Yo-yo, yo-yo, yo, what up? What up?
Good morning. Good morning, G MG.
He Wednesday, September 27th. I got it right 2023.
Look at that. Another beautiful day to have a
beautiful day. I got my Co hosts in the house.
Ohh Seth AKA Mr No Wi-Fi. What's up man?
How you doing today? No Wi-Fi No.
I see no. Yeah, back in London tomorrow.
So hell yeah. I hear we're going.
I hear we're golfing. Next week?
Yeah.
Let's go, let's go, let's go. My other co-host, Mando.
Mando, how you doing this morning?
Doing good, man. Doing good in the tropical
island of Videira today. So.
Bit of a holiday. It's a beautiful day.
To have a beautiful day, Madeira, that's great.
I have also changed locations. I have also changed location.
I'm in London. I'm in London.
Looks like we're like running after each other.
Like missed, Like it's like we're not like, swapping out
spots in there. Neither of us are right.
It's like a weird thing when I'm but but but but it sounds it
sounds it sounds like we'll be together starting Monday.
So I cannot wait. I cannot wait.
You know I fixed my issue. Ovi also texted Meadows You have
to take me working out you know all these in like full like
Rocky Balboa mode and shit like he's gonna do crazy.
So all my workouts in got my workouts in I get my golfing
with my boy and and then we're gonna see.
I mean listen I I hope I hope your your your father-in-law is
ready for that smoke. You know let me know if he's
like way better than us so I don't get sharked on the course.
Because you know like the gamble but should be it should be a fun
time. But anyways, anyways, anyways
I'm gonna go quick here because today on the show, today today
we have a stacked stacked stacked our coming up for you.
Also can crypto obviously market report as usual gonna get
through the market. OK crypto rally while stocks are
puking. That's topic number one.
Topic number 2 will go through Biden's foot.
Yeah. It's like I see.
Yes. You know what forget that.
Like Catholic Church. Like we didn't finance like most
of the show or something, right. Maybe I shouldn't say that today
we have Jesse on anyways. Binance wide and Gesler
testifies in front of the House of.
I don't know why but we'll talk about this in a minute.
Pudgy Penguins. Pudgy Penguins, man.
Well, the fibre good in NFT line today actually in general.
I love that. Well maybe we'll talk about this
a little bit but pudgy Penguins in 2000 Walmarts fun fact that's
like 40% of all Walmarts in America.
It's pretty wild. It's like 4000 something stores
so crushed it. Of course you've seen after we
had a bunch but it I think Ovie has I think Mando everybody's
tweeting about this in a positive light which is great.
This is good. This is going to all rallied
together especially with this with with this algorithm and put
that forth and what's happening Pudgy Penguins then and then
Xbox. Xbox.
Yeah they may enable crypto we saw that in the in the league.
But guess who won't JP Morgan won't back anyways they might
miss out on that one. And the last but not least, we
will be joined by Jesse Pollack, contributor number 001 of BASE.
OK, pretty much the creator of base right?
Where you know we talk about friend tech every single day
where yeah that's also built fun stuff.
Whoop. We're gonna have a lot of fun
stuff to to jam about today on the show.
So hang tight. Gave your boys a retweet.
Give your boss a follow If you're on YouTube give your boys
a subscribe a like a comment and everything else to get
algorithms going and then without.
And then last but not least, of course this show is powered by
cracking. So go to kraken.com cracking
NFT, but go cracking.com/rug radio RUGRADIO to find out more
about what they are up twos anyways.
Anyways. Anyways, it is where we get this
going for topic number one for the market report, but also can
crypto rally while the stocks are puking solving random what's
happened? What's happened in this market
land? Yeah, it's a bit strange because
it seems to be developing as this show goes on, and the
answer to that is no. We had an overnight rally in
Ethan and Crypto Bitcoin. I think Bitcoin nearly hit. 27,
OK. I think I've got about 16301640
area and then kind of in the last hour has like puked about 3
or 4% lower. Don't really see any headlines
there other than Gensler right now is testifying.
So there may be some headlines around that, but yesterday was a
really weekday macro. So, and this has been building
for the last few weeks, the SMPS headed back to its 200 day
moving average around 4200. I think doctor down about 7%
since the Fed took out its recession talk in July.
So it's been a really, really soft period for macro in general
and it just intensified. Yesterday stocks were down about
2%. A lot of the major tech stocks
like Apple, NVIDIA rule quite a bit lower.
So just a really bad sentiment at the time.
Crypto didn't really move. Bitcoin kind of still held about
26 K kind of held around. UM 1590 at the time, and it felt
as though today we might see a bit of a rally because stocks
have opened slightly higher today.
Or at least marginally higher on things like the NASDAQ that
they're kind of flat on the Dow and we just haven't been able to
hold on to the gains that we had this morning.
So it was a bit of a pump and then seemingly as always become
deflated over the last few minutes, probably with what
Kenzo has been saying in front of the house.
That was a crazy chart if you ask me.
Look at this market is unpredictable anymore as a third
party here. Like just watching and listen to
you guys everyday I'm looking at this.
I'm like holy like. I missed that.
Ohh yeah. Yeah, that.
Yeah, that was the power cut dump right there.
Like it basically happened as I was coming onto the show.
I think when I was when I was on my way from the airport, it was
like 1620 area, 1625 and then as we came on it just kind of gave
up another 2% or so. So whatever the rally was last
night has been has basically been eradicated.
I mean, it's not, we're not in a bad situation.
Crypto still massively outperformed stocks, but the
idea that we could rally while stocks were going lower seems
like. That has been put to bed.
That move right there. It's funny because you had that
that topic going before you saw The Nuke and then he came on the
three studios. Like, wait, wait, that's not
working out pretty well for us. What's Gary saying?
What's happening?
Does anyone has is there like is one word on it?
His comments were pre released, so you actually got the
statement yesterday and he yesterday evening and he
basically said that we needed more compliance from the crypto
firms. Nothing he hasn't said before,
just generic Gary Fudd, let's just put it to that box.
Interestingly, 4 of the senators that put forward, and actually I
think they're just Congressman actually, but they put forward a
motion yesterday basically saying that.
Like, Gary got to approve these ETFs and within hours he then
delayed the RTF. Those all those representatives
there are actually grilling him today.
So I was hoping for a bit more of a grilling today from the
people that have been vocal critics of him.
But we haven't really seen that. There's been various other like
fun pieces overnight, but none of it seemed to stick.
So I don't really know what over the last few minutes caused this
dump, but maybe it's something that he's saying.
I'm haven't really been following notifications on for a
bunch of these guys and I haven't seen anything just yet.
So it'll probably come out at some point during the show and
and we'll figure it out but I'm not seeing much anything much
and I'm assuming same for you Ovie.
But because you had your Internet cut and everything but
there's just a tweet from 4414 minutes ago but the dump started
like 45 ish but it says SEC would have about 8% of staff
working in shutdown says Gensler.
SEC has taken feedback into account and rulemakings per
Gensler again, but there's nothing else because that Walter
Bloomberg is usually like on top of it with all these.
But there's. It just feels like it's just
liquidity games maybe it's like this feels like there was no
news to take it higher and then we've just gone straight back to
where we were. Yesterday, which is still a big
outperformance, but yeah, it's just.
It's interesting because you know that really is the ARC ETF.
That has a earlier final deadline date than all the other
ETF. The deadline for that is
actually the 10th of January. So was the delay just like a
random delay or was the delay because this yesterday was the
deadline for them to come up with like an interim deadline
for this with the decision? I I'm not sure I know have some
headlines in October, right there are.
All the all the all the main like Black Rock Fidelity et
cetera that all 17 Clover. But they're they're later in the
cycle. The ARK ETF is, you're right, is
is by, is by two months ahead. Yeah.
So on 11/11 was a third deadline which they've already decided to
push and the last deadline is on is on on January.
January So they What do they push?
They pushed 1111, yeah, they pushed 1111 and they already
pushed up with the I shares one, right Mando I think, I think was
one of them. No, they have no issues with
that. One, yeah, they haven't
published it yet. It was strange.
People don't know why they pushed that one first because
obviously there are other deadlines ahead of that and like
Kathy and a number of other people have been saying, they
expect several of them to be approved at the same time.
So either they're screwing ARC here and allowing all the others
to get approval, or they it may be a strange scenario where.
Black Rock inside. Job, yeah, maybe.
Who knows like part of this is related to the government
shutdown as you just said as I said if that goes ahead and.
There was a a deal, I think put forward by McCarthy yesterday,
which makes it more likely that they may be able to strike a
deal before the end of the week. But if there is a government
shutdown that's really gonna affect the SEC.
They're gonna have staff working.
So 92% of the staff, but there there were 10.
People, let's be honest, if you were in office and there's only
8% of people there, no, nothing's getting done.
Literally nothing is getting done.
And that's 4200 employees, bro. What's 88% of of 4200?
4200 * 100 like from that. What is this is this is a lot,
you know. It's not a lot of employees
left, but still quite a bit. Enough to fight crypto?
There's no way. There's no way anything gets
done for a while. I don't know how long government
shutdown would last, but it would probably delay all those
decisions as well, just from an admin perspective.
But yeah, if the answer to the question can crypto rally while
stocks puke, it doesn't look like they can, but it does look
like they can outperform for now.
OK, well that's good. That's good enough.
Yeah, good point. On the ETF side, Ohh, because I
I thought yes it was some two of them were already delayed and I
thought maybe they're going ahead and delaying ahead of the
government shutdown cause like September, October is around the
corner, like it's this October is Sunday right or Saturday
forgot which day. But Sunday.
Yeah, Sunday, right? So I figured maybe, like, he's
like, hey, let me front run these crypto Bros and, like,
ruin their October. But whether they know October
has that prefix for a reason, Gary.
Anyways, with that being said, with with that being said, a
topic number two of the day, yes.
Speaking of Gary Gaz, I mean he's testifying.
I don't think we have much to say on that front yet, but there
is more Binance FUD going around Mando as the CEO of Binance Fund
reports. Milo, why did you tell me?
I just feel like you're so good at the Binance stuff.
Like you're honestly just like an expert in Binance.
Remember when like used to be my go to medic guy for a moment and
even like down three months later I ask you about Matic and
like, why are you sending me about Matic?
I feel like I'm just gonna be asking you about Binance for
next years. So by the way, I saw some stuff,
but Russia, blah, blah, blah. So tell us, give us a TLDR here.
This this was just a new article by the Wall Street Journal, who
generally are pretty close and and seem to have good sources at
various different places, but basically saying that the
Department of Justice is yet to finish its investigation into
violence. There have been some talks that
had already happened, but that it is highly likely that the end
of this will be fines for CZ and for Binance, and most probably
some sort of criminal charges for both of them.
Um, so. It's kind of a preemptive thing,
this is. Maybe unsurprising.
I think many people were expecting maybe fines over
criminal charges, or maybe the fines would absolve them from
some of their criminal charges. So let's wait to see.
But. And CD came out and basically
did a four tweet. And yeah, like a bit of like war
words between him and the Wall Street Journal there for a
little bit. But yeah, I think you have to
expect that that's coming. Like you have to expect there's
gonna be some form of charges against CZ coming very shortly,
would expect in the next weeks or months.
Maybe that's why this is selling off right now.
Maybe we're gonna get it today. But I yeah, right Before shuts
down. Right.
Let's go give it. I rather it's all come at once.
You know when it rains it pours. I'm used to this in life.
So if you could just just, you know pour it out right.
Just like I did with the milk. You know, like just like just
one one go and that way we can see what's going on.
Look that that WSJ headline is not great like I we don't like
to hear it. Right.
And they said like every situation door is do or die,
apparently. According to the cofounder.
However, the tweet that you LinkedIn your minutes this
morning does say that there's nothing new that was revealed,
right? It said the Wall Street Journal
article does not contain any new information, nor does it reveal
any progression in in DOJ's negotiations with Binance.
So that's that's for that. I guess it's just shedding
light, more light because it's good to flood it almost.
Exactly. It's It's kind of annoying at
the moment because you just feel like a lot of this stuff is
going on behind closed doors and I'd rather just get it out
there. And we're having to hear about
this from a Wall Street Journal article, which seems a bit.
Ridiculous. But yeah, I expect we will
hopefully hear a resolution on that relatively soon.
OK, perfect. Finance basically sold.
It's sold disruption operations to itself today.
Yeah. So that may be itself, right?
Well, it it sold it to some random exchange comments ever
heard of. And then Comex seems to have
exactly the same UI UX as finance.
It looks exactly the same. They work in the same building,
the same address, bro. They work in the same building.
So yeah, that's that looks dodgy, but rushes where a lot of
the money laundering stuff that people have been.
Have had they gotten for his his from undisclosed amount.
The Twitter for comics was created in 2023.
Just all sorts of funny things. I saw it this morning and
obviously I texted to you guys first because I figured you
would you would talk about it today but I just thought it was
funny. So it's I guess we'll see we'll
see what happens on the Binance front with regards to that.
But you know best of luck and and and we'll see where where we
go next with that anyways. But on better side in the news
right now we're not going to talk about Marquis Bugatti.
We're not going to talk about food or whatever.
And as a matter of fact for a rare time in a long time we got
some really I like personal opinion And then you guys said
what you think some very positive news coming out of the
NFT space as Pudgy Penguins CEO Luca Netz announced that the
brand Pudgy Penguins debuted its toy collection in 2000 Walmart
stores. Each tour provides access to
Pudgy World, a multiplayer digital social experience which
could help improve visibility and users of the Pudgy brand.
And so in a very well written thread yesterday with videos and
whatnot, we got the whole rundown of like what the Pudgy
world is. And you know, Brave New World
was obviously like the big thing.
Actually, it's funny because in your guests like mine, you talk
about a metaverse, A Metaverse. You could argue that if it's not
a metaverse, it's kind of a game.
Like it feels like they're kind of bringing Club Penguin back
with Brave New World, like the that that was the other news,
right? Aside from the, from the, from
the toys in Walmart. So that was pretty cool.
But 2000 Walmarts, I mean, that's significant.
We knew for a fact that he had made multiple trips look to
Arkansas, so Arkansas at Walmart is based so something like that,
multiple trips there. He posted screenshots of like
selfies there already months ago but it looks like in just under
a year. I mean looking at scheme, it was
with the Collective. They acquired the pudgy Penguin
brand for two and a half million dollars and what was like an
iconic back and forth tweet between himself and Beanie at
the time. Like Beanie was like I'll give
500 E to to what was his name Cole to buy the pudgies.
He came out and there was like 700 and 50th.
Remember when 750 ETH was two and a half million by the way.
And so and shit I just realised that but anyways and that's when
that collective acquired the pudgy Penguins would then you
saw the $9 million raise announcement from one KX.
I not sure the the the the the valuation was disclosed but I'm
assuming in the 30s between 30 to 50 if I you know if I'm right
or wrong, I don't know. And then of course then you saw
this massive news. I like to think that this is the
first time this year or one of the first times that we saw.
I don't consider his marketing hype because all marketing this,
what marketing's purpose is, right?
Like are we not allowed to like market anymore right in the
space. So I do think he was marketing
properly. But I do think that the hype
that the marketing created was met and we saw that this is a
positive reaction on the market. We saw Cyrus tweeted that there
was a lot, a couple of sweeps by a big wallet that was not a
farmer and a few other people that started buying up buggies.
And the general sentiment, it seems I've got a really good
positive general sentiment around NFT's in general.
A lot of founders came out. I know you guys tweeted.
I perceived Twitter but also founders other collections came
out to to applaud looking at and his and and his team of course
on on delivering on on on the news number of new world.
So curious about you guys, so actually I'll go with Mando 1st
and Ovi. But first question is what do
you, what do you think of this news for the NFT space in
general? But second question is do you do
you believe that the expectations were met?
In the meantime, I am going to bring P Somerset, Chief Officer
at at Pudgy Penguins on stage on on Twitter.
But Amanda, what are your thoughts here?
I mean, I think it's great. I think it's great.
I think he teased this before, right?
I remember him being at the Walmart offices and I remember
seeing that and. But yeah, I think this is, this
is big. It's kind of doing it a
different way, maybe a bit more of a sustainable way in my
opinion than most other NFT projects.
Like when we talk about other NFT projects, it's like this.
Right. We think there's going to be
some parabolic, UM, IP player where you get air drop stuff.
Pages is not doing it that way. They're gonna try and build a
consumer products business, mainly around toys but also
clothing and then that's going to be a very strong foundation
and then the NFTS are gonna be the IP play of that.
So in some ways it's less parabolic.
So like projects didn't do like a 5X yesterday sometimes.
Also the market. It's part of the market too, but
I think it's also because people recognise this is more about
building a business than like, right, We're gonna get royalties
from this, we're gonna get some coin, AirDrop or something like
that. It doesn't lead to the parabolic
style increases, but I think this is awesome.
I think we're building a really, really, really strong foundation
for the business. I think you can be safely say
that Project Penguin is going to be around for a long, long, long
long time. With the way they've set up like
it's building themselves to be a brand for the future and that's
very, very important for a lot of these NFTS companies, which
the vast majority are just burning cash and we'll just, I
don't know, I think they have a lot of trouble.
And yeah, I think there's a good chance that that.
Probably one of the best chances that this IP can become some
sort of a a recognised brand, and I think that's kind of what
a lot of people sold the dream for, but very, very few went to
try and do it. So he's doing what I think a lot
of other people said they were gonna do, and he's actually gone
out and done it. So I think it's awesome.
I didn't really understand the fraud or like why there was even
any FOD yesterday, but nothing was like it was like fun.
It was always people sceptical. I think there's people liked,
yeah people just trying to poke holes and whatever.
But overall percent love like honestly it was a lot of
positivity on the timeline even in chats and stuff.
I think it was cool. You know what It's actually much
more than that. So first of all in the market
standpoint pudgies hit five Ethan pre pre thing, they
weren't at 5 and so I was so contingent.
So they're up 7% in 24 hours, which is wow, like you have a
collection that pumped after announcement and the last time
you guys saw that it was crazy and so you love to see that.
But part of the announcement, like of course it was a Pudgy
toys, which of course like a lot of people are saying about
royalties. Well, if you licence your Pudgy
Penguin out for that's being sold at Walmart and know for a
fact he's working on a programme because he's talked about this
in the Nitro ones like to see how people can licence to them,
blah blah, which is really cool. Right.
So it's not a third party licencing, the actual project
licence things from its own, you know, holders, which I love.
So it's a reshare there. I love the fact that there's a
collaboration with multiple projects so you can find like a
Kempi panda hoodie, A sappy seals trade.
Soon there's A creeps, there's D guards, there's youths, there's
a bunch of others that I love. So Lucas like trying to put
other people on something he's always talked about.
And another thing is the Zika sink link here.
It seems like there are tech partner for all the L2 solutions
and what they're building now in a tech perspective.
That's ZK sync. And that's not like to just be
glossed over in my opinion. It's it says in the tweet here,
he says. It's actually in the last one.
One of them, he goes, Each toy comes the QR code that unlocks
digital traits which can be redeemed in our digital social
experience. Pudgy World at pudgyworld.com,
now powered by ZK Sync by buyers can digitally collect and
connect with friends for nothing more than the purchase of a toy.
So there is much more than meets the eye here.
Like the I feel like the Walmart thing is cool.
It's fired by he's going to have huge Christmas that that company
set. Now they can tell his toilet is
so cute. Like everybody loves them and it
seems like they're left right front and centre of every
Walmart in America now. But the Zika singling for the
tech is big and I think it's pretty awesome.
But only I saw you tweet about about all this.
I mean what's your what's your general sentiment and and you
think you know is this does this meet your expectation over under
like how do you feel about everything.
I think, and I just tweeted this now as I was thinking about it
again, I think. What pudgy Penguins is on the
brink of doing is delivering value to the holders without
selling more NFTS. Yep, actually generating real
revenue and real cash flow without selling more NFTS,
sustainable revenues and cash flow.
And growing their IP and brand without selling more NFTS.
So like Luca by the way, who's like only 24 has out already
outperformed 95% probably more of most NFT project founders
because the thing that he's done that is very smart is he's
taken. The existing IP that could only
have been built within Web three and applied it to a sustainable
and reliable business model and now they're able to generate
real revenues with real partners and actually have a real
business. And I think one of the questions
that people are asking is. How does this benefit me as a
pudgy Penguins holder but look like if Pudgy Penguins as a toy
becomes this huge brand, this great big thing pudgy Penguins
the original NFT's will have value.
Like imagine if you could have imagine if Disney had released
all its characters as NFTS right when it started and you could
buy the original Mickey Mouse NFT's or I don't know like the
original Aladdin FT whatever it is they would be worth quite a
lot. They are they were are worth
quite a lot. Think about how much like first
edition Harry Potter books go for, right?
So I think that's how you. Need to perceive this like here,
he has an opportunity to. Build this great big brand
outside of the NFT space, which I think is what you have to do
if you want to become a big global brand because let's face
it, there's no one left in NFT's and he's done it the right way.
He's done it by not dumping on existing NFT holders.
And if you compare his movements and what he's done to someone
like Doodles, Doodles had the same ambition.
We're gonna, we're gonna be bigger than this we're gonna go
mainstream etcetera, etcetera. Well what do they do?
They just like dumped they they monetize, they raise money by
monetizing their holders and dumping more entities on them
and then they increase their supply to like.
There's hundreds of thousands. So then the whole thing died and
they actually lost. The loyalty of of their holders.
Luca hasn't done that. He they haven't actually sold
any NFP since he started and Country Penguins has
outperformed. The vast majority of projects
and it has one of the strongest followings and and loyalties out
there and and they're gonna crush it.
And this is like somebody this 2024 year old kid doing this and
it's not. I mean he's I don't take
anything away from him. He's very, very smart.
But what he's doing is not like rocket science and it's just
amazing that no one else has done this.
I think so. I think like, personally, I
think it's just like pretty incredible.
And I think you have to take your hats off and give credit
where it's due. And I think they just do it the
right way. I absolutely agree with every
single thing you say. I'm not going to double down on
this because we're we're we're on we're crunching on time.
I wanna go to people real quick. And I see Jesse Pollock in the
studio on YouTube. So if you're not on YouTube yet,
go to YouTube, look up rock radio.
You know how to spell that. I'm not gonna share the link and
get destroyed on my algorithm on X, but go and find us on YouTube
because I see Jesse in the Stew. I see Jessie.
So maybe like second or third best start in Web 3 because he's
got his point all up to like I did this morning.
But. And I'll bring him about people
real quick. Well, I mean you're chief memes
officer, but you Penguins, you one of the faces of the pudgy
Penguins. You know it's like you think
pudgy Penguins you think of of of PMC.
So like what are you what are you what is your quick thoughts
on on everything we're saying and did we miss anything out And
then you know obviously we'll we'll bring you back.
I'm already chatting to Luca to figure a time out for him to
come on the show and spend some time with us, but definitely go
to your. Quick Yeah, man.
Thanks for having me up. It's one of those things, right?
Like where if you're outward focused and you're not, you
know, I said a lot yesterday is like our bubble of like web
three people is like actually really small.
And one of the smart things Luca did was like when he first came
in was like. Hey, like we're gonna lift you
guys up by showing how great you are to the outward eye and so
like that's one thing you do with the toys.
So like we're in Vegas, not Vegas, but us San Diego Comic
Con. Like we had lines like 30-40
minutes long, people coming and getting our toys that had no
idea where NFT's they knew us from Giffy.
They knew us from Instagram. So the fact that, you know, he
came in with his marketing knowledge and said, alright,
hey, we need to build this thing, not for the small bubble
that we're in, but we need to lift that.
Level that we're in up by showing how great you guys are
to the outward eye. It's been awesome to see.
And so yesterday was really cool too because like normally when
I'm like I like to do is like Fight Club by meaning it and I
didn't have to do that because everybody else was like
everybody else in the space was attacking the club force was
pretty great. Listen this is a a collective
one I think I believe for the space and it's important I think
for for large forces to step up because it's easy to bash but
then you know there's nothing much left of it.
So anyways, P I'll let you know when we we all you'll probably
know what we managed to get Luke on his interview and I really
want to dive deeper into everything that you guys got
planned up so thank you for coming up quick.
But last but not least like I say we're gonna dish the JP
Morgan and the Xbox gaming topic and want to talk about it
tomorrow because that's a banger so gonna spend more time of it.
But we are joined by the hardest and to getting crypto.
Maybe maybe after Brian Armstrong where it's a Coinbase
thing. But Jesse Pollack the
contributor number 001 of base, creator of base, though he
doesn't have the highest friend tech key.
What's going on there? Exclaimed Jesse GM.
Good morning. How are you doing today?
Good morning, everyone. Doing great.
Can you hear me OK? Absolutely.
We can hear you perfectly. I see you on stage with this
glorious punk that you got going on on the Twitter space.
So we're out here. So one last reminder, If you're
on YouTube, yeah, you definitely want to be on because all four
of us are on here And. And one space also makes you
give it a retweet, but everything's recorded as usual.
Yada, yada, yada. So Jesse, I mean, wow.
It's been a minute since we chatted on stage at Vicon.
Yeah, that was good. The nation.
I think that was the 1st place where Unchained Summer started
to enter the public eye. That's exactly where I was
going. And so I was on stage with you
Vicon, which was great that you know last week just slid in and
I was sitting next to him and every time like what the FM I
supposed to say next, this guy was struggling.
This guy was shutting it down every time and he was handing me
the mic and like and what you're going to say but it was no base
yet right? Or not yet.
There was nothing that you were just starting to talk punching
someone. You dropped the bar and I will
start with that and everybody stopped thinking like 400 people
and it's pretty wild. But you said it's a builder
spring and Unchained summer, and this is where you really dropped
that bar and everybody stopped clapping everything you were
saying. And so I kind of want to start
with says how has this unchanged summer gone thus far?
And are we gonna see this unchanged summer continue and
spiral down towards the the, the fall and the winter?
Yeah I mean I think it's got I'm curious how do you think it's
gone. I mean I think it's done great.
I mean we talk about on chain activity on this show almost
every morning and we're obviously all we're we're all
see we're all on base we're all in front tech.
I think a couple of us at least minted the DK Motion artwork as
well and and played around I mean Mendel was like almost
about to become CEO of French at this stage him and Brett guy you
know and so and so you know we we we I think once in summer so
far has been incredible movement.
What do you think? Well, how is how is launching
Summer been for you so far? Yeah, it's been interesting.
I think it's been a long, a medium term friend.
Money's moved off exchanges and to self custody.
I think part of that is like long term holders often have
them. A lot of that like big bags and
like cold stories and all that sort of stuff.
But yeah, it's been interesting, like even for Coinbase itself to
go from being an exchange to kind of now being.
Being a a chain right like it's gonna be I think I saw the other
day it makes 202 hundred grand a week or is it like something
something very very high and I remember thinking.
People are gonna start now realising that Coinbase isn't
just an exchange anymore, it's it's it's gonna be more of an
infrastructure play than just than maybe some of the other
people in the space. Yeah.
Well, I think our feeling is that on chain summer went and
the whole on chain movement is going about as well as it could
be. When we were kind of working
towards the initial launch of base, we didn't really know what
to expect. Like we were kind of bringing
all the pieces together, trying to make sure that it landed in a
good way. But you never know whether
everyone's going to show up to the party like send out.
Lot of invites, a lot of people say yes, but then until that
moment where everything actually happens, you never know exactly
how it will play out. And you know we're now six weeks
later, there's more than half a billion dollars on base.
You're seeing it consistently be like #1, #2, #3 in transactions
per day. Like that for us is about as
good as it possibly could have gone.
And I think for us it just feels like you know one more kind of
step towards this cascade of on chain adoption that is starting
to come. And the the, the role that we
get to play is just making it easier for people to build,
making it easier for everyday people to actually use these
cool new products that are being built and doing everything we
possibly can to get a billion people on chain over the next
few years, Well, you definitely, well, a billion.
People he's he always comes in with the bars.
I told you guys, it's hard to, it's hard to follow Jesse.
How do you get people? On game like how like I know
they've been those sort of comments before.
I know CZ was always saying 100 million people, how we get 100
million people. You've kind of done a 10X on
that. So for me, I think some of the
main it's onboarding relation it's.
I guess even the tech like yeah. So how are you going to solve
that? Like how you gonna?
Get. Yeah, I think we basically think
about kind of like 3 big infrastructure unlocks.
The 1st is lower cost block space and so that's what we're
working on with space, right. It's how do we make it so every
transaction costs less than a cent.
We're not there yet, but we're down you know 100 X from what
ETH costs to the $0.10 range. And with 4844 and and Ding
sharding we we see a path to getting to sub 10 for
transaction costs. So we think that that's going to
be a huge one. The second one is better wallet
experiences. And this is kind of both on the
consumer wallet side, you know, and we're seeing, you know, a
tonne of incredible wallets continue to mature, whether it's
Coinbase wallet or Rainbow or family.
I think we've, we've come a long way in the last year.
But then also on the embedded wallet side, for instance, like
friend tech, people were just able to use friend tech, right.
They didn't have to worry about like setting up a crypto wallet
and doing this whole like separate user journey.
It was like, no, I want to use this app.
It just works. And so I think that that's kind
of the the second big thing where there's still more work to
do, but will be a big kind of. Enabler for bringing a billion
people on chain and then take the third one and this one's a
little, you know, earlier in its life cycle is really around
identity. I think that our one of our
thesis is that currently because of a lack of on chain identity
and the ability to know who people are are just kind of
indecency of that infrastructure.
A lot of products that people would want to use or could use
just aren't possible. You know, think about like a
credit card, right? Like in the off chain world.
That's the primary way most everyday people interact.
With lending and it's just not possible on chain today.
And so we think that kind of getting better identity tools is
going to be the third big unlock.
And so I'd say those are the three big infrastructure things
we're focused on. And then I think one of the
things that I really believe is, you know, I feel like all of us
are a little bit collectively traumatised by the last decade
of crypto where for the most part growth has been flat except
for these kind of spikes that have been driven by like
speculative mania. But if you look at like
traditional consumer products, right, you look at like TikTok
or you look at. Instagram like once those
products find product market fit, they grow very quickly,
right, TikTok went from no users to billion plus users in a few
years. You know Facebook obviously has
3 billion plus folks who are using it.
And so I think that like we haven't really had consumer
products with product market fit and crypto, but we are
approaching the era of consumer products with product marketing
crypto. And once those products start
emerging, they're going to just have dramatically different
growth curves. Than all of our experience with
crypto thus far. And so I think it's gonna kind
of catch people by surprise that we're gonna kind of hit this
Inflexion point. We may have already hit this
Inflexion point where we'll stop being kind of like flat from a
growth perspective and we'll just start growing month over
month with these use cases that have product market fit until
literally a billion people are on chain.
And so, you know, how quickly does that happen?
You know, we'll see, but I think it's going to happen faster than
people expect. Yeah, I suppose even the other
day, like. I know, Tom coin Telegram coins
are big and they're integrating already 800 million users I
think. Wow, that's once you get the app
right, sometimes you can onboard people very, very quickly.
Frontex been an incredible example, actually put a tweet
yesterday just being like two years ago, three years ago, all
of these sort of ideas people had and they ended up doing them
on the wrong chain or they ended up doing it with too high a cost
on an L1. It never really worked out.
And just like the first example of if you take a step back, what
could you ever use blockchains for?
Like where do you need a public Ledger?
Things like big social media. Take one of the objects like is
a good example or big ownership right systems or big financial
systems and you can start to do these sort of things suddenly on
L2 like all of those ideas that we've had a few years ago, but
we're restricted now. People can do now know Brian
Armstrong had that really good tweet recently, which is like
the 10 ideas he wants to see happen.
Did you have an idea that French was coming?
And I guess the second part of that is what else are you
excited about coming maybe to base that you might get the
first look on some of this stuff?
So did I have an idea that Frantic was coming?
Yeah. You know I I've been a user of
Steel Cam which was kind of the first product that raised her in
team built maybe like 6-9 months ago and I I love that and it was
really cool mechanic and so that was when I first kind of reached
out to the team and was like this is awesome like let me know
if I can help in any way. We had a bunch of conversations
and and talked about kind of like how we could, you know,
support from tech and how we could line that up with this
moment where we were going to be bringing base to the world and I
think really like. All the credit goes to them.
They kind of had the insight, ohh, there's all this energy
like let's capture that energy and create a moment.
And so they time the friend tech launch, I think they launched it
on the day that base launched and that just kind of like, you
know, again all credit to them, they built a really awesome
product that I think has kind of captured the attention of
crypto. You know, I was at main net and
I was at permission less and I feel like all anyone wanted to
talk about was Fred tech. Like everyone was like you by my
key, You know, like, what's your experience?
How are you using it? And and so yeah, I feel super,
super grateful that we're getting to build with those
folks and like it's the first of many consumer products that
we're gonna see really capture the attention of the world over
the next you know, few months, quarters, years.
So excited about that in terms of what's coming, you know, I'm
not going to leak it off, but there's a lot coming.
You know, I think what we're seeing is that folks like I
think again like thanks to Friend Tech and others like
base. Pain and you know friend Pat,
like people have basically seen ohh wow.
Like the technology stack from the infrastructure perspective
is finally ready like with you know low cost L2 plus an
embedded wallet, you can actually in a really rapid
amount of time build really powerful products that everyday
people can actually use. And I think that has kind of
unlocked this next wave of excitement, innovation and I
feel like we're at the very, very early stages of that where
over the next little. While we're gonna see kind of
all of these products that people have had kind of
percolating in their heads but never really thought were quite
ready from an infrastructure perspective, just come to market
very rapidly. And I think that that, you know,
some of them are going to succeed, some of them are going
to fail, probably like 90% of them will fail because that's
how it goes with products and companies.
But I think there's a tonne of innovation that comes out of it,
and most of it is going to be on these kind of consumer
experiences that aren't necessarily speculative, they're
not necessarily financial. They're really just about giving
people, you know, something cool to do.
It happens to be on chain because that's the best place to
build a product that's globally available that leverages these
powerful new tools. But it's mostly just like, hey,
this is something I want to do because it's fucking awesome.
That's really cool, Jesse. Have a quick go on, go on.
There you go. No, no, I was just going to
challenge that slightly and just say I remember when some of
these stuff was built on other L ones and the chain would go down
and there would be like it's not ready, like the change up ready.
Most of the laws that we have seen recently have gone down
having even base was down for a little bit of a month ago and
there's been some fraud about. Sequences, fraud, proofs or
feeling quite centralised in similar sort of way.
Like how do you see this all developing?
How do you see the infrastructure improving over
time to really capture maybe the same level of security that can
support these huge apps? Like if we're going to start
doing crazy things on L2, we can't really have them going
down. So how do you think we're going
to be able to get to that stage? Yeah, absolutely.
And yeah, like you said, Based had a little outrage the other
day from Retro we actually published that shared all the
takeaways and you know, really investing in in continuing to
increase the reliability, availability of the system and
feel really confident that that we're gonna be able to do that.
I think generally the way I think about this is especially
like layer two, these systems are still relatively early,
right like you know they're most are stage zero, stage one and
kind of the decentralisation road map.
But there's really clear kind of execution pathways that get us
to stage 2 decentralisation and get us to that like highly
available 4 to 5 lines of availability And and that's not
really like, hey, there's a bunch of unsolved research
challenges that need to get fixed.
It's more like, ohh, we just need to do a bunch of hard work.
And we've kindly finally kind of pulled together all of the folks
who have the ability to do that hard work because now there's
like clarity, oh, this is going to be the path for scaling
Ethereum. And so, you know, that's one of
the reasons why we decided to build based on this thing called
the open stack, which is like an open source technology stack.
Basically with the intent of saying, hey, like we're going to
contribute all of Coinbase's security expertise.
We're going to contribute all of our scaling expertise from
scaling Coinbase for the last decade to this public good that
will power base and make sure that base is highly available,
highly scaleable, highly decentralised.
But also for anyone else who wants to run a chain like
they're going to benefit from that too.
And I think kind of having all of us swarm on that, you know,
like open shared code base is actually going to be really,
really powerful for increasing the availability, reliability,
security and decentralisation of all of these different systems.
So I I think that like we're gonna see that happen pretty
quickly over the next few months and in in quarters.
I do think that there will be, you know issues, right.
And one thing that I, I think is you know like kind of an an
analogy is like in the early Internet days there were also a
lot of issues, right. You know Twitter was like the
whole meme of Twitter was fail Well, as it was kind of going
from you know hundreds of people were using to millions of people
and 10s of millions and hundreds of millions and billions or not
quite billions. Hundreds of millions of people
were using. Yeah like the Twitter fail.
Well, Twitter used to go down for hours and they're like down
Page was a whale, and so everyone called.
I've seen only a couple of times, but it seems similar in
the NFT space. I mean open C was down every
time. You meant was out.
So if you equipment was down every time, you know, Bitcoin
price went to 40,000, right? And so like, look, this is not
going to be perfect. You know, these things are gonna
go through growing pains. That's what happens when you go
from having, you know, millions of people to 10s of millions to
hundreds of millions to billions.
But I think we have all the right talent, we have all the
right focus and we're going to make them more and more
reliable. I love that.
I think this is great. It seems as such.
Like obviously we've shared conversations before.
You guys are heavily focused on creators and I've obviously seen
everything you did with with with the UK motion, big fan of
his. I mean we all are, we talked, we
covered that in the show as well that we minted that as well,
definitely wanted one. So that was pretty cool.
She was supported a lot of creators, seems like to be a big
focus when it comes to base. Is that what you guys are mainly
focused on at base like focusing infrastructure for creators in
the space and then my the follow up on that would be like any
plans? Like supporting gaming
infrastructure is like a lot of the other L twos that we're
seeing. Yeah, yeah, I'd say our focus is
consumer products like non financial consumer products and
of course there will be the financial stuff like USC is
going to be there, G5 is going to be there.
But from a pure focus perspective, it's really on
consumer products. And so for us that is kind of
creators and creatives that's social and then that's gaming.
Those are the three big kind of focus areas for us.
And so that's why, you know, on Chain Summer, like we didn't
talk about finance and perps and derivatives.
Like, no, it was all like, we're gonna show you cool things to do
on Chain. And whether it's like Parallel,
which is building this incredibly cool trading card
game, or Blackbird that's building like fully Unchained
restaurant experience, you know, live in like 30 restaurants in
New York and growing really quickly.
Or, you know, Zora Manifold highlight all these incredible
creator platforms, like giving people a cool thing to do on
Chain that they're actually excited about.
And they're like, oh, I get this, this is a cool piece of
art or this is a cool way to interact with my favourite
restaurant or this is a cool game that I want to play.
Like I think our thesis is that's gonna be what brings
these next millions of people on chain.
And so that's really the the type of builder that we want to
be supporting and making sure that and on the gaming side
there's there's a lot more, a lot more coming.
We we we've had a bunch of things launched just in the last
few weeks. One that I love that is, is like
super I guess two that I love that are super bottoms up.
I already talked about Parallel which is you know like really
cool trading card game. I think probably like the best
gaming community on chain right now.
But two like more smaller ones. There's one called Friend Pet
which is kind of like a Tamagotchi with a whole like
Unchained experience built around it.
It's a progressive web app in the same way as friends back,
Really cool. And then another one which
launched just for a little preview and then it's going to
relaunch in a in a in a month I think.
It's called words three, I think.
Is what it's called and it's like really cool derivative of
Scrabble where you kind of like earn money or pay for each
character that you place and then if people play on your
characters you earn back that money.
And it was a whole kind of like 7 day competition.
A lot of gruelling battles between people trying to win it
out and and they're coming back in a couple of months for the
full. Yeah, I'm seeing.
I'm seeing that here on your on your on your Twitter.
Ohh, that's actually a different words game.
Yeah, there's a lot of word games.
Sorry. Yeah.
That's words that art, which is epic.
The other one is words three, which you know it by letters to
spell words and score points. So there's yeah, there's a lot
of a lot of cool stuff coming. There's a lot of cool largest is
coming too. Like Patrick who's epic.
Patrick Rivera. They've been building some
really cool stuff launching under this brand called the
world's largest and they're gonna be dropping I think next
week or the week after and you just you just pat scrolled past
Ferrand which is like a purely pet creator on tree now which I
love my tweet on that as like basis for everyone including
pets. You know like we again we just
want to be supporting people to have fun and you know there's
all sorts of ways people have fun including just like
literally watching pet videos and creating pet videos.
So we want that on base too. That's great, man.
This is awesome. It looks like there's a lot of
stuff. I love the whole, like, I forgot
the word that you use that how it's like an in app.
It's an app. It's a progressive Web app.
Progressive Web app I I'm such a huge fan of that.
I kind of like hack that and you know kind of created the the the
the social web app. I want to toss it back to my
co-host here. But I have a quick question
because we're talking about friendship earlier and I kind of
wanted to chime in here. Jesse Pollack is very important
questions. Do you 33?
I do, I do I yeah. I mean, I just buy everyone's
keys on French who I can. I put some money in French.
I put one ETH into French tech on like day one.
And I just have like, you know, made trading fees and put them
back into everyone. And so I'm here.
I'm here, I'm here to support the holders on French tech.
Yeah, no, I've loved, I've loved, I've loved playing around
with friend tech using it. I'm like a probably a daily
active user at this point. And I think the thing that's
kind of most impressed me about frantic is just how quickly the
team is iterating on the product.
Like I just opened it yesterday. I was like, oh, now I get like
red notifications for all of my messages and I can see how many
people read them. It's like they're they're just
like the, you know, the product was almost unusable on day one,
and day one was like a month ago, and now it's like it has
every social feature you want. And so I I'm, I've been really
impressed with the the pace of that team's.
Execution. We we were.
We were on day one. This is done.
Yeah. I can see Jesse's OK you're
active. Active.
OK, Jesse's acting like we're not leaking at chats here, but
once you get the. Let's say I got the key.
I think. I think it was .422.
How poetic. But.
It's. This is, this is great that you
do. You do talk a lot on that, which
is awesome. And make sure I don't buy a fake
one because I'm so good at buying fake fake.
He's here. But Mando, back to you if you
had. Yeah, do that.
Have you got have you got. Well, I gotta.
I gotta do my 3 three right now. So there we go.
I'm now I'm now for. OK, Holder.
That's where you live real time. I mean no, I think like it is
pretty remarkable though like you just open up your app and
you like kind of join my room and then in the next second I
opened up my app and join you. And like that wasn't this
complex crazy thing that like you know took a bunch of I
didn't this transactions, you just did it on the show.
I just did it on the show right back.
And so I think that in and of itself is just indicative of
kind of like where we are getting to as an industry and as
a product stack. It's like this, this stuff just
getting easy, like it's just working.
It's it's finally usable in a way that, you know, maybe not
every everyday person can use, but more and more people can
use. Yeah, this this is great so.
I saw your tweet the other day, which was the tweet kind of in
response I think to the ethod that's kind of been circulating
for the last few days. Like it's got inflationary, like
JP Morgan. Yeah, that negative piece being
like all transactions are down and actually just like complete
miss. Ohh.
Well I believe that completely painting the wrong picture of
what is actually going on, which is all these which is everything
is just moved deltos and if you start counting that.
Transact, I think I saw the other day some like four times
the number of transactions is now taking place on L2 and L
ones on a week on like 5 * 6 times.
So it's it's crazy how fast it's growing.
I mean, I was in, I was in a meeting with kind of the
Coinbase executive team yesterday and we were talking
about just the L2 beat growth and it's like find another graph
in crypto that looks like the L2 transaction growth chart.
Like, I mean this is like every venture capitalist's dream, like
the most perfect up and to the right, that's like curving,
curving, curving, getting steeper.
And so I think for us it's like it's happening and we just want
to put like more fuel on the fire.
That's that's my my second question there is, I think
people do find the L2 infrastructure like landscape a
bit more complicated. I mean they find down the L1 was
complicated. I think the L2 was or maybe even
more nuanced like why did you end up going with the op stack,
How do you see these L2 wars developing?
Do you think everyone is an optimistic rollup versus like a
ZK for example? And are you thinking about doing
a different way? I don't like 5 different ways to
try and scale. Like are you gonna be just you?
You're an optimistic. Pull up Coinbase team now or are
you going to think about how we think about it slightly
differently? And 1st off, it's not like I
don't think about this as wars, right?
I think one of the things that's really interesting and different
about the L2 thing versus the L1 thing is like an L1.
It was like these are totally different environments.
Like you're you're talking about like East and you know Solana
and Polka Dot and they're all like islands basically.
But the L2 and it's like we're all connected via Etherium.
And so, yeah, there's competitive dynamics in there.
And like, yeah, we have to figure out, yeah, people are
using different technology stacks.
Like at the end of the day, we're all aligned to Etherium.
We're all using EDM. And so, like it, it doesn't feel
like a war to me. It more feels like, OK, we're
all kind of working together to figure out how we're going to
scale Ethereum. And then inside of that, like
overall arching goal, overarching goal we have like,
OK, who's going to scale Ethereum the most, which is
like, you know, like, sure, like I want to scale Ethereum the
most. And other people want to scale
theorem the most. But like at the end of the day,
it's all still scaling. I'm very, I think that yeah,
like you know it's hard not to be at this point.
So I think that that's the starting point for me.
In terms of why we we built on the OP stack, a bunch of
reasons. You know we we spend basically a
year trying to figure out what our strategy should be here.
And after kind of working with and talking to pretty much every
team and going deep, I think we ended up saying hey like the OP
stack makes a tonne of sense for us.
That was kind of a technology decision.
You know feel like it's a really powerful technology platform.
It was a kind of a commitment to public goods and open source
like we love the way it was built with an MIT licence.
That felt really important to us and we want to contribute back
to that. It was also kind of a bet on
decentralisation and particularly on optimism's
ability to be kind of a counterweight to coin base like
you think about Coinbase it's like where the scaled public
company that centralised. On the other end of the
spectrum, optimism is like decentralised on chain
governance kind of pushing the boundaries of what's possible
there and but like that pairing would work really, really well
and they took the last thing is we just had gotten to know the
optimism team really well and we'd actually started working
with them at the very beginning of 2022 on EIP 4844 which is
this upgrade to Ethereum that's gonna lower fees on layer twos
like base by another 5X probably.
And so kind of that working relationship I think also kind
of gave us confidence that this is going to be a good
partnership in terms of kind of the optimistic versus ZK thing,
you know the way we think about base and the way we think about
the open stack is it's not an optimistic rollup, it's a roll
up and it's going to have an optimistic prover for it which
can secure it. But we're also investing in ZK
proving stack for it. And so we actually just did kind
of a request for proposals to build this OK prover for the OP
stack that went out a couple of months ago.
We got a bunch of great proposals.
I'm actually just trying to find this, let's see OP zero
knowledge proof. We got a bunch of proposals and
gave out two kind of rewards for the grants, one to a company
called Risk Zero and one, two O1 Labs who built Meena.
And both of them have now built like pretty solid prototypes of
ZK provers for the OP stack with a kind of line of sight to
productizing that in you know the middle of next year at a
totally reasonable price point that would work.
And so for us like we think about this technology stack as a
roll up stack and the proving technology is kind of whatever
the best thing that's available. And so that's going to start
with optimistic prover, but we're going to transition it as
soon as that technology matures to the point where we're
comfortable. I wanted to ask one more thing
which you just said there, which was?
Optimism might balance Coinbase 3 months ago or four months ago.
There was never going to be a token for BASE.
It seemed as though recently there were some saying we
haven't ruled it out. And most of these other tokens,
optimism and they're all dials and all like trying to go down
this centralised route. If you guys were to do a token
like, how would it maybe be different or how would you even
look at something like that? Yeah.
And I think that's a big if I you're referring to the comments
that kind of Paul. Archibald, I have, Paul said on
Zedd. All it up.
He brought it up. Ohh, Max is here.
I have his notifications on. We would always tweets we quote
him at least two times a week. So we're we, we we like the men
we love Paul, you know, I think that that was him just being
like classically lawyerly, like lawyers never want to confirm or
deny or you know say anything. They just want to be totally
neutral. You know there there are no
plans for based Habit Token. We've been really consistent
about that from the beginning and it's not not in the cards.
And so no, no new news on that. No changes.
Alright, shut it down. Man, you've disappointed so many
people now. Ohh my heart.
Just doing my my friend tech chats going crazy, my my keys
going to 0. But anyways, I know we're tight
on time with you, but I do wanna kick it to OV if you ask a
question for you or a couple of questions for you real quick
Jesse. And then obviously we'll let you
because I'm sure you're very, very, very busy.
Have one final question. Yeah, which is a question I like
to ask all, I guess. What type of music do you like
listening to when you work? Ohh man, that's a good question.
I, you know, I like, really need melody in the music I listened
to. So it's a lot of like, you know,
R&B, like you know R&B pop some electronic music in there, but
like you know, strong melodic vocals, some beat bass.
You know what have I been listening to recently?
Another thing that about me that that is an interesting fun fact
about Jesse is I am like cannot remember the names of artists or
songs or lyrics. My experience of music is
basically entirely like like a physical like sensory experience
where I just listen to music. I listen to it all the time when
I'm working. If I'm writing, it doesn't
distract me at all. I and I just don't remember any
of it. I just like experience it
background playing. So yeah.
But like, no, my recently listened to like SG Lewis.
I love, like incredible artists, like very like, you know, 5B
electronic vocals. What else is in there?
Dominic Fike. The Dominic, one song that's
been on repeat for me is this song called Mona Lisa by Dominic
Fike, which was in the new Spiderman movie.
And it is is like such a banger. I think I probably listened to
it like 300 times in the last month.
Yeah, so that's that's me. That's extensive answer.
I like that. I love music.
Music is like my favourite thing in the world, but it's always, I
always feel a little guilty because I say that and then
people like what's your favourite song recently?
I'm like it depends on. The if, if you play, tell you it
depends on the vibe, right? It's always like that, Alright.
Well, aside from from from destroying, shattering our
dreams and then talking to us about your entire music stack, I
think this was not staying with you.
But Jesse, that was that was great.
I know you're tight on time, so I don't wanna, I don't wanna
hold you much longer, but really grateful that you accepted to do
an interview with us. Thanks for having me on, you
guys came on from the chat. Are you gonna be at the people
punk thing in Charleston? Or where can we catch you again
like a live event? I'm I'm not going to be at the
people punk thing. Although there will be some
other people from kind of the. Case and and and Coinbase Orbit
there I will. I've been like totally on the
road doing a bunch of events recently and so for the next
little while I'm not going to be doing, but I think likely TBD
but likely to be at Dev Connect and likely to be at Art Basel in
some form. And those are probably the two
touch points in in the next, you know, a few months.
Alright, perfect. Well, that's cool.
Thanks for having me on. Y'all.
This is awesome. Such a huge fan.
Honoured to be here. I appreciate that.
Thanks. Have a great day.
Ciao bye Ohh there boys. That was a good interview.
That was fun. You know, I I love the music
taste, Ovie. I think that was the longest
answer we got with regards to someone's music like
discography. Should I say man?
Though I have to say man kind of kind of killed my my hopes and
dreams And here, here and there. You know I did get a three,
three live on stage. I didn't even plan that, but
that's down. That's well, who knows?
Who knows? Who knows?
We're such DJ and it's like, yeah, he's just saying it to say
like this guy who invented base, right?
Just came on the show and told it's not going to be a token,
right. And like, every news outlet is
probably gonna pick up on that tomorrow and we're here.
You know what though? He's probably trolling.
Yeah. That's what we'll say, you know,
That's what the Discord group would say, you know.
Oh yeah. He didn't really mean it.
We need to study his like his facial interaction while he was
saying that because I think he was like just playing with us
right. Like he I think I think it was
fine anyway. So that was fun.
I I really appreciate him coming on because he's hard to get get
a get around of. I think it's fired.
I got this whole thing I saw basis for posted that the show.
So hopefully a lot of people can catch the last three minutes of
the show. That was great boys.
A lot of fun. A lot of fun and with that I
guess that's wrapped up. Another great episode of Jim Web
Three powered by Kraken and FTX are cracking.com/rug radio
RUGRADIO. To check it out, not so much
thought about the interview and let us know.
Also if you're in the audience like who you'd like to hear
next. You know, we we like to get some
fire guests on. I like to think that we managed
to pull quite some heavyweights and so definitely want to keep
this 30 minute, you know, interview cooking like that for
a minute. So that was great.
And with that, with that, with that, I will see you all
tomorrow morning, 10:30, we have Eastern Standard Time, 7:30 PM
Pacific Standard Time for another episode of Jim Web 3 on
rock radio. Let's go.