1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,440 So I don't know about you, but many people have asked me, why 2 00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:06,880 are you Catholic? And for most of the years in my 3 00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:08,560 life, I didn't really have a good answer. 4 00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:10,760 I would say, well, my family's Italian. 5 00:00:10,920 --> 00:00:15,000 That's just kind of what we do. As I've grown up, I've got a 6 00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:17,960 better answer, which is that Jesus Christ founded the 7 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:20,560 Catholic Church. And today what we want to talk 8 00:00:20,560 --> 00:00:23,760 about is what's the difference between someone who just says, 9 00:00:24,120 --> 00:00:27,440 oh, I'm Catholic because my family's Catholic, versus 10 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:31,120 someone who says I'm Catholic and it's the center of my life. 11 00:00:31,560 --> 00:00:33,320 Don't go anywhere. You're going to want to hear 12 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:49,510 this. All right, gentlemen. 13 00:00:49,670 --> 00:00:54,550 So let's get into some data. Let's see what big data has to 14 00:00:54,550 --> 00:00:58,160 say about this topic. So there's been a ton of stuff 15 00:00:58,160 --> 00:01:02,000 in the news right now about, you know, are people becoming more 16 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:05,720 Catholic or people becoming more Christian US population, What's 17 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:09,360 the survey data saying? And Pew Research, which is kind 18 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:12,440 of like the leading religious organization when it comes to 19 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:15,160 data. They just finished their study 20 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:20,520 in a 2025 S pretty recent data. And here's what they say that 21 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:25,800 nearly half of US adults claim a connection to the Catholic 22 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:27,400 faith. Kind of interesting. 23 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:29,360 And then they break it down, they say. 24 00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:31,440 That could mean anything. Yeah, just a connection. 25 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:35,320 And they break it down. They say 20% of US adults 26 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:39,320 identify as Catholic. When asked what their religion 27 00:01:39,320 --> 00:01:46,000 is, 9% of adults say that they are culturally Catholic, which 28 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,920 means they do not say that they are, that they identify with the 29 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:53,920 religion of the Catholic Church. But they say yes when asked 30 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:57,680 whether aside from religion, they consider themselves as 31 00:01:57,680 --> 00:02:02,160 Catholic, for example, ethnically, culturally, or 32 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:03,400 because of their family background. 33 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:06,600 Wow. Not sure what those people are 34 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:11,039 thinking, but 9% and then 9% say that they're former Catholic. 35 00:02:11,640 --> 00:02:16,320 So they identify as Catholic religiously previously, but no 36 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:20,240 longer, and the 9% said that they're connected to Catholicism 37 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:20,960 in other ways. I. 38 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:26,840 Know a guy? My cousin's friend's dog was 39 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:28,960 Catholic. They are not Catholic culturally 40 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:32,080 or formally, but they have a Catholic parent, spouse, or 41 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:34,960 partner and they say yes when asked if they have attended a 42 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:37,840 Catholic mass. So then you break it down. 43 00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:39,720 You say OK. Of the people who identify as 44 00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:44,680 Catholic, 20% say that they are religiously Catholic. 50% say 45 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:46,560 that they pray daily. That's cool. 46 00:02:47,920 --> 00:02:55,320 But 28% say that they go to Mass weekly, and then 23% say that 47 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:58,680 they go to confession with the priest at least once a year. 48 00:02:59,960 --> 00:03:05,160 Only 13% of American Catholics say that they do three of the 49 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:09,760 following things, pray daily, attend Mass weekly, and go to 50 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:14,240 confession at least once a year. So we gave a lot of numbers, but 51 00:03:14,240 --> 00:03:18,040 let's just break it down really simply is that we have tons of 52 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:22,000 people that say I am Catholic or I have a Catholic friend. 53 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:26,560 But then of all those people who say that 13%. 54 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:30,920 So you have 10 people in a room who say they're Catholic, 1.3 55 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:33,560 point three of them. Maybe there's a super short guy 56 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:38,160 in the room says I do the bit the the absolute basics. 57 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:40,720 I pray daily. Maybe that's, you know, a 58 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:43,360 blessing before meal. I go to Mass weekly, and I go to 59 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:50,800 confession at least once a year. I don't know, frankly, what that 60 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:53,960 means, but I'm hoping that we can come to some conclusions 61 00:03:53,960 --> 00:03:58,360 here together about the difference between those 13% and 62 00:03:58,360 --> 00:04:01,320 the other 87% who say, yeah, I'm Catholic for sure. 63 00:04:02,040 --> 00:04:06,160 But I actually don't do any of the things that the Catholic 64 00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:10,560 faith would say are the basic tenets, the basic activities of 65 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:14,160 someone who's Catholic. Yeah, so when you say that, I, I 66 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:16,760 think growing up and I, and I've shared a little bit of my story 67 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:19,959 on, on, on the podcast. I grew up in Mexico, which is a 68 00:04:19,959 --> 00:04:22,520 very culturally Catholic country. 69 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:28,080 And when I share my story, I say we didn't grow up in any sort of 70 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:33,120 faith, but the we, we actually did grow up Catholic. 71 00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:36,160 It's just that what that meant was we would go to Mass maybe 72 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,960 once every three years, right. But back then I thought, that's 73 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:43,600 what, Oh, yeah, we're Catholic, you know? 74 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:45,920 But now looking back, I'm like we we were not practicing 75 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:48,880 anything. Pew Research actually did a 76 00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:52,080 study on particularly just Hispanic Catholics in the US 77 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:54,160 really. And there is there's two data 78 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,600 points that are fascinating of Hispanic Catholics. 79 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:01,880 They said, do you regularly wear religious items, maybe a 80 00:05:01,880 --> 00:05:05,480 necklace, maybe a bracelet? 56% said yes. 81 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:09,800 How many of them attended Mass weekly? 82 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:12,200 19%. Wow. 83 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:16,080 So I think that that speaks very much to what you're saying, 84 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:19,800 which is it's important enough for me to wear a necklace about 85 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:23,840 it, but it's not important enough for me to actually go and 86 00:05:23,840 --> 00:05:27,040 celebrate the very thing that makes me Catholic, which is 87 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:29,200 Mass. And I see this a lot too. 88 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:31,400 And it, this isn't just limited to Louisiana, but Louisiana is 89 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:34,320 another place that where I live, it's very culturally Catholic. 90 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:38,400 Now I always struggle with this because I'll meet someone and 91 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:41,000 like, oh, like, I don't know how come up with it. 92 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:43,480 Like, Oh yeah, I'm Catholic. It's like, oh, that's great. 93 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:45,720 What do you, you know where we keep talking? 94 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:47,440 Like what do you live? He's like, oh, I live with my 95 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:49,560 girlfriend, You, you know, over here. 96 00:05:49,560 --> 00:05:51,200 And it's like they, they start listening. 97 00:05:51,200 --> 00:05:53,200 All these things. I'm like, well, those are like 98 00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:56,200 pretty, I don't want to say pretty basic, but there's 99 00:05:56,200 --> 00:06:00,080 definitely on the more basic side of things that the Catholic 100 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:02,560 Church has not to do. And it's like, how do I 101 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,080 reconcile that? Well, I think your your life 102 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:07,480 experience is really fascinating because I'm thinking about like 103 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:09,560 the four main places that you've lived. 104 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:13,760 So Mexico, obviously culturally Catholic, San Antonio, you 105 00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:16,520 probably identify that as AUS city that would have a lot of 106 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:20,000 cultural Catholicism, Louisiana, as you said. 107 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:23,240 And then South Carolina, which is kind of the outlier probably 108 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:27,400 of those four places, did you see differences between the 109 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:30,320 faithfulness of people and the three versus the one? 110 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:33,560 Yes and no. I think that it was basic, yes. 111 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:36,240 South Carolina is kind of more in the Bible Belt, right? 112 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:37,960 So there's a lot less Catholicism. 113 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:45,000 And so when I was not on the university campus, it was rare 114 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,000 to meet someone else Catholic. And when they were Catholic, 115 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:49,040 they were actually Catholic, you know what I mean? 116 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:52,920 And, but I mean, what I mean by actually is that they, they 117 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:57,200 practiced a lot, if not most or most, if not all of the, of the 118 00:06:57,800 --> 00:06:59,160 basic tenets of the Catholic faith. 119 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:02,400 So that that set up. But at the same time, when I was 120 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:06,080 on the university campus, it was a little different because I 121 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:09,880 think people are just, like, starting to kind of wrestle with 122 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:12,320 like, what is faith more than just what my parents have handed 123 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:13,920 down to me? And I think that's where I would 124 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:17,160 run into a lot of the same if I'm Catholic. 125 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:18,440 But I don't really know what that means. 126 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:19,800 I don't really know what that entails. 127 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:22,560 Just maybe because my parents told me or that's good what my 128 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:25,360 parents did, that that would be the biggest difference is 129 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:28,160 outside of the university campus, anyone that said they 130 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:32,320 were Catholic was probably very faithful to the to the tent of 131 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:32,880 the faith. Yeah. 132 00:07:33,440 --> 00:07:36,160 But what's he also experiencing growing up in Dallas going 133 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:41,760 private school? I, you know, it's funny because 134 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:48,240 I, there's a part of cultural Catholicism that I think did a 135 00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:52,240 lot of damage to my faith. And I'm, I'm putting that in 136 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:55,200 comparison with my wife who's a convert to the Catholic faith, 137 00:07:56,040 --> 00:08:01,040 where for me, I knew all of the things growing up. 138 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:04,200 Like I actually look back at some of the things that I did as 139 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:08,040 a kid and I'm like, I had incredible Catholic formation. 140 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:11,600 Like I could have quoted you. I remember my freshman year at 141 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:15,400 Jesuit college prep, I was like the star student in the theology 142 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:17,680 class, but I didn't want to show that I was the star student 143 00:08:17,680 --> 00:08:21,120 because it was kind of nerdy to be the, the theologian in an all 144 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:24,400 boys prep school. But my confirmation saying it 145 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:27,360 was Saint Ignatius. And like the first half of the 146 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:29,560 whole class was about the history of the Jesuits. 147 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:33,000 And I knew every single answer because I, I had researched St. 148 00:08:33,000 --> 00:08:35,559 Ignatius and like, I started making fun of me and they were 149 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,080 like, oh, hey, you going to go where you going to be priest, 150 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,480 you know. And, and so it kind of, it 151 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:46,440 honestly kind of did some damage because pretty early on as you 152 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:50,160 start growing up and, and figuring out what's cool, what's 153 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:55,120 not, what was shown to me by the people I was around was if 154 00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:58,000 you're faithful, you're, you're you're pretty weird. 155 00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:00,560 Yeah. Like, I was the only guy in my 156 00:09:00,560 --> 00:09:02,840 friend group that went to youth group at my church. 157 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:06,200 And I remember kind of hiding it from people to be like, oh, what 158 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:07,120 are you, what are you up to tonight? 159 00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:09,560 Oh, you know, oh, yeah. Family commitment. 160 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:12,360 And I'd, I'd, I'd head over to youth group at the parish, which 161 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:14,000 I loved. Like, I, I thought the youth 162 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:17,080 minister was super cool. I, I related a lot to him. 163 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:20,920 He was athletic, you know, very vivacious, fun to be around. 164 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:24,080 But I was like afraid to tell people, even though all these 165 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:26,560 guys were Catholic. It was just like, oh, if you're, 166 00:09:26,560 --> 00:09:30,240 if you're into your faith, like that's kind of a nerd. 167 00:09:30,560 --> 00:09:33,960 So growing up going to Catholic school, was everyone Catholic? 168 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:38,200 For the most part. I made 8085 percent, 90 percent, 169 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:41,440 95%. Yeah, but, and I guess it was 170 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:42,960 high school. So, you know, when we're in high 171 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:46,240 school, we don't think through things a lot, but how many of 172 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:49,520 them were actually entering into the? 173 00:09:49,560 --> 00:09:50,360 Not many. Yeah. 174 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:55,280 Very, very, very few. Yeah, not many good one guy I 175 00:09:55,280 --> 00:10:00,160 remember enter the Jesuits right out of high school and I just 176 00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:01,920 remember thinking that was. That was just crazy. 177 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:03,360 That was the. Weirdest thing I've ever seen, 178 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:06,960 you know, and then my family, we went to Mass every Sunday. 179 00:10:08,680 --> 00:10:10,720 But again, it was just one of those things that you kind of 180 00:10:10,720 --> 00:10:12,760 had to do. Here's something I'm, I'm 181 00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:15,840 wondering though, because I'm, we use the term, I think when we 182 00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:19,880 say culturally Catholic, what we mean by that is you're not 183 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:22,600 really Catholic. You know, it's kind of a it's a 184 00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:25,360 funny phrase. Like it Catholicism is kind of 185 00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:31,680 in the air, but you're, you're not, you know, super practicing, 186 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:35,400 you know, versus like you think of a country like Poland or 187 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:39,080 Maria von Trapp, you know, in Austria, you know, or you think 188 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:44,240 of our experience at, at Texas A&M and being a part of Saint 189 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:47,600 Mary's and the Catholic Center there, there was a culture that 190 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:50,000 was Catholic. And, and those types of 191 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:53,800 instances, it's like, yeah, the, the, the culture of Catholicism 192 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:57,240 at Saint Mary's at Texas A&M drew me in. 193 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,800 I wanted to be Catholic because it was a part of it wasn't just 194 00:11:01,280 --> 00:11:04,240 it wasn't just me that had this desire for God. 195 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:05,840 It was the culture that did, you know. 196 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:07,720 And so I think it's just kind of interesting that when we 197 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:11,080 culturally Catholic means that the the culture is not really 198 00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:13,040 Catholic. Totally right. 199 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,840 Well, it's funny because I think you're, you're identifying that 200 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:20,320 there's like a healthy culture, often times of, of Catholicism 201 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:23,200 and then a very unhealthy culture of Catholicism. 202 00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:27,760 Like when we first started being involved in, you know, our, our 203 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:31,840 Catholic faith, frankly, it was because there was a lot of 204 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:36,960 people that we respected and looked up to and liked that were 205 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:40,040 Catholic and, and like actually practicing their faith. 206 00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:43,080 I think about men who are older than us, like the missionaries 207 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:47,160 we worked with, or older men involved like Evan or guys like 208 00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:50,000 that who just look to and you're like, that's a culture I want to 209 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:51,000 be a part of. You know. 210 00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:55,120 So cultural Catholicism gets a bad rap, but there's also a 211 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:58,280 cultural Catholicism that creates a space where people are 212 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:01,040 actually attracted to it. And I'm wondering if we could 213 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:05,080 identify kind of the differences between the bad culture that 214 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:08,400 says I don't really want to be a part of that, and then a healthy 215 00:12:08,400 --> 00:12:12,760 culture that is attractive, like a moth to a light for souls. 216 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:20,000 I think when we talked about maybe the, the bad side of, of 217 00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:25,680 the culture, one thing that stands out to me is people that 218 00:12:25,680 --> 00:12:31,680 aren't really committed and, and I used to get really bothered by 219 00:12:31,680 --> 00:12:33,200 this when someone was like, yeah, I'm Catholic. 220 00:12:34,360 --> 00:12:36,320 And then I'm like, nothing about your life tells me you're 221 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:40,000 Catholic because you're neither in or out. 222 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,040 And I'm like, just honestly, I, I would prefer if you tell me 223 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:46,600 you're not Catholic, right? And, and it would kind of, it 224 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:48,040 would just kind of anger me a little bit. 225 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:52,920 It would kind of grind my gears because I'm attracted to people 226 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:56,760 that are committed people that are like when they say they're 227 00:12:56,760 --> 00:12:59,080 going to do something, they, they actually do it. 228 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:02,680 I find that attractive. And so when you, when, when I 229 00:13:02,680 --> 00:13:06,720 would meet people, it's like, Oh, I'm Catholic, but you know, 230 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:09,880 half the stories that tell you I'm, I'm celebrating how, how 231 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:13,920 drunk I get on the weekends, you know, and, and I'm not saying 232 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:16,640 that, you know, if you're Catholic, you, you never get 233 00:13:16,640 --> 00:13:18,720 drunk, right? We all fall sometimes. 234 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:20,520 But there's a difference between celebrating it and not. 235 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:24,040 And I think that's one of the things that that differs is like 236 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:27,440 there's a level of commitment and a level of actually taking 237 00:13:27,440 --> 00:13:31,640 something serious. So would you say in response to 238 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:36,240 that, would you say that having no faith is better than having 239 00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:36,960 cultural faith? I. 240 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:39,360 Don't know. And that's where I kind of get 241 00:13:39,360 --> 00:13:41,360 lost because I, I don't know the answer to that. 242 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:45,200 But to me when someone tells me I'm Catholic, but you're not 243 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:48,560 living any of it, I'm like, you're almost just lying to 244 00:13:48,560 --> 00:13:53,760 yourself. And in my own life, I, I think 245 00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:57,360 where I've seen the most growth is when I'm able to admit where 246 00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:01,080 I'm really at. And this is me just projecting 247 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:02,760 until the people, I don't know where people are actually at. 248 00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:05,760 But a lot of times I'm like, well, are you saying that 249 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:08,120 because you don't want to admit that you've actually fallen so 250 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:10,480 far from what, you know, the Catholic faith to be, but you're 251 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:13,880 scared to face that? So that, that's where I, I kind 252 00:14:13,880 --> 00:14:15,560 of get frustrated. Like, I'd rather you just tell 253 00:14:15,560 --> 00:14:19,520 me you're not Catholic. So that we, like, I want you to 254 00:14:19,520 --> 00:14:21,600 have a real understanding of where you're at. 255 00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:23,480 So it'll be hot or cold. Yeah. 256 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,440 But I'm not, I'm not saying it's better than like, no faith is 257 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:28,280 better than a little faith. I, I don't know the answer to 258 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:30,040 that. I don't know if you guys have 259 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:33,000 thoughts on that. Well, I mean that the church has 260 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:38,120 spoken about a, a topic maybe surrounding your question, which 261 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:42,520 is that when you're evangelizing and our churches, you know, the, 262 00:14:42,560 --> 00:14:46,000 the term, the new evangelization or the re evangelization has 263 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:48,520 become kind of a colloquial idea. 264 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:54,320 But what it really means is that you're evangelizing people that 265 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:57,880 have some sort of understanding of the faith. 266 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:01,600 The problem and the, the reason that we've kind of taken on this 267 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:05,800 term of the new evangelization is it's the, the church has 268 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:10,440 stated that it is somewhat harder to evangelize people who 269 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:14,400 think they know what the church is versus evangelizing people 270 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:17,040 that actually have no concept. They're kind of starting at a 271 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:21,400 neutral point versus we, we can all identify when you're trying 272 00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:24,680 to work with someone that is not neutral to the faith, but 273 00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:27,560 actually has a lot of preconceived notions about what 274 00:15:27,560 --> 00:15:31,000 they think it is. You actually have to restructure 275 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:35,240 their idea of what the faith is first before you can even bring 276 00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:38,560 them to the true faith, versus when you start with someone 277 00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:41,080 who's neutral. Yeah, I'd actually don't know 278 00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:42,720 anything. Like, please teach me. 279 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:45,080 You don't actually have to restructure any of their 280 00:15:45,080 --> 00:15:47,520 mindsets. You can just teach the faith for 281 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:52,440 what it is instead of having to show them what you what you 282 00:15:52,440 --> 00:15:56,040 think you believe the faith is, is actually the in inappropriate 283 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:57,680 understanding of what it truly is. 284 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:04,080 I think Archbishop Venerable. Is he Venerable Fulton Sheen or 285 00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:05,240 Blessed? He's about to be. 286 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:10,240 I don't know, but but he would say, he would say, you know, 287 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:15,800 millions of people hate their idea of the Catholic Church, but 288 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:20,680 only a few who truly fall in love with it actually understand 289 00:16:20,880 --> 00:16:25,240 the fullness of the faith. I think he said there. 290 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:27,240 I think he must go there a little bit. 291 00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:30,520 Butchered it I. Think you said there are. 292 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:32,520 There are many. There are many people who hate 293 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:33,960 what they think the Catholic Church to be. 294 00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:35,840 There are but a few that hate what the Catholic Church 295 00:16:35,840 --> 00:16:38,400 actually is. Yeah, that makes a lot more 296 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:41,840 sense. That makes a lot more sense. 297 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:46,200 So I think would you rather have someone who's neutral, who you 298 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:47,600 don't have to reteach? Yes. 299 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:50,760 But would you rather have someone who has some basic 300 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:55,240 catechesis in them that you can then they have some kindling 301 00:16:55,240 --> 00:16:58,040 there that you just have to light on fire to get them going? 302 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:04,960 Yes. Boom. 303 00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:12,960 So what do we do with folks? And, and maybe we have some 304 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:18,720 listeners that would say I'm Catholic, but I don't do a ton 305 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:21,280 of the activities that a Catholic does. 306 00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:26,240 And it's funny because if you use an analogy, it's it's kind 307 00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:27,760 of hilarious. It's like I'm a football player. 308 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:29,080 Oh, when was the last time you played? 309 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:30,880 I haven't haven't played in a long time. 310 00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:32,720 Do you know anything about football? 311 00:17:32,720 --> 00:17:35,160 No, not really. Do you read books about 312 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:35,840 football? No. 313 00:17:36,360 --> 00:17:37,840 Do you watch football? No, never. 314 00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:41,160 But I'm a football player. Like in no way, shape or form 315 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:42,640 would that ever make sense to anyone. 316 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:45,920 But when it comes to Catholic, people do that all the time. 317 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:48,720 So how do we how do we win these people? 318 00:17:49,120 --> 00:17:52,240 The I'm I'm thinking of a quote from Saint Pope Paul the 6th 319 00:17:52,240 --> 00:17:54,320 all. Right, get this one because I I 320 00:17:54,320 --> 00:18:00,240 butchered my last name. Said modern man listens more 321 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:07,320 modern man, modern man listens more willingly to witnesses than 322 00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:09,160 he does teachers. And if they listen to teachers, 323 00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:11,880 it is because they are first witnesses themselves, right. 324 00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:16,080 And so, you know, you're talking John Michael of, of, of teaching 325 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:18,560 somebody the faith. But why would somebody be 326 00:18:18,560 --> 00:18:20,120 interested in learning the faith? 327 00:18:20,120 --> 00:18:22,520 Or if they feel like they know the faith already, why would 328 00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:24,400 they be interested in in relearning it? 329 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:27,000 I think we have to ask the question, what are we witnessing 330 00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:29,920 to other people? You know, what, what kind of 331 00:18:29,920 --> 00:18:32,000 Catholic life are we witnessing? Are we witnessing? 332 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:35,240 We do. You don't do the activities, but 333 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:37,760 I do the activities. So let me, let me witness to you 334 00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:41,000 all of my activity doing what is it that we're actually, you 335 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:44,520 know, when, when you see someone that is on fire and zealous for 336 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:46,200 the faith, there's something about them or you look at them 337 00:18:46,200 --> 00:18:49,520 and they're like, they understand something that I that 338 00:18:49,520 --> 00:18:52,520 I don't, or they live differently in a way that I, I 339 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:54,040 don't live. But I would say we're the same. 340 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:56,560 We're both Catholic. So why is your life so different 341 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:58,240 than mine? Why do you have something that I 342 00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:02,200 don't? What do you guys think that that 343 00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:12,760 witness entails? I think the the first word that 344 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:16,800 comes to mind is freedom. I think that's like a big piece 345 00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:21,080 of it of like a lot of we, we hear this a lot, especially the 346 00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:24,600 three of us worked on university campuses walking with people in 347 00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:28,360 all aspects of life, right from culturally Catholic to not 348 00:19:28,360 --> 00:19:31,320 Catholic to I've been authentically Catholic my whole 349 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:33,680 life. And he's a lot of like, well, 350 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:37,560 there was something attractive. And I, I think for me, at least 351 00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:40,160 whenever I was one of those people that wasn't sure what it 352 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:42,960 meant to be Catholic and I saw other people, I talked about 353 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:45,600 commit commitment, right, being hot or cold. 354 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,280 Another thing that I that was very attractive. 355 00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:51,120 And I don't know if this answering your question like 356 00:19:51,120 --> 00:19:54,720 that witness to me was freedom. There was a freedom that I 357 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:57,680 didn't know where it came from, but I knew I wanted it. 358 00:19:58,440 --> 00:20:00,960 You know, I, I think at least that's for me. 359 00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:02,720 I don't know if you guys have a different answer. 360 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:08,320 Yeah, I think what what is attractive and and what I'm 361 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:10,920 thinking about is what attracted us to the Catholic faith. 362 00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:15,040 Like who were the witnesses and why was I attracted to them? 363 00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:19,600 I think freedom, absolutely. I think about for all of us, it 364 00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:22,640 was those older men in our lives who we looked, who we looked at. 365 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:25,240 And I'm asking myself the question, what, what did they 366 00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:30,240 witness to? To me, I'll tell you John, who 367 00:20:30,240 --> 00:20:32,520 was a great witness to, to all three of us. 368 00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:36,000 He was someone that had a, a big effect on our lives in college 369 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:39,680 and I think won me over to authentic Catholicism. 370 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:46,000 What attracted me to him was a few things. 1 He knew who he was 371 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:49,640 and he was integrated. And what I mean by integration 372 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:53,240 is that the way he, the things he spoke about, the things he 373 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:56,600 cared about, the things that he spent time doing, if you looked 374 00:20:56,600 --> 00:21:00,600 at his schedule, yes, it was full of Catholic activities, but 375 00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:02,360 it wasn't for the activity itself. 376 00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:07,640 It was it was because he believed in what he believed, 377 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:12,520 that the church was the source of life for him, that he just 378 00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:15,480 talked about the faith. And I'll never forget we, me and 379 00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:19,760 Clayton went to Jamaica with him on a mission trip and we'd sit 380 00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:22,400 down at dinner and most guys would sit at dinner and, and 381 00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:24,840 they'd talk about football and they'd talk about, you know, 382 00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:27,200 their girlfriends. And instead John would sit down 383 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:29,000 and, and he would start talking about the Eucharist. 384 00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:31,200 And it was, it was such a mind blowing concept. 385 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:34,800 Who Mendo, who does that? No one even says that. 386 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:38,840 And he'd ask us questions. He'd be like, So what, how do 387 00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:41,560 you, how is your reception of the Eucharist changing your 388 00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:44,360 life? And we're sitting back going, it 389 00:21:44,360 --> 00:21:48,720 doesn't, it depends how crunchy it is. 390 00:21:48,720 --> 00:21:53,320 You know, I, I don't know. And, and there was something 391 00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:58,240 about him that had a full confidence in who he was. 392 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:02,120 He also was not a man of duplicity. 393 00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:05,840 He was pursuing a woman at the time that that we knew he was 394 00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:08,520 really into. And you could just tell his 395 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:13,280 pursuit of her was something outside of what we had witnessed 396 00:22:13,280 --> 00:22:16,160 in our life. It was dedicated, it was 397 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:21,640 intentional, it was faithful. It was fearless, frankly. 398 00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:24,880 I mean, he just went after it. The first date they ever went 399 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:28,840 on, he showed up at her house with flowers because he just was 400 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:31,360 like, I know who I am. I know what I'm about. 401 00:22:31,360 --> 00:22:33,520 And I'm just going to, I'm just going to put it out there for 402 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:34,880 you. And if you don't like it, that's 403 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:38,840 OK. So that is a witness that people 404 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:42,400 are attracted to. And I think in a world where 405 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,800 people are constantly logged on to podcast and YouTube videos, 406 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:48,040 they don't have authentic witnesses. 407 00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:49,880 They have people with microphones. 408 00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:53,080 They have an image of what people want you to see. 409 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:57,160 And, and our podcast is, is wonderful, but, but we want to 410 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:00,400 encourage people don't, don't be like us because you're listening 411 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:01,560 to us. Hold microphones. 412 00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:06,240 Find people in your real life who showcased this authenticity 413 00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:07,960 to you. Yeah, it was a great way of 414 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:11,080 putting out what I'm thinking too of like that you kind of put 415 00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:13,800 towards what I'm thinking when I say freedom, right? 416 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:16,120 I think coming into college, when I saw that a lot of 417 00:23:16,120 --> 00:23:18,800 misunderstandings of what it meant to be Catholic, Christian 418 00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:22,880 or Christian, whatever it was I thought to be Catholic, it was 419 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,480 just like boring. You had to follow a lot of 420 00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:27,240 rules. You couldn't have desires, 421 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:27,760 right? It was. 422 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:30,000 Just no adventure. You couldn't be yourself. 423 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:32,280 And that's what I mean by freedom, by authenticity. 424 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:36,120 It's like, oh, these guys are still themselves, You know, for 425 00:23:36,120 --> 00:23:40,280 for me, John was big, but Evan was another big figure in my 426 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:43,240 life. I'm like, man, you also, you 427 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:46,760 still like to drink beer, but you are faithful and you pray 428 00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:51,080 that that was crazy. You know, you like to go out and 429 00:23:51,080 --> 00:23:54,000 you, you're still like, that's the freedom that I mean of, of 430 00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:55,880 what you just sort of like, this is who I am. 431 00:23:56,360 --> 00:23:59,920 And I'm very confident in that. And I don't have to change for 432 00:23:59,920 --> 00:24:02,280 anyone else, you know, because this is how God made me. 433 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,840 That was like, whoa, that's crazy. 434 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:06,640 And, and especially coming to college, someone that cared so 435 00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:09,480 much what other people thought of me, that was attractive. 436 00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:13,320 A freedom from insecurities, a freedom from, again, not saying 437 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:15,520 that I don't, he might have had insecurities. 438 00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:18,640 I still have my insecurities, but a freedom of like, this is 439 00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:20,280 who I am and this is the authentic me. 440 00:24:20,280 --> 00:24:22,680 And I, I, I'm not just some boring person that's following 441 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:25,760 rules. I'm myself as God created me to 442 00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:29,080 be. And I still like football and I 443 00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:30,400 can still talk about football at dinner. 444 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:33,360 You know, now it's not the only thing I talked about, but I 445 00:24:33,360 --> 00:24:37,440 still can't. Those are the things that but 446 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:40,440 what's going on here? You know, we clean. 447 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:46,960 Remember my freshman year of college went to a, a men's 448 00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:50,320 prayer meeting. So I'd never been to something 449 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:52,240 like that before in, in my entire life. 450 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:54,720 And I remember getting there and and and. 451 00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:58,400 Were you nervous? Yeah, yeah, for sure. 452 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:00,640 Yeah. And I remember getting there and 453 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:05,320 I met all of these just awesome dudes and, you know, that I was 454 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:08,360 new to the, you know, come up and say hi and, you know, shake 455 00:25:08,360 --> 00:25:09,200 my hand. They're smiling. 456 00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:11,640 They're asking me questions and having a good time like. 457 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:14,480 These guys are so cool. You know, they're, they're, 458 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:19,240 they're tall, they're athletic, they're funny, you know, you 459 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:21,880 know, not all of them were were, you know, cool, athletic and 460 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:26,080 tan, you know, but they were all approachable, you know, in, in 461 00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:30,440 different ways. And you know, after I guess chit 462 00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:33,880 chatting, you know, for a little bit, we went into, you know, a 463 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:37,520 time of, of prayer together and then just one praise and praise 464 00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:40,480 and worship song. And I remember, you know, 465 00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:46,120 seeing, you know, about 100 and 5200 men go into, into prayer 466 00:25:46,120 --> 00:25:49,560 and then, you know, close their eyes and, and, and, and, and 467 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:52,320 worship and worship God and, and give him praise. 468 00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:54,840 And I remember thinking to myself, this is the first time 469 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:59,760 ever I, I ever thought this to myself my entire life was, oh, 470 00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:02,360 like, maybe this is what I'm missing. 471 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:04,120 You know, maybe this is what I'm missing. 472 00:26:04,120 --> 00:26:06,600 I'm, I'm around all of these men that have something that I 473 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:08,440 don't. I think what attracted to me, 474 00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:13,000 attracted me to them the most was their was their authentic 475 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,880 joy that they had. It's beautiful. 476 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:20,560 I wonder if an element of our stories that that helped us get 477 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:26,960 out of cultural Catholicism was spending tons of time with non 478 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:29,760 Catholics. So in college, most of our 479 00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:33,360 friends were not Catholic. Some, some were evangelical 480 00:26:33,360 --> 00:26:36,600 Protestants, some were, you know, just trying to figure out 481 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:40,520 what they believed. And for me, that was a very new 482 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:44,120 experience, primarily in college because I went to a Catholic 483 00:26:44,120 --> 00:26:45,840 elementary school, went to a Catholic prep school. 484 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:48,960 My whole family was Catholic. I remember meeting someone who 485 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:50,800 was Luther and I thought it was a salad dressing. 486 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:54,840 I'd never heard of it. I'll never forget. 487 00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:57,000 We're, we're, we're at the beginning of college and some 488 00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:58,400 guy comes to me. He's like, hey, where do you go 489 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:00,520 to church? It's like kind of a weird 490 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:02,600 question to lead with. What's your name? 491 00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:05,200 Maybe is a better one. I said, oh, I, I, you know, I 492 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:06,600 don't really know, but I'm Catholic. 493 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:11,520 So they got Saint Mary's here. I said, where, where do you go 494 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:14,240 to church? He's like, I go to Grace Grace 495 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:16,280 Anderson. I said, who's she? 496 00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:22,240 And so just being surrounded with people who who were not 497 00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:25,000 Catholic, we started getting questions. 498 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:27,520 Well, OK, you're Catholic. What does that even mean? 499 00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:30,360 I have no idea. I had no idea. 500 00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:35,080 And so I think for for some of our listeners, spend time with 501 00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:39,560 people who are not Catholic, spend ton don't just have a 502 00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:44,680 bunch of friends who believe the same things as you, but get out 503 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:49,400 into arenas that you actually are able to distinguish what you 504 00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:53,280 believe from people who do not believe the same thing. 505 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:58,920 And that tension, that requirement to be reflective and 506 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,400 and ask yourself, why do I believe this is something that 507 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:04,720 leads hopefully to deeper conviction? 508 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:11,880 I remember the first conversation, you know, a 509 00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:14,240 conversation that I had when I was in college was with an 510 00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:17,080 evangelical president. He told me that I was going to 511 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:19,800 go to hell for being Catholic. And I had, I had. 512 00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:22,960 Now, obviously not every evangelical president believes 513 00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:26,160 that, but that was the first time that I had ever heard. 514 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:27,760 That you're like, why haven't I heard this before? 515 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:30,160 I was. Like, So what was I raised in a 516 00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:32,720 cult? What is this, you know, and I 517 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:35,920 didn't I didn't understand. I was like, what are you, what 518 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,040 do you mean? Like, why would you ever think 519 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:40,640 that, You know, And it forced me. 520 00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:43,880 That was just a moment where it forced me to start asking myself 521 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:47,920 some questions of like, oh, well, other people think this 522 00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:50,160 about what I believe, but I didn't, I wasn't able to give 523 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:51,800 them an answer in response to that. 524 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:54,600 So what do I actually believe and why do I actually believe 525 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:55,520 it? And I think what you're getting 526 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,120 at, John Michael, is like, what is it going to take for you to 527 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:00,280 have a sense of ownership and agency for your life? 528 00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:04,600 You know, of just this is something that I do and I don't 529 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:06,440 really challenge myself in it. And nobody else really 530 00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:09,520 challenges, challenges me, you know, And so I just kind of live 531 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,000 my life on, on, on cruise control, on autopilot. 532 00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:16,600 What's what's beautiful about our Catholic faith is like, we 533 00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:21,360 actually have that decision point built in to what we 534 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:23,160 believe. So when you run through the 535 00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:26,960 sacraments, baptism, your parents choose it for you, Holy 536 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,360 Communion and confession. Typically you receive those 537 00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:34,080 sacraments when you're younger and you do it because yes, you 538 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:36,520 might believe it, but when you're in 1st and 2nd grade, 539 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:39,640 it's hard to make a full decision of the will that I, 540 00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:43,040 I'm, I'm all in on this thing. But then we have the sacrament 541 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:45,320 of confession. And so our, our faith actually 542 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:49,400 bakes in the decision point, right for us where the, the 543 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:53,400 sacrament of confirmation is supposed to be in its pure form, 544 00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:57,240 the decision of the will that says, I actually believe this. 545 00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:01,080 I'm making this faith, not the faith of my parents, not the 546 00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:03,640 faith of my forefathers, but the faith of me. 547 00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:07,240 And so it's beautiful because we received those sacraments. 548 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:11,040 Now, when I received my confirmation, I was just excited 549 00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:13,040 because we got the next day off of school and there was an ice 550 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:16,400 cream party. And so I didn't think of it that 551 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,160 way. But in its purest form, our 552 00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:24,280 church actually bakes in this very decision point for us in 553 00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:31,680 our formation. For those Jose who maybe they 554 00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:33,800 have friends who are at this place. 555 00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,240 Like we were talking the other day about your your neighbor and 556 00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:39,600 you guys had a nice conversation and you thought he was super 557 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:41,440 cool looking. They just had their first baby. 558 00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:43,880 You had your first baby and you're like, dude, I want to get 559 00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:47,160 to know this guy. What would a conversation look 560 00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:51,480 like with him to just be able to slowly, over the course of a 561 00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:55,640 friendship, move him from, yeah I was raised Catholic to man, 562 00:30:55,640 --> 00:31:00,240 I'm really interested in this. That's a great question. 563 00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:02,440 There's a funny story type to this. 564 00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:05,080 So I I met this neighbor that I was telling you all about a 565 00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:10,200 couple months ago. He was putting up Christmas 566 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:12,800 lights and. Shirtless. 567 00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:14,920 No. Because wasn't. 568 00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,160 Isn't he pretty jacked? He, he's so jacked and so he's 569 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:21,800 putting up Christmas lights and I, I was going on a walk with 570 00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:24,800 our newborn, right? Giving my wife a, a time to 571 00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:27,240 breathe and, and, you know, do what she need to do. 572 00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:29,400 And so I just started up a conversation. 573 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:32,640 It was kind of weird at first, yeah, but I, I saw him as a, he 574 00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:36,480 looks around my age and we live in like a neighborhood and like, 575 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:40,000 you're not living here if you're single, you know, so like, oh, 576 00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:42,920 we want to make some community. And so start a conversation. 577 00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:44,920 I was like, hey, he was wrapping the trees. 578 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:48,200 I was like, oh man, like what did I say was my opener? 579 00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:50,440 It was a. Great rapping job man. 580 00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:52,320 I thought about this and I was like, oh, dude, that's great. 581 00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,600 I said, hey, looking good. I've been thinking about doing 582 00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:58,680 the same thing. You know, how are you? 583 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:00,800 Like, what are you doing? How are you doing? 584 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,440 The rapping right? And so smooth. 585 00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:05,520 It was a little awkward. But you thinking to me, he's 586 00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:08,720 like, yeah, dude, you know, my, my wife and I just like reached 587 00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:10,480 out to someone and they quoted us like a ton of money. 588 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:11,840 He's like, oh, me too. So we just kind of started 589 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,840 connecting and we ended up having a great conversation 590 00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:18,160 where they both went to LSU and he's like, yeah, we're Catholic. 591 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:21,280 I was like, great. But I didn't want to start 592 00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:22,800 saying like, oh, I'm Catholic too, You know, I work for a 593 00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,840 Catholic organization, like. I'm super Catholic. 594 00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:25,840 I love Catholic. At the end, you're. 595 00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:27,080 Right. Because I was like that. 596 00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:30,600 There's such a spectrum of like what someone means when they say 597 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:33,160 they're Catholic, right? But I was laughing as I walked 598 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,680 away because I wanted to invite them into something so I could 599 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:37,920 like become better friends with them. 600 00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:41,280 But the same time it was around my birthday and they want to be 601 00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:42,760 like, hey, do you want to come to a birthday party this 602 00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:44,520 weekend? And right. 603 00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:46,800 And so as I ended the conversation, I was like, well, 604 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:48,520 how can I ensure that I see them again? 605 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:55,480 And so you guys, he's like, how do you do you normally like walk 606 00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:56,600 over here? He's like, yeah, we live down 607 00:32:56,600 --> 00:32:58,080 the street. Normally around this time we go 608 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:00,680 on a walk. He's like, dude, well, you know, 609 00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,440 swing by anytime whenever you're, you're going on a walk 610 00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:06,320 with, you know, and so it, this is a funny part. 611 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:10,040 It's like ever since then, like almost every single day around 612 00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:13,200 the same time, I walked past their house hoping that I read 613 00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:14,520 into them again. And you don't. 614 00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:18,000 I still have it, you don't. I do wonder if they see me 615 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:20,720 through the window who's slowly walking by house and. 616 00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,880 Everything. Like that, I can make an effort 617 00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:24,760 not to look at their house, you know? 618 00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:32,000 But I think what you're getting too, and my normal stance with 619 00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:36,800 this is it is kind of hard to start by verbally asking like, 620 00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:40,000 oh, tell me what you believe, right? 621 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:42,600 What do you think about what the Catholic Church teaches about 622 00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:46,480 this? That's like a really strong way 623 00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:48,040 to start a conversation about the faith. 624 00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:52,520 But what my wife and I always talk about is like, well, we 625 00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:55,880 need to invite people into our lives and let them see the 626 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:58,000 difference, right? And I don't know if that's what 627 00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:00,640 you're getting too. And then they can start asking 628 00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:02,960 questions. But I need to be my authentic 629 00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,240 self. And what I mean by that is I 630 00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:09,000 need to be OK with sharing. Like, you know, when it might be 631 00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,239 like a simple question, like, oh, why do you guys live here in 632 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:14,000 Baton Rouge? I'm not going to say like, oh, 633 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:16,760 because it just made sense. I'll go ahead and share. 634 00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:18,920 It's like, Oh, well, you know, my wife and I took some time 635 00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:24,360 praying with this and I'll, I'll start talking about like I'll be 636 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:27,880 pretty authentic about how we live our Catholic life. 637 00:34:28,560 --> 00:34:31,480 And then I'll let them decide if they want to ask or not, at 638 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:33,920 least initially, right? Once we become better friends, 639 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:37,639 maybe I'll start asking. And then sometimes that doesn't 640 00:34:37,639 --> 00:34:39,719 work out. Sometimes that in and of itself 641 00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:42,800 can weird people out. But I'm OK with that because I 642 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:45,199 know that I did what I like. I'm not going to hide who I am 643 00:34:45,199 --> 00:34:47,040 and I'm not going to hide what I believe. 644 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,159 I'm not going to hide the truth of the Catholic faith just to 645 00:34:50,159 --> 00:34:51,360 make someone feel more comfortable. 646 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:53,360 But I'm also not going to attack him with it. 647 00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:57,720 You know what I mean? I, I love how you, you use the 648 00:34:57,720 --> 00:35:03,680 example of like using natural conversation to slowly weave in 649 00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:06,720 your beliefs. And I think that's such a, a 650 00:35:06,720 --> 00:35:10,040 smart, emotionally intelligent way to, to show the cards a 651 00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:13,240 little bit without shoving the cards across the table. 652 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:18,240 And I'm, I'm thinking about, I always do this and, and I get so 653 00:35:18,240 --> 00:35:20,520 frustrated. You know, all three of us have 654 00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:22,840 travelled pretty frequently for our jobs. 655 00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:27,040 And so you're on a plane and you sit next to a gentleman. 656 00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:30,120 First question. Oh, So what were you were you 657 00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:31,840 heading, you going home, leaving for a trip? 658 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:33,200 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, what do you do for work? 659 00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:36,120 And there's, I have two answers, OK. 660 00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:39,280 One is the cop out answer. And unfortunately, I give the 661 00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,680 cop out answer way more than I would like to, which is, oh, you 662 00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:45,600 know, I, I, I travel for work. I work for a, a non profit. 663 00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:47,920 I think that's, that's a cop out. 664 00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:50,200 And I know it's a cop out because I don't want them to ask 665 00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:53,280 more about it. Yeah, the the real answer and 666 00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,200 the answer I would like to give is I'm a Catholic missionary and 667 00:35:56,200 --> 00:35:59,600 I work for a Catholic apostolate and we serve college campuses 668 00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:01,520 across the country. So I'm going to visit some of 669 00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:04,200 our staff. And that's the real answer. 670 00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:08,680 That's the answer I should give. But my fear and my honestly 671 00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:11,560 laziness and tiredness that says, please don't ask any more 672 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:15,600 about it often overwhelms. So I love that example you gave 673 00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:19,120 because in in conversations and friendships, there's there's 674 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:23,600 honestly subtle ways, but but yet bold to still weave in what 675 00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:27,160 we really believe in elements that that are just natural 676 00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:29,920 conversation points. Yeah. 677 00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:33,320 And, and I think that's a really easy one for us in our stage of 678 00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:35,360 life is like, we do work for Catholic Apostle and it's a 679 00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:38,800 really easy way for us to start. I mean, even with this person 680 00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:41,320 that we're talking about, my neighbors, that's how it 681 00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:44,400 started, right? I, I, I was wearing my A&M 682 00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:45,760 stretcher. He's like, oh, you went to A&MI 683 00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:47,880 was like, yeah, what about He's like, I went to LSU and I was 684 00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:49,360 like, oh, no way. I work with LSU. 685 00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:51,240 Cool. And he was like, oh, what do you 686 00:36:51,240 --> 00:36:52,960 mean by that? Let's go actually work for a 687 00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:56,520 Catholic organization. And I'm a Catholic missionary 688 00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:58,680 and I and I work with students at LSU that are trying to find 689 00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:01,320 more about their faith, right. And that's when he was like, oh, 690 00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:02,720 what it well, what does that mean? 691 00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:06,880 And that kind of led to a little bit of something, but that's a 692 00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:08,760 very natural way for us to talk about it. 693 00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:12,520 What about for for listeners, for friends that maybe don't 694 00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:16,000 have such an easy way, such as I work for Catholic organization 695 00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:18,320 organization. How can you work that into a 696 00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:23,000 conversation? I think, I mean, I think a great 697 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:26,600 way is, you know, if you're, if you, you know, spend time and 698 00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:29,040 prayer in the morning, you know, if, if someone says what you do 699 00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:30,880 today, you might say, oh, you know, I've worked out, went to 700 00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:33,320 work, you know, great day. I had a great conversation at 701 00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:35,200 lunch, like, blah, blah, blah. What if you could start working 702 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:38,400 in, you know, the, the regular practices that you, that you 703 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:40,320 have in, in your life is like actually, you know, it's been a 704 00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:43,360 great, been a great day. I had a, you know, 6:00 AM, you 705 00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:46,560 know, Bible study this morning about, you know, 7 or 8 guys 706 00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:49,800 that we, you know, we meet weekly together and the content 707 00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:51,200 was really great, you know, yadda, yadda. 708 00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:54,800 Or, you know, I went to Mass this morning and just not being 709 00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:56,800 afraid, honestly. Here's another big one as well. 710 00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:58,800 This isn't about, you know, just directly being in a 711 00:37:58,800 --> 00:38:03,600 conversation, but unabashedly making the sign of the cross 712 00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:06,840 before your meal in public because we all do the thing 713 00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,320 where we go like this. You know, sometimes when I'm 714 00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:10,720 praying a rosary on a plant, I do that. 715 00:38:10,720 --> 00:38:12,640 I did this on, on a plane ride recently. 716 00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:14,600 I was praying my rosary and I kind of just went. 717 00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:16,760 Yeah, 'cause I hide the rosary in your pocket. 718 00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:18,760 Yeah, You know, you just kind of I'm like, bring it out. 719 00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:21,840 But like when we before we take off and when we land, I always 720 00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:26,600 say a few prayers for, you know, protection and, you know, I, I 721 00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:28,840 should be making the full sign of the cross, but I don't, I 722 00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:30,560 don't do that, you know. So there's all these tendencies 723 00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:34,640 to not want to offend people or make people feel uncomfortable. 724 00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:37,720 But I would say that's a just a really normal way of like, yeah, 725 00:38:37,720 --> 00:38:41,000 like, did you pray this morning? Share that you know. 726 00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:45,080 The weekend question is another one of my favorites. 727 00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:49,120 So it's like the ultimate, you know, low level water cooler 728 00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:51,320 office conversation. Oh, what'd you do this weekend? 729 00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:53,520 Watch the eggs? You know, did some lawn work, 730 00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:56,480 you know, trees getting trees really getting overwhelmed here. 731 00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:59,440 You know, instead, like, Oh yeah, took, we went to Mass on 732 00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:01,560 Sunday, went home, had a big brunch. 733 00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:02,960 You know, we had a wonderful Sabbath. 734 00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:05,120 It was, it was wonderful. Got to watch the eggs lose 735 00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:08,000 again. And, and that's just a, a 736 00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:12,040 natural time, like you said, to just weave in what's actually 737 00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:15,360 happening in our lives. I mean, heck, the best way to 738 00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:19,080 make your faith clear is just have kids because they do things 739 00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:23,600 that and with boldness that you're almost embarrassed about, 740 00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:27,560 you know, and, and frankly, when you have a lot of kids, the 741 00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:29,040 first question you get is, are you Catholic? 742 00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:32,560 For sure. And it's either yes or a Mormon. 743 00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:38,720 And normally I pick Catholic. So as, as we close up our time 744 00:39:38,720 --> 00:39:41,760 here, you know, we hope this is, is a relatable conversation for 745 00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:44,160 you. We'll close with just an image 746 00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:48,840 that a friend gave me, which is that a lot of people wear these, 747 00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:51,840 these jackets of their beliefs. And you can imagine like a 748 00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:54,960 Letterman jacket, you know, and it has employee and it has 749 00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:57,880 husband and it has father and it has, I graduated from this 750 00:39:57,880 --> 00:39:59,480 school. And then they have like the 751 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,560 Catholic patch on. And, and often times in our 752 00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:05,560 lives, we feel like we just have the Catholic patch on. 753 00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:09,040 It's just a part of our lives. But what would it look like to 754 00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:13,040 not just make Catholicism the the patch that you wear or just 755 00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:17,040 one aspect of your life, but to make your faith in Christ the 756 00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:20,240 deepest part of your identity? That's what we're about at the 757 00:40:20,240 --> 00:40:24,960 All In podcast is, is moving our faith from just a small snippet 758 00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:28,560 to everything that we do flowing from our faith in Christ. 759 00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:32,840 And so if you are a guy on that journey, where you have friends 760 00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:35,360 that are on that journey, make sure that you're tuned into this 761 00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:39,200 podcast because we are all about relatably sharing our journey of 762 00:40:39,200 --> 00:40:42,800 holiness together as brothers. And we want as many men to join 763 00:40:42,800 --> 00:40:46,160 us in that journey as possible. This is the All In podcast. 764 00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:49,080 Make sure you're subscribed, liked, share this with the 765 00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:52,560 brother who needs this. We are all in on not just being 766 00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:55,600 culturally Catholic, but being truly Catholic. 767 00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:57,200 See you in the next one.