay, you're going
to probably be bad at it. You're going to feel weird.
It's going to feel awkward and that's okay.
And not only is it okay? It's like to be very expected
and I think that that's one of the reasons why my former self
my younger self, you know, wasn't fit because I was so
afraid of being bad. I was so afraid of not being
perfect of being embarrassed of people making fun of me.
And now I'm so much more secure and just like I go and try
something new and I'm like, God, that it is great.
I got lots to learn, you know, but again that confidence in
being able to be bad at things in motion also just, you know,
now be doing this for 20 years and I've been doing therapy for
20 years and but yeah, you got to be able to be bad at things
in order to get better and confidence comes through action.
And one of the things I tell my clients all the time is like,
you know, if you had if you're anxious about anything, you ask
It's like action solves, basically, any type of anxiety
or at least softens it and so much of the anxiety is like
wanting to do something and then being afraid of doing it and
sort of feeling guilty that you're not doing it.
And then you get into this sort of echo chamber of emotion
where, you know, you want to do something and then you don't do
it. And then you feel a shame that
you're not doing and then say, makes you feel even worse
instead of just being like, okay, you know, this is the
moment I have control over this is the only moment I have
control over right now and if I want to impact my future, I Have
to take control of this moment. So, you know, got it.
You can't put off till tomorrow what you can do today because
then you just end up with crap load of tomorrow's and nothing
to show for it and we got one precious life, right?
So if you want to learn something, a new language and
new score, whatever it is, do it.
If you want to be able to go hiking, so you can do hunting,
great start training for it. Like just decide what you want
and then work backwards and start now.
Yeah, and the time is going to pass anyway.
I think like once you realize that the time is going to pass
anyways, you can spend that time Worrying about whether people
are going to think. Are you just simply make a fool
of yourself for One Moment In Time with in progress, really?
Yeah, and all those people who are like yeah, all those people
who are judging you either the really not thinking about you at
all. Like, that's one of the nice
things about getting older is I realized that all the people
that I was worried for judging me when I was a kid.
They were just worried about themselves.
And the only, if they were judging me at all, it was purely
as a in relation to how they were judging themselves.
So, it's a combination of I get older.
I'm like, I don't care if you are judging me, but eat But
you're probably not judging me as much as I am.
Actually, judging the fact that I think you're judging me.
Like, it's this weird. It's this crazy thing about us
as a world like, we're so we, so comparison driven instead of
just being like, hey like who do I want to be?
What Integrity do? I want, how do I match my
actions with my values and then you know, stop with the
comparison game and just go and do.
Yeah, and the reality is most people honestly don't really
even care. Like, if you, that's exactly a
lot of people worry about it, looking like a fool in the gym,
like not having the proper squat.
Form, that would have been everybody watching them.
Like, anytime I go to a public gym, I don't really care what
anybody else is doing. I'm there for me, it's like I'm
not around critiquing, everybody's forms that like
people go in knowing that I just simply do what they can with
what they got and then obviously trying to minimize the risk of
injury. Then, they have to worry about
people, you know just finger pointing and staring at them.
Totally. Absolutely.
People are are worried about themselves they're you know,
they're carrying much more about us than we think.
You know, it's just that our inner world is so large, it's
our inner world. Old.
So, you know, we are the main event are in our movie, but you
know, everyone else is the main character in their movie, right?
And we're only bit players if we even our players at all, you
know? And that's fine.
We're supposed to be the main event in our movie because, you
know, you're you and I'm me, but we have to you know, stop
letting our fear of what other people think and do impact what
we think and do, right? Like some to a client the other
day and she has some hit like a hip replacement and some knee
issues and all this stuff and she really should be walking.
It walking sticks to keep her posture for now.
Anyway. And you know she's older and she
was like I couldn't do that. Coupling people will be watching
me and I was like, okay so you're going to ruin your
tissues in your body because you're worried people are
watching you and they're not actually watching you.
But even if they were like, that's worth you.
Not being able to walk properly like this is what you need right
now, you're not going to need them in a month or so, but you
do need them right now and she kind of looked at me and you
She's like yeah, I like but it just in her brain the power of
the the gays from the outside was so strong that it was almost
going to be enough to completely, you know, derail her
goals and and so I really try to encourage my clients to thrive
in their own lane, right? Like fine, like to Circle way
back to where we started find something that they enjoy or at
least they don't despise so that they can do it.
Consistently find something that's convenient.
Find something that works for them.
And and really work on that like turning your gaze Inward and
figuring out. OK, what can I do in this moment
knowing that this moment is not going to be the moment 10 years
from now. Like, meaning, I started walking
for 10 minutes but I didn't finish walking for 10 minutes.
I've done an Ironman. I've done hat, ate half Iron
Man's I've done like 10 marathons, so my 10 minutes of
walking turned into marathons, but I would never be able to do
the marathon. If I didn't do the ten minutes
at the beginning. So I think when people listen to
He sometimes they think. Oh, what you're saying is just
like let myself off the hook and 10 minutes is fine forever and
always and I don't, you know, do my best but best is not really a
lot and that's why I love and I'm like no, absolutely not.
I'm not saying to just chill with ten minutes for the rest of
your life. What I'm saying is you can't do
anything else until you start with the 10 minutes, so start
with 10 and then re-evaluate you want to do 15, do you want to do
20 minutes and then progressed up and you'll get to a point
eventually where like you know what, half an hour is enough.
Cool that's fine. Fine.
But you don't have to decide that.
Now you just have to take the next right step and you will
never get to that 30 minute Mark if you don't start now.
So like stop with the analysis paralysis stop.
Like with getting in your own head and just do something.
I love the work of James, Clear? His book of as atomic habits and
he always talks about this idea of standardized and then you can
optimize right? So standardized, the fact that
you do move do the 10 minutes at the gym.
I'm like I did and then you can optimize it as you go like you
could always tweak but if you don't have anything to start
with there's nothing to tweak. Yeah.
It's kind of like the whole concept of progressive overload
in weight training, applies quite nicely in this situation
to any Endeavor. Whether it's training, whether
it's nutrition, whether it's just simply movement, you know,
you start with where you where you can and then you
progressively overload that over time, honestly the same thing
with like adversities in mindset like what you're able to deem a
you know in sir. Animal diversity.
At one point in time, May totally change over time to the
point where it's just a simple inconvenience, but you can't
really build that former minimum till you put yourself out there
in the first place. So, as regarding yeah, the
walking, you know, just start there and then scaling up from
that. I feel like to.
Once you do that long enough, like you'll recognize
internally. That this is no longer taxing on
your body or mind. You kind of have this desire to
move the needle forward. It's usually how, it's certainly
how I think, like, once I come to the point where it's not
taxing on me, Moore's, not really an adversity.
I want to push that forward to, to just basically increase that
Baseline starting point. I couldn't agree with more with
everything you just said, I think yes, Progressive overload
of the body and the mind and building, both physical and
emotional resilience is huge, and I do think that the more you
are active, the more, hmm, the easier or the lower price of
admission, it is to to do the workout, right?
Like, I still sometimes want to skip but it's Almost harder for
me to skip that it is for me to just do it.
And part of that is that I know I will feel better afterwards.
Like, you know, one of the things I say to my clients is
the worst your mood, the more important, the work out and I
can tell you from 20 years of training that, you know, if I am
on a scale of 1 out of 10 of mood, I'm at a one and I work
out, I have the possibility of going up to like a for, but if
I'm already out of four, no, I might get to like a five.
But the difference in mood won't be as great.
And I've spent so much of Of my life fighting depression and I'm
so depressed when I was younger. So, for me, it's as I said, it's
harder for me to skip a workout because I have 20 years now of
experience that I feel better when I move, but again, just how
confidence has to be built than earned.
So did that knowledge that you will feel better after a workout
and that you will feel stronger? And as you said, and then you
feel stronger and you want to get even stronger, but it's hard
at the beginning of setting up a workout program because you
don't necessarily have That knowledge of oh, I know, I will
feel better, like your doctor said you should work out and
people have said to you, oh yeah, you'll feel great when you
exercise but at the beginning it just kind of feels like crap,
right? It's hard.
You know your tissues would be sore after.
So I guess one of my main takeaways for this podcast for
people listening is if you're just starting out it kind of got
a live through the sock of the first couple months, which is
why you want to make it convenient and at least somewhat
enjoyable to kind of offset that it is going to be a challenge at
the beginning. But once you make it through the
challenge, it does become slightly easier to push yourself
and you get to know your environment also changes, right?
So you might have more friends that are into fitness and then
they want they say like oh come play, some softball or go for a
run and you just you start to feel better.
And my therapist always tells me that desire drives Behavior,
right? So the more you exercise, I know
that it makes you feel better than you're like, oh, that
desired pushes you to move. The more you can stay away from
sugar and you see that. Feel better, then it's like, oh,
you don't want that Sugar anymore because, you know, you
feel better without it, you sleep more, you feel better, you
want to sleep more like, but it's all about starting the
habits and doing them for enough time that you can get that
emotional data of like, yes, this does make me feel better
and it's very easy to quit at the beginning.
Yeah. And I feel like in the
beginning, especially you really got to be really protective of
your environmental factors. Like if you're starting out you
don't have an environment of friend group that is you know
also interested in Proving their body mind weight training,
getting the nutrition down, then it's going to come so much
easier to keep falling into that habit of just doing the
unhealthy things because you don't have that built-in
internally. Whereas if you yes, you know do
have a group of friends that are doing that are trying to pursue
that. It's gonna be much easier to say
no to the Temptations. Some easier to sacrifice was
things that you know, maybe nice in them in the moment.
But certainly aren't Paving the way for long-term, success, and
progress. So I feel like really kind of
doubling down on your environmental factors your
friend group, your peer group, For you have those built-in
habits is key. I completely agree.
I would call those things systems, and one of the
sentences that I say to my clients.
All the time is, we don't rise to the level of our
expectations. We fall to the level of our
systems. Right?
And you know, often you client come in, they're like, oh, I'm
gonna lose this metal. Wait, I'm going to exercise and
I'm like, okay, great. So what environmental factors?
What guide rails are you putting in what systems?
So that you don't not go do the workout tomorrow, or what, look,
how are you going to make this goal?
A reality based? Locally and they're like, no,
no, no. I'm just motivated.
I'm gonna do it, I promise. And I'm like, nope, that is not
good enough and it just won't happen, right?
Because in the moment. Yeah, you feel motivated you go
to your trainer for the first time, like I'm gonna do this,
I'm gonna kill it, but motivation is akin to an
emotion, it kind of comes and goes and what you need is the
systems that so when your motivation is low, the system
just carries you through. So it's what you were talking
about that is those environmental constraints.
So having a friend. So if you have a fitness buddy
waiting for you, you're much more likely to Go and do that.
Walk of do that run, if you've joined a sports team, you know,
if you put money down to see a personal trainer, if you have
your clothes, if you leave your clothes out at night.
So when you wake up there, they're like if you have your
gym bag in the car so you can go to the gym like whatever you
know, if work gives you a break, you just have to have as many
systems. So food prep on the weekend.
Maybe have a food delivery service.
Whatever. It is an alarm that goes off to
remind you to drink your water, especially at the beginning
systems are always extremely important but as Especially at
the beginning because it's just it's not going to be natural and
when you are not as motivated as you are, you know when you start
with your trainer on your birthday or January 1st or
Monday morning or whatever, it is those Peak motivation times
make you feel that you are going to be successful but just
because you stayed a goal of wanting to, you know, start
exercising and lose weight. It doesn't mean it's going to
happen, you need those systems. You need those guide rails.
That sort of be like, oh yeah, you want to skip that workout?
Nope, you can't because your friend is waiting for you.
So what's the All that you have in your life that is trapped in
a system that's not really as conducive as it should are
ideally be towards achieving that specific goal, because it
sounds like you've got your your training dialed, and what other
goals you have your life in which the systems are not really
conducive to returnable. Oh, you are a wonderful
wonderful interviewer. So what I am working on in my
life is a little bit more balanced and some time off, it's
hard, you know, I work hourly and I love is you can tell I
love my job. Job and it's very easy for me to
let my work life sort of bleed in to my personal life.
And that is not fair for my partner.
James, it's not fair for our dog Olive, so we're trying to set up
systems. So, one of the things we've been
doing lately is just at the end of every night.
We always go for a dog walk. And it just means that James
can, I can games that I can chat means that I have to stop work
at the time that we decide to do the dog walk.
It means that I got some time with olive so things like that.
Like I'm just trying to set in more Are in advance.
So I'm trying really hard to every month.
Looking at the next month and making sure I have like either a
night away with James to like either the city or just like
blocked off time, even if it's just for a conference.
So I'm learning like a virtual something online.
But I think that just like, with exercise for most people they're
like oh yeah, it'll happen, don't worry.
And I say to them no it can't be just like catch-as-catch-can
because it doesn't work that way.
You have to look at your schedule in advance.
And book it in. It's similar with me with time
off and both the best. And the worst part about my life
is that I thoroughly love my job and it's amazing.
But I don't want to burn out and I have in my life burned out.
So that is definitely a system that I'm working on just that
advanced planning of scheduled time time off.
And then also making sure that I communicate with James about
that too. So it's not just, I'm like,
totally my bounds. I have time off but he's Wire.
So he's busy too so we have to coordinate our time off in
advance. Yeah and I think I mean I'm
pretty much doing the same thing myself have get you know there's
a double-edged sword to living your passion with your career
because it literally never turns off which is awesome.
Like I love that, I wouldn't trade it for the world but like
you said, it's it can often times be unfair for the people
in your life. It's almost like kind of unfair
for your ability to sustain it long term in certain ways as
well. So, I think building those
systems in a place where you like legitimately have a An off
switch in which trying to step away from it and just pour
another things. One thing that I've been doing
that, I've found success with is, I've got a Google Calendar,
that's what I use for scheduling my podcast interviews, my client
calls, all that stuff. And if it doesn't live in that
Google Calendar, just simply does not exist, but I've already
blocked out times like dedicated times for, you know, having
dinner with my wife, having time with my kid, having these things
structure, like having my own unique workout time, having all
these things structures that people cannot Is upon those
blocked out hours. Otherwise I would just like,
move my own stuff around to make things work.
So I'm trying to get better just saying no to everything else.
Yeah, it's interesting how so much of health and finding that
balance is about sort of stepping back and having that
objective View. And that's I think one of the
great things about a schedule is, yes, if it's in there, you
will do it, but it's also, you get to look at it be like, okay.
So interesting how much of what thing am I doing?
And if a day is, you know, 14 hours of clients and no time
with your neck, Wife and no time with your child, I've no time
for your old work, at your like, okay, this is out of whack, but
sometimes if we don't get that objective view with the
schedule, we just don't see it. And I think that's for
everybody, like we get so in our self and in our head, and it
goes back to being able to see a fly on somebody else's shoulder.
Like, if you ask any, one of my clients this sort of idea, okay,
is Kathleen's, life balance, they would all say absolutely
not. She is the most amazing trainer,
we love her but she needs more time for herself.
She needs more vacation but Whatever reason it's taken me
like 20 years in this line of work to be able to see it in
myself. And that's I think one of the
reasons why having a personal trainer is good.
It's one of the reasons why talking about your goals with
your friends and your family is good to get that objective view
as one of the reasons. Why saying things out loud is
good because you then get some space from your own thoughts and
you can sort of see like, oh wait a second.
I just told somebody I was working 10 hours with no break.
That's not healthy. That's not balanced.
And I think seeing the schedule is just an absolutely.
A fantastic and you can look at you know, your schedule for a
year and see. Okay.
So do I have larger vacations? And there's this book and
podcast actually called the one thing and they always say that
you have three things every year that you block off in your
calendar, you block off your vacation first before anything
else. Then you block off, like
scheduling time, like, literally time where you sit at your desk
and you look at your schedule and then you figure out how your
life is going to map out from there.
And then you figure out, Time for your one thing and that very
thing is like this, one thing that you do, that makes
everything else less, you know, less challenging less hard
easier, more fun that kind of thing, but I like the idea of
just, okay. So it's not even that you have
to schedule. You have to schedule in your
time that is your schedule in time and you have schedule on
your vacation and that comes before anything else.
And you know, you and I need to schedule in vacation.
Whereas a lot of people there, listening they don't need the
schedule in the vacation as much but they need to schedule in the
Shouts and the meal prep and you know, if it's not scheduled it's
probably not going to happen or what will happen once in a
while. But it won't happen enough to
create the balance that we all need in our life.
Yeah, I agree. What do you do?
Like the beginning and end of each day that you have like an
in Camp to kind of like set the stage off, you know, for the did
it just finished and for the next debate, how do you
typically structure the first 30 minutes of the day in the last
30 minutes? I'm like yeah I love that
question. So the end of the day is
definitely dog walk for sure. And then I try to do sort of
Inventory of what are one or two things that I did that day.
That made me more of my favorite version of Kathleen and how can
I replicate that? You know, and it could be
something as simple as you know, I drank a certain amount of
water and I know that made me feel really good and then I
think of, okay, what are one, or two things that you did that?
I did that made me, sort of less of a favorite version of
Kathleen. And then I was like, okay, so
how can I try not to have those happen?
You know, going forward and then I always meditate at the end of
the day for sure. So those are The things that I
find really set me up also just for a good sleep because, you
know, going through the inventory of my day.
Also just will help calm me in and sort of put me in a state of
sleep. And then in the morning it sort
of depends on the morning because some mornings, I have
six am client, so it's pretty much like I do.
My first client before I do my own daily sort of wake up and
then I, then I would do my sort of 30 minutes of them as an hour
of depending on what it is. I do some journaling, I do.
Work out and I do my physio stuff because I had a hip injury
by the eight years ago and then not and then I go about the rest
of my day. So it depends on what I start
with. But I always have in the morning
sometime either before my clients are after my first
client. I have about an hour to myself
where I do a workout and I Journal a little bit just like
free-flowing, like morning pages and, you know, take a gratitude
moment and have some breakfast instead of just, you know, I
like to try to think about how how grateful I am.
I'm the things that I'm lucky to have because it's easy to sort
of. I don't let life kind of take
over and lose a little bit of perspective.
Yeah. Did the, the journaling and the
meditation to that come pretty naturally to you?
Or was it kind of a struggle to get in the habit of doing that?
I'm sorry, I'm laughing because you can't see because we're not.
I've never, but I have this cat very much vying for my attention
right now, everybody, listening both at somebody else's home
right now because my house was there is massive drilling
outside my condo. So I had to discuss.
And so, this person has two cats and a dog and their surrounding.
It's rather than sorry. Can you the question was
meditation and journaling? Those are very hard things for
me because I find it hard to be still, so, meditation in
particular. Yeah, my therapist told me that
I should try it. And I read a book called true
happiness by Sharon salzberg. I that was a very helpful, you
know, she sort of has a similar idea but meditation that I do of
exercise of just like start with 5.
For 10 minutes, start where you are, her book goes through, you
know, like 20 different ways, different types of meditation,
everything from like a walking meditation to loving-kindness
meditation and her idea is like doesn't matter which of these.
You like just do one of them, so I tried that it's hard.
I like, yeah. The idea of sort of with
meditation is that, you know, your chair is always going to
swivel, like your mind is always Gonna Leave You but like, how
quickly can you pull yourself back?
It's a lovely concept. It's hard to do for some Like me
is very type A and I want to be moving, I want to be like
running and sweating and grunting.
So the idea of sitting still with my own boss, it's like
really why am I not doing something but I'm getting better
at it slowly but surely right. It's a process.
Everything is a process. Yeah, I feel like I've failed
multiple times at, you know, carving out time for meditation
but I've figured out the solution for me at least I'm
going to get a sauna and I want to sit in a sauna for 20 minutes
and then is going to be when I meditate as if I have the you
know, motive to Sit in the sun. It's going to make it much
easier. And with the song like you can't
have your phone in there because it's going to be too hot for the
fire. It's like, that's going to be
like, yeah, Primo time and setting for me to actually
exist. It was meditating.
Yeah, so I love that because that's an example for every
listing of two really wonderful things.
The first one is that you can piggyback or Mary something you
love with something that you want to do like a new habit with
something like a sauna that you really enjoy.
So and that could be with anything.
Like you know, if you're having a hard time working out, you
know, It was seeing a friend or instead of just taking your dog
for like a saunter something that you already do.
And you like, you can add some interval training to that or if
you like to hang out with your kids, like the, you know, make
it a sporting event, like, oh, you know, throw the ball around
or whatever, but marrying sort of habit that you have a desire
to create with something you already enjoy an RD.
Do can be so useful, but I also just really like the way you
said is that you made it work for you, right?
And that's I think the key. With all of this is I say to my
clients It's like moving has to be a non-negotiable, but how you
move is up to you, right? And and I think for a lot of
people meditation needs to be on a non-negotiable.
But how you meditate this up to you?
If you want to, as I said, you could do a walking meditation or
you could do a sauna meditation, whatever it is like, you know,
you can always tweak it. Once you start, as we said it
was exercise but I do think you have you ever heard the phrase?
Like, if you have time to meditate meditate, you should
meditate for 10 minutes but if you have no time to meditate,
you need to meditate for three hours but totally true but it's
just the thing. Like it's whatever.
We have a hard time. Prioritizing is probably the
thing that we need the most. Like I have a really hard time
prioritizing time off. I need that more than anything.
I need time off much more than I need a ride because I run all
the time, but I do not give myself time off, you know?
So it's just, I don't know. Our habits are so based in, you
know, sort of your own childhood, like a fertilizer of
what we grew up with and are sort of own unique brand of
neuroses and unique brand of sort of fears.
And you know there's something about it for me of you know
growing up with a mom. That you know, we didn't have a
lot of money, single mom and acting is very precarious, you
don't always know if you have a job and so I have this thing
like I like to know I'm working on I like to make sure I'm
making money and I like to support myself and so I get it,
you know? So it's uniquely me.
And then I have to figure out how to fight those good neuroses
that are not serving me, you know?
So yeah. Anyway, I love the fact that you
found a way to meditate. Yeah, it's like doing those
things that weird least, you know likely are least desirable
to do those do. It should likely be done.
First, I feel like the, as the day progresses, so much easier
to talk yourself out of doing whatever whether that's working
out or whatever, the case may be.
But I feel like if you just knock that thing out of the park
for very first thing in the day and then your likelihood of
actually getting it finished and completed is going to be just
exponentially higher, 100%. You need to front-load any of
the activities that you're not good at or don't want to do
because it's just so easy for life to take over.
And then it's like, oh, I forgot to do that.
Okay? And forgot in quotes, you No.
Like, you know, either consciously or unconsciously for
god, well, I don't have time to meditate anywhere.
It's also the don't have time. Write, like, you're doing
something for five minutes, everybody has five minutes.
You can meditate as you wait for the bus or if you have kids are
running late for school, then take a moment and close your
eyes and like there's always a way to filter it into like
pepper it into your life. You just have to find like find
Solutions. That's the thing.
My mom used to always say, to me Kathleen, there's always a
solution and that's one of the biggest gift, she gave me Like
just that mindset of, you know, I don't necessarily know what
the solution is yet, but either you find it, and if you can't
find it, you create it. Like, that is the power we have
as human beings. What's the biggest time sink
that you struggle with? Like, is it social media?
Or what would be the biggest thing that just sucks time away.
That is not productive hours. I have a lot of time that's not
productive hours which is I actually think part of my
problem, like I really think that if my therapist was here
which she would say is I need much more time.
That is unproductive. Yeah.
Not social media unproductive. But like I need to sort of sit
and read a book or sit and meditate or just like play more,
like more games or that. So productive in another way.
That's, you know, fun and joy and but for better and worse,
I'm pretty. The iron fisted with my time.
Which I think James, my partner would say that.
That's both my best. And also unbelievably one of my
most annoying qualities because it's like, okay, this is
budgeted for half an hour and we move on.
Now, click know what? We always like, what's going on?
No, no, yeah, I don't know. I like reruns of Beverly Hills
90210. That's my favorite.
One of my favorite television shows and Buffy the Vampire,
Slayer. Yeah, you go.
There you go. I feel like, like, for the
taipei's like you and I doing something like that is totally
quote, unquote unproductive, which in reality is very The is
yeah. Contagious.
You just have to have the wherewithal to know when you
need that and when you need it, you know.
Oh my God. You're so wise it's knowing what
you need versus what you want. And that is just so tricky
because if you are type A and you get so much of your worth
and so much of just everything from feeling, like you're always
doing what you need. It's all about balance out,
right? Like, if you biased towards the
person who sort of sits and doesn't do, you know, plays on
their phone or sleeps all the time.
Whatever, watching a lot of Netflix.
And yeah, so you need a little bit more like, 15% more like,
get up and go. But if you're the type of person
who biases to never meditating, to never sleeping to never doing
any of that, then you need to sort of redefine.
What productivity is. My therapist says this to me all
the time, like, joy and fun and all that stuff.
It's productive. It's just a different type of
productive it's and it's helping you be a better version but
better as in like a more calm centered.
Favorite but I like this idea of not my best version of Kathleen
but my favorite version of Kathleen like and what feels
good in my skin to be Kathleen you know and you know going to
the park with the dog and like throwing the ball.
It's unproductive and totally productive all the same time
because it's just a more Balanced Life.
Yeah, no I can totally get behind that.
I've tried to shift my thinking away from this concept of
balance because I think often times this imagery of balance
involves you know, a teetering tottering?
Teeter-totter is one's going up and one going down.
I've instead, tried to shift my focus towards this idea, that
everything in my life is symbiotic in nature.
And there's this concept of ten. Segregate.
So tensional Integrity. As I'm pulling one thing other
things. Yeah.
I love chemical.
Yeah, yeah. I like that.
Yeah. I've heard that critique of
balance before and I think I agree with that on sort of like
an intellectual level, I think so much.
It's just finding the word that works for you.
Like when I think about, I actually don't really think
Think of like finding a perfect Middle Ground.
I sort of just think of everything always in flux, and I
guess, maybe it's just because I'm so skewed biased in One
Direction. I don't think about getting
myself to of any perfect middle. I just sort of, think of, it's
almost more like, in my brain. My, my life is very much like a
light switch. It's like either I'm working all
the time or I fear that I'm going to be like, quote-unquote
lazy. Like I feel like I'm going to go
back to my old version of Kathleen which is like a light
switch. The The direction.
And so, when I think of balance I almost think of just like a
dimmer switch like just finding ways to be a little bit less
skewed in One Direction. Yeah, yeah.
More of like an equilibrium may be less than a balance and a
being aware of all the different parts of what I want to be in my
life that social connection, you know, the friends and the family
and the exercise and everything, but I like the tents Equity.
Like, we talked about that a lot in with the body, like the
tensaiga T model of the body. Versus just pure like by a
mechanical model of the body and I've never really thought about
applying that to all of the different aspects of my life.
So I'm going to think on that, I'm going to Noodle on that.
I like yeah yeah that's worked really well for me because I
don't know, I just like I'm an extremist type person but I
recognize that I can't be 100% with all things, 100% of time.
It's better to be, you know, it's better to be 90% 100% of
time than a hundred percent 10 percent of time.
So to say so figuring out, Where that lies and then just doubling
down those things that I think are moving the overall needle
forward throughout every aspect of my life that I want to excel
in. So you're kind of just figuring
out and defining what that looks like for me.
But, you know, for me, and for you to it sounds, it's
oftentimes, you know, favoring that of the work, or the career,
or the clientele. Yeah, so much everything else.
And it's unfortunate because, like, like Crystal my wife, for
instance, like the people that are closest to, you are willing
to put up with the most bullshit's, like you Bruce that
total as you can which is not fair but it's just kind of how
we're wired. So just kind of putting systems
into place so that that is not the case more often than not.
I guess I completely completely agree act just ever.
So slightly dialing down that aspect and dialing up other
aspects of our life. Yeah, I one of the podcast that
just changed my life. I actually forget, which
podcast, it was odd that it was with this woman Kristin, Neff,
who does a lot of work on self-compassion and the
interviewer was saying, look A lot of Pride shows they now will
I just tell my kids to like, you know, do their best?
And then I'll always do their best at everything.
And I'll and then that's all. That's what counts?
And Kristen just took this pause and she basically said, if you
tell your kid, if you tell your kid or anybody to be their best
at everything, they will end up in the hospital.
It is not possible to give 100% to everything all at once.
She's like instead, tell your kids to figure out the one, two,
three, four, five, things that they want to Be their best at
and give 100% at that and then be okay showing up for the rest
and I thought that was a really sort of what you were talking
about of like the, you know, 100 percent versus 90% in 10 and
that I thought that was a really interesting just idea.
And so I try to think about that in life as well.
Like what today am I going to really try to excel at and then
what today is okay, like some workouts it just the point of
like just going and doing that's totally okay.
It doesn't have to be a ten out. It doesn't have to be in a race.
All the time, you know, be races and see races.
Like if you're an athlete, right?
Like they have their place to that's where you get practice
and that's where you get sort of, you know, as a triathlete
that's where you get the practice of like going from
swimming to biking and it's they have a different purpose, those
times in life where you show up. So I don't, I don't know, like I
think for exercise it's just a matter of understanding that the
sum of the parts is greater than each individual.
Like it doesn't each workout doesn't have to be a 10 out of
10, it doesn't have to be Your best workout ever, to be
extremely worthwhile, like, so much of it is showing up, it's
just consistently showing up for yourself.
And then eventually you wake up and you're like, oh, I do feel
overall better, you know. Yeah.
And I feel like, you know, if you are moving, if your, if you
have some for minimum, it's much easier to keep that momentum
going as opposed to trying to stop and are just start an
immobile object. You know, stuff people that are
working at, it's not really a habit like for you.
And I working at is as much part of the day as brushing our teeth
I could just Happens. Yeah, fault.
But for people, that's not a habit, you know, I kind of like
this idea of working at every single day, not necessarily
going all-in. Trying to hit PRS every single
day. But just simply getting some
movement in every single day that way they don't have this
like planned, you know, off day or like several off days.
Like if you refer to it as like an off day there, it's like for
me whenever I take a quote unquote off day, the next day
back is much harder than it had. I never taken off there, you
know, so just keep performing and goings is key.
Yeah, I think that's very, very true but I also think that
what's interesting is that we all have sort of better and
worst days, but as you get more fit and as exercising gets more
habitual. What you define, as a better and
worse day, really changes. So and the better or worse week.
Great. So my quote unquote off days,
I'm still walking like ten fifteen thousand steps because I
have the dog and we go for walks.
And so whereas like 1015 Thousand Steps, 20 years ago
would have been a crazy exercise day for me, right?
So what I Define as sort of my like a day days at a workouts is
very different now than it was before.
So I think it's important to sort of realize that everyone is
always going to have better and worse days.
You're going to have sort of date like you need recovery day.
Do you need, you know, you need those a days and be days and see
days. But what you, what you define of
those things is going to change. Like, there's always going to be
some undulation, but you're going to undulated a higher
Paradigm. The fitter you get, so you're
never aiming for perfect, you're aiming for progress?
Yeah, so you want your better days to be better and you want
your worst case to be like the better than your old worst days?
Yeah, 100%. Well Kathleen.
What's on the horizon for you like with you having this
Progressive overload on your life getting better and all
aspects, like what is on the horizon fee?
That you're super excited about doubling down on and just
improving. Well, I'm very, I offer this
five-week group coaching courses called kick your ass with
compassion. So, I'm starting another one
November 10th. I really love that because it
allows me to connect with a greater number of people and
said, Of just one-on-one training its online.
It says, umm it's five weeks and it's great, it's coaching.
So it's not exercise. You're not, you know, doing
squats and lunges. It's really about mindset.
It's about connecting the dots between wanting and doing so
goal-setting Court course. So, really like you come in, you
learn the science of achieving a goal.
So that's great is really fun because it's people from all
over the world who joined so that on a professional level, I
like helping people kick their own ass but with compassion you
know, hold their toes to the fire but do it because they
respect and love themselves. Not be As now they hate
themselves. And personally, we actually just
booked like an hour ago, a trip to Whistler, which I'm really
excited about because my mom she's a movie in the Whistler,
Film Festival as Premier, and it's a whisper from Festival.
So, my Mom and James and myself were all going to go to Whistler
for 5 days and see my mom's movie and have some good food,
and I think will be really fun. I'm very excited and that sort
of goes with that bucket of, you know, looking in advance to the
month that's coming and saying, like Okay, In that month, when
is your time off going to be and, you know, making being very
intentional with my time and I think intentionality is huge.
Yeah, hundred percent agree. I feel like you know kind of
going back to the personal aspect of things.
Your mom knowing what she knows about you and the type of person
that you are you making that time, dedicate that time to her
and supporting her is going to mean so much more to her than
you probably even realize. And I feel like when you have
family members and you make that time for them that's like a
really Good way to just kind of work that into the system.
Like if you've got all these specific goals and aspirations,
you know, when your career path in your business, but you have
these times carved out for specific family members, that's
like a great way to check that box for for you and Kevin
proving that aspect of your life but also it means so much more
to them. So it's awesome that you're
doing that. Yeah, I think you're well, I
think that, you know, as we have been talking about the more
something becomes habitual and the more you can see the
positives of doing it right, the more you exercise, you feel good
that you want exercise. More and I just think vacation
and time with friends and family is a very similar idea like I
think partly over the pandemic I was just seeing fewer people.
I wasn't seeing my mom as much and now it's time to sort of get
out and do more things and the more I get back in the habit of
seeing my mom more and doing more fun things away from my
home. I think I will also just
remember how much I used to love it and that desire will drive
Behavior, you know? So I think it comes full circle
to everything. We've talked about, like, if you
want to have a confidence to do something again, you have to do
it. First time even though the first
time the little bit scary, right?
No, I totally hundred percent agree. 100% agree.
Well, where do people go to find out?
More about you dive deeper into your ecosystem and sign up for
this. Kick your ass with a compassion
course. My website is Kathleen,
Trotter.com, and I am fit by Kathleen t on all the sort of
Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, all that kind of stuff.
So, I'm always open to people's questions.
So if they want to get in contact with me and talked about
their fitness journey, I am always around.
Awesome. I'll certainly link out, make it
easy. Of people to find you.
One other thing, we really love the same books.
Like the, you're the one thing Atomic habits, you ought to read
discipline is Destiny by Ryan holiday.
If you haven't already. I love Ryan holiday.
Of course, I've read that book, I think, but I don't know if
I've read all of his books, but ya know, I'm a huge stoic
philosophy. I often joke to James, but I'm a
stoic Buddhist, and he thinks that's hilarious because he's,
like, you are neither stoic nor Buddhist.
But, let me tell you, I tried really hard to live the, some of
the stoic virtues and also, to be fair They examine and in my
approach to life. But anyway, so yes, I love Ryan
holiday. So thank you very much for that
recommendation. Yeah, no, it's awesome step for
speaking the same language for sure.
Yes, for sure. And people listening, if they do
like any of the books we've chatted about on my website and
I do a book sort of reviews, are not really reviews.
They're like, I take the main tip takeaways from the book and
apply it to health and wellness. So there's one on Atomic habits.
I have one on Carol dweck's growth mindset.
I have a bunch of Brené Brown books.
I have, I don't have a ton of bugs.
Probably have a couple Ryan holiday.
I think I did one for Stillness is the key but anyway so you can
if you are interested in reading some self development books and
you're like which book should I start with?
But you can look on the website and do a deep dive into the
books and how they might apply to your health Journey.
Awesome, awesome. That's awesome.
Resource that you put out there for people.
Kathleen has been an absolute pleasure chatting with you.
I've thoroughly enjoyed it. Like I've learned quite a bit.
I will link out to your site, your socials, make it easy
people to find you if there's ever anything I could do for you
at all, by all means just reach out.
Let me know. This was so fun.
Take care. Have a good one.
Kathleen has been an absolute pleasure chatting with you.
I've thoroughly enjoyed it. Like I've learned quite a bit.
I will link out to your site, your socials, make it easy
people to find you if there's ever anything I could do for you
at all, by all means just reach out.
Let me know. This was so fun.
Take care. Have a good one.