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Welcome to the Everyday PM 
podcast, the podcast where we 

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discussed project management 
principles for your everyday 

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life. 
My name is Ann Camthia, I am a 

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certified project manager, 
having had the great opportunity

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to work across industries like 
tech, healthcare, and now I find

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myself in marketing. 
I am excited to welcome 

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Priscilla McKinney, who is an 
author of Collaboration is the 

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New Competition, which I have 
right here. 

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Excuse my blurred screen there 
if you're watching the video, 

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but she is here to talk about 
not just the book, but really 

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talk about what true 
collaboration means. 

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And we're going to go into that 
topic in more detail in just a 

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few minutes here. 
But for those who have not met 

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you, Priscilla, if you can take 
a brief moment to introduce 

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yourself to our audience, that'd
be great. 

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Yeah, for sure. 
Thank you so much for having me 

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on. 
And people, if you're listening 

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in and you love this show, you 
need to give her a 5 star rating

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because these podcasts are 
absolutely a labor of love from 

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all of us podcasting hosts. 
And you know, if you like what 

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you hear, then this is the way 
that you can give something back

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to Anne to make sure that she 
can keep doing it. 

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But thank you for having me on. 
I really appreciate it. 

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I know what goes into, you know,
creating a podcast and all of 

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the logistical planning, which 
I, you know, is one of the 

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reasons why I really do love 
your show. 

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And I think this kind of, you 
know, this kind of approach, 

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this kind of conversation needs 
to always be having, you know, 

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with amongst your team. 
So who I am, I am the CEO here 

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at Little Bird marketing. 
We are a content marketing 

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agency specifically for revenue 
generation for B to B. 

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Now, I happen to heavily 
specialized in the market 

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research industry, but we we 
take a lot of clients across the

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B to B space. 
We do everything from writing 

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thought leadership to writing, 
you know, highly compelling lead

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magnets to creating digital ads 
or revenue sprints, to building 

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websites that convert, to 
showing up at conferences and 

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helping get ROI out of that 
through video, through a 

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podcasting, through photography.
So my team really looks at the 

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whole B to B ecosystem and says 
how can we take the next step 

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with the client and make sure 
that they are continually 

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growing at the right pace? 
You know, I don't know if this 

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ever happens to you, but this 
consistently happens to me, 

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Priscilla, in where I bring on 
guests onto the podcast and I 

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completely just get nervous. 
And it's because with you, it's 

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because you bring the 
experiences that I am still 

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trying to create in my own 
professional journey. 

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You've written and obviously 
authored a book. 

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You manage a gigantic team and 
then all the while you are able 

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to do multiple podcasts. 
You are so kind in terms of your

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outreach to other podcasters. 
So I will just let the audience 

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know that I am a little bit 
intimidated right now by doing 

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this interview with you. 
But I am so excited that you are

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able to join us here on the 
everyday PM and I appreciate the

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support that you've provided to 
me. 

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So without further ado, oh, go 
ahead. 

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All we have all been there. 
And I mean, I had to start my 

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podcast at one time and I do 
remember way back when, when I 

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started, I remember listening to
Amy Porterfield like non-stop on

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her podcast. 
And I think about 5678 other 

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people in leadership who have 
really helped me along the way. 

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And it's no small thing. 
So finding those people who are 

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maybe at a different place that 
are further along in the journey

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where you want to go is so key. 
And I have those people for me 

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and I am, I would be proud to be
one of those people for you. 

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I feel so much better about just
that the supportive nature of, 

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you know, and especially since 
we're both women as well, I 

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think that's amazing. 
So I appreciate that the title 

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of your book, it's 
collaboration, but you also use 

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the word competition. 
And I thought that was really 

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interesting because you don't 
often hear those two words 

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spoken together in terms of how 
do you be collaborative? 

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Yet there's also this 
competitive nature that happens 

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alongside that. 
So collaboration is a new 

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competition when it comes to the
book that you've authored. 

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How do you define true 
collaboration in the context of 

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the book? 
Well. 

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First I would say for business I
would have to say, first of all,

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there's really bad news and that
is you can't go it alone. 

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And I would also say there's 
really good news. 

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Guess what, you can't go it 
alone. 

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You know, so kind of like how 
you kind of led with that just 

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vulnerability of just feeling 
like, oh, I'm a little 

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intimidated and I got to go 
launch my business. 

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Well, nobody goes it alone. 
And unfortunately this kind of 

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Americana, you know, Whitesnake,
you know, here I go again on my 

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own, kind of, you know, Anthem 
does not really service and kind

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of, as you pointed out, it 
doesn't really service as women 

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either. 
And yet we keep engaging in it. 

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But the fact of the matter is, 
is that people who are 

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competitive and who have one, 
they are also collaborative, 

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have had help. 
And so this idea that they are 

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on the opposite sides of a 
spectrum to me is a fallacy. 

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They aren't. 
They can go hand in hand. 

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Now what they aren't is a 
sharing of trade secrets when it

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comes to business or a it also 
doesn't mean we have to 

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collaborate for a long time. 
It could be a very short one. 

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You and I are going to 
collaborate today for about 1/2 

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an hour. 
And then I'm going to have you 

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on my podcast and I'm going to 
collaborate with you. 

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And we're going to use each 
other's networks to help each 

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other in the way we best can. 
I can. 

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That doesn't mean now that I'm 
going to open up my books and 

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share that with you. 
So just because we're 

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collaborating in this moment, it
means we can still compete and 

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can still find her right 
audience and have them come to 

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her and pay her. 
And I can find my right audience

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and have them come to me. 
So we don't have to have this 

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mentality of win, lose anymore. 
I could win and you could win, 

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all while we're both competing 
for business. 

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I love that, I love that. 
And as that pertains to project 

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managers, I think that's one of 
the hardest barriers to break in

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terms of the mentality when we 
see our role within a project 

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team, which is so often times 
project managers will come to me

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and say, I'm not making any 
headway on this project. 

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I how can I be successful? 
It feels like we're all 

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competing against each other. 
And it sounds like to your point

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and what's emphasized in the 
book is, yes, there's this 

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element of competition that has 
to happen in order for you to 

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innovate and grow, but that can 
all be done in a collaborative 

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manner. 
As you had said, I would never 

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show you my books. 
You would maybe never show me 

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the details of your books. 
But there's something that to be

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said about us being successful 
together that basically what 

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you're trying to get at in the 
definition there. 

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And I think that there's 
something even further. 

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You bring up this project 
management and it can get very 

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competitive, like for example, 
when there's a project manager 

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kind of a taskmaster, if you 
will, you know, we can get very 

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checklisty. 
We work on Trello here and we 

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kind of live and die by Trello. 
You know, we have to collaborate

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with with clients all the time. 
And you're right, you can get in

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that feeling like, Oh my gosh, 
I'm lifting all the weight here.

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I keep nudging them and nudging 
them. 

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How come you're not getting this
done? 

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You know, these kinds of things 
are very frustrating, but that's

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because we have had this 
abundance of I'm doing my thing 

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and then you have to do your 
thing and it like as opposed to 

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really understanding how we can 
collaborate. 

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And one thing I would say about 
that, it does show us that we do

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have a little bit of a win lose.
Like when we do try one up, 

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someone with like, Nope, I got 
all those things done at 10:00 

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at night so that you're 
basically feel completely 

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drowned. 
You know, when you come in, in 

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the morning there you can see 
some underlying tone maybe of 

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how we work and how we project 
manage together. 

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But I would say the biggest 
issue for that is I like to call

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attention to the fact that 
working in proximity does not 

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mean we're collaborating. 
So just because you and I are 

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sharing the same project 
management board and maybe we 

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sat down together at this 
meeting, we still could be 

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worlds apart and not be 
collaborating. 

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And that is the fallacy. 
I want to make sure I call out 

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with people. 
Just because you get on the same

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project management board with 
them does not mean you have 

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dealt with the issues that you 
need to deal with so that you 

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are truly collaborating. 
Was there a moment that's that's

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such a great point. 
And I'm curious if there was a 

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moment in your professional 
journey where you had that 

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realization was that you were 
working with a specific partner 

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and you don't obviously have to 
name any names or anything like 

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that. 
But this is not something that 

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you would realize early on in 
your professional journey. 

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At least I did not. 
It took me a quite a number of 

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years and experiences and 
failures to finally figure out 

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that that is a thing that can 
happen within a collaborative 

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space is that you still can be 
very much on opposing sides of 

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the argument. 
So was there a specific example 

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that aha moment for you of where
you're thinking, oh, this is how

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we play the game in the world of
business? 

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Yeah, for sure. 
My good friend Sarah Kotva from 

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Field Work, she is, had been a 
client of mine for a lot of 

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years. 
But we met at an event where I 

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was speaking and eventually she 
hired me. 

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Well, we work together for 
years. 

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We still work together and we 
have such a great dialogue. 

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But one day she said to me, you 
came on the market research 

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scene in like 2016 and you just 
like blew up. 

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Like how? 
How did you do that? 

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She's like, I've been in this 
industry my whole life. 

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And I was like, oh, that's 
interesting. 

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How did I do that? 
Right. 

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And I did have an aha moment. 
What is it I'm doing differently

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than other people are doing that
is getting me further, quicker 

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and really helping me achieve my
biggest goals? 

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And I realized I'm bringing a 
lot of people on that journey 

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with me. 
I'm collaborating with a lot of 

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people. 
I'm saying not, hey, can I get 

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you to pay me? 
You lose, I win. 

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But I'm saying, oh, what are 
some other things you need? 

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You want to pay me, I win. 
What do you need? 

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OK, well, let me get you in 
touch with this person. 

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I realized that it didn't have 
to be tit for tat. 

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You don't have to have those 
kinds of relationships. 

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And so I was doing a lot of 
things, doing a lot of favors 

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for people who were in exchange 
doing favors for me. 

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And I was really, more than 
anything, asking better 

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questions of people I would meet
along the way. 

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And I was seeing if I could go a
little further with doing them a

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favor of helping them achieve 
that next goal they had. 

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At the same time, when they 
asked me, well, how can I help 

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you, Priscilla? 
I wasn't polite and go, oh, 

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don't worry about it. 
Don't help me. 

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Which is not only what we do in 
business, but it's very heavily 

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what a lot of women do. 
Yeah. 

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And instead I said, Oh well, 
what would really help me is if 

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you did this or this or this is 
one of those like really easy 

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for you and they would pick one 
and help me and voila, I got a 

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lot further faster. 
And so when she asked that to 

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me, like, how did you do that? 
I thought, Oh well, I thought 

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that's what everybody does. 
And I had that aha moment that I

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had been doing something 
differently that was intuitive 

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to me, but that I really did 
have a very specific codified 

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system. 
I just needed to explain it to 

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other people so they could 
benefit from it. 

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Isn't that I you had so many 
good Nuggets of what you just 

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said in terms of the way that 
I'm just going to call back to 

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the way that women perceive that
type of direction is they always

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say, I feel bad asking. 
And so I'm really glad that you 

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called that out in terms of you 
took that completely off the 

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table and said this is 
transactional in some ways, but 

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it never was an emotional tie 
in. 

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It feels in, in terms of the way
that you illustrated that 

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journey of that aha moment. 
It didn't feel like there was 

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any emotions tied to it. 
This is just business and this 

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is how you collaborate within 
the business space. 

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And if we're able to, and I'm 
just bringing it back to my 

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audience in the project 
management world, untie those 

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things, I think we can 
accomplish a lot more. 

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But I think in the journey of a 
project manager, often times 

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those two ideas are intertwined.
And that's something that comes 

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with experience, maturity, 
failures, trust, relationships 

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and that sort of thing, that 
collaborative nature and 

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something that you learn along 
the way. 

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And I often felt like I was 
feeling bad about asking for 

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those things early on in my 
career, whereas I get it now. 

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I totally get it. 
Well, when I think about project

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management, I think a lot of 
times we are remiss that we 

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don't ask how somebody else 
wants the project to be managed 

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or what does success look like 
for someone else. 

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Because for those people who are
in project management, listen, I

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love those people. 
I hire those people all the time

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because I love those checklisty 
people. 

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Oh look, good Lord, they run my 
life, you know, and they make me

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look really good. 
But sometimes that's exhausting.

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And so when we think about a 
project, my team is also in tune

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enough to say, OK, do you want 
me just to run this list? 

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Like just exactly. 
And I'd be like, yes, Oh my 

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gosh, don't even ask me about 
it. 

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Or they might find that I go, Oh
no, this one is so dear to me. 

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Can we just talk about a little 
bit and let's nuance this. 

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Let's put a, you know, put some 
kid gloves on and, and deal with

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this client. 
And this is where I'm thinking 

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we could go. 
And they know that I am not the 

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same person every day when I 
approach every single project. 

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And so in, in terms of project 
management, if you want to 

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collaborate with people, you 
also, in my opinion, have to 

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learn how to collaborate with 
yourself. 

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What do I stand to win and lose 
if I do this approach? 

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Like you need to be a little bit
awake and alive to what you're 

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holding onto so closely. 
And so that's, that's that kind 

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of like true, you know, self 
talk. 

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I'm coming at it from this 
perspective. 

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Let me be honest about the 
perspective I'm coming from. 

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And it really is that 
introspective work that you have

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to do on yourself as well. 
I love that you're calling that 

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out even though you've never 
held the role of project 

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manager. 
As far as I'm concerned, I feel 

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like you would be the perfect 
fit for that role. 

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If you like checklist Priscilla 
I. 

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Do no joke, we live and die by 
it. 

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And I mean for all intents and 
purposes, I'm just a glorified 

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project manager. 
I just happen to be managing 

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projects of revenue for multiple
companies at the same time. 

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So you do have to have a lot of 
checklist, You do have to have a

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lot of organization. 
You just can't live and die by 

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them. 
You have to really come at it 

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and say, well, in this 
particular case, how could I 

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best collaborate with this 
client for this goal, but with 

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these personalities as well? 
Yeah, that emotional 

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00:14:57,480 --> 00:15:00,240
intelligence piece is often 
something that's not spoken of. 

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You kind of just learn it along 
the way as well. 

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00:15:02,840 --> 00:15:06,520
And I wanted to call back to 
the, the, the cover of your book

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and I know that I'm kind of in a
blurred screen for those that 

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are, are maybe watching this 
video. 

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00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:16,360
But you talk about kind of the 
beehive mentality or the, the 

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00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:19,840
dynamics of a beehive and you're
able to draw parallels between 

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00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:23,200
collaboration and a beehive. 
So can you talk a little bit 

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00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:26,080
about that with our audience in 
terms of, you know, how that 

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00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:29,440
idea came about? 
And what is it about beehives 

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00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:32,440
and the dynamics of that that 
make you think about 

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00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:33,840
collaboration? 
Yeah. 

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00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:35,920
So first of all, I'll let you 
know, we have tried to be 

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00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:37,360
beekeepers. 
We have been incredibly 

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00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:41,280
unsuccessful at my house. 
So please know I cannot do this 

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00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:43,880
in real life. 
But as far as the collaboration 

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00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:46,240
is concerned, of course, all the
things you're thinking about 

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00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:49,560
bees, there are a lot of people 
doing the same, you know, 

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00:15:49,560 --> 00:15:54,240
project achieving more together.
There's a lot, you know, so we 

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00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:56,760
get that busy bee, like we get 
all that mentality, but there's 

301
00:15:56,760 --> 00:15:59,040
more to it. 
And one of the things I call out

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00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:01,840
in my book just and I'll just 
get into just this one point is 

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00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:04,200
that there is a hierarchy in a 
beehive. 

304
00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:07,320
Okay, So what I think when 
people come into collaboration 

305
00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:11,600
and indeed when they come into 
project management is they act 

306
00:16:11,600 --> 00:16:15,560
like, oh, we're all equals here 
and we all have to have a, but 

307
00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:18,480
if we're going to collaborate, 
then we all get to have the same

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00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:22,560
say no, that's not how it works.
I'm the CEO and when I create a 

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00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:26,040
project, the project manager 
needs to manage it, you know, 

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00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:29,160
and they don't get to then, you 
know, say, well, I did it this 

311
00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:32,120
way because I decided that's no,
there's a hierarchy. 

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00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:35,360
Now, unfortunately, in our 
society, we have really equated 

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00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:39,200
hierarchy with abuse of power. 
And so immediately when I say, 

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00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:43,600
Oh, no, I'm in charge, everybody
goes, oh, that's so bad, That's 

315
00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:45,720
not bad, That's great. 
There's a hierarchy. 

316
00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:48,120
I understand what it is. 
The queen bee has a particular 

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00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:49,880
role. 
This is what she does. 

318
00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:51,960
You know, you have worker bees. 
We understand all of this. 

319
00:16:51,960 --> 00:16:53,520
This is like fifth grade 
science, right? 

320
00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:57,200
I think when people get in 
business and they want to 

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00:16:57,200 --> 00:16:59,840
collaborate, all of a sudden 
they get this idea like it's 

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00:16:59,840 --> 00:17:03,320
just altruistic. 
Let's just come around the fire 

323
00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:05,440
and sing some songs and we'll 
collaborate. 

324
00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:07,640
That is not what collaboration 
is. 

325
00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:12,200
Collaboration is hard. 
It is, it is a way of competing 

326
00:17:12,520 --> 00:17:19,359
and it is about, in my opinion, 
three things #1 knowing what you

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00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:21,520
have to lose and what you have 
to gain. 

328
00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:25,160
And I don't think you should get
involved in collaboration with 

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00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:28,640
anybody who does not have both 
yourself and the other people. 

330
00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:33,280
You've got to have both. 
And the second thing is you have

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00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:34,920
to be willing to show your 
cards. 

332
00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:37,640
Now, I'm not saying all your 
cards, not your IP, not your 

333
00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,320
books, not anything you have to 
show your cards about. 

334
00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:42,320
What is it I'm trying to get out
of here. 

335
00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,720
So for example, I reached out to
you in a collaboration. 

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00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:48,600
I have something to gain and I 
have something to lose because 

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00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:50,560
what I asked was and you have a 
podcast. 

338
00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:52,600
I have a podcast. 
Let's collaborate, right? 

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00:17:53,120 --> 00:17:55,800
So you let me on your show, I'll
let you on my show. 

340
00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:57,600
What do I have to stand to lose 
or to gain? 

341
00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:02,080
Maybe you come on my show and 
then you never air mine and I 

342
00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:04,200
air yours. 
OK, I have that to lose, but 

343
00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:06,400
what do I have to gain? 
I can make a significant 

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00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:09,280
connection with you. 
We could build a network as 

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00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:12,040
women in business. 
I could be on your podcast and 

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00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:15,520
somebody from your audience ends
up working with me. 

347
00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:18,720
I have a lot to gain. 
So I have to have that in mind. 

348
00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:23,160
And I have to be willing to let 
you have both of those too, you 

349
00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:25,240
know? 
And then the next thing is 

350
00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:28,040
showing your card. 
So you be honest about what you 

351
00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:30,160
have to win and what you have to
lose in that moment. 

352
00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:33,040
And then the third thing is you 
need to work with people who 

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00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:38,080
have a will to win, and I mean a
will for themselves and for 

354
00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:39,840
others. 
And I again, I'm going to come 

355
00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:42,440
back to this women in business. 
So often people say, oh, what 

356
00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:44,320
can I do for your Priscilla? 
And I say, well, you can do 

357
00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:45,000
this, blah, blah, blah. 
OK. 

358
00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:46,080
And then I say, what can I do 
for you? 

359
00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:50,240
Oh, no, don't worry about it. 
I don't want to collaborate with

360
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:53,160
that person if they don't have 
the will to win. 

361
00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:56,040
The verb, the energy, the drive 
in their own business. 

362
00:18:57,080 --> 00:18:59,440
I don't expect that they should 
do that for me. 

363
00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:03,280
And so to me, when I think about
like, you know, the beehive and 

364
00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:05,680
that kind of stuff, there's a 
hierarchy you need to see. 

365
00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:08,480
You just need to understand it. 
It doesn't mean that you're less

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00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:11,440
valuable than someone else. 
It means you have a role in it. 

367
00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:13,960
And once you understand that and
you quit putting all these 

368
00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:17,200
weirdness things over the 
hierarchy, you can get down to 

369
00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:20,560
business and collaborate. 
And that's how you can get what 

370
00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:23,640
maybe I would call, you know, 
parity or equity. 

371
00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,360
It does not have to be 
hierarchy, right? 

372
00:19:26,360 --> 00:19:31,280
And that's how a beehive works. 
That's you've described almost 

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00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:34,720
every company that I've had an 
opportunity to work for. 

374
00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:38,760
And even if they've promoted 
themselves as a collaborative 

375
00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,640
environment where we listen to 
everybody's thoughts, you know, 

376
00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:46,440
I'm thinking Apple for example, 
which they do, they try to set 

377
00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:48,840
it up that way. 
But to Priscilla's point, 

378
00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:53,080
ultimately, there is somebody at
the top that is going to have to

379
00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:57,480
make a decision, right? 
And let's not forget that that 

380
00:19:57,480 --> 00:20:01,520
is actually very critical in 
order to move business forward 

381
00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:04,120
in order for projects to be 
successful. 

382
00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:08,440
We can collaborate until, I 
don't know what the right phrase

383
00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,520
is, but we can collaborate until
we're exhausted and still never 

384
00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:14,600
come to an alignment of the 
direction we want to go in. 

385
00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:18,400
And so all of that of what 
Priscilla just outlined. 

386
00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:22,880
Is very, very useful in terms of
how project managers can lead 

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00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:27,400
projects to success while still 
introducing this element of 

388
00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:31,360
collaboration and also being 
very honest about the 

389
00:20:31,360 --> 00:20:33,640
competition that still needs to 
have to happen. 

390
00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:36,120
I mean, your book has key 
elements. 

391
00:20:36,120 --> 00:20:38,720
It has a framework, it has 
strategies. 

392
00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:41,120
Is there any kind of imparting 
words? 

393
00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:43,840
Obviously, I want the audience 
to pick this book up, so I'm not

394
00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:47,440
trying to give away all of the 
elements of what's in the book. 

395
00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:50,760
But is there anything else that 
you want to kind of call out, 

396
00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:53,640
whether specific to project 
managers who might be listening 

397
00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:57,080
to this or just to the general 
audience around your book? 

398
00:20:57,080 --> 00:20:58,920
Collaboration is a new 
competition. 

399
00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:03,000
Yeah, I would love to give more 
value to specifically to project

400
00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:04,960
managers. 
And one thing I would say is 

401
00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:08,400
that I find that a lot of people
who take that kind of role at a 

402
00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:11,440
company, they usually get very 
heads down, right? 

403
00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:14,680
They're they're doers. 
Like I said, I love these doers,

404
00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:17,960
but often they don't pick their 
head up to look at the larger 

405
00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:19,640
world. 
And one of the things I would 

406
00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:24,920
offer in this book is the 
reminder that you need to be 

407
00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:27,280
networking. 
You need to be out after your 

408
00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:29,520
own good. 
You need to be building your 

409
00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:32,920
personal brand, you need to be 
building your influence online 

410
00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:36,400
as a as a business professional,
you need to be taking care of 

411
00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:38,480
yourself. 
And to that end, you need to 

412
00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:41,480
collaborate with other people. 
So just because you're a good 

413
00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:44,160
worker bee and you put your head
down and get things done and you

414
00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:47,840
might be the absolute best 
project manager, but that might 

415
00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:52,560
not mean anything to you five 
years down the line if you fail 

416
00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:55,240
to really take opportunities to 
collaborate. 

417
00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:58,240
And I mean, in very tiny ways or
in very large ways 

418
00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:02,440
collaborating, meaning maybe 
meeting with five other, you 

419
00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:07,280
know, women in your area or you 
know, for, for business ideas or

420
00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:09,760
meeting with other project 
managers and saying, how do we 

421
00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:12,720
need to upskill? 
Or hey, who meeting with 10 

422
00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:15,000
project managers and saying, 
hey, who's using what tech? 

423
00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:17,560
You get 5 minutes to talk about 
what tech you're doing, like 

424
00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:20,880
find interesting ways to 
collaborate with people that are

425
00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:26,360
is meaningful to you, that grows
your career and really gets you 

426
00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,240
out of your, you know, your 
day-to-day grind. 

427
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:34,800
Yeah, that's fantastic. 
Priscilla, I appreciate your 

428
00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:38,280
time joining us on the Everyday 
PM podcast today. 

429
00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:41,480
From businesswoman to 
businesswoman, I completely see 

430
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:44,680
you as a boss lady that I am 
just completely enamored with. 

431
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,200
And I really do appreciate you 
reaching out to me and then 

432
00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:51,160
inviting me onto your podcast as
well, which I'm very much 

433
00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:53,760
looking forward to doing that 
episode with you as well. 

434
00:22:53,760 --> 00:22:57,480
So if folks want to continue the
conversation with you, where can

435
00:22:57,480 --> 00:22:59,960
they find you online? 
A couple of places. 

436
00:22:59,960 --> 00:23:02,760
First of all, I teach social 
influence on LinkedIn and so 

437
00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:05,160
therefore I have a very big 
presence on LinkedIn. 

438
00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:07,480
Very easy to find me, I answer 
it myself. 

439
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:10,880
I also for my book have 
priscillamckinney.com. 

440
00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:14,880
And then if you're in marketing 
or in the realm where where I 

441
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:19,480
live and work, Little Bird 
marketing.com is a great site. 

442
00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:23,560
But I'm telling you, Slash 
Resources has so many free 

443
00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,960
resources about taking the next 
step with your own life and, you

444
00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:29,840
know, bettering your stance in 
your own career. 

445
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:34,040
So we are not weird salesy, you 
know, people download what you 

446
00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:35,760
want from there. 
If you're not interested in our 

447
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services, you can unsubscribe. 
It's no big deal. 

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Like we are not harassing 
salespeople, but there are some 

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really great resources that we 
have created, you know, with an 

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award-winning teen over the last
12 years. 

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They are very valuable. 
And I just kind of say shame on 

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the person who doesn't reach out
and say, look, this person's 

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further along than I am, So what
do they have to offer? 

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I certainly have learned from 
some of the best pros in the 

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industry, and just that 
graciousness with which people 

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put their best and brightest 
ideas out there is something I 

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really appreciate and I looked 
to emulate. 

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This has truly been an honor 
having you on the podcast. 

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00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:15,920
I myself have worked through 
your resources and just again, 

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00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:18,480
enamored by the way that you 
brand yourself, present 

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00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,120
yourself. 
I've been on the on the website,

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I've gone through some of the 
resources already because I 

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00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:26,440
myself find that myself in that 
place of wanting to learn from 

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others who have had those 
experiences. 

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So I highly encourage our 
audience to not just pick up 

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Priscilla's book, but also check
out the resources on their 

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00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:36,960
website. 
I'll make sure all of the 

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00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:40,600
relevant links are attached to 
this in the audio and video 

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formats of this podcast. 
So Priscilla, on behalf of the 

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Everyday PM audience, thank you 
so much for your time today. 

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00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:50,200
I'm Ann Campia, you can also 
find me on LinkedIn if you'd 

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00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,640
like to collect, connect 
further, and I look forward to 

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00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:56,280
speaking you all on the next 
episode of the Everyday PM 

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Podcast. 
So that will do it for both of 

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us. 
Thank you so much for joining.