1 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:10,560 Kyodo and Welcome to Swim Chats, a podcast about swimming. 2 00:00:10,760 --> 00:00:13,840 I'm Shona Riddell, a writer, former journalist and swimmer 3 00:00:13,840 --> 00:00:15,840 from Wellington, Alciro and New Zealand. 4 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:18,960 For each episode, I talk to a different guest from our swim 5 00:00:18,960 --> 00:00:21,480 community. Please hit the follow button so 6 00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:24,480 you don't miss an episode. If you enjoy the podcast, please 7 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:27,400 share it with a friend or two. You can also leave a five star 8 00:00:27,400 --> 00:00:30,000 rating which helps other people discover swim chats. 9 00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:33,360 And finally, to support the podcast and help me to continue 10 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,560 running it, you can become a Swim Buddy on Patreon for $5 a 11 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:38,520 month. To find out more, visit 12 00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:42,360 patreon.com/swim Chats. There's a link in the episode 13 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:46,800 Show Nights. Hi, Laura. 14 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:49,880 Nice to see you and nice to meet you, and I really appreciate 15 00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:51,240 your time. Thanks for coming on the 16 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:53,640 podcast. Yeah, lovely to meet you too and 17 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:55,400 thanks for being by. Cool. 18 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:59,640 So I don't normally open these interviews by talking about 19 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:03,880 people's ages, but I know in your case as as part of your, 20 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:07,280 your swim story and that you I read that you retired from 21 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:11,040 competitive swimming in your mid 20s and then 8:00 or so years 22 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:15,080 later, you found yourself returning to it and you were 23 00:01:15,160 --> 00:01:17,840 faster and stronger than you had been before. 24 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:21,160 So would you like to talk a bit about how that came about? 25 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:25,920 Yeah, so I officially retired. I think I've almost got 2 26 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:29,160 chapters of swimming now. So my, I suppose you could call 27 00:01:29,160 --> 00:01:32,720 it traditional competitive swimming finished in 2016. 28 00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:36,480 I finished on a big high that year with my surf life saving. 29 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:40,720 I broke a world record. Our national team won the pole, 30 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:42,360 the beach and the overall trophy. 31 00:01:42,360 --> 00:01:47,040 So that side was just awesome. But it was also an Olympic year 32 00:01:47,040 --> 00:01:50,680 and I missed the Olympics, my third attempt of three different 33 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:52,880 games. And I think it was just a 34 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:55,600 natural. It felt there was no pressure 35 00:01:55,600 --> 00:01:57,360 from anyone else. I just felt like I was ready to 36 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:00,720 move on, go into my career. A lot of my friends at that time 37 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:02,880 had finished their degrees and we're now actually in 38 00:02:02,920 --> 00:02:05,520 established careers. So I was having that a little 39 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:08,360 bit of, I suppose it, it feels like it's done. 40 00:02:09,039 --> 00:02:13,800 And then, yeah, I suppose 8 was eight years later, I jumped back 41 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:18,000 in for a master's event and just got a a big shock by how fast, 42 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:21,680 how much speed I've retained. And I attribute all of that to 43 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:23,800 strength work. And that's simply because I was 44 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:27,440 only swimming once a week in a triathlon squad, which is 45 00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:31,640 absolutely not a Sprint program. And I think that just, it 46 00:02:31,640 --> 00:02:33,560 reignited a love that I've always had. 47 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:36,440 I think one of the my favorite parts of swimming is it will be 48 00:02:36,440 --> 00:02:39,400 in my life forever. I just love swimming in all its 49 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:42,400 forms. And it just kind of gave me an 50 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:45,800 opportunity to do it my way. And not that I had any. 51 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:48,280 I loved my journey with all my different coaches. 52 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:52,680 And I think they, you know, they helped to unleash a certain 53 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:54,640 athlete in me. And I don't think I could have 54 00:02:54,640 --> 00:02:58,160 done better at that stage. But this I suppose 2nd chapter, 55 00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:02,280 I've just had so much autonomy and it's a really, really fun 56 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:04,320 experience. Yeah, cool. 57 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:08,560 And I, I read that as, as you're saying, you've had coaches in 58 00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:11,280 the past that you you really valued, but now you're mostly 59 00:03:11,280 --> 00:03:14,440 coaching yourself. Is that quite unusual? 60 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:17,680 Very unusual in the competitive swimming scene. 61 00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:22,160 So my biggest shock of the 2025 was making it back to the 62 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:24,880 national team. So I competed at my very first 63 00:03:24,880 --> 00:03:28,360 World Aquatics Championships and the 50 butterfly and the 50 64 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:32,280 freestyle. So that was 2014 was my last New 65 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:36,080 Zealand swim team. So you know that that was quite 66 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:39,160 an unreal experience. And I think I'm the first New 67 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:41,520 Zealand swimmer to be self coached potentially. 68 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:45,120 I don't know of any others. So yes, it is unusual and it's, 69 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:49,240 it makes the whole experience a lot more exciting because 70 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:53,720 everything I kind of and is on me or lose is on me. 71 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:57,040 But I do have to always say that it's definitely not a solo 72 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:58,720 mission. Like, yes, I tend to write the 73 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:01,160 macro plans and I've got the vision of what I want my 74 00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:04,280 training to look like, but I've had so much support. 75 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:06,920 So there's no way I think I could have done this without 76 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:09,880 very supportive people and very knowledgeable people. 77 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:14,880 Yeah, yeah, differently. And so when you're coaching 78 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:18,640 yourself, I imagine it's a combination of positive self 79 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:23,520 talk to motivate yourself and, you know, champion your own 80 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:27,760 abilities, but also give yourself constructive criticism. 81 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:29,600 So how do you sort of balance those two? 82 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:34,600 I've learned not to trust everything my body's trying to 83 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:37,920 tell me. So I think it's been a really 84 00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:41,200 interesting journey where I've got say the set plan, but 85 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:43,720 because I'm older and I'm working particularly around 86 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:45,960 shift work where there's a lot of stress and potentially 87 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:51,760 disruption and sleep patterns. If I'm really fatigued, I rather 88 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:55,160 than say, oh, I do need more rest because that's important as 89 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:57,840 you get older, particularly for recovery and trying to come back 90 00:04:57,840 --> 00:05:02,000 stronger, I would just go to the gym or I'd go to the pool and 91 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:05,120 I'd do the warm up and begin the main set or the main lift. 92 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:07,600 And if I more often than not, I actually felt great. 93 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:11,600 So I would continue with the session and have like pretty 94 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:13,920 good results. So I think one of the most 95 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:17,720 surprising parts of the self coaching journey had been 96 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:23,800 curiosity and not trusting that you're really tired all the time 97 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:27,000 or really starting to challenge these notions of what your your 98 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:30,200 capacities really are. Because sometimes I really did 99 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:34,440 need that risk, but other times just been a bit been a bit 100 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:36,520 tougher. I think I've got no 101 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:39,400 expectations. And that was one very big 102 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:43,600 fronting full pattern to get over at the start was that I 103 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:46,880 started to build all these ideas of what if I don't achieve this? 104 00:05:46,880 --> 00:05:49,200 What if I don't do that? And it was quite liberating to 105 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:52,520 be like, who cares? Like I'm 33, I'm doing this for 106 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:55,160 a bit of fun. If I fail, like, yeah, it'll 107 00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:58,520 suck, but I'm not going to be devastated by that news. 108 00:05:58,840 --> 00:06:04,560 And I think that's been a really positive side of my second life 109 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:06,120 in swimming is that I'm much more balanced. 110 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,920 So like I see a lot of friends and family, I go to events, it's 111 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:13,440 not swimming is life. And for me and I think my 112 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:16,480 personality that works really well when I'm hyper focused. 113 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:21,160 I think it's it can be a lot and it works for some and it doesn't 114 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:23,840 for others. That sounds like a very healthy 115 00:06:23,840 --> 00:06:26,680 approach, yeah. And so you're writing your own 116 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:29,160 swim programs, I imagine, each week. 117 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:32,400 And are you writing your own strength programs in the gym as 118 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:33,880 well? I am. 119 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:36,680 So I did a personal training certificate about five years ago 120 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:38,920 and didn't use it until recently. 121 00:06:38,920 --> 00:06:42,920 So that that's been really fun. I definitely pick the brains of 122 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:45,600 my fiance who's a physiotherapist who's very 123 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:49,040 knowledgeable and trying to balance my programs because I 124 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:52,800 would often have, maybe it was biased to one side of the body 125 00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:56,320 or I didn't have enough say rotational or anti rotational 126 00:06:56,320 --> 00:06:59,120 core movements embedded in those programs. 127 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:02,800 So he's been really good at just the finesse of the sessions that 128 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:05,720 I'd built and he's really helped me to develop like my own 129 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:08,640 sessions, but also my coaching capacities because I've got a 130 00:07:08,640 --> 00:07:12,880 few online clients that it's, it's helped them as well. 131 00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:16,600 So it's been, yes, I do write my own programs, but it's been 132 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:20,000 pretty cool picking the brains of other people that have been 133 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:22,080 in the sector for longer. Yeah. 134 00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:26,480 And I'm curious to none apparently differs week on week, 135 00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:30,720 but what what sort of percentage of your training is swimming 136 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:34,240 based and what percentage is strength based if it makes 137 00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:35,760 sense? Yeah, absolutely. 138 00:07:35,760 --> 00:07:38,800 So this year with the world's build up, I did slightly more 139 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:42,120 swimming because I was focused on my technique a lot more. 140 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:46,400 Swimming is so unique in the environment that we work in, 141 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:47,600 right? So the water moves so 142 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:49,320 differently. You can't just get your 143 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:51,640 technique better on dry land. So I think I was swimming 144 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:56,800 anywhere between 3:00 and very rarely about 6 * a week. 145 00:07:56,840 --> 00:07:59,360 And then gym would always be a consistent 4. 146 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:02,240 So it did kind of vary throughout the season. 147 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:05,560 So I would start, I started with less swimming and then built it 148 00:08:05,560 --> 00:08:08,520 up and it kind of almost did a mountain peak in terms of 149 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:11,320 building up the volume of swimming and skill based 150 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:13,520 acquisition and then tape it a little bit. 151 00:08:13,960 --> 00:08:17,040 My first year back I kind of wanted to challenge the 152 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:20,200 narrative. So I swam little like I think I 153 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:24,920 was in the gym 5 or 6 * a week and only swimming two or three 154 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:27,640 and I was still smashing my lifetime beasts. 155 00:08:27,640 --> 00:08:32,360 And so that was a very, I didn't expect that outcome with such 156 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:34,559 little swimming. Yeah. 157 00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:37,120 And whereabouts do you do your training? 158 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:39,520 Like you don't have to say the exact pool, but you're in 159 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:42,080 Auckland, is that right? So are you training in indoor 160 00:08:42,080 --> 00:08:44,600 pools or a mix of places? It's. 161 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:48,080 A mix so I would mainly swim at one of our premier indoor pools, 162 00:08:48,720 --> 00:08:52,240 but it's actually quite fun. So there's a the big competition 163 00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:55,880 50m pool and I used to train there a decade ago, but there's 164 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:58,840 actually a small and a warm learn to swim pool that's like 165 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:01,360 33°. I actually did a lot of my 166 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:04,720 training in this learn to swim pool because it was warm. 167 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:09,440 And I the training sets that I do are hyper focused on the 50m. 168 00:09:09,600 --> 00:09:14,040 So I would swim sets of 15 or 20 meters and have two or three 169 00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:16,440 minutes rest. So in that big pool that I'm so 170 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:19,560 used to, I would get cold and I don't know, it was actually 171 00:09:19,560 --> 00:09:22,680 quite fun being in this little kiddie pool just absolutely 172 00:09:22,680 --> 00:09:26,800 ripping Max effort 50m fives. And then and then I'd do swim in 173 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:28,600 an outdoor pool, which is really close to me. 174 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:31,680 That's actually where I've just been and it, it brings, again, 175 00:09:31,680 --> 00:09:34,240 like what I was talking about with balance. 176 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:37,720 I think so many outdoors are such a unique experience, 177 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:40,280 particularly doing backstroke. I do tend to hit the land rope a 178 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:42,600 little bit more often, but it just, I don't know, you feel 179 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:45,200 more in the environment, more grounded. 180 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:47,640 It's similar to a Bush walk or you know, when you get your feet 181 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:50,720 on the grass or the sand, it feels great to swim outdoors. 182 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:53,880 Yeah, cool. And I know you've you do a bit 183 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:57,720 of open water swimming as well. Is that more as a coach or do 184 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:00,280 you do it sort of for your own personal swimming as well? 185 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:04,680 I'm personal swimming yeah, I just enjoy my partner and I do a 186 00:10:04,680 --> 00:10:06,560 lot of. We go to the beach in the 187 00:10:06,560 --> 00:10:09,440 morning and do 20 strokes one way and then 20 strokes the 188 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:12,760 other and go get a coffee. So not big volume training. 189 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:18,080 I will definitely get back into the ocean more often when my, 190 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:20,640 what do you call it, Sprint career is done. 191 00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:24,440 So I love the open water, but it's not conducive to top end 192 00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:25,320 speed. Yeah. 193 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:28,040 Fair enough. And I know that your special 194 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:31,120 Taser, if that's the right word of freestyle and butterfly, 195 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:33,480 right, like you, that's what you've qualified for in the 196 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:39,760 past, the 50m sprints. And so I'm very much a freestyle 197 00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:41,560 swimmer. I'm pretty confident with my 198 00:10:41,560 --> 00:10:45,000 freestyle now. Butterfly I tend to avoid like 199 00:10:45,000 --> 00:10:48,920 the plague because I've never really learned to do it and any 200 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:51,720 time I attempt it I feel like I'm dislocating my shoulders. 201 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:57,960 Do you do you have any tips for someone like me who is curious 202 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:00,600 about butterfly? But a little bit he's attempt to 203 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:04,600 to give it a go. We're thin, but first of all, my 204 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:07,240 sight always if you're not someone, if you haven't learned 205 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:10,880 butterfly, I use tools all the time with my beginner and 206 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:15,640 intermediate athletes. So big soft fins and then it is 207 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:17,520 all about rhythm so you can break it down. 208 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:21,160 Get used to the undulation of the butterfly kick first. 209 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:24,520 So doing a range of the side butterfly kick, trying to get 210 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:27,760 that even kick forward and back with the hamstring activation 211 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:30,680 butterfly kick on the back. You should feel your core doing 212 00:11:30,680 --> 00:11:33,240 that a lot. And then also butterfly kick 213 00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:36,240 with the arms by the side, just on the stomach because I think 214 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:41,280 without a strong butterfly kick it can be quite challenging with 215 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:42,960 the arms. There's a few different drills 216 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:46,640 to start to get the rhythm, but it is such an interesting stroke 217 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:50,760 because it does, it weaves strength and rhythm perfectly 218 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:53,160 together. So if you've got both of those 219 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:54,840 things, it feels awesome and you love it. 220 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:57,960 But it does take a long time. But I think as long as you can 221 00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:00,960 safely build up to it without getting shoulder pain, it's 222 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:03,840 definitely worth it because it is such a cool stroke. 223 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:08,240 And I actually, when I came back two years ago, I wasn't, I was 224 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:12,240 only swimming the butterfly for fun and I've always loved it. 225 00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:14,480 And the reason I did it, a lot of my training was just for 226 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:17,800 strength actually, because it's so hard and it just randomly 227 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:22,120 paid off in the event. That's awesome. 228 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:26,960 And so related related to that you, you spend a lot of time 229 00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:29,760 coaching other people I know and you have your own business where 230 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:33,600 you also do virtual coaching, which is, you know, I assume 231 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:36,720 it's where people send you videos of their swimming and 232 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:40,320 also you provide online content that other people can watch and 233 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:43,880 subscribe to. When did you decide to set up 234 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:47,840 your business? It came off the back of my 235 00:12:47,840 --> 00:12:51,600 social media. So I started my page or a move I 236 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:55,480 can't a few years ago now. And it was just my way of 237 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:58,320 sharing knowledge about swimming and it honestly just resonated 238 00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:01,560 with people and kept growing and that kept fueling my interest. 239 00:13:01,560 --> 00:13:04,480 And I'm, I found it so fascinating to try and put my 240 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:08,280 kid or my, you know, think about what it would be like to be a 241 00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:11,480 beginner, like an adult on set learner, or whether it was like 242 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:14,080 a former elite summer getting back into masters. 243 00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:16,800 So I was kind of crafting content for all these different 244 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:19,160 people. And from that I thought, well, 245 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:22,440 if, if people are resonating with free content and I love it, 246 00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:26,520 like it would be a dream come true basically to, to make a 247 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:29,120 side hustle from my passion. So it's grown from there. 248 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:32,720 And it's definitely taken a long time and I tend to get excited 249 00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:35,200 and go one way and in the other. And it's, it's been a bit of a 250 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:36,960 journey, but it's going really well now. 251 00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:39,800 And the group, the online guys are awesome. 252 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:42,840 So it's a lot of it's primarily like a squad essentially. 253 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:45,360 So it's a lot of programs on sets. 254 00:13:45,840 --> 00:13:48,800 We've got an online forum, you know, chat and connect in there 255 00:13:48,800 --> 00:13:52,280 with some challenges and the strength, the strength side, I 256 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:54,240 think is one of my passion points as well. 257 00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:57,200 So that's been growing and I think that's been quite a cool 258 00:13:57,200 --> 00:14:01,120 opportunity because you've got capacity to really push or 259 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:03,960 regress people depending on what they're capable of. 260 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:07,480 Yeah, interesting. And we should say that on your 261 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:10,680 Instagram, you've got almost 70,000 followers, which is 262 00:14:10,680 --> 00:14:13,240 massive. And I'll link to it in the show 263 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:15,160 notes so people can go and find it. 264 00:14:15,960 --> 00:14:18,400 And like you say, you're posting a lot of content. 265 00:14:18,400 --> 00:14:22,800 It's sort of how to how to content and it's usually videos 266 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:25,280 of your swimming and you're giving people advice. 267 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:28,360 And I like, I don't want to gush too much, but your swimming is 268 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:30,000 amazing. Like obviously you're very 269 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:32,920 accomplished, but just to watch it is such a pleasure because 270 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:36,160 you're just moving with such grace and ease through the 271 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:38,000 water. You know, there are people who 272 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:42,600 are fast swimmers, but they're creating a lot of, you know, it 273 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:46,440 just looks like they're working so hard, they're splashing so 274 00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:48,520 much. But to watch you, it's like 275 00:14:48,520 --> 00:14:51,520 watching it's it's almost like a work of art, if that's not 276 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:55,800 overstating it. But yeah, I definitely recommend 277 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:57,640 that people go and and check it out. 278 00:14:57,920 --> 00:14:59,040 Oh, thank. You that's that's so. 279 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:03,920 Common. Yeah, It's very inspiring. 280 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:08,040 And I know that recently you coached your dad as well. 281 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:09,440 Would you like to talk a bit about that? 282 00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:11,480 Because that's really cool. Absolutely. 283 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:14,560 That was probably one of the coolest experiences. 284 00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:18,800 So my dad turned 65 last year and he just kind of mentioned 285 00:15:18,800 --> 00:15:20,920 offhand about maybe doing the masters. 286 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:24,240 And bearing in mind like my dad has never done a swimming event 287 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:27,000 in his entire life. Like he literally learned to 288 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:30,320 swim out on the farm in a river. Like his brother taught him to 289 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:32,960 put his arms over and kick like anything. 290 00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:37,200 So it was, it was just so much fun because he was so motivated 291 00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:39,120 and so adherent with the sessions. 292 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:43,240 But the sessions I was writing him started at 400 meters and I 293 00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:45,560 think our longest session was about 900. 294 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:50,280 So trying to keep them purposeful, but you know, I 295 00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:54,320 suppose at his level was was really fun as a coach and to 296 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:57,960 actually see him change because he seen me through a few videos 297 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:01,720 of his dive and his sprinting and a few technical changes when 298 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:04,760 you have never swum competitively, the changes 299 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:07,360 happened so quickly. And I tell you what, I was so 300 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:11,000 nervous at the actual nationals. So he was at the at the masters 301 00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:13,000 nationals, just one event, the 50 freestyle. 302 00:16:13,520 --> 00:16:15,720 And I was just like, please don't break. 303 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:17,040 Like don't fall into the water early. 304 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:21,000 Don't you know? And he swam 15 seconds faster 305 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:24,480 than this this time trial. But I'll be like, yeah, that's 306 00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:26,240 partly. Hopefully it's somewhat of the 307 00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:28,240 coaching I'm. Sure it is. 308 00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:31,320 That's huge. That's a huge change in time. 309 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:33,200 So I'm. Trying to now convince mom and 310 00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:36,520 my brother to do a full quilter relay at the next Masters. 311 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:40,200 But then I think what makes it particularly special was it 312 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:43,640 Dad's just changed so much. He almost passed away last year 313 00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:47,440 in a freak medical accident. And so for him to take on 314 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:50,280 something like this and actually, like, do it, he was. 315 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:52,520 Yeah. It was the coolest 40 seconds of 316 00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:55,840 my life. I think 39, four or something in 317 00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:58,840 the 53, Yeah. And, like, all the more special 318 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:01,920 that it's your dad, right? Like family, yeah. 319 00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:04,920 Like before the race, I'm trying to put his cap on, so I'm 320 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:07,560 holding it on his forehead and I'm like, you know, make sure 321 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:10,079 that your goggles don't have the cap underneath, otherwise 322 00:17:10,079 --> 00:17:12,440 they'll leak. And we did a couple of practices 323 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:14,640 because to reposition the goggles because that's quite a 324 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:16,520 personal thing. You don't want them to come off. 325 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:19,560 It was, it was so much fun because he's been like my 326 00:17:19,599 --> 00:17:22,160 biggest supporter. He was like the starter in 327 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:25,440 Gisborne for my brother and I like came to every competition, 328 00:17:25,599 --> 00:17:28,440 loved to watch us train, but there was no pressure on us 329 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:30,560 either. And I think if I could speak to 330 00:17:30,560 --> 00:17:33,600 any swimming parents and a lot of my friends who did really 331 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:37,640 well, we've had supportive parents, but not overbearing. 332 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:41,280 So it was always an expectation that if I didn't train, mom and 333 00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:43,520 dad would stop paying the fees. But they didn't really care 334 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:46,720 whether I swam or not. And I think they gave us the 335 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:49,840 freedom, my brother and I, to really explore our, like, 336 00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:52,960 athletic capacities without the stress of needing to win because 337 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:56,400 I wasn't particularly good until I was, you know, early teenager. 338 00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:58,240 I just love the process of training. 339 00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:01,720 I think having supportive parents that weren't forcing us 340 00:18:02,360 --> 00:18:04,880 to achieve was such a cool experience. 341 00:18:05,240 --> 00:18:08,840 Yeah, that's awesome. And Speaking of sort of the 342 00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:13,320 older generation, like people I swim with range and age, I think 343 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:18,440 from their 30s to their 80s here in Wellington, and I'm in my 344 00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:21,720 late 40s now. So it's really cool to see older 345 00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:25,320 people, not necessarily old people, but you know, older 346 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:28,080 people swimming and continuing to swim. 347 00:18:28,760 --> 00:18:31,720 Like it's the kind of sport that you can keep doing, right? 348 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:35,920 And that's really cool to see. I think that's one of the my 349 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:38,920 favorite parts about swimming. So it's just so kind on your 350 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:40,000 body. Like, yeah, you get some 351 00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:41,480 overview stuff through your shoulders. 352 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:44,800 But you know, the Masters world champs, I think they have like 353 00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:47,920 octogenarians there, right? Like the over 100 year olds. 354 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:49,720 And I think that's you're so right. 355 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:53,320 It is so special. I read somewhere that your 356 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:56,520 favorite quote is the water doesn't know how old you are and 357 00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:59,000 I really like that that's. From Dara Torres. 358 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:02,680 So she that book is phenomenal, phenomenal if anyone wants a 359 00:19:02,680 --> 00:19:04,960 swimming range. So she was an American athlete 360 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:07,640 and she actually was overshadowed of course because 361 00:19:07,640 --> 00:19:09,880 Michael Phelps won 8 golds and rightly so. 362 00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:14,320 But she was 42 years old at that Olympics and she won silver in 363 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:20,280 the 53 and she lost the gold by .01 like 42 years old. 364 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:23,480 Well, I don't people even know that happened. 365 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:26,000 And she had a 2 year old in the stands watching her like her, 366 00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:29,080 her child, she's an incredible athlete. 367 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:31,960 Like no normal 42 year old will do that. 368 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:34,960 She had been to five previous Olympics, her first on debut at 369 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:37,680 like 15 years old. But when you read a book, you 370 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,520 understand it's an insight into a really elite mindset. 371 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:43,880 Wow. I no, I hadn't heard of her. 372 00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:45,280 And do you know what the books called? 373 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:47,400 I can look it up. Age. 374 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:49,480 Is just a number, yeah. Nice. 375 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:53,760 Yeah, cool. And I know another thing you've 376 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:56,440 been sort of curious about is ice swimming. 377 00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:59,960 And I read that you're a a current world record holder and 378 00:19:59,960 --> 00:20:01,920 ice swimming now. So if you want to talk a bit 379 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:04,840 about that. That, that was another really 380 00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:06,960 fun thing. I'm quite a curious person now 381 00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:09,120 work as a nurse. So physiologically and 382 00:20:09,120 --> 00:20:11,680 scientifically, I was quite interested in your response to 383 00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:14,960 cold exposure. And I just saw it on social 384 00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:17,680 media, to be honest. Ice swimming, I was like, well, 385 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:20,640 like I find swimming 100 meters very easy. 386 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:22,080 There's not much challenge to it. 387 00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:24,800 But if you put me into two degrees, I don't know like what 388 00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:27,280 would happen. And it was actually quite fun 389 00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:31,240 because my build up, obviously I'm based in Auckland and I did 390 00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:34,080 all my training basically in a ice bar. 391 00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:37,720 So I started off just with acclimatization sitting in this 392 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:41,600 ice bath and then I gradually worked up to putting my face in. 393 00:20:42,120 --> 00:20:45,360 And the craziest part of that training was the face in was 394 00:20:45,360 --> 00:20:48,240 actually tolerable when I started practicing blowing 395 00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:50,120 bubbles. And so I'm like in the size bar, 396 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:53,800 blowing bubbles, pretending to roll to breathe, the bubbles 397 00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:56,440 hitting my forehead, it was like being punched. 398 00:20:56,440 --> 00:21:01,240 Like the pain of that cold was actually really surprising. 399 00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:04,120 And when I was rolling to breathe, like even getting used 400 00:21:04,120 --> 00:21:07,920 to trying to relax and breathe because you get like things 401 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:10,600 called like jaw retractions and all your carotids get quite 402 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:12,880 cold. And so, so that was quite an 403 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:15,400 experience. And then the actual community 404 00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:18,160 down there when I got there, they're just so supportive. 405 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:21,440 Like you've got people you've never met cheering for you and 406 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:24,240 you can hear everything because there's no tumble turns you have 407 00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:26,400 to touch and go. So you hear everyone calling 408 00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:29,280 your name, but I think that was quite funny. 409 00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:32,600 I'd only entered the hundreds and when I got down there, the 410 00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:36,400 vibe I, I got a bit competitive and wanted to enter the 500. 411 00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:39,480 Got through there and said to one of the more experienced 412 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:43,240 ladies and Susan Sherwood, who's awesome, said do you think based 413 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:46,280 on the 500 I would finish AK? And she said yes. 414 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:48,440 So I was like, send it, let's do it. 415 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:53,040 So 1000 meters and 2.1°. And I think for me, one of the 416 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:56,560 strangest experiences is I swim with a lot of feels. 417 00:21:56,560 --> 00:21:59,240 So I like to swim with my eyes closed a lot of the time because 418 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:02,240 you can focus on whether you're cause engaged, whether you're 419 00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:06,120 symmetrical, your kick timing. But I'd be watching my hand 420 00:22:06,120 --> 00:22:09,000 assuming this K and I couldn't feel anything. 421 00:22:09,360 --> 00:22:12,000 And even if you're for a few strokes, I was going like 422 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:16,160 finger, like little finger down, thumb down, nothing. 423 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:20,440 I was so cold that you just had to hope you were swimming well. 424 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:23,360 And the other thing I got so cold I was having to rotate like 425 00:22:23,360 --> 00:22:28,000 to 90° just to I suppose get my arm over in the recovery. 426 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,120 And then the actual recovery after I finished was unlike 427 00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:34,760 anything I've ever experienced in my life. 428 00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:37,760 So for people that have never heard of ice swimming, there's a 429 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:40,800 thing called after drop. So actually quite dangerous the 430 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,280 hopefully I'm doing it justice and trying to explain, but 431 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:46,720 essentially when the body gets cold, all your blood vessels 432 00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:50,520 construct so that they keeps the the warm blood around your 433 00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:52,600 centre. So this is what I think happens 434 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:56,120 the hypothesis anyway. So as the body starts to warm 435 00:22:56,120 --> 00:23:00,520 and those extremities, the little arterioles and the 436 00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:04,360 vessels and your fingers start to open, all that cold blood 437 00:23:04,360 --> 00:23:06,560 goes back into the centre. And it can actually suddenly 438 00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:10,520 just that actually 'cause, you know, some people have had 439 00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:14,320 pretty poor outcomes from that. But it was the most intense 440 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:19,520 experience where I had to just accept my body just to, I had to 441 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:22,440 allow my body to save me essentially. 442 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:25,280 Like the shaking was so uncontrollable, I can't even 443 00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:27,640 describe it. You can't drink anything because 444 00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:29,560 you've just got, it's called thermogenesis. 445 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:31,800 So it's just shivering, right? But it's just shivering on a 446 00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:36,600 whole different scale. And that took a couple of hours, 447 00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:39,560 I think, to fully recover. But that was an experience, and 448 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,000 I would actually recommend it. Like, I know that sounds awful, 449 00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:45,240 but that was 1000 meters. And I love a good challenge for 450 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:48,360 anyone that's, you know, a competent summer, doing 100 451 00:23:48,360 --> 00:23:52,240 meters is such a thrill because you get out, you're cold, but 452 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:55,720 you're just so energized. And it was awesome. 453 00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,840 Yeah, it's, it seems to be a growing thing in New Zealand. 454 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:03,120 Like I know more and more people going down to, to participate in 455 00:24:03,120 --> 00:24:04,400 it. I'm sorry. 456 00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:08,440 I, I don't know if I will personally I'm, I'm very 457 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:09,840 interested to hear about it though. 458 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:14,200 Like how do you, how do you sort of psych yourself up to get into 459 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:16,080 that very cold water in the 1st place? 460 00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:19,600 Like, do you have sort of a mental process that you go 461 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:23,680 through? It was mainly focused on 462 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:26,560 breathing because you get a cold shock response, so you tend to 463 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:30,720 inhale quite quickly. So you get in the water because 464 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:33,280 there's no diving. The first thing I'd do was do a 465 00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:36,200 long exhale and put my face in the water. 466 00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:39,440 And that was kind of just to get used to the cold because as 467 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:41,720 you're holding onto the edge, there's literally ice, like 468 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:43,400 sheets of ice on the side of the pool. 469 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,000 So for me, there wasn't much of a mental game, much more in 470 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:50,040 competitive swimming. Like I've got keywords that I 471 00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:54,440 use to stay in the moment and not too nervous For ice 472 00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:56,680 swimming, it was very much physiological because that was 473 00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,480 my biggest challenge. So it was more on breath 474 00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:01,400 control. And if I could control my 475 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:04,240 breathing before the start gun went off, I knew I'd be fine. 476 00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:08,080 Would you be willing to share some of the keyword to use or is 477 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:09,640 that more of a personal thing? No. 478 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:14,080 Absolutely. So for so for dive, I have 479 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,000 keywords for training and for racing. 480 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:20,320 So at the world chance I used cool, which was just I knew that 481 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:24,640 I'd be quite nervous. So trying to relax and just call 482 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:28,560 me that like I was cool headed or, you know, just call on the 483 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:33,520 start. And then lock was another good 484 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:36,600 one that I used to use a lot in training because in sprinting 485 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:38,360 you really want to lock the core on. 486 00:25:38,360 --> 00:25:41,560 So really focusing on drawing like navel to spine and locking 487 00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:45,480 the core on left was one for my dive. 488 00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:48,800 So when I dive, I tend to just flock a little bit. 489 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:52,200 So left meant to try get my sternum up to try get a little 490 00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:57,040 bit more flight time. And yeah, so a few different 491 00:25:57,040 --> 00:25:59,800 ones, but it's quite fun as long as it's a short, sharp word. 492 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:05,800 Because one of the most challenging things for is is 493 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,360 paralysis by analysis. And you just get 100 different 494 00:26:08,360 --> 00:26:10,400 thoughts because you've gone onto aura move and you've seen 495 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:12,760 10 different ideas. You go onto if it was swimming, 496 00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:15,000 you've seen 10 different ideas and you're thinking about them 497 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:16,880 all just swimming. It's just too much. 498 00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:20,560 So when I like when I catch my guys, I just I've got quite a 499 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:23,000 rhythmical process we go through, but it's about 500 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:27,320 isolating one key technical point and then one limb as well. 501 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:30,040 So if you're working on your catch, just your left arm and 502 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,760 really trying to feel the sensation and playing with 503 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,680 extremes, right, we we get less creative as as we get older. 504 00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:38,960 So what does it feel like if you just almost like touch your 505 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,240 shoulder on the way through on your catch versus going to did 506 00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:44,200 straight up and then something in between. 507 00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:47,440 So there's gone a bit off track, but yeah, keywords I like. 508 00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:49,320 I like that paralysis by analysis. 509 00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:52,600 I can relate to that, yeah. And as a coach, you can actually 510 00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,960 see it when someone is thinking a lot that it's there's so much 511 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,080 stiffer, they hold their body and there's a little bit of 512 00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:03,360 hesitation and yeah. Oh and one one thing I was going 513 00:27:03,360 --> 00:27:08,080 to ask is I've recently bought my first smart watch and I'm 514 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,840 enjoying the the data analysis side of fun. 515 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:14,720 So how do you track your own data when you're swimming? 516 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:20,200 I don't I press go when I get in the water and then I press stop 517 00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:21,640 at the end. So it's quite funny because I 518 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:25,400 coach a lot of triathletes who are constantly Start Stop doing 519 00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:28,480 their laps. But I grew up old school, you 520 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:30,120 know, the big clock that spins round. 521 00:27:30,120 --> 00:27:32,480 So I'd. Face clock, yeah. 522 00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:36,800 Face clock, I just used that for leave cycles, but then that's 523 00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:40,120 another really unique part about my journey is I basically 524 00:27:40,120 --> 00:27:42,360 trained blind. So when you're in a squad, 525 00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:44,760 you've got the benefit of timed set. 526 00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,920 So you know on the stopwatch the coach has given you, you know, 527 00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:51,280 exact seconds and split seconds if you're doing Sprint training. 528 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:54,880 I literally just went on field and a little bit of video. 529 00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:56,920 So I had someone kind of fill me. 530 00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,960 I'd have a look and be like, oh, something's not quite, quite 531 00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:01,840 right. Near the end of the season, 532 00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,240 particularly when I made the national team, I did have access 533 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,640 to some coaching, like some timing. 534 00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:11,720 But yeah, in terms of data, that the primary data metrics that I 535 00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:16,120 track are steps because I like to make sure that my daily, my 536 00:28:16,120 --> 00:28:20,480 daily is a acronym for it. TDA, your total daily 537 00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:25,160 expenditure, I think as long as I'm around that 10,000 I think 538 00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:29,120 that's quite good. I track my sleep and my HRV and 539 00:28:29,120 --> 00:28:32,320 that's about it I read. That you or you mentioned 540 00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,880 earlier that you've represented New Zealand in the Life Saving 541 00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:40,360 World Championships and that you're a black fan. 542 00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:44,920 So what is a black fan? Is the name for a national team 543 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,640 member so if you make the New Zealand some team, you're an 544 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:49,760 Aqua black. If you make the New Zealand Surf 545 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:51,320 Life Saving team, you're a black fan. 546 00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:57,360 So I was on the Black Fins team from 2012 to 2016 and I think it 547 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:01,920 was such a cool experience because in 2014 I was on the 548 00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:04,880 Commonwealth Games team and on the Surf life saving team. 549 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:09,120 And you know, both elite level. Obviously swimming is a lot more 550 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:12,440 popular global sport versus Surf life saving a little bit less 551 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:14,880 global. But the team dynamics are just 552 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:16,920 so different. And I feel like I learned and 553 00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:20,840 grew so much from taking aspects of both cultures, the 554 00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:23,280 professionalism and things inside the swimming and the 555 00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:27,080 structure around training and when you're eating and 556 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:30,920 recovering versus the Surf life saving because you just got to 557 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,720 adapt, particularly the guys on the beach because you can't swim 558 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:37,040 perfectly when there's a six foot swell or something. 559 00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:40,880 Like they were the the beach athletes brought so much fun and 560 00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:44,120 lightness to sport and they were still so good. 561 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:48,160 And I think that helped me to have a little bit more joy in my 562 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:52,320 swimming because yes, you do do definitely need structure and to 563 00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:55,480 be taking things seriously. But taking things seriously 564 00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:59,720 doesn't mean you can't have fun. And I think that was one of my 565 00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:02,320 biggest, the challenges going into the world champs, was 566 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:04,640 trying to maintain the joy that I've had from swimming and not 567 00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:08,760 get, I suppose like beat down by personal expectation. 568 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:13,040 Like once you're on a national team, obviously a lot of people 569 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:16,000 want to be where you are. So there's there's definitely 570 00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:19,120 pressure to perform. And I think sitting another 571 00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:22,560 personal best over there in the freestyle like that felt like 572 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:24,920 I'd done my job and I felt like I'd done what I'd trained for. 573 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:27,720 And that was a very proud moment for me, yeah. 574 00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:32,240 That's really cool. And Speaking of swells, I, I 575 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,680 watched a video recently on your Instagram where you talked about 576 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,720 helping somebody build their confidence in the open water. 577 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,240 And that was really lovely. You know, helping somebody 578 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,640 achieve something like that, that must be rewarding. 579 00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:47,840 That was. Definitely my peak of last week. 580 00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:52,040 So Mon or Monica is my flatmate's partner and she 581 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:54,960 seriously almost drowned when she was in high school. 582 00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:57,040 So a lot of people that almost drowned, they have like a little 583 00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:00,760 bit of a scare, but she like was with a high school group and it 584 00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:03,040 made the newspapers like there was a group of them in the sea 585 00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:06,160 for a few hours. So she's got quite a quite a 586 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,600 history with swimming. And so we've been swimming 587 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:12,240 together once a leak at the pole and then that was our first, her 588 00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:16,840 first ever ocean swim. And like I gave her the option. 589 00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:19,120 We kind of said, you know, I don't care if we go in there and 590 00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,600 go out and don't even take a stroke, like it's fine. 591 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:25,640 So we started quite shallow and just said let's go 5 minutes, 592 00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:27,960 see how you feel. And she was amazing. 593 00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:30,800 So I said to her, do you want to swim out to that pink boy? 594 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:33,920 And I'm not great at estimating distances. 595 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,160 I think it was probably about 200 meters offshore, like a 596 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:40,320 decent way. And you could don't see the fear 597 00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:42,400 in her eyes. But then she she was like, yeah, 598 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:44,000 we can do this. And I said, even if we get 599 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:47,880 halfway, we can turn around. But yeah, she made it all the 600 00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:51,560 way around that boy and back in and it was it was so awesome. 601 00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:55,720 And I think that's, you know, that was the best part of my 602 00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:58,440 entire week. But also random skills when you 603 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:02,000 go into the open water because I forget how much I learned from 604 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:04,480 surf life saving. So I grew up at Wynoi Beach. 605 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:08,480 Dion, the legend, He was my coach, but he taught me to 606 00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:10,640 respect the ocean, but how to work with it. 607 00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:12,280 So why not? We get a lot of big surf. 608 00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:15,920 So we were taught from nippers from five years old to go under 609 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:19,840 to hold on to the sand until we felt the wave go past and then 610 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,040 come up. Take a breath, watch where the 611 00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,560 next wave is under hold on, push off the ground. 612 00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:28,960 And you know, Mon didn't even know about that and take a porn 613 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:31,160 ahead waves for the first time in like ever. 614 00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:35,240 So it was quite fun to teach her like the waves, even if you're 9 615 00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:39,400 foot tall or maybe 6 foot tall, you go under as long as you can 616 00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:41,960 hold on to the sand, you're going to be absolutely fine. 617 00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:43,480 It's not going to RIP you off the bottom. 618 00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:48,680 And so it was quite fun teaching her some surf skills as well as 619 00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,360 the confidence to swim out to that boy. 620 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:53,160 That's a. Really interesting tip. 621 00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:55,160 I didn't know that one about holding on to the sand. 622 00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:58,240 Yeah. Yeah, yeah, definitely. 623 00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:00,400 Because it's, you get used to the rhythm of it as well, 624 00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:03,440 because you want to go under with time, but you'll feel the 625 00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:06,960 pole, you'll feel the wave go past and then you go up after 626 00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:08,240 that. If you go and come up too early, 627 00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:11,760 it drags you back as well. But yeah, hands in the sand, 628 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:14,960 hands on the sand. Easy to remember. 629 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:19,120 And earlier we were talking a bit about strength training and 630 00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:23,880 a few weeks ago I sprained my back not too badly, but I was 631 00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:26,680 learning how to do flip turns for the first time in my life 632 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,320 and the pole and probably not doing them particularly well. 633 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:33,680 And so I've been seeing a physio and he said that, you know, my 634 00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:36,320 back muscles are very stiff, which is very common for 635 00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:38,960 swimmers. And so I've been doing the old 636 00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:42,000 foam roller and all that sort of stuff and strengthening 637 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:45,880 exercises. So for your for your own 638 00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:50,280 strength building, are there particular exercises that you 639 00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:54,520 think swimmers tend to neglect that they should focus on? 640 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:56,280 That's a very broad question, but. 641 00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:00,920 I think as long as you do, the key movements are your push, 642 00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:05,920 pull, hinge and squat lunge. So hinge particularly is quite 643 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:09,040 good for the posterior chain. So dead lifting, but dead 644 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:12,800 lifting comes with a lot of risk if you don't have the form down. 645 00:34:13,239 --> 00:34:17,280 And so you can kind of modify that in different ways to reduce 646 00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:20,920 the risk. But in terms of back immobility, 647 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:24,840 I think a lot of thoracic range of motion is really important. 648 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:30,040 So I actually sometimes do more dry land than swimming for my 649 00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:31,480 sessions. So I think that's something 650 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:33,639 that's very, very different about my process. 651 00:34:33,639 --> 00:34:38,520 Now in that competitive world we did do pre poll but it was we do 652 00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:41,239 some mid ball work which was awesome and some poor work. 653 00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:43,760 Actually there was 1 squad that was very good. 654 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:46,679 The others it was kind of lift up to yourself and unless you 655 00:34:46,679 --> 00:34:50,360 were very motivated, you kind of just do a hamstring stretch and 656 00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:53,600 get in. Now I'm very structured with my 657 00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:58,480 pre pool workout so I do anywhere from 10 minutes to 40 658 00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:01,680 minutes before I get in the water and I structure that with 659 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:06,360 some active dynamic stretching and move more into strength and 660 00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:09,560 stability based exercises and then finish with hits. 661 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:13,280 So like explosive push ups and jumps and then when I get in the 662 00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:16,280 water, I feel so much better. But I think with swimmers, a lot 663 00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:20,040 of that thoracic rotation work is really, really beneficial. 664 00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:21,800 Doing things like thread the needle. 665 00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:26,800 Even cat cows get extension and flexion through the spine. 666 00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:31,200 But a lot of it as well is because we breathe shallow a lot 667 00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:33,560 of the time and swimming often it's actually breathing 668 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:36,360 mechanics. And globally there's actually a 669 00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:39,960 huge amount of people that have got breathing pattern disorders. 670 00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,840 So we tend to over breathe. So we breathe more frequently 671 00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:45,800 than we should and we tend to breathe up high into the chest 672 00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:49,840 rather than diaphragmatically. When you swim, it's that's one 673 00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:51,720 thing I've changed my perception of. 674 00:35:52,720 --> 00:35:55,360 Obviously if you can breathe diaphragmatically quickly, 675 00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,880 that's awesome, but it's a short sip of air when you swim 676 00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:01,600 freestyle so often. I actually I'm an advocate for 677 00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:04,040 shallow breathing because it means that you minimize your 678 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:07,640 time to neutral how often like how much time it takes you to 679 00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:10,040 breathe. But as long as you revert to 680 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:13,160 belly breathing, diaphragmatic and day-to-day living, that's 681 00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,640 quite important. And swimmers tend to or will I 682 00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:18,120 do preferentially breathe through the mouth because I'm so 683 00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:21,560 used to training and I had a history of asthma that breathing 684 00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:23,840 through my nose is not necessarily natural. 685 00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:28,880 And so learning to breathe properly, surprisingly is, is 686 00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:31,320 very beneficial. And I'll try to keep the story 687 00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:35,240 short, but I had some neck problems a few years ago when I 688 00:36:35,240 --> 00:36:38,200 still swimming competitively. And the physio that I saw 689 00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:40,640 addressed it through teaching me to breathe better. 690 00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:44,040 And my like track pain went away because it turns out that I was 691 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:47,080 stressed, I had a lot going on. I was breathing really shallow 692 00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:51,560 and everything kind of bound up. So it's kind of crazy to think 693 00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:55,960 that I had attributed it to my picnic when in fact I just had 694 00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:59,360 poor breathing mechanics. They're saying breath work is so 695 00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:00,760 important for swimmers, isn't it? 696 00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:03,840 Because if you haven't got the breath right, then nothing else 697 00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:05,760 will work either. Absolutely. 698 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:09,960 You mentioned earlier that you're you're very competitive, 699 00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:12,320 which isn't surprising because you're a competitive swimmer. 700 00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:15,040 But I was curious to know with the ice swimming, for example, 701 00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:19,920 like you've you, you gave it a go and you did phenomenally well 702 00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:21,920 in that. So is that something now where 703 00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:25,440 you would feel like, OK, I've I've done that, now move on to 704 00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:29,040 the next challenge? Or will you continue to return 705 00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:35,240 to ice swimming each year? That's such a hard one because I 706 00:37:35,240 --> 00:37:37,000 actually really don't like the cold. 707 00:37:37,240 --> 00:37:41,600 So the competitive that was part of the challenge, the 708 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:45,160 competitive side of me for the ice swimming was intra 709 00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:47,400 competitive. So I'm very competitive with 710 00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:49,800 myself. I'm actually not very inter 711 00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:52,000 competitive. So if you get up on the blocks, 712 00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:53,920 you're like, all right, I'm going to crush that person next 713 00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:55,280 to me. They've got nothing on me. 714 00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,760 It's not actually that great. Like when I focus on trying to 715 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,160 beat myself, like that's when I sell. 716 00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:06,040 So the the competitive side of the ice swimming was can I swim 717 00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:07,760 OK? It wasn't necessarily can I try 718 00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:09,800 and beat the person next to me or whatever. 719 00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:17,080 So in terms of like when I return, I think that my event 720 00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:22,200 selection is based off what brings me the most joy at this 721 00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:24,000 stage because I've been so lucky. 722 00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:28,680 I had, you know, 20 years of competitive athleticism. 723 00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:32,000 I was a full time athlete for like, you know, six or seven 724 00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:34,000 years. And that's a pretty unique 725 00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:36,960 experience to get to do that. And I'm so appreciative of that. 726 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:41,280 And so I know what it takes to be really focused. 727 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:46,560 So I'm very aware of getting too serious again because I've got a 728 00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:49,160 whole, I've got a lot more going on right now. 729 00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:52,320 Like I'm, I'm getting married in April, we've got our first 730 00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:53,680 house. That there's a lot of things 731 00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:56,400 that I don't want to miss out on anymore that I would have been 732 00:38:56,400 --> 00:38:59,280 more than happy to miss out on in my first swimming career, 733 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,160 which I also think is important. So if you want to be an Olympic 734 00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:04,240 champion, I think there's no way around it. 735 00:39:04,240 --> 00:39:08,080 You have to give up a lot and I think that's normal, but I'm a 736 00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:10,240 bit older now. So in terms of event selection, 737 00:39:10,240 --> 00:39:13,240 it's what do I feel like doing? I'm doing a high rocks in a 10K 738 00:39:13,240 --> 00:39:16,840 run early next year and I've, I think I actually might go back 739 00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:18,800 to competitive swimming. Like literally I did an 740 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:20,360 interview two weeks ago and said no. 741 00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:24,560 So who knows? Who knows that's. 742 00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:26,960 Cool. And with the, with, with the ice 743 00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:30,120 swimming, you mentioned, you know, you, you had an ice bath 744 00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:33,760 and you were acclimatizing, you know, getting your body used to 745 00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:36,520 those colder temperatures. And I was just thinking about 746 00:39:36,520 --> 00:39:40,520 that because I was in Auckland, like I'm not an ice swimmer, but 747 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:43,560 I was in Auckland last week and I had a swim at Takapuna Beach. 748 00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:45,040 Actually. It's really beautiful. 749 00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:48,880 But I'm thinking, oh, this, this water isn't as cold as I'm used 750 00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:51,240 to because I, I swam in Wellington, the water just the 751 00:39:51,240 --> 00:39:56,160 temperatures a bit lower here. And, and so when you did you 752 00:39:56,160 --> 00:39:58,800 find that when you were training for your ice swim that you 753 00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:01,760 became less tolerant of the warmer water? 754 00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:05,400 Like, how did that, How did your body sort of change as you 755 00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:10,640 adapted it? Yeah, I don't I didn't notice a 756 00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:14,480 change in the warmer water. Like Full disclosure, I think I 757 00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:16,600 did 2 ocean swims in my build up. 758 00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:21,720 Like I I trained in the swimming pool in 27° and in the ice bath 759 00:40:21,720 --> 00:40:25,080 to get used to the cold because I figured if I train 760 00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:28,400 specifically for 100 metre freestyle, but my body 761 00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:30,520 understands what it feels like to be in that. 762 00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:34,880 I had no option to swim in anything close to sub five in 763 00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:37,640 the North Island or maybe in Tampa or somewhere. 764 00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:41,600 But also like it feels quite weird to go to a lake and do 765 00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:44,400 like a Sprint. So a lot of those ice swimmers 766 00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:48,200 that do the longer of it longer events, it's specific to be able 767 00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:52,320 to go and swim 1315 minutes. For me, my event that I was 768 00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:54,920 focusing on was hopefully going to be a minute. 769 00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:57,520 Like I would have loved to have been the first ice swimmer in 770 00:40:57,520 --> 00:40:59,440 the sub minute for the woman in the freestyle. 771 00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:02,200 I think it went like a one-on-one, so maybe I don't 772 00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:05,720 need to do another one. So how many have you done so 773 00:41:05,720 --> 00:41:07,920 far? Is it 2 or just one? 774 00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:10,520 Swimming championships? I've only. 775 00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:12,080 Done 1 ice swimming championships. 776 00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:14,120 Yeah, yeah. And that was was that the one 777 00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:15,560 that was in the pole? Because I remember seeing 778 00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:17,680 pictures, yeah. It was alternate. 779 00:41:17,680 --> 00:41:20,360 Don't they? Between pole and Yeah, yeah. 780 00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:23,960 Much more. Much more attracted to the pool. 781 00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:27,360 Fair enough. It's your happy place. 782 00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:32,560 Cool. Well, I think that that's some 783 00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:34,720 of my questions. I've really enjoyed talking to 784 00:41:34,720 --> 00:41:35,760 you. I've learned a lot. 785 00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:38,920 Is there anything you want to mention that I haven't already 786 00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:45,440 asked you about? Off the top of my head, not 787 00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:47,240 really. I can't, I can't think of 788 00:41:47,240 --> 00:41:49,240 anything. I just say, yeah. 789 00:41:49,240 --> 00:41:53,480 I think to almost recall what you said earlier, swimming is 790 00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:57,280 one of those activities you can do essentially until you die. 791 00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:00,160 Like I will be swimming as late as possible. 792 00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:02,600 So I think it doesn't matter. Maybe if you're even a bit 793 00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:06,480 older, trying to learn it is something that can bring so much 794 00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:10,720 joy and also a bit of fun. So like trying to do something 795 00:42:10,720 --> 00:42:13,280 different in Ocean Storm, a Masters swimming event, an 796 00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:16,480 awesome event, you get to make some pretty amazing people and 797 00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:19,840 go to some amazing places around the world if you choose to do 798 00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:21,960 those different ocean swims or Masters events. 799 00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:26,680 So I'm just really grateful that swimming is something that I've 800 00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,360 got in my life and we'll have for the rest of my life. 801 00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:33,360 Did you, when you had your eight years of non competitive 802 00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:35,920 swimming, did you miss it at that time or did you feel like 803 00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:38,680 you'd put it behind you and you're focused on other things? 804 00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,440 Yeah, I I didn't miss the competitive side at all. 805 00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:46,120 I still swam a lot with the triathlon squad, but it was 806 00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:49,480 definitely the right call. Yeah, yeah. 807 00:42:49,720 --> 00:42:52,000 Yeah, cool. All right, Well, thank you so 808 00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:55,640 much for your time, Laura and all the best with your training 809 00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:57,560 and your your upcoming wedding too. 810 00:42:57,600 --> 00:42:59,200 Congratulations. Thank. 811 00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:03,000 You it was so nice to chat. Thanks for listening to this 812 00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:05,960 episode of Swim Chats. Please remember to follow or 813 00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:09,600 subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss an episode and if you 814 00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:12,600 enjoyed it, you can leave a five star rating and review which 815 00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:16,240 helps other people find it too. Enjoy the water and we'll see 816 00:43:16,240 --> 00:43:16,840 you next time.