It's like one of my secret bugaboos.
You'll notice I'm I'm usually wearing a button down shirt and
most of the time wearing a jacket.
When I do an appearance, every minute I'm on there, I'm selling
my my lawyer ring. So I should look a little bit
but like people think a lawyer should look like.
That was one thing that struck me about the Black Muslims, the
Nation of Islam is they teach their guys.
Why not look like $1,000,000? Do you think a solution to some
of this ridiculousness is dressing like a grown?
Up. Yeah, I do.
I think a lot of the things that we see people do they they
wouldn't dream of doing either because they would feel silly
because they would recognize that they're they're acting out
of out of out of place. But also good self regard that
comes the healthy self regard that comes from looking like a
Mensch. And dressing like a Mensch is
contagious to your entire self. Do act differently when I'm
wearing a suit I feel like. Think about it now, all
interviewers have their own style, and my style is to try to
get to the point and to be intensely curious.
And the key to interviewing is listening.
Take a look behind the curtain with a real whistleblower and
American patriot. Prepare to embrace the
uncomfortable truth, because this program has no time for
comforting lies. Here is civil liberties
enthusiast, Second Amendment defender, and recovering FBI
agent Kyle Seraf. Well, hello my friends, welcome
to our Sunday Sit down and episode 600.
That seems like a lot. My daughter just asked me that
this morning. How many of these shows have you
done? I said I don't know, but like
over 500. We're at 600 today.
So thanks for joining us for the 600 episode.
The Pal Seraphin show is we've settled into this format of
doing Sunday sit downs and that's what this is.
It's going to be a profile on kind of the state of affairs.
It's a it's actually a great fun little chat.
I went back and edited and was listening to it and I thought,
doggone it, I would sit and listen to this all again.
And I was there when we recorded it.
So it's a little bit of a couple days old at this point, but
we're going to be talking to Ron Coleman.
He's an attorney. He's argued in front of the
Supreme Court. He works with the Dylan law
firm. He's also a social media
personality and a podcaster and just an all around interesting
nice guy and he makes me laugh. He's very bright.
It's nice to talk to smart people.
I think my dad told me that one time.
It's really, it is nice to talk to smart people.
It's nice when people have a different sense of humor that
also kind of tickles your funny bone.
So I think you guys are going to enjoy this conversation.
It's not super heavy. We cover some pretty broad
ranging topics and I walked away thinking about things that I
wasn't thinking about previously, so I think you might
as well. Before we get started with the
program, we're going to say thanks to the folks that
sponsored this program. Today's sponsor, as we do just a
single commercial interruption, is for the folks over at My
Patriot Supply. They've got a 4th of July sale
going on. Being free means being ready, so
we'll just encourage you to check them out at
mypatriotsupply.com/kyle. Folks, you can look at the
headlines. They're always getting crazier.
Today's a little day where we can take a moment away for them.
But I'll just remind you, we've got a little bit of an unstable
situation in the Middle East. There's questions about sleeper
cells and terrorist attacks in the United States, the looming
threat of nuclear proliferation, whether it be serious or
otherwise. A buddy of mine told me that the
ATF is just days away from a nuclear weapon.
I'm joking of course. Nobody knows what's coming next
though. That's something we can all
agree on and that's not funny. If you want to be clear, when a
crisis hits that is not a good time to prepare.
That's time for you to repair. If you guys want to get ready in
advanced, you may want to check out the Independence Day
Preparedness Bundle. It's available right now from my
Patriot Supply. It is a massive option with a
one year emergency food supply for an adult that's throwing in
over $1200 in free survival gear.
You guys probably know this, but I'm a gear guy.
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and solar power back up and water filtration and everything
you need to write out whatever's coming your way, check out one
monster option I'll buy once cry runs.
Just bite the bullet and get it done at mypatriotsupply.com.
Slash Kyle again, mypatriotsupply.com/kyle.
It's more than a great deal. It might be the last best chance
to get your house in order. You actually never know what's
coming your way. Don't to do fear mongering, but
I do like to feel like I've got things under control and this is
one way you can do it. Again.
Check out this special offer. Not going to
lastlong@mypatriotsupply.com/kyle. Get yourself squared away right
now. Let's do this conversation with
Mr. Ron Coleman. Let's do this.
Ladies and gentlemen, my guest today is Ron Coleman.
He's one of my favorite people, even if he doesn't know it.
And he sort of insinuated himself on to today's program by
asking if he was going to be on today's program.
So here he is. Hello, Ron Coleman.
How you doing? I'm really well.
How are you doing? I'm all right.
Thank you. I didn't.
It wasn't necessarily a today's program thing.
But then I should realize you don't really have anyone else
coming on. So if I say I'd like to be on
the show again, Kyle, because right, you know, it's been a
while, they should have realized that for you that means, wow,
I've got someone for tomorrow. Really, man?
I don't want to blow your mind, but I've been doing these
interviews on Sundays and so you're like a couple weeks out
now from today. So that's even we're we're
stocking in, we're filling our cup.
Well, I got to say that I'm impressed with that kind of
having that kind of stock. As a podcaster myself.
You know, it's hard keeping interviews that long because
sometimes they become untimely. Unless you're talking about
like, Renaissance literature. I think that's probably what
we're going to end up talking about today.
Actually. I felt like what we would talk
about today is the status of the 1st Amendment in this country
because I think speech is always important and we're kind of at
an interesting time. So you actually opined on a on a
post that I made where I had an issue with the White House press
secretary calling out a reporter from her official Twitter
account. And when you and I do a lot on
Twitter. So that's what I thought might
be kind of an interesting discussion.
And I think it'll also maybe get bigger, like maybe we should
burn down cities if we're unhappy with what's being said
or what other fun things are out there.
And maybe we can find out if it's the Jews that are
responsible for all the bad things because I keep getting
told that I'm getting paid by the Jews.
Someone said I got to come to you to get the paycheck.
So I think we got like plenty to talk about.
It's always going to be timely. Especially look, there's always
time to talk about the Jews. Why?
Hold on, let's let's just go straight there for one second.
What about this time? Because I don't remember a time
in my life when it was so easy for people to jump up and
insinuate that it is the Jews and I.
I like to spell Jews with OS that get bigger and smaller
through for a lot of them. Yeah, I don't quite understand
like that the, the, the spelling of the Jews thing got altered me
very, very fast. I will be quite honest with you.
But in terms of the your, your essential question, it's social
media. It's social media and it was
never, you know, there has never been as little gatekeeping on
public expression as there is now.
And it although it is true that there are forces that from the
outside and some from the inside that are using anti-Semitism as
a weapon to divide us. Clearly, it's also the case that
there are have always been numbers of lunatics who have
historically or, or, or, you know, male contents miscreants
who have historically not been able to get their voice out
there because nobody with any valuable sort of outlet would
let them do so. Now, every man is his own
publisher. And there are many, many
terrific things about that because gatekeeping really is
hard to justify in an age when there's no capital investment
required to broadcast something. But what we get is a picture of
what is probably to a significant extent, been flowing
beneath our very feet for much longer than we want to realize.
You think there's always been an amount of bigotry and there just
hasn't been a means to distribute it as much?
Of course, of course, I don't think that anyone doubts that.
All kinds of bigotry, all kinds of resentment, all kinds of
jealousy, all kinds of generalized observations about
groups of people that may very well have validity that even
historical. I mean, you really still in the
mainstream press and in the Academy are not allowed to
publish or teach or even really talk about intellectual
intelligence differences among different the populations of
people. And you can't really
scientifically say race. There really aren't races.
There's no genetic difference. There are differences in
features and in geology, geology, geology, geography.
But nonetheless, we know there are generally speaking, there's
such a thing as white people, black people, Asian people,
many, many, many, many, many, many, many different kinds of
Asian people. I mean other.
I think they're all different flavors of Chinese.
Are you saying otherwise? I think.
I think I am. OK, I like I like asking Asian
people what flavor of Chinese they are, because really good
spirited people will always laugh at that.
And people that are that are maybe a little bit punchy about
it tend to be very upset about it.
But I like to be a reverent as as I think you do sometimes it's
just fun to say. We also like to be dark and
irreverent. Yes.
Including in your studio. Yes, can.
We can we get a little bit more light on you or is this part of
your deep cover now? I want to put the light on the
subject of who I'm talking to so it's less about.
Me, I don't know who is that what it?
Is is that stylistic? Also, I've just moved my
lighting, so it's possible that I need to turn that one up.
It's now further away. It used to be a glowing orb in
my in my eyeballs, so this is a little bit easier.
You know, actually I'm supposed to.
I just always forget I'm supposed to buffer down my shine
here. Oh.
I thought it looked nice. Well, it just, it throws off the
meter a little bit, you know? I mean, Harmeet taught me that.
I have to. Here we go.
Oh, quite good, yeah. See just just a little bit
there. This is a harmeet trick.
Well, you know, I don't think she has the problem in quite the
same language, but you know, she is arguably Speaking of our
favorite topic, crime and punishment, right, and the FBI
and the the Department of Justice.
She is arguably the one person you can say who was coming to
DOJ who is making differences on the ground immediately.
I agree. And to a large extent, her
success backs up your hypothesis that the people we have been
looking to for big changes at FBI don't seem to be prepared to
implement them. Time is of the essence, one
would think. You would think.
Although when it comes to one thing I will say, when people
talk about arrests and indictments, I expect that to
take long. That takes a long time.
Sure, that takes a long time. The fact that the Democrats
wasted no time arresting people for J6 yeah, they didn't.
But that was that was just what what the mafia does.
I mean, it was that was basically just an organized
crime action under the color of law.
So I I bet like that doesn't impress me at all.
In fact, it depresses me. But on the other hand.
Did you say it depresses you? Well, I mean, that was nice.
Does Ron Coleman ever really look deeper?
You know what though? Just Speaking of depressed, did
you see that video, an AI video that someone did a few days
maybe it was a week ago, yeah. About showing Trump and Musk
after their breakup. Oh, it is, it is so.
It is so good and the and the brilliance of it is like, it
shows them like going through their separate lives, but their
hearts are like. Something is missing.
They keep thinking of each other OK.
And it was the most compelling depiction of broken hearted
males. I think they're going to get
back together. Well, apparently they're playing
nice on X now. You know, I just saw, you know,
a heart from Musk. I mean, one or both of them was
off their meds or, or on on his meds.
You know, that was a crazy incident, but you know, I I
despair. I got us a little bit further
off topic because we did we had actually had an important thing
to talk about, which is so we were talking about.
I had made a comment yes. Your original point was the
government just leave it is that her name?
Yes. Caroline demanded to know is NBC
was was it ABC or NBC? It was a BC.
ABC What are you going to do about this guy?
Right. He said.
And it was all kinds of shit talk that he was doing.
Yeah, he was. And it was ugly.
It was nasty. It was nasty, but it wasn't.
It wasn't profane. Threatening.
It wasn't professional, but it wasn't profane and it wasn't
professional. I agree with that.
It was just sort of like what people who are having a bad day
might say. If yeah.
And it's what? And it's what we know 90% of
them are thinking almost all the time.
Yeah, I agree. And so there are two, there are
definitely two sides to this. On the one hand, she's
absolutely entitled to to squeeze ABC.
For what it's worth, this is what they call an economics,
right? Moral suasion when the Fed gets
the banks together and say, listen, I don't, I don't want to
change the discount rate, but I I need you guys to work with me.
I need you. So but, but but the way it came
across, I think you and I both agree, was as if some sort of
law had been broken or some sort of more than a social decency
protocol, but that ABC was in danger of losing some kind of
right or privilege. Now, the Supreme Court just held
that the White House can in fact, not the Supreme Court.
I'm sorry, was the, the DC Circuit of all places?
OK, said no, the the the White House can kick people out of the
press room for no reason or any reason, including stupid reasons
like the Gulf of America that that's actually no, no
organization or person has a First Amendment right to a
privileged seats in the in the press room.
OK. So that's what that that, what
was that decision that just came out?
I think it, I think it was, I mean, I saw it on and I heard
about it through Robert Govia. OK.
But is that something? And then is the news
organization, are they appealing that all the way if they?
Can well, they've now. So what happened was the
decision, it was an emergency appeal to the to the Federal
Circuit, not the Federal Circuit, the DC Circuit, which
reversed the District Court. If it's going to go to the
Supreme Court, they are not going to consider it, in my
humble opinion on will they? Will they be able to take it to
like an in bank or or a panel review at all?
They they could, they could. So you're saying it might, this
might not be the, the, the last word on this matter.
I I think it's a very sound decision though.
OK, but that has nothing to do with the DC Circuit?
No, that doesn't have anything to do with anything, it turns
out in our courts at this point. But, but I think what it, but
what we're saying is that there at least has been a decision.
And the decision was, is that you have no right to access,
which is kind of what what the White House spokesperson was
saying or the press secretary rather.
She kind of alluded to you were in danger of losing access.
And you're saying that the courts have said, yeah, you
don't have a right to access? Yeah.
And you know, there's something to there's something to be said
for, for saying if you, you know, we understand that we are
political adversaries. We we get that.
No surprise here. But if you're going to be over
the top nasty, just like I wouldn't expect to be granting
access to the Sturmer or the Daily Worker, or in other words,
people who are just whose, whose outlets or who themselves are
just simply too obnoxious to be tolerated.
We're not going to do it and we're going to kick, you know,
we're going to kick you out. And I mean, I don't understand
how anyone could ever have really seriously argued that any
organization or person has a right to a privileged location
in the, in, in, in the, in the press office.
So. So I apparently that tweet was
deleted. Yes, and, you know, it went more
or less as it should. And listen, I also don't have a
real problem with the Trump administration or its personnel.
Well, the administration flexing its muscles where it can,
especially given how assiduously other branches of government,
especially the judiciary, has acted to clip its wings in so
many respects. So, you know, politically
speaking, in terms of bare fist, bare fisted, political brawling,
It's it's, it's fine. I don't really, but, but I do
think you and I have the same impression when we read it,
which was that it just came across a little bit
heavy-handed. Yeah.
I guess the question is, is it good for America whether or not
you're allowed to do it, that you do things like that?
In other words, you know, is it something that you should do
even if you can do it? You know, I, I think you, I
think the answer is it's the kind of thing you should do.
I think she, I think her e-mail was, it was a very long e-mail.
Not her e-mail, her, her post. I liked it.
I like to think that she was emailing us directly.
I liked. It, it was like, it was very
much like an e-mail. But first of all, I don't, I
don't like very long emails either.
I think that she could have made the point a lot faster.
You know, this is a little bit kind of the problem that
President Trump himself often has in his posts.
Just when you think that he. OK, you know, you read the first
couple sentences and yeah, you know, I think you might be on to
something there, President Trump.
But then he. Right, so you talk yourself out
of it. Then he talks you out of it
because he starts with the capital letters and the you
know, and. Brevity really is the soul of
wit, Kyle. It is, and you know what I think
that goes to the earliest point you made is that the low bar of
entry of of any man being his own publisher.
You know what you don't have when you're self-publishing?
Usually is a good editor. That is very true.
And because I'm hearing this all the time from my my brilliant
and and lovely wife, Jane Coleman, who writes for Legal
Insurrection and who edits herself the occasional late
night involuntary assistance of of her lawyer, writer and
podcaster husband, but who who so assiduously edits herself or
she's like just this crazy, like I'm a shoot from the hip guy.
But you're also very brief when you shoot from the hip.
Well, I do tend to to to. Yeah, I do think I did boil
things down as a general rule, and so does Jane.
But but her getting there is, is such a such a grind and is but,
but she's always telling me when she reads other people's stuff,
no one's editing anything anymore.
And that also includes books that come in hardcover from
publishing houses because because traditional media are
competing with are competing with the free media, the
margins, you know, in order for them to compete financially or
economically. The the features are are I'm
sorry there's less and less attention being paid to editing
and you don't see things like indexes in in books anymore
either. No, I think you feel they're
trying to tighten that tooth to tail ratio.
That's what the military would call it so.
To tail ratio you. Like that that yeah, the the
tail being everything behind, but the tooth being what
actually bites you, which is the the the print itself and and and
editing always seems to suffer. Let me let me give you the I
think his name was Terry Morons. That sound right?
And and Carolyn Lovett. Let me give you a alternative
world scenario where I think you might agree with me.
Imagine Terry of ABC News writes his unhinged tweet and it's it's
not pleasant, not professional, but not profane.
As we said, it's certainly not the worst or nastiest thing that
we've read this week because we spent time on social media.
In other words, it's it's it's it's high normal.
It's anything that Rachel Maddow would have normally read on her
evening newscast thing that she does.
Got it. OK, so it's ugly.
And the White House press, you know, physically and also to the
ear. And so I said it.
I'll loan that. And so the White House press
secretary says, we really hope that ABC considers professional
standards for their journalists in future.
Boop. And everybody knows what she
meant. And then Peter Doocy probably
shows up at the next press secretary briefing because he's
known to be helpful in that way. And then he says, press
secretary, we we've noticed that Terry Moran had the tweet and
then he he deleted it. And he had these sort of nasty
things to say about Stephen Miller.
What is the White House's position about people from ABC
having nasty tweets about Stephen Miller?
And she just says, we hope that journalists in America are
striving for truth and giving the American people information.
We've seen, obviously, that that hasn't happened in the last
couple years. We hope that they continue to do
better. And we, you know, we stand by
his decision to delete that tweet because it's probably the
right move. We hope that moves the discourse
forward. That's the White House
statement. Doesn't have to be any more than
that. He's been slapped, as we would
say in the military, slapped on the pee pee as necessary.
And everybody knows that They're the adults in the room.
And America is no worse off. Is that good or not good?
I'm going to say that you're watering it down a little bit
too much. Too much?
Does it need to be more aggressive?
Because what you've, what you've just given me in terms of the
exchange is a rather muddled, vague, bureaucratic kind of
speak that doesn't tell us, especially those of us who are
not in the loop Here's like, here's.
The thing there needs to be exposition to the problem, I
think. There has to be some exposition
because right, you got to help these people who are actually
following these people and reading their stuff and know
what's going on. But most but us, we normal
people have no idea so. You're not in the normal people,
you're in the highly informed people.
I'm the highly informed people on certain things, but on track
on what journalists say about President Trump.
I'm like, isn't that usually on blue sky anyway?
Aren't they mostly right? I suppose so.
Is there a lot of anti-Semitism on Blue Sky?
Is there? I don't know.
Do you hear that? I don't know I mean they just I,
I I applied they said it's not anti-Semitism wrong.
But we do judge a man by the size of his nose and how much
you and how much he talks with his hands.
So you're not aware of any. No, I mean, seriously, I, I, I
don't, I understand. It's a highly, highly filtered
environment and anyone they regard as a Nazi, including a
semi such as myself, doesn't, is not allowed to participate in
the discussion. From what I understand, the, the
oxygen is being so rapidly drained out of that room that
they're all going to be pretty much, you know, sniffing their
way along the, the linoleum pretty soon in a desperate
attempt to, you know, retain consciousness.
So I, I, I don't really know what's going on in Blue Sky, you
know, among the things that I always wish I had time to do,
like why go join anyone on blue sky just to get it kicked off
immediately? Even if I, you know, that's not,
that's a waste of time. I will tell you one secret
desire that I had. I, I don't have the time and I'm
not even sure I have the inclination, but there's a part
of me that does to do a parody account.
There's so many potential parody accounts and I think we've lost,
I think we've lost a number of them.
I don't think we have the the parody accounts that we used to.
They all end up getting big enough that people follow them
and then they start taking themselves seriously.
Which yes, that's true. They they they step out of
character and plus they're eventually doxxed.
Inevitably. And then they take on the right
their new identity. By the way, have you have you
seen any of the stuff about the Pope hat?
About what? An utterly crazed guy at
lunatic. Who is this?
Ken White doesn't ring any bells with you.
No, he was a very prominent when we still a prominent Blogger.
If anyone pays attention to blogs, most blogs are not
getting a lot of attention. But his blog was called Pope Hat
when I worked on him with him on many, many things.
And he was a conservative libertarian who Trump simply
absolutely snapped in half like a like a really Southern
California droughty twig. OK.
And he he's now he's so Trump deranged.
He left, he left blue sky after he he left Twitter after Elon
bought it. He's been on blue.
He has his like a whole cult. He's a brilliant writer.
He seems to be a very good lawyer.
He lost some some big ones, but I've lost some big ones.
But he really cut off all those friends, everyone who you know,
we considered to be insufficiently anti Trump or
much less pro Trump. But if you don't know the guy,
we're we're just. No, But that does say that
there's a lot of really bright people that seem to have really
lost their minds, like people that I would otherwise respect
in other venues. And then the minute that
something comes up, they Why is there such an emotional reaction
to Donald Trump? Well, and here's a related
question. I still have that question.
I don't know because I don't feel emotional about the guy at
all. I just don't.
Emotional. I myself have been devoid of
emotions for a very, very long time, so I can't.
But the DC Circuit has actually issued a number of moderately
reasonable stays and decisions in favor of the Trump
administration. And yet when it comes to
anything involving J6, they're absolutely out of their minds.
Yeah, so and, and and most of them are bright people.
So there's just, it's the nature of woke virus infection that
different patients are affected differently.
And sometimes they lose it all, but sometimes they they only
lose portions of their rationality.
And it seems that in the DC courts, they have everyone, you
know, took a blood oath that anyone involved in or suspected
of approving anything that happened on January 6th must
must be hounded and prosecuted and persecuted to the fullest
possible extent, but to a very large extent.
And there have been, unfortunately, far too many
exceptions to this. They've kind of gone back to
doing their jobs, it seems, and sometimes coming out with some
reasonable opinions. Unlike, say, the first Circuit,
I now say the first. What what area is covered by the
1st Circuit? First Circuit's New England, OK,
and it is. It's pretty much that there's a
judge in Boston who has just become the go to judge for
injunctions against anything Trump does.
And the First Circuit has upheld almost every one of them.
And I will tell you that as a I'm a member of all the circuit
courts in the country, whenever I get involved in a case
involving the First Circuit, I'm pretty confident it's a waste of
time. In other words, people, why
would you come to a guy in New Jersey first Circuit case for
first Circuit case? Because Mark, because Mark
Randazza doesn't have time for you or you can't afford him or
something. The point is usually it's an
issue. It's a, it's a political case or
free speech case. And they're just so
ideologically shaked and baked there.
I mean, The thing is the 9th Circuit, which was historical,
you know, California, Washington, Oregon, famous for
being the most frequently reversed circuit, has been
reversed a lot less than in previous years, partly because
there are, you can pull some very decent panels in the 9th
Circuit. Trump did put quite a few people
onto the 9th Circuit in his first, in his first go round.
So there are some panels that are that are decent.
There's some that are still absolute crud and when they go
on bonk, you can't expect much from them.
But the first circuit is consistently bad.
I think probably there were not, not a lot of Republican
appointees there at all. So myself with this.
No, you're fair that that leads me to something my wife grew up
in in your neck of the woods. She grew up in Brooklyn and was
born in Manhattan. And she said something to me
that has stuck with me. She said it to me about a week
and a half ago, and I keep hearing it in my head.
She said there's no such thing as a happy communist.
What do you think about that? Not a truly happy communist.
I mean in other words, you a communist can be happy because
right now he has his boot on the neck of an Estonian that he is
absorbed into his empire, right? But as soon as he shoots all the
local Estonians and Estonian party leaders and sets up his
own people, he immediately starts assuming that the ones
that he has put into place are plotting against him.
But, but I mean in a more broad sense, which is I think what
your wife was getting at. Yeah, I think she was talking
about Bostonians and New Yorkers and the people that we see in
New England, Connecticut, they just seem miserable.
They are, they really are. They can't be happy.
They there. There's always a problem.
There's always an I'll never forget there was a Woody Allen
movie gazillion years ago. My God, when I well over 40
years ago, it might have been Manhattan.
And we see in his living room that he has on one of the walls
a gigantic blown up mural of that famous picture from the
Vietnam War of the North Vietnamese guy shooting a a Viet
Cong prisoner. You know, just like right next,
point blank right next to him. You've seen that picture a
million times. Yeah, sure.
Time life picture type thing. Yeah, and at one point you might
have even been standing in front of in front of that picture, he
says. I can't even I can't go to sleep
at night as long as I know someone, something, something in
the world is is some kind of injustice is going.
It was something, something stupid like that.
And, and I was an adolescent when I saw this and, and I
wasn't particularly political, but I remember thinking, what is
that? I mean, but who the hell are
you? You what are.
You going to do about it? Right.
I mean, in your rent control apartment, you know, it's so
much and it's and what it really is, it's a form of incredible
moral vanity with with as you, as you point out, very, very
little skin in the game. They don't give up their club
memberships. They don't give up.
You know, there are a handful of social justice warriors who have
walked the walk as well as talking the talk.
I always think of Ralph Nader who took these ridiculously low
salaries even though he had created and was the head of
Consumers Union. I think it was, which is a
different kind of bullshit all together.
I mean, I don't think people who people who are heads of, of
nonprofits should be making multi $1,000,000 salaries unless
they can justify return on investment that way.
It might be possible. But this idea that you're going
to, you know, live on ramen noodles in order to prove your.
Yeah. The nobility of poverty kind of
ethos. It's it's, it's all
performative. It's performative.
And sometimes it can be performative just to yourself.
But listen, are we being any happier by sitting here and and
catching about? I think we might be.
I'm having a good time. Yeah.
I I knew a gal in college who who I think she had a tattooed
on a on a, a forearm or something and said the vanity
and virtue. And I've always thought that to
be very clever. The vanity in virtue.
Yeah, people who take The Who, who are vain in their virtues
and, and, and they, they sort of carry them around and parade
them. And you know, there's some,
there's some Christian scripture about this, just talking about
the people who go out there and let everybody know that they are
now suffering and that they are, they're fasting or they are
giving alms and they do so and their reward is given in public.
And that is the, the public acknowledges what a great person
you are for doing that thing. But there's but there's no real
value to God, is what the claim is.
Well, so that's actually a controversial issue in Christian
theology. I'm I'm actually 2/3 of the way
through a book by my professor at college, Peter Brown, the
the, the esteemed historian of, of medieval and and and
antiquity, Eros of antiquity and, and the medieval periods in
Europe, where he it's called through the eye of a needle.
And he examines the question of how the church in its in its
early era metamorphosed its views and how there were
different parties within the church.
Augustine being one but not the not the only voice different
ideas within Christianity of how do we deal with wealth and some
of what the church taught about wealth echoed its Jewish
origins. And some of it said, no,
actually one of the things that Jesus rebelled against, you
know, the hypocrites and the synagogues, the people who
wanted you to know what they were giving.
And, and by the way, there's conflict in the rabbinical
literature as well, which Jesus would have probably been
familiar with as a rabbinical student.
On the one hand, we say that the highest form of charity is
charity that's given secretly as opposed to publicly.
And on the other hand, one of the traditional ways of
lampooning Jewish affluence is the how if you go into a
synagogue or of a Jewish institution, everything has a
plaque on it that says who donated it?
That's right. And I remember when I was hit up
for money by a rabbinical leader, I, I challenged him with
this and he said both are true. Because when, when people see
that their friend Ron Coleman gave the money for this, they
say, oh, if Ron can do it, I can do it.
Or, oh, Ron Ron's endorsing it. That's a guy that I like.
He's making a commitment. So there, you know.
There's a social value to that in in the the social pressure
that it applies for everyone to do well and do better.
And then there's also an argument that it gives glory to
God to put your name on the list of people who are giving for his
side. But you know, all right, these
are these are complicated issues.
And who? Who are Ron and Kyle to judge
after all? Just two guys, but I'm more
curious what caused you to read this book about, you know,
Christian theology changing and the handling of wealth in the
early church? That sounds like an interesting
thing. What caused you to go and read
this? Anything Peter Brown writes is
interesting. He was just such a great
professor and I, I, I was just looking at I didn't hadn't
realized how long after I graduated, which was 40 years
ago, because I, I actually attended a little sliver of my
class reunion a couple weeks ago, how active he had remained
as as a scholar. So I just you know, because he
go in the process of answering this question, he goes through
history of the. Of the Western Roman, of the,
the Western Roman Empire and what's happening in Italy.
And just I happen to, to be an, an aficionado of culture, I
mean, of European history as I'm particularly interested in the
period that he teaches about. So, you know, that's just, I'm a
man of many parts, some of which are not suitable for public
display, but that's one of them. I'm an intellectual.
I can't sleep at night if I know there's an unanswered device.
That's exactly it, the hubris to think that your awareness of
injustice somehow changes the way the scales work.
I love it. It is a it is a thing.
Listen, my, my father-in-law is, is from your neck of the woods
as well and was born in Manhattan.
And I remember him saying something one time that was one
of the funniest thing. I'd never, I'd never
contemplated the thought. You know, someone's like
introduced. You're like, there's people out
there that think that way. I've just met one.
I cannot now not know that we were driving in a car.
He looked over and saw a black man walking on the streets of
Brooklyn. And that's the all the
information I have about this guy.
I don't remember what he was wearing, but it wasn't
remarkable. Wait.
Wait wait, before you go any further, do you know about what
decade this took place during? Oh yeah, yeah, sure.
This was in in the 2002 thousand 10:00-ish to 2012, 2015
something like that. Somewhere in that range.
Yeah. So somewhere in the 20 tens and
and we were on what is the Nets stadium on?
Are there their things on Is that Atlantic?
Yeah, am I? It might be.
It's very close to Flatbush Ave. OK.
I think it was on Flatbush, if my memory serves it, we were
like on Flatbush because which is not too far from where she
was. She was in that area, Boerum
Hill or Park Slope or whatever. So we're driving in a car and he
looks over and sees a black man. No further information about
this man, nothing remarkable. And we were having some sort of
discussion about opportunity in America because that's what
communists like to talk about and injustice.
And he looked over at a guy that we knew nothing about, nothing
whatsoever. And he said, look at that man,
there's no opportunity for him here in this country.
I thought, what? How do you know what, what would
cause you to think this thing, this, this strange thought?
I'd never once considered whether or not there was
opportunity for a stranger that I saw in America.
It never even occurred to me. And this was within sight of the
Nets. Yeah.
OK, where? Where?
Walking distance for sure. Yeah, sure.
Like a relatively reasonable New York walk to.
It a building in which you can find dozens of black men who are
multi gazillionaires. Yes.
I also assure you that there are black property owners and black
men who are doing developing in that area.
There's no question in my mind that there are construction
contracts that are being executed by by black-owned
companies, that there are law firms run by black attorneys
within that area. There's probably some record
labels, there's probably some shops and businesses of all
different varieties within walking distance of that man who
by the look of him had no opportunity in America in other.
Words. So the guy.
In other words, the guy. The guy was down and out.
No, he was just a guy. He was wearing normal people
clothes. He didn't look like a homeless
person. He was unremarkable.
He was a person. He was a pedestrian in New York.
So your father-in-law is like he's an old line lefty?
Is that what it is? Yeah, yeah, I think so.
I think that at one point in time, he told me that he didn't
think that people should be able to own private property and it
certainly shouldn't pass from one person to another, things
like that. Now you can imagine what he made
his real his, his living doing, right?
I mean, that's pretty obvious. He was a real estate agent.
An envious real estate agent. I, I just don't know, Like I,
like I said, my my wife is very well educated in certain things
that I have no experience with. And when she told me that
there's no such thing as a happy communist, it really it really
stuck with me. Well, she I have the impression
then that she saw quite a few of them in close and up close and
personal in her time. Kind of kind of the experience
maybe that you have obviously different generation, but she
grew up in that area and we talked about it previously.
And I'll recommend people go back and listen to the first
time we sat in chat where you kind of told me how you came up.
But yeah, she went from being a person who was very strong on
the left and very much in the culture of the the world that
you have to tread around in. And she's a pretty conservative
person now. And she wears a veil on her hair
when she goes to to Mass. And if we could find a Latin
Mass, we'd go to it. And she converted out of out of
nowhere. I didn't know that was a thing
because, I mean, I knew it was a thing conceptually.
People don't understand that Muslims and Jewish women who
cover their hair are not unique in this regard.
The in In the In the old world, any married woman would cover
her hair as a matter of modesty. Modesty, exactly.
Yeah, No, it's, it's actually getting more and more common, I
think in young Catholics as well.
And let me ask you guys, how do you dress when you go to Mass?
I dress appropriate for the area.
So I, we go, we live out in a, we're right on the edge of, of
farm country and, and some kind of like Texas, Central Texas
Hill Country type stuff. So people show up.
If you came in a suit and tie you would look weird.
I would look like I'm trying to do something that other people
do not. Yeah.
So I wear, I wear slacks or jeans, usually dark colored
jeans. I wear shoes that are clean.
I wear a button down shirt. I also carry a gun to church.
I just feel like that's my duty just as my capability.
So I'm, I kind of have an eye on that.
And, you know, I also have kids that drool on me because my
little ones are small. So we're doing that.
But yeah, I I don't dress in a dark suit, but if I was in a
place where that was not pretentious, I wouldn't think
twice about it. Do you remember when you were a
child how people dressed for church?
Yes, but I also spent time in Texas and California, which are
kind of. Always ahead of the curve on.
A lot of things, yeah, I think so too.
So my father often wore slacks, polo shirt, you know, maybe a
button down shirt, but not, not often a tie unless it was an
event. So we were outside of the maybe
the more traditional, more more conservative, modest thing.
And and some of that is spinning back in this country.
I think there's a backlash against modernism in a lot of
places. Well, you know, to a large, you
know, I'm a little bit of a it's like one of my secret bugaboos.
You'll notice I'm, I'm usually wearing a button down shirt and
frequently most of the time I'm wearing a jacket when I do an
appearance. And part of that is because I'm
trying to project it. If I, you know, if I'm going to
rationalize to Mrs. Coleman, why do I spend so much time on
people's podcasts? And I say, well, you know, I'm
every minute I'm on there, I'm selling my legal, my lawyer, my
lawyer ring. So I should look a little bit
about like people think a lawyer should look alike.
But you know, in our Orthodox Jewish community in hours, not
in all of them, yes, dressed down culture is not a thing or
it's only a thing among certain guys.
I mean, my, my sons are not like on a Sunday, my sons and I were
all wearing white shirts and dark suits or they're not ties
necessarily. Usually not.
And, and on the Sabbath and holidays when we go to
synagogue, we're wearing suits and ties and hats.
And I recognize but but that's a statement in and of itself.
You know, I remember that was one thing that struck me about
the the Black Muslims, the Nation of Islam is they they you
know, they teach their guys. Why not look like $1,000,000?
We're going to rebuild yourself respect.
And a good way to do that would be for us to to you look great.
And here's the thing, everyone looks better dressed nicely.
Every true. And the irony is it's never been
less expensive to dress nicely. You know, 100 years ago, even 50
years ago, garments, textiles were things that people made and
they were expensive. And you would you'd recycle
clothing and you'd do hand me downs.
Today's young people don't want hand me downs from their parents
that they would say like nothing is cheaper than a shmata.
Nothing is cheaper than a garment.
They're all made by Third World people.
It's it, it is garbage. It's really everything's good.
So you it's. Disposable too.
It's not like you're going to hem it, repair it, or patch it.
And. Make it but but you can't, you
could go to target and get a suit.
It might not last you five years, but you could look if you
had to, you could look like $1,000,000 at least for, you
know, for six months to a year in that suit And and then I so
it's not even a class statement. It's not like, oh, that's what
fancy people look like, but I can't afford that.
That's it. It's within our reach.
But but the call of laziness and slovenliness, the siren song,
it's just so it's just so prevalent that there doesn't
seem to be any, any way to, to to unless you're an incredibly
influential opinion and thought leader like Ron Coleman.
And everyone says, hey, he always looks.
How does Ron Coleman always look Great for an old guy?
It's, it's not an accident is what you're saying It's.
Not it's not an accident. But you know, I used to.
Like to shop. I don't get to shop anymore
because I I don't. You used to like to shop.
Hold on, let's just let's just explore that for a second.
You used to like to shop. Yeah, because I like clothes.
I do like to look. I like to choose my clothes.
I like to be in in style and I would love to have a reason to
buy myself, especially if I have a good month, right?
I got a few extra bucks sitting around.
I maybe would like to buy myself a a a nice suit.
Who's appreciating a nice suit anymore?
Yeah, maybe that's the other piece of it too.
People, people don't care as much.
I, I see the same thing in my old profession, that there was
a, a departure from people showing up in a suit and a tie.
That was the expectation when I was in Washington, DC.
If you were going to go do an interview, particularly in a
very professional sort of job like I used to have, when you
were doing counterintelligence investigations, you were dealing
with counterintelligence type people.
And these are government employees and and folks who have
money and influence. Well, that's interesting because
even now I noticed that Washington is one of the few
cities you can go to where you will still see people dressed as
adults on the street, walking the streets because in most
government jobs use. But evidently you still have to,
you know, put on your your, your work talks.
Yeah, you're grown up close. Listen, that was the the only
money I spent when I was at the FBI Academy was on some new
shirts from Brooke Brothers. I bought 5 new dress shirts.
It's the only money I spent when I was there for five months.
I paid off my wife's student loan debts, you know, we paid
them off and. Imagine.
And, and yeah, go figure that and, and I responsibly bought
myself some some dress shirts, which I still own today because
they were so well made that you can still wear them.
It turns out I have this buy once cry once mentality.
If you buy nicer things occasionally, as long as you buy
them for quality and not for your name, they actually do
last. You want to hear something
funny? That's kind of a it's bothering
me right now since we're talking about clothing and I didn't know
we were going to talk about this.
I have the tuxedo Ron that I wore to my junior prom in 1990.
8 And you, you son of a bitch, can probably fit into it.
I. Can fit into it, but the style
is not right and my wife has let me know.
In fact, I probably look better in it today if we're being
honest. Because.
Because 1998 Kyle was 125 lbs. Yeah, I was about to you must
have been a string bit and. Today Kyle is about 175 lbs.
So there's £50 more Kyle. And, you know, it's mostly in
places where you expect men to develop and like leg muscles and
arms and, and, you know, just chest and just being a bigger
person. That is wild.
I'm the same height though as I have been since I was in 8th
grade. So you hit it and you got there
fast and then. You I didn't get there fast
either. I was not tall then, even for
the age, and then I just continued to be not tall for the
rest of my life. Well, how tall are you?
5/8. Oh yeah, you're a little shrimp,
aren't you? That's it.
Says says no one to me, generally to my face, but online
that is a, that is a classic. It's like, listen, I've been
this. I've been this way for a long
time. I'm more of a Jesse Kelly fan.
He's tall. He's he's.
I mean, I've seen him standing next to some pictures of some
tiny little women and he looks like the Jolly Green Giant.
Yeah, he's freakishly tall. So is Sebastian Gorka.
He's big, you know. Well, Sean Parnell's big.
There's a couple of them. Yeah, I mean, a lot of these
people, you meet them in person and I just, I've so when I was a
kid, I would go to these, you know, family, family weddings
and whatnot, bar mitzvahs and my grandparents generation was
still alive and they were, they all grew up in Eastern Europe
and were all suffered from malnutrition as children.
So they were all 5152. So I would go, I'm a, you know,
I'm a 5 foot 1014 year old and I just the sea of bald heads, you
know, at sternum level. And then I got some to college
and there are all these corn fed gentiles there and all of a
sudden I'm the guy sneaking under people's armpits to look
at the grades that are posted. And I said, but you know,
perspective is is a heck. Of a thing it is.
It's important. It could be important.
All right, let's, let's, let's meander our way back towards
this First Amendment thing, which I think is relevant in so
much as our country. It sounds like we, I don't want
to put words in your mouth, but I feel like we need to have
healthy dissent, including allowing people to say some
really, really ugly things, which we started off talking
about. But there's obviously a line.
Some people don't know where that line is, just like they
don't know how to dress. They seem not to know where the
line is. And they are executing it all
over this country. Go ahead.
So let's let's examine what you just said we should have.
Who's we, we in, in the Americans, Americans in America,
in the free air, in the park, on the on the soapbox.
Now, how about on your social media platform?
You say same thing, Ron, to which I say, hold on a second.
If some guy is shouting expletives or hateful things or
insulting things on a soapbox in Hyde Park or military park
outside my building here, I don't have to hang around and
listen to him. I can go somewhere else.
But if I'm on Twitter and every time I make a a comment about
Israel, I get flooded with replies from people wishing I
had been killed in the Holocaust, people making fun of
the size of my nose, people asking me what was my original,
my last name originally, which I don't know what it was, in other
words, but really I'm not just. So then you say, well, Ron, but
you can block them, right? The answer is no, I really
can't. I can block what I can block,
but there's an infinite number of them.
So what you've done is, is you've, and this is what clearly
what I, I think all things considered, the free speech
changes that Elon Musk made on X are get an 8 out of 10 immensely
better because people are not being banned for being
conservatives or for even being hateful.
But what is clear is that it is you can absolutely destroy the
ability of people to have the kind of experience on the
platform that the platform wants its users to have.
Now where how to tune that is definitely the choice of the
owner of the platform. No one.
There's no serious not only there's no serious argument to
the contrary, there are people who take the position that this
is really a public forum in the year 2025 and we and issued
under under constitutional law be treated as a as a public
forum. I don't think that's ever going
to carry the day. It could, but maybe it will.
But but I do think that a person can say as I have to well, two
things. 1 is I think Twitter is allowing the experience of being
or X is allowing the experience of being an A prominent X user
like Ron Coleman. You know, I get my way to a
large extent on X. I don't get much of A monetary
payout because I'm just, I'm not doing it right.
I don't have big enough. I don't have big enough breasts.
I don't know what it is. I think it's principal if you
operate on principal, OK, if you're not going to chase
whatever the dragon is that allows.
You to I've never been If I were any good at that, I would be
retired by now. That's.
What I heard about you. All right.
So I don't really have any major complaints, but there's no
question that they have allowed a level of anti-Semitism infect
the experience on Twitter in a way that not only degrades my
experience, but is absolutely societally damaging.
It is hurting us because this goes back to our original
discussion, yeah. Flesh that out a little bit.
We're hearing more from more creeps, and it may not be more
creeps. It could be 10 people with
server farms or or with bot farms.
OK, but the effect is because our brains are treating these
messages, it's impossible for us, not at least viscerally, to
treat each reply as it's got a face attached to it.
Or a dog. Usually a dog, but usually.
A dog? Yeah, a lot of cartoons or dogs.
But it's got it seems to be a person and it seems to be
speaking for a person. And and what we learned actually
a few months ago was that there was a very large operation that
was paid for by was it act blue or was it the guys are shut
down. Media matters to swarm to swarm
social media and especially Twitter with bots to move the
Overton window on a lot of to give people a different
impression of what everybody says and everybody believes.
That's societally. So right.
Bot issue is related, but not the same.
But what we have seen on X is a normalization of hey, so that
people like Jake Shields and this guy Christensen, who's the
hot thing now? Like who's Jake Shields?
Just so people understand. He's a guy, I don't really know
who he is, I just he's a he's a prominent anti semite on X.
He's an MMA fighter, is he not? Isn't that?
He wasn't, I think he was a mediocre MMA fighter and and
also like, well, Dan Bilzeria, a guy who was famous for nothing.
I thought he was famous for being rich, wasn't he?
Famous for being the son of a rich person who used who, who,
who who who who is used by his father as a way to launder part
of his stolen money perfect and bilzerian lost almost all the
money. So what these failures in life
frequently do Stu Peters is they turn to anti-Semitism because
it's a way to get lots of followers.
Now we don't know where these again, we don't know where these
followers really are from. How many of them are Americans?
How many of them are Pakistanis and then we don't really know.
Nonetheless, again, as human beings operating in a simulated
community, we're we think there's all this hatred out
there, and we also think that what what that the line for what
has for what passes as normal discourse and accepted
statements has moved so that even my friend Jack Posobik do.
You know him in real life. I know him in real life.
We have each other cell numbers, we've met several times.
You've had lunch together. That's how much it homeown real.
Yeah, no, but. I never I think it's couch.
OK, but it's relevant, you know, people will.
I have had people say, you know, Kyle Serafin is my friend and I
go, oh, we've never really met. That's a weird thing to have.
Well, you know, you and I have never met, but I do feel like
we're friends. I would agree.
Yeah, I would. I would say that, but I wouldn't
say. To everybody that I talked,
multiple hour long conversations, right?
And we've also communicated many times personally in DMS making
fun of all the other dumb people who are not as great as us.
That's correct. No, but Jack is a friend and we
do talk. And yet yesterday he saw fit to
tweet. I'm going to still call it
tweeting to tweet. Today's the, I don't know, 86th,
not the 56th anniversary of the attack on the USS Liberty.
The fuck, Jack, What, what are you accomplishing with that?
What? Why is that necessary?
I'm I'm, I'm not happy with that and.
Not with. There's no context to it.
It's just. It's just the.
The you don't need the context. No, not on the Internet.
I agree with you. But it wasn't saying like
historically this is relevant because of this thing.
And I want people to be aware that this was a great, you know,
information OP, this was a thing that happened.
No, you just said. This out of context and there's,
you know, look, many people believe that Jack is an anti
Semite. I am not that concerned about
whether someone is an anti Semite because it's really none
of my business if someone treats me decently and doesn't do any
harm to other people. I don't really care what his
internal views are about me or groups or I really because if
you knew as many Jews as I do you'd be an anti Semite also.
No, it might be the line of the day.
Especially my family so and I did a whole thread on that.
I don't, I don't care. Just be a civil and I think
Jack's a Great American, but. I would agree with you because
listen for whatever happens online and for some reason you
and I spend way too much time there.
So it becomes a, it is. It's interesting.
I rarely talk about it with people outside of my wife and
maybe with you. So we have this sort of this,
this weird experience of it and why, why No, it's not real,
although it it does absolutely feel real when you feel like
quote UN quote attacked or people say nasty things about
you. As you said, our brain is not
able to interpret that. That's probably a phone that is
sitting on a Bank of wall phones that some a hole who barely
speaks English is out there tapping away on and saying awful
things. And that may very well be true
behind the picture of a cat or a dog or a cartoon character or a
Batman symbol or whatever it is. And you go like, yeah,
intellectually I know that. But emotionally, it feels like
some awful human beings out there saying the worst thing
about me all the time. And I hate it.
But I also know that nobody does that to my face.
And I don't think they often will do it to your face, which
makes me know that there is a big difference between the real
world. I, I actually had this
conversation with Sean Ryan right when things were getting
crazy at the beginning of the year.
There was a Tesla that blew up at front of Trump Tower and some
other things. And, and, and Sean reached out
to me and he's obviously very prominent.
He gets a lot of hate and love and all the things you get when
you're online and prominent. He's got a bigger profile than
either one of us. And he called me for advice,
which was really interesting because we've never spoken
before. So I think I like it when people
that I don't know call me up and ask me what I think about
something and I don't know what the answer is before they
answer. Like he goes, you know, is the
FBI going to come after me? And I go, I don't think so.
No, based on I know about the FBI.
So I'll give you that opinion. And then he said, he asked me a
couple of the questions and he just said, I'm really, really
concerned. And I said, Sean, not knowing
him at all, never having met the guy just on the phone and
watching his podcast, I said, right now you're in the retard
vortex and there's there's no other way to explain it.
That's what we're in right now. And I'm going to remind you that
anytime you want, you can put your phone in a Faraday bag and
you can walk out and hug your kid.
And I would recommend you do that for this weekend because
there's nothing for you here except just swirling, you know,
retards. There's mean, ugly sentiment
everywhere. Unlimited amounts of it, as you
mentioned. So just get out of the pool for
a little while. You can step back in tomorrow.
You can step back in on Monday, whatever, but just take some
time. And you did to his credit, and I
think all of us should probably remember that too, but it
doesn't make it feel like there's not people that are
awful. I'll come down and look beaten
and my wife just looks at me and goes like, are you OK?
And I go, yeah, I'm just surrounded by really awful
people. And you're right, it takes away
from the experience. But not only the experience.
I mean, look, look at the college campuses and look what's
happening in Los Angeles. Right.
It's more real for them. They they don't have a real life
they can walk into the way you and I do.
I don't think. I think their real life and
their online life are blended and they are one.
And this is a real change that's taken place in our lives during
the time that you and I have been, you know, adults.
And we've had to adjust to it. And you have adjusted to it
phenomenally well because we have lots of people who like to
hear what we have to say. And that gives you, everyone
wants to be heard. So people like you and I really
want to be heard, get able to get people to listen to us.
And it's great. But you know, many have observed
as well. But on the other hand, there is,
it's a little bit like the old saw about 8 million, New York
City being the city of 8 million lonely people and everyone's on
the Internet at the same time. We're more alienated from each
other and in many respects isolated then, you know, we were
when we mostly just knew the people that we knew.
Who knows? There, there has to be some kind
of a swing. One of my friends is not college
educated and yet one of the brightest people as often as the
case, and he referred to our time right now as a digital dark
age where we have technologies. Unlike the dark age where people
had technologies from a previous civilization and didn't know
what to do with them or didn't know how to repair them, we now
have technologies from our future civilization and we
haven't figured out how to use them yet.
I feel like, And I think he might be right.
He might be right, but I will tell you the last couple of days
I've seen a number of posts, pushback posts regarding AI from
people in a position to know people who are highly
intelligent and highly knowledgeable, saying we're
really being fed a bill of goods about AI.
It will never truly be what we recognize as human intelligence,
much less exceeded because it's just, it's just modelling, it's
just simulation. It can't it, it lacks
consciousness, it lacks true creativity.
And even there's data, this data I think was particularly related
to the work of an AI being done by Apple, which is not a leader,
but that they have found that the bigger the problems get, the
worse AI gets at being accurate about results and the more
confused it gets because I think because the model doesn't scale.
It doesn't have to weigh the value of certain sources the way
that a human being would. I have to imagine that's true
because I've I've. I mean, go query about yourself
and find out all the interesting things that AI believes about
you. First of all, Grok is absolutely
determined that I'm an African American.
Well, we cannot disprove that. I've seen an African American
Ron Coleman. There is, in fact, a dark
skinned Ron Coleman. There is, well, I think there
may be more dark skinned Ron Coleman's than there are light
skinned Ron Coleman's. But when I say the Grok, I'm Ron
Coleman at Ron Coleman. Make a picture of the lawyer Ron
Coleman with the account Ron Coleman OK in a sailor suit.
Yes. Grok can't figure out that I
mean me me me yes, it just it just.
I love that though I got a lot of black Kyle Seraphin's for a
while too because the most prominent Seraphin.
In the dark, I told you. The most prominent Seraphin was
Kevin Seraphin, who incidentally, I believe played
for the Nets. So.
So that was the. Fact was, that's the guy your
father-in-law saw. That's.
What my father-in-law saw, thought had no opportunity in
America. And now, now the AI bots want to
just draw my picture as that man, which is he had an
opportunity. His opportunity.
Yeah. His opportunity was to be my
doppelganger. He just didn't realize it.
Well, I think we've exhausted nothing.
These subjects are not exhausted.
These are hard. They never go anywhere.
What what, What do you make of people taking it Seemed like we
were able to have some pretty healthy debate in my lifetime
and I didn't see very much political rioting and I saw a
riot that happened in 92 with Rodney King.
And I think that was very telling as as a young person I
saw that. But I haven't really seen wide
scale rioting right up until 2020.
That was maybe the the next time that I saw that.
What do you make of that happening now as a guy who kind
of does advocating on behalf of speech because.
This has nothing to do with speech.
Clearly not, but it is. It is an outlet that people are
trying to express something. Would you agree or do you not
even think that? I think that it is predominantly
a performance designed to simulate the expression of
opinion, just like those Act Blue or Media Matters bot farms.
It is very clear there is a lot of evidence, not only indirect
evidence, but direct evidence that both the 2020 riots and the
riots in LA now have been coordinated and funded by groups
and entities with an interest in harming American Society.
And they use, just as they use the free speech regime of
Twitter, they use the free speech regime of American, the
American tradition of legal St. demonstrations to SIM to, to
shield themselves from the effects of their violence.
So that you have an entire political party that will and an
entire media in a cadre that will look you right in the eye
in front of a row of burning buildings and say this is a
mostly peaceful demonstration. And say, Trump, don't, don't
send your military help here. We've got we've got the LAPD
handling everything while at the same time people are throwing
cinder blocks on top of LAPD cars and that cops are
scrambling underneath the underpasses, right?
That has nothing to do with speech, nothing.
But because the Democrats have made these political and
symbolic choices so that anything that can possibly be
construed and, and, and they know that we know that they're
lying, that we know that it's not an expression, much less a
sincere and authentic expression of opinion, but that it's rather
a show that's it's got. No, the answer is it has nothing
to do with free speech whatsoever.
It is, and in fact it is so corrosive to free speech because
of the way it abuses it and leverages it against the values
of the various society that free speech is meant to encourage.
That unless and until we have a political class that is prepared
to acknowledge these truths, we are in for very, very rocky
times ahead. Well, I do like that you drew
the parallel between the online bot farms and the the in real
life bot farms, which are these people that are that are,
they're seeding this thing they used to call astroturfing, but
they would use it for different types of things.
But this is an astroturf. In other words, it is not
grassroots. It is fake grass and it's
made-up grass. And so they're, like you said,
they're using the vestiges of free speech to simulate speech,
but it's obviously not speech and it's more performative.
How how sad for us. I did hear the fiery but mostly
peaceful line of this year's version.
I already heard it was on ABC7 and the statement was the law
enforcement must be very cautious when they go to engage
with people because they don't want to upset the balance.
It might just be that there are people who enjoy surrounding
burning cars and you don't want to upset them by coming in too
heavy handedly. And he said it a little bit more
eloquently or maybe a little bit shorter to the point.
But the effect, the effect was some people just burn cars for
fun, Ron. And you really don't want to
upset those people in America, now do you?
No, that's where we are. I mean just so many things are
are so out of whack. What a wild statement from a
from a newscaster. But but you know, Kyle, as you
pointed out, you go home for the weekend in my clay.
In my case, you would at least have one day of Sabbath rest
where you turn it all off and you're dealing entirely with
real people and the Lord. And you, you, you and your
family just might get through it.
If you will touch grasses, they say.
And it's never been more important because there is so
much else going out there that is so determined to get you off
track. So keep doing what you're doing.
We're going to keep doing that. As a last thought, do you think
a solution to some of this ridiculousness is dressing like
a grown up? Yeah, I do.
I think a lot of the things that we see people do they they
wouldn't dream of doing either because they would feel silly,
because they would recognize that they're they're acting out
of, out of out of place. But also they the the, the good
self regard that comes, the healthy self regard that comes
from looking like a Mensch. And dressing like a Mensch is
contagious to your entire psyche.
I do ACT differently when I'm wearing a suit I feel like.
Think about it. There's something to that.
And maybe that's maybe that's the lesson that these I know
that other people also act like they are at a slumber party on
an airplane when they show up in their pajamas.
It is just unbelievable how people go around now and even in
over the last 20 years. I mean, you know, we can't
compare things with the 1950s. That's just ridiculous.
But even in the last 20 years, I mean, I used to go onto a plane
and there would be a few business people on there dressed
for business. And now it's just like riding
the subway, you know? But not the subway at any hour
of the day. The subway at at 2:00 AM when
the bars have let out. With the people who live on that
subway. Yes, with people who are
actually inhabitants and you are a visitor in their home, in
their in the atrium that is their home.
Yeah, I mean, I wouldn't want to put too much on it.
But but, but, but I will tell you that if you if you could
change one seemingly, you know, 11 seemingly isolated thing
about our society without making anyone, without imprisoning
anyone or executing anyone, but just that everyone's going to
have to dress as if it was they were going to a job interview in
1986. And that starts with every
individual person because people will treat you differently when
you when you do, people treat you differently than the hobos
that are walking around out in the street.
No, they do. I mean, but, but, but let's face
it, there's a certain aura. I mean, I have total strangers.
The guys in front of Quick Check.
OK, Who live in front of Quick Check?
Yes. Hey, Mr. Lawyer, I get out of my
car. OK, I'm going to get a slut.
Hey, lawyer, they can just tell. OK?
So you can't use me as an example.
You just exude lawyerness legal scholarliness.
Well. Down South I exude Rabbi this,
but yeah, it's essentially the same thing anyway.
That's fair. I love it.
Ron, tell people about the culmination.
Culmination is my podcast. It doesn't go every day such as
Kyle's does, but it goes every couple of weeks, which is just
about right for someone who has a real job.
And, you know, we, it supposedly is about free speech, but it's
whatever interests me. It's it's, it has my name in it,
so just whatever I want to do. And you can find it at
coleman-nation.com. But if you just look up
roncoleman.com, you'll find me in everything I'm about and it
will enable you to proactively avoid me as well if that's what
you want to do after listening to this.
It's a free country. I want to make your experience
as pleasant as possible online too that.
Is very that is very thoughtful and courteous of you.
Good on you. We will put your link in the
show description for people who want to send you nice messages
only on X. They have to be flattering, or
at least constructively sarcastic.
Listen, the the I just dropped today an episode new new podcast
episode of culmination. And my guest is Andrew Branca,
law of self-defense, who once blocked me on Twitter.
OK, he has some. Really, really nasty things to
say sometimes. Yeah, he does.
And I, I must have, I must have tripped over one of them.
And yet we became pretty friendly.
So, you know, I, I'm, I'm not afraid of of nasty comments, but
nasty there. I guess there's a level of nasty
that. There has to be some value
added. Oh no.
There is, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
All right. All right.
Thanks for having me. Great talking to you again,
Kyle. I enjoyed it.
Thanks Ron. And that my dear friends, is the
Sunday sit down. It was brought to you by my
Patriot supply. Check them out at
mypatriotsupply.com slash Kyle for that 4th of July
preparedness option bundle. If you guys are looking for all
their sale options, it's there too.
I hope you enjoyed that. I hope there was some fun there
for you. It was a very fun time for me.
I I loved talking to talking to Ron.
It's just when I say he's one of my favorite people that I've met
in the social media sphere, it's not exaggerating.
Thanks for being part of the program and make sure you have
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Hope you join us for the regular Kyle Seraphin show which does
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and we'll start with show six O 1 on Monday.
God bless all of you. Thanks for making us a success
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8 episodes. We are crushing it over here and
it's because of you. So thank God for you and God
bless you. I look forward to seeing you on
the other side of this weekend. Have a great one.
Thank you for listening. To the Kyle Seraphin Show,
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