1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:06,000 Take a look behind the curtain with a real whistle blower, an 2 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:09,480 American patriot prepared to embrace the uncomfortable truth 3 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:12,880 because this program has no time for comforting lies. 4 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:16,160 Here is civil liberties enthusiasts, Second Amendment 5 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:19,760 defender and recovering FBI agent Kyle Seraphin. 6 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:23,480 Hello my friends, welcome to the Kyle Seraphin show. 7 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:26,720 Today is Thursday, August the 17th and we have a very special 8 00:00:26,720 --> 00:00:29,560 treat for you today. We have an interview from an 9 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:34,480 American in Moscow, something that you may not expect to hear 10 00:00:34,480 --> 00:00:38,080 and certainly something that I thought was worth our time once. 11 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:41,360 Once Tara and I had a conversation the day before. 12 00:00:41,480 --> 00:00:43,360 So ladies and gentlemen, stick around for that. 13 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:44,720 First, we want to say thanks to our sponsors. 14 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:46,800 We want to say thank you to Catholic Vote. 15 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:49,440 Go to catholicvote.org and you will get the loop. 16 00:00:49,760 --> 00:00:52,000 The Loop is their e-mail. You know how to get there. 17 00:00:52,200 --> 00:00:54,360 catholicvote.org. You will fill in your e-mail 18 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:58,360 address, your name, your zip code, and what will you get? 19 00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:03,440 Today's news, useful information that you can go forth and no 20 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:07,200 more things in the world. Today's loop, let's see right 21 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:12,160 here. Today's loop has federal courts 22 00:01:12,320 --> 00:01:14,760 ending mail order abortion pills. 23 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:17,520 The United States Fifth Circuit, the 5th Circuit has really been 24 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:21,080 coming through in a big way. Stories about Alabama passing 25 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:22,840 school choice. Fantastic stuff. 26 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:27,280 Americans want to protect kids from pornography. 83% of a 27 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:29,400 national poll shows there's a story about that. 28 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:32,880 Catholic preschools suing the state of Colorado. 29 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:36,240 Leftist defending disgraced teachers after an assault in 30 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:37,880 Santa Barbara. This is a really good story 31 00:01:37,960 --> 00:01:40,080 coming from Daily Wire and Luke Rosiak. 32 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:45,000 Target continuing its long term collapse with their LGBT key 33 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:47,360 LGBTQ. Why do we have so many letters 34 00:01:47,360 --> 00:01:50,760 in that themed closing line? Folks, check out the loop. 35 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:53,240 You can get in there and get lots of useful information that 36 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:55,000 will start your day off. We do really appreciate them 37 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:59,800 again, catholicvote.org. And today we announce for the 38 00:01:59,800 --> 00:02:04,480 first time, despite all of the the delays, we now have 39 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:08,479 suspendables merch. I'm not even sure what all is in 40 00:02:08,479 --> 00:02:09,320 there. I've looked at the store. 41 00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:10,400 It's going to be continuing to add. 42 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:12,640 There's going to be some new additions in the next week. 43 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:16,440 Our friend Gerardo Boyle, GOB actual on Twitter and true 44 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:18,560 Social. Gerardo Boyle has come through 45 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:21,040 with a web page that you all can go to that's 46 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:28,000 http://thedashsuspendables.com. Again, go to 47 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:33,080 thedashsuspendables.com. It's just like it sounds. 48 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:34,480 And you'll find suspendables merch. 49 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:36,360 There's T-shirts there looks like there's going to be some 50 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:37,640 lapel pins. If you want to go out there and 51 00:02:37,640 --> 00:02:39,920 support it as you move around in a little bit dressier clothes, 52 00:02:39,920 --> 00:02:42,080 gentlemen, if you want to put something on your lapel and let 53 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:44,840 people know that you are suspendable, check it out. 54 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:48,760 And as he said, exercise your First Amendment through your 55 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:52,440 attire until you cannot do so any longer. 56 00:02:52,440 --> 00:02:58,320 The Dash suspendables.com folks, thanks for thanks for supporting 57 00:02:58,320 --> 00:02:59,200 us. And that is going to be 58 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:01,720 supporting Garrett and his family, but also our new 59 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:02,840 foundation, which we're putting out. 60 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:05,440 We're going to have some very unique and limited edition stuff 61 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:09,200 that's going to go out there and support the 5O1C4 that is in the 62 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:12,440 process of being activated at this moment. 63 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:16,080 The DASH suspendables.com. OK, without any further ado, I 64 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:18,640 want to say folks tuck in for this one. 65 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:20,520 It's a long conversation. I think you're going to get 66 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:22,600 information you probably haven't heard anywhere else, at least in 67 00:03:22,600 --> 00:03:24,360 this format. I haven't. 68 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:27,000 And I've spoken to to Tara long form. 69 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:30,400 So without further ado, Tara Reid from Moscow. 70 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:36,440 All right, ladies and gentlemen, I'm very excited about this 71 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:39,360 interview. We are speaking to Tara Reid. 72 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:42,480 She is in Moscow. That is not America. 73 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,320 She's speaking to us here, live in Liberty Hill, TX. 74 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:49,400 And we are going to get to the bottom of what has been called a 75 00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:51,920 defection, which I think is probably the wrong word. 76 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:55,080 We made this connection again. So Tara and I have talked a 77 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:56,640 number of times over the last few months. 78 00:03:56,880 --> 00:03:59,560 She reached out to me yesterday and I knew that the story was 79 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:01,080 something you all should hear as well. 80 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:03,240 So we're going to get to the bottom of what's going on with 81 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:05,720 her situation, and I'm going to debunk any of the myths that 82 00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:07,400 have been put out there in the mainstream media, and there are 83 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:09,400 many of them. We're going to get the whole 84 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:11,440 story here. So, folks, I think you're going 85 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:13,560 to really want to tune in, clear your schedules. 86 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,079 I don't know how long this will take, but let's get going. 87 00:04:16,079 --> 00:04:18,519 And Taro, thanks for joining me at such a late hour. 88 00:04:18,519 --> 00:04:21,800 What time is it right now? Oh, it's like, you know, 10:45 89 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:24,880 or so at night. It is late, so I appreciate you 90 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:27,320 staying up late. People stay up late in Russia's, 91 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:28,560 not even Europe. What do we call that? 92 00:04:28,560 --> 00:04:31,880 Eurasia. No, I, I mean, it's, it's the 93 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:34,800 East, I guess, but Russia, Russia is, you're right, though 94 00:04:34,800 --> 00:04:37,160 it does get light early, like at 3:00 or 4:00 in the morning, it 95 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:39,560 starts getting light. So, yeah. 96 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:43,400 And in Saint Petersburg, it stays light. 97 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:45,000 They have white nights and it stays. 98 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:47,360 I was there for white nights. It's quite beautiful. 99 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:49,560 It's light almost until 2/3 in the morning. 100 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:50,480 It's quite lovely. That's. 101 00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:52,360 Kind of like what goes on in Anchorage I guess. 102 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:54,480 Is it that far up? Yes. 103 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:57,120 I, I never think of it as that far up, but I guess that makes 104 00:04:57,120 --> 00:04:59,600 sense. All right, before we get too far 105 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:01,560 afield, because I will just get sideways and we'll just start 106 00:05:01,560 --> 00:05:04,800 chatting. Let's tell people who you are 107 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:08,240 and why they know your name and what sort of the, the prequel of 108 00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:09,640 the story is. And then we're going to get into 109 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:11,360 the nitty gritty of it. As long as you'd like to tell 110 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:12,920 it. But start with maybe where you 111 00:05:12,920 --> 00:05:14,360 grew up. I, I read a quick bio on you, 112 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:16,360 some things I didn't know, like you'd lived in Wisconsin. 113 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:17,960 Maybe tell us the story. I've grown up. 114 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:20,760 Yeah, yeah. I, I was, I was born in 115 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:23,400 Monterey, CA, Monterey County, California. 116 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:27,280 And my parents moved when I was a baby to Wisconsin and had a 117 00:05:27,280 --> 00:05:29,560 farm. My father owned a business. 118 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:32,280 And so he was a, what you call a gentleman farmer, if you will. 119 00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:38,520 And my mom had like an acre organic garden and we had 80 120 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:43,120 acres and lots of animals. And it was very nice upbringing. 121 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:47,200 I don't think I even had fast food until I was 15 years old 122 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:49,280 because we were really living off the land. 123 00:05:49,280 --> 00:05:51,840 We had beef cattle. Our neighbor had dairy cattle, 124 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:54,520 so it was quite a wholesome upbringing. 125 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:58,720 And I had a couple of brothers. My, my, you know, my family had 126 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:03,360 its ups and downs and my parents divorced when I was 13 and my 127 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:07,560 father was a defense contractor. I became a defense contractor. 128 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:10,320 He also was the president of PR for Honeywell. 129 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:12,120 And so he was pretty establishment. 130 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:17,000 My mother on the other hand was an artist and she was not 131 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:22,280 establishment at all and she was an activist and anti war and 132 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:29,840 marched and then also helped boys go to Canada to avoid the 133 00:06:29,840 --> 00:06:33,160 Vietnam draft. Although my brother served 134 00:06:33,160 --> 00:06:39,240 Michael, he was a conscientious objector but he did go overseas 135 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:41,440 during the Vietnam War. He was quite a bit older than me 136 00:06:41,960 --> 00:06:44,480 and my brother Michael unfortunately died when I was 137 00:06:45,640 --> 00:06:49,160 young and he and I were very close. 138 00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:52,560 So it was, it was a really hard time for me when he when he 139 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:55,960 died. But my mother was quite, you 140 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:59,920 know, she was quite the activist and, you know, very outspoken 141 00:07:00,080 --> 00:07:03,040 and, you know, and, and, and a guiding force. 142 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:07,280 And so I kind of had political cognitive dissonance, if you 143 00:07:07,280 --> 00:07:08,840 will. I had a great grandmother that 144 00:07:08,840 --> 00:07:12,320 was a communist and I had Republicans and I had but mostly 145 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:17,280 Democrats in my family. And I went on very interested in 146 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,160 politics as well as acting. I was in acting and classically 147 00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:24,880 trained when I was young and my first professional work was when 148 00:07:24,880 --> 00:07:27,960 I was 16. It was as as a writer and an 149 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:29,840 actress. I wrote some poetry that was 150 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:31,920 published and that was my first paycheck ever. 151 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:34,800 And then after that, I did modeling and acting 152 00:07:35,160 --> 00:07:37,720 professionally, moved out of the house. 153 00:07:37,720 --> 00:07:43,720 And then, you know, I was really needing to feed the intellect 154 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:46,120 and was really into political science and geopolitics. 155 00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:47,520 It was just always a fascination. 156 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:52,040 And I was a like a debate person in high school and went to state 157 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:53,680 with debate. I mean, I was really into it. 158 00:07:54,080 --> 00:07:59,120 So I had this opportunity in college. 159 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:01,320 I was approached by one of my professors and they said, hey, 160 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:04,680 there's an internship with Leon Panetta's office and I think 161 00:08:04,680 --> 00:08:08,240 that you might fit the bill for it if you want to try to apply. 162 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:14,440 And so I did and I was hired and, and I went and worked for 163 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:16,400 him. And then I after the internship, 164 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:20,280 I was trained in campaigns and worked as a Democratic 165 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:24,360 operative. And then I went on and worked 166 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:28,000 for Joe Biden. And before we jump into that, 167 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:30,760 will you give people context of Leon Panetta, what he was doing? 168 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:32,840 I think a lot of people know the name and don't know who he is. 169 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:35,000 And then maybe what you mean by the word political operative, 170 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:37,000 which I hear a lot, but I don't have a great idea of what it 171 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:41,440 means. OK, well, you have different 172 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:45,440 roles in campaigns. I was a field manager and I was 173 00:08:45,440 --> 00:08:49,280 more in strategy of, you know, how to win that congressional 174 00:08:49,280 --> 00:08:52,120 campaign. So I was I was working on that 175 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:55,920 and overseeing volunteers, hundreds of volunteers and also 176 00:08:55,920 --> 00:09:00,040 strategy of how to win it. And you know, we're trained by 177 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:02,680 different organizations, think tanks, they come in and they do 178 00:09:02,680 --> 00:09:06,160 trainings and teach you how to do that. 179 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:09,880 I really enjoyed doing that work. 180 00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:13,200 There are other people that do camping opposition research. 181 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:16,880 That's a little more, that's the that's the hit things that you 182 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:18,560 see. I'm not really, I wasn't really 183 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:20,800 even back then, I didn't like that kind of thing. 184 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:23,400 But there are other people that that's there, you know, 185 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:26,840 wheelhouse. But overall it's like, it's 186 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:29,080 almost like a, they even call it a war room. 187 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:31,960 When you're running a campaign, It's it's very much like war. 188 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:36,640 You're dealing with strategy and you're trying to win and and you 189 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:41,320 do what it takes to do that. As far as Congressman Panetta, 190 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:44,600 he was, well, I just said it, he was a congressman representing, 191 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:47,640 he's from Carmel Valley, CA. I was born in Monterey, as you 192 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:49,560 know. So it's in that same district 193 00:09:49,560 --> 00:09:53,800 and back then it was district there and he represented that 194 00:09:53,840 --> 00:09:55,760 area before he went into the CIA. 195 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:59,880 He was a also a former White House chief of staff for Bill 196 00:09:59,880 --> 00:10:03,720 Clinton, but left and I believe he left and discussed. 197 00:10:03,720 --> 00:10:08,200 So my time at Leon Panetta's was unremarkable. 198 00:10:08,200 --> 00:10:10,600 I mean, I learned a lot. But he was really, you know, a 199 00:10:10,600 --> 00:10:14,200 very the kind of person that seemed very serious about his 200 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:15,880 work. He would stay up late reading 201 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:17,680 the bills. There was no nonsense in his 202 00:10:17,680 --> 00:10:23,240 office, not like Joe Biden. And he was he was an interesting 203 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:26,160 person. I disagree with a lot of his 204 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:29,280 positions, particularly on war. And, you know, as it stands 205 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:32,880 right now, he's on the board of Raytheon, which is a missile 206 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:33,680 company. So. 207 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:37,520 And so when you see him comment about Ukraine and be really, you 208 00:10:37,520 --> 00:10:40,480 know, forceful about that, just remember he's lining his pockets 209 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:42,720 so. And he was the Secretary of 210 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:46,600 Defense and as well as the CIA, so, so obviously very entrenched 211 00:10:46,600 --> 00:10:48,680 in the the military industrial type world, right? 212 00:10:49,280 --> 00:10:53,960 Absolutely yes. I want to, I want to dig into a 213 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:56,200 little bit of this. You gave us kind of a, a taste 214 00:10:56,200 --> 00:10:58,040 of your dad was a military defense contractor. 215 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:01,000 You said, did I get that right? And mom is an activist. 216 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:04,000 Who do you think you took after? Or did you take a little bit of 217 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:07,480 both? I took after my mother, I guess, 218 00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:10,280 as far as because I did work for traditional Democrats and in 219 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:11,840 that I wanted to work in the Senate. 220 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:13,320 I wanted to run for office eventually. 221 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,240 Then I guess I, you know, there's a little bit of my dad 222 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:17,720 there too. So, yeah, little, you know, 223 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:19,880 working within the system to make change. 224 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:23,480 I didn't like marching. I wasn't the type that like to 225 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:25,200 hold signs or March. That wasn't my thing. 226 00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:28,680 Instead of that, you like to work in the office end and 227 00:11:28,680 --> 00:11:30,360 actually execute strategy it sounds like. 228 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:32,120 Yes. Yeah, I want. 229 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:33,960 To work behind the scenes to do all that. 230 00:11:34,760 --> 00:11:38,560 So you've gone from intern, we've gone into a operative 231 00:11:38,560 --> 00:11:42,080 working on campaign work. And then what was the the door 232 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:43,960 that opened that allowed you to go to work for Joe Biden? 233 00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:48,920 I was actually hired at the interview, which is, you know, I 234 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,160 thought that was normal, but apparently that's not. 235 00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:56,040 But I did a phone call interview with the scheduler and then was 236 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:58,560 and and then someone else jumped on the line. 237 00:11:58,560 --> 00:12:01,480 I think the one of my other supervisors who became my 238 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:04,120 supervisor and I can't really recall. 239 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:10,000 But then I flew out for the final interview and I was 240 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:14,240 sitting and being interviewed and Joe Biden breezed in with a 241 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:19,920 couple of the his staff and her office was like right next to 242 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:23,280 his and kind of out in the open. So he had to walk past her to 243 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:27,680 get to his door. And he just looked at me and on 244 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:31,880 our conversation and he interrupted and introduced 245 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:37,280 himself and, and she basically, Marianne basically said, who is 246 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:40,400 the scheduler? She said, Oh, this is Tara Reid. 247 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:43,560 And, and he said, oh, an Irish name Tara, you know, and then 248 00:12:43,560 --> 00:12:48,600 he's, she said he, she worked for, she worked for Leon Panetta 249 00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:50,600 as an intern. He said, oh, Leon, he's a great 250 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:52,400 guy. He's a good man, good man. 251 00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:56,320 And then he looked at me and he just looked at me and looked 252 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:58,680 back at her and said, you should hire her. 253 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:02,000 You know she's hired so and then. 254 00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:04,840 That was that. Yeah, he left. 255 00:13:04,840 --> 00:13:07,000 He like moved away. And then she looked at me and 256 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:11,080 said OK, so you're hired. And I'm like, OK. 257 00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:15,240 And that that's not common, you're saying, huh, that's not 258 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:17,720 common apparently. Apparently not. 259 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:20,360 I thought it was like I, you know, I left and, you know, 260 00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:22,400 being in my 20s, I thought, oh, OK, cool. 261 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:25,200 You get hired at the interview. That never happened to me in my 262 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:28,000 life. So yeah, that was that was 263 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:30,200 interesting. We have a picture, I think, of 264 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:33,560 your ID badge from that era. This is when you're working for 265 00:13:33,560 --> 00:13:35,280 Leon Panetta. Does that sound right, Ryan? 266 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:37,520 We pull up the the picture of the ID badge just for kind of 267 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:39,800 fun. It's just kind of vintage setup 268 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:41,560 if you can. Yeah, Give me one second. 269 00:13:41,560 --> 00:13:42,600 I got to track it down. I'll get it. 270 00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:44,600 OK, no problem. And then there's also we have a, 271 00:13:44,680 --> 00:13:47,120 a photo from probably about that air, I'm thinking where you have 272 00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:48,080 the long hair in the red dress on. 273 00:13:48,080 --> 00:13:50,040 So we're going to throw a couple of photos up from that kind of 274 00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:52,400 time frame. And so you, you get hired right 275 00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:54,560 at the interview. There's there's that photo. 276 00:13:54,560 --> 00:13:56,280 Look at that. So there, that was your 277 00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:57,720 congressional ID as an intern, I think. 278 00:13:57,720 --> 00:13:59,240 Does that sound right? And. 279 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:03,120 You have the curly hair there, and so you get hired right off 280 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:04,800 the spot. You don't know any better. 281 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:07,360 Did you go back and talk to your colleagues in that space and 282 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:09,000 hear about different hiring stories? 283 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:11,080 I know the FBI, we always compared notes. 284 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:15,000 Well, you know, it's interesting because I left, right and a 285 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:18,160 friend was waiting for me and they expected to just like, 286 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:21,320 because I traveled there to just, we would go out to dinner 287 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:22,960 and just like see the sights or whatever. 288 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:24,720 And I was like, well, I got the job. 289 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:27,960 And he was like, he was amazed. He was like, what, you know, you 290 00:14:27,960 --> 00:14:31,560 got it at the, And I said, yeah. And then he he said, well, let's 291 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:33,040 go celebrate. Let's go to New York. 292 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:36,600 So we went to New York City and we celebrated, took the train up 293 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,200 and had fun and met other friends and and celebrated. 294 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:44,120 And then I went back to California and packed up my 295 00:14:44,120 --> 00:14:48,200 world and moved to DC. And thus began the great 296 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:50,560 adventure in many ways. What did you see? 297 00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:53,680 If you can think back to that time, what did you think you 298 00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:55,160 were embarking on as far as a life? 299 00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:56,600 Because I'm sure it went differently. 300 00:14:57,520 --> 00:14:59,760 Oh, I thought it was the beginning of my career. 301 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:01,640 I was very enthusiastic at that point. 302 00:15:01,640 --> 00:15:04,040 You know, Joe Biden was very powerful in the Senate. 303 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:06,320 He was the chairman of judiciary, chairman of the 304 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:09,960 Foreign Relations. I was really fascinated with the 305 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:13,000 Foreign Relations Committee, with anything to do with 306 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:16,640 geopolitics. And I wanted to eventually run 307 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,720 for Senate if I could, or Congress. 308 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:22,360 So I looked at him. As you know, he's about my 309 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:26,320 father's age at that time as a mentor, frankly. 310 00:15:27,080 --> 00:15:32,440 And, you know, so I was very kind of starstruck that I got to 311 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,360 work in the Senate. I was so proud to serve my 312 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,360 country. I was so proud to to be in 313 00:15:38,360 --> 00:15:41,000 public service. It's what I always wanted to do. 314 00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:43,800 And so, yeah, I felt like I was in the right place, you know, 315 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:45,280 that feeling like, oh, this is it. 316 00:15:45,640 --> 00:15:47,040 This is the right place to be. And. 317 00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:48,680 What about the people you worked with? 318 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:50,760 What was the climate in the office? 319 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:54,160 The other staffers. That was interesting because 320 00:15:54,680 --> 00:15:58,720 right away I got the vibe that there was a lot of unhappiness 321 00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:02,720 and it was very top down. And the chief of staff is Ted 322 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:06,000 Kaufman. And Ted Kaufman, now I know more 323 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:09,640 about his background. He's from DuPont Corporation and 324 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:13,800 was very high up in that. And he runs it like kind of that 325 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,320 like a very kind of a corporate kind of feel. 326 00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:21,800 Also Biden has you're given each office is given the same amount 327 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:23,640 of money, but they allocate it the way they wish. 328 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:25,440 The chief of staff is responsible for that. 329 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:29,240 And Biden's office was 49th out of 50 in pay. 330 00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:33,720 So we're yeah, for all the staffers because my pay was very 331 00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:35,240 low. It was very hard to live on the 332 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:39,240 wage that they gave us because they kept a top heavy. 333 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:43,040 So like the Ted Kaufman got a lot of money and Dennis Toner 334 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:44,400 and some of the other upper level. 335 00:16:44,680 --> 00:16:49,720 But you know, you know, other staffers and legislative aides, 336 00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:53,400 we were paid very little. So it was interesting. 337 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:56,480 But you always, you hear people, sometimes they say you get paid 338 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,040 in salary and sometimes you get paid with the title. 339 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:01,240 It sounds like they were open, you were getting by with the 340 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:02,600 title and you were excited about your right. 341 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:04,680 And you had you had a lot of privilege there. 342 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:06,839 You had a lot of people that were trust funders. 343 00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:09,560 I think this was sort of the beginning of that era that you 344 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:13,760 have back East where where the media and where the politics are 345 00:17:13,760 --> 00:17:18,720 run by these, you know, barons of industries, children, right? 346 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:20,319 Like they're, they're privileged. 347 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:22,040 They've gone to all the right schools. 348 00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:25,160 Like, you know, they would have conversations about the 349 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:27,119 different Ivy League schools they went to. 350 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:32,400 I went to Community College and you know, I am and my mother was 351 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:35,360 highly educated, but self educated. 352 00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:39,280 My father did go to Colgate, but you know, that's neither here 353 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:42,720 nor there. He, he, I don't consider that 354 00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:46,040 really an Ivy League school and he had to actually go back and 355 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:49,040 get to his master's. So, you know, I think it's 356 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:53,160 interesting that there was a lot of snobbery around that on the 357 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:56,000 Hill even back then, like who went to Brown and who went to 358 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:59,240 Harvard and such. So that I think that era 359 00:17:59,240 --> 00:18:00,880 started, it was really starting in. 360 00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:03,680 And now you see that with the media, where you see media 361 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:06,640 people where they're coming from these Ivy League schools and 362 00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:09,080 they have no idea how to do real journalism. 363 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,720 They're just, you know, they've had a very different life. 364 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:15,280 You're touching on something that has been very dear to my 365 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:17,720 heart. My people like Matt Taibbi and 366 00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:19,760 and even my father, who was in media for a long time, always 367 00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:22,280 talked about journalism being a blue collar profession where 368 00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:24,200 people would go and try to hold the powerful to account. 369 00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:27,920 And now it seems like they they just want to pad their 370 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:28,960 friendships that they have with them. 371 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:30,360 How did you fit into that culture? 372 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:32,080 Did you did you get along with your colleagues? 373 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:35,600 Well, I got, I got along OK. I just didn't try to fit in. 374 00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:39,160 And remember, too, I kind of had the attitude because I'm, you 375 00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:43,480 know, at this point, I'm 28 years old, 27 years old and I, I 376 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:47,840 already had the, you know, you know, I've been on movie sets 377 00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:50,680 and film sets and different work environments and then worked in 378 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:53,960 campaigns. I didn't necessarily socialize 379 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:56,560 with the people I worked with. Now they did, they all 380 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:58,840 socialized with each other, but I kept a little bit of a 381 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:00,920 distance. And I think there wasn't even a 382 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:03,920 hit article written about that. But I wasn't an outlier, an 383 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:06,200 outsider. I simply didn't think it was a 384 00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:09,040 good idea to go. And I wasn't a drinker. 385 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:11,440 I don't really drink alcohol. I don't do drugs. 386 00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:14,720 And a lot of the people in that culture at that time were doing 387 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:18,320 cocaine, They were doing drugs, they were doing drinking and 388 00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:20,640 they were partying. And they would even do it at the 389 00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:23,400 House and the Senate and especially on long nights when 390 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:26,280 there was bills and stuff, you'd see a lot of drinking and stuff. 391 00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:28,520 And I I just wasn't part of that culture it. 392 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:32,440 Makes a lot of sense. Once in a while I did once in a 393 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:36,440 while, you know, I did my Wilds whatever, went to the Irish pub 394 00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:40,040 and you know, whatever. But I wasn't like an Angel. 395 00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:42,360 But I just mean it wasn't a regular practice. 396 00:19:42,360 --> 00:19:44,280 It wasn't something that I sought out to do. 397 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:46,920 It wasn't like, oh, this Friday night, this is all I want to do. 398 00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:51,360 I also had built because of Congressman Leon Peretta. 399 00:19:51,360 --> 00:19:56,080 I had built a friendships with some girls that we, we lived in 400 00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:58,600 this place called the Nunnery. They called it, they nicknamed 401 00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:01,640 it Thompson, Mark Markwood Hall, Markson Hall. 402 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:06,040 And we it was girls only and boys were not allowed up after 403 00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:09,200 9:00. Of course, women snuck their 404 00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:11,440 boyfriends up because we were in their 20s, you know, whatever. 405 00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:17,080 But we were in college and, and so I made some really good 406 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:19,080 friends. In fact, I'm still friends with 407 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:22,200 some of them today. Well, now it's a little more 408 00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:26,600 difficult, but but you know, carried on for decades, our 409 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:29,840 friendship, you know, because you're living in that dorm and 410 00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:32,200 then you're all walking across the street to the sun at the 411 00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:33,840 house. And it was supposed to be the 412 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:38,200 safe place like in DC because DC was seen as so dangerous during 413 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:39,560 that time. It was considered a very 414 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:41,680 dangerous city. There was even like a headline 415 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:45,720 article about that at that time. And what's ironic about that is 416 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:48,520 the actual predators were in Congress. 417 00:20:49,120 --> 00:20:50,360 Let's Yeah, let's talk about that. 418 00:20:50,360 --> 00:20:53,600 First of all, give me give me the the feeling of living in DC 419 00:20:53,600 --> 00:20:54,880 at the time, having worked in there. 420 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:56,960 I have a sense of what it looked like obviously in the last 10 421 00:20:56,960 --> 00:20:59,520 years or so. But I'm curious how was it at 422 00:20:59,520 --> 00:21:01,200 that point? What, what was the street level 423 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:03,600 crime looking like? What was the experience of 424 00:21:03,600 --> 00:21:07,240 moving around in Northwest near where all the the seats of power 425 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:11,960 are? There was a lot of homeless 426 00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:15,120 during that time, homeless families, homeless children. 427 00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:18,520 In fact, I was a volunteer for Hill Staffers for the Hungry and 428 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:21,840 the Homeless. And it was really kind of, you 429 00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:24,760 know, didn't that organization didn't do much when we tried. 430 00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:30,800 But like, it was, it was really, really dire poverty right around 431 00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:32,880 the hill. Like, I mean, you're talking 432 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:36,400 people living in shocks with no electricity, no running water 433 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:40,760 and children with bare feet. Real poverty. 434 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:45,880 I saw a lot of real bad poverty when I was there. 435 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:48,600 And I noticed that maybe some of my friends didn't. 436 00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:50,760 They were more into the, you know, social scene. 437 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:53,520 But I was noticing it when I would go into a restaurant, I 438 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:55,400 would see right outside there was homeless. 439 00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:59,600 And this is before other cities, you know, started really seeing 440 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:02,440 a lot of homeless. And I think Washington, DC was 441 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:06,160 one of the first places that you really saw greater numbers. 442 00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:11,080 And so you already saw the economic divide happening in DC 443 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:16,000 and then you saw, of course, you know, the people that are in 444 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:19,360 their bubbles, they don't even notice the poverty around them, 445 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:23,120 the very wealthy and the diplomats and whatnot that live 446 00:22:23,120 --> 00:22:28,840 in their bubbles, right? And, you know, as far as you 447 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:33,440 know, the atmosphere for women, it was changing, but it was 448 00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:39,360 still, we were very objectified, or at least I was to extend. 449 00:22:39,360 --> 00:22:45,880 And there was a lot of, there is a lot of bad behavior, if you 450 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:51,600 will, on the hill and and you know, some women participated in 451 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:54,600 that themselves and some didn't want to. 452 00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:58,560 And so the ones that didn't want to didn't last long, right? 453 00:22:59,920 --> 00:23:03,120 I would say that there was a lot of that kind of behavior and, 454 00:23:03,360 --> 00:23:06,840 you know, objectification. Can you get specific about what 455 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:08,080 we're talking about bad behavior? 456 00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,640 I don't have to have names per SE, but I'm curious of examples 457 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:13,320 of what we're talking about. You know, whether it's liaisons 458 00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:15,760 or parties, whatever. But like, so people get an idea 459 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,160 because you're giving people a look behind something that they 460 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,320 don't ever get to experience. They suspect it, I think. 461 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:22,600 But you. Know when I was at Thompson 462 00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:25,520 Markwood Hall, you know at one point I brought my car out from 463 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:27,680 California. Being a Californian, we I took 464 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:29,520 the metro, but we love our cars. You know how we are. 465 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:32,600 So I was like often the designated driver because I 466 00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:36,320 didn't really drink and I or like if we went far out, I was 467 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,800 like the person that would drive or pick up someone that was in a 468 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:44,760 bad situation. And I got a call, you know, and 469 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:47,000 we had beepers back then. By the way, this is like how old 470 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:49,280 I I was. Just thinking this is everyone's 471 00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:51,720 thinking of Ubers, but there's no Ubers, There's taxi cab only. 472 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:55,040 There's the metro, Yeah, no, cell phones weren't as common 473 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:55,920 with that. So. 474 00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:59,760 So then I went out and the young there was a young girl who was 475 00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:05,400 in the hallway who was in the. Excuse me, the, the place, the 476 00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:07,480 hall with me. You know that that residence. 477 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:12,080 And she called hysterical, crying drunk, whatever. 478 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:15,520 And when I, when I got ahold of her and she was at a payphone 479 00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:19,400 and in the middle of nowhere and it was like really late at 480 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:22,120 night, I woke up my other friend from the other room and said, 481 00:24:22,120 --> 00:24:23,920 you know, you're coming with me and we're going to go get her. 482 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,200 And I don't want to say her name, but she had had a 483 00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:31,680 consensual affair with a very prominent Republican senator. 484 00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:34,280 And I won't say his name right now. 485 00:24:34,360 --> 00:24:37,640 It's in my book. And I lead to it Someday I'll 486 00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:41,040 I'll reveal who it was, but very prominent, you'd know the name. 487 00:24:41,360 --> 00:24:44,320 And he had had an affair with her and she was totally 488 00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:47,080 enthralled and thought he was going to leave his wife and be 489 00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:48,600 with her. And she's like 22. 490 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:53,480 She was younger than me and and she was. 491 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:56,480 Anyway, she was crying, drunk, her stockings were all torn. 492 00:24:56,680 --> 00:25:00,560 He apparently she'd made a scene and he dumped her off just in 493 00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:04,080 the middle of somewhere in Virginia, just like on the side 494 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,760 of the road and dumped her. And so I took her, you know, we 495 00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:09,560 took her. And I was like, the whole time I 496 00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:12,160 was sort of sympathetic. But then also I was hoping she 497 00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:14,000 wouldn't bar from the car. You know, I was having those 498 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:18,160 thoughts that we do when we're getting our friends out of 499 00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,480 messes. And the next day, you know, she 500 00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,360 was really, really heartbroken. I didn't really even realize. 501 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,520 I just thought she was drunk until later, how heartbroken she 502 00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:31,200 was. And I was walking down the hall, 503 00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:35,840 and this young staffer walked up to me, and he said, good job. 504 00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:37,720 Thanks for that. And I'm like, what? 505 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:39,240 And he goes cleaning up that mess. 506 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:44,040 And then he walked away. And I was like, oh, my God, I'm 507 00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:46,920 part of the problem. Yeah, I'm part of the problem. 508 00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:49,160 Yeah. So she ended up going back to 509 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,520 her home state and not returning. 510 00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:56,160 And she was a very young intern who fell in love with, you know, 511 00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:59,520 her boss, I guess, and had sexual relations. 512 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,680 And he dumped her on the side of the road, so. 513 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:04,760 Can you talk about, So this is totally foreign to me. 514 00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:08,520 So I'm, I'm both curious, but also a little bit, a little bit 515 00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:12,000 horrified by it. There is a culture of women that 516 00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:15,080 are very attracted to, to particularly unattractive men 517 00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:17,200 who have power that are much older than them. 518 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:19,600 Can you talk about it especially 'cause it sounds like you were 519 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:21,760 kind of a dispassionate observer and I'd love to hear your 520 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:23,520 response. And just seeing some of your 521 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:26,320 younger colleagues, young, pretty idealistic. 522 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:32,080 Yeah, I mean, there were many like that, that thought, I mean, 523 00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:35,080 you 2 you have to remember at the time period in the 90s, 524 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:39,680 there's still this thought or traditional theory that women 525 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:42,120 were to get married and have babies and. 526 00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:44,120 And that powerful men were the way you go. 527 00:26:44,120 --> 00:26:46,080 It's almost like biological, right? 528 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,040 They go for the biggest wingspan and the birds. 529 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:52,080 And in this case, we're going for the for the most power. 530 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,440 I look at it dispassionately, probably because I was estranged 531 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:56,880 for my father for most of my life. 532 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,520 So I didn't have what you would call daddy issues. 533 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:04,000 I didn't have I I didn't idolize a daddy and I didn't think I 534 00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,240 needed one, if you know what I mean saying. 535 00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:08,240 So I just, I just wanted a partner. 536 00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:11,800 I wanted like I wanted a guy who was equal to me and could handle 537 00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:14,440 me, but I didn't want necessarily affect all the men I 538 00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:16,440 dated were my age or even a little younger. 539 00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:20,800 So I didn't want an older dude. That's just me. 540 00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:24,200 I just didn't find them attractive And but some of my 541 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:28,040 friends did and they just did. They they found that alluring. 542 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:31,400 Maybe the way they dressed, maybe the way whatever it was 543 00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:33,760 that attracted them. I it's always been a mystery to 544 00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:39,720 me, but but they did. There were several that were 545 00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:43,560 just what you're saying. They were actually doing a job, 546 00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:48,600 kind of hunting for a husband or a powerful lover that could take 547 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,280 them to the next level rather than just relying on their own 548 00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,680 skills, which which is kind of sad. 549 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:58,560 Well, I'm, I'm reflecting on this, this sort of cultural 550 00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:01,480 phenomenon. And Pretty Woman was released in 551 00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:05,040 1990, the famous Julia Roberts movie with Richard Gere. 552 00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,120 And and in a lot of ways, I see a lot of the parallels there. 553 00:28:08,120 --> 00:28:09,520 You know, he's rich, he's powerful. 554 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:12,200 He's he's kind of dashing. He's got Gray hair even at a 555 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,120 younger age, you know, and and she's yelling. 556 00:28:16,360 --> 00:28:19,400 Yeah. And and there is that phenomenon 557 00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:23,640 that was kind of an archetype or a mythology that existed in the 558 00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:26,120 90s maybe, you know, and that is kind of a throwback thing. 559 00:28:26,120 --> 00:28:28,680 I mean, it's almost vintage 50s kind of thing where women were 560 00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,320 looking for that, that kind of hero, But it wasn't a knight in 561 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:32,960 shining armor. Think about what was it Bonnie 562 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,400 Tyler that did I need a hero, Right? 563 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:38,280 It was the same kind of time. And so that's what we're 564 00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:39,640 describing. And, and I just want people to 565 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:43,240 get out of that mindset because it is so different than 20 plus 566 00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:45,960 years, 30 years from now. And I mean, like, they would 567 00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:49,400 make jokes in front of us about sex or whatever, or like they 568 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:52,320 would tell us, you know, to go get the beer, go get the wine, 569 00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:54,920 bring it to the, you know, I remember carrying cases of beer 570 00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,280 up to Panetta's office for the other staffers. 571 00:28:57,440 --> 00:28:59,920 He wasn't doing that, but it was his, you know, staff and me. 572 00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:03,720 And they'd make jokes about, they'd go through like the 573 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:08,000 resumes and, and like try to, you know, and, and joke about 574 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:09,920 what the women looked at. I mean, it's just, you know, 575 00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,240 and, and some of it I didn't, you know, I grew up with 576 00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:14,440 brothers. So I grew up with three brothers 577 00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:20,120 and I didn't have a sister to, to, you know, so I know how men 578 00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:22,400 behave. And I didn't think too much of 579 00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:24,520 that. Like I wasn't, I'm not, I don't 580 00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:26,920 like the word feminist, but I wasn't like a hardcore feminist. 581 00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:33,240 But I did want to be appreciated for my intellectual abilities 582 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:36,200 and my skills and my analytical skills. 583 00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:40,720 And that definitely wasn't happening when I was 2728 years 584 00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:41,440 old. So no. 585 00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:44,320 All right, you, you mentioned earlier predators weren't on the 586 00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:46,120 streets, they were in the halls of Congress. 587 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,680 Let's let's go there and kind of dig into that a little bit. 588 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,560 We talked about the culture. Now, you had a very unique 589 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:53,520 experience with that. And I know some people have 590 00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:55,960 asked questions about it. You and I have talked about it. 591 00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:58,880 Let's let's lay it out for people what the allegation was, 592 00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:02,400 what the you know, so they can make up their own mind about 593 00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:04,680 your story. Sure. 594 00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:10,000 Yeah, You know, I, well, it started off like this. 595 00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:13,120 You know, I didn't have any kind of rapport or relationship with 596 00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:15,440 Joe Biden. I met him, you know, I was a low 597 00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:18,080 level staffer, so I had, you know, a little bit of contact 598 00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:21,840 with him, but not a lot. He was there daily on and off. 599 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:24,480 And sometimes he'd be traveling there would be like a whole 600 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:25,800 week. I wouldn't see him, whatever. 601 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,560 And there'd be other times where I'd see him twice or three times 602 00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:30,480 in a day. You know, it just depended. 603 00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:33,200 I wouldn't necessarily interact with him. 604 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:36,360 It wasn't like a a flirtation or relationship like you heard 605 00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:38,480 about like with Monica Lewinsky or some of those things. 606 00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:44,600 Nothing like that at all. And so I thought of him, this 607 00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:48,160 office, not so much him per SE, but the office as like a 608 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,560 mentoring place where then I would make, you know, my next 609 00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:54,600 move, Like I would work here for a while and then move up. 610 00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:59,960 And that quickly changed the reality of that. 611 00:30:59,960 --> 00:31:03,440 He started making like when I would see him at a meeting, he 612 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:06,520 would put his hands on me, put him his hands on my shoulder. 613 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:10,680 And then he would rub my neck underneath my hair with his 614 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:13,480 thumb. And he would just put, you know, 615 00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:18,640 he just didn't have any kind of sense of space for people. 616 00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:21,920 And it was really unusual. No boundaries. 617 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:23,760 Yeah. And I and, and we didn't really 618 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:25,360 use the vernacular back then like that. 619 00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:28,400 It was just, it was odd. I just remember being like, God, 620 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,480 OK, Panetta never did anything like that. 621 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,720 Like, I can't even imagine him doing anything like that. 622 00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:35,880 So. So I and I only have that to 623 00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:42,520 compare to, Right. So then he kept doing things 624 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:44,920 like that and at different times. 625 00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:50,400 And then there was an incident where I walked in to where 626 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,320 Marianne was sitting and there was an argument between 627 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:57,840 Genevieve Cullen, one of the staffers, and her and another 628 00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:01,760 staffer, Tracy, who is the assistant to Marianne. 629 00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:05,880 And they were all arguing about the fact that Joe Biden wanted 630 00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:09,000 to have me serve drinks because he liked my legs and he thought 631 00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,560 I was pretty. And so who's having this 632 00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:13,040 argument? These are two women discussing 633 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:16,000 what Joe Biden had said to them. Right. 634 00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,120 And so Genevieve was sticking up for me, and she turned to me and 635 00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:22,000 she was like, in the heat of it. And she goes, Tara, you don't 636 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,000 have to do that. That's not your job. 637 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:27,520 And I'm like, OK. And I, it was like one of those 638 00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:29,600 moments where and then everyone kind of looked at me. 639 00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:31,960 I was like, there's nothing I can say that's going to be 640 00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:33,560 right. Anything I say is going to be 641 00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:36,760 wrong in this in this moment. And I just kind of froze. 642 00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:42,320 And Marianne said, you know, she gave me a look like she had this 643 00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:44,760 way of giving you a look like when she was trying to get you 644 00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:45,960 to do what you're supposed to do. 645 00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:49,000 She was my supervisor. And so I just stayed quiet. 646 00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:52,720 And then, you know, Genevieve talked to me by myself. 647 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:55,880 And then and then Marianne took me in the hallway and she said, 648 00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:58,320 you know, you've got to just keep your head down and, you 649 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:00,880 know, you go along to get along. You know, that kind of the kind 650 00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:03,120 of pep talk, right? Like this is, you know, you 651 00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:04,400 should take this as a compliment. 652 00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:06,600 You know, like he, he noticed you and you should, you know, 653 00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:08,920 whatever. And then you're 20. 654 00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:11,120 Eight years old. I'm sorry. 655 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:12,800 You're about 28 at the time. Is that? 656 00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:15,280 Yes, 27? This picture that we're flashing 657 00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:17,360 up on the screen you sent over, what, what, what age was that 658 00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:19,280 you think? That was the same age I was. 659 00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:21,720 It was like, in fact, it was taken a month before I went to 660 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:24,640 Biden's office. OK, so just so people, this is 661 00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:27,360 this is the hair, this is what the the look is that you've got. 662 00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,440 This is the this is the air. I'm looking at the clothes. 663 00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:31,240 Even the clothes is kind of reminding me of the 90s too. 664 00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:35,960 And, and so and how old is this this woman who's your boss 665 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:37,840 that's telling you what is she? She's. 50s. 666 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:42,600 OK, so she's kind of matronly and she's giving you this is how 667 00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:45,120 it works. This is what you do. 668 00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:50,120 Then I went home, of course, talked to my mom, and my mom was 669 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:52,040 furious. And she goes, that's, she 670 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:53,880 labeled it, she goes, that's sexual harassment. 671 00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:56,640 That's not OK. And I'd been calling her about 672 00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:58,960 him putting his hands on me and feeling like weird and not 673 00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:01,280 knowing how to handle it. And it put me in a weird 674 00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:03,240 situation in the office with other people. 675 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,200 You know, it was just a weird thing and. 676 00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:09,280 Then what was she saying? What would your mother say about 677 00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:09,920 that? Because that's. 678 00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:11,880 She was furious. She said I needed to make a 679 00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:14,639 complaint right then, like she was telling me right then to 680 00:34:14,639 --> 00:34:16,520 take action to put put my foot down. 681 00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:20,120 So I did in a sense. I I said, no, I'm not going to 682 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:21,800 serve drinks. I didn't want to do it. 683 00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:25,040 Marianne was furious with me. We had several, I call them our 684 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:26,560 hall meetings. She would Take Me Out in the 685 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:31,040 hallway and, like, scold me and tell me everything that I was 686 00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:34,400 supposed to be doing. And, you know, my mom was very 687 00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,000 fierce and very activist. And at this point, I was a 688 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:40,360 little more timid about that kind of thing. 689 00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:42,880 Like I was more careful. And I really wanted a career. 690 00:34:43,159 --> 00:34:46,560 And I was trying not to make this a huge deal. 691 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:48,760 I just wanted it to go away, right? 692 00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:52,120 I just thought, if I just am quiet, it'll just go away. 693 00:34:52,159 --> 00:34:55,639 And then But then by refusing, that sort of sent a message. 694 00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,440 And then things got really icy in the office. 695 00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:03,000 And so I went to talk to the chief of staff and, and told 696 00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:05,760 him, you know, I, I didn't like it, you know, and. 697 00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:09,600 Was this event that, yeah, this event you turned down, was this 698 00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:14,160 a specific party of notoriety or was it just like a a Thursday 699 00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:14,960 night kind of thing? I mean. 700 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:17,600 I don't even know what it was. It was like one of those I 701 00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:20,360 can't, I think I remember it as like a fundraising. 702 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:22,160 So off site. It would have been off site. 703 00:35:22,240 --> 00:35:24,960 I know that. But I, I remember it's kind of 704 00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:26,440 being a fundraising, but I'm not sure. 705 00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:29,160 And you're not allowed to have fundraising on the hill at that 706 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:31,360 point in that. So it was like something that 707 00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:35,880 was being done, but they, but they would often have, you know, 708 00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:39,000 they'd have staff do things differently than what their 709 00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:41,400 roles were. But this was it. 710 00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:42,920 It's just the way he presented it. 711 00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:45,920 It was not OK. So OK, so that went by, right. 712 00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,520 But then things get really frosty and then all of a sudden 713 00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:50,200 I'm, I'm being sort of frosted out. 714 00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:54,640 And but it's, it's the kind of environment where it's all hands 715 00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:56,680 on deck. It's not as rigid as it is now 716 00:35:56,680 --> 00:35:59,520 where everyone has their roles. I, you know, they were, you 717 00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:03,600 know, everybody would have to pitch in to different offices. 718 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,920 Like for instance, I was helping the assistant press secretary. 719 00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:09,360 I would go through speeches and do some editing. 720 00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:12,720 I would go take notes out of hearing, you know, we, it was 721 00:36:12,720 --> 00:36:14,560 just all hands on deck, that kind of thing. 722 00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:17,760 And so I was doing that. I was actually correcting 723 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:21,440 something on the some document or whatever. 724 00:36:21,720 --> 00:36:27,040 And I get this frantic, you know, ask from Mary Ann, she 725 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:30,360 comes running in, but she usually never does to where I 726 00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,280 was and said, can you please take this? 727 00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:37,720 He he forgot it, it was his gym bag and take it to him. 728 00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:40,280 And I I remember. Him being Joe Biden. 729 00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,600 Yes, and, and yeah, him. He's him. 730 00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:47,800 So, so, yeah. So I had to go so I go, you 731 00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:50,680 know, running after him towards the capital. 732 00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:54,760 And as I'm going down, I remember like I, I remember 733 00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:56,480 flashes. I don't remember exactly where I 734 00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:57,760 am. And one of the things that I've 735 00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:02,000 been careful about is because every day I worked there and 736 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:04,720 took sometimes different routes, sometimes the same, but it's 737 00:37:04,720 --> 00:37:07,680 like trying to remember the exact route I took. 738 00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:10,160 But I remember I went downstairs. 739 00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:12,840 I remember my shins. I had my heels on it. 740 00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:15,080 I wasn't wearing like sometimes you'll throw on tennis shoes or 741 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:18,640 different shoes because of the marble floors because they hurt. 742 00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:20,560 But anyway, I remember my shins hurting. 743 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:24,440 I remember that that distinctly like more of the physical stuff 744 00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:29,160 and going down, chasing him down and basically, and he's ahead of 745 00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:30,920 me. I see him, he's talking to 746 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:33,240 someone, they walk away. And then we're like in his 747 00:37:33,240 --> 00:37:37,200 corridor near the Capitol because we're going, you know, 748 00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:41,280 remember this is the the he is coming from the Senate building, 749 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:46,880 from the Russell building. So then, you know, I'm just 750 00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:49,600 focused on getting in this gym bag, right? 751 00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:52,400 And then going back to what I was supposed to have this 752 00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:54,360 document done. And I was really focused on that 753 00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:58,240 document, but I was also kind of like, OK, I'm going to see Joe 754 00:37:58,240 --> 00:38:00,120 Biden and hand him a gym bag, you know, whatever. 755 00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:04,480 And then he said, was that a? Remarkable thing for you at that 756 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:05,240 moment. Would that have been a 757 00:38:05,240 --> 00:38:06,840 remarkable experience for you in any way? 758 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:10,920 Well, I mean, not so much but but like, because I had just 759 00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:14,160 seen him at another meeting and I was already kind of like not 760 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:16,720 sure how I felt about him. I was already kind of like half 761 00:38:16,720 --> 00:38:19,320 liked him and half thought he was a little there was something 762 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,920 off. So I had mixed emotions, let's 763 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:24,640 put it that way. Is it good to have FaceTime with 764 00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:26,720 the senator when you're working in the office at a low level? 765 00:38:26,720 --> 00:38:28,800 Is that a A? Oh, it's huge. 766 00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:31,400 It's huge. But my interactions low level 767 00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:33,840 were kind of weird. That's so I wasn't sure what 768 00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:36,400 this was going to be and I was right to worry. 769 00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:41,600 So anyway, I handed him the gym bag and and said, you know, here 770 00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:43,200 you go, Senator. I called him senator. 771 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:46,400 I didn't call him Joe. And he recognized my name. 772 00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:50,360 You know, he said my name. And then next thing I knew, and 773 00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:56,560 this part is really hard for me to describe because it wasn't 774 00:38:56,560 --> 00:39:01,880 like, it wasn't like sequential. It was just all at once I was up 775 00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:04,760 against a wall. And I remember the coldness of 776 00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:07,640 the wall. And I remember, you know, I 777 00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:11,480 remember him being underneath my clothes, like underneath my 778 00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:15,760 shirt, underneath my skirt, like he was just, and you know, I had 779 00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:18,240 absurd thoughts. I thought, where's the gym bag? 780 00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:21,360 Like I remember thinking that, you know, which is an absurd 781 00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:24,440 thought, but that's one of my vivid memories. 782 00:39:24,440 --> 00:39:29,720 And, and he and I think I just didn't want what was happening 783 00:39:29,720 --> 00:39:32,160 to be happening. And so he was saying things to 784 00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:34,600 me and I can remember some of it, not all of it. 785 00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:40,000 And he was kissing me and leaning in and it was, and I was 786 00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:44,480 trying to pull back and I was and I remember the smell and 787 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:46,120 there was a smell that I didn't like. 788 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:48,920 It was like a dry cleaning smell. 789 00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:50,560 And even when I talk about it, I get nauseous. 790 00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:53,040 Like there's this a particular smell that if I ever smell it, I 791 00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:57,320 get like immediately, like I'll but like I didn't want him near 792 00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:04,160 me and, and he was forcing it and he used his leg to spread my 793 00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:10,400 legs and he was saying he wanted to go, you know, he wanted to 794 00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:12,320 fuck me. And he he said he got very 795 00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:14,880 graphic and he said other things and. 796 00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:18,960 How loud is he speaking? He very softly, it was like in 797 00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:21,240 my ear, he was kissing me and doing it like in my ear. 798 00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:25,200 And that's why it almost sounded in my mind echoey because it was 799 00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:29,800 like right in my ear, right and and kissing me and I'm pulling 800 00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:33,600 away this, you know, like away. And he doesn't seem to be taking 801 00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:36,320 those signals. And then he penetrated me with 802 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:40,520 his fingers, and I managed to pull away. 803 00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:44,280 And I remember, you know, my whole body was like shaking 804 00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:49,960 because it wasn't just what he was doing, but it was like he 805 00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:52,840 was, you know, it was him. And, you know, he had a lot of 806 00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:54,160 power. And it was just really 807 00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:56,040 frightening. And I just didn't want to be 808 00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:58,800 part of what he was doing. And I was saying no. 809 00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:07,120 And you know, he immediately did this thing that's really 810 00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:10,120 disconcerting. He smiles when he's angry, which 811 00:41:10,120 --> 00:41:12,840 is very disconcerting. I think a lot of the Americans 812 00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,800 have seen that recently. He he smiles when he's very 813 00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:20,840 angry and he used to do it like in meetings, if he was pissed 814 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:23,400 off at somebody or somebody pissed him off, he would smile 815 00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:25,120 and then say something through his gritted teeth. 816 00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:28,560 So anyway, at first he was saying, come on, man, I heard 817 00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:33,040 you liked me. And then in my mind I'm 818 00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:36,360 thinking, what did I do wrong? How did I get in this position? 819 00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:38,880 Immediately I'm starting to think about like all my 820 00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:42,280 behavior, like, what did I do? How did I get to this right, to 821 00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:46,280 this moment? And then he all of a sudden 822 00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:49,440 switched to that smiling and anger and had his, you know, 823 00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:54,000 finger in my face. And he said, you're nothing. 824 00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:58,720 You're nothing to me. And you're in public? 825 00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:03,080 Yeah, there's no. Around at this point yet that I 826 00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:05,800 know of maybe people were if they were I wouldn't even have 827 00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:07,520 known I was like, you know what I mean? 828 00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:10,440 I was tunnel vision into what he was, what was happening. 829 00:42:10,720 --> 00:42:14,320 And I was shaking. And I remember my legs were 830 00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:16,680 shaking so bad, it's almost like I could barely stand. 831 00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:23,120 And, and he's, he, I think, immediately realized he'd gone 832 00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:25,840 too far. Because after you said you're 833 00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:29,520 nothing, you know, a couple of times and you know, and I, he 834 00:42:29,520 --> 00:42:31,200 took me by the shoulders and he kind of shook me. 835 00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:32,880 And he said, you're fine, You're OK, you're fine. 836 00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:38,920 And then he took the gym bag and he whisked away and walked away. 837 00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:45,200 And I was just standing there, still silent and still trying to 838 00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:47,200 like, comprehend what had happened. 839 00:42:47,240 --> 00:42:50,080 And he was already off and somebody was getting his 840 00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:55,640 attention. And I remember I sunk down to 841 00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:59,560 the stairs and the stairs, it's where they have the tall 842 00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:03,640 windows. And I remember thinking it was 843 00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:08,400 just, it was horrible. I mean, I knew like what he did 844 00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:13,160 made me feel so gross. Like it just felt gross. 845 00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:21,720 Just, I felt terrible and used and, and then on top of it, I 846 00:43:21,720 --> 00:43:23,240 knew that was the end of my career. 847 00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:26,880 Like I sat there and, and, and I was processing that. 848 00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:29,760 So it wasn't just the actual assault and he and, you know, 849 00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:31,880 and, and it hurt. It's not like he, he was being 850 00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:34,560 gentle, right? It was like, you know, our knees 851 00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:36,480 clashed. So my knee was hurting. 852 00:43:37,120 --> 00:43:42,000 He, you know, he entered me with his fingers pretty violently and 853 00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:43,360 this. Was not something that you were 854 00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:47,360 physiologically prepared for. No. 855 00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:50,240 And I I couldn't even comprehend it was an assault, but it was an 856 00:43:50,240 --> 00:43:53,560 assault. And, but at the time, I didn't 857 00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:57,360 even think of it in those terms. I just, I was just trying to 858 00:43:57,360 --> 00:43:58,800 assimilate it. It was really hard. 859 00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:01,040 And I knew in that moment my career was over. 860 00:44:01,040 --> 00:44:05,520 Like it was over. It's just I, I can't because 861 00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:08,400 though how angry he got and because he have how powerful he 862 00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:12,560 was, I just had this moment that I knew my life was was forever 863 00:44:12,560 --> 00:44:13,960 changed. Like that was it? 864 00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:17,480 It was just sort of the sinking feeling and. 865 00:44:18,320 --> 00:44:20,160 As you sat on the stairs, what what was your next move? 866 00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:21,400 Where did you go next physically? 867 00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:26,280 I, I went to the bathroom and cleaned up a bit and then I got 868 00:44:26,280 --> 00:44:28,720 home and that part I, it's so odd. 869 00:44:28,720 --> 00:44:31,080 I don't remember going back. I had to have gone back to the 870 00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:33,800 office to get my purse, but I don't remember it at all. 871 00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:36,360 Like, I just remember the next thing I remember is being home 872 00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:42,000 and I was talking to my mom on the phone and she was screaming 873 00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:44,480 at me and we got in this huge argument because she wanted me 874 00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:47,680 to go right then to the police. Well, before I called her, I had 875 00:44:47,680 --> 00:44:52,000 taken a shower and I had like taken a shower and I'd like 876 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,320 taken all my clothes, including my shoes and put them in a 877 00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:58,320 garbage bag and took them down to a dumpster. 878 00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:00,760 Like, I, I mean, I didn't even want the shoes I had on. 879 00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:03,800 It was so I was just like, I was acting without thinking, if that 880 00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:08,520 makes sense. And my mom was trying to anyway. 881 00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:11,960 And the shower thing was like, I couldn't like, I remember my 882 00:45:12,120 --> 00:45:15,040 scrubbing my face because I couldn't get rid of that smell, 883 00:45:15,040 --> 00:45:17,160 that smell that it just, it just. 884 00:45:18,120 --> 00:45:22,720 And my anyway, my mom was screaming at me to go to the 885 00:45:22,720 --> 00:45:24,600 police. And I was like, it's the Capitol 886 00:45:24,600 --> 00:45:27,400 Police. You know, they're not going to 887 00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:29,160 help me. They're not going to help. 888 00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:32,000 You know, they work for the, they work for the members of 889 00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:33,240 Congress. They don't work for us. 890 00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:35,560 What I didn't know at that time is that I could have gone to the 891 00:45:35,560 --> 00:45:38,000 Metro Police. But probably, you know, it was 892 00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:39,960 the 90s. Who knows how they would have 893 00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:41,400 treated me. Who knows what would have 894 00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,600 happened. But I didn't choose to do that. 895 00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:46,440 I should have listened to my mother and I didn't. 896 00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:49,960 She begged me. She even started sobbing on the 897 00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:52,680 phone after she got mad. And then, you know, I but I just 898 00:45:52,680 --> 00:45:55,520 wanted her to support me. I didn't want to be told what to 899 00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:57,440 do. And so we got into this like 900 00:45:57,440 --> 00:46:02,000 really bad argument. So that's how that went. 901 00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:06,280 And then within the next day, I had talked to my brother, my 902 00:46:06,280 --> 00:46:08,560 little brother. I put it in a little more 903 00:46:08,560 --> 00:46:11,080 delicate terms because he was my little brother. 904 00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:14,240 So, you know, you don't talk to your little siblings the same 905 00:46:14,240 --> 00:46:17,320 way that you do. You know, your your parent. 906 00:46:17,600 --> 00:46:21,560 And then I told my friend who worked in Kennedy's office 907 00:46:21,560 --> 00:46:26,960 actually, and, and she's one of my witnesses, She would have 908 00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:28,760 testified. She's one of my cooperating 909 00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,760 witnesses. And she she knew what was going 910 00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:34,760 on all along, like with Biden and everything and. 911 00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:37,160 This was part of the girl talk that you guys had when you were 912 00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:39,680 discussing your work. Yeah, yeah. 913 00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:42,400 And then so when I I called her when this happened at the next 914 00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:47,360 day and and I called her and she was devastated that that 915 00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:49,520 happened to me. But we knew what it was, but we 916 00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:52,760 didn't say the words. But she didn't think I should go 917 00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:54,760 to the police either. You know, she was really worried 918 00:46:54,760 --> 00:46:58,520 for me because, you know, people died, you know, like you'd hear 919 00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:02,520 about like staffers, like there was a, there was someone who I, 920 00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:05,680 I don't know, there was. You just didn't do that. 921 00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:08,640 And then later you heard about what happened to Chandra Levy. 922 00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:14,200 That was later after me, though. But still, you know, you, you, 923 00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:17,240 you just, they had too much to lose these, these men. 924 00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:20,680 And that's why, like when my my friend that I had helped, who 925 00:47:20,680 --> 00:47:23,760 was crying, you know, on the side of the road, she was giving 926 00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:26,560 ultimatums. And I remember, you know, my 927 00:47:26,560 --> 00:47:29,560 friend and I talking to her saying, look, you can't they 928 00:47:29,560 --> 00:47:31,600 have, they have everything to lose. 929 00:47:31,600 --> 00:47:35,560 Like you can't do that. Don't put yourself in that 930 00:47:35,560 --> 00:47:37,040 position. Put yourself in danger. 931 00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:39,120 I want to just take a thought, just take a beat. 932 00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:42,680 One of the things that is that is staying with me. 933 00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:47,200 One of the things that's staying with me is the fact that this is 934 00:47:47,200 --> 00:47:51,240 the 90s. There's no Internet and it was 935 00:47:51,240 --> 00:47:54,600 probably the last time and probably will be the last time 936 00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:59,240 in recorded history when people could really go disappear, when 937 00:47:59,240 --> 00:48:01,800 things could go without. There were no cell phones 938 00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:03,120 tracking your position everywhere. 939 00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:07,400 There was no DNA analysis happening for minor crimes, 940 00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:08,480 right? This wasn't a thing. 941 00:48:08,960 --> 00:48:12,000 This is a totally different world that even people that are 942 00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:15,320 my age and and older, they remember it, but it's a distant 943 00:48:15,320 --> 00:48:16,320 memory in a lot of ways. I. 944 00:48:16,920 --> 00:48:19,160 Mean. It's it's really hard to 945 00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:20,400 process. You just talked about Chandra 946 00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:21,320 Levy. I haven't heard that name 947 00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:24,640 forever. You know, there was always that, 948 00:48:24,720 --> 00:48:29,400 that weird fear that people in power could do things that maybe 949 00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:32,280 they would. There was a there was a public 950 00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:34,840 outrage that would happen that we don't have any more. 951 00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:38,360 It's assumed that people are scum today. 952 00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:40,400 I think in so many more ways, maybe the Internet has done 953 00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:42,720 that, maybe the access of pornography, whatever it is, 954 00:48:42,720 --> 00:48:45,440 there's been some cheapening in our society and our culture of 955 00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:48,560 some of the human dignities. And so it's less, we're less 956 00:48:48,560 --> 00:48:50,960 shocked. But that story would have been 957 00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,360 truly shocking at that time and would have been really 958 00:48:54,360 --> 00:48:57,480 dangerous. Yeah, and and you know, when I 959 00:48:57,480 --> 00:49:01,360 tried to talk about it to my supervisors, 'cause I did 960 00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:03,960 complain about the other part and I was going to get to the 961 00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:08,640 part of what he did, I was really shut down. 962 00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:11,240 Like they they just shut me down and they didn't. 963 00:49:11,240 --> 00:49:13,640 It's almost like they knew something happened. 964 00:49:14,600 --> 00:49:17,960 I don't know how but but one thing that do. 965 00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:20,280 You think something like this was discussed behind scenes, 966 00:49:20,280 --> 00:49:22,320 like, hey, this just happened. I just had a bad interaction. 967 00:49:22,320 --> 00:49:23,400 You guys are going to have to step on this. 968 00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:25,960 Could that have been, would that have been the kind of culture in 969 00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:26,320 the office? Well. 970 00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:29,720 You know, my friend thinks that he did it before and that 971 00:49:29,720 --> 00:49:31,040 they've had to clean up a lot of messes. 972 00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:33,360 That's what my friend thinks. I don't know. 973 00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:37,680 I know that if we can unseal those files that are all, you 974 00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:39,960 know, sealed at the University of Delaware, that'll be 975 00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:43,240 interesting to see what complaints were made because 976 00:49:43,240 --> 00:49:46,400 they're all sealed there. Rather, they have the complaints 977 00:49:46,400 --> 00:49:48,200 from the office like the personnel files. 978 00:49:48,200 --> 00:49:49,200 Why would they have those at the? 979 00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:52,400 Back then, they didn't have a protocol like they do now. 980 00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:56,080 So all of those complaints went back to the chief of staff. 981 00:49:56,240 --> 00:50:00,200 And then the chief of staff chose how to secure records and 982 00:50:00,520 --> 00:50:04,600 and Biden's office chose to put it in the University of Delaware 983 00:50:04,600 --> 00:50:06,920 and seal it. And so it's out of touch. 984 00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:09,520 You can't FOIA it because it's a university. 985 00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:16,880 And this is really pre normalized HR human relations 986 00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:18,800 type departments. I'm also just, I'm, I'm also 987 00:50:18,800 --> 00:50:21,080 thinking about the just the administrative stuff that was 988 00:50:21,080 --> 00:50:23,640 going on at that time. And I don't know, was there, was 989 00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:25,400 there a big human resources department in the? 990 00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:28,560 No, no, I mean, like, it was pretty disorganized. 991 00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:31,280 They they, they, they called it the office of counseling or 992 00:50:31,280 --> 00:50:33,200 something. So when I took the paper to 993 00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:36,520 write to make that complaint, it was something called like a 994 00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:38,480 counseling office, like this offshoot. 995 00:50:38,480 --> 00:50:41,360 It was like going to, you know, this window and you filled out a 996 00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:43,720 form almost like you're going to the dentist or doctor, right? 997 00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:49,160 Like an intake form. And I filled it out and I did 998 00:50:49,160 --> 00:50:52,360 not talk about, I know that I didn't talk about the assault. 999 00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:54,120 I talked about, you know, the other stuff. 1000 00:50:54,560 --> 00:50:59,440 And, you know, I wanted to talk face to face with someone about 1001 00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:03,520 the what happened. And I didn't get a, no one 1002 00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:06,760 followed up, no one called. But what was interesting was one 1003 00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:13,400 of the the assistant press secretary who worked with Evelyn 1004 00:51:13,400 --> 00:51:18,000 Lieberman, who is the press secretary for Joe Biden, knew me 1005 00:51:18,000 --> 00:51:21,440 and he actually was dating one of the interns that I hired. 1006 00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:24,680 So again, like it's just through the atmosphere. 1007 00:51:24,680 --> 00:51:26,760 It's just crazy. But anyway, so I'm seeing them 1008 00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:30,840 out and we're out actually. And he said matter of factly to 1009 00:51:30,840 --> 00:51:34,200 me, when he found out that I had filed this paper, he said, Tara, 1010 00:51:34,200 --> 00:51:37,040 we will fucking destroy you. Direct quote. 1011 00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:41,760 Direct quote. So how do you go back to work in 1012 00:51:41,760 --> 00:51:44,320 that kind of an environment? It was pretty hard. 1013 00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:47,320 In fact, what they did was they made it seem like if they turn 1014 00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:49,240 it around so much, like they made it seem like it was my 1015 00:51:49,240 --> 00:51:51,040 fault. Like I had these meetings where 1016 00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:53,360 I was told that I wasn't dressed properly and I had to wear 1017 00:51:53,360 --> 00:51:59,120 longer dresses and not show my cleavage and things like that. 1018 00:51:59,120 --> 00:52:02,600 And then I was told I was taken. The intern duties were 1019 00:52:02,600 --> 00:52:05,200 immediately taken from me. I was put into a room with no 1020 00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:08,480 windows and had to. And I was told my job was to get 1021 00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:12,440 a job. And my supervisor said, you come 1022 00:52:12,440 --> 00:52:14,880 to me even if you have to go to the restroom, you don't leave 1023 00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:17,560 this office. And that all changed from the 1024 00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:18,760 time that you filed your complaint? 1025 00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:21,920 Oh yeah, that's that, that was after, right after. 1026 00:52:21,920 --> 00:52:26,200 That's all that what happened. And then I was applying for 1027 00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:29,880 other offices obviously, and no one would even interview me. 1028 00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:32,200 That's the black ball feeling you. 1029 00:52:32,280 --> 00:52:36,800 You went from someone saying do your job, go along to get along. 1030 00:52:37,040 --> 00:52:38,840 You have nice legs and so therefore you should be 1031 00:52:38,840 --> 00:52:40,920 delivering drinks at a fundraiser because that's what 1032 00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:42,280 the big man wants. That's what the guy who's 1033 00:52:42,360 --> 00:52:45,840 running the office says to you need to cover your cleavage and 1034 00:52:45,840 --> 00:52:48,640 you need to wear longer skirts and sit in A and ask for 1035 00:52:48,640 --> 00:52:50,520 permission to go pee. Is that accurate? 1036 00:52:51,320 --> 00:52:54,240 Yeah, that's pretty much it. What are you feeling at that 1037 00:52:54,240 --> 00:52:57,320 time? Pretty classic, you know, 1038 00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:00,760 retribution and, and all that stuff. 1039 00:53:01,760 --> 00:53:03,240 But I never saw the light of day, right? 1040 00:53:03,320 --> 00:53:09,600 So, so I went about my, my life. And then in 2019, I saw a young 1041 00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:13,680 politician named Lucy Flores getting torn to pieces by the 1042 00:53:13,680 --> 00:53:18,080 press because she dared to say she didn't like Joe Biden 1043 00:53:18,080 --> 00:53:19,840 kissing the top of her head without her permission and 1044 00:53:19,840 --> 00:53:22,800 putting his hands on her. And, you know, she thought of 1045 00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:24,800 him as like grandfather. At least she wasn't trying to 1046 00:53:24,800 --> 00:53:27,280 imply that it was sexual, but it creeped her out, right? 1047 00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:30,440 Then you had seven other women that had similar stories. 1048 00:53:30,720 --> 00:53:33,520 Well, there's even more, you know, and if you dig, there's 1049 00:53:33,520 --> 00:53:36,160 more. There's a Secret Service person 1050 00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:40,480 who complained that he would strip down naked in front of her 1051 00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,600 and swim laps and, and just the way he did it probably. 1052 00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:45,000 And we can imagine because I know. 1053 00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:46,920 I can imagine because I know how he acted. 1054 00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:51,560 He just thought of women as, as objects When when he did what he 1055 00:53:51,560 --> 00:53:55,120 did to me, it's not like there was emotion behind it. 1056 00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:58,040 I felt like I was just in the wrong place at the wrong time 1057 00:53:58,080 --> 00:54:00,920 almost. But it was like he wanted 1058 00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:03,640 pleasure in that moment. And I was in front of him and 1059 00:54:03,640 --> 00:54:05,120 that's what he wanted. That's it. 1060 00:54:05,720 --> 00:54:08,040 There was no like, he wasn't trying to woo me. 1061 00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:09,320 He wasn't trying to have an affair with me. 1062 00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:12,520 It was just basically he was trying to, you know. 1063 00:54:12,520 --> 00:54:15,280 Yeah. Do you do you remember that 1064 00:54:15,280 --> 00:54:20,000 movie Back to the Future? Oh gosh, vaguely. 1065 00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:22,880 Yeah. Yeah, I do with what's his name? 1066 00:54:24,600 --> 00:54:26,160 Marty McFly. He's wearing the vest. 1067 00:54:26,160 --> 00:54:27,920 What is his name? I know he has Parkinson. 1068 00:54:27,920 --> 00:54:29,200 Now I can't. Why can't I not think of his 1069 00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:30,960 name? But yeah, I can either, sorry. 1070 00:54:31,400 --> 00:54:32,600 Michael J Fox. It's Michael. 1071 00:54:32,600 --> 00:54:36,880 J Fox's. Great movie, 80s heroism, all 1072 00:54:36,880 --> 00:54:40,840 this kind of thing. I get this weird sense of 1073 00:54:40,840 --> 00:54:43,400 watching from the outside and I don't know if it's real or not, 1074 00:54:43,400 --> 00:54:44,600 but maybe it's just the stories I've read. 1075 00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:48,120 Maybe it's from talking to you. I see the bad guy in there, the 1076 00:54:48,120 --> 00:54:49,520 villain. The bully's name is Biff. 1077 00:54:49,520 --> 00:54:52,840 Do you remember Biff? Yeah, yeah. 1078 00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:56,320 And one of the things that I recall being so upset about when 1079 00:54:56,320 --> 00:55:00,840 I was a kid watching this was the way that he takes Marty 1080 00:55:00,840 --> 00:55:03,760 Mcfly's date, who's actually his mom, right? 1081 00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:05,000 Because it's the fact of the future. 1082 00:55:05,680 --> 00:55:08,040 But he takes her out of the dance and this is that classic 1083 00:55:08,040 --> 00:55:11,480 bully mentality. And he throws her in the car and 1084 00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:14,760 he's going up her very like ruffled poodle dress or whatever 1085 00:55:14,760 --> 00:55:16,720 it was. And he's reaching and he's 1086 00:55:16,760 --> 00:55:18,720 putting his hands on her in the car. 1087 00:55:18,720 --> 00:55:20,600 That's the classic like, get your damn hands off her. 1088 00:55:20,600 --> 00:55:22,640 And you know, the guy who's getting his arm beaten, you 1089 00:55:22,640 --> 00:55:25,240 know, hits him in the face. And that's the 80s story of 1090 00:55:25,240 --> 00:55:29,480 redemption, you know, and yet that that bully has been around 1091 00:55:29,640 --> 00:55:31,360 forever. It's a archetype. 1092 00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:33,880 And I don't know why I think of Joe Biden in that way in a lot 1093 00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:35,400 of ways. But the way that he seems to put 1094 00:55:35,480 --> 00:55:38,400 hands on women and the way that he acts about people and the way 1095 00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:40,680 that he talks, I'll take somebody out behind the gym. 1096 00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:42,960 That has always inspired me that. 1097 00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:44,560 And like I said, I don't know where it comes from, but. 1098 00:55:45,640 --> 00:55:49,000 On the hot mic, he said a few months ago he said no one fucks 1099 00:55:49,000 --> 00:55:51,400 with a Biden. Right, that's attitude though. 1100 00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:52,680 What? About the President of the 1101 00:55:52,680 --> 00:55:54,320 United States, That's like the mafia. 1102 00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:56,120 Yeah. I mean it's. 1103 00:55:56,120 --> 00:55:59,280 A cartoon bully from a from a 50s movie. 1104 00:55:59,760 --> 00:56:03,480 An 80s movie showing throwback. Me, he seemed very frat boy. 1105 00:56:04,080 --> 00:56:08,120 Very frat boy OK like, but the privileged, violent kind. 1106 00:56:09,320 --> 00:56:11,560 But that is the thing that we see in colleges like where you 1107 00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:13,640 think about, it's like the, the, the sexual predator move. 1108 00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:16,320 It's not like it's about lust and it's not about excitement 1109 00:56:16,320 --> 00:56:19,320 or, or love for somebody or even an attraction to it. 1110 00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:21,720 It's that that's the old thing we used to hear about in the 90s 1111 00:56:21,720 --> 00:56:24,200 about how sexual assault or rape is about power. 1112 00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:29,960 Because I can attitude, right? And, and you just mentioned, and 1113 00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:32,160 I, I heard the way you described it and I've, I visualized it. 1114 00:56:32,160 --> 00:56:34,400 I've taken sexual assault interviews from the, you know, 1115 00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:37,080 from the receiving end of it as a as law enforcement and also as 1116 00:56:37,080 --> 00:56:39,200 a paramedic. And those don't sound like 1117 00:56:39,200 --> 00:56:41,440 somebody who was figuring out what his move was. 1118 00:56:41,920 --> 00:56:43,760 That was the guy that knew how to put the moves on somebody. 1119 00:56:44,560 --> 00:56:46,680 And correct me if I'm wrong. And that's the way you described 1120 00:56:46,720 --> 00:56:47,560 it to me. That's what I heard. 1121 00:56:47,600 --> 00:56:49,040 You tell me if I'm not hearing it correctly. 1122 00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:53,760 It, it did seem looking back in retrospect, in the middle of it, 1123 00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:57,240 I couldn't really tell, but like looking back though, the way he 1124 00:56:57,240 --> 00:56:59,920 immediately kind of put it off on me, like, hey man, I heard 1125 00:56:59,920 --> 00:57:02,360 you liked me. Like immediately blaming me like 1126 00:57:02,360 --> 00:57:04,920 I'm right. And that I I. 1127 00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:06,960 And you said you thought this wasn't the first time it 1128 00:57:06,960 --> 00:57:09,560 happened. So you said you thought that 1129 00:57:09,560 --> 00:57:10,800 wasn't the first time it happened. 1130 00:57:10,800 --> 00:57:13,800 And and there's a reason why you think that way, but I I'm just 1131 00:57:13,800 --> 00:57:18,000 trying to suss that out. Yeah, I think, I think he was 1132 00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:21,200 very, because I look back at it now and it was the way he walked 1133 00:57:21,200 --> 00:57:22,760 away. He didn't look back. 1134 00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:26,520 He didn't like, he just literally walked away and then 1135 00:57:26,520 --> 00:57:29,200 went on. And I heard him jovially way 1136 00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:31,360 down, you know, because you can hear the echoing down the 1137 00:57:31,840 --> 00:57:33,680 hallway when he met up with someone. 1138 00:57:34,200 --> 00:57:36,200 It's like it didn't happen. It didn't exist. 1139 00:57:36,760 --> 00:57:40,160 Like he just got It was like an annoyance like OK, that didn't 1140 00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:42,200 work out. That annoyed my day. 1141 00:57:42,200 --> 00:57:44,040 Now I'm going to go do this. Right. 1142 00:57:44,760 --> 00:57:46,560 Yeah, it was going to go one way, but the day goes another 1143 00:57:46,560 --> 00:57:49,160 way. Yeah, Yeah. 1144 00:57:49,160 --> 00:57:53,000 There was no like, yeah. And now looking back at that, 1145 00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:57,360 now seeing him actually the way he is now, even though I know 1146 00:57:57,360 --> 00:58:00,920 that he's different now, he seems much weaker and he seems 1147 00:58:00,920 --> 00:58:05,320 obviously mentally, you know, like in a decline, but still 1148 00:58:05,320 --> 00:58:07,040 there's that element of arrogance. 1149 00:58:07,400 --> 00:58:09,400 It was the arrogance. That's what I was trying the 1150 00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:10,760 word. I was trying to look for just 1151 00:58:10,760 --> 00:58:13,320 this arrogance. Like he's above the law. 1152 00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:17,040 He can do whatever he wants. Yeah, the word that keeps 1153 00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:18,720 getting suggested, especially the culture you're talking 1154 00:58:18,720 --> 00:58:21,600 about, is entitlement. It seems like that's that's kind 1155 00:58:21,600 --> 00:58:26,400 of the the air of it. So you're looking for other 1156 00:58:26,400 --> 00:58:27,880 jobs, you're getting blackballed. 1157 00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:29,240 You're not getting other options. 1158 00:58:29,480 --> 00:58:34,280 What do you do? Well, I was with somebody at 1159 00:58:34,280 --> 00:58:35,960 that point. I probably wouldn't have gone 1160 00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:39,360 with him had I not been just assaulted. 1161 00:58:39,360 --> 00:58:44,080 And, you know, I, I made a bad choice with my ex-husband that I 1162 00:58:44,080 --> 00:58:47,040 ended up going with who he worked for another senator, 1163 00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:51,520 another Democrat, and we went off together and I went back to 1164 00:58:51,520 --> 00:58:56,520 California and we were married and I had my daughter and I 1165 00:58:56,640 --> 00:59:00,680 worked for Jack O'Connell, who was a state senator. 1166 00:59:01,480 --> 00:59:06,080 And when I was hired, I, of course, put down the reference 1167 00:59:06,080 --> 00:59:08,640 because the agreement was they would give me a reference. 1168 00:59:10,040 --> 00:59:12,360 That was the agreement I had with Ted Kaufman when I left. 1169 00:59:12,360 --> 00:59:14,640 Because, you know, I did have that file. 1170 00:59:14,640 --> 00:59:17,280 I did get a little pushed back a little bit. 1171 00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:21,920 I should have pushed back much harder, but I did push a bit on 1172 00:59:21,920 --> 00:59:23,440 Ted Kaufman and had a meeting with him. 1173 00:59:24,800 --> 00:59:29,320 And so I go, I get hired by Jack O'Connell. 1174 00:59:29,560 --> 00:59:33,480 Right. And before I get hired, though, 1175 00:59:34,040 --> 00:59:37,120 the chief of staff, Gavin, what's his last name? 1176 00:59:37,120 --> 00:59:39,080 Gavin. I can't remember his last name. 1177 00:59:40,200 --> 00:59:41,800 I almost said Gavin Newsom. That's the governor. 1178 00:59:42,360 --> 00:59:44,600 Yeah, it was Gavin. I can't remember his last name, 1179 00:59:44,600 --> 00:59:47,880 but he was the chief of staff there for, for O'Connell. 1180 00:59:47,880 --> 00:59:52,680 And he calls me up and he goes, Tara, you know, we were just 1181 00:59:52,680 --> 00:59:55,520 about to hire you. And then we got a bad reference 1182 00:59:55,960 --> 00:59:58,160 from Biden's office. And I said, really? 1183 00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:00,720 I said, could you do me a favor, Gavin? 1184 01:00:00,720 --> 01:00:03,440 Could you give me 30 minutes? And he said, sure. 1185 01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:08,120 OK. And so we hung up and I called 1186 01:00:08,120 --> 01:00:14,240 up Dennis Toner and who is my one of my supervisors. 1187 01:00:14,240 --> 01:00:17,040 And I reamed him out. I lost my temper on the phone. 1188 01:00:17,040 --> 01:00:19,680 And I said, you fucking get on that phone and you give him a 1189 01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:21,000 good reference. I have a baby. 1190 01:00:21,640 --> 01:00:25,520 And I will, I will blast you. I will, you know, you made an 1191 01:00:25,520 --> 01:00:28,400 agreement. And anyway, so then I get a call 1192 01:00:28,400 --> 01:00:31,080 20 minutes later from O'connell's office. 1193 01:00:31,560 --> 01:00:36,520 I mean, and they said, wow, we just got a call from Joe Biden's 1194 01:00:36,520 --> 01:00:38,000 office. And they were effusive and 1195 01:00:38,000 --> 01:00:40,800 apologized and said they didn't remember exactly who we were 1196 01:00:40,800 --> 01:00:42,960 talking about. And now they do and went on and 1197 01:00:42,960 --> 01:00:46,080 gave you a great reference. And we just decided anybody that 1198 01:00:46,080 --> 01:00:49,040 can get them to call back with that quickly deserves to be 1199 01:00:49,040 --> 01:00:50,280 hired. So I got that job. 1200 01:00:51,560 --> 01:00:53,800 And that is a skill set, so well done on that I guess. 1201 01:00:54,640 --> 01:00:57,120 I know and it's funny because I don't know if it was hormones or 1202 01:00:57,120 --> 01:00:59,880 what 'cause I just had a baby, but I was like you will fucking 1203 01:00:59,880 --> 01:01:03,400 give me a good preference. So I got tough. 1204 01:01:03,840 --> 01:01:05,520 Yeah, and there is something to be said. 1205 01:01:05,520 --> 01:01:07,200 You you start messing around with a Mama bear. 1206 01:01:08,120 --> 01:01:09,760 Yeah. We all know how that goes. 1207 01:01:10,760 --> 01:01:12,200 That was still in a Democrat's office. 1208 01:01:13,120 --> 01:01:15,520 Yes, I was still in a Democrat's office. 1209 01:01:15,520 --> 01:01:18,600 Still hadn't learned my lesson. Well, that being said, you, you 1210 01:01:18,600 --> 01:01:21,480 spent pretty much most of your adult life or at least certainly 1211 01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:24,120 your, your professional life working for Democrats. 1212 01:01:24,560 --> 01:01:28,240 And you mentioned was it Flores, you said that you didn't you 1213 01:01:28,240 --> 01:01:29,800 heard in 2019? Yes. 1214 01:01:29,840 --> 01:01:32,840 And you know, after that what I did was I, because of the 1215 01:01:32,840 --> 01:01:36,480 situation with my ex-husband, I, I'd moved to Seattle, we had a 1216 01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:39,160 very contentious divorce. His rights were terminated with 1217 01:01:39,160 --> 01:01:40,960 my daughter. And it was, it was pretty 1218 01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:43,720 abusive. And I ended up getting trained 1219 01:01:43,720 --> 01:01:47,480 by Seattle Police Department as a Victim Support person for 1220 01:01:47,480 --> 01:01:50,800 domestic violence victims. And I ended up going to law 1221 01:01:50,800 --> 01:01:53,440 school at Seattle U, went to law school, studied international 1222 01:01:53,440 --> 01:01:56,840 relations and got back into that geopolitical kind of world that 1223 01:01:56,840 --> 01:01:59,040 I liked a little bit with those classes. 1224 01:01:59,320 --> 01:02:03,160 And then also was an expert witness later on for, for 1225 01:02:03,160 --> 01:02:08,320 domestic violence victims and, and then even testified before 1226 01:02:08,320 --> 01:02:11,120 the Washington state legislature to help with laws that would 1227 01:02:11,120 --> 01:02:14,040 help victims of domestic violence. 1228 01:02:14,520 --> 01:02:16,720 And that was really gratifying work. 1229 01:02:16,720 --> 01:02:20,480 I really enjoyed it. And anyway, I was raising my 1230 01:02:20,480 --> 01:02:26,120 daughter and then she was during 2019. 1231 01:02:26,120 --> 01:02:28,680 She's an adult now, right? She's at this point, she's an 1232 01:02:28,680 --> 01:02:32,240 adult. And I see Lucy Flores from 1233 01:02:32,240 --> 01:02:34,920 Nevada just get torn to pieces along with the other women. 1234 01:02:34,920 --> 01:02:37,360 They're calling them lunatics and all these names, you know, 1235 01:02:37,360 --> 01:02:39,440 the Democratic press was just going after them. 1236 01:02:39,480 --> 01:02:43,040 And I knew what they were doing. They're planting articles, you 1237 01:02:43,040 --> 01:02:45,520 know, And my friend called me from DC, the one who was a 1238 01:02:45,520 --> 01:02:48,240 witness, and she said, Tara, did you see what they said? 1239 01:02:48,240 --> 01:02:54,280 They said that no one, no former employee of Biden has ever made 1240 01:02:54,280 --> 01:02:56,200 a complaint against him. And I said, yeah, I know. 1241 01:02:56,200 --> 01:02:58,320 I saw. And she said, are you going to 1242 01:02:58,320 --> 01:03:00,800 do something? And I said, yeah, I probably am. 1243 01:03:01,360 --> 01:03:02,480 So I did. I was. 1244 01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:05,680 Telling you this again, this is your friend from the yeah that 1245 01:03:05,680 --> 01:03:08,120 was living in the same. Dormant. 1246 01:03:08,120 --> 01:03:11,640 No, she, she, she was married and, you know, moved on with her 1247 01:03:11,640 --> 01:03:13,280 life, but she's living in Virginia. 1248 01:03:13,280 --> 01:03:14,480 And she was living there at the time. 1249 01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:17,920 She was in the DC vicinity. Yeah. 1250 01:03:17,920 --> 01:03:19,000 But she was. Yes, she was. 1251 01:03:19,080 --> 01:03:21,480 Yeah. We were all there, you know, So 1252 01:03:21,480 --> 01:03:23,760 she, we've stayed in touch over the years, even though I went 1253 01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:26,680 back to California and moved all over and, you know, but we 1254 01:03:26,680 --> 01:03:32,400 stayed in touch. So it was interesting because it 1255 01:03:32,400 --> 01:03:35,720 was really difficult for me again to come forward. 1256 01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:37,560 It had never occurred to me to go to the press. 1257 01:03:37,560 --> 01:03:41,800 I had told people in my life over the years, but I did. 1258 01:03:42,560 --> 01:03:46,920 And it hit the local press first because I went to like, just a 1259 01:03:46,920 --> 01:03:48,880 local newspaper and they published it. 1260 01:03:48,880 --> 01:03:53,240 And then, of course, it went to the bigger papers. 1261 01:03:53,240 --> 01:03:58,240 And I put my toe in the water. I was just like, so scared. 1262 01:03:58,240 --> 01:04:01,360 I talked about the harassment, but I didn't get into the sexual 1263 01:04:01,360 --> 01:04:06,720 assault. And finally I got a hold of Lisa 1264 01:04:06,720 --> 01:04:11,240 Layer from Layer from New York Times and during the summer and 1265 01:04:11,240 --> 01:04:15,040 I said, you know, there's something more and I just I just 1266 01:04:15,040 --> 01:04:18,400 have to say it, but I I need, you know, I was scared to do it. 1267 01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:23,960 And she said she got the message and I actually had was sorry she 1268 01:04:23,960 --> 01:04:25,640 didn't get it. I had called Ronan Farrow. 1269 01:04:25,640 --> 01:04:29,480 He didn't get a hold of me. He didn't know he had gotten the 1270 01:04:29,480 --> 01:04:33,680 messages. And so anyway, she got back to 1271 01:04:33,680 --> 01:04:36,440 me eventually. But besides that, I went to 1272 01:04:36,440 --> 01:04:37,560 Time's Up. And I went. 1273 01:04:37,560 --> 01:04:40,240 Time's Up is this organization that's supposed to help women 1274 01:04:40,680 --> 01:04:43,920 who have, you know, coming forward about powerful abusers. 1275 01:04:43,920 --> 01:04:47,520 And I was really wanting insulation to do this. 1276 01:04:47,520 --> 01:04:51,640 I wanted a lawyer and I wanted, you know, protection a bit. 1277 01:04:52,520 --> 01:04:54,760 And so my case was accepted initially. 1278 01:04:55,520 --> 01:05:01,920 And come to find out that Tina Chen was fundraising for Biden 1279 01:05:01,920 --> 01:05:06,480 and I didn't know it. And Hilary Rosen and who was 1280 01:05:06,480 --> 01:05:09,720 former Obama was was for, you know, of course, for Biden. 1281 01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:15,160 And then, you know, they were all working for Joe Biden 1282 01:05:15,160 --> 01:05:20,200 basically and on the payroll. So Knickerbocker, the public 1283 01:05:20,200 --> 01:05:25,800 relations firm, was actually received millions of dollars, 1284 01:05:25,800 --> 01:05:30,680 according to FEC, from the Biden campaign during the time I was 1285 01:05:30,680 --> 01:05:33,600 telling the story to them. You brought your story to a 1286 01:05:33,600 --> 01:05:36,240 group that was supposed to protect women from powerful men 1287 01:05:36,480 --> 01:05:39,160 that had also taken money from a powerful man that you were 1288 01:05:39,160 --> 01:05:42,240 making an allegation against. Yeah, so Anita Dunn was running 1289 01:05:42,240 --> 01:05:44,400 that and and so they never told me about the conflict of 1290 01:05:44,400 --> 01:05:45,520 interest. And then they said, oh, well, 1291 01:05:45,520 --> 01:05:48,720 this case is too political. And come to find out, because 1292 01:05:48,800 --> 01:05:52,280 Ryan Grimm exposed it, exposed Time's Up, and then later the 1293 01:05:52,280 --> 01:05:55,880 New York Times finally exposed them that they were working for 1294 01:05:55,880 --> 01:05:59,360 Biden the whole time. And they went after the Cuomo 1295 01:05:59,360 --> 01:06:00,920 survivors and they went after me. 1296 01:06:01,000 --> 01:06:05,240 And they literally brought, they literally just strung me along 1297 01:06:05,240 --> 01:06:08,880 so that they could get all the information from me and who my 1298 01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:11,560 witnesses were and anything they could extract. 1299 01:06:12,920 --> 01:06:16,840 And I remember the last thing they said to me was, can you 1300 01:06:16,840 --> 01:06:18,880 tell us any other names? Can you give us names of other 1301 01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:22,880 women regarding Biden? Because Biden's campaign was 1302 01:06:22,880 --> 01:06:24,080 scared. They knew, right? 1303 01:06:24,640 --> 01:06:29,080 And I didn't, of course. And, you know, now Time's Up has 1304 01:06:29,080 --> 01:06:34,000 been dismantled for corruption. Yeah. 1305 01:06:34,960 --> 01:06:40,360 Do me a favor and walk me back a couple of steps because you said 1306 01:06:40,360 --> 01:06:41,880 something that I think will be interesting to folks. 1307 01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:48,200 You took a job as a domestic violence victim advocate. 1308 01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:50,200 Is that did I say it correctly? Correct. 1309 01:06:51,240 --> 01:06:54,000 What drove you to that field and what sort of knowledge did you 1310 01:06:54,000 --> 01:06:57,760 gain by doing that work that affected your maybe 2019 1311 01:06:57,760 --> 01:06:59,600 decision? Well, what? 1312 01:07:00,000 --> 01:07:04,960 Well, that this as far as you know, because I was, I did 1313 01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:08,640 survive some pretty bad abuse for my ex-husband. 1314 01:07:08,640 --> 01:07:12,280 And, you know, in our family, my dad was pretty abusive. 1315 01:07:12,760 --> 01:07:17,200 And the training really helped me understand the dynamic of 1316 01:07:17,200 --> 01:07:19,320 power and control, which I didn't really understand until 1317 01:07:19,320 --> 01:07:21,520 that training. You know, I had, you know, 1318 01:07:21,720 --> 01:07:23,960 different kinds of trainings. But when you train with the 1319 01:07:23,960 --> 01:07:26,400 Seattle Police Department for domestic violence, it's a very 1320 01:07:26,400 --> 01:07:31,720 specific kind of training. And it also allowed me to look 1321 01:07:31,720 --> 01:07:34,560 at things more objectively instead of emotionally. 1322 01:07:34,560 --> 01:07:38,000 So it really gave me that distance to look at things as a 1323 01:07:38,000 --> 01:07:40,560 bigger picture. So you're not just, I don't 1324 01:07:40,560 --> 01:07:43,920 know, reliving your own story or your own kind of bad experience, 1325 01:07:43,920 --> 01:07:48,280 but you're actually empathizing with other people, trying to 1326 01:07:48,280 --> 01:07:51,800 help other people and, and getting out of your own self, 1327 01:07:51,800 --> 01:07:54,880 trying to do the bigger picture, if that makes sense. 1328 01:07:56,880 --> 01:07:59,520 So again, it was kind of like another public service thing, 1329 01:07:59,520 --> 01:08:03,160 but it was important to me to give back because I had been 1330 01:08:03,160 --> 01:08:05,760 helped when I was in domestic violence and my daughter and I 1331 01:08:05,760 --> 01:08:09,320 were were very much helped and I was able to go to law school, 1332 01:08:10,280 --> 01:08:12,680 you know, and, and work and, and move on. 1333 01:08:12,960 --> 01:08:17,040 So I wanted to give that opportunity to others as well. 1334 01:08:18,000 --> 01:08:21,439 When I saw, you know, and then with me too movement, I thought 1335 01:08:21,439 --> 01:08:27,240 I had this structure around me to speak out, whereas before it 1336 01:08:27,240 --> 01:08:30,080 never occurred to me to talk about what happened with Biden 1337 01:08:30,120 --> 01:08:31,840 to the media. I mean, it never even occurred 1338 01:08:31,840 --> 01:08:34,279 to me. My daughter, I would never while 1339 01:08:34,279 --> 01:08:36,000 she was in school, I would never have done that. 1340 01:08:37,439 --> 01:08:42,319 But also, I just felt like there was no mechanism to do that, if 1341 01:08:42,319 --> 01:08:45,520 that makes sense. And with the Me Too movement, I 1342 01:08:45,520 --> 01:08:47,800 felt like, OK, we're talking about this. 1343 01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:51,120 This happened. I experienced this from a person 1344 01:08:51,120 --> 01:08:53,479 who's running for office. And you have to recall, too, 1345 01:08:53,680 --> 01:08:56,160 during the time that I came forward, he wasn't the only 1346 01:08:56,160 --> 01:08:59,240 candidate and he wasn't the necessarily the pick. 1347 01:09:00,600 --> 01:09:02,120 Right there was a whole primary season going on. 1348 01:09:02,279 --> 01:09:08,319 Yeah, so I was trying to sound the warning alarm, and I've been 1349 01:09:08,319 --> 01:09:09,920 trying to sound it for a long time. 1350 01:09:09,920 --> 01:09:13,439 And I said this guy's a monster and he was my monster. 1351 01:09:13,439 --> 01:09:16,319 And now he's like the whole world's monster and taking us 1352 01:09:16,319 --> 01:09:18,760 close to World War Three. I you know. 1353 01:09:19,160 --> 01:09:21,399 I want to get into your activism in the middle too, because I 1354 01:09:21,399 --> 01:09:24,080 think that all plays into your current situation where you are. 1355 01:09:24,240 --> 01:09:26,760 I want to dig one more question about the training that you got 1356 01:09:26,760 --> 01:09:28,720 while you were doing that work. Did you guys discuss the 1357 01:09:28,720 --> 01:09:32,680 physiological and psychological reactions and the way the body 1358 01:09:32,680 --> 01:09:36,319 responds to either acute or long term trauma? 1359 01:09:37,800 --> 01:09:40,040 You know, we talked about the cycle of violence. 1360 01:09:40,040 --> 01:09:43,439 That was more the key of, and then with the cycle of violence 1361 01:09:43,439 --> 01:09:46,319 is, and I wish we had I, I, if I'd known we were going to talk 1362 01:09:46,319 --> 01:09:48,760 about this, I would have it that it's a Duluth model. 1363 01:09:49,000 --> 01:09:52,439 But basically it talks about the height, like when you're in a 1364 01:09:52,439 --> 01:09:56,000 cycle of violence with someone, an intimate partner, about how 1365 01:09:56,320 --> 01:09:58,720 you know, you'll go through like a honeymoon period and 1366 01:09:58,720 --> 01:10:00,760 everything will seem fine. And then it built, the tension 1367 01:10:00,760 --> 01:10:02,680 builds and then there's an explosion of violence. 1368 01:10:03,680 --> 01:10:06,200 So it was more, it was, it was like that. 1369 01:10:07,400 --> 01:10:10,840 I, you know, again, these were trainings, but they weren't 1370 01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:12,960 deep. You know, I didn't, I've never 1371 01:10:12,960 --> 01:10:14,800 taken psychology or anything like that. 1372 01:10:14,800 --> 01:10:17,680 So I can't really speak to that. I'm curious if you dealt with 1373 01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:20,440 victims, yeah, in close proximity to physical violence 1374 01:10:20,440 --> 01:10:22,920 with themselves and ever dealt with the shaking you mentioned. 1375 01:10:22,920 --> 01:10:24,480 I've heard you mentioned in every interview I've seen you 1376 01:10:24,480 --> 01:10:27,040 talk about it, and I'm curious if you know much about what was 1377 01:10:27,040 --> 01:10:31,280 going on there. I think personally, I think I 1378 01:10:31,280 --> 01:10:37,040 was in shock, but I, I, because I felt cold and I've been in 1379 01:10:37,040 --> 01:10:40,360 physical shock before from an injury and it felt like that. 1380 01:10:40,840 --> 01:10:42,600 It felt very similar just like that. 1381 01:10:42,600 --> 01:10:46,160 So I, I, I would say it's like that. 1382 01:10:46,360 --> 01:10:50,200 What I did learn is that people, victims like of domestic 1383 01:10:50,200 --> 01:10:52,600 violence would be disorganized with their thoughts, with their 1384 01:10:52,600 --> 01:10:55,600 executive functioning. And I did experience that as 1385 01:10:55,600 --> 01:10:57,240 well. So there was some similarities 1386 01:10:57,240 --> 01:11:01,440 there for sure. But and by executive 1387 01:11:01,440 --> 01:11:03,880 functioning, I mean, you know, it's like you can do one thing 1388 01:11:03,880 --> 01:11:05,440 but you can't do another. I don't know that's what I mean 1389 01:11:05,440 --> 01:11:07,440 by that, but it's. It's focusing on where's the gym 1390 01:11:07,440 --> 01:11:08,560 bag? Well, you should be trying to 1391 01:11:08,560 --> 01:11:10,440 figure out how do I get myself out of this place. 1392 01:11:11,120 --> 01:11:15,840 And so, you know, and so it was really beneficial for me and I 1393 01:11:15,840 --> 01:11:18,200 would recommend it for anyone who is trying to kind of 1394 01:11:18,200 --> 01:11:23,200 understand something that happened to them because it it 1395 01:11:23,240 --> 01:11:26,440 put it in an objective kind of scientific way, if that makes 1396 01:11:26,440 --> 01:11:30,040 sense. Like more you don't feel so 1397 01:11:30,040 --> 01:11:32,360 isolated or like you're the only person this has ever happened 1398 01:11:32,360 --> 01:11:34,280 to. And I think everyone, people 1399 01:11:34,280 --> 01:11:37,520 that had experienced things like that get that isolated feeling. 1400 01:11:38,440 --> 01:11:44,280 And yeah, so, and back then, you know, we just didn't talk about, 1401 01:11:44,760 --> 01:11:47,240 I don't even know how to, because I, because you have to 1402 01:11:47,240 --> 01:11:49,800 remember I did the training years later. 1403 01:11:50,240 --> 01:11:53,240 So for many years, you know, I would talk about it once in a 1404 01:11:53,240 --> 01:11:56,960 while, but you know, in the 90s and following the 90's, the 1405 01:11:56,960 --> 01:11:58,960 early 2000s, you didn't talk about things like that that 1406 01:11:58,960 --> 01:12:00,560 much. You just didn't. 1407 01:12:01,040 --> 01:12:04,640 It just wasn't talked about. Clear. 1408 01:12:04,720 --> 01:12:06,080 No, I agree, a lot of secrets kept. 1409 01:12:06,440 --> 01:12:08,640 There. There were, like you said, a lot 1410 01:12:08,640 --> 01:12:10,640 of secrets kept. There's a Are you, are you 1411 01:12:10,680 --> 01:12:13,680 familiar with the concept of a sympathetic nervous response to 1412 01:12:13,680 --> 01:12:16,000 the the so-called fight or flight or freeze syndrome? 1413 01:12:16,520 --> 01:12:20,600 Yes, and I would say looking back, I probably went into 1414 01:12:20,600 --> 01:12:24,800 freeze mode. It's the most common, but it, 1415 01:12:24,880 --> 01:12:27,440 but it's the, the physiological background of it. 1416 01:12:27,440 --> 01:12:29,000 And you learn this is a paramedic and you learn it if 1417 01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:31,600 you're somebody who goes into, you know, into a violent place 1418 01:12:31,600 --> 01:12:33,400 where I was trying to go in the military and, and in law 1419 01:12:33,400 --> 01:12:36,880 enforcement, there is a, a significant adrenal drum dump. 1420 01:12:36,960 --> 01:12:41,240 And that is when your body sends epinephrine into the bloodstream 1421 01:12:41,720 --> 01:12:46,600 and it does vasoconstriction and it sends all the peripheral 1422 01:12:48,800 --> 01:12:51,160 vasovasculature, all of your small blood vessels. 1423 01:12:51,320 --> 01:12:53,640 They shunt all the blood to the big places. 1424 01:12:53,640 --> 01:12:55,880 They need to be like your legs, like your arms, things that you 1425 01:12:55,880 --> 01:12:58,320 could fight to your heart. And so that's the feeling of 1426 01:12:58,320 --> 01:13:00,120 cold is that you lose all the heat. 1427 01:13:00,120 --> 01:13:02,760 You literally lose heat from your surface level skin because 1428 01:13:02,760 --> 01:13:04,640 that's irrelevant. What we need to do is we need to 1429 01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:07,600 put blood where we can react. And so they go to your eyes, 1430 01:13:07,600 --> 01:13:09,320 they go to your brain, they go to your heart. 1431 01:13:09,920 --> 01:13:12,880 And then when you're done with that moment and your your moment 1432 01:13:12,880 --> 01:13:14,600 has passed and doesn't matter if you drew your gun and shot 1433 01:13:14,600 --> 01:13:18,800 somebody or somebody attacked you, that runoff leaves people 1434 01:13:18,800 --> 01:13:21,360 with the shakes. It's universal across people 1435 01:13:21,520 --> 01:13:23,400 that experience a significant event. 1436 01:13:23,680 --> 01:13:25,040 OK. I haven't heard it explained 1437 01:13:25,040 --> 01:13:26,240 like that, but that's interesting. 1438 01:13:26,240 --> 01:13:27,920 OK, that explains a lot. OK. 1439 01:13:27,960 --> 01:13:31,400 It's it's a fundamentally like it's, it's a dinosaur brain, 1440 01:13:31,400 --> 01:13:33,840 human reaction significant. Threat. 1441 01:13:33,840 --> 01:13:35,520 OK, there you have it. Yeah. 1442 01:13:36,000 --> 01:13:38,680 And it's interesting because like there are things I don't 1443 01:13:38,680 --> 01:13:40,840 remember and things I do vividly. 1444 01:13:41,280 --> 01:13:43,000 And so that really frustrated me. 1445 01:13:43,000 --> 01:13:46,240 And I was reading other trauma, you know, professors recently, 1446 01:13:46,240 --> 01:13:48,760 like after I came forward, actually there was a trauma 1447 01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:52,480 professor that explained to me about why, because I was so 1448 01:13:52,480 --> 01:13:55,640 frustrated, there was trying to remember this one portion of 1449 01:13:55,640 --> 01:13:58,120 what happened. And no matter how hard I try, I 1450 01:13:58,120 --> 01:13:59,800 can't, it's a blank. It's a blank. 1451 01:14:00,080 --> 01:14:03,200 And I try and try and try. And they said that's like a 1452 01:14:03,200 --> 01:14:05,640 trauma response. Like there's parts probably that 1453 01:14:05,640 --> 01:14:07,560 are blanked out. It's just blanked out. 1454 01:14:08,200 --> 01:14:10,280 Yeah, I also think a lot of times when you, because I've 1455 01:14:10,280 --> 01:14:12,600 taken these notes, you know, you have somebody, something 1456 01:14:12,600 --> 01:14:15,000 happened, whether it's a car accident or an attack, and 1457 01:14:15,000 --> 01:14:16,840 you're trying to document like what happened next. 1458 01:14:17,080 --> 01:14:19,520 It's almost like the camera was pointed in a different direction 1459 01:14:19,520 --> 01:14:22,760 because your attention was how do I get out of these shoes 1460 01:14:22,760 --> 01:14:25,840 because my feet are hurting right now and my shins hurt. 1461 01:14:26,080 --> 01:14:27,960 But you're not able to focus on the thing that's happening 1462 01:14:27,960 --> 01:14:30,360 directly to you because that is too much for the brain to 1463 01:14:30,360 --> 01:14:31,720 process. So it goes to these, you know, 1464 01:14:32,040 --> 01:14:34,360 like you said, the executive functions are, are very confused 1465 01:14:34,360 --> 01:14:37,320 and muddled. It's very common and it's across 1466 01:14:37,320 --> 01:14:39,120 all types of trauma. It doesn't matter if it's sexual 1467 01:14:39,120 --> 01:14:41,160 or otherwise. So, you know, and it's 1468 01:14:41,160 --> 01:14:44,000 interesting because, you know, you know, looking back, you 1469 01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:46,600 know, Joe Biden was just very relaxed almost. 1470 01:14:47,320 --> 01:14:48,640 That's the predatory piece of it. 1471 01:14:49,320 --> 01:14:51,600 And and that's what was kind of chilling is that that was a 1472 01:14:51,600 --> 01:14:53,800 confrontation almost because I was pulling away and like 1473 01:14:53,800 --> 01:14:57,280 fighting it, right? And he's casual. 1474 01:14:58,040 --> 01:15:00,560 No, it's just like, at the time, I didn't think too much of it. 1475 01:15:00,560 --> 01:15:02,760 And now looking back at it, I'm like, oh, wow. 1476 01:15:02,760 --> 01:15:04,920 Like that's, that's why I think he's done it. 1477 01:15:05,840 --> 01:15:10,040 He did it before me and he did it after me and he doesn't think 1478 01:15:10,040 --> 01:15:11,640 anything of it. And and I think his, the 1479 01:15:11,640 --> 01:15:16,120 behavior that I've heard about his son is indicative of being a 1480 01:15:16,120 --> 01:15:20,080 child of a predator, right? Like he's been modeled to, you 1481 01:15:20,080 --> 01:15:22,600 know, But I wanted to touch on something you said 1482 01:15:22,600 --> 01:15:26,880 parasympathetic. So there's two sides to it. 1483 01:15:26,880 --> 01:15:31,800 There's the sympathetic. Is the reaction where you 1484 01:15:31,800 --> 01:15:33,840 actually are experiencing that fight or flight? 1485 01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:35,280 The parasympathetic is the opposite. 1486 01:15:35,280 --> 01:15:36,760 It's when you relax and you go the other way. 1487 01:15:36,880 --> 01:15:40,560 These are conflicting systems. Right, what I was going to say 1488 01:15:40,560 --> 01:15:44,360 is that part of healing trauma, like one of the things that I I 1489 01:15:45,080 --> 01:15:51,840 like is horses and what they've learned about trauma because 1490 01:15:51,840 --> 01:15:56,160 I've had other things happen to me that were actually almost 1491 01:15:56,160 --> 01:15:58,400 worse than what happened with Biden, believe it or not. 1492 01:15:58,400 --> 01:16:04,160 And what they said with about PTSD is that somatic healing is 1493 01:16:04,160 --> 01:16:07,280 really important, that talk therapy doesn't really work. 1494 01:16:08,520 --> 01:16:10,960 And so that's why, you know, equine therapy is really good 1495 01:16:10,960 --> 01:16:14,920 and things like that. And, you know, focusing forward, 1496 01:16:15,320 --> 01:16:18,240 I think that's, you know, a really beneficial thing for 1497 01:16:18,240 --> 01:16:21,280 people that have had something, you know, horrific happen like 1498 01:16:21,280 --> 01:16:23,680 what I did. But it wasn't just what 1499 01:16:23,680 --> 01:16:25,880 happened. It was the loss of the mentor. 1500 01:16:25,880 --> 01:16:29,720 It was the loss of the career. It was the loss of my standing 1501 01:16:29,720 --> 01:16:34,240 in my community. It was being, it was a betrayal, 1502 01:16:34,920 --> 01:16:37,120 you know, and then that went on, right? 1503 01:16:37,120 --> 01:16:39,880 So then I come forward and I'm thinking I'm doing a public 1504 01:16:39,880 --> 01:16:41,880 service. It's like a whistle blowing in a 1505 01:16:41,880 --> 01:16:44,560 way, right? Except it's about a personal 1506 01:16:44,560 --> 01:16:48,080 situation. And, you know, the media just 1507 01:16:49,560 --> 01:16:52,520 goes after me. You know, like jackals. 1508 01:16:52,800 --> 01:16:54,320 Yeah, talk about that. Obviously you didn't know you 1509 01:16:54,320 --> 01:16:56,640 were going up against a multi $1,000,000 PR firm that was 1510 01:16:56,640 --> 01:17:00,680 already in the know. But how, how is it received for 1511 01:17:00,680 --> 01:17:02,640 people who can't remember three years back? 1512 01:17:03,160 --> 01:17:04,760 You know, I remember hearing the allegation. 1513 01:17:04,880 --> 01:17:06,520 I didn't pay attention to a whole lot of it. 1514 01:17:06,520 --> 01:17:08,160 I didn't have interactions with you at the time. 1515 01:17:09,200 --> 01:17:11,040 I just went like, OK, that's a story. 1516 01:17:11,040 --> 01:17:13,840 And you know, we, we listen to the story and then you try to 1517 01:17:13,840 --> 01:17:15,040 figure out if it's credible or not. 1518 01:17:15,400 --> 01:17:17,320 The media did their own thing. They did something different. 1519 01:17:18,520 --> 01:17:21,080 Oh, they attacked me. Beth Reinhardt, Pulitzer Prize 1520 01:17:21,080 --> 01:17:23,040 winner, right, reporter. She was my first interview with 1521 01:17:23,040 --> 01:17:26,680 The Washington Post, and she said the first thing she said 1522 01:17:26,680 --> 01:17:28,360 out of her mouth. And I wrote about this in my 1523 01:17:28,360 --> 01:17:32,440 book. She goes, Tara, do you don't you 1524 01:17:32,440 --> 01:17:35,240 realize that this is going to hurt Joe Biden's campaign? 1525 01:17:35,520 --> 01:17:37,320 You know, because like she's trying to speak to me like I'm 1526 01:17:37,320 --> 01:17:39,680 some Democrat, like my allegation, right? 1527 01:17:40,080 --> 01:17:42,800 And then she goes into talking about the allegation, you know, 1528 01:17:42,800 --> 01:17:45,240 when she's interviewing me, trying to get me to give her the 1529 01:17:45,240 --> 01:17:48,280 details and she's like with stopping her up being goes. 1530 01:17:48,640 --> 01:17:53,480 So she it was really gross. She she said so did he touch 1531 01:17:53,480 --> 01:17:55,840 your clitoris? Did you get pleasure from that? 1532 01:17:55,840 --> 01:17:58,400 I mean, these are the kinds of questions a Pulitzer Prize 1533 01:17:58,400 --> 01:18:03,000 winner, the reporter asked me. She, she, she had me down in 1534 01:18:03,000 --> 01:18:04,760 tears. Like I was literally by the end 1535 01:18:04,760 --> 01:18:06,880 of the interview, I was in tears and I was sick. 1536 01:18:07,680 --> 01:18:08,560 Why do you think she was that awful? 1537 01:18:09,440 --> 01:18:13,000 She just attacked me like, you know, in other words, she was 1538 01:18:13,000 --> 01:18:15,440 implying like, even if he did it, you probably liked it. 1539 01:18:15,480 --> 01:18:18,160 You know, it was just awful. It was, it was probably one of 1540 01:18:18,160 --> 01:18:21,560 the most ugly things I've ever been through and. 1541 01:18:21,960 --> 01:18:23,600 How did that compare to the others that talked to you? 1542 01:18:24,320 --> 01:18:27,480 Well, they were equally horrible, but not as graphic. 1543 01:18:29,000 --> 01:18:32,320 But you know, Lisa Lehrer was more earn your trust, earn the 1544 01:18:32,320 --> 01:18:34,440 trust, earn the trust and then betray. 1545 01:18:34,720 --> 01:18:39,120 That was her thing, you know, and then do the hit piece. 1546 01:18:39,360 --> 01:18:42,200 And they made it all about the fact that I was a Russian asset 1547 01:18:42,400 --> 01:18:45,920 that because that's when the Russian agent, everybody who 1548 01:18:45,920 --> 01:18:48,720 wasn't agreeing with Democrats was a Russian agent. 1549 01:18:48,720 --> 01:18:51,520 That's when that was rolling out against Donald Trump, against 1550 01:18:51,840 --> 01:18:53,960 any Republican. That's, you know, it just was it 1551 01:18:53,960 --> 01:18:58,840 was ridiculous. And so, of course, Lisa Lehrer 1552 01:18:58,840 --> 01:19:02,880 even said when they approached the Biden campaign, the only 1553 01:19:02,880 --> 01:19:05,560 thing he did was the campaign faxed back. 1554 01:19:05,560 --> 01:19:07,600 They wouldn't answer about the assault. 1555 01:19:07,760 --> 01:19:11,600 They would fax back something saying that I was something 1556 01:19:11,600 --> 01:19:15,840 about one of my posts that I made about Russia that was 1557 01:19:15,840 --> 01:19:18,560 positive, implying I was a Russian agent. 1558 01:19:20,360 --> 01:19:23,680 So it was just stupid. So it was a way to just distract 1559 01:19:23,680 --> 01:19:27,040 the whole conversation. What was the allegation that was 1560 01:19:27,040 --> 01:19:33,240 made that tied you to Russia? Because I publicly had spoken 1561 01:19:33,240 --> 01:19:36,360 out about a couple of specific things. 1562 01:19:36,360 --> 01:19:41,840 I said that Biden, if he were elected, would take us to war 1563 01:19:41,840 --> 01:19:45,960 with Russia. And I said that in 2019, and he 1564 01:19:45,960 --> 01:19:50,280 did. But anyway, but at that time, 1565 01:19:50,280 --> 01:19:52,400 nobody was going to hear that, right? 1566 01:19:52,400 --> 01:19:55,240 That was a conspiracy theory. I'm, you know, or whatever. 1567 01:19:55,520 --> 01:19:59,360 And I said positive things about Vladimir Putin because I said I 1568 01:19:59,360 --> 01:20:01,600 think he's a good leader. He simply takes care of his 1569 01:20:01,600 --> 01:20:03,400 people. That's all it took. 1570 01:20:03,880 --> 01:20:09,160 Basically. I had said I was writing a novel 1571 01:20:09,160 --> 01:20:12,040 about Russia and America, and I was writing about. 1572 01:20:13,040 --> 01:20:16,720 Something from the Cold War up through to the current time. 1573 01:20:16,720 --> 01:20:19,720 And I was trying to because the Russophobia was kind of coming 1574 01:20:19,720 --> 01:20:22,160 up and I was writing it from a geopolitical kind of sense. 1575 01:20:22,160 --> 01:20:24,200 But it was a novel. So I was in the middle of 1576 01:20:24,200 --> 01:20:27,080 writing that. And that they pulled a bunch of 1577 01:20:27,080 --> 01:20:31,120 the pieces of the novel that were, you know, posted in a 1578 01:20:31,120 --> 01:20:34,920 writing group that I was in and made it seem like I was somehow 1579 01:20:34,920 --> 01:20:38,160 tied to the Russian government. And were you? 1580 01:20:39,400 --> 01:20:43,880 No Niet. Miyat, she says when you were 1581 01:20:43,880 --> 01:20:45,400 growing up when you were growing up. 1582 01:20:45,480 --> 01:20:48,880 Tell me about your impression of Russia from your the childhood 1583 01:20:48,920 --> 01:20:49,600 and it's. Interesting. 1584 01:20:49,840 --> 01:20:55,600 My cousin, actually I'm, I have a cousin that's Russian. 1585 01:20:56,120 --> 01:21:00,040 So by marriage and so it was always very positive. 1586 01:21:00,520 --> 01:21:04,280 I, I didn't, you know, we were taught in school. 1587 01:21:05,440 --> 01:21:11,800 I, I was, I, I'm too young, excuse me to be under the desk. 1588 01:21:11,800 --> 01:21:15,120 Like, I know people older than me had to like practice, you 1589 01:21:15,120 --> 01:21:18,160 know, nuclear war and stuff. That was before my time. 1590 01:21:18,440 --> 01:21:21,560 But like, for me, it was just sort of the rhetoric. 1591 01:21:21,560 --> 01:21:24,760 We were told basically that America won World War 2. 1592 01:21:24,760 --> 01:21:27,960 And it's like, you know, Leningrad didn't even exist. 1593 01:21:27,960 --> 01:21:31,080 Like the the whole stand against, you know, and all the 1594 01:21:31,080 --> 01:21:32,920 losses that the Soviet Union suffered. 1595 01:21:33,440 --> 01:21:36,000 Touch on that just for a second, because I I always like to give 1596 01:21:36,000 --> 01:21:37,800 people a little bit of history and I think people don't have a 1597 01:21:37,800 --> 01:21:40,680 good concept of the, the number of losses the Soviets had during 1598 01:21:40,680 --> 01:21:44,760 World War 2. 27,000,000 Yeah. Including civilians, right? 1599 01:21:45,200 --> 01:21:47,440 Yeah. I think close to 20 or like 19 1600 01:21:47,440 --> 01:21:49,240 or 20 million in uniform, something like that. 1601 01:21:49,760 --> 01:21:50,880 Right. It was like a third of the 1602 01:21:50,880 --> 01:21:54,360 country was like dust, like it was burned. 1603 01:21:54,560 --> 01:21:57,800 Yeah, and do you know how many in the Allied side lost their 1604 01:21:57,800 --> 01:22:01,960 lives? No. 500,000 United States, 1605 01:22:01,960 --> 01:22:07,480 500,000 Great Britain. So just the the losses were 20X 1606 01:22:07,760 --> 01:22:11,320 plus for the Russians and the Soviets at that time. 1607 01:22:11,320 --> 01:22:12,720 People don't have any. Contact John. 1608 01:22:12,720 --> 01:22:18,320 John Kennedy gave that eloquent quote where he said we owe the 1609 01:22:18,320 --> 01:22:21,360 Soviet Union a debt we can never repay, you know? 1610 01:22:21,360 --> 01:22:25,680 And that's something. Yeah, so, so, yeah, I was kind 1611 01:22:25,680 --> 01:22:28,720 of grew up with the Cold War mentality, although my mother, 1612 01:22:28,840 --> 01:22:31,880 you know, remember my great grandmother was a communist, you 1613 01:22:31,880 --> 01:22:33,200 know, and followed like Jack Reed. 1614 01:22:33,440 --> 01:22:35,080 She was into women's right to vote. 1615 01:22:35,320 --> 01:22:37,520 They were into different thinking, intellectual thinking. 1616 01:22:37,520 --> 01:22:41,720 So I was exposed to Karl Marx when I was a little girl. 1617 01:22:41,720 --> 01:22:46,120 I brought a book of Karl Marx to school and we had the stump out 1618 01:22:46,120 --> 01:22:47,720 in Wisconsin. It was like this little red 1619 01:22:47,720 --> 01:22:51,600 schoolhouse and we would take turns getting on the stump, 1620 01:22:51,600 --> 01:22:54,880 doing different things, talking, singing, reading, you know, 1621 01:22:54,880 --> 01:22:57,000 playing whatever. We were all, you know, little 1622 01:22:57,000 --> 01:22:59,200 whatever. And so I have my Karl Marx book 1623 01:22:59,200 --> 01:23:03,040 for my Big Brothers and, and I was explaining it. 1624 01:23:03,040 --> 01:23:07,360 God knows how I explained it at 8 years old, because that was 1625 01:23:07,360 --> 01:23:09,960 probably would have been, I wish I had a recording of it because 1626 01:23:09,960 --> 01:23:14,800 God knows what I said. But it was enough to where the 1627 01:23:14,800 --> 01:23:18,400 kids went home and talked about it and about how maybe there 1628 01:23:18,400 --> 01:23:22,280 wasn't a God and that maybe Karl Marx, other stuff, you know, and 1629 01:23:22,280 --> 01:23:23,600 I come from a Catholic background. 1630 01:23:23,600 --> 01:23:25,800 A lot of the kids there in Wisconsin are Lutheran. 1631 01:23:26,760 --> 01:23:29,560 And yeah, it was. It was funny because. 1632 01:23:31,360 --> 01:23:32,800 I can only imagine how this went over. 1633 01:23:34,200 --> 01:23:37,520 My parents got a call and they said they had to go in and my 1634 01:23:37,520 --> 01:23:42,760 mom had to go in and and they said, you know, Tara is showing 1635 01:23:42,760 --> 01:23:47,240 some leadership qualities and we like that, but we need to figure 1636 01:23:47,240 --> 01:23:49,960 out a different thing for her because and she can't bring her 1637 01:23:49,960 --> 01:23:51,320 Karl Marx book to the school because. 1638 01:23:51,320 --> 01:23:54,200 She might be organizing A revolt, A Marxist revolt, and 1639 01:23:54,320 --> 01:23:56,720 and they might be moving around the means of production for 1640 01:23:56,720 --> 01:23:58,760 education. Well, check this out. 1641 01:23:58,760 --> 01:24:02,000 So this is what they did. They made me a bus patrol and 1642 01:24:02,000 --> 01:24:05,360 they I got to wear the orange sash with the, with the with, 1643 01:24:05,640 --> 01:24:08,920 you know, the badge turned into a total fascist. 1644 01:24:08,920 --> 01:24:11,480 I loved it. I was like going after, you 1645 01:24:11,480 --> 01:24:14,760 know, the older boys that would pick on people. 1646 01:24:14,760 --> 01:24:16,440 They gave you a little bit of authority, it went straight to 1647 01:24:16,440 --> 01:24:18,280 your head and you became a. Fascist. 1648 01:24:18,280 --> 01:24:20,800 I was Marxism to fascism, just like that. 1649 01:24:20,800 --> 01:24:23,560 Like a you know, like a typical Democrat, right? 1650 01:24:23,840 --> 01:24:26,680 Like like it can happen on to anybody given the right amount 1651 01:24:26,680 --> 01:24:28,280 of power and the wrong kind of ideas. 1652 01:24:28,640 --> 01:24:31,760 I know, so I got to sit at the front of the bus with my orange 1653 01:24:31,760 --> 01:24:33,560 sass so. And tell people what to do. 1654 01:24:33,560 --> 01:24:35,360 That's all I had to do is give me my uniform. 1655 01:24:35,640 --> 01:24:37,920 It's so good. That's very, very funny. 1656 01:24:38,400 --> 01:24:41,000 All right, so from Marxism to fascism, that'll be your next 1657 01:24:41,000 --> 01:24:44,440 book. You have written one book about 1658 01:24:44,440 --> 01:24:48,720 your story, and I think it plays into why you are where you are, 1659 01:24:48,720 --> 01:24:51,840 if I understand correctly. Obviously, you got torn apart in 1660 01:24:51,840 --> 01:24:54,160 the mainstream press here. You were not received the way 1661 01:24:54,160 --> 01:24:56,880 you expected. I think that is pretty evident. 1662 01:24:57,120 --> 01:24:59,720 And you went from being someone who in theory had some 1663 01:24:59,720 --> 01:25:02,000 alliances, probably historically, to the Democrat 1664 01:25:02,000 --> 01:25:03,880 Party. Who received you? 1665 01:25:03,880 --> 01:25:06,320 Did anyone receive you? Well, did anyone take your story 1666 01:25:06,320 --> 01:25:11,200 and say we believe you? Behind the scenes, right? 1667 01:25:11,520 --> 01:25:14,720 But they won't say it publicly. So that was really frustrating. 1668 01:25:14,720 --> 01:25:15,880 Like you want. To name any names. 1669 01:25:16,280 --> 01:25:19,240 Oh yeah, like Chris Wallace, right? 1670 01:25:21,160 --> 01:25:21,920 Said his. Wife. 1671 01:25:24,160 --> 01:25:28,520 Was groped by him when, when Joe Biden was the vice president. 1672 01:25:28,520 --> 01:25:31,280 And I don't mind saying it because, you know, they should 1673 01:25:31,280 --> 01:25:33,680 be talking about this. He's a media person. 1674 01:25:33,680 --> 01:25:37,040 He should be telling the truth. And it's bullshit that I have to 1675 01:25:37,040 --> 01:25:40,840 stand out here on my own. And, you know, but yeah, he, he 1676 01:25:40,840 --> 01:25:43,360 had that problem. Now, you had that Senator Brown 1677 01:25:43,360 --> 01:25:46,640 just came forward about his wife getting roped and that he was 1678 01:25:46,640 --> 01:25:48,600 going to kick the shit out of Biden, is what he told them, 1679 01:25:48,600 --> 01:25:50,000 right? So I I. 1680 01:25:50,040 --> 01:25:51,800 Didn't hear that one tell. Tell that story if you would. 1681 01:25:52,640 --> 01:25:54,520 Well, I, I don't really know it personally. 1682 01:25:54,520 --> 01:25:56,640 I just know it's been in the media just last few days. 1683 01:25:56,640 --> 01:25:59,400 But, and of course, only in the conservative media, they're not. 1684 01:25:59,400 --> 01:26:02,760 That's what I'm getting at. Yeah, but Brown was a Democrat, 1685 01:26:02,760 --> 01:26:06,200 a friend of Joe Biden's, and basically said those words, said 1686 01:26:06,200 --> 01:26:08,800 I will kick the shit out of you if you do that again. 1687 01:26:09,000 --> 01:26:11,520 But he was groped. His wife, he had his hand all 1688 01:26:11,520 --> 01:26:15,480 over her ass basically at A at a function where there's cameras 1689 01:26:15,480 --> 01:26:17,880 or whatever. And he he groped her and he 1690 01:26:17,880 --> 01:26:19,720 didn't. And you know, he didn't like it. 1691 01:26:19,720 --> 01:26:22,320 He defended his wife. Yeah, so. 1692 01:26:22,800 --> 01:26:23,920 Well, luckily he didn't. It was this. 1693 01:26:24,120 --> 01:26:26,480 I wonder how recently that was. Was that something that. 1694 01:26:26,480 --> 01:26:28,040 Just happened. We did mention that there was 1695 01:26:28,040 --> 01:26:30,440 mental decline, so it must have been recently. 1696 01:26:30,720 --> 01:26:32,840 Interesting. So, yeah. 1697 01:26:32,840 --> 01:26:35,320 And so, yeah, look, look up that article with Brown, though, 1698 01:26:35,320 --> 01:26:37,560 that's he's a former representative. 1699 01:26:38,440 --> 01:26:41,040 And, you know, you know, you have a lot of people that are 1700 01:26:41,040 --> 01:26:45,280 coming forward as far as like, you know, behind the scenes, you 1701 01:26:45,280 --> 01:26:47,440 know, Democrats coming to me. No, not a word. 1702 01:26:47,440 --> 01:26:50,160 In fact, I wrote before I went public, I wrote to Bernie 1703 01:26:50,160 --> 01:26:53,880 Sanders, I wrote to Elizabeth Warren, I wrote to a OCI, wrote 1704 01:26:53,880 --> 01:26:55,920 to Nancy Pelosi and Dianne Feinstein, 'cause they were in 1705 01:26:55,920 --> 01:26:58,920 my districts, you know, in California that you know, time 1706 01:27:00,360 --> 01:27:05,160 and silence. No Christy Blasey Ford type 1707 01:27:05,240 --> 01:27:09,240 Christine Blasey Ford reaction. No, no response at all. 1708 01:27:09,560 --> 01:27:13,800 Except Elizabeth Warren sent me back a fundraising letter, so 1709 01:27:13,800 --> 01:27:17,880 they got it. Yeah, it's a tone, but it was a 1710 01:27:17,880 --> 01:27:19,120 form letter. But yeah, no. 1711 01:27:19,120 --> 01:27:22,360 And, you know, it's not like I was just someone random. 1712 01:27:23,040 --> 01:27:27,000 I mean, I was a staffer and they could see that I was a staffer. 1713 01:27:29,120 --> 01:27:31,880 So yeah, they just chose to ignore it. 1714 01:27:33,480 --> 01:27:37,400 AOC. 2 Yeah, Let's talk about a, a word that has been thrown 1715 01:27:37,400 --> 01:27:39,040 around quite a bit. I'm trying to see if I have the 1716 01:27:39,600 --> 01:27:40,960 There it is. There's the definition of it. 1717 01:27:41,200 --> 01:27:43,720 This is coming from Wikipedia, the word defection. 1718 01:27:43,720 --> 01:27:46,000 Defection is when a person leaves their home country in a 1719 01:27:46,000 --> 01:27:48,880 way that the home country claims to be illegal. 1720 01:27:49,600 --> 01:27:52,040 To the first country, they can be seen as a traitor. 1721 01:27:52,040 --> 01:27:55,480 It is a political label used by authoritarian countries. 1722 01:27:55,720 --> 01:27:57,320 This is from left-leaning Wikipedia. 1723 01:27:57,560 --> 01:27:59,560 I just pulled that up, but before we started talking, 1724 01:28:00,000 --> 01:28:01,400 people have said that you have defected. 1725 01:28:01,400 --> 01:28:06,680 You are now in Moscow. I am now in Moscow, Russia, yes, 1726 01:28:07,800 --> 01:28:12,160 Defected, you know, and also usually is used in terms of like 1727 01:28:12,160 --> 01:28:18,320 military or, you know, someone who is working, you know, in 1728 01:28:18,320 --> 01:28:23,880 that capacity, you know, and I'm not that. 1729 01:28:24,080 --> 01:28:28,360 So I yeah, they're there. There it is, defecting, yeah. 1730 01:28:28,640 --> 01:28:30,920 It's right. When I was younger, defectors 1731 01:28:30,920 --> 01:28:34,200 were people who were flying like a Mig 28 and they decided to 1732 01:28:34,200 --> 01:28:36,880 leave Cuba and land and Florida airspace, put it down on the 1733 01:28:36,880 --> 01:28:41,720 tarmac and claim asylum, real asylum, and say I am defecting 1734 01:28:41,720 --> 01:28:43,840 to the United States. I'm bringing whatever I have and 1735 01:28:44,000 --> 01:28:46,280 you can have my plane, right? Right. 1736 01:28:46,800 --> 01:28:48,280 That's the recollection I have of that word. 1737 01:28:48,280 --> 01:28:49,480 I've never heard of this for. Someone. 1738 01:28:49,480 --> 01:28:52,280 It's more of like, if you're in a military conflict, Russia's 1739 01:28:52,280 --> 01:28:53,920 not supposed to be our enemy right now. 1740 01:28:54,520 --> 01:28:57,280 Officially, right? Have we declared war? 1741 01:28:57,280 --> 01:28:59,920 Officially, no, not. That I've seen, although we seem 1742 01:28:59,960 --> 01:29:02,120 to be doing a multi billion dollar proxy. 1743 01:29:02,680 --> 01:29:04,360 Yeah, we're doing a multi billion dollar proxy. 1744 01:29:04,360 --> 01:29:06,760 But my point is, is that, you know, it's it's it's an odd 1745 01:29:06,760 --> 01:29:11,240 term, but yeah. So I, you know, I, I'm really 1746 01:29:11,880 --> 01:29:18,240 lucky that I was able to not be taken into custody because I 1747 01:29:18,240 --> 01:29:23,160 think the next thing, the next phase, because of how loud I 1748 01:29:23,160 --> 01:29:26,880 continued to be about Joe Biden and kept pressing the issue. 1749 01:29:26,880 --> 01:29:31,120 And then I was about to testify before Congress, you know. 1750 01:29:31,400 --> 01:29:33,240 Yeah, let's set, let's set the stage for this. 1751 01:29:33,240 --> 01:29:34,920 There are two things that I think that were going on. 1752 01:29:34,960 --> 01:29:37,360 One, you were speaking out about Joe Biden and I've heard that 1753 01:29:37,680 --> 01:29:39,800 and and many people will not know that you had a pretty 1754 01:29:39,800 --> 01:29:43,440 strong anti war position that you were speaking out about. 1755 01:29:43,600 --> 01:29:46,440 Is that correct? Talk about your anti war 1756 01:29:46,440 --> 01:29:49,160 activism and whether you think that was playing into any of the 1757 01:29:49,440 --> 01:29:51,960 you know, we always talk about potentiation like one thing 1758 01:29:51,960 --> 01:29:54,600 makes another thing worse if you think that that was involved. 1759 01:29:55,520 --> 01:29:58,840 Well, I, I really chose because my platform was small, right? 1760 01:29:58,840 --> 01:30:01,000 But I had a little 1 and I thought, well, you know what, 1761 01:30:01,000 --> 01:30:02,480 I'm going to use this for something. 1762 01:30:02,800 --> 01:30:07,600 And you know, and I don't think of myself as a victim, right? 1763 01:30:07,600 --> 01:30:10,880 I, I'm kind of, I don't like that, you know, I, I chose to 1764 01:30:11,040 --> 01:30:13,680 look at this in a different way. This happened a long time ago. 1765 01:30:13,720 --> 01:30:16,280 It was wrong. It's never been investigated. 1766 01:30:16,280 --> 01:30:19,440 It should have been. And it cost me my career. 1767 01:30:19,640 --> 01:30:22,360 That was wrong. And so I wanted to make it so 1768 01:30:22,360 --> 01:30:23,840 that no one else had to suffer that. 1769 01:30:23,840 --> 01:30:25,640 That's how I wanted to approach it. 1770 01:30:25,800 --> 01:30:28,640 I didn't want to like get into the whole victim space and get 1771 01:30:28,640 --> 01:30:31,320 into all of that. I simply wanted to tell the 1772 01:30:31,320 --> 01:30:36,480 truth and get some real something close to justice. 1773 01:30:36,520 --> 01:30:39,160 And when it became obvious that wasn't going to happen, I 1774 01:30:39,160 --> 01:30:41,560 decided, OK, I have this little platform, what can I do with it? 1775 01:30:41,800 --> 01:30:46,000 Well, the bigger issue became very quickly early on in the 1776 01:30:46,080 --> 01:30:49,080 administration for Biden was was the proxy war. 1777 01:30:49,440 --> 01:30:51,920 And so I decided, you know, and all the Russophobia stuff. 1778 01:30:51,920 --> 01:30:54,320 And I decided, you know what? I'm going to push back on this. 1779 01:30:54,320 --> 01:30:57,400 I'm going to use my voice to push back on this and align 1780 01:30:57,400 --> 01:31:00,760 myself with other people who are pushing back on this, other anti 1781 01:31:00,760 --> 01:31:04,320 imperialist voices, you know, like the Gray zone, like 1782 01:31:04,320 --> 01:31:10,960 antiwar.com and and like frankly some of the libertarian and 1783 01:31:10,960 --> 01:31:12,720 conservative voices in Tucker Carlson. 1784 01:31:13,200 --> 01:31:17,080 You know, I was on Tucker Carlson show 3 * 1 of those 1785 01:31:17,080 --> 01:31:19,040 times. Of course, I was talking about, 1786 01:31:19,400 --> 01:31:21,760 you know, I was talking about, you know, what happened. 1787 01:31:22,360 --> 01:31:24,560 But then the other two, I was talking about something totally 1788 01:31:24,560 --> 01:31:26,080 different. And one of them I talked about, 1789 01:31:26,440 --> 01:31:29,360 I got to speak at the Rage Against the War Machine and we 1790 01:31:29,360 --> 01:31:33,200 had libertarians, Republicans and some lefties. 1791 01:31:33,200 --> 01:31:36,000 You have people from all over the political spectrum all 1792 01:31:36,000 --> 01:31:38,960 saying the same thing. Quit sending our tax money over 1793 01:31:38,960 --> 01:31:43,280 to this country and having a proxy war when we need 1794 01:31:43,280 --> 01:31:47,640 infrastructure at home, when we need homes for 600,000 people, 1795 01:31:47,640 --> 01:31:50,360 when we need, you know, inflation to go down. 1796 01:31:51,320 --> 01:31:54,480 Now I know my me talking about inflation is going to make the 1797 01:31:54,480 --> 01:31:57,320 CIA very angry because they said that in USA TODAY. 1798 01:31:57,320 --> 01:31:59,840 They were. They were very A former CIA 1799 01:31:59,840 --> 01:32:03,920 agent saw me complaining, he said, about the US. 1800 01:32:04,120 --> 01:32:07,040 That made him viscerally angry. Can you pull up the the the 1801 01:32:07,040 --> 01:32:09,920 picture from the USA TODAY Ryan? I know we sent that article 1802 01:32:09,920 --> 01:32:12,840 over. Makes the makes the CIA mad for 1803 01:32:12,840 --> 01:32:14,800 you to talk about the money. There it is. 1804 01:32:15,280 --> 01:32:16,720 A Biden accuser. Tara Reid. 1805 01:32:16,720 --> 01:32:17,920 Bolts. Bolts. 1806 01:32:17,920 --> 01:32:19,120 That's a good one. You. 1807 01:32:19,680 --> 01:32:22,640 Yeah, that's what happened. And so she fears for her safety. 1808 01:32:22,880 --> 01:32:24,640 So you're speaking out about the war effort. 1809 01:32:24,640 --> 01:32:27,200 That's a pretty traditional lefty 'cause I would say that 1810 01:32:27,640 --> 01:32:29,960 let's give peace a chance. That was always the chant in the 1811 01:32:29,960 --> 01:32:33,560 60s and the 70s, right? You said you had a brother who 1812 01:32:33,560 --> 01:32:35,520 was a conscientious objector. That sounds like that was kind 1813 01:32:35,520 --> 01:32:37,800 of mom's ethos. That was definitely in your 1814 01:32:37,800 --> 01:32:41,160 house putting words into your mouth, but stop me anytime and 1815 01:32:41,160 --> 01:32:42,840 then now you still. Have that my dad. 1816 01:32:43,400 --> 01:32:45,840 My dad was tongued. Well, that's the other thing. 1817 01:32:45,840 --> 01:32:48,080 If your dad was more conservative and was more 1818 01:32:48,440 --> 01:32:51,680 aligned with the establishment, that was always kind of a right 1819 01:32:51,680 --> 01:32:53,240 wing position. It's like, yeah, bombs cost 1820 01:32:53,240 --> 01:32:56,160 money and money equals jobs and those are all good things. 1821 01:32:56,160 --> 01:32:58,240 So war is a good business and right. 1822 01:32:58,240 --> 01:33:00,640 I mean, the people always accuse the Republicans of being war 1823 01:33:00,640 --> 01:33:01,760 Hawks. Yeah. 1824 01:33:02,880 --> 01:33:05,680 So now I was aligning myself with a lot of Republicans. 1825 01:33:05,680 --> 01:33:08,080 And if you notice, you know, Donald Trump, you know, I I 1826 01:33:08,080 --> 01:33:10,840 didn't vote for him, but he didn't get as close to war. 1827 01:33:10,840 --> 01:33:12,240 Yeah. What do you think about that? 1828 01:33:12,520 --> 01:33:13,680 You weren't a Donald Trump voter. 1829 01:33:14,840 --> 01:33:15,600 No, I wasn't. What do you? 1830 01:33:15,600 --> 01:33:18,520 What do you think about the guy looking from the looking from 1831 01:33:18,520 --> 01:33:20,360 Moscow? What do you think about Donald 1832 01:33:20,360 --> 01:33:23,040 Trump in the last, let's say, 7 years that you've seen when he 1833 01:33:23,040 --> 01:33:26,600 didn't vote for him? Well, I, I think what I saw was 1834 01:33:26,600 --> 01:33:30,520 that he actually, he obviously did a better job than Joe Biden 1835 01:33:30,520 --> 01:33:33,440 is doing OK economically. Just from an objective point of 1836 01:33:33,440 --> 01:33:34,520 view. He didn't get us. 1837 01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:36,480 He got us out of wars and into wars. 1838 01:33:36,560 --> 01:33:40,400 And he, you know, was fighting the whole time against a 1839 01:33:40,400 --> 01:33:43,760 bureaucracy that wanted him out and was persecuting him and 1840 01:33:43,760 --> 01:33:46,240 accusing him of ties to Russia, which he didn't have. 1841 01:33:46,480 --> 01:33:48,480 And that was proven that that didn't exist. 1842 01:33:48,480 --> 01:33:51,400 And it was all, you know, something that was manufactured 1843 01:33:51,400 --> 01:33:54,000 by Democrats, you know, to maintain power and to get him 1844 01:33:54,000 --> 01:33:57,680 out. And, you know, it also kind of 1845 01:33:57,680 --> 01:34:01,720 solidified for me in my mind how much power people like Anthony 1846 01:34:01,720 --> 01:34:05,920 Blinken and Victoria Nuland and, you know, John Kirby and people 1847 01:34:05,920 --> 01:34:08,000 like that have. The bureaucrats behind the 1848 01:34:08,000 --> 01:34:10,400 scenes are the ones running the show with the military 1849 01:34:10,400 --> 01:34:14,640 industrial complex. And now they're going after, now 1850 01:34:15,200 --> 01:34:17,720 Donald Trump is the political opposition and they're taking 1851 01:34:17,720 --> 01:34:20,080 him out. OK, so let's look at this. 1852 01:34:20,240 --> 01:34:22,880 They're taking out the political opposition. 1853 01:34:23,120 --> 01:34:25,800 It's been shown that they've been weaponizing the DOJ and the 1854 01:34:25,800 --> 01:34:29,880 FBI and social media and other things to go after U.S. citizens 1855 01:34:30,160 --> 01:34:33,720 that aren't for this proxy war or that maybe want to vote for 1856 01:34:33,720 --> 01:34:37,800 Donald Trump. And you have also, you have 1857 01:34:37,840 --> 01:34:41,040 agencies going after people with religious beliefs. 1858 01:34:42,920 --> 01:34:44,240 Does that sound like a democracy? 1859 01:34:45,880 --> 01:34:47,760 I know we have a we have a Republican. 1860 01:34:47,880 --> 01:34:50,560 It doesn't sound very much like a Democratic Republic in any 1861 01:34:50,560 --> 01:34:51,560 way. No, it didn't sound like a 1862 01:34:51,560 --> 01:34:54,360 Democratic Republic. So I tweeted something, I shared 1863 01:34:54,360 --> 01:34:56,440 something the other day. I said the country I grew up in 1864 01:34:56,560 --> 01:34:58,080 would have invaded the country that I live in. 1865 01:34:58,080 --> 01:34:59,360 What do you think about that idea? 1866 01:35:00,360 --> 01:35:02,720 I think that's a, a really interesting quote because I 1867 01:35:02,720 --> 01:35:06,640 think you're right. And you know, and we're coming 1868 01:35:06,640 --> 01:35:11,640 to the point where I talk about why I left and you know, it 1869 01:35:11,640 --> 01:35:15,960 wasn't I, I was actually coming to Moscow, Russia because of 1870 01:35:15,960 --> 01:35:18,600 this book. And I have an interpreter and I 1871 01:35:18,600 --> 01:35:20,240 was coming in person to oversee it. 1872 01:35:20,480 --> 01:35:25,160 And I packed for one week. And let me tell you, I mean, 1873 01:35:26,000 --> 01:35:28,120 people have like said, oh, you planned or whatever. 1874 01:35:28,120 --> 01:35:30,920 No, I didn't. In fact, I didn't say there's a 1875 01:35:30,920 --> 01:35:34,440 lot of regrets I have. I didn't say if I had known what 1876 01:35:34,440 --> 01:35:37,240 was going to happen, I would have said goodbye differently. 1877 01:35:37,400 --> 01:35:39,240 I would have spent my last few days differently. 1878 01:35:39,240 --> 01:35:42,840 I would have packed differently, but I didn't. 1879 01:35:42,840 --> 01:35:44,880 I packed for a week and thought I was coming right back. 1880 01:35:44,880 --> 01:35:48,440 And, you know, and it became clear. 1881 01:35:48,440 --> 01:35:50,280 It was becoming clear. I was getting a lot of death 1882 01:35:50,280 --> 01:35:52,120 threats during that time. I was getting nervous. 1883 01:35:52,120 --> 01:35:54,720 I reached out to you, Kyle, As a matter of fact, Remember. 1884 01:35:55,680 --> 01:35:57,000 Yeah. I remember you calling me and 1885 01:35:57,000 --> 01:35:59,080 asking me a question that I couldn't answer and I would have 1886 01:35:59,080 --> 01:36:01,160 no way to know. And I thought, Oh my God, this 1887 01:36:01,160 --> 01:36:02,600 poor woman. Like I, I remember thinking 1888 01:36:02,600 --> 01:36:03,800 like, I have no, no way to help you. 1889 01:36:03,840 --> 01:36:05,720 You also called me right in the middle of some really chaotic 1890 01:36:05,720 --> 01:36:08,400 times on our end. And I thought it, it's 1891 01:36:08,400 --> 01:36:10,040 everywhere. And you know, you can only fight 1892 01:36:10,040 --> 01:36:12,920 so many battles at once. But as I recall, you asked me, 1893 01:36:13,520 --> 01:36:15,560 is there an open FBI case on me at the time? 1894 01:36:15,560 --> 01:36:16,760 Is that? Is that about? 1895 01:36:16,760 --> 01:36:19,560 Right. Yeah, Yeah, I wanted to know and 1896 01:36:19,880 --> 01:36:22,520 I did get an answer to that question elsewhere. 1897 01:36:22,520 --> 01:36:28,400 But what it turned out to be is that, you know, as far as like, 1898 01:36:28,400 --> 01:36:30,880 I don't know all the details of what is going on. 1899 01:36:30,880 --> 01:36:32,600 I know there's a sealed indictment. 1900 01:36:33,080 --> 01:36:36,800 I know that I had gotten a message that there was a Red 1901 01:36:36,800 --> 01:36:41,880 notices, Interpol Red notices, which are, it's an international 1902 01:36:42,320 --> 01:36:44,880 red notice where they'll arrest you at that airport. 1903 01:36:44,880 --> 01:36:46,920 So I had, you know, you can't go to Moscow directly. 1904 01:36:46,920 --> 01:36:49,840 You have to go through Istanbul, Turkey or Dubai. 1905 01:36:50,080 --> 01:36:52,800 And so I'd gone through Istanbul, Turkey into Moscow. 1906 01:36:53,760 --> 01:36:59,960 And so we've now like put out, you know, a request to see if if 1907 01:36:59,960 --> 01:37:03,480 I had the Red notice, like what countries those Interpol notices 1908 01:37:03,480 --> 01:37:05,640 are and things like that. These are international arrest 1909 01:37:05,640 --> 01:37:07,560 warrants. Right. 1910 01:37:08,720 --> 01:37:13,320 And what I've been told, or what's assumed is that there was 1911 01:37:13,320 --> 01:37:20,080 something about, I want to get this right, Farah, which is the 1912 01:37:20,080 --> 01:37:25,160 Foreign Registration Act, and that's like the back door into 1913 01:37:25,160 --> 01:37:29,120 the Espionage Act and conspiracy and possibly violation of 1914 01:37:29,120 --> 01:37:30,960 sanctions. So it was like a little bit of a 1915 01:37:30,960 --> 01:37:33,960 laundry list of things coming my way. 1916 01:37:34,720 --> 01:37:37,400 And it would have allowed them while they were sorting it out 1917 01:37:37,720 --> 01:37:42,960 to the the US can hold you for 18 months without charges and 1918 01:37:42,960 --> 01:37:45,040 they can hold you in foreign prisons that long. 1919 01:37:45,320 --> 01:37:47,600 Like for instance if I was in Istanbul, Turkey and had a red 1920 01:37:47,600 --> 01:37:49,560 notice, they could just hold me for months there. 1921 01:37:50,640 --> 01:37:52,480 In a Turkish Persian. Yep. 1922 01:37:53,120 --> 01:38:00,080 I don't, I don't know. Well, I have a human. 1923 01:38:00,920 --> 01:38:01,840 Rights attorney. So that's. 1924 01:38:02,040 --> 01:38:03,920 Right, and then, and that's the other thing I I know you have 1925 01:38:03,920 --> 01:38:05,720 people that are working on your behalf that are concerned about 1926 01:38:05,720 --> 01:38:06,760 this kind of thing. Folks, if you have some 1927 01:38:06,760 --> 01:38:08,720 different experience and it's professional and it's going to 1928 01:38:08,720 --> 01:38:10,720 be constructive, put it in the comments below. 1929 01:38:10,720 --> 01:38:12,320 By all means. We'll always read those kind of 1930 01:38:12,320 --> 01:38:14,960 things, especially if it takes off the the heat off someone. 1931 01:38:15,520 --> 01:38:19,680 OK, so you packed for a one week trip to go and do a translation 1932 01:38:19,680 --> 01:38:21,280 of a book. Can we throw the book on the on 1933 01:38:21,280 --> 01:38:24,800 the screen for a second here? Tell us what what drove you to 1934 01:38:24,880 --> 01:38:28,120 write the book? The Left Out When the Truth 1935 01:38:28,200 --> 01:38:32,360 Doesn't Fit in was actually published in 2020 and it was 1936 01:38:32,680 --> 01:38:36,280 about what happened and the media out, you know how they 1937 01:38:36,600 --> 01:38:40,640 really big basically crushed me and social media, you know, with 1938 01:38:40,640 --> 01:38:42,960 bots and democratic bots and things like that. 1939 01:38:42,960 --> 01:38:45,960 When after my family, I mean, they went after my family, my 1940 01:38:45,960 --> 01:38:48,960 friends, everything. And so I write about that in the 1941 01:38:48,960 --> 01:38:51,880 book, a little bit about my childhood, about the event 1942 01:38:51,880 --> 01:38:55,520 itself, and I even write about Russia and being accused of 1943 01:38:55,520 --> 01:38:57,160 being a Russian agent in that book. 1944 01:38:57,520 --> 01:39:03,520 And so I was adding a chapter to the book through this company 1945 01:39:03,600 --> 01:39:06,840 here, the international publishing company in Moscow, 1946 01:39:07,240 --> 01:39:09,200 and they were translating it into Russian. 1947 01:39:11,000 --> 01:39:14,320 And so while I was overseeing that, then, you know, it became 1948 01:39:14,320 --> 01:39:19,400 clear that I might not be able to if I went home, I could have 1949 01:39:19,400 --> 01:39:22,240 been facing, you know, years in jail. 1950 01:39:22,240 --> 01:39:26,600 And in the middle of all of this, I had been talking to Matt 1951 01:39:26,600 --> 01:39:30,320 Gaetz and Marjorie Taylor Green about testifying before 1952 01:39:30,320 --> 01:39:32,480 Congress. I'd had a long interview with 1953 01:39:32,480 --> 01:39:32,920 them. Did. 1954 01:39:33,200 --> 01:39:34,760 They reach out to you or did you reach to them? 1955 01:39:35,360 --> 01:39:38,520 They reached out to me and they were going to and if you can see 1956 01:39:38,520 --> 01:39:40,800 on Twitter, if you look through the history, you can see some of 1957 01:39:40,800 --> 01:39:42,400 the comments that Matt Gaetz gave. 1958 01:39:42,400 --> 01:39:47,200 He believed me and supported me. And he still, you know, he still 1959 01:39:47,200 --> 01:39:49,760 does and he, but I'm in Moscow, Russia. 1960 01:39:49,760 --> 01:39:52,000 So it's like, you know, whatever, but. 1961 01:39:52,200 --> 01:39:53,760 You're kind of untouchable in some ways now. 1962 01:39:54,080 --> 01:39:59,000 Yes, but he basically I reached out to his legal counsel and to 1963 01:39:59,000 --> 01:40:02,440 him and when I was in Moscow because they wanted me to come 1964 01:40:02,440 --> 01:40:08,360 to DC and. I didn't go, obviously, I stayed 1965 01:40:08,360 --> 01:40:11,960 in Russia, but I called him and he was one of the reasons why I 1966 01:40:11,960 --> 01:40:14,320 stayed, not the whole reason. He didn't give me advice. 1967 01:40:14,320 --> 01:40:16,240 He just simply gave me information. 1968 01:40:17,320 --> 01:40:19,240 And I'm glad he gave me honest information. 1969 01:40:19,240 --> 01:40:22,440 He gave me an honest take on it. He just said, Tara, you know, 1970 01:40:24,160 --> 01:40:26,120 I'm worried for your physical safety. 1971 01:40:26,120 --> 01:40:31,640 I know how these people operate, you know, and, and he was not 1972 01:40:31,640 --> 01:40:33,080 just talking about the legal stuff. 1973 01:40:33,160 --> 01:40:36,480 I had gotten a lot of threats on my life. 1974 01:40:36,520 --> 01:40:39,200 And remember, Matt Gaetz is close to, you know, the 1975 01:40:39,200 --> 01:40:42,720 intelligence community. So I think he had, you know, he 1976 01:40:42,720 --> 01:40:45,480 knows like how dangerous it is for whistleblowers and 1977 01:40:45,480 --> 01:40:47,560 witnesses. And he was concerned for my 1978 01:40:47,560 --> 01:40:50,640 safety and told me that. And he, you know, he basically 1979 01:40:50,640 --> 01:40:54,760 said as far as the legal stuff goes, he he couldn't, you know, 1980 01:40:54,760 --> 01:40:56,360 there's no way they can protect me from that. 1981 01:40:56,360 --> 01:41:01,120 I like, you know. There's no way, yeah, DOJ does 1982 01:41:01,120 --> 01:41:02,400 what it does. Is this an appropriate time to 1983 01:41:02,400 --> 01:41:04,120 play the the Kirby video that we have? 1984 01:41:04,360 --> 01:41:05,360 Yeah, yeah. And then? 1985 01:41:06,360 --> 01:41:09,280 Set set up the video and and where you were when you received 1986 01:41:09,280 --> 01:41:11,160 it if you would, and I'll have Ryan play it when you say so. 1987 01:41:11,320 --> 01:41:15,840 So I gave a press conference in Russia and I explained why I was 1988 01:41:15,840 --> 01:41:18,520 asking for asylum in Russia because I wanted people to know 1989 01:41:18,520 --> 01:41:22,320 that I was being intimidated and being kept from from testifying 1990 01:41:22,320 --> 01:41:26,680 against Biden. And then apparently, John Kirby 1991 01:41:26,680 --> 01:41:30,160 decided that he needed to give a press conference and talk about 1992 01:41:30,160 --> 01:41:31,200 it. So here it is. 1993 01:41:34,560 --> 01:41:38,160 Tara Reid, who was an aide to then Senator Biden back in the 1994 01:41:38,160 --> 01:41:42,440 90s and then in 2020 accused him of sexual assault. 1995 01:41:42,440 --> 01:41:45,600 She announced yesterday she's seeking citizenship in Russia 1996 01:41:45,600 --> 01:41:48,920 and she feels safer there. Does the White House have any 1997 01:41:49,200 --> 01:41:52,760 reaction to that announcement, given the accusations that she's 1998 01:41:52,760 --> 01:41:54,400 made against? President, we'd be load the. 1999 01:41:54,400 --> 01:41:58,880 Comment on the on the musings of a potential Russian citizen. 2000 01:41:58,880 --> 01:42:00,880 That's really up for her to. To speak to does. 2001 01:42:01,440 --> 01:42:05,400 The White House believe that her allegations may have been 2002 01:42:05,400 --> 01:42:10,120 motivated by her allegations to affinity for Russia. 2003 01:42:10,280 --> 01:42:16,320 Difficult to say. I mean, I can't get inside her, 2004 01:42:16,400 --> 01:42:19,640 her head and, and, and speak for her motivations and intentions. 2005 01:42:19,640 --> 01:42:21,440 That's really for her to speak to. 2006 01:42:21,440 --> 01:42:25,960 The one thing I will say is that the allegations that her life 2007 01:42:25,960 --> 01:42:29,720 was at risk by the United States government, absolutely false, 2008 01:42:29,720 --> 01:42:31,080 baseless. There's nothing to that. 2009 01:42:34,280 --> 01:42:36,000 What do you think when you see that? 2010 01:42:37,200 --> 01:42:39,120 Yeah. Well, he said it, so it must be 2011 01:42:39,120 --> 01:42:42,600 true, right? Yeah, I kind of took it like 2012 01:42:42,600 --> 01:42:45,000 opposite world. Like when he says you're safe, 2013 01:42:45,000 --> 01:42:50,360 you're not safe because he says a lot of things, right? 2014 01:42:50,760 --> 01:42:52,160 He's, you know, the head of the NSA. 2015 01:42:52,160 --> 01:42:55,000 So. Where where were you when you 2016 01:42:55,000 --> 01:42:59,720 saw that video first? I was in Russia, so I watched it 2017 01:42:59,720 --> 01:43:02,280 and I was having, you know, those ambivalent feelings like, 2018 01:43:02,280 --> 01:43:04,120 well, maybe I can go back. And then I saw that and I was 2019 01:43:04,120 --> 01:43:07,880 like, oh, OK, no. And he gave 2, by the way, there 2020 01:43:07,880 --> 01:43:11,080 were, that was one of them. He gave another set of comments 2021 01:43:11,080 --> 01:43:13,240 too. So he was pretty. 2022 01:43:14,280 --> 01:43:17,560 Anyway, my lawyer said I I think I made the NSA mad so. 2023 01:43:18,680 --> 01:43:22,480 Oh well done. So apparently they had different 2024 01:43:22,480 --> 01:43:25,520 plans and I didn't follow the Yeah. 2025 01:43:26,360 --> 01:43:27,920 You weren't following what they expected. 2026 01:43:28,120 --> 01:43:30,160 Well, here's the thing that we found and, and I think that you 2027 01:43:30,160 --> 01:43:32,400 and I share this, is that they have an, there's an expectation 2028 01:43:32,400 --> 01:43:35,000 of what you will do and there's a playbook that people do 2029 01:43:35,000 --> 01:43:37,320 because that's how the success has been achieved. 2030 01:43:37,320 --> 01:43:41,040 And stifling stories from going public, whatever those stories 2031 01:43:41,040 --> 01:43:43,080 may be. And when you go outside of the, 2032 01:43:43,080 --> 01:43:46,440 the, the boundaries, when you color outside of the lines, it 2033 01:43:46,440 --> 01:43:49,320 upsets them. And also it makes them do things 2034 01:43:49,320 --> 01:43:50,760 that they don't know what to do with you. 2035 01:43:50,760 --> 01:43:52,440 And it gives you at least a little bit of wiggle room. 2036 01:43:53,160 --> 01:43:55,760 And I'm, I'm very appreciative that you're sharing your story 2037 01:43:55,760 --> 01:43:57,680 here with us because I think that people should hear it. 2038 01:43:57,840 --> 01:43:59,520 I hope there's some more journalists that will look into 2039 01:43:59,560 --> 01:44:01,760 it and, and follow up on some of the allegations on there. 2040 01:44:02,120 --> 01:44:03,320 For what it's worth, you talked to you. 2041 01:44:03,480 --> 01:44:05,160 I know you sat down with Tucker three times. 2042 01:44:05,280 --> 01:44:07,040 He brought up your story. Obviously you have some private 2043 01:44:07,040 --> 01:44:08,760 moments when you guys 'cause you were in person doing the 2044 01:44:08,760 --> 01:44:11,360 interviews, right? How did he receive you? 2045 01:44:12,720 --> 01:44:15,520 He was very warm, like at first, you know, he was like didn't 2046 01:44:15,520 --> 01:44:17,880 know what to make of me. And then after talking to me 2047 01:44:17,880 --> 01:44:20,320 afterwards, he became very warm and gave me his phone number. 2048 01:44:20,600 --> 01:44:24,040 He said he believed me and he wanted to talk to me more. 2049 01:44:24,040 --> 01:44:27,600 And he, you know, because we had like a 3 1/2 hour conversation, 2050 01:44:27,600 --> 01:44:29,920 an hour ended up hour and a half or whatever ended up in the 2051 01:44:29,920 --> 01:44:32,840 interview. But he, he and I saw eye to eye 2052 01:44:32,840 --> 01:44:35,480 and a lot of things anti, he's very anti imperialist. 2053 01:44:35,480 --> 01:44:39,000 He's a libertarian and I think there's parts of me that are 2054 01:44:39,000 --> 01:44:43,520 very libertarian too. So we kind of bonded on those 2055 01:44:43,520 --> 01:44:47,640 political belief systems. I didn't anticipate at the time, 2056 01:44:47,640 --> 01:44:49,120 you know, that he would be fired. 2057 01:44:49,120 --> 01:44:51,640 And, you know, now he's, of course he doesn't. 2058 01:44:51,640 --> 01:44:53,680 He can have his own platform. He'll do his own thing. 2059 01:44:53,760 --> 01:44:56,920 He'll be fine. But still, he was doing such 2060 01:44:56,920 --> 01:45:00,280 great work. I I'm really shocked, although I 2061 01:45:00,280 --> 01:45:03,840 shouldn't be, but I still am, that he was, you know, removed. 2062 01:45:04,680 --> 01:45:07,600 But he was also open to hearing about Russia, you know, and, 2063 01:45:07,760 --> 01:45:12,760 and, you know, I have to say, Kyle, I think that what people 2064 01:45:12,760 --> 01:45:16,800 don't understand in America is that there's a lot of propaganda 2065 01:45:16,800 --> 01:45:20,240 to try to keep us from knowing the truth about Russia. 2066 01:45:20,600 --> 01:45:23,800 And I think it's not just political about, you know, 2067 01:45:24,280 --> 01:45:26,800 tension. I think what it is is they don't 2068 01:45:26,800 --> 01:45:28,560 want us to know how good the life is here. 2069 01:45:29,560 --> 01:45:33,600 Their economy is booming despite the sanctions, and it's very 2070 01:45:33,600 --> 01:45:35,600 clean. It's very efficient city in 2071 01:45:35,600 --> 01:45:37,120 Moscow. I've been to other cities, I've 2072 01:45:37,120 --> 01:45:40,440 been to the Caucasus, I've been to Saint Petersburg, I've been 2073 01:45:40,440 --> 01:45:43,800 to Sochi. And I've seen, you know, the 2074 01:45:43,800 --> 01:45:45,760 countryside. I've taken a train and seen 2075 01:45:45,760 --> 01:45:48,760 other small towns. Some of them don't have as much 2076 01:45:48,760 --> 01:45:52,720 as others. But here you see a scene of this 2077 01:45:52,720 --> 01:45:58,120 is Red Square near the Kremlin, and you see the the. 2078 01:45:59,840 --> 01:46:01,760 This is your video. This is video you shot just 2079 01:46:01,760 --> 01:46:04,280 walking around. Just walking around, people are 2080 01:46:04,280 --> 01:46:07,280 happy and content there. You have a very thriving middle 2081 01:46:07,280 --> 01:46:10,480 class. A very and here is from a boat I 2082 01:46:10,480 --> 01:46:12,480 took a little. They have boat tours almost 2083 01:46:12,920 --> 01:46:16,640 every day you can take and it's a really nice kind of way to see 2084 01:46:16,640 --> 01:46:19,200 the city. Where are the homeless people? 2085 01:46:20,520 --> 01:46:24,560 You don't see homeless people, and in fact, 80 to 90% of 2086 01:46:25,280 --> 01:46:29,680 Moscovites own their own apartments and even a dasha. 2087 01:46:29,680 --> 01:46:32,240 So we're talking young people out of college. 2088 01:46:32,600 --> 01:46:34,360 It's very easy to own homes. What? 2089 01:46:34,560 --> 01:46:35,600 What? Is that percentage? 2090 01:46:37,040 --> 01:46:40,640 80 to 90% that own it outright. Not a bank owns it. 2091 01:46:40,640 --> 01:46:42,960 Like I thought that meant a mortgage but it doesn't. 2092 01:46:43,240 --> 01:46:45,040 I was wrong. It's it outright. 2093 01:46:45,560 --> 01:46:48,000 This is a subway system that you're seeing here. 2094 01:46:48,480 --> 01:46:50,200 If you look at it, look how beautiful it is. 2095 01:46:50,200 --> 01:46:52,880 They look like museums. Each stops unique and different 2096 01:46:55,000 --> 01:46:57,600 and and they're always very clean, very efficient. 2097 01:46:57,600 --> 01:46:58,960 They run every two or three minutes. 2098 01:46:59,000 --> 01:47:01,760 You can go anywhere in the city. Who's playing the music and 2099 01:47:01,800 --> 01:47:03,400 pooping on the side of the platform? 2100 01:47:03,880 --> 01:47:06,880 Well, you know what? There are sometimes musicians 2101 01:47:06,880 --> 01:47:10,400 like, but you'll hear classical music as opposed to other 2102 01:47:10,400 --> 01:47:13,640 things. And yeah, you don't see any kind 2103 01:47:13,640 --> 01:47:15,720 of of that. Like there's nothing like that. 2104 01:47:15,880 --> 01:47:17,560 And you don't even see a lot of police. 2105 01:47:17,560 --> 01:47:18,680 That's what's really interesting. 2106 01:47:18,680 --> 01:47:22,480 It's not like you constantly see police because you don't. 2107 01:47:22,520 --> 01:47:24,800 It's, it's just a really well run city. 2108 01:47:24,800 --> 01:47:27,600 They're there, I'm sure security's there, everything's 2109 01:47:27,600 --> 01:47:31,840 monitored. But again, they, there's a 2110 01:47:31,840 --> 01:47:35,560 social net I think for people that have struggles. 2111 01:47:35,560 --> 01:47:39,800 So they have homes and they have basic food needs taken care of 2112 01:47:39,800 --> 01:47:43,520 and transportation's cheap. So like workers that have to 2113 01:47:43,520 --> 01:47:45,800 work across the city, like let's say 30 minute commute or 2114 01:47:45,800 --> 01:47:49,000 whatever, it's 500 rubles, which is about $0.50. 2115 01:47:49,600 --> 01:47:52,280 And and that train, like if you miss one, there's 1-2 minutes 2116 01:47:52,280 --> 01:47:54,320 later and then there's another 1-2 minutes later. 2117 01:47:54,440 --> 01:47:56,320 It's 550 cents. What was I saying? 2118 01:47:56,320 --> 01:47:59,520 It's 100 rupals is a dollar. Is that not what I saw recently? 2119 01:48:00,120 --> 01:48:01,360 No, no, I don't. I don't know. 2120 01:48:01,360 --> 01:48:04,600 But I think I it's about $0.50 is how much the subway is. 2121 01:48:04,600 --> 01:48:07,880 So if I got the the denominations wrong, I probably 2122 01:48:09,280 --> 01:48:12,960 did. And yeah, I always tip too much 2123 01:48:12,960 --> 01:48:14,960 and people are always stopping don't tip that much. 2124 01:48:14,960 --> 01:48:16,880 They. Yeah, I got that when I was in 2125 01:48:16,880 --> 01:48:20,320 Poland many years ago. Yeah, I did that in Poland when 2126 01:48:20,320 --> 01:48:22,440 the money was like water there. We had 4-5 X. 2127 01:48:22,440 --> 01:48:24,640 Like your dollar went so much further at that point. 2128 01:48:24,640 --> 01:48:27,120 And I remember people telling me, no, you know, like I think 2129 01:48:27,120 --> 01:48:30,720 $13 paid for, you know, meal for two people. 2130 01:48:30,960 --> 01:48:34,280 And then on top of that, it also was like a 50% tip and people 2131 01:48:34,280 --> 01:48:36,000 looked at you like you were a rich person act. 2132 01:48:36,000 --> 01:48:38,120 And I was like, I'm just trying to be not like $13 is not that 2133 01:48:38,120 --> 01:48:40,920 much money to me, even though I had no money at the top. 2134 01:48:42,040 --> 01:48:44,000 Well, you. Know what the wages, the wages 2135 01:48:44,000 --> 01:48:46,960 are a little lower in Russia, but the cost of living is so 2136 01:48:46,960 --> 01:48:48,760 much lower for the people. So they have their 2137 01:48:48,760 --> 01:48:50,440 transportation pretty well taken care of. 2138 01:48:50,640 --> 01:48:52,720 Education is paid for. Medical is very cheap. 2139 01:48:53,080 --> 01:48:57,840 I have to have like something done with the with amri thing. 2140 01:48:58,160 --> 01:49:04,360 An MRI, which is thousands of dollars in the US is $200 in, in 2141 01:49:04,360 --> 01:49:07,360 Moscow to pay out of pocket. And most places have insurance, 2142 01:49:07,880 --> 01:49:11,240 so it's free. And you know, there's a big 2143 01:49:11,240 --> 01:49:13,560 state system for, for medical too. 2144 01:49:14,800 --> 01:49:17,240 You know, it's not, I'm not saying, I'm not here to say 2145 01:49:17,240 --> 01:49:19,840 everything's perfect. I'm just here to say I think 2146 01:49:19,840 --> 01:49:23,200 we've been kept from knowing how good it is because they're 2147 01:49:23,200 --> 01:49:26,000 capitalistic. They, and, and I see people in 2148 01:49:26,000 --> 01:49:27,560 their comments communist, blah, blah, blah. 2149 01:49:27,560 --> 01:49:31,320 They're not communist at all. This is a very thriving economy 2150 01:49:31,320 --> 01:49:33,800 of capitalism, but it's not crony capitalism. 2151 01:49:34,640 --> 01:49:37,240 And that's the difference. And in the US, we're suffering 2152 01:49:37,240 --> 01:49:40,040 right now under the weight of crony capitalism. 2153 01:49:40,240 --> 01:49:43,080 So it's very top heavy and nothing in between. 2154 01:49:43,280 --> 01:49:45,600 And then poverty, you know, it's just poverty. 2155 01:49:46,160 --> 01:49:49,760 Whereas in Russia, you know, it's growing, it's new 2156 01:49:49,840 --> 01:49:55,640 capitalism is relatively new, and you're seeing a thriving 2157 01:49:55,640 --> 01:49:58,120 middle class. This is Gorky Park. 2158 01:49:58,760 --> 01:50:01,120 Gorky Park is one of the big major parks, kind of like 2159 01:50:01,120 --> 01:50:04,960 Central Park in New York. It's quite beautiful, it looks 2160 01:50:04,960 --> 01:50:06,320 like. The IT looks like the Queen's 2161 01:50:06,320 --> 01:50:10,280 Gardens in in London. It's, it's one of the few 2162 01:50:10,280 --> 01:50:13,600 sections and there's places where they just let it go wild 2163 01:50:13,600 --> 01:50:16,560 and there's wildflowers. There's, there's skate park, 2164 01:50:16,720 --> 01:50:20,200 there's a concert area, there's a huge pond where you can take 2165 01:50:20,200 --> 01:50:23,600 little boats and there's Swans. I mean, it's a huge park. 2166 01:50:23,600 --> 01:50:25,560 Like I only got like 1 little piece of it. 2167 01:50:26,720 --> 01:50:28,120 There's parks all over the place. 2168 01:50:28,120 --> 01:50:31,000 They, they put a lot of emphasis on greenery in Moscow. 2169 01:50:31,640 --> 01:50:34,240 And one of the things that I found really striking here is, 2170 01:50:34,240 --> 01:50:36,760 you know, when you're in New York, there's like this kinetic 2171 01:50:36,760 --> 01:50:39,440 energy. It's very intense and you're 2172 01:50:39,440 --> 01:50:40,920 always kind of on guard and it's. 2173 01:50:41,000 --> 01:50:42,560 Hectic. Mm hmm. 2174 01:50:43,040 --> 01:50:46,000 It's dangerous. Moscow's as big as New York. 2175 01:50:46,000 --> 01:50:48,760 But you don't. It's more relaxed. 2176 01:50:48,800 --> 01:50:50,880 You have people moving quickly, right? 2177 01:50:51,280 --> 01:50:54,760 Because people can rent scooters and bikes everywhere. 2178 01:50:54,760 --> 01:50:56,720 They're everywhere. You just rent them with your app 2179 01:50:57,360 --> 01:51:01,960 and everyone's moving really fast, but yet there's a calmness 2180 01:51:02,320 --> 01:51:04,400 and like when you're in the parks, you see a lot of 2181 01:51:04,400 --> 01:51:06,720 families, very traditional families. 2182 01:51:07,080 --> 01:51:10,360 There's an earnestness. If someone hears me speak 2183 01:51:10,360 --> 01:51:13,800 English, they run up and they want to talk to me and they're 2184 01:51:13,800 --> 01:51:17,160 really, there's no animosity. I've never not experienced it 2185 01:51:17,160 --> 01:51:18,960 one time. Why? 2186 01:51:18,960 --> 01:51:20,720 I've been here and I've been here now four months. 2187 01:51:20,720 --> 01:51:23,760 So since May 20th I've been here. 2188 01:51:23,760 --> 01:51:29,240 It's gone fast too, hasn't it? So and there's been no like they 2189 01:51:29,320 --> 01:51:32,360 they don't feel animosity towards Americans. 2190 01:51:32,600 --> 01:51:37,200 So all of this hatred that in vitrol coming from Washington DC 2191 01:51:37,400 --> 01:51:38,320 is really sad. Let. 2192 01:51:39,080 --> 01:51:44,080 Me, let me throw a, a, a mirror image at you, 1980s. 2193 01:51:44,640 --> 01:51:48,200 We're thinking about Russia in the United States and we think 2194 01:51:48,200 --> 01:51:52,840 that it's Gray and it's dingy and it's economically depressed 2195 01:51:52,840 --> 01:51:55,400 and they're losing the Cold War and they've lost freedoms. 2196 01:51:55,400 --> 01:51:56,800 They have totalitarianism over them. 2197 01:51:56,880 --> 01:51:58,720 And all the things that we heard, I don't know if they're 2198 01:51:58,720 --> 01:52:01,360 true or not because I wasn't there, but probably wasn't 2199 01:52:01,360 --> 01:52:05,680 great. And then we always heard that 2200 01:52:05,680 --> 01:52:10,720 there was a constant traded effort. 2201 01:52:12,880 --> 01:52:14,800 Do you remember, did we just lose our feed? 2202 01:52:14,800 --> 01:52:16,880 There it is. So do you do you remember like 2203 01:52:16,880 --> 01:52:18,800 they were always saying that the Russians, we had the Radio Free 2204 01:52:18,800 --> 01:52:21,120 Europe movements, we were always trying to broadcast in behind 2205 01:52:21,120 --> 01:52:22,840 the Iron Curtain. We were trying to let them know 2206 01:52:22,840 --> 01:52:24,800 that things were better and that you could overthrow the, you 2207 01:52:24,920 --> 01:52:26,920 know, communist overlords and and live freedom. 2208 01:52:27,240 --> 01:52:30,640 That was the American push and they were and the, and the 2209 01:52:31,280 --> 01:52:33,240 theoretically the, the government there of the USSR was 2210 01:52:33,240 --> 01:52:37,320 trying to stop that. And now I feel like maybe we've 2211 01:52:37,320 --> 01:52:38,920 switched roles based on what you're saying. 2212 01:52:39,040 --> 01:52:41,320 I don't know if it's 100% true, but I trust you as a human 2213 01:52:41,320 --> 01:52:42,960 being. I'm sure your experience is 2214 01:52:42,960 --> 01:52:46,560 being honest. Have we just swapped places? 2215 01:52:47,400 --> 01:52:51,520 I'm wondering, I'm thinking the same thing because like what 2216 01:52:51,520 --> 01:52:54,160 this has been feeling like to me being here because I didn't 2217 01:52:54,160 --> 01:52:56,720 really expect it to be this nice, right? 2218 01:52:56,720 --> 01:53:00,480 Like I kind of even though I was pushing back on risophobia, I 2219 01:53:00,480 --> 01:53:03,400 still was indoctrinated to think of Russia a certain way. 2220 01:53:03,800 --> 01:53:06,240 And I had to be here to really experience it to see like, wow, 2221 01:53:06,240 --> 01:53:08,600 this is completely different than what I thought. 2222 01:53:08,640 --> 01:53:13,080 And they have like super modern and, you know, really cool 2223 01:53:13,080 --> 01:53:15,920 things going on and innovation that we don't have right now in 2224 01:53:15,920 --> 01:53:18,720 the US And it's like you said, we switched roles. 2225 01:53:19,000 --> 01:53:23,120 But it's it's nostalgic for me of what the 80s were like in 2226 01:53:23,120 --> 01:53:26,480 America. Like there was an innocence. 2227 01:53:26,560 --> 01:53:29,760 There was something different, right? 2228 01:53:30,080 --> 01:53:33,600 Right now, I feel like the United States is like what the 2229 01:53:33,600 --> 01:53:35,760 Soviet Union was right before it collapsed. 2230 01:53:36,120 --> 01:53:40,760 I really am concerned that and I don't want that to happen to the 2231 01:53:40,760 --> 01:53:45,440 country that I was born in, but I feel like under Biden, and if 2232 01:53:45,440 --> 01:53:49,160 it continues and it goes to like Gavin Newsom and they continue 2233 01:53:49,160 --> 01:53:52,640 with the same path, I think the government is going to collapse. 2234 01:53:52,640 --> 01:53:57,880 I think that it is collapsing because of the culture and and 2235 01:53:57,880 --> 01:54:00,400 everything it's it's, you know, become eroded. 2236 01:54:00,600 --> 01:54:03,680 One thing that that about Putin that's interesting is he chose 2237 01:54:03,680 --> 01:54:10,160 to ban Monsanto and to ban hormones and foods. 2238 01:54:10,280 --> 01:54:13,520 He was watching the culture and he and you know, like they say 2239 01:54:13,520 --> 01:54:17,520 he's anti that he's a anti LGBT, which isn't true. 2240 01:54:17,800 --> 01:54:20,440 I thought he was anti shirt. He just likes to ride bears. 2241 01:54:20,440 --> 01:54:23,720 That's what I was under the. Impression of but but like what 2242 01:54:23,760 --> 01:54:28,560 with the Russian culture is Orthodox Christian and so LGBT. 2243 01:54:28,560 --> 01:54:31,920 They're very concerned about children and they're, they are 2244 01:54:31,920 --> 01:54:34,400 very concerned about children. Like you'll go into a bookstore 2245 01:54:34,400 --> 01:54:37,400 and there are books that are not allowed for children under 18 2246 01:54:37,400 --> 01:54:38,720 and they're wrapped a certain way. 2247 01:54:38,960 --> 01:54:40,480 I mean, they protect their children. 2248 01:54:40,480 --> 01:54:42,080 They want them to have their innocence. 2249 01:54:42,080 --> 01:54:43,560 Like the 80s. Yeah. 2250 01:54:43,560 --> 01:54:46,520 And I think that that's OK. Like, what's wrong with that? 2251 01:54:47,640 --> 01:54:49,640 What's wrong with protecting children? 2252 01:54:50,360 --> 01:54:52,520 They don't need to know everything, right? 2253 01:54:52,560 --> 01:54:54,720 Like right away. They need to be able to grow and 2254 01:54:54,720 --> 01:54:57,400 then assimilate things in a natural way. 2255 01:54:57,920 --> 01:55:03,400 But but anyway, back to Monsanto, they don't allow, you 2256 01:55:03,400 --> 01:55:07,040 know, a lot of the, the pesticides here and, and in 2257 01:55:07,040 --> 01:55:09,320 Europe too, there are certain countries in Europe that also 2258 01:55:09,320 --> 01:55:11,800 banned them. But he just, he just saw all the 2259 01:55:11,800 --> 01:55:16,320 illness and all the carcinogens in the food and he decided to, 2260 01:55:16,600 --> 01:55:18,960 to do all that. So that got implemented a few 2261 01:55:18,960 --> 01:55:22,840 years ago. And they have so like you don't 2262 01:55:22,840 --> 01:55:24,880 have to look for organic food. It's everywhere you go. 2263 01:55:26,160 --> 01:55:27,640 I saw the pictures that you sent me. 2264 01:55:27,920 --> 01:55:30,640 There's not a lot of people that look like American classic 2265 01:55:30,640 --> 01:55:34,800 obesity, unhealthy looking kind of mom and dads struggling with 2266 01:55:34,800 --> 01:55:35,960 overweight kids and things like that. 2267 01:55:35,960 --> 01:55:37,280 I didn't see that. I mean, Ryan can roll some of 2268 01:55:37,280 --> 01:55:39,120 the footage while you're talking, but you mentioned 2269 01:55:39,120 --> 01:55:40,600 something about the health of the middle class there. 2270 01:55:40,680 --> 01:55:43,280 It was kind of impressive to me. And we're just looking at people 2271 01:55:43,280 --> 01:55:44,640 in the city. So maybe that's what people in 2272 01:55:44,640 --> 01:55:47,560 cities look like, but. No, no, no. 2273 01:55:47,600 --> 01:55:49,400 It's, it's like that. I mean, there are people of all 2274 01:55:49,400 --> 01:55:52,160 different kinds of sizes, right? And different backgrounds. 2275 01:55:52,160 --> 01:55:56,520 I mean, Russia's very diverse actually, with different 2276 01:55:56,520 --> 01:55:59,480 cultures and different religions and whatnot. 2277 01:55:59,480 --> 01:56:03,200 But you notice a lot of fit people because they don't have 2278 01:56:03,200 --> 01:56:04,880 poison in their food. Their food's not poisoned. 2279 01:56:05,080 --> 01:56:10,120 And you have access to activities, you walk a lot, you 2280 01:56:10,120 --> 01:56:14,920 have access to gyms, things are cheaper and there's not the air 2281 01:56:14,920 --> 01:56:17,280 of desperation. Like look at, look at if you 2282 01:56:17,280 --> 01:56:20,120 looked at those footages, you saw the calmness, people going 2283 01:56:20,120 --> 01:56:21,400 about their business that was during. 2284 01:56:21,880 --> 01:56:23,560 Yeah, it kind of freaks me out, to be honest. 2285 01:56:23,560 --> 01:56:25,520 Like I don't see people. They look like they're in a like 2286 01:56:25,520 --> 01:56:30,440 a movie set maybe. Yeah, so that's, that's, I mean, 2287 01:56:30,440 --> 01:56:33,040 it's been a real, they talk about culture shock. 2288 01:56:33,040 --> 01:56:37,800 The culture shock has been realizing how bad things are in 2289 01:56:37,800 --> 01:56:40,760 the US and that's been hard. And I know that again, it makes 2290 01:56:40,800 --> 01:56:45,840 the CIA officers mad. Sorry boys, but it's the truth. 2291 01:56:46,160 --> 01:56:49,200 They're hiding it from us. They've taken our country into 2292 01:56:49,200 --> 01:56:53,880 disarray and ruin. And I've just, I'm in a country 2293 01:56:53,880 --> 01:56:56,840 where they're building and they believe innovation. 2294 01:56:57,880 --> 01:57:00,240 I I showed a clip from Trading Spaces. 2295 01:57:00,240 --> 01:57:01,840 Do you remember that movie with Eddie Murphy? 2296 01:57:01,960 --> 01:57:04,080 It's the 80s movie about Wall Street. 2297 01:57:04,080 --> 01:57:05,480 I. Never saw it though. 2298 01:57:05,640 --> 01:57:06,720 Oh, you're not missing a whole lot. 2299 01:57:06,720 --> 01:57:08,920 I mean, it's just a cutesy movie, but you know, classic 2300 01:57:08,920 --> 01:57:12,280 Eddie Murphy stuff. And, and I've been watching 80s 2301 01:57:12,280 --> 01:57:13,720 movies. I've been watching early 90s 2302 01:57:13,720 --> 01:57:16,840 movies with my kids. It's like walking back in time. 2303 01:57:17,040 --> 01:57:19,240 It's like looking at a thing that was calmer. 2304 01:57:19,600 --> 01:57:21,520 I I just watched honey I shrunk the kids. 2305 01:57:21,520 --> 01:57:23,840 This is probably overshare but I watched My wife Found it for 5 2306 01:57:23,840 --> 01:57:25,240 bucks. You remember Rick Morandis is in 2307 01:57:25,240 --> 01:57:26,280 it. Can't remember the name of the 2308 01:57:26,440 --> 01:57:28,840 female actress but she's in a lot of movies and she's great. 2309 01:57:29,280 --> 01:57:33,040 And the kids are cute. They're sweet, right? 2310 01:57:33,520 --> 01:57:37,240 And the story was the mom and the dad had a fight and she's 2311 01:57:37,240 --> 01:57:40,600 out and staying at her sisters and she calls on the phone and 2312 01:57:40,600 --> 01:57:43,040 she wishes him good luck, honey. And it's not the story of 2313 01:57:43,040 --> 01:57:45,400 divorce, although that was very common in the 80s and the 90s. 2314 01:57:45,400 --> 01:57:48,480 We experienced a lot of that. It was she said, we need to put 2315 01:57:48,480 --> 01:57:51,240 this family back together. And so that was the the message 2316 01:57:51,240 --> 01:57:53,840 that came out of out of Hollywood. 2317 01:57:54,360 --> 01:57:57,080 And in a lot of ways, if people want to look back in time, they 2318 01:57:57,080 --> 01:57:58,440 can see how much more hopeful it was. 2319 01:57:58,440 --> 01:58:00,640 Part of it was probably the cocaine in the 80s, but there 2320 01:58:00,640 --> 01:58:03,520 was a hope that existed like you just talked about. 2321 01:58:03,760 --> 01:58:06,480 And I think so many people that are learnt looking for that and 2322 01:58:06,480 --> 01:58:08,480 are upset about the way America looks right now. 2323 01:58:09,080 --> 01:58:11,160 I feel like a lot of us are looking for, it's a nostalgia 2324 01:58:11,160 --> 01:58:14,680 feeling for for my childhood, for your childhood, which is to 2325 01:58:14,680 --> 01:58:17,120 say that end of Cold War era where there was a lot of 2326 01:58:17,120 --> 01:58:20,000 possibilities. And there's a big sadness when 2327 01:58:20,000 --> 01:58:22,400 it's gone because it feels like we lost something really 2328 01:58:22,400 --> 01:58:24,280 important and our kids are not going to get it. 2329 01:58:24,360 --> 01:58:25,880 Your daughter just graduated from grad school. 2330 01:58:26,200 --> 01:58:27,880 I know you called me yesterday to tell me about that. 2331 01:58:28,320 --> 01:58:31,040 And she's. Not going to inherit that same 2332 01:58:31,040 --> 01:58:32,160 world. She's not walking into the same 2333 01:58:32,160 --> 01:58:35,240 world that you did. No, she's walking into a world 2334 01:58:35,640 --> 01:58:37,560 of a lot of broken people that need a lot of help. 2335 01:58:38,400 --> 01:58:44,320 And, you know, I have to say, you know, I, it's been hard to 2336 01:58:44,320 --> 01:58:48,480 to suddenly go to a different country and then ask for safety 2337 01:58:48,680 --> 01:58:52,400 because I, I just refused to go home and be put in a cage or to 2338 01:58:52,400 --> 01:58:54,560 have, you know, be threatened anymore. 2339 01:58:54,560 --> 01:58:56,280 So I decided to stay here in Russia. 2340 01:58:56,640 --> 01:58:59,080 I did apply for asylum. I'm waiting for my final 2341 01:58:59,080 --> 01:59:03,320 paperwork and citizenship. My dream was to have both like 2342 01:59:03,320 --> 01:59:06,680 to, to go back and forth, right. But I don't know if that'll be 2343 01:59:06,680 --> 01:59:08,280 possible. I don't know when I'll be able 2344 01:59:08,280 --> 01:59:10,640 to go back to the United States. So one of the difficult 2345 01:59:10,640 --> 01:59:13,360 conversations I had to have with my daughter was, you know, I 2346 01:59:13,360 --> 01:59:14,520 don't know when I'll see her again. 2347 01:59:14,960 --> 01:59:21,280 And that was a conversation of many tears over the course of 2348 01:59:21,280 --> 01:59:25,000 many weeks here. But she also is of the mind that 2349 01:59:25,920 --> 01:59:29,920 I'm safer here and it's better for me to be here. 2350 01:59:30,840 --> 01:59:33,200 I wasn't going to be and, and, and just, you know, I wasn't 2351 01:59:33,200 --> 01:59:35,240 allowed to work. I wasn't allowed to function. 2352 01:59:35,560 --> 01:59:37,520 I was they were just on me about little things. 2353 01:59:37,520 --> 01:59:40,560 Now it's taxes, you know, and before it was this or that. 2354 01:59:40,800 --> 01:59:44,360 And it's just everything, you know it, you know, they just 2355 01:59:44,360 --> 01:59:48,920 come at you with everything. And you know, when when the DOJ 2356 01:59:48,920 --> 01:59:52,080 gets weaponized like it did. And I think the most important 2357 01:59:52,080 --> 01:59:55,760 thing for people to do right now is to understand how weaponized 2358 01:59:55,760 --> 01:59:57,720 our government is against its own citizens. 2359 01:59:58,120 --> 02:00:00,720 Not this is I could I am everyone, right? 2360 02:00:00,720 --> 02:00:02,880 Like I could be anyone. They're weaponized against you, 2361 02:00:02,880 --> 02:00:05,800 Kyle, because you spoke up. They're weaponized against the 2362 02:00:05,800 --> 02:00:10,600 former President Donald Trump. Monday he's going to be maybe 2363 02:00:10,600 --> 02:00:15,040 put in jail. With 19 other people who it's 2364 02:00:15,080 --> 02:00:18,880 just, it's mind boggling to me. You I I haven't disclosed this 2365 02:00:18,880 --> 02:00:20,760 on our show before, but we're talking and we're sharing 2366 02:00:20,760 --> 02:00:21,960 stories and so I'll share the story. 2367 02:00:21,960 --> 02:00:26,120 I got a bill for about $10,000 for insurance that I didn't know 2368 02:00:26,120 --> 02:00:28,800 that I had because the FBI kicked me out of the office and 2369 02:00:28,800 --> 02:00:30,040 they said that I owed them back money. 2370 02:00:30,040 --> 02:00:32,120 I don't intend to pay them that. And then they sent me another 2371 02:00:32,120 --> 02:00:35,320 bill through e-mail and they said that you owe us $10,000 for 2372 02:00:35,320 --> 02:00:38,000 the move that we paid for to move you to a job that we 2373 02:00:38,000 --> 02:00:39,480 cancelled you from in New Mexico. 2374 02:00:39,800 --> 02:00:41,280 And I've been dealing with that on the back end. 2375 02:00:41,400 --> 02:00:43,600 So you talk about the weaponization and hassling you 2376 02:00:43,600 --> 02:00:46,680 over little things like taxes. And this is not a little space 2377 02:00:46,760 --> 02:00:48,040 because. It's the administrative 2378 02:00:48,040 --> 02:00:49,320 bullshit, Yeah, it's over and over again. 2379 02:00:49,320 --> 02:00:51,400 It's the FBI. It's the DOJ sending you a bill 2380 02:00:51,720 --> 02:00:54,720 and saying were coming for you. And then they also sent me a 2381 02:00:54,720 --> 02:00:57,760 letter that said they accused me of 10 different crimes that they 2382 02:00:57,760 --> 02:01:00,120 were investigating with their internal affairs division 2383 02:01:00,280 --> 02:01:04,280 because I was an employee unless I quit, which I did because I 2384 02:01:04,280 --> 02:01:06,480 don't need them anymore. And honestly, I didn't consider 2385 02:01:06,480 --> 02:01:08,680 myself an employee there if they wanted me to break up with them 2386 02:01:08,680 --> 02:01:09,840 because they broke up with me already. 2387 02:01:09,840 --> 02:01:11,200 I did the same. And I don't mean to make it 2388 02:01:11,200 --> 02:01:14,080 about me in this case, but I I do think that is the kinship 2389 02:01:14,080 --> 02:01:17,680 that you and I have. Here's up with America, you 2390 02:01:17,800 --> 02:01:19,560 know. Which is, which is what we were 2391 02:01:19,560 --> 02:01:21,480 talking about yesterday. And, and I know you called me 2392 02:01:21,480 --> 02:01:22,880 and, and, and you were tearful about it. 2393 02:01:22,880 --> 02:01:25,520 And I, I can, I, we started off and I was like, Oh my God, like, 2394 02:01:25,520 --> 02:01:27,400 what do we? I don't even know what to say to 2395 02:01:27,400 --> 02:01:28,920 you. But here's the questions that I 2396 02:01:28,920 --> 02:01:32,280 think people are going to have. Were you scared getting on that 2397 02:01:32,280 --> 02:01:34,240 plane to go there and translate the book? 2398 02:01:34,560 --> 02:01:36,800 And if not, did something change when you were there? 2399 02:01:37,960 --> 02:01:40,960 No, I mean, I had like, I was scared about the death threats 2400 02:01:40,960 --> 02:01:43,920 and stuff like that, but I was excited about seeing Moscow. 2401 02:01:43,920 --> 02:01:46,120 But I was coming right back. It was like a quick trip. 2402 02:01:46,360 --> 02:01:48,080 So I didn't have that in my mind. 2403 02:01:49,160 --> 02:01:53,040 I was more apprehensive about like, you know, testifying 2404 02:01:53,040 --> 02:01:56,440 before Congress later on. That was something, Were they 2405 02:01:56,440 --> 02:01:59,360 going to come after me again? And, you know, the death threats 2406 02:01:59,360 --> 02:02:02,320 are really concerning me because I had people show up at my 2407 02:02:02,320 --> 02:02:04,000 daughter's house and try to break in. 2408 02:02:04,000 --> 02:02:07,320 I mean, there's police reports. My horse was almost stolen back 2409 02:02:07,320 --> 02:02:10,280 in 2020 and then again when I was here in Russia. 2410 02:02:10,520 --> 02:02:14,800 So that's happened, you know, so, so I had the anxiety about 2411 02:02:14,800 --> 02:02:17,400 that stuff. I'd call it anxiety, but I was 2412 02:02:17,400 --> 02:02:21,200 excited about going for one week to Russia and seeing it finally 2413 02:02:21,200 --> 02:02:24,680 with my own eyes. And then when it was clear I 2414 02:02:24,680 --> 02:02:30,400 couldn't go back, that was. And then, yeah, I just. 2415 02:02:30,400 --> 02:02:32,680 I would. But one thing stopped. 2416 02:02:33,680 --> 02:02:35,920 I was here. I stopped having like the panic 2417 02:02:35,920 --> 02:02:38,840 attacks I was having, almost like you and I were talking 2418 02:02:38,840 --> 02:02:42,160 about how like how scary it is, how you lay at four or five in 2419 02:02:42,160 --> 02:02:44,200 the morning wondering if that's the day, the knots going to 2420 02:02:44,200 --> 02:02:45,840 come. That's the day. 2421 02:02:46,080 --> 02:02:48,040 Is this the day? Is this the day? 2422 02:02:48,360 --> 02:02:50,280 And you just. And it's like you're waiting for 2423 02:02:50,280 --> 02:02:53,000 that other shoe to drop, you know, because I've been 2424 02:02:53,000 --> 02:02:55,240 threatened so many times that the FBI was going to come raid 2425 02:02:55,240 --> 02:02:58,920 me or bring me into custody for what I don't, you know, 2426 02:02:58,920 --> 02:03:00,760 whatever. Yeah, your cortisol levels are 2427 02:03:00,760 --> 02:03:02,360 off the chart. It's like living in a war zone. 2428 02:03:02,600 --> 02:03:04,960 I mean, it's a psychological war, but it's a war nonetheless. 2429 02:03:05,760 --> 02:03:08,760 Yeah, and they went after people I knew so like that who were 2430 02:03:08,760 --> 02:03:11,160 group, they raided them and then they went after them and now 2431 02:03:11,160 --> 02:03:13,440 they're they took away their passports and they're in prison. 2432 02:03:13,440 --> 02:03:16,080 They're going to face 8 to 10 years in prison for sowing 2433 02:03:16,120 --> 02:03:21,680 discord, which I mean, shoot. I do that every day I feel. 2434 02:03:21,680 --> 02:03:23,440 Like you have an American right to sow discord. 2435 02:03:23,440 --> 02:03:24,920 It's actually part of the 1st Amendment. 2436 02:03:25,720 --> 02:03:28,880 Not anymore, not according to the recent DOJ. 2437 02:03:29,120 --> 02:03:33,080 So merit, not under Merrick Garland, you know, not under 2438 02:03:33,080 --> 02:03:35,640 Biden. So that's what we're looking at. 2439 02:03:35,640 --> 02:03:38,440 We're looking at the loss of our liberty, our freedom of 2440 02:03:38,960 --> 02:03:42,320 expression, our freedom of speech and our ability to 2441 02:03:42,320 --> 02:03:46,480 whistleblow, our ability to call out what's wrong and make it 2442 02:03:46,480 --> 02:03:49,800 better. And I think that that's the, you 2443 02:03:49,800 --> 02:03:51,400 know, that's that's a damn shame. 2444 02:03:51,520 --> 02:03:56,000 And I, I really get annoyed when people say I'm not a patriot 2445 02:03:56,000 --> 02:03:57,800 because I'm not. First of all, I'm not like, I've 2446 02:03:57,800 --> 02:04:00,120 never been like you, Kyle, OK? I didn't work for the FBI. 2447 02:04:00,120 --> 02:04:02,200 I wasn't like, you know, like that. 2448 02:04:02,320 --> 02:04:04,480 But I did work for the Senate and the Congress and I took it 2449 02:04:04,480 --> 02:04:06,960 seriously. And I, and I did like being a 2450 02:04:06,960 --> 02:04:09,760 public servant. And I do care about my country 2451 02:04:09,760 --> 02:04:11,400 and I care about my fellow Americans. 2452 02:04:11,760 --> 02:04:14,280 I don't like Biden and I don't like that regime. 2453 02:04:14,360 --> 02:04:18,400 And it is a regime. They're basically making money 2454 02:04:18,920 --> 02:04:21,200 off our taxes. And they're, they're, you know, 2455 02:04:22,360 --> 02:04:24,840 laundering it basically. You know, I think about my 2456 02:04:24,840 --> 02:04:26,080 father. My father's dead. 2457 02:04:26,080 --> 02:04:28,080 My mother's dead. And we were pretty estranged. 2458 02:04:28,080 --> 02:04:31,920 But I wonder what he would think about all the military 2459 02:04:31,920 --> 02:04:34,000 contracts. He probably would have made 2460 02:04:34,000 --> 02:04:35,480 money. But like, would he have been OK 2461 02:04:35,480 --> 02:04:38,280 with it? Because it's gotten really ugly, 2462 02:04:39,080 --> 02:04:40,760 I mean. I always ask people, what's the 2463 02:04:40,760 --> 02:04:43,120 cost? If you say yes and you go along 2464 02:04:43,120 --> 02:04:45,160 with it and you get your paycheck and you get your 2465 02:04:45,160 --> 02:04:47,720 retirement and your pension or you get a big, you know, payday 2466 02:04:47,720 --> 02:04:50,680 from a contract, where are you gonna spend that? 2467 02:04:50,920 --> 02:04:52,880 You gonna spend that in America? That's tyrannical. 2468 02:04:54,240 --> 02:04:57,480 That's the real question. So now you know, what I wanna do 2469 02:04:57,480 --> 02:04:59,960 is testify before Congress from Moscow. 2470 02:05:00,240 --> 02:05:01,680 And I wish there was a way I could do that. 2471 02:05:01,680 --> 02:05:03,360 I want to I'll. Bring my laptop in. 2472 02:05:03,360 --> 02:05:04,240 They can. They can go to me. 2473 02:05:04,240 --> 02:05:06,920 They don't even have to use any U.S. government stuff. 2474 02:05:06,920 --> 02:05:08,800 I'm more than happy to pay for the connection that's. 2475 02:05:08,800 --> 02:05:11,080 All there, tell Matt Gaetz like we're. 2476 02:05:11,080 --> 02:05:14,880 Telling him right now we're telling Matt Gaetz, Matt Gaetz, 2477 02:05:14,960 --> 02:05:18,160 let's set this thing up. I want to see a remote testimony 2478 02:05:18,160 --> 02:05:20,160 from Moscow. Look, there is precedent for 2479 02:05:20,160 --> 02:05:21,760 things that are quote UN quote enemies. 2480 02:05:21,960 --> 02:05:25,360 They brought in the Japanese submarine commander who sunk the 2481 02:05:25,360 --> 02:05:28,520 USS Indianapolis at the end of World War 2. 2482 02:05:28,960 --> 02:05:31,600 And they brought him in for a court martial and they had him 2483 02:05:31,600 --> 02:05:35,440 go and convict the captain of the USS Indianapolis of failing 2484 02:05:35,440 --> 02:05:38,920 to zig and zag properly in this military tribunal. 2485 02:05:38,920 --> 02:05:41,160 There. There is plenty of reasons that 2486 02:05:41,160 --> 02:05:43,120 you might bring somebody in from another country that might even 2487 02:05:43,120 --> 02:05:46,360 be considered hostile. So I I think doing it digitally 2488 02:05:46,360 --> 02:05:49,440 in the, in the COVID era, the post COVID world we live in, you 2489 02:05:49,440 --> 02:05:51,480 can do it instantaneously. It'll be really late your time. 2490 02:05:51,760 --> 02:05:53,280 That's the only thing you have to be doing a late night. 2491 02:05:53,960 --> 02:05:56,520 I don't care. I want to do it, you know, you 2492 02:05:56,520 --> 02:05:59,000 know, it would mean a lot to me. I know, I I know I'm never going 2493 02:05:59,000 --> 02:06:00,720 to get justice, right? Like, I know that. 2494 02:06:00,720 --> 02:06:03,840 But I would like to make it easier for the person behind me. 2495 02:06:03,840 --> 02:06:06,800 And, and right now, I feel like they might get the impression 2496 02:06:06,800 --> 02:06:09,640 that, Oh yeah, this works. This playbook works. 2497 02:06:09,640 --> 02:06:13,160 We chased her away. I'm continuing my work. 2498 02:06:13,160 --> 02:06:15,920 I'm going to keep working, keep exposing Biden. 2499 02:06:15,920 --> 02:06:19,600 So I'm not going to shut up and I'm going to keep keep pushing 2500 02:06:20,080 --> 02:06:22,640 because we need now. I have the freedom to do it and 2501 02:06:22,640 --> 02:06:26,000 I I don't have the DOJ hanging over my head. 2502 02:06:27,640 --> 02:06:31,560 Can you imagine the the the little 8 year old girl that was 2503 02:06:31,560 --> 02:06:34,120 standing on the stump that was reading Karl Marx to her 2504 02:06:34,120 --> 02:06:36,720 classmates? Could she have ever fathomed 2505 02:06:36,720 --> 02:06:41,680 that you would have sought a safe haven in former Soviet 2506 02:06:41,680 --> 02:06:43,800 Russia from the United States? Is that? 2507 02:06:43,800 --> 02:06:46,160 Is that the most? Is that a thing you could ever 2508 02:06:46,160 --> 02:06:47,440 even imagine anytime in your life? 2509 02:06:48,280 --> 02:06:51,240 No, no, I really didn't see that coming. 2510 02:06:51,760 --> 02:06:54,880 In fact, I didn't see it coming that I would be accused of being 2511 02:06:54,880 --> 02:06:57,440 a Russian agent by Biden's people. 2512 02:06:57,440 --> 02:07:00,120 So that was a sideways thing when that happened. 2513 02:07:00,680 --> 02:07:02,880 Yeah. So this is all been very much a 2514 02:07:02,880 --> 02:07:07,880 surprise. But you know, you, you take what 2515 02:07:07,880 --> 02:07:10,760 I've learned is to, you know, adapt and survive. 2516 02:07:11,040 --> 02:07:13,960 You know, survive and adapt and adapt and survive. 2517 02:07:14,600 --> 02:07:19,080 And that's what you do. And but there's no reason why I 2518 02:07:19,080 --> 02:07:21,560 can't thrive here. There's no reason why I can't 2519 02:07:21,560 --> 02:07:26,200 rebuild my life. Somehow I'll be able to maybe 2520 02:07:26,640 --> 02:07:29,240 come back to my country of origin, but I don't know if it's 2521 02:07:29,240 --> 02:07:32,320 going to act like if, if, if there it's going to continue to 2522 02:07:32,320 --> 02:07:34,920 have leaders like but Joe Biden, then no, there's no reason for 2523 02:07:34,920 --> 02:07:38,720 me to go back. But you know, I'll go back when 2524 02:07:38,720 --> 02:07:41,920 it's safe and say hi. Otherwise, people are going to 2525 02:07:41,920 --> 02:07:45,960 have to come here and see me. And they might especially I, I 2526 02:07:45,960 --> 02:07:47,560 keep hear people who say, why don't you go to Russia? 2527 02:07:47,560 --> 02:07:48,960 I hear there's a great expat community. 2528 02:07:48,960 --> 02:07:50,280 And it's like, I keep hearing that too. 2529 02:07:50,280 --> 02:07:51,880 And you say it like it's a mean thing. 2530 02:07:52,120 --> 02:07:54,720 I keep wondering, you're rolling around, you don't even speak 2531 02:07:54,720 --> 02:07:57,160 Russian and you seem to be doing OK, which is kind of amazing. 2532 02:07:57,160 --> 02:07:58,760 I'm not. I don't want to leave my country 2533 02:07:58,760 --> 02:07:59,720 either. I don't want to take my kids 2534 02:07:59,720 --> 02:08:01,760 anywhere else. But you know, first and 2535 02:08:01,760 --> 02:08:05,520 foremost, but it is, it is truly interesting to see that I want 2536 02:08:05,520 --> 02:08:08,240 to, I want to buzz you about your interactions with the 2537 02:08:08,240 --> 02:08:12,800 Russian government. What have they been and and and 2538 02:08:12,800 --> 02:08:14,720 with what agencies and and what kind of people? 2539 02:08:16,400 --> 02:08:19,600 I haven't really had any interactions other than like 2540 02:08:19,600 --> 02:08:23,280 going to the office to sign up for the paperwork for the asylum 2541 02:08:23,400 --> 02:08:27,200 and then doing that process and they ask you a few questions and 2542 02:08:27,200 --> 02:08:31,240 then now it's just in that bureaucratic, wherever it is 2543 02:08:31,400 --> 02:08:35,240 space on someone's desk I assume and that's it. 2544 02:08:36,080 --> 02:08:39,200 Now I'm just waiting. So I haven't had much, you know, 2545 02:08:39,200 --> 02:08:42,640 I've been working with my podcast. 2546 02:08:42,640 --> 02:08:45,240 I work with TNT Radio, which is out of Australia. 2547 02:08:45,720 --> 02:08:52,480 And I do, I do some commentary for RT once in a while, but 2548 02:08:52,480 --> 02:08:56,440 that's it. And as far as expat, no, it's 2549 02:08:56,440 --> 02:08:57,960 Russia Today. Russia Today, sorry. 2550 02:08:58,880 --> 02:09:02,760 And as far as expats, you're mentioning that I have met 2551 02:09:02,760 --> 02:09:07,320 Irish, English, Australians that have come here and I have met 2552 02:09:07,320 --> 02:09:09,800 people that have sought asylum and then have made their life 2553 02:09:09,800 --> 02:09:12,200 here and are much happier and they said they don't want to go 2554 02:09:12,200 --> 02:09:14,160 back even if they could. What? 2555 02:09:14,520 --> 02:09:15,880 What are they? What are they looking for? 2556 02:09:15,880 --> 02:09:19,560 What are they finding? They're finding not they're not 2557 02:09:19,560 --> 02:09:22,200 having to be afraid to have their political or religious 2558 02:09:22,200 --> 02:09:25,000 beliefs, whatever that is. Some of them are like Orthodox 2559 02:09:25,000 --> 02:09:30,720 Christian or just Catholic. They're feeling like a sense of 2560 02:09:30,720 --> 02:09:32,560 home for their children. They have, many of them have 2561 02:09:32,560 --> 02:09:35,000 children and have them in school and said it's just a much 2562 02:09:35,080 --> 02:09:40,960 superior education system and that it's free, you know, and 2563 02:09:41,240 --> 02:09:45,160 that I mean, private school costs money, but like not, you 2564 02:09:45,160 --> 02:09:50,800 know, know what it is in the US And it's just, it's just a much 2565 02:09:50,800 --> 02:09:54,040 more thriving economy. Like it's more moving towards 2566 02:09:54,040 --> 02:09:57,200 the future. So they're excited about it. 2567 02:09:57,320 --> 02:09:59,760 People are more accepting. It's a it's a kind of a laid 2568 02:09:59,760 --> 02:10:02,080 back in a way. I know it sounds so odd because 2569 02:10:02,320 --> 02:10:06,640 right now there's a war raging, but I have to say it's pretty 2570 02:10:06,640 --> 02:10:10,360 laid back. It's not because you're not 2571 02:10:10,360 --> 02:10:13,960 having the sense of desperation that's going on in the cities 2572 02:10:13,960 --> 02:10:18,000 right now, in Seattle and in San Francisco and in New York and in 2573 02:10:18,000 --> 02:10:19,320 some of the rural communities in. 2574 02:10:20,080 --> 02:10:21,960 Chicago. You don't have the drugs here. 2575 02:10:22,040 --> 02:10:24,240 There's no, they're very strict about drugs. 2576 02:10:24,240 --> 02:10:27,600 There is no drug use and no, marijuana is not legal. 2577 02:10:27,600 --> 02:10:30,160 So if you're into that, that's not the place for you. 2578 02:10:31,680 --> 02:10:33,320 It's not legal and it's not wanted. 2579 02:10:33,320 --> 02:10:36,880 So they're very strict about all drugs. 2580 02:10:37,920 --> 02:10:39,680 What about alcohol abuse? I always hear that a lot of 2581 02:10:39,680 --> 02:10:41,520 Russians die from from abusing alcohol. 2582 02:10:41,520 --> 02:10:43,040 Is that something you're seeing at all in the city? 2583 02:10:43,800 --> 02:10:46,920 I've seen two drunks, like I've seen some drunk men. 2584 02:10:47,680 --> 02:10:49,760 I haven't seen like what they're talking about. 2585 02:10:49,760 --> 02:10:52,560 That's more from the 90s when there was like no money and 2586 02:10:52,560 --> 02:10:55,520 people were literally just like it was pretty bad. 2587 02:10:55,840 --> 02:10:57,680 Are we just getting disinformation that's just been 2588 02:10:57,680 --> 02:10:59,560 fed from like a 90s like hit reel? 2589 02:10:59,560 --> 02:11:01,520 Is that what's going on? I mean, I I wouldn't put it past 2590 02:11:01,520 --> 02:11:04,360 anybody at this point. I think alcoholism, they have a 2591 02:11:04,360 --> 02:11:07,200 push back against alcoholism here because I think, you know, 2592 02:11:07,200 --> 02:11:09,280 it was a problem. It's like Ireland too, Irish 2593 02:11:09,280 --> 02:11:12,160 people and English people up at the pub, you know, it's kind of 2594 02:11:12,160 --> 02:11:14,800 that. But like, no, they, they have a 2595 02:11:14,800 --> 02:11:18,080 real push back against alcoholism and that kind of 2596 02:11:18,080 --> 02:11:20,840 thing here. But during the 90s there was a 2597 02:11:20,840 --> 02:11:23,800 lot of alcoholism. So that's kind of the stereotype 2598 02:11:25,160 --> 02:11:29,280 from that, I think. But yeah, you don't hear like, 2599 02:11:29,280 --> 02:11:33,240 like right now it's the middle of the night and you can my 2600 02:11:33,240 --> 02:11:35,080 windows are open. Sirens. 2601 02:11:36,560 --> 02:11:39,120 You don't hear sirens, you don't hear people shouting, you don't 2602 02:11:39,120 --> 02:11:42,800 hear anything like that ever. Rarely. 2603 02:11:42,800 --> 02:11:46,000 I don't know. I've never even seen a fight. 2604 02:11:46,000 --> 02:11:47,760 And I've walked around. And the other thing that's 2605 02:11:47,760 --> 02:11:52,280 really cool is I can walk around at night as a woman and feel 2606 02:11:52,280 --> 02:11:54,640 safe. I don't feel worried. 2607 02:11:55,520 --> 02:11:57,880 It's everything's well lit. There's a usually a lot of 2608 02:11:57,880 --> 02:12:01,160 people out because, you know, it's summertime and it's warm 2609 02:12:01,320 --> 02:12:05,440 and it gets light early, but there are quiet times when 2610 02:12:05,440 --> 02:12:09,160 there's not a lot of people and it's still feels safe. 2611 02:12:09,560 --> 02:12:12,560 When you go down under bridges, like Gorky Park has the section 2612 02:12:12,560 --> 02:12:14,520 where you go along the river and then you go down underneath this 2613 02:12:14,520 --> 02:12:16,040 bridge. I remember I kind of had this, 2614 02:12:16,040 --> 02:12:19,480 like, bracing myself because, you know, like in the cities, in 2615 02:12:19,480 --> 02:12:22,400 Seattle or New York, you go down under a bridge, there's going to 2616 02:12:22,400 --> 02:12:25,240 be homeless people, druggies possibly getting, you know, 2617 02:12:26,520 --> 02:12:29,320 robbed or whatever. No, it's like you go down 2618 02:12:30,160 --> 02:12:32,600 underneath the bridge and there's just more families 2619 02:12:32,600 --> 02:12:35,320 walking and people going to the metro or going wherever. 2620 02:12:35,320 --> 02:12:37,800 And it was like, OK, this is really safe. 2621 02:12:38,200 --> 02:12:40,720 I mean, it's a city, so I'm sure there's pickpockets. 2622 02:12:40,720 --> 02:12:42,360 You got to, you know, watch your stuff a bit. 2623 02:12:42,360 --> 02:12:44,920 But I haven't had anything happen. 2624 02:12:46,560 --> 02:12:50,400 I have been lost pretty much almost every day. 2625 02:12:51,800 --> 02:12:55,200 I'll be honest, it's I have a bad sense of direction. 2626 02:12:55,200 --> 02:12:58,920 But anyway. But you know, they will go out 2627 02:12:58,920 --> 02:13:01,120 of their way to help me. Like someone will see me on my 2628 02:13:01,120 --> 02:13:04,560 phone just looking confused and they'll walk up and go, you 2629 02:13:04,560 --> 02:13:05,720 know, in Russian. Do you need help? 2630 02:13:05,720 --> 02:13:07,280 And then I'll say, I don't speak Russian. 2631 02:13:07,280 --> 02:13:10,760 And then they'll say, oh, I speak Choo Choo English. 2632 02:13:10,760 --> 02:13:14,000 And then they'll try to help me. And I never know where I am 2633 02:13:14,000 --> 02:13:15,800 because the names of the streets are so long. 2634 02:13:15,800 --> 02:13:18,280 And, you know, so I, I'm, I'm struggling with the language of 2635 02:13:18,280 --> 02:13:21,680 it. But overall, I'm, I'm getting 2636 02:13:21,680 --> 02:13:26,480 along fine, you know? It's, it's, that's so crazy. 2637 02:13:26,680 --> 02:13:28,680 There's a scorpion song that's called winds of change that 2638 02:13:28,680 --> 02:13:30,280 keeps running through my head that won't put, you know what 2639 02:13:30,280 --> 02:13:32,360 I'm talking about. There's a, a whistle solo in 2640 02:13:32,360 --> 02:13:34,360 there and they talk about going through Gorky Park and how 2641 02:13:34,360 --> 02:13:38,160 things are changing. And anyway, I, I just all of our 2642 02:13:38,160 --> 02:13:40,320 conversation yesterday and today has led me to think about that 2643 02:13:40,320 --> 02:13:42,520 and it's. It, it really is, you know, I 2644 02:13:42,520 --> 02:13:45,200 think the East is, you know, it's, it's becoming multipolar 2645 02:13:45,200 --> 02:13:49,560 world and the East is rising and the West is falling. 2646 02:13:49,800 --> 02:13:51,160 You're pissing off the CIA again. 2647 02:13:51,160 --> 02:13:52,160 Why would you do that on my process? 2648 02:13:52,240 --> 02:13:55,240 I know, I know, but but the West, all the West has to do is 2649 02:13:55,240 --> 02:13:58,440 become a partner and become like part of it. 2650 02:13:58,440 --> 02:14:01,720 So then there's the competition is not with war machines but 2651 02:14:01,720 --> 02:14:04,160 with just economic like Donald Trump. 2652 02:14:04,440 --> 02:14:06,560 You know, I have to go back to Donald Trump because I'm not. 2653 02:14:06,560 --> 02:14:10,000 Again, I never supported him in the past, but he did make a 2654 02:14:10,000 --> 02:14:12,520 point. Economic competition is what you 2655 02:14:12,520 --> 02:14:13,760 want. You don't want more. 2656 02:14:14,440 --> 02:14:16,360 You just want healthy competition and then you have 2657 02:14:16,360 --> 02:14:17,080 innovation. He. 2658 02:14:19,360 --> 02:14:21,080 Converted you? How did he do this? 2659 02:14:22,560 --> 02:14:25,440 I think by watching him, like, fight through all those 2660 02:14:25,440 --> 02:14:28,000 indictments. My goodness, My goodness. 2661 02:14:28,000 --> 02:14:29,120 I Yeah. Yeah, you're, so you're 2662 02:14:29,120 --> 02:14:31,480 experiencing a little, you know, your own taste of it. 2663 02:14:31,480 --> 02:14:34,080 I think that many people empathize with the Donald Trump 2664 02:14:34,080 --> 02:14:35,880 scenario. Is there? 2665 02:14:36,040 --> 02:14:38,920 Have you ever had a conversation over there about what's going on 2666 02:14:38,920 --> 02:14:40,120 here? Does anyone even know what we're 2667 02:14:40,120 --> 02:14:43,160 doing to ourselves? Yeah, I mean, at RT I've made my 2668 02:14:43,160 --> 02:14:46,680 commentaries. They know my positions, so they 2669 02:14:46,680 --> 02:14:48,400 understand. What do they talk about? 2670 02:14:48,480 --> 02:14:50,800 There's a lot of questions. Actually, they try to be more 2671 02:14:50,800 --> 02:14:53,120 defending of US. It's kind of interesting. 2672 02:14:53,520 --> 02:14:57,640 They think I'm a little harsh because because to some of the 2673 02:14:58,360 --> 02:15:01,080 young people, especially here, they think America is going to 2674 02:15:01,080 --> 02:15:03,760 be great because that was the image they had. 2675 02:15:04,200 --> 02:15:07,000 And I'm like, no, it's not great right now. 2676 02:15:07,440 --> 02:15:09,600 It's not great. You don't want to go there. 2677 02:15:09,840 --> 02:15:10,960 And they think they want to go there. 2678 02:15:10,960 --> 02:15:13,120 And I'm like, no, they. Because imagine they'd be 2679 02:15:13,120 --> 02:15:16,400 suffering Russophobia. Yeah. 2680 02:15:16,400 --> 02:15:19,240 And they might even end up in jail because the United States 2681 02:15:19,240 --> 02:15:23,520 is so mean to Russian nationals like what they did to Maria 2682 02:15:23,520 --> 02:15:25,080 Butina. She was not a spy. 2683 02:15:26,400 --> 02:15:28,480 She was not a spy. And everybody knows that. 2684 02:15:28,480 --> 02:15:31,800 There's even an article say that that's called the spy who wasn't 2685 02:15:31,800 --> 02:15:38,080 She was totally speed up and and made and actually they used her 2686 02:15:38,080 --> 02:15:41,880 case the same judge that's indicting Trump indicted Maria 2687 02:15:41,880 --> 02:15:46,200 Butina and using the FARA Act, which was never used before. 2688 02:15:46,360 --> 02:15:48,400 Which is not being used on Charlie Mcgonigal, by the way. 2689 02:15:49,520 --> 02:15:52,280 It is not. No. 2690 02:15:52,800 --> 02:15:55,120 OK, So what? OK. 2691 02:15:55,760 --> 02:15:59,560 Anything about that? I don't know, it's like upside 2692 02:15:59,560 --> 02:16:02,200 down world. There's no counts of FARA 2693 02:16:02,200 --> 02:16:04,920 violations in the indictments that I've seen, despite the fact 2694 02:16:04,920 --> 02:16:07,040 that he was receiving money and working on behalf of I'm an 2695 02:16:07,040 --> 02:16:10,440 oligarch. Yeah, interesting. 2696 02:16:11,000 --> 02:16:12,520 And you theoretically were facing it. 2697 02:16:13,920 --> 02:16:16,000 Up is down, huh? And I'm not working. 2698 02:16:16,000 --> 02:16:17,280 Yeah. And I'm definitely not working 2699 02:16:17,280 --> 02:16:18,360 for an oligarch. Yeah. 2700 02:16:18,360 --> 02:16:20,720 And, and you know, the, the, when, when they make people out 2701 02:16:20,720 --> 02:16:24,360 to be Putin, you know, agents or whatever, it's like he must have 2702 02:16:24,360 --> 02:16:27,960 so many people on payroll. Oh man, yeah, I sounds. 2703 02:16:27,960 --> 02:16:29,040 Great. And why are so many of us 2704 02:16:29,040 --> 02:16:29,760 poorly? Wealthy. 2705 02:16:31,400 --> 02:16:35,680 No but but seriously though the that case is really interesting 2706 02:16:35,680 --> 02:16:39,240 to me because he was accusing other people of what he was 2707 02:16:39,240 --> 02:16:42,360 doing. It's just I mean he works in the 2708 02:16:42,360 --> 02:16:47,860 FBI that how did he go to work every day and do and face his Co 2709 02:16:47,860 --> 02:16:49,440 workers? Sociopath maybe? 2710 02:16:49,440 --> 02:16:51,639 I don't know, I don't get it. It doesn't make any sense to me 2711 02:16:52,200 --> 02:16:53,879 at least. Robert Hanson was like a nervous 2712 02:16:53,879 --> 02:16:56,000 wreck all the time is what everyone says, that he basically 2713 02:16:56,000 --> 02:16:59,120 was constantly, you know, had explosive temper and had all the 2714 02:16:59,120 --> 02:17:01,320 pressure of what was going on. And I just interviewed his 2715 02:17:01,320 --> 02:17:02,559 girlfriend. You can go back and watch it on 2716 02:17:02,559 --> 02:17:04,600 our show. I did it on Monday this week and 2717 02:17:04,600 --> 02:17:07,360 you can watch her talk about it. And she said he didn't go off in 2718 02:17:07,360 --> 02:17:08,160 the air. He didn't care. 2719 02:17:08,360 --> 02:17:10,120 He walked around. He had a family, he had a wife. 2720 02:17:11,080 --> 02:17:13,240 He was hanging out with her. She thought it was cool. 2721 02:17:13,719 --> 02:17:16,559 He was introducing her as his girlfriend to to the wife's 2722 02:17:16,559 --> 02:17:20,400 cousin, rented Rice's cousin, rented the apartment for him, 2723 02:17:20,600 --> 02:17:23,760 presented as girlfriend as far as she knows. 2724 02:17:23,760 --> 02:17:26,920 Like they may have never even had any separation then he may 2725 02:17:26,920 --> 02:17:27,760 have been married the whole time. 2726 02:17:27,760 --> 02:17:28,920 He's obviously back with the wife right now. 2727 02:17:28,920 --> 02:17:34,040 Just bizarro world. And you know, I grew up watching 2728 02:17:34,040 --> 02:17:36,440 Robert Hansen and alter James like basically get thrown in 2729 02:17:36,440 --> 02:17:39,559 prison forever. That's what we used to do to 2730 02:17:39,559 --> 02:17:41,959 people that betrayed the country in the oath, and now we got 2731 02:17:41,959 --> 02:17:45,280 people like you that ran to the country that we were being 2732 02:17:45,280 --> 02:17:47,040 betrayed to. How do you feel? 2733 02:17:48,280 --> 02:17:51,920 How do you feel like, does that, does that make you feel 2734 02:17:51,920 --> 02:17:55,000 uncomfortable in some ways when you have me, when you hear me 2735 02:17:55,000 --> 02:17:57,760 sing the praises of Russia? Because I'm just telling you my 2736 02:17:57,760 --> 02:17:59,680 real experience right now. No, it doesn't bother me at all. 2737 02:17:59,680 --> 02:18:02,280 It just makes me know how far this America is not what it was. 2738 02:18:02,520 --> 02:18:04,959 I mean, we're a nation that is post constitutional. 2739 02:18:04,959 --> 02:18:08,680 I feel like I say it a lot of times on our show, I I feel like 2740 02:18:08,680 --> 02:18:13,280 we've, we've abandoned the principles that were why we were 2741 02:18:13,280 --> 02:18:16,480 so proud of being American. Do you think Biden's going to be 2742 02:18:16,480 --> 02:18:18,879 held accountable or Hunter Biden are going to be accountable for? 2743 02:18:19,520 --> 02:18:20,719 Anything. Walk. 2744 02:18:21,959 --> 02:18:24,480 No, see, I'm not, I'm I'm not objective. 2745 02:18:24,520 --> 02:18:26,840 And there's just this little part of me that thinks the good 2746 02:18:26,840 --> 02:18:29,240 guys are going to win, you know, that they're going to be the 2747 02:18:29,400 --> 02:18:32,200 their villainy really is going to be exposed. 2748 02:18:32,639 --> 02:18:34,600 But I know realistically that's not. 2749 02:18:34,799 --> 02:18:37,360 I think realistically the only way that something really I 2750 02:18:37,360 --> 02:18:39,320 don't know the path. I just tweeted about this the 2751 02:18:39,320 --> 02:18:40,639 other day, so I put it in public already. 2752 02:18:40,639 --> 02:18:43,280 I already own it, but I don't know how we avoid violence in 2753 02:18:43,280 --> 02:18:46,959 this country because when you when you weaponize the federal 2754 02:18:46,959 --> 02:18:50,799 government and you delegitimize the things that are supposed to 2755 02:18:50,799 --> 02:18:54,680 be sacrosanct, like our judiciary, a blind Lady Justice 2756 02:18:54,680 --> 02:18:57,000 that's supposed to weigh people. You know, we always knew that 2757 02:18:57,000 --> 02:18:59,080 the the people who had more money and more access got a 2758 02:18:59,080 --> 02:19:01,120 little bit of a better deal. That was always the case. 2759 02:19:01,320 --> 02:19:02,920 Everyone always knew that if you had a little more money, you 2760 02:19:02,920 --> 02:19:04,879 could, you know, hire a better defense attorney. 2761 02:19:04,879 --> 02:19:07,480 And maybe that defense attorney plays golf with the judge and 2762 02:19:07,480 --> 02:19:10,200 maybe you get a sweetheart deal. Like that was always there. 2763 02:19:10,240 --> 02:19:12,799 Everyone knew that. But he didn't think that the FBI 2764 02:19:12,799 --> 02:19:15,200 was going to kick down your door and shoot you if you were 75 2765 02:19:15,200 --> 02:19:17,639 years old and overweight because you were an asshole. 2766 02:19:18,600 --> 02:19:20,400 Like, and I don't know the guy. Maybe he wasn't. 2767 02:19:20,400 --> 02:19:22,240 Maybe he was a really sweetheart and he was just an asshole of 2768 02:19:22,240 --> 02:19:23,879 mine. I have an uncle that reminds me 2769 02:19:23,879 --> 02:19:26,080 of the guy they just shot. Do you know the FBI shot a guy 2770 02:19:26,080 --> 02:19:26,520 today? They. 2771 02:19:27,760 --> 02:19:29,600 Did no you're. Memphis, you're not going to 2772 02:19:29,600 --> 02:19:31,240 hear about it. That's three in a week. 2773 02:19:31,559 --> 02:19:34,080 We've shot all SWAT shots and I'm sure they were all 2774 02:19:34,080 --> 02:19:35,440 justified. That's the other problem. 2775 02:19:36,400 --> 02:19:39,959 But like, imagine, imagine a federal police force in another 2776 02:19:39,959 --> 02:19:43,320 country that that has shot three citizens for violations of the 2777 02:19:43,320 --> 02:19:47,080 law or whatever. It's just, man, I can't remember 2778 02:19:47,080 --> 02:19:48,480 a time when that was the thing in the FBI. 2779 02:19:48,480 --> 02:19:49,880 You're not even talking about it. 2780 02:19:49,880 --> 02:19:51,400 I mean, you know, they. Never do. 2781 02:19:52,160 --> 02:19:53,840 They never do. They control that media. 2782 02:19:54,200 --> 02:19:56,240 It doesn't get out there. You want to talk about the stuff 2783 02:19:56,240 --> 02:19:59,160 that we used to see when we were younger looking at the Soviet 2784 02:19:59,160 --> 02:20:01,040 Union, It's like, of course, they quashed the story. 2785 02:20:01,240 --> 02:20:03,480 Of course, the only press that is doing it is the Free Press. 2786 02:20:03,680 --> 02:20:05,400 Right now the only people that are reporting on this stuff is 2787 02:20:05,400 --> 02:20:07,480 local news and the suspendables. Me and my buddies. 2788 02:20:08,160 --> 02:20:10,680 And that's crazy. So it doesn't bother me that 2789 02:20:10,680 --> 02:20:12,760 people are saying things are I just know that if you say things 2790 02:20:12,760 --> 02:20:15,040 nice about Russia, then people are going to go and say the same 2791 02:20:15,040 --> 02:20:16,760 thing about me that they said about you, which is that I'm a 2792 02:20:16,760 --> 02:20:18,760 Russian agent, which is freaking hilarious. 2793 02:20:19,120 --> 02:20:22,640 Like I've got, I got AI got a Smith and Wesson here that was 2794 02:20:22,640 --> 02:20:23,720 made on the year that I was born. 2795 02:20:23,720 --> 02:20:26,560 It's a American revolver. I get about as red blooded as it 2796 02:20:26,560 --> 02:20:28,480 gets. I got American flags all over 2797 02:20:28,480 --> 02:20:29,600 the place. I don't have any tattoos, but if 2798 02:20:29,600 --> 02:20:31,160 I did, it would probably be an American flag. 2799 02:20:31,800 --> 02:20:35,440 And yet they will accuse you of calling out this country when 2800 02:20:35,440 --> 02:20:36,680 it's doing things that are wrong. 2801 02:20:37,760 --> 02:20:40,160 Well, and it's not even calling out the country, it's calling 2802 02:20:40,160 --> 02:20:42,360 out the elites that are running it, the ones that are 2803 02:20:42,360 --> 02:20:44,680 benefiting. And you know, like my, my thing 2804 02:20:44,680 --> 02:20:47,880 about Leon Panetta that I'm so disappointed about is that when 2805 02:20:47,880 --> 02:20:50,800 I knew him as an intern, I looked up to him and I and I 2806 02:20:50,800 --> 02:20:53,760 really thought he was serious and really wanted to do good 2807 02:20:53,760 --> 02:20:58,160 things. And now I see his path. 2808 02:20:58,200 --> 02:21:00,800 And he literally was just all about the power. 2809 02:21:01,640 --> 02:21:05,000 His son was ordained basically as a congressman in the same 2810 02:21:05,000 --> 02:21:08,680 district as if it's now royalty. These Democrats think that. 2811 02:21:08,680 --> 02:21:10,480 OK, now, Grassley. Is trying to do the same thing. 2812 02:21:10,960 --> 02:21:12,560 Yeah. He's trying to give it to. 2813 02:21:12,560 --> 02:21:15,360 His grandson, right, Or whatever I think grandson. 2814 02:21:15,400 --> 02:21:17,280 Grandson, yeah. It's like. 2815 02:21:17,280 --> 02:21:19,920 Because he's 1000 years old. Because he's, he's almost 100 2816 02:21:19,920 --> 02:21:21,600 years old right now. That's why. 2817 02:21:21,960 --> 02:21:23,880 And people love Chuck Grassley. They get mad at you when you 2818 02:21:23,880 --> 02:21:25,480 when you call out any of their sacred cows. 2819 02:21:25,680 --> 02:21:28,000 But look, I don't care if you're Mitch McConnell or if you're 2820 02:21:28,000 --> 02:21:30,800 Dianne Feinstein or if you're Chuck Grassley or if you're Joe 2821 02:21:30,800 --> 02:21:33,880 Biden, you're too freaking old. And honestly, I think Donald 2822 02:21:33,880 --> 02:21:36,280 Trump is too old. But he may be the only way that 2823 02:21:36,280 --> 02:21:39,120 he stays out of jail. And so I can get behind the idea 2824 02:21:39,120 --> 02:21:41,000 of it. I was not 100% behind Donald 2825 02:21:41,080 --> 02:21:43,760 Trump until the 3rd indictment. And then it's like, man, are you 2826 02:21:43,760 --> 02:21:46,160 kidding me? Look, I wanted to have a 2827 02:21:46,160 --> 02:21:48,680 comeback like freaking Sly Stallone did in Rocky 8 or 2828 02:21:48,680 --> 02:21:52,360 whatever, Rocky 11, 'cause they it's like, I can't have the guy 2829 02:21:52,360 --> 02:21:54,920 lose on that. You can't send the man to jail 2830 02:21:54,920 --> 02:21:56,160 because he doesn't win the election. 2831 02:21:56,160 --> 02:21:59,120 That sounds horrific. That sounds like what I thought 2832 02:21:59,120 --> 02:22:00,320 Russia was like when I was a kid. 2833 02:22:02,480 --> 02:22:06,440 Yeah, And I, I just think it's so sad the way, you know, this 2834 02:22:06,440 --> 02:22:09,680 is all kind of unfolding and and they're just blatant about it. 2835 02:22:09,680 --> 02:22:12,240 They're not trying to hide it. Like the Democratic Party is not 2836 02:22:12,240 --> 02:22:15,080 even hiding it. They're not there's like they're 2837 02:22:15,080 --> 02:22:18,440 they're just every time there's a new thing about Hunter Biden 2838 02:22:18,440 --> 02:22:21,560 and a new revelation about the bribery and the scandals around 2839 02:22:21,720 --> 02:22:25,120 around the money laundering in Ukraine and Romania and China, 2840 02:22:25,840 --> 02:22:27,640 boom, there's another indictment for Trump. 2841 02:22:28,640 --> 02:22:33,000 And but now these are serious ones that are in the states are 2842 02:22:33,000 --> 02:22:35,120 are going to be harder. Those are going to be hard for 2843 02:22:35,120 --> 02:22:35,480 him. Yeah. 2844 02:22:35,920 --> 02:22:38,000 There's an argument. There's an argument that's being 2845 02:22:38,000 --> 02:22:39,520 made right now. Mark Meadows is trying to bring 2846 02:22:39,520 --> 02:22:41,240 his case federally. I talked about it on the show 2847 02:22:42,280 --> 02:22:43,920 that they're, they're literally trying to bring it up. 2848 02:22:43,920 --> 02:22:46,920 It's the same thing that you do when a a federal agent gets 2849 02:22:46,920 --> 02:22:49,560 involved in a shooting. What they'll do is they try to 2850 02:22:49,600 --> 02:22:51,960 federalize the case under the fact that the person was 2851 02:22:51,960 --> 02:22:54,480 operating under federal authority and fulfilling their 2852 02:22:54,480 --> 02:22:56,040 federal job. And then the supremacy clause 2853 02:22:56,040 --> 02:22:58,320 comes in. And then in theory, you get 2854 02:22:58,320 --> 02:23:00,880 tried in federal court and or it gets dismissed by the DOJ 2855 02:23:00,880 --> 02:23:02,840 because the DOJ is not going to go do it because they understand 2856 02:23:02,840 --> 02:23:05,600 the Constitution. And yet we have a weaponized DOJ 2857 02:23:05,600 --> 02:23:08,320 too. So the only way this works is if 2858 02:23:08,320 --> 02:23:10,440 this man gets in office, which is crazy. 2859 02:23:10,560 --> 02:23:13,520 I don't want to vote who the president of the United States 2860 02:23:13,520 --> 02:23:16,280 is based on whether or not that guy should go to jail because 2861 02:23:16,280 --> 02:23:19,320 our country is unfair. I, I wasn't mad about his 2862 02:23:19,320 --> 02:23:20,600 policies. I thought he did a good job 2863 02:23:20,600 --> 02:23:22,480 until the COVID lockdown. So it's like, all right, fine. 2864 02:23:23,000 --> 02:23:24,960 If, if I have to choose the lesser of two evils, it's no 2865 02:23:24,960 --> 02:23:26,480 brainer. Donald Trump wins that hands 2866 02:23:26,480 --> 02:23:28,600 down. You know, and yet. 2867 02:23:28,600 --> 02:23:31,240 And that and that phrase. The luster of two evils, though, 2868 02:23:31,240 --> 02:23:33,520 is really kind of sad, isn't? It it's always been there, has 2869 02:23:33,520 --> 02:23:36,040 it not? Evil is just evil, so there's 2870 02:23:36,040 --> 02:23:38,360 not lesser than. Well, there was always, it was 2871 02:23:38,360 --> 02:23:40,800 always a lesser than, I feel like nobody ever personally, you 2872 02:23:40,800 --> 02:23:43,280 know, nobody's ever perfectly represented you and no one's 2873 02:23:43,280 --> 02:23:46,520 ever perfectly represented me. And so we were always choosing 2874 02:23:46,520 --> 02:23:48,200 somebody who agreed with us most of the time. 2875 02:23:48,760 --> 02:23:51,240 But the idea that if you didn't agree with them, they'd put you 2876 02:23:51,240 --> 02:23:57,240 in jail is a new that's new. And so I, I took action and I 2877 02:23:57,240 --> 02:24:03,480 decided to not go back and face that because, you know, the 2878 02:24:03,480 --> 02:24:06,560 frankly, you know, and I said this to you yesterday when I was 2879 02:24:06,560 --> 02:24:08,760 kind of cheerful, like, I'm just not finding anything about my 2880 02:24:08,760 --> 02:24:10,560 case. I can't, you know, I mean, I'm 2881 02:24:10,560 --> 02:24:12,160 going to miss my daughter's wedding. 2882 02:24:12,160 --> 02:24:15,280 I'm going to miss my daughter's graduation for masters. 2883 02:24:15,280 --> 02:24:19,480 I'm missing these life events. This is heartbreaking, you know, 2884 02:24:19,600 --> 02:24:22,680 and it's my country. I was born in Monterey, CA and I 2885 02:24:22,680 --> 02:24:26,240 loved it and never see it maybe again. 2886 02:24:26,560 --> 02:24:30,080 And it's simply because I told the truth, right? 2887 02:24:31,640 --> 02:24:33,920 It doesn't make any sense. And I'm trying to like make 2888 02:24:33,920 --> 02:24:38,320 sense of it and it doesn't. And it's hard and I don't want 2889 02:24:38,320 --> 02:24:40,080 anybody to have to go through what I'm going through. 2890 02:24:40,080 --> 02:24:42,480 But if I'm going to have to make that choice and I have to live 2891 02:24:42,480 --> 02:24:45,040 here, I'm going to make the best of it. 2892 02:24:45,040 --> 02:24:50,680 And frankly, I'm kind of lucky in a way, because at least I 2893 02:24:50,680 --> 02:24:53,880 have a roof over my head. I have a way to make a living. 2894 02:24:53,880 --> 02:24:57,080 I have people that care about me already. 2895 02:24:57,600 --> 02:24:59,680 I mean, they're very loving and caring here. 2896 02:24:59,840 --> 02:25:02,480 And, and that's the thing you always hear about Russians being 2897 02:25:02,480 --> 02:25:04,200 really cold. I've now experienced that. 2898 02:25:04,200 --> 02:25:07,760 They're very warm, very loving, and they smile at you. 2899 02:25:07,760 --> 02:25:09,680 That's all a bunch of bullshit. I was at the subway the other 2900 02:25:09,680 --> 02:25:11,560 day and someone smiled at me and I smiled back. 2901 02:25:12,480 --> 02:25:15,880 Like, you know, all the all these myths they do give, you 2902 02:25:15,880 --> 02:25:18,240 know, space like it takes a while to get to know someone. 2903 02:25:18,240 --> 02:25:20,880 But that's also in most cities like it takes. 2904 02:25:21,160 --> 02:25:22,840 And that's a very Slavic thing anyhow. 2905 02:25:23,080 --> 02:25:25,240 I just feel like all Slavs are like that. 2906 02:25:26,280 --> 02:25:29,480 Yeah, so there you have it. But anyway, do you have a faith 2907 02:25:29,480 --> 02:25:31,760 tradition that you you? On. 2908 02:25:31,760 --> 02:25:33,800 Catholic. Do you go to Catholic mass? 2909 02:25:34,840 --> 02:25:37,840 I was gonna try to actually, I was gonna look at some of the 2910 02:25:37,840 --> 02:25:41,480 Orthodox Christian churches 'cause they're really beautiful 2911 02:25:41,800 --> 02:25:44,120 and I was going to look at that. But yes, there's a beautiful 2912 02:25:44,120 --> 02:25:46,280 Catholic Church here, a couple of them, yeah. 2913 02:25:46,680 --> 02:25:50,760 And there's actually a priest here that is friends of a 2914 02:25:51,520 --> 02:25:54,360 British man that I know who he wanted to introduce me to an 2915 02:25:54,360 --> 02:25:56,400 Irish priest. I love it. 2916 02:25:56,400 --> 02:25:59,040 Well, you, if you go, you give me the update on that. 2917 02:25:59,040 --> 02:26:00,960 I hope you'll come back and give us an update on your status too. 2918 02:26:00,960 --> 02:26:02,760 You don't have to be a stranger anytime you want to come on here 2919 02:26:02,760 --> 02:26:05,800 and let us know what's going on. Give us a different wider 2920 02:26:05,800 --> 02:26:07,560 perspective on there and I'll figure out a time that I can 2921 02:26:07,560 --> 02:26:09,720 come on and be on your, your TNT show as well. 2922 02:26:09,720 --> 02:26:12,960 I'd be happy to if we'll, we'll work out a time to do a tape 2923 02:26:12,960 --> 02:26:15,560 delay since folks, if you don't know, I know it's getting very, 2924 02:26:15,560 --> 02:26:17,880 very late there. Tell people where they can reach 2925 02:26:17,880 --> 02:26:20,360 out to you and give messages to support where they can buy your 2926 02:26:20,360 --> 02:26:22,520 book and all that kind of stuff. Just kind of plug all the things 2927 02:26:22,520 --> 02:26:24,280 that you might do because I know people are going to want to know 2928 02:26:24,280 --> 02:26:26,320 more. I kind of made it easy. 2929 02:26:26,320 --> 02:26:29,640 It's one place, tarareidpodcast.com. 2930 02:26:29,920 --> 02:26:32,560 So Reade is how you spell. My last name, 2931 02:26:32,560 --> 02:26:35,000 tarareidpodcast.com. It's where you have links to my 2932 02:26:35,000 --> 02:26:38,880 book, links to everything and my Twitter account at Reid 2933 02:26:38,880 --> 02:26:43,240 Alexandra. You can find me rage tweeting 2934 02:26:43,240 --> 02:26:45,280 once in a while. Sometimes I'm tweeting nice 2935 02:26:45,280 --> 02:26:47,600 videos of Moscow. It depends on my mood. 2936 02:26:48,680 --> 02:26:51,120 I rage tweet Biden a couple times today. 2937 02:26:51,120 --> 02:26:52,680 You can have fun with that. I know. 2938 02:26:53,760 --> 02:26:56,520 Yeah. And do you know that your do you 2939 02:26:56,600 --> 02:26:59,000 know that your hardcover book is selling for a dollar cheaper 2940 02:26:59,000 --> 02:27:01,520 than your soft back your paperback book on Amazon? 2941 02:27:03,920 --> 02:27:05,880 It's funny. I don't know why, but it is. 2942 02:27:06,120 --> 02:27:06,840 Yeah. It's kind of fun. 2943 02:27:08,000 --> 02:27:09,480 And people can find your memoir there. 2944 02:27:09,520 --> 02:27:12,200 Yeah. And I'm doing the audible I'm. 2945 02:27:12,200 --> 02:27:14,600 Adding actually what's coming. With the book is. 2946 02:27:14,600 --> 02:27:17,280 I'm adding an epilogue called Moscow, so I'm going to talk 2947 02:27:17,280 --> 02:27:19,840 about. Moscow and I'm also doing an 2948 02:27:19,840 --> 02:27:21,800 audio version of the book so that's coming. 2949 02:27:22,240 --> 02:27:24,000 Fantastic. Yeah. 2950 02:27:24,000 --> 02:27:25,720 Does Rose McGowan. She does the four. 2951 02:27:25,760 --> 02:27:27,880 She does the four word, which is amazing because she is 2952 02:27:27,880 --> 02:27:29,560 definitely a lefty and probably not a. 2953 02:27:29,560 --> 02:27:31,960 Big Donald Trump fan and yet there are things you can all 2954 02:27:31,960 --> 02:27:35,280 agree on that people shouldn't have to be victims of powerful 2955 02:27:35,280 --> 02:27:37,600 people. Well, Tara, thanks so much for 2956 02:27:37,600 --> 02:27:39,840 spending more hours than you planned on with us. 2957 02:27:39,840 --> 02:27:41,880 I do really appreciate it. I really enjoy talking to you. 2958 02:27:41,960 --> 02:27:44,280 I'm glad that you look better than the last time I talked to 2959 02:27:44,280 --> 02:27:47,160 you. You look less stressed. 2960 02:27:47,360 --> 02:27:50,000 And I, I hope that is the case. Even though it's tough to be 2961 02:27:50,000 --> 02:27:52,080 away, I'm I'm glad you're in a place where you feel safer 2962 02:27:52,080 --> 02:27:54,440 because I know what that war looks like and what it what it, 2963 02:27:54,440 --> 02:27:55,920 what it does. It's exhausting. 2964 02:27:56,440 --> 02:28:00,440 So and good luck to you too and your family. 2965 02:28:00,480 --> 02:28:02,160 Please give your family my love. Take care. 2966 02:28:02,160 --> 02:28:03,680 I will absolutely. All right. 2967 02:28:03,680 --> 02:28:08,320 Thanks so much. You've been listening to the 2968 02:28:08,320 --> 02:28:11,960 Kyle Seraphin Show streamed. Live from Liberty Hill, TX, 2969 02:28:12,000 --> 02:28:16,280 America and we are very grateful to you for joining us. 2970 02:28:16,280 --> 02:28:19,000 Thanks so much. Please consider giving us a five 2971 02:28:19,000 --> 02:28:22,480 star review on Apple, which you can go ahead and find in the 2972 02:28:22,480 --> 02:28:25,320 show notes directly below me and we will read them on the show 2973 02:28:25,480 --> 02:28:31,040 like this one here from Falcion. Falcolone says love the show. 5 2974 02:28:31,040 --> 02:28:33,200 stars, spicy takes on the state of America. 2975 02:28:33,200 --> 02:28:36,000 Great guests just like this one. Today we want to say thanks to 2976 02:28:36,000 --> 02:28:40,040 Tara Reid for joining us from Moscow and giving you her inside 2977 02:28:40,040 --> 02:28:43,560 story, the the scoop on what she's living through, why she 2978 02:28:43,560 --> 02:28:45,200 made the decision to stay over there. 2979 02:28:45,520 --> 02:28:47,040 I think it's pretty chilling, but I think it's really 2980 02:28:47,040 --> 02:28:48,240 important that we hear these things. 2981 02:28:48,440 --> 02:28:51,680 We do want to say thanks to all the folks that it takes to build 2982 02:28:51,680 --> 02:28:55,120 the show up. Our guests, you and our 2983 02:28:55,120 --> 02:28:57,800 technical producer Ryan Maddow, who does a fantastic job. 2984 02:28:57,800 --> 02:29:01,080 Please follow Ryan on Twitter at Ryan Matta Media. 2985 02:29:01,080 --> 02:29:03,840 That's MATTA. You can also find him on true 2986 02:29:03,840 --> 02:29:09,240 social at Ryan Matta MATTA. You can find him later on this 2987 02:29:09,240 --> 02:29:14,880 day on Rumble on LFA TV show. His show Matta A fact MATTA. 2988 02:29:15,120 --> 02:29:17,040 You get the pattern. You know what's going on here, 2989 02:29:17,720 --> 02:29:18,920 folks. Don't forget to like this video. 2990 02:29:19,000 --> 02:29:21,080 Scroll on down. Give it that thumbs up that 2991 02:29:21,080 --> 02:29:23,600 Green piss off the CIA if that's what it's doing. 2992 02:29:23,600 --> 02:29:26,360 Upset those who are trying to run counterintelligence cases on 2993 02:29:26,360 --> 02:29:29,840 American citizens who simply have some disagreements with our 2994 02:29:29,840 --> 02:29:32,520 political structure. And we will see you again 2995 02:29:32,520 --> 02:29:35,760 tomorrow for Friendly Friday. Hang in there. 2996 02:29:35,960 --> 02:29:39,120 I know it's getting rough out there folks, but we're going to 2997 02:29:39,120 --> 02:29:41,240 keep telling the stories and we'll see you soon. 2998 02:29:42,000 --> 02:29:44,720 Thanks for listening to the Kyle Serafin Show, streamed live 2999 02:29:44,720 --> 02:29:47,760 weekdays on rumble.com/kyle Serafin. 3000 02:29:47,840 --> 02:29:52,040 Follow Kyle on Twitter, True Social and Instagram at Kyle 3001 02:29:52,040 --> 02:29:52,760 Serafin.