Oh yo-yo, what up? What up?
Good morning. Good morning.
GMG Friday, February. What is it?
16th 2024 Four four. Look at that.
Another beautiful day to have a beautiful day.
I got my Co host in the house, OSF Mando, both with new
backgrounds. You love to see that.
How you guys doing today? My Internet is screwed.
You look, you look, you look like you look really like,
focused on something right now. Is it your Internet?
My yeah, I hate my up. Weirdly, my upload speed is
really good, but my download speed is like one MB per second.
I just don't understand. I can't hear you guys, but you
guys can probably hear me really clearly.
We can hear you perfectly and actually I see you pretty well
like you and your rec jerseys in the back.
Like it's literally crisp for what it's worth.
But but I don't know it. We hear you well though.
We we we, we, we hear the well. But it's OK we can we can you
can troubleshoot in the back and while we get, while we get this
squared away. Mando, how you doing?
I like the brick wall. I'm a big fan of the brick wall.
Yeah, I'm currently in an old bar, one in central London doing
the show. So I think as the as the show
goes on and we get about four 4:30, this place is going to get
absolutely rammed. But it was just the quickest
place for me to be able to sit down and do the show.
I love that it sounds like a It sounds like I'm on my own today.
I if if someone was to come on the stream and help me with this
one, looks like we're down two men or like I'm.
Here, I'm here. This song really is going to get
rowdy. I know that.
That's, that's why I'm saying if there's any reinforcements in
the audience, are you drinking a whiskey Coke here or just just a
Coca-Cola? What's in there?
You're muted. I said, who knows?
You know I'll never tell. Never tell you It looks like you
may have a little whiskey in there.
It it looks like a little something in there.
Mando love to see that, love to see that.
Anyway, so today we got a, we got a, we got a front show today
we got a, we got another great show for y'all.
Of course it's Friday after all. Are we going to get our Shabbat
candles or not? We'll see.
One thing's for sure is that the market definitely cooled down a
little bit this morning versus what we got used to this morning
of pure euphoria at 10:30 AM Eastern Standard Time.
So that that's that's what's up. So we'll we'll go over market
report as usual. We'll go over a few topics and
what's going down in the space. And then there was a number
another I think it was inflection number came in this
morning. So I'm sure OV given that the
his Wi-Fi is fixed, given his Wi-Fi is fixed will be will be
good on on that front. And of course we have some great
topics lined up for you on the gaming side.
One of them which was meant to be today the 8 chain.
So Arbitrum is going to be you know hosting the 8 chain.
They won the bid. It was dowvoed.
It was dowvoed actually it was not really bid but we'll get
into details of that because on following that I I I just kind
of like commented on on on on the founder of off chain labs
you know Twitter account. I was like hey you want to come
on the show And he was like yeah let's go.
And so we made that happen quick on a quick turn around last
night and so we'll be joined by by legend actually on this on
the show today I'm I'm I'm hella hyped.
I'm not going to lie, I'm super hype because we are working with
Arbitrim now for what we've got going on Rugby or the crib.
But we're talking about a really a really, really big founder in
crypto in general. So it's really exciting to be
able to have Steven Goldfetter coming on to talk about all
what's going on, why is it important for Theorem?
And also maybe we could squeeze in a few questions overall about
the ecosystem Theorem ecosystem and how he feels about the
market currently in the state of crypto.
So that is going to be an exciting show.
And as if the show is not good enough, at the end of this show
it is Friday, so you already know it's Flute Box Friday.
At the end of the show, we're gonna be picking two winners
from the audience. So two people that retweet the
space. At the bottom right, there's a
purple box. It's also pinned at the top.
All you have to do is literally just retweet the space and be
here. That's all you have to do.
You were to the space you're here, you follow from our and
Robit, obviously that's a given. We're not going to give right,
you know, this money away to people don't follow us, right.
And and then you'll have a chance, two chances actually to
come up on stage and spend a $5000 loop box with us and
potentially win a lot of money. So that would be fun.
That's today. So make sure that you retweet
the Twitter spaces at the bottom right.
And I got some good news for you all.
I got some good news for y'all. It looks like.
It looks like we got the OK to give money every day again on
the show starting next week. So Mando, we got we got we got
the approval I think this morning.
So it looks like we're just going to keep you know, the the
show goes on. It looks like we're just going
to keep giving money away every day.
You know Razor was like why not. So we're going to keep it going.
We're going to make it rain. So make sure you follow from our
wow that's that's. Impressive.
That's fucking impressive. I mean, you know, they're happy.
We're happy, people are happy. This is a triple win.
This is, this is the perfect thing.
You know, this is perfect when everybody's winning.
The audience, the creators, the brands, you know, we're happy.
It's it's it's a perfect trifecta.
So anyways, anyways, anyways, why don't we get started and
talk about this market? Yeah, GM everyone.
So I have to admit I only just saw the market before I before I
opened it up. Although I did the minutes this
morning, it does look like we've we've taken a little bit of a of
a dip over the last over the last couple of hours.
You had strong coin base results last night, felt like crypto
might even take another leg higher.
Very big inflow day yesterday again on the ETF I think, which
was just shy of 500 billion again.
And yeah, it's kind of got kind of an insane, insane week and
1/2 for ETF inflows I have to say.
And I put it in the chat with broken OSF earlier today and I
took off quite a lot of positions this morning.
Is that one thing I would expect to see is, is it the weekends
are probably not going to be as strong like as we've been seeing
each day like we rally into the US Open which we were doing.
I think because even rallying when I last checked it and then
we dumped when we when that buying is done because
everyone's like fuck, you know we're not going to get any more
buying after the initial buys are done and we're not going to
get any more buying till Monday now.
So I I think people just should be a bit more wary that the the
market might trade a little bit. Weak.
On let's say Friday afternoon into Sunday, Sunday evening and
then probably pick up then. So personally I'm not buying
this dip yet and the reason is for that I think, I think, I
think funding was a little bit high and if you're not having
ETS buying 500 million for the next few days then then it could
we could fall back a little bit. So yeah I'm I'm going to wait
and maybe I missed it slightly but but just given how far stuff
ran up I think it's a little bit dangerous.
But the thing that I'll I will be buying is E on this dip.
It still feels like the thing that I would want to buy, maybe
Solana. I think Solana's on the full
decent amount for the last few days.
But but yeah, those two at least, at least on the weekend,
you know? Yeah, I didn't realize the Wick
was so. I mean, I didn't realize.
Look at the Darth Vader looking wet, Wick.
Yeah dude, that's why I was. That's why I was scared.
If you you you you got caught like.
Almost. Almost.
I almost got caught bad. I almost got caught bad last
night. You know what happens to me?
And that that's why I was telling you and OV.
So I may as well talk about it here because I'm curious if some
people can relate to that in the audience.
When trading in here we see the Asia Open at like 8:00 PM from
the East Coast. And every day without fail in
this market like at around 8:00 we rally like literally.
You can go back and check on all coins around like 7/8, 9:10 PM.
And usually sometimes I catch a trade before bed like a bit I
scalp, sometimes I just go to sleep and before bed I just like
catch that. And last night I left it open
thinking yo like surely tomorrow we have another day of ETF
inflows we may see another leg up $100 on ETH.
That did not happen thankfully. Thankfully, like an hour before
the show I was like OK, this is not working.
Or two hours before I woke up early enough and I was like OK
this is not working. This sounds like one of those
places where I made a lot of money this week trading for my
bag and I'm going to get give it back and so I cut it and then it
tanked even more so I I nearly round trip like a whole trade
here. Thankfully I, I, I did it.
So we're good. The the the we're good for the
week. But that was that was scary.
Mando. That was that was a scary one.
I think you muted again. Oh, there you go.
I mean I did obviously. I've been saying that I think
you should hold hold on for a median term like I I guess I I I
didn't. I still have a large bit of my
trade on, but I took off pretty much all of my alt, alt coins
yesterday and this morning Sorry for a little bit that just
because just because it felt like I could imagine the weekend
being a little bit scary and you could see some very, very big
Wicks slower than some of those. But yeah, I'm I'm going to be
buying this weekend like I I think this movie is nowhere near
done. Like nowhere near done.
So I yeah, I'm going to be buying the pain, but it's not
today because I think you know things would get a little bit
scary. So I think the next 24 hours and
that's that's great opportunity. You know, I mean, it's a great
opportunity. Yeah I I I actually I actually
agree I mean I don't see this move going stopping in time soon
but that's really mostly what you and and what we talk about
usually I'm I'm just I'm I'm just a permeable that's all I am
and it's very tough at times to be that because you have to calm
down and calm yourself down. The other big out, the other
big, big one yesterday that had a big day, I mean Mando, it was
really say, right, I know you were, you've been talking about
it for a minute now, say reached a dollar, yes, a dollar O 2 a
dollar O1. I forgot what it was.
Obviously it was all over a timeline.
I guess it's a big mental like thing like when we see these
round numbers and everything. So that's that was a big, big
one that happened on the market yesterday, went all the way up
to what is it 1103. But you've been talking about
this one for a minute. Yesterday morning you explained
about the big ecosystem on what that happened over there, so.
Yeah, I took off. I took off about 90% of the
trade at $0.96 there but Mists listed run up but then I was
like it's that's $10 billion fluid in market cap put in
perspective like suey which we spoke about it's at 18 two years
or something similar I think sale keep going but it moved 50%
in a week like let's just put that into perspective like it
moved 50% in a week that's that's quite a big move.
So I just felt like it could, it could move around.
But I like that story for the next few months because like if
I look ahead, May is going to be their big release in C2.
I think that'll be, that'll be a big deal for that.
And then yeah, what are the other stories?
But the other big stories that were happening yesterday were in
AI. So if you look at all the big
movers, at least from this morning it was, it was all the
AI related points. It seems like cow render fair.
A few others like they all started moving because of
because of the release of this Sora Black Sora text to video
chat from Open AI, which I saw that just got everyone.
I mean, it's kind of silly because a lot of these coins A
either really do nothing or like the people who own them don't
really know how they're going to be used and B, even if they do
do something, It's not often related to what the bit of AI
news is that came out and this sort of news is just like a, you
know, it's a text to video. It looks looks pretty
incredible, particularly if it starts being used, things like
games and stuff like that. But yeah, like why someone sees
that and needs to buy, I don't know how or buy that, it's just
a bit of a jump. But yeah, AI as a narrative has
LED crypto for the last two weeks.
So if you go onto the AI coins, you'll see they're all up.
You know, they're all up 30 to 50% over the last couple of
weeks. I'm up even more.
Yeah, the the store thing is interesting.
Text to prompt what is it prompt prompt to a video and I've seen
some pretty impressive use of it so far.
So it's I it's getting scary every time.
It just gets better and bigger and crazier.
So I saw the Sora access and of course digens were very quick to
jump to making a shit coin about it.
So I have to say Mando, I really admire the speed at which digens
in this industry are at creating things and just I'm very
impressed at the speed of which. Two chains.
On Two Chainz, you know what I mean?
Like you know, I have to say like the the speed at which
people in this space are to create buddy out of vaporware
like air. You know what I mean?
Like in the magical Internet money is is impressive.
So whoever, whoever is running those, you know, those are
people that just like copy pasta contracts, right?
They're just just ready to go. They're on on the Internet all
day long and they see a new meme, they see a new thing.
They see something Elon is saying online or like, you know,
a new invention like Sora. And they just, they just go
right into it. So if you're lucky enough,
you're online, you catch it and if and if you're unlucky, you're
usually buying the top and then you know it follows by a dump
99% where you lose all your money.
So I would be careful and beware when it comes to to to trading
those. But it's definitely funny to see
that happening. Mind the one thing I see, I, I,
I, I, I actually, we could use over here, 'cause I didn't want,
I didn't want to ask him about inflation, miss fixing his
Internet. But one thing I want to ask you
here, I find it so funny and that's something I was talking
to you before the show about, is a few weeks ago we were saying
we can't wait for the weekend, GBTC can't dump on us, and now
we're saying the opposite. Now we're saying can't wait for
the week almost. Or like weekend's gonna be a
dump or like dibs but the week is gonna have inflows.
This, this minds, this shift in mind is interesting.
Is that I don't know is that a good or a bad thing?
Like I don't know how I feel about it.
I feel like in a bull market or in the core cryptos not to be
super correlated like that to the to the markets.
Like what? What do you think?
What do you think of this mindset shift going on?
I think you just have to accept it, yeah.
I think a lot more of the flows are now going to be having
during working, working, working hours for like the rest of the
market. So yeah, I think we just gotta
we gotta live in that world. Yeah.
Definitely definitely gotta just OK fine that was you know that
was that was a very clear answer that was a very clear answer
Mando. You just have to accept it.
That's just how it is and you're gonna have to deal with it.
So it's it's very interesting dynamic So but it just shows you
for me I want to point out because it shows you the the the
the the mental behind it like we one week you'll we're bearish,
one week we're bullish. One week this is good.
One week no this is bad. One week it's a southern news
one week it's never mind like this is something you should
have. So it's just it's just
interesting when you when you when you look at it from this
perspective and how we tend to play mind games on ourselves
actually and that's just that's just something I wanted to point
out that I find that I find kind of funny.
It looks like all we still having Wi-Fi issues.
It's so funny. Ovi was so excited to move
because he moved over last week that's why he was on the show
one or two days then and and and he and it's so funny because he
was excited the most about his new Wi-Fi and it seems like his
new Wi-Fi is just not working. It seems like the boy is having
a one MB per second download speed so that that's not
working. He can't hear us.
He can't talk to us. And that's, and that's a tough
one. And it looks like Mando is sort
of logged here. Am I gonna have to like, am I
gonna have to talk? Am I gonna have to just talk
NFTS here on my own? Because I can cover that.
I can. I can cover that very easily.
So I guess, I I guess before we have Stephen.
Come on. So Stephen's going to be on in
about 7 minutes. Let's talk about ape chain.
So make sure you're retweeting the spaces, make sure you follow
four more hour and that you're sharing it.
Because at the end you're going to have the chance to win a lot
of money, that's for sure. And I Oh my God, I had to fix a
little bit of the boxes too. OK.
This is such a typical show for us.
Oh my God, I love this. This is you.
Can hear me, but it's going to be really loud now.
No, it's better. You sure?
This is better. OK.
I have to say this is better I I I mean that maybe cuz these
headsets are not meant to be like a Bluetooth connected thing
that well cuz I've tried this headset before for calls.
It's the worst though. It cost an arm, but they're not
bad anyways. Yeah, see we got stout Connor in
there saying way better everybody.
Sorry y'all we're back. We're still back.
I'm going to post it back. I also have to post the
broadcast link on our on our on their account and everything.
So where's back? We're here, Mando.
What was this size Chad? We got size watching the video
broad guy saying, yeah, Mando, your mic was shit, yo.
Peter Size, Chad. Yeah.
Yo, why don't you come on? Why don't you come on the stream
with us? Why don't we?
Why don't we tell side chat to
join us on this stream? I'm sending.
I'm sending him the link. I just sent him the stream yard
link over here if he wants to join us on video.
Amanda, what was his inflation number this morning?
Is that something we should care about?
And did that have anything to do with the market?
Yeah, that was the 2nd inflation figure of the week.
So that was PPI that came out and PPI is producing by some
slight inflation. It just came in slightly higher
than expected. So I mean, no one really was
expecting now a March rate cut. I think there's only 8% chance
that we'd have a rate cut in March.
It now seems like that's going to be pushed out for sure until
later in the year, probably May. These aren't like massive beats,
but they're beats that show that inflation is a little bit more
persistent than expected. So well, I mean, it's still
producer price inflation was actually higher, but but
consumer price inflation has still been falling.
It just fell less than expected but it's not this isn't terminal
like we're we're talking about at the margin you know so the
market I don't think will be that bad.
OK. OK.
That's good. Just checking in on that and to
see how we're on that front anyway.
So on the NFT front, I mean I may as well, I may as well just
give a breakdown on the NFT side because we haven't been able to
much this week. It was really heavily market
related and usually when the markets move across all chains,
NFTS tend to cool down. One thing that I found
interesting and actually like we could talk about that but.
That was I I. It happened late last night I
saw this morning but the son, one of the one of the children
of the richest man in the world, Alex Song.
I don't know. So Bernard's son who is the CEO
of Tiffany I believe is the CEO of Tiffany is listed.
Did you see this tweet man though he yeah I know, I know,
he posted. He posted.
This is a bargain period. And he posted the link to his
Crypto Punk 3167 that is for sale, which is his 3D glasses.
It's a it's a sick punk. For what it's worth, I love this
punk. And it was actually marked two
times above, above the, you know, above the the, the, the,
the real value of it. Above the real value of it.
And then Sergito came in just now actually during the show and
put it a underneath bid. Are you?
Would you buy Alexander Arnold's crypto punk Mando?
I feel like this is something you.
Should do. Why is he selling?
His crypto punk? To me, it's It's less why he's
selling it. It's more why is he posting that
it's a bargain when it's double the four price, But I don't mean
that in a bad way. I I don't want to get in, you
know? Yeah, I'm not trying.
To yeah, it just it doesn't strike me as the son of the of
like the richest man in the world to be doing that, but.
Yeah, I think. I think so.
What I don't understand is, haven't there been like several
partnerships between Yoga Labs and LBMH?
Brands no. So not unofficial right?
Like the crypto parks pending with Tiffany.
So he is ACO Tiffany. So it's actually it was him that
right? But like, so why the hell is he
selling? I don't know, maybe they're
trying to buy the alien that was listed yesterday for 5500 ETH.
Who knows? I mean, it's not like they need
an extra 100 ETH. I mean you're.
I mean, shit, never mind. I mean, how much is LVMH?
What is LVMH? Market cap, €412 billion.
What is Bernard Arnault net worth?
Wow. He's worth $216 billion, though.
Doesn't feel like he needs 200 grand.
Well, that family doesn't. I I I I don't.
I don't know. I I don't know.
I thought it was funny. Like I said, I saw it this
morning and I thought it was so funny.
I'd see it was posted last night late.
But it's he's selling it. So if anybody wants to own
Crypto Punk 3167, formerly, formerly owned by the CEO of, or
currently, shall I say owned by the CEO of Tiffany and Son and
the hair of of of of the biggest, one of the biggest
companies on earth, you have a bargain happening here.
And I'm not getting it cut out of the sale, so I'm just putting
it out there. You get Do you get the Tiffany
chain or? Dude, because he, you know what?
See that would have been see see, you see see that's actually
not stick to that. The first chain was made for him
because he did it for himself first to showcase it.
I remember the marketing of it and so imagine if he would have
posted that. It's actually a thing where like
the punk comes, the first chain made see now that now we're
talking for for, for that extra. Because I know for a fact on
that punk OTC and and OTC. A lot of punks have been going
with a premium for the chain because it it ended up paying
that a lot of people like them. And so some people are like they
want to pay the extra. Some people think it's stupid to
pay extra for it, which like, I get it, but some people like it
and they're like purposely shopping with punks with chains.
So hey, you never know. Maybe it's the case, maybe it's
not. So I thought that was funny to
see this morning and and to share that in other news, you
know, just punk's still selling pretty well.
There was also like some nice sales on it and when it comes to
like some board apes another hoodie punk it's one wallet
lowered up a bunch of ace bought a sick pipe hoodie punk and
which is I don't know if it's not showing on the tops here but
I'm pretty sure it's sold yesterday forgot where it's this
one I wanna put a bid on it sorry for for this one for 2:20
and then besides that you know just it was a lot of movement on
Bitcoin side it was Bitcoin D gods saw a huge rise which oh
it's not being indexed on here but the Bitcoin D gods saw and
rise to oh never mind may it's not but I saw them here
yesterday all the way to half a Bitcoin yesterday the.
Trades may have happened more than 24 hours ago.
That's. Yeah, that's why.
That's why it's probably what happened.
So the Bitcoin D gods saw a huge rise in floor price.
I heard Frank on his face last night, yada yada yada.
So that's a .55 Bitcoin. So that's quite a lot of money.
So there's that RSIC saw rise 2 on the back of the boosting that
started. So you could you know either in
scrub you're on FT like I said the other day or you could I
found out Mando. That is, if you're too lazy to
describe. If the fees are high, you could
have just gone and like bought a floor like RSAC boosted
inscription and it would boost your wallet so like it came out
cheaper. Sometimes to do that instead of
like the other way around and describing everything because
the cost of that. So that came out to around $200.
Quantum cats saw bounce above .16 back to .2, the puppets
going lower, actually grinding lower now under .06 and OMB .8
Bitcoin. So that's again a lot of the
attention is on there on Solana, Solana, of course Matt Lazant
and Sorans have been grinding higher based on the fact that
you know they keep on getting those.
It's really part of that the the, the meta of like the
ecosystem airdrops happening on there.
Quick shout out to. They're talking about the
backpack exchange. They're doing mad volume like 30
billion the volumes over the last 24 hours on that, on the
backpack. Huge volume on that front.
It's insane to watch. Congratulations to them again.
Reminder they have they're one of the rare people exchanges
that have the license in Dubai and so they're they're grinding.
So I'm actually a huge fan of Armani and that entire team
personally speaking. But Dogos, I saw something with
Tensorians and then their show now is sponsored by Tensor in
the morning. So something there, I don't
know. But they did this really funny
videos, the nifty Portal crew with like picking an exchange
and putting a hat on. And they put the they put the
tensor HQ hat on I thought was hilarious.
Shout out to them. They're very good with content.
We're fans and we're friends. So on the Solana side that was
like really what I that I picked up on.
And on the East side, the biggest news to me was what
we're actually gonna cover now as I see Steven in the studio
and coming on stage here, some of bring up on the stage here
was really, I know it's not yoga directly or board ape directly,
but it was the news that ape chain is going to happen and be
launched on the best L2IN existence.
There is only one Arbitrum and we are joined by the Co founder
of Off Chain Labs, Steven Goldfetter.
What's up Steven? Good morning.
How you doing? Hey, good morning.
Great to be here. Yes, super exciting week and
super excited to be here and talk about it.
And by the way, before we get into this week's announcement,
obviously I just wanted to give a shout out to arbiter and rug
radio which had you know their partnership announced a couple
months ago or weeks, I don't know all the time, just sort of
blends together. But the point is I was not on
here to give that shout out. So I just wanted to lead off of
that. I appreciate that.
I I appreciate that. You know, it's it's really fun.
I love to see that. You know, we had this beautiful,
you know, oh, that was so nice when it came out on stage.
I'll never forget it was during the Art Basel event and and Sam
from, you know, your CMO, you know, flew down just for that
one night to spend it with us for the announcement so big.
Shout out, of course we got to. Be there dude.
It was fun. We're excited to build with you
guys. You know, obviously we have good
friends building with you guys, including zai.
So a quick shout out to you know, Sobi and and Sobi and Toby
over there at zai. They're cooking you know first
layer of three over there. So you guys have a lot going on
right now ironically actually yesterday we had our first
activation with our partnership with Gigi and reboot with rock
radio as well where they came on our on our stage on rock radio
we went on theirs to play the game.
So which is also an Arbitrum. So like Arbitrum like you guys
are left right off chain labs you know in Arbitrum it's left
right run and center of of of the attention right now.
But the big news really was with eight chain yesterday.
Do you want to do you want to kind of like maybe start with an
intro here Steven and then we can get into like what why this
is important for theorem because it was really on your your tweet
that I picked up there. Yeah, absolutely.
So this actually goes back a really long time.
If you remember when you got to the other side launch, I don't
know was that 2021 again, time is this is just all blended
together. I've been in this in this space
for over a decade now. So who knows sometime in a
couple years ago and basically broke Ethereum for for the day
and you know you got put out a tweet maybe that night or the
next day like hey we need to like scaling solution.
You know we basically need a chain and that led to like
intense conversations in public behind closed doors.
Everyone was vying for this and that includes like the theorem
scaling solutions that were around at the time that includes
all the all Tel ones. Everyone wanted to be the chain
where Yugo launches games and Fast forward a couple years.
There's obviously there's eight eight coin Dow now, which is the
Dow that is associated with the apes.
And I think the recent there again there were private
conversations going on for a long time and I can tell you
we've been part of those and just trying to understand you
know what the plans are for the ecosystem.
But really recently, a couple months ago Polygon put out this
proposal out on the eighth coin Dow that started the initial
conversation said hey, you know they put us this proposal out
there build on Polygon and that you know of course let everyone
say OK, they're going to make a decision.
Now there's a forcing function. So Arbitron followed on with the
proposal. So did others optimism decay
sync and it started off a little bit chaotic because you have
like these different proposals. There was no like glue
connecting them. And actually on the Polygon one
went up for a vote and then it didn't pass and then like the
thought was OK, I guess the next one goes up for a vote now.
And then finally the I think the special counsel's like, you know
what, we're going to actually run a process here.
They had a like request for proposal said OK, anyone who
wants to get a proposal and can get one in now you ready to
propose, that's fine. And we're going to do like one
process as opposed to like otherwise kind of weird.
It's like if they win, it's over, otherwise it goes to the
next one. Kind of like it's like weird
relay relay race type thing. But so they did this, this, this
vote basically. And it was two weeks of actual
voting, but you know, months of preparation for it and this was
what I guess you're showing now on the screen and.
This is what this. One, right?
Actually, so this first one is, is they had a vote that said
should we build a chain, Like forget about the technology
provider provider, should we build a chain that was one where
just about everyone could unite and say yes, you should build a
chain. And then there was another one
which actually started a little before that There's like select
the provider for for the H chain community and that's the one
where there were four different opportunities and they were
actually all Ethereum based. So when I said I started off and
said couple years ago everyone was buying Ethereum one from day
one because everyone that they were considering was Ethereum
base which is like huge shout out to to the holy doubt
community for being Ethereum aligned, being super excited
about Ethereum and and basically saying hey you know we'll
consider Ethereum skinning solutions.
But Arbitrum was one of the four different proposals there and
the community came out, the community came out in force and
Arbitrum had a a decisive victory there and that's when
the fun starts. Now we get to build.
I like that decisive victory you know we you love to see that I I
you know this this type of stuff really excites me given that you
know feels like we made the right decision on our end.
But I think I think this is a big deal and I I want to bring
back the tweet that you just mentioned that I'm sharing on
screen here and and and just a reminder for everybody we are
live on on video and audio and Steven join us on video so you
can find our our stream. I think I posted it Sims.
If I didn't post, I'm sorry Sims or our producer in studio I'll
get it done right now. But you said understated in the
ape chain news. This is a big win for theorem.
Every proposal in the recent vote was a theorem based.
We already knew a theorem would win but a few years back the
Alton ones were vying for ape chain.
Glad that ape coin has doubled down on a theorem.
And one thing I really like about I guess you in general
Steven, is you you often you know a lot of the conversation
right now on the space like oh L twos are taking all this energy
away from Ethereum. L threes all this and that and
like everything's ticking away from here.
But you seem to always bring it back to theorem the
conversation, and you seem to think that this actually just
adds value to theorem as a whole.
So can I ask you like to explain that for people so they can
understand like from your perspective how you see it?
Definitely. The reason we're here and the
reason we started this years ago and the reason though that's
renewed we're here today is to scale Ethereum because we
believe, I believe we at Off Chain Labs believe I think we,
many of us in the community believe that Ethereum is the
best from a security and decentralization perspective,
the best smart contract platform.
But it also needs to scale right because you can like sit in your
ivory tower and say this is the best, but if people can't use it
because it's too expensive, doesn't have enough bandwidth,
then it doesn't work. And so the question we set out
to set out to decide here to to figure out years ago was can we
scale Ethereum without compromising on these core
principles. And the decisively, yes.
And if you look actually back, it's not just me.
If you go back to 2021, Vitalik had this blog, blog post which
which was the roll up centric road map for Ethereum.
So we're very aligned there. Vitalik had now one perspective
of hey we're going to build Ethereum into a chain of chains
if you will chain that supports roll ups and that's how we scale
and Arbitron was one of the only ones back then.
Now there's a ton of others which is great.
That said, OK, we're going to take this Mantle and actually
build that roll up centric road map.
We're going to be that role of centric road map.
We're going to be part of Etherium.
But to forget that now would be silly where you know, Arbitrum
is extremely successful. And it's true if you look at the
like the leaderboards and forget that Arbitrary is an L2, you
could say, OK, it's like the number 2 blockchain or the
number 3 blockchain in some metrics like it can stand in its
own right, but but that's not the point here.
The point here is we're bringing the security and
decentralization of Etherium. We'll bring it to mass market or
bring it to users at a price point that they can afford.
And to be honest, I think a lot of this like L2L3, Etherium is
not. It's like all like pushed by
those that have an agenda to push it.
So, you know, I'm not going to name names specifically like
Waltel ones. You you can fill in the blanks.
The Altale ones are basically, you know, have an agenda to try
to, you know, split here and say, oh, this is not Ethereum.
We're better than Ethereum. These are just other things.
They're parasitic. You know, some of them even go
ahead and say, like, oh, we, we are more Ethereum aligned than
you. It's like, dude, what?
Like, what? What are you even saying?
And then they point to things that they're like, well, you
have your own token. I say go back and read Vitalic's
2021 blog post. He said one of the benefits is
that that each one can have their own token.
And they're like, oh, you guys fight all the time.
It's like, yeah, we fight time because Etherium is a community
that a lot of people care about and there are lots of opinions.
Probably the art from Dow is the same way.
Any time you have a real community that's not monolithic,
there's gonna be fighting. I'm gonna look at world
governments like people care, People are passionate, people
have different opinions, and that's what makes the world go
around. And if everyone agrees and
there's no discord, probably no one cares.
So you know, it's a little bit like spicy, I guess.
But we are here to scale Ethereum.
We are built on Ethereum. The ones trying to drive the
wedge are the ones that are afraid to compete with this
powerhouse or Ethereum plus L twos.
But that's what that's what we are and that's what we're here
for. Wow.
I'm I'm about the Max long theorem right now these I've
I've this guy's got me fired up this morning I love that and and
I and I no I think you're right and and I think it's it's
important for some for people to hear it from from you because
you know there's only so much we can explain and and people have
to you know understand that like all the L twos actually add a
lot of value to that. So just to go back to the APE
chain and everything, because that's really what we wanted to
cover today because we think it's like a really big deal for
gaming in general. And of course you guys have a
massive gaming ecosystem on Arbitrum.
What, what happens now with APE chain, like what does it mean
for for for the board of Yacht Club and in general.
So one of the coolest things of the night was after the vote was
over, Yuga Labs put out a tweet which said basically we're
really excited to, among others, to see what we can build a name
chain and sort of everyone that was always like in like the
background. Everyone kind of assumed that
and went unspoken. But to hear hear them, yeah,
there it is. That one.
That was like a very, very big deal because Yuga has an
incredibly strong ecosystem with incredibly strong IP and they
took, you know, a couple of minutes to lean in and lean in
hard and that's really exciting. So you mentioned, yeah, Arbitrim
has it. It's emerging basically as an
ecosystem of ecosystems and gaming, which is kind of what it
is in D5 too. Like you have like a bunch of
different derivative protocols. You have GMX obviously, which is
just a really strong protocol to others.
And they all sort of compete and work together and lift each
other up. And it's the same thing In
gaming, you have treasure. You have a Zion like you
mentioned, shout out, Toby, and you have other emerging
ecosystems as well. And now you have ape chain, you
know, joining there right up there.
And they're going to have some nice pull and nice advantages.
Obviously the Yuga Connection is going to be huge and they'll
also, I think be able to draw in others.
It's a very, very strong community, a very passionate
community, but it'll also be benefited by the larger
ecosystem and arbitrary. So what happens now?
And now we, we start building, you know, we take a celebratory
pat on the back and then we say, all right, let's get back to
work and we build this. And one of the cool things about
Arbitrim is that you can customize it.
You can take this technology and customize it.
You don't have to take the technology of vanilla and say,
hey, boom, here's a chain use it.
It's just does what every other chain does.
You can say, all right, community, like, what do you
want to do? Do you want to enforce creator
royalties on chain? Do you want to share back some
of the royalties with the, you know, with the creators, with
the community? You can do whatever you want and
and encode that in the rules of the chains.
There's got to be a conversation now with the community.
We're going to put a proposal out like, hey, we think this is
a way where a chain can be pretty unique and we're going to
present some of that to the community.
But I expect the chain to be up and running.
It's the end of Q1 now or the middle of Q1 by by next quarter.
You know, during next quarter, I expect the chain to be up and
running and I think that's a very, very fair and reasonable
timeline. Wow.
OK. This is, this is a nice timeline
like and like mid, mid, next, next quarter is nice.
This is really just. Any reason why that wouldn't
happen? OK, okay.
I like that. I like that and and and just,
you know, I know I don't want to take too much of your time.
Sure you're very busy. Very busy, man.
But like what are what are dude? I mean, I'm glad you.
I'm glad this was really like on a whim by the way.
So at some point like I do need to like you know do a proper
interview with you with the boys you know OV had some issues
etcetera like we wanted the proper one and and background.
So out to Arbitrum they just came on stage and shared this as
well with super last. Just a reminder for everyone,
make sure you retweet the spaces at the bottom right, it's a
purple box you know what to do dropper GM while you're while
you're at it but what do you, what insights are the most right
now given this market. You know, we talk every day
about the market, we talk price, we talk innovation, we talk, you
know, what's coming, what's leaving, whatever, like what do
you, what do you, what is the state of the market for you
broader crypto where are we at right now?
Yeah. So I think market wise one of
the exciting things that I see now is increased interest and
this always happens with market cycles where more and more
people come in and build and and are interested and just you know
people don't forget about crypto.
So the last time the circle expands a little bit and those
people kind of are there and then they'll come back and then
it expands a little bit more. And you know we we build, we
just keep building, we don't care about what the market does,
we keep building. But obviously we like when more
people are are using the technology and we're ready for
that. And we've been building for the
past you know a couple years during the bear market even
though people say hey do we need a layer two scale solutions
anymore prices are cheap, usage is down and we just keep
building saying no, you're going to want this, you're going to
want these features. There's going to come a day and
that day I feel like is increasingly coming and.
But there's more and more interest in in Ethereum as a
whole in doing things on Ethereum from you know industry
like non non web, three companies institutions doing
things on Ethereum in the financial space and the gaming
space and other spaces as well. And so it's sort of the moment
where all that work that we've been building for the past
couple of years is going to be appreciated and we're going to
see prices and gas prices likely go up in the next couple of
months would be my guest. And we're going to see more and
more of a need for for for arbitrary and scaling solutions
generally. And we're going to see people
benefiting from the other features we've been building
quietly for the past few years like Arbiter, Stylus, which is
set to come live this year on main and it's already on test.
That which will allow industry developers to build in other
languages like Rust and C and C++ on these chains.
All these things that have been building in private building
during the during the beer as more users come on.
It's super exciting for us to have a larger audience and we're
ready. You know, we've been building
because we said, hey, we know there's going to be more demand
and we need to scale now because the last thing you want is to
wait. And then the demand comes like,
hey, where have you been? Like, hey, you guys told us to
go away. No, no, no, We know what we need
to be here. We've been building, we've been
ready and we're excited for a new surge of users and new use
cases. And gaming by the way is like
just emerging and I was just like exploding on Arbitrum and
you know people would say one of the complaints we've got
sometimes like hey you don't guys don't give enough focus to
gaming. I think you know we're we're,
it's just that the industry's a little bit younger, but
hopefully we've demonstrated that we care a ton about gaming
and actually hear some alpha. So there was the Arbitrum, there
was the Arbitrum Odyssey a couple of the years, a year or
so back which was like really popular.
The next one is coming live in a couple weeks and it's only about
gaming, so we are super, super pumped for for this next era.
OK, this is big. We got some alpha here.
Y'all heard that. Y'all heard that we we
definitely we we definitely got some some alpha here and I love
that. What are what are some of the of
the things you're most excited about when it comes to that
right like on the on the arbitrary eco that are like more
imminent. Is there anything that people
should be paying attention to right now?
Yeah, so the the three, the three pillars that I I'm super
excited about an Arbitrum and I think Arbitrum is doing super
well on is D5 of course, right. So let's not forget about that.
Arbitrum is king of D5 and we're trying to expand, but like D5 is
not going anywhere and D5 is strong as ever.
An Arbitrum. You can look at the numbers.
Actually, just yesterday Arbitrum surpassed Robin Hood to
be the number four largest wallet underneath, so that the
number four largest ETH holder is the Arbitron Bridge.
And that's obviously a testament to to.
To. D5, which drives a lot of that.
The second pillar is gaming which is a huge focus and the
third pillar which is a bit like again in the in the woodworks
now, but we're starting to see some coming forth is what they
call RW as do I hate that term. But like we're world athletes
and that's the institutions, the financial institutions, the like
that are coming and tokenizing things on chain.
I would say those are the the three big pillars that's going
to be a little more nascent for some time.
You know, we'll see some come through, like Franklin Templeton
to launch an Arbitrary, which is a big deal, but I think gaming
is having its moment right now. Wow, wow.
Totally agree with that dude that is crazy. 4th largest
holder of ETH. No.
Third. Third.
Now third. Sorry, third. 4th but but the
first two. By the way, #1 is like a staking
contract. #2 is raft ETH number 30.
Those are. Transactions.
Right. These are the transactions.
Yeah, that was Arbitrim, Nova yesterday, which is the gaming
stained. Arbitrim did more transactions
than any other layers do. That was like there's actually
this like a project called Arbius, which is like an AI
project I think, which I think is driving a lot of that, but
that's like Nova taking off. But the other one is if you look
at an Ether scan they have, they have like a list of accounts and
the number one account is like the the staking beacon contract
the number two accounts do. You see that?
What do you see the top accounts on ether scanning let?
Me. Grab that.
Hang on a second. I forgot I always check on D5
llama for everything like that but.
Yeah, but this is like a a particularly interesting stat.
I'm going to drop it here in the chat if I figure out where that
is. There you go.
Let me pick that up. From you.
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
OK.
I see, I see, I see, I see. Here you go.
Boom bridge.
Crazy bridge. You know #4, right?
So speaking the project contract which is literally the steak
Eve, it's wrapped Eve, it's finance it's Arbitron bridge.
So you know Defy is is exploding on Arbitrum and again the pie is
expanding, Arbitrim is leading in multi and that's what it is.
So it's a general purpose chain and it's exploding.
We have a lot of work to do. We want you know to make sure
that as more and more verticals emerge and they will that you
know Arbitrim is front and center.
But I'm super excited about where the ecosystem is now and
shout out to folks like you who see the, you know who love
Arbitrim and are using it and building on it and that's really
where it drives it all. It's not me.
We can build technology from today to tomorrow all year, and
if people don't use it, it's not gonna go anywhere.
It's really folks like you and the 8 chain community, etc.
That are driving all this awesome adoption.
Let's go. Love to hear that, Mando.
I know, I know I didn't go to you too often, but figured I'd
ask a few questions here. But did you have any last things
you wanna ask Steve before we take off or any?
No. I think it's it's interesting to
see this like obviously I think Origin came up as a defied chain
mainly like that's where a lot of the stuff happened we had the
magic ecosystem but it was really like the bastion of all
the perk decks's and that sort of stuff.
So 8 chain eight coin 8 Dow like it's been a it's been I don't
know I wouldn't say controversial it's been a
difficult difficult thing to to get right and I think I think
you're the right team to have a go at it that's that's what I
think. Thank you.
So you've got a lot, lot of work to do.
I think Horizon as well are a great partner to do alongside.
They're very smart like their team.
So yeah, all the best to you. I'm sure that April will get
behind it. Thank you.
And yeah, shout out to Horizon by the way.
So I'll just tell you one more brief thing which is you know,
because you mentioned it when this whole proposal came out,
you know, I know, you know AJ So AJ and I sat there and talked to
foundation folks. We said you know we want to like
propose here and like we'd love for this to be us, but like we
feel like we're kind of outsiders and again we can build
technology, but like we want to also need the lead growth of the
ecosystem, make sure we're implementing the vision of the
ecosystem. And we were kind of like on the
fence and that's sort of when exactly the partnership with
Horizon came on. Like these guys have been there
from day one. They built some of the initial,
So we build the core technology, they lead growth and and really
lead the community efforts and make sure that these two things
connect. And that's like OK, we're all on
board together. This is going to be a success
and that's why, you know, we were so excited and I'm so
excited to now have the opportunity to build it.
Hell yeah. I remember Speaking of Dean
Steinbeck early on and they even we hosted the first we actually
hosted the first ever Acorn Daos Twitter spaces when the first
council was was put in place with Alexis Ohanian and and
Mario Bajwa. Yeah.
Amy Wu and Dean and it was somebody else.
I forgot it was 1/5. It was yeah.
Yeah. So the five of them.
So I remember that very well and this whole thing taken off and I
think that I think that it being in the hands of professionals
like yourself is fun. But anyway, Steven, I'll hit you
up another time so we can get a background because that AJ can
spend hours talking about you. Okay, let me tell you, I go.
I do have to give a shout out to my boys size Chad, AJ, Sam and
my girl Nina, the foundation. Because those people are always
here to help, always here to generally trying to scale it up.
There's a reason why we've decided with regular and decrypt
to work with you guys. It's not just, it's just in the
whim, right? There was a lot of research that
went behind this and I've heard some great things about you in
your passive Princeton. You know how you've been
thinking about L twos and stuff like that for 10 years now.
So I know you're a big brain, Steven, I can talk with you
more. So thank you so much for coming
in and and good Shabbos actually.
Thank you for having me. Yes, Shabbat Shalom.
All right, man. Have a good one.
Thank you. Ciao.
All right. All right.
Well, looks like looks like OV decided to join the show at
11:23 AM. It's it's a pleasure to have you
OV. Thank you for joining.
Fucking Internet, man. Like move to a new place.
Get the the fastest Internet you can get in this country and it
still plays up like I'm just. And you've had a leak as well.
Which? I had a few.
Solid start this move. A few leaks, yeah.
A few leaks. And well, yeah, in the new
place. That's horrible.
That's. But there's some nice jerseys
behind you. Are you bringing me a size
large? Yeah, we'll have these in Paris
for for Web Three FC to. One that web Three FC guys.
First of all, can they stop doing their events like 50
minutes away from the conference first and foremost and 2nd?
Pictures aren't in central Paris or in central CCD's like.
It's definitely on central Paris.
And then can they? Can they also other things stop
doing their events, like the same hours of the conference?
That would be great, you know, just putting it out there.
Number one, you will never find a football pitch in the middle
of a city. Number two, people don't.
People don't. People don't go to the
conference usually so. Well, NFT Paris is one of those
conferences that people go to. Proof is in the pudding.
You have a bar set up in our booth area and but you, I agree
with you on a lot of things. I think I I get it.
It's true. Maybe the right the right pitch
is true. But maybe I'm maybe I'm meming.
Maybe I'm exaggerating. I I like the Web 3 football
guys. I don't want to guys I I don't
you know maybe I'm meming that it's not that far just because
last time I was like outside of Brooklyn and everything was
happening like Manhattan. So that's what happened in in
New York and I was so bummed. I'm just salty because I
couldn't play and this time I can't play again because during
the conference and I have to like work it, work the
conference. So I'm just salty because I want
to play. I'm dying to put the rec jersey
on. It represents the colors OK of
of of of rec guy. I have my jersey still in the in
the in the in in my stuff.