Because so many women, there are so many women entrepreneurs and
more are coming and they are not making a lot of money.
So it's going and they know will not have a pension in in 20 to
30 years. That is a crisis.
So yeah, I think that is the sense of urgency needs to be
communicated and lobbied. Welcome to Women Disrupting
Tech. My name is Der Konopkas, and on
this podcast I give the women who work in tech the platform
they need to inspire and empower each other.
Join me on a journey into the world of entrepreneurship,
funding biases, and role models to discover the strategies for
success in the tech industry. In other words, how women can
disrupt tech. Are you ready to listen?
Hey, welcome back to Women Disrupting Tech and thank you
for tuning into episode 110. This podcast started with the
statistic that only 2% of VC funding goes to female founded
teams. And from the start, this has
been a journey to discover why that is and what we can do about
it. In this episode, we'll explore
what role education can play when it comes to closing the
funding gap. You'll hear from Femstart
founders Marion Spear and Simona von Baisterfeld how they are
building a global platform that teaches female entrepreneurs
what the language of venture capital investors is, how they
can build realistic forecasts that appeal to those investors,
and why it's important to know your worth at the negotiation
table. What makes this episode special
is that it is packed with insight and inspiration for
female entrepreneurs. One thing that struck me is that
about 25 minutes into the episode, Marion Spears says
something I haven't heard before on the podcast.
She believes that the funding situation for female founders
changes when more women owned businesses become too big to
ignore. So when you're ready to listen
and learn how Femstart helps female founders get funded,
please welcome to women disrupting tech, Marion Spear
and Simona von Baistervelt. Marion Spear, Simona von
Baistervelt, welcome to women disrupting tech.
Good to have you. Question I always ask at the
start is how you got into your current job or current positions
as founders of Femstart and Marion Floor is yours.
Well, I organised TEDx events since 2009 and 2010.
I started organising TEDx Amsterdam Women in 2015.
I founded the Startup Awards because what we discovered with
the group, the team is that the most underprivileged group was
female entrepreneurs. And what we saw was the snowball
effect, which was that once the women were visible and started
learning more about how to raise funding, they were able to raise
funding. So in 2020 after I quit FedEx
Amsterdam Women, I founded Femstar in 2020 right before
COVID and then after that my Co founders joined because I
thought well it's nice that they're giving me a cup of
coffee after they raised funding.
But I think I should start a business with this and not just
have a cup of coffee after one of the ladies race funding.
Yeah, we'll get to the business part in a bit.
So Simone, you joined 10 a bit later.
How did you get into contact? Did you know each other?
Yeah, we knew each other. I started my working career long
time ago in finance and I did a lot of finance jobs and at some
point I was working at Media Monks as a CFO.
Media Monks is part of S4 Capital listed in the UK.
And there we were also, that was also during COVID time and we
were working in 34 countries with a lot of colleagues.
And there Marion was introduced by the HR director to help us
out on writing a code, how to engage with each other as
colleagues. So that's where I first met
Marion and then at some point when I already quit my job at
Mediamonks, I started as an entrepreneur myself to help
startup in scale UPS, making sure their back office was
organized in a good way. So I do that as the CFO, as a
service or financial advisor. And at some point Marian asked
me, do you want to join as Co founder because you are more the
complementary part of my capabilities and that's how it
started. OK.
So you started in COVID. How was that?
Because currently you organize physical events and physical
trainings. What did you start with?
How did you make that switch, Malayan?
So when I started, the plan was to create an incubator program
and a global incubator program because there was no at that
time, there were there were no incubator programs for female
entrepreneurs mostly in the US, but not that much.
Once, yeah, COVID was there, we said OK, then we have to create
a digital platform. That's How I Met Jim Stolzo, who
was one of the founders of TEDx Amsterdam, and I knew that he
was building AT tech platforms. So I contacted him and asked him
if he wants to help us build an AT tech platform for Femstart.
So it was a pivot. As startups, you need to pivot
your business constantly because the world is changing and you
need to change with the world. So that's how it started, yeah.
Yeah. And that's and at that point you
really needed to pivot. Yes, we needed to.
Pivot, because the world did change a lot.
Yes, yes, yes. So how did you?
But still the basis of the program is online program.
So we have two online courses which are combined with the
physical meetings we have. And the first online course is
types of funding. So they're a female entrepreneur
can learn about which types of funding are out there to finance
the growth of your company. And the second one is meeting
the investor where you can really see Marion interviewing
an investor and they female founder in a real between
brackets context with questions you can expect from an investor
because I think that is that is a big hurdle for female
entrepreneurs to go across doing that actual meeting with the
investor. So, so that is the basis of our
of our training still. Yeah.
Can you double click on on the why that is difficult for women?
I think twofold. So one is female entrepreneurs
have a lack of networking to have a seat at the table.
And the second thing is that female entrepreneurs are more
risk averse and a bit more shy in showing what they are able to
build with growth funding. So Marion, do you have anything
to add there? So there are a few reasons, of
course. Feasibility investors have
always have what they call FOMO of fear of missing out.
So when an entrepreneur is visible in in the press, you see
that they receive more funding. And a lot of female
entrepreneurs lack visibility because they're focused more on
building the business and or creating the product.
Another reason is access. So with networking, what we see
is as a young man, maybe he studies said to you Delft,
there's always somebody who will and he built something.
There's always an uncle, a friend or a friend of a friend
who will say, I know somebody maybe who will be able to invest
in you, which is more difficult for women entrepreneurs.
Once they build something, then it's oh, that's cute, cute
business. Oh, it's nice, maybe some
interest on Instagram, but it's not.
That is something I don't know, but why?
But there is another click that somebody says this could become
a huge business. So access to networks, what we
see now women entrepreneurs on networking more, they go to the
next web and all these tech events.
And then is there's a third thing called access to financial
institutions. So this could be what I've heard
a lot is that when my entrepreneurs will send an
e-mail to a VC or an investor and they would not receive an
response back, that is one. But even with banks, most of the
time banks send the letter. That is well known, Sir, Mr. XY
said. It is that there's where the
bias comes in for the access to the financial institution part.
And I think it is mostly that they don't know then that also
sometimes not willing, but mostly they don't know the
potential. Women entrepreneurs have women
entrepreneurs who want to scale their business because we also
have to focus on debt group and women with a growth potential
and who want to scale their business.
But are these women then still more modest about their, their,
their business and financial projections?
Because I would expect once you have, and this is a bit of
testing my own bias, that once you have a growth mindset, once
you want to grow, you don't have that modesty or not as much
modesty, let's say. Are you asking me the question?
So yes, So that is well known based on on research that women
are more modest. They're honest as you can say
it's not modest, they're honest. And we use honesty as a modest.
We say honesty is modesty, but they're just honest in showing
the correct numbers. So and that is how, not how the
game is played. So understanding the game of how
this ecosystem works is very important for a female
entrepreneurs. I don't think it's modesty.
I think when you're an entrepreneur, you want to grow
your business. It is your yeah, you and you're
focused on your product, as I said in the beginning.
So that could be a hurdle for for female entrepreneurs.
But nowadays, I mean, all the information is on the Internet.
They have access to the events, there are tickets available for
female entrepreneurs. There's so many spaces where
they can go to to race funding. I think there's still not even
level playing field. But yeah, I think now the bias
comes in because all the instruments are available and
the information. We've sort of the access is less
of a problem is that what I'm hearing you say?
But by still is the big problem. No, access is still a problem.
As I said, there are the events where they say, for instance,
there's a women in tech, they can go to the web, some they can
go to the next web. All these events where you could
meet investors, you have all these programs, you have
Codefaay, you have all these programs.
But The thing is, the moment they send out the e-mail to meet
up, then there is no response. So yes, there's still no access
for many female entrepreneurs who want to grow their business.
And it starts with, of course, as we all know that it takes at
least a year before you race funding.
You need to have many conversations with investors.
And if you don't have many conversations, you don't learn
on how to approach them and or how to pitch your business.
So you need the access. And you need also to talk to a
lot of VCs and not just one. Not one.
Yes, you need to talk to a lot because not everybody who is an
investor is maybe a match for you.
So you need to talk to at least 20 to 40 investors to know like,
OK, this is the right partner. You know, you receive feedback,
you apply the feedback, it becomes better your pitch, you
know, So, yes. And that's.
Really a problem. Yeah.
So, Simone, how can we change that?
How can we get that second layer of access better in place?
So women can go to events but they once they send the e-mail,
they get nothing back? How can we change that?
Is that investor education that we need to do or?
I think we need to do together because I think female
entrepreneurs but also female investors, male investors need
to work Better Together to start with, I think, and that's where
Fem Start comes in, is that female entrepreneurs do need to
educate themselves to prepare for that investment talk, right?
Because I mean, I still don't understand why investors ask
female entrepreneurs how they organize things with the kids at
home and with male investor, with male entrepreneurs, they
don't because that is still the case.
But besides that, female entrepreneurs do need to educate
themselves on specific terms when it comes to investment
cases and those kind of stuff. Because I mean, I work my whole
life in finance, but this is another type of business with
another language. So everybody needs to learn when
you're a female founder and wants to get money in a second
is that, um, if male investors judge the forecasts of female
entrepreneurs that they should keep in mind that probably those
figures are based on realistic assumptions compared to the more
meal forecasts where the hockey stick effects will be a bit
higher. But we also educate the female
entrepreneurs in our course. The other side that male
entrepreneurs have the more like the heavier hockey sticks
presented. So not that we educate the
female entrepreneurs, you have to do it completely differently
according to how males do it, but they need to be a aware and
need to be educated on this specific topic to understand the
real potential upside of their business.
Yeah. And also to be able to, let's
say, prompt investors to say, hey, don't just cut 30% of my
forecast because this is actually realistic stuff.
And compared to men where investors are known to just cut
20 to 30% of the forecast right away and then see if it's works,
yes or no. Yeah.
So, So what we, I mean, what we really try to emphasize is that
they describe their assumptions as specific as possible in their
business case because that helps understanding the investor on
the other side what the business case is based on so.
Talk talk me through what you mean then How specific does does
a founder need to get? Well, that is a difficult
question because obviously every business case is different.
But I think it's important to to write down assumptions which is
handed over to the investor, like how big is the markets,
which percentage do you want to achieve?
What is your price? What is your price flexibility
when it comes to your revenue? How many people do you want to
have on the payroll? Those kind of things being very
specific helps the investor understand your business case in
a better way. And then if a female investor
decides to present her more realistic scenario, then the
investor at least understands where that business case is
based upon. So I think I think that helps
the female entrepreneur to to present a business case where
she is confident about because that confidence is important in
that meeting with the investor, right.
So, yeah. So I think that is also what we
educate a few more entrepreneurs.
Is it also a bit of a mind game then, Marion, that that you're
playing with the investor, that it's also in part there's
knowledge, of course there's being prepared for the pitch,
but there's also like mental prep that you need to do that
you're really confident when you're pitching.
Well, yeah, that applies to men and to women.
So I, I believe everybody needs to do the mental prep before.
I don't think that's a gender based thing.
The difference between men and men and women is that there is
bias when the women stand in front.
So if you're too, you know, you know your stuff, you stand
there, you could, they would think you're too cocky.
Or if you're, you know, a bit nervous, then you don't know
what you're talking about. So the prep is for everybody.
It's not just for women. But The thing is that on the
other side, there's the bias once you're not prep.
But I, I always think to, to stay true to yourself when
you're standing there and not because it's like a marriage
when you receive the funding. So if you start playing a game
or you're acting up, you will not keep up with that.
So I think I don't think women should change to receive
investment. I think they need to stay like
who they are because you have shy guys who are are pitching.
I think you should have an investor who's not biased
because once you're, you know, being an entrepreneur goes with
ebbs and flows and you cannot have an investor who is, you
know, like when you go, when they're when they're going, that
stuff that he looks at you because you're a woman that
you're not doing well. I think women should remain.
They should stay. The thing is with, and this is
not only for women, but mostly because they do not have the
networks, It's the lingo. You know the words.
If you understand what is ticked size, what is, what is precede
seed, what is, you know, Series A, series B, series C, you know,
you need to understand the lingo.
I think once you understand the lingo you communicate the
language the VCs are communicating, I think it is
easier to picture your your company.
But you should not never, never, ever change.
You know, you can grow as a as a person, but you have to build a
relationship with that investor. So yeah, if he's biased, he's
not going to change. Yeah.
And and to add to that, it's also up to the entrepreneur,
male or female, to choose if you want to add an investor to your
company, because that's also what we sometimes hear, that
investor want to have a big chunk of the equity against low
value. And then indeed, what Marian
says stay true to yourself and don't sell your company at every
cost. You know, but that that applies
to men and women to be honest, because you, you especially
early stage, you do not want to sell a lot of your company
because that also means that in series come Series A, series B,
that you have nothing to sell anymore.
Yeah. Exactly.
And at some point, it could be very difficult because
especially when you're precedes, you don't have enough money on
your bank accounts when you're really desperate.
I mean, that is, yeah, that's really difficult.
But that still is, yeah, very important to also to, if needed,
say no, Yeah. And and that's where staying
true to yourself also comes in, yes.
Yes. So no games.
No, so, so go. But going back to Dubai, I said
because, so there's a lot, I hate to say this, but there's a
lot that can be fixed about women.
But there's one big thing that needs to be fixed on the male
side of the equation, on the investor side, which is the bias
part. How?
How can we go about that? I don't, I don't believe we
should fix women. I think we should educate, which
is, you know, when you are changing careers and you don't
know a lot about the subject, you should educate, which is
like if especially you're starting a business, it's like a
career change. You should educate yourself on
the subject and not just start as women are educating
themselves how to raise funding because this is the one of the
fastest growing groups within the ecosystem.
I think investors should educate themselves too because this is a
group that is growing within the ecosystem.
They cannot ignore it anymore. So I don't believe in fixing,
educating. Too, But how do we educate the
the the investors then instead? Because that doesn't isn't just
one bias training session I would think.
No I don't I 1. I don't believe in bias training
sessions but. Why not?
Because scientifically it's proven that it doesn't work.
So what? But I'm not going into that.
But I just received the presentation on that, that it
does not work and it only shows the bias, but it doesn't change
the behaviour. I think once the group is now,
for now, especially in the Netherlands, you could see 37%
of women with a Chamber of Commerce number, the group is
growing. Once the groups becomes 6040 and
you have like say 20% of these women want to grow their
business because not all of them want to grow, just some just
want to have a business, then you'll see a bigger change.
So the only way that it will change, I don't think that
people will be able to change. The system itself will change
because the group will become so large that they cannot ignore
them. Not every entrepreneur needs
funding to grow, but once there will be more women entrepreneurs
with large businesses, they cannot, you know, then the
perception changes and then I think that is the only way from
in my opinion, it's not scientifically proven, but I
don't think vice training events and all these things will change
it because it's not a male female thing.
It's a masculine way of thinking because science proves also that
female investors are all very also very conservative.
So it's not have more female investors.
I know some of them will invest in women, but it is
scientifically proven that it doesn't change.
Okay, so yes, that's. Proven so, yeah.
No, no, no, I believe you. But it's.
It's, I think that should be more, more.
It's like the workforce. No, Before there were not many
women working 100 years ago. And because there are more women
working, it became more equal. There's still no, there's still
a big gap, but there are more women working, there are more
women who become managers. And it will take time because,
yeah, it's ingrained in the system.
But when I'm hearing you say it will sort of, at least in part,
take care of itself. Let's hope so.
OK, so you've talked to a lot of investors yourself, I suppose.
What's 1 myth that you're tired of hearing about female
founders, Maria? That they we've discussed this
beforehand because I see many myths.
Not for me the myth is the the babies.
But Simone says we should take a brother.
But I, I think what they see, especially when it's a young
female entrepreneur with a startup, they're all worried
about when they have a baby, will they still be, you know,
this hungry for the business. And I believe that women who
want to grow their business, it doesn't matter if they have a
baby or not, They will be the same.
They will not change unless they become ill.
But that could happen to men also.
Yeah, we also discussed this and as Simona had another point, but
maybe you can share your point. Yeah, Yeah.
Well, I think, I think it's broader.
So not only female entrepreneurs, but also female
in business that it's important to focus on the person itself
and the characteristics instead of she's the female.
So she will take care of the households and the kids.
And from my perspective, I also hope to be a role model myself
for women in business, but also for female entrepreneurs, that
it is possible to at some point become a CFO or a entrepreneur
while raising 3 kids who are now 1416 and 18.
And that it goes hand in hand with a balance between work and
private, which is, which is good.
But I, I think it's important that you need environments also
for the support in a positive way instead of how are you going
to organize it with the kids and asking that question, right?
I mean, I think it's very important to to be treated equal
from that perspective. So to, to also, I either ask men
the same question on how, how do you, do you have kids?
Do you plan to have kids? How is this?
How do you want to organize this with your partner together?
Because I think it's it's important also that this becomes
a shared responsibility. Definitely.
Not just because otherwise we risk perpetuating the bias that
women will take care of of the kids.
Yeah. So having that said, I think
yeah indeed it's it's a broader discussion where for example,
hey, you, you in the Netherlands now you have the law with a
percentage on boards of of females etcetera.
I question if getting laws in place, I mean it, it might help
but in the end we all need to do together.
Do you think quota will help? Well, I still think that's a
difficult question to ask because I think that diversity
imports is very important, but that not only relates to gender.
So that's one. And second, I still think that
you have to choose for the best fit slash quality in a certain
role, but that is difficult to judge if you only look at
gender, if you understand what I mean.
So for the company itself, a diverse board is very important.
But at some point, if a board is already there with a certain
with a certain setting and you need to add an extra person, why
couldn't it be the a meal? It's more about capabilities,
but my point there is always that if you look at the best
person or the best fit, that is really looked through a biased
gender lens. So if a woman is a fit and this
there there's, I'm reading a book about the 40 cap right now.
It's until they get to the top, they are sort of seen as less
capable. Once they get to the top level,
it sort of equalizes, especially if they you have a woman become
ACEO, then it's sort of because then she has the title.
So then you know, all else equal almost.
But until that time, there are still a lot of bias where in
place, where, where. And this is also why I
continuously sort of pitch a bit on the on the on the bias card,
let's say of the of the tech. There's still a lot of bias that
prevents women from being seen as the best fit.
Yeah, but also that if, if a female's asked to do promotion,
then she thinks about it and then she needs to make sure that
she's capable for 200% whilst male just says yes, right.
So that's also, I think from that perspective, you need to
have the environment there to make sure that also for women in
business or entrepreneurs are able to flourish and are able to
or that they feel that they can make the next step.
Yeah, yeah, true. So, so Maria and I want to just
switch back to you for a minute because the FEM start is, is
important education platform. Are there any things that you
think should be taught at school instead of having FEM Start
teach women entrepreneurs? So Femstart is an education
platform, it's an ad tech platform 1st and I've worked in
education for eight years. I know the University of Applied
Sciences in Amsterdam has an entrepreneurship program and
more than 50% of the of the school consists of women.
I don't think there's an issue there.
What we are focusing on is how to raise funding, which is a
different from being an entrepreneur.
You can be an entrepreneur, but you don't not need or want to
raise funding. So what we're focusing is on is
the gap and I think they could create a minor for that program.
We have to be honest and and this is not a large group.
And when you start a school adverts in education, you look
at and we would say the Tom sum sum of education and and is it,
are there enough students who will apply for this program?
As I said before, you have 800,000, you have 37% of the
entrepreneurs are women. They have a KAFI car number, but
that doesn't mean that all of them want to grow their
business. So we are just focusing on the
ones that want to grow their business, which is not a very
large group in the Netherlands. And we have to be honest about
it, how large the group is. I hope June 13th Code of Faith
will give us the answer, but if they do not have the answer, we
still will not know. We only know that there are
800,000 women who have a Chamber of Commerce in America.
So there's a group that wants to grow the business and there's a
group who doesn't know that they need to grow their business.
Yeah, I think it, it is a small program of the university, but I
do not think that every school, I don't know.
But if, if we take it a bit broader, hey, if we look at it,
not only the funding part, but more the entrepreneurship part,
also a quote, UN quote, selling yourself or pitching yourself,
which you have to do either way, even if you don't want to grow,
you still have to sell your product at some in some way,
shape or form, right? Is that something that we also
should start teaching women how to do?
But they're already teaching that, but they teaching it in
the entrepreneurship program, which is different from from
fundraising, which is they teaching them of course how to
pitch. But what we are focusing on is
access to networks, access to financial institutions, those
topics, you know that they teach them how to build a business.
But the access to networks and access to institutions, that's
something I don't know if they teach it, I don't think so.
Now what I'm was trying to point out is if you look at the
entrepreneurship curriculum, that already reaches a small
subset of the students who are interested in that.
I was looking at a state one stage, sorry, one stage earlier.
So really in high school or maybe and really start earlier,
because I think most of how I understand this to work is that
most of the traits that you have as a person you get in the first
seven years or so of your life. Most of the the capabilities are
instilled at that point. So if you're not, you don't ever
have anyone around you who's an entrepreneur, Chances of you
becoming an entrepreneur are still to none.
The same applies also to dealing, dealing with situations
where you have to sell yourself. If you are not in a position
where you have to, let's say, yeah, maybe sell yourself.
I I've had so many small children at my door over the
past few weeks trying to sell me something, which is a lot of
fun, but it's it's a small they are children of entrepreneurs
because I always ask, is your father or mother an
entrepreneur? Yeah, yeah, My, my father has a
business this so I. I I think Mbo, I don't know how
you say it's vocational. Studies, yeah.
Vocational studies, yeah. They have entrepreneurship
programs, They have it. So it's already being taught.
It's different than 10 years ago, but I know that most
educational studies have entrepreneurial program.
OK. So it's getting pushed to
earlier stages of education. For sure, sure.
Yeah. So I was wondering with
Femstart, you're organizing, you're an ad tech platform.
What kind of entrepreneurs are you most excited to have there
except that they want to grow their business?
Do you focus on specific sectors?
Do you know I see a no. No, no, I think every female
entrepreneur who is willing to get education on how to grow
their business is very welcome. So, so no specific branches, no
specific. Well, we have two, two types of
programs actually. We have the growth program and
that is for the female entrepreneurs who are probably
still in the precede stage. And we have the next level
training where female entrepreneurs already have
revenue and and that is the second program.
But all the female entrepreneurs doesn't matter which brands are
more than welcome to join. Except that it needs to be sort
of early stage, or let's say not not late stage.
So series B probably would be, but then.
Correct, because it really relates to education on how
Marion says it, the lingo, what you can expect in raising money
for your business. Cool.
I wanted to move a bit to your personal experience, how it's
shaped your journey. So Marion, you worked in in
innovation and leadership. How does that help you build Fem
Start? I think my educational
background helps with understanding on how people
learn because I worked in education for many years.
That is 1. I think I'm an entrepreneur
since 2012. I know it goes in absent flows.
It never is never like a straight line.
So perseverance is important as an entrepreneur because the
moment you think you're completely down, it goes up
again. And I don't know, it's something
miraculous about being an entrepreneur and I cannot
explain it, but that helps also to understand entrepreneurs.
Honestly, I must say I have not encountered a lot of bias
raising funding, maybe because I had like in Dutch, they would
say bought from a cop. When I would go for funding, I
would just ask. But also, of course, like really
struggling with a, with my business.
I in the beginning, I, I really struggled.
So I understand the hardship of being an believe in in making
something out of it and also constantly pivoting.
So that is the innovative part. The leadership part is the many
management positions I had which not do not come to play as with
the with the entrepreneurs, but mostly with stakeholder
management because we have a lot of stakeholders also now because
you also have AB to B platform. Yeah.
So it is so many things come to play when you're an
entrepreneur. And that's why I encourage young
people who immediately want to become an entrepreneur first to
get a job. Unless you're like a talent
talented entrepreneur and you have a family who can support
you. It is very good to have a
regular job first, to know how it works, the system to be
organized, to be disciplined to. Yeah, to report to, to know how
to work with colleagues. Yeah, that that helps.
So also to see a job. As as sort of education prep
education for entrepreneurship, then yeah, well, education.
Prep. It is a prep before.
I believe that. I think if you look at
successful entrepreneurs, you have a few.
Talents. Like the guy from Apple, but
most had a job before they started, you know, and they
started with their colleagues or with friends.
But it is it it helps it helps to just understand how to do the
job. So, Simone, you.
You have a background in finance also.
Did you also handle investors? Not per SE, but obviously.
As a controller slash CFO, you do handle stakeholders in the
broadest sense. So from that perspective, yes.
But I think the investor language is completely different
to regular finance, which also explained to you before.
So that was partly new for me, but I mean, the basics in
finance need to be that's what we also educate your basics in
finance need to be on par before an investor joins.
So from that perspective, that helps me in educating the female
entrepreneurs. Not that we have a training for
financial household of your company, but we do explain a few
things which you need to have in place and also like making sure
that you do your tax returns in time, those kind of stuff.
I mean, it's if you have a backlog in that, I mean, you
don't want to know at some point you could have big issues.
You just, I mean and that's not necessary.
So just make sure that your finances and your bookkeeping is
is up and running that there is a difference between P&L and
cash flow and because that is still difficult to understand,
but that's where she will say cash is king.
I mean if you don't have any money on your bank account and
you're and you're lost, but it's different.
I mean you can make a profit but don't have the money in your
bank yet. So, so those kind of kind of
things. And obviously when female
founders have questions about making forecast plus I can high
level help them out and give them some pointers.
So yeah, that's from my perspective.
I think what helps does do you think a founder.
Needs to know his or her finances by heart, yes.
Yes, I do. I do think and then specific on
the main KPIs, because the founder knows his or her
business the best. I mean, I believe that that he
or she should know, know the business case by heart because
if if he or she doesn't know it, then what should an investor do
with it, right. So, yeah, because I also think
if you know the heart, they also know the possibilities in your
business case. And do you then you know where
to turn the the dials to make things better or different or
quicker or slower or whatever? Yeah.
So I'm. Definitely confused.
By that. OK, Mario, how about you?
Of course, that is the first. Mistake I made that I didn't
know my finances, my heart. And now I know.
Like every penny I spent. So yeah.
But I I can know. Every penny I spend and still
have no overview of of the picture as well and.
Have the overview. I have the overview.
I know like even with the bookkeeper, he would send
something and I would send something back.
I know even the laws. So, yeah, I, I, I take a deep
dive in everything, even the tax laws, the things that are
changing because, yeah, once you are burned once, then you learn,
you know, and because when you're an entrepreneur, you're
so focused on building the business and, and, and, and
making money, but you're not focused on handling the
finances. And it is important to know how
to handle your finances and your taxes also to be able to.
Outshort it to a bookkeeper, yes.
Yeah. When you're outsources.
You need to know what he's doing.
You need to read what he's doing.
You know, he's also a human being or she, they can make
mistakes. But not even, I think it's just
not finances. It's also the legal part of your
business. You know that it's set up right,
You know, legally. So I want to move a bit.
To words to future fam start, if I remember correctly from the
start, Marion, you wanted to build a want to build a global
platform that's say it's 10 years from now you have that
global platform. So it's not just the Netherlands
or Europe, but it's really everywhere.
What is the one thing step that has taken you there?
What has changed, I think, for us?
The challenge is how can we scale up the technical part of
our platform. So that is once we take that
hurdle, I think you can go global, which is also a hurdle
for every tech entrepreneur. So does it work in the
Netherlands and then tested in other countries?
Yeah. So I think the first hurdle is
the tech part of the platform to to Caleb find the right product
market fits for that and then go global.
But that is the Holy Grail of entrepreneurship.
Yeah, yeah. So, Simone, I see you smile.
Yeah, that is because Marion says that's.
The Holy Grail of entrepreneurship.
If we go now and then, everything will be easy, right?
But what what needs to happen in?
Your view to to go global except for the technical, the yeah, the
technical capabilities. Are there any other things?
No, I think Marion. Just said I think product market
fits in other countries. That is the next step.
Look the the the IT works. If you look at our LinkedIn, you
see women are raising funding, You see the results.
It's not. We're not lying.
No, it is. The impact is there and the
thing. Is who are these?
Women different, right? So yes, who are these women with
growth potential? Because it's different from who
are The Who are female entrepreneurs.
If you create an entrepreneurship program, you
can reach all the 800,000 women in the Netherlands.
You say that's your market, but who are these women who want to
grow their business and who want to raise funding finding in a in
a different? Setting in a different culture
and a different language, yes. So you.
Briefly entered on. On results, Marion, can you name
one female founder that you're particularly proud of who raised
who managed to raise funding, proud of all the.
Women, you know, it is not easy to raise funding.
It is not easy and it means somebody needs to trust in you.
We have the women who we kick started, we give them a kick
start through the startup awards who raised funding in millions
and 1,000,002 million, 3 million.
And we have the woman who raised funding through our program
200,000. Now we're hearing 500,000 but
also 17 have 50,000. So it's every amount that help
bridge the funding gap that is important.
I cannot say one woman no, because all of them are are
heroes for me. It is not easy.
It's not easy for men and so it's not easy for women.
No, that that is true. But.
OK. Are you, are you proud of
specific collaborations you've helped accomplish, for instance,
the Fem start awards that you organize or that her capital
connection? Yeah, well, I think we are proud
of. All our partners, so our first
partner was KPMG Maybach, which is really great.
So when it comes to Texas that the female entrepreneurs have a
low entrance to a very big firm with a lot of knowledge, but
they can really be global from the starts.
Sorry, also global. Yes, also.
Global, so that is great. The other one important partner
we wanted to add to our to our Fem Starts community is legal.
So we are proud of AO Sherman and to be our partner.
That is what we have seen developing and what we are in
favour of that Fem Start is part of an ecosystem which needs to
change, right. So from that perspective, we are
proud of her capital connection that different partners in that
ecosystem work together to create awareness to give the
female founders a platform where also investors are part of it.
So we keep on saying Fem Start is the educational platform in
that ecosystem. And if every, if every
organization plays her or his role in a good way, we can close
that funding gap. Yeah.
Is that also? A bit of the I was looking for
the right word here, but also knowing your role.
That you're part of an ecosystem.
And you solve this particular problem in your, in your case,
it's educational female founders who get to understand how to
pitch their start up to an investor and what to be mindful
of in terms of being a founder. Is that also part of the
strength of fem start? That you only focus on this part
and that you outsource all the other work, that you collaborate
for all the other parts that are needed, like bookkeeping, like
tax advise, like ego advise, that you just you don't build
the whole thing yourself. No, because I think from that.
Perspective tax is very complicated specialism legal as
well. So yeah.
So I think that is really that is a really conscious decision
that we don't try to do that what other people can do way
better because they had a lot of education before and already
built brands globally. So, yeah, that is, I think
that's a conscious decision and that's something extra which we
give to that female entrepreneurs where and then we
go back to when we where we started is that female
entrepreneurs do lack networking on different topics.
And so also on taxes, also on legal.
So we give them access also to those networks.
So you provide the access. But then they have to act
themselves. In getting.
The right advice? On the topics, they have cool
sounds. Like a great place to move to my
last question. So I'm on a mission to make
inclusion in tech 2 new normal by the end of 2032 on What would
be your advice to me? What what what both action
should I take or should men in general take to get there?
I think, but how? Do you want like what do you
mean by that? Because then then I can answer
your question correctly. So inclusion in tech to.
Really make it applicable to funding is that I want to
achieve a state where funding of mixed teams is to norm by the
end of 2032. So if you have I always forget
what the English word is, but in Dutch it's a normal for daily.
So you have 80% in the middle, 80% is funded, funding goes.
To mixed teams. Because then you have the
inclusion, the diversity that you need on boards or on
startups and you get better products as a result.
So that's and then there are 10% women and there are 10% men
because they are really good, just really good at what they
do, which by the way, I think the 10% and still was a big, a
lot bigger percentage than we have now.
Well, I think once for the. Successful entrepreneurs is not
just only by good what they do, it's also how they know how to
play the game. So you have an ecosystem and
there are many players in that ecosystem.
You have the government who plays a role.
So if you want to change that, then you have to start lobbying
and key players who can help you with that at the Ministry of
Economic Affairs. Then you have the feces who are
the ones that are investing in entrepreneurs.
So that is also a lobby because I don't, I think, I think you
position yourself for me. It's just not clear what your
role would be. But what I hear is you're
positioning yourself as a evangelist lobbyist.
So I think there is where you need to lobby.
It's the, the, the, the Ministry of Economic Affairs, the
government, because they have the instruments, they are able
to change this system. They have the money to do that.
If they can invest so much money in Invest NL, they can invest so
much money in creating even ecosystem.
So that is where and then once, you know, once the government
creates the instruments, the feces and the England fest and
everybody will follow because they are the only ones in the
Netherlands who will be able and has the the money to do that,
the capital to do that. I don't think if you want this
is 7 years, but it's a lot of lobbying.
I think the communication towards women entrepreneurs,
it's been, you know, of course it should be, but that is also
where the government can play a role in.
It's just like how they play the role in less smoking or you
know, so this is a crisis because so many women, there are
so many women entrepreneurs and more are coming and there are
not making a lot of money. So it's going and they know will
not have a pension in in 20 to 30 years and it's a crisis.
So yeah, I think that is the sense of urgency needs to be
communicated and lobbied. So if you could play a role in
that, that'll be great. I'm more than happy to.
But. Thanks for sharing, Simona.
Nothing to add to this, Dan. Thanks.
Very much for an. Amazing conversation.
Simona and Mariam really enjoyed this.
I hope you did too. Thank you if people that.
Would like to learn. More about femstart or connect
with you? Where would you like to send
them? WWW dot.
Famstart.com anditsalready.com. Yes, yes dot NL.
It's dot dot dot dot everywhere. OK, cool.
So. Famstar.com. famstar.com Yes.
Where can they connect? With you.
Personally on LinkedIn. LinkedIn, of course.
Cool. And we'll include.
Those things in the show notes. So Simona von Baiserfeld, Marian
Speer, thank you very much for an amazing conversation.
This nurse, thank you very much for listening.
And until the next episode, keep being awesome.
Well, that's a wrap for episode 110 of Women Disrupting Tech
with Marian Speer and Simona von Baiserfeld on how Femstart helps
female founders get funded. Marion, Simona, and I hope that
you found this conversation as inspiring and educational as we
intended it to be. And if you have any questions
for Marion or Simona or maybe for me, please leave them in the
comments on Spotify, Apple or YouTube.
I do read all the comments and I will make sure they get
answered. If you'd like to learn more
about Marion, Speer, Simona, von Baisdefeld and Femstart, please
check out the links in the show notes.
And as usual, you can find show notes at Women Disrupting Tech
dot blog. The link is also in the
description. If you've enjoyed this episode,
please consider leaving a rating or a review on Apple or Spotify.
If you leave a rating or a review, this helps new listeners
find the podcast and it supports my guest by giving them a bigger
platform. If you are a regular listener,
please make sure to follow Women Disrupting Tech on Spotify,
Apple, Amazon and or YouTube. Following Women Disrupting Tech
is a simple 0 cost way to support Marion, Simona and my
older guests in closing the funding gap by the end of 2032.
For more about Women Disrupting Tech, please follow the podcast
on social media, on LinkedIn, we're at the True Story Company
and on Instagram, YouTube and Sub Stack.
We're at Women Disrupting Tech on sub stack.
You can also find in depth stories in behind the scenes
insights from each of the episodes.
Plus I share trends that I've spotted across 100 plus
conversations so far. So don't forget to subscribe to
my sub stack for more about women disrupting tech.
Finally, if you want to connect with me directly, please reach
out via e-mail. Dear John at Women Disrupting
Tech dot blog or connect on LinkedIn.
On LinkedIn, simply search for my name and you'll find me.
With that, I wish you a wonderful day.
I hope to see you in the next episode and until then, keep
being awesome.