1 00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:08,320 Welcome to Just a Dog podcast. I'm your host Nadine. 2 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:10,840 Today I'm speaking with Sam Walker. 3 00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:13,920 Aaron's known to many as Sam the Dog coach. 4 00:00:14,520 --> 00:00:17,960 Sam is a force free trainer and canine behaviour practitioner 5 00:00:18,160 --> 00:00:21,600 who works with dogs and they're humans to build calmer, kinder 6 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:24,960 and safer households. Her work spans puppy 7 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:29,240 development, behaviour consults, separation anxiety support and 8 00:00:29,240 --> 00:00:32,880 the messy real life situations that never fit neatly into 9 00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:37,080 training manuals. Sam also has two rescue site 10 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:41,440 hounds of her own, Ivy the greyhound and Rayner the Galgo, 11 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:43,800 whose stories shape much of her practise. 12 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:47,880 What I admire about Sam is her honesty and vulnerability. 13 00:00:48,560 --> 00:00:51,920 There's no quick fixes here, no performative confidence. 14 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:56,200 Her approach is grounded in compassion, science, and a deep 15 00:00:56,200 --> 00:01:00,080 respect for individual dogs, especially those who arrive in 16 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:03,560 our homes with history on their bodies and their nervous 17 00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:07,160 systems. In this conversation, we explore 18 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:11,440 what safety means for a dog, how fierce sits in the body, why so 19 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:15,160 many guardians feel overwhelmed, and what it really looks like to 20 00:01:15,160 --> 00:01:17,600 support a dog who is learning to trust again. 21 00:01:18,600 --> 00:01:22,640 We also talk about fostering and the emotional reality of making 22 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:26,160 choices that put a dog's well-being ahead of our own 23 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:30,360 expectations. It is a gentle searching episode 24 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:33,640 that invites you to slow down and look more closely at the 25 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:38,520 dogs in your life, not through an obedience lens, but through a 26 00:01:38,520 --> 00:01:40,920 human one. Let's begin. 27 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:47,080 Sam, welcome to Just the Dog podcast. 28 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:51,160 I would love to know more about your journey with Project Galgo 29 00:01:51,160 --> 00:01:55,320 but also how you became a dog trainer and behaviourist. 30 00:01:55,560 --> 00:01:59,040 Actually, I used to be an actor back in the day and puppeteer 31 00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:00,760 really randomly. So I did some acting from 32 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:04,880 puppetry, real like variety of stuff, but always on the side 33 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:08,120 was dogs. So it used to be that I was a 34 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:11,720 dog Walker and then I did holiday dog stays and I had a 35 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:14,240 few clients whose dogs would come and stay with us when 36 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:16,840 they're on holiday. And then I just loved, I just 37 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:18,280 loved dogs. Remember my husband saying to 38 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:22,560 me, you are always at your happiest when you are with or 39 00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:26,640 talking about dogs. So then I started doing short 40 00:02:26,640 --> 00:02:31,360 behavioural courses just for fun, did a whole variety of 41 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:38,120 different things, Tacomas and then got get a larger diploma 42 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:40,720 with the ISCP again, that was really useful. 43 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:44,560 That was in 2020 and I just had the time because of all the 44 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:47,040 lockdowns and stuff. So I did a lot of studying then 45 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:50,640 and started sort of tentatively with puppy classes and then 46 00:02:50,640 --> 00:02:53,920 started taking on the odd behavioural course and just sort 47 00:02:53,920 --> 00:02:56,560 of grown from then really. Yeah. 48 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:59,960 And yeah, the enrichment videos were mainly for my mind fun. 49 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:03,120 But yeah, I'm really glad that people find them useful because 50 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:07,480 I think there is a real, I want to say Gap, but people often 51 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:08,800 don't know what to do with their dogs. 52 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:11,520 And they buy all these expensive toys that dogs will play with 53 00:03:11,520 --> 00:03:14,040 for once or twice and then that's it. 54 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:17,160 Or they feel like they have to do far more with their dogs 55 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:19,920 outside and take them here and there and do the errands with 56 00:03:19,920 --> 00:03:22,960 them and go running with that. And for the majority of dogs, 57 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:24,560 actually, it's just far too much. 58 00:03:24,560 --> 00:03:26,800 And just living in our world is far too much. 59 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:30,800 So just having simple activities that you can do with home, the 60 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:33,160 stuff you've already got in the house, you know, Amazon boxes 61 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:37,440 and packaging and towels and, and you know, whatever egg boxes 62 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:39,960 and all of this, it's actually, it's something nice that you can 63 00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:41,040 do. It's great if there's kids in 64 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:43,600 the house 'cause it's like, it's a nice little crafty thing that 65 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:45,840 kids can do. And it's just a nice way for 66 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:50,160 dogs to use some of those natural instincts, the sniffing, 67 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,280 the tearing, the chewing, the the search and finding. 68 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:56,960 And I love doing treat searches in the garden, call them 69 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,120 treasure hunts. And my 3 year old does them at 70 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:00,920 the moment. Every day she asks if she can do 71 00:04:00,920 --> 00:04:03,440 a treasure hunt for the dogs and she'll hide food all around the 72 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:05,280 garden. And it's, yeah, it's great. 73 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:08,640 But all of those things are, yeah are brilliant. 74 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:13,240 Just ways for the dogs to just decompress and let out a little 75 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:17,360 bit of innate dogness. Some drive. 76 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:18,360 Yeah. It's so funny. 77 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:22,720 I've recently realised that whenever do not has a treat 78 00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:25,640 search or does a treat search as you call it, she relieves 79 00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:27,720 herself soon after. Yeah, it's. 80 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:29,800 I don't know what it is. It's like something in our brain 81 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:31,960 goes. Yeah, yeah, definitely. 82 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:34,520 I always find that like if there's, if they're on strike, 83 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:37,360 mine say if there's fireworks that are, but sure about going 84 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:40,720 out for a wee and if I can get them sniffing, if I can throw 85 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:44,000 some treats and they're sniffing the grass, they nearly always 86 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:46,240 will then do away. So just that sort of 87 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:50,120 concentration on sniffing and finding something will often, I 88 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:53,640 mean, sniffing is a is a, you know, it does actually lower the 89 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:55,920 heart rate, lower the blood pressure. 90 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:59,720 So I think it is sort of dogs aren't quite feeling if their 91 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:01,960 brain is somewhere else. It will help just relax them 92 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:05,840 enough to go the. Magical powers of olfactory. 93 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:14,240 So I was just listening to your podcast episode with just with 94 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:17,280 the dog, that dog. With with the wonderful Harriet. 95 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:21,320 Yes, I think you recorded it during COVID time and so I 96 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:23,880 learned a little bit more about your both of your dogs. 97 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:27,960 So we've got Ivy and Rayna. I think you had the dogs before 98 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:31,160 you became a mom. So how did that change your 99 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:36,560 perspective over time? Yeah, it's you know what being a 100 00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:41,960 mom and also being a mom to, well, to little girls. 101 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:45,920 Now I've got one or three-year old and also two dogs and the 102 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:48,560 chicken dough. It's been, it's been very 103 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:55,560 humbling actually, because when I just had the dogs, I already 104 00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:59,440 was, you know, advising people on how to prepare dogs for 105 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:02,120 babies and children and thing ways that children can interact 106 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:03,280 with dogs. This is before I even had 107 00:06:03,280 --> 00:06:06,120 children myself. And a lot of that has come in 108 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,800 really useful. It's been wonderful but also 109 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:13,320 also also tough. But yeah, I guess to go back, we 110 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:20,040 started with just Ivy. So we adopted her 2018-2019. 111 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:22,000 I think she's an ex racing greyhound. 112 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:26,520 Hypical ex racer. Immediately jumped on our beds, 113 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:29,840 tried to be all our pizza, just made herself right home. 114 00:06:29,840 --> 00:06:33,280 Immediately loves the sofa, yeah, loves, loves a bit of 115 00:06:33,280 --> 00:06:36,840 fast, a bit weary around other dogs who certain X racing traits 116 00:06:36,840 --> 00:06:39,000 that you see you know where they've not been socialised very 117 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:41,200 well. Yeah, she's, she's, she's been 118 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:45,760 great. And yeah, we had her for about a 119 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:51,120 year, about a year or so. And then we decided to Foster 120 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:57,640 and we fostered Raina. It wasn't, it wasn't Project 121 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:01,000 Galgo at the time became Project Galgo, but it was Helena who 122 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:02,760 runs Project Galgo. So that was who I have my 123 00:07:02,760 --> 00:07:05,720 dealings with. And we sort of said, you know, 124 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:08,840 we'd like to foster. We have this greyhound who likes 125 00:07:08,840 --> 00:07:10,400 some dogs, doesn't like all dogs. 126 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:14,120 She sort of likes like old nervous dogs that are just going 127 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:16,760 to mainly leave her alone. And she said, I think Rayna 128 00:07:16,760 --> 00:07:18,600 might be really great. She's really timid. 129 00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:22,080 And let's see how they get on. And they got on really well. 130 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:26,160 They're not besties, but they really cohabit really well. 131 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:30,080 Yeah, we fostered her with and we did intend to really just 132 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:33,160 foster. I am a failed foster. 133 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:37,480 And she just was so scared of everyone. 134 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:39,400 Raina, she came. She's missing an ear. 135 00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:41,680 I don't know. I'm sure you're aware a lot of 136 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:44,040 the a lot of the gal goes we get it's quite common they're 137 00:07:44,040 --> 00:07:47,480 missing an ear. It's a punishment that they seem 138 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:50,360 to get where. Yeah, like any a cut off, which 139 00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:52,560 is awful. Some of them have no ears. 140 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:55,880 And yeah, poor Raina's just got one ear covered in scars. 141 00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:00,600 It's got like a weird hip and there's all, all sorts going on 142 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:07,240 with her, bless her. And but just so gentle, so timid 143 00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:09,440 and was very scared of myself, my husband at first. 144 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:13,600 We just hide under the table, but very slowly began to trust 145 00:08:13,640 --> 00:08:16,520 us. And yeah, very much a flight 146 00:08:16,520 --> 00:08:18,400 risk. We got the attractive tracker 147 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:20,960 straight away. It was very much like she's a, 148 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:23,240 if you get the fight flight freeze. 149 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:26,520 She's a she's a flighter. Like she gets a spook. 150 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:29,640 She's she's gone, but I think it was a we only made it about two 151 00:08:29,640 --> 00:08:32,720 weeks in and my husband said should we keep her? 152 00:08:34,159 --> 00:08:37,880 Which is awful because I respect people who foster so much. 153 00:08:37,919 --> 00:08:42,440 It's so difficult to bring a dog into your home and give it love 154 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:47,600 and help it and support it and then to, you know, move it 155 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:51,600 along. I just think is such a best 156 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:54,680 skill and so noble and I wish that I could have done it. 157 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:56,520 But we just fell in love with her. 158 00:08:56,600 --> 00:09:02,480 And I think because Ivy was very unsure about most dogs, but 159 00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:04,960 actually there was just no dramas. 160 00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:07,920 They just seem to cohabit really, really nicely. 161 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:10,080 We're like, yeah, let's let's keep her. 162 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:15,000 So she's been with us since. And yeah, she's she's great and 163 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:17,160 still, still nervous. Not of us is. 164 00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:20,280 She. She's so much better. 165 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:24,360 She's so much better. It used to be that if, and we're 166 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:26,880 very lucky, that her way of dealing with her nervousness is 167 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:31,480 just to remove herself. She's not a Barker, a growler. 168 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:35,840 She just will hide. If we had someone over initially 169 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:40,200 she would hide the other side of the house under a table or at 170 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:41,800 the point where she will be in the room. 171 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:45,080 If we have a visitor over or friends over, she will be in the 172 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:47,600 room. She's a bit unsure and if they 173 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:50,160 get up, she might get up as well, but then she'll settle 174 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:53,600 again. She has got a bigger circle. 175 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:57,440 So some members of our family now she's she's like a lot. 176 00:09:57,440 --> 00:09:59,840 She will actually sit, sit with them and get up on the sofa with 177 00:09:59,840 --> 00:10:01,840 them. So she's a circle has gotten 178 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:03,880 bigger. She would never let a stranger 179 00:10:03,880 --> 00:10:05,600 stroke her. But that's just her. 180 00:10:05,600 --> 00:10:08,120 And you look at only see all of her scars and you think, yeah, I 181 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:09,800 get it. She needs time to know that 182 00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:11,720 they're safe. Great with the kids. 183 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:15,280 Really, really great with the kids in that they are good with 184 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:16,880 her. Like I like to think I'm I've 185 00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:20,320 managed the situation well and they're actually they're very my 186 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:22,640 3 year old is incredibly gentle with them. 187 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:27,240 If they are my one, if my kids are playing and it the noise is 188 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:29,440 a bit much, she will just remove herself. 189 00:10:29,440 --> 00:10:31,840 She just gets up and goes to a different room. 190 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:34,080 But she just knows when things are getting too much. 191 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:38,840 But aside from that, she's she's just yeah, we used to when had 192 00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:42,680 the baby camera sometimes I checked the baby Cam and she's 193 00:10:42,680 --> 00:10:45,240 worked her way into the room and she's just sniffing the baby 194 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:47,800 through the bars just to make sure she's OK before she goes to 195 00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:49,720 bed. But when she was found roaming 196 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:52,400 the streets in Spain, she had puppies with her. 197 00:10:52,760 --> 00:10:56,440 So she does definitely seem she when we have a baby in the 198 00:10:56,440 --> 00:10:58,600 house. She's very much, it's the only 199 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:02,600 time she gets very, she gets very woofy in terms of she very 200 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:05,840 much, if we're on a walk, she'll just woof to the outside world. 201 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:08,040 It's like letting her know, like, I don't know, because we 202 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:11,000 have the baby with us in the carrier, she just becomes very, 203 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:14,520 I guess, protective. But she, she very much seems to 204 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:20,600 be very interested and fond of the little little babies. 205 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:23,000 And actually, if we have small children over, she's not scared 206 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:26,160 of them. It's very much just grown up 207 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:30,120 people who obviously at some point have hurt her that, yeah, 208 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:32,400 she's wary of. Do you know the other day on a 209 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:34,880 walk, we could hear a baby crying? 210 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:38,680 I think mom was probably putting the baby into the car and the 211 00:11:38,680 --> 00:11:42,360 and the kid was just, you know, crying their little heart out 212 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:45,840 and do know, it's just like she just, it was almost like she was 213 00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:48,240 concerned. She was pointing her entire body 214 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:51,800 towards the car and she just kept looking at me like, you 215 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:54,200 know, and I thought to myself, oh, there's something there. 216 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:57,520 Because when she's when she sees a group of children, loud 217 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:00,840 children, she'll avoid them. Yeah, it's it's a lot. 218 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:05,400 It's a lot for them. Children are loud, unpredictable 219 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:08,600 in their movements. They say what they're going to 220 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:11,360 do. They are at certain age they are 221 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:14,440 very wobbly on their feet. They fall over a heart. 222 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:17,920 It's it's it's tough for them. And this is all quite new. 223 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:20,160 So I'm going to this is this is coming from honest place because 224 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:23,160 this is all very like happened in the last week or two new. 225 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:27,200 But I so Ivy now is about 11, so. 226 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:30,680 Yeah, yeah, 11. And I, I feel like she's, she's 227 00:12:30,680 --> 00:12:33,120 not really a kid dog. She likes people who are going 228 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:34,880 to give her food. She likes to go fast. 229 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:39,080 She's sort of she's she's like she's always been fine with 230 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:41,400 children. She's not a dog that enjoys 231 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:44,000 children. If they've got food for her, 232 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:47,280 she'll want the food aside. Yeah. 233 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:50,440 She's never you know, when we used to visit my see my niece 234 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:53,160 and nephew she'd always just keep her distance and when we 235 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:55,560 had one baby I felt like managed it. 236 00:12:55,560 --> 00:12:57,240 She wasn't. Once she realised the baby 237 00:12:57,240 --> 00:12:59,720 wasn't really doing much, bored a bit. 238 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:03,840 When we had one toddler I felt like we managed the situation. 239 00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:06,520 It was all OK. Then we had a newborn and a 240 00:13:06,520 --> 00:13:09,120 toddler and again I felt like, you know, management management. 241 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:13,280 Then now we've got 2 toddlers that are running around and 242 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:16,240 screaming and playing and falling over and doing all 243 00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:17,720 sorts. Myself, my husband have 244 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:23,320 definitely sensed Ivy is making it very clear that she is not 245 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:26,640 happy with the chaos, the situation. 246 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:28,800 She won't remove herself like Rayna though. 247 00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:32,760 So we have had a couple of like snaps we had. 248 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:35,560 So which have been quite upsetting because also I'd never 249 00:13:35,560 --> 00:13:38,040 want to be putting Ivy in a situation where she's getting 250 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:40,600 that stressed. And we have tried a lot of 251 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:42,480 management. We've got baby gates everywhere. 252 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:45,080 We've got the dog beds, they're allowed on our beds. 253 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:47,040 So we've tried, you know, when we're in the living room, the 254 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:49,800 dogs have the run of the rest of the house because all of us 255 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:54,640 being in one room, I know my dog, you know, Ivy, because, you 256 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:58,240 know, yawning and looking a bit unsure and you can tell when 257 00:13:58,240 --> 00:14:00,440 your dog is just isn't and it's nothing. 258 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:01,920 My children. And then they're not even 259 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:03,640 touching her. They're just having fun 260 00:14:03,640 --> 00:14:06,880 together. So we tried a lot of management 261 00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:11,160 and Ivy struggles with that because she just wants to be 262 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:13,600 with us. She will eventually settle. 263 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:16,720 She just looks a bit unhappy about it. 264 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:20,360 And this has been going on for a little while and obviously, you 265 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:22,880 know, like right now my kids are a nursery and she's having a 266 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:25,720 lovely time just in the piece. And I try and take them, you 267 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:29,520 know, lovely long walks when I can and give you enrichment and 268 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:31,560 choose. And in the summer it was fine 269 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:33,560 because we had the garden they could just relax in. 270 00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:36,080 And, you know, I'm trying to do like all of the things I have 271 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:40,080 advised other people to do. And then there gets to a point 272 00:14:40,080 --> 00:14:43,400 where myself, my husband had this talk when I don't think 273 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:44,840 she's very happy here at the moment. 274 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:48,280 Sorry. That's so tough because she's 275 00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:50,640 been there for so long before the kids. 276 00:14:50,640 --> 00:14:53,760 And then, oh, you make it very emotional because I, I mean, 277 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:56,360 it's such a hard decision to make, isn't it? 278 00:14:56,360 --> 00:14:59,160 Like what's best for your family and then what's best? 279 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:00,560 I will. Totally persevere. 280 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:04,640 I'm like it's fine, I can make it work on two hours sleep. 281 00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:05,880 It's fine. I've got it. 282 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:08,360 Choose upstairs, kids downstairs. 283 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:10,560 The three-year old now obviously she opens the doors and was 284 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:13,840 like, I need a wee and then the dogs run up down. 285 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:17,120 So it's all, it's honestly, it's just constant like management. 286 00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:20,280 I would feel like it's fine, she's an old girl now, I will 287 00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:22,560 manage it. But then we have this option 288 00:15:22,560 --> 00:15:27,840 where my mum and dad adore her. She's actually stayed with them 289 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:32,120 while we've been on holiday and they very lucky they, they have 290 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:33,840 a lovely big garden. They spent their time, they 291 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:36,000 spent a lot of the time the Lake District where they've got a 292 00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:38,240 lovely bit of land. They've got a dog that she gets 293 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:42,680 on well with and they have said, well, look, she can come and 294 00:15:42,680 --> 00:15:47,160 stay with us and then when we go on holiday, she comes back down 295 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:48,800 to you. So it'll be a bit of a timeshare 296 00:15:48,800 --> 00:15:53,000 situation, which is so it's sort of if I'm, if I'm thinking just 297 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:56,920 about the fact I'm thinking she's much prefer that because 298 00:15:56,920 --> 00:16:00,320 my mum and dad are retired, they're in the house a lot, They 299 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:02,320 have another dog. She gets home well with, it's 300 00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:04,560 peaceful. She won't be bothered by 301 00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:07,840 constant noise and this and that and being woken up in the night. 302 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:10,520 She will be actually, she gets spoilt rotten. 303 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,600 They give us so many. And so she will be happier. 304 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:15,960 And when she comes down to visit us, she'll be like, I'm here 305 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,320 again. But when I think with it, with 306 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:20,840 emotion behind it, and I think about the fact that we've had 307 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:25,440 her now, you know, for 7-8 years and she's an old girl and the 308 00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:28,160 sort of the path that you want to take with your dog as they 309 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:34,400 reach old age, this was not it. But I think you have to like 310 00:16:34,400 --> 00:16:38,760 remove your own sort of ego and emotion from it and just look at 311 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:41,680 the facts. My husband said what, what would 312 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:45,160 you, what would you say if this was a client and they were 313 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:47,400 explaining to you all the management and all the things 314 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:49,800 that they were doing? And I would say, well, that I 315 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:52,440 would say to them, I think actually spending the majority 316 00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:56,200 of time with parents was the best thing, you know, and you 317 00:16:56,200 --> 00:17:01,120 have to sort of, yeah, do do that because selfishly, I'm 318 00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:02,920 like, she's my dog. I wanted to stay with me. 319 00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:06,880 I'll manage it. But also, you know, it's not 320 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:08,720 really fair on her. It's not really fair on the 321 00:17:08,720 --> 00:17:11,720 kids. So it's I think that's will be 322 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:13,960 the right way forward. If there's a motion coming out, 323 00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:16,319 it's because this is literally an ongoing conversation at the 324 00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:20,000 moment. Yeah, it's very, it's very broad 325 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:21,760 and you're right in the thick of it. 326 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:25,599 And having to make that decision is not easy, just isn't. 327 00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:28,560 Luckily, you do have an alternative option. 328 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:30,960 Where she'll still be in our lives and will still come and 329 00:17:30,960 --> 00:17:33,160 stay with us, but she will have more peace. 330 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:36,960 It's been very humbling though, because I have part of my job 331 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:39,760 has been visiting people who have been struggling with 332 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:43,560 integrating dogs and children and, and preparing their dogs 333 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:46,160 for children. And you feel like when you're 334 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:49,160 doing that, you feel like I've, I've got this, you know, and I 335 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:50,760 have been using all of the tools. 336 00:17:50,760 --> 00:17:54,440 And it's just gotten to a point where at the moment, at this 337 00:17:54,440 --> 00:17:57,760 current stage that we're in actually is impacting on her 338 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,520 quality of life. And I feel like that is a better 339 00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:03,440 option for her current. And who knows, then it might, 340 00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:06,280 things might change again, you know, if she hopefully will have 341 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:09,360 more time with her. But at this current moment, I 342 00:18:09,360 --> 00:18:12,200 think is it that that is looking best. 343 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:14,720 But it has, it has been quite humbling, definitely. 344 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:18,240 I think it's amazing how you've been able to tune into them to 345 00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:22,920 really read Ivy, to really pick up on, you know, what her needs 346 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:24,720 are as well. Because I think typically what 347 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:28,360 would happen is there would be frustration that builds in the 348 00:18:28,360 --> 00:18:33,800 owner or the guardian because maybe fear not really 349 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:36,400 understanding. So, you know, maybe the dog 350 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:40,560 would reach the bottom of their stress bucket and then, you 351 00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:43,520 know, growl or snap or whatever. And it would feel like this 352 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:47,320 enormous, huge problem. But people might not understand 353 00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:50,440 how that came to be because it's not an instant thing, right? 354 00:18:50,440 --> 00:18:52,440 It kind of happens gradually over time. 355 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,320 They reach their limit and then it's like you're not listening 356 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:59,880 to me or I think it's amazing that you tune in to their needs 357 00:18:59,880 --> 00:19:04,600 and realise what's causing this particular expression, I guess. 358 00:19:04,880 --> 00:19:07,520 Well, yeah, I think with Ivy that, I mean, that's exactly it. 359 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:13,040 She's just for most, for a lot of dogs, it wouldn't be that big 360 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:15,320 deal. But for whatever reason, and 361 00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:17,400 also I think she's becoming a bit more intolerant and just 362 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:20,000 getting older. I also should say that we're 363 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:23,560 having a full blood work done just to make sure that she there 364 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:28,280 isn't anything else going on. She doesn't seem in any pain, 365 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:31,360 but but I would always say if there has been any change in 366 00:19:31,360 --> 00:19:33,680 behaviour, yeah, definitely vet check. 367 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:40,320 But she just seems that even being within the room with the 368 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:44,160 kids, I'm seeing the signs that she's at her limit. 369 00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:47,880 She just seems like a coiled spring. 370 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:52,360 So it's, yeah, it's, yeah, it has, yeah, it's been, it's been 371 00:19:52,360 --> 00:19:54,440 tough. But it's, it's really important 372 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:56,840 that that's part of my job is helping people breed their dogs. 373 00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:00,040 Because I'll get emails that will say, oh, my dog has always 374 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:02,640 been great with my kids. And then all of a sudden they've 375 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:04,080 snapped. All of a sudden they've done 376 00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:05,600 this. And they've always been fine 377 00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:08,440 with being stroked. And actually, when you talk in 378 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,360 more depth, I think the dog has been tolerating a lot. 379 00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:13,840 And I think that there is this thing we expect our dogs to 380 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:16,480 tolerate. Yeah, a lot, a lot. 381 00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:19,960 And some will tolerate. A huge amount and some will 382 00:20:19,960 --> 00:20:23,280 tolerate and then not really go up that ladder or go up that 383 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:26,400 ladder very slowly. But other dogs, their tolerance 384 00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:30,320 runs thin and for whatever reason they are trying to, they 385 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:32,160 try and communicate with us in different ways. 386 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,160 We often miss that or we don't understand that. 387 00:20:38,120 --> 00:20:39,840 I think that that's, that's it with most people. 388 00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:42,520 I think with some people that they, there is this expectation 389 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:45,120 of, well, dogs should be good with this and dogs should be 390 00:20:45,120 --> 00:20:46,840 able to do this. And then you're into different 391 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:49,080 territory then. But I think for the majority of 392 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:51,760 people, they do want the best for their dogs, but they will 393 00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:56,600 just not not be able to read that situation. 394 00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:58,920 They won't understand that their dog is just tolerating a 395 00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:02,640 situation but not enjoying it. Yeah, makes a lot of sense. 396 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:06,040 Just out of curiosity, is it possible to teach resilience to 397 00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:09,200 an older dog or resilience in general? 398 00:21:09,360 --> 00:21:11,400 Yeah. I mean, I think there's always, 399 00:21:13,120 --> 00:21:16,680 it's always resilience that can be built. 400 00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:19,800 But then I'm thinking, I'm thinking like with Ivy, I do 401 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:22,360 think as she's gotten older, she has just become maybe a little 402 00:21:22,360 --> 00:21:27,200 bit more intolerant, but that it's dog to dog. 403 00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:30,160 Every dog's different. And I think of the journey that 404 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:32,920 Rain has been on. She wasn't old. 405 00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:34,680 We got her. She was maybe 7. 406 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:38,240 But maybe she would have had, you know, be more comfortable 407 00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:39,600 with people. She'd come to us when she was 408 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:41,440 younger. But she still has gone on this 409 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:45,920 huge journey where she's. Yeah, I mean, definitely her 410 00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:48,080 fear levels have produced significantly. 411 00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:50,520 And she's a much happier, more confident dog. 412 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:54,640 But part of that is knowing her that I would never expect her to 413 00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:58,640 come to a pub with me because I just know it's just, it's just 414 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:02,560 not, it's just not her. And I think some of some of the 415 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:05,800 work that I do is, is when we, when we get a dog, whether we 416 00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:08,800 get a puppy with again, whatever dog we get looking at the dog. 417 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:12,480 And sometimes it's changing our expectations of what we want, 418 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:14,080 which can be quite upsetting at times. 419 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:17,880 I think people will have this real idea of I really want my 420 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:21,280 dog to be able to come to the pub with me on Sunday and go on 421 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:24,160 holidays with my friends and their dogs and kids. 422 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:25,840 And you know, they'll have all these expectations. 423 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,080 And sometimes dogs will be fine with that. 424 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,960 Some dogs will love it. Some dogs love doing all those 425 00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:32,880 things and being really social and getting out and going to 426 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:34,720 pubs. And then for other dogs, they 427 00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:38,280 just, it's just not for them. And I think you can, you can get 428 00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:41,400 them to a certain point and it will be, it won't, it won't be 429 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,200 saying, well, all your dog can do is be at home. 430 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:46,680 It's it's thinking, OK, well, what is it you'd like to do with 431 00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:47,960 your dog? And then seeing if there's some 432 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:50,640 compromise to be made there and think about, you know, I think 433 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:52,880 it's possible that your dog could get to this stage, you 434 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:53,280 know? Yeah. 435 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:57,360 You were like, I used to run so. Well, I do run, but I've been on 436 00:22:57,360 --> 00:23:00,600 maternity leave, social walks for nervous dogs. 437 00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:03,560 And I would get people contacting me whose dogs they 438 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:05,280 would walk their dogs at 5:00 in the morning. 439 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:08,000 Their dogs would never see other dogs because they were scared 440 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,480 what the reaction would be. And they were like, my dog just 441 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:13,160 never meets other dogs. And I feel really nervous about 442 00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:14,960 it. And they would come along on my 443 00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:19,280 walks and we would meet probably about anywhere between 5:00 and 444 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:22,960 8:00 of us and we would just walk together. 445 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,840 And it was amazing that actually, because they weren't 446 00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:30,000 meeting face to face, we were meeting and then walking 447 00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:31,920 together as a group. We would go on this at Woodland 448 00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:33,640 Walk. There would be treat searches 449 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:35,320 along the walk. At the end there'd be a little 450 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:37,480 pappuccino. So they'd be lots of nice things 451 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:39,800 dotted around. Dogs had a great time. 452 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:42,880 And actually within a few weeks, they definitely, they were so 453 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,680 comfortable with the other dogs that they had met before because 454 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:49,760 they knew in that context, I'm safe, this dog isn't going to 455 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,680 run at me, We're going to do nice things. 456 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:56,960 So it's all about contacts and wait context and where you want 457 00:23:56,960 --> 00:23:59,920 to get to. But in that situation, the dogs 458 00:23:59,920 --> 00:24:02,840 actually could form a little bit of a social group and walk 459 00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:04,440 together. And these owners who never 460 00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:06,360 thought their dogs would be able to walk with another dog. 461 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:09,640 It's, it's interesting because that's kind of made me think 462 00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:12,160 about a previous conversation I had on the podcast. 463 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:16,360 It was about whether or not dogs actually benefit from 1-2 and 464 00:24:16,360 --> 00:24:18,480 should socialise with their own kind. 465 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:22,200 So it's interesting that you've that you've, you've created that 466 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:23,920 walk. What, what are your thoughts on 467 00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,600 that? Is it necessary that they meet 468 00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:28,120 and socialise with their own kind? 469 00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:30,720 Firstly, the walk is such a small part of their day, the 470 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:33,000 majority of the day is going to be spent at home. 471 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:35,160 So if you're looking at, I have this dog and I want to make sure 472 00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:37,280 they're having this lovely fulfilled life, I definitely 473 00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:40,360 would start with making sure they're comfortable and happy 474 00:24:40,360 --> 00:24:43,600 and safe and enriched at home. Also, it totally depends on 475 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,240 that. Some dogs are so super social. 476 00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:49,760 They love seeing other dogs and running around with that. 477 00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:51,720 You have to make sure they're not being rude to other dogs, 478 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,520 but they love, they love their social circle. 479 00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:57,960 They love meeting other dogs. I definitely and I would put my 480 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:01,280 two dogs as part of it. They enjoy each other. 481 00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:06,520 They enjoy my mom and dad's dog. Their circle is very small and 482 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:10,120 they don't have any desire when we're out to go towards another 483 00:25:10,120 --> 00:25:12,280 dog. They will definitely just avoid 484 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,640 it. They don't have, they just don't 485 00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:15,400 care. They don't. 486 00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:18,240 And actually they did quite enjoy the social walks because 487 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:20,680 there was space, because it was a small group, because there was 488 00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:25,560 treats, because they felt safe. But they're not dogs that hugely 489 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:29,840 love socialising. And actually, I do think that 490 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:31,920 it's very sad. I, I meet, I meet a lot of 491 00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:35,360 people who with the best will in the world, I'll give an example 492 00:25:35,360 --> 00:25:38,840 of, of, of what might happen. And but this, this situation has 493 00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:41,880 happened so many times that people will will get a puppy and 494 00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:44,280 the puppy gets to me like 3-4 months old and then they might 495 00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:47,760 start sending it to a daycare. And I should say that Someday 496 00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:50,320 Cares are brilliant. And I have worked with some 497 00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:52,640 daycare owners and yeah, they're great. 498 00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:55,360 And the dogs have a wonderful time and they choose what dog 499 00:25:55,360 --> 00:25:56,360 should be there. Very well. 500 00:25:56,440 --> 00:26:01,280 There are someday Cares, though. The whole push is socialising 501 00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:04,760 the dogs and dogs having fun. And then these owners will send 502 00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:07,280 their dogs off to daycare with the best will in the world that 503 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:09,680 their dogs are going to be socialised and meet other dogs 504 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:13,280 and have a great time. And often they'll be in these 505 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:17,760 really big groups of dogs, big dogs, small dogs, maybe some 506 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:20,480 dogs that don't like other dogs and really shouldn't be there, 507 00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:22,880 and that'll be growled out and all sorts of things. 508 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:25,440 And the amount of times that people said, you know, I sent my 509 00:26:25,440 --> 00:26:27,720 puppy off and now my puppy is like seven months old and 510 00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:29,640 actually they're really scared of other dogs and they don't 511 00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:33,000 want to go. And they've started growling and 512 00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:36,600 barking other dogs. And it's obviously just been far 513 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:38,960 too much for them. You know, all this thing around 514 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:43,280 puppy parties and dog parties. And you know, you do have to 515 00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:45,840 look at each individual dog and what that they're better with 516 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:47,960 people. Some people are super social and 517 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:52,000 some people just want to, you know, stay in their home and 518 00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:56,040 only mix for their families. But we've really, I think as, 519 00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:59,400 as, as a society in the dog world, done our dogs a 520 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:03,480 disservice in terms of the push that sometimes is made on doing 521 00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,920 loads with our dogs, tiring them out, having them having loads of 522 00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:08,800 fun playing with loads of other dogs. 523 00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:11,720 You know, when I look at if I, if I run, when I have my puppy 524 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:15,040 classes running, I limit it to four or five puppy. 525 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:17,600 He's it's a try and make it very like calm. 526 00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:20,320 And you know, you hear about some of these puppy parties and 527 00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:23,160 there's 20 or more puppies tearing around and think about 528 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:27,880 how overwhelming that must be, hugely overwhelming for them. 529 00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:31,440 And that in itself can spark a whole myriad of behavioural 530 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,160 issues because they often will be communicating that they're 531 00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:36,400 not comfortable. They may be hiding, they may be 532 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,000 growling, their tail may be tucked. 533 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:39,960 And often those signs are completely missed or 534 00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:42,400 disregarded. And then where do they go from 535 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:44,360 there? And often this myriad of 536 00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:47,000 behavioural issues can can just pop up from there. 537 00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:49,760 And you can work on those things, but it's very difficult 538 00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:54,000 to get it back to square 1, to get them back to that empty 539 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,040 slate. Yeah, it's quite, yeah, 540 00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,400 upsetting. And often when you're having 541 00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:01,400 these discussions with owners, they get very upset because they 542 00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:04,120 have always just wanted what is best for their dog. 543 00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:06,160 And that is what the majority of us want. 544 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:09,840 And that they're not in the wrong. 545 00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:11,360 It's just it's confusing out there. 546 00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:14,680 It's a bit of a Wild West of everyone is marketing. 547 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:17,000 This is best for your dog. This is what you need for your 548 00:28:17,000 --> 00:28:18,920 dog. You know, the dog industry is 549 00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:21,680 huge. And yeah, it's really confusing 550 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:25,360 out there, I think. It is, I think even even myself. 551 00:28:25,360 --> 00:28:28,600 I mean, obviously I know kind of a little bit better now on this 552 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:32,120 journey what kind of things to look for, but I'm still amazed 553 00:28:32,120 --> 00:28:37,560 at how polarising things can be. And I tend to notice a pattern 554 00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:41,400 around confidence. I think about it in terms of 555 00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:47,480 sometimes we would attach authority, trust to the loudest 556 00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:52,040 person in the room and that does not mean that that person is the 557 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:56,120 most competent, the most respectable, etcetera, etcetera. 558 00:28:56,120 --> 00:29:00,920 And it's it's really interesting how I've seen a correlation in 559 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:04,920 some of the louder and some of the most expressive and some of 560 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:08,720 the most opinionated perspectives having the bigger 561 00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:13,120 following and therefore the bigger client base. 562 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:16,800 And that is concerning, you know what that signals to people in 563 00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,160 terms of, OK, he must be confident. 564 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:21,440 I think he knows what he's talking about and will ever 565 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:23,640 meanwhile not being. Able and people will get these 566 00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:29,120 snippets of social media or off off certain television shows. 567 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:31,840 Firstly, I look at the editing and I think, well, it's safe. 568 00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:34,520 It's a TV show who I'm sure you can imagine what one until I 569 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:36,680 won't mention names, I'm thinking, but that that that is 570 00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:39,200 edited together. That is not that isn't happening 571 00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:44,040 in real time, but also people just they look at this illusion 572 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,040 of this quick fix when you're, there are some, there are 573 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:49,200 certain things that you can fix quite quickly. 574 00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:51,960 The majority though, if you're looking at a dog that has a lot 575 00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:55,840 of fear, for example, and maybe is is guarding because of that 576 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:58,960 fear or has separation anxiety or they're not, they're not 577 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:02,320 quick fixes. They're often quite often the 578 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:04,120 truth is quite slow and quite boring though. 579 00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:06,880 So when you're working with people, often is a bit of a 580 00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,560 drip, drip, drip, but there is that progress there. 581 00:30:11,280 --> 00:30:13,160 But they're living in a world, unfortunately, where that's why 582 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:16,880 not what people want to hear. They literally want to, you 583 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,240 know, not very often, thankfully, but I've had it 584 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,240 where people will expect within the hour that I meet with them 585 00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:24,720 that all of the issues they are having with their dog will go. 586 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:28,200 That isn't good. That isn't going to happen. 587 00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:32,640 I haven't got a magic wand, but it's unfortunate that those sort 588 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:35,360 of that quick, quick social media type world that we're 589 00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:38,400 living in, we'll get the follows and we'll get the bigger client 590 00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:41,880 bases, yeah. Yeah, we have this expectation 591 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:45,240 on our dogs that they should be able to change their behaviour 592 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:47,640 quite quickly. And when we look at ourselves 593 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:51,080 and perhaps we've got our own challenges, quitting smoking, 594 00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:54,720 waking up earlier, going to bed earlier, you know, whatever it 595 00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:59,400 would be, fitness, dieting, there are so many obstacles to 596 00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:03,000 changing our, our own behaviour. Yet we have an expectation often 597 00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:07,040 that these creatures have to adapt much faster than we would 598 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:07,880 and. We're often we're so 599 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:12,760 understanding with people. It's like it's like when a baby 600 00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:14,720 teeths, we totally understand that they're going to be 601 00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:16,200 grizzly. And when a puppy teeth and 602 00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:19,160 they're chewing things, we're like, oh, why are they chewing 603 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:21,640 things? Or, you know, if a person is 604 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:24,520 scared of, you know, whatever they're scared or whatever their 605 00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:26,920 fear is, we can understand that and empathise with it. 606 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,640 And I think for example, if a dog is scared of maybe being 607 00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:33,680 left alone, there's, there's such a frustration there, which 608 00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:37,640 I do understand like that as an example, I, I understand it 609 00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:41,000 makes things very difficult. Also, it's understanding that 610 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:44,360 there's no quick magical fix for those those things. 611 00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:49,720 Yeah, yeah, Actually Elena suggested I reach out to you 612 00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:53,760 about this very topic because since I've had, you know, which 613 00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:56,640 is just over a month now, actually closer to two months, 614 00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:01,160 she is made such progress. So yes, since I've had her, I've 615 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:04,960 not really had much of A social life and leaving her just to 616 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:09,040 take the rubbish out doesn't like that going nipping to the 617 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:11,680 shop, doesn't like that in general. 618 00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:15,320 In general she struggles when I leave. 619 00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:19,520 And I was taught by another behaviourist that you kind of 620 00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:24,080 like create gradual, you know, desensitisation or building that 621 00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:27,400 trust that you will come back or that object permanence, I don't 622 00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:30,160 even know what it's called, but you will come back and they get 623 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:32,520 used to it. But what what I found is that 624 00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:36,880 real life doesn't work that way. I can't get her used to small 625 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:40,320 amounts of time where I leave and then come back because I 626 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:42,880 might have to nip out to the post office, you know, that's 627 00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:45,360 not a 10 minute thing necessarily. 628 00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:48,320 Or I might need to take something to my storage unit or 629 00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:51,760 whatever it might be. So yeah, just out of curiosity, 630 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:55,720 how does 1, Not so much in training, training tips, but 631 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,880 what do you think is going on for Galgos because you have this 632 00:32:59,880 --> 00:33:03,440 background with your own galgo and with rescue dogs in general? 633 00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:07,480 Well, yeah, firstly with the separation anxiety, completely 634 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:09,840 empathise. I did my training with Julie 635 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:13,640 Naismith, who is he's great. Yeah, she's, she's brilliant in 636 00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:17,280 terms of learning all about all things separation anxiety and, 637 00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:22,280 and definitely the training that I help people do, I do think 638 00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:24,200 really helps. And that is that slow drip, 639 00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:26,680 drip, drip, you know, getting them used to, for some dogs, it 640 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:30,280 may just be going to the front door and back and then going out 641 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,560 of the door and coming back in and taking the bins out and 642 00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,400 coming back in and doing these sort of, I would put together 643 00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:39,480 daily training sessions for people to do where they might do 644 00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:41,720 two or three short sessions in a day. 645 00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:45,440 And you do find that there is definitely this improvement 646 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:48,640 where suddenly a dog can be left for might just be a minute and 647 00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:50,640 people will be like celebrating. But like, I went down the road 648 00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:54,200 and came back and my dog was OK. And then that just builds and 649 00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:59,200 builds. However, again, being a mum now 650 00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:03,000 and having young kids, I totally empathise with people that say, 651 00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:07,560 well, I, I can't, we have to leave them or I don't. 652 00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:10,719 I'm living on my own. So I, when I, I need to go to 653 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:13,840 the doctors and I need to go out for an hour and I, it's really 654 00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:18,360 challenging, but we always try and like troubleshoot and work 655 00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:21,080 out around those issues. Is there anyone that can come 656 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:23,520 over when you're going out? Do you have family nearby? 657 00:34:23,639 --> 00:34:26,199 Is there as any way that we could do this training and 658 00:34:26,199 --> 00:34:29,480 minimum, even if we're not completely cutting out minimise 659 00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:32,560 what wanting to are wanting to minimise the amount of time the 660 00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:35,280 dog is being left alone where they're thinking the world is 661 00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:37,639 crumbling because every time they're left alone and they 662 00:34:37,639 --> 00:34:40,199 think it's the end of the world and they're having this panic, 663 00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:43,520 it reinforces in them that being left is really scary. 664 00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:47,040 So, so ideally you would only be leaving them when you're doing 665 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,120 this structure training. However, I totally get that for 666 00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:51,760 some people that is just impossible. 667 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,560 So sometimes it is working in like, OK, well, I'll go out, 668 00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:56,639 I'll make sure my husband's here, my sister lives down the 669 00:34:56,639 --> 00:34:59,240 road, she can pop over. And other times it's just trying 670 00:34:59,240 --> 00:35:02,800 to minimise things and do what you can and hope that it might 671 00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:05,520 be a bit of a longer journey, but you're going in that 672 00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:08,600 direction. Yeah, with Gal Goes, we're very 673 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:11,800 lucky with Rayna, I think partly because she really got a lot of 674 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:14,640 confidence from Ivy. I mean, the first month she just 675 00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:17,760 followed Ivy around and I don't think she really cared that we 676 00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:20,040 weren't there, if I'm honest. She didn't bond to us. 677 00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:22,080 I would say the first month it took time. 678 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:26,600 So I think day one we went out for a 5 minute walk, came back, 679 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:28,320 if anything, she was like, Oh no, they're back. 680 00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:31,000 And we just did that every day. We would just go out for a 681 00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,240 little walk and we built and built and we were just really 682 00:35:33,240 --> 00:35:36,520 lucky that yeah, we didn't have any, any issues with her. 683 00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:39,400 It is definitely, I think with all rescue dogs and particularly 684 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,880 the gal goes, if you the certain issues that we, you know, you 685 00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:46,280 can run into, I think with rescues and especially rescues 686 00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:49,120 that might have had. I'm not saying that all of the 687 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:51,560 Galgos have, but a lot of them have come from quite traumatic 688 00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:53,200 pasts. You know, Raina with all the 689 00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:55,840 scars and one ear, but they've, they've all come from different 690 00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:58,480 places, but a lot of them would have been through some sort of 691 00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:00,760 trauma or not a very nice start in life. 692 00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:04,520 And they have no like routing or feeling of safety. 693 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:07,040 And then we bring them over and it's natural. 694 00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:09,360 Like definitely separation is something they could have 695 00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:12,920 because suddenly they, you know, they have this person they're 696 00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:16,000 connecting to and they might have never actually been on 697 00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:20,040 their own before. They might have not been in a 698 00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:22,480 home, but they might have always been surrounded by the dogs. 699 00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:25,200 They might have been in a busy kennel environment, loads of 700 00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:31,360 noise, lots of things going on. So to suddenly be in a home on 701 00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:35,280 your own with not a lot of noise around you and the person that 702 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:38,200 you're building that bond with and feeling safe with that your 703 00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:43,160 whole, you know, whole ability to feel safe is with that person 704 00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:46,240 goes away. You can imagine like, you know, 705 00:36:46,240 --> 00:36:49,520 if you're putting yourself in their feet in their shoes, how 706 00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:52,480 that would feel likewise. And I will say that with with 707 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:54,960 some of the gal goes, we bring over actually, they fit in so 708 00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:59,960 easily and so effortlessly. And like I say with Rayna, we've 709 00:36:59,960 --> 00:37:03,480 been very lucky, apart from her being very timid, she just sort 710 00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:06,240 of fit in with us very, very cohesively. 711 00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:10,200 But other issues that we might get, like you said, I work as a 712 00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:13,800 behaviourist or project gal. Some dogs may just be completely 713 00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:17,720 overwhelmed. And we always say when you get, 714 00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:21,520 when the gal goes, come to your home, just do nothing with them. 715 00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:24,920 Let them adapt, let them sleep. Most of them haven't slept 716 00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:27,160 properly and they've been in busy environments that have been 717 00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:29,640 noisy and they might not be getting enough food and they're 718 00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:32,240 underweight. So let them eat, let them sleep, 719 00:37:32,240 --> 00:37:36,040 let them rest, let them build that feeling of actually being 720 00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:37,440 safe. They're not going to get moved 721 00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:38,800 again. They're not nothing bad is going 722 00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:41,760 to happen to them. Then start taking them up and 723 00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:44,160 take them to quiet areas. They don't have to go out to the 724 00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:46,240 park and meet all the dogs on the first day. 725 00:37:46,240 --> 00:37:48,760 Anything like that might just be far too much for them. 726 00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:51,840 You know, take them out for small quiet sniffs. 727 00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:54,960 And some dogs may be a bit reactive because maybe just 728 00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:58,120 being outside and a big open park where there's dogs and 729 00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:00,680 bikes and kids, it might just be so overwhelming and their way of 730 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:03,240 dealing with it is to bark or to lunge. 731 00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:06,680 Some dogs may do a little bit of guarding at first because 732 00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:11,240 suddenly they've got a really comfy bed or they find the soap 733 00:38:11,240 --> 00:38:14,080 they've never been on a sofa before and they may not want the 734 00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:16,440 other resident dog to come near them on the sofa. 735 00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:20,480 Or they may be so hungry they want to eat all of the food and 736 00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:22,240 that so there may be some guarding issues. 737 00:38:22,240 --> 00:38:25,600 So this all of these things are perfectly natural and most of 738 00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:31,520 them can be worked through, but worked through with kindness and 739 00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:35,440 patience. So that that's part of my role 740 00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:39,920 is to help support people with with that because often that 741 00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:43,520 that I mean, I'll ask you actually, have you have you had, 742 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,880 have you had gal goes before rescues before? 743 00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:50,240 No, no, never before. No. 744 00:38:50,240 --> 00:38:54,920 I was a volunteer dog Walker for about 5 years before being able 745 00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:57,280 to because I've always wanted to have my own dog. 746 00:38:57,280 --> 00:39:00,360 But you know, I was renting up until recently and once I was 747 00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:02,840 able to I was like, that's it, I can foster now. 748 00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:05,760 So I got do now. And it happened really, really 749 00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:08,400 quickly though, in terms of mindset, I didn't even know what 750 00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:10,640 kind of mindset to have or what to expect. 751 00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:14,200 I think I had this fantasy or vision of me and my dog, we're 752 00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:17,640 going to go grab a coffee in the morning and then we're going to 753 00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:19,200 go for a little walk and did it there. 754 00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:21,120 But actually it's been quite the opposite. 755 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:22,880 Do not only walks around the block. 756 00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:25,080 She doesn't like to go even cross the road. 757 00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:29,240 She just shuts down and or body blocks me any kind of cafe 758 00:39:29,240 --> 00:39:33,080 situation, a shop, No, not interested. 759 00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:35,800 So that is our life at the moment, going around the block. 760 00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,280 And if I leave home, she'll bark. 761 00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:42,640 But the, the interesting thing is I've spoken with lots of 762 00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:46,600 people and they tend to liken it to leaving a baby to cry. 763 00:39:47,520 --> 00:39:50,520 And my thoughts have been, I can't do that. 764 00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:53,280 She's not feeling safe. She's not feeling, you know what 765 00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:56,360 I mean? Like do you see some parallels 766 00:39:56,360 --> 00:40:00,120 there in terms of kind of what's best, I guess for the dog and 767 00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:02,160 your relationship? Definitely. 768 00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:04,640 I mean, this is everyone has their different views on it. 769 00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:07,840 Me as a person, I think generally I've looked after my 770 00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:09,720 dogs the way I've looked after my kids. 771 00:40:09,720 --> 00:40:12,600 There's been a lot of parallels in terms of I'm not one to leave 772 00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:15,360 them to cry. If I can help them, I will. 773 00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:19,360 Yeah. It just has never felt 774 00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:21,520 comfortable. I mean, we know with, you know, 775 00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:25,080 with dogs with separation anxiety, if it comes down to 776 00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:27,000 temperament. And actually it's very similar 777 00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:31,560 to babies because I think if you leave babies to cry, there are 778 00:40:31,560 --> 00:40:35,200 some who very quickly will cry, cry, and then we'll be able to 779 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:38,880 soothe themselves and just sort of get it very quickly. 780 00:40:39,160 --> 00:40:42,440 And some dogs will cry. And then, you know, their 781 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:45,520 temperament is always very, you know, I would, I would say they 782 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:47,800 probably haven't, they haven't got separation anxiety. 783 00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:50,720 They might just not really like being alone and they will very 784 00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:54,600 quickly get used to being alone. However, for the majority of 785 00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:59,600 dogs, of the majority of babies crying and crying and crying, it 786 00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:02,480 just isn't going to with dogs, it will often the separate 787 00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,280 anxiety could get worse. It definitely could get worse 788 00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:09,320 because if they, they do have separation anxiety and they are 789 00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:11,960 expressing that through crying and howling and they are being 790 00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:17,000 left alone for, I know, 234 hours regularly with this 791 00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:20,480 anxiety. And I would say there's very 792 00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:24,640 few, there's a lot of dogs that that wouldn't benefits. 793 00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:28,000 And I think sometimes people have had a very Placid dog that 794 00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:30,560 hasn't really been that bothered about being left and they've 795 00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:31,920 gone. I left them once and they whined 796 00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:33,200 a bit. Then they will find that's what 797 00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:35,360 you should do. But you have to look at your 798 00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:38,600 individual dog and if you feel like your dog is getting really 799 00:41:38,600 --> 00:41:42,280 distressed when you leave. I mean, there's plenty of people 800 00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:45,320 that have tried leaving them to cry out and then they reach out 801 00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:47,640 to me or other behaviours because they're like, this is 802 00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,760 the neighbours are complaining and we come home and the 803 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,320 furniture has been destroyed or they've they've weed everywhere 804 00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:55,680 or they're defecating. And so it's, it's looking at 805 00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:58,760 what the other options are because no one wants that dog 806 00:41:58,760 --> 00:42:01,840 alone upset for hours. That's an awful feeling. 807 00:42:02,520 --> 00:42:05,080 Yeah, yeah, especially if you like leave them. 808 00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:08,760 So I've, I've left dinner before, maybe 15/15/20 minutes. 809 00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:12,080 And from the moment I've left, I've heard her barking. 810 00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:14,800 And when I come back, she's still barking and I'm just 811 00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:16,640 thinking, Oh my God, that's so stressful. 812 00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:19,200 That must be a lot of stress back in, back in the body. 813 00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:22,720 You know, after all that time we spent with decompressing, It's 814 00:42:22,720 --> 00:42:23,560 stressful. You. 815 00:42:23,720 --> 00:42:28,400 Need to give yourself some grace as well because when you and you 816 00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:30,800 don't have that support of having other people that are in 817 00:42:30,800 --> 00:42:33,960 your home, that can be like, I'll watch while you pop out. 818 00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:36,520 It's incredibly, incredibly difficult. 819 00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:39,160 It can be, it can be really restrictive. 820 00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:42,160 I think the thing that I found most interesting is just the 821 00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:44,720 mindset. You know, it's so easy for me to 822 00:42:44,720 --> 00:42:46,880 assume that other people are going to tweet do know the way 823 00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:48,800 that I do. But I realise I'm part of a 824 00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:52,480 minority. You know, you kind of have to 825 00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:56,560 really be invested in the dog to want to, you know, give her the 826 00:42:56,560 --> 00:42:58,960 best life. And I'm not talking about being 827 00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:02,800 permissive. I don't think that is relevant 828 00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:06,600 in this context because I don't believe that dogs are naughty. 829 00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:10,840 In her case, it's about making her feel safe and, you know, and 830 00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:14,160 kind of giving her the opportunities in the life that 831 00:43:14,240 --> 00:43:17,960 she did not have before. So. 832 00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:22,440 So yeah, when I have left her with other people, what I've 833 00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:27,440 found is that she will hold everything in until I get home 834 00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:30,880 and then release indoors. And that tells me that was not 835 00:43:31,160 --> 00:43:34,240 maybe an ideal experience for her. 836 00:43:34,240 --> 00:43:39,440 But recently I have found dog sitters and the way I kind of 837 00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:42,600 recruited them was different because I I was looking for very 838 00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:45,120 specific things. And they've come over and it's 839 00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:48,560 been a bit of a process. And I've I've observed them with 840 00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:52,360 her and learn more about their philosophy and their approach to 841 00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,600 dogs because I'm very much focused on dog scented. 842 00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:58,640 I want people who see dogs as opposed to the opposite. 843 00:43:59,240 --> 00:44:01,480 So there is light at the end of the tunnel. 844 00:44:01,720 --> 00:44:04,040 But I think it was so important to get to this point. 845 00:44:04,040 --> 00:44:07,440 I think Duna has shown me that she's, she's like a Velcro dog 846 00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:09,480 really. She just always wants to be near 847 00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:11,120 me. And I am a bit fearful with 848 00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:12,840 regards to how she's going to respond to this. 849 00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:15,800 But we're going to do it in small increments, getting her 850 00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:19,840 used to being around other people and me not being here and 851 00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:22,800 build up to a weakness. Honestly, that that that is the 852 00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:25,760 advice often I'll give people who are in your situation. 853 00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:28,440 It's because if people are in a family or they're living in a 854 00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:31,280 bigger group, often I'm talking about like spreading love 855 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:33,840 because often it's very natural that a dog will really bond with 856 00:44:33,840 --> 00:44:36,560 one person. Often you'll find that one 857 00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:39,520 person is doing all the walks or the feeding, a lot of the care. 858 00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:42,800 So it's often thinking about, well, how can we broaden that 859 00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:44,920 dog's horizons a little bit so that they feel safe? 860 00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:48,200 They might not be as happy with every single person, but just so 861 00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:53,560 they feel safe with a few other people to lighten the load off 862 00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:56,840 your shoulders. So absolutely, yeah. 863 00:44:57,000 --> 00:44:59,280 If, if if I were you, I'd be looking at. 864 00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:01,400 Right. Well, could I, you know, are 865 00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:04,000 there any friends nearby that she would be comfortable with? 866 00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:06,600 Are there any dog sitters or dog walkers that I could get in 867 00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:09,120 touch with? The, you know, I did exactly 868 00:45:09,120 --> 00:45:10,920 that. So we've got a great dog Walker 869 00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:14,280 called Izzy, who, because both my dogs are a bit cute. 870 00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:15,800 You know, they have their quirks. 871 00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:18,800 They're sort of really easy. But also, you know, rain, it's a 872 00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:20,880 bit of a flight risk. Rainer is very nervous for 873 00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:24,120 people she doesn't know live is a bit dog fussy. 874 00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:29,080 So it was really important we found the right dog Walker and 875 00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:30,280 she only takes about once a week. 876 00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:34,160 But things like when I went into labour, we called is he she was 877 00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:39,040 all like, she's our person. If like whatever happens, we 878 00:45:39,040 --> 00:45:41,840 know that someone that the dogs will feel safe with who can come 879 00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:44,680 over. And I know you know, a good dog 880 00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:47,720 Walker, when they say, well, look, I think she'll be tuned. 881 00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:50,360 I won't just take them out because I don't think they trust 882 00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:52,600 me enough. I'll come out on walks with you. 883 00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:55,320 And then she would just come over for cups of tea. 884 00:45:56,240 --> 00:45:59,520 And we definitely built that, that trust. 885 00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:03,480 And now, I mean, Ivy loves anyone with a treat, but Raina 886 00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:04,680 loves her. Yeah. 887 00:46:04,840 --> 00:46:07,760 And it's really nice to feel like you're broadening the 888 00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:11,880 horizon a little bit. And I think so much pressure on 889 00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:17,080 one person, if you have a needy dog, a Velcro dog, a dog with 890 00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:21,520 separation anxiety, so much pressure on that one person 891 00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:25,880 because, you know, generally where I think most people are 892 00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:28,960 empathic people, I think to to feel like you can't do anything 893 00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:34,840 that's going to, yeah, make them distraught is yeah, it's tough, 894 00:46:35,320 --> 00:46:37,360 but I'm glad that you're getting that help. 895 00:46:38,520 --> 00:46:41,360 Yeah, no, I'm really excited about it actually. 896 00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:44,600 But yeah, it's a process. I think like this kind of leads 897 00:46:44,600 --> 00:46:50,000 nicely to the, I guess I wanted to ask you for other people to 898 00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:53,600 really consider fostering. So perhaps maybe you could 899 00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:57,120 highlight some of the benefits of fostering, especially with 900 00:46:57,120 --> 00:46:58,960 Project Galgo? Maybe yes. 901 00:46:59,160 --> 00:47:02,960 And then also, what kind of mindset is really important 902 00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:06,920 prior to starting to foster so that people can really 903 00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:08,400 understand what they're getting into? 904 00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:13,280 Yeah, the first thing, yeah, I mean, fostering it's it's so, so 905 00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:17,920 important and so, so needed. And yeah, I, I am definitely 906 00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:22,120 part of the foster fail club, but I mean, Project Galgo would 907 00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:26,160 not be able to function without the network of amazing fosters 908 00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:29,760 that we have. And what it means is that these 909 00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:33,360 dogs, you know, like I said, you know, some of them have, you 910 00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:35,600 know, quite traumatised. Some of them have been treated 911 00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:39,400 badly by people that most of them have never been in a home. 912 00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:43,200 Some of them have only lived in a kennel sort of environment. 913 00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:47,920 Without the project, without the, the the network of fosters, 914 00:47:47,920 --> 00:47:50,520 it would mean that they would just go into kennels and we 915 00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:52,800 wouldn't have any idea about that dog and what was best 916 00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:55,240 suited to that dog. And the dog would what would 917 00:47:55,240 --> 00:47:58,400 then try and be rehomed with no idea of what that dog is like. 918 00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:02,920 And the dog would be so pent up. And then what you have is a lot 919 00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:05,640 more people returning dogs and then where did they return to? 920 00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:08,760 They return back to kennels. Having the fosters means that 921 00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:12,840 these dogs can come over often. They've not had a very nice life 922 00:48:12,840 --> 00:48:15,160 so far. And then they have a comfortable 923 00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:18,360 place where they feel safe and they can sleep and they can rest 924 00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:21,800 and it's nice and they can learn that people are nice because 925 00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:23,840 sometimes they can. Their only interaction to people 926 00:48:23,840 --> 00:48:27,840 might have been quite negative. It's also quite common that Gal 927 00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:33,480 goes a bit wary of men. So for some that's a bigger 928 00:48:33,480 --> 00:48:36,120 issue than others. But they can start to learn that 929 00:48:36,240 --> 00:48:39,040 that men, actually, some men are OK. 930 00:48:40,720 --> 00:48:44,560 They can have this safe place where they can decompress and 931 00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:46,720 this decompressing time is so important. 932 00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:52,920 They catch up on sleep, they rest, they eat, they start to 933 00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:56,040 feel a little bit grounded again in the world. 934 00:48:56,680 --> 00:49:00,400 Their stress bucket starts to, yeah, just get a little bit 935 00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:02,080 lower. Everything just seems a bit more 936 00:49:02,080 --> 00:49:03,880 doable. They eat, they put on a bit of 937 00:49:03,880 --> 00:49:07,040 weight. And most importantly, the 938 00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:09,640 fosters can look at this dog and go, you know what? 939 00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:12,800 This, this dog is a pleasure. Like, it's great. 940 00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:14,080 I think it'd be great with the family. 941 00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:16,400 It's got so much energy. It loves running around with our 942 00:49:16,400 --> 00:49:19,160 kids. It loves a cuddle, loves this. 943 00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:23,320 Or they might say, you know, this dog is brilliant, proper 944 00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:25,400 Velcro dog though. So you need to keep that in mind 945 00:49:25,400 --> 00:49:27,720 wherever it's going to go because it really does doesn't 946 00:49:27,720 --> 00:49:29,920 like to be left alone. Maybe it might be comfortable 947 00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:33,080 with a resident dog. Maybe this dog actually through 948 00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:35,360 being a foster, you've realised actually it doesn't really like 949 00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:37,320 being around either dog because it actually quite likes having 950 00:49:37,320 --> 00:49:40,080 the sofa to itself might be better as an only dog. 951 00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:43,120 So we get all this information from people, these wonderful 952 00:49:43,120 --> 00:49:48,480 fosterers. So the I should say that the 953 00:49:49,160 --> 00:49:51,160 team I work with a project, I'll go up brilliant. 954 00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:54,920 And Helena and Camilla do the majority of the enormous amount 955 00:49:54,920 --> 00:49:57,960 of work. And then Penny Clayton also does 956 00:49:57,960 --> 00:49:59,160 a lot of work as behaviourists there. 957 00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:02,880 And they're all working tirelessly to look after these 958 00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:05,400 dogs and make sure they have a good a good life. 959 00:50:05,520 --> 00:50:07,840 Yeah. But it means that they then can 960 00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:10,640 look at all this information given from the dog and give the 961 00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:13,640 dog time and space to start to be comfortable, start to maybe 962 00:50:13,640 --> 00:50:18,240 go out into the world and sort of safe sniff walks constantly. 963 00:50:18,240 --> 00:50:20,800 Our information is, you know, don't they're going to be 964 00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:22,640 overwhelmed. We don't have to do too much 965 00:50:22,640 --> 00:50:24,640 with them. Enrichment, choose all these 966 00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:26,840 ways that dogs can just start to decompress. 967 00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:30,440 But we take all this information and then we can try and match 968 00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:33,080 them with, you know, the right home for them. 969 00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:37,240 And then they can go from one comfortable home to another 970 00:50:37,240 --> 00:50:40,280 comfortable home, which is which we hope is going to be a good 971 00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:42,680 fit. And we hope that by then we know 972 00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:46,280 actually this dog needs to be with another dog or this, this 973 00:50:46,280 --> 00:50:49,240 dog is that is surprisingly great with cats because maybe a 974 00:50:49,240 --> 00:50:52,120 fosterer has had a cat and they've done an introduction and 975 00:50:52,120 --> 00:50:54,360 that's gone really well. And the dog really is really 976 00:50:54,360 --> 00:50:55,960 Placid. We think that's amazing. 977 00:50:56,040 --> 00:50:57,320 So we can home it with someone with cats. 978 00:50:57,320 --> 00:51:00,160 But all of this stuff, it's just, it's an amazing thing to 979 00:51:00,160 --> 00:51:01,160 do. And I think it's one of the 980 00:51:01,160 --> 00:51:03,280 hardest things to do. And like I say, I failed at it, 981 00:51:03,280 --> 00:51:07,200 but I think it takes a really, we've got many fosters who 982 00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:09,200 foster again and again and again for us. 983 00:51:09,280 --> 00:51:12,440 We also have many foster fails. It's a big club, the Foster fail 984 00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:15,560 family, but. Oh yeah, I would join it. 985 00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:17,760 I would join it. I'm very tempted. 986 00:51:17,880 --> 00:51:19,800 Gonna say I didn't want to. Yeah, yeah. 987 00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:23,080 No, Since day one I've thought, yeah, I want her. 988 00:51:23,080 --> 00:51:26,040 That's no shame in it. It was like with Rayna, she just 989 00:51:26,040 --> 00:51:31,040 fit into our lives and we're so glad that she stayed with us. 990 00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:35,920 However, yeah, the people that Foster and foster, I don't think 991 00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:37,560 it's ever easy for them to say goodbye. 992 00:51:37,560 --> 00:51:39,440 Sometimes they might have these dogs with them for months. 993 00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:42,480 Sometimes they've got family and kids and then they have to say 994 00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:45,480 goodbye to this dog and and it goes to somewhere else and. 995 00:51:45,840 --> 00:51:48,720 And that is, yeah, really heartbreaking. 996 00:51:48,720 --> 00:51:50,280 Then they'll take in another dog for us. 997 00:51:50,280 --> 00:51:53,520 And it's amazing. It's invaluable, really. 998 00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:58,200 And yeah, like the Project Gaga wouldn't be able to function the 999 00:51:58,200 --> 00:52:01,040 way it does without them. Yeah, I guess I would says 1000 00:52:01,040 --> 00:52:04,440 anyone out there that feels like they would like to foster, We're 1001 00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:05,800 always looking for new foster it. 1002 00:52:06,040 --> 00:52:09,880 And I guess in terms of things to keep in mind, obviously, you 1003 00:52:09,880 --> 00:52:13,800 know, you have some natural sight houndy things. 1004 00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:18,880 So a lot of them will have the high prey Dr. You know, some 1005 00:52:18,960 --> 00:52:22,080 actually can live with cats, but the majority can't. 1006 00:52:22,080 --> 00:52:25,640 They also will have totally lacked certain forms of 1007 00:52:25,640 --> 00:52:28,760 socialisation, so things like in the house, the Hoover, the 1008 00:52:28,760 --> 00:52:31,640 washing machine, that might scare them, noises of, you know, 1009 00:52:31,640 --> 00:52:33,040 say about going to a coffee shop. 1010 00:52:33,040 --> 00:52:36,200 It's funny because where we used to live, we used to have to walk 1011 00:52:36,200 --> 00:52:40,240 past a coffee shop to get to the park and Raina was terrified of 1012 00:52:40,240 --> 00:52:42,320 it. And for her it was the bang, 1013 00:52:42,320 --> 00:52:44,240 bang, bang. Like the metal, like when they'd 1014 00:52:44,240 --> 00:52:46,960 empty the coffee, bang, bang, bang, and she would throw 1015 00:52:46,960 --> 00:52:50,320 herself to the ground like she was some sort of splattered 1016 00:52:50,320 --> 00:52:52,680 frog, like her legs would just go out. 1017 00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:56,560 She hated that noise. We wouldn't even think about 1018 00:52:56,560 --> 00:53:00,440 that because of the way that we, you know, we often with puppies, 1019 00:53:00,440 --> 00:53:02,200 they just sort of get used to the world. 1020 00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:04,840 And then you would never think that that something like that 1021 00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:07,720 would terrify them so much. But these little noises, these 1022 00:53:07,720 --> 00:53:11,920 little things that they've not known before can really, really, 1023 00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:15,000 yeah, terrify them. So yeah, our advice is always, 1024 00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:18,160 you know, prepare yourself as best you can as loads of 1025 00:53:18,160 --> 00:53:20,600 resources with Project Galgo, if you were going to foster with 1026 00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:22,640 us. But just be aware that, you 1027 00:53:22,640 --> 00:53:24,600 know, these dogs often have never been in a home. 1028 00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:28,080 They've never been on a sofa. They might have always been just 1029 00:53:28,080 --> 00:53:30,440 that bit hungry. They might be a bit underweight. 1030 00:53:30,520 --> 00:53:33,280 They might have only ever seen other gal goes and not seen 1031 00:53:33,280 --> 00:53:37,480 other breeds of dog. So there's so much that that you 1032 00:53:37,480 --> 00:53:40,480 just need to keep in mind and really resist the urge. 1033 00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,000 I don't know, it's so tough. Just resist the urge to think, 1034 00:53:43,080 --> 00:53:44,960 I've got this dog. I'm going to have my friend come 1035 00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:46,640 over to meet them. I'm going to have my family 1036 00:53:46,640 --> 00:53:48,840 over. I really want to go out on a dog 1037 00:53:48,840 --> 00:53:53,000 walk with my friend and her dog. And it's just time and 1038 00:53:53,000 --> 00:53:56,440 decompressing. And I remember actually, again, 1039 00:53:56,440 --> 00:53:58,400 it's different. It's different views and people 1040 00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:01,280 have to approach it from what way it feels is best. 1041 00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:04,160 Is is the right thing for them. But I remember speaking to 1042 00:54:04,160 --> 00:54:08,040 someone who had gotten advice from another another rescue to 1043 00:54:08,520 --> 00:54:11,880 keep their dog in a crate for the first 48 hours so that their 1044 00:54:11,880 --> 00:54:14,960 dog could feel safe in the crate and then slowly let them in one 1045 00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:18,120 room and then slowly expand their world. 1046 00:54:18,120 --> 00:54:20,920 That isn't how I work. And generally I wouldn't have 1047 00:54:20,920 --> 00:54:22,920 done that. With, I mean obviously like with 1048 00:54:22,920 --> 00:54:25,560 having the young kids now we do have some baby gates in place in 1049 00:54:25,560 --> 00:54:27,880 terms of management, but generally we have an open door 1050 00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:31,200 policy and it's very much where does the dog feel safe? 1051 00:54:31,200 --> 00:54:33,920 Where do they want to be? Rayna really loves being at the 1052 00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:36,040 top of the stairs. I think she just feels safe 1053 00:54:36,040 --> 00:54:39,120 overlooking the house. Like a queen, Yeah, the queen, 1054 00:54:39,240 --> 00:54:43,080 the Queen and she. Is just overlooking things, but 1055 00:54:43,080 --> 00:54:45,960 just see where do they feel safe how what can we give them to 1056 00:54:45,960 --> 00:54:50,120 feel safe How can we help them find their feet for me putting 1057 00:54:50,120 --> 00:54:53,880 them in little boxes and and you know being like, well, you have 1058 00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:57,160 to do this and you have to do that it's not it's not going to 1059 00:54:57,160 --> 00:55:00,480 help them yes. So I guess ultimately the 1060 00:55:00,480 --> 00:55:03,520 mindset is you don't have to do anything. 1061 00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:08,360 There is no expectation when you foster or when you rescue really 1062 00:55:08,360 --> 00:55:10,040 is. I think what what's been a 1063 00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:13,160 common thread throughout our conversation is personalization, 1064 00:55:13,480 --> 00:55:18,240 seeing the individual and seeing the individual's needs and being 1065 00:55:18,240 --> 00:55:22,240 able to meet those needs. For them as best as opposed to, 1066 00:55:22,480 --> 00:55:25,160 you know, as best as you can. And yeah, you might, you know, 1067 00:55:25,160 --> 00:55:28,600 if you foster, you might get a dog that really wants to sleep 1068 00:55:29,360 --> 00:55:32,000 in your bedroom. And then then there's that talk 1069 00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:34,360 on OK, well, are you comfortable with a dog being on your bed? 1070 00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:37,080 Are you comfortable with the dog being in your room on a dog bed? 1071 00:55:37,080 --> 00:55:40,360 Or you might get a dog that wants to be as far away from you 1072 00:55:40,360 --> 00:55:44,480 as possible for those first few weeks and not be in a room with 1073 00:55:44,480 --> 00:55:47,440 you. And again, that is another we 1074 00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:49,280 bring this dog and expecting that this dog is going to love 1075 00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:52,360 us and actually right, you know, with at first with Rayna, she 1076 00:55:52,360 --> 00:55:54,000 don't want to be anywhere near me and that isn't. 1077 00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:55,040 Really. At first. 1078 00:55:55,440 --> 00:55:57,400 Yeah, she was very scared of all people. 1079 00:55:57,400 --> 00:56:00,520 She was a definite flight risk. Like I think if we'd have left 1080 00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:03,000 our door open a crack, she'd have been gone and we'd never 1081 00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:05,600 seen her again. There was a click in her brain. 1082 00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:08,920 I would say about 3 or 4 weeks in, she sudden, I remember I 1083 00:56:08,920 --> 00:56:12,320 used to open the front door and I would see her running down in 1084 00:56:12,320 --> 00:56:15,360 the corridor. And then one day I opened the 1085 00:56:15,360 --> 00:56:19,200 door and she came running towards me and it was like, ah, 1086 00:56:20,080 --> 00:56:24,200 she suddenly is like, it's you and something had changed in her 1087 00:56:24,200 --> 00:56:25,960 brain. But that is wonderful. 1088 00:56:25,960 --> 00:56:28,240 And that is one of the reasons we decided to keep her because 1089 00:56:28,240 --> 00:56:31,120 it just felt like, Oh, no, she's yeah. 1090 00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:35,400 Yeah, she was just, yeah, she needed a bit of time, and then 1091 00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:37,760 she warmed to you. So I guess that that's so 1092 00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:40,160 magical, isn't it? It's so beautiful to see the 1093 00:56:40,160 --> 00:56:44,800 transition, to see that now bond form and them learning to trust 1094 00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:48,320 and learning like to show a bit more of themselves and know that 1095 00:56:48,320 --> 00:56:50,040 they are saved. They don't have to be young 1096 00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:52,160 dogs. They can be quite old dogs and 1097 00:56:52,160 --> 00:56:55,640 they can learn these things. Like you said, it's they might 1098 00:56:55,640 --> 00:56:58,920 not, you know, you might get a 1011 year old dog and it might 1099 00:56:58,920 --> 00:57:03,840 not be that you can, you know, take them to the busy park or to 1100 00:57:03,880 --> 00:57:08,800 a picnic or BBQ, whatever. But you definitely can make such 1101 00:57:08,800 --> 00:57:10,560 progress with them quite quickly. 1102 00:57:10,560 --> 00:57:14,560 Just in terms of them feeling it's just safety. 1103 00:57:14,560 --> 00:57:17,600 I think safety, if there's one take away, it's just how can I 1104 00:57:17,600 --> 00:57:20,360 help this dog feel safe? Because everything else comes 1105 00:57:20,360 --> 00:57:23,280 from from that. And safety looks confront to 1106 00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:26,600 other dogs. So for some dogs, safety is 1107 00:57:26,600 --> 00:57:29,200 eating their meal and peace without other people around. 1108 00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:32,840 For some dogs, safety is being as close as they can be to a 1109 00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:35,320 human when they're sleeping and not being on their own. 1110 00:57:35,320 --> 00:57:38,320 Safety has different forms, but it's looking at that dog and 1111 00:57:38,320 --> 00:57:40,040 thinking, right, what does this dog need to? 1112 00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:42,920 Yeah, to feel safe. It's so funny you mentioned 1113 00:57:42,920 --> 00:57:45,840 about sleeping. Duna would sleep on me if she 1114 00:57:45,840 --> 00:57:48,760 could. I've gradually I like get on in 1115 00:57:48,760 --> 00:57:51,000 the bed and in like, I don't know. 1116 00:57:51,320 --> 00:57:55,480 So she'll be next to me. Oh, they need to. 1117 00:57:57,080 --> 00:58:01,560 Hello, Rayna. Oh, she's gorgeous. 1118 00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:03,960 I just hurt my heart to see the scars. 1119 00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:05,320 I know, I know. It does. 1120 00:58:05,360 --> 00:58:08,520 I feel really angry. I sometimes think like if I. 1121 00:58:10,480 --> 00:58:13,880 Yeah, it's just you just think how they're so. 1122 00:58:14,000 --> 00:58:15,880 Yeah. Like with Rayna, she is just the 1123 00:58:15,880 --> 00:58:19,400 most gentle soul. She really is. 1124 00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:21,880 She's just like this little gentle. 1125 00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:24,120 It's like living. It's like sharing my house with 1126 00:58:24,120 --> 00:58:27,880 a really gentle, timid deer. And you think, how could someone 1127 00:58:27,880 --> 00:58:31,880 hurt her? It's just, yeah, unfathomable. 1128 00:58:31,920 --> 00:58:34,320 I know that cutting the ear can be a common punishment for 1129 00:58:34,320 --> 00:58:38,000 things like stealing food or, you know, but then you think, 1130 00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:41,520 wow, what a consequence for taking food when you're hungry. 1131 00:58:41,520 --> 00:58:44,920 Like, yeah, if that is what we think naughty is, you know, and 1132 00:58:44,920 --> 00:58:48,000 they're just trying to eat. It's, it's mad, isn't it? 1133 00:58:48,480 --> 00:58:51,800 It really is, Sam. It's really, really lovely to 1134 00:58:51,800 --> 00:58:55,480 have met you finally and then also have a chat with you. 1135 00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:57,720 I've learned so much from our conversation, and I think 1136 00:58:57,720 --> 00:59:03,360 ultimately just what oozes out of you is empathy and warms. 1137 00:59:03,400 --> 00:59:05,920 And I just think your dogs are so lucky to have you as their 1138 00:59:05,920 --> 00:59:08,600 mom. Yeah, and your kids, obviously. 1139 00:59:08,600 --> 00:59:12,520 Yeah, I'm still her mom and we've already got like trips 1140 00:59:12,520 --> 00:59:14,880 planned on what week she'll be here and there. 1141 00:59:14,880 --> 00:59:17,400 And but yeah, it's like you said, it's taking each 1142 00:59:17,400 --> 00:59:19,400 individual dog and thinking about what do they need right 1143 00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:21,480 now and what's the best for them. 1144 00:59:22,240 --> 00:59:24,080 But. What's the best for them? 1145 00:59:24,080 --> 00:59:27,080 Yeah, it's really hard because it means we have to put our own 1146 00:59:27,080 --> 00:59:28,440 needs aside. Definitely. 1147 00:59:28,520 --> 00:59:31,560 And I think that's the crux of this episode is being 1148 00:59:31,560 --> 00:59:35,480 comfortable with that and and doing what's right for them. 1149 00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:39,760 So I commend you on realising that and caring enough to make 1150 00:59:39,760 --> 00:59:45,400 sure that she what's left of her time, will enjoy that time and 1151 00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:49,000 not be stressed and fearful. Well, I hope all the most about 1152 00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:52,800 yourself and Duna as well, and always just from the Project 1153 00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:56,520 Galgo team support either way, whether you decide that actually 1154 00:59:56,520 --> 00:59:59,240 you couldn't bear to part without or you decide actually 1155 00:59:59,560 --> 01:00:03,200 you want to just be multiple fostering either, either way, 1156 01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:06,040 it's it's it's wonderful and you'll get support. 1157 01:00:06,240 --> 01:00:08,560 Oh 100%. You know what I was thinking the 1158 01:00:08,560 --> 01:00:12,360 other day of all of the different rescues charities that 1159 01:00:12,360 --> 01:00:17,200 I could have chosen as a start to my fostering journey, I just 1160 01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:20,520 think Project Galgo is incredible, incredible. 1161 01:00:20,520 --> 01:00:24,520 The amount of support I've received, you know, responses, 1162 01:00:24,520 --> 01:00:28,120 it's like God knows what time in the evening, they're always on, 1163 01:00:28,120 --> 01:00:30,360 they're always trying to help and I just think it's 1164 01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:32,400 incredible. It sets the bar really high. 1165 01:00:32,400 --> 01:00:34,280 Nobody paid me to say any of this. 1166 01:00:34,280 --> 01:00:37,520 This is just my own lived experience and it's lovely 1167 01:00:37,520 --> 01:00:40,800 because that means that the support that I'm getting is the 1168 01:00:40,800 --> 01:00:44,840 support the dogs are getting. I think that that sends a clear 1169 01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:49,080 message to me. Above and beyond just such a 1170 01:00:49,080 --> 01:00:53,120 very very small cog in it but they the amount of time and love 1171 01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:57,360 that is put in to helping them trying to better dogs lives is 1172 01:00:57,360 --> 01:00:59,840 is amazing. Yeah, and it's personal. 1173 01:00:59,840 --> 01:01:02,320 It feels very high so. I think if people do feel like 1174 01:01:02,320 --> 01:01:05,640 they've got the, you know, the time and the ability to foster, 1175 01:01:05,640 --> 01:01:10,200 I think it's such a fulfilling experience to feel like you are 1176 01:01:10,560 --> 01:01:13,960 changing this dog's course in life and they're on this course 1177 01:01:13,960 --> 01:01:18,120 and, you know, they've got a lot of trauma and a lot of upset and 1178 01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:20,520 a lot of stress. And then you are sort of 1179 01:01:20,520 --> 01:01:25,360 changing tact and giving them a new start is really such a great 1180 01:01:25,360 --> 01:01:27,080 thing to do. It's amazing. 1181 01:01:27,080 --> 01:01:28,600 And it's not like an overnight thing. 1182 01:01:28,600 --> 01:01:32,720 It's so gradual and it's so subtle that, yeah, it's not 1183 01:01:32,720 --> 01:01:36,240 like, I don't know, you're saved, you know, it's like, and 1184 01:01:36,240 --> 01:01:39,600 in that process you change as an individual as well because you 1185 01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:41,920 learn about yourself, your capacity for love, your 1186 01:01:41,920 --> 01:01:44,400 patience, your, you know, empathy and all that kind of 1187 01:01:44,400 --> 01:01:46,240 stuff. So it really is a win win in 1188 01:01:46,240 --> 01:01:49,640 many ways. But yeah, anyways, I will let 1189 01:01:49,640 --> 01:01:53,040 you go because obviously you're. Being cold summons about that, 1190 01:01:53,040 --> 01:01:54,520 she's very good at letting me know what she needs. 1191 01:01:55,320 --> 01:01:56,920 Thank you for chatting with me today. 1192 01:01:57,000 --> 01:01:58,800 I'll speak to you again soon. Bye. 1193 01:01:59,680 --> 01:02:00,560 Bye, Sam.