1 00:00:00,100 --> 00:00:01,200 Hey there. It's Melissa. 2 00:00:01,200 --> 00:00:04,700 Brunetti and welcome to the mind your own Karma podcast. 3 00:00:15,300 --> 00:00:17,500 Hey, their karma crew. Thanks for joining me for 4 00:00:17,500 --> 00:00:20,000 another episode of mind. Your own Karma. 5 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:23,300 The adoption Chronicles. I just want to say real quick, 6 00:00:23,300 --> 00:00:27,900 we will be approaching 100 episodes at the end of summer 7 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:31,900 and that is super exciting. A great milestone for mind, your 8 00:00:31,900 --> 00:00:35,200 own Karma and myself. So thanks so much for hanging in 9 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:38,100 there with me through all the changes and the twists and 10 00:00:38,100 --> 00:00:41,200 turns. I truly appreciate each and 11 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:42,700 every one. One of you. 12 00:00:43,300 --> 00:00:46,800 So let's jump right into today's episode today. 13 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:49,600 I have a very insightful, young man. 14 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:53,200 Frankie Cohen on the show today. Let me tell you a little bit 15 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:56,500 about Frankie. Frankie was born in Seoul, South 16 00:00:56,500 --> 00:01:00,200 Korea, and adopted at 5 months old to a family in Portland. 17 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:04,599 Oregon being adopted has posed many challenges in his life. 18 00:01:04,900 --> 00:01:09,000 Most of them still unresolved. However, over the past couple 19 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:12,800 years he has been working diligently to try and Himself 20 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:17,100 from the wounds of his past through deep self-reflection 21 00:01:17,100 --> 00:01:20,200 support from his loved ones and the willingness to be a better 22 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:22,900 person. Frankie has come a long way. 23 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:26,300 He, thanks you for listening to his story today. 24 00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:32,700 Here is my interview with Frankie Cohen so we're welcoming 25 00:01:32,700 --> 00:01:35,500 Frankie Cohen to the show today. I Frankie how you doing? 26 00:01:35,800 --> 00:01:39,400 All right, I'm good. Yes, so let's just jump right in 27 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:42,400 and tell us what, you know, about the circumstances has of 28 00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:47,600 your adoption. Well, I know that I was adopted 29 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:52,000 through an agency called Holt's. I think their own organization 30 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:57,200 that hosts a lot of adoptions and Korea, specifically, South 31 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:01,600 Korea, specifically but maybe other areas in Asia and I was 32 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:06,000 adopted at 5 months old, I was in foster care system up until 33 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:09,699 when I was born, when I came to the United States. 34 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:12,800 And yeah, that's pretty much my story. 35 00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:15,900 I don't know too much. On that, I think I had a broken 36 00:02:15,900 --> 00:02:19,800 collarbone. When I was born, my bones are 37 00:02:19,808 --> 00:02:23,100 soft and so I think I did have some like medical issues. 38 00:02:23,100 --> 00:02:26,500 It's right at the beginning. Mmm, which kind of, I don't 39 00:02:26,500 --> 00:02:28,500 know. Complicated things in terms of 40 00:02:28,500 --> 00:02:31,100 just needing, you know, attention and whatnot. 41 00:02:31,100 --> 00:02:34,400 So yeah, so you don't know the circumstances like why your 42 00:02:34,400 --> 00:02:37,000 mother gave you up or you don't know any of that stuff? 43 00:02:37,700 --> 00:02:41,000 Yeah, they kept that pretty private. 44 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:44,000 Unfortunately. Yeah and especially in Korean. 45 00:02:44,100 --> 00:02:47,200 Culture. You know, I think I don't know 46 00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:52,000 this is like the story but like they had me out of wedlock and 47 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:55,500 that's very frowned upon and green societies. 48 00:02:55,600 --> 00:03:01,900 So yeah, I assumed that it was kept pretty secret my birth so 49 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:05,600 and then you are saying the agency that you were adopted 50 00:03:05,600 --> 00:03:09,400 through. Was it all kids from Korea? 51 00:03:09,500 --> 00:03:14,000 Only, or are you think? No, I think I think it was 52 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:18,600 Pretty big in China as well. Okay, yeah. 53 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:22,100 The most mostly Asian adoptions. Yeah, Asia. 54 00:03:22,100 --> 00:03:25,300 Adoptions holds yeah, it's huge. And then we're all those 55 00:03:25,300 --> 00:03:29,300 children Coming to America or all over the world, you know, 56 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:33,400 for that agency? Yeah, I'm pretty sure who is 57 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:40,500 primarily to the United States. There's a big, like, kind of 58 00:03:40,500 --> 00:03:46,800 movement in like the 90s were A lot of children or being adopted 59 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:48,900 from Asia. And whole was one of the 60 00:03:48,900 --> 00:03:52,200 organizations that I was a lot of those adoptions. 61 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:55,800 Yeah. And do, you know, why, why your 62 00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:58,200 adoptive parents wanted to adopt? 63 00:03:58,700 --> 00:04:02,600 Yeah. Sort of my dad's side of the 64 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:07,900 family, had a lot of trouble producing healthy sperm 65 00:04:07,900 --> 00:04:12,800 basically, okay. So there was trouble on that 66 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,300 end. So, Going to take a lot of like 67 00:04:15,500 --> 00:04:19,600 medical procedures to enhance that and my parents didn't want 68 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:24,100 that. And I think yeah, I got lucky 69 00:04:24,100 --> 00:04:29,900 with my parents because they really they're very kind and 70 00:04:29,900 --> 00:04:36,500 understanding of like hardship. I guess in a sense and really 71 00:04:36,500 --> 00:04:40,100 want to make a better life for their friends and family. 72 00:04:40,300 --> 00:04:43,700 And so when they were thinking about having kids, I think 73 00:04:43,700 --> 00:04:47,200 adoption, Option was always kind of on the table even despite the 74 00:04:47,207 --> 00:04:49,800 medical complications. So yeah. 75 00:04:49,900 --> 00:04:52,500 Yeah. I even so they never, they never 76 00:04:52,500 --> 00:04:54,800 had children of their own then, nope. 77 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:58,000 Yeah, I have one other brother and he's also adopted from 78 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:00,400 Korea. So okay but you two aren't 79 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:03,100 related. I mean, biologically know. 80 00:05:03,500 --> 00:05:08,500 Yeah, why did they decide to go through and adopt from Korea? 81 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:12,500 Because they're not Korean right? 82 00:05:12,700 --> 00:05:16,100 No. Okay, yeah, that's a great 83 00:05:16,100 --> 00:05:18,700 question. Yeah, I really don't have 84 00:05:18,700 --> 00:05:20,500 chances for that. Yeah. 85 00:05:22,300 --> 00:05:24,600 And so you just have one other brother. 86 00:05:24,600 --> 00:05:27,400 They didn't adopt anybody else and they have no biological 87 00:05:27,500 --> 00:05:29,500 kids. Yeah, no. 88 00:05:30,300 --> 00:05:33,300 So this might kind of sound like a dumb question, but since you 89 00:05:33,300 --> 00:05:35,500 don't look like any of your family members because our 90 00:05:35,500 --> 00:05:39,900 Caucasian your parents right after parents when you grew up, 91 00:05:39,900 --> 00:05:42,400 did you? That you who are adopted? 92 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:46,300 Yeah, my parents were very open about having the embraced by 93 00:05:46,300 --> 00:05:50,600 adoption. Now, they're open about it. 94 00:05:51,200 --> 00:05:55,200 I embraced it to an extent and then it took a while for me, to 95 00:05:55,200 --> 00:06:00,000 actually come to like full acceptance of it, I think. 96 00:06:00,300 --> 00:06:02,600 Yeah. So they were always open about 97 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:05,400 me being adopted, we would celebrate something called a 98 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:07,000 coming home today. Hmm. 99 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:12,400 So it was like, the day I came to America and And my mom would 100 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:16,000 bring Korean food into the elementary school or whatever 101 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:19,200 and it's cool. Yeah, just celebrate that day. 102 00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:23,700 So yeah, so you kind of touched a little bit on struggling with 103 00:06:23,700 --> 00:06:25,200 coming to terms with being adopted. 104 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:30,600 So talk about that a little bit. Yeah, I think it really like 105 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:35,200 boiled down to when I started Middle School, just Adolescence 106 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:39,700 in generals is hard and trying to figure out you know, your 107 00:06:39,700 --> 00:06:43,000 identity. And what Our and I was pretty 108 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:46,700 harshly. Picked on for being Asian, a, my 109 00:06:46,700 --> 00:06:48,600 school, which was predominantly white. 110 00:06:49,100 --> 00:06:54,600 And so, it confused me more so than anything because I would go 111 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:59,100 home and look at my parents and they were white like, I have, 112 00:06:59,300 --> 00:07:01,800 you know, 20 cousins, they're all white, you know, my whole, 113 00:07:01,900 --> 00:07:04,000 I'm just in a white family. Yeah. 114 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:09,500 And so being bullied for being Asian really kind of made me 115 00:07:09,500 --> 00:07:16,800 start to Isn't my necessity. Mmm and I, you know, develops 116 00:07:16,900 --> 00:07:20,900 very self-deprecating behaviors. And I didn't like the fact that 117 00:07:20,900 --> 00:07:24,400 I was Korean that was really hard to navigate. 118 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:28,800 So yeah. Yeah, I think it really just 119 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:32,500 kind of like pushed me away from a part of myself that was 120 00:07:32,500 --> 00:07:34,100 inherent. Hmm. 121 00:07:34,400 --> 00:07:37,700 And that this Association, you know like anyone right? 122 00:07:37,700 --> 00:07:40,600 The this cessation from yourself. 123 00:07:40,900 --> 00:07:44,200 Causes a lot of problems just in general about, finding out who 124 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:47,200 you are and what your values are and what you care about, what 125 00:07:47,200 --> 00:07:51,100 your morals are. And so, it took me a really long 126 00:07:51,100 --> 00:07:57,200 time to really understand that I'm not just Korean or like, I'm 127 00:07:57,200 --> 00:08:01,300 not just an adopted kid. Like I'm me. 128 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:07,000 Yes, I really have that deep sense of myself because I got 129 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:10,600 pushed out from who I was kind of out of young. 130 00:08:10,700 --> 00:08:14,500 Young age. So yeah, and I'll lose your 131 00:08:15,300 --> 00:08:18,900 authenticity and start questioning who you think you 132 00:08:18,900 --> 00:08:22,900 are or who you should be against who you really are, you know. 133 00:08:23,300 --> 00:08:26,100 So how was your life think growing up in an all-white 134 00:08:26,100 --> 00:08:27,900 family? I mean, was it? 135 00:08:27,900 --> 00:08:32,100 Where did you feel different? Did you feel like you fit in 136 00:08:32,900 --> 00:08:35,400 when I was little? It was, it was, it was great. 137 00:08:42,900 --> 00:08:47,800 That's okay. Yeah, I always say it was good 138 00:08:47,800 --> 00:09:02,400 because I always accepted. it was my, it was my grandmother 139 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:07,400 who She made everyone feel like they are the most special person 140 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:15,700 in the world. you know, it was I think when I was going through 141 00:09:15,700 --> 00:09:21,000 that hard time, you know, she was choose. 142 00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:26,800 I can always trust that she was always gonna be there for me. 143 00:09:29,500 --> 00:09:33,600 And you know, I had my problems with my parents because child 144 00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:41,400 Parenthood so your parents but when I would see my my 145 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:49,400 grandmother, you know, just just full Embrace of love and 146 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:54,500 kindness and compassion, no matter what it was, it was 147 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:58,900 unconditional. And so, You know, I always 148 00:09:58,900 --> 00:10:03,300 trusted her no matter what the other people in my family, you 149 00:10:03,300 --> 00:10:07,600 know, it wasn't as like I never felt a stable of a relationship 150 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:15,100 with people in my family because because of the loss of myself, 151 00:10:15,100 --> 00:10:20,400 and I didn't trust anybody, and but she was always there. 152 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:25,600 So, so important. So you did talk a little bit 153 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:29,000 about being able to sell it. Liberate your culture within 154 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:33,000 your adopted family, besides the day that they got you and write 155 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:35,400 Korean food. Did you guys did they they 156 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:38,100 embrace the culture at all? Yes. 157 00:10:38,100 --> 00:10:40,800 Sort of culture. So deep right. 158 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:43,400 I mean food was a big part of the culture. 159 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:47,600 Yes. And then my uncle actually 160 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:53,000 married a Korean woman. And so he kind of had that tie. 161 00:10:53,300 --> 00:10:56,900 And so we go to her parents and her parents church. 162 00:10:57,300 --> 00:11:02,800 Usually and you know is all in Korean so we didn't really know. 163 00:11:05,500 --> 00:11:09,100 It was cool just to be around people who kind of look like me 164 00:11:09,100 --> 00:11:11,800 so right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. 165 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:15,700 So your sibling was also adopted. 166 00:11:15,700 --> 00:11:17,600 How did you guys get along growing up? 167 00:11:17,700 --> 00:11:22,400 Hmm, not great. Yeah, my end. 168 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:26,700 Yeah, you were older. I'm the younger sibling. 169 00:11:26,900 --> 00:11:28,800 You're the younger sister? Yeah, okay. 170 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:35,900 And you know, I think part of that difficulty of resenting, my 171 00:11:35,900 --> 00:11:40,300 ethnicity. My brother was the, you know, 172 00:11:40,500 --> 00:11:47,000 archetype or person that I saw in myself that I hated mmm. 173 00:11:47,700 --> 00:11:51,800 And I wanted to destroy that part of myself, you know, so to 174 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:55,100 speak. And so, whenever I would be 175 00:11:55,200 --> 00:12:00,400 upset or, you know, I get picked on that day and I would come 176 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:05,400 home and I just, I'd be so angry and I take it out on him. 177 00:12:06,100 --> 00:12:08,600 Hmm. And so it was a tough. 178 00:12:08,900 --> 00:12:11,500 I mean, it was a tough relationship just because for 179 00:12:11,500 --> 00:12:17,100 him, On my part because I just saw him and something that I 180 00:12:17,100 --> 00:12:21,000 didn't like him myself. Yeah, I let him know that. 181 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:27,900 So yeah, that was too bad. I you know, I have a lot of 182 00:12:27,900 --> 00:12:30,000 regret, I have a lot of regrets for that. 183 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:32,400 So how do you guys get along now? 184 00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:34,900 We don't interact really too much. 185 00:12:35,900 --> 00:12:41,700 He lives in Canada with his wife and You know, if he actually 186 00:12:41,700 --> 00:12:45,500 just got married last year, I remember going up to him during 187 00:12:45,500 --> 00:12:47,100 his wedding. I'm just kind of breaking down 188 00:12:47,100 --> 00:12:50,400 crying saying, you know. Yeah. 189 00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:52,900 I'm just sorry. Yeah. 190 00:12:53,100 --> 00:12:58,700 So little by little, you know, I'll pick away at mending. 191 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:00,800 Yeah. Well my relationship. 192 00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:02,000 But yeah. Tough. 193 00:13:02,500 --> 00:13:05,300 Yeah. So we talked a little bit about 194 00:13:05,300 --> 00:13:09,200 how you kind of, you know, lost yourself and your authenticity 195 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:12,000 and Junior High. And you're still a young guy, 196 00:13:12,100 --> 00:13:17,100 but do you feel like you've kind of embraced who you are? 197 00:13:17,500 --> 00:13:20,500 Or are you still trying to figure that out? 198 00:13:21,500 --> 00:13:27,100 Yeah, no, I've been braced it and I really feel, you know, 199 00:13:27,500 --> 00:13:30,100 there's plenty of things that I need to work on and become more 200 00:13:30,100 --> 00:13:33,800 self-aware about and, you know, it's not over but I think 201 00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:38,600 fundamentally I know who I am and not just the good parts, but 202 00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:44,200 like the darker parts. And it's taken me a really long 203 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:48,500 time, but I've slowly been able to kind of accept those parts 204 00:13:48,500 --> 00:13:55,400 about myself and integrate them in ways that I can use to kind 205 00:13:55,400 --> 00:13:58,700 of move through life. You know, life isn't easy. 206 00:13:58,700 --> 00:14:02,700 So you know, sometimes anger is necessary and a lot of anger 207 00:14:02,700 --> 00:14:07,200 when I was kid, and, but it would come out like an explosion 208 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,700 when I was younger. And I've worked really, really 209 00:14:10,700 --> 00:14:15,800 hard about learning to become aware of it learning to use it 210 00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:19,700 in ways that are that are useful and not destructive. 211 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:25,300 So yeah. So I think you had mentioned in 212 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:28,700 an e-mailed to me that. You said it confused you because 213 00:14:28,700 --> 00:14:32,700 your parents were Caucasian. What were you meeting by that? 214 00:14:32,700 --> 00:14:34,200 What were you? What were you thinking? 215 00:14:35,300 --> 00:14:37,600 Like the kids who were picking on me? 216 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:43,400 I mean, it was almost like not humorous per se, but it was 217 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:50,700 confusing because, you know, culturally I'm just an American 218 00:14:50,900 --> 00:14:52,500 white kid. Yeah. 219 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:56,500 Now, Is how I grew up. You know I was fortunate to come 220 00:14:56,500 --> 00:15:01,300 into a very stable family and now I had a good childhood Now 221 00:15:01,300 --> 00:15:05,200 Sports and summer reading programs and friends and, you 222 00:15:05,208 --> 00:15:10,800 know, very very, very typical American Childhood and so then 223 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:16,200 when I would get bullied for, you know, being Asian, I had to 224 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:20,800 wrap my whole head around it because I didn't identify as 225 00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:23,300 that and yet that's how I was being perceived. 226 00:15:23,500 --> 00:15:27,800 Left, right? And so it gave me a very deep 227 00:15:27,800 --> 00:15:30,700 understanding about the psychology of perception in 228 00:15:30,700 --> 00:15:33,600 general, especially from a child's point of view or 229 00:15:34,100 --> 00:15:37,700 prepubescent, whatever Adolescent and so perception is 230 00:15:37,700 --> 00:15:43,300 very important and so yeah that was that was the confusion. 231 00:15:43,300 --> 00:15:45,900 Yeah. So the anger that you carried 232 00:15:45,900 --> 00:15:48,400 because of the bullying and that kind of thing. 233 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:51,300 It sounds like it was more from The Bullying than Anger from 234 00:15:51,300 --> 00:15:53,200 being adopted or was it kind of both? 235 00:15:53,500 --> 00:15:58,100 Kind of intertwined. Yeah, I think the anger came 236 00:15:58,100 --> 00:16:02,200 mostly from the bullying because it was unwarranted but if I were 237 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:05,800 to actually think about like my adoption and I can't really 238 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:08,300 think about it when I was kid because I can probably 239 00:16:08,300 --> 00:16:10,600 understand it all that. Well, but I feel just so 240 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:14,800 grateful. I mean, that's, it's almost 241 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:20,900 Indescribable, right? I mean I was born and then put 242 00:16:20,900 --> 00:16:25,400 into a system that I could have been adopted by anybody. 243 00:16:25,700 --> 00:16:29,000 Yeah. And I'm gonna Pat my parents on 244 00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:33,700 the back here, but I have probably like the most modest 245 00:16:33,700 --> 00:16:38,800 and humble, and hard-working parents that I could ask for. 246 00:16:39,900 --> 00:16:43,500 And it really, it probably saved my life. 247 00:16:43,900 --> 00:16:47,900 Mmm. So that's kind of funny how, you 248 00:16:47,900 --> 00:16:50,500 know, as adoptees were told that we're lucky. 249 00:16:50,700 --> 00:16:53,800 A lot of the time and it is kind of like a lottery. 250 00:16:54,300 --> 00:16:57,500 A lot of adoptees are told, you know that we chose you, but 251 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:02,200 actually, you were just the next one up for adoption like, you 252 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:07,000 weren't chosen most aren't? I mean, I have heard of people 253 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:09,300 that have were there with, you know, five other babies and 254 00:17:09,300 --> 00:17:12,800 then, Were chosen out of those that group of babies but most of 255 00:17:12,808 --> 00:17:15,300 the time it's basically winning the lottery. 256 00:17:15,300 --> 00:17:17,800 You know, when you get that grade adoptive family like that 257 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:20,300 because I mean there's so many adoptees that don't have that 258 00:17:20,300 --> 00:17:22,400 story. I'm one of those two that won a 259 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,500 lottery. So nice. 260 00:17:24,500 --> 00:17:28,300 Yeah, yeah but I mean it could have been it like, is it could 261 00:17:28,300 --> 00:17:31,300 have been, anybody could have been literally anybody. 262 00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:36,500 So you sounds like you get along with your, you know, adoptive 263 00:17:36,500 --> 00:17:39,000 parents. Yeah, that's great. 264 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:41,600 Have you ever searched for your or can you? 265 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:43,800 I don't know what. Heidi would you even search in 266 00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:47,700 Korea for biological relatives? Yeah, I beat difficult again. 267 00:17:47,700 --> 00:17:51,800 I think it comes down to the cultural element of that having 268 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:58,700 a baby out of wedlock is is dishonorable and so I could go 269 00:17:58,700 --> 00:18:02,200 through the organization, but I think it's up to the birth 270 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:07,900 parents to choose whether or not they would want to meet up. 271 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:13,000 Personally, I I had no desire to meet my birth parents. 272 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:17,100 Because yeah, I just think it wouldn't. 273 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:20,700 Like, I don't feel any resentment. 274 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:24,400 Well, that's maybe not true. Actually Yeah. 275 00:18:25,100 --> 00:18:28,500 Interesting right now, right? Yeah. 276 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:32,300 I don't think he would give me kind of the like, I don't know. 277 00:18:32,300 --> 00:18:34,400 I actually haven't thought about that question actually in a 278 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:36,800 while, so I don't know where I went. 279 00:18:36,900 --> 00:18:41,000 Do they do DNA over there like ancestry probably? 280 00:18:41,100 --> 00:18:43,600 Yeah, I'm sure. Yeah, yeah. 281 00:18:44,300 --> 00:18:47,100 So do you think you've suffered any Trauma from your a 282 00:18:47,100 --> 00:18:49,300 relinquishment? You like have any residual 283 00:18:49,300 --> 00:18:55,800 Trauma from Probably, you know, I can't highlight exactly what 284 00:18:55,800 --> 00:18:59,800 it is. But the question that preceded, 285 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:06,900 this one kind of invoke this thought of, well, I have 286 00:19:06,900 --> 00:19:13,100 Tendencies with attachment that coincide with a traumatic 287 00:19:13,100 --> 00:19:16,600 experience. And so, you know, I had a pretty 288 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:18,700 good childhood in the United States. 289 00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:22,800 But that's not to say that it wasn't hard first five months. 290 00:19:23,100 --> 00:19:25,400 Yeah. And especially I think the 291 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:28,500 disconnection from my birth mother. 292 00:19:28,700 --> 00:19:29,900 You know. I think babies need that 293 00:19:29,900 --> 00:19:32,600 chemical bonding or yeah or other. 294 00:19:32,700 --> 00:19:36,900 I didn't get it. So right, so you're in your 20s. 295 00:19:36,900 --> 00:19:39,100 Yeah, yeah, I'm 26. Yeah. 296 00:19:39,100 --> 00:19:41,100 Yeah. You know, most people don't that 297 00:19:41,100 --> 00:19:44,300 doesn't really start hitting home most of the time until like 298 00:19:44,300 --> 00:19:47,400 your 40s and 50s. It seems like from what I've 299 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:50,200 seen out in the adoptee community It's kind of like 300 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:53,900 almost like a midlife crisis, really, but it's about your 301 00:19:53,900 --> 00:19:57,100 adoption and just trying to come to terms with all that that 302 00:19:57,100 --> 00:20:01,300 entails including looking back on your life and being like like 303 00:20:01,300 --> 00:20:04,400 you were saying attachment disorders or, you know, problems 304 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:08,300 with attaching and oh, that's probably why I do that. 305 00:20:08,300 --> 00:20:10,300 I do that thing. I do you know that I don't 306 00:20:10,300 --> 00:20:12,100 really like her. That's not really serving me you 307 00:20:12,100 --> 00:20:14,600 know? But that doesn't usually come a 308 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:18,900 long till later it seems, but I think the community is kind of 309 00:20:18,900 --> 00:20:20,300 coming. Going out now and talking more 310 00:20:20,300 --> 00:20:22,600 about what really happens with adoptions. 311 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:25,100 And so I think the younger Generations are getting there a 312 00:20:25,100 --> 00:20:28,800 little sooner now. So I mean it's a good thing 313 00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:32,700 because I wish I had kind of explored it when I was younger 314 00:20:32,700 --> 00:20:35,400 and kind of gotten through a lot of what I've had to deal with. 315 00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:39,100 But I haven't had to deal with a lot because of my adoption being 316 00:20:39,100 --> 00:20:42,200 so positive. Then that I see in the 317 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:44,000 community. So many people hurting, I'm just 318 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,900 like, oh my gosh, it just breaks my heart because I can't imagine 319 00:20:47,900 --> 00:20:50,800 some of the things that they've Through it's hard enough. 320 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:53,200 Just being adopted like you were saying and being relinquished 321 00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:55,900 and taken from your birth mother and coming to terms with all 322 00:20:55,900 --> 00:20:57,600 that. But then when you have a bad 323 00:20:57,700 --> 00:21:02,100 adoptive experience in the family that just it's horrible. 324 00:21:02,500 --> 00:21:04,900 So I'm so glad to hear it. The positive adoption story 325 00:21:04,900 --> 00:21:09,400 today, so you told me your experience of with adoption is 326 00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:11,500 taught you many things about life. 327 00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:15,900 What is adoption taught, you? I think the most profound thing 328 00:21:15,900 --> 00:21:18,700 that I've learned is that family can be anyone. 329 00:21:20,900 --> 00:21:24,300 You know, like it's not a permanent off of blood per se 330 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:31,100 and so you know, the love that my parents showed me and the 331 00:21:31,100 --> 00:21:34,200 love that my my grandmother and all my family and I have been 332 00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:37,300 very very supportive and encouraging and you know they 333 00:21:37,300 --> 00:21:39,500 want the best for me, they care for me. 334 00:21:39,500 --> 00:21:46,000 So it really drove me to to see the world in that kind of funds 335 00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:50,200 and to understand that People struggle. 336 00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:54,700 I mean, everyone struggles. Right life isn't easy and you 337 00:21:54,700 --> 00:21:57,500 need people to beat it for real. Yeah. 338 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:01,500 Through all stages. And so, you know, drove me to 339 00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:05,600 I'm in school right now to become a clinical psychologist. 340 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:11,300 Hmm, mental health therapist and so I want to be that person who 341 00:22:11,300 --> 00:22:14,900 somebody can turn to when they're having a tough time, 342 00:22:15,300 --> 00:22:19,900 because I was given that From these random people who adopted 343 00:22:19,900 --> 00:22:23,500 me and I'm right. Oh yeah it's just taught me. 344 00:22:23,500 --> 00:22:28,900 Family can be anyone and that you know, showing somebody love 345 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:36,300 and showing love can really turn a bad situation into something 346 00:22:36,300 --> 00:22:41,100 beautiful, mmm. And and I was given that 347 00:22:41,100 --> 00:22:44,700 opportunity and I want to pay it forward as much as I can't. 348 00:22:44,900 --> 00:22:48,200 Yeah. And I mean, adoptee therapist, - 349 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:51,500 are being highly sought out by adoptees. 350 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:56,000 So yeah, that's exciting that you're going to be doing that. 351 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:59,300 You know, I kind of touched on. There's a lot of hurting 352 00:22:59,300 --> 00:23:02,900 adoptees out there. What advice would you have? 353 00:23:02,900 --> 00:23:06,800 For those that are struggling? I mean, you you kind of went 354 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:11,100 through the bullying and then losing your authenticity and 355 00:23:11,100 --> 00:23:13,700 then kind of a learning to embrace it again. 356 00:23:13,900 --> 00:23:17,500 What made you turn around and want to embrace who you were? 357 00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:21,400 There's something that happened where you just sick of not being 358 00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:23,500 who you were. Did you realize you were not 359 00:23:23,500 --> 00:23:25,300 being who you were? Like what happened? 360 00:23:25,700 --> 00:23:29,900 Because you're pretty young to be like, you know, realizing all 361 00:23:29,900 --> 00:23:32,000 that. So, yeah, just wondering like, 362 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,900 how did you do that? I mean, the first thing that 363 00:23:34,900 --> 00:23:38,200 kind of comes to mind, is that I was sick of the person who I was 364 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:39,800 becoming. Mmm. 365 00:23:40,100 --> 00:23:44,800 So through all that turmoil and all that adversity, I started to 366 00:23:44,808 --> 00:23:51,000 become very Nihilistic and cynical and narcissistic, I 367 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,600 think as well. But it's all about me. 368 00:23:53,700 --> 00:23:57,700 Me me, why me? And and sorry. 369 00:23:57,700 --> 00:24:02,900 Blame people, it's your fault. This is why I am who I am or 370 00:24:02,900 --> 00:24:05,700 this is, you know, this situation that made me who I 371 00:24:05,700 --> 00:24:08,900 was. And I don't remember exactly 372 00:24:09,300 --> 00:24:13,700 when it was. But I really started to realize 373 00:24:13,700 --> 00:24:19,500 that I didn't, like, who I was becoming Being you know, I was, 374 00:24:19,500 --> 00:24:23,800 I was hurting people around me, I was hurting loved ones, and I 375 00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:30,100 was hurting myself, and it was only until I realized that it 376 00:24:30,100 --> 00:24:36,600 was my responsibility to take care of my life that I really 377 00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:40,900 started getting into the work of self-improvement. 378 00:24:40,900 --> 00:24:43,800 So speaker self, self, healing, and self grow. 379 00:24:43,900 --> 00:24:47,900 I would say the, What specifically Did you do to start 380 00:24:47,900 --> 00:24:54,500 the healing and growth? I started to, I think it started 381 00:24:54,500 --> 00:25:00,800 with humility was the main thing I got in to some trouble. 382 00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:08,100 And I actually ended up spending a night in jail, that'll wake 383 00:25:08,100 --> 00:25:13,600 you up. And I just remember, I phone 384 00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:16,900 call with my dad who's a criminal defense attorney. 385 00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:20,900 Hmm. And she wasn't all that proud of 386 00:25:20,900 --> 00:25:29,900 me up. And so, you know, I had I was in 387 00:25:30,100 --> 00:25:34,400 handcuffs and And feet, cuffs for the whole night. 388 00:25:35,100 --> 00:25:39,300 And I was just was thinking caps. 389 00:25:39,300 --> 00:25:43,700 L, like, how did I get here, right? 390 00:25:45,700 --> 00:25:49,000 And I was like, I thought about it. 391 00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:54,500 I was like, well, I got myself here and that's when I realized. 392 00:25:54,500 --> 00:25:58,800 Like, I'm the only one who can get myself out also. 393 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:06,200 So that is symbolic for My own self imprisonment and for 394 00:26:06,300 --> 00:26:09,400 ultimate Liberation or Transcendence or whatever you 395 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:13,200 want to call it of, you know, the corrupted self. 396 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:19,900 I had to take responsibility for my actions that's when I started 397 00:26:19,900 --> 00:26:22,800 doing and so. What did you do after that to 398 00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:26,300 start that Journey? Okay, so this is a good segue. 399 00:26:26,300 --> 00:26:30,500 Yes, it was Buddhism. Actually, the structure of 400 00:26:30,500 --> 00:26:34,600 Buddhism that really Help me. And you know buddhism's it's not 401 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:39,300 it's not a religion per se, it's more like a way of life is how I 402 00:26:39,308 --> 00:26:44,700 like to describe it and it talks about that life is hard, life is 403 00:26:44,700 --> 00:26:46,600 suffering. That's the first Noble Truth of 404 00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:49,100 Buddhism. It's like life is really really 405 00:26:49,100 --> 00:26:52,500 difficult and I'm like okay I agree with that. 406 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:59,200 Tell me it's like I said I'm onboard and but second Noble 407 00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:02,900 Truth is why life is suffering. Third, Noble Truth is that 408 00:27:02,900 --> 00:27:06,400 there's a way out in the fourth Noble Truth is that this is the 409 00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:11,800 way and one of the principles in the fourth Noble Truth Is Right 410 00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:17,600 understanding and it basically, this is the humiliating part is 411 00:27:17,700 --> 00:27:21,100 you have to become aware of the reality of the situation. 412 00:27:21,900 --> 00:27:25,000 You can no longer delude yourself into thinking that the 413 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,200 world careened around you to torture you for you know, 414 00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,400 however I date whatever your whole life. 415 00:27:31,500 --> 00:27:33,800 Life. But that you know the things 416 00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:37,100 that you did had a cause and effect. 417 00:27:37,500 --> 00:27:40,700 Yeah. And the effect can be positive 418 00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:44,500 or the effect can be negative and yeah. 419 00:27:44,500 --> 00:27:46,900 Anyways, interesting. Yeah. 420 00:27:48,100 --> 00:27:53,000 And then you are interested in becoming a death Doula and I've 421 00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:55,100 just been hearing about this recently. 422 00:27:55,100 --> 00:27:56,800 Sounds like an up-and-coming thing. 423 00:27:56,800 --> 00:27:58,500 Do you want to explain that a little bit? 424 00:27:58,500 --> 00:28:03,700 What is the death doula? Yeah, death Doula is basically. 425 00:28:05,700 --> 00:28:09,400 I would say it's like a emotional mental health, 426 00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:13,200 counselor for somebody who's in the dying process. 427 00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:19,900 Death is one of those things that it is, the thing that is, 428 00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:22,300 you know, the ultimate unknown, right? 429 00:28:22,300 --> 00:28:27,600 Yeah. And when people are approaching 430 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:34,100 that sage in their life, The death Doula is there to empower 431 00:28:34,100 --> 00:28:36,900 and support the person through their process. 432 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:41,100 The things like, what do you want to do after your dad? 433 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:47,400 Do you want a burial? You made a deal or something. 434 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:54,200 A little bit more difficult would be having a safe space to 435 00:28:54,300 --> 00:28:58,700 talk about the emotions that are bubbling up or that person in 436 00:28:58,700 --> 00:29:00,700 that time. I'm and they're very, very 437 00:29:00,700 --> 00:29:05,800 unique to the problems. Yeah, I had a friend. 438 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:07,700 Stay with me. Who was terminal. 439 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:10,800 I didn't know she was terminal, but it ended up being that way. 440 00:29:11,300 --> 00:29:15,900 And my biggest regret in that was when she would start to want 441 00:29:15,900 --> 00:29:18,100 to talk about that kind of stuff. 442 00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:19,900 I would just be like, nope, we're not going there. 443 00:29:20,100 --> 00:29:21,500 We're not talking about that because that's not going to 444 00:29:21,500 --> 00:29:23,700 happen, you know? And I would just cut her off 445 00:29:23,700 --> 00:29:25,000 like, nope, we're not talking about that. 446 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,300 And that's my biggest regret that I didn't give her that 447 00:29:28,300 --> 00:29:31,300 space. To talk about it. 448 00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:34,800 Yeah. To this day I'm just still like 449 00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:36,900 what I do that. I did it for me it was a selfish 450 00:29:36,900 --> 00:29:38,700 reason. I didn't I didn't want to talk 451 00:29:38,700 --> 00:29:40,900 about it. I didn't want to hear it, you 452 00:29:40,908 --> 00:29:43,500 know. But I yeah, to this day, I still 453 00:29:43,500 --> 00:29:47,500 feel horrible about that. So how do you learn to be a 454 00:29:47,508 --> 00:29:50,100 death? Doula is there like a class or 455 00:29:50,100 --> 00:29:53,400 is it through your psychology classes? 456 00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:56,800 Is this like something new but there are teaching or do you 457 00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:57,800 just? I don't know. 458 00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,300 What do you happen to you? Become a dad? 459 00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:03,100 Abdullah. Yeah, so the like kind of the I 460 00:30:03,100 --> 00:30:05,000 guess. Like professional way. 461 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:08,800 You become a death Doula is it? There's like several different 462 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,300 certification courses. Okay. 463 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:15,700 Then you can take each one, kind of bearing a little from the 464 00:30:15,700 --> 00:30:17,800 other. Do you have to have a psychology 465 00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:21,700 background to know do that? Now, that's kind of the other 466 00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:25,200 one of the prerequisites. Basically is a predisposition, 467 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,800 like, naturally to be able to talk about death. 468 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:32,300 Yeah. And so I've had a lot of death 469 00:30:32,300 --> 00:30:38,100 in my life in general and I've always had an inclination to not 470 00:30:38,100 --> 00:30:43,700 look at it as something that I lost per se, but more as part of 471 00:30:43,700 --> 00:30:49,200 life, And I was always curious about it. 472 00:30:50,100 --> 00:30:53,000 So and that was when I was really young really, really 473 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:57,200 young. So I've always been fascinated 474 00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:03,500 by death and which has kind of allowed me to hold those spaces 475 00:31:03,900 --> 00:31:09,100 for people to talk about it. Because I'm interested in it as 476 00:31:09,100 --> 00:31:13,200 opposed to I think, you know, maybe the more normal thing 477 00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:15,000 would be to be scared of it and I don't know. 478 00:31:15,100 --> 00:31:18,000 Yeah, not that much fear about it, but I don't. 479 00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:21,300 So yeah, yeah. So the other thing that you do 480 00:31:21,300 --> 00:31:25,700 is you do Dharma talks in your area and I don't think a lot of 481 00:31:25,700 --> 00:31:29,000 people even know what Dharma is, so you want to talk about that a 482 00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:30,900 little bit? Yeah, Dharma. 483 00:31:30,900 --> 00:31:33,700 And the kind of like the sense that I'm talking about it is 484 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:35,800 just the teachings of the Buddha. 485 00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:40,800 So there's three jewels of Buddhism the Buddha, which is 486 00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:44,300 the goal, and that just means the enlightened one, the 487 00:31:44,300 --> 00:31:48,600 awakened one. So it's self-awareness, the 488 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:55,300 Sangha, which is the community. So that's who helps you along 489 00:31:55,300 --> 00:31:59,900 the way. And then the Dharma, which is 490 00:31:59,900 --> 00:32:03,300 the teachings, and that's how you get there. 491 00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:08,400 Mmm. And so the dharmically Us is 492 00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:12,500 Buddhist principles in the lens of daily life. 493 00:32:13,100 --> 00:32:14,000 What I teach? Yeah. 494 00:32:14,500 --> 00:32:17,800 Okay cool. I love talking about that stuff. 495 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:21,800 Yeah. Do you follow Buddhism of it all 496 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:26,000 you know, I kind of take a little bit from here and there 497 00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:29,900 but mostly yeah I don't know a lot about the intricacies of it 498 00:32:29,900 --> 00:32:35,900 like you do but the philosophy of it I think is what I embrace. 499 00:32:36,300 --> 00:32:38,200 About it. And like I said, I just, you 500 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:41,900 know, whatever feels good to me and that changes, you know, as I 501 00:32:41,900 --> 00:32:45,200 get older too is that maybe? I don't believe that anymore, 502 00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:48,800 but I used to believe 20 years ago, you know, I think as you 503 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:51,200 grow and change that kind of changes as well. 504 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:57,600 So, is there any advice that you would have for adoptees that are 505 00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:09,000 struggling? It's kind of cliche, but I think 506 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:13,200 trust your gut as something that I would tell people just in 507 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:17,600 general, you know, that means you have to listen to your gut. 508 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:19,500 It's easy. To get caught up in like 509 00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:25,700 everybody else's voice. Hmm, But if you can quiet the 510 00:33:25,700 --> 00:33:32,400 mind and find your intuition. Listen to that. 511 00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,700 Yeah. Listen to that there. 512 00:33:35,700 --> 00:33:38,800 Anything else you'd want to share about anything that we 513 00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:43,600 didn't cover like we covered it? Yeah, no, I think. 514 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:46,200 Yeah, this is fantastic. I really enjoyed. 515 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:49,900 Yeah, yeah. Well, thanks for coming on today 516 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:52,500 and sharing your story, we're educating the world and one 517 00:33:52,500 --> 00:33:54,500 story at a time. You know, whether it's a good 518 00:33:54,500 --> 00:33:57,100 adoption story or about adoption stories. 519 00:33:57,100 --> 00:34:00,200 They're all educating the world about what really happens with 520 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:02,300 adoption. So thanks for sharing today. 521 00:34:03,600 --> 00:34:08,699 Thank you for having me. This was such a sweet interview 522 00:34:08,699 --> 00:34:12,500 for me. I have not interviewed someone 523 00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:19,400 so young and yet wanting to work on himself and be a better 524 00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:25,199 person at the age of 26. So many adoptees don't even 525 00:34:25,199 --> 00:34:29,600 realize that their adoption is affecting their entire lives. 526 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:35,000 Until we are in our 40s and 50s. But I'm telling you because we 527 00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:38,800 as These are coming out and telling our stories, we're 528 00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:42,900 getting the word out about adoption and how it affects us. 529 00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:47,400 It's going to help these, younger Generations realize it 530 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,800 quicker than we did. And this is the whole reason I 531 00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:53,699 do. This podcast is to educate the 532 00:34:53,699 --> 00:34:59,900 world, but this young man at such an early age, is wanting to 533 00:34:59,900 --> 00:35:04,500 be the best version of himself the most authentic version of 534 00:35:04,500 --> 00:35:07,700 himself. And he wants to work on it at 535 00:35:07,700 --> 00:35:09,800 such a young age. It's so inspiring. 536 00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:14,700 And during the interview as I was asking Frankie questions. 537 00:35:14,700 --> 00:35:20,200 I could just feel him thinking about what I asked and just 538 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:25,300 trying to dig deeper and I'm sure as the week's pass after we 539 00:35:25,300 --> 00:35:29,400 did our interview that he will continue to process and learn 540 00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:34,400 from what was asked of him during this interview, it can be 541 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:39,900 such a heavy topic. And I don't usually give my 542 00:35:39,900 --> 00:35:44,000 guests the questions ahead of time unless they ask because I 543 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:46,500 like the interview to be spontaneous. 544 00:35:46,500 --> 00:35:49,900 I don't even do a pre-interview with anyone sometimes. 545 00:35:49,900 --> 00:35:53,000 I don't even know what my guest is going to look like. 546 00:35:53,300 --> 00:35:59,800 It's new and fresh and just I love the spontaneity of kind of 547 00:35:59,808 --> 00:36:02,200 just doing it on the fly like that. 548 00:36:02,500 --> 00:36:05,700 I think it's more real, it's more authentic. 549 00:36:06,300 --> 00:36:10,800 And that way, there's no scripted answers, it is just on 550 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:16,400 the Fly truthful, whatever pops into your emotions in mind in 551 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:18,300 that moment to answer that question. 552 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:22,400 So for me it just feels like it gives a more true and authentic 553 00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:26,600 Flair to the interview. And I've had many guests email 554 00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:29,700 me afterwards saying, you know that question you asked me? 555 00:36:30,700 --> 00:36:33,600 I thought about it later? And this came to me and that 556 00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:36,900 came to me and it really got me thinking Processing. 557 00:36:37,500 --> 00:36:41,700 So that's why I do it in the style that I do and it is my 558 00:36:41,700 --> 00:36:46,800 hope that some of the questions I'm asking my guests, get you to 559 00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:52,800 think and process about your own situation and I hope it helps. 560 00:36:53,300 --> 00:36:58,800 I know that hearing adoptees stories can be so validating, 561 00:36:59,300 --> 00:37:02,100 but I hope that you are asking some of these questions of 562 00:37:02,100 --> 00:37:05,000 yourself that I am asking of my guests. 563 00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:09,000 So that That you can get something out of it as well. 564 00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:13,400 And speaking of answering the interview questions that I'm 565 00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:16,600 asking of my guests, have you thought about coming on the 566 00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:21,800 podcast and telling your story? Trust me when I say there is 567 00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:28,400 someone out there waiting to hear your specific story and 568 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:33,200 your story will help so many others out there you have no 569 00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,400 idea. The impact that You can have on 570 00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:41,500 fellow adoptees and those in the constellation if you would like 571 00:37:41,500 --> 00:37:44,700 to get a hold of me, you can email me, at mind your own Karma 572 00:37:44,700 --> 00:37:48,000 at gmail.com. If you want to know more about 573 00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:52,100 me and the podcast, you can go to my website, mind your own 574 00:37:52,100 --> 00:37:56,300 Karma.com. If you have been enjoying mind 575 00:37:56,300 --> 00:38:01,000 your own karma for a while, now please subscribe to the podcast. 576 00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:04,100 It really helps the algorithms and it helps get the word out 577 00:38:04,100 --> 00:38:08,100 about adoption. As always, take what you need 578 00:38:08,100 --> 00:38:12,700 and leave what you don't and always remember to mind your own 579 00:38:12,700 --> 00:38:15,300 Karma. I'll see you next time. 580 00:38:05,900 --> 00:38:10,200 As always, take what you need and leave what you don't and 581 00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,200 always remember to mind your own Karma. 582 00:38:14,100 --> 00:38:15,300 I'll see you next time.