1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,240 Hello and welcome to Tracks of Our Quiz. 2 00:00:11,640 --> 00:00:14,200 If you're a longtime listener, you know the drill. 3 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:17,440 But if you're new here, each episode of this podcast sits 4 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:21,160 down with a different queer person that I find fascinating 5 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:24,240 as we discussed just some of the music which is soundtracked, 6 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:28,040 shaped or informed their life. This guest is someone I have 7 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:32,000 followed for quite some time, which comes with the beauty and 8 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:36,760 pleasure of watching someone grow, evolve and play with all 9 00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:40,760 the colours in the crayon box. I first followed them as at 10 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:41,840 Baby. DILF. 11 00:00:42,040 --> 00:00:44,680 Which, by the way, is still their Instagram handle in case 12 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:47,960 you're not following. Or as Emil Kunita, the 13 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:51,800 entrancing artist behind beautiful love poems scrawled on 14 00:00:51,800 --> 00:00:56,280 the Polaroids of their lovers. A technique I assumed was in 15 00:00:56,280 --> 00:00:59,440 tribute to another Tracks of Our Queers interviewee William 16 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:03,280 Young, about who we actually have a beautiful side chat in 17 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:06,600 this episode. But you would know this artist 18 00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:11,320 today as Malaya Bayanihan pronouns he, she or they. 19 00:01:11,720 --> 00:01:16,800 Malaya is, in their words, first and foremost a lover, then a 20 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:20,720 shapeshifter who has represented herself as a microphone, a 21 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:23,840 camera and a pen. Born in the Philippines before 22 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:27,160 moving to Australia in their teens, they work tirelessly as 23 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:31,360 an advocate for those living with HIV, while their art both 24 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:34,880 pays tribute to those we've lost to AIDS and imagines a brighter, 25 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:38,240 queerer utopia. Her work acknowledges the men 26 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:41,560 she's come to love through sex work, the person they are in a 27 00:01:41,560 --> 00:01:44,840 constant state of becoming, and the queer community he works 28 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:48,400 with each and every day of the. They are a walking, breathing 29 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:51,320 queer dream. And they're your guest for this 30 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:55,040 Tracks of Our Queers episode. Spoiler alert, Spectacular 31 00:01:55,040 --> 00:01:57,920 musical choices. Fancy buying me a coffee? 32 00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:00,920 Because perhaps you loved the last episode you heard, or maybe 33 00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:03,840 you even loved this one. Well, luckily there's a link for 34 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:07,480 just that in the show notes and every penny I can guarantee goes 35 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:11,320 to the costs associated with this fab little venture over to 36 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:19,760 Malia. Hey Malaya Bayanihan, welcome to 37 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:21,280 Tracks of our Queers. Hello. 38 00:02:21,280 --> 00:02:23,240 Hello. Well, first of all, it would be 39 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:25,360 great to hear where you were born. 40 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:31,080 And then really, what are those first musical memories you can 41 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:35,000 picture in your brain when you go back to your earliest years? 42 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:39,560 I grew up in Luog City, which is otherwise known as the Sun 43 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:41,240 Sunshine City in the Philippines. 44 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:45,120 We're up north, so like right at the tip of the Philippines. 45 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:47,520 And very often people would joke like, oh, you could hear the 46 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,080 Roosters in Taiwan because we're that close to it. 47 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:53,960 When it came to music, I was kind of surrounded by it because 48 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:58,400 my mom is a professional singer. She sang at me a lot. 49 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:01,160 I remember I, I don't know, it's like if this is a false memory, 50 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:04,480 but I just remembered her singing to me whenever I was 51 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:08,040 crying as a kid. And then, you know, so there was 52 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:12,080 this, this, this kind of thing that I'm so spoiled by sound 53 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:13,880 because my mom knows how to sing. 54 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:16,880 And in a lot of ways, it's because it's Filipino, quite 55 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:19,000 stereotypically. Like a lot of people in my 56 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:23,040 family know how to sing. There's karaoke everywhere. 57 00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:28,200 Like, sound is just such a a generous, generous part of 58 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:32,400 Filipino culture. So I grew up with with sound. 59 00:03:32,880 --> 00:03:36,840 Yeah. In this little fishing village 60 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:40,400 up north in the Philippines. Tell me about how and when you 61 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:41,240 moved to Australia. You. 62 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:46,920 Moved to this massive continent when I was in rate 1011 towards 63 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:51,880 the start of it, I was about 16 because my mom and her husband 64 00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:55,640 was living in Hong Kong and my mom was a singer there mostly. 65 00:03:56,240 --> 00:03:59,360 And because they were just conscious of that, I was getting 66 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:02,720 to a point where I'm turning 18 and they wanted to give me a 67 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:05,440 better future. So we all decided to migrate 68 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:08,160 because my mom's husband is in a Cheyenne. 69 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:10,840 So we ended up moving to Bris Vegas. 70 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:17,480 Specifically, we moved to Kwanda, Moca country up in 71 00:04:17,480 --> 00:04:21,279 Cleveland, like Redland Bay. So it's basically southeast from 72 00:04:21,279 --> 00:04:24,640 Brisbane. And you know, as someone who's 73 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:27,240 never really heard much about a Cheyenne cultures aside from the 74 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:32,560 beach, you know, the hot Aussie boys that go surfing Kangaroos, 75 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:35,640 you've never really heard about the term bogan before. 76 00:04:36,760 --> 00:04:40,840 So in a lot of ways, it was a massive culture shock for me 77 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:47,640 because here I was an hour and a half away from the city and 78 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:51,960 mostly surrounded by white people, you know, So it was a 79 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:54,200 real introduction. I think it was a really, really 80 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:57,320 good introduction to what is a triad. 81 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:01,680 Triad, you know, as the general kind of Australian would know 82 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:04,640 about this country. The facts that stands out for me 83 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:08,400 there is your age, you know, to be 16 and go through such an 84 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:12,520 upheaval is 16 is a very formative age. 85 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:15,840 There's so much change going on anyway and generally I ask these 86 00:05:15,840 --> 00:05:18,880 questions because I'm curious to know what you were listening to 87 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:22,840 at these periods of your life. Help me understand what role 88 00:05:22,840 --> 00:05:26,960 music was playing as you kind of made a new home in Australia. 89 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:31,880 This was around the emo era, but I was very much a poppy emo. 90 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:35,600 Like I was one of those Asian kids with the bangs, you know, 91 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:39,320 and a guy line in it. I was very much into Paramore, 92 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:58,400 very much into Fall Out Boy. Panic at the Disco, like real 93 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:02,560 pop emo vibes and in a lot of ways it was really help for me 94 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,040 looking back at it now during the process what I was going 95 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:07,160 through, like you said, I was 16. 96 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:09,160 We move in the middle of bum fuck nowhere. 97 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:12,840 We were one of the only two Filipino families in this small 98 00:06:12,840 --> 00:06:14,960 town. And during this time, I found 99 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:18,680 out that my mom's husband, which is why I call her my mom's 100 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:23,440 husband, is because he was quite a queer phobic person and quite 101 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:27,680 racist. So I felt really trapped at that 102 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,160 particular point in my life. And it was hard. 103 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:33,320 It was really hard. It was definitely one of the 104 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:37,600 hardest moments of my life because I felt so isolated and 105 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:40,800 alone and in the middle of somewhere where I didn't know 106 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:44,000 anyone or even really knew how the system work. 107 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:48,000 And I just remember during this period, going through high 108 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:52,640 school, I saw this guidance counsellor because they meet you 109 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:56,400 and you enrol in and she's like, oh, this you must be having a 110 00:06:56,400 --> 00:07:01,280 really hard time. When Fisher first saw me and she 111 00:07:01,280 --> 00:07:04,200 kind of knew about what was going on about me moving here at 112 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:09,520 this age. And her acknowledging that was 113 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:14,080 actually the thing that saved my life because I was so depressed 114 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:20,440 living there that one day I just ended up coming up to her office 115 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:24,160 after contemplating ending my life because it was so hard. 116 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:27,520 And just crying in front of her about how difficult it was and 117 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:31,240 how isolating it was when for most of that year, for my year 118 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:34,040 12, I was mostly spending days at the guidelines counsellor. 119 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:37,240 And no one knows that no one knew because they were like, oh, 120 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:38,880 we'd love to talk to your parents about this. 121 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:41,600 And I'm like, you can't. Like I'm dealing with a man with 122 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:43,800 an emotional maturity of a 2 year old. 123 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:48,920 And my mom was too busy trying to kind of put up this perfect 124 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:50,480 life fantasy, you know what I mean? 125 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:53,440 Because I guess, yeah, I would come from a generation of people 126 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:56,640 and a culture where those things you don't really let other 127 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:58,320 people know. It really brought me up a lot 128 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:01,720 and taught me how to communicate how I feel from a very early age 129 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:06,840 and knew that being able to express myself emotionally was 130 00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:09,720 in a lot of ways a tool to save myself. 131 00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:11,720 And it's something I still used to this day. 132 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:13,280 So it was really quite formative. 133 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:18,040 But yeah, it was rough. It's wonderful knowing that 134 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:23,720 there are adults out there who aren't necessarily teachers or 135 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:29,400 kind of like there are these people out there who a lot of 136 00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:34,720 the time kids can't access them. But every now and then some kids 137 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:38,960 will be lucky enough to access people who can give them support 138 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:43,280 and guidance and a safe space when they don't necessarily get 139 00:08:43,280 --> 00:08:45,480 that at home. And we know that's important all 140 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:49,360 around the world for all sorts of kids, and it's so often not 141 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:52,160 available. Malaya, in my kind of research 142 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:55,160 and thinking I've been doing about this conversation, this 143 00:08:55,160 --> 00:08:57,600 word has come up over and over again. 144 00:08:57,680 --> 00:08:59,840 I know we'll be talking about it in at least one of your 145 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:03,080 selections, but I think the word of this conversation is going to 146 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:07,640 be freedom. And so my next question for you 147 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:09,640 from that chat about the guidance counsellor is going to 148 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:14,840 be how did you find your freedom at that age? 149 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:18,360 Like what did you do from like 161718 onwards? 150 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:22,360 So how did you navigate those next few years to start carving 151 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:25,640 out your own path? Well, I left home, Yeah. 152 00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:28,360 Like, it was hard, but my mom understood why. 153 00:09:28,360 --> 00:09:31,120 And, you know, it was hard because I was practically kicked 154 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:33,480 out of home because he just wasn't fitting in. 155 00:09:34,200 --> 00:09:37,720 I ended up living with a couple of sex workers at that time who 156 00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:41,360 taught me how to do the tricks, you know, and really taught me a 157 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:45,200 lot about life and survival. But the first few years of that, 158 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:52,440 it was very much just surviving. And so much of I think about 159 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:54,720 this a lot when we were talking to William Young's interview, 160 00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:57,960 and it's so easy to look at the past with this roasted glasses. 161 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:02,160 And in a lot of ways, I do look at them with these glasses 162 00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:07,640 because it's taught me a lot of how much I can be resilient with 163 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:13,280 and how I can survive and what my body is capable of going 164 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:17,600 through, Even at times when I was a pretty dumb bitch, you 165 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:19,840 know what I mean? Like, I was just trying to make 166 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:25,280 it work and she managed. So I'm like, OK, great, now I 167 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:27,920 should be all fine then, you know, whatever happens. 168 00:10:28,640 --> 00:10:31,320 Now everything's fine. Everything looks good now. 169 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:34,040 I wish. You were teaching yourself how 170 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:36,920 to live, how to survive, how to be in the world. 171 00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:40,960 And it's one of those many queer superpowers. 172 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:45,200 I believe that we're thrown into these situations where we 173 00:10:45,560 --> 00:10:48,880 generally have to learn a lot of these skills a lot quicker. 174 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:54,080 That roast into glasses thing. I think that the human ability 175 00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:57,440 to look at things with rose tinted glasses is actually like 176 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:01,160 a protective mechanism because, you know, we just simply cannot 177 00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:04,360 dwell in the darkness of our past forever or we just wouldn't 178 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:06,600 get out of bed. So I think it's like the brains 179 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:11,960 ability to kind of sift philtre through the crappy stuff and 180 00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:14,040 like surface the really special stuff. 181 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,280 I think so. Sentimentality and having a bit 182 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:21,800 of a romantic view of history helps because it kind of makes 183 00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:26,400 you feel optimistic in a way or makes you feel resilient. 184 00:11:26,400 --> 00:11:28,080 I mean, it has its own dangerous, right? 185 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:31,080 Like I remember whenever I see people be like, oh, why can it 186 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:33,920 be back to the 1920s? And I'm like, yeah, they saw as 187 00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:35,960 a savages back then. You know, I mean, like, I see 188 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:39,440 this a lot when it comes to queer recallings of the past and 189 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:44,480 like, oh, look at them pre pre AIDS, you know, and now like 190 00:11:44,640 --> 00:11:46,440 reading through a lot of history, they're like, well, 191 00:11:46,600 --> 00:11:50,120 what we actually see now, like the same kind of like white 192 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:53,960 centric aesthetic and funny of masculinity. 193 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:56,760 And what it does was very much what's happening back then. 194 00:11:57,160 --> 00:11:59,800 I think it's also very good to be very careful about how you 195 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:02,040 put on those glasses. I do remember this really great 196 00:12:02,040 --> 00:12:04,000 meme that I read and they're like it's hard to look at red 197 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,440 flags when you have roast into the glasses on because all you 198 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:08,280 see are flags. Preach. 199 00:12:08,560 --> 00:12:11,480 I see you as a very romantic person. 200 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:15,320 I've followed you online for a few years now so I've probably 201 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:20,280 seen 1000 of your stories and you live in my opinion a 202 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:22,480 romantic life. You know you're talking to me 203 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:24,920 now from this beautifully decorated apt. 204 00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:27,240 I felt like I went on this whole journey with you where I was 205 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:31,360 watching you like interior design your space and like the 206 00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:34,600 romance of course shows up in your art. 207 00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:37,360 Like I remember what from from when I first encountered your 208 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:40,440 series of Polaroids which I'd love to ask you about more on 209 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:42,560 now. I love the very William Young 210 00:12:42,560 --> 00:12:46,200 esque notion of writing on the Polaroids. 211 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:49,800 Are your reflections of lovers that you've had and those first 212 00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:53,960 initial feelings when you read your writings is of romance and 213 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:58,520 whimsy and intimacy. And so tell me about that. 214 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,600 Would you mind sharing how you began that practise of taking 215 00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:04,400 those Polaroids and then sharing them with the world? 216 00:13:04,840 --> 00:13:07,040 Like you said, they're William Young ass. 217 00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:12,440 Because in a lot of ways, when I was young, this was when I was 218 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:17,200 18, that's when I first saw my first William Young. 219 00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:23,080 And I think the work was Andy. And it was this guy who was deaf 220 00:13:23,080 --> 00:13:27,760 that he picked up in a club. And it was a photo of him in the 221 00:13:27,760 --> 00:13:31,280 back of his hair. It was a tight, tight perm 222 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:33,320 facing. And it was talking about like, 223 00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:35,400 you know, how he took this guy home. 224 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:41,800 And I just remembered I'm like, Oh, my God, an Asian queer man 225 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:50,720 being sexually open in 1975. Like, I really love this quote 226 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:53,120 that I read, I think a couple of years ago. 227 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:58,880 And the quote said, you know, what artists do for each and 228 00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:02,080 every one of us is to give you permission. 229 00:14:03,040 --> 00:14:07,160 And in a lot of ways, I see seeing William Young when I was 230 00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:13,680 18 was giving me a permission to embrace my sexuality, embrace my 231 00:14:13,680 --> 00:14:17,760 earnestness and be able to reflect that was someone who is 232 00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:21,040 living with HIV. I've been living with it and 233 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:25,960 undetectable now for almost half my life for about 12 years now. 234 00:14:25,960 --> 00:14:28,800 And I'm alive today because of my elders. 235 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:31,880 I'm alive today because of the advocacy that people like 236 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:34,680 William Young has done during this generation. 237 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:41,600 And so a lot of my work is really about quoting the 238 00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:46,760 political concepts that I play with and use in my work often 239 00:14:46,760 --> 00:14:50,120 references HIV positive people that are not with us there 240 00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:54,040 anymore and poor artists and also people like William Young 241 00:14:54,040 --> 00:14:57,640 and other artists I came who represented HIV during that time 242 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,080 because in a lot of ways my reality would not exist without 243 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:03,800 them. I like playing with this notion 244 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:08,920 of time and really trying to use our in a way to teach people 245 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:12,160 about history because if we don't know where we're from and 246 00:15:12,160 --> 00:15:15,600 where we've come from and the sacrifices of the people before 247 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:20,240 us, we don't know what our culture is and what is valuable. 248 00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:25,720 And it's such an honour for me to be able to really have 249 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:31,240 Williams politics and values and aesthetics be represented in my 250 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:34,560 practise because this is a man that really has allowed me to 251 00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:37,600 dream and find myself as an artist. 252 00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:40,200 I really love it when people see my watch and they're like, oh, 253 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:43,640 it looks like William Young or it reminds me of William Young. 254 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:46,440 And I'm like, that's great. And I'm glad you know this man 255 00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:51,880 because here you have a queer Asian man who actually helped us 256 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:55,400 see what queer and liberation look like here in the Shire. 257 00:15:56,080 --> 00:15:58,760 Even though most of the subjects are white, you don't know that 258 00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:02,160 eyes looking at them is actually an Asian man. 259 00:16:02,160 --> 00:16:04,440 And I love that. I love the subtlety in that. 260 00:16:04,680 --> 00:16:07,720 I love the new ones in that if you look up anything, see the 261 00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:10,280 Mardi Gras seventies, 80s, very often they're not. 262 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:12,920 You're looking at true Williams eyes and I love that. 263 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,000 I never thought of that very last thing that you said, that 264 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:19,800 the way that the world sees queer Sydney in the 70s and 80s 265 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:23,440 is through William Young's eyes. That's so special and it's so 266 00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:25,720 lovely. I love your passion for William, 267 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:28,640 and you were saying earlier that you listened to my chat with 268 00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:30,600 him. But I also can't help but think, 269 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:33,800 you know, William is one of many artists who gave you permission, 270 00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:36,720 but you're giving artists permission with your work. 271 00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:40,680 You exhibited your Polaroids in a beautiful exhibition that's 272 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:43,440 popped up in various places, I believe called At First I Was 273 00:16:43,440 --> 00:16:48,440 Afraid, which is just the most exquisite title at all for an 274 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:51,880 exhibition. Tell me when the penny dropped 275 00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:55,400 and you decided to call your exhibition that Lyric and why? 276 00:16:56,160 --> 00:17:01,960 All of my works shows often connected them to sound because 277 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:06,119 I really want to honour my mom and the role of music and sound 278 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,839 has in my life, you know? So here we have. 279 00:17:08,839 --> 00:17:12,079 At first I was afraid. And I just love the way these 280 00:17:12,079 --> 00:17:16,280 kind of lyrics, it evokes so much memory. 281 00:17:16,280 --> 00:17:20,440 And I often connect them to camp culture, to queer culture again, 282 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:24,079 like romance back into a time during the AIDS epidemic where 283 00:17:24,079 --> 00:17:27,119 there was a lot of survival but also communities coming 284 00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:29,240 together. And I love with something like 285 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:31,120 at first I was afraid. You can kind of. 286 00:17:31,360 --> 00:17:33,400 You almost can't help but sing along. 287 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:38,840 Absolutely first. Guy was afraid I was petrified. 288 00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:41,360 Kept thinking I could never live without you by my side. 289 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:45,080 And like, you know, I've done other shows where it's called, 290 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:47,480 Yeah, the one I did with Collingwood Yards a few months 291 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:50,080 ago was You Make Me Feel Mighty Real. 292 00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:53,400 I have a next show coming up that's going to be titled I Will 293 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:56,120 Survive. I'm working on a sound work 294 00:17:56,120 --> 00:17:59,000 right now titled Pretty Woman Walking Down the Street. 295 00:17:59,880 --> 00:18:03,240 I always try and use sound first because even though I don't have 296 00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:06,240 a relationship with my mom anymore, I still really want to 297 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:09,920 honour what music and sound and her in my life. 298 00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:12,920 The other last show that I'm working on right now is for my 299 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:15,800 first solo show in the Philippines, and the title is 300 00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:18,400 hopelessly devoted to. Oh please. 301 00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:21,720 Honestly, my dream job would just be sitting in a room with 302 00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:23,720 you coming up with the titles for all your shows. 303 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:26,480 I want to kind of get into your music selections first of all, 304 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:31,160 before we do, do you mind sharing the role that music? 305 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:36,400 You've talked about music in your art and how you're inspired 306 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:38,840 by lyrics and that kind of thing, but how does music show 307 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:41,080 up in your day-to-day in your work? 308 00:18:41,080 --> 00:18:43,280 For example, how often are you listening to music? 309 00:18:43,560 --> 00:18:47,680 I listen to music, 95% of the time I'm having sex. 310 00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:53,320 I've got a sex playlist that's usually like jazz, techno, 311 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:59,920 experimental and I get it plain as soon as someone comes through 312 00:18:59,920 --> 00:19:03,840 the door. I'm also working on a sound 313 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:10,720 piece right now titled Happily Ever After and it's a sculpture 314 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:14,720 work but basically it's a stack to see these towers back. 315 00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:20,760 And I've been collecting C DS in those beautiful jewelled cases 316 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:23,440 of artists who have died of AIDS. 317 00:19:24,120 --> 00:19:25,800 I mean, I seem selecting the works. 318 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:27,920 I'm actually listening through the whole album. 319 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:28,360 Yeah. Wow. 320 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:32,000 Of all of these artists to really connect with them. 321 00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:35,880 And I was you just. Got the Queen album, didn't you? 322 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:36,880 Today I saw made in heaven. Made in. 323 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:38,440 Heaven and I just finished listening to his album. 324 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:39,960 Yeah, Too much love to kill you if you can make up your mind. 325 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:41,400 Torn between the live and the lively leave behind. 326 00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:57,360 But through this work, it was actually nice to really slow 327 00:19:57,360 --> 00:20:02,080 down and experience someone's body of work, you know, and to 328 00:20:03,120 --> 00:20:06,120 have the dead talking again. You know, that's how I've kind 329 00:20:06,120 --> 00:20:07,920 of been relating to it a lot. It's this. 330 00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:12,200 How does the ghost of the past continue to live with us? 331 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:14,120 I love that. And what does that mean? 332 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:17,440 You know, yeah. It's not as nice as a tower of 333 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:21,320 jewelled CDs, but I have a Spotify playlist with music by 334 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:27,520 artists who died of HIV, AIDS and also songs that others have 335 00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:31,120 made about them in tribute. So it's like songs. 336 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:35,640 Songs by those that we've lost and songs that are for those 337 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:37,600 we've lost. I'm proud of that place. 338 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:39,600 Yeah, OK. Well done. 339 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:41,760 Yeah, I'll share it with you. Let's go. 340 00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:46,160 You have given me some sensational selections, a track, 341 00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:48,600 an album and an artist, and we're going to kick off with 342 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:50,760 your track. So Malaya, what track did you 343 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:54,640 pick and why? OK, first one was Freedom by 344 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:55,560 George Michael. I won't let you down. 345 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:56,560 Will I give you a God? I have some free. 346 00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:12,120 Why does this song resonate with your queerness? 347 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:18,720 Malia, when I decided to birth my own name quite recently, 348 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:24,120 actually means freedom in Tagalog, my first language 349 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:27,240 because I've always thought about love. 350 00:21:27,360 --> 00:21:32,920 Well not always, but throughout my therapies years I've come to 351 00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:41,960 understand that love is actually freedom and more recently I've 352 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:46,440 had some really hard times. So like dealing with a stalker 353 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:52,160 who tried to endanger my life, all the fun bits of that I've, 354 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:57,280 I've had a very close best mate of mine pass away the, you know, 355 00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:59,280 he chose to end his life. I'm so sorry. 356 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:01,720 So it's like there's a lot of these moments where I've been 357 00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:04,000 very much conscious of my mortality. 358 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:10,360 And also lastly, I've been reading a lot of Jose Esteban 359 00:22:10,360 --> 00:22:16,160 Buenos, which is, you know, like one of the grand damn theories 360 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:20,240 of queer theory. Basically, in his iconic book 361 00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:25,920 Cruising Utopia, he talks about living in the status quo as 362 00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:30,360 living in straight time, right? So if you're behaving as you are 363 00:22:30,360 --> 00:22:35,040 now, as you exist, following the rules, that's in straight time. 364 00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:40,440 But he offers kind of like this beautiful way to live in the 365 00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:44,040 future. And that is true, the practise 366 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:47,280 of queer futurity. And in a way, it's like you can 367 00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:52,400 actually live in the future now by behaving in a way of how you 368 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:54,000 want the future should look like. 369 00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:56,000 It's this kind of art because a lot of people are like, oh, you 370 00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:58,400 got to stay in the present. I'm like, yeah, well, nothing 371 00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:01,440 makes you feel more in the present by actually behaving in 372 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:06,120 the future because you're so aware of what the present looks 373 00:23:06,120 --> 00:23:09,960 like and you're reacting to it. Because for me, in my world, 374 00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:13,920 there's all these men that are openly desired and love trans 375 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,600 people. For me, in my world, there's so 376 00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:19,440 many positive people who are just openly living themselves, 377 00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:22,840 shameless, you know? So I think a lot about that when 378 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:24,360 it comes to the say, the freedom. 379 00:23:24,360 --> 00:23:27,600 Because I guess for me, when I birded this whole name and gave 380 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:30,760 myself the name Malaya, I know it's a vision. 381 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,800 I know it's a goal. And I'll probably never get 382 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,320 there until I'm, you know, part of the earth again. 383 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:41,600 But I wanted to be a reminder of why I want to move through this 384 00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:45,680 world and why I want to kind of like anchor me as I, you know, 385 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:48,400 as I grow old and connect with everyone else. 386 00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:53,000 And I mean, George Michael, I've actually haven't discovered him 387 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:58,320 until God. In my early 20s, I had this 388 00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:03,000 lover of mine who was, I was in tropical fruits one year and he 389 00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:04,720 took me to my first cruising site. 390 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:09,080 It was around the tea tree lakes and on our way back to the 391 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,680 camping site. He was just like, I love George 392 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:15,080 Michael and I'm like, who's that? 393 00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:18,280 And he was just, I just remember how disappointed he was. 394 00:24:18,360 --> 00:24:20,360 We're all learning, we're all on a journey. 395 00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:22,200 We're all learning. We're all learning, everyone. 396 00:24:38,760 --> 00:24:42,480 throughout the ride back to our campsite, I just listened 397 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:45,640 through all of these songs by George Michael and I got this 398 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:48,680 beautiful, out of love letter to who he is. 399 00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:53,440 I I'll come clean with you. I also did not discover, no. 400 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:56,120 I've always known George Michael because my dad's always been a 401 00:24:56,120 --> 00:24:59,120 big fan. But I didn't fall in love with 402 00:24:59,120 --> 00:25:02,040 him until, very sadly, he passed away. 403 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:04,640 I remember when he died, it was close to like Prince. 404 00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:07,120 There was that time where all these legends were just dying 405 00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:08,760 and I was like. Right, I'm going to get. 406 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:12,440 Into George Michael and I just fell in love and it was so sad 407 00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,240 because I was like, Oh my gosh, I'm only falling in love with 408 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:18,920 this man as we've just lost him. So that was like the 1st signal 409 00:25:18,920 --> 00:25:21,720 for me that, you know, give our legends their flowers while 410 00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:23,920 we've got them. I love that you selected Freedom 411 00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:26,160 90. It came at this really pivotal 412 00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:29,880 part of his solo career where he'd already got one album under 413 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:33,440 his bow and he was exploring who he wanted to be as an artist. 414 00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:38,320 But in the famous music video, the film clip shows him lighting 415 00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:42,600 the leather jacket from Faith on Fire from the Faith album, which 416 00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:57,560 was his first big solo album. But then it's so matter because 417 00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:04,680 the song Faith opens up with the organ playing a bit of Freedom 418 00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:08,080 84, which was from his boy band Ram days. 419 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:22,560 We give Madonna credit for being queen of reinvention, but George 420 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:24,200 was the queen of reinvention as well. 421 00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:29,280 And it's that very queer notion of he is in control of who you 422 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:32,040 want to perceive him as. At any point in time, he'll 423 00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:36,120 control who he is and how we can cast off that previous 424 00:26:36,120 --> 00:26:40,720 iteration, which is yet another queer superpower. 425 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:45,080 Yes, you know, when I see artists like him who's just able 426 00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:49,200 to cross these illusions and lines that we put on ourselves 427 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,360 as people, you see someone who really knows how to connect with 428 00:26:52,360 --> 00:26:56,200 the human soul, but still at the same time being so openly 429 00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:58,560 hedonistic. Like, you know, I just still 430 00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:01,120 remember coming across this article of him getting caught in 431 00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:05,200 the toilets in London and being like, So what? 432 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:07,840 Like that was a vibe. But this was 3 decades ago or 433 00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:10,360 so, or two decades ago. But you know, for someone to 434 00:27:10,360 --> 00:27:13,520 just really just be themselves at that time, I'm like, oh, 435 00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:16,760 honey, if you think you're doing something new now, just look at 436 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:17,480 George. Absolutely. 437 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:19,640 I think you've hit it quite well. 438 00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:24,920 His discography have really kind of reflected or meditated on the 439 00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:29,400 kind of complexity of what it means to be a queer person and 440 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,320 be aware of the norm. And perhaps the sometimes these 441 00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:34,840 kind of resentment and bittersweet relationship we have 442 00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:36,520 with this, where I'm like, you know, I have moments where I'm 443 00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:38,400 like, Oh my God, I'd love to just be shy. 444 00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:42,120 I love living in the country and knocking cows in the sun or 445 00:27:42,120 --> 00:27:44,640 something, you know, because I'm like, how nice. 446 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:47,600 But you're a country girl now. But sometimes I'm like, oh, but 447 00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:51,120 this is not really me. It's not really my life, you 448 00:27:51,120 --> 00:27:55,160 know, because this often comes up with people who I know and 449 00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,040 they're like, oh, do you have a partner right now? 450 00:27:57,040 --> 00:28:03,120 And I'm like, I have partners, you know, like I, I've often 451 00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:06,600 seen myself and a lot of people anyways, you know, just 452 00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:11,640 polyamorous by nature. We love generously and openly 453 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:16,160 throughout and it's expressed through different levels and 454 00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:18,040 emotions. For quite some time now I 455 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:20,920 thought to myself, I'm like, I don't have a conventional 456 00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:23,800 lifestyle. It would just feel unfair to put 457 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:27,440 these conventional values and restrictions on me. 458 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,840 And the only I could really ever do is love someone, you know, 459 00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:35,600 Which goes back to why a lot of the letters are the polarised 460 00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:38,720 that you've seen of my work. They read like love letters 461 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:43,000 because they are, they're this proof that one day if anyone 462 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,120 ever asks if someone loved me and I'm like, look at all these 463 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:47,080 men. These men have loved me. 464 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:50,480 You know, because. Why would they give me their 465 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:54,560 story to represent to the world? And it's often how I explain it 466 00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:57,200 when I talk to them about it, when they're like a lot of the 467 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:01,480 people that I worked with for my first series, 85% of them or 468 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,760 more I still talk to. Because in a lot of ways, if I 469 00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:09,040 make art with you, I feel almost like I need to be with you, like 470 00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:11,440 I need to be connected with you. So it's a very, very cautious 471 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,320 thing because I want you to be part of this evolution and this 472 00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:17,240 is your work. Like when I make these works, 473 00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,280 it's really not about me being the artist, but because I 474 00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:23,880 consider everyone as artists. My last name by Anihan. 475 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:27,520 It's there will be no core value, but if you look it up on 476 00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:30,560 Google, it's a bunch of people carrying someone's house to 477 00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:33,000 move. But that's how I kind of see my 478 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,600 practise and my work. It's about how do you get each 479 00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:39,000 other out so that you can get somewhere, so that you can dream 480 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:41,280 together, so you can advocate for someone. 481 00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:56,120 It's so special. And I was listening to another 482 00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:58,560 conversation you did, I believe on a podcast called The 483 00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:01,200 Philosophy of Sex. It was from a few years ago, I 484 00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:05,560 think 2022. And so you beautifully describe 485 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,840 your philosophy of generous love in that. 486 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:11,360 And I'll link it in the show notes to this episode if anyone 487 00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:13,840 wants to listen to it. But I was writing down all these 488 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:16,960 notes about you, like my reflections. 489 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:20,760 And I've got to say that we're recording this conversation in a 490 00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:24,240 week where there's a lot of noise in the Australian queer 491 00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:28,280 scene about essentially there's a venue in Sydney which is a 492 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:30,920 deep consecrated church. It hasn't been a church for 493 00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:34,560 about 100 years, I believe. And recently a kind of queer 494 00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:37,280 collective have taken over it. And we're putting on this all 495 00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:40,360 this programming and it's it's all been shut down because the 496 00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:45,320 owner, the landlord, I guess, was terrified of the legions of 497 00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:48,000 religious protesters who have been rallied together through 498 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:52,600 the Internet to, you know, cast down this queer performance as 499 00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:57,160 being completely disrespectful to thinking about the work that 500 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,960 you do. Where correct me if I'm wrong, 501 00:30:59,960 --> 00:31:02,960 but I feel like you said in this other interview where the vast 502 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:06,880 majority of your clients or partners, well, they don't they 503 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,440 don't identify as gay or queer. Is that correct? 504 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:11,280 Yeah. I hope I'm connecting a thread 505 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:14,200 between these different topics, but it got me thinking about how 506 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:20,000 your work so powerfully lets us peek behind the curtain, 507 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:23,440 metaphorically and maybe even sometimes actually practically. 508 00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:26,320 We get to peer through the looking glass, which is yet 509 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:30,600 another queer superpower, where we as queer people get to see 510 00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:32,840 the reality of how things really are. 511 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:37,920 I think about these joyful queer performers being shut down by 512 00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:41,760 people who are so ardent in their beliefs that they are on 513 00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:44,720 the right side and they're outraged by this. 514 00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:48,600 But so many of those people are, I'm going to say it, I'm going 515 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:51,240 to be generalised and say they're repressed individuals 516 00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:55,920 who are often pushing down their real emotions or feelings. 517 00:31:55,920 --> 00:32:00,280 And then I look at the work you do where you create this space 518 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:04,880 for people who often don't feel like they can participate in 519 00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:08,800 labels or boxes or categories. And that's fine. 520 00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:14,400 But with you, they get to be part of their authentic selves. 521 00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:19,200 And I swear to you, I did not know the translation of what 522 00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:21,680 your name means, but I kept writing down in my notes app 523 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:24,400 Freedom. And this was, I hadn't even 524 00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:26,560 connected the pieces to the the name of this George Michael song 525 00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:31,000 that we're discussing. But I think your art is freedom. 526 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:36,200 It show it's your freedom. It allows your, the people you 527 00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:40,720 make the art with to be free. And that is, I keep saying the 528 00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:43,280 same phrase over and over again, but it's it's, it's another 529 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:46,400 queer superpower. It's part of life in the world 530 00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:51,400 that queer people can tap into that many people can't because 531 00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:54,240 of restrictions that are placed on them or they place on 532 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:56,640 themselves. No. 100% I think he either right 533 00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:57,960 in the head. This is one of the most 534 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:02,080 insightful experiences I've had working with a lot of these men 535 00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:05,440 who never in my life would have ever taught. 536 00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:09,720 The last six years of my life, I'd be spending more time with 537 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:14,000 the most masculine blokes in the world that I am with queer 538 00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:16,560 people. But through this work, I've been 539 00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:19,960 able to understand masculinity, particularly in a showing sense, 540 00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:27,120 and it's openness, curiosity, intelligence, emotional 541 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:30,440 capacity, and generosity. That's why I make work about 542 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:33,120 them, because in a lot of ways they're the people that actually 543 00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,520 fund my work directly. No one is funding it more 544 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,720 directly than these straight boys from the suburbs. 545 00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:45,320 And I have there, I say, a very, very queer art form because what 546 00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:49,600 they've taught me is because they are in a lot of ways, they 547 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:54,320 carry the spirit of queerness. But I think that it's also comes 548 00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:58,320 with the label query in itself. It's really been violence. 549 00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:03,680 It's got a history environment, violence and the the power of 550 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:07,800 reclamatory politics takes a lot of emotion, emotional kind of 551 00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:11,000 gymnastics that a lot of people don't resonate with or connect 552 00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:13,560 to absolutely and very often. And now, you know, I think it's 553 00:34:13,639 --> 00:34:16,840 a it's a confirmation of what we've known for a while when it 554 00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:19,080 comes to straightness. Straightness is more of a 555 00:34:19,080 --> 00:34:20,639 culture than a national identity. 556 00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,199 And it's something that people associate themselves with or 557 00:34:24,199 --> 00:34:28,800 live in, but in terms of their sexuality and what they're 558 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:30,280 curious about. I think this is something I've 559 00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:33,960 learned a lot by getting to know a lot of these men, is that just 560 00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:36,320 because you're straight doesn't also mean that you can't be 561 00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:39,920 curious and that you can't be open in the same way that 562 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:42,800 queerness. And I think we've unfortunately 563 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:46,920 kind of crystallised straightness or heterosexuality 564 00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,480 as this static thing, where in fact it's actually just as 565 00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:52,400 dynamic as queerness. I think to have aestheticized 566 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:55,800 both a lot of these identities and we've used aesthetics a lot 567 00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:59,680 and how someone, it makes themselves visible as a way of 568 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:03,000 showing what greatness and straightness is. 569 00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:08,360 I met this beautiful Carpenter in Brisbane last week and I was 570 00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:10,360 like, how would you describe your sexuality? 571 00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:15,040 And he said to me, I don't know, I think because maybe for me 572 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:17,880 it's never been a thing that I have to be very conscious about. 573 00:35:18,240 --> 00:35:21,040 You know, for me, I've never spent much time actually 574 00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:24,160 thinking about it because it's just not something I think 575 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:27,720 about. But if anyone asks me, it smells 576 00:35:27,720 --> 00:35:30,600 like water. You know, I, when something 577 00:35:30,600 --> 00:35:34,120 comes up and I like someone, I kind of, I do them. 578 00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:36,280 And then if I like something else, I do that. 579 00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:39,760 Which is also to be free. That's there's so many ways 580 00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:45,680 freedom exists in our everyday, but it's really a question. 581 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:49,840 Are we making that person feel safe to be free around us? 582 00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:53,560 Often in times we look at people like oh they're trap or they're 583 00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:56,800 this, rather than actually asking ourselves, am I making 584 00:35:56,800 --> 00:36:00,240 you feel free? Oh my gosh, we could speak for 585 00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:01,960 hours. I'm like, Oh my gosh, we've got 586 00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:03,360 some heavy hitters to get through. 587 00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:07,360 We better get into this album. Please tell me that album you 588 00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:11,240 picked and why. Oh my God, we picked the iconic 589 00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:14,480 self-titled SPICE. Vice Vice. 590 00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:15,680 You say what I want, what I really, really want. 591 00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:22,480 Don't tell me what you want. What you. 592 00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:26,680 Really. Really. 593 00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:30,440 Want I just get the sense that we're of like a similar age. 594 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,960 You might be younger than me. It's the come gets a younger. 595 00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:37,440 Parent, if I've got like a friend, an IRL friend who's 596 00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:40,320 listening to this right now, they're like, Oh no, Andy's 597 00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:43,360 guest just spit the Spice Girls. He's about to have going to 598 00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:48,000 cardiac arrest. Tell me, when do you first hear 599 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:50,000 the Spice Girls? When did you first hear this 600 00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:53,160 album? My God, I think I was like 4-5 601 00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:56,720 and because my parents were overseas, I had nannies. 602 00:36:56,760 --> 00:37:01,520 I had two nannies and as kids when this first album came out, 603 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:06,920 it was the only thing we listened to and danced to every 604 00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:10,080 day, like we knew all the choreography, you know what I 605 00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:22,200 mean? And I remember in the turtle 606 00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:24,840 pits, there was this rumour going around that they're all 607 00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:27,680 trans women, you know? And they were like, oh, but 608 00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:30,120 they're trans. And I remember as a kid I was 609 00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:33,080 like, I don't care. I still love them. 610 00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:36,320 You know, maybe I will love a trans person because they're 611 00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:38,880 amazing. Like, in a lot of ways. 612 00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:42,600 Sad enough for you. But through Spice Girls, I have 613 00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:44,240 actually discovered my queerness. 614 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,720 You know, they gave me the permission because I'm like, 615 00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:52,120 what else was faggoty in our generation than Spice Girls? 616 00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:58,600 It was the faggotest thing ever. It was so camp, it was so gay, 617 00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:02,560 but it was so joyful as well. You were just living in spice 618 00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:04,640 world. I don't see, I was just living 619 00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:07,800 in spice world. So when you ask me what album I 620 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:10,360 wanted this. I have to show you because she's 621 00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:12,600 staring down at me right now. Oh yes please. 622 00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:14,800 This is my. Wow. 623 00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:18,920 Jerry, doll. She stares at me as I talk. 624 00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:21,560 The eyes. And you know, this is your 625 00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:22,560 story. It's not mine. 626 00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:24,760 But you mentioned that there was this. 627 00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:27,840 Sounds like it's yours. There was, well, it's ours. 628 00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:29,680 We share this story with many people. 629 00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:32,000 It's like, you know, that's why I think I was like, I think 630 00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:34,960 we're of a similar age because it's such a signifier to have 631 00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:38,560 grown up in Spice world. I've said this a few times on 632 00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:41,520 this pod, I think, but I believe that the Spice Girls were my 633 00:38:41,520 --> 00:38:46,120 first exposure to draft. Regardless of what those ladies 634 00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:49,600 might say today, I think that they were drag Queens. 635 00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:54,720 They existed in this insane period of pop music where they 636 00:38:54,720 --> 00:38:57,360 were the biggest thing on the planet for two years and then 637 00:38:57,360 --> 00:39:00,080 they were just gone. They went and did their solo 638 00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,000 careers, and some of them still make music this day. 639 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:05,560 Obviously some have incredible global fashion ventures, but I 640 00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:09,800 love that as we navigated a period where love them as they 641 00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:13,880 were kids, probably many of us turned away from them in teens 642 00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:17,440 because they were cheesy and corny and we wanted to be emo 643 00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:19,680 and India, whatever. And then as we've gone through 644 00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:24,120 our 20s and 30s, it's like, no, they're fucking cool. 645 00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:27,280 They were cool then and they're cool now, and it's like the 646 00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:31,400 world seems to have more goodwill for them as time goes 647 00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:33,160 on. I didn't get to see it myself, 648 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:37,480 but in 2019 they did a reunion tour in the UK and I watched 649 00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:41,440 every video on YouTube. It was so proudly queer. 650 00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:45,040 The visuals, they had this whole stadium set up, and I believe 651 00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:48,520 all of their visuals were made by this kind of like queer 652 00:39:48,720 --> 00:39:53,240 graphic design collective in the UK, which really took these 653 00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:57,040 emblems of the 90s but made it feel contemporary. 654 00:39:57,280 --> 00:40:01,240 But I remember when the Spice Girls on their first round, it 655 00:40:01,240 --> 00:40:04,400 was all about little girls. So this is where I had an 656 00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:08,360 element of shame for myself as a little boy, where I wanted, yes. 657 00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:13,480 The dolls I wanted protect, the dolls I wanted the merchandise 658 00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:17,840 and whether the signalling was over or not, what I picked up 659 00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:19,840 from the world was, well, you can't like them because you're a 660 00:40:19,840 --> 00:40:21,080 boy. You should be listening to the 661 00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:23,440 Spice Girls. The reason I just brought up 662 00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:26,920 that kind of 2019 reunion is because their imagery when they 663 00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:30,720 came back was not just about girls, it was about everyone. 664 00:40:30,720 --> 00:40:33,240 It was almost like they had realised in the time that they'd 665 00:40:33,240 --> 00:40:38,320 been away the impact that they had had on queer boys, queer 666 00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:40,720 people, and it wasn't just little girls. 667 00:40:40,720 --> 00:40:43,680 And I love that. It's like they've they've become 668 00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:47,840 gay icons over time, if they weren't already on their first 669 00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:59,440 iteration. Honestly I feel like you can do 670 00:40:59,680 --> 00:41:02,520 tell me you have an interview line up with one of the spice 671 00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:03,560 roles. You have to. 672 00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:06,040 It would be amazing if I could interview any one of them. 673 00:41:06,040 --> 00:41:09,040 It would be Melanie C Sporty Spice, because she seems to be 674 00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:11,720 the one who's most tapped into queer culture. 675 00:41:11,720 --> 00:41:14,880 She works with a lot of queer artists, and she went on a 676 00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:18,280 really interesting journey herself, where in the press 677 00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:22,680 around the time she was often labelled as a lesbian in an 678 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:24,360 insulting way. They'd be like, you know, 679 00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:28,480 lesbian spice because she was sporty or active. 680 00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:31,720 I know you're dying laughing. But like the press at the time 681 00:41:31,720 --> 00:41:36,800 was ruthless and malicious. And so she's spoken about this 682 00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:38,760 as halfway. It was really conflicting for 683 00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:41,680 her because she was like, they're insulting me by saying 684 00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:43,880 that I'm a lesbian and I'm not a lesbian. 685 00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:48,120 I love men, but also, is it a bad thing to be a lesbian? 686 00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:50,520 Then she went on this journey and then all these years later 687 00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:52,480 she's she wears it as like a medal of honour. 688 00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,200 Now she was like, well, so fucking what if I was a lesbian? 689 00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:59,000 Like I don't care, I like Bring it On, she's amazing, but less 690 00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:00,600 about me. What are your favourite? 691 00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:02,520 What are your top 3 tracks from this album? 692 00:42:02,520 --> 00:42:04,120 Because there's, there's, there's many. 693 00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:07,080 Wannabe, of course. I think wannabe is my #1. 694 00:42:21,240 --> 00:42:24,680 Who do you think you are? Yes, and my last one, look, I've 695 00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,640 got a lot of people that's, I mean songs that are fighting 696 00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:30,600 against it, but I think just to follow on through the theme of 697 00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:33,040 the conversation tonight, I'm going to pick Mama She. 698 00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:44,480 Let me be free catching me a places. 699 00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:45,680 That I knew I shouldn't be. That's really special. 700 00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:47,040 You know, special. Damn it. 701 00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:49,520 OK, let's kick her. What about you? 702 00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:53,000 Well, on the on the topic of ballads, To Become one is my 703 00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:56,360 absolute favourite and that has its own queer history because 704 00:42:56,360 --> 00:42:59,960 the first version of that song, there's a lyric where it's like 705 00:42:59,960 --> 00:43:09,120 boys. Together and then the story goes 706 00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:12,000 that they started to realise that they had a lot of gay fans 707 00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:15,880 so they re recorded that line and I think 708 00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:34,000 So they got rid of the girl and boy line that you fucked the 709 00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:37,440 binary off. And yeah, so that's my child to 710 00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:39,520 become one. Your artist. 711 00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:42,480 Tell me the artist that you picked and I can't wait to hear 712 00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:45,080 why. The artist that I picked is 713 00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:51,800 Patrick Cowley. He's a producer, he's EDM 714 00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:57,040 artist, a real club kid, collaborated a lot with 715 00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:01,680 brilliant artist like Sylvester. I think there's so many iconic 716 00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:04,480 songs, but one of his albums that I really love is Megatron 717 00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:14,470 Man. He's the artist that I picked 718 00:44:14,470 --> 00:44:19,230 for because of, you know, he's also an artist who died of AIDS 719 00:44:20,030 --> 00:44:24,190 and at heart. I always say this with other 720 00:44:24,350 --> 00:44:26,510 podcasts that I've got in interviews that I don't know 721 00:44:26,510 --> 00:44:28,350 making up. My heart is with the community, 722 00:44:28,350 --> 00:44:33,680 but my soul is in the club, so I really have a lot of resonance 723 00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:36,440 and respect for people like Patrick Howley. 724 00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:44,320 That just brought so much joy and fun and hedonism unlike 725 00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:46,720 anyone else, you know, like, do you want to fun? 726 00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:15,320 Oh, just all these iconic songs that we all still dancing to 727 00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:18,480 this day, you know, that gets remixed so many times. 728 00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:21,800 It's probably being played at Pole Festival now, as it should 729 00:45:21,800 --> 00:45:23,000 be. But he is. 730 00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:26,280 Yeah. He's one of the granddads of HIV 731 00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:29,200 positive artists for me. I'm. 732 00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:34,440 So genuine when I say this that he is at the top of my list of 733 00:45:34,560 --> 00:45:38,760 artists who I've been dying to talk about on this podcast, but 734 00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:43,000 no one has explicitly named him before I've spoken to people. 735 00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:47,200 I spoke to an amazing journalist called Larry Flick who selected 736 00:45:47,440 --> 00:46:06,440 songs by Paul Parker. Produced by Patrick Cowley and 737 00:46:06,440 --> 00:46:10,120 he did like an amazing education on what was going on in San 738 00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:12,880 Francisco at that time around, like electronic pop music. 739 00:46:13,560 --> 00:46:18,360 I spoke to our mutual connection, Johnny Seymour, when 740 00:46:18,360 --> 00:46:21,440 I interviewed them, and a song that they picked which will 741 00:46:21,440 --> 00:46:24,840 always stay with me is Sylvester's I Need Somebody to 742 00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:27,840 Love Tonight, which is produced by Patrick. 743 00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:45,160 Cowley. There's this record label in San 744 00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:49,680 Francisco called Dark Entries, and they acquired the rights to 745 00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:53,880 Patrick Cowley's material a few years ago, which a lot of it was 746 00:46:53,880 --> 00:46:57,520 out of print, it wasn't available on streaming or vinyl, 747 00:46:57,720 --> 00:47:00,000 and they're the ones who have made it available in streaming. 748 00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:02,440 So if you've enjoyed Patrick Cowley on streaming, it's 749 00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:04,200 because of this record label. But they've also. 750 00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:06,880 We printed all the vinyls and I wanted to give a shout out to 751 00:47:06,880 --> 00:47:10,440 any queers in Australia. You can purchase a Patrick 752 00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:14,640 Cowley vinyl from the legends at Queer Records who are based in 753 00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:18,360 Narm and I've bought Patrick Cowley vinyls from them. 754 00:47:18,560 --> 00:47:24,080 He's just such a fantastic part of a semi recent queer history, 755 00:47:24,200 --> 00:47:28,320 yet his name is always to be found in the lists and records 756 00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:31,520 of incredible artists that we lost too young to AIDS. 757 00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:33,480 Yeah, really young. Really, really young. 758 00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,880 He was only 32 himself and you just need to check out his 759 00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:39,280 Wikipedia to see how much work he achieved in that time. 760 00:47:39,280 --> 00:47:44,200 And I mean alone from his solo. You could just discard his 761 00:47:44,200 --> 00:47:47,880 entire body of work and be left with you Make me feel Mighty 762 00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:51,200 Real and he would still be one of the most accomplished queer 763 00:47:51,200 --> 00:47:55,560 artists of the 20th century. So yeah, amazing selection. 764 00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:07,400 I think there's been, I was going, you know, when I told you 765 00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:10,400 earlier, when I've been reflecting a lot on mortality, 766 00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:14,800 particularly this year when I decided to give myself the name 767 00:48:14,800 --> 00:48:16,520 Eli. And because I've been 768 00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:20,080 researching so many of the kids, Gonzalez stories, Keith Herring, 769 00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:24,040 Patrick Alley, all of these brilliant, brilliant artists 770 00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:25,840 that we still talk about to this day. 771 00:48:26,200 --> 00:48:29,920 They died around our age. Most of them died between the 772 00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:34,480 ages of 32 to 37. A lot of really brilliant, clear 773 00:48:34,480 --> 00:48:37,520 artists that are not with us today are actually our 774 00:48:37,520 --> 00:48:42,720 contemporary. And I'm just like, wow, how 775 00:48:42,720 --> 00:48:47,200 lucky are we to be in this generation, 45 years since the 776 00:48:47,240 --> 00:48:52,000 AIDS epidemic was identified and really began to affect and 777 00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:53,880 decimate so many people in our communities. 778 00:48:53,880 --> 00:48:56,920 And now we're at a time when people living with HIV can live 779 00:48:56,920 --> 00:49:00,520 long, healthy, normal lives, not affect their partners. 780 00:49:00,720 --> 00:49:04,040 We're so, so lucky, but also there's so much of this 781 00:49:05,080 --> 00:49:08,160 incredible culture that they left us behind that are gifts 782 00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:14,320 from them that we also get to use and witness and surround us 783 00:49:14,320 --> 00:49:17,160 with. And yeah, I hope people who 784 00:49:17,160 --> 00:49:20,760 listens to us tonight, today, this morning, when they're on 785 00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:23,880 their way to work, when they're having a shower, maybe fucking, 786 00:49:23,880 --> 00:49:27,440 you know, it's to think about the way these artists continue 787 00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:30,080 to infect our lives. And what a gift. 788 00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:34,920 The past is the ghost of our past, as is for us now. 789 00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:39,240 I think we've kind of named the huge bangers. 790 00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:44,200 If you had to pick a #1 Patrick Cowley production to go and 791 00:49:44,200 --> 00:49:45,640 listen to right now, what would it be? 792 00:49:46,320 --> 00:49:48,000 I think it's going to be do you on a phone? 793 00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:53,360 Let's go. I had such an incredible dance 794 00:49:53,920 --> 00:50:01,240 of that during World Pride when Boris was playing a beautiful, 795 00:50:01,240 --> 00:50:05,560 beautiful mix of it during a House of Mince party. 796 00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:11,600 And I don't know, every time a year a positive artist, this 797 00:50:12,080 --> 00:50:16,120 sound, I always give it my life. I always give it my best dance 798 00:50:16,160 --> 00:50:20,520 and I just remember having such a fun, fun, incredible dance to 799 00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:22,200 that song. That's really special. 800 00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:25,240 I'm with you there on the dance floor and actually maybe in the 801 00:50:25,240 --> 00:50:26,960 future we will share a dance floor together. 802 00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:27,600 It's very. Real. 803 00:50:27,680 --> 00:50:31,840 As I mentioned this before, we started as the pappers of Pod, 804 00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:34,840 the podcasting world. You did say that off Mike. 805 00:50:34,840 --> 00:50:36,800 And thank you for saying it again on Mike. 806 00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:41,560 Off the record, on the record, on the dance floor. 807 00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:44,440 Before I let you go, this has just been the most beautiful 808 00:50:44,440 --> 00:50:47,320 chat, but I want to do a quick fire that I haven't prepared you 809 00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:49,960 for on purpose. Oh, go, let's go, let's go. 810 00:50:49,960 --> 00:50:52,080 A song that you listen to when you feel blue. 811 00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:53,960 Oh. I have. 812 00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:56,520 It's called New Day for You by Bassia. 813 00:51:05,010 --> 00:51:06,970 A song that makes you feel powerful. 814 00:51:07,450 --> 00:51:11,090 Make me feel my area. What was the last new song that 815 00:51:11,090 --> 00:51:12,490 you heard that you fell in love with? 816 00:51:13,130 --> 00:51:17,050 The reprice version of Part of Your World, The Disney song What 817 00:51:17,050 --> 00:51:18,370 would I? Give to you 818 00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:34,960 at? Me, written by Howard Ashman, 819 00:51:35,000 --> 00:51:37,920 another artist we lost. Yeah, who died of AIDS. 820 00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:40,880 But I love listening to the reprise version of it because 821 00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:44,960 you could really hear his longing for his love. 822 00:51:45,720 --> 00:51:49,480 Who died of AIDS? You could really hear that loss. 823 00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:53,600 And I'm just like, oh, honey, yeah. 824 00:51:54,160 --> 00:51:58,080 Like the longingness. And in a lot of ways, it almost 825 00:51:58,080 --> 00:52:03,760 kind of like really echoed the original version of The Little 826 00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:07,560 Mermaid because of the original version he turned into what do 827 00:52:08,120 --> 00:52:10,000 you call those bubbles in the sea he turned. 828 00:52:10,600 --> 00:52:12,720 Into. One of those you know. 829 00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:15,560 And Hans Christian Andersen was gay. 830 00:52:15,560 --> 00:52:17,840 Yeah, it's all connected. I know. 831 00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:21,240 Wow, honestly, we could carry on for hours. 832 00:52:21,480 --> 00:52:24,960 Finally, is there a queer charity or an initiative that 833 00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:26,200 you'd like to give a shout out to? 834 00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:29,760 I want to give shout out to Living Positive Vic. 835 00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:33,000 There are community based organisation base here in 836 00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:36,560 Victoria and the provide advocacy and support for all 837 00:52:36,560 --> 00:52:38,360 people living with HIV across the state. 838 00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:41,880 I give them a shout out also because I'm so, so lucky to be 839 00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:45,160 someone who is working very, very closely with them and I've 840 00:52:45,160 --> 00:52:49,800 been able to witness just the absolute beauty and amazingness. 841 00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:54,040 So what it means to live with HIV now, today, because of what 842 00:52:54,040 --> 00:52:57,200 this organisation provides, because of the COVID kind of 843 00:52:57,920 --> 00:53:00,960 quote unquote overspend. In the last six years, a lot of 844 00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:03,400 community organisations in Victoria have actually lost 845 00:53:03,880 --> 00:53:07,840 quite a fair bit of their funding from 30 to some 50%. 846 00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:13,520 So anyone who has got some coin feeling generous, please support 847 00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:16,640 any of the community organisations that you feel your 848 00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:20,560 heart close to here in Victoria because so many people still out 849 00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:23,360 there and need this and a small amount of money can go a long, 850 00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:25,880 long, long, long way. I also want to thank the Mars 851 00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:28,960 Gallery who is a commercial gallery here who did a beautiful 852 00:53:28,960 --> 00:53:32,280 fundraising for us last month called Polaroids, Polaroids, 853 00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:35,360 Polaroids. And they've been able to collect 854 00:53:35,360 --> 00:53:39,320 $10,000 worth of donations by inviting community members to 855 00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:42,800 submit Polaroids and people, anyone on the street and by 856 00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:44,720 these Polaroids. And it all goes directly to 857 00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:46,960 supporting people living in Malaysia, being Victoria. 858 00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:49,480 So yes. I love it. 859 00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:52,280 Plugged. Fantastic, I love it. 860 00:53:52,720 --> 00:53:57,480 Malaya Bayernihan, you are queer and thank you very much for your 861 00:53:57,480 --> 00:53:58,720 tracks. Thank you. 862 00:54:07,480 --> 00:54:11,360 You can find Malaya online at at Baby DILF X. 863 00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:16,120 That's BABYDILFX. And in case there was any doubt, 864 00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:18,560 I applaud you to do so if not already. 865 00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:22,360 We are coming to the pointy end of this season that I've saved 866 00:54:22,360 --> 00:54:25,280 up some of my favourite episodes I've ever recorded and I can't 867 00:54:25,280 --> 00:54:27,680 wait for you to hear them. See you next time.