1 00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:06,080 Good morning. Good morning, everyone, GMG and 2 00:00:06,080 --> 00:00:09,720 welcome to another episode of the promo hour. 3 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:18,360 Hey, hey, close Thursday 2025. What day has already been? 4 00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:22,920 This can get better. Here we have a huge. 5 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:26,720 OK, huge. Trump is back saying he's going 6 00:00:26,720 --> 00:00:28,440 to make crypto great again in the US. 7 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:32,520 We had a mega Kaido AirDrop this morning, the pain token pre sell 8 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:36,960 last night, and some big news out of the SEC which might have 9 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:40,240 just stopped crime season in its tracks. 10 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:45,960 Plus folks, our biggest guest in quite some time, legendary 11 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:51,080 artist Sam Spratt, is joining us halfway through the show to talk 12 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:54,160 everything about the Masquerade. This is a big one. 13 00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:57,840 We've been looking forward to this show for days. 14 00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:01,720 Farouk is still out in Asia. Mando might pop in. 15 00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:04,599 He may not be able to join us, but we've got Ovi on with us. 16 00:01:04,599 --> 00:01:08,480 OSF fresh off his pain trade fresh off Paris. 17 00:01:08,880 --> 00:01:12,880 Ovi How you doing GM? When you GM, when you were like, 18 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:16,600 we've got our biggest guests in a while, legendary. 19 00:01:16,600 --> 00:01:18,560 I was like waiting for my finger. 20 00:01:18,560 --> 00:01:21,800 And I was like, oh wait, obviously you're talking about 21 00:01:21,800 --> 00:01:24,520 sound, not me. We have two legendary artists on 22 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,160 with us. Sound definitely much more 23 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:29,840 legendary than me. It's good to be back. 24 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:31,040 It's good to be back. How you doing man? 25 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:34,920 I'm good. It's it's been an eventful day 26 00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:37,640 already, but we are feeling good. 27 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:42,000 How was Paris? I'm sad I wasn't able to go. 28 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:43,160 It looked like it was a lot of fun. 29 00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:47,400 It was good. I mean, I really of all the NFT 30 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:50,160 events and stuff, Paris one I enjoy quite a lot. 31 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:51,680 There's a ton of people that turn up. 32 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:54,840 I think there's like the actual conference itself. 33 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:58,240 There's at least 20,000 people that roll by. 34 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:02,760 And this time I felt like there were a lot of people who weren't 35 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:05,440 really in the NFT space, not even necessarily in crypto. 36 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:07,280 They had some AI events and that kind of stuff. 37 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:12,240 You know, we have like a big wrecked booth at each of these 38 00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:13,960 events and we just hand out drinks for free. 39 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:18,960 And I felt like last time 95% of people who turned up were people 40 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:20,680 in the space who kind of knew what we were. 41 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:23,520 This time it was a bit more 5050 where people were like, you know 42 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:25,440 what, what is this? What is this drink? 43 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:29,640 How is it related to crypto or web 3 and and and and stuff? 44 00:02:29,640 --> 00:02:33,080 So it was good. Like it was a lot of a different 45 00:02:33,080 --> 00:02:35,880 crowd, I think to usual. So yeah, I had a good time, 46 00:02:35,880 --> 00:02:39,040 enjoyed it, but good to good to be back, I think. 47 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:42,160 Nice expanding that top of funnel exactly. 48 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:46,880 Love to hear it folks. We're very excited to have 49 00:02:46,920 --> 00:02:49,920 legendary artist OSF on with us as well. 50 00:02:50,120 --> 00:02:52,080 What are we talking about? So we're going to chat with him 51 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:53,640 to start. We're going to talk markets, 52 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:57,840 alts, cooking a little bit, this breaking news about this SEC 53 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:00,360 cybercrime unit. We're going to talk to the Kaido 54 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:02,320 AirDrop. We're going to talk to the pain 55 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:04,720 presale. I also want to get Obi's 56 00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:07,960 thoughts on where AI, crypto AI is here. 57 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:11,640 And then second-half of the show, Sam Spratt will be joining 58 00:03:11,640 --> 00:03:15,000 us to talk about the Masquerade, the idea, how it came up with 59 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:18,840 it, how it's going to work, the one-on-one sale and a whole lot 60 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:20,880 more. So we are stoked for that one. 61 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:24,040 Before we dive in, shout outs to our partners, Galaxis. 62 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:27,560 Galaxis is a Web 3 platform empowering creators and brands 63 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:30,400 to build unstoppable communities with full ownership and 64 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:34,200 independence, trusted by icons like Donald Trump, Steve Aoki, 65 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:37,840 Mike Tyson, and the NBA, shaping together the future of 66 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:41,480 engagement. And every day we see people's 67 00:03:41,480 --> 00:03:44,680 wallets get drained. Fairside is about to launch the 68 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:46,840 fair alternative to insurance for crypto scams. 69 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:49,920 Check out at Fairside Network on X. 70 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:53,480 If you get drained, you won't be wrecked. 71 00:03:54,360 --> 00:03:58,400 All right, Sims, do we have music for Ovi or should we just 72 00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:01,280 dive right in to our market chats? 73 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:03,720 We actually don't. I removed it a while back. 74 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:06,360 Oh, sad. You know when you joined, we 75 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:07,360 switched it out, we got your own. 76 00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:08,960 You can play your Jingle if you want to go with it. 77 00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:11,080 Let's do it. We need, we need a Jingle here 78 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:24,840 today. All right, folks. 79 00:04:24,840 --> 00:04:27,120 Well, I'll take a quick overview and then I just want to get into 80 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:29,800 more high level conversation with OSF here. 81 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:33,320 But it's like Bitcoin 97,000 right now on the dot. 82 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:38,480 It's up 1% on the day ETH up in line, ETH 2730 sold up a bit 83 00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:42,480 more back at 173. So it seemed like we've been 84 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:47,240 kind of grinding up a bit here this week off of the Tuesday 85 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:51,200 intraday lows. Some alts are cooking, seriously 86 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:53,200 cooking. So the story protocol, their IP 87 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:57,480 tokens up 23%, Barra up 22%, back to $8. 88 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:05,600 Celestia say Pythe all up double digits on the day as well. 89 00:05:06,440 --> 00:05:10,600 So some nice movement and alts we see SPX is up there, one of 90 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:13,920 the top movers and also I think memes overall, pretty much even 91 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:17,000 on the day kind of chopping in this zone right now. 92 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:24,080 Not a whole lot of big movement on that board news wise. 93 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:27,120 There wasn't a whole lot of big news that that really came out 94 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:29,480 yesterday from a macro standpoint. 95 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:32,000 We had Trump come out and say talk about how he passes 96 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:36,920 executive orders to effectively end Biden's war on crypto. 97 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:41,200 No new details really came out from that. 98 00:05:41,480 --> 00:05:45,280 I think the biggest piece of macro news broke this morning 99 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:48,560 right before the show. So we've got DB tier 10K 100 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:51,360 reporting. The SEC has launched a cyber and 101 00:05:51,360 --> 00:05:56,200 emerging technologies unit. It will combat fraud in crypto 102 00:05:56,920 --> 00:05:59,240 among other areas. And folks, if you, if you dig 103 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:02,600 into this and what they're actually going to focus on fraud 104 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:06,400 committed using, using emergency emerging technologies such as AI 105 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:10,120 and machine learning, use of social media or false websites 106 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:14,280 to perpetrate fraud, fraud involving blockchain tech and or 107 00:06:14,280 --> 00:06:18,000 crypto assets. So this is a big one. 108 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,360 I don't, I don't think that we necessarily expected this to 109 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:25,000 come out here so soon. I think it's very welcome. 110 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:28,600 I've seen some takes that perhaps this would be more 111 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:32,560 limited to to things like SIM swaps, but I don't know when I 112 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:35,720 read this. 5th bullet fraud involving blockchain tech and 113 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:38,720 crypto assets that feels like it's pretty open-ended to me. 114 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:42,800 Ovi, what's your take on this? Is is crime season going to end 115 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:45,040 in its tracks? Hear what this? 116 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:49,280 I just, yes, it's about time we see something like this because 117 00:06:49,280 --> 00:06:53,640 I think one of the faults of the previous administration is that 118 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:55,760 there wasn't really any clear guidance. 119 00:06:55,760 --> 00:06:58,760 So not only did you not know what was right, yours didn't 120 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:00,600 really know what was wrong. And people would just do random 121 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:02,080 things and pay for it after the fact. 122 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:04,920 So it's good to see. Like, there's going to be a task 123 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:09,240 force focusing on this stuff. And yeah, it's just, it's 124 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:11,000 mental. Like how blatant the crime 125 00:07:11,000 --> 00:07:13,800 season has been to start the year, just because everyone has 126 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,480 assumed if Trump did this, and I can do that, but what other 127 00:07:16,480 --> 00:07:18,840 people have done is obviously way worse than than what Trump 128 00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:19,960 did, which is just launched a token. 129 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,040 So it's good to see. I think it will be good for the 130 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:25,400 industry. There's just a ton of crime and 131 00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:30,560 bad actors that are siphoning money right now out of crypto, 132 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,360 which is affecting all of us and affecting all of our existing 133 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:35,040 bags. And so it would be really nice 134 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:38,560 to have some stricter enforcement on that stuff. 135 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:44,200 I hope an announcement like this prevents people from doing any 136 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:46,440 more of that kind of stuff or at least makes people think twice. 137 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:49,760 You know, like a lot of the crime has been committed by 138 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,640 these guys like Hayden Davis, who's like an American citizens. 139 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:55,960 And, you know, at least like it's going to have some layer of 140 00:07:55,960 --> 00:07:58,160 protection where the next people who want to do it will at least 141 00:07:58,160 --> 00:07:59,200 try and be anonymous or whatever. 142 00:07:59,200 --> 00:08:03,800 So yeah, hopefully goodbye to blatant crime season, I think. 143 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:08,920 Were you Mark, safe from the the Libra scandal over? 144 00:08:09,360 --> 00:08:13,000 Yeah, I mean, I, I, I put in a bit of money, but not very much. 145 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:18,040 Like I put in 60 Soul and I sold it and for a 12 soul loss. 146 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:20,960 So it wasn't like a huge loss for me. 147 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:25,680 And I think by this point I've gotten wise enough to it where 148 00:08:25,680 --> 00:08:28,440 it was like, I'm not going to just fucking put my full port 149 00:08:28,440 --> 00:08:32,360 listing. I was even just angry at myself. 150 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:34,480 Why don't even put in 60 soul? Like I knew exactly what it was. 151 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:36,720 And I lost some money on the Enron thing. 152 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:41,200 Not again, not that much. But so the amount I've been 153 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:45,280 gambling with on the stuff has just reduced each iteration and 154 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:46,480 now I'm not even going to touch it. 155 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:48,920 Like if if kind of we spoke about this yesterday, Tyler, if 156 00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:52,800 kind of, you know, did a token, I wouldn't touch it because I'm 157 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:54,600 not an insider. I'm not going to get the 158 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:56,880 contract address early. I'm not going to be able to 159 00:08:56,880 --> 00:08:58,880 snipe it. I'm going to get second hand 160 00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:01,760 information or too late. And by the time I get to buy it, 161 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:04,720 maybe a catch a small move higher, but people will already 162 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:08,120 be be dumping on me. I don't want to give my money to 163 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:11,160 these people anymore. Yeah, It it feels like what's 164 00:09:11,160 --> 00:09:15,320 come out here is more just exposing that that portions of 165 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:16,960 the meme market were a rigged game. 166 00:09:18,560 --> 00:09:20,480 I kind of hate the over generalization that that the 167 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:23,160 entire thing is rigged because I don't think that's fair. 168 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:28,200 Look, you have launched a a meme coin Reg coin. 169 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:30,960 I don't think anyone would try to make an argument that that is 170 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:35,160 a rigged token and it was just kind of a natural progression. 171 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:37,680 So I guess how are you feeling about the broader meme market? 172 00:09:37,680 --> 00:09:41,360 I mean some people think it's over forever, some feel like 173 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:44,160 maybe just a Lol and and this is just cycles playing out. 174 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:47,200 What's your view? Yeah, I, I haven't been that 175 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:53,120 constructive on meme coins and like the animal meme thing to 176 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:55,240 start the year. I, I think I tweeted about that 177 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:59,560 few times that I have more of a focus on AI this year rather 178 00:09:59,560 --> 00:10:03,280 than just memes or if it's memes, meme coins within AI or 179 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:07,360 that have some sort of like AI relation to it. 180 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:11,160 So to me, I think a lot of these, you know, I see some of 181 00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:13,680 the meme coins bouncing today, but I just think these are all 182 00:10:13,680 --> 00:10:18,080 going to be dead cat bounces and we're not going to see 99% of 183 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:21,400 meme coins we saw in 2024. They're not going to reach their 184 00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:24,560 all time highs ever again. I think I think they're probably 185 00:10:24,560 --> 00:10:30,520 about three, maybe 5 coins that could be inter cycle and will so 186 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:35,320 stuff like Pepe, for example. But yeah, generally speaking, I, 187 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:37,760 I don't think I think it's going to be very tough for the meme 188 00:10:37,760 --> 00:10:42,080 coin market to bounce because we haven't had that, that many new 189 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:44,520 that much retail inflow this year. 190 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:48,160 And I think the idea of like, oh, these communities are really 191 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:51,640 strong is massively diluted by the fact there are just tons of 192 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:56,720 new coins all the time. And people seem so it's like the 193 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:59,840 same people who were previously the communities now just full on 194 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:02,520 gamblers, everyone just addicted to the to gambling. 195 00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:05,120 And when something new comes, everyone sells the old bags. 196 00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:09,520 So like chase the new one. And so that just seems to be, I 197 00:11:09,520 --> 00:11:11,120 don't think it's a meta that that's happening. 198 00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:15,080 I think that's a natural maturing of the market. 199 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:18,840 And so yeah, I just, you know, I don't, I don't, I barely earn 200 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:22,640 any memes apart from Rect and Rect is obviously has a big AI 201 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:25,040 focus to it now and everything else that we're doing with the 202 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:27,200 drinks, etcetera. So I don't, I wouldn't even 203 00:11:27,200 --> 00:11:28,840 class Rect as just like a pure meme coin. 204 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:32,040 I think the pure meme coins I don't own any of right now 205 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:34,960 because I just don't. I think it's very tough to buy 206 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:37,200 and hold that stuff. It's tricky. 207 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:41,880 Folks have moved on from like the memes as communities to just 208 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:45,480 pure rocket game. I am hopeful that that trend 209 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:48,840 will reverse at some point, but I'm also not naive. 210 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:50,320 I don't think it's happening anytime soon. 211 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:54,800 Perhaps like zooming back out to just Bitcoin and broader crypto 212 00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:55,840 markets. Like what? 213 00:11:56,320 --> 00:11:59,120 How are you feeling? Like we've had a pretty big run 214 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:02,640 of positive news, macro positive news for for Bitcoin 215 00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:04,360 specifically. I think also just for the 216 00:12:04,360 --> 00:12:07,480 broader crypto space here, we are kind of just still ranging 217 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:13,400 97 K, like what's your view like Q1 plus like maybe on the year? 218 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:15,280 Like do you think we're going to keep chopping here for a while? 219 00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:20,360 Do you have perspective? Yeah, I think it's all been sell 220 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:24,080 the news really, hasn't it. And I think last year at the end 221 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:29,480 of last year, my fear was that inauguration would be a sell the 222 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:32,720 news because I didn't, I never had the view that they would 223 00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:36,120 announce immediately announce Bitcoin reserve and that they 224 00:12:36,120 --> 00:12:38,320 would immediately start buying like my, I was like these 225 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:40,280 things. Trump's not even president yet. 226 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:44,560 And for the US to like classify a whole new asset as like a 227 00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:48,800 strategic reserve surely takes a lot more work and effort and 228 00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:52,160 research than just Trump saying, Hey, I want to do this and it 229 00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:53,920 being, you know, done on day one. 230 00:12:53,920 --> 00:12:56,080 So I always felt like that would be a sell of the news. 231 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:58,640 But then we had all this like really positive, all these 232 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:02,600 really positive headlines around other stuff into it, like the 233 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:05,800 crypto task force and the idea of potentially other digital 234 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:09,520 assets being passed the stockpile and just Trump really 235 00:13:09,520 --> 00:13:11,320 talking everything up. And originally when Trump 236 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:13,640 launched his meme coin as well, this is before the other tokens 237 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:15,120 came. I was like, wow, that's pretty 238 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:16,920 bullish. It's just it's just like the 239 00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:19,280 president launching a coin in the US, They're going to really, 240 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:24,000 really push this stuff. But I think my original thought 241 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:26,040 of like it being sell the news was the right one because 242 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:28,400 obviously we had all these other coins and it turns out their 243 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:30,720 intentions were bad. And yeah, I think we're in for 244 00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:32,880 Trump. I think it will take at least 245 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:37,560 six months, probably from now still to approve a strategic 246 00:13:37,560 --> 00:13:40,880 Bitcoin reserve and then the act of actually buying Bitcoin from 247 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:44,000 that, possibly even longer. Like these things don't get done 248 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:45,760 overnight. But what I would say is that 249 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:47,760 they are insanely, insanely positive and they've gone from 250 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:52,440 being priced in to slowly being priced out over time. 251 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:57,960 And a lot of ults are down. Ults are down 90% plus I mean, 252 00:13:57,960 --> 00:13:58,960 because obviously down quite a lot. 253 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:02,320 AI is down a ton. So I've been like mostly in 254 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:05,680 Bitcoin for a while for you know, since kind of like the 255 00:14:05,680 --> 00:14:08,320 beginning of the year after that first AI nuke. 256 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:11,040 But things are at interesting levels for me now where I'm 257 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:16,200 looking to like rotate into stuff like soul stuff like AII. 258 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:21,800 Think if you look at Bitcoin dominance, the the three times 259 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:26,560 it has fallen sharply in the last 12 months have been when 260 00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:30,520 Trump won the elections, when Trump started speaking about 261 00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:34,480 crypto in the Bitcoin reserve around like it was May, June 262 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:38,480 time and when the Bitcoin ETF got approved. 263 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:42,120 So they were all like Bitcoin positive events that actually 264 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:44,880 caused Bitcoin dominance to fall and Ulster rally. 265 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:47,920 And that's because I think the market goes risk on and it tries 266 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:51,360 to gamble the other stuff to outperform Bitcoin. 267 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:53,880 So my expectation is a few months of chop. 268 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:57,400 We may even get like a bigger pull back if we get some 269 00:14:57,400 --> 00:15:00,160 negative headlines on Bitcoin reserve, which is definitely 270 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:02,400 possible. But ultimately I do think it 271 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:06,640 will get approved. And that's that's my North star 272 00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:10,240 catalyst really for risk rallying into that, I think, But 273 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:13,920 I think we have to be patient. There's no need to get crazy 274 00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:15,400 loading the boat at these levels. 275 00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:19,640 And you know, I've been my play outside of Bitcoin really is has 276 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:23,800 been AI and Arc and AI 16 is the other two I've been buying. 277 00:15:23,800 --> 00:15:26,440 I've just been very patient about only adding them when they 278 00:15:26,440 --> 00:15:31,080 hit new lows really. Sometimes I feel like I would be 279 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:33,120 more, I wish I was more aggressive there at sometimes at 280 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:36,800 times, but that's kind of like my my thought right now, yeah. 281 00:15:37,760 --> 00:15:40,080 Well, I appreciate your thoughts as always. 282 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:45,680 And I mean, it's hard to be super aggressive with this AI 283 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:49,120 market cap right now at six billion. 284 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:50,560 I guess it depends on your perspective. 285 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:54,520 It, it feels like every time we we've bought the dip and and 286 00:15:54,520 --> 00:16:00,520 seen the the rebound, the next dip is dippier and it goes 287 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:06,160 lower. So I guess real quick, I would 288 00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:09,120 love your AI thoughts. Like we talked about this before 289 00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:13,240 you, you laid out potential $100 billion mark total market cap 290 00:16:13,240 --> 00:16:15,680 for all these. Do you think that the next meta 291 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:19,320 is going to be different? You talked about ARC and AI16Z. 292 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:21,560 Those are your the the horses you're betting on. 293 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:26,000 Yeah, I really like. So within the AI space, I think 294 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:30,720 the big play here is thinking of maybe some of these things as 295 00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:34,640 like potential L ones. And so I think AI16Z and ARC 296 00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:38,400 fall in that bucket. And the reason why I say that is 297 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:41,960 because if you can view something as a potential like L1 298 00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:46,920 for AI agents, your ceiling is a lot higher for for an L1 coin 299 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:49,400 than it is for an altcoin than it is for a meme coin. 300 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,360 So those are the two that I like. 301 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:57,320 I think it's really hard to ignore the mind share that AI16Z 302 00:16:57,320 --> 00:17:00,160 has and all the tech that supports it. 303 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:02,160 I know people will have an issue with the shore and all that kind 304 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:04,560 of stuff, but for me, that's kind of created like a buying 305 00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:06,480 opportunity for something that I felt like I missed earlier. 306 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:11,880 And you know, just like a like a similar thesis really there on 307 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:15,280 on that one. So, you know, these things are 308 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:17,200 are nascent and they're not without fault and they're not 309 00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:19,839 without trials and tribulations. And we've kind of seen that a 310 00:17:19,839 --> 00:17:22,240 couple of times in arc. But for me, I do think they 311 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:23,319 will. I think, I think this whole 312 00:17:23,319 --> 00:17:26,520 sector will come out on top this year because it's really hard 313 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:31,320 just to ignore AI in not only in markets or in crypto, but just 314 00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:32,400 in your everyday life. Really. 315 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:34,400 It's hard. AI is always mentioned. 316 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:38,920 And this for me is the first. I'm like, I'm not a detailed 317 00:17:38,920 --> 00:17:41,480 investor or detailed trader like like someone like Mando is, or 318 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:43,160 maybe even yourself, Like I don't look that much into the 319 00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:45,280 details. I'm like, OK, what can I just 320 00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:49,000 like tangibly see and feel that makes me want to buy something? 321 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:52,920 Because that's how I think the most the the a larger portion of 322 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:55,960 the retail investor base thinks. And for me, AI agents is like 323 00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:58,320 the first actual product within AI where you can be like, oh, 324 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:03,120 cool, I see AIXBT all over the timeline or hey, I see like 325 00:18:03,360 --> 00:18:04,960 wrecked guy AI producing these art pieces. 326 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:08,240 Like I see these things and I can tell explain to you someone 327 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:11,400 in simple English what this actually does as soon as you 328 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:12,680 have, we didn't have that last year. 329 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:15,160 We have that this year. We didn't have that, you know, 330 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,960 the first half of last year. So now that we have that, I 331 00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:21,080 think it's like a real, whether it's a real product market fit 332 00:18:21,080 --> 00:18:22,600 that has longevity, I don't really know. 333 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:25,520 Like who knows if this is just going to be vapor Ware stuff in 334 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:28,160 the future or real stuff. But for now it's new, it's 335 00:18:28,160 --> 00:18:30,560 fresh. I can explain to my normally 336 00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:34,120 friends what it is, what it does and why you should buy the token 337 00:18:34,120 --> 00:18:37,680 and explain that the market cap is so low versus other sectors 338 00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:40,200 in crypto. I think it's a really good 339 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,200 investment case. Plus like I've and I know we 340 00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:47,600 like to hate and ignore the institutions, but there is a lot 341 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:49,200 of institutional capital flowing into this stuff. 342 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:52,160 Like I spoke to a lot of guys who are putting in big tickets 343 00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:55,080 and I mean even the other day it was like someone bought like 344 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:59,520 what was it like 7 mil of AI16Z and eight mil of Arc like that. 345 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:01,520 Those are institutional tickets that are going into the stuff 346 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:07,280 and these guys who've missed the whole meme coin cycle who can't 347 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:11,000 really raise capital from their LP's investors to invest in meme 348 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:12,320 coins. They can in this. 349 00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:15,760 And there are similar people who are commentating on this space 350 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:17,800 who are commentating on meme coins last year. 351 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:21,240 So for me, it has all the DNA to to be a main cycle narrative. 352 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:25,200 We've gotten caught in the meme sell off and the altcoin sell 353 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:28,080 off and, and what not. But I don't think this is the 354 00:19:28,080 --> 00:19:30,720 end of the story for AI agents. And I do think we, I think 355 00:19:30,720 --> 00:19:33,320 there's, there's going to be one point this year where people 356 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:36,080 will look at these levels and think, fuck, I really should 357 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:39,080 have bought that dip in size. I really think we'll see that. 358 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:41,400 I hope you're right. I think you make a good point 359 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:44,120 about like more institutional capital being able to allocate 360 00:19:44,120 --> 00:19:47,840 to this sector versus memes. I think that's spot on. 361 00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:50,640 You talked about ARC and AI16C. That's primarily where I've 362 00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:52,080 played. I have to give a quick shout out 363 00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:53,240 to Virtuals and then we'll move on. 364 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:57,560 We got to talk Kaido as well as pain quickly. 365 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:01,520 They introduced their agent commerce protocol yesterday. 366 00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:04,720 And if someone is interested in the space, I I definitely 367 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:08,120 encourage you to read the white paper or at least a summary. 368 00:20:08,120 --> 00:20:11,360 I created a summary of it yesterday for folks. 369 00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:14,600 But but basically they are have built a decentralized open 370 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:20,760 source protocol for agent to agent commerce on chain as well 371 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:23,440 as with with a human interaction component. 372 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:28,960 So if you are bullish on the scenario where agents will be 373 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:32,160 acting autonomously and transacting on chain and there 374 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:34,720 will be a home for that, virtuals is throwing their hat 375 00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:35,720 in the ring. And I don't know if they're 376 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:37,680 going to be the winner, but they're actually, but they are 377 00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:40,840 trying to go after it. And I'm going to talk about some 378 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:43,520 of the examples and like spinning up an AI digital 379 00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:47,920 marketing business where you have like an AI artist, you have 380 00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:53,360 an AI writer doing the the copy. And then perhaps they employ a 381 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:56,720 human Akol to do their marketing for them. 382 00:20:57,080 --> 00:21:00,880 And like that is a model where humans can actually be paid by 383 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:03,760 agents in the somewhat near future, which is wild to think 384 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:05,160 about. But I feel like that's very non 385 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,120 zero. I actually think it's non zero 386 00:21:07,120 --> 00:21:10,360 to happen in 2025. And how that could happen 387 00:21:10,360 --> 00:21:13,320 actually is via a protocol like Kaido. 388 00:21:13,360 --> 00:21:19,120 So Kaido has the, the, the, the nuts and bolts in place showing 389 00:21:19,120 --> 00:21:22,160 who has the mindshare. And they've got the, I, I 390 00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:25,040 believe they're starting to set it up in the back end to, to 391 00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:27,360 create that type of a payment mechanism. 392 00:21:27,560 --> 00:21:30,920 So folks, the news out of Qaeda, they did launch their token here 393 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:33,320 this morning. I don't think we've gotten a 394 00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:36,160 whole lot of more news about what it will be. 395 00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:39,800 Perhaps they're kind of saving that, you know, for a post 396 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,960 AirDrop. But in Info Boom, we did get the 397 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:46,680 tokenomics 25% core contributors, 32% for the 398 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:51,280 ecosystem, 2% to Binance, 10% was for the community and eco 399 00:21:51,360 --> 00:21:53,880 claim and then seven half percent for longer incentives. 400 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:57,640 So the AirDrop today was a bit smaller than some folks were 401 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:01,000 expecting. It does come along with another 402 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:06,600 round of potential airdrops coming in the future. 403 00:22:08,120 --> 00:22:11,920 The token itself, it performs strongly out of the gate, so it 404 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:15,640 opened around $1.20. Oh wow, it's really moved since 405 00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:18,480 since we last spoke about it. Wow it. 406 00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:22,480 Has it, It dipped to a dollar O 6 and then just shot straight to 407 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:27,320 $1.50 and it looked like all the early sellers perhaps have made 408 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:29,640 a mistake and then it has since been selling off. 409 00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:35,040 So it's right around $0.90 or a $900 million FTV here. 410 00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:39,640 So still in the early, early hours of this token, it's going 411 00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:44,160 to be volatile. Curious OSF, any reactions to 412 00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:47,400 you from the token or just broader thoughts on Kaito? 413 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:51,400 Yeah, I like Kaito. There's a lot of FUD on the 414 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:54,280 timeline about it. Like this is worse than Fentech 415 00:22:54,360 --> 00:22:58,280 and all that kind of stuff. Like I think of all the social 416 00:22:58,280 --> 00:23:05,320 fire stuff we've seen, it has the best like scoring mechanism 417 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:08,560 in my opinion, for rewarding people who tweet useful things. 418 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:11,680 Like when I look through the Kaito list and I see the 419 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:13,840 rankings, I think, oh wow, here's some people who are I've 420 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:17,520 actually personally always rated, but who don't typically 421 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:19,760 score on the well on the other stuff because they maybe have 422 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:22,320 fewer followers or worse engagement. 423 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,120 So I think it, in my opinion, it's done a pretty good job of 424 00:23:26,120 --> 00:23:29,480 identifying like people who have useful content. 425 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:31,960 And it does that through this idea of like smart followers and 426 00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:33,320 stuff like that, which I think is quite interesting. 427 00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:35,280 So I think it's good tech in my opinion. 428 00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:37,640 I don't think it's just another friend tech. 429 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:41,160 I think it's very useful tech. Should it be worth 1 billion, 430 00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:42,840 one half billion FTV more than that? 431 00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:45,400 I don't really know. Like I don't really have a full 432 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:50,000 understanding of how the revenue model works and nothing to do 433 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:52,840 with like Kite or their tech, but it gets bucketed within 434 00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:54,680 like, oh, this is what everyone is focused on right now. 435 00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:57,640 Air drop happens. OK, boom, let's move to the next 436 00:23:57,640 --> 00:23:58,960 thing. Like that's just how the market 437 00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:00,840 is right now. So you really have to have 438 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:05,640 something extremely special to or something that people will 439 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:08,520 want to really use every single day, like hyper liquid to 440 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:09,920 maintain that kind of mind share. 441 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:12,920 So I don't know if it's going to be able to do that. 442 00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:15,080 I really hope it does because it's really for me, it's like a 443 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:18,680 breath of fresh air to see a project, a product that people 444 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:22,400 have honest and hard working people have been working on, 445 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:24,720 come to the market and do an air drop and everyone makes a bit of 446 00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:26,960 money from it. Yes, it's not quite the moon 447 00:24:26,960 --> 00:24:31,560 mass everyone was making out to to making out to be, but from my 448 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:36,880 perspective, I got whatever I could 5 figure AirDrop from just 449 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:39,320 doing nothing other than tweeting like how I normally 450 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:41,880 tweet like I'm I'm definitely very grateful for that. 451 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:46,960 So I think I think we should be celebrating it for sure. 452 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,200 At the end of the day, they're giving a bunch of people free 453 00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:55,000 money, but you know, will it last here and will this these 454 00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:56,400 levels last that I'm not sure about. 455 00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,320 I hope it does, but you know, that will remain to be seen, I 456 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:01,840 think. Yeah, you make a lot of good 457 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:04,240 points and absolutely rooting the Kaido team on. 458 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:06,000 I think they've done everything really well. 459 00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:11,000 They moved fast through a launch and what's been kind of a tricky 460 00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:13,000 market so that they weren't just trying to time market 461 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:15,600 conditions, they opened up over a billion. 462 00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:20,120 Like that's an incredibly difficult thing to do at the 463 00:25:20,120 --> 00:25:24,120 same time from an investment standpoint, like so I I sold a 464 00:25:24,120 --> 00:25:26,040 good chunk of my air drop. I'm happy to be transparent 465 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:29,040 about that. It's it was harder for me to 466 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:33,800 justify a $1.2 billion FTV evaluation based on like what 467 00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:35,560 we've seen from them to date and maybe they're going to come out 468 00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:37,320 and share revenue numbers that back that up. 469 00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:39,960 I'm optimistic on their future business model. 470 00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:43,200 I think they still have a long road to go to prove out that 471 00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:45,280 they're a billion dollar protocol. 472 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:48,560 So that's where I'm at. But I'm actively rooting them 473 00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:49,320 on. I'll continue to be 474 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:51,760 participating in the the ecosystem. 475 00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:53,800 So I'm I'm very excited to see what more they're going to 476 00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:57,920 release today with respect to staking and perhaps their their 477 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:01,760 near term vision for how they're going to continue to monetize 478 00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:04,640 the ecosystem and how that information comes out. 479 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:08,800 Again, may, may change my opinion of the protocol, but I 480 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:10,120 think they have to be happy today. 481 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:14,280 This was a huge launch in what is still kind of a challenging 482 00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:16,800 market. The other launch and we're we're 483 00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:18,600 going to go to Sam here in just a couple minutes. 484 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:20,960 We got to quickly talk about the pain pre sale. 485 00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:25,800 I know you were plugged in to this one pain team. 486 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:27,320 They threw a couple curveballs our way. 487 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:30,440 So they they refunded 80% of the pre sales. 488 00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:33,000 They knew it was probably going to be tough to perform and then 489 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:34,800 it came out of the gate yesterday. 490 00:26:35,360 --> 00:26:39,240 Let's see it it opened, it opened absurdly high because of 491 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:44,920 snipers, but then it got to about $60 million market cap, 492 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:52,800 which was 120 million FTV, sold off a bit and then it rallied 493 00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:57,800 all the way to 250 million FTV and we're like $25 a tokens back 494 00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:00,480 to 15. Now the curveball they had is 495 00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:02,960 they released some tokenomics. They effectively burned 50% of 496 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:06,120 tokens by sending them to Harold, the person behind the 497 00:27:06,120 --> 00:27:11,400 meme, and locking it till 2045. What were your thoughts around 498 00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:13,160 this presale? You participated and would you 499 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,080 do it again? Do you think Mainland would be 500 00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:16,880 able to pull this off again or do they they need to wait a 501 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:18,920 little while? Yeah, I think they will. 502 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:20,480 I don't think you can do it back-to-back. 503 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:22,000 Obviously. I think they'll need to waste a 504 00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:24,240 while. But again, I think this is a 505 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:29,680 good example of people acting the right way after all these 506 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:34,040 all this extraction we've seen, like, you know, they could have 507 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:38,320 just taken $40 million, right and put in a portion of that 508 00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:42,400 into liquidity and all that kind of stuff and just really banked 509 00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:47,160 may bank on it, but they didn't. They refunded 80% of it back to 510 00:27:47,360 --> 00:27:49,920 pre sellers and then they burnt half the token supply. 511 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:53,920 They haven't been too greedy in like taking coins for themselves 512 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:57,400 or anything like that. So honestly, like I think 513 00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,440 they've done everything the right way. 514 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:03,280 I think if this was launched just a couple of weeks ago 515 00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:08,200 before the the Libra stuff and there's more liquidity in the 516 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:09,880 trenches, I think this could have done really well. 517 00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:12,280 It could have been, you know, I mean, it has done really well 518 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,600 for appreciate the appreciates are up like whatever it is 5-6 X 519 00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,600 right now, but it could have been even bigger. 520 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:20,880 I think, I think it really could have been could have done really 521 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:24,760 well because right when they did the refund, it caught everyone 522 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:26,880 off guard and it was like, oh fuck, this isn't a scam. 523 00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:30,560 This is legit. So you know, timing is timing 524 00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:33,720 and it's not always in everyone's controls and you 525 00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:35,520 know, these guys have been working hard to try and get all 526 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:37,480 the exchange listings and that kind of stuff. 527 00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:41,320 So I think honestly, I think if they did another one, people 528 00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:43,720 would go in for it hard. I think if they if they did 529 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:49,720 another pre sale for I don't know, I think for another one of 530 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,560 the IPS that they have partnership with, let's say in a 531 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:56,240 month or two time, I think they would probably raise more than 532 00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:58,440 this original 40 million is is my guess. 533 00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:00,800 But they would have to make it. What they should probably need 534 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:04,120 to do is like make it a capped pre sale and make it such that 535 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:08,480 if you're a pain holder or maybe you know the mainland assets you 536 00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:10,320 get first looking or something like that. 537 00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:11,720 I think is would be the way to do it. 538 00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:14,360 It'll be hard for them to have another big success, but this 539 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:16,720 like was just laid out this was I think it was a big win for 540 00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:20,920 anyone who's sent to the pre sale anywhere from a + 50% to a 541 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:25,480 2X or more if you held through the overnight peak in in a rough 542 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:27,600 me market. So I'm calling it a win. 543 00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:30,600 More is to come from Meme Land. So I don't know if folks saw 544 00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:32,600 this. It was a little buried at 545 00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:35,560 consensus. In Hong Kong, Ray Chan, CEO of 546 00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:38,720 Meme Land, is giving a talk and he's talking and he's going to 547 00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:42,520 reveal their 2025 road map, the launch of Meme Pay, their new 548 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:48,640 crypto credit card, as well as Meme Strategy, their version of 549 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,560 micro strategy. So I think that's is arguably 550 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:53,680 like the the biggest open item here. 551 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:56,360 It is what that actually means. I don't think they're just going 552 00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:58,800 to be stockpiling meme coins. I think there's likely going to 553 00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:02,840 be more to it. Maybe it's some kind of a a meme 554 00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:06,880 launching capacity. I think they have a chance to to 555 00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:09,120 monetize that and they're good at it. 556 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,920 And I think this was a very well done launch. 557 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:14,880 I think smart people were plugged in stats. 558 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:17,160 Sam friend of the show, he did a nice write up on everything they 559 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,120 tried to do to it to vent snipers. 560 00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:21,440 And I think a lot of snipers actually got wrecked on this. 561 00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:28,000 Yeah, it's perfect to to see that I think yeah, I think look, 562 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,680 these guys obviously their original business is is 9 gag, 563 00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:34,840 which is huge and like these guys understand me and I think 564 00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:39,600 they understand community like I wouldn't I wouldn't I wouldn't 565 00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:43,160 ever fade Ray or Charles. These guys, I think I made a 566 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:47,160 comment on meme land artwork like once two years ago and they 567 00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:51,000 sort of like raged at meme token and went got the bio accessing 568 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:52,560 everything and they they really, really crushed it. 569 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:55,160 So I think I definitely wouldn't fade these guys. 570 00:30:55,160 --> 00:31:00,120 And I know people have a sort of like a perception sometimes, but 571 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:02,040 I think, you know, these are good actors and I think they've 572 00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:04,720 serially been successful at things that they've done. 573 00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:07,160 So this whole like meme strategy and meme that thing is, is 574 00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:09,200 interesting. And yeah, like, on the one hand, 575 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:12,760 you may say meme should be meme. They shouldn't have utility. 576 00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:16,280 They shouldn't have these other things like it should just be 577 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:17,680 the meme. And if it's if it's funny, 578 00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,640 people will buy it. And I think that's true to an 579 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:24,920 extent or it's definitely very true in a market like last year 580 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:27,960 when bean coins are going crazy. But you know, as the overall 581 00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:32,040 market evolves and people find new things even more funny or, 582 00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:36,200 you know, other things come to play if you're not a Pepe or a 583 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:39,560 Doge or a share, but it's very hard to maintain that attention. 584 00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:42,080 So having these other things that these guys are talking 585 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:45,840 about, it's something that I think could keep a meme coin 586 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:48,960 alive if it needs to be. And for me, it's interesting. 587 00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:51,920 I think it's a different, slightly different path to the 588 00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:55,440 typical meme coin thing. But it's important to understand 589 00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:59,440 that if you want your your meme coin to last for multiple years 590 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:01,400 and not just multiple days, which is the hard thing right 591 00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:04,000 now, then you need to have another element to it that's not 592 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,120 just, hey, this meme is pretty funny. 593 00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:11,440 Yeah, and I've got I've got confidence in this team. 594 00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:15,880 I am trust stats Sam. I don't think he would be 595 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:19,520 working with them if he didn't believe in the mission and the 596 00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:21,320 vision. So I think they've got some more 597 00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:24,200 tricks up their sleeve or tricks is probably the wrong word. 598 00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:26,720 I think they've got some some big plans here. 599 00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:30,960 So I'm very curious to see what they'll continue to to roll out. 600 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:37,800 But a nice win on pain here from the the meme land team folks. 601 00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:40,240 All right, we've done our market roundup. 602 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:47,600 It is time to get into our discussion here with Sam Spratt. 603 00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:50,680 Wow, this is this is a big one, folks. 604 00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:53,240 If you're not familiar, I'm sure almost all of you are Sam 605 00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:57,560 Spratt, legendary digital artist, fresh off his $3,000,000 606 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,240 sale for his one of 1X Masquerade. 607 00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:03,680 And the game is about to go live. 608 00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:05,560 He's incredibly busy. We're thankful he took out some 609 00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:09,320 of his time to speak with us. Sam GM, how are you doing? 610 00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:12,000 Man, that's good to see you both. 611 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:17,000 It's good to see you too. I, I appreciate your time. 612 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:20,240 Wow, I imagine your, your head is spinning. 613 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:23,760 You're, you're locked in the, the office right now. 614 00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:27,200 We, we can go so many directions with this. 615 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:30,960 I think maybe First off, I'm just curious, when did you come 616 00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:33,040 up with the idea for the masquerade? 617 00:33:33,040 --> 00:33:36,840 Has this been something that like this ever stretching kind 618 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:40,360 of games and evolving games, has that been in the works for quite 619 00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:42,960 some time? Like talk to us a little bit 620 00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:44,920 about that. Sure. 621 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:49,120 So all of Lucy, the series I've been making over the last three 622 00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:52,680 years and change, it's episodic, so it's always kind of made. 623 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:58,120 As I'm starting this new bit of my life, I'm going to make one 624 00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:02,640 painting at a time and each one is going to be what I'm actively 625 00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:05,960 learning, maybe trying to capture a little bit of what I 626 00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:08,600 have learned and try to point at what I want to learn next. 627 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:12,960 And so, you know, that began with these narrative paintings 628 00:34:13,679 --> 00:34:19,920 and then it's slowly started slipping into utilizing the 629 00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:23,840 blockchain, but in kind of like a, a not code based way, more in 630 00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:29,080 a relationship based way. So like the skulls of Lucy was 631 00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:32,080 the, the first example of this, where those first three 632 00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:35,880 paintings I did in the auctions, I ended up painting a skull for 633 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,719 each one of the people that entered into my first steps into 634 00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:40,800 the space. So these these things were free 635 00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:43,280 gifts. In the act of doing that, 636 00:34:43,560 --> 00:34:49,159 suddenly I collided with this host of, you know, 50 people who 637 00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:50,960 all have totally different lives than me. 638 00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:54,400 I've been artists for 10 years doing album covers, movie 639 00:34:54,400 --> 00:35:00,760 posters, things like that. And to collide with traders, 640 00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:03,920 poker players, protocol engineers, other artists. 641 00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:06,200 So just like a, a totally different ball game. 642 00:35:06,240 --> 00:35:08,480 It, it, you know, it's inspiring. 643 00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:11,040 It kind of just shows you, you're in a very, very tiny 644 00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:15,680 bubble and a lot of different industries are suddenly buttered 645 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,040 up against each other. And with that, I, I think it 646 00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:21,520 just kind of broke a little bit of my path that started as this 647 00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:25,240 very solitary artistic kind of melodramatic endeavor. 648 00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:29,680 And then a node connected to it with my wife Rachel, and then a 649 00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:33,040 node connected to it with a few friends and then a council of 650 00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:35,200 people. And then the monument game, that 651 00:35:35,240 --> 00:35:40,040 piece back there was a way to to kind of create a, a large 652 00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:44,120 painting, but have a lot of people gather around and 653 00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:47,960 contribute their thoughts to it. And so while I was making that 654 00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:51,440 towards the tail end of it, the idea for Masquerade was 655 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:55,080 percolating. Little fragments of it was was 656 00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:58,400 there, but really it was actually seeing what happened 657 00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:02,400 through my collision with all the people that wrote on top of 658 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:09,240 it that traded after and seeing all of the human behavior around 659 00:36:09,240 --> 00:36:11,960 this art. This like very maybe over 660 00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:15,240 earnest story that I had been making suddenly having a bunch 661 00:36:15,240 --> 00:36:20,200 of people both give me their own earnesty of love letters and 662 00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:26,560 confessions and letters to their dead brother and like beautiful 663 00:36:26,560 --> 00:36:29,680 things that are just etched in code on my painting forever. 664 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:33,640 But also like the opposite end of the spectrum of our space, 665 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:35,720 you know, the more degenerate side of it as well. 666 00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:38,440 And then as it started entering the market and people started 667 00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:42,320 trading it, you see this thing that was a link between us. 668 00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:46,120 You know, it's it's tenuous. There's there's some people that 669 00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:49,040 hold it for a very long time. It remains precious to them. 670 00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:50,840 And there's some that it starts moving. 671 00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:54,880 And then as an artist reckoning with, OK, well, suddenly I've 672 00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:57,840 connected to this network. What do they all want from me? 673 00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:01,120 And it covered. It's a bit of a jungle out 674 00:37:01,120 --> 00:37:02,160 there. It's a little mad. 675 00:37:02,440 --> 00:37:07,920 And so Masquerade was really born from seeing both the like 676 00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:11,200 profound camaraderie and friendship of colliding with 677 00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:15,440 like people like OV and some of the members of the council and 678 00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:19,480 like the genuine brotherhood and bonds and formations that can 679 00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:23,360 occur in such AI mean, let's be real here, like a very absurd 680 00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:26,360 small portion of the world that we're we're all kind of 681 00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:28,680 colliding in. And then on the other end of 682 00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:31,480 spectrum, the inverse of camaraderie, right? 683 00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:37,480 The the people that maybe wear that to you, but do not act that 684 00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:41,680 way behind the scenes. And as you wrestle with all 685 00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:45,320 this, I think where Masquerade ultimately started coming into 686 00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:49,120 fruition was the recognition that there's no good, there's no 687 00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:51,240 bad. You need the whole spectrum. 688 00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:54,680 You need the people that are like your tightest brothers, 689 00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:56,920 your most trusted people right next to you. 690 00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,800 You need your even tighter version of that in the form of 691 00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:02,480 family. And then you need the kind of 692 00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:04,680 people gradating all the way in between. 693 00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:07,360 And that's what creates like a living and breathing ecosystem. 694 00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:10,440 Like we're, we're undulating and, and you, you need the 695 00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:12,960 predators and the prey. You need the people that provide 696 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,840 cover for others, the good guides and the teachers and the 697 00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:18,600 people that are. I would need poison shit posters 698 00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,560 like there's none of this works without the whole spectrum. 699 00:38:22,840 --> 00:38:25,760 It is a growing Organism. That's such an interesting way 700 00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:27,320 to put it. So you started with your one of 701 00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:29,360 ones you you have a handful of collectors. 702 00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:32,240 Then you do skulls 49, I believe. 703 00:38:32,240 --> 00:38:35,800 So you're growing the circle. I think my first glimpse was NFT 704 00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:40,760 NYC2022 and that's where I really saw like the skull holder 705 00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:43,200 and like this cult forming around you like go, this is this 706 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:46,760 is a real thing. This is a group of people who 707 00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:49,400 who really believe in in your work. 708 00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:52,720 And then you've expanded here last or two years ago with with 709 00:38:52,720 --> 00:38:58,200 Monument game 256 and now 613 for the Masquerade. 710 00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:02,360 There's a lot of directions we can take this. 711 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:06,560 I want to give you a chance to, to walk folks through the the 712 00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:09,720 Masquerade here. How is it going to work? 713 00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:14,320 And I also want to get into like why you like these interactive 714 00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:17,720 games, so maybe talk to us a little bit more about the 715 00:39:17,720 --> 00:39:21,080 Masquerade. So to kind of just strip out a 716 00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:23,960 lot of the, there's a lot to it, but to just kind of boil into 717 00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:27,240 like what the actual participation and interaction 718 00:39:27,240 --> 00:39:31,840 here is, is it's built on some of the foundation with Monument 719 00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,400 Game. So Monument Game was one large 720 00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,560 labyrinthian image, very complex, hundreds of stories 721 00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:40,520 within it that I made. And then we built an interface 722 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:43,960 for you to leave a coordinate and a written observation on top 723 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:46,240 of. Think of it like a slightly long 724 00:39:46,240 --> 00:39:49,960 tweet that is embedded atop of it, this communal varnish of 725 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:53,120 written contributions atop my work. 726 00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:57,960 So it builds on that foundation, but across 3 phases. 727 00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:01,720 So the first phase is everyone with a mask. 728 00:40:01,720 --> 00:40:04,000 So right now the public drawing ends later today. 729 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:07,600 So we'll find like the total who all is on on this guest list, 730 00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:10,960 who all has a bare mask. So all of these masks begin 731 00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:14,840 identical to one another and each one of them will begin the 732 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:16,840 first phase by leaving an observation. 733 00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:20,720 So just a written contribution of themselves atop the work the 734 00:40:20,720 --> 00:40:23,880 Masquerade. After a few days, we're going to 735 00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:26,520 switch to the next phase. The next phase was really 736 00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:29,560 inspired by what happened after the monument game, which was 737 00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:33,960 well, suddenly I'm, I'm not just like alone in the network. 738 00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:36,640 I'm connected with all of you. So well, what happens if now 739 00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:39,520 you've observed and then everyone kind of gets to be a 740 00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:43,280 reply guy to one another and you are now discussing with one 741 00:40:43,280 --> 00:40:45,440 another. You're engaging in discourse and 742 00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:49,560 dialogue and so you'll reply to a few of the people that are are 743 00:40:49,560 --> 00:40:54,160 near you and then move to the next phase is taking that 744 00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:56,000 collision. Whatever you learned from 745 00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:01,600 whether it was a extremely friendly, helpful person that 746 00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:04,520 kind of took some strand of your thoughts and tried to pull it in 747 00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:08,520 a new direction, open a window for you, or if it's someone that 748 00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:10,840 shout all over everything that you had to say. 749 00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:13,880 However you choose to take that is like that is the collision 750 00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:18,000 that is other people destroying trying to find form of your idea 751 00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:22,120 and you come back in to try to balance it with a revision, an 752 00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:25,120 edit and really it's these three steps of life. 753 00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:28,920 The observation is a creation. It's like that first vulnerable 754 00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:30,440 act of putting yourself out there. 755 00:41:31,120 --> 00:41:34,200 Destruction is discussion. That's where us engaging in a 756 00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:38,640 dialogue with one another, if we trust each other, if we care 757 00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:42,560 about trying to find each other's best form, or even if we 758 00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:46,960 don't, just the act of being in dialogue starts chipping away at 759 00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:48,400 making that creation better, right? 760 00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:51,840 It's like any business you guys have run, like the more eyeballs 761 00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:53,600 you have. Sometimes it's too many cooks in 762 00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:56,600 the kitchen, but sometimes it shows you things that you didn't 763 00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:59,600 see because you are a little too close to it. 764 00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:03,760 And then at the end, try to balance and I can get into 765 00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:07,640 what's all inspired by, which is this ancient form of scripture 766 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:11,280 and commentary, but that's the core mechanic of what everyone 767 00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:13,480 will be doing. And then this collection that 768 00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:16,400 all begins bare. So all the masks are the same. 769 00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:20,880 Every mask that I've made, they're all one of one of this 770 00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:24,560 613 collection is inspired by all these different kinds of 771 00:42:24,560 --> 00:42:26,960 people that we're talking about. You know, the the the full ends 772 00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:31,280 of the spectrum of your kindest and your cruelest, the the 773 00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:35,960 funniest, the most profound. And so the masks rather than I 774 00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:40,000 would say how people might typically associate a collection 775 00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:43,000 where you would mint and a random number generator would 776 00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:46,480 determine what you get or your hand selecting the piece that 777 00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:48,760 you want. This is actually a link between 778 00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:52,640 me and you. And so the words you give me, I 779 00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,160 will be going through this collection of, you know, the 780 00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:59,760 it's 613, but I've made more than 613 and seeing what goes 781 00:42:59,760 --> 00:43:01,640 with you. And because of some of the tools 782 00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:04,800 I built, if there's people that have behavior, which is almost 783 00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:08,480 an inevitability that totally surprises me and is way outside 784 00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:12,400 of like, you know, the attempts to show a variety of human 785 00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:15,160 beings, But, you know, you'll never really capture the density 786 00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:17,080 and complexity of all of our little variables. 787 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:21,880 I'll be making them in real time over the course of this to hit 788 00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:24,800 those anomalies. I was curious how you were going 789 00:43:24,800 --> 00:43:27,080 to actually make the the masks. Yeah, me too. 790 00:43:27,080 --> 00:43:29,480 It's. Like so, so much work. 791 00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:32,280 So you've, you've built kind of a foundation and then you, 792 00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:35,000 you've got some levers and things that you can, you know, 793 00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:37,840 do as you're going through and reading. 794 00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:40,880 I'm sure people would love to hear a little bit more about how 795 00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:44,520 that's going to work. Yeah, so, so much like the this, 796 00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:47,920 this system of participation, creation, destruction, balance. 797 00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:50,160 That's kind of what I've been doing for the last year and a 798 00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:51,920 half. So I've been a painter my whole 799 00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:56,000 life, illustrator. I've been drawing professionally 800 00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:59,720 for, you know, almost 15 years or so, starting out with, you 801 00:43:59,720 --> 00:44:03,080 know, little gigs for editorial sites and album covers and so 802 00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:07,240 on. But you know, I've, I've loved 803 00:44:07,240 --> 00:44:10,320 drawing and painting forever, but I became very curious about 804 00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:14,640 expanding my skill set a little bit, the tool set. 805 00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:18,320 And when I was a few things happened. 806 00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:21,840 But one, when I was out in Venice for the monument game 807 00:44:21,840 --> 00:44:24,720 exhibition, you know, you're there during the BNLS, you're 808 00:44:24,720 --> 00:44:27,600 colliding with all these traditional artists and the 809 00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:30,320 traditional artists that go and do their exhibitions there. 810 00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:34,600 You learn that, you know, most of the the top tier artists in 811 00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:38,800 the traditional world that are given these opportunities, you 812 00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:41,520 know, they're not a lone guy up on a mountain. 813 00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:45,000 You know, they have, they have whole team studios of assistants 814 00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:48,600 of a bunch of like Pratt interns that are doing their, you know, 815 00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:52,640 their, their it's like a factory, a pipeline working in 816 00:44:53,080 --> 00:44:56,280 hand in hand with them. And for me, there's just 817 00:44:56,280 --> 00:44:59,640 something that like kind of terrifies me about like loving 818 00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:03,440 so much, making things this way, drawing my whole life being an 819 00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:07,400 artist. I'm like, oh, to grow, I have to 820 00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:10,320 one day just become a manager like that, that, that like 821 00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:13,080 horrifies me a little bit. And I understand there's 822 00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:17,400 components of that of directing, conducting that will absolutely 823 00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:19,920 come into the picture here. But I was curious, like, can I 824 00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:23,080 stay close to it? Like, do I not have to abstract 825 00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:25,320 myself, filter and filter and filter away from it? 826 00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:28,080 So I started learning node based programming and I started 827 00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:32,240 learning sculpting and I started slowly stitching together over a 828 00:45:32,240 --> 00:45:36,000 very long time kind of a set of hybrid tools. 829 00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:40,160 That is, it is drawing, it is painting, it's sculpture, it's 830 00:45:40,160 --> 00:45:43,800 trained on my poetry, it's trained at different epochs 831 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:48,600 along the process on my sketches, my under paintings, my 832 00:45:48,600 --> 00:45:53,200 paintings, my characters, and finally my individual brushes 833 00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:55,840 and brushwork. And what ended up happening is 834 00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:58,640 kind of building a hybrid system where I can make one brush 835 00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:02,000 stroke and that brush stroke kind of has every brush stroke 836 00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:04,360 I've made in the past. It's like this oddly weird 837 00:46:04,720 --> 00:46:07,880 avatar like situation where you're sort of like recalling 838 00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:12,560 your past because you've spent a long time extracting the file 839 00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:15,920 structure of how everything you've made would work. 840 00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:20,320 And So what I've done is kind of like a very, very grimy form of 841 00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:24,040 a man machine hybrid tool where there there's no point where 842 00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:27,440 anything is really generating without me in it. 843 00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:31,560 It's just this constant pass back and forth, this constant 844 00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:34,320 conversation. I, I like to describe it as like 845 00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:38,000 grinding a rock against a mainframe because it's, it is 846 00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:41,160 inelegant. But if you watch some of the 847 00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:44,320 videos that I posted, you can see a little bit of like the 848 00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:48,080 lattice work of the nodes and how it kind of slips in and out 849 00:46:48,120 --> 00:46:53,600 of drawing and painting and 3D and generative work all kind of 850 00:46:53,960 --> 00:46:57,600 eventually get into the other side where I guess my main goal 851 00:46:57,600 --> 00:47:02,120 is I don't really think art that is defined by its tool to is 852 00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:04,480 very interesting. Like it's kind of like, I don't 853 00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:09,200 know, I'm a man. OK, great. 854 00:47:09,480 --> 00:47:12,440 Like not that interesting of like a premise to start getting 855 00:47:12,440 --> 00:47:16,640 to know someone. So really it's more I wanted to 856 00:47:16,720 --> 00:47:19,640 break down my own patterns and how I've done things my whole 857 00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:21,400 life. And the act of learning how to 858 00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:25,760 do that and seeing what can't be outsourced to a machine, but 859 00:47:25,760 --> 00:47:29,320 also what can is like an interesting to learn thing to 860 00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:31,560 learn about yourself, like your strengths and weaknesses. 861 00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:34,840 There's a little bit of like ego dissolution, but then also like 862 00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:40,320 you get to see that most of what's precious and left in 863 00:47:40,320 --> 00:47:43,640 there is kind of your flaws in a weird way. 864 00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:48,080 And preserving that has been like the the process. 865 00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:52,320 I'm, I've got one quick question, Sam. 866 00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:55,640 Yeah. Everything you know this 867 00:47:55,640 --> 00:48:00,720 everything that you've just explained and also monument 868 00:48:00,720 --> 00:48:05,840 game, it all has this feeling of like really careful, intricate 869 00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:11,920 planning and a lot of thought that's gone into it and a lot of 870 00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:15,600 careful construction. And I'm sure all that happens 871 00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:18,200 when you come round to like, OK when you Rachel sit down and 872 00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:20,040 come round to like, OK, this is what we're going to do. 873 00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:26,240 But how much of like the ideas that you have and kind of the 874 00:48:26,240 --> 00:48:32,200 outcome of what you decide to do is premeditated versus how much 875 00:48:32,200 --> 00:48:35,440 of it is just like, oh, I kind of felt this way today and this 876 00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:36,960 seems like a good idea. Let's try that. 877 00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:40,760 Like for example, when you did the monument game, did you 878 00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:44,720 already have the plans and the ideas kind of in place already 879 00:48:44,720 --> 00:48:47,920 for the Masquerade? And then when you were doing the 880 00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:49,880 Lucy one of ones, did you have the idea for the monument game? 881 00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:53,320 Or is it just kind of things that have developed over time 882 00:48:54,360 --> 00:48:56,600 because, you know, the way that you speak about it and the way 883 00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:59,760 that we see these come to fruition, it's like, wow, Sam 884 00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:01,640 must have been planning this stuff since he was born. 885 00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:05,160 But I'd love to get like an insight into like, you know, how 886 00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:10,640 these thoughts spring up and, you know, spawn in your mind, if 887 00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:12,480 that makes sense. Sure. 888 00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:15,720 So I, I guess I would say I have a plan in the sense that I have 889 00:49:15,720 --> 00:49:20,360 a direction like I, I can usually I try to think in a time 890 00:49:20,360 --> 00:49:26,000 scale that is far enough out there that I directionally have 891 00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:29,840 batted up against my own ideas enough to know that that is 892 00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:32,560 fundamentally where I want to point towards. 893 00:49:32,880 --> 00:49:38,800 But the, the thing about over planning or not letting like 894 00:49:38,800 --> 00:49:42,400 when I hideaway for a year and a half and make something, when I 895 00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:46,280 finally put it out there and share it, especially when it is 896 00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:50,600 this participatory mechanism. There's just so many new 897 00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:54,240 variables that, you know, I'm trying to construct rules and 898 00:49:54,240 --> 00:49:58,400 guides and the parameters of what I care about the the 899 00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:02,680 outcomes, the behavior that I want to provoke or incentivize. 900 00:50:02,840 --> 00:50:06,360 But I also am building just enough chaos in it that I don't 901 00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:08,200 really know exactly how it's all going to unfurl. 902 00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:10,600 And that's already happened even in the like preliminary 903 00:50:10,600 --> 00:50:13,560 mechanics of how people have invited people or whatnot like 904 00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:16,600 that. So even if I have the plan of a 905 00:50:16,600 --> 00:50:19,320 direction or to take like a Trumpism, like a concept of a 906 00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:24,680 plan is, there's a always a intentional wiggle room left 907 00:50:24,680 --> 00:50:28,400 there where I want to be able to learn from whatever happens the 908 00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:31,840 moment I share it out there. Because there's just a very 909 00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:35,960 different thing that occurs that if I only had my initial 910 00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:41,080 architecture of the idea, then I've almost like trapped myself 911 00:50:41,080 --> 00:50:45,600 in a prior state of growth. And you don't I, I don't really 912 00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:47,400 like doing that whenever possible. 913 00:50:48,080 --> 00:50:50,280 It's already hard enough to kind of avoid that. 914 00:50:50,440 --> 00:50:54,120 But like, for example, within monument game, you know, there's 915 00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:58,720 a book buried on the ground hidden next to the log that says 916 00:50:58,840 --> 00:51:01,240 the mass of Lucy collection, right? 917 00:51:01,240 --> 00:51:04,040 So like, I knew I wanted to make this and I knew I wanted to 918 00:51:04,040 --> 00:51:07,720 explore new tools to learn how to create a collection of the 919 00:51:07,720 --> 00:51:11,680 size of the fidelity and creativity that I wanted to. 920 00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:15,240 But at that point, I had no idea whether or not I would 921 00:51:15,240 --> 00:51:18,840 necessarily be able to or what form it would take. 922 00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:24,040 I just directly knew that this is a mission that will stretch 923 00:51:24,040 --> 00:51:26,040 me. I don't totally know if I can do 924 00:51:26,040 --> 00:51:27,400 it. That excites me. 925 00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:30,880 I think most of what I find compelling about, well, maybe 926 00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:33,800 any bit of art is like, I'm currently capable of this. 927 00:51:34,000 --> 00:51:37,320 I believe I've some weird delusion in my head that maybe 928 00:51:37,320 --> 00:51:39,720 I'm capable of that. The tension to get there. 929 00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:42,920 Like there's the joy, right? There's the act of doing the 930 00:51:42,920 --> 00:51:45,080 whole damn thing. It's like same thing with 931 00:51:45,080 --> 00:51:47,200 raising a kid, building a relationship, all of that. 932 00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:50,400 It's just this like projection out into the future. 933 00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:53,800 And so that's the plan, if you will. 934 00:51:53,800 --> 00:51:57,000 So, so yes, there are there are ingredients of this that are 935 00:51:57,240 --> 00:52:00,800 highly architected that have multiple years in mind, but 936 00:52:00,800 --> 00:52:05,760 usually those are like little details compared to the big 937 00:52:05,760 --> 00:52:10,160 thing is I want to let my collision with you, with you, 938 00:52:10,560 --> 00:52:14,480 with everyone help. I don't know, I just want to 939 00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:18,680 learn from this. Yeah, I love hearing that the 940 00:52:18,680 --> 00:52:21,600 high level vision, how this is all tied together in the 941 00:52:21,600 --> 00:52:23,920 timeline. I know some of our listeners are 942 00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:27,360 playing and they want more specific details if if you can 943 00:52:27,360 --> 00:52:29,600 get into it. So I I got a couple questions. 944 00:52:29,600 --> 00:52:33,880 One just perhaps about kind of what you are looking for from 945 00:52:33,880 --> 00:52:39,520 participants and like this is a competition, how does one win? 946 00:52:39,520 --> 00:52:41,960 I guess the other, like the the third part of this I know I'm 947 00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:45,000 throwing a lot, is how do you manage anonymity? 948 00:52:46,280 --> 00:52:49,280 Do people tip themselves off via comments and how do you kind of 949 00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:52,760 work around that? So people can tip themselves off 950 00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:55,240 with comments. That's 100% the case. 951 00:52:55,480 --> 00:52:58,240 But there are a number of people that will be playing the 952 00:52:58,240 --> 00:53:02,360 Masquerade that I know will be there, but I don't know which 953 00:53:02,360 --> 00:53:06,600 masks they are and they have not publicly revealed themselves. 954 00:53:06,600 --> 00:53:10,120 And so like our guest list is a very eclectic group of kind of 955 00:53:10,120 --> 00:53:13,720 all ends of the spectrum in a common space. 956 00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:19,880 As far as what I'm looking for, I guess I'll start there is I 957 00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:23,800 think there's this maybe like a we got a little bit of this in 958 00:53:23,800 --> 00:53:25,560 the monument game. Not a lot, but a little bit 959 00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:30,320 where people thought that what I was after was, you know, things 960 00:53:30,320 --> 00:53:35,200 that speak in my language or use the kind of words that I use or 961 00:53:35,440 --> 00:53:38,320 have immersed themselves in the world of Lucy and all that. 962 00:53:38,320 --> 00:53:42,120 And you know, like that. If that's what drives you and 963 00:53:42,120 --> 00:53:46,320 motivates you, by all means. But you know, for me, the point 964 00:53:46,320 --> 00:53:49,800 of kind of me exerting the art and building the system around 965 00:53:49,800 --> 00:53:55,800 it is to try to capture some little snapshot of what all this 966 00:53:55,880 --> 00:53:58,360 this strange cultural moment we're in is. 967 00:53:58,360 --> 00:54:01,560 And that is, you know, like we talked about the market in 968 00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:05,280 abstraction, like it's some kind of entity, but it's people, 969 00:54:05,520 --> 00:54:07,800 right? It's an undulating Organism of 970 00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:10,680 people. And so who are each of the 971 00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:12,760 people that helped move and motivate it? 972 00:54:13,480 --> 00:54:17,560 So like what I'm looking for, as I don't care if it is about 973 00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:22,520 Lucy, about my art, about using my words, I don't care if it's 974 00:54:22,520 --> 00:54:23,880 well written or anything like that. 975 00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:25,440 Like that is not what I'm looking for at all. 976 00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:29,320 I am genuinely just curious like what have you been up to? 977 00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:32,800 Like what is your life? What if you could encapsulate 1 978 00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:36,720 little snapshot into it? One story 1 leave behind one 979 00:54:36,720 --> 00:54:40,480 note to someone else when anything that is of your 980 00:54:40,840 --> 00:54:44,880 essence, if you want to call it like there, there's there 981 00:54:44,880 --> 00:54:47,760 doesn't need to be anything deep or profound about that. 982 00:54:48,080 --> 00:54:55,040 It can just be you is that will help me know where to put it 983 00:54:55,040 --> 00:54:57,760 all. And I think it's the things 984 00:54:57,760 --> 00:55:01,400 where we get a little stuck of knowing, well, what do I want to 985 00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:06,080 leave behind? That's when, well, you start 986 00:55:06,640 --> 00:55:09,080 wearing a different kind of nature and, and there's a, 987 00:55:09,120 --> 00:55:11,160 there's something to observe in that as well. 988 00:55:11,760 --> 00:55:17,160 But no, the, the, the point of masquerade is it's not to there. 989 00:55:17,200 --> 00:55:20,240 Yes, look, there are keys and codes and riddles. 990 00:55:20,240 --> 00:55:21,760 There are things to find. There's all that. 991 00:55:21,800 --> 00:55:24,480 But that's just because there's a whole host of people that work 992 00:55:24,480 --> 00:55:26,320 like that. Yes, there are three masks that 993 00:55:26,320 --> 00:55:28,760 can be won. Not everyone is motivated by 994 00:55:28,760 --> 00:55:34,320 winning like some people just want to be and that whatever 995 00:55:34,320 --> 00:55:36,680 form that takes, you're kind of encouraged. 996 00:55:36,680 --> 00:55:40,800 Like the reason why one of the lessons learned from monument 997 00:55:40,800 --> 00:55:43,240 game of, well, all the players were identical, but there's 998 00:55:43,240 --> 00:55:47,720 these three skulls is some of my reflection on that is man, 999 00:55:47,720 --> 00:55:49,920 there's just, there's so much that I read that people 1000 00:55:49,920 --> 00:55:53,480 contributed that how could I really even sort it? 1001 00:55:53,720 --> 00:55:56,520 You know, like my, my attempt to try to create these parameters 1002 00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:58,680 and incentive structures. Like there's so much that I 1003 00:55:58,680 --> 00:56:02,480 loved that meant a lot to me that how can I create more of 1004 00:56:02,720 --> 00:56:06,640 the spectrum of sorting of all of these masks and try to make 1005 00:56:06,640 --> 00:56:10,200 it it really felt and understand that I am going through. 1006 00:56:10,200 --> 00:56:13,320 I am reading all of these, every single line written means the 1007 00:56:13,320 --> 00:56:16,040 world to me that you would even bother to take the time, let 1008 00:56:16,040 --> 00:56:19,720 alone collect a piece of my art. And so the all all I'm looking 1009 00:56:19,720 --> 00:56:24,600 for is you basically. And as far as the winners, that 1010 00:56:24,600 --> 00:56:26,960 is the task that I've given to the council. 1011 00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:29,440 And so, you know, OB is, is part of that. 1012 00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:35,360 And basically what that will be is closer to the monument game. 1013 00:56:35,360 --> 00:56:39,240 They'll be, they're structured a little different here, but I 1014 00:56:39,240 --> 00:56:40,600 can't get into that too much yet. 1015 00:56:41,000 --> 00:56:45,240 But the intent is to take everyone in and based on these 1016 00:56:45,240 --> 00:56:48,600 three separate phases, which kind of have very different 1017 00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:51,760 behaviors, if you think about them of that initial observation 1018 00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:53,320 is something we kind of do alone. 1019 00:56:53,360 --> 00:56:56,920 It's like a personal thing between me and whoever is coming 1020 00:56:56,920 --> 00:56:59,320 in in some sense. But then the discourse and 1021 00:56:59,320 --> 00:57:02,760 discussion, now I'm out of it and it's everyone there 1022 00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:05,480 colliding with one another. What do you want to leave behind 1023 00:57:05,480 --> 00:57:08,640 on, on a topic of one another? And then that final step of 1024 00:57:08,640 --> 00:57:12,240 revision is, you know, like, do you take feedback well, do you 1025 00:57:12,400 --> 00:57:16,360 or do you reject it outright? And so there's three things are 1026 00:57:16,360 --> 00:57:19,720 are kind of the separate rubrics, if you will, of what 1027 00:57:19,720 --> 00:57:22,520 everyone is looking at. And there are three masks that 1028 00:57:22,520 --> 00:57:25,480 represent creation, destruction and balance. 1029 00:57:25,480 --> 00:57:28,200 So observation, discussion and revision. 1030 00:57:28,600 --> 00:57:33,000 And it's one extra mask that is given to each of the three, but 1031 00:57:33,120 --> 00:57:36,240 everyone has their masks revealed and chosen at the same 1032 00:57:36,240 --> 00:57:37,440 time. Got it. 1033 00:57:37,760 --> 00:57:39,720 Well that this is super insightful, especially for me. 1034 00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:41,880 I could disclosure I'll be playing for the first time and 1035 00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:45,320 I'm incredibly excited and now I have a better idea about how 1036 00:57:45,320 --> 00:57:47,160 this is going to work. I'm curious for you on a 1037 00:57:47,160 --> 00:57:49,960 personal level, how stressful is this? 1038 00:57:49,960 --> 00:57:52,800 Like what what parts of the next couple weeks are are like the 1039 00:57:52,800 --> 00:57:57,360 most stressful or are you you just love it and just deep and 1040 00:57:57,840 --> 00:58:01,360 enjoying every second I. I do love all of it. 1041 00:58:01,560 --> 00:58:04,360 Like I wouldn't do it if I I didn't enjoy it. 1042 00:58:04,360 --> 00:58:07,880 But yeah, I mean, look, it's, it's been a long roll out 1043 00:58:07,880 --> 00:58:11,480 already. We, we try to pace it in a way 1044 00:58:11,480 --> 00:58:14,920 where there's kind of moments of extreme activity and exertion 1045 00:58:14,920 --> 00:58:16,320 and then a little bit of breathing room. 1046 00:58:16,320 --> 00:58:22,080 So it's not just all the time, but today we get to the end of 1047 00:58:22,080 --> 00:58:24,720 the, the public drawing phase, which is like we're kind of out 1048 00:58:24,720 --> 00:58:29,200 of the zone of anything to do with the sale or anything to do 1049 00:58:29,200 --> 00:58:31,680 with who is or isn't in the thing. 1050 00:58:32,680 --> 00:58:35,440 And tomorrow we get to go into, you know, the, the core 1051 00:58:35,440 --> 00:58:39,880 experience that we are creating. And so for me, like all of the 1052 00:58:39,960 --> 00:58:46,720 the preamble, a lot of that centers around slowly trickling 1053 00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:49,920 out information so that it's not overwhelming. 1054 00:58:50,760 --> 00:58:58,320 And to almost create a filter of people who are curious and 1055 00:58:58,320 --> 00:59:02,520 interested and want to take a leap and are comfortable with 1056 00:59:02,520 --> 00:59:04,640 the oddities and opacities around this. 1057 00:59:04,640 --> 00:59:09,000 That like some of the years spent building all this is they 1058 00:59:09,000 --> 00:59:11,920 don't need to necessarily follow every single step that I've 1059 00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:14,480 done. But through like consensus among 1060 00:59:14,480 --> 00:59:17,600 friends or anything like that, that that final group of people 1061 00:59:17,600 --> 00:59:21,280 that comes into this are people that are like they're down like 1062 00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:25,520 they're they they they recognize the absurdity of making arts to 1063 00:59:25,520 --> 00:59:29,880 begin with, doing it on chain, doing it all together like this. 1064 00:59:29,920 --> 00:59:34,320 And they're willing to dive all the way in and not kind of 1065 00:59:34,600 --> 00:59:36,920 sideline or side eye the whole thing. 1066 00:59:36,920 --> 00:59:41,280 And so the the slow dole out has kind of created a a beautiful 1067 00:59:41,280 --> 00:59:43,840 crew of people. Like I, I think the guess list 1068 00:59:43,840 --> 00:59:49,000 will make itself apparent to people at the close after it's 1069 00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:52,320 done. But it like genuinely warms my 1070 00:59:52,320 --> 00:59:56,880 heart to see like people that I have seen tiniest glimmers of or 1071 00:59:56,880 --> 00:59:59,480 just like new with like the fragment of a name for three 1072 00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:01,800 years. Like we've said hello or shook 1073 01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:04,760 hands at like 1 random event two years ago and now suddenly 1074 01:00:04,760 --> 01:00:07,280 they're in this and that you have like the high and the low 1075 01:00:07,280 --> 01:00:09,280 of all of this. You have someone that randomly 1076 01:00:09,280 --> 01:00:13,280 bought Ethereum like. I don't know, six years ago and 1077 01:00:13,280 --> 01:00:15,880 has five followers and a milady PFP. 1078 01:00:16,080 --> 01:00:18,640 And then you also have like billionaire art collectors from 1079 01:00:18,640 --> 01:00:20,080 the traditional art world like that. 1080 01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:21,520 They're all in the commonplace space. 1081 01:00:21,520 --> 01:00:25,280 It's very interesting to me. I I enjoy that kind of like 1082 01:00:25,560 --> 01:00:33,040 folding in of of spaces. It's incredible, Sam. 1083 01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:34,680 I know we're overtime. I want to be conscious of your 1084 01:00:34,680 --> 01:00:37,600 time because you're a busy man. I guess maybe one last question 1085 01:00:37,880 --> 01:00:41,920 here is what would you tell someone who's interested that 1086 01:00:42,080 --> 01:00:44,840 they've seen they're they're starting to see the masquerade, 1087 01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:47,880 they don't have a mask. If they want to learn more about 1088 01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:51,360 the ecosystem and figure out how how to join, what should they do 1089 01:00:51,480 --> 01:00:54,160 over the coming weeks? Sure. 1090 01:00:54,160 --> 01:00:58,040 So until 6:00 PM today, there's a public drawing for the 1091 01:00:58,040 --> 01:01:01,080 remaining 68 masks. So it's a collection of 6/13. 1092 01:01:01,080 --> 01:01:04,320 All the others are accounted for based on decisions that players 1093 01:01:04,320 --> 01:01:06,400 have made. This is that final pool. 1094 01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:09,640 I don't know the number of entries we're out. 1095 01:01:09,800 --> 01:01:13,320 I think it's like 405 hundred, something like that so far. 1096 01:01:14,600 --> 01:01:18,720 And you can try to get in through that method. 1097 01:01:19,240 --> 01:01:23,480 And if you're able to, you'll find out at 6:00 PM whether or 1098 01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:25,160 not you're you're kind of in or out. 1099 01:01:25,960 --> 01:01:31,400 But I guess what I'd also say is like seeing like the number of 1100 01:01:31,400 --> 01:01:36,640 entries versus what's available for me, the intent of keeping 1101 01:01:36,640 --> 01:01:40,480 the collection size, what it is and not making something that is 1102 01:01:40,480 --> 01:01:45,800 like 1005 thousand 10,000 is like very explicit is that's a, 1103 01:01:45,840 --> 01:01:48,040 that's a lot of people, It's a lot of responsibility. 1104 01:01:48,040 --> 01:01:51,360 It's a it's a lot it it's sure, it's way more money that could 1105 01:01:51,360 --> 01:01:53,960 be made or anything like that. I don't really care about that 1106 01:01:53,960 --> 01:01:56,280 so much. Like I would rather leave that 1107 01:01:56,280 --> 01:02:00,400 on the table for others to get to try to figure out how to do 1108 01:02:00,400 --> 01:02:02,880 my next thing later. Like that's, you know, this is 1109 01:02:02,920 --> 01:02:06,240 more than enough. We have a blessed life, but the 1110 01:02:06,360 --> 01:02:12,000 the people that are in tomorrow, you'll begin that process of 1111 01:02:12,000 --> 01:02:16,600 observation, discussion and revision and then at the close, 1112 01:02:17,920 --> 01:02:21,720 all of the secondary will open and now all of the masks that 1113 01:02:21,720 --> 01:02:24,440 everyone has received. If anyone doesn't, you know, 1114 01:02:24,440 --> 01:02:28,560 they're, let's be real, like there are some people that I've 1115 01:02:28,560 --> 01:02:30,480 gotten it. They may not, Maybe they don't 1116 01:02:30,480 --> 01:02:31,960 like the mask I gave them, right? 1117 01:02:32,520 --> 01:02:34,440 There's always that. Maybe they want a different 1118 01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:35,920 mask. There's a million things that 1119 01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:39,120 could motivate that behavior is they'll start swapping at the 1120 01:02:39,120 --> 01:02:40,920 end of all this. We've also built the whole 1121 01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:44,120 secondary market with a new royalty structure that I created 1122 01:02:44,120 --> 01:02:48,160 as well, which we probably don't have time to get into. 1123 01:02:48,160 --> 01:02:54,160 But nonetheless, a big part of the way I wanted to think about 1124 01:02:54,160 --> 01:02:59,600 the masks is when a player left an observation on the monument 1125 01:02:59,600 --> 01:03:02,760 game. Some of those ones that maybe 1126 01:03:02,760 --> 01:03:06,200 like hit a liquidity crisis over the year and had to sell it. 1127 01:03:06,640 --> 01:03:08,560 They are actually kind of bummed about it. 1128 01:03:08,560 --> 01:03:10,840 Like there was a personal nature to it. 1129 01:03:10,840 --> 01:03:13,480 But at the end of the day, like, I don't know, there's even like 1130 01:03:13,480 --> 01:03:17,080 people I know who you know, that selling their player, they were 1131 01:03:17,080 --> 01:03:19,200 able to build something very cool in their life. 1132 01:03:19,320 --> 01:03:22,000 And so I, you know, it's, I don't fault him or, or anything 1133 01:03:22,000 --> 01:03:24,040 like that, but it did make me curious. 1134 01:03:24,040 --> 01:03:28,760 Like is there some way to think about the future beyond the 1135 01:03:28,760 --> 01:03:30,600 initial iteration of the mass grade? 1136 01:03:30,920 --> 01:03:35,160 Where should these change hands? Is there a way for someone to 1137 01:03:35,160 --> 01:03:37,960 come back in? And so even if this version of 1138 01:03:37,960 --> 01:03:41,520 it, the 613 and what every, the guest list is set here. 1139 01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:45,720 If you are not part of that, I just recommend to keep an eye on 1140 01:03:45,720 --> 01:03:48,000 the future because we, we've accounted for that. 1141 01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:51,240 And later this year, we have a a rather beautiful thing that I'm 1142 01:03:51,600 --> 01:03:53,480 very excited to share with people, but it's like a little 1143 01:03:53,480 --> 01:03:55,600 bit too early and there's plenty of other things to talk about. 1144 01:03:56,200 --> 01:03:58,160 Yes, sounds sounds like a spoiler there. 1145 01:04:01,720 --> 01:04:04,760 Well, this has been incredible. Sam, I, I know you are 1146 01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:06,960 incredibly busy. I guess maybe just any final 1147 01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:09,680 words you want to leave listeners, your collectors with 1148 01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:11,240 ahead of the games about to begin? 1149 01:04:12,320 --> 01:04:16,480 Just that like Rachel, my wife and I are just like so insanely 1150 01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:19,840 appreciative. Like it's it, it means an insane 1151 01:04:19,840 --> 01:04:22,400 amount to us to have this kind of support. 1152 01:04:22,400 --> 01:04:25,080 Like we're, we're cognizant of how crazy it is out there. 1153 01:04:25,080 --> 01:04:28,120 And like we have a number of friends that got hit very hard 1154 01:04:28,120 --> 01:04:29,920 during like market downturn and everything. 1155 01:04:29,920 --> 01:04:33,480 And sort of like have people galvanized around this in some 1156 01:04:33,480 --> 01:04:37,280 sense and be ready to kind of like dip out of their own 1157 01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:40,520 patterns and trading and whatever to try this. 1158 01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:43,720 And like, even though it'd be like you got a kid, you building 1159 01:04:43,720 --> 01:04:46,600 a little empire over there, you taking the time to like go 1160 01:04:46,600 --> 01:04:49,960 through and read these observations and like where that 1161 01:04:49,960 --> 01:04:54,360 role within this, like it is, it is an insane privilege that I, I 1162 01:04:54,360 --> 01:04:56,640 do not take for granted. And it means quite a lot to me. 1163 01:04:56,640 --> 01:04:59,000 Well. Love to hear that. 1164 01:04:59,120 --> 01:05:01,080 And Obie, how are you feeling, you know, ahead of 1165 01:05:01,080 --> 01:05:03,560 deliberations? Yeah, I'm excited to that. 1166 01:05:03,560 --> 01:05:07,640 Unfortunately, I'm I've missed just be it my luck. 1167 01:05:07,640 --> 01:05:09,520 I'm not really the luckiest person in the world, but I've 1168 01:05:09,520 --> 01:05:13,160 missed the in person council meetings that are famously held 1169 01:05:13,160 --> 01:05:16,640 in in New York where various come like activities occur, 1170 01:05:16,640 --> 01:05:18,440 which seems to involve killing Benny each time. 1171 01:05:21,400 --> 01:05:22,720 I've missed the previous ones. Hopefully. 1172 01:05:22,720 --> 01:05:26,800 I'd love to make it out to it to one of the ones that coming up 1173 01:05:26,800 --> 01:05:27,760 this year. But yeah, it's cool. 1174 01:05:27,760 --> 01:05:31,640 Like it's really cool. I bought my skull probably about 1175 01:05:31,640 --> 01:05:34,160 a year and a half ago now. I think it was in 2023 I 1176 01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:36,440 believe. But it's really cool. 1177 01:05:36,440 --> 01:05:38,320 Like I love being part of something like this because it's 1178 01:05:38,320 --> 01:05:41,800 just like it gets so engrossed in like, oh, looking at charts, 1179 01:05:41,800 --> 01:05:44,080 numbers or all this stuff and then suddenly it's like like, 1180 01:05:45,040 --> 01:05:47,400 you know, Masquerade, I can just finally, like, it's like a 1181 01:05:47,400 --> 01:05:49,160 release for my mind where it's like, ah, this is actually 1182 01:05:49,160 --> 01:05:52,520 something fun that I can sit down and just think like use a 1183 01:05:52,520 --> 01:05:55,840 different parts of my brain that I'm not using every single day 1184 01:05:55,840 --> 01:05:59,680 to actually really just appreciate some good art, to be 1185 01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:01,440 honest with you. Like, I think that's for me, 1186 01:06:01,440 --> 01:06:03,720 that's what it always comes down and boils down to. 1187 01:06:05,320 --> 01:06:06,640 So I'm really excited to see how this works. 1188 01:06:06,640 --> 01:06:11,720 This is definitely a each iteration of this story ends up 1189 01:06:11,720 --> 01:06:13,760 being a larger scale than the previous one. 1190 01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:17,040 And this is, you know, the monument game was huge, but this 1191 01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:19,960 is like another level. So I'm, I'm very curious to see 1192 01:06:19,960 --> 01:06:23,600 how it all pans out. And yeah, excited to to, to play 1193 01:06:23,600 --> 01:06:25,280 a part in the deliberations for sure. 1194 01:06:25,920 --> 01:06:28,600 Yeah, and, and I agree, I'm a huge fan of your work. 1195 01:06:28,640 --> 01:06:32,200 I I think these, these last few, one of ones, they keep getting 1196 01:06:32,200 --> 01:06:33,520 better. I think there's some of the best 1197 01:06:33,520 --> 01:06:36,400 digital art we've been blessed with in in this space. 1198 01:06:37,480 --> 01:06:41,080 I think you're on my my Mount Rushmore, a digital artist, Sam. 1199 01:06:41,080 --> 01:06:43,440 So very impressive. I'm very excited to be be 1200 01:06:43,440 --> 01:06:47,840 following and participating in this game and reporting on it as 1201 01:06:47,840 --> 01:06:50,480 well. So wish you the the best of luck 1202 01:06:51,520 --> 01:06:52,880 and we'll be excited to let this play out. 1203 01:06:53,440 --> 01:06:55,680 Thank you so much. Appreciate it, guys. 1204 01:06:55,800 --> 01:07:00,720 Take care, K Sam. All right folks, we, we went 1205 01:07:00,720 --> 01:07:05,040 over, but it was well worth that getting to hear in detail from 1206 01:07:05,040 --> 01:07:07,720 from Sam everything the masquerade. 1207 01:07:07,720 --> 01:07:11,800 So I'm excited for this one. This is going to be a fun few 1208 01:07:11,800 --> 01:07:13,360 weeks. It kicks off here. 1209 01:07:13,560 --> 01:07:18,000 Yeah, really. Today the drawing ends, then the 1210 01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:19,520 21st. So tomorrow is when the party 1211 01:07:19,520 --> 01:07:22,080 starts. So get ready to party. 1212 01:07:22,080 --> 01:07:26,320 As for today, we are going to end two days show there. 1213 01:07:26,320 --> 01:07:29,200 Want to thank our listeners, want to thank our partners. 1214 01:07:29,200 --> 01:07:31,680 Want to thank Sam, of course, for coming on an ovie for taking 1215 01:07:31,680 --> 01:07:33,760 time out. This has been a fun show. 1216 01:07:33,760 --> 01:07:36,520 We'll be back tomorrow at 10:00 AM Eastern to close was out the 1217 01:07:36,520 --> 01:07:38,280 week. Till then, go make it a great 1218 01:07:38,280 --> 01:07:39,080 day. Goodbye.